Paranormal Stories of a Navajo Ranger with Stanley Milford Jr.

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:03):
Join us as we dive into the history, hauntings, and
high strangers of the world to try to better understand
the paranormal. I will be your guide. I am paranormal
researcher and investigator Eric Freeman Simms. Welcome to the Unseen
Paranormal Podcast. Hey everybody, welcome back to the show. Sorry

(00:25):
for the long hiatus, but is great to be back.
Have been recording episodes behind the scenes the past few months,
so got some episodes in the bank, got some awesome
guests I'm excited to bring to y'all today. We have
an amazing guest before we get to that. If any
of y'all don't know, Me and my husband bought a
two year old haunted house in Hopkinsville, Kentucky in April,

(00:46):
and I took the hiatus from the show here to
have a little more time to work on that, work
on the website and build all that up and build
that part of our business up. And it is open
for private history tours. You can give me a call.
My number is on the website and we can set
up a private history tour. Also, we have it open
to paranormal teams for half nine investigation overnighte investigations. The

(01:07):
half night is three and fifty bucks and the overnight
is five hundred dollars. You go on the website, it
is the Nighthouse kwyd dot com and night to spelled
Kate and i GHD. And if you're not following us
on Facebook, please go follow the Facebook page as well.
And it's not only paranormal stuff, but we're putting all
the renovation stuff up there too that we that we

(01:28):
do and you can continue to see the evolution of
the house. We've done a lot in the five months
that we've owned it, and it's been going good. It
got teams in the house, coming in the house, and
the and the pairent, the paranormals off the chain man.
They are ready to talk, I'm telling you. But yeah,
go on the website. You can book to your team.
If you don't have a team and don't know how
to investigate, but you would like to ghos hunt the house,

(01:50):
you can do that with me, and we're gonna we
got a bunch of three hour guided ghost hunts and
you investigate with me the whole three hours, and the
first two hours with you in your group will be
investigating with me. The last hour you get to go
investigate by yourselves, and I'll be there still help and
I have all the equipment you can play with and
all the things you've seen on TV and all that
good stuff. So have a good time and get to

(02:12):
learn the history of the house as well as experience
with the hauntings hopefully. But today we have mister Stanley
Milford Junior. He is a paranormal ranger for the Navajo Nation,
and the Navajo Nation, if you don't know, incompasses four
or five states out in the Midwest, and it is
where Skinwalker's come from. Him and his partner Jonathan were

(02:34):
tasked by their boss as Navajo rangers to be the
two that investigated all of the paranormal goings on on
the reservation. So anything to do with skin Walker's witchcraft, ghost, bigfoot, aliens,
they investigated all of it. And now Stanley has written
a book that is coming out of October first, and

(02:55):
it is already on the New York Times Top twenty
two Books to read this fall for it to be
a New York Times bestseller. He's a great guest. We're
going to have him on again to tell more of
his stories. He wanted to do that he said, and
we only got the tip of Iceberg, so look for
a part too sometime in the near future. But sit back, relax,
and enjoy this episode. And I'm so happy to be back.

(03:15):
Thank you for listening, Thank you all for sticking with us,
and we'll talk again soon. Have a good day, Hey, Stan,
thanks for joining us on the show today.

Speaker 2 (03:23):
Oh sure, sure, glad to be here.

Speaker 1 (03:25):
Yeah. Like I said before we started recording, I was
excited when your publicist reached out because, for one, this
is a different type of book than most of the
paranormal books. I like how you wrote it from a
biographical standpoint as well. It's not just a bunch of stories.
And I like it because I think the journey, most
of the time is just as important as the destination.

(03:45):
So I know people want to get to like the
paranormal stories and things, but I think the journey is
just as interesting.

Speaker 2 (03:51):
I agree with you. You know, the fact that you
and I are sitting here talking for a podcast is
part of that journey. And yeah that you know, all
of us that have an interest in that subject matter
are on this journey. It's leading somewhere, and I think
it's a very important journey. We're taking.

Speaker 1 (04:12):
So yeah, yeah, yeah, And I like how you put
your your life story in there too, because it shows
how life and in the Creator or God or wherever
you want to call it, was kind of it seems
like it was kind of training you to ultimately become
the paranormal ranger. Throughout all the experiences to your life,

(04:33):
it seems like you're being you're being prepared as a
kid to be a police officer and then go on
to be a Navaja ranger and then go on to
do the paranormal cases.

Speaker 2 (04:41):
Yeah. Well, there's so many things that have transpired that
have come into play for you and I to be
sitting here today, and for me a lot of it.
You know, it wasn't really planned. If those if the
two young rookie rangers you read in the book hadn't

(05:02):
watched the response to the elderly woman that had a
claiming to have a big foot take one of her sheet,
then John Dover and I would have never been assigned
to take these kind of cases. And there's things like that,
just on and on that you know, that things that

(05:23):
happened and things that fell into place for this whole,
this whole thing to transpire and to be where we
are today.

