October 1, 2025 • 55 mins
Two straight wins change more than the standings; they change how we carry ourselves. The Jags went over to the West Coast and handled business against a beat up 49ers team that is still a very respectable unit. They did this by matching San Francisco’s physical edge, turning special teams into a weapon, and playing complimentary football in the end.
With a lot to unpack, we discussed multiple topics after the Jags 26-21 victory, including the following talking points:
• Devin Lloyd’s all-field surge and leadership
• Liam Coen’s culture-setting moment with Robert Saleh
• Anthony Campanile and Co. bullying the 49ers offensive line
• Parker Washington’s game-changing punt return and special teams swing
• Trevor Lawrence's mental miscues
• The ongoing issue with penalties
• What do we need to see Monday vs. KC
• Are the Jags back?
Use our promo code Touchdown Jaguars on SeatGeek to save $20 off your first purchase
James Johnson and Phil Barrera bring you the best and most up to date Jacksonville Jaguars news. "Touchdown Jaguars!" is a tribute to the prospective ownership group "Touchdown Jacksonville!" In 1991, the NFL announced plans to add two expansion teams and "Touchdown Jacksonville!" announced its bid for a team, and Jacksonville was ultimately chosen as one of five finalists. In November 1993, the NFL owners voted 26–2 in favor of awarding the 30th franchise to Jacksonville. James and Phil have been fans of the franchise ever since and have had the honor (and sometimes dishonor) of covering the team professionally since 2017. The rest as they say, is history.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_01 (01:01):
Jaguars podcast.
Here your hosts, James Johnsonand Phil Smith.
SPEAKER_02 (01:08):
Hey everyone, welcome back to the Touchdown
Jaguars podcast.
I am your co-host, Phil Barrera,joined as always by your other
co-host, James Johnson and Jay.
For the second straight week, weare recording here on a victory
Monday here for the podcast.
It is a very nice and unfamiliarfeeling, especially over the
(01:31):
last couple of years, but wewill certainly take it.
And uh, you know, while we umwhile uh Liam Cohen, of course,
wants to you know wants peopleto keep his name out of other
people's mouths, uh we certainlywant to make sure people are
saying touchdown Jaguars aroundhere and listening to the
podcast.
So we very much appreciate thesupport we've gotten so far.
(01:53):
But uh Jay, hey, theJacksonville Jaguars, three and
one, tied for first place in theAFC South.
And uh, you know, just a coupleweeks ago when we did our season
preview episode, we said, hey,if they come out of this stretch
of the first four games, two andtwo, we're pretty happy.
Uh lo and behold, they're overthere two games over 500 and
(02:14):
very much in the mix and winninggames that they probably would
have lost in the past.
So we'll certainly take that.
SPEAKER_00 (02:21):
Yeah, man.
It again, the team um in a lotof ways feels night and day
different than the teams of thepast.
Going over there on the WestCoast and just flat out looking
prepared.
We never look prepared on theWest Coast, right?
So that's a uh change that Itook note of here, and we'll
kind of discuss that later, man.
But yeah, man, it feels great tobe talking about a win,
(02:44):
especially against a team thatum, you know, to a degree we
have respect for until theytried our coach, right?
But um, you know, like we can'tI'll put it this way we came
into the game with a great dealof respect for the 49ers, you
know, like you hadn't heard abad word from you and I, at
least from the 49ers, and wepraised him in the past and Kyle
(03:07):
Shanahan and company, and evenRobert Sala.
We even kind of discussed himwhen we were going through our
head coaching search, and uh, ofcourse, we will be talking about
him again today for obviousreasons.
But yeah, man, very excited todiscuss what transpired.
Wasn't able to see the gameinitially like I wanted to
because I was at work, so it waskind of paying attention to that
(03:31):
here here and there, and then myjob.
So I wasn't able to see it, butthen I went back and watched the
condensed version.
Uh, so albeit I did see a quickversion of it, I still gotta
process some stuff, but hey,we'll roll with the punches.
That's what podcasting is allabout.
And um, as I said, I've seenenough of it, and yeah, can't
wait to uh get these takes off.
SPEAKER_02 (03:53):
Yeah, plenty to talk about in what was a dominant
performance in multiple phasesof the game uh against the San
Francisco 49ers, a team that Ithink over the last few years
has certainly built up a um youknow a bully mentality when you
know, talking about physicalitywhen it comes to that team.
But Jacksonville went in thereand played kind of a brand of
(04:16):
49ers football that we have seenin the past, and they did it
very, very well.
Plenty to discuss here thisevening, Jay, as we uh uh break
down the Jaguars win and eagerlyawait Monday night football.
So yeah, but before we jump intoit, uh once again, if you want
to make sure you keep up witheverything Touchdown Jaguars
(04:37):
related, make sure you check theLink Tree link in the show notes
of this and every singleepisode.
And if you're looking fortickets for Monday night, make
sure you head on over toSeatGeek.
Use our promo code TouchdownJaguars, and all of you
first-time buyers over on uhSeatGeek can save$20 off your
first purchase courtesy of theTouchdown Jaguars podcast.
(04:58):
But yeah, Jay, uh, once again,Jacksonville goes into San
Francisco and wins 26 to 21.
It was a third straight orfourth straight game where the
Jaguars had three or moreturnovers.
And uh, you know, boy, there aresome crazy standouts when it
comes to these performances.
Devin Lloyd obviously beingfront and center uh with his
(05:22):
interceptions as well as justbeing all over the ball.
Um, but we happen to start herewith uh what was making the
rounds after the game, and thatof course was the video of Liam
Cohen and Robert Sala.
And Liam Cohen in very shortwords just saying, Keep my name
out of your mouth.
And for those of you that don'tknow, if you were maybe living
(05:44):
under a rock or just weren'tpaying attention, Robert Sala
was in uh press conferencesduring the week leading up to
the game saying that Liam Cohenand his staff have a way of
legally stealing offensive signsor defensive signs, and uh Kyle
Shanahan kind of doubled down onthat throughout the week.
Certainly didn't do anything touh to hush those claims.
(06:10):
And uh again, the Jaguars cameinto San Francisco and punched
them in the mouth.
So after the game, Liam Cohen.
It definitely seemed like RobertSalah was trying to go up and
shake his hand, and Liam Cohenwas having none of it.
And I want to shout out Wig herebecause I I want to um repeat a
lot of what he was saying overon Locked On Jaguars, where you
(06:30):
know the thing that reallyirritated me about this whole
Robert Sala thing, especiallyafterwards, is like stand-on
business, man.
Like he it feels like he brokesome sort of like there was like
a coach's code, you know what Imean?
And this really did just reek ofsomeone who was very bitter that
he didn't get the JacksonvilleJaguars coaching job.
(06:53):
You know, he we you mentioned itbefore we got started.
He was one of the guys that wasthat was in the running, he's
probably one of the finalistsbefore uh you know the whole
thing happened with Liam Cohen.
And um, and I think he'scertainly pretty salty about
that.
You know, things ended poorly inNew York and he was forced out
of there.
And uh I'm sure he wants to be ahead coach again, probably feels
(07:14):
like he should be a head coachin the NFL.
Uh, but you know what?
You didn't get the job.
And uh yeah, I'm glad that hedidn't get the job here in
Jacksonville because we have acoach now who I think really
embodies the fan base.
I mean, Jacksonville has beenthe the laughing stock of the
league essentially you know foryears.
(07:36):
And people use Jacksonville as avery easy target, and I think
Liam Cohen and James Gladstoneand Tony Biselli and everybody
in there now are they've justhad enough of it.
And performances like this andand actions like this, you know,
and and Wig said this too.
No one's gonna fight on thefield, right?
That's not gonna happen as faras coaches go.
(07:57):
But Liam Cohen's like, hey,well, you know what?
This is my this is my team now.
This is, you know, we love thiscity.
We love we're gonna embrace thefans and we're gonna stand up
for ourselves, and I thinkthat's a great sign.
So, you know, Robert Salah, uh,and then oh yeah, and then Mike
uh Kyle Shanahan after the gamesaying, you know, maybe he
shouldn't be so sensitive.
You know what, maybe your teamshouldn't be so sensitive and
you would have won the footballgame.
(08:18):
Maybe if you guys didn't play sosoft and and Brock Purdy, your
dork of a quarterback, didn'tthrow and turn the ball over, or
you didn't give us, you didn't,you know, give us a bunch of uh
turnovers.
Maybe, you know, maybe maybeyour team needs to be a little
less sensitive.
But I don't know, Jay.
Uh, how do you feel about all ofthis?
And then, you know, of course wewere irritated about it going
into the game, and then we seethe footage of uh of Liam Cohen
(08:40):
showing that fire and just uhyou know sticking up for
himself, which I think is great.
So what was your uh what wereyour initial thoughts when that
video came out?
SPEAKER_00 (08:50):
Um I think like now that I've had the time to
process it, I think what thiswas a matter of is Liam Cohen
understands that he is amouthpiece for the Jacksonville
Jaguars organization and for thecity.
(09:10):
And he also understands, and wekind of talked about this when
we were looking for a coach,like what kind of front office
culture would we have?
What would be our identity, notjust on the field, but what
would be our identity as anorganization?
And the one thing that you kepthearing in the reports that the
Jaguars wanted to be was acoach-centric team.
(09:31):
You remember we kept hearingthat word a lot, coach-centric
team.
And I think when Liam got thejob, he understood that, right?
I mean, for crying out loud, wehired him before we hired a GM.
If that doesn't screamcoach-centric, I don't know what
does, right?
But he understands that this isa coach-centric team and that
he's a mouthpiece for not onlythe team, but also for Duval and
(09:53):
the 904 and so on and so forth.
And kind of going to what youwere saying, we've been a
laughing stock for a long time.
And if you're gonna be themouthpiece of a coach-centric
team, you need to establish thatearly, you know, in your career.
Early in the here we are, whatfour games into his career, he's
establishing in that um againsta 49ers team, which this is
(10:18):
another thing.
Liam understanding thesituation, he's a smart dude.
What team to better have thissituation, you know, in terms of
meeting somebody on the fieldand having words with them, than
an organization that bulliespeople, like you said, Phil,
like the San Francisco 49ers.
(10:38):
So that's him understanding likethis is the perfect team for me
to get my you know what off,basically.
The 49ers, a team who hastraditionally beat up on us.
And you know, I did the researchand I mentioned it on Twitter,
Phil, uh under Balkey, westruggled mightily against the
49ers.
We played them twice in histenure.
That was his former team, by theway.
(11:00):
They beat us by a score of 64 to13.
And in those matches, bro, weand you know, we seen the film
of them, both of them.
We were just outclassed, right?
And every time we ended upplaying them, it felt like we
left those games saying, like,that's what we want to be.
We want to be a bully to otherteams.
(11:21):
And here we are, we bulliedthem, like ran the ball almost
with ease on them.
And um, you know, we justmatched their physicality.
Well, we outmatched theirphysicality if we're being
honest about it.
So it's just Liam understandingthat we're a coach-centric
organization now.
