Into the Light: The Rendlesham Forest, & the UFO That Altered History Ft. John Burroughs

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:15):
Welcome back to Total Disclosure. My name's Ty and tonight,
I am so excited to get into this episode. This
is something, or this is at least a case, an
episode that I've been looking forward to for a long time.
I've been doing this for five three five years, podcasting

(00:38):
for much longer than that, and someone who I've been
watching for a very long time, I finally gets a
chance to speak with him. December nineteen eighty, deep in
quiet English forest, a young US airman stepped forward towards
a pulsing light that should not have been there. Nothing

(01:00):
in his life, or even in the UFO history, would
ever be the same. We're going to revisit the Rndulsham
Forest incident through the eyes of the man who lived
it up close, closer than anyone most people, a man
who's encounters were so real, so physical, and so undeniable
that the United States government quietly granted him full VA disability,

(01:25):
the first case in history linked directly to a UFO event.
John F. Burrows is here. He was there that night,
that weekend in December. He approached the craft, and he
may have paid the price for it. Before we dive in,
make sure you're subscribed to Total Disclosure on YouTube, Spotify,
Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your shows. Hit that

(01:47):
like button, share this with someone that you know loves
the topic, and yeah, help support. It's really really a
great best way to help. I got to like get
into this one. I had some banter ready, but I
think I kind of just want to get right into it.
So with that being said, guys, well i'll see you
on the other side, let's get right into it. I could.

(02:16):
I couldn't even read my own handwriting on the intro
slit and I had to I couldn't read the banter part.
But John, thank you for thank you for being here man,
thanks for having me on. So embarrassing. I don't get
nervous before shows, but uh I don't. I can't. I
literally can't even read my own handwriting. I feel like

(02:38):
an idiot right now. But you have been someone that listen.
I mean, I'm thirty two, so I have been what
your case was. The Randolsom case in general was one
that I came across pretty pretty early on. I mean
pretty early on when I had my own sighting and

(02:58):
I made my mom bring me to the library and
you know, teach me as much as I as much
information as I could get on UFOs and what they
might be, who they could be piloted by your The
Rndollstrom case came up pretty quick. I don't know how quick,
but it was one that I knew about pretty pretty

(03:19):
much right after my sight in. So that was about
twenty years ago. So sometime after that I started watching
pretty much anything I could get my hands on, and
that's when I came across you, Jim Peniston. Uh. And
obviously everyone knows this case. H knows the the obviously
the recording from the base Commander Charles Hall. So I

(03:44):
just want to say, like, I mean, thank You've gone
through so much and this community can be a little relentless,
but you've kept pushing on and pushing on and you
just have like a pretty pretty incredible story. So I
just wanted to say thank you, thank you for your service.

Speaker 2 (04:01):
Right, well, I appreciate that.

Speaker 1 (04:04):
Before we I mean, before we jump into the events
of Rndlesham, can you tell me a little bit about yourself,
who you are, who you were, you know before you
went into the military, maybe why you went to the military.

Speaker 2 (04:18):
Well, as far as I just had graduated from high
school back then. People think the economy is bad now,
it was terrible back in the seventies. Flash was through
really through the roof. There's a lot of issues. Jobs
are hard to come by, like any kind of job,
most people there'll be one hundred people apply for a
job that would even be, you know, working as a

(04:39):
store clerk or something like that. They were hard to find.
I actually had a decent job, but I just was
ready to get out and see some of the world.
So I graduated in seventy eight and I went to work,
and I just felt like I didn't want to stay
my home town. So I explored the military, and I

(05:02):
chose the Air Force and I joined it.

Speaker 1 (05:05):
Had you, I mean, I had you ever been interested
in the topics of UFOs or like, you know, had
you just seen it in the news? What was your
relationship with the phenomena before entering the military?

Speaker 2 (05:18):
Nothing?

Speaker 1 (05:19):
Literally nothing.

Speaker 2 (05:20):
Okay, this is a different world. Back then, it was
fast cars and girls and an alcohol. Fast cars and alcohol, Okay,
that's all. I really was in motorcycles and I had
a fast car Camaro. I had a motorcycle, and I
like girls a lot, So I had a drink all
not I shouldn't say drink. I like to drink.

Speaker 1 (05:42):
I get it, I get it. But so so yeah,
I mean, the internet wasn't a thing. I mean, for
anyone who's listening, like a newer audience, you guys got
to remember the time period. There's no internet. I mean,
how many channels did you have on cable three?

Speaker 2 (05:59):
I think it just started, so I think there was
CNN where I live, WGN, and I don't know if
there's anything else.

Speaker 1 (06:06):
So you're not even really getting I mean, you're getting
the news is really starting to become a twenty four
to seven program, but it's not quite there yet. It's
still local, it's still regional.

Speaker 2 (06:18):
Well yeah, most of it's wrote local, including the paper
was still very popular.

Speaker 1 (06:22):
Yeah yeah, exactly, not just to not just to hide
under a during a rainstorm, but to actually read. And
that's yeah.

Speaker 2 (06:30):
Well, today's phone is yesterday's newspaper. There was a picture
one time everybody was standing on the corner reading the newspaper.
Nowadays they're all standing in the corner reading their.

Speaker 1 (06:39):
Phone, right right, And so okay, so no, like literally
had you I mean, so yeah, actually I won't even
go there because you already said it you were interested
in one thing.

Speaker 2 (06:54):
Well, it was a young kid, that's what I did.
I mean, yeah, I wasn't into the library, scholars or
any of that stuff. It just really wasn't.

Speaker 1 (07:03):
It was sports, yeah, because I was thinking like for myself,
like I went to parties, I drank. But I mean again,
I come from a different time period. I was always
like hanging out with like the existential guys, smoking a
joint in the corner, like.

Speaker 2 (07:20):
Go back then. But see, I mean UFOs weren't that
popular back then. In fact, it was a taboo. You
didn't really want to talk about it.

Speaker 1 (07:27):
Yeah, kind of a career under actually not just.

Speaker 2 (07:29):
A career or period. People just would look at you
like what little Green men?

Speaker 1 (07:34):
You know, right right.

Speaker 2 (07:35):
It wasn't that many books out then, and there wasn't
really any TV or anything that really covered it. I
mean there was sci fi, but you know, it wasn't
a lot in the UFOs and stuffs or whatever you
want to say.

Speaker 1 (07:50):
It's so that's I think that's so interesting to think about,
like the time period difference, and I think the UFO
community like the fact that that's even a thing. I mean,
we take that for granted. Every day, and I think
it's it's a very it's an interesting dichotomy to think
about the way it is now and how far it's come.

(08:12):
It really has come so far compared to like when
you were a kid. And that's not that long ago.
I mean, you're not that old or anything.

Speaker 2 (08:20):
I'm sixty five. The incident took place only forty five years.
But yeah, it's a lot's changed.

Speaker 1 (08:25):
That's less than a person ago, right, Yeah, generations? Where
were so you joined the you joined the military, where
were you stationed? What was your role? And and you
know we can go from there.

Speaker 2 (08:41):
Okay, Well, when you joined back then, it was six
week basic, so that was at Lachlan. You did the basic, right.
The tech school was at Lachlan too in San Antonio,
so I think that was six weeks two and it
was called security police at the time. So and I
went into law enforcement. So you went through the tech school,
you graduated. About halfway through your tech school, you got

(09:03):
your orders, which I received orders to go to the
r bet Waters had no idea where that was. I mean,
and I really didn't ask to go overseas when I
meant to see the world. I just wanted to get
out of Homington normal. I didn't necessarily want to go overseas.
I was thinking more about getting somewhere in the United
States different, especially what was warmer in Illinois. But I

(09:24):
ended up in England. That was my first tour. I
was there from seventy nine to eighty one.

Speaker 1 (09:28):
So that's one way to see the world.

Speaker 2 (09:31):
Well, yeah, it was solo World.

Speaker 1 (09:34):
Yeah, how did you did you? Now? Can you explain
the strategic and the the importance of raf bent Waters?
And it doesn't it have a So it has a
sister It has a sister base, and it's called it
starts with a W.

Speaker 2 (09:53):
Wood Breaks it's Woodbridge. Yeah. Well, actually everything happened at Woodbridge.
It didn't happen to bet Waters. Originally I called the
Bentwaters event, but it really wasn't at bent Waters. It
happened outside the back of Woodward's East Gay And then
they changed it now for the rental from Forests because
it happened in rentals for us.

Speaker 1 (10:13):
Can you go? Can you go? Can sell? Like if
I were to fly in and could I get to
Is the base there still is it closed? Well?

Speaker 2 (10:22):
Bent Waters is an air park. It was sold, so
there's a private owner they still have. They have the
gate going onto the flat line, the flight line is
still there, the buildings are still there. A move they
actually build a movie studio so they filmed there. In fact,
I went back there with the Canadian crew. We filmed
on their facilities besides going through the forest. So bent

(10:43):
Waters has been so privately. Woodbridge belongs to the British
and they have an active military helicopter unit on there,
so it's still there. And then yeah, you could get
out in the forest. Yeah, it's changed a lot and
they've made a lot of you know, different things, different stuff,
but yeah, you can still go out there. They have
a trail out there. They have the craft Penisen described there,

(11:07):
but it's not where it really happened. It's farther away
from really happens.

Speaker 1 (11:13):
So it's kind of for me that, you know, that
makes me think of It's like, uh, I don't know
if you know Massachusetts at all, but Salem and the
Witch Trials where the Witch's memorial is is. It's like
a bunch of headstones and it has all their names right.
It's like a mile from where they actually were hanged.

Speaker 2 (11:33):
It's a while, but it's probably a quarter mile down.
There was a lot of deception done with this case.
Colonel Hall did an interview one time or even said
they planted fake sites. They did different things because they
were trying to hide exactly where the location is, just
like they were trying to hide the dates and times
and everything else, because the deeper you would dig into

(11:54):
this case, the more you would find about it, and
you know, the things that took place, just like the
memo wasn't factual in dates and times. But the event
actually took down right down by Cable Green, which you know,
it's down there towards the corner of the forest where
you cross, there's a fence line and the farmer that

(12:15):
owns the fields actually now put a big fence up
because he doesn't want people out in this field just
to be it was just a barbar fence. You could
climb over and go into.

Speaker 1 (12:23):
The field, right, Yeah, I kind of understand that on
the farmer's perspective, like you probably just like, oh my god,
so many people are coming through here, Like.

Speaker 2 (12:32):
Yeah, it got it got pretty popular. I don't know
how popular it is after COVID. Everything kind of died
after COVID for a while, literally before COVID. A lot
of people would come there and do stuff and film
there and everything else.

Speaker 1 (12:44):
I would have loved. I would love to go there,
but I again, it's I mean, that's that's another thing.

Speaker 2 (12:49):
So well, the honest thing is is if you go there,
there's a chance you could see something. There's still stuff
going on to this day outside in the forest.

Speaker 1 (12:56):
Area, and that's something I definitely want to touch upon
in this evening. And maybe maybe I'll just come right
out and ask you right in the beginning. I've I've
worked with a lot of the I've I've walked nuclear
witnesses into members of Congress's office to brief them on

(13:19):
the situation of UAPs or UFOs as the most commonly
known in nukes that for me, there I can draw
very uh Uh. I can draw not too many hard
conclusions or things, but I can draw lines to things
where there's so much evidence that it goes beyond coincidence. Uh,

(13:42):
that UFOs are attracted or at least are surveiling to
a degree. Whatever that means, I don't know, because we
can't put ourselves in an unidentified or unknown's brain. But
there's something with the advent of the nuclear technology that
humans once they split the atom, sightings start the spike data.

(14:05):
Bent Waters have nuclear weapons. The government has denied it,
but most people will give you a smirk and say,
I can't comment.

Speaker 2 (14:15):
Well, this is what I can tell you about the area. Okay,
First of all, I could tell you the misconception that
nukes were not allowed in England is wrong. And the
fact of the matter is the base we were at
and all the other bases that were inside of England
or NATO bases, so we fell under a NATO charter

(14:37):
under NATO law, so the facilities and bases were allowed
to have nuclear weapons on. Okay, there's a charter and
I put this on my Facebook fakes years ago because
there were people jumping up and down in the UK
and saying it was they broke the law. No, they
did not. The NATO charter to this day allows nuclear
weapons in NATO countries. They just don't like to make

(15:00):
a big deal about it. Because if you if you
go forward from our incident, Green and Common came online
with that type of nuclear weapon that they admitted was there,
that had all kinds of protests and issues, so they
didn't want to broadcast it. But the fact was there
were nuclear weapons inside of NATA and England under NATO Charter.

Speaker 1 (15:20):
Okay, and maybe we don't have to go further than
that for the sake of your freedom. But okay, so
but and then I want to ask one more question.
Ben Waters and Woodbridge their strategic Yeah.

Speaker 2 (15:36):
I can give you the whole rundown of the base.
What our mission was. The Cold War was going full board.
That was Carter was the president leaving regular one. There
was a huge build up after Reagan came in and redeed,
he modernized the military and he made bases bigger. Every
base I went to from bent Waters all the way

(15:57):
through grew after Reagan became president. There was all kinds
of technology being brought online that was being hidden from
the Carter administration. Because most people don't remember, because you
probably don't. Mkultra was real and mk ultra was taken.
But I'm just saying it was taking place, was taking
place in the seventies, and all that technology got transferred

(16:18):
over to the United Kingdom. They hid it from They
hid it from the American Congress and from the President,
and they moved it to Europe. It was all being
done right outside the back gate of Woodbridge. Out there,
it's called Orford Nest or Ford Nest. Most people don't
know is area fifty one for the United Kingdom. It's huge.

(16:42):
They developed lasers, nuclear weapons, radar there. Everything that was
done exotic wise, it was advancement of technology was all
done right outside the backde of Woodbridge. And there was
a facility that was a joint American British at the
time and now it's only British called Marlstrom Heath and

(17:02):
Marconi was the defense contractor at the time. They were
working on SDI. Yeah, during the event, but there were
but most people think sci didn't even start until after Reagan.
Reagan took com president. It wasn't being worked on back
in the seventies.

Speaker 1 (17:17):
Which would make total I mean, it would make total
sense that. I mean that idea didn't just pop it was.
It sounds like it went public because they wanted they
needed more funding.

Speaker 2 (17:28):
And then yeah, well so different. Trump just talked about
the Golden Dome, which is just an advancement of SDI, right,
and that's what they're doing. And it's ironic that SDI
was just becoming popular when our event happened. Now they're
going to do the Golden Dome, which ties in to
UAP techno.

Speaker 1 (17:46):
That's I didn't And with that, I mean that is
not that's so timely right now obviously stranger things right
just just I mean loosely based on the mod doc
project and you know they're incorporated.

Speaker 2 (18:00):
Yeah, Montalk was tried to mk Ultra. Yeah, the equipment,
but the equipment, but the equipment that came from Montalk
went over to.

Speaker 1 (18:06):
The United Kingdom and that's how they That is very interesting.
I don't think i've heard that so well.