Speaker 1 (05:33):
Yeah. I feel that way in life too sometimes, that
that you just feel like you're being steered in the
right direction and kind of you get off course. Then
it kind of has a way of correcting itself to
put you where you're supposed to be.

Speaker 2 (05:43):
Yeah, self correcting, Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 1 (05:47):
So you start off life kind of with your foot
in two different two different cultures, in two different worlds,
one in the Native American world and kind of one
in the Western world.

Speaker 2 (05:55):
That's very true, and that plays a significant role in
how all of this came together. So I was born
on the Naval Reservation and my mother and father. I
had an older sister five years older than me, the
name of Deborah. And when I was about two years old,
my mother and father separated and we were living on

(06:17):
the navination at that time, and my mother took me
and my oldest sister back to where she was from
in Oklahoma, a little town called Talaquah, Oklahoma, which is
the capital of Cherokee Nation. So I grew up predominantly
living there in Tehlequah in the surrounding area. I would

(06:41):
school there from first grade all the way through graduating
high school, but my father would fly me and my
older sister usually every summer from Paulta, Oklahoma, out to Albuquerque,
and my father would pick us up and we would
spend time. And they're on the naval reservation with all

(07:02):
our relatives there, my father's family, and so, like you said,
I was kind of speaked in both cultures. In Oklahoma.
I went to public school, and yes, there were Native
American students. I mean, Oklahoma was Indian territory. The sport
became a state, so you have a number of different

(07:23):
Indian tribes from the state of Oklahoma. And so I
went to public school and I was there with all
of the other students. You know, we had a really
diverse student classroom. I would say that probably the majority
were white, but the second part of that would probably
be Native American, and then you did have black and

(07:47):
you had Asians, so it was very diverse. I always
felt included in everything that I did growing up there
in Oklahoma, and so I went to school there. My
father would bring me my older sister out to the
Naval reservation and I got to experience navoculture and the

(08:08):
foods and everything that goes with that. The tales of
shape shifters and skin walkers, so that was there. But
one of the unique things about the investigation of the
paranormal for the Department of Resource Enforcement or the Naval

(08:29):
Rangers was that at the time the chief Ranger, the
way he ran his department was that he felt that
as sworn law enforcement officers, we were there to either
help people or protect thee and that was your primary job.

(08:49):
It didn't matter that we were investigating things of paranormal
or others. It's just the fact that these people needed
help and they were reaching out to somebody. And typically
when people experience these things that fall under the paranormal umbrella,
they aren't given very much attention by your local law

(09:11):
enforcement right the police departments and sheriff's departments. And the
other thing is most agencies today are understaffed, under under manned,
and so they're busy dealing with the day to day
domestic violence and other daily calls. But because this comes

(09:33):
from the navinations, you have the cultural aspect of a
Native American tribes, and within that, you know you'll have
your you'll have your medicine men that do practice certain
ceremonies and things like that for healing purposes, and it's

(09:54):
a part of the culture. It's very much a part
of the culture within that you also have with that
particular tribe, you have an element of witchcraft that's involved,
and this is a very real part of the reality
of that culture. And same with some of the tribes

(10:16):
there in Oklahoma. You know, I had grown up there
in Oklahoma hearing my relatives talk about stories of shape
shifting and even in Oklahoma, but it was a little
bit different than what I'd heard on the Nava Reservation,
and so it's kind of back and forth. But also

(10:38):
my partner, Jonathan Dover, he grew up being born and
living in Los Angeles and then spending time with his
grandparents on the Naval Reservation. His grandfather was a medicine man,
and so he would be back and forth between those
two locations, and there again he was able to view

(11:02):
these cases that we dealt with of paranormal from both sides,
from both sides of that coin, is the western side
and then the traditional and cultural sides. The same was
with our chief. Chief was born on the reservation, he
was raised on the reservation, but when he was a
little boy, he was taken back to Salt Lake City,

(11:27):
and he went to school through the Mormon Church up
near Salt Lake City, and so he too also was
able to view these cases and this phenomenon of paranormal
from both sides, and so coming together those three individuals

(11:49):
made it unique. Because the average ranger that I worked with,
having been raised on the reservation their entire life, the
taboos was so strong that in the navoculture you don't
deal with anything that has to do with death or
the witchcraft or things of that nature. So anything involving

(12:13):
those kinds of things they would avoid. And for me
and John, we didn't, you know, we were We were
able to look at it from Western perspective and to
focus on what it is that we had as an
objective for our job. So yeah, I think that really
set the foundation for the investigation of these paranormal cases.

Speaker 1 (12:38):
Yeah, and kind of made you and him uniquely qualified
and the chief to deal with those type of cases. Yeah,
and exactly, growing up here in the stories and the
beliefs of the Navajo, you kind of didn't buy into
it at first. A lot of the stories to where
it is like your cousins and people growing up on

(12:58):
the on the reservation did and what made you come
around to start believing somewhat in some of the stories
and things you've been told.

