June 6, 2023 • 39 mins
In recent years, roughly half of the motorcyclists involved in fatal crashes in Texas were unlicensed. Safety advocates are working to enlist more instructors who can help riders develop the safety skills they need.
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Episode Transcript
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Bernie Fette (host) (00:14):
Hello and welcome to Thinking
Transportation -- conversationsabout how we get ourselves and
the things we need from oneplace to another. I'm Bernie
Fette with the Texas A&MTransportation Institute.
Motorcycle riders face a fargreater risk than other roadway
travelers. About 30 percent ofmotorcycle crashes result in
(00:37):
death or serious injury, butthat's true for only about 3
percent of car and truckcrashes. The reasons for that
might seem obvious. For one,motorcycles don't offer the
same protection that cars andtrucks do, and because they
take up less space on theroads, they're simply harder
for us to see. One thing thatmotorcycles and other vehicles
(00:59):
share in common, of course, isthat both require an operator's
license. But according to theNational Highway Traffic Safety
Administration, 30 percent ofmotorcyclists involved in a
fatal crash in 2019 weredriving without a valid
motorcycle license. In Texas ,that number is more than 50
(01:20):
percent. It's a complex andpersistent problem. We have two
guests with us today who canhelp us understand it a bit
more clearly. Cathy Brooks is aproject specialist at TTI, and
Michael Strong is a programmanager at the Texas Department
of Licensing and Regulation.
Cathy, Michael, thank you forjoining us today.
Michael Strawn (guest) (01:45):
Thank you for having us.
Cathy Brooks (guest) (01:45):
Yes, thank you for having us.
Bernie Fette (01:49):
We're going to be talking today about your
efforts to increase the numberof motorcycle safety
instructors in Texas. But justfor background, can you begin
please by giving people a senseof the motorcycle safety
challenge in recent years? Whatcan you tell us about the
number of crashes andfatalities and injuries?
Cathy Brooks (02:11):
So , yes, Bernie, over the last several years,
the motorcycle crashes ingeneral have been on the rise.
That includes our fatalitiesand our suspected serious
injuries. Some of the factorsthat are prevalent are impaired
riders. Speed is another largefactor. And unfortunately the
(02:33):
number of unlicensedmotorcyclists has also been on
the rise. In Texas, to gain amotorcycle license for your
first time, you are required totake an entry level rider
course.
Bernie Fette (02:50):
And that's simply a step that a large number of
people have just chosen not totake.
Cathy Brooks (02:54):
That's speculative. It's hard to tell
why people are not licensed,whether or not they're taking
the course and not gettingtheir license or just not
taking the course. Mm-hmm .
Bernie Fette (03:07):
You mentioned , uh, speed and alcohol
impairment as two of the moreprevalent causes is just the
fact that motorcycles aresmaller and so perhaps less
easy for the rest of us to seeor we're unaccustomed to
looking for them. Is therevisibility, their, I think you
call it conspicuity also afactor.
Cathy Brooks (03:28):
Yeah. Conspicuity is a major issue. Size and
shape -- we're narrower. It'sharder for drivers to determine
our speed and our distance, andif you're not consciously
looking for something, you maynot see it. That inattentional
blindness comes into effect.
Bernie Fette (03:51):
Okay. I have a couple of questions that you
may not have data for, but I'vebeen wondering about as I was
preparing for our visit today.
Is there anything in the way ofthat motorcycles have evolved
over the years that makes adifference in the crash
numbers? And I'm asking thatbecause they seem to be much
faster and more powerful thanthe ones that I remember from
(04:13):
my teenage years. Is thereanything to that or is that
just something that I'm kind ofimagining?
Cathy Brooks (04:20):
They're definitely larger size engines.
They're definitely morepowerful and bigger than they
used to be when I first was ona motorcycle at probably two
years old. But whether or notthat's a factor, no, I don't
have any data on that.
Bernie Fette (04:35):
Don't have .
Okay. And I noticed that maybeit has something to do with the
size of the engines that youwere talking about, but they
seem to be louder too.
Cathy Brooks (04:43):
There are some brands that the loud pipes and
the specific noises they makeare, their trademark. There are
some others that are very quietand now we are seeing an
increase also in the electricmotorcycle industry. So there
are no, no sounds coming fromthose at all.
Bernie Fette (05:04):
Quieter, still.
Yeah. And I know that this mayseem to be a bit of a stretch,
but I was wondering if they arelouder, the ones that are
louder, might that make themeasier to notice? Because in
other words , their loudnessmakes them any safer because
they're more likely to see themif we hear them coming. And
again, probably no data there,but is there anything to that
(05:24):
assumption? I see you're kindof shaking your head there,
Michael.
Cathy Brooks (05:28):
, I say
no. Uh , loud pipes are not
necessarily something thathelp. Personal experience. I
was on my motorcycle on afreeway going speed 70 miles an
hour probably, and checking mymirrors, my 360 awareness to
know what's going on, don't seeanything, and then all of a
sudden there's this loud noiseto my right and it was a
(05:51):
motorcycle passing me. I didn'tsee it or didn't hear it until
it was right next to me andactually made me jump. Not
something that's the safe thingto do on a motorcycle at 70
miles an hour. So that's, somepeople say loud pipes save
lives. I don't necessarilyagree with that statement.
Bernie Fette (06:10):
Michael. It seemed that you might have had
something to add there.
Michael Strawn (06:13):
Yeah, I mean, as Cathy said, when it comes to
the loud pipes, there is alwaysa saying that loud pipes save
lives. Having ridden for many,many years now. And a proponent
of loving to hear my motorcycleor car, I can tell you that you
don't hear a car or motorcycleapproaching until it's already
(06:34):
upon you. The noise is exitingthe opposite direction. It's
highly unlikely it's going todo anything. Riders oftentimes
think that they're gonna revversus uh , honk at somebody as
well. And those are factorsthat a motorist is not ready
for. You know, they're used towhat a horn means. They're not
used to what the sound of arevving engine behind them
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means. And it can causepanicking. It really doesn't
induce as much safety asindividuals might think that it
is. It could be a false senseof security when riding out
there. And that's somethingthat the industry,
motorcyclists out there need tobe conscientious of, that you
are responsible for your safetyat all times. There are a lot
of riders out there, accordingto crash statistics that come
(07:19):
from Texas Department ofTransportation, TxDOT, that 45
percent of all crashes, peopleare not wearing a helmet, you
know, not wearing appropriategear. Motorcycle doesn't have a
shell around it. As you said,it doesn't have a cage around
to protect the rider, theoccupants. So the next best
step that we have is safetygear. And that's one thing that
we try to preach througheducation, training, awareness
(07:42):
is, you hear this term all thetime, it's called ATGATT -- all
the gear all the time. Wearingboots , uh, proper gloves,
helmets. Those do go very farinto saving not only your skin
but your actual life in manysituations. In 2021, there were
over 520 motorcyclists thatwere killed in accidents. It is
(08:03):
certainly something that wehave to take into account how
to increase the safety, how toincrease the awareness, the
visibility, all aspects ofmotorcycle safety from top to
bottom. It is a challenge thatwe are trying to do our best to
overcome.
Bernie Fette (08:17):
We've noted that crash numbers are going up at
the same time. There's anothernumber that's going down and
that's the number of motorcyclesafety instructors in Texas.
And those instructors, ofcourse are very important to
teaching the differences inoperating a motorcycle versus a
standard motor vehicle. AndTexas doesn't have enough of
(08:39):
them. Is that right?
Michael Strawn (08:40):
Bernie -- I mean, that's what we hear from
the industry. That is the needfor more instructors. Several
years ago, there was a newtraining program that came in
before my agency, TexasDepartment of Licensing and
Regulation took over thisindustry and we saw a
significant dip in the amountof instructors because of a new
training program. And sincethen we have worked diligently
(09:02):
to try and create and foster anenvironment to create new
instructors. When we, we cameinto this, there was a decline
in the number of instructorsand since then we've gone from
about 240 instructors to about260, 265 instructors at
current. What we hear from theindustry is that's not enough
to serve the industry that wehave out there. We see about
(09:26):
30,000 students coming throughall of our training programs
every year. That's 30,000interested parties that are
seeking to get a motorcyclelicense. Now that's great and
we'd love to see 30,000, butwe'd love to see every single
person, 40,000, 50,000,whatever it looks like in the
state of Texas. Everybodythat's seeking education should
(09:47):
have that opportunity andshould have the opportunity to
get into a class quickly, as weknow is individuals that may
not be able to get into a classeasily or quickly or near them
may seek to ride unlicensed.
