September 18, 2025 • 28 mins
Fit, Healthy & Happy Podcast
Welcome to the Fit, Healthy and Happy Podcast hosted by Josh and Kyle from Colossus...
Welcome to the Fit, Healthy and Happy Podcast hosted by Josh and Kyle from Colossus...
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to there is a Method to the Madness.
My name is Rob Maxwell and I'man exercise physiologist and
personal trainer.
I am the owner of Maxwell'sFitness Programs and I've been
in business since 1994.
The purpose of this podcast isto get to the real deal of what
really works and, mostimportantly, why things work.
(00:21):
Hence the name there is amethod to the madness.
Before I get to today's show, Iwant to thank Jonathan and Lynn
Gildan of the Gildan Group atRealty Pros.
They are committed to providingthe highest level of customer
service in home sales.
Why don't you give them a shoutand figure out what your home
is worth?
386-451-2412.
(00:44):
All right, we have a specialguest again today.
I've been talking a little bitabout this.
Kathy Blackman is going to talkabout her desire to help with
animals, and I think it's really, really cool.
And she came out to our MaxFitGames and was a beneficiary of a
(01:04):
little bit of money to help.
So welcome, kathy.
I'll let you introduce yourselfand introduce everything that
you do.
Speaker 2 (01:11):
Okay, Thank you, Rob.
This is really nice of you todo this.
Yeah, my name is Kathy Blackmanand I started a dog rescue and
pet food pantry almost 20 yearsago and Pet Food Pantry almost
20 years ago, and the Pet FoodPantry was what I was primarily
doing back then in 2008.
I'm sure you remember when thehousing crisis and people were
(01:34):
losing their homes.
So I was trying to help thepeople keep their pets at home
and giving them dog food, catfood, and, recognizing that the
shelters were just overwhelmedand there was just not enough
space, they were euthanizing inpretty high numbers and so I
(01:56):
still do that to this day I'mstill giving pet food.
But I started rescuing dogs acouple years into.
It started getting dogs.
People were asking me for helprehoming them and that just took
over everything and that isreally my primary focus now.
I have a lot of dogs that I'mjuggling.
(02:17):
I have a lot of dogs gettingadopted.
I average 500 a year and I'veexceeded 4,500 that I've rehomed
since I started gettinginvolved in it and I really do
enjoy the process of matchinggood people up.
I would say I match good peopleup with good dogs.
Speaker 1 (02:40):
That's pretty awesome .
So one thing that jumped out atme right away that I guess I
really didn't know about andit's interesting because you
were talking about the housingcrisis and how you wanted the
owners to hold on to their dogsand they needed to be able to
feed them issue now, like, eventhough the housing crisis is,
(03:03):
maybe I don't know if we can sayit's resolved there's still
issues, but is that still anissue?
Like, are people still having ahard?
Speaker 2 (03:13):
time being able to afford their dogs.
They are it really settled downfor the longest time and I
continued doing the pet foodpantry just out of sheer
momentum or you know, justapathy or I'm not sure what the
word, because I had dwindled itdown to people that I felt like
I was more of an enabler thandoing an actual benefit and
(03:36):
seriously considered stopping,because the point was to the pet
food pantry was to give peoplehelp until they could get back
on their feet.
And when you've got people thatyou know they had been coming
for years, faithfully, everysingle week, they're not going
to get back on their feet.
They have no interest of eventrying.
(03:56):
So that's where the you know,the enabling seemed to come in
and I wasn't sure what I wantedto do about it.
And the next thing it's justgot.
It got bad again.
You know, just quickly andalmost like overnight it got bad
and I'm just, my phone is justringing constantly.
I'm getting emails, peopleneeding food.
(04:18):
They are.
I try when I'm rehoming a dog,when I get the phone calls which
are constant because there'sdogs being surrendered in epic,
epic numbers right now and it istruly a crisis and the shelters
are full and everybody'spanicking and there's nowhere to
go with these dogs.
(04:38):
And so and by the way, I justdo dogs, I love cats and I
always give food at the pet foodpantry for cats, but I am a dog
rescue, just to be clear onthat.
And so the people call and myquestion to them is what can we
do to save this dog's home In alot of cases multiple dogs, you
(05:00):
know like what can we do?
So we get.
I just got one today.
The owner was arrested, he's injail.
You don't really talk to thosepeople, you know.
You just try to get the doghelp and move on.
Maybe they're moving and theyhave no interest in trying to
figure out where they're goingto go, that they can take their
dog.
Those people are checked outand you don't try with those
(05:22):
either.
You just take the dog and dothe best you can for the dog.
But if somebody is down ontheir luck, if somebody is
really struggling, and if I canhelp them, if I can say, like
what do I need to do so thatthis dog can stay in his home?
And sometimes it might be itneeds some kind of medical
attention and they just don'thave the money.
(05:45):
And when I'm talking to peopleI get a feel for the person and
if I'm feeling good about thatperson, I'll do even go that
route to say, all right, let'sget this dog treated, let's get
this dog the surgery it needs orwhatever.
And then at the the end youkeep your dog.
(06:07):
You know, because most of thetime the vets want the dog
surrendered if the owner's notgoing to pay and um, now
surrender to to me, okay, or toa rescue, you know so they make
like a bargain almostexactly.
You know they can't afford it.
So the say, well, then you haveto surrender the dog to rescue.
And then they'll call me oranother rescue and then I'll say
(06:29):
, okay, I just did that, in fact, with an Airedale.
It had chewed up something.
They don't even know what theheck they pulled out of it.
It was the second time it didit.
The dog was only one year oldand that is very expensive
surgery.
And the guy you know he did notwant the dog back.
If somebody really wants theirdog back, I'm going to work it
(06:52):
out with them, but in this casehe did not want the dog.
Speaker 1 (06:56):
And that's the second time you said.
Speaker 2 (06:58):
Second time and dog's only a year old.
Yeah, and the surgery was toughbecause there was so much scar
tissue from the first surgery.
Speaker 1 (07:06):
They don't know what it was.
Speaker 2 (07:07):
They pulled something leathery out of them, something
big Like a toy.
Yeah, they couldn't tell atthat point what it was, but
those things happen.
I know I'm kind of all over theplace here.
Speaker 1 (07:18):
No, you're good.
Speaker 2 (07:22):
It's so convoluted really.
I mean, every day is a gamechanger.
You never know what you'regoing to get when you answer the
phone.
