July 28, 2025 • 34 mins
In this podcast, Jen announces the rebranding of her podcast from Maneely Consulting to The Recovering Family, focusing on helping families with substance abuse issues. She outlines five principles for creating unbreakable boundaries: the Exchange Principle, emphasizing equal exchanges in financial, time, and energy; the Action Principle, stressing the importance of actions over words; the Present Principle, urging focus on the here and now; the Love Principle, advocating for loving communication; and the Joy Principle, highlighting the need for self-care and joy. She also promotes her nonprofit's donation-based services and encourages listeners to visit therecoveringfamily.org for more information.
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Jen (00:00):
Welcome back to the unbreakable boundaries podcast
with your host, myself, JenniferManeely, in today's episode,
this is going to be a reallybrief episode, mostly because
all I wanted to do was make alittle bit of announcement and
tell you what's getting ready tocome up moving forward. So in
(00:20):
the past, all of my episodeshave kind of linked back to my
company called ManeelyConsulting, which is where I
work with families that haveloved ones with substance abuse
issues. Well, starting thisyear, earlier in this year, I
actually opened my own nonprofitdoing the exact same thing, just
(00:42):
under a nonprofit called therecovering family. And then I
had a little bit of angst, andI'm just giving you a little bit
of the backstory, because Ithink transparency is amazing,
and I love when people are justreal and authentic. And for a
while, I spent some time reallyjust angsting over what I was
(01:03):
going to do about the podcast,because it's all branded for
Maneely Consulting, and so howwas I supposed to make that
transition? There was so manygood interviews that I did for
the podcast, so much goodcontent, I didn't want to just
feel like I had to start over,because that seemed exhausting
to me, and I didn't want to losethe content in which has been
(01:28):
created. So I was like, You knowwhat? I am just going to
actually just rebrand everythingand turn it into the recovering
family and keep the name theunbreakable boundaries, because
the unbreakable boundariesreally is about the five
principles that I use when I'mworking with families. So in
(01:51):
terms of the content and thestyle of the content, there
might be some changes. I hope toactually do a little bit more
where I'm going through some ofthese principles, some of the
ideas. And just so you know,because I haven't really
explicitly, even in the past,with this podcast, kind of gone
(02:13):
through those five principles ofwhat I call creating unbreakable
boundaries. And so I thoughtthat could be a good place to
start with this podcast where Ijust touch on those five
principles. Now, the fiveprinciples is really designed to
also be worked with someone likemyself, just because there's is
(02:37):
a lot of accountability and alot of looking at our own
patterns. And as we know aboutpatterns, when we're in them,
sometimes it's really hard forus to see them. So it's really
good to have a third party comein and kind of have us highlight
our own patterns, because whenwe're stuck in them, we're
pretty stuck in them. And so theunbreakable boundaries really is
(02:58):
about breaking free of thesepatterns that we find ourselves
in. So the first principle iswhat I call the Exchange
Principle. And this is reallylooking at three different
categories, financial, time andenergy. And the gist of this is,
(03:18):
how do we create an equalexchange in everything that we
do, it can have a whole lot todo with the situation that you
find yourself in. If you have aloved one with substance abuse
issue and they're constantlyasking you for something, but it
can go much bigger than that,right? You can look at your time
and energy in all aspects ofyour life, whether it's work,
(03:41):
whether it's at work, whetherit's in other types of
relationships, your friendships,whatever it is, especially if
you feel like so many people areasking so many things of you,
and you're like, I'm exhausted.
I can't do this anymore, but yetyou keep saying, Yes, right? So
this is a great thing to reallypay attention to, which is what,
again, what I call the ExchangePrinciple, is, is, how do we
(04:01):
create an equal exchange? Soit's not just us giving
everything to someone else, andthat can happen a lot when we do
have loved ones with substanceabuse issues, where it's like
we're just giving a whole lot ofall of the things that I listed,
the financial the money piece,the the the time piece, as well
(04:23):
as so much of our energy, andthey're just taking, taking,
taking, taking, and we don'tever get any anything in return.
So how do we create that equalexchange? So let me just give
you a scenario, just so you cankind of understand a little bit
how this works. On there's somany times where I get hit up on
Facebook for people needingmoney, maybe not even on
(04:47):
Facebook maybe, you know, theytext me friends I haven't maybe
I haven't even talked to them ina long time, and all of a sudden
I get this random text or thisrandom Facebook message that's
like, Hey, I have really.
Struggling, they give me somesob story about, you know,
what's going on in their life?
I've really been strugglinglately. I don't have any food.
Is there any way that maybe youcan send me some money? Now, a
(05:09):
lot of times I haven't talked tothis person, or I happen to know
that they have been strugglingwith substances lately. And one
thing that I don't want to do isjust give them money, you know,
for them to use on substances,like I know that they're
(05:30):
probably going to do, but Idon't want to be a person that
denies someone help when theyactually really need it, so I
don't ever want to be thatperson, either. So where do we
find this, this place that wecan come to in ourselves, where
we are able to both help peoplethat really, truly need it,
(05:54):
because I don't ever wantanybody to starve, but also, I
don't want to help someone feedtheir own addiction, either. So
I usually will make people jumpthrough some hoops before I give
them any money. I try to createso like, if it's someone in the
area, I may go ask them to meetme down at the car wash, and
(06:20):
they can, like, wash my car. AndI can go to one of the car
washes where you actually haveto, like, put the quarters in
and scrub your car down orwhatever. And maybe I, maybe I
want them to, like, vacuum theinside of the car out or
whatever. And but they can doall of that work for themselves,
and I will give them X amount ofdollars for however long that
(06:43):
they do or something like that,right? So, like, that's just an
example of of how can I ask themto do something for me so that I
am paying for a service of somekind, right? So what they choose
to do with the money at thatpoint is, is no longer my
(07:06):
business. It's I am paying themfor a service. There is an
exchange they worked for it. NowI will tell you that I have yet
to have people in this situationwho fed me this sob story, and I
wanted to give them, you know, achance, an offering. I have not
found people take me up on thisbecause I know that that's
(07:31):
probably what's going on in yourhead, is, is like, well, maybe I
don't want to do that, or maybethat's not a good exchange, or
maybe they're not in the area,or whatever. Well, I just kind
of want to see one where theirmindset is at first, it's
they're even willing toentertain an exchange so that I
can pay for a service. Now,here's the trick of this as
well.
