Spotlight Episode: Travel Weekly with Editor in Chief, Arnie Weissmann

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When millennials rediscovered travel advisors, they revived a profession many had written off too soon. “Millennials’ expertise is knowing who the experts are,” says Arnie Weissmann, editor-in-chief of Travel Weekly. With more than 25 years leading the travel industry’s most influential trade publication, Arnie has chronicled - and shaped - some of the most pivotal transformations in travel.

His own path from passionate explorer to industry leader is as compelling as it is instructive. Arnie’s love for discovery began on a 10-country camping trip through Africa, a journey fueled by curiosity and wanderlust. Frustrated by the lack of meaningful pre-trip resources, he launched a destination information service that later became part of Travel 42. That entrepreneurial spirit, combined with a deep empathy for traveler needs, made him the perfect fit to take the helm at Travel Weekly - a role he stepped into just after the seismic events of 9/11. Today, as part of Northstar Media’s global portfolio - which also includes Phocuswright and Business Travel News, Arnie oversees an unparalleled network of travel industry intelligence.

For those eager to make their mark in travel, his advice is both simple and timeless: stand apart. “What are you going to do that isn’t being done right now, that nobody else is doing, and that people truly need?” It’s a guiding principle that has shaped Arnie’s extraordinary career and continues to serve as a compass for innovation in a constantly evolving industry.

As travel undergoes yet another era of change, Arnie’s insights remind us that clarity of purpose and a willingness to innovate are the keys to thriving. We’re deeply grateful to Arnie for sharing his journey and wisdom - this is a conversation you won’t want to miss.

The #1 B2B Travel Podcast Globally. Over 100 Episodes. Listeners in 125 countries. New Episodes Every Weds.

https://www.traveltrendspodcast.com/

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:04):
The key with millennials is millennials
expertise is knowing who theexperts are, and I think that
you know that generation reallykind of revived things when
things were looking questionable.
To be honest, you know, and nowno one's looked back.
I mean, the travel advisorbusiness is thriving.

Speaker 2 (00:26):
Hello everyone and welcome to a special spotlight
edition of Travel Trends.
This is your host, DanChristian, and today we're going
to be speaking to theeditor-in-chief of Travel Weekly
, arnie Weissman.
Now, I have the privilege tosee Arnie throughout the year
and I was so keen to bring hisvoice to the Travel Trends
podcast, as we have become thenumber one B2B podcast globally.

(00:47):
Arnie Weissman leads the way intravel trade media on a global
level, and he not only speaks tothe widest possible audience in
the biggest market in the US.
Travel Weekly has over 2million visits a month and
Northstar Media is the largestB2B travel media business in

(01:07):
North America and Europe andAsia.
And, of course, we work reallyclosely with our friends over at
Focusrite.
We love their conferences andwe have a great partnership with
them.
Well, arnie himself is a truelegend in this industry and
really sets the stage for ourCaptains of Industry
conversations in season six.
So I was very keen to bringthis standalone episode together

(01:30):
for this extraordinaryindividual that has given so
much to our travel industry.
To give you an idea, not onlyhas he had nearly 25 years in
this role, he is a journalist, aphotojournalist.
He's won more than 60 awardsfor things, including video as
well.
He's been on PBS's TrueDetective.
He actually started the veryfirst B2B destination

(01:52):
information service, which wasquoted by the New York Times,
the Wall Street Journal and CNN.
He speaks at conferences aroundthe world, not just in travel.
He's also spoken at the WorldEconomic Forum and CES.
So who better to talk to aboutthe latest trends in travel than
Arnie Weissman?
So it is a huge pleasure tointroduce you all to one of my

(02:13):
heroes in the industry and oneof the leaders in this space,
arnie Weissman.
Arnie, it's so great to haveyou on Travel Trends.
Thanks so much for joining us.
Well, thank you for inviting me.

Speaker 1 (02:22):
I'm glad to be here.

