May 8, 2024 • 22 mins
Ever felt like chucking your day job for a wild dream? Milo Shapiro did just that, swapping his IT security blanket for the unpredictable world of improv, and he's here to share his epic journey. This week on the Home Business Success Show, I, Hank Eder, sit down with the man behind Improv Ventures – the homegrown business that's teaching teams to communicate and collaborate with the spontaneity of a comedy troupe. Milo's story isn't just about gutsy career moves; it's a master class in transforming passions into entrepreneurial gold, proving that the leap from secure income to the thrill of home business can land you in a place of success and satisfaction.
Say 'yes, and' to innovation! Milo and I dissect the core skills of improvisation that can revolutionize team dynamics and idea generation. Imagine a world where every Lisa gets her moment to shine, contributing ideas that could propel her company forward. That's the power of embracing 'yes, and' in team building, a principle Milo's Improv Ventures champions. We delve into how these techniques are transforming the corporate landscape, encouraging teams to adapt, problem-solve, and even find the silver lining in failure. It's not just about being funny; it's about harnessing the potential of every team member to unlock groundbreaking innovations.
From commanding improv workshops to captivating audiences as a keynote speaker and public speaking coach, Milo's trajectory is a story of evolution. This episode reveals how an impromptu coaching session with a QVC seller became the cornerstone of Milo's speaking career, highlighting the beauty of a path that unfolds in real time, guided by the spirit of improvisation. For those who dream of charting their course and crafting a narrative that's uniquely theirs, Milo's switch from structured IT to the fluidity of improv speaks volumes. Tune in as we celebrate the home business hustle, where independence and success aren't just possible – they're just a podcast away.
Public Speaking Coaching: https://www.publicdynamics.com
Motivational Speaking/Teambuilding: https://www.miloshapiro.con
Photo Restoration & Editing: https://www.freshenyourphoto.com
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/milo.m.shapiro/
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/motivationalspeakermiloshapiro/
Twitter: https://twitter.com/miloshapiro
Be sure to visit BizRadio.US to discover hundreds more engaging conversations, local events and more.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Hank (00:05):
Welcome to the Home Business Success Show.
Join us as we speak to homebusiness entrepreneurs for tips,
tricks, do's and even don'tsfor running a successful home
business.
Welcome everyone.
I'm Hank Eder, also known asHank the PR Guy, host of the
Home Business Success Show, andyou're listening to bizradious
(00:30):
all entrepreneurs all the time.
Today we're going to pass on mytwo cents marketing minute to
spend more time with our guest,milo Shapiro.
Milo Shapiro has a ratherunusual set of businesses that
have grown organically.
Milo Shapiro has a ratherunusual set of businesses that
have grown organically, one outof the other, and all home-based
.
In 2000, he quit his job ininformation technology to take
(00:52):
his love of improvisation intobecoming a corporate team
builder, using improv games tobring out creativity and
communication among theattendees.
From there he became amotivational speaker, leading
audiences in some of the gamesand talking about our
relationship with risk, changeand even failure.
(01:15):
These speeches surprisinglymorphed into his becoming a
public speaking coach, workingone-on-one with people to help
them improve their publicspeaking, be it a one-time
speech, a speech they givefrequently, or just helping them
feel more prepared, polishedand powerful whenever and
(01:35):
wherever they speak.
Milo also has a business as aphoto editor and restorer.
Whether you want to get a stainout, a scratch out, bring back
faded photos, add color to blackand white, or just take your ex
out of a family shot.
Milo has been doing this since2004, having edited thousands of
(01:56):
pictures in that time.
That business isfreshinyourphotocom.
Welcome to the show, milo.
Milo (02:02):
It's a pleasure to be here .
Good job with the intro.
I appreciate that.
Hank (02:05):
You're welcome.
You know, my mother would haveloved to use your services
because my oldest brother hadthree wives.
He's on his third wife and ifhe didn't leave on good terms
with any of the wives, she wouldtake the photos and she'd
either rip out the person or shewould take, you know, whiteout
or marker.
Yeah.
(02:27):
So we call 1980s Photoshop isthe whiteout and the marker.
Exactly, my mother was a masterof 1980s Photoshop, but anyway,
let me ask you this how did youdecide to leave information
technology and start a companyaround improvisation?
Milo (02:40):
It was the scariest thing I ever did to go to four-year
college, have a good benefitspackage, be in a solid company.
I actually liked my job as muchas I could like IT, but I was
passionate about improv.
I was spending my weekends andmy evenings even my vacations I
was spending flying to Calgaryand San Francisco to learn from
masters to get better and betterat improv because I had such a
(03:02):
passion for it.
So when I heard that there wasa company I think it was in
Maryland that this new thing in97 was going around called
websites, and someone came by mydesk and said, hey, check out
this website and it was acompany doing team building
events in I think it wasMaryland, Um, and I was looking
and they they basically listedall the games they played.
They were all games that I knew.
I was like this game does teachlistening skills.
(03:24):
This is a good game forbuilding on each other's ideas.
Oh, this is not a good game forcreative problem solving.
I think what I would do is andjust sat there at my desk one
day, not doing my work for aboutan hour, making a list of if I
ever did a team building course,what games would I include?
And then I shoved it in mydrawer, because who quits their
job to do something crazy likethat?
Well, about two, two and a halfyears later, after a merger, we
(03:47):
were offered voluntaryseparation packages.
Didn't have to take it, but itwas one of those things where it
was just staring me in the facethat they were going to give me
six months salary to go away,which would be enough to get a
business off the ground, andthere was every good reason in
the world not to do it.
But I kept thinking this isgonna be one of those deathbed
things Like, after spending 40years doing something I found
(04:08):
not the least bit satisfyingbeing in IT, was I going to look
back and go?
