August 2, 2024 • 43 mins
In this episode of “The UMB Pulse” podcast, we welcome Harry Knipp, MD '76, FACR, a distinguished alumnus of the University of Maryland, Baltimore (UMB).
A 1976 graduate of the University of Maryland School of Medicine, Knipp represents the fourth in a line of five consecutive generations of UMB graduates, starting with his great-grandfather in 1887 and continuing with his son, David, in 2014. Knipp has made significant contributions to the medical field as a founding board member of Advanced Radiology, a past chairman of the Maryland state medical board, and a leader in various professional organizations.
He has also served as chief of staff and board member at Carroll Hospital and holds emeritus status at UMMS St. Joseph Medical Center. We discuss Knipp’s experiences at UMB, the evolution of the University, and his family’s enduring legacy.
His dedication to UMB extends beyond his career, with active involvement as past president of the Medical Alumni Association, chair of the Board of Trustees of the University of Maryland Baltimore Foundation, and other key roles. Join us to hear Knipp’s insights on lifelong involvement, legacy, networking, and his remarkable journey with UMB, while also highlighting how all UMB alumni can find meaningful ways to engage with the University.
Listen to The UMB Pulse on Apple, Spotify, Amazon Music, and wherever you like to listen. The UMB Pulse is also now on YouTube.
Visit our website at umaryland.edu/pulse or email us at umbpulse@umaryland.edu.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Charles Schelle (00:00):
The University of Maryland Baltimore is such a
(00:02):
tight knit family environment,and it's incredible when you
find a family that spansgenerations here at this
institution.
Dana Rampolla (00:13):
Yes, multiple generations, and we're excited
to talk today to Harry Knipp,who is the fourth of five
generations.
Direct lineage who is here atUMB.
We're going to hear his storyall about his connections.
And I think what's reallyinteresting about talking to
someone like Harry is it showsas an alum, how you really can
(00:35):
stay connected with youruniversity and how you can make
a huge difference, not only inyour community by living out
UMB's mission, but then bringingit all back here to to your alma
mater.
Charles Schelle (00:46):
You know Harry the best as the chair of the
board of trustees of theUniversity of Maryland
Baltimore's foundation and he'salso a past president of the
medical alumni association andhe was on the founding board of
advanced radiology.
He has done so much in his lifeand he's near that retirement
stage but it doesn't sound likehe's quite there yet wanting to
(01:10):
retire because he's so connectedto UMB and he truly, truly,
truly loves his job.
And I hope that really comes outin our conversation with Harry
Knipp here on the UMB Pulse.
Jena Frick (01:25):
You're listening to the heartbeat of the University
of Maryland Baltimore, the UMBPulse.
Dana Rampolla (01:39):
Hi, Harry.
It's great to have you on ThePulse.
Thanks for joining us today.
Harry Knipp (01:44):
My pleasure.
Dana Rampolla (01:45):
I don't know if Charles knows this, but you and
I were Reiserstownonianstogether.
I'm not sure if you're aware, welived about a mile apart, and I,
I am fortunate to know yourwife, Nora.
She went your son, David, wentto school with my my oldest son,
Vincent.
Many years ago.
So our paths have kind ofcrossed.
I know that we see you veryoften at UMB events.
(02:08):
I can't name too many eventsthat we haven't seen you at,
which is fortunately whereCharles met you.
And, you know, we put our headstogether and Charles said, Oh my
gosh, he would be a great guy tohave on the pulse.
So we are thankful.
Yeah, we are thankful thatyou're here today.
Tell us a little bit, just getthe conversation going.
Tell us a little bit about yourfamily's legacy here at UMB.
(02:30):
When did you graduate?
From which school did yougraduate?
Tell us a little about youreducational background.
Harry Knipp (02:35):
So, well, we, we probably have the oldest run,
longest run at UMB of anyfamily.
I think my my great, great,great uncle James Waters
graduated in 1859 from the medschool.
And then, next up, I guess, wasmy great grandfather, Harry E.
Knipp in 1887.
(02:57):
His brother in law, Charles R.
Davis, in 1890 and then a cousinin 1911 who became a famous
radiologist, Charles Waters andthen my grandfather in 1923 my
father in 1951, I was class of76, and my son graduated in
2014, so we have we have five ina row from my great grandfather
(03:22):
through my son.
And we have eight uh, grad plusone from the law school in 1902,
and other uncles.
So, so it's you know, I had nochoice when I, When I graduated
in 1976, I was their firstfourth generation graduate, and
of course, Gene Gural, who wasthe head of the Medical Alumni
(03:44):
Association at the time, draggedme right in, you know, so I was,
I got involved in the MedicalAlumni early on, and and then
I've continued that involvementbecause I love Larry Pitroff,
who, who came in 1994, rightafter I was alumni president.
So, I didn't get to work withLarry there, but now I work with
(04:06):
him all the time on a couple ofdifferent things.
So, so that's, that's kind ofhow we got, we got started
there.
I didn't even apply anywhereelse, nor did my son, David.
So, I was lucky to get in fromthe junior year of college.
I took a shot and applied earlyand had a lot of AP, so I was
lucky to get in early.
We figured out that David, whoyou know, you know, was the
(04:28):
first one of our, of ourgraduates our five in a row to
graduate from college.
When my great grandfather wentin, in the 1800s, they went
right from high school.
And my grandfather was delayedbecause of World War One.
And so he just got his creditsand then got in.
Similarly, my dad with World WarTwo, they were all hurrying
(04:48):
after the war.
So he got in without a collegedegree.
I took a stab and got in just.
By luck, and Dave was the firstone to actually graduate from
college.
We just figured that out notlong ago, actually.
So another little fun familyfact.
So
Dana Rampolla (05:07):
That is interesting and a lot of Knipp
family genetics here at UMB.
Tell us a little bit about whatyou studied.
Harry Knipp (05:15):
Well, I, I was a chem major in college and and
so, you know, after medicalschool, I was going to be a
family doc and work with my dadhas he worked with his father
and he worked with his father inWest Baltimore.
But when I was a senior studentand already locked into family
practice residency first year inthe brand new department that my
(05:39):
dad helped form with all hisfriends on the faculty.
It just hit me like a ton ofbricks one day that it really
wasn't me.
And I went over and I talked toa new Dean Dennis, John, John
Dennis was just the new Deanthen.
And I had met him through beingthe class president.
I had met Dr.
Dennis and he was a radiologistbefore, chief of radiology at
(06:02):
Maryland.
And I went over and talked tohim in Davidge Hall one day, and
I was sort of depressed.
I had just gotten engaged to mywife, Nora, and I, I, I was
thinking, you know, it was justwasn't what I thought I was
going to do.
And all of a sudden I was inupheaval in my senior year.
And it was Dr.
Dennis who said you know,you're, you're pretty good at
(06:24):
committee stuff and, and andmaking sure things get done and
and the like.
And he said, you really, youknow, think about doing
something on the administrativeside.
So you need a, specialty whereyou're fungible, which is exact
words, where, where you don'thave your own patients that you
have to be there with every day.
So he said, do you wantsomething like radiology or
(06:46):
pathology or something likethat, where you couldn't be
easily replaced at the desk, youknow?
And so I liked radiology causeit was high tech cat scanning
had just come in.
And I went over and talked tothe chief of radiology and
actually Dr.
Dennis said he'd get me out ofmy family practice thing and
bully them into taking me inradiology, but I went ahead and
(07:07):
did the internship because itwas good training for radiology,
did a little of everything.
And and then I switched overmuch to the dismay of the family
practice department and myfather, and even got hate mail
and anonymous hate mail, I stilldon't know from who, and then
that, that got me off on mycareer in radiology and and boy,
(07:30):
Dr.
Dennis was right.
Cause that allowed me theflexibility to be on committees
and do stuff pro bono for thestate that I've enjoyed so much.
And and it's, it, it reallychanged my whole life.
So I owe him and big time forthat.
And I've told, I told him thatmany times before he passed
away.
Dana Rampolla (07:50):
And from the perspective of like what UMB was
at that time, explain a littlebit about what the climate was
like for you when you werestudying here versus maybe what
it was like for your father andyour grandfather.
Harry Knipp (08:04):
It was still a good journeyman medical school.
Maryland always turned out good,solid patient focused doctors.
It wasn't quite the researchpowerhouse that it is today.
We still didn't even have the VAon campus.
And when my, when my forebearsall went there, it was, it was a
(08:26):
much different place, you know,my, when my father went, The old
university hospital was the newone, and my grandfather went to
the original one on Lombard and,and and Greene that they tore
down when I was a freshman.
Of course everybody went toclass in Davidge Hall right up
through my son.
And it just we, when we were inschool, we were in an old
(08:49):
Hutzler's or Herschel conewarehouse that they had quickly
thrown up some risers in one ofthe warehouse rooms.
And that was our lecture hallback then.
None of the fancy things theyhave now were there.
We had anatomy over in what was,what used to be the Bressler
building on Greene street That'sright across from the old 1930
(09:10):
hospital, and it was a, it was awhole different shebang.
The library was a brick buildingon the, on the other side of the
street from where the currentbeautiful library is right
across from the front of DavidgeHall, and nice, but nowhere near
as fancy as we have now and noneof the institutes were there.
One of my classmates was the sonof the campus president.
(09:34):
Albin Kuhn was the, the, them,they called it the chancellor of
UMBC and UMB.