Speaker 2 (18:13):
It's there. I mean a lot of people will scoff
at it, but it's there. You just have to do
your research, which I did. See I had skin in
the game when I got sick, and I was already
trying to figure out what happened to us before that.
But when I got sick, I did a deep dive
and I started working with researchers that were looking at
all possibilities of what a UAP is, not just the

(18:34):
nuts and boats, UFOs and biological beings. And before I forget,
I want to tell you. I know you worked with Sallas,
but Aero was being honest about it. There's something you're
not aware of. That Sallas doesn't like to talk about.
But you can go back and research this, Okay. One
of the things that Salas has said was that we

(18:56):
wouldn't have tested our technology on those facilities because we
would have ruined it. But he claims that the aliens
did something to it and we were able to bring
it back online in three to five days. Yeah, that
that doesn't add up. And I'll tell you why if
you go back and look. Have you ever heard of
what it's called a Marx generator.

Speaker 1 (19:15):
Marx generator is sounds similar.

Speaker 2 (19:17):
It's tied to Tesla, and that's a that's a generator
that was developed back during the Philadelphia experiment, and it's
Tesla based technology. And that particular generator was tied directly
to the sallas's launch site and the Sage radar, which
was tied directly to the launch site, and the Marx

(19:40):
generator will create those UAPF facts two frequencies and everything else.
And here's the other thing you need to think about.
They did not see an alien craft. They saw lights
and they did not see alien beans. The Marx generator
is tied to these things. It's tied to phenomenon, it's

(20:01):
tied to frequencies and everything else, and that was all
tied directly to his facility and all these other nuclear
facilities that had these events that it and it was
all tied in through nora AD and all the radar
systems and everything else. So when Arrow came back and said,

(20:21):
which people missed it because they wanted to argue and
say the fact that they're lying about that Arrow was
being honest. They were admitting that the government tests technology,
this type of technology on our equipment facilities. But nobody
wanted to listen to that. They just said they were
lying about what happened to Salas and his crew.

Speaker 1 (20:41):
A huge part of UFO history.

Speaker 2 (20:43):
It is because yes, but UFOs, if you go back
to what Bigelow's talking about and Green and those guys,
they're not talking about nuts and boats aliens. They're talking
about unidentified aero phenomenon. Now they have talked about some
biological bodies, but actually a UAP is its own intelligence
within itself, and they're actually working on that within all

(21:07):
of our advanced technology going forward right now.

Speaker 1 (21:10):
Jesus.

Speaker 2 (21:10):
In fact, if you go to the movie that just
came out, one of the guys that I just briefly
saw a clip he said, whoever controls his technology going forward,
this is the next Manhattan Projects and whoever controls this
technology will control the world for the next underd Yeah,
just like we did what the we did with.

Speaker 1 (21:27):
The new It was Jay Stratton who said that.

Speaker 2 (21:30):
Yeah, it's true, he's being honest, that there's some things
they're honest about.

Speaker 1 (21:34):
But I had I and I'm I'm actually friends. I
consider him a friend. I don't know if he I
we did the episode, but Tim Phillips O Varrow, I
had him on and I heard him out, and I
I of course pushed on him. But the way you
just the way that you just brought those things together.

(21:56):
In my head, I guess I was being arrogant in
the same way that other people have been that I
didn't want to believe or I didn't want to think
about the fact that maybe our government was testing on
our own facilities, because that's where you're gonna have to
test it. If you test it on an enemy, that's

(22:17):
called an active war.

Speaker 2 (22:19):
Well, no, it's not even that you don't want to
divulge your hand to the enemy totally. Yeah. Yeah, but
it's just like the Nimens incident was just the same
thing that if you go down and you look at
where it happened, it happened off of Catalina Island. Yeah,
Now it's interesting that blu Asondo. If you watch Unidentified,

(22:40):
there was one of the episodes where he started they
had him talk about before right before they went to
commercial break, and he started going into what south of
Catalina Island and what everything involves Catalina Island and the technology.
Then he said they acted like they were going to
carry it on after the uh after the break, and
they didn't because and the incident that happened with the

(23:02):
other aircraft carrier off the East coast was right down
by the Florida Pensula Peninsula. That is where all stealth
technologies developed and worked on. It sits right off of
Eglin air Force Bace and that's where all these same
raidar facilities and everything else. But they're all down there.
So both of the big incidents with both aircraft carrier
groups were done in these facility facility areas where they

(23:24):
could test this stuff on our own equipment. Because it's
the best in the world, the best radars, the best systems,
and it isn't convenient that both carrier groups were unarmed.
So I got into it with Kevin Day. I interviewed
him for Phenomenal Radio and he made a comment that
he said, well, if the craft, if our ship, if
the aircraft would have been armed, they would have fired

(23:45):
on it. And I said, well, what would have happened?
He goes, well, the weapon systems would have probably wouldn't
have been able to identify this and came back and
blew the aircraft up because this stuff is all keyed
in to heat and sensors, and the weapons would go.
It would turn around and reidentify our own aircraft. So

(24:06):
that's a that's a weapon right then in itself. So
you can create these effects. And the EC aircraft that
Navy have can create these effects, and so can some
of our other aircraft. They can create these effects that
are with the carrier striker.

Speaker 1 (24:22):
So what you're talking about is now now we're going
I mean, this is deep already, right, So you're talking
about essentially having the ability to not just trick the radar,
but trick the physical evidence.

Speaker 2 (24:39):
Well, see, but Favor and Day weren't honest, and the
Day eventually got caught and had to admit that we've
already had technology to can manipulate radars, so they can
manipulate what you're seeing on radar and what it's doing.
What what what Favor wasn't honest about And I called
them on it and he admitted they had the helmet,
but they claim you would using it that day. There's

(25:01):
a helmet that the F thirty five pilots used and
it was the first generation that was that was the
first generation of it that was being used by the
Fateen pilots during the nemesis of that that you can
actually control different different parts of the equipment, different stuff
in equipment, all through the helmet itself, which is actually

(25:22):
you're using your mind to control it. It's multitaskic. Yeah,
it's that's it's that. That's why the F thirty five
is so so real. It's so classified. The helmet itself. Now,
all you have to do is go back. Have you
heard of the gods helmet?

Speaker 1 (25:36):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (25:37):
Yeah, that was persenger that was tied to this whole group.
Do you can you can manipulate the mind. You can
manipulate everything through these helmets, and you can control different
parts of the aircraft, weapons systems and everything else. And
all you have to do is go back to an
old movie called Firefox where they talked about that. In
the movie, it was the Russians had it in clinding

(26:00):
what it was in it and you can use your
mind to control stuff. We have that, we have that ability.

Speaker 1 (26:06):
It's real conscious consciousness based now to whatever that means.
So you're using your your you're harnessing your consciousness.

Speaker 2 (26:15):
To control the control the weapon system, interface with the
and these pilots are trained on that through meditation and
everything else.

Speaker 1 (26:22):
Yeah, so the psionics thing is something that you totally are.

Speaker 2 (26:28):
No, it's real.

Speaker 1 (26:29):
It's that's what I mean.

Speaker 2 (26:30):
Yeah, it's yeah, no, I mean, this isn't made up stuff.
But then i'm you know, apothesizing, and this is all
the technology. DARPA just came out and said they're within
very shortly able to they're going to be able to
create time dilation bubbles for individual soldiers, and they'll be
able to create it through a backpack. Again, they admitted
to it. And that's what happened to me and the

(26:52):
other guy that got compensated from the government. I actually
for sure went into a time dilation bubble that was
being created by our own technology and the real phenomenon
that's in the forest at or Woodbridge.

Speaker 1 (27:07):
Yeah, let's let's circle back for a minute, because gee,
you just kind of blew up my whole worldview right there. Like,
but it's okay, and.

Speaker 2 (27:16):
You know what, these are all tied to SAP programs.

Speaker 1 (27:19):
That's what.

Speaker 2 (27:20):
But here's the thing. These Congress people you're meeting with,
they're a waste of time. They have no control, no power.
Nancy Mace just came out and said, what was there
about a month ago, she said, they vote on SAP.
They vote on SAP programs. They don't even know what
they're voting on. They just get given the number and
will they support fifty billion going to this program? They

(27:41):
don't even know what the program is. All this technology
stuff that's going on. Congress has no oversight over it.
They have no control. Only the gaining units like CIA
and all those and the contract companies that control the
technology and are developing the technology. So this is all
a farce, Tyler. You're not going to get disclosure, you're

(28:02):
not going to get anything. And the fact that they're
doing this heerings to a subcommittee just lays it even deeper.
The head of the committee is not comer, is not
even interested in this. He farmed it off to a
subcommittee that has no subpoena power. And I've been invited.
I was invited to meet with Arrow, come up and
meet the Gang of Eight testifying all this other stuff.

(28:23):
And I said, I will not do any of that
until you confront the Department of War now and the
VA and ask them the status of my records. And
no one will touch that. No one will confront the
VA or or anything and have them clarify your records. Yeah,
my records where they are, what they are.

Speaker 1 (28:42):
Big deal that your records are still hidden, and no
one they've asked you to come talk. But yet they
will not entertain the idea or at least muddy themselves
by they can't.

Speaker 2 (29:00):
But none of that. But I do have proof that
Adrian and I got a settlement. We have these documents.
It's real. They admitted we were injured during the event.
Colonel Hawch just did an interview with US Caulkart and
said on the record that Adrian and I were injured
during that event. Okay, but here's the issue. That is proof.
But the government remained silent and until the government will

(29:25):
admit to what's going on, which these units won't. It's
just like these people. Do you remember, I can't remember.
The last guy, the most stunning guy and all these testimonies,
was the guy that came forward, that talked in the
last hearings and said, I can't talk about most of
it unless we go into a skiff. And even then,
if we go into a skiff, you're not going to
have the clearance to hear what I know. And that

(29:47):
is the fact. These congress people don't have access to
any of these programs. They don't know what's going on.
They don't know where the money's going. And if you
go back to nine to eleven, which is conspiracy based theory,
but it's these are the facts. Sheill testified on the
hill the day before.

Speaker 1 (30:02):
A trillion.

Speaker 2 (30:04):
No, it was more. Now it's like eight trillion they
can't account for. And if you go it's over twenty
trillion now, But it was around eight trillion that they
couldn't account for at that point. And if you go
back and add up all the budgets prior to when
he testified, all that money didn't even equal what he
said they couldn't account for. So then all of a sudden,
nine to eleven happens, and the two areas where the

(30:26):
data was held was the name was in the Kindagon
where the Pentagon got hit, and Building seven held the
backup files and they completely dropped everything. And now it's
over twenty trillion that they can't account for.

Speaker 1 (30:40):
I just did an episode about I was asked to
entertain this idea because I'm part of the UFO world
that they potentially used to use directed energy weapons on
nine to eleven, and I'm from Boston, so I mean
New York's four hours away. I I went through nine

(31:01):
to eleven in a way that most people didn't we do.

Speaker 2 (31:07):
What I can tell you is this kind of gone.

Speaker 1 (31:10):
That is fucking crazy. I think they that's fucking crazy.

Speaker 2 (31:13):
The problem with the Pentagon is there's people that were
there that said there were was plane wreckage and bodies,
but they wouldn't identify the aircraft that hit it. But
I could tell you when I flew on missions after
nine to eleven with pilots, every one of them to
t would say they didn't want to go into conspiracy.
It just said that aircraft couldn't have done what they

(31:34):
said it did, nor could there be any pilot they
could have. Yeah, and they want you to believe them.

Speaker 1 (31:40):
If you were to go on the actual guy that
did it, he was demonstrably, noticeably the worst pilot out
of all the hijackers. The guy couldn't even fly a
little cessna. And you're telling me that he banked a
two hundred and eighty degree turn and then and then
came street level and and just guided perfectly into the building.

(32:05):
I mean, come on, it just.

Speaker 2 (32:06):
Did it didn't. A lot of that stuff didn't happen
the way it is, and we lost control at that
point of our own of our own freedoms because they
did the Patriot.

Speaker 1 (32:16):
Acts Patriot Act.

Speaker 2 (32:17):
But the bottom line is is that's the concern right
now that we're going to have something having to do
with UFOs. It's going to get admitted to and that
will be the next patriot type of apt type of thing.

Speaker 1 (32:30):
Are you saying a false flag?

Speaker 2 (32:33):
It could be a combination of both. I mean, nine
to eleven happened, it's just the circumstances behind it don't
all add up. I'm not arguing that things didn't.

Speaker 1 (32:42):
Go on, but we like the Gulf of Town can well.

Speaker 2 (32:46):
You just think about how it's been over twenty years,
how much more advanced they are the technology than they
were twenty years ago. I really don't know how totally
they did everything. I just know the details behind what
they that.

Speaker 1 (33:01):
Have you ever heard of doctor Judy would No, I
look into her. She's talk about the directed energy weapon thing,
and I mean, it's interesting.

Speaker 2 (33:13):
There were guys that I talked to that got to
the site within the first twenty four hours, and they
said there was high explosives smell in the air. So
it sounded like some.

Speaker 1 (33:21):
Of these I don't doubt that. I don't doubt that,
Like I don't doubt that control. Some sort of explosive
controlled demolution happened, But I don't think that was at
the core of it, because the buildings justified. But that's
not we're here to talk about.

Speaker 2 (33:38):
So no, I know. But and not only that, but
here's the final kicker. Everything they've claimed happened to bring
the buildings down, they still found passports at the bottom
of the grubble that that identified who the terrorists were.

Speaker 1 (33:51):
Oh h lucky.

Speaker 2 (33:53):
That's all I'm getting that, folks. Just all I'm trying
to say before we go forward is don't believe everything
the government tells.

Speaker 1 (33:59):
You shit, don't even believe more. Don't believe any of it.

Speaker 2 (34:04):
I'm trying to be nice, Okay.

Speaker 1 (34:05):
Yeah, don't believe any of it. Just do your own reason.

Speaker 2 (34:08):
And also don't believe that the people in Congress actually
know what's going on either that way, they have no clue.
They have no clue to what's going on.

Speaker 1 (34:15):
I can't. I don't want to say anything on air.
I didn't. It's a I won't go to that, but
I don't want I don't want to bash. I'm not bash.
I know you're not bashing Congress because they're doing what all.

Speaker 2 (34:27):
I'm just saying is I'm not saying they're not interested
or they don't want to know, and they don't realize
they have no oversight. But the bottom line is they're
not going to have it. Look at what happened all
You got to just go back to m k Ultra.
When they found it out, they just they claimed and
destroyed all the records and all the technology went bye
bye and they didn't get any access to it, which
that just tells you that started way back then and

(34:49):
it's just got worse ever since then. How they hide stuff,
keep stuff from Congress and they don't have access to it.
How could you vote on a project and give funding
too something you don't even know what it is.

Speaker 1 (35:00):
Because they don't even they make And it's so funny.
They make these fucking bills, five thousand pages and they
have twenty four hours to sign it. It's like you
no one could read through that.

Speaker 2 (35:12):
No, I don't, but that I mean you saying so.
I'm not trying to bash individual members of Congress. I'm
just saying we're not gonna I know your show is
total disclosure. They ain't gonna happen. That's all I wanna
tell you. You're not gonna get total disclosures, even when they
tell you the truth, which I don't think they were
totally a lying about the Salas incident. People don't want

(35:34):
to They don't even believe it. They don't even consider
anything else other than an alien craft showed up outside
of the missile site, brought it down, fried the systems.
But we could bring them back online in three days,
you know. But we wouldn't do that to ourselves, nor
we couldn't brought it back if we did it. That's all.
I'm just saying this. This stuff doesn't add.

