March 6, 2024 • 54 mins
Have you ever witnessed a transformation that reshaped a life's trajectory? That's precisely what Jesse Hernandez has experienced, evolving from a high-achieving construction maven to a magnanimous contributor through stories and wisdom shared in his compelling book, "Becoming the Promise that you Were Intended to Be." Our conversation peels back the layers of crafting an authentic personal brand, the delicate dance of self-promotion, and the profound shifts that come from pouring into others. Jesse's insights into mentorship and community engagement are a testament to the strength found in collective wisdom.
Baring one's soul isn't for the faint of heart, and this episode doesn't shy away from the raw edges of vulnerability. We navigate the therapeutic landscapes of storytelling, especially in the context of addiction recovery and the search for self-worth. Jesse and I discuss the beauty in embracing our imperfections and the transformative power of seeing ourselves through the compassionate lens of others. It's a deep dive into the resilience that blooms from storytelling, the clarity that whispers in our intuitive moments, and the opportunities disguised in life's adversities.
Closing out this insightful exchange, we celebrate the language of inclusivity and the camaraderie that fuels professional environments. Reflecting on the parallels between the solidarity of 12-step meetings and team dynamics, we examine how embracing our humanity can enhance both personal growth and professional interactions. This heart-to-heart is a masterclass in leveraging personal narratives to inspire and connect, serving as a reminder that our individual journeys have the power to echo in the lives of others, urging them to share their own. Join us for this inspiring session that will leave you contemplating the stories you have to tell and the promise you were meant to be.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to this week's episode another throwback
with Jesse Hernandez.
In this episode we talked aboutJesse's book Becoming the
Promise that you Were Intendedto Be.
It's more than just aconversation around a book and
around a great guy social mediamogul but also talks about his
journey through communication,which, strangely and just
perfectly, becomes masteredthrough the 12-step program
(00:24):
where he learns to be vulnerableand learns to really understand
what his purpose and what hisplan in life is.
So listen to him.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
You want to talk right?
Down to us and elane us, aseverybody here can easily
understand.
Do you understand the worldthat is coming out of my mouth?
Space one again, space oneagain.
I dare you, I double dare you.
What we got here is a failureto communicate.
Speaker 1 (00:59):
Welcome to the Uncommon Communicator Podcast,
where we are here to bringenlightenment to the topic of
communication.
Help me welcome Jesse Hernandez, my guest today.
Jesse is a construction mindshifter.
He's building a community ofintentional leaders, known as
the emotional bungee jumpers.
He's a consultant and authorpodcast host, and I don't agree
(01:19):
with this aspiring social mediamogul.
Jesse is a social media mogul.
Jesse, welcome to the program.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
What's going on, james, thank you.
Thank you, yes, I am working onit.
I don't have the numbers thatjustify my mogul-ness, but in
Jesse Land I am a mogul and inthe future and the rest of the
omniverse I will be that socialmedia mogul.
Speaker 1 (01:47):
You are certainly defined as a mogul in my world.
If a mogul inspires otherpeople, then you're out there
doing that.
That's it Well did I leaveanything else out.
I mean, that's from yourLinkedIn, so it's your fault if
I left anything out.
Speaker 2 (02:02):
Yeah, no, no, I appreciate that.
So I don't know about you,James, but like crafting the
profile on any of the socials oreven a bio for like speaking
engagements and stuff, it isreally.
It's a really uncomfortablething for me to do because it
feels self-serving andbraggadocious.
(02:23):
Now, I don't mind being thepeacock and getting all the
attention when we're live, andyou got the rooster on your
shirt.
I don't mind that, but that'sdifferent than me writing about
the stuff.
So, in terms of if anything wasleft out, no, I think that
(02:47):
covers it.
There's probably stuff, but Ithink we're good.
Speaker 1 (02:51):
Well, we're going to dive in and we're going to cover
some of what you just talkedabout in one of your chapters,
specifically the chapter on I.
I believe it is when is I rightchapter 11?
We're going to dive into thatone a little bit because that
one sparked something within me.
But let's talk about we got youon again second time on the
show.
Welcome right here.
(03:13):
Jesse has written a couple ofbooks and started live streams
and all kinds of things sincethe last time we met.
Hey, it's your baby, you don'ttabulate your own deal, but I
kind of definitely dove into thebook and I've got to say this
first, a shout out to youdirectly you are responsible for
(03:35):
, I believe, any success thatthe I should be giving you
royalties on the uncommoncommunicator podcast.
We met early, early on, and youinspired me to podcast.
You know we were at this leanevent which was five bucks or
something to go to a Gemba lockand you were just even a portion
of.
You weren't even leading it andyou mentioned podcasts and I'm
(03:55):
like, hey, what's this about?
I don't think I had listened toa podcast before.
Then.
I thought, man, if Jesse can dothis, I want to do this and I
did so.
You, you inspired me to startmy own podcast and I appreciate
that and really, oh, a lot ofits growth to following the
social media logo that you are.
But you wrote a book right here.
It's the promise and it is yoursecond first book.
(04:17):
I want to explain that beforewe move on to this one.
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:23):
So the second, first book.
So I had begun writing thisbook, which is becoming the
promise you're intended to be.
I don't know, maybe two yearsago.
I was inspired by my friend,lee Crump, who wrote the forward
in the book, and as I was, sowhen I started writing it, I was
, I was in my head.
(04:44):
I was like, okay, I want thisto be like essentialism.
Like you've read the book,essentialism I don't think so.
Amazing book, great ideas inthere and the five dysfunctions
right, lindsay O'Neill and kindof the way they write their
books is a story and there'stakeaways.
And so I started writing it andthe idea was I became aware
(05:06):
that two things I became awareof.
One was I became aware of whenI transitioned from achieving to
contribution, my life gotbetter.
The other thing was when thiswas least bought, he made me
aware that my story couldinspire other people to forgive
(05:28):
themselves or to forgive familymembers, etc.
And give them hope.
So, anyways, I was writing thebook.
That's right.
About that time, jennifer Laceyand I started having the, the
live streams about five S inrelationships, and so after
those live streams and you werea part of those, a lot of people
(05:49):
were part of them, kirby, kirbycoats had asked like hey, Jess,
like I wish there was a placethat I could just have like all
the nuggets, all the greatpractices that people shared in
the chat, and I said, Okay, well, I got all the transcripts, the
transcriptions.
I'll go read them and find them.
I spent about 10 minutesreading and I said hell with
(06:09):
this, I ain't going to read allof this.
It was like eight and a halfhours of content and then I said
, wait a minute, I've got allthis transcribed.
Kim White Princess Kim was shewas my coach in publishing the
first book.
I sent her an email and said,hey, I got an idea.
This was like December twoyears ago and she said, yeah,
let's do it.
So we did, and so I had topause on this book because that
(06:32):
was the first book workedthrough producing Lean and Love,
and then, once that got out, Ipicked up this book again.
It was interesting because whenI read my original transcript, I
was like this is garbage.
This is like weak sauce.
Kindergarten tough guy, stuffright.
And when I mean by kindergartentough guy, I mean like not.
(06:56):
So this is just superficial topwater skiing crap.
And that's because, through thelive streams.
I discovered that thisvulnerability thing was a thing
and I didn't understand it atfirst, but people were like
Jesse, it's because you shareyour mistakes and you just talk
(07:19):
about anything, any mistake thatyou made, whatever I learned.
I was like, oh, and that wasvaluable for people.
No-transcript, like my mindsethad shifted such that it was
like that first draft was likethere was no vulnerability, it
was very cerebral, superintellectualized, and so I said
(07:39):
hell with that, I'm going to godeep.
And then that's what happened.
So that's why it is my second,first book.
Speaker 1 (07:47):
So the first book, then in that pause, really
helped you bring a betterproduct in this book with a
different set of eyes.
Isn't that great?
And how?
And I'm a big believer in howthings happen for a reason and
you look at that, and always tothe better if you're looking to
find the better out of it,because it's always hidden in
there somewhere.
So let's talk about the bookfirst, that structure.
(08:10):
I like talking about thestructure of your book.
It is a bunch of stories whichare fantastic, right, and
they're doing, they're servingthe purpose which you want is
these stories help impact andlead to the message.
But there's a couple of thingsthat I noted in here is every
one of your titles are questions, almost every single one of
them, and I thought that isJesse and in it which made the
(08:33):
investigator and me say where isthe question in it.
Because what I really enjoyedabout the book and it's almost
like a mystery novel is you knowif say here's a, you know
here's a chapter, start righthere that says you know, is
there a prize in the darkness?
You don't start the eachchapter with is there a prize in
the darkness and then answer it.
It's in there somewhere whichis really kind of new.
(08:56):
I don't know if you did thatpurposely, but the question is
hidden in there.
So I love that because and asyou, you know, you have master
questionator as your title andthat's something that you know,
a moniker that you have givenyourself, not me, we've all
given.
I've given that to you as well,but it's all the chapters or
questions which is really makesyou dive into.
Does that question fit me?
(09:16):
So I love the idea of it and Idid something I don't normally
do, which is I read the firstchapter and the last chapter
because I wanted to see how youcircled this around, and so this
is an interesting.
So at the end of your veryfirst chapter, you said this we
just can't keep living life theway we've been living it.
We have to let people in.
(09:37):
There are too many of us foryou and me to continue walking
alone.
Now that obviously you put thatfor a reason, tell me a little
bit more about that, thatpurpose statement that you put
in there, man, thank you.
Speaker 2 (09:51):
Thank you.
So you know the the.
The gist of that statement isand it's something that I
discovered right, and you canhear all the details throughout
the book but the gist of thestatement is for a very long
period of time, I believed I wasthe only one experiencing the
pains that I was experiencingand I thought, like I thought it
(10:18):
was unique to me because of mydeficiencies, because of my
defects.
And what I've learned over theyears is that it's absolutely
not unique to me and it's notbecause I'm my character defects
, it's because I'm human andwe're all human, right.
So, going back to thevulnerability thing, when I
(10:40):
share the stuff, the dumb stuff,the short-sighted, selfish,
embarrassing, shameful thingsthat I've done and what I've
learned from them, that helpsothers know that they are not
alone and we're none of us arealone, but we're all walking I
shouldn't say, oh, many of usare walking as if we are, and so
(11:03):
it's, it's a call out to say,hey, I got you Right.
We're people, we make mistakesand we can learn from them.
And, and you know, walking thepath in community is far more
fulfilling than it is to bewalking it independently, which
ties to like the original ideaof achievement and winning,
(11:26):
Because when I win, everybodyelse has to lose, and when I
achieve I have to do better,score higher than everybody else
around me.
So that's the isolatingexperience, whereas contributing
, sharing my gifts and talents,that is a communal experience.
Speaker 1 (11:45):
Yeah, and that's okay .
So now I'm going to jump intothe last chapter because I don't
, I don't know.
I do know you tied this alltogether and you can.
So your very last statement inthe book, because you know that
I think about.
In any message that we give,the most important thing is how
we started and the and thesecond most is how we end it,
(12:07):
and sometimes that's the mostimportant because that's what
people remember.
