August 26, 2024 • 24 mins
Ever wondered what it really means to be labeled as gifted? On this episode of "The Unscripted Mind," we guarantee you'll gain a deeper understanding of the myths and realities behind giftedness. From exceptional talents in areas like art and mathematics to the struggles of sensory overload and perfectionism, we dissect the complexities and unique challenges gifted individuals face. Traditional educational settings often fall short, leaving these brilliant minds grappling with intense curiosity, overthinking, and sleepless nights. We'll highlight how boredom and isolation can worsen these issues and stress the necessity of tailored support.
But there's more to the story. Discover the fascinating world of gifted individuals' unique intensities, like imaginational and psychomotor intensity, often mistaken for ADHD. Hear about Chuck, a kindergartner with a knack for weaving elaborate tales, and understand the difficulties these kids face in middle school. From perfectionism to the challenge of choosing a career due to multi-potentiality, we discuss it all. We also explore strategies to help highly empathetic and altruistic individuals manage their intense feelings, offering practical advice for parents, educators, and gifted individuals themselves. Join us for an insightful episode filled with valuable takeaways and expert perspectives.
But there's more to the story. Discover the fascinating world of gifted individuals' unique intensities, like imaginational and psychomotor intensity, often mistaken for ADHD. Hear about Chuck, a kindergartner with a knack for weaving elaborate tales, and understand the difficulties these kids face in middle school. From perfectionism to the challenge of choosing a career due to multi-potentiality, we discuss it all. We also explore strategies to help highly empathetic and altruistic individuals manage their intense feelings, offering practical advice for parents, educators, and gifted individuals themselves. Join us for an insightful episode filled with valuable takeaways and expert perspectives.
The goal of The UnScripted Mind Podcast is to give you fresh perspectives, practical insights and tools you can use to give you more choices, self-awareness and control of your feelings, reactions and behaviors.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Jim Cunningham (00:00):
Are you the type of person that overthinks a
simple text message?
Maybe you can see the side ofevery problem, but then not know
where you stand on that veryproblem.
Do you take tags out of allyour clothes or wear your socks
inside out?
Do you ever feel out of syncwith those around you?
Well, today we're discussingthe myths and the mysteries of
(00:21):
giftedness, because being calledgifted isn't always the present
people think it is.
We're going to dive into theblessings and the cursings of
the gifted label, from the wildmisconceptions people have to
the things that most peoplenever knew, like how these
people can be both Einsteins onone hand and world-class
warriors at the same time.
(00:42):
It's not all smooth sailing inthe land of the gifted.
No, we're talking about sensoryoverloads, perfectionism and
why gifted people, not just kids, might be the best
procrastinators you've ever met.
All on this episode of theUnscripted Mind.
Welcome to the Unscripted Mind,where our goal is to give you
(01:05):
fresh perspectives, practicalinsights and tools you can use
to give you more choices,increase your awareness and have
better control of your feelings, reactions and behaviors.
My name is Jim Cunningham andI'm a licensed professional
counselor, and today we'retalking about giftedness, and
that's kind of a vague term.
So what do I mean by that?
Well, giftedness is whensomeone has a natural talent or
(01:27):
ability that stands out, whetherit's in art, music, math,
reading, leadership and a lot ofdifferent areas.
But they tend to be in the 95thto 98th percentile in at least
one category or skill.
That means that only 5% or lesspeople are as advanced as they
are in that one particular area.
So it's like having asupercharged brain that picks up
(01:50):
on things faster, asks deeperquestions and thinks very
creatively.
It's not just about gettinggood grades.
Gifted people might excel inanything from playing an
instrument to solving complexproblems.
People usually can spot thisidea of giftedness or giftedness
in their kids early on,noticing that they might be
ahead of their peers in a lot ofareas.
(02:12):
So, for example, I see someclients who started reading
chapter books when they were inkindergarten.
But see, it's not all smoothsailing and being gifted can
also come with the challengeslike feeling different or
setting really high standardsfor themselves.
So while giftedness can beamazing and that's what most
people think it is just beingsmart and very cool it sometimes
(02:34):
needs a little extra support tohelp navigate the ups and downs
.
See, most people get the labelof being gifted and nobody ever
tells them that.
By the way, there's somedownsides to this and life is
going to be a little bit of adifferent life experience for
you than most other people.
So being smart or highlyintelligent in one area or very
(02:55):
talented in one area is anotherway of saying.
That comes with its own set ofchallenges.
So, when you look across thenation, approximately 18 to 25%
of our gifted students are highschool dropouts nationwide, and
that's from a variety ofdifferent studies.
This statistic highlights thechallenges that gifted kids face
in traditional educationsettings, which might not always
(03:16):
meet their unique needs.
Now, when I say intense desireto learn things, I don't mean
school things.
I mean things that they areinterested in.
They're really good at doing alot of self-study, spending
hours on YouTube, watchingvideos, being on Pinterest,
googling or searching things.
So this intense desire to learnthings is very cool, but it
(03:37):
also gets them into a lot oftrouble because they will what
if themselves?
To death, what if this, what ifthat which leads to a ton of
anxiety and a lot of the kidswho do this.
Unlike most kids, they have thesecond and third order way of
thinking.
For example, when 9-11 happenedand planes flew into buildings,
most kids said, well, that'stragic.
(03:59):
People who have second andthird order ways of thinking and
go down the rabbit hole thinkwell, we have planes here too
and we have buildings here too,it could happen here.
So that leads into a wholedifferent level of concern,
anxiety just because of moreawareness, and again, it's that
way of thinking that can kind ofget them into trouble.
They also need to know whythings need to make sense, which
(04:22):
, if you have a kid that hasthis, they're going to ask you a
lot of questions and they'llwant you to explain every rule
and all of that.