Speaker 3 (35:56):
Up, It doesn't add up.

Speaker 1 (35:57):
You're right, You're right. I know that I'm we're gonna,
we're gonna like each other. And uh, I'll there's some
things I definitely want to talk to you off air about.
But going back to bet Waters to keep some sort
of just linear path because your brain. Yeah, I love

(36:18):
the stuff you're talking about, and I could I could
talk for hours. I don't wanna, I do wanna. I
do want to get into the redistry because I do
want to spur out on that and I think we
could touch on all these things. Uh, but talk to
me about I'd like to hear in your words. I've
listened to it and of course before, but can you
tell me just bring me to that night that you

(36:42):
had your encounter, walk me through what happened, No details
too small, and just give me the give me the
give me in the audience. The that not the longest version,
but summation.

Speaker 2 (36:57):
I'll give you a condensed version, okay, the first the
first night. And you can't go off the memo because
the memo when it was written, they didn't have the
proper dates and times we came on duty. It was
our last midnight shift. It was Christmas night going into
Boxing Day in the UK. It was twenty three hundred.
We came on duty and the event happened at oh

(37:19):
three hundred in the morning. And how it all started
was myself and the law enforcement supervisor staff sergeant who
was my supervisor directly new to the base. We got
together and we were riding around. It was a slow
night and we were driving around the base and we
also went down to the east gate and we had
to check it to make sure it was scare. As

(37:40):
we're going down to the east gate together talking, he
saw something in the sky going to the forest. I
didn't see it going into the forest, but he got
my attention. I saw it into the forest. So from
that point we've got went off base to see if
we can figure out what was going on. It wasn't
the direct threat to the base, but it was right
outside the base in the forest, right down at the
end of the road. Well, we got down to the
end of the road, it didn't feel right. We were

(38:01):
off based. We got back up called it in. They
called the security soup down, which was Peniston. He came
down and saw the same thing we did in the forest,
so they did some stuff behind the scenes, called radars,
got confirmation there was something on radar Odi area disappeared,
so the decision was made to send Penistons riding myself
into the forest to figure out what it could be.

(38:22):
They called the local authorities built the British police and
the fire department, but we were out in the middle
of nowhere, so it took it was going to take
them a while to get there, so it was another
reason why we went by back. And if we had
come across something our own fire department could have responded
quicker then they could have. So we went into the forest.
We played cat and mouse with it for a while.
At some point they lost radio contact with this. Our

(38:42):
radios weren't working right. We got close to something and
when we finally did, we came up into a clearing
over a burm and all three of us saw it.
We dropped to the ground. Everything changes from that moment
on on what our recollections are. I remember getting close
to it, everything dimmed down and then it got bright
again and went up into the sky and went back

(39:02):
into the forest. The other guy that was the brand
new airman first night on flight, did an interview with
James Fox and said when we got close to it,
I was armed, which I don't remember being armed. I
don't think I was. I drew my weapon and it
zappedis and we all passed on and we woke up
and it was gone. A pedestin goes into the details
of where he got up, walk around it, touched it,

(39:23):
roade stuff in his notebook, took pictures and all this
other stuff, touched the craft, called her the Crangle Draft,
and then had a buying their download. So that's the
basic discussion of the three of us, all different synopsis
of what happened the first night. It did go out.
We all agree that, I think two of us do
for sure. I don't remember if Ed did say that
or not that it did go out into the Actually

(39:46):
he did, because he wrote in a statement it did.
We went into the field and into another field, and
we followed it for a while, and then we lost it.
When we all came back, our watches were forty five
minutes slow, and they said they lost us for over
forty five minutes right traffic. So that's the synopsis of
the first night. Then they we went back to the base,

(40:06):
turned in, got a briefing, went out to the site,
found some evidence of some pictures and from trying to
object in the forest, damage to the trees and all that.
So that was night one. Night two was the flight
that took over midnight shift had an incident. I wasn't there.
What I was told right after it happened was they

(40:26):
saw lights to shift commander and left that waters when
I was going over to Woodbridge, had an encounter with
some lights, shut her vehicle down. She freaked out and
she ended up getting relieved duty and she left the base.
So that was night too, and if I'm ann rayo,
we did. We interviewed all the people involved at night too,
and they saw things and a bunch of stuff. On
Night three was the halt night where you can find

(40:48):
the memo where he talked about it and the morning
and the recording which is stunning if you listen to it.

Speaker 1 (40:54):
Yeah, like what do you make like does does it
line up with what you experienced in the sense of
like what how he's talking, the tone he has and
then as it's coming toward him the fright.

Speaker 2 (41:12):
Well I wasn't actually there for that, no, So but yeah,
that was that was That was what was going on,
and he's always been honest about his experience. Where he's
been flaky is who was there? He denied Adrian and
I weren't there even at first, and finally we proved
that we were the tape. Yeah, at the very beginning

(41:32):
he claimed neither one of us were even involved in
the Third Night, but we were able to provide evidence
to the tape and other stuff. So he's finally not
only admitted that we were there, but we were in
the tape. Yeah. But what that tape wasn't very cleaned up.
Georgina BRUNEI got the tape and had it cleaned up,
and that's when you could hear it. That's when the

(41:53):
story started to fall apart with Adrian and I weren't involved.

Speaker 1 (41:57):
Maybe I'm going to create a marker here so the
people that are listening in the future, I might insert
a clip of that audio recording organ.

Speaker 2 (42:06):
You can say, we have airman Burros and two other
personnel at our location. They want to rendezvous, and they
said not at this point. We'll let him know that
I remember, Yeah, yeah, but that was not The original
tape that was released was not very clear, and it
was only after they cleaned it up and listened to it.
That was the beginning of him falling apart, and it
bestinds it was on the tape, So it was trying

(42:27):
to cover up with happering to Adrian and I okay.

Speaker 1 (42:30):
Because that is the I mean, if you strip everything
away from the rest of what happened, the real problem
for the US military and the US government was going
to be the fact that you were you got zapped
by this thing, Like there was physical interaction where you were,

(42:54):
where you were somewhat harmed and had missing time. There
was physical engage to a level that that the military,
you know, even from on the site, knew this was
going to be a fucking problem.

Speaker 2 (43:09):
I don't know if it was the military or if
it was the government contract Maconie and those guys, because
Green was involved in it. Kick Green was involved in
US back then. He was involved in our incident. So
is Nick Pope's father. No, Kick Green's the CIA guy
that was Yeah, but he's the one that helped get
my settlement. He's actually a doctor that has done a

(43:33):
lot of He's actually treated and evaluated people that were
injured by UAPs. So he was involved in that incident
and so Nick Pope's father was too, which most people
aren't aware of. It's going to be in my new book.
Jeffrey Pope was in charge of all the technology for
the United Kingdom. He was the head scientist for all

(43:55):
this technology that was going on during that time frame. Yeah,
he was. It's gonna come out in the new book
called Project Well. He poo poos around iteck he does
everything else. Yeah, he says, you know, I can tell
you what my dad did. It's been declassified. I can't
tell you what he did, it's still classified. He did
get an award for certain things, blah blah blah, but

(44:17):
I can't talk about things that are still classified. So
he does his typical.

Speaker 1 (44:22):
Nippi company man.

Speaker 2 (44:24):
Well, no, Nick Pope, I don't want to go there.

Speaker 1 (44:27):
No, I know, I know, I know, I know. I
agree the.

Speaker 2 (44:33):
Very people put Off and Green and we're involved in
this stuff way back in nineteen eighty. In fact, i'll
put off Bob with Project Stargate. He worked for SRI.
SRI was involved in this incident, including Mark County Company
and everything else. So it's it's a big interwoven.

Speaker 1 (44:54):
Okay, Okay, after night three.

Speaker 2 (44:59):
Well, I finished, I real fast so when we met
with Hall. I met up with Hall, and then there
was there was what he was seeing in the sky.
He point into stuff flying around in the sky still,
and there was some lights coming down from them. But
then this light appeared in the distance and started coming
towards us, and he asked me if that was the
same thing that we saw the first night. I said,

(45:21):
I can't tell. Can they get closer? And he let
me and Adrian go forward, And then when we went forward,
we got close to it, and Adrian got knocked to
the ground as we were approaching it. And then he
saw me go into it and I completely disappeared for
a while, and then I reappeared.

Speaker 1 (45:38):
So he he testified that you vanished.

Speaker 2 (45:42):
Yeah, I vanished.

Speaker 1 (45:44):
Yes, do you recollect that?

Speaker 2 (45:46):
No, none of that. Every both nights I got close
to it. I don't remember what happened. But that's the
interesting part about all this. It's called a time dilation bubble,
which it's they can create it, but it involves what
he is.

Speaker 1 (46:01):
So what you're saying is that this, to some degree
this craft had, whether it be by proximity or by design,
it took you somewhere.

Speaker 2 (46:19):
Yeah, I just well, if you understand time valation, you
actually go into a different dimension. You actually either slow
down or speed up, you go somewhere else. And so
that's part of the interest they've had in me, these
agencies and stuff. When I had my surgery, they got
my tissue, the damage to the heart and everything. Was
the fact that somehow I was able to survive interacting

(46:40):
with the time valation, whether it was a real up
or effect that we created. Because at the time, there's
a guy who wrote a book by Andrew Pike that
talked about this. He was down there studying UAPs and
his studies through the university was working with through the government.
Funding got interwoven into the vent Waters or Rentalds of
for this incident. So they were looking at what a

(47:02):
UAP is down there, and not only that our government
was studying it. And actually he admitted they were provoking
the UAPs. They're trying to understand it and learn it
how to utilize it.

Speaker 1 (47:14):
So and other people have talked about this, like Jay
Stratton has talked about how they wanted to use nuclear
material to pretty much bate UAP so that they could
study them. And this was a tactic that they proposed
several times. But so with saying that, well, he's not

(47:38):
being honest.

Speaker 2 (47:39):
It's not it's not nuclear material, it's radars. If you
go back and when you look at when Roswell happened,
are you aware of what happened? Right? Yeah, So they
set up that triangle radar system down there because they
moved it from the East coast. The big things that
have gone on, including the food fighters that took place
in World War Two, that all has to do a

(48:00):
frequencies and radars and everything else. It's not the fact
that the detonating a nuclear bomb didn't do something because
it created the p effect. But it's more the radar
systems than everything else that play into what a UAP is. Again,
I'm not getting into the nuts and bolts UFOs that
people believe exists or biological beings. I'm talking about what

(48:23):
this group's talking about UAPs and stuff not I'm not
trying to discuss what nuts and bolts UFO.

Speaker 1 (48:30):
Is, Jim. So just to clear this up, Jim Peniston,
most other people are not most because I don't want
to say that, but there's this thing in the community
where when Rendelsham is retold, you know, in these documentaries
and in these other books they frame it as this

(48:50):
thing was a craft from another world.

Speaker 2 (48:54):
No, no, no, he's not. No, no, no, that's not true.
It's for his his belief is it's us from the future. Yeah,
it's not from another world. It's not alien. He's and
I don't I don't particularly like some of the things
he's done or how he's hurt the incident my personal opinion,
but I'm not gonna let that. He believes it was

(49:15):
a craft of unknown origin, but it came from the future,
and it came back to that timeframe of our event,
And there's he doesn't believe in aliens. He believes in
time travel is exactly which ties into all this what
a UAP is and all that other stuff. But it
and and even Bigelow if you follow what he said,

(49:37):
he said they're here, but he didn't say they were aliens.
He just said they're here. And it could very well
be something from the future coming back. I can't say
that's wrong completely.

Speaker 1 (49:50):
It would make sense that maybe maybe something in our future,
their past happens and it starts fitting out the herd,
and they're coming back for genetic material. And I mean,
that's totally plausible.

Speaker 2 (50:06):
I think I don't know. I don't think they're really
coming back for materials. What they're doing is whatever in
the future screwed up. They're trying to come back and
keep that from happening. But every time, according to the
people involved, the scientists, just because you change one thing
doesn't mean that doesn't change something else. You can screw

(50:26):
the timeline up even worse than it was, you know,
when you try to take something out that happened in
the first place.

Speaker 1 (50:34):
So yeah, time being a time being a fickle, fickle
character like it seems to. It seems to when you
poke in prod it it pokes back.

Speaker 2 (50:45):
Right now, you've seen the stuff that's come out recently
where this contractor talked about the tic TAC where they
worked on this object that could use this frequencies and stuff. Well,
think about that as a system. If you have something
do that to your radars fly in front of you,
you labeled as a threat, you fire at it. The
first thing you do is the weapon could come back

(51:07):
and destroy your own craft. But the other thing is
is once you learn how to make that work, every
aircraft you have. It's like cloaking in star trek it.
Actually it's no longer visible. It's somewhere else. So even
if you fired on it in a cloak, you'd miss
because it's either going slow or faster. So and including

(51:29):
when they talk about an interstellar travel. I don't know
if you're aware of this. You were up in DC,
but you're aware of how put offs paper got submitted
as evidence yes on interstellar travel. I saw that paper
before it got declassified. I visited Putoff's facility and I
saw all the Dirt's papers. I knew all about it.
I didn't know they were classified, but I saw them.

(51:51):
And what's interesting if you know the backstory of McCain.
McCain was involved in my settlement and then after, and
he knew a lot of what was going on with
me and the cover up and Department of Justice involved.
So when the twenty seventeen article came out, he wanted
to know what was really going on because he knew
the wolves being pulled over their eyes, even him and
his own committee. So that's when they came forward. But

(52:14):
their goal wasn't to really let him know everything, just
enough to get some funding to advance these papers in
this technology that.

Speaker 1 (52:21):
They're working on right and.

Speaker 2 (52:23):
Then unfortunately he got cancer and he died.

Speaker 1 (52:26):
Yeah, unfortunate. Yeah, that really sucks. And that's what it's
seems to be, not a theme, but seems to be
something that like we're always racing the Undertaker in the
UFO community, and you know, people have been met with untimely,
untimely deaths and you know, deaths through through weird, weird circumstance.

Speaker 3 (52:49):
And but.

Speaker 1 (52:52):
Okay, so after the night, after the third night, now,
so these this is December, it's cold, it's it's it's
right around now, we're actually right around the anniversary, you know, yeah, yeah,
that's crazy. So after the third night, what happens do

(53:15):
you guys are what happens on an official basis? Because
I've heard things about like sodium pentol penta.

