November 29, 2025 • 33 mins
Navigating Cybersecurity Challenges with Mike Armistead
In this episode of The Wireless Way, host Chris Whitaker discusses the complexities of cybersecurity with seasoned entrepreneur Mike Armistead. With over 30 years of experience in creating and selling multiple tech companies, Mike shares practical lessons on persistence, timing, and leadership. The conversation delves into how AI is transforming both defensive and offensive strategies in cybersecurity, the importance of proactive security measures, and the challenges businesses face in maintaining cybersecurity amidst rapid technological changes. Mike also highlights the need for businesses of all sizes to invest in proper cybersecurity measures and the balance between innovation and risk. Tune in to gain valuable insights on how to better protect your organization in today's digital landscape.
00:00 Introduction and Host Welcome
00:23 Guest Introduction: Mike Armistead
01:56 Mike's Career Journey and Influences
04:15 Lessons from Startups and Entrepreneurship
11:43 The Impact of AI on Cybersecurity
15:21 Challenges and Innovations in Cybersecurity
26:32 Advice for Business Leaders on Cybersecurity
28:59 Closing Remarks and Resources
Check out my website https://thewirelessway.net/ use the contact button to send request and feedback.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
chris_1_11-25-2025_1230 (00:04):
Welcome to another episode of The
Wireless Way.
I'm your host, Chris Whitaker,and as always, I'm so grateful
you're here today.
I know there's a lot going onyou probably could be doing,
and, this is a good topic.
I mean, you know, it's thewireless way and we talk a lot
about a lot of things and,probably, I don't think I get
this topic enough attention,cybersecurity.
So, I have a special guesttoday.
(00:24):
We're gonna unpack that, Whatdoes it take to build and sell
multiple companies in one of thetoughest industries?
Cybersecurity and I, I've had afront row seat to that.
Mike Armistead has done it againand again, leading startups to
nine figure acquisitions and nowguiding pulse security ai.
with more than 30 years ofexperience across major
(00:46):
technology shifts from the earlyinternet, to today's rise of
artificial intelligence, youalmost can't read a news report
without AI being in theresomewhere.
Mike brings practical lessonsfrom both success and failure,
easier to share our persistence,timing, and thoughtful
leadership.
can help organizations thrive atfast changing times.
(01:07):
he spent nearly 40 yearsbuilding companies, leading
teams, driving growth across awide range of industries.
he's co-founded our help buildseveral successful startups like
response software, fortifysoftware who, where, and of
course, pure software.
The guy knows what he is talkingabout, so I'm so grateful we
have him on the show today.
in fact, he's still driven bybuilding great teams and
(01:28):
tracking big, meaningfulchallenges.
Mike, welcome to the show.
I'm so glad we're able to getthis set up today.
How you doing?
mike-armistead_1_11-25-20 (01:35):
Chris doing great.
I really appreciate you havingme on.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (01:39):
I'm glad to have, like I said, iron
sharpens iron.
You know, this is a importantconversation that is really
impacting business.
It's impacting revenues forcompanies, reputations,
operational outputs andoutcomes.
I mean, it touches all parts oftechnology and business.
So, I'm really glad we're havingthis conversation.
as always, my first question,you know, like, what's not the
(01:59):
bio man?
How did you get here?
mike-armistead_1_11-25-20 (02:01):
Yeah.
You know, one thing I always, amsurprised by on the bios that
when I start thinking about'emis that it leaves out all the
people that you've come acrossin those years.
You know, I'm 40 years into thisprofessional life and just
thinking about, just all thepeople that have helped been
part of.
Just the fabric that gets woventhere.
(02:22):
I do have two interestingcharacters of that, that I'll
mention, you know, for theaudience'cause they're gonna
know'em.
the, my first startup, was.
A guy that, we all, you know,kind of interact with, at least
his product in the day was, ReedHastings, who ran Netflix, for
so many years, and Reed had acompany before Netflix, that was
(02:43):
very technical.
It was in the, software qualityspace.
and it related, it was memory,error, debugging.
If you could think of a,
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (02:53):
So it's exciting.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-20 (02:54):
Yeah.
It's kind of the, casual, partyconversation, revolves
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (02:58):
Yeah.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025_ (02:58):
so that was one.
And then the other one was, oneof our advisors of the company
that, in my first CEO gig was,Elon Musk of all
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (03:05):
Oh wow.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025 (03:07):
and this was early Elon.
This was post PayPal.
but, early Elon and, you know,he, it was interesting, from
that standpoint, he didn't havea lot of interaction with us, to
tell you the truth.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (03:18):
Yeah.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025_ (03:18):
he was there as part of the
advisors for the company.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (03:21):
Wow.
What a fascinating guy.
Whether you agree with hisbeliefs or not?
I mean, the dude's had someimpact on society, right?
I mean, he's an icon.
he's left his mark, let's say.
I mean, the whole world knows.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025_0 (03:32):
I would say the same about Reid,
you know, he is,
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (03:34):
Yeah, that's true.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025_ (03:35):
he is, very thoughtful, great
person, great manager, and just,has done a lot of really good
things.
he now owns a ski area.
Mountain in Utah.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (03:46):
Did not know that.
Yeah, did not know that.
wow.
So, you know, in our pre-showand in your bio we're talking,
you know, about your career.
A lot of success, a lot ofstartups.
I mean, you live to tell aboutit, but surely I know along the
way things went wrong and, and Ithink a lot of business leaders
and people maybe start their owncompanies, that's what they're
(04:07):
most concerned.
Everybody wants success, but wedon't often think about, the
lessons learned.
What kinda nuggets can you sharewith us that you took from those
experiences?
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025 (04:17):
You know, I often relate this to, an
analogy here.
It's like starting new companiesis, you know, I'm in California,
so I was like surfing.
And, you know, surfing soundspretty basic, right?
you grab a board, paddle out,turn around and raise, and
that's all there is.
you know, but surfing, when youstart thinking about it,
(04:39):
especially with related to astartup.
the size of the wave makes ahuge difference.
the wind that's blowing acrossthat wave makes a huge
difference.
Do waves break differently?
according to the differentserfs, you gotta think about
being able to stand up or notstand up.
You know, there's very manythings that I think of startups
that way, to tell you the truth.
(05:00):
it's, it's, they're all a, theyall have.
similarities in what you have todo to get'em successful, but
there's so many different littlethings that, either go right or
wrong, within that, and you, youknow, there's either different
obstacles that you are, facedwith that you need to overcome.
(05:21):
but I do say that the wholething, I mean, I wouldn't do
this repeatedly if it wasn'tfun.
and so there is, there's thatelement too.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (05:30):
Is it, had there been moments where
you're like, what am I doing?
Why am I trying this, this iscrazy.
I would imagine being anentrepreneur, you push through
those moments clearly, but doesit ever happen?
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025_ (05:39):
Oh yeah.
I mean, my co-founders and I,especially in this one, we talk
about the.
It can happen weekly sometimeswhere it does good news, bad
news, and, the beauty of thestartup is, the consequences are
so strong and you're always.
Wondering about that, and itfeels like survival, there's
been plenty, we did responsesoftware during COVID we were
(06:04):
doing what a small startup doeswhere we had our little office,
in Mountain View, California,and, there's a lot of benefit to
that as a startup because youneed a lot of interaction with
that.
Suddenly we couldn't interact.
daily, and how did we keep thatgoing?
And that was a big challenge,you know, through that.
other kinds of, challenges.