But this is what you said today.
I surround myself with peoplewho appreciate the goodness.
You likely have X-ray vision to.
You can see the enormous,gigantic human being that is in
front of you, hiding behind fear, hiding behind perfection and
avoiding rejection.
Because you can see this, it isyour responsibility to let them
(12:30):
know what you see, pointed out,show them, help them understand
.
You see them because we allneed to be seen.
Speaker 2 (12:40):
Did I write that Damn ?
That sounds good.
Speaker 1 (12:43):
And that's how you ended it.
You tied in that very firststatement to the end, with some
fantastic stories in the middle.
But tell me about thatstatement, because that one
really it's a challenge, butit's coming straight from your
heart.
Speaker 2 (12:58):
Yeah, man, yeah, first I got to get a.
Confess I did not do that tieon purpose.
I absolute like for real, forreal.
When I put the, put the storiesout, I just I did speech to
text and I just had a list ofstories and I shared all the set
, all the stories, blah, blah,blah.
Kim Princess Kim is the one whoarranged the sequence of the
(13:22):
stories.
The only one thing I wanted wasstory number one had to be
number one because people neededto understand the title.
The rest of it was up to her.
I just left it up to her and soI got a credit her for that.
Now, but the fact that you putit together like that's pretty
awesome, man.
(13:42):
So that last statement in theend comes from and I think a lot
of I'm not alone in.
Rather, I know I'm not alone inthis.
You know, when I think of meand kind of ties back to the bio
thing, I see all of my mistakes, all of the nefarious things
(14:06):
that I've done, selfish thingsthat I've done, all the, all the
goals that I missed, all thepeople that I let down, all the
disappointment that that Icontributed to people's lives,
and I see it like like a hull ofmirrors right with jeans.
They're magnified and amplifiedand contorted and really way
(14:27):
bigger than what they actuallyare, and that's all that I see.
And so that keeps me in thisstate of feeling less than.
But when I interact withanother human being, I'm just
like you, saying that I'vecontributed to your path as a
social media mogul.
I don't see that.
(14:49):
The only time I see it, and theonly time I can believe it, is
when I'm seeing myself throughyour eyes, right, and so when
people talk to me and share withme of how I've impacted their
life, I've given them courage,how I've given them hope, how I
pissed them off, like it doesn'tmatter when people are telling
me what they see, I fall in lovewith that version of me because
(15:13):
it is true, but it is foreignto me, because it's not the
version that I see all the time.
And and so, like I know how Ifeel when I'm around people that
reflect back to me the greaterthings that I ignore, and so
that's the idea, right, surroundmyself, if I surround myself
(15:33):
with people, because for a longtime I doubted it, I discounted
like, no, no, you don't, youjust don't know all my garbage,
right, the only reason you'resaying is because you don't know
, I finally got to a point where, it's, like you know, I'm very
selective about who I surroundmyself with, and those people
are like ballers, right, likethey contribute to the community
.
They're not just aboutthemselves.
They have accomplished great,they're very accomplished in
(15:56):
their careers.
They're honest, they're,they're good people, and because
they are, I need to believewhat they're telling me, and so
it's that kind of it's a littleweird thing, but it's what helps
me get away from operating in asense of deficit, right,
(16:18):
meaning like I'm trying to makeup for something and keeps me in
a place of contribution.
How do I continue to share mygifts and talents?
I'm not always aware of thegifts and talents, I'm not
always aware of how I impact andtouch people's lives, until
somebody tells me and they showme through their eyes of what
they see.
And so that's the point.
(16:40):
Right Is find people around youthat that they tell you things
that you don't want to believebecause they're not lying, and
that gives us freedom, right.
That gives us permission tocontinue being super awesome.
Speaker 1 (16:58):
Yeah, absolutely.
Now the book, I mean you digreally deep into some personal
stuff and what was, you know,interesting?
And we've known each other fora year and a half, a couple
years now but to reallyunderstand the back story, a
little bit of what brought youthrough to your sobriety, I mean
in.
You know, in a lot of sensethis is a book to help anybody
(17:21):
out of who's into addictions,and you're specifically talking
about substance and alcohol.
But those type of abuses fitany type of addiction and a lot
of construction folks have them.
You know there's a lot ofalcoholism, a lot of drugs and
stuff involved in any businessthat you're at, but specifically
in our trade as well, inconstruction, is workaholism.
(17:43):
I mean, there's things that webecome addictive to.
You know, I'd come from analcoholic family myself and I
never, you know, built intoalcoholism.
But do I have addictivetendencies?
Yeah, did I have over 40 bonsaitrees at one point because 39
wasn't enough right.
And then, for the most part,though, my addictions have been
(18:04):
towards, you know, work, likelast night.
I worked till 7 o'clock atnight because I wanted to get
that floor done.
You know, there's things thatbecome important to us in our
work, which is just as much ofan addiction.
So these things fit.
But in diving into your storiesthere's the reps you talk about.
Right, and I hadn't thoughtabout AA in that whole process.
(18:29):
Being getting talking aboutthese things more is something
that you're doing with peoplenow, especially through the live
streams.
You know there's, there arethings that I'm realizing like
why, why?
Who am I who have not beenemotional for most of my life,
purposely, you know, strugglingwith some things?
It's because I've never talkedabout these and you're drawing
these out in people now as well.
(18:51):
But I see that you've put thereps in because, like I can't
get through it.
You know I can't barely talkthrough it, but how therapeutic
was it to also put all of thatstuff out there for everybody in
?
Speaker 2 (19:03):
the book man.
So first I want to say this interms of addiction, people have
asked me, especially when I wasin rehab and recovered.
Like in those circles, thecommon question is like what's
your drug of choice?
Right, because everybody wantsto know.
Huh, and mine is more.
I'm addicted to more ofwhatever.
(19:24):
Most of the stories in here aretied to my addiction with
alcohol, because that's what Igot arrested for and I'm
grateful that I didn't getarrested for some of the other
things.
But I'll tell you like I'll hiton this and so hope maybe
people can can do someself-reflection.
(19:44):
Some of the symptoms of me beinggoing down the path of
addiction to whatever it is likeyou said work, marathon, run-in
, womanizing, like all of thethings is all.
The rest of my life is indisarray.
My weeds are three foot.
The weeds in the yard are threefoot higher than they ever been
.
None of the dishes are washed,none of the clothes are washed.
(20:05):
Everything's a mess.
The trucks are freaking mess,like the chaos in my life.
It looks the same regardless ofwhat I am being consumed by.
So it is absolutely.
Alcoholism is a thing, right,and there's some other stuff
that comes with alcoholism, buthaving an addictive nature and
(20:28):
over rather neglecting the otherimportant things.
For one thing is also a symptomof addiction and requires
attention.
So now, but back to the reps.
That was the question.
Right Is the therapeutic natureof getting this book out.
So when I was in South Carolina,when I started doing the speech
(20:51):
to text, it had a lot of roadtime, windshield time.
I was driving back and forth, Iwas going to Clemson with Adam
to do a thing and anyways, I wassurprised at some of the
stories.
I think the last four storiesare the ones that moved me the
most.
It drew out the most emotion.
I didn't expect it to happenand as I was like speaking the
(21:17):
stories, some of it like I criedon most of them, and when I say
cry I mean like teary-eyed, youknow, choked up a little bit.
But those four stories, at theend, even when I recorded the
audio book, you can hear myvoice cracking and me trying to
maintain composure.
I ugly cried when I recordedthem right, and it was hard
(21:40):
because I had to go back andlike figure out what the hell I
was saying, because the voicedidn't pick it up right.
And the interesting thing.
So after I did it.
I'm like, okay, why is that?
Why am I like what is going on?
Because some of that stuffhappened back when I was a kid,
yeah, and the difference was Iused to cry tears of anger, I
(22:08):
used to cry tears of pain andregret.
This time those tears were maybetears of empathy, like, because
I know what I felt back thenand that kind of feeling came up
and I also know that I havecome a long, long way from that
(22:30):
and I also know the impact thatI've been able to have in other
people's lives because of thatexperience.
And I was also excited about ohmy god, I'm putting this thing
out there into the world.
Imagine the impact it can havegoing forward.
And so the tears this time werelike, filled with all of that
(22:55):
right, they're tears of hope,they're tears of healing, tears
of understanding, and so, interms of therapy, it helped me
really, because I don't thinkbefore then that I wasn't aware
of the progress that I have madearound those issues.
And so what it helped meunderstand was like or maybe it
(23:20):
helped me turn really negative,dark times into meaningful
things that could help otherpeople.
And so if I had, I experienceda mind shift of my own in the
process.
Speaker 1 (23:34):
In the process and that's the whole key right.
It's not just you get the magicpill and you don't get some way
to get out of it.
It's that process that I'mdiscovering myself very slowly
in understanding thatvulnerability part and a lot of
that.
And we're gonna dive into alittle bit of that.
Let's jump into it.
There's a chapter.
First I wanted to talk aboutthe whispers.
Speaker 2 (23:56):
Oh, yeah, and.
Speaker 1 (23:58):
I've heard you mention that term before and I
didn't know the really the depthof the idea of the whispers,
but this says here's anotherquote from your book I was first
introduced to the whispers byOprah Jesse.
Yes, anyways, the easiest wayto describe the whispers is
intuition.
The whispers pop up randomly,sometimes when I'm running,
(24:18):
sometimes when I'm in the middleof a presentation.
They are like little datapoints.
They look like a comment or aquestion by someone else.
When I'm listening to a book,something in the content I'm
consuming may connect with anidea or a question I've been
chewing on and make the nextrightest step a little clearer.
The feeling in my gut says yes,that's the way, that's the
(24:38):
thing I need to get unstuck.
I call them the whispersbecause I really can't take full
credit for the clarity of thedirection.
It feels more like I'm beingguided into discovery.
That statement, that idea reallyconnected with me because and
I've heard you mention thatbefore this podcast is a result
(24:59):
of a whisper.
You hear something, you get anidea and somebody says what
about that?
That whole idea?
I'm not sure about the Oprahpart, but tell me more.
This seems like the whispershave been a big part of your
life?
Have they always been there, orhas this been something that
you decided to start listeningto?
Speaker 2 (25:18):
Oh man, first Oprah raised by a single mom.
When I was a kid I didn't havecontrol over the TV.
She mentioned it.
I was like, oh yeah, that's thething I'll say.
The whispers have always beenthere.
I have not always paidattention to them.
(25:42):
I know this because even earlyon, as a foreman or when I was
transitioning from installer toforeman and all of a sudden
there were deeper, greater asksof me in terms of taking
responsibility and leadership, Ifought against it.
The whispers were telling me dothis, this is your gift, go do
(26:07):
something with it.
I ignored it and continued tosay no, no, no, I'm not going to
be one of those suck asses, I'man installer.
Blah, blah, blah.
The friction that I experiencedin my life by ignoring the
whispers is one of thecontributors to my substance
abuse and to the things I did toescape from my life, which most
(26:31):
of that was self-imposedfriction.
They've always been there.
