July 29, 2025 • 50 mins
Ever wonder why your grandparents could afford a house, two cars, and yearly vacations on a single income while you're drowning in debt with two salaries? The answer lies in a fascinating economic breakdown that demolishes the myth of America's "good old days."
When we crunch the numbers comparing a 1946 household budget to today's financial reality, the results are staggering. While the average household income has increased just 19% since the post-war era (adjusted for inflation), essential expenses have exploded. Auto-related costs have jumped from $1,666 to $12,000 annually. Healthcare has skyrocketed from $2,383 to over $12,297. Most devastating of all: housing has transformed from approximately one year's salary to over five times annual income.
The math is brutally simple: a modern family attempting the traditional single-income model begins each year approximately $23,000 in debt before buying a single piece of clothing or school supply. This mathematical impossibility exposes the hollow core of nostalgia-driven politics that promise a return to an economic model that cannot function in today's reality.
Beyond the economics, we explore the social mythology surrounding the "traditional family." Historical records reveal that many women worked outside the home even in the 1940s and 1950s. The perfectly content housewife in pearls was largely a television creation that bore little resemblance to reality, where undiagnosed PTSD, alcoholism, and domestic abuse were widespread yet unaddressed issues.
Looking at the cold, hard numbers forces a vital question: was America ever actually "great" the way we collectively remember it? And what happens when we try forcing modern families into impossible economic models from an era that never truly existed as portrayed? The answers might surprise you.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:15):
Hi and welcome to the Toxic Cooking Show, where we
break down toxic people to theirsimplest ingredients.
I'm your host, christopherPatchett LCSW.
Speaker 2 (00:25):
And I'm Lindsay McLean ingredients.
Speaker 1 (00:26):
I'm your host, christopher patchett lcsw and
I'm lindsey mclean.
Before we go into today'sepisode, it's been a little
while since you and I talkedmaybe like 12 hours or so since
we texted, or or something Iactually more yeah, yeah,
because it's been about 16.
Hours so, so I, I, I came with awhole like you know, like, um,
(00:49):
I I've changed my ways in thepast 16 hours as one does yeah,
as one does, and I, I reallythought about it and and I
decided that that I, I, I thinkthat we need to go back to the
1940s way of living oh, okay so,therefore, you need to get your
(01:14):
ass back into the kitchen okay,so you're gonna go back into
the coal mines I'm gonna bebecause you're in west virginia.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
So it's the coal west virginia, it's the coal, it's
Virginia, it is the coal minesfor you, sir.
Speaker 1 (01:26):
Well, so I'm going to be doing average America
employment here.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
No, no, no, no, no, I'm in the kitchen.
Speaker 1 (01:34):
Okay, I'm hopped up on whatever drugs they give me
as the housewife.
We're making America greatagain, america as a whole.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
Right, right, right, not just.
Speaker 1 (01:45):
West Virginia.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
West Virginia, but that's the only part that counts
the appalachians, like we don'tcare about the rest appalachian
I'm gonna tell your girlfriendshe's gonna beat your ass
appalachian.
Speaker 1 (02:03):
so so I I'm taking on the average American job,
average American salary.
Okay, and your ass is comingback to the kitchen.
Speaker 2 (02:13):
But when, in the 1940s, are we?
Because I may have a job, youmay be at war and I may have
taken your manufacturing jobwhile you were at war.
Speaker 1 (02:24):
We're talking 1946.
So this is right after.
Speaker 2 (02:28):
Okay, so you came back from the war and my job.
Yeah, I already thought aboutthat.
Speaker 1 (02:32):
Yeah, my ass is not getting shot at, fuck that.
Speaker 2 (02:40):
Says the military veteran.
Speaker 1 (02:43):
Look, there's a reason why I joined the Navy,
okay.
Speaker 2 (02:47):
Fair, fair.
Speaker 1 (02:52):
It is now.
Let's first start off.
Let's go back to 1945, whenAmerica was great.
So I came back from war and nowwomen are going back into the
kitchen.
I came back from war and nowwomen are going back into the
kitchen, and so so I'm going tostart off with the prices of
1946.
And then, after I kind of readthrough this, I'll, I'll give
(03:15):
you the inflated, inflatedprices, so you know.
So, looking at the averageincome, it was $3,115.
Speaker 2 (03:26):
Is that per year?
Speaker 1 (03:28):
Per year.
Okay, the average per, or theaverage household.
So this is a household of fourpeople man, woman and two kids.
I didn't find what it would befor the 2.3.
I just found for two kids, weexcuse you.
(03:50):
So the average house wouldspend 863 dollars on food,
heating, lights, electricity,421 dollars a year on cars so
that's saving for a new car fuel, any car repairs it was $92 a
year.
Medical, so this is medicalinsurance plus paying for any
(04:12):
medical expenses.
It's $133 per year, giving youa total of $1,509 a year.
Housing $509 a year Housing.
Well, I'll, I'll, I'll, you're.
You're jumping ahead a littlebit here because I have a little
, a little, a little treat forfor house itself.
Speaker 2 (04:35):
Oh my gosh.
Yes, I get a big kitchen towork in.
Speaker 1 (04:39):
Yes, yes, yes, yes.
I mean obviously we, you know,as the man being the provider,
you know, I, I have to provider,I have to provide the best of
the best here.
Speaker 2 (04:50):
I want a good kitchen to make sandwiches in.
Speaker 1 (05:04):
Inflation.
So income is $55,820.
Food is $15,465.
Utilities is $7,554.
Auto is $1,666.
And medical is $2,383.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
I was about to say ain't, no fucking way.
There's like a hundred inAmerican medical, unless it's
hundreds of thousands.
Speaker 1 (05:36):
You got to remember that 1940s you still had the
house doctor.
This was before medicinesbecame very, became more of an
industry.
It was basically like you tookthe doctor's words.
You didn't.
(05:57):
You didn't have fucking Zolofthaving ads on TV and you know
the person telling.
Speaker 2 (06:04):
No, you just gave the baby like a little bit of
bourbon to knock them out, sothey'd sleep while they were
sick yeah, exactly cocaine for anosebleed like.
Speaker 1 (06:13):
Those were the good times let's you know, since we
were making making America greatagain.
Let's look at today's priceshere.
So, like I said, I believe thatthe woman needs to go back to
the kitchen.
I'm going to work, I'm going tobe the provider and I am going
(06:36):
to do everything with the moneythat I'm making Money that I'm
making.
So my income has gone from, oris now, $66,622.
Food is $1,000.
I'm sorry, food is now $19,236for family and for utilities is
(07:03):
$6,99 five dollars.
So you know what is actuallylooking doable.
I mean my.
My income, adjusted forinflation, in 1946 was 55 820
and now is 66 66,622.
(07:23):
Food in 1945, inflated, wouldhave been 15,465.
It's a little bit more at19,236.
Heat electricity utilitieswould have been inflated 7,554.
(07:44):
Would have been inflated $7,554.
And now it's actually gone downto $6,996.
So that's even including online.
So you know we now have all ofour housing expenses covered and
it's looking like it's gettingbetter.
Speaker 2 (08:05):
Our housing expenses.
Speaker 1 (08:07):
Well, for food and and electricity we were.
We're not touching house itselfyet.
Speaker 2 (08:13):
Okay, I was about to say I know where this is going.
Speaker 1 (08:18):
So you know, the thing was is that as I was doing
this, this research, I was like, oh shit, like you know, like
I'm actually might be kind ofthrowing myself under the bus
here because I mean, food andheat didn't go up that much.
Housing I knew had gone up alot, but that was one of the
(08:41):
last things I looked at.
But this is where really kindof going off is auto.
So from 1945, inflated priceswould have been $1,666.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
It is now $12,000.
Wow, I'm so glad I don't own acar in America.
Speaker 1 (09:04):
So this is.
Speaker 2 (09:04):
I mean part of that makes sense, that they're like
you have to have a car now,whereas before, like in 46, I
think, there were plenty ofpeople who didn't have a car, a
lot of people who didn't have acar so you could get around
better without it theoretically,whereas now, like, if you don't
have one, unless you live in amajor city like new york, you're
fucked yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (09:28):
And and I mean also, you gotta figure on top of that,
like your, your cars were very,very, very basic at the time.
So I mean, yeah, you know wehave, yes, you know we, we have.
It's a longer lifespan andeverything like that.
However, repairs are, you know,like that much higher repairs
(09:50):
are crazy expensive.
Speaker 2 (09:52):
So much stuff like breaks within the car, like not
the actual, like oh it's a flattire, but like the software I
guess.
Yeah, I don't know, that's notmy field of experience.
Speaker 1 (10:07):
I mean you think about like how complex it is
nowadays, and especially like Ijust took my car in for Susan.
Susan, I just took her in forauto repair and yeah, it was 12,
$1,200 just for a clutch damnsuzy, oh, how could you do this?
(10:30):
Uh, but yeah, you know.
So that's twelve thousanddollars.
That's saving up for a new car,that's fuel, that's auto
repairs and everything like that.
Speaker 2 (10:39):
Your your car notes medical oh god, so car note
Medical, oh God.
Speaker 1 (10:49):
Nope.
So with medical in 1946,adjusted was $2,383.
Medical now is $12,297.
Wow, Wow yeah.
Speaker 2 (11:07):
That's.
I'm not surprised, I'm reallynot surprised.
I mean I told you that I justthe other day ended up at the
doctor's and then had to go geta prescription and Lee was like,
oh, you have social security.
And I was like, no, there's,you know, got to fill out this
thing and that thing.