(06:25):
like who wear was the heady daysof Web 1.0.
it took a lot of, there was alot of unknowns and there was a
lot of effort, especially, know,people were just saying the
world was gonna change.
I don't know if we've heard thatyet with ai.
it happens at a different pacethan you ever expect, I guess is
the way I'd put it.
I'm, expecting AI to follow alot of that web 1.0 thing where.
(06:51):
life's gonna change.
think it's gonna change in thenext year or two.
It's probably gonna take a longtime for it to change, embed
itself in, you know, and, andfully weave itself into the
fabric of our everyday life.
but it's there and it willchange things.
And what's interesting is thosewinners.
In 1.0 days were not the winnersthat eventually, came out of it,
(07:16):
five, 10 years later.
And that was interesting too.
I think that was a good lessonto learn, along the way.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (07:23):
Yeah.
adapt and overcome, you know,or, or you will, you won't make
it.
I mean, You have to, you have toadapt at the times.
I remember hearing a story froma colleague years ago, that
worked, for Blackberry, If youknow those, the time you got a
Blackberry on your hip.
You were the, you were the one.
you were the big boy, big, bigguy on campus.
So anyway, they were in thismeeting and someone raises their
(07:44):
hand.
It's a q and a session.
They asked the CEO, Hey.
So, you know, iPhone justlaunched the app store.
What's our response to that?
And he said, it's just a fad.
No, no one needs apps.
People just use these devicesfor email and texting and phone
calls.
That's all at it.
And you said you could hear acollective sigh across the
audience.
Everyone knew.
(08:04):
Oh man, this is the beginning ofthe end.
you know, Hey, did we go Netflixand Blockbuster?
Right?
Great, great story of how, youknow, if you didn't, evolve with
the times.
Yeah, it does, it, it doeschange.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025_ (08:15):
I, think there's, there's lessons,
you know, there's lessons in theweb 1.0 bubble popping and I
think, people are relating a lotof that to AI right now.
but I think one of the thingsthat gets missed is, certainly
there was a lot of wealthcreated before that bubble
popped.
the ripple effect, once it did,really shut down, venture
(08:39):
capital at the time shut down alot of funding.
You know, it was the same duringthe financial crisis sometimes
those ripples get into placesthat you never thought they'd
reach because you, you thought,I, I remember you, you just had
mentioned this, Chris, and, andbrought back a memory of I had
just taken that first CEO job.
in late 2000 and was told by myinvestors, oh yeah, this is just
(09:02):
a head cold.
it's nothing.
We're gonna get through this.
unfortunately, three monthslater, I'm having to lay off, a
quarter of the company becausewe wouldn't make it, we didn't
have the finances to do it
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (09:14):
Gosh.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025 (09:14):
It, you know, and then we got a
double whammy on that onebecause the nine 11 hit and we
had a lot debt outstanding.
talk about learning throughfailure.
I learned about what debt cando, especially when you have
these unexpected turns of, thatthose creditors came and asked
for all their money.
(09:35):
you know what?
You owe it to them.
I mean, they lent it to you, andso.
we couldn't raise any extramoney because the extra money
was gonna go to them because wehad to pay off the things that
we didn't have enough money leftto pay off.
it really taught me in a startupworld, the dangers of having
debt.
and that's why venture capitalis popular Now it has its own,
(09:56):
cut because you can't forgetthat venture capitalists are
there to make money for theirlimited partners.
they will help you.
but you just gotta keep that inmind.
and so, they sometimes get a badrep for taking the side of their
investors, like cutting losses,not funding things, but, if you
keep that in mind and know howto work with them.
(10:17):
They're a tremendous resourceand they, give you the fuel that
you need to get off thelaunchpad.
And that's what happens instartups.
You have to, you have to get offthat launchpad or else you're
just gonna be a, know, either ifyou have enough money for a
while, you'll just be a zombie,or, you won't, and you'll be one
of the nine outta 10 that don'tmake it.
(10:37):
and I think that ecosystem andthat challenge even now in my
sixth one, scares me at times.
but it also, provides a lot ofclarity on what you have to do
and you're there to give value.
Your product needs to give valueto your customer, like no other.
it's gotta replace things in anew way.
(10:58):
You talked about shifts intechnology and new ways of doing
things.
Absolutely.
It's gotta provide that andprovide a value in that and do
it in a way that's better thanit was before.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (12:45):
Yes.
you're spot on there.
my day job, we talk, a lot aboutall various types of the tech
stack, and oftentimes I may havea dozen suppliers that can do
the same thing to solve for X.
and of course, these dozensuppliers like, Hey, why are we
getting the deal?
why is it not coming our way?
I'm like, well, there's nodifferentiators.
You look just like everybodyelse, and it now is up to
(13:06):
salesmanship and who's mostresponsive and who can be most
aggressive at pricing but if youhave a differentiator.
Now, that's why they're makingthe buying decision and I'm
doing price like, hey, this issolving a better problem.
Faster, quicker, easier,whatever.
And, this is kind of, you know,pivoting to the, one of the main
things I really wanted to talkto you about was, you know,
cybersecurity and ai.
(13:27):
How is AI changing thatcybersecurity conversation for
CISOs and bigger companies?
mike-armistead_1_11-25-20 (13:33):
Yeah, two main ways.
I, I put it in two big buckets.
One is we can't forget,cybersecurity is about the
adversary partly of course aboutthe defender.
I mean, those are the two sidesto it.
And AI is changing both worlds.
the world of the adversary.
is changing, uh, and I can relaythe story again.
(13:55):
Back, back to founding a, acompany in 2003, we actually
talked to our investors and saidthe words, no way would another
country attack a differentcountry because it cause a war.
was kind, that was reality in2003.
today, a Chinese group, or aRussian group or something like
(14:17):
that, attacking something else,happens all the time and we
don't even bat an eye it.
So there's change that happensthere now with ai almost, you
know, just like AI can helpnon-programmers, programmers
write a program, it can help,attackers, that aren't
technical.
(14:38):
Actually have the tooling thatthey need to actually, execute
an attack, and an attack thatworks at a scale and a speed
that our infrastructures aren'tused to.
So that's kind of the bummerside of, how AI is affecting,
the world.
The upside is it also gives thedefenders, new tools and
(14:58):
different ways of using it.
if you're a cybersecurity vendorand you don't talk about AI
right now, maybe something'swrong with your marketing
department or something, but ithas real advantages now in the
history of cybersecurity.
It has grown from practitionerlevel, technical level up,
that's just been, its history.
(15:19):
When we have had malware.
look for malware detectors.
When we, give access to people,we now have to control that
access because, a lot of thereal important parts of
companies, are now in the cloudSo, those are all really keys.
But I also think AI gives theadvantage to the leadership
(15:39):
teams too.
and that's a real, unmined, areathat I think can shift, you
know, the focus to beingdetection only, or, you know,
there's really, the trend I'dsay in cybersecurity is all
about how fast you can detectsomething.
And we should be also thinkingabout how to build the
prevention side up.
(16:00):
You know, how do we actuallydeter the attack happening in
the first place because ourdefenses are so strong.
AI is definitely having that bigimpact.
And, what I'm doing now and whatpulled me outta retirement was
the fact that I think I can makea difference and our company can
make a difference in, havingsome more proactiveness to this
(16:22):
through the use of this newtechnology, ai.
chris_1_11-25-2025_12302 (16:25):
That's fantastic.
I mean, yeah, there'stremendous, investments being
made by companies.