When I started deciding tolisten to the whispers, things
have become so much easier andway, way, way more fulfilling,
(26:52):
the reason I have to credit thewhispers.
Like, even when I have my 60minutes of thinking time every
day and I'm journaling,sometimes there's something that
comes out like whoa, I got towrite that down, or I was
jogging.
Just like you said, I write itdown and I can't take credit for
it.
I think that's an importantthing, because I don't know if
(27:14):
you know, but I have a prettyhealthy ego.
If I credit myself for being agenius and discovering all these
things and creating all thesethings all on my own, I know
where that road takes me.
These things, these ideas,these bits of clarity that pop
(27:34):
up, help me understand or showme like oh yes, that's connected
.
That's something I've beenthinking about.
Now I'm going to take the nextrightest step, what I mean by
that.
So example I was talking, I gotinterviewed.
(27:55):
I was interviewed on a podcastsuper awesome interview.
The line of questioning wasaround how do leaders connect
with people in the field?
I just kept answering thequestions.
It was good conversation.
Then, after that, I startedthinking well, that's
interesting, because when I wasdoing the in-person training,
(28:16):
part of that was to go out andmeet people in the field.
A lot of the folks that weregoing through the training
struggled with well, what am Isupposed to say?
What do you?
Speaker 1 (28:25):
mean.
Speaker 2 (28:26):
You're superintendent .
What do you mean?
What are you supposed to say?
Then I was talking to Sean andSean Moran.
We were on a call and he'sfamiliar with the training, the
sweat equity improvement that Itransitioned into a virtual
experience.
He's like all right, jess, howare you doing the visible
(28:47):
leadership piece, which is whereyou go talk to people?
I said, well, I don't thinkthat's not part of the
curriculum, because it's virtual, it doesn't fit.
Of course.
He gave me he's like come on,jess, you're weak.
After I got off the call withhim and, mind you, these are
things that have happened, let'ssay, a 24 month timeline of all
(29:10):
of this he hits me with thatand I'm like oh, okay, I need to
do something.
On the podcast the other daythey asked me a bunch of
questions around this.
This happened way back then.
There's something there.
I was listening to anotherpodcast and they were talking
about email courses and then,boom, it all came together.
(29:30):
Now I wasn't actively trying tofigure out what email course to
produce.
The whispers showed me what thenext rightist step was, and so
it's just that right, and italso frees me up because I'm
obsessive.
It frees me up when I'm stuckon something of like okay, I'm
(29:53):
at a point and I know I need toget the next thing, but I can't
Now I just leave.
I'm just going to leave it, putit on the shelf for a little
bit, because I know the whisperswill show me what to do with
that idea, and it may not.
It may be next week, it may benext year.
I just need to leave it there.
(30:14):
That's the whispers.
Speaker 1 (30:17):
Well, and the key is to respond to them right.
And you mentioned aboutignoring them in the past and I
think that's the whole key isknowing when to let it lay and
when you need to respond to it,because I would say I would, on
the most part, am guilty ofpassing over and or ignoring.
And then there's times wherethey're so loud that you have to
(30:39):
listen and there's enoughconnection right, and so you
have to find the right time, theright place.
But I just thought that wasthat really stuck out for me in
that section of the book,because that really connected
and then it's going to connectwith a lot of people because
they're going to go.
Oh, that's why that's why I dothat.
So I appreciate you bringing inthe whispers and kind of
sharing a little deeper talkinto that.
(31:00):
I do want to talk briefly aboutchapter five, I believe.
Now, chapter five is what areyou waiting for?
Another question, but the thingthat stuck out for me.
There's a couple of things inhere.
One is so you're preparing forpotentially being incarcerated.
So what does Jesse do?
Jesse's like I'm going to makethe best time of this.
(31:22):
What am I going to learn andget out of this I'm going to
have all this time I'm going to.
You know, you're like theShawshank Redemption.
You're going to become a lawyeror something.
Right, you got it all and youwrote this what could I learn if
I had no distractions?
So you start creating a list ofthis potential time which, for
you to sit, I got to imagine iswas, in your mind, going to be
probably a prison in itself.
(31:43):
Well, you're like, how am Igoing to make the most out of
this?
But this is the thing thatstuck out in that chapter my own
thinking can be a prism and Idon't have to wait for
incarceration to take action.
Bingo, there's so many timesthat we wait for that moment,
and this ties into your whispercomment as well, too.
(32:04):
You don't have to wait, likemost people solve problems when
the problem arises.
Yes, that's where, when I havetime, especially on my job, you
know I get some free, free brainload.
In fact, there's one particularjob we were on.
We had just I had taken overand we had a ton of problems
that got to the point where Ithen we had a really young group
of field engineers and otherassistant soups.
(32:26):
I'm like what are we going tosolve today Like we had no
problems, like what are we goingto solve today and that's what
I got from that is, instead ofwaiting for that potential
incarceration?
You know, you're saying I cando things right now.
Speaker 2 (32:40):
Yes, yeah, so you know that practice of seeing,
like changing my perspective ofa really bad situation.
I learned that from one of mysponsors in AA and he would,
because you know when, when,when I'm, when I'm in my
(33:01):
addiction and doing all thestuff, everything seems to be
falling apart.
The world's against me, likeit's just like you can't win, no
matter what.
Most of it is because of my owndecisions and my own actions,
right, and he would always tellme.
He would say what can you learnfrom this?
Right, like, I know I'm likeand I'm like, what do you mean?
(33:23):
He's like, I know it sucks, butwhat are you learning about it?
What can you learn from this?
So it was always that.
What can you learn from this?
So, anyways, this last time Iwas like really, really looking
at 10 to 15 years in prison, itwas a, it was a reality that
that could happen, and I knowthat if I get stuck in my head
(33:45):
around how horrible it's goingto be, I'm going to lose my
career, I'm going to lose mylicenses, I'm going to lose
family money, property, like ifI get.
Those are all true, but what isalso true, or what could also
be true?
I could also learn a lot.
And then I said, okay, what isthat condition that I'm going to
be in if, if I go to prison,like, well, I'm not going to be
(34:07):
distracted, right, like I'm not,I'm not going to have my damn
phone bugging the hell out of me.
Okay, so focus, if I have focustime and I have this just
enormous amount of time to dowhatever I want with what could
I do?
What I've always wanted tolearn, and I start.
I wrote down a list of a wholelike learn the right, left
(34:29):
handed.
I wouldn't do that now becauseI got a lot of things going on,
but I've always wanted to beambidextrous, right, and so what
that helped me do working onthat list because I didn't just
do it in one sitting it helpedme change my focus.
So every time, the like, thescary, negative idea crept in,
it's like, yeah, yeah, that'strue.
And but what could I learn ifI'm while I'm there and writing
(34:53):
down that list?
And this didn't happenimmediately.
So I wrote the list down, youknow, went through the whole
thing, went to got my attorneythey don't give me prison time
and I think that's actually whenit came together, when they
gave me my sentence, which was,you know, relatively like
considering what I did, I saidyou know what I don't need to
(35:17):
like?
I have this list and I think Imentioned in the book one of
those was reading Moby Dick.
I don't have to wait to be inprison to do that.
So I got Moby Dick on Audibleand I listed.
It was awesome.
I was like, wow, now Iunderstand why people make such
a big deal about the book itself.
And then it was like, well,what else on this damn list can
I do?
(35:37):
Why am I waiting?
Like I don't have to wait.
And then the realization was weall kind of create our own
prison, like the prison is inour head.
The circumstances or ourphysical environment is a whole
separate thing.
It's not as big or condemningas our own mind is, and so
(36:00):
that's the gist of that idea.
Speaker 1 (36:02):
Yeah, and that's absolutely huge.
To capture that instead ofsaying, all right, I spent 10
years in prison and now I'm, youknow, a doctor.
I'm Dr Hernandez.
You know, you didn't have towait to do that, and I think
that that connects with a lot ofpeople, because we wait for
those waypoints, right, andsometimes, when that change is
going to come, when we'resitting here, we are sitting
(36:26):
here scrolling through TikTokand looking at videos, thinking,
you know, what could I be doingto better my life?
Well, I'll do that tomorrow.
But when you're in prison, youknow every day is tomorrow.
I guess, I don't know, I'vebecome a little better saying
than that, but that's, I think,a key point in anybody's
successful journey in life,which you're helping them to
understand.
And also, you know there's somany threads in there that tie
(36:49):
to your project as well too.
You know, as a lean, you knowso many times I am the victim of
tomorrow.
You know I will do thattomorrow.
We'll be back tomorrow.
You know, last night they wereworking until you know, at 3.30,
I was told we had three to fourmore hours left and it's like,
how about tomorrow?
I'm like, no, we're going toget it done today.
(37:11):
I want my tomorrow.
Yes, so there's just thingsthat you become a victim of
tomorrow.
And it stops that.
It says what am I doing now tobring purpose?
So, man, I appreciate thatchapter.
I do want.
There's one more chapter.
I want to dive into this onehere.
Chapter 11, when is I right?
(37:31):
This one I have struggled withfor most of a lot of my career
and especially when I got intogeneral construction.
A lot of people don't know that.
You know I was in industrialconstruction mill right by trade
.
So I've worked through thetrades and you know now I'm the
evil general contractor.
You know, and people don't knowthat there's a history behind.
Everybody right that this hasnot been.
(37:54):
It's like oh, you're thecontract.
In fact, felipe said that hesays you don't post anything
about your life.
You know when you were in thetrades.
I'm like I need to change that.
But with that you come intogeneral contracting and a lot of
superintendents are I, I, I, Iright, I did this, I was.
I've worked with asuperintendent who built the
(38:14):
Ikea in town all by himself.
Oh, yeah.
Bigel, ikea, and then he alsobuilt this gigantic hotel at the
Denver International Airportand so everything that he has
done he built right.
Those are his stories.
But we go and we hear that andand you really touch on it
pretty deeply within when thishere, when is I right?
(38:36):
I do want to talk about this,so this is just a quote.
I want to first, you have toknow that these are emotionally
charged conversations.
I credit this to therepetitions, repetitions or reps
we get.
Sharing our issues openly withstrangers.
This builds a high threshold ofvulnerable, vulnerability and
real human stuff.
So, first, you know you, you'resetting up this I thing because
(38:57):
the other part is that you knowI'm I'm worried that it's going
to be self centered, you know,and how I use the word I, I
don't right, I've used we a lotwhen it is me, I've used so
because I want to avoid that.
But I think you opened up.
There's a little bit of a keyin here that you really get in
(39:19):
in talking about the delivery ofthat.
So this chapter, I think herehere's a quote from you.
He was extremely vulnerablebecause the whole thing about
this I thing talks aboutsomebody who changed your
perspective on stuff.
And in addition was this, andthis was somebody who was
presenting at an AA meeting.
He was extremely vulnerable.
(39:39):
He shared details that most ofus spend our whole life hiding.
Speaker 2 (39:44):
Yes, yes, oh, man.
So you know one thing I got tosay I did not intend to write a
book about my recovery and myexperience in, in, in addiction
and AA, 12 step programs, etcetera.
