August 12, 2024 • 45 mins
In this episode, I speak with Julie Davitz, Founder and CEO of Plus Media Solutions to explore how purpose-driven organizations can turn awareness of an issue into measurable action. As the media landscape becomes increasingly fragmented, and with intense competition for people’s attention, it’s more important than ever to engage audiences at moments when they are most passionate about a cause and move them to take action.
Join us as we explore how Plus Media Solutions is pioneering a new approach to this challenge. Discover how engaging storytelling and dynamic content and experiences can be timed in such a way that awareness and inspiration is transformed into deeper connections with organizations and their missions, and ultimately into action. Whether you're with a nonprofit organization or a purpose-driven brand, this episode will provide you with fresh insights into how to engage your audience in today’s media environment.
Learn more about Plus Media Solutions: https://www.plusmedia.solutions/
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Episode Transcript
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Intro (00:06):
You're listening to.
There's a Lesson in here,Somewhere, a podcast featuring
compelling conversations withexceptional people.
Whether it's an inspirationalachievement, a hardship overcome
or simply a unique perspective,these are stories we can all
learn from.
Here are your hosts, JamieSerino and Carlos Arcila.
Jamie (00:29):
Hello and welcome.
This is.
There's a Lesson in hereSomewhere.
I'm Jamie Serino and I'm heretoday with Julie Davids, who's
the founder of Plus MediaSolutions, and we're going to
learn all about the amazing workthat they do.
And we're going to learn allabout the amazing work that they
do and Julie started her careerand spent most of her career
working in impact, on both thefor-profit side and the
(00:51):
nonprofit side, and we'll hear alittle bit more about that.
And through Julie's travels,she realized that there were
some problems with gettingpeople to do stuff.
Getting people to do stuff andso how can we get people to
donate and spend time andvolunteer and actually follow
(01:11):
through on the things that theywant to do?
And that will be a big part ofthe conversation today
motivating and then gettingpeople to do the things that
they actually want to do.
That will support causes thatthey believe in.
So, julie, I'll turn it over toyou for more complete
introduction and if you could gointo, you know, some of your
career, that would be great.
Julie (01:33):
Sure, thanks so much, jamie.
Really fun to be here chattingwith you.
You're absolutely right.
I mean my through line has beenaround positive social change
and started way back when in SanFrancisco with a family a
Silicon Valley family who soldtheir company and wanted to do
(01:58):
good.
So they carved out $100 millionof the profit and they turned
it over to me and said, okay,figure it out.
So that was a great opportunityto build a private family
foundation and over 12 years wereally made a dent or an impact
(02:23):
in the California literacyprogram and in fact we developed
a program that is now part ofthe curriculum in California
schools, a take-home libraryprogram.
So that was really my firstforay into formal kind of
nonprofit impact.
(02:46):
From there I went to work with aNobel laureate at the
University of California, sanFrancisco, and helped him build
the Institute forNeurodegenerative Diseases, and
that was.
Even though I am not ascientist, I certainly learned a
lot about neurodegenerativediseases and really opened my
(03:08):
eyes to our healthcare systemall over the world, because
neurodegenerative diseases arenot geographically specific.
And then from there I moved toNew York City and had my own
consulting firm working withultra high net worth
(03:28):
corporations, foundations,individuals who really wanted to
make a difference, both withtheir for-profit capital regular
dollars to invest and thencharitable dollars to invest and
that then led me to being headof impact for North America at
BNP Paribas Bank of the West.
(03:49):
Bnp is the seventh or eighthlargest global bank in the world
and that was an amazingplatform to think about how to
make change at scale.
But all of those pieces kind offell into place and has made up
(04:09):
Plus Media, so it's been anexciting journey.
Jamie (04:13):
Nice, and so you know, what some people don't realize
is that it actually can bedifficult to give away money,
right, and you discover that yougot dropped in there and you're
like why is it so difficult togive away money?
Julie (04:27):
Oh my gosh.
Yes, you know, for so manyreasons.
I mean, most people probablyare familiar with Dan Pallotta's
great book called Uncharitableand there's a film out now on
that.
But it is complicated for humanreasons.
You know there are a lot ofegos involved in philanthropy.
(04:50):
And it's complicated forsystemic reasons because these
problems, most of the problemsthat philanthropy looks at, you
know poverty, healthcare,education these are so deep and
so tangled and so ingrained.
And lastly, I would say youknow the US in particular.
(05:11):
We don't have a good socialsafety net here.
So there's a lot of pressure onphilanthropy to fill that gap,
to fill that gap, whereas, youknow, the programs that I've
seen working in Europe andelsewhere are much more robust
(05:33):
and feel much more effective interms of systems change.
So, yes, it is a complicatedsector.
Jamie (05:42):
And there was something you said earlier too that
reminded me of the UNSustainable Development Goals
and I wonder, something you saidearlier too that reminded me of
the UN sustainable developmentgoals, and I wonder if you could
talk a little bit about that,because I feel like they kind of
were stepping in and maybetrying to like get corporations
to step up a little bit, to sortof step in there and and if
they define these goals andthese sort of columns where the
(06:03):
money could go, then it made ita little bit easier, you know.
So I wonder if you could talk alittle bit about that.
Julie (06:09):
Yeah, I'm a big fan of the UN SDGs and, in fact,
everything that Plus Media doesinternally.
We frame around the UNSustainable Development Goals.
We can talk about that later,but since they've been
established, it definitely givesclarity to corporations, to
(06:31):
brands, to foundations andhopefully to individuals as well
.
I think of them as a roadmap orframework, or, some people say,
goalposts.
Sometimes when I talk aboutthem in public, I still have to
explain what they are.
(06:52):
They're not a sexuallytransmitted disease.
You know they are the roadmapfor a healthier people and
planet, and they're very, verysmart and very effective.
It works for corporationsbecause it gives these
businesses something to hang onto.
And that's not to say thatyou've got to hit all of those
(07:17):
17 and all of the numerouspoints under each of the 17.
The numerous points under eachof the 17.
But what's helpful is to say,okay, I'm a brand.
Let's just say I produce, youknow, soft drinks, so that
(07:38):
involves water.
So you might want to focus onwhat can I do around SDG you
know, I believe it five, and Ishould know that off the top of
my head around clean water, andthat's a great just starting
point.
And then measure against thatframework and that really helps
the corporation know wherethey're going and it also helps
(08:02):
them communicate to theirconstituents, their shareholders
, how they're doing on this.
Jamie (08:10):
That's a really important aspect of it the measurement
and also, I think, stopping likethe shotgun blast approach, and
you've probably been, you know,in the field enough to see the
movement away from that.
Right, Could you talk a littlebit about like, because I
remember being at corporationsand it was like, yeah, we're
going to do this, we're going todo this.
(08:30):
And then I remember the shiftand people would get annoyed,
like, can you sponsor this?
Like, no, no, Like, why no?
Because we're putting all themoney here to have more of an
impact.
And then it makes sense forpeople.
But you know it's a hard pillto swallow at first, Right?
So I wonder if you could talk alittle bit about that shift.
Julie (08:51):
Yeah, it is hard for those great NGOs and nonprofits
who are out there looking forfinancial support, are looking
for financial support.
But, as someone who's worked onboth sides of that line, it is
really important to take intoaccount alignment and focus.
(09:13):
So for corporations, whether ornot they have a foundation,
they have to put their stake inthe ground.
That shotgun effect doesn'twork.
And when you can align thecorporate product, the corporate
set of values, the corporateinitiatives, with something
(09:36):
that's really clear, like one ormore of the UN SDGs, that just
helps everyone row in the samedirection and it ends up being a
unifier both internally andexternally for that corporation
and it helps them put up somekind of fence really around.