And she was kind of hesitatingand I knew what the issue was
(11:29):
because I knew what one of themedications was.
And in France they like dude,they're like, oh, this one's
really expensive, it's 40 euros.
And to them they were like, ohmy God, and I was like, no, babe
, I'm from the U?
S.
And she was like, oh, oh, sothis is not, this is not a
problem for you.
(11:50):
And I was like no, no, I'm notthe, the price doesn't scare me,
I'm sorry.
Speaker 1 (11:59):
So yeah, I mean, I know, like a friend of mine,
this is when I was working forthe state Pennsylvania and she
was getting, I think it was like$385 for taking out for medical
and this is really good medical, you know, considering the fact
(12:20):
that I was, you know, a stateemployee.
So that was for her husband andher two kids.
So that's you figure, that'sabout four hundred dollars a
month times 12.
well, and that doesn't covereverything usually well, and and
and that you also have tofigure there was also a five
(12:41):
thousand dollar deductible.
Yes, so yeah, right, there,you're looking at $11,000.
And then if you talk aboutsomebody who's out of network or
you know, et cetera, et cetera,yeah, it goes up to $12,000
very, very quickly, wow.
Speaker 2 (13:03):
Yeah, usa, usa, usa.
Speaker 1 (13:08):
So we are looking at $50,528 so far, okay, as opposed
to 1945.
With all that taken out, youspent already $1,509.
Speaker 2 (13:26):
Out of your $3,000 something.
Speaker 1 (13:28):
Out of your $3,115.
Speaker 2 (13:33):
Okay, so in 1946, it was about a third that was gone,
and in 2025, it's likesignificantly more.
It's about.
Speaker 1 (13:46):
That's a little under half in 1946.
So 31, 15 so far, you'vealready spent 50,528.
So I think I've, I think Icovered everything.
(14:13):
Everything sounds so yeah, Imean, it is completely doable,
oh shit.
Speaker 2 (14:19):
That is 75%, by the way.
Speaker 1 (14:22):
I forgot one minor thing.
Speaker 2 (14:25):
Uh-huh, tee-peaty little thing.
Speaker 1 (14:29):
Where are we going to park the car?
Where are we going to?
Speaker 2 (14:34):
Where am I going to make the sandwiches?
Where are?
Speaker 1 (14:36):
you going to make the sandwiches?
Damn it, Because I'm fuckinghungry now.
I want my sandwich.
Speaker 2 (14:41):
And you spent the money on the sandwich materials.
Speaker 1 (14:44):
Yeah, I got the sandwiches.
You're healthy enough because Ispent a lot of money on medical
to go to the kitchen I was ableto get my kitchen bitch, I was
able to get the uh sandwiches inmy car.
However, oh, I forgot about thewhole house thing.
Oh so, looking at 1946, theaverage cost of a house was
(15:10):
three thousand eight hundreddollars so a little more than a
year's average salary yeah,about a year and three months
salary okay housing nowadays andI was actually generous with
this number I because I wantedto get us more than just a
(15:34):
shithole place.
Speaker 2 (15:35):
but well, because we do have two kids.
So you know we need to makesure the kids grow up in a
decent enough place, like theschool system is okay and you
know we have a yard for thewhite picket fence and the dog
exactly so.
Speaker 1 (15:53):
Now online is saying the average houses in america is
five hundred and four thousanddollars are you shitting me?
Yeah, I'm for real, for real.
Now, again, I'm trying to be,I'm trying to be generous, I'm
trying to, you know, like, maybe, maybe we won't have the, the,
(16:17):
the, the very nice house, we'regoing to have to scale back a
little bit A little bit.
Yeah.
So yeah, you know, I did dosome searching around.
I was kind of curious.
I was like, okay, like if I wasreally like you know, like
looking for a house right now, Imight find something that's
pretty decent for about 350.
Speaker 2 (16:39):
And that kind of makes it because I've seen like
some interesting prices forstuff.
It seems to unsurprisinglydepend on like where you are.
Speaker 1 (16:47):
Yeah.
So, yeah, yeah, so, yeah.
So I mean, you know, even, evenin West Virginia, here, like
this is the lowest area you'relooking at at start of like two
50.
Speaker 2 (17:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (17:03):
So three 50 is not exactly like I mean.
Again, I'm being extremelygenerous.
Speaker 2 (17:12):
We got a real good deal on that.
Speaker 1 (17:14):
We got a really, really good deal on that.
You're still looking at $2,200for a mortgage.
Speaker 2 (17:22):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (17:23):
A month, a month, a month so.
Speaker 2 (17:27):
I think we're out of money I think we're out of money
.
Speaker 1 (17:30):
Yeah, well, you figure that all we had left over
was 16, a little over 16.
Yeah, just over $16,000.
22 times 12.
Yeah, 26.
So we're already in debt$10,000.
Speaker 2 (17:52):
Thank God for credit cards.
Speaker 1 (17:54):
Oh damn it.
Credit cards.
Speaker 2 (17:58):
Yeah, don't forget to count how much Americans have
in debt there.
Speaker 1 (18:05):
So yeah, I mean like credit cards, you know, and then
also you got to figure if we'retruly making america great
again, your credit cards getthem out the door because you,
young lady, as a woman, no okay,just me, just me I mean me, I,
(18:25):
I can actually I'm kind ofcurious about this, holy shit
wait did you look up how muchdebt Americans have like credit
cards?
Nope, I looked this.
You're going to love this, ohno.
So do you want to know what thecredit card debt was in America
in 1946?
Speaker 2 (18:45):
What.
Speaker 1 (18:46):
Not a penny, because credit cards were not even
invented until the 1950s, andeven that, you know that does
kind of make sense.
Not a penny, because creditcards were not even invented
until the 1950s, and even thatyou know, it does kind of make
sense.
And your first credit card wasit was a diner's club.
Speaker 2 (19:00):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (19:01):
So yeah, there was no credit card debt.
And now I'm curious Actually,it's not as bad as I thought it
was going to be.
How much is it?
Is this per person, or perhousehold.
Speaker 2 (19:12):
And now I'm curious.
Actually, it's not as bad as Ithought it was going to be.
How much is it?
Is this?
Speaker 1 (19:16):
per person or per household, per borrower.
So the average American creditcard debt is $7,321.
So you got to figure that's perborrower.
You have two people in thehousehold, so about $1,500 in
credit card debt or $15,000 incredit card debt.
Speaker 2 (19:40):
Yeah, that's just credit card debt.
That's not including debt forlike anything else.
Yeah, that's not just collegedebt or anything like that.
Speaker 1 (19:48):
So, but I mean, okay, so we're making america great
again.
So I'm the only one with creditcards?
Because I mean I remember youwere saying that in one of the
past episodes that women werenot even allowed to get credit
cards, and without their debitcards or like open a bank
account right yeah, okay we're15 or I'm the only one in the
(20:12):
household with credit card$7,600 in credit card debit or
debt, and that's alreadyincluding the fact that we are
$10,000 in the whole per year.
Speaker 2 (20:25):
This is going really well.
I feel amazing.
Speaker 1 (20:30):
And so you know, and here's the thing you know, like
whenever I hear about, like youknow, like people talking about
we've talked about trad boys,before kind of going back into
the traditional home where there, you know, a lot of them are
speaking for, like you know,like we want, you know, we want
our rights taken away, we wanteverything to be reliant on the
(20:53):
male we're, we're sick and tired, we're here to serve.
Speaker 2 (20:57):
We're going to stay home, raise the kids, take care
of the house.
It's very like traditional invery heavy quotes, view of like
what the woman's job was.
Speaker 1 (21:09):
Right, and they talk about how women should be women,
men should be men.
So you got to look at if wereally want to go back to making
america great again.
But let's look at all of it,because now also including that
and we've talked about this withemotions, men's emotions how we
(21:33):
are kind of going into the orhow we were kind of trained
throughout our lifetimes thatback in second grade you know
like the rules of the playgroundDon't be a sissy, don't be a
girl, only girls cry.
You heard it in football Takeall of your emotions and bottle
up and throw down the field.
You heard it in football takeall of your emotions and bottle
up and throw down the field.
(21:53):
You hear it in the militaryespecially, and since you know
we all just got back from themilitary or from war in 1946,
embrace the suck and bullshitlike that.
Speaker 2 (22:07):
Yeah, everyone's got PTSD, but that's not a thing yet
.
So we just don't talk about thefact that daddy likes to sit in
the corner and drink and hatesreally loud noises yep so.
Speaker 1 (22:18):
And mental health, like you know, like, uh, men's
mental health, men are supposedto be like very strong.
You know, in the mind andeverything you know the woman is
the weak one.
You know the men or the, thewoman, you know, uh, but but men
, we're strong, you know, we, wedon't need mental health or
anything like that.
(22:38):
So let's get rid of that bottleup our feelings and everything
like that.
Now we're we're ten thousanddollars in debt.
Now, okay, I am still theprovider.
You're sure it's not going towork.
Speaker 2 (22:54):
No, because now I've got kids and so I've got to stay
home with them.
If we're really going back toit, then I'm not going to get
hired until my children aregrown enough to be taking care
of themselves.
If even then.
Speaker 1 (23:13):
Just as you said, Dad's hitting the bottle a lot
more because dad has PTSD.
Also, all this pressure that isfalling on me as the guy, and
also especially the fact thatI'm not allowed to show any type
of emotion Except for what aremen allowed to show Anger, anger
, anger.
(23:34):
Don't win a prize, so we'retruly going back to when America
was so-called great.
