April 28, 2023 • 52 mins
In this episode, Maddy and Julian sit down with Andrea Burns who plays Miguel’s mother and Norm Lewis who plays the wizard Ciprian.
They talk about Andrea’s longtime friendship with actress Katie Finneran who plays Lindsey’s mom, some of her favorite moments on set, and an emotional scene from this episode that ended up getting cut.
Then they talk with Norm Lewis about what it’s like playing a video game wizard, how he keeps his beautiful voice healthy and full, and whether or not he’s ever partaken in mushrooms.
And as always, they talk about the songs in episode 6 with songwriters and creators Bobby Lopez and Kristen Anderson-Lopez.
From Straw Hut Media
They talk about Andrea’s longtime friendship with actress Katie Finneran who plays Lindsey’s mom, some of her favorite moments on set, and an emotional scene from this episode that ended up getting cut.
Then they talk with Norm Lewis about what it’s like playing a video game wizard, how he keeps his beautiful voice healthy and full, and whether or not he’s ever partaken in mushrooms.
And as always, they talk about the songs in episode 6 with songwriters and creators Bobby Lopez and Kristen Anderson-Lopez.
From Straw Hut Media
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Straw Hut Media.
Speaker 2 (00:03):
Who are the voices in your head?
Speaker 3 (00:06):
Definitely my mother?
Speaker 4 (00:07):
Oh my god, my mother? Yes, did you put lipsti
gom before you left the house. I have live glass
on right now and this is going to be an
audio recording.
Speaker 3 (00:14):
Do you understand?
Speaker 4 (00:17):
But I and I had to put some lipt glass
on for an up here interview even though no one
will see it.
Speaker 5 (00:30):
Welcome to the up Here down Low, the official companion
podcast to Hul's musical rom com up Here. We're your hosts,
Madison Cross.
Speaker 6 (00:38):
And Juline Goze, two friends and theater kids.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
You're the Baker to my Baker's wife.
Speaker 6 (00:42):
And you're the Roxy to my Velma.
Speaker 5 (00:44):
And we're here to look behind the scenes with cast,
crew and creators on making musical TV Magic.
Speaker 6 (00:50):
Musical TV Magie.
Speaker 2 (00:52):
I told you not to sing.
Speaker 7 (01:02):
On today's episode, we sit down with Andrea Burns, who
plays Miguel's mother, and norm Lewis, who plays the wizard Cyprian.
Speaker 6 (01:08):
We'll talk about Andrea's longtime friendship with actress Katie Finnrin,
who plays Lindsay's mom, some of her favorite moments on set,
and an emotional scene from this episode that ended up
getting cut.
Speaker 7 (01:18):
Then we'll talk with Norm Lewis about what it's like
playing a video game Wizard, how he keeps his beautiful
voice healthy in full, and whether or not he's ever
partaken in mushrooms.
Speaker 6 (01:27):
Plus we'll hear from songwriters and creators Bobby Lopez and
Christian Anderson Lopez in our song segment.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
But first, let's start with a little recap.
Speaker 8 (01:45):
Put on the shoes to tap. Its time for the cap.
Speaker 6 (01:52):
Alright, Hello, hello, Maddie.
Speaker 2 (01:54):
Hello, episode six.
Speaker 6 (01:57):
It never gets old saying hello to you.
Speaker 2 (01:59):
Hello.
Speaker 5 (02:00):
Oh so episode six Armor, Armor, I mean we love
this episode.
Speaker 6 (02:08):
Yeah, this was a fun episode.
Speaker 2 (02:09):
Well, first, it opens with our grease like number.
Speaker 6 (02:12):
Where he's singing about putting in only what he's willing
to lose.
Speaker 5 (02:17):
Right and his head, the people in his head are
telling him, like, you're moving too fast. Then finds out
that she has to move. Suddenly turns out that they
weren't subletting, they were squatting in that apartment.
Speaker 6 (02:29):
New York is just so chaotic.
Speaker 2 (02:31):
Yeah, So as he's trying to say he doesn't want
to you know, they're trying to not move so fast,
she immediately has to crash with him.
Speaker 6 (02:40):
Yeah, which is stressful.
Speaker 5 (02:42):
I think, especially like you're in a new relationship, you
don't really want to be living together immediately, and he
obviously doesn't want that because then you also like feel
like you're in someone else's space, especially.
Speaker 2 (02:53):
Because he lives with his dad.
Speaker 5 (02:54):
So she's also got this block on her children's book
that she's trying to write, and she worked shops it
in front of a bunch of kids who have notes.
It's like, is it a squid or a squirrel?
Speaker 6 (03:08):
They're like the industry suits.
Speaker 2 (03:09):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (03:10):
And also she doesn't have like illustrations obviously because this
is just a traffic yes, so she's like just picture,
which is sometimes the funnest part.
Speaker 5 (03:18):
And then Miguel is struggling because he's got this big
pitch on bringing in this juice money, and the juice
guy is like, you're not passionate.
Speaker 6 (03:27):
Yeah, you're not striking me as a Snapple killer, Like
I need a Snapple killer.
Speaker 5 (03:31):
Which is also kind of Miguel's narrative that we're learning
is that he's given up a lot of his passion,
like he had for video games and drawing and things,
because he had a vision for his life that didn't
include like struggling, which.
Speaker 6 (03:46):
By the way, that wizard that we thought was Snape
a few episodes back, he's back in this acid Cyprian,
which is so similar to Snape Verry.
Speaker 2 (03:55):
So she's got a block.
Speaker 5 (03:58):
He needs to find more passion about juice and he
comes home. She's there, and when she was trying to
workshop her book in front of the kids, the children's
author that was supposed to do a reading did show up,
and he tells her that to get rid of his
writer's block, he took something called psilocybin and gives her some,
(04:21):
and Miguel accidentally takes a sip of that tea, not
just a sip, a full on gulp.
Speaker 6 (04:27):
I love these different children's author archetypes that we've been seeing.
Speaker 2 (04:30):
Yeah, totally like the weird sex pervert, and then this
guy and.
Speaker 6 (04:34):
This guy who's like essentially like William Burrows. There's like,
he's such a freaky like country writer. Yeah, Cormick McCarthy
up in here.
Speaker 5 (04:42):
And so the two of them embark on a little
mushroom trip and neither of them have done it before.
Then Miguel goes out into the living room and discovers
his video game The Legend of Miguel, which was so fun,
and he's like totally referencing like Zelda. Yes, he's giving
full Super Nintendo.
Speaker 2 (05:01):
But his whole journey what we learn on this Wizard
takes him on this journey and he ends up going
to his office, which we were like, is this in
his head or is this real? Which we'll get to that.
Speaker 6 (05:10):
But each level he's confronted by someone from his past, yes.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
And he's saying, I feel nothing.
Speaker 6 (05:15):
And each time he says that to that person, he
gets a new piece of armor. Yes, and they disappear yes.
Speaker 5 (05:20):
And so what the narrative of that is telling us
is that he has just ignored his feelings for so long,
lost his passion, lost his ability to feel from like
losing his mom and all these things, because he's just
built up this armor to try and keep it all together.
Speaker 8 (05:38):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (05:39):
And so he's pretty much going level by level confronting
all these people. So by the time he gets to
the last level, it's Lindsay, Yeah, and he's like totally
in like a Knight's in like a suit of armor
with like the little cage over his face.
Speaker 2 (05:52):
And he realizes that Lindsay is like this sort of
key to helping him be more vulnerable.
Speaker 6 (05:59):
And while she's tripping, her ex husband's Ned, who we
speculated possibly gay, emerges from her closet. Yeah, even though
she thinks it's it's Miguel's deal yogurt, which we just
love that we.
Speaker 5 (06:13):
Just love, Yeah, And he emerges and is like, well,
it's because you're rooting for this monster character that you
can't write you're a monster, and.
Speaker 6 (06:24):
Then he points out to her the suitcase in the corner.
Speaker 5 (06:27):
I also don't even think that she's told him about
leaving the fiance and her whole family behind and all
these different things, Like she's definitely got some skeletons in
there that she's not telling him about.
Speaker 6 (06:40):
Right, And Ned pretty much comes out right and it's
like I am your block.
Speaker 5 (06:43):
Yeah, Like you need to be more honest about this
past of yours and what you left behind. And I
think it's so easy to just not want to share
your baggage with someone else because you're afraid that they'll
leave you. And that's totally her fear, because when they
come out of their hallucination, he's like, I realize, like
(07:06):
I just need to take off all this armor. And
she doesn't tell him about.
Speaker 6 (07:13):
Yeah, she was like, I didn't really feel much of anything.
Speaker 5 (07:15):
Because she's afraid of giving her baggage. She doesn't want
to be honest.
Speaker 6 (07:19):
There is like a paradox in that where you're like, Okay,
I'm going to like keep all of my baggage close
to the vest so that way I don't scare them away. Yeah,
but how could he ever hope to actually have a meaningful,
in depth relationship romantically with someone without showing them what's
in the suitcase.
Speaker 2 (07:36):
It's really hard.
Speaker 6 (07:37):
Yeah, And so he goes to the office the next morning.
Speaker 2 (07:39):
Well, no, then he gets a call from the office saying,
you got to come back, and we find out that
he actually did go to the office while he was
hallucinating and taking his pants offs.
Speaker 5 (07:50):
Taking off his armor, literally took off his clothes to
be passionate about juice.
Speaker 6 (07:56):
But I loved it.
Speaker 2 (07:58):
Apparently it went really well.
Speaker 6 (08:00):
We'll find out be a straight man and a corporate environment.
Anytime I take off my pants, they run for the hills.
Speaker 2 (08:08):
Yeah, the take security. I got some questions you. It's
time for the interview.
Speaker 7 (08:20):
So I know we've said it before, but we also
said it to her. Julian knew Andrea Burns back in
his days as a young student of the theater.
Speaker 6 (08:28):
Well, Andrea, I'm not sure you remember me, because you
had me like twelve years ago at Adler. At Adler,
I was class of twenty thirteen, trying to think of
who was in my group that maybe would ring bells,
like will Sarat, Katie Wilmore.
Speaker 3 (08:43):
Yeah, because Katie Wilmore was my YU student too. Oh
my god.
Speaker 6 (08:48):
So I was I audibly gasped when Maddie and I
were watching the show and you popped up. I was like,
that's not try. So it's delightful to reconnect.
Speaker 3 (08:59):
Yeah, oh my god, I'm so happy to reconnect with you.
This is great.
Speaker 5 (09:02):
He was just like singing your praises when we were
watching and just He's like, Oh.
Speaker 2 (09:07):
She's the best, she's the best teacher.
Speaker 3 (09:10):
Thank you.
Speaker 4 (09:11):
We we really had a wonderful time at Adler. And yeah,
I'm so glad. I love I love seeing my students
like working in the field because that's the that's the
whole plan, is just to just breed wonderful humans and
artists to be working with in the future.
Speaker 6 (09:28):
So it's my pleasures.
Speaker 4 (09:29):
That we're collaborating on this, I'm thrilled.
Speaker 5 (09:32):
Well to continue about collaboration. We thank you so much
for sitting down with us. How did you get involved
in the project?
Speaker 2 (09:42):
How did it come to you?
Speaker 4 (09:44):
Well, you know, I know Tommy Kale since in The
Heights we worked on the development of that musical as
well as the off Broadway and Broadway runs. So yeah,
it was a really exciting thing to know that, you know,
that was in the works and I and I read
for the whole team because I know Kristen and Bobby
(10:04):
had done demos for them back in the day.
Speaker 3 (10:07):
And yeah, I was thrilled.
Speaker 4 (10:10):
Basically I would have done anything to work with this,
you know, amazing group of people. And yeah, so it
was such a delight. Tommy and I have a great
relationship and I have always looked forward to every collaboration,
you know, we have, like post Heights. So this was
I'm so so happy that this we connected on this one.
(10:33):
And yeah, I would go I just do whatever they
were doing. Honestly, I love Tommy so much.
Speaker 6 (10:39):
That's totally understandable. Yeah, it's a dream team for sure. Well,
so a little Bertie told us. So when I say
a little Bertie, I mean Tommy cale that you've known
Katie since you were like fourteen, and he also said
you were all over pen Pals. So I have a
lot of questions around that, like give us, give us
the origin story pals.
Speaker 3 (10:58):
Penn Pals is not a thing.
Speaker 6 (10:59):
No, Okay, I was like, were they at like different camps, Like.