Speaker 1 (07:28):
So how do you know?
Is it a gut feeling when it'stime to cut somebody, not the
animal, not the dog, but theperson?
Like, is it a gut feeling whenit's time to say, okay, I'm
enabling them, yes, yeah?
Speaker 2 (07:39):
Yes, very much so.
And then I just I just stophelping because I want that
person to to really try to helpthemselves and try to meet me
halfway and um, and I'll helpanybody anytime.
I really don't have a problem.
If I have it, I'm going toshare it, I'm going to help and
I really and truly want the dogsto stay home.
(08:01):
I don't, I don't want thesedogs and I don.
But if I have to take the dog,I'm going to do right by the dog
and I'm going to find this dogthe best home I possibly can.
And in most cases, a lot oftimes they're not current on
their vaccines.
Maybe they never spay orneutered them, maybe they're
heartworm positive.
(08:22):
Oh my gosh, gosh.
There's so many scenarios.
So you take care of all that,you pay for all that and that's.
Speaker 1 (08:29):
You have to pay for that, or do you yeah?
I do wow, yeah, so so are youum a 501 3c where you you get
some help somehow I am, I am,yeah, uh-huh and um, you know,
we do fundraisers, people inviteme me.
Speaker 2 (08:45):
You know the one you did.
Speaker 1 (08:46):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
Those help so much.
Speaker 1 (08:48):
But that's still going to be expensive for you,
though.
I mean, if you've got to takecare of the vaccines, do some of
the veterinarians help you outwith that at least.
Speaker 2 (08:56):
I have my network, I do.
I have the vets that I dealwith and they're not doing a lot
Rescue.
The future of rescue is onshaky ground because the vets
don't want to be discounting.
A lot of the veterinarianoffices are being bought out and
they're going corporate andonce they go corporate.
They're not helping a rescue,they don't care.
Speaker 1 (09:21):
That's just not what their mission is, not even local
anymore.
Speaker 2 (09:23):
Right, no, and you can tell the ones that were
bought out because they changedtheir whole practice.
They, you know, they really doLess personal.
Oh, much less personal, yeah,you know.
So there's vets, though thatthe ones that so for the most
part vets aren't taking onrescue.
If somebody says today, likeI'm going to be a rescue and I'm
(09:44):
going to start calling vets,well the vets are like no, no,
no.
I would have a hard time rightnow getting a new vet to say,
yes, I'll give a discount,because for the most part
they're very adamant, like no, Idon't discount for anybody.
So I'm happy with who I have.
(10:06):
Thankfully, I have great vetsand I've got them all over the
place.
I have them up in Jacksonville,orlando.
I have the local ones, ofcourse, and so, depending on
where the dog goes, if they get,you know, or where my foster is
, I can just call the vet that'sclose to them.
I try to keep it convenient foreverybody.
Speaker 1 (10:28):
You do an excellent job with that.
So when you said it's gottenbad again, like, is it like the
affordability thing?
And then people, the firstthing they go are the pets.
Maybe Is that what's happening.
Speaker 2 (10:40):
The pets are the first to go.
They are hanging on that bottomrail of the ladder, they're
just hanging on for dear lifeand they're the first to go
because it's like I can't affordthis.
And you know that's.
That's why I said you knowthat's when I talked to them,
like what can't you affordspecifically, is it a food issue
?
Is it, you know, like what isthe issue?
(11:01):
And let me, let me help Is help?
Is it the monthly flea medicineand all that?
How can I help you?
Because I can get my hands onall that stuff and help them
with whatever it takes to keepthe dog in their home.
You know that's the mostdesirable outcome, is that you
save the relationship.
Speaker 1 (11:21):
But if you have to move forward, then and that's
tough right now too, becauseadoptions are slow- so like I
mean I know it's a little bitoff the beaten path, but I mean
part of the issue might seemthat veterinarian care, I mean
it's gotten so expensive.
It has 10, maybe 15 years agoit not being bad you had your
(11:46):
yearly and you're like, oh youknow, a couple hundred bucks
maybe.
Now it's like when I go it'slike 500.
Yes and I don't know how somepeople do it.
Speaker 2 (11:55):
I don't either.
I know it's gotten crazy and Iknow that you know different
procedures, like a torn ACL,what it used to be compared to.
You know, because everythingrepeats Right.
There's only so many thingsthat can go wrong, and so you've
pretty much done it all.
You know I've done more than myshare of blockages.
(12:15):
I've done more than my share offractures, Paid for more than
you know, more dentals than Ican count.
Speaker 1 (12:22):
That's expensive.
Speaker 2 (12:22):
Yeah, and then the range.
That's the other thing.
The range of what a spaysurgery costs, like you'll go to
one.
I mean it's insane.
There's vets that are chargingbetween $1,000 and $1,500 for a
spay.
Speaker 1 (12:38):
That's crazy.
Speaker 2 (12:39):
It's insane, and it's the same surgery that you get
in another vet for $200, $300.
Speaker 1 (12:46):
Yeah, and I found I just had a my dog Hazel.
She had to have a lump removedand you know I do trust the vet
and like the vet, you know, andthey do tend to be a little bit
on the high end.
But I found that like where shewent before for this they were,
you know, quoting somethingdifferent and I'm like I'm going
to stick with the one, but itwas expensive.
(13:08):
So I imagine that's like reallya big part of why maybe people
feel like they have to surrendertheir and I would guess that,
more than food maybe I meanfood's expensive now too.
Speaker 2 (13:18):
Food's very expensive .
Well, look at how much the umthe hard guard next card crazy
money.
Well, look at how much the hardcard next card it's crazy money
.
Speaker 1 (13:26):
Five.
I think I just paid 300, Idon't know, it was 300 and
something plus.
They gave me the 50%, not 50%,50 bucks off thing.
You usually have like a rebateor something.
Yeah, yeah, and that's for sixmonths, and that's on top of
everything else I know.
So I don't know what we can doabout that, but I know what
you're doing is awesome withthat, so all right.
(13:49):
So then, getting back to whatyou're actually doing and trying
to help with fostering andeverything, so do you take the
animals yourself?
Speaker 2 (14:02):
I have fosters, I have a foster network, so I
don't have a facility.
Speaker 1 (14:06):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (14:06):
So, um, everybody is an approved foster and their
home is checked out, they'rechecked out, and so I've got my
list and, um, you know, and thensometimes they'll say, okay, I
need to take a break.