One of the other things thatmade America great was the fact
that we had this very solidhousehold, that you know, the
(23:57):
man and the woman and the kids,they all stuck together.
That divorce.
Speaker 2 (24:09):
That wasn't a thing, you know like no, no, I'm not.
I mean, I'm gonna call out myown family on this because
everyone involved has passedaway at this point.
But it's not like.
I found evidence in the 1950census that one of my great
aunts had a child.
Then she was married to theperson who she had the child
with.
Then they she was 19, by theway, Unclear if she was married
(24:35):
when she gave birth to the childand by 1950, child was living
with the grandparents.
Damn yeah, but divorce wasn't athing.
Speaker 1 (24:49):
No, yeah, divorce was .
You know, if you got divorced,you were pretty much shunned,
because, I mean, you got toremember that religion was
extremely part of the familycore.
And if your religion is sayingthat you can't get divorced, and
all of a sudden now you're, youknow, a divorcee, you weren't
(25:13):
able to keep the family together.
Speaker 2 (25:15):
Right, clearly for context, this great aunt did
actually get remarried again,but it was because she was
already knocked up with secondchild Shotgun money, you can
look at the dates and you'relike God I love old records.
Speaker 1 (25:35):
So you know like okay , so.
So divorce is not a thing.
Dad's angry Dad has is goingthrough a lot of mental health
Dad is is now being abusive.
Well, you know is going througha lot of mental health.
Dad is now being abusive.
Well, what can a woman do ifshe's being abused?
Speaker 2 (26:01):
Not a lot in this case, other than Violet's back.
Speaker 1 (26:06):
Well, and also remember that, as a woman, you
are there to serve.
Speaker 2 (26:13):
Of course yes.
Speaker 1 (26:14):
And so, yeah, I mean, if you want to talk about if,
if it's really getting bad, sure, get a divorce, but also you're
going to be shunned.
And on top of that, you don'thave any work experience because
dad's been working this entiretime.
So now, now you are going tohave to figure out a way to pay
(26:37):
all the bills, making minimumwage while also raising children
while also being shunned bysociety exactly so yeah, you
know, like this isn't a goodhousehold for neither the man or
the woman.
The man is bottling up all ofhis feelings.
(26:59):
He is going through alcoholabuse.
He is having all the stress ofhaving everything being relied
on him.
The woman is going throughstress as far as I mean she's
going through the stress of herhusband trying to keep up with
(27:21):
the bills and everything likethat.
Speaker 2 (27:25):
Well, trying to manage the household, trying to
make everything work trying tomake everything work.
Speaker 1 (27:32):
Yeah, this whole idea that, you know, going back in
time and men who are goingaround saying that men need to
be men again, that women need tobe women and women kind of
going around saying that we'reprepared to give up all of our
rights to have this, thislifestyle again, it's not even,
(27:53):
it's not even doable these days,you know it's not doable these
days and it wasn't doable backthen.
Speaker 2 (28:01):
This is the thing that people forget too, is that
we have this idea that like, oh,you know, the woman just sat at
home.
Both of my grandmothers workedto some extent, either outside
of the house or you know.
For instance, one of them wasteaching music after she had
children teaching lessons Likeit was not uncommon, even in the
(28:22):
50s, for women to need to workto help support the household in
some form or another.
Were women going in and doingthe same jobs as men were?
No, they weren't, but they weredoing something to support the
family and everything that wasgoing on.
Maybe it was growing vegetablesin the backyard that then you
(28:43):
sold on the side of the road.
That's something that thesepeople conveniently leave out
was all of that extra work thatwas going on to help support the
families that supposedly themen were supporting a hundred
percent?
They weren't.
They were doing a lot of it,yeah, but like women were
filling in the gaps.
Speaker 1 (29:01):
Right.
So I mean and, and the thing isis that you.
So I mean, and the thing is isthat you might be able to fill
in the gaps, that you're able towork very, very, very part-time
, considering the fact that youwere spending most of the time
raising the kids and everythinglike that didn't leave you any
time for, like education.
(29:22):
Your only job opportunitieswere like the very entry levels.
You were never given any typeof experience.
So I mean, you were at entrylevel, you stayed at entry level
yeah, because you got it.
As soon as you had kids, youwere out of the workforce right,
so even like, but I mean nowyou're talking about again,
(29:47):
you're already ten10,000 in thehole, and that's not even
including clothing, that's notincluding activities, that's not
including time out, vacations,anything like that, and we're
coming out of the gate already$10,000 in debt.
Speaker 2 (30:04):
Yeah, it was a much smaller difference.
I think women were having to tomake up back in the day that
difference between like oh,what's my husband bringing home
and what am I like adding to it,to kind of like fill in the
gaps, versus now it's like, ohno, it's dozens of thousands,
tens of thousands of dollarsthat the second partner has to
(30:25):
bring in.
Speaker 1 (30:27):
How many thousands?
Speaker 2 (30:31):
Look, I tried.
I said dozens and I was like,nope, I don't like it, it's tens
of thousands.
And then I said 10.
And now you're going to mock me, so jealous of my accent.
Speaker 1 (30:45):
So, yes, we are tens of thousands of dollars in the
hole and again, this is per year, so it's not.
We're in the hole for $10,000.
Speaker 2 (30:55):
It's just every year like more and more and more.
Speaker 1 (30:58):
Right, You're raising the kids and we're spending the
first 10 years of marriage justfocusing on the kids.
So that's $100,000 of debt.
Speaker 2 (31:11):
Don't forget interest .
Speaker 1 (31:13):
Don't forget interest Now.
I wanted to say this for lastoh no.
So I forgot one other thingwith the $66,662.
Speaker 2 (31:28):
Uh-huh.
Speaker 1 (31:29):
That's pre-taxes.
Speaker 2 (31:32):
Well, so I hope you got some good skills, man,
because I'm going to need you toget at least three other jobs
if you want me to keep makingsandwiches.
Speaker 1 (31:42):
Going off of for me.
I put away about 30, 35% fortaxes as a freelancer.
Let's just say that this big,beautiful bill that was just
passed really was for theaverage income family or the
(32:05):
average American family.
Speaker 2 (32:07):
Of course it was.
Speaker 1 (32:09):
Which you're on average.
You might get $1,000 more back.
However, because of the thingsthat were taken away from
medical, you're actually down inthe hole another about five
thousand dollars.
Speaker 2 (32:29):
So so it's not even like close so.
Speaker 1 (32:35):
So you know, let's just like I'm giving.
I'm giving the big beautifulbill, the, the benefit of the
doubt that you know it truly ishelping the american family out,
even lowering taxes down to 20,which, no, it's again.
I'm being extremely generous.
(32:55):
Again, we are starting off with50 000 or, I'm sorry, 53 298.
So remember the.
The price I said before housingis $50,528.
So we have $3,270 left over forhousing.
Speaker 2 (33:20):
For the year.
Speaker 1 (33:20):
For the year, $3,300.
How do you feel?
Speaker 2 (33:25):
about working 24.
Hours a day.
Speaker 1 (33:30):
So again, you know like I was extremely generous
with the housing and we'relooking at $26,000 a year for
your mortgage, year for yourmortgage.
(33:52):
So that $10,000 a year that Iwas saying about that, that is
fantasy land.
That again is being hopefulbecause you also have to take
out taxes.
So now we're at $23,000 a yearthat we are in the hole.
So this this father knows bestlifestyle.
Or the Donna Reed, which I knowyou don't know either one of
(34:13):
them because I know you don'twant to watch TV, but I'm still
surprised you don't know Atleast those, god maybe one day,
if you're lucky, I'll look themup and then I'll understand your
, your old people references.
Okay, this is even before mytime asshole.
Okay, these were shows back inthe 1950s.
(34:34):
I wasn't even.
I was not even a twinkle in myparents side.
My parents didn't even meet.
My parents were in grade schoolat this time.
Okay, so fuck off, people,don't give you old people
(34:55):
somebody's testy about being old, cranky, old man over there.
So so I mean again, we're we'realready about $23,000 in debt,
and that's again before clothing, before school supplies, that's
before any type ofentertainment.
(35:17):
That is the very, very basics.
That's even before BarkBox, ooh, and we know.
Speaker 2 (35:27):
We love BarkBox, yes, barkbox.
Oh, and we know we love BarkBox.
Speaker 1 (35:29):
Yes, BarkBox keeps me alive.
Speaker 2 (35:34):
Better make sure that all those subscriptions are set
in place.
Speaker 1 (35:37):
BarkBox.
If you're listening, I willgladly.
Speaker 2 (35:41):
We will sponsor that.
Speaker 1 (35:46):
So yes, little Miss Molly over here is gonna go
without fruity toot loops andher squeaky toys, because
there's no way in hell, afterbeing 23 000 in debt, that she's
gonna be able to get her FruityLoops.
Speaker 2 (36:09):
Sorry.
Speaker 1 (36:10):
Molly.
But yeah, Donna Reed, it wasthe fantasy of the 1940s 1950s,
household.
Actually, yeah, look her up.
Speaker 2 (36:20):
I am, yeah, I'm curious.
Speaker 1 (36:24):
And this is where we get the pomp dress.
She was always makeuped up andhad the poofy dress waiting for
her husband to come home withdinner.
Speaker 2 (36:37):
Did you know she was married in 1943, divorced 1945,
married 1945, divorced 1971, andthen married again in 1974?
Good job, good job, good job.
I mean she looks.
It's hard to talk because allof these photos like kind of
(36:59):
look the same from back in theday, like the actresses.
