The Trauma Within Balancing Creativity and Mental Health W/ RJ City

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:19):
fabulous.
I listen y'all, we'll see howthis goes.
My, my good friend here isgoing to bring all kinds of
things and I don't know what'shappening.
They don't know what'shappening, and so my first
question to let me.

Speaker 2 (00:32):
Let me tell you what's unfair.
No, I want to tell you what'sunfair about this.
Why?
That you're recording the introseparately and that I won't be
able to hear it, and that you'regonna do it after this.

Speaker 1 (00:45):
I might even do it today, so I'm gonna get one of
those.

Speaker 2 (00:47):
What an interesting guy.
And I'm gonna have to hear itwhen the episode goes up and I'm
gonna have to deal with yourreaction to it after, when it's
too late well, you know why isbecause I'm probably gonna talk
you up and you're gonna hate it,right.

Speaker 1 (01:01):
And so why do you want to sit through the
uncomfortableness?

Speaker 2 (01:05):
I, I enjoy picking it apart, okay.
Well then, fine it.
You know what?
No, I don't, you don't, I'mjust telling you, I just I enjoy
it.

Speaker 1 (01:15):
So okay, well, you sent me a two-line bio.
You ready to pick it apart?

Speaker 2 (01:18):
yeah, are you gonna?

Speaker 1 (01:19):
read that okay great, great, okay, listen everyone.
This is the reason that I havemy own show is because we do
what we want.
So we're going to introducethis person now and then we're
going to get into theinformation, because this one is
special, all right, all right,everyone.

(01:40):
Today we have the one and onlythe one and only RJ City, whom
is an actor, writer and bittermedia personality.
He hosts AEW's hey you, alongwith a variety of other programs
that he refuses to acceptpraise for.
And when I tell you you enjoythis human's work all the time

(02:01):
and get a little cackle, alittle giggle, you do.
This human's work all the timeand get a little cackle, a
little giggle, you do.
And this person doesn't acceptall the praise.
But today I will praise themand they will have to accept it.
So my first question to you,sir RJ City, is who are you what
?

Speaker 2 (02:20):
Why should I know that and why do I need to know
that?
Why do I need to know who I am?
And also, who I was a week agois different than who I am today
.

Speaker 1 (02:31):
Well, that's why I'm asking who you are today.

Speaker 2 (02:33):
Well, I would say in what capacity.

Speaker 1 (02:36):
In the capacity that you're currently sitting here in
.

Speaker 2 (02:39):
Yeah, but in what length do you want me to speak
Emotionally, physically?

Speaker 1 (02:43):
What do?

Speaker 2 (02:44):
you got.
Um, I did not have a nap today,so I'm I actually feel calm, so
I feel a little like a littletired, but in a good way.
Um, I like to get up early.
I like to get up Cause you'reold, no, because I feel like I

(03:05):
can get up before my anxiety andI can actually get some work
done.

Speaker 1 (03:12):
So you beat your anxiety in the mornings.

Speaker 2 (03:14):
Yeah, from like six to ten.
Okay, it's a pretty good windowof like my brain is on enough
to do work, but not so on Like Ifeel like I would benefit from.
I'm speaking in grand termshere, but like a lobotomy, Like
I wish I had less of my brain.

Speaker 1 (03:34):
Oh, I get that yeah.
That sounds heavy andinteresting in the morning, yeah
.

Speaker 2 (03:41):
I get jealous of people who are less aware than I
am.
Oh yeah, Ignorance is bliss.
Yeah, and I find it I find itvery freeing to go to um.
One of the things I like to dois like go to museums, small
town museums when we're on theroad and we're doing shows, and

(04:03):
go, look at this guy rippingtickets.
He is no, he's not worriedabout what anyone thinks, he's
not thinking about himself atall.
He, I ripped the tickets.
People come in, I ripped thetickets and I'm like isn't?

Speaker 1 (04:15):
that zero fucks about you beautiful.

Speaker 2 (04:17):
No, and he will never know me, he will never think
about me, and it's fantastic,yeah so how do we?
Meet how well at work or beforethat, I don't know, I don't
know.
Did we meet before that?
I don't think so.

(04:37):
Maybe not, but you had known ofme.
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah.
And what did you know exactly?

Speaker 1 (04:44):
I knew that you were an amazing writer, an amazing
creator.
I thought you were funny, yeah.
Also, I looked at old wrestlingvideos because I like to know
who's around me, right?
So you know, I just like to doa little research and also
because you like to haveinteresting conversations with
people to find your own humor,so that also is entertaining for

(05:06):
me.

Speaker 2 (05:06):
Yeah, yeah.
But then we met at work.
Yes, we caught when acolleagues that the word that's
not the word.

Speaker 1 (05:15):
I mean we work at the same place.
No, my colleague is a littleman named Dr Reese who I'm also
friends with.
Yeah yeah, yeah, he's a lovelylittle human he's a sweet man
yeah, did you have more to addto who you were today, after you
gave me your spiel about howyou don't want to talk about who
you were?
No, I feel calm.

Speaker 2 (05:34):
I I guess if, if who are you today is, I did some
writing, yeah can't wait to hearit.
Yeah, I feel okay today.

Speaker 1 (05:45):
Okay, we'll receive that.
I think okay is a great placeto be.

Speaker 2 (05:48):
Oh, that's like a yeah, it doesn't happen often.
Yeah, I was like what it's morelike?
Huh, I feel okay.
Today it's a surprise to methat I feel okay.
Let me put it that way it'sbecause you're at home today.
Yeah, it's because I got workdone today.
It's because you're at hometoday.

Speaker 1 (06:06):
Yeah, it's because I got work done today.
Productivity what?

Speaker 2 (06:10):
does trauma mean to you?
Not that much.
I feel like it's very overusedand that bothers me.
I get bothered by things like,for example, yoga or soy milk,

(06:30):
that once it's mass marketed topeople, it becomes useless.
And now I can't tell.
I can't go take a yoga classand know and know if it's good
or not.
There's so much of it.
The same way, you can't drinksoy milk now because there's a
million companies are making it.
You don't know if it's good orbad or anything.
I also feel that way about aCrossFit.
Uh, well, because the CrossFitis dangerous.
Well, yeah, but I'm sayingsometimes you could go to

(06:52):
CrossFit and you have someonewho knows what they're doing.
Or you get a guy who just, youknow, saw a YouTube video, said
I can do it stoicism.
I feel the same way about, thesame way about okay, um.

(07:13):
So trauma feels like a realoverused term to me.
I've had, um, I guess it's.
I don't want to say it's notsomething I believe in, but I've
had experiences that I onlyrealized much later were
traumatizing.
So I feel like it's something Idon't often feel in the moment
because of how I'm wired.
I'm a worst case scenarioperson.
My brain likes to worry aboutthe unknown and what could go

(07:33):
wrong and to create horriblescenarios.
So when bad things happen, I'malmost relieved.

Speaker 1 (07:45):
Is it because it gives like like my gut was right
, I knew that shit was gonna beshit?

Speaker 2 (07:50):
Yeah, well, first of all, when push comes to shove, I
feel like I'm a capable person,handling those situations like
calmly, rationally.
Rarely do I look back and go, Ioverreacted.
I usually do a good jobhandling the situation.
And then also that part of mybrain is allowed to shut off
that worries about it andthere's like, well, there's

(08:10):
nothing to worry about becausewe have to deal with it do you
raw dog life um, no, I, to behonest with you, I, if anything,
I double bag it and I'll sayI'll say you know what?
why don't I just masturbate?

Speaker 1 (08:34):
okay, so you like to.
So, for those that aren'tunderstanding where I'm going
with this, are you medicated, doyou?

Speaker 2 (08:40):
oh, that's what you mean.
Do you show up?

Speaker 1 (08:43):
oh my god and rj said I like to just live life raw,
just no, I don't like to livelife.

Speaker 2 (08:48):
What are you talking about?
I said the opposite.
Well, I didn't know what youmeant by rodo.

Speaker 1 (08:52):
Yeah, I guess I do rodo um?

Speaker 2 (08:55):
I take supplements.
I don't not interested intaking medication.
I feel like the issues I havecan be solved through thought,
through more thought.
I feel like I can find my wayout of that maze, and I also.
There are plenty of things thatI am proud of, that I do and

(09:16):
can produce, and I'm afraid ofcompromising those things by
taking medication.

Speaker 1 (09:21):
Artist brain Got it.
You don't want to fuck it up.
So before you got to this olderfancy gentleman that's in front
of us what was baby rj like,like what was?
It's giving smart ass.

Speaker 2 (09:32):
So yeah, I mean, I feel like I was almost exactly
the same.
There was a lot of singing anddancing and old things going on
what just would not shut up.
There's a lot of home movieswhere I'm told to be quiet or to
get out of the way, or the bestone.
Talk about trauma, me saying,hey, let's do a skit.

(09:56):
Everybody Are you filming?
And then my mother or fatherwould say yes, as the camera
slowly fades and shuts off andthey're just holding it because
they didn't want to waste thetape.
So, yeah, I gotta deal withthat now.

Speaker 1 (10:14):
Um yeah, seems like a .

Speaker 2 (10:16):
Thing baby or jay, was that very hopeful, very big
believer in the magic of life?

Speaker 1 (10:25):
Very Disney.

Speaker 2 (10:26):
Very Disney, but also like very, very reverential to
figures, old wrestlers andpeople and comedians and people
who knew stuff, and I was reallybig into that.
And then the second half of mylife has felt like an unlearning
of that.
Sure, yeah, a real like oh,everyone is no better or worse

(10:50):
than you.
Yeah, they barely know anything.
At no point will you get it,you just age and kind of stay
the same.
So, yeah, it's been a lot of,especially in wrestling it's
been.

Speaker 1 (11:08):
It's been like oh wow that guy I idolized was an
idiot.
Yeah, yeah, wow, I mean sureit's true.