Speaker 2 (53:22):
Well, okay, I can kind of lay that. Okay, what
I remember was we we went home after night one
it was, and we were told when we came back,
we have to write a statement. So I was back
out there on night three. When it came back to
work on Monday, they posted me on a gate. The
team from Langley came into the forest. Now, what's interesting

(53:44):
about the event, which has kind of gotten lost in
the thing. They were working on technology to bring satellites down,
and most likely a Russian satellite got brought down during
this event, so they used the cover of the poll
spacecraft damage the end of the runway, and it was
involved in the whole thing. But in reality, what people
have to understand is the lighthouse actually played a part

(54:06):
in this. If you go back to the history of
the area, they developed radar and the original radar system
was tied into the lighthouse, and the lighthouse was being
utilized to being frequencies into the forest, which was creating
an effect that we walked into. The big question is
is whether or not we were deliberately brought into it.
I don't think night one, but by night three it's

(54:27):
possible that they wanted to test us, honest, and that's
why a bunch of stuff took place. But ultimately a
team came in and recovered the satellite. There was an
investigation taking place. Now go back to the era. What
was the thing they said they used to like to
go down and spread the word aliens lined the very
beginning right after on December thirty first, a person from

(54:51):
the base went downtown to the group that was Beautfa
or something not like muffon Ere that were involved in
the UFOs and told everybody an alien landed at bent Waters.
So they got into they started asking questions and that
was a big deal. They wrote a book about it.
But eventually a group in the United States, Barry Greenwald

(55:12):
and I can't I think his name is Barry greenwal
and Fawcett was his name. They did a foyer and
they got that halt memo released right and when the
memo released, now the government was in a bind because
they had to try to explain what went on. And
not only did it cause issues with the UFO community,
but CNN got in the middle of it, and that
really stirred the problem. And then the News of the

(55:35):
World broke the story and it was off to the races,
playing hide and seek with the media of the rest
of my life with what I could say what I
couldn't say. I ended up being forced to talk with CNN.
I didn't go on the record for the Special Assignments
Report you can see it online because they were very
adamant that I couldn't deny the event took place, but

(55:57):
they didn't want me to talk much about the event.
And so I just kind of said, I just told
the reporter Chuck Tocaro, Look, this took place, some took place,
the memos wrong, but it took place. But I'm not
going to talk about it. And it was pretty cool
about it. And Adrian was the same way. Both him
and I never went on the original report. Nordia Hall,

(56:18):
RDA Peniston, and a lot of the main people that
were evolved in the Three Nights. But so it's just
been a mess ever since. But for me, when I
got sick is when I started digging into this, and
that's when I discovered all this stuff about what was
going on outside the gate, the technology, how it plays
into all this. I meant, how put off Christopher Green,

(56:40):
Eric Davis, Gary Noen, Colin Kellaher. I was around all
these people. They wanted my DNA, they wanted to study
my brain, all this other stuff, and I started putting
all this stuff together.

Speaker 1 (56:52):
Wait wait wait, wait wait wait, they wanted your blood they.

Speaker 2 (56:58):
Went my DNA. Yeah, they actually the rink came after
we did the citizen's hearing. We testified right now, if
you go back, and it was the Bassett hearing, Yes, Well,
if you go back, what's interesting in the hearing are
and I'm not trying to brag, but it is a fact.
Our testimony, the two part testimony we did, was the

(57:19):
biggest deal for the whole hearing because the people from
Congress weren't even aware, most of them about the Classified
Record section or all this stuff. There were two people
that did. The guy and that can't remember his name.
He's an older guy who was a congressman. His district
was Langley, so he knew exactly what was going on,
including is one of his staffers still work for him.
Came down and talked to me and helped Cheryl get

(57:40):
some of the stuff done through the classified section.

Speaker 1 (57:45):
Cheryl is John McCain's assistant.

Speaker 2 (57:46):
Cheryl Bennett, Yes, who helped. Yes, she was the driving
force behind my settlement. Right. So, but the other guy,
I don't know if you know it was. His last
name was Gravel and he was a senator that read
d mk altar papers on the floor of the Senate.
He was involved in all the stuff, and so he

(58:08):
started asking us questions and everybody that was up there
on the committee freaked out. He goes, oh, you could
tell us what you really know, and they're like, no,
you can't. You cannot talk about this, Do not talk
about this, you don't have immunity, blah blah blah blah.
So he suspected what some of this himself, what was
going on, what was going on? So that helped bring

(58:29):
in Christopher Green, who came down and met with my attorney,
Pat for Sconia, who then came out and evaluated me,
and they he flew Gary Nolan into Vegas, met with
Colin Keller, and they tried to come down and meet
with me in Flagstaff, Arizona to get my DNA, and
I refused. So I refused to do that, but they

(58:49):
got my DNA when they did the heart surgery. Not
only did they get my DNA, but they got my
tissue too when they did the heart surgery.

Speaker 1 (58:55):
They placed about I mean, yeah, you're you're you. I
think that it's possible that someone manipulated the fact that
the manipulated the fact that you needed this care and
only in order to get.

Speaker 2 (59:11):
No I was sick, I was dying. The DoD handled.

Speaker 1 (59:16):
They just exploited the fact that you.

Speaker 2 (59:18):
Well, here's the best guess I can make based on
everything that's going on. This technology has existed for a
long time. But it's been so classified because if you
go back and look after I got my settlement, Green
re public on the biptop secret and laid out a
bunch of stuff about why my stuff was classified, what
was the involvement, and all that other stuff. These guys

(59:38):
were hidden in the shadows and they were getting crumbs
to continue developing the technology. But I think they were
getting cut off. One of the people I know inside
government said, every years a battle with the defense funding
on exact technology over what works for sure, bullets, bombs,
everything else naturally right. Well, and also they weren't They

(01:00:03):
weren't at the cuspos to be able to make this
stuff work. Right, They were working on it. They were
trying to get it to work. They were like, to
make some of this work, you had to have these
huge facilities, these huge energy draws, like most people don't
realize size. Well, the Rendall Schim incident was tied to
the sizeble nuclear plant. It was just down the coast

(01:00:23):
that all that energy was brought into the facilities that
were there outside the back eight that were driving this
testing and everything else. Well, they've made advancements of quantum
technology and energy and so now it's ready to come
off the drawing board and be utilized. Right, So they're
they're trying to get their skin in the game. Even

(01:00:43):
though they're older. They're all in their eighties except for
Davis is a little bit younger. They're trying to get
their skin in their game. You know, I'm younger too.
But the DNA stuff ties into something totally different. That's scary.
They're kind of implying that there are people here that
receded here through bloodlines that aren't necessarily what the radio

(01:01:04):
general population is.

Speaker 1 (01:01:07):
So you think that you have some sort of genetic
marker or well.

Speaker 2 (01:01:13):
I can say that that's what they're implying. Yeah, and
I have a report that implies that, But how do
you verify it?

Speaker 1 (01:01:21):
Yeah? I got right, right right?

Speaker 2 (01:01:22):
A lot of this stuff is That's why I refuse
to cooperate with them, because they said there was only
one lab in the world that could do it too. Technically,
there was another one in Europe, but the main one
was was Stanford Lab, which was Nolan. How do you
fact check any of this? How do you peer review it?

Speaker 1 (01:01:39):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (01:01:40):
Yeah, that's a dangerous road to go down.

Speaker 1 (01:01:42):
It is a dangerous road to go down and what
I mean, so you you you did not want to
play ball with that, and I think that's fair.

Speaker 2 (01:01:52):
But they got it anyway. And then Green came and
visited me in Illinois, and once I knew you had
it anyway, I just agreed. I went in my own
genetics testing and to help my son because I was adopted.
And then that was another game they played. They went
ahead and I agreed to go on the test, but
this time they didn't want my blood, they just wanted
saliveas so that just reconfirmed that they already had my

(01:02:14):
blood through the VA, you know, through the VA Department
of War, because there was a d Department of War
doctor involved in the whole thing besides the surgeon. But
going forward, he got my saliva, did a test, and
he called me back through NOH and said that my
son and I are two of the most unique people
in the world because I'm only a one database, that

(01:02:36):
my DNA's only one database, which would go back to
probably when they got it from the surgery, and my
son's DNA doesn't exist anywhere. So that was all the
stuff that they said took place. They sent me to
reports it does say that, but how do you verify it?

Speaker 1 (01:02:54):
Okay, that's you know, that's that's that's fair. So but
they're at least saying it and so.

Speaker 2 (01:03:01):
Well, that's not just my son and I. There's other
they believe there's other people out there. What they haven't
been clear about, at least that I'm aware of, is
they've been back and forth. Are the people that have
these experiences already connected to a bloodline from ancient times
or were they affected by the reinteraction with the phenomenon

(01:03:21):
and that.

Speaker 1 (01:03:22):
A changed you?

Speaker 2 (01:03:23):
That changes?

Speaker 1 (01:03:24):
Right? Is it? Is it something that we're innate you're
you were innately born with or something that happened because
of and maybe maybe maybe that is what they're trying
to figure out.

Speaker 2 (01:03:34):
I don't know what they're doing, because that's again they're
no different than they say they want disclosure, but they
won't be They won't see you open and completely open
and what they're doing and who funding it or what
they're doing and what they've learned either.

Speaker 1 (01:03:48):
So well, yeah, I guess so. I Actually I kind
of had like a respect for Gary Nolan because you know,
I I I he was. I mean, you look at
a CV and like you look at some of these
guys's history right, how put off Eric Davis. But they're
all playing both sides. They're playing.

Speaker 2 (01:04:08):
Oh yeah, they are, They're playing. They're playing both sides.
So's Loando. I don't know you're young, but do you
remember the first wave of this was in the seventies
and eighties and the guy that was a lou Asanda
at the time was Richard Dody. Lou Asano just replaced
Richard Dody. They were both counter and intel. Dody was
for osis and he ran this whole counter intel. You

(01:04:32):
never can make heads or tails of what was really
real and what wasn't. And Alessando's done the same thing.
You don't really know because he goes back and forth.
One minute he talks about it being one way that
he talks about bait being aliens and craft and and
grish is the same way. I had had numerous conversations
with him. And none of these guys are legit when

(01:04:56):
it comes to being honest about what their goal is.
They're not about disclosure. And I'll debate them tooth and nail.
I'll go ahead to head with any of them. They know,
first of all, they know disclosure is not going to
happen because what they're involved in the government and the
programs that they're aware of and going on, they know
darn well this will never become public. Okay, just for example,

(01:05:21):
you know what, you know what the F thirty five is, right,
but do you know how it operates? Do not works?
The best you're going to give is what Bigelow said
way back to George Nap when he started this old crusade,
was you'll get confirmation something's going on, but you're not
going to get disclosure. He was open and honest about
that way back when this all started, after he got
the money from read and they worked on all this,

(01:05:42):
and that's what we have. We have confirmation. There's no
doubt the government's hiding secrets from us. There's no doubt
it could be some kind of life for them. It's
either here you know it's been here, or visitors here
is here there We've learned some of our advancements of
technology from it. That's what I mean with lou and
those guys. One minute's in a dimensional one, then it's

(01:06:03):
this one min it's that and stuff, and they won't
even be honest. How can you believe any of this
stuff is my.

Speaker 1 (01:06:10):
Point, Well, I mean that brings up a good a
good point, right, or at least a good question. A
barrier is don't you think that maybe the government, maybe
the military, for all they do know that that they

(01:06:33):
may have some of the same questions that we have still, like,
do I think that that humans are working in underground
bunkers and aliens? I? I really don't like that's. I'll
entertain it, I'll talk to people, I'll hear the stories,
But do I really think that that's happening. I don't
know that that that that it's something that I think

(01:06:57):
my worldview, or at least my right it logically says
like something doesn't feel right, like it doesn't feel right
with this. But again, I don't know everything. I've never
been in the military, I've never held a clearance. I've
seen things that I can't explain. I know they exist.

(01:07:18):
But do I know that the government knows exactly what's
going on. I don't have faith in them to get
my taxes right, let alone know what the fuck a
UFO really is right.

Speaker 2 (01:07:27):
But the thing is is that does the general government know,
does general science? Does the white science world know? No,
does the dark science know? You can't be developing weapons
systems off of this technology if you don't have a
pretty good understanding of it.

Speaker 1 (01:07:45):
Is kind of crazy that most of modern like if
you look at modern disclosure post twenty seventeen disclosure specifically
what we have right now, has all been framed in
this kind of like threat narrative.

Speaker 2 (01:08:03):
And that was part of my problem with lou He
Originally he's backed off some now, but he came on
as a threat. Well, you have to create a threat
to get funding. The people have to feel fear to justify.
That's what they do all the time.

Speaker 1 (01:08:18):
You don't get we almost have it, We.

Speaker 2 (01:08:20):
Almost have a trillion dollar defense budget, and you know,
and they just can't get enough of the piece of
the pie to go forward with their their technology. But
the point being is is you have to create a fear.
So if you go back to what von Braun said,
and a lot of this goes back to Germany, it

(01:08:41):
goes back to the scientists and what they were, what
they learned, what they were working on, and they brought
a lot of these scientists are our country and that's
how our technology started to evolve. In fact, I've had
people approached me that they were in government. I don't know,
I can't. They haven't been able to prove me what
they claim. But they and the Nazis are still in this.

(01:09:02):
There's a group of people that are still working from
this from inside the original nuts Nazi bloodline that they're
still working on this.

Speaker 1 (01:09:10):
But well, there was there was. I mean, uh, this
is something else that people don't want to think about,
let alone tack onto the UFO topic because it's such
a dirty thing. But the United States was was. There
was people in the United States, specifically the banking systems, uh,

(01:09:33):
like JP Morgan Chase. Uh. They helped fund the rise
of the Nazi Party.

Speaker 2 (01:09:41):
Well, the Bush family was involved.

Speaker 1 (01:09:43):
In Scott Bush was involved. So and there was tons
of Nazi sympathizers in the United States.

Speaker 2 (01:09:51):
Well, actually, I don't I don't believe there were sympathizers.
I'll be honest with you. All the stuff I've looked at,
Eisenhower warned us before he left office. Of course, this
was all put together. Have you heard of a project
called Iron Mountain.

Speaker 1 (01:10:09):
No, you have.

Speaker 2 (01:10:10):
To go read about it. It was done in the seventies.
It was this group of scientists got together in the
facility called Iron Mountain, and they looked at how to
control control people and technology and everything, and they put
the book out and then Johnson, the president, they found
out about it and they turned around and he said,
you have to pull it. Well, it was already out,

(01:10:32):
too far gone, so that these scientists came back and
said it was fiction, but it wasn't. And if you
just go from Iron Mountain and what they said, that's
how we've evolved control. It's all about control, and part
of control is fear and military and when you tie
so much money up into the military complex, imagine what

(01:10:53):
the world would be like if we only it took
fifty percent of the world budget to kill each other
and did it to make the better. But according to
what these people felt was we would never be satisfied,
so we would self destruct, be having things too well,
we would we wouldn't be satisfied. We just keep wanting more.

(01:11:15):
And so they had to come with the balance of
keeping people off their feet, you know, off the balance,
and how to control them. So that is exactly and
people don't have to grit this, but it's true. You
just have to really go look, a small group of
people control of the world.

Speaker 1 (01:11:31):
Yeah, that's why I do believe in like you know,
Daniel in a way, who was part of the Gang
eight that that did give the money to or was
working with Harry Reid to get that money put aside
for us up which you know then conveniently went to
Harry Reid's buddy from Las Vegas, Robert Bigelow. He says

(01:11:53):
he had the best, best bid. And you know, I
mean whatever, we we we do things our friends, uh,
and we do things for our constituency. So uh, you know,
whatever it is, what it is. But we look at
we look at the topic of UFOs. And again again,

(01:12:13):
you talk to anybody on the street, You walk up
to anybody and say what is the UFO and they're
gonna immediately think small gray, big eyes, big head like alien,
the archetypal alien. And I think that is a huge
issue that we are going to face going forward, when
in fact that you has always been and stood for unidentified.