(07:54):
If I cannot create a goodexchange with someone, a
reasonable exchange. Maybe it'sjust not possible. Maybe they're
not in the area. Maybe there isnot a service that they can
provide for me. I can offerother suggestions for the ways
for them to get food. So inevery town that I've I have
(08:19):
lived in, or I know aboutthere's always some sort of
resource available for people.
It could be through churches.
Many, many churches have foodpantries. And I don't know of a
church that, if you went up tothem and said, Hey, I'm really
hungry. I'm starving. I needfood for my kids, or whatever it
(08:42):
is that they wouldn't figure outhow to get you some food, right?
So there is always that optionwhere, if someone is is asking
for food, and the reason that Iam leaning on the food part of
this is because many times whenpeople are trying to get
substances they will often usethe I'm starving, I have no
(09:06):
food, I have no whatever,because all they really need is,
like, 5075, bucks or somethingto go get. It's not like they're
missing out on their rent.
They're not asking for rentpayments. They're asking for
food because they know thattypically people don't deny them
access to food. And so if Ican't create an equal exchange,
(09:27):
I might offer some suggestionson the best ways for them to go
get some food without meactually giving them money. I'm
just not. I'm just not in the inthe practice of doing that,
because I've been I have beenburned quite a few times. So all
of this, I'm telling you, iscoming based on my experience of
(09:51):
what happens and all of thetimes that I have been burned.
And. And how sometimes when I'vebeen burned, that kind of makes
me a little jaded in terms ofwanting to help people, but I
don't want to also be thatperson, so I had to find a way
within myself to to be able tooffer help when someone really
(10:16):
needed it without also gettingtaken advantage of. So this was
just, you know, a pretty simpleway that I have found for myself
to kind of have people jumpthrough some hoops and to create
an exchange with people, tolimit the amount of times that I
get taken advantage of. When welook at time and energy, they
(10:37):
kind of go a little hand inhand, because sometimes there's,
like, a lot of situations inwhich people are asking for so
much time. Can you give me aride here? Can you do this? And
it's all just me putting in somuch more effort than what they
are willing to put inthemselves. And so this is the
other thing that I look at. Howmuch willingness does someone
else have for themselves to putenergy into themselves. So if
(11:01):
I'm putting more energy into aperson, then I feel like they
are putting more energy. So ifI'm just doing all the heavy
lifting, I got to take a stepback and realize that maybe
that's not the best way to goabout things. So I I look at my
time, and I'm like, I don't wantto spend all of this time. What,
(11:22):
like, what can you do for me? Solike, I don't mind giving people
rides every now and then, if itmakes sense for me, if I'm in
town and they really need it,but I am not going to create a
pattern of giving people rides.
So like, if, if you might be aperson that people just come to
all the time consistently andasking for rise, and you're
(11:45):
like, I gotta stop this shit.
Yeah, yeah, you do, becausethat's a whole lot of that's a
whole lot of time for not awhole lot of return, right? So
again, like, I can start askingpeople to do things for me as
well. Sure, I'll give you a rideif you do X, Y and Z for me as
well. Most of the time, people,if they really are wanting to
(12:09):
return the favor and they're nottaking advantage of you, they
will jump on the opportunity toalso help you out as well. And
if they are just not interestedin helping you out, and they
just want to keep takingadvantage of you and creating a
one side sided street here, thenthey will often not take you up
on them doing a favor for you,right? So we want to start
(12:35):
having ways for people to jumpthrough hoops and creating some
sort of an equal exchange, sothat it's just not you always
giving everything out. And thesame goes with energy too. We're
going to talk about this here ina little bit when I get to
another principle towards theend. But the energy is really,
(12:55):
really important. So wheneverwe're we are putting energy out,
we have to find ways to bringthat energy back in. And so this
is a lot about taking care ofourselves and our self care
routines. And what are we doingto not spend so much energy on
people? And when we do, how dowe bring that back in? Which,
(13:18):
again, I'm going to talk about alittle bit more in depth when we
get to the last principle that Italk about, which is called The
Joy principle. Now the nextprinciple that I want to talk
about is what I call the actionprinciple. So this is really
about understanding that peoplecannot hear the words that come
(13:40):
out of your mouth. They can onlyunderstand the actions that you
take behind the things that yousay, and that, again, that goes
with anybody, right? So when wesay, actions speak louder than
words. That's what we're talkingabout. But we're talking about
it, not in such a like we canacknowledge that. But do we
(14:04):
really think about when we'resaying things? What are our own
actions? Right? We're so busypaying attention to that saying
when it comes to someone else,that we don't really reflect and
think about it for ourselves interms of the things that we say
and do matter, you know, likethe things that, if you're
(14:26):
telling someone that you'regoing to do something and then
you don't do it right, then it'steaching them maybe they can get
away with it. I was, I was justrecently talking to someone,
which is, this is a very commonexample where they're like, hey,
you know, I said I set thisboundary, and then I went back
on it, right? And it's like,well, that's where we start
(14:48):
teaching them that they can getaway, that they don't really,
actually have to listen to ourboundaries, because it's not the
words that you're saying tothem, it's the actual action.
That you're putting in. And sosometimes when we set
boundaries, a not clear boundaryis a boundary that has zero
action. There's nothing reallylike you're just telling someone
(15:10):
else what to do. Hey, you can'tdo this anymore. Well, that's
not, yes, it's a boundary, butit's not one that people are
going to probably take veryseriously because there's no
action behind it, and we'retrying to control someone else's
behavior, right? Which we can'tdo. We can't control someone
else's behavior. I would love tosit here and say that there's
(15:32):
all these things that you cansay and do to try to control
someone's behavior, and I Iwould be a lot better off in my
business if I could tell you thethe phrase to say that would
make someone listen to you anddo what you tell them to do.