(10:04):
There's a limited amount ofdollars.
I mean, even if you're thebiggest corporation in the world
, you can't just keep grantingout money to things that sound
good.
It's got to be more strategic.
So I think I really lean on thealignment as the most important
(10:25):
, so that the brand matches thecause.
I heard a very appropriatestory at a conference on
sustainable brands recently andit was given by the head of
sustainability at Mars, and Marsproduces M&Ms, but they had a
(10:47):
campaign that linked M&Ms towind power.
Hmm it fell terribly flatbecause do you I mean, when you
look at M&Ms, when you're eatingin M&Ms is there any alignment
with wind power at all?
So you know, that campaign wentnowhere and they really learned
(11:12):
about alignment and I'm I'm allfor that.
Jamie (11:16):
Yeah, and because, as you were talking there, I was
thinking too about some of thebrands that really stand out,
because they do focus on certainthings, like Patagonia.
There's some obvious ones,right.
So when there is a companymaybe where it's less obvious,
do you have any advice for them,even like BNP?
(11:37):
I mean, you could probably talkabout I don't know, like
microfinance and you could.
You know, there's probably abunch of things there, but what
would you say to a company whereit isn't quite as obvious, as
we use a lot of water or we'rewith the environment, or we're
in education, you know?
Julie (11:55):
Mm-hmm.
You know, at least from myexperience because I'm always
looking at things from an impactlens I find those threads.
I mean it is.
I have yet to come across acompany, a client, who doesn't
have, you know, something thatthey can align with.
Jamie (12:19):
Yeah.
Julie (12:19):
Whether it's regenerative ag or green chemicals or
reforestation or you know it's,it's there.
If, if they really areinterested, it's there and the
great thing is we know that whenyou move towards that, that
(12:44):
impact or purpose orsustainability, whatever you
want to call it it is good forbusiness.
I mean, that's the bottom line.
It's good internally, it's goodexternally, it's certainly good
long-term for your ROI and wereally we feel strongly that by
(13:07):
holding people to account andthen communicating the best
sustainability story andmeasuring that that leads to
increased ROI.
Jamie (13:17):
Yeah, and there are studies even that show that it
can even move the stock price.
So those studies that are outthere now.
So how have you seen themeasurement of this change?
Because I feel like I've seenthat change a lot too.
You know, between knowing whereto put the dollars and the
resources.
Sometimes these things are hardto measure, right.
(13:39):
These.
You know you're fundingsomething and sometimes it's
pretty obvious, but other timesit's not so.
So what are your thoughts onthat?
Julie (13:49):
So measurement is a huge reason of why I launched Part
Plus Media and here's why youtouched on that.
For example, let's just takefilms, any kind of content video
, documentary, mainstream TV,all of that Throw it into one
(14:12):
bucket.
There's a lot of time andeffort and money that go into
most of that production.
Right, and a lot of I'd say alarge percentage of that content
bucket has to do with some kindof social impact.
It tells some story, it'shighlighting an issue or topic.
(14:37):
Some story.
It's highlighting an issue ortopic.
It's uncovering maybe a reallyuncomfortable challenge that we
have in the world.
So all of that money and all ofthat time goes into telling
that story.
And then what happens?
I mean we're left.
And those content producers foryears have thought well, the
(14:59):
audience, you know they can gooff and they can.
They can do what they want todo.
And then they measure theimpact of their story by
eyeballs or likes and shareswhen the fact is that doesn't
move the needle on any of thoseissues.
So that's one reason why Istarted Plus Media.
(15:20):
I feel that measurement is soimportant to affecting social
change.
If we can measure what'sresonating with audiences,
what's resonating with consumers, what are people willing to do,
what are people willing tolearn, and then track that, then
(15:43):
we can know what's working.
Is our message working?
Are consumers making smarterchoices because of that
sustainability communication?
We need to know that we can'tjust keep putting out these ads
and videos and producing theseevents and expecting people to
(16:05):
make the change.
We have to give them the toolsto make change and we need to
measure that change.
Jamie (16:10):
Yeah, that's great because it definitely goes a
level deeper.
So, I think, because it wasdifficult to measure, for a
while no one was reallymeasuring much, and then people
started to measure and then, Ithink, you know, because it was
difficult to measure, for awhile no one was really
measuring much, and then peoplestarted to measure and then they
, I think they felt satisfiedwith okay, impressions, eyeballs
like shares, you know, signingup for the newsletter, things
like that, and that.
(16:31):
That is great, you know, andyou're you're getting eyeballs
and you're getting people.
Maybe you are inspiring people,eyeballs and you're getting
people.
Maybe you are inspiring people.
But then the action.
So you're talking about going alevel deeper to that action.
And it's funny you mentionedthe documentaries and stuff,
because I saw a documentaryabout the food industry and I'm
like maybe I'll become a vegannow after watching that.
(16:53):
I don't know if I will.
I'm not going to say I will, butbut if I did, then it was
because of that.
That documentary Right and so,or right now the documentary is
making me walk around talkingabout it, which is helpful, but
what is it really?
Maybe I'll donate more money tocertain things, Maybe I will
cut down on eating meat orchicken or whatever, I don't
(17:16):
know.
But you're bringing up a greatpoint.
So could you talk more aboutarriving at that?
And then how do you really getin there and know like, okay,
this person did that becausethey consume that piece of
content.
Julie (17:33):
Right, that is a little bit of a scary answer, but I
will respond.
But I would say that to yourcomment about maybe you'll
become a vegan or maybe you'lldonate, it's the maybe that we
are focused on.
(17:53):
So when you're watching thatdocumentary on, you know the
food waste or food systems.
If at the moment that you'reinterested, you had a plus media
menu that you could learn moreabout what it means to be vegan,
maybe get some vegan recipes,maybe there's a one click
(18:14):
donation, maybe there's apodcast that you could listen to
All of that catching you atthat moment of inspiration so
that you will decide to learnmore, you will take an action.
And then from there to yourquestion about how do you track
and know what people are doingafter they have expressed
(18:38):
interest and watched a film orattended an event, or even at
point of purchase with a brand.
So today's technology hasdeveloped exponentially and if
people think that they are notbeing tracked, they're being
(18:59):
really naive.
Jamie (19:00):
Yeah.
Julie (19:02):
It just, it is part of our life.
So what Plus Media does is we.
We track that behavior.
It's anonymous, we don'tcollect any personal information
at all, but we can follow thatviewer.
If that viewer decides oh, Iwant to listen to that podcast
(19:24):
on how to become vegan, or Iwant to download those recipes,
or I'll sign a petition, or Iwill donate, or you name it,
through our tech tags we trackthat behavior and we can tell
then the content producer or thebrand or the event producer
(19:47):
what people are actually doingwhen they are watching or
listening to their messaging.
Jamie (19:54):
Yeah, yeah, I mean you're just taking, well, not to just
you're just doing this or justdoing that, but you're taking.
You know what's happening inthe marketing world and and you
know, sort of using it for good,right, um and and so cause you
know what.
What in the marketing world?
People will say it takes seven,eight or nine touches to get
(20:15):
someone to make a buyingdecision, especially if it's
something expensive orespecially if it's like business
to business and things likethat.
And there's a great likemarketing cartoon where it sort
of shows this and this guy'sdriving and he sees a billboard
about a sneaker.
He opens a magazine.
There's a sneaker he's on.
He looks on TV and the star iswearing the sneaker, you know,
(20:37):
and he keeps seeing the sneaker.
Then he sees the sneaker on hiscomputer and he clicks on it
and he buys it.