I had a chance and I didn'ttake it.
So I signed the paperwork andgot that money and went off to
start the company.
I also learned how important itis to read the fine print,
because they did not give me sixmonths salary.
They gave me six months salaryin my 401k that I couldn't touch
for 30 years.
(04:29):
So I had to hit the groundrunning, starting my own
home-based business, and I hadto make it work, and so that's
how I ended up starting thecompany and naming it Improv
Ventures, Because initially itwas all only about what I was
doing with the improv and theteam building.
Hank (04:44):
You know they say, of course, you know the kind of
things they say they say thatthings don't happen by accident,
so you're not reading.
The fine print was probably oneof those.
What do they call that?
Kismet?
You know, it's one of thosethings that if you had known
that, maybe you wouldn't havetaken the leap.
Milo (05:03):
No, I never would have, and, as it turns out, not only
is it good that I didn't know,because I wouldn't have taken
the leap, but it's also given my401k 30 years to grow with that
money, so it'll turn out to bethe right choice.
Hank (05:20):
But it was a lot of ramen bride for a while.
That's very cool to have thatlittle nest egg that was set up
that way.
Yeah, so, okay.
So you started a company to doteam building using
improvisation and created acourse that you call team
improvising.
Let's say, I'm a manager.
With all the different kinds ofteam building out there, why
(05:40):
choose a class on improvisation?
Milo (05:42):
So much of what I see out there with team building is, hey
, let's all have fun and that'sgoing to change something, right
, and it really doesn't.
You can go out and playvolleyball, go out and do a
scavenger hunt, but what did youget out of it?
Or, at the other end of thescale, I've seen a lot of team
building that feel like you'rebeing put through some kind of a
psychological experience andit's hard to get involved and
(06:05):
emotionally connected to itbecause you feel like you're
being put through paces.
This is the best of both.
Improv is a lot of fun.
Even the people who start outwith their arms crossed across
their chest I'm not doing itthey end up having a great time
with it because I bring theminto it nice and slowly.
It's all full group stuff andthen working in pairs.
By the time I get people up infront of the group, everyone's
having a great time and laughingand letting their guards down.
(06:28):
But in terms of why that?
Compared to other kinds of fun?
Some of the things that I'vementioned improv teaches us
about listening skills, buildingon each other's ideas, creative
problem solving, non-verbalcommunication.
I can't tell you how many timesI've heard things like uh, what
just happened in that last game?
That's what happens in ourstaff meetings, but it's not so
funny there.
Or I have a client who justpulled that same nonsense on me
(06:50):
the other day.
That was going on in that game.
It was the same dynamic.
But it's not funny when it's meand my client.
How do I handle this?
I've even had managers watch mego over and say to a pair Dave,
you know what you just did inthat?
I and say to a pair Dave, youknow what you just did in that?
I think what happened was youtwo are struggling because you
built on the last thing.
You said Listen to Liz andbuild on the thing Liz just said
(07:11):
.
Yes, like that, go.
And then the two of them starthaving more fun and laughing and
the manager will go.
I've been trying to say that toDave for 10 years.
Why did that just work?
I'm like you're critiquing hiswork performance, I'm helping
him win a game.
Which one is he more likely tolisten to?
But the message sinks in Wow, Ido that.
I was building on my idea, nothers.
So those kind of things canmake a real difference.
Hank (07:33):
Well, that's an interesting point because a lot
of people, when they're supposedto be listening and I've done
this many times, I'm sure we allhave we listen for our next
response, not to truly listenand understand what the other
person is saying, not to reallyentertain what the other person
is saying.
And in business it becomes moreand more important to truly
(07:55):
listen, because if we listen toour customers or to our
potential customers when we'rein meetings with potential
customers, if we listen realcarefully, we get an idea of who
they are and, more importantthan that, what keeps them awake
at night and what can we do.
What kind of solutions do wehave to help them sleep at night
(08:16):
.
And then they're more likely tosay well, this person has
something that I need and want,as opposed to trying to dazzle
them with all our credentialsand our ego and all that kind of
stuff.
Milo (08:28):
So yeah, when I'm doing an initial contact with people
whether it's about the teambuilding or speaking or, even
more so, with the coaching thatwe'll get to I ask a whole lot
of questions and I'm typing andtaking notes the whole time and
I almost always say so I justwant to make sure I really know
where we're at and I parrot backeverything they said to them,
including the goals they want tomake sure I really know where
we're at" and I parrot backeverything they said to them,
including the goals they want toget.
I can't tell you how manypeople go.
Oh, my gosh, you totally getwhat I'm looking for.
(08:49):
Yes, I'm like wow.
All I did was say back to youwhat you said to me, but we are
so used to not really beingheard because everyone has an
agenda that someone just makingit really clear that they truly
heard what that person said, andit's big for people to feel
that.
Hank (09:05):
Yeah, because everybody wants to be heard, but mostly
they're not.
So what are the skills ofimprovisation that you help
relate in team improvising?
Milo (09:16):
So I've covered a couple of them a little bit, but one of
the ones that's really big isthe building on each other's
idea.
I'm going to talk about that alittle bit more.
There is so many times you mayhave heard it's kind of famous
the idea of yes and that we'rebuilding on the other person's
idea.
So one of the exercises I do isI make the person.
You can't start your nextsentence without the words yes,
and, and it's amazing how manytimes people will say yes but
(09:37):
and everyone laughs and they'relike what's so funny?
Like you don't even know whatyou just said, did you?
I said yes and I'm like no, youdid.
And I've heard people say yesand they go on with their own
idea and it becomes more obviousonce you start looking at it.
I had this one woman, lisa, whowas in a chorus with me and she
went back to the office andheard someone literally use the
(09:58):
words yes, and and he went on.
