October 14, 2021 • 55 mins
Sean interviewing Chris this time? What is this world coming to?!
In this episode, we talk about real estate investing and Chris's recent and early stages investment of Short Term Renting and how he incorporated it into his personal home purchase. There are more ways to invest that take a more creative approach and we talk about the why's and how's Chris got involved.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Chris Holling (00:00):
This is the truth about investing back to basics
podcast. Where we want to helpyou take control of your
personal finance and long terminvestments. If you're looking
for a way to learn the why andhow of investing, then you found
the right place. Thank you fortaking the time to learn how to
(00:23):
better yourselves.
Because because we're, you know,interviewing me today, do you
have jokes for me today? Oh,
Sean Cooper (00:37):
no, I did not go that far. No, I not. No, I took
over the the coming up withquestions portion. And outside
of that, you're still on for theintro and all that good stuff.
Chris Holling (00:51):
Oh, man.
Okay, well,
Sean Cooper (00:54):
yep.
Chris Holling (00:55):
The intro and the funny funny jokes.
Sean Cooper (00:59):
That's why you're here.
Chris Holling (01:02):
I agree.
Sean Cooper (01:04):
I'm not gonna be funny. If I was the funny one,
then my videos would have morehits.
Chris Holling (01:09):
This would be it.
That's, I guess there's sometruth to that. Okay. All right.
Well, I guess I guess becauseI'm the funny one, then we don't
we don't have to prep withjokes. It'll just it'll just be
be fluid.
Sean Cooper (01:25):
fluid. Okay,
Chris Holling (01:26):
jokes throughout.
Sean Cooper (01:28):
So then you can introduce us and then I'll start
grilling you with questions?
Chris Holling (01:32):
Okay. Well, welcome, ladies and gentlemen,
boys and girls, people of allages to another episode of the
truth about investing back tobasics. My name is Chris
Holling.
Sean Cooper (01:46):
And I'm Sean Cooper.
Chris Holling (01:47):
And Sean's gonna interview me today about stuff.
I okay, I guess I can throw in alittle bit more of an intro that
so
Sean Cooper (01:57):
yeah.
Chris Holling (01:59):
The the previous Yeah, it was the previous
episode that we did, we focusedon alternative investments. And
one of those that we addressedwas actually real estate. We
talked about real estate. Andreally, there's there's entire
podcasts that are dedicated tothis through and through, and
there are very, very successfulones at that. And I mean, just
(02:20):
to give a guess kind of my ownshout out to it unless I need to
bleep it later. I really enjoybigger pockets, bigger pockets,
does a really good job of doinga real estate investing podcast,
they've got a lot of really coolresources that I've personally
learned a lot from just on myown time, my own research. And,
(02:41):
specifically, the reason we'retalking about it at all today is
a large investment where it's mymost active investment is I do a
short term rental that I havearranged that I'm going to try
not describe too much so thatSean can ask me questions.
Sean Cooper (03:00):
That's right
Chris Holling (03:01):
But, but I run a short term rental property, this
is very new for me. And so wewanted to get a recording of
this on kind of the early stagesof some of that. And
specifically, for me, it's aversion that BiggerPockets
would, or others, depending onhow I edit this would reference
(03:22):
it as called house hacking. Andso what I am doing is I have
recently purchased a house a fewmonths ago and did some
renovations in order to separateit into two functional units.
And short term rent one of theunits, some people do this with
just a room or they stay in thebasement, and then they separate
(03:43):
the other part in the house. Orsome people do it where it's
just, you know, a carriage houseseparately or some variation of
that. But it's it's worked wellfor us so far. And we're
starting to see some returns onit. And now we get to get into
the meat potatoes of kind of howit works and answer. I really
(04:04):
have no idea what questions Seanhas for me. So I'm kind of
curious, actually. But yeah,that's that's why we're
interviewing me today.
Sean Cooper (04:13):
Exactly. Exactly.
So I to start off I know this isprobably a multi faceted answer
that you have. Because you knowyou have when you have capital,
you have lots of opportunitiesopen to you with what you could
do with it. And I knowpreviously you guys were renting
and you had a pretty sweet dealin terms of your rent. So what
(04:38):
made you decide to take yourcapital and invest in real
estate in the first place?
Chris Holling (04:46):
Hmm, okay, yeah, that's a that's a
cool question. So Wow, it's notjust a multi faceted question
but a kind of a multiple reasonsanswer.
Sean Cooper (04:59):
Right
Chris Holling (04:59):
Uh, There, there is something to be said for just
kind of the inception of some ofmy first, like foundational
pieces of learning in investing,where a lot of people, when they
first start thinking aboutinvesting at all, when when
they're trying to get out of thegrind of just, you work, you get
(05:21):
paid, you pay bills, and thenyou do that until you retire.
And then you die. Like to, tokind of have just a different
mindset. A very common book thata lot of people read that I did
read was Rich Dad, Poor Dad,Robert Kiyosaki. And it he did
make his money in real estate.
And so he does a lot of realestate examples in that. And
(05:43):
that is, by far not the only wayto gain ground in investing. But
it's an example that gets usedpretty consistently. And so I
was, I was pretty aware to it,just early stages of learning of
just considering it as anoption. And then by chance, when
we moved back, and like Seanmentioned, we were still renting
(06:05):
and, and doing some of that,then I knew that we still wanted
to get our own space that wecould, we could call our own.
And we tried to figure out howto do that, but also how to
simultaneously advance ouractive investing plan, because
comparatively to a lot ofpeople, I am a pretty aggressive
(06:25):
investor, just because I do havea pretty secure job. And I'm
pretty comfortable with the ideathat if absolutely everything
blows up in my face, I can kindof hit the reset button a little
bit. And I'm willing to take onthat risk. And so to look at it
as a how do we get started andget a good springboard of going.
(06:45):
And also how do we get a spaceto ourself this seemed like one
of the best ways to do it. Wealso entertained getting a hold
of a multi unit place outrightlike a triplex or four Plex, you
can do that with an FHA loan,FHA will approve up to a quad
Plex and we looked at some ofthose options and just wound up
(07:06):
going this route instead, aftermultiple multiple comparisons
and numbers and lots of numbercrunching and lots of lots of
learning between then and nowand it we're in the right place
that I feel like fits us bestpersonally. So
Sean Cooper (07:27):
awesome.
Chris Holling (07:28):
How's that?
Sean Cooper (07:28):
Yeah, no, that's I mean that's what you got to do
is find out what works best foryou. And to to that point you
referenced some of the differentideas of investing in real
estate that you guys talkedabout and I think split buying a
house and then splitting it andrenting half is a fairly unique
(07:52):
because a lot of real estateinvestors think you know that
you've got the fix and flippersout there you've got people that
just go around they buy up, buya house, rent it, use it to pay
itself off refinance it, usethat to buy another one and
continue the process. In thiscase you're living and you know,
you know working the house atthe same time so
Chris Holling (08:14):
correct
Sean Cooper (08:15):
What led you to that particular method
specifically Why did you choosethat manner of investing in real
estate specifically?
Chris Holling (08:24):
Oh, interesting.
Okay, um, so something that Ithink I've been learning a lot
about real estate, investing inparticular is it it really does
widely widely vary the optionsand how well you can do in
certain areas justgeographically and I don't just
(08:48):
mean like per state, but I meanlike per city per county per
neighborhood and that can vary alot of things wildly so strictly
short term as an example, if youare looking in a spot out in I
don't know say Maine, I loveMaine Maine is a beautiful place
(09:11):
to be but their touristy time isvery much the summertime because
of lobsters and lobster seasonand sometimes the the winter a
bit just because people like toget out and, and a little bit of
fall to see the colors andwhatnot. But those are slower
times in comparison to summer.
So when you're looking at thatas a real estate investment, and
(09:32):
you're considering like vacationhome renting, which is a that's
sort of one of the versions ofshort term renting, then that's
that's the type of thing thatyou got to consider because when
you're looking at those, thenyou're offsetting the costs for
when you know when the gettingis good and you can get good
rates and good good returnversus the slower months and
kind of feast and famine andwriting through that. Whereas
(09:56):
say you're looking in the DenverMetro area then Denver Metro
area there's there's tourismthat kind of occurs all year
round and there really is alarge influx of people that's
always coming into the area andso because people are are moving
in moving out moving from placeto place, it's pretty common to
(10:17):
have things like short termrental long term rental
available to you and thereforethere's also a lot of
opportunity for growth like likefix and flips like he referenced
there's there's just a lot thathappens on the real estate side
here whereas say you find asmall town in Iowa I don't know
(10:38):
why I picked Iowa I just did.
But there there might not be alot of traffic of people coming
in and out or moving into it soyou could get a house for four
grand I saw one go for fourgrand the other day, which is
just wild in comparison toDenver Metro numbers. But you
know, then if you do that, andyou choose to long term rent it
(10:59):
out for I don't know 500 bucks amonth, then you could still
technically turn a profit onthat and, and so it widly varies
depending on the area thatyou're looking at in the first
place. So to answer yourquestion, we wanted to be
somewhere where we were in theDenver Metro area because that's
where family is for us. And kindof particular to the Denver
(11:22):
Metro area. The short termrenting tends to be relatively
consistent and not justvacationing like you would find
in Vail because of the fact thatit is year round tourism year
round business year roundseasons it is it is a constant
inflow of people which makes theshort term more regular than you
(11:43):
would find in in other areas andso once we once we started like
comparing a lot of numbers andwe were trying to figure out do
we want to take on long term Dowe want to take on a little bit
of extra risk on the short termside but the payoff could be a
little bit better once wedetermine that we were we were
(12:05):
comfortable with a short termroute that's where you start
getting into the morecomplicated portions of
regulation because it is a newerthing and some cities some
counties don't like it. So evenif you said I want to do this
and this is the best thing forme and then you look at say
Highlands Ranch is a greatexample just in the Denver Metro
(12:28):
area if you decide to look it upHighlands Ranch has a hard no we
do not allow short term rentalwhether you are listed on the
property if nothing absolutelyhard, no
Sean Cooper (12:41):
interesting.
Chris Holling (12:41):
Whereas Denver specifically it's okay so long
as you are the primary residentand so there's lots of either
splitting the house or acarriage house is a great
example where there'sessentially an ADU or an
accessory dwelling unit. So youare the primary owner of that
but as soon as you split it upand it develops essentially to
(13:04):
addresses then that's whenyou're rezoning and it's a
duplex and duplexes cannot beshort term rented from what I
understand in city of Denver. Soto specific to ours because it's
short term, you have to gothrough the stages of okay is we
want to do this for thesereasons. Okay, now that we've
determined we want to is itapproved by the state? Is it
(13:27):
approved by the county is itapproved by the city is it
approved by the HOA and theneighborhood that I'm looking at
if all of those is yes then it'sokay to do there and that's when
you have to try and find a spotthat that works well depending
on where you want to be andwhere you want that location to
be so it's got a lot of steps tomake it happen but as long as
you're looking in that specificgeographical area like I was
(13:51):
trying to describe then then itcan work out quite well and
that's how we landed in that iswe wanted a space that was for
us and did the did the math didthe research found an area that
works well for us in particularand is also approved to do so
and went through all thosestages to do it where it's did
some permitting by the city andso we have a renters permit for
(14:15):
those things and got therenovations done with the the
when you have the vision in mindwe found the house and we said
okay, I think we can do it thisway. Got into the house did the
renovations and now it itfunctions on its own with its
own private entrance and so Iyou know it's it's pretty hands
off, apart from very minor stuffhere and there. So
Sean Cooper (14:39):
nice. So a combination of circumstance as
well as strategy then,
Chris Holling (14:44):
yes,
Sean Cooper (14:44):
that kind of led you to this this particular
choice.