Speaker 2 (02:23):
This is a huge honor for me.
You are a legend in thisindustry.
You and I have seen each othermany times over the past year
and have planned to get thisopportunity together.
We saw each other at the ForbesTravel Guide Conference, at the
Summit.
We see each other, of course,at the Focusrite Conferences,
and so you have.
From that introduction, ofcourse, people heard what an
impressive background you havein the industry, and I guess the

(02:45):
first thing I wanted to startwith is actually to finally have
the opportunity to ask you,arnie, about your background and
how you ended up in the travelindustry and, ultimately, the
role that you have at TravelWeekly.

Speaker 1 (02:57):
Yeah, well, I mean I had a lot of pent-up demand.
My parents went nowhere.
I mean we went, took a coupledriving trips, so I don't think
I got on an airplane until I wasabout 16.
And when I was in school I,after one year, I mean I was
taking things like organicgardening, japanese tea ceremony

(03:19):
, oil painting, voice, it wasjust I had, I was undirected, I
think that would be the way tosay it.
And so after a year, mystepfather, when he looked at
the report card, said what?
No ping pong?
So he missed the square dancing.
But I took a year off after thatbecause after my freshman year

(03:42):
I just thought I'm wasting timeand money and spent half a year
saving money to travel, thesecond half of the year
traveling and boy was I hooked.
It was just a whole notherworld.
I was really excited.
And so when I graduated, Isaved with single-mindedly to

(04:04):
take off again and my goal wasto take an open-ended trip
around the world, and I knewthat would take some money.
So I saved until I was about 29, quit my job, sold everything,
took off, started with a10-country camping trip through
Africa, from Nairobi to Tangier,and ended up traveling for

(04:26):
about a year and a half.
So the one thing that struck meas I was planning to take this
trip and this is pre-internet soI went into and out of about a
dozen travel agencies because Iwas very interested in going off
the beaten path I was reallyinterested in starting in Africa
and I told them I wantinformation but I really don't

(04:50):
want to go on a tour.
And one after another said areyou sure you don't want to do a
tour?
And they'd give me brochuresand I wouldn't come back.
And I finally found a traveladvisor who himself was very,
very well-traveled.
He was the son of a wealthy manand he got me started and that

(05:13):
was terrific.
And when I got back we haddinner and I said, you know, it
has been in the back of my mindhow come travel advisors can't
just open a book and find outhow to help someone like me?
And he said there is no suchbook.
So I said, well, why don't wewrite it?
But looking into it, we weregoing to do essentially a
guidebook for the whole worldfor the travel industry, but we
realized by the time we got ittogether it would be out of date

(05:35):
.
So we started instead asubscription service that had
information on every country inthe world, regularly updated.
It's now part of Travel 42.
It started out as the FullerWeissman Report.
It became the Weissman Reportand we did this for about 12
years.

(05:55):
And when the internet did comealong, we provided AOL with
their core content ofdestination information.
We licensed to everybodycontent of destination
information we license toeverybody.
So sold the company to what isnow North Star Travel Media in
the mid 90s and I did a coupleof things.
I was a group publisher therefor a little while.
There were some hoteldirectories, some things in the

(06:17):
UK, and when the job of travelweekly editor opened up and is
uh 23 years ago, uh, theyoffered it to me and uh, I
accepted it on the day after 9,11 and uh, I have been there
ever since and uh, what afantastic perch to watch, uh,

(06:40):
the world in the travel industryabsolutely what extraordinary
25 years it has been reallysince that time, and it's
interesting you mentioned thatbecause that is exactly when I
arrived on the scene in thetravel industry, was literally
just after 9-11, graduatinguniversity with marketing and
computer science background andstarted working at Carlson
Wagonly building out e-commercebooking platforms.

Speaker 2 (07:02):
And the reason I mentioned this is to the
interesting point ofconnectivity between us, because
one of the things I love aboutyour background, arnie, is that
you experienced travelpre-internet.
You've gone through that wholedot-com boom and here we are in
2025 talking about things likeAI, and so you have wisdom from
all of those years.
You also know what it was liketo travel at those different
times and I never want to everbe one of those people, and I'm

(07:24):
sure you feel the same way whereyou say you know way back when
it was great to travel because.
But actually I do think thattoday's generation missed out on
an opportunity to travel preinternet.
I at least had that opportunity.
I didn't get the internetreally until I was in university
, and I think this is where itdefines different generations
right.
Did you grow up with TVs, radio,internet, social media?