Others are just like, okay, I'mready for the next, ready for
the next.
They're just.
Others are just like, okay, I'mready for the next, ready for
the next.
There's some only want smalldogs.
(14:27):
Some of them have a lot of themhave cats, and that really
narrows down the prospectivedogs that can go to them.
And I deal with a lot of bigdogs and big dogs and cats
typically are not, unless theygrew up with the cat.
Speaker 1 (14:44):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (14:45):
Yeah, that's tough to introduce and it's a short-term
relationship.
You're just putting them in thehome until you can get them a
home, and I'll put more time andeffort into if the adopter has
a cat you know, since that'sgoing to be the dog's permanent
home, whereas I'm not going torisk a foster's cap on a dog.
(15:06):
That is just, I just don't know,you know, and a lot of times
you just you don't know and, um,you just can't, you cannot take
that chance.
But, like I said, with theadoption, you're doing
everything you can to make surethat this is going to be
successful.
So I'll send a trainer in.
(15:27):
We have tons of tips and adviceand help and we're very
hands-on, we're relationshippeople by the time the dog's
actually adopted and in the homewe're relationship people.
By the time the dog's actuallyadopted and in the home, we're
best friends.
And it's great because thenthey're sending me pictures of
the dog.
I'm getting these on Christmas.
(15:48):
I'm getting Merry Christmasesfrom half of Volusia County.
Speaker 1 (15:53):
Right, I mean your reputation, I mean, is
phenomenal.
Speaker 2 (15:57):
Oh, thank you.
Speaker 1 (15:57):
I knew of it long before we contacted you about
the games.
So, Sophie Circle, how did youcome up with that name?
I mean, it's kind of I couldguess, but how did you come up
with?
Speaker 2 (16:09):
that.
So Sophie was the dog thatchanged my perspective.
You know she was going to beeuthanized and I sort of
stumbled on her and, likeeverything that changes the
direction you're going in yourlife, if you look back on pretty
much anything, it was somethingthat happened unexpectedly.
(16:29):
For the most part, I thinkeveryone has that same story
that I did not go to get a dogthat day, but I left with a dog
and I could not wrap my brainaround the fact that they were
going to euthanize this dog.
I thought she was beautiful andshe had issues.
She had so many health issues,poor Sophie.
Sophie was a train wreck, butshe was so beautiful and she was
(16:54):
so sweet and I thought, oh, myGod, they're going to kill this
dog.
How is this possible?
And so then you start to dig alittle deeper and realize that
this isn't a good situation.
These dogs are being euthanizedright and left and there's a
lot and it's bad and I need tohelp.
(17:15):
And so I started the.
I started to help and I teamedup with.
I started meeting people thatwere involved in animal welfare
in the area, made some reallygood friends that are still, you
know, extremely close friends,and we all share the same
(17:37):
frustrations and you know, butit's after 20 years.
I mean I just have some strong,strong relationships from that
time of meeting up with thesepeople and met a lot of people.
I mean really just, and itdoesn't take long to get deep in
it.
I mean it just there's so muchneed.
But as far as circle, you knowthe, the universe, just
(17:59):
everything is pretty much acircle in life.
You know, everything sort ofcircles back and I just like the
concept of just being a circleof good that we're putting out
there.
Speaker 1 (18:11):
So what was it 2008?
You started that.
Speaker 2 (18:13):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (18:14):
Around, then Right around, the housing crisis the
first yes.
Speaker 2 (18:16):
And how many around?
The housing crisis the firstyes.
Speaker 1 (18:18):
And how many?
You said 4,500?
.
Speaker 2 (18:22):
More than 4,500,.
Speaker 1 (18:23):
yes, Now that's pretty awesome.
So what can people do to helpyou?
Like, do you do this byyourself?
I mean, I know you have yourpeople that help you foster, but
like do you do this by yourself?
Wow, that can't be easy.
Speaker 2 (18:39):
I have people I have.
I have people that there's likefor instance, I have somebody
who is invaluable to me and I'llsay to her I'll give you the.
For instance, I have a girl inMiami.
She messaged me I get a lot ofdogs out of Miami, believe it or
not.
Speaker 1 (19:02):
They're in such prices.
Speaker 2 (19:04):
So the girl called me , messaged me yesterday Please,
please help.
You're my last hope.
This dog just wandered up intomy yard.
It's been raining.
I don't know what to do.
I'm out of options.
I've asked everybody.
Everybody's telling me to callyou.
(19:40):
So I said, well, I'm going todo what I can to help you.
And so I've been working withher and I'm getting the dog.
I mean, it's happening.
I can just send her a messagesaying we're getting this dog
from Miami.
I need a ride for her.
She's coming on whatever dayand here's where she's going.
She likes me to send her apicture of the dog and I can
walk on, I can move on with myday, I can walk on, I can move
on with my day.
And the next thing, you know,it's all set, the dog has a ride
, she can get a pilot to fly thedog.
(20:04):
You wouldn't believe what shedoes.
That's awesome.
Anywhere, everywhere.
I'll say even sometimes likewell, like, I need to get a
crate up to Ormond by the sea.
Right, she'll put something onFacebook.
You know, we need a cratepicked up at Kathy's and taken
(20:26):
to Ormond by the sea.
And then you know, she justtags everybody and then the
people start, you know.
Speaker 1 (20:33):
I can Facebook.
Speaker 2 (20:34):
Yeah, I can do it if.
If it's this time or I can dothis or I can do that, and then
somebody will say, yeah, I'll doit.
And then she'll just message meSo-and-so is going to be there
at 3 o'clock to pick the crateup.
Okay, done.
Something is.
You can't believe all thoselittle details, and this is all
day long, and she is masterfulat this.
(20:56):
I mean really.
And so there's that.
And then the Fosters.
You know that whole network.
Speaker 1 (21:02):
How many Ds?
Speaker 2 (21:03):
50 plus, and but then there's all.
You have the promotions and theevents.
You know you've got to get allthat stuff arranged.
We're working right now on onethat we do in February, because
these are a lot of work.
Speaker 1 (21:20):
And you're talking about a mutual friend of ours I
think said she was helping youput it on a 5K.
Maybe Is that.
Speaker 2 (21:28):
Oh, Joanne.
Speaker 1 (21:28):
Yes, yes, yes, so that'll be.
Is that a good way to help youas well?
Oh, an amazing way, yeah.
