February 20, 2024 • 34 mins
Veteran podcaster Jeff Walker joins newcomer Joe P for an engaging conversation about Evel Knievel, the legendary daredevil, and the making of a museum dedicated to his legacy. The discussion covers the inspiration behind the museum, Neon City's connections with Evel Knievel, his history, iconic stunts, and merchandise popularity. The conversation also includes insights into the Evel Knievel Museum's future move from Topeka, Kansas to Las Vegas, and the launching of an associated podcast capturing unique stories about Evel Knievel from various perspectives.
0:00 Jeff Does Vegas
04:08 The Young Knievel
05:32 Evel Knievel at Caesars Palace
18:16 The Evel Knievel Connection to Las Vegas
19:11 How the museum started in Topeka
22:00 Evel Knievel Museum in Las Vegas
24:16 The Evel Knievel Museum Podcast
33:07 Outro
Check out Jeff's travelcast at JeffDoesVegas.com
Grab merch at www.EvelKnievelMuseum.com
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Heather (00:00):
Evel Knievel inspired millions of us with this courage
and perseverance.
We're building a museum so youcan relive those memories and be
reinvigorated with that spiritof bravery.
Evel Knievel (00:13):
My name is Evel Knievel.
I'm a professional daredevil.
Heather (00:17):
Along the way we meet people involved in the life, the
times, and the legacy of theKing of Daredevils.
Here with their stories is yourhost, Joe Friday.
Frank Gifford (00:27):
And he will go
Jeff (01:52):
Yeah,
Joe P (01:52):
I've been looking for a podcast mentor and you had the
best Las Vegas podcast that Ifound.
Ironically, you're not fromVegas?
Jeff (02:01):
No, which is really weird.
Everybody always gets a littlethrown off by that, but I feel
like a local, there's times Iget annoyed by the tourists and
I hand out directions to peopleSo I kind of start feeling a
little bit like a local.
So it's good.
Yeah, I mean, it's great to, asI say, finally sit down and
meet.
I've been called a lot ofthings.
I've never been called a mentor,so I appreciate that.
Joe P (02:19):
You've helped me immensely so far.
Jeff (02:22):
Let's start off, I want to find out a little bit about
yourself and how you gotinvolved with the Evel Knievel
Museum.
What was your connection withEvel Knievel?
Joe P (02:31):
I have a business in Topeka, Kansas where we do a lot
of stainless steel specialties,especially in the food business.
It's the center of agriculturethere in Kansas So we have a lot
of food processing.
My specialty was stainlesssteel.
One day a guy comes in and says,can you polish this bumper And I
(02:52):
said, I can, but I won't it'snot what I do.
I don't do automotive.
You're not just working onsomebody's tractor, you have get
whole story.
They pull their phone out andstart telling you all about it
ended up being he's reallytrying to twist my arm.
This is Evel Knievel's bumper.
And I say, dude, does EvelKnievel have money?
I didn't know Knievel was deadthe time.
(03:13):
But it turns out that it washistoric Harley Davidson of
Topeka that needed thisrestoration work they were
working this semi-truck thatEvel Knievel had.
It's like a circus wagon.
If this big red wagon comesthrough your town, you know
something big's going to happen.
So We ended up helping them outand a hundred local contractors
helped and so we restored thisbig red that's how I started to
(03:37):
get involved.
Jeff (03:38):
Mm-hmm.
And so you mentioned like youdidn't know Evel Knievel was
dead.
Were you not an Evel Knievel fanprior to this situation?
I'm sure you were, obviously,you were aware of who Evel
Knievel was.
Joe P (03:49):
Yeah, I was a fan when I was kid.
Jeff (03:51):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (03:51):
But 1977, Evel Knievel dropped off the map
Jeff (03:54):
Right.
Joe P (03:55):
I quit following him when they quit putting the front of
the National Enquirer I hadn'theard that name since
Jeff (04:03):
1977 Right.
Joe P (04:05):
I was a fan then but moved on.
Jeff (04:08):
Obviously now you're involved with the museum, so you
know, the Evel Knievel storyintimately.
Let's talk a little bit aboutEvel Knievel story share a
little bit about his life andhis history and how he, where he
started and what he ended updoing.
Joe P (04:23):
Okay.
He started in butte, Montana,where he was born started all
the shenanigans the motorcycleriding and hucksterism deal
where he started a securitybusiness for 30 bucks a month.
He guarantees your tavern willnot get broken into
Jeff (04:42):
Yeah.
One of those kinds of deals.
Joe P (04:43):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Okay.
You don't pay the 30 bucks.
Well, there's no guarantee yourtavern's not going to get broken
into.
Jeff (04:47):
I get it.
Yeah.
Joe P (04:48):
Yeah.
Worked at the mines there.
Dropped out high school there.
He was a, high school athlete,so he was a ski jumper in school
award-winning amateur hockeyplayer.
In the Army, he was a polevaulter that's where I he got
his start.
Made his way around country.
His hero was Joie Chitwood fromTopeka Kansas, who was a race
(05:11):
car driver.
hugely skilled race car driver.
He could take his car up twowheels go around the track Took
his show on the road.
He's got rodeo clowns andeverything, and he's jumping
over flaming barrels and EvelKnievel goes and sees Joie
Chitwood crash into a wall andsays,"That's what I want to do
rest of my life." it's a longstory, but his launch into
(05:35):
stardom was here in Las Vegas
Jeff (05:37):
Right.
So I think people who are, Vegasfanatics or even with a little
bit of knowledge about Vegashave a bit of an idea of the
Vegas connection with EvelKnievel, but it it 1969?
Am I getting my numbers right?
0, 67.
So I was close.
Okay.
It was so 19.
Joe P (05:54):
You were really close.
New.
Jeff (05:55):
I was really close.
Joe P (05:55):
New Year's Eve.
Jeff (05:56):
Yeah.
New Year's Eve, 1967 into 68.
And he decides prior to that,obviously he's going to jump his
motorcycle over the fountains ofCaesars Palace.
Joe P (06:06):
Yeah.
He's unemployed at that point.
He tried to have a Joie Chitwoodcircus where he had a little guy
who would entertain crowds.
If Evel was going to jump overtwo trucks, then Butch Wilhelm
would get on his little minibike jump over two Tonka trucks,
if Evel's going through flamingboards.
(06:27):
Butch is going throughcardboard.
Jeff (06:29):
Yeah.
Joe P (06:30):
I as an aside Butch eventually became an Ewok, and
he lived in Hollywood.
Jeff (06:34):
Oh really?
Joe P (06:34):
Yeah, he's unemployed.
He's sitting at a bar in Butte,Montana when one of his buddies
says,"Hey, you know, our fellowbeautician?
Beautician?
Fellow Buttian is fightingagainst Dick Tiger." His name's
Rick Rouse from Butte Montanagoing to fight against Dick
Tiger in a boxing match and it'sin Vegas.
(06:56):
Let's road trip it So they pilefrom the bar into a van to Vegas
where they cannot afford a roomat this palatial venue Jay Sarno
has built this 25 million dollarhotel.
with the Roman columns,hostesses dressed like
goddesses.
They can't afford to stay there,but they can afford a beer
(07:18):
there.
They go into the bar and one ofhis buddies, this guy says, his
buddies got great ideas.
"You know, you could be the drawhere.
They don't have a Dean Martin,like Sands has, they don't have
a Frank Sinatra like the DunesYou could do like your wheelies
and tricks you do at home hereas a draw." Evel said"The more
(07:39):
beer I drank, the smallerfountains got until I decide I'm
going jump fountains, I'm goingto call the owner of joint."
Yeah.
that's exactly what he did.
He called the owner but couldnot get past the receptionist,
even though he explains,"I'mfamous.
I was on Wide World of Sportsfor three minutes".
Jay Sarno is not going to takecall he tells the receptionist.
(08:00):
No more calls from that
Jeff (08:02):
yeah.
Joe P (08:02):
yayhoo.
So Evel begins to disguise hisvoice
Jeff (08:07):
love it.
Joe P (08:08):
Hey, it's Bill Fleming for ABC's Wide World of Sports.
I'm calling the about this EvelKnievel character that's
supposed jump your fountains onNew Year's Eve.
Making sure you have enoughrooms for me in my entire crew."
Sarno says,"never heard of itthen"Hey, it's Samy Smith.
My boss here at SportsIllustrated told me to come take
pictures of this character Evelknievel jumping over your
fountains on New Year's Eve.
What time does that start?" andfinally he Evel calls with a
(08:34):
lawyer accent.
Hello, this is Saul Rosenberg.
I understand that you arepromoting an event which my
client Evel Knievel, is to jumpyour fountains.
The only problem is we don'thave any sort contract or
agreement for him to perform atyour place.
I'm inclined to sue you as ithappens, I'm going out town
another of my clients.
You may have heard LawrenceWelk, but Evel Knievel is in Las
(08:56):
Vegas and available to meet withyou tomorrow.
So by then Sarno is going...
Jeff (09:03):
I love it.
Joe P (09:03):
Yeah.
