April 5, 2025 • 48 mins
Join us for a heartfelt conversation with Julie Voris as we explore the profound and often overlooked transition to empty nesting—a journey that many parents experience but few openly discuss. In a society lacking cultural roadmaps and generational models, this phase can leave parents feeling lost and uncertain about their purpose once their children become independent.
Julie shares her personal path of moving from Indiana to Florida while her three daughters embarked on their own independent lives across the country. She reveals a crucial insight: the initial empty nesting phase, when children leave for college, is merely a rehearsal for the deeper transition that occurs when they achieve full autonomy—landing jobs, forming significant relationships, and making major life decisions without parental input.
Highlights:
- Emotional complexities during this transition, experiencing simultaneous feelings of pride, sadness, confusion, and excitement.
- The empty nest phase as an opportunity for personal growth and identity reclamation.
- The importance of seeking professional support and building a fulfilling life that fosters healthier relationships with adult children.
Key Takeaways:
- Recognize that college is just a "dress rehearsal" for true empty nesting, where autonomy presents the biggest challenges.
- Understand that feelings of confusion and sadness are common and should not be isolated or ashamed.
- Strive to be the kind of person your adult children want to be around, demonstrating the value of self-improvement.
Julie Voris Bio
Julie Voris is a Mindset + Habits coach for women who are done getting lost in the minutiae, tired of playing small, and “so over” asking for permission. She helps them to tap into the power of habits to create more impact & income while serving as inspiring role models for their family.
When Julie isn’t dishing truth, hope & energy to her audience, you can find her soaking in the magic at Walt Disney World in Florida, where she and her husband recently moved, making a lifelong dream come true, as well as traveling to see their three amazing daughters, and buying too many books in a local bookstore.
You can find Julie Online: Instagram, Facebook, Website
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Our generation.
The parents were like okay, goget married now and have
children.
And just the gap between us,you know, graduating college,
for example, and then gettingmarried and having children that
gap was so small that they wereon to their next role.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Right.
Speaker 1 (00:16):
Quickly.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
Quicker.
Speaker 1 (00:17):
And the gap now is so much greater, like, my oldest
daughter is past the age where Iwas already married and had her
, and so the gap is widening,and so I think that makes it a
little more like loosey-gooseyfor parents, like wait, what am
I supposed to be doing?
Because we have no role modelfor this.
Speaker 3 (00:37):
Welcome to this Empty Nest Life.
Join Jay Ramsden as he leadsyou on a transformative journey
through the uncharted seas ofmidlife and empty nesting.
If you're ready to embark onthis new adventure and redefine
your future, you're in the rightplace.
Here's your host the Empty NestCoach, Jay Ramsden, Julie.
(00:57):
Voris welcome to this EmptyNest Life.
Yeah, I'm so glad that you'rehere.
Speaker 1 (01:04):
We were going to talk about empty nesting.
Who would have thought I know?
Speaker 2 (01:07):
Right, right, like nobody talks about it, and you
know I'm trying to think Like.
I found you online and you knowI started following you on
Instagram.
I think it was no-transcript.
(01:31):
Get rolling.
Speaker 1 (01:33):
Of course, thank you for this opportunity.
It's such a pleasure to be ableto talk about empty nesting and
be able to talk about thisseason of life.
First and foremost, thank youfor doing this, because not
enough people are talking aboutit and it becomes this strange
wilderness that nobody knows themap to, and there are lots of
people who've been through it.
There is an app.
So you know we can help otherpeople kind of figure it out.
(01:55):
I think that that's a reallycool opportunity for us.
So I am a former high schoolEnglish teacher and I kind of
fell into fitness.
I discovered a passion forfitness, teaching fitness,
training others to teach fitnessbecame an online health and
wellness business owner and itjust kind of got to this place
(02:17):
where, all of a sudden, now allthese things I did with my girls
being home and for my girls nowthey're actually not home
anymore.
And so here we are what do wedo, what are we doing and how we
figure these out?
My husband was a collegefootball coach, so we lived the
football life for 30 plus yearsand just two years ago we made
(02:39):
our big dream come true.
We were in Indiana, we moved toFlorida.
We are Midwestern people kindof lived in the Midwest.
Even with coaching and moving alot, we tended to stay in the
Midwest.
We had a little bit of a stintin Texas, but we were Indiana,
illinois, pennsylvania,wisconsin, and the majority of
(03:00):
our time was spent in Indiana.
And two years ago we made thebig move down to Orlando,
florida, so we can both havenicer weather than Indiana and
live a little closer to Disneybecause we love it here, and
thank goodness that I did thatat the time, that I really went
(03:21):
off the deep end into emptynesting because I tell you what
there's something reallypowerful about seeing the
sunrise every morning.
It's really good for your mentalhealth and the gray in Indiana
was not so much, and I don'tknow what my mental health would
have done if I was goingthrough this this season, which
the transition has been toughfor me, as it is for many, um,
(03:43):
and not living in a place whereI can at least go get a little
magic every once in a while.
So I'm really thankful for howit all worked out and, honestly,
the girls are as well becauseit's a lot more fun to come home
to Orlando, florida, or is toIndia.
There's a lot more to do here,so everything happens for a
reason, but it's been a littlebit of a tough transition for me
(04:04):
.
Speaker 2 (04:10):
Yeah, and that's not uncommon, right when?
When I talk to people, it'slike throughout life you see
these seasons of transitionsfrom elementary school to middle
school, middle school to highschool, high school to college,
college to job, job to marriage,Like it's all laid out.
You see that that's kind oflike the quote unquote normal
path that you take and even so,you like see retirement life,
but nobody talks about betweenthe time the kids leave and that
retirement life.
(04:30):
There's no modeling of whatthat looks like for anybody.
And so that's what I got soimpassioned and empowered about
trying to spread this word andhaving conversations with people
is because I want to model like.
I want to be an example ofwhat's possible, and you
certainly are an example ofwhat's possible based upon your
(04:50):
story.
I'm curious when you leftIndiana, said go to Orlando like
were the kids out of college incollege?
Like what was the timing?
Speaker 1 (04:58):
So when we left, uh, jenna, our oldest had once.
She graduated college she livedfor a year in New York City and
working and then she decided togo to grad school in DC.
So she was in grad school in DCfinishing up working.
She was in DC.
Our middle one was in Indianafinishing her last year of
(05:22):
school and our youngest one wasin New York City in school.
So it was kind of a moment whereit was a pretty good time to go
, because people have sort ofcut their ties a little bit to
you know where it is the placethey grew up, but they kind of
(05:44):
cut their ties a little bit tothat, that childhood home and
such.
And you know, my husband, as Isaid, had been a college
football coach and going throughthe pandemic as a college
football coach wasextraordinarily difficult and I
watched his mental healthdecline and we just got to the
point where I couldn't find areally good reason to stay.
(06:07):
Yes, he was still working, buthe was unhappy and I was looking
around going, okay, the girlsare all gone now, everyone's in
school now, but I'm living inthe same town and which was
amazing when they were in school.
Growing up it was a fabulousplace.
(06:28):
We lived in Carmel, indiana.
It was a fabulous.
School system was amazing.
That was a fabulous place withamazing opportunities to raise a
family.
And then, once the family wasgone, I just would look around
and going I'm not sure what'skeeping us here and watching him
.
You know kind of struggle withhis mental health.
I'm like it's, it's time and Ireally I had to do some, some
(06:48):
pushing a little bit, but youknow that's, that's what happens
Sometimes.
I do a little pushing.
I'm like we're going to need tomove this timeline up a little
bit more.
And then once we moved, it waslike, oh my gosh, this is the
best thing that we ever did.
So the girls were at was nothard for them, it wasn't like it
wasn't this.
Oh my goodness, you're sellingour childhood home.
Speaker 3 (07:07):
What are we going to do?
You know?
Speaker 1 (07:09):
And one of the most fun experiences we had actually
was the holiday break prior tous moving in March of 2022.
And everyone was home that weekbefore Christmas, between
Christmas and New Year's, and wehauled everything up 16 years
of stuff out of the basement,all their school stuff that I
(07:31):
kept, just everything and we,every night that week, went
through everything.
And it was such a cool familyexperience to go through all of
that stuff and relive all thesememories and for them to choose
what we wanted to keep and whatthey were like no, we're done
with this.
And really they were so fullyinvested in the move and the
(07:52):
process of moving.
The timing was perfect.
Speaker 2 (07:57):
It was perfect.
Yeah, like and I get thatquestion a lot from people like
just, you know, openly on socialis like, well, I'm thinking
about moving but I don't knowwhat to do.
Speaker 3 (08:08):
It's like the childhood home and all the
memories right, but I loved howyou approached it.
Right.
Speaker 2 (08:11):
Let's bring all the memories up and see what sticks,
and you know what stays andwhat goes, and oftentimes you
know, the memories of things getso wrapped in a thing.
Yes, you know somebody gave methis pen.
You know sort of that was.
That was part of him, but is itreally the pen?
Is the memory, is it the personYou're afraid?
If you let go of the memory,you let go of the person or the
(08:31):
thing.
Yeah, and I love that how youapproach that.
It was just probably verycathartic.
Speaker 1 (08:38):
It was, and it was so much fun and I would, I would
really encourage anyone who isthinking about moving like to
really bring everyone into thatprocess and because your
children leave home, right.
So this idea of, oh my goodness, my kids don't want me to move,
they don't, they don't want meto leave their child at home,
(08:59):
yeah, but they're leaving home.
Right so at one point do you getto do your own thing too, right
, you know so.
So there's.
We were kind of at that pointto like, would you rather come
home to Orlando, florida, wouldyou rather come home to Indiana?
They're like, yeah, florida isway better.
So it did.
The whole timing of it workedwell, but also because I think
(09:22):
we involved them so much in allof it, it felt really good.
Speaker 2 (09:27):
Yeah, yeah, and for those listening like, you don't
have to sell your home and moveto Orlando Florida.
There are other options.
Yeah, this was just yourjourney.
So, given all that you havegoing on right now right,
obviously an empty nester yourun a business, a pretty big
business Like.
What's your greatest motivatorright now?
Speaker 1 (09:44):
My biggest motivator for the entirety of my life,
since I had children since themoment you know the oldest one
was born has always been I'vegot children who are watching me
and I need to model for them tobeing the best human I can
(10:05):
possibly be Not the most perfecthuman, not the human that gets
it right Cause, goodness knows,nobody is that and goodness
knows I did not get and I didnot go through this empty
nesting journey.
Well, many, many mistakes alongthe way, and I'm okay with them
seeing that, because whatthey're also seeing me do is try
(10:27):
to get better, and I thinkthat's really important for our
kids to see.
So, my motivator, whether it'sbeen showing up for stuff I
didn't want not, we don't wantto show up for everything that
we have to show up to in ourlives, but showing up to the to
my life, show up to in our lives, but showing up to, to the to
my life, trying to get better,being a constant student,
(10:47):
building a business, sort ofsmashing some of those
stereotypes of of women Well,you can either be a mom or you
can build a business.