That's just the way it came out.
So just a side note.
(40:06):
So I'll talk about, like, thereps and how that connected to
this.
This speaker, you know somebodyhad asked me, or a lot of people
would ask me back when we weredoing the five S and
relationships thing is like, howare you so vulnerable?
It's amazing how vulnerable youare, your vulnerabilities and
so on.
Like, what in the world are youall talking about?
Then I got clear like, oh, youshare your, like the dumb things
(40:27):
you've done.
Like, oh, okay, that'svulnerable.
Then, yes, I do that.
And then I started askingmyself there's so many people
asking me about this.
And, yes, and, and I don't knowhow I built that Like, how did
I develop that strength to bevulnerable and share whatever?
And so I was thinking and I'mlike, oh, you know what it was.
(40:49):
It was from the years and yearsand years that I spent in 12
step meetings, because in thosemeetings you are invited to say
hi, my name's Jesse and I'm anaddict or I'm an alcoholic or
whatever, and talk about yourissue.
Whether it's good or baddoesn't matter.
For the first two years, Iwould not.
(41:11):
There was no damn way I wasgonna raise my hand.
But I saw people demonstratingthe behavior, right, like they
were doing it.
They were saying hi, my name's,whatever.
This is what I experienced, youknow, my wife, my girlfriend,
whatever, the judge, whatever,like all the stuff, and even
celebrating good things.
Until I finally did it myselfand because I was, you know, I
(41:36):
had the privilege of going tothese meetings for so many years
I got very practiced at sayinghi, my name's Jesse, I'm an
alcoholic, and this is what Idid.
Today, this is a dumb thingthat I did.
Or blah, blah, blah.
And I think it was.
I don't think I know those repsof saying hi, I'm a human being
(41:57):
and I have problems.
Or hi, I'm a human being and Ihave something to celebrate.
Build the strength for me to besuper, super vulnerable.
You know, relatively speaking,and we don't practice that, we
don't.
There's really there's very fewvenues where we can just say it
(42:19):
out loud to discover that thesky's not gonna fall down right
Like me sharing my garbage.
Oh, at first, for two years Iwouldn't, because I didn't want
to be judged.
I didn't you know, blah, blah,blah.
And then, when the first time Idid it, guess what happened?
Nothing.
I felt better.
And then I did it again andguess what happened?
(42:39):
I felt better, like, oh, it'snot that bad Now.
So there's that one thing,because I am talking about what
I personally experienced andvery few people will challenge
that or judge that, because it'smy own personal experience.
(43:00):
Now it drives me nuts whenpeople say I built that, I'd be
like you know damn way you builtthat.
And I'm sure that's not whatthey mean, but I know what I
feel when I hear them say thatright.
So I was always kind of similarto what you stated.
I'm very like I pay closeattention to me not saying I
(43:25):
when it was a we thing, but thenI went all the way over to one
side of the pendulum when it'salways we and never me.
When I heard this gentlemanspeak, it was powerful, right.
Like you know, he shared hisexperience, but he spoke from I.
He didn't say you know, whenyou're in addiction, da, da, da,
(43:48):
da, da da, or when you do likehe didn't say that he said I, my
addiction, my experience, myerrors, my shortcomings, my wins
, like it was all from an eyeperspective.
And I remember thinking like,wow, he talked about himself in
terms of I, but I wasn'tdisgusted by him, right, it
(44:11):
didn't give me license, like Ididn't disengage like I normally
do.
I was like, oh, wow, what wasthat?
And it was because of the wayhe delivered the message.
He was, it was from aperspective of ownership.
He was owning his experiences,he was owning his mistakes and
that was the difference.
(44:32):
And so it was really importantbecause it transformed the way.
Like from that point, I decided,okay, from now on, this is how
I'm going to present and Imentioned it in that story you
know, I used to follow thepractices that they right.
Whatever public speaking, likeall those classes, you know,
(44:52):
make sure you let them know,give them your credibility.
You want to give them yourcredentials before you start
speaking, because people want toknow why they should listen to
you.
I stopped that crap, those twoslides with, you know, my
credentials got deletedimmediately and I just jump into
it and start sharing myexperience around the thing,
whatever it is I'm talking about.
(45:12):
It also helped me stop likefrom that point forward, I have
not done a presentation onanything that I don't have real,
real experience doing, and whatI mean by that is like if I'm
going to be like teaching orfacilitating some learning and I
can't apply the concept or thepractice in my personal day to
(45:37):
day, I'm not going to try toteach about it because I can't
speak from my own experience.
I have to attach it to somebodyelse's article or white paper or
whatever, and if that's thecase, I have no business doing
it.
And so that's gotten me very,very comfortable with I and,
(45:59):
more importantly, it becomeseasy to say I in a
non-self-serving manner when Ionly speak about things that
I've lived and experienceddirectly.
Speaker 1 (46:11):
And nobody can take that from you right?
Nobody works sharing thatspecifically from your heart,
and that's something that Ithink really stuck out for me,
and this is important foranybody diving into public
speaking as well, too.
So this is definitely ourcommunication moment to talk
about, right, because you are,you're out there, you're a
public speaker, you'veexperienced something that
(46:33):
through Toastmasters, they callit the icebreaker.
It's the very first speech thatyou give and whenever I'm
coaching somebody, I'm like thisis going to be the easiest,
hardest speech that you evergive.
It's the easiest because allyou have to do is talk about
yourself, like we can do that.
It's hard because it's yourfirst one, but that whole
principle kind of gets lostthrough the course of these
pathways that we have, becausethen we're teaching on things
(46:55):
that we don't.
And that's now has been mycoaching thing is like what talk
about?
The things that you know?
Because then you can talkendlessly about it and people
know that if you're talkingabout something that you don't
know, then people know that.
They know right away and youknow it right.
And it's hard and it'sdifficult to get through and
it's not fun.
You probably have had theluxury of giving the same
(47:18):
message more than once.
Every time that you do that youbuild those reps and in my mind
it's getting better and I'msure for you the message is
getting better.
But if anything it's gettingeasier because you're having the
ability to meet the audience'sneeds, because you're familiar
with the topic.
That becomes kind of the wholekey to public speaking is be
(47:39):
familiar with the topic and thenyou can go up there and have
fun.
So I think that just it's soneat to see that weaved into
your book.
This whole public speaking youknow huge like tip on how to be
successful is wrapped up in justone little note on the I
portion of chapter 11.
Speaker 2 (47:57):
But I did see that.
I'll add James on.
That is if maybe for aspiringpublics, people are just kind of
getting into it.
I can remember clearly when Iwas doing presentations on stuff
that I hadn't experienced.
If somebody asked me a question, the answer I gave him was hard
, like it was weak sauce and andand I knew it.
(48:22):
And they knew it right, like oh, he's a fraud, he just read
some article and now he'stalking about it.
Yeah, but now, whatever I'mtalking about, when somebody
asked me a question I got somedeep real life experience.
Like I have swam Through theexperience.
I know what it smells like, Iknow what it feels like, I know
what it tastes like and theanswers that I can provide to
(48:45):
the questions I get are Muchmore actionable, whereas before
it stayed in the conceptualperspective and and so maybe to
the to the uncommon Communicatorcommunity, if you can't answer
a question deeply on thepresentation you've presented,
(49:06):
that's an indicator that you'vegot to live and experience the
topic that you're discussingjust a little bit more.
Speaker 1 (49:13):
Yeah, that's exactly it, and that's that is really
the key to being comfortable,being successful, being a good
speaker, and that really goes toa lot of even just general
conversation.
Right, you've all been therewith the guy where, you know,
you just know that he's justbabbling on and you know, I do
want to touch on one thing thatyou talked about as well too,
which is really when you knowthe topic and you're sharing
(49:36):
that topic there's there'ssomething that is being open
about it like one thing that youdo, and one thing I struggle
with is I sanitize myConversations, you know, and
that's something that I juststill in work.
I mean it's difficult for mebecause all of my stories in the
past were this guy, this person, this individual, this company,
(49:59):
and I've sanitized those andlooking at it through this
perspective is Am I just makingstories up, you know, to fit my
need?
And I mean these are, these arereal stories.
But I don't have and I haven'tstored those facts in my mind
that you know, on January 7th wedid this with Bill, you know,
out on the Malt House deck.
You know those are true thingsthat happen and I think that's
(50:21):
an important part of how youtell stories is you use real
names, real people, real color,you really paint that picture
and it's okay and you share thiswith me and not on this podcast
yet.
But you talked about how youkind of evolved through that as
well, too, where you thought Ididn't want to mention the
company or get them in troubleWell there.
And then you did it and did you.
(50:42):
Of course, you know you alwayspushing, pushing a little bit,
aren't you?
But did you, did you get introuble?
No, right, and those thingsbring true value and I think
that's the other component.
I know I'm working on.
That's something that I'mprocessing through.
But what I've decided thosebecause I've stuffed a lot of
emotions and feelings andeverything away for years that
that's gonna have to happen onmy new stories, because I don't.
(51:05):
I don't think I can dig thefacts out of some of these older
stories, otherwise I'm justmaking them up and then I truly
am just making this storytimeframe.
But, jesse, I've really enjoyedthis time meeting and
connecting with you again, yourway of telling stories and
especially that you put theminto a book.
Really we use, you know who youare and I think there's a lot
(51:27):
of value.
I'm gonna encourage everybodywill have a link in the show
notes on how to buy the book.
Look into it.
There's an audio version of itas well.
Well, links to your website.
But how else can tell us how?
How else can people get a holdof you, man?
So?
Speaker 2 (51:43):
obviously the website .
The other way, I am amhyperactive on LinkedIn and, and
so, in terms of like dailyhabits, I spend a good amount of
time on LinkedIn every day, andso if people want to connect,
make a comment, what like, let'sconnect there and and get a
feel for what you're reallydealing with, because if you
(52:06):
want to work with me, this iswhat you're gonna get Right, and
and so maybe I'd rather Irecommend that you get a feel
for the flavor that I bring, andyou can do that best through
interacting on LinkedIn.
Obviously, on my websitethere's links to my email
address and all the othersocials, all the other good
stuff.
But, james, you and I weretalking about this before we
(52:30):
started.
Let me know you're there,because the one thing that
drives me nuts is not like goodfeedback, I love it.
Critical feedback, I love it.
No feedback, I hate it.
It drives me nuts.
And so, if you're there, let meknow you're there, because it
really does mean a lot to me.
Speaker 1 (52:50):
Well, we'll definitely provide some
Information on how to contactyou in the show notes.
Maybe together we can tie oursocial media moguling together
for this episode, for people canlearn a little more about Jesse
.
But I'm gonna ask you this andI'm asking all my guests this
now is what do you think is theUC moment?
The uncommon communicatormoment is, says this is you know
(53:10):
, we've been talking for an hour.
What sums up?
What do people leave with thatthey could use from this
conversation today?
Speaker 2 (53:17):
Oh, man, that's a good one, I'm gonna say.