He needs to establish that andand speak up for the 904 and the
(11:44):
team and be that mouthpiece forthe team.
And he saw the perfectopportunity to do it against a
team with tradition,physicality, and a team.
Also, too, part of this is hehas history with the 49ers,
right?
The McVay tree, which Shanahanis kind of a part of, too, by
the way.
But the McVay tree has historywith facing that 49ers tree,
(12:06):
like the current 49ers tree ofShanahan, Robert Sala.
Um, I guess you could put GusBradley in there now because
he's the assistant head coach,and you know, Robert Salah's
from his tree, technically.
So they have history from yearsand years of battling each
other.
So it's probably some bad bloodfrom then, too, as well, like
the Rams and the 49ers as well.
(12:28):
So that it can go back as far asthat as well.
And you mentioned the other partof it too.
For Robert to say something likethat, you know, which you know
it didn't bother me like a lot,but I can see why a coach would
take offense to it, right?
Um for him to say something likethat, you gotta think like it
(12:49):
was something that sparked himto say that.
Because typically in pressconferences, you don't hear
coaches mention that, right?
You know, like that's notsomething you typically, it's
like, hey, you know, we got agood team that we're playing in
front of us, um, they playedhard, so on and so forth.
A lot of coach speak.
Never do you hear this, youknow, whole thing about they
steal signals, this, that, andthe other.
(13:11):
But a part of it, you have tofeel like for him to mention
something like that, has to bethat they were both candidates
for this Jags job in the end.
You know, a lot of people willsay Salah was kind of in the his
name was in the the hat, so tospeak, because uh of Trent
Balkey, obviously.
And Trent Balkey just has tofind whoever would agree to join
(13:33):
the team with him being a GM.
So it's not like he had a lot ofoptions out there, or some
people can even say that Salahhe has a good relationship with
the cons too, which there's thattoo.
Um, but at the end of the day,Liam Cohen wowed, you know,
wowed them even more so thanSalah did.
He got the job.
But I think that's part of ittoo, Phil.
I think for him to mentionsomething and take a little
(13:56):
slight like that, which again tome it didn't bother me that
much, but I can see if I was ahead coach, it probably would
have triggered me as a headcoach.
Um, for him to mention somethinglike that, it has to be more to
it um than we're looking at.
And when you look at theirhistory, it it most likely is
that they were both they theyboth had their names in the hat
for the job.
SPEAKER_02 (14:17):
Yeah, it just reeks of that and uh you know
bitterness, and um, like like Isaid, you know, Robert Salah,
I'm sure still uh the whole theway that things ended with the
Jets and Aaron Rodgersessentially, you know, strong
arming him out of the out ofthat job, and um, I'm sure also
played into it.
But uh, you know what?
At the end of the day, theJacksonville Jaguars won the
(14:40):
game, and Robert Sala ended upon Jaguar Twitter's hate list.
So uh enjoy that as well as KyleShanahan.
Um and yeah, Jay, as far as likethe struggles against the
Niners, they brought it up onthe broadcast.
Like we had they had been we wehad always struggled against the
San Francisco 49ers, which iswhy we circled some of these
West Coast trips as probablelosses.
(15:01):
But um, yeah, they came in, andyou know the argument can be
made.
The score should have been uh,you know, a lot um a lot a lot
or the the deficit should havebeen a lot wider when it came
down to the end of the game.
But uh yeah, there are plenty ofstandouts here.
Jay Travis Etienne had himselfanother solid game, 19 carries,
124 yards, and a touchdown.
(15:22):
Uh we saw Parker Washington getthe punt return uh that was much
needed at the time as you kindof felt like momentum was
swinging back in the way of theSan Francisco 49ers.
And then the defense, man,forcing the turnovers, and then
Devin Lloyd continuing to be allover the field, Jay.
Uh, we talked about thedefensive line, also had
(15:44):
themselves a really solid day.
Devon Hamilton, um, those guysinside.
Uh Josh Hines Allen was bullyingTrent Armstrong Trent uh Trent
Williams throughout the entireday.
Um, and then of course, youknow, one thing we are awaiting
news on.
I believe he went to go see aspecialist today is the the
status of Trayvon Walker becausehe has been a big, as big of a
(16:09):
um force multiplier on thedefense as anybody else here
this season.
So we current you know certainlyum hope to hear good news on
that front.
But Jay, what did you want topoint out as far as individual
performances, uh performances byan entire unit, whatever you
would like to start?
Um, because yeah, there was alot to like about the
(16:30):
performance on Sunday.
SPEAKER_00 (16:32):
So the first one is just um the elite level that
Devin Lloyd is playing at, man.
And um, you know, he's been theconversation of a lot of Jags
talk on Twitter.
You know, some people saying weshould have picked up the
fifth-year option, and somepeople are like, hey, you know,
stay on that side with DevinLloyd.
But look, man, I'm here to tellyou.
(16:54):
When I looked at that man onfilm last year, and me and you
mentioned this, Phil.
It was one time in the Titansgame, he missed like two to
three tackles in one drive,right?
There was times where he lookedlike he didn't want any part in
chasing down the plays, right?
And look, that very well couldhave been that Doug Peterson was
wearing on him.
So I stand by it, man.
He didn't look good last year.
(17:15):
He doesn't he didn't looknowhere near the player that he
looks to be today.
And I'm glad to eat my words onhim now that he's playing to his
potential.
But, you know, like I was I waslooking like the potential and
all of that went impressing melast year.
I wanted to see it take place onthe field before, you know, I
(17:36):
jumped the gun on this youngman.
And here he is, he's showing hispotential that he showed at Utah
playing like the player he is.
And again, I think a lot of itis um Anthony Campanini and his
impact um on Devin Lloyd uhbecause it just looks like he,
you know, he wants to be there,and uh he's making the tackles
in the open field that he wasn'tmaking before.
(17:57):
He's um playing better incoverage, right?
Like it was one time, and youknow, we mentioned this film in
the preseason when he played inthat third preseason game, which
we were kind of shocked.
Like, why is Devin Lloyd outhere against the Dolphins?
He looked lost in coverage, andnow like you look at the film,
and I think it was Gus um thatput this out.
Shoutouts to him.
(18:17):
Um, but you look at the film,and Devin Lloyd is conducting
like he's foyer, right?
Like he's pointing out routes tofoyer, like, hey, take that
route, passing off routes topeople.
He's making, as I mentionedearlier, he's making the the
tackles in the open field thathe wasn't making before at
times, and um, you know, he justlooks like a completely
(18:38):
different player, man.
He's unstoppable and blitzing,right?
As well.
Uh, he's getting penetration inthe backfield, so he's just
really doing it all.
And yeah, he is playing, youknow.
I'll be the first to admit this,man.
He's playing at an all-pro levelright now.
And um, you know, he's a guythat like at this point, man, as
as upset as I was as I was withhim last year, like you gotta
(19:02):
keep him if he's playing likethis, bro.
Like, good organizations don'tlet that go, right?
So um, I don't know, man.
I I feel like maybe maybe me andyou talked about this film.
Uh maybe him and Fred Warnerswapped hands or something
because Fred Warner couldn'tcatch a cole yesterday.
Although he was he he was helooked good, Trevor was trying
(19:24):
to give him the ball, man.
Yeah, she was trying.
But you know, and speaking ofwhich, um, shoutouts to Trevor
for not breaking theinterception record.
It was an interception record upfor grabs.
So um shoutouts to him and alittle help from Warner uh for
not breaking that.
But that's where I wanted tostart is with Devin Lloyd, man.
And um, yeah, man, like I'm at apoint now where it's like I
(19:47):
would be hurt if we let that mango.
The way he's playing in themiddle of the field, like at an
all-pro level, you gotta figureit out and keep him.
And you know, James Gladstonecomes from a Rams organization
that knows you don't let playerslike that just go.
Like, that's something TrentBalkey would do, but um not um
James Gladstone.
SPEAKER_02 (20:07):
Yeah, man, Devin Lloyd.
Uh I mean we were talking aboutit like before the season when
we were looking at like hisMadden rating, like we were
joking about it.
Like, who does Devin Lloyd bribeat EA to get his Madden rating
this high?
And you know, we have we've seenlike a version kind of of this
Devin Lloyd, like in his rookieyear, and then that's the one
(20:29):
that like disappeared.
So, you know, fingers crossedthat, and I don't think that's
going to happen again, uh, asfar as him uh you know reverting
back.
But this is a uh a wholedifferent level.
This is all pro footballdefensive player of the year
conversation type of um type ofplay.
(20:49):
If Devin Lloyd is playing likethis in Dallas or in New York or
in Kansas City, something one ofthese bigger markets, people are
talking about him being one ofthe best linebackers in the
league.
And he's playing that way rightnow.
In in heading into week five,Devin Lloyd is a top five to ten
linebacker in the NFL.
(21:09):
And he is gonna get paid, andrightly so.
And, you know, I you know, Ithink that him not getting that
fifth-year option certainlyplayed a part into how he is
performed, but he's everywhere,man.
You turn on the film and you youwatch every single play, he's
somewhere nearby all the time,whether he's making the tackle
or at least just impacting theplay in some sort of way.
(21:32):
I have not seen anything likethis in a in a very, very long
time.
And then when you pair that withhow well Josh Hines Allen and
Trayvon Walker are playing,along with uh Eric Armstead
making plays, being back in hisnatural position, making his
return to San Francisco.
Eric Armstead, another guy,people that were ready to throw
out of town, you know, and we'rewe're learning just so much
(21:54):
about like how much these guysjust were not put in the right
positions to succeed.
And now they are.
And I think the thing that we'rewe're all worried about now,
Jay, is that we aren't gonnahave Anthony Campanili very
long.
He is going to get head coachingopportunities very, very soon if
things continue to trend thesame way.
(22:15):
And imagine if this defense hasa similar performance on prime
time against the Kansas CityChiefs on Monday.
They have an opportunity here.
I I think there even thoughthere's not necessarily such a
thing as a moral victory, theyhave an opportunity to come out
of here, even if they I think ifthey don't win to make a big
(22:38):
statement on uh, you know, beingthe only game on uh and being in
prime time and kind of ridingthose wrongs from last year's
Monday night performance againstBuffalo.
Uh this is a team that I thinkas far as defensively and
schematically, they can they cantry and figure out.
It's just of course that speed,you know, when you talk about
like Pacheck, I'm getting aheadof myself and looking towards
(22:59):
next week, but um, you know,there's an opportunity here for
for them to make a big statementon Monday night football um for
sure if they continue to playthis way.
And hopefully that includes, ofcourse, Trayvon Walker on Monday
night.
But yeah, lots to lots to loveabout how Devin Lloyd is
playing, Jay.
SPEAKER_00 (23:17):
Absolutely.
And you talked on you know who'shelped him get there, uh Camp
O'Neilly, um, who you know,yeah, there are concerns he
might be gone uh sooner ratherthan later.
But the good news is, Phil, theleague hates defensive
coordinators as head coaches.
So that's the good news, right?