(01:12:37):
Now what the government knows, what the government understands, and
what they're hiding from us, well right now, until they
can come out and tell me, or until I can
get evidence of it, that I can't operate with any There.

Speaker 2 (01:12:51):
Is evidence though, the problem is people don't want to
accept it. Like Project Condine lays out a lot of
what UAPs are and why the government wants to study
him and everything. It was a declassified report the British
government did. They got released in two thousand and six.
That was part of my evidence presented from my settlement case.
And in Project Condine it admits that the people were

(01:13:14):
involved in RENTOLSM were exposed to the UAP radiation. Okay,
so Project Condine is a roadmap to what a UAP is.
The gray area is what is the difference between the
UAP and a UFO. Now, if you go back to
a book called Maraje Man in a documentary they did,
Green and those guys are in it, and the guy

(01:13:35):
Pilgington did it. Of course, I said he didn't believe
in any of this until he met this group, and
then he believes there's something to it and it's being hidden.
But Green said he was quoted in this book kind
of paraphrasing, but he said, what we've been told and
what's real is different. And once the American public in
the world understands the difference, they won't be as terrified

(01:13:57):
by it as when they started with war of the
worlds going forward. We have the condition to believe what
aliens and craft are and everything else for generations, and
that's not really what we're dealing with. Well, before Mitchell died,
I got the medium personally and talked to him a
couple of times. He told me Condinne's real and what
they talk about, and Condinne is what we're dealing with.

Speaker 1 (01:14:20):
Mitchell was what number was he on the moon?

Speaker 2 (01:14:26):
I don't I don't remember. I want to say eleven,
but I don't remember.

Speaker 1 (01:14:30):
Yeah, we're right in the same ballpark. So, but Edgar
Mitchell is really the He's such an interesting character.

Speaker 3 (01:14:40):
So what he.

Speaker 1 (01:14:42):
Given your research and given what happened to you, you
got sick, you got can you talk to me about?
So talk to me about what happened to you physically
that well.

Speaker 2 (01:14:56):
Right after the event, I didn't feel good, but there
was nothing directly. I aven't had little vision problems. When
I came back from England, I got sick in the summertime.
I don't think it was really related to the incident.
I just got sick. But I was away from the base.
I couldn't travel back, so I had to go to
the Mercy room to get checked out so that they
knew I was sick. When I went to the mercy room,

(01:15:18):
they found a heart murmur. The doctor, the merchcy room
doctor wanted to know what the military I thought about
my heart murmur and so I don't have one. He goes,
well you do. So from that point it went forward
with that. That's when I went back to the base
and they brought a doctor for right Patterson. He evaluated me,
sent me, Yeah, at the time, I didn't know any

(01:15:39):
of this. You have to understand, okay. So then he
came in, evaluated me, sent me the right pat and
they did a bunch of tests on me. So it
came back and told me that he thought it was
one thing and was going to have to do surgery
right away, but it wasn't. They would continue to monitor
tur me and that's how it ended. And all that's
in my records, including all the testing they did on

(01:16:01):
my heart and everything, and that's what my civilian doctor
wanted when I got sick, and that's what's classified. The
other issue that's classified is my eyes started having vision problems.
Ended up at Wolfer Hall at Lachlan, and they evaluated me.
The first thing this vescial has said was have you
been exposed to radiation before? I'm like, nothing, I'm aware
of but because I didn't know what could have happened

(01:16:24):
to us there and stuff, I actually had orders for
Korean and he tried to keep me from going to
Korea because they couldn't treat the issues I was having,
which ended up I found out later was really to
my heart too, and they sent me anyway, The DoD
made me go to England and you didn't know about this.
I'll go to the Korea. I didn't know about this
till later. But this is right when everything broke with

(01:16:46):
the news of the world and all the stories came
out and they were chasing us. So I was at Kson,
cal got moved to Coonson and the packapp commander was
Gordon Williams. So they hid the three of us over
there and pack A because it was hard for the
press to get over there.

Speaker 1 (01:17:04):
Did they did they ever?

Speaker 2 (01:17:08):
Like?

Speaker 1 (01:17:08):
Is there any truth to the the idea that that
you guys got called into the uh like the office
and and UH hit with sodium sodium?

Speaker 2 (01:17:19):
Well that's what Penniston says, that that he was actually
under hypnosis. It comes out that he was interrogated and
he was as sodium pentathologies. I don't remember that happening.
A lot of people claim I was called in and interrogated.
I don't remember it all. I don't remember. It doesn't
mean it didn't happen.

Speaker 1 (01:17:37):
But what was the base's official reaction to the events
immediately after?

Speaker 2 (01:17:42):
Was it?

Speaker 1 (01:17:42):
Like?

Speaker 2 (01:17:42):
No, I don't know, because that was the backstory. I
lived off Bass, so I wasn't in the dorm. The
dorm was crazy about it. They were they I guess
they went in. They went into the dorms and were
searching for some pictures that were supposedly taken. A bunch
of stuff went on on the base itself and the dorms.
I lived downtown, so I really wasn't prey in any

(01:18:04):
of those stuff that went on on the base.

Speaker 1 (01:18:06):
You just said pictures. Do you think there is actual
video out there or pictures.

Speaker 2 (01:18:10):
Of there was pictures taken. Now, the question is they
often supposed it came back fogged. That doesn't mean he did.
I mean, were clothed pictures taken out with thirty five
millimeter cameras.

Speaker 1 (01:18:23):
And the base would obviously have some sort of if
there was cameras at all. I mean this base would
have them for security right now.

Speaker 2 (01:18:34):
It was all done through Everything was done through the
photo lab. So yeah, the base would have had access
to the picture.

Speaker 1 (01:18:41):
I wonder, I wonder, I wonder.

Speaker 2 (01:18:44):
Well that was part of what has been claimed. General Gabriel,
who was the commander of Europe, came in right afterwards,
took the reports, took the bladders. There was there was
audio besides the hall tape. Every radio transmission that took
place was reported at the command post and that was
held for a month. All that was taken. So everything

(01:19:04):
that went on during that event, all the radio transmission
and all that was taken.

Speaker 1 (01:19:09):
In classes, taken by higher ups.

Speaker 2 (01:19:11):
And well it was taken by Gabriel. Yeah, he came
in and got a briefing on it and then took
all the evidence with him.

Speaker 1 (01:19:18):
And did he ever wanted to speak Did he ever
want to speak to you guys?

Speaker 2 (01:19:22):
He's never, no, we never that I'm aware of. It
was the interrogation was done by the people involved that
remembered said it was OSI, but not on our base.
It was outside os I most likely D I A,
C I A and the Navy.

Speaker 1 (01:19:37):
Was what people kind of call the men in black, right.

Speaker 2 (01:19:42):
Yeah, I mean the men in Black. Yeah. It's an
investigative group that comes in and looks at this stuff.

Speaker 1 (01:19:48):
Right and and and they just probably I mean arrow
did it. They they after you testify, they kindly like
I had Tim Phillips to kind of say this to me,
and he's like, you know, we we hear the testimony
that we kindly remind them of their oaths and there yea.

Speaker 2 (01:20:06):
But that's that was one of the reasons why I
wouldn't go up there. I was there was a contract
that was working for Rubio. He wasn't actually an aide.
He was a contractor that contacted me and my attorney,
and they didn't want my attorney to come up. They
wanted me to come up. He was going to be
a take me personally to the Aero Committee and take
me to the Gang of Eight, but no attorney was

(01:20:30):
going to be allowed. He was going to represent me
and I had to sign a non disclosure.

Speaker 1 (01:20:36):
That's odd.

Speaker 2 (01:20:37):
Well, they didn't want me to talk about what we
talked about, right right. And I was supposed to get
to meet Hobby Log and they also promised me gristed
that I would get to go to a classified briefing
at NORA ed about all of this taken place. I
refused to go. They were shocked that I wouldn't go
up there, and I've got for people to say that

(01:20:58):
I'm making it up. I don't. There was an article
written by Toby Martinez through the Roswell Daily. I provided
them all the emails, the evidence, and he wrote the
article on it. And I still all the emails interactions
I had with these different people and agencies that they
wanted me up there again. Two reasons. Number one, I'm
not signing an NDA and number two, I am not

(01:21:20):
going to go up there unless they get the VA,
Department of Defense to admit exactly what they know about
the case.

Speaker 1 (01:21:28):
And me, so you have, yeah, it's exactly, you have
stipulations and yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:21:34):
Because it's just again, it's a good story that I
could testify and I've got some evidence. I've got more
of it in the most most I've got the settlement. Yeah,
but I still the government has never Billy Cox was
a reporter that actually followed up on it, and the
response was from the door the VA was the same
they just gave to those guys from Area fifty one

(01:21:55):
that are suing the government for injuries. Each individual case
is identified, you know, is always identified separately. Whatever takes
place will not be released or talked about by the
government other than they say that if you get any
kind of compensation or treatment, then it has to be
tied directly to an event that took place during you know,

(01:22:17):
what happened to you was involving the government itself, whether
it was on active duty or if you were working
as a contractor and everything else. So you can't get
a settlement unless you can prove you injured in the
line of duty, which we were, and our settlement was
directly to the Rentals Force event.

Speaker 1 (01:22:33):
And that's what I mean, so by by by the
definition of like even some of these debunkers, the rendalsrom
case has everything from physical evidence to to.

Speaker 2 (01:22:49):
You know, well, here's yeah, you have the memo, you
have the tape, you have the fact the government and
a minute it took place. You have two individuals that
were working incident, and we're injured by it. So it's
a verifiable, viable incident exactly. But the problem is you
still don't have an answer my settlement. They didn't. They

(01:23:10):
accepted it, but they didn't say why they accepted it
other than the evidence presented, And they didn't say what
injured me. Nor will any of the doctors that I
ever deal with the treat me. They will never tell
me what they know or what's going on. And it's
only a limited amount of doctors that can deal with
my heart, my eyes.

Speaker 1 (01:23:30):
Of course it would be a specialist. Yeah, you know,
and and so in your experience, I want to go
back to one more thing. Okay, before you get zapped
the first like you know, the first time and again
sounds kind of similar to like a Travis Walton scenario,
but I'm just obviously just drawing, painting a picture for

(01:23:54):
the audience that's listening. But before you get before you
get struck, and then you know, lights out, do you
remember any smells, what shape did you see? What colors?

Speaker 2 (01:24:10):
Well, the lighting that the third night was like a
it was an orangish kind of rustic color. It was
a big, big, like glob of light, which at the time,
like I understand why people have incidents say that could
be us because both nights one and three we walked

(01:24:34):
out of there. We couldn't explain it, and where else
could it be that maybe something from somewhere else. But
once you, once I dug into it, I could see
how we could have been involved or created that effect
or been part of that effect. But the point being
is what I saw both nights were lights, peniston, you know,
and a phenomenon effect including you know, there was like

(01:24:57):
a frequency effect. My hair on my back of my
head stood up. But I don't remember any smell and
anything else other than the other thing. I remember at
some point it felt like time was slowing down, like
you were not moving. Things didn't seem right with what
we were in. So those are the main effects that
I remember both nights.

Speaker 1 (01:25:20):
Sorry I was muted, so no, you said the hairs
kind of raised. No ozone smell that you can remember.

Speaker 2 (01:25:26):
No, I don't remember.

Speaker 1 (01:25:27):
Okay, well that's and again I think others.

Speaker 2 (01:25:33):
I think some other people may have. Some other people
remember different things and stuff, but this is what I remember.

Speaker 1 (01:25:40):
And do you you said you don't recall, Like, is
there any memory of whether it was through regression? Even
though I'm not a huge fan of regression. I do
you think some memories can be implanted or at least
maybe exaggerated to a degree, But is there anything that

(01:26:02):
you remember from the time that you get hit to
when you come to no.

Speaker 2 (01:26:08):
I did go into regression in eighty eight. They actually
I just got out of active. It was in the
reserves and they were doing the show called UFO Cover
Up Live, so they had approached me to go on
the show. I got flown out to LA I met
with the executive producer's name was Kurt Brubaker. Forget the
guy that was the producer for the show, but ended
up working with brew Baker, and Brewbaker actually convinced me

(01:26:31):
not to go on UFO Cover Up Live. It was
after I met with him and talked about everything, and
he wanted to He was looking He had a company
called Brewbaker Group. Brubaker was tied originally to the lyric
jet John Leir. Then he worked for GM and he
worked with Kit Green. I didn't know that at the time,
but later I found out. So he was a technical guy.

(01:26:52):
He was looking at this from a technical standpoint, so
he talked me out of it. One of the things
that we did do is I did regression in nineteen
eighty eight. There's a clip of an online on the YouTube.
It's ten minute clip and it just shows a little
bit about what came out under regression. But what did
come out was we never got to the point where
what happened when I went in it, but we got

(01:27:12):
into it what it could be. And actually, in my regression,
it told me that it would be back for me
at some point. What, Yeah, it would come back for me.
It said that. And what was weird was and again
I can't prove this part of it, so it's kind
of in the book Veritas Obscira. But I had different

(01:27:33):
people from different agencies approached me in different ways. I
did another hypnosis through US, through Stanford and somebody else,
and through the intelligence agencies. And the interesting thing was
they believed, according to what they told me, was I
could communicate with the phenomenon in my in my original hypnosis,

(01:27:55):
I was actually communicating real time with the phenomenon.

Speaker 1 (01:28:00):
That's an interesting thought right.

Speaker 2 (01:28:02):
Now, that's what they claim I there. It is very
interesting this. I haven't ever showed it other than a
ten minute clip. And I've always said if people thought
the binary code blew the case up, if they saw
this hypnosis tape from beginning, it would it would completely
go come on. And remember this was done in eighty eight.
This wasn't done. This was done way before all the

(01:28:24):
modern stuff that's come out. This was and everything that
came out. When I came out of it and I
saw the tape, I was like, what.

Speaker 1 (01:28:31):
You really don't remember saying.

Speaker 3 (01:28:32):
Any of that?

Speaker 2 (01:28:33):
No, I was completely out. The guy that did it
was an LAPD cop. He was trained in this, and
he was a guy that was trained in traumatic hypnosis
to bring out experiences. So this wasn't like somebody that.

Speaker 1 (01:28:46):
Was just pulled out, Like was there any was it? Like?
The was the light talk? Because you've the light.

Speaker 2 (01:28:53):
Was actually the actual end the hypnosis. The life form
is the intelligence.

Speaker 1 (01:28:58):
That's that's what I mean. So you didn't see like
a being, No, but you saw the craft and it
was the one communicating to you I'll be back.

Speaker 2 (01:29:07):
Yes it was. It was the light that was communicating.
It was the life for him.

Speaker 1 (01:29:11):
Yes, that is fucking crazy.

Speaker 2 (01:29:14):
And that's partly why put Off was interested in me
because it ties into what he did with Stargate and
consciousness and everything else, which is another whole thing that
they're working on because AI's taking over everything, so they're
trying to find a way to put a human consciousness
to control AI. Yeah, it's all going on. But I
knew about this ten years ago when I went down there.

(01:29:37):
They were looking at all that back.