And so I got to hear some of theinside stuff about what was
going on on the campus from FromAlbin II, who was my classmate,
my carpooler and and still mygood friend.
So, it was, it was quitedifferent.
(09:55):
And then, you know, when my sonwas there, and now we, we have
all these wonderful institutes.
We have world famous scientiststhat gradually came with Dr.
Wilson and Dr.
Dennis got the VA there and gotthings going.
Dr.
Wilson came in as dean and, andramped up the research, and then
Dr.
Reese came and really did it,brought in the institutes.
(10:17):
The rest of the schools have, wehave a brand new law school we
have the pharmacy school wentfrom being a little building on
Lombard Street to a tower andthe whole campus nursing
schools, always good, but nowhas added on beautiful big new
library with a dean level headlibrarian.
So it, it's it's just an amazingnow 75 acres of downtown
(10:41):
Baltimore which it's just hardto imagine.
It's so cool.
And Dr.
Jarrell's new.
Initiative for vibrancy of thecampus and, you know, connecting
us with the nearby social thingsand expanding the reach of the
campus police and the Live NearWhere You Work program.
And and it's it's, it's a reallyit's way cool now.
(11:05):
I'm really excited to be a partof it.
Charles Schelle (11:09):
You really set the scene there between you and
your, your son, David what aboutcomparing the, the experience
between you and, and your sonabout, you know, maybe the
requirements or the things thathe had the opportunity to
participate in?
Harry Knipp (11:24):
Well, I must say the thing we always kid about
medical school is it's stillfour years.
And, and there's every year,there's astronomically more
information and more technology.
And, and it's still just fouryears.
So the now I would say that thewe had some very smart people in
(11:46):
my class, but when I talked tothe current medical students,
they are wildly smart.
I think we get over 6, 000applicants for 150 slots now.
So, so they can, I would neverhave been accepted, but they're
wonderful people too.
They're they're multi multitalented in addition to being
(12:08):
great students.
They all have secondary talents,either in research or the arts
or whatever.
And they're just a joy to bewith.
So our time in the 70s was theVietnam era.
A lot of my classmates wereangry.
The campus was not as pretty asit is now.
(12:28):
And while they did a good jobteaching us, we some of the
faculty had left and it was in alittle bit of an upheaval.
We had just gotten a new dean.
And, you know, when the, whenyou get a new dean, a lot of the
chairman move around and goother places.
So the place was a bit ofupheaval during my class's time
whereas during my son's timethey, it was much more
(12:52):
harmonious.
They, I think student affairswas always good at looking out
for the well being of thestudents.
And I know I got a lot ofwonderful support.
I, I had a little bit of adepression over some personal
stuff when I started the school.
They could not have been betterfor me or At the end, when I was
(13:13):
deciding to change what I wantedto do aside from Dr.
Dennis student affairs were verysupportive.
But now the, the whole attitudeis a little more nurturing And
they've weeded out some of thechaff.
The students don't have to do asmuch grunt work as we used to
do.
They, they realized that theyonly have so much time to learn.
(13:34):
And, and so I don't think theyget burned out running samples
to the lab as, as much as maybewe were expected to do.
But it, it wasn't terrible andit, it definitely toughened up,
that's for sure.
So, you know, it was fine for me'cause I was always a night al I
didn't mind being up late butyeah, it was I, I wouldn't trade
(13:56):
it, but not, not the happiest.
Cheers, that's for sure.
Charles Schelle (14:00):
Yeah.
Well, you know, all that gruntwork must have done something
because it paved a nice path foryou to be part of the founding
board for Advanced Radiology oneof Maryland's largest medical
practices.
A lot of us who play sports or,or had accidents that probably
had imaging at Advanced.
I know I have a few times tellus about what it meant to be
(14:24):
involved in that and, and reallyputting together,, a solid group
that could make an impact acrossthe state.
Harry Knipp (14:31):
Well, I am so proud.
I have my Advanced Radiology mugright here.
I'm so proud of the, of thegroup.
It was really the brainchild ofof another Maryland alum, Mike
Sherman who's a few years aheadof me, maybe 10 years ahead of
me.
He was the managing partner of agreat big I think then 28 office
(14:52):
radiology group in town, andthere were five others of us
groups, and at the time, theinsurance companies were
pressing hard for capitated carewhere they give you so much
money per member per month, andyou had, they wanted you to
provide all of their imaging forthat.
And none of us wanted that.
We wanted to have a discountedfee for service.
(15:13):
And, and so, we started meetingthere about eight of us that
representing five or six groupsthat started meeting, I guess,
for almost a couple of years allof the various Founder groups
had very disparate structures.
Some were purely hospital basedand didn't own any physical
assets.
Others were more office basedand owned CAT scanners and, and
(15:36):
had a lot of investment moneyinvolved.
Some were seven years topartnership, some were three,
and we had to figure out a wayto make all of that equal.
It was nice though, in that mostof us already knew each other.
Because at the time radiologyin, in the Baltimore area was
much more parochial, almosteverybody had trained either at
(15:58):
Maryland or Hopkins.
At least two thirds and maybeanother third came from out of
town.
So we all kind of knew eachother.
And and so it was a little bitof a slog working with lawyers
to figure out a formula to makeit work.
But, but we did.
And in 1995, we opened up, wewent without pay for a whole
year because we didn't have anybilling numbers at the
(16:20):
beginning.
So we were grinding out the workand not getting any paycheck,
which was an interestingexperience.
And then a couple years in, weformed a national company with
six other groups and formed acompany named Radiologics which
is now owned by RadNet based outin California.
So, RadNet now owns all thephysical plant of Advanced
(16:41):
Radiology, and we're Now, 103radiologists, I think.
I've been out since 2013, buthaving been there at the birth,
I'm super proud of it.
They they, they hire really goodpeople and, and treat them well.
There are no punitivepartnership things or anything.
Everybody's treated as an equalright from the beginning.
(17:03):
So there's a lot of good people.
Collegiality and and they justhave some wonderfully talented
young people in the group.
I'm immensely proud of it.
It was funny.
I was at a school of pharmacyfundraiser at, at Ellen
Yanklow's house, who's the vicechair of the UMBF board and, and
on the pharmacy school board.
(17:24):
Wonderful, wonderful person.
I hardly knew anybody thereexcept the campus people.
They were all friends of hers.
And I was sitting around herkitchen table and everybody was
telling what they did.
And I said, well, I'm aradiologist with Advanced
Radiology.
And one of the women piped up,she was the graphic artist that
had designed our pyramid logoand working with my partner,
(17:47):
Chuck Wiener, who's anotherMaryland alum and father of two
more Maryland alums and medschool alums.
And And Chuck had hired her andshe came up with the with the
pyramid logo with the x ray tubein the middle and the rays going
out that we all like so much.
So we had a grand time talkingabout that.
Fortunately, I had one of mycards with the logo that
(18:08):
everybody else could see at theday.
So you never know.
Smalltimore is definitely a realthing.
Dana Rampolla (18:15):
That is for sure.
You talked a little bit aboutsome of the other work that
you've done because of yourorganizational abilities.
And I know that you've served ona number of different boards.
You've been a past chief ofstaff and board member at
Carroll Hospital, for example.
Tell me why that was animportant part of your, your
career trajectory.
Harry Knipp (18:34):
I don't know.
It all started with Mrs.
Kirkwood back in coming into myfifth grade room, my, my sixth
grade teacher to be and tappingme, taking me out and telling me
they were making me the captainof the safety patrol the next
year.
And and of course that was in myelementary school.
That was the big shot job.
Then I went to junior high andgot on the AV squad and they may
(18:56):
be the captain of that.
And then I went off to highschool and college and I was
commuting and I didn't really doanything other than manage the
basketball team at Poly for fouryears.
But then when I got to medschool One of my classmates
talked me into running for classpresident, and I got elected,
and it kind of snowballed fromthere.
I enjoyed working with otherpeople, and meeting other smart
(19:20):
people, and bouncing ideasaround.
My partner out in Westminster,in my original practice, was of
a similar ilk, and he was about10 years older, but he got me
involved in the medical staffthere early on and got me
involved in the state radiologysociety.
He gave me the cushy job ofbeing the liaison with the x ray
(19:41):
techs.
All I had to do was go to theirannual meeting at the ocean,
play some golf and give them acheck and judge their student
exhibits.
And of course, when I start,they decided they wanted to
become licensed.
So that's that set me off on awhole thing.
Six of us worked on institutingx ray tech licensure in Maryland
at which we got through.
(20:01):
And I like to think I personallygot Governor Schaffer to sign
off on in a very interestingstory that's too long to tell
here, but and that got meinvolved with the various
iterations of the state medicalboard back then where, where
they were licensed.
And I, I did that in the x raytech arena there for 17 years.
And then.
Governor Ehrlich appointed me tothe brand new formed Maryland
(20:26):
Board of Physicians and I becamethe chairman and I did that for
two terms and stayed there for adecade.
I love doing that and andradiology allowed me to do that
because honestly, I was wellpaid enough and, and had the
career flexibility enough that Icould work half time and, and do
that big job and go to Annapolisand be at all these various
(20:49):
meetings and run around thestate giving talks on the board
and all, which I, I justwonderful, smart people I get to
work with.
That's why I love.
Larry Pitroff when that wascoming to an end there was an
opening on the UMBF board thatmy friend, Larry Pitchoff at the
medical alumni suggested me for.