Um, because we had topractically um yell at the top
(23:42):
our lawns for AG to get a job,right?
For Aaron Glenn to get a job.
So um there's that.
So, you know, hopefully, well,you know, I don't want to say
that because you want the man toget the best opportunity that he
can.
I was about to say hopefully theleague continues that trend of
not wanting DC's as headcoaches, but you know, you never
want to say that because thispertains to him feeding his
(24:02):
family and getting a betteropportunity.
But I wouldn't mind keepingkeeping Coach Camp as long as we
can.
I'll put it that way.
Right.
Um, so yeah, the next thing uh Iwanted to talk about um is just
the fact that um BTJ's handslook better.
Um, you know, he he didn't haveany issues catching the ball.
(24:22):
Now I know he did have the onecatch where he couldn't get both
feet in bounds, which that'sthis generation just frustrates
me so much with that.
Like, I I don't know, man.
Like it was something that likereceivers practiced to the T
back in the day.
But um anyway, that being said,though, um, it looks like he is
(24:43):
starting to slowly get hisconfidence back in terms of
catching the ball.
Uh, we kind of talked about it alittle bit um earlier where it
was mentioned that um, you know,it looked like the Jaguars were
maybe trying to design um asituation for him to not catch
many in the middle of the field.
Um, and then Mia kind ofresponded in a tweet in response
(25:05):
to that.
Uh, it's probably because justyou know, the reason they that
he caught a lot of out routes,which is fine.
Like, if that's what it takes toget him going, good.
You know, shout outs to RobertSalah for helping us get um BTJ
going.
But a part of it is probablybecause you know Salah and that
Gus Bradley and Pete CarrollTree, they believe in a lot of
like cup cover three and deepzone coverage, this, that, and
(25:27):
the other.
So they were playing so far offof BTJ where it was a lot of
opportunities probably foroutbreak and routes.
So if that's what it takes toget him going, shout outs uh to
them for helping us get themthere, as I said earlier.
But I I just like seeing BTJ um,you know, using his hands to
catch the passes, looking themin, all of that good stuff.
(25:49):
That's an encouraging sign, andum, hopefully he'll continue
trending in the right direction.
Uh, Parker Washington, man,that's that's the last takeaway.
Is not just him though, but thespecial teams, which it was hit
or miss, right?
We we missed a field goal, sothere was that.
Um, but now people understandwhy we say, like, and we weren't
(26:09):
joking about this, that thisteam has the potential to have
the best special teams, youknow.
If our punter and kicker can gettheir stuff back together, they
have the potential to be thebest special teams in the
league.
And Parker Washington showedthat, um, showed it in a big way
with the punt return.
Um, Liam kind of talked aboutthis too as well.
And this is why this team is umin some ways special, is because
(26:34):
while one side of the ball mightbe struggling, somebody else
picks it up somewhere down theroad.
So, that being said, ParkerWashington kind of made up for
um some of the offensive issuesthat we were having.
Um, contributed that touchdown,Bachel Tootin, as well.
You could put him in that mix.
He had the big return that putus in good position as well.
(26:56):
Um, so shoutouts to them interms of the return game.
Now we just need to get CamLittle back right.
We need to get um uh Logan Cookback right.
Who Logan Cook, I'll have to goback and look at the film with
him.
He looked okay today or Sunday,should I say.
So I'll go back and look and seehow he looked in totality.
But yeah, shoutouts to thespecial teams for uh giving us
(27:18):
that shot in the arm that weneeded because when you look at
how the game turned out, theyprobably were the X factor.
Special teams was probably the Xfactor in this game.
And if you go and look at someof the takeaways from like these
49ers writers, right?
Some of the things they'resaying is like special teams let
us down.
So that feels like it was the Xfactor in this game that kind of
(27:39):
uh compensated for some of theissues that the offense was
having.
SPEAKER_02 (27:43):
Yeah, that was going to be one of my questions that
uh for you is what is your levelof concern for for the special
teams?
Logan Cook is is very low onthis scale just because uh, you
know, and I didn't see the gamelast week, so I don't know if he
struggled last week as well.
But here, you know, it LeviStadium is a weird stadium, you
(28:03):
know, you got the wind comingoff the uh off the lower part of
the stadium.
We were talking about how it'sjust oddly placed and oddly
shaped and oddly built.
We were talking about thatbefore the episode.
So I'm I'm not going to fullypanic when it comes to that.
Um, but you know, they uhobviously Cam Little has a
chance to make a big field goalthere in the fourth quarter, and
he misses that.
(28:24):
Uh, he missed one whether it waslast week or a couple of weeks
ago.
And uh, you know, um obviouslywe're we're weeks and weeks away
from the 70-yard field goal,right?
Um that was the feel-good storyof the preseason.
But um, you know, we're startingto see a couple of things that
are a little concerning.
Um, and then uh again, obviouslythe great the great thing has
been Parker Washington and andum yeah, a little bit of a you
(28:48):
know uh a mix up there with theQuentin Allen with early on with
the kickoff, and that that'sjust these rookies learning
these new rules, and honestly,everybody learning these new
rules.
We've seen major mistakes uhwhen it comes to these new
kickoff rules.
So, what is your level ofconcern when it comes to special
teams?
You know what can they do as faras getting that right?
(29:09):
Because you're talking about oneguy who is you know still very
new to the league, and thenLogan Cook, like I said, I'm
very low in the totem pole interms of my concern.
But uh yeah, what do you see inthere?
And you know, what do you whatdo you think is going on?
SPEAKER_00 (29:21):
Not high.
I don't have a high levelconcern for him.
For one, like I've always likedhow Cam Little, and he mentioned
this before, how he's wired andhow he goes about his business
of kicking field goals.
And he says, like, when he heenters the field, he just kind
of just blocks everything out,you know, and he's just in this
(29:42):
his own space, which I likekickers that can do that.
I mean, I and I get it, like alot of kickers try and do that,
but you could tell like he'sreal good at blocking out the
noise and just getting himselfin that place where it's just it
feels like it's just him on thefield, and I think he can get
back to that.
And also, too, man, he you know,the Reason he's on his team for
a reason in regards to why theJaguars spent the draft pick on
(30:04):
him.
And a big reason for that isbecause he's kicked in big time
atmospheres.
When you come from the SEC,right, Arkansas, which is where
he came from, you know, he'she's been to all of these
stadiums that we talk about allthe time, the swamp.
Um, he's been to um SanfordPhil, um, Between the Hedges, so
(30:27):
on and so forth.
He's been to all of these,probably played Texas too, your
team, Phil Loud Stadium as well,Alabama, all of these legendary
stadiums that we talk about,Auburn Stadium.
He's been there and he's feltthose atmospheres.
And I think that's like how hewas able to be drafted as high
as he was, is because he'skicked in some of those
(30:47):
situations.
So um honestly, he's reallykicked in stadiums bigger than
NFL stadiums, if we're beinghonest.
So that doesn't concern me.
And and Logan Cook's been in theleague long enough where he
could correct things.
Um, I know the question came upas to if special teams coach
Heath Evans um is somebody thatwe need to start looking at and
(31:11):
um you know considering like ishe getting the job done?
And I'll say this, man, that manis one of the better special
teams coaches in the league.
Up until two weeks ago, weweren't having this
conversation, and you know, hewas so good at his job that Liam
Cohen kept him from the previousregime.
So that's kind of a sign, youknow, like, hey, Liam looked at
(31:33):
him as a as something as a pieceof the previous organization
that he could keep and buildwith.
So, no, to answer your question,I'm not concerned about the
special teams.
SPEAKER_02 (31:44):
Yeah, they built up enough goodwill to earn the
benefit of the doubt, especiallylike I said, Logan Cook.
Um, we'll see what happens witha uh a young kicker who has at
least so far has shown that uhyou know that he again is able
to uh kick through thesesituations and um you know have
ice in his veins.
So uh yeah, not totally, totallyconcerned with that quite yet.
(32:06):
And hopefully they won't give usa reason uh to uh to do so.
So um and then the last questionhere uh as we uh you start to
look towards Monday is uh youknow the performance of Trevor
Lawrence.
He certainly didn't light it up,but early on he was doing pretty
well.
I think he started around likeeight of eight, then uh of
course had the uh the touchdownpass to Hunter Long.
Um, but there were up there weredefinitely situations there uh
(32:30):
where you know he he could haveeasily had maybe two or three
interceptions, if I recallcorrectly.
Um J, I'm a very emotionalwatcher of football.
You know, you know that I am,especially the Bengals game
really, really made me angry.
And 21 to 31, 174, uh and atouchdown.
Um there were still severalmiscues when it came to running
(32:55):
the offense.
Obviously, the penalties havecontinued to be a thing.
Uh that's the one thing we havewe are just not seeing get
better week after week, andthat's something that needs to
fix itself very, very soon.
With Trevor, you know, we havebeen very, very avid defenders
of him, and Trevor Lawrence haskind of become this quarterback
where you can really get an ideaif somebody is watching film or
(33:18):
not.
And I watched the entire uh youknow, I watched the entire game
on Sunday, and there are a lotof things that are beginning to
frustrate me about TrevorLawrence.
Now, this is no not certainlynot me saying that we need to
move on from him, but there arejust certain actions in the and
the way that he's still he'sstill making some mistakes that
(33:41):
should not be happening at thispoint in his career.
We're gonna throw the money outof it.
We're gonna get the money out.
We know how it works forquarterbacks on this podcast.
You pay or you or or you or youdon't, and then you're you know,
you're one of these core one ofthese teams that are constantly
looking for a quarterback.
When do you need to seesomething from Trevor this year
before you're like, all right,man, let's go, let's let's pick
(34:05):
it up.
You have to you have to be areason that we're winning some
of these games as well.
And they're playing verycomplimentary football right
now, and you can argue that thepart that still hasn't quite
flashed, the way that ETN, theway that Parker Washington, the
way that Devin Lloyd has, is 16.
And I just want to know how howyou're feeling about it.
Um, because I didn't want tocome in here and be totally
(34:27):
negative, of course, coming offof a win, but there are just
some things that are continuingto concern me about Trev.
SPEAKER_00 (34:33):
Yeah, well, I think one thing um that is the issue,
and and Liam has said this too,and I think I I kind of
overlooked it myself because asI told you earlier, I thought it
was gonna be the defense thatstarted slow, you know.
So, like I didn't really Ireally didn't pay any mind to
(34:53):
the offense because I thoughtthe offense was gonna be the
side of the ball that startedfaster than the defense because
they had the run game.
But Liam has said this too, man.
Like, he got a lot on his plate,right?
Um, this is what Trevor's.
So it was Liam Doug Urban.
This is his third scheme in fouryears, if my math is right,
(35:16):
third and four years.
Um, and like I said, Liam hassaid it like we're gonna ask a
lot out of him as thequarterback for this offense,
and also too, something thatthat makes me optimistic about
him.
He started slow with DougPeterson, and then he had that
stretch where he went crazy.
(35:37):
I think it started with theRavens game, right?