And then in the last frame yousee the people in the boardroom
and they're like so this is whywe need to put more money into
digital and they're forgettingabout all those other touches,
right?
And so the same thing ishappening with a person, you
know, and it might even be abigger hurdle to get someone to
(20:59):
donate.
Or you're talking aboutchanging people's behavior,
changing habits right Eatinghabits or whatever they might be
and so you have to sort of pullthem along, like you're not
going to go from the first touchto the buying decision, from
the first touch to the to thebuying decision.
So you bring them along, justas you were describing maybe a
(21:21):
podcast next, or maybe anarticle, you know, or or
something else and keep going,keep going, keep going until
they're ready.
So I think it's, it's great.
So, um, do you have, like youknow, maybe an example or
something of of how that works?
Julie (21:43):
something of how that works.
Yeah, we describe that as theladder or the continuum of
engagement, and that's reallywhere our expertise comes in, on
the front end of our work witha client.
So I would start by describingthe process and I'll give you an
example.
So what we know, the actions,that or the messaging that
(22:05):
requires consumers to take anaction and that will lead to
behavior change, has to be very,very specific, and there's so
much research on this.
Someone will take an action ifthey understand that it's
relevant to them, it'scontextual to them, it affects
(22:26):
their health, their wealth,their personal world.
So when we get a project forexample, we're working on a film
right now that is talking aboutthe importance of health and
nutrition for inner city youthGreat film called Generation
(22:54):
Growth because the curation onthe front end is alignment with
the story and giving the viewersopportunities to take action,
to learn more or buy somethingor do something that makes sense
to them, and it can be anythingfrom buy a kit to start your
(23:19):
own garden at home todownloading toolkits, to
bringing this how to duplicatethis work and bring it to your
local school, set up a screening, and we're always changing the
opportunities that we offer toalign with that content so that
(23:43):
it matches the audience that'swatching the content, so it's
always relevant, it's alwayscontextual and that brings
really high engagement rates.
So you're not just plugging ina hashtag donate $5 to whatever.
I have to understand why thisis important to me.
(24:04):
Yes, I'm predisposed to thetopic because I've watched the
film, but I want to know why Ishould take that next step and
that's what we do.
Jamie (24:15):
That's great.
And so when an organizationwants to engage with you,
they'll say, okay, I've got thisfilm or I have this campaign
and I'm about to launch it, andthen that's when they engage
with you and you sort of lay outall those steps.
Okay, can you tell me a littlebit more about that, that
process, the planning.
Julie (24:36):
Exactly.
So, you know, I'd say the bulkof our work has fallen.
Even though we serve all ofthose 17 UN SDGs that we talked
about, it tends to fall in theenvironmental group.
If someone is doing a campaignaround something related to
(24:58):
climate or environment, we willfirst understand what are their
goals, what are their KPIs,their key performance indicators
.
So, taking those and looking atwhat they're going to be using
for their messaging is it video?
Is it social channels?
Is it, you know, events thatcould be all of the above Then
(25:22):
how can we translate that intoconcrete actions for the
audience in learn and actopportunities, and those learn
and act opportunities need to bemeasurable.
So we do all of that work, theresearch and curation, and we
come up with various menus thatare appropriate for all of these
(25:43):
different demographics.
If they're looking to targetGen Z on social, we've got a
menu for that.
If they're looking to activateaudiences at a big event, we
have that.
So it's all very personalized,it's a very personal engagement
(26:05):
experience.
And then, of course, on theback end, we're measuring all of
that user behavior so that thecampaign knows what's working.
Is our message really gettingout?
Are people activating umtowards the goals that that we
have set out.
If they're not, let's figureout why and and switch things up
(26:27):
yeah, that's great.
Jamie (26:29):
so you, you mentioned, um , a lot of environmental causes
and stuff, um, so, because Iwanted to ask you a little bit
about you.
You know some trends and stuff,so that's, those are the types
of organizations that are comingto you more often.
You feel like is is, do you?
I mean, is it just cause maybeword of mouth and and in your
(26:50):
services, or are people more intune with we need to do
something about the environment?
Yeah, cause in tune with weneed to do something about the
environment?
Yeah, because what I will sayis, anecdotally, my oldest son's
in third grade and they had towork on a project and every kid
they were in pairs, every singlepair did something about the
(27:10):
environment.
It was amazing.
It was so amazing they wereallowed to do anything.
Just had to be you're gonna fixa problem, that's out there.
That was it.
Everyone did something on theenvironment.
Now, sure, they were probablyinfluencing each other, but it
was really interesting to seethat.
That's what the outcome wasthere.
So, yeah, so are you seeing?
(27:30):
You're just seeing moreorganizations turning their
attention to that?
Julie (27:35):
I do, I do, I think so.
I think there are a couple ofthings at play.
We just happen to be working ona number of films that touch on
some in climate orenvironmental issue.
I mean, we worked onExtrapolations, which was on
Apple TV, an episodic climatefilm series, and there's some
(28:02):
really interesting ones comingup.
I think the plethora of focuscontent production around
climate and environmental issuesshows that awareness raising
really might not be as importantany longer.
(28:22):
What is in your third gradeexample is perfect.
What's really important isgetting people doing something,
and that's really where myfrustration has been in that
great, we've got the awarenessraising covered.
Climate change is a problem.
(28:45):
What are we going to do aboutit?
And that's where these filmsare saying oh yeah, we need to
get people doing something afterwe motivate them and inspire
them with our content.
Same with events, and I'd saythe same goes for brands,
because if the brand is, youknow, committed to
(29:09):
sustainability, to recycle,reuse, repair, all of those
great things, then communicateit to your consumer and use it
for, you know, marketing,because it's very positive and
consumers respond to that.
Jamie (29:26):
Yeah, so yeah, you were saying something in there you
know about, we know, we knowthere's a problem and I was just
reading an article about thatand, you know, an environmental
scientist was saying we don't.
And it was a psychologist thatwas interviewed too and they
were like, yeah, we don't thinkheaping more data onto this like
(29:49):
there's a problem is going tohelp.
More data onto this likethere's a problem it's going to
help, because we know, like andwe keep hearing about it, but no
one is.
You don't say no one's doinganything, but it's, it's now.
I think to that next step andyou, you keep going there like
what's the next step?
What's the next step in thisaction taking?
So have you seen any trendswith, like you know, different
(30:11):
generations?
Julie (30:22):
Have you seen any trends with, like you know, different
generations, you know, betweenwanting to become active or
wanting to donate or wanting totake some sort of action?
Yes, there are some prettyclear trends, and you mentioned
donate.
I think one of the biggesttrends is away from donating.
I think one of the biggesttrends is away from donating,
and that's a big reason why wework so hard on the curation, on
the front end, when we'rereally thinking about what can
(30:43):
people do around this issue.
They don't always want to givemoney.
Maybe they will further downthe line, but they need to be
convinced first that I'mcomfortable with this.
This makes sense to my life.
I think that there's been toomuch emphasis placed on just
(31:05):
donate, just give money andthat's going to solve it.
So one of the things that wereally be laid there, I think,
(31:33):
particularly for youngeraudiences and younger
generations, they're willing toget involved, they're willing to
volunteer, to do meetups, to dosocial campaigns, not
necessarily donate right off thebat.
Jamie (31:50):
Yeah, Well, that's probably good.
I mean, of course the money isneeded and maybe some people
it's oh, I'll just donate money.
But if people are willing tospend time and actually effort,
then that's a whole other layerthere, so maybe that's a good
sign.
Yeah, so besides so you talkeda little bit about environment,
(32:16):
you talked a little bit abouteducation Are there any other?