And I met with Sue Gladhill, whowas then the, the president of
(21:12):
UMBF and we hit it off and theyI, I came onto that board in
2009 and wormed my way up to bein the chair.
So, it's just you know, Been inthe right place at the right
time.
And I'm just so privileged toget to work with so many smart
people and nice people that arededicated and learn from, you
(21:36):
know, I kid myself all the timethat I'm just a country
radiologist from Westminster andI get to hang out with the CEO
of T.
Rowe Price and the, you know,Brian Gibbons who runs all the
shopping centers around town andyou know, I get to talk to these
people plus all the deans andand the university presidents
and it's it I still pinchmyself, you know, because I
(21:58):
don't view myself as having anygreat expertise other than, you
know, Just being a goodschmoozer.
Dana Rampolla (22:06):
Maybe it's a good human being.
Harry Knipp (22:08):
Well, thank you for saying that.
Dana Rampolla (22:10):
Well, there's an old saying that says we not only
count our blessings, but we alsomake our blessings count.
So let's migrate theconversation a little bit
because you certainly are beingvery humble.
You obviously are a very brightman, but you've gone beyond
that.
You have given so much as you'vejust shared a little bit of that
with UMB.
So what, what ways have youserved UMB in recent years, that
(22:35):
makes you feel good.
I mean, you've, you've commentedwhat you've done, but how, how
does it make you feel to be ableto give back to the university?
Because you've stayed connected.
A lot of alumni graduate fromvarious schools and they go
their own way, but you keepcoming back.
Is that tied into the legacythat you have?
Or is it just something reallyspecial about UMB?
Harry Knipp (22:57):
Well, in part to the legacy, but and it's sort of
a mutual thing.
I mean that, you know, I, I didsome things and they made me
feel good about it.
And you know, when you feel goodabout it, then you, you want to
do more things and you know, Andthen I I've made friends with
the with the leadership and I'vegotten got to know people in all
(23:20):
of the schools, not just the medschool.
I'm a lifelong baltimorean.
I was born in the city.
never left.
100 percent of my education frompreschool through my fellowship
at the end of my radiologytraining was all in the
Baltimore City limits.
I went to the Baltimore Citypublic schools all the way.
And until I till I moved out toReisterstown, I lived in the in
(23:44):
the city and in West Baltimore.
The whole family's always beenin the city.
My father and grandfather'spractice.
So I'm like a dyed in the woolBaltimore in and and what, what
better thing than to, you know,with huge anchor institution in
West Baltimore that.
We, we all were a little bit ofa part of, and I've just had fun
(24:07):
being there and they make mefeel good.
I hope I, you know, I'm doingthings that are nice.
I, I really enjoy at the medicalalumni.
I was always on, there's a jointmagazine that the med school and
the medical alumni put outquarterly.
It's fairly nice 40 some pageglossy magazine called The
Bulletin and I was on theeditorial board under one of my
(24:29):
mentors, Dr Joe McLaughlin asthe chair.
And then when he retired fromthat, I was able to chair that
editorial board, which I lovedoing.
I.
I edited the school newspaperwhen I was in medical school and
now I'm doing that again.
I proofread the thing andsuggest articles and and and
that I really enjoy.
(24:50):
We just, the current issue isall about the whole campus and
Dr.
Gerald's vibrancy project andall of the wonderful new things
for the whole campus, not justmedicine.
And I hope that Dr.
Gerald's going to love that whenit, when it it's, I guess it's
out now.
So, And then people like yourcolleague, Jennifer Litchman,
(25:12):
I've, I've worked with her formany, many years, the
fundraising people I've knownfor a long time, and I've gotten
kind of the, the gotten into thedevelopment world now and I'm
interested in helping raisemoney and, and honestly, it's
kind of fun to give some of itaway.
I went around the school andtried to do little things to
(25:33):
memorialize my various familymembers who went there and you
know, a room there or ascholarship here or an award
there.
for various, for various of myforebears.
Never.
I never did anything in my nameuntil just a year or so ago.
I, I I endowed a little awardfor the graduating med student
(25:54):
who was interested in doingsomething in organized medicine.
I figured, you know, that, that,that changed my whole life.
So, I'll I'll find my somebodywho's following in my footsteps.
And so I've had a lot of fundoing that.
And and I guess we'll continueto do more as I go along in
retirement and get older.
(26:15):
My, my kids are into it.
My, my daughter, who's a bigshot banker is is well aware of
my desire.
So, Someday when I, when Idepart, I'm sure she'll take
care of remembering UMB again.
Charles Schelle (26:30):
That's great.
You, you mentioned how much youtalk to people, whether they're
connected with UMB or not, butAs you said, you get to talk to
a lot of students and alumni.
And I'm wondering when, when youmake that connection with alumni
and they're like, I, I want tobe part of UMB again, maybe
giving my time or money.
(26:50):
Is there like a common threadthat you hear from these alumni
about what makes them so proud?
What makes them want to, youknow, still be part of UMB?
Harry Knipp (26:58):
Well, I think that.
We're such a powerhouse placenow with so many terrific
research projects going on worldfamous scholars that are are
teaching at the school now andin the leadership that when
people see that through thevarious media that we put out,
(27:21):
if it's not our bulletinmagazine or the wonderful things
that the that all of the campuspublications people put out.
so much.
Or even the newspaper thesedays, we're getting more press
in The Sun than we've evergotten.
And and when people see that, Ithink they're proud of the
school.
And and then they when they comeback for reunion or whatever, if
(27:43):
I run into them at meetings Ialways try and talk it up even
more and, and tell them waysthat they can be involved.
A couple of my class, one of my.
Classmates Mel Scirocchi went onto be the head of a, of a
pharmaceutical company, and he'sbeen very generous and served as
the chair of the med schoolboard for years, and others the
(28:03):
class ahead of me, class aheadof our classes are big givers.
Our class is still angry, butbut the, the, the class of 75
are really good givers.
So, I'm always trying to towheel people to tell them how
much I've enjoyed it and and howvaluable it's been to me and and
bring up all the good people.
(28:25):
I'm always trying to invitepeople down to campus to to see
things.
I'm on the board at the ProtonTreatment Center on campus,
which is a private thing, butit's the school is invested in
it and it's in our BioPark andand I'm always bringing people
down for tours of that, youknow, to show them and then they
(28:45):
see the BioPark and they flipout and I'm so proud of that.
My wife, Nora is is really intothe biopark.
She, from the beginning, she,she just the first time she saw
it going up Martin Luther KingBoulevard, she was like, wow,
look at this.
And And has been a big fan eversince.
And she hasn't even seen 4MLKyet.
(29:05):
You know, our amazing newbuilding that we're doing with
Wexford is just incredible.
That's on my good buddy JimHughes, which is another treat.
I always loved Jim Hughes, whofor people listening in as our
senior VP of businessdevelopment and economic
development, wonderful man, adoctor's son.
(29:25):
And and I always enjoyed workingwith him.
Now he has a bigger role in theUMB foundation and I get to hang
with Jim all the time, which isa real treat.
It's just a lot of fun.
I do it because it's fun and thepeople are so great and
enthusiastic and we're doingwonderful stuff.
It's a no pay job and in termsof money, but it's huge pay in
(29:47):
terms of personal satisfactionand, and the wonderful people
you get to meet and work with.
Charles Schelle (29:54):
It's a relationship business, and it's
all about the connections andthe people you meet, and on a
fun aside there's anotherconnection you have where maybe
you could go on one of myfavorite TV shows, Finding Your
Roots, with Henry Louis GatesJr.
With one of our members of theadministration.
Tell us a little bit about that.
Harry Knipp (30:16):
Roger Ward.
Oh, what a hoot that, that is.
So, Roger is our wonderfulprovost who has more degrees
than anybody I know.
Brilliant man from Trinidad.
And and we were at a, at a UMBChristmas party over at Hidden
Waters.
And It just, it dawned on methat, you know, I said, Roger,
(30:37):
you know, my, my, my mother'sfather came from Barbados.
He immigrated from Barbadoswhere he grew up.
So I'm one quarter Bajan.
And and his younger sistermarried a fellow named Harry
Ward on the island and blendedour two families together down
there.
And the Wards were quiteprolific.
And there were a lot of themthroughout the Caribbean.
(30:59):
And so, after I got home fromthat, that breakfast with Roger
there, I, I messaged my cousin,Richard Ward up in Toronto and
said, Richard, what are the oddsthat I could be related to an
African American Ward fromTrinidad who has relatives on
Barbados?
He said, a hundred percent.
(31:20):
He said, so apparently one of,one of.
My forebears by marriage wasquite the lothario.
And so there's a, there's a goodpossibility that Roger and I
might be related by marriage, sowe wouldn't have a DNA link, but
we certainly have a lot of funwith it cause we're an unlikely
pairing, but what a great guy heis and he, and of course he ran
(31:43):
the grad school until Dr.
Wong came and and now he's inthe provost role and we just
have a terrific time.
At the meetings together and Youknow, so many, so many smart
people.
Dr.
Wong is wonderful.
I've really enjoyed working withhim.
All of the deans Rene Hutchinsat the law school and Mark
Reynolds I was talking to at adinner one night, his wife was
(32:05):
there.
It turns out we went to the samecommunity pool in West Baltimore
when we were kids.
And then, Sarah Michel beingfrom Sarasota.