(07:47):
Because it certainly changesyour behavior, outlook on the
world, and so I only referencethat to our listeners, because
you have so many things I wantto ask you today, and I just
think it is a unique contextwhen someone has come up as a
journalist, someone who'straveled the world like you have
, and has that passion for thesubject matter and also just the
you know, an American with aglobal perspective.

(08:12):
But also you have seen thisindustry evolve over time and I
think that you know weconstantly go from crisis to
crisis, and we're in certainlyanother one now, and we're
definitely going to talk aboutthat today.
But you've seen us throughthings like 911, when everyone
thought, you know that it took along time for the travel
industry to come back.
So, anyway, there's so much,arnie, I want to talk to you
about today, but I guess, justto make sure that all of our
listeners understand TravelWeekly and North Star Media,

(08:35):
since you mentioned those two,and clearly those are very well
known to me, but would you mindjust giving a bit of an overview
of North Star Media and TravelWeekly today?
So so we bring all ourlisteners along with the journey
.

Speaker 1 (08:44):
Sure.
So Northstar is the parentcompany of Travel Weekly, but
also the parent company ofFocusrite, the research company
and conference company at theintersection of tech and travel.
There's a number of meetings,publications, meetings and
conventions, successful meetings, meeting news that are part of

(09:05):
Northstar.
My old company is now part ofTravel 42, which is part of
Northstar, which is destinationinformation.
We also have business travelnews, Focus Wire, Travel Age
West.
So we're the largest B2Bpublishing company that focuses

(09:26):
exclusively on travel.
We don't have anything in theportfolio that isn't travel
related, and I'm sure anyone whohas been in any sort of
corporate environment has heardthe word synergy thrust upon
them.
Find synergy with this group orthat and I'll tell you I think
that North Star works as well asit does because we actually

(09:47):
have true synergy.
If I have a question aboutsomething in the corporate
travel world, I'll call up aneditor over at Business Travel
News or technology.
I can call Focus Wire, Likewisethey'll call me, and so that
sort of synergy actually works.
Nothing is forced.
We actually like each other andfind out lots of information

(10:08):
from one another.
Leading travel media, B2Btravel media publication that is
focused initially kind of ontravel advisors.

(10:30):
We've kind of broadened it alittle bit more to the entire
travel industry.
But having these otherpublications in North Star makes
our job a lot easier because wehave this expertise really at
our fingertips.

Speaker 2 (10:43):
That's great.
I appreciate giving thatcontext, and I think people
would have listened to Pete Como, who's been on our show before
as a standalone episode Ofcourse.
He's actually been on aspotlight episode quite recently
as we were preparing forFocusrite in Barcelona, the
European edition, and obviouslythat team and those colleagues
of yours I highly admire as well.
And Pete kindly mentioned thatyou're part of the extended

(11:05):
family and so I love the dynamicand I just wanted to actually
just underscore your pointbecause I've seen it firsthand
at my experience of theconferences and getting to know
you and many members of theextended North Star family, and
it really is that dynamic.
You guys have a wonderful teamand everyone gets along really
well and you have so manycomplimentary initiatives.

(11:26):
And I guess that's where youknow with today's conversation,
one of the things I reallywanted to get into is this
concept of trade media, and so,as you mentioned, with Travel
Weekly being around since the1950s and when I entered this
space in the early 2000s, itbecame clear to me just how
important these publicationswere to these travel advisors
that I was working with.
So when I was going into thelunchroom they were all reading

(11:48):
the latest weekly publication,which ultimately, then, many of
them became digital versions oras well as the print version,
and then they were getting faxes, still from suppliers with
special offers, and this was theway that the world worked for
many, many years and, incredibly, still today there's many
aspects of that world that stillexist, and so the world of

(12:10):
trade media has never been moreimportant, because the travel
media, as we know, and the tradeside of this business continues
to grow despite its predicteddemise over the last 20 or 30
years.
So would you mind, arnie, howwould you describe trade media
for our audience, because Ithink you and I both know what
trade means and you alreadystarted to mention about it's

(12:31):
travel agents but also, so, whenyou think about trade media and
B2B, how would you describethat to our listeners?
Who is the audience for TravelWeekly?
And tell me, because I'm sokeen to get your perspective on
this, is that?
What do you think the purpose oftrade media is compared to B2C,
consumer media?