And when they start ridingunlicensed, it's gonna be a
very unlikely scenario thatthey all of a sudden , you
(10:08):
know, six months later, a yearlater decide that they need to
come back to what they see as aremedial class at that point in
time. They've been riding for afew months and they're managing
to figure it out on their ownand then getting them to come
back in -- that's its ownchallenge. So making sure that
education is available,plentiful and available in a
(10:29):
timely manner is how we instilla safety minded mindset out
there for individuals.
Bernie Fette (10:36):
Right. And there are certainly implications to
the problem of having notenough instructors, but before
we get into some detail onthat, maybe I can ask you,
Cathy. Michael was just talkingabout availability of the
courses and also the numbers.
Am I understanding right, inthinking that you may have
quite a few customers,potential customers out there,
(10:59):
if we can call 'em that for asafety course, but just because
of distance or availability orconvenience, that's a big
reason why they're not takingthe course?
Cathy Brooks (11:12):
That's our understanding, yes.
Bernie Fette (11:14):
Why does that shortage exist?
Cathy Brooks (11:16):
There's multiple factors. I believe in that over
the years we've seen attritionwith rider instructors when the
core curriculum changes. Forinstance, the Motorcycle Safety
Foundation Basic Rider Coursehas been a staple in Texas for
many, many years and theychange their curriculum every
(11:39):
five to 10 years. And when Ifirst became an instructor
myself, I took the basic ridercourse to get my license to
waive the riding portion of alicense in Texas. And at that
time they were pilot testing inTexas, the new curriculum for
the Motorcycle SafetyFoundation or the MSF. And the
(12:00):
reason I took that course waswith my father because a family
friend of ours had mentioned tohim as he was retiring for the
second time, that you shouldfind out about becoming an
instructor because we're losinginstructors through this change
of curriculum. And that wasback in 2003. We had another
change in curriculum or anotherupdate more recently. And then
(12:23):
when the change from the TexasDepartment of Public Safety or
DPS to TDLR caused anotherattrition, people are like,
yeah , don't like change. It'stime for me to stop doing this.
So that's one major factor. Ithink that's when we have our
biggest loss of instructors.
Bernie Fette (12:43):
So you've got changes in the curriculum that
happen and the instructors thatyou already have that are
qualified choose to not becomere-certified because it's just
too onerous or burdensome forthem to make those adjustments?
Cathy Brooks (12:58):
That or they're comfortable where they are and
they don't like change.
Bernie Fette (13:03):
So you're not keeping the ones that you have
and at the same time you're notrecruiting the new ones. So
you've got the problem iscompounded.
Cathy Brooks (13:10):
At least not at the same rates . Correct.
Bernie Fette (13:12):
Is this a problem elsewhere in the United States
or is this largely a Texasthing that the number of safety
instructors is declining?
Cathy Brooks (13:21):
With my experience working with other
states and being part of theState Motorcycle Safety
Association, it's a nationalissue. This thing is fairly
common nationwide.
Michael Strawn (13:33):
Bernie, and another thing here is outside
of the Motorcycle SafetyFoundation certification
process or total control safetycertification process that we
have, Texas also has its ownmotorcycle instructor license.
So there are a few additionalqualifications that that
instructor must go through herein Texas to become a motorcycle
(13:53):
instructor rather than just anendorsement from the curriculum
providers that are out there.
Bernie Fette (13:59):
Meaning that it's just a little more difficult in
Texas to reach a standard ofbeing able to give qualified
instruction.
Michael Strawn (14:07):
Here in Texas, we're not really adding
additional regulations or a tonof red tape for individuals to
go through. There are safetyaspects and why we provide a
license for instructors toteach in Texas, a lot of that
deals with safety, interactingwith the citizens of Texas.
Instructors around minors,around students, they're out
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there , uh, teachingindividuals how to be a safe
rider . So there's somebackground checks that are
there in place, right there isdriver history checks that are
done on them , make sure thatthey're a safe rider . You
know, if you don't practicewhat you preach, you're
probably not going to be ableto speak that safety mindset to
the individuals that you'reteaching out there. There are
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some things such as CPR , uh,first aid requirements because
if there is an accident on therange while training
individuals, we wanna make surethese instructors are as best
equipped to tend to thatmedical need while waiting on
emergency services as possible.
Bernie Fette (15:08):
Anything to add, Cathy?
Cathy Brooks (15:09):
Texas is not the only state in the union that
requires additional steps. Insome states all they need is
the curriculum providercertification, but in several
states there are thoseadditional layers to be
approved in the state. Myunderstanding in looking into
some of the other staterequirements, Texas is not one
that is onerous. It may take alittle time for the checks to
(15:32):
go through and the reports tocome back once the paperwork is
submitted to TDLR.
Michael Strawn (15:38):
And those are areas, you know, when we
inherited this program,everything is done on paper. It
didn't come to us in alicensing database, and it's
something here within the nextfew days. Actually within the
next two weeks, we're movingthis program into our licensing
database where applicants canthen pay online, renew online ,
uh, manage their accountonline, upload documents. The
(16:00):
other hurdle that we had wasthe current pathway into
becoming an instructor in Texascreated a framework where all
training is given through asingle entity. That's something
that there's currentlegislation out there that may
be changing this here verysoon, but that actually could
be seen as onerous for manyindividuals. It can be
difficult to travel across thestate to one location for nine
(16:22):
days-plus of training to beaway from your work, friends,
family, whatever it may be.
That pathway to becoming aninstructor. We've heard some
feedback that that can be verydifficult at this point in
time, and it is something thatwe're vehemently working
towards resolving and makingsure that anything that we are
doing as a function is not aregulatory hurdle for
(16:45):
individuals that want to be amotorcycle safety instructor in
this state. They have theopportunity and the
availability to do so.
Bernie Fette (16:52):
You're trying to make it as seamless and simple
for people to reach that goalof certification within the
framework or within therequirements that you have to
just in the interest of, ofsafety and security for
everybody involved. Soundslike.
Michael Strawn (17:06):
Yes, sir.
Anything that we can do tofacilitate a quicker, more
accessible pathway forindividuals to become a
motorcycle instructor in thestate of Texas within the
confines of the laws and rulesthat we have for this program,
that is absolutely our mission.
Cathy Brooks (17:24):
In addition to what Michael said about the
legislation that may be makingit easier for instructors to
get training, he mentioned inone location and nine days
consecutive. That's a majorhurdle for a lot of potential
instructors. There are multipleways that other states are
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offering this training. It is anine-day program from the MSF,
to become what they call arider coach. So it's a rider
coach prep, and it's typicallya nine-day training that is in
person nine days. And there aresome states that do it over
three weekends. There are someplaces that do it over two
weekends. Texas has typicallybeen the nine days straight. So
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that's somebody taking off ofwork potentially. And if you
aren't having paid vacation,that's already an obstacle to
come over, plus the cost of theclass, plus the cost of room
and board for that nine days,et cetera . But being able to
have multiple providers thatcan do the training opens up
(18:30):
the opportunity to have it indifferent regions of the state
and to open it up to differentschedules. There is one benefit
I guess you could call it , uh,when Covid hit, it really shut
down a lot of the in-persontraining, both for motorcycle
training classes to the publicas well as training new
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instructors or rider coaches.
There is one company thatworked with the MSF to come up
with a hybrid of virtualtraining session to get you
started, and then it's afour-day in person . That's
another opportunity to make itmore accessible to more people.
(19:14):
That being said, that's onecompany nationwide that does
it, and they do provide it indifferent states, and they
could offer it in Texas if theyfollow the rules of TDLR and
apply to become approved orlicensed by TDLR.
Michael Strawn (19:29):
With pending legislation if it passes. At
its current, there's a singlesource of training in Texas.