Chris Holling (14:47):
Yes, because if if we, with the circumstance and
strategy, the way that we see itis at the very least the the
market out here is very, verydifficult. It's very expensive,
and it's very, very competitive.
And if nothing else, justbecause of the level of expense,
rather than me trying to figureout a way to work extra overtime
(15:09):
to afford a house of some sort,I thought it would be better to
try and figure out a way to getmy house to work for me, which
kind of goes back into the RichDad Poor Dad example that if you
haven't read it, then one of thethings that they like to justify
is something we've referencedbefore is the separation between
assets and liabilities. And anasset, as a reminder is
(15:32):
something that you spend moneyon that's going to make you
money. And a liability issomething you spend money on
that's going to cost you money.
And if we bought a house,
Sean Cooper (15:44):
Chirs' definition not mine.
Chris Holling (15:46):
Right, right.
Sorry. With that. That's there'san entire episode dedicated to
that.
Sean Cooper (15:49):
Yes.
Chris Holling (15:52):
But yes, under my definition, then when I'm
looking at a house, and when I'mtrying to make this decision,
I'm saying do I want to take onthis liability? I can but how do
I want to do it? versus now I'mtaking on this liability and in
my psychological categorizething that I'm talking about.
(16:14):
Now, I am making it become anasset because this thing that
was going to cost me money isnow making me money or at the at
the very lowest instance of ithelping offset some of those
things, rather than it all justcoming out of my pocket.
Sean Cooper (16:30):
Yep, for sure. So how did you actually go about
starting this process? Andyou've touched on this a little
bit as we've we've gone throughhere, but can you if somebody
wanted to follow suit, what didyou actually go about doing? How
did you find places to look athow did you handle the financing
(16:52):
things of that nature?
Chris Holling (16:54):
Okay, so specific to Denver Metro
area, because that, like I'msaying it's it really there are
extra variables everywhere youlook so specific to this area, I
was able to utilize a lenderthat that was able to allow me
to do a cash offer that was veryparamount for what we wanted to
(17:14):
accomplish in order to staycompetitive in the market
because they're veryconsistently almost, geez, I
can't say every single one aslike a blanket statement, but
very consistently the housesthat are being sold out here
right now in this very currentmarket, as we record this in the
end of September, it could
Sean Cooper (17:37):
in 21'
Chris Holling (17:38):
right, It could change wildly here. But as it
stands right now, most housesare selling for about 50 to
100,000 over asking price.
Sean Cooper (17:48):
That's insane.
Chris Holling (17:50):
It's it is a lot.
And so in doing so, we needed tohave something that was
competitive and comparable. Andif you are doing a cash offer,
the closing process movesquicker, there's a couple of
fees that kind of get removedfrom the process so it it's like
having more money even thoughyou're not you don't have more
(18:10):
money in a way. And we were ableto go through a program that was
able to do a cash offer whichmade it
Sean Cooper (18:17):
so without actually naming that program because
Chris Holling (18:19):
that's what I'm trying to avoid.
Sean Cooper (18:20):
Yeah, I know, how would somebody go about finding
a program like that?
Chris Holling (18:26):
You know, it's It was so unique and it's so new
here in this area that I kind ofstumbled across it by my realtor
suggesting it
Sean Cooper (18:37):
okay,
Chris Holling (18:38):
but
Sean Cooper (18:38):
so maybe tap your realtor for advice on that one?
Chris Holling (18:41):
Sure. Or you know, there's there's really
nothing wrong with with talkingto multiple realtors, there's,
there's this
Sean Cooper (18:47):
oh absolutely
Chris Holling (18:48):
that Oh, there's there's a very strange dynamic
that exists where if you sign acontract with a realtor,
technically you're supposed touse that realtor, especially
with a broker and there's awhole bunch to that and the fact
of the matter is and I we I hopeto not get too much backlash
from this but like, if yourrealtor is not doing well by
(19:09):
you, you can find ways out ofthat contract. Absolutely. And
so when you are trying to findnew avenues because your realtor
isn't doing what you feel thatthey should be doing or really
just they're they're notoperating within your best
interest which is literallytheir job description. Then look
(19:30):
elsewhere, talk to other peopleand just compare because if you
find somebody that's reallywilling to go the extra mile for
you, then that's that's why youwant that person anyway. So
Sean Cooper (19:40):
for sure,
Chris Holling (19:41):
I say that to say that mine was going the extra
mile for me and found thisopportunity for me and and it
was it was very, very helpful.
So if you were looking for thatin particular, check your area
you know, have like a Googlesearch call around call some
maybe call a local Investor orsomething and try try to just
see what you can find out andspecifically ask for that, hey,
(20:05):
do you have you ever heard of aprogram that allows you to do a
cash offer, and and they act asyour cash offer. And that's how
it worked is they did a cashoffer, they closed, and then
they connected me with amortgage broker, and then the
mortgage was set up in a namethat they picked, or what the
(20:27):
mortgage company that theypicked, and how it works. And
the way that they make money isthat for me, I don't see a
difference. If the rate is 3%,then I get connected with this
mortgage broker. And they say,okay, we're the going rate right
now is 3%. So I'm just going tocharge this guy 3% Hey, you
(20:48):
company that just did the cashoffer, tell you what we're going
to give you point 5% becausewhile it's lower for us, we
never would have had thecontract if it wasn't for you in
the first place. So they maketheir money by essentially
referring, and then I still getthe same rate as the market rate
in the process and have the cashoffer to do so. So that was just
(21:11):
the purchase side. to yourquestion. How did I get to that
point? Wasn't that yourquestion? See this is this is
why, you know, you keep track ofthe questions was Was that your
question?
Sean Cooper (21:27):
That was that was part of it? Yeah, it was, you
know, how did you go about it?
So the other aspect, you alreadykind of talked about this a fair
bit, but was like, how did youactually find this specific
place? So
Chris Holling (21:40):
gotcha. Okay. I was I was doing a lot of hunting
around like I was talking aboutthe a lot of very active real
estate investors will tell youthat you should really first do
the number crunching on 100deals, or 100. Real Estate
Investing opportunities, 100properties, before you actually
(22:04):
make your first one, just kindof as a rule of thumb, so that
you are crunching numbers andyou're going through the reps.
And by the time that we had donethis I I had done over that
amount by accident, I didn'teven mean to like shoot for that
Mark I just had by that time.
And so I was looking around alot of places. And it's, it does
take a level of creativity, likeyou were talking about where we
(22:24):
said, okay, let's check out thishouse. We go and check it out.
And it's in the type of area wewanted in the first place. So we
did our research to find out. Isit okay on that state City
County Hoa level in the firstplace?
Sean Cooper (22:41):
Right
Chris Holling (22:41):
Once we found out that that was okay. Then we
showed up and poked around thehouse and thought, Okay, how can
we split this up to give itprivate access so that they
Sean Cooper (22:47):
Slick yeah, really have their own space
entirely. You can do short termrenting where you say you rent
out a room and share the kitchenor something. And some people do
that. And I personally don'tenjoy renting those. So I don't
want to offer that as a thing to
Chris Holling (23:04):
so then they can come and go as they please and
rent. If that makes sense. Ijust I just don't personally
enjoy that option. And so whywould I offer that option if I
don't even enjoy it. And so whenwe were able to, somewhat
creatively, look at the look atthe house and go, I see a way to
(23:26):
privatize this entrance and walloff this area. So it's private,
and make it so that they canoperate within their own, then
we did just that we were able tomake the purchase. And then got
in and we walled up a couple ofareas put in a door put in some
newer features that I thoughtwere important like egress
windows, which are windows forthe basement, if you've never
(23:48):
heard of that. And a centralAC system, because I wanted
to make sure everybody remaind comfy, and some very minor
aintenance things. And then Iput in a smart lock that sits a
the front door that I kept,have complete access to all th
codes. And so it's alwaysa private code, and it's per gu
st and it logs each time the peson comes in and out and I can
(24:12):
ell who what code is used.
o I temporarily give the code tmy guest and that if they'r
staying for three days, then i's active for three days and th
n it's not active after that.
nd it's pretty self sufficent past that point.
you know, we're not sharing akitchen is ultimately it
Sean Cooper (24:33):
Yeah, no. Um, so as we've gone through this, you've
talked about some of theperceived advantages of this
type of real estate investment,at least for you personally, now
that you're in it, you've you'vebeen doing it for a while now.
Which of those perceivedadvantages turned out to be
(24:54):
legitimate? Which ones weremaybe overblown or non existent
at all?
Chris Holling (24:59):
Hmm. Okay, the the legitimate advantage
that I have gotten from it is adoing exactly what I wanted. It
operates on its own, it is aseparate portion to the house,
it's private enough to where ifpeople want to meet us, then we
welcome it. But it's privateenough to where there's been
(25:20):
several guests that I've nevereven seen, to be honest. And so
I, I know that they're gettingtheir privacy as well. And not
not just on on our end. So it's,it's functioning, and it is
getting a return on myinvestment in the way that that
I was hoping for, which was atthe very least, being able to
(25:41):
help out with the cost of mymortgage. And, really, for for
all intents and purposes, thethe very first month we were
just shy of making the mortgage.
But second month we we obtainedour mortgage, as well as some
(26:01):
cash flow, along with that
Sean Cooper (26:02):
way to way to just go ahead and blow my my question
number seven. Thanks for thatChris
Chris Holling (26:07):
Question number seven, what question are we even
on?
Sean Cooper (26:11):
Four
Chris Holling (26:12):
Four. Okay, well, I'll forget by then don't, don't
worry about it. Now. One thingactually, it's funny, I might
blow it right here. One thingthat was a thing I didn't expect
was that when you're talkingabout numbers there, there are
gross numbers. And then there isa net profit, so to speak, where
(26:33):
all of your expenses are paid.
So like the the number that youfind after your expenses are
paid is, is the number that'slike your net your cash flow at
that point. And when I waslooking at gross numbers, the
thing that I didn't considerthat, that I should have, I
guess, is that when I wascomparing other comparable
properties, making X amount, Ithought, That's insane. I've
(26:56):
never even heard of that. Itdidn't really include the
cleaning costs that that youhave, which you can clean it on
your own. But I've got too muchgoing on in my life, to also
take that on, because really,it's a second job at that point.
So I needed tomake sure I had a cleaning crew
Sean Cooper (27:12):
Right.
come in, and they do a greatjob. And it's it's a very fluid
process. But it really dropsthat amount of gross cost two
less than you would thinkbecause it's still gross, like
say, say cleaning costs $500 atthe end of the month, then you
(27:33):
still have your gross amountafter cleaning. And that those
numbers were still good. Butthose weren't the numbers that I
expected out of the gate justbecause you charge the renter
for the cleaning fee. And so Idon't even see it. But when you
are talking to people, and theysay these are my gross numbers,
that usually includes thecleaning fee that you don't even
(27:55):
see in the first place when youfirst talked to people about it,
if that makes sense.