Speaker 1 (01:29:39):
The next gen fighters are going to have AI, they're going.

Speaker 2 (01:29:42):
To be well they already do. There's so by AI.

Speaker 1 (01:29:46):
And you know the next like so think about that
in two thousand and four. If what you're saying is true,
of course, and I and again I'm not I'm with you. You're
saying that there was technology that through a helmet, you know,
you could control and F sixteen or thirty five or no,

(01:30:08):
it was a helmet.

Speaker 2 (01:30:09):
The helmet was being was introduced during the nimesisciment in
favor of a minute to that. It was the next.

Speaker 1 (01:30:16):
Generation two thousand and four, right, but.

Speaker 2 (01:30:19):
The actual helmet was modified and it really came into
play the actual it was being it was being modified
as we launch, so it was part of the F eighteen.
But the real technology helmet is the F thirty five helmet, right,
that's the final.

Speaker 1 (01:30:37):
Complete and utor control.

Speaker 2 (01:30:39):
Yeah. Well there's pictures that came out and that got
pulled Norfolk Grumblin did it and stuff where the F
thirty five through the pilot can control all different kinds
of weapons, systems and stuff. The airplane can have missiles
flying off the airplane, drones, all kinds of stuff, and
it's all controlled through the aircraft and the pilot's mind,

(01:31:00):
the helmet and a lot of the stuff. People say,
how the C seventeen. What happens is the plane takes off, okay,
and then the seventeen is up in the air and
all this armament is dropped down and meets up with
the aircraft and it's protected in the bubble of the aircraft,

(01:31:20):
which creates the stealth effect. The actual the F seventeen,
it was somewhat the shape and the paint, but it
generated a plasma field around it that made it invisible.
The radar, it's not. It's that's the key to this.
But the original fighter had a piece that they had
to attach to it before it left. The new fighters

(01:31:41):
have it within the skin of the plane itself. That
creates the generation effect. The zoom Wall class destroyer has
that effect. They put a picture out where they showed
it cloaking, disappearing and coming back. Is it being able
to do that because it has the technology and the
computing systems in it to make it disappear, cloak into
a different dimension.

Speaker 1 (01:32:03):
So so and again, you know, bits and pieces of
truth start to come out, like you know, HELPU it
off in Eric Davis and this new age of disclosure documentary.
You know, I watch everything that comes out because I
like to get a the fullest picture I can because
I know what So, you know, some of what's being

(01:32:24):
said is bullshit, but there's always like the best disinformation
has information. So I try to glean when I can
from everything. So I'll watch what Greer puts out, I'll
watch what James Fox puts out, I'll put watch what
just all of them, I consume it all and then
I try to sift through it as best I can.

(01:32:45):
That's that's my that's what I do. Yeah, Yeah, And you.

Speaker 2 (01:32:53):
Have to learn how to separate bullshit from.

Speaker 1 (01:32:56):
Real exactly exactly. And that's why I like people always
ask me, like, why are you friends with guys like
John Alexander.

Speaker 2 (01:33:04):
Well, Alexander is actually the guy that knows more about
this than anybody, anybody you want this almost He actually
worked on the technology called non lethal web systems.

Speaker 1 (01:33:18):
He's the father of no use.

Speaker 2 (01:33:20):
Yeah, and I know John Well, I do. In fact,
he was the one who told me that that's how
they got my DNA.

Speaker 1 (01:33:26):
I I email with that guy all the every week
and I talk.

Speaker 2 (01:33:31):
I just remember John's spook, and he's not going to
give you anything that's already not going to be made
or has been made public.

Speaker 1 (01:33:38):
I And that's that's the criticism I get, of course.
And they say he's trying to I say no, I
keep everyone at an arm's length and I know what
their role is.

Speaker 2 (01:33:49):
But you can't. You can't. No one can say you're
being influenced. As far as what I mean by that is,
if you're just a person who listens to what somebody
says and runs with it, yeah you're being influence. But
if you're willing to do your own research and look
at everything from an open mind, then then that's what
I did. And I had to do that for self
preservation to live. I was dying and I dug into this,

(01:34:12):
and then I went further with this because people ask
why I just didn't shut up. I tried, but Green
and that group wouldn't let me. If you've been following this,
and you know, I get talked about a cult cart
at least once a month or every other month, they
talk about me and my DNA and all that. No
one talks about me. Other people bring me up all
the time because they've introduced this DNA the whole shebang.

(01:34:37):
Never mind, And what I try to do is at
least be honest on what I believe and the fact
that I don't trust them. I don't trust any of them.
But I will say this, if you want to know
the real Smoky Man is, it's a toss up between
Green and put Off from you know, the X Files.
Those two are and Alexander. Those three guys are the

(01:34:58):
real deal. They know what's going on. Yeah, tell you
what's going on. And if you've ever dealt with them
directly and sat down with them like I have, you
think you know what you're talking about right up until
you walk away, and then the next thing you know,
and then you go back and you're it's totally it's
a different world. These guys are a whole in a

(01:35:19):
different world. But these guys are definitely in the know
of what's going on inside these projects. And one of
the things that they said was, and that's another thing,
they've never got these guys to testify.

Speaker 1 (01:35:32):
It fucking blows my mind. That you know, uh we
Eric Davis right, like help put off? There they were
they were doing that thing in Congress where it was
for like the UAP Disclosure Fund. Yeah, and you know,
Eric Davis a sin. They're talking about like different types

(01:35:53):
of aliens and ship and How's there and Abby's there
and and all this, and I'm like, what are we?
What do we fucking doing? Guys? What do we They
should be you should be calling them in under oath
to tell like this is why are we fucking wasting
our time with this? Like I get why they were

(01:36:14):
doing it, but they should also have been asking them like, hey, Eric,
I need to know about the Wilson Davis memo. I
want to know more about that. That's what you're most
famously known for. Let me like, let me bring you
into a skiff and let's talk about it.

Speaker 2 (01:36:28):
But but see they couldn't. He couldn't. But he can't
talk about it. The guy, like I said, the guy
that's most no, the guy that was the most honest,
Inness was the guy I forget, the guy that testified
in the last hearing. Yeah, when they got to him,
he said, I can't talk about any of this unless
we go on the skiff, and even then you're not

(01:36:48):
I'm not going to be able to talk to you
about it anyway, because you don't have the clinics to
know about this, and I don't have the permission to
talk about it from the agencies that I work with.
And that is the truth. That is the underlying truth. Congress,
except maybe a few people in the gang of a
even have a clearance or the need to know what's

(01:37:09):
going on.

Speaker 1 (01:37:10):
But do you see the people's point? Do you do
you see the regular like person, do you see the
point in if if say they were to go in
a skiff and they were to tell member of Congress, a,
let's just we will put names nobody about it, right?

Speaker 2 (01:37:29):
What if they did?

Speaker 1 (01:37:29):
Yeah? What if they didn't, who's gonna like, are they
gonna arrest this person to throw them in the brig
and the like? And then and then have not have Congress?
Like the regular person is like, what just just just
tell them, just tell them, no one's gonna come arrest you.
No one's gonna come do that.

Speaker 2 (01:37:48):
That's not true. Though, that's not true.

Speaker 1 (01:37:50):
Though, right, that's not true.

Speaker 2 (01:37:53):
National security trumps everything, whether you like it or not.
That's one of the arguments I get about my records,
They say, I have an access to my rec You
don't have access to anything that involves a military incident
if you're in the military, if it's classified.

Speaker 1 (01:38:06):
Well, then we're caught in between a rock and a
hard place, because now what we do have is a
bunch of d D preapproved quote unquote whistleblowers, which is
that's not the term. That is not the term for
someone who goes through pre publication through the DoD gets
exactly what they're able to talk about cleared by the

(01:38:27):
d D. They are not a whistleblower.

Speaker 2 (01:38:31):
No, but you can't think though, that's the whole thing. Plus,
you're not protected, You're only protected, Okay. Whistleblower status is this,
You're supposed to follow a protocol. And let's say, for example,
I'm working on a project that I feel is being
misused or something I'm not supposed to go public with it.

(01:38:52):
I'm not protected technically by whistlebow says, I'm supposed to
go to the Inspector General General and they are evaluating
them through clearance procedures. Then they go into these agencies
and then the Inspector General is not going to get
the answer either SAP programs are are excluded from just

(01:39:14):
about everybody. The only people that have access to them
are the people working on the programs and even within
the program is.

Speaker 1 (01:39:21):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:39:22):
And that's why when when everybody calls me, they don't
like me. But it's true, you're never going to get disclosure.
You're never going to get the answers. You don't get
the answers for how our radars work, our aircraft fry,
how they go stealth, how our weapon systems work, where
our deployments are exactly, unless they want you to know
any of that stuff. So I'll classify people are okay

(01:39:43):
with that, but then they somehow think that then they're
going to blow the whistle and tell you everything we
know about our exotic technology and how we get aspect,
how we're utilizing and everything else.

Speaker 1 (01:39:54):
This is not gonna happen, okay. So in your educated experience,
with all all the research that you've done, what so
what do you think you interacted.

Speaker 2 (01:40:09):
With I think I went into a time Daishim bubble
and I survived it somehow. One of the things that
was interesting that I did learn was my genetics were
such that normally a mitro valve. You have two leaflets,
I had a third, so I should have died on
the spot. But because I had an extra leaflet, it
protected me enough that it kept me alive for a

(01:40:30):
few years, you know, and it protected my heart. Was
valve was damaged by what we were exposed to going
into it, but I had an extra valve that was
in the medical stuff that I was able to get
my hands on. So I also think it's possible that
there are people that genetics. I mean, it's clear, it's possible.
It's real people have different genetics, but it may have

(01:40:51):
been my genetics were more susceptible to survive this. So
for a fact, they clearly were interested in me because
I did have an encounter. I did it, survived something.
But what's unknown is other than it's a UAP, which
is an unidentified aerial phenomenon. Exactly the nuts and bolts
of it are I don't one hundred percent. No, I've
gotten a better grasp of it through declassified documents and

(01:41:14):
everything else, to include the Marx generator was involved. I've
been in the fight with the mold for seven months
and it started out with I asked a bunch of
questions and they came back and said, well, there's too
much questions here, too much knowledge that you want to know.
We have it, but we won't give it to you
because it's going to cost too much. Then they came
back and said, keep narrowing it down. When I narrowed
it down to certain points, they said, oh, well, we

(01:41:35):
don't know anything on it. I'm in a debate with
the DOE right now. I'm in a five thousand person
of five thousand foy a Q right now on their
utilization of Marx generators and projects that I found out about.

Speaker 1 (01:41:50):
Do you are you leaning more towards one or another?

Speaker 2 (01:41:54):
Like? I think it's both. I think there is. There
is for sure there is. Your EPs are real and
it's unidentified aerial phenomena. I don't necessarily believe it's a
biological being. It's an energy forces, it's intelligent in nature,
it's able to do these different things. It probably is
interdimensional travel just because it involves time dilation, which is

(01:42:16):
technically interdimensional travel. I think that these scientists that are
involved know it. I think some of the reason why
it's becoming more prevalent they want to utilize it is
because of the advance, but to quantum. Quantum is what
makes us work. The computing couldn't keep up with the
technology to make it work on these things. Put Off
got a contract with the BISMA for working on tanks

(01:42:40):
to make them cloak and recloak. One of the problems
that they had was it was supposed to go from
A to B and it showed up way over somewhere else.
So the computing power couldn't keep up with the time
change to bring it back to where it started.

Speaker 1 (01:42:55):
You know, what is that similar to what happened with
like say, the Philadelphia EXPERI.

Speaker 2 (01:43:00):
Yeah, the Marx generator goes back to the Philadelphia experiment.
It goes back to Tesla. So something probably the Philadelphi
experiment was took place. It's just got completely blown out
of proportion to keep people from even accepting it possible, right,
and it all goes back up. Frequencies and manipulation of time.

Speaker 1 (01:43:19):
Yeah, sound, light, frequency seemed to.

Speaker 2 (01:43:22):
Be and the coloring, the coloring that you see represents
different frequencies. Bruce mcabee's past now was big into that,
and I did a show with him and he broke
down what the different coloring meant when you saw it
within within what this object or you know, was.

Speaker 1 (01:43:39):
Doing, right, I have, I have kind of gotten into
I think I've researched into that, and it's kind of
weird when you think about it again from a linear standpoint.
You know, in the in the fifties, grab like the
Science Popular Mechanics, all all the rage was we're about

(01:44:01):
to crack gravity, like we're about to crack gravity. The
g engines are coming and then it goes dark, right,
it goes black, and it's never heard of again. And
I don't think that's because they didn't do it. I
think it's because the black programs and the advent of
the national security state allowed the infrastructure for it to

(01:44:25):
get compartmentalized, to be brought under the banner of national security.
And that's where things get murky, because then you know,
by the time Eisenhower does warn us, he's lost control
of this thing called the military industrial complex because you
can't do anything in the military and the government with
with it being susceptible to FLOYA and freedom of information. Right,

(01:44:47):
these chips are balances, so you need to push it
out to contractors, but that brings in liability, so then
you have these this real mockery that happened between the
government and the private contractors because who holds the ownership.

Speaker 2 (01:45:08):
Well, if you really want to understand the contract part
of it, watch the movie Angels Has Fallen and it
doesn't go into UFOs, but it talks about how falling
Angels has fallen. It's a movie, and it talks about
how the contract companies control our government more than people realize.
Like right before we put out of Afghanistan, there was
twenty thousand personneled over there, fifteen thousand and were contractors.

(01:45:31):
Only five thousand military personnel were there. So the contract
companies control of this and that's how they hide all
this stuff. It's under the patent rules, the laws, and
everything else. And most people don't even know where to
start because if you don't even know which company exists
and what project they're working on, which goes back to
SAP programs. And again God God helped these congress people.

(01:45:57):
But they don't even know what they're voting on. They
don't they've admitted they don't even know where the money,
what projects, this money's going through. They just have a number, Well,
this project needs five billion, this project needs and they
vote on it. But then they complain that they complain
that they don't have oversight. Well, it's that's the way
the systems come to it's they control.

Speaker 1 (01:46:17):
It, and it's all time to do that.

Speaker 2 (01:46:20):
Yeah, it's designed to keep a secret, whether you agree
with it or not. Then you go into the whole
UFO thing was how we been lied from from the
beginning on our own existence.

Speaker 1 (01:46:33):
You now getting into like some obviously we're going to
get into some speculative territory. I would love to have
you back on the show, Okay, to do as many
parts maybe, well we'll talk off air, but I would
love to bring you in.

Speaker 2 (01:46:48):
Well, I think you need to read the book when
it comes out of it. It goes into all this stuff.
It's an open book I'm putting out. I'm talking about
every involvement, everything I had, everything I've learned, all the
I have avoided from the mold admitting that they actually
have developed UAP technology.

Speaker 1 (01:47:04):
You fin because it seemed you seemed to see through
the bullshit.

Speaker 2 (01:47:09):
And but here's the thing. You have to understand something.
Two things opened up my eyes. One, I was dying,
but I was also in most of the guys that
were involved in this incident got out. I stayed in
until two thousand and four, but I technically was until six.
I was deployed for Bosnia and for Tora Bora and

(01:47:31):
for the invasion of Iraq, and I was exposed to
technology I can't talk about.