But if legislation passes, thenyes, we would seek to develop
rules around the new regulatoryframework that we would have .
Bernie Fette (19:43):
Let's talk for just a minute if we can, about
the implications of thisinstructor shortage. You've got
a shrinking number ofinstructors, you've got a
growing number of unlicensedriders and you've got an
increase in crash injuries anddeaths. I'm not a scientist,
I'm not a researcher, but if weput all those things together
(20:06):
into one collective thought,that suggests to me that
there's a connection. Am Istretching things there or is
there a connection between thecrash trend and the declining
number of instructors?
Cathy Brooks (20:20):
Yes, Bernie. I would say that can't make a
direct causal, but there is acorrelation. There would be
seemingly a correlation betweenthe number of unlicensed
riders, unlicensed ridercrashes, fatalities, and
serious injuries stemming fromthe lack of instructors, which
(20:42):
would be a lack of potentialclasses available or classes
being canceled for lack ofinstructors across the state.
Michael Strawn (20:50):
I would echo much of what Cathy said. We
have individuals out there muchsmarter than us that that look
at this. And I don't know ifthere's still one consensus out
there. There's certainlycorrelation. You know, we see
an increase in alcohol use,we've seen an increase in the
number of distracted drivingcases out there, and there's
far severely underreported inthose number of crashes as
(21:11):
well. And one minor mistakefrom a motorist interacting
with a motorcyclist that isdistracted is potentially
fatal. There are a lot offactors that go into play here.
Certainly education, as youheard me say earlier, is top of
that list, making sure that wehave safe rider that have the
skillsets and the basis. Youknow, when you're going to
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these motorcycle trainingcourses, it's not a punishment,
it's not remedial. It is givingyou the basis and the
foundation to build yournecessary skills every day
while you're out there ridingon the road, learning how to
emergency brake, your avoidancetechniques, things like that,
all skill sets that you shouldbe practicing out there. And a
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lot of these riders who are notgoing through these education
aren't able to ascertain.
There's a lot of factors outthere. We certainly know the
education and making theeducation readily available is
step one into mitigating asmany of these factors as
possible.
Cathy Brooks (22:12):
As Michael said, having the proper knowledge and
skillset does improve safety.
And as he said, it's notnecessarily remedial. I've had
students that have been ridingfor years that got caught
without a license and comethrough the basic course and
they start out a little saltyabout it, but at the end
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they're like, I learnedsomething. As Michael said
earlier, we are responsible forour own safety on the roads as
motorcyclists. So if we cankeep safety top of mind, if we
can understand that othermotorists may not perceive us,
they may not see us, they maynot understand how quickly we
(22:56):
are going or how far away weare, if we can ride like we're
invisible. If we can usetechniques to be more
conspicuous, those things helpus stay safer on the roads as
motorcyclists. And those arethings that you learn in the
motorcycle safety courses.
Bernie Fette (23:12):
You've mentioned specifically that the kind of
people that you're looking forhave to have a hunger for this.
They have to have a real desireto be an instructor, they have
to have a certain mindset. In anutshell, what does it take to
become a really good motorcyclesafety instructor?
Cathy Brooks (23:28):
That's a tough nut to crack. Actually.
With some of the research thatwe've done over the last few
years with this project throughTDLR. There's three themes that
we came up with. One is alifelong learner. So as a
motorcyclist, if you're alwaystrying to self-assess, you're
trying to get better, you wannaimprove your skills. Another
one is sharing the passion.
(23:49):
This is something that I loveto do and I want to help others
find the joy that I find inmotorcycling. And the third one
is a legacy of learning. Sothis most recent research that
we did found that somebody whowants to give back to the
community, somebody that is anatural mentor, somebody who
(24:11):
finds that people come to themfor advice, teachers, coaches,
those people that like doingthat, that like sharing their
knowledge, that like helpingothers. Those are the kind of
people that make really goodinstructors. Tail onto that, as
Michael said earlier, ATGATT,is it somebody who's wearing
all the gear all the time? Isit somebody that has a good
driving record? Is it somebodythat's already practicing
(24:35):
safety in their own ridingexperiences?
Bernie Fette (24:38):
They have to model good behavior, in other
words.
Cathy Brooks (24:41):
Correct . And if that's something that you're
already doing, then that'seasier for them to be genuine
when they're teaching that in aclass or on the range.
Michael Strawn (24:50):
And Bernie, I want to kind of segue off of
that. As Cathy says, there's alot of new information we're
learning out there, and I thinkthat's one of the beautiful
things that's come from thispartnership between Texas A&M
Transportation Institute andTexas Department of Licensing
and Regulation. For the firsttime we're really doing these
surveys and they're trying todrive down into what retains
(25:11):
instructors, what makes peopleinterested in this, what
creates a great instructor andwhat values they bring, and how
do we retain those individuals.
And those are questions wehaven't asked in the past that
I'm aware of and you know, butmoving forward, we look at the
rider engagement, theinstructor engagement, how to
obtain and retain all of thosepeople and make lifelong
(25:32):
learners. And that's what makesmotorcycling so passionate and
so loved by so many individualsis you're always out there and
there's always something new.
There's always a way to bebetter. And there's always that
excitement and that joy thatcomes with it. Our inherent
dangers and being able to growand learn, figuring out what
(25:53):
encapsulates all that and howto bring that passion and that
knowledge into an instructor toshare with everybody and how to
retain that individual. That iswhere our focus is now. What
does that person look like?
What are their interests andhow do we retain them? And how
do we get that individual toshare that wealth of knowledge,
that passion and that sense ofsafety and security out there
(26:15):
to new riders that are comingin.
Bernie Fette (26:18):
You've both done a really nice job of painting a
picture of what your idealinstructor might look like,
think like, sound like. And itsounds like the work that
you're doing with the surveysand research that you're both
working on is you're trying tomaybe narrow your market a
little bit and try to identifythose people who might be the
most receptive to taking thispath. Is that right?
Cathy Brooks (26:41):
Yes, sir. That's right. And in addition to that,
I think getting people that maynot have ever considered taking
that path to say, okay , maybethat's something I could look
into, right . For myself, whenthe coach that I went through a
class to get my street license,my motorcycle license in Texas
suggested I become a coach.
(27:01):
I've never been on the streets,why would I be a coach?
Currently there is a two-yearwait after you have a
motorcycle license, before youcan become an instructor in
Texas.
Bernie Fette (27:11):
Okay .
Cathy Brooks (27:12):
But at the time that I became an instructor,
that wasn't a rule. And so Ispent the next year going to
different locations across thestate, different training
schools across the state, andworked as what they called a
range aide. I would be sittingthrough the classroom and
observing. I would be out onthe range helping them place
(27:35):
the cones and move the bikes asneeded. And I watched students,
people who were terrified toput their leg over a motorcycle
who'd never done it before, andby the end of the first day,
they're accomplishingsomething. It's something that
I've called seeing a smileinside a full-face helmet
because their eyes aretwinkling with the joy and the
(27:56):
excitement and the fun. Andit's like, it gave me a sense
of awe , I guess, and inspiredme to, yeah, this is something
that I, I can see myself doingand I've been doing for almost
20 years now.
Michael Strawn (28:08):
And Bernie, as Cathy said, a big part of this
endeavor is reaching newindividuals out there, whether
that's a , a young individual ,uh, that has a , a history of
riding in their family and youknow, has been dirt riding
before they ever saw thestreet. We want to find those
individuals and make them awareof this path and this
(28:28):
opportunity exists. Uh, there'sseveral young instructors that
have come out in the pastcouple years that are doing
this on the weekends whilethey're going through college.
It's , it may be something theyretain for years while they
even get into a differentpathway. Some individuals do
this full-time, some people doit part-time. Many individuals
don't know it even exists andthat this is an opportunity for
(28:49):
them. One of the big focuses ofthis survey is for us to be
able to capture new riders thatare interested in this and that
have that skillset and thatcorrect mindset to be an
instructor and to promotesafety in Texas.
Bernie Fette (29:06):
This is a really broad and deep topic, and
there's no way we could coverall of it in just in the
limited time that we've got,but if you wanted people who
are listening to remember justone really important thing that
we talked about today, whatwould that be? Let's call it
your elevator speech.
