January 22, 2024 • 37 mins
Today we are hunting for elephants with The Purpose Hunter, Matthew Berrafato! Joining Tara for an amazing conversation, Matthew showcases his Top5 Ways to Find Your Purpose. Tune in as he asks important questions and answers we should all a ourselves as we find our true purpose.
1. Explore your gifts
2. What are you passionate about?
3. Determine who you can serve with your gifts and your passion
4. Legacy - Who taught you your greatest lessons?
5. Try a different combination of steps 1, 2 & 3 and don’t stop trying!
The Purpose Hunter podcast: https://open.spotify.com/show/53qftyrMnFdhCqPlUZlGIq?si=f3698f12d97e49c9
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/matt-berrafato-83528113/
YouTube channel: Mattelephanthunter
Blog: Matthew Berrafato EHI One Bite Connection
Twitter: @OneBite31
Facebook: Matthew Berrafato
847-757-2467
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Tara Thurber (00:00):
Hey everyone, welcome back to Top5 brought to
(00:02):
you by DefineTalent. We are aresults driven service working
with clients to connect themwith quality talent, as well as
working to make an impact withinthe recruiting industry. We talk
straight about today'sprofessional world with real
world professionals, experts inrecruitment, job seekers and
business owners alike. Have aquestion for us? Send it in and
(00:25):
you might spur our nextconversation.
I'm Tara Thurber, co founder anddirector of talent partnerships
here at DefineTalent. Andjoining me today is Matt
Berrafato. The Purpose Hunter.
Hey, Matt, how are you today?
Matt Berrafato (00:41):
Tara, I am just very excited to be here today.
You have no idea. So thank you.
Thank you so much for having me.
Tara Thurber (00:49):
Of course. So, Matt, you're coming to us live
from the Windy City. Can youstart off by just providing some
background for our listeners?
Maybe some personal history andprofessional backgrounds. So we
can just get to know you alittle bit.
But no, no worries. So yeah, I'mborn and raised here in Chicago.
(01:14):
And it's interesting becauseI've at heart a part of my
story, which you've alreadytalked about. And you I mean,
you're going to talk about I'msure is I'm an old hockey goalie
and a lot of people I like tosay that first because people
go, what does that have to dowith anything in life? Well, it
really has a lot to do with it.
But my entire professionalcareer has been in sales,
(01:35):
employee benefits for small tomidsize corporations, believe it
or not for 42 years, and gotinvolved in coaching people. And
when I started to do this, Inever realized how often I was
doing this my whole life and mywhole journey has always been
around really talking to peopleabout what do they love to do?
(01:58):
What are they passionate about?
What are the things that they'regood at? What are those kinds of
things and I didn't neverrealize that I did that from the
day I was in high school that Ican remember earliest days in
high school.
Matt Berrafato (02:11):
And I would always love to get into deep
Yeah.
conversations with people and Inever realized there was such a
deep connection. And that's whatI love to do. So I have I've
been married for 42 years. And Ihave three girls, we now have
four grandsons. And we have oneon the way so we're just really
(02:31):
excited.
Tara Thurber (02:31):
Yay! So you shared a little bit about your history
and professional background.
Now. Also, what I would love foryou to do is share with us why
the greatest world in the job(laughs) greatest job in the
world is a goalie. I'm fromCanada. So I understand the
(02:51):
importance of hockey. But agoalie?
Matt Berrafato (02:55):
Yeah, there you go. I love it. What Tara is
referencing to you listeners outthere is referencing I did a
blog post that says the greatestjob in the world and it's being
a hockey goalie. And a lot ofpeople I know we're looking go
"are you nuts?!"
Tara Thurber (03:10):
(laughs)
Matt Berrafato (03:12):
I love being a goalie for many reasons, but one
of the things and it's reallyclosely tied to my purpose for
being on this planet, which isreally strange people sometimes
look for collections andconnections. I mean, and you
know, as a goalie, I became agoalie because you're a hockey
fan. So you know this but as ahockey fan. Goalies played the
(03:35):
whole game, which is I saidthat's a cool thing.
Tara Thurber (03:38):
(laughs)
Matt Berrafato (03:38):
And I think the second best part about being a
goalie was you can get a penaltyand you don't have to go to the
Tara Thurber (03:43):
Yep. (laughs)
Matt Berrafato (03:43):
I remember when I was 10 years old. What a great
penalty box.
Tara Thurber (03:43):
(laughs)
Matt Berrafato (03:48):
So it's a little pressure on me. But in the same
deal that is, right? And ofcourse as I started jumping into
token, it's one of those thingsso I I've just always enjoyed
being in the in that kind of aLimelight from the perspective
it and I started to realizebeing a goalie, you know, any
(04:08):
team that's ever done well, inany hockey endeavor, as far as
certainly championship, youdon't do it unless you have a
goaltender that is that can Isay stand on their head, a
(04:33):
that when I know my job is tostop the puck, how do I do that?
goalie that can stop people whenno one else can a it's a you
And how do I help my team win?
And it's been a part of myleadership. A lot about my the
leadership that I have broughtknow, similar to like a
quarterback, I guess on ato the world has come from the
fact that I can view the wholeice of what's happening in life.
And when when they're coming infootball but as a goalie, too,
it's an odd thing because as aon me and my defenseman are
(04:55):
skating backwards. They don'tthey don't see the whole Ice Ice
the whole ice. And so being upgoalie, I could be the best
goalie ever and stop every shot.
being a goalie is the greatestthing ever. Because, you know
the other thing too is I couldnever imagine getting hit by a
250 pound person into theseboards. There's like a wall.
But if I'm on a team thatdoesn't score a goal, I end up
Tara Thurber (05:11):
Yeah (laughs).
Matt Berrafato (05:12):
Oh, I got to do is look at a puck coming in. And
so it's coming to me 100 milesan hour who cares. But it's just
a little puck like that. That'sit. And I just love that. And so
I love doing that's why I lovebeing a goalie.
with a tie.
Tara Thurber (05:22):
I love that so much map. So we want to dive
into 2024 super strong, withintentional purpose in mind. I
want to dive into your book,Purpose Hunting, Navigating your
Way to a Fulfilled Life. Wheredid you get the idea? And what
(05:45):
do you want readers to takeaway?
Matt Berrafato (05:47):
I love it. Thank you for asking that. So my first
book was written 20 years ago,and my first book was called
Elephant Hunting. And it was mylife philosophy. And why is it
elephants? White Elephant, whyelephant? Wy Elephant. The
philosophy is based on ametaphor thar you and I have
(06:08):
talked about it.
Tara Thurber (06:09):
Yes (laughs).
Matt Berrafato (06:10):
How do you eat an elephant. And of course, it's
one bite at a time is how you dothat. So I want everybody know
I'm not hurting elephants. Idon't hunt elephants. I don't
eat real elephants. It's ametaphor, a big project, you
break into little pieces. Andyou do one bite at a time. So
when I wrote that book, that wasmy life philosophy. And I wanted
my daughters to have this is howI lived my life.
Tara Thurber (06:33):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (06:33):
In any big project I've ever done, I took
big projects, broken littlepieces, and I got them done.
Okay? And as that start is thatso that was 20 years ago, and my
whole life has been aroundeverything I do is like that.
Well, I didn't realize that oneof the most important parts of
that philosophy is understandingyour Cornerstone values.
Tara Thurber (06:53):
Right.
Matt Berrafato (06:53):
And it's a big part of that, which means what's
Tara Thurber (06:54):
(laughs) most important to you, in each
of your life arenas? And my
Matt Berrafato (06:57):
It's really about, hey, you can change. And
first book had it in a differentorder. It was like, Oh, I really
I talked about finding purpose,but I never was direct about it.
But I really went deeply onwhat's most important to you. So
as I start to coach more andmore people, I started to see
that my book does my first book,and this one, but the first
(07:17):
book, especially forces, peoplelook in the mirror and look at
themselves. Who are you? And alot of people don't like what
they see. And what I was reallysurprised that was a lot of
people will put they'll look inthe mirror like "oh, look what I
see" they put my book down andthey've shoving forward, they're
going, you've missed the wholepoint of what you think the book
(07:39):
is.
the issue is how can I change tobe the best version myself?
Tara Thurber (07:46):
Right.
