Trump Appeals Sham Hush Money Conviction | Friday, 01/31/2025

President Trump is renewing efforts to overturn his 34 felony convictions in the state of New York - and I get why he's doing it on principle, but at the same time, I think it's a badge of honor that he beat them at their own game. Plus, Vice President J.D. Vance's Thomistic argument on the hierarchy of love has many modern Christians conflating Jesus with John Locke, as one Catholic deacon is putting it. And finally, Trump is purging the upper ranks of the FBI.


Guests:


Matt Gaetz | Host, The Matt Gaetz Show
Chad Pecknold | Professor, The Catholic University of America
Patrick Casey | Podcast Host, Restoring Order
William Wolfe | Founder & Executive Director, Center for Baptist Leadership

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
I'm your host, Kara McKinney, and this is tipping point.
Even though President Trump having thirty four felony convictions as
part of his coolness factor, for lack of a more
erudite phrase, He's renewing attempts to have that case overturned

(00:21):
on appeal. Trump's original lawyers from that New York hush
money case are now pointed to positions within his government,
and so Trump is back with a fresh new team.
Their legal brief is expected to be submitted within the
coming months. Now I understand why President Trump wants to
win this case on appeal so that he can drive
the final stake right through the heart of this law fair,
which was originally designed to either lock him up or

(00:44):
to prevent him from being re elected or both. It
failed on both counts. We still don't even know what
the underlying crime is supposed to be. I don't think
the jury does either, or the judge for that matter.
Horror brag, and it sets a bad precedent for future
use of lawfare. But at the same time time, it's
incredible how the lawfair backfires so spectacularly on the left,

(01:04):
and like I said, it only made Trump cooler. We
can't underestimate how important that is, even if it sounds
like such a juvenile or even lackluster argument. But it's
pretty obvious that most people aren't one over, at least
at first by abstract debate. Instead, they gauge everything based
on feelings and if they trust the source, which boils
down to do I subjectively like this person, are they

(01:25):
telling me the truth? If the answer to that question
is yes, then they'll agree with pretty much everything they say.
And if the answer is no, then they'll take everything
that person says and put it in the worst possible light.
That's just human nature, and we have to deal with it.
The like has to come first, and then the openness
to being won over by argument. And since Trump never
lost his signature humor even during the exile that was

(01:46):
forced on him after the twenty twenty election, and since
he kept fighting back so publicly against the very establishment
status quo that lost a lot of legitimacy during the
Biden years of high crime, low wages, and open borders,
people swung back around to saying, Hey, maybe this Trump
guy isn't so bad after all. And man, that mugshot
is pretty hardcore. I respect that So in short, I

(02:07):
hope President Trump gets those convictions overturned on principle, but
it'll be bittersweet in a very silly way, because those
phony convictions are a reminder of how much Trump has
discredited this entire system of injustice because he won anyway,
and they lost. Joining us now to discuss all this
and a whole lot more is Matt Gates, the host
of the Matt Gates Show right here on OA and Matt,

(02:30):
thanks for being here tonight.

Speaker 2 (02:31):
It's good to be with you again.

Speaker 1 (02:32):
Kara gra So you heard my thoughts on the appeal.
What are yours?

Speaker 2 (02:35):
I think there are a number of matters that represented
reversible error in this, most notably the lack of the
identification of a true felony, which was the basis for
the jurisdiction of this court to be able to charge
President Trump in what would normally be a regulatory business matter.
This was an abuse of criminal law to such an

(02:57):
extent that you had a lot of hedge fund leaders
and investment for folks saying that New York would not
be a friendly place to do some of the most
important business in the world if you could criminalize this
type of just a paperwork snafu at worst, and so
I see why that's going up for review. Frankly, I
think the judge should have thrown out the indictment anyway,

(03:19):
based on that argument that was already presented. But I
believe Judge Marshawn wanted to preside over this historic trial,
and he did so at the expense.

Speaker 1 (03:28):
Of the law that he did. And also, I mean,
he's a Democrat donor. His daughter as well, is highly connected,
and you know it helps herve for President Trump to
be convicted, or at least did before he won the election. Anyways,
despite all this, but I think the real example of
how phony all of this is was on sentencing day,
right the unconditional discharge. Literally nothing happens. He just keeps

(03:48):
the title of felon and then the judge wishes him
well upon a re entering office. But I was led
to believe that this man was a criminal, he's scary,
he's dangerous. They're releasing him right back out into the
highest office in the land to do god knows what right.
That's the argument they make to us all the time,
and here they are wishing him well. I think it
just kind of showed that they knew it was fake
the entire time.

Speaker 2 (04:08):
Yeah, but they only did that because he won. And
it really sharpens the mind that had this election gone
a different way, had millions of Americans who were low
prensity voters not cast their ballots in these critically important
swing states, he would have been sentenced on that day
to prison. And you think about that, You think about
what the voters saved our country from having to endure.

(04:31):
We were very close to seeing the essence of the
republic slip away. And I think that's why it's so
important to get people like cash, Patel and Pambondi confirmed
in their roles to make sure we don't ever slide
back into that again. President Trump is uniquely positioned to
break this cycle of law fair. I think that the
appeal is part of that, but certainly getting these cabinet

(04:52):
confirmations is central to cementing the solution.

Speaker 1 (04:57):
And that's why it's so important to govern in the
way that President Trump is governing right now, because when
it comes to politics, you have to win, right because
if you don't have that power, these people will do
very very bad things.

Speaker 2 (05:09):
You shouldn't be win or go to prison. I know,
I mean that's the crazy part that we just observed.
And now we're kind of seeing the back nine of that.

Speaker 1 (05:17):
That we are and it shows the nasty reality, right
that all these people, like you said, they never believed
in the first place. They say he's Hitler, but then
they pat him on the back when he gets back
into office. At the same time, like you said, they
would salivate if he was in prison forever, and everyone
just got to say, Haha, Hitler's locked up. We won,
he lost, and they don't believe it the entire time,
but they are happy to see him go. And that
is scary. You can't rationalize with that, right. You can't

(05:39):
argue someone out of that. If they hate you in
this in talking about these types of people, they hate you,
they want you locked up forever. There's nothing you can
say to change your mind because they know you're not Hitler,
if you're Trump or when you were in Congress and
the like right, calling you Hitler, right, And.