Speaker 2 (21:35):
Yes, her husband was, was one who had the idea.
He approached me about it.
And joanne, I love joanne.
Yeah, yeah, she fostered, butthen she had to stop because her
dog said no she's got a lot ofcats now too, yeah so how else
can, um, what's the best waylisteners could help, like, do
you take donations?
Speaker 1 (21:57):
yes, uh, so, as we wrap up, maybe give your address
, or however you want to do that, to contact you, um, and then
any other way that people canassist you, like maybe volunteer
to be more fosters, volunteerto be drivers, I mean you know,
whatever you think, and thenkind of tell everybody how to
(22:18):
reach you.
That would be great.
Speaker 2 (22:20):
Okay, so our website is sophiecircleorg.
Speaker 1 (22:24):
And I will put that in the notes, by the way.
Oh, thank you, thank you.
Speaker 2 (22:26):
Okay, and then our website.
I mean our Facebook page isSophie Circle Dog Rescue and
when you go to our website youcan go right into Pet Finder,
where the dogs are.
And when you go to our website,that's where our foster
applications are, our adoptionapplications, our surrender
(22:47):
forms are there.
If you're surrendering your dog, a lot of people just go ahead
and fill out a surrender formwithout calling or saying
anything.
That doesn't really do themmuch good.
If you're not going to fightfor my attention, you're not
going to get my attentionbecause I'm too inundated, I'm
too swamped, you know, right, um, so that you have to Call me
and, you know, wave your armsaround and tell me how desperate
(23:10):
you are for me to go into thatfile and start taking it around
and finding your surrender form.
But the surrender forms are onthere and in there, and so
that's a pretty good workhorse.
The website.
Speaker 1 (23:24):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (23:24):
Because you know also the donations are.
It's set up for donations onthere also.
Speaker 1 (23:30):
Is there a link, like for a Venmo or like just okay?
Speaker 2 (23:33):
Yeah, Venmo Zelle, there's one of those.
They have it set up withLinktree.
Speaker 1 (23:37):
Okay, yeah.
Speaker 2 (23:38):
And so that's good.
And then, yeah, and my phonenumber is pretty much everywhere
.
I don't hide my number.
I'm not one of those rescueswhere there's it's impossible to
find out how to get a hold ofme.
I am pretty much.
I figure, if you're going to doit, you may as well be
(23:59):
accessible to the people,because I talk to desperate
people and I don't want thembecoming more frustrated and
desperate trying to tracksomebody down who will actually
talk to them, because sometimesit's just a matter of talking to
them.
Speaker 1 (24:09):
Right.
Speaker 2 (24:10):
And you know setting, helping them, giving them some
good advice or some otheroptions.
Speaker 1 (24:16):
So, as I did want to ask one more thing I know I'm
running out of time here, but Iwas thinking about it and, as
you just said that I just youknow we're coming up on
hurricane season.
Speaker 2 (24:27):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (24:28):
What is your advice?
Because I just see sometimesdogs get abandoned.
Yeah, what's the best thingpeople can do here in Central
Florida or wherever so thisdoesn't happen?
Speaker 2 (24:41):
Well, I always tell people make sure your dog is
crate trained.
Even if you don't use a crate,make sure your dog is actually
crate trained, Because the lastplace in the whole world you
want to be trying to get yourdog acclimated to a crate is at
a brand new shelter, with peoplepanicked and swarming around
because the shelters will notlet you in if your dog is not in
(25:04):
a crate.
Speaker 1 (25:05):
Do they have to have their own crate?
Yes, Okay so everybody shouldhave a crate.
Speaker 2 (25:10):
They should, because it's Florida, I mean, we're a
natural disaster state, so havea crate, have it at the ready,
and people call me I loan themout.
I'm happy to loan out crates,you know.
You just call me up and tell mehey, I'm as panicked for
everybody as the next one,believe me.
Speaker 1 (25:29):
See, I'm so glad I asked, because I don't think
people know that.
Speaker 2 (25:33):
I don't think they think about it until and then
there's like yeah but you needthat dog needs to go into that
crate quietly and calm down andnot be hysterical.
And any single dog I don't knowof a dog that's not going to be
hysterical if it's never beenin a crate before.
They'll chew their way out,they will yes yeah.
Speaker 1 (25:54):
Well, that's awesome.
Do you have any final words forthe listeners out there?
I want to encourage everybodyto go to the website.
Speaker 2 (26:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (26:02):
Donate where you can See if there's any information
on there to volunteer, if you'reable Get a crate for the dogs,
for the hurricanes or any othernatural disasters.
Speaker 2 (26:13):
Get them used to it, acclimate them to it and then
fold it up and put it somewherewhere it's handy and spay and
neuter your pets.
There's an overpopulationproblem and it's a serious,
serious problem.
Speaker 1 (26:25):
I noticed that at the MaxFit Games.
When afterwards that's whateverybody yelled, that seems to
be the big thing, spay andneuter gangs.
When afterwards that's whateverybody yelled.
Speaker 2 (26:31):
That seems to be the big thing Spray and neuter Spray
, and neuter yeah, it seems Isthat.
Speaker 1 (26:36):
Can people do that for free anywhere, or is that
something they?
Speaker 2 (26:40):
have to pay.
But there's clinics where youcan get it for less money.
You know there are they stoppeddoing it for free.
But there are there's options.
There's low-cost options outthere.
But you know the vets are, it'spricey, it is a pricey
procedure.
But we do not need more animals, we need a break.
Speaker 1 (27:00):
Yeah, I mean, and you see these abandoned animals and
it's just so sad.
It is sad I mean nobody wantsto see?
At least I don't see lifesuffering.
No, I don't see life suffering.
Speaker 2 (27:09):
No.
Speaker 1 (27:09):
All right.
Well, I thank you so much forcoming on.
We've been planning this for alittle bit and I just got behind
, but now we got it in and Ireally appreciate you taking
your time to come out andeducating my listeners on good
animal welfare.
Speaker 2 (27:24):
Well, I appreciate you, rob.
Thank you so much, all right.
Speaker 1 (27:27):
Bye-bye.
Thank you for listening totoday's program.
I ask you to please follow theshow wherever you get your
podcasts and please selectautomatic download, because that
really helps the show.
Now I want to thank OverheadDoor of Daytona Beach, the
area's premier garage doorcompany.
(27:48):
They have the best product.
They have the best service.