So it almostinflates what the what it sounds
like they're getting.
Chris Holling (28:06):
Yes,
Sean Cooper (28:07):
yeah.
Chris Holling (28:07):
Yes. And I mean, like it's, it's still it's still
good. But it's, it does inflateit further than then you thing.
On top of that, at least it didfor me on those first
conversations that I had everlooking into this,
Sean Cooper (28:21):
that's fair, that actually leads right into my
next question because I wouldkind of classify that as a
challenge or an unexpectedhurdle. And one of the other
challenges that you and I havediscussed offline is revolves
around pricing. So figuring outthe appropriate price to the
(28:41):
unit to optimize profitability,and you know, it being rented
and that sort of thingconsistently. Can you tell us a
little bit about that, thelimitations on the platform, and
any other challenges that maybewere unforeseen,
Chris Holling (29:04):
the two most common short term rental
programs. One is called VRBO,and one is called Airbnb and I
don't really have a big systeminto how I picked mine Mine was
much more commonly used in myarea and with the real estate
(29:25):
networking group that I'm now apart of, it's it is the the
program that is used as majorityamong this group in particular,
so I
Sean Cooper (29:36):
That's fair
Chris Holling (29:37):
I legitimately don't have a I prefer one over
the other because I've triedboth I've really only tried one
and I do appreciate a lot ofaspects about it. And so I don't
have a you know, one reallyobviously stuck out really just
look into what works for you.
And for me, it was the one thatwas majorly used in the area. So
(29:57):
I feel like it communicatesbetter with people that are
looking anyway.
Sean Cooper (30:03):
Gotcha.
Chris Holling (30:06):
The pricing, that's what you asked. So I, I'm
kind of cheating on this,because of the same network
group that I got a part of,like, if you're interested in
this, like find other people oflike minds, chances are, there's
always somebody that is biggerand badder and smarter than you
at at anything in life. And I, Ireally try to keep that in mind.
(30:29):
Because if I don't, then I'm notgoing to be able to learn new
things from somebody that mighthave a different perspective
than me. And so, go out thereand find find a network, find a
opportunity, there's lots ofreal, real REIAs in almost every
state, they real estateinvesting association of some
(30:50):
sort. And you can just googlefinding one of your own. And if
you are interested in realestate, there are lots of
opportunities. So within my own,and I started making contact
with these people, I started toask, Well, what, what should I
charge do you think? And theysaid, I think with your property
in particular, I'm comfy withnumbers on here, I guess that's
(31:14):
it's up to you, do you care?
Sean Cooper (31:15):
Now go for it,
Chris Holling (31:16):
okay.
So they pretty much out of thegate, they said, I think with
your property, the way that youhave yours set up, you can get
around 150 to 175 a night. Thereare stages that need to happen
before that, where you aregaining your publicity. And you
need to make sure that it it'sadvertised well, and you have a
(31:39):
good reputation, and you havegood reviews to get to that
point. But they were saying Ibelieve you can make it to this
level. And I think that you canacquire those things which we
are starting to come close tothat currently, or we're playing
with about that range right now.
So specific to your question ofhow did you discover pricing?
(32:00):
Well, I started with a realloose idea based off of somebody
else's advice that operateswithin this network. And then
really, it's just a matter of ustrying and seeing where things
land and seeing, you know, ifnobody books, then that's a
pretty good indication thatmaybe we need to readjust some
stuff. And ultimately, as aswe've done it, we've still
(32:23):
gathered, still gathered bookingand still continue to, and we
are about to hit a new mark,actually in a couple of days
that will give us a new titlethat will help promote some of
our help promote the unit alittle bit as well as give us a
a reputation that's backed bythe program. So
Sean Cooper (32:46):
Right, because I think you mentioned that there
are some limitations or certainhurdles you have to or
milestones you have to achievein order to do certain types of
promotional pricing and thingsof that nature.
Chris Holling (32:59):
Yes, so the promotional pricing outright,
like putting a discount on yourproperty and getting some
advertising is more just beingestablished for about a month,
the title that I'm referring tothat we're about to get to, you
have to have a history of goodreviews, you have to have a
history of good response timeson the program itself. And you
(33:21):
have to have a certain amount ofstays depending on how long or
how short that they've been. Andyou have to do all of those by
the time they do their quarterlyreview. And in our case, the
next review is going to be in acouple of days, once you acquire
that then people can search forpeople that only have that title
and therefore have a goodreputation backed by that
(33:42):
program. And so we become partof a special search system for
people that care about that aswell as the program is more
likely to promote it becausethey know that you have a good
reputation. And in doing so youget more bookings and you can
also increase your prices alittle bit because you are a I
guess a cut above so to speakbecause you're you are doing the
(34:05):
legwork to make sure that it's aquality unit.
Sean Cooper (34:08):
Oh, there's less risk on the renters side
Chris Holling (34:11):
correct
Sean Cooper (34:11):
of things
Chris Holling (34:12):
Yes. Right.
It's it's bound to be a more amore quality option and more
quality stay as far as ifthere's an issue, then it will
be addressed. Because there's agood reputation but also exactly
to what you're saying thatthere's there's less risk of
something going wrong becausethey have been actively
established as, as somebodythat's helpful, somebody that
(34:33):
will will take care of the jobproperly.
Sean Cooper (34:36):
Right. You've been vetted.
Chris Holling (34:37):
Right. Exactly.
And so once we once we reachthat stage, then we'll we'll
play with the pricing and see ifpeople continue to book and I,
they they've continued so fareven without this title. So I
believe that's a that's a goodpiece. One personal piece of
advice that I'll offer tosomebody if they are doing short
term stuff or if they'reinterested in they're going down
(35:00):
this road, it's been my personalexperience that it's almost
better to charge a little abovewhat the going rate is in the
area rather than below you wouldthink it's below in order to try
and be competitive and bringpeople in which as you're
starting out might be true. ButI've found that if you have
something that's more expensivein general especially if you
(35:23):
have a quality place that peoplewill want to stay at anyway, it
tends to bring in a type ofclient that is less likely to
mess up your stuff rather thanone that's only looking for a
deal because the ones that arelooking for a deal I've found
are more likely to have someform of a damage to your
(35:43):
property or or an issue or orexpecting a deal so to speak. So
on a very personal note, we'vewe found that that shooting a
little above the area tends toattract a certain type of person
that we we like to have asespecially as we live on the
(36:04):
property so
Sean Cooper (36:10):
for sure
Chris Holling (36:10):
makes sense.
Sean Cooper (36:12):
Yeah, I was curious if you want to expand on that it
sounds like there's a story thatgoes along with that.
Chris Holling (36:20):
I mean, the thing is, is that it's that was some
advice that I was finding andearly early on when we were
doing some of these we had acouple of questionable problems
that came through of like werethey actually honoring our rules
for no smoking and we weredealing with less questions on
(36:40):
the program itself of saying ohwell can you cut me a deal for
this once we started to get outof that bracket so to speak but
as far as you know stories forfor other people there's it is
still short term you know that'sthat's also what turns people
off about it is that there'sthere's not a large vetting
process in comparison You know,when you
Sean Cooper (37:00):
Right
Chris Holling (37:01):
when you have somebody that's held there for a
long period of time doing
Sean Cooper (37:03):
You're not doing a background check,
Chris Holling (37:05):
right exactly no I mean this program we have
opted to make sure that we havea government ID issued so it
still keeps people prettyaccountable but it doesn't have
as in depth as check as a longterm would be but you know, I'll
have that I was I was talkingwith somebody from my network
the other day that was tellingme that they they were doing a
(37:28):
rental and I guess an entiremariachi band was in their place
and they were driving by andthey noticed it and they had to
kick them out like like there'sstill weird stuff that goes on
but generally if if you'reshooting for we're trying to
attract a a different group thatthat might be less likely to
(37:49):
screw up the area then thenwe've found that just making
sure you have quality place thatyou can justify charging that
will attract the right kind ofperson.
Sean Cooper (37:59):
Gotcha. What other learning curves have you come
across?
Chris Holling (38:03):
Hmm overall, I'd say the biggest learning curve
was like I was talking aboutwith doing the the 100 deals or
so in my head where you'relooking at different properties
and different opportunities andlooking into regulations and
where to find those consideringnumbers like how much does it
(38:25):
cost you in taxes? Because ifit's that much more in taxes,
can you really just just doingthe numbers itself was was a
learning curve? And I'd say I'dsay general repairs
Sean Cooper (38:42):
You haven't even done all the taxes yet you
get to you get
Chris Holling (38:45):
Oh, no
Sean Cooper (38:45):
to deal with that for the first time in April. of
next year
Chris Holling (38:48):
Right now I am I'm not looking forward to any
of that. But I when I'm talkingabout that, I'm talking about
crunching the numbers and makingthe considerations into what
your expenses are going to be.
So mortgage, the taxes the costfor you know, how does the
program affect things, what typeof amenities there you're going
to be looking at, like,considering all of the business
(39:09):
expenses because that's whatyou're going to be doing. I'd
say the other learning curvewould be I'm familiar with
houses and and renovations justas a whole but the actual
operational process of it andwhat needs to be done and how
things all work is why I broughtin a general contractor. I'm
(39:32):
sure I could have done a lot ofYouTube and screwed it up and
then paid the same amount forsomebody to come in and unscrew
up my stuff and then fix it butinstead I just outright went for
the contractor and so havingsome of those, oh I want to do
this well that's fine, but yougot to hit these these marks
first was also a learning curvethat I think happens to anyone
(39:55):
really trying to think ifthere's anything else that's
takes out i don't i don't thinkso but the yeah
Sean Cooper (40:03):
that's fair
Chris Holling (40:03):
looking at the numbers and business expenses
ahead of time and making surethat you're not just seeing
dollar signs and you'reconsidering what the cost is for
for it to operate appropriatelyis is very important.
Sean Cooper (40:16):
Well, like I said you already more or less
answered this question because Iwas gonna ask you you know about
general idea of the outcome ifyou broke even came out ahead
that sort of thing. And I knowin your particular circumstance
like we we touched on brieflybriefly previously for you
breakeven was kind of a almost atougher mark because you had
(40:40):
such a good deal in terms ofyour rental previously so the
assumption I would make and Ithink you and I have talked
about before is if somebody iscurrently renting in their their
same market especially with theway things are today, then the
offset the the breakeven pointis actually easier to hit
(41:04):
because you're dealing with amuch higher rental that you're
paying on a monthly basis thatyou're you're switching over to
that mortgage and then trying tooffset with the income so is
there any additional color you'dlike to add around that?
Chris Holling (41:21):
I think that's a good point i i do think that my
circumstance was just a littlebit more unique because so what
we what we had because that'swhat we're talking about is rent
rent was on the cheaper side forus because we were with family
and it was still a verysymbiotic relationship because
being with family offered whatwhat benefits you get for living
(41:44):
with family in the first place.