No, you can actually dowhatever you want and modeling
that for them.
And then, even now, whether theyknow it or not, or absorb it
now, modeling what it looks liketo be in this season of life
(11:08):
all the imperfections, all themistakes, all of it and showing
them you know what a lifewell-lived looks like.
That is what motivates me.
You know, I'm pretty clear thatI'm not going to get it right
every day.
I'm pretty clear I'm going tomake a lot of mistakes, but I
have conversations with mydaughters that I never had with
(11:31):
my parents.
We just never would have hadthese kinds of conversations,
and that's motivating to me.
How can I continue to grow into, for as long as I'm on this
planet, the kind of person thatmy girls want to be around and
that they kind of look at and gothat?
She lived a great life, and Ihope to be able to do that too.
(11:51):
So, good, that's what motivatesme.
Speaker 2 (11:53):
Yeah, yeah, it's like being the example of what's
possible, yes, right, because sooften people think, ok, well,
we get to the empty nestingyears and if I'm working, I just
keep working and I just waitfor grandkids to come or a
wedding to come and then Iretire, like it's like this
feeling stuck but not feelingstuck, it's like the routine of
it all which I get right.
(12:14):
Our brains crave routine.
But how incredible it is thatthat you're an example of what's
possible for your girls.
Like a hundred percent in this.
You can do anything at anystage in life.
Yes, right, and you're, andyou're a walking example of that
for them.
Speaker 1 (12:30):
Well, I also don't want to be waiting yes, me me
waiting for their nextaccomplishment.
It was a statement on the.
I don't have enough going on inmy life right now Like I'm
waiting, you know, if I don'thave enough going on in my life
right now Like I'm waiting, youknow, if I'm just waiting around
for them to get married, whatif they choose never to do that
(12:50):
which, by the way, is fine?
Or waiting around for them tohave children, which they may
never have children, which also,by the way, is fine I'm just
waiting around for their nextthing.
But that means I've forgottenthat I'm also a human being,
person with goals and dreams ofmy own, and I don't do them any
(13:12):
service just by waiting around.
They need to see me flourishingso that they know, when they get
to this season of life, theycan do this too.
The reason why they know theycan do anything in life they
want is in part not a hundredpercent, but it is in part to
what they've seen me do up tothis point in their life, and
even though I did alwaysnavigate empty nesting, you know
, amazingly, that's okay.
They saw that too.
They saw a human who was tryingto figure stuff out and is
(13:35):
willing to work to figure stuffout, and when they get to this
season, they'll do it a littlebetter.
That's the point.
They should do it a littlebetter than I did.
And if they do choose to havekids, awesome.
And when their kids get to thisseason of life, hopefully they
do it a little bit better.
That's kind of the point of allthis is continuing to model for
them what these differentseasons in life can look like
(13:58):
and then give them the baton sothey can do it a little bit
better.
Speaker 2 (14:02):
Yeah, yeah, it's like we want better for every
generation wants it a little bitbetter.
Yeah, yeah, it's like the wewant better for every generation
wants better for the nextgeneration.
Right, but the old philosophyof what that looked like, I
think, needs to change.
Speaker 1 (14:14):
Right.
Speaker 2 (14:15):
Like the old philosophy was like working a
job till forever and then retire.
And then you just do retirement, you know, and play the role of
grandparent.
But I want people, this is whatI want.
People and see if thisresonates with you is like I
want.
I want my grandkids or my kidsto be able to say to their kids,
my grandkids, like, oh, my God,look what grandpa whatever name
they give me did at this age inlife.
(14:37):
Like, look at all the thingsthat he, he did that were like
just cool.
This is how we, how we livelife.
Yes, Right, we don't live lifegoing through the motions.
Speaker 1 (14:46):
I don't know if that resonates or yes, very much,
very much, because I you know, Ithink what makes empty nesting
a challenging transition is likeas we talked about nobody talks
about it.
So if you research what's itlike to parent grownup children,
you will find very little outthere.
(15:07):
You'll find lots of stuff abouttoddlerhood, which is about two
years.
You'll find lots of stuff aboutelementary and middle school,
which is three, four, whatever,how many years.
You'll find lots of stuff aboutteenage years and then there's
a huge drop-off and there'snothing except the majority of
our lives we will spend knowingour children as actual adult
(15:27):
children.
And the fact that there'snothing out there about this
season of life and how it can bechallenging, particularly for
women, I think makes people veryunprepared for this season of
life.
And I know, you know my parentsdidn't talk to me about it and
also I think my generation was alittle bit, our generation was
(15:48):
a little bit different and youknow I did get married pretty
quickly out of college, I didhave children pretty quickly and
my girls just are not doingwhich I have any say in.
I was very unprepared for thatand I think it's because no one
(16:21):
talks about it.
No one talks about it.
And if they do talk about it,you only hear them talk about
them being sad and how theycan't wait for grandchildren, or
they push down the negativeemotions and just talk about it.
But I'm just so proud.
I'm just so proud.
Here's the God's honest truth.
You're going to feel sad andproud and excited and lost and
(16:43):
confused and happy all at thesame exact time.
You're not going to know what'sgoing on and all that's okay,
but most of us aren't preparedfor that influx and tornado of
emotions because nobody talksabout this season.
Speaker 2 (17:01):
Exactly.
I think they call that that oneinstance college drop off day.
No, I'm kidding, Like that'sthe one where it is All.
Think they call that that oneinstance college drop-off day.
No, I'm kidding, Like likethat's the one where it is.
All of those emotions happen inthat day.
You're proud, you're sad,you're angry, you're frustrated.
You're happy, you're lonely,Like you're confused that day is
like the Kickstarter, for allthe balls of emotions that we
feel, yeah, and it's the factthat, like people, that well,
(17:25):
what it's like, oh, it'd be fine, just you know, just do this
and enjoy it, and then go homeLike no, like there are so many
things you can do to get readyfor that day.
There's so many things you cando when you, once you get home,
I think what happens is peopleexperience that and then they're
just left with a whole bunch ofquestions.
Speaker 1 (17:39):
Correct, correct.
And then they go home and theenergy in their house has
shifted and they don't know howto navigate it.
Yeah, that's so smart and theydon't know how to talk about it.
Because and I'll speak aboutwomen specifically because if
you're a woman and you talkabout feeling sad to a point
(18:01):
that that makes you selfish, toa point that that makes you
selfish, you can talk about as afemale this is what I've
discovered and as a female, youcan talk about being worried
about your kids, because that'sabout them.
But if you talk about being sador confused or lost, well
that's about you.
And suddenly now you're aselfish mom and you can't talk
(18:21):
about that.
You can be worried becausethat's about them.
Selfish mom, and you can't talkabout that.
You can be worried becausethat's about them.
Or you can be proud, but heavenforbid you be all those things
which newsflash you are, andover and over and over again
over the past two years,especially women would have said
to me.
Well, I thought I was the onlyone feeling all this and I
(18:43):
thought to myself and sometimesI would say to them it's a
planet of 8 billion people.
What part of you thinks thatyou're the special unicorn who
feels this?
But we think that because noone talks about it.
It's sort of this shamefulthing to say wait, I did this
thing that I was kind ofsupposed to do with my kids, but
(19:06):
now I'm not really sure how Ifeel about it.
In fact, I feel kind of crappyabout it, that's.
That's kind of we've made thatkind of shameful in society and,
frankly, it's time that we stopthat and just normalize.
You're going to feel all thefeelings.
You're going to feel all thefeelings on any given day.
There are going to be some daysthat are more sad than others.
There are going to be some daysthat are happy and you're fine.
(19:27):
You're going to feel all of it,and the piece that will help
you navigate it the most is time.
That's it.
You have to live through it, gothrough it, make mistakes,
learn from them, work on you andput some time into actively
(19:50):
doing the work to feel better,or you will stay stuck in the
sad and your children are seeingthat and that's a disservice to
them.
Speaker 2 (19:57):
Yeah, yeah, I agree, I agree, and I think nobody
talks about it because of theshame.
Agree, right.
It's like oh, if I, if I, if Itell my family, or I tell my
friends that I'm struggling,especially if I have friends who
still have kids at home, that'swhere the shame really comes
from.
Speaker 3 (20:13):
They're like wait.
Speaker 2 (20:14):
you're out of be the best day of your life.
The house is empty, you get todo whatever you want to do.
Right.
But if you spend so much timeof your self-identity you know
mom or dad right, because wehave dads who do that Like
they're the one who's thelogistics person or the coach of
the kid's team or whatever allthe way through, whatever it may
be, when you wrap yourself-identity up into being
(20:36):
Billy or Susie's mom or dad,you're not your.
Your self identity isn't whoyou are as a person.
Speaker 1 (20:43):
And it's so.
It's so interesting that yousay that you use those words,
cause I was thinking about lastweek.
We have this great family thatlives next to us and they have
four young kids and they have.
You know, in Florida, of course, everybody has a pool in their
backyard.
The kids are out in the pool intheir backyard and I don't know
which kid was like well, Ithink it was all of them Mom,
mom, mom, watch me, mom, watchme, mom, mom.
(21:04):
And I was standing out in ourpool and I was just.
I was laughing to myselfbecause it was constant Mom, mom
, mom, watch me, mom, mom, mom,mom.
And my husband came through.
He goes.
I just, I love hearing thesound of the kids next door.
I go, I do too, but I'mthinking about this on a whole
(21:31):
nother level, because I'mthinking about that is such a
perfect example of why it is sochallenging for women to
navigate this transition,because the dad that lives next
door is an amazing dad.
My husband is, was an amazingdad, is an amazing dad.
My husband is was an amazingdad.
It's an amazing dad, butthey're not going.
Dad, dad, dad, watch me.
They're saying mom, mom, mom,mom, mom, watch me.
And then we get to this placewhere it's time to to launch
(21:52):
them.
And again, mine are old enoughNow they're making their own
money, they're making their owndecisions and you're like, wait
what?
No one's saying mom, mom, mom,watch me.
No one's saying mom, mom, mom,what should I do?
No one's saying mom, mom, mom.
And it is such a hard, it'ssuch a hard act to extricate
yourself from that identity ofmom because for however long
(22:16):
your kids were like, that's whatyou heard, that's, that was
part of it.
And I was just standing outthere listening to all of it and
thinking this is what makesempty nesting so challenging the
transition into that.
You know, I was literallyverbally hearing why it's so
hard, you know, in the housenext to me, because no one's, no
(22:37):
one's like mom, mom, mom, mom,mom, watch me.
At this point in my life, andthat can be a challenge.
Speaker 2 (22:44):
Yeah, definitely Right, because it's where you
put your attention and focus,but also where your kids put
their attention and focus Right,and so, as they're younger,
their attention and focus is onyou.
Right, you are the full-time,24-7 model for what life looks
like and you know guidance, andone of my favorite sayings is
(23:06):
like uh, you know, I taught youeverything you know, but not
everything I know.
Right.
That's how we act as parents iswe try and teach our kids
everything that we know beforethey go right off right.