I may have seen some of thesephotos before, I don't know.
But yeah, I see what you meanby that, though Like that very
stereotypical.
Speaker 1 (37:15):
With all that being said, the fact that we are that
much in debt that men arecompletely burned out and the
only emotion that a man's reallyable to show is anger, that a
woman who is going through abusereally doesn't have that option
(37:36):
of leaving the home.
Therefore, that was the reasonwhy divorce rates were a lot
lower than they are today, werea lot lower than they are today,
and that they basically womenjust had to go through the abuse
or not have a place to live.
And this is the America thatmany people are trying to, are
(38:01):
trying to go back to.
Where do we go from here?
Speaker 2 (38:06):
Well, we start by acknowledging that the america
we want to go back to neverexisted, like the ideas that are
being espoused by that movement, never all existed at one time.
Again, this idea of like, oh,the man was the happy provider,
he worked his job and he camehome.
And again, the wife who wasjust sitting at home all day
(38:32):
loving her husband, loving herchildren, all of that that was
not actually the norm.
Women were working in one wayor another, in many cases
outside of the home too, to someextent in the 50sies and
sixties.
Like, all of that, like thatwas that was a thing.
Again, my parents were bothborn in the fifties.
Their mothers worked one way oranother.
(38:54):
Cause, that's, that's what youdid, you were, you were allowed
to.
Both of my grandmothersreceived an education, both of
them went to college of somesort.
And so this idea of like, oh,you know, women didn't do this,
they just sat there, they gotmarried at 18.
Like, that was not actually thenorm.
And so pushing this idea onpeople of like, oh, things were
so great back then it didn'texist, and the stuff that did
(39:16):
exist, as you said, was notgreat, like the fact that you
had dad who's got all this likebottled up rage and feelings and
he doesn't have a way to get itout.
That's not a happy home.
Mom who's like zonked out onmedication so that she's not
bored out of her mind or so thatshe can, like you know, deal
with the stress and all that.
(39:37):
That's not a great thing.
Children who are dying ofdiseases that are now
preventable because we know backthen we didn't have the
vaccination.
You know we didn't have theknowledge that we do now.
Like we just gave childrenalcohol so like that's fine,
puts the baby to sleep.
Here you go a little morebrandy.
(39:58):
You know that we understand nowthat that that's not.
We don't need to do that.
So I think it's the first stepis understanding that, like it's
, this is a made-up fantasyworld that maga is pushing, like
the idea of maga make americagreat again is pushing on people
like they're making this uplike, oh, it was perfect, it was
(40:19):
great, everyone was happy.
No, no, they weren't.
They weren't happy, it didn'texist.
What did existed, like therewere always going to be problems
.
So I think that's the firststep is you acknowledge that,
like this was not a real thingand then, second you, you pick
up on the fact that, like, whatwe did have was not there.
(40:39):
There were some really bigproblems.
Like we've made some likereally great advances and, and I
think once you like overcomethose two bits, then you
understand that, like this isn'ta viable solution.
I would hope.
Speaker 1 (40:54):
Yeah, I agree, like I know.
So I know my grandmother on my,my, my mother's side.
She did do work like part-timeand, unfortunately, like she had
it pretty hard because, like Imean, like my grandfather was
not exactly the grandpa I loveyou, but not exactly the, the,
(41:17):
the, the most caring person.
You know.
He was in the navy.
He cheated on my grandmothermany, many times.
He was alcoholic, he was Irish,you know, yeah, he probably not
the greatest person.
My grandmother, I would say,definitely deserved better than
(41:38):
him, but she was kind of stuckin that whole thing where, like
she couldn't leave him, eventhough she threatened many times
.
And the thing is is that my mom, my aunts and uncles got to
grow up seeing this.
I know my dad.
He grew up in a one incomehousehold that his father, but
(42:02):
my dad also lived in what wasconsidered a quote unquote
changing neighborhood.
So you know my dad also livedin what was considered a quote
unquote changing neighborhood.
So you know he grew up where hegrew up in Chicago and it was
one of these neighborhoods thatwas I fucking hate saying this
now but more and more blackfamilies moving to there and
(42:23):
therefore, like the housing wasgoing down and things like that.
So he ended up having to livenot fully poor because, like I
said, it was still like achanging neighborhood when he
was growing up, but it wasn'texactly like beverly hills, any
type type of things like thatand so.
(42:44):
So, yeah, I mean this wholefantasy that you know like, uh,
the one income household youknow and having like the Donna
Reed house.
I think the biggest thing is isthat, because that was my image
of the 1940s- as well.
Speaker 2 (43:08):
1940s, 1950s, like that's what pops into my head,
even though I know it's not true.
Of like again, the like I seethe clothing, I see the colors.
Like because we've beeninundated with it for years,
even before maga existed.
Of like housewife 1950shousewife.
She sat at home and made jellosalad and looked cute and that's
that all.
That's all she did Like.
(43:29):
We've been fed that narrativefor years.
Speaker 1 (43:31):
Yeah, yeah.
And I think that a big part ofit is just TV.
You know it's because you Imean any show that you had it
was always the single incomefather knows best on a read show
.
God, who's with Spanky andLittle?
Speaker 2 (43:51):
Rascals, see, I know them Ooh.
Speaker 1 (43:56):
Look at you go Wow.
So, yeah, I think that one ofthe biggest things is being able
to recognize that it's afucking TV show, like none of
that was real.
So, like you know, the kidswere grown up and that they did
(44:38):
do like, just as you said, youknow, grown vegetables in the
yard where they were able to dosomething to kind of like that.
Still, like, a lot of womenwere in this predicament where,
just like my grandmother,couldn't, couldn't leave the
house and had to deal with theabuse and I don't know if it was
ever physical, but I do know alot of it was emotional abuse at
(44:59):
the very least.
But yeah, all of this is totalbullshit and I think that that's
the biggest thing that peopleneed to realize is what they're
(45:19):
going for is an absolute lie.
Speaker 2 (45:19):
And even the tradwives that we've talked
about on our show before, a lotof them, who are big influencers
, are getting paid.
That's their whole point is.
They're getting paid.
And they're sitting theretelling you like just sit at
home, be like me, bitch, youhave sponsors, yeah, at home.
Be like me, bitch, you havesponsors, yeah.
Like.
Or your husband, cough cough,ballerina farms is like some
rich millionaire heir orwhatever.
Like you guys are not wantingfor money.
Of course you can do this, butyour average family?
Speaker 1 (45:39):
it's not feasible right at all so, with all that
being said, where would you putthis on our scale of toxicity?
Would you say that this is agreen potato where just shave
off the green and you can stilleat it?
Death cap mushroom where youhave a 50-50 shot of dying?
Or a antifreeze jello where it?
Speaker 2 (46:07):
is a delightful last meal.
I'm going back and forth onthis one where part of me is
like it can't be antifreezebecause is it as bad as you know
?
Something like gaslighting.
But then I look at it and I'mlike but maybe it is.
Like, maybe it really is thisidea that we're pushing on
people that says like, hey,here's this like fantasy world,
(46:32):
you want this right?
Like go back to it.
Never existed, so it's notgoing to exist now, especially
not now.
And pushing people to believethat you know it damages both
men and women.
Like men believes, like, oh,I'm supposed to be this big
tough guy, I'm supposed to bethe provider and we know, like
evidence, science shows us thatmen get really upset when women
(46:55):
make more than them.
Like that's that's alreadystill a problem we have in our
society.
And then you know we're feedingthem more.
It's like you're supposed to bethe only provider and like
pushing that all on dudes.
It's like don't cry, don't showemotions.
You have to make all this moneyto provide for your family and
if you don't, you're not a realman.
And then for the women.
(47:15):
It's like you're supposed to,you're supposed to find a real
man and you're supposed toprovide this thing, but we don't
actually give you the tools todo it, and I think you end up
(47:40):
with an entire potentiallystunted generation of people who
try and do this.
It doesn't work, or they justnever even end up together.
This is what's happening, withGen Z's going to sit at home and
take care of me and have mybabies and you know I'm going to
be the man and women are likeno, no, I don't want that, and
so they're going further apart.
Like it'll be interesting tosee what happens with that.
So I guess I do have to givethis an antifreeze.
(48:03):
Like I think it is really,really bad for society.
Speaker 1 (48:07):
Yeah, to freeze, I think it is really, really bad
for society.
Yeah, I actually agree.
I think that this is.
it sounds cutesy to when youkind of first mention it, but I
think, based off of everythingthat you said, and then also I
would have to throw on top of it, that laws are being made
(48:28):
towards that's true, this, thisway of living and that's kind of
the thing is that now you'renot, now you're trying to force
people into this way of living,which is absolutely impossible
right, because if you say like,hey, this is something I want to
have, like for myselfpersonally, you know more power
(48:50):
to you.
Speaker 2 (48:51):
If that's the lifestyle you want to lead and
you can make it happen, I'm notgonna stop you by any means.
But you're right, yeah, I mean,laws are being passed forcing
people, telling them like youhave to do this, and now you
actually don't even have anotheroption.
It's not even like well, youshould, it's you, you have to.
You may not have another choice, but it's not viable yeah, yeah
(49:13):
.
Speaker 1 (49:13):
So I mean, I I think that you know it's, it's so that
I I say that you know, flat out, it's antifreeze, no, no
splashing of it.
I I think that, uh, it is flatout just ant freeze pouring into
into lime jello.
Speaker 2 (49:30):
Lime jello.
I think you're right.
Yeah, I think that it has to beyum.