It's just not going to happen.
(15:53):
So the action principle isreally about making sure that we
have actions. So you know, youcan say something like, Hey, if
you continue to do this, thenI'm going to do, you know that
I'm going to do Y. So if you doX, I'm going to do y, and then
(16:15):
you actually have to do Y,right? So when we're setting
boundaries and we're being veryclear. You know, things have to
kind of be set in such a waythat that people can understand
there's time frames are reallygood as well. So when you're
thinking about boundaries, howlong does someone have to to
meet the expectations? People dobetter when they know what to
(16:37):
expect. And so I think, likewhen it comes to the the action
principle, this is where peopleyou can really be clear about
what they can expect from youand the behaviors that they can
expect from you. Everything wesay and do, we're teaching
people how to treat us, so bemindful of the things that you
(17:00):
say and you do or don't doright? The next principle is a
fairly deep and intense this isthe journey. This is the
lifelong stuff. This is thestuff that your work really
starts. You start investing alot in your personal journey,
your personal work. And it'scalled the present principle,
(17:21):
and by present I mean being inthe here and the now. So we
can't allow our past to dictateand get in the way of the
decisions that we have to maketoday.
Nor can we allow the fear of thefuture to to control how we're
(17:43):
making decisions for the hereand the now, because when we're
looking at future and we'reworried about the future, we're
worried about scenarios thataren't actually happening, we're
not basing our decisions inreality. We're basing our
decisions in fear. And peoplecan often come back to me and
say, Yeah, but I know exactlyhow they're going to act. I know
(18:06):
exactly what's going to get,what's going to happen, and I'm
just preemptively responding,well, no, you're you're afraid
that that's how they're going toact. You're afraid that that's
how it's going to go down. Butwe don't know that. We have to
look at the situation in thehere and the now and the same
with the past, right? So maybeyou grew up in a certain way.
Maybe you were taught a certainthing. Maybe you have a belief
(18:29):
system created from when youwere a child about how to feel
about certain things. Maybe yougrew up with a father, a mother,
a brother, a sister that hadsubstances in your life, and
you're basing decisions aroundyour own family and your own
(18:50):
kids now based on what you'veexperienced in the past and the
way that you interpreted whatyou experienced in the past. So
now we're here, and I'm notsaying that it can't be
educational, because, like, ourexperience gives us education to
help us form decisions, but whenwe are sometimes, our past can
(19:11):
actually interfere with thedecisions that we have to make
today. So there's a differencebetween, you know, allowing our
past to interfere with thedecisions that we know we need
to make, versus allowing ourexperience to create wiser
decisions. Sometimes that's notalways very clear. So the
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question is is, how are weletting our past interfere with
the decisions, and then also,how are we letting the fear of
the future dictate the decisionsthat we need to make now, that
we may be afraid of becausewe're worried about the outcome
that hasn't even happened yet,or the scenario in which isn't
even in existence, because we'rejust afraid of this scenario,
(19:58):
but we know we need to. At thatboundary, we're just too afraid
to do it, because we are afraidof what's going to happen. And
so we have to really look atthat fear. And that's the
present principle is, how do westay in the here and then now?
Now? The next principle is thelove principle, and this is
(20:19):
really all about cultivating andgenerating loving communication
with our loved one. Because,man, I know that they have spent
years just pissing you off anddoing really stupid shitty
things, and there's a lot ofanger in there. And as there has
every right, you have everyright to be angry about some of
(20:40):
the things that they done, aswell as be fearful about the
things that they're going to do,or, you know, who they're
capable of, and all all of thatstuff. So how, when we
communicate, how do we remainloving, how do we remain in in a
way that's in alignment with howwe want to actually show up and
(21:01):
treat them, and the reason forthis is really because we can't
spend so much time and energyreleasing our anger on them, not
that they don't deserve it,because I know they do, but It's
not helpful. And what we want isdoing things that are helpful,
(21:24):
and how do we communicate ourexpectations in a very clear and
loving way? Hey, I believe inyou. I trust that you can do
this. I am not kicking you outof the house. I am honoring the
decision that you're making toleave because you did not want
(21:45):
to abide by the rules in underwhich we had stated in which you
can live in this house, right?
So we look at loving language,language that does not hit on
their own, already in existenceshame spiral, right? So we don't
want to fuel their shame spiralanymore, and we want to be
(22:06):
helpful, and we want to bebeneficial. And so when we go
into our angry place, and whenwe go into our place in which,
you know, we're mostly beggingthem to hear us, which they
can't they can't hear us, right?
(22:27):
We're asking them to give ussomething that they can't give
us, and then getting mad at themwhen they can't give us the
thing that they don't have togive us. Does that make sense?
But what we want is to make surethat we are helping them and we
can heal the damage that hasbeen caused in our relationships
(22:47):
from all of the stuff thatthey've done in the future. Now
this, this is where it's like, Idon't know any parent that gets
to the point where they want tocut their kid off, right? But
sometimes that feels like theonly other option they have. And
I'm here to tell you that wedon't have to allow things to
(23:09):
get to that point when we startcreating this loving
communication with them thathonors them, but that does not
allow them certain behaviors inyour life anymore, right? So we
reject behaviors. We don't everreject the person, because their
behaviors does not mean that'swho they are, and that's
(23:32):
something that we have to bevery clear. And when we're able
to separate the people fromtheir behaviors and start
communicating in that way wherewe are again we are rejecting
that behavior, then our languagecan align and be in alignment
(23:52):
with serving them, and also bein alignment with who we want to
be as people that we care aboutand how we want to handle that
we just don't have to allowcertain things in our lives, and
we can also be very clear aboutthat, and they may get mad, they
(24:12):
may get frustrated, and they mayget into that manipulative state
of being where it's mostly justthem trying to figure out how to
get what they want, and so angryand stuff. So people often get
angry, not because they'rereally angry, but because they
know that that's the button thatthey need to push in order to
(24:33):
get what they want. So when itcomes to loving communication,
we also have to have lovingcommunication when it comes to
ourselves as well, when it comesto how we are thinking about
ourselves, how we are talkingabout ourselves. We want to stay
in that loving place forourselves, and we want to look
at our own shame and our ownguilt. And how do we look at
(24:57):
that so that it's not dictatingin this? Kind of goes back a
little bit into being in thepresent, or back into the
present principle, which isreally looking at our shame and
our guilt and making sure thatthe people that we care about
and the people we're trying tohelp are actually able to use
that and weaponize that againstus. Right. Language matters if
(25:21):
you don't take anything elseaway from this podcast today, I
want you to take that one thing,language matters. Now the last
principle I want to talk aboutis what I call the joy
principle. And this is reallyabout making sure that we are
(25:41):
paying attention to how much joythat we have in our own lives.