Sarno goes from"Never heard ofit" to"Call me back" to"Where
you been, kid, I've been lookingall over for you."
Jeff (09:08):
Yeah.
Joe P (09:10):
So that beginning, that's the beginning of the Caesar's
Palace story.
Jeff (09:16):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (09:17):
later Evel'fessed up to it and he and Jay Sarno became
close friends
Jeff (09:23):
Yeah.
Joe P (09:24):
But at the time that's how he he got the gig for very
little money a thousand dollarson New Year's Eve, a thousand
dollars on New Year's Day.
Jeff (09:32):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (09:34):
Sarno said, I'm not covering your hospital bills
either.
Knievel wrecks just spoiler, Iguess it's not a spoiler alert.
Jeff (09:45):
Spoiler alert.
It happened.
Joe P (09:46):
Spoiler alert, happened in 1968.
Jeff (09:48):
1968.
But you know, spoiler alert incase you've been living under a
rock since then.
Yeah.
Yeah.
He, it did not go well for himon this jump, by any stretch of
the imagination.
Went very badly.
Joe P (10:01):
Very badly.
Very badly.
He hit top of a van.
The very last van cleared.
Cleared most of the fountains.
I mean, he did clear thefountains, but.
as he said,"I never had aproblem jumping a motorcycle.
It was always the landing,"right?
Jeff (10:16):
,right.
Joe P (10:18):
Broke both wrists, both ankles, his hip, pelvis and
femur Yeah.
And was rushed the hospital.
Meanwhile, Sarno, the owner ofthe hotel, is watching from
portica chere, a great vantagepoint but he's got these two
little kids with him, his kids,his two they both thought they
(10:42):
saw a man die,
Jeff (10:44):
Right.
Joe P (10:44):
Sarno says,"No, Mr.
Knievel is alive.
I could see him speaking as theyloaded him into the ambulance.
But to reassure you, I you tothe hospital and show that Mr.
Knievel is okay."
Jeff (10:55):
Yeah.
Joe P (10:56):
Took him 20 minutes to from his office to his car,
which normally takes two minutesright?
But it's so crowded...
Sarno starts scratching his headthinking,"Wow, this place is so
packed.
It's taking me this long, andI've still got this clown signed
for a second jump."
Jeff (11:15):
Right.
Joe P (11:16):
It may not be tomorrow, but he's, contractually
obligated.
They get to the hospital,Knievel is awake, alive at alert
flirting with nurses, but in alot pain,
Jeff (11:27):
Right.
Joe P (11:29):
And he says, Jay, thank God you're here.
You gotta get me outta here.
I don't have insurance."
Jeff (11:36):
Of course.
Of course.
Joe P (11:38):
And Jay Sarno.
You've known Jay Sarno's story.
Jeff (11:41):
Yes.
I mean, very, very famousdeveloping Caesar's Palace and
Circus Circus and heavilyinvolved in the development of
Las Vegas in the somewhat modernresort.
He would've been, I mean, tocompare him, he almost would've
been the Steve Wynn of that eraof Las Vegas.
Joe P (12:00):
That's true.
Jeff (12:01):
Yeah.
Joe P (12:01):
Like from Frontier Town to mega resort.
Jeff (12:04):
Yeah, exactly.
Yeah.
Joe P (12:06):
Anyways, the point is that he's a super mind when it
comes to marketing.
Jeff (12:11):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (12:11):
and he says,"Don't worry kid, I will cover your hospital
bills if you roll with me onthis marketing plan."
Jeff (12:16):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (12:17):
"Because you're coming to jump again as soon as you get
out.
But you gotta heal up first.
So I'm going to pay off thenurses to speak to nobody.
I'm going to pay off the doctorsto hold a press conference in
their white lab coats," whichthey do.
And the doctor stands out frontand says,"Yes, Evel Knievel is
alive in our hospital.
And we are assured that he isgoing to try again as soon as he
(12:42):
awakes from his coma."
Jeff (12:46):
just the ultimate level of P.T.
Barnum-ish showmanship, right?
Like really.
Joe P (12:53):
He is both, both those two characters.
Yeah.
I don't know how this townsurvived both of them on the
town at the same time.
Jeff (12:59):
That's outstanding.
Joe P (13:01):
Yeah.
So, um, he never did end updoing that, the second jump, but
that is what launched hiscareer, that press conference,
because it not only ran in Buttein Las Vegas, but it.
Kansas City and New York andDallas and Chicago.
Jeff (13:16):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (13:17):
This crazy maniac crashed almost killed himself and he's
fixing to do it again.
Jeff (13:22):
Yeah.
Well, and I mean, he went onafter that, like you say, that
was the jump that reallylaunched his career because he
went on from there and it was,he did further jumps and bigger
jumps and bigger paychecks.
And of course then cameendorsements and all of a sudden
this is a guy who is on lunchboxes and he's action figures
and it's millions of dollars inendorsements that he's getting
(13:44):
as well.
Joe P (13:45):
Yeah, that was the, the cash cow was.
this, toy.
I'm not sure if you're oldenough yet, but if you're old
enough, yet.
If you're old enough.
But there was toy when I waskid.
Jeff (13:57):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (13:57):
that outsold Barbie in 1974.
It's the first action figuremade after a living, breathing
human being.
Jeff (14:02):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (14:02):
And that's the Evel Knievel Stunt Cycle.
Jeff (14:05):
Right.
Joe P (14:05):
Wind it up.
It's got a little gyro in it andit takes off and it really
works.
It one of those toys thatactually worked as advertised.
Jeff (14:12):
Yeah.
Joe P (14:13):
And he made more money off of that toy than he did any
events or television or moviesor jumps.
Jeff (14:19):
Yeah.
Yeah, I've seen videos recentlybecause there's the odd time
somebody will score one of thesethings off eBay or in an antique
store that still works and yousee the video of them and
they're just zzz-zzz-zzz windingit up and you watch and yeah,
like it actually does workreally well--the way it should
work as opposed to so many ofthose other toys that, yeah,
(14:40):
they didn't work like that.
This, this really, you could setit up to jump over stuff is
fantastic
Joe P (14:47):
Yeah.
Jeff (14:48):
Awesome.
Joe P (14:48):
And all started here in that hospital bed.
Jeff (14:50):
Yeah.
Joe P (14:51):
He had called Wide World of Sports, which eventually
turned into ESPN, but Wide WorldSports, was on one day a week
and said,"I'm jumping over thefountains at Caesars Palaces,
come cover me." They declined.
"We've already got schedule, butmaybe if you take some footage,
we might use it." So Knievelhired private contractors, John
Derek, who's more famous formarrying Bo Derek
Jeff (15:14):
mm-hmm.
Joe P (15:15):
and his wife the time was Linda Evans, who's famous for
Dynasty,
Jeff (15:19):
I think Dynasty, yeah.
Joe P (15:20):
And they took the footage I mean this amazing footage,
which is kind of like the agonyof defeat now.
Jeff (15:27):
Yeah.
Joe P (15:27):
at the time, had it developed, dropped it off to be
developed in Los Angeles wherethey lived.
Went camping for a week becausethat's how long it took to
develop film.
Jeff (15:36):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (15:36):
and returned.
The developer hands in thiscanister and says,"I have done
Oscar work and this is the bestfootage I have ever seen in my
entire life." And they took,they rushed it to Las Vegas,
screened it on Evel Knievel'shospital room wall.
Jeff (15:52):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (15:53):
there.
And it's just, it's Evel Knievelhead over tea kettle just looks
exactly rag doll.
And his bones are breaking andyou can see it.
And even though black and whiteand even though it's old
footage, it still makes onecringe to look at.
And of course when he saw it thefirst time, his eyeballs turned
(16:14):
into little dollar signs and hesaid,
Jeff (16:16):
Right.
Joe P (16:16):
"Man, I'm going to take that on Joey Bishop and Johnny
Carson"
Jeff (16:19):
yeah.
Joe P (16:19):
"And if people don't want to come watch me make a jump
successfully at their statefair, they sure don't want to
mess it when I die there."
Jeff (16:26):
Right.
It was almost like him failingthat jump really kind of was the
best thing that ever happened to
Joe P (16:34):
him.
So true, so true, so true.
Jeff (16:38):
And the fact that, I mean, what still blows me away to this
day is the fact that yeah, hepitches it to Wide World of
Sports and they're like,"Eh, no.
You know what?
Get back to us if somethingexciting happens." Something
exciting really happened, right?
Joe P (16:53):
It did.
Jeff (16:54):
That's, that's so cool.
And I mean, so to this day now,there's, there's been a lot of
and, well, I mean, to follow upon that, as you say, he never
tried the jump again.
He never attempted the Caesar'sPalace jump again.
Was that a choice?
Was it his choice?
Do you know if it was a choiceby Caesars or was it just he
never got around to it orCaesars, was it willing to let
(17:14):
him nearly die again?
Like how come that neverhappened?
Joe P (17:18):
Yeah, I think that was probably Evel Knievel
Jeff (17:21):
Yeah.