Speaker 3 (11:04):
What is it important to tell the truth? Isn't that
the theme of today's show? No, we actually were.
Speaker 4 (11:12):
We went to different junior high schools, okay, in the
Miami area, and we would see each other these like
you know, state competitions and district competitions, and we when
we were fourteen, we spent a week at a music
camp on the campus of University of Miami, and we
were pretty inseparable then, just discovering that we were both
(11:36):
so into this and so obsessed with musicals and acting
and and so that happened then and we started a friendship.
But then by the time we were I think sixteen,
the performing Arts school in Miami, the New World School
of the Arts opened. We were in the first We
(11:58):
weren't the first, we're the first middle child of that
high school. We were juniors the year that it opened,
and so we went into it saying, oh my goodness,
now we're actually going to be in high school together,
studying theater.
Speaker 3 (12:10):
This is dreams come true.
Speaker 4 (12:11):
So basically from that day on, we were inseparable, and
we you know, we moved to New York around the
same time, and before either of us were married or
even in a relationship where we're like each other's spouse,
you know, one always made sure the other one was
fed and clothed and housed and taken to the doctor.
(12:33):
Like we really looked out for each other. And it's
been just a beautiful thing to be celebrating this friendship
through our marriages, through our kids who know each other.
And also, I mean so thrilling when we were doing
Broadway shows in the same season, because we'd meet at
somebody's dressing room and we'd order in together and say,
oh my gosh, you know we did this, but we
(12:55):
have never actually worked together. So this was outrageous to
get a TV series where we play the moms when
you know, I think, deep down, I think we both
consider ourselves about maybe around seventeen years old. It's where
we met, so it's kind of the way we act
(13:15):
when we're together.
Speaker 3 (13:16):
But that's just been an unbelievable gift.
Speaker 4 (13:19):
And you know, if you're talking about proud parents, both
sets of parents were just plot sing, absolutely freaking out
watching us on TV together.
Speaker 2 (13:29):
And how did that come to be? How did was
it just happenstance.
Speaker 4 (13:33):
Or Tommy nail, Tommy cale He's got tricks up his sleeve,
Tommy Calee. So yeah, I mean clearly he you know,
is an advocate of what both of us do. But
I think he knew that and he was really excited
to put us together.
Speaker 6 (13:54):
So but obviously you knew she was going to be
in it before like the initial read through or was
that like an honest Okay.
Speaker 4 (14:00):
We spoke on the phone, We screamed, we freaked out,
we were very excited.
Speaker 8 (14:04):
Oh nice.
Speaker 3 (14:05):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (14:06):
So do you have a favorite moment in the series
or a favorite song?
Speaker 4 (14:11):
I mean, I think they're all great. I mean, speaking
of something I am not a part of. I loved
chapter two. I love when Lindsay is writing, you know,
deciding that what she's going to what she's going to write,
and what she's not going to write. And I love
the way this version of herself that is the writer
(14:32):
is watching the couple herself as a couple in New
York City. I thought that was so beautifully, beautifully done.
But all the songs are good, are you kidding? I mean,
I love the theme song quite frankly, I can never
know you. It's such it's such a hook, and it's
so much fun. Yeah, but I love everything. I mean,
I love all the stuff I get to do with
(14:55):
with Carlos. I mean, that's the real fun of it,
and watching him try to navigate conversations with May Whitman,
who plays Lindsay while all of us are screaming at
him as fun.
Speaker 6 (15:08):
And he's also from Miami, right.
Speaker 4 (15:11):
He's also from Miami too, Yes, so we got three
h five.
Speaker 3 (15:15):
In the house.
Speaker 4 (15:16):
We are fully representing now in the musical theater scene.
Speaker 3 (15:20):
Whereas Katie and I.
Speaker 4 (15:21):
Were pioneers trailblazers back in the day, but now we
are really seeing a great representation of Miami artists in
New York.
Speaker 2 (15:30):
Can you share with us some memorable moments from being
on set?
Speaker 3 (15:35):
Of course, so much fun.
Speaker 4 (15:36):
Like Katie and I anytime we were on set together,
which was not often because unfortunately, you know, we live
in separate realities on the show, but when we were
there at the same time just camping out and having
lunch in our trailers and laughing and saying, Oh my god,
can you believe we're doing this together. But also something
(15:56):
that was really fun was because of the time period,
the early nineties sort of late eighties vibe of it.
I certainly got into costume and looked in the mirror
and said, oh my god, this is my mother. I
am literally looking at my when I was a teenager.
This is what my mother looked like. And it was
so great to have someone there like Katie who knew
(16:17):
what my mother looked like then, who was able to say,
Oh my god, you are your mom right now.
Speaker 3 (16:23):
This is so wild. So that was really fun.
Speaker 6 (16:26):
And so Katie said that you reminded her of your mom,
which begs the question, what are some of the similarities
and differences between Rosie and your own mom.
Speaker 3 (16:37):
My mother?
Speaker 4 (16:38):
I would say a similarity is my mother is protective
in the sense that she will always attack anyone she
feels does not value me. She will go into attack mode,
like what do they know anyway? You know, I don't
like that person. I don't think they really, you know,
have value to who you are, so she doesn't deserve
(16:59):
you that kind of stuff comes from my mom. But
the you're the best, I'm so proud of you definitely
comes from my dad. And I had I was really lucky.
Speaker 3 (17:09):
Who is Jewish?
Speaker 4 (17:10):
You know, I'm half Jewish and my mom is from Venezuela.
But my dad is like, full on you know Brooklyn
jew And I said to Tommy Klee too, I was like,
this is the Latina Jewish mother. Because Jewish moms always
think their sons are the greatest things to walk the earth,
and my dad certainly felt that way about me.
Speaker 3 (17:30):
I feel that way about my son.
Speaker 4 (17:34):
In fact, I saw Lin Manuel the other day at
the screening and he was like, uh, Andrea burns in
my mind telling me like I'm the best and I'm
a genius. He's like, I mean, ask your son and me.
We've lived with it our whole lives and we have
no problem with it. So yes, I tend to be
a cheerleader.
Speaker 8 (17:54):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (17:54):
I have a lottin mother from Cuba, and it's a
very similar thing. She's very quick to be like, oh,
your enemy is my enemy. Even before I've decided that
person's my enemy, She's like, that's your enemy. I'm like,
all right, I guess oh wait.
Speaker 3 (18:07):
But wait, who yet?
Speaker 4 (18:08):
If your mother, then do you make up with that
person and the mother can't get over it? Your mom
can't get over it?
Speaker 6 (18:15):
Yes, I have that too.
Speaker 3 (18:18):
I'm like, I know you all are good now, but.
Speaker 4 (18:20):
It's going to take me some time, Thank you very much.
Don't bring them around.
Speaker 6 (18:24):
Yeah, it's like I've forgiven them, mom, surely that should
be easy for you too. And she's like, I'm your mother,
I'm your protector.
Speaker 8 (18:30):
You know.
Speaker 3 (18:30):
That's right.
Speaker 6 (18:31):
Someone's got to be.
Speaker 3 (18:32):
Yeah, that's right, someone's got to be. That's our job.
Speaker 9 (18:36):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (18:36):
Julian was relating a lot to that dynamic and the
part where she's like smart smart, smart smart, like tak
smart over.
Speaker 6 (18:43):
And over again.
Speaker 8 (18:44):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (18:45):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (18:45):
I mean she's so proud of him, and I love
that and I think it's all so important that he
has that voice of hope and protection in his head.
So often we listen to the negative ones, right, but
it's nice to know that we do have the voices
of people who have stood up for us in the past,
Like they're in there, and maybe we can pay a
(19:05):
little bit more attention to those and'd say, tell, you know,
tell them you're sat score you know, tell them, tell
them how smart you are. Obviously, you know, we get
embarrassed and cringe when our parents say stuff like that,
but at the same time we do we value having that,
having that in our minds and in our pockets and
moments of uncertainty.
Speaker 5 (19:27):
That's perfect lead into something we've been asking everyone, which is,
who are the voices in your head?
Speaker 4 (19:33):
You know what, Katie and I were talking about this
the other day. We're in the middle of a bunch
of interviews, and I turned to her and I said,
I think you're one of the voices in my head,
you know, just like May has her friend from from
growing up. There's certain things like, yeah, there was like
something recently that I wanted to sign my initiation my
(19:53):
email with just my initial, and I remembered her voice going,
you don't do that for people who don't really know you.
You can't just sign a like that's for like your friends,
that's for people who know you. And so I discovered
I was like, I don't do that because her voice
is always in my head saying that, which.
Speaker 3 (20:09):
Is like, they don't deserve for you to just put
an initial.
Speaker 4 (20:11):
I don't even know what that means. But that's in there.
That's the thing from Katie that's in there. Definitely my mother.
Oh my god, my mother. Yes, did you put lipstick
on before you left the house. I have live glass
on right now and this is going to be an
audio recording.
Speaker 3 (20:25):
Do you understand?
Speaker 4 (20:28):
But I and I had to put some lip glass
on for an up here interview even though no.
Speaker 3 (20:34):
One will see it.
Speaker 4 (20:36):
So yeah, that's my mom and uh yeah.
Speaker 3 (20:41):
What else?
Speaker 8 (20:42):
I don't know?
Speaker 3 (20:44):
Let me think.
Speaker 4 (20:45):
Well, I also try to keep you know, I have
a married to somebody I really adore and really respect,
Julian you know him, Peter Flynn.
Speaker 3 (20:55):
He's a director and educator.
Speaker 4 (20:56):
And and he's someone who always will say things when
I'm nervous about something or I don't have enough time,
He'll say something like, you know what burns always delivers,
and that that's something that I keep in my head
when I get nervous, like right, he always tells me
that it's true.
Speaker 3 (21:15):
It's true.
Speaker 4 (21:16):
So no matter how crazy it seems right now, that's
that's a little rock.
Speaker 3 (21:20):
That's a little thing I hold on to.
Speaker 6 (21:23):
Yeah, Maddie, if you could call me by my last
name to hype me up from time to time, I'll
be very appreciative of that. I'll take nodes girl, even
though that is totally Katie.
Speaker 4 (21:34):
Yeah, yeah, I mean it's it's good to focus on
the ones. We all have the negative ones, but it's
really important to dig deep and say.
Speaker 3 (21:42):
Yeah, but what are the ones?
Speaker 4 (21:43):
Who are the people that just thinking about them makes
me feel really good about myself, And try to remember
some of the things that they've said to you, because
it's it's what we it's the fuel we need to
to function in this world and to function. Well, what's
the Maya Angelou quote? People will never remember what you
(22:03):
did or what you said, only how you made them feel.
Speaker 8 (22:06):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (22:06):
So I'm a big believer in that, and I really
try to make people feel good.
Speaker 2 (22:11):
Do you see aspects of yourself in any of the
other characters.
Speaker 3 (22:15):
Well, sure, I see aspects of myself.
Speaker 4 (22:18):
In Miguel in wanting to do the right thing, wanting
to make the smart decision, putting my eyes on a
prize that I think everybody else may value, but also
feeling very uneasy in the particular kind of environment sometimes
that requires I'm speaking about, like you know, those scenes
(22:40):
in the bank when he's with those guys who By
the way, Michael and Adam are the nicest, sweetest boys
you can possibly imagine.
Speaker 3 (22:49):
They play these.
Speaker 4 (22:50):
Horrible bro type guys and with like the sense of
humor of a twelve year old. And they are mature, creative,
delicious artists. And I love them and I always like
to say that about them because they've played these crazy parts.
But the roles they play, you know, seem to also
speak to so much game playing and lying and hustling
(23:11):
that you have to do to make it to achieve
all of the prizes that we think are important, right
the money, the penthouse, then you know, the super job.
And I have always been ambitious and I've you know,
wanted to raise to the top of my field. But
I have never been somebody who is comfortable as a
(23:31):
hustler who just sort of get I don't know, I
just find I find his uneasiness and that something that
I relate to. I relate to, but then also wanting
to make his mom proud, I relate to that too.
Speaker 2 (23:42):
Can you tell us a little bit about that normousy
and that got cut? What was that about?
Speaker 4 (23:47):
Yeah, well, he was going through there's Miguel is facing
different things that make him that are challenging to him
and have caused him to put on more emotional armor.