If things don't make sense,it's really hard for them to get
on board with that, and I seethis in a lot of my high school
clients as well.
A lot of the things they feellike they're being taught aren't
preparing them for adult life.
(04:42):
So they don't think it cares,it doesn't matter, and they plus
they also think they might havea better way of doing things.
The other thing that this lookslike is not being able to turn
the brain off to go to sleep atnight.
So there's a lot of the brainis kind of always going.
It's an amazing machine when ithas something to do, and what I
(05:03):
have found is the biggestAchilles heel for a lot of these
overthinkers and big thinkersis boredom, because the brain
isn't going to stop when itdoesn't have anything to do.
Instead, it just starts makingup things, and usually bad
things, not the good things andso that leads to also very dark
places.
So, for example, during COVID,I saw a lot of very intelligent
(05:26):
people, adults and children whowere all of a sudden having
panic attacks and worrying aboutthings, and they're like I
think I'm going crazy.
I've never felt this way beforeand when their brain didn't
have anything to do, being stuckat home or in isolation, it
leads to very bad things, andI've had a lot of these folks
tell me I hate being alone withmy thoughts for too long, which
(05:48):
is a problem that most of usdon't relate to too much.
So this analytical thinking andall these curiosities also
leads kids to ask what you mightthink are odd questions, very
deep questions, though.
Things like why isn't theremouse-flavored cat food?
Or if you choke a Smurf, whatcolor does it turn?
Why do they call it lipstick ifyou can still move your lips
(06:12):
and one from a client said ifyou were in a coma for 10 years,
would you live longer?
Now, these are great questions,imponderable questions in a lot
of ways.
So that's a good example ofsome of the ways that they think
a little bit differently thanmost of us do.
A second intensity is anemotional intensity and I've had
a lot of clients who tell me Idon't know where my emotions end
(06:35):
and yours begin.
They can be overwhelmed by alot of big emotions.
Again, we're kind of goingthrough life on steroids.
So if I'm at a 10 and you're ata six, things are going to
sound a lot different to me.
If mom and dad are talking moresternly to me or someone else
is, it might feel like yellingNot really the case, but it
feels that way.
(06:55):
So a lot of these folks are veryuncomfortable with big emotions
, crying anger, and so they wantto make sure that everybody is
good.
What does that end up lookinglike and why does it cause
problems for them?
Well, they start trying tomanage everybody's emotions, to
make sure everybody is good, toplacate, or sometimes they just
want to be out of the situation.
(07:15):
The problem is that curiositywe talked about in the
intellectual part wants to stickaround and make sure it's
informed in what's going on,which again creates more
problems because now they'reexposing themselves to all this
emotional overwhelm.
So this is one of the otherchallenges.
If you've got friends orchildren who fit this category
(07:36):
and this criteria is that youhave to be careful and they have
to be careful what informationthey feed into these brains,
because it's going to create alot of emotional worry and
anxiety that they hadn'tanticipated.
So one of the challenges isthat these folks come across as
very mature, gifted kids.
(07:56):
You can have great adultconversations with them.
The problem is emotionally theymay not be at the same level as
they are intellectually.
So intellectually they canapprehend and comprehend what
you're saying.
Emotionally it could becompletely overwhelming for them
.
So I tell a lot of folks it'sgreat to have these
(08:23):
conversations, but you have tobe careful and you have to
titrate the dose a little bit.
So, for example, talking toyour kids about, say, a late
payment on a credit card, I'veseen some kids who will go way
down the rabbit hole with that,thinking oh my gosh, we're going
to lose the house, becausethat's the way they think about
things.
Second and third order andthey'll take it to the nth
degree.
So sometimes it's better justto discriminate on what
information you share.
Now, understanding that theirintense curiosity also leads
(08:44):
them to overhear a lot ofconversations.
So you have to be particularlycareful sometimes if you're
discussing something sensitive,so they don't get kind of sucked
into that.
So those are the first twointellectual, emotional.
So they don't get kind ofsucked into that.
So those are the first twointellectual, emotional.
The third one is a sensoryintensity.
So that's some or all of thefive senses.
What does that exactly looklike?
Well, it looks like taking tagsout of clothes.
(09:05):
It looks like wearing socksinside out.
It looks like aversion tocertain sounds, certain food
textures, certain clothingtextures.
It also looks like an affinityfor certain soft things.
So I will see a lot of kids whowould wear the exact same
hoodie every day or when theycame home from school, put on
their pajamas right after school.
They can also have very strongsenses of smell, they notice all
(09:29):
kinds of sounds, and so again,it's kind of like going through
life on steroids and they justagain feel more because they
sense more.
I've had to stop sessions inthe middle of a counseling
session because I've had torearrange books on my bookcase
because they weren't properlyaligned and it was just too
distracting.
I've removed ticking clocksfrom my office because it annoys
(09:50):
way too many people.
The sound of somebody chewingcould drive these folks crazy.
When they turn up the volume onthe television it has to be
multiples of two or multiples offive, things that most of us
don't really notice or think of.
They are just hyper in tunewith that and that can again
lead to kind of overwhelm.
So when you think of putting akid in a school environment and
(10:10):
if you've ever been to anelementary school recently, or
many classrooms, every ounce ofthe wall is covered, wall to
wall.
It's very overstimulating.
There's a lot of noise, theteacher's going, other people
are talking, so there's a lotgoing on.
So this overwhelm can causethese folks to have to come home
, maybe in the afternoon andthey just need time to
decompress, to take some timeaway from a lot of that
(10:33):
overwhelming and overstimulation.