Speaker 2 (05:53):
I actually think that's playing out now in this contest
to lead the DNC, where instead of internal the failures
of their own policies, they're saying, well, the reason that
Kamala Harris lost is because of racism because of misogyny,
and I think that that continues to try to demonize
the other side rather than to make a series of

(06:14):
concessions on issues where voters have moved one way and
the Democratic Party has moved the other way, and you're
left sort of wondering who's left in the Democratic Party.
If Republicans have such a huge advantage with men, if
more and more suburban women are voting based on economic issues,
if you know, Latino Americans are voting at a higher

(06:36):
rate for Republicans, they're left with like angry transsexuals and
beta males. And I just don't know that that is
enough to build a national party on.

Speaker 1 (06:47):
No, it's not, but I mean it works for us
right that they haven't learned their lesson. But at this point,
danc chair, is it even a real position? I mean,
they just it's just the king maker. We saw Bernie,
but I mean he's fake opposition for you know, when
he coxes with Democrats. So he let himself be be
sold down river in two seconds for Hillary for her
coronation that never happened. We saw on the switcheroo with
Biden and Kamala that happened last year. So it seems

(07:09):
like Obama or whoever else is behind the curtain whispers
to them and they just make it happen. So I
don't know it is DNC chair even a real position. No.

Speaker 2 (07:17):
I think it's a COPPO in the larger kind of
a criminal enterprise that has become the Democratic Party, where
they've been more interested in some of these features.

Speaker 3 (07:26):
Of law fair.

Speaker 2 (07:27):
And let's not forget the original sin of the fusion
of Democrat politics and criminal law and counterintelligence through the
Russia hoax, where they were out there using Democrat political
operatives to spin up disinformation about Trump to try to
make their loss less about their ideas and more about

(07:48):
this notion that Vladimir Putin convinced us all to vote
for Donald Trump based on one hundred and eighty thousand
dollars in Facebook ads. I think that they're now falling
back into that same rather regressive cycle that they.

Speaker 1 (08:00):
Are, But I do like how President Trump has really
discredited their system so much even their fake felony convictions
couldn't hold him down. They're going to keep trying to
throw out the whole racism stick, and that's not landing anymore,
and so much so that now the former Transportation Secretary
Pete Boudha Judge. I'm sure you've seen some people with
eagle eyes on X have noticed that before the inauguration,

(08:22):
Buddha Judge had his preferred pronouns, which are he him I.
For some reason, I thought it would be different than
he him, but he had he him, they're enlisted. But
then now, of course today he got rid of it.
From what I hear is he's doing that across a
lot of different social media platforms. So what does that show?
Is there any kind of fracturing? Do you think on
this this left wing behemoth of wokeness?

Speaker 2 (08:44):
Well, American technology may survive Deep sk Ai, but I
don't know that will survive Pete Buddha Judge's digital presence,
not identifying pronouns. In all reality, this is just a
pure political move care of Pete Buddha Judge plans to
run for governor of Michigan. That's why he's moved there.
He's teed that up as his post Secretary of Transportation job.

(09:06):
And I think if you look at that electorate and
the way they went for Trump, they're not interested in
your pronouns. They're interested in your plans for the future.
And that's not to say Michigan can elect Democrat governors
continuously going forward, But I don't they think they're going
to be voting on the issue sets that seem to
be central to the Pete Buddhaje edge virtue signal when

(09:26):
he was leading the Department of Transportation.

Speaker 1 (09:28):
No, I think that right. And also I do want
to ask you because I know quite recently you went
into the Lions then yourself Franks were talking about breaking
up the left and their monopoly power and the like.
Bill Maher, I know he's kind of hard to put
into a box. He's definitely far left, but he thinks
he's more centrist than he is. He's a whole colosh
of things. But you were on his show. Can you
just tell us how did that go? Well?

Speaker 2 (09:50):
It is interesting when commentators like Bill Maher attack the
left and police the concepts that have lost elections for
the Democratic Party in re in time, he also had
plenty of critiques for me, And honestly, I hope that
people can observe that interview and maybe it gets them
a little more interested in coming over and watching the
Matt Gates Show on One American News but culture is

(10:13):
upstream from politics. We talk about this a lot on
my program at nine Eastern, and so you've got to
get into less comfortable exchanges in order to be able
to convince people. And you see how President Trump is
handling himself in the opening weeks of this administration. He's
so accessible, he's answering questions from hostile media, and he's
trying to change minds. And the way to make sure

(10:34):
that the victories we've had are durable is to go
to those places where minds are up to be changed.
And I found an audience that was pretty receptive. Actually,
if folks look in the comments section on Club Random,
they'll see people were definitely willing to hear out my
ideas on how we can do good for the country.

Speaker 1 (10:52):
And it also perhaps speak to this idea that the
legacy immediately losing so much credibility. I mean, I know
he's part of that world at least on the night
kind of deal. But at the same time, he sells
a podcast. And for some reason, when I heard he
had a podcast, I was like, but he has this
big TV show, whyse you have a podcast? But look,
he tries to portran at least some more relaxed side,
a little more of an open side. Does that kind

(11:14):
of show that people are sick and tired of being,
you know, told the line that they're forced to swallow,
and they want someone who at least presents, even if
they may not inhabit it themselves or live it, but
at least presents to the audience as being more authentic
and more open to you know, slinging arrows and taking
some arrows in return.

Speaker 2 (11:33):
I think the authenticity is what people crave. But there's
another feature of it, Kara. We live in a time
of more fragmented information than any other time in human history,
and so rather than all of the family having to
gather around the Dan Rather or Walter Cronkite news program,
you've got all these different vectors of information. And that's

(11:53):
why we here at One American News, have such a
robust digital platform and social media platform and our live
app people can buy, and you know, even this week,
Dan Ball and I are launching a podcast out of
these great studios at OA and Anchorman. People can find
it wherever you get podcasts. And I think that that
is an area where President Trump did very well in
the last election with those audiences and it's the new

(12:16):
frontier of information and so we can go seize it
just like anybody else.