Speaker 1 (49:36):
So if you have any stories of your grandparents and
if they were able to make itwork, or if they weren't able to
make it work, feel free towrite us at toxic, at
awesomelyteskillscom.
You can also find us on Twitter.
(49:58):
Blue Sky.
Are we still on Twitter?
Speaker 2 (50:03):
Kind of technically.
The web hosting that we havefor the podcast makes it really
easy to post on Twitter, so Ijust do it anyway.
So, I prefer, if you don't findus on Twitter.
Speaker 1 (50:15):
Twitter, a blue sky, instagram, facebook.
Please feel free to connectwith us there.
And then until next time.
I've been Christopher Patchett,lcsw, and I've been christopher
patchett lcsw and I've beenlindsey mclean bye bye.
Hi and welcome to the Toxic Cooking Show, where we
break down toxic people to theirsimplest ingredients.
I'm your host, christopherPatchett LCSW.
Speaker 2 (00:25):
And I'm Lindsay McLean ingredients.
Speaker 1 (00:26):
I'm your host, christopher patchett lcsw and
I'm lindsey mclean.
Before we go into today'sepisode, it's been a little
while since you and I talkedmaybe like 12 hours or so since
we texted, or or something Iactually more yeah, yeah,
because it's been about 16.
Hours so, so I, I, I came with awhole like you know, like, um,
(00:49):
I I've changed my ways in thepast 16 hours as one does yeah,
as one does, and I, I reallythought about it and and I
decided that that I, I, I thinkthat we need to go back to the
1940s way of living oh, okay so,therefore, you need to get your
(01:14):
ass back into the kitchen okay,so you're gonna go back into
the coal mines I'm gonna bebecause you're in west virginia.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
So it's the coal west virginia, it's the coal, it's
Virginia, it is the coal minesfor you, sir.
Speaker 1 (01:26):
Well, so I'm going to be doing average America
employment here.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
No, no, no, no, no, I'm in the kitchen.
Speaker 1 (01:34):
Okay, I'm hopped up on whatever drugs they give me
as the housewife.
We're making America greatagain, america as a whole.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
Right, right, right, not just.
Speaker 1 (01:45):
West Virginia.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
West Virginia, but that's the only part that counts
the appalachians, like we don'tcare about the rest appalachian
I'm gonna tell your girlfriendshe's gonna beat your ass
appalachian.
Speaker 1 (02:03):
so so I I'm taking on the average American job,
average American salary.
Okay, and your ass is comingback to the kitchen.
Speaker 2 (02:13):
But when, in the 1940s, are we?
Because I may have a job, youmay be at war and I may have
taken your manufacturing jobwhile you were at war.
Speaker 1 (02:24):
We're talking 1946.
So this is right after.
Speaker 2 (02:28):
Okay, so you came back from the war and my job.
Yeah, I already thought aboutthat.
Speaker 1 (02:32):
Yeah, my ass is not getting shot at, fuck that.
Speaker 2 (02:40):
Says the military veteran.
Speaker 1 (02:43):
Look, there's a reason why I joined the Navy,
okay.
Speaker 2 (02:47):
Fair, fair.
Speaker 1 (02:52):
It is now.
Let's first start off.
Let's go back to 1945, whenAmerica was great.
So I came back from war and nowwomen are going back into the
kitchen.
I came back from war and nowwomen are going back into the
kitchen, and so so I'm going tostart off with the prices of
1946.
And then, after I kind of readthrough this, I'll, I'll give
(03:15):
you the inflated, inflatedprices, so you know.
So, looking at the averageincome, it was $3,115.
Speaker 2 (03:26):
Is that per year?
Speaker 1 (03:28):
Per year.
Okay, the average per, or theaverage household.
So this is a household of fourpeople man, woman and two kids.
I didn't find what it would befor the 2.3.
I just found for two kids, weexcuse you.
(03:50):
So the average house wouldspend 863 dollars on food,
heating, lights, electricity,421 dollars a year on cars so
that's saving for a new car fuel, any car repairs it was $92 a
year.
Medical, so this is medicalinsurance plus paying for any
(04:12):
medical expenses.
It's $133 per year, giving youa total of $1,509 a year.
Housing $509 a year Housing.
Well, I'll, I'll, I'll, you're.
You're jumping ahead a littlebit here because I have a little
, a little, a little treat forfor house itself.
Speaker 2 (04:35):
Oh my gosh.
Yes, I get a big kitchen towork in.
Speaker 1 (04:39):
Yes, yes, yes, yes.
I mean obviously we, you know,as the man being the provider,
you know, I, I have to provider,I have to provide the best of
the best here.
Speaker 2 (04:50):
I want a good kitchen to make sandwiches in.
Speaker 1 (05:04):
Inflation.
So income is $55,820.
Food is $15,465.
Utilities is $7,554.
Auto is $1,666.
And medical is $2,383.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
I was about to say ain't, no fucking way.
There's like a hundred inAmerican medical, unless it's
hundreds of thousands.
Speaker 1 (05:36):
You got to remember that 1940s you still had the
house doctor.
This was before medicinesbecame very, became more of an
industry.
It was basically like you tookthe doctor's words.
You didn't.
(05:57):
You didn't have fucking Zolofthaving ads on TV and you know
the person telling.
Speaker 2 (06:04):
No, you just gave the baby like a little bit of
bourbon to knock them out, sothey'd sleep while they were
sick yeah, exactly cocaine for anosebleed like.
Speaker 1 (06:13):
Those were the good times let's you know, since we
were making making America greatagain.
Let's look at today's priceshere.
So, like I said, I believe thatthe woman needs to go back to
the kitchen.
I'm going to work, I'm going tobe the provider and I am going
(06:36):
to do everything with the moneythat I'm making Money that I'm
making.
So my income has gone from, oris now, $66,622.
Food is $1,000.
I'm sorry, food is now $19,236for family and for utilities is
(07:03):
$6,99 five dollars.
So you know what is actuallylooking doable.
I mean my.
My income, adjusted forinflation, in 1946 was 55 820
and now is 66 66,622.
(07:23):
Food in 1945, inflated, wouldhave been 15,465.
It's a little bit more at19,236.
Heat electricity utilitieswould have been inflated 7,554.
(07:44):
Would have been inflated $7,554.
And now it's actually gone downto $6,996.
So that's even including online.
So you know we now have all ofour housing expenses covered and
it's looking like it's gettingbetter.
Speaker 2 (08:05):
Our housing expenses.
Speaker 1 (08:07):
Well, for food and and electricity we were.
We're not touching house itselfyet.
Speaker 2 (08:13):
Okay, I was about to say I know where this is going.
Speaker 1 (08:18):
So you know, the thing was is that as I was doing
this, this research, I was like, oh shit, like you know, like
I'm actually might be kind ofthrowing myself under the bus
here because I mean, food andheat didn't go up that much.
Housing I knew had gone up alot, but that was one of the
(08:41):
last things I looked at.
But this is where really kindof going off is auto.
So from 1945, inflated priceswould have been $1,666.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
It is now $12,000.
Wow, I'm so glad I don't own acar in America.
Speaker 1 (09:04):
So this is.
Speaker 2 (09:04):
I mean part of that makes sense, that they're like
you have to have a car now,whereas before, like in 46, I
think, there were plenty ofpeople who didn't have a car, a
lot of people who didn't have acar so you could get around
better without it theoretically,whereas now, like, if you don't
have one, unless you live in amajor city like new york, you're
fucked yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (09:28):
And and I mean also, you gotta figure on top of that,
like your, your cars were very,very, very basic at the time.
So I mean, yeah, you know wehave, yes, you know we, we have.
It's a longer lifespan andeverything like that.
However, repairs are, you know,like that much higher repairs
(09:50):
are crazy expensive.
Speaker 2 (09:52):
So much stuff like breaks within the car, like not
the actual, like oh it's a flattire, but like the software I
guess.
Yeah, I don't know, that's notmy field of experience.
Speaker 1 (10:07):
I mean you think about like how complex it is
nowadays, and especially like Ijust took my car in for Susan.
Susan, I just took her in forauto repair and yeah, it was 12,
$1,200 just for a clutch damnsuzy, oh, how could you do this?
(10:30):
Uh, but yeah, you know.
So that's twelve thousanddollars.
That's saving up for a new car,that's fuel, that's auto
repairs and everything like that.
Speaker 2 (10:39):
Your your car notes medical oh god, so car note
Medical, oh God.
Speaker 1 (10:49):
Nope.
So with medical in 1946,adjusted was $2,383.
Medical now is $12,297.
Wow, Wow yeah.
Speaker 2 (11:07):
That's.
I'm not surprised, I'm reallynot surprised.
I mean I told you that I justthe other day ended up at the
doctor's and then had to go geta prescription and Lee was like,
oh, you have social security.
And I was like, no, there's,you know, got to fill out this
thing and that thing.
And she was kind of hesitatingand I knew what the issue was
(11:29):
because I knew what one of themedications was.
And in France they like dude,they're like, oh, this one's
really expensive, it's 40 euros.
And to them they were like, ohmy God, and I was like, no, babe
, I'm from the U?
S.
And she was like, oh, oh, sothis is not, this is not a
problem for you.
(11:50):
And I was like no, no, I'm notthe, the price doesn't scare me,
I'm sorry.
Speaker 1 (11:59):
So yeah, I mean, I know, like a friend of mine,
this is when I was working forthe state Pennsylvania and she
was getting, I think it was like$385 for taking out for medical
and this is really good medical, you know, considering the fact
(12:20):
that I was, you know, a stateemployee.