But it also means that you don'thave your own shared space. So
the the money was helpful forthem and the extra sets of hands
were helpful for us really withthe kiddo and it in doing so the
the rent was actually only semia factor of that it was much
more about us personally wantingto get our own space, and
(42:07):
wanting to to be able to spreadour wings, so to speak, I guess
with that, but but having ourown our own elbow room was was
very paramount in specific to,how do you compare when you're
looking at rent versus versusnot even if you have a cheap
rent deal, or something alongthose lines, is very much a, a
(42:29):
long term thing, like I I knowthat personally and this I feel
like this is hard to do withouta diagram. But I really tried to
make it so that my paychecktakes care of me and my
expenses. And my investing hasthe capability to operate on its
(42:50):
own. And while I plan oncontinuing to put into it, or
finding ways for it to continueto grow, I want it to be able to
function on its own so that ifmy paycheck only takes care of
my expenses for that month, forwhatever reason, because a bunch
of stuff goes wrong, I want theinvestments to still be able to
continue to grow. And so this isa springboard into that where
(43:14):
our plan is we just don't havean exact route is to move from
this point. And whether it'sselling it or keeping the home
and continuing to rent it orsome variation of that. This is
going to be a springboard intoallowing investments to grow
beyond that. So we are takingthe time to actively put into it
(43:36):
right now so that we can stepaway from it and allow it to
grow on its own. And so if youare making a consideration like
Sean is talking about, okay, doI step out of this renting area
to get into a spot there'sthere's nothing wrong with
stepping back into a rentingarea later, or even continuing
(43:56):
to rent. While while you've gotstuff that's going on, that's
cheap, and then using money onthe side to allow real estate
specifically or some type ofinvestment grow for you while
you're continuing to rent it'svery, very case by case basis on
what works best for you. We justhappen to also want our own
(44:17):
space and wanted to aggressivelyinvest in so we were willing to
take on some risk and this wasour way to do both. Does that
does that answer that pretty?
Well?
Sean Cooper (44:28):
Yeah, yeah, very much so.
Chris Holling (44:30):
Okay.
Sean Cooper (44:31):
Yep. That brings me to the the ultimate question if
you will, and and one follow upquestion to it. And so would you
do it again? And if so, whatwhat would you do differently?
Chris Holling (44:47):
Oh, okay. Yes, I would do it again. Ask me again
in a year you know, I'm stillright on cloud nine of a couple
of months in and, and just justthe fact that I'm getting proof
of concept right now is iswonderful to me. So maybe maybe
I'm
Sean Cooper (45:02):
for sure.
Chris Holling (45:03):
Maybe I'm a little rose colored glasses at
the moment. And that's but whatI would do in the future Hmm.
Here's the problem with withthat question is this was done
(45:24):
over years of me doing researchand coming to the conclusion
that I did. And in a way Ididn't even realize that this
route that we picked was anoption until this year. So I was
going to tell you, My onlyregret was not doing it sooner.
But I really think that if I didit sooner, I wouldn't have had
(45:45):
the knowledge that I have now.
And I might have made somebigger mistakes on the way
Sean Cooper (45:49):
very valid point.
Chris Holling (45:51):
So yeah, I want to I remember when I first
started getting into investment,like it was actually around the
time that you and I very firststarted talking there was a I
had I had a patient by chancethat he he was just he was sick
and he needed to go to thehospital we we got to talking
because I mean, what else areyou going to do back there but
(46:14):
we got to talking and he wastelling me that he's got a
business that's up and running,I think it was a tire business
or something along those linesand he had just purchased it and
he was looking to do somethingelse and he was he was upset
what was that he had just gotteninto a fight with somebody and
he was dealing with a biglawsuit and his anxiety kicked
(46:37):
up because he was in thecourtroom and it it was just all
becoming a little overwhelmingfor him because the other person
didn't show up like a reallyreally messy circumstance that
just really caused a bunch ofdifferent problems and he told
me he's like you know it'sreally not about the money for
me I'm so upset about this andthis and this and I started
asking him about it and he'slike oh no, I I started
(46:59):
investing in real estate after Isold some of my businesses said
oh well you know tell me what'swhat is the best advice you can
give me because I'm just nowlooking into the possibility of
real estate investing at all andreally just investing in general
and he said the only piece ofadvice I'll give you is start
yesterday I wish I had done thisyears ago and again you know,
(47:22):
this isn't for everybody butit's it's something that stuck
with me because I thought okay,you know, I need to at least for
me, in my personal circumstanceat that point, I was interested
enough to where I knew it wasgoing to be a part of my
investing portfolio at somepoint. This just happened to
push it up in my priority listfor me personally. How's that?
Sean Cooper (47:46):
Yeah, I like it. I like it
Chris Holling (47:48):
Cool
Sean Cooper (47:48):
Is anything else you would add for our listeners?
Chris Holling (47:52):
Okay, I really know that I touched on this but
I want to stress it because Ireally do think that it's
important make sure that you aredoing it if you do get involved
in real estate investing, makesure that you are doing it for
you and for the right reasonsmeaning if you are doing it
strictly for numbers, make surethe numbers are good and that's
(48:16):
that's all you need to worryabout. For me I needed to make
sure that I had to I had a lotof considerations I had to
consider a place that was alsogoing to be comfortable for me
and my family so I had to lookin areas that I was comfortable
with that being as well as areasthat were going to be close to
family for us and if it's I usedto I was talking to a buddy of
(48:39):
mine about this yesterday I toldhim hey you know if if it was
just you and me and we were justlooking for money and we were
going to move in somewhere butyou know we didn't have these
these families attached to usyou know, you and me would be
out in this in this terriblepart of town and just bring a
couple of baseball bats and youknow just just ride it out for a
couple of years once we buy thisbuilding and and then turn a
(49:00):
profit but like that doesn'twork for me in my circumstance.
And I think that could have beenmore lucrative overall and I
would have gotten way more coolstories in the process. But it
It did not work for what wasneeded in my life and I think we
talked about that a lot on thispodcast is that when you are
(49:23):
when you are looking at allthese things and you're looking
at your personal finances andyou're investing you need to
find out what's comfortable foryou and you need to know why
you're doing it which is how weled to doing this at all because
of our long term goals as wellas what we needed right now. And
I think that's that's reallyimportant for everybody to
(49:44):
consider if you're looking intoit at all and not just a I'm
gonna do it to do it.
Sean Cooper (49:51):
Good advice
Chris Holling (49:52):
Cool,
Sean Cooper (49:53):
cool man
Chris Holling (49:54):
I like it
Sean Cooper (49:54):
that's all I had on my end so
Chris Holling (49:56):
sweet. Well you know interview time for you.
What did you What did you thinkis just like it? Did you? Did
you like switching it around andasking me questions. It felt it
felt weird, right?
Sean Cooper (50:06):
Yeah, it felt like the pressure was off all I had
to do was sit here and listen.
Chris Holling (50:12):
Well, I'll tell you what,
Sean Cooper (50:13):
except I probably didn't fill the role of being
funny and entertaining. Youstill had to do that. So you
know, really, really just putmore on you.
Chris Holling (50:24):
Well, well, thanks for joining us on the
truth about investing. I'm ChrisHolling. And I'm also Chris
Holling.
Sean Cooper (50:32):
Yeah, I'm Sean Cooper. Thanks for that
Chris Holling (50:36):
Trying to get excited about it. Oh man. Okay.
Yeah. Let me actually wrap thisup. Thank you again, everybody,
for coming to join us. And thankyou. Thank you for asking me
those questions. those are thoseare great questions. I'm glad.
I'm glad I had to actually thinkabout stuff. And it wasn't just
like, spewing information thatwas that was great. So I
(50:57):
appreciate you asking those.
Sean Cooper (50:57):
You're welcome.
Chris Holling (50:59):
And thank you everybody for coming out to
listen or picking up yourheadphone to listen, I guess.
And thank you for taking thetime to want to better yourself.
I just had a brain fart. I don'tknow. That was weird. My name is
Chris Holling.
Sean Cooper (51:18):
You had a brain fart about your own name.
Chris Holling (51:20):
I know I just talking just English was not my
strong suit. right then. Andthank you for calling attention
to it. Because now any type ofinsecurities that I have are
just blown even further intoproportion. And
Sean Cooper (51:35):
you're welcome. I'm Sean Cooper.
Chris Holling (51:38):
Yeah, and that did come. See now I'm all tongue
tied. Have truth about investingback to basics. kit, you can
show up next time. Did you knowif you want if you
Sean Cooper (51:51):
You did great on the questions, we'll just leave
it at that you did greatanswering the questions.
Chris Holling (51:58):
Thanks, buddy.
We'll see you guys here. Hearyou next dang it. I'm stopping
this.
Sean Cooper (52:06):
Yeah, we'll get this right next.
Chris Holling (52:10):
podcast disclaimer, disclaimer. The
disclaimer following thisdisclaimer, is the disclaimer
that is required for thispodcast to be up and running and
fully functioning and movingforward. This is going to be the
same disclaimer that you willhear in each one of our
episodes. We hope you enjoy itjust as much as we enjoyed
(52:31):
making it. All content on thispodcast and accompanying
transcripts is for informationalpurposes only. opinions
expressed here in by Sean Cooperare solely those of fit
financial consulting LLC, unlessotherwise specifically sighted.
(52:54):
Chris Holling is not affiliatedwith fit financial consulting,
LLC nor do the views expressedby Chris Holling represent the
views of fit financialconsulting, LLC. This podcast is
intended to be used in itsentirety. Any other use beyond
(53:14):
its author's intent,distribution or copying of the
contents of this podcast isstrictly prohibited. Nothing in
this podcast is intended aslegal accounting or tax advice
and is for informationalpurposes only. All information
or ideas provided should bediscussed in detail with an
(53:37):
advisor, accountant or legalcounsel prior to implementation.
This podcast may reference linksto websites for the convenience
of our users. Our firm has nocontrol over the accuracy or
content of these other websites.
advisory services offeredthrough fit financial
(53:59):
consulting, LLC, an investmentadvisor firm registered in the
states of Washington andColorado. The presence of this
podcast on the internet shallnot be directly or indirectly
interpreted as a solicitation ofinvestment advisory services to
persons of another jurisdictionunless otherwise permitted by
(54:22):
statute. Follow up orindividualized responses to
consumers in a particular stateby our firm in the rendering of
personalized investment advicefor compensation shall not be
made without our first complyingwith jurisdiction requirements,
or pursuant an applicable stateexemption. For information
(54:47):
concerning the status ordisciplinary history of a broker
dealer, investment advisor ortheir representatives. A
consumer should contact theirstate's purities administrator.
This has been a test of theemergency disclosures.
Sean Cooper (55:12):
That was my favorite of our disclaimers was
when you did the visine guycommercial,
Chris Holling (55:18):
I still throw it in every once in a while
Sean Cooper (55:19):
I know it was on there for the last time I
Chris Holling (55:21):
For red eyes, use clear eyes
This is the truth about investing back to basics
podcast. Where we want to helpyou take control of your
personal finance and long terminvestments. If you're looking
for a way to learn the why andhow of investing, then you found
the right place. Thank you fortaking the time to learn how to
(00:23):
better yourselves.