Speaker 2 (11:14):
It's true because they're just people, sure and
it's maybe not even their faultthat they were presented as not
an idiot no, we put them onthese pedestals and and believed
it.
Because they're charactersRight.
So it's been a real levelingout experience, I think around
22 to 25.
I became a lot moredisappointed.

(11:35):
I was very angry that themessaging I was given as a child
Did not hold true.
What?

Speaker 1 (11:46):
messaging.

Speaker 2 (11:47):
Wrestling-wise and life-wise.
Oh, okay, you know you're likeI took everyone's advice on what
to do and this kind of sucks,you know.
And then for a while I was sucha big believer in my plans and
then they didn't work out andthen I ended up really going
through life without a plan andthat seemed to work for me.

Speaker 1 (12:12):
Yeah, I think there's parts we're skipping.
I feel like a lot of thebecause now we're in present day
and I feel like there's a lotthat happens when we are in our
later teens, when our brainsstart to go wait, what the fuck?
And then in our 20s.

Speaker 2 (12:27):
Yes.

Speaker 1 (12:28):
And as someone who I always ask individuals what they
want to talk about, and when Isay the list was thick the ideas
were flowing in this human andI thought the combination of
talking about being chosen andthe anxiety as a motivator is
something that a lot of us gothrough.
And so you didn't just wake upas a 20 something with like, oh,

(12:49):
these are my struggles.
So when was the first time younoticed or can think back to,
when you felt like you werestruggling or wanting to be
chosen?

Speaker 2 (13:02):
I would say very, very early on, like grade school
, I enjoyed doing plays andthings of that nature, sports
and things.
Not that I always had to be thebest, but I wanted my own thing
.
In the fifth grade my teacherknew enough to give me my own

(13:23):
weekly show in front of theclass.
Okay, I got whatever it wasfive, 10 minutes every Friday
and I worked on it depressinglysimilar to the way I work now.

Speaker 1 (13:35):
I was like wow, I feel like I'm at present day
with you.

Speaker 2 (13:37):
So when I say nothing's changed, I really mean
that there's that stress of, oh, what am I going to do?
I got to do the show.
I don't have to do the show.
No, what?
What would happen if I said,hey, I don't really feel like
doing this today?
You'd say, okay, no problem,she's not gonna say we have, we
have affiliates who need you.

(13:59):
But that is the pressure Iguess I enjoy putting myself
under.
I have a compulsion to do thosethings.
Yeah, so I have to get it done.
I feel like I'm a I will alsosay, as someone who was out of
work in my chosen fields forquite some time, I feel like I'm
a much better person.

(14:20):
When I'm able to do thosethings, I have a certain energy
that needs to go somewhere, andwhen it doesn't go somewhere,
it's not fun to be around.
What do you do with it?
I don't, I don't.
I try to create that work.
So I've realized like, oh, Ican't just sit with it, like I

(14:41):
can't just be an annoyingbartender.

Speaker 1 (14:50):
I have to just make stuff, you know when you don't
get that.
So there's this.
I have a lot of canadianfriends and y'all are so nice or
passive or whatever.
Is that a stereotype?

Speaker 2 (15:00):
yes, because I find I mean, I'm from Toronto and I
find the majority of people herevery rude and I find them rude
in a passive way- Okay, so we'reback to passive.
We're back to passive, althoughI I'm well.
No, I'm not passive, I'mpassive, aggressive is
difference.
Well well, there is a difference.
I mean, yeah, passive in thesense that like sometimes I go

(15:23):
to a restaurant or some anythinglike that, and I'm like I'm
just waiting there forever andI'm like does anyone want any of
my money here today at all?
We're gonna, we're gonna keepthis train running.

Speaker 1 (15:37):
I think that's.
The interesting part, though,is when we're able to identify
these things about ourselves.
Like you're, like I'm, past nopassive aggressive aggressive.
How did you figure out you'repassive aggressive?
Did somebody tell you, yes, Idated a girl for two weeks.

Speaker 2 (15:51):
Oh uh, when.
When was this?
I was in university, maybe?
Uh, very nice, good, goodperson, healthy you ever have,
like a good.
Even though it was two weeks,nothing bad happened.
It was like a good, healthy.
Yeah, this is not, and I don't,I can't even remember the
reason why, but I remember hertelling me that I'm a passive

(16:13):
aggressive alpha male and I wentah an alpha male.
Yeah, oh, come on massiveaggressive alpha male meaning
okay.
So perfect example, eddieKingston.
We know, we know about EK.
Okay, maybe an alpha male,right?
Okay, got to be loud and beathis chest and oh, what's on my

(16:36):
mind?
And I'm you know whatever.
So when we interact, he's thefirst to make a comment.
I am never the first to make acomment.
I am never the first.
No, he has the compulsion to bethe first and to set the tone.
But what I will do is thepassive aggressiveness is wait

(16:56):
for him to put his cards downand then comment on his cards.
Uh-huh, um.
So then, yeah, I can't make thefirst move.
I'm not a first move person.
I love making the second move.
Second move is amazing is it?

Speaker 1 (17:13):
is it the anxiety?
Is it the fear?
Is it the placement?
Is it like wanting to follow,like, where is it?

Speaker 2 (17:19):
yes, I have a uh, probably a difficulty being
vulnerable, right, putting yourcards down.
Setting the tone saying I wantthis is not my, my best.
I have probably a difficultybeing vulnerable, right, putting
your cards down.
Setting the tone saying I wantthis is not my best.
I have difficulty startingthose kinds of conversations.
If someone wants to talk aboutthem, then I can talk about them
, but it's the starting thatwill just drive me insane.

(17:40):
So someone like Eddie will runup to me and say rj, shitty or
whatever, something cute,something cute, hug me.

Speaker 1 (17:52):
And then I'll say you're dressed like a default
grand theft auto characterthat's fair yeah I feel like
this is actually something youwould say right, and I would
just walk by and be like well,here we are yeah are yeah, so
that's that's.

Speaker 2 (18:03):
Those are most of my interactions in the nutshell.

Speaker 1 (18:07):
Vulnerability.
It's one of my favorite things.
Yeah, why do you run from her?

Speaker 2 (18:11):
Well.

Speaker 1 (18:12):
What's your relationship with her?
I love using it.

Speaker 2 (18:16):
I love using it in a work situation.
When I do my show when Iinterview people.

Speaker 1 (18:22):
I think Whose vulnerability.

Speaker 2 (18:29):
Yours or theirs?
Uh, both, but I don't.
I'm not afraid to make myselfvulnerable there, because it's
funny, hmm.

Speaker 1 (18:32):
You know, it's okay if it's a joke.

Speaker 2 (18:35):
Yeah, well, yeah, there's a lot of things.
Well, the goal of the show forme is to be funny.
So a lot of things.
Sure, it's just my job.
I don't know, being beingvulnerable is a lot for me.
Yeah, I guess it's a lot foreveryone.
Um, although I used to be avery emotional child and I still

(18:56):
I'm think I'm a still anemotional person I just get if I
express it.

Speaker 1 (19:05):
I feel like if I say I love you, I've somehow signed
a binding contract that I cannotget out of how do you navigate
existence if vulnerability is soscary, but, like the work, your
art is so vulnerable, though,like everything you do is still

(19:26):
very vulnerable yeah, but likein a hands.

Speaker 2 (19:28):
Well, sunday mornings I have, I have coffee in my
underwear.
I mean, that's a littlevulnerable, right right, and I
like fielding uh comments and Ilike like this.
You asked if I wanted to knowwhat you wrote and I said no,
that's somewhat of avulnerability, you know, because
and I enjoy that, because I itdemands all of my attention.

Speaker 1 (19:51):
I was like because then the anxiety won't pick up
and start to think and follow upand create.

Speaker 2 (19:55):
Yes, yeah so when I do my show, or when I do a
stand-up or an improv show orwhatever, I have no option but
to completely focus on that.
It's a thing that demands allof my focus.

Speaker 1 (20:12):
Okay, what does acceptance mean to?

Speaker 2 (20:15):
you, Can you?
I like understanding, you know,and also I mean mean, if I'm
accepting of another person.

Speaker 1 (20:27):
You're saying what does acceptance mean to?

Speaker 2 (20:30):
you.
Oh my god, you know you can'tact like it's like a.
The answer is whatever you wantit to be, it's very like the
ending of a show okay what doesacceptance to other people mean
to you, then?
Acceptance of other people.

Speaker 1 (20:49):
With other people, like acceptance of you.
What does that mean to you?
What does that look like?

Speaker 2 (20:53):
Oh, my God, I have a.
Very Well, you're justrespecting people's boundaries.
I think that's really it.
No, you went on mute.
What are you doing?
Are you making notes?
No, this is not a psych session, I think it's.

(21:16):
It's listening, understandingand respecting people's
boundaries.
I think that's it.
It's like what works for you.
I have a certain way I need todo shit yeah, do you feel
accepted?
no, it depends, I mean, withcertain people.
Yes, um, I have a very out ofwhack, I guess, for most people

(21:36):
work-life balance.
So, yeah, it's crazy, yeah,it's fine.
I'm doing a lot, I wanted to doa lot for a very long time and
now it's happening and here I am.
Uh, this is what I need to doin order to be happy.
So there's people sacrifice.
There's people from the lifeside who understand that peop, I

(21:58):
have friends who are comediansand writers and they understand
it.
They've been through itthemselves.
And I have people who don'tunderstand that because they're
not from that.
Yeah well, they want somethingelse and that's fine.
That doesn't make them betteror worse than me, but yeah, and
I should, I could probably alsodo a better job of understanding

(22:19):
them to you know finding thenuance in between the struggles.
Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (22:27):
Do you find that acceptance and needing to be
chosen like that's somethingthat you navigate in one part of
your life, or is that just likein all aspects of your life?

