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June 20, 2023 • 26 mins
In this episode, bodybuilder and vegan activist Robert Cheeke is put in the hot seat for rapid fire questions! Plus we dish on the hottest headlines, foods perfect for summer vegan picnics, listener Q&As, and all of the exciting things happening at the VegNews HQ.

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Episode Transcript

Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Strawhut Media, food news, celebrities, and more from the world's
number one plant based food and lifestyle magazine.

Speaker 2 (00:14):
It's the veg News Podcast and here's your host, Jasmine Singer.

Speaker 3 (00:24):
Hi there, so glad you're here again, or maybe for
the very first time. I'm your host, Jasmine Singer, and
we're back again for another installment of the veg News Podcast,
brought to you by the fabulous Mudwater. Today we will
be joined by the incomparable Robert Cheek of vegan bodybuilding
and fitness fame. We will also catch up with veg

(00:45):
News Food editor Eddie Garza, check in with you our
listeners via the veg News Hotline, and get the latest
HAPs from veg News publisher Colleen Holland. But first, it's
time for this week's top headlines of the week. Here
are the we can't stop talking about here at veg News,

(01:05):
our first story today. These days, Cookie Monster isn't dunking
his favorite namesake treats into cow's milk, and that's because
he's reaching for almond milk. The beloved Sesame Street character
is the star of an ad campaign for vegan milk
company Califia Farms. With ads running nationally across TV, social media,

(01:26):
and digital platforms. We're hoping Cookie Monster can convince the
masses to ditch dairy. Our second story today. Nearly thirty
years ago, actor James Cromwell adopted a vegan lifestyle after
he starred in Babe alongside a number of farmed animals,
including the film's namesake pig. Recently, the Oscar nominated actor

(01:50):
adopted a piglet who had fallen from a truck heading
toward a slaughterhouse. The piglet's new name Babe, and nothing
could be more fitting. Third story today. For some, a
vegan diet could be the key to improving reproductive health.
According to new research, plant based diets rich in carbohydrates,

(02:10):
whole grains, and soi can increase rates of pregnancy and
live birth. According to new research. In fact, animal protein
has even been linked to disorders known to affect ovulation.
Our fourth story today. Antibiotics are routinely overused in factory farming,
and this widespread practice has serious consequences for public health

(02:33):
and the environment. This overuse has led to the emergence
of bacteria that are resistant to antibiotics and therefore pose
serious health threats In fact, since twenty nineteen, nearly one
million human deaths have been linked to these superbug bacteria.
Ed our final story today. If perusing bookstores is your

(02:55):
idea of fun, We've got great news. Barnes and Noble
has added a vegan breakfast in which to the menu
of its in store cafes available nationwide. The sandwich is
made with just egg, biolife cheese, and plant based aoli.
We'll take ten please. That's all for this week. All
of our headlines of the week will be linked to

(03:16):
in the show notes at VegNews dot com slash podcast.
Today's interviewee has been a friend of veg News for
a very long time, and we all love him very much.
You are about to as well. It's vegan bodybuilder Robert Chic.

(03:40):
Robert is a motivational speaker, an author of vegan activist,
and founder of Vegan Bodybuilding and Fitness. We recently put
Robert in the veg News hot seat for a rapid
fire Q and A. He will be joining us right
after this. Welcome to the veg News podcast. Robert.

Speaker 4 (04:07):
Thank you, Jasmine. I appreciate you having me here. Excited
to be here today.

Speaker 3 (04:10):
You're a friend of veg News for so long, and
you're also as of late, a New York Times bestseller
for your book, The Plant Based Athletes. So congratulations. That
is so exciting.

Speaker 5 (04:22):
Thank you, Jasmine.

Speaker 4 (04:23):
It has been a really a thirty three year journey
since I was eight years old and wanted to write
books and.

Speaker 5 (04:29):
A bunch of self published books.

Speaker 4 (04:31):
Finally landed this big book deal and New York Times
bestseller and we're already in seven languages.

Speaker 5 (04:36):
So I am super excited about The Plant Based Athlete.
Thank you.

Speaker 3 (04:39):
Amazing. Well, I don't want to take the I don't
want to take the excitement away from you, but I
also just sort of feel if this is okay. I
feel like it's like for all of us, for everyone
who's vegan to see a book like yours in the
New York Times bestseller list, it feels like we all
get to celebrate.

Speaker 4 (04:55):
That.

Speaker 3 (04:55):
Does that make sense?

Speaker 4 (04:56):
Well, everybody's part of it, that's the thing, you know,
Like veg News is supported me for fifteen years and
put me in the magazine and put me on the website,
on the social media pages.

Speaker 5 (05:05):
You've had me on your podcast years ago. We recorded
in Portland, Oregon. Yes, Oh my god, like everybody is
part of it.

Speaker 4 (05:13):
You know, all the people who endorsed my book or
supported my work over the years, gave me an opportunity
to speak at a vegefest, or supported my self published
books when I was selling them out of my car,
Like that's all part of it. And now it's a
number one international bestseller and that's like representation of all
of us like working together to I happen to be

(05:34):
a co author of the book, but so many people
played a role in that.

Speaker 5 (05:38):
So yourself included, and veged News included. So thank you.

Speaker 3 (05:41):
Well, you're very generous, but you have worked really hard
for this and it's very exciting. And I know that
you're often referred to as the godfather of vegan bodybuilding.
It's really too bad though that vegans, you know, don't
get enough protein and can't be strong, don't you think?

Speaker 6 (05:57):
Yeah, yeah, I've put on a hundred pounds as a
as a vegan, you know, from my days of being
a long distance runner when I was in high school
becoming vegan, weighing one hundred and twenty pounds back in
nineteen ninety five to last year before going on the
Ritual podcast, being two hundred and twenty pounds, so obviously
protein has.

Speaker 5 (06:16):
Been Yeah for me.

Speaker 3 (06:18):
Yeah, when I look at you, I'm like that guy
looks protein deprived. You know what I'm saying now, I'm
just kidding. Okay, So you are the first person on
the VEG News podcast to be in the hot seat
for our fire around questions, So don't overthink these. I
want to know the first thing that comes to your mind.
And we're going to start in three two tofu or

(06:42):
tempe tofu? What do you put it on?

Speaker 4 (06:47):
Brito bowls, sandwiches, lettuce wraps, fresh rolls, those those types
of those types of dishes.

Speaker 3 (06:57):
Rice, you know, good and hungry, peanut or almond butter,
peanut butter. Favorite way of having.

Speaker 4 (07:04):
It peanut butter, let's see, maybe on fruit, apple slices,
something like that.

Speaker 5 (07:14):
I have also a bizarre one I probably shouldn't say
on camera.

Speaker 4 (07:19):
Basically I put it on rice and make my own
like peanut sauce. But it's literally just like peanut butter
on rice or spaghetti without all the extra ingredients like
that actually makes a peanut sauce.

Speaker 3 (07:30):
So my mind was going somewhere totally different. So I'm
glad you clarified.

Speaker 5 (07:34):
I want to make it sound like vegan food is
like so boring.

Speaker 4 (07:37):
This guy just puts peanut butter on on rice and
pasta and calls it peanut sauce. So that is one
way that I enjoy it, as well as on fruit
and and in sandwiches of course, on rice cakes whatever, I.

Speaker 3 (07:50):
Personally enjoy it on a date as well as the
dried fruit. Moving on door Dash or cook at home.

Speaker 5 (07:58):
I've never used door dash before. So cook at home.

Speaker 3 (08:01):
Well, I mean ordering in or cooking at home.

Speaker 4 (08:03):
Yeah, I've rarely ever had food delivered to my house.
It's like a app technology I barely know how to use.

Speaker 5 (08:09):
So cook at Home I love it.

Speaker 3 (08:12):
I think I know the answer to this one. Instagram
or TikTok uh Instagram.

Speaker 5 (08:16):
I've never used TikTok before.

Speaker 3 (08:18):
Same, And how can people find you on Instagram? Which
is shameless plug?

Speaker 4 (08:21):
Yeah, at Robert dot Cheek or at Vegan Bodybuilding and Fitness.

Speaker 3 (08:26):
Under the vegan umbrella as always dark chocolate, milk chocolate,
or white chocolate.

Speaker 5 (08:34):
I'll go with milk chocolate.

Speaker 3 (08:35):
Oooh, I love a vegan milk chocolate all right. Now,
this one I want to know for selfish reasons because
I like to imagine people eating breakfast. It's a weird
thing about me. But pancakes or tofu scramble, tofa scramble
me too. Let's have breakfast cozy dinner or night out
on the town.

Speaker 5 (08:57):
Cozy dinner.

Speaker 3 (08:59):
Interesting. But if you were going to have a night
out on the town anywhere in the world, where would
it be.

Speaker 4 (09:04):
Oh, it would probably be somewhere in Southeast Asia. I
had a great time out there in Thailand and Indonesia,
and I I just love it out there. So I
would have some awesome vegan food out in Thailand.

Speaker 3 (09:19):
So many cuisines that are not American are just inherently
vegan friendly. And now I want some fresh spring rolls.
Book or kindle book. Okay, so like the hardcover old
school you like it? You have it? Okay, you're showing
me a book right now. Okay, I get it. Oh,
you're showing me your book?

Speaker 7 (09:38):
Perfect, Yes, I it yeah, hardcover.

Speaker 5 (09:40):
Yeah, I like to feel it.

Speaker 3 (09:42):
Yeah, press some tofu with it? Whatever. Okay, very on
brand for you. Robert. Push ups or sit ups?

Speaker 5 (09:52):
Uh push ups?

Speaker 3 (09:53):
While doing sit ups knowing you, I don't know what
that means.

Speaker 4 (09:57):
I used to do both every single day for seven
hundred and thirty nine consecutive days. Like a certain amount
of both, but push ups, I just I like it
a little bit better.

Speaker 3 (10:06):
And in my forty two years on the planet, I
think I have done a push up or a situp.
Smoothies with protein powder or without without really tell us
all why I have not.

Speaker 4 (10:21):
Used protein powders in ten years, not since twenty twelve.
I feel like I get all the protein I need
from my standard plant based diet from eating food, and
I feel like protein is often overrated and over emphasized,
and I think we kind of underemphasize the micronutrients, the vitamins, minerals,
antioxidants that come from more carbohydrate rich foods like fruits, vegetables,

(10:45):
leafy green vegetables and of course legoons, legoons and grains.
So for me, no protein powder and still no problem.

Speaker 3 (10:53):
Wonderful. Okay, Well, I have one more question for you,
but it is not part of the fire round question,
So let's take breath. You don't have to hurry if
you want. For our listeners and for me, our bonus
question is what is your favorite part about being vegan?

Speaker 4 (11:10):
My favorite part is perhaps cliche, but it's altruistic, and
it is the difference that I make in the lives
of others. That is what compelled me from the very
beginning growing up on a farm raising animals. I literally
used to bottle feed baby animals before going on the
school bus. I would show animals in four ahe at
the county fair. I unfortunately sold animals of the auction,

(11:32):
animals that were passed with first names like Tim and
Betsy and others to be turned into someone else's meal.
I decided not to do that anymore when I was
fifteen years old in nineteen ninety five, and that's what
has compelled me for more than a quarter century to
stay vegan and continue to promote veganism. It's the difference
that I'm able to make in the lives of others,

(11:53):
and that's what I love about being vegan.

Speaker 3 (11:55):
Beautifully said, it's like we get to walk the walk,
we get to live in alignment with our ethical beliefs,
and it happens to be very tasty. So, Robert Cheek,
you are such a wonderful human being in so many ways.
Please tell our listeners how they can find you online
and support your efforts and get your book.

Speaker 4 (12:13):
Thank you, Jasmine, I appreciate it. Thanks for the opportunity
and so cool through the first one on this veg
News rapid fire hot seat interview. So thank you for
thinking of me. I run Veganbodybuilding dot com and have
for about twenty years. I'm on social media just usually searching.
Robert Cheek will find me. My book is of course
on Amazon, in every major bookstore in North America and

(12:35):
now in many countries around the world, and it's called
The Plant Based Athlete, and you can find me that
way as well.

Speaker 3 (12:41):
Well. Thank you so much, Robert. We will talk to
you very soon. Please come back for a longer interview
sometime soon.

Speaker 4 (12:46):
You got it, Jasmin, Thank you for the opportunity today
and say hi to the veg News crews for me.

Speaker 3 (12:50):
We'll do.

Speaker 1 (12:53):
Thank you.

Speaker 3 (12:59):
Well is finally here and what better way to celebrate
these sunny, sunny days than to share a vegan meal
outdoors with friends and maybe frenemies. I don't know, because
sharing is caring, right. So today we're talking picnic foods,
which is one of my favorite subjects of all times.
These are the kinds of foods you can prepare quickly.
You can share easily with your loved ones for a

(13:20):
day at the beach or a lake in my case,
or maybe your neighborhood park. So here to give us
the tea on all things picnic foods is my buddy.
Veg News is food editor Eddie Garza. Welcome back to
the veg News podcast.

Speaker 7 (13:34):
Eddie, Thank you so much, Jasmine. Always amazing being here
with you. I miss our day's picnicking together.

Speaker 3 (13:41):
I know we have to set that up, so let's
just jump right in. Let's talk picnics. First question, are
you a fan of picnics or like eating alfresco? I am.

Speaker 7 (13:52):
I love a good picnic.

Speaker 5 (13:54):
I'm from Texas.

Speaker 7 (13:55):
I'm an outdoorsy guy, so I'm always up for eating
al resco, but especially now that I live here in
the beach cities of southern California, where the weather is
generally perfect year round, apart from the occasional blizzard.

Speaker 1 (14:07):
Right.

Speaker 7 (14:08):
But apart from that, I just think picnics are so
much fun. They're a great way to meet people casually,
people in the community who you maybe have never met before,
learn about their cultures through their meals, and just have
a good time.

Speaker 3 (14:19):
Yeah, I'm a big fan too. You know, sometimes I
get annoyed by it ahead of time, and every time
i'm there, I'm like, oh, I'm so glad i'm here.
But the reason I get annoyed is because it's overwhelming.
I'm not It's not a natural inclination for me to
make a ton of food for everyone to eat. Help me.

Speaker 7 (14:37):
Yeah, I totally get that. And actually that's one of
the misconceptions about going to big potlucks or picnics is
that people think they've got to make enough food for everybody. Now,
if it's a small group, like say six to eight people,
sure you're going to want to pack about six to
eight servings of whatever it is you're making. But if
we're talking about a large gathering, like the kind that
some of our friends would throw in New York or LA,

(15:00):
you really still only need to pack enough to serve
about six to eight people. Because think about it, if
you're going to have like thirty to fifty people showing
up with thirty to fifty servings of whatever it is
they're bringing, everybody is going to have to eat thirty
to fifty servings or we end up with a bunch
of food waste. So the general rule is to always
pack as much food as you personally are going to eat,
and then, of course you want to think about how

(15:21):
you pack it too.

Speaker 3 (15:22):
Wait, hang on with it, What does that mean how
it's packed?

Speaker 7 (15:25):
Yeah, well, whether your picnic is at a beach, a park,
or anywhere outdoors, all fresco meals tend to get messy
pretty easily and pretty quickly. For example, if you're going
to be making a hummus for a picnic, maybe instead
of packing it in a large container where it's surely
going to lose its freshness or attract uninvited critters outdoors
just minutes after unwrapping it, you're going to want to

(15:46):
package that individually and maybe small tupperware or eco friendly
disposable containers, because the last thing you want is to
take a large bowl of something you prepared and then
have it go to waste. So what I do is
I package things like hummus or any kind of dip
into individual tuppers, and I put them inside paper bags
with pre portioned pita chips or tortilla chips, and then

(16:09):
simply add a tag to the bag so that people
can pass by just grab a bag and then go
sit down and find their place at the picnic super easy.

Speaker 3 (16:16):
That is such a smart idea. And by the way,
I love that you say tuppers. That's so cute. I've
never heard before. It's so normal. But even at indoor potlux, right,
you always see that bowl of it's definitely half eaten
hummus with those really gross, crusty edges that like nobody
wants to touch because it's been sitting there for hours.
And this is not a good advertisement for veganism.

Speaker 7 (16:38):
Right exactly. I mean, how many potlucks have we been
to where we see that big bowl of hummus that
look delicious maybe at one point, but the edges are crusty,
nobody wants to touch it. You don't know if it's
been double dipped. So the general rule applies to anything
that is going to be in a large cast role
type of situation. Just don't do it. Instead of bringing

(16:59):
your pots salad or your potato salad in a large
bowl packet individually. And also leave your mom's lasagna at home, please.
Your mom's lasagna is a raw zucchini lasagna with Macademi recoditis,
meant to be eaten at room temperature. Then yes, please
bring that, just of course, make sure to pack it
individually so that your guests can enjoy it and they

(17:19):
don't have to go fighting for the best looking piece.

Speaker 5 (17:23):
I just need your mouthwater.

Speaker 3 (17:24):
Yeah, me too, And I'm actually now searching for a
mom who makes rawasaangna. You know, my mom's going to
listen to this and she's next time I see her,
she's going to present me with macadamia lasagna. But anyway,
oh man, Eddie, I still remember that zucchini raw zangna
that we shared at Quintessence in New York City. Do
you remember that when you first moved there from Texas?

(17:45):
Oh my god, that was It was so good. It
was like decad in and it had this sun dried
tomato sauce. Oh my god, I want it right now.
I would welcome that, you know, at any picnic. But
since we are not in New York City right now,
what other food would you suggest for the perfect summer picnic?

Speaker 7 (18:03):
Yes? Of course, God, that was so delicious, and God,
I do remember that, and I remember all our fun
times together. But you know, one of the things that
I love about picnics is that you can really bring
all your favorite chilled or room temperature foods. Those are
really going to be always the best things to bring.
Anything people can easily grab at their hands put on
a plate. And of course I love it when guests

(18:23):
bring a little bit of their culture to the picnic table.
So for instance, I love it when I see Vietnamese
spring rolls, texmex pinwheels, falafel, and of course sandwiches are
always great. How about like a tempe blt, something with tempe,
or maybe even a Chautaki mushroom bacon on an everything bagel? Yes, please,

(18:43):
And of course if you want to make like an
Italian fortata which can be eaten hot or cold, or
a Spanish tortilla, you can bake that egg mixture into
a cupcake mold so we can be served individually instead
of a large cast role. And of course, going back
to other things, we can bring desserts like cookies and cupcakes.
Those are always a graded should it any picnic, And
you don't want to forget the adult beverages. That's never adult,

(19:04):
and in fact there's sometimes what keeps the party going.

Speaker 3 (19:07):
Yes, you definitely have got my number right there. You
should come back and talk about adult beverages. By the way,
I would really enjoy that. I would too.

Speaker 5 (19:15):
Let's do it.

Speaker 3 (19:16):
Anything that you are particularly excited about these days that
you are eating when you're not at.

Speaker 7 (19:21):
A picnic, I guess, Oh my gosh, well, right now,
I've been doing a lot of training because I'm trying
to gain some muscle these days, so I've been eating
lots of high protein foods. And that's such a cool
thing to explore right now with the veganism. A lot
of people who try veganism for the first time, thing
or am I going to get my protein? I know
it's an old question, but we still get it. And

(19:42):
the thing is that there are so many fortified plant
based foods that are super high in protein. And one
of the things that I've been really digging these days
is making my tofoo scramble with Trader Joe's extra packed
like super high protein tofood.

Speaker 3 (19:57):
Oh I know you mean, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's right, incredible.

Speaker 7 (20:00):
The entire package has seventy grams of proteins. So imagine
that in a tof you scramble, that is your protein
for the day in the morning. So I've been really
digging on that.

Speaker 3 (20:11):
Eddie Garza, you have to go because you have to
start preparing the adult beverage segment because I'm just going
to be waiting. But thank you so much. Tell our
listeners how they can follow you online.

Speaker 7 (20:21):
Thank you so much, Jasmine. You can follow me on
Instagram and Facebook at the Eddie Garza, and of course
follow us on VegNews dot com, where we have so
many delicious recipes and you're going to find so many
fabulous recipes in our summer issue. You do not want
to miss it.

Speaker 3 (20:34):
Eddie, Thank you, thank you, thank you. The veg News
podcast hotline is open for business. Call me with all
of your vegan questions and your vegan needs. You can
reach me at eight eight eight nine to one Vegan.

(20:55):
That's eight eight eight nine to one vegan. All right,
let's get it. Today's questions. Stacy in Santa Cruz, says Jasmine.

Speaker 4 (21:04):
I know you've lived in both New York City and
Los Angeles. What are your favorite restaurants in those cities?

Speaker 3 (21:09):
Thanks well, Stacy, It's true I lived in New York
City for nearly twenty years, and therefore my answers are
going to maybe surprise you because I know that a
whole lot of other amazing vegan restaurants open, but there
are some classics that I still just love. Hungawi, which
is vegan Korean food, to me, is like one of

(21:31):
the most special places and it's I love to get
the bulls there. They have like just the most wonderful
date paste tea. There's Porridges. Oh. In fact, I'm going
to the city really soon and that is what I'm
doing the first night I arrive. I also love PS
Kitchen because it is right in Midtown and there's not

(21:53):
like a ton of vegan food in Midtown, and I
am a theater goer, so I go to PS Kitchen.
I use usually go before the theater, so like pretty
early because the show's already either seven or eight. I'll
also sit at the bar, which I really enjoy doing.
And then my final favorite in New York City is
Buddha Bodai on Mott Street, which has been there for

(22:16):
so long. Buddha Bodai has long been one of my
go to places being in Chinese food, and it's just
a really special experience because it's also in the middle
of Chinatown, and I mean, you don't really get better
than Chinatown in New York City, all right. In La
let's see, I loved living in Los Angeles. I lived
there for years as well. I lived very close to Crossroads,

(22:40):
which was a little higher end. They had a beautiful
outdoor area. I like the kind of hustle and bustle
of West Hollywood of that area. So Crossroads you can't
go wrong. You also can't go wrong at Nick's on
Beverly and that's an ICUs Nicks. Oh my gosh. I
have had also probably the best wine there, and I
like to say in their garden, so hot tip sit

(23:02):
in the garden. And my final place, because I told
you I like vegan Asian food, is my Vegan Gold
or one of the many other Thaie vegan places. I
love my Vegan Gold. It's very casual, so you could
just like hop over there, no reservation or anything. It's
actually like in a strip mall where my dentist was,
so every time I went to the dentist, I then

(23:23):
immediately ruined whatever they did to my teeth by going
and eating my Vegan Gold. But it's so good. It's
everyone there is so nice. So I hope you enjoy
your trips to New York City in La Okay. The
second question is from Lyla in Kansas.

Speaker 5 (23:41):
I love to cook and eat.

Speaker 4 (23:43):
Where can I find great, easy to make vegan recipes?

Speaker 3 (23:46):
Thank you well, Lilah, I'm so glad you asked this question.
There are thousands of plant based recipes that you can
filter by meal type, ingredients, on hand, a holiday, and
many other things at vegnos dot com. No further than
veg news dot com and veg News Magazine. Our team
creates the perfect and most incredible recipes for each issue.

(24:07):
I salivate every time the new issue comes out. Seriously,
there is seriously nothing like the recipes in our magazine.
So definitely check that out at VegNews dot com and
don't forget to call me with your vegan questions. That
is eight eight eight nine one Vegan eight eight eight
nine one Vegan. Let's check in with VegNews publisher Colleen

(24:33):
Holland to hear the latest on all of the exciting
things happening at Vegnewshq. Hi, Colleen, tell us what's going
on this week at veg News.

Speaker 8 (24:42):
Hey, Jasmine, it's great to be back on the Veggies podcast.
I just wanted to stop by and wish everyone a
very happy summer. I can't believe it's finally here after
such a long winter.

Speaker 3 (24:54):
But I also just.

Speaker 5 (24:56):
Want to invite everyone to head over to vegees dot com.

Speaker 3 (24:58):
We have so many great summer recipes.

Speaker 2 (25:01):
We've got editor taste tests for everything from veggie burgers
and sausages to ice cream. We have guides to drilling
guides to sunscreen beach snacks. We just have a lot
of great summer stories for our podcast listeners and for
our readers, So please head on over to bed news
dot com.

Speaker 3 (25:35):
Thank you so much for joining us for this week's
episode of the veg News podcast. Head over to VegNews
dot com slash podcast for all the show notes, and
be sure to check out bevegnews dot com each day
for the latest in plant based news, recipes, taste us guides,
and so much more. And don't forget to subscribe to

(25:56):
our award winning magazine to have the best of the
vegan lifestyle delivered straight to your doorstep. I want to
send a special thank you to the team at straw
Hut Media and to Colleen Holland, Eddie Garza, Sarah McLaughlin,
Vicky Beechler, and Laurie Johnston for their work in the
production of this podcast, and a huge thank you to

(26:16):
our wonderful podcast sponsor, Mudwater. I'm your host, Jasmine Singer,
and I'll see you next week. Bye for now.
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