November 19, 2025 • 39 mins
In a world where wellness is often commodified and put on aesthetic display, it's easy to fall into the performative wellness trap. It’s the constant pressure to look zen, to buy the right gear, and to follow the latest trends instead of honestly checking in with how you truly feel.
In this bold and empowering episode, host Jazzmyn Proctor sits down with body intelligence coach and spinal energetics practitioner Shantani Moore to discuss the messy reality beneath the "high vibe" facade.
Shantani and Jazzmyn dive deep into:
- 🧘♀️ The Performance Pressure: How the wellness industry's lack of inclusivity and representation creates a harmful, narrow mold of who gets to be "well."
- 💔 From Wellness to Wholeness: The crucial shift from chasing an external, perfect look to embracing your messy, integrated self (and why perfectionism is often just toxic positivity repackaged).
- ✊ Invisible Labor & Visibility: The unique pressure and invisible labor carried by Black women in the healing space to shape-shift and dilute their message to be received.
- 🧠 Be the Buffalo: Learning to build distress tolerance and move toward the hard feelings (like anger, shame, and anxiety) as data, rather than running from them, to achieve true nervous system regulation.
- 🌎 The Necessity of Collective Care: Moving beyond hyper-individualism and self-centered narratives to show up courageously for your community.
You have permission to dismantle the hierarchy of healing. You do not have to have it all figured out, and your authenticity—even the messy parts—is the most potent form of healing. Your people cannot find you if they cannot see you.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_01 (00:00):
Are you sitting with thousands of hours of B-roll
(00:02):
content and telling yourself,I'll start posting tomorrow?
Are you in your head worriedabout your friends and family
thinking your fringe refusing tobe visible?
Are you chasing trends insteadof building influence?
Welcome to the VisibilityStandard, where the visionaries
of today are changing the rolesof their industries and letting
their voice be heard.
I'm your host, Jasmine, and weare setting the standard.
(00:30):
I'm so excited for my guest.
We are going to be talking abouthow wellness has really just
become a performative space.
It has become a space where thelook is more important than the
feel at times.
And I'm just so excited to talkabout this with her.
Today I have my guest with me,Shantany Moore.
(00:52):
Thank you so much for joining metoday.
SPEAKER_00 (00:54):
Thank you for having me.
I'm excited to get into this.
This is a juicy topic that Icould talk about all damn day.
SPEAKER_01 (01:01):
What really drew me to your Instagram was your video
about the aloe athletic wear andhow we love the two-piece set.
We love having the yoga mat.
We love the matcha morning asthis epitome of wellness.
And it's really become for showversus what it actually feels.
SPEAKER_00 (01:26):
Yeah, I think that narrative has been so harmful
for me in my life, even beingsomeone who spent 10 years in
the fitness industry in wellnessspaces, and it's just time to
pull it back.
We need to talk about it andjust put it on the airwaves
because I know that there'sprobably someone listening who
might feel like you have to keepup, and I'm just here to tell
you, you don't have to keep up.
SPEAKER_01 (01:47):
Tell us, how did you get started in the wellness
space?
SPEAKER_00 (01:53):
So my journey started about 10 years ago.
I was a professional dancer whofound fitness and yoga as a side
hustle and also as a way tocross-train.
And once I started going downthat journey and trying to do it
all, I live in Los Angeles.
I was trying to do it all and beit all and literally perform for
(02:14):
a paycheck.
And I found myself one day aftera fitness class that I was
teaching on a parking garagefloor with tonic immobility and
I'm unable to move from burnout,just completely burned out.
My body wasn't able to function.
And that was the first timewhere I saw there was a little
bit of a chink in the armor.
I was like, that's ironic thatI'm a fitness professional and
(02:37):
wellness enthusiast who is nowteaching this and on the floor.
So that was the beginning of myjourney with this whole
conversation.
SPEAKER_01 (02:48):
Very nice.
And now you are into spinalenergetics.
SPEAKER_00 (02:53):
Yes.
So now I'm a body intelligencecoach and I weave spinal
energetics, other somaticprocessing practices, and what
I've learned in my shamanic artstraining to really like ground
the esoteric principles that wecome to live by and maybe aspire
to be in alignment with justlike your lived experience and
just making it real.
Do you live in DC?
(03:13):
Yeah.
Like you live in DC, I live inLA.
I'm like, we gotta make it real.
So what is spinal energetics?
Spinal energetics is a nervoussystem training technique in the
simplest form.
We use association and awarenesstraining to help your body to
remember how to process stressfaster.
(03:37):
So many of us are living,especially if you live in like
these urban areas, or if you'resomebody who has a lot of
responsibilities, which I knowif you're listening to this
podcast, you are here becauseyou need the answers.
We use this modality to helpyour body to remember how to
come out of that chronic freezestate or any kind of stress
(03:58):
response that we might bespiraling in that's preventing
us from ultimately just feelingmore grounded, integrated, and
able to get through our dayswith less stress.
SPEAKER_01 (04:10):
When I hear you talk, you sound, I mean, very
certain and confident with yourpath within the wellness space.
And I'm so curious, was thereever a part of you that wanted
to leave the wellness space?
SPEAKER_00 (04:25):
Girl, yes.
So the second part really hitwhen you just said that of
wanting to leave.
I'll just, I'm here to say ithow it is.
There's room for every industryto improve, and the wellness
industry has so far to go whenit has through the conversation
of inclusivity, of livedexperience, of a lot of these.
(04:48):
I know you talk a lot about likeanti-capitalism on this podcast,
and I'm sure we'll get into it.
But I'll be honest, I was awellness practitioner and
fitness instructor who didn'tsee myself represented in the
spaces.
I worked in boutique fitness andworked really hard and got some
really incredible connectionsand jobs.
(05:09):
But when I would look around, Iwas the only one in the room who
looked like me.
And that was so on a personallevel, because we're human too,
disorienting, displacing, andthere was this silent string of
loneliness.
And now I feel I'm in adifferent place with that
conversation in my work,obviously, because I'm not
teaching fitness anymore.
(05:29):
But with my body intelligencecoaching and connecting with
people on how their livedexperience informs the way that
they move through the world is ahuge conversation when we talk
about wellness.
SPEAKER_01 (05:40):
Especially, I feel like with social media, as
influential as it is, when wehave similar bodies, similar
race, ethnicities representingwellness, we're creating a mold
for wellness.
And we can look back as early aslike fashion magazines, setting
(06:01):
the trend, setting the tone forhow people should look, how
people should dress, what isneeded to fit in.
That sort of narrative iscontinuing to happen in the
wellness space.
And as you're talking, I'mthinking about a TikTok video.
This girl got major backlash forit, but she made the statement
that fat people shouldn't be inPilates.
(06:24):
And I'm glad she got theresponse that she did, but it
goes to show that there is anexpectation that people should
look a certain way, that theyneed to be a certain way to uh
participate in wellness.
SPEAKER_00 (06:41):
Totally.
When you were speaking, I wasalso just thinking about how
young this industry actually is.
It's so young.
It is like fresh out the gate inrespect to other industries and
the conversation around fitnessspecifically, which is tied to
really deeply entrenched withthe wellness conversation.
And so there's room for all ofus to see where we have room to
(07:04):
improve, and as leaders and thenas people who are participating
in the industry to question likeexactly what you said with this
TikTok that went viral and gotthe backlash.
It's like people say things andeverybody's entitled to say what
they're gonna say, but you needto be conscious of what you're
saying and who you're saying itto.
(07:24):
And I think that really peopleshould hold leaders accountable
and hold us all accountable.
And when we know better, we dobetter.
What is that?
My Angelou, I think she saysthat.
And uh, our industry has a longway to go.
SPEAKER_01 (07:38):
Absolutely.
Do you ever feel like wellnessis a buzzword now?