I personally vouch for Jeff andZach Hawk, the owners.
They are great people with agreat company.
If you have any garage doorneeds, please give them a shout
at 386-222-3165.
Welcome to there is a Method to the Madness.
My name is Rob Maxwell and I'man exercise physiologist and
personal trainer.
I am the owner of Maxwell'sFitness Programs and I've been
in business since 1994.
The purpose of this podcast isto get to the real deal of what
really works and, mostimportantly, why things work.
(00:21):
Hence the name there is amethod to the madness.
Before I get to today's show, Iwant to thank Jonathan and Lynn
Gildan of the Gildan Group atRealty Pros.
They are committed to providingthe highest level of customer
service in home sales.
Why don't you give them a shoutand figure out what your home
is worth?
386-451-2412.
(00:44):
All right, we have a specialguest again today.
I've been talking a little bitabout this.
Kathy Blackman is going to talkabout her desire to help with
animals, and I think it's really, really cool.
And she came out to our MaxFitGames and was a beneficiary of a
(01:04):
little bit of money to help.
So welcome, kathy.
I'll let you introduce yourselfand introduce everything that
you do.
Speaker 2 (01:11):
Okay, Thank you, Rob.
This is really nice of you todo this.
Yeah, my name is Kathy Blackmanand I started a dog rescue and
pet food pantry almost 20 yearsago and Pet Food Pantry almost
20 years ago, and the Pet FoodPantry was what I was primarily
doing back then in 2008.
I'm sure you remember when thehousing crisis and people were
(01:34):
losing their homes.
So I was trying to help thepeople keep their pets at home
and giving them dog food, catfood, and, recognizing that the
shelters were just overwhelmedand there was just not enough
space, they were euthanizing inpretty high numbers and so I
(01:56):
still do that to this day I'mstill giving pet food.
But I started rescuing dogs acouple years into.
It started getting dogs.
People were asking me for helprehoming them and that just took
over everything and that isreally my primary focus now.
I have a lot of dogs that I'mjuggling.
(02:17):
I have a lot of dogs gettingadopted.
I average 500 a year and I'veexceeded 4,500 that I've rehomed
since I started gettinginvolved in it and I really do
enjoy the process of matchinggood people up.
I would say I match good peopleup with good dogs.
Speaker 1 (02:40):
That's pretty awesome .
So one thing that jumped out atme right away that I guess I
really didn't know about andit's interesting because you
were talking about the housingcrisis and how you wanted the
owners to hold on to their dogsand they needed to be able to
feed them issue now, like, eventhough the housing crisis is,
(03:03):
maybe I don't know if we can sayit's resolved there's still
issues, but is that still anissue?
Like, are people still having ahard?
Speaker 2 (03:13):
time being able to afford their dogs.
They are it really settled downfor the longest time and I
continued doing the pet foodpantry just out of sheer
momentum or you know, justapathy or I'm not sure what the
word, because I had dwindled itdown to people that I felt like
I was more of an enabler thandoing an actual benefit and
(03:36):
seriously considered stopping,because the point was to the pet
food pantry was to give peoplehelp until they could get back
on their feet.
And when you've got people thatyou know they had been coming
for years, faithfully, everysingle week, they're not going
to get back on their feet.
They have no interest of eventrying.
(03:56):
So that's where the you know,the enabling seemed to come in
and I wasn't sure what I wantedto do about it.
And the next thing it's justgot.
It got bad again.
You know, just quickly andalmost like overnight it got bad
and I'm just, my phone is justringing constantly.
I'm getting emails, peopleneeding food.
(04:18):
They are.
I try when I'm rehoming a dog,when I get the phone calls which
are constant because there'sdogs being surrendered in epic,
epic numbers right now and it istruly a crisis and the shelters
are full and everybody'spanicking and there's nowhere to
go with these dogs.
(04:38):
And so and by the way, I justdo dogs, I love cats and I
always give food at the pet foodpantry for cats, but I am a dog
rescue, just to be clear onthat.
And so the people call and myquestion to them is what can we
do to save this dog's home In alot of cases multiple dogs, you
(05:00):
know like what can we do?
So we get.
I just got one today.
The owner was arrested, he's injail.
You don't really talk to thosepeople, you know.
You just try to get the doghelp and move on.
Maybe they're moving and theyhave no interest in trying to
figure out where they're goingto go, that they can take their
dog.
Those people are checked outand you don't try with those
(05:22):
either.
You just take the dog and dothe best you can for the dog.
But if somebody is down ontheir luck, if somebody is
really struggling, and if I canhelp them, if I can say, like
what do I need to do so thatthis dog can stay in his home?
And sometimes it might be itneeds some kind of medical
attention and they just don'thave the money.
(05:45):
And when I'm talking to peopleI get a feel for the person and
if I'm feeling good about thatperson, I'll do even go that
route to say, all right, let'sget this dog treated, let's get
this dog the surgery it needs orwhatever.
And then at the the end youkeep your dog.
(06:07):
You know, because most of thetime the vets want the dog
surrendered if the owner's notgoing to pay and um, now
surrender to to me, okay, or toa rescue, you know so they make
like a bargain almostexactly.
You know they can't afford it.
So the say, well, then you haveto surrender the dog to rescue.
And then they'll call me oranother rescue and then I'll say
(06:29):
, okay, I just did that, in fact, with an Airedale.
It had chewed up something.
They don't even know what theheck they pulled out of it.
It was the second time it didit.
The dog was only one year oldand that is very expensive
surgery.
And the guy you know he did notwant the dog back.
If somebody really wants theirdog back, I'm going to work it
(06:52):
out with them, but in this casehe did not want the dog.
Speaker 1 (06:56):
And that's the second time you said.
Speaker 2 (06:58):
Second time and dog's only a year old.
Yeah, and the surgery was toughbecause there was so much scar
tissue from the first surgery.
Speaker 1 (07:06):
They don't know what it was.
Speaker 2 (07:07):
They pulled something leathery out of them, something
big Like a toy.
Yeah, they couldn't tell atthat point what it was, but
those things happen.
I know I'm kind of all over theplace here.
Speaker 1 (07:18):
No, you're good.
Speaker 2 (07:22):
It's so convoluted really.
I mean, every day is a gamechanger.
You never know what you'regoing to get when you answer the
phone.
Speaker 1 (07:28):
So how do you know?
Is it a gut feeling when it'stime to cut somebody, not the
animal, not the dog, but theperson?