If I'm not mistaken, it was thatRavens game, and he just went
crazy after that.
So I have to go back and look atwhat point in the season that
was that year, but he startedslow under Doug too, and he put
it together, and then that'swhen they went on that crazy
run, went to the playoffs.
Um, it's just that's part of hisnature, I think.
(35:58):
It is just he just starts slow.
And um, for him to be in anotherscheme, like he was with the
Doug Peterson situation, samesituation basically.
Um, I can envision a situationwhere he starts to put it
together around, you know, whoknows, like maybe that Rams game
uh that's coming up in Londonsomewhere like that, or you
(36:19):
know, somewhere in thatballpark.
So, no, I'm not concerned withhim because again, like I've
seen this before.
I've seen him start like thisunder Doug Peterson.
I can't remember like the UrbanMeyer season is such a blur
because it's something we ratherall forget.
Um I just I know you know theseason in general wasn't good,
but I just forgot like howsporadic he was that year is
(36:40):
what I'm saying.
Um, but yeah, no, I'm notconcerned about him because just
I date back to how he startedwith Doug and turned it on then.
So uh that's what I would sayabout that.
SPEAKER_02 (36:52):
Yeah, that's a really good point.
You know, it took some time withthat, you know, that first year
with uh with Doug.
And listen, if they put thisthing together and it's all
three phases and then thepenalties go away, if you even
cut the penalties in half, Jay,like they are they're blowing
teams out.
If if you if you stop shootingyourself in the foot and you
(37:14):
know, Trev turned some of thosemisses into uh, you know, the
the Travis Hunter miss in theCarolina game, you know, some of
these decisions that were he'sjust missing Brian Thomas Jr.
or Parker Washington, you know,those one or two or three plays
and we're having uh you know atotally different conversation.
So, you know, I always got todepend on you to be the uh to be
(37:38):
the level-headed one because uhyeah, I was very frustrated
watching some of uh the reallythe frustration came when he's
uh you know, we're with theback-to-back um delay of games.
I'm just like, get the damn playout.
Like what's what's happeninghere?
Luckily, the interception isoverturned, but yeah, uh
certainly need to preachpatience when it comes to this,
you know, learning quite a bitand and having a a competent
(38:01):
head coach and offensive stafftry and uh guide his way, you
know, through this.
But yeah, you're gonna saysomething.
Go ahead, Jay.
SPEAKER_00 (38:08):
Yeah, and uh, you know, like I'm not excusing his
mental miscues or anything likethat.
Um, but yeah, a lot of themental stuff is what frustrates
me.
And then I think about itthough, man, like this kind of
goes back to me and you have hadthis conversation as well, too,
um, in terms of the mental partof the game.
And when I'm talking about that,um, I'm talking about um, you
(38:30):
know, the when they were goinginto the half where he throws
the ball to ETN, and it's like,bro, what what are you doing,
man?
Throw it over his head.
Time slides out of boundstowards the end of the game,
too.
Yeah, exactly.
Those types of things.
Now, some people said he startedinbounds.
I have to go back and look atthat play, so maybe he did, I
don't know.
But um, also my argument to thatwas why not slide earlier,
(38:52):
though.
You're such a tall quarterback,slide earlier, you know what I'm
saying, to ensure you're inbounds.
Like, I don't get it.
Like, why wait so close to thebound line?
But um, one thing I have toremind myself is that the mental
part of this game is somethingthat it does take the younger
generation something to acquire.
(39:14):
Like, we have theseconversations all the time, and
look no further than you knowwhat Brian Thomas Jr.
has been going through with thedrops, right?
Um, and also, too, we just weliterally mentioned this him not
being able to get his feet inbounds.
So, like, this is a thing yousee not just with Trevor, but
with a lot of young skilledplayers in general, and I think
(39:36):
it goes back to what I mentionedearlier, Phil, what that we've
talked about here.
I personally don't like how kidsare getting coached out of high
school, into college, into theNFL.
Like, that's where it all startsin terms of getting them like
mentally prepared and not tomake these kind of mental
mistakes that they're making.
Like, I don't think the coachingon the high school level is
(40:00):
where it should be in a lot ofplaces, and I think that stuff
trickles, man.
It trickles down into where theyou know, and I get it, like,
yeah, at this point you'reprofessional, you're getting
paid a lot of money, but itstarts early with these kids,
man.
And when you see little thingslike that, like we just
mentioned, Phil, right, withhim, you know, sliding at the
(40:23):
wrong time and throwing the ballto ETN.
That's stuff you start learninglike way back in high school,
right?
And that just kind of shows youlike not it, it's not just
something that's affecting him,uh, BTJ.
We see these mistakesleague-wide.
Man, we see kids likeprofessional football players
and college football playersthrowing the ball away before
(40:44):
they cross the pipeline.
Like, what are y'all coachingthese kids, man?
What are y'all coaching thesekids at the high school and
college level?
And a lot of that stuff is hardto remove out of your system
because it again it startsearly.
So I think like we're seeingthat with Trevor.
But again, um, Liam is such adetailed coach to the point
(41:06):
where I think like he'll be ableto help, you know, a lot of
these issues that they're havingin general, not just Trevor and
BTJ, but a lot of the otherissues that um we're seeing
here.
And um, yeah, man, I think itjust boils down to again, as I
say, he started slow with Doug,but also to just kind of the
faith in in Liam and also thefaith in and also Gladstone and
(41:30):
his previous experience with theRams.
I know he's not the coach, butyou also have him to lean on and
you have Boselli to lean on.
So had this been Doug, I'd besaying, yeah, we're he's
probably not gonna get ittogether.
You know what I'm saying?
But um, this isn't Doug.
And um, yeah, I can't wait tosee what the the future holds
for him because I think when itdoes click for Trevor, it's he's
(41:52):
gonna like take off, right?
Like that's kind of what he didwith with Doug, speaking of
which, like he's gonna take offto like heights, and then people
are gonna start having theseconversations of like, okay,
like should this dude be a probowler now?
And we'll be looking at him kindof like we were looking at Devin
Lloyd earlier, like, you know,it just it clicked somewhere
down the road, it clicked, andhe ascended from here to here.
(42:15):
But we'll see in time or two.
SPEAKER_02 (42:18):
Yeah, I think also it's just a tough ask, I think,
for a lot of people to just froma baseline perspective to say
continue to be patient with witha fifth-year, fourth, fifth-year
quarterback, right?
And even though uh even though,you know, they we we need to
(42:38):
exercise that patience becausethis is a new system.
And he has had just anincredibly rocky start.
We see so many of thesequarterbacks ruined over and
over again uh because of poor uhfront office decisions and poor
management.
And now we got the right guys inthe building, and it it warrants
(42:59):
having that patience again.
So um, yeah, I think it's justagain a hard ask, or it's a
tougher ask for for somebodywhen they have been in the
league for so long.
But again, you know, there'sjust so much here going on that
he just hasn't experiencedbefore.
Um, and and hopefully we'll umuh end up uh improving him for
the better going forward.
Go ahead.
SPEAKER_00 (43:18):
Yeah, also keep this in mind, I feel while he did
have that run with Doug, he'sbeen poorly coached on the NFL
level too.
Keep that in mind, too.
Um he started with Urb, likeblame Shad Khan for that, you
know, like that.
And that's why we had apassionate discussion about that
in spaces.
Do not give Urban Meyer the keysto start this young man's career
(43:42):
in the NFL and Trent Balkey andShod Khan did it anyway.
But he was poorly coached byUrban Meyer and poorly coached
by Doug, too.
Even when he had that run, itwas a lot of mechanical stuff
that he was getting away withwhen he had the great run that
he had.
So, you know, he he's beenpoorly coached a long, long
(44:02):
time.
So, yeah, all of that said, man,I just wanted to spin this into
one more question that uh Stodgeput in our space or our um our
text thread and get your opinionon this.
Um Stodge asked this, and we canmaybe even title the episode
this, but um, after what we'veseen so far in this first
quarter, do you think the Jagsare back?
SPEAKER_02 (44:24):
Well, that is that's a loaded and dangerous question
to answer four weeks into theseason.
Um I'll say this they are closerto being back than I thought
they would be at this point ofthe season.
Uh, if you don't uh if you guysremember my or didn't see my
record prediction, I think wasnine and eight.
(44:45):
I had them coming out of likethis first stretch pretty rough
all the way up until the Ramsgame, the international game.
I think if they win on Monday,and it is a uh uh a decisive and
maybe not decisive, but youknow, if they're competitive all
the way through and if it's aback and forth game and they
(45:06):
once again find a way to win agame that they previously would
have lost, like the Houstongame.
That's a game we would have lostin the past.
This game, we would have giventhat one away.
Shades of what we saw inCincinnati, right?
That that is what we wereworried about is oh crap, same
old Jags.
And these last two weeks, theyhave turned that around.
If they pull out a win, becauseKansas City all of a sudden they
(45:27):
got some of their guys back andthey're looking right.
So you're never gonna wave offor dismiss a team that has
Patrick Mahomes and Andy Reid.
If they go into Monday NightFootball and they don't
embarrass themselves like theydid last year in Buffalo, which
I don't expect to happen.
I expect them to at least becompetitive, then I think we can
say probably.
(45:49):
It's such a long NFL season,man.
We're so scarred from eight andthree that I can't and being a
win away from the one seed, Ican't quite say it without
feeling I'm gonna jinx us.
So what do you what do youthink?
Because I I'm just toosuperstitious of a sports fan to
say it.
SPEAKER_00 (46:06):
Nah, yeah, I understand.
I have superstitions too, man.
Um I'll say this.
I think we've already answeredthis question.
And what I mean by that, we'vealready given our prediction,
which they've overachieved on.
So we, in a nutshell, havealready said, well, at least
(46:27):
before the season, we said theJazz would be back.
You know, we think they would beback.
So for them to overachieve atthis point, in terms of where we
had them on our predictions, I Ican feel like we probably
answered that question when wedid our predictions, you know,
because we were all but sayingthat the Jaguars were gonna be
(46:48):
back.
And um, that being said, notonly have they overachieved in
terms of where we thought theywould be too.
Um, they won a game that we hadcircled as the one of the most
questionable ones on theschedule, you know, if not the
most questionable, just becauselike how we function on the West
(47:09):
Coast.
Um, so yeah, I think I thinkkeyword that we are back.
Um now look now the we had tomonitor some of these injuries.
We did come out of the um thisgame, and that's that's what
happens when you face the 49ers.
You're gonna come out of thatgame beat up.
(47:30):
It just is what it is, and Imean to kind of echo that, look
at how beat up the 49ers cameout of the game.
You know what I'm saying?
Like they came out of the gameeven.
So it's just it's one of themGeorgia, the way these two teams
are built, it's one of thoseGeorgia Alabama type games where
it's a slug fest, people aregonna come out banged up, you
(47:51):
know, and you know, hopefullyTrayvon Walker, which is a a big
part of this they do is theybuilt great Georgia and from
(53:13):
Texas, by the way, which I knowKirby Smart teaches fundamentals
like that, like to the T.