Oh my gosh, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (07:46):
I have been, Jasmine, let me tell you, this
is like behind the scenes, okay?
I have been on this wholerebranding journey because when
people think about it, that'stheir first gateway into
understanding that health goesbeyond the physical.
I think people usually start outtheir journey going, oh, I'm not
(08:08):
happy with how I'm feeling orlooking at my body.
So they find fitness and thenthey find wellness, and then
they go, actually, I need atherapist.
And so it's like this naturaljourney.
But yeah, I definitely thinkthat it's a buzzword now.
In my practice, I like to reallyencourage this conversation
around wholeness versuswellness.
(08:31):
What does it mean to be well?
And what does it mean to feelmore whole and more integrated?
Pun intended to have all of ourparts coming together.
And that wellness doesn't justhave to do with how you look, it
has to do with how you feel, howyou relate to other people, to
your community, how you'reengaging with your community.
(08:54):
So it's very much a buzzword, inmy opinion.
And yeah, that's theconversation we need to be
having, I think, is more aboutwholeness.
SPEAKER_01 (09:01):
And the statement of wholeness, I feel like
encapsulates what people areseeking when they discuss
wellness.
It's the spiritual, it's thephysical, it is the mental, it's
the emotional, it's the wholeperson versus this commodified
version of wellness that I thinkthat we sometimes put on display
(09:22):
because it looks really pretty,but that's not really like the
journey of I feel like seekingwholeness for people.
It's actually pretty messy.
SPEAKER_00 (09:32):
Totally.
Oh my gosh, it's so messy, it'sthe messiest, and it's this
balance, right?
Like from a business standpoint,there's something to be said
where I understand that you wantto get messages out there, and
sometimes it's easier to digestwith a certain aesthetic or
branding or whatever, but you'reso right, it is so messy.
I just keep thinking, like in mypractice, people come in and
(09:58):
they might say things that tendto be more, I'm gonna use the
language of surface level, butit might just be like more
relational.
I don't like how I feel in mybody, for example.
We've been talking a lot aboutbodies so far, right?
And when you really diveunderneath the hood, it's what
is this, what is this reallyabout?
What is it that you're wantingto experience?
Is it really that you want toquote unquote lose weight, or is
(10:21):
it that you really just want tofeel more grounded and you want
to relate to people in a waywhere you don't feel like you
constantly have to fix and fusswith your external to feel like
you belong?
Is that what this is reallyabout?
And I agree with you.
It's just, it's never reallyabout the thing.
It's usually about what'sunderneath the hood and asking
the question.
(10:42):
I'll just end this point withthis of so that you can what?
This is something I say all thetime.
It's okay, you want to launchthis business so that you can
what?
So you can make lots of money.
Why do you want to make a lot ofmoney so that you can take care
of your mother, so that you can,you know, like just challenging
people to go deeper?
It's like, it's never usuallyjust about the thing, which I
(11:05):
know because you're a therapist.
SPEAKER_01 (11:08):
It's never about the thing, and it's always about the
more vulnerable thing that we'reworking towards that we don't
always have the words for.
I'm curious, as a black woman inthis space, do you ever feel
like you have to shape shift inany way to be received?
SPEAKER_00 (11:28):
This has been a long journey for me.
The short answer is yes.
Like, I feel that pressure.
I would be disingenuous to saythat I don't experience that
very real pressure.
And my Scorpio mid-heaven beslinking girl.
She be like going through, youknow what I'm saying?
So that's a real shadow as well.
(11:48):
But I think something that hashelped me to navigate these
spaces is to just ask myselfthis, which this is a shamanic
principle of like, how can I bea bridge?
How can I be a bridge and notabandon myself in the space, but
be a bridge between worlds,between my lived experience and
(12:13):
someone else's who might lookdifferent than me, and help them
to not, it's not my job to makethem understand, but to stand in
my own right in my truth.
I'm a black woman and I'm alsofirst generation here, and my
dad's from Jamaica, my mom'sfrom Singapore.
I have a very nuanced experienceas well, and not feeling like I
(12:36):
even have to, this is a shadowas well, where you might feel
like you have to live up topeople's expectations,
especially as a black woman.
Like people have an expectationor a stereotype or something
that they're carrying, and youfeel you can feel that pressure.
(12:56):
And I definitely have a lot ofcompassion in that conversation
because it is a it's a trickyline to walk, and I just think
that we all get to find how wecan be a bridge.
SPEAKER_01 (13:08):
Thank you so much for sharing that.
And as I'm hearing you, likebeing a bridge is a huge
responsibility, it's a bigweight to carry.
SPEAKER_00 (13:18):
Yeah, I think this is the conversation, right?
It's like this extra invisiblelabor.
This invisible labor of how am Ibeing perceived?
I know that you talk a lot aboutvisibility, right?
How am I being perceived?
And that's the truth of ourexperience.
It's the truth of the world thatwe live in, and that's why I
(13:39):
love supporting people whopeople like us, because it's a
nuanced conversation of how areyou being perceived versus who
are you really?
And what invisible labor can weput down?
And so, with my somatic work andmy body intelligence coaching,
this is a space for you to bevisible in the truth of who you
(14:03):
are first, before the world,because telling you who you are
supposed to be, or supposed toact, or supposed to talk.
There's this quote by PabloPicasso, and I believe he said
something along the lines of, Ispent my entire life learning
how to paint like a kid again.
And I feel like that is theweight that we carry, especially
(14:27):
as black women, and especiallyas black women in the wellness
and healing space, is I amasking the question of who am I?
And who was I before everyoneelse told me who I should be?
SPEAKER_01 (14:44):
Um chill, just like having this conversation because
we show up online, we arevisibly black, like owning that,
and we have no control of howpeople receive or perceive that.
And so maybe diluting ourmessage, or maybe not being as
outspoken, maybe not being asbold with some of our takes,
(15:07):
because we know they will bereceived very differently from
someone else who might say thesame thing.
And let to what you said earlierabout oh, not self-abandoning,
about staying true to ourselves,being anchored in confident in
who we are is I know for me is afull-time job if as long as I
(15:30):
choose to show up publicly, aslong as I choose to show up,
have opinions, be someone thatis public in the healing space.
I have to feel so certain aboutmyself because there are going
to be so many people that willbenefit from me questioning
myself.
SPEAKER_00 (15:48):
Come on now.
That who will benefit from mequestioning myself.
And and I think you do a reallybeautiful job of this, and I
just want to commend you on itbecause it's I was listening to
one of your episodes beforegetting on here, and you were
talking about yeah, your journeywith visibility and how more
nuanced conversations whenposted on social media dragged
(16:13):
uh but just dragged.
You're like, you have nocontext, honey.
You have no context, and you aretaking my words and twisting
them.
And yes, what you said as wellof acknowledging I'm work more
in that esoteric, and you'realso in the coaching space, but
it's predominantly a whitefemale space, and I just it's it
(16:37):
just doesn't hit the same whenor it doesn't land the same, and
is it perceived the same when Isay the same things that other
people are saying?
So the question that I ask formyself and for my clients, and
is what's the path through?
Because so often we can say, Icould never say it like that, or
I could never do that, right?
And I I like to ask, well, it'snot if you can, it's just how.
(17:01):
How are we gonna find a paththrough?
And acknowledging that if youare somebody who is visible in
the public eye or looking to be,there's a fine line with
vulnerability.
It doesn't mean that you have toovershare in a way that takes
you outside of your window oftolerance, right?
What is something that is trueand honest and speaks to what
(17:26):
you want to speak to, but it'salso not gonna put you on the
personal level, the personbehind the camera, in jeopardy
with your own mental health.
SPEAKER_01 (17:34):
Yeah.
It it is a balancing act forsure.
But I do believe that the payoffis much more positive.
Being able to be seen, beingable to navigate authenticity
publicly, uh it is it allowsthat representation.