And especially with yourorganization being aligned with
the SDGs, are there any otherones that you see a little bit
more attention, you know, alittle more focus on?
Julie (32:29):
You know it's it's.
It's interesting.
I mean we very much expected toget involved with some
organization this year aroundjust promoting democracy.
I mean we try and stay verycentrist, we're not a political
(32:49):
organization and I've beensurprised that our system has
not been used as yet aroundthese, you know, democratic with
a small d issues.
It's something that has juststruck us.
Other than that, I meanhomelessness, affordable housing
(33:13):
has has been big.
Education is another really,really big one and we're very
excited about.
There's been legislation passedin the EU.
It's called a digital productpassport.
It's called a digital productpassport and every item that is
(34:00):
sold in the EU in the comingyears requires this DPP, this
digital product passport, muchmore clearly to consumers and to
move those consumers' dollarsand hence behavior, to a better
cycle of that circular economysystem.
um that we're, we're lookingtowards.
So, um, I think that's a bigtrend and a big topic that is
coming up that hasn't gotten alot of attention yet in the U S.
Jamie (34:24):
Yeah, well, it's leading me to to think about, um, you
know, just educating people,about a lot of people, including
myself, don't realize theimpact that they might have on
on the environment, on the world, like that documentary about,
about food.
One fact that keeps sticking inmy mind is that it was it said
(34:46):
it takes, I think, 25 pounds offeed to get one pound out of the
cow right, which is like soinefficient, like why would we
do that?
You know, and and so it's likeyou know, I mean I don't eat
that much meat, but it justmakes me wonder like, oh, maybe
(35:06):
yeah, maybe that hamburger justisn't looking so good anymore.
Yeah, yeah, um so well.
Well then there's like localthings you can do.
So, just sticking with thatexample, I actually know a
cattle farmer and then thatfeels a little better, but then
I'm sure there's a bunch ofother things, and so maybe
(35:27):
embedded in that digital productwould be like here's the
pressure that this product putson the environment.
Julie (35:38):
you know, and then you know that and you then decide do
I need that or not?
So that's, that's a really goodpoint, because then the
question for that brand is do Iwant to communicate that to the
customer.
Do I feel proud about that?
There's a way to you know.
First of all, they're going tobe regulated so that information
(36:00):
is going to be out there.
But you could also have a storythat maybe that brand is really
making an effort.
Jamie (36:11):
Yeah.
Julie (36:12):
And that's a good story too.
Jamie (36:13):
Yeah, exactly Right.
So it's like what you weresaying earlier and you line up,
you have this alignment betweenyour efforts and there are I
mean Walmart's, a good exampleof turning it around.
Well, I don't know, I haven'tlooked at them in a while, but
they were turning it around and,you know, becoming a little bit
(36:36):
more aware.
So you get companies and brandsout there that maybe realize
they get shown and then theychange so that can happen.
Going back to something you andI were talking about before we
hit record here was the changeeven in just phrases that are
(36:57):
used, and this happens in allindustries and fields and stuff.
But I think it's a little bitmore emotional here, maybe, or
the relationship between how youmight think about something, or
how a word or a phrase canbecome, you know, sullied in
(37:18):
some way.
You know, and there are peopleout there, I guess, maybe trying
to do that, or maybe it happensby accident or whatever.
But we were talking about likephrases, like social good and
CSR, and and so I wonder if youcould talk a little bit about
that, because I think I'd liketo learn a little bit more about
that and I think it's aninteresting topic of just
(37:40):
language change and phrases andstuff and that.
That, that whole journey, Iguess that we've all taken.
Julie (37:47):
Yeah, yeah, you know when I started out in in the, you
know I use impact in a verybroad sense.
When I started out, you knowthere was philanthropy and there
you know, charitable givingstraight up, very clear and just
(38:08):
the beginnings of sociallyresponsible investing.
Even though sociallyresponsible investing has
actually been around in the USfor a very long time, it was
started by actually a religiousorganization way back when.
That's a whole nother story andat that time it was quite clear
(38:28):
Either you made a charitabledonation or you invested your
dollars aligned with your values, and you were sure to lose
money.
Jamie (38:39):
Right.
Julie (38:39):
And then everything changed.
There became, you know, charityeven became much more
complicated because you havethings like donor advised funds
and in the donor advised fundsand in your philanthropic
endowment, if you have afoundation, you can invest that
(39:00):
those dollars into for-profitinvestments, hopefully, that are
also aligned with your values.
But then social responsibleinvesting, you know, just caught
on fire and it became impactinvesting and values aligned
investing and all of thesethings.
(39:28):
We started to have CSR,corporate Social Responsibility
in companies, and then out ofthat we got DE&I.
Now we have heads ofsustainability at most
corporations and then, flowingout of that, we have a lot of
(39:50):
chief creative officers, chiefinnovation officers and, for
whatever reason, a lot of thesetitles became very problematic
and political.
I think that when we startedwith socially responsible
(40:13):
investing, it was clear that noone was making money and so that
, unfortunately, that belief up.
And then, on the philanthropicside, when you have a CSR
(40:39):
officer, it's not just feel good, it's actually for the good of
the company, which is directlytied to bottom line.
It all becomes very touchy andwhen you know I think that we
(41:00):
should just be looking at it.
This is for the common good,it's for the good of a business.
It's for the good of a cause.
It's for the good of theemployees.
It's for the good of theemployees.
(41:22):
Language is constantly evolvingand our approach to social good
is constantly evolving.
I would say it's great that ESGand the UN, sdgs and impact
investing, I think, has become apart of more mainstream
conversation.
Jamie (41:38):
Yeah, I think it has.
And yeah, I guess, like whatI've seen at different companies
is, I mean, now of course,there's a lot of awareness on
employee well-being and, youknow, mental health and stuff,
and that gets sometimes tiedinto that as well.
So it does seem to be everchanging.
And I guess, how you end updefining yourself within the
(42:02):
field.
Maybe you do have to be careful, but there now are different
perceptions of these, differentacronyms and words and stuff,
which is interesting how it alldeveloped.
So, julie, what is your website?
So everyone knows where to gowwwplusmedia.
Julie (42:26):
all lowercase one word dot solutions plus media
solutions dot solutions.
Jamie (42:37):
Plus media solutions Great, very easy Plus media
solutions.
Is there anything else that youfeel like I didn't ask or you
want to let everybody know?
Julie (42:42):
I think you know.
Going back to to really wherewe started stories are great.
Stories make us human, we welove them.
Stories are great Stories makeus human, we love them, but they
don't make change.
People make change and whatwe've been missing is that
bridge to give people tools totake action that feel right to
(43:07):
them, and and then measuringwhat actually works.
And then measuring whatactually works.
So it's not complicated, itjust hasn't existed before.
And when something's new, youknow people have a lot of
(43:27):
questions about it, but it'stime for people to act on their
interests and to act for thecommon good, and plus, media is
just there to make it easy andmeasurable.
Jamie (43:36):
That's well said.
You're reminding me of likewhen you're at like a gala, you
know, and you're there andyou're feeling inspired, and
then people start.
There's the auction or whowants to donate more, and
everyone starts, and you're,everyone starts and you're
getting people when they feelpassionate right, and that's the
(43:58):
whole thing is that when youwatch something, then you
literally wake up the next dayand sort of shrug your shoulders
about it and go and not recyclethat can or whatever, but when
you have that passion you justsaw this thing then, boom, you
get hit with that next thing andkeep that, keep on that path,
(44:19):
and that's the key.