And it was all actually leading up to a scene
with me in the hospital actually, so we had this
very tender moment and scene there that you'll have to
(24:10):
ask the producers, but they just decided they didn't want
to stick with My feeling is yeah, I don't know.
I have different theories about it. But it was a
fantastic you know, it was a very long day, but
it was fantastic to be with Norm who is a
dear friend who is just absolutely hilarious and was just
(24:32):
holding court there. He didn't know a lot of the
people on the set that day, and he could just
walk into a room full of strangers and say, what's
your favorite song. We're all going to listen to it,
play it on his phone, we're all going to sing it, We're.
Speaker 3 (24:43):
All going to like.
Speaker 4 (24:44):
He's incredible that way. So he made that day especially fun,
which is really hard, by the way, for a guest
star to do because everyone's kind of got their own rhythm.
And then I've been a guest star many times. You
just come in and you feel a little bit sometimes
like you're approaching the lunch table, like we're all the
cool kids are and you're like, no, nah, you guys
are good. I'll just be I'll just sit over here,
(25:05):
right And just because you don't know everybody and you
don't want to presume anything, That's how I feel. But
Norm just came in and took over and it was delicious, delicious.
Speaker 6 (25:21):
We're going to take a quick break when we come back.
We have the special treat of listening to Norm Lewis's
velvety baritone as we talk about the differences between performing
on stage versus on screen, his video game skills, and
his own experiences with matching mushrooms.
Speaker 5 (25:48):
So I just have a few questions about the show.
So how did you get involved an audition?
Speaker 8 (25:53):
No, no, it wasn't an audition. I think I had
seen the Lopezes at an event that was for them
at Carnegie Hall and we've known each other. But but yeah,
they we were at dinner of that particular celebration and
they said something to me. It was like, you'll probably
(26:14):
be hearing from us soon. So and then there you go,
that's what happened.
Speaker 2 (26:18):
How ominous. Yeah, so there's you know, your character is
a big video game element. And you happen to be
a video gamer yourself.
Speaker 8 (26:26):
I can play pack man. I'm old school. I never
really learned how to do you know, the manipulation of
the those things, I can't even I don't even know
they're called. But I've seen other people do it, and
I admire it.
Speaker 2 (26:41):
I'm with you. I also have no idea how any
of that works.
Speaker 5 (26:45):
So most of the voices in Miguel's had our people
from his life. How do you approach playing like a
video game character though, who's just a figment of the imagination,
there's no history.
Speaker 8 (26:57):
Well, I think that you know when people create, because
I'm created by him. I think when people create anything,
it's from their subconscious, it's from their environment that they've
you know, they're reflecting in some way. But I feel
like I'm part of his subconscious, you know, something that
he has been struggling with for a little bit, and
just the confidence in himself and all of that. So
(27:19):
I think he's talking to himself, but it's through me.
Speaker 2 (27:22):
And do you have a favorite memory from set?
Speaker 8 (27:25):
God, there's so many, because there was you know, there's
a lot of routine, like moving around, the manipulation around
the buildings, and stuff, and just wearing that cape was
kind of cumbersome, so we had to make sure that
people were out of the way, equipment was out of
the way, so we didn't knock anything over. But it
(27:46):
was just you know, being on set with a lot
of good friends. You know, we don't get a chance
to see each other a lot because we're in shows
and you know, Broadway shows or just different theater shows.
But when you come together on set, it's kind of
like a nice little reunion.
Speaker 2 (28:02):
And how do you approach acting on screen versus when
you're on stage, Well.
Speaker 8 (28:08):
This is different, I would say. Normally, with stage, you know,
you're trying to hit the back of the theater and
you're using your voice and the whole thing. But with
television and film, it's a little bit more intimate. And
I just remember when I first started doing television, someone
told me that they gave me the grace of like saying, okay,
you can bring it down. You're a theater actor. You
have a voice, Your voice booms, so just bring it
(28:30):
down just a little bit. But with this show, you know,
it's so theatrical and it's so melodramatic that you know,
I think we I think we were hired just because
we are big theater theater people.
Speaker 2 (28:43):
What is your favorite role that you've played on stage?
Speaker 8 (28:46):
Oh god, I get this question a lot, and I
know it sounds like a cop out, but I love
all of them. I mean it's like, you know, I
don't have children, but if it's like if I had kids,
you can't love one more than the other. I will
say that I'm best known for some you know, Porgy
and Bess and Phantom and Le Miz, you know Javert.
But I remember reflecting on a character that I played
(29:09):
back in the nineties. I did. I had four lines
and it was off Broadway. It was a show called
Captain's Courageous And because of the research that I did
for this character, I felt very prideful, and every time
I said those four lines, I was so happy.
Speaker 5 (29:24):
I was actually watching this morning, I watched you singing
stars and just incredible. Do you have any like vocal
secrets of how you keep your voice so healthy and powerful?
Speaker 8 (29:35):
Well, you're very kind. I appreciate that. I will say
that it's a lot of rest, a lot of hydration,
you know, when I'm doing a show, like when I
did Fantom. Not that I'm a big, you know, alcoholic drinker,
but I stayed away from alcohol for nine months. It just,
I said, I just don't want to take the chance.
It can dry you out, It sometimes can make you
vulnerable to get sick. So I just stayed away from
(29:57):
it and with that show because as it is so exposed,
your voice is so exposed. I try not to talk
too much during the day and you know, not use
my voice for some random kind of thing. Even on
the phone. I would text people and say, look, I
can't talk right now. But yeah, I try to be
as disciplined as possible. But definitely sleep and hydration.
Speaker 2 (30:19):
Those are good tips.
Speaker 8 (30:21):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (30:21):
Do you have a favorite song from up here?
Speaker 8 (30:24):
God? I mean I love listening to everybody, you know,
Brian Stokes, Mitchell, Andrea Burns. I mean, it's the voices
were so amazing. Got Well, I'll just choose my song.
It was fun singing it and I had to sing
it so many times, so yeah, I'll choose that one.
Speaker 2 (30:43):
Yeah, it's a great song.
Speaker 5 (30:45):
So in the episode, your character is a reaction to
a mushroom trip, so feel free to you know, have
I ever been on.
Speaker 8 (30:56):
The mushroom troop? Is that the question. You know, it's
funny because I've always wanted to try mushrooms because I
remember being I've been in Amsterdam now a couple of
times and I was a little too nervous to try it.
But I was at a friend's house in Vegas, and
you have to be with people. I think you have
(31:16):
to be with people that understands that journey. And a
friend of mine, I know that some people drink a
tea and some people just eat it straight. This person
made a lemonade from it, and that was a more
palatable thing for me to take. And I drank it,
and I will say, yeah, I felt good. I felt
really good. It wasn't a strong dose, let's put it
(31:38):
that way. You know. I didn't see walls moving in
and out, but I felt really really good, and I
would do that again.
Speaker 2 (31:44):
I just did it for me.
Speaker 5 (31:45):
I was always really scared too, and I just did
it for the first time, like a year ago, and
it was like a chocolate and I was like, oh,
this is great.
Speaker 2 (31:54):
I don't know what I was so scared of exactly exactly.
I didn't see any sort of wizard coming to me,
and I didn't know that far.
Speaker 8 (32:03):
Maybe I didn't come to your head.
Speaker 5 (32:04):
I didn't go no, no, maybe next time, next time
and tell us more about So the song the Quest,
it's about him sort of trying to get rid of
this armor that he's built up.
Speaker 2 (32:18):
Can you relate to sort of that feeling that Miguel
is having.
Speaker 8 (32:21):
Yeah, you know, the thing about it is that we
all put on these masks in society when we're all
in public and we're trying to be our best selves.
And some people are truly their best selves because they've
done the work and they've you know, gone to therapy
and they've done some of the spiritual journeys and stuff.
But a lot of us are still just trying to
fit in. And I think, you know, he is basically
(32:45):
just just trying to shed that armor, you know, of
to find himself, to find himself. I know that there
have been I've been in certain rooms where I felt like, oh,
this person's a little bit smarter than I am, so
I have to kind of pull up or this person
personal exptter than I do. You know. So I think
we go around life with masks on and then but
(33:07):
it's easier said than done to try to shep that
that armor and just be your true self.
Speaker 2 (33:13):
Yeah, definitely, And so the hope is obviously that there
will be a season two of up Here. Do you
see a future for your character?
Speaker 8 (33:23):
Listen, I'm open to anything. I know that there was
a figurine or some sort of artwork of me in
one of the scenes, and you know, I'm one of
the I'm one of his creations. So yeah, I might.
I think I might. I didn't get destroyed, let's just
put it that way. I might make an appair, and
I'm a wizard, so even if I did, I can always.
Speaker 6 (33:41):
Pop back there you go.
Speaker 5 (33:45):
What was the mechanics of filming that scene. You were
saying that the set was sort of like moving around
they're taking away pieces. Can you tell me a bit
more about that.
Speaker 10 (33:54):
Yeah.
Speaker 8 (33:54):
We were in an office building and now I'm forgetting
where we were, but we were in an office building,
and because I had a cape, it was definitely I
mean this there were real cubicles, and there were you know,
it was all set up because I think we just
kind of just took over this this one company's office,
and so we had to just make sure that the
cameras were in the right position. I was in the
(34:16):
right position, Miguel was in the right position, and whoever
else was you know in that scene, and they took
different angles just to see which one would be best
suited for editing and everything. So it was just a
lot of that, and you know, you expect you expect
that kind of thing, but but no, it was fun.
And then also the music playing in the background, if
I can be heard all of that stuff, so it's just, uh,
(34:39):
it's it's it becomes a team, and you want to
make sure that you win.
Speaker 2 (34:43):
Do you sing along when they're playing the song or
do you just sort of lipsnk it?
Speaker 8 (34:47):
No? No, I sing I sing along because I think
it just there's an authenticity to movement of the mouth
and breathing and all that kind of stuff. So I
always try to.
Speaker 2 (34:57):
Sing along, I think.
Speaker 5 (34:58):
So, yeah, I agree with that they whenever they call
out like a pop star for lip singing, and I
was like, well, they're probably singing anyway, like you know,
they're probably doing a little bit of both, right, right.
So we heard about this sort of up here university
where it was like upstairs there was a recording studio
and then downstairs was filming.
Speaker 2 (35:17):
Was there did you have that experience or was years different.
Speaker 8 (35:21):
No, mine was pretty much the same. But we that
one scene where we were in the office that was
that would that was definitely a real office like I
was saying before. But then there was another scene we're
in the elevator that was that was actually built on set,
and so we were able to make sure that the
doors open correctly in the whole thing, but it was
also someone making sure that the fog was coming up
(35:43):
and they were inside and so they were kind of
stuck in the corner like that so they wouldn't be
seen by the camera. But yeah, I did the recording
I guess maybe a week or so before, and then
afterwards we came down and we got on this huge
set out there and did our thing. There was another
(36:04):
set that was built for another office and hallways that
we had to go through. So if you remember there's
armor that's being put on in one scene, like he's
putting armor on, he's putting armor on, he's putting a
shield on, and it just keeps building up on him.
That was another thing that we had to deal with too,
(36:25):
to make sure that what's the word I'm looking for
that every time we did it, we did it the same.
I can't think of the terminology right now, but there's
a person on set to make sure that your watch
is that at the right.
Speaker 2 (36:37):
Time and continuity.
Speaker 8 (36:39):
Continuity, that's the word I was looking for. Yeah, yeah,
so that was That was a long day, but it
was fun. You know, I get to sing all day.
Speaker 2 (36:49):
Have you worked with and it's such a powerhouse team
of musical theater legends. Have you worked with anyone before
that's part of the production.
Speaker 8 (36:59):
The only thing. The only person I've worked with before
was Andrea Burns. We did a couple of concerts together.
Other than that, you know, still Brian Stokes, Mitchell and
I are friends and we've been on you know, we're
part of Black Data United, so we're on a lot
of the same boards. But no, we've never actually done
a show together. And I've always wanted to work with
(37:19):
him because he's so amazing and I'm trying to think
who else has been in the show that there was
so many great people, but Andrew Burns is like the
only person I've actually had it, like, you know, a
real thing with.
Speaker 2 (37:30):
We're speaking with Brian.
Speaker 5 (37:31):
I think next week, are there any questions that we
should ask him?
Speaker 8 (37:38):
Well, a lot of well, yeah, sure, I'll go for it.
People get us confused, really they do. It's really interesting.