You know, there's cyberinsurance, cybersecurity
insurance, you know, you gotCISOs, you got all these layers
of, developers and coders.
in fact, someone was telling methere's like, hundreds of
thousands of open job recs forcybersecurity professionals.
so there's a lot of investmentgoing on, a lot of activity,
(16:46):
but.
Is there trouble in Paradise?
I mean, is all this investment,it fell to deliver what people
need to protect their companiesand their data?
What are your thoughts on that?
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025 (16:58):
I'd say, you know, there's always
been This arms race that happensin cybersecurity.
And we're actually at a timeright now where the attackers
have a bit of the advantage.
I would give them that.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (17:11):
It's scary.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-202 (17:13):
and, and it is scary, uh, within
that.
and you have certain things thatare novel today.
you have called a, you know, aprompt injection, which is
basically.
Having the attackers, send aprompt to a perfectly
well-meaning LLM and having itdo what it's not meant to do.
(17:35):
And, you know, either you, youmake use of the infrastructure
there or the answers, thingslike that.
you know, I think where AI hasthe, the consumer or public.
Caught their imagination is inthe, the deep fakes that can
happen now.
and just how good the imagery isand the fact that you can stick
people in what looks like.
(17:57):
You know, certain circumstancesthat they'd never be in.
And you can kinda make thatimage look really real.
I mean, those are pretty novel,now.
but at the same time, and therehas been a lot of spend, to,
like you were mentioning to, togo after it.
I do think.
Cybersecurity at times plays awhack-a-mole game, which is, you
(18:20):
know, something comes up, they,they, they try to detect it and
solve it and you know, theadversaries innovate as well.
And so there's this propensityto, just go stop that.
Oh, I have to go stop this.
Oh, this third one I have to gostop.
that's somewhat what I meant bydetection versus prevention we
need to start thinking about howcan we change the game on the
(18:42):
adversaries and get ahead ofthis so that it isn't so much
about the technique they'reusing.
it gets more about, oh, I'vebuilt enough defense that they
aren't even gonna try, you canuse analogies that everybody is
familiar with as just like, youknow, your security of your home
and how many doors and windowsyou leave open.
(19:03):
So that makes it easy for them,And then you go on your vacation
for a week and, see whathappens.
and it is, it's true even in thecyber sense, like how easy is it
to break in, how easy is to getto what we'd call the crown
jewels of an organization, youknow?
and that might be.
Information about theircustomers.
(19:23):
It might be the credit cardsthat they store on a retail
site.
It might be health records.
You know, it might be differentthings like that.
but you need to build thedefenses that do that, and you
need to think proactively of howdo I thwart.
those innovations that theadversaries are using.
I do think we're in a periodwhere it does feel like the
adversaries have a bit of theadvantage, but I have faith
(19:44):
that, there's innovationhappening on the defender side
too.
mostly companies are trying todo good and, you know, I think
society mostly is good.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (19:55):
Yeah.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-202 (19:55):
Kind of, thwarting these things that
are bad.
And, we'll get there.
And I think, we're gonna have tocontinue to spend unfortunately
for that.
But, part of that spend, we haveto remember is, the businesses
are using these technologies.
I keep saying new with ai, as weboth know, it's not really a new
(20:16):
technology, but I think thecurrent models, the LLMs and
things like that are kind of newto the landscape, but they're
using these things for reallygood business.
it's advancing the ball.
it's helping make interactionswith their customers better.
It's, being able to describethings better for people.
it's increasing the speed ofthat it's cybersecurity's job.
(20:38):
To mitigate the risk that comeswith that.
And you had mentioned too,Chris, the attack surface has
expanded now.
Yep.
And so it's the job ofcybersecurity to help protect
that expanded, network.
But I think that's whereinnovations are happening.
and I do think that to enablethe business, we need to do the
(20:58):
spend that mitigates that risk.
Because if you don't.
Consumers and other people,whoever your customers are, lose
trust in your systems and thatis gonna be bad for business.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (21:10):
Yeah.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025_ (21:10):
so you know, that spend has to be
there.
It doesn't have to be extreme,it needs to do its job.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (21:16):
Yeah.
What's the saying?
you think it's expensive todeploy this to see how expensive
it is to not deploy?
Because Yeah, if you, you know,once you get bit by it.
Do you have any insight on like,what is the size of a, of a
company to be a good target fora cyber security bad actor?
I mean, if someone was goingafter a company, do mama and
pops have to worry or is it justFortune five hundreds?
mike-armistead_1_11-25-20 (21:38):
Yeah.
Here's where something we justdiscussed earlier, comes into
play.
I think, the technology rightnow can cast a very wide net.
And so, normally it wasn't thatthey would go after the mom and
pops.
Depends on the actor, the threatactors.
if they're, a well organizedcriminal organization, gonna do
the Willie Sutton thing.
(21:59):
And, you know, why do you robbanks?
Well, it's because that's wherethe money is.
the adversaries will go afterwhere the money is, whatever
that means to them.
there's other targets, you know,there certainly can be targets
for.
Just causing disruption, to theorganization just for the heck
of it.
we're starting to see a bit of arise of that.
if you think of, like a year anda half ago, the casinos were hit
(22:22):
with a ransomware thing.
But it was primarily just todisrupt In the end it was a very
expensive disruption, but it wasto do that.
And I think they traced downeven the Jaguar Land Rover,
incident that shut downmanufacturing of those cars, to
a actor group that.
More or less kind of protestingkind of stuff.
(22:43):
it could happen to mom and pops,especially if there's easy
Pickens to take.
So, you know, I often am talkingto people about just.
Good security hygiene.
You know, you still need to havepasswords under control.
and by that I mean, these, itused to be, you know, they'd say
(23:05):
change of every two weeks.
Well, people then forget theirpasswords and revert back to
something super easy to rememberand or, or apply to all their
things.
And it's much better to have avery lengthy password, but maybe
use a password manager now.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (23:20):
You.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025 (23:21):
you do have to worry about someone
getting into that passwordmanager, but that's a lot harder
for the hackers to do than, themremembering, security 1, 2, 3 as
your password.
So, for organizations that getsinto, things that are, their it.
Infrastructure has to withstandreal basic stuff.
these days a lot of it's in thecloud.
(23:41):
So you gotta watch your access,pay attention to that.
if people are no longer withyour organization, you gotta
remember to cut off theiraccess.
And it's not that they're gonnanecessarily, cause a problem.
that's something out there thatmaybe a bad guy could use, we
talk a lot about, I am longtimeapplication security, person by
(24:02):
training.
software runs a lot of ourbusinesses and we've gotta make
sure that it doesn't have holesin it.
chris_1_11-25-2025_ (24:08):
absolutely.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-20 (24:09):
yeah, so
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (24:11):
Yeah, I mean, I talk to a lot of
companies every day and some ofthem may have, thousands of cell
phones and tablets.
Back to your point, we do thisanalysis on their expenses
actually, and we find out that10% of their thousand phones,
Are still active and there's noemployee there to use them.
they just never turned it off.
And it still has OneDrive on it,and maybe it has the share
(24:32):
folders on it and, shareddrives, whatnot.
And all the corporate data's onthere.
It's like, do you even knowwhere this phone is?
and they don't.
it's probably some drawersomewhere or an employee just
shoved it in a box when theyleft.
and along that lines, again,being the IOT guy that I am.
What are your thoughts on, howmany iot sensors are deployed
and businesses and even at home?
(24:53):
I think about my Nestthermostat, my ring cameras,
smart tv, smart refrigerator,everything.