Matt Berrafato (07:47):
So the new book is front and center about
purpose hunting, find yourpurpose, first. If you can
figure out why you're on thisplanet. The reason you were
born, the reason the purpose foryour being, you're going to
stick out the work what I callhard work to figure out your
Cornerstone values, what's mostimportant to you. And I didn't
(08:08):
realize before I wasn't, theorder was backwards. So what I
love about the new book is thatit puts right in the front. Hey,
if you don't know why on thisplanet, join the club, because
there's a lot of people don'tknow why they're on this planet.
And don't be afraid of that.
Let's go to let's go down here.
And let's figure out the way wecan have an idea of Oh, what if
I, if I know I'm here? Oh,great. If I don't know why I'm
(08:30):
here, I'm not going to just giveup and say oh my gosh, my life's
over. No, there's a formula. Andthat's what I've been doing is
I've been actually capturingwhat is that process to figure
Tara Thurber (08:39):
Right. I love it.
And I love that it's come in, Ithat out?
like the navigating. You know,the purpose hunting and just
navigating your way. I mean,navigating oneself is hard. And
figuring out that way is hard.
So t's just, it's phenomenal tobe able to sit and chat with you
(09:00):
and learn. I mean, 20 yearslater, you took something you
created and realized, I mean,you brought yourself into now,
this new book to share witheverybody have almost a little
bit of a flip to say, Okay,here's your purpose. Now let's
figure out how to do it.
Matt Berrafato (09:21):
Right. So here's there's actually two parts of
the question or two parts of thestatement.
Tara Thurber (09:25):
Right.
Matt Berrafato (09:26):
It's not just finding your purpose. Tara, it's
find your purpose. And how doyou live it every day?
Tara Thurber (09:32):
Yes.
Matt Berrafato (09:32):
Because that I think is the biggest challenge.
The bigger challenge or thebiggest challenge. Yeah, you
need to find your purpose. Butonce you do, how do you live it
every single day of your life?
Tara Thurber (09:43):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (09:43):
And I'm not saying that we're always gonna
be able to live the whole thingbut on a scale of one to 10. If
you can do seven out of 10.
That's better than two out of10.
Tara Thurber (09:51):
Right (laughs).
Matt Berrafato (09:53):
That much I've learned and so what I love is
that and you'll think aboutnavigating I love that word
navigating because it's almostlike if you don't have a
roadmap. And I always you know,and I use this example all the
time is Alice in Wonderland. Ilove that story, Alice in
Wonderland.
Tara Thurber (10:10):
Mmm me too.
Matt Berrafato (10:11):
And she goes, when she meets the Cheshire Cat,
she's at a fork in the road, shemeets the cat, you know, she
meets the Cheshire Cat. And shesays, The cat says, Hey, Alice,
what's going on? And l says,Hey, which road should I take?
And, and right away the catgoes? Well, I don't know what
Alice, where are you going? AndAlice says, Well, I don't know.
(10:32):
And then the cat smiles andsays, Well, I guess it doesn't
matter which road you take themto get there then does it? That
stripes me.
Tara Thurber (10:40):
I just got goose bumps.
Matt Berrafato (10:43):
That's what I think that happened to me too.
And I said, that's the key. Soif you don't know, and what's
going to tell you which road totake? Well, if you don't know
what's most important to you, Idon't know which road you can
take, and it really doesn'tmatter.
Tara Thurber (10:58):
Right.
Matt Berrafato (10:58):
Let's just go and how many people do you know,
Tara that live life and theyjust let they just live life?
They just I'm just going well,wouldn't it be cool if you
actually knew what was mostimportant and you decide to go
that way?
Tara Thurber (11:10):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (11:11):
You know that wasn't going to be the easy way,
instead of taking the easy way.
Because it's a lot easier, butit's not the right way. Does
that make sense?
Tara Thurber (11:20):
It makes total sense. It makes total sense. So
in addition to the book, youalso host the Purpose Hunter
podcast. And now first of all,when do I get to be a guest?
Matt Berrafato (11:36):
Absolutely. You have a right calling an open
invitation. I can't wait.
Literally when we're done today,I wanted to schedule it because
I think you do, you would be agreat guest. Let me give you the
premise of the podcast. And Iguess I started to do it.
Because what I knew was this.
The idea behind it is Iinterview people, ordinary
(11:58):
people, famous people, justpeople about how did you find
your purpose? And when I thoughtabout having this podcast, I
said, you know, I didn't know ifI was going to like it or what I
wasn't sure. So after I starteddoing them right away, I fell in
love with it. Because what I dois I just ask people very those
(12:23):
questions that they're all goingto look at you and go, Oh, not
that question. I go Yeah, that'sthe idea. I want to ask you, how
did you navigate those watersyourself? And the idea behind it
is there's going to be peoplewatching or excuse me listening
to my podcast.
Tara Thurber (12:39):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (12:39):
That through our conversation with whoever I'm
talking to. They may get someclues to their own purpose.
Tara Thurber (12:50):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (12:50):
And and so as I go through these interviews, I
am just in awe at number one,how great conversations that I'm
having with people. And Ichallenge them and they many
times they have to pause theygo. That's a good question. I'm
not sure. I go, that's okay. I'mnot gonna I'm you know, and I
let them stew a while and I letthem come out. And then I
(13:13):
challenged them on what madewhat made that happen for you.
What, what was the catalyst?
What was the thing thathappened? And usually when they
have an aha moment, and you'regoing, that is fabulous. And
you're somebody who's listeningto it need to hear that could
probably apply that to their ownlife. And that's why the podcast
has been really wonderful. Ijust can't wait to get more and
(13:33):
more people that will be willingto share it. You know, people
think to me, they go just likeyou did, hey, I want to be on
your podcast. Well, before yousay you want to be on my cat
Podcast. I'm gonna put you onthe spot.
Tara Thurber (13:46):
Yeah (laughs).
Matt Berrafato (13:48):
And a lot of people don't like that. I know
you do. You and I had greatinsights on our conversation. So
thank you for that. Bringingthat up.
Tara Thurber (13:55):
Yeah, no problem.
So before we dive into your Top5Ways to Find Your Purpose, I
want to just throw a funquestion in there and ask you,
how would you describe yourperfect day?
Matt Berrafato (14:11):
My perfect day?
Well, my perfect day. It'susually I'm a morning person.
And so a lot of times peopledon't I think it's a really when
I coach people I really wantthem to really understand where
are you at your best Are you inthe morning an afternoon or
evening person, you know, all ofus have a place in the day that
(14:33):
we are at our best. And we'resharp, we're thinking we're just
there's something about it andso I love waking up before
anybody else in my household.
Now when they were kids, itwould be different but now my
kids are gone. It's just me andmy wife and but I love when I
can't sleep. As a matter offact, what I love most about
(14:57):
what I do is making other peoplenot sleep the next state by the
way.
Tara Thurber (15:00):
Yes, I've experienced that I've
experienced that (laughs).
Matt Berrafato (15:05):
I'm glad that you still smiling when I say it,
but I actually love doing that.
So I love when I can't sleep atnight, and I wake up, I don't
want to just lay there and just,I just don't like that. So I'll
get up, I'll find my favoritechair. In the living room, I put
on my favorite brainstormingmusic, I have a blank sheet of
paper. And I have my favoritepen, this is so important, I
(15:27):
have my favorite pen. And I amable to sit down and I start to
just let I start to let thingsfall out of my mind onto paper,
I let it fall. And the writingprocess to me is something
that's very unique. And it has abig part of this. So my ideal
day is to start like that, thatI'm able to just before anyone
(15:48):
else gets up. And even sometimesbefore I even have my first cup
of coffee, I've just all of asudden got these things flowing
out. And I'm and I don't like tostop. So I just like to keep it
letting you know. And that'swhat happens is when you do it
the right way. And so I love todo that. So then once I'm done
with that would be to work out Ireally like to I'm not a big
(16:12):
runner. I mean, I now havelearned how to learn to run
learned, I've learned to likerunning just crazy. As a hockey
goalie, you don't have to runlike, you know, that's one of
the other things I love being ahockey goalie. But I really love
you know, what I understandabout these bodies we have is
that they don't last forever.
(16:32):
And if you don't take care ofit. Good luck on this planet,
you know, in this plant, we needthat body. And again, that's
part of the product deal. So Ilove that. And then, you know,
then can I be purpose hunting?
Can I have conversations likethis as often as I can, helping
or just talking with otherpeople about why are they here?
Yeah, pure and simple.
Tara Thurber (16:54):
Now that sounds like an amazing day.