And we look nothing alike, nothing alike, and I guess
we have similar voices, but we look nothing. And people
have told me that they thought I was great in
(37:59):
a show that he did, and he said the same
thing has happened to him. And he's actually gotten a
fan mail of mine from Sideshow because they thought he
was in it. So it's just it's a weird phenomenon.
But listen, if anyone thinks I sound like Brian Stokes Mitchell,
(38:20):
I am so honored by that because he has a
glorious voice.
Speaker 5 (38:24):
Yeah, it's definitely. That's so funny. I feel like that
happens my dad is. My dad's a musician. His name's
Christopher Cross. Oh and yeah, I love that guy. Yeah,
he's a great guy.
Speaker 2 (38:36):
He's my dad. I got one of his records behind me.
Speaker 8 (38:40):
That's okay.
Speaker 2 (38:41):
Yeah, But he always the person that he gets mixed up.
It's not because of his voice. It is because they
look alike. Is Kyle Gas from Tenacious D? Yes, and
so people will go up to my dad and be like,
I love Tenacious.
Speaker 6 (38:58):
D, and you like, so do I nice?
Speaker 5 (39:02):
Like they're great guys. And I met Kyle Gass once
and I told him who my dad was. He's like
everybody always comes up to me and he's like, I
love you Christopher Cross or so you know.
Speaker 8 (39:10):
You know, they should do something together. They actually should
do like a thing a collab. Yeah, that would be great.
Speaker 2 (39:16):
That would be pretty great.
Speaker 5 (39:18):
So one last question, do you have any sort of
like you know, you're a guide.
Speaker 2 (39:23):
Do you have any wizard guides in your life?
Speaker 8 (39:25):
Do? I no, but I would say that I would
give some good advice, and I would just anyone, doesn't
matter what if you're going to try to be in
this industry or whatever industry you're in, just try to
find who you are. Just find a self awareness, whether
that be through spirituality or something. You know that you
(39:47):
have to realize there's something bigger than you. Whether you
believe it's in you or whether you believe it's outside
of you, it's something bigger than you. And just try
to find the truth in that and just stay strong,
Just stay you know, try to find out who you are.
Speaker 7 (40:05):
It's time for another quick break. When we come back,
we talk about the songs in episode six, Falling in
Love and The Quest with songwriters and creators Kristin Anderson
Lopez and Bobby Lopez.
Speaker 11 (40:28):
Hold on to your thumb, it's time to talk about songs.
Speaker 6 (40:41):
Naddie and I are strum enthusiasts.
Speaker 5 (40:43):
We dabble, We dabble the entire time we were watching it.
It's like, oh no, don't tell him, it's going to
be about to just let you know, keep order a sandwich.
Speaker 2 (40:54):
Like, but that's not where we start.
Speaker 5 (40:58):
We start with Falling in Love, which I felt was
like so grease, so uh felt like very inspired by
Maybe that's incorrect, but no.
Speaker 1 (41:08):
No, you're exactly right. It's inspired by the fifties and
the eighties, back when people were like dancing as fast
as they could, so you know, it has a little
bit of rama. Lama Lama kadingad ding Dong with also
Katrina and the Waves.
Speaker 9 (41:22):
Right that we were slightly inspired by the music video
for Tell Her About It, Right.
Speaker 1 (41:29):
Yes, the music video for Tell Her About It is
also just it's like magnic and that's sort of that
feeling of not wanting to stop moving so that you
don't go deep when you when when you get into
a relationship. But you've been hurt, and it's so much
(41:49):
easier to just keep things breezy, keep it, keep it breezy,
but keep it going, but keep it breezy. And then
someone is trying to get you to like, you know,
I'm going to share this. I'm going to disclose this.
Now you disclose something and you're like, h, let's go
to the movies.
Speaker 10 (42:04):
Because falling in love is like placing off that how
much you pull it in affects how much you get.
I've been burned before, so this time I'll choose to
only pull it in when I'm willing to lose. Low stakes,
no mess, and I guess I'm okay with falling in love.
Speaker 6 (42:32):
Falling in.
Speaker 9 (42:36):
We'll backing it up for a bit. The originally wrote
a different song for the slot, but this was the
hardest slot to get right. We wrote, We wrote many
different things. We wrote a song called something to Lose,
which was almost like a motown song, was like, now
I've got something to lose, so I'm gonna keep things.
I'm gonna keep things distant. And I'm not sure that
(42:56):
everybody liked that song, so we cut it out and
we wrote another song called falling in Love. But it
wasn't the version you know it was. It was almost
like a French waltz, like an Elliott Smith song, kind
of like a sad, melancholy kind of and you'll hear
it at the end of the episode on the soundtrack,
(43:17):
it's the credits bit. You'll hear it at the end.
But then people were like, that's that's a bummer that
it just feels like Miguel is constantly being negative.
Speaker 8 (43:29):
We can, we can.
Speaker 9 (43:30):
We started with some enthusiasm, so we took I mean,
the song that you would never believe in a million
years could be a fast, happy song, and somehow it
became one. We just sped the fuck out of it.
Speaker 1 (43:42):
Hey and found Sony found this amazing jitterbug.
Speaker 8 (43:48):
Oh yeah.
Speaker 1 (43:49):
That that sort of helped us bring it to life.
And there was something else I was going to say,
but it's gone.
Speaker 9 (43:57):
There was also another one that, like the was there
were some scenes that you'll you will see sort of
at the beginning and at the end of it, which
we thought maybe they'd go in the middle, but it
was one of those and that's how we wrote the thing.
But we try to impost a zillion different ways, and
we realized like, oh no, the song kind of needs
to live as at some thing and the scenes can
go at the beginning. In the end, it was just like,
(44:18):
this is the way you make a musical and TV.
You would never do it that way on stage or
in an animated sequence, but you know, before you executed it,
you'd know exactly what you wanted it to be.
Speaker 8 (44:29):
But this is how you make TV.
Speaker 1 (44:31):
I found what I was going to say, which is,
if you're looking at the meta musical of the eight episodes,
the act break is I feel like I've always known
you woulds That's where you would have had intermission and
people would go pee and get raised nets or like
double vodkas, depending on or both. And this this song
(44:56):
is the opening of Act two where needs to feel,
you know. It is like couldn't be happier? Right, it's
the everything's happy, but is it really? It has to
do that hard job of saying there's more to come
and so it took us a few cracks, but I
think we found it. And then come.
Speaker 3 (45:18):
The shrooms.
Speaker 2 (45:21):
With the sexiest older man alive, Norm Lewis. Another audible gasp, Yeah,
another audible gasp. Jillian was like, oh my.
Speaker 9 (45:30):
Stuff, well, we had just prior to starting pre production
on up Here, we did a concert at Carnegie Hall
of all of our songs, and normally this wasn't in it.
But he was at the party and we didn't really
know norm but he came up to us and gave
us a big hug and he started singing he was.
(45:54):
He hugged us and then he started singing our favorite
song that he does from the Rather Be Silly Yes,
And we just felt this resonance coming from him right
against right up against our skin.
Speaker 8 (46:09):
It was like this beautiful, weird, erotic moment.
Speaker 6 (46:15):
I need to take a break here.
Speaker 1 (46:18):
That song is by William Finn.
Speaker 9 (46:21):
I'd Rather be Sick. I'm sorry, I always have to
do that whenever I think about it.
Speaker 1 (46:25):
But that song is by William Finn, who I lied
about interviewing, just tying it back. The part of this
song that you should know is that Bobby and I
have never done shrooms, like really honestly. We were raised
in Nancy Reagan Just Say No Time, and we thought
that we would go insane if we did drugs, then
(46:48):
our brain would cook like an egg like the commercial.
Speaker 9 (46:53):
It worked on us and did our parents, so we
didn't learn it from watching them, no commercial.
Speaker 1 (47:00):
At least there were some people in the writer's room
who had dune rooms.
Speaker 2 (47:03):
You can always trust a writer's room that somebody, somebody
if not micro dosing right now.
Speaker 1 (47:11):
And what we did know, especially Bobby and I will
so I'll stop talking. But what Bobby knows a lot
about is video game music and anything having to do
with and any kind of Lord of the Rings or
Star Wars kind of epic sty fi fantasy.
Speaker 8 (47:32):
Yeah.
Speaker 9 (47:32):
I love that stuff, as who doesn't.
Speaker 1 (47:35):
And I'm not a young numismatist.
Speaker 8 (47:40):
You wouldn't think.
Speaker 11 (47:41):
It, but yes, very feelings we don't obtain in thy
Shield and sword stormy, evil squear, beauty by Lord Man's
quick to fight, a strong.
Speaker 8 (48:00):
Ball den dealing to night.
Speaker 9 (48:04):
And so I always wanted to do an eight bit
and play with an eight bit plug in, and so
I got one and just had a ball.
Speaker 8 (48:23):
Like we started. I started.
Speaker 9 (48:25):
I rolled like twelve or thirteen themes, which we got
pared down to like maybe three or four.
Speaker 1 (48:31):
That's true. Yeah, Bobby just started the Other thing that's
so amazing about my husband is that he is constantly
on it. He's constantly in dialogue with music, in some
way just in his own life. So almost for every
birthday or or Christmas, I get him a new instrument
(48:51):
because it just makes him come alive, and he likes
to explore it and see, like, let's take this baby
out for a spin. And he found this eight bit
plug in that he just started in like all of
his off time, you know, whether he's like on the
toilet or up early before us or whatever, he was
playing with his eight bit plug in and and just
(49:13):
seeing like, oh, what can I make?
Speaker 3 (49:14):
What can I make?
Speaker 1 (49:15):
So he truly wrote an hour of eight bit opera
music that got cut down to what this song is?
Speaker 3 (49:25):
What is it called?
Speaker 6 (49:26):
The question?
Speaker 8 (49:27):
That's right.
Speaker 1 (49:27):
I'm not great with titles, especially of my own music,
because we've called it so many things.
Speaker 9 (49:34):
Well, and this one is so different than all the
other ones because all the other ones are essentially in
song form their AA ba or you know, some variation
of that, and they are mostly self contained. This one
is split up over you know, there's a there's another
scene in between two of the sections. There's uh, you know,
(49:54):
there's different themes, there's you know, there's different moments within it.
I wanted it to feel like an epic journey and
be reflected in it's in its structure, so uh and
I wanted it to have like a legend of Zelda
kind of feeling and all that stuff, putting there's a
little bit of Mario in there that I don't know.
Speaker 6 (50:11):
We yeah, my my memories of a Supernintendo were came
back to me.
Speaker 1 (50:16):
Oh yeah, yeah. This was a bear of an episode
to crack. There was something about episode six that just
got rewritten and got rewritten. In this song too got
rewritten and rewritten. But uh and even in post we
were sort of figuring out what's staying, what's going, what
do we need to reveal of Miguel and what what
(50:39):
can still be hidden?
Speaker 9 (50:40):
And the maybe you know fun fact the little reprise
of falling in love at the end where he's taking
off the armor that that's falling in love in the melody,
but the accompaniment is I Am Not Alone. The tune
if I'm Not Alone is playing in the background, So
if you catch.
Speaker 1 (50:59):
That from the brilliant mind of Robert Lopez, just to
let the notes there though I wrote the lyrics.
Speaker 6 (51:15):
Thanks for listening. If you want to reach out to
us and share a moment where you could have burst
into song. Email us at up Here at straw hutmedia
dot com. If you like the show, please rate, review
and share with your friends. See you next week.
Speaker 5 (51:33):
Up Here down Low is a straw Hut Media production.
It's hosted by Madison Cross and Julian Goza. The show's
produced by Ryan Tillotson and Maggie Bulls.
Speaker 2 (51:42):
Our associate producers are.
Speaker 5 (51:43):
Lydia McMahon, Javier Salas, and Jean Lee. Our editor is
Daniel Ferreira. Big thanks to everyone at Hulu, including Kristin
Anderson Lopez and Bobby Lopez for their help putting the
show together.
Speaker 6 (52:01):
Okay, this is also a very like She's also a question,
but I have to ask because speak I'm pretty sure
I heard it from Katie when we were your students.
But is your cousin Gavin du Graus?
Speaker 4 (52:12):
Yes, my cousin is Gavin de Grau, Yes, singer, songwriter, superstar,
Yes he is. Yes he is on my father's side,
my non Latino side. But yes, I'm very proud to
call him my cousin. And he has been singing and
writing songs since he was a little boy.