Smart this, smart that, italmost surprises me how lack of
cybersecurity conversations arebeing had for those kind of
deployments.
I mean, have you ever beeninvolved in any of those kind of
conversations with iot?
mike-armistead_1_11-25-202 (25:11):
some of the people that we've,
serviced and had as customers,have a lot of iot, portions to
it.
and some of it had, strongramifications like being a power
company or a gas line, and theycertainly do think very
seriously about that.
but it's not as much in theconsumer end of things.
I wish it was to tell you thetruth.
(25:32):
Like you said, you're surprisedby it.
So am I.
there's a whole generation, andI know because I have, four kids
that, don't think about it.
I think enough to say, do Ireally wanna have an opening
here?
that could be.
Could be taken it.
Now, I, I do drive a Tesla andI'm, I know it's recording
wherever I'm driving and thingslike that.
(25:53):
But you know, there's some ofthat, that, you know, there's a
balance, I guess I'd say.
What are you willing to acceptto give out to have a better
experience?
what do you not want to have,out there as an experience?
And so, because these things aregonna be used in one way or
another, and, you know, we haveto, we have to be, thinking
(26:13):
about that and the IOT side, Ido think there's, there was such
an expansion of making theproduct better, by giving it a
way talk to out, external toitself.
But that opened up that attacksurface and that attack surface
can be used.
And you know, there's plenty ofhacks that started from the HVAC
(26:37):
system because that's howsomebody gained access to the
network.
And then as adversaries can bevery patiently moved around the
network without triggering, youknow, a bunch of trip liars.
Until they found out where,what, you know, there was
something worthwhile to extractand then they extracted it and,
(27:00):
and that, that's what we have toworry about.
I think too, it's, it's notnecessarily that you're worried
about your refrigerator givingup, you know, your social
security number, but if therefrigerator is in your home
network and your home networkhas, your financial, has maybe
passwords lying around in some.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (27:19):
Yeah.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025_ (27:20):
to start worrying about it.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (27:21):
Yeah, that's true.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025_ (27:23):
of life.
chris_1_11-25-2025_12302 (27:23):
That's right.
And, if there's a refrigeratorthat stores your credit card
information and it can, do anonline order for Amazon
groceries or DoorDash'causeyou're low on milk.
That information's there andsomething you say kind of
triggered another cliche, youknow, for everything you gain in
life, you give up something.
I mean, it's almost next toimpossible to gain something
(27:44):
and, not have a cost.
Our sacrifice, our downside.
I mean, even, being successful,it may be your time, maybe
you're giving up your time.
I mean, but, uh, but that's spoton You had so many of these apps
now, you get it for free, butyou gotta give us all this
information.
Let's track you everywhere.
Or you could pay us$10 a monthand, we won't track you.
very interesting.
Well, I know we just kind ofscratched the surface of this
(28:07):
such a big topic.
Any advice for business leadersout there that are concerned
about cybersecurity?
what would your advice be tosomeone that owns a medium sized
business and they're growing andthey have a lot of, sensitive
corporate data.
What's your advice to'em?
mike-armistead_1_11-25-20 (28:21):
Don't bury your head in the sand.
if you're small and you don'thave the expertise.
think about getting anassessment, around cybersecurity
from somebody.
there's plenty of very reputablepeople that can do that.
the large organizations, youknow, they all know this and
they all do allocate budget forit.
and they do that, but even theyhave to think about, the
(28:45):
different kind of securitybasics.
I talked earlier about, theseadvanced, hacking techniques and
these innovations, and even whatAI brings to that.
You know what, in the end, theyusually almost always exploit
something that is, I'd call oldschool, like an old school
vulnerability or something likethat.
(29:05):
So it kind of gets down to doyour proper security, what I'd
call hygiene.
It's like, brushing your teethand things like if you don't
want a cavity.
do those things, and do properhygiene floss.
chris_1_11-25-2025_12302 (29:19):
right.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025 (29:20):
and then it's the same with
security.
if you really don't know, don'tbe in the dark because that's,
that's when it gets, that's whenyou know it's, it gets bad.
and if you're a consumer, youknow, just be aware.
You know, it's
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (29:33):
Yeah.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025_ (29:33):
be critical of kind of message you
see.
the phishing.
Attacks are gonna get super goodbecause they're gonna know, it's
gonna feel like it comes fromyour best friend.
chris_1_11-25-2025_1230 (29:45):
Mm-hmm.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-202 (29:46):
your best friend, but verify that,
you
chris_1_11-25-2025_12302 (29:48):
That's right.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025_0 (29:49):
I mean, verify
chris_1_11-25-2025_12302 (29:50):
Right.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-202 (29:50):
take the proper steps.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (29:52):
Yeah.
Another cliche comes to mind.
You can tell I love cliches paynow or pay layer, but you're
going to pay.
I mean that.
And that is so true with so manyof these business technology
conversations.
Everybody's trying to cutcorners and save money and
almost always ends up costingthem more.
Almost always.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-202 (30:09):
and,
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (30:09):
gosh.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025_ (30:10):
as you do your security
assessments, it might actuallyeven generate business idea or a
positioning that you're moretrusted for your customers.
You know, there's lots of waysto do that, and I'm a firm
believer being in cybersecurityfor a long time.
it needs to help obtain thebusiness goal, not just be
cybersecurity unto itself.
And so, yeah, I'll be thinkingabout that, but I do think it's
(30:32):
an important
chris_1_11-25-2025_12302 (30:32):
That's a good point.
Make it a part of the businessplan.
well, Mike, it's been a greatconversation.
is there any last words,anything we missed?
Anything you wanna leave uswith?
a favorite book quote oranything else?
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025_ (30:45):
it is such a broad topic and,
there's so much going on, withit.
I think we kind of, skim thesurface in a really good way.
So I'm pretty happy with that.
you say book, I go between mytrashy books tend to be like
sci-fi or, things.
I know it was made a series, itwas actually an Apple series.
I should.
(31:05):
Yeah, I would say it's that.
But the
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (31:07):
Yeah,
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025_ (31:08):
if you've never read the Murder
bot, series, they're extremely,they have a good sense of humor
in'em.
but, some really good, youshould pick,
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (31:17):
I'll have to, I will look it up.
No, I like sci-fi.
I like anything with technologythat,
mike-armistead_1_11-25-20 (31:21):
Yeah.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (31:22):
that it sounds scary already, you
know.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-202 (31:24):
It's actually funnier than scary.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (31:26):
oh, good.
Oh, I'm in, I'm in.
Well, Mike, again, thanks somuch for your time.
check the show notes, folks.
I'll have some links to learnmore about Mike and his
organization.
and yeah, on your website, I'venoticed you got some great
articles.
Actually, I already reposted oneon LinkedIn, Good thought
leadership.
And back to your point, it'slike, you don't know, find
someone that does, or, call Mikeand his team.
(31:48):
I mean, there's folks out therethat can help you.
but this is a topic ofcybersecurity.
You wanna, you wanna do your duediligence, so thanks so much,
Mike.
I appreciate it.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-202 (31:57):
Hey, glad to be here.
chris_1_11-25-2025_1 (31:58):
Fantastic.
And there you go folks.
Another episode of The WirelessWay.
And as always, if a customer ora colleague or a teammate came
to mind, please share thisepisode with'em.
I really appreciate us how welove spread the good news of
technology, how it's solvingproblems and increasing revenue
for businesses.
rising tide rises all boats.