Speaker 2 (13:06):
Well, you're correct in that and that when I was
growing up in Oklahoma, you know, I'd hear these tales
of shape shifting and stuff. But that's what I took
it as stories, storytelling. So I I had graduated high school.
I had gone and graduated from the highschool Union Nation

(13:28):
College at the time, it's now a university in Kansas,
and I had come home during the summer into Arizona,
and I was staying with my father and I had
gone to the movie theater one night to watch a movie,
Stephen King movie about these It was a tractor trailer

(13:50):
that actually came to life because of a meteor that
passed close to Earth. And there was a ACDC soundtrack.
And I was big to the hard rock and heavy
metals during my you know, even today, I still love
that kind of means met Anyway, I had this a
CDC soundtracks. I went to the movies by myself, and

(14:11):
when the movie was over, it was around midnight sometimes
and when I came into the lobby, there was an
elderly man that was sitting there on one of the benches,
and him and I ended up talking and he asked
to be could catch a ride back to the town
that I was there I lived in, which was about
seven miles away, and so him and I got in

(14:35):
the car and I took him to where he wanted
to be taken and it was it was in an
area where there's no street lights or anything like that.
It was very dark where he has to be let out,
and I was it's kind of, you know, kind of
unnerving letting his elderly man there was probably in his

(14:57):
eighties out in this area. And fore I let him out.
There was a long stretch of highways, so I turned
around and I started back down that straight stretch of
highways going back to the house, and I was as
I was driving out the passenger window, there was something

(15:17):
that caught my eye, something moving, and I continued to
glance in that direction to tend to see what this was.
The first I assumed maybe that it was a horse
or something running on the inside of the fence, but
pretty soon whatever this was was able to leap that
right away fence, the barb wire right away front that

(15:38):
runs parallel to the road, and this thing moved closer
and closer to the car. It ended up getting within
a couple of feet of the car, two or three
feet from the car. And this thing was Its body
form or shape appeared a lot like a greyhound, but
much bigger or kind of more robust than that. It

(16:02):
had this thick barrel kind of chest. It was running
on all fours. It was all white from head to toe,
and it was keeping up with me at the highway speed.
So I kept looking over to try to see what
this was. And at one point I look over that
way and it's looking right at me, and its eyes

(16:27):
were this fluorescent orange color like what you see on
the exit signs of a movie theater. It was a
really intense right color, like it had its own self elimination.
And this thing had these eyes, It had a mouthful

(16:48):
of teeth. Its head was canine in shape, much like
what was portrayed in the movies with the werewolves. So
I'm looking at this thing. We were looking at each other,
and at one point I just slid down on the
seat as far as I could the driver's seat and
barely seen over the dash, and I floored it. I

(17:11):
didn't look back at it. I did look at my
rear view mirrors. I don't know what it did at
that point, but yeah, seeing that thing was like ice
water in your veins. It was nothing I ever seen
before and since, and it was one of those life
changing experiences you had. But you know, I'll never forget

(17:34):
that as long as I live. When I closed my eyes,
I can still see its eyes and how they looked
in this mouthful of teeth, and it was very menacing.
And how this thing was able to keep up with
me at sixty five or more miles an hour, I
don't know. So that road comes to a tee. I

(17:55):
don't know how I made it around the corner there
because I was blind, and I come sliding into the
driveway at the house, jumped out and ran in the house.
I was kind of out of breath, and my dad
was still away. He's sitting a recliner, and he said,
what what's wrong with you? Done? For what happened? And

(18:15):
I described what I'd seen and he said, he said, son,
that's that's a skin walkness. That's what you've seen. And
at that point, you know, I knew all of the
stories I'd heard about these things wasn't just make believe
these things were real. I shouldn't know what I've seen,
and it was in a physical form right there, a

(18:37):
couple of feet away from me, you know, And so
I knew that at that point this was real, you know,
and not just legend, not just fable, not just a story,
that it really that these things were real.

Speaker 1 (18:53):
Yeah, and there's no case of mistaken identity there, especially
since it was about an hour right.

Speaker 2 (19:01):
Well. The other thing that coincided with that was I
was really close to one of my cousins out there,
one of my now thoss. He and I were about
the same age. I think we were only months apart,
and with our birthdays. And when that happened, he was
he was killed. He was killed in an accident, and

(19:23):
my aunt, his mother, sought out help from a medicine man,
and the medicine man performed some ceremonies and stuff, and
he said that my cousin's death was related to me
seeing what I that thing running by my vehicle.

Speaker 1 (19:41):
Wow.

Speaker 2 (19:41):
So yeah, pretty serious stuff.

Speaker 1 (19:44):
Yeah, And it's kind of from what I understand, it's
kind of taboo and the and the Navaho culture to
even talk about skinwalkers because they think it brings on
things like that.