Speaker 3 (52:28):
Amazing.
Speaker 8 (52:28):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (52:30):
Julian was like, oh, my God, and her cousin is
Gavin du Grau.
Speaker 3 (52:33):
And I was like, what, that's so random, but it's not.
Speaker 2 (52:37):
He was so so sure about it. We'll have to
ask her.
Speaker 4 (52:40):
Yeah, definitely, definitely. He's like once removed, So my first
cousin who was older than me is his mom.
Speaker 6 (52:49):
Wow, it runs in the family. That's so cool.
Speaker 3 (52:51):
Yeah,
Straw Hut Media.
Speaker 2 (00:03):
Who are the voices in your head?
Speaker 3 (00:06):
Definitely my mother?
Speaker 4 (00:07):
Oh my god, my mother? Yes, did you put lipsti
gom before you left the house. I have live glass
on right now and this is going to be an
audio recording.
Speaker 3 (00:14):
Do you understand?
Speaker 4 (00:17):
But I and I had to put some lipt glass
on for an up here interview even though no one
will see it.
Speaker 5 (00:30):
Welcome to the up Here down Low, the official companion
podcast to Hul's musical rom com up Here. We're your hosts,
Madison Cross.
Speaker 6 (00:38):
And Juline Goze, two friends and theater kids.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
You're the Baker to my Baker's wife.
Speaker 6 (00:42):
And you're the Roxy to my Velma.
Speaker 5 (00:44):
And we're here to look behind the scenes with cast,
crew and creators on making musical TV Magic.
Speaker 6 (00:50):
Musical TV Magie.
Speaker 2 (00:52):
I told you not to sing.
Speaker 7 (01:02):
On today's episode, we sit down with Andrea Burns, who
plays Miguel's mother, and norm Lewis, who plays the wizard Cyprian.
Speaker 6 (01:08):
We'll talk about Andrea's longtime friendship with actress Katie Finnrin,
who plays Lindsay's mom, some of her favorite moments on set,
and an emotional scene from this episode that ended up
getting cut.
Speaker 7 (01:18):
Then we'll talk with Norm Lewis about what it's like
playing a video game Wizard, how he keeps his beautiful
voice healthy in full, and whether or not he's ever
partaken in mushrooms.
Speaker 6 (01:27):
Plus we'll hear from songwriters and creators Bobby Lopez and
Christian Anderson Lopez in our song segment.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
But first, let's start with a little recap.
Speaker 8 (01:45):
Put on the shoes to tap. Its time for the cap.
Speaker 6 (01:52):
Alright, Hello, hello, Maddie.
Speaker 2 (01:54):
Hello, episode six.
Speaker 6 (01:57):
It never gets old saying hello to you.
Speaker 2 (01:59):
Hello.
Speaker 5 (02:00):
Oh so episode six Armor, Armor, I mean we love
this episode.
Speaker 6 (02:08):
Yeah, this was a fun episode.
Speaker 2 (02:09):
Well, first, it opens with our grease like number.
Speaker 6 (02:12):
Where he's singing about putting in only what he's willing
to lose.
Speaker 5 (02:17):
Right and his head, the people in his head are
telling him, like, you're moving too fast. Then finds out
that she has to move. Suddenly turns out that they
weren't subletting, they were squatting in that apartment.
Speaker 6 (02:29):
New York is just so chaotic.
Speaker 2 (02:31):
Yeah, So as he's trying to say he doesn't want
to you know, they're trying to not move so fast,
she immediately has to crash with him.
Speaker 6 (02:40):
Yeah, which is stressful.
Speaker 5 (02:42):
I think, especially like you're in a new relationship, you
don't really want to be living together immediately, and he
obviously doesn't want that because then you also like feel
like you're in someone else's space, especially.
Speaker 2 (02:53):
Because he lives with his dad.
Speaker 5 (02:54):
So she's also got this block on her children's book
that she's trying to write, and she worked shops it
in front of a bunch of kids who have notes.
It's like, is it a squid or a squirrel?
Speaker 6 (03:08):
They're like the industry suits.
Speaker 2 (03:09):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (03:10):
And also she doesn't have like illustrations obviously because this
is just a traffic yes, so she's like just picture,
which is sometimes the funnest part.
Speaker 5 (03:18):
And then Miguel is struggling because he's got this big
pitch on bringing in this juice money, and the juice
guy is like, you're not passionate.
Speaker 6 (03:27):
Yeah, you're not striking me as a Snapple killer, Like
I need a Snapple killer.
Speaker 5 (03:31):
Which is also kind of Miguel's narrative that we're learning
is that he's given up a lot of his passion,
like he had for video games and drawing and things,
because he had a vision for his life that didn't
include like struggling, which.
Speaker 6 (03:46):
By the way, that wizard that we thought was Snape
a few episodes back, he's back in this acid Cyprian,
which is so similar to Snape Verry.
Speaker 2 (03:55):
So she's got a block.
Speaker 5 (03:58):
He needs to find more passion about juice and he
comes home. She's there, and when she was trying to
workshop her book in front of the kids, the children's
author that was supposed to do a reading did show up,
and he tells her that to get rid of his
writer's block, he took something called psilocybin and gives her some,
(04:21):
and Miguel accidentally takes a sip of that tea, not
just a sip, a full on gulp.
Speaker 6 (04:27):
I love these different children's author archetypes that we've been seeing.
Speaker 2 (04:30):
Yeah, totally like the weird sex pervert, and then this
guy and.
Speaker 6 (04:34):
This guy who's like essentially like William Burrows. There's like,
he's such a freaky like country writer. Yeah, Cormick McCarthy
up in here.
Speaker 5 (04:42):
And so the two of them embark on a little
mushroom trip and neither of them have done it before.
Then Miguel goes out into the living room and discovers
his video game The Legend of Miguel, which was so fun,
and he's like totally referencing like Zelda. Yes, he's giving
full Super Nintendo.
Speaker 2 (05:01):
But his whole journey what we learn on this Wizard
takes him on this journey and he ends up going
to his office, which we were like, is this in
his head or is this real? Which we'll get to that.
Speaker 6 (05:10):
But each level he's confronted by someone from his past, yes.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
And he's saying, I feel nothing.
Speaker 6 (05:15):
And each time he says that to that person, he
gets a new piece of armor. Yes, and they disappear yes.
Speaker 5 (05:20):
And so what the narrative of that is telling us
is that he has just ignored his feelings for so long,
lost his passion, lost his ability to feel from like
losing his mom and all these things, because he's just
built up this armor to try and keep it all together.
Speaker 8 (05:38):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (05:39):
And so he's pretty much going level by level confronting
all these people. So by the time he gets to
the last level, it's Lindsay, Yeah, and he's like totally
in like a Knight's in like a suit of armor
with like the little cage over his face.
Speaker 2 (05:52):
And he realizes that Lindsay is like this sort of
key to helping him be more vulnerable.
Speaker 6 (05:59):
And while she's tripping, her ex husband's Ned, who we
speculated possibly gay, emerges from her closet. Yeah, even though
she thinks it's it's Miguel's deal yogurt, which we just
love that we.
Speaker 5 (06:13):
Just love, Yeah, And he emerges and is like, well,
it's because you're rooting for this monster character that you
can't write you're a monster, and.
Speaker 6 (06:24):
Then he points out to her the suitcase in the corner.
Speaker 5 (06:27):
I also don't even think that she's told him about
leaving the fiance and her whole family behind and all
these different things, Like she's definitely got some skeletons in
there that she's not telling him about.
Speaker 6 (06:40):
Right, And Ned pretty much comes out right and it's
like I am your block.
Speaker 5 (06:43):
Yeah, Like you need to be more honest about this
past of yours and what you left behind. And I
think it's so easy to just not want to share
your baggage with someone else because you're afraid that they'll
leave you. And that's totally her fear, because when they
come out of their hallucination, he's like, I realize, like
(07:06):
I just need to take off all this armor. And
she doesn't tell him about.
Speaker 6 (07:13):
Yeah, she was like, I didn't really feel much of anything.
Speaker 5 (07:15):
Because she's afraid of giving her baggage. She doesn't want
to be honest.
Speaker 6 (07:19):
There is like a paradox in that where you're like, Okay,
I'm going to like keep all of my baggage close
to the vest so that way I don't scare them away. Yeah,
but how could he ever hope to actually have a meaningful,
in depth relationship romantically with someone without showing them what's
in the suitcase.
Speaker 2 (07:36):
It's really hard.
Speaker 6 (07:37):
Yeah, And so he goes to the office the next morning.
Speaker 2 (07:39):
Well, no, then he gets a call from the office saying,
you got to come back, and we find out that
he actually did go to the office while he was
hallucinating and taking his pants offs.
Speaker 5 (07:50):
Taking off his armor, literally took off his clothes to
be passionate about juice.
Speaker 6 (07:56):
But I loved it.
Speaker 2 (07:58):
Apparently it went really well.
Speaker 6 (08:00):
We'll find out be a straight man and a corporate environment.
Anytime I take off my pants, they run for the hills.
Speaker 2 (08:08):
Yeah, the take security. I got some questions you. It's
time for the interview.
Speaker 7 (08:20):
So I know we've said it before, but we also
said it to her. Julian knew Andrea Burns back in
his days as a young student of the theater.
Speaker 6 (08:28):
Well, Andrea, I'm not sure you remember me, because you
had me like twelve years ago at Adler. At Adler,
I was class of twenty thirteen, trying to think of
who was in my group that maybe would ring bells,
like will Sarat, Katie Wilmore.
Speaker 3 (08:43):
Yeah, because Katie Wilmore was my YU student too. Oh
my god.
Speaker 6 (08:48):
So I was I audibly gasped when Maddie and I
were watching the show and you popped up. I was like,
that's not try. So it's delightful to reconnect.
Speaker 3 (08:59):
Yeah, oh my god, I'm so happy to reconnect with you.
This is great.
Speaker 5 (09:02):
He was just like singing your praises when we were
watching and just He's like, Oh.
Speaker 2 (09:07):
She's the best, she's the best teacher.
Speaker 3 (09:10):
Thank you.
Speaker 4 (09:11):
We we really had a wonderful time at Adler. And yeah,
I'm so glad. I love I love seeing my students
like working in the field because that's the that's the
whole plan, is just to just breed wonderful humans and
artists to be working with in the future.
Speaker 6 (09:28):
So it's my pleasures.
Speaker 4 (09:29):
That we're collaborating on this, I'm thrilled.
Speaker 5 (09:32):
Well to continue about collaboration. We thank you so much
for sitting down with us. How did you get involved
in the project?
Speaker 2 (09:42):
How did it come to you?
Speaker 4 (09:44):
Well, you know, I know Tommy Kale since in The
Heights we worked on the development of that musical as
well as the off Broadway and Broadway runs. So yeah,
it was a really exciting thing to know that, you know,
that was in the works and I and I read
for the whole team because I know Kristen and Bobby
(10:04):
had done demos for them back in the day.
Speaker 3 (10:07):
And yeah, I was thrilled.
Speaker 4 (10:10):
Basically I would have done anything to work with this,
you know, amazing group of people. And yeah, so it
was such a delight. Tommy and I have a great
relationship and I have always looked forward to every collaboration,
you know, we have, like post Heights. So this was
I'm so so happy that this we connected on this one.
(10:33):
And yeah, I would go I just do whatever they
were doing. Honestly, I love Tommy so much.
Speaker 6 (10:39):
That's totally understandable. Yeah, it's a dream team for sure. Well,
so a little Bertie told us. So when I say
a little Bertie, I mean Tommy cale that you've known
Katie since you were like fourteen, and he also said
you were all over pen Pals. So I have a
lot of questions around that, like give us, give us
the origin story pals.
Speaker 3 (10:58):
Penn Pals is not a thing.
Speaker 6 (10:59):
No, Okay, I was like, were they at like different camps, Like.
Speaker 3 (11:04):
What is it important to tell the truth? Isn't that
the theme of today's show? No, we actually were.
Speaker 4 (11:12):
We went to different junior high schools, okay, in the
Miami area, and we would see each other these like
you know, state competitions and district competitions, and we when
we were fourteen, we spent a week at a music
camp on the campus of University of Miami, and we
were pretty inseparable then, just discovering that we were both
(11:36):
so into this and so obsessed with musicals and acting
and and so that happened then and we started a friendship.