The one thing that peopleshould take away from this
conversation is the value insharing your story From your
perspective, with all the dirtydetails.
The value is it's liberatingand healing for you as an
(53:38):
individual.
It gives people hope and Givesthem permission to do more of
the same.
I mean, james, you've said itseveral times there's a lot of
things that you haven't sharedFor multiple, for many reasons,
and you're not the only one andso, in sharing our story as
courageously as as you can rightnow right, you'll get more
(54:01):
courageous or as you get thereps in but share, share, share
your perspective with all thedirty details, and it will help
you build deeper communeconnections with the person
that's directly in front of you.
Speaker 1 (54:15):
I love that.
That's a great UC moment.
Share your story with all thedirty details.
What more do we need than that?
We're gonna end with that andthat's all we got.
See you back, peace.
Welcome to this week's episode another throwback
with Jesse Hernandez.
In this episode we talked aboutJesse's book Becoming the
Promise that you Were Intendedto Be.
It's more than just aconversation around a book and
around a great guy social mediamogul but also talks about his
journey through communication,which, strangely and just
perfectly, becomes masteredthrough the 12-step program
(00:24):
where he learns to be vulnerableand learns to really understand
what his purpose and what hisplan in life is.
So listen to him.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
You want to talk right?
Down to us and elane us, aseverybody here can easily
understand.
Do you understand the worldthat is coming out of my mouth?
Space one again, space oneagain.
I dare you, I double dare you.
What we got here is a failureto communicate.
Speaker 1 (00:59):
Welcome to the Uncommon Communicator Podcast,
where we are here to bringenlightenment to the topic of
communication.
Help me welcome Jesse Hernandez, my guest today.
Jesse is a construction mindshifter.
He's building a community ofintentional leaders, known as
the emotional bungee jumpers.
He's a consultant and authorpodcast host, and I don't agree
(01:19):
with this aspiring social mediamogul.
Jesse is a social media mogul.
Jesse, welcome to the program.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
What's going on, james, thank you.
Thank you, yes, I am working onit.
I don't have the numbers thatjustify my mogul-ness, but in
Jesse Land I am a mogul and inthe future and the rest of the
omniverse I will be that socialmedia mogul.
Speaker 1 (01:47):
You are certainly defined as a mogul in my world.
If a mogul inspires otherpeople, then you're out there
doing that.
That's it Well did I leaveanything else out.
I mean, that's from yourLinkedIn, so it's your fault if
I left anything out.
Speaker 2 (02:02):
Yeah, no, no, I appreciate that.
So I don't know about you,James, but like crafting the
profile on any of the socials oreven a bio for like speaking
engagements and stuff, it isreally.
It's a really uncomfortablething for me to do because it
feels self-serving andbraggadocious.
(02:23):
Now, I don't mind being thepeacock and getting all the
attention when we're live, andyou got the rooster on your
shirt.
I don't mind that, but that'sdifferent than me writing about
the stuff.
So, in terms of if anything wasleft out, no, I think that
(02:47):
covers it.
There's probably stuff, but Ithink we're good.
Speaker 1 (02:51):
Well, we're going to dive in and we're going to cover
some of what you just talkedabout in one of your chapters,
specifically the chapter on I.
I believe it is when is I rightchapter 11?
We're going to dive into thatone a little bit because that
one sparked something within me.
But let's talk about we got youon again second time on the
show.
Welcome right here.
(03:13):
Jesse has written a couple ofbooks and started live streams
and all kinds of things sincethe last time we met.
Hey, it's your baby, you don'ttabulate your own deal, but I
kind of definitely dove into thebook and I've got to say this
first, a shout out to youdirectly you are responsible for
(03:35):
, I believe, any success thatthe I should be giving you
royalties on the uncommoncommunicator podcast.
We met early, early on, and youinspired me to podcast.
You know we were at this leanevent which was five bucks or
something to go to a Gemba lockand you were just even a portion
of.
You weren't even leading it andyou mentioned podcasts and I'm
(03:55):
like, hey, what's this about?
I don't think I had listened toa podcast before.
Then.
I thought, man, if Jesse can dothis, I want to do this and I
did so.
You, you inspired me to startmy own podcast and I appreciate
that and really, oh, a lot ofits growth to following the
social media logo that you are.
But you wrote a book right here.
It's the promise and it is yoursecond first book.
(04:17):
I want to explain that beforewe move on to this one.
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:23):
So the second, first book.
So I had begun writing thisbook, which is becoming the
promise you're intended to be.
I don't know, maybe two yearsago.
I was inspired by my friend,lee Crump, who wrote the forward
in the book, and as I was, sowhen I started writing it, I was
, I was in my head.
(04:44):
I was like, okay, I want thisto be like essentialism.
Like you've read the book,essentialism I don't think so.
Amazing book, great ideas inthere and the five dysfunctions
right, lindsay O'Neill and kindof the way they write their
books is a story and there'stakeaways.
And so I started writing it andthe idea was I became aware
(05:06):
that two things I became awareof.
One was I became aware of whenI transitioned from achieving to
contribution, my life gotbetter.
The other thing was when thiswas least bought, he made me
aware that my story couldinspire other people to forgive
(05:28):
themselves or to forgive familymembers, etc.
And give them hope.
So, anyways, I was writing thebook.
That's right.
About that time, jennifer Laceyand I started having the, the
live streams about five S inrelationships, and so after
those live streams and you werea part of those, a lot of people
(05:49):
were part of them, kirby, kirbycoats had asked like hey, Jess,
like I wish there was a placethat I could just have like all
the nuggets, all the greatpractices that people shared in
the chat, and I said, Okay, well, I got all the transcripts, the
transcriptions.
I'll go read them and find them.
I spent about 10 minutesreading and I said hell with
(06:09):
this, I ain't going to read allof this.
It was like eight and a halfhours of content and then I said
, wait a minute, I've got allthis transcribed.
Kim White Princess Kim was shewas my coach in publishing the
first book.
I sent her an email and said,hey, I got an idea.
This was like December twoyears ago and she said, yeah,
let's do it.
So we did, and so I had topause on this book because that
(06:32):
was the first book workedthrough producing Lean and Love,
and then, once that got out, Ipicked up this book again.
It was interesting because whenI read my original transcript, I
was like this is garbage.
This is like weak sauce.
Kindergarten tough guy, stuffright.
And when I mean by kindergartentough guy, I mean like not.
(06:56):
So this is just superficial topwater skiing crap.
And that's because, through thelive streams.
I discovered that thisvulnerability thing was a thing
and I didn't understand it atfirst, but people were like
Jesse, it's because you shareyour mistakes and you just talk
(07:19):
about anything, any mistake thatyou made, whatever I learned.
I was like, oh, and that wasvaluable for people.
No-transcript, like my mindsethad shifted such that it was
like that first draft was likethere was no vulnerability, it
was very cerebral, superintellectualized, and so I said
(07:39):
hell with that, I'm going to godeep.
And then that's what happened.
So that's why it is my second,first book.
Speaker 1 (07:47):
So the first book, then in that pause, really
helped you bring a betterproduct in this book with a
different set of eyes.
Isn't that great?
And how?
And I'm a big believer in howthings happen for a reason and
you look at that, and always tothe better if you're looking to
find the better out of it,because it's always hidden in
there somewhere.
So let's talk about the bookfirst, that structure.
(08:10):
I like talking about thestructure of your book.
It is a bunch of stories whichare fantastic, right, and
they're doing, they're servingthe purpose which you want is
these stories help impact andlead to the message.
But there's a couple of thingsthat I noted in here is every
one of your titles are questions, almost every single one of
them, and I thought that isJesse and in it which made the
(08:33):
investigator and me say where isthe question in it.
Because what I really enjoyedabout the book and it's almost
like a mystery novel is you knowif say here's a, you know
here's a chapter, start righthere that says you know, is
there a prize in the darkness?
You don't start the eachchapter with is there a prize in
the darkness and then answer it.
It's in there somewhere whichis really kind of new.
(08:56):
I don't know if you did thatpurposely, but the question is
hidden in there.
So I love that because and asyou, you know, you have master
questionator as your title andthat's something that you know,
a moniker that you have givenyourself, not me, we've all
given.
I've given that to you as well,but it's all the chapters or
questions which is really makesyou dive into.
Does that question fit me?
(09:16):
So I love the idea of it and Idid something I don't normally
do, which is I read the firstchapter and the last chapter
because I wanted to see how youcircled this around, and so this
is an interesting.
So at the end of your veryfirst chapter, you said this we
just can't keep living life theway we've been living it.
We have to let people in.
(09:37):
There are too many of us foryou and me to continue walking
alone.
Now that obviously you put thatfor a reason, tell me a little
bit more about that, thatpurpose statement that you put
in there, man, thank you.
Speaker 2 (09:51):
Thank you.
So you know the the.
The gist of that statement isand it's something that I
discovered right, and you canhear all the details throughout
the book but the gist of thestatement is for a very long
period of time, I believed I wasthe only one experiencing the
pains that I was experiencingand I thought, like I thought it
(10:18):
was unique to me because of mydeficiencies, because of my
defects.
And what I've learned over theyears is that it's absolutely
not unique to me and it's notbecause I'm my character defects
, it's because I'm human andwe're all human, right.
So, going back to thevulnerability thing, when I
(10:40):
share the stuff, the dumb stuff,the short-sighted, selfish,
embarrassing, shameful thingsthat I've done and what I've
learned from them, that helpsothers know that they are not
alone and we're none of us arealone, but we're all walking I
shouldn't say, oh, many of usare walking as if we are, and so
(11:03):
it's, it's a call out to say,hey, I got you Right.
We're people, we make mistakesand we can learn from them.
And, and you know, walking thepath in community is far more
fulfilling than it is to bewalking it independently, which
ties to like the original ideaof achievement and winning,
(11:26):
Because when I win, everybodyelse has to lose, and when I
achieve I have to do better,score higher than everybody else
around me.
So that's the isolatingexperience, whereas contributing
, sharing my gifts and talents,that is a communal experience.
Speaker 1 (11:45):
Yeah, and that's okay .
So now I'm going to jump intothe last chapter because I don't
, I don't know.
I do know you tied this alltogether and you can.
So your very last statement inthe book, because you know that
I think about.
In any message that we give,the most important thing is how
we started and the and thesecond most is how we end it,
(12:07):
and sometimes that's the mostimportant because that's what
people remember.
But this is what you said today.
I surround myself with peoplewho appreciate the goodness.
You likely have X-ray vision to.
You can see the enormous,gigantic human being that is in
front of you, hiding behind fear, hiding behind perfection and
avoiding rejection.
Because you can see this, it isyour responsibility to let them
(12:30):
know what you see, pointed out,show them, help them understand
.
You see them because we allneed to be seen.
Speaker 2 (12:40):
Did I write that Damn ?
That sounds good.
Speaker 1 (12:43):
And that's how you ended it.
You tied in that very firststatement to the end, with some
fantastic stories in the middle.
But tell me about thatstatement, because that one
really it's a challenge, butit's coming straight from your
heart.