Joy is something that I think isoften minimized and it's put to
the side when we are goingthrough so many rough things, if
we're going through depressionor we're going through anxiety,
we put ourselves to the side alot when other people around us
(26:04):
are struggling, and it's to me,it's actually the opposite of
what we need to be doing when weare struggling or someone else
in our life is struggling.
We have to spend more timebringing in joy and being
conscious and being mindfulabout ensuring that we are
taking care of ourselves throughthat time period when we have
(26:26):
someone else, because it's soeasy to feel like we don't
deserve joy. We don't need to beworried about ourselves right
now. We have to worry aboutsomeone else, but if we want to
be the person that they need usto be and this goes for any
situation. I'm not just talkingabout having a family member
(26:46):
with substance abuse issues. I'mtalking about in any situation
you have a sick parent, you havea sick kid, you have, you know,
something going on with anotherfriend, you are allowed to have
a multitude of emotions at anyone given time, so you can both
feel upset and sad for whateversomeone else is going through,
(27:08):
while also taking care ofyourself in the process and
bringing joy into your life,because that is going to make
you a better person for them,and I want you to remember that
it's going to make you a better,stronger person for them, and
it's going to make you feelbetter in the meantime, this is
a crucial, probably one of themore crucial principles of all
(27:32):
of them, because it all ties in.
You can't do a whole lot of theother principles as effectively
if you don't have joy in yourlife. So self care is important,
and yes, things like gettingmassages and getting
acupuncture, that is part ofself care, right? It's a great
thing, but making sure thatyou're feeling your cup, that
(27:57):
you are feeling joy like youare, that sense of like
overwhelming, like, I'm just sohappy, even if it's just for two
minutes, even if it's just even60 seconds, finding something,
turning on, Some music, anddancing your full little head
(28:20):
off. This is one of my personalfavorite things to do. Turn on
some good music, dance like acrazy woman and just be in the
moment. It's something that
Unknown (28:34):
brings me back to center, brings me peace, makes
me
Jen (28:37):
feel good, makes the world feel not so stressful, right? So
sometimes we can get just sostressed out that it just starts
spiraling. All of that anxietycan just really feed off of each
other and like it's not a goodthing. So we have to figure out
(28:59):
how to balance the anxiety. Ofour lives with also bringing in
the joy. This is also why I lookat like the Exchange Principle,
right? So whenever we have a lotof anxiety going on, we need to
bring just as much joy into ourlives. This is I cannot express
(29:23):
and articulate in words howimportant it is to be mindful
and allow yourself, giveyourself permission to be happy,
even if in other areas of yourlife you are unhappy, there
needs to be a balance, and giveyourself permission to do that,
(29:47):
to have that, to be that. Sothose are the five principles of
the unbreakable boundaries inwhich I. Really never
articulated in this podcast, inin how do we go about living a
boundaries lifestyle when wehave a loved one, substance
(30:10):
abuse issues or just in general,and keeping in mind that these
are all things that I have Ihave learned through experience.
I've been there. These are thethings that I have to do in
order to take care of myself.
And it's an ongoing journey. Andso I'm not gonna sit here and
say I'm perfect, but whensomething goes on that maybe
(30:36):
like I did something that I lookback and go, ooh. Was that in
alignment with one of these fiveprinciples? What was I missing?
Hindsight, being 2020, if Icould do it all over again, this
is the way that I would do it.
This is a reflection. Socreating unbreakable boundaries
is more about not so much taskoriented, but about a lifestyle.
(30:59):
It's about being aware. It'sabout figuring out how you see
the world and thinkingdifferently, and starting to
recognize patterns, starting topay attention to when we fall
short, and being willing to takea look at it and do something
different in the future. Becausethat's what this is about, is
(31:20):
about being willing to dosomething different, so if you
want to know more. And this iswhere, again, this is my first
podcast where I'm actuallylooking at, you know, my
nonprofit and kind of sharingabout that you can if you want
(31:42):
to learn more and understand theservices that we provide, you
can go check out my website atthe recovering family.org and on
there, you will see that all ofour services are donation based
services, which I think isamazing, so anyone can afford
it. That was a crucial piece tome. Also on there, if you are
(32:07):
someone that can and you'relike, Man, I just love what
you're doing, and you want togive a donation to help
supplement and pay for some ofthese services that other people
can't afford, there is a littledonation spot that you can make
a donation all 100% of thedonations that are received goes
directly into the services thatwe offer. So anyway, I am super
(32:35):
proud of the the work that thenonprofit and this organization
does, and I really hope that youwant to be a part of it in any
way, shape or form, whether it'sdonation, whether you're someone
that does have a family memberthat has loved ones with
substance abuse issues and youneed help, I would love for you
(32:56):
to reach out and just figure outhow to handle the situation,
Whether it's one call that youneed, if you're just like, I
just need someone to talk to, orif you're like, I'm ready to
actually dive in and do somethings differently and change my
life. I can't keep living likethis anymore, and you want to
set up a more long term kind ofsituation with us. We can
(33:21):
definitely work with you. Thegreatest thing is that all of
our services are also virtual,so we can work with people from
all over, from everywhere.
There's even a little box on mywebsite that you can literally
just schedule a call all on yourown. And again, that website is
the recoveringfamily.org so gocheck that website out and see
(33:46):
all of the cool things that wehave on there. We also do blogs.