Speaker 1 (12:21):
Yeah, and I love how he's employing that as well
into the White House Press briefing room. Oh and of
course we're back and independent media as well, that they're
allowed to come in now, at least to apply to
be allowed into the room and to ask questions. So
I for one, am very excited about these new avenues
that are really opening up toward us. And it's interesting
to see those who went so far left now trying

(12:42):
to reel themselves back at least closer to center, trying
to rebrand themselves. I know Chris Cuomo, he's trying and failing,
but trying to right say, he's a little more of
a realist now in COVID, which is quite hilarious. But
it also shows that now the power is swinging in
our way and again that opens up a lot of
avenues for us. So just Matt, before I like you
go tonight, any last thoughts for the audience, Like you said,
you've got Anchorman launching anything else they need to know.

Speaker 2 (13:05):
Well, we are really excited about that program. Dan and
I are good buddies and just like I've had a
great time coming on your show as a member of Congress,
I did that with him as well, and now we're
extending those discussions. But I really think that President Trump
is executing a strategy right now of Blitzkreek, where so
much is happening that you're going to be You're going

(13:27):
to overwhelm a system that is otherwise demonstrated strong resilience
to change. And it's such a different Trump two point
zero than we had back in twenty seventeen. I think
he is peaking. I think he's at his best, He's
at his most popular. People go look at the polling.

Speaker 1 (13:43):
He is as.

Speaker 2 (13:44):
Popular now as Obama when Obama was first elected, and
we're a way more divided country now than we were then.
Obama used his tenure in office to push a lot
of that division, and so it's a great time to
be alive. I think that you're going to see a
lot of executs give action directed at aviation safety in
the coming days and weeks, because there's a lot of

(14:04):
concern even if some of the problems at FAA didn't
cause this particular collision.

Speaker 1 (14:12):
Let's not have to learn.

Speaker 2 (14:13):
Every lesson from you know from from an actual mistake
or casualty. Let's fix what we can.

Speaker 1 (14:19):
Now definitely couldn't agree more, Matt, thanks for joining us tonight.
Thank you, Ka, and coming up next, Vice President jd
Vance says the far left has inverted the Christian concept
of love your neighbor. We'll show you the clip of
his comments, which are drawing so much attention. What do
we come back into?

Speaker 4 (14:39):
Watch o An live on cloudtv dot com and see
what you're missing. Download the cloud tv app and watch
One America News Network wherever you go, visit klowd tv
dot com Today. That's klowd tv dot com Today.

Speaker 1 (15:03):
Welcome back to Tipping Point. I'm your host, Kara McKinney.
Ordo amoris the proper ordering of loves. If you've never
heard of this Latin phrase before, Vice President jd Vance
is encouraging you to google it. We finally have an
intellectual in the White House and atomis sit that we've
never been so back. As the kids say online these days,
it's frankly depressing that this ancient Christian understanding of Christ's

(15:25):
commandment to love your neighbor as yourself, as paired with
loving God first above all things is drawing so much flak.
But first before we get into that, here as Vance's
interview on Fox News that has drawing so much attention. Watch.

Speaker 5 (15:38):
There's this old school, and I think it's a very
Christian concept by the way, that you love your family,
and then you love your neighbor, and then you love
your community, and then you love your fellow citizens in
your own country, and then after that you can focus
and prioritize the rest of the world. A lot of
the far left has completely inverted that. They seem to
hate the citizens of their own country and care more

(16:00):
about people outside their own borders. That is no way
to run a society.

Speaker 1 (16:05):
Essentially, what he's saying here is that it is disordered
to love less those who are close to you, and
to proclaim some great love for someone far away, especially
if you've never met them. That cast suspicion on your
proclaimed love. For example, to put it into more concrete terms,
wouldn't you second guess the motivations of a woman who
spends all of her time at the soup kitchen feeding
the homeless while her own children starve and are neglected

(16:27):
at home. Surely you would realize that something is severely wrong,
and that such a woman has her priorities completely backwards.
It's because everything, even love, has a higherarchy. If it didn't,
then Christ's answer about what the greatest commandment of all
is wouldn't make sense, because before he says to love
your neighbor as yourself, he says to love God first
above all things, with your heart, mind, body, and soul.

(16:49):
That right, there is a higherarchy. It is only right
that God be loved first above all things, and then
less your loves be ordered properly toward that sumum bonum
or greatest good.

Speaker 2 (16:58):
JD.

Speaker 1 (16:59):
Vance astutely makes as clear, and his response to one
of his detractors, a professor and podcaster with a large following,
Rory Stuart. Stuart argues, quote a bizarre take on John
chapter fifteen, verse twelve through thirteen, less Christian and more
pagan tribal, which will start worrying when politicians become theologians
assume to speak for Jesus and tell Us in which

(17:19):
order to love end quote. Vance replied, quote, just google
Ordo Amorus. Aside from that, the idea that there isn't
a hierarchy of obligations violates basic common sense does Rory
really think his moral duties to his own children are
the same as his duties to a stranger who lives
thousands of miles away, does anyone. I've said before, and

(17:39):
I'll say it again, the problem with Rory and people
like him is that he has an IQ of one
hundred and ten and thinks he has an IQ of
one hundred and thirty. This false arrogance drives so much
elite failure over the last forty years. Quote but Vance
is arguing here comes from Saint Thomas Aquinas and was
first explored by Saint Augustine. This line of traditional Christian
thinking has a long and prodigious pedigree, but most, even

(18:01):
self reclined Christians, are woefully underinformed about their own history.
That's going to get simple dismissals like this one from
an ex account I normally tend to agree with, But
he gets it completely wrong in this case when he
shoots off about Vance's response in that interview we just
watched a few minutes ago. I know of no Christian
doctrine or biblical injunction. Seems like he just made this

(18:21):
up out of thin air before being corrected about its
roots in the writings of Saint Thomas aquinas so. Deacon
Harrison Garlic of Oklahoma, as always, sums it up perfectly.
After making a point about how modern Christians see their
own intellectual and spiritual heritage as foreign to their current
modern beliefs, he elaborates, quote, modern Christianity has completely conflated

(18:42):
liberal tolerance with Christian charity. They say Jesus, but mean
John Locke end quote. Joining us now to discuss is
chadpeck Nold, a professor at the Catholic University of America. Professor,
thanks for being here.