Speaker 2 (19:55):
Well, the commonality and all of these things I investigated
under the are normal bit, UFO's extraterrestrial bigfoot hauntings and spirits,
and the witch gust the commonality was that in one
of the cases I investigated, there was coins that would

(20:17):
a port or fall out of thin air into the floor.
And sometimes the coins would fly across from the top
corner of the room. Sometimes they would hit it. And
in that particular case there was sixty six coins over
the course of two days, a two day investigation.

Speaker 1 (20:36):
Wow.

Speaker 2 (20:36):
And that was again another one of those things when
you actually witnessed this phenomenon happening right in front of
your eyes, right right there in front of your eyes,
a coin materializing out of nothingness, no nothing there, thin air,
falling maybe three feet high to the floor. You realize

(20:58):
that this eye of other dimensions and other planes of existence,
that there's something to them. And I beg, you know,
as like an epiphany or a light bulb going up
on above my head. Where at that point, at the
moment I realized that that was how all these things
were connected. The UFOs come into our environment and atmosphere

(21:20):
from some other plane of existence the Bigfoot. You know,
me and John had lived in the woods at times
on the reservation. You know, the naval reservation is twenty
seven thousand square miles. That's the size of the state
of West Virginia. The biggest part is in Arizona, then
New Mexico, Utah, and now Colorado. Novel Nation has some

(21:44):
ranches in Colorado today, but that's a vast area. And
John and I had spent a lot of our career
out in the woods, the forest areas on the reservation.
We could see the evidence of all of the wildlife,
the bears, the mountain lions, bobcats, coyotes, all of these things.

(22:06):
You could find the evidence of them living in that environment.
You know, you'll find where they have their dens and
bed down and where they have routes to get water
during the day or at night, where they hunt. You'll

(22:26):
see all of that, and you'll see where they poop
and everything. But with the big Foot, you don't see that.
You know, people are withnessing that people are having these encounters,
but you don't see that evidence of these things living
in the woods. And I know there are some investigators
that have a different viewpoint in that where they do

(22:48):
think they migrate and this kind of thing that I
follow that line of thought simply because of the evidence
that there in the woods. And so I feel that
these like the bigfoots are either being they either cross
over from some other dimension into our physical world and

(23:08):
we see them. They leave the tracks and the hair
and different things, and and then they cross back over
and then people are running around trying to find out
where did it. And you know, John and I investigated
cases where we would have tracks that start at one
point and go out for miles and then all of

(23:29):
a sudden, the last track it ends, and there's no
you know, there would be no disturbance within the corridor
in and around those tracks, no disturbance, and that that
repeated itself, you know, over and over. So I started
thinking about the theory that these things we're not living

(23:50):
out there, they're not you know, they're not wildlife. They
come into our physical world for whatever reason. Maybe they're
extra pressure or putting these things that are built like
a tank here on earth to gather information and then
they bring them back to where they originate. Bigfoot is
built like a tank. I mean, no matter where you
put that that bigfoot on this planet bit you know,

(24:16):
in alpine locations or like the swamp ep down in
Florida or in the South or the Yaoe. You know,
this thing could survive even if it got into an
altercation with a grizzly bear. These things could probably survive that, yeah,

(24:37):
simply by how they're built and how they're commonly described.
So yeah, I mean that was kind of the epiphany
that I had with the coins. You know, it was
one of those again life changing experiences that made me
realize there's a hell of a lot more to our
universe than what's right here in front of us, with

(24:58):
us going to and from work each day and paying
bills and getting kids to school and those kinds of
things that we get caught up with. You know, there's
more to it than that. And I've been blessed to
experience these paranormal phenomenons and know that this stuff is real.
I've I've seen it, not all cases, yeah, I've John,

(25:20):
and I have found you know a number of people
hoaxing some of this stuff over the years, and and
there is a lot of that today simply because you've
got AI that can manipulate photographs and and the Internet
and things of that nature that can use to manipulate

(25:44):
the media to make it look like it's real, and
it does look real, but it's it's being fake. And
so yeah, I mean.

Speaker 1 (25:52):
Yeah, when you when you get when you get money involved, exactly,
you know, clicks and things like that and YouTube paying people, Yeah, exactly. Yeah,
definitely within within your department, y'all kind of had an
unwritten rule about Bigfoot, about hot shooting at.

Speaker 2 (26:06):
Them, right. You know, anytime a law enforcement officer put
in a situation to have to potentially use deadly force,
that's a huge thing. I mean, that's the biggest thing.
You're given the authority to use deadly force in the
day to day duties. You know, of your authority. And

(26:29):
to me, I was a Federal Farms instructor for almost
all of my career. So John and I and John too.
John and I taught the qualifications and training and John
and I also worked SWAT. We were the commanders for
our swating and so we we took that, you know,

(26:50):
that was the the the greatest authority we had, you know,
and we didn't take that lightly. And the fact that
you know what you do have these hoaxers, you as
a law enforce and law enforcement officer. You would not
want to end up using deadly force against one of

(27:12):
these things and go up to it and it's got
a zipper on the back and there's somebody inside, you know,
and that would be the worst, the worst thing in
the world. And so in the use of deadly force,
you only use daily force in a situation where your
life or the life of somebody else's is compromised or

(27:37):
at risk. And that's the only reason you would use
deadly force. You you are required to use a lesser
means of course, if it is possible to control that situation.
So only unless one of these things were attacking you
and uh or someone else and you had to within

(28:00):
your life for someone else's used their course, Yeah, there
was there was an unwritten policy about.