And then, as they get older andthey start to do things for
themselves and start to see lifea little bit differently, like
that role kind of slowlydwindles until you get fired.
(23:26):
Literally, you drop them off atcollege, you come home, you got
fired from your job, you know,part time you're like a
consultant yes, like a 1090,like a 1099 employee
is like yeah, you know I'llreach out to you when I need you
that.
Speaker 1 (23:38):
That's exactly right.
That's exactly right.
Speaker 2 (23:41):
And that is so hard to wrap your head around,
because it does not only do.
You come home and the house isquiet, but the focus is gone.
Speaker 1 (23:47):
Correct, correct, that's.
You're exactly right.
Like, all of a sudden, you gotfired.
And the crazy part about it all, jay, the crazy part about it
all is we did this ourselves.
Is we did this ourselves.
Like we left home and we, youknow, had children.
We've actually done thisourselves, you know, quote
(24:09):
unquote, to our parents.
So you would think that when itcomes time for us to launch our
own kids, we, you know, we wouldlook at that and go, well, yeah
, like, this is the naturalorder, and there is a piece of
your brain that knows that, yes,this is the natural order.
I did this.
Now it's time for my kids to dothis, and your brain knows that
(24:29):
, but your heart has a hardertime catching up to it.
So, even though you know it andyou know it's what's supposed
to be happening, the last thingyou need to hear from people is
well, this is what you weresupposed to do and this is what
you launched them for, andthey're like no, I don't need to
hear any of that, because yourheart takes a minute to catch up
to literally how fast time hasflown, and I think that's the
(24:54):
piece that makes parents sad aswell.
It's not like you're sad thatyour, your child, is going off
and pursuing their goals anddreams and, maybe you know,
doing great things with theirlife.
You're sad at how fast the timewent.
And for someone just to go justbe proud, it's, it's um, it's
(25:15):
annoying.
Speaker 3 (25:17):
It's like a slap in the face.
Yes, it's very demeaning Likeplease don't say Annoying it's
like a slap in the face.
Speaker 1 (25:19):
Yes, it's very demeaning, like, please don't
say that to empty nesters,please just don't tell nesters
to just be proud because you'reassuming that we're not.
We're proud, we're very proud.
We're also sad and lost andconfused and excited and all the
things and kind of trying tosettle into this new reality
that we knew cognitively wascoming because we did it, but
(25:40):
you you just don't knowemotionally how it's going to
feel.
And I think just talking aboutit more, having more empathy and
not saying dumb things to emptynesters would be a really great
start and just a little bitmore empathy.
And the other piece that I alsonoticed was that everyone asks
(26:02):
about the kids but no one asksabout the parents.
Yes, everyone asks about howthey're doing in school or how
they.
You know, and our youngestactually was in Hong Kong last
year for a job that's across onthe other side of the planet,
which is really hard to put yourchild on a plane for them to go
(26:23):
to Hong Kong.
Very cool, very hard andeveryone asked about how she was
doing.
Very few people asked about howwe were doing.
So just note, if you have newempty nesters in your life, ask
them how they are doing beforeyou ask about the kids, because
(26:43):
chances are they're not doingwell and they need you to.
You know, hype them up a littlebit and, maybe you know, ask
about them and then ask aboutthe kids, because the kids are
probably settling in fine, theparents probably not so much.
Speaker 2 (26:57):
That's true, that's true.
Here's something that I thinkhas maybe perhaps made it harder
for us.
We're probably like the firstgeneration where, yes, we left
home, left our parents to becomeempty nesters and then now our
kids are leaving.
I think the difference is, whenwe left home, our parents said,
here's a quarter and call ifyou have trouble Right yeah.
(27:19):
When we left home, our parentssaid, here's a quarter and call
if you have trouble Right yeah.
Like the connection, the alltime connection through, you
know, smartphones, I think isexacerbating the transition to
emptiness.
I don't know your thoughts onthat.
Speaker 1 (27:32):
I also think the pandemic for me personally and I
don't know about other parents,but for me personally.
I got extra time with my girls.
Speaker 2 (27:43):
Yes, yeah.
Speaker 1 (27:44):
Because they were in school in New York City and they
came home, which is horriblefor them.
It was extra time for me.
But I think that probablytripled the hardness of
transitioning into empty nestingbecause I did get that extra
time, the hardness oftransitioning into empty nesting
because I did get that extratime.
And when they're older andyou're older, I think you have a
(28:05):
greater appreciation of thattime.
I think when you're in thethick of when they're littles
and you're just trying to getthrough the day, you don't
necessarily appreciate the timewith them quite as much that's
been my experience anywaynecessarily appreciate the time
with them quite as much.
That's been my experienceanyway.
And when they're older and you,you really have a better
understanding how fast time goes.
(28:26):
The fact that I got that extratime, I was so grateful for it,
even amidst a horrible lifesituation and even though I knew
it was not the best situationfor them, I was so grateful for
that time.
And then the back end of that,the thing that came then back
and, you know, punched me in thegut, was that it made the
transition into them growing upand moving or again making their
(28:50):
own money and their owndecisions, having significant
others.
All that it made it harder forme.
So there was a give and a takewith that pandemic, but I think
the pandemic has made this alittle bit different.
I just, I think to your point,our generation, the parents,
were like, okay, go get marriednow and have children.
(29:11):
And just the gap between us and, you know, graduating college,
for example, and then gettingmarried and having children,
that gap was so small that theywere onto their next role.
Speaker 2 (29:24):
Right, quickly, quicker.
Speaker 1 (29:26):
And the gap now is so much greater.
Like, my oldest daughter ispast the age where I was already
married and had her.
She's already older than thatand so the gap is widening, and
so I think that makes it alittle more like loosey-goosey
for parents, like wait, what amI supposed to be doing?
Because we have no role modelfor this.
(29:48):
Gen X is kind of the first ones.
We have no role models.
Our parents sent us off if wewent to college, or maybe we got
married before that, whateverand then we had kids and they
were right into beinggrandparents.
We are not doing that, gen Xisn't doing that, and we don't
have anyone that showed us howto do this.
So we're a littlediscombobulated on this whole.
(30:11):
How are we supposed?
to do it Because we didn't seeanyone do it.
Speaker 2 (30:15):
Yeah, where's the roadmap?
Speaker 1 (30:16):
Where's the roadmap?
Where's the instruction guide?
Speaker 2 (30:24):
Yeah, that's right, we are creating it.
We are creating it, but I Ithink your point is valid about
the pandemic is like we did getextra time with them at home.
We didn't suck for them.
They didn't have the fullexperience of college, correct,
like we had the full experienceof college but we had a longer
runway to the launch of them,and for me in particular, it
just hit me, like my son did, afifth year of college and so
that made um him finishing thesame time.
My daughter was finishing, orlike a year apart or something
(30:47):
like that, but we moved her intoher senior apartment, uh, or
into her apartment, her firstadult apartment, like right
before she graduated college,but we moved my son in the very
next week to his first adultapartment because he stayed home
a little bit longer, likelooking for a job.
We had moved in a transition soto put them in both their
apartments, like within a week,and each other, having had, like
(31:09):
them, go off to collegeseparately, but slowly drip home
through the pandemic.
And that was where it was likeoh, it was just.
I would imagine it or liken itto if you have children but your
children are twins and thoseare the only children you have
and they both go off to collegeat the same time.
Speaker 1 (31:24):
Yes, yeah, yeah.
I also think that I learned.
I didn't know this, but Ilearned that when I took our
youngest, because I always didcollege drop off because we were
in football season.
So when I took our youngest toNew York city to go to college
in fall of 2019, I was like,okay, this is empty nesting.
(31:45):
And I came home and we were infootball season, so we still had
a lot going on pre pandemic,whatever.
But I thought that that wasempty nesting and what I learned
was that was practice.
That was like dress rehearsalfor empty nesting, cause when
they're in college, they'restill dependent on you.
They're still coming home fortheir breaks.
(32:05):
They're you know it's.
It's not until they actuallyhave a job.
And you know, our oldest livesin DC.
Now our middle one lives in LosAngeles.
The youngest one is home rightnow, just in between contracts.
But it's once they get a joband make money and have a
significant other and they'redoing things out and about in
the world without asking you ortelling you or anything that
(32:29):
you're like wait what ishappening.
That was when it really.
That was when it hit me.
I thought empty nesting startedwhen we took the youngest one
to college and I was incorrect.
That was a dress rehearsal forthe transition and emotions that
(32:50):
I went through over the pastcouple of years.
Speaker 2 (32:54):
Yeah, so what is empty nesting?
What is it?
What is that?
Tell me what you think emptynesting is.
Speaker 1 (32:59):
To me, I think it's when they're if they choose to
go to college or whatever,wherever they go out of high
school, whenever, when they areout of your house with
employment, that is, making themmoney and making them decisions
, and they're not asking youradvice or your opinions or your
(33:22):
permission.
You know, you, you open upInstagram and there's one of
them in you know Seattle orsomething.
You're like wait, what?
Like, what's your wait?
You're traveling with them andI didn't know that.
And, yes, they are, and that'sokay, Cause they are grown up
adults making their own moneyand their own decisions.
That was empty nesting to me.
(33:42):
It was the, it was the jobs, itwas more financial autonomy, it
was relationships and it justfelt like it happened quickly
and and it was a lot for me toprocess at one time.
So that's why I always laughwhen people are like, oh,
(34:04):
they're in college, I'm an emptynester.
I'm like, oh, girly, no, you'renot practice, you know exactly
where they are, because you mayor may not be putting that bill,
but they're probably cominghome to you for every, for
breaks and weekends and to dolaundry and such, and it just
shifts when you know they movedto LA for their job and they've
(34:27):
got to figure out where do youget the car fixed?
And I'm going to travel and seemy friends this weekend and I'm
going to do whatever.
And you're like wait what?
And you're just not involved inany of that, as you shouldn't
be.
But that's hard.
Speaker 2 (34:41):
Hard, yeah, yeah that .
That it's the concept ofletting go and moving on.
And people are like, wait what?
Yes, like I'm supposed to letgo and move on yes and it's like
yes and that is the exact frame.
Speaker 1 (34:56):
Wait what that's exactly what I felt like I was
doing for several years Likewait what?
Speaker 3 (35:00):
Wait, what, what?
Speaker 1 (35:01):
is happening with that.
You nailed it.
I need a shirt with that,because that is what I feel like
.
I walked around saying a lot.
It is your heart, your emotions, your spirit that has to play
catch up, and there's not atimeline for that.
(35:25):
You know, how everyone movesinto this new season of life is
different.
Some people may have absolutelyno issue with it whatsoever.
Other people may have a hardertime.
Everyone's timeline isdifferent.
I just think we can helpeveryone navigate it more easily
, with more confidence, a littlebit more joy, a little bit more
(35:46):
calm, if we talk about it moreand talk about the fact that
you're going to feel all thefeelings and that all the
feelings are valid and it's okayto let your kids know that
you're feeling all the feelingsand that you're working on it.
Speaker 2 (36:00):
Yeah, yeah, and I think that's what you talk.