So that was for her husband andher two kids.
So that's you figure, that'sabout four hundred dollars a
month times 12.
well, and that doesn't covereverything usually well, and and
and that you also have tofigure there was also a five
(12:41):
thousand dollar deductible.
Yes, so yeah, right, there,you're looking at $11,000.
And then if you talk aboutsomebody who's out of network or
you know, et cetera, et cetera,yeah, it goes up to $12,000
very, very quickly, wow.
Speaker 2 (13:03):
Yeah, usa, usa, usa.
Speaker 1 (13:08):
So we are looking at $50,528 so far, okay, as opposed
to 1945.
With all that taken out, youspent already $1,509.
Speaker 2 (13:26):
Out of your $3,000 something.
Speaker 1 (13:28):
Out of your $3,115.
Speaker 2 (13:33):
Okay, so in 1946, it was about a third that was gone,
and in 2025, it's likesignificantly more.
It's about.
Speaker 1 (13:46):
That's a little under half in 1946.
So 31, 15 so far, you'vealready spent 50,528.
So I think I've, I think Icovered everything.
(14:13):
Everything sounds so yeah, Imean, it is completely doable,
oh shit.
Speaker 2 (14:19):
That is 75%, by the way.
Speaker 1 (14:22):
I forgot one minor thing.
Speaker 2 (14:25):
Uh-huh, tee-peaty little thing.
Speaker 1 (14:29):
Where are we going to park the car?
Where are we going to?
Speaker 2 (14:34):
Where am I going to make the sandwiches?
Where are?
Speaker 1 (14:36):
you going to make the sandwiches?
Damn it, Because I'm fuckinghungry now.
I want my sandwich.
Speaker 2 (14:41):
And you spent the money on the sandwich materials.
Speaker 1 (14:44):
Yeah, I got the sandwiches.
You're healthy enough because Ispent a lot of money on medical
to go to the kitchen I was ableto get my kitchen bitch, I was
able to get the uh sandwiches inmy car.
However, oh, I forgot about thewhole house thing.
Oh so, looking at 1946, theaverage cost of a house was
(15:10):
three thousand eight hundreddollars so a little more than a
year's average salary yeah,about a year and three months
salary okay housing nowadays andI was actually generous with
this number I because I wantedto get us more than just a
(15:34):
shithole place.
Speaker 2 (15:35):
but well, because we do have two kids.
So you know we need to makesure the kids grow up in a
decent enough place, like theschool system is okay and you
know we have a yard for thewhite picket fence and the dog
exactly so.
Speaker 1 (15:53):
Now online is saying the average houses in america is
five hundred and four thousanddollars are you shitting me?
Yeah, I'm for real, for real.
Now, again, I'm trying to be,I'm trying to be generous, I'm
trying to, you know, like, maybe, maybe we won't have the, the,
(16:17):
the, the very nice house, we'regoing to have to scale back a
little bit A little bit.
Yeah.
So yeah, you know, I did dosome searching around.
I was kind of curious.
I was like, okay, like if I wasreally like you know, like
looking for a house right now, Imight find something that's
pretty decent for about 350.
Speaker 2 (16:39):
And that kind of makes it because I've seen like
some interesting prices forstuff.
It seems to unsurprisinglydepend on like where you are.
Speaker 1 (16:47):
Yeah.
So, yeah, yeah, so, yeah.
So I mean, you know, even, evenin West Virginia, here, like
this is the lowest area you'relooking at at start of like two
50.
Speaker 2 (17:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (17:03):
So three 50 is not exactly like I mean.
Again, I'm being extremelygenerous.
Speaker 2 (17:12):
We got a real good deal on that.
Speaker 1 (17:14):
We got a really, really good deal on that.
You're still looking at $2,200for a mortgage.
Speaker 2 (17:22):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (17:23):
A month, a month, a month so.
Speaker 2 (17:27):
I think we're out of money I think we're out of money
.
Speaker 1 (17:30):
Yeah, well, you figure that all we had left over
was 16, a little over 16.
Yeah, just over $16,000.
22 times 12.
Yeah, 26.
So we're already in debt$10,000.
Speaker 2 (17:52):
Thank God for credit cards.
Speaker 1 (17:54):
Oh damn it.
Credit cards.
Speaker 2 (17:58):
Yeah, don't forget to count how much Americans have
in debt there.
Speaker 1 (18:05):
So yeah, I mean like credit cards, you know, and then
also you got to figure if we'retruly making america great
again, your credit cards getthem out the door because you,
young lady, as a woman, no okay,just me, just me I mean me, I,
(18:25):
I can actually I'm kind ofcurious about this, holy shit
wait did you look up how muchdebt Americans have like credit
cards?
Nope, I looked this.
You're going to love this, ohno.
So do you want to know what thecredit card debt was in America
in 1946?
Speaker 2 (18:45):
What.
Speaker 1 (18:46):
Not a penny, because credit cards were not even
invented until the 1950s, andeven that, you know that does
kind of make sense.
Not a penny, because creditcards were not even invented
until the 1950s, and even thatyou know, it does kind of make
sense.
And your first credit card wasit was a diner's club.
Speaker 2 (19:00):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (19:01):
So yeah, there was no credit card debt.
And now I'm curious Actually,it's not as bad as I thought it
was going to be.
How much is it?
Is this per person, or perhousehold.
Speaker 2 (19:12):
And now I'm curious.
Actually, it's not as bad as Ithought it was going to be.
How much is it?
Is this?
Speaker 1 (19:16):
per person or per household, per borrower.
So the average American creditcard debt is $7,321.
So you got to figure that's perborrower.
You have two people in thehousehold, so about $1,500 in
credit card debt or $15,000 incredit card debt.
Speaker 2 (19:40):
Yeah, that's just credit card debt.
That's not including debt forlike anything else.
Yeah, that's not just collegedebt or anything like that.
Speaker 1 (19:48):
So, but I mean, okay, so we're making america great
again.
So I'm the only one with creditcards?
Because I mean I remember youwere saying that in one of the
past episodes that women werenot even allowed to get credit
cards, and without their debitcards or like open a bank
account right yeah, okay we're15 or I'm the only one in the
(20:12):
household with credit card$7,600 in credit card debit or
debt, and that's alreadyincluding the fact that we are
$10,000 in the whole per year.
Speaker 2 (20:25):
This is going really well.
I feel amazing.
Speaker 1 (20:30):
And so you know, and here's the thing you know, like
whenever I hear about, like youknow, like people talking about
we've talked about trad boys,before kind of going back into
the traditional home where there, you know, a lot of them are
speaking for, like you know,like we want, you know, we want
our rights taken away, we wanteverything to be reliant on the
(20:53):
male we're, we're sick and tired, we're here to serve.
Speaker 2 (20:57):
We're going to stay home, raise the kids, take care
of the house.
It's very like traditional invery heavy quotes, view of like
what the woman's job was.
Speaker 1 (21:09):
Right, and they talk about how women should be women,
men should be men.
So you got to look at if wereally want to go back to making
america great again.
But let's look at all of it,because now also including that
and we've talked about this withemotions, men's emotions how we
(21:33):
are kind of going into the orhow we were kind of trained
throughout our lifetimes thatback in second grade you know
like the rules of the playgroundDon't be a sissy, don't be a
girl, only girls cry.
You heard it in football Takeall of your emotions and bottle
up and throw down the field.
You heard it in football takeall of your emotions and bottle
up and throw down the field.
(21:53):
You hear it in the militaryespecially, and since you know
we all just got back from themilitary or from war in 1946,
embrace the suck and bullshitlike that.
Speaker 2 (22:07):
Yeah, everyone's got PTSD, but that's not a thing yet
.
So we just don't talk about thefact that daddy likes to sit in
the corner and drink and hatesreally loud noises yep so.
Speaker 1 (22:18):
And mental health, like you know, like, uh, men's
mental health, men are supposedto be like very strong.
You know, in the mind andeverything you know the woman is
the weak one.
You know the men or the, thewoman, you know, uh, but but men
, we're strong, you know, we, wedon't need mental health or
anything like that.
(22:38):
So let's get rid of that bottleup our feelings and everything
like that.
Now we're we're ten thousanddollars in debt.
Now, okay, I am still theprovider.
You're sure it's not going towork.
Speaker 2 (22:54):
No, because now I've got kids and so I've got to stay
home with them.
If we're really going back toit, then I'm not going to get
hired until my children aregrown enough to be taking care
of themselves.
If even then.
Speaker 1 (23:13):
Just as you said, Dad's hitting the bottle a lot
more because dad has PTSD.
Also, all this pressure that isfalling on me as the guy, and
also especially the fact thatI'm not allowed to show any type
of emotion Except for what aremen allowed to show Anger, anger
, anger.
(23:34):
Don't win a prize, so we'retruly going back to when America
was so-called great.
One of the other things thatmade America great was the fact
that we had this very solidhousehold, that you know, the
(23:57):
man and the woman and the kids,they all stuck together.
That divorce.
Speaker 2 (24:09):
That wasn't a thing, you know like no, no, I'm not.
I mean, I'm gonna call out myown family on this because
everyone involved has passedaway at this point.
But it's not like.
I found evidence in the 1950census that one of my great
aunts had a child.
Then she was married to theperson who she had the child
with.
Then they she was 19, by theway, Unclear if she was married
(24:35):
when she gave birth to the childand by 1950, child was living
with the grandparents.
Damn yeah, but divorce wasn't athing.
Speaker 1 (24:49):
No, yeah, divorce was .