Joe P (17:21):
that, did not, hold up his end of the bargain on that
contract.
The reason I say that becauseyou did special on Caesar's
Palace.
Jeff (17:30):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (17:30):
and stunts that were there
Jeff (17:31):
Yeah.
Joe P (17:32):
And they did let other people do it.
Jeff (17:34):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (17:34):
They let Robbie Knievel do it, Travis Pastrana
Jeff (17:37):
Yeah.
Joe P (17:37):
and Gary Wells.
Jeff (17:38):
Gary Wells tried it too.
He also spectacularly failed aswell, so, yeah.
Yeah.
It didn't go well for a lot ofpeople.
Joe P (17:47):
That's true.
Jeff (17:48):
Yeah.
But Robbie succeeded.
Robbie did
Joe P (17:52):
Yes,
Jeff (17:52):
He did the jump.
Joe P (17:53):
Yep.
Jeff (17:54):
He succeeded.
And Travis Pastrana, he made it.
Joe P (17:57):
Yeah, dude, he broke all records.
Jeff (17:58):
Yeah.
Yeah.
So I mean, it was clearlydoable.
But with Evel, if I'm recallingcorrectly, was it Evel Knievel
that he figured there was a bitof a downshift right as he was
hitting the ramp or a bit of adrop in speed?
Was that Evel that was what hefigured why he didn't make it?
That's Evel The Evel KnievelEvel connection to Vegas
(18:18):
continues today.
I mean, there is a fair bit ofhistory, particularly, I'm
assuming you've been down toEvel Pie on Fremont Street.
Yes.
Which an Evel Pie, which ofcourse is, is run by the estate
of Evel Knievel.
And if you've never been there,it's such a cool little joint
just jammed with Evel Knievelmemorabilia.
It's a fantastic place to go.
Joe P (18:40):
Yeah.
Jeff (18:40):
The first time you ever went in there, was it just kind
like, this is awesome?
Joe P (18:44):
Yeah, that's first time I was in there.
I was like, this awesome.
This is awesome.
By then I had already worked atthe Evel Knievel Museum
Jeff (18:51):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (18:52):
So, I mean it was less awesome than the museum in
Topeka but they had some stuff
Jeff (18:57):
But do they serve pizza at the museum in Topeka?
Joe P (18:59):
No.
Jeff (19:00):
There you go.
that's that's what wins it
Joe P (19:04):
Well, Jeff, you haven't been there and.
But the barbecue at the, at themuseum.
Jeff (19:10):
There we go.
Joe P (19:11):
Is really good.
Jeff (19:11):
There we go.
Let's talk about the museum.
So right now it is in Topeka,Kansas, which seems kind of
random in my brain.
I'm assuming there's a reasonit's in Topeka.
Joe P (19:23):
I hear ya.
It is sort of random.
Jeff (19:26):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (19:26):
But where we're from.
And where Mike Patterson's fromand he befriended a really great
guy, Lathan McKay, who wascollector
Jeff (19:37):
Okay.
Joe P (19:37):
of Evel Knievel memorabilia.
If it was Evel Knievel, he wasand is on a mission
Jeff (19:45):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (19:46):
starting pair leathers.
Lathan looked around to seewhere the Evel Knievel Museum
was.
Jeff (19:53):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (19:53):
There wasn't one.
Evel er, Lathan I get the twoconfused.
Just went out collected a lot ofdifferent things,
Jeff (20:00):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (20:01):
motorcycles, helmets, jewelry, canes, capes.
had a traveling exhibit for awhile.
Jeff (20:10):
Okay.
Joe P (20:12):
Eventually ran across big red circus wagon
Jeff (20:15):
Right.
it
Joe P (20:17):
was rotting away in a lot in Florida Lathan didn't really
know where to get restored.
He tried place or two, couldn'tget it started.
And Jeff, I mean, it wasdilapidated.
You could see sky through thecab of the Mack truck and was
friends with the Jerry Lee Lewisfamily from Memphis, Tennessee.
Jeff (20:39):
Okay.
Yep.
Joe P (20:40):
And historic Harley Davidson of Topeka, they
specialize in the historicrestoration of Harley Davidsons.
Jeff (20:47):
Right.
Joe P (20:47):
So if it says Harley Davidson, whether it's 1906 or
whatever it is,
Jeff (20:52):
mm-hmm.
Joe P (20:53):
Mike's going to make sure that gets as pristine as you can
pay for.
So that's how it started.
Lathan called Mike and said,Hey, I've got this Mack truck
was owned by Evel Knievel.
Can you restore it?
Jeff (21:08):
Yeah.
Joe P (21:09):
But what Mike hears is, "blah, blah, blah Evel Knievel
blah, blah, blah"
Jeff (21:16):
Right.
Joe P (21:16):
Mike's like, yeah, bring it.
Bring it.
Yeah.
So, yeah.
So this motorcycle dealer now isin the business of restoring a
big tractor trailer with coachand.
it's a Mack, it's a 1974 truck,I think.
Jeff (21:28):
Yeah, So
Joe P (21:29):
it took a couple years and it took a hundred local
contractors.
As I said, I was one of them.
Mm-hmm.
Goodyear Tire another one.
and it's all painted like amotorcycle, so
Jeff (21:40):
mm-hmm.
Joe P (21:40):
All the old logos are replicated in hand painted
design
Jeff (21:44):
Wow.
Joe P (21:44):
instead of, uh, decals
Jeff (21:46):
that's awesome.
Joe P (21:47):
Anyway.
Far, far too big travelingmuseum,
Jeff (21:50):
Right.
Joe P (21:51):
And so Mike built a, 13,000 square foot museum there
so that people could enjoy
Jeff (21:57):
mm-hmm.
Joe P (21:58):
Lathan and Mike's collection.
That's awesome.
Jeff (22:00):
And so now the plan is, this is very cool, and this is
how you and I connected intalking about Las Vegas and Evel
Knievel.
The plan is the museum coming toVegas
Joe P (22:11):
Hot damn
Jeff (22:12):
Hot damn.
That is so cool.
So let's talk a little bit aboutthat.
You guys have a location inmind.
You have a timeline in mind ofwhen people are going to be able
to start visiting The EvelKnievel Museum in Las Vegas?
Joe P (22:26):
Yes to the first part and no to the second.
Jeff (22:28):
Okay.
Joe P (22:29):
Yes, there's place, and it's in the Arts District, which
is this between the Strip anddowntown.
Jeff (22:36):
Right.
Joe P (22:37):
The Arts District is an up and coming spot.
Jeff (22:40):
Mm-hmm
Joe P (22:41):
Everybody that I've talked to here in Las Vegas this
week is super excited about theArts District.
I have not been there.
Jeff (22:47):
Yeah,
Joe P (22:48):
They've got first Fridays
Jeff (22:50):
mm-hmm.
Joe P (22:50):
looks hugely crowded.
Jeff (22:51):
It's a real booming area in the city.
And, and as you say, it's withlots of great restaurants and
lots of great new real estateand lots of great new apartments
condos and living space.
And it is the hot spot for forpeople to be going to in Las
Vegas right now.
That is where everybody isstarting to go is into the arts
(23:11):
district, so that is, that's anoutstanding spot.
Joe P (23:14):
Good I didn't pick it.
The team picked yeah, it's, itsounds great.
And they've got a new Punk RockMuseum going in there.
Jeff (23:23):
Yeah,
Joe P (23:23):
just down the street.
Jeff (23:24):
Yeah,
Joe P (23:25):
And I don't know what other, but there are other
museums there.
Oh, there's Burlesque Museum.
Jeff (23:28):
Yeah, the Burlesque Hall of Fame is down in there.
I've had them on the podcast.
I've never, I've yet to gothrough, but I've had them on
the podcast to talk about thehistory of burlesque in Las
Vegas and the Burlesque Hall ofFame and yeah, like, it's a real
growing area and that location.
Being near Fremont and beingDowntown, but also being sort of
within easy access of the Strip.
(23:49):
That's a great spot.
That's a really good spot forthat be, that's going to be
excellent.
Yeah.
Joe P (23:55):
Topeka's been very kind to us but Vegas, that's where it
belongs
Jeff (24:02):
Yeah,
Joe P (24:02):
Nobody can argue that it should be in Topeka, Kansas
Jeff (24:05):
Right.
Joe P (24:05):
instead of in Las Vegas.
Jeff (24:07):
And so now something that you've branched out into, and
that's why you're here in Vegasthis week at this conference
conference, everybody comes toVegas to go to a conference.
Joe P (24:16):
You're here Podcast Movement Evolutions, learning
how to get into the podcastspace.
And that's how you reached outto me to connect, to talk about
podcasting.
You were launching an EvelKnievel podcast, which I think
is super cool.
What made you want to jump intothe podcast space with this?
Well, been talking a lot aboutmarketing
Jeff (24:36):
mm-hmm.
Joe P (24:37):
to coincide with the opening of the Evel Knievel
museum here in Las Vegas.
And podcasting is one of thosethings that I hadn't thought
about in the last decade, butwhat I had thought about is I
want to share these stories.