Speaker 1 (01:47:37):
You were listened during the Operation Iraqi Freedom.

Speaker 2 (01:47:41):
Yeah, Yeah, I stayed in. I got out of active
in eighty eight, but stayed in reserve because of my specialty.
I got pulled back in constantly, and I was brought
back in after nine to eleven, and I deployed overseas.
I was involved in the Bosni incident, which no one,
nobody knows half of what really went on with that,
when when that went on with Clinton and special operations,

(01:48:02):
and then I was involved with Tora Bora, which was
the whole thing having to do with Osama Ban.

Speaker 1 (01:48:09):
Yeah, and then that was involved.

Speaker 2 (01:48:12):
And that was involved in the Iraqi invasion. I was,
in fact, I was in a classified site that's still
playing a part and everything that's going on right now
for this day over there and all the technology that
was involved back then, so what was utilized open my
eyes and opened my eyes. In fact, some of the
stuff I saw helped explain what happened to us in

(01:48:32):
rentals for us.

Speaker 1 (01:48:34):
Well, that's what I would love. That's why I want
to I think I want to bring you either come
to you or after the book comes out, of course
I'll read it. And what is it called? So i'll
the book.

Speaker 2 (01:48:45):
Is when we get it out, it's going to be
called Project Reynolds from Crossing the Threshold. Now I don't
have the name of the book. I wish I did,
but I wrote an eighty four page book that came
out in May and a guy just evaluated it's involved
in technology. He was That particular book lays out all
the agencies that are involved, including an agency you probably

(01:49:06):
never heard of called net Assessment. Now that goes back
to the exotic technology. And the guy that was involved
with this is cossign was Yoda and his name was
Andy Marshall, and he ran this agency called the Net
Assessment and it just got disbanded. Now I can't confirm

(01:49:26):
that when I put the book out they disbanded it,
but right after the book hit the shelves, the Net
Assessment Office was disbanded. And this really goes I don't know,
but it really goes into the in depth part of
the agencies and the technology that they've been working on
and how they've developed it. It's an eighty four page book,

(01:49:47):
and that was to set up this next book for
Crossing the.

Speaker 1 (01:49:50):
Threshold Crossing the Threshold as well, and that will be available.

Speaker 2 (01:49:54):
It should be hopefully before the end of the month.
And still we've got a lot of things. I'm still
trying to te have the Foyer stuff. They drugged me
on for months with their really yeah, with not giving
me answers and lead me on and and everything else,
and the DOE.

Speaker 1 (01:50:11):
But ultimately then the government shut down happens and they just.

Speaker 2 (01:50:15):
Yeah, well yeah, but that they shut the net Assessment
Office off and most people don't even know what that is.

Speaker 1 (01:50:22):
Just real.

Speaker 2 (01:50:22):
We get the book, say, four page book. I'll send
it to you afterwards. I wish I had it written down,
but it really goes into the agencies and the evolvement,
especially in that assessment off.

Speaker 1 (01:50:33):
Okay, so is it? Am I on the right track
and thinking? Okay, so an age of disclosure the one Again,
I'm not saying that everything in that is is accurate
or even true. Again, I think you have a bunch
of intelligence guys telling you their version of the story,

(01:50:54):
which is the pre publicized d O D version of
the story. So beside that, what they talk about is
is the overseeing the arch. The dog that ties it
all together is the CIA. And then under that you
have DOE, you have DOE Department, Department of Energy, the

(01:51:21):
Air Force, and oh there was one other that I
was thinking of, but you said, and then there's and
then there's the NATSK thing.

Speaker 2 (01:51:30):
It was in that assessment office. Andy Marshall was the
father of all anxiety technology. His group worked.

Speaker 4 (01:51:37):
On all that.

Speaker 2 (01:51:38):
And not only that, but he was he groomed all
the Secretary of States right through Bill Gates, and he
was involved in the actual of falling of Russia. He
was part of the Russian doctrine and and stuff with
SDI and everything else. This guy, he's past now, but
he he Obama got rid of him. Trump brought him

(01:51:59):
back under first administration, and then he passed after Trump
came out of office. But he actually that office is
neck deep in all this. But all I'm saying is
when they put this book out right afterwards, they actually
and I have confirmed it. In that assessment they made
an announcement through the Department of War that that was disbanded,

(01:52:20):
but it's still there. They've just moved it into two
or three other agencies of course. But here's the key.
You can't get any information because the agency doesn't exist anymore.
So you can't do any foya, which I did. I
actually did some FOYA on the that Assessment office.

Speaker 1 (01:52:35):
Yeah, because because now when you look for it, no,
no such program exists.

Speaker 2 (01:52:40):
No, it's been disbanded, ye, right.

Speaker 1 (01:52:42):
So that that becomes a huge issue in the FOYA process.
So I can't even imagine. So I just I want
to get into a little bit of speculation. But when
you look at things like the pyramids or these megalithic
structures across the globe, and the idea of religion and

(01:53:07):
what it what it means, right, like the themes and
the common threads that seem to tie these origin stories together.
Have you have you looked at any of that and pondered,
you know, the the were they seeing the same things
that you're seeing and you experience through a different lens

(01:53:29):
and with a different length, like you know, obviously different
a different lens they're looking at it through. They don't
have quite the vernacular we do so we call it aliens,
they call it gods. I mean, have you ever you can.

Speaker 2 (01:53:44):
Go to different cultures through the history of this planet
and they they there's different stuff the natives through on
the walls, different things that that we're written about it. Unfortunately,
the first thing that happened, which is in this book
that I just put out, Vistair Scira Echoed Protocol, which

(01:54:05):
is science fiction book, but it really goes into how
the balance was taken away from Earth when they completely
destroyed the Western hemisphere. They came over from Europe and
destroyed the cultures. They were a belief system, everything that
they had, everything they believed in, what they worshiped as gods,
and everything else that was all destroyed. Now leglie the

(01:54:28):
Vatican has some of it hidden, but the Mayas and
all that. But they completely unbalanced the earth itself when
they completely eliminated all that. And you have to go
back and ask yourself why were there two different the
East and the West. And then you have to ask
they they want to call this the old World, and
it's actually the New World. And even Churchill said the

(01:54:51):
new it called it the New World, not the Old World.
So the New World came over and destroyed the Old
world came over and destroyed the New World, and the
cult so and Catholicism, it took over a lot of
it early and now we're now Muslims are becoming more
and more prevalent, Yeah, prominent. But I'm just saying there's

(01:55:13):
always been a battle with cultures religion. What they could
have seen or not seen. I was told by somebody
in government that still in government, that just substitute alien
for God, and you have your answer.

Speaker 1 (01:55:27):
That's what and and and again, like that's how I'm
looking at it and seeing it is. You know what
if what we're experiencing now is what our ancestors experienced
and tried to tell us through their own language. I mean,
obviously like a fire breathing dragon in the sky. You

(01:55:49):
know what does that sound like? Well, it sounds like,
you know, a rocket or something right, shooting fire out
the There's a book.

Speaker 2 (01:55:56):
Out there and I can't think of the name of
I'm working on something with that right now, but I'm
not trying to hold the book back. But it was
a NASA official tried to discredit, uh, the von Donicans work,
and he couldn't do it. It's all and he looked
at it, and but he said, what was reported in
the Bible is chariots and stuff was probably alien ships

(01:56:18):
or something to the fact that came here and visited
Earth and seated Earth. Well, that's funny.

Speaker 1 (01:56:25):
Not to interrupt you, but the common theme being that
this this being you know, and Jesus said it too,
so down to you know, Christianity. The same message that
you got from that craft, I that you'll it'll be
coming back. That's the theme, right this this God always

(01:56:49):
always promises that they'll return.

Speaker 2 (01:56:52):
Yeah, right, Well, that's part of the book I'm talking about.
I talk about how we messed up everything. But the
big threat right in humanity is actually AI through NHI,
so not human intelligence is controlling AI. So and what
people don't understand about AI, it's just like what they

(01:57:12):
did with DNA. That DNA stuff that they've done where
everybody sends their DNA and analyze is going into a
major database that that there, I know, but they're studying
they're studying all the DNA out there, So what they're
studying is a lot different than what they're giving your
report back on. But the real true DNA study has

(01:57:33):
to come through blood is not through saliva. That's the
nuts and bolts. That's where ours was. Mine was done
through saliva through a lab in Pennsylvania. But the study
that put off on those guys working was a blood
drop and that was what That's when they can get
down to the nitty gritty, which by the Hope Hopey
claim that the secrets are hidden in our DNA. They've

(01:57:56):
always said that the secrets are and that's what they
were looking at, and the genetic markers and what bloodlines
do they come back to go back to and everything else.
Plus the mind is self's only being used about ten percent,
But so they were studying the mind to see the
markers in the mind and stuff like that. So these
are real studies they were doing, but they're not giving

(01:58:19):
any real reports on what they've learned.

Speaker 1 (01:58:22):
Isn't it weird that the same people in Silicon Valley
like they're they're they're racing, they're they're sprinting with AI
when they should be you know, slow crawling, and then
they're trying to warn like the Peter Tiels of the world.

(01:58:45):
They worry me because you know, when he's not doing
defense contracts and investing in these you know, companies, uh
and running talent here. You know, he's giving four part
lectures on the Antichrist and and it's like it's it's
very weird to me the ties between Silicon Valley and

(01:59:08):
what they're doing right now, and you know some of
the esoteric things, Uh, well have you?

Speaker 2 (01:59:15):
I mean you can always you can always show the Antichrist.
And I mean that's one of the things that's supposed
to go on inside government they're fighting over is what
aliens are, the Antichrist, the fallen angels. But again, there's
not enough evidence to support it one way or another.
You have to go off of what we've been told.

(01:59:36):
But what I do believe, based on what I was
exposed to and documents and everything else, that AI is
a danger because it takes away our critical thinking skills.

Speaker 1 (01:59:49):
It just just like how I mean, you know this
better probably of course better than I do. But I
remember I used to know every single person's phone number.
You know, there was a time when when GPS GPS
didn't exist, and there was a time when like the
Magellan GPS because my dad owned a moving company, so

(02:00:10):
GPS is like the ones that you could get in
the car. The Magellan ones though that was like top
tier technology at the time because it allowed you to
then start like driving and and and getting the fastest
route and but and then with phones and and all that,
like you you you stopped being able to retain information

(02:00:33):
in our wa Well, you.

Speaker 2 (02:00:34):
Can't make change or anything, right. Most people don't even
know how to spell. They they have a general idea
and they let spell check pick care.

Speaker 1 (02:00:42):
Yeah, or they don't even teach cursive in school anymore.

Speaker 2 (02:00:47):
Read regular time.

Speaker 1 (02:00:48):
Doesn't mean so it makes me.

Speaker 2 (02:00:51):
So, but but it is. And what they don't understand
what the AI. If you go like in the chat GBT,
it's kind of like Star Trek and the board. Okay,
I have my own account, so everything that I research
and go into goes into that is saved. But then
all my stuff goes into another bigger account. So everything

(02:01:14):
people are curious about, everything you're working on, all the
stuff is going into a collective. And so AI and
NHI is learning about what we know, what we could
do and how to manipulate us.

Speaker 1 (02:01:27):
Yeah, we're giving it, you know, John, I was actually terrified.
I know I have a friend and I'm not going
to say the name because I Honestly, if she hears it,
she'll know who she is. And if you do hear this,
I'm sorry I'm telling this story, but it concerns me.
I was talking to this person. This person doesn't even

(02:01:49):
have fucking Facebook or Twitter or anything. They they've and
I've always had such respect for this person's ability to
stay off social media, and like, you know, I used
to tell people like, hey, I have this one friend
you know that's not on social media. And uh, we

(02:02:09):
got to talking the other night and I didn't. She
started talking to me about how she's been talking to
chat GPT and then in talking about it, she goes
and I tell her every and I went, WHOA what
I tell her every? She's assigning it gender like it's

(02:02:31):
a fucking person. And I'm like, dude, like, hey be care,
Like I know, I don't know what did you mean
to do that? Like you know that it's not a
they or them, like, it's not a thing. It's so
like going over this and I'm like, and for all
the reasons you've stayed off social media, you're now telling

(02:02:53):
it your biggest uh your biggest secrets here. You're telling
it your flaws, You're telling it your deepest thoughts, and
you don't think that somewhere some billionaires are going to
extort that that data.

Speaker 2 (02:03:10):
But it may even be deeper. I really do believe
there's not even intelligence out there. I'm just not supporting
the biological the biological part of it. I think that
if I had to take an educated guess right now,
it's something from the future that we've evolved to, or
something that came from somewhere else that's come down here

(02:03:33):
and we eventually have to evolve to that. It's affecting everything.
But if you really look at AI, it's going to
replace almost everything we do. Slowly but surely. The only
thing that's going to hold it up short term is
the energy. They don't have the energy or the world infrastructure. Yeah,
they don't have it yet. They don't have it slowing it.

Speaker 1 (02:03:53):
Down here at here's a little tidbit for you. I
don't mean to be conspiracy guy.

Speaker 2 (02:03:59):
But.

Speaker 1 (02:04:01):
You know this, like you know this ballroom that they're
making right now?

Speaker 2 (02:04:06):
Are you talking about it? The DC?

Speaker 1 (02:04:07):
Indeed, at the way, well, Israel had Israel built this
like data center for AI and it costs like a
certain number whatever it was, and it was a it needed,
you need a certain amount of space. So I look,
someone brought it up to me and they were like,

(02:04:28):
here's the price of what the data center for Israel cost, YadA, YadA, YadA.
And then they showed me the amount of money that
was donated by big tech companies towards this ballroom and
the dimensions of it, and they said, isn't it coincidental
that it costs so the exact amount that this data

(02:04:49):
center in Israel costs. This is and it could be coincidence,
of course, But all the tech companies donated all this money,
the all the all of them, and then T Mobile.
I don't know if you want to call that a
big tech company, but I guess they are, you know,
Lockheed Martin, h Facebook, Meta, Google, open It. They're all

(02:05:10):
donating this money this ballroom, and it's all that. What
the guy was saying was the ballroom might be what
is what you can see, but underground he thinks they
might be building one of these data centers. Because that's
like a big point of contention right now, like you said,
is the infrastructure to actually to power these AI and

(02:05:35):
these AI you know things. So it's that that is
speculation that's probably not true. I thought it was Quinn's
you know it.

Speaker 2 (02:05:44):
Well, they're probably they're probably upgrading the White House because
they did with the Bunker and everything else.

Speaker 1 (02:05:50):
That they haven't you.

Speaker 2 (02:05:52):
Yeah, but again, I can't believe the White House still
sits where it does. I would think there's different.

Speaker 1 (02:06:00):
Facilities, especially after nine to eleven.

Speaker 2 (02:06:02):
Yeah, there's different facilities. There's one it's it's in the
it's Raven Rock. I don't know if you've heard of
it in Pennsylvania. That's something that's tied directly to can't
David and the President can go up there and be protected.

Speaker 1 (02:06:17):
But then like things like Chienne Mountain, that's public knowledge.
That's what we know that they publicly do, and that's
you know, that basis is crazy. It's crazy.

Speaker 2 (02:06:30):
No, there's a lot of stuff that no one's aware of.

