October 8, 2025 • 53 mins
Some careers are built on big breaks; Nick White’s is built on small promises kept. Rates jump from 3% to 7%, buyers hit the brakes, and the easy deals vanish—so he doubles down on what doesn’t go out of style: crisp communication, daily prospecting, and the kind of follow-through agents actually brag about. We sit down with Nick, a Denver-based mortgage broker, to map the shift from the pandemic refi rush to a tougher, trust-first market—and how staying calm, curious, and accountable can turn a tight pipeline into steady momentum.
We get specific about lead flow: using production tools to spot real opportunities, reaching out to agents who aren’t locked to one lender, and generating business from your own sphere so partnerships feel reciprocal instead of needy. Nick walks through the habits that move the needle—status updates that prevent surprises, asking smart questions before pitching products, and creative problem solving within guidelines. He also shares why hobbies aren’t just hobbies. Golf rounds become five-hour conversations. Triathlon teams morph into community. Local coffee shops and gyms turn into warm intros and soft landings for future clients. Active touches meet passive touches, and mindshare compounds.
There’s a human layer here too: boundaries as a growth strategy, not a luxury. Nick blocks time, protects focus, and says no when quality would suffer. A brutal DNF on a scorching race day reframed failure as a redirect, not a verdict. We talk about patience—the 18–24 months it often takes before results stack—and the difference between passing a licensing exam and learning to sell, listen, and lead a file from start to finish. Whether you’re a lender, agent, or any kind of builder, this conversation is a reminder that consistent value wins long after trends fade.
If this resonates, follow the show, share with someone who needs a nudge back to the basics, and leave a quick review—what one habit will you recommit to this week?
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_01 (00:00):
Welcome to Timeless Movement.
I'm your host, Alexander Laszlo,and I'm here joined by Nick
White.
Appreciate you having me.
Yeah, thank you for coming on.
Of course.
So tell us a little bit aboutyou.
SPEAKER_00 (00:12):
For sure.
So my name's Nick White.
I'm a mortgage broker withthree-point mortgage here in
Denver.
I work all throughout the stateof Colorado, primarily here on
the Denver Metro, but also havesome deals up north of Fort
Collins, Sound Springs as well.
Nothing out west in themountains yet, but only a matter
of time.
I'm originally from the state ofNew Hampshire.
Moved out here two years ago inAugust of 2023, and it's been
(00:35):
everything I've wanted and moreliving in Colorado.
It's a lot of fun.
It's been such a fulfillingexperience, and very grateful to
make the move.
And yeah, it's been great.
SPEAKER_01 (00:45):
Yeah.
So how'd you get into themortgage world?
SPEAKER_00 (00:49):
For sure.
I always knew going into comingout of college, I wanted to be
involved in financial services,some way, shape, or form.
And mortgage was the route thatI just initially went with.
And I've been at it out since Ipretty much graduated school
five years ago.
So I've had a variety ofdifferent roles in the industry,
(01:10):
but now I'm a full-timeoriginator.
I've been doing that for threeyears now.
And it's been, yeah, it's been alot of fun that way.
And I don't see myself goinganywhere else anytime soon.
SPEAKER_01 (01:19):
Nice.
So you said you've been in therefive years?
Four and a half, technically,coming up on my fifth year.
Yep.
So what were your uh firstcouple years like?
SPEAKER_00 (01:28):
Uh it was definitely during a very busy time period
in just real estate in generalacross the country.
Inventory was constantlydecreasing on a month-over-month
basis.
This was during the coronaviruspandemic.
Right.
Refies were just off the shelf.
People, everyone wasrefinancing, residential and
commercial.
So my first job was more so asales role for other loan
(01:51):
officers across the country,just helping them maintain their
databases, build newrelationships, stay in front of
their referral partners andtheir clientele, and just
consistently try to find newways to prospect business that
way.
I did that for about a year anda half.
SPEAKER_01 (02:06):
Nice.
So, what did you do to like findsuccess and find business when
you first started?
SPEAKER_00 (02:14):
Yeah, I think that's probably better for that's a
better question for when I movedhere, I would say.
So I got fully licensed in 2022,and that was the year that the
market, the market reallyflipped.
We went from 3% rates up toseven in the span of probably
(02:37):
six months.
So buyers pretty much put thebrakes on everything.
Like, wait, my mortgage paymentjust went up 150%.
It would have been six monthsago.
Like that's we should probablyput a pause on it real quick.
People stopped overbidding forhouses, they sat on the silence
a lot more.
So the buyer pool really shrunkin 2022 and 2023.
(02:59):
So I did close a handful ofdeals in 2023 and was making it
actually made a transition to anew company in 2022.
So didn't close any deals for myown, per se, in 2022, but in uh
2023, that's when I I startedclosing more business.
That was also the year I madethe move out to Colorado.
So money was definitely prettytight and had to make things
(03:22):
work.
And one thing I've realized nowthat I've been in the business
here in Colorado for over twoyears, is it is incredibly
important to stay true to yourword.
If you say you're gonna dosomething, do it.
Don't just, you know, sell a bagof crap and not proceed with it.
(03:46):
So one thing that I've learnedis if you say you're gonna
commit to a certain service, acertain marketing program, a
certain way of communicatingwith clientele, stick to it and
always find ways to sharpen thatknife, be more, be better on a
daily basis.
(04:18):
One thing I've done, I'm proudof myself for this, is just
surround myself with people thatare in it to win it.
Not just other lenders, butagents, people in financial
planning, CPAs, insuranceagents, people that aren't in
that referral-based industry.
So one, I guess to answer yourquestion, long story short, here
is uh constantly just learn.
(04:41):
Education is invaluable.
Always take opportunities tolearn and educate yourself on
how you can become a better, abetter uh agent, better lender,
better lender, whatever industryyou're in.
And just surround yourself withpeople who are out there to get
it.
They're in it to win it.
They're and they and they do allthe things that I just
mentioned.
They're they're constantlylearning, they're finding new
(05:01):
ways to prospect, finding newways to improve their processes.
And my development as an LO,especially over the past two
years, has been pretty prettyamazing to see.
Not trying to toot my horn thereby any means, but I can
definitely be let me repeat thatactually.
(05:23):
I have just I've experienced alot of different clientele and
different files that comethrough.
So the I think my ability toproblem solve and my ability to
get things done have hasdrastically improved, which has
then resulted in me being ableto close more business that way.
So be a problem solver, don't bea problem creator in the
(05:46):
business.
And and when you do have thosego-to clients, go-to referral
partners, make sure that it's avery equal exchange and
relationship, not one-sided.
It's always a two-way street.
SPEAKER_01 (05:58):
Yep.
Yeah, I was golfing with thisguy from the hospitality
business a couple weeks back.
And kind of off your point, hewas like, Yeah, I moved out here
in Colorado, and I was surprisedit's just a pool of lazy people.
He's like, the people whoactually do stuff and get stuff
done are the ones who succeed,and the ones who are just
sitting there waiting for it,just they don't get anything,
(06:20):
and then they complain about it.
SPEAKER_00 (06:22):
One thing that is I think it's pretty unfortunate to
hear time and time again.
Every time I meet with a newagent, one of my referral
partners, an agent I'm buildinga relationship with, right?
About 75% of my business comesfrom real realtors.
That's where I make most of mymoney and get most of my
(06:43):
clientele.
One thing I always ask them iswhat are you looking for in a
mortgage broker, a lender?
What qualities do you want tosee?
What attributes do you want tosee in me?
The number one answer, 90% ofthe time, is communicate with
me.
(07:03):
The fact that that has to bespoken about time and time again
is pretty disheartening to hearbecause it's kind of the number
one point of our job is we talkto each other.
We are problem solving, we areworking together.
These are people's homes, we'rehelping them buy and sell, and
(07:24):
for me, finance them.
Every client is treated thesame.
And you know, it's up to us tomake sure that everyone's on the
same page with that.
So to hear so many agents justsay, just communicate with me,
shows that they've had badexperiences with lenders before
that.
SPEAKER_02 (07:41):
Yep.
SPEAKER_00 (07:42):
And it it just frustrates me because that
should just be the standard.
It shouldn't have to be an itshouldn't have to be an ask.
You know, it should just be thestandard.
And that's something that Ipersonally just been like, wow.
The the level of laziness,maybe, or procrastination?
Procrastination is one of them.
(08:03):
I'd say probably the theattention to detail with the
majority of people here, and notto talk smack about anybody in
particular, but it you wouldthink that there'd just be a
higher level of accountabilityand a higher level of detail
there.
And it's just unfortunate to seethat time and time again.
So bring it back going back toyour point of there's a lot of
(08:24):
people who are lazy.
I don't know if it's just acolor route of thing.
I'm from the East Coast whereeveryone is just going 110 miles
an hour.
Yep.
But yeah, I think it's justreally important to just hold
yourself accountable as anentrepreneurial business and you
don't have a boss you knowtelling you what to do.
It's you're you are your ownboss.
(08:45):
So hold yourself accountable tothe standard that you would want
to be held to.
SPEAKER_01 (08:50):
Yeah.
And I mean, it's like 10 minutesmaybe out of your way just to
you know talk to someone on thephone to like a minute to text
them.
It's not it's really not thathard.
Like minimum, you should betexting them with updates.
SPEAKER_00 (09:05):
That's the other funny part.
It's such it's such not a timesuck either.
SPEAKER_01 (09:09):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (09:10):
It's it's it's a it's maybe max like 10 minutes
out of your day.
I mean, if you have multiplefiles under your belt, like it
may take more than that, butit's still less than an hour of
your time each day just to makesure everyone that you're
working with on certain filesare informed and they're they
know what they're doing,especially your the agent
(09:32):
partner slash lender partner,and then also your back office
team, so your TC, the loanprocessor, underwriter, any
assistants that are on the team.
And then most importantly, yourclients.
Our clients are how we get paid,our clients are who choose us.
Hold up, set set yourself up forthat higher standard, and more
(09:53):
business will come your way inthe long term.
Exactly.
SPEAKER_01 (09:58):
So, in what ways have you connected with um
fellow business people andlike-minded business partners to
gain some business?
What ways have I connected withthem?
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (10:09):
Yeah, I think with every single individual that you
meet, you most likely have atleast one thing in common with
them.
That is I'm pretty concrete inmy brain about that.
Like, I guarantee in ourconversation here today, and
this is our first time meeting,you and I will find something
that we share in common.
(10:31):
I'll give you an example.
One of my better agent partners,he's with EXP, met him probably
two or three months after Imoved out here through a mutual
connection that him and I had.
He made it very clear to me,he's like, I have my guy, like
I'm very locked in with him.
He has a great job, and youknow, we can be friends, but I
can't promise you business.
Right.
(10:51):
I said, not a problem.
And he's a great producer, hedoes a good amount of business
for himself.
And just over time, you know, westay in flow, we stay in contact
with each other, build thatlong-term sustainable
relationship, and we found outwe both really enjoyed golfing.
So we've hit the range, we'vehit the range, we've hit the
(11:11):
course together countlessoccasions, right?
And we just we found out similarsenses of humor, similar other
interests, and we just havebecome better friends than
business partners.
And now we have two undercontract right now, possibly
have everyone here by theweekend.
Nice.
And that's really rewarding, youknow, to see two years of work
(11:33):
really come into play and seethe results of that come
through, which is reallyexciting.
So to answer your question, andnot to, I guess, flex there, but
to answer your question, you youI guarantee more often than not,
you have something in commonwith them.
And don't be like asking justquestion after question to get
(11:53):
to it, but it's just naturallygonna come up in conversation.