Like, is it a gut feeling whenit's time to say, okay, I'm
enabling them, yes, yeah?
Speaker 2 (07:39):
Yes, very much so.
And then I just I just stophelping because I want that
person to to really try to helpthemselves and try to meet me
halfway and um, and I'll helpanybody anytime.
I really don't have a problem.
If I have it, I'm going toshare it, I'm going to help and
I really and truly want the dogsto stay home.
(08:01):
I don't, I don't want thesedogs and I don.
But if I have to take the dog,I'm going to do right by the dog
and I'm going to find this dogthe best home I possibly can.
And in most cases, a lot oftimes they're not current on
their vaccines.
Maybe they never spay orneutered them, maybe they're
heartworm positive.
(08:22):
Oh my gosh, gosh.
There's so many scenarios.
So you take care of all that,you pay for all that and that's.
Speaker 1 (08:29):
You have to pay for that, or do you yeah?
I do wow, yeah, so so are youum a 501 3c where you you get
some help somehow I am, I am,yeah, uh-huh and um, you know,
we do fundraisers, people inviteme me.
Speaker 2 (08:45):
You know the one you did.
Speaker 1 (08:46):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
Those help so much.
Speaker 1 (08:48):
But that's still going to be expensive for you,
though.
I mean, if you've got to takecare of the vaccines, do some of
the veterinarians help you outwith that at least.
Speaker 2 (08:56):
I have my network, I do.
I have the vets that I dealwith and they're not doing a lot
Rescue.
The future of rescue is onshaky ground because the vets
don't want to be discounting.
A lot of the veterinarianoffices are being bought out and
they're going corporate andonce they go corporate.
They're not helping a rescue,they don't care.
Speaker 1 (09:21):
That's just not what their mission is, not even local
anymore.
Speaker 2 (09:23):
Right, no, and you can tell the ones that were
bought out because they changedtheir whole practice.
They, you know, they really doLess personal.
Oh, much less personal, yeah,you know.
So there's vets, though thatthe ones that so for the most
part vets aren't taking onrescue.
If somebody says today, likeI'm going to be a rescue and I'm
(09:44):
going to start calling vets,well the vets are like no, no,
no.
I would have a hard time rightnow getting a new vet to say,
yes, I'll give a discount,because for the most part
they're very adamant, like no, Idon't discount for anybody.
So I'm happy with who I have.
(10:06):
Thankfully, I have great vetsand I've got them all over the
place.
I have them up in Jacksonville,orlando.
I have the local ones, ofcourse, and so, depending on
where the dog goes, if they get,you know, or where my foster is
, I can just call the vet that'sclose to them.
I try to keep it convenient foreverybody.
Speaker 1 (10:28):
You do an excellent job with that.
So when you said it's gottenbad again, like, is it like the
affordability thing?
And then people, the firstthing they go are the pets.
Maybe Is that what's happening.
Speaker 2 (10:40):
The pets are the first to go.
They are hanging on that bottomrail of the ladder, they're
just hanging on for dear lifeand they're the first to go
because it's like I can't affordthis.
And you know that's.
That's why I said you knowthat's when I talked to them,
like what can't you affordspecifically, is it a food issue
?
Is it, you know, like what isthe issue?
(11:01):
And let me, let me help Is help?
Is it the monthly flea medicineand all that?
How can I help you?
Because I can get my hands onall that stuff and help them
with whatever it takes to keepthe dog in their home.
You know that's the mostdesirable outcome, is that you
save the relationship.
Speaker 1 (11:21):
But if you have to move forward, then and that's
tough right now too, becauseadoptions are slow- so like I
mean I know it's a little bitoff the beaten path, but I mean
part of the issue might seemthat veterinarian care, I mean
it's gotten so expensive.
It has 10, maybe 15 years agoit not being bad you had your
(11:46):
yearly and you're like, oh youknow, a couple hundred bucks
maybe.
Now it's like when I go it'slike 500.
Yes and I don't know how somepeople do it.
Speaker 2 (11:55):
I don't either.
I know it's gotten crazy and Iknow that you know different
procedures, like a torn ACL,what it used to be compared to.
You know, because everythingrepeats Right.
There's only so many thingsthat can go wrong, and so you've
pretty much done it all.
You know I've done more than myshare of blockages.
(12:15):
I've done more than my share offractures, Paid for more than
you know, more dentals than Ican count.
Speaker 1 (12:22):
That's expensive.
Speaker 2 (12:22):
Yeah, and then the range.
That's the other thing.
The range of what a spaysurgery costs, like you'll go to
one.
I mean it's insane.
There's vets that are chargingbetween $1,000 and $1,500 for a
spay.
Speaker 1 (12:38):
That's crazy.
Speaker 2 (12:39):
It's insane, and it's the same surgery that you get
in another vet for $200, $300.
Speaker 1 (12:46):
Yeah, and I found I just had a my dog Hazel.
She had to have a lump removedand you know I do trust the vet
and like the vet, you know, andthey do tend to be a little bit
on the high end.
But I found that like where shewent before for this they were,
you know, quoting somethingdifferent and I'm like I'm going
to stick with the one, but itwas expensive.
(13:08):
So I imagine that's like reallya big part of why maybe people
feel like they have to surrendertheir and I would guess that,
more than food maybe I meanfood's expensive now too.
Speaker 2 (13:18):
Food's very expensive .
Well, look at how much the umthe hard guard next card crazy
money.
Well, look at how much the hardcard next card it's crazy money
.
Speaker 1 (13:26):
Five.
I think I just paid 300, Idon't know, it was 300 and
something plus.
They gave me the 50%, not 50%,50 bucks off thing.
You usually have like a rebateor something.
Yeah, yeah, and that's for sixmonths, and that's on top of
everything else I know.
So I don't know what we can doabout that, but I know what
you're doing is awesome withthat, so all right.
(13:49):
So then, getting back to whatyou're actually doing and trying
to help with fostering andeverything, so do you take the
animals yourself?
Speaker 2 (14:02):
I have fosters, I have a foster network, so I
don't have a facility.
Speaker 1 (14:06):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (14:06):
So, um, everybody is an approved foster and their
home is checked out, they'rechecked out, and so I've got my
list and, um, you know, and thensometimes they'll say, okay, I
need to take a break.
Others are just like, okay, I'mready for the next, ready for
the next.
They're just.
Others are just like, okay, I'mready for the next, ready for
the next.