(17:58):
Like we allow representationwhen we choose to show up in
these spaces and choose to shareour opinions and stand by them
and stand behind them.
What anchors you what groundsyou in your own life that allows
you to do the work?
Because coaching and especiallyenergetics can be very sensitive
(18:18):
work in the sense that otherpeople's energy can potentially
bleed out, like you're carryingso much.
And so, what grounds you to beable to support people in the
ways that you do?
SPEAKER_00 (18:30):
That's such a beautiful question.
And I I first want to say, justnodding back to what you just
said about being authentic andletting yourself speak, your
people cannot find you if theycannot see you.
And there's something sopowerful that I think we get to
do is when we speak in ourvisibility and allow ourselves
(18:53):
to be authentic.
Yeah, you do run the risk ofcriticism, but you also there's
so much benefit to actuallygoing, oh, you all think this
too.
That's sometimes where I thinkthat sometimes the algorithm can
be on your side, where it'llstart pushing your stuff to
people who agree.
And so that can make you feelless lonely.
(19:14):
Coming back to what grounds mein this conversation.
Well, my philosophy, which is inalignment with the things that
I've learned and the teachersand the mentors that I have the
privilege to work with, is notreally subscribing to this idea
of bad or like negative energy,first of all, where I think in
(19:35):
the conventional, like you'llsee you gotta stay high vibe,
everybody stay high vibe, andit's all about positive, what is
that, toxic positivity?
Like, we are not about this, weare not about this in my corner
of the internet.
Number one, I think it takes alevel of courage for all of us
to really be able to sit withpeople in the hard stuff.
And so that really is somethingthat in those moments where I
(19:59):
feel my humanity goes, whew,this is a lot, like, or
whatever, the energetically I'mfeeling a lot.
I look at it as we're all justwalking stories, we're all
living our stories and ourbodies hold stories.
And so I just get to read achapter out of your book.
And for me to be able toexperience that, whether it be
(20:21):
somatically, energetically, oreven relationally, like you and
I talking right now.
Like I get to add a couple morewrinkles to my brain and a
couple more pages to my bookwhere I get to learn.
So that's like a cognitive waythat I can sometimes talk myself
through it.
On a practical sense, whatreally grounds me in that work?
(20:43):
It's really being a student inthe work.
I receive session and receivecoaching as well.
And allowing myself to staygrounded in that humanity and be
in the work and go, oh yeah, Igot my shit to work on too,
guys.
And it keeps me connected to thetruth and doesn't make me fear
(21:07):
it quite so much.
And the last thing I'll say iswith the texture of somatics
that I'm working with, it reallyteaches you how to listen in
such a way.
Where I think I said this inthis conversation where I was
like, oh, I have this likepodcast interview with Jasmine,
(21:30):
we've been ramping up for it.
I'm so excited.
And noticing this, like thetexture of the fine line between
excitement and anxiety, andgoing, maybe not make a story
about this.
I think it could be a little bitof a both.
So I'm just gonna get on my matand just use the tools that I
have to just move the energy.
So insummation to answer thequestion, knowing that I don't
(21:56):
believe personally in negativeor bad energy.
I think that we're all justwalking each other home.
And being a student of the workand being an integrity in that
allows me to have a read on myown system and respond
accordingly.
SPEAKER_01 (22:10):
Yeah.
You mentioned earlier, too,about having mentors and
teachers.
And I've found that the only waythat I've been able to really
elevate is also having peoplehold me up as well.
Huge.
SPEAKER_00 (22:24):
And you know what else?
Is having like different circlesfor those different aspects as
well, like having a communityfor people who understand you
professionally because like yourbestie from when you were 10
years old might not be in thesame line of work.
And so if you're going to themand talking to them about it, it
(22:47):
you might not be met in the waythat you need, right?
So, like having community inyour line of work, and then on
the flip side, having peoplethat you can connect with that
don't give a shit about what youdo for work and can just connect
with you on a human level.
So, yeah, I think that's a hugepart of it.
(23:08):
I believe in what I know aboutyour work, you talk a lot about
community care and collectivecare, which I think is a huge
conversation around wellness andthe conversation around how
capitalism and colonization hasfound its way into the wellness
space, right?
Is sectoring us off all of usoff and having this huge push
(23:29):
around only the self.
And how am I taking care of meand setting boundaries, which
people say setting boundaries,but really they're just pushing
people out.
And like finding that line, Ithink, is really important.
SPEAKER_01 (23:45):
Absolutely.
I it's so sad to me.
I feel like sometimes we'vegotten into a space where we
almost want to resolve ourselvesof responsibility for others to
the extent that we just trulyisolate ourselves, we truly
disconnect ourselves from thehuman experience because we are
(24:05):
so engulfed with the self.
We're so interested in how wecan improve ourselves, how we
can protect our energy, how wecan have like tunnel vision on
our goals.
And I am just ambitious as thenext girly.
And I also believe in holding mypeople up because I also need
(24:28):
that.
And if relationships aren'treciprocal, if relationships
aren't fueling one another, thenreally we're just like we're
just isolated beings trying toput out things that are
completely disconnected fromwhat the community actually is
looking for.
SPEAKER_00 (24:46):
Totally.
And it I it again it comes tothis conversation for me around
courage.
This is something for me on apersonal level of living my life
courageously and being brave andwhat I've learned through some
of my shamanic arts training andjust watching nature in general.
It's I talk a lot about this.
It's I call it like buffalomedicine.
(25:08):
And I don't know if you've heardthis, but there's this saying, I
am not like a professional whenit comes to cattle and
livestock, but here's what theysay.
Okay, the proverbial day is thatwhen you're looking at livestock
naturally, let's just takecattle versus buffalo.
So if there's a storm coming,the cattle will sense that and
(25:30):
they tend to run in thedirection that is going away
from the storm, right?
So if it's coming from the east,they're running to the west.
What happens is cattle get tiredand they end up staying in the
storm longer because the stormcatches up with them, right?
Now, Buffalo, the proverbialthey say, that it they tend to
(25:53):
run towards the storm and theyactually charge through it,
knowing that it's gonna beharder and more challenging, but
they get through it faster.
And I think about that a lot inmy life and use it as a metaphor
with my clients of like, how canwe be the buffalo?
Like, how can we go towards itcourageously, which allows us,
(26:15):
which comes up in thisconversation around how we are
allowing ourselves to let othersin this conversation around
collective care and becourageous and show up in those
moments where you're like, Idon't know, this feels hard, all
of that stewing inside of you.
And so that's what I work withwith my clients is like how can
(26:37):
you hold more capacity for thehard stuff so you can be
courageous and not be so in yourown, and I don't mean this in a
negative way, but like yourself-centered store and really
think about the bigger picture.
SPEAKER_01 (26:53):
Yes.
How can we build and therapyspeak?
How can we build our distresstolerance?
How can we set ourselves up towithstand hard situations and
still come out able to trust whowe are, trust our voice, and
still feel confident that ifsomething else hard were to
(27:16):
happen, we would be able to holdourselves up.
SPEAKER_00 (27:21):
That's the ticket, I think.
And more and for it's a complex,nuanced conversation coming back
to people's lived experience.
Because when you're talkingabout distress tolerance, like
you brought up, and we alsobrought up the invisible labor
that we carry, you and I andpeople like us.
And so our cup is already prettyfull with stress and distress.
(27:47):
And so, yeah, I think that's areally important conversation as
well to for us to havecompassion for ourselves, but
also to understand that we'reall holding just a little bit
more than what meets the eye.
SPEAKER_01 (27:59):
Yeah.
And not villainizing or shamingany of it, like you said about
no bad energy, no bad feeling,no bad vibes, like all of any
emotion, any energy, any feelingis all data.
It's information.
It allows us to make moreinformed choices.