People come in there and lot ofpeople have a story about Evel
Knievel.
And a lot of them are getting upin years.
(25:00):
Our mission is preserve andpresent the legacy of Evel
Knievel.
So I wanted the stories, say thedriver of this big red truck,
because you know he has storieswhether he's telling them or
not.
Jeff (25:12):
Yeah.
Joe P (25:14):
But I was walking around at conference,
Jeff (25:18):
we do for those, for those listening to this episode of the
podcast, we're doing the airquotes around conference the
meme.
I'm going to Vegas for aconference.
Yeah, yeah.
Here we are.
Here we are.
Joe P (25:30):
But you and I went out to watch bands play Monday.
Jeff (25:34):
Yeah.
It was at Monday Dark
Joe P (25:35):
which was freaking awesome.
It's mostly sitting in a darkroom, listening to the loud
music and probably about, Idon't know, 15 minutes of
socializing.
Yeah.
And I met John Katz.
Yeah.
Or you introduced me to JohnKatz who said,"My uncle was
owner of Bucyrus Erie Cranes."And I'd heard that name.
(25:58):
I'd seen the name on cranes thatdid the sky cycle.
But yeah, this is an example ofone connection.
Jeff (26:04):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (26:05):
Then I'm at the bar.
Girl sees my jacket and says,"Evel Knievel.
My dad did all his jewelry EvelKnievel and all Sammy Davis jrs
and all Frank Sinatras, and hedid the TCB for Elvis.
His name's Mordecai." So I'mtexting Mike from the museum
saying, Dude, we're getting goldfor this podcast if I can get
these people to come on."
Jeff (26:24):
Yeah.
Joe P (26:25):
He says, how do you, how are you making all these
connections?
Right, Just wear the jacket.
Yeah, just wear jacket.
People come up they've gotstories.
Jeff (26:33):
Yeah.
Joe P (26:34):
So I've got some in the bank for editing still.
Sure.
The biographer of J Sarno
Jeff (26:43):
Is that David Schwartz?
Joe P (26:44):
David G.
Schwartz, yeah.
Jeff (26:45):
Yeah.
I've had Dave on a couple oftimes to talk.
He wrote a book about the Sandsand the history of the Sands.
And so I had him on to talkabout that.
And then he also joined me totalk about family friendly
Vegas.
Because he wrote a bunch ofstuff.
He was involved in some paneldiscussions.
I think they were hosted the Mobmuseum about the family friendly
era of Las Vegas.
(27:06):
and yeah.
And then he also great bookGrandissimo, which is all about
Jay Sarno and all about theCaesar's Palace and Circus
Circus and then the plans thathe had for an even bigger
resort, which was Grandissimo sothat's great that you were able
to get David on to talk.
That's great.
Yeah.
Joe P (27:22):
Then we've got couple others.
Just as preview of our podcast,Eddie Langert invented the metal
golf driver.
They were called woods beforethat, right?
He used three wood, he inventedfor weather purposes.
He was a golf pro in Wisconsinand it turns out these weather,
these metal drivers nail golfball really long ways, invested
(27:45):
his life savings, mortgaged hishouse to build 16 prototypes.
Took them down to Florida,couldn't get any traction,
couldn't get any buy-in.
I mean, this sport's 500 yearsold.
Nobody's buying metalwoodsclubs.
Ends up on a golf course whereKnievel tries hustle him.
It's a long story.
Evel ends up buying into thismetal golf club.
(28:07):
This guy had traveled Wisconsinwith$22 and 16 clubs, ends up
sells 2 million dollars worth ofclubs that weekend.
From 22 dollars to 2 milliondollars
Jeff (28:19):
wow.
Joe P (28:19):
with a little help from Evel Knievel.
Jeff (28:21):
Yeah.
Joe P (28:22):
George Sedlak was Evel Knievel's painter.
He's going to be on, And thenhopefully we can get Lathan and
Mike on.
It's been fun
Jeff (28:33):
That's awesome.
Joe P (28:34):
Now, I did survey what people wanted in an Evel Knievel
Museum
Jeff (28:39):
podcast Mm-hmm.
Joe P (28:40):
This is my target market.
And even at this conference,they've been telling us, Do what
your listeners want.
Jeff (28:48):
Yeah.
Joe P (28:48):
You don't need to worry about advertisers.
Do what your listeners want, andeverything else will flow from
that
Jeff (28:53):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (28:53):
so put out a survey poll on social media.
If there was an Evel Knievelpodcast, what would you want
covered?
Jeff (29:07):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (29:07):
50% wanted history content the records 25% wanted
insider news about displays thatare being built or acquisitions.
0% wanted to hear travel tips,hotel information,
Jeff (29:26):
Well, I mean, they're not going to the Evel Knievel
podcast for that.
That's they're coming to mypodcast for the travel tips and
the travel information.
Joe P (29:34):
Yeah.
Okay, good.
Well, I don't think my listenersknow how often they come in and
say,"What's the closestrestaurant?"
Jeff (29:44):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (29:45):
Or where can I get barbecue now that I'm here or
Jeff (29:47):
Yeah.
Joe P (29:48):
Where should I stay?
Jeff (29:49):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (29:50):
So the Jeff's is the man.
Jeff Does Vegas.
Jeff with a J sometimes?
No, just Jeff with a J I like tosay I'm a Jeff, not a G- off.
That's, that's my tag.
Jeff (30:02):
A timeline for the podcast launch?
Are you, thinking you want tohave it get the museum up and
going and get the podcast out atthe same time or podcast leading
up to the opening of the museum.
Do you have any, yeah.
Joe P (30:14):
Leading up to thoughts?
Yeah, I've got some in the can.
Jeff (30:16):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (30:17):
Got a few recorded, I've got most of those edited, not
released yet.
but I wanted to to conference soI could, you know, get tips and
tricks Yeah.
How to get things uploaded andwhat the best ways to market Mm.
Now that we're done I wouldguess I'm going can get it
(30:38):
launched
Jeff (30:39):
that's awesome.
it's funny how, we joke aboutconference quote unquote, but it
really is, it's interesting.
You come to these things and yougo home invigorated and I mean,
I know like after I finish thisconference, I've got a couple of
weeks off.
I'm going to have about fiveinterviews the can a trip report
that I want to write.
I'm home and I'm going to spendthe next two weeks just creating
(31:01):
stuff.
So it is, when you spend thetime around creative people and
around people that are veryencouraging to you you do just
want to go home and just wantcreate, and you want to get at
it.
So that's, that's excellent thatyou're looking pushing this
timeline forward and just going,yeah, I want to go home and I
want to go hard and I want getthis stuff out
Joe P (31:18):
Yes.
Jeff (31:19):
That's awesome.
That's awesome.
In the meantime, if people wantto learn about the Evel Knievel
Museum and they want to hitTopeka, Kansas, how can they do
that?
You guys are online, you've gotsocial media?
Both of things.
Online and social media.
So the online isEvelKnievelMuseum.com Mm-hmm.
Joe P (31:36):
It's the very best place to buy Evel Knievel gear
Jeff (31:39):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (31:41):
The Evel Knievel gear I'm talking about is not cheap
keychains.
Sorry.
It is well-made clothing and
Jeff (31:49):
mm-hmm.
Joe P (31:51):
historic replicas of his canes, helmets, and more.
Jeff (31:55):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (31:56):
So that there's that, but then online, there's Facebook
and Instagram and all stuff.
Jeff (32:02):
Yeah.
Joe P (32:03):
And then I think to coincide with the podcast will
be video and audio just becausethat's what I'm used
Jeff (32:10):
to.
Yeah.
Joe P (32:10):
I've been doing four-minute sessions on YouTube.
Jeff (32:13):
Yeah.
Which is excellent.
That's a very cool way to do it.
And especially too, becauseyou're going to be telling some
really interesting stories frompeople who are going to be
telling some interesting storiesand you want to get that facial
expression and have that contactwith them.
So that's excellent.
That's excellent.
Joe P (32:28):
Yeah.
We've got a whole lot ofhistoric video that sort of goes
along with
Jeff (32:33):
Yeah.
Joe P (32:33):
It's awkward and I'll have to walk through video on
the podcast.
Jeff (32:37):
Yeah.
That's awesome.
Well, I wish you all the bestwith all of this.
I think it's going to beexcellent.
I'm looking forward to thelaunch and I'm looking forward
to having something new to checkout when I come to Vegas.
Joe P (32:47):
Yeah, right on.
Jeff (32:49):
Excellent.
excellent, Joe, thank you somuch for this
Joe P (32:51):
happy landings.
Thanks for joining us again.
That was so nice of Jeff Walkerto do that for us.
We're going to head back toKansas now.
So if you're ready, we're goingto take a trip back and we're
going to play with some guns andwe're going to play with
explosive devices and we'regoing to race cars.
Are you up for that?
Well then let's go.
Heather (33:07):
All right.
If you enjoyed this episode,please subscribe.
It's our mission to preserve andpresent the legacy of Evel
Knievel.