You know, if you got divorced,you were pretty much shunned,
because, I mean, you got toremember that religion was
extremely part of the familycore.
And if your religion is sayingthat you can't get divorced, and
all of a sudden now you're, youknow, a divorcee, you weren't
(25:13):
able to keep the family together.
Speaker 2 (25:15):
Right, clearly for context, this great aunt did
actually get remarried again,but it was because she was
already knocked up with secondchild Shotgun money, you can
look at the dates and you'relike God I love old records.
Speaker 1 (25:35):
So you know like okay , so.
So divorce is not a thing.
Dad's angry Dad has is goingthrough a lot of mental health
Dad is is now being abusive.
Well, you know is going througha lot of mental health.
Dad is now being abusive.
Well, what can a woman do ifshe's being abused?
Speaker 2 (26:01):
Not a lot in this case, other than Violet's back.
Speaker 1 (26:06):
Well, and also remember that, as a woman, you
are there to serve.
Speaker 2 (26:13):
Of course yes.
Speaker 1 (26:14):
And so, yeah, I mean, if you want to talk about if,
if it's really getting bad, sure, get a divorce, but also you're
going to be shunned.
And on top of that, you don'thave any work experience because
dad's been working this entiretime.
So now, now you are going tohave to figure out a way to pay
(26:37):
all the bills, making minimumwage while also raising children
while also being shunned bysociety exactly so yeah, you
know, like this isn't a goodhousehold for neither the man or
the woman.
The man is bottling up all ofhis feelings.
(26:59):
He is going through alcoholabuse.
He is having all the stress ofhaving everything being relied
on him.
The woman is going throughstress as far as I mean she's
going through the stress of herhusband trying to keep up with
(27:21):
the bills and everything likethat.
Speaker 2 (27:25):
Well, trying to manage the household, trying to
make everything work trying tomake everything work.
Speaker 1 (27:32):
Yeah, this whole idea that, you know, going back in
time and men who are goingaround saying that men need to
be men again, that women need tobe women and women kind of
going around saying that we'reprepared to give up all of our
rights to have this, thislifestyle again, it's not even,
(27:53):
it's not even doable these days,you know it's not doable these
days and it wasn't doable backthen.
Speaker 2 (28:01):
This is the thing that people forget too, is that
we have this idea that like, oh,you know, the woman just sat at
home.
Both of my grandmothers workedto some extent, either outside
of the house or you know.
For instance, one of them wasteaching music after she had
children teaching lessons Likeit was not uncommon, even in the
(28:22):
50s, for women to need to workto help support the household in
some form or another.
Were women going in and doingthe same jobs as men were?
No, they weren't, but they weredoing something to support the
family and everything that wasgoing on.
Maybe it was growing vegetablesin the backyard that then you
(28:43):
sold on the side of the road.
That's something that thesepeople conveniently leave out
was all of that extra work thatwas going on to help support the
families that supposedly themen were supporting a hundred
percent?
They weren't.
They were doing a lot of it,yeah, but like women were
filling in the gaps.
Speaker 1 (29:01):
Right.
So I mean and, and the thing isis that you.
So I mean, and the thing is isthat you might be able to fill
in the gaps, that you're able towork very, very, very part-time
, considering the fact that youwere spending most of the time
raising the kids and everythinglike that didn't leave you any
time for, like education.
(29:22):
Your only job opportunitieswere like the very entry levels.
You were never given any typeof experience.
So I mean, you were at entrylevel, you stayed at entry level
yeah, because you got it.
As soon as you had kids, youwere out of the workforce right,
so even like, but I mean nowyou're talking about again,
(29:47):
you're already ten10,000 in thehole, and that's not even
including clothing, that's notincluding activities, that's not
including time out, vacations,anything like that, and we're
coming out of the gate already$10,000 in debt.
Speaker 2 (30:04):
Yeah, it was a much smaller difference.
I think women were having to tomake up back in the day that
difference between like oh,what's my husband bringing home
and what am I like adding to it,to kind of like fill in the
gaps, versus now it's like, ohno, it's dozens of thousands,
tens of thousands of dollarsthat the second partner has to
(30:25):
bring in.
Speaker 1 (30:27):
How many thousands?
Speaker 2 (30:31):
Look, I tried.
I said dozens and I was like,nope, I don't like it, it's tens
of thousands.
And then I said 10.
And now you're going to mock me, so jealous of my accent.
Speaker 1 (30:45):
So, yes, we are tens of thousands of dollars in the
hole and again, this is per year, so it's not.
We're in the hole for $10,000.
Speaker 2 (30:55):
It's just every year like more and more and more.
Speaker 1 (30:58):
Right, You're raising the kids and we're spending the
first 10 years of marriage justfocusing on the kids.
So that's $100,000 of debt.
Speaker 2 (31:11):
Don't forget interest .
Speaker 1 (31:13):
Don't forget interest Now.
I wanted to say this for lastoh no.
So I forgot one other thingwith the $66,662.
Speaker 2 (31:28):
Uh-huh.
Speaker 1 (31:29):
That's pre-taxes.
Speaker 2 (31:32):
Well, so I hope you got some good skills, man,
because I'm going to need you toget at least three other jobs
if you want me to keep makingsandwiches.
Speaker 1 (31:42):
Going off of for me.
I put away about 30, 35% fortaxes as a freelancer.
Let's just say that this big,beautiful bill that was just
passed really was for theaverage income family or the
(32:05):
average American family.
Speaker 2 (32:07):
Of course it was.
Speaker 1 (32:09):
Which you're on average.
You might get $1,000 more back.
However, because of the thingsthat were taken away from
medical, you're actually down inthe hole another about five
thousand dollars.
Speaker 2 (32:29):
So so it's not even like close so.
Speaker 1 (32:35):
So you know, let's just like I'm giving.
I'm giving the big beautifulbill, the, the benefit of the
doubt that you know it truly ishelping the american family out,
even lowering taxes down to 20,which, no, it's again.
I'm being extremely generous.
(32:55):
Again, we are starting off with50 000 or, I'm sorry, 53 298.
So remember the.
The price I said before housingis $50,528.
So we have $3,270 left over forhousing.
Speaker 2 (33:20):
For the year.
Speaker 1 (33:20):
For the year, $3,300.
How do you feel?
Speaker 2 (33:25):
about working 24.
Hours a day.
Speaker 1 (33:30):
So again, you know like I was extremely generous
with the housing and we'relooking at $26,000 a year for
your mortgage, year for yourmortgage.
(33:52):
So that $10,000 a year that Iwas saying about that, that is
fantasy land.
That again is being hopefulbecause you also have to take
out taxes.
So now we're at $23,000 a yearthat we are in the hole.
So this this father knows bestlifestyle.
Or the Donna Reed, which I knowyou don't know either one of
(34:13):
them because I know you don'twant to watch TV, but I'm still
surprised you don't know Atleast those, god maybe one day,
if you're lucky, I'll look themup and then I'll understand your
, your old people references.
Okay, this is even before mytime asshole.
Okay, these were shows back inthe 1950s.
(34:34):
I wasn't even.
I was not even a twinkle in myparents side.
My parents didn't even meet.
My parents were in grade schoolat this time.
Okay, so fuck off, people,don't give you old people
(34:55):
somebody's testy about being old, cranky, old man over there.
So so I mean again, we're we'realready about $23,000 in debt,
and that's again before clothing, before school supplies, that's
before any type ofentertainment.
(35:17):
That is the very, very basics.
That's even before BarkBox, ooh, and we know.
Speaker 2 (35:27):
We love BarkBox, yes, barkbox.
Oh, and we know we love BarkBox.
Speaker 1 (35:29):
Yes, BarkBox keeps me alive.
Speaker 2 (35:34):
Better make sure that all those subscriptions are set
in place.
Speaker 1 (35:37):
BarkBox.
If you're listening, I willgladly.
Speaker 2 (35:41):
We will sponsor that.
Speaker 1 (35:46):
So yes, little Miss Molly over here is gonna go
without fruity toot loops andher squeaky toys, because
there's no way in hell, afterbeing 23 000 in debt, that she's
gonna be able to get her FruityLoops.
Speaker 2 (36:09):
Sorry.
Speaker 1 (36:10):
Molly.
But yeah, Donna Reed, it wasthe fantasy of the 1940s 1950s,
household.
Actually, yeah, look her up.
Speaker 2 (36:20):
I am, yeah, I'm curious.
Speaker 1 (36:24):
And this is where we get the pomp dress.
She was always makeuped up andhad the poofy dress waiting for
her husband to come home withdinner.
Speaker 2 (36:37):
Did you know she was married in 1943, divorced 1945,
married 1945, divorced 1971, andthen married again in 1974?
Good job, good job, good job.
I mean she looks.
It's hard to talk because allof these photos like kind of
(36:59):
look the same from back in theday, like the actresses.
I may have seen some of thesephotos before, I don't know.
But yeah, I see what you meanby that, though Like that very
stereotypical.
Speaker 1 (37:15):
With all that being said, the fact that we are that
much in debt that men arecompletely burned out and the
only emotion that a man's reallyable to show is anger, that a
woman who is going through abusereally doesn't have that option
(37:36):
of leaving the home.
Therefore, that was the reasonwhy divorce rates were a lot
lower than they are today, werea lot lower than they are today,
and that they basically womenjust had to go through the abuse
or not have a place to live.
And this is the America thatmany people are trying to, are
(38:01):
trying to go back to.
Where do we go from here?
Speaker 2 (38:06):
Well, we start by acknowledging that the america
we want to go back to neverexisted, like the ideas that are
being espoused by that movement, never all existed at one time.