Matt Berrafato (16:57):
Well, thank you.
My family's around. It's my wifeand my kids, my grandkids even
better, but you know what? I'm,if I'm able to purpose hunt with
them better yet.
Tara Thurber (17:08):
Wow. So wow, well, I agree with the writing and
getting into I call it the flow,you start something and that's
like, your perfect start to theday or where you need to be. And
then before you it, it's threehours later, and you're like,
Oh, great. Now let's dosomething else. And you know,
(17:30):
you flow with your day. So Ireally love what you shared with
us, Matt.
Matt Berrafato (17:34):
Thank you. Thank you.
Tara Thurber (17:37):
So now I am, what I'm waiting for are your Top5
Ways to Finding your Purpose.
Please share with us. Okay,
Matt Berrafato (17:50):
So this was actually I had to think really
deeply last night about becausethe topic of your show is your
top five, when you say oh godgive top five ways.
Tara Thurber (18:01):
(laughs)
Matt Berrafato (18:03):
What I'm going to do is I'm going to break it
down, because I think that thereare different things you can do.
So I'm going to just kind ofnumbering them one through five
doesn't mean which one goesfirst. But these are the top
these are the top five. And thevery first one is what we were
just talking about a little bit,which is I want you to explore
your gifts. And everybody I'veever sent it through, they look
(18:28):
at me and they and you justdidn't know the first time we
ever talked about it. And theyuse Oh yeah, I get that and say
no, you don't know what I'mtalking about. I'm talking a
deep, deep dive on exploringwhat your gifts are. And I'm
saying what are the God givengifts that you have? And only
you have? And you don't evenhave to think about these
(18:49):
things. And they come thatnatural to you. And you know
what every person I've ever doneand I want to brainstorm with
that. And I want people toidentify what are the greatest
gifts you have. And you mighthave 10, you might have 15, you
might have 25 might have five,you have at least one. But I
know you have many. And that'swhat I call the what I'm gonna
(19:12):
say that's one of the waysbecause there's so many clues
that are wrapped around findingyour purpose in life.
Tara Thurber (19:18):
Right.
Matt Berrafato (19:19):
That are directly tied to something that.
You know how many times I'vetalked to people and they go,
and I go, I do this exercise inmy workshops. And I just love
brainstorming, I have a seriesof questions. And I just love
watching the people's face asthey start right and they start
to smile. Every time I do that Istop and I say Why are you
(19:41):
smiling? Whatever you wrotedown, and they look at me and
they go, I haven't thought aboutthat since I was in eighth
grade. And I just said why not?
And they go, I don't even know.
Tara Thurber (19:54):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (19:55):
And usually everybody has things that
they're so good at. So naturalat and they've forgotten that
taken for granted and they havenot done those things. And when
they're stuck with, I'm not surewhat my purpose is. That's the
first place I'm gonna go. Sothat's number one, what we're
going to do. Number two, I wantthem to examine what are they
(20:18):
passionate about? And again,it's one of those things where
people go, Oh, well, I think Iknow what you're talking about,
you know, what are youpassionate about? I think you
and I were one of theconversations I saw a was it a
surfboard, or some something. Itwas a surfboard.
Tara Thurber (20:35):
Yup.
Matt Berrafato (20:36):
And I couldn't wait to ask you about it just so
I could hear your story about itjust like you were asking me
about being a hockey goalie.
Tara Thurber (20:43):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (20:44):
And, again, it's a way of finding purpose.
Because what people don'trealize is that when you're that
passionate about something, it'snot an accident. It's a matter
of fact, they've lived part oftheir life going through
something that they go, youknow, I love go to a like a
(21:05):
barbecue, or maybe a party orsomething. And they start
talking, and I'll talk to awoman or a man, and all of a
sudden, they'll start talkingabout a guy a lot of times on
when he loved to barbecue andsmoke meats and do this kind of
I just am intrigued with that.
And I just asked question, I lethim talk. And before you know
what, they're gone, you know,they they're going, Am I boring
you?
Tara Thurber (21:27):
(laughs)
Matt Berrafato (21:27):
And I go, boring me? You are inspiring me if. And
people don't realize howinspiring they can be to other
people.
Tara Thurber (21:37):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (21:38):
When they touch something they're passionate
about. And a lot of times youhave many passions. In my
opinion, you only have onepurpose. When I say one, I make
the purpose.
Tara Thurber (21:48):
Right.
Matt Berrafato (21:48):
Like the purpose. Some people all you got
no, no, you'll understand whenyou go through this process.
Tara Thurber (21:53):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (21:54):
And but many passions. So yeah, so number two
is what are you passionateabout? Okay. Now, any one of
these by themselves would haveworked by themselves, I don't
know. But I know there have beenmany clues where you can start
connecting dots.
Tara Thurber (22:07):
Absolutely.
Matt Berrafato (22:08):
But slowly, I start on that. And then number
three is determine who you canserve with your gifts and your
passion. So determine who youcan serve. So it says there's
like a question that I would askyourself, Who can I serve? With
(22:29):
this thing that I'm really goodat, and that I'm really
passionate about. And peopledon't realize how powerful that
statement is because you'regone? You know, you and I even
talked about because I know youreally have skilled people. I've
had never had anybody who says,Hey, I asked them what your
purpose is. And they go, Well,you know what, I want to help
people? And well, that's great,because I think everybody does.
(22:51):
But if you don't define thatthen that's when you start to
get really specific clues aboutyour purpose, when you start to
define who can you actuallyhelp? And what are those, you
know, a lot of times there'speople and that you may be the
only one that can help someone.
And if you are the only one canhelp someone, you're not
(23:11):
fulfilling your purpose unlessyou're actually not afraid to go
towards that, and really go outthere off that. So number three,
again, by itself isn't gonna doit. Might okay, I you know, I
love I've stopped started anyone of those three, and I'll go,
but number four is one that'sreally probably one of the most
powerful, and I call it legacy.
(23:36):
And called legacy because what Iwant people to do is ask the
question of themselves, whotaught you the greatest lessons
in your life? Whether they arestill with us or not? So if
they've passed away, that is oneof the most powerful groups and
then if they're still alive,great. You can make me think
(23:59):
about someone that just died.
Yeah. You think it makes methink about someone that I
really loved? Or they loved meand they're not with me anymore?
Yeah. Because here's myquestion. Why I think it's one
of the greatest ways to findyour purpose is, is there
something that that persontaught you that was not supposed
to go to their grave? Oh, yeah.
(24:29):
You just you've just grown alittle bit because that's, I
think that's really powerful.
Tara Thurber (24:34):
Very powerful.
Matt Berrafato (24:35):
If you don't teach someone else what they
taught you. What if you were theonly one that learned the
lesson. And that's why I thinkthere's a responsibility ie
purpose to maybe teachingsomeone else what you learn, and
I want to share a little storythat it really ties excuse me
ties that together.
Tara Thurber (24:54):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (24:56):
I love being a hockey goalie when I was in high
school. My best friend was aforward, he loved being a
forward. Our two passionsbrought us together to play on
the same team in high school.
Our senior year he was going inon a breakaway, got checked from
behind, hit the board's headfirst, ended up breaking his
neck. As a senior in highschool. I'll never forget this.
(25:21):
I'll never forget this, skatingup to him where the coach had
pulled his skates off his feet,and was pinching his toes and
said, Michael, can you feelthis? Michael, can you feel
this? Michael, can you feelthis? And he said, No. He broke
his neck that night. And I havealways asked this question. Why
(25:48):
was I on the ice to watch thathappen? I was the goalie
watching him going in abreakaway, he hits the board, I
saw him hit the ice. I come upthere and find out he's a
quadriplegic. I mean, we didn'tknow this for his whole life.
And he ended up passing away 13years ago. And I don't think the
(26:12):
lessons he taught me about whatI needed to know about people
who are disabled, was supposedto go to his death to his grave.
I think I'm responsible forteaching those things to other
people. And that's deeplyconnected to my purpose. And I
think everybody has a scenariolike that, whether it's a mom or
(26:34):
a dad or grandpa, whoever raisedyou, a friend, I don't really
care, but what lessons theyteach you. And then if that
doesn't work, then you look atpeople who are still with you
that they taught you lessons,and that is where you get a huge
connection. Does that makessense?
Tara Thurber (26:49):
It makes total sense. Absolutely. Makes sense.