Maybe you follow each other onsocial media and you just find
similar interests that way too.
So it can be something as youknow easy, like simple as golf.
It's pretty popular.
SPEAKER_02 (12:07):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (12:07):
An agent friend of mine back in New Hampshire, we
both like the same smoothie fromthe same smoothie shop.
We've built a relationship offthat.
It's just funny things, right?
So that's with every client,too.
You probably have something incommon and find a way to build
that relationship with thembased off that and find out what
else you have in common fromthere.
SPEAKER_01 (12:25):
Yeah, it's pretty funny how many people actually
like golf.
Like I've probably gained two orthree new connections just from
one round of golf.
You know, just I never realizedhow many people were actually
into the sport.
It's a lot.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (12:40):
I think it's I've played more golf um nowadays
than I ever have in my entirelife.
And I I enjoy it.
It's something I'm a bigphysical, like not specimen,
that's a bad way to put it, butI like to work out and I like to
be you know outside and active.
And golf's just a great way tobe outside and be active, but
(13:02):
also network and connect andjust be with people for an
extended period of time.
So as I've also learned it'speople think of you a little bit
higher if you're good at golf.
Yeah.
So if you can shoot nine yearlevels, pretty competitive out
there.
SPEAKER_01 (13:15):
What was that?
They get pretty competitive outthere.
SPEAKER_00 (13:18):
Yeah.
If you're you know consistentlyputting your first shot into the
fairway and everything, andyou're hitting your putts,
you'll be a bit more respected,which I think is pretty, pretty
funny that way.
Apollo later, sorry.
SPEAKER_01 (13:30):
Yeah, I'll get so what do you do to overcome
obstacles and ceilings when theyarise?
SPEAKER_00 (13:43):
What do I do to overcome obstacles and ceilings
when they arrive?
That's an enormous part of alender's job.
You know, not every file isgonna be squeaky clean.
Some clients are gonna rate shopyou.
Not every deal is just gonna bebutter.
It's not gonna be super smooth,right?
So I think it's important toreally listen to the client
(14:04):
need.
You know, why are what are theyexperiencing, whether it be on a
financial basis, potentially apersonal basis, et cetera, et
cetera.
What is the client looking for?
What do they need?
And just listen to them.
Ask them questions, don't pushthe sale.
(14:25):
Ask them questions, hear themout.
When people feel heard andunderstood, they're gonna be
feel more valued by you, they'regonna feel more inclined to work
with you.
So listen, pause between, youknow, responding because it
shows you're gonna process theinformation, process that
question, ask smart questions inreturn.
(14:45):
And lending, you can be prettycreative with it.
There is obviously a variety ofguidelines you have to follow,
but at the same time, you canget creative with it, especially
in the broker world, which iswhere I'm at now.
So use your resources too.
There are people, I guaranteethere are people within your
company that have experienced acertain situation before and
(15:07):
they can guide you through it.
So don't be afraid to rely onyour resources, but also you
know, you're there's gonna bemost for you to figure out on
your own and make sure that youput in your best foot that way.
So the way that I've gone aboutovercoming obstacles and
ceilings is I listen to myclients.
I uh I ask them what theirconcerns are and why are they
(15:28):
you know feeling a certain way.
Listen to them, make surethey're heard, make sure they're
they feel understood, and thenprovide the solution come up
with the solution.
Try to figure out on your own atfirst.
And if you're truly stumped, youwe have people that we can work
with to ask those questions.
SPEAKER_01 (15:44):
Yeah, no, that's I like that because it shows you
really communicate, really careabout the client.
And you know, some not everyonedoes that, which is unfortunate,
but you know, the ones who dolike you will find your success.
It's nice to see.
Try to.
Okay.
Thanks.
So, like kind of a question offthat question what about when
(16:07):
you're stuck trying to findclients?
SPEAKER_00 (16:12):
Stuck trying to find clients?
Yeah.
Like what do I do?
SPEAKER_02 (16:14):
Yep.
SPEAKER_00 (16:16):
I think my lineup works a little bit different
than yours, where I will hit thephones, slide in DMs, and go
target new agents.
You know, people, you never knowwhere people are going to end up
in their real estate career.
And I always want to make surethat I am a person that they
know from the beginning.
So whether it's new agents, moreexperienced agents, even, we
(16:39):
have a software called MMI wherewe are able to prospect
realtors, see what theirproduction looks like, who they
work with for mortgage partners.
Um, if someone works at mycompany three point, I'm not
going to prospect them.
They already have a standingrelationship with someone there.
But if I see a good producerthat has worked with a variety
of age lenders and not just onein particular, I'll reach out.
(17:02):
If I see there's clearly anoutstanding relationship, they
close 30 deals, 20 members witha certain lender, it's pretty
clear they're locked in withsomeone that is that works, they
work well with them.
So to find a new business, I amalways, I'm always prospecting.
I always allocate at least anhour a day to prospect, to reach
out to people on social media,meet set up meetings just like
(17:25):
this to build a relationshipthat way, which in turn will
lead to clientele.
And then I'm also a firmbeliever that a lender should
generate their own business.
There's no reason why you know alender should just keep
continuously asked for referralsfrom agents.
There's also, you know, ifyou're marketing on social
(17:46):
media, there's no way you can'tgenerate your own business from
your own sphere, right?
We all have friends, we all havefamily, former coworkers, etc.
So every lender is able togenerate their own business,
which I'd be very fortunate tohave been able to give back to a
lot of my agents that way aswell, with buyers and potential
sellers too.
SPEAKER_01 (18:03):
Plus it, you know, if you're asking for a referral
business, I feel like you haveto have either something of
value to bring them or like someexperience that you can show
them.
SPEAKER_00 (18:13):
Yeah, I think one thing that agents want in
lending partnership is obviouslystrong communication, make sure
they're fully eloped with what'sgoing on.
Be a problem solver.
You know, things arise, thingspop up.
Find that, find that problem,understand what you can respond
with, and move forward that way.
(18:35):
So, yeah, I think a lot ofpeople want people that are
gonna be a value to them.
Not just swipe the credit card,grab lunch.
It's not that's not reallyproviding value.
You just buy them food for theday or around a golf or
whatever, but actually be aproblem solver.
Under know your no loansituations in and out, no
guidelines, find creativesolutions off the top of your
(18:56):
head.
Right, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (18:58):
Yeah, that's when I first started, you know, when
it's like a couple weeks in, Ididn't really understand it.
So I'd go and I'd be like, hey,you want to have like business
relationship?
And you know, no one reallywanted to because I didn't have
anything to bring them.
I was brand new.
Like lenders, lenders, insuranceagents, you know, etc.
(19:19):
And they're like, Well, youknow, we'll take a we'll take a
step back here.
And I was like, okay.
And I I wasn't fully, I didn'trealize what I was, you know,
doing with no valuation, tryingto ask for business until
probably a couple more monthsin, and I was like, you know, I
can't just be asking thesepeople for business.
(19:40):
I need to actually bring themsomething.
And I mean, everyone hassomething to bring to the table.
Like for me, my biggest thing isI have all the time to cater to
your needs, to cater to clients'needs.
And I don't have all theexperience, but I have people in
my office office who are 20 plusyears in the business who I can
ask on, rely on.
(20:00):
But yeah, I just think everyonehas the opportunity to add
something to anything.
SPEAKER_00 (20:07):
Yeah, that's kind of the cool part about this
industry is the barrier to entryis pretty low.
Truthfully, you don't need adegree for it.
So you get people from so manydifferent backgrounds of life,
right?
I work with agents that areformer engineers, former
hospitality workers, formermedical professionals, education
professionals too.
(20:28):
So it's pretty unique to see outpeep where people come from and
how they can apply their pastexperience to growing their
business as an agent or alender.
It's pretty unique to see whatthey do.
So I think it's also importantto be true to yourself.
Don't be someone that you'renot.
Be Alex Laszlo, I'll be NickWiley, don't be someone you're
not.
It's important to obviously haveinspiration so you can learn
(20:53):
from them.
Don't be them, but learn fromthem.
Be your own person, obviously.
People want to work with you,not with a masked version of
you.
That makes sense.
So you'll find out exactly howyou know, or everyone finds out
how they sell, how they interactwith clientele, how they build
their business accordingly basedon how they want to do it.
And then with that, you're gonnanaturally find value with
(21:17):
experience, right?
Through through, you know,whatever you end up deciding to
do, right?
You're gonna have trickytransactions, you're gonna learn
from them, you're gonna be ableto apply that to a future,
future deal.
It's real estate is always,always, always a long-term game.
Right.
It's never a getting quick, makesix figures in one year.
(21:38):
Exactly.
If you do that, great.
It's not likely.
It's gonna take 18 to 24 monthsto really see progress, to see
the fruits of your labor come tofruition, right?
SPEAKER_01 (21:49):
So it's like growing crops.
You gotta plant the seeds,they're not gonna grow in a
night, but they're gonna taketime and the harvest is gonna be
much worse the way.
SPEAKER_00 (21:58):
If everyone was good at it, everyone would be doing
it, right?
You know?
That's why I can now kind ofconfidently say like I've been
in Colorado now for 26 months.
Just yeah, 26 months now.
I'm now really starting to seemy business just ramp up
quickly.
And but it took me two years toreally see that come to
(22:21):
fruition.
So it's some days are gonna bereally tough, some days are
gonna suck, you're gonna lose aclient here and there.
Just keep moving forward, keeppushing forward.
And again, always just every dayis a new day.
Exactly.
Don't reflect on what happenedyesterday or the week before.
Every day's a new day.
You have the ability to dosomething new, and you know who
(22:43):
that next best client or nextbest referral partner of yours
could be right around thecorner.
And you do not want to be in abad mood for that.
You want to be very ready whenthat time frame comes along.
SPEAKER_01 (22:53):
Exactly.
SPEAKER_00 (22:53):
Yep.
SPEAKER_01 (22:54):
Yeah.
I mean, just that's what I wasgonna say.
Yeah, I was talking about thison my first episode for this
podcast, and I was saying, youknow, if you got to take the
time and really learn about yourcraft and really learn about
what you're doing, and you'renot gonna make it overnight, but
you're gonna have it's gonnatake time, it's gonna take
(23:16):
practice, you're gonna fail, butyou'll learn from it and you'll
be better for it.
And I think that the reasonpeople don't succeed is that
when they fail, they think theyfailed, and so they just give up
and they don't keep trying.
For example, I saw aninteresting fact about podcasts
the other day that like 50% orsomething around that fail after
(23:40):
the first three episodes.
So if you get past threeepisodes of a podcast, you're
already in the top 50%.
And I thought that was prettyinteresting because you know you
can apply that to whateveryou're doing, because you know,
as long as you don't give up,you're still gonna succeed.
You don't learn from yourfailures, but it's gonna take
time.
SPEAKER_00 (23:59):
Yep.
You only fail when you give up,right?
A failure is just redirection.
Everyone learns more from theirfailures in life, so it hits
harder than a success.
It weighs harder, right?
A success is always great toexperience, but this the feeling
of failure weighs more than thefeeling of success.
(24:20):
And you don't want that tohappen again.
So you essentially forceyourself to learn that mistake
and don't apply it again, ordon't don't let it happen again.
So and you also only fail whenyou when you quit and give it
up, right?
Not every deal is smooth.
I know lenders that are 15 yearsin the business, 20 years in the
(24:42):
business, same with agents.
We're always learning, we'realways applying new things,
learning how to sell, learninghow to communicate with
clientele, etc.
And people are gonna makemistakes.
