June 6, 2025 • 35 mins
Grace Schafer is not your average hairstylist. A red hair enthusiast, cutting specialist, wedding artist, and certified extension artist, from IMAGE Studios in Grand Rapids, Michigan, she has carved out a unique niche in the beauty industry by combining her passion for theater, science, and hair design. With a keen eye for color theory and a commitment to educating her clients, Grace has built The Hair Lab into a thriving independent business that challenges traditional salon approaches.
In this inspiring episode of The VIP Suite podcast, Grace shares her journey from commissioned stylist to independent business owner, revealing the mindset shifts, challenges, and transformative moments that have shaped her career. From helping clients through personal struggles to mastering the delicate art of red hair formulation, Grace demonstrates how creativity, scientific understanding, and a genuine desire to empower clients can lead to professional success and personal fulfillment.
Find her on Instagram: @thehairlab.ges and TikTok: @gmistster
The VIP Suite is the official podcast of IMAGE Studios, created for independent beauty, health, and wellness professionals who want to grow their businesses and thrive in salon suite life. Hosted by Director of Education, Matthew Landis, each episode shares real success stories, marketing tips, and business strategies from top beauty entrepreneurs and wellness leaders.
This episode is sponsored by GlossGenius, the all-in-one salon software designed to help independent professionals book appointments, accept payments, manage schedules, and build strong beauty brands. Learn more at glossgenius.com.
Don’t forget to follow, rate, and review the show on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen. Connect with us on Instagram @imagestudios360 and visit imagestudios360.com for more information about IMAGE Studios luxury salon suites. New episodes drop every two week. Subscribe to hear how beauty and wellness professionals like you are building powerful, independent careers.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Matthew Landis (00:00):
Welcome to The VIP Suite, the podcast for Salon
(00:03):
Suite professionals who arebuilding bold, brilliant
businesses. I'm your host.
Matthew Landis, former salonowner, business coach and
lifelong advocate forentrepreneurs in the beauty and
wellness industry. Each week wespotlight industry MVPs, from
hairstylists, estheticians, nailand lash artists and a wide
array of solo entrepreneurs whoarecreating success on their own
terms, you'll hear strategiesfor marketing, client, growth
(00:24):
mindset and overall Salon Suitesuccess, plus honest
conversations about what itreally takes to thrive. This
season, we're going even deeperinto growth, grit, community and
all the messy magic that comeswith carving your own path. So
hit subscribe, turn up thevolume, and welcome to The VIP
Suite where independent beautyand wellness pros come to shine.
(00:49):
Hey, IMAGE Pros, your businessdeserves booking, payment and
client management tools aselevated as your space. That's
why GlossGenius's, top ratedsalon software is included in
your lease at all inclusivelocations, giving you everything
you need to grow your businesswith less busy work with one
flat 2.6% payment processingrate, you can save 1000s on
(01:09):
hidden fees. Clients can book injust 30 seconds with no app
downloads or logins. On average,businesses see a 27% + increase
in revenue within the first yearon GlossGenius. So sign up today
with coupon code IMAGEPRO in andselect your location to start
making the most of GlossGenius.
Joining me today on The VIPsuite is Grace Schaefer in Grand
(01:30):
Rapids, Michigan. Welcome to thepodcast, Grace,
Grace Schafer (01:34):
Hi. Thank you so much for having me.
Matthew Landis (01:36):
Well. Thank you so much for being here. Grace
is, according to her Instagram,is a red hair enthusiast, a
cutting specialist, an extensionspecialist, a wedding
specialist, and as I justrecently found out, also does
wig design, which I'm absolutelyfascinated with.
Grace Schafer (01:55):
Yes, it is. It is a really fun way to bring my
passion for theater andperforming together with hair,
and it allows a little bit morelike, creativity outside of the
chair, doing period pieces andjust like, hey, can you make
horns out of hair? Like, can youdo that? Just things like that.
It's just, it's fun, things Idon't get to do behind the chair
(02:15):
every day.
Matthew Landis (02:16):
Red hair enthusiast. Now that's the top
of your list. So I'm reallycurious about that. Tell me more
about your red hair enthusiasm.
Grace Schafer (02:25):
Well as a fake redhead myself, I don't know how
much you can tell, but I havebeen red for about five years,
and I absolutely love red hairformulation. There's just
something about it, likebalancing red and orange and
gold to find the perfectcombination for everyone. This
might be a hot take. I thinkeveryone can be a redhead. What
(02:46):
kind of redhead you are isdependent on your skin tone and
all that fun stuff. So that hasalways been really fascinating
to me, and it's a very delicateprocess, because if you add a
little too much red, like if Iadd too much red into my
formula, I look terrible. I haveto have a very orange based red
hair color. So it is been areally fun and just like, really
(03:10):
fun thing for me to focus on. Ifind a lot of I just find a lot
of joy in it. And I think thered hair gives a certain type
of, like, extra bit ofconfidence and fun energy.
Matthew Landis (03:21):
Well, there's a whole psychology behind red
hair. You know, I read astatistic once that there are
more CEOs, women, CEOs andexecutives with red hair than
any other color.
Unknown (03:33):
Well, I guess there must be something to it. Then,
okay, I love that. I did notknow that.
Matthew Landis (03:38):
You know, I was a blonde hair specialist, so I
know that sort of passion andinterest in really sort of
problem solving and figuring itout, I did a lot of red hair as
well, and red hair is a lot moredifficult than people think. So
what are the challenges when itcomes to formulating red hair?
Unknown (03:56):
I get a lot of people who are very fair, and who those
fair clients who want to be red,not making them too red, if that
makes sense, using more gold andcopper versus actual like fire
(04:18):
truck engine red, the justtrying to, trying to do the
balance between everything andmaking it fit their skin tone
the best, just a little bit toomuch red. Red is a very powerful
color, and really likes to takeover a formula if you add even
just a little bit too much. Sofinding that delicate balance is
really important.
Matthew Landis (04:37):
Yeah, I think when we think of red hair, we're
thinking of orange hair, we'rethinking of golden hair,
usually, so it sort of getspainted with this, you know,
broad brush as red. But thereare so many, so much nuance when
it comes to red. One of thechallenges I always had is
making it not brown out. What?
Yeah, the tips you have for notbrowning out. Especially the mid
(04:59):
shafts and the ends.
Grace Schafer (05:02):
Not being afraid to use an intensifier. I think
that was something when I firstreally started getting a larger
red hair clientele. Honestly,after I went red, it was like I
had all of all of a sudden, allof these thread heads in my
chair, which tends, tends tohappen you reflect your
clientele. So I think for me,like finally getting the
(05:26):
confidence to be like, I'm gonnatake 744, and it's gonna be
okay, um, you know, it's it'sgonna give it that extra kick
that it needs, so that it's notimmediate, either immediately
browned out or doesn't fade intobrown in the next three days.
When you wash it, I mean red,red and orange fade the fastest.
So it's, it's important toalmost leave them feeling like,
(05:49):
almost like, really vibrant, oralmost too vibrant, so then they
can have that longevity as theylive with it for the next, you
know, six, eight weeks.
Matthew Landis (05:57):
Well, I can tell you really love a challenge,
because you have all of theseother specialties as well. So
what I'm getting from this isyou're not someone who likes to
just sort of coast.
Grace Schafer (06:06):
No, I get bored really easily. I really like to
have my hands in everything. Iwould definitely classify myself
as like a jack of all trades. Ilove to kind of have a hand in
everything. I've got like eighthands, one and is in is in each
thing? Um, yeah, I I have foundthat if I stick with one thing
(06:31):
for too long, or do the samething for too long, even that, I
think that happens to a lot ofstylists behind the chair, where
you get kind of caught up in thein the mundane, and you have
your touches and you have thesame clientele, I find that that
can be uninspiring sometimes,and you just kind of get in that
rut, that creative rut, and itmakes you not it dulls your fire
(06:53):
a little bit. And so, you know,learning new skills and taking
education classes and and doingwigs and doing red hair and
bridal and like having such avariety in my day really keeps
the flicker alive.