Matt Berrafato (26:53):
And I just you know what? It leads me to number
five, which is the the end alland be all on finding purpose.
Try a different combination ofmy number one, two, and three.
And don't stop trying. Andpeople go what are you talking
(27:14):
If you were togo and someone says I'm not
about?
Tara Thurber (27:14):
(laughs) sure. Because here's here's what
I know, people fall into one ofthree categories - one of three
purpose buckets? Number one iseither - I'm not sure my
purpose. But no, no, I think Iknow my purpose. But I'm not
sure. That's the number onebucket number one. bucket number
two is I don't know my purpose.
(27:36):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (27:37):
Or bucket.
Number three is, I know mypurpose, but I'm not living it
every day. And what I know isthis, here's how you figure out
your purpose. You take yournumber one gift, remember you
brainstormed on that, what'syour number one gift, your
natural thing that you love todo that you're really good at?
Number two, it's a three leggedstool. Number two, you look at
what are you passionate about?
Tara Thurber (28:01):
Tight.
Matt Berrafato (28:01):
And then number three, you look at who can I
serve with your gifts and yourpassion. So if you take your
number one gift, and you takeyour number one passion, and
you're no one group of peopleyou can serve, wrap a ribbon
around that stool, jump in thewater and start playing in that
water. And if something doesn'temerge, that is your purpose
then guess what you do. Okay,well, let's try this. Let's
(28:22):
change the order up. Let's takemy number three gift. And let's
take my number four passion. Andmy number two person people I
can serve, wrap a ribbon aroundit, jump in the water and jump
in and go, Oh, well, that didn'twork. And then you know, when
you get to the fifth time and itdidn't work at all, I guess I
don't have a purpose. No, youhaven't found the right
(28:43):
combination. I don't want you tostop. So maybe it's number six,
gift. And number two, passion.
And number four group of peopleand read and start doing it.
Eventually what will happen,Tara is your purpose is going to
emerge from a completelyunexpected place. And it's going
to come and hit you right in thechest. You're going to turn your
(29:03):
attention go. That's it. That'swhy I'm here. Now what do I do?
Tara Thurber (29:07):
(laughs)
Matt Berrafato (29:10):
And that's the secret to finding purpose. Don't
ever quit. Don't ever stoplooking at combinations. And I
think good people get reallythey go Oh my What if it takes
me a year? I don't care. It tookme till I was 58 years old to
figure mine out.
Tara Thurber (29:24):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (29:25):
But it's never too late. Never too late, never
ever, ever too late. And whenyou finally get to that place
where you're touching that thingcalled purpose. Here's the first
thing that you'll feel - timecompletely disappears when
you're doing it.
Tara Thurber (29:44):
Yes.
Matt Berrafato (29:45):
Right? And if you feel that if you actually
feel that happening, and youjust touch that and you go oh my
gosh, and you're going - That'swhat I'm what I'm telling people
pay attention to what you'redoing. And usually people Oh,
what do you mean? So that personwho is the barbecue talking
about barbecuing, or maybe youlove surfing, or maybe you love
(30:06):
flowers, or maybe you lovecooking, or baking or something,
you don't realize that energythat's flowing from you. Number
one, when you're doing that, Iknow time is completely
disappearing. Number two, you'reinspiring other people with your
energy. And people don'trealize, because here's, I'm
(30:27):
gonna end on this, I think thatthere's a responsibility for
every human being, to get soexcited. And get so enthusiastic
about something that they arepassionate about. So that
whoever you're talking to canfeel your emotion. I think you
(30:52):
can feel it right now. I'mhoping your listeners can feel
the emotion that comes from mewhen I'm purpose hunting,
because it's inspiring people.
And here's the thing. If I don'tdo that, if I don't let other
people feel my passion, if youdon't let people feel your
passion, I think you're stealingan opportunity for that person
you're talking to, to beinspired by you. That's a
(31:14):
responsibility. I don't takethat lightly. I think that
people say they go, Oh, am Iboring? I say boring me? No,
that's your responsibility toget excited. Let people get
inspired. And all of a sudden,you don't know, you may be the
only one that can inspire thatperson. Because you let your
emotions out. And they felt it.
Tara Thurber (31:37):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (31:37):
That makes sense?
Tara Thurber (31:39):
Absolutely. It's like, this magic that happens,
this energetic magic tointernally, but when somebody
else can feel that, and thegoosebumps and it's all the
fields, it's not just onefeeling. It's all the fields.
And it's magic. It's magical,what comes of it when you can do
(32:05):
that. And you do that.
Matt Berrafato (32:08):
When you say magical, and it's you that this
is one of the reasons you and Ihave had so many meaningful
conversations.
Tara Thurber (32:16):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (32:17):
Inspirational conversations, because we've
allowed each other to be to beinspired. And when you think
about what you do for you know,in your work as far as helping
people get find the right job,think about that. Okay? When you
really find the right job. Okay,I actually call it career one
(32:37):
and career two, I don't know ifanybody career one career to
career two follow me on thiscareer two is what you do to
make a living. You're usuallyvery good at it. You're usually
bringing value to the to themarketplace in a really
significant way. But you don'tnecessarily love it. That's
(33:01):
career two. If you can look atme, I'm holding up to his career
one is something you love to do.
But you don't necessarily make aliving doing it right now. Oh,
wouldn't it be cool if you couldmeld those two worlds together
and do something you love whileserving a group of people using
(33:23):
your gifts and your passions,and you hit a homerun that that
magic that you just describedhappens? And a lot of people I
don't think they put thattogether and they go, Oh, I'll
never find that a go. No,remember my number five point
don't ever stop. Put thedifferent combinations, maybe
maybe it's that number one gift,and you just got to choose. It's
(33:43):
just that one, not not numbertwo, but number three, passion.
And then it's, it's just makingone adjustment. And then when
you make that one adjustment,all I've done and it gets back
to my book, all I've done was Ihave watched my progress and
what I did, I've documented myprocess. And all I'm doing to
people showing them Don't youhave to pay attention to these
(34:07):
clues that come from each one ofthe things we've talked about.
Tara Thurber (34:10):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (34:11):
When you do that and you put this right
combination together when youhit it, it's like that's it and
that's when you go oh my gosh,and now you now you sit there
and go what am I going to donow? Well, you know really what
you just did was you gave birthto an elephant.
Tara Thurber (34:25):
Right (laughs).
Matt Berrafato (34:28):
You know what, Tara? Be careful because you
will either you will either killit or it will kill you if you're
not organized.
Tara Thurber (34:38):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (34:39):
And that's when you get into this whole thing of
oh my gosh, you know myfavorite, favorite people that I
love to coach to there's twodifferent groups of people my
favorite are people like my age.
Okay, I'm only 39 Well okaycalendar says I'm 65 but I never
paid attention to that thinganyways.
Tara Thurber (34:55):
(laughs)
Matt Berrafato (34:56):
But but those that are like looking at
retirement looking for work orthey're about to retire. Right?
Tara Thurber (35:01):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (35:02):
And my favorite question when someone is either
retired or about to retire, ifyou did not have to make money
anymore, what would you do? Andpeople are silent. And they go,
Oh my gosh, and he deer in theheadlights? I'm going no, that's
the beautiful part is what wouldyou do if you did not have to
(35:22):
make money? Would you go and youknow, who could you serve with
your gifts and your passion? Ifyou didn't have to make money?
That would be it'd be a utopiaforever. Right? Well, that's
when people you know people whoyou ever heard someone who
retires and then they die verysoon after.
They've studiedthis, you know that in your
Tara Thurber (35:40):
Yeah.
world, right? They study this.
And if you don't have a purpose,you don't have a bigger reason
to be when you stop doing yourwork and you know, when you when
you're done working, you know,42 years in the insurance
business I was really good atbut I didn't love it. Doing
this. I could do this forever.
And I will do it forever. Aslong as God willing, God Willing
(36:01):
that he's letting me be here andI take care of my body. Same
with you say how do you becauseyou're, you're a coach, you are
touching lives, you are doingthings in ways that you don't
realize how important that is.
Powerful. Matt,I'm, I have no words right now.
(36:22):
I'm filled. Everything thatyou've just touched upon. For
our audience listening, it's upto you. And you get to take
those steps. And it's one step,one after the other. And keep
moving forward. And, Matt, thankyou so so very much for sharing
(36:47):
your top five ways to findingyour purpose. I want to make
sure we share your book, I wantto make sure we share your
podcast for all of our listenersout there on a mission for 2024.