And you can always check out,the wireless way.net.
(32:20):
And there's a contact us buttonif you have any feedback,
comments or suggestions.
Love to hear from you and, we'llsee you next time on the
Wireless way.
Welcome to another episode of The
Wireless Way.
I'm your host, Chris Whitaker,and as always, I'm so grateful
you're here today.
I know there's a lot going onyou probably could be doing,
and, this is a good topic.
I mean, you know, it's thewireless way and we talk a lot
about a lot of things and,probably, I don't think I get
this topic enough attention,cybersecurity.
So, I have a special guesttoday.
(00:24):
We're gonna unpack that, Whatdoes it take to build and sell
multiple companies in one of thetoughest industries?
Cybersecurity and I, I've had afront row seat to that.
Mike Armistead has done it againand again, leading startups to
nine figure acquisitions and nowguiding pulse security ai.
with more than 30 years ofexperience across major
(00:46):
technology shifts from the earlyinternet, to today's rise of
artificial intelligence, youalmost can't read a news report
without AI being in theresomewhere.
Mike brings practical lessonsfrom both success and failure,
easier to share our persistence,timing, and thoughtful
leadership.
can help organizations thrive atfast changing times.
(01:07):
he spent nearly 40 yearsbuilding companies, leading
teams, driving growth across awide range of industries.
he's co-founded our help buildseveral successful startups like
response software, fortifysoftware who, where, and of
course, pure software.
The guy knows what he is talkingabout, so I'm so grateful we
have him on the show today.
in fact, he's still driven bybuilding great teams and
(01:28):
tracking big, meaningfulchallenges.
Mike, welcome to the show.
I'm so glad we're able to getthis set up today.
How you doing?
mike-armistead_1_11-25-20 (01:35):
Chris doing great.
I really appreciate you havingme on.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (01:39):
I'm glad to have, like I said, iron
sharpens iron.
You know, this is a importantconversation that is really
impacting business.
It's impacting revenues forcompanies, reputations,
operational outputs andoutcomes.
I mean, it touches all parts oftechnology and business.
So, I'm really glad we're havingthis conversation.
as always, my first question,you know, like, what's not the
(01:59):
bio man?
How did you get here?
mike-armistead_1_11-25-20 (02:01):
Yeah.
You know, one thing I always, amsurprised by on the bios that
when I start thinking about'emis that it leaves out all the
people that you've come acrossin those years.
You know, I'm 40 years into thisprofessional life and just
thinking about, just all thepeople that have helped been
part of.
Just the fabric that gets woventhere.
(02:22):
I do have two interestingcharacters of that, that I'll
mention, you know, for theaudience'cause they're gonna
know'em.
the, my first startup, was.
A guy that, we all, you know,kind of interact with, at least
his product in the day was, ReedHastings, who ran Netflix, for
so many years, and Reed had acompany before Netflix, that was
(02:43):
very technical.
It was in the, software qualityspace.
and it related, it was memory,error, debugging.
If you could think of a,
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (02:53):
So it's exciting.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-20 (02:54):
Yeah.
It's kind of the, casual, partyconversation, revolves
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (02:58):
Yeah.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025_ (02:58):
so that was one.
And then the other one was, oneof our advisors of the company
that, in my first CEO gig was,Elon Musk of all
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (03:05):
Oh wow.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025 (03:07):
and this was early Elon.
This was post PayPal.
but, early Elon and, you know,he, it was interesting, from
that standpoint, he didn't havea lot of interaction with us, to
tell you the truth.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (03:18):
Yeah.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025_ (03:18):
he was there as part of the
advisors for the company.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (03:21):
Wow.
What a fascinating guy.
Whether you agree with hisbeliefs or not?
I mean, the dude's had someimpact on society, right?
I mean, he's an icon.
he's left his mark, let's say.
I mean, the whole world knows.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025_0 (03:32):
I would say the same about Reid,
you know, he is,
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (03:34):
Yeah, that's true.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025_ (03:35):
he is, very thoughtful, great
person, great manager, and just,has done a lot of really good
things.
he now owns a ski area.
Mountain in Utah.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (03:46):
Did not know that.
Yeah, did not know that.
wow.
So, you know, in our pre-showand in your bio we're talking,
you know, about your career.
A lot of success, a lot ofstartups.
I mean, you live to tell aboutit, but surely I know along the
way things went wrong and, and Ithink a lot of business leaders
and people maybe start their owncompanies, that's what they're
(04:07):
most concerned.
Everybody wants success, but wedon't often think about, the
lessons learned.
What kinda nuggets can you sharewith us that you took from those
experiences?
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025 (04:17):
You know, I often relate this to, an
analogy here.
It's like starting new companiesis, you know, I'm in California,
so I was like surfing.
And, you know, surfing soundspretty basic, right?
you grab a board, paddle out,turn around and raise, and
that's all there is.
you know, but surfing, when youstart thinking about it,
(04:39):
especially with related to astartup.
the size of the wave makes ahuge difference.
the wind that's blowing acrossthat wave makes a huge
difference.
Do waves break differently?
according to the differentserfs, you gotta think about
being able to stand up or notstand up.
You know, there's very manythings that I think of startups
that way, to tell you the truth.
(05:00):
it's, it's, they're all a, theyall have.
similarities in what you have todo to get'em successful, but
there's so many different littlethings that, either go right or
wrong, within that, and you, youknow, there's either different
obstacles that you are, facedwith that you need to overcome.
(05:21):
but I do say that the wholething, I mean, I wouldn't do
this repeatedly if it wasn'tfun.
and so there is, there's thatelement too.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (05:30):
Is it, had there been moments where
you're like, what am I doing?
Why am I trying this, this iscrazy.
I would imagine being anentrepreneur, you push through
those moments clearly, but doesit ever happen?
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025_ (05:39):
Oh yeah.
I mean, my co-founders and I,especially in this one, we talk
about the.
It can happen weekly sometimeswhere it does good news, bad
news, and, the beauty of thestartup is, the consequences are
so strong and you're always.
Wondering about that, and itfeels like survival, there's
been plenty, we did responsesoftware during COVID we were
(06:04):
doing what a small startup doeswhere we had our little office,
in Mountain View, California,and, there's a lot of benefit to
that as a startup because youneed a lot of interaction with
that.
Suddenly we couldn't interact.
daily, and how did we keep thatgoing?
And that was a big challenge,you know, through that.
other kinds of, challenges.
(06:25):
like who wear was the heady daysof Web 1.0.
it took a lot of, there was alot of unknowns and there was a
lot of effort, especially, know,people were just saying the
world was gonna change.
I don't know if we've heard thatyet with ai.
it happens at a different pacethan you ever expect, I guess is
the way I'd put it.
I'm, expecting AI to follow alot of that web 1.0 thing where.
(06:51):
life's gonna change.
think it's gonna change in thenext year or two.
It's probably gonna take a longtime for it to change, embed
itself in, you know, and, andfully weave itself into the
fabric of our everyday life.
but it's there and it willchange things.
And what's interesting is thosewinners.
In 1.0 days were not the winnersthat eventually, came out of it,
(07:16):
five, 10 years later.
And that was interesting too.
I think that was a good lessonto learn, along the way.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (07:23):
Yeah.
adapt and overcome, you know,or, or you will, you won't make
it.
I mean, You have to, you have toadapt at the times.
I remember hearing a story froma colleague years ago, that
worked, for Blackberry, If youknow those, the time you got a
Blackberry on your hip.