Again, this idea of like, oh,the man was the happy provider,
he worked his job and he camehome.
And again, the wife who wasjust sitting at home all day
(38:32):
loving her husband, loving herchildren, all of that that was
not actually the norm.
Women were working in one wayor another, in many cases
outside of the home too, to someextent in the 50sies and
sixties.
Like, all of that, like thatwas that was a thing.
Again, my parents were bothborn in the fifties.
Their mothers worked one way oranother.
(38:54):
Cause, that's, that's what youdid, you were, you were allowed
to.
Both of my grandmothersreceived an education, both of
them went to college of somesort.
And so this idea of like, oh,you know, women didn't do this,
they just sat there, they gotmarried at 18.
Like, that was not actually thenorm.
And so pushing this idea onpeople of like, oh, things were
so great back then it didn'texist, and the stuff that did
(39:16):
exist, as you said, was notgreat, like the fact that you
had dad who's got all this likebottled up rage and feelings and
he doesn't have a way to get itout.
That's not a happy home.
Mom who's like zonked out onmedication so that she's not
bored out of her mind or so thatshe can, like you know, deal
with the stress and all that.
(39:37):
That's not a great thing.
Children who are dying ofdiseases that are now
preventable because we know backthen we didn't have the
vaccination.
You know we didn't have theknowledge that we do now.
Like we just gave childrenalcohol so like that's fine,
puts the baby to sleep.
Here you go a little morebrandy.
(39:58):
You know that we understand nowthat that that's not.
We don't need to do that.
So I think it's the first stepis understanding that, like it's
, this is a made-up fantasyworld that maga is pushing, like
the idea of maga make americagreat again is pushing on people
like they're making this uplike, oh, it was perfect, it was
(40:19):
great, everyone was happy.
No, no, they weren't.
They weren't happy, it didn'texist.
What did existed, like therewere always going to be problems
.
So I think that's the firststep is you acknowledge that,
like this was not a real thingand then, second you, you pick
up on the fact that, like, whatwe did have was not there.
(40:39):
There were some really bigproblems.
Like we've made some likereally great advances and, and I
think once you like overcomethose two bits, then you
understand that, like this isn'ta viable solution.
I would hope.
Speaker 1 (40:54):
Yeah, I agree, like I know.
So I know my grandmother on my,my, my mother's side.
She did do work like part-timeand, unfortunately, like she had
it pretty hard because, like Imean, like my grandfather was
not exactly the grandpa I loveyou, but not exactly the, the,
(41:17):
the, the most caring person.
You know.
He was in the navy.
He cheated on my grandmothermany, many times.
He was alcoholic, he was Irish,you know, yeah, he probably not
the greatest person.
My grandmother, I would say,definitely deserved better than
(41:38):
him, but she was kind of stuckin that whole thing where, like
she couldn't leave him, eventhough she threatened many times
.
And the thing is is that my mom, my aunts and uncles got to
grow up seeing this.
I know my dad.
He grew up in a one incomehousehold that his father, but
(42:02):
my dad also lived in what wasconsidered a quote unquote
changing neighborhood.
So you know my dad also livedin what was considered a quote
unquote changing neighborhood.
So you know he grew up where hegrew up in Chicago and it was
one of these neighborhoods thatwas I fucking hate saying this
now but more and more blackfamilies moving to there and
(42:23):
therefore, like the housing wasgoing down and things like that.
So he ended up having to livenot fully poor because, like I
said, it was still like achanging neighborhood when he
was growing up, but it wasn'texactly like beverly hills, any
type type of things like thatand so.
(42:44):
So, yeah, I mean this wholefantasy that you know like, uh,
the one income household youknow and having like the Donna
Reed house.
I think the biggest thing is isthat, because that was my image
of the 1940s- as well.
Speaker 2 (43:08):
1940s, 1950s, like that's what pops into my head,
even though I know it's not true.
Of like again, the like I seethe clothing, I see the colors.
Like because we've beeninundated with it for years,
even before maga existed.
Of like housewife 1950shousewife.
She sat at home and made jellosalad and looked cute and that's
that all.
That's all she did Like.
(43:29):
We've been fed that narrativefor years.
Speaker 1 (43:31):
Yeah, yeah.
And I think that a big part ofit is just TV.
You know it's because you Imean any show that you had it
was always the single incomefather knows best on a read show
.
God, who's with Spanky andLittle?
Speaker 2 (43:51):
Rascals, see, I know them Ooh.
Speaker 1 (43:56):
Look at you go Wow.
So, yeah, I think that one ofthe biggest things is being able
to recognize that it's afucking TV show, like none of
that was real.
So, like you know, the kidswere grown up and that they did
(44:38):
do like, just as you said, youknow, grown vegetables in the
yard where they were able to dosomething to kind of like that.
Still, like, a lot of womenwere in this predicament where,
just like my grandmother,couldn't, couldn't leave the
house and had to deal with theabuse and I don't know if it was
ever physical, but I do know alot of it was emotional abuse at
(44:59):
the very least.
But yeah, all of this is totalbullshit and I think that that's
the biggest thing that peopleneed to realize is what they're
(45:19):
going for is an absolute lie.
Speaker 2 (45:19):
And even the tradwives that we've talked
about on our show before, a lotof them, who are big influencers
, are getting paid.
That's their whole point is.
They're getting paid.
And they're sitting theretelling you like just sit at
home, be like me, bitch, youhave sponsors, yeah, at home.
Be like me, bitch, you havesponsors, yeah.
Like.
Or your husband, cough cough,ballerina farms is like some
rich millionaire heir orwhatever.
Like you guys are not wantingfor money.
Of course you can do this, butyour average family?
Speaker 1 (45:39):
it's not feasible right at all so, with all that
being said, where would you putthis on our scale of toxicity?
Would you say that this is agreen potato where just shave
off the green and you can stilleat it?
Death cap mushroom where youhave a 50-50 shot of dying?
Or a antifreeze jello where it?
Speaker 2 (46:07):
is a delightful last meal.
I'm going back and forth onthis one where part of me is
like it can't be antifreezebecause is it as bad as you know
?
Something like gaslighting.
But then I look at it and I'mlike but maybe it is.
Like, maybe it really is thisidea that we're pushing on
people that says like, hey,here's this like fantasy world,
(46:32):
you want this right?
Like go back to it.
Never existed, so it's notgoing to exist now, especially
not now.
And pushing people to believethat you know it damages both
men and women.
Like men believes, like, oh,I'm supposed to be this big
tough guy, I'm supposed to bethe provider and we know, like
evidence, science shows us thatmen get really upset when women
(46:55):
make more than them.
Like that's that's alreadystill a problem we have in our
society.
And then you know we're feedingthem more.
It's like you're supposed to bethe only provider and like
pushing that all on dudes.
It's like don't cry, don't showemotions.
You have to make all this moneyto provide for your family and
if you don't, you're not a realman.
And then for the women.
(47:15):
It's like you're supposed to,you're supposed to find a real
man and you're supposed toprovide this thing, but we don't
actually give you the tools todo it, and I think you end up
(47:40):
with an entire potentiallystunted generation of people who
try and do this.
It doesn't work, or they justnever even end up together.
This is what's happening, withGen Z's going to sit at home and
take care of me and have mybabies and you know I'm going to
be the man and women are likeno, no, I don't want that, and
so they're going further apart.
Like it'll be interesting tosee what happens with that.
So I guess I do have to givethis an antifreeze.
(48:03):
Like I think it is really,really bad for society.
Speaker 1 (48:07):
Yeah, to freeze, I think it is really, really bad
for society.
Yeah, I actually agree.
I think that this is.
it sounds cutesy to when youkind of first mention it, but I
think, based off of everythingthat you said, and then also I
would have to throw on top of it, that laws are being made
(48:28):
towards that's true, this, thisway of living and that's kind of
the thing is that now you'renot, now you're trying to force
people into this way of living,which is absolutely impossible
right, because if you say like,hey, this is something I want to
have, like for myselfpersonally, you know more power
(48:50):
to you.
Speaker 2 (48:51):
If that's the lifestyle you want to lead and
you can make it happen, I'm notgonna stop you by any means.
But you're right, yeah, I mean,laws are being passed forcing
people, telling them like youhave to do this, and now you
actually don't even have anotheroption.
It's not even like well, youshould, it's you, you have to.
You may not have another choice, but it's not viable yeah, yeah
(49:13):
.
Speaker 1 (49:13):
So I mean, I I think that you know it's, it's so that
I I say that you know, flat out, it's antifreeze, no, no
splashing of it.
I I think that, uh, it is flatout just ant freeze pouring into
into lime jello.
Speaker 2 (49:30):
Lime jello.
I think you're right.
Yeah, I think that it has to beyum.
Speaker 1 (49:36):
So if you have any stories of your grandparents and
if they were able to make itwork, or if they weren't able to
make it work, feel free towrite us at toxic, at
awesomelyteskillscom.
You can also find us on Twitter.
(49:58):
Blue Sky.
Are we still on Twitter?
Speaker 2 (50:03):
Kind of technically.
The web hosting that we havefor the podcast makes it really
easy to post on Twitter, so Ijust do it anyway.
So, I prefer, if you don't findus on Twitter.
Speaker 1 (50:15):
Twitter, a blue sky, instagram, facebook.
Please feel free to connectwith us there.
And then until next time.
I've been Christopher Patchett,lcsw, and I've been christopher
patchett lcsw and I've beenlindsey mclean bye bye.
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