Speaker 1 (28:11):
So you were a Navajo ranger. You became a ranger,
And what is difference between that and like a regular
travel police or like local wealth police.

Speaker 2 (28:20):
Department of Resource Enforcement slash Navajo Rangers is situated under
the Division of Natural Resources. So the Naval Rangers is
kind of a catch all law enforcement department. They would
also do the work of your fish and wildlife conservation
officer your forestry officers, your livestock and agriculture officers, and

(28:48):
even the naval police officers. So let's say a ranger
is at the one of the remote lakes checking fishing
permits or something, and it comes across across the domestic
violence in progress. You know, he's got to take action
on that. So he had the authority like a police
officer to make a risk and detain that person and

(29:12):
either have another police officer under the location and transport
the individual, or some cases we would make the arrest
and transport that person into the detention or whatever. But
it's not that we were and and some of us,
like work partners, we were trained to run radar and

(29:33):
issue traffic citations and things like that. And again, like
I mentioned, John and I worked SWAT. We were trained
as SWAT personnel, and so when there was a call
for possible school shooting or things like that, we responded
to those kind of calls and we dig the dignitary

(29:58):
protection under the Special Projects Unit, and we did security
for like the motion pictures and filming on the naval reservation.
You know, they would have Johnny Depp they're filming, you know,

(30:19):
the lone ranger or something like that, and they would
need a law enforcement presence and security there, so we
would be detailed to do this kind of things. The
band Metallic I did security for one time. You know
a lot of different things. Dignitary protection we did. John
and I did security for the first Navajo woman that

(30:41):
ran for the Naval Presidence presidency when they were campaigning,
you know, out there on the reservation. John and I
were the ones that were her law enforcement security and
dignitary protection. So there there was an incident where there

(31:01):
was too young rangers that were dispatched to her call
that came in. There was an elderly grandmother in what's
known as sheep Camp, which is the high elevation mountain area.
The elders will heard their sheep up into the mountains
during the summer months because up there in the mountains
it's a lot cooler and it's greener. There's a lot

(31:24):
of water and your livestock and grays up there. And
this elderly Navo grandmother had called the department saying that
she witnessed one of these things that people referred to
as a bigfoot had stepped over into her sheep crow
taken one of her sheep and took off with it.

(31:44):
And so there was two young rangers that were assigned
to that particular case. One of these rangers I liked her,
referred to him as a comedian because he's always jokeing,
always left, and always carrying on, you know, It's just

(32:06):
part of his personality. And I think the grandmother overheard
him carrying on back into either the sheep corral or
back to the patrol unit, and I she think she
took offense to this. I think she thought that he
wasn't being serious about the case. So she contacted the
chief rangers back and probably let him have it as

(32:33):
far as a map of a grandmother could. So he
called it. The chief called the department wide meeting and
he said, you know, these cases that we get that
fall under what is known as paranormal or supernatural. He said, yes,

(32:57):
you may not understand it, you may not believe it,
but you will investigate these cases like any other case,
just as professional as you do any other case, because yeah,
you might not believe it, but to these people that
are experiencing it, for the most part, they're traumatized, right,

(33:19):
It's very real to them. And that's what he said,
He said, it doesn't matter whether it's an elderly person
or even a child. You know, it's very real to them.
So you chose to stand behind a badge and gun,
and you chose to do one of two things, and

(33:42):
that's to either help people or in some cases, to
protect people. And he said, you will do that. If
you don't want to do this, there's other jobs that
you can you can do. And he said, we will
do this because these people need help. They are reached
out for help. And for most law enforcement agencies, they
won't touch this stuff with a ten foot pole, but

(34:05):
because it's in a way it's part of the culture,
we will. We would you know, we were going to
help you. And he looked over at me and John
sitting now on the side, and he pointed his finger.
It in YouTube are going to manage these cases. We
should get certain. And that's how it began. You know,
we begin investigating all these different cases that a lot

(34:28):
of them were life changing. They were something out of
you know, in some cases, out of a horm movie.
But one of the things that John and I would
never do was to show fear with these cases. You know,
we've been trained as SWAT officers, and with SWAT, yeah,
there can be an element of fear when there is

(34:50):
someone shooting at you, but you've got to keep your
cool and rely on your training to get you through that.
And that's what we did, is that some of these
cases evolving spirit activity or witchcraft or demonic things, it'll
try to instill fear in me. Yeah, and you just

(35:12):
can't give into that, you know, you have to. John
and I both have had a strong spirituality and faith
in our creators from the time we were little boys,
ever since we were young, and I was able to
growing up in Oklahoma, I disappear off into the woods,
you know, on the weekends and from school, and I

(35:35):
wasn't scared and I would be out there playing until
after it got dark. You know, my mom would be
hollering at me, yelling at me to come in. So
I think that also played a very important role in
in investigating and being into these.