Matthew Landis (07:07):
So tell me a little bit more about your
business.
Grace Schafer (07:09):
The Hair Lab is my business. That was a name my
dad and I came up with. I wasalways really fascinated with
the science behind hairdressing.
Hairdressing, of course, is socreative and artistic, but it's
also very technical, and lookingat the science of it, if you're
stumped with a problem, thescience will always bring you
(07:30):
home like as long as youunderstand the science properly,
you can pretty much overcome anyissue, whether it's an issue a
client is having with theirscalp or with their the ends of
their hair, or with their color.
The science of color theory, andthe science of the science is
always going to bring you homeand be able to solve any
problem. And I really try mybest to educate my clients on
(07:52):
the science and tell them why.
So for example, with let's saysomeone has really straight
hair, and they're like, Well, myhair doesn't curl. And I was
like, Okay, well here's why it'snot curling. I'm gonna explain
to you how this works. Yourhydrogen bonds in your hair get
broken and reformed into this,into the curl. And while they're
(08:14):
hot, they're still pliable. Soif you brush your hair while
it's hot, it's not going to stayright. And so explaining why it
works and and why I'm saying,Hey, don't brush your hair until
it's cooled down. Because Icould just say that, and they
could be like, okay, but I don'tknow why I'm not supposed to do
that, right? So just, I thinkthat knowledge is power, and
(08:35):
knowledge equals trust, andtrust equals respect. And I want
my clients to feel like they cantrust me. And I think that just
comes from sharing my knowledgewith them, and that, in turn,
solves a lot of problems forthem at home, and that's what
keeps them in my chair.
Matthew Landis (08:55):
I don't think a lot of people know that aren't
in this industry, in the beautyand wellness industry, and this
goes for estheticians and nailartists and anybody sort of in
this creative line of work,there is so much science behind
it. There's chemistry andphysics and architecture and,
you know, gravity, those are allthings that are really important
(09:15):
in understanding the work thatwe do, which is so fascinating.
So tell me a little bit moreabout what made you decide to go
independent into business foryourself.
Unknown (09:25):
I worked commissioned for the first six years of my
career. I've I'm approachingeight years in the hair
industry, and I workedcommissioned for six years. And
I think it's something that as abeginner stylist when you're in
your first like five years ofyour three to five years of your
career, I think it's reallyimportant to do, and it really
(09:49):
allowed me to build my clienteleand not focus so much on
inventory and balancing my booksand doing all of that, because I
do all of that myself now, andit's it's a lot, and I. Know
that as a beginner baby, I wouldnot have been able to do that.
That would have been way toomuch. So I think it's like I did
it for a long time. I grew outof it and the numbers, I'm a
(10:11):
numbers. Gal, I'm a science anda numbers gal, the numbers just
didn't sit well with me. Youknow, making, I made like,
anywhere between 45 to 50%commission in my commission time
and and that's before tax. So atthe end of the day, out of $100
I'm seeing probably $35 aftertax. That doesn't sit very well
with me. So at the end of theday, it came down to, I want to
(10:34):
see more from my work, becausethat's it's it's worth that, and
I'm willing to take on theinventory, the balancing of the
books, the ordering all of thisstuff, responding to everybody,
dealing with all of the all ofany issues that come up because
I don't have a manager I cansend them off to anymore, right?
So even if I was making the sameamount of money, which is not
(10:57):
true, but even if I was, theperks of having full control, of
choosing what I want to carry,what services I want to do, what
I want to advertise, when I wantto go on vacation, when I want
to perform in a show or take ona wig designing gig, I just can
do that. And there were just itwas really hard to say no,
(11:19):
specifically to image,especially, it was really hard
to say no to that.
Matthew Landis (11:24):
What was so hard to say no to image about so
Unknown (11:27):
I had kind of already had it in my head that I wanted
to be independent. I'm Chairrental was not super appealing
to me, mostly because it wasjust, I'm like, if we're gonna
bite the bullet, let's just doit. You know, get a get a room,
right? So I was looking around,and so I'm from West Michigan, a
lot of it's not as trendy.
That's typically a little bitbehind in terms of, like,
(11:52):
comparing to New York orCalifornia, you're a little,
we're, we get things like, ayear or two later, right? Which
is normal, totally fine. Butlooking at all of the other
sweet spaces in town, I just waslike, it's this, more of the
same. It's white, it's oldschool, it's white, as in color
scheme, like it's beige, it'sit's basic, and there's nothing
(12:16):
wrong with that. If that is yourif that's what you like, that is
totally okay. That's just wasn'tsomething I was looking for. And
I got a message from ZachDuggar, who runs our location,
and it was like, Oh my gosh,this was, this is what I've been
looking for. It's editorial,it's clean, it's luxurious, it's
(12:37):
new. Like, there is. It's thefirst location in Michigan,
hopefully not the last, and it'sthe first location in Michigan.
And I was like, no one's donethis yet. I mean, it's kind of a
fatal flaw. I want to do thingsthat people don't do, or I want
to be the first one to do it,and sometimes that's a fatal
flaw, but no one's done thisyet. And it's, it's clean, it's
(12:59):
fresh, it's new, and it's it'svery editorial, and that's what
I wanted, and it that is thefeedback that I've gotten my
clients. They walk in the doorand they're like, this place is
nice, you know? And that'sexactly what I wanted. So it was
really, really hard to say no,in your partnership with gloss
genius, I love gloss genius.
I've been using, I use that atmy previous salon as well, and I
(13:23):
just love it. The perks thelandlord, the location, is
phenomenal. It's at a great spotin Grand Rapids, so, and it's
across from a Starbucks. That'sjust a fun little perk. That was
just like, okay, that's just thecherry on top. I was already
committed, but that's just a funlittle cherry on top to it, but
it was, it well, all of thatconsidered, it was very, very
(13:44):
hard to say no to that.
Matthew Landis (13:45):
That's a great endorsement. And, you know, I've
been with IMAGE since the beforethe first one was even built.
And one of our biggest goals wasalways to make things sexy,
because this is a fashionindustry. So we wanted luxury,
luxury, and we wanted ourbranding and everything that we
do to be sexy and fashionable.
So it's nice to hear that. Solet me ask you a question about
(14:06):
mindset Yeah. So have youexperienced any sort of mindset
shift since you went independentas a professional?
Unknown (14:18):
100% Yeah, totally. I think also, especially after,
like, my first six months of ofbusiness. And it was kind of, it
was, there was that first sixmonths of transition period. I
have a very good friend of minewho is in sales, and she would
always, she's always talking meup whenever we're out at the
(14:39):
bar, whatever, anyone who gets acompliment on her hair, she
always says something. Or whenshe introduces me, she'll, you
know, she will say what I do andand she'd always say, yeah,
she's a business owner. And I'mlike, Ah, am I? Though it's kind
of very imposter syndromy Andshe and there was one thing that
she said to me. I was like, Idon't know if I like, am. I
(15:00):
though. And she was like, well,think about it, a restaurant
lease is a building, but thatdoesn't make them any less an
owner. And I was like, You're soright. And I just had this,
like, after I got through thatlittle bit of imposter syndrome,
it was just like, Okay, watchout world. Here I come. Like, I
had a much easier time creatingboundaries and knowing my worth
(15:22):
and knowing what I was willingto take and what I was willing
to bend over backwards for, andwhat I wasn't willing to bend
over backwards for, whereasbefore I was like, I will do
whatever, like, I will takewhatever I'll get yelled out in
the salon, whatever, like, it'sfine, like, I'll just deal with
it, and I have my confidence isis much better, and it the the
(15:44):
mindset shift. It is interestingthat you asked that, um, because
that has been a huge thing inthe last like year and a half.