So the fourth one is animaginational intensity that
looks like getting lost infantasy novels and stories, open
world games like Minecraft,very common for a lot of these
folks to have imaginary friendsas pets.
I knew one kid who hadimaginary friends with imaginary
pets.
So very creative minds, veryvisually in-depth way of
(10:57):
thinking about things.
When I worked at the school, Isaw a kindergartner one day and
he went by the name of Chuck andhe was telling me about how he
had broken his arm when he hadbeen skiing in the past and all
the details that went along withthat, very specific details.
Well, when I talked to his momand said hey, by the way, I met
Chuck today and she said, well,who's Chuck?
(11:18):
And talking to his teacher, wefound out that he goes by Chuck,
charles or Charlie, dependingon the day, depending on what he
felt like, and he had neverbroken a bone in his body.
Now, he wasn't there just tolie to me.
He was there because he hadthis great, amazing story and
this imagination and this worldthat he had built and he was
just sharing it.
So it's really amazing, it'svery cool, it's very creative,
(11:41):
it's much more than most of usare used to.
And so, getting lost in thoseworlds one of the things that
they tend to hate too is theylike fantasy novels that have a
series, so a series of 10 books,and that way the story can go
on and on, and I've had a lot ofthem tell me that they hate
when those stories end or whenthose series end, because then
they'll make up alternateendings.
(12:01):
They'll put themselves in thealternate ending.
So there's a lot of very coolthings that go along with that.
But you have to kind ofunderstand what you're dealing
with, otherwise it can be veryconfusing.
And the last intensity is apsychomotor intensity and that
means a lot of wiggling, toetapping, shaking.
I think it's just a function ofthe brain and how it's always
(12:22):
moving and always going.
These tend to be the mostmisdiagnosed group for ADHD,
because it looks similar in alot of ways, in the sense that
they daydream a lot.
They don't pay attention, theyget bored.
If it's a class in school, forexample, that they have are very
interested in, they've done alot of self-study and a lot of
the research would suggest theyknow 50% of the material before
(12:44):
the school year starts.
So you put them in thatclassroom and they get bored.
Additionally, they might hearsomething that's of interest to
them.
So they go down the rabbit holeto think about this new concept
that they've heard.
20 minutes later they come outof the rabbit hole and they have
missed a lot of material.
It also leads them to askquestions that have nothing to
(13:05):
do with the conversation.
That's interesting because Ihad a hard time understanding
that with some people, becauseyou would be talking and all of
a sudden this question comes outof nowhere and then you realize
20 minutes ago that had come upin the conversation.
That person had gone down therabbit hole.
They came back and now they'restill thinking about that and
(13:25):
everybody else had moved on.
So in elementary school thingsgo pretty well for the gifted
kids in my experience.
Right, they get along withtheir peers, they play
Everybody's good.
The problem starts to come, andwhere they start diverging from
their peers is in middle school, and that's where you see a lot
of these kids say, yeah, I missmy friends.
(13:47):
But honestly they feel kind ofimmature and so that can be
frustrating for them and for alot of these kids they don't
really find their own tribesuntil they get into high school,
depending on the size of theschool and people that they can
connect with.
And even a lot of these folkswill have to find several groups
of people to kind of meet allof their needs One group to have
(14:07):
the intellectual conversationswith one group to just be kind
of have fun with maybe anathletic group, and so you find
that they kind of bounce aroundfrom those groups quite a bit.
They also have this otherproblem called
multi-potentiality.
Most of them are very smart,very creative, and so they can
do a lot of things really well.
(14:28):
The problem with that is whenit comes time to decide on a
career, how do they pick?
I can do so many things reallywell, how do I choose one?
The other challenge that I seetoo is that their interests
change rather frequently.
So I know somebody who in highschool went through four
different sports and honestlythey probably could have had
(14:48):
scholarships in two of the four.
But they get to a certain levelof mastery of that pretty
quickly and then they kind ofget bored with it and they want
to go try something else.
So that's hard as a parent or afriend to keep up with.
These kinds of changinginterests and desires can also
be expensive when you go downthat road as well.
So I say all this to say isthat understanding this and as
(15:14):
many parents don't understandthis and they get frustrated
with their kids because theyseem argumentative and they ask
a lot of questions and they needto know why, and that can be
very frustrating.
Another problem a lot of thesefolks have and this tends maybe
to be their biggest problem ishow critical they are of
themselves.
They tend to be perfectionisticand they tend to be big
(15:35):
procrastinators, and thosethings go hand in hand.
They will beat themselvesperfectionistic and they tend to
be big procrastinators andthose things go hand in hand.
They will beat themselves uplike nobody's business and I
often have to tell parents youdon't have to beat them up too
much and you're probably notgoing to say anything to them
they haven't said to themselves.
10 times worse procrastinationand perfectionism.
I've had a lot of people tellme that if I study for a test
(15:58):
and get a B, that's no good.
If I don't study and get a B,I'm fine with it.
The same holds true forstarting a big project at the
last moment, and it's kind ofthe way to build in this way of
addressing self-criticism,because if I do poorly on the
test that I didn't study for,it's not really me, it's just
that I didn't study, so itdoesn't reflect directly on me,
(16:21):
it reflects on just well, I gotstarted late on that thing, so
it's a different way ofunderstanding the perfectionism
and procrastination, and that'sa topic of a whole different
podcast.
This list could go on and on.
Of all the challenges that theyhave, I'll mention one more,
and that is in middle school andeven into high school often
feel more mature than theirpeers.
(16:42):
It leads them to gravitatetowards older people.
I know some people who will gohang out at their friend's house
and spend all night talking totheir parents because those are
adult conversations and theyjust connect with older people a
little bit better in middleschool and high school.
Obviously, that can lead tosome other challenges, right?