Speaker 2 (22:40):
It's in all aspects of my life.
I and this is such a trivialparanoia when I leave a plane,
when I disembark a plane, Ialways feel like the flight
attendant does not like me asmuch as the person in front of

(23:01):
me.
Why?
Because they will often get agood goodbye, thanks for flying
with us, whatever.
And then I get like a realhalf-assed one, a real shit,
like have a nice day.
It was really like under thebreath and I'm like did I mean
nothing to you?
What did you get from theperson in front of me that you

(23:21):
didn't get from me today?

Speaker 1 (23:23):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (23:23):
So I guess that's something that the need to be
chosen feels like my default.
You know, guess that'ssomething that color the need to
be chosen, feels like mydefault, you know I would love
to give less of a.

Speaker 1 (23:40):
Where does your anxiety in?

Speaker 2 (23:41):
relation to that, like where do they collide?
Well, and then I become veryself-conscious and I go well,
what did I do?
That that one's veryretroactive, obviously, except
left.
And now I'm walking up the rampgoing.
Did I do, yeah, do something?
Is it because I just asked forwater?
It's because I didn't buyanything, too many fucking
waters.
You know, I should have done ahello, a real hello, you know,

(24:03):
um, but my, but my anxiety isoften forward thinking.
In any situation of, oh, evenif I have to go out with a
friend, or what are they goingto talk about?
What's going to happen?
Or if I email people, you knowI have different things on the

(24:24):
go.
So, like Monday morning, I'llemail like three different
people about three differentthings and I'll hear nothing
back in a reasonable amount oftime.
And my brain says, well,they've all had a meeting,
they've had a cross projectmeeting without you and they
decided not to email you back.
Cut you out.

Speaker 1 (24:42):
Yeah, of course Anxiety does that.
It's such a fun game of youshit talking yourself and then
spiraling and then being like,well, you should have figured
this out.
You're like, but I dug the holeand then covered myself.

Speaker 2 (24:57):
But I feel like this is the natural consequence of
having a good imagination.
Sure, the same way they can saywell, what do you want to do
interviewing this person and Icreate these things that I
believe in, and then they becomereality.
Yeah right, my brain will canalso do that in a bad way.

(25:19):
I've learned that nothing,nothing is good or bad.
Things are just things, andoften both duality duality, yeah
, but oh, and also it's wouldn'tbe triality.

Speaker 1 (25:35):
Sometimes they can be neutral well, okay, no, three
sums for you, sure, sure, keepit fun, keep it spicy yes, um,
and I also have not.

Speaker 2 (25:46):
I don't like, uh, when people tell me that they're
happy or that they're happypeople.

Speaker 1 (25:53):
What.

Speaker 2 (25:53):
I have a problem with that.

Speaker 1 (25:55):
Let's probably have that talk.
Why don't you like happiness?

Speaker 2 (25:58):
Because I feel like, not that I don't like happiness,
I don't like the idea thatpeople can be happy or be happy
people.
Why?
Because happiness means.

Speaker 1 (26:09):
Do you not believe in it?

Speaker 2 (26:10):
Well, no, I.
Why?
Because happiness, do you notbelieve in it?
Well, no, I don't.
Because happiness is astimulation.
I don't think it's a way ofbeing.
It makes no sense.
It's just the opposite of being.
And I understand people arenegative and whatever, but I
feel like it's just the oppositeend of that.
It's just as shallow in theother way.
So people that just try to behappy are like what?

Speaker 1 (26:39):
Even the phrase be happy I find it incorrect.
You did kind of like your bodywas like rejecting, even saying
you're like happiness be happygross, because it's just a
feeling.

Speaker 2 (26:46):
It's like saying I'm a hungry person.
It's like, no, sometimes you'rehungry and sometimes you're not
.

Speaker 1 (26:51):
Sometimes, you're thirsty.

Speaker 2 (26:52):
Sometimes you're thirsty and sometimes you're not
.
You can't be thirsty all thetime.
That makes no sense.
It's a feeling.

Speaker 1 (27:01):
Now I'm thinking I'm like, I am happy, though, and
you're like, are you?

Speaker 2 (27:05):
You're not, you're not, you can, you're not, you're
not, you can't be happy all thetime.
Oh, I didn't say I was happyall the time, no, but what I'm
saying people are like I'm ahappy person.
It's like fuck you, like no, oh, okay you know what?

Speaker 1 (27:17):
okay, let's reel it in, because I'm in agreeance,
yeah, and this is probably.
People are probably like thereit is, he got her, yeah, but no,
I don't think that that's arealistic state to be in.
No, it's kind of like a newrelationship, energy, yes, and
you're like oh my god, I loveyou so much, I can't wait.
Blah, blah.
And then you're year two.

Speaker 2 (27:36):
You're like I like you, yes, yes, and.
And people are attached so muchto the first feeling and they
define the first feeling as thething we need to have.
The same way, they would definehappiness in themselves as the
thing they need to have, thatwhen they suddenly don't, it's
like the end of the world.
And then they're just trying tokeep this fucking ball in the

(27:58):
air to stay happy.
Why, why?
First of all, why are weshutting out nice feeling?
Yes, but to do it all the timeis not like sex.

Speaker 1 (28:15):
It's like sex.
It's like eating.
It's like addiction.
Drugs, yes yeah.

Speaker 2 (28:17):
Right, chasing the oxy, yeah, but that's not good.
That's not good for the thosechemicals.
We don't, we're not supposed tohave those chemicals all the
time, or else we would have themall the time.

Speaker 1 (28:25):
So what's your advice for the happy people?

Speaker 2 (28:28):
First of all, there's other feelings out there.
I think I would say, though andI've learned this as someone
who would have highs and thenlows and be really upset with
the lows because I had the highsPeace is not a bad thing, peace
is great.
You can be a calm person,period.

(28:54):
I think that's pretty flat.
Are you calm?
I need to be.
I know you know what, in in thestress, in the stressful
environments, I am a calm person.
I don't feel like I add to it.
I'll give you that.

Speaker 1 (29:08):
I'll give you that.
I'll give you that.
But what does your anxiety looklike?
Like when you like, when youknow it's active, like how does
it show up?

Speaker 2 (29:15):
Physically it does not manifest, which is great,
and it's probably from beingable to perform.
A lot of times I'll do stand upor host something and and no
one can tell that I'm horriblynervous or that I didn't enjoy
it.
If something goes wrong andrarely can people tell Sure,

(29:36):
there's a burning inside.
Is it in your gut, it's in mygut and also in my chest?
It's like above my heart.
If I could just sort of locateit, that's where we hold it,
yeah, and there's just a feelingof light.
Lightness and not in a good wayof like you're not a real human

(29:57):
being, you're not firmlyplanted, you're not, like,
confident in what you're doingsounds like you're dissociating
a little bit probably yeah, yeah, that's probably probably what
that would.
Look at us throwing in psychwords I also have to go through.
You know, let's say I'm havinga business meeting or something.

(30:19):
I would really have to putmyself through a few worst case
scenarios to comfortably enterthat meeting.
Sure, yeah.
And then of course, unrealisticworst case scenarios which I'm
sure take a toll on my body.
They do yeah, absolutely,absolutely, because I was
actually just like here about itand and here, yeah, I like it I

(30:43):
mean to bring the shit that wasdye your hair, you that, what?
That artificial color blacklike I'm.
The funds look horriblehorrible I would judge you out
loud.
It came in in a commercial wayquite frankly, it's kind of cute
.

Speaker 1 (30:59):
I'm telling you I wish mine did, like the little
bang gray.
Yeah, can't have it all no, andyou chose question yes's going
to say green too, because we'retrying to bring in money
Awareness helpful or harmful?

Speaker 2 (31:14):
Very helpful, well, so it depends.
Obviously.
Think you need a healthy.
You can't if you have too much.
I'm hyper aware and sometimesthat will prevent me from
getting things done.
The less I know about certainthings sometimes, the better.

(31:35):
That would be very.
Yeah, sometimes it can be abarrier.

Speaker 1 (31:40):
I guess it's what you do with that awareness.
Sure, that was my next questionLike because you are someone
that is doing unlearning things.
That already tells me thatyou're like looking back and
being like maybe that wasn't forme.
And sometimes, when we go back,do you find that your awareness
brings any shame or guilt?
Yes, in what way?

Speaker 2 (32:02):
Oh well, I don't understand what you're saying.
Say it again, Rephrase this.

Speaker 1 (32:07):
Sure, I, sure can I, I have other words.
So when you are starting to dolike the reflection work yeah,
and you're.
You said you're like unlearningthings, right, which I think.
As a good human, we unlearn abunch of shit and so when you
are unlearning things, sometimesI look back and I'm like, oh
fuck, like I should have knownbetter, and I start to like
shame myself, oh, which thenadds to an anxiety spiral.

(32:28):
What does that look like foryou?

Speaker 2 (32:30):
So I am a judgmental person, I'm an observant person,
I'm an aware person, but then Ialso like to sort them into
good and bad, which is verywrong.

Speaker 1 (32:42):
I thought things weren't good and bad.

Speaker 2 (32:44):
Well, and that's why and it should stop it's not good
, uh at all.
Uh.
So what happens is I will dothat with myself, with my past,
and I'm, you know, anunreasonable past.
It's one thing to be upsetabout something you did last
week, but when we're going Ithink past 10 years, you know,

(33:07):
or real childhood shit, whereit's me learning stuff sure I'm
not kind to myself yeah reallyreally not?

Speaker 1 (33:18):
do you notice you being unkind to yourself more
often in certain situations,like certain times of the year,
like some people get triggeredto be like meaner?
Is it like work, projects?
Is it relationships?
Is it just like getting out offucking bed?
Like when are you the kindestand least kindest?

Speaker 2 (33:36):
Um well, uh, yeah, I mean I'm, I'm kind, I'm not kind
to myself in my work, which Ithink helps me do better work.
Certain times I have to.
I will write something and thenI have to look back and I do
have to edit my own work.
I don't know how you could dothat from a kind place.
Sometimes you have to makechoices, you know, in your work,

(34:01):
especially creatively.
If I write 10 pages of shit andI only need two pages, I really
can't.