But then by the time we were I think sixteen,
the performing Arts school in Miami, the New World School
of the Arts opened. We were in the first We
(11:58):
weren't the first, we're the first middle child of that
high school. We were juniors the year that it opened,
and so we went into it saying, oh my goodness,
now we're actually going to be in high school together,
studying theater.
Speaker 3 (12:10):
This is dreams come true.
Speaker 4 (12:11):
So basically from that day on, we were inseparable, and
we you know, we moved to New York around the
same time, and before either of us were married or
even in a relationship where we're like each other's spouse,
you know, one always made sure the other one was
fed and clothed and housed and taken to the doctor.
(12:33):
Like we really looked out for each other. And it's
been just a beautiful thing to be celebrating this friendship
through our marriages, through our kids who know each other.
And also, I mean so thrilling when we were doing
Broadway shows in the same season, because we'd meet at
somebody's dressing room and we'd order in together and say,
oh my gosh, you know we did this, but we
(12:55):
have never actually worked together. So this was outrageous to
get a TV series where we play the moms when
you know, I think, deep down, I think we both
consider ourselves about maybe around seventeen years old. It's where
we met, so it's kind of the way we act
(13:15):
when we're together.
Speaker 3 (13:16):
But that's just been an unbelievable gift.
Speaker 4 (13:19):
And you know, if you're talking about proud parents, both
sets of parents were just plot sing, absolutely freaking out
watching us on TV together.
Speaker 2 (13:29):
And how did that come to be? How did was
it just happenstance.
Speaker 4 (13:33):
Or Tommy nail, Tommy cale He's got tricks up his sleeve,
Tommy Calee. So yeah, I mean clearly he you know,
is an advocate of what both of us do. But
I think he knew that and he was really excited
to put us together.
Speaker 6 (13:54):
So but obviously you knew she was going to be
in it before like the initial read through or was
that like an honest Okay.
Speaker 4 (14:00):
We spoke on the phone, We screamed, we freaked out,
we were very excited.
Speaker 8 (14:04):
Oh nice.
Speaker 3 (14:05):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (14:06):
So do you have a favorite moment in the series
or a favorite song?
Speaker 4 (14:11):
I mean, I think they're all great. I mean, speaking
of something I am not a part of. I loved
chapter two. I love when Lindsay is writing, you know,
deciding that what she's going to what she's going to write,
and what she's not going to write. And I love
the way this version of herself that is the writer
(14:32):
is watching the couple herself as a couple in New
York City. I thought that was so beautifully, beautifully done.
But all the songs are good, are you kidding? I mean,
I love the theme song quite frankly, I can never
know you. It's such it's such a hook, and it's
so much fun. Yeah, but I love everything. I mean,
I love all the stuff I get to do with
(14:55):
with Carlos. I mean, that's the real fun of it,
and watching him try to navigate conversations with May Whitman,
who plays Lindsay while all of us are screaming at
him as fun.
Speaker 6 (15:08):
And he's also from Miami, right.
Speaker 4 (15:11):
He's also from Miami too, Yes, so we got three
h five.
Speaker 3 (15:15):
In the house.
Speaker 4 (15:16):
We are fully representing now in the musical theater scene.
Speaker 3 (15:20):
Whereas Katie and I.
Speaker 4 (15:21):
Were pioneers trailblazers back in the day, but now we
are really seeing a great representation of Miami artists in
New York.
Speaker 2 (15:30):
Can you share with us some memorable moments from being
on set?
Speaker 3 (15:35):
Of course, so much fun.
Speaker 4 (15:36):
Like Katie and I anytime we were on set together,
which was not often because unfortunately, you know, we live
in separate realities on the show, but when we were
there at the same time just camping out and having
lunch in our trailers and laughing and saying, Oh my god,
can you believe we're doing this together. But also something
(15:56):
that was really fun was because of the time period,
the early nineties sort of late eighties vibe of it.
I certainly got into costume and looked in the mirror
and said, oh my god, this is my mother. I
am literally looking at my when I was a teenager.
This is what my mother looked like. And it was
so great to have someone there like Katie who knew
(16:17):
what my mother looked like then, who was able to say,
Oh my god, you are your mom right now.
Speaker 3 (16:23):
This is so wild. So that was really fun.
Speaker 6 (16:26):
And so Katie said that you reminded her of your mom,
which begs the question, what are some of the similarities
and differences between Rosie and your own mom.
Speaker 3 (16:37):
My mother?
Speaker 4 (16:38):
I would say a similarity is my mother is protective
in the sense that she will always attack anyone she
feels does not value me. She will go into attack mode,
like what do they know anyway? You know, I don't
like that person. I don't think they really, you know,
have value to who you are, so she doesn't deserve
(16:59):
you that kind of stuff comes from my mom. But
the you're the best, I'm so proud of you definitely
comes from my dad. And I had I was really lucky.
Speaker 3 (17:09):
Who is Jewish?
Speaker 4 (17:10):
You know, I'm half Jewish and my mom is from Venezuela.
But my dad is like, full on you know Brooklyn
jew And I said to Tommy Klee too, I was like,
this is the Latina Jewish mother. Because Jewish moms always
think their sons are the greatest things to walk the earth,
and my dad certainly felt that way about me.
Speaker 3 (17:30):
I feel that way about my son.
Speaker 4 (17:34):
In fact, I saw Lin Manuel the other day at
the screening and he was like, uh, Andrea burns in
my mind telling me like I'm the best and I'm
a genius. He's like, I mean, ask your son and me.
We've lived with it our whole lives and we have
no problem with it. So yes, I tend to be
a cheerleader.
Speaker 8 (17:54):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (17:54):
I have a lottin mother from Cuba, and it's a
very similar thing. She's very quick to be like, oh,
your enemy is my enemy. Even before I've decided that
person's my enemy, She's like, that's your enemy. I'm like,
all right, I guess oh wait.
Speaker 3 (18:07):
But wait, who yet?
Speaker 4 (18:08):
If your mother, then do you make up with that
person and the mother can't get over it? Your mom
can't get over it?
Speaker 6 (18:15):
Yes, I have that too.
Speaker 3 (18:18):
I'm like, I know you all are good now, but.
Speaker 4 (18:20):
It's going to take me some time, Thank you very much.
Don't bring them around.
Speaker 6 (18:24):
Yeah, it's like I've forgiven them, mom, surely that should
be easy for you too. And she's like, I'm your mother,
I'm your protector.
Speaker 8 (18:30):
You know.
Speaker 3 (18:30):
That's right.
Speaker 6 (18:31):
Someone's got to be.
Speaker 3 (18:32):
Yeah, that's right, someone's got to be. That's our job.
Speaker 9 (18:36):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (18:36):
Julian was relating a lot to that dynamic and the
part where she's like smart smart, smart smart, like tak
smart over.
Speaker 6 (18:43):
And over again.
Speaker 8 (18:44):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (18:45):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (18:45):
I mean she's so proud of him, and I love
that and I think it's all so important that he
has that voice of hope and protection in his head.
So often we listen to the negative ones, right, but
it's nice to know that we do have the voices
of people who have stood up for us in the past,
Like they're in there, and maybe we can pay a
(19:05):
little bit more attention to those and'd say, tell, you know,
tell them you're sat score you know, tell them, tell
them how smart you are. Obviously, you know, we get
embarrassed and cringe when our parents say stuff like that,
but at the same time we do we value having that,
having that in our minds and in our pockets and
moments of uncertainty.
Speaker 5 (19:27):
That's perfect lead into something we've been asking everyone, which is,
who are the voices in your head?
Speaker 4 (19:33):
You know what, Katie and I were talking about this
the other day. We're in the middle of a bunch
of interviews, and I turned to her and I said,
I think you're one of the voices in my head,
you know, just like May has her friend from from
growing up. There's certain things like, yeah, there was like
something recently that I wanted to sign my initiation my
(19:53):
email with just my initial, and I remembered her voice going,
you don't do that for people who don't really know you.
You can't just sign a like that's for like your friends,
that's for people who know you. And so I discovered
I was like, I don't do that because her voice
is always in my head saying that, which.
Speaker 3 (20:09):
Is like, they don't deserve for you to just put
an initial.
Speaker 4 (20:11):
I don't even know what that means. But that's in there.
That's the thing from Katie that's in there. Definitely my mother.
Oh my god, my mother. Yes, did you put lipstick
on before you left the house. I have live glass
on right now and this is going to be an
audio recording.
Speaker 3 (20:25):
Do you understand?
Speaker 4 (20:28):
But I and I had to put some lip glass
on for an up here interview even though no.
Speaker 3 (20:34):
One will see it.
Speaker 4 (20:36):
So yeah, that's my mom and uh yeah.
Speaker 3 (20:41):
What else?
Speaker 8 (20:42):
I don't know?
Speaker 3 (20:44):
Let me think.
Speaker 4 (20:45):
Well, I also try to keep you know, I have
a married to somebody I really adore and really respect,
Julian you know him, Peter Flynn.
Speaker 3 (20:55):
He's a director and educator.
Speaker 4 (20:56):
And and he's someone who always will say things when
I'm nervous about something or I don't have enough time,
He'll say something like, you know what burns always delivers,
and that that's something that I keep in my head
when I get nervous, like right, he always tells me
that it's true.
Speaker 3 (21:15):
It's true.
Speaker 4 (21:16):
So no matter how crazy it seems right now, that's
that's a little rock.
Speaker 3 (21:20):
That's a little thing I hold on to.
Speaker 6 (21:23):
Yeah, Maddie, if you could call me by my last
name to hype me up from time to time, I'll
be very appreciative of that. I'll take nodes girl, even
though that is totally Katie.
Speaker 4 (21:34):
Yeah, yeah, I mean it's it's good to focus on
the ones. We all have the negative ones, but it's
really important to dig deep and say.
Speaker 3 (21:42):
Yeah, but what are the ones?
Speaker 4 (21:43):
Who are the people that just thinking about them makes
me feel really good about myself, And try to remember
some of the things that they've said to you, because
it's it's what we it's the fuel we need to
to function in this world and to function. Well, what's
the Maya Angelou quote? People will never remember what you
(22:03):
did or what you said, only how you made them feel.
Speaker 8 (22:06):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (22:06):
So I'm a big believer in that, and I really
try to make people feel good.
Speaker 2 (22:11):
Do you see aspects of yourself in any of the
other characters.
Speaker 3 (22:15):
Well, sure, I see aspects of myself.
Speaker 4 (22:18):
In Miguel in wanting to do the right thing, wanting
to make the smart decision, putting my eyes on a
prize that I think everybody else may value, but also
feeling very uneasy in the particular kind of environment sometimes
that requires I'm speaking about, like you know, those scenes
(22:40):
in the bank when he's with those guys who By
the way, Michael and Adam are the nicest, sweetest boys
you can possibly imagine.
Speaker 3 (22:49):
They play these.
Speaker 4 (22:50):
Horrible bro type guys and with like the sense of
humor of a twelve year old. And they are mature, creative,
delicious artists. And I love them and I always like
to say that about them because they've played these crazy parts.
But the roles they play, you know, seem to also
speak to so much game playing and lying and hustling
(23:11):
that you have to do to make it to achieve
all of the prizes that we think are important, right
the money, the penthouse, then you know, the super job.
And I have always been ambitious and I've you know,
wanted to raise to the top of my field. But
I have never been somebody who is comfortable as a
(23:31):
hustler who just sort of get I don't know, I
just find I find his uneasiness and that something that
I relate to. I relate to, but then also wanting
to make his mom proud, I relate to that too.
Speaker 2 (23:42):
Can you tell us a little bit about that normousy
and that got cut? What was that about?
Speaker 4 (23:47):
Yeah, well, he was going through there's Miguel is facing
different things that make him that are challenging to him
and have caused him to put on more emotional armor.
And it was all actually leading up to a scene
with me in the hospital actually, so we had this
very tender moment and scene there that you'll have to
(24:10):
ask the producers, but they just decided they didn't want
to stick with My feeling is yeah, I don't know.
I have different theories about it. But it was a
fantastic you know, it was a very long day, but
it was fantastic to be with Norm who is a
dear friend who is just absolutely hilarious and was just
(24:32):
holding court there. He didn't know a lot of the
people on the set that day, and he could just
walk into a room full of strangers and say, what's
your favorite song. We're all going to listen to it,
play it on his phone, we're all going to sing it, We're.
Speaker 3 (24:43):
All going to like.
