To Bear Witness: Stories from Auschwitz to Cincinnati. The lives of Roma Kaltman & Rozalia Berke

She said, "Will you take me as a sister?" And we said, "Yes, you will be our third sister.” And that's how we went through the war to be known as the three sisters." We were always holding hands together so we wouldn't be separated. 

- Rozalia Berke, Auschwitz survivor 

In Auschwitz, two sisters chose resistance — not with weapons, but with books, courage, and love. Roma and Rozalia Kaltman survived the Holocaust by clinging to each other and forming a chosen family with a third girl in the camps, Danka. Together, they became "the three sisters," and stayed alive despite dehumanization and death marches. 

Cori Silbernagel, Director of Collections & Exhibitions is joined by Trinity Johnson, Director of Holocaust Programs & Museum Experiences to explore the stories of these incredible women by sharing a few minutes of them in their own words. Even though Roma and Rozalia are gone, their lives continue to move and inspire us. 

This episode is part of a limited series, created to enrich the experience of visitors planning to attend the exhibition Auschwitz. Not long ago. Not far away. Coming to Cincinnati Museum Center in October, 2025.  

Those who visit will not just see the same exhibition shown around the world. They will also get in-depth local stories of Auschwitz survivors who immigrated to Cincinnati. During WWII, the historic train station where this exhibition will be shown saw millions of American servicemen come through its doors. But there was another group of travelers whose lives would be impacted by Union Terminal. More than 1,000 Jews who survived the Holocaust immigrated to Cincinnati, arriving in the very building where the public will be able to view Auschwitz. Not long ago. Not far away. 

The opportunity to bring this exhibition to Cincinnati has been generously supported by Rhonda and Larry Sheakley, the Jewish Federation of Cincinnati, the Jewish Foundation of Cincinnati, the Ohio Holocaust and Genocide Memorial and Education Commission and  

H.B., E.W. & F.R. Luther Charitable Foundation, Fifth Third Bank, Trustee  

Jacob G. Schmidlapp Fund, Fifth Third Bank, Trustee  

Helen G., Henry F., Louise Tuechter Dornette Foundation, Fifth Third Bank, Trustee  

Western & Southern Financial Group  

Les and Renee Sandler  

The Kanter/Knue Family  

The Neil Bortz Family  

Rosenthal Family Foundation  

Beth and Louis Guttman 

Interviews of Roma Kaltman, Rozalia Berke, Henry Meyer, and Bella Ouziel are from the archive of the USC Shoah Foundation – The Institute for Visual History and Education 

For more information: http://sfi.usc.edu/ 

To Bear Witness: Stories from Auschwitz to Cincinnati is part of the Cynthia & Harold Guttman Family Center for Storytelling. Special thanks to Julie and John Cohen for their support of this series. Auschwitz. Not long ago. Not far away. was created by Musealia in cooperation with the Auschwitz-Birkenau State Museum.  Presented by NEON.  

Musealia  https://www.musealia.net/  

Auschwitz-Birkenau State Museum  https://www.auschwitz.org/en/  

NEON  https://www.neonglobal.com/en/ 

Auschwitz. Not long ago. Not far away. ticket info, additional resources for both adults and students, travel itineraries and more https://www.cincymuseum.org/auschwitz/  

Visit the Nancy & David Wolf Holocaust & Humanity Center https://www.holocaustandhumanity.org/

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Episode Transcript

Jackie Congedo (00:01):
Auschwitz is a name the world can't forget. At
the Nancy and David WolfHolocaust and Humanity Center,
we've made it part of ourmission to understand its impact
by learning from those whosurvived and came to Cincinnati.
In this limited series, we sharethose stories of courage loss
and the ripple effects stillfelt today.

Cori Silbernagel (00:22):
I'm Cori Silbernagel, Director of
collections and exhibitions atthe Nancy and David Wolfe
Holocaust and Humanity Center.
Thanks for joining us for thisspecial podcast series ahead of
a special exhibit coming inOctober, Auschwitz, not long
ago, not far away, will open inCincinnati museum Center at
Union terminal. And I'm reallyhappy to be able to share some
of our local Auschwitz storieswith you, along with my

(00:45):
colleague Trinity Johnson, ourDirector of Museum Experiences
and Holocaust Programs.