Speaker 6 (18:54):
Tonight, Oh, pleasure to be with you. My friend grat So.

Speaker 1 (18:58):
Is Deacon Garlic perhaps bought on with our modern conflation
of Jesus and John Locke.

Speaker 6 (19:05):
Yeah, of course you're right. Deacon is always right. He's
a great friend, and he's got this right. You know.
I think the Vice President is also, you know, right
to say from the beginning of the remarks that this
is an old philosophical idea as well as a Christian
idea that we would love those who are nearest to us.
And you know, it's it's important to think about America

(19:31):
as a family, and we've i think failed to do that.
We think America is somewhere else. We think America is abroad,
or it's in the face of people coming over our borders.
We actually have a nation, and we have a nation
which is a family for families, and we have obligations

(19:51):
to our families. I wonder if part of the gnosticism
of that kind of locky and liberal way of conceiving
of the stranger is actually a way of detaching us
from our families, and that what we have is a
kind of blindness towards the family that struggles. In Appalachia,

(20:14):
we have a blindness to the family that's struggling, struggling
with opioid addiction. We have a blindness to the way
in which our own laws have actually been aimed against
the family. And we need to have a revision of
our laws that build up thriving and healthy families, as

(20:35):
Vice President said at the March for Life, and so
we've got a family problem in America and we have
to fix that problem. We need healthy, thriving American families
before we can start offering charity to families from other countries.
I think this is you know, another important point I
just mentioned is about law. I think when you get

(20:57):
people who you know, the left will not even call
an illegal alien an illegal. They'll say undocumented or something
like that. Well, this is an enormous anarchical impulse of
the left. They don't actually want to live according to
laws of a land. They want to make things up

(21:18):
as they go along. They want to be attached to
people who aren't really attached to us. The order of
love is a hierarchy which is all ruled by God's love.
God's love is at the bottom of it, and at
the top of it, and all the way up and
down that hierarchy. You have goods which we are to love.

(21:39):
The first good that we are to love is God
in ourselves, and then God as the good of our families,
God in the good of our community, God and the
good of our nation. God goes all the way up
and down, but in its external forms and its external effects,
as Saint Thomas says, we have obligation which are hierarchical.

(22:01):
To our highest obligation are those nearest to us. And
so Vice President Vance was exactly right about that. We
need to pay attention to our families, and we need
to pay attention to the family of families that is
the nation and then after that we can pay attention
to can we take more people in? The bishops of
course want us to take as many in as we can,

(22:23):
and that's in the order of charity, something that we
could do, but not right now. Right now, our country
needs to pay attention to recovering from this kind of
delirium that we've been experiencing for years under the tyranny
of leftism.

Speaker 1 (22:43):
And that's so important. You make so many important points
right there, and I think so many people take what
Jade vance and they're trying to cast it in a
negative line, trying to say that he means to love
your family first at the expense of someone else, to
perhaps hog up and hoard up wealth for yourself, saying,
but I have to do it to help my family,
even though my family has more than enough, and I'm
doing it to hurt or to spite you, or because

(23:04):
I have hatred towards the other, when of course that's
not at whatsoever. What he's saying is you love those
closest to you first, because God has directly given them
into your life for you to take care of. When
you take care of them first and they're secure, then
you move to the next concentric circle, then to the next,
and on and on and on, and it overflows, and
the grace and the love of God then keeps flowing
outward and no one is left behind. Right. And I

(23:26):
think it's important, as you point out, with you know,
loving the other, but not those who are actually physically
next to you. And it's because it's so prideful. Right.
I gave the example earlier of the woman at the
soup kitchen, and you could say, but I don't understand.
How is she neglect her kids? If she loves all
these homeless so much that she's feeding them, that's a
charity in itself. Yes it is. But what she's more

(23:47):
addicted to is not the charity. She's not toiling away
in the quietness as she would if she was at
home with her kids, when instead she's doing in my hypothetical,
is she loves the attention. It's the pride. If people go, wow,
you're here every day, Hey, you're feeding the homeless, You're
so great, you're amazing. Pats on the back. It was pride.
And it shows that the love is disordered, that if
she truly was doing these things out of love, she

(24:08):
would be with her kids first and foremost, and when
they are truly taking care of then any time remaining
over can be given to the homeless, and too the
stranger into the other. And that is the disordered world
in which we find, as you say, the Left has
taken everything out of its proper context and try to
rearrange the world and make all these other things God
which are not God. And Professor I could speak to

(24:30):
you all night. Unfortunately we are running out of time
and I hate that, but I do want to bring
you back soon where we could go for much longer
on this topic than others. But thank you so much
for joining us tonight. Coming up next, we are learning
that an aero traffic controller may have been allowed to
go home early on the night of the fatal plane
crash in DC. Where details on the tragedy when we
come back in two.

Speaker 4 (24:55):
Watch o An Live on cloudtv dot com and see
what you're missing. Load the cloud tv app and watch
one America News Network wherever you go, visit klowd tv
dot com Today. That's klowd tv dot com Today.

Speaker 1 (25:19):
Welcome back to Tipping Point. I'm your host, Kara McKinney.
Turns out that on the night of the fatal crash
at Ronald Reagan Washington National Airport in DC, one air
traffic controller was allowed to go home early during the
busiest part of the night. This was told to The
New York Times by a source who claims to have
been briefed on staffing levels and an internal preliminary FAA

(25:40):
safety report, and since staffing levels were already not normal,
as in they were low according to early reports, this
further strain the remaining controllers, who have to handle both
helicopter and plane traffic. The airport is known for having
chronically low staffing levels, forcing the remaining controllers to have
to work up to six days a week at ten
hours per day, depending on the volume of traffic and

(26:02):
the level of staffing. That same report is also allowing
that the Army Blackhawk helicopter may have been flying too
high and about a half mile off course when it
collided with the descending American Airlines plane. Brightbart's Pentagon corresponded
in front of the show. Christina Wong has some other
key insights into Wednesday's fatal crash. She relays from a
source within the same unit as the Army black Hawk

(26:25):
crew that quotes one that it was a training flight
was not unusual at all. Those flights are flown every day.
Two the co pilot was going through her annual evaluation
for night flying. Night vision goggles can magnify light, making
it easier to confuse aircraft lights with ground lights. Three.
Runway thirty three, where air traffic control told the passenger

(26:46):
jet to land, is rarely used. This person said in
his four years, he saw it being used ten times.
It is a much shorter runway than the main one used,
which is Runway one. Four The black Hawk appeared to
confuse the passenger yet with another plane landing at runway one,
which is why the pilot in command confirmed seeing the
CRJ and requesting visual separation or essentially saying he would

(27:10):
avoid it.