Speaker 4 (24:44):
He's incredible that way. So he made that day especially fun,
which is really hard, by the way, for a guest
star to do because everyone's kind of got their own rhythm.
And then I've been a guest star many times. You
just come in and you feel a little bit sometimes
like you're approaching the lunch table, like we're all the
cool kids are and you're like, no, nah, you guys
are good. I'll just be I'll just sit over here,
(25:05):
right And just because you don't know everybody and you
don't want to presume anything, That's how I feel. But
Norm just came in and took over and it was delicious, delicious.
Speaker 6 (25:21):
We're going to take a quick break when we come back.
We have the special treat of listening to Norm Lewis's
velvety baritone as we talk about the differences between performing
on stage versus on screen, his video game skills, and
his own experiences with matching mushrooms.
Speaker 5 (25:48):
So I just have a few questions about the show.
So how did you get involved an audition?
Speaker 8 (25:53):
No, no, it wasn't an audition. I think I had
seen the Lopezes at an event that was for them
at Carnegie Hall and we've known each other. But but yeah,
they we were at dinner of that particular celebration and
they said something to me. It was like, you'll probably
(26:14):
be hearing from us soon. So and then there you go,
that's what happened.
Speaker 2 (26:18):
How ominous. Yeah, so there's you know, your character is
a big video game element. And you happen to be
a video gamer yourself.
Speaker 8 (26:26):
I can play pack man. I'm old school. I never
really learned how to do you know, the manipulation of
the those things, I can't even I don't even know
they're called. But I've seen other people do it, and
I admire it.
Speaker 2 (26:41):
I'm with you. I also have no idea how any
of that works.
Speaker 5 (26:45):
So most of the voices in Miguel's had our people
from his life. How do you approach playing like a
video game character though, who's just a figment of the imagination,
there's no history.
Speaker 8 (26:57):
Well, I think that you know when people create, because
I'm created by him. I think when people create anything,
it's from their subconscious, it's from their environment that they've
you know, they're reflecting in some way. But I feel
like I'm part of his subconscious, you know, something that
he has been struggling with for a little bit, and
just the confidence in himself and all of that. So
(27:19):
I think he's talking to himself, but it's through me.
Speaker 2 (27:22):
And do you have a favorite memory from set?
Speaker 8 (27:25):
God, there's so many, because there was you know, there's
a lot of routine, like moving around, the manipulation around
the buildings, and stuff, and just wearing that cape was
kind of cumbersome, so we had to make sure that
people were out of the way, equipment was out of
the way, so we didn't knock anything over. But it
(27:46):
was just you know, being on set with a lot
of good friends. You know, we don't get a chance
to see each other a lot because we're in shows
and you know, Broadway shows or just different theater shows.
But when you come together on set, it's kind of
like a nice little reunion.
Speaker 2 (28:02):
And how do you approach acting on screen versus when
you're on stage, Well.
Speaker 8 (28:08):
This is different, I would say. Normally, with stage, you know,
you're trying to hit the back of the theater and
you're using your voice and the whole thing. But with
television and film, it's a little bit more intimate. And
I just remember when I first started doing television, someone
told me that they gave me the grace of like saying, okay,
you can bring it down. You're a theater actor. You
have a voice, Your voice booms, so just bring it
(28:30):
down just a little bit. But with this show, you know,
it's so theatrical and it's so melodramatic that you know,
I think we I think we were hired just because
we are big theater theater people.
Speaker 2 (28:43):
What is your favorite role that you've played on stage?
Speaker 8 (28:46):
Oh god, I get this question a lot, and I
know it sounds like a cop out, but I love
all of them. I mean it's like, you know, I
don't have children, but if it's like if I had kids,
you can't love one more than the other. I will
say that I'm best known for some you know, Porgy
and Bess and Phantom and Le Miz, you know Javert.
But I remember reflecting on a character that I played
(29:09):
back in the nineties. I did. I had four lines
and it was off Broadway. It was a show called
Captain's Courageous And because of the research that I did
for this character, I felt very prideful, and every time
I said those four lines, I was so happy.
Speaker 5 (29:24):
I was actually watching this morning, I watched you singing
stars and just incredible. Do you have any like vocal
secrets of how you keep your voice so healthy and powerful?
Speaker 8 (29:35):
Well, you're very kind. I appreciate that. I will say
that it's a lot of rest, a lot of hydration,
you know, when I'm doing a show, like when I
did Fantom. Not that I'm a big, you know, alcoholic drinker,
but I stayed away from alcohol for nine months. It just,
I said, I just don't want to take the chance.
It can dry you out, It sometimes can make you
vulnerable to get sick. So I just stayed away from
(29:57):
it and with that show because as it is so exposed,
your voice is so exposed. I try not to talk
too much during the day and you know, not use
my voice for some random kind of thing. Even on
the phone. I would text people and say, look, I
can't talk right now. But yeah, I try to be
as disciplined as possible. But definitely sleep and hydration.
Speaker 2 (30:19):
Those are good tips.
Speaker 8 (30:21):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (30:21):
Do you have a favorite song from up here?
Speaker 8 (30:24):
God? I mean I love listening to everybody, you know,
Brian Stokes, Mitchell, Andrea Burns. I mean, it's the voices
were so amazing. Got Well, I'll just choose my song.
It was fun singing it and I had to sing
it so many times, so yeah, I'll choose that one.
Speaker 2 (30:43):
Yeah, it's a great song.
Speaker 5 (30:45):
So in the episode, your character is a reaction to
a mushroom trip, so feel free to you know, have
I ever been on.
Speaker 8 (30:56):
The mushroom troop? Is that the question. You know, it's
funny because I've always wanted to try mushrooms because I
remember being I've been in Amsterdam now a couple of
times and I was a little too nervous to try it.
But I was at a friend's house in Vegas, and
you have to be with people. I think you have
(31:16):
to be with people that understands that journey. And a
friend of mine, I know that some people drink a
tea and some people just eat it straight. This person
made a lemonade from it, and that was a more
palatable thing for me to take. And I drank it,
and I will say, yeah, I felt good. I felt
really good. It wasn't a strong dose, let's put it
(31:38):
that way. You know. I didn't see walls moving in
and out, but I felt really really good, and I
would do that again.
Speaker 2 (31:44):
I just did it for me.
Speaker 5 (31:45):
I was always really scared too, and I just did
it for the first time, like a year ago, and
it was like a chocolate and I was like, oh,
this is great.
Speaker 2 (31:54):
I don't know what I was so scared of exactly exactly.
I didn't see any sort of wizard coming to me,
and I didn't know that far.
Speaker 8 (32:03):
Maybe I didn't come to your head.
Speaker 5 (32:04):
I didn't go no, no, maybe next time, next time
and tell us more about So the song the Quest,
it's about him sort of trying to get rid of
this armor that he's built up.
Speaker 2 (32:18):
Can you relate to sort of that feeling that Miguel
is having.
Speaker 8 (32:21):
Yeah, you know, the thing about it is that we
all put on these masks in society when we're all
in public and we're trying to be our best selves.
And some people are truly their best selves because they've
done the work and they've you know, gone to therapy
and they've done some of the spiritual journeys and stuff.
But a lot of us are still just trying to
fit in. And I think, you know, he is basically
(32:45):
just just trying to shed that armor, you know, of
to find himself, to find himself. I know that there
have been I've been in certain rooms where I felt like, oh,
this person's a little bit smarter than I am, so
I have to kind of pull up or this person
personal exptter than I do. You know. So I think
we go around life with masks on and then but
(33:07):
it's easier said than done to try to shep that
that armor and just be your true self.
Speaker 2 (33:13):
Yeah, definitely, And so the hope is obviously that there
will be a season two of up Here. Do you
see a future for your character?
Speaker 8 (33:23):
Listen, I'm open to anything. I know that there was
a figurine or some sort of artwork of me in
one of the scenes, and you know, I'm one of
the I'm one of his creations. So yeah, I might.
I think I might. I didn't get destroyed, let's just
put it that way. I might make an appair, and
I'm a wizard, so even if I did, I can always.
Speaker 6 (33:41):
Pop back there you go.
Speaker 5 (33:45):
What was the mechanics of filming that scene. You were
saying that the set was sort of like moving around
they're taking away pieces. Can you tell me a bit
more about that.
Speaker 10 (33:54):
Yeah.
Speaker 8 (33:54):
We were in an office building and now I'm forgetting
where we were, but we were in an office building,
and because I had a cape, it was definitely I
mean this there were real cubicles, and there were you know,
it was all set up because I think we just
kind of just took over this this one company's office,
and so we had to just make sure that the
cameras were in the right position. I was in the
(34:16):
right position, Miguel was in the right position, and whoever
else was you know in that scene, and they took
different angles just to see which one would be best
suited for editing and everything. So it was just a
lot of that, and you know, you expect you expect
that kind of thing, but but no, it was fun.
And then also the music playing in the background, if
I can be heard all of that stuff, so it's just, uh,
(34:39):
it's it's it becomes a team, and you want to
make sure that you win.
Speaker 2 (34:43):
Do you sing along when they're playing the song or
do you just sort of lipsnk it?
Speaker 8 (34:47):
No? No, I sing I sing along because I think
it just there's an authenticity to movement of the mouth
and breathing and all that kind of stuff. So I
always try to.
Speaker 2 (34:57):
Sing along, I think.
Speaker 5 (34:58):
So, yeah, I agree with that they whenever they call
out like a pop star for lip singing, and I
was like, well, they're probably singing anyway, like you know,
they're probably doing a little bit of both, right, right.
So we heard about this sort of up here university
where it was like upstairs there was a recording studio
and then downstairs was filming.
Speaker 2 (35:17):
Was there did you have that experience or was years different.
Speaker 8 (35:21):
No, mine was pretty much the same. But we that
one scene where we were in the office that was
that would that was definitely a real office like I
was saying before. But then there was another scene we're
in the elevator that was that was actually built on set,
and so we were able to make sure that the
doors open correctly in the whole thing, but it was
also someone making sure that the fog was coming up
(35:43):
and they were inside and so they were kind of
stuck in the corner like that so they wouldn't be
seen by the camera. But yeah, I did the recording
I guess maybe a week or so before, and then
afterwards we came down and we got on this huge
set out there and did our thing. There was another
(36:04):
set that was built for another office and hallways that
we had to go through. So if you remember there's
armor that's being put on in one scene, like he's
putting armor on, he's putting armor on, he's putting a
shield on, and it just keeps building up on him.
That was another thing that we had to deal with too,
(36:25):
to make sure that what's the word I'm looking for
that every time we did it, we did it the same.
I can't think of the terminology right now, but there's
a person on set to make sure that your watch
is that at the right.
Speaker 2 (36:37):
Time and continuity.
Speaker 8 (36:39):
Continuity, that's the word I was looking for. Yeah, yeah,
so that was That was a long day, but it
was fun. You know, I get to sing all day.
Speaker 2 (36:49):
Have you worked with and it's such a powerhouse team
of musical theater legends. Have you worked with anyone before
that's part of the production.
Speaker 8 (36:59):
The only thing. The only person I've worked with before
was Andrea Burns. We did a couple of concerts together.
Other than that, you know, still Brian Stokes, Mitchell and
I are friends and we've been on you know, we're
part of Black Data United, so we're on a lot
of the same boards. But no, we've never actually done
a show together. And I've always wanted to work with
(37:19):
him because he's so amazing and I'm trying to think
who else has been in the show that there was
so many great people, but Andrew Burns is like the
only person I've actually had it, like, you know, a
real thing with.
Speaker 2 (37:30):
We're speaking with Brian.
Speaker 5 (37:31):
I think next week, are there any questions that we
should ask him?
Speaker 8 (37:38):
Well, a lot of well, yeah, sure, I'll go for it.
People get us confused, really they do. It's really interesting.
And we look nothing alike, nothing alike, and I guess
we have similar voices, but we look nothing. And people
have told me that they thought I was great in
(37:59):
a show that he did, and he said the same
thing has happened to him. And he's actually gotten a
fan mail of mine from Sideshow because they thought he
was in it. So it's just it's a weird phenomenon.
But listen, if anyone thinks I sound like Brian Stokes Mitchell,
(38:20):
I am so honored by that because he has a
glorious voice.
Speaker 5 (38:24):
Yeah, it's definitely. That's so funny. I feel like that
happens my dad is. My dad's a musician. His name's
Christopher Cross. Oh and yeah, I love that guy. Yeah,
he's a great guy.