It's human nature, right?
So that's bound to happen witheverybody, and don't but don't
let it define you.
(25:02):
You know, just learn from it, uhtake ownership of it as well.
Don't blame it on somebody else.
Take accountability and apply itto yourself and move forward.
And again, there's always morebusiness to get out there, and
you want to be able to put yourbest foot forward accordingly,
right?
SPEAKER_01 (25:22):
What advice would you have for fellow
entrepreneurs?
SPEAKER_00 (25:44):
Find your niche.
Find what you are very good at.
I'm gonna quote Hormozy here.
You try to do as as much ofvolume as you humanly possibly
can so that it's impossible tofail.
You know, whatever that industryis that you want to pursue in,
(26:06):
master it, make thoseconnections, have a certain
niche in it, find out what youare good at, and just give 100%
effort.
If you do anything less, it'snot free.
Right.
So if I had to give any advice,right, not that I feel like I'm
(26:27):
qualified yet to give thisadvice, but just never ever give
up.
Find your niche and just go allin.
You know, if you need to work aside job to pay bills, do it.
Every other hour that you canpossibly put in and make sure
you always make time foryourself.
Go, yeah, just do as doeverything you can to make it
(26:48):
happen.
SPEAKER_02 (26:49):
Yep.
SPEAKER_00 (26:49):
You know, the only person that is in it from start
to finish is yourself, so youhave to want the most of anybody
else.
So do what you can to make ithappen.
SPEAKER_01 (26:58):
Yeah.
One of my uh actually a greatquote from Injaga, funny enough.
They say if you if you wantsomething bad enough, you'll
find a way to make it happen.
And you know, just if you wantit, you gotta work for it.
You actually have to go out andput in the effort and you find
ways to make what you wanthappening 100%.
SPEAKER_00 (27:22):
That's the part of problem solving, right?
You find what's not working,find what would work.
Again, that's gonna be throughtrial and error, and you'll find
a way to make it happen.
Right.
And also, just to reemphasize onthis point I said earlier, do
(27:45):
what works for you and beyourself with it.
Also you take inspiration fromother people, but make sure it's
what works for Alex and whatworks for Nick, not what works
for somebody else.
Because we're all differentpeople, we all are gonna attract
clients a certain way andreferral partners as well.
Be true to yourself.
(28:05):
Don't be someone you're not,right?
SPEAKER_01 (28:07):
Yeah, my my coach says he's like you have to find
people who are like-minded andyou actually get along with and
you click with, because if youdon't, it's just gonna make the
process longer, it's not gonnamake it as fun if you're trying
to switch yourself so that youactually can have an enjoyable
time to working together.
It's better to find someone whois like you and you're like
(28:30):
them.
And if it's not you know,clicking, well, then you might
have to switch and find anotherperson.
Yep.
SPEAKER_02 (28:42):
Yep.
SPEAKER_01 (28:42):
I've got nothing else to say on that.
And then what do you like whatkind of stuff do you do outside
of work to keep yourself frombeing burned out?
SPEAKER_00 (28:52):
For sure.
Burnout is very common in thisbusiness because you never know
when the phone's gonna ring,who's gonna reach out to you,
and what time frames those arelike, right?
Some are very urgent.
Also to drop what you're doingand focus on that.
(29:12):
So one thing I've done, and I'mvery grateful to that I've I've
been able to reach this point isjust set boundaries.
You know, I have a county link,and if someone books time in my
calendar, if I'm availableduring that time, we we will
speak.
But I will always block off timethat I'm not available.
(29:36):
Like we're here today, I blockedoff a full hour for us to be
present in this conversation.
Like I've gotten three phonecalls sitting here, they can
wait.
Right.
You know.
So if people if people get madat you for not picking up the
phone immediately, but if it'san hour or so afterwards, it's
probably not the person I wantto work with, anyways.
unknown (29:59):
So
SPEAKER_00 (30:00):
So set boundaries.
Don't be afraid to say no aswell.
Like in this industry, it's veryeasy to say yes to everything.
Events, clientele, meetings,whatever it may be, and I
definitely fall victim to thatearlier in my career.
But if I can't make an event orif I can't do something because
something in my personal lifetakes priority, I'm not going to
(30:23):
go to it.
I'm going to focus on my own.
I prefer sustainability andlongevity over short-term
short-term gains, right?
Don't get me wrong, every nowand then, yeah, I'll I'll drop
them if I have the bandwidth forit.
But if I don't have thebandwidth for it, I I simply say
no and hopefully there's thenext time that we can play
better for it.
(30:43):
We all have personal lives.
We're all we all need to behealthy as well.
Make sure you eat your lunch.
Make sure you train at least 30minutes a day so you can feel
good about yourself mentally andphysically.
We all have friends, family,significant others, pets.
Like make sure you allocate timeto them because that's that's
(31:04):
super, super important.
And at the end of the day,business isn't forever, but the
people in your life that are forfriends and family for long term
will be.
What's the point of having allthis money and all this success
if you have no one to share itwith?
You know?
I unfortunately know people inmy life that are older that have
dedicated a lot to work and notenough to family and friends,
(31:26):
and now it's biting them, right?
So always just allocate time forthe people in your life.
Not it doesn't always have to bemortgage or real estate related,
right?
We all are people with differentinterests and beliefs, right?
So if you need to put in extrahours one day to make the calls,
(31:47):
send out emails, put your nameout there more, you know, grow
your marketing platform, etcetera, right?
Work on files, do it, right?
Every entrepreneur is gonna haveto work long hours early on, and
even when they have moreestablished systems in place.
But if you go on vacation, Iknow you just went on a European
(32:09):
trip here recently, allocate allyour time into that.
Like you're there, don't befocused on work.
Yeah, just be super presentbecause who knows when you go to
Europe again, you know?
I have a friend last, sorry tocut you off there.
I have a friend who went toEurope last year and he worked
24-7 nights, weekends, holidaysfor a whole year.
(32:32):
Built his business incredibly.
He he made incredible strides inhis first year in the business.
And he said he went to Europelast August or last September,
somewhere in that ballpark in2024.
Didn't touch his phone, didn'trespond to anybody.
He was fully present with hisfamily.
And he said it was the mostrefreshing and rejuvenated he
(32:54):
felt afterwards.
So he could wake up at 11 a.m.,walk down the streets in Paris,
either croissant and coffee, andjust be in no rush.
Right.
We're all human, right?
We we aren't machines, we allcan work hard, but burnout is
real.
Spend time for yourself, enjoytime away from work because work
will always be waiting for youand always be there when you get
(33:16):
back.
SPEAKER_01 (33:17):
So yeah, that's by with those videos that I do
every day.
I said, you know, I'm gonna bein Europe here for I think it
was 10 days.
I said, I don't want to, youknow, even though the videos are
30 seconds to a minute, I waslike, I don't want to do one of
those each day.
I mean, I want to be here andnot have to worry about
anything.
And I think like what you'resaying with boundaries, it's
(33:39):
important to know when to workand when not to work, or to just
enjoy life.
SPEAKER_00 (33:45):
To go back to my one of my friends who we have two in
a contract right now, my one ofmy referral partners who took me
two years to build therelationship with, love in the
pieces, he is a very, veryboundaried person.
And he has no problem settingthose and sticking to them,
which I really respect.
And I've learned from a lot fromthat too.
So, and his business has grownfrom it.
It hasn't shrunk, it hasn'tdecreased, it's it's grown.
(34:09):
So it just goes to show thatboundaries are not gonna hinder
your progression.
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (34:15):
We're gonna go a little off a bit, but I'll I'll
come back to it.
What kind of hobbies do you haveoutside of work?
SPEAKER_00 (34:23):
Yeah.
It's a great leeway from the theprior question.
So when I'm not working, whenI'm not building business, I'm a
big fitness junkie.
I love to stay active, whetherit be playing sports, working
out in my gym, I do triathlontraining as well.
Yeah, so you just did a racerecently?
(34:43):
Back in June.
And I did I did another one inJuly as well.
Yeah.
I'll talk about that in aminute.
But uh I love to push myselfphysically.
Any way I can push my mind andbody that way, I will do it.
I've hiked four teeners.
I've I love to ski in the winteras well, love to hoop as well,
(35:03):
which is great.
Any way I can keep my bodymoving and healthy is more often
than not open to trying itsomeday.
I hosted a roller skating eventa month ago.
Have been roller skating sincehigh school.
Yeah, I just it was fun.
Had a great time doing it.
So that's why I love to dooutside of outside of work is
(35:24):
just could pursue physicalpursuits that way.
I'm also a very big smallbusiness enthusiast too.
You'll never find really find meshopping, big box restaurants or
chain stores.
I always appreciate supportinglocal business, local coffee
shops, restaurants, events goingon, whatever it may be.
(35:46):
I think local business deservesway more money than any
corporate chain, personally.
And any form of coffee, lunch,or happy hour agent meeting that
I have, it's never at Starbucks,never at Panera, never at those
bigger, bigger places.
It's always at a local place.
Don't knock to them.
It's just my preference.
(36:08):
Plus, I think the food and thethe product always tastes
better.
So big farmer's market guy onSundays as well.
And I also love to cook as well.
Love making Mediterranean dishesand Mexican food as well.
So you'll find me doing that.
SPEAKER_01 (36:29):
Yeah.
And then uh tell us about the uhrace you did back in June and
July.
Sure.
SPEAKER_00 (36:36):
So during college, I was just a big meathead in the
gym lifting weights, trying toget as swole as possible, pretty
much.
Two years into that, you know,gained 20 plus pounds and really
put on some good muscle.
I started thinking to myself,just very casually, like, you
know, there's something elsephysically that I would like to
(36:59):
do at some point.
Didn't know what that was, butuh just knew like, okay, you
know, I'll always be aweightlifter, I'll always be
doing this.
But there's gotta be otherthings that I could push myself
to do.
I'm sure you're familiar withNick Bear, who he is
professionally.
He owns a a supplement companydown in Austin, Texas.
(37:22):
He's built an amazing platformover the past 10 years.
I've actually drifted away fromhim for a lot over the past
couple of years here, but Ireally watched him a lot, like
2017 to 2020, that time period.
He did an Iron Man triathlon,which is a two and a half mile
swim, 112-mile bike, and 26-milerun all in the same day.
(37:44):
Back in 2019, did the did a fulldocumentary about it.
Absolutely loved it.
I was like, this is really cool,we'll have to try it someday.
2020 comes around, life changesfor everybody.
You know, gym shut down, andjust me having a very fixed
mindset, and like I'm nevergonna be out of shape.
I'm always gonna take care ofmyself, which I guess is a good
(38:06):
form of stubbornness.
I said, I'm I'm gonna go.
This is I had to move homebecause college was canceled and
moved back home with my parents.
I went back to my high schoollike football field and just did
like sprint drills.
Other guys I used to I graduatedwith did that as well, and we
(38:27):
all actually hung out a goodamount during that you know few
month period, which I which isactually pretty pretty cool
looking back on it now.
But we yeah, sprint drills, werun on the trails behind the
school because I grew up in NewHampshire.
And really just kind of got moreinto endurance training, pretty
much.
And we ran a marathon that year,just kind of a dry run.
(38:51):
We one of the guys set up agroup chat when it was like a
Wednesday, saying, Hey, we'rerunning a marathon Sunday, who
wants to join?
And with nothing going on, we'relike, sure, let's let's do it,
let's let's try it out.
I've never felt more in pain inmy life than come like mile
18-19, ended up finishing it,and that was incredibly
(39:13):
rewarding to experience that,and I want to do that again.