You know a lot.
You've mentioned the wordmental health a lot throughout
you know conversation so far anda lot of mental health is
dealing with your feelings,right, and so people are so
afraid to actually feel afeeling, right, know what that
feels like in your body, knowwhere it shows up.
And I know you know people outthere may be listening and be
(36:20):
like, well, that's very woohooish, but like well, no, that's
literally how your body works.
Yes, like you can't have athought without a feeling.
Yeah, it doesn't.
They're not separated.
You can't have a thought andhave no feeling attached to it.
It's automatic Thought andfeeling, thought and feeling,
thought and feeling.
And then those thoughts andfeelings drive what you do,
right, how you respond or not toany given situation.
(36:41):
If you don't know how those twowork in tandem and actually know
, oh, I can feel I'm gettingangry.
Yeah Right, I can feel it in myjaw.
My jaw is starting to clench,boom, great.
Or I'm feeling sad.
Where does that show up?
Well, it feels like a lump inmy throat or like somebody
sitting in my chest.
Awesome, feel it, because then,once you feel it and know
exactly how it's done, you canmove past it quicker than
(37:01):
letting it spiral and take youdown the river of misery.
Speaker 1 (37:04):
Yeah, and women have a lot of feelings about our
feelings, feelings about howwe're feeling, so we need to
work on that too.
I think, as a generation,probably our coping skills are
less.
We're kind of in a weird space,because I think Gen X is the
generation whose parents werevery much okay with them being
bored and letting them figure itout, but now we all have phones
(37:27):
and so we scroll or do thingsthat are less healthy other than
, to your point, feeling ourfeelings.
I also learned that when we hada lot of things kind of happen
at the same time and this willnot be true for everyone, but
this was, this, was, this is mylived experience.
For us, our truth was we moved.
My husband retired fromfootball coaching, we moved to a
(37:50):
new place that, while we werevery excited, we didn't know
anyone.
Our girls were gone, life wasjust different and there was an
energy vacuum in my life in myhead in my heart there was an
energy vacuum and we all havegenerational baggage.
We all have generational trauma.
(38:10):
That baggage and trauma that Ihad pushed down for a lot of
years decided it would be theperfect opportunity to come out
and play.
So that made the transition forme empty nesting even more
challenging, because I also hada lot of generational baggage
and trauma wrapped up in it thatI had to navigate and wade
(38:33):
through.
That was tied into how I wasfeeling about the girls and all
of it.
So if, if you're a little bitbefore, if, if you haven't quite
got to empty nesting and youthink that sounds kind of silly,
just be prepared that whenthere is an energy vacuum, often
your brain will now try to fillit and sometimes it's not
(38:58):
always the most positive ofthoughts and feelings that fill
it.
And I believe that everybodyneeds therapy.
Everybody needs to be going totherapy.
I don't care if you think youneed therapy.
You don't think you have stuff.
We all have stuff.
We are human beings on thisplanet carrying baggage and
trauma and stuff generationallyand part of our job is to
(39:21):
lighten that load for our kidsand so the work that I do on me
waiting through that, thatgenerational baggage and that
trauma and that junk that I'vecarried for a long time.
Part of that work that I do onme lightens the load for my
girls because I maybe stop someof those behaviors, words,
(39:43):
actions, thoughts that I've beencarrying, that I was passing on
to them.
We're all going to pass the junkon, but the amount that we pass
on we can take some control inthat.
And that was part of thechallenge for empty nesting for
me is that I also had a lot ofjunk that I had been carrying
around that when everything wasreally busy I didn't have to
(40:03):
deal with.
And then, when everything wasless busy, it came out to play
and I had to deal with it andthank goodness I had to because
it has to be dealt with at somepoint.
And navigating that and makingmistakes and letting my girls
see that I'm navigating it andtalking about therapy with them
and going through that is reallypowerful for them to see as
(40:23):
well, because it's an okay thingto let your kids know that you
are not just a parent but you'realso a human and that you're
working on you and that givesthem a better roadmap for when
they get to this season.
So I think that's all part ofthe empty net nesting process as
well, as there could be somejunk that comes up that you're
(40:45):
going to have to process, andplease do go to therapy and
process it.
You will be better off becauseof it.
Speaker 2 (40:52):
Yeah, a hundred percent.
Like I fully believe, like whenyou work on yourself and get
better, it's not just for you,no, no it's for everybody in
your life.
yes, right, and so just imaginewhat the world would be like if
everybody was working onthemselves.
So people are often likethere's a stigma with therapy
(41:14):
and maybe even coaching, right.
So you know, therapy is likegoing backwards to figure out,
okay, what's keeping you stuck,and then coaching helps you move
forward.
That's kind of like thesimplest way to describe both of
them.
If you're not doing either,then you're stuck.
You are, you stay stagnant,you're in the middle.
But professional athletes havecoaches.
Sure, they have all differentkinds of coaches.
Sure, they have a nutritionist.
(41:34):
They have a weight you know,strength and weight training
coach.
They have a position coach.
They have coaches out the wazoo.
Why wouldn't you do the samething for yourself?
Speaker 1 (41:44):
I always say I don't cut my own hair.
I do not cut my own hair, so Icannot fix my own brain.
If I go to someone to cut myhair which is much less serious
than someone fixing my brain,you know, I think we have to get
over that and I do think that,honestly, our children's
generation, the millennials andGen Zers, are doing a much
(42:05):
better job of talking abouttherapy and mental health, and
we're almost taking our cuesfrom them.
But I'm okay with that too.
We can learn from our kids asmuch as we can teach our kids.
So it's a really powerful thingfor them to see you working on
you yeah, 100%, I love that.
So it's a really powerful thingfor them to see you working on
you.
Speaker 2 (42:21):
Yeah, a hundred percent, and I love that.
Like to be open and transparentand honest with kind of how
you're living life and thechanges you want to make and how
you want to get better onlyhelps them, and vice versa.
Speaker 1 (42:32):
Right, yeah, cause we're going to live with them as
grownups for the rest of ourlives.
And yes, you know I had to havea honest conversation with my
girls at one point and be likelisten, I know I have to figure
this stuff out and you're notgetting it right either, like
we're all human None of us aregetting this right but my goal
is that we have a really greatrelationship for the rest of
(42:55):
time.
So we're going to probablygoing to go through some
uncomfortable patches as we workon this, because that's my goal
is a really great relationshipwith my kids, because I like my
daughters as much as I love themas their mom.
I really like them.
They're funny, they're smart,they're way cooler than I am, or
ever was, and they'rewell-traveled, they're
(43:18):
articulate.
I really like them.
Well, I really want to spendtime with them.
No one wants to spend time witha mom who's just talking about
how sad she is all the time.
So I better get this stufffigured out because I want my
relationship with my girls to beamazing for the rest of the
time that I get to have theopportunity to be on this planet
, and that means I'm going tohave to do some work.
(43:40):
I'm get to have the opportunityto be on this planet, and that
means I'm going to have to dosome work.
I'm going to have to figure itout, and if I don't, then I'm
choosing not to, and sometimeswe choose to stay stuck in that
sad.
For a little bit I felt like Ifeel like I probably chose to
stay stuck there longer than Ishould have, and that's also a
little bit part of the journey.
And then you choose to do thework and you figure it out and
(44:03):
and they see that too and um, Ijust I want to make sure that
I'm the kind of person that mykids want to be around for a
really long time, cause I reallylike them.
I want them to want to hang outwith me, so I need to do the
work on me to make sure thatthat happens.
Speaker 2 (44:18):
Yeah, when you become invested in your own life, you
become interesting to your kids.
Yes, Right, they're like ohlook at that, like why are you
doing that?
Why are you taking that on?
Why are you attempting that?
You know you're tryingsomething different, you're
learning something new.
Speaker 1 (44:31):
They're like oh, I actually want to know you more
than just my parent.
Yes, yes, yes, and the goalreally is that they call or come
home sometime and like you'renot there because you're out
like doing whatever cool thingis that you're doing, and
they're like wait, wait, well,my parents have a life.
Speaker 2 (44:48):
Yes, yes, we do Maybe it takes us a minute to get
there but we do, we're workingon getting there.
That's right and for everybodylistening.
It's okay not to text back ornot to pick up the call right
away.
Like you're, you can have alife and do other things.
You don't have to wait for themto text or call you and be on
call for that.
Speaker 1 (45:04):
That's a great reminder.
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (45:07):
Although it is kind of funny because they do expect
that immediate, like where wereyou?
Speaker 1 (45:10):
A thousand percent.
Oh my God, a thousand percent.
They're like do you, what areyou doing?
Maybe I was doing somethingelse, maybe I was taking a walk,
maybe.
Speaker 2 (45:18):
I just didn't want to talk to you at that particular
moment so good.
So good.
As we wrap up, I'm curiouswhat's your life motto?
Speaker 1 (45:27):
Oh my gosh, that's a great question.
You know, I will say I thinkthat it's show up when I think
about it.
My dad really modeled that forme.
He would say that little phraseyou know, shower, shave, show
up.
He would say it occasionally,but I also watched him do that.
I have a very differentrelationship with my mom, where
(45:51):
a lot of this generationalbaggage comes from.
So when I think about whomodeled what I would want this
season of my life to be, itreally was my dad.
And that mindset around you showup.
You show up and do the thing,whether you feel like doing the
thing or not.
You show up when it'sinconvenient.
You show up so that you can putyour head on the pillow at
night knowing that you dideverything to be your best and
(46:14):
do your best that day.
And I think that that reallyhas become something that I've
I've absorbed and tried to liveby.
The work to feel better is noteasy, but I'm going to show up
for it.
I'm going to show up for itbecause my relationship with my
girls matter, I matter, my goalsand dreams matter.
This life matters.
(46:35):
I'm going to show up and do thesmall things well so that we
can create a really big, amazinglife together.
I think if you just takeemotions off the table sometimes
sometimes and simply show upand do the work, you'll get the
emotions you were after on theother side of doing the work.
(46:58):
No one really loves to work out,but I sure do love how I feel
on the other side of doing thework.
No one really loves to work out, but I sure do love how I feel
on the other side of it.
I don't think a lot.
A lot of people, maybe somepeople do but I don't love going
to therapy, but I love how Ifeel on the other side of it.
So I'm going to show up and dothose things, whether I feel
like it or not in my life,because on the other side of it
(47:18):
is probably what I'm looking for.
So I would say my motto is showup.
Speaker 2 (47:24):
Show up so good.
Julie, thank you for showing uphere today and sharing a little
bit of your story with thisemptiness life.
I so appreciate it.
And for showing up in the worldhow you show up there for the
people who follow you and modelafter that right You're doing so
needed.
So thank you for like talkingabout it.
Speaker 1 (47:43):
When you popped up on my Instagram.
Speaker 3 (47:45):
I'm like wait a minute someone else is talking
about this.
Speaker 1 (47:48):
That's amazing.