And that is really a key thing,I think, when you're talking
about, you know, impact andsocial good and whatnot, is that
there are these moments ofpassion and they do become
easily forgotten and and butwhen you can act on them and the
thing is too like what you'redoing, people want that, you
know.
They want that path.
(44:41):
You're clearing a path for them.
They'll take that path, they'llfollow that passion, so that
inaction is made and it's great.
Well, julie, thank you forjoining us.
I learned a lot and I want tothank everyone for watching or
listening and, uh, we'll see younext time great Take care.
You're listening to.
There's a Lesson in here,Somewhere, a podcast featuring
compelling conversations withexceptional people.
Whether it's an inspirationalachievement, a hardship overcome
or simply a unique perspective,these are stories we can all
learn from.
Here are your hosts, JamieSerino and Carlos Arcila.
Jamie (00:29):
Hello and welcome.
This is.
There's a Lesson in hereSomewhere.
I'm Jamie Serino and I'm heretoday with Julie Davids, who's
the founder of Plus MediaSolutions, and we're going to
learn all about the amazing workthat they do.
And we're going to learn allabout the amazing work that they
do and Julie started her careerand spent most of her career
working in impact, on both thefor-profit side and the
(00:51):
nonprofit side, and we'll hear alittle bit more about that.
And through Julie's travels,she realized that there were
some problems with gettingpeople to do stuff.
Getting people to do stuff andso how can we get people to
donate and spend time andvolunteer and actually follow
(01:11):
through on the things that theywant to do?
And that will be a big part ofthe conversation today
motivating and then gettingpeople to do the things that
they actually want to do.
That will support causes thatthey believe in.
So, julie, I'll turn it over toyou for more complete
introduction and if you could gointo, you know, some of your
career, that would be great.
Julie (01:33):
Sure, thanks so much, jamie.
Really fun to be here chattingwith you.
You're absolutely right.
I mean my through line has beenaround positive social change
and started way back when in SanFrancisco with a family a
Silicon Valley family who soldtheir company and wanted to do
(01:58):
good.
So they carved out $100 millionof the profit and they turned
it over to me and said, okay,figure it out.
So that was a great opportunityto build a private family
foundation and over 12 years wereally made a dent or an impact
(02:23):
in the California literacyprogram and in fact we developed
a program that is now part ofthe curriculum in California
schools, a take-home libraryprogram.
So that was really my firstforay into formal kind of
nonprofit impact.
(02:46):
From there I went to work with aNobel laureate at the
University of California, sanFrancisco, and helped him build
the Institute forNeurodegenerative Diseases, and
that was.
Even though I am not ascientist, I certainly learned a
lot about neurodegenerativediseases and really opened my
(03:08):
eyes to our healthcare systemall over the world, because
neurodegenerative diseases arenot geographically specific.
And then from there I moved toNew York City and had my own
consulting firm working withultra high net worth
(03:28):
corporations, foundations,individuals who really wanted to
make a difference, both withtheir for-profit capital regular
dollars to invest and thencharitable dollars to invest and
that then led me to being headof impact for North America at
BNP Paribas Bank of the West.
(03:49):
Bnp is the seventh or eighthlargest global bank in the world
and that was an amazingplatform to think about how to
make change at scale.
But all of those pieces kind offell into place and has made up
(04:09):
Plus Media, so it's been anexciting journey.
Jamie (04:13):
Nice, and so you know, what some people don't realize
is that it actually can bedifficult to give away money,
right, and you discover that yougot dropped in there and you're
like why is it so difficult togive away money?
Julie (04:27):
Oh my gosh.
Yes, you know, for so manyreasons.
I mean, most people probablyare familiar with Dan Pallotta's
great book called Uncharitableand there's a film out now on
that.
But it is complicated for humanreasons.
You know there are a lot ofegos involved in philanthropy.
(04:50):
And it's complicated forsystemic reasons because these
problems, most of the problemsthat philanthropy looks at, you
know poverty, healthcare,education these are so deep and
so tangled and so ingrained.
And lastly, I would say youknow the US in particular.
(05:11):
We don't have a good socialsafety net here.
So there's a lot of pressure onphilanthropy to fill that gap,
to fill that gap, whereas, youknow, the programs that I've
seen working in Europe andelsewhere are much more robust
(05:33):
and feel much more effective interms of systems change.
So, yes, it is a complicatedsector.
Jamie (05:42):
And there was something you said earlier too that
reminded me of the UNSustainable Development Goals
and I wonder, something you saidearlier too that reminded me of
the UN sustainable developmentgoals, and I wonder if you could
talk a little bit about that,because I feel like they kind of
were stepping in and maybetrying to like get corporations
to step up a little bit, to sortof step in there and and if
they define these goals andthese sort of columns where the
(06:03):
money could go, then it made ita little bit easier, you know.
So I wonder if you could talk alittle bit about that.
Julie (06:09):
Yeah, I'm a big fan of the UN SDGs and, in fact,
everything that Plus Media doesinternally.
We frame around the UNSustainable Development Goals.
We can talk about that later,but since they've been
established, it definitely givesclarity to corporations, to
(06:31):
brands, to foundations andhopefully to individuals as well
.
I think of them as a roadmap orframework, or, some people say,
goalposts.
Sometimes when I talk aboutthem in public, I still have to
explain what they are.
(06:52):
They're not a sexuallytransmitted disease.
You know they are the roadmapfor a healthier people and
planet, and they're very, verysmart and very effective.
It works for corporationsbecause it gives these
businesses something to hang onto.
And that's not to say thatyou've got to hit all of those
(07:17):
17 and all of the numerouspoints under each of the 17.
The numerous points under eachof the 17.
But what's helpful is to say,okay, I'm a brand.
Let's just say I produce, youknow, soft drinks, so that
(07:38):
involves water.
So you might want to focus onwhat can I do around SDG you
know, I believe it five, and Ishould know that off the top of
my head around clean water, andthat's a great just starting
point.
And then measure against thatframework and that really helps
the corporation know wherethey're going and it also helps
(08:02):
them communicate to theirconstituents, their shareholders
, how they're doing on this.
Jamie (08:10):
That's a really important aspect of it the measurement
and also, I think, stopping likethe shotgun blast approach, and
you've probably been, you know,in the field enough to see the
movement away from that.
Right, Could you talk a littlebit about like, because I
remember being at corporationsand it was like, yeah, we're
going to do this, we're going todo this.
(08:30):
And then I remember the shiftand people would get annoyed,
like, can you sponsor this?
Like, no, no, Like, why no?
Because we're putting all themoney here to have more of an
impact.
And then it makes sense forpeople.
But you know it's a hard pillto swallow at first, Right?
So I wonder if you could talk alittle bit about that shift.
Julie (08:51):
Yeah, it is hard for those great NGOs and nonprofits
who are out there looking forfinancial support, are looking
for financial support.
But, as someone who's worked onboth sides of that line, it is
really important to take intoaccount alignment and focus.
(09:13):
So for corporations, whether ornot they have a foundation,
they have to put their stake inthe ground.
That shotgun effect doesn'twork.
And when you can align thecorporate product, the corporate
set of values, the corporateinitiatives, with something
(09:36):
that's really clear, like one ormore of the UN SDGs, that just
helps everyone row in the samedirection and it ends up being a
unifier both internally andexternally for that corporation
and it helps them put up somekind of fence really around.
(10:04):
There's a limited amount ofdollars.
I mean, even if you're thebiggest corporation in the world
, you can't just keep grantingout money to things that sound
good.
It's got to be more strategic.
So I think I really lean on thealignment as the most important
(10:25):
, so that the brand matches thecause.