Speaker 2 (38:36):
He's my dad. I got one of his records behind me.
Speaker 8 (38:40):
That's okay.
Speaker 2 (38:41):
Yeah, But he always the person that he gets mixed up.
It's not because of his voice. It is because they
look alike. Is Kyle Gas from Tenacious D? Yes, and
so people will go up to my dad and be like,
I love Tenacious.
Speaker 6 (38:58):
D, and you like, so do I nice?
Speaker 5 (39:02):
Like they're great guys. And I met Kyle Gass once
and I told him who my dad was. He's like
everybody always comes up to me and he's like, I
love you Christopher Cross or so you know.
Speaker 8 (39:10):
You know, they should do something together. They actually should
do like a thing a collab. Yeah, that would be great.
Speaker 2 (39:16):
That would be pretty great.
Speaker 5 (39:18):
So one last question, do you have any sort of
like you know, you're a guide.
Speaker 2 (39:23):
Do you have any wizard guides in your life?
Speaker 8 (39:25):
Do? I no, but I would say that I would
give some good advice, and I would just anyone, doesn't
matter what if you're going to try to be in
this industry or whatever industry you're in, just try to
find who you are. Just find a self awareness, whether
that be through spirituality or something. You know that you
(39:47):
have to realize there's something bigger than you. Whether you
believe it's in you or whether you believe it's outside
of you, it's something bigger than you. And just try
to find the truth in that and just stay strong,
Just stay you know, try to find out who you are.
Speaker 7 (40:05):
It's time for another quick break. When we come back,
we talk about the songs in episode six, Falling in
Love and The Quest with songwriters and creators Kristin Anderson
Lopez and Bobby Lopez.
Speaker 11 (40:28):
Hold on to your thumb, it's time to talk about songs.
Speaker 6 (40:41):
Naddie and I are strum enthusiasts.
Speaker 5 (40:43):
We dabble, We dabble the entire time we were watching it.
It's like, oh no, don't tell him, it's going to
be about to just let you know, keep order a sandwich.
Speaker 2 (40:54):
Like, but that's not where we start.
Speaker 5 (40:58):
We start with Falling in Love, which I felt was
like so grease, so uh felt like very inspired by
Maybe that's incorrect, but no.
Speaker 1 (41:08):
No, you're exactly right. It's inspired by the fifties and
the eighties, back when people were like dancing as fast
as they could, so you know, it has a little
bit of rama. Lama Lama kadingad ding Dong with also
Katrina and the Waves.
Speaker 9 (41:22):
Right that we were slightly inspired by the music video
for Tell Her About It, Right.
Speaker 1 (41:29):
Yes, the music video for Tell Her About It is
also just it's like magnic and that's sort of that
feeling of not wanting to stop moving so that you
don't go deep when you when when you get into
a relationship. But you've been hurt, and it's so much
(41:49):
easier to just keep things breezy, keep it, keep it breezy,
but keep it going, but keep it breezy. And then
someone is trying to get you to like, you know,
I'm going to share this. I'm going to disclose this.
Now you disclose something and you're like, h, let's go
to the movies.
Speaker 10 (42:04):
Because falling in love is like placing off that how
much you pull it in affects how much you get.
I've been burned before, so this time I'll choose to
only pull it in when I'm willing to lose. Low stakes,
no mess, and I guess I'm okay with falling in love.
Speaker 6 (42:32):
Falling in.
Speaker 9 (42:36):
We'll backing it up for a bit. The originally wrote
a different song for the slot, but this was the
hardest slot to get right. We wrote, We wrote many
different things. We wrote a song called something to Lose,
which was almost like a motown song, was like, now
I've got something to lose, so I'm gonna keep things.
I'm gonna keep things distant. And I'm not sure that
(42:56):
everybody liked that song, so we cut it out and
we wrote another song called falling in Love. But it
wasn't the version you know it was. It was almost
like a French waltz, like an Elliott Smith song, kind
of like a sad, melancholy kind of and you'll hear
it at the end of the episode on the soundtrack,
(43:17):
it's the credits bit. You'll hear it at the end.
But then people were like, that's that's a bummer that
it just feels like Miguel is constantly being negative.
Speaker 8 (43:29):
We can, we can.
Speaker 9 (43:30):
We started with some enthusiasm, so we took I mean,
the song that you would never believe in a million
years could be a fast, happy song, and somehow it
became one. We just sped the fuck out of it.
Speaker 1 (43:42):
Hey and found Sony found this amazing jitterbug.
Speaker 8 (43:48):
Oh yeah.
Speaker 1 (43:49):
That that sort of helped us bring it to life.
And there was something else I was going to say,
but it's gone.
Speaker 9 (43:57):
There was also another one that, like the was there
were some scenes that you'll you will see sort of
at the beginning and at the end of it, which
we thought maybe they'd go in the middle, but it
was one of those and that's how we wrote the thing.
But we try to impost a zillion different ways, and
we realized like, oh no, the song kind of needs
to live as at some thing and the scenes can
go at the beginning. In the end, it was just like,
(44:18):
this is the way you make a musical and TV.
You would never do it that way on stage or
in an animated sequence, but you know, before you executed it,
you'd know exactly what you wanted it to be.
Speaker 8 (44:29):
But this is how you make TV.
Speaker 1 (44:31):
I found what I was going to say, which is,
if you're looking at the meta musical of the eight episodes,
the act break is I feel like I've always known
you woulds That's where you would have had intermission and
people would go pee and get raised nets or like
double vodkas, depending on or both. And this this song
(44:56):
is the opening of Act two where needs to feel,
you know. It is like couldn't be happier? Right, it's
the everything's happy, but is it really? It has to
do that hard job of saying there's more to come
and so it took us a few cracks, but I
think we found it. And then come.
Speaker 3 (45:18):
The shrooms.
Speaker 2 (45:21):
With the sexiest older man alive, Norm Lewis. Another audible gasp, Yeah,
another audible gasp. Jillian was like, oh my.
Speaker 9 (45:30):
Stuff, well, we had just prior to starting pre production
on up Here, we did a concert at Carnegie Hall
of all of our songs, and normally this wasn't in it.
But he was at the party and we didn't really
know norm but he came up to us and gave
us a big hug and he started singing he was.
(45:54):
He hugged us and then he started singing our favorite
song that he does from the Rather Be Silly Yes,
And we just felt this resonance coming from him right
against right up against our skin.
Speaker 8 (46:09):
It was like this beautiful, weird, erotic moment.
Speaker 6 (46:15):
I need to take a break here.
Speaker 1 (46:18):
That song is by William Finn.
Speaker 9 (46:21):
I'd Rather be Sick. I'm sorry, I always have to
do that whenever I think about it.
Speaker 1 (46:25):
But that song is by William Finn, who I lied
about interviewing, just tying it back. The part of this
song that you should know is that Bobby and I
have never done shrooms, like really honestly. We were raised
in Nancy Reagan Just Say No Time, and we thought
that we would go insane if we did drugs, then
(46:48):
our brain would cook like an egg like the commercial.
Speaker 9 (46:53):
It worked on us and did our parents, so we
didn't learn it from watching them, no commercial.
Speaker 1 (47:00):
At least there were some people in the writer's room
who had dune rooms.
Speaker 2 (47:03):
You can always trust a writer's room that somebody, somebody
if not micro dosing right now.
Speaker 1 (47:11):
And what we did know, especially Bobby and I will
so I'll stop talking. But what Bobby knows a lot
about is video game music and anything having to do
with and any kind of Lord of the Rings or
Star Wars kind of epic sty fi fantasy.
Speaker 8 (47:32):
Yeah.
Speaker 9 (47:32):
I love that stuff, as who doesn't.
Speaker 1 (47:35):
And I'm not a young numismatist.
Speaker 8 (47:40):
You wouldn't think.
Speaker 11 (47:41):
It, but yes, very feelings we don't obtain in thy
Shield and sword stormy, evil squear, beauty by Lord Man's
quick to fight, a strong.
Speaker 8 (48:00):
Ball den dealing to night.
Speaker 9 (48:04):
And so I always wanted to do an eight bit
and play with an eight bit plug in, and so
I got one and just had a ball.
Speaker 8 (48:23):
Like we started. I started.
Speaker 9 (48:25):
I rolled like twelve or thirteen themes, which we got
pared down to like maybe three or four.
Speaker 1 (48:31):
That's true. Yeah, Bobby just started the Other thing that's
so amazing about my husband is that he is constantly
on it. He's constantly in dialogue with music, in some
way just in his own life. So almost for every
birthday or or Christmas, I get him a new instrument
(48:51):
because it just makes him come alive, and he likes
to explore it and see, like, let's take this baby
out for a spin. And he found this eight bit
plug in that he just started in like all of
his off time, you know, whether he's like on the
toilet or up early before us or whatever, he was
playing with his eight bit plug in and and just
(49:13):
seeing like, oh, what can I make?
Speaker 3 (49:14):
What can I make?
Speaker 1 (49:15):
So he truly wrote an hour of eight bit opera
music that got cut down to what this song is?
Speaker 3 (49:25):
What is it called?
Speaker 6 (49:26):
The question?
Speaker 8 (49:27):
That's right.
Speaker 1 (49:27):
I'm not great with titles, especially of my own music,
because we've called it so many things.
Speaker 9 (49:34):
Well, and this one is so different than all the
other ones because all the other ones are essentially in
song form their AA ba or you know, some variation
of that, and they are mostly self contained. This one
is split up over you know, there's a there's another
scene in between two of the sections. There's uh, you know,
(49:54):
there's different themes, there's you know, there's different moments within it.
I wanted it to feel like an epic journey and
be reflected in it's in its structure, so uh and
I wanted it to have like a legend of Zelda
kind of feeling and all that stuff, putting there's a
little bit of Mario in there that I don't know.
Speaker 6 (50:11):
We yeah, my my memories of a Supernintendo were came
back to me.
Speaker 1 (50:16):
Oh yeah, yeah. This was a bear of an episode
to crack. There was something about episode six that just
got rewritten and got rewritten. In this song too got
rewritten and rewritten. But uh and even in post we
were sort of figuring out what's staying, what's going, what
do we need to reveal of Miguel and what what
(50:39):
can still be hidden?
Speaker 9 (50:40):
And the maybe you know fun fact the little reprise
of falling in love at the end where he's taking
off the armor that that's falling in love in the melody,
but the accompaniment is I Am Not Alone. The tune
if I'm Not Alone is playing in the background, So
if you catch.
Speaker 1 (50:59):
That from the brilliant mind of Robert Lopez, just to
let the notes there though I wrote the lyrics.
Speaker 6 (51:15):
Thanks for listening. If you want to reach out to
us and share a moment where you could have burst
into song. Email us at up Here at straw hutmedia
dot com. If you like the show, please rate, review
and share with your friends. See you next week.
Speaker 5 (51:33):
Up Here down Low is a straw Hut Media production.
It's hosted by Madison Cross and Julian Goza. The show's
produced by Ryan Tillotson and Maggie Bulls.
Speaker 2 (51:42):
Our associate producers are.
Speaker 5 (51:43):
Lydia McMahon, Javier Salas, and Jean Lee. Our editor is
Daniel Ferreira. Big thanks to everyone at Hulu, including Kristin
Anderson Lopez and Bobby Lopez for their help putting the
show together.
Speaker 6 (52:01):
Okay, this is also a very like She's also a question,
but I have to ask because speak I'm pretty sure
I heard it from Katie when we were your students.
But is your cousin Gavin du Graus?
Speaker 4 (52:12):
Yes, my cousin is Gavin de Grau, Yes, singer, songwriter, superstar,
Yes he is. Yes he is on my father's side,
my non Latino side. But yes, I'm very proud to
call him my cousin. And he has been singing and
writing songs since he was a little boy.
Speaker 3 (52:28):
Amazing.
Speaker 8 (52:28):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (52:30):
Julian was like, oh, my God, and her cousin is
Gavin du Grau.
Speaker 3 (52:33):
And I was like, what, that's so random, but it's not.
Speaker 2 (52:37):
He was so so sure about it. We'll have to
ask her.
Speaker 4 (52:40):
Yeah, definitely, definitely. He's like once removed, So my first
cousin who was older than me is his mom.
Speaker 6 (52:49):
Wow, it runs in the family. That's so cool.
Speaker 3 (52:51):
Yeah,
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