Michael Strawn (29:24):
For me, I'm gonna say trained riders are
safe riders. At the end of theday, getting that education,
that awareness out there,making this an easy lifestyle,
hobby, industry, whateverpathway you, you deem that you
wanna come into this or , uh,whatever capacity you are into
this motorcycle lifestyle, wewant to make sure that
(29:48):
individuals are trained andthey're safe. There's a ton of
great education and materialsout there that give you that
foundation to continually buildyour skills in the correct
manner. We wanna make sure thateducation and those
opportunities are available toeverybody. Learning bad habits,
trying to learn on your own,those are things that you're
building on bad habits andthere's a lot of things out
(30:11):
there that can really getriders into trouble. And I
still hear a lot of confusion.
People confused about thecomplexity of, do I need a
motorcycle to go take alicensing test down at
Department of Public Safety?
That was years and years ago.
Those misnomers still existtoday. This is something that
the education's so importantto, to everything because
(30:33):
riding unlicensed, ridingdirty, whatever you want to
call it, it's costly. Whetherthat's money in the way of
tickets, crashes, motorcyclesare not cheap anymore, can be
extremely costly, and that thehighest price you can pay is
your life or the life ofsomeone else. It is a, a
brotherhood in a lot of ways.
It's a giant family, and that'sbecause we are all out there
(30:56):
together on these roads. We'resharing these roads together. I
hope everybody that getsinterested in this community
helps everybody be smarter. Ithelps everybody be safer.
Bernie Fette (31:06):
Cathy, what's your big takeaway?
Cathy Brooks (31:10):
In my experience as an instructor, it's a lot
easier to take someone that'snever ridden and build good
habits than someone who hasridden and break bad ones. So
having access to rider safetytraining, being licensed helps
increase that knowledge, thoseskill sets that help riders be
(31:33):
safer on the roadway and helpmitigate their risk on the
roads. To have those classesavailable, we need to have
instructors, people that arepassionate, caring, want to
share, safe themselves, genuineto be a part of those efforts.
To keep riders safe on thestreets is a lot of people that
(31:55):
don't know they need to have amotorcycle license to ride a
motorcycle. That's one barrier.
There's a lot of people thatthink that when they graduate
this class that, that MSB- 8that Michael mentioned, which
is their Texas specificcompletion certificate that you
take to the licensing office toget your motorcycle license.
(32:15):
That's all they need, and it'snot, they need to go and
actually get the licenseknowing that there's classes
available, knowing where theyare. Having the instructors to
fill the schedules based on thedemand of those that wanna take
the class are important for usto fulfill . And right now,
we're not being able to fulfillthat need. The joy we feel when
(32:37):
you're riding a motorcycle is ajoy that you can see blossom in
somebody else is well worth theeffort to take the training to
become an instructor. Beingable to grow that next
generation of motorcyclists ina manner that can help them be
safe riders for a very longtime. It's inherently dangerous
to ride a motorcycle and overhalf of our fatalities, are
(33:01):
motorcycle-only crashes. Sohaving not just the skillset ,
but the mindset of being a saferider is very, very important
to help reduce those, thosefatality numbers.
Bernie Fette (33:18):
Last question.
What is it that makes you bothwant to get up and come to work
every day ?
Cathy Brooks (33:28):
That's an interesting question for me,
Bernie. This isn't somewhere Iwould've seen myself, as I
mentioned earlier, I took themotorcycle safety course to get
a license to be able to testride bikes and was suggested
that I become a coach. Neverthought I'd be. I can't do
that. I'm, I'm too new. And Ispent the next year no longer
(33:48):
being new. There was a periodof time that I went and did my
end-of-year taxes and I'd onlytaught eight classes that year.
And the person that I workedwith, a friend of mine said,
you're miserable. Go teach aclass. Or a weekend that I
taught a class, she'd come andsay, you taught a class this
weekend. And it wasn't justbecause my red face from the
(34:10):
sun, but my whole attitudechanged. It's something that
recharges my batteries. Nomatter how much training we do,
no matter how much we we learn,we can't always fix what
happens on the roadway. I'm amother of four, one of three
generations of motorcyclesafety instructors in Texas,
(34:35):
and I lost my husband to amotorcycle crash. I lost my
husband to a motorcycle crash.
In addition to being thatinstructor, I started getting
involved with the TexasMotorcycle Safety Coalition
that sponsored through TTI andthe Texas Department of
Transportation's MotorcycleSafety Education and Outreach
(34:55):
Program. What's led me heretoday. My grandfather rode, my
father rode, found a picturerecently of me sitting on a
motorcycle with my dad when Iwas maybe two years old. My
children, all four of them havemotorcycle licenses, and my
daughter is also a motorcycletraining instructor. This is my
(35:18):
family. It was a motorcyclecommunity that was a big
supporter when my husband died.
It's my family. And I wannakeep my family safe and I want
them to be happy and find thejoy of motorcycling going
forward.
Bernie Fette (35:35):
It is so admirable that you could
channel your experience, yourloss in this way, Cathy. Thank
you for being brave enough toshare your story. You're an
inspiration, Michael. That's atough act to follow.
Michael Strawn (35:48):
Absolutely, and I mean, I, I can't do any
amount of justice or service tothis as much as Cathy has given
to this community. And Cathy, Imean, my heart goes out to you
that knows something that's inevery student you train. I know
that passion and that love thatyou had for your husband is
carried into that. And Bernie ,you ask a really tough question
(36:11):
and you know, I had to thinkabout it. But at the end of the
day, it really comes down tofamily. And it sounds parroting
a little bit what Cathy said,but my mom rides. My dad used
to ride. My cousins ride. Ihave a license. And you know,
if I have kids that are outthere on the roadway, I look at
that. If something happened tomy dad, to my cousin, to
(36:33):
anybody out there that I know,even that I don't know, that's
my own personal responsibility.
I have to do what I can withinmy powers and then some to make
this as safe as it can be. Itshould never be that someone
was injured or killed becauseof a policy or the lack of
(36:58):
training or whatever roadblockthat they saw or they
inherently believe was in theirpathway to obtaining that
education that could have savedtheir life. I don't want that
for my family. I don't wantthat for anybody else's family
out there. I never want to heara story like Cathy's ever
again. Luckily she's turned outon something beautiful in
(37:20):
helping other people and if Icould emulate somebody here, I
mean, that would be exactlywhat I would do is take my
knowledge and my passion and mylove and uh , responsibility
for this program and channelthat into all those things that
can help protect all of ourcitizens here in Texas and
anybody that's on our roadways.
Bernie Fette (37:39):
We have been visiting with Cathy Brooks, a
project specialist at TTI andMichael Strong, a program
manager for the TexasDepartment of Licensing and
Regulation. Cathy, Michael,thank you so much for sharing
your time and your insight andyour passion with us. Thank you
for working to make roadwaytravel safer for all of us. We
(38:02):
appreciate you.
Michael Strawn (38:03):
Thank you, Bernie.
Cathy Brooks (38:04):
Thank you, Bernie.
Bernie Fette (38:05):
Motorcycles make up only about 3 percent of all
registered vehicles, but peoplewho ride them account for
almost 15 percent of alltraffic deaths. The number of
motorcycle fatalities has beenon a steady increase in recent
years up by about 20 percentover the past decade. Also on
(38:28):
the rise is the percentage ofunlicensed riders . An entry
level rider safety course isrequired for anyone trying to
get a license, but a shortageof qualified safety instructors
makes it difficult for newriders to access that training.
A statewide recruitment effortaims to change that with plans
(38:50):
to find a lot more writingcoaches with the passion,
knowledge, and desire to helptheir fellow motorcyclists stay
safe. Thanks for listening.
Please take just a minute togive us a review, subscribe and
share this episode, and pleasejoin us again next time for a
(39:11):
conversation with DennisChristensen, director emeritus
of TTI and the founder of theTexas Transportation Hall of
Honor. Thinking Transportationis a production of the Texas
A&M Transportation Institute, amember of the Texas A&M
University System. The show isedited and produced by Chris
(39:32):
Pourteau. I'm your writer andhost, Bernie Fette. Thanks
again for listening. We'll seeyou next time.