Speaker 4 (27:12):
Five.

Speaker 1 (27:12):
The CRJ was circling to land and making a left
turn at the time the black Hawk was in its
blind spot. Six The crew was experienced. The instructor pilot
had just under one thousand flying hours he was former Navy.
The copilot had around five hundred hours, and the crew chief,
who served on multiple combat tours, around one thousand hours.
They flew these same routes for at least three years.

(27:34):
Seven it was not unusual to have three crew members
on a black Hawk. There's only four for certain mission sets.
Whether the crew chief saw the CRJ would have depended
on which side he was sitting on. Eight, it was
a dark night with no moon. Nine air traffic control
could have told the black Hawk to hold north or
diverted it. And ten potential changes could be made to

(27:55):
change the route, altitude, or hours during heavy air traffic.
Then ends her post by quoting her source as saying
it was the perfect store. And as for the part
about air traffic control, a lot has been said about
DEI affecting staff levels and quality. Our next guest tonight
has a thorough breakdown on that very issue. Joining us
now to discuss is Patrick Casey, the host of the

(28:16):
Restoring Order podcast. Patrick thinks for being back tonight.

Speaker 7 (28:21):
Yeah, it's unfortunate that I'm back on your show, which
I quite like under these tragic circumstances. But there's a
lot of important stuff to discuss related to the crash.

Speaker 1 (28:30):
That there is, And that's the sad part about tragedy, right,
is that it brings out some much needed change. But
of course, like we're saying, the sad part is it's
bortant of tragedy. So you have this long thread on
X that and you say that in twenty twenty three
there were five hundred and three aero traffic control lapses
categorized as significant of sixty five percent from the year prior.
So what's happening? I know that's that's a big question

(28:54):
to ask you, But if you could perhaps streamline your
argument to the essentials for the audience to understand what
is argument here as to why this is happening?

Speaker 7 (29:03):
Sure, so, I think there are two main problems here,
and both of them are are you know, downstream from
DEI and these sorts of policies. What are the main
ones when it comes to these lapses and air traffic
control and incidents potentially like the one we saw last night.
We don't one hundred percent know the cause of this
tragic crash, but one of the main ones is these

(29:27):
air traffic controllers. You see article after article, and you've
been seeing these for years saying that these air traffic
controllers are overworked, they're understaffed. You know, there's all sorts
of problems in that regard, and the other part is
that a lot of them just are not qualified. There
are also many whistleblowers have talked about the level of
unprofessionalism on the job, people coming into work drunk, buzzed high.

(29:52):
And you know, when there's this alleged short whether there
is a shortage of them, whether or not there's a
shortage as we'll see, of people who want to do
the job in our qualified as a different story. When
you have this this shortage, you know, people are able
to get away with, I think, a level of unprofessional
behavior that is really just advantageous to such a critical job,

(30:12):
right because this is something, as we're seeing very tragically,
is something that you need to have competent people doing
and they shouldn't be over over staffed. Now, the establishment,
the mainstream media New York Times, they're very quick to
point out the understaffing problem, but they don't want to
talk about how that is. As we'll see some of

(30:33):
the history here downstream from DEI as well, not just
the competence crisis, so to speak.

Speaker 1 (30:39):
So then give us some of those nuts and bolts.
Then you start off in twenty thirteen. Perhaps it started earlier,
but at least twenty thirteen, Obama I think appointed to
the FAA Michael Wuerta can you talk about some of
the changes that were made and how they have led
to this staffing shortage.

Speaker 3 (30:56):
Sure.

Speaker 1 (30:56):
So.

Speaker 7 (30:57):
In twenty thirteen, as part of you know, the Obama
administration's assaults on meritocracy, on anything perceived to be right
wing conservative, what we would probably consider normal, Obama pointed
a man named Michael Werta to the position of FAA
administrator where to criticize the existing standards at the FAA
on the grounds that they didn't promote diversity.

Speaker 1 (31:19):
Right.

Speaker 7 (31:19):
And now, this isn't me reading into it, this isn't
me intuiting it. He was very explicit. I have a
quote here he plans to an I quote transform. He
planned to at the time transform the FAA into a
more diverse and inclusive workplace that reflects, understands, relates to
the diverse customers. So, in other words, the FAA was

(31:39):
hiring too many men, to many heterosexuals, too many white people.
I think there are some examples of Asians or other
you know, the proverbial model minority groups being discriminated against,
but it was primarily saying there are too many white
guys in here. Okay, So when you seize to select
for competence, what do you do well? They used to

(32:02):
do something. They used to have a CTI program they
called it worked with thirty six colleges to educate future
air traffic controllers.

Speaker 3 (32:08):
These colleges offered two and.

Speaker 7 (32:09):
Four year degrees requiring courses in air traffic control and
aviation administration. There's also, and this is very critical, a
rigorous skills test. So this, you know, you're testing someone's skills,
that's you're testing someone's intelligence, their competence, that's the kind
of thing you want to test for. Okay, Well, it's
kind of it's kind of unknown to what extent the
skills test was replaced. I think I think I've heard

(32:31):
that it was still there, but it was overshadowed by
this very subjective behavioral assessment a part of the biographical questionnaire.
And it was kind of a behavioral assessment in a sense,
but it basically asked applicants questions like what sports did
you play in high school? How would you describe your
ideal job, what has been a major cost of your failures?