Like, I don't know what what wasgoing on there, man.
Um, and then yeah, one more lastthing, too.
Yeah, that you mentioned aboutuh us needing to fix the
penalties too.
That's another reason why Ithink we're back too, is because
like we've won as arguably, I'llhave to look at the stats.
(53:37):
Like, we've been winning as likethe most penal now penalized
team.
Arguably, uh, we might not benumber one, but somewhere in the
top, one of the most penalizedteams in in football, man.
So that's a good sign where youcan win with the amount of
penalties we have.
I'll have to look and see howmany we have total, but we gotta
be in the top of the leaguesomewhere.
But yeah, nothing else to add,man.
(53:58):
Good episode.
Um, had fun as always for Mondaynight.
Jaguars podcast.
Here your hosts, James Johnsonand Phil Smith.
SPEAKER_02 (01:08):
Hey everyone, welcome back to the Touchdown
Jaguars podcast.
I am your co-host, Phil Barrera,joined as always by your other
co-host, James Johnson and Jay.
For the second straight week, weare recording here on a victory
Monday here for the podcast.
It is a very nice and unfamiliarfeeling, especially over the
(01:31):
last couple of years, but wewill certainly take it.
And uh, you know, while we umwhile uh Liam Cohen, of course,
wants to you know wants peopleto keep his name out of other
people's mouths, uh we certainlywant to make sure people are
saying touchdown Jaguars aroundhere and listening to the
podcast.
So we very much appreciate thesupport we've gotten so far.
(01:53):
But uh Jay, hey, theJacksonville Jaguars, three and
one, tied for first place in theAFC South.
And uh, you know, just a coupleweeks ago when we did our season
preview episode, we said, hey,if they come out of this stretch
of the first four games, two andtwo, we're pretty happy.
Uh lo and behold, they're overthere two games over 500 and
(02:14):
very much in the mix and winninggames that they probably would
have lost in the past.
So we'll certainly take that.
SPEAKER_00 (02:21):
Yeah, man.
It again, the team um in a lotof ways feels night and day
different than the teams of thepast.
Going over there on the WestCoast and just flat out looking
prepared.
We never look prepared on theWest Coast, right?
So that's a uh change that Itook note of here, and we'll
kind of discuss that later, man.
But yeah, man, it feels great tobe talking about a win,
(02:44):
especially against a team thatum, you know, to a degree we
have respect for until theytried our coach, right?
But um, you know, like we can'tI'll put it this way we came
into the game with a great dealof respect for the 49ers, you
know, like you hadn't heard abad word from you and I, at
least from the 49ers, and wepraised him in the past and Kyle
(03:07):
Shanahan and company, and evenRobert Sala.
We even kind of discussed himwhen we were going through our
head coaching search, and uh, ofcourse, we will be talking about
him again today for obviousreasons.
But yeah, man, very excited todiscuss what transpired.
Wasn't able to see the gameinitially like I wanted to
because I was at work, so it waskind of paying attention to that
(03:31):
here here and there, and then myjob.
So I wasn't able to see it, butthen I went back and watched the
condensed version.
Uh, so albeit I did see a quickversion of it, I still gotta
process some stuff, but hey,we'll roll with the punches.
That's what podcasting is allabout.
And um, as I said, I've seenenough of it, and yeah, can't
wait to uh get these takes off.
SPEAKER_02 (03:53):
Yeah, plenty to talk about in what was a dominant
performance in multiple phasesof the game uh against the San
Francisco 49ers, a team that Ithink over the last few years
has certainly built up a um youknow a bully mentality when you
know, talking about physicalitywhen it comes to that team.
But Jacksonville went in thereand played kind of a brand of
(04:16):
49ers football that we have seenin the past, and they did it
very, very well.
Plenty to discuss here thisevening, Jay, as we uh uh break
down the Jaguars win and eagerlyawait Monday night football.
So yeah, but before we jump intoit, uh once again, if you want
to make sure you keep up witheverything Touchdown Jaguars
(04:37):
related, make sure you check theLink Tree link in the show notes
of this and every singleepisode.
And if you're looking fortickets for Monday night, make
sure you head on over toSeatGeek.
Use our promo code TouchdownJaguars, and all of you
first-time buyers over on uhSeatGeek can save$20 off your
first purchase courtesy of theTouchdown Jaguars podcast.
(04:58):
But yeah, Jay, uh, once again,Jacksonville goes into San
Francisco and wins 26 to 21.
It was a third straight orfourth straight game where the
Jaguars had three or moreturnovers.
And uh, you know, boy, there aresome crazy standouts when it
comes to these performances.
Devin Lloyd obviously beingfront and center uh with his
(05:22):
interceptions as well as justbeing all over the ball.
Um, but we happen to start herewith uh what was making the
rounds after the game, and thatof course was the video of Liam
Cohen and Robert Sala.
And Liam Cohen in very shortwords just saying, Keep my name
out of your mouth.
And for those of you that don'tknow, if you were maybe living
(05:44):
under a rock or just weren'tpaying attention, Robert Sala
was in uh press conferencesduring the week leading up to
the game saying that Liam Cohenand his staff have a way of
legally stealing offensive signsor defensive signs, and uh Kyle
Shanahan kind of doubled down onthat throughout the week.
Certainly didn't do anything touh to hush those claims.
(06:10):
And uh again, the Jaguars cameinto San Francisco and punched
them in the mouth.
So after the game, Liam Cohen.
It definitely seemed like RobertSalah was trying to go up and
shake his hand, and Liam Cohenwas having none of it.
And I want to shout out Wig herebecause I I want to um repeat a
lot of what he was saying overon Locked On Jaguars, where you
(06:30):
know the thing that reallyirritated me about this whole
Robert Sala thing, especiallyafterwards, is like stand-on
business, man.
Like he it feels like he brokesome sort of like there was like
a coach's code, you know what Imean?
And this really did just reek ofsomeone who was very bitter that
he didn't get the JacksonvilleJaguars coaching job.
(06:53):
You know, he we you mentioned itbefore we got started.
He was one of the guys that wasthat was in the running, he's
probably one of the finalistsbefore uh you know the whole
thing happened with Liam Cohen.
And um, and I think he'scertainly pretty salty about
that.
You know, things ended poorly inNew York and he was forced out
of there.
And uh I'm sure he wants to be ahead coach again, probably feels
(07:14):
like he should be a head coachin the NFL.
Uh, but you know what?
You didn't get the job.
And uh yeah, I'm glad that hedidn't get the job here in
Jacksonville because we have acoach now who I think really
embodies the fan base.
I mean, Jacksonville has beenthe the laughing stock of the
league essentially you know foryears.
(07:36):
And people use Jacksonville as avery easy target, and I think
Liam Cohen and James Gladstoneand Tony Biselli and everybody
in there now are they've justhad enough of it.
And performances like this andand actions like this, you know,
and and Wig said this too.
No one's gonna fight on thefield, right?
That's not gonna happen as faras coaches go.
(07:57):
But Liam Cohen's like, hey,well, you know what?
This is my this is my team now.
This is, you know, we love thiscity.
We love we're gonna embrace thefans and we're gonna stand up
for ourselves, and I thinkthat's a great sign.
So, you know, Robert Salah, uh,and then oh yeah, and then Mike
uh Kyle Shanahan after the gamesaying, you know, maybe he
shouldn't be so sensitive.
You know what, maybe your teamshouldn't be so sensitive and
you would have won the footballgame.
(08:18):
Maybe if you guys didn't play sosoft and and Brock Purdy, your
dork of a quarterback, didn'tthrow and turn the ball over, or
you didn't give us, you didn't,you know, give us a bunch of uh
turnovers.
Maybe, you know, maybe maybeyour team needs to be a little
less sensitive.
But I don't know, Jay.
Uh, how do you feel about all ofthis?
And then, you know, of course wewere irritated about it going
into the game, and then we seethe footage of uh of Liam Cohen
(08:40):
showing that fire and just uhyou know sticking up for
himself, which I think is great.
So what was your uh what wereyour initial thoughts when that
video came out?
SPEAKER_00 (08:50):
Um I think like now that I've had the time to
process it, I think what thiswas a matter of is Liam Cohen
understands that he is amouthpiece for the Jacksonville
Jaguars organization and for thecity.
(09:10):
And he also understands, and wekind of talked about this when
we were looking for a coach,like what kind of front office
culture would we have?
What would be our identity, notjust on the field, but what
would be our identity as anorganization?
And the one thing that you kepthearing in the reports that the
Jaguars wanted to be was acoach-centric team.
(09:31):
You remember we kept hearingthat word a lot, coach-centric
team.
And I think when Liam got thejob, he understood that, right?
I mean, for crying out loud, wehired him before we hired a GM.
If that doesn't screamcoach-centric, I don't know what
does, right?
But he understands that this isa coach-centric team and that
he's a mouthpiece for not onlythe team, but also for Duval and
(09:53):
the 904 and so on and so forth.
And kind of going to what youwere saying, we've been a
laughing stock for a long time.
And if you're gonna be themouthpiece of a coach-centric
team, you need to establish thatearly, you know, in your career.
Early in the here we are, whatfour games into his career, he's
establishing in that um againsta 49ers team, which this is
(10:18):
another thing.
Liam understanding thesituation, he's a smart dude.
What team to better have thissituation, you know, in terms of
meeting somebody on the fieldand having words with them, than
an organization that bulliespeople, like you said, Phil,
like the San Francisco 49ers.
(10:38):
So that's him understanding likethis is the perfect team for me
to get my you know what off,basically.
The 49ers, a team who hastraditionally beat up on us.
And you know, I did the researchand I mentioned it on Twitter,
Phil, uh under Balkey, westruggled mightily against the
49ers.
We played them twice in histenure.
That was his former team, by theway.
(11:00):
They beat us by a score of 64 to13.
And in those matches, bro, weand you know, we seen the film
of them, both of them.
We were just outclassed, right?
And every time we ended upplaying them, it felt like we
left those games saying, like,that's what we want to be.
We want to be a bully to otherteams.
(11:21):
And here we are, we bulliedthem, like ran the ball almost
with ease on them.
And um, you know, we justmatched their physicality.
Well, we outmatched theirphysicality if we're being
honest about it.
So it's just Liam understandingthat we're a coach-centric
organization now.
He needs to establish that andand speak up for the 904 and the
(11:44):
team and be that mouthpiece forthe team.
And he saw the perfectopportunity to do it against a
team with tradition,physicality, and a team.
Also, too, part of this is hehas history with the 49ers,
right?
The McVay tree, which Shanahanis kind of a part of, too, by
the way.
But the McVay tree has historywith facing that 49ers tree,
(12:06):
like the current 49ers tree ofShanahan, Robert Sala.
Um, I guess you could put GusBradley in there now because
he's the assistant head coach,and you know, Robert Salah's
from his tree, technically.
So they have history from yearsand years of battling each
other.
So it's probably some bad bloodfrom then, too, as well, like
the Rams and the 49ers as well.