Matthew Landis (15:55):
I've had those moments too, where, you know,
I've started a new endeavor, andit takes a while to own that new
identity and to be like, Yeah,you know what? This is, who I
am? Yeah, absolutely. Period,end of sentence, period.
Hey, IMAGE Pros, your businessdeserves booking, payment and
(16:15):
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(16:36):
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(16:59):
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making the most of GlossGenius.
What's the most surprising ormeaningful transformation that
(17:22):
you have helped a client with?
Unknown (17:24):
So I had this is, this is one that sticks out to me.
I'm I haven't thought this is agreat question. I haven't
thought about this in a longtime. A family friend of mine,
his mom, who has, she hasParkinson's, and she's also she
has cancer. I believe she is inremission now, but at the time
she came and she she had gottenthis beautiful wig, just this
(17:50):
insane, like human hair, fulllike lace all the way around,
just this amazing wig. She hadgotten it, and she was, she had
asked me to just like, kind ofcut it, style it, teach her how
to style it. And I sat down withher, and we just, like, talked
through all of that and and Iwas like, Hey, you get the best
of both worlds, because youliterally get to pop your hair
off and do it and then put it onyour head. I can't even tell you
(18:14):
how many times I wish I could dothat. Just pop my head off, my
body, into my hair, and cut myhair even, and put it back on so
sitting down with her andgetting to do that, and the fact
that she's a family friend, andher son is a good friend of
mine, and so it was just reallycool to be able to do that for
her, and it meant the world toher too. And so it was just
(18:34):
things like that. I just just, Ijust like to help people and
bring people joy and to makethem feel confident and
beautiful. And I was able to dothat for her in a time where
time where she was reallystruggling. And that's just like
everything to me.
Matthew Landis (18:47):
Those kinds of experiences can be very
humbling, I think, because wetake for granted what we do on a
daily basis, and then when wehave the opportunity to make a
difference for someone likethat, it means the world to us.
And you never know whatanybody's going through on a on
a daily basis. I always sort ofbristle at when people say, Oh,
(19:07):
you're like a therapist, and I'mlike, I am not a therapist. I do
not want that responsibility,no. But we often, in a way, I
get the comparison, because wehold space for people, and we do
change lives in really profoundways that sometimes we're not
even expecting to do. Yeah,yeah. Thank you sharing that is
(19:31):
there a client of yours that haschallenged you in a way that has
changed the way that you work?
Unknown (19:37):
Okay? The first person who comes to mind, she is, she's
awesome. She I started doing herhair when her hair was long, and
now she's got this, like, think,like, boy band, soft mullet,
just like, has really helped hercome into her identity as a
queer individual, and thattransformation like her, and
(19:57):
she's gone on a full healthjourney to her hair. You. To
like, not grow. It was dry. Itjust wasn't do anything. And she
went on a journey with herself.
And in turn, I got to see howher hair just chant, oh my gosh,
just the way it changed. It'sgrowing like a weed now, and
it's so healthy and hydrated.
And with that too, like havinggoing from here to here and like
(20:24):
to then the chin and thecheekbone, and then getting
really short, and kind of justdipping one toe at a time and
having her come back every timebe like, Okay, I'm ready for
more. I'm ready for more. I'mnot ready for more. I'm ready
for more and like, and justchanging it and just kind of
adapting to whatever she wasmost comfortable with, I think
was a challenge, but such a funone, because it just kind of
(20:46):
made me stand back and think ittakes you out of your your
routine, out of your musclememory, of of doing the same
formula, same haircuts onpeople, and just kind of makes
you step back and be like, Huh,okay. And it has just been so
fun to be able to play with her,play with her hair and her
style. And she's really foundsomething that she loves now,
(21:08):
and it's the soft like boy bandmullet, and it's, it's been
Matthew Landis (21:13):
I love those clients that really challenge us
awesome for her.
to do more. And you know what?
Sometimes, frankly, I'm not inthe mood. I Good. I love having
to sort of pause and take a deepbreath and go, okay. You know,
this is my seventh haircuttoday, but this is going to be
the one that is going to reallyset me apart. And let's do it.
(21:35):
What is one lesson that you wishyou had learned earlier in your
career?
Unknown (21:48):
Don't think about it too hard. Just like, don't it's
gonna be okay. It's gonna beokay. Take a deep breath. Don't
think about it too hard. Youknow what you're doing. Relax.
Matthew Landis (22:01):
I give this advice all the time because, you
know, I moved to New York aboutfive years into my career, and I
worked for a big corporatecompany there, and I had to go
through their training program,and it was so intense, like it
was, and they really made yousweat. And when I say sweat, I
mean sweat. I would I wouldbreak out in a cold sweat, until
(22:24):
one day I was working on mymannequin head, I think, and I
was just trying so hard to beperfect, and I wanted it to be
perfect, because I wanted toprove that I could do this. And
I just couldn't take it anymore.
So I just looked up from thehaircut, and I just was like,
looked out the window and Iwatched the world go by, and I
thought nobody outside thiswindow on this salon gives a
(22:46):
what is going on in here. Theydon't care. This is just a
haircut. It is just a mannequinhead. This is not the world, and
I will survive this. And so Ijust take a deep breath and and
do the best that I can. And thatwas such a watershed moment for
me. So I'm really glad that youshared that.
Unknown (23:10):
Yeah, it's, it's such an important lesson. And I try
and give it not to make a pun, Itry and give myself grace. Of
course, I think we, as we allshould. I'm 25 when I started my
career, I was 19, and it's evento learn. I'm so grateful to
even learn the lesson that Ilearned as as young as I am
(23:31):
right now. I know, I know thereare so many people who don't
learn that until they're older,and I'm just grateful to have
come to that point, because Ithink it is detrimental to your
mental health, to constantlyoverthink things, and to be so
hard on yourself, and of course,I am sometimes, but then it's
just kind of like, hey, it'sgonna be all right. Don't think
(23:53):
about it too hard. You're gonnabe okay.
Matthew Landis (23:56):
You know what?
It's just hair. Yeah, it is.
Unknown (23:59):
It's just hair. It probably will grow back, right?
Yeah,
Matthew Landis (24:04):
Hopefully. There were times in my career where I
had to remind myself. I wentinto this to have fun. Yeah,
this is supposed to be fun. Soif I'm not having fun, then we
have a problem. I have aproblem.
Grace Schafer (24:20):
Why am I doing it?
Matthew Landis (24:22):
I need to get back to the reason that I went
into this and that really helpedguide me. What is a philosophy
of yours that sort of guidesyou?
Unknown (24:31):
I think this is something I say a lot, and
anyone who knows me, who listen,who is listening to this will
hopefully giggle, is, I alwayssay awareness is the first step,
just being aware, and even iflike you, even if you made a
mistake, you said something youshouldn't have, or you're
(24:51):
noticing a pattern of likebehind the chair, I'm noticing
I'm falling into a rut. Beingaware of that is the first step
to growing and I. I hesitate tosay the word fixing it, but
like, improving it. Yeah, thatis, that is something I always
say. If a friend's like, well, Idon't, I don't know, but I did
notice this, and I'm like, well,awareness is the first step. And
(25:12):
that's, and that's that, that'sthat that is something that does
really drive me, and something Ido kind of live by.
Matthew Landis (25:19):
That is so simple but so powerful. You
know, I listen to a lot ofEckhart Tolle. Do you know who
he is? He wrote a new earth andthe power of now. He's a
spiritual guru. He talks a lotabout awareness and
consciousness, and we are notour thoughts, but sometimes when
we are having anxiety, justbeing aware and saying to
(25:41):
ourselves, you're having anxietylike this isn't real, that that
can sometimes really help, andwe can get back to being present
and letting go of thoughts whenwe're just aware that they are
thoughts.