This was in a meeting, not animprov class, and she said
because of the improv, itretrained her brain to go.
He made that sound like he wasbuilding on my idea and he
didn't.
He just used the technique thathe has come up with or
subconsciously, and she said youknow what?
That wasn't my idea.
Let's finish talking about youridea.
But then I want to come back tomy idea, because it's not the
(10:19):
same.
Lisa's idea made a milliondollars.
I don't even know which ideathey picked, but what was it
worth to the company, at leastthat they had two ideas to
choose between because Lisacaught that.
And what was it worth to Lisato feel like she didn't get
stepped on when she didn't evenreally realize that in the same
way before, because she didn'thave the insight?
(10:39):
Those are the kinds of things wecan get from improv.
Also, it's how to take an ideaand build on it in a different
way.
I can't tell you often howoften the phone rings and
someone asks me to do somethingand it's not what I do and I'm I
would be wrong to say yes.
I'm also wrong to try and talkthem into what I normally do,
because it's not what they need,apparently.
So improv has taught me how togo.
(11:00):
That's not exactly what I do,but here is something I could do
that is within the world ofwhat you're trying to accomplish
, that might accomplish the samegoals and that and I don't want
to tell you I'll do somethingI'm not suited for with this
reach.
Oh, actually, that sounds likeit would reach our goal even
better and take less time.
Okay, so now we've found that'simprov, because it would be
easier.
(11:20):
What would most people go andsay?
That's not what we do.
Hank (11:23):
Yeah, there you go.
That's improv and it also camefrom.
It was born out of carefullistening, Because by listening
and understanding then you wereable to pivot and offer them
something that they reallyneeded, rather than something
that you would try to convincethem that maybe they needed.
Milo (11:41):
I don't know on stage of any skill worse in beginner
improvisers or sometimes they'renot beginners than not being a
listener.
You can tell when someone's gotan agenda and they're trying to
drive all the other actorsthrough their agenda, and the
audience picks up on that too.
Hank (11:56):
Yeah, you know, when I was in high school drama, I had a
really remarkable drama teacher.
His name was Jay Jensen, out ofMiami Beach, and there's a
movie on him called Class Act.
He was the teacher of MickeyRourke, he was the teacher of
Andy Garcia and he was myteacher.
But the difference betweenthose guys is that they were
(12:19):
pretty good actors.
You know, I thought I wanted tobe an actor, but I really
wasn't very good at it.
Milo (12:24):
Well, their podcasts are terrible, though, so everyone
has their own.
Hank (12:28):
But when we did a show in my junior year of high school it
was called the Serpent and itwas an experimental theater
thing and he brought us in theChicago cast of Hair, who was in
town to teach us some teambuilding exercises.
It was very amazing and that'swhat kind of a man this was.
(12:49):
That's kind of a teacher he was, if you ever get a chance to
find the movie class at that.
Okay, about Jay Jensen, yeah,he was totally amazing.
That being said, I get now howyou became a motivational
speaker.
But how did that lead to yourbecoming a coach?
Milo (13:08):
Well, there was a step in between there, the team building
people kept saying to me thisis really powerful, you should
do this with bigger crowds.
So that's how I ended up takingsome of the games and tying
them into a keynote called weGotta Fail to Succeed, where I
talk about our relationship withchange, risk and failure.
In an improv show, you shouldbe failing 20% of the time.
(13:30):
If you're not, you're probablyplaying it too safe.
It's only in failing about 20%of the time that you can do
anything really brilliant, andthe other 80% because you're
pushing your borders.
And that's what I talk about.
And they have people noddinglike I just saw you nodding, I
go great, you got the idea.
Turn to the person next to you.
You saw you nodding, I go great, you got the idea.
(13:50):
Turn to the person next to you.
You're going to try it.
And for about 30 minutes out ofthe 60, I lead them in the
games.
And the surprising thing to mewhen I started keynoting was all
of a sudden it became thebigger part of my business.
I became like 20% team building, 80%.
Speaker.
Did not see that coming, but Iwas fine with it.
The speaking was fun and,honestly, it was less exhausting
One hour on stage versus fiveor six hours with team building
sometimes.
But you had to back to yourquestion how did that lead to
coaching?
Was that?
People kept coming up to me atthe ends of my speeches and
(14:13):
saying would you work with me onmy speaking skills?
Would you come and work with mystaff?
And I kept saying, no, that's,that's not what I do.
I had years in toastmasters.
I've had a lot of trainingsince then through the national
speakers association, but I nottrained to train other people.
But this one guy came up to meand he was quite insistent.
He said I really think you'rethe one who's supposed to help
me and I need it fast.
(14:33):
So what's going on?
He said I sell on QVC network.
I sell plants and they told methe last time I was there that
if I don't sell more next timethey're cutting me, and QVC is
90% of our sales.
I can't lose this.
So I really need your help.
I said well, you sounddesperate and you don't have
much time to find someone else.
Come on over Home-basedbusiness.
Literally came into my livingroom with a stack of VHS tapes
(14:56):
that's how long ago this was andshowed me some of his QVC
performances.
And I said yeah, I can see someof the things you're clearly
doing wrong.
That's off-putting to theviewers.
And so he worked on a few ofthose things and he practiced
them and got better.
And he went back toPennsylvania to try and save
himself from being cut.
And about five minutes intoselling the plants he noticed a
(15:16):
strange look on the face of thewoman who was interviewing him
and she said I understand, youhave plant food too.
Tell me about your plant food.
You didn't want to talk aboutplant food.
He you have plant food too.
Tell me about your plant food.
He didn't want to talk aboutplant food.
He had plants to sell.