(12:28):
So that it can go back as far asthat as well.
And you mentioned the other partof it too.
For Robert to say something likethat, you know, which you know
it didn't bother me like a lot,but I can see why a coach would
take offense to it, right?
Um for him to say something likethat, you gotta think like it
(12:49):
was something that sparked himto say that.
Because typically in pressconferences, you don't hear
coaches mention that, right?
You know, like that's notsomething you typically, it's
like, hey, you know, we got agood team that we're playing in
front of us, um, they playedhard, so on and so forth.
A lot of coach speak.
Never do you hear this, youknow, whole thing about they
steal signals, this, that, andthe other.
(13:11):
But a part of it, you have tofeel like for him to mention
something like that, has to bethat they were both candidates
for this Jags job in the end.
You know, a lot of people willsay Salah was kind of in the his
name was in the the hat, so tospeak, because uh of Trent
Balkey, obviously.
And Trent Balkey just has tofind whoever would agree to join
(13:33):
the team with him being a GM.
So it's not like he had a lot ofoptions out there, or some
people can even say that Salahhe has a good relationship with
the cons too, which there's thattoo.
Um, but at the end of the day,Liam Cohen wowed, you know,
wowed them even more so thanSalah did.
He got the job.
But I think that's part of ittoo, Phil.
I think for him to mentionsomething and take a little
(13:56):
slight like that, which again tome it didn't bother me that
much, but I can see if I was ahead coach, it probably would
have triggered me as a headcoach.
Um, for him to mention somethinglike that, it has to be more to
it um than we're looking at.
And when you look at theirhistory, it it most likely is
that they were both they theyboth had their names in the hat
for the job.
SPEAKER_02 (14:17):
Yeah, it just reeks of that and uh you know
bitterness, and um, like like Isaid, you know, Robert Salah,
I'm sure still uh the whole theway that things ended with the
Jets and Aaron Rodgersessentially, you know, strong
arming him out of the out ofthat job, and um, I'm sure also
played into it.
But uh, you know what?
At the end of the day, theJacksonville Jaguars won the
(14:40):
game, and Robert Sala ended upon Jaguar Twitter's hate list.
So uh enjoy that as well as KyleShanahan.
Um and yeah, Jay, as far as likethe struggles against the
Niners, they brought it up onthe broadcast.
Like we had they had been we wehad always struggled against the
San Francisco 49ers, which iswhy we circled some of these
West Coast trips as probablelosses.
(15:01):
But um, yeah, they came in, andyou know the argument can be
made.
The score should have been uh,you know, a lot um a lot a lot
or the the deficit should havebeen a lot wider when it came
down to the end of the game.
But uh yeah, there are plenty ofstandouts here.
Jay Travis Etienne had himselfanother solid game, 19 carries,
124 yards, and a touchdown.
(15:22):
Uh we saw Parker Washington getthe punt return uh that was much
needed at the time as you kindof felt like momentum was
swinging back in the way of theSan Francisco 49ers.
And then the defense, man,forcing the turnovers, and then
Devin Lloyd continuing to be allover the field, Jay.
Uh, we talked about thedefensive line, also had
(15:44):
themselves a really solid day.
Devon Hamilton, um, those guysinside.
Uh Josh Hines Allen was bullyingTrent Armstrong Trent uh Trent
Williams throughout the entireday.
Um, and then of course, youknow, one thing we are awaiting
news on.
I believe he went to go see aspecialist today is the the
status of Trayvon Walker becausehe has been a big, as big of a
(16:09):
um force multiplier on thedefense as anybody else here
this season.
So we current you know certainlyum hope to hear good news on
that front.
But Jay, what did you want topoint out as far as individual
performances, uh performances byan entire unit, whatever you
would like to start?
Um, because yeah, there was alot to like about the
(16:30):
performance on Sunday.
SPEAKER_00 (16:32):
So the first one is just um the elite level that
Devin Lloyd is playing at, man.
And um, you know, he's been theconversation of a lot of Jags
talk on Twitter.
You know, some people saying weshould have picked up the
fifth-year option, and somepeople are like, hey, you know,
stay on that side with DevinLloyd.
But look, man, I'm here to tellyou.
(16:54):
When I looked at that man onfilm last year, and me and you
mentioned this, Phil.
It was one time in the Titansgame, he missed like two to
three tackles in one drive,right?
There was times where he lookedlike he didn't want any part in
chasing down the plays, right?
And look, that very well couldhave been that Doug Peterson was
wearing on him.
So I stand by it, man.
He didn't look good last year.
(17:15):
He doesn't he didn't looknowhere near the player that he
looks to be today.
And I'm glad to eat my words onhim now that he's playing to his
potential.
But, you know, like I was I waslooking like the potential and
all of that went impressing melast year.
I wanted to see it take place onthe field before, you know, I
(17:36):
jumped the gun on this youngman.
And here he is, he's showing hispotential that he showed at Utah
playing like the player he is.
And again, I think a lot of itis um Anthony Campanini and his
impact um on Devin Lloyd uhbecause it just looks like he,
you know, he wants to be there,and uh he's making the tackles
in the open field that he wasn'tmaking before.
(17:57):
He's um playing better incoverage, right?
Like it was one time, and youknow, we mentioned this film in
the preseason when he played inthat third preseason game, which
we were kind of shocked.
Like, why is Devin Lloyd outhere against the Dolphins?
He looked lost in coverage, andnow like you look at the film,
and I think it was Gus um thatput this out.
Shoutouts to him.
(18:17):
Um, but you look at the film,and Devin Lloyd is conducting
like he's foyer, right?
Like he's pointing out routes tofoyer, like, hey, take that
route, passing off routes topeople.
He's making, as I mentionedearlier, he's making the the
tackles in the open field thathe wasn't making before at
times, and um, you know, he justlooks like a completely
(18:38):
different player, man.
He's unstoppable and blitzing,right?
As well.
Uh, he's getting penetration inthe backfield, so he's just
really doing it all.
And yeah, he is playing, youknow.
I'll be the first to admit this,man.
He's playing at an all-pro levelright now.
And um, you know, he's a guythat like at this point, man, as
as upset as I was as I was withhim last year, like you gotta
(19:02):
keep him if he's playing likethis, bro.
Like, good organizations don'tlet that go, right?
So um, I don't know, man.
I I feel like maybe maybe me andyou talked about this film.
Uh maybe him and Fred Warnerswapped hands or something
because Fred Warner couldn'tcatch a cole yesterday.
Although he was he he was helooked good, Trevor was trying
(19:24):
to give him the ball, man.
Yeah, she was trying.
But you know, and speaking ofwhich, um, shoutouts to Trevor
for not breaking theinterception record.
It was an interception record upfor grabs.
So um shoutouts to him and alittle help from Warner uh for
not breaking that.
But that's where I wanted tostart is with Devin Lloyd, man.
And um, yeah, man, like I'm at apoint now where it's like I
(19:47):
would be hurt if we let that mango.
The way he's playing in themiddle of the field, like at an
all-pro level, you gotta figureit out and keep him.
And you know, James Gladstonecomes from a Rams organization
that knows you don't let playerslike that just go.
Like, that's something TrentBalkey would do, but um not um
James Gladstone.
SPEAKER_02 (20:07):
Yeah, man, Devin Lloyd.
Uh I mean we were talking aboutit like before the season when
we were looking at like hisMadden rating, like we were
joking about it.
Like, who does Devin Lloyd bribeat EA to get his Madden rating
this high?
And you know, we have we've seenlike a version kind of of this
Devin Lloyd, like in his rookieyear, and then that's the one
(20:29):
that like disappeared.
So, you know, fingers crossedthat, and I don't think that's
going to happen again, uh, asfar as him uh you know reverting
back.
But this is a uh a wholedifferent level.
This is all pro footballdefensive player of the year
conversation type of um type ofplay.
(20:49):
If Devin Lloyd is playing likethis in Dallas or in New York or
in Kansas City, something one ofthese bigger markets, people are
talking about him being one ofthe best linebackers in the
league.
And he's playing that way rightnow.
In in heading into week five,Devin Lloyd is a top five to ten
linebacker in the NFL.
(21:09):
And he is gonna get paid, andrightly so.
And, you know, I you know, Ithink that him not getting that
fifth-year option certainlyplayed a part into how he is
performed, but he's everywhere,man.
You turn on the film and you youwatch every single play, he's
somewhere nearby all the time,whether he's making the tackle
or at least just impacting theplay in some sort of way.
(21:32):
I have not seen anything likethis in a in a very, very long
time.
And then when you pair that withhow well Josh Hines Allen and
Trayvon Walker are playing,along with uh Eric Armstead
making plays, being back in hisnatural position, making his
return to San Francisco.
Eric Armstead, another guy,people that were ready to throw
out of town, you know, and we'rewe're learning just so much
(21:54):
about like how much these guysjust were not put in the right
positions to succeed.
And now they are.
And I think the thing that we'rewe're all worried about now,
Jay, is that we aren't gonnahave Anthony Campanili very
long.
He is going to get head coachingopportunities very, very soon if
things continue to trend thesame way.
(22:15):
And imagine if this defense hasa similar performance on prime
time against the Kansas CityChiefs on Monday.
They have an opportunity here.
I I think there even thoughthere's not necessarily such a
thing as a moral victory, theyhave an opportunity to come out
of here, even if they I think ifthey don't win to make a big
(22:38):
statement on uh, you know, beingthe only game on uh and being in
prime time and kind of ridingthose wrongs from last year's
Monday night performance againstBuffalo.
Uh this is a team that I thinkas far as defensively and
schematically, they can they cantry and figure out.
It's just of course that speed,you know, when you talk about
like Pacheck, I'm getting aheadof myself and looking towards
(22:59):
next week, but um, you know,there's an opportunity here for
for them to make a big statementon Monday night football um for
sure if they continue to playthis way.
And hopefully that includes, ofcourse, Trayvon Walker on Monday
night.
But yeah, lots to lots to loveabout how Devin Lloyd is
playing, Jay.
SPEAKER_00 (23:17):
Absolutely.
And you talked on you know who'shelped him get there, uh Camp
O'Neilly, um, who you know,yeah, there are concerns he
might be gone uh sooner ratherthan later.
But the good news is, Phil, theleague hates defensive
coordinators as head coaches.
So that's the good news, right?
Um, because we had topractically um yell at the top
(23:42):
our lawns for AG to get a job,right?
For Aaron Glenn to get a job.
So um there's that.
So, you know, hopefully, well,you know, I don't want to say
that because you want the man toget the best opportunity that he
can.
I was about to say hopefully theleague continues that trend of
not wanting DC's as headcoaches, but you know, you never
want to say that because thispertains to him feeding his
(24:02):
family and getting a betteropportunity.
But I wouldn't mind keepingkeeping Coach Camp as long as we
can.
I'll put it that way.
Right.
Um, so yeah, the next thing uh Iwanted to talk about um is just
the fact that um BTJ's handslook better.
Um, you know, he he didn't haveany issues catching the ball.