Speaker 1 (34:07):
Kindness or honesty though.

Speaker 2 (34:10):
Um, I like to get to the point of editing where I'm
upset it hurts me to losesomething, and that's where I
know I've got, I'm gettingsomewhere good, I'm getting
somewhere tight where I go oh mygod, do I lose this, or do I
lose this?
And then I'm like, just whenI'm like a little second inch
about happiness, I go Okay, Ithink we've got something here.

(34:33):
Um, and I don't mind saying,and I'm also, I would say, just
as unkind to other people's work, but I wow, that's not true.
Sometimes I should communicateit more, and I don't.
I just feel it instead ofcommunicating it, which is
really bad you're just like thatshit and you continue on well
of like this should be 30seconds shorter.

(34:56):
Sure you know, but I also amprobably too kind to the person
that Canadian yeah in tellingthem that and I feel I feel
uncomfortable telling them that.
So then the thing goes out andit's, quite frankly, 30 seconds
too long.
Then they have to like back upfrom it.
Relationships, I'm too kind.
Uh, I will put other people'sfeelings above my own,

(35:20):
ultimately not in a good wayit's normally not in a good way.

Speaker 1 (35:24):
No, no, sacrifice yourself yeah, it doesn't.

Speaker 2 (35:27):
It doesn't result in, uh, me being honest with myself
, yeah, or with the other personyou know, and then you feel,
and you feel bad and you're alsolike, but I just wanted you to
be okay and I guess like me orjust not hate me, I don't know
well, I think that's.

Speaker 1 (35:44):
That's back to the whole conversation today needing
to be chosen and like using theother parts as like motivators
to like get through.
Do you talk back to your brainLike when you're in these
situations?

Speaker 2 (35:57):
Yeah, I mean, I go around in circles.

Speaker 1 (36:00):
Well, I heard the spiral, but, like in the, do you
talk to the?

Speaker 2 (36:03):
spiral.
I've been getting better at itof you're.
You are making this up.
This is not remotely rooted inreality at all.
This is based on what?
Because scenarios will reallyjust rob me of any joy and any.
I will be thinking about thingsthat I'm not dealing with yet

(36:26):
and I'm like it's very unfair tothink about what will happen
next week when I still have thisweek to deal with.
You know, I should put more ofmy effort on the dealing with
the things that are in front ofme, and I don't know if that's I
wouldn't considerprocrastination necessarily.

Speaker 1 (36:45):
No, I look at it more as like a distraction sometimes
.
Wouldn't that beprocrastination, not necessarily
a distraction?
I mean, procrastination is likeputting off of something.
Distraction is just likedoesn't have necessarily just a
direct intention, right.

Speaker 2 (36:59):
A lot of times.
I will very much not be in theroom.

Speaker 1 (37:05):
When did you start using humor as a cover up?

Speaker 2 (37:09):
Okay, First of all.
I don't know if it's humor as acover up.
I, okay, First of all.
I don't know if it's used as acover up.
As if anytime I'm funny, I mustbe covering something up.

Speaker 1 (37:26):
I also think a lot of honesty comes out In humor, yes
, but it's also not direct.

Speaker 2 (37:30):
No, it's's not direct , but I don't think you can be
direct about a lot of stuff.
Why?
Because it's hurtful to people.
Uh, it's a more digestible wayof communicating the truth
sometimes.
Um, I had a friend say to melast week oh my god, you look

(37:50):
fantastic.
Since I've whatever, I haven'tseen you in a month, you look
great.
And I think you look exactlythe same they look they do.
It was fine, it's fine, but itwas a wrong.

Speaker 1 (38:04):
It was like you know the humor of it is just a wrong
thing to say you don't say sure,but it's also true yeah, I
think we normalize a lot of likesugarcoating and that's why a
lot of people can't handleactual conversations like we
fuck ourselves.

Speaker 2 (38:18):
Yes, and communication, because we're
like yeah yes, so it's a goodoften seems like a good way to
get the truth out.
Sure, as, as opposed todistracting from the truth, it's
like what if I put it in alittle package and give it to
you?

Speaker 1 (38:37):
I used to use humor as a get back, like growing up
in my family, the only power Ihad was sarcasm, right, and so
it was like my tongue is soquick now?
Yeah, because I it for survival.
Did you ever use it forsurvival?

Speaker 2 (38:53):
This certain side of the family my grandmother, my
mother, and then that whole side, and then anyone outside of
that had difficulty with howbrutal it was.

(39:18):
It was quite brutal.
I guess there's no other.
And I don't feel that way, youknow, because I was a part of it
, and then that's how Icommunicate with people.
I love because I was a part ofit, and then that's how I
communicate with people.
I love, yeah, um, but can bevery, very mean, especially when

(39:39):
you have enough, you know,bring enough girlfriends to meet
your family, and then itsuddenly doesn't work out.

Speaker 1 (39:44):
you realize like, oh, maybe this is not for everybody
is that a part of what you'reunlearning.

Speaker 2 (39:48):
Yeah, well it's.
It's understanding otherpeople's families and oh, you
live with.
You know, for me my family wasthe only way to live.
Why wouldn't you want to livewith my family?
Like your family's fuckingboring, like you know.
Obviously you know, as you getolder, you understand it's not
the right way to think, probably, and you also think, you know

(40:09):
maybe there's older.
You understand this is not theright way to think.

Speaker 1 (40:10):
probably, I don't know.

Speaker 2 (40:10):
You also think, you know, maybe there's nothing
wrong with a boring family.

Speaker 1 (40:16):
I think there's honestly something true to that.
Like the people that I like.
Look at, my friends are like ohyeah, no, we have like these
family dinners and gatheringsand I'm like what?
Yeah, no, we don't.
Why Is that like a thing thatpeople do?
It seems nice.

Speaker 2 (40:34):
Yeah, you don't get.
You don't get together withanybody.

Speaker 1 (40:37):
No, we do, but it's like we're not like sitting down
for thanksgiving it's likewe're at the house and
everyone's in their own corner.
Yeah, my cousins are taking awalk right.
Uh, you know my mom's bitchingin the kitchen like it's not,
like it doesn't feel communal ohyeah, I'm, I'm.
I would say I'm, I'm friendswith my family oh, I would say

(40:59):
they want to be friends with me.

Speaker 2 (41:01):
But it's too late, right?
I like I would say almostacross all ages, we're like,
really friends.
So it does feel like you'rehanging out as opposed to and
I've gone to friendsthanksgivings or christmases and
you're like jesus uh, thisfeels a lot more fun and people
will also say that my family isfun for that.

(41:22):
For that reason, they'reenjoyable to be around and if
you can handle that kind ofthing, so you wear a lot of hats
.

Speaker 1 (41:31):
Yes, a lot of them.

Speaker 2 (41:33):
So many hats yeah, but I also feel like it's just,
it's all the same shit, just indifferent directions.

Speaker 1 (41:40):
I will agree, but sometimes you put a little extra
spin on the things and there'sso much shit that you do that
people don't even know.
It's you, no, which?

Speaker 2 (41:49):
I think is and they don't need to, why not?
Some jobs don't need credit,don't need credit, and some jobs
are only good if people can'ttell that you're doing them.

Speaker 1 (42:17):
So how do you?

Speaker 2 (42:17):
get accepted and get chosen for the cool things.
If people don't know you'redoing them, uh well, that's why
I do many things, I mean I havemy front facing stuff.
Sure, very clearly, this is me,this is all me.
Nobody gives me notes like, hey, it's a good example.
People rarely give me notes onanything, it's just I get 10
minutes with the person andbasically whatever.
When I ask them, I get to askthem, which is great.

(42:37):
It's always a time, it's a time.
And then when I do coffee andunderwear, that's me Sunday
mornings in my underwear, alonefor an hour Just reading
comments and talking back tocomments.
That's very like, hey, this isme.
And then there's other things.
When you, I don't know, workingwith people on characters and
developing stuff, I'm helpingthem own something.

(43:01):
So me coming out and takingcredit is like ludicrous to me.
And if you can see that I, ifyou can see me in it, then I
feel like I've not done a goodjob.
Nor do I need the credit.
I mean I, I, you know, let thefront facing people own the
stuff.

(43:21):
I always.
It's very frustrating to mewhen, like I do, I do work, or
I'm handed a script orsomething's like sort of
half-assed and how it's producedand the, the production, the
people behind the scenes don'tcare and it's like buddy, it's
my fucking name and my fuckingface.
So I eat shit if it's bad, evenif it's not my fault absolutely

(43:44):
so by that same token, I feellike those, the people on camera
, should be getting, uh, therewards for that work fair
enough.

Speaker 1 (43:52):
How do you balance it all like?
Do you have a system?

Speaker 2 (43:55):
I don't you don't.

Speaker 1 (43:56):
I know you didn't.
I just wanted to ask you don'tdo a very good.

Speaker 2 (43:59):
I will also say I mean, I have wanted to do so
many things for so long and thenthey've all happened, not at
once, but they are all on the go, different things and, like my
rest from my main work isworking on my other work, and I
go oh, it's so refreshing tostop writing this and start

(44:21):
writing this, but I also am very.
You know, this is not aguaranteed line of work at all.
The window is only open for acertain amount of time and I've
always prioritized that andthat's how I'm wired, that's how
I feel comfortable.
The idea that I would take aweek off is ridiculous.

(44:43):
You need three, I know.
But to do what?
But I feel like that would bevery hard for me.

Speaker 1 (44:50):
Sure, I mean you need the first week to learn how to
breathe and not pick up yourphone and do stuff yes.
Then the second week to tellyourself no, it's okay.