Hello and welcome to Thinking
Transportation -- conversationsabout how we get ourselves and
the things we need from oneplace to another. I'm Bernie
Fette with the Texas A&MTransportation Institute.
Motorcycle riders face a fargreater risk than other roadway
travelers. About 30 percent ofmotorcycle crashes result in
(00:37):
death or serious injury, butthat's true for only about 3
percent of car and truckcrashes. The reasons for that
might seem obvious. For one,motorcycles don't offer the
same protection that cars andtrucks do, and because they
take up less space on theroads, they're simply harder
for us to see. One thing thatmotorcycles and other vehicles
(00:59):
share in common, of course, isthat both require an operator's
license. But according to theNational Highway Traffic Safety
Administration, 30 percent ofmotorcyclists involved in a
fatal crash in 2019 weredriving without a valid
motorcycle license. In Texas ,that number is more than 50
(01:20):
percent. It's a complex andpersistent problem. We have two
guests with us today who canhelp us understand it a bit
more clearly. Cathy Brooks is aproject specialist at TTI, and
Michael Strong is a programmanager at the Texas Department
of Licensing and Regulation.
Cathy, Michael, thank you forjoining us today.
Michael Strawn (guest) (01:45):
Thank you for having us.
Cathy Brooks (guest) (01:45):
Yes, thank you for having us.
Bernie Fette (01:49):
We're going to be talking today about your
efforts to increase the numberof motorcycle safety
instructors in Texas. But justfor background, can you begin
please by giving people a senseof the motorcycle safety
challenge in recent years? Whatcan you tell us about the
number of crashes andfatalities and injuries?
Cathy Brooks (02:11):
So , yes, Bernie, over the last several years,
the motorcycle crashes ingeneral have been on the rise.
That includes our fatalitiesand our suspected serious
injuries. Some of the factorsthat are prevalent are impaired
riders. Speed is another largefactor. And unfortunately the
(02:33):
number of unlicensedmotorcyclists has also been on
the rise. In Texas, to gain amotorcycle license for your
first time, you are required totake an entry level rider
course.
Bernie Fette (02:50):
And that's simply a step that a large number of
people have just chosen not totake.
Cathy Brooks (02:54):
That's speculative. It's hard to tell
why people are not licensed,whether or not they're taking
the course and not gettingtheir license or just not
taking the course. Mm-hmm .
Bernie Fette (03:07):
You mentioned , uh, speed and alcohol
impairment as two of the moreprevalent causes is just the
fact that motorcycles aresmaller and so perhaps less
easy for the rest of us to seeor we're unaccustomed to
looking for them. Is therevisibility, their, I think you
call it conspicuity also afactor.
Cathy Brooks (03:28):
Yeah. Conspicuity is a major issue. Size and
shape -- we're narrower. It'sharder for drivers to determine
our speed and our distance, andif you're not consciously
looking for something, you maynot see it. That inattentional
blindness comes into effect.
Bernie Fette (03:51):
Okay. I have a couple of questions that you
may not have data for, but I'vebeen wondering about as I was
preparing for our visit today.
Is there anything in the way ofthat motorcycles have evolved
over the years that makes adifference in the crash
numbers? And I'm asking thatbecause they seem to be much
faster and more powerful thanthe ones that I remember from
(04:13):
my teenage years. Is thereanything to that or is that
just something that I'm kind ofimagining?
Cathy Brooks (04:20):
They're definitely larger size engines.
They're definitely morepowerful and bigger than they
used to be when I first was ona motorcycle at probably two
years old. But whether or notthat's a factor, no, I don't
have any data on that.
Bernie Fette (04:35):
Don't have .
Okay. And I noticed that maybeit has something to do with the
size of the engines that youwere talking about, but they
seem to be louder too.
Cathy Brooks (04:43):
There are some brands that the loud pipes and
the specific noises they makeare, their trademark. There are
some others that are very quietand now we are seeing an
increase also in the electricmotorcycle industry. So there
are no, no sounds coming fromthose at all.
Bernie Fette (05:04):
Quieter, still.
Yeah. And I know that this mayseem to be a bit of a stretch,
but I was wondering if they arelouder, the ones that are
louder, might that make themeasier to notice? Because in
other words , their loudnessmakes them any safer because
they're more likely to see themif we hear them coming. And
again, probably no data there,but is there anything to that
(05:24):
assumption? I see you're kindof shaking your head there,
Michael.
Cathy Brooks (05:28):
necessarily something thathelp. Personal experience. I
was on my motorcycle on afreeway going speed 70 miles an
hour probably, and checking mymirrors, my 360 awareness to
know what's going on, don't seeanything, and then all of a
sudden there's this loud noiseto my right and it was a
(05:51):
motorcycle passing me. I didn'tsee it or didn't hear it until
it was right next to me andactually made me jump. Not
something that's the safe thingto do on a motorcycle at 70
miles an hour. So that's, somepeople say loud pipes save
lives. I don't necessarilyagree with that statement.
Bernie Fette (06:10):
Michael. It seemed that you might have had
something to add there.
Michael Strawn (06:13):
Yeah, I mean, as Cathy said, when it comes to
the loud pipes, there is alwaysa saying that loud pipes save
lives. Having ridden for many,many years now. And a proponent
of loving to hear my motorcycleor car, I can tell you that you
don't hear a car or motorcycleapproaching until it's already
(06:34):
upon you. The noise is exitingthe opposite direction. It's
highly unlikely it's going todo anything. Riders oftentimes
think that they're gonna revversus uh , honk at somebody as
well. And those are factorsthat a motorist is not ready
for. You know, they're used towhat a horn means. They're not
used to what the sound of arevving engine behind them
(06:56):
means. And it can causepanicking. It really doesn't
induce as much safety asindividuals might think that it
is. It could be a false senseof security when riding out
there. And that's somethingthat the industry,
motorcyclists out there need tobe conscientious of, that you
are responsible for your safetyat all times. There are a lot
of riders out there, accordingto crash statistics that come
(07:19):
from Texas Department ofTransportation, TxDOT, that 45
percent of all crashes, peopleare not wearing a helmet, you
know, not wearing appropriategear. Motorcycle doesn't have a
shell around it. As you said,it doesn't have a cage around
to protect the rider, theoccupants. So the next best
step that we have is safetygear. And that's one thing that
we try to preach througheducation, training, awareness
(07:42):
is, you hear this term all thetime, it's called ATGATT -- all
the gear all the time. Wearingboots , uh, proper gloves,
helmets. Those do go very farinto saving not only your skin
but your actual life in manysituations. In 2021, there were
over 520 motorcyclists thatwere killed in accidents. It is
(08:03):
certainly something that wehave to take into account how
to increase the safety, how toincrease the awareness, the
visibility, all aspects ofmotorcycle safety from top to
bottom. It is a challenge thatwe are trying to do our best to
overcome.
Bernie Fette (08:17):
We've noted that crash numbers are going up at
the same time. There's anothernumber that's going down and
that's the number of motorcyclesafety instructors in Texas.
And those instructors, ofcourse are very important to
teaching the differences inoperating a motorcycle versus a
standard motor vehicle. AndTexas doesn't have enough of
(08:39):
them. Is that right?
Michael Strawn (08:40):
Bernie -- I mean, that's what we hear from
the industry. That is the needfor more instructors. Several
years ago, there was a newtraining program that came in
before my agency, TexasDepartment of Licensing and
Regulation took over thisindustry and we saw a
significant dip in the amountof instructors because of a new
training program. And sincethen we have worked diligently
(09:02):
to try and create and foster anenvironment to create new
instructors. When we, we cameinto this, there was a decline
in the number of instructorsand since then we've gone from
about 240 instructors to about260, 265 instructors at
current. What we hear from theindustry is that's not enough
to serve the industry that wehave out there. We see about
(09:26):
30,000 students coming throughall of our training programs
every year. That's 30,000interested parties that are
seeking to get a motorcyclelicense. Now that's great and
we'd love to see 30,000, butwe'd love to see every single
person, 40,000, 50,000,whatever it looks like in the
state of Texas. Everybodythat's seeking education should
(09:47):
have that opportunity andshould have the opportunity to
get into a class quickly, as weknow is individuals that may
not be able to get into a classeasily or quickly or near them
may seek to ride unlicensed.