You were the, you were the one.
you were the big boy, big, bigguy on campus.
So anyway, they were in thismeeting and someone raises their
(07:44):
hand.
It's a q and a session.
They asked the CEO, Hey.
So, you know, iPhone justlaunched the app store.
What's our response to that?
And he said, it's just a fad.
No, no one needs apps.
People just use these devicesfor email and texting and phone
calls.
That's all at it.
And you said you could hear acollective sigh across the
audience.
Everyone knew.
(08:04):
Oh man, this is the beginning ofthe end.
you know, Hey, did we go Netflixand Blockbuster?
Right?
Great, great story of how, youknow, if you didn't, evolve with
the times.
Yeah, it does, it, it doeschange.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025_ (08:15):
I, think there's, there's lessons,
you know, there's lessons in theweb 1.0 bubble popping and I
think, people are relating a lotof that to AI right now.
but I think one of the thingsthat gets missed is, certainly
there was a lot of wealthcreated before that bubble
popped.
the ripple effect, once it did,really shut down, venture
(08:39):
capital at the time shut down alot of funding.
You know, it was the same duringthe financial crisis sometimes
those ripples get into placesthat you never thought they'd
reach because you, you thought,I, I remember you, you just had
mentioned this, Chris, and, andbrought back a memory of I had
just taken that first CEO job.
in late 2000 and was told by myinvestors, oh yeah, this is just
(09:02):
a head cold.
it's nothing.
We're gonna get through this.
unfortunately, three monthslater, I'm having to lay off, a
quarter of the company becausewe wouldn't make it, we didn't
have the finances to do it
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (09:14):
Gosh.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025 (09:14):
It, you know, and then we got a
double whammy on that onebecause the nine 11 hit and we
had a lot debt outstanding.
talk about learning throughfailure.
I learned about what debt cando, especially when you have
these unexpected turns of, thatthose creditors came and asked
for all their money.
(09:35):
you know what?
You owe it to them.
I mean, they lent it to you, andso.
we couldn't raise any extramoney because the extra money
was gonna go to them because wehad to pay off the things that
we didn't have enough money leftto pay off.
it really taught me in a startupworld, the dangers of having
debt.
and that's why venture capitalis popular Now it has its own,
(09:56):
cut because you can't forgetthat venture capitalists are
there to make money for theirlimited partners.
they will help you.
but you just gotta keep that inmind.
and so, they sometimes get a badrep for taking the side of their
investors, like cutting losses,not funding things, but, if you
keep that in mind and know howto work with them.
(10:17):
They're a tremendous resourceand they, give you the fuel that
you need to get off thelaunchpad.
And that's what happens instartups.
You have to, you have to get offthat launchpad or else you're
just gonna be a, know, either ifyou have enough money for a
while, you'll just be a zombie,or, you won't, and you'll be one
of the nine outta 10 that don'tmake it.
(10:37):
and I think that ecosystem andthat challenge even now in my
sixth one, scares me at times.
but it also, provides a lot ofclarity on what you have to do
and you're there to give value.
Your product needs to give valueto your customer, like no other.
it's gotta replace things in anew way.
(10:58):
You talked about shifts intechnology and new ways of doing
things.
Absolutely.
It's gotta provide that andprovide a value in that and do
it in a way that's better thanit was before.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (12:45):
Yes.
you're spot on there.
my day job, we talk, a lot aboutall various types of the tech
stack, and oftentimes I may havea dozen suppliers that can do
the same thing to solve for X.
and of course, these dozensuppliers like, Hey, why are we
getting the deal?
why is it not coming our way?
I'm like, well, there's nodifferentiators.
You look just like everybodyelse, and it now is up to
(13:06):
salesmanship and who's mostresponsive and who can be most
aggressive at pricing but if youhave a differentiator.
Now, that's why they're makingthe buying decision and I'm
doing price like, hey, this issolving a better problem.
Faster, quicker, easier,whatever.
And, this is kind of, you know,pivoting to the, one of the main
things I really wanted to talkto you about was, you know,
cybersecurity and ai.
(13:27):
How is AI changing thatcybersecurity conversation for
CISOs and bigger companies?
mike-armistead_1_11-25-20 (13:33):
Yeah, two main ways.
I, I put it in two big buckets.
One is we can't forget,cybersecurity is about the
adversary partly of course aboutthe defender.
I mean, those are the two sidesto it.
And AI is changing both worlds.
the world of the adversary.
is changing, uh, and I can relaythe story again.
(13:55):
Back, back to founding a, acompany in 2003, we actually
talked to our investors and saidthe words, no way would another
country attack a differentcountry because it cause a war.
was kind, that was reality in2003.
today, a Chinese group, or aRussian group or something like
(14:17):
that, attacking something else,happens all the time and we
don't even bat an eye it.
So there's change that happensthere now with ai almost, you
know, just like AI can helpnon-programmers, programmers
write a program, it can help,attackers, that aren't
technical.
(14:38):
Actually have the tooling thatthey need to actually, execute
an attack, and an attack thatworks at a scale and a speed
that our infrastructures aren'tused to.
So that's kind of the bummerside of, how AI is affecting,
the world.
The upside is it also gives thedefenders, new tools and
(14:58):
different ways of using it.
if you're a cybersecurity vendorand you don't talk about AI
right now, maybe something'swrong with your marketing
department or something, but ithas real advantages now in the
history of cybersecurity.
It has grown from practitionerlevel, technical level up,
that's just been, its history.
(15:19):
When we have had malware.
look for malware detectors.
When we, give access to people,we now have to control that
access because, a lot of thereal important parts of
companies, are now in the cloudSo, those are all really keys.
But I also think AI gives theadvantage to the leadership
(15:39):
teams too.
and that's a real, unmined, areathat I think can shift, you
know, the focus to beingdetection only, or, you know,
there's really, the trend I'dsay in cybersecurity is all
about how fast you can detectsomething.
And we should be also thinkingabout how to build the
prevention side up.
(16:00):
You know, how do we actuallydeter the attack happening in
the first place because ourdefenses are so strong.
AI is definitely having that bigimpact.
And, what I'm doing now and whatpulled me outta retirement was
the fact that I think I can makea difference and our company can
make a difference in, havingsome more proactiveness to this
(16:22):
through the use of this newtechnology, ai.
chris_1_11-25-2025_12302 (16:25):
That's fantastic.
I mean, yeah, there'stremendous, investments being
made by companies.
You know, there's cyberinsurance, cybersecurity
insurance, you know, you gotCISOs, you got all these layers
of, developers and coders.
in fact, someone was telling methere's like, hundreds of
thousands of open job recs forcybersecurity professionals.
so there's a lot of investmentgoing on, a lot of activity,
(16:46):
but.
Is there trouble in Paradise?
I mean, is all this investment,it fell to deliver what people
need to protect their companiesand their data?
What are your thoughts on that?
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025 (16:58):
I'd say, you know, there's always
been This arms race that happensin cybersecurity.
And we're actually at a timeright now where the attackers
have a bit of the advantage.
I would give them that.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (17:11):
It's scary.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-202 (17:13):
and, and it is scary, uh, within
that.
and you have certain things thatare novel today.
you have called a, you know, aprompt injection, which is
basically.
Having the attackers, send aprompt to a perfectly
well-meaning LLM and having itdo what it's not meant to do.
(17:35):
And, you know, either you, youmake use of the infrastructure
there or the answers, thingslike that.
you know, I think where AI hasthe, the consumer or public.