Unknown (25:56):
Yeah, absolutely.
That's huge. That's huge.
Matthew Landis (25:59):
I have to tell myself all the time, I am not my
thoughts, I am not my, I am notmy thoughts.
Grace Schafer (26:04):
I love that. I am not my thoughts. I'm not my
thoughts.
Matthew Landis (26:08):
This has been great. So if you can
revolutionize one thing in thebeauty industry, the beauty and
wellness industry, what would itbe?
Unknown (26:16):
I feel like there's a lot of this is like a
hairstylist. Worst Enemy is likeTikTok, right?All of this, like
hearsay about a lot of things.
Like, over information. There'sso much information on the
internet. I love the internet.
The internet is great, but itis. There's so much information
and which represents so muchconfusion for clients. And I
(26:39):
think if I could revolutionizeanything. It would just be a way
to, like, quit the quit, the BSand quit and just like, have
clean, clear information. Andlike, a solid way, a solid way
to, like, get that out to peopleand that. So the word just kind
of all on the same page. And Ithink there are so many people
(27:00):
out there who are motivated bybrand deals and by money, and
people who are not licensed andwho are like, this is what's
good for your hair? And Isomething like says, Who?
Where's your certification,where's your schooling, where's
your license. I want to see it,you know. And I think that is
confusing for clients who seethese people with these big
followings who have nocredentials, and then people
(27:22):
with credentials who don't haveas some there are some people,
some styles out there who dohave, have those big followings
and those big numbers, but thereare a lot of hair stylists that
don't, and it's just hard tofigure out who to trust, and it
just makes everything veryconfusing. So I think if I could
revolutionize anything. It wouldbe that just to try and filter
(27:43):
that a little bit better.
Matthew Landis (27:44):
It seems to be one of a philosophy of yours,
that you that you provide thatfor your clients. You mentioned
that earlier, explaining thescience, explaining the reasons,
and sort of cutting through thenoise and providing a sort of
space for your clients tounderstand and get a better
understanding of what they need,and that's so important. And I
(28:06):
think one of this also goes backto owning your identity. And you
know, I am the professional, Iam the expert. I am here to help
you. I am here to tell you whatwhat the truth is and what the
science is. And I love that youare able to do that and that
that's so important to you.
Unknown (28:24):
Thank you. Yeah, it I think also, too, I love to
create that space of like, I'mgoing to give you some
knowledge, but this is also asafe space for you to ask me
questions. If you don't know howto curl your hair, I'm not going
to look at you and be like, youdon't you know? Like, I'm never
going to do that. It's a placefor exploration and curiosity
and for learning things, andthere's, there's no like,
(28:46):
there's no such thing as astupid question, and my book,
unless we I've already told youand you didn't listen the first
time, but, but there's no suchthing as a stupid question. And
I think that, again, it justcomes back to knowledge. Is
power, knowing why I'm tellingyou to do something, not just
that. I'm telling you it'sreally important to create that
(29:08):
space for learning. Just ingeneral, you know.
Matthew Landis (29:11):
You're such a smart, cool, easy person to be
around that I am sure that yourclients absolutely love you, and
they probably want to do rightby you. They're like, you know,
Grace told me to do this.
Unknown (29:28):
They do and almost to a fault where they're like, Look.
I know I told I know you told meto do my bangs, but I didn't do
them today. Don't look at them.
And I'm like, relax. It's you'rea human. I'm a human. My bangs
are I'm like, my bangs are slicktoday too. So it's okay, um, you
know, yeah, they I, I'm sureevery hairstylist says this, but
(29:49):
I really do firmly believe Ihave the best, most wonderful,
kindest, most supportiveclientele. They are just so
wonderful, and they challengeme. They're so kind and just
open and, like, thirsty forknowledge and like, I just, oh,
I just love them so much.
Matthew Landis (30:07):
Well, you said this earlier, that we do tend to
attract people like us. I thinkthat you can say that in the
mirror and probably say thatabout yourself as well.
Unknown (30:17):
Hopefully sometimes right,
Matthew Landis (30:27):
If you weren't in this industry, what else
would you be doing?
Grace Schafer (30:30):
If I wasn't in this industry? I probably would
have ended up pursuing musicaltheater, which is what I wanted
to do before I did this. If itwas eight years out after high
school, instead of being heresitting talking to you, I'd
probably be, uh, miserable andbroke with a musical theater
degree and no job. Not sayingthat that happens to every
(30:52):
musical theater performer, butthat's probably where I would
be. I'm just knowing myself. I'mvery I am very hard on myself,
and I just know that I would nothave been successful in doing it
professionally, because it Ilove what you said earlier about
like loving what you do issupposed to be fun. If you're
not loving it, if you're nothaving fun, then why are you
doing it? And I even lost thatwith performing for a long time,
(31:15):
up until kind of recently, I wasreminded why I love to do it,
and if I had done itprofessionally, I would have
lost it and never found itagain. I think that's that is
the only thing I probably woulddo. And even there are some days
where I'm just like, what if Iquit? What if I quit my job?
What if I sold my business? Andjust like, quit, and then you
come back down to earth andyou're like, No, you can't do
(31:36):
anything else. Like, what else?
What else would you want to do?
You know, but there are alwaysthose days where you're like,
quit, you know? So I don't, Idon't think I could do anything
else, to be honest.
Matthew Landis (31:48):
Let me ask you, who is your rock?
Grace Schafer (31:51):
Probably my boo.
He is amazing. Ethan is hisname. He's amazing. We've been
together seven years. I met himwhile I was in Costco, and he
has seen the entire journey. Hehas seen the whole thing. And
before I moved into Image, heand I were searching. We were
house hunting. And of course,the market is awful, right? So
(32:12):
that didn't go very well. Andthen the the plan was, the
original plan was we would get ahouse, and I put a she shed out
back, and I would have a studioin the backyard. I was like, I'm
just never gonna leave my house,and that's okay. But that did
not go as planned, obviously.
But I got to a point of like, Idon't want this economy and this
(32:38):
this market to rule my career.
And I went to him, and I said,Look, I know we're taking a
break from house hunting. And Isaid that I wouldn't go
independent until we have ahouse, but, like, I kind of want
to do it anyway. And he said,Okay, you can. So go for it.
Why? Why not? What do you youknow, what? More or less, what
are you waiting for? And I waslike, Okay. And then off, off I
(32:59):
went. So he has just been sosupportive. And just he brings
me out of that, like, when I getin that space of, like,
negativity and getting down onmyself, he is really the one to
be like, but like, you're reallygood at your job, so you're
fine. You know, he really just,he brings me back down, and just
(33:20):
really evens me out so I wouldnot be where I am without him.
Matthew Landis (33:27):
Well, that's wonderful. And, you know, we're
so lucky to have people in ourlives that we can rely on and
and give us that sort of thosepep talks. And I have my
husband, Steve, and I'll give ashout out to him, because we've
been together at least. We're inour 13th year, and, yeah, I
never thought that I wanted tobe married or or tied down, but
(33:49):
it's actually given me a lotmore freedom to insecurity, and
it's been a wonderful thing. AndI'm so glad and happy for you,
and that's wonderful. Thank youvery much. Now, one last thing,
what sort of advice would yougive to somebody that wants to
go independent and run their ownbusiness, like what? What's
important?
Grace Schafer (34:07):
Honestly, it's not that scary. It's not as
scary as you think it. Is it? Iwould do it again. I'd start
another business. It wasn't thatscary. It's, it's scary looking
at it, but when you're in it,it's really not that scary. And
it's, it's hard, but it's alsonot that hard at the same time,
because ultimately, thehappiness that you have and the
freedom that you have just is soworth it. It is so so, so worth
(34:30):
it. So don't be scared. It's notthat bad.