So if you have an idea for anepisode or a guest or have a
suggestion to improve our show,just drop us a line at
Joe@Thrill.Show.
Evel Knievel (33:27):
I just think the Evel Knievel way.
Heather (33:33):
We leave you with the encouraging words from the book
of Deuteronomy.
"Be strong and courageous.
Do not be afraid or terrifiedfor the Lord your God goes with
you.
He will never leave you orforsake you." Until next time,
happy landings.
Joe Friday (33:49):
If you like to fly by the seat of your pants, this
is where you belong.
Evel Knievel inspired millions of us with this courage
and perseverance.
We're building a museum so youcan relive those memories and be
reinvigorated with that spiritof bravery.
Evel Knievel (00:13):
My name is Evel Knievel.
I'm a professional daredevil.
Heather (00:17):
Along the way we meet people involved in the life, the
times, and the legacy of theKing of Daredevils.
Here with their stories is yourhost, Joe Friday.
Frank Gifford (00:27):
And he will go
Jeff (01:52):
Yeah,
Joe P (01:52):
I've been looking for a podcast mentor and you had the
best Las Vegas podcast that Ifound.
Ironically, you're not fromVegas?
Jeff (02:01):
No, which is really weird.
Everybody always gets a littlethrown off by that, but I feel
like a local, there's times Iget annoyed by the tourists and
I hand out directions to peopleSo I kind of start feeling a
little bit like a local.
So it's good.
Yeah, I mean, it's great to, asI say, finally sit down and
meet.
I've been called a lot ofthings.
I've never been called a mentor,so I appreciate that.
Joe P (02:19):
You've helped me immensely so far.
Jeff (02:22):
Let's start off, I want to find out a little bit about
yourself and how you gotinvolved with the Evel Knievel
Museum.
What was your connection withEvel Knievel?
Joe P (02:31):
I have a business in Topeka, Kansas where we do a lot
of stainless steel specialties,especially in the food business.
It's the center of agriculturethere in Kansas So we have a lot
of food processing.
My specialty was stainlesssteel.
One day a guy comes in and says,can you polish this bumper And I
(02:52):
said, I can, but I won't it'snot what I do.
I don't do automotive.
You're not just working onsomebody's tractor, you have get
whole story.
They pull their phone out andstart telling you all about it
ended up being he's reallytrying to twist my arm.
This is Evel Knievel's bumper.
And I say, dude, does EvelKnievel have money?
I didn't know Knievel was deadthe time.
(03:13):
But it turns out that it washistoric Harley Davidson of
Topeka that needed thisrestoration work they were
working this semi-truck thatEvel Knievel had.
It's like a circus wagon.
If this big red wagon comesthrough your town, you know
something big's going to happen.
So We ended up helping them outand a hundred local contractors
helped and so we restored thisbig red that's how I started to
(03:37):
get involved.
Jeff (03:38):
Mm-hmm.
And so you mentioned like youdidn't know Evel Knievel was
dead.
Were you not an Evel Knievel fanprior to this situation?
I'm sure you were, obviously,you were aware of who Evel
Knievel was.
Joe P (03:49):
Yeah, I was a fan when I was kid.
Jeff (03:51):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (03:51):
But 1977, Evel Knievel dropped off the map
Jeff (03:54):
Right.
Joe P (03:55):
I quit following him when they quit putting the front of
the National Enquirer I hadn'theard that name since
Jeff (04:03):
1977 Right.
Joe P (04:05):
I was a fan then but moved on.
Jeff (04:08):
Obviously now you're involved with the museum, so you
know, the Evel Knievel storyintimately.
Let's talk a little bit aboutEvel Knievel story share a
little bit about his life andhis history and how he, where he
started and what he ended updoing.
Joe P (04:23):
Okay.
He started in butte, Montana,where he was born started all
the shenanigans the motorcycleriding and hucksterism deal
where he started a securitybusiness for 30 bucks a month.
He guarantees your tavern willnot get broken into
Jeff (04:42):
Yeah.
One of those kinds of deals.
Joe P (04:43):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Okay.
You don't pay the 30 bucks.
Well, there's no guarantee yourtavern's not going to get broken
into.
Jeff (04:47):
I get it.
Yeah.
Joe P (04:48):
Yeah.
Worked at the mines there.
Dropped out high school there.
He was a, high school athlete,so he was a ski jumper in school
award-winning amateur hockeyplayer.
In the Army, he was a polevaulter that's where I he got
his start.
Made his way around country.
His hero was Joie Chitwood fromTopeka Kansas, who was a race
(05:11):
car driver.
hugely skilled race car driver.
He could take his car up twowheels go around the track Took
his show on the road.
He's got rodeo clowns andeverything, and he's jumping
over flaming barrels and EvelKnievel goes and sees Joie
Chitwood crash into a wall andsays,"That's what I want to do
rest of my life." it's a longstory, but his launch into
(05:35):
stardom was here in Las Vegas
Jeff (05:37):
Right.
So I think people who are, Vegasfanatics or even with a little
bit of knowledge about Vegashave a bit of an idea of the
Vegas connection with EvelKnievel, but it it 1969?
Am I getting my numbers right?
0, 67.
So I was close.
Okay.
It was so 19.
Joe P (05:54):
You were really close.
New.
Jeff (05:55):
I was really close.
Joe P (05:55):
New Year's Eve.
Jeff (05:56):
Yeah.
New Year's Eve, 1967 into 68.
And he decides prior to that,obviously he's going to jump his
motorcycle over the fountains ofCaesars Palace.
Joe P (06:06):
Yeah.
He's unemployed at that point.
He tried to have a Joie Chitwoodcircus where he had a little guy
who would entertain crowds.
If Evel was going to jump overtwo trucks, then Butch Wilhelm
would get on his little minibike jump over two Tonka trucks,
if Evel's going through flamingboards.
(06:27):
Butch is going throughcardboard.
Jeff (06:29):
Yeah.
Joe P (06:30):
I as an aside Butch eventually became an Ewok, and
he lived in Hollywood.
Jeff (06:34):
Oh really?
Joe P (06:34):
Yeah, he's unemployed.
He's sitting at a bar in Butte,Montana when one of his buddies
says,"Hey, you know, our fellowbeautician?
Beautician?
Fellow Buttian is fightingagainst Dick Tiger." His name's
Rick Rouse from Butte Montanagoing to fight against Dick
Tiger in a boxing match and it'sin Vegas.
(06:56):
Let's road trip it So they pilefrom the bar into a van to Vegas
where they cannot afford a roomat this palatial venue Jay Sarno
has built this 25 million dollarhotel.
with the Roman columns,hostesses dressed like
goddesses.
They can't afford to stay there,but they can afford a beer
(07:18):
there.
They go into the bar and one ofhis buddies, this guy says, his
buddies got great ideas.
"You know, you could be the drawhere.
They don't have a Dean Martin,like Sands has, they don't have
a Frank Sinatra like the DunesYou could do like your wheelies
and tricks you do at home hereas a draw." Evel said"The more
(07:39):
beer I drank, the smallerfountains got until I decide I'm
going jump fountains, I'm goingto call the owner of joint."
Yeah.
that's exactly what he did.
He called the owner but couldnot get past the receptionist,
even though he explains,"I'mfamous.
I was on Wide World of Sportsfor three minutes".
Jay Sarno is not going to takecall he tells the receptionist.
(08:00):
No more calls from that
Jeff (08:02):
yeah.
Joe P (08:02):
yayhoo.
So Evel begins to disguise hisvoice
Jeff (08:07):
love it.
Joe P (08:08):
Hey, it's Bill Fleming for ABC's Wide World of Sports.
I'm calling the about this EvelKnievel character that's
supposed jump your fountains onNew Year's Eve.
Making sure you have enoughrooms for me in my entire crew."
Sarno says,"never heard of itthen"Hey, it's Samy Smith.
My boss here at SportsIllustrated told me to come take
pictures of this character Evelknievel jumping over your
fountains on New Year's Eve.
What time does that start?" andfinally he Evel calls with a
(08:34):
lawyer accent.
Hello, this is Saul Rosenberg.
I understand that you arepromoting an event which my
client Evel Knievel, is to jumpyour fountains.
The only problem is we don'thave any sort contract or
agreement for him to perform atyour place.
I'm inclined to sue you as ithappens, I'm going out town
another of my clients.
You may have heard LawrenceWelk, but Evel Knievel is in Las
(08:56):
Vegas and available to meet withyou tomorrow.
So by then Sarno is going...
Jeff (09:03):
I love it.
Joe P (09:03):
Yeah.
Sarno goes from"Never heard ofit" to"Call me back" to"Where
you been, kid, I've been lookingall over for you."
Jeff (09:08):
Yeah.
Joe P (09:10):
So that beginning, that's the beginning of the Caesar's
Palace story.
Jeff (09:16):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (09:17):
later Evel'fessed up to it and he and Jay Sarno became
close friends
Jeff (09:23):
Yeah.
Joe P (09:24):
But at the time that's how he he got the gig for very
little money a thousand dollarson New Year's Eve, a thousand
dollars on New Year's Day.