Because kids who are seniorshanging out with freshmen,
(17:02):
they're just in different placesin life and so that can create
challenges as well.
At the end of the day, what dowe do and how do we help these
folks?
Not that they need a ton ofhelp, and not that they want a
ton of help because, again,they're very smart and they know
a lot of things.
So want a ton of help because,again, they're very smart and
they know a lot of things.
So there's about three or fourchallenges that I work with
(17:22):
clients on to try to help them.
Number one to normalize howthey're feeling and how they're
thinking about things,understanding why they are
having anxiety and panic attacks, and what are the strategies to
get that brain to slow down alittle bit?
So one of the ideas that wetalk about is these brains are
kind of like having an IndyCarand you're driving through a
residential neighborhood.
(17:43):
It can get away from you.
So you have to be careful whatyou put into the brain.
Just because you're curiousabout something doesn't mean
that you need to start lookingit up From an emotional
intensity standpoint.
These folks are very altruistic,very caring, very empathetic.
Usually they feel a lot.
So for them to get curiousabout what's going on in world
(18:06):
politics or wars or anything,and they start doing the
research, that can be veryupsetting for them.
Even if somebody they seesomebody pull a dog's leash too
hard, that can be very upsettingas well.
So the advice for them is to becareful what they put in their
brains and if you have kids whoare like this, be careful what
you say around them and how yousay it, because again, they're
(18:28):
listening to everything and theycan just take the ball and run
with it and go to dark placeswith it and overthink it too
much and that can cause someanxiety as well.
Another strategy is to help themexplore and understand the
emotions that go with all thethinking and everything else
that's going on in their minds.
So, especially for the youngerkids, they can have a lot of
(18:49):
very big feelings and thoughtsand not be able to verbalize
them and might struggle withthat.
Instead, they'll get wrappedaround the axle debating facts
and those kinds of things.
One of the strategies I thinkthat when you find someone who
wants to debate a lot of thesethings, to help make the
connection between what we'retalking about and the emotions
(19:11):
that go with that is to have aconversation about the
conversation.
So I don't want to get wrappedinto talking about all the
details and the specifics.
I want to point out how I feelwhen you say these kinds of
things, how I'm feeling in thisconversation and in this moment
and I can put words to thoseemotions and connect the dots
for them a little bit.
(19:31):
And I think for a lot of kidsthat can be very helpful,
understanding that a lot of thehigh degree of justice that a
lot of these folks have, howthings ought to be right, it's
kind of black and white thinkingin a lot of ways and that can
kind of get people into a littlebit of trouble, and and not not
in the sense that it's a hugeproblem, but emotionally it can
(19:52):
be a problem because it's eithergood or it's bad and there's no
middle ground in that.
Additionally, with that highdegree of principle and high
degree of justice, some folksfeel like, well, if it's true, I
can just say it and withoutregard of how other people feel
about that, because it's a truestatement, I don't like it, and
so I should be able to say whatI don't like.
So, understanding andconnecting the dots of like,
(20:14):
okay, I have to titrate the dosefor other people, and just
because it is true doesn't meanthat I can just be as blunt as I
want to be, because that causesother problems for people as
well.
Another strategy and I'vementioned this before is that
the greatest enemy seems to beboredom for these minds that are
so busy because they come upwith all kinds of bad things.
(20:34):
So the challenge, of course, isto keep the mind busy and
occupied, have some downtime,but do it through hobbies
puzzles, gardening, whatever itis.
That's a hobby, but it's adifferent way of challenging the
brain.
So you're not just gettingburned out on doing math and
sciences and those kinds ofthings, reading books, but
there's, there should be someother way to keep the mind
(20:57):
gainfully occupied, gainfullyemployed and occupied, so that
it's not going down the rabbitholes and creating all kinds of
bad ideas.
The other thing I would say, too, is journaling can be very
helpful to get a lot of thesethoughts out of people's heads.
I mentioned that, since thebrains are going a lot,
(21:18):
sometimes it's hard for thesepeople just to go to sleep, and
so I've known people who havestrategies where they write down
everything they were thinkingthe night before to help them go
to sleep, sometimes music, somekinds of distractions, like
there are some apps like CalmC-A-L-M that have like sleep
stories where people are justnarrating stories or audiobooks
(21:40):
that they can listen to, let thebrain focus on something else,
so they can actually go to sleep.
So, understanding that this isa challenge and that giftedness
is not just a present, andpeople who have been given the
label of gifted, but if thesethings tend to resonate with you
, understand that this is kindof a normal way of life for you
and a lot of these challengesare to be expected because
(22:01):
you're kind of outside thenormal bell curve and that's a
blessing and a curse, because itmeans a lot of really great
things but also means thatthere's some things that come
with that, and just being ableto understand that normalizes it
.
And what I say to a lot ofpeople is that if you're going
to be exceptional, you have tobe the exception.
Lot of people is that if you'regoing to be exceptional, you
have to be the exception.
You're not going to look likeeverybody else.
I think this is an importantpoint and I could have made this
(22:29):
earlier.
But the need to look like otherpeople and not stand out and be
differentiated is veryuncomfortable for a lot of
people.
So a lot of these folks,particularly in middle school,
where they start diverging fromtheir peers, they want to fit in
.
So there's this thing calledimposter syndrome and I've seen
kids who will fail classes, failtests, so they can fit in a
(22:49):
little bit better.
I knew one student who wasfluent in a language but the
girl next to her had to studyreally hard for the tests and
she felt so bad about that, eventhough she didn't need to.
She would go home and study foran hour and a half on something
that she could have easilypassed without studying.