Let's make it happen.
Matt Berrafato (37:04):
Well, thank you for having me, Tara. It's been a
pleasure and I can't wait tomeet anybody who's listening.
Reach out to me and I'm sureyou'll have a link to get a hold
of me. I appreciate that. Thankyou so much.
Tara Thurber (37:17):
Absolutely. We are DefinedTalent, a DefinedLogic
service coming to you at Top5.
Make it a great day.
Hey everyone, welcome back to Top5 brought to
(00:02):
you by DefineTalent. We are aresults driven service working
with clients to connect themwith quality talent, as well as
working to make an impact withinthe recruiting industry. We talk
straight about today'sprofessional world with real
world professionals, experts inrecruitment, job seekers and
business owners alike. Have aquestion for us? Send it in and
(00:25):
you might spur our nextconversation.
I'm Tara Thurber, co founder anddirector of talent partnerships
here at DefineTalent. Andjoining me today is Matt
Berrafato. The Purpose Hunter.
Hey, Matt, how are you today?
Matt Berrafato (00:41):
Tara, I am just very excited to be here today.
You have no idea. So thank you.
Thank you so much for having me.
Tara Thurber (00:49):
Of course. So, Matt, you're coming to us live
from the Windy City. Can youstart off by just providing some
background for our listeners?
Maybe some personal history andprofessional backgrounds. So we
can just get to know you alittle bit.
But no, no worries. So yeah, I'mborn and raised here in Chicago.
(01:14):
And it's interesting becauseI've at heart a part of my
story, which you've alreadytalked about. And you I mean,
you're going to talk about I'msure is I'm an old hockey goalie
and a lot of people I like tosay that first because people
go, what does that have to dowith anything in life? Well, it
really has a lot to do with it.
But my entire professionalcareer has been in sales,
(01:35):
employee benefits for small tomidsize corporations, believe it
or not for 42 years, and gotinvolved in coaching people. And
when I started to do this, Inever realized how often I was
doing this my whole life and mywhole journey has always been
around really talking to peopleabout what do they love to do?
(01:58):
What are they passionate about?
What are the things that they'regood at? What are those kinds of
things and I didn't neverrealize that I did that from the
day I was in high school that Ican remember earliest days in
high school.
Matt Berrafato (02:11):
And I would always love to get into deep
Yeah.
conversations with people and Inever realized there was such a
deep connection. And that's whatI love to do. So I have I've
been married for 42 years. And Ihave three girls, we now have
four grandsons. And we have oneon the way so we're just really
(02:31):
excited.
Tara Thurber (02:31):
Yay! So you shared a little bit about your history
and professional background.
Now. Also, what I would love foryou to do is share with us why
the greatest world in the job(laughs) greatest job in the
world is a goalie. I'm fromCanada. So I understand the
(02:51):
importance of hockey. But agoalie?
Matt Berrafato (02:55):
Yeah, there you go. I love it. What Tara is
referencing to you listeners outthere is referencing I did a
blog post that says the greatestjob in the world and it's being
a hockey goalie. And a lot ofpeople I know we're looking go
"are you nuts?!"
Tara Thurber (03:10):
(laughs)
Matt Berrafato (03:12):
I love being a goalie for many reasons, but one
of the things and it's reallyclosely tied to my purpose for
being on this planet, which isreally strange people sometimes
look for collections andconnections. I mean, and you
know, as a goalie, I became agoalie because you're a hockey
fan. So you know this but as ahockey fan. Goalies played the
(03:35):
whole game, which is I saidthat's a cool thing.
Tara Thurber (03:38):
(laughs)
Matt Berrafato (03:38):
And I think the second best part about being a
goalie was you can get a penaltyand you don't have to go to the
Tara Thurber (03:43):
Yep. (laughs)
Matt Berrafato (03:43):
I remember when I was 10 years old. What a great
penalty box.
Tara Thurber (03:43):
(laughs)
Matt Berrafato (03:48):
So it's a little pressure on me. But in the same
deal that is, right? And ofcourse as I started jumping into
token, it's one of those thingsso I I've just always enjoyed
being in the in that kind of aLimelight from the perspective
it and I started to realizebeing a goalie, you know, any
(04:08):
team that's ever done well, inany hockey endeavor, as far as
certainly championship, youdon't do it unless you have a
goaltender that is that can Isay stand on their head, a
(04:33):
that when I know my job is tostop the puck, how do I do that?
goalie that can stop people whenno one else can a it's a you
And how do I help my team win?
And it's been a part of myleadership. A lot about my the
leadership that I have broughtknow, similar to like a
quarterback, I guess on ato the world has come from the
fact that I can view the wholeice of what's happening in life.
And when when they're coming infootball but as a goalie, too,
it's an odd thing because as aon me and my defenseman are
(04:55):
skating backwards. They don'tthey don't see the whole Ice Ice
the whole ice. And so being upgoalie, I could be the best
goalie ever and stop every shot.
being a goalie is the greatestthing ever. Because, you know
the other thing too is I couldnever imagine getting hit by a
250 pound person into theseboards. There's like a wall.
But if I'm on a team thatdoesn't score a goal, I end up
Tara Thurber (05:11):
Yeah (laughs).
Matt Berrafato (05:12):
Oh, I got to do is look at a puck coming in. And
so it's coming to me 100 milesan hour who cares. But it's just
a little puck like that. That'sit. And I just love that. And so
I love doing that's why I lovebeing a goalie.
with a tie.
Tara Thurber (05:22):
I love that so much map. So we want to dive
into 2024 super strong, withintentional purpose in mind. I
want to dive into your book,Purpose Hunting, Navigating your
Way to a Fulfilled Life. Wheredid you get the idea? And what
(05:45):
do you want readers to takeaway?
Matt Berrafato (05:47):
I love it. Thank you for asking that. So my first
book was written 20 years ago,and my first book was called
Elephant Hunting. And it was mylife philosophy. And why is it
elephants? White Elephant, whyelephant? Wy Elephant. The
philosophy is based on ametaphor thar you and I have
(06:08):
talked about it.
Tara Thurber (06:09):
Yes (laughs).
Matt Berrafato (06:10):
How do you eat an elephant. And of course, it's
one bite at a time is how you dothat. So I want everybody know
I'm not hurting elephants. Idon't hunt elephants. I don't
eat real elephants. It's ametaphor, a big project, you
break into little pieces. Andyou do one bite at a time. So
when I wrote that book, that wasmy life philosophy. And I wanted
my daughters to have this is howI lived my life.
Tara Thurber (06:33):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (06:33):
In any big project I've ever done, I took
big projects, broken littlepieces, and I got them done.
Okay? And as that start is thatso that was 20 years ago, and my
whole life has been aroundeverything I do is like that.
Well, I didn't realize that oneof the most important parts of
that philosophy is understandingyour Cornerstone values.
Tara Thurber (06:53):
Right.
Matt Berrafato (06:53):
And it's a big part of that, which means what's
Tara Thurber (06:54):
(laughs) most important to you, in each
of your life arenas? And my
Matt Berrafato (06:57):
It's really about, hey, you can change. And
first book had it in a differentorder. It was like, Oh, I really
I talked about finding purpose,but I never was direct about it.
But I really went deeply onwhat's most important to you. So
as I start to coach more andmore people, I started to see
that my book does my first book,and this one, but the first
(07:17):
book, especially forces, peoplelook in the mirror and look at
themselves. Who are you? And alot of people don't like what
they see. And what I was reallysurprised that was a lot of
people will put they'll look inthe mirror like "oh, look what I
see" they put my book down andthey've shoving forward, they're
going, you've missed the wholepoint of what you think the book
(07:39):
is.
the issue is how can I change tobe the best version myself?
Tara Thurber (07:46):
Right.
Matt Berrafato (07:47):
So the new book is front and center about
purpose hunting, find yourpurpose, first. If you can
figure out why you're on thisplanet. The reason you were
born, the reason the purpose foryour being, you're going to
stick out the work what I callhard work to figure out your
Cornerstone values, what's mostimportant to you. And I didn't
(08:08):
realize before I wasn't, theorder was backwards. So what I
love about the new book is thatit puts right in the front. Hey,
if you don't know why on thisplanet, join the club, because
there's a lot of people don'tknow why they're on this planet.
And don't be afraid of that.
Let's go to let's go down here.