Trinity Johnson (00:52):
Thanks, Cori.
So I think the first story wewere going to talk about was the
Kaltman family, and startingwith Roma and Rozalia, and
eventually we'll talk abouttheir third sister, Danka, but
just for place and space, Romaand her family were from Lodz,
Poland, and in 1940 when theLodz ghetto was established, her
family was interned there. Weknow that ghetto conditions -

(01:16):
we'll talk a lot about campconditions, which were also
atrocious - ghetto conditionsalso very atrocious. But there's
something incredible aboutRoma's story in the ghetto that
I know we we're not going toshare a lot about the ghetto
experience, but I have to sharethis, because it'll link to her
marrying her husband,eventually, after the war, Sam.

(01:37):
While she's in the ghetto, andwe know ghetto conditions
terrible. People are starving.
Roma actually, the meager rationshe would receive for slave
labor, she would buy books sothat she could continue
learning. And I just think thatthat's such a important piece of
that part of her story, thatthat I have to bring up right

(02:01):
now, because I know Auschwitz isthe focus, but I think that
spirit in some of the clips thatwe're going to share today will
really come through that thatdefiance and resilience in her
spirit.

Cori Silbernagel (02:15):
I love I love that story, because it reminds
me that resistance takes manydifferent forms, right? And for
Roma, her act of resistance isto is to hold on to that, that
one joyful thing in her life.
And I think that's reallybeautiful. Do you want to share
how Sam and Roma met each other?

(02:38):
Because it is connected to thatbook story,

Trinity Johnson (02:40):
yes, so they, you know, in those days, you're
exhausted from work. You knowyou're seeing family starving
around you, still holding on towhether that's religion or
education. And Roma's situation,she said, you know, learning was
important, because they couldn'ttake what was up here. They

(03:03):
might take everything else,property, life, but they
couldn't take the education whatwas in her mind. So teenagers in
those days would meet in acourtyard there in the ghetto.
That was their socialization.
That was how they encouraged oneanother, and that's where Roma
and Sam met. They met, you know,with other teenagers in the

(03:23):
ghetto, even exchanging booksand continuing to learn. And so
I know what we'll talk aboutlater is how that education
played such a role in kind oftheir second chapter here in
Cincinnati. I also I think itwas important to voice that
because it's so much connectedto some of the later things and

(03:45):
their legacy here in Cincinnati,

Cori Silbernagel (03:48):
yeah, yeah, I totally agree. So in Lodz, the
ghetto is liquidated, and all ofthe Jews of the Lodz ghetto
ultimately are sent toconcentration camps. Roma is
living in the ghetto with hersister Rozalia, who she remains
with throughout the war. And sheis also with brothers, two

(04:13):
brothers of hers that are in theghetto. When the ghetto is
liquidated, they're all sent toAuschwitz and separated. So
let's share a clip about whathappens when, when they arrive
at Auschwitz, and how, how theirstory changes.

Roma Kaltman (04:32):
Unfortunately, we were never assigned a job, which
was a lot worse than evenworking because we didn't have
anything to do with us. Andforever we were standing in
lines, either they wouldexperiment on something, or they
would tattoo us. And whenever wewere in line, we sort of thought

(04:59):
to go over. Is to the end of theline, and this is the only
reason that I am not numbered.
Also, they did have a number forme and Auschwitz, but I did not
get it on my arm.

Trinity Johnson (05:17):
So that's a really powerful clip, and one of
my favorite parts of the story,because it really speaks to
ingenuity, right? Here are thesetwo women who have survived
ghetto conditions. They've nowarrived at a camp. They're...
the rest of their family isgone. It's really just Rozalia
and Roma together clinging toone another for mutual support

(05:42):
and keep going to the back ofthe line so that they don't get
a tattoo. I just find that sointeresting and incredible,

Cori Silbernagel (05:51):
yeah, and it's, it's hard to even imagine
how that could have beenpossible, and what huge risk
they were taking right that,that risk to keep going to the
back of the line over and over,to re risk each time is really
quite remarkable, and it is soinspiring to me to you know,

(06:13):
consider these two young women,You know, younger than I am
today. You know, surviving somuch already and and, you know,
realizing they're they're notdone yet. They still have have
more survival ahead of them. So,you know, that's something that

(06:36):
I think is really importantabout this clip, and just Roma
and Rozalia story.