So thank you for theseconversations and for getting
this topic out into moreeveryday, normal conversation so
that we you and I can maybeshorten the learning curve for
people who are kind of coming upin this next generation and
that they navigate this season alittle bit better maybe than we
(48:10):
did and understand that it'snot an end.
It is truly just the beginningof a new season.
I love that.
Speaker 2 (48:16):
I love that, yeah, and to be the model for it yes.
I like that idea, like the morewe can share, the more we can
get out there in front of it, sopeople can say, oh, there is
something between when the kidsleave for school and when we
retire like life doesn't stop.
Speaker 1 (48:30):
For sure, for sure.
Speaker 2 (48:31):
Love it, love it.
Thanks again for being here.
Speaker 1 (48:33):
Thank you.
Speaker 3 (48:36):
Are you ready to start living and enjoying your
empty nest years?
If so, head over tojasonramsdencom and click work
with me to get the conversationstarted.
This Empty Nest Life is aproduction of Impact.
One Media LLC.
All rights reserved.
Our generation.
The parents were like okay, goget married now and have
children.
And just the gap between us,you know, graduating college,
for example, and then gettingmarried and having children that
gap was so small that they wereon to their next role.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Right.
Speaker 1 (00:16):
Quickly.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
Quicker.
Speaker 1 (00:17):
And the gap now is so much greater, like, my oldest
daughter is past the age where Iwas already married and had her
, and so the gap is widening,and so I think that makes it a
little more like loosey-gooseyfor parents, like wait, what am
I supposed to be doing?
Because we have no role modelfor this.
Speaker 3 (00:37):
Welcome to this Empty Nest Life.
Join Jay Ramsden as he leadsyou on a transformative journey
through the uncharted seas ofmidlife and empty nesting.
If you're ready to embark onthis new adventure and redefine
your future, you're in the rightplace.
Here's your host the Empty NestCoach, Jay Ramsden, Julie.
(00:57):
Voris welcome to this EmptyNest Life.
Yeah, I'm so glad that you'rehere.
Speaker 1 (01:04):
We were going to talk about empty nesting.
Who would have thought I know?
Speaker 2 (01:07):
Right, right, like nobody talks about it, and you
know I'm trying to think Like.
I found you online and you knowI started following you on
Instagram.
I think it was no-transcript.
(01:31):
Get rolling.
Speaker 1 (01:33):
Of course, thank you for this opportunity.
It's such a pleasure to be ableto talk about empty nesting and
be able to talk about thisseason of life.
First and foremost, thank youfor doing this, because not
enough people are talking aboutit and it becomes this strange
wilderness that nobody knows themap to, and there are lots of
people who've been through it.
There is an app.
So you know we can help otherpeople kind of figure it out.
(01:55):
I think that that's a reallycool opportunity for us.
So I am a former high schoolEnglish teacher and I kind of
fell into fitness.
I discovered a passion forfitness, teaching fitness,
training others to teach fitnessbecame an online health and
wellness business owner and itjust kind of got to this place
(02:17):
where, all of a sudden, now allthese things I did with my girls
being home and for my girls nowthey're actually not home
anymore.
And so here we are what do wedo, what are we doing and how we
figure these out?
My husband was a collegefootball coach, so we lived the
football life for 30 plus yearsand just two years ago we made
(02:39):
our big dream come true.
We were in Indiana, we moved toFlorida.
We are Midwestern people kindof lived in the Midwest.
Even with coaching and moving alot, we tended to stay in the
Midwest.
We had a little bit of a stintin Texas, but we were Indiana,
illinois, pennsylvania,wisconsin, and the majority of
(03:00):
our time was spent in Indiana.
And two years ago we made thebig move down to Orlando,
florida, so we can both havenicer weather than Indiana and
live a little closer to Disneybecause we love it here, and
thank goodness that I did thatat the time, that I really went
(03:21):
off the deep end into emptynesting because I tell you what
there's something reallypowerful about seeing the
sunrise every morning.
It's really good for your mentalhealth and the gray in Indiana
was not so much, and I don'tknow what my mental health would
have done if I was goingthrough this this season, which
the transition has been toughfor me, as it is for many, um,
(03:43):
and not living in a place whereI can at least go get a little
magic every once in a while.
So I'm really thankful for howit all worked out and, honestly,
the girls are as well becauseit's a lot more fun to come home
to Orlando, florida, or is toIndia.
There's a lot more to do here,so everything happens for a
reason, but it's been a littlebit of a tough transition for me
(04:04):
.
Speaker 2 (04:10):
Yeah, and that's not uncommon, right when?
When I talk to people, it'slike throughout life you see
these seasons of transitionsfrom elementary school to middle
school, middle school to highschool, high school to college,
college to job, job to marriage,Like it's all laid out.
You see that that's kind oflike the quote unquote normal
path that you take and even so,you like see retirement life,
but nobody talks about betweenthe time the kids leave and that
retirement life.
(04:30):
There's no modeling of whatthat looks like for anybody.
And so that's what I got soimpassioned and empowered about
trying to spread this word andhaving conversations with people
is because I want to model like.
I want to be an example ofwhat's possible, and you
certainly are an example ofwhat's possible based upon your
(04:50):
story.
I'm curious when you leftIndiana, said go to Orlando like
were the kids out of college incollege?
Like what was the timing?
Speaker 1 (04:58):
So when we left, uh, jenna, our oldest had once.
She graduated college she livedfor a year in New York City and
working and then she decided togo to grad school in DC.
So she was in grad school in DCfinishing up working.
She was in DC.
Our middle one was in Indianafinishing her last year of
(05:22):
school and our youngest one wasin New York City in school.
So it was kind of a moment whereit was a pretty good time to go
, because people have sort ofcut their ties a little bit to
you know where it is the placethey grew up, but they kind of
(05:44):
cut their ties a little bit tothat, that childhood home and
such.
And you know, my husband, as Isaid, had been a college
football coach and going throughthe pandemic as a college
football coach wasextraordinarily difficult and I
watched his mental healthdecline and we just got to the
point where I couldn't find areally good reason to stay.
(06:07):
Yes, he was still working, buthe was unhappy and I was looking
around going, okay, the girlsare all gone now, everyone's in
school now, but I'm living inthe same town and which was
amazing when they were in school.
Growing up it was a fabulousplace.
(06:28):
We lived in Carmel, indiana.
It was a fabulous.
School system was amazing.
That was a fabulous place withamazing opportunities to raise a
family.
And then, once the family wasgone, I just would look around
and going I'm not sure what'skeeping us here and watching him
.
You know kind of struggle withhis mental health.
I'm like it's, it's time and Ireally I had to do some, some
(06:48):
pushing a little bit, but youknow that's, that's what happens
Sometimes.
I do a little pushing.
I'm like we're going to need tomove this timeline up a little
bit more.
And then once we moved, it waslike, oh my gosh, this is the
best thing that we ever did.
So the girls were at was nothard for them, it wasn't like it
wasn't this.
Oh my goodness, you're sellingour childhood home.
Speaker 3 (07:07):
What are we going to do?
You know?
Speaker 1 (07:09):
And one of the most fun experiences we had actually
was the holiday break prior tous moving in March of 2022.
And everyone was home that weekbefore Christmas, between
Christmas and New Year's, and wehauled everything up 16 years
of stuff out of the basement,all their school stuff that I
(07:31):
kept, just everything and we,every night that week, went
through everything.
And it was such a cool familyexperience to go through all of
that stuff and relive all thesememories and for them to choose
what we wanted to keep and whatthey were like no, we're done
with this.
And really they were so fullyinvested in the move and the
(07:52):
process of moving.
The timing was perfect.
Speaker 2 (07:57):
It was perfect.
Yeah, like and I get thatquestion a lot from people like
just, you know, openly on socialis like, well, I'm thinking
about moving but I don't knowwhat to do.
Speaker 3 (08:08):
It's like the childhood home and all the
memories right, but I loved howyou approached it.
Right.
Speaker 2 (08:11):
Let's bring all the memories up and see what sticks,
and you know what stays andwhat goes, and oftentimes you
know, the memories of things getso wrapped in a thing.
Yes, you know somebody gave methis pen.
You know sort of that was.
That was part of him, but is itreally the pen?
Is the memory, is it the personYou're afraid?
If you let go of the memory,you let go of the person or the
(08:31):
thing.
Yeah, and I love that how youapproach that.
It was just probably verycathartic.
Speaker 1 (08:38):
It was, and it was so much fun and I would, I would
really encourage anyone who isthinking about moving like to
really bring everyone into thatprocess and because your
children leave home, right.
So this idea of, oh my goodness, my kids don't want me to move,
they don't, they don't want meto leave their child at home,
(08:59):
yeah, but they're leaving home.
Right so at one point do you getto do your own thing too, right
, you know so.
So there's.
We were kind of at that pointto like, would you rather come
home to Orlando, florida, wouldyou rather come home to Indiana?
They're like, yeah, florida isway better.
So it did.
The whole timing of it workedwell, but also because I think
(09:22):
we involved them so much in allof it, it felt really good.
Speaker 2 (09:27):
Yeah, yeah, and for those listening like, you don't
have to sell your home and moveto Orlando Florida.
There are other options.
Yeah, this was just yourjourney.
So, given all that you havegoing on right now right,
obviously an empty nester yourun a business, a pretty big
business Like.
What's your greatest motivatorright now?
Speaker 1 (09:44):
My biggest motivator for the entirety of my life,
since I had children since themoment you know the oldest one
was born has always been I'vegot children who are watching me
and I need to model for them tobeing the best human I can
(10:05):
possibly be Not the most perfecthuman, not the human that gets
it right Cause, goodness knows,nobody is that and goodness
knows I did not get and I didnot go through this empty
nesting journey.
Well, many, many mistakes alongthe way, and I'm okay with them
seeing that, because whatthey're also seeing me do is try
(10:27):
to get better, and I thinkthat's really important for our
kids to see.
So, my motivator, whether it'sbeen showing up for stuff I
didn't want not, we don't wantto show up for everything that
we have to show up to in ourlives, but showing up to the to
my life, show up to in our lives, but showing up to, to the to
my life, trying to get better,being a constant student,
(10:47):
building a business, sort ofsmashing some of those
stereotypes of of women Well,you can either be a mom or you
can build a business.
No, you can actually dowhatever you want and modeling
that for them.
And then, even now, whether theyknow it or not, or absorb it
now, modeling what it looks liketo be in this season of life
(11:08):
all the imperfections, all themistakes, all of it and showing
them you know what a lifewell-lived looks like.
That is what motivates me.
You know, I'm pretty clear thatI'm not going to get it right
every day.
I'm pretty clear I'm going tomake a lot of mistakes, but I
have conversations with mydaughters that I never had with
(11:31):
my parents.
We just never would have hadthese kinds of conversations,
and that's motivating to me.
How can I continue to grow into, for as long as I'm on this
planet, the kind of person thatmy girls want to be around and
that they kind of look at and gothat?
She lived a great life, and Ihope to be able to do that too.
(11:51):
So, good, that's what motivatesme.