Because because we're, you know,interviewing me today, do you
have jokes for me today? Oh,
Sean Cooper (00:37):
no, I did not go that far. No, I not. No, I took
over the the coming up withquestions portion. And outside
of that, you're still on for theintro and all that good stuff.
Chris Holling (00:51):
Oh, man.
Okay, well,
Sean Cooper (00:54):
yep.
Chris Holling (00:55):
The intro and the funny funny jokes.
Sean Cooper (00:59):
That's why you're here.
Chris Holling (01:02):
I agree.
Sean Cooper (01:04):
I'm not gonna be funny. If I was the funny one,
then my videos would have morehits.
Chris Holling (01:09):
This would be it.
That's, I guess there's sometruth to that. Okay. All right.
Well, I guess I guess becauseI'm the funny one, then we don't
we don't have to prep withjokes. It'll just it'll just be
be fluid.
Sean Cooper (01:25):
fluid. Okay,
Chris Holling (01:26):
jokes throughout.
Sean Cooper (01:28):
So then you can introduce us and then I'll start
grilling you with questions?
Chris Holling (01:32):
Okay. Well, welcome, ladies and gentlemen,
boys and girls, people of allages to another episode of the
truth about investing back tobasics. My name is Chris
Holling.
Sean Cooper (01:46):
And I'm Sean Cooper.
Chris Holling (01:47):
And Sean's gonna interview me today about stuff.
I okay, I guess I can throw in alittle bit more of an intro that
so
Sean Cooper (01:57):
yeah.
Chris Holling (01:59):
The the previous Yeah, it was the previous
episode that we did, we focusedon alternative investments. And
one of those that we addressedwas actually real estate. We
talked about real estate. Andreally, there's there's entire
podcasts that are dedicated tothis through and through, and
there are very, very successfulones at that. And I mean, just
(02:20):
to give a guess kind of my ownshout out to it unless I need to
bleep it later. I really enjoybigger pockets, bigger pockets,
does a really good job of doinga real estate investing podcast,
they've got a lot of really coolresources that I've personally
learned a lot from just on myown time, my own research. And,
(02:41):
specifically, the reason we'retalking about it at all today is
a large investment where it's mymost active investment is I do a
short term rental that I havearranged that I'm going to try
not describe too much so thatSean can ask me questions.
Sean Cooper (03:00):
That's right
Chris Holling (03:01):
But, but I run a short term rental property, this
is very new for me. And so wewanted to get a recording of
this on kind of the early stagesof some of that. And
specifically, for me, it's aversion that BiggerPockets
would, or others, depending onhow I edit this would reference
(03:22):
it as called house hacking. Andso what I am doing is I have
recently purchased a house a fewmonths ago and did some
renovations in order to separateit into two functional units.
And short term rent one of theunits, some people do this with
just a room or they stay in thebasement, and then they separate
(03:43):
the other part in the house. Orsome people do it where it's
just, you know, a carriage houseseparately or some variation of
that. But it's it's worked wellfor us so far. And we're
starting to see some returns onit. And now we get to get into
the meat potatoes of kind of howit works and answer. I really
(04:04):
have no idea what questions Seanhas for me. So I'm kind of
curious, actually. But yeah,that's that's why we're
interviewing me today.
Sean Cooper (04:13):
Exactly. Exactly.
So I to start off I know this isprobably a multi faceted answer
that you have. Because you knowyou have when you have capital,
you have lots of opportunitiesopen to you with what you could
do with it. And I knowpreviously you guys were renting
and you had a pretty sweet dealin terms of your rent. So what
(04:38):
made you decide to take yourcapital and invest in real
estate in the first place?
Chris Holling (04:46):
Hmm, okay, yeah, that's a that's a
cool question. So Wow, it's notjust a multi faceted question
but a kind of a multiple reasonsanswer.
Sean Cooper (04:59):
Right
Chris Holling (04:59):
Uh, There, there is something to be said for just
kind of the inception of some ofmy first, like foundational
pieces of learning in investing,where a lot of people, when they
first start thinking aboutinvesting at all, when when
they're trying to get out of thegrind of just, you work, you get
(05:21):
paid, you pay bills, and thenyou do that until you retire.
And then you die. Like to, tokind of have just a different
mindset. A very common book thata lot of people read that I did
read was Rich Dad, Poor Dad,Robert Kiyosaki. And it he did
make his money in real estate.
And so he does a lot of realestate examples in that. And
(05:43):
that is, by far not the only wayto gain ground in investing. But
it's an example that gets usedpretty consistently. And so I
was, I was pretty aware to it,just early stages of learning of
just considering it as anoption. And then by chance, when
we moved back, and like Seanmentioned, we were still renting
(06:05):
and, and doing some of that,then I knew that we still wanted
to get our own space that wecould, we could call our own.
And we tried to figure out howto do that, but also how to
simultaneously advance ouractive investing plan, because
comparatively to a lot ofpeople, I am a pretty aggressive
(06:25):
investor, just because I do havea pretty secure job. And I'm
pretty comfortable with the ideathat if absolutely everything
blows up in my face, I can kindof hit the reset button a little
bit. And I'm willing to take onthat risk. And so to look at it
as a how do we get started andget a good springboard of going.
(06:45):
And also how do we get a spaceto ourself this seemed like one
of the best ways to do it. Wealso entertained getting a hold
of a multi unit place outrightlike a triplex or four Plex, you
can do that with an FHA loan,FHA will approve up to a quad
Plex and we looked at some ofthose options and just wound up
(07:06):
going this route instead, aftermultiple multiple comparisons
and numbers and lots of numbercrunching and lots of lots of
learning between then and nowand it we're in the right place
that I feel like fits us bestpersonally. So
Sean Cooper (07:27):
awesome.
Chris Holling (07:28):
How's that?
Sean Cooper (07:28):
Yeah, no, that's I mean that's what you got to do
is find out what works best foryou. And to to that point you
referenced some of the differentideas of investing in real
estate that you guys talkedabout and I think split buying a
house and then splitting it andrenting half is a fairly unique
(07:52):
because a lot of real estateinvestors think you know that
you've got the fix and flippersout there you've got people that
just go around they buy up, buya house, rent it, use it to pay
itself off refinance it, usethat to buy another one and
continue the process. In thiscase you're living and you know,
you know working the house atthe same time so
Chris Holling (08:14):
correct
Sean Cooper (08:15):
What led you to that particular method
specifically Why did you choosethat manner of investing in real
estate specifically?
Chris Holling (08:24):
Oh, interesting.
Okay, um, so something that Ithink I've been learning a lot
about real estate, investing inparticular is it it really does
widely widely vary the optionsand how well you can do in
certain areas justgeographically and I don't just
(08:48):
mean like per state, but I meanlike per city per county per
neighborhood and that can vary alot of things wildly so strictly
short term as an example, if youare looking in a spot out in I
don't know say Maine, I loveMaine Maine is a beautiful place
(09:11):
to be but their touristy time isvery much the summertime because
of lobsters and lobster seasonand sometimes the the winter a
bit just because people like toget out and, and a little bit of
fall to see the colors andwhatnot. But those are slower
times in comparison to summer.
So when you're looking at thatas a real estate investment, and
(09:32):
you're considering like vacationhome renting, which is a that's
sort of one of the versions ofshort term renting, then that's
that's the type of thing thatyou got to consider because when
you're looking at those, thenyou're offsetting the costs for
when you know when the gettingis good and you can get good
rates and good good returnversus the slower months and
kind of feast and famine andwriting through that. Whereas
(09:56):
say you're looking in the DenverMetro area then Denver Metro
area there's there's tourismthat kind of occurs all year
round and there really is alarge influx of people that's
always coming into the area andso because people are are moving
in moving out moving from placeto place, it's pretty common to
(10:17):
have things like short termrental long term rental
available to you and thereforethere's also a lot of
opportunity for growth like likefix and flips like he referenced
there's there's just a lot thathappens on the real estate side
here whereas say you find asmall town in Iowa I don't know
(10:38):
why I picked Iowa I just did.
But there there might not be alot of traffic of people coming
in and out or moving into it soyou could get a house for four
grand I saw one go for fourgrand the other day, which is
just wild in comparison toDenver Metro numbers. But you
know, then if you do that, andyou choose to long term rent it
(10:59):
out for I don't know 500 bucks amonth, then you could still
technically turn a profit onthat and, and so it widly varies
depending on the area thatyou're looking at in the first
place. So to answer yourquestion, we wanted to be
somewhere where we were in theDenver Metro area because that's
where family is for us. And kindof particular to the Denver
(11:22):
Metro area. The short termrenting tends to be relatively
consistent and not justvacationing like you would find
in Vail because of the fact thatit is year round tourism year
round business year roundseasons it is it is a constant
inflow of people which makes theshort term more regular than you
(11:43):
would find in in other areas andso once we once we started like
comparing a lot of numbers andwe were trying to figure out do
we want to take on long term Dowe want to take on a little bit
of extra risk on the short termside but the payoff could be a
little bit better once wedetermine that we were we were
(12:05):
comfortable with a short termroute that's where you start
getting into the morecomplicated portions of
regulation because it is a newerthing and some cities some
counties don't like it. So evenif you said I want to do this
and this is the best thing forme and then you look at say
Highlands Ranch is a greatexample just in the Denver Metro
(12:28):
area if you decide to look it upHighlands Ranch has a hard no we
do not allow short term rentalwhether you are listed on the
property if nothing absolutelyhard, no
Sean Cooper (12:41):
interesting.
Chris Holling (12:41):
Whereas Denver specifically it's okay so long
as you are the primary residentand so there's lots of either
splitting the house or acarriage house is a great
example where there'sessentially an ADU or an
accessory dwelling unit. So youare the primary owner of that
but as soon as you split it upand it develops essentially to
(13:04):
addresses then that's whenyou're rezoning and it's a
duplex and duplexes cannot beshort term rented from what I
understand in city of Denver. Soto specific to ours because it's
short term, you have to gothrough the stages of okay is we
want to do this for thesereasons. Okay, now that we've
determined we want to is itapproved by the state? Is it
(13:27):
approved by the county is itapproved by the city is it
approved by the HOA and theneighborhood that I'm looking at
if all of those is yes then it'sokay to do there and that's when
you have to try and find a spotthat that works well depending
on where you want to be andwhere you want that location to
be so it's got a lot of steps tomake it happen but as long as
you're looking in that specificgeographical area like I was
(13:51):
trying to describe then then itcan work out quite well and
that's how we landed in that iswe wanted a space that was for
us and did the did the math didthe research found an area that
works well for us in particularand is also approved to do so
and went through all thosestages to do it where it's did
some permitting by the city andso we have a renters permit for
(14:15):
those things and got therenovations done with the the
when you have the vision in mindwe found the house and we said
okay, I think we can do it thisway. Got into the house did the
renovations and now it itfunctions on its own with its
own private entrance and so Iyou know it's it's pretty hands
off, apart from very minor stuffhere and there. So
Sean Cooper (14:39):
nice. So a combination of circumstance as
well as strategy then,
Chris Holling (14:44):
yes,
Sean Cooper (14:44):
that kind of led you to this this particular
choice.