I heard a very appropriatestory at a conference on
sustainable brands recently andit was given by the head of
sustainability at Mars, and Marsproduces M&Ms, but they had a
(10:47):
campaign that linked M&Ms towind power.
Hmm it fell terribly flatbecause do you I mean, when you
look at M&Ms, when you're eatingin M&Ms is there any alignment
with wind power at all?
So you know, that campaign wentnowhere and they really learned
(11:12):
about alignment and I'm I'm allfor that.
Jamie (11:16):
Yeah, and because, as you were talking there, I was
thinking too about some of thebrands that really stand out,
because they do focus on certainthings, like Patagonia.
There's some obvious ones,right.
So when there is a companymaybe where it's less obvious,
do you have any advice for them,even like BNP?
(11:37):
I mean, you could probably talkabout I don't know, like
microfinance and you could.
You know, there's probably abunch of things there, but what
would you say to a company whereit isn't quite as obvious, as
we use a lot of water or we'rewith the environment, or we're
in education, you know?
Julie (11:55):
Mm-hmm.
You know, at least from myexperience because I'm always
looking at things from an impactlens I find those threads.
I mean it is.
I have yet to come across acompany, a client, who doesn't
have, you know, something thatthey can align with.
Jamie (12:19):
Yeah.
Julie (12:19):
Whether it's regenerative ag or green chemicals or
reforestation or you know it's,it's there.
If, if they really areinterested, it's there and the
great thing is we know that whenyou move towards that, that
(12:44):
impact or purpose orsustainability, whatever you
want to call it it is good forbusiness.
I mean, that's the bottom line.
It's good internally, it's goodexternally, it's certainly good
long-term for your ROI and wereally we feel strongly that by
(13:07):
holding people to account andthen communicating the best
sustainability story andmeasuring that that leads to
increased ROI.
Jamie (13:17):
Yeah, and there are studies even that show that it
can even move the stock price.
So those studies that are outthere now.
So how have you seen themeasurement of this change?
Because I feel like I've seenthat change a lot too.
You know, between knowing whereto put the dollars and the
resources.
Sometimes these things are hardto measure, right.
(13:39):
These.
You know you're fundingsomething and sometimes it's
pretty obvious, but other timesit's not so.
So what are your thoughts onthat?
Julie (13:49):
So measurement is a huge reason of why I launched Part
Plus Media and here's why youtouched on that.
For example, let's just takefilms, any kind of content video
, documentary, mainstream TV,all of that Throw it into one
(14:12):
bucket.
There's a lot of time andeffort and money that go into
most of that production.
Right, and a lot of I'd say alarge percentage of that content
bucket has to do with some kindof social impact.
It tells some story, it'shighlighting an issue or topic.
(14:37):
Some story.
It's highlighting an issue ortopic.
It's uncovering maybe a reallyuncomfortable challenge that we
have in the world.
So all of that money and all ofthat time goes into telling
that story.
And then what happens?
I mean we're left.
And those content producers foryears have thought well, the
(14:59):
audience, you know they can gooff and they can.
They can do what they want todo.
And then they measure theimpact of their story by
eyeballs or likes and shareswhen the fact is that doesn't
move the needle on any of thoseissues.
So that's one reason why Istarted Plus Media.
(15:20):
I feel that measurement is soimportant to affecting social
change.
If we can measure what'sresonating with audiences,
what's resonating with consumers, what are people willing to do,
what are people willing tolearn, and then track that, then
(15:43):
we can know what's working.
Is our message working?
Are consumers making smarterchoices because of that
sustainability communication?
We need to know that we can'tjust keep putting out these ads
and videos and producing theseevents and expecting people to
(16:05):
make the change.
We have to give them the toolsto make change and we need to
measure that change.
Jamie (16:10):
Yeah, that's great because it definitely goes a
level deeper.
So, I think, because it wasdifficult to measure, for a
while no one was reallymeasuring much, and then people
started to measure and then, Ithink, you know, because it was
difficult to measure, for awhile no one was really
measuring much, and then peoplestarted to measure and then they
, I think they felt satisfiedwith okay, impressions, eyeballs
like shares, you know, signingup for the newsletter, things
like that, and that.
(16:31):
That is great, you know, andyou're you're getting eyeballs
and you're getting people.
Maybe you are inspiring people,eyeballs and you're getting
people.
Maybe you are inspiring people.
But then the action.
So you're talking about going alevel deeper to that action.
And it's funny you mentionedthe documentaries and stuff,
because I saw a documentaryabout the food industry and I'm
like maybe I'll become a vegannow after watching that.
(16:53):
I don't know if I will.
I'm not going to say I will, butbut if I did, then it was
because of that.
That documentary Right and so,or right now the documentary is
making me walk around talkingabout it, which is helpful, but
what is it really?
Maybe I'll donate more money tocertain things, Maybe I will
cut down on eating meat orchicken or whatever, I don't
(17:16):
know.
But you're bringing up a greatpoint.
So could you talk more aboutarriving at that?
And then how do you really getin there and know like, okay,
this person did that becausethey consume that piece of
content.
Julie (17:33):
Right, that is a little bit of a scary answer, but I
will respond.
But I would say that to yourcomment about maybe you'll
become a vegan or maybe you'lldonate, it's the maybe that we
are focused on.
(17:53):
So when you're watching thatdocumentary on, you know the
food waste or food systems.
If at the moment that you'reinterested, you had a plus media
menu that you could learn moreabout what it means to be vegan,
maybe get some vegan recipes,maybe there's a one click
(18:14):
donation, maybe there's apodcast that you could listen to
All of that catching you atthat moment of inspiration so
that you will decide to learnmore, you will take an action.
And then from there to yourquestion about how do you track
and know what people are doingafter they have expressed
(18:38):
interest and watched a film orattended an event, or even at
point of purchase with a brand.
So today's technology hasdeveloped exponentially and if
people think that they are notbeing tracked, they're being
(18:59):
really naive.
Jamie (19:00):
Yeah.
Julie (19:02):
It just, it is part of our life.
So what Plus Media does is we.
We track that behavior.
It's anonymous, we don'tcollect any personal information
at all, but we can follow thatviewer.
If that viewer decides oh, Iwant to listen to that podcast
(19:24):
on how to become vegan, or Iwant to download those recipes,
or I'll sign a petition, or Iwill donate, or you name it,
through our tech tags we trackthat behavior and we can tell
then the content producer or thebrand or the event producer
(19:47):
what people are actually doingwhen they are watching or
listening to their messaging.
Jamie (19:54):
Yeah, yeah, I mean you're just taking, well, not to just
you're just doing this or justdoing that, but you're taking.
You know what's happening inthe marketing world and and you
know, sort of using it for good,right, um and and so cause you
know what.
What in the marketing world?
People will say it takes seven,eight or nine touches to get
(20:15):
someone to make a buyingdecision, especially if it's
something expensive orespecially if it's like business
to business and things likethat.
And there's a great likemarketing cartoon where it sort
of shows this and this guy'sdriving and he sees a billboard
about a sneaker.
He opens a magazine.
There's a sneaker he's on.
He looks on TV and the star iswearing the sneaker, you know,
(20:37):
and he keeps seeing the sneaker.
Then he sees the sneaker on hiscomputer and he clicks on it
and he buys it.
And then in the last frame yousee the people in the boardroom
and they're like so this is whywe need to put more money into
digital and they're forgettingabout all those other touches,
right?
And so the same thing ishappening with a person, you
know, and it might even be abigger hurdle to get someone to
(20:59):
donate.
Or you're talking aboutchanging people's behavior,
changing habits right Eatinghabits or whatever they might be
and so you have to sort of pullthem along, like you're not
going to go from the first touchto the buying decision, from
the first touch to the to thebuying decision.