Trinity Johnson (06:42):
And when we think about tattoos and really
what those symbolize, right, theultimate form of dehumanization,
of stripping one's stripping oneof their humanity and their
identity, and now they're anumber or a cog in the slave
labor wheel. But you know, whichis terrible, but it's so
interesting that, in a way,they're holding on to their

(07:05):
humanity as well, that they arenot - they're refusing to have
their their identities takenaway. And I think that's such a
beautiful aspect as well, of "Weare just we're going to beat the
system in this moment. We'regoing to be defiant." And to
your point, also the incrediblerisk that that that took, I

(07:25):
think, when we think of theirresilience and how they
supported one another, one ofthe really interesting aspects
of the next clip we're going toshare is how that resilience,
but also love, also was part oftheir camp relationship with

(07:46):
Danka, their adopted sister, andso in the next clip, we'll hear
about how they met her and howthey formed this beautiful camp
family. So let's watch that.

Rozalia Berke (07:58):
So it was, of course, lamenting and crying
from people whom they took away,the mothers and sisters and one
of my friends whom we knew fromthe ghetto, Dorca Doriskiewicz,
she wanted - she ran to thebarbed wires, and I yelled to

(08:20):
her, "Don't go to the barbedwires. You will get
electrocuted." She said, Whatis... what should I have to live
for? They took away my motherand sister, and they separated
me from them, and my father andwith my brother, went on the
other side. I don't have nothingto live for alone." So we said,

(08:40):
"Come here with us." And shesaid, "Will you take me as a
sister?" And we said, "Yes, youwill be our third sister. And
that's how we went through thewar to be known as the three
sisters." We were always holdinghands together so we wouldn't be
separated.

Cori Silbernagel (08:59):
This is a story that we have shared in our
museum for a really long time,and it's such an important
story, you know one just becauseit's sharing the story of camp
sisterhood, the story ofsurvival by depending on on your
community. Those around you,Roma and Rosalia weren't close

(09:22):
friends with Danka before theywere in Auschwitz, they all were
from Lodz, but they weren'tclose. Roma would have described
them as acquaintances, and it'sreally powerful to me that when
Roma and Rosalia saw theirfriend in Auschwitz, someone

(09:44):
who, you know, they had notknown very well before, but that
they recognized someone fromtheir past life. That that's so
important that they, you know,they reached out and helped. And
I don't know if everyone wouldhave whether they were put into
this situation or not.

Trinity Johnson (10:05):
I think it's amazing to think about, you
know, seeing someone in need andknowing that you're really in
the same situation right. Everymoment matters, every morsel
matters, every wink of sleep, ifyou can, matters, and to find
some kind of inner strength andresilience to reach out and then

(10:27):
help someone else as well, inthat area where you're kind of
all on the same level, like yourfate is really unfortunately
supposed to be sealed. I justthink that that speaks so much
to the strength of Roma andRozalia and the love that they
showed Danka or Dorca, asRosalia also would refer to her.

(10:50):
And I think that love onlytranscends the rest of the story
in camp situations, a lot oftimes, among women, the
phenomena was camp families orsister bonds. So it's really
interesting to see women cometogether. There are other
stories of sharing recipes andthings like that, right, holding

(11:11):
on to these feminine aspectsthat are very interesting. And
here, holding on to family,right, finding family, forming
family, and then just the partof how they were always holding
hands, right, always holding oneanother up and pushing forward
to survive. And we also see thateven through their death march

(11:35):
out of Auschwitz, so whenthey're being marched out of
Auschwitz in early '45 we knowthe camp is starting to also be
liquidated. All the slave laboris being shifted back toward
Germany, and they are marchingto Stuthoff. And they stuck
together and held one another upand pushed each other forward,

(11:58):
so much so that I think theirescape story is incredible,
right? I don't remember whichone pushed who into the ditch,
but all three of them roll intoa ditch and hide in a ditch
while the line continues on toStuthoff. And I remember Roma
talking about turning her coatinside out so that it wasn't
obvious that that they wereprisoners. And even then, they

(12:23):
stuck together and looked outfor one another through the end
of the war. And I just thinkthat's such a beautiful I mean,
they really were sisters. Theybecame sisters.