But she kept driving him backto the plant food and he finally
said I guess I'm sunk here.
I'll just talk about plant food.
And afterwards she said he saidto her why did you take me away
from the plants?
She said you sold everythingout in five out of your seven
(15:38):
minutes.
We couldn't have two minutes ofdead air.
I had to talk about something.
You were completely differenton camera.
What did you do?
The audience loved you and hesaid oh, I hired a coach.
So when he came back and toldme that story.
I said, guess I got to add thisto the third thing on the
website and it took off and nowI'm probably 80% in that
business, 80% speaking coach,15% speaker, 5% team builder.
(16:02):
So the thing that I started thecompany from is only a couple
of times a year compared to thiscoaching, and I'm fine with
that.
I love helping people andwatching them grow and get that
excitement.
Hank (16:12):
Well, you know, we mentioned that these things.
They blossomed organically,which is a great thing.
You know, I have a writingpartner and I heard, you know,
when we spoke earlier you saidyou're also a writer and you're
writing a play.
I have a writing partner, youknow.
We've written screenplays.
We came really close to sellingone, but you know how that goes
(16:33):
.
We had an actual producer, whoI won't mention, but he's pretty
well known, but then the wholething, of course, fell apart at
the last minute.
But, that being said, my writingpartner we're working on some
novels right now, little bylittle.
He's got more time than I do,but when I try to put in the
(16:54):
outline, here's the outline.
We need these kind of beatpoints, you know, and he always
says, yeah, beat points, schmiedpoints, it has to evolve
organically.
And I say, okay, I will let itevolve organically, but we still
have to hit the beat points,because we need somebody to
publish this or, in the case ofa screenplay, we need somebody
(17:15):
to produce it.
Without the beat points it'snot going to happen.
But when you merge the twoworlds, it's a really good thing
.
Milo (17:25):
And it's challenging because if you don't have those
things that they're looking for,they'll turn against you.
But at the same time it's gotto feel organic.
So I tend to write as animproviser.
It's got its pros and cons.
I tend to say what is whatcomes next?
Don't think beyond that.
Reanalyze, what is what comesnext, what comes next?
And there was one time I wasworking on a novella and
somebody said I can't wait tofind out how this ends.
(17:46):
I said I know me too.
He goes you don't know yet.
I said no, the charactershaven't told me yet.
I have to see what else theysay before I know how this thing
is going to end.
And he looked at me like I wascrazy, like I was.
You know how do you, how do thecharacters tell you?
But it was working because Imade interesting characters in
interesting situations.
Hank (18:04):
That's right.
Well, if your characters aretrue and they're actually acting
from the motivation of who theyare, then the choices they make
should be relevant.
They should be.
They should organically fallinto place and be true to what
that character would choose.
So, yeah, what does coachingwith you look like?
Milo (18:25):
It's something that I make sure that they know that we're
on the right path.
For there's a lot of coachesout there who say here's my
patented seven step process.
I take everybody through and Ihave to be really clear to
people that I will never havethat.
I don't want that.
I don't think it's healthy,Because if Chris comes to me
because he's bland and boringand nobody really wants to
(18:45):
listen to him but he's at leastfairly organized, and Tina comes
to me because she's lively andexciting and fun and never makes
a point and people say sherambles, why would I put them
through the same process?
They need different things.
So what coaching looks like isthe initial appointment.
I do two things.
(19:09):
I do a feedback interview withthem where I ask them a lot more
questions than most people everhave about what do they know,
what don't they know, what'sgetting in their way, what are
they trying to accomplish?
To make sure we're on the samepage through this assessment and
I've had a lot of people say tome I learned a lot about myself
doing the assessment.
I didn't expect to get that.
It's not Myers-Briggs or DISC,it's specifically on speaking
skills.
I designed it.
The second part I teachsomething called the four steps
(19:29):
to successful speech structure.
This is a fundamental ofeverything I teach about how to
organize a speech, and I'd liketo do it right up front because
if I don't, I end up wanting toreference to it and backpedaling
.
So in that first appointment,everyone, whether they decide to
continue with me or not, atleast leaves with the four steps
.
And so many people have said tome oh my gosh, I'm not going to
just stare at that blankMicrosoft Word page or the first
(19:51):
screen of PowerPoint.
I know how to start.
I'm going to work the foursteps At the end of that
appointment.
If they decide that we're not afit, or if I once in a while say
I don't think we're a fit, thenwe go our separate ways.
It's rare, maybe 5% of the time.
For the other 95%, they're moreexcited than ever and I say
great.
That's the moment that coachingactually starts and they always
have a homework assignment,because I don't want their
learning to be limited to thetime we have together.
(20:12):
And we'll come together andI'll ask how was the homework?
Was it easy, Was it hard?
Did you have fun with it?
Where did you get stuck?
They'll give me a lesson of theday.
And the lesson of the day willvary based on what I saw in the
homework and what their goalsare, and they can pick at that
point in time what packagethey're going to choose.
(20:35):
Are they going to pay each time?
Are they going to get a blockof three, five, 10, or 25 hours
with me so that we can worktogether to help them reach
their goals?
Hank (20:41):
Very, very cool.
You know I hate to cut you offhere, but this time is flying by
no-transcript.
Milo (21:06):
But, as we were talking about earlier, it's tricky to
find the second edition.
You might accidentally buy thefirst.
So the best thing you can do isgo to miloshapirocom and click
the books tab and that'll takeyou to the second edition from
2020 instead of the 2007 version.
Hank (21:21):
Right Now, what is the best way for our audience to
contact you if they'reinterested in getting your
coaching or anything else thatyou have to offer your photo
editing, which we never got achance to talk about.
Milo (21:36):
That's okay.