I then saw in the end of 2020that a guy out of Florida with
Down syndrome completed the fullIron Man, and I was like, that's
incredibly impressive.
Yeah that is that's likeuncharted territory for us.
(39:36):
Not that we're discounting thosepeople by any means, but to see
someone who has those just thosedaily struggles go and achieve
something like that, there's noway that I can't do that as
well.
So February 2021 signed up for afull Iron Man and just trained
for seven or eight months, justworking in the mortgage business
(39:59):
during a crazy time period.
Also, somehow found a way totrain for that.
My girlfriend at the time brokeup things I was training too
much, and I was like, well,clearly not meant to be.
And I ended up completing thefull Iron Man in October of
2021.
So about four years ago, I didthat.
And I've always just stuck withthat, and I've always loved it
(40:19):
since then.
I've done a variety of racessince then.
The one in June, though, wasactually the first race I I just
I DNF'd at.
Every person who does triathlonsis bound to have a race where
they don't finish it.
And this was my first one.
And the swim was great,finishing a good time there.
The bike was really toughbecause it got really hot out.
Remember that heat wave we hadback in like June, early July?
(40:40):
That was the first weekend wehad it.
I was training in weather thatwas not acclimated to that
100-degree heat yet.
So mile five on the run comesaround.
I am beat tired.
Like I am sweaty, I've my trisuits unzipped fully, I've ice
just coming like in and out ofthe jersey.
It was I was a mess pretty much.
(41:03):
And I remember the mile five aidstation, I came around, put my
hands on my knees, and then I Ipassed out, hit the grass, and I
woke up shortly after that.
But people in the Iron Man raceare always super positive and
uplifting.
You know, you got this, keepgoing, you're doing great.
And this was the first time outof all the races I've done, I've
(41:25):
heard, hey, you're you're notlooking great.
You should probably stop racing.
And when I heard someone who wasan Iron Man employee say that, I
was like, probably a good thing.
I should probably drop out.
So I ended up dropping out.
My my knee hurt like crazy, soit was cramping up.
But yeah, somehow, some way,managed to go 62 miles, 63
(41:47):
miles, something like that.
So had to get enough out ofthat.
And then I did a smaller raceback in July, and that was a
great time.
I finished that in about threeand a half hours.
And that was a lot of fun too,both up in Boulder.
SPEAKER_01 (41:58):
Oh, nice.
Um then bringing it back, how doyou connect those hobbies and
interests into your business?
SPEAKER_00 (42:09):
Totally.
I think the conversation of whatdo you do for work amongst
adults is just such an easyconversation starter.
And when people ask me, hey,what do you do for work?
I always say I'm I work inmortgage and I help people
finance their houses.
And with that, homeownership isbound to come up in everyone's
(42:29):
financial picture at some pointin their life, whether you're
25, 35, or 45 or above that.
Owning property throughout thecourse of your life is
essentially expected to be apart of everyone's future,
right?
Or present, even for thatmatter.
So I'm a part of a triathlonteam.
I've nurtured some leads tothat.
(42:50):
Haven't closed anything from ityet, but I've nurtured some
business from there.
I've also nurtured business fromthe gyms I go to, the small
business I go to, two coffeeshops, different restaurants.
You know, I'm a luckily a prettybig extrovert, so I just enjoy
talking to new people.
And with that, you know, justthe conversations continue and
(43:13):
people ask questions becausethey are they're going to
consider buying a home at somepoint.
They ask me what rates are at,what do I think the market's
gonna look like, and I just givethem honest advice and exchange
information that way.
And then I do have a every othermonth an email going out to
those prospective people, justlike a newsletter update.
(43:34):
Yeah.
And they don't have they're notnecessarily like trying to sell
you anything, it's just updateson myself and if I've made moves
or what I'm up to kind ofpersonally that way.
And then also market updateshere and there too.
But just so people havesomething in their inbox, right?
(43:55):
I I'm not dumb.
I know more often that it'sgoing right in the right in the
trash bin, but again, just thethe constant state of being in
flow with people is gonna, youknow, gonna reward you.
Staying fresh in their mind.
Yep.
Have you run into selling at allor been a part of their programs
at all?
No, I haven't.
They have a very key uh subjectcalled active and passive flow.
(44:17):
So active flow is what we'redoing right now, having that
live conversation.
It could be over the phone,FaceTime, we're texting.
So we're having activeconversation in one way, shape,
or form.
Passive flow is all thingsmarketing.
You know, they see your emailsgo out, they see your social
media posts, but they they seeyour face, they see your name,
(44:38):
they see who you are and whatyou do, and you're talking about
what you do.
The more often you stay in flowwith people, the better.
Oftentimes it takes people sevento seven touch points to for
them to click in their head,Alex a realtor.
Alex is a realtor, my bad.
Nick is a mortgage broker, likethat's what he does.
It takes multiple touch points,right?
(44:59):
So when you're constantly juststaying in flow with people,
that's a great thing.
And luckily, I've made some goodconnections from my other
outlets of life, and it's beenable to translate to, you know,
some business my way.
SPEAKER_01 (45:12):
I heard another thing the other day that said it
takes people seven hours totrust you.
So, and you know, you don'talways have seven hours to give
them.
But if you're posting videosthat are, you know, minute long,
then you're gaining those hoursand gaining that trust slowly
through that.
SPEAKER_00 (45:33):
And just make sure what you're saying is
knowledgeable, right?
It's interesting.
A decent, well enough editedvideo.
And yeah, it doesn't have to belong.
It can be short, it can be 30seconds, but make sure what
you're saying is valuable andeducational.
And yeah, that's that's Ihaven't heard that before.
Seven hours to build trust.
(45:54):
It makes sense.
So you can lose that trust witha snap of a finger, right?
But to build, I mean, I guess itgoes kind of goes hand in hand
with the the the Rails reporterI have, who I've talked about
twice now.
It took two years to reallybuild that very good, consistent
relationship.
And not that it was bad by anymeans.
We've never had a badconversation by any metric, but
(46:16):
yeah, it takes takes time tobuild that trust and build that
build that relationship.
SPEAKER_01 (46:20):
Yeah, because um I think another thing with the
videos is you're not oversellingthem, uh overselling a small
crowd with the videos.
You're just consistently puttinga mouse, staying fresh in
people's mind.
Agreed.
Yeah, absolutely agree.
All right, well, as we'rewrapping up here, you got any
final thoughts.
SPEAKER_00 (46:43):
I'll turn I'll turn the page over to you.
So I know we met for the firsttime two months ago.
Yeah, probably back in July.
Somewhere in that range, right?
Three months ago then.
So you're fresh out of highschool.
Just I guess tell me why realestate, why not college, why not
(47:04):
something different?
What prompted you to get rightinto it out of school?
SPEAKER_01 (47:08):
Yeah, I've always wanted to be an entrepreneur,
always wanted to own business.
And you know, as a you're young,you always think you have to go
to college and get a businessdegree to do that.
I do.
Yeah.
And so, you know, I was planningto go to college for probably
until junior year, and then Iwas like, Well, I don't really
know if I want to go to college.
(47:28):
And then senior year camearound, and I was like, I really
don't want to go to college.
And my dad was like, You'regonna have to do something with
your life.
And I was like, Yeah, but Idon't know what that is.
And so he's like, Okay, comemeet my real estate friend and
we'll have lunch.
And so just talking with him,having lunch with him, I was
like, you know, real estateseems pretty cool.
I'll, you know, look into it,see what, see what it's like.
(47:52):
Um, and then kind of went offfrom there and got I did real
estate school and normal schoolat the same time and got fully
licensed about the same time Igraduated high school and then
just jumped right into it.
And I have a couple friends whoare going to college for real
estate, and I thought that wasthe stupidest thing I've ever
(48:15):
heard.
Because they're like, oh, I wantthe experience of going to
college, but you're gonna befour years behind and however
much in debt.
And so I mean that's really thereason I jumped into real
estate, is I just liked how it'syour own business, but you're
worth it with someone, so youkind of have a help to rely on
(48:36):
and you're not just startingfrom scratch.
And I'd like, you know, justthat you can connect with
whoever you want, whenever youwant.
It's just kind of uh a uniquefield to be in.
SPEAKER_00 (48:50):
For sure.
That's great to hear.
I guess it really depends onwhat they're going to school
for.
If they're trying to be in likecommercial real estate
financing, oh they they'regetting business degrees.
So they're getting a businessdegree to then become an agent
after?
Yeah.
Interesting.
(49:10):
Okay.
Yeah.
I can confidently say this onbehalf of my education in
school, this high school andparts of college.
I did not take educationseriously in high school or
parts of college as well.
I was a bit entitled, just beingtransparent there.
And I remember taking a financeclass that went over mortgages
(49:31):
in school and thought that wasalways pretty interesting.
So the only thing I will sayabout college that I thought was
a benefit was it exposed me todifferent things because I
didn't know I wanted to be alender going into college,
right?
It exposed me to differentfields, different industries,
but it also gave me a lot ofconnections as well.
(49:53):
I've met my significant otherthere.
I've met she's everything I've Iwant and more.
I have some of my best friendsfrom college.
The how I got into pretty muchthe mortgage business as a full
was from a connection fromcollege, right?
So I think college is going tobe really, really good for
people if long term to buildconnections into possibly help
(50:18):
with employment, help maybe youhelp them buy or sell property
in the future.
So college, I would say, is abenefit in that category where
it can expose you to differentfields if you don't know what
you want to do yet.
You you were pretty confidentthat you didn't want to go to
school and you wanted to pursuereal estate.
So different story there foryou.
But for me, I knew I wanted towork in financial services just
(50:39):
to know which route I wanted togo into.
And plus, I'm also veryfortunate where my parents had
over 80% of my college save for.
Yeah.
Super notable.
Yeah.
No intention to pay this offanytime soon.
So it's a it's a$180 per monthpayment, super cheap.
(51:01):
So I think college is beneficialif you're not coming out of
school with six figures of debt,even five figures of debt for
most people.
You can enter a career that youcan have higher knee potential.
And then number three is theconnections.
I like if it I guess it depends,right?
(51:25):
No major is a bad major, butthere are majors with har with
higher ROIs than others.
So I think that if you are goingto go to school, just weigh your
options.
You also don't have to go toschool immediately.
You can go to school at 19, youcan go to school at 22 or 25 if
you want to, right?
Or 18.
So I would say college isbeneficial for those three
(51:46):
things, you know, exposure,networking, and I forget the
other part that I said, but Iwould see I would say that is
the is the benefit of going.
But it's to say it's a aprerequisite to success in a
real estate field as an agent,as a lender, is just so not
true.
(52:06):
You know, it's not.
Do I think that, you know, notagain, I don't know the people
that you're referring to, but Iwould say you'll probably learn
more in your four years as anactual agent than reading out of
a textbook for sure.
SPEAKER_01 (52:19):
Because the other thing is the when you're in real
estate school, they aren'tteaching you really about real
estate.
They're teaching you how to passthe test.
SPEAKER_00 (52:29):
Like going through the 40 hours, they're just
teaching how to pass the exam.
Yep, they're teaching you how topass the exam.
It's similar with the mortgageexam.
It's like 20 hours ofpre-licensing and then you take
an exam.
It's just brute forcememorization on things that do
not you do not really need toknow.
There's you don't get wrong, youneed to know Trid, RESTPA, all
the things, but the computertells you pretty much the
(52:50):
majority of that, right?
It doesn't actually teach youhow to sell, how to listen to
your clients, how to advocatefor your clients, how to manage
your process behind the scenes.