Speaker 1 (35:52):
Yeah, let's get into some of the cases that you
put in the book. One of the ones that really
caught my attention, that's one of the first ones that
you put in the book, is you responded to a
ranch that had sheet mutilations and I think it was
like twenty six sheep.

Speaker 2 (36:09):
Yeah, that was one of the early cases that I took,
even before John and I were assigned to investigate the paranormal.
So the tribe has their own vetinary program, and there
was a veterinarian that was on scene, and I was
dispatched to that location. I get there and the vetinarians there,

(36:31):
and him and I talked, and the family was extremely
upset simply because livestock and in this case sheet are
a very very critical part of their finances and it's
their livelihood. And they woke up to find all twenty
six head of their sheep and the corral dead. And

(36:54):
so in that particular case, when I approached the corral,
as I was approaching the crawl, I could already get
a sense that there was This wasn't just your average case.
There was something felt uh and and even notably there
was the odor. The smell was the sickening, petroleum tinged

(37:20):
smell if you've ever smelled the burning burning tires or
something like that. There was an element to it like that.
There was, and it wasn't normal. They shouldn't have been that,
you know, that wasn't part of I was expecting to find,
you know, a predatory kill. Mountain lions will get into

(37:42):
a corral sometimes to kill mini main sheet and bobcats.
Bobcats are really notorious for killing a whole flock sheet,
you know, simply because of that aggressive bloodluss kind of
thing that goes on with the predatory animal. So I

(38:04):
get up there and I'm looking for the entrols and
the blood, and there's none of that. There's none of that.
All of these sheep within the corral, they're all laying
there on their sides. And I get to looking and
crawl over into the corral and these sheep are slit

(38:26):
from there up near their neck all the way to
their growing in a precise straight line. And that's no
small feet to cut through the wool of these sheep
like that. And this was like, you know, I didn't

(38:46):
know what could cut like that in such a precise
straight line like that, other than maybe some type of
medical laser that you know, would lay open the skin
and the wool like that. And it was just the
strangest thing I've ever experienced when it comes to livestock

(39:06):
in that, you know, I grew up on a ranch
in Oklahoma. My uncle Sarancian he had. You know, I
grew up around cattle, you know, taking care of cattle
on cattle ranching, and I've seen a lot of a
lot of predatory kills and things of livestock, but I'd
never seen anything like that, not the entire sheep population

(39:28):
within the corral and no introls or none of that,
and no blood, and it was the whole thing was
just your mind is trying to wrap around what you're
seeing because it don't make any sense. And the other
thing was the sheep dogs that look after the sheep

(39:49):
wouldn't come anywhere near the corral. They stayed away from
that corral and usually they're right right in there with
the sheep. And the other thing is they also serve
as kind of guardians or sentinels over those animals. So
in the middle of the night, all of a sudden,
you hear the dogs barking like crazy. You got some

(40:11):
predatory animal that's trying to get to the sheet for something.
And that didn't happen. The family wasn't awakened, you know,
throughout the night and until they actually got up in
the morning and went out and found the sheet. All
the sheep did. So that was one of those that
was one of those mutilation livestock mutilation cases that was

(40:35):
kind of bafflinged to me, you know, and everybody that
I knew of that came out to that location that
looked at him, you know, the ved there and he
didn't know, he didn't know what the hell to think
about it, and they just had to end up using
a backdobe and burying all of those live stocks. I

(40:55):
think they might have earned them to I think before
they covered them.

Speaker 1 (41:00):
Yeah. What caught my attention is, like you hear those
stories about you know, maybe one or two cattle mutilations
or something, but not that many at one time.

Speaker 2 (41:08):
That's many all at once. Yeah, that was one of
those cases. It was just mine battling, you know.

Speaker 1 (41:15):
Yeah. Yeah, and all right, you you kind of spend
a lot of time out in the desert area. Yeah. Yeah,
I've heard stories about weird things in the desert, you know,
of course, skinwalkers and things like that. But being out
there alone, did it. Did you ever get i don't know,
spooked out or creeped out in different places like just

(41:35):
the energy was off or or anything like that when
you're out there by yourself.