And when they start ridingunlicensed, it's gonna be a
very unlikely scenario thatthey all of a sudden , you
(10:08):
know, six months later, a yearlater decide that they need to
come back to what they see as aremedial class at that point in
time. They've been riding for afew months and they're managing
to figure it out on their ownand then getting them to come
back in -- that's its ownchallenge. So making sure that
education is available,plentiful and available in a
(10:29):
timely manner is how we instilla safety minded mindset out
there for individuals.
Bernie Fette (10:36):
Right. And there are certainly implications to
the problem of having notenough instructors, but before
we get into some detail onthat, maybe I can ask you,
Cathy. Michael was just talkingabout availability of the
courses and also the numbers.
Am I understanding right, inthinking that you may have
quite a few customers,potential customers out there,
(10:59):
if we can call 'em that for asafety course, but just because
of distance or availability orconvenience, that's a big
reason why they're not takingthe course?
Cathy Brooks (11:12):
That's our understanding, yes.
Bernie Fette (11:14):
Why does that shortage exist?
Cathy Brooks (11:16):
There's multiple factors. I believe in that over
the years we've seen attritionwith rider instructors when the
core curriculum changes. Forinstance, the Motorcycle Safety
Foundation Basic Rider Coursehas been a staple in Texas for
many, many years and theychange their curriculum every
(11:39):
five to 10 years. And when Ifirst became an instructor
myself, I took the basic ridercourse to get my license to
waive the riding portion of alicense in Texas. And at that
time they were pilot testing inTexas, the new curriculum for
the Motorcycle SafetyFoundation or the MSF. And the
(12:00):
reason I took that course waswith my father because a family
friend of ours had mentioned tohim as he was retiring for the
second time, that you shouldfind out about becoming an
instructor because we're losinginstructors through this change
of curriculum. And that wasback in 2003. We had another
change in curriculum or anotherupdate more recently. And then
(12:23):
when the change from the TexasDepartment of Public Safety or
DPS to TDLR caused anotherattrition, people are like,
yeah , don't like change. It'stime for me to stop doing this.
So that's one major factor. Ithink that's when we have our
biggest loss of instructors.
Bernie Fette (12:43):
So you've got changes in the curriculum that
happen and the instructors thatyou already have that are
qualified choose to not becomere-certified because it's just
too onerous or burdensome forthem to make those adjustments?
Cathy Brooks (12:58):
That or they're comfortable where they are and
they don't like change.
Bernie Fette (13:03):
So you're not keeping the ones that you have
and at the same time you're notrecruiting the new ones. So
you've got the problem iscompounded.
Cathy Brooks (13:10):
At least not at the same rates . Correct.
Bernie Fette (13:12):
Is this a problem elsewhere in the United States
or is this largely a Texasthing that the number of safety
instructors is declining?
Cathy Brooks (13:21):
With my experience working with other
states and being part of theState Motorcycle Safety
Association, it's a nationalissue. This thing is fairly
common nationwide.
Michael Strawn (13:33):
Bernie, and another thing here is outside
of the Motorcycle SafetyFoundation certification
process or total control safetycertification process that we
have, Texas also has its ownmotorcycle instructor license.
So there are a few additionalqualifications that that
instructor must go through herein Texas to become a motorcycle
(13:53):
instructor rather than just anendorsement from the curriculum
providers that are out there.
Bernie Fette (13:59):
Meaning that it's just a little more difficult in
Texas to reach a standard ofbeing able to give qualified
instruction.
Michael Strawn (14:07):
Here in Texas, we're not really adding
additional regulations or a tonof red tape for individuals to
go through. There are safetyaspects and why we provide a
license for instructors toteach in Texas, a lot of that
deals with safety, interactingwith the citizens of Texas.
Instructors around minors,around students, they're out
(14:30):
there , uh, teachingindividuals how to be a safe
rider . So there's somebackground checks that are
there in place, right there isdriver history checks that are
done on them , make sure thatthey're a safe rider . You
know, if you don't practicewhat you preach, you're
probably not going to be ableto speak that safety mindset to
the individuals that you'reteaching out there. There are
(14:51):
some things such as CPR , uh,first aid requirements because
if there is an accident on therange while training
individuals, we wanna make surethese instructors are as best
equipped to tend to thatmedical need while waiting on
emergency services as possible.
Bernie Fette (15:08):
Anything to add, Cathy?
Cathy Brooks (15:09):
Texas is not the only state in the union that
requires additional steps. Insome states all they need is
the curriculum providercertification, but in several
states there are thoseadditional layers to be
approved in the state. Myunderstanding in looking into
some of the other staterequirements, Texas is not one
that is onerous. It may take alittle time for the checks to
(15:32):
go through and the reports tocome back once the paperwork is
submitted to TDLR.
Michael Strawn (15:38):
And those are areas, you know, when we
inherited this program,everything is done on paper. It
didn't come to us in alicensing database, and it's
something here within the nextfew days. Actually within the
next two weeks, we're movingthis program into our licensing
database where applicants canthen pay online, renew online ,
uh, manage their accountonline, upload documents. The
(16:00):
other hurdle that we had wasthe current pathway into
becoming an instructor in Texascreated a framework where all
training is given through asingle entity. That's something
that there's currentlegislation out there that may
be changing this here verysoon, but that actually could
be seen as onerous for manyindividuals. It can be
difficult to travel across thestate to one location for nine
(16:22):
days-plus of training to beaway from your work, friends,
family, whatever it may be.
That pathway to becoming aninstructor. We've heard some
feedback that that can be verydifficult at this point in
time, and it is something thatwe're vehemently working
towards resolving and makingsure that anything that we are
doing as a function is not aregulatory hurdle for
(16:45):
individuals that want to be amotorcycle safety instructor in
this state. They have theopportunity and the
availability to do so.
Bernie Fette (16:52):
You're trying to make it as seamless and simple
for people to reach that goalof certification within the
framework or within therequirements that you have to
just in the interest of, ofsafety and security for
everybody involved. Soundslike.
Michael Strawn (17:06):
Yes, sir.
Anything that we can do tofacilitate a quicker, more
accessible pathway forindividuals to become a
motorcycle instructor in thestate of Texas within the
confines of the laws and rulesthat we have for this program,
that is absolutely our mission.
Cathy Brooks (17:24):
In addition to what Michael said about the
legislation that may be makingit easier for instructors to
get training, he mentioned inone location and nine days
consecutive. That's a majorhurdle for a lot of potential
instructors. There are multipleways that other states are
(17:46):
offering this training. It is anine-day program from the MSF,
to become what they call arider coach. So it's a rider
coach prep, and it's typicallya nine-day training that is in
person nine days. And there aresome states that do it over
three weekends. There are someplaces that do it over two
weekends. Texas has typicallybeen the nine days straight. So
(18:10):
that's somebody taking off ofwork potentially. And if you
aren't having paid vacation,that's already an obstacle to
come over, plus the cost of theclass, plus the cost of room
and board for that nine days,et cetera . But being able to
have multiple providers thatcan do the training opens up
(18:30):
the opportunity to have it indifferent regions of the state
and to open it up to differentschedules. There is one benefit
I guess you could call it , uh,when Covid hit, it really shut
down a lot of the in-persontraining, both for motorcycle
training classes to the publicas well as training new
(18:52):
instructors or rider coaches.
There is one company thatworked with the MSF to come up
with a hybrid of virtualtraining session to get you
started, and then it's afour-day in person . That's
another opportunity to make itmore accessible to more people.
(19:14):
That being said, that's onecompany nationwide that does
it, and they do provide it indifferent states, and they
could offer it in Texas if theyfollow the rules of TDLR and
apply to become approved orlicensed by TDLR.
Michael Strawn (19:29):
With pending legislation if it passes. At
its current, there's a singlesource of training in Texas.
But if legislation passes, thenyes, we would seek to develop
rules around the new regulatoryframework that we would have .