Matthew Landis (34:33):
That was perfect. All right. Grace. Where
can our listeners find you?
Grace Schafer (34:39):
You can find me on Instagram @thehairlab.ges,
and on Facebook as The Hair Lab,and then on Tiktok is @gmistster
Matthew Landis (34:50):
Well grace. This has been so wonderful. Thank you
so much for joining me here onThe VIP Suite.
Grace Schafer (34:56):
Thank you so much for having me. This has been so
much fun.
Matthew Landis (34:59):
Thank you for tuning into The VIP Suite. If
you love this episode, don'tforget to subscribe and follow
us on Instagram @imagestudios360for more inspiration from our
community of independent beautyand wellness pros. Interested in
renting your own luxury studioor becoming a franchise owner?
Visit imagestudios360.com tolearn more and take the next
(35:20):
step toward building your dreambusiness. Until next time,
here's to beauty, health andwellness and building the life
that you want.
Welcome to The VIP Suite, the podcast for Salon
(00:03):
Suite professionals who arebuilding bold, brilliant
businesses. I'm your host.
Matthew Landis, former salonowner, business coach and
lifelong advocate forentrepreneurs in the beauty and
wellness industry. Each week wespotlight industry MVPs, from
hairstylists, estheticians, nailand lash artists and a wide
array of solo entrepreneurs whoarecreating success on their own
terms, you'll hear strategiesfor marketing, client, growth
(00:24):
mindset and overall Salon Suitesuccess, plus honest
conversations about what itreally takes to thrive. This
season, we're going even deeperinto growth, grit, community and
all the messy magic that comeswith carving your own path. So
hit subscribe, turn up thevolume, and welcome to The VIP
Suite where independent beautyand wellness pros come to shine.
(00:49):
Hey, IMAGE Pros, your businessdeserves booking, payment and
client management tools aselevated as your space. That's
why GlossGenius's, top ratedsalon software is included in
your lease at all inclusivelocations, giving you everything
you need to grow your businesswith less busy work with one
flat 2.6% payment processingrate, you can save 1000s on
(01:09):
hidden fees. Clients can book injust 30 seconds with no app
downloads or logins. On average,businesses see a 27% + increase
in revenue within the first yearon GlossGenius. So sign up today
with coupon code IMAGEPRO in andselect your location to start
making the most of GlossGenius.
Joining me today on The VIPsuite is Grace Schaefer in Grand
(01:30):
Rapids, Michigan. Welcome to thepodcast, Grace,
Grace Schafer (01:34):
Hi. Thank you so much for having me.
Matthew Landis (01:36):
Well. Thank you so much for being here. Grace
is, according to her Instagram,is a red hair enthusiast, a
cutting specialist, an extensionspecialist, a wedding
specialist, and as I justrecently found out, also does
wig design, which I'm absolutelyfascinated with.
Grace Schafer (01:55):
Yes, it is. It is a really fun way to bring my
passion for theater andperforming together with hair,
and it allows a little bit morelike, creativity outside of the
chair, doing period pieces andjust like, hey, can you make
horns out of hair? Like, can youdo that? Just things like that.
It's just, it's fun, things Idon't get to do behind the chair
(02:15):
every day.
Matthew Landis (02:16):
Red hair enthusiast. Now that's the top
of your list. So I'm reallycurious about that. Tell me more
about your red hair enthusiasm.
Grace Schafer (02:25):
Well as a fake redhead myself, I don't know how
much you can tell, but I havebeen red for about five years,
and I absolutely love red hairformulation. There's just
something about it, likebalancing red and orange and
gold to find the perfectcombination for everyone. This
might be a hot take. I thinkeveryone can be a redhead. What
(02:46):
kind of redhead you are isdependent on your skin tone and
all that fun stuff. So that hasalways been really fascinating
to me, and it's a very delicateprocess, because if you add a
little too much red, like if Iadd too much red into my
formula, I look terrible. I haveto have a very orange based red
hair color. So it is been areally fun and just like, really
(03:10):
fun thing for me to focus on. Ifind a lot of I just find a lot
of joy in it. And I think thered hair gives a certain type
of, like, extra bit ofconfidence and fun energy.
Matthew Landis (03:21):
Well, there's a whole psychology behind red
hair. You know, I read astatistic once that there are
more CEOs, women, CEOs andexecutives with red hair than
any other color.
Unknown (03:33):
Well, I guess there must be something to it. Then,
okay, I love that. I did notknow that.
Matthew Landis (03:38):
You know, I was a blonde hair specialist, so I
know that sort of passion andinterest in really sort of
problem solving and figuring itout, I did a lot of red hair as
well, and red hair is a lot moredifficult than people think. So
what are the challenges when itcomes to formulating red hair?
Unknown (03:56):
I get a lot of people who are very fair, and who those
fair clients who want to be red,not making them too red, if that
makes sense, using more gold andcopper versus actual like fire
(04:18):
truck engine red, the justtrying to, trying to do the
balance between everything andmaking it fit their skin tone
the best, just a little bit toomuch red. Red is a very powerful
color, and really likes to takeover a formula if you add even
just a little bit too much. Sofinding that delicate balance is
really important.
Matthew Landis (04:37):
Yeah, I think when we think of red hair, we're
thinking of orange hair, we'rethinking of golden hair,
usually, so it sort of getspainted with this, you know,
broad brush as red. But thereare so many, so much nuance when
it comes to red. One of thechallenges I always had is
making it not brown out. What?
Yeah, the tips you have for notbrowning out. Especially the mid
(04:59):
shafts and the ends.
Grace Schafer (05:02):
Not being afraid to use an intensifier. I think
that was something when I firstreally started getting a larger
red hair clientele. Honestly,after I went red, it was like I
had all of all of a sudden, allof these thread heads in my
chair, which tends, tends tohappen you reflect your
clientele. So I think for me,like finally getting the
(05:26):
confidence to be like, I'm gonnatake 744, and it's gonna be
okay, um, you know, it's it'sgonna give it that extra kick
that it needs, so that it's notimmediate, either immediately
browned out or doesn't fade intobrown in the next three days.
When you wash it, I mean red,red and orange fade the fastest.
So it's, it's important toalmost leave them feeling like,
(05:49):
almost like, really vibrant, oralmost too vibrant, so then they
can have that longevity as theylive with it for the next, you
know, six, eight weeks.
Matthew Landis (05:57):
Well, I can tell you really love a challenge,
because you have all of theseother specialties as well. So
what I'm getting from this isyou're not someone who likes to
just sort of coast.
Grace Schafer (06:06):
No, I get bored really easily. I really like to
have my hands in everything. Iwould definitely classify myself
as like a jack of all trades. Ilove to kind of have a hand in
everything. I've got like eighthands, one and is in is in each
thing? Um, yeah, I I have foundthat if I stick with one thing
(06:31):
for too long, or do the samething for too long, even that, I
think that happens to a lot ofstylists behind the chair, where
you get kind of caught up in thein the mundane, and you have
your touches and you have thesame clientele, I find that that
can be uninspiring sometimes,and you just kind of get in that
rut, that creative rut, and itmakes you not it dulls your fire
(06:53):
a little bit. And so, you know,learning new skills and taking
education classes and and doingwigs and doing red hair and
bridal and like having such avariety in my day really keeps
the flicker alive.
Matthew Landis (07:07):
So tell me a little bit more about your
business.
Grace Schafer (07:09):
The Hair Lab is my business. That was a name my
dad and I came up with. I wasalways really fascinated with
the science behind hairdressing.
Hairdressing, of course, is socreative and artistic, but it's
also very technical, and lookingat the science of it, if you're
stumped with a problem, thescience will always bring you
(07:30):
home like as long as youunderstand the science properly,
you can pretty much overcome anyissue, whether it's an issue a
client is having with theirscalp or with their the ends of
their hair, or with their color.