Like it just teaches you to passan exam and then you're kind of
left to figure it out for yourown, unless you have a good
mentor willing to teach youthings.
(53:10):
So it's all subjective.
I think whichever path peoplechoose, it's right for them in
that very moment.
But yeah, to say that realestate school is a prerequisite
of success is just not the case.
SPEAKER_01 (53:23):
Yep.
SPEAKER_00 (53:24):
Mm-hmm.
SPEAKER_01 (53:27):
Already at our one hour mark.
SPEAKER_00 (53:30):
Cool.
Well, thank you for having me,Alex.
SPEAKER_01 (53:32):
Thank you for taking the time.
Of course.
SPEAKER_00 (53:34):
I'm glad we got to be in person and and chat and
have good conversations.
So really appreciate it.
SPEAKER_01 (53:39):
I really enjoyed it.
Yeah.
Welcome to Timeless Movement.
I'm your host, Alexander Laszlo,and I'm here joined by Nick
White.
Appreciate you having me.
Yeah, thank you for coming on.
Of course.
So tell us a little bit aboutyou.
SPEAKER_00 (00:12):
For sure.
So my name's Nick White.
I'm a mortgage broker withthree-point mortgage here in
Denver.
I work all throughout the stateof Colorado, primarily here on
the Denver Metro, but also havesome deals up north of Fort
Collins, Sound Springs as well.
Nothing out west in themountains yet, but only a matter
of time.
I'm originally from the state ofNew Hampshire.
Moved out here two years ago inAugust of 2023, and it's been
(00:35):
everything I've wanted and moreliving in Colorado.
It's a lot of fun.
It's been such a fulfillingexperience, and very grateful to
make the move.
And yeah, it's been great.
SPEAKER_01 (00:45):
Yeah.
So how'd you get into themortgage world?
SPEAKER_00 (00:49):
For sure.
I always knew going into comingout of college, I wanted to be
involved in financial services,some way, shape, or form.
And mortgage was the route thatI just initially went with.
And I've been at it out since Ipretty much graduated school
five years ago.
So I've had a variety ofdifferent roles in the industry,
(01:10):
but now I'm a full-timeoriginator.
I've been doing that for threeyears now.
And it's been, yeah, it's been alot of fun that way.
And I don't see myself goinganywhere else anytime soon.
SPEAKER_01 (01:19):
Nice.
So you said you've been in therefive years?
Four and a half, technically,coming up on my fifth year.
Yep.
So what were your uh firstcouple years like?
SPEAKER_00 (01:28):
Uh it was definitely during a very busy time period
in just real estate in generalacross the country.
Inventory was constantlydecreasing on a month-over-month
basis.
This was during the coronaviruspandemic.
Right.
Refies were just off the shelf.
People, everyone wasrefinancing, residential and
commercial.
So my first job was more so asales role for other loan
(01:51):
officers across the country,just helping them maintain their
databases, build newrelationships, stay in front of
their referral partners andtheir clientele, and just
consistently try to find newways to prospect business that
way.
I did that for about a year anda half.
SPEAKER_01 (02:06):
Nice.
So, what did you do to like findsuccess and find business when
you first started?
SPEAKER_00 (02:14):
Yeah, I think that's probably better for that's a
better question for when I movedhere, I would say.
So I got fully licensed in 2022,and that was the year that the
market, the market reallyflipped.
We went from 3% rates up toseven in the span of probably
(02:37):
six months.
So buyers pretty much put thebrakes on everything.
Like, wait, my mortgage paymentjust went up 150%.
It would have been six monthsago.
Like that's we should probablyput a pause on it real quick.
People stopped overbidding forhouses, they sat on the silence
a lot more.
So the buyer pool really shrunkin 2022 and 2023.
(02:59):
So I did close a handful ofdeals in 2023 and was making it
actually made a transition to anew company in 2022.
So didn't close any deals for myown, per se, in 2022, but in uh
2023, that's when I I startedclosing more business.
That was also the year I madethe move out to Colorado.
So money was definitely prettytight and had to make things
(03:22):
work.
And one thing I've realized nowthat I've been in the business
here in Colorado for over twoyears, is it is incredibly
important to stay true to yourword.
If you say you're gonna dosomething, do it.
Don't just, you know, sell a bagof crap and not proceed with it.
(03:46):
So one thing that I've learnedis if you say you're gonna
commit to a certain service, acertain marketing program, a
certain way of communicatingwith clientele, stick to it and
always find ways to sharpen thatknife, be more, be better on a
daily basis.
(04:18):
One thing I've done, I'm proudof myself for this, is just
surround myself with people thatare in it to win it.
Not just other lenders, butagents, people in financial
planning, CPAs, insuranceagents, people that aren't in
that referral-based industry.
So one, I guess to answer yourquestion, long story short, here
is uh constantly just learn.
(04:41):
Education is invaluable.
Always take opportunities tolearn and educate yourself on
how you can become a better, abetter uh agent, better lender,
better lender, whatever industryyou're in.
And just surround yourself withpeople who are out there to get
it.
They're in it to win it.
They're and they and they do allthe things that I just
mentioned.
They're they're constantlylearning, they're finding new
(05:01):
ways to prospect, finding newways to improve their processes.
And my development as an LO,especially over the past two
years, has been pretty prettyamazing to see.
Not trying to toot my horn thereby any means, but I can
definitely be let me repeat thatactually.
(05:23):
I have just I've experienced alot of different clientele and
different files that comethrough.
So the I think my ability toproblem solve and my ability to
get things done have hasdrastically improved, which has
then resulted in me being ableto close more business that way.
So be a problem solver, don't bea problem creator in the
(05:46):
business.
And and when you do have thosego-to clients, go-to referral
partners, make sure that it's avery equal exchange and
relationship, not one-sided.
It's always a two-way street.
SPEAKER_01 (05:58):
Yep.
Yeah, I was golfing with thisguy from the hospitality
business a couple weeks back.
And kind of off your point, hewas like, Yeah, I moved out here
in Colorado, and I was surprisedit's just a pool of lazy people.
He's like, the people whoactually do stuff and get stuff
done are the ones who succeed,and the ones who are just
sitting there waiting for it,just they don't get anything,
(06:20):
and then they complain about it.
SPEAKER_00 (06:22):
One thing that is I think it's pretty unfortunate to
hear time and time again.
Every time I meet with a newagent, one of my referral
partners, an agent I'm buildinga relationship with, right?
About 75% of my business comesfrom real realtors.
That's where I make most of mymoney and get most of my
(06:43):
clientele.
One thing I always ask them iswhat are you looking for in a
mortgage broker, a lender?
What qualities do you want tosee?
What attributes do you want tosee in me?
The number one answer, 90% ofthe time, is communicate with
me.
(07:03):
The fact that that has to bespoken about time and time again
is pretty disheartening to hearbecause it's kind of the number
one point of our job is we talkto each other.
We are problem solving, we areworking together.
These are people's homes, we'rehelping them buy and sell, and
(07:24):
for me, finance them.
Every client is treated thesame.
And you know, it's up to us tomake sure that everyone's on the
same page with that.
So to hear so many agents justsay, just communicate with me,
shows that they've had badexperiences with lenders before
that.
SPEAKER_02 (07:41):
Yep.
SPEAKER_00 (07:42):
And it it just frustrates me because that
should just be the standard.
It shouldn't have to be an itshouldn't have to be an ask.
You know, it should just be thestandard.
And that's something that Ipersonally just been like, wow.
The the level of laziness,maybe, or procrastination?
Procrastination is one of them.
(08:03):
I'd say probably the theattention to detail with the
majority of people here, and notto talk smack about anybody in
particular, but it you wouldthink that there'd just be a
higher level of accountabilityand a higher level of detail
there.
And it's just unfortunate to seethat time and time again.
So bring it back going back toyour point of there's a lot of
(08:24):
people who are lazy.
I don't know if it's just acolor route of thing.
I'm from the East Coast whereeveryone is just going 110 miles
an hour.
Yep.
But yeah, I think it's justreally important to just hold
yourself accountable as anentrepreneurial business and you
don't have a boss you knowtelling you what to do.
It's you're you are your ownboss.
(08:45):
So hold yourself accountable tothe standard that you would want
to be held to.
SPEAKER_01 (08:50):
Yeah.
And I mean, it's like 10 minutesmaybe out of your way just to
you know talk to someone on thephone to like a minute to text
them.
It's not it's really not thathard.
Like minimum, you should betexting them with updates.
SPEAKER_00 (09:05):
That's the other funny part.
It's such it's such not a timesuck either.
SPEAKER_01 (09:09):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (09:10):
It's it's it's a it's maybe max like 10 minutes
out of your day.
I mean, if you have multiplefiles under your belt, like it
may take more than that, butit's still less than an hour of
your time each day just to makesure everyone that you're
working with on certain filesare informed and they're they
know what they're doing,especially your the agent
(09:32):
partner slash lender partner,and then also your back office
team, so your TC, the loanprocessor, underwriter, any
assistants that are on the team.
And then most importantly, yourclients.
Our clients are how we get paid,our clients are who choose us.
Hold up, set set yourself up forthat higher standard, and more
(09:53):
business will come your way inthe long term.
Exactly.
SPEAKER_01 (09:58):
So, in what ways have you connected with um
fellow business people andlike-minded business partners to
gain some business?
What ways have I connected withthem?
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (10:09):
Yeah, I think with every single individual that you
meet, you most likely have atleast one thing in common with
them.
That is I'm pretty concrete inmy brain about that.
Like, I guarantee in ourconversation here today, and
this is our first time meeting,you and I will find something
that we share in common.
(10:31):
I'll give you an example.
One of my better agent partners,he's with EXP, met him probably
two or three months after Imoved out here through a mutual
connection that him and I had.
He made it very clear to me,he's like, I have my guy, like
I'm very locked in with him.
He has a great job, and youknow, we can be friends, but I
can't promise you business.
Right.
(10:51):
I said, not a problem.
And he's a great producer, hedoes a good amount of business
for himself.
And just over time, you know, westay in flow, we stay in contact
with each other, build thatlong-term sustainable
relationship, and we found outwe both really enjoyed golfing.
So we've hit the range, we'vehit the range, we've hit the
(11:11):
course together countlessoccasions, right?
And we just we found out similarsenses of humor, similar other
interests, and we just havebecome better friends than
business partners.
And now we have two undercontract right now, possibly
have everyone here by theweekend.
Nice.
And that's really rewarding, youknow, to see two years of work
(11:33):
really come into play and seethe results of that come
through, which is reallyexciting.
So to answer your question, andnot to, I guess, flex there, but
to answer your question, you youI guarantee more often than not,
you have something in commonwith them.
And don't be like asking justquestion after question to get
(11:53):
to it, but it's just naturallygonna come up in conversation.
Maybe you follow each other onsocial media and you just find
similar interests that way too.
So it can be something as youknow easy, like simple as golf.
It's pretty popular.
SPEAKER_02 (12:07):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (12:07):
An agent friend of mine back in New Hampshire, we
both like the same smoothie fromthe same smoothie shop.
We've built a relationship offthat.
It's just funny things, right?
So that's with every client,too.
You probably have something incommon and find a way to build
that relationship with thembased off that and find out what
else you have in common fromthere.
SPEAKER_01 (12:25):
Yeah, it's pretty funny how many people actually
like golf.
Like I've probably gained two orthree new connections just from
one round of golf.
You know, just I never realizedhow many people were actually
into the sport.
It's a lot.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (12:40):
I think it's I've played more golf um nowadays
than I ever have in my entirelife.