Speaker 2 (41:39):
There are places where you know, there's obviously places like
Sedona and what is known as Skinwalker Ranch, the Sherman
Ranch up and Burning Utah, where there are different types
of phenomenon that is occurring in those locations. You'll have
odd electromagnetic frequencies and a lot of different energies swirling

(42:03):
in those areas known as hot spots, or they'll have
what known as wartecks and things of that nature. There
are those places that are known to have the strange phenomenon,
strange energy. One of the cases that I worked on
was in an area known by one of the Masons

(42:26):
there is referred to as satan Butte, and there was
an individual there who he was non Indian, but he
was married to not a whole woman, and he lived there.
He taught school in one of the local schools, and
he contacted us and he was experiencing what he referred

(42:50):
to as UFOs and these orbs flying into this mason,
this Satane mason, and he said it was doing it
over and over, you know, and he was trying to
get even his wife's attention that this was happening, and
she didn't really believe him. And he went out and

(43:10):
got a digital camera and he caught pictures of this
thing and he contacted me in John and he was
having also seeing the shape shifting creatures or beings during
that time, and they were disturbing the horses. Things was,

(43:31):
objects were coming around disturbing the livestocks. And so there
are those areas like that. And later on I found
that particular location of that investigation was on the same
longitude as the Skinwalker Ranch location. So kind of puzzling,

(43:52):
you know, trying to makes you wonder. People talk talk
about lay lines and things of that nature. You know,
there's books written on it. You never know, maybe there
is something to that.

Speaker 1 (44:03):
Yeah. I had the pleasure of talking to uh gentlemen
who owns the ranch that butts up the Skinwalker Ranch.
Oh yeah, and uh space Wolf research. I think this
is just stuff and yeah, they you know, it's not
just Skinwalker Ranch. It's kind of that entire area, true
and there and there's there's other areas like that around

(44:24):
the world. I mean, you got Laskan Triangle and all
these other triangles we talked about all the time. Ryan
Burns was his name that I talked to the ranch
next door, but he he had some incredible things happening
as well. They do.

Speaker 2 (44:36):
It's not just the ranch, it's it's that whole region
up there has unusual energy and phenomenon about it. You know.
I've been John and I have both been on that
uh figures of Skinwalker Ranch television series and the Beyond
Skinwalker Rants series. And I know for myself, you know,

(44:59):
over the years investigating and this stuff that whether it
was already there or whether it's more developed today. Having
investigated all of this stuff, I'm sensitive to it. You know.
I can. I can go into a building that's uh
it's said to be haunted, and I can tell if

(45:20):
that energy inside the building is negative or if it's
just neutral or BEDGN or positive energy. See, I can
sense that. And when John and I walked the grounds
of Skinwalker Ranch, we were afforded to travel wherever we

(45:42):
wanted to on the ranch, and and there's definitely energies
there and some are more notable than in places than others.
But even in the outside area too, Like you said,
there's there's places around that area have the same kind
of phenomenon occurring. They're pretty interesting.

Speaker 1 (46:06):
I guess you developed these over the years. But what tools.
Did y'all necessarily have to like help people because I know,
you know you're talking about going out and investigating these things.
I mean, did you have people that that you could,
you know, send them to. Yeah, whether it be medicine
men or other people come out and clear the land
or you know, help them in different ways.

Speaker 2 (46:26):
Well, John and I are not, and never claim to
have been medicine men or shaman or any of that.
We have relatives and friends who are medicine men. And
I have a good friend that shaman that's not Navaho

(46:47):
that and these people are the ones we turned to
when it's obvious that there is some type of activity
going on, and we'll refer to victims or people are
experiencing this to those individuals and let them, you know,
work out what it is they need to do. And

(47:10):
John and I really, for the most part, we're there
to try to validate that something's going on, something is
of a paranormal supernatural nature and not just a natural
phenomenon life rate on gas or something of that nature
that's naturally occurring.

Speaker 1 (47:33):
And we're like mental health issues or exact.

Speaker 2 (47:36):
Mental health issues, you know, whatever it could be that
could be the root cause of what people are experiencing.
So we try to go in, you know, we're investigators.
We were trained as there was a law of federal
law enforcement training programs and centers as criminal investigators. So

(47:58):
over the years we had worked with like Robert Bigelow's
investigators with Bigelow Aerospace, they had investigators that assisted this
on a number of cases. Plus we turned to like
move On and the International UFO Congress. You know, their

(48:18):
people have been investigating these phenomenons for a long long time,
and we turned to them for their expertise, you know,
in the very beginning in how to handle these kind
of cases because it's not in the law enforcement manual.
The kind of had to modify your investigative techniques and

(48:39):
what worked in law enforcements doesn't mean that it's always
going to work investigating the paranormal or UFOs or whatever.
And so we began working with them. But when we
first reached out to them, the people would move On.
When they found out the investigations they were doing, they
were like, oh my god, you guys have to put

(49:01):
together a presentation and we would invite you to be
speakers for our monthly group that we that we come
together for Mutual UFO Network, and we were kind of
taken back by it. You know, that wasn't that was
never our intent to get into that full genre of

(49:24):
speaking about this stuff. But we did put together a
PowerPoint and we presented it to the Mutual UFO Networks
Monthly Monthly group. And when we did it was it
was standing room only. I mean, the house was packed,

(49:45):
and and the reception we got at the end was
just you know, a standing ovation in that and we
were kind of shocked. And but we knew that people
were interested in it. You know, people had a curiosity
with this stuff, and we could say that with some
of these cases, they were real, these phenomenon were unexplainable,

(50:08):
and and so yeah, it led to today you and
I talked team and yeah, now I have a book
that I've written that's coming out October first, the Paranormal Ranger,
and I've only investigative search for the unexplained. So it's
kind of surreal. I had to pinch myself. You know.