Chris Holling (14:47):
Yes, because if if we, with the circumstance and
strategy, the way that we see itis at the very least the the
market out here is very, verydifficult. It's very expensive,
and it's very, very competitive.
And if nothing else, justbecause of the level of expense,
rather than me trying to figureout a way to work extra overtime
(15:09):
to afford a house of some sort,I thought it would be better to
try and figure out a way to getmy house to work for me, which
kind of goes back into the RichDad Poor Dad example that if you
haven't read it, then one of thethings that they like to justify
is something we've referencedbefore is the separation between
assets and liabilities. And anasset, as a reminder is
(15:32):
something that you spend moneyon that's going to make you
money. And a liability issomething you spend money on
that's going to cost you money.
And if we bought a house,
Sean Cooper (15:44):
Chirs' definition not mine.
Chris Holling (15:46):
Right, right.
Sorry. With that. That's there'san entire episode dedicated to
that.
Sean Cooper (15:49):
Yes.
Chris Holling (15:52):
But yes, under my definition, then when I'm
looking at a house, and when I'mtrying to make this decision,
I'm saying do I want to take onthis liability? I can but how do
I want to do it? versus now I'mtaking on this liability and in
my psychological categorizething that I'm talking about.
(16:14):
Now, I am making it become anasset because this thing that
was going to cost me money isnow making me money or at the at
the very lowest instance of ithelping offset some of those
things, rather than it all justcoming out of my pocket.
Sean Cooper (16:30):
Yep, for sure. So how did you actually go about
starting this process? Andyou've touched on this a little
bit as we've we've gone throughhere, but can you if somebody
wanted to follow suit, what didyou actually go about doing? How
did you find places to look athow did you handle the financing
(16:52):
things of that nature?
Chris Holling (16:54):
Okay, so specific to Denver Metro
area, because that, like I'msaying it's it really there are
extra variables everywhere youlook so specific to this area, I
was able to utilize a lenderthat that was able to allow me
to do a cash offer that was veryparamount for what we wanted to
(17:14):
accomplish in order to staycompetitive in the market
because they're veryconsistently almost, geez, I
can't say every single one aslike a blanket statement, but
very consistently the housesthat are being sold out here
right now in this very currentmarket, as we record this in the
end of September, it could
Sean Cooper (17:37):
in 21'
Chris Holling (17:38):
right, It could change wildly here. But as it
stands right now, most housesare selling for about 50 to
100,000 over asking price.
Sean Cooper (17:48):
That's insane.
Chris Holling (17:50):
It's it is a lot.
And so in doing so, we needed tohave something that was
competitive and comparable. Andif you are doing a cash offer,
the closing process movesquicker, there's a couple of
fees that kind of get removedfrom the process so it it's like
having more money even thoughyou're not you don't have more
(18:10):
money in a way. And we were ableto go through a program that was
able to do a cash offer whichmade it
Sean Cooper (18:17):
so without actually naming that program because
Chris Holling (18:19):
that's what I'm trying to avoid.
Sean Cooper (18:20):
Yeah, I know, how would somebody go about finding
a program like that?
Chris Holling (18:26):
You know, it's It was so unique and it's so new
here in this area that I kind ofstumbled across it by my realtor
suggesting it
Sean Cooper (18:37):
okay,
Chris Holling (18:38):
but
Sean Cooper (18:38):
so maybe tap your realtor for advice on that one?
Chris Holling (18:41):
Sure. Or you know, there's there's really
nothing wrong with with talkingto multiple realtors, there's,
there's this
Sean Cooper (18:47):
oh absolutely
Chris Holling (18:48):
that Oh, there's there's a very strange dynamic
that exists where if you sign acontract with a realtor,
technically you're supposed touse that realtor, especially
with a broker and there's awhole bunch to that and the fact
of the matter is and I we I hopeto not get too much backlash
from this but like, if yourrealtor is not doing well by
(19:09):
you, you can find ways out ofthat contract. Absolutely. And
so when you are trying to findnew avenues because your realtor
isn't doing what you feel thatthey should be doing or really
just they're they're notoperating within your best
interest which is literallytheir job description. Then look
(19:30):
elsewhere, talk to other peopleand just compare because if you
find somebody that's reallywilling to go the extra mile for
you, then that's that's why youwant that person anyway. So
Sean Cooper (19:40):
for sure,
Chris Holling (19:41):
I say that to say that mine was going the extra
mile for me and found thisopportunity for me and and it
was it was very, very helpful.
So if you were looking for thatin particular, check your area
you know, have like a Googlesearch call around call some
maybe call a local Investor orsomething and try try to just
see what you can find out andspecifically ask for that, hey,
(20:05):
do you have you ever heard of aprogram that allows you to do a
cash offer, and and they act asyour cash offer. And that's how
it worked is they did a cashoffer, they closed, and then
they connected me with amortgage broker, and then the
mortgage was set up in a namethat they picked, or what the
(20:27):
mortgage company that theypicked, and how it works. And
the way that they make money isthat for me, I don't see a
difference. If the rate is 3%,then I get connected with this
mortgage broker. And they say,okay, we're the going rate right
now is 3%. So I'm just going tocharge this guy 3% Hey, you
(20:48):
company that just did the cashoffer, tell you what we're going
to give you point 5% becausewhile it's lower for us, we
never would have had thecontract if it wasn't for you in
the first place. So they maketheir money by essentially
referring, and then I still getthe same rate as the market rate
in the process and have the cashoffer to do so. So that was just
(21:11):
the purchase side. to yourquestion. How did I get to that
point? Wasn't that yourquestion? See this is this is
why, you know, you keep track ofthe questions was Was that your
question?
Sean Cooper (21:27):
That was that was part of it? Yeah, it was, you
know, how did you go about it?
So the other aspect, you alreadykind of talked about this a fair
bit, but was like, how did youactually find this specific
place? So
Chris Holling (21:40):
gotcha. Okay. I was I was doing a lot of hunting
around like I was talking aboutthe a lot of very active real
estate investors will tell youthat you should really first do
the number crunching on 100deals, or 100. Real Estate
Investing opportunities, 100properties, before you actually
(22:04):
make your first one, just kindof as a rule of thumb, so that
you are crunching numbers andyou're going through the reps.
And by the time that we had donethis I I had done over that
amount by accident, I didn'teven mean to like shoot for that
Mark I just had by that time.
And so I was looking around alot of places. And it's, it does
take a level of creativity, likeyou were talking about where we
(22:24):
said, okay, let's check out thishouse. We go and check it out.
And it's in the type of area wewanted in the first place. So we
did our research to find out. Isit okay on that state City
County Hoa level in the firstplace?
Sean Cooper (22:41):
Right
Chris Holling (22:41):
Once we found out that that was okay. Then we
showed up and poked around thehouse and thought, Okay, how can
we split this up to give itprivate access so that they
Sean Cooper (22:47):
Slick yeah, really have their own space
entirely. You can do short termrenting where you say you rent
out a room and share the kitchenor something. And some people do
that. And I personally don'tenjoy renting those. So I don't
want to offer that as a thing to
Chris Holling (23:04):
so then they can come and go as they please and
rent. If that makes sense. Ijust I just don't personally
enjoy that option. And so whywould I offer that option if I
don't even enjoy it. And so whenwe were able to, somewhat
creatively, look at the look atthe house and go, I see a way to
(23:26):
privatize this entrance and walloff this area. So it's private,
and make it so that they canoperate within their own, then
we did just that we were able tomake the purchase. And then got
in and we walled up a couple ofareas put in a door put in some
newer features that I thoughtwere important like egress
windows, which are windows forthe basement, if you've never
(23:48):
heard of that. And a centralAC system, because I wanted
to make sure everybody remaind comfy, and some very minor
aintenance things. And then Iput in a smart lock that sits a
the front door that I kept,have complete access to all th
codes. And so it's alwaysa private code, and it's per gu
st and it logs each time the peson comes in and out and I can
(24:12):
ell who what code is used.
o I temporarily give the code tmy guest and that if they'r
staying for three days, then i's active for three days and th
n it's not active after that.
nd it's pretty self sufficent past that point.
you know, we're not sharing akitchen is ultimately it
Sean Cooper (24:33):
Yeah, no. Um, so as we've gone through this, you've
talked about some of theperceived advantages of this
type of real estate investment,at least for you personally, now
that you're in it, you've you'vebeen doing it for a while now.
Which of those perceivedadvantages turned out to be
(24:54):
legitimate? Which ones weremaybe overblown or non existent
at all?
Chris Holling (24:59):
Hmm. Okay, the the legitimate advantage
that I have gotten from it is adoing exactly what I wanted. It
operates on its own, it is aseparate portion to the house,
it's private enough to where ifpeople want to meet us, then we
welcome it. But it's privateenough to where there's been
(25:20):
several guests that I've nevereven seen, to be honest. And so
I, I know that they're gettingtheir privacy as well. And not
not just on on our end. So it's,it's functioning, and it is
getting a return on myinvestment in the way that that
I was hoping for, which was atthe very least, being able to
(25:41):
help out with the cost of mymortgage. And, really, for for
all intents and purposes, thethe very first month we were
just shy of making the mortgage.
But second month we we obtainedour mortgage, as well as some
(26:01):
cash flow, along with that
Sean Cooper (26:02):
way to way to just go ahead and blow my my question
number seven. Thanks for thatChris
Chris Holling (26:07):
Question number seven, what question are we even
on?
Sean Cooper (26:11):
Four
Chris Holling (26:12):
Four. Okay, well, I'll forget by then don't, don't
worry about it. Now. One thingactually, it's funny, I might
blow it right here. One thingthat was a thing I didn't expect
was that when you're talkingabout numbers there, there are
gross numbers. And then there isa net profit, so to speak, where
(26:33):
all of your expenses are paid.
So like the the number that youfind after your expenses are
paid is, is the number that'slike your net your cash flow at
that point. And when I waslooking at gross numbers, the
thing that I didn't considerthat, that I should have, I
guess, is that when I wascomparing other comparable
properties, making X amount, Ithought, That's insane. I've
(26:56):
never even heard of that. Itdidn't really include the
cleaning costs that that youhave, which you can clean it on
your own. But I've got too muchgoing on in my life, to also
take that on, because really,it's a second job at that point.
So I needed tomake sure I had a cleaning crew
Sean Cooper (27:12):
Right.
come in, and they do a greatjob. And it's it's a very fluid
process. But it really dropsthat amount of gross cost two
less than you would thinkbecause it's still gross, like
say, say cleaning costs $500 atthe end of the month, then you
(27:33):
still have your gross amountafter cleaning. And that those
numbers were still good. Butthose weren't the numbers that I
expected out of the gate justbecause you charge the renter
for the cleaning fee. And so Idon't even see it. But when you
are talking to people, and theysay these are my gross numbers,
that usually includes thecleaning fee that you don't even
(27:55):
see in the first place when youfirst talked to people about it,
if that makes sense.
So it almostinflates what the what it sounds
like they're getting.
Chris Holling (28:06):
Yes,
Sean Cooper (28:07):
yeah.
Chris Holling (28:07):
Yes. And I mean, like it's, it's still it's still
good. But it's, it does inflateit further than then you thing.