(28:19):
And so the more that we canallow ourselves to lean into
those more uncomfy feelings likeanger, resentment, sadness,
shame, embarrassment, the morethat we allow ourselves room to
allow those in, the moreinformation we have about
ourselves.
SPEAKER_00 (28:39):
And then the more that we can move forward and
actually feel more capablebecause you have that awareness
and you've met it, you know it,you love it, you sat it down,
you took it out for coffee, youknow, like you have you are with
it.
You're like, okay, I know thisabout myself.
And that doesn't mean that wehave to then like always strive
(28:59):
to this.
Is something else that I talkabout is like how perfectionism
is really woven into thatconversation, especially in the
wellness space and spiritualityand this concept of
enlightenment.
And there is, and this is myopinion.
So, my opinion is that there'sjust a lot, way too much
conversation around beingenlightened or being like high
(29:26):
vibe, and like this conversationaround like being better than is
really what it is.
When some of the most wisepeople that I know have never
stepped foot into a yoga studio.
So I think there's something tobe said about this.
Again, it's just having thatperspective of letting people
teach you.
The other day, me and my partnerwere at the farmers market, and
(29:48):
I was having a day where I wasbeating myself up back end
business stuff, day in the life.
And he was like, Let's just gofor a walk, and we end up at
this farmers market, and there'sthis 10 year old kid who is.
Like, hey, I made some hotsauce.
Do you want to buy it?
And I remember just being like,if this teeny tot mogul could be
(30:10):
out here in these LA streets,like we are gonna be okay.
And my point in sharing thatstory is if a 10-year-old can
teach me like something thatday, like we need to just
dismantle this wholeconversation of hierarchy when
it comes to spirituality,healing, wellness.
It's like we're all teachingeach other all the time.
And I gotta, that was thatSunday, I was like, okay, we are
(30:31):
back on the horse.
SPEAKER_01 (30:34):
And it's just a reminder that showing up is
literally 90% of the battle.
SPEAKER_00 (30:40):
Ugh, literally, literally showing up, getting
yourself to the point.
Because if you've done all thatwork, once you're there, you're
like, we're here.
We're recording.
We're live.
We might as well do it.
SPEAKER_01 (30:51):
He already had his hot sauce.
He was at the farmer's market.
Now the worst thing that canhappen is someone said no, but I
put myself out there.
I have created this product.
I am offering this product.
I've done the heavy work.
And then I've done the work.
The right people will find me.
SPEAKER_00 (31:10):
That's right.
And I was like, yes, you can putthat sauce on a chip and let me
taste it, boo.
Let me let me get a sample.
I was like, okay.
But yeah, I think there's it'sagain, it's I'm hearing a theme
here and putting yourself outthere.
Visibility, the invisible laborthat we carry, having
discernment with the messagesthat we're taking in around all
of that.
(31:30):
Like super important.
I think it's really important.
And I do think that it'sshifting.
It's slowly starting to shift.
I think in the last five years,people are getting over it.
They're getting over it becausethey're not feeling met.
And I'm really excited aboutthat actually.
I don't know.
How do you feel about it?
SPEAKER_01 (31:48):
Oh, yeah.
I feel like the nothing but goodvibes, like relaxed nervous
system is we are now realizingis just repackaged
perfectionism.
Like no one is always 100% zen.
Nobody's nervous system isalways 100% regulated.
(32:11):
That's not realistic.
How about I get to crash out andthen come back to my center?
SPEAKER_00 (32:18):
Okay, because that right there, like there's the
there's so much in that.
There's so much life in that.
That's so human, that's so real,that's life.
That's something that I candefinitely get behind.
And it's like, I was justthinking, I was like, are you in
my journal or in my likemessaging strategy?
That's crazy.
This repurpose perfectionism isa huge part of it.
And it is a slippery slopebecause at the end of the day,
(32:42):
it pulls on that thread, Ithink, as humans, of us just
wanting to live our best life,whatever that means.
Make the most out of this thing.
I'm a millennial, I've got maybe50 more years at this if I'm
lucky, if all goes well.
And you're like, man, I reallyhope I do this justice, do this
(33:02):
service.
Like, I really give my all.
And yeah, it is a fine line towalk, but I love how you framed
that.
It's beautiful.
SPEAKER_01 (33:09):
I the most dysregulated my nervous system
has felt was when I wasconstantly walking around as if
I always had it together.
Or if I always had thisregulated state.
But when I've allowed myself torage, when I've allowed myself
to cry, now that I've allowedmyself to experience a range of
(33:29):
emotion, it has given me thetools to learn how to return to
my baseline.
Performing and pretending that Ilike full zen, like high vibe,
all that did was left me feelingreally disregulated, like really
confused in my own body.
But when I've allowed myself toexpress, to share and to move
(33:51):
through it, that's when I feltlike okay, I got it.
That's when I felt the mostconfident.
SPEAKER_00 (34:08):
Yes, and the this comes up a lot with clients for
me, and I'm curious for you, butworking somatically in the body,
we talk a lot about and feel alot about the resonance between
different states and theresonance between anger and
passion or grief and love.
(34:31):
I think I cannot think of hername, Marissa.
There's her book is called Griefis Love, I believe.
And I believe she said grief islove with nowhere to go.
And that for me is like when youreally think about it, that's
(34:51):
there's a connection between allof these feelings.
If you take anger, for example,it feels like intense and like
you wanna, but then when youflip it and you can alchemize
it, you can channel passionthrough it.
Or today, right before thiscall, I was like, am I anxious
or excited?
Doesn't matter actually, itdoesn't really matter, but we
(35:12):
can channel, we can weave thosetwo and come to some kind of
resolution.
And I just think it adds so muchmore texture, it's so much more
texture to the human experienceto let ourselves feel that and
to let us let ourselvesexperience that because like my
belief is that we yeah, wethat's the most one of the
(35:36):
greatest gifts of being in thehuman experience is having such
a myriad of texture in ourday-to-day life and emotions let
us do that.
SPEAKER_01 (35:45):
This has been such a rewarding conversation, and I
feel like so many people canresonate with just the idea of
just showing up for yourself toto live within your truth, to be
scared and do it anyway.
I feel like we've touched on somany various topics, but being
(36:08):
able to like find that anchorwithin, not seeking, not looking
for someone else to beperforming it, not looking for
someone else to be the model,but finding that anchor within
and then allowing that to beportrayed externally and coming
(36:28):
home to ourselves at the end ofthe day.
SPEAKER_00 (36:30):
That's what it's all about.
And I know that for myself, Idon't want to speak for you, but
and for anyone listening, it'syeah, just anchoring down in the
truth of your experience and letyourself just be human.
It's okay.
Nobody has it figured out, and Iknow you know that already, but
it's nice to hear.
SPEAKER_01 (36:48):
Putting double emphasis on it, nobody has it
figured out.
None of us do.
We are winging it, we areshowing up every day.
Winging it every day.
Where can folks find you if theyare interested in learning more
or wanting to work with you?
SPEAKER_00 (37:07):
Yeah, you can find me if you want to shoot me a DM
on Instagram.
I'm at Somatic CEO.
That's where you can just getstraight into my inbox and talk.
But I would love to gift you andyour listeners one of my fun
free quizzes, which is calledWhat Wild Animal Runs Your
Subconscious?
And it's a fun, like, it'sgiving buzzfeed.
(37:29):
It's giving, I just need alittle cute dopamine hit that's
gonna actually teach mesomething.
And I have fused attachmenttheory and nervous system
research to help us tounderstand like how what
archetype are you and how stressis moving and motivating you in
your life, but also having thisconversation of like how can you
(37:52):
alchemize nerves intoexcitement?
How can you like really walkthis way that we've been talking
about today?
So definitely invite y'all totake that quiz.
It's lots of fun.
Shoot me a DM at Somatic CEO andshare this episode with a friend
who you think needs it.