(24:22):
Now I know he did have the onecatch where he couldn't get both
feet in bounds, which that'sthis generation just frustrates
me so much with that.
Like, I I don't know, man.
Like it was something that likereceivers practiced to the T
back in the day.
But um anyway, that being said,though, um, it looks like he is
(24:43):
starting to slowly get hisconfidence back in terms of
catching the ball.
Uh, we kind of talked about it alittle bit um earlier where it
was mentioned that um, you know,it looked like the Jaguars were
maybe trying to design um asituation for him to not catch
many in the middle of the field.
Um, and then Mia kind ofresponded in a tweet in response
(25:05):
to that.
Uh, it's probably because justyou know, the reason they that
he caught a lot of out routes,which is fine.
Like, if that's what it takes toget him going, good.
You know, shout outs to RobertSalah for helping us get um BTJ
going.
But a part of it is probablybecause you know Salah and that
Gus Bradley and Pete CarrollTree, they believe in a lot of
like cup cover three and deepzone coverage, this, that, and
(25:27):
the other.
So they were playing so far offof BTJ where it was a lot of
opportunities probably foroutbreak and routes.
So if that's what it takes toget him going, shout outs uh to
them for helping us get themthere, as I said earlier.
But I I just like seeing BTJ um,you know, using his hands to
catch the passes, looking themin, all of that good stuff.
(25:49):
That's an encouraging sign, andum, hopefully he'll continue
trending in the right direction.
Uh, Parker Washington, man,that's that's the last takeaway.
Is not just him though, but thespecial teams, which it was hit
or miss, right?
We we missed a field goal, sothere was that.
Um, but now people understandwhy we say, like, and we weren't
(26:09):
joking about this, that thisteam has the potential to have
the best special teams, youknow.
If our punter and kicker can gettheir stuff back together, they
have the potential to be thebest special teams in the
league.
And Parker Washington showedthat, um, showed it in a big way
with the punt return.
Um, Liam kind of talked aboutthis too as well.
And this is why this team is umin some ways special, is because
(26:34):
while one side of the ball mightbe struggling, somebody else
picks it up somewhere down theroad.
So, that being said, ParkerWashington kind of made up for
um some of the offensive issuesthat we were having.
Um, contributed that touchdown,Bachel Tootin, as well.
You could put him in that mix.
He had the big return that putus in good position as well.
(26:56):
Um, so shoutouts to them interms of the return game.
Now we just need to get CamLittle back right.
We need to get um uh Logan Cookback right.
Who Logan Cook, I'll have to goback and look at the film with
him.
He looked okay today or Sunday,should I say.
So I'll go back and look and seehow he looked in totality.
But yeah, shoutouts to thespecial teams for uh giving us
(27:18):
that shot in the arm that weneeded because when you look at
how the game turned out, theyprobably were the X factor.
Special teams was probably the Xfactor in this game.
And if you go and look at someof the takeaways from like these
49ers writers, right?
Some of the things they'resaying is like special teams let
us down.
So that feels like it was the Xfactor in this game that kind of
(27:39):
uh compensated for some of theissues that the offense was
having.
SPEAKER_02 (27:43):
Yeah, that was going to be one of my questions that
uh for you is what is your levelof concern for for the special
teams?
Logan Cook is is very low onthis scale just because uh, you
know, and I didn't see the gamelast week, so I don't know if he
struggled last week as well.
But here, you know, it LeviStadium is a weird stadium, you
(28:03):
know, you got the wind comingoff the uh off the lower part of
the stadium.
We were talking about how it'sjust oddly placed and oddly
shaped and oddly built.
We were talking about thatbefore the episode.
So I'm I'm not going to fullypanic when it comes to that.
Um, but you know, they uhobviously Cam Little has a
chance to make a big field goalthere in the fourth quarter, and
he misses that.
(28:24):
Uh, he missed one whether it waslast week or a couple of weeks
ago.
And uh, you know, um obviouslywe're we're weeks and weeks away
from the 70-yard field goal,right?
Um that was the feel-good storyof the preseason.
But um, you know, we're startingto see a couple of things that
are a little concerning.
Um, and then uh again, obviouslythe great the great thing has
been Parker Washington and andum yeah, a little bit of a you
(28:48):
know uh a mix up there with theQuentin Allen with early on with
the kickoff, and that that'sjust these rookies learning
these new rules, and honestly,everybody learning these new
rules.
We've seen major mistakes uhwhen it comes to these new
kickoff rules.
So, what is your level ofconcern when it comes to special
teams?
You know what can they do as faras getting that right?
(29:09):
Because you're talking about oneguy who is you know still very
new to the league, and thenLogan Cook, like I said, I'm
very low in the totem pole interms of my concern.
But uh yeah, what do you see inthere?
And you know, what do you whatdo you think is going on?
SPEAKER_00 (29:21):
Not high.
I don't have a high levelconcern for him.
For one, like I've always likedhow Cam Little, and he mentioned
this before, how he's wired andhow he goes about his business
of kicking field goals.
And he says, like, when he heenters the field, he just kind
of just blocks everything out,you know, and he's just in this
(29:42):
his own space, which I likekickers that can do that.
I mean, I and I get it, like alot of kickers try and do that,
but you could tell like he'sreal good at blocking out the
noise and just getting himselfin that place where it's just it
feels like it's just him on thefield, and I think he can get
back to that.
And also, too, man, he you know,the Reason he's on his team for
a reason in regards to why theJaguars spent the draft pick on
(30:04):
him.
And a big reason for that isbecause he's kicked in big time
atmospheres.
When you come from the SEC,right, Arkansas, which is where
he came from, you know, he'she's been to all of these
stadiums that we talk about allthe time, the swamp.
Um, he's been to um SanfordPhil, um, Between the Hedges, so
(30:27):
on and so forth.
He's been to all of these,probably played Texas too, your
team, Phil Loud Stadium as well,Alabama, all of these legendary
stadiums that we talk about,Auburn Stadium.
He's been there and he's feltthose atmospheres.
And I think that's like how hewas able to be drafted as high
as he was, is because he'skicked in some of those
(30:47):
situations.
So um honestly, he's reallykicked in stadiums bigger than
NFL stadiums, if we're beinghonest.
So that doesn't concern me.
And and Logan Cook's been in theleague long enough where he
could correct things.
Um, I know the question came upas to if special teams coach
Heath Evans um is somebody thatwe need to start looking at and
(31:11):
um you know considering like ishe getting the job done?
And I'll say this, man, that manis one of the better special
teams coaches in the league.
Up until two weeks ago, weweren't having this
conversation, and you know, hewas so good at his job that Liam
Cohen kept him from the previousregime.
So that's kind of a sign, youknow, like, hey, Liam looked at
(31:33):
him as a as something as a pieceof the previous organization
that he could keep and buildwith.
So, no, to answer your question,I'm not concerned about the
special teams.
SPEAKER_02 (31:44):
Yeah, they built up enough goodwill to earn the
benefit of the doubt, especiallylike I said, Logan Cook.
Um, we'll see what happens witha uh a young kicker who has at
least so far has shown that uhyou know that he again is able
to uh kick through thesesituations and um you know have
ice in his veins.
So uh yeah, not totally, totallyconcerned with that quite yet.
(32:06):
And hopefully they won't give usa reason uh to uh to do so.
So um and then the last questionhere uh as we uh you start to
look towards Monday is uh youknow the performance of Trevor
Lawrence.
He certainly didn't light it up,but early on he was doing pretty
well.
I think he started around likeeight of eight, then uh of
course had the uh the touchdownpass to Hunter Long.
Um, but there were up there weredefinitely situations there uh
(32:30):
where you know he he could haveeasily had maybe two or three
interceptions, if I recallcorrectly.
Um J, I'm a very emotionalwatcher of football.
You know, you know that I am,especially the Bengals game
really, really made me angry.
And 21 to 31, 174, uh and atouchdown.
Um there were still severalmiscues when it came to running
(32:55):
the offense.
Obviously, the penalties havecontinued to be a thing.
Uh that's the one thing we havewe are just not seeing get
better week after week, andthat's something that needs to
fix itself very, very soon.
With Trevor, you know, we havebeen very, very avid defenders
of him, and Trevor Lawrence haskind of become this quarterback
where you can really get an ideaif somebody is watching film or
(33:18):
not.
And I watched the entire uh youknow, I watched the entire game
on Sunday, and there are a lotof things that are beginning to
frustrate me about TrevorLawrence.
Now, this is no not certainlynot me saying that we need to
move on from him, but there arejust certain actions in the and
the way that he's still he'sstill making some mistakes that
(33:41):
should not be happening at thispoint in his career.
We're gonna throw the money outof it.
We're gonna get the money out.
We know how it works forquarterbacks on this podcast.
You pay or you or or you or youdon't, and then you're you know,
you're one of these core one ofthese teams that are constantly
looking for a quarterback.
When do you need to seesomething from Trevor this year
before you're like, all right,man, let's go, let's let's pick
(34:05):
it up.
You have to you have to be areason that we're winning some
of these games as well.
And they're playing verycomplimentary football right
now, and you can argue that thepart that still hasn't quite
flashed, the way that ETN, theway that Parker Washington, the
way that Devin Lloyd has, is 16.
And I just want to know how howyou're feeling about it.
Um, because I didn't want tocome in here and be totally
(34:27):
negative, of course, coming offof a win, but there are just
some things that are continuingto concern me about Trev.
SPEAKER_00 (34:33):
Yeah, well, I think one thing um that is the issue,
and and Liam has said this too,and I think I I kind of
overlooked it myself because asI told you earlier, I thought it
was gonna be the defense thatstarted slow, you know.
So, like I didn't really Ireally didn't pay any mind to
(34:53):
the offense because I thoughtthe offense was gonna be the
side of the ball that startedfaster than the defense because
they had the run game.
But Liam has said this too, man.
Like, he got a lot on his plate,right?
Um, this is what Trevor's.
So it was Liam Doug Urban.
This is his third scheme in fouryears, if my math is right,
(35:16):
third and four years.
Um, and like I said, Liam hassaid it like we're gonna ask a
lot out of him as thequarterback for this offense,
and also too, something thatthat makes me optimistic about
him.
He started slow with DougPeterson, and then he had that
stretch where he went crazy.
(35:37):
I think it started with theRavens game, right?
If I'm not mistaken, it was thatRavens game, and he just went
crazy after that.
So I have to go back and look atwhat point in the season that
was that year, but he startedslow under Doug too, and he put
it together, and then that'swhen they went on that crazy
run, went to the playoffs.
Um, it's just that's part of hisnature, I think.
(35:58):
It is just he just starts slow.
And um, for him to be in anotherscheme, like he was with the
Doug Peterson situation, samesituation basically.
Um, I can envision a situationwhere he starts to put it
together around, you know, whoknows, like maybe that Rams game
uh that's coming up in Londonsomewhere like that, or you
(36:19):
know, somewhere in thatballpark.
So, no, I'm not concerned withhim because again, like I've
seen this before.
I've seen him start like thisunder Doug Peterson.