Bernie Fette (19:43):
Let's talk for just a minute if we can, about
the implications of thisinstructor shortage. You've got
a shrinking number ofinstructors, you've got a
growing number of unlicensedriders and you've got an
increase in crash injuries anddeaths. I'm not a scientist,
I'm not a researcher, but if weput all those things together
(20:06):
into one collective thought,that suggests to me that
there's a connection. Am Istretching things there or is
there a connection between thecrash trend and the declining
number of instructors?
Cathy Brooks (20:20):
Yes, Bernie. I would say that can't make a
direct causal, but there is acorrelation. There would be
seemingly a correlation betweenthe number of unlicensed
riders, unlicensed ridercrashes, fatalities, and
serious injuries stemming fromthe lack of instructors, which
(20:42):
would be a lack of potentialclasses available or classes
being canceled for lack ofinstructors across the state.
Michael Strawn (20:50):
I would echo much of what Cathy said. We
have individuals out there muchsmarter than us that that look
at this. And I don't know ifthere's still one consensus out
there. There's certainlycorrelation. You know, we see
an increase in alcohol use,we've seen an increase in the
number of distracted drivingcases out there, and there's
far severely underreported inthose number of crashes as
(21:11):
well. And one minor mistakefrom a motorist interacting
with a motorcyclist that isdistracted is potentially
fatal. There are a lot offactors that go into play here.
Certainly education, as youheard me say earlier, is top of
that list, making sure that wehave safe rider that have the
skillsets and the basis. Youknow, when you're going to
(21:33):
these motorcycle trainingcourses, it's not a punishment,
it's not remedial. It is givingyou the basis and the
foundation to build yournecessary skills every day
while you're out there ridingon the road, learning how to
emergency brake, your avoidancetechniques, things like that,
all skill sets that you shouldbe practicing out there. And a
(21:56):
lot of these riders who are notgoing through these education
aren't able to ascertain.
There's a lot of factors outthere. We certainly know the
education and making theeducation readily available is
step one into mitigating asmany of these factors as
possible.
Cathy Brooks (22:12):
As Michael said, having the proper knowledge and
skillset does improve safety.
And as he said, it's notnecessarily remedial. I've had
students that have been ridingfor years that got caught
without a license and comethrough the basic course and
they start out a little saltyabout it, but at the end
(22:34):
they're like, I learnedsomething. As Michael said
earlier, we are responsible forour own safety on the roads as
motorcyclists. So if we cankeep safety top of mind, if we
can understand that othermotorists may not perceive us,
they may not see us, they maynot understand how quickly we
(22:56):
are going or how far away weare, if we can ride like we're
invisible. If we can usetechniques to be more
conspicuous, those things helpus stay safer on the roads as
motorcyclists. And those arethings that you learn in the
motorcycle safety courses.
Bernie Fette (23:12):
You've mentioned specifically that the kind of
people that you're looking forhave to have a hunger for this.
They have to have a real desireto be an instructor, they have
to have a certain mindset. In anutshell, what does it take to
become a really good motorcyclesafety instructor?
Cathy Brooks (23:28):
That's a tough nut to crack. Actually.
With some of the research thatwe've done over the last few
years with this project throughTDLR. There's three themes that
we came up with. One is alifelong learner. So as a
motorcyclist, if you're alwaystrying to self-assess, you're
trying to get better, you wannaimprove your skills. Another
one is sharing the passion.
(23:49):
This is something that I loveto do and I want to help others
find the joy that I find inmotorcycling. And the third one
is a legacy of learning. Sothis most recent research that
we did found that somebody whowants to give back to the
community, somebody that is anatural mentor, somebody who
(24:11):
finds that people come to themfor advice, teachers, coaches,
those people that like doingthat, that like sharing their
knowledge, that like helpingothers. Those are the kind of
people that make really goodinstructors. Tail onto that, as
Michael said earlier, ATGATT,is it somebody who's wearing
all the gear all the time? Isit somebody that has a good
driving record? Is it somebodythat's already practicing
(24:35):
safety in their own ridingexperiences?
Bernie Fette (24:38):
They have to model good behavior, in other
words.
Cathy Brooks (24:41):
Correct . And if that's something that you're
already doing, then that'seasier for them to be genuine
when they're teaching that in aclass or on the range.
Michael Strawn (24:50):
And Bernie, I want to kind of segue off of
that. As Cathy says, there's alot of new information we're
learning out there, and I thinkthat's one of the beautiful
things that's come from thispartnership between Texas A&M
Transportation Institute andTexas Department of Licensing
and Regulation. For the firsttime we're really doing these
surveys and they're trying todrive down into what retains
(25:11):
instructors, what makes peopleinterested in this, what
creates a great instructor andwhat values they bring, and how
do we retain those individuals.
And those are questions wehaven't asked in the past that
I'm aware of and you know, butmoving forward, we look at the
rider engagement, theinstructor engagement, how to
obtain and retain all of thosepeople and make lifelong
(25:32):
learners. And that's what makesmotorcycling so passionate and
so loved by so many individualsis you're always out there and
there's always something new.
There's always a way to bebetter. And there's always that
excitement and that joy thatcomes with it. Our inherent
dangers and being able to growand learn, figuring out what
(25:53):
encapsulates all that and howto bring that passion and that
knowledge into an instructor toshare with everybody and how to
retain that individual. That iswhere our focus is now. What
does that person look like?
What are their interests andhow do we retain them? And how
do we get that individual toshare that wealth of knowledge,
that passion and that sense ofsafety and security out there
(26:15):
to new riders that are comingin.
Bernie Fette (26:18):
You've both done a really nice job of painting a
picture of what your idealinstructor might look like,
think like, sound like. And itsounds like the work that
you're doing with the surveysand research that you're both
working on is you're trying tomaybe narrow your market a
little bit and try to identifythose people who might be the
most receptive to taking thispath. Is that right?
Cathy Brooks (26:41):
Yes, sir. That's right. And in addition to that,
I think getting people that maynot have ever considered taking
that path to say, okay , maybethat's something I could look
into, right . For myself, whenthe coach that I went through a
class to get my street license,my motorcycle license in Texas
suggested I become a coach.
(27:01):
I've never been on the streets,why would I be a coach?
Currently there is a two-yearwait after you have a
motorcycle license, before youcan become an instructor in
Texas.
Bernie Fette (27:11):
Okay .
Cathy Brooks (27:12):
But at the time that I became an instructor,
that wasn't a rule. And so Ispent the next year going to
different locations across thestate, different training
schools across the state, andworked as what they called a
range aide. I would be sittingthrough the classroom and
observing. I would be out onthe range helping them place
(27:35):
the cones and move the bikes asneeded. And I watched students,
people who were terrified toput their leg over a motorcycle
who'd never done it before, andby the end of the first day,
they're accomplishingsomething. It's something that
I've called seeing a smileinside a full-face helmet
because their eyes aretwinkling with the joy and the
(27:56):
excitement and the fun. Andit's like, it gave me a sense
of awe , I guess, and inspiredme to, yeah, this is something
that I, I can see myself doingand I've been doing for almost
20 years now.
Michael Strawn (28:08):
And Bernie, as Cathy said, a big part of this
endeavor is reaching newindividuals out there, whether
that's a , a young individual ,uh, that has a , a history of
riding in their family and youknow, has been dirt riding
before they ever saw thestreet. We want to find those
individuals and make them awareof this path and this
(28:28):
opportunity exists. Uh, there'sseveral young instructors that
have come out in the pastcouple years that are doing
this on the weekends whilethey're going through college.
It's , it may be something theyretain for years while they
even get into a differentpathway. Some individuals do
this full-time, some people doit part-time. Many individuals
don't know it even exists andthat this is an opportunity for
(28:49):
them. One of the big focuses ofthis survey is for us to be
able to capture new riders thatare interested in this and that
have that skillset and thatcorrect mindset to be an
instructor and to promotesafety in Texas.
Bernie Fette (29:06):
This is a really broad and deep topic, and
there's no way we could coverall of it in just in the
limited time that we've got,but if you wanted people who
are listening to remember justone really important thing that
we talked about today, whatwould that be? Let's call it
your elevator speech.