Speaker 1 (12:50):
Sure, so travel weekly, when we look at our
audiences, perhaps in 80 pluspercent are travel advisors.
The remainder work for suppliers, cruise lines, tour operators,
hotels and resorts, as well astravel technology companies
where people do bookingsairlines Any component of a trip

(13:15):
that can be booked ahead oftime is who is in our audience.
So we have the marketers, wehave the salespeople, we have
the CEOs, are all readers ofTravel Weekly and what is a
primary difference is our focusis to make our readers'
businesses more successful, tohelp them grow.

(13:37):
So when we look for whatinformation to put in because I
can tell you I get over 200press releases a day you know
we're looking at what are thestories that are the most
important for our readers tounderstand and how will that
help their business either byletting them know that they need
to watch out for something, orit's just a development or an

(13:57):
announcement.
So we'll put up roughly 10 to12 stories a day and these are
ones that we feel are reallyones that are going to help the
businesses of our reader in ouraudience.

Speaker 2 (14:13):
Got it Now.
That's helpful context, I think, for all of our listeners,
because, overwhelmingly, traveltrends is a B2B podcast.
We are seeing more and morelisteners coming in that are
looking to enter the industry.
That was part of the intentionas we launched this
post-pandemic is to welcomepeople into our industry or back
to our industry, and make surethey had the information about
what was happening in this space.
And I think this is where youknow clearly, you've got the

(14:33):
finger on the pulse of what'shappening in the travel industry
.
So people have been looking toyou and continue to look to you
as the thought leader and alsothe person that is going to be
best positioned to advise themon what they should know today
or this week that will have animpact on their business.
And I guess that's where justto dive in that one a little bit
further, because again, this iswhere I finally get the chance

(14:54):
to ask you these questions.
Like, I see Travel Weekly as avital resource in the travel
industry and I hear it all thetime from I work with Global
Journeys as a good example.
They're an Australian-basedcompany, they've launched a
North American office andwhenever we catch up, I mean
they're always talking aboutwhat's on travel industry
publications, and most of mycolleagues they all retravel

(15:15):
weekly, all of my colleagues inthe US.
I lived in the US for manyyears, and so tell us from your
perspective, though, why youthink it continues to be such a
vital resource and, to yourpoint there, about the number of
articles you're sharing, howyou continue to make sure that
it's relevant, it's contemporary, because, again, I just you've
been able to navigate this andI'm sure there's a clear

(15:36):
strategy around it, so I justlove to give you the opportunity
to answer that question.
I'm very keen to know how, howyou continue to make travel
weekly such a relevant form ofmedia today for the for the
trade that question I'm verykeen to know how you continue to
make Travel Weekly such arelevant form of media today for
the trade.

Speaker 1 (15:47):
Yeah.
So I mean, unless it's a very,very straightforward
announcement, we look at a pressrelease as the beginning, not
as the story.
So we're always on the lookoutfor trends.
When we begin to see thingsthat you know, for example, like
solo travel, this big rise insolo travel and a large rise in
women traveling alone you know,when we see these things

(16:12):
starting, one of our writers,one of our senior editors, will
put together an in-depth look atthat trend with multiple
sources.
See where it's going.
Every week we do a cover story,but we also do analysis pieces
every week in addition to those.
So there's a million ways youcan get straightforward

(16:38):
information and we have to addvalue.
If we don't add value, then thebarrier to entry is gone.
So I believe we have thelargest editorial staff of any
trade publication in travel andthese are people whose
experience our news editor comesfrom the New York Times.