So imposter syndrome is a veryreal thing too, and allowing
(23:10):
people and allowing yourselfjust to be you and appreciate
the, the qualities and traitsthat you have, these are gifts
and they are blessings in somany ways.
And so how do we begin toappreciate that, not to beat
ourselves up for it, because,ultimately, being gifted is just
a journey filled with bothhighs and challenges, like most
people, but it's your uniquestrengths and perspectives that
(23:33):
make the world a richer place.
As someone once said, beinggifted means you sometimes have
to color outside the lines, andthat's okay.
So embrace your gifts, nurtureyour passions and don't be
afraid to dream big.
Thanks for checking us out onthe Unscripted Mind today.
If you found this episodehelpful, share it with somebody
who might need it Also.
(23:54):
Please subscribe, follow us andleave a review, and if you have
any questions or topics you'dlike us to cover, please include
that also.
Until next time, remember lifedoesn't come with a script.
So embrace the unexpected,cherish the unplanned, always
stay curious and have an amazingday.
We'll see you next time on theUnscripted mind.
Are you the type of person that overthinks a
simple text message?
Maybe you can see the side ofevery problem, but then not know
where you stand on that veryproblem.
Do you take tags out of allyour clothes or wear your socks
inside out?
Do you ever feel out of syncwith those around you?
Well, today we're discussingthe myths and the mysteries of
(00:21):
giftedness, because being calledgifted isn't always the present
people think it is.
We're going to dive into theblessings and the cursings of
the gifted label, from the wildmisconceptions people have to
the things that most peoplenever knew, like how these
people can be both Einsteins onone hand and world-class
warriors at the same time.
(00:42):
It's not all smooth sailing inthe land of the gifted.
No, we're talking about sensoryoverloads, perfectionism and
why gifted people, not just kids, might be the best
procrastinators you've ever met.
All on this episode of theUnscripted Mind.
Welcome to the Unscripted Mind,where our goal is to give you
(01:05):
fresh perspectives, practicalinsights and tools you can use
to give you more choices,increase your awareness and have
better control of your feelings, reactions and behaviors.
My name is Jim Cunningham andI'm a licensed professional
counselor, and today we'retalking about giftedness, and
that's kind of a vague term.
So what do I mean by that?
Well, giftedness is whensomeone has a natural talent or
(01:27):
ability that stands out, whetherit's in art, music, math,
reading, leadership and a lot ofdifferent areas.
But they tend to be in the 95thto 98th percentile in at least
one category or skill.
That means that only 5% or lesspeople are as advanced as they
are in that one particular area.
So it's like having asupercharged brain that picks up
(01:50):
on things faster, asks deeperquestions and thinks very
creatively.
It's not just about gettinggood grades.
Gifted people might excel inanything from playing an
instrument to solving complexproblems.
People usually can spot thisidea of giftedness or giftedness
in their kids early on,noticing that they might be
ahead of their peers in a lot ofareas.
(02:12):
So, for example, I see someclients who started reading
chapter books when they were inkindergarten.
But see, it's not all smoothsailing and being gifted can
also come with the challengeslike feeling different or
setting really high standardsfor themselves.
So while giftedness can beamazing and that's what most
people think it is just beingsmart and very cool it sometimes
(02:34):
needs a little extra support tohelp navigate the ups and downs
.
See, most people get the labelof being gifted and nobody ever
tells them that.
By the way, there's somedownsides to this and life is
going to be a little bit of adifferent life experience for
you than most other people.
So being smart or highlyintelligent in one area or very
(02:55):
talented in one area is anotherway of saying.
That comes with its own set ofchallenges.
So, when you look across thenation, approximately 18 to 25%
of our gifted students are highschool dropouts nationwide, and
that's from a variety ofdifferent studies.
This statistic highlights thechallenges that gifted kids face
in traditional educationsettings, which might not always
(03:16):
meet their unique needs.
Now, when I say intense desireto learn things, I don't mean
school things.
I mean things that they areinterested in.
They're really good at doing alot of self-study, spending
hours on YouTube, watchingvideos, being on Pinterest,
googling or searching things.
So this intense desire to learnthings is very cool, but it
(03:37):
also gets them into a lot oftrouble because they will what
if themselves?
To death, what if this, what ifthat which leads to a ton of
anxiety and a lot of the kidswho do this.
Unlike most kids, they have thesecond and third order way of
thinking.
For example, when 9-11 happenedand planes flew into buildings,
most kids said, well, that'stragic.
(03:59):
People who have second andthird order ways of thinking and
go down the rabbit hole thinkwell, we have planes here too
and we have buildings here too,it could happen here.
So that leads into a wholedifferent level of concern,
anxiety just because of moreawareness, and again, it's that
way of thinking that can kind ofget them into trouble.
They also need to know whythings need to make sense, which
(04:22):
, if you have a kid that hasthis, they're going to ask you a
lot of questions and they'llwant you to explain every rule
and all of that.
If things don't make sense,it's really hard for them to get
on board with that, and I seethis in a lot of my high school
clients as well.
A lot of the things they feellike they're being taught aren't
preparing them for adult life.
(04:42):
So they don't think it cares,it doesn't matter, and they plus
they also think they might havea better way of doing things.
The other thing that this lookslike is not being able to turn
the brain off to go to sleep atnight.
So there's a lot of the brainis kind of always going.
It's an amazing machine when ithas something to do, and what I
(05:03):
have found is the biggestAchilles heel for a lot of these
overthinkers and big thinkersis boredom, because the brain
isn't going to stop when itdoesn't have anything to do.
Instead, it just starts makingup things, and usually bad
things, not the good things andso that leads to also very dark
places.
So, for example, during COVID,I saw a lot of very intelligent
(05:26):
people, adults and children whowere all of a sudden having
panic attacks and worrying aboutthings, and they're like I
think I'm going crazy.