On top of that, at least it didfor me on those first
conversations that I had everlooking into this,
Sean Cooper (28:21):
that's fair, that actually leads right into my
next question because I wouldkind of classify that as a
challenge or an unexpectedhurdle. And one of the other
challenges that you and I havediscussed offline is revolves
around pricing. So figuring outthe appropriate price to the
(28:41):
unit to optimize profitability,and you know, it being rented
and that sort of thingconsistently. Can you tell us a
little bit about that, thelimitations on the platform, and
any other challenges that maybewere unforeseen,
Chris Holling (29:04):
the two most common short term rental
programs. One is called VRBO,and one is called Airbnb and I
don't really have a big systeminto how I picked mine Mine was
much more commonly used in myarea and with the real estate
(29:25):
networking group that I'm now apart of, it's it is the the
program that is used as majorityamong this group in particular,
so I
Sean Cooper (29:36):
That's fair
Chris Holling (29:37):
I legitimately don't have a I prefer one over
the other because I've triedboth I've really only tried one
and I do appreciate a lot ofaspects about it. And so I don't
have a you know, one reallyobviously stuck out really just
look into what works for you.
And for me, it was the one thatwas majorly used in the area. So
(29:57):
I feel like it communicatesbetter with people that are
looking anyway.
Sean Cooper (30:03):
Gotcha.
Chris Holling (30:06):
The pricing, that's what you asked. So I, I'm
kind of cheating on this,because of the same network
group that I got a part of,like, if you're interested in
this, like find other people oflike minds, chances are, there's
always somebody that is biggerand badder and smarter than you
at at anything in life. And I, Ireally try to keep that in mind.
(30:29):
Because if I don't, then I'm notgoing to be able to learn new
things from somebody that mighthave a different perspective
than me. And so, go out thereand find find a network, find a
opportunity, there's lots ofreal, real REIAs in almost every
state, they real estateinvesting association of some
(30:50):
sort. And you can just googlefinding one of your own. And if
you are interested in realestate, there are lots of
opportunities. So within my own,and I started making contact
with these people, I started toask, Well, what, what should I
charge do you think? And theysaid, I think with your property
in particular, I'm comfy withnumbers on here, I guess that's
(31:14):
it's up to you, do you care?
Sean Cooper (31:15):
Now go for it,
Chris Holling (31:16):
okay.
So they pretty much out of thegate, they said, I think with
your property, the way that youhave yours set up, you can get
around 150 to 175 a night. Thereare stages that need to happen
before that, where you aregaining your publicity. And you
need to make sure that it it'sadvertised well, and you have a
(31:39):
good reputation, and you havegood reviews to get to that
point. But they were saying Ibelieve you can make it to this
level. And I think that you canacquire those things which we
are starting to come close tothat currently, or we're playing
with about that range right now.
So specific to your question ofhow did you discover pricing?
(32:00):
Well, I started with a realloose idea based off of somebody
else's advice that operateswithin this network. And then
really, it's just a matter of ustrying and seeing where things
land and seeing, you know, ifnobody books, then that's a
pretty good indication thatmaybe we need to readjust some
stuff. And ultimately, as aswe've done it, we've still
(32:23):
gathered, still gathered bookingand still continue to, and we
are about to hit a new mark,actually in a couple of days
that will give us a new titlethat will help promote some of
our help promote the unit alittle bit as well as give us a
a reputation that's backed bythe program. So
Sean Cooper (32:46):
Right, because I think you mentioned that there
are some limitations or certainhurdles you have to or
milestones you have to achievein order to do certain types of
promotional pricing and thingsof that nature.
Chris Holling (32:59):
Yes, so the promotional pricing outright,
like putting a discount on yourproperty and getting some
advertising is more just beingestablished for about a month,
the title that I'm referring tothat we're about to get to, you
have to have a history of goodreviews, you have to have a
history of good response timeson the program itself. And you
(33:21):
have to have a certain amount ofstays depending on how long or
how short that they've been. Andyou have to do all of those by
the time they do their quarterlyreview. And in our case, the
next review is going to be in acouple of days, once you acquire
that then people can search forpeople that only have that title
and therefore have a goodreputation backed by that
(33:42):
program. And so we become partof a special search system for
people that care about that aswell as the program is more
likely to promote it becausethey know that you have a good
reputation. And in doing so youget more bookings and you can
also increase your prices alittle bit because you are a I
guess a cut above so to speakbecause you're you are doing the
(34:05):
legwork to make sure that it's aquality unit.
Sean Cooper (34:08):
Oh, there's less risk on the renters side
Chris Holling (34:11):
correct
Sean Cooper (34:11):
of things
Chris Holling (34:12):
Yes. Right.
It's it's bound to be a more amore quality option and more
quality stay as far as ifthere's an issue, then it will
be addressed. Because there's agood reputation but also exactly
to what you're saying thatthere's there's less risk of
something going wrong becausethey have been actively
established as, as somebodythat's helpful, somebody that
(34:33):
will will take care of the jobproperly.
Sean Cooper (34:36):
Right. You've been vetted.
Chris Holling (34:37):
Right. Exactly.
And so once we once we reachthat stage, then we'll we'll
play with the pricing and see ifpeople continue to book and I,
they they've continued so fareven without this title. So I
believe that's a that's a goodpiece. One personal piece of
advice that I'll offer tosomebody if they are doing short
term stuff or if they'reinterested in they're going down
(35:00):
this road, it's been my personalexperience that it's almost
better to charge a little abovewhat the going rate is in the
area rather than below you wouldthink it's below in order to try
and be competitive and bringpeople in which as you're
starting out might be true. ButI've found that if you have
something that's more expensivein general especially if you
(35:23):
have a quality place that peoplewill want to stay at anyway, it
tends to bring in a type ofclient that is less likely to
mess up your stuff rather thanone that's only looking for a
deal because the ones that arelooking for a deal I've found
are more likely to have someform of a damage to your
(35:43):
property or or an issue or orexpecting a deal so to speak. So
on a very personal note, we'vewe found that that shooting a
little above the area tends toattract a certain type of person
that we we like to have asespecially as we live on the
(36:04):
property so
Sean Cooper (36:10):
for sure
Chris Holling (36:10):
makes sense.
Sean Cooper (36:12):
Yeah, I was curious if you want to expand on that it
sounds like there's a story thatgoes along with that.
Chris Holling (36:20):
I mean, the thing is, is that it's that was some
advice that I was finding andearly early on when we were
doing some of these we had acouple of questionable problems
that came through of like werethey actually honoring our rules
for no smoking and we weredealing with less questions on
(36:40):
the program itself of saying ohwell can you cut me a deal for
this once we started to get outof that bracket so to speak but
as far as you know stories forfor other people there's it is
still short term you know that'sthat's also what turns people
off about it is that there'sthere's not a large vetting
process in comparison You know,when you
Sean Cooper (37:00):
Right
Chris Holling (37:01):
when you have somebody that's held there for a
long period of time doing
Sean Cooper (37:03):
You're not doing a background check,
Chris Holling (37:05):
right exactly no I mean this program we have
opted to make sure that we havea government ID issued so it
still keeps people prettyaccountable but it doesn't have
as in depth as check as a longterm would be but you know, I'll
have that I was I was talkingwith somebody from my network
the other day that was tellingme that they they were doing a
(37:28):
rental and I guess an entiremariachi band was in their place
and they were driving by andthey noticed it and they had to
kick them out like like there'sstill weird stuff that goes on
but generally if if you'reshooting for we're trying to
attract a a different group thatthat might be less likely to
(37:49):
screw up the area then thenwe've found that just making
sure you have quality place thatyou can justify charging that
will attract the right kind ofperson.
Sean Cooper (37:59):
Gotcha. What other learning curves have you come
across?
Chris Holling (38:03):
Hmm overall, I'd say the biggest learning curve
was like I was talking aboutwith doing the the 100 deals or
so in my head where you'relooking at different properties
and different opportunities andlooking into regulations and
where to find those consideringnumbers like how much does it
(38:25):
cost you in taxes? Because ifit's that much more in taxes,
can you really just just doingthe numbers itself was was a
learning curve? And I'd say I'dsay general repairs
Sean Cooper (38:42):
You haven't even done all the taxes yet you
get to you get
Chris Holling (38:45):
Oh, no
Sean Cooper (38:45):
to deal with that for the first time in April. of
next year
Chris Holling (38:48):
Right now I am I'm not looking forward to any
of that. But I when I'm talkingabout that, I'm talking about
crunching the numbers and makingthe considerations into what
your expenses are going to be.
So mortgage, the taxes the costfor you know, how does the
program affect things, what typeof amenities there you're going
to be looking at, like,considering all of the business
(39:09):
expenses because that's whatyou're going to be doing. I'd
say the other learning curvewould be I'm familiar with
houses and and renovations justas a whole but the actual
operational process of it andwhat needs to be done and how
things all work is why I broughtin a general contractor. I'm
(39:32):
sure I could have done a lot ofYouTube and screwed it up and
then paid the same amount forsomebody to come in and unscrew
up my stuff and then fix it butinstead I just outright went for
the contractor and so havingsome of those, oh I want to do
this well that's fine, but yougot to hit these these marks
first was also a learning curvethat I think happens to anyone
(39:55):
really trying to think ifthere's anything else that's
takes out i don't i don't thinkso but the yeah
Sean Cooper (40:03):
that's fair
Chris Holling (40:03):
looking at the numbers and business expenses
ahead of time and making surethat you're not just seeing
dollar signs and you'reconsidering what the cost is for
for it to operate appropriatelyis is very important.
Sean Cooper (40:16):
Well, like I said you already more or less
answered this question because Iwas gonna ask you you know about
general idea of the outcome ifyou broke even came out ahead
that sort of thing. And I knowin your particular circumstance
like we we touched on brieflybriefly previously for you
breakeven was kind of a almost atougher mark because you had
(40:40):
such a good deal in terms ofyour rental previously so the
assumption I would make and Ithink you and I have talked
about before is if somebody iscurrently renting in their their
same market especially with theway things are today, then the
offset the the breakeven pointis actually easier to hit
(41:04):
because you're dealing with amuch higher rental that you're
paying on a monthly basis thatyou're you're switching over to
that mortgage and then trying tooffset with the income so is
there any additional color you'dlike to add around that?
Chris Holling (41:21):
I think that's a good point i i do think that my
circumstance was just a littlebit more unique because so what
we what we had because that'swhat we're talking about is rent
rent was on the cheaper side forus because we were with family
and it was still a verysymbiotic relationship because
being with family offered whatwhat benefits you get for living
(41:44):
with family in the first place.