(17:00):
A vast majority have come fromconsumer media and are really
solid journalists and goodthinkers and they see what is
happening.
In a way, you know, if you're areader, if you're a travel
advisor, you're busy all day.
I mean, you are getting, you'rebooking trips, you're talking

(17:21):
with clients, with potentialclients.
You don't have the luxury ofsort of sitting back and
analyzing and thinking about allthe different things that have
come across your desk, so we seethat as a big part of our role.

Speaker 2 (17:33):
And one of the things I wanted to ask you too when
people are looking up TravelWeekly and of course it's
travelweeklycom for any of ourlisteners that are just joining
this journey with us and aremultitasking as they're
listening to our interview here,which many people do, whether
you're folding laundry on theexercise treadmill, but some
people are in front of theircomputers or on their phone, so
you can when people look upTravel Weekly, now there are

(17:54):
Travel Weeklies in other markets.
There's a Travel Week in Canada, there's a Travel Weekly UK how
do you, with Travel Weekly whenit comes to your business, with
Travel Weekly when it comes toyour business, your audience?
I mean, america is the largestmarket for many travel brands,
and so how does it work on, Iguess, a global scale in terms
of Travel Weekly attracting aglobal audience?

Speaker 1 (18:27):
And how do you manage when there is similar names in
other regions?
Yeah, so once upon a time wewere all part of Reed Elsevier,
which is a Dutch-Britishconglomerate in Europe, and they
decided to focus exclusively onevents, so things like.
They're now called RX Globaland they had a world travel
market, as when all their otherworld travel markets are their
properties as our ILTM and allthe various ILTMs.

(18:51):
So when that happened and thiswas right around 2001,.
They just kind of got rid ofall their publications and they
usually went to the publishers.
The publishers of them justfigured out how to acquire them
and we have acquired, reacquired, I should say, travel Weekly

(19:14):
Asia and Travel Weekly China.
Travel Weekly China is on holdright now, but Travel Weekly
Asia is functioning quite well.
And you know Travel Weekly UK.
We know those people reallywell, we really like them.
You know it's one of the goodthings about these Travel
Weeklies.
That'd be pretty good.
I mean, I would worry about thebrand if there was one that was

(19:37):
really off.
You know, in Canada,interestingly, we have Northstar
, has Travel Pulse Canada, whichis our property there.
But yes, there are some travelweeklies that are not ours but
Asia, china and the US are, andI have had some hand in and

(20:03):
responsibility for those ones inAsia Less so, as it's matured,
got it.

Speaker 2 (20:08):
I was keen to understand that for myself, but
also for our listeners as well,to just dispel any
misunderstanding or confusion.
So I appreciate clarifying that.
And then the other thing Iwanted to get into you were
mentioning about you get pressreleases and it starts there and
your team does their research,and I think many news
organizations have been kind ofunder attack and under siege for
the last decade or more, giventhe rise of digital channels and
social media and decliningrevenue, as Google and Meta and

(20:31):
these companies have, and sothis doesn't just apply to
travel trade media, but so it'sreassuring to hear about the
size of the team and the efforts, the efforts, and I guess one
of the things I wanted to askyou along those lines is that,
when we think about editorialcontent compared to advertorial,
clearly all publications needto generate revenue and a key

(20:53):
component and our podcast is agreat example of that too we
have great sponsors, greatpartners, but I always try and
separate the two.
Obviously, the focus is puttinggreat content together and then
having great commercerelationships where our audience
can, or partners can, benefitfrom connecting with our
audience.
So the thing I'm keen to askyou is how do you approach that
at Travel Weekly, where you knowyou need to be an advocate for

(21:15):
the travel industry but you haveto balance objective journalism
with you know brands constantlybombarding you with you know
get their story into the media.
They've bought a new ship orthey're launching a new travel
style, and so I'm sure you getbombarded.
When you're launching 12articles a day, I'm sure you
could publish 200.
So how do you approachbalancing objective journalism
with you know helping just topromote this industry that

(21:37):
clearly we both love?