And I I enjoy it.
It's something I'm a bigphysical, like not specimen,
that's a bad way to put it, butI like to work out and I like to
be you know outside and active.
And golf's just a great way tobe outside and be active, but
(13:02):
also network and connect andjust be with people for an
extended period of time.
So as I've also learned it'speople think of you a little bit
higher if you're good at golf.
Yeah.
So if you can shoot nine yearlevels, pretty competitive out
there.
SPEAKER_01 (13:15):
What was that?
They get pretty competitive outthere.
SPEAKER_00 (13:18):
Yeah.
If you're you know consistentlyputting your first shot into the
fairway and everything, andyou're hitting your putts,
you'll be a bit more respected,which I think is pretty, pretty
funny that way.
Apollo later, sorry.
SPEAKER_01 (13:30):
Yeah, I'll get so what do you do to overcome
obstacles and ceilings when theyarise?
SPEAKER_00 (13:43):
What do I do to overcome obstacles and ceilings
when they arrive?
That's an enormous part of alender's job.
You know, not every file isgonna be squeaky clean.
Some clients are gonna rate shopyou.
Not every deal is just gonna bebutter.
It's not gonna be super smooth,right?
So I think it's important toreally listen to the client
(14:04):
need.
You know, why are what are theyexperiencing, whether it be on a
financial basis, potentially apersonal basis, et cetera, et
cetera.
What is the client looking for?
What do they need?
And just listen to them.
Ask them questions, don't pushthe sale.
(14:25):
Ask them questions, hear themout.
When people feel heard andunderstood, they're gonna be
feel more valued by you, they'regonna feel more inclined to work
with you.
So listen, pause between, youknow, responding because it
shows you're gonna process theinformation, process that
question, ask smart questions inreturn.
(14:45):
And lending, you can be prettycreative with it.
There is obviously a variety ofguidelines you have to follow,
but at the same time, you canget creative with it, especially
in the broker world, which iswhere I'm at now.
So use your resources too.
There are people, I guaranteethere are people within your
company that have experienced acertain situation before and
(15:07):
they can guide you through it.
So don't be afraid to rely onyour resources, but also you
know, you're there's gonna bemost for you to figure out on
your own and make sure that youput in your best foot that way.
So the way that I've gone aboutovercoming obstacles and
ceilings is I listen to myclients.
I uh I ask them what theirconcerns are and why are they
(15:28):
you know feeling a certain way.
Listen to them, make surethey're heard, make sure they're
they feel understood, and thenprovide the solution come up
with the solution.
Try to figure out on your own atfirst.
And if you're truly stumped, youwe have people that we can work
with to ask those questions.
SPEAKER_01 (15:44):
Yeah, no, that's I like that because it shows you
really communicate, really careabout the client.
And you know, some not everyonedoes that, which is unfortunate,
but you know, the ones who dolike you will find your success.
It's nice to see.
Try to.
Okay.
Thanks.
So, like kind of a question offthat question what about when
(16:07):
you're stuck trying to findclients?
SPEAKER_00 (16:12):
Stuck trying to find clients?
Yeah.
Like what do I do?
SPEAKER_02 (16:14):
Yep.
SPEAKER_00 (16:16):
I think my lineup works a little bit different
than yours, where I will hit thephones, slide in DMs, and go
target new agents.
You know, people, you never knowwhere people are going to end up
in their real estate career.
And I always want to make surethat I am a person that they
know from the beginning.
So whether it's new agents, moreexperienced agents, even, we
(16:39):
have a software called MMI wherewe are able to prospect
realtors, see what theirproduction looks like, who they
work with for mortgage partners.
Um, if someone works at mycompany three point, I'm not
going to prospect them.
They already have a standingrelationship with someone there.
But if I see a good producerthat has worked with a variety
of age lenders and not just onein particular, I'll reach out.
(17:02):
If I see there's clearly anoutstanding relationship, they
close 30 deals, 20 members witha certain lender, it's pretty
clear they're locked in withsomeone that is that works, they
work well with them.
So to find a new business, I amalways, I'm always prospecting.
I always allocate at least anhour a day to prospect, to reach
out to people on social media,meet set up meetings just like
(17:25):
this to build a relationshipthat way, which in turn will
lead to clientele.
And then I'm also a firmbeliever that a lender should
generate their own business.
There's no reason why you know alender should just keep
continuously asked for referralsfrom agents.
There's also, you know, ifyou're marketing on social
(17:46):
media, there's no way you can'tgenerate your own business from
your own sphere, right?
We all have friends, we all havefamily, former coworkers, etc.
So every lender is able togenerate their own business,
which I'd be very fortunate tohave been able to give back to a
lot of my agents that way aswell, with buyers and potential
sellers too.
SPEAKER_01 (18:03):
Plus it, you know, if you're asking for a referral
business, I feel like you haveto have either something of
value to bring them or like someexperience that you can show
them.
SPEAKER_00 (18:13):
Yeah, I think one thing that agents want in
lending partnership is obviouslystrong communication, make sure
they're fully eloped with what'sgoing on.
Be a problem solver.
You know, things arise, thingspop up.
Find that, find that problem,understand what you can respond
with, and move forward that way.
(18:35):
So, yeah, I think a lot ofpeople want people that are
gonna be a value to them.
Not just swipe the credit card,grab lunch.
It's not that's not reallyproviding value.
You just buy them food for theday or around a golf or
whatever, but actually be aproblem solver.
Under know your no loansituations in and out, no
guidelines, find creativesolutions off the top of your
(18:56):
head.
Right, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (18:58):
Yeah, that's when I first started, you know, when
it's like a couple weeks in, Ididn't really understand it.
So I'd go and I'd be like, hey,you want to have like business
relationship?
And you know, no one reallywanted to because I didn't have
anything to bring them.
I was brand new.
Like lenders, lenders, insuranceagents, you know, etc.
(19:19):
And they're like, Well, youknow, we'll take a we'll take a
step back here.
And I was like, okay.
And I I wasn't fully, I didn'trealize what I was, you know,
doing with no valuation, tryingto ask for business until
probably a couple more monthsin, and I was like, you know, I
can't just be asking thesepeople for business.
(19:40):
I need to actually bring themsomething.
And I mean, everyone hassomething to bring to the table.
Like for me, my biggest thing isI have all the time to cater to
your needs, to cater to clients'needs.
And I don't have all theexperience, but I have people in
my office office who are 20 plusyears in the business who I can
ask on, rely on.
(20:00):
But yeah, I just think everyonehas the opportunity to add
something to anything.
SPEAKER_00 (20:07):
Yeah, that's kind of the cool part about this
industry is the barrier to entryis pretty low.
Truthfully, you don't need adegree for it.
So you get people from so manydifferent backgrounds of life,
right?
I work with agents that areformer engineers, former
hospitality workers, formermedical professionals, education
professionals too.
(20:28):
So it's pretty unique to see outpeep where people come from and
how they can apply their pastexperience to growing their
business as an agent or alender.
It's pretty unique to see whatthey do.
So I think it's also importantto be true to yourself.
Don't be someone that you'renot.
Be Alex Laszlo, I'll be NickWiley, don't be someone you're
not.
It's important to obviously haveinspiration so you can learn
(20:53):
from them.
Don't be them, but learn fromthem.
Be your own person, obviously.
People want to work with you,not with a masked version of
you.
That makes sense.
So you'll find out exactly howyou know, or everyone finds out
how they sell, how they interactwith clientele, how they build
their business accordingly basedon how they want to do it.
And then with that, you're gonnanaturally find value with
(21:17):
experience, right?
Through through, you know,whatever you end up deciding to
do, right?
You're gonna have trickytransactions, you're gonna learn
from them, you're gonna be ableto apply that to a future,
future deal.
It's real estate is always,always, always a long-term game.
Right.
It's never a getting quick, makesix figures in one year.
(21:38):
Exactly.
If you do that, great.
It's not likely.
It's gonna take 18 to 24 monthsto really see progress, to see
the fruits of your labor come tofruition, right?
SPEAKER_01 (21:49):
So it's like growing crops.
You gotta plant the seeds,they're not gonna grow in a
night, but they're gonna taketime and the harvest is gonna be
much worse the way.
SPEAKER_00 (21:58):
If everyone was good at it, everyone would be doing
it, right?
You know?
That's why I can now kind ofconfidently say like I've been
in Colorado now for 26 months.
Just yeah, 26 months now.
I'm now really starting to seemy business just ramp up
quickly.
And but it took me two years toreally see that come to
(22:21):
fruition.
So it's some days are gonna bereally tough, some days are
gonna suck, you're gonna lose aclient here and there.
Just keep moving forward, keeppushing forward.
And again, always just every dayis a new day.
Exactly.
Don't reflect on what happenedyesterday or the week before.
Every day's a new day.
You have the ability to dosomething new, and you know who
(22:43):
that next best client or nextbest referral partner of yours
could be right around thecorner.
And you do not want to be in abad mood for that.
You want to be very ready whenthat time frame comes along.
SPEAKER_01 (22:53):
Exactly.
SPEAKER_00 (22:53):
Yep.
SPEAKER_01 (22:54):
Yeah.
I mean, just that's what I wasgonna say.
Yeah, I was talking about thison my first episode for this
podcast, and I was saying, youknow, if you got to take the
time and really learn about yourcraft and really learn about
what you're doing, and you'renot gonna make it overnight, but
you're gonna have it's gonnatake time, it's gonna take
(23:16):
practice, you're gonna fail, butyou'll learn from it and you'll
be better for it.
And I think that the reasonpeople don't succeed is that
when they fail, they think theyfailed, and so they just give up
and they don't keep trying.
For example, I saw aninteresting fact about podcasts
the other day that like 50% orsomething around that fail after
(23:40):
the first three episodes.
So if you get past threeepisodes of a podcast, you're
already in the top 50%.
And I thought that was prettyinteresting because you know you
can apply that to whateveryou're doing, because you know,
as long as you don't give up,you're still gonna succeed.
You don't learn from yourfailures, but it's gonna take
time.
SPEAKER_00 (23:59):
Yep.
You only fail when you give up,right?
A failure is just redirection.
Everyone learns more from theirfailures in life, so it hits
harder than a success.
It weighs harder, right?
A success is always great toexperience, but this the feeling
of failure weighs more than thefeeling of success.
(24:20):
And you don't want that tohappen again.
So you essentially forceyourself to learn that mistake
and don't apply it again, ordon't don't let it happen again.
So and you also only fail whenyou when you quit and give it
up, right?
Not every deal is smooth.
I know lenders that are 15 yearsin the business, 20 years in the
(24:42):
business, same with agents.
We're always learning, we'realways applying new things,
learning how to sell, learninghow to communicate with
clientele, etc.
And people are gonna makemistakes.
It's human nature, right?
So that's bound to happen witheverybody, and don't but don't
let it define you.
(25:02):
You know, just learn from it, uhtake ownership of it as well.
Don't blame it on somebody else.
Take accountability and apply itto yourself and move forward.
And again, there's always morebusiness to get out there, and
you want to be able to put yourbest foot forward accordingly,
right?
SPEAKER_01 (25:22):
What advice would you have for fellow
entrepreneurs?
SPEAKER_00 (25:44):
Find your niche.
Find what you are very good at.
I'm gonna quote Hormozy here.
You try to do as as much ofvolume as you humanly possibly
can so that it's impossible tofail.
You know, whatever that industryis that you want to pursue in,
(26:06):
master it, make thoseconnections, have a certain
niche in it, find out what youare good at, and just give 100%
effort.
If you do anything less, it'snot free.