And going to the same school asmy grandnephew.
I, I loved Jane Kirschling atthe nursing school.
And when she retired, we got Dr.
Ogbolu and she's very, verynice.
And our, our new librarian, Mrs.
(32:27):
Hurst, I think it is.
I've only met her one time, butshe seems terrific.
And and of course, Mark Gladwin,I worked with Dr.
Reese for 16 years at the at themedical school and he retired
and we got the wonderful Dr.
Gladwin, who's got all of theenergy in the world.
And I'm glad that he stayedaround that CARTI, the research
(32:49):
training institute there.
And I try and talk to him on aregular basis to Just just a
real treat.
I never thought that I wouldknow so many brilliant academic
people.
Charles Schelle (33:02):
We should quickly congratulate, we should
quickly congratulate the, theMaryland Carey Law dean because
she is now Renee HutchinsLaurent.
She got married over the summer.
Harry Knipp (33:12):
Oh, I didn't know.
Wonderful.
I worked with her on a couple ofsearch committees and we got to
know each other a little better.
And she's just been terrific.
I mean, Don Tobin, who was therebefore and another doctor's son
that we we had a good timetalking about and he's, he
stayed around to teach and Reneecame and uh, Judy Postmas over
(33:34):
at the social work school takingover for Rick Barth who I got to
know really well.
And Judy and I have a, have areally nice relationship now.
I'm just getting to know her newdevelopment person.
And so, It's such a treat.
Of course, my, my time will becoming to an end.
I've done this for a while and Ikeep telling telling them they,
(33:55):
they need to spread the wealtharound, but they nobody else
wants to do it.
So, so as long as they're happywith me.
And Zoom works really well and Ican fly up from Sarasota.
I'm up at our place at DeepCreek Lake in Western Maryland
for the summer and and I caneasily drive down from here.
So I've come down for, forseveral meetings and at the same
(34:17):
time going out to dinner with myReistertown friends.
So, that's been that's been alot of fun.
Dana Rampolla (34:24):
So Harry, you certainly are well connected and
you've been very involved.
You, you mentioned retirement,but it doesn't sound like you're
really slowing down any.
What, what does that next seasonlook like for you?
Oh,
Harry Knipp (34:34):
I, I, I, I'll keep doing all this stuff.
I have my hobbies you know, andmy, my wife keeps saying you
need to retire, but I love doingthese.
This, this stuff is me.
I mean, it's just and I think, Ithink Nora has come to realize
that it's just part of my, Itell her it's like heart
muscles.
People, you know, heart musclesintrinsically beat, you know,
(34:56):
it's not work for them to beat.
They beat because they like tobeat and, and that's me with
doing stuff like this.
I'm the president of the roadassociation up here at Deep
Creek, where I live.
And and I'm on, I think I'm onfive boards all together.
One of them actually pays me.
So that was a, that was a nicetreat.
(35:16):
And it's I just I love it.
I, you know, zoom has changedeverything.
That was one of the good thingsto come out of COVID was
everybody learned to zoom andour attendance at meetings has
gone way up because all of thepeople that had trouble driving
in or or were wonderful peoplelike on the alumni bulletin
(35:38):
thing.
We have wonderful people allover the country that couldn't
be involved in that until zoomcame around.
And now, you know, I have 14people on my on my board
meetings there and and the wholeUMBF board always shows up and
the people that live in DC orlive out of town.
That was one of my big goalswith the UMBF board was to get
(35:59):
more people from out of town.
We have so many Baltimorecentric people, but we're a
national institution, and weneed to get our message out
across the country.
And one way to do that is tostart having your board members
be influential people in otherbig cities.
So Dr.
(36:20):
Gladwin, I keep wanting him toYou know, get his Pittsburgh
people on our board.
We have a board member in St.
Louis now, Jennifer Estabrook,who's the retired CEO of Fila is
on our UMBF board andparticipates from New York and
could not be a more active boardmember.
So, I'm really excited abouttrying to expand the reach, at
(36:42):
least have that sort of be mylegacy, if you will Is to try
and, and get the board to be we,we kind of were dragged kicking
and screaming from a littleboard of 18 up to in the forties
now.
And at first some people wereuncomfortable with that, but it
turned out to be a great thing.
And we have.
Just multiplied the talent thatDr Jarrell has to call on for
(37:06):
for various activities, whetherit's real estate or finance, our
finance committee that overseesall the donated monies are just
brilliant people that and I andI want my kids.
My daughter.
Is the head of lending for thewhole United States for
JPMorgan's private bank.
She has a Duke MBA and and isand is brilliant.
(37:30):
So when I go off of the board, Iwant my daughter to, to come
onto the board and, and replaceme.
So there's still a Knippinvolved even if she has a
different last name now, but ormy son, Dave I keep prodding
him.
He's a new partner in hispractice in, in the Clearwater
area.
And and I keep prodding him toget involved in the Florida
(37:51):
Radiologic Society where I havesome friends that I've made over
the years.
That was truly a pleasure.
Last summer, the FloridaRadiologic Society met in
Sarasota and my son drove downfrom Clearwater and I was there
and we went to the meetingstogether.
I got to meet his partners andhe got to meet some of the
senior people from around thecountry that were speakers that
(38:13):
I'd known from my career and myother Florida friends in
radiology.
And we just had a wonderfulweekend there together.
And I'm so excited to have himin the field.
I mean, we, we talk about casesevery day and And he, he's and
he, he, I, I wish my father hadbeen alive when Dave graduated
(38:35):
because Dr.
Reese made a big deal out of itand Dave.
Being the smart little boy thathe is won the faculty gold
medal, which my father wouldhave been immensely proud of.
Dave went on to train atHarvard, you know, and so he's
he's my little Ivy Leaguer Pennand Harvard and, and, and still
just came to Maryland for medschool.
What
Dana Rampolla (38:54):
would you say to an alum who might freshly be
graduated, who is trying to, youknow, they hear this story,
they're empowered by it, whatwould you recommend or encourage
them to do to, to becomeinvolved with their alumni
groups?
Harry Knipp (39:09):
I mean, don't, don't forget where you began
your career, you know, and forme, it was multiplied because
not only did I go to schoolthere, but I trained there as
well.
And a lot of docs have someaffiliation to where they
trained, even if they didn't goto medical school there.
But I would, I would say,remember your roots and and pay
(39:30):
it forward a little bit, youknow, Other people were very
kind to, to do things to make myexperience better I've tried to,
and my family's, and, and I'vetried to to pay that forward and
in medicine, and I hate to harpon medicine because I feel this
way about all the schools therebut it's only natural, I guess,
but It's a good feeling and andit's it's a way to put some
(39:54):
richness in your life and and dogood and, and pay your good
fortune at being one of the 150that got picked out of the 6,
000 to to show your appreciationa little bit and, and do
something nice for the, forstudents coming up.
I always tell them, keep, keeplearning.
(40:15):
That's one beautiful thing aboutmedicine.
You have to keep learning allthe time.
And and there's a lot of joy ingiving back, you know, even if
it's just a little bit, if youcan't afford a lot of money.
And I'm certainly well off, butI'm not as rich as some of the
people that, you know, I'm notgoing to name the medical
school.
That's for sure.
But but it's it's just, youknow, if you can help somebody
(40:38):
out with a scholarship, youknow, and that's, I did that to
memorialize my grandfather, theBajan grandfather.
He loaned me money early in mycareer to allow me to, buy into
a medical office building when Iwas just a young pup just
joining my practice.
And that ended up being a verysuccessful investment.
And when we finally sold thatthing, I didn't need the money
(41:01):
then.
And I had the money and I said,well, darn it, I'm going to do a
scholarship in my grandfather'sname and, and remember him that
way.
And and so we, we have that.
We did another one when Davegraduated for our five
generations.
And and it's just, it, it makesme feel good to know that there
there's a student out therethat's had their burden lowered
(41:22):
a little bit by our, you know,by what we were giving.
Or at the student awardsceremony.
I had such a good time sittingwith the families of these
seniors that have gotten one ofthe awards that we've set up and
and their, their parents are soproud and, and it's just
wonderful to see how brilliantthey are and what they're going
to do.
Dana Rampolla (41:43):
So as we wrap up, I, Harry, I thank you.
I thank you for shedding lighton the school of medicine
specifically here at theuniversity of Maryland,
Baltimore, but also giving a nodto all of the other schools.
I am going to put a little plugjust to all of our alumni.
We try to host you know, one ortwo events each year for the
overarching alumni of theuniversity.
We like to try to encouragepeople to stay connected and
(42:05):
certainly if you're not in aposition to be as generous as
the Knipp family has, you know,there's many ways that our
alumni who are listening mightbe thinking, well, how else can
I get involved?
And there's opportunities to bementors for current students
different ways that you can beinvolved.
So I encourage our listeners toreach out to the alumni
departments within yourindividual schools or, you know,
(42:28):
reach out to Charles and I, andwe can help connect you in some
way that works for you.
So, Harry, thank you so much forsharing and
Harry Knipp (42:35):
then I'll mention the Jennifer Lichman's UMBrella
program who I've hooked her upwith a couple of speakers for,
you know, for the young women oncampus, faculty and students
it's been terrific and being thefather of a smart girl you know,
You know, I thought that was agreat program that she's running
there.
So there's so many wonderfulthings that you guys do for us
(42:57):
and could not be more gratefulto have so many wonderful people
in the family.