There's some only want smalldogs.
(14:27):
Some of them have a lot of themhave cats, and that really
narrows down the prospectivedogs that can go to them.
And I deal with a lot of bigdogs and big dogs and cats
typically are not, unless theygrew up with the cat.
Speaker 1 (14:44):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (14:45):
Yeah, that's tough to introduce and it's a short-term
relationship.
You're just putting them in thehome until you can get them a
home, and I'll put more time andeffort into if the adopter has
a cat you know, since that'sgoing to be the dog's permanent
home, whereas I'm not going torisk a foster's cap on a dog.
(15:06):
That is just, I just don't know,you know, and a lot of times
you just you don't know and, um,you just can't, you cannot take
that chance.
But, like I said, with theadoption, you're doing
everything you can to make surethat this is going to be
successful.
So I'll send a trainer in.
(15:27):
We have tons of tips and adviceand help and we're very
hands-on, we're relationshippeople by the time the dog's
actually adopted and in the homewe're relationship people.
By the time the dog's actuallyadopted and in the home, we're
best friends.
And it's great because thenthey're sending me pictures of
the dog.
I'm getting these on Christmas.
(15:48):
I'm getting Merry Christmasesfrom half of Volusia County.
Speaker 1 (15:53):
Right, I mean your reputation, I mean, is
phenomenal.
Speaker 2 (15:57):
Oh, thank you.
Speaker 1 (15:57):
I knew of it long before we contacted you about
the games.
So, Sophie Circle, how did youcome up with that name?
I mean, it's kind of I couldguess, but how did you come up
with?
Speaker 2 (16:09):
that.
So Sophie was the dog thatchanged my perspective.
You know she was going to beeuthanized and I sort of
stumbled on her and, likeeverything that changes the
direction you're going in yourlife, if you look back on pretty
much anything, it was somethingthat happened unexpectedly.
(16:29):
For the most part, I thinkeveryone has that same story
that I did not go to get a dogthat day, but I left with a dog
and I could not wrap my brainaround the fact that they were
going to euthanize this dog.
I thought she was beautiful andshe had issues.
She had so many health issues,poor Sophie.
Sophie was a train wreck, butshe was so beautiful and she was
(16:54):
so sweet and I thought, oh, myGod, they're going to kill this
dog.
How is this possible?
And so then you start to dig alittle deeper and realize that
this isn't a good situation.
These dogs are being euthanizedright and left and there's a
lot and it's bad and I need tohelp.
(17:15):
And so I started the.
I started to help and I teamedup with.
I started meeting people thatwere involved in animal welfare
in the area, made some reallygood friends that are still, you
know, extremely close friends,and we all share the same
(17:37):
frustrations and you know, butit's after 20 years.
I mean I just have some strong,strong relationships from that
time of meeting up with thesepeople and met a lot of people.
I mean really just, and itdoesn't take long to get deep in
it.
I mean it just there's so muchneed.
But as far as circle, you knowthe, the universe, just
(17:59):
everything is pretty much acircle in life.
You know, everything sort ofcircles back and I just like the
concept of just being a circleof good that we're putting out
there.
Speaker 1 (18:11):
So what was it 2008?
You started that.
Speaker 2 (18:13):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (18:14):
Around, then Right around, the housing crisis the
first yes.
Speaker 2 (18:16):
And how many around?
The housing crisis the firstyes.
Speaker 1 (18:18):
And how many?
You said 4,500?
.
Speaker 2 (18:22):
More than 4,500,.
Speaker 1 (18:23):
yes, Now that's pretty awesome.
So what can people do to helpyou?
Like, do you do this byyourself?
I mean, I know you have yourpeople that help you foster, but
like do you do this by yourself?
Wow, that can't be easy.
Speaker 2 (18:39):
I have people I have.
I have people that there's likefor instance, I have somebody
who is invaluable to me and I'llsay to her I'll give you the.
For instance, I have a girl inMiami.
She messaged me I get a lot ofdogs out of Miami, believe it or
not.
Speaker 1 (19:02):
They're in such prices.
Speaker 2 (19:04):
So the girl called me , messaged me yesterday Please,
please help.
You're my last hope.
This dog just wandered up intomy yard.
It's been raining.
I don't know what to do.
I'm out of options.
I've asked everybody.
Everybody's telling me to callyou.
(19:40):
So I said, well, I'm going todo what I can to help you.
And so I've been working withher and I'm getting the dog.
I mean, it's happening.
I can just send her a messagesaying we're getting this dog
from Miami.
I need a ride for her.
She's coming on whatever dayand here's where she's going.
She likes me to send her apicture of the dog and I can
walk on, I can move on with myday, I can walk on, I can move
on with my day.
And the next thing, you know,it's all set, the dog has a ride
, she can get a pilot to fly thedog.
(20:04):
You wouldn't believe what shedoes.
That's awesome.
Anywhere, everywhere.
I'll say even sometimes likewell, like, I need to get a
crate up to Ormond by the sea.
Right, she'll put something onFacebook.
You know, we need a cratepicked up at Kathy's and taken
(20:26):
to Ormond by the sea.
And then you know, she justtags everybody and then the
people start, you know.
Speaker 1 (20:33):
I can Facebook.
Speaker 2 (20:34):
Yeah, I can do it if.
If it's this time or I can dothis or I can do that, and then
somebody will say, yeah, I'll doit.
And then she'll just message meSo-and-so is going to be there
at 3 o'clock to pick the crateup.
Okay, done.
Something is.
You can't believe all thoselittle details, and this is all
day long, and she is masterfulat this.
(20:56):
I mean really.
And so there's that.
And then the Fosters.
You know that whole network.
Speaker 1 (21:02):
How many Ds?
Speaker 2 (21:03):
50 plus, and but then there's all.
You have the promotions and theevents.
You know you've got to get allthat stuff arranged.
We're working right now on onethat we do in February, because
these are a lot of work.
Speaker 1 (21:20):
And you're talking about a mutual friend of ours I
think said she was helping youput it on a 5K.
Maybe Is that.
Speaker 2 (21:28):
Oh, Joanne.
Speaker 1 (21:28):
Yes, yes, yes, so that'll be.
Is that a good way to help youas well?
Oh, an amazing way, yeah.
Speaker 2 (21:35):
Yes, her husband was, was one who had the idea.
He approached me about it.
And joanne, I love joanne.