Speaker 2 (44:57):
Then the third week to actually enjoy a little bit
of time right, right, I, I, Ijust don't see that as being
possible right now.
I've not done enough work ormade enough money to be like.
You know, I always feel likeI'm kind of drowning not not
quite, my lungs aren't fillingup, but I'm not quite being

(45:18):
saved.
You know, it always gets me tolike the next, the next one you
know what I mean.
Like every so I do haze everySunday and then they come out
and I go, that's great.
And then the next one begins.
You know, the worry of the nextone begins.
It's just like another train Ihop on which is you know

(45:38):
whatever.
So I guess I can't get off thattrain it's like you're
continuously chasing the high.

Speaker 1 (45:43):
Is it like your drug?

Speaker 2 (45:45):
yes, but sometimes I don't even know if it's a high.
It's like this.
The low is so bad that I'm justbecause sometimes, like
especially when I read commentsand on I would say, most of my
work, I read all the comments.
Oh oh, oh, really, really allthe comments, Reddit included,

(46:08):
which, thank God, it seemspositive, Like you should it.
Yeah, well, whatever, okay, thenegative comment.
So this is me at neutral.
You know the negative commentswill bring me way down, but a
positive comment will only justkeep me at neutral, of course.
Yeah, at no point am Iexperiencing the high.

(46:29):
That's not.
That's not true.
Some people will compliment meon my work.
They do.
A lot of people I'm saying achosen few people will
compliment me on something and Iwill feel great about it.
Who, um, people, people where Ifeel like you have to earn the

(46:52):
compliment.
You have to work very hard.
A lot of wrestlers are not, uh,very free with their compliment
giving you know, which is fine.
Who else?
I even, even even my parents, Idon't really, oh, that was good
.
Or they have a.

(47:12):
I think not that they overcompliment me, but you know,
yeah, oh, that was.
I'm trying to think of like, oh, that was really good.
I like getting messages frompeople who I don't really know.
Or there's people who I thinkare like cool, ben mankiewicz
being one of those people whothat's really insulting and as

(47:34):
someone who, who works for awarner discovery affiliated
company.
You're going to be ashamed ofyourself.

Speaker 1 (47:40):
I'm kidding.
No, I do, that's nice.

Speaker 2 (47:45):
I was friends with Paul Rubens for like 15 years.

Speaker 1 (47:48):
We had that conversation because one of my
close friends was also reallyclose with him Anytime.

Speaker 2 (47:55):
He said something about my work was just like
something that I would cling toand carry with me.
So when I did get I I'm fairlycriticized or did a bad job, I
would go you're like got thislook in my pocket and go, but he
said, he said I was good yeah,yeah.

Speaker 1 (48:14):
Do you ever make time to celebrate yourself?

Speaker 2 (48:18):
not really celebrate myself.
Yes, meaning what?

Speaker 1 (48:24):
like.
Repeating it back doesn't makeit a thing, so, but give me an
example of that.
Yeah, what do you like?
Take yourself out for a treat?
Do you actually say you fuckingdid it?
Do you sit with yourself?
Do you actually spend time init?
Do you buy yourself a littlesomething, do you?

Speaker 2 (48:40):
yes, although I feel like that easier to do on
collaborative projects, why Ifeel like I'm kinder to other
people than I am with myself.
So, including myself in thegroup, I think it is multiple
times we've done a good job onsomething and I'm like let's go
to dinner.
I'm taking everyone to dinnerBecause I want to celebrate them

(49:03):
and the work we did together.
Rarely do I go you did a goodjob.
Go do something nice foryourself.

Speaker 1 (49:10):
When's the last thing you did nice for yourself?

Speaker 2 (49:12):
Well, I was just in Omaha and I walked around there
was these old toy stores.
I don't know if that was nicein terms of like treating, but I
didn't buy anything.
I should have fucking boughtthat's okay.

Speaker 1 (49:25):
You went for the experience.

Speaker 2 (49:26):
I went for the experience.
I loved not speaking to anyone.
I do love that too.
It was amazing.
And then you know, the next dayat work you're ready to speak
to people.

Speaker 1 (49:37):
Yeah who knew, because there's a lot of talking
then yeah it was nice, not well, actually, this is a bizarre.

Speaker 2 (49:46):
You know, I I went to this toy store and I like got
back to like going to museums, Ilike that.
Nobody knows who I am.
I'm never going to come backhere again.
I feel free to be myselfbecause I'm not being judged.
Uh, meanwhile I was in thewrestling section and I did some
digging and and my actionfigure is there.
I did see that and then I gowell, now what do I do?

(50:09):
It's like I had to walk aroundwith it.
Well, sometimes they do thisthing and this is this thing now
where they will buy the actionfigure.
So, like I think anthony bowensdid it, he saw his action
figure in target and he boughtit and signed it and then put it
back and tweeted out hey, thisis this target here.
If you know first person tofind it, it's yours.

Speaker 1 (50:31):
I already bought it, it's my gift did you leave the
receipt or something, becausethey're going to think that's
theft?

Speaker 2 (50:35):
right.
Well, they'll scan it and showthe tweet.
Maybe I don't know um it's agood way to get someone arrested
.
It is a fun prank, anthony.
Um you're right, is everythingokay?
Um?

Speaker 1 (50:49):
yeah, someone rang my doorbell and I was like, oh, do
I do something?

Speaker 2 (50:52):
and then I was like, do I sign it?
I don't have a sharpie.
And then I was like, do I go tothe front desk and say, do you
have a sharpie?
This is me.

Speaker 1 (51:03):
And then I thought this is insane, this would be
ridiculous how long did youstand there in this oh cycle of
10 minutes, 10 minutes, okaysure, yeah, so, and it was nice
being on the shelf, yeah youknow being what'd you do.

Speaker 2 (51:19):
I walked away.
He just left.
I said I can't, I can't botherwith it because the the worst
part of it would be talking tothe cashier.
To me that was the deterrentthat be tweeting about it.
You know, fielding thosecomments from people, whatever,
no big deal.
I I say the worst things topeople online all the time.

(51:42):
Speaking to the cashier waslike insurmountable odds.
I have to talk to someone.
That's not happening.
Now I got to add extra layer.
Yeah, I'm out.
No, the whole thing.
If the waiter fucks up my food,you will get no feedback from
me.
I just don't say anything.
Having to do that conversationis like I'll eat whatever piece

(52:02):
of shit you put down in front ofme, just so I don't have to do
that is it because you you don'twant to talk to them or you
don't want to like shake thetable?
yeah, I don't want to shake thetable.
I'm really big on like.
I'm really big on like, like,and maybe it's it's a reaction
to pro wrestling being so legacyfocused.

(52:23):
Is that like?

Speaker 1 (52:25):
all this.
You don't want to end up on adark side of the ring?

Speaker 2 (52:27):
no, is that, like all this shit's going to be
forgotten about?
The same way, dark side of thering, whether it's good or bad,
it's going to be forgotten about.
So, let me, let me, make thesmallest footprint possible.

Speaker 1 (52:44):
Hmm, you know do you think about your legacy?

Speaker 2 (52:49):
Yes, but I think about it in the very short term
and I also think beinginterested in old things helps
me be rational about that haveyou always been an old man?
You said you've been interestedin quite some time it's my
grandmother's fault to to put onthat music and those tv shows
and movies that were old thenwise, what's?

Speaker 1 (53:13):
how old are you in spirit?

Speaker 2 (53:16):
culturally, we've pinpointed it to like 67, 68
okay but even even then I mean,and that was the base.
And then you push yourselffurther.
Where I go, who?
I have like three possiblepeople in my phone who would
know shit I want to talk aboutsometimes, right, so you're like
, well, what do I do here?

(53:37):
But it gives me perspective,especially with like old show
businesses like these peoplehave completely forgotten about.
You know, I'm, I feel likesometimes the only person on
earth who knows any of thatstuff and that helps me and I go
.
One day that will be, and Ifeel like it would happen at an
even more rapid of a pace for menow.

(53:59):
There's so much shit out there,you know.

Speaker 1 (54:03):
You're such a unique human and I enjoy talking to you
for many reasons, because I'malso not the nicest and I like
to live in reality and be likethis is bullshit and get to the
point.
It keeps it, keeps it fun.
But something that's alwaysbeen really important to me.
I was driving the other day, alittle elevated and I was
thinking how important communityis for me yeah and like having

(54:23):
people, how important iscommunity for you?
Like do you care?
Like, do you have a crew?
I've got a few crews communityagain.

Speaker 2 (54:32):
Like everything, community can be very good,
community can be.
Community can be very bad.
Sure, right, it's just a bunchof people who think something
similar, really so sure, but Ithink there's support that like
a good one.

Speaker 1 (54:47):
Yeah, there's similar views.
And also, if you need something, do you have people you can
call?
Do you got like a list?

Speaker 2 (54:54):
yeah, yes, yes, yes, I have, I would say, a small
circle of friends who I feellike I can really rely on and
people that I don't have tonecessarily spend time with all
the time.
Sure, but there's alsocommunities like I'm not big on
it.
I never felt like I don't knowidentifying as a wrestler.

(55:15):
When I was wrestling Me in thelocker room one of the boys,
that shit was like weird to me.
That was like a turnoff.
I don't know why I don't likeidentifying myself as things.

Speaker 1 (55:27):
Then why wrestling?
How did you?
We're going to flip it andreverse it.
How did we get to wrestlingwith all of these?
I mean, honestly, wrestlingkind of combines all the things.
It's a show, it's a performance, it's comedy, it's Well, it is.

Speaker 2 (55:42):
My old line is that it's just, it's the Muppet show,
it's the violent Muppet showand it is.
As a kid there was.
I loved wrestling and I lovedthe Muppets, so you also.
You can't.
You can't become a Muppet.
You can become a wrestler.
I can't be Sam the Eagle.
I would have to be a puppet.

(56:02):
I would have to fucking.
You know what I mean.
I got to deal with lifelessfelt and production and whatever
, but I could become a wrestler.
So it was this interestingfantasy world to me.
The performances are fun.
I feel like all wrestling isrooted in comedy.
Many wrestlers don't likehaving this conversation because

(56:25):
they feel humiliated by comedyand they feel degraded by comedy
.
It's probably because theydon't understand it, but you
know you're falling down.
Most of wrestling is fallingdown.
How is that not like the rootof comedy through history?