And we really are like a familydown there, you know, it's I
love UMB and hopefully they'llhave me for a few more years
yet.
So
Dana Rampolla (43:12):
we certainly hope so.
Well, thanks again, Harry, andwe look forward to seeing you at
the next event.
Harry Knipp (43:17):
Absolutely.
I'm very flattered to talk toyou today.
It's nice to work with both ofyou.
Charles Schelle (43:21):
Yeah.
Thank you, Harry.
Jena Frick (43:28):
The UMB Pulse with Charles Schelle and Dana
Rampolla is a UMB Office ofCommunications and Public
Affairs production, edited byCharles Schelle, marketing by
Dana Rampolla.
The University of Maryland Baltimore is such a
(00:02):
tight knit family environment,and it's incredible when you
find a family that spansgenerations here at this
institution.
Dana Rampolla (00:13):
Yes, multiple generations, and we're excited
to talk today to Harry Knipp,who is the fourth of five
generations.
Direct lineage who is here atUMB.
We're going to hear his storyall about his connections.
And I think what's reallyinteresting about talking to
someone like Harry is it showsas an alum, how you really can
(00:35):
stay connected with youruniversity and how you can make
a huge difference, not only inyour community by living out
UMB's mission, but then bringingit all back here to to your alma
mater.
Charles Schelle (00:46):
You know Harry the best as the chair of the
board of trustees of theUniversity of Maryland
Baltimore's foundation and he'salso a past president of the
medical alumni association andhe was on the founding board of
advanced radiology.
He has done so much in his lifeand he's near that retirement
stage but it doesn't sound likehe's quite there yet wanting to
(01:10):
retire because he's so connectedto UMB and he truly, truly,
truly loves his job.
And I hope that really comes outin our conversation with Harry
Knipp here on the UMB Pulse.
Jena Frick (01:25):
You're listening to the heartbeat of the University
of Maryland Baltimore, the UMBPulse.
Dana Rampolla (01:39):
Hi, Harry.
It's great to have you on ThePulse.
Thanks for joining us today.
Harry Knipp (01:44):
My pleasure.
Dana Rampolla (01:45):
I don't know if Charles knows this, but you and
I were Reiserstownonianstogether.
I'm not sure if you're aware, welived about a mile apart, and I,
I am fortunate to know yourwife, Nora.
She went your son, David, wentto school with my my oldest son,
Vincent.
Many years ago.
So our paths have kind ofcrossed.
I know that we see you veryoften at UMB events.
(02:08):
I can't name too many eventsthat we haven't seen you at,
which is fortunately whereCharles met you.
And, you know, we put our headstogether and Charles said, Oh my
gosh, he would be a great guy tohave on the pulse.
So we are thankful.
Yeah, we are thankful thatyou're here today.
Tell us a little bit, just getthe conversation going.
Tell us a little bit about yourfamily's legacy here at UMB.
(02:30):
When did you graduate?
From which school did yougraduate?
Tell us a little about youreducational background.
Harry Knipp (02:35):
So, well, we, we probably have the oldest run,
longest run at UMB of anyfamily.
I think my my great, great,great uncle James Waters
graduated in 1859 from the medschool.
And then, next up, I guess, wasmy great grandfather, Harry E.
Knipp in 1887.
(02:57):
His brother in law, Charles R.
Davis, in 1890 and then a cousinin 1911 who became a famous
radiologist, Charles Waters andthen my grandfather in 1923 my
father in 1951, I was class of76, and my son graduated in
2014, so we have we have five ina row from my great grandfather
(03:22):
through my son.
And we have eight uh, grad plusone from the law school in 1902,
and other uncles.
So, so it's you know, I had nochoice when I, When I graduated
in 1976, I was their firstfourth generation graduate, and
of course, Gene Gural, who wasthe head of the Medical Alumni
(03:44):
Association at the time, draggedme right in, you know, so I was,
I got involved in the MedicalAlumni early on, and and then
I've continued that involvementbecause I love Larry Pitroff,
who, who came in 1994, rightafter I was alumni president.
So, I didn't get to work withLarry there, but now I work with
(04:06):
him all the time on a couple ofdifferent things.
So, so that's, that's kind ofhow we got, we got started
there.
I didn't even apply anywhereelse, nor did my son, David.
So, I was lucky to get in fromthe junior year of college.
I took a shot and applied earlyand had a lot of AP, so I was
lucky to get in early.
We figured out that David, whoyou know, you know, was the
(04:28):
first one of our, of ourgraduates our five in a row to
graduate from college.
When my great grandfather wentin, in the 1800s, they went
right from high school.
And my grandfather was delayedbecause of World War One.
And so he just got his creditsand then got in.
Similarly, my dad with World WarTwo, they were all hurrying
(04:48):
after the war.
So he got in without a collegedegree.
I took a stab and got in just.
By luck, and Dave was the firstone to actually graduate from
college.
We just figured that out notlong ago, actually.
So another little fun familyfact.
So
Dana Rampolla (05:07):
That is interesting and a lot of Knipp
family genetics here at UMB.
Tell us a little bit about whatyou studied.
Harry Knipp (05:15):
Well, I, I was a chem major in college and and
so, you know, after medicalschool, I was going to be a
family doc and work with my dadhas he worked with his father
and he worked with his father inWest Baltimore.
But when I was a senior studentand already locked into family
practice residency first year inthe brand new department that my
(05:39):
dad helped form with all hisfriends on the faculty.
It just hit me like a ton ofbricks one day that it really
wasn't me.
And I went over and I talked toa new Dean Dennis, John, John
Dennis was just the new Deanthen.
And I had met him through beingthe class president.
I had met Dr.
Dennis and he was a radiologistbefore, chief of radiology at
(06:02):
Maryland.
And I went over and talked tohim in Davidge Hall one day, and
I was sort of depressed.
I had just gotten engaged to mywife, Nora, and I, I, I was
thinking, you know, it was justwasn't what I thought I was
going to do.
And all of a sudden I was inupheaval in my senior year.
And it was Dr.
Dennis who said you know,you're, you're pretty good at
(06:24):
committee stuff and, and andmaking sure things get done and
and the like.
And he said, you really, youknow, think about doing
something on the administrativeside.
So you need a, specialty whereyou're fungible, which is exact
words, where, where you don'thave your own patients that you
have to be there with every day.
So he said, do you wantsomething like radiology or
(06:46):
pathology or something likethat, where you couldn't be
easily replaced at the desk, youknow?
And so I liked radiology causeit was high tech cat scanning
had just come in.
And I went over and talked tothe chief of radiology and
actually Dr.
Dennis said he'd get me out ofmy family practice thing and
bully them into taking me inradiology, but I went ahead and
(07:07):
did the internship because itwas good training for radiology,
did a little of everything.
And and then I switched overmuch to the dismay of the family
practice department and myfather, and even got hate mail
and anonymous hate mail, I stilldon't know from who, and then
that, that got me off on mycareer in radiology and and boy,
(07:30):
Dr.
Dennis was right.
Cause that allowed me theflexibility to be on committees
and do stuff pro bono for thestate that I've enjoyed so much.
And and it's, it, it reallychanged my whole life.
So I owe him and big time forthat.
And I've told, I told him thatmany times before he passed
away.
Dana Rampolla (07:50):
And from the perspective of like what UMB was
at that time, explain a littlebit about what the climate was
like for you when you werestudying here versus maybe what
it was like for your father andyour grandfather.
Harry Knipp (08:04):
It was still a good journeyman medical school.
Maryland always turned out good,solid patient focused doctors.
It wasn't quite the researchpowerhouse that it is today.
We still didn't even have the VAon campus.
And when my, when my forebearsall went there, it was, it was a
(08:26):
much different place, you know,my, when my father went, The old
university hospital was the newone, and my grandfather went to
the original one on Lombard and,and and Greene that they tore
down when I was a freshman.
Of course everybody went toclass in Davidge Hall right up
through my son.
And it just we, when we were inschool, we were in an old
(08:49):
Hutzler's or Herschel conewarehouse that they had quickly
thrown up some risers in one ofthe warehouse rooms.
And that was our lecture hallback then.
None of the fancy things theyhave now were there.
We had anatomy over in what was,what used to be the Bressler
building on Greene street That'sright across from the old 1930
(09:10):
hospital, and it was a, it was awhole different shebang.
The library was a brick buildingon the, on the other side of the
street from where the currentbeautiful library is right
across from the front of DavidgeHall, and nice, but nowhere near
as fancy as we have now and noneof the institutes were there.
One of my classmates was the sonof the campus president.
(09:34):
Albin Kuhn was the, the, them,they called it the chancellor of
UMBC and UMB.
And so I got to hear some of theinside stuff about what was
going on on the campus from FromAlbin II, who was my classmate,
my carpooler and and still mygood friend.
So, it was, it was quitedifferent.
(09:55):
And then, you know, when my sonwas there, and now we, we have
all these wonderful institutes.
We have world famous scientiststhat gradually came with Dr.
Wilson and Dr.
Dennis got the VA there and gotthings going.
Dr.
Wilson came in as dean and, andramped up the research, and then
Dr.
Reese came and really did it,brought in the institutes.
(10:17):
The rest of the schools have, wehave a brand new law school we
have the pharmacy school wentfrom being a little building on
Lombard Street to a tower andthe whole campus nursing
schools, always good, but nowhas added on beautiful big new
library with a dean level headlibrarian.