Right.
So if I had to give any advice,right, not that I feel like I'm
(26:27):
qualified yet to give thisadvice, but just never ever give
up.
Find your niche and just go allin.
You know, if you need to work aside job to pay bills, do it.
Every other hour that you canpossibly put in and make sure
you always make time foryourself.
Go, yeah, just do as doeverything you can to make it
(26:48):
happen.
SPEAKER_02 (26:49):
Yep.
SPEAKER_00 (26:49):
You know, the only person that is in it from start
to finish is yourself, so youhave to want the most of anybody
else.
So do what you can to make ithappen.
SPEAKER_01 (26:58):
Yeah.
One of my uh actually a greatquote from Injaga, funny enough.
They say if you if you wantsomething bad enough, you'll
find a way to make it happen.
And you know, just if you wantit, you gotta work for it.
You actually have to go out andput in the effort and you find
ways to make what you wanthappening 100%.
SPEAKER_00 (27:22):
That's the part of problem solving, right?
You find what's not working,find what would work.
Again, that's gonna be throughtrial and error, and you'll find
a way to make it happen.
Right.
And also, just to reemphasize onthis point I said earlier, do
(27:45):
what works for you and beyourself with it.
Also you take inspiration fromother people, but make sure it's
what works for Alex and whatworks for Nick, not what works
for somebody else.
Because we're all differentpeople, we all are gonna attract
clients a certain way andreferral partners as well.
Be true to yourself.
(28:05):
Don't be someone you're not,right?
SPEAKER_01 (28:07):
Yeah, my my coach says he's like you have to find
people who are like-minded andyou actually get along with and
you click with, because if youdon't, it's just gonna make the
process longer, it's not gonnamake it as fun if you're trying
to switch yourself so that youactually can have an enjoyable
time to working together.
It's better to find someone whois like you and you're like
(28:30):
them.
And if it's not you know,clicking, well, then you might
have to switch and find anotherperson.
Yep.
SPEAKER_02 (28:42):
Yep.
SPEAKER_01 (28:42):
I've got nothing else to say on that.
And then what do you like whatkind of stuff do you do outside
of work to keep yourself frombeing burned out?
SPEAKER_00 (28:52):
For sure.
Burnout is very common in thisbusiness because you never know
when the phone's gonna ring,who's gonna reach out to you,
and what time frames those arelike, right?
Some are very urgent.
Also to drop what you're doingand focus on that.
(29:12):
So one thing I've done, and I'mvery grateful to that I've I've
been able to reach this point isjust set boundaries.
You know, I have a county link,and if someone books time in my
calendar, if I'm availableduring that time, we we will
speak.
But I will always block off timethat I'm not available.
(29:36):
Like we're here today, I blockedoff a full hour for us to be
present in this conversation.
Like I've gotten three phonecalls sitting here, they can
wait.
Right.
You know.
So if people if people get madat you for not picking up the
phone immediately, but if it'san hour or so afterwards, it's
probably not the person I wantto work with, anyways.
unknown (29:59):
So
SPEAKER_00 (30:00):
So set boundaries.
Don't be afraid to say no aswell.
Like in this industry, it's veryeasy to say yes to everything.
Events, clientele, meetings,whatever it may be, and I
definitely fall victim to thatearlier in my career.
But if I can't make an event orif I can't do something because
something in my personal lifetakes priority, I'm not going to
(30:23):
go to it.
I'm going to focus on my own.
I prefer sustainability andlongevity over short-term
short-term gains, right?
Don't get me wrong, every nowand then, yeah, I'll I'll drop
them if I have the bandwidth forit.
But if I don't have thebandwidth for it, I I simply say
no and hopefully there's thenext time that we can play
better for it.
(30:43):
We all have personal lives.
We're all we all need to behealthy as well.
Make sure you eat your lunch.
Make sure you train at least 30minutes a day so you can feel
good about yourself mentally andphysically.
We all have friends, family,significant others, pets.
Like make sure you allocate timeto them because that's that's
(31:04):
super, super important.
And at the end of the day,business isn't forever, but the
people in your life that are forfriends and family for long term
will be.
What's the point of having allthis money and all this success
if you have no one to share itwith?
You know?
I unfortunately know people inmy life that are older that have
dedicated a lot to work and notenough to family and friends,
(31:26):
and now it's biting them, right?
So always just allocate time forthe people in your life.
Not it doesn't always have to bemortgage or real estate related,
right?
We all are people with differentinterests and beliefs, right?
So if you need to put in extrahours one day to make the calls,
(31:47):
send out emails, put your nameout there more, you know, grow
your marketing platform, etcetera, right?
Work on files, do it, right?
Every entrepreneur is gonna haveto work long hours early on, and
even when they have moreestablished systems in place.
But if you go on vacation, Iknow you just went on a European
(32:09):
trip here recently, allocate allyour time into that.
Like you're there, don't befocused on work.
Yeah, just be super presentbecause who knows when you go to
Europe again, you know?
I have a friend last, sorry tocut you off there.
I have a friend who went toEurope last year and he worked
24-7 nights, weekends, holidaysfor a whole year.
(32:32):
Built his business incredibly.
He he made incredible strides inhis first year in the business.
And he said he went to Europelast August or last September,
somewhere in that ballpark in2024.
Didn't touch his phone, didn'trespond to anybody.
He was fully present with hisfamily.
And he said it was the mostrefreshing and rejuvenated he
(32:54):
felt afterwards.
So he could wake up at 11 a.m.,walk down the streets in Paris,
either croissant and coffee, andjust be in no rush.
Right.
We're all human, right?
We we aren't machines, we allcan work hard, but burnout is
real.
Spend time for yourself, enjoytime away from work because work
will always be waiting for youand always be there when you get
(33:16):
back.
SPEAKER_01 (33:17):
So yeah, that's by with those videos that I do
every day.
I said, you know, I'm gonna bein Europe here for I think it
was 10 days.
I said, I don't want to, youknow, even though the videos are
30 seconds to a minute, I waslike, I don't want to do one of
those each day.
I mean, I want to be here andnot have to worry about
anything.
And I think like what you'resaying with boundaries, it's
(33:39):
important to know when to workand when not to work, or to just
enjoy life.
SPEAKER_00 (33:45):
To go back to my one of my friends who we have two in
a contract right now, my one ofmy referral partners who took me
two years to build therelationship with, love in the
pieces, he is a very, veryboundaried person.
And he has no problem settingthose and sticking to them,
which I really respect.
And I've learned from a lot fromthat too.
So, and his business has grownfrom it.
It hasn't shrunk, it hasn'tdecreased, it's it's grown.
(34:09):
So it just goes to show thatboundaries are not gonna hinder
your progression.
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (34:15):
We're gonna go a little off a bit, but I'll I'll
come back to it.
What kind of hobbies do you haveoutside of work?
SPEAKER_00 (34:23):
Yeah.
It's a great leeway from the theprior question.
So when I'm not working, whenI'm not building business, I'm a
big fitness junkie.
I love to stay active, whetherit be playing sports, working
out in my gym, I do triathlontraining as well.
Yeah, so you just did a racerecently?
(34:43):
Back in June.
And I did I did another one inJuly as well.
Yeah.
I'll talk about that in aminute.
But uh I love to push myselfphysically.
Any way I can push my mind andbody that way, I will do it.
I've hiked four teeners.
I've I love to ski in the winteras well, love to hoop as well,
(35:03):
which is great.
Any way I can keep my bodymoving and healthy is more often
than not open to trying itsomeday.
I hosted a roller skating eventa month ago.
Have been roller skating sincehigh school.
Yeah, I just it was fun.
Had a great time doing it.
So that's why I love to dooutside of outside of work is
(35:24):
just could pursue physicalpursuits that way.
I'm also a very big smallbusiness enthusiast too.
You'll never find really find meshopping, big box restaurants or
chain stores.
I always appreciate supportinglocal business, local coffee
shops, restaurants, events goingon, whatever it may be.
(35:46):
I think local business deservesway more money than any
corporate chain, personally.
And any form of coffee, lunch,or happy hour agent meeting that
I have, it's never at Starbucks,never at Panera, never at those
bigger, bigger places.
It's always at a local place.
Don't knock to them.
It's just my preference.
(36:08):
Plus, I think the food and thethe product always tastes
better.
So big farmer's market guy onSundays as well.
And I also love to cook as well.
Love making Mediterranean dishesand Mexican food as well.
So you'll find me doing that.
SPEAKER_01 (36:29):
Yeah.
And then uh tell us about the uhrace you did back in June and
July.
Sure.
SPEAKER_00 (36:36):
So during college, I was just a big meathead in the
gym lifting weights, trying toget as swole as possible, pretty
much.
Two years into that, you know,gained 20 plus pounds and really
put on some good muscle.
I started thinking to myself,just very casually, like, you
know, there's something elsephysically that I would like to
(36:59):
do at some point.
Didn't know what that was, butuh just knew like, okay, you
know, I'll always be aweightlifter, I'll always be
doing this.
But there's gotta be otherthings that I could push myself
to do.
I'm sure you're familiar withNick Bear, who he is
professionally.
He owns a a supplement companydown in Austin, Texas.
(37:22):
He's built an amazing platformover the past 10 years.
I've actually drifted away fromhim for a lot over the past
couple of years here, but Ireally watched him a lot, like
2017 to 2020, that time period.
He did an Iron Man triathlon,which is a two and a half mile
swim, 112-mile bike, and 26-milerun all in the same day.
(37:44):
Back in 2019, did the did a fulldocumentary about it.
Absolutely loved it.
I was like, this is really cool,we'll have to try it someday.
2020 comes around, life changesfor everybody.
You know, gym shut down, andjust me having a very fixed
mindset, and like I'm nevergonna be out of shape.
I'm always gonna take care ofmyself, which I guess is a good
(38:06):
form of stubbornness.
I said, I'm I'm gonna go.
This is I had to move homebecause college was canceled and
moved back home with my parents.
I went back to my high schoollike football field and just did
like sprint drills.
Other guys I used to I graduatedwith did that as well, and we
(38:27):
all actually hung out a goodamount during that you know few
month period, which I which isactually pretty pretty cool
looking back on it now.
But we yeah, sprint drills, werun on the trails behind the
school because I grew up in NewHampshire.
And really just kind of got moreinto endurance training, pretty
much.
And we ran a marathon that year,just kind of a dry run.
(38:51):
We one of the guys set up agroup chat when it was like a
Wednesday, saying, Hey, we'rerunning a marathon Sunday, who
wants to join?
And with nothing going on, we'relike, sure, let's let's do it,
let's let's try it out.
I've never felt more in pain inmy life than come like mile
18-19, ended up finishing it,and that was incredibly
(39:13):
rewarding to experience that,and I want to do that again.
I then saw in the end of 2020that a guy out of Florida with
Down syndrome completed the fullIron Man, and I was like, that's
incredibly impressive.
Yeah that is that's likeuncharted territory for us.
(39:36):
Not that we're discounting thosepeople by any means, but to see
someone who has those just thosedaily struggles go and achieve
something like that, there's noway that I can't do that as
well.
So February 2021 signed up for afull Iron Man and just trained
for seven or eight months, justworking in the mortgage business
(39:59):
during a crazy time period.
Also, somehow found a way totrain for that.
My girlfriend at the time brokeup things I was training too
much, and I was like, well,clearly not meant to be.
And I ended up completing thefull Iron Man in October of
2021.
So about four years ago, I didthat.
And I've always just stuck withthat, and I've always loved it
(40:19):
since then.
I've done a variety of racessince then.