The best way to find all of itthe team building, the hiring me
to speak at a conference andthe coaching is all at
MiloShapirocom.
There is no C in Shapiro.
That's the one place people gowrong, miloshapirocom.
And if you were teased at thebeginning by, oh, I have some
photos that could stand to befixed up in one way or another.
Check out freshenyourphotocom.
(21:56):
You'll see all kinds ofexamples, and both websites have
contact pages to reach me.
Hank (22:01):
Very cool.
Well, thanks for being herewith us today, milo.
And to our listeners, tune Verycool.
Well, thanks for being herewith us today, milo.
And to our listeners, tune inevery Wednesday for the Home
Business Success Show here onbizradious.
Remember, you can achievesuccess, freedom and
independence in your ownhome-based business.
I've done it, milo has done it,and you can, too, see you again
(22:21):
next Wednesday here on BizRadio.
This is Hank Eder, wishing allof you a fabulous day of home
business success.
Welcome to the Home Business Success Show.
Join us as we speak to homebusiness entrepreneurs for tips,
tricks, do's and even don'tsfor running a successful home
business.
Welcome everyone.
I'm Hank Eder, also known asHank the PR Guy, host of the
Home Business Success Show, andyou're listening to bizradious
(00:30):
all entrepreneurs all the time.
Today we're going to pass on mytwo cents marketing minute to
spend more time with our guest,milo Shapiro.
Milo Shapiro has a ratherunusual set of businesses that
have grown organically.
Milo Shapiro has a ratherunusual set of businesses that
have grown organically, one outof the other, and all home-based
.
In 2000, he quit his job ininformation technology to take
(00:52):
his love of improvisation intobecoming a corporate team
builder, using improv games tobring out creativity and
communication among theattendees.
From there he became amotivational speaker, leading
audiences in some of the gamesand talking about our
relationship with risk, changeand even failure.
(01:15):
These speeches surprisinglymorphed into his becoming a
public speaking coach, workingone-on-one with people to help
them improve their publicspeaking, be it a one-time
speech, a speech they givefrequently, or just helping them
feel more prepared, polishedand powerful whenever and
(01:35):
wherever they speak.
Milo also has a business as aphoto editor and restorer.
Whether you want to get a stainout, a scratch out, bring back
faded photos, add color to blackand white, or just take your ex
out of a family shot.
Milo has been doing this since2004, having edited thousands of
(01:56):
pictures in that time.
That business isfreshinyourphotocom.
Welcome to the show, milo.
Milo (02:02):
It's a pleasure to be here .
Good job with the intro.
I appreciate that.
Hank (02:05):
You're welcome.
You know, my mother would haveloved to use your services
because my oldest brother hadthree wives.
He's on his third wife and ifhe didn't leave on good terms
with any of the wives, she wouldtake the photos and she'd
either rip out the person or shewould take, you know, whiteout
or marker.
Yeah.
(02:27):
So we call 1980s Photoshop isthe whiteout and the marker.
Exactly, my mother was a masterof 1980s Photoshop, but anyway,
let me ask you this how did youdecide to leave information
technology and start a companyaround improvisation?
Milo (02:40):
It was the scariest thing I ever did to go to four-year
college, have a good benefitspackage, be in a solid company.
I actually liked my job as muchas I could like IT, but I was
passionate about improv.
I was spending my weekends andmy evenings even my vacations I
was spending flying to Calgaryand San Francisco to learn from
masters to get better and betterat improv because I had such a
(03:02):
passion for it.
So when I heard that there wasa company I think it was in
Maryland that this new thing in97 was going around called
websites, and someone came by mydesk and said, hey, check out
this website and it was acompany doing team building
events in I think it wasMaryland, Um, and I was looking
and they they basically listedall the games they played.
They were all games that I knew.
I was like this game does teachlistening skills.
(03:24):
This is a good game forbuilding on each other's ideas.
Oh, this is not a good game forcreative problem solving.
I think what I would do is andjust sat there at my desk one
day, not doing my work for aboutan hour, making a list of if I
ever did a team building course,what games would I include?
And then I shoved it in mydrawer, because who quits their
job to do something crazy likethat?
Well, about two, two and a halfyears later, after a merger, we
(03:47):
were offered voluntaryseparation packages.
Didn't have to take it, but itwas one of those things where it
was just staring me in the facethat they were going to give me
six months salary to go away,which would be enough to get a
business off the ground, andthere was every good reason in
the world not to do it.
But I kept thinking this isgonna be one of those deathbed
things Like, after spending 40years doing something I found
(04:08):
not the least bit satisfyingbeing in IT, was I going to look
back and go?
I had a chance and I didn'ttake it.
So I signed the paperwork andgot that money and went off to
start the company.
I also learned how important itis to read the fine print,
because they did not give me sixmonths salary.
They gave me six months salaryin my 401k that I couldn't touch
for 30 years.
(04:29):
So I had to hit the groundrunning, starting my own
home-based business, and I hadto make it work, and so that's
how I ended up starting thecompany and naming it Improv
Ventures, Because initially itwas all only about what I was
doing with the improv and theteam building.
Hank (04:44):
You know they say, of course, you know the kind of
things they say they say thatthings don't happen by accident,
so you're not reading.
The fine print was probably oneof those.
What do they call that?
Kismet?
You know, it's one of thosethings that if you had known
that, maybe you wouldn't havetaken the leap.
Milo (05:03):
No, I never would have, and, as it turns out, not only
is it good that I didn't know,because I wouldn't have taken
the leap, but it's also given my401k 30 years to grow with that
money, so it'll turn out to bethe right choice.
Hank (05:20):
But it was a lot of ramen bride for a while.
That's very cool to have thatlittle nest egg that was set up
that way.
Yeah, so, okay.