(50:31):
The heads of HarperCollins Publishing had watched television episode John
and I had done with Netflix called Unsolved Mischief, and
when they watched that, the heads contacted me and John.
They said, oh my god, we watch your episode. We

(50:51):
want to help you published books based on that. I
jumped on it. I jumped on it, and I worked
at it diligent and so coming out very soon.

Speaker 1 (51:03):
Yeah, and and congratulations on being on the New York
Times top top books to read this fall. That's awesome.

Speaker 2 (51:11):
Yeah. Again, I had to pinch myself almost. Yeah, I'm
excited about it.

Speaker 1 (51:19):
Yeah, I was. I was really excited to get the
one of the one of the person my job that
I see because I read a lot of books because
I have a lot of authors, and the fun is
is getting the the proofs, you know, from the authors
that other people don't get. I think that's pretty neat.
And oh, yeah, you get to read it before. Yeah,
I've had the book for like two months already, so
I've been itching to talk to you. Yeah, and and

(51:40):
to get the episode episode out. But yeah, it's I'm glad.

Speaker 2 (51:44):
It worked out. Yeah, I'm glad it worked out.

Speaker 1 (51:46):
And and I think, you know, so many people are
interested in it because you don't hear a lot of
law enforcement officers anywhere talk about, you know, the paranormal cases.

Speaker 2 (51:54):
And they're out there twenty four to seven, So they
do experiences that. Yeah, it's just the department's policy is
not to be talking about it and addressing yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (52:05):
Yeah. And and also I think it's a it's a
credibility thing, you know, that don't want their credibility called
in a question because they're reporting paranormal things.

Speaker 2 (52:13):
You know, in some cases that's true. Yeah, it does happen.

Speaker 1 (52:17):
Yeah, And and for you to be in a unique
position because of you know, the beliefs of the Navajo
and in it being you know, part of the culture. Yeah. Yeah,
but people need to go out and grab the book.
There are amazing stories in there. And and uh, I
always enjoy seeing seeing you and John both on Skinwalker
Ranch uh and and then on Unsolved Mysters is great.

(52:39):
And anything that I that I see y'all on it's
just a fascinating stuff. And yeah. Also, I mean, you
you gather evidence for some of these, like you've had
pictures and you know, and and it's not just all
conjecture and things you know, or or or just personal experiences.

Speaker 2 (52:55):
I had four coins of port here in my house
within the last three weeks. So yeah, and that original
case was in two thousand and nine.

Speaker 1 (53:04):
Wow.

Speaker 2 (53:04):
And it's still happening to me this very day, even
in my bedroom where the coins will materialize out of
the area and I just collect them, bag them day
and time them. And I've got a huge bag of
coins today today, over the years. And it can happen anywhere.
It happened when I traveled to Scotland and Canada, and

(53:25):
it could happen anywhere.

Speaker 1 (53:26):
Wow.

Speaker 2 (53:26):
And it's pretty amazing.

Speaker 1 (53:27):
Yeah. Yeah, So the book is out October first, and
of course it being Amazon, barn and Noble and anywhere
else fine books are sold. I'll have all those links
in the show notes. And is there anywhere anywhere that
people can connect to you if they want to directly
connect to social media?

Speaker 2 (53:44):
Well, there is a podcast that being Jonathan Dover and
Michelle Minors do called Native Paranormal Crossroads. You can find
that on YouTube and you can reach us through that,
and the Paranormal Rangers there's a website. So yeah, you
can reach out to this and you know, maybe we

(54:06):
could you and I and get together and do a
part two. There's a lot more information.

Speaker 1 (54:11):
Yeah, yeah, for sure. I enjoy that. All right, Stan,
thank you so much for coming on the show. I
really appreciate it.

Speaker 2 (54:18):
You're very welcome. Nice to meet you.

Speaker 1 (54:20):
Yeah, very nice to meet you as well. All Right, everybody,
y'all stay safe out there, have a good day. We'll
see you next time.

Speaker 2 (54:25):
Thank you, everybody.

Speaker 1 (54:28):
Thank you for listening to the Unseen Paranormal. Join me
next Wednesday with a brand new guest, and please rate, review, share,
subscribe on Apple, Spotify or wherever you're listening right now.
This helps more people discover the show. You can connect
with me over on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, or join us
in the Unseen Paranormal Lounge group on Facebook. Until next time,
remember some of the scariest things for Unseen who I've

(55:05):
can bear yours.

Speaker 2 (55:10):
You pass you on the side as a bike hide sideway.

Speaker 1 (55:23):
There's God and that whereas

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