The one in June, though, wasactually the first race I I just
I DNF'd at.
Every person who does triathlonsis bound to have a race where
they don't finish it.
And this was my first one.
And the swim was great,finishing a good time there.
The bike was really toughbecause it got really hot out.
Remember that heat wave we hadback in like June, early July?
(40:40):
That was the first weekend wehad it.
I was training in weather thatwas not acclimated to that
100-degree heat yet.
So mile five on the run comesaround.
I am beat tired.
Like I am sweaty, I've my trisuits unzipped fully, I've ice
just coming like in and out ofthe jersey.
It was I was a mess pretty much.
(41:03):
And I remember the mile five aidstation, I came around, put my
hands on my knees, and then I Ipassed out, hit the grass, and I
woke up shortly after that.
But people in the Iron Man raceare always super positive and
uplifting.
You know, you got this, keepgoing, you're doing great.
And this was the first time outof all the races I've done, I've
(41:25):
heard, hey, you're you're notlooking great.
You should probably stop racing.
And when I heard someone who wasan Iron Man employee say that, I
was like, probably a good thing.
I should probably drop out.
So I ended up dropping out.
My my knee hurt like crazy, soit was cramping up.
But yeah, somehow, some way,managed to go 62 miles, 63
(41:47):
miles, something like that.
So had to get enough out ofthat.
And then I did a smaller raceback in July, and that was a
great time.
I finished that in about threeand a half hours.
And that was a lot of fun too,both up in Boulder.
SPEAKER_01 (41:58):
Oh, nice.
Um then bringing it back, how doyou connect those hobbies and
interests into your business?
SPEAKER_00 (42:09):
Totally.
I think the conversation of whatdo you do for work amongst
adults is just such an easyconversation starter.
And when people ask me, hey,what do you do for work?
I always say I'm I work inmortgage and I help people
finance their houses.
And with that, homeownership isbound to come up in everyone's
(42:29):
financial picture at some pointin their life, whether you're
25, 35, or 45 or above that.
Owning property throughout thecourse of your life is
essentially expected to be apart of everyone's future,
right?
Or present, even for thatmatter.
So I'm a part of a triathlonteam.
I've nurtured some leads tothat.
(42:50):
Haven't closed anything from ityet, but I've nurtured some
business from there.
I've also nurtured business fromthe gyms I go to, the small
business I go to, two coffeeshops, different restaurants.
You know, I'm a luckily a prettybig extrovert, so I just enjoy
talking to new people.
And with that, you know, justthe conversations continue and
(43:13):
people ask questions becausethey are they're going to
consider buying a home at somepoint.
They ask me what rates are at,what do I think the market's
gonna look like, and I just givethem honest advice and exchange
information that way.
And then I do have a every othermonth an email going out to
those prospective people, justlike a newsletter update.
(43:34):
Yeah.
And they don't have they're notnecessarily like trying to sell
you anything, it's just updateson myself and if I've made moves
or what I'm up to kind ofpersonally that way.
And then also market updateshere and there too.
But just so people havesomething in their inbox, right?
(43:55):
I I'm not dumb.
I know more often that it'sgoing right in the right in the
trash bin, but again, just thethe constant state of being in
flow with people is gonna, youknow, gonna reward you.
Staying fresh in their mind.
Yep.
Have you run into selling at allor been a part of their programs
at all?
No, I haven't.
They have a very key uh subjectcalled active and passive flow.
(44:17):
So active flow is what we'redoing right now, having that
live conversation.
It could be over the phone,FaceTime, we're texting.
So we're having activeconversation in one way, shape,
or form.
Passive flow is all thingsmarketing.
You know, they see your emailsgo out, they see your social
media posts, but they they seeyour face, they see your name,
(44:38):
they see who you are and whatyou do, and you're talking about
what you do.
The more often you stay in flowwith people, the better.
Oftentimes it takes people sevento seven touch points to for
them to click in their head,Alex a realtor.
Alex is a realtor, my bad.
Nick is a mortgage broker, likethat's what he does.
It takes multiple touch points,right?
(44:59):
So when you're constantly juststaying in flow with people,
that's a great thing.
And luckily, I've made some goodconnections from my other
outlets of life, and it's beenable to translate to, you know,
some business my way.
SPEAKER_01 (45:12):
I heard another thing the other day that said it
takes people seven hours totrust you.
So, and you know, you don'talways have seven hours to give
them.
But if you're posting videosthat are, you know, minute long,
then you're gaining those hoursand gaining that trust slowly
through that.
SPEAKER_00 (45:33):
And just make sure what you're saying is
knowledgeable, right?
It's interesting.
A decent, well enough editedvideo.
And yeah, it doesn't have to belong.
It can be short, it can be 30seconds, but make sure what
you're saying is valuable andeducational.
And yeah, that's that's Ihaven't heard that before.
Seven hours to build trust.
(45:54):
It makes sense.
So you can lose that trust witha snap of a finger, right?
But to build, I mean, I guess itgoes kind of goes hand in hand
with the the the Rails reporterI have, who I've talked about
twice now.
It took two years to reallybuild that very good, consistent
relationship.
And not that it was bad by anymeans.
We've never had a badconversation by any metric, but
(46:16):
yeah, it takes takes time tobuild that trust and build that
build that relationship.
SPEAKER_01 (46:20):
Yeah, because um I think another thing with the
videos is you're not oversellingthem, uh overselling a small
crowd with the videos.
You're just consistently puttinga mouse, staying fresh in
people's mind.
Agreed.
Yeah, absolutely agree.
All right, well, as we'rewrapping up here, you got any
final thoughts.
SPEAKER_00 (46:43):
I'll turn I'll turn the page over to you.
So I know we met for the firsttime two months ago.
Yeah, probably back in July.
Somewhere in that range, right?
Three months ago then.
So you're fresh out of highschool.
Just I guess tell me why realestate, why not college, why not
(47:04):
something different?
What prompted you to get rightinto it out of school?
SPEAKER_01 (47:08):
Yeah, I've always wanted to be an entrepreneur,
always wanted to own business.
And you know, as a you're young,you always think you have to go
to college and get a businessdegree to do that.
I do.
Yeah.
And so, you know, I was planningto go to college for probably
until junior year, and then Iwas like, Well, I don't really
know if I want to go to college.
(47:28):
And then senior year camearound, and I was like, I really
don't want to go to college.
And my dad was like, You'regonna have to do something with
your life.
And I was like, Yeah, but Idon't know what that is.
And so he's like, Okay, comemeet my real estate friend and
we'll have lunch.
And so just talking with him,having lunch with him, I was
like, you know, real estateseems pretty cool.
I'll, you know, look into it,see what, see what it's like.
(47:52):
Um, and then kind of went offfrom there and got I did real
estate school and normal schoolat the same time and got fully
licensed about the same time Igraduated high school and then
just jumped right into it.
And I have a couple friends whoare going to college for real
estate, and I thought that wasthe stupidest thing I've ever
(48:15):
heard.
Because they're like, oh, I wantthe experience of going to
college, but you're gonna befour years behind and however
much in debt.
And so I mean that's really thereason I jumped into real
estate, is I just liked how it'syour own business, but you're
worth it with someone, so youkind of have a help to rely on
(48:36):
and you're not just startingfrom scratch.
And I'd like, you know, justthat you can connect with
whoever you want, whenever youwant.
It's just kind of uh a uniquefield to be in.
SPEAKER_00 (48:50):
For sure.
That's great to hear.
I guess it really depends onwhat they're going to school
for.
If they're trying to be in likecommercial real estate
financing, oh they they'regetting business degrees.
So they're getting a businessdegree to then become an agent
after?
Yeah.
Interesting.
(49:10):
Okay.
Yeah.
I can confidently say this onbehalf of my education in
school, this high school andparts of college.
I did not take educationseriously in high school or
parts of college as well.
I was a bit entitled, just beingtransparent there.
And I remember taking a financeclass that went over mortgages
(49:31):
in school and thought that wasalways pretty interesting.
So the only thing I will sayabout college that I thought was
a benefit was it exposed me todifferent things because I
didn't know I wanted to be alender going into college,
right?
It exposed me to differentfields, different industries,
but it also gave me a lot ofconnections as well.
(49:53):
I've met my significant otherthere.
I've met she's everything I've Iwant and more.
I have some of my best friendsfrom college.
The how I got into pretty muchthe mortgage business as a full
was from a connection fromcollege, right?
So I think college is going tobe really, really good for
people if long term to buildconnections into possibly help
(50:18):
with employment, help maybe youhelp them buy or sell property
in the future.
So college, I would say, is abenefit in that category where
it can expose you to differentfields if you don't know what
you want to do yet.
You you were pretty confidentthat you didn't want to go to
school and you wanted to pursuereal estate.
So different story there foryou.
But for me, I knew I wanted towork in financial services just
(50:39):
to know which route I wanted togo into.
And plus, I'm also veryfortunate where my parents had
over 80% of my college save for.
Yeah.
Super notable.
Yeah.
No intention to pay this offanytime soon.
So it's a it's a$180 per monthpayment, super cheap.
(51:01):
So I think college is beneficialif you're not coming out of
school with six figures of debt,even five figures of debt for
most people.
You can enter a career that youcan have higher knee potential.
And then number three is theconnections.
I like if it I guess it depends,right?
(51:25):
No major is a bad major, butthere are majors with har with
higher ROIs than others.
So I think that if you are goingto go to school, just weigh your
options.
You also don't have to go toschool immediately.
You can go to school at 19, youcan go to school at 22 or 25 if
you want to, right?
Or 18.
So I would say college isbeneficial for those three
(51:46):
things, you know, exposure,networking, and I forget the
other part that I said, but Iwould see I would say that is
the is the benefit of going.
But it's to say it's a aprerequisite to success in a
real estate field as an agent,as a lender, is just so not
true.
(52:06):
You know, it's not.
Do I think that, you know, notagain, I don't know the people
that you're referring to, but Iwould say you'll probably learn
more in your four years as anactual agent than reading out of
a textbook for sure.
SPEAKER_01 (52:19):
Because the other thing is the when you're in real
estate school, they aren'tteaching you really about real
estate.
They're teaching you how to passthe test.
SPEAKER_00 (52:29):
Like going through the 40 hours, they're just
teaching how to pass the exam.
Yep, they're teaching you how topass the exam.
It's similar with the mortgageexam.
It's like 20 hours ofpre-licensing and then you take
an exam.
It's just brute forcememorization on things that do
not you do not really need toknow.
There's you don't get wrong, youneed to know Trid, RESTPA, all
the things, but the computertells you pretty much the
(52:50):
majority of that, right?
It doesn't actually teach youhow to sell, how to listen to
your clients, how to advocatefor your clients, how to manage
your process behind the scenes.
Like it just teaches you to passan exam and then you're kind of
left to figure it out for yourown, unless you have a good
mentor willing to teach youthings.
(53:10):
So it's all subjective.
I think whichever path peoplechoose, it's right for them in
that very moment.
But yeah, to say that realestate school is a prerequisite
of success is just not the case.
SPEAKER_01 (53:23):
Yep.
SPEAKER_00 (53:24):
Mm-hmm.
SPEAKER_01 (53:27):
Already at our one hour mark.
SPEAKER_00 (53:30):
Cool.
Well, thank you for having me,Alex.
SPEAKER_01 (53:32):
Thank you for taking the time.
Of course.
SPEAKER_00 (53:34):
I'm glad we got to be in person and and chat and
have good conversations.
So really appreciate it.
SPEAKER_01 (53:39):
I really enjoyed it.
Yeah.
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