I spend a lot of time writingblogs as well as some video
content, so you shoulddefinitely check some of that
stuff out as well. So I hopeeveryone has a great rest of
their day and until the nextpodcast, get out there and go
create some unbreakableboundaries. You.
Welcome back to the unbreakable boundaries podcast
with your host, myself, JenniferManeely, in today's episode,
this is going to be a reallybrief episode, mostly because
all I wanted to do was make alittle bit of announcement and
tell you what's getting ready tocome up moving forward. So in
(00:20):
the past, all of my episodeshave kind of linked back to my
company called ManeelyConsulting, which is where I
work with families that haveloved ones with substance abuse
issues. Well, starting thisyear, earlier in this year, I
actually opened my own nonprofitdoing the exact same thing, just
(00:42):
under a nonprofit called therecovering family. And then I
had a little bit of angst, andI'm just giving you a little bit
of the backstory, because Ithink transparency is amazing,
and I love when people are justreal and authentic. And for a
while, I spent some time reallyjust angsting over what I was
(01:03):
going to do about the podcast,because it's all branded for
Maneely Consulting, and so howwas I supposed to make that
transition? There was so manygood interviews that I did for
the podcast, so much goodcontent, I didn't want to just
feel like I had to start over,because that seemed exhausting
to me, and I didn't want to losethe content in which has been
(01:28):
created. So I was like, You knowwhat? I am just going to
actually just rebrand everythingand turn it into the recovering
family and keep the name theunbreakable boundaries, because
the unbreakable boundariesreally is about the five
principles that I use when I'mworking with families. So in
(01:51):
terms of the content and thestyle of the content, there
might be some changes. I hope toactually do a little bit more
where I'm going through some ofthese principles, some of the
ideas. And just so you know,because I haven't really
explicitly, even in the past,with this podcast, kind of gone
(02:13):
through those five principles ofwhat I call creating unbreakable
boundaries. And so I thoughtthat could be a good place to
start with this podcast where Ijust touch on those five
principles. Now, the fiveprinciples is really designed to
also be worked with someone likemyself, just because there's is
(02:37):
a lot of accountability and alot of looking at our own
patterns. And as we know aboutpatterns, when we're in them,
sometimes it's really hard forus to see them. So it's really
good to have a third party comein and kind of have us highlight
our own patterns, because whenwe're stuck in them, we're
pretty stuck in them. And so theunbreakable boundaries really is
(02:58):
about breaking free of thesepatterns that we find ourselves
in. So the first principle iswhat I call the Exchange
Principle. And this is reallylooking at three different
categories, financial, time andenergy. And the gist of this is,
(03:18):
how do we create an equalexchange in everything that we
do, it can have a whole lot todo with the situation that you
find yourself in. If you have aloved one with substance abuse
issue and they're constantlyasking you for something, but it
can go much bigger than that,right? You can look at your time
and energy in all aspects ofyour life, whether it's work,
(03:41):
whether it's at work, whetherit's in other types of
relationships, your friendships,whatever it is, especially if
you feel like so many people areasking so many things of you,
and you're like, I'm exhausted.
I can't do this anymore, but yetyou keep saying, Yes, right? So
this is a great thing to reallypay attention to, which is what,
again, what I call the ExchangePrinciple, is, is, how do we
(04:01):
create an equal exchange? Soit's not just us giving
everything to someone else, andthat can happen a lot when we do
have loved ones with substanceabuse issues, where it's like
we're just giving a whole lot ofall of the things that I listed,
the financial the money piece,the the the time piece, as well
(04:23):
as so much of our energy, andthey're just taking, taking,
taking, taking, and we don'tever get any anything in return.
So how do we create that equalexchange? So let me just give
you a scenario, just so you cankind of understand a little bit
how this works. On there's somany times where I get hit up on
Facebook for people needingmoney, maybe not even on
(04:47):
Facebook maybe, you know, theytext me friends I haven't maybe
I haven't even talked to them ina long time, and all of a sudden
I get this random text or thisrandom Facebook message that's
like, Hey, I have really.
Struggling, they give me somesob story about, you know,
what's going on in their life?
I've really been strugglinglately. I don't have any food.
Is there any way that maybe youcan send me some money? Now, a
(05:09):
lot of times I haven't talked tothis person, or I happen to know
that they have been strugglingwith substances lately. And one
thing that I don't want to do isjust give them money, you know,
for them to use on substances,like I know that they're
(05:30):
probably going to do, but Idon't want to be a person that
denies someone help when theyactually really need it, so I
don't ever want to be thatperson, either. So where do we
find this, this place that wecan come to in ourselves, where
we are able to both help peoplethat really, truly need it,
(05:54):
because I don't ever wantanybody to starve, but also, I
don't want to help someone feedtheir own addiction, either. So
I usually will make people jumpthrough some hoops before I give
them any money. I try to createso like, if it's someone in the
area, I may go ask them to meetme down at the car wash, and
(06:20):
they can, like, wash my car. AndI can go to one of the car
washes where you actually haveto, like, put the quarters in
and scrub your car down orwhatever. And maybe I, maybe I
want them to, like, vacuum theinside of the car out or
whatever. And but they can doall of that work for themselves,
and I will give them X amount ofdollars for however long that
(06:43):
they do or something like that,right? So, like, that's just an
example of of how can I ask themto do something for me so that I
am paying for a service of somekind, right? So what they choose
to do with the money at thatpoint is, is no longer my
(07:06):
business. It's I am paying themfor a service. There is an
exchange they worked for it. NowI will tell you that I have yet
to have people in this situationwho fed me this sob story, and I
wanted to give them, you know, achance, an offering. I have not
found people take me up on thisbecause I know that that's
(07:31):
probably what's going on in yourhead, is, is like, well, maybe I
don't want to do that, or maybethat's not a good exchange, or
maybe they're not in the area,or whatever. Well, I just kind
of want to see one where theirmindset is at first, it's
they're even willing toentertain an exchange so that I
can pay for a service. Now,here's the trick of this as
well.