SPEAKER_01 (38:11):
Everything will be linked in the show notes.
And as a closing question forall of my guests in the latter
half of the year, I am asking,what word do you want to embody
by the end of 2025?
SPEAKER_00 (38:25):
What word do I want to embody?
This one's a good question.
I'm gonna have to sit with itfor just a moment.
The loudest word that I'mhearing is devotion.
Devotion to myself, to what Ibelieve, to those I love, to
(38:46):
those I've yet to meet, to mycommunity, to the earth.
Just being in devotion, being inservice, and just leaving this
place a little bit brighter thanhow I found it.
SPEAKER_01 (39:00):
Thank you so much for joining me today.
SPEAKER_00 (39:03):
Thank you so much, Jasmine.
It's been a pleasure.
Are you sitting with thousands of hours of B-roll
(00:02):
content and telling yourself,I'll start posting tomorrow?
Are you in your head worriedabout your friends and family
thinking your fringe refusing tobe visible?
Are you chasing trends insteadof building influence?
Welcome to the VisibilityStandard, where the visionaries
of today are changing the rolesof their industries and letting
their voice be heard.
I'm your host, Jasmine, and weare setting the standard.
(00:30):
I'm so excited for my guest.
We are going to be talking abouthow wellness has really just
become a performative space.
It has become a space where thelook is more important than the
feel at times.
And I'm just so excited to talkabout this with her.
Today I have my guest with me,Shantany Moore.
(00:52):
Thank you so much for joining metoday.
SPEAKER_00 (00:54):
Thank you for having me.
I'm excited to get into this.
This is a juicy topic that Icould talk about all damn day.
SPEAKER_01 (01:01):
What really drew me to your Instagram was your video
about the aloe athletic wear andhow we love the two-piece set.
We love having the yoga mat.
We love the matcha morning asthis epitome of wellness.
And it's really become for showversus what it actually feels.
SPEAKER_00 (01:26):
Yeah, I think that narrative has been so harmful
for me in my life, even beingsomeone who spent 10 years in
the fitness industry in wellnessspaces, and it's just time to
pull it back.
We need to talk about it andjust put it on the airwaves
because I know that there'sprobably someone listening who
might feel like you have to keepup, and I'm just here to tell
you, you don't have to keep up.
SPEAKER_01 (01:47):
Tell us, how did you get started in the wellness
space?
SPEAKER_00 (01:53):
So my journey started about 10 years ago.
I was a professional dancer whofound fitness and yoga as a side
hustle and also as a way tocross-train.
And once I started going downthat journey and trying to do it
all, I live in Los Angeles.
I was trying to do it all and beit all and literally perform for
(02:14):
a paycheck.
And I found myself one day aftera fitness class that I was
teaching on a parking garagefloor with tonic immobility and
I'm unable to move from burnout,just completely burned out.
My body wasn't able to function.
And that was the first timewhere I saw there was a little
bit of a chink in the armor.
I was like, that's ironic thatI'm a fitness professional and
(02:37):
wellness enthusiast who is nowteaching this and on the floor.
So that was the beginning of myjourney with this whole
conversation.
SPEAKER_01 (02:48):
Very nice.
And now you are into spinalenergetics.
SPEAKER_00 (02:53):
Yes.
So now I'm a body intelligencecoach and I weave spinal
energetics, other somaticprocessing practices, and what
I've learned in my shamanic artstraining to really like ground
the esoteric principles that wecome to live by and maybe aspire
to be in alignment with justlike your lived experience and
just making it real.
Do you live in DC?
(03:13):
Yeah.
Like you live in DC, I live inLA.
I'm like, we gotta make it real.
So what is spinal energetics?
Spinal energetics is a nervoussystem training technique in the
simplest form.
We use association and awarenesstraining to help your body to
remember how to process stressfaster.
(03:37):
So many of us are living,especially if you live in like
these urban areas, or if you'resomebody who has a lot of
responsibilities, which I knowif you're listening to this
podcast, you are here becauseyou need the answers.
We use this modality to helpyour body to remember how to
come out of that chronic freezestate or any kind of stress
(03:58):
response that we might bespiraling in that's preventing
us from ultimately just feelingmore grounded, integrated, and
able to get through our dayswith less stress.
SPEAKER_01 (04:10):
When I hear you talk, you sound, I mean, very
certain and confident with yourpath within the wellness space.
And I'm so curious, was thereever a part of you that wanted
to leave the wellness space?
SPEAKER_00 (04:25):
Girl, yes.
So the second part really hitwhen you just said that of
wanting to leave.
I'll just, I'm here to say ithow it is.
There's room for every industryto improve, and the wellness
industry has so far to go whenit has through the conversation
of inclusivity, of livedexperience, of a lot of these.
(04:48):
I know you talk a lot about likeanti-capitalism on this podcast,
and I'm sure we'll get into it.
But I'll be honest, I was awellness practitioner and
fitness instructor who didn'tsee myself represented in the
spaces.
I worked in boutique fitness andworked really hard and got some
really incredible connectionsand jobs.
(05:09):
But when I would look around, Iwas the only one in the room who
looked like me.
And that was so on a personallevel, because we're human too,
disorienting, displacing, andthere was this silent string of
loneliness.
And now I feel I'm in adifferent place with that
conversation in my work,obviously, because I'm not
teaching fitness anymore.
(05:29):
But with my body intelligencecoaching and connecting with
people on how their livedexperience informs the way that
they move through the world is ahuge conversation when we talk
about wellness.
SPEAKER_01 (05:40):
Especially, I feel like with social media, as
influential as it is, when wehave similar bodies, similar
race, ethnicities representingwellness, we're creating a mold
for wellness.
And we can look back as early aslike fashion magazines, setting
(06:01):
the trend, setting the tone forhow people should look, how
people should dress, what isneeded to fit in.
That sort of narrative iscontinuing to happen in the
wellness space.
And as you're talking, I'mthinking about a TikTok video.
This girl got major backlash forit, but she made the statement
that fat people shouldn't be inPilates.
(06:24):
And I'm glad she got theresponse that she did, but it
goes to show that there is anexpectation that people should
look a certain way, that theyneed to be a certain way to uh
participate in wellness.
SPEAKER_00 (06:41):
Totally.
When you were speaking, I wasalso just thinking about how
young this industry actually is.
It's so young.
It is like fresh out the gate inrespect to other industries and
the conversation around fitnessspecifically, which is tied to
really deeply entrenched withthe wellness conversation.
And so there's room for all ofus to see where we have room to
(07:04):
improve, and as leaders and thenas people who are participating
in the industry to question likeexactly what you said with this
TikTok that went viral and gotthe backlash.
It's like people say things andeverybody's entitled to say what
they're gonna say, but you needto be conscious of what you're
saying and who you're saying itto.
(07:24):
And I think that really peopleshould hold leaders accountable
and hold us all accountable.
And when we know better, we dobetter.
What is that?
My Angelou, I think she saysthat.
And uh, our industry has a longway to go.
SPEAKER_01 (07:38):
Absolutely.
Do you ever feel like wellnessis a buzzword now?
Oh my gosh, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (07:46):
I have been, Jasmine, let me tell you, this
is like behind the scenes, okay?
I have been on this wholerebranding journey because when
people think about it, that'stheir first gateway into
understanding that health goesbeyond the physical.
I think people usually start outtheir journey going, oh, I'm not
(08:08):
happy with how I'm feeling orlooking at my body.
So they find fitness and thenthey find wellness, and then
they go, actually, I need atherapist.
And so it's like this naturaljourney.
But yeah, I definitely thinkthat it's a buzzword now.
In my practice, I like to reallyencourage this conversation
around wholeness versuswellness.
(08:31):
What does it mean to be well?
And what does it mean to feelmore whole and more integrated?
Pun intended to have all of ourparts coming together.