Yeah, yeah, she fostered, butthen she had to stop because her
dog said no she's got a lot ofcats now too, yeah so how else
can, um, what's the best waylisteners could help, like, do
you take donations?
Speaker 1 (21:57):
yes, uh, so, as we wrap up, maybe give your address
, or however you want to do that, to contact you, um, and then
any other way that people canassist you, like maybe volunteer
to be more fosters, volunteerto be drivers, I mean you know,
whatever you think, and thenkind of tell everybody how to
(22:18):
reach you.
That would be great.
Speaker 2 (22:20):
Okay, so our website is sophiecircleorg.
Speaker 1 (22:24):
And I will put that in the notes, by the way.
Oh, thank you, thank you.
Speaker 2 (22:26):
Okay, and then our website.
I mean our Facebook page isSophie Circle Dog Rescue and
when you go to our website youcan go right into Pet Finder,
where the dogs are.
And when you go to our website,that's where our foster
applications are, our adoptionapplications, our surrender
(22:47):
forms are there.
If you're surrendering your dog, a lot of people just go ahead
and fill out a surrender formwithout calling or saying
anything.
That doesn't really do themmuch good.
If you're not going to fightfor my attention, you're not
going to get my attentionbecause I'm too inundated, I'm
too swamped, you know, right, um, so that you have to Call me
and, you know, wave your armsaround and tell me how desperate
(23:10):
you are for me to go into thatfile and start taking it around
and finding your surrender form.
But the surrender forms are onthere and in there, and so
that's a pretty good workhorse.
The website.
Speaker 1 (23:24):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (23:24):
Because you know also the donations are.
It's set up for donations onthere also.
Speaker 1 (23:30):
Is there a link, like for a Venmo or like just okay?
Speaker 2 (23:33):
Yeah, Venmo Zelle, there's one of those.
They have it set up withLinktree.
Speaker 1 (23:37):
Okay, yeah.
Speaker 2 (23:38):
And so that's good.
And then, yeah, and my phonenumber is pretty much everywhere
.
I don't hide my number.
I'm not one of those rescueswhere there's it's impossible to
find out how to get a hold ofme.
I am pretty much.
I figure, if you're going to doit, you may as well be
(23:59):
accessible to the people,because I talk to desperate
people and I don't want thembecoming more frustrated and
desperate trying to tracksomebody down who will actually
talk to them, because sometimesit's just a matter of talking to
them.
Speaker 1 (24:09):
Right.
Speaker 2 (24:10):
And you know setting, helping them, giving them some
good advice or some otheroptions.
Speaker 1 (24:16):
So, as I did want to ask one more thing I know I'm
running out of time here, but Iwas thinking about it and, as
you just said that I just youknow we're coming up on
hurricane season.
Speaker 2 (24:27):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (24:28):
What is your advice?
Because I just see sometimesdogs get abandoned.
Yeah, what's the best thingpeople can do here in Central
Florida or wherever so thisdoesn't happen?
Speaker 2 (24:41):
Well, I always tell people make sure your dog is
crate trained.
Even if you don't use a crate,make sure your dog is actually
crate trained, Because the lastplace in the whole world you
want to be trying to get yourdog acclimated to a crate is at
a brand new shelter, with peoplepanicked and swarming around
because the shelters will notlet you in if your dog is not in
(25:04):
a crate.
Speaker 1 (25:05):
Do they have to have their own crate?
Yes, Okay so everybody shouldhave a crate.
Speaker 2 (25:10):
They should, because it's Florida, I mean, we're a
natural disaster state, so havea crate, have it at the ready,
and people call me I loan themout.
I'm happy to loan out crates,you know.
You just call me up and tell mehey, I'm as panicked for
everybody as the next one,believe me.
Speaker 1 (25:29):
See, I'm so glad I asked, because I don't think
people know that.
Speaker 2 (25:33):
I don't think they think about it until and then
there's like yeah but you needthat dog needs to go into that
crate quietly and calm down andnot be hysterical.
And any single dog I don't knowof a dog that's not going to be
hysterical if it's never beenin a crate before.
They'll chew their way out,they will yes yeah.
Speaker 1 (25:54):
Well, that's awesome.
Do you have any final words forthe listeners out there?
I want to encourage everybodyto go to the website.
Speaker 2 (26:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (26:02):
Donate where you can See if there's any information
on there to volunteer, if you'reable Get a crate for the dogs,
for the hurricanes or any othernatural disasters.
Speaker 2 (26:13):
Get them used to it, acclimate them to it and then
fold it up and put it somewherewhere it's handy and spay and
neuter your pets.
There's an overpopulationproblem and it's a serious,
serious problem.
Speaker 1 (26:25):
I noticed that at the MaxFit Games.
When afterwards that's whateverybody yelled, that seems to
be the big thing, spay andneuter gangs.
When afterwards that's whateverybody yelled.
Speaker 2 (26:31):
That seems to be the big thing Spray and neuter Spray
, and neuter yeah, it seems Isthat.
Speaker 1 (26:36):
Can people do that for free anywhere, or is that
something they?
Speaker 2 (26:40):
have to pay.
But there's clinics where youcan get it for less money.
You know there are they stoppeddoing it for free.
But there are there's options.
There's low-cost options outthere.
But you know the vets are, it'spricey, it is a pricey
procedure.
But we do not need more animals, we need a break.
Speaker 1 (27:00):
Yeah, I mean, and you see these abandoned animals and
it's just so sad.
It is sad I mean nobody wantsto see?
At least I don't see lifesuffering.
No, I don't see life suffering.
Speaker 2 (27:09):
No.
Speaker 1 (27:09):
All right.
Well, I thank you so much forcoming on.
We've been planning this for alittle bit and I just got behind
, but now we got it in and Ireally appreciate you taking
your time to come out andeducating my listeners on good
animal welfare.
Speaker 2 (27:24):
Well, I appreciate you, rob.
Thank you so much, all right.
Speaker 1 (27:27):
Bye-bye.
Thank you for listening totoday's program.
I ask you to please follow theshow wherever you get your
podcasts and please selectautomatic download, because that
really helps the show.
Now I want to thank OverheadDoor of Daytona Beach, the
area's premier garage doorcompany.
(27:48):
They have the best product.
They have the best service.
I personally vouch for Jeff andZach Hawk, the owners.
They are great people with agreat company.
If you have any garage doorneeds, please give them a shout
at 386-222-3165.
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