Caught their imagination is inthe, the deep fakes that can
happen now.
and just how good the imagery isand the fact that you can stick
people in what looks like.
(17:57):
You know, certain circumstancesthat they'd never be in.
And you can kinda make thatimage look really real.
I mean, those are pretty novel,now.
but at the same time, and therehas been a lot of spend, to,
like you were mentioning to, togo after it.
I do think.
Cybersecurity at times plays awhack-a-mole game, which is, you
(18:20):
know, something comes up, they,they, they try to detect it and
solve it and you know, theadversaries innovate as well.
And so there's this propensityto, just go stop that.
Oh, I have to go stop this.
Oh, this third one I have to gostop.
that's somewhat what I meant bydetection versus prevention we
need to start thinking about howcan we change the game on the
(18:42):
adversaries and get ahead ofthis so that it isn't so much
about the technique they'reusing.
it gets more about, oh, I'vebuilt enough defense that they
aren't even gonna try, you canuse analogies that everybody is
familiar with as just like, youknow, your security of your home
and how many doors and windowsyou leave open.
(19:03):
So that makes it easy for them,And then you go on your vacation
for a week and, see whathappens.
and it is, it's true even in thecyber sense, like how easy is it
to break in, how easy is to getto what we'd call the crown
jewels of an organization, youknow?
and that might be.
Information about theircustomers.
(19:23):
It might be the credit cardsthat they store on a retail
site.
It might be health records.
You know, it might be differentthings like that.
but you need to build thedefenses that do that, and you
need to think proactively of howdo I thwart.
those innovations that theadversaries are using.
I do think we're in a periodwhere it does feel like the
adversaries have a bit of theadvantage, but I have faith
(19:44):
that, there's innovationhappening on the defender side
too.
mostly companies are trying todo good and, you know, I think
society mostly is good.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (19:55):
Yeah.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-202 (19:55):
Kind of, thwarting these things that
are bad.
And, we'll get there.
And I think, we're gonna have tocontinue to spend unfortunately
for that.
But, part of that spend, we haveto remember is, the businesses
are using these technologies.
I keep saying new with ai, as weboth know, it's not really a new
(20:16):
technology, but I think thecurrent models, the LLMs and
things like that are kind of newto the landscape, but they're
using these things for reallygood business.
it's advancing the ball.
it's helping make interactionswith their customers better.
It's, being able to describethings better for people.
it's increasing the speed ofthat it's cybersecurity's job.
(20:38):
To mitigate the risk that comeswith that.
And you had mentioned too,Chris, the attack surface has
expanded now.
Yep.
And so it's the job ofcybersecurity to help protect
that expanded, network.
But I think that's whereinnovations are happening.
and I do think that to enablethe business, we need to do the
(20:58):
spend that mitigates that risk.
Because if you don't.
Consumers and other people,whoever your customers are, lose
trust in your systems and thatis gonna be bad for business.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (21:10):
Yeah.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025_ (21:10):
so you know, that spend has to be
there.
It doesn't have to be extreme,it needs to do its job.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (21:16):
Yeah.
What's the saying?
you think it's expensive todeploy this to see how expensive
it is to not deploy?
Because Yeah, if you, you know,once you get bit by it.
Do you have any insight on like,what is the size of a, of a
company to be a good target fora cyber security bad actor?
I mean, if someone was goingafter a company, do mama and
pops have to worry or is it justFortune five hundreds?
mike-armistead_1_11-25-20 (21:38):
Yeah.
Here's where something we justdiscussed earlier, comes into
play.
I think, the technology rightnow can cast a very wide net.
And so, normally it wasn't thatthey would go after the mom and
pops.
Depends on the actor, the threatactors.
if they're, a well organizedcriminal organization, gonna do
the Willie Sutton thing.
(21:59):
And, you know, why do you robbanks?
Well, it's because that's wherethe money is.
the adversaries will go afterwhere the money is, whatever
that means to them.
there's other targets, you know,there certainly can be targets
for.
Just causing disruption, to theorganization just for the heck
of it.
we're starting to see a bit of arise of that.
if you think of, like a year anda half ago, the casinos were hit
(22:22):
with a ransomware thing.
But it was primarily just todisrupt In the end it was a very
expensive disruption, but it wasto do that.
And I think they traced downeven the Jaguar Land Rover,
incident that shut downmanufacturing of those cars, to
a actor group that.
More or less kind of protestingkind of stuff.
(22:43):
it could happen to mom and pops,especially if there's easy
Pickens to take.
So, you know, I often am talkingto people about just.
Good security hygiene.
You know, you still need to havepasswords under control.
and by that I mean, these, itused to be, you know, they'd say
(23:05):
change of every two weeks.
Well, people then forget theirpasswords and revert back to
something super easy to rememberand or, or apply to all their
things.
And it's much better to have avery lengthy password, but maybe
use a password manager now.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (23:20):
You.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025 (23:21):
you do have to worry about someone
getting into that passwordmanager, but that's a lot harder
for the hackers to do than, themremembering, security 1, 2, 3 as
your password.
So, for organizations that getsinto, things that are, their it.
Infrastructure has to withstandreal basic stuff.
these days a lot of it's in thecloud.
(23:41):
So you gotta watch your access,pay attention to that.
if people are no longer withyour organization, you gotta
remember to cut off theiraccess.
And it's not that they're gonnanecessarily, cause a problem.
that's something out there thatmaybe a bad guy could use, we
talk a lot about, I am longtimeapplication security, person by
(24:02):
training.
software runs a lot of ourbusinesses and we've gotta make
sure that it doesn't have holesin it.
chris_1_11-25-2025_ (24:08):
absolutely.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-20 (24:09):
yeah, so
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (24:11):
Yeah, I mean, I talk to a lot of
companies every day and some ofthem may have, thousands of cell
phones and tablets.
Back to your point, we do thisanalysis on their expenses
actually, and we find out that10% of their thousand phones,
Are still active and there's noemployee there to use them.
they just never turned it off.
And it still has OneDrive on it,and maybe it has the share
(24:32):
folders on it and, shareddrives, whatnot.
And all the corporate data's onthere.
It's like, do you even knowwhere this phone is?
and they don't.
it's probably some drawersomewhere or an employee just
shoved it in a box when theyleft.
and along that lines, again,being the IOT guy that I am.
What are your thoughts on, howmany iot sensors are deployed
and businesses and even at home?
(24:53):
I think about my Nestthermostat, my ring cameras,
smart tv, smart refrigerator,everything.
Smart this, smart that, italmost surprises me how lack of
cybersecurity conversations arebeing had for those kind of
deployments.
I mean, have you ever beeninvolved in any of those kind of
conversations with iot?
mike-armistead_1_11-25-202 (25:11):
some of the people that we've,
serviced and had as customers,have a lot of iot, portions to
it.
and some of it had, strongramifications like being a power
company or a gas line, and theycertainly do think very
seriously about that.
but it's not as much in theconsumer end of things.
I wish it was to tell you thetruth.
(25:32):
Like you said, you're surprisedby it.
So am I.
there's a whole generation, andI know because I have, four kids
that, don't think about it.
I think enough to say, do Ireally wanna have an opening
here?
that could be.
Could be taken it.
Now, I, I do drive a Tesla andI'm, I know it's recording
wherever I'm driving and thingslike that.
(25:53):
But you know, there's some ofthat, that, you know, there's a
balance, I guess I'd say.
What are you willing to acceptto give out to have a better
experience?
what do you not want to have,out there as an experience?