Speaker 2 (11:53):
Yeah, yeah, it's like being the example of what's
possible, yes, right, because sooften people think, ok, well,
we get to the empty nestingyears and if I'm working, I just
keep working and I just waitfor grandkids to come or a
wedding to come and then Iretire, like it's like this
feeling stuck but not feelingstuck, it's like the routine of
it all which I get right.
(12:14):
Our brains crave routine.
But how incredible it is thatthat you're an example of what's
possible for your girls.
Like a hundred percent in this.
You can do anything at anystage in life.
Yes, right, and you're, andyou're a walking example of that
for them.
Speaker 1 (12:30):
Well, I also don't want to be waiting yes, me me
waiting for their nextaccomplishment.
It was a statement on the.
I don't have enough going on inmy life right now Like I'm
waiting, you know, if I don'thave enough going on in my life
right now Like I'm waiting, youknow, if I'm just waiting around
for them to get married, whatif they choose never to do that
(12:50):
which, by the way, is fine?
Or waiting around for them tohave children, which they may
never have children, which also,by the way, is fine I'm just
waiting around for their nextthing.
But that means I've forgottenthat I'm also a human being,
person with goals and dreams ofmy own, and I don't do them any
(13:12):
service just by waiting around.
They need to see me flourishingso that they know, when they get
to this season of life, theycan do this too.
The reason why they know theycan do anything in life they
want is in part not a hundredpercent, but it is in part to
what they've seen me do up tothis point in their life, and
even though I did alwaysnavigate empty nesting, you know
, amazingly, that's okay.
They saw that too.
They saw a human who was tryingto figure stuff out and is
(13:35):
willing to work to figure stuffout, and when they get to this
season, they'll do it a littlebetter.
That's the point.
They should do it a littlebetter than I did.
And if they do choose to havekids, awesome.
And when their kids get to thisseason of life, hopefully they
do it a little bit better.
That's kind of the point of allthis is continuing to model for
them what these differentseasons in life can look like
(13:58):
and then give them the baton sothey can do it a little bit
better.
Speaker 2 (14:02):
Yeah, yeah, it's like we want better for every
generation wants it a little bitbetter.
Yeah, yeah, it's like the wewant better for every generation
wants better for the nextgeneration.
Right, but the old philosophyof what that looked like, I
think, needs to change.
Speaker 1 (14:14):
Right.
Speaker 2 (14:15):
Like the old philosophy was like working a
job till forever and then retire.
And then you just do retirement, you know, and play the role of
grandparent.
But I want people, this is whatI want.
People and see if thisresonates with you is like I
want.
I want my grandkids or my kidsto be able to say to their kids,
my grandkids, like, oh, my God,look what grandpa whatever name
they give me did at this age inlife.
(14:37):
Like, look at all the thingsthat he, he did that were like
just cool.
This is how we, how we livelife.
Yes, Right, we don't live lifegoing through the motions.
Speaker 1 (14:46):
I don't know if that resonates or yes, very much,
very much, because I you know, Ithink what makes empty nesting
a challenging transition is likeas we talked about nobody talks
about it.
So if you research what's itlike to parent grownup children,
you will find very little outthere.
(15:07):
You'll find lots of stuff abouttoddlerhood, which is about two
years.
You'll find lots of stuff aboutelementary and middle school,
which is three, four, whatever,how many years.
You'll find lots of stuff aboutteenage years and then there's
a huge drop-off and there'snothing except the majority of
our lives we will spend knowingour children as actual adult
(15:27):
children.
And the fact that there'snothing out there about this
season of life and how it can bechallenging, particularly for
women, I think makes people veryunprepared for this season of
life.
And I know, you know my parentsdidn't talk to me about it and
also I think my generation was alittle bit, our generation was
(15:48):
a little bit different and youknow I did get married pretty
quickly out of college, I didhave children pretty quickly and
my girls just are not doingwhich I have any say in.
I was very unprepared for thatand I think it's because no one
(16:21):
talks about it.
No one talks about it.
And if they do talk about it,you only hear them talk about
them being sad and how theycan't wait for grandchildren, or
they push down the negativeemotions and just talk about it.
But I'm just so proud.
I'm just so proud.
Here's the God's honest truth.
You're going to feel sad andproud and excited and lost and
(16:43):
confused and happy all at thesame exact time.
You're not going to know what'sgoing on and all that's okay,
but most of us aren't preparedfor that influx and tornado of
emotions because nobody talksabout this season.
Speaker 2 (17:01):
Exactly.
I think they call that that oneinstance college drop off day.
No, I'm kidding, Like that'sthe one where it is All.
Think they call that that oneinstance college drop-off day.
No, I'm kidding, Like likethat's the one where it is.
All of those emotions happen inthat day.
You're proud, you're sad,you're angry, you're frustrated.
You're happy, you're lonely,Like you're confused that day is
like the Kickstarter, for allthe balls of emotions that we
feel, yeah, and it's the factthat, like people, that well,
(17:25):
what it's like, oh, it'd be fine, just you know, just do this
and enjoy it, and then go homeLike no, like there are so many
things you can do to get readyfor that day.
There's so many things you cando when you, once you get home,
I think what happens is peopleexperience that and then they're
just left with a whole bunch ofquestions.
Speaker 1 (17:39):
Correct, correct.
And then they go home and theenergy in their house has
shifted and they don't know howto navigate it.
Yeah, that's so smart and theydon't know how to talk about it.
Because and I'll speak aboutwomen specifically because if
you're a woman and you talkabout feeling sad to a point
(18:01):
that that makes you selfish, toa point that that makes you
selfish, you can talk about as afemale this is what I've
discovered and as a female, youcan talk about being worried
about your kids, because that'sabout them.
But if you talk about being sador confused or lost, well
that's about you.
And suddenly now you're aselfish mom and you can't talk
(18:21):
about that.
You can be worried becausethat's about them.
Selfish mom, and you can't talkabout that.
You can be worried becausethat's about them.
Or you can be proud, but heavenforbid you be all those things
which newsflash you are, andover and over and over again
over the past two years,especially women would have said
to me.
Well, I thought I was the onlyone feeling all this and I
(18:43):
thought to myself and sometimesI would say to them it's a
planet of 8 billion people.
What part of you thinks thatyou're the special unicorn who
feels this?
But we think that because noone talks about it.
It's sort of this shamefulthing to say wait, I did this
thing that I was kind ofsupposed to do with my kids, but
(19:06):
now I'm not really sure how Ifeel about it.
In fact, I feel kind of crappyabout it, that's.
That's kind of we've made thatkind of shameful in society and,
frankly, it's time that we stopthat and just normalize.
You're going to feel all thefeelings.
You're going to feel all thefeelings on any given day.
There are going to be some daysthat are more sad than others.
There are going to be some daysthat are happy and you're fine.
(19:27):
You're going to feel all of it,and the piece that will help
you navigate it the most is time.
That's it.
You have to live through it, gothrough it, make mistakes,
learn from them, work on you andput some time into actively
(19:50):
doing the work to feel better,or you will stay stuck in the
sad and your children are seeingthat and that's a disservice to
them.
Speaker 2 (19:57):
Yeah, yeah, I agree, I agree, and I think nobody
talks about it because of theshame.
Agree, right.
It's like oh, if I, if I, if Itell my family, or I tell my
friends that I'm struggling,especially if I have friends who
still have kids at home, that'swhere the shame really comes
from.
Speaker 3 (20:13):
They're like wait.
Speaker 2 (20:14):
you're out of be the best day of your life.
The house is empty, you get todo whatever you want to do.
Right.
But if you spend so much timeof your self-identity you know
mom or dad right, because wehave dads who do that Like
they're the one who's thelogistics person or the coach of
the kid's team or whatever allthe way through, whatever it may
be, when you wrap yourself-identity up into being
(20:36):
Billy or Susie's mom or dad,you're not your.
Your self identity isn't whoyou are as a person.
Speaker 1 (20:43):
And it's so.
It's so interesting that yousay that you use those words,
cause I was thinking about lastweek.
We have this great family thatlives next to us and they have
four young kids and they have.
You know, in Florida, of course, everybody has a pool in their
backyard.
The kids are out in the pool intheir backyard and I don't know
which kid was like well, Ithink it was all of them Mom,
mom, mom, watch me, mom, watchme, mom, mom.
(21:04):
And I was standing out in ourpool and I was just.
I was laughing to myselfbecause it was constant Mom, mom
, mom, watch me, mom, mom, mom,mom.
And my husband came through.
He goes.
I just, I love hearing thesound of the kids next door.
I go, I do too, but I'mthinking about this on a whole
(21:31):
nother level, because I'mthinking about that is such a
perfect example of why it is sochallenging for women to
navigate this transition,because the dad that lives next
door is an amazing dad.
My husband is, was an amazingdad, is an amazing dad.
My husband is was an amazingdad.
It's an amazing dad, butthey're not going.
Dad, dad, dad, watch me.
They're saying mom, mom, mom,mom, mom, watch me.
And then we get to this placewhere it's time to to launch
(21:52):
them.
And again, mine are old enoughNow they're making their own
money, they're making their owndecisions and you're like, wait
what?
No one's saying mom, mom, mom,watch me.
No one's saying mom, mom, mom,what should I do?
No one's saying mom, mom, mom.
And it is such a hard, it'ssuch a hard act to extricate
yourself from that identity ofmom because for however long
(22:16):
your kids were like, that's whatyou heard, that's, that was
part of it.
And I was just standing outthere listening to all of it and
thinking this is what makesempty nesting so challenging the
transition into that.
You know, I was literallyverbally hearing why it's so
hard, you know, in the housenext to me, because no one's, no
(22:37):
one's like mom, mom, mom, mom,mom, watch me.
At this point in my life, andthat can be a challenge.
Speaker 2 (22:44):
Yeah, definitely Right, because it's where you
put your attention and focus,but also where your kids put
their attention and focus Right,and so, as they're younger,
their attention and focus is onyou.
Right, you are the full-time,24-7 model for what life looks
like and you know guidance, andone of my favorite sayings is
(23:06):
like uh, you know, I taught youeverything you know, but not
everything I know.
Right.
That's how we act as parents iswe try and teach our kids
everything that we know beforethey go right off right.
And then, as they get older andthey start to do things for
themselves and start to see lifea little bit differently, like
that role kind of slowlydwindles until you get fired.
(23:26):
Literally, you drop them off atcollege, you come home, you got
fired from your job, you know,part time you're like a
consultant yes, like a 1090,like a 1099 employee
is like yeah, you know I'llreach out to you when I need you
that.
Speaker 1 (23:38):
That's exactly right.
That's exactly right.
Speaker 2 (23:41):
And that is so hard to wrap your head around,
because it does not only do.
You come home and the house isquiet, but the focus is gone.
Speaker 1 (23:47):
Correct, correct, that's.
You're exactly right.
Like, all of a sudden, you gotfired.
And the crazy part about it all, jay, the crazy part about it
all is we did this ourselves.
Is we did this ourselves.
Like we left home and we, youknow, had children.
We've actually done thisourselves, you know, quote
(24:09):
unquote, to our parents.