Speaker 1 (56:40):
yeah, my friends were like it's so camp.
Oh my god, I didn't knowwrestling was so camp.
This is wild.
I'm like yeah, well, don't tellthem that.
In the back right.

Speaker 2 (56:48):
But well, I I I've gotten into arguments and and
because someone, a wrestler,called, I had this discussion
today again and somebody saidthat the stuff I do is campy.
I said, no, all of this iscampy and the people who don't
realize it and think it'sserious are actually more campy

(57:08):
than the people who are awarethat it's campy you're like,
that's when it's working yeah,and the fact that you think the
shit you're doing is like youidentify, you're not aware of
the campiness is the best.
It's somehow so much better.
Um, yeah, so I I find a realparallel between wrestling and
comedy, and there's timing there, I mean, there's physical,

(57:31):
there's an a.
If comedy is inadequacy, whichit it seems to be to, to me at
least, the idea that you'veeither made it, you've tried to
make a situation better, butyou've either kept it the same,
you've made it worse.
Um, every wrestling match hasan inadequate person at the end
of it, at least one.
There's winners and losers.

(57:54):
You lost right and you have tolose in front of a bunch of
people and you really have toeat a loss.
The same way that in I don'tknow a comedy or America's
Funniest Home Videos, this guygets hit in the balls for the
world to see.

Speaker 1 (58:10):
Yeah.
And you don't have to laughevery time.

Speaker 2 (58:13):
Right, and I also think, but I don't.
I always wonder why people areso adverse to identifying as
being funny I think it's alsoattached to vulnerability.

Speaker 1 (58:27):
You know, like being in the back and at wrestling
show, it's very humbling.
You're like, oh, it's allregular ass people everybody's
back.
You're all anxious and in theirheads like it's, it's all
pretend and I think people asyou're saying, it's like this is
not, we're not doctors, this isnot like science.
We are entertaining and maybehelping people's brains take a

(58:47):
break.

Speaker 2 (58:48):
Yeah, and most of the time we're entertaining, we're
entertaining people and we we'renot even sure why what we're
doing is entertaining, and mostof the time, the people who are
watching it don't even know whywhat we're doing is entertaining
, and most of the time, thepeople who are watching it don't
even know why it's entertainingeither and then, and probably
it's because it's very sort ofprimal and there's a community

(59:11):
aspect to being a wrestling fan,there's something obviously the
the magic in 10,000 peoplereacting together in a way that
one person going woo, it's notthe same.
you know, there's something niceabout that.
Yeah, I feel like to wonder whyit's entertaining to people is
to get to a death that they'reuncomfortable with.

(59:35):
And then, you know, you pointout the male intimacy and I love
that part.

Speaker 1 (59:40):
I well.

Speaker 2 (59:41):
I love being like it's so gay to not think this is
gay.
It's so gay, Right, it's so gay.
The gayest people are thepeople who are like no, this
isn't gay, You're like come on.

Speaker 1 (59:54):
You're like.
I just feel like it's PrideMonth.
This is very fitting.

Speaker 2 (01:00:00):
I will also say, and one of the main challenges I
feel wrestling has in growing asa business is not properly
branding itself to any othersexuality.

Speaker 1 (01:00:17):
You know what's so funny?
We had a show in LA recently,so I just got tickets for my
friends and my friends were likethis is the gayest thing.
They need to promote better,because the queers would go up
for this.

Speaker 2 (01:00:30):
Well, what?
What used to hurt me?
And I'm in Toronto, so youwould get, like I would say,
fairly progressive people, andbut wrestling is very like lift
up a rock and you will.
They will always be like aredneck at a wrestling show, no
matter what.
Uh, you could be in france andyou'll just get and like, wow, I
didn't know, you did it hereyeah.
So a lot of of gay friends.

(01:00:51):
We did not want to come to theshows because they were they,
they love to watch it.
They would never come to a showbecause they found the
community so unfriendly to gaypeople and that's bad.
I mean it's bad morally.
It's also bad in a businesssense.
They're throwing money at dragqueens and we're bleeding and

(01:01:14):
they're like, I don't know,freaking Queers and women.
Yeah, is it that?

Speaker 1 (01:01:21):
Yeah, because we buy things and we buy merch Right
and I'm a queer woman RightDouble down.

Speaker 2 (01:01:28):
You know, most straight male wrestling fans
that I've experienced have theirmoney in like Ziploc bags.

Speaker 1 (01:01:36):
And I'm like so.

Speaker 2 (01:01:36):
But even from a financial standpoint, which is,
you know, when I, when I talk topeople who can promote things
in a business sense, I'm like it, just it makes business sense.

Speaker 1 (01:01:47):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:01:48):
There's a bunch of people out there who could be
fans and they're not.
What are we doing?

Speaker 1 (01:01:55):
We have like two more questions because we've been
chatting.
We, yeah, I'm going to ask them, you're going to answer them.
What's anxiety holding you backfrom right now?

Speaker 2 (01:02:04):
Oh, so, much Often from relaxing, from experiencing
joy, from having importantconversations or difficult
conversations, wanting to waitto the right moment.
A lot of conversations there isno right moment.

(01:02:26):
Um, you know, it's the beforethe conversation is so dreadful,
and then after the conversationso much better.
But my body won't let me getthere.
You know, I just gotta wait, Ihave to wait it out.
Uh, confronting people,communicating my needs, that's

(01:02:46):
pretty all across the board.
Yeah, just saying I want this,I don't want this is like I've
often made a huge mess of mylife.
Just not saying this is what Iwant and I don't want this, and
that's it.
It shouldn't make me a badperson, but I guess that's my

(01:03:06):
fear.

Speaker 1 (01:03:09):
That's the not being chosen or not being seen as this
type of person role.

Speaker 2 (01:03:14):
Yes, I mean, I just want to be chosen.
I guess I don't worry aboutwhat type of person I am.
I want to hug you.
I guess I don't worry aboutwhat type of person I am.

Speaker 1 (01:03:23):
Oh, you know well once.
Oh, and throw water balloonsfor fun.

Speaker 2 (01:03:25):
What Water balloons?
Yeah, hug.
And then come on, what are wedoing?
Dangerous, the bed for thebirds.
What are we doing?
You want to hurt them.
I'm not picking them up, Idon't want to purchase.
Well, now you're literally that.
That's another thing where I'mlike I don't want to have a
water balloon fight with youbecause I don't want to pick
them up.
Afterwards I always see thenon-joy aspect of it.

Speaker 1 (01:03:48):
You can't just sit in the thing.

Speaker 2 (01:03:52):
No, I can't.
The part that's joyful neveroutweighs the non-joyful part.

Speaker 1 (01:03:58):
When was the last time it did?

Speaker 2 (01:03:59):
Ever.
No, not ever.
But I'm saying you say waterballoon fight, my mind goes to
someone has to clean this up.

Speaker 1 (01:04:06):
No, it's going to litter, then I'm going to be wet
, and then all these things.

Speaker 2 (01:04:09):
Right, which is a fun thing to explore when I'm
performing.

Speaker 1 (01:04:15):
Which is coming.
You have a performance coming.

Speaker 2 (01:04:18):
I have a performance coming, which is coming.
You have a performance coming,I have a performance coming, but
even on, you know, hey, whensomebody knocks over my sign,
it's nice to deal with thosesort of instincts while there's
a camera present.

Speaker 1 (01:04:29):
So those are the things.
Anxiety is holding you back.
What are things that arecurrently being motivated by
anxiety for you?

Speaker 2 (01:04:36):
I turn out so much work in a day.
I really do.
The writing is a lot Scriptsfor a bunch of shit.
I'm on top of stuff so muchthat when I send stuff to people
I go you don't have to messageme back right now.
This is for a week from now.

(01:04:57):
It may happen, it may not.
I'm like I need to write thisright now to just get out of the
way.
Don't even answer me, because Idon't want you to have any
pressure.
Um, there's stuff like that, uh,being able to uh to work on
multiple projects at the sametime and and oh, it's like, oh,
I really am getting a lot ofstuff done in a day and I'm

(01:05:19):
thinking about other stuff ontop of it.
So, yeah, that's usually whatit's helping me.
Do I mean be prepared like,pack my bag, make sure I have my
shit to get like I travel?
Well, I think that's good.
I mean that's you know mygrandmother and my mother saying
make sure you have your wallet,make sure you have your keys,

(01:05:39):
make sure you have your keys,make sure you have your coat.
This, I feel like, says it in anutshell.
Talk about not seeing the joyin it.
My cousin and I went toWrestleMania 20 in Madison
Square Garden, which was just adream, a total dream.
Wrestlemania, madison SquareGarden, I don't know.
My dad got me tickets and shit.
This is the greatest.

(01:05:59):
My cousin, he was a shoeshopper, this is great.
And my grandmother said makesure when you stand up to cheer,
that you feel behind you foryour jacket, because people like
to steal jackets.

(01:06:20):
When people stand up to cheer,like there's some guy in the
back going, I have them all nowReally saying that your highest
moment of enjoying this thingshe's like but wait, someone
will steal and it's like.
It's almost like you would be afool to celebrate Because

(01:06:41):
people will take advantage ofthat.
Why she ended up with thatmindset, I don't know, but she
certainly passed it along to mebut she definitely passed that
down I've also experienced a lotof people who you know
celebrities or people in work, Imean, obviously wrestling like
there's a shelf life and and Iguess with comedy to who got so

(01:07:01):
big or got so carried away withshit that they didn't realize
when it was over and then theycouldn't change.
So I feel like to celebrate isto really sometimes take my
finger off the pulse and I maymiss something.
You know, and I did that before.
I mean, I was on a nickelodeonshow, it's true, and I went.