So it, it's it's just an amazingnow 75 acres of downtown
(10:41):
Baltimore which it's just hardto imagine.
It's so cool.
And Dr.
Jarrell's new.
Initiative for vibrancy of thecampus and, you know, connecting
us with the nearby social thingsand expanding the reach of the
campus police and the Live NearWhere You Work program.
And and it's it's, it's a reallyit's way cool now.
(11:05):
I'm really excited to be a partof it.
Charles Schelle (11:09):
You really set the scene there between you and
your, your son, David what aboutcomparing the, the experience
between you and, and your sonabout, you know, maybe the
requirements or the things thathe had the opportunity to
participate in?
Harry Knipp (11:24):
Well, I must say the thing we always kid about
medical school is it's stillfour years.
And, and there's every year,there's astronomically more
information and more technology.
And, and it's still just fouryears.
So the now I would say that thewe had some very smart people in
(11:46):
my class, but when I talked tothe current medical students,
they are wildly smart.
I think we get over 6, 000applicants for 150 slots now.
So, so they can, I would neverhave been accepted, but they're
wonderful people too.
They're they're multi multitalented in addition to being
(12:08):
great students.
They all have secondary talents,either in research or the arts
or whatever.
And they're just a joy to bewith.
So our time in the 70s was theVietnam era.
A lot of my classmates wereangry.
The campus was not as pretty asit is now.
(12:28):
And while they did a good jobteaching us, we some of the
faculty had left and it was in alittle bit of an upheaval.
We had just gotten a new dean.
And, you know, when the, whenyou get a new dean, a lot of the
chairman move around and goother places.
So the place was a bit ofupheaval during my class's time
whereas during my son's timethey, it was much more
(12:52):
harmonious.
They, I think student affairswas always good at looking out
for the well being of thestudents.
And I know I got a lot ofwonderful support.
I, I had a little bit of adepression over some personal
stuff when I started the school.
They could not have been betterfor me or At the end, when I was
(13:13):
deciding to change what I wantedto do aside from Dr.
Dennis student affairs were verysupportive.
But now the, the whole attitudeis a little more nurturing And
they've weeded out some of thechaff.
The students don't have to do asmuch grunt work as we used to
do.
They, they realized that theyonly have so much time to learn.
(13:34):
And, and so I don't think theyget burned out running samples
to the lab as, as much as maybewe were expected to do.
But it, it wasn't terrible andit, it definitely toughened up,
that's for sure.
So, you know, it was fine for me'cause I was always a night al I
didn't mind being up late butyeah, it was I, I wouldn't trade
(13:56):
it, but not, not the happiest.
Cheers, that's for sure.
Charles Schelle (14:00):
Yeah.
Well, you know, all that gruntwork must have done something
because it paved a nice path foryou to be part of the founding
board for Advanced Radiology oneof Maryland's largest medical
practices.
A lot of us who play sports or,or had accidents that probably
had imaging at Advanced.
I know I have a few times tellus about what it meant to be
(14:24):
involved in that and, and reallyputting together,, a solid group
that could make an impact acrossthe state.
Harry Knipp (14:31):
Well, I am so proud.
I have my Advanced Radiology mugright here.
I'm so proud of the, of thegroup.
It was really the brainchild ofof another Maryland alum, Mike
Sherman who's a few years aheadof me, maybe 10 years ahead of
me.
He was the managing partner of agreat big I think then 28 office
(14:52):
radiology group in town, andthere were five others of us
groups, and at the time, theinsurance companies were
pressing hard for capitated carewhere they give you so much
money per member per month, andyou had, they wanted you to
provide all of their imaging forthat.
And none of us wanted that.
We wanted to have a discountedfee for service.
(15:13):
And, and so, we started meetingthere about eight of us that
representing five or six groupsthat started meeting, I guess,
for almost a couple of years allof the various Founder groups
had very disparate structures.
Some were purely hospital basedand didn't own any physical
assets.
Others were more office basedand owned CAT scanners and, and
(15:36):
had a lot of investment moneyinvolved.
Some were seven years topartnership, some were three,
and we had to figure out a wayto make all of that equal.
It was nice though, in that mostof us already knew each other.
Because at the time radiologyin, in the Baltimore area was
much more parochial, almosteverybody had trained either at
(15:58):
Maryland or Hopkins.
At least two thirds and maybeanother third came from out of
town.
So we all kind of knew eachother.
And and so it was a little bitof a slog working with lawyers
to figure out a formula to makeit work.
But, but we did.
And in 1995, we opened up, wewent without pay for a whole
year because we didn't have anybilling numbers at the
(16:20):
beginning.
So we were grinding out the workand not getting any paycheck,
which was an interestingexperience.
And then a couple years in, weformed a national company with
six other groups and formed acompany named Radiologics which
is now owned by RadNet based outin California.
So, RadNet now owns all thephysical plant of Advanced
(16:41):
Radiology, and we're Now, 103radiologists, I think.
I've been out since 2013, buthaving been there at the birth,
I'm super proud of it.
They they, they hire really goodpeople and, and treat them well.
There are no punitivepartnership things or anything.
Everybody's treated as an equalright from the beginning.
(17:03):
So there's a lot of good people.
Collegiality and and they justhave some wonderfully talented
young people in the group.
I'm immensely proud of it.
It was funny.
I was at a school of pharmacyfundraiser at, at Ellen
Yanklow's house, who's the vicechair of the UMBF board and, and
on the pharmacy school board.
(17:24):
Wonderful, wonderful person.
I hardly knew anybody thereexcept the campus people.
They were all friends of hers.
And I was sitting around herkitchen table and everybody was
telling what they did.
And I said, well, I'm aradiologist with Advanced
Radiology.
And one of the women piped up,she was the graphic artist that
had designed our pyramid logoand working with my partner,
(17:47):
Chuck Wiener, who's anotherMaryland alum and father of two
more Maryland alums and medschool alums.
And And Chuck had hired her andshe came up with the with the
pyramid logo with the x ray tubein the middle and the rays going
out that we all like so much.
So we had a grand time talkingabout that.
Fortunately, I had one of mycards with the logo that
(18:08):
everybody else could see at theday.
So you never know.
Smalltimore is definitely a realthing.
Dana Rampolla (18:15):
That is for sure.
You talked a little bit aboutsome of the other work that
you've done because of yourorganizational abilities.
And I know that you've served ona number of different boards.
You've been a past chief ofstaff and board member at
Carroll Hospital, for example.
Tell me why that was animportant part of your, your
career trajectory.
Harry Knipp (18:34):
I don't know.
It all started with Mrs.
Kirkwood back in coming into myfifth grade room, my, my sixth
grade teacher to be and tappingme, taking me out and telling me
they were making me the captainof the safety patrol the next
year.
And and of course that was in myelementary school.
That was the big shot job.
Then I went to junior high andgot on the AV squad and they may
(18:56):
be the captain of that.
And then I went off to highschool and college and I was
commuting and I didn't really doanything other than manage the
basketball team at Poly for fouryears.
But then when I got to medschool One of my classmates
talked me into running for classpresident, and I got elected,
and it kind of snowballed fromthere.
I enjoyed working with otherpeople, and meeting other smart
(19:20):
people, and bouncing ideasaround.
My partner out in Westminster,in my original practice, was of
a similar ilk, and he was about10 years older, but he got me
involved in the medical staffthere early on and got me
involved in the state radiologysociety.
He gave me the cushy job ofbeing the liaison with the x ray
(19:41):
techs.
All I had to do was go to theirannual meeting at the ocean,
play some golf and give them acheck and judge their student
exhibits.
And of course, when I start,they decided they wanted to
become licensed.
So that's that set me off on awhole thing.
Six of us worked on institutingx ray tech licensure in Maryland
at which we got through.
(20:01):
And I like to think I personallygot Governor Schaffer to sign
off on in a very interestingstory that's too long to tell
here, but and that got meinvolved with the various
iterations of the state medicalboard back then where, where
they were licensed.
And I, I did that in the x raytech arena there for 17 years.
And then.
Governor Ehrlich appointed me tothe brand new formed Maryland
(20:26):
Board of Physicians and I becamethe chairman and I did that for
two terms and stayed there for adecade.
I love doing that and andradiology allowed me to do that
because honestly, I was wellpaid enough and, and had the
career flexibility enough that Icould work half time and, and do
that big job and go to Annapolisand be at all these various
(20:49):
meetings and run around thestate giving talks on the board
and all, which I, I justwonderful, smart people I get to
work with.
That's why I love.
Larry Pitroff when that wascoming to an end there was an
opening on the UMBF board thatmy friend, Larry Pitchoff at the
medical alumni suggested me for.
And I met with Sue Gladhill, whowas then the, the president of
(21:12):
UMBF and we hit it off and theyI, I came onto that board in
2009 and wormed my way up to bein the chair.
So, it's just you know, Been inthe right place at the right
time.
And I'm just so privileged toget to work with so many smart
people and nice people that arededicated and learn from, you
(21:36):
know, I kid myself all the timethat I'm just a country
radiologist from Westminster andI get to hang out with the CEO
of T.
Rowe Price and the, you know,Brian Gibbons who runs all the
shopping centers around town andyou know, I get to talk to these
people plus all the deans andand the university presidents
and it's it I still pinchmyself, you know, because I
(21:58):
don't view myself as having anygreat expertise other than, you
know, Just being a goodschmoozer.