Cori Silbernagel (12:32):
Well and they, they remained sisters the rest
of their life, through theirrebuilding. I'm jumping ahead in
the story, but they, they, theysurvive, and they do go back to
Poland for a time, buteventually, all go to England,
and all three of them are livingtogether. Roma leaves first. She

(12:52):
comes to Cincinnati with herhusband Sam, who she met in the
ghetto. They were exchangingbooks and reading together right

Trinity Johnson (13:00):
and up until they were writing letters,
right, he was still in Europe.
She was she was in England, andthey connected over letters,

Cori Silbernagel (13:08):
yeah, so, so she comes to Cincinnati. Rozalia
eventually comes to Cincinnatitoo, and Danka stays in England,
but they always remained close,so close that, in fact, their
children remained close asfamily. So you know that that
camp sisterhood really became asisterhood in every sense which

(13:33):
is really so beautiful.

Trinity Johnson (13:34):
Yeah, and having lost all of her family,
Danka now, she had family that Iknow over the years, they went
and visited her in England, andso always kept in touch. Just a
beautiful story. I also thinkthe next chapter, especially
when we think of Roma andRozalia and what their next
chapter was here in Cincinnati,is really incredible. Will you

(13:57):
read that quote from Rozalia?
It's one of my favorites, that'sin our rebuilding section. And
sure, yeah, yeah, one of my

Cori Silbernagel (14:04):
favorites. So Rozalia in the ghetto worked in
a hospital, and much of her workdealt with with death and death
throughout the rest of herHolocaust years. So Roma wanted
to bring life into the world asher reaction. So she she shares
in her testimony. And as yousaid, we share in our museum, "I

(14:28):
wasn't happy in men's surgery,so I was transferred to
obstetrics. I admitted to saythat I also took a midwifery
course in England because I haveseen dying famine and innocent
children go that I wanted tobring life into this world, and
I trained, and I am statecertified midwife in England."

(14:53):
We put that quote into ourmuseum, because it really is. It
captures the legacy that Rozaliabrought to the world after what
she experienced, and she didbring life into the world and
and I hope for her that thatthat brought healing after,

Trinity Johnson (15:13):
And it's, it's also equally amazing what Roma
after this life changing event.
and Sam then did because meetingover a love of learning in the
ghetto and then, many yearsafter surviving, marrying having
children, they established theKaltman Institute, which is our

(15:35):
Museum's week long Institute forteachers to come be equipped and
learn the best pedagogy, tools,techniques, how to teach this
history to students. And that'snamed in their honor, the
Kaltman Institute. And I thinkit's so incredible that that
love of learning, that passionfor Holocaust education and

(15:58):
raising awareness of antisemitism, was something that was
so important to them in theirnext chapter, and it's just such
a beautiful legacy that they'veleft us with. Yeah, yeah,

Cori Silbernagel (16:08):
I think both Roma and Rozalia are are really
tremendous examples of peoplewho have seen the worst of
humanity and and did everythingthey could to bring forward the
best in humanity and that thatis so in tune with with
everything we stand fororganizationally at the

(16:30):
Holocaust & Humanity Center.

Jackie Congedo (16:31):
This is a production of the Nancy and
David Wolfe Holocaust andHumanity Center. The Center's
mission is to ensure that thelessons of the Holocaust inspire
action today. This series ispart of the Cynthia and Harold
Guttman Family Center forStorytelling. Special thanks to
Julie and John Cohen for theirsupport of this series. Visit us
in person at historic UnionTerminal in Cincinnati, Ohio, or

(16:52):
online anytime atHolocaustandhumanity.org
Managing Producer is AnneThompson. Technical Producer is
Robert Mills, and TechnicalDirector is Josh Emerson.
Additional video production byMichael Holder. Archive footage
courtesy of the USC ShoahFoundation. Visit Auschwitz. Not
long ago. Not far away. at Unionterminal, beginning in October

(17:13):
2025.