And that wellness doesn't justhave to do with how you look, it
has to do with how you feel, howyou relate to other people, to
your community, how you'reengaging with your community.
(08:54):
So it's very much a buzzword, inmy opinion.
And yeah, that's theconversation we need to be
having, I think, is more aboutwholeness.
SPEAKER_01 (09:01):
And the statement of wholeness, I feel like
encapsulates what people areseeking when they discuss
wellness.
It's the spiritual, it's thephysical, it is the mental, it's
the emotional, it's the wholeperson versus this commodified
version of wellness that I thinkthat we sometimes put on display
(09:22):
because it looks really pretty,but that's not really like the
journey of I feel like seekingwholeness for people.
It's actually pretty messy.
SPEAKER_00 (09:32):
Totally.
Oh my gosh, it's so messy, it'sthe messiest, and it's this
balance, right?
Like from a business standpoint,there's something to be said
where I understand that you wantto get messages out there, and
sometimes it's easier to digestwith a certain aesthetic or
branding or whatever, but you'reso right, it is so messy.
I just keep thinking, like in mypractice, people come in and
(09:58):
they might say things that tendto be more, I'm gonna use the
language of surface level, butit might just be like more
relational.
I don't like how I feel in mybody, for example.
We've been talking a lot aboutbodies so far, right?
And when you really diveunderneath the hood, it's what
is this, what is this reallyabout?
What is it that you're wantingto experience?
Is it really that you want toquote unquote lose weight, or is
(10:21):
it that you really just want tofeel more grounded and you want
to relate to people in a waywhere you don't feel like you
constantly have to fix and fusswith your external to feel like
you belong?
Is that what this is reallyabout?
And I agree with you.
It's just, it's never reallyabout the thing.
It's usually about what'sunderneath the hood and asking
the question.
(10:42):
I'll just end this point withthis of so that you can what?
This is something I say all thetime.
It's okay, you want to launchthis business so that you can
what?
So you can make lots of money.
Why do you want to make a lot ofmoney so that you can take care
of your mother, so that you can,you know, like just challenging
people to go deeper?
It's like, it's never usuallyjust about the thing, which I
(11:05):
know because you're a therapist.
SPEAKER_01 (11:08):
It's never about the thing, and it's always about the
more vulnerable thing that we'reworking towards that we don't
always have the words for.
I'm curious, as a black woman inthis space, do you ever feel
like you have to shape shift inany way to be received?
SPEAKER_00 (11:28):
This has been a long journey for me.
The short answer is yes.
Like, I feel that pressure.
I would be disingenuous to saythat I don't experience that
very real pressure.
And my Scorpio mid-heaven beslinking girl.
She be like going through, youknow what I'm saying?
So that's a real shadow as well.
(11:48):
But I think something that hashelped me to navigate these
spaces is to just ask myselfthis, which this is a shamanic
principle of like, how can I bea bridge?
How can I be a bridge and notabandon myself in the space, but
be a bridge between worlds,between my lived experience and
(12:13):
someone else's who might lookdifferent than me, and help them
to not, it's not my job to makethem understand, but to stand in
my own right in my truth.
I'm a black woman and I'm alsofirst generation here, and my
dad's from Jamaica, my mom'sfrom Singapore.
I have a very nuanced experienceas well, and not feeling like I
(12:36):
even have to, this is a shadowas well, where you might feel
like you have to live up topeople's expectations,
especially as a black woman.
Like people have an expectationor a stereotype or something
that they're carrying, and youfeel you can feel that pressure.
(12:56):
And I definitely have a lot ofcompassion in that conversation
because it is a it's a trickyline to walk, and I just think
that we all get to find how wecan be a bridge.
SPEAKER_01 (13:08):
Thank you so much for sharing that.
And as I'm hearing you, likebeing a bridge is a huge
responsibility, it's a bigweight to carry.
SPEAKER_00 (13:18):
Yeah, I think this is the conversation, right?
It's like this extra invisiblelabor.
This invisible labor of how am Ibeing perceived?
I know that you talk a lot aboutvisibility, right?
How am I being perceived?
And that's the truth of ourexperience.
It's the truth of the world thatwe live in, and that's why I
(13:39):
love supporting people whopeople like us, because it's a
nuanced conversation of how areyou being perceived versus who
are you really?
And what invisible labor can weput down?
And so, with my somatic work andmy body intelligence coaching,
this is a space for you to bevisible in the truth of who you
(14:03):
are first, before the world,because telling you who you are
supposed to be, or supposed toact, or supposed to talk.
There's this quote by PabloPicasso, and I believe he said
something along the lines of, Ispent my entire life learning
how to paint like a kid again.
And I feel like that is theweight that we carry, especially
(14:27):
as black women, and especiallyas black women in the wellness
and healing space, is I amasking the question of who am I?
And who was I before everyoneelse told me who I should be?
SPEAKER_01 (14:44):
Um chill, just like having this conversation because
we show up online, we arevisibly black, like owning that,
and we have no control of howpeople receive or perceive that.
And so maybe diluting ourmessage, or maybe not being as
outspoken, maybe not being asbold with some of our takes,
(15:07):
because we know they will bereceived very differently from
someone else who might say thesame thing.
And let to what you said earlierabout oh, not self-abandoning,
about staying true to ourselves,being anchored in confident in
who we are is I know for me is afull-time job if as long as I
(15:30):
choose to show up publicly, aslong as I choose to show up,
have opinions, be someone thatis public in the healing space.
I have to feel so certain aboutmyself because there are going
to be so many people that willbenefit from me questioning
myself.
SPEAKER_00 (15:48):
Come on now.
That who will benefit from mequestioning myself.
And and I think you do a reallybeautiful job of this, and I
just want to commend you on itbecause it's I was listening to
one of your episodes beforegetting on here, and you were
talking about yeah, your journeywith visibility and how more
nuanced conversations whenposted on social media dragged
(16:13):
uh but just dragged.
You're like, you have nocontext, honey.
You have no context, and you aretaking my words and twisting
them.
And yes, what you said as wellof acknowledging I'm work more
in that esoteric, and you'realso in the coaching space, but
it's predominantly a whitefemale space, and I just it's it
(16:37):
just doesn't hit the same whenor it doesn't land the same, and
is it perceived the same when Isay the same things that other
people are saying?
So the question that I ask formyself and for my clients, and
is what's the path through?
Because so often we can say, Icould never say it like that, or
I could never do that, right?
And I I like to ask, well, it'snot if you can, it's just how.
(17:01):
How are we gonna find a paththrough?
And acknowledging that if youare somebody who is visible in
the public eye or looking to be,there's a fine line with
vulnerability.
It doesn't mean that you have toovershare in a way that takes
you outside of your window oftolerance, right?
What is something that is trueand honest and speaks to what
(17:26):
you want to speak to, but it'salso not gonna put you on the
personal level, the personbehind the camera, in jeopardy
with your own mental health.
SPEAKER_01 (17:34):
Yeah.
It it is a balancing act forsure.
But I do believe that the payoffis much more positive.
Being able to be seen, beingable to navigate authenticity
publicly, uh it is it allowsthat representation.
(17:58):
Like we allow representationwhen we choose to show up in
these spaces and choose to shareour opinions and stand by them
and stand behind them.
What anchors you what groundsyou in your own life that allows
you to do the work?
Because coaching and especiallyenergetics can be very sensitive
(18:18):
work in the sense that otherpeople's energy can potentially
bleed out, like you're carryingso much.
And so, what grounds you to beable to support people in the
ways that you do?
SPEAKER_00 (18:30):
That's such a beautiful question.
And I I first want to say, justnodding back to what you just
said about being authentic andletting yourself speak, your
people cannot find you if theycannot see you.
And there's something sopowerful that I think we get to
do is when we speak in ourvisibility and allow ourselves
(18:53):
to be authentic.