Michael Strawn (29:24):
For me, I'm gonna say trained riders are
safe riders. At the end of theday, getting that education,
that awareness out there,making this an easy lifestyle,
hobby, industry, whateverpathway you, you deem that you
wanna come into this or , uh,whatever capacity you are into
this motorcycle lifestyle, wewant to make sure that
(29:48):
individuals are trained andthey're safe. There's a ton of
great education and materialsout there that give you that
foundation to continually buildyour skills in the correct
manner. We wanna make sure thateducation and those
opportunities are available toeverybody. Learning bad habits,
trying to learn on your own,those are things that you're
building on bad habits andthere's a lot of things out
(30:11):
there that can really getriders into trouble. And I
still hear a lot of confusion.
People confused about thecomplexity of, do I need a
motorcycle to go take alicensing test down at
Department of Public Safety?
That was years and years ago.
Those misnomers still existtoday. This is something that
the education's so importantto, to everything because
(30:33):
riding unlicensed, ridingdirty, whatever you want to
call it, it's costly. Whetherthat's money in the way of
tickets, crashes, motorcyclesare not cheap anymore, can be
extremely costly, and that thehighest price you can pay is
your life or the life ofsomeone else. It is a, a
brotherhood in a lot of ways.
It's a giant family, and that'sbecause we are all out there
(30:56):
together on these roads. We'resharing these roads together. I
hope everybody that getsinterested in this community
helps everybody be smarter. Ithelps everybody be safer.
Bernie Fette (31:06):
Cathy, what's your big takeaway?
Cathy Brooks (31:10):
In my experience as an instructor, it's a lot
easier to take someone that'snever ridden and build good
habits than someone who hasridden and break bad ones. So
having access to rider safetytraining, being licensed helps
increase that knowledge, thoseskill sets that help riders be
(31:33):
safer on the roadway and helpmitigate their risk on the
roads. To have those classesavailable, we need to have
instructors, people that arepassionate, caring, want to
share, safe themselves, genuineto be a part of those efforts.
To keep riders safe on thestreets is a lot of people that
(31:55):
don't know they need to have amotorcycle license to ride a
motorcycle. That's one barrier.
There's a lot of people thatthink that when they graduate
this class that, that MSB- 8that Michael mentioned, which
is their Texas specificcompletion certificate that you
take to the licensing office toget your motorcycle license.
(32:15):
That's all they need, and it'snot, they need to go and
actually get the licenseknowing that there's classes
available, knowing where theyare. Having the instructors to
fill the schedules based on thedemand of those that wanna take
the class are important for usto fulfill . And right now,
we're not being able to fulfillthat need. The joy we feel when
(32:37):
you're riding a motorcycle is ajoy that you can see blossom in
somebody else is well worth theeffort to take the training to
become an instructor. Beingable to grow that next
generation of motorcyclists ina manner that can help them be
safe riders for a very longtime. It's inherently dangerous
to ride a motorcycle and overhalf of our fatalities, are
(33:01):
motorcycle-only crashes. Sohaving not just the skillset ,
but the mindset of being a saferider is very, very important
to help reduce those, thosefatality numbers.
Bernie Fette (33:18):
Last question.
What is it that makes you bothwant to get up and come to work
every day ?
Cathy Brooks (33:28):
That's an interesting question for me,
Bernie. This isn't somewhere Iwould've seen myself, as I
mentioned earlier, I took themotorcycle safety course to get
a license to be able to testride bikes and was suggested
that I become a coach. Neverthought I'd be. I can't do
that. I'm, I'm too new. And Ispent the next year no longer
(33:48):
being new. There was a periodof time that I went and did my
end-of-year taxes and I'd onlytaught eight classes that year.
And the person that I workedwith, a friend of mine said,
you're miserable. Go teach aclass. Or a weekend that I
taught a class, she'd come andsay, you taught a class this
weekend. And it wasn't justbecause my red face from the
(34:10):
sun, but my whole attitudechanged. It's something that
recharges my batteries. Nomatter how much training we do,
no matter how much we we learn,we can't always fix what
happens on the roadway. I'm amother of four, one of three
generations of motorcyclesafety instructors in Texas,
(34:35):
and I lost my husband to amotorcycle crash. I lost my
husband to a motorcycle crash.
In addition to being thatinstructor, I started getting
involved with the TexasMotorcycle Safety Coalition
that sponsored through TTI andthe Texas Department of
Transportation's MotorcycleSafety Education and Outreach
(34:55):
Program. What's led me heretoday. My grandfather rode, my
father rode, found a picturerecently of me sitting on a
motorcycle with my dad when Iwas maybe two years old. My
children, all four of them havemotorcycle licenses, and my
daughter is also a motorcycletraining instructor. This is my
(35:18):
family. It was a motorcyclecommunity that was a big
supporter when my husband died.
It's my family. And I wannakeep my family safe and I want
them to be happy and find thejoy of motorcycling going
forward.
Bernie Fette (35:35):
It is so admirable that you could
channel your experience, yourloss in this way, Cathy. Thank
you for being brave enough toshare your story. You're an
inspiration, Michael. That's atough act to follow.
Michael Strawn (35:48):
Absolutely, and I mean, I, I can't do any
amount of justice or service tothis as much as Cathy has given
to this community. And Cathy, Imean, my heart goes out to you
that knows something that's inevery student you train. I know
that passion and that love thatyou had for your husband is
carried into that. And Bernie ,you ask a really tough question
(36:11):
and you know, I had to thinkabout it. But at the end of the
day, it really comes down tofamily. And it sounds parroting
a little bit what Cathy said,but my mom rides. My dad used
to ride. My cousins ride. Ihave a license. And you know,
if I have kids that are outthere on the roadway, I look at
that. If something happened tomy dad, to my cousin, to
(36:33):
anybody out there that I know,even that I don't know, that's
my own personal responsibility.
I have to do what I can withinmy powers and then some to make
this as safe as it can be. Itshould never be that someone
was injured or killed becauseof a policy or the lack of
(36:58):
training or whatever roadblockthat they saw or they
inherently believe was in theirpathway to obtaining that
education that could have savedtheir life. I don't want that
for my family. I don't wantthat for anybody else's family
out there. I never want to heara story like Cathy's ever
again. Luckily she's turned outon something beautiful in
(37:20):
helping other people and if Icould emulate somebody here, I
mean, that would be exactlywhat I would do is take my
knowledge and my passion and mylove and uh , responsibility
for this program and channelthat into all those things that
can help protect all of ourcitizens here in Texas and
anybody that's on our roadways.
Bernie Fette (37:39):
We have been visiting with Cathy Brooks, a
project specialist at TTI andMichael Strong, a program
manager for the TexasDepartment of Licensing and
Regulation. Cathy, Michael,thank you so much for sharing
your time and your insight andyour passion with us. Thank you
for working to make roadwaytravel safer for all of us. We
(38:02):
appreciate you.
Michael Strawn (38:03):
Thank you, Bernie.
Cathy Brooks (38:04):
Thank you, Bernie.
Bernie Fette (38:05):
Motorcycles make up only about 3 percent of all
registered vehicles, but peoplewho ride them account for
almost 15 percent of alltraffic deaths. The number of
motorcycle fatalities has beenon a steady increase in recent
years up by about 20 percentover the past decade. Also on
(38:28):
the rise is the percentage ofunlicensed riders . An entry
level rider safety course isrequired for anyone trying to
get a license, but a shortageof qualified safety instructors
makes it difficult for newriders to access that training.
A statewide recruitment effortaims to change that with plans
(38:50):
to find a lot more writingcoaches with the passion,
knowledge, and desire to helptheir fellow motorcyclists stay
safe. Thanks for listening.
Please take just a minute togive us a review, subscribe and
share this episode, and pleasejoin us again next time for a
(39:11):
conversation with DennisChristensen, director emeritus
of TTI and the founder of theTexas Transportation Hall of
Honor. Thinking Transportationis a production of the Texas
A&M Transportation Institute, amember of the Texas A&M
University System. The show isedited and produced by Chris
(39:32):
Pourteau. I'm your writer andhost, Bernie Fette. Thanks
again for listening. We'll seeyou next time.
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