Jeff (09:32):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (09:34):
Sarno said, I'm not covering your hospital bills
either.
Knievel wrecks just spoiler, Iguess it's not a spoiler alert.
Jeff (09:45):
Spoiler alert.
It happened.
Joe P (09:46):
Spoiler alert, happened in 1968.
Jeff (09:48):
1968.
But you know, spoiler alert incase you've been living under a
rock since then.
Yeah.
Yeah.
He, it did not go well for himon this jump, by any stretch of
the imagination.
Went very badly.
Joe P (10:01):
Very badly.
Very badly.
He hit top of a van.
The very last van cleared.
Cleared most of the fountains.
I mean, he did clear thefountains, but.
as he said,"I never had aproblem jumping a motorcycle.
It was always the landing,"right?
Jeff (10:16):
,right.
Joe P (10:18):
Broke both wrists, both ankles, his hip, pelvis and
femur Yeah.
And was rushed the hospital.
Meanwhile, Sarno, the owner ofthe hotel, is watching from
portica chere, a great vantagepoint but he's got these two
little kids with him, his kids,his two they both thought they
(10:42):
saw a man die,
Jeff (10:44):
Right.
Joe P (10:44):
Sarno says,"No, Mr.
Knievel is alive.
I could see him speaking as theyloaded him into the ambulance.
But to reassure you, I you tothe hospital and show that Mr.
Knievel is okay."
Jeff (10:55):
Yeah.
Joe P (10:56):
Took him 20 minutes to from his office to his car,
which normally takes two minutesright?
But it's so crowded...
Sarno starts scratching his headthinking,"Wow, this place is so
packed.
It's taking me this long, andI've still got this clown signed
for a second jump."
Jeff (11:15):
Right.
Joe P (11:16):
It may not be tomorrow, but he's, contractually
obligated.
They get to the hospital,Knievel is awake, alive at alert
flirting with nurses, but in alot pain,
Jeff (11:27):
Right.
Joe P (11:29):
And he says, Jay, thank God you're here.
You gotta get me outta here.
I don't have insurance."
Jeff (11:36):
Of course.
Of course.
Joe P (11:38):
And Jay Sarno.
You've known Jay Sarno's story.
Jeff (11:41):
Yes.
I mean, very, very famousdeveloping Caesar's Palace and
Circus Circus and heavilyinvolved in the development of
Las Vegas in the somewhat modernresort.
He would've been, I mean, tocompare him, he almost would've
been the Steve Wynn of that eraof Las Vegas.
Joe P (12:00):
That's true.
Jeff (12:01):
Yeah.
Joe P (12:01):
Like from Frontier Town to mega resort.
Jeff (12:04):
Yeah, exactly.
Yeah.
Joe P (12:06):
Anyways, the point is that he's a super mind when it
comes to marketing.
Jeff (12:11):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (12:11):
and he says,"Don't worry kid, I will cover your hospital
bills if you roll with me onthis marketing plan."
Jeff (12:16):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (12:17):
"Because you're coming to jump again as soon as you get
out.
But you gotta heal up first.
So I'm going to pay off thenurses to speak to nobody.
I'm going to pay off the doctorsto hold a press conference in
their white lab coats," whichthey do.
And the doctor stands out frontand says,"Yes, Evel Knievel is
alive in our hospital.
And we are assured that he isgoing to try again as soon as he
(12:42):
awakes from his coma."
Jeff (12:46):
just the ultimate level of P.T.
Barnum-ish showmanship, right?
Like really.
Joe P (12:53):
He is both, both those two characters.
Yeah.
I don't know how this townsurvived both of them on the
town at the same time.
Jeff (12:59):
That's outstanding.
Joe P (13:01):
Yeah.
So, um, he never did end updoing that, the second jump, but
that is what launched hiscareer, that press conference,
because it not only ran in Buttein Las Vegas, but it.
Kansas City and New York andDallas and Chicago.
Jeff (13:16):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (13:17):
This crazy maniac crashed almost killed himself and he's
fixing to do it again.
Jeff (13:22):
Yeah.
Well, and I mean, he went onafter that, like you say, that
was the jump that reallylaunched his career because he
went on from there and it was,he did further jumps and bigger
jumps and bigger paychecks.
And of course then cameendorsements and all of a sudden
this is a guy who is on lunchboxes and he's action figures
and it's millions of dollars inendorsements that he's getting
(13:44):
as well.
Joe P (13:45):
Yeah, that was the, the cash cow was.
this, toy.
I'm not sure if you're oldenough yet, but if you're old
enough, yet.
If you're old enough.
But there was toy when I waskid.
Jeff (13:57):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (13:57):
that outsold Barbie in 1974.
It's the first action figuremade after a living, breathing
human being.
Jeff (14:02):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (14:02):
And that's the Evel Knievel Stunt Cycle.
Jeff (14:05):
Right.
Joe P (14:05):
Wind it up.
It's got a little gyro in it andit takes off and it really
works.
It one of those toys thatactually worked as advertised.
Jeff (14:12):
Yeah.
Joe P (14:13):
And he made more money off of that toy than he did any
events or television or moviesor jumps.
Jeff (14:19):
Yeah.
Yeah, I've seen videos recentlybecause there's the odd time
somebody will score one of thesethings off eBay or in an antique
store that still works and yousee the video of them and
they're just zzz-zzz-zzz windingit up and you watch and yeah,
like it actually does workreally well--the way it should
work as opposed to so many ofthose other toys that, yeah,
(14:40):
they didn't work like that.
This, this really, you could setit up to jump over stuff is
fantastic
Joe P (14:47):
Yeah.
Jeff (14:48):
Awesome.
Joe P (14:48):
And all started here in that hospital bed.
Jeff (14:50):
Yeah.
Joe P (14:51):
He had called Wide World of Sports, which eventually
turned into ESPN, but Wide WorldSports, was on one day a week
and said,"I'm jumping over thefountains at Caesars Palaces,
come cover me." They declined.
"We've already got schedule, butmaybe if you take some footage,
we might use it." So Knievelhired private contractors, John
Derek, who's more famous formarrying Bo Derek
Jeff (15:14):
mm-hmm.
Joe P (15:15):
and his wife the time was Linda Evans, who's famous for
Dynasty,
Jeff (15:19):
I think Dynasty, yeah.
Joe P (15:20):
And they took the footage I mean this amazing footage,
which is kind of like the agonyof defeat now.
Jeff (15:27):
Yeah.
Joe P (15:27):
at the time, had it developed, dropped it off to be
developed in Los Angeles wherethey lived.
Went camping for a week becausethat's how long it took to
develop film.
Jeff (15:36):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (15:36):
and returned.
The developer hands in thiscanister and says,"I have done
Oscar work and this is the bestfootage I have ever seen in my
entire life." And they took,they rushed it to Las Vegas,
screened it on Evel Knievel'shospital room wall.
Jeff (15:52):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (15:53):
there.
And it's just, it's Evel Knievelhead over tea kettle just looks
exactly rag doll.
And his bones are breaking andyou can see it.
And even though black and whiteand even though it's old
footage, it still makes onecringe to look at.
And of course when he saw it thefirst time, his eyeballs turned
(16:14):
into little dollar signs and hesaid,
Jeff (16:16):
Right.
Joe P (16:16):
"Man, I'm going to take that on Joey Bishop and Johnny
Carson"
Jeff (16:19):
yeah.
Joe P (16:19):
"And if people don't want to come watch me make a jump
successfully at their statefair, they sure don't want to
mess it when I die there."
Jeff (16:26):
Right.
It was almost like him failingthat jump really kind of was the
best thing that ever happened to
Joe P (16:34):
him.
So true, so true, so true.
Jeff (16:38):
And the fact that, I mean, what still blows me away to this
day is the fact that yeah, hepitches it to Wide World of
Sports and they're like,"Eh, no.
You know what?
Get back to us if somethingexciting happens." Something
exciting really happened, right?
Joe P (16:53):
It did.
Jeff (16:54):
That's, that's so cool.
And I mean, so to this day now,there's, there's been a lot of
and, well, I mean, to follow upon that, as you say, he never
tried the jump again.
He never attempted the Caesar'sPalace jump again.
Was that a choice?
Was it his choice?
Do you know if it was a choiceby Caesars or was it just he
never got around to it orCaesars, was it willing to let
(17:14):
him nearly die again?
Like how come that neverhappened?
Joe P (17:18):
Yeah, I think that was probably Evel Knievel
Jeff (17:21):
Yeah.
Joe P (17:21):
that, did not, hold up his end of the bargain on that
contract.
The reason I say that becauseyou did special on Caesar's
Palace.
Jeff (17:30):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (17:30):
and stunts that were there
Jeff (17:31):
Yeah.
Joe P (17:32):
And they did let other people do it.
Jeff (17:34):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (17:34):
They let Robbie Knievel do it, Travis Pastrana
Jeff (17:37):
Yeah.
Joe P (17:37):
and Gary Wells.
Jeff (17:38):
Gary Wells tried it too.