Yeah, you do run the risk ofcriticism, but you also there's
so much benefit to actuallygoing, oh, you all think this
too.
That's sometimes where I thinkthat sometimes the algorithm can
be on your side, where it'llstart pushing your stuff to
people who agree.
And so that can make you feelless lonely.
(19:14):
Coming back to what grounds mein this conversation.
Well, my philosophy, which is inalignment with the things that
I've learned and the teachersand the mentors that I have the
privilege to work with, is notreally subscribing to this idea
of bad or like negative energy,first of all, where I think in
(19:35):
the conventional, like you'llsee you gotta stay high vibe,
everybody stay high vibe, andit's all about positive, what is
that, toxic positivity?
Like, we are not about this, weare not about this in my corner
of the internet.
Number one, I think it takes alevel of courage for all of us
to really be able to sit withpeople in the hard stuff.
And so that really is somethingthat in those moments where I
(19:59):
feel my humanity goes, whew,this is a lot, like, or
whatever, the energetically I'mfeeling a lot.
I look at it as we're all justwalking stories, we're all
living our stories and ourbodies hold stories.
And so I just get to read achapter out of your book.
And for me to be able toexperience that, whether it be
(20:21):
somatically, energetically, oreven relationally, like you and
I talking right now.
Like I get to add a couple morewrinkles to my brain and a
couple more pages to my bookwhere I get to learn.
So that's like a cognitive waythat I can sometimes talk myself
through it.
On a practical sense, whatreally grounds me in that work?
(20:43):
It's really being a student inthe work.
I receive session and receivecoaching as well.
And allowing myself to staygrounded in that humanity and be
in the work and go, oh yeah, Igot my shit to work on too,
guys.
And it keeps me connected to thetruth and doesn't make me fear
(21:07):
it quite so much.
And the last thing I'll say iswith the texture of somatics
that I'm working with, it reallyteaches you how to listen in
such a way.
Where I think I said this inthis conversation where I was
like, oh, I have this likepodcast interview with Jasmine,
(21:30):
we've been ramping up for it.
I'm so excited.
And noticing this, like thetexture of the fine line between
excitement and anxiety, andgoing, maybe not make a story
about this.
I think it could be a little bitof a both.
So I'm just gonna get on my matand just use the tools that I
have to just move the energy.
So insummation to answer thequestion, knowing that I don't
(21:56):
believe personally in negativeor bad energy.
I think that we're all justwalking each other home.
And being a student of the workand being an integrity in that
allows me to have a read on myown system and respond
accordingly.
SPEAKER_01 (22:10):
Yeah.
You mentioned earlier, too,about having mentors and
teachers.
And I've found that the only waythat I've been able to really
elevate is also having peoplehold me up as well.
Huge.
SPEAKER_00 (22:24):
And you know what else?
Is having like different circlesfor those different aspects as
well, like having a communityfor people who understand you
professionally because like yourbestie from when you were 10
years old might not be in thesame line of work.
And so if you're going to themand talking to them about it, it
(22:47):
you might not be met in the waythat you need, right?
So, like having community inyour line of work, and then on
the flip side, having peoplethat you can connect with that
don't give a shit about what youdo for work and can just connect
with you on a human level.
So, yeah, I think that's a hugepart of it.
(23:08):
I believe in what I know aboutyour work, you talk a lot about
community care and collectivecare, which I think is a huge
conversation around wellness andthe conversation around how
capitalism and colonization hasfound its way into the wellness
space, right?
Is sectoring us off all of usoff and having this huge push
(23:29):
around only the self.
And how am I taking care of meand setting boundaries, which
people say setting boundaries,but really they're just pushing
people out.
And like finding that line, Ithink, is really important.
SPEAKER_01 (23:45):
Absolutely.
I it's so sad to me.
I feel like sometimes we'vegotten into a space where we
almost want to resolve ourselvesof responsibility for others to
the extent that we just trulyisolate ourselves, we truly
disconnect ourselves from thehuman experience because we are
(24:05):
so engulfed with the self.
We're so interested in how wecan improve ourselves, how we
can protect our energy, how wecan have like tunnel vision on
our goals.
And I am just ambitious as thenext girly.
And I also believe in holding mypeople up because I also need
(24:28):
that.
And if relationships aren'treciprocal, if relationships
aren't fueling one another, thenreally we're just like we're
just isolated beings trying toput out things that are
completely disconnected fromwhat the community actually is
looking for.
SPEAKER_00 (24:46):
Totally.
And it I it again it comes tothis conversation for me around
courage.
This is something for me on apersonal level of living my life
courageously and being brave andwhat I've learned through some
of my shamanic arts training andjust watching nature in general.
It's I talk a lot about this.
It's I call it like buffalomedicine.
(25:08):
And I don't know if you've heardthis, but there's this saying, I
am not like a professional whenit comes to cattle and
livestock, but here's what theysay.
Okay, the proverbial day is thatwhen you're looking at livestock
naturally, let's just takecattle versus buffalo.
So if there's a storm coming,the cattle will sense that and
(25:30):
they tend to run in thedirection that is going away
from the storm, right?
So if it's coming from the east,they're running to the west.
What happens is cattle get tiredand they end up staying in the
storm longer because the stormcatches up with them, right?
Now, Buffalo, the proverbialthey say, that it they tend to
(25:53):
run towards the storm and theyactually charge through it,
knowing that it's gonna beharder and more challenging, but
they get through it faster.
And I think about that a lot inmy life and use it as a metaphor
with my clients of like, how canwe be the buffalo?
Like, how can we go towards itcourageously, which allows us,
(26:15):
which comes up in thisconversation around how we are
allowing ourselves to let othersin this conversation around
collective care and becourageous and show up in those
moments where you're like, Idon't know, this feels hard, all
of that stewing inside of you.
And so that's what I work withwith my clients is like how can
(26:37):
you hold more capacity for thehard stuff so you can be
courageous and not be so in yourown, and I don't mean this in a
negative way, but like yourself-centered store and really
think about the bigger picture.
SPEAKER_01 (26:53):
Yes.
How can we build and therapyspeak?
How can we build our distresstolerance?
How can we set ourselves up towithstand hard situations and
still come out able to trust whowe are, trust our voice, and
still feel confident that ifsomething else hard were to
(27:16):
happen, we would be able to holdourselves up.
SPEAKER_00 (27:21):
That's the ticket, I think.
And more and for it's a complex,nuanced conversation coming back
to people's lived experience.
Because when you're talkingabout distress tolerance, like
you brought up, and we alsobrought up the invisible labor
that we carry, you and I andpeople like us.
And so our cup is already prettyfull with stress and distress.
(27:47):
And so, yeah, I think that's areally important conversation as
well to for us to havecompassion for ourselves, but
also to understand that we'reall holding just a little bit
more than what meets the eye.
SPEAKER_01 (27:59):
Yeah.
And not villainizing or shamingany of it, like you said about
no bad energy, no bad feeling,no bad vibes, like all of any
emotion, any energy, any feelingis all data.
It's information.
It allows us to make moreinformed choices.
(28:19):
And so the more that we canallow ourselves to lean into
those more uncomfy feelings likeanger, resentment, sadness,
shame, embarrassment, the morethat we allow ourselves room to
allow those in, the moreinformation we have about
ourselves.
SPEAKER_00 (28:39):
And then the more that we can move forward and
actually feel more capablebecause you have that awareness
and you've met it, you know it,you love it, you sat it down,
you took it out for coffee, youknow, like you have you are with
it.
You're like, okay, I know thisabout myself.
And that doesn't mean that wehave to then like always strive
(28:59):
to this.
Is something else that I talkabout is like how perfectionism
is really woven into thatconversation, especially in the
wellness space and spiritualityand this concept of
enlightenment.
And there is, and this is myopinion.