So you started a company to doteam building using
improvisation and created acourse that you call team
improvising.
Let's say, I'm a manager.
With all the different kinds ofteam building out there, why
(05:40):
choose a class on improvisation?
Milo (05:42):
So much of what I see out there with team building is, hey
, let's all have fun and that'sgoing to change something, right
, and it really doesn't.
You can go out and playvolleyball, go out and do a
scavenger hunt, but what did youget out of it?
Or, at the other end of thescale, I've seen a lot of team
building that feel like you'rebeing put through some kind of a
psychological experience andit's hard to get involved and
(06:05):
emotionally connected to itbecause you feel like you're
being put through paces.
This is the best of both.
Improv is a lot of fun.
Even the people who start outwith their arms crossed across
their chest I'm not doing itthey end up having a great time
with it because I bring theminto it nice and slowly.
It's all full group stuff andthen working in pairs.
By the time I get people up infront of the group, everyone's
having a great time and laughingand letting their guards down.
(06:28):
But in terms of why that?
Compared to other kinds of fun?
Some of the things that I'vementioned improv teaches us
about listening skills, buildingon each other's ideas, creative
problem solving, non-verbalcommunication.
I can't tell you how many timesI've heard things like uh, what
just happened in that last game?
That's what happens in ourstaff meetings, but it's not so
funny there.
Or I have a client who justpulled that same nonsense on me
(06:50):
the other day.
That was going on in that game.
It was the same dynamic.
But it's not funny when it's meand my client.
How do I handle this?
I've even had managers watch mego over and say to a pair Dave,
you know what you just did inthat?
I and say to a pair Dave, youknow what you just did in that?
I think what happened was youtwo are struggling because you
built on the last thing.
You said Listen to Liz andbuild on the thing Liz just said
(07:11):
.
Yes, like that, go.
And then the two of them starthaving more fun and laughing and
the manager will go.
I've been trying to say that toDave for 10 years.
Why did that just work?
I'm like you're critiquing hiswork performance, I'm helping
him win a game.
Which one is he more likely tolisten to?
But the message sinks in Wow, Ido that.
I was building on my idea, nothers.
So those kind of things canmake a real difference.
Hank (07:33):
Well, that's an interesting point because a lot
of people, when they're supposedto be listening and I've done
this many times, I'm sure we allhave we listen for our next
response, not to truly listenand understand what the other
person is saying, not to reallyentertain what the other person
is saying.
And in business it becomes moreand more important to truly
(07:55):
listen, because if we listen toour customers or to our
potential customers when we'rein meetings with potential
customers, if we listen realcarefully, we get an idea of who
they are and, more importantthan that, what keeps them awake
at night and what can we do.
What kind of solutions do wehave to help them sleep at night
(08:16):
.
And then they're more likely tosay well, this person has
something that I need and want,as opposed to trying to dazzle
them with all our credentialsand our ego and all that kind of
stuff.
Milo (08:28):
So yeah, when I'm doing an initial contact with people
whether it's about the teambuilding or speaking or, even
more so, with the coaching thatwe'll get to I ask a whole lot
of questions and I'm typing andtaking notes the whole time and
I almost always say so I justwant to make sure I really know
where we're at and I parrot backeverything they said to them,
including the goals they want tomake sure I really know where
we're at" and I parrot backeverything they said to them,
including the goals they want toget.
I can't tell you how manypeople go.
Oh, my gosh, you totally getwhat I'm looking for.
(08:49):
Yes, I'm like wow.
All I did was say back to youwhat you said to me, but we are
so used to not really beingheard because everyone has an
agenda that someone just makingit really clear that they truly
heard what that person said, andit's big for people to feel
that.
Hank (09:05):
Yeah, because everybody wants to be heard, but mostly
they're not.
So what are the skills ofimprovisation that you help
relate in team improvising?
Milo (09:16):
So I've covered a couple of them a little bit, but one of
the ones that's really big isthe building on each other's
idea.
I'm going to talk about that alittle bit more.
There is so many times you mayhave heard it's kind of famous
the idea of yes and that we'rebuilding on the other person's
idea.
So one of the exercises I do isI make the person.
You can't start your nextsentence without the words yes,
and, and it's amazing how manytimes people will say yes but
(09:37):
and everyone laughs and they'relike what's so funny?
Like you don't even know whatyou just said, did you?
I said yes and I'm like no, youdid.
And I've heard people say yesand they go on with their own
idea and it becomes more obviousonce you start looking at it.
I had this one woman, lisa, whowas in a chorus with me and she
went back to the office andheard someone literally use the
(09:58):
words yes, and and he went on.
This was in a meeting, not animprov class, and she said
because of the improv, itretrained her brain to go.
He made that sound like he wasbuilding on my idea and he
didn't.
He just used the technique thathe has come up with or
subconsciously, and she said youknow what?
That wasn't my idea.
Let's finish talking about youridea.
But then I want to come back tomy idea, because it's not the
(10:19):
same.
Lisa's idea made a milliondollars.
I don't even know which ideathey picked, but what was it
worth to the company, at leastthat they had two ideas to
choose between because Lisacaught that.
And what was it worth to Lisato feel like she didn't get
stepped on when she didn't evenreally realize that in the same
way before, because she didn'thave the insight?
(10:39):
Those are the kinds of things wecan get from improv.
Also, it's how to take an ideaand build on it in a different
way.
I can't tell you often howoften the phone rings and
someone asks me to do somethingand it's not what I do and I'm I
would be wrong to say yes.
I'm also wrong to try and talkthem into what I normally do,
because it's not what they need,apparently.
So improv has taught me how togo.
(11:00):
That's not exactly what I do,but here is something I could do
that is within the world ofwhat you're trying to accomplish
, that might accomplish the samegoals and that and I don't want
to tell you I'll do somethingI'm not suited for with this
reach.