Speaker 2 (12:58):
Yeah, man, yeah, first I got to get a.
Confess I did not do that tieon purpose.
I absolute like for real, forreal.
When I put the, put the storiesout, I just I did speech to
text and I just had a list ofstories and I shared all the set
, all the stories, blah, blah,blah.
Kim Princess Kim is the one whoarranged the sequence of the
(13:22):
stories.
The only one thing I wanted wasstory number one had to be
number one because people neededto understand the title.
The rest of it was up to her.
I just left it up to her and soI got a credit her for that.
Now, but the fact that you putit together like that's pretty
awesome, man.
(13:42):
So that last statement in theend comes from and I think a lot
of I'm not alone in.
Rather, I know I'm not alone inthis.
You know, when I think of meand kind of ties back to the bio
thing, I see all of my mistakes, all of the nefarious things
(14:06):
that I've done, selfish thingsthat I've done, all the, all the
goals that I missed, all thepeople that I let down, all the
disappointment that that Icontributed to people's lives,
and I see it like like a hull ofmirrors right with jeans.
They're magnified and amplifiedand contorted and really way
(14:27):
bigger than what they actuallyare, and that's all that I see.
And so that keeps me in thisstate of feeling less than.
But when I interact withanother human being, I'm just
like you, saying that I'vecontributed to your path as a
social media mogul.
I don't see that.
(14:49):
The only time I see it, and theonly time I can believe it, is
when I'm seeing myself throughyour eyes, right, and so when
people talk to me and share withme of how I've impacted their
life, I've given them courage,how I've given them hope, how I
pissed them off, like it doesn'tmatter when people are telling
me what they see, I fall in lovewith that version of me because
(15:13):
it is true, but it is foreignto me, because it's not the
version that I see all the time.
And and so, like I know how Ifeel when I'm around people that
reflect back to me the greaterthings that I ignore, and so
that's the idea, right, surroundmyself, if I surround myself
(15:33):
with people, because for a longtime I doubted it, I discounted
like, no, no, you don't, youjust don't know all my garbage,
right, the only reason you'resaying is because you don't know
, I finally got to a point where, it's, like you know, I'm very
selective about who I surroundmyself with, and those people
are like ballers, right, likethey contribute to the community
.
They're not just aboutthemselves.
They have accomplished great,they're very accomplished in
(15:56):
their careers.
They're honest, they're,they're good people, and because
they are, I need to believewhat they're telling me, and so
it's that kind of it's a littleweird thing, but it's what helps
me get away from operating in asense of deficit, right,
(16:18):
meaning like I'm trying to makeup for something and keeps me in
a place of contribution.
How do I continue to share mygifts and talents?
I'm not always aware of thegifts and talents, I'm not
always aware of how I impact andtouch people's lives, until
somebody tells me and they showme through their eyes of what
they see.
And so that's the point.
(16:40):
Right Is find people around youthat that they tell you things
that you don't want to believebecause they're not lying, and
that gives us freedom, right.
That gives us permission tocontinue being super awesome.
Speaker 1 (16:58):
Yeah, absolutely.
Now the book, I mean you digreally deep into some personal
stuff and what was, you know,interesting?
And we've known each other fora year and a half, a couple
years now but to reallyunderstand the back story, a
little bit of what brought youthrough to your sobriety, I mean
in.
You know, in a lot of sensethis is a book to help anybody
(17:21):
out of who's into addictions,and you're specifically talking
about substance and alcohol.
But those type of abuses fitany type of addiction and a lot
of construction folks have them.
You know there's a lot ofalcoholism, a lot of drugs and
stuff involved in any businessthat you're at, but specifically
in our trade as well, inconstruction, is workaholism.
(17:43):
I mean, there's things that webecome addictive to.
You know, I'd come from analcoholic family myself and I
never, you know, built intoalcoholism.
But do I have addictivetendencies?
Yeah, did I have over 40 bonsaitrees at one point because 39
wasn't enough right.
And then, for the most part,though, my addictions have been
(18:04):
towards, you know, work, likelast night.
I worked till 7 o'clock atnight because I wanted to get
that floor done.
You know, there's things thatbecome important to us in our
work, which is just as much ofan addiction.
So these things fit.
But in diving into your storiesthere's the reps you talk about.
Right, and I hadn't thoughtabout AA in that whole process.
(18:29):
Being getting talking aboutthese things more is something
that you're doing with peoplenow, especially through the live
streams.
You know there's, there arethings that I'm realizing like
why, why?
Who am I who have not beenemotional for most of my life,
purposely, you know, strugglingwith some things?
It's because I've never talkedabout these and you're drawing
these out in people now as well.
(18:51):
But I see that you've put thereps in because, like I can't
get through it.
You know I can't barely talkthrough it, but how therapeutic
was it to also put all of thatstuff out there for everybody in
?
Speaker 2 (19:03):
the book man.
So first I want to say this interms of addiction, people have
asked me, especially when I wasin rehab and recovered.
Like in those circles, thecommon question is like what's
your drug of choice?
Right, because everybody wantsto know.
Huh, and mine is more.
I'm addicted to more ofwhatever.
(19:24):
Most of the stories in here aretied to my addiction with
alcohol, because that's what Igot arrested for and I'm
grateful that I didn't getarrested for some of the other
things.
But I'll tell you like I'll hiton this and so hope maybe
people can can do someself-reflection.
(19:44):
Some of the symptoms of me beinggoing down the path of
addiction to whatever it is likeyou said work, marathon, run-in
, womanizing, like all of thethings is all.
The rest of my life is indisarray.
My weeds are three foot.
The weeds in the yard are threefoot higher than they ever been
.
None of the dishes are washed,none of the clothes are washed.
(20:05):
Everything's a mess.
The trucks are freaking mess,like the chaos in my life.
It looks the same regardless ofwhat I am being consumed by.
So it is absolutely.
Alcoholism is a thing, right,and there's some other stuff
that comes with alcoholism, buthaving an addictive nature and
(20:28):
over rather neglecting the otherimportant things.
For one thing is also a symptomof addiction and requires
attention.
So now, but back to the reps.
That was the question.
Right Is the therapeutic natureof getting this book out.
So when I was in South Carolina,when I started doing the speech
(20:51):
to text, it had a lot of roadtime, windshield time.
I was driving back and forth, Iwas going to Clemson with Adam
to do a thing and anyways, I wassurprised at some of the
stories.
I think the last four storiesare the ones that moved me the
most.
It drew out the most emotion.
I didn't expect it to happenand as I was like speaking the
(21:17):
stories, some of it like I criedon most of them, and when I say
cry I mean like teary-eyed, youknow, choked up a little bit.
But those four stories, at theend, even when I recorded the
audio book, you can hear myvoice cracking and me trying to
maintain composure.
I ugly cried when I recordedthem right, and it was hard
(21:40):
because I had to go back andlike figure out what the hell I
was saying, because the voicedidn't pick it up right.
And the interesting thing.
So after I did it.
I'm like, okay, why is that?
Why am I like what is going on?
Because some of that stuffhappened back when I was a kid,
yeah, and the difference was Iused to cry tears of anger, I
(22:08):
used to cry tears of pain andregret.
This time those tears were maybetears of empathy, like, because
I know what I felt back thenand that kind of feeling came up
and I also know that I havecome a long, long way from that
(22:30):
and I also know the impact thatI've been able to have in other
people's lives because of thatexperience.
And I was also excited about ohmy god, I'm putting this thing
out there into the world.
Imagine the impact it can havegoing forward.
And so the tears this time werelike, filled with all of that
(22:55):
right, they're tears of hope,they're tears of healing, tears
of understanding, and so, interms of therapy, it helped me
really, because I don't thinkbefore then that I wasn't aware
of the progress that I have madearound those issues.
And so what it helped meunderstand was like or maybe it
(23:20):
helped me turn really negative,dark times into meaningful
things that could help otherpeople.
And so if I had, I experienceda mind shift of my own in the
process.
Speaker 1 (23:34):
In the process and that's the whole key right.
It's not just you get the magicpill and you don't get some way
to get out of it.
It's that process that I'mdiscovering myself very slowly
in understanding thatvulnerability part and a lot of
that.
And we're gonna dive into alittle bit of that.
Let's jump into it.
There's a chapter.
First I wanted to talk aboutthe whispers.
Speaker 2 (23:56):
Oh, yeah, and.
Speaker 1 (23:58):
I've heard you mention that term before and I
didn't know the really the depthof the idea of the whispers,
but this says here's anotherquote from your book I was first
introduced to the whispers byOprah Jesse.
Yes, anyways, the easiest wayto describe the whispers is
intuition.
The whispers pop up randomly,sometimes when I'm running,
(24:18):
sometimes when I'm in the middleof a presentation.
They are like little datapoints.
They look like a comment or aquestion by someone else.
When I'm listening to a book,something in the content I'm
consuming may connect with anidea or a question I've been
chewing on and make the nextrightest step a little clearer.
The feeling in my gut says yes,that's the way, that's the
(24:38):
thing I need to get unstuck.
I call them the whispersbecause I really can't take full
credit for the clarity of thedirection.
It feels more like I'm beingguided into discovery.
That statement, that idea reallyconnected with me because and
I've heard you mention thatbefore this podcast is a result
(24:59):
of a whisper.
You hear something, you get anidea and somebody says what
about that?
That whole idea?
I'm not sure about the Oprahpart, but tell me more.
This seems like the whispershave been a big part of your
life?
Have they always been there, orhas this been something that
you decided to start listeningto?
Speaker 2 (25:18):
Oh man, first Oprah raised by a single mom.
When I was a kid I didn't havecontrol over the TV.
She mentioned it.
I was like, oh yeah, that's thething I'll say.
The whispers have always beenthere.
I have not always paidattention to them.
(25:42):
I know this because even earlyon, as a foreman or when I was
transitioning from installer toforeman and all of a sudden
there were deeper, greater asksof me in terms of taking
responsibility and leadership, Ifought against it.
The whispers were telling me dothis, this is your gift, go do
(26:07):
something with it.
I ignored it and continued tosay no, no, no, I'm not going to
be one of those suck asses, I'man installer.
Blah, blah, blah.
The friction that I experiencedin my life by ignoring the
whispers is one of thecontributors to my substance
abuse and to the things I did toescape from my life, which most
(26:31):
of that was self-imposedfriction.
They've always been there.
When I started deciding tolisten to the whispers, things
have become so much easier andway, way, way more fulfilling,
(26:52):
the reason I have to credit thewhispers.
Like, even when I have my 60minutes of thinking time every
day and I'm journaling,sometimes there's something that
comes out like whoa, I got towrite that down, or I was
jogging.
Just like you said, I write itdown and I can't take credit for
it.
I think that's an importantthing, because I don't know if
(27:14):
you know, but I have a prettyhealthy ego.
If I credit myself for being agenius and discovering all these
things and creating all thesethings all on my own, I know
where that road takes me.
These things, these ideas,these bits of clarity that pop
(27:34):
up, help me understand or showme like oh yes, that's connected
.
That's something I've beenthinking about.