So you bring them along, justas you were describing maybe a
(21:21):
podcast next, or maybe anarticle, you know, or or
something else and keep going,keep going, keep going until
they're ready.
So I think it's, it's great.
So, um, do you have, like youknow, maybe an example or
something of of how that works?
Julie (21:43):
something of how that works.
Yeah, we describe that as theladder or the continuum of
engagement, and that's reallywhere our expertise comes in, on
the front end of our work witha client.
So I would start by describingthe process and I'll give you an
example.
So what we know, the actions,that or the messaging that
(22:05):
requires consumers to take anaction and that will lead to
behavior change, has to be very,very specific, and there's so
much research on this.
Someone will take an action ifthey understand that it's
relevant to them, it'scontextual to them, it affects
(22:26):
their health, their wealth,their personal world.
So when we get a project forexample, we're working on a film
right now that is talking aboutthe importance of health and
nutrition for inner city youthGreat film called Generation
(22:54):
Growth because the curation onthe front end is alignment with
the story and giving the viewersopportunities to take action,
to learn more or buy somethingor do something that makes sense
to them, and it can be anythingfrom buy a kit to start your
(23:19):
own garden at home todownloading toolkits, to
bringing this how to duplicatethis work and bring it to your
local school, set up a screening, and we're always changing the
opportunities that we offer toalign with that content so that
(23:43):
it matches the audience that'swatching the content, so it's
always relevant, it's alwayscontextual and that brings
really high engagement rates.
So you're not just plugging ina hashtag donate $5 to whatever.
I have to understand why thisis important to me.
(24:04):
Yes, I'm predisposed to thetopic because I've watched the
film, but I want to know why Ishould take that next step and
that's what we do.
Jamie (24:15):
That's great.
And so when an organizationwants to engage with you,
they'll say, okay, I've got thisfilm or I have this campaign
and I'm about to launch it, andthen that's when they engage
with you and you sort of lay outall those steps.
Okay, can you tell me a littlebit more about that, that
process, the planning.
Julie (24:36):
Exactly.
So, you know, I'd say the bulkof our work has fallen.
Even though we serve all ofthose 17 UN SDGs that we talked
about, it tends to fall in theenvironmental group.
If someone is doing a campaignaround something related to
(24:58):
climate or environment, we willfirst understand what are their
goals, what are their KPIs,their key performance indicators
.
So, taking those and looking atwhat they're going to be using
for their messaging is it video?
Is it social channels?
Is it, you know, events thatcould be all of the above Then
(25:22):
how can we translate that intoconcrete actions for the
audience in learn and actopportunities, and those learn
and act opportunities need to bemeasurable.
So we do all of that work, theresearch and curation, and we
come up with various menus thatare appropriate for all of these
(25:43):
different demographics.
If they're looking to targetGen Z on social, we've got a
menu for that.
If they're looking to activateaudiences at a big event, we
have that.
So it's all very personalized,it's a very personal engagement
(26:05):
experience.
And then, of course, on theback end, we're measuring all of
that user behavior so that thecampaign knows what's working.
Is our message really gettingout?
Are people activating umtowards the goals that that we
have set out.
If they're not, let's figureout why and and switch things up
(26:27):
yeah, that's great.
Jamie (26:29):
so you, you mentioned, um , a lot of environmental causes
and stuff, um, so, because Iwanted to ask you a little bit
about you.
You know some trends and stuff,so that's, those are the types
of organizations that are comingto you more often.
You feel like is is, do you?
I mean, is it just cause maybeword of mouth and and in your
(26:50):
services, or are people more intune with we need to do
something about the environment?
Yeah, cause in tune with weneed to do something about the
environment?
Yeah, because what I will sayis, anecdotally, my oldest son's
in third grade and they had towork on a project and every kid
they were in pairs, every singlepair did something about the
(27:10):
environment.
It was amazing.
It was so amazing they wereallowed to do anything.
Just had to be you're gonna fixa problem, that's out there.
That was it.
Everyone did something on theenvironment.
Now, sure, they were probablyinfluencing each other, but it
was really interesting to seethat.
That's what the outcome wasthere.
So, yeah, so are you seeing?
(27:30):
You're just seeing moreorganizations turning their
attention to that?
Julie (27:35):
I do, I do, I think so.
I think there are a couple ofthings at play.
We just happen to be working ona number of films that touch on
some in climate orenvironmental issue.
I mean, we worked onExtrapolations, which was on
Apple TV, an episodic climatefilm series, and there's some
(28:02):
really interesting ones comingup.
I think the plethora of focuscontent production around
climate and environmental issuesshows that awareness raising
really might not be as importantany longer.
(28:22):
What is in your third gradeexample is perfect.
What's really important isgetting people doing something,
and that's really where myfrustration has been in that
great, we've got the awarenessraising covered.
Climate change is a problem.
(28:45):
What are we going to do aboutit?
And that's where these filmsare saying oh yeah, we need to
get people doing something afterwe motivate them and inspire
them with our content.
Same with events, and I'd saythe same goes for brands,
because if the brand is, youknow, committed to
(29:09):
sustainability, to recycle,reuse, repair, all of those
great things, then communicateit to your consumer and use it
for, you know, marketing,because it's very positive and
consumers respond to that.
Jamie (29:26):
Yeah, so yeah, you were saying something in there you
know about, we know, we knowthere's a problem and I was just
reading an article about thatand, you know, an environmental
scientist was saying we don't.
And it was a psychologist thatwas interviewed too and they
were like, yeah, we don't thinkheaping more data onto this like
(29:49):
there's a problem is going tohelp.
More data onto this likethere's a problem it's going to
help, because we know, like andwe keep hearing about it, but no
one is.
You don't say no one's doinganything, but it's, it's now.
I think to that next step andyou, you keep going there like
what's the next step?
What's the next step in thisaction taking?
So have you seen any trendswith, like you know, different
(30:11):
generations?
Julie (30:22):
Have you seen any trends with, like you know, different
generations, you know, betweenwanting to become active or
wanting to donate or wanting totake some sort of action?
Yes, there are some prettyclear trends, and you mentioned
donate.
I think one of the biggesttrends is away from donating.
I think one of the biggesttrends is away from donating,
and that's a big reason why wework so hard on the curation, on
the front end, when we'rereally thinking about what can
(30:43):
people do around this issue.
They don't always want to givemoney.
Maybe they will further downthe line, but they need to be
convinced first that I'mcomfortable with this.
This makes sense to my life.
I think that there's been toomuch emphasis placed on just
(31:05):
donate, just give money andthat's going to solve it.
So one of the things that wereally be laid there, I think,
(31:33):
particularly for youngeraudiences and younger
generations, they're willing toget involved, they're willing to
volunteer, to do meetups, to dosocial campaigns, not
necessarily donate right off thebat.
Jamie (31:50):
Yeah, Well, that's probably good.
I mean, of course the money isneeded and maybe some people
it's oh, I'll just donate money.
But if people are willing tospend time and actually effort,
then that's a whole other layerthere, so maybe that's a good
sign.
Yeah, so besides so you talkeda little bit about environment,
(32:16):
you talked a little bit abouteducation Are there any other?
And especially with yourorganization being aligned with
the SDGs, are there any otherones that you see a little bit
more attention, you know, alittle more focus on?
Julie (32:29):
You know it's it's.
It's interesting.
I mean we very much expected toget involved with some
organization this year aroundjust promoting democracy.
I mean we try and stay verycentrist, we're not a political
(32:49):
organization and I've beensurprised that our system has
not been used as yet aroundthese, you know, democratic with
a small d issues.