And so, because these things aregonna be used in one way or
another, and, you know, we haveto, we have to be, thinking
(26:13):
about that and the IOT side, Ido think there's, there was such
an expansion of making theproduct better, by giving it a
way talk to out, external toitself.
But that opened up that attacksurface and that attack surface
can be used.
And you know, there's plenty ofhacks that started from the HVAC
(26:37):
system because that's howsomebody gained access to the
network.
And then as adversaries can bevery patiently moved around the
network without triggering, youknow, a bunch of trip liars.
Until they found out where,what, you know, there was
something worthwhile to extractand then they extracted it and,
(27:00):
and that, that's what we have toworry about.
I think too, it's, it's notnecessarily that you're worried
about your refrigerator givingup, you know, your social
security number, but if therefrigerator is in your home
network and your home networkhas, your financial, has maybe
passwords lying around in some.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (27:19):
Yeah.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025_ (27:20):
to start worrying about it.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (27:21):
Yeah, that's true.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025_ (27:23):
of life.
chris_1_11-25-2025_12302 (27:23):
That's right.
And, if there's a refrigeratorthat stores your credit card
information and it can, do anonline order for Amazon
groceries or DoorDash'causeyou're low on milk.
That information's there andsomething you say kind of
triggered another cliche, youknow, for everything you gain in
life, you give up something.
I mean, it's almost next toimpossible to gain something
(27:44):
and, not have a cost.
Our sacrifice, our downside.
I mean, even, being successful,it may be your time, maybe
you're giving up your time.
I mean, but, uh, but that's spoton You had so many of these apps
now, you get it for free, butyou gotta give us all this
information.
Let's track you everywhere.
Or you could pay us$10 a monthand, we won't track you.
very interesting.
Well, I know we just kind ofscratched the surface of this
(28:07):
such a big topic.
Any advice for business leadersout there that are concerned
about cybersecurity?
what would your advice be tosomeone that owns a medium sized
business and they're growing andthey have a lot of, sensitive
corporate data.
What's your advice to'em?
mike-armistead_1_11-25-20 (28:21):
Don't bury your head in the sand.
if you're small and you don'thave the expertise.
think about getting anassessment, around cybersecurity
from somebody.
there's plenty of very reputablepeople that can do that.
the large organizations, youknow, they all know this and
they all do allocate budget forit.
and they do that, but even theyhave to think about, the
(28:45):
different kind of securitybasics.
I talked earlier about, theseadvanced, hacking techniques and
these innovations, and even whatAI brings to that.
You know what, in the end, theyusually almost always exploit
something that is, I'd call oldschool, like an old school
vulnerability or something likethat.
(29:05):
So it kind of gets down to doyour proper security, what I'd
call hygiene.
It's like, brushing your teethand things like if you don't
want a cavity.
do those things, and do properhygiene floss.
chris_1_11-25-2025_12302 (29:19):
right.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025 (29:20):
and then it's the same with
security.
if you really don't know, don'tbe in the dark because that's,
that's when it gets, that's whenyou know it's, it gets bad.
and if you're a consumer, youknow, just be aware.
You know, it's
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (29:33):
Yeah.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025_ (29:33):
be critical of kind of message you
see.
the phishing.
Attacks are gonna get super goodbecause they're gonna know, it's
gonna feel like it comes fromyour best friend.
chris_1_11-25-2025_1230 (29:45):
Mm-hmm.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-202 (29:46):
your best friend, but verify that,
you
chris_1_11-25-2025_12302 (29:48):
That's right.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025_0 (29:49):
I mean, verify
chris_1_11-25-2025_12302 (29:50):
Right.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-202 (29:50):
take the proper steps.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (29:52):
Yeah.
Another cliche comes to mind.
You can tell I love cliches paynow or pay layer, but you're
going to pay.
I mean that.
And that is so true with so manyof these business technology
conversations.
Everybody's trying to cutcorners and save money and
almost always ends up costingthem more.
Almost always.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-202 (30:09):
and,
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (30:09):
gosh.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025_ (30:10):
as you do your security
assessments, it might actuallyeven generate business idea or a
positioning that you're moretrusted for your customers.
You know, there's lots of waysto do that, and I'm a firm
believer being in cybersecurityfor a long time.
it needs to help obtain thebusiness goal, not just be
cybersecurity unto itself.
And so, yeah, I'll be thinkingabout that, but I do think it's
(30:32):
an important
chris_1_11-25-2025_12302 (30:32):
That's a good point.
Make it a part of the businessplan.
well, Mike, it's been a greatconversation.
is there any last words,anything we missed?
Anything you wanna leave uswith?
a favorite book quote oranything else?
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025_ (30:45):
it is such a broad topic and,
there's so much going on, withit.
I think we kind of, skim thesurface in a really good way.
So I'm pretty happy with that.
you say book, I go between mytrashy books tend to be like
sci-fi or, things.
I know it was made a series, itwas actually an Apple series.
I should.
(31:05):
Yeah, I would say it's that.
But the
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (31:07):
Yeah,
mike-armistead_1_11-25-2025_ (31:08):
if you've never read the Murder
bot, series, they're extremely,they have a good sense of humor
in'em.
but, some really good, youshould pick,
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (31:17):
I'll have to, I will look it up.
No, I like sci-fi.
I like anything with technologythat,
mike-armistead_1_11-25-20 (31:21):
Yeah.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (31:22):
that it sounds scary already, you
know.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-202 (31:24):
It's actually funnier than scary.
chris_1_11-25-2025_123029 (31:26):
oh, good.
Oh, I'm in, I'm in.
Well, Mike, again, thanks somuch for your time.
check the show notes, folks.
I'll have some links to learnmore about Mike and his
organization.
and yeah, on your website, I'venoticed you got some great
articles.
Actually, I already reposted oneon LinkedIn, Good thought
leadership.
And back to your point, it'slike, you don't know, find
someone that does, or, call Mikeand his team.
(31:48):
I mean, there's folks out therethat can help you.
but this is a topic ofcybersecurity.
You wanna, you wanna do your duediligence, so thanks so much,
Mike.
I appreciate it.
mike-armistead_1_11-25-202 (31:57):
Hey, glad to be here.
chris_1_11-25-2025_1 (31:58):
Fantastic.
And there you go folks.
Another episode of The WirelessWay.
And as always, if a customer ora colleague or a teammate came
to mind, please share thisepisode with'em.
I really appreciate us how welove spread the good news of
technology, how it's solvingproblems and increasing revenue
for businesses.
rising tide rises all boats.
And you can always check out,the wireless way.net.
(32:20):
And there's a contact us buttonif you have any feedback,
comments or suggestions.
Love to hear from you and, we'llsee you next time on the
Wireless way.
Popular Podcasts
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
Are You A Charlotte?
In 1997, actress Kristin Davis’ life was forever changed when she took on the role of Charlotte York in Sex and the City. As we watched Carrie, Samantha, Miranda and Charlotte navigate relationships in NYC, the show helped push once unacceptable conversation topics out of the shadows and altered the narrative around women and sex. We all saw ourselves in them as they searched for fulfillment in life, sex and friendships. Now, Kristin Davis wants to connect with you, the fans, and share untold stories and all the behind the scenes. Together, with Kristin and special guests, what will begin with Sex and the City will evolve into talks about themes that are still so relevant today. "Are you a Charlotte?" is much more than just rewatching this beloved show, it brings the past and the present together as we talk with heart, humor and of course some optimism.
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.