So you would think that when itcomes time for us to launch our
own kids, we, you know, we wouldlook at that and go, well, yeah
, like, this is the naturalorder, and there is a piece of
your brain that knows that, yes,this is the natural order.
I did this.
Now it's time for my kids to dothis, and your brain knows that
(24:29):
, but your heart has a hardertime catching up to it.
So, even though you know it andyou know it's what's supposed
to be happening, the last thingyou need to hear from people is
well, this is what you weresupposed to do and this is what
you launched them for, andthey're like no, I don't need to
hear any of that, because yourheart takes a minute to catch up
to literally how fast time hasflown, and I think that's the
(24:54):
piece that makes parents sad aswell.
It's not like you're sad thatyour, your child, is going off
and pursuing their goals anddreams and, maybe you know,
doing great things with theirlife.
You're sad at how fast the timewent.
And for someone just to go justbe proud, it's, it's um, it's
(25:15):
annoying.
Speaker 3 (25:17):
It's like a slap in the face.
Yes, it's very demeaning Likeplease don't say Annoying it's
like a slap in the face.
Speaker 1 (25:19):
Yes, it's very demeaning, like, please don't
say that to empty nesters,please just don't tell nesters
to just be proud because you'reassuming that we're not.
We're proud, we're very proud.
We're also sad and lost andconfused and excited and all the
things and kind of trying tosettle into this new reality
that we knew cognitively wascoming because we did it, but
(25:40):
you you just don't knowemotionally how it's going to
feel.
And I think just talking aboutit more, having more empathy and
not saying dumb things to emptynesters would be a really great
start and just a little bitmore empathy.
And the other piece that I alsonoticed was that everyone asks
(26:02):
about the kids but no one asksabout the parents.
Yes, everyone asks about howthey're doing in school or how
they.
You know, and our youngestactually was in Hong Kong last
year for a job that's across onthe other side of the planet,
which is really hard to put yourchild on a plane for them to go
(26:23):
to Hong Kong.
Very cool, very hard andeveryone asked about how she was
doing.
Very few people asked about howwe were doing.
So just note, if you have newempty nesters in your life, ask
them how they are doing beforeyou ask about the kids, because
(26:43):
chances are they're not doingwell and they need you to.
You know, hype them up a littlebit and, maybe you know, ask
about them and then ask aboutthe kids, because the kids are
probably settling in fine, theparents probably not so much.
Speaker 2 (26:57):
That's true, that's true.
Here's something that I thinkhas maybe perhaps made it harder
for us.
We're probably like the firstgeneration where, yes, we left
home, left our parents to becomeempty nesters and then now our
kids are leaving.
I think the difference is, whenwe left home, our parents said,
here's a quarter and call ifyou have trouble Right yeah.
(27:19):
When we left home, our parentssaid, here's a quarter and call
if you have trouble Right yeah.
Like the connection, the alltime connection through, you
know, smartphones, I think isexacerbating the transition to
emptiness.
I don't know your thoughts onthat.
Speaker 1 (27:32):
I also think the pandemic for me personally and I
don't know about other parents,but for me personally.
I got extra time with my girls.
Speaker 2 (27:43):
Yes, yeah.
Speaker 1 (27:44):
Because they were in school in New York City and they
came home, which is horriblefor them.
It was extra time for me.
But I think that probablytripled the hardness of
transitioning into empty nestingbecause I did get that extra
time, the hardness oftransitioning into empty nesting
because I did get that extratime.
And when they're older andyou're older, I think you have a
(28:05):
greater appreciation of thattime.
I think when you're in thethick of when they're littles
and you're just trying to getthrough the day, you don't
necessarily appreciate the timewith them quite as much that's
been my experience anywaynecessarily appreciate the time
with them quite as much.
That's been my experienceanyway.
And when they're older and you,you really have a better
understanding how fast time goes.
(28:26):
The fact that I got that extratime, I was so grateful for it,
even amidst a horrible lifesituation and even though I knew
it was not the best situationfor them, I was so grateful for
that time.
And then the back end of that,the thing that came then back
and, you know, punched me in thegut, was that it made the
transition into them growing upand moving or again making their
(28:50):
own money and their owndecisions, having significant
others.
All that it made it harder forme.
So there was a give and a takewith that pandemic, but I think
the pandemic has made this alittle bit different.
I just, I think to your point,our generation, the parents,
were like, okay, go get marriednow and have children.
(29:11):
And just the gap between us and, you know, graduating college,
for example, and then gettingmarried and having children,
that gap was so small that theywere onto their next role.
Speaker 2 (29:24):
Right, quickly, quicker.
Speaker 1 (29:26):
And the gap now is so much greater.
Like, my oldest daughter ispast the age where I was already
married and had her.
She's already older than thatand so the gap is widening, and
so I think that makes it alittle more like loosey-goosey
for parents, like wait, what amI supposed to be doing?
Because we have no role modelfor this.
(29:48):
Gen X is kind of the first ones.
We have no role models.
Our parents sent us off if wewent to college, or maybe we got
married before that, whateverand then we had kids and they
were right into beinggrandparents.
We are not doing that, gen Xisn't doing that, and we don't
have anyone that showed us howto do this.
So we're a littlediscombobulated on this whole.
(30:11):
How are we supposed?
to do it Because we didn't seeanyone do it.
Speaker 2 (30:15):
Yeah, where's the roadmap?
Speaker 1 (30:16):
Where's the roadmap?
Where's the instruction guide?
Speaker 2 (30:24):
Yeah, that's right, we are creating it.
We are creating it, but I Ithink your point is valid about
the pandemic is like we did getextra time with them at home.
We didn't suck for them.
They didn't have the fullexperience of college, correct,
like we had the full experienceof college but we had a longer
runway to the launch of them,and for me in particular, it
just hit me, like my son did, afifth year of college and so
that made um him finishing thesame time.
My daughter was finishing, orlike a year apart or something
(30:47):
like that, but we moved her intoher senior apartment, uh, or
into her apartment, her firstadult apartment, like right
before she graduated college,but we moved my son in the very
next week to his first adultapartment because he stayed home
a little bit longer, likelooking for a job.
We had moved in a transition soto put them in both their
apartments, like within a week,and each other, having had, like
(31:09):
them, go off to collegeseparately, but slowly drip home
through the pandemic.
And that was where it was likeoh, it was just.
I would imagine it or liken itto if you have children but your
children are twins and thoseare the only children you have
and they both go off to collegeat the same time.
Speaker 1 (31:24):
Yes, yeah, yeah.
I also think that I learned.
I didn't know this, but Ilearned that when I took our
youngest, because I always didcollege drop off because we were
in football season.
So when I took our youngest toNew York city to go to college
in fall of 2019, I was like,okay, this is empty nesting.
(31:45):
And I came home and we were infootball season, so we still had
a lot going on pre pandemic,whatever.
But I thought that that wasempty nesting and what I learned
was that was practice.
That was like dress rehearsalfor empty nesting, cause when
they're in college, they'restill dependent on you.
They're still coming home fortheir breaks.
(32:05):
They're you know it's.
It's not until they actuallyhave a job.
And you know, our oldest livesin DC.
Now our middle one lives in LosAngeles.
The youngest one is home rightnow, just in between contracts.
But it's once they get a joband make money and have a
significant other and they'redoing things out and about in
the world without asking you ortelling you or anything that
(32:29):
you're like wait what ishappening.
That was when it really.
That was when it hit me.
I thought empty nesting startedwhen we took the youngest one
to college and I was incorrect.
That was a dress rehearsal forthe transition and emotions that
(32:50):
I went through over the pastcouple of years.
Speaker 2 (32:54):
Yeah, so what is empty nesting?
What is it?
What is that?
Tell me what you think emptynesting is.
Speaker 1 (32:59):
To me, I think it's when they're if they choose to
go to college or whatever,wherever they go out of high
school, whenever, when they areout of your house with
employment, that is, making themmoney and making them decisions
, and they're not asking youradvice or your opinions or your
(33:22):
permission.
You know, you, you open upInstagram and there's one of
them in you know Seattle orsomething.
You're like wait, what?
Like, what's your wait?
You're traveling with them andI didn't know that.
And, yes, they are, and that'sokay, Cause they are grown up
adults making their own moneyand their own decisions.
That was empty nesting to me.
(33:42):
It was the, it was the jobs, itwas more financial autonomy, it
was relationships and it justfelt like it happened quickly
and and it was a lot for me toprocess at one time.
So that's why I always laughwhen people are like, oh,
(34:04):
they're in college, I'm an emptynester.
I'm like, oh, girly, no, you'renot practice, you know exactly
where they are, because you mayor may not be putting that bill,
but they're probably cominghome to you for every, for
breaks and weekends and to dolaundry and such, and it just
shifts when you know they movedto LA for their job and they've
(34:27):
got to figure out where do youget the car fixed?
And I'm going to travel and seemy friends this weekend and I'm
going to do whatever.
And you're like wait what?
And you're just not involved inany of that, as you shouldn't
be.
But that's hard.
Speaker 2 (34:41):
Hard, yeah, yeah that .
That it's the concept ofletting go and moving on.
And people are like, wait what?
Yes, like I'm supposed to letgo and move on yes and it's like
yes and that is the exact frame.
Speaker 1 (34:56):
Wait what that's exactly what I felt like I was
doing for several years Likewait what?
Speaker 3 (35:00):
Wait, what, what?
Speaker 1 (35:01):
is happening with that.
You nailed it.
I need a shirt with that,because that is what I feel like
.
I walked around saying a lot.
It is your heart, your emotions, your spirit that has to play
catch up, and there's not atimeline for that.
(35:25):
You know, how everyone movesinto this new season of life is
different.
Some people may have absolutelyno issue with it whatsoever.
Other people may have a hardertime.
Everyone's timeline isdifferent.
I just think we can helpeveryone navigate it more easily
, with more confidence, a littlebit more joy, a little bit more
(35:46):
calm, if we talk about it moreand talk about the fact that
you're going to feel all thefeelings and that all the
feelings are valid and it's okayto let your kids know that
you're feeling all the feelingsand that you're working on it.
Speaker 2 (36:00):
Yeah, yeah, and I think that's what you talk.
You know a lot.
You've mentioned the wordmental health a lot throughout
you know conversation so far anda lot of mental health is
dealing with your feelings,right, and so people are so
afraid to actually feel afeeling, right, know what that
feels like in your body, knowwhere it shows up.
And I know you know people outthere may be listening and be
(36:20):
like, well, that's very woohooish, but like well, no, that's
literally how your body works.
Yes, like you can't have athought without a feeling.
Yeah, it doesn't.
They're not separated.
You can't have a thought andhave no feeling attached to it.
It's automatic Thought andfeeling, thought and feeling,
thought and feeling.
And then those thoughts andfeelings drive what you do,
right, how you respond or not toany given situation.
(36:41):
If you don't know how those twowork in tandem and actually know
, oh, I can feel I'm gettingangry.
Yeah Right, I can feel it in myjaw.
My jaw is starting to clench,boom, great.