(32:53):
So very subjective things. The idea that answers to these
questions could could tell you whether or not someone is
qualified to become an air traffic controller, I think is
frankly ridiculous. I think a skills test, testing people for
skills that are relevant to that very critical job is
the kind of thing that they should be doing. The

(33:14):
Obama administration disagreed, so they opened it up to a
more subjective hiring process. And you know, and why again
because of diversity. Because of diversity. So you had in
twenty fifteen a man named Peter Cursonow who was then
a member of the US Commission on Civil Rights. He
wrote a letter to the FAA. Right, not a crank,
this is someone who who's very involved in this sort

(33:35):
of stuff, accusing the FA of diluting its objective standards
of evaluating competence. You also had, you know, three thousand
qualified applicants that were rejected by the FA. They filed
the class action lawsuit. So, in the process of switching
over from a more mirroredocratic way of hiring air traffic

(33:56):
controllers and I think other positions at the FAA well
wanted up happening is they just kind of scrapped all
of those and in order to get the diversity in
there that they wanted.

Speaker 3 (34:07):
So just keep that in mind.

Speaker 7 (34:08):
Everyone whenever you see the mainstream media talk about how
these air traffic controllers were overworked, there's a labor shortage,
they're understaff. Just keep that in mind. They've scrapped thousands
in the pursuit of diversity. They scrapped thousands of qualified candidates.
And that's there's no way that's not you know, at
the very least it's a major factor in this lack

(34:29):
of purported lack of air traffic controllers.

Speaker 1 (34:32):
Then it is. And to your point, we even heard
Vice President J. D. Vans the other day at the
White House Press briefing room. He was making a similar point.
He was talking about how there's been lawsuits again as
you were talking about of thousands of applicants saying, hey,
I was discriminated on based on my race, right, you know,
I want to work air traffic control and all these
roadblocks are being put up in front of me. So DEI,
as they say in de Ie, is what it should

(34:55):
be because it does kill. Towards the end of your
ex thread here, as you were laying out some of
these facts, you then link to a magazine article from
palladium or platium I believe, and the article basically is
talking about becoming competency crisis, as you can see right therapy,
because we have so many complex systems right everywhere, high
tech machinery, a lot of artificial intelligence, now you see

(35:16):
the Internet, all this stuff. It's these are complex systems.
There's a lot that goes into it. They're multifaceted. You
need competent people to handle it. But are we hurtling
towards that competency crisis? I know, thankfully President Trump is
in office. He's going to do what he can do
to help reverse this tide somewhat. But we just have
that National Grade report come out twenty twenty four, the

(35:37):
year twenty twenty four showing eighth graders once again, I
believe about a third of them or not reading at
grade level, and many of them are not doing math
at grade level. I think it's much more than a third.
It doesn't speak too well. And a lot of this,
once again, can be laid at the feed of DEI.
So talk to us about how this article plays into
what you just laid out for us.

Speaker 7 (35:58):
Sure, So we've been talking about the ramifications of DEI
within one admittedly very important field, which is profession air
traffic controllers But as the article does a good job
of laying out, this is not something that is limited
to this is this is a society wide malaise that
that has that has taken root. And contrary to what

(36:19):
some might think, this isn't you know, the results of
it isn't just the results of Barack Obama's policies in
this instance, Yes, but the overall assaults on meritocracy really
can be traced back to civil rights law. Now, it's
understanding that some of some of the motives of people
around the time pushing back against Jim Crow. I think
you'd be hard pressed to find a conservative these days

(36:39):
that thinks that we need to return to that right.
I certainly don't. But but in the pursuit of something
like that, you had, really they they kind of created
a monster, this civil rights law bureaucracy. What was ideal,
what was intended, at least in some cases, at least
according to some people, what was envisioned to be a
system of law that made sure that no one, regardless

(37:01):
of whether black, male, you know, woman, Catholic, Jewish, whatever,
could be discriminated against, ended up becoming something that became
very discriminatory, discriminating against what we understand to you know, today,
these categories that are not deemed minority groups Whites, men, Christians,
these sorts of things in some cases Asians, Indians, maybe

(37:22):
since October seventh, to some extent, Jews as well. And
so you're when you're not selecting for as this article
lays out, when you're not selecting for merit, you're selecting
for diversity. There's really no way around the fact that
you're not selecting for competent people. At that point, some
of the people who might get in under affirmative action
under DEI policies could could you know, It's not that

(37:44):
none of it's not that no minorities are are competent
who are working in these sorts of jobs.

Speaker 3 (37:48):
But it's really that you just you just kind of
don't know.

Speaker 7 (37:53):
And there's no way that overall, even while some individuals
might be still competent, there's there's no way that overall
there can't be a decline in there won't be a
decline in the competence overall. And as the article points out,
this is a big problem because America is an incredibly
complex country, right, Any first world country is going to

(38:14):
be incredible, incredibly complex and it's going to be defined
by complex systems that require really intelligent, knowledgeable and hardworking
people to operate them. And when you no longer have
a system that selects for those qualities, where you're going
to have people that again don't don't aren't really up
to muster, so to speak. We're running those incredibly complex

(38:35):
systems and the the ATC thing there traffick controllers. That's
really just kind of a microcosm for the for the
much bigger picture, think about every other aspect of society
where we rely on skilled people to operate things, to
keep our the power grid on, to perform surgeries, to make.

Speaker 3 (38:54):
Sure that your your food is fit to eat.

Speaker 7 (38:56):
I'll make sure the food gets gets to your ta
you know, the grocery store. It's really like literally any
other aspect of society you can think probably requires smart
people involved there somewhere.

Speaker 3 (39:06):
So it's a big problem. It absolutely is that it is.