(01:07:25):
Well, this is it.
Pack up my bags, you know we'rehitting the big.
It's not gonna get any biggerthan this.
And then it was like you do itfor a summer and you're like
can't wait for it to come out.
And it comes out and it's like,all right, it's, it's a shot
and it did well, I mean, theydid another season, it's in 100
countries, but relative to whatyou thought it was.

(01:07:47):
And then you're like maybe Ishould not get excited about
anything Because that was fuckedup.

Speaker 1 (01:07:53):
Do you think you'll ever get to a place where you'll
get to just?

Speaker 2 (01:07:56):
exist.

Speaker 1 (01:07:58):
Yeah.
I feel, like time will grind mymind and body down.

Speaker 2 (01:08:03):
Oh so, like when you're like unable to operate
yeah, well unable to operate orjust forced to, I don't know do
other things or do them in acertain way.
I don't, I don't know.
And then I also wonder aboutlike, oh my god, will we all
fucking be 70 and have ouryoutube?
Is there an age where thatstops?

(01:08:26):
Or are we taking it all with us?
You know, I've done coffee andunderwear for like five years
now, so, and I did not.
And then I go what the fuck?
Why are we?
Why are we doing this?
I mean I certainly I consumeenough old people, media that

(01:08:46):
you know old people have podcast.
It's not like you have to 25 tohave a podcast.
So, as you all age, I mean thisis where we're gonna be and I'm
like crazy.
It feels like such a youngthing to me.
And then then I also thinkabout like I don't know people
like Eminem who put out thatmusic video and I thought, gee,
aren't you a little.

Speaker 1 (01:09:07):
Aren't you a little old to?

Speaker 2 (01:09:08):
just make a music video.

Speaker 1 (01:09:11):
You're aging people's music video.

Speaker 2 (01:09:13):
Well, at some point are you just like let me just
put out an album, what am Idoing?
That I I mean, and it wasreceived mixed, you know.
And then there are people likeit's like a him and like a bill
maher will be like talking aboutbeing cancelled.
I'm like, oh, come on, how doyou not realize that that's like
a death sentence in your work,like what are you not paying

(01:09:36):
attention to?
And that's when I get worriedand I go if it happens to them,
if that happens to eminem areyou not paying attention to, and
that's when I get worried and Igo if it happens to them, if
that shit happens to eminem?

Speaker 1 (01:09:43):
are you worried about getting canceled?
No okay, it's also not real.

Speaker 2 (01:09:49):
That's not true, because I it's not you know what
go ahead.

Speaker 1 (01:09:52):
Go ahead, because I go, I'm going, oh yeah I will
say it is true, if you can getcancelled faster, if you are a
woman or someone of color okay,I would say fatty arbuckle.

Speaker 2 (01:10:08):
Do you know?
Do you know who fanny arbuckleis?
No, I know fatty coo fattyarbuckle old actor silent film.
You gotta look it up, it's fun,I will.
But there was a party, a womandied at the party.
Oh well, they, they put him ontrial, I think four times and he
was acquitted all four timesand they poured through all all

(01:10:30):
the evidence and like the commonconsensus now is that he was
completely innocent.
She died to some condition shehad and he's probably dead now
right, oh my god, he would belike 300 years old, um, but he
was like fucking done and had tolike try to work under a
different name and so blah, blah, blah, and it's like a learning
history, I will say, helps meput stuff like well, this cancel

(01:10:54):
culture now into perspective,really, and it's like you guys
just don't know, you're you know, I had someone tell me that
eminem was the first celebrityto be canceled.
I'm like, let me, here is thisbook you're like I'm a guy first
of all named fat.
To cancel someone named fatty isso cruel.
He's already done you thedecency of letting you call him

(01:11:15):
fatty, and now he's incrediblymean.
But no, am I worried aboutcancel culture?
No, I don't know.
I'm not worried about.
I'm motivated by I I don't likewell, because it's anxiety.
I don't like the idea that youcan't say anything anymore, that
it's so wrong, and it bothersme that in a lot of my, a lot of

(01:11:37):
my work is like let's just befunny, but sometimes there will
be an ulterior motive to go.
How can I write a joke abouttrans people or autism and you
did some good things, thank youand have it be understood in a
good way.

(01:11:58):
Like I'm of the belief that youcan't, you should not ban any
word.
Just, I'm just speaking inrules.
Obviously there's a lot ofwords you shouldn't say.
I was like To do a blanketstatement like that.
Forever is wrong to me, right,there's certain words I can't
say in this time, right now, buttheoretically is there a well,

(01:12:20):
I'm just sure, sure,theoretically will there be.
You know, is it potentially?
Is there a time and a placewhere I could say that word?
I would like to say, yes, I'mnot going to bother finding out
what it is, it's not, it's notworth my time, but I really
believe that and and so I hatepeople complaining about you

(01:12:40):
can't say anything anymore.
And then I made all these jokeson what I would say is a fairly
large platform for a very bigpublic company, and they were
understood very well andsometimes celebrated Not that I
need them to be celebrated, butmy point being it's it's your

(01:13:02):
perspective on them and peoplewould understand them.
And I also think I mean someonewho has anxiety and can joke
about it, and then people reachout to me.
The same way, I mean making ajoke about autism or or
transsexual, and then peoplereach out and enjoy it and
they're happy to be seen I meanto be joked about in a good way

(01:13:22):
is being recognized.
It's not in a mocking way, youknow you disagree?

Speaker 1 (01:13:31):
no, no, I don't.
I'm actually really into thisright now.
Do you think that your work ischanging the world or adding to
it?

Speaker 2 (01:13:40):
uh, changing, no, releasing a little bit of ar in
a good way, yeah, okay, I don'tthink that's not my never my
goal, because there are so manyfactors beyond my control, and

(01:14:02):
that also is what happens whenyou work for a company.
You have to put stuff out there.
You've got to deal with amillion other things.
You have to deal withalgorithms that you didn't write
.
I can only control my work tobe a certain level of good, yeah
, and even then I rarely reachthat mark.
But that's the goal, you know.

(01:14:24):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:14:26):
When people tell you I keep saying this one last
question, but I got some morewhen people tell you the depth.
There's also a wall, but that'sfine, I'll climb it another day
.
I'm not coming back.
When people tell you you'recoming back, when people tell
you that your work has changedtheir life or has added to it

(01:14:48):
how does that land for you?

Speaker 2 (01:14:54):
or has added to it.
Yes, how does that land for you?
Um, I understand it becausethere have been some, some, I
would say, meaningless worksthat have brought me joy of, not
of mine, of other people thatmean something to me, and I will
go watch very obscure sketchesor concerts or whatever they are
, and just really really enjoythem.
It's.
But at no point do I walkaround going.

(01:15:15):
I'm changing people's lives.
That's wrong.
I also am selfish and, I guess,narcissistic, in the sense that
if this is not funny for me, Idon't really care.
If I'm doing it, saying thisisn't funny for me but somebody

(01:15:36):
else will enjoy it, that makesme sick to my stomach.
That is a repulsion I can'teven explain to you to to phone
it into that degree and go.
They'll find it, put the pie inthe face.
They'll find that funny thatI've just, and then I go.
What am I doing?
And then that makes me go.
So what am I doing here?
I'm?
I'm making something for myselfreally.

(01:15:58):
So the fact that anyone elseenjoys it is a surprise and, uh,
you know, a bonus, and ofcourse, I've made the mistake of
of trying to make it my job,and then you have to deal with
that aspect of it and do it in acertain way where I can
actually make money and I caneat.
But food.

(01:16:18):
We need that yeah I, yeah, Ithink about like my brother.
Sometimes I have a brotherwho's very funny and but he's
not involved in any sort ofentertainment and I just, oh, he
can just be funny and he didn'thave to do anything with, oh,
he can just be funny and hedidn't have to do anything with
it.
Yeah, he could just be like afunny person in life.
Oh, I look at it and go huh.

Speaker 1 (01:16:40):
That was an option, yeah.
But it was an option, and youchose this one.

Speaker 2 (01:16:44):
Yeah, I'm very, very, I guess, protective of it and
stubborn about it and I go no,this is what I want to, and
that's probably part of why I'mnot very kind to my work,
because I want to make sure it'ssomething that I would enjoy.
Does that help at all In yourself-reflections?

Speaker 1 (01:17:03):
No, it's not done.
It's not done.

Speaker 2 (01:17:05):
It did not help.
I have the time.

Speaker 1 (01:17:08):
In your self-reflections.
Do you ever go?
I actually am pretty funny toother people and that's okay I
don't go, that's okay.

Speaker 2 (01:17:24):
What do you go?
Well, I'm saying, oh, that wasfunny, that was okay, I mean so.
So hay, for example, has done Idon't know 102 episodes now,
yeah, which is a tremendousamount for me, like.
So it's in the sense that Ididn't realize it's a lot, but
it's something where I was likeI can't believe I did that many
yeah, I can't believe.

(01:17:45):
Like I put my head down and didthe work and thought, gee, maybe
we'll get 10 episodes if we'relucky.
And and here we are, and we'rehave yet to also slow down and
it gets harder and harder.
Get more eyes as it goes.
Get more eyes, but you alsohave to deal with like you want
to still keep it fresh and youknow evolve what the show is and

(01:18:08):
the stuff I'm asking and I'minterested in, so that you know
evolve what the show is and thestuff I'm asking and I'm
interested in.
Um, so that makes me go, okay,well, I'm, it's not even I don't
go, I'm funny.
I look back on stuff and I go,well I'm, I must be according to
it's very like, according tothis, like I don't personalize
it, you know, although I I willalso say and I do enjoy, like

(01:18:29):
somebody came up to me incatering, which is a very common
thing, I'm like a real, likeinsult salesman.
And a guy came up to me and saidhey, I need your help.
I got to do a thing withwhoever it was.
I need some shit to say aboutthem.
Some shit to say about them andlike that's where me being

(01:18:56):
critical and hard and judgmentaland all those horrible things
immediately become useful.
They say, oh, what about this,what about this, what about this
?
And it's great to have nothing.
You know, yeah, he came to mebecause he had nothing and I had
nothing I didn't know he wasgonna ask for.
And then now we have fiveperfectly good insults and
that's great.
It's a little like magic trick.