He also spectacularly failed aswell, so, yeah.
Yeah.
It didn't go well for a lot ofpeople.
Joe P (17:47):
That's true.
Jeff (17:48):
Yeah.
But Robbie succeeded.
Robbie did
Joe P (17:52):
Yes,
Jeff (17:52):
He did the jump.
Joe P (17:53):
Yep.
Jeff (17:54):
He succeeded.
And Travis Pastrana, he made it.
Joe P (17:57):
Yeah, dude, he broke all records.
Jeff (17:58):
Yeah.
Yeah.
So I mean, it was clearlydoable.
But with Evel, if I'm recallingcorrectly, was it Evel Knievel
that he figured there was a bitof a downshift right as he was
hitting the ramp or a bit of adrop in speed?
Was that Evel that was what hefigured why he didn't make it?
That's Evel The Evel KnievelEvel connection to Vegas
(18:18):
continues today.
I mean, there is a fair bit ofhistory, particularly, I'm
assuming you've been down toEvel Pie on Fremont Street.
Yes.
Which an Evel Pie, which ofcourse is, is run by the estate
of Evel Knievel.
And if you've never been there,it's such a cool little joint
just jammed with Evel Knievelmemorabilia.
It's a fantastic place to go.
Joe P (18:40):
Yeah.
Jeff (18:40):
The first time you ever went in there, was it just kind
like, this is awesome?
Joe P (18:44):
Yeah, that's first time I was in there.
I was like, this awesome.
This is awesome.
By then I had already worked atthe Evel Knievel Museum
Jeff (18:51):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (18:52):
So, I mean it was less awesome than the museum in
Topeka but they had some stuff
Jeff (18:57):
But do they serve pizza at the museum in Topeka?
Joe P (18:59):
No.
Jeff (19:00):
There you go.
that's that's what wins it
Joe P (19:04):
Well, Jeff, you haven't been there and.
But the barbecue at the, at themuseum.
Jeff (19:10):
There we go.
Joe P (19:11):
Is really good.
Jeff (19:11):
There we go.
Let's talk about the museum.
So right now it is in Topeka,Kansas, which seems kind of
random in my brain.
I'm assuming there's a reasonit's in Topeka.
Joe P (19:23):
I hear ya.
It is sort of random.
Jeff (19:26):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (19:26):
But where we're from.
And where Mike Patterson's fromand he befriended a really great
guy, Lathan McKay, who wascollector
Jeff (19:37):
Okay.
Joe P (19:37):
of Evel Knievel memorabilia.
If it was Evel Knievel, he wasand is on a mission
Jeff (19:45):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (19:46):
starting pair leathers.
Lathan looked around to seewhere the Evel Knievel Museum
was.
Jeff (19:53):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (19:53):
There wasn't one.
Evel er, Lathan I get the twoconfused.
Just went out collected a lot ofdifferent things,
Jeff (20:00):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (20:01):
motorcycles, helmets, jewelry, canes, capes.
had a traveling exhibit for awhile.
Jeff (20:10):
Okay.
Joe P (20:12):
Eventually ran across big red circus wagon
Jeff (20:15):
Right.
it
Joe P (20:17):
was rotting away in a lot in Florida Lathan didn't really
know where to get restored.
He tried place or two, couldn'tget it started.
And Jeff, I mean, it wasdilapidated.
You could see sky through thecab of the Mack truck and was
friends with the Jerry Lee Lewisfamily from Memphis, Tennessee.
Jeff (20:39):
Okay.
Yep.
Joe P (20:40):
And historic Harley Davidson of Topeka, they
specialize in the historicrestoration of Harley Davidsons.
Jeff (20:47):
Right.
Joe P (20:47):
So if it says Harley Davidson, whether it's 1906 or
whatever it is,
Jeff (20:52):
mm-hmm.
Joe P (20:53):
Mike's going to make sure that gets as pristine as you can
pay for.
So that's how it started.
Lathan called Mike and said,Hey, I've got this Mack truck
was owned by Evel Knievel.
Can you restore it?
Jeff (21:08):
Yeah.
Joe P (21:09):
But what Mike hears is, "blah, blah, blah Evel Knievel
blah, blah, blah"
Jeff (21:16):
Right.
Joe P (21:16):
Mike's like, yeah, bring it.
Bring it.
Yeah.
So, yeah.
So this motorcycle dealer now isin the business of restoring a
big tractor trailer with coachand.
it's a Mack, it's a 1974 truck,I think.
Jeff (21:28):
Yeah, So
Joe P (21:29):
it took a couple years and it took a hundred local
contractors.
As I said, I was one of them.
Mm-hmm.
Goodyear Tire another one.
and it's all painted like amotorcycle, so
Jeff (21:40):
mm-hmm.
Joe P (21:40):
All the old logos are replicated in hand painted
design
Jeff (21:44):
Wow.
Joe P (21:44):
instead of, uh, decals
Jeff (21:46):
that's awesome.
Joe P (21:47):
Anyway.
Far, far too big travelingmuseum,
Jeff (21:50):
Right.
Joe P (21:51):
And so Mike built a, 13,000 square foot museum there
so that people could enjoy
Jeff (21:57):
mm-hmm.
Joe P (21:58):
Lathan and Mike's collection.
That's awesome.
Jeff (22:00):
And so now the plan is, this is very cool, and this is
how you and I connected intalking about Las Vegas and Evel
Knievel.
The plan is the museum coming toVegas
Joe P (22:11):
Hot damn
Jeff (22:12):
Hot damn.
That is so cool.
So let's talk a little bit aboutthat.
You guys have a location inmind.
You have a timeline in mind ofwhen people are going to be able
to start visiting The EvelKnievel Museum in Las Vegas?
Joe P (22:26):
Yes to the first part and no to the second.
Jeff (22:28):
Okay.
Joe P (22:29):
Yes, there's place, and it's in the Arts District, which
is this between the Strip anddowntown.
Jeff (22:36):
Right.
Joe P (22:37):
The Arts District is an up and coming spot.
Jeff (22:40):
Mm-hmm
Joe P (22:41):
Everybody that I've talked to here in Las Vegas this
week is super excited about theArts District.
I have not been there.
Jeff (22:47):
Yeah,
Joe P (22:48):
They've got first Fridays
Jeff (22:50):
mm-hmm.
Joe P (22:50):
looks hugely crowded.
Jeff (22:51):
It's a real booming area in the city.
And, and as you say, it's withlots of great restaurants and
lots of great new real estateand lots of great new apartments
condos and living space.
And it is the hot spot for forpeople to be going to in Las
Vegas right now.
That is where everybody isstarting to go is into the arts
(23:11):
district, so that is, that's anoutstanding spot.
Joe P (23:14):
Good I didn't pick it.
The team picked yeah, it's, itsounds great.
And they've got a new Punk RockMuseum going in there.
Jeff (23:23):
Yeah,
Joe P (23:23):
just down the street.
Jeff (23:24):
Yeah,
Joe P (23:25):
And I don't know what other, but there are other
museums there.
Oh, there's Burlesque Museum.
Jeff (23:28):
Yeah, the Burlesque Hall of Fame is down in there.
I've had them on the podcast.
I've never, I've yet to gothrough, but I've had them on
the podcast to talk about thehistory of burlesque in Las
Vegas and the Burlesque Hall ofFame and yeah, like, it's a real
growing area and that location.
Being near Fremont and beingDowntown, but also being sort of
within easy access of the Strip.
(23:49):
That's a great spot.
That's a really good spot forthat be, that's going to be
excellent.
Yeah.
Joe P (23:55):
Topeka's been very kind to us but Vegas, that's where it
belongs
Jeff (24:02):
Yeah,
Joe P (24:02):
Nobody can argue that it should be in Topeka, Kansas
Jeff (24:05):
Right.
Joe P (24:05):
instead of in Las Vegas.
Jeff (24:07):
And so now something that you've branched out into, and
that's why you're here in Vegasthis week at this conference
conference, everybody comes toVegas to go to a conference.
Joe P (24:16):
You're here Podcast Movement Evolutions, learning
how to get into the podcastspace.
And that's how you reached outto me to connect, to talk about
podcasting.
You were launching an EvelKnievel podcast, which I think
is super cool.
What made you want to jump intothe podcast space with this?
Well, been talking a lot aboutmarketing
Jeff (24:36):
mm-hmm.
Joe P (24:37):
to coincide with the opening of the Evel Knievel
museum here in Las Vegas.
And podcasting is one of thosethings that I hadn't thought
about in the last decade, butwhat I had thought about is I
want to share these stories.
People come in there and lot ofpeople have a story about Evel
Knievel.
And a lot of them are getting upin years.
(25:00):
Our mission is preserve andpresent the legacy of Evel
Knievel.
So I wanted the stories, say thedriver of this big red truck,
because you know he has storieswhether he's telling them or
not.
Jeff (25:12):
Yeah.
Joe P (25:14):
But I was walking around at conference,
Jeff (25:18):
we do for those, for those listening to this episode of the
podcast, we're doing the airquotes around conference the
meme.