Speaker 1 (39:10):
I know on this show we've covered and other conservative
media have covered as well that even in medical schools,
top medical schools, that they're inserting the wokeness and saying
that if you stick to the old rigorous curriculum, you know,
the one that gave us brainiac surgeons and the like
that that is now somehow racist because not enough students
can reach that standard anymore. So they just call it
racist and they throw it out the window, right, and

(39:31):
that brings, as you were talking about, the competency down,
and it's a lot easier to just keep calling everything racist.
So you keep getting read more and more of standardized
testings that really show the failures, because that's a lot
easier than actually going to the root of a lot
of these problems. For examples, just one of this multifaceted
issue is obviously schooling education in this country, right, the failures,
especially in very democrat left wing areas, have they failed

(39:53):
their students time and time again. They cover for lazy teachers,
they cover for stupid teachers. They don't allow these people
to be fired or to be moved away from students,
and then it brings down everything for those students. They
keeping passed around like little hot potatoes. Right If they're
acting out violently in school, they're not being punished in
the way that they should be. That affects the learning
for other students, and they get passed up through the

(40:14):
grade levels. Next you know, they're graduating high school, they
can't read or write, and they're wondering why they're not
getting hired a McDonald's, and they go, well, it must
be because of my skin color, my gender, or my religion,
or just something. It has to be some reason, or
it's the evil capitalist and I want communism and that's
the reason why I can't get a job. It has
to be some version of discrimination when really they've been
failed their entire lives. And again, it's harder to attack

(40:36):
that system, so it's easier to just say it's all
racist and rigged anuous, so let's get rid of it.
But like you're saying, when we live in a very
complex world that comes with very real and serious consequences,
and we're starting to live through that. Patrick, thanks so
much for joining us tonight. Coming up next, several top
FBI officials say they're being told to resign or be
fired as President Trump continues as much needed federal purge.

(40:58):
No wonder the established is so scared. Details when we
come back.

Speaker 4 (41:01):
Into watchn Live on cloudtv dot com and see what
you're missing. Download the cloud tv app and watch One
America News Network wherever you go. Visit klowd tv dot
com Today. That's Klowd TV dot com Today.

Speaker 1 (41:32):
Welcome back to Tipping Point. I'm your host, Kara McKinney.
It's the Purge, but this isn't a horror movie. Quite
the opposite. Top FBI officials, including those recently promoted by
former Director Chris Ray, are getting a similar fork in
the road email that two million other federal workers got
to entice them into self deporting from their cushy jobs.

(41:54):
Except to my knowledge, there's no general severance package being
offered to these feds. NBC News says. These top officials
are telling them that they received emails saying to resign
now Friday or to face their risk of being fired
on Monday morning when they return. Like how Trump got
rid of eighteen Inspectors general last week for not doing
their jobs. The notice went out to about six executive

(42:15):
assistant directors for the bureau. Now wonder the establishment is
so scared of Cash Bettel possibly replacing Ray as a
new director for the FBI, or even Tolsey Gabbert as
the new Director of National Intelligence for that matter. There
were many standout moments from yesterday's hearings, but one of
the biggest ones for me was when Gabert exposed the
following watch.

Speaker 8 (42:35):
When Russia was denying Assad's use of chemical weapons, they
accused the US of supporting terrorists. This is a line
that Putin used frequently during the Syrian Civil War as
he supported Assad. Syrian officials made similar comments.

Speaker 3 (42:52):
They did it.

Speaker 8 (42:52):
Repeatedly, They did it in public, they did it at
the United Nations. In twenty sixteen, you gave an interview
in which you said, and this is a quote, the
US is providing direct and indirect support to terrorist groups
in order to overthrow the Syrian government. And in twenty nineteen,
on the Democratic presidential debate stage, you said of President Trump,

(43:14):
this is a quote. This current president is continuing to
betray us. We were supposed to be going after al Qaeda,
but over years now, not only have we not gone
after al Qaeda, our president is supporting al Qaeda.

Speaker 3 (43:30):
So I'm interested to hear what was your.

Speaker 8 (43:32):
Goal in saying these things and did you consider before
saying them the motives of Iran in Russia, what their
motives might have been before making these claims.

Speaker 9 (43:45):
Senator, as someone who enlisted in the military specifically because
of al Qaeda's terrorist attack, on nine to eleven, and
committing myself in my life to doing what I could
to defeat these terrorists. It was shocking and a betrayal
to me and every person who was killed on nine
to eleven, their families, and my brothers and sisters in uniform.

(44:09):
When as a member of Congress I learned about President
Obama's dual programs that he had begun really to overthrow
the regime of Syria and being willing to through the
CIA's Timber Sycamore program that has now been made public,
of working with and arming and equipping al Qaeda in

(44:32):
an effort to overthrow that regime, starting yet another regime
change war in the Middle East.

Speaker 1 (44:39):
Just because Russia says it doesn't mean it's not true.
If we want to talk about where our tax mayer
dollars are going, then most Americans would be absolutely shocked
to know those dollars are being used to prop up
literal terrorists like Al Qaeda abroad. Joining us not to
discuss is William Wolfe, the founder and executive director of
the Center for Baptist Leadership. William, thanks for being back tonight.

Speaker 6 (45:02):
It's good to be back, Grace.

Speaker 1 (45:03):
So what stood out to you the most about these hearings, Well,
where to start?

Speaker 10 (45:09):
I mean, both Cash Battel and Tulsa Gabbert did an
excellent job defending the priorities of the president and clearly
articulating that they want to return law and order and
sensible foreign policy and national security programming to these branches.
And of course they're being met with opposition from the
deep state and for members of Congress who have entrenched

(45:31):
interests in not being exposed, perhaps even for their participation
in some of the unlawful activities that have been going
on there. So both of them have done a great job.

Speaker 1 (45:40):
So far that they have, and I've seen others make
the point and I just want to reiterate it here
and see if you would agree. But should we just
ban lawmakers during these type of confirmation hearings from giving
yes for making so many yes or no questions? Because
the idea, by and large, I know, perhaps that it
started out with good intentions, is the idea to cut

(46:01):
through the noise and to just get someone on record
as either saying yes or no. But what at least
it's being used for now is just complete grandstanding. Right,
It's the idea that I'm going to ask you a
very layered and in depth and nuanced question, but I'm
only going to allow you to say yes or no,
And if you try to answer in any other way,
I'm going to keep shouting at you yes or no.
It's a simple question and therefore to get you to
just say yes or no. So then I, as the lawmaker,

(46:24):
can just lecture, lecture, lecture until my time runs out
and learn absolutely nothing about the candidates. So some of
these hearings are just absolutely dog and pony shows. They're
just so fake and so phony. Is it time that
either we just get rid of them wholesale or we
just add some new rules. I mean, I feel like
something's got to give.