And let's figure out the way wecan have an idea of Oh, what if
I, if I know I'm here? Oh,great. If I don't know why I'm
(08:30):
here, I'm not going to just giveup and say oh my gosh, my life's
over. No, there's a formula. Andthat's what I've been doing is
I've been actually capturingwhat is that process to figure
Tara Thurber (08:39):
Right. I love it.
And I love that it's come in, Ithat out?
like the navigating. You know,the purpose hunting and just
navigating your way. I mean,navigating oneself is hard. And
figuring out that way is hard.
So t's just, it's phenomenal tobe able to sit and chat with you
(09:00):
and learn. I mean, 20 yearslater, you took something you
created and realized, I mean,you brought yourself into now,
this new book to share witheverybody have almost a little
bit of a flip to say, Okay,here's your purpose. Now let's
figure out how to do it.
Matt Berrafato (09:21):
Right. So here's there's actually two parts of
the question or two parts of thestatement.
Tara Thurber (09:25):
Right.
Matt Berrafato (09:26):
It's not just finding your purpose. Tara, it's
find your purpose. And how doyou live it every day?
Tara Thurber (09:32):
Yes.
Matt Berrafato (09:32):
Because that I think is the biggest challenge.
The bigger challenge or thebiggest challenge. Yeah, you
need to find your purpose. Butonce you do, how do you live it
every single day of your life?
Tara Thurber (09:43):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (09:43):
And I'm not saying that we're always gonna
be able to live the whole thingbut on a scale of one to 10. If
you can do seven out of 10.
That's better than two out of10.
Tara Thurber (09:51):
Right (laughs).
Matt Berrafato (09:53):
That much I've learned and so what I love is
that and you'll think aboutnavigating I love that word
navigating because it's almostlike if you don't have a
roadmap. And I always you know,and I use this example all the
time is Alice in Wonderland. Ilove that story, Alice in
Wonderland.
Tara Thurber (10:10):
Mmm me too.
Matt Berrafato (10:11):
And she goes, when she meets the Cheshire Cat,
she's at a fork in the road, shemeets the cat, you know, she
meets the Cheshire Cat. And shesays, The cat says, Hey, Alice,
what's going on? And l says,Hey, which road should I take?
And, and right away the catgoes? Well, I don't know what
Alice, where are you going? AndAlice says, Well, I don't know.
(10:32):
And then the cat smiles andsays, Well, I guess it doesn't
matter which road you take themto get there then does it? That
stripes me.
Tara Thurber (10:40):
I just got goose bumps.
Matt Berrafato (10:43):
That's what I think that happened to me too.
And I said, that's the key. Soif you don't know, and what's
going to tell you which road totake? Well, if you don't know
what's most important to you, Idon't know which road you can
take, and it really doesn'tmatter.
Tara Thurber (10:58):
Right.
Matt Berrafato (10:58):
Let's just go and how many people do you know,
Tara that live life and theyjust let they just live life?
They just I'm just going well,wouldn't it be cool if you
actually knew what was mostimportant and you decide to go
that way?
Tara Thurber (11:10):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (11:11):
You know that wasn't going to be the easy way,
instead of taking the easy way.
Because it's a lot easier, butit's not the right way. Does
that make sense?
Tara Thurber (11:20):
It makes total sense. It makes total sense. So
in addition to the book, youalso host the Purpose Hunter
podcast. And now first of all,when do I get to be a guest?
Matt Berrafato (11:36):
Absolutely. You have a right calling an open
invitation. I can't wait.
Literally when we're done today,I wanted to schedule it because
I think you do, you would be agreat guest. Let me give you the
premise of the podcast. And Iguess I started to do it.
Because what I knew was this.
The idea behind it is Iinterview people, ordinary
(11:58):
people, famous people, justpeople about how did you find
your purpose? And when I thoughtabout having this podcast, I
said, you know, I didn't know ifI was going to like it or what I
wasn't sure. So after I starteddoing them right away, I fell in
love with it. Because what I dois I just ask people very those
(12:23):
questions that they're all goingto look at you and go, Oh, not
that question. I go Yeah, that'sthe idea. I want to ask you, how
did you navigate those watersyourself? And the idea behind it
is there's going to be peoplewatching or excuse me listening
to my podcast.
Tara Thurber (12:39):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (12:39):
That through our conversation with whoever I'm
talking to. They may get someclues to their own purpose.
Tara Thurber (12:50):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (12:50):
And and so as I go through these interviews, I
am just in awe at number one,how great conversations that I'm
having with people. And Ichallenge them and they many
times they have to pause theygo. That's a good question. I'm
not sure. I go, that's okay. I'mnot gonna I'm you know, and I
let them stew a while and I letthem come out. And then I
(13:13):
challenged them on what madewhat made that happen for you.
What, what was the catalyst?
What was the thing thathappened? And usually when they
have an aha moment, and you'regoing, that is fabulous. And
you're somebody who's listeningto it need to hear that could
probably apply that to their ownlife. And that's why the podcast
has been really wonderful. Ijust can't wait to get more and
(13:33):
more people that will be willingto share it. You know, people
think to me, they go just likeyou did, hey, I want to be on
your podcast. Well, before yousay you want to be on my cat
Podcast. I'm gonna put you onthe spot.
Tara Thurber (13:46):
Yeah (laughs).
Matt Berrafato (13:48):
And a lot of people don't like that. I know
you do. You and I had greatinsights on our conversation. So
thank you for that. Bringingthat up.
Tara Thurber (13:55):
Yeah, no problem.
So before we dive into your Top5Ways to Find Your Purpose, I
want to just throw a funquestion in there and ask you,
how would you describe yourperfect day?
Matt Berrafato (14:11):
My perfect day?
Well, my perfect day. It'susually I'm a morning person.
And so a lot of times peopledon't I think it's a really when
I coach people I really wantthem to really understand where
are you at your best Are you inthe morning an afternoon or
evening person, you know, all ofus have a place in the day that
(14:33):
we are at our best. And we'resharp, we're thinking we're just
there's something about it andso I love waking up before
anybody else in my household.
Now when they were kids, itwould be different but now my
kids are gone. It's just me andmy wife and but I love when I
can't sleep. As a matter offact, what I love most about
(14:57):
what I do is making other peoplenot sleep the next state by the
way.
Tara Thurber (15:00):
Yes, I've experienced that I've
experienced that (laughs).
Matt Berrafato (15:05):
I'm glad that you still smiling when I say it,
but I actually love doing that.
So I love when I can't sleep atnight, and I wake up, I don't
want to just lay there and just,I just don't like that. So I'll
get up, I'll find my favoritechair. In the living room, I put
on my favorite brainstormingmusic, I have a blank sheet of
paper. And I have my favoritepen, this is so important, I
(15:27):
have my favorite pen. And I amable to sit down and I start to
just let I start to let thingsfall out of my mind onto paper,
I let it fall. And the writingprocess to me is something
that's very unique. And it has abig part of this. So my ideal
day is to start like that, thatI'm able to just before anyone
(15:48):
else gets up. And even sometimesbefore I even have my first cup
of coffee, I've just all of asudden got these things flowing
out. And I'm and I don't like tostop. So I just like to keep it
letting you know. And that'swhat happens is when you do it
the right way. And so I love todo that. So then once I'm done
with that would be to work out Ireally like to I'm not a big
(16:12):
runner. I mean, I now havelearned how to learn to run
learned, I've learned to likerunning just crazy. As a hockey
goalie, you don't have to runlike, you know, that's one of
the other things I love being ahockey goalie. But I really love
you know, what I understandabout these bodies we have is
that they don't last forever.
(16:32):
And if you don't take care ofit. Good luck on this planet,
you know, in this plant, we needthat body. And again, that's
part of the product deal. So Ilove that. And then, you know,
then can I be purpose hunting?
Can I have conversations likethis as often as I can, helping
or just talking with otherpeople about why are they here?
Yeah, pure and simple.
Tara Thurber (16:54):
Now that sounds like an amazing day.
Matt Berrafato (16:57):
Well, thank you.
My family's around. It's my wifeand my kids, my grandkids even
better, but you know what? I'm,if I'm able to purpose hunt with
them better yet.
Tara Thurber (17:08):
Wow. So wow, well, I agree with the writing and
getting into I call it the flow,you start something and that's
like, your perfect start to theday or where you need to be. And
then before you it, it's threehours later, and you're like,
Oh, great. Now let's dosomething else. And you know,
(17:30):
you flow with your day. So Ireally love what you shared with
us, Matt.