I'm going to Vegas for aconference.
Yeah, yeah.
Here we are.
Here we are.
Joe P (25:30):
But you and I went out to watch bands play Monday.
Jeff (25:34):
Yeah.
It was at Monday Dark
Joe P (25:35):
which was freaking awesome.
It's mostly sitting in a darkroom, listening to the loud
music and probably about, Idon't know, 15 minutes of
socializing.
Yeah.
And I met John Katz.
Yeah.
Or you introduced me to JohnKatz who said,"My uncle was
owner of Bucyrus Erie Cranes."And I'd heard that name.
(25:58):
I'd seen the name on cranes thatdid the sky cycle.
But yeah, this is an example ofone connection.
Jeff (26:04):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (26:05):
Then I'm at the bar.
Girl sees my jacket and says,"Evel Knievel.
My dad did all his jewelry EvelKnievel and all Sammy Davis jrs
and all Frank Sinatras, and hedid the TCB for Elvis.
His name's Mordecai." So I'mtexting Mike from the museum
saying, Dude, we're getting goldfor this podcast if I can get
these people to come on."
Jeff (26:24):
Yeah.
Joe P (26:25):
He says, how do you, how are you making all these
connections?
Right, Just wear the jacket.
Yeah, just wear jacket.
People come up they've gotstories.
Jeff (26:33):
Yeah.
Joe P (26:34):
So I've got some in the bank for editing still.
Sure.
The biographer of J Sarno
Jeff (26:43):
Is that David Schwartz?
Joe P (26:44):
David G.
Schwartz, yeah.
Jeff (26:45):
Yeah.
I've had Dave on a couple oftimes to talk.
He wrote a book about the Sandsand the history of the Sands.
And so I had him on to talkabout that.
And then he also joined me totalk about family friendly
Vegas.
Because he wrote a bunch ofstuff.
He was involved in some paneldiscussions.
I think they were hosted the Mobmuseum about the family friendly
era of Las Vegas.
(27:06):
and yeah.
And then he also great bookGrandissimo, which is all about
Jay Sarno and all about theCaesar's Palace and Circus
Circus and then the plans thathe had for an even bigger
resort, which was Grandissimo sothat's great that you were able
to get David on to talk.
That's great.
Yeah.
Joe P (27:22):
Then we've got couple others.
Just as preview of our podcast,Eddie Langert invented the metal
golf driver.
They were called woods beforethat, right?
He used three wood, he inventedfor weather purposes.
He was a golf pro in Wisconsinand it turns out these weather,
these metal drivers nail golfball really long ways, invested
(27:45):
his life savings, mortgaged hishouse to build 16 prototypes.
Took them down to Florida,couldn't get any traction,
couldn't get any buy-in.
I mean, this sport's 500 yearsold.
Nobody's buying metalwoodsclubs.
Ends up on a golf course whereKnievel tries hustle him.
It's a long story.
Evel ends up buying into thismetal golf club.
(28:07):
This guy had traveled Wisconsinwith$22 and 16 clubs, ends up
sells 2 million dollars worth ofclubs that weekend.
From 22 dollars to 2 milliondollars
Jeff (28:19):
wow.
Joe P (28:19):
with a little help from Evel Knievel.
Jeff (28:21):
Yeah.
Joe P (28:22):
George Sedlak was Evel Knievel's painter.
He's going to be on, And thenhopefully we can get Lathan and
Mike on.
It's been fun
Jeff (28:33):
That's awesome.
Joe P (28:34):
Now, I did survey what people wanted in an Evel Knievel
Museum
Jeff (28:39):
podcast Mm-hmm.
Joe P (28:40):
This is my target market.
And even at this conference,they've been telling us, Do what
your listeners want.
Jeff (28:48):
Yeah.
Joe P (28:48):
You don't need to worry about advertisers.
Do what your listeners want, andeverything else will flow from
that
Jeff (28:53):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (28:53):
so put out a survey poll on social media.
If there was an Evel Knievelpodcast, what would you want
covered?
Jeff (29:07):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (29:07):
50% wanted history content the records 25% wanted
insider news about displays thatare being built or acquisitions.
0% wanted to hear travel tips,hotel information,
Jeff (29:26):
Well, I mean, they're not going to the Evel Knievel
podcast for that.
That's they're coming to mypodcast for the travel tips and
the travel information.
Joe P (29:34):
Yeah.
Okay, good.
Well, I don't think my listenersknow how often they come in and
say,"What's the closestrestaurant?"
Jeff (29:44):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (29:45):
Or where can I get barbecue now that I'm here or
Jeff (29:47):
Yeah.
Joe P (29:48):
Where should I stay?
Jeff (29:49):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (29:50):
So the Jeff's is the man.
Jeff Does Vegas.
Jeff with a J sometimes?
No, just Jeff with a J I like tosay I'm a Jeff, not a G- off.
That's, that's my tag.
Jeff (30:02):
A timeline for the podcast launch?
Are you, thinking you want tohave it get the museum up and
going and get the podcast out atthe same time or podcast leading
up to the opening of the museum.
Do you have any, yeah.
Joe P (30:14):
Leading up to thoughts?
Yeah, I've got some in the can.
Jeff (30:16):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (30:17):
Got a few recorded, I've got most of those edited, not
released yet.
but I wanted to to conference soI could, you know, get tips and
tricks Yeah.
How to get things uploaded andwhat the best ways to market Mm.
Now that we're done I wouldguess I'm going can get it
(30:38):
launched
Jeff (30:39):
that's awesome.
it's funny how, we joke aboutconference quote unquote, but it
really is, it's interesting.
You come to these things and yougo home invigorated and I mean,
I know like after I finish thisconference, I've got a couple of
weeks off.
I'm going to have about fiveinterviews the can a trip report
that I want to write.
I'm home and I'm going to spendthe next two weeks just creating
(31:01):
stuff.
So it is, when you spend thetime around creative people and
around people that are veryencouraging to you you do just
want to go home and just wantcreate, and you want to get at
it.
So that's, that's excellent thatyou're looking pushing this
timeline forward and just going,yeah, I want to go home and I
want to go hard and I want getthis stuff out
Joe P (31:18):
Yes.
Jeff (31:19):
That's awesome.
That's awesome.
In the meantime, if people wantto learn about the Evel Knievel
Museum and they want to hitTopeka, Kansas, how can they do
that?
You guys are online, you've gotsocial media?
Both of things.
Online and social media.
So the online isEvelKnievelMuseum.com Mm-hmm.
Joe P (31:36):
It's the very best place to buy Evel Knievel gear
Jeff (31:39):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (31:41):
The Evel Knievel gear I'm talking about is not cheap
keychains.
Sorry.
It is well-made clothing and
Jeff (31:49):
mm-hmm.
Joe P (31:51):
historic replicas of his canes, helmets, and more.
Jeff (31:55):
Mm-hmm.
Joe P (31:56):
So that there's that, but then online, there's Facebook
and Instagram and all stuff.
Jeff (32:02):
Yeah.
Joe P (32:03):
And then I think to coincide with the podcast will
be video and audio just becausethat's what I'm used
Jeff (32:10):
to.
Yeah.
Joe P (32:10):
I've been doing four-minute sessions on YouTube.
Jeff (32:13):
Yeah.
Which is excellent.
That's a very cool way to do it.
And especially too, becauseyou're going to be telling some
really interesting stories frompeople who are going to be
telling some interesting storiesand you want to get that facial
expression and have that contactwith them.
So that's excellent.
That's excellent.
Joe P (32:28):
Yeah.
We've got a whole lot ofhistoric video that sort of goes
along with
Jeff (32:33):
Yeah.
Joe P (32:33):
It's awkward and I'll have to walk through video on
the podcast.
Jeff (32:37):
Yeah.
That's awesome.
Well, I wish you all the bestwith all of this.
I think it's going to beexcellent.
I'm looking forward to thelaunch and I'm looking forward
to having something new to checkout when I come to Vegas.
Joe P (32:47):
Yeah, right on.
Jeff (32:49):
Excellent.
excellent, Joe, thank you somuch for this
Joe P (32:51):
happy landings.
Thanks for joining us again.
That was so nice of Jeff Walkerto do that for us.
We're going to head back toKansas now.
So if you're ready, we're goingto take a trip back and we're
going to play with some guns andwe're going to play with
explosive devices and we'regoing to race cars.
Are you up for that?
Well then let's go.
Heather (33:07):
All right.
If you enjoyed this episode,please subscribe.
It's our mission to preserve andpresent the legacy of Evel
Knievel.
So if you have an idea for anepisode or a guest or have a
suggestion to improve our show,just drop us a line at
Joe@Thrill.Show.
Evel Knievel (33:27):
I just think the Evel Knievel way.
Heather (33:33):
We leave you with the encouraging words from the book
of Deuteronomy.
"Be strong and courageous.
Do not be afraid or terrifiedfor the Lord your God goes with
you.
He will never leave you orforsake you." Until next time,
happy landings.
Joe Friday (33:49):
If you like to fly by the seat of your pants, this
is where you belong.
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