Oh, actually, that sounds likeit would reach our goal even
better and take less time.
Okay, so now we've found that'simprov, because it would be
easier.
(11:20):
What would most people go andsay?
That's not what we do.
Hank (11:23):
Yeah, there you go.
That's improv and it also camefrom.
It was born out of carefullistening, Because by listening
and understanding then you wereable to pivot and offer them
something that they reallyneeded, rather than something
that you would try to convincethem that maybe they needed.
Milo (11:41):
I don't know on stage of any skill worse in beginner
improvisers or sometimes they'renot beginners than not being a
listener.
You can tell when someone's gotan agenda and they're trying to
drive all the other actorsthrough their agenda, and the
audience picks up on that too.
Hank (11:56):
Yeah, you know, when I was in high school drama, I had a
really remarkable drama teacher.
His name was Jay Jensen, out ofMiami Beach, and there's a
movie on him called Class Act.
He was the teacher of MickeyRourke, he was the teacher of
Andy Garcia and he was myteacher.
But the difference betweenthose guys is that they were
(12:19):
pretty good actors.
You know, I thought I wanted tobe an actor, but I really
wasn't very good at it.
Milo (12:24):
Well, their podcasts are terrible, though, so everyone
has their own.
Hank (12:28):
But when we did a show in my junior year of high school it
was called the Serpent and itwas an experimental theater
thing and he brought us in theChicago cast of Hair, who was in
town to teach us some teambuilding exercises.
It was very amazing and that'swhat kind of a man this was.
(12:49):
That's kind of a teacher he was, if you ever get a chance to
find the movie class at that.
Okay, about Jay Jensen, yeah,he was totally amazing.
That being said, I get now howyou became a motivational
speaker.
But how did that lead to yourbecoming a coach?
Milo (13:08):
Well, there was a step in between there, the team building
people kept saying to me thisis really powerful, you should
do this with bigger crowds.
So that's how I ended up takingsome of the games and tying
them into a keynote called weGotta Fail to Succeed, where I
talk about our relationship withchange, risk and failure.
In an improv show, you shouldbe failing 20% of the time.
(13:30):
If you're not, you're probablyplaying it too safe.
It's only in failing about 20%of the time that you can do
anything really brilliant, andthe other 80% because you're
pushing your borders.
And that's what I talk about.
And they have people noddinglike I just saw you nodding, I
go great, you got the idea.
Turn to the person next to you.
You saw you nodding, I go great, you got the idea.
(13:50):
Turn to the person next to you.
You're going to try it.
And for about 30 minutes out ofthe 60, I lead them in the
games.
And the surprising thing to mewhen I started keynoting was all
of a sudden it became thebigger part of my business.
I became like 20% team building, 80%.
Speaker.
Did not see that coming, but Iwas fine with it.
The speaking was fun and,honestly, it was less exhausting
One hour on stage versus fiveor six hours with team building
sometimes.
But you had to back to yourquestion how did that lead to
coaching?
Was that?
People kept coming up to me atthe ends of my speeches and
(14:13):
saying would you work with me onmy speaking skills?
Would you come and work with mystaff?
And I kept saying, no, that's,that's not what I do.
I had years in toastmasters.
I've had a lot of trainingsince then through the national
speakers association, but I nottrained to train other people.
But this one guy came up to meand he was quite insistent.
He said I really think you'rethe one who's supposed to help
me and I need it fast.
(14:33):
So what's going on?
He said I sell on QVC network.
I sell plants and they told methe last time I was there that
if I don't sell more next timethey're cutting me, and QVC is
90% of our sales.
I can't lose this.
So I really need your help.
I said well, you sounddesperate and you don't have
much time to find someone else.
Come on over Home-basedbusiness.
Literally came into my livingroom with a stack of VHS tapes
(14:56):
that's how long ago this was andshowed me some of his QVC
performances.
And I said yeah, I can see someof the things you're clearly
doing wrong.
That's off-putting to theviewers.
And so he worked on a few ofthose things and he practiced
them and got better.
And he went back toPennsylvania to try and save
himself from being cut.
And about five minutes intoselling the plants he noticed a
(15:16):
strange look on the face of thewoman who was interviewing him
and she said I understand, youhave plant food too.
Tell me about your plant food.
You didn't want to talk aboutplant food.
He you have plant food too.
Tell me about your plant food.
He didn't want to talk aboutplant food.
He had plants to sell.
But she kept driving him backto the plant food and he finally
said I guess I'm sunk here.
I'll just talk about plant food.
And afterwards she said he saidto her why did you take me away
from the plants?
She said you sold everythingout in five out of your seven
(15:38):
minutes.
We couldn't have two minutes ofdead air.
I had to talk about something.
You were completely differenton camera.
What did you do?
The audience loved you and hesaid oh, I hired a coach.
So when he came back and toldme that story.
I said, guess I got to add thisto the third thing on the
website and it took off and nowI'm probably 80% in that
business, 80% speaking coach,15% speaker, 5% team builder.
(16:02):
So the thing that I started thecompany from is only a couple
of times a year compared to thiscoaching, and I'm fine with
that.
I love helping people andwatching them grow and get that
excitement.
Hank (16:12):
Well, you know, we mentioned that these things.
They blossomed organically,which is a great thing.
You know, I have a writingpartner and I heard, you know,
when we spoke earlier you saidyou're also a writer and you're
writing a play.
I have a writing partner, youknow.
We've written screenplays.
We came really close to sellingone, but you know how that goes
(16:33):
.
We had an actual producer, whoI won't mention, but he's pretty
well known, but then the wholething, of course, fell apart at
the last minute.