Or I'm feeling sad.
Where does that show up?
Well, it feels like a lump inmy throat or like somebody
sitting in my chest.
Awesome, feel it, because then,once you feel it and know
exactly how it's done, you canmove past it quicker than
(37:01):
letting it spiral and take youdown the river of misery.
Speaker 1 (37:04):
Yeah, and women have a lot of feelings about our
feelings, feelings about howwe're feeling, so we need to
work on that too.
I think, as a generation,probably our coping skills are
less.
We're kind of in a weird space,because I think Gen X is the
generation whose parents werevery much okay with them being
bored and letting them figure itout, but now we all have phones
(37:27):
and so we scroll or do thingsthat are less healthy other than
, to your point, feeling ourfeelings.
I also learned that when we hada lot of things kind of happen
at the same time and this willnot be true for everyone, but
this was, this, was, this is mylived experience.
For us, our truth was we moved.
My husband retired fromfootball coaching, we moved to a
(37:50):
new place that, while we werevery excited, we didn't know
anyone.
Our girls were gone, life wasjust different and there was an
energy vacuum in my life in myhead in my heart there was an
energy vacuum and we all havegenerational baggage.
We all have generational trauma.
(38:10):
That baggage and trauma that Ihad pushed down for a lot of
years decided it would be theperfect opportunity to come out
and play.
So that made the transition forme empty nesting even more
challenging, because I also hada lot of generational baggage
and trauma wrapped up in it thatI had to navigate and wade
(38:33):
through.
That was tied into how I wasfeeling about the girls and all
of it.
So if, if you're a little bitbefore, if, if you haven't quite
got to empty nesting and youthink that sounds kind of silly,
just be prepared that whenthere is an energy vacuum, often
your brain will now try to fillit and sometimes it's not
(38:58):
always the most positive ofthoughts and feelings that fill
it.
And I believe that everybodyneeds therapy.
Everybody needs to be going totherapy.
I don't care if you think youneed therapy.
You don't think you have stuff.
We all have stuff.
We are human beings on thisplanet carrying baggage and
trauma and stuff generationallyand part of our job is to
(39:21):
lighten that load for our kidsand so the work that I do on me
waiting through that, thatgenerational baggage and that
trauma and that junk that I'vecarried for a long time.
Part of that work that I do onme lightens the load for my
girls because I maybe stop someof those behaviors, words,
(39:43):
actions, thoughts that I've beencarrying, that I was passing on
to them.
We're all going to pass the junkon, but the amount that we pass
on we can take some control inthat.
And that was part of thechallenge for empty nesting for
me is that I also had a lot ofjunk that I had been carrying
around that when everything wasreally busy I didn't have to
(40:03):
deal with.
And then, when everything wasless busy, it came out to play
and I had to deal with it andthank goodness I had to because
it has to be dealt with at somepoint.
And navigating that and makingmistakes and letting my girls
see that I'm navigating it andtalking about therapy with them
and going through that is reallypowerful for them to see as
(40:23):
well, because it's an okay thingto let your kids know that you
are not just a parent but you'realso a human and that you're
working on you and that givesthem a better roadmap for when
they get to this season.
So I think that's all part ofthe empty net nesting process as
well, as there could be somejunk that comes up that you're
(40:45):
going to have to process, andplease do go to therapy and
process it.
You will be better off becauseof it.
Speaker 2 (40:52):
Yeah, a hundred percent.
Like I fully believe, like whenyou work on yourself and get
better, it's not just for you,no, no it's for everybody in
your life.
yes, right, and so just imaginewhat the world would be like if
everybody was working onthemselves.
So people are often likethere's a stigma with therapy
(41:14):
and maybe even coaching, right.
So you know, therapy is likegoing backwards to figure out,
okay, what's keeping you stuck,and then coaching helps you move
forward.
That's kind of like thesimplest way to describe both of
them.
If you're not doing either,then you're stuck.
You are, you stay stagnant,you're in the middle.
But professional athletes havecoaches.
Sure, they have all differentkinds of coaches.
Sure, they have a nutritionist.
(41:34):
They have a weight you know,strength and weight training
coach.
They have a position coach.
They have coaches out the wazoo.
Why wouldn't you do the samething for yourself?
Speaker 1 (41:44):
I always say I don't cut my own hair.
I do not cut my own hair, so Icannot fix my own brain.
If I go to someone to cut myhair which is much less serious
than someone fixing my brain,you know, I think we have to get
over that and I do think that,honestly, our children's
generation, the millennials andGen Zers, are doing a much
(42:05):
better job of talking abouttherapy and mental health, and
we're almost taking our cuesfrom them.
But I'm okay with that too.
We can learn from our kids asmuch as we can teach our kids.
So it's a really powerful thingfor them to see you working on
you yeah, 100%, I love that.
So it's a really powerful thingfor them to see you working on
you.
Speaker 2 (42:21):
Yeah, a hundred percent, and I love that.
Like to be open and transparentand honest with kind of how
you're living life and thechanges you want to make and how
you want to get better onlyhelps them, and vice versa.
Speaker 1 (42:32):
Right, yeah, cause we're going to live with them as
grownups for the rest of ourlives.
And yes, you know I had to havea honest conversation with my
girls at one point and be likelisten, I know I have to figure
this stuff out and you're notgetting it right either, like
we're all human None of us aregetting this right but my goal
is that we have a really greatrelationship for the rest of
(42:55):
time.
So we're going to probablygoing to go through some
uncomfortable patches as we workon this, because that's my goal
is a really great relationshipwith my kids, because I like my
daughters as much as I love themas their mom.
I really like them.
They're funny, they're smart,they're way cooler than I am, or
ever was, and they'rewell-traveled, they're
(43:18):
articulate.
I really like them.
Well, I really want to spendtime with them.
No one wants to spend time witha mom who's just talking about
how sad she is all the time.
So I better get this stufffigured out because I want my
relationship with my girls to beamazing for the rest of the
time that I get to have theopportunity to be on this planet
, and that means I'm going tohave to do some work.
(43:40):
I'm get to have the opportunityto be on this planet, and that
means I'm going to have to dosome work.
I'm going to have to figure itout, and if I don't, then I'm
choosing not to, and sometimeswe choose to stay stuck in that
sad.
For a little bit I felt like Ifeel like I probably chose to
stay stuck there longer than Ishould have, and that's also a
little bit part of the journey.
And then you choose to do thework and you figure it out and
(44:03):
and they see that too and um, Ijust I want to make sure that
I'm the kind of person that mykids want to be around for a
really long time, cause I reallylike them.
I want them to want to hang outwith me, so I need to do the
work on me to make sure thatthat happens.
Speaker 2 (44:18):
Yeah, when you become invested in your own life, you
become interesting to your kids.
Yes, Right, they're like ohlook at that, like why are you
doing that?
Why are you taking that on?
Why are you attempting that?
You know you're tryingsomething different, you're
learning something new.
Speaker 1 (44:31):
They're like oh, I actually want to know you more
than just my parent.
Yes, yes, yes, and the goalreally is that they call or come
home sometime and like you'renot there because you're out
like doing whatever cool thingis that you're doing, and
they're like wait, wait, well,my parents have a life.
Speaker 2 (44:48):
Yes, yes, we do Maybe it takes us a minute to get
there but we do, we're workingon getting there.
That's right and for everybodylistening.
It's okay not to text back ornot to pick up the call right
away.
Like you're, you can have alife and do other things.
You don't have to wait for themto text or call you and be on
call for that.
Speaker 1 (45:04):
That's a great reminder.
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (45:07):
Although it is kind of funny because they do expect
that immediate, like where wereyou?
Speaker 1 (45:10):
A thousand percent.
Oh my God, a thousand percent.
They're like do you, what areyou doing?
Maybe I was doing somethingelse, maybe I was taking a walk,
maybe.
Speaker 2 (45:18):
I just didn't want to talk to you at that particular
moment so good.
So good.
As we wrap up, I'm curiouswhat's your life motto?
Speaker 1 (45:27):
Oh my gosh, that's a great question.
You know, I will say I thinkthat it's show up when I think
about it.
My dad really modeled that forme.
He would say that little phraseyou know, shower, shave, show
up.
He would say it occasionally,but I also watched him do that.
I have a very differentrelationship with my mom, where
(45:51):
a lot of this generationalbaggage comes from.
So when I think about whomodeled what I would want this
season of my life to be, itreally was my dad.
And that mindset around you showup.
You show up and do the thing,whether you feel like doing the
thing or not.
You show up when it'sinconvenient.
You show up so that you can putyour head on the pillow at
night knowing that you dideverything to be your best and
(46:14):
do your best that day.
And I think that that reallyhas become something that I've
I've absorbed and tried to liveby.
The work to feel better is noteasy, but I'm going to show up
for it.
I'm going to show up for itbecause my relationship with my
girls matter, I matter, my goalsand dreams matter.
This life matters.
(46:35):
I'm going to show up and do thesmall things well so that we
can create a really big, amazinglife together.
I think if you just takeemotions off the table sometimes
sometimes and simply show upand do the work, you'll get the
emotions you were after on theother side of doing the work.
(46:58):
No one really loves to work out,but I sure do love how I feel
on the other side of doing thework.
No one really loves to work out, but I sure do love how I feel
on the other side of it.
I don't think a lot.
A lot of people, maybe somepeople do but I don't love going
to therapy, but I love how Ifeel on the other side of it.
So I'm going to show up and dothose things, whether I feel
like it or not in my life,because on the other side of it
(47:18):
is probably what I'm looking for.
So I would say my motto is showup.
Speaker 2 (47:24):
Show up so good.
Julie, thank you for showing uphere today and sharing a little
bit of your story with thisemptiness life.
I so appreciate it.
And for showing up in the worldhow you show up there for the
people who follow you and modelafter that right You're doing so
needed.
So thank you for like talkingabout it.
Speaker 1 (47:43):
When you popped up on my Instagram.
Speaker 3 (47:45):
I'm like wait a minute someone else is talking
about this.
Speaker 1 (47:48):
That's amazing.
So thank you for theseconversations and for getting
this topic out into moreeveryday, normal conversation so
that we you and I can maybeshorten the learning curve for
people who are kind of coming upin this next generation and
that they navigate this season alittle bit better maybe than we
(48:10):
did and understand that it'snot an end.
It is truly just the beginningof a new season.
I love that.
Speaker 2 (48:16):
I love that, yeah, and to be the model for it yes.
I like that idea, like the morewe can share, the more we can
get out there in front of it, sopeople can say, oh, there is
something between when the kidsleave for school and when we
retire like life doesn't stop.
Speaker 1 (48:30):
For sure, for sure.
Speaker 2 (48:31):
Love it, love it.
Thanks again for being here.
Speaker 1 (48:33):
Thank you.
Speaker 3 (48:36):
Are you ready to start living and enjoying your
empty nest years?
If so, head over tojasonramsdencom and click work
with me to get the conversationstarted.
This Empty Nest Life is aproduction of Impact.
One Media LLC.
All rights reserved.
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