(01:19:16):
It does make me feel good tolike whoa, nothing was there.
Yes, but then similarly, andwhen that happens it also helps
me.
You know, when I have anxietyand I do the catastrophizing and
I go see that's the same muscle.
You're just not steering it inthe right direction.
There was nothing there andthen you put something there.

Speaker 1 (01:19:40):
And that will lead us to our last question.

Speaker 2 (01:19:42):
Oh God.

Speaker 1 (01:19:43):
It's the last one, but it's my favorite one.

Speaker 2 (01:19:46):
Who are you now?
Yeah, okay, no.

Speaker 1 (01:19:50):
Nope, what is the wildest thing?
That someone has texted,emailed or dm'd you in the last
two weeks?

Speaker 2 (01:19:56):
oh, in the last two weeks, I was gonna say of all
time, and I immediately had ananswer oh, I mean, if you want
to switch it up.

Speaker 1 (01:20:04):
Some people are like can I give you a list?

Speaker 2 (01:20:06):
I'm like years and years and years ago it was a
sexed gun awry.

Speaker 1 (01:20:12):
Give you a list I'm like years and years and years
ago it was a sexed gun awry yes,I'm in.

Speaker 2 (01:20:14):
You want to hear this ?
Okay, this is absolutely verylong time ago.
Wonderful person allegedly um,and it was I, and I remember I
was.
I was doing a shower just afteruniversity.
I remember, like the, the roomI was in when I read this oh,

(01:20:39):
let's meet up next week, I willbe off my period then and we can
devour each other and I.
My issue was period and devourwere in the same sentence.
They were not separated by evena comma and I went this is a
bad sex, that there's likelogistics.
And then she tried to spin itand I'm like just be like,
either give me the business endor the fun end, don't try to

(01:21:00):
merge them.
That would be like whoa.
And then I was just, I washorribly affected by it.
No, what is the wildest In?
The past is relative in thepast two weeks.

Speaker 1 (01:21:15):
Yeah, we want it fresh, Huh, hmm, see, this is
why you read the questions, rj.
So I didn't know.

Speaker 2 (01:21:25):
Let me what I can think of it.
You cut this out.
Yeah, we can cut this out.
There's a long silence.

Speaker 1 (01:21:32):
Now we hear about this.

Speaker 2 (01:21:33):
Audio track.
Well, I'm trying to tighten itup for you, that's fine.
Hmm, this is let me look.
Does that bother you if Iscroll through my phone?

Speaker 1 (01:21:52):
no, people do it all the time.
They're like, damn it, I knewyou were gonna ask this and I'm
like, well, you weren't prepared.
So here we are.
Um, I've gotten some wildanswers I don't know if that's
well.

Speaker 2 (01:22:09):
I do do think this is sort of wild and a weird.
No, that's not wild, my, my, Imean the fact that I've now
checking my mother's textmessages should say something.
What's why I'm trying to thinkwhat is considered wild here.

Speaker 1 (01:22:31):
Wild is relative.
I've had people get reached outto by cholo clubs.
I want to escort survivors.

Speaker 2 (01:22:37):
I my friend got a video breakup.

Speaker 1 (01:22:42):
I've had people getting sexted.
I've got, you know, dicks, I'vegot vaginas.
I've got sad stories.
I've got weird sex toys.
It's you know, dicks, I've gotvaginas, I've got sad stories.

Speaker 2 (01:22:56):
I've got weird sex toys.
It's you know the gamut, these.
I don't find any of these wild.
I'm upset we're not wild.
Yeah, what's what's weird.

Speaker 1 (01:23:10):
I'm upset that there's nothing wild here.
I'm sorry.

Speaker 2 (01:23:14):
Oh, I will actually say no, something happened today
and it was it's oh, it's sonice to be invested in other
people's drama I had.
I have a friend who was whofound out that they were blocked
by somebody on Twitter, juice.
I never knew, years ago In themedia business, a person that I

(01:23:41):
not personally knew, but I knewof them, and it was one of those
things where I was like, whatdid you do to this person?
There's nothing.
You didn't even cross paths,you didn't even work together,
whatever.
And this my friend discoveredthat they were blocked, like
maybe a year ago, two years ago.
Today, the person who blockedthem messaged them on Instagram

(01:24:05):
saying, hey, what's going on?
Like checking up, catching up,and I was like like blown the
fuck away.
And I was like you got to getto the bottom of this.
You got to ask like why youwere blocked.
You need, like you got to do.
And then my friend was like I'mgonna, I'm gonna play a long
game.
I'm gonna like settle in firstand like catch up with them and

(01:24:26):
let them know.
I was like, no, no, you gotta,you have to, you gotta find out.
I'm thinking, maybe, that I I'mlike maybe they think they got
a divorce, they had a reallycontrolling partner or something
.
You like a tweet and they'relike you gotta block them.
So what a weird.
I mean you save that for likethe worst people in the world
sometimes I know, I know thatthat's me, then I think everyone

(01:24:49):
, anyone who blocks me, mustthink I'm the worst person in
the world.
I'm like no, maybe they justfind me annoying.
Block me, please do.
Right, see, I can't.
That's just like well.

Speaker 1 (01:25:00):
Well, it's also because I'm I the older I've
gotten, I've lost more fucks, soI've become more combative.

Speaker 2 (01:25:07):
Right, gotta lose some of those fucks.
I guess I have really, really,really truly too many bucks.

Speaker 1 (01:25:15):
I got a lot of fucks.
Yeah it's, we're gonna work onlosing some of those fucks.
It's so much funner on thisside, like I'm saying funner,
look at there yeah, that's.
That's just sloppy work butit's because I'm so happy.

Speaker 2 (01:25:27):
Yeah, but it's sloppy , you're happy, and sloppy, fine
, fine, that's fine.
Does that work for you?
I thought we were going forpoignancy and I told a story I'm
not even attached to.

Speaker 1 (01:25:42):
I liked it.

Speaker 2 (01:25:42):
You got the good period one.
I think that was a good one.
We got the good period one.

Speaker 1 (01:25:45):
I think we did it.
I think that you showed uptoday and I think you shared a
lot about yourself that I thinkpeople will find amusing and
also people will furtherunderstand you.
I don't do this show becausepeople know folks in different
lights.
They're like, oh, they know, rjdoes this thing.
I do this show because there'sparts of you that I enjoy that I

(01:26:08):
don't think other people get tosee, right, and I think there's
this human aspect ofvulnerability that's like fuck,
yeah, we're doing.

Speaker 2 (01:26:15):
Yeah, for someone who hosts a weekly comedy show, I
really wanted to present a humanside.
That's going to do really wellfor me.
Thanks, let them know what'sbehind the laughter.

Speaker 1 (01:26:29):
Oh you know what, and the laughter, uh, I you know
what, and that's okay.
I love when they just like ohyou're funny.

Speaker 2 (01:26:33):
You must, you know, oh, you must like hide the
sadness.
I'm like, yeah, as opposed toyou who are just fucking sad,
you know well, I think you coulddo both.
I'm sad all the time I know alot, of, a lot of says the whole
thing is meaningless.
What do you want me to do aboutit?

Speaker 1 (01:26:49):
as I don't get me started, all this shit's made up
.

Speaker 2 (01:26:51):
As I often said, if I did not laugh, my brain would
just be splattered across thewall.
My head would explode.

Speaker 1 (01:26:56):
Laughter is healing, it's healing.
But okay, here's the one thing.

Speaker 2 (01:27:01):
Here's the last question, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:27:03):
No, I'm just a statement, actually, but I think
that, as someone that works intrauma, I utilize trauma in the
sense of like navigate, let'srun this back.
Someone that works in trauma.
I utilize humor because ifyou're laughing, you're present.
If you're present you'rebreathing, you're here.

Speaker 2 (01:27:24):
Right, yes, although other times I laugh about shit
in my head.
That says not remotely that'sokay.

Speaker 1 (01:27:33):
That's okay, but you're still allowing that
energy to flow through it is.

Speaker 2 (01:27:37):
It is a spontaneous body reaction.
That is that it is very nice.
It is freeing when I do comedy,see, yeah past the anxiety wall
.
Yeah, oh yeah, we're past itnow.

Speaker 1 (01:27:51):
Thanks, oh well, where can he, she, they, them,
the, they, zan and all the above?
Where can they find you gettingyour business?
Maybe spend some doll hairs onyou?

Speaker 2 (01:28:02):
Here's my issue.
I put it in the fuckinginformation sheet I filled out
for you.
Second of all, you're the host.
We have to stop.
If I may now get into a littlepodcast hosting etiquette, you
come on a talk show, I plug yourmovie.
I plug your book.
If you came on my talk show toplug a book, I'd plug your

(01:28:22):
fucking book.

Speaker 1 (01:28:23):
I wouldn't say do you have a book?

Speaker 2 (01:28:25):
Would you like to tell us your book?
Why?
Because the responsibility ofthe host Is to give that
information out.

Speaker 1 (01:28:35):
My responsibility was to ask you questions that made
you squirm, to share a littlebit more about yourself, and
that's what we got.

Speaker 2 (01:28:41):
So I did my job.
You see me in the hallway tofind you as a host.
You would be ashamed ofyourself.
Just Google my name, a bunch ofthings will come up to go on a
little adventure.
You ought to be ashamed ofyourself.
Just Google my name, bunch ofthings will come up.

Speaker 1 (01:28:56):
Do come on a little adventure.
What a complicated cutie.

Speaker 2 (01:28:58):
Yeah great, that's a pretty black and white issue I'm
holding you to.

Speaker 1 (01:29:03):
I feel fine about it.
Good for you Until next time,ha.

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