(07:54):
If I cannot create a goodexchange with someone, a
reasonable exchange. Maybe it'sjust not possible. Maybe they're
not in the area. Maybe there isnot a service that they can
provide for me. I can offerother suggestions for the ways
for them to get food. So inevery town that I've I have
(08:19):
lived in, or I know aboutthere's always some sort of
resource available for people.
It could be through churches.
Many, many churches have foodpantries. And I don't know of a
church that, if you went up tothem and said, Hey, I'm really
hungry. I'm starving. I needfood for my kids, or whatever it
(08:42):
is that they wouldn't figure outhow to get you some food, right?
So there is always that optionwhere, if someone is is asking
for food, and the reason that Iam leaning on the food part of
this is because many times whenpeople are trying to get
substances they will often usethe I'm starving, I have no
(09:06):
food, I have no whatever,because all they really need is,
like, 5075, bucks or somethingto go get. It's not like they're
missing out on their rent.
They're not asking for rentpayments. They're asking for
food because they know thattypically people don't deny them
access to food. And so if Ican't create an equal exchange,
(09:27):
I might offer some suggestionson the best ways for them to go
get some food without meactually giving them money. I'm
just not. I'm just not in the inthe practice of doing that,
because I've been I have beenburned quite a few times. So all
of this, I'm telling you, iscoming based on my experience of
(09:51):
what happens and all of thetimes that I have been burned.
And. And how sometimes when I'vebeen burned, that kind of makes
me a little jaded in terms ofwanting to help people, but I
don't want to also be thatperson, so I had to find a way
within myself to to be able tooffer help when someone really
(10:16):
needed it without also gettingtaken advantage of. So this was
just, you know, a pretty simpleway that I have found for myself
to kind of have people jumpthrough some hoops and to create
an exchange with people, tolimit the amount of times that I
get taken advantage of. When welook at time and energy, they
(10:37):
kind of go a little hand inhand, because sometimes there's,
like, a lot of situations inwhich people are asking for so
much time. Can you give me aride here? Can you do this? And
it's all just me putting in somuch more effort than what they
are willing to put inthemselves. And so this is the
other thing that I look at. Howmuch willingness does someone
else have for themselves to putenergy into themselves. So if
(11:01):
I'm putting more energy into aperson, then I feel like they
are putting more energy. So ifI'm just doing all the heavy
lifting, I got to take a stepback and realize that maybe
that's not the best way to goabout things. So I I look at my
time, and I'm like, I don't wantto spend all of this time. What,
(11:22):
like, what can you do for me? Solike, I don't mind giving people
rides every now and then, if itmakes sense for me, if I'm in
town and they really need it,but I am not going to create a
pattern of giving people rides.
So like, if, if you might be aperson that people just come to
all the time consistently andasking for rise, and you're
(11:45):
like, I gotta stop this shit.
Yeah, yeah, you do, becausethat's a whole lot of that's a
whole lot of time for not awhole lot of return, right? So
again, like, I can start askingpeople to do things for me as
well. Sure, I'll give you a rideif you do X, Y and Z for me as
well. Most of the time, people,if they really are wanting to
(12:09):
return the favor and they're nottaking advantage of you, they
will jump on the opportunity toalso help you out as well. And
if they are just not interestedin helping you out, and they
just want to keep takingadvantage of you and creating a
one side sided street here, thenthey will often not take you up
on them doing a favor for you,right? So we want to start
(12:35):
having ways for people to jumpthrough hoops and creating some
sort of an equal exchange, sothat it's just not you always
giving everything out. And thesame goes with energy too. We're
going to talk about this here ina little bit when I get to
another principle towards theend. But the energy is really,
(12:55):
really important. So wheneverwe're we are putting energy out,
we have to find ways to bringthat energy back in. And so this
is a lot about taking care ofourselves and our self care
routines. And what are we doingto not spend so much energy on
people? And when we do, how dowe bring that back in? Which,
(13:18):
again, I'm going to talk about alittle bit more in depth when we
get to the last principle that Italk about, which is called The
Joy principle. Now the nextprinciple that I want to talk
about is what I call the actionprinciple. So this is really
about understanding that peoplecannot hear the words that come
(13:40):
out of your mouth. They can onlyunderstand the actions that you
take behind the things that yousay, and that, again, that goes
with anybody, right? So when wesay, actions speak louder than
words. That's what we're talkingabout. But we're talking about
it, not in such a like we canacknowledge that. But do we
(14:04):
really think about when we'resaying things? What are our own
actions? Right? We're so busypaying attention to that saying
when it comes to someone else,that we don't really reflect and
think about it for ourselves interms of the things that we say
and do matter, you know, likethe things that, if you're
(14:26):
telling someone that you'regoing to do something and then
you don't do it right, then it'steaching them maybe they can get
away with it. I was, I was justrecently talking to someone,
which is, this is a very commonexample where they're like, hey,
you know, I said I set thisboundary, and then I went back
on it, right? And it's like,well, that's where we start
(14:48):
teaching them that they can getaway, that they don't really,
actually have to listen to ourboundaries, because it's not the
words that you're saying tothem, it's the actual action.
That you're putting in. And sosometimes when we set
boundaries, a not clear boundaryis a boundary that has zero
action. There's nothing reallylike you're just telling someone
(15:10):
else what to do. Hey, you can'tdo this anymore. Well, that's
not, yes, it's a boundary, butit's not one that people are
going to probably take veryseriously because there's no
action behind it, and we'retrying to control someone else's
behavior, right? Which we can'tdo. We can't control someone
else's behavior. I would love tosit here and say that there's
(15:32):
all these things that you cansay and do to try to control
someone's behavior, and I Iwould be a lot better off in my
business if I could tell you thethe phrase to say that would
make someone listen to you anddo what you tell them to do.
It's just not going to happen.