I can't remember like the UrbanMeyer season is such a blur
because it's something we ratherall forget.
Um I just I know you know theseason in general wasn't good,
but I just forgot like howsporadic he was that year is
(36:40):
what I'm saying.
Um, but yeah, no, I'm notconcerned about him because just
I date back to how he startedwith Doug and turned it on then.
So uh that's what I would sayabout that.
SPEAKER_02 (36:52):
Yeah, that's a really good point.
You know, it took some time withthat, you know, that first year
with uh with Doug.
And listen, if they put thisthing together and it's all
three phases and then thepenalties go away, if you even
cut the penalties in half, Jay,like they are they're blowing
teams out.
If if you if you stop shootingyourself in the foot and you
(37:14):
know, Trev turned some of thosemisses into uh, you know, the
the Travis Hunter miss in theCarolina game, you know, some of
these decisions that were he'sjust missing Brian Thomas Jr.
or Parker Washington, you know,those one or two or three plays
and we're having uh you know atotally different conversation.
So, you know, I always got todepend on you to be the uh to be
(37:38):
the level-headed one because uhyeah, I was very frustrated
watching some of uh the reallythe frustration came when he's
uh you know, we're with theback-to-back um delay of games.
I'm just like, get the damn playout.
Like what's what's happeninghere?
Luckily, the interception isoverturned, but yeah, uh
certainly need to preachpatience when it comes to this,
you know, learning quite a bitand and having a a competent
(38:01):
head coach and offensive stafftry and uh guide his way, you
know, through this.
But yeah, you're gonna saysomething.
Go ahead, Jay.
SPEAKER_00 (38:08):
Yeah, and uh, you know, like I'm not excusing his
mental miscues or anything likethat.
Um, but yeah, a lot of themental stuff is what frustrates
me.
And then I think about itthough, man, like this kind of
goes back to me and you have hadthis conversation as well, too,
um, in terms of the mental partof the game.
And when I'm talking about that,um, I'm talking about um, you
(38:30):
know, the when they were goinginto the half where he throws
the ball to ETN, and it's like,bro, what what are you doing,
man?
Throw it over his head.
Time slides out of boundstowards the end of the game,
too.
Yeah, exactly.
Those types of things.
Now, some people said he startedinbounds.
I have to go back and look atthat play, so maybe he did, I
don't know.
But um, also my argument to thatwas why not slide earlier,
(38:52):
though.
You're such a tall quarterback,slide earlier, you know what I'm
saying, to ensure you're inbounds.
Like, I don't get it.
Like, why wait so close to thebound line?
But um, one thing I have toremind myself is that the mental
part of this game is somethingthat it does take the younger
generation something to acquire.
(39:14):
Like, we have theseconversations all the time, and
look no further than you knowwhat Brian Thomas Jr.
has been going through with thedrops, right?
Um, and also, too, we just weliterally mentioned this him not
being able to get his feet inbounds.
So, like, this is a thing yousee not just with Trevor, but
with a lot of young skilledplayers in general, and I think
(39:36):
it goes back to what I mentionedearlier, Phil, what that we've
talked about here.
I personally don't like how kidsare getting coached out of high
school, into college, into theNFL.
Like, that's where it all startsin terms of getting them like
mentally prepared and not tomake these kind of mental
mistakes that they're making.
Like, I don't think the coachingon the high school level is
(40:00):
where it should be in a lot ofplaces, and I think that stuff
trickles, man.
It trickles down into where theyou know, and I get it, like,
yeah, at this point you'reprofessional, you're getting
paid a lot of money, but itstarts early with these kids,
man.
And when you see little thingslike that, like we just
mentioned, Phil, right, withhim, you know, sliding at the
(40:23):
wrong time and throwing the ballto ETN.
That's stuff you start learninglike way back in high school,
right?
And that just kind of shows youlike not it, it's not just
something that's affecting him,uh, BTJ.
We see these mistakesleague-wide.
Man, we see kids likeprofessional football players
and college football playersthrowing the ball away before
(40:44):
they cross the pipeline.
Like, what are y'all coachingthese kids, man?
What are y'all coaching thesekids at the high school and
college level?
And a lot of that stuff is hardto remove out of your system
because it again it startsearly.
So I think like we're seeingthat with Trevor.
But again, um, Liam is such adetailed coach to the point
(41:06):
where I think like he'll be ableto help, you know, a lot of
these issues that they're havingin general, not just Trevor and
BTJ, but a lot of the otherissues that um we're seeing
here.
And um, yeah, man, I think itjust boils down to again, as I
say, he started slow with Doug,but also to just kind of the
faith in in Liam and also thefaith in and also Gladstone and
(41:30):
his previous experience with theRams.
I know he's not the coach, butyou also have him to lean on and
you have Boselli to lean on.
So had this been Doug, I'd besaying, yeah, we're he's
probably not gonna get ittogether.
You know what I'm saying?
But um, this isn't Doug.
And um, yeah, I can't wait tosee what the the future holds
for him because I think when itdoes click for Trevor, it's he's
(41:52):
gonna like take off, right?
Like that's kind of what he didwith with Doug, speaking of
which, like he's gonna take offto like heights, and then people
are gonna start having theseconversations of like, okay,
like should this dude be a probowler now?
And we'll be looking at him kindof like we were looking at Devin
Lloyd earlier, like, you know,it just it clicked somewhere
down the road, it clicked, andhe ascended from here to here.
(42:15):
But we'll see in time or two.
SPEAKER_02 (42:18):
Yeah, I think also it's just a tough ask, I think,
for a lot of people to just froma baseline perspective to say
continue to be patient with witha fifth-year, fourth, fifth-year
quarterback, right?
And even though uh even though,you know, they we we need to
(42:38):
exercise that patience becausethis is a new system.
And he has had just anincredibly rocky start.
We see so many of thesequarterbacks ruined over and
over again uh because of poor uhfront office decisions and poor
management.
And now we got the right guys inthe building, and it it warrants
(42:59):
having that patience again.
So um, yeah, I think it's justagain a hard ask, or it's a
tougher ask for for somebodywhen they have been in the
league for so long.
But again, you know, there'sjust so much here going on that
he just hasn't experiencedbefore.
Um, and and hopefully we'll umuh end up uh improving him for
the better going forward.
Go ahead.
SPEAKER_00 (43:18):
Yeah, also keep this in mind, I feel while he did
have that run with Doug, he'sbeen poorly coached on the NFL
level too.
Keep that in mind, too.
Um he started with Urb, likeblame Shad Khan for that, you
know, like that.
And that's why we had apassionate discussion about that
in spaces.
Do not give Urban Meyer the keysto start this young man's career
(43:42):
in the NFL and Trent Balkey andShod Khan did it anyway.
But he was poorly coached byUrban Meyer and poorly coached
by Doug, too.
Even when he had that run, itwas a lot of mechanical stuff
that he was getting away withwhen he had the great run that
he had.
So, you know, he he's beenpoorly coached a long, long
(44:02):
time.
So, yeah, all of that said, man,I just wanted to spin this into
one more question that uh Stodgeput in our space or our um our
text thread and get your opinionon this.
Um Stodge asked this, and we canmaybe even title the episode
this, but um, after what we'veseen so far in this first
quarter, do you think the Jagsare back?
SPEAKER_02 (44:24):
Well, that is that's a loaded and dangerous question
to answer four weeks into theseason.
Um I'll say this they are closerto being back than I thought
they would be at this point ofthe season.
Uh, if you don't uh if you guysremember my or didn't see my
record prediction, I think wasnine and eight.
(44:45):
I had them coming out of likethis first stretch pretty rough
all the way up until the Ramsgame, the international game.
I think if they win on Monday,and it is a uh uh a decisive and
maybe not decisive, but youknow, if they're competitive all
the way through and if it's aback and forth game and they
(45:06):
once again find a way to win agame that they previously would
have lost, like the Houstongame.
That's a game we would have lostin the past.
This game, we would have giventhat one away.
Shades of what we saw inCincinnati, right?
That that is what we wereworried about is oh crap, same
old Jags.
And these last two weeks, theyhave turned that around.
If they pull out a win, becauseKansas City all of a sudden they
(45:27):
got some of their guys back andthey're looking right.
So you're never gonna wave offor dismiss a team that has
Patrick Mahomes and Andy Reid.
If they go into Monday NightFootball and they don't
embarrass themselves like theydid last year in Buffalo, which
I don't expect to happen.
I expect them to at least becompetitive, then I think we can
say probably.
(45:49):
It's such a long NFL season,man.
We're so scarred from eight andthree that I can't and being a
win away from the one seed, Ican't quite say it without
feeling I'm gonna jinx us.
So what do you what do youthink?
Because I I'm just toosuperstitious of a sports fan to
say it.
SPEAKER_00 (46:06):
Nah, yeah, I understand.
I have superstitions too, man.
Um I'll say this.
I think we've already answeredthis question.
And what I mean by that, we'vealready given our prediction,
which they've overachieved on.
So we, in a nutshell, havealready said, well, at least
(46:27):
before the season, we said theJazz would be back.
You know, we think they would beback.
So for them to overachieve atthis point, in terms of where we
had them on our predictions, I Ican feel like we probably
answered that question when wedid our predictions, you know,
because we were all but sayingthat the Jaguars were gonna be
(46:48):
back.
And um, that being said, notonly have they overachieved in
terms of where we thought theywould be too.
Um, they won a game that we hadcircled as the one of the most
questionable ones on theschedule, you know, if not the
most questionable, just becauselike how we function on the West
(47:09):
Coast.
Um, so yeah, I think I thinkkeyword that we are back.
Um now look now the we had tomonitor some of these injuries.
We did come out of the um thisgame, and that's that's what
happens when you face the 49ers.
You're gonna come out of thatgame beat up.
(47:30):
It just is what it is, and Imean to kind of echo that, look
at how beat up the 49ers cameout of the game.
You know what I'm saying?
Like they came out of the gameeven.
So it's just it's one of themGeorgia, the way these two teams
are built, it's one of thoseGeorgia Alabama type games where
it's a slug fest, people aregonna come out banged up, you
(47:51):
know, and you know, hopefullyTrayvon Walker, which is a a big
part of this they do is theybuilt great Georgia and from
(53:13):
Texas, by the way, which I knowKirby Smart teaches fundamentals
like that, like to the T.
Like, I don't know what what wasgoing on there, man.
Um, and then yeah, one more lastthing, too.
Yeah, that you mentioned aboutuh us needing to fix the
penalties too.
That's another reason why Ithink we're back too, is because
like we've won as arguably, I'llhave to look at the stats.
(53:37):
Like, we've been winning as likethe most penal now penalized
team.
Arguably, uh, we might not benumber one, but somewhere in the
top, one of the most penalizedteams in in football, man.
So that's a good sign where youcan win with the amount of
penalties we have.
I'll have to look and see howmany we have total, but we gotta
be in the top of the leaguesomewhere.
But yeah, nothing else to add,man.
(53:58):
Good episode.
Um, had fun as always for Mondaynight.
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