Speaker 1 (02:06:32):
Yeah, anyway, but bringing that up, you know, I don't
know if angels and demons exist, and but I know
evil and good exists, and these AI models it seems
like it's it's it's it's searching for like it's it's

(02:06:54):
running and it's trying to find some sort of model
where it can create a body for itself. And it
feels kind of demonic, to be honest. But regardless of that.

Speaker 2 (02:07:08):
You well, the one thing I could say, probably because
we're probably getting close to wrapping up, is this all
of this goes back to nineteen eighty. I firmly believe
that area in England was a major part, even prior
to that, in the advancement of ZACH technology and including

(02:07:30):
UAP technology, because there is an area there that UAPs exist.
It's real, it's there's an energy for us there and
all that, And that's probably the reason why I'm interested
in all this ties back to what happened to us
in nineteen eighty.

Speaker 1 (02:07:49):
So, I mean, have you had when it told you
that it was going to come back? Have you had
any like I mean people talk about like the hitchhiker
effect and that kind of stuff. Have you had any
other experiences? I know a lot of the other guys
have said they have. Have you had any experiences that
you can't explain since the Rendell ship incident.

Speaker 2 (02:08:09):
There's two things that's happened to me. I lived in
Sedona for two years and we had I had some
weird stuff happened by a Branshaw.

Speaker 1 (02:08:16):
Range that's a weird place.

Speaker 2 (02:08:18):
Yeah, that is all Sidonia is completely, and there was
stuff all around in the sky and stuff that couldn't
be explained. And then I went up to Skinwalker a
couple of years ago. Originally we're going I was going
to get to go on it, and then all of
a sudden I got denied at the last second. But
we were outside the back area, and well, the story
is well. Feugel said, no problem, handed it over to

(02:08:43):
a chief scientist, and then all of a sudden the
scientists came back at the last second and wouldn't let.

Speaker 4 (02:08:49):
Me go on.

Speaker 2 (02:08:50):
So that's what There's another guy that was involved, and
that's what happened. So we'd already make plans to go
up there anyway. So we went out and we were
outside the back area, the back part. It sets off
the highway, and when we were out there, all kinds
of weird stuff happened for a couple hours, about an
hour while we were out there, flying around and everything.
We could see the facility, the vehicles driving around in

(02:09:12):
the main area from where we were back behind it.
But originally they were gonna let me on and then
they backed off led me on. The story we were
told was, and I'm just telling you what we were told. Okay,
I'm not telling you I believe this, but the people
involved feel I can manipulate the phenomenon. Huh that my

(02:09:33):
whatever happened to me and whatever I have the capabilities
I have, I can affect the phenomenon itself. And they
did me on the site that seems like.

Speaker 1 (02:09:43):
Of what I mean, I would want to bring you
on if you could do that. I'm just telling you
what I was told.

Speaker 2 (02:09:52):
I don't know what to believe or whatever, but that's
that was the final explanation on Feugal didn't have a
the problem with it. The scientists eventually came back.

Speaker 1 (02:10:02):
Would you go back if given the opportunity.

Speaker 2 (02:10:06):
I wouldn't go back unless it was a hundred percent guaranteed.
I've always wanted to go to Skinwalker because Biggelo tracked
me down forever, was tracking me down through his cronies.
I call him for years, and I always said every
time they call me, And eventually I think I ended
up meeting with the lowest the highest level before him,
which was put off Green and those guys, but it

(02:10:28):
would be lower level people before that. I always said,
I'll be happy to talk about it when Bigelow meets
me on their ranch, and they'd say, well, we'll get
back to you, and I'd always get the answer back,
mister Bigelow is not interested in meeting you on the ranch.
I said, all right, well, then mister Biggielow is not
going to get to talk to me through his cronies.
If he wants to know what I know, I'll talk

(02:10:49):
to him directly on their ranch. So I've always wanted
to go to the ranch. And it was interesting when
I met with keller Her and Nolan in Flag. That
was one of the things I told him. I said,
I'm going to do it now, but you could bait
me by letting me go up to the ranch. And
then keller Her got his eyes got huge, and even Knowlan,
he said, oh, you can't go up there, And I go,
why because of what's happened to you and what you

(02:11:12):
what what what's happened to you and everything else. It
wouldn't be good for you or the phenomenon to go
up there. So that I did hear that once before,
Pat my attorney, was right there when they wouldn't let
me go up on their ranch.

Speaker 1 (02:11:26):
So so but no, no, paranormal like no UFO sighting.
Since then, well, just what was.

Speaker 2 (02:11:34):
In the sky, which was I would call him U
A P s were finer?

Speaker 1 (02:11:37):
Yeah, aside from.

Speaker 2 (02:11:39):
Those were the only two yeah incidents.

Speaker 1 (02:11:41):
Okay, okay, both of them.

Speaker 2 (02:11:43):
Are unknown areas where UAPs exist because brats are Ranch
is a U A P site, not a UFO site.
And I believe skim Walker is too. I've never heard
of them ever talking about a craft, but I could
be wrong about skim Walker.

Speaker 1 (02:11:58):
Yeah, it's mostly like lights and cryptids and like dimensional
portalstic anomalies and that, right.

Speaker 2 (02:12:05):
So yeah, so those both times us.

Speaker 1 (02:12:09):
The only thing where I can think about that they
talk about craft like nuts and bolts craft is I
think I think some of what they think now is
that buried in the Mesa from some of the data
that they've gathered through like ground penetrating radar and other

(02:12:30):
UH sensory equipment, is that there's this in the Mesa.
There's a metallic tic tac structure.

Speaker 2 (02:12:43):
Okay, I don't know, there could be a pyramid underneath there.
That was one of the things that they speculated a
Bradshaw because of the fact, I mean, most people don't
know this, but Sonona has a timestupa, which is the
only one in the world. The Buddhens put a time
stupa in Sodona, south west. It's a stupa that manipulates

(02:13:06):
through meditation time. They actually have stupas. You can go
online and investigate it different stupas around the world. They
only have one time stupa and it's located in Sodona,
and they've tied in a version of the medicine wheel,
which is what the Native Americans have up in Wyoming.
So they have a medicine wheel and a time stupa

(02:13:27):
in Sodona out of West Sidona over by Bradshaw Rams
and the Buddhists control the time stupa. The Buddhists live there,
they have a house and they actually it's a real
Buddhist time stupa that they do ceremonies and everything else.
But I think that sits right at the base of
a major mountain. I think it's called Chimmer Rock. And

(02:13:49):
when we were up there, we saw ravens disappear into
the mountain. That's a weird place. I'm not going to
make this up. If you want to go up and
have a weird experience.

Speaker 1 (02:14:01):
A chance there's something there.

Speaker 2 (02:14:04):
I'm not trying to sell it. I don't know anything there.
I don't some people do. They want you to come
there to make money off of you. I'm going to
tell you there's something to Sedona there. I don't know
exactly what. I lived there for two years right out
right at the right to U two streets from bell Rock,
which is another whole thing that's in the culture of

(02:14:26):
the phenomenon itself and stuff. It's weird.

Speaker 1 (02:14:29):
Yeah, Yeah, there's that, there's there's there's a.

Speaker 3 (02:14:35):
There's a there's a there's a there's a there's that.
There's a. There's a, there's a, there's a, there's a,
there's a there's a. There's a. There's a there's a.
There's a. There's a. There's a. There's a. There's a.
There's a there's that. There's a there's a.

Speaker 2 (02:14:57):
Did you just flicker off? Like yeah? Something will weird
with the whole thing? Everything bizarre?

Speaker 1 (02:15:04):
What hell was?

Speaker 2 (02:15:05):
I don't know. It's happened before, would be in different interviews.
All of a sudden technology it.

Speaker 1 (02:15:11):
Changed my microphone, my cameras. Everything.

Speaker 2 (02:15:16):
Things can happen, just who knows what it is. I
never get worried about it anymore. I mean, some people
believe it's a phenomenon, right yea, it is weird. I
will tell you if you ever want to visit a
place that you can go to.

Speaker 1 (02:15:30):
You on your journey, you're writing books, you're trying to
you're staying involved, your your well for.

Speaker 2 (02:15:35):
Short term, short term. I'm hoping where.

Speaker 1 (02:15:38):
Can people Where can people find the book when it
does come out?

Speaker 2 (02:15:41):
Okay, it's going to be on Amazon.

Speaker 1 (02:15:44):
I want to have you back on to some degree
whatever you know fashion that comes in. But where can
people continue with what you're doing?

Speaker 2 (02:15:53):
Can you still hear me? Can you hear me? Can
you hear me?

Speaker 1 (02:16:01):
Yeah? I can hear you.

Speaker 2 (02:16:02):
Okay, I want to make sure. Okay, right now, Varasopovskira
is available. Call it. It's Verasopovskira Echo Protocol. It's available on
Amazon project rentals from crossing the threshold. Hopefully it'll be
out in the next two weeks. We're finishing up the
stuff and I'm been doing a thing every every week
on KGRA about Verisaskira. But ultimately I don't plan on

(02:16:27):
being around much longer with this. I've said about everything
I could say the book gode cover everything. My experience
is if something weird happens where some kind of disclosure
comes out, as people want to call it, what I
mean is the government starts opening up more to this,
I could draw me in. Or let's say somebody actually

(02:16:48):
gets the government to admit my files are classified. I'm
not saying I won't ever talk about it again, but
at this point in time, it's called insanity. It just
keep chasing your tail. I've pretty much said everything I can.
I'll probably do a few more interviews, but there's really
not much more to say until that somebody in authority

(02:17:08):
convinces the American people what we're really dealing with.

Speaker 1 (02:17:12):
You know what, that is pretty respectable. I think that's
pretty respectable.

Speaker 2 (02:17:17):
I'm not sure that person is going to be a
lot of people now respectulating Trump is going to do it.
So he might. I mean, I'm not saying he won't,
but but you know that's been every president's going to
give us disclosure and they come and go and we
never hear anything.

Speaker 1 (02:17:32):
Well, I think there's a specific there's there's for Trump
being the person that he is, right, you know that
he wants to leave his legacy, some sort of legacy
what and you know, I think to date right now
he's kind of been polarizing. Like if he you know,
if he's realistic about it and he zooms out, I

(02:17:57):
mean the just to content and and and the this
time we'll be talked about. But like will Trump be
like in the history books. I think there's one way
to do that, and that's too you know, as as
as pressure is mounting, as the general public starts to

(02:18:18):
open up and really clamor for you know, transparency and
whether it's the Epstein files or this or that, we're
in the age of you know, maybe we're not in
the age of disclosure, but we're in the age of information.
And the government they're they're no longer going to be
able to operate under the guises that they do because

(02:18:39):
if if, if it continues down the path that we're on,
it's either going to be some sort of civil war
or up uprising. Because tensions are boiling.

Speaker 2 (02:18:49):
Can make a statement, be careful what you wish for. Okay,
what happened back in the revolution cannot happen today. They
control them too much. They control the money, they control
the commodities, they control the technology and everything else, and

(02:19:10):
they the key to all this besides that is the military.
So unless the military were to want to turn on leadership,
which I find it hard to believe because they're neck
deep in all this stuff and they support secrets that
you can huff and puff and yell and scream and
say we're going to overthrow our government, but we can't

(02:19:32):
even get eighty percent of the population to vote in
the general election. So we can't get people to come
forward and come out and go to the vote and
then then go and voice their opinion peacefully, not not violently,
peacefully go out and put pressure on these people in government.

(02:19:54):
How are we going to get think that we're going
to get the government to ment anything when they control
everything that's important to include. I don't want to get
into the political side of COVID, but we shut down
over COVID, not that it wasn't real enough that people
didn't die. But if they can get us that to
turn on each other that quickly and do everything they

(02:20:16):
did with us, imagine what they could do with the
UFOs THINGO.

Speaker 1 (02:20:20):
You're actually raised a very very good point there, So.

Speaker 2 (02:20:23):
Just be careful to wish for I'd like to see
things get better, and I hope they do. But a
revolution is not going to take place because the last
thing I'll say is people aren't really willing to sacrifice
what you'd have to sacrifice. Because just look at Canada.
Do you remember those guys that demonstrated about COVID. They
cut their bank accounts away, they put them in jail,

(02:20:48):
So that was just over COVID. Imagine what they would
do if there was a movement to overthrow government. Right
January sixth, there are people still I believe, maybe not
maybe you got them all out. There were still people
before Trump came back in as president, still locked up
in cells in regions.

Speaker 1 (02:21:06):
Like fifty year old women who walked into the capitol. Like,
you know, there was definitely violence, but there's also, like
I think people need to zoom out and realize that
there was also two hundred and forty FBI agents that
were there.

Speaker 2 (02:21:21):
Right. But I'm not trying to make this political. I'm
just saying, yeah, ultimately, if just look at a couple
examples and everybody thinks we're gonna have a revolution, well yeah,
we're seeing a revolution could be realized if we could
get the majority of the registered voters to vote, and
then second of all, get everybody else that's eligible to
register to vote. Then maybe we can make a difference.

(02:21:43):
But if we can't even do that, how are we
going to form a revolution?

Speaker 1 (02:21:47):
You're right, You're right, you bring up a very very
good point, my friend. So but John always, I mean,
this was absolutely a pleasure. You're You're someone I could
definitely talk to for for literal hours. So I I,
that's that's impressive. That not not It's not every day

(02:22:08):
I speak to someone who's as quick as me on thinking.
I'm I'm a very fast paced interviewer. Uh, and jeez,
I I had trouble keeping up with you at some points.
You're a really really fun person, and you know, I
hope I know you said you want to kind of
fade into the horizon for a while.

Speaker 2 (02:22:26):
I just believe you can only talk so much. I
respect you know.

Speaker 1 (02:22:30):
I respect that. I respect that. I'd love to I'd
love to any of the other people that you're in
touch with, as far as Rendelssoon goes, I would love to,
you know, uh, talk to talk to some of them
as well.

Speaker 2 (02:22:43):
But I think you should just go down the list
yourself and approach him. Curl Holt's still here, I don't
know how much longer because he's getting older. You got
penicals out there. There's a few other people that have
made public, make public, but they said, bring them on
talk to him. But I'm so passed arguing about Rendalsom
because ultimately, at the end of the day, Rentalsom has

(02:23:04):
got so many facets to it and so many disagreements
that it's hard to take the case serious sometimes because
of some of the things that have been said that
are out there. But I firmly believe in this latest
I put out a different book called Weaponization of the UAP,
which we expose some of the technology that was there
outside the back gate. I firmly believe everything that I

(02:23:25):
put out. I know it's real and it can be
sourced and documented. So I don't try to get to
the hypothetical as least as possible. I try to show
you what I believe is going on and why and
where it goes to, you know, not so much the
hypothetical and stuff. And there is hypothetical because no one
really knows what the dark secrets really are. Right they're there, they're.

Speaker 1 (02:23:49):
There, right there. Well, But that being said, with everyone.
You know what it is, uh maybe a thought, Stay humble,
stay kind, and uh you up question everything. All right,
we'll see you guys next time. Thank you, John, Thank
you for your services country.

Speaker 4 (02:24:08):
Thanks, thank you.

Speaker 2 (02:25:01):
What did you mean

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