I've never felt this way beforeand when their brain didn't
have anything to do, being stuckat home or in isolation, it
leads to very bad things, andI've had a lot of these folks
tell me I hate being alone withmy thoughts for too long, which
(05:48):
is a problem that most of usdon't relate to too much.
So this analytical thinking andall these curiosities also
leads kids to ask what you mightthink are odd questions, very
deep questions, though.
Things like why isn't theremouse-flavored cat food?
Or if you choke a Smurf, whatcolor does it turn?
Why do they call it lipstick ifyou can still move your lips
(06:12):
and one from a client said ifyou were in a coma for 10 years,
would you live longer?
Now, these are great questions,imponderable questions in a lot
of ways.
So that's a good example ofsome of the ways that they think
a little bit differently thanmost of us do.
A second intensity is anemotional intensity and I've had
a lot of clients who tell me Idon't know where my emotions end
(06:35):
and yours begin.
They can be overwhelmed by alot of big emotions.
Again, we're kind of goingthrough life on steroids.
So if I'm at a 10 and you're ata six, things are going to
sound a lot different to me.
If mom and dad are talking moresternly to me or someone else
is, it might feel like yellingNot really the case, but it
feels that way.
(06:55):
So a lot of these folks are veryuncomfortable with big emotions
, crying anger, and so they wantto make sure that everybody is
good.
What does that end up lookinglike and why does it cause
problems for them?
Well, they start trying tomanage everybody's emotions, to
make sure everybody is good, toplacate, or sometimes they just
want to be out of the situation.
(07:15):
The problem is that curiositywe talked about in the
intellectual part wants to stickaround and make sure it's
informed in what's going on,which again creates more
problems because now they'reexposing themselves to all this
emotional overwhelm.
So this is one of the otherchallenges.
If you've got friends orchildren who fit this category
(07:36):
and this criteria is that youhave to be careful and they have
to be careful what informationthey feed into these brains,
because it's going to create alot of emotional worry and
anxiety that they hadn'tanticipated.
So one of the challenges isthat these folks come across as
very mature, gifted kids.
(07:56):
You can have great adultconversations with them.
The problem is emotionally theymay not be at the same level as
they are intellectually.
So intellectually they canapprehend and comprehend what
you're saying.
Emotionally it could becompletely overwhelming for them
.
So I tell a lot of folks it'sgreat to have these
(08:23):
conversations, but you have tobe careful and you have to
titrate the dose a little bit.
So, for example, talking toyour kids about, say, a late
payment on a credit card, I'veseen some kids who will go way
down the rabbit hole with that,thinking oh my gosh, we're going
to lose the house, becausethat's the way they think about
things.
Second and third order andthey'll take it to the nth
degree.
So sometimes it's better justto discriminate on what
information you share.
Now, understanding that theirintense curiosity also leads
(08:44):
them to overhear a lot ofconversations.
So you have to be particularlycareful sometimes if you're
discussing something sensitive,so they don't get kind of sucked
into that.
So those are the first twointellectual, emotional.
So they don't get kind ofsucked into that.
So those are the first twointellectual, emotional.
The third one is a sensoryintensity.
So that's some or all of thefive senses.
What does that exactly looklike?
Well, it looks like taking tagsout of clothes.
(09:05):
It looks like wearing socksinside out.
It looks like aversion tocertain sounds, certain food
textures, certain clothingtextures.
It also looks like an affinityfor certain soft things.
So I will see a lot of kids whowould wear the exact same
hoodie every day or when theycame home from school, put on
their pajamas right after school.
They can also have very strongsenses of smell, they notice all
(09:29):
kinds of sounds, and so again,it's kind of like going through
life on steroids and they justagain feel more because they
sense more.
I've had to stop sessions inthe middle of a counseling
session because I've had torearrange books on my bookcase
because they weren't properlyaligned and it was just too
distracting.
I've removed ticking clocksfrom my office because it annoys
(09:50):
way too many people.
The sound of somebody chewingcould drive these folks crazy.
When they turn up the volume onthe television it has to be
multiples of two or multiples offive, things that most of us
don't really notice or think of.
They are just hyper in tunewith that and that can again
lead to kind of overwhelm.
So when you think of putting akid in a school environment and
(10:10):
if you've ever been to anelementary school recently, or
many classrooms, every ounce ofthe wall is covered, wall to
wall.
It's very overstimulating.
There's a lot of noise, theteacher's going, other people
are talking, so there's a lotgoing on.
So this overwhelm can causethese folks to have to come home
, maybe in the afternoon andthey just need time to
decompress, to take some timeaway from a lot of that
(10:33):
overwhelming and overstimulation.
So the fourth one is animaginational intensity that
looks like getting lost infantasy novels and stories, open
world games like Minecraft,very common for a lot of these
folks to have imaginary friendsas pets.
I knew one kid who hadimaginary friends with imaginary
pets.
So very creative minds, veryvisually in-depth way of
(10:57):
thinking about things.
When I worked at the school, Isaw a kindergartner one day and
he went by the name of Chuck andhe was telling me about how he
had broken his arm when he hadbeen skiing in the past and all
the details that went along withthat, very specific details.
Well, when I talked to his momand said hey, by the way, I met
Chuck today and she said, well,who's Chuck?
(11:18):
And talking to his teacher, wefound out that he goes by Chuck,
charles or Charlie, dependingon the day, depending on what he
felt like, and he had neverbroken a bone in his body.
Now, he wasn't there just tolie to me.
He was there because he hadthis great, amazing story and
this imagination and this worldthat he had built and he was
just sharing it.
So it's really amazing, it'svery cool, it's very creative,
(11:41):
it's much more than most of usare used to.