Dana Rampolla (22:06):
Maybe it's a good human being.
Harry Knipp (22:08):
Well, thank you for saying that.
Dana Rampolla (22:10):
Well, there's an old saying that says we not only
count our blessings, but we alsomake our blessings count.
So let's migrate theconversation a little bit
because you certainly are beingvery humble.
You obviously are a very brightman, but you've gone beyond
that.
You have given so much as you'vejust shared a little bit of that
with UMB.
So what, what ways have youserved UMB in recent years, that
(22:35):
makes you feel good.
I mean, you've, you've commentedwhat you've done, but how, how
does it make you feel to be ableto give back to the university?
Because you've stayed connected.
A lot of alumni graduate fromvarious schools and they go
their own way, but you keepcoming back.
Is that tied into the legacythat you have?
Or is it just something reallyspecial about UMB?
Harry Knipp (22:57):
Well, in part to the legacy, but and it's sort of
a mutual thing.
I mean that, you know, I, I didsome things and they made me
feel good about it.
And you know, when you feel goodabout it, then you, you want to
do more things and you know, Andthen I I've made friends with
the with the leadership and I'vegotten got to know people in all
(23:20):
of the schools, not just the medschool.
I'm a lifelong baltimorean.
I was born in the city.
never left.
100 percent of my education frompreschool through my fellowship
at the end of my radiologytraining was all in the
Baltimore City limits.
I went to the Baltimore Citypublic schools all the way.
And until I till I moved out toReisterstown, I lived in the in
(23:44):
the city and in West Baltimore.
The whole family's always beenin the city.
My father and grandfather'spractice.
So I'm like a dyed in the woolBaltimore in and and what, what
better thing than to, you know,with huge anchor institution in
West Baltimore that.
We, we all were a little bit ofa part of, and I've just had fun
(24:07):
being there and they make mefeel good.
I hope I, you know, I'm doingthings that are nice.
I, I really enjoy at the medicalalumni.
I was always on, there's a jointmagazine that the med school and
the medical alumni put outquarterly.
It's fairly nice 40 some pageglossy magazine called The
Bulletin and I was on theeditorial board under one of my
(24:29):
mentors, Dr Joe McLaughlin asthe chair.
And then when he retired fromthat, I was able to chair that
editorial board, which I lovedoing.
I.
I edited the school newspaperwhen I was in medical school and
now I'm doing that again.
I proofread the thing andsuggest articles and and and
that I really enjoy.
(24:50):
We just, the current issue isall about the whole campus and
Dr.
Gerald's vibrancy project andall of the wonderful new things
for the whole campus, not justmedicine.
And I hope that Dr.
Gerald's going to love that whenit, when it it's, I guess it's
out now.
So, And then people like yourcolleague, Jennifer Litchman,
(25:12):
I've, I've worked with her formany, many years, the
fundraising people I've knownfor a long time, and I've gotten
kind of the, the gotten into thedevelopment world now and I'm
interested in helping raisemoney and, and honestly, it's
kind of fun to give some of itaway.
I went around the school andtried to do little things to
(25:33):
memorialize my various familymembers who went there and you
know, a room there or ascholarship here or an award
there.
for various, for various of myforebears.
Never.
I never did anything in my nameuntil just a year or so ago.
I, I I endowed a little awardfor the graduating med student
(25:54):
who was interested in doingsomething in organized medicine.
I figured, you know, that, that,that changed my whole life.
So, I'll I'll find my somebodywho's following in my footsteps.
And so I've had a lot of fundoing that.
And and I guess we'll continueto do more as I go along in
retirement and get older.
(26:15):
My, my kids are into it.
My, my daughter, who's a bigshot banker is is well aware of
my desire.
So, Someday when I, when Idepart, I'm sure she'll take
care of remembering UMB again.
Charles Schelle (26:30):
That's great.
You, you mentioned how much youtalk to people, whether they're
connected with UMB or not, butAs you said, you get to talk to
a lot of students and alumni.
And I'm wondering when, when youmake that connection with alumni
and they're like, I, I want tobe part of UMB again, maybe
giving my time or money.
(26:50):
Is there like a common threadthat you hear from these alumni
about what makes them so proud?
What makes them want to, youknow, still be part of UMB?
Harry Knipp (26:58):
Well, I think that.
We're such a powerhouse placenow with so many terrific
research projects going on worldfamous scholars that are are
teaching at the school now andin the leadership that when
people see that through thevarious media that we put out,
(27:21):
if it's not our bulletinmagazine or the wonderful things
that the that all of the campuspublications people put out.
so much.
Or even the newspaper thesedays, we're getting more press
in The Sun than we've evergotten.
And and when people see that, Ithink they're proud of the
school.
And and then they when they comeback for reunion or whatever, if
(27:43):
I run into them at meetings Ialways try and talk it up even
more and, and tell them waysthat they can be involved.
A couple of my class, one of my.
Classmates Mel Scirocchi went onto be the head of a, of a
pharmaceutical company, and he'sbeen very generous and served as
the chair of the med schoolboard for years, and others the
(28:03):
class ahead of me, class aheadof our classes are big givers.
Our class is still angry, butbut the, the, the class of 75
are really good givers.
So, I'm always trying to towheel people to tell them how
much I've enjoyed it and and howvaluable it's been to me and and
bring up all the good people.
(28:25):
I'm always trying to invitepeople down to campus to to see
things.
I'm on the board at the ProtonTreatment Center on campus,
which is a private thing, butit's the school is invested in
it and it's in our BioPark andand I'm always bringing people
down for tours of that, youknow, to show them and then they
(28:45):
see the BioPark and they flipout and I'm so proud of that.
My wife, Nora is is really intothe biopark.
She, from the beginning, she,she just the first time she saw
it going up Martin Luther KingBoulevard, she was like, wow,
look at this.
And And has been a big fan eversince.
And she hasn't even seen 4MLKyet.
(29:05):
You know, our amazing newbuilding that we're doing with
Wexford is just incredible.
That's on my good buddy JimHughes, which is another treat.
I always loved Jim Hughes, whofor people listening in as our
senior VP of businessdevelopment and economic
development, wonderful man, adoctor's son.
(29:25):
And and I always enjoyed workingwith him.
Now he has a bigger role in theUMB foundation and I get to hang
with Jim all the time, which isa real treat.
It's just a lot of fun.
I do it because it's fun and thepeople are so great and
enthusiastic and we're doingwonderful stuff.
It's a no pay job and in termsof money, but it's huge pay in
(29:47):
terms of personal satisfactionand, and the wonderful people
you get to meet and work with.
Charles Schelle (29:54):
It's a relationship business, and it's
all about the connections andthe people you meet, and on a
fun aside there's anotherconnection you have where maybe
you could go on one of myfavorite TV shows, Finding Your
Roots, with Henry Louis GatesJr.
With one of our members of theadministration.
Tell us a little bit about that.
Harry Knipp (30:16):
Roger Ward.
Oh, what a hoot that, that is.
So, Roger is our wonderfulprovost who has more degrees
than anybody I know.
Brilliant man from Trinidad.
And and we were at a, at a UMBChristmas party over at Hidden
Waters.
And It just, it dawned on methat, you know, I said, Roger,
(30:37):
you know, my, my, my mother'sfather came from Barbados.
He immigrated from Barbadoswhere he grew up.
So I'm one quarter Bajan.
And and his younger sistermarried a fellow named Harry
Ward on the island and blendedour two families together down
there.
And the Wards were quiteprolific.
And there were a lot of themthroughout the Caribbean.
(30:59):
And so, after I got home fromthat, that breakfast with Roger
there, I, I messaged my cousin,Richard Ward up in Toronto and
said, Richard, what are the oddsthat I could be related to an
African American Ward fromTrinidad who has relatives on
Barbados?
He said, a hundred percent.
(31:20):
He said, so apparently one of,one of.
My forebears by marriage wasquite the lothario.
And so there's a, there's a goodpossibility that Roger and I
might be related by marriage, sowe wouldn't have a DNA link, but
we certainly have a lot of funwith it cause we're an unlikely
pairing, but what a great guy heis and he, and of course he ran
(31:43):
the grad school until Dr.
Wong came and and now he's inthe provost role and we just
have a terrific time.
At the meetings together and Youknow, so many, so many smart
people.
Dr.
Wong is wonderful.
I've really enjoyed working withhim.
All of the deans Rene Hutchinsat the law school and Mark
Reynolds I was talking to at adinner one night, his wife was
(32:05):
there.
It turns out we went to the samecommunity pool in West Baltimore
when we were kids.
And then, Sarah Michel beingfrom Sarasota.
And going to the same school asmy grandnephew.
I, I loved Jane Kirschling atthe nursing school.
And when she retired, we got Dr.
Ogbolu and she's very, verynice.
And our, our new librarian, Mrs.
(32:27):
Hurst, I think it is.
I've only met her one time, butshe seems terrific.
And and of course, Mark Gladwin,I worked with Dr.
Reese for 16 years at the at themedical school and he retired
and we got the wonderful Dr.
Gladwin, who's got all of theenergy in the world.
And I'm glad that he stayedaround that CARTI, the research
(32:49):
training institute there.
And I try and talk to him on aregular basis to Just just a
real treat.
I never thought that I wouldknow so many brilliant academic
people.