Now I'm going to take the nextrightest step, what I mean by
that.
So example I was talking, I gotinterviewed.
(27:55):
I was interviewed on a podcastsuper awesome interview.
The line of questioning wasaround how do leaders connect
with people in the field?
I just kept answering thequestions.
It was good conversation.
Then, after that, I startedthinking well, that's
interesting, because when I wasdoing the in-person training,
(28:16):
part of that was to go out andmeet people in the field.
A lot of the folks that weregoing through the training
struggled with well, what am Isupposed to say?
What do you?
Speaker 1 (28:25):
mean.
Speaker 2 (28:26):
You're superintendent .
What do you mean?
What are you supposed to say?
Then I was talking to Sean andSean Moran.
We were on a call and he'sfamiliar with the training, the
sweat equity improvement that Itransitioned into a virtual
experience.
He's like all right, jess, howare you doing the visible
(28:47):
leadership piece, which is whereyou go talk to people?
I said, well, I don't thinkthat's not part of the
curriculum, because it's virtual, it doesn't fit.
Of course.
He gave me he's like come on,jess, you're weak.
After I got off the call withhim and, mind you, these are
things that have happened, let'ssay, a 24 month timeline of all
(29:10):
of this he hits me with thatand I'm like oh, okay, I need to
do something.
On the podcast the other daythey asked me a bunch of
questions around this.
This happened way back then.
There's something there.
I was listening to anotherpodcast and they were talking
about email courses and then,boom, it all came together.
(29:30):
Now I wasn't actively trying tofigure out what email course to
produce.
The whispers showed me what thenext rightist step was, and so
it's just that right, and italso frees me up because I'm
obsessive.
It frees me up when I'm stuckon something of like okay, I'm
(29:53):
at a point and I know I need toget the next thing, but I can't
Now I just leave.
I'm just going to leave it, putit on the shelf for a little
bit, because I know the whisperswill show me what to do with
that idea, and it may not.
It may be next week, it may benext year.
I just need to leave it there.
(30:14):
That's the whispers.
Speaker 1 (30:17):
Well, and the key is to respond to them right.
And you mentioned aboutignoring them in the past and I
think that's the whole key isknowing when to let it lay and
when you need to respond to it,because I would say I would, on
the most part, am guilty ofpassing over and or ignoring.
And then there's times wherethey're so loud that you have to
(30:39):
listen and there's enoughconnection right, and so you
have to find the right time, theright place.
But I just thought that wasthat really stuck out for me in
that section of the book,because that really connected
and then it's going to connectwith a lot of people because
they're going to go.
Oh, that's why that's why I dothat.
So I appreciate you bringing inthe whispers and kind of
sharing a little deeper talkinto that.
(31:00):
I do want to talk briefly aboutchapter five, I believe.
Now, chapter five is what areyou waiting for?
Another question, but the thingthat stuck out for me.
There's a couple of things inhere.
One is so you're preparing forpotentially being incarcerated.
So what does Jesse do?
Jesse's like I'm going to makethe best time of this.
(31:22):
What am I going to learn andget out of this I'm going to
have all this time I'm going to.
You know, you're like theShawshank Redemption.
You're going to become a lawyeror something.
Right, you got it all and youwrote this what could I learn if
I had no distractions?
So you start creating a list ofthis potential time which, for
you to sit, I got to imagine iswas, in your mind, going to be
probably a prison in itself.
(31:43):
Well, you're like, how am Igoing to make the most out of
this?
But this is the thing thatstuck out in that chapter my own
thinking can be a prism and Idon't have to wait for
incarceration to take action.
Bingo, there's so many timesthat we wait for that moment,
and this ties into your whispercomment as well, too.
(32:04):
You don't have to wait, likemost people solve problems when
the problem arises.
Yes, that's where, when I havetime, especially on my job, you
know I get some free, free brainload.
In fact, there's one particularjob we were on.
We had just I had taken overand we had a ton of problems
that got to the point where Ithen we had a really young group
of field engineers and otherassistant soups.
(32:26):
I'm like what are we going tosolve today Like we had no
problems, like what are we goingto solve today and that's what
I got from that is, instead ofwaiting for that potential
incarceration?
You know, you're saying I cando things right now.
Speaker 2 (32:40):
Yes, yeah, so you know that practice of seeing,
like changing my perspective ofa really bad situation.
I learned that from one of mysponsors in AA and he would,
because you know when, when,when I'm, when I'm in my
(33:01):
addiction and doing all thestuff, everything seems to be
falling apart.
The world's against me, likeit's just like you can't win, no
matter what.
Most of it is because of my owndecisions and my own actions,
right, and he would always tellme.
He would say what can you learnfrom this?
Right, like, I know I'm likeand I'm like, what do you mean?
(33:23):
He's like, I know it sucks, butwhat are you learning about it?
What can you learn from this?
So it was always that.
What can you learn from this?
So, anyways, this last time Iwas like really, really looking
at 10 to 15 years in prison, itwas a, it was a reality that
that could happen, and I knowthat if I get stuck in my head
(33:45):
around how horrible it's goingto be, I'm going to lose my
career, I'm going to lose mylicenses, I'm going to lose
family money, property, like ifI get.
Those are all true, but what isalso true, or what could also
be true?
I could also learn a lot.
And then I said, okay, what isthat condition that I'm going to
be in if, if I go to prison,like, well, I'm not going to be
(34:07):
distracted, right, like I'm not,I'm not going to have my damn
phone bugging the hell out of me.
Okay, so focus, if I have focustime and I have this just
enormous amount of time to dowhatever I want with what could
I do?
What I've always wanted tolearn, and I start.
I wrote down a list of a wholelike learn the right, left
(34:29):
handed.
I wouldn't do that now becauseI got a lot of things going on,
but I've always wanted to beambidextrous, right, and so what
that helped me do working onthat list because I didn't just
do it in one sitting it helpedme change my focus.
So every time, the like, thescary, negative idea crept in,
it's like, yeah, yeah, that'strue.
And but what could I learn ifI'm while I'm there and writing
(34:53):
down that list?
And this didn't happenimmediately.
So I wrote the list down, youknow, went through the whole
thing, went to got my attorneythey don't give me prison time
and I think that's actually whenit came together, when they
gave me my sentence, which was,you know, relatively like
considering what I did, I saidyou know what I don't need to
(35:17):
like?
I have this list and I think Imentioned in the book one of
those was reading Moby Dick.
I don't have to wait to be inprison to do that.
So I got Moby Dick on Audibleand I listed.
It was awesome.
I was like, wow, now Iunderstand why people make such
a big deal about the book itself.
And then it was like, well,what else on this damn list can
I do?
(35:37):
Why am I waiting?
Like I don't have to wait.
And then the realization was weall kind of create our own
prison, like the prison is inour head.
The circumstances or ourphysical environment is a whole
separate thing.
It's not as big or condemningas our own mind is, and so
(36:00):
that's the gist of that idea.
Speaker 1 (36:02):
Yeah, and that's absolutely huge.
To capture that instead ofsaying, all right, I spent 10
years in prison and now I'm, youknow, a doctor.
I'm Dr Hernandez.
You know, you didn't have towait to do that, and I think
that that connects with a lot ofpeople, because we wait for
those waypoints, right, andsometimes, when that change is
going to come, when we'resitting here, we are sitting
(36:26):
here scrolling through TikTokand looking at videos, thinking,
you know, what could I be doingto better my life?
Well, I'll do that tomorrow.
But when you're in prison, youknow every day is tomorrow.
I guess, I don't know, I'vebecome a little better saying
than that, but that's, I think,a key point in anybody's
successful journey in life,which you're helping them to
understand.
And also, you know there's somany threads in there that tie
(36:49):
to your project as well too.
You know, as a lean, you knowso many times I am the victim of
tomorrow.
You know I will do thattomorrow.
We'll be back tomorrow.
You know, last night they wereworking until you know, at 3.30,
I was told we had three to fourmore hours left and it's like,
how about tomorrow?
I'm like, no, we're going toget it done today.
(37:11):
I want my tomorrow.
Yes, so there's just thingsthat you become a victim of
tomorrow.
And it stops that.
It says what am I doing now tobring purpose?
So, man, I appreciate thatchapter.
I do want.
There's one more chapter.
I want to dive into this onehere.
Chapter 11, when is I right?
(37:31):
This one I have struggled withfor most of a lot of my career
and especially when I got intogeneral construction.
A lot of people don't know that.
You know I was in industrialconstruction mill right by trade
.
So I've worked through thetrades and you know now I'm the
evil general contractor.
You know, and people don't knowthat there's a history behind.
Everybody right that this hasnot been.
(37:54):
It's like oh, you're thecontract.
In fact, felipe said that hesays you don't post anything
about your life.
You know when you were in thetrades.
I'm like I need to change that.
But with that you come intogeneral contracting and a lot of
superintendents are I, I, I, Iright, I did this, I was.
I've worked with asuperintendent who built the
(38:14):
Ikea in town all by himself.
Oh, yeah.
Bigel, ikea, and then he alsobuilt this gigantic hotel at the
Denver International Airportand so everything that he has
done he built right.
Those are his stories.
But we go and we hear that andand you really touch on it
pretty deeply within when thishere, when is I right?
(38:36):
I do want to talk about this,so this is just a quote.
I want to first, you have toknow that these are emotionally
charged conversations.
I credit this to therepetitions, repetitions or reps
we get.
Sharing our issues openly withstrangers.
This builds a high threshold ofvulnerable, vulnerability and
real human stuff.
So, first, you know you, you'resetting up this I thing because
(38:57):
the other part is that you knowI'm I'm worried that it's going
to be self centered, you know,and how I use the word I, I
don't right, I've used we a lotwhen it is me, I've used so
because I want to avoid that.
But I think you opened up.
There's a little bit of a keyin here that you really get in
(39:19):
in talking about the delivery ofthat.
So this chapter, I think herehere's a quote from you.
He was extremely vulnerablebecause the whole thing about
this I thing talks aboutsomebody who changed your
perspective on stuff.
And in addition was this, andthis was somebody who was
presenting at an AA meeting.
He was extremely vulnerable.
(39:39):
He shared details that most ofus spend our whole life hiding.
Speaker 2 (39:44):
Yes, yes, oh, man.
So you know one thing I got tosay I did not intend to write a
book about my recovery and myexperience in, in, in addiction
and AA, 12 step programs, etcetera.
That's just the way it came out.
So just a side note.
(40:06):
So I'll talk about, like, thereps and how that connected to
this.
This speaker, you know somebodyhad asked me, or a lot of people
would ask me back when we weredoing the five S and
relationships thing is like, howare you so vulnerable?
It's amazing how vulnerable youare, your vulnerabilities and
so on.
Like, what in the world are youall talking about?
Then I got clear like, oh, youshare your, like the dumb things
(40:27):
you've done.
Like, oh, okay, that'svulnerable.
Then, yes, I do that.
And then I started askingmyself there's so many people
asking me about this.
And, yes, and, and I don't knowhow I built that Like, how did
I develop that strength to bevulnerable and share whatever?