It's something that has juststruck us.
Other than that, I meanhomelessness, affordable housing
(33:13):
has has been big.
Education is another really,really big one and we're very
excited about.
There's been legislation passedin the EU.
It's called a digital productpassport.
It's called a digital productpassport and every item that is
(34:00):
sold in the EU in the comingyears requires this DPP, this
digital product passport, muchmore clearly to consumers and to
move those consumers' dollarsand hence behavior, to a better
cycle of that circular economysystem.
um that we're, we're lookingtowards.
So, um, I think that's a bigtrend and a big topic that is
coming up that hasn't gotten alot of attention yet in the U S.
Jamie (34:24):
Yeah, well, it's leading me to to think about, um, you
know, just educating people,about a lot of people, including
myself, don't realize theimpact that they might have on
on the environment, on the world, like that documentary about,
about food.
One fact that keeps sticking inmy mind is that it was it said
(34:46):
it takes, I think, 25 pounds offeed to get one pound out of the
cow right, which is like soinefficient, like why would we
do that?
You know, and and so it's likeyou know, I mean I don't eat
that much meat, but it justmakes me wonder like, oh, maybe
(35:06):
yeah, maybe that hamburger justisn't looking so good anymore.
Yeah, yeah, um so well.
Well then there's like localthings you can do.
So, just sticking with thatexample, I actually know a
cattle farmer and then thatfeels a little better, but then
I'm sure there's a bunch ofother things, and so maybe
(35:27):
embedded in that digital productwould be like here's the
pressure that this product putson the environment.
Julie (35:38):
you know, and then you know that and you then decide do
I need that or not?
So that's, that's a really goodpoint, because then the
question for that brand is do Iwant to communicate that to the
customer.
Do I feel proud about that?
There's a way to you know.
First of all, they're going tobe regulated so that information
(36:00):
is going to be out there.
But you could also have a storythat maybe that brand is really
making an effort.
Jamie (36:11):
Yeah.
Julie (36:12):
And that's a good story too.
Jamie (36:13):
Yeah, exactly Right.
So it's like what you weresaying earlier and you line up,
you have this alignment betweenyour efforts and there are I
mean Walmart's, a good exampleof turning it around.
Well, I don't know, I haven'tlooked at them in a while, but
they were turning it around and,you know, becoming a little bit
(36:36):
more aware.
So you get companies and brandsout there that maybe realize
they get shown and then theychange so that can happen.
Going back to something you andI were talking about before we
hit record here was the changeeven in just phrases that are
(36:57):
used, and this happens in allindustries and fields and stuff.
But I think it's a little bitmore emotional here, maybe, or
the relationship between how youmight think about something, or
how a word or a phrase canbecome, you know, sullied in
(37:18):
some way.
You know, and there are peopleout there, I guess, maybe trying
to do that, or maybe it happensby accident or whatever.
But we were talking about likephrases, like social good and
CSR, and and so I wonder if youcould talk a little bit about
that, because I think I'd liketo learn a little bit more about
that and I think it's aninteresting topic of just
(37:40):
language change and phrases andstuff and that.
That, that whole journey, Iguess that we've all taken.
Julie (37:47):
Yeah, yeah, you know when I started out in in the, you
know I use impact in a verybroad sense.
When I started out, you knowthere was philanthropy and there
you know, charitable givingstraight up, very clear and just
(38:08):
the beginnings of sociallyresponsible investing.
Even though sociallyresponsible investing has
actually been around in the USfor a very long time, it was
started by actually a religiousorganization way back when.
That's a whole nother story andat that time it was quite clear
(38:28):
Either you made a charitabledonation or you invested your
dollars aligned with your values, and you were sure to lose
money.
Jamie (38:39):
Right.
Julie (38:39):
And then everything changed.
There became, you know, charityeven became much more
complicated because you havethings like donor advised funds
and in the donor advised fundsand in your philanthropic
endowment, if you have afoundation, you can invest that
(39:00):
those dollars into for-profitinvestments, hopefully, that are
also aligned with your values.
But then social responsibleinvesting, you know, just caught
on fire and it became impactinvesting and values aligned
investing and all of thesethings.
(39:28):
We started to have CSR,corporate Social Responsibility
in companies, and then out ofthat we got DE&I.
Now we have heads ofsustainability at most
corporations and then, flowingout of that, we have a lot of
(39:50):
chief creative officers, chiefinnovation officers and, for
whatever reason, a lot of thesetitles became very problematic
and political.
I think that when we startedwith socially responsible
(40:13):
investing, it was clear that noone was making money and so that
, unfortunately, that belief up.
And then, on the philanthropicside, when you have a CSR
(40:39):
officer, it's not just feel good, it's actually for the good of
the company, which is directlytied to bottom line.
It all becomes very touchy andwhen you know I think that we
(41:00):
should just be looking at it.
This is for the common good,it's for the good of a business.
It's for the good of a cause.
It's for the good of theemployees.
It's for the good of theemployees.
(41:22):
Language is constantly evolvingand our approach to social good
is constantly evolving.
I would say it's great that ESGand the UN, sdgs and impact
investing, I think, has become apart of more mainstream
conversation.
Jamie (41:38):
Yeah, I think it has.
And yeah, I guess, like whatI've seen at different companies
is, I mean, now of course,there's a lot of awareness on
employee well-being and, youknow, mental health and stuff,
and that gets sometimes tiedinto that as well.
So it does seem to be everchanging.
And I guess, how you end updefining yourself within the
(42:02):
field.
Maybe you do have to be careful, but there now are different
perceptions of these, differentacronyms and words and stuff,
which is interesting how it alldeveloped.
So, julie, what is your website?
So everyone knows where to gowwwplusmedia.
Julie (42:26):
all lowercase one word dot solutions plus media
solutions dot solutions.
Jamie (42:37):
Plus media solutions Great, very easy Plus media
solutions.
Is there anything else that youfeel like I didn't ask or you
want to let everybody know?
Julie (42:42):
I think you know.
Going back to to really wherewe started stories are great.
Stories make us human, we welove them.
Stories are great Stories makeus human, we love them, but they
don't make change.
People make change and whatwe've been missing is that
bridge to give people tools totake action that feel right to
(43:07):
them, and and then measuringwhat actually works.
And then measuring whatactually works.
So it's not complicated, itjust hasn't existed before.
And when something's new, youknow people have a lot of
(43:27):
questions about it, but it'stime for people to act on their
interests and to act for thecommon good, and plus, media is
just there to make it easy andmeasurable.
Jamie (43:36):
That's well said.
You're reminding me of likewhen you're at like a gala, you
know, and you're there andyou're feeling inspired, and
then people start.
There's the auction or whowants to donate more, and
everyone starts, and you're,everyone starts and you're
getting people when they feelpassionate right, and that's the
(43:58):
whole thing is that when youwatch something, then you
literally wake up the next dayand sort of shrug your shoulders
about it and go and not recyclethat can or whatever, but when
you have that passion you justsaw this thing then, boom, you
get hit with that next thing andkeep that, keep on that path,
(44:19):
and that's the key.
And that is really a key thing,I think, when you're talking
about, you know, impact andsocial good and whatnot, is that
there are these moments ofpassion and they do become
easily forgotten and and butwhen you can act on them and the
thing is too like what you'redoing, people want that, you
know.
They want that path.
(44:41):
You're clearing a path for them.
They'll take that path, they'llfollow that passion, so that
inaction is made and it's great.
Well, julie, thank you forjoining us.
I learned a lot and I want tothank everyone for watching or
listening and, uh, we'll see younext time great Take care.
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