(15:53):
So the action principle isreally about making sure that we
have actions. So you know, youcan say something like, Hey, if
you continue to do this, thenI'm going to do, you know that
I'm going to do Y. So if you doX, I'm going to do y, and then
(16:15):
you actually have to do Y,right? So when we're setting
boundaries and we're being veryclear. You know, things have to
kind of be set in such a waythat that people can understand
there's time frames are reallygood as well. So when you're
thinking about boundaries, howlong does someone have to to
meet the expectations? People dobetter when they know what to
(16:37):
expect. And so I think, likewhen it comes to the the action
principle, this is where peopleyou can really be clear about
what they can expect from youand the behaviors that they can
expect from you. Everything wesay and do, we're teaching
people how to treat us, so bemindful of the things that you
(17:00):
say and you do or don't doright? The next principle is a
fairly deep and intense this isthe journey. This is the
lifelong stuff. This is thestuff that your work really
starts. You start investing alot in your personal journey,
your personal work. And it'scalled the present principle,
(17:21):
and by present I mean being inthe here and the now. So we
can't allow our past to dictateand get in the way of the
decisions that we have to maketoday.
Nor can we allow the fear of thefuture to to control how we're
(17:43):
making decisions for the hereand the now, because when we're
looking at future and we'reworried about the future, we're
worried about scenarios thataren't actually happening, we're
not basing our decisions inreality. We're basing our
decisions in fear. And peoplecan often come back to me and
say, Yeah, but I know exactlyhow they're going to act. I know
(18:06):
exactly what's going to get,what's going to happen, and I'm
just preemptively responding,well, no, you're you're afraid
that that's how they're going toact. You're afraid that that's
how it's going to go down. Butwe don't know that. We have to
look at the situation in thehere and the now and the same
with the past, right? So maybeyou grew up in a certain way.
Maybe you were taught a certainthing. Maybe you have a belief
(18:29):
system created from when youwere a child about how to feel
about certain things. Maybe yougrew up with a father, a mother,
a brother, a sister that hadsubstances in your life, and
you're basing decisions aroundyour own family and your own
(18:50):
kids now based on what you'veexperienced in the past and the
way that you interpreted whatyou experienced in the past. So
now we're here, and I'm notsaying that it can't be
educational, because, like, ourexperience gives us education to
help us form decisions, but whenwe are sometimes, our past can
(19:11):
actually interfere with thedecisions that we have to make
today. So there's a differencebetween, you know, allowing our
past to interfere with thedecisions that we know we need
to make, versus allowing ourexperience to create wiser
decisions. Sometimes that's notalways very clear. So the
(19:37):
question is is, how are weletting our past interfere with
the decisions, and then also,how are we letting the fear of
the future dictate the decisionsthat we need to make now, that
we may be afraid of becausewe're worried about the outcome
that hasn't even happened yet,or the scenario in which isn't
even in existence, because we'rejust afraid of this scenario,
(19:58):
but we know we need to. At thatboundary, we're just too afraid
to do it, because we are afraidof what's going to happen. And
so we have to really look atthat fear. And that's the
present principle is, how do westay in the here and then now?
Now? The next principle is thelove principle, and this is
(20:19):
really all about cultivating andgenerating loving communication
with our loved one. Because,man, I know that they have spent
years just pissing you off anddoing really stupid shitty
things, and there's a lot ofanger in there. And as there has
every right, you have everyright to be angry about some of
(20:40):
the things that they done, aswell as be fearful about the
things that they're going to do,or, you know, who they're
capable of, and all all of thatstuff. So how, when we
communicate, how do we remainloving, how do we remain in in a
way that's in alignment with howwe want to actually show up and
(21:01):
treat them, and the reason forthis is really because we can't
spend so much time and energyreleasing our anger on them, not
that they don't deserve it,because I know they do, but It's
not helpful. And what we want isdoing things that are helpful,
(21:24):
and how do we communicate ourexpectations in a very clear and
loving way? Hey, I believe inyou. I trust that you can do
this. I am not kicking you outof the house. I am honoring the
decision that you're making toleave because you did not want
(21:45):
to abide by the rules in underwhich we had stated in which you
can live in this house, right?
So we look at loving language,language that does not hit on
their own, already in existenceshame spiral, right? So we don't
want to fuel their shame spiralanymore, and we want to be
(22:06):
helpful, and we want to bebeneficial. And so when we go
into our angry place, and whenwe go into our place in which,
you know, we're mostly beggingthem to hear us, which they
can't they can't hear us, right?
(22:27):
We're asking them to give ussomething that they can't give
us, and then getting mad at themwhen they can't give us the
thing that they don't have togive us. Does that make sense?
But what we want is to make surethat we are helping them and we
can heal the damage that hasbeen caused in our relationships
(22:47):
from all of the stuff thatthey've done in the future. Now
this, this is where it's like, Idon't know any parent that gets
to the point where they want tocut their kid off, right? But
sometimes that feels like theonly other option they have. And
I'm here to tell you that wedon't have to allow things to
(23:09):
get to that point when we startcreating this loving
communication with them thathonors them, but that does not
allow them certain behaviors inyour life anymore, right? So we
reject behaviors. We don't everreject the person, because their
behaviors does not mean that'swho they are, and that's
(23:32):
something that we have to bevery clear. And when we're able
to separate the people fromtheir behaviors and start
communicating in that way wherewe are again we are rejecting
that behavior, then our languagecan align and be in alignment
(23:52):
with serving them, and also bein alignment with who we want to
be as people that we care aboutand how we want to handle that
we just don't have to allowcertain things in our lives, and
we can also be very clear aboutthat, and they may get mad, they
(24:12):
may get frustrated, and they mayget into that manipulative state
of being where it's mostly justthem trying to figure out how to
get what they want, and so angryand stuff. So people often get
angry, not because they'rereally angry, but because they
know that that's the button thatthey need to push in order to
(24:33):
get what they want. So when itcomes to loving communication,
we also have to have lovingcommunication when it comes to
ourselves as well, when it comesto how we are thinking about
ourselves, how we are talkingabout ourselves. We want to stay
in that loving place forourselves, and we want to look
at our own shame and our ownguilt. And how do we look at
(24:57):
that so that it's not dictatingin this? Kind of goes back a
little bit into being in thepresent, or back into the
present principle, which isreally looking at our shame and
our guilt and making sure thatthe people that we care about
and the people we're trying tohelp are actually able to use
that and weaponize that againstus. Right. Language matters if
(25:21):
you don't take anything elseaway from this podcast today, I
want you to take that one thing,language matters. Now the last
principle I want to talk aboutis what I call the joy
principle. And this is reallyabout making sure that we are
(25:41):
paying attention to how much joythat we have in our own lives.