And so, getting lost in thoseworlds one of the things that
they tend to hate too is theylike fantasy novels that have a
series, so a series of 10 books,and that way the story can go
on and on, and I've had a lot ofthem tell me that they hate
when those stories end or whenthose series end, because then
they'll make up alternateendings.
(12:01):
They'll put themselves in thealternate ending.
So there's a lot of very coolthings that go along with that.
But you have to kind ofunderstand what you're dealing
with, otherwise it can be veryconfusing.
And the last intensity is apsychomotor intensity and that
means a lot of wiggling, toetapping, shaking.
I think it's just a function ofthe brain and how it's always
(12:22):
moving and always going.
These tend to be the mostmisdiagnosed group for ADHD,
because it looks similar in alot of ways, in the sense that
they daydream a lot.
They don't pay attention, theyget bored.
If it's a class in school, forexample, that they have are very
interested in, they've done alot of self-study and a lot of
the research would suggest theyknow 50% of the material before
(12:44):
the school year starts.
So you put them in thatclassroom and they get bored.
Additionally, they might hearsomething that's of interest to
them.
So they go down the rabbit holeto think about this new concept
that they've heard.
20 minutes later they come outof the rabbit hole and they have
missed a lot of material.
It also leads them to askquestions that have nothing to
(13:05):
do with the conversation.
That's interesting because Ihad a hard time understanding
that with some people, becauseyou would be talking and all of
a sudden this question comes outof nowhere and then you realize
20 minutes ago that had come upin the conversation.
That person had gone down therabbit hole.
They came back and now they'restill thinking about that and
(13:25):
everybody else had moved on.
So in elementary school thingsgo pretty well for the gifted
kids in my experience.
Right, they get along withtheir peers, they play
Everybody's good.
The problem starts to come, andwhere they start diverging from
their peers is in middle school, and that's where you see a lot
of these kids say, yeah, I missmy friends.
(13:47):
But honestly they feel kind ofimmature and so that can be
frustrating for them and for alot of these kids they don't
really find their own tribesuntil they get into high school,
depending on the size of theschool and people that they can
connect with.
And even a lot of these folkswill have to find several groups
of people to kind of meet allof their needs One group to have
(14:07):
the intellectual conversationswith one group to just be kind
of have fun with maybe anathletic group, and so you find
that they kind of bounce aroundfrom those groups quite a bit.
They also have this otherproblem called
multi-potentiality.
Most of them are very smart,very creative, and so they can
do a lot of things really well.
(14:28):
The problem with that is whenit comes time to decide on a
career, how do they pick?
I can do so many things reallywell, how do I choose one?
The other challenge that I seetoo is that their interests
change rather frequently.
So I know somebody who in highschool went through four
different sports and honestlythey probably could have had
(14:48):
scholarships in two of the four.
But they get to a certain levelof mastery of that pretty
quickly and then they kind ofget bored with it and they want
to go try something else.
So that's hard as a parent or afriend to keep up with.
These kinds of changinginterests and desires can also
be expensive when you go downthat road as well.
So I say all this to say isthat understanding this and as
(15:14):
many parents don't understandthis and they get frustrated
with their kids because theyseem argumentative and they ask
a lot of questions and they needto know why, and that can be
very frustrating.
Another problem a lot of thesefolks have and this tends maybe
to be their biggest problem ishow critical they are of
themselves.
They tend to be perfectionisticand they tend to be big
(15:35):
procrastinators, and thosethings go hand in hand.
They will beat themselvesperfectionistic and they tend to
be big procrastinators andthose things go hand in hand.
They will beat themselves uplike nobody's business and I
often have to tell parents youdon't have to beat them up too
much and you're probably notgoing to say anything to them
they haven't said to themselves.
10 times worse procrastinationand perfectionism.
I've had a lot of people tellme that if I study for a test
(15:58):
and get a B, that's no good.
If I don't study and get a B,I'm fine with it.
The same holds true forstarting a big project at the
last moment, and it's kind ofthe way to build in this way of
addressing self-criticism,because if I do poorly on the
test that I didn't study for,it's not really me, it's just
that I didn't study, so itdoesn't reflect directly on me,
(16:21):
it reflects on just well, I gotstarted late on that thing, so
it's a different way ofunderstanding the perfectionism
and procrastination, and that'sa topic of a whole different
podcast.
This list could go on and on.
Of all the challenges that theyhave, I'll mention one more,
and that is in middle school andeven into high school often
feel more mature than theirpeers.
(16:42):
It leads them to gravitatetowards older people.
I know some people who will gohang out at their friend's house
and spend all night talking totheir parents because those are
adult conversations and theyjust connect with older people a
little bit better in middleschool and high school.
Obviously, that can lead tosome other challenges, right?
Because kids who are seniorshanging out with freshmen,
(17:02):
they're just in different placesin life and so that can create
challenges as well.
At the end of the day, what dowe do and how do we help these
folks?
Not that they need a ton ofhelp, and not that they want a
ton of help because, again,they're very smart and they know
a lot of things.
So want a ton of help because,again, they're very smart and
they know a lot of things.
So there's about three or fourchallenges that I work with
(17:22):
clients on to try to help them.
Number one to normalize howthey're feeling and how they're
thinking about things,understanding why they are
having anxiety and panic attacks, and what are the strategies to
get that brain to slow down alittle bit?
So one of the ideas that wetalk about is these brains are
kind of like having an IndyCarand you're driving through a
residential neighborhood.
(17:43):
It can get away from you.
So you have to be careful whatyou put into the brain.
Just because you're curiousabout something doesn't mean
that you need to start lookingit up From an emotional
intensity standpoint.