Matt Berrafato (17:34):
Thank you. Thank you.
Tara Thurber (17:37):
So now I am, what I'm waiting for are your Top5
Ways to Finding your Purpose.
Please share with us. Okay,
Matt Berrafato (17:50):
So this was actually I had to think really
deeply last night about becausethe topic of your show is your
top five, when you say oh godgive top five ways.
Tara Thurber (18:01):
(laughs)
Matt Berrafato (18:03):
What I'm going to do is I'm going to break it
down, because I think that thereare different things you can do.
So I'm going to just kind ofnumbering them one through five
doesn't mean which one goesfirst. But these are the top
these are the top five. And thevery first one is what we were
just talking about a little bit,which is I want you to explore
your gifts. And everybody I'veever sent it through, they look
(18:28):
at me and they and you justdidn't know the first time we
ever talked about it. And theyuse Oh yeah, I get that and say
no, you don't know what I'mtalking about. I'm talking a
deep, deep dive on exploringwhat your gifts are. And I'm
saying what are the God givengifts that you have? And only
you have? And you don't evenhave to think about these
(18:49):
things. And they come thatnatural to you. And you know
what every person I've ever doneand I want to brainstorm with
that. And I want people toidentify what are the greatest
gifts you have. And you mighthave 10, you might have 15, you
might have 25 might have five,you have at least one. But I
know you have many. And that'swhat I call the what I'm gonna
(19:12):
say that's one of the waysbecause there's so many clues
that are wrapped around findingyour purpose in life.
Tara Thurber (19:18):
Right.
Matt Berrafato (19:19):
That are directly tied to something that.
You know how many times I'vetalked to people and they go,
and I go, I do this exercise inmy workshops. And I just love
brainstorming, I have a seriesof questions. And I just love
watching the people's face asthey start right and they start
to smile. Every time I do that Istop and I say Why are you
(19:41):
smiling? Whatever you wrotedown, and they look at me and
they go, I haven't thought aboutthat since I was in eighth
grade. And I just said why not?
And they go, I don't even know.
Tara Thurber (19:54):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (19:55):
And usually everybody has things that
they're so good at. So naturalat and they've forgotten that
taken for granted and they havenot done those things. And when
they're stuck with, I'm not surewhat my purpose is. That's the
first place I'm gonna go. Sothat's number one, what we're
going to do. Number two, I wantthem to examine what are they
(20:18):
passionate about? And again,it's one of those things where
people go, Oh, well, I think Iknow what you're talking about,
you know, what are youpassionate about? I think you
and I were one of theconversations I saw a was it a
surfboard, or some something. Itwas a surfboard.
Tara Thurber (20:35):
Yup.
Matt Berrafato (20:36):
And I couldn't wait to ask you about it just so
I could hear your story about itjust like you were asking me
about being a hockey goalie.
Tara Thurber (20:43):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (20:44):
And, again, it's a way of finding purpose.
Because what people don'trealize is that when you're that
passionate about something, it'snot an accident. It's a matter
of fact, they've lived part oftheir life going through
something that they go, youknow, I love go to a like a
(21:05):
barbecue, or maybe a party orsomething. And they start
talking, and I'll talk to awoman or a man, and all of a
sudden, they'll start talkingabout a guy a lot of times on
when he loved to barbecue andsmoke meats and do this kind of
I just am intrigued with that.
And I just asked question, I lethim talk. And before you know
what, they're gone, you know,they they're going, Am I boring
you?
Tara Thurber (21:27):
(laughs)
Matt Berrafato (21:27):
And I go, boring me? You are inspiring me if. And
people don't realize howinspiring they can be to other
people.
Tara Thurber (21:37):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (21:38):
When they touch something they're passionate
about. And a lot of times youhave many passions. In my
opinion, you only have onepurpose. When I say one, I make
the purpose.
Tara Thurber (21:48):
Right.
Matt Berrafato (21:48):
Like the purpose. Some people all you got
no, no, you'll understand whenyou go through this process.
Tara Thurber (21:53):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (21:54):
And but many passions. So yeah, so number two
is what are you passionateabout? Okay. Now, any one of
these by themselves would haveworked by themselves, I don't
know. But I know there have beenmany clues where you can start
connecting dots.
Tara Thurber (22:07):
Absolutely.
Matt Berrafato (22:08):
But slowly, I start on that. And then number
three is determine who you canserve with your gifts and your
passion. So determine who youcan serve. So it says there's
like a question that I would askyourself, Who can I serve? With
(22:29):
this thing that I'm really goodat, and that I'm really
passionate about. And peopledon't realize how powerful that
statement is because you'regone? You know, you and I even
talked about because I know youreally have skilled people. I've
had never had anybody who says,Hey, I asked them what your
purpose is. And they go, Well,you know what, I want to help
people? And well, that's great,because I think everybody does.
(22:51):
But if you don't define thatthen that's when you start to
get really specific clues aboutyour purpose, when you start to
define who can you actuallyhelp? And what are those, you
know, a lot of times there'speople and that you may be the
only one that can help someone.
And if you are the only one canhelp someone, you're not
(23:11):
fulfilling your purpose unlessyou're actually not afraid to go
towards that, and really go outthere off that. So number three,
again, by itself isn't gonna doit. Might okay, I you know, I
love I've stopped started anyone of those three, and I'll go,
but number four is one that'sreally probably one of the most
powerful, and I call it legacy.
(23:36):
And called legacy because what Iwant people to do is ask the
question of themselves, whotaught you the greatest lessons
in your life? Whether they arestill with us or not? So if
they've passed away, that is oneof the most powerful groups and
then if they're still alive,great. You can make me think
(23:59):
about someone that just died.
Yeah. You think it makes methink about someone that I
really loved? Or they loved meand they're not with me anymore?
Yeah. Because here's myquestion. Why I think it's one
of the greatest ways to findyour purpose is, is there
something that that persontaught you that was not supposed
to go to their grave? Oh, yeah.
(24:29):
You just you've just grown alittle bit because that's, I
think that's really powerful.
Tara Thurber (24:34):
Very powerful.
Matt Berrafato (24:35):
If you don't teach someone else what they
taught you. What if you were theonly one that learned the
lesson. And that's why I thinkthere's a responsibility ie
purpose to maybe teachingsomeone else what you learn, and
I want to share a little storythat it really ties excuse me
ties that together.
Tara Thurber (24:54):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (24:56):
I love being a hockey goalie when I was in high
school. My best friend was aforward, he loved being a
forward. Our two passionsbrought us together to play on
the same team in high school.
Our senior year he was going inon a breakaway, got checked from
behind, hit the board's headfirst, ended up breaking his
neck. As a senior in highschool. I'll never forget this.
(25:21):
I'll never forget this, skatingup to him where the coach had
pulled his skates off his feet,and was pinching his toes and
said, Michael, can you feelthis? Michael, can you feel
this? Michael, can you feelthis? And he said, No. He broke
his neck that night. And I havealways asked this question. Why
(25:48):
was I on the ice to watch thathappen? I was the goalie
watching him going in abreakaway, he hits the board, I
saw him hit the ice. I come upthere and find out he's a
quadriplegic. I mean, we didn'tknow this for his whole life.
And he ended up passing away 13years ago. And I don't think the
(26:12):
lessons he taught me about whatI needed to know about people
who are disabled, was supposedto go to his death to his grave.
I think I'm responsible forteaching those things to other
people. And that's deeplyconnected to my purpose. And I
think everybody has a scenariolike that, whether it's a mom or
(26:34):
a dad or grandpa, whoever raisedyou, a friend, I don't really
care, but what lessons theyteach you. And then if that
doesn't work, then you look atpeople who are still with you
that they taught you lessons,and that is where you get a huge
connection. Does that makessense?
Tara Thurber (26:49):
It makes total sense. Absolutely. Makes sense.
Matt Berrafato (26:53):
And I just you know what? It leads me to number
five, which is the the end alland be all on finding purpose.
Try a different combination ofmy number one, two, and three.
And don't stop trying. Andpeople go what are you talking
(27:14):
If you were togo and someone says I'm not
about?
Tara Thurber (27:14):
(laughs) sure. Because here's here's what
I know, people fall into one ofthree categories - one of three
purpose buckets? Number one iseither - I'm not sure my
purpose. But no, no, I think Iknow my purpose. But I'm not
sure. That's the number onebucket number one. bucket number
two is I don't know my purpose.