Speaker 1 (21:39):
Yeah, it's pretty, it's actually pretty
straightforward.
So we believe that an objectivejournalistic news enterprise
and we don't say newspaperanymore, most of our revenue
does not come from our printpublication that it will succeed

(22:00):
best when there is a separationbetween the commercial side and
the editorial side.
So we certainly know who youknow, we have friendly relations
on a personal basis, but theyare very aware that their
success is dependent upon ourindependence and objectivity

(22:30):
independence and objectivity.
So we take that approach and itdoes result.
Sometimes people get unhappyand they cancel their
advertising and things like that.
But the publisher and thecommercial side are aware that
the formula of where objectivityis the ultimate guiding
principle is in their bestinterest too.
I mean, travel Weekly has beennumber one for a reason, and you

(22:51):
know a lot of our competitors.
You know the covers for saleand that's not.
You know it's pop.
I would say that's publishing.
It's not necessarily journalismas I understand it, but you
know they can.
They can do what they want andif it works for them that's
publishing.
It's not necessarily journalismas I understand it, but you
know they can do what they wantand if it works for them, that's
great.
But it's just not the way we go.

Speaker 2 (23:12):
Now the other thing I wanted to ask you, too, is the
challenges, and then I want toget into some of the things that
we're both seeing in 2025, butspecifically your perspective
more where the industry is todayfor travel, trade media and
where it's headed.
But I just wanted to cover someof the challenges that we've
seen to get us to where we aretoday, and you started to
reference this, of course, aboutmoving away from newspapers and

(23:33):
also with the rise of digitalchannels.
But I'm keen to hear from yourvantage point how you would
define the main challenges fortrade media today, given that
you do need to still produce aprint publication.
You've got the digitalplatforms.
You're constantly updating thearticles on your website, and
then you've got all of these.
You know content creators outthere now that are also putting

(23:55):
out their updates and theirposts, especially on the social
channels.
So tell me, if you wouldn'tmind, like what?
What do you see as the biggestchallenges for trade media today
?

Speaker 1 (24:04):
What do you see as the biggest challenges for trade
media today?
Sure, so, I mean we're much.
Most people who consumeinformation from Travel Weekly
do it digitally.
We get two million page viewsevery month, which, for a B2B
publication, is a monster.
I mean, it's really we get alot of traffic.
We had a lot of traffic and theB2B space is kind of funny.

(24:26):
When I first started the job,the consumer media editors and
writers were sort of thedesirable let's say more
desirable place to be, and Ihave been listening to them sing
the blues now for more than adecade and the challenges that
they're having, whereas we'rekind of moving from strength to

(24:47):
strength.
And a lot of it is because acouple of reasons, I think.
One our information really doeshelp people in their business.
It's not just entertaining, wetry to make it entertaining, but
it is because the news isessential to them.
So we also, when you thinkabout it, the consumer

(25:09):
publications, and I'm believingthat, not in consumer
publications, but they have alot of competition from
influencers and from bloggers.
And if you look up France, Imean Condé Nast, traveler and
Travel and Leisure, and AFAR,national Geographic they may be
the first four that are listed.
But then there's a whole lot ofpeople who all they do is focus

(25:33):
on France.
You know, they are real, theseinfluencers are really experts
but they really can go muchdeeper in some ways than the
traditional publications can.
In the B2B side much less ofthat sort of competition there

(25:57):
are some people who are doinggreat work with blogs and things
like that.
Blogs and things like that, butwe kind of, I feel, have the
depth and breadth that we're Idon't want to say one-stop
shopping, but you can, you knowwe will show up.
We or other North Star brandswill certainly dominate most

(26:17):
searches that have anything todo with B2B.

Speaker 2 (26:20):
Right.
Yeah, it's interesting thatwhen you think about travel
advisors, too, today, I mean,it's one of the things that
keeps coming up when you thinkabout AI and we'll talk about AI
, of course, in our conversationas well but one of the things
that has stood out to mestartups always talk about
having a moat and this idea thatyou have a competitive
advantage and one of thecertainly with travel advisors,

(26:