These folks are very altruistic,very caring, very empathetic.
Usually they feel a lot.
So for them to get curiousabout what's going on in world
(18:06):
politics or wars or anything,and they start doing the
research, that can be veryupsetting for them.
Even if somebody they seesomebody pull a dog's leash too
hard, that can be very upsettingas well.
So the advice for them is to becareful what they put in their
brains and if you have kids whoare like this, be careful what
you say around them and how yousay it, because again, they're
(18:28):
listening to everything and theycan just take the ball and run
with it and go to dark placeswith it and overthink it too
much and that can cause someanxiety as well.
Another strategy is to help themexplore and understand the
emotions that go with all thethinking and everything else
that's going on in their minds.
So, especially for the youngerkids, they can have a lot of
(18:49):
very big feelings and thoughtsand not be able to verbalize
them and might struggle withthat.
Instead, they'll get wrappedaround the axle debating facts
and those kinds of things.
One of the strategies I thinkthat when you find someone who
wants to debate a lot of thesethings, to help make the
connection between what we'retalking about and the emotions
(19:11):
that go with that is to have aconversation about the
conversation.
So I don't want to get wrappedinto talking about all the
details and the specifics.
I want to point out how I feelwhen you say these kinds of
things, how I'm feeling in thisconversation and in this moment
and I can put words to thoseemotions and connect the dots
for them a little bit.
(19:31):
And I think for a lot of kidsthat can be very helpful,
understanding that a lot of thehigh degree of justice that a
lot of these folks have, howthings ought to be right, it's
kind of black and white thinkingin a lot of ways and that can
kind of get people into a littlebit of trouble, and and not not
in the sense that it's a hugeproblem, but emotionally it can
(19:52):
be a problem because it's eithergood or it's bad and there's no
middle ground in that.
Additionally, with that highdegree of principle and high
degree of justice, some folksfeel like, well, if it's true, I
can just say it and withoutregard of how other people feel
about that, because it's a truestatement, I don't like it, and
so I should be able to say whatI don't like.
So, understanding andconnecting the dots of like,
(20:14):
okay, I have to titrate the dosefor other people, and just
because it is true doesn't meanthat I can just be as blunt as I
want to be, because that causesother problems for people as
well.
Another strategy and I'vementioned this before is that
the greatest enemy seems to beboredom for these minds that are
so busy because they come upwith all kinds of bad things.
(20:34):
So the challenge, of course, isto keep the mind busy and
occupied, have some downtime,but do it through hobbies
puzzles, gardening, whatever itis.
That's a hobby, but it's adifferent way of challenging the
brain.
So you're not just gettingburned out on doing math and
sciences and those kinds ofthings, reading books, but
there's, there should be someother way to keep the mind
(20:57):
gainfully occupied, gainfullyemployed and occupied, so that
it's not going down the rabbitholes and creating all kinds of
bad ideas.
The other thing I would say, too, is journaling can be very
helpful to get a lot of thesethoughts out of people's heads.
I mentioned that, since thebrains are going a lot,
(21:18):
sometimes it's hard for thesepeople just to go to sleep, and
so I've known people who havestrategies where they write down
everything they were thinkingthe night before to help them go
to sleep, sometimes music, somekinds of distractions, like
there are some apps like CalmC-A-L-M that have like sleep
stories where people are justnarrating stories or audiobooks
(21:40):
that they can listen to, let thebrain focus on something else,
so they can actually go to sleep.
So, understanding that this isa challenge and that giftedness
is not just a present, andpeople who have been given the
label of gifted, but if thesethings tend to resonate with you
, understand that this is kindof a normal way of life for you
and a lot of these challengesare to be expected because
(22:01):
you're kind of outside thenormal bell curve and that's a
blessing and a curse, because itmeans a lot of really great
things but also means thatthere's some things that come
with that, and just being ableto understand that normalizes it
.
And what I say to a lot ofpeople is that if you're going
to be exceptional, you have tobe the exception.
Lot of people is that if you'regoing to be exceptional, you
have to be the exception.
You're not going to look likeeverybody else.
I think this is an importantpoint and I could have made this
(22:29):
earlier.
But the need to look like otherpeople and not stand out and be
differentiated is veryuncomfortable for a lot of
people.
So a lot of these folks,particularly in middle school,
where they start diverging fromtheir peers, they want to fit in
.
So there's this thing calledimposter syndrome and I've seen
kids who will fail classes, failtests, so they can fit in a
(22:49):
little bit better.
I knew one student who wasfluent in a language but the
girl next to her had to studyreally hard for the tests and
she felt so bad about that, eventhough she didn't need to.
She would go home and study foran hour and a half on something
that she could have easilypassed without studying.
So imposter syndrome is a veryreal thing too, and allowing
(23:10):
people and allowing yourselfjust to be you and appreciate
the, the qualities and traitsthat you have, these are gifts
and they are blessings in somany ways.
And so how do we begin toappreciate that, not to beat
ourselves up for it, because,ultimately, being gifted is just
a journey filled with bothhighs and challenges, like most
people, but it's your uniquestrengths and perspectives that
(23:33):
make the world a richer place.
As someone once said, beinggifted means you sometimes have
to color outside the lines, andthat's okay.
So embrace your gifts, nurtureyour passions and don't be
afraid to dream big.
Thanks for checking us out onthe Unscripted Mind today.
If you found this episodehelpful, share it with somebody
who might need it Also.
(23:54):
Please subscribe, follow us andleave a review, and if you have
any questions or topics you'dlike us to cover, please include
that also.
Until next time, remember lifedoesn't come with a script.
So embrace the unexpected,cherish the unplanned, always
stay curious and have an amazingday.
We'll see you next time on theUnscripted mind.
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