(27:36):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (27:37):
Or bucket.
Number three is, I know mypurpose, but I'm not living it
every day. And what I know isthis, here's how you figure out
your purpose. You take yournumber one gift, remember you
brainstormed on that, what'syour number one gift, your
natural thing that you love todo that you're really good at?
Number two, it's a three leggedstool. Number two, you look at
what are you passionate about?
Tara Thurber (28:01):
Tight.
Matt Berrafato (28:01):
And then number three, you look at who can I
serve with your gifts and yourpassion. So if you take your
number one gift, and you takeyour number one passion, and
you're no one group of peopleyou can serve, wrap a ribbon
around that stool, jump in thewater and start playing in that
water. And if something doesn'temerge, that is your purpose
then guess what you do. Okay,well, let's try this. Let's
(28:22):
change the order up. Let's takemy number three gift. And let's
take my number four passion. Andmy number two person people I
can serve, wrap a ribbon aroundit, jump in the water and jump
in and go, Oh, well, that didn'twork. And then you know, when
you get to the fifth time and itdidn't work at all, I guess I
don't have a purpose. No, youhaven't found the right
(28:43):
combination. I don't want you tostop. So maybe it's number six,
gift. And number two, passion.
And number four group of peopleand read and start doing it.
Eventually what will happen,Tara is your purpose is going to
emerge from a completelyunexpected place. And it's going
to come and hit you right in thechest. You're going to turn your
(29:03):
attention go. That's it. That'swhy I'm here. Now what do I do?
Tara Thurber (29:07):
(laughs)
Matt Berrafato (29:10):
And that's the secret to finding purpose. Don't
ever quit. Don't ever stoplooking at combinations. And I
think good people get reallythey go Oh my What if it takes
me a year? I don't care. It tookme till I was 58 years old to
figure mine out.
Tara Thurber (29:24):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (29:25):
But it's never too late. Never too late, never
ever, ever too late. And whenyou finally get to that place
where you're touching that thingcalled purpose. Here's the first
thing that you'll feel - timecompletely disappears when
you're doing it.
Tara Thurber (29:44):
Yes.
Matt Berrafato (29:45):
Right? And if you feel that if you actually
feel that happening, and youjust touch that and you go oh my
gosh, and you're going - That'swhat I'm what I'm telling people
pay attention to what you'redoing. And usually people Oh,
what do you mean? So that personwho is the barbecue talking
about barbecuing, or maybe youlove surfing, or maybe you love
(30:06):
flowers, or maybe you lovecooking, or baking or something,
you don't realize that energythat's flowing from you. Number
one, when you're doing that, Iknow time is completely
disappearing. Number two, you'reinspiring other people with your
energy. And people don'trealize, because here's, I'm
(30:27):
gonna end on this, I think thatthere's a responsibility for
every human being, to get soexcited. And get so enthusiastic
about something that they arepassionate about. So that
whoever you're talking to canfeel your emotion. I think you
(30:52):
can feel it right now. I'mhoping your listeners can feel
the emotion that comes from mewhen I'm purpose hunting,
because it's inspiring people.
And here's the thing. If I don'tdo that, if I don't let other
people feel my passion, if youdon't let people feel your
passion, I think you're stealingan opportunity for that person
you're talking to, to beinspired by you. That's a
(31:14):
responsibility. I don't takethat lightly. I think that
people say they go, Oh, am Iboring? I say boring me? No,
that's your responsibility toget excited. Let people get
inspired. And all of a sudden,you don't know, you may be the
only one that can inspire thatperson. Because you let your
emotions out. And they felt it.
Tara Thurber (31:37):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (31:37):
That makes sense?
Tara Thurber (31:39):
Absolutely. It's like, this magic that happens,
this energetic magic tointernally, but when somebody
else can feel that, and thegoosebumps and it's all the
fields, it's not just onefeeling. It's all the fields.
And it's magic. It's magical,what comes of it when you can do
(32:05):
that. And you do that.
Matt Berrafato (32:08):
When you say magical, and it's you that this
is one of the reasons you and Ihave had so many meaningful
conversations.
Tara Thurber (32:16):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (32:17):
Inspirational conversations, because we've
allowed each other to be to beinspired. And when you think
about what you do for you know,in your work as far as helping
people get find the right job,think about that. Okay? When you
really find the right job. Okay,I actually call it career one
(32:37):
and career two, I don't know ifanybody career one career to
career two follow me on thiscareer two is what you do to
make a living. You're usuallyvery good at it. You're usually
bringing value to the to themarketplace in a really
significant way. But you don'tnecessarily love it. That's
(33:01):
career two. If you can look atme, I'm holding up to his career
one is something you love to do.
But you don't necessarily make aliving doing it right now. Oh,
wouldn't it be cool if you couldmeld those two worlds together
and do something you love whileserving a group of people using
(33:23):
your gifts and your passions,and you hit a homerun that that
magic that you just describedhappens? And a lot of people I
don't think they put thattogether and they go, Oh, I'll
never find that a go. No,remember my number five point
don't ever stop. Put thedifferent combinations, maybe
maybe it's that number one gift,and you just got to choose. It's
(33:43):
just that one, not not numbertwo, but number three, passion.
And then it's, it's just makingone adjustment. And then when
you make that one adjustment,all I've done and it gets back
to my book, all I've done was Ihave watched my progress and
what I did, I've documented myprocess. And all I'm doing to
people showing them Don't youhave to pay attention to these
(34:07):
clues that come from each one ofthe things we've talked about.
Tara Thurber (34:10):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (34:11):
When you do that and you put this right
combination together when youhit it, it's like that's it and
that's when you go oh my gosh,and now you now you sit there
and go what am I going to donow? Well, you know really what
you just did was you gave birthto an elephant.
Tara Thurber (34:25):
Right (laughs).
Matt Berrafato (34:28):
You know what, Tara? Be careful because you
will either you will either killit or it will kill you if you're
not organized.
Tara Thurber (34:38):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (34:39):
And that's when you get into this whole thing of
oh my gosh, you know myfavorite, favorite people that I
love to coach to there's twodifferent groups of people my
favorite are people like my age.
Okay, I'm only 39 Well okaycalendar says I'm 65 but I never
paid attention to that thinganyways.
Tara Thurber (34:55):
(laughs)
Matt Berrafato (34:56):
But but those that are like looking at
retirement looking for work orthey're about to retire. Right?
Tara Thurber (35:01):
Yeah.
Matt Berrafato (35:02):
And my favorite question when someone is either
retired or about to retire, ifyou did not have to make money
anymore, what would you do? Andpeople are silent. And they go,
Oh my gosh, and he deer in theheadlights? I'm going no, that's
the beautiful part is what wouldyou do if you did not have to
(35:22):
make money? Would you go and youknow, who could you serve with
your gifts and your passion? Ifyou didn't have to make money?
That would be it'd be a utopiaforever. Right? Well, that's
when people you know people whoyou ever heard someone who
retires and then they die verysoon after.
They've studiedthis, you know that in your
Tara Thurber (35:40):
Yeah.
world, right? They study this.
And if you don't have a purpose,you don't have a bigger reason
to be when you stop doing yourwork and you know, when you when
you're done working, you know,42 years in the insurance
business I was really good atbut I didn't love it. Doing
this. I could do this forever.
And I will do it forever. Aslong as God willing, God Willing
(36:01):
that he's letting me be here andI take care of my body. Same
with you say how do you becauseyou're, you're a coach, you are
touching lives, you are doingthings in ways that you don't
realize how important that is.
Powerful. Matt,I'm, I have no words right now.
(36:22):
I'm filled. Everything thatyou've just touched upon. For
our audience listening, it's upto you. And you get to take
those steps. And it's one step,one after the other. And keep
moving forward. And, Matt, thankyou so so very much for sharing
(36:47):
your top five ways to findingyour purpose. I want to make
sure we share your book, I wantto make sure we share your
podcast for all of our listenersout there on a mission for 2024.
Let's make it happen.
Matt Berrafato (37:04):
Well, thank you for having me, Tara. It's been a
pleasure and I can't wait tomeet anybody who's listening.
Reach out to me and I'm sureyou'll have a link to get a hold
of me. I appreciate that. Thankyou so much.
Tara Thurber (37:17):
Absolutely. We are DefinedTalent, a DefinedLogic
service coming to you at Top5.
Make it a great day.
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