The science of color theory, andthe science of the science is
always going to bring you homeand be able to solve any
problem. And I really try mybest to educate my clients on
(07:52):
the science and tell them why.
So for example, with let's saysomeone has really straight
hair, and they're like, Well, myhair doesn't curl. And I was
like, Okay, well here's why it'snot curling. I'm gonna explain
to you how this works. Yourhydrogen bonds in your hair get
broken and reformed into this,into the curl. And while they're
(08:14):
hot, they're still pliable. Soif you brush your hair while
it's hot, it's not going to stayright. And so explaining why it
works and and why I'm saying,Hey, don't brush your hair until
it's cooled down. Because Icould just say that, and they
could be like, okay, but I don'tknow why I'm not supposed to do
that, right? So just, I thinkthat knowledge is power, and
(08:35):
knowledge equals trust, andtrust equals respect. And I want
my clients to feel like they cantrust me. And I think that just
comes from sharing my knowledgewith them, and that, in turn,
solves a lot of problems forthem at home, and that's what
keeps them in my chair.
Matthew Landis (08:55):
I don't think a lot of people know that aren't
in this industry, in the beautyand wellness industry, and this
goes for estheticians and nailartists and anybody sort of in
this creative line of work,there is so much science behind
it. There's chemistry andphysics and architecture and,
you know, gravity, those are allthings that are really important
(09:15):
in understanding the work thatwe do, which is so fascinating.
So tell me a little bit moreabout what made you decide to go
independent into business foryourself.
Unknown (09:25):
I worked commissioned for the first six years of my
career. I've I'm approachingeight years in the hair
industry, and I workedcommissioned for six years. And
I think it's something that as abeginner stylist when you're in
your first like five years ofyour three to five years of your
career, I think it's reallyimportant to do, and it really
(09:49):
allowed me to build my clienteleand not focus so much on
inventory and balancing my booksand doing all of that, because I
do all of that myself now, andit's it's a lot, and I. Know
that as a beginner baby, I wouldnot have been able to do that.
That would have been way toomuch. So I think it's like I did
it for a long time. I grew outof it and the numbers, I'm a
(10:11):
numbers. Gal, I'm a science anda numbers gal, the numbers just
didn't sit well with me. Youknow, making, I made like,
anywhere between 45 to 50%commission in my commission time
and and that's before tax. So atthe end of the day, out of $100
I'm seeing probably $35 aftertax. That doesn't sit very well
with me. So at the end of theday, it came down to, I want to
(10:34):
see more from my work, becausethat's it's it's worth that, and
I'm willing to take on theinventory, the balancing of the
books, the ordering all of thisstuff, responding to everybody,
dealing with all of the all ofany issues that come up because
I don't have a manager I cansend them off to anymore, right?
So even if I was making the sameamount of money, which is not
(10:57):
true, but even if I was, theperks of having full control, of
choosing what I want to carry,what services I want to do, what
I want to advertise, when I wantto go on vacation, when I want
to perform in a show or take ona wig designing gig, I just can
do that. And there were just itwas really hard to say no,
(11:19):
specifically to image,especially, it was really hard
to say no to that.
Matthew Landis (11:24):
What was so hard to say no to image about so
Unknown (11:27):
I had kind of already had it in my head that I wanted
to be independent. I'm Chairrental was not super appealing
to me, mostly because it wasjust, I'm like, if we're gonna
bite the bullet, let's just doit. You know, get a get a room,
right? So I was looking around,and so I'm from West Michigan, a
lot of it's not as trendy.
That's typically a little bitbehind in terms of, like,
(11:52):
comparing to New York orCalifornia, you're a little,
we're, we get things like, ayear or two later, right? Which
is normal, totally fine. Butlooking at all of the other
sweet spaces in town, I just waslike, it's this, more of the
same. It's white, it's oldschool, it's white, as in color
scheme, like it's beige, it'sit's basic, and there's nothing
(12:16):
wrong with that. If that is yourif that's what you like, that is
totally okay. That's just wasn'tsomething I was looking for. And
I got a message from ZachDuggar, who runs our location,
and it was like, Oh my gosh,this was, this is what I've been
looking for. It's editorial,it's clean, it's luxurious, it's
(12:37):
new. Like, there is. It's thefirst location in Michigan,
hopefully not the last, and it'sthe first location in Michigan.
And I was like, no one's donethis yet. I mean, it's kind of a
fatal flaw. I want to do thingsthat people don't do, or I want
to be the first one to do it,and sometimes that's a fatal
flaw, but no one's done thisyet. And it's, it's clean, it's
(12:59):
fresh, it's new, and it's it'svery editorial, and that's what
I wanted, and it that is thefeedback that I've gotten my
clients. They walk in the doorand they're like, this place is
nice, you know? And that'sexactly what I wanted. So it was
really, really hard to say no,in your partnership with gloss
genius, I love gloss genius.
I've been using, I use that atmy previous salon as well, and I
(13:23):
just love it. The perks thelandlord, the location, is
phenomenal. It's at a great spotin Grand Rapids, so, and it's
across from a Starbucks. That'sjust a fun little perk. That was
just like, okay, that's just thecherry on top. I was already
committed, but that's just a funlittle cherry on top to it, but
it was, it well, all of thatconsidered, it was very, very
(13:44):
hard to say no to that.
Matthew Landis (13:45):
That's a great endorsement. And, you know, I've
been with IMAGE since the beforethe first one was even built.
And one of our biggest goals wasalways to make things sexy,
because this is a fashionindustry. So we wanted luxury,
luxury, and we wanted ourbranding and everything that we
do to be sexy and fashionable.
So it's nice to hear that. Solet me ask you a question about
(14:06):
mindset Yeah. So have youexperienced any sort of mindset
shift since you went independentas a professional?
Unknown (14:18):
100% Yeah, totally. I think also, especially after,
like, my first six months of ofbusiness. And it was kind of, it
was, there was that first sixmonths of transition period. I
have a very good friend of minewho is in sales, and she would
always, she's always talking meup whenever we're out at the
(14:39):
bar, whatever, anyone who gets acompliment on her hair, she
always says something. Or whenshe introduces me, she'll, you
know, she will say what I do andand she'd always say, yeah,
she's a business owner. And I'mlike, Ah, am I? Though it's kind
of very imposter syndromy Andshe and there was one thing that
she said to me. I was like, Idon't know if I like, am. I
(15:00):
though. And she was like, well,think about it, a restaurant
lease is a building, but thatdoesn't make them any less an
owner. And I was like, You're soright. And I just had this,
like, after I got through thatlittle bit of imposter syndrome,
it was just like, Okay, watchout world. Here I come. Like, I
had a much easier time creatingboundaries and knowing my worth
(15:22):
and knowing what I was willingto take and what I was willing
to bend over backwards for, andwhat I wasn't willing to bend
over backwards for, whereasbefore I was like, I will do
whatever, like, I will takewhatever I'll get yelled out in
the salon, whatever, like, it'sfine, like, I'll just deal with
it, and I have my confidence isis much better, and it the the
(15:44):
mindset shift. It is interestingthat you asked that, um, because
that has been a huge thing inthe last like year and a half.
Matthew Landis (15:55):
I've had those moments too, where, you know,
I've started a new endeavor, andit takes a while to own that new
identity and to be like, Yeah,you know what? This is, who I
am? Yeah, absolutely. Period,end of sentence, period.
Hey, IMAGE Pros, your businessdeserves booking, payment and
(16:15):
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(16:36):
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What's the most surprising ormeaningful transformation that
(17:22):
you have helped a client with?
Unknown (17:24):
So I had this is, this is one that sticks out to me.