And so I was thinking and I'mlike, oh, you know what it was.
(40:49):
It was from the years and yearsand years that I spent in 12
step meetings, because in thosemeetings you are invited to say
hi, my name's Jesse and I'm anaddict or I'm an alcoholic or
whatever, and talk about yourissue.
Whether it's good or baddoesn't matter.
For the first two years, Iwould not.
(41:11):
There was no damn way I wasgonna raise my hand.
But I saw people demonstratingthe behavior, right, like they
were doing it.
They were saying hi, my name's,whatever.
This is what I experienced, youknow, my wife, my girlfriend,
whatever, the judge, whatever,like all the stuff, and even
celebrating good things.
Until I finally did it myselfand because I was, you know, I
(41:36):
had the privilege of going tothese meetings for so many years
I got very practiced at sayinghi, my name's Jesse, I'm an
alcoholic, and this is what Idid.
Today, this is a dumb thingthat I did.
Or blah, blah, blah.
And I think it was.
I don't think I know those repsof saying hi, I'm a human being
(41:57):
and I have problems.
Or hi, I'm a human being and Ihave something to celebrate.
Build the strength for me to besuper, super vulnerable.
You know, relatively speaking,and we don't practice that, we
don't.
There's really there's very fewvenues where we can just say it
(42:19):
out loud to discover that thesky's not gonna fall down right
Like me sharing my garbage.
Oh, at first, for two years Iwouldn't, because I didn't want
to be judged.
I didn't you know, blah, blah,blah.
And then, when the first time Idid it, guess what happened?
Nothing.
I felt better.
And then I did it again andguess what happened?
(42:39):
I felt better, like, oh, it'snot that bad Now.
So there's that one thing,because I am talking about what
I personally experienced andvery few people will challenge
that or judge that, because it'smy own personal experience.
(43:00):
Now it drives me nuts whenpeople say I built that, I'd be
like you know damn way you builtthat.
And I'm sure that's not whatthey mean, but I know what I
feel when I hear them say thatright.
So I was always kind of similarto what you stated.
I'm very like I pay closeattention to me not saying I
(43:25):
when it was a we thing, but thenI went all the way over to one
side of the pendulum when it'salways we and never me.
When I heard this gentlemanspeak, it was powerful, right.
Like you know, he shared hisexperience, but he spoke from I.
He didn't say you know, whenyou're in addiction, da, da, da,
(43:48):
da, da da, or when you do likehe didn't say that he said I, my
addiction, my experience, myerrors, my shortcomings, my wins
, like it was all from an eyeperspective.
And I remember thinking like,wow, he talked about himself in
terms of I, but I wasn'tdisgusted by him, right, it
(44:11):
didn't give me license, like Ididn't disengage like I normally
do.
I was like, oh, wow, what wasthat?
And it was because of the wayhe delivered the message.
He was, it was from aperspective of ownership.
He was owning his experiences,he was owning his mistakes and
that was the difference.
(44:32):
And so it was really importantbecause it transformed the way.
Like from that point, I decided,okay, from now on, this is how
I'm going to present and Imentioned it in that story you
know, I used to follow thepractices that they right.
Whatever public speaking, likeall those classes, you know,
(44:52):
make sure you let them know,give them your credibility.
You want to give them yourcredentials before you start
speaking, because people want toknow why they should listen to
you.
I stopped that crap, those twoslides with, you know, my
credentials got deletedimmediately and I just jump into
it and start sharing myexperience around the thing,
whatever it is I'm talking about.
(45:12):
It also helped me stop likefrom that point forward, I have
not done a presentation onanything that I don't have real,
real experience doing, and whatI mean by that is like if I'm
going to be like teaching orfacilitating some learning and I
can't apply the concept or thepractice in my personal day to
(45:37):
day, I'm not going to try toteach about it because I can't
speak from my own experience.
I have to attach it to somebodyelse's article or white paper or
whatever, and if that's thecase, I have no business doing
it.
And so that's gotten me very,very comfortable with I and,
(45:59):
more importantly, it becomeseasy to say I in a
non-self-serving manner when Ionly speak about things that
I've lived and experienceddirectly.
Speaker 1 (46:11):
And nobody can take that from you right?
Nobody works sharing thatspecifically from your heart,
and that's something that Ithink really stuck out for me,
and this is important foranybody diving into public
speaking as well, too.
So this is definitely ourcommunication moment to talk
about, right, because you are,you're out there, you're a
public speaker, you'veexperienced something that
(46:33):
through Toastmasters, they callit the icebreaker.
It's the very first speech thatyou give and whenever I'm
coaching somebody, I'm like thisis going to be the easiest,
hardest speech that you evergive.
It's the easiest because allyou have to do is talk about
yourself, like we can do that.
It's hard because it's yourfirst one, but that whole
principle kind of gets lostthrough the course of these
pathways that we have, becausethen we're teaching on things
(46:55):
that we don't.
And that's now has been mycoaching thing is like what talk
about?
The things that you know?
Because then you can talkendlessly about it and people
know that if you're talkingabout something that you don't
know, then people know that.
They know right away and youknow it right.
And it's hard and it'sdifficult to get through and
it's not fun.
You probably have had theluxury of giving the same
(47:18):
message more than once.
Every time that you do that youbuild those reps and in my mind
it's getting better and I'msure for you the message is
getting better.
But if anything it's gettingeasier because you're having the
ability to meet the audience'sneeds, because you're familiar
with the topic.
That becomes kind of the wholekey to public speaking is be
(47:39):
familiar with the topic and thenyou can go up there and have
fun.
So I think that just it's soneat to see that weaved into
your book.
This whole public speaking youknow huge like tip on how to be
successful is wrapped up in justone little note on the I
portion of chapter 11.
Speaker 2 (47:57):
But I did see that.
I'll add James on.
That is if maybe for aspiringpublics, people are just kind of
getting into it.
I can remember clearly when Iwas doing presentations on stuff
that I hadn't experienced.
If somebody asked me a question, the answer I gave him was hard
, like it was weak sauce and andand I knew it.
(48:22):
And they knew it right, like oh, he's a fraud, he just read
some article and now he'stalking about it.
Yeah, but now, whatever I'mtalking about, when somebody
asked me a question I got somedeep real life experience.
Like I have swam Through theexperience.
I know what it smells like, Iknow what it feels like, I know
what it tastes like and theanswers that I can provide to
(48:45):
the questions I get are Muchmore actionable, whereas before
it stayed in the conceptualperspective and and so maybe to
the to the uncommon Communicatorcommunity, if you can't answer
a question deeply on thepresentation you've presented,
(49:06):
that's an indicator that you'vegot to live and experience the
topic that you're discussingjust a little bit more.
Speaker 1 (49:13):
Yeah, that's exactly it, and that's that is really
the key to being comfortable,being successful, being a good
speaker, and that really goes toa lot of even just general
conversation.
Right, you've all been therewith the guy where, you know,
you just know that he's justbabbling on and you know, I do
want to touch on one thing thatyou talked about as well too,
which is really when you knowthe topic and you're sharing
(49:36):
that topic there's there'ssomething that is being open
about it like one thing that youdo, and one thing I struggle
with is I sanitize myConversations, you know, and
that's something that I juststill in work.
I mean it's difficult for mebecause all of my stories in the
past were this guy, this person, this individual, this company,
(49:59):
and I've sanitized those andlooking at it through this
perspective is Am I just makingstories up, you know, to fit my
need?
And I mean these are, these arereal stories.
But I don't have and I haven'tstored those facts in my mind
that you know, on January 7th wedid this with Bill, you know,
out on the Malt House deck.
You know those are true thingsthat happen and I think that's
(50:21):
an important part of how youtell stories is you use real
names, real people, real color,you really paint that picture
and it's okay and you share thiswith me and not on this podcast
yet.
But you talked about how youkind of evolved through that as
well, too, where you thought Ididn't want to mention the
company or get them in troubleWell there.
And then you did it and did you.
(50:42):
Of course, you know you alwayspushing, pushing a little bit,
aren't you?
But did you, did you get introuble?
No, right, and those thingsbring true value and I think
that's the other component.
I know I'm working on.
That's something that I'mprocessing through.
But what I've decided thosebecause I've stuffed a lot of
emotions and feelings andeverything away for years that
that's gonna have to happen onmy new stories, because I don't.
(51:05):
I don't think I can dig thefacts out of some of these older
stories, otherwise I'm justmaking them up and then I truly
am just making this storytimeframe.
But, jesse, I've really enjoyedthis time meeting and
connecting with you again, yourway of telling stories and
especially that you put theminto a book.
Really we use, you know who youare and I think there's a lot
(51:27):
of value.
I'm gonna encourage everybodywill have a link in the show
notes on how to buy the book.
Look into it.
There's an audio version of itas well.
Well, links to your website.
But how else can tell us how?
How else can people get a holdof you, man?
So?
Speaker 2 (51:43):
obviously the website .
The other way, I am amhyperactive on LinkedIn and, and
so, in terms of like dailyhabits, I spend a good amount of
time on LinkedIn every day, andso if people want to connect,
make a comment, what like, let'sconnect there and and get a
feel for what you're reallydealing with, because if you
(52:06):
want to work with me, this iswhat you're gonna get Right, and
and so maybe I'd rather Irecommend that you get a feel
for the flavor that I bring, andyou can do that best through
interacting on LinkedIn.
Obviously, on my websitethere's links to my email
address and all the othersocials, all the other good
stuff.
But, james, you and I weretalking about this before we
(52:30):
started.
Let me know you're there,because the one thing that
drives me nuts is not like goodfeedback, I love it.
Critical feedback, I love it.
No feedback, I hate it.
It drives me nuts.
And so, if you're there, let meknow you're there, because it
really does mean a lot to me.
Speaker 1 (52:50):
Well, we'll definitely provide some
Information on how to contactyou in the show notes.
Maybe together we can tie oursocial media moguling together
for this episode, for people canlearn a little more about Jesse
.
But I'm gonna ask you this andI'm asking all my guests this
now is what do you think is theUC moment?
The uncommon communicatormoment is, says this is you know
(53:10):
, we've been talking for an hour.
What sums up?
What do people leave with thatthey could use from this
conversation today?
Speaker 2 (53:17):
Oh, man, that's a good one, I'm gonna say.
The one thing that peopleshould take away from this
conversation is the value insharing your story From your
perspective, with all the dirtydetails.
The value is it's liberatingand healing for you as an
(53:38):
individual.
It gives people hope and Givesthem permission to do more of
the same.
I mean, james, you've said itseveral times there's a lot of
things that you haven't sharedFor multiple, for many reasons,
and you're not the only one andso, in sharing our story as
courageously as as you can rightnow right, you'll get more
(54:01):
courageous or as you get thereps in but share, share, share
your perspective with all thedirty details, and it will help
you build deeper communeconnections with the person
that's directly in front of you.
Speaker 1 (54:15):
I love that.
That's a great UC moment.
Share your story with all thedirty details.
What more do we need than that?
We're gonna end with that andthat's all we got.
See you back, peace.
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