Speaker 10 (46:42):
Yeah, well, they've certainly become a circus. You know, as
an unapologetic partisan, I will say I support yes and
no questions. What exposes the bad guys, and I don't
support them whether they're being used to obstacate with the
good guys, which is what's happening here right These Democrats Senators,
they're not interested in a real debate over some very
nuanced and complicated issues like the us CIA funding al

(47:07):
Qaeda to overthrow the regime in Syria. This is not
a matter of speculation or debate. This is a provable
and demonstrable fact. I mean, and it truly is a
betrayal to so many men and women who joined our
military after nine to eleven that somehow, now over twenty
years later, a key component of black ops in the
Middle East, that's actually funding al Qaeda against actors that

(47:30):
we don't like, particularly if we can use them to
go after Russia or I Ran. Look, those are bad
actors too, But why are we joining with the people
and the organization responsible for bringing down the Twin Towers
in New York.

Speaker 1 (47:42):
It makes no sense, It really doesn't. And also it
leads so many innocent people caught in the crosshairs to
the mercy of literal Johannes who will saw their heads
often kill them. I mean, it's it's horrific and it's evil,
and I for one don't want my taxpayer dollars going
toward it. But also it's interesting to me, right cash
Betel being nominated to the position he was, He, along
with Devin nun As, were really the first to expose

(48:04):
the whole Russia Gate hoax that was used against President Trump.
I think that's why there's so much hatred right now
against him, and of course Tulci Gabbard as well, and
even RFK Junior, because they're exposing that, right, they're exposing
that side at the government that the government would prefer
it not be exposed. They like to do a lot
of their they're violent and intimidation behind closed doors because
I guess that's more gentlemanly somehow, when it's really not.

(48:27):
But I asked this to say, with Patel perhaps becoming
the FBI director, you can see that the left, especially
and establishment Republicans rhinos if you will, are very very scared.
President Trump, for his part, though already even before any
confirmation can happen. Here he is purging the federal government
in a way that we only hoped and dreamed of
right before he took office. It was the inspectors General,

(48:50):
it was the two million federal workers, and now even
some top FBI guys are saying, Hey, he's coming for
me too. I love to see it. What about you, well, absolutely.

Speaker 10 (49:00):
I mean it's time for sunlight and disinfectant to rain
down upon the corrupt law enforcement agencies within the federal government.
The left likes to pretend like the FBI some sort
of like nonpartisan neutral actor, when in reality, over the
last four years under President Biden and quite frankly under
President Trump too and Obama before that, they have made

(49:21):
it a de facto state police enforcement arm for the
progressive agenda. They've used it to go after everybody from
pro life protesters to meme posters online, all while ignoring actual,
credible and real threats to the American people, like the
New Orleans terrorist attack that we saw just last month,
makes become a meme on the internet. When there's this

(49:42):
mass shooting, the FBI comes out and says, this guy's
been on our radar, So why didn't you deal with him? Oh,
because you were too busy investigating conservatives or trying to
enact lawfare against President Trump or his surrogants. What had
you so Cash Fattel is striking fear into the heart
of darkness that is the corrupt police state here in
the executive brands and administration. And I'll just remind all

(50:04):
of your listeners and everybody else that you know Article two,
section one of the Constitution says the executive power shall
be vested in the President of the United States and
that includes the FBI. Donald Trump has every reason and
constitutional right to expect that the FBI will not just
be acting as some independent organization, but will be executing

(50:26):
constitutional rulemaking and police enforcement under his jurisdiction.

Speaker 1 (50:31):
And it was just absolutely crazy to me as well
to see Democrat senator now sorry, I'm in California. I
didn't vote for the guy, but I'm sorry he's now
the senator. I hadnam shift right. We saw him just
going really at Patel, trying to act like he is
covering up for cop killers and the like because of
January sixth, when no cops are killed on January six
by any of those political prisoners, those defendants. But of

(50:54):
course that's the tagline the left uses. But I really
like how Ptel went after him, basically because the left
the Democrat party, they are the party of supporting actual
true cop killers who were who were not remorseful in
any way whatsoever. And also I really liked how we said,
is that the real the FBI men and women who
actually take their job seriously. He wants to restore integrity
back to their position, and that is the greatest gift

(51:15):
writer that he could give them. So last thirty seconds
to you. Any last thoughts on this?

Speaker 10 (51:21):
Yeah, I mean if we get Cash Qtel confirmed as
the director of the FBI, which I trust that he
will be, he will restore integrity and honesty to the
FBI in the way that we haven't seen in decades.
He's an absolutely critical appointment by Donald Trump. He's a
right man for the job, as is Tulsa Gabbard for
Odie and I and my hope in prayer is that
they will be confirmed and bring justice.

Speaker 1 (51:44):
I am second that as well. William. Thanks for joining
us tonight, and when we come back, we'll have the
results of our last dipping Point poll where we asked
is air traffic control to blame for the plane crash
over the Potomac River. You won't want to miss it.

Speaker 4 (51:55):
Next, watch an live on cloudtv dot com and see
what you're missing. Download the cloud tv app and watch
One America News Network wherever you go. Visit klowd tv
dot com Today. That's klowd tv dot com Today.

Speaker 1 (52:25):
Welcome back to you tipping Point. I'm your host, Kara McKinney.
It's now time to reveal the results of our last
tipping point poll, where we asked is air traffic control
to blame for the plane crash over the Potomac River.
Eighty percent of you said yes, whereas twenty percent of
you said no. And now tonight we asked the question
should the drinking age be lowered to eighteen to wayne
and vote in the poll. Please visit us on truth
Social and X at tipping point oa N. We'll have

(52:47):
the results for you on Monday. And with that, I'm
all out of time for tonight. You know where to
find me on all the socials. So as always, thank
you and I have a great Friday night.

Speaker 4 (53:00):
Watch o AN Live on cloudtv dot com and see
what you're missing. Download the cloud tv app and watch
One America News Network wherever you go. Visit k l
o w d tv dot com Today. That's k l
o w d tv dot com Today.