I'm I haven't thought this is agreat question. I haven't
thought about this in a longtime. A family friend of mine,
his mom, who has, she hasParkinson's, and she's also she
has cancer. I believe she is inremission now, but at the time
she came and she she had gottenthis beautiful wig, just this
(17:50):
insane, like human hair, fulllike lace all the way around,
just this amazing wig. She hadgotten it, and she was, she had
asked me to just like, kind ofcut it, style it, teach her how
to style it. And I sat down withher, and we just, like, talked
through all of that and and Iwas like, Hey, you get the best
of both worlds, because youliterally get to pop your hair
off and do it and then put it onyour head. I can't even tell you
(18:14):
how many times I wish I could dothat. Just pop my head off, my
body, into my hair, and cut myhair even, and put it back on so
sitting down with her andgetting to do that, and the fact
that she's a family friend, andher son is a good friend of
mine, and so it was just reallycool to be able to do that for
her, and it meant the world toher too. And so it was just
(18:34):
things like that. I just just, Ijust like to help people and
bring people joy and to makethem feel confident and
beautiful. And I was able to dothat for her in a time where
time where she was reallystruggling. And that's just like
everything to me.
Matthew Landis (18:47):
Those kinds of experiences can be very
humbling, I think, because wetake for granted what we do on a
daily basis, and then when wehave the opportunity to make a
difference for someone likethat, it means the world to us.
And you never know whatanybody's going through on a on
a daily basis. I always sort ofbristle at when people say, Oh,
(19:07):
you're like a therapist, and I'mlike, I am not a therapist. I do
not want that responsibility,no. But we often, in a way, I
get the comparison, because wehold space for people, and we do
change lives in really profoundways that sometimes we're not
even expecting to do. Yeah,yeah. Thank you sharing that is
(19:31):
there a client of yours that haschallenged you in a way that has
changed the way that you work?
Unknown (19:37):
Okay? The first person who comes to mind, she is, she's
awesome. She I started doing herhair when her hair was long, and
now she's got this, like, think,like, boy band, soft mullet,
just like, has really helped hercome into her identity as a
queer individual, and thattransformation like her, and
(19:57):
she's gone on a full healthjourney to her hair. You. To
like, not grow. It was dry. Itjust wasn't do anything. And she
went on a journey with herself.
And in turn, I got to see howher hair just chant, oh my gosh,
just the way it changed. It'sgrowing like a weed now, and
it's so healthy and hydrated.
And with that too, like havinggoing from here to here and like
(20:24):
to then the chin and thecheekbone, and then getting
really short, and kind of justdipping one toe at a time and
having her come back every timebe like, Okay, I'm ready for
more. I'm ready for more. I'mnot ready for more. I'm ready
for more and like, and justchanging it and just kind of
adapting to whatever she wasmost comfortable with, I think
was a challenge, but such a funone, because it just kind of
(20:46):
made me stand back and think ittakes you out of your your
routine, out of your musclememory, of of doing the same
formula, same haircuts onpeople, and just kind of makes
you step back and be like, Huh,okay. And it has just been so
fun to be able to play with her,play with her hair and her
style. And she's really foundsomething that she loves now,
(21:08):
and it's the soft like boy bandmullet, and it's, it's been
Matthew Landis (21:13):
I love those clients that really challenge us
awesome for her.
to do more. And you know what?
Sometimes, frankly, I'm not inthe mood. I Good. I love having
to sort of pause and take a deepbreath and go, okay. You know,
this is my seventh haircuttoday, but this is going to be
the one that is going to reallyset me apart. And let's do it.
(21:35):
What is one lesson that you wishyou had learned earlier in your
career?
Unknown (21:48):
Don't think about it too hard. Just like, don't it's
gonna be okay. It's gonna beokay. Take a deep breath. Don't
think about it too hard. Youknow what you're doing. Relax.
Matthew Landis (22:01):
I give this advice all the time because, you
know, I moved to New York aboutfive years into my career, and I
worked for a big corporatecompany there, and I had to go
through their training program,and it was so intense, like it
was, and they really made yousweat. And when I say sweat, I
mean sweat. I would I wouldbreak out in a cold sweat, until
(22:24):
one day I was working on mymannequin head, I think, and I
was just trying so hard to beperfect, and I wanted it to be
perfect, because I wanted toprove that I could do this. And
I just couldn't take it anymore.
So I just looked up from thehaircut, and I just was like,
looked out the window and Iwatched the world go by, and I
thought nobody outside thiswindow on this salon gives a
(22:46):
what is going on in here. Theydon't care. This is just a
haircut. It is just a mannequinhead. This is not the world, and
I will survive this. And so Ijust take a deep breath and and
do the best that I can. And thatwas such a watershed moment for
me. So I'm really glad that youshared that.
Unknown (23:10):
Yeah, it's, it's such an important lesson. And I try
and give it not to make a pun, Itry and give myself grace. Of
course, I think we, as we allshould. I'm 25 when I started my
career, I was 19, and it's evento learn. I'm so grateful to
even learn the lesson that Ilearned as as young as I am
(23:31):
right now. I know, I know thereare so many people who don't
learn that until they're older,and I'm just grateful to have
come to that point, because Ithink it is detrimental to your
mental health, to constantlyoverthink things, and to be so
hard on yourself, and of course,I am sometimes, but then it's
just kind of like, hey, it'sgonna be all right. Don't think
(23:53):
about it too hard. You're gonnabe okay.
Matthew Landis (23:56):
You know what?
It's just hair. Yeah, it is.
Unknown (23:59):
It's just hair. It probably will grow back, right?
Yeah,
Matthew Landis (24:04):
Hopefully. There were times in my career where I
had to remind myself. I wentinto this to have fun. Yeah,
this is supposed to be fun. Soif I'm not having fun, then we
have a problem. I have aproblem.
Grace Schafer (24:20):
Why am I doing it?
Matthew Landis (24:22):
I need to get back to the reason that I went
into this and that really helpedguide me. What is a philosophy
of yours that sort of guidesyou?
Unknown (24:31):
I think this is something I say a lot, and
anyone who knows me, who listen,who is listening to this will
hopefully giggle, is, I alwayssay awareness is the first step,
just being aware, and even iflike you, even if you made a
mistake, you said something youshouldn't have, or you're
(24:51):
noticing a pattern of likebehind the chair, I'm noticing
I'm falling into a rut. Beingaware of that is the first step
to growing and I. I hesitate tosay the word fixing it, but
like, improving it. Yeah, thatis, that is something I always
say. If a friend's like, well, Idon't, I don't know, but I did
notice this, and I'm like, well,awareness is the first step. And
(25:12):
that's, and that's that, that'sthat that is something that does
really drive me, and something Ido kind of live by.
Matthew Landis (25:19):
That is so simple but so powerful. You
know, I listen to a lot ofEckhart Tolle. Do you know who
he is? He wrote a new earth andthe power of now. He's a
spiritual guru. He talks a lotabout awareness and
consciousness, and we are notour thoughts, but sometimes when
we are having anxiety, justbeing aware and saying to
(25:41):
ourselves, you're having anxietylike this isn't real, that that
can sometimes really help, andwe can get back to being present
and letting go of thoughts whenwe're just aware that they are
thoughts.
Unknown (25:56):
Yeah, absolutely.
That's huge. That's huge.
Matthew Landis (25:59):
I have to tell myself all the time, I am not my
thoughts, I am not my, I am notmy thoughts.
Grace Schafer (26:04):
I love that. I am not my thoughts. I'm not my
thoughts.
Matthew Landis (26:08):
This has been great. So if you can
revolutionize one thing in thebeauty industry, the beauty and
wellness industry, what would itbe?
Unknown (26:16):
I feel like there's a lot of this is like a
hairstylist. Worst Enemy is likeTikTok, right?All of this, like
hearsay about a lot of things.
Like, over information. There'sso much information on the
internet. I love the internet.