So, my opinion is that there'sjust a lot, way too much
conversation around beingenlightened or being like high
(29:26):
vibe, and like this conversationaround like being better than is
really what it is.
When some of the most wisepeople that I know have never
stepped foot into a yoga studio.
So I think there's something tobe said about this.
Again, it's just having thatperspective of letting people
teach you.
The other day, me and my partnerwere at the farmers market, and
(29:48):
I was having a day where I wasbeating myself up back end
business stuff, day in the life.
And he was like, Let's just gofor a walk, and we end up at
this farmers market, and there'sthis 10 year old kid who is.
Like, hey, I made some hotsauce.
Do you want to buy it?
And I remember just being like,if this teeny tot mogul could be
(30:10):
out here in these LA streets,like we are gonna be okay.
And my point in sharing thatstory is if a 10-year-old can
teach me like something thatday, like we need to just
dismantle this wholeconversation of hierarchy when
it comes to spirituality,healing, wellness.
It's like we're all teachingeach other all the time.
And I gotta, that was thatSunday, I was like, okay, we are
(30:31):
back on the horse.
SPEAKER_01 (30:34):
And it's just a reminder that showing up is
literally 90% of the battle.
SPEAKER_00 (30:40):
Ugh, literally, literally showing up, getting
yourself to the point.
Because if you've done all thatwork, once you're there, you're
like, we're here.
We're recording.
We're live.
We might as well do it.
SPEAKER_01 (30:51):
He already had his hot sauce.
He was at the farmer's market.
Now the worst thing that canhappen is someone said no, but I
put myself out there.
I have created this product.
I am offering this product.
I've done the heavy work.
And then I've done the work.
The right people will find me.
SPEAKER_00 (31:10):
That's right.
And I was like, yes, you can putthat sauce on a chip and let me
taste it, boo.
Let me let me get a sample.
I was like, okay.
But yeah, I think there's it'sagain, it's I'm hearing a theme
here and putting yourself outthere.
Visibility, the invisible laborthat we carry, having
discernment with the messagesthat we're taking in around all
of that.
(31:30):
Like super important.
I think it's really important.
And I do think that it'sshifting.
It's slowly starting to shift.
I think in the last five years,people are getting over it.
They're getting over it becausethey're not feeling met.
And I'm really excited aboutthat actually.
I don't know.
How do you feel about it?
SPEAKER_01 (31:48):
Oh, yeah.
I feel like the nothing but goodvibes, like relaxed nervous
system is we are now realizingis just repackaged
perfectionism.
Like no one is always 100% zen.
Nobody's nervous system isalways 100% regulated.
(32:11):
That's not realistic.
How about I get to crash out andthen come back to my center?
SPEAKER_00 (32:18):
Okay, because that right there, like there's the
there's so much in that.
There's so much life in that.
That's so human, that's so real,that's life.
That's something that I candefinitely get behind.
And it's like, I was justthinking, I was like, are you in
my journal or in my likemessaging strategy?
That's crazy.
This repurpose perfectionism isa huge part of it.
And it is a slippery slopebecause at the end of the day,
(32:42):
it pulls on that thread, Ithink, as humans, of us just
wanting to live our best life,whatever that means.
Make the most out of this thing.
I'm a millennial, I've got maybe50 more years at this if I'm
lucky, if all goes well.
And you're like, man, I reallyhope I do this justice, do this
(33:02):
service.
Like, I really give my all.
And yeah, it is a fine line towalk, but I love how you framed
that.
It's beautiful.
SPEAKER_01 (33:09):
I the most dysregulated my nervous system
has felt was when I wasconstantly walking around as if
I always had it together.
Or if I always had thisregulated state.
But when I've allowed myself torage, when I've allowed myself
to cry, now that I've allowedmyself to experience a range of
(33:29):
emotion, it has given me thetools to learn how to return to
my baseline.
Performing and pretending that Ilike full zen, like high vibe,
all that did was left me feelingreally disregulated, like really
confused in my own body.
But when I've allowed myself toexpress, to share and to move
(33:51):
through it, that's when I feltlike okay, I got it.
That's when I felt the mostconfident.
SPEAKER_00 (34:08):
Yes, and the this comes up a lot with clients for
me, and I'm curious for you, butworking somatically in the body,
we talk a lot about and feel alot about the resonance between
different states and theresonance between anger and
passion or grief and love.
(34:31):
I think I cannot think of hername, Marissa.
There's her book is called Griefis Love, I believe.
And I believe she said grief islove with nowhere to go.
And that for me is like when youreally think about it, that's
(34:51):
there's a connection between allof these feelings.
If you take anger, for example,it feels like intense and like
you wanna, but then when youflip it and you can alchemize
it, you can channel passionthrough it.
Or today, right before thiscall, I was like, am I anxious
or excited?
Doesn't matter actually, itdoesn't really matter, but we
(35:12):
can channel, we can weave thosetwo and come to some kind of
resolution.
And I just think it adds so muchmore texture, it's so much more
texture to the human experienceto let ourselves feel that and
to let us let ourselvesexperience that because like my
belief is that we yeah, wethat's the most one of the
(35:36):
greatest gifts of being in thehuman experience is having such
a myriad of texture in ourday-to-day life and emotions let
us do that.
SPEAKER_01 (35:45):
This has been such a rewarding conversation, and I
feel like so many people canresonate with just the idea of
just showing up for yourself toto live within your truth, to be
scared and do it anyway.
I feel like we've touched on somany various topics, but being
(36:08):
able to like find that anchorwithin, not seeking, not looking
for someone else to beperforming it, not looking for
someone else to be the model,but finding that anchor within
and then allowing that to beportrayed externally and coming
(36:28):
home to ourselves at the end ofthe day.
SPEAKER_00 (36:30):
That's what it's all about.
And I know that for myself, Idon't want to speak for you, but
and for anyone listening, it'syeah, just anchoring down in the
truth of your experience and letyourself just be human.
It's okay.
Nobody has it figured out, and Iknow you know that already, but
it's nice to hear.
SPEAKER_01 (36:48):
Putting double emphasis on it, nobody has it
figured out.
None of us do.
We are winging it, we areshowing up every day.
Winging it every day.
Where can folks find you if theyare interested in learning more
or wanting to work with you?
SPEAKER_00 (37:07):
Yeah, you can find me if you want to shoot me a DM
on Instagram.
I'm at Somatic CEO.
That's where you can just getstraight into my inbox and talk.
But I would love to gift you andyour listeners one of my fun
free quizzes, which is calledWhat Wild Animal Runs Your
Subconscious?
And it's a fun, like, it'sgiving buzzfeed.
(37:29):
It's giving, I just need alittle cute dopamine hit that's
gonna actually teach mesomething.
And I have fused attachmenttheory and nervous system
research to help us tounderstand like how what
archetype are you and how stressis moving and motivating you in
your life, but also having thisconversation of like how can you
(37:52):
alchemize nerves intoexcitement?
How can you like really walkthis way that we've been talking
about today?
So definitely invite y'all totake that quiz.
It's lots of fun.
Shoot me a DM at Somatic CEO andshare this episode with a friend
who you think needs it.
SPEAKER_01 (38:11):
Everything will be linked in the show notes.
And as a closing question forall of my guests in the latter
half of the year, I am asking,what word do you want to embody
by the end of 2025?
SPEAKER_00 (38:25):
What word do I want to embody?
This one's a good question.
I'm gonna have to sit with itfor just a moment.
The loudest word that I'mhearing is devotion.
Devotion to myself, to what Ibelieve, to those I love, to
(38:46):
those I've yet to meet, to mycommunity, to the earth.
Just being in devotion, being inservice, and just leaving this
place a little bit brighter thanhow I found it.
SPEAKER_01 (39:00):
Thank you so much for joining me today.
SPEAKER_00 (39:03):
Thank you so much, Jasmine.
It's been a pleasure.
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