But, that being said, my writingpartner we're working on some
novels right now, little bylittle.
He's got more time than I do,but when I try to put in the
(16:54):
outline, here's the outline.
We need these kind of beatpoints, you know, and he always
says, yeah, beat points, schmiedpoints, it has to evolve
organically.
And I say, okay, I will let itevolve organically, but we still
have to hit the beat points,because we need somebody to
publish this or, in the case ofa screenplay, we need somebody
(17:15):
to produce it.
Without the beat points it'snot going to happen.
But when you merge the twoworlds, it's a really good thing
.
Milo (17:25):
And it's challenging because if you don't have those
things that they're looking for,they'll turn against you.
But at the same time it's gotto feel organic.
So I tend to write as animproviser.
It's got its pros and cons.
I tend to say what is whatcomes next?
Don't think beyond that.
Reanalyze, what is what comesnext, what comes next?
And there was one time I wasworking on a novella and
somebody said I can't wait tofind out how this ends.
(17:46):
I said I know me too.
He goes you don't know yet.
I said no, the charactershaven't told me yet.
I have to see what else theysay before I know how this thing
is going to end.
And he looked at me like I wascrazy, like I was.
You know how do you, how do thecharacters tell you?
But it was working because Imade interesting characters in
interesting situations.
Hank (18:04):
That's right.
Well, if your characters aretrue and they're actually acting
from the motivation of who theyare, then the choices they make
should be relevant.
They should be.
They should organically fallinto place and be true to what
that character would choose.
So, yeah, what does coachingwith you look like?
Milo (18:25):
It's something that I make sure that they know that we're
on the right path.
For there's a lot of coachesout there who say here's my
patented seven step process.
I take everybody through and Ihave to be really clear to
people that I will never havethat.
I don't want that.
I don't think it's healthy,Because if Chris comes to me
because he's bland and boringand nobody really wants to
(18:45):
listen to him but he's at leastfairly organized, and Tina comes
to me because she's lively andexciting and fun and never makes
a point and people say sherambles, why would I put them
through the same process?
They need different things.
So what coaching looks like isthe initial appointment.
I do two things.
(19:09):
I do a feedback interview withthem where I ask them a lot more
questions than most people everhave about what do they know,
what don't they know, what'sgetting in their way, what are
they trying to accomplish?
To make sure we're on the samepage through this assessment and
I've had a lot of people say tome I learned a lot about myself
doing the assessment.
I didn't expect to get that.
It's not Myers-Briggs or DISC,it's specifically on speaking
skills.
I designed it.
The second part I teachsomething called the four steps
(19:29):
to successful speech structure.
This is a fundamental ofeverything I teach about how to
organize a speech, and I'd liketo do it right up front because
if I don't, I end up wanting toreference to it and backpedaling
.
So in that first appointment,everyone, whether they decide to
continue with me or not, atleast leaves with the four steps
.
And so many people have said tome oh my gosh, I'm not going to
just stare at that blankMicrosoft Word page or the first
(19:51):
screen of PowerPoint.
I know how to start.
I'm going to work the foursteps At the end of that
appointment.
If they decide that we're not afit, or if I once in a while say
I don't think we're a fit, thenwe go our separate ways.
It's rare, maybe 5% of the time.
For the other 95%, they're moreexcited than ever and I say
great.
That's the moment that coachingactually starts and they always
have a homework assignment,because I don't want their
learning to be limited to thetime we have together.
(20:12):
And we'll come together andI'll ask how was the homework?
Was it easy, Was it hard?
Did you have fun with it?
Where did you get stuck?
They'll give me a lesson of theday.
And the lesson of the day willvary based on what I saw in the
homework and what their goalsare, and they can pick at that
point in time what packagethey're going to choose.
(20:35):
Are they going to pay each time?
Are they going to get a blockof three, five, 10, or 25 hours
with me so that we can worktogether to help them reach
their goals?
Hank (20:41):
Very, very cool.
You know I hate to cut you offhere, but this time is flying by
no-transcript.
Milo (21:06):
But, as we were talking about earlier, it's tricky to
find the second edition.
You might accidentally buy thefirst.
So the best thing you can do isgo to miloshapirocom and click
the books tab and that'll takeyou to the second edition from
2020 instead of the 2007 version.
Hank (21:21):
Right Now, what is the best way for our audience to
contact you if they'reinterested in getting your
coaching or anything else thatyou have to offer your photo
editing, which we never got achance to talk about.
Milo (21:36):
That's okay.
The best way to find all of itthe team building, the hiring me
to speak at a conference andthe coaching is all at
MiloShapirocom.
There is no C in Shapiro.
That's the one place people gowrong, miloshapirocom.
And if you were teased at thebeginning by, oh, I have some
photos that could stand to befixed up in one way or another.
Check out freshenyourphotocom.
(21:56):
You'll see all kinds ofexamples, and both websites have
contact pages to reach me.
Hank (22:01):
Very cool.
Well, thanks for being herewith us today, milo.
And to our listeners, tune Verycool.
Well, thanks for being herewith us today, milo.
And to our listeners, tune inevery Wednesday for the Home
Business Success Show here onbizradious.
Remember, you can achievesuccess, freedom and
independence in your ownhome-based business.
I've done it, milo has done it,and you can, too, see you again
(22:21):
next Wednesday here on BizRadio.
This is Hank Eder, wishing allof you a fabulous day of home
business success.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
Las Culturistas with Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang
Ding dong! Join your culture consultants, Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang, on an unforgettable journey into the beating heart of CULTURE. Alongside sizzling special guests, they GET INTO the hottest pop-culture moments of the day and the formative cultural experiences that turned them into Culturistas. Produced by the Big Money Players Network and iHeartRadio.