Joy is something that I think isoften minimized and it's put to
the side when we are goingthrough so many rough things, if
we're going through depressionor we're going through anxiety,
we put ourselves to the side alot when other people around us
(26:04):
are struggling, and it's to me,it's actually the opposite of
what we need to be doing when weare struggling or someone else
in our life is struggling.
We have to spend more timebringing in joy and being
conscious and being mindfulabout ensuring that we are
taking care of ourselves throughthat time period when we have
(26:26):
someone else, because it's soeasy to feel like we don't
deserve joy. We don't need to beworried about ourselves right
now. We have to worry aboutsomeone else, but if we want to
be the person that they need usto be and this goes for any
situation. I'm not just talkingabout having a family member
(26:46):
with substance abuse issues. I'mtalking about in any situation
you have a sick parent, you havea sick kid, you have, you know,
something going on with anotherfriend, you are allowed to have
a multitude of emotions at anyone given time, so you can both
feel upset and sad for whateversomeone else is going through,
(27:08):
while also taking care ofyourself in the process and
bringing joy into your life,because that is going to make
you a better person for them,and I want you to remember that
it's going to make you a better,stronger person for them, and
it's going to make you feelbetter in the meantime, this is
a crucial, probably one of themore crucial principles of all
(27:32):
of them, because it all ties in.
You can't do a whole lot of theother principles as effectively
if you don't have joy in yourlife. So self care is important,
and yes, things like gettingmassages and getting
acupuncture, that is part ofself care, right? It's a great
thing, but making sure thatyou're feeling your cup, that
(27:57):
you are feeling joy like youare, that sense of like
overwhelming, like, I'm just sohappy, even if it's just for two
minutes, even if it's just even60 seconds, finding something,
turning on, Some music, anddancing your full little head
(28:20):
off. This is one of my personalfavorite things to do. Turn on
some good music, dance like acrazy woman and just be in the
moment. It's something that
Unknown (28:34):
brings me back to center, brings me peace, makes
me
Jen (28:37):
feel good, makes the world feel not so stressful, right? So
sometimes we can get just sostressed out that it just starts
spiraling. All of that anxietycan just really feed off of each
other and like it's not a goodthing. So we have to figure out
(28:59):
how to balance the anxiety. Ofour lives with also bringing in
the joy. This is also why I lookat like the Exchange Principle,
right? So whenever we have a lotof anxiety going on, we need to
bring just as much joy into ourlives. This is I cannot express
(29:23):
and articulate in words howimportant it is to be mindful
and allow yourself, giveyourself permission to be happy,
even if in other areas of yourlife you are unhappy, there
needs to be a balance, and giveyourself permission to do that,
(29:47):
to have that, to be that. Sothose are the five principles of
the unbreakable boundaries inwhich I. Really never
articulated in this podcast, inin how do we go about living a
boundaries lifestyle when wehave a loved one, substance
(30:10):
abuse issues or just in general,and keeping in mind that these
are all things that I have Ihave learned through experience.
I've been there. These are thethings that I have to do in
order to take care of myself.
And it's an ongoing journey. Andso I'm not gonna sit here and
say I'm perfect, but whensomething goes on that maybe
(30:36):
like I did something that I lookback and go, ooh. Was that in
alignment with one of these fiveprinciples? What was I missing?
Hindsight, being 2020, if Icould do it all over again, this
is the way that I would do it.
This is a reflection. Socreating unbreakable boundaries
is more about not so much taskoriented, but about a lifestyle.
(30:59):
It's about being aware. It'sabout figuring out how you see
the world and thinkingdifferently, and starting to
recognize patterns, starting topay attention to when we fall
short, and being willing to takea look at it and do something
different in the future. Becausethat's what this is about, is
(31:20):
about being willing to dosomething different, so if you
want to know more. And this iswhere, again, this is my first
podcast where I'm actuallylooking at, you know, my
nonprofit and kind of sharingabout that you can if you want
(31:42):
to learn more and understand theservices that we provide, you
can go check out my website atthe recovering family.org and on
there, you will see that all ofour services are donation based
services, which I think isamazing, so anyone can afford
it. That was a crucial piece tome. Also on there, if you are
(32:07):
someone that can and you'relike, Man, I just love what
you're doing, and you want togive a donation to help
supplement and pay for some ofthese services that other people
can't afford, there is a littledonation spot that you can make
a donation all 100% of thedonations that are received goes
directly into the services thatwe offer. So anyway, I am super
(32:35):
proud of the the work that thenonprofit and this organization
does, and I really hope that youwant to be a part of it in any
way, shape or form, whether it'sdonation, whether you're someone
that does have a family memberthat has loved ones with
substance abuse issues and youneed help, I would love for you
(32:56):
to reach out and just figure outhow to handle the situation,
Whether it's one call that youneed, if you're just like, I
just need someone to talk to, orif you're like, I'm ready to
actually dive in and do somethings differently and change my
life. I can't keep living likethis anymore, and you want to
set up a more long term kind ofsituation with us. We can
(33:21):
definitely work with you. Thegreatest thing is that all of
our services are also virtual,so we can work with people from
all over, from everywhere.
There's even a little box on mywebsite that you can literally
just schedule a call all on yourown. And again, that website is
the recoveringfamily.org so gocheck that website out and see
(33:46):
all of the cool things that wehave on there. We also do blogs.
I spend a lot of time writingblogs as well as some video
content, so you shoulddefinitely check some of that
stuff out as well. So I hopeeveryone has a great rest of
their day and until the nextpodcast, get out there and go
create some unbreakableboundaries. You.
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