But it also means that you don'thave your own shared space. So
the the money was helpful forthem and the extra sets of hands
were helpful for us really withthe kiddo and it in doing so the
the rent was actually only semia factor of that it was much
more about us personally wantingto get our own space, and
(42:07):
wanting to to be able to spreadour wings, so to speak, I guess
with that, but but having ourown our own elbow room was was
very paramount in specific to,how do you compare when you're
looking at rent versus versusnot even if you have a cheap
rent deal, or something alongthose lines, is very much a, a
(42:29):
long term thing, like I I knowthat personally and this I feel
like this is hard to do withouta diagram. But I really tried to
make it so that my paychecktakes care of me and my
expenses. And my investing hasthe capability to operate on its
(42:50):
own. And while I plan oncontinuing to put into it, or
finding ways for it to continueto grow, I want it to be able to
function on its own so that ifmy paycheck only takes care of
my expenses for that month, forwhatever reason, because a bunch
of stuff goes wrong, I want theinvestments to still be able to
continue to grow. And so this isa springboard into that where
(43:14):
our plan is we just don't havean exact route is to move from
this point. And whether it'sselling it or keeping the home
and continuing to rent it orsome variation of that. This is
going to be a springboard intoallowing investments to grow
beyond that. So we are takingthe time to actively put into it
(43:36):
right now so that we can stepaway from it and allow it to
grow on its own. And so if youare making a consideration like
Sean is talking about, okay, doI step out of this renting area
to get into a spot there'sthere's nothing wrong with
stepping back into a rentingarea later, or even continuing
(43:56):
to rent. While while you've gotstuff that's going on, that's
cheap, and then using money onthe side to allow real estate
specifically or some type ofinvestment grow for you while
you're continuing to rent it'svery, very case by case basis on
what works best for you. We justhappen to also want our own
(44:17):
space and wanted to aggressivelyinvest in so we were willing to
take on some risk and this wasour way to do both. Does that
does that answer that pretty?
Well?
Sean Cooper (44:28):
Yeah, yeah, very much so.
Chris Holling (44:30):
Okay.
Sean Cooper (44:31):
Yep. That brings me to the the ultimate question if
you will, and and one follow upquestion to it. And so would you
do it again? And if so, whatwhat would you do differently?
Chris Holling (44:47):
Oh, okay. Yes, I would do it again. Ask me again
in a year you know, I'm stillright on cloud nine of a couple
of months in and, and just justthe fact that I'm getting proof
of concept right now is iswonderful to me. So maybe maybe
I'm
Sean Cooper (45:02):
for sure.
Chris Holling (45:03):
Maybe I'm a little rose colored glasses at
the moment. And that's but whatI would do in the future Hmm.
Here's the problem with withthat question is this was done
(45:24):
over years of me doing researchand coming to the conclusion
that I did. And in a way Ididn't even realize that this
route that we picked was anoption until this year. So I was
going to tell you, My onlyregret was not doing it sooner.
But I really think that if I didit sooner, I wouldn't have had
(45:45):
the knowledge that I have now.
And I might have made somebigger mistakes on the way
Sean Cooper (45:49):
very valid point.
Chris Holling (45:51):
So yeah, I want to I remember when I first
started getting into investment,like it was actually around the
time that you and I very firststarted talking there was a I
had I had a patient by chancethat he he was just he was sick
and he needed to go to thehospital we we got to talking
because I mean, what else areyou going to do back there but
(46:14):
we got to talking and he wastelling me that he's got a
business that's up and running,I think it was a tire business
or something along those linesand he had just purchased it and
he was looking to do somethingelse and he was he was upset
what was that he had just gotteninto a fight with somebody and
he was dealing with a biglawsuit and his anxiety kicked
(46:37):
up because he was in thecourtroom and it it was just all
becoming a little overwhelmingfor him because the other person
didn't show up like a reallyreally messy circumstance that
just really caused a bunch ofdifferent problems and he told
me he's like you know it'sreally not about the money for
me I'm so upset about this andthis and this and I started
asking him about it and he'slike oh no, I I started
(46:59):
investing in real estate after Isold some of my businesses said
oh well you know tell me what'swhat is the best advice you can
give me because I'm just nowlooking into the possibility of
real estate investing at all andreally just investing in general
and he said the only piece ofadvice I'll give you is start
yesterday I wish I had done thisyears ago and again you know,
(47:22):
this isn't for everybody butit's it's something that stuck
with me because I thought okay,you know, I need to at least for
me, in my personal circumstanceat that point, I was interested
enough to where I knew it wasgoing to be a part of my
investing portfolio at somepoint. This just happened to
push it up in my priority listfor me personally. How's that?
Sean Cooper (47:46):
Yeah, I like it. I like it
Chris Holling (47:48):
Cool
Sean Cooper (47:48):
Is anything else you would add for our listeners?
Chris Holling (47:52):
Okay, I really know that I touched on this but
I want to stress it because Ireally do think that it's
important make sure that you aredoing it if you do get involved
in real estate investing, makesure that you are doing it for
you and for the right reasonsmeaning if you are doing it
strictly for numbers, make surethe numbers are good and that's
(48:16):
that's all you need to worryabout. For me I needed to make
sure that I had to I had a lotof considerations I had to
consider a place that was alsogoing to be comfortable for me
and my family so I had to lookin areas that I was comfortable
with that being as well as areasthat were going to be close to
family for us and if it's I usedto I was talking to a buddy of
(48:39):
mine about this yesterday I toldhim hey you know if if it was
just you and me and we were justlooking for money and we were
going to move in somewhere butyou know we didn't have these
these families attached to usyou know, you and me would be
out in this in this terriblepart of town and just bring a
couple of baseball bats and youknow just just ride it out for a
couple of years once we buy thisbuilding and and then turn a
(49:00):
profit but like that doesn'twork for me in my circumstance.
And I think that could have beenmore lucrative overall and I
would have gotten way more coolstories in the process. But it
It did not work for what wasneeded in my life and I think we
talked about that a lot on thispodcast is that when you are
(49:23):
when you are looking at allthese things and you're looking
at your personal finances andyou're investing you need to
find out what's comfortable foryou and you need to know why
you're doing it which is how weled to doing this at all because
of our long term goals as wellas what we needed right now. And
I think that's that's reallyimportant for everybody to
(49:44):
consider if you're looking intoit at all and not just a I'm
gonna do it to do it.
Sean Cooper (49:51):
Good advice
Chris Holling (49:52):
Cool,
Sean Cooper (49:53):
cool man
Chris Holling (49:54):
I like it
Sean Cooper (49:54):
that's all I had on my end so
Chris Holling (49:56):
sweet. Well you know interview time for you.
What did you What did you thinkis just like it? Did you? Did
you like switching it around andasking me questions. It felt it
felt weird, right?
Sean Cooper (50:06):
Yeah, it felt like the pressure was off all I had
to do was sit here and listen.
Chris Holling (50:12):
Well, I'll tell you what,
Sean Cooper (50:13):
except I probably didn't fill the role of being
funny and entertaining. Youstill had to do that. So you
know, really, really just putmore on you.
Chris Holling (50:24):
Well, well, thanks for joining us on the
truth about investing. I'm ChrisHolling. And I'm also Chris
Holling.
Sean Cooper (50:32):
Yeah, I'm Sean Cooper. Thanks for that
Chris Holling (50:36):
Trying to get excited about it. Oh man. Okay.
Yeah. Let me actually wrap thisup. Thank you again, everybody,
for coming to join us. And thankyou. Thank you for asking me
those questions. those are thoseare great questions. I'm glad.
I'm glad I had to actually thinkabout stuff. And it wasn't just
like, spewing information thatwas that was great. So I
(50:57):
appreciate you asking those.
Sean Cooper (50:57):
You're welcome.
Chris Holling (50:59):
And thank you everybody for coming out to
listen or picking up yourheadphone to listen, I guess.
And thank you for taking thetime to want to better yourself.
I just had a brain fart. I don'tknow. That was weird. My name is
Chris Holling.
Sean Cooper (51:18):
You had a brain fart about your own name.
Chris Holling (51:20):
I know I just talking just English was not my
strong suit. right then. Andthank you for calling attention
to it. Because now any type ofinsecurities that I have are
just blown even further intoproportion. And
Sean Cooper (51:35):
you're welcome. I'm Sean Cooper.
Chris Holling (51:38):
Yeah, and that did come. See now I'm all tongue
tied. Have truth about investingback to basics. kit, you can
show up next time. Did you knowif you want if you
Sean Cooper (51:51):
You did great on the questions, we'll just leave
it at that you did greatanswering the questions.
Chris Holling (51:58):
Thanks, buddy.
We'll see you guys here. Hearyou next dang it. I'm stopping
this.
Sean Cooper (52:06):
Yeah, we'll get this right next.
Chris Holling (52:10):
podcast disclaimer, disclaimer. The
disclaimer following thisdisclaimer, is the disclaimer
that is required for thispodcast to be up and running and
fully functioning and movingforward. This is going to be the
same disclaimer that you willhear in each one of our
episodes. We hope you enjoy itjust as much as we enjoyed
(52:31):
making it. All content on thispodcast and accompanying
transcripts is for informationalpurposes only. opinions
expressed here in by Sean Cooperare solely those of fit
financial consulting LLC, unlessotherwise specifically sighted.
(52:54):
Chris Holling is not affiliatedwith fit financial consulting,
LLC nor do the views expressedby Chris Holling represent the
views of fit financialconsulting, LLC. This podcast is
intended to be used in itsentirety. Any other use beyond
(53:14):
its author's intent,distribution or copying of the
contents of this podcast isstrictly prohibited. Nothing in
this podcast is intended aslegal accounting or tax advice
and is for informationalpurposes only. All information
or ideas provided should bediscussed in detail with an
(53:37):
advisor, accountant or legalcounsel prior to implementation.
This podcast may reference linksto websites for the convenience
of our users. Our firm has nocontrol over the accuracy or
content of these other websites.
advisory services offeredthrough fit financial
(53:59):
consulting, LLC, an investmentadvisor firm registered in the
states of Washington andColorado. The presence of this
podcast on the internet shallnot be directly or indirectly
interpreted as a solicitation ofinvestment advisory services to
persons of another jurisdictionunless otherwise permitted by
(54:22):
statute. Follow up orindividualized responses to
consumers in a particular stateby our firm in the rendering of
personalized investment advicefor compensation shall not be
made without our first complyingwith jurisdiction requirements,
or pursuant an applicable stateexemption. For information
(54:47):
concerning the status ordisciplinary history of a broker
dealer, investment advisor ortheir representatives. A
consumer should contact theirstate's purities administrator.
This has been a test of theemergency disclosures.
Sean Cooper (55:12):
That was my favorite of our disclaimers was
when you did the visine guycommercial,
Chris Holling (55:18):
I still throw it in every once in a while
Sean Cooper (55:19):
I know it was on there for the last time I
Chris Holling (55:21):
For red eyes, use clear eyes
Popular Podcasts
Are You A Charlotte?
In 1997, actress Kristin Davis’ life was forever changed when she took on the role of Charlotte York in Sex and the City. As we watched Carrie, Samantha, Miranda and Charlotte navigate relationships in NYC, the show helped push once unacceptable conversation topics out of the shadows and altered the narrative around women and sex. We all saw ourselves in them as they searched for fulfillment in life, sex and friendships. Now, Kristin Davis wants to connect with you, the fans, and share untold stories and all the behind the scenes. Together, with Kristin and special guests, what will begin with Sex and the City will evolve into talks about themes that are still so relevant today. "Are you a Charlotte?" is much more than just rewatching this beloved show, it brings the past and the present together as we talk with heart, humor and of course some optimism.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.