Charles Schelle (33:02):
We should quickly congratulate, we should
quickly congratulate the, theMaryland Carey Law dean because
she is now Renee HutchinsLaurent.
She got married over the summer.
Harry Knipp (33:12):
Oh, I didn't know.
Wonderful.
I worked with her on a couple ofsearch committees and we got to
know each other a little better.
And she's just been terrific.
I mean, Don Tobin, who was therebefore and another doctor's son
that we we had a good timetalking about and he's, he
stayed around to teach and Reneecame and uh, Judy Postmas over
(33:34):
at the social work school takingover for Rick Barth who I got to
know really well.
And Judy and I have a, have areally nice relationship now.
I'm just getting to know her newdevelopment person.
And so, It's such a treat.
Of course, my, my time will becoming to an end.
I've done this for a while and Ikeep telling telling them they,
(33:55):
they need to spread the wealtharound, but they nobody else
wants to do it.
So, so as long as they're happywith me.
And Zoom works really well and Ican fly up from Sarasota.
I'm up at our place at DeepCreek Lake in Western Maryland
for the summer and and I caneasily drive down from here.
So I've come down for, forseveral meetings and at the same
(34:17):
time going out to dinner with myReistertown friends.
So, that's been that's been alot of fun.
Dana Rampolla (34:24):
So Harry, you certainly are well connected and
you've been very involved.
You, you mentioned retirement,but it doesn't sound like you're
really slowing down any.
What, what does that next seasonlook like for you?
Oh,
Harry Knipp (34:34):
I, I, I, I'll keep doing all this stuff.
I have my hobbies you know, andmy, my wife keeps saying you
need to retire, but I love doingthese.
This, this stuff is me.
I mean, it's just and I think, Ithink Nora has come to realize
that it's just part of my, Itell her it's like heart
muscles.
People, you know, heart musclesintrinsically beat, you know,
(34:56):
it's not work for them to beat.
They beat because they like tobeat and, and that's me with
doing stuff like this.
I'm the president of the roadassociation up here at Deep
Creek, where I live.
And and I'm on, I think I'm onfive boards all together.
One of them actually pays me.
So that was a, that was a nicetreat.
(35:16):
And it's I just I love it.
I, you know, zoom has changedeverything.
That was one of the good thingsto come out of COVID was
everybody learned to zoom andour attendance at meetings has
gone way up because all of thepeople that had trouble driving
in or or were wonderful peoplelike on the alumni bulletin
(35:38):
thing.
We have wonderful people allover the country that couldn't
be involved in that until zoomcame around.
And now, you know, I have 14people on my on my board
meetings there and and the wholeUMBF board always shows up and
the people that live in DC orlive out of town.
That was one of my big goalswith the UMBF board was to get
(35:59):
more people from out of town.
We have so many Baltimorecentric people, but we're a
national institution, and weneed to get our message out
across the country.
And one way to do that is tostart having your board members
be influential people in otherbig cities.
So Dr.
(36:20):
Gladwin, I keep wanting him toYou know, get his Pittsburgh
people on our board.
We have a board member in St.
Louis now, Jennifer Estabrook,who's the retired CEO of Fila is
on our UMBF board andparticipates from New York and
could not be a more active boardmember.
So, I'm really excited abouttrying to expand the reach, at
(36:42):
least have that sort of be mylegacy, if you will Is to try
and, and get the board to be we,we kind of were dragged kicking
and screaming from a littleboard of 18 up to in the forties
now.
And at first some people wereuncomfortable with that, but it
turned out to be a great thing.
And we have.
Just multiplied the talent thatDr Jarrell has to call on for
(37:06):
for various activities, whetherit's real estate or finance, our
finance committee that overseesall the donated monies are just
brilliant people that and I andI want my kids.
My daughter.
Is the head of lending for thewhole United States for
JPMorgan's private bank.
She has a Duke MBA and and isand is brilliant.
(37:30):
So when I go off of the board, Iwant my daughter to, to come
onto the board and, and replaceme.
So there's still a Knippinvolved even if she has a
different last name now, but ormy son, Dave I keep prodding
him.
He's a new partner in hispractice in, in the Clearwater
area.
And and I keep prodding him toget involved in the Florida
(37:51):
Radiologic Society where I havesome friends that I've made over
the years.
That was truly a pleasure.
Last summer, the FloridaRadiologic Society met in
Sarasota and my son drove downfrom Clearwater and I was there
and we went to the meetingstogether.
I got to meet his partners andhe got to meet some of the
senior people from around thecountry that were speakers that
(38:13):
I'd known from my career and myother Florida friends in
radiology.
And we just had a wonderfulweekend there together.
And I'm so excited to have himin the field.
I mean, we, we talk about casesevery day and And he, he's and
he, he, I, I wish my father hadbeen alive when Dave graduated
(38:35):
because Dr.
Reese made a big deal out of itand Dave.
Being the smart little boy thathe is won the faculty gold
medal, which my father wouldhave been immensely proud of.
Dave went on to train atHarvard, you know, and so he's
he's my little Ivy Leaguer Pennand Harvard and, and, and still
just came to Maryland for medschool.
What
Dana Rampolla (38:54):
would you say to an alum who might freshly be
graduated, who is trying to, youknow, they hear this story,
they're empowered by it, whatwould you recommend or encourage
them to do to, to becomeinvolved with their alumni
groups?
Harry Knipp (39:09):
I mean, don't, don't forget where you began
your career, you know, and forme, it was multiplied because
not only did I go to schoolthere, but I trained there as
well.
And a lot of docs have someaffiliation to where they
trained, even if they didn't goto medical school there.
But I would, I would say,remember your roots and and pay
(39:30):
it forward a little bit, youknow, Other people were very
kind to, to do things to make myexperience better I've tried to,
and my family's, and, and I'vetried to to pay that forward and
in medicine, and I hate to harpon medicine because I feel this
way about all the schools therebut it's only natural, I guess,
but It's a good feeling and andit's it's a way to put some
(39:54):
richness in your life and and dogood and, and pay your good
fortune at being one of the 150that got picked out of the 6,
000 to to show your appreciationa little bit and, and do
something nice for the, forstudents coming up.
I always tell them, keep, keeplearning.
(40:15):
That's one beautiful thing aboutmedicine.
You have to keep learning allthe time.
And and there's a lot of joy ingiving back, you know, even if
it's just a little bit, if youcan't afford a lot of money.
And I'm certainly well off, butI'm not as rich as some of the
people that, you know, I'm notgoing to name the medical
school.
That's for sure.
But but it's it's just, youknow, if you can help somebody
(40:38):
out with a scholarship, youknow, and that's, I did that to
memorialize my grandfather, theBajan grandfather.
He loaned me money early in mycareer to allow me to, buy into
a medical office building when Iwas just a young pup just
joining my practice.
And that ended up being a verysuccessful investment.
And when we finally sold thatthing, I didn't need the money
(41:01):
then.
And I had the money and I said,well, darn it, I'm going to do a
scholarship in my grandfather'sname and, and remember him that
way.
And and so we, we have that.
We did another one when Davegraduated for our five
generations.
And and it's just, it, it makesme feel good to know that there
there's a student out therethat's had their burden lowered
(41:22):
a little bit by our, you know,by what we were giving.
Or at the student awardsceremony.
I had such a good time sittingwith the families of these
seniors that have gotten one ofthe awards that we've set up and
and their, their parents are soproud and, and it's just
wonderful to see how brilliantthey are and what they're going
to do.
Dana Rampolla (41:43):
So as we wrap up, I, Harry, I thank you.
I thank you for shedding lighton the school of medicine
specifically here at theuniversity of Maryland,
Baltimore, but also giving a nodto all of the other schools.
I am going to put a little plugjust to all of our alumni.
We try to host you know, one ortwo events each year for the
overarching alumni of theuniversity.
We like to try to encouragepeople to stay connected and
(42:05):
certainly if you're not in aposition to be as generous as
the Knipp family has, you know,there's many ways that our
alumni who are listening mightbe thinking, well, how else can
I get involved?
And there's opportunities to bementors for current students
different ways that you can beinvolved.
So I encourage our listeners toreach out to the alumni
departments within yourindividual schools or, you know,
(42:28):
reach out to Charles and I, andwe can help connect you in some
way that works for you.
So, Harry, thank you so much forsharing and
Harry Knipp (42:35):
then I'll mention the Jennifer Lichman's UMBrella
program who I've hooked her upwith a couple of speakers for,
you know, for the young women oncampus, faculty and students
it's been terrific and being thefather of a smart girl you know,
You know, I thought that was agreat program that she's running
there.
So there's so many wonderfulthings that you guys do for us
(42:57):
and could not be more gratefulto have so many wonderful people
in the family.
And we really are like a familydown there, you know, it's I
love UMB and hopefully they'llhave me for a few more years
yet.
So
Dana Rampolla (43:12):
we certainly hope so.
Well, thanks again, Harry, andwe look forward to seeing you at
the next event.
Harry Knipp (43:17):
Absolutely.
I'm very flattered to talk toyou today.
It's nice to work with both ofyou.
Charles Schelle (43:21):
Yeah.
Thank you, Harry.
Jena Frick (43:28):
The UMB Pulse with Charles Schelle and Dana
Rampolla is a UMB Office ofCommunications and Public
Affairs production, edited byCharles Schelle, marketing by
Dana Rampolla.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!