The internet is great, but itis. There's so much information
and which represents so muchconfusion for clients. And I
(26:39):
think if I could revolutionizeanything. It would just be a way
to, like, quit the quit, the BSand quit and just like, have
clean, clear information. Andlike, a solid way, a solid way
to, like, get that out to peopleand that. So the word just kind
of all on the same page. And Ithink there are so many people
(27:00):
out there who are motivated bybrand deals and by money, and
people who are not licensed andwho are like, this is what's
good for your hair? And Isomething like says, Who?
Where's your certification,where's your schooling, where's
your license. I want to see it,you know. And I think that is
confusing for clients who seethese people with these big
followings who have nocredentials, and then people
(27:22):
with credentials who don't haveas some there are some people,
some styles out there who dohave, have those big followings
and those big numbers, but thereare a lot of hair stylists that
don't, and it's just hard tofigure out who to trust, and it
just makes everything veryconfusing. So I think if I could
revolutionize anything. It wouldbe that just to try and filter
(27:43):
that a little bit better.
Matthew Landis (27:44):
It seems to be one of a philosophy of yours,
that you that you provide thatfor your clients. You mentioned
that earlier, explaining thescience, explaining the reasons,
and sort of cutting through thenoise and providing a sort of
space for your clients tounderstand and get a better
understanding of what they need,and that's so important. And I
(28:06):
think one of this also goes backto owning your identity. And you
know, I am the professional, Iam the expert. I am here to help
you. I am here to tell you whatwhat the truth is and what the
science is. And I love that youare able to do that and that
that's so important to you.
Unknown (28:24):
Thank you. Yeah, it I think also, too, I love to
create that space of like, I'mgoing to give you some
knowledge, but this is also asafe space for you to ask me
questions. If you don't know howto curl your hair, I'm not going
to look at you and be like, youdon't you know? Like, I'm never
going to do that. It's a placefor exploration and curiosity
and for learning things, andthere's, there's no like,
(28:46):
there's no such thing as astupid question, and my book,
unless we I've already told youand you didn't listen the first
time, but, but there's no suchthing as a stupid question. And
I think that, again, it justcomes back to knowledge. Is
power, knowing why I'm tellingyou to do something, not just
that. I'm telling you it'sreally important to create that
(29:08):
space for learning. Just ingeneral, you know.
Matthew Landis (29:11):
You're such a smart, cool, easy person to be
around that I am sure that yourclients absolutely love you, and
they probably want to do rightby you. They're like, you know,
Grace told me to do this.
Unknown (29:28):
They do and almost to a fault where they're like, Look.
I know I told I know you told meto do my bangs, but I didn't do
them today. Don't look at them.
And I'm like, relax. It's you'rea human. I'm a human. My bangs
are I'm like, my bangs are slicktoday too. So it's okay, um, you
know, yeah, they I, I'm sureevery hairstylist says this, but
(29:49):
I really do firmly believe Ihave the best, most wonderful,
kindest, most supportiveclientele. They are just so
wonderful, and they challengeme. They're so kind and just
open and, like, thirsty forknowledge and like, I just, oh,
I just love them so much.
Matthew Landis (30:07):
Well, you said this earlier, that we do tend to
attract people like us. I thinkthat you can say that in the
mirror and probably say thatabout yourself as well.
Unknown (30:17):
Hopefully sometimes right,
Matthew Landis (30:27):
If you weren't in this industry, what else
would you be doing?
Grace Schafer (30:30):
If I wasn't in this industry? I probably would
have ended up pursuing musicaltheater, which is what I wanted
to do before I did this. If itwas eight years out after high
school, instead of being heresitting talking to you, I'd
probably be, uh, miserable andbroke with a musical theater
degree and no job. Not sayingthat that happens to every
(30:52):
musical theater performer, butthat's probably where I would
be. I'm just knowing myself. I'mvery I am very hard on myself,
and I just know that I would nothave been successful in doing it
professionally, because it Ilove what you said earlier about
like loving what you do issupposed to be fun. If you're
not loving it, if you're nothaving fun, then why are you
doing it? And I even lost thatwith performing for a long time,
(31:15):
up until kind of recently, I wasreminded why I love to do it,
and if I had done itprofessionally, I would have
lost it and never found itagain. I think that's that is
the only thing I probably woulddo. And even there are some days
where I'm just like, what if Iquit? What if I quit my job?
What if I sold my business? Andjust like, quit, and then you
come back down to earth andyou're like, No, you can't do
(31:36):
anything else. Like, what else?
What else would you want to do?
You know, but there are alwaysthose days where you're like,
quit, you know? So I don't, Idon't think I could do anything
else, to be honest.
Matthew Landis (31:48):
Let me ask you, who is your rock?
Grace Schafer (31:51):
Probably my boo.
He is amazing. Ethan is hisname. He's amazing. We've been
together seven years. I met himwhile I was in Costco, and he
has seen the entire journey. Hehas seen the whole thing. And
before I moved into Image, heand I were searching. We were
house hunting. And of course,the market is awful, right? So
(32:12):
that didn't go very well. Andthen the the plan was, the
original plan was we would get ahouse, and I put a she shed out
back, and I would have a studioin the backyard. I was like, I'm
just never gonna leave my house,and that's okay. But that did
not go as planned, obviously.
But I got to a point of like, Idon't want this economy and this
(32:38):
this market to rule my career.
And I went to him, and I said,Look, I know we're taking a
break from house hunting. And Isaid that I wouldn't go
independent until we have ahouse, but, like, I kind of want
to do it anyway. And he said,Okay, you can. So go for it.
Why? Why not? What do you youknow, what? More or less, what
are you waiting for? And I waslike, Okay. And then off, off I
(32:59):
went. So he has just been sosupportive. And just he brings
me out of that, like, when I getin that space of, like,
negativity and getting down onmyself, he is really the one to
be like, but like, you're reallygood at your job, so you're
fine. You know, he really just,he brings me back down, and just
(33:20):
really evens me out so I wouldnot be where I am without him.
Matthew Landis (33:27):
Well, that's wonderful. And, you know, we're
so lucky to have people in ourlives that we can rely on and
and give us that sort of thosepep talks. And I have my
husband, Steve, and I'll give ashout out to him, because we've
been together at least. We're inour 13th year, and, yeah, I
never thought that I wanted tobe married or or tied down, but
(33:49):
it's actually given me a lotmore freedom to insecurity, and
it's been a wonderful thing. AndI'm so glad and happy for you,
and that's wonderful. Thank youvery much. Now, one last thing,
what sort of advice would yougive to somebody that wants to
go independent and run their ownbusiness, like what? What's
important?
Grace Schafer (34:07):
Honestly, it's not that scary. It's not as
scary as you think it. Is it? Iwould do it again. I'd start
another business. It wasn't thatscary. It's, it's scary looking
at it, but when you're in it,it's really not that scary. And
it's, it's hard, but it's alsonot that hard at the same time,
because ultimately, thehappiness that you have and the
freedom that you have just is soworth it. It is so so, so worth
(34:30):
it. So don't be scared. It's notthat bad.
Matthew Landis (34:33):
That was perfect. All right. Grace. Where
can our listeners find you?
Grace Schafer (34:39):
You can find me on Instagram @thehairlab.ges,
and on Facebook as The Hair Lab,and then on Tiktok is @gmistster
Matthew Landis (34:50):
Well grace. This has been so wonderful. Thank you
so much for joining me here onThe VIP Suite.
Grace Schafer (34:56):
Thank you so much for having me. This has been so
much fun.
Matthew Landis (34:59):
Thank you for tuning into The VIP Suite. If
you love this episode, don'tforget to subscribe and follow
us on Instagram @imagestudios360for more inspiration from our
community of independent beautyand wellness pros. Interested in
renting your own luxury studioor becoming a franchise owner?
Visit imagestudios360.com tolearn more and take the next
(35:20):
step toward building your dreambusiness. Until next time,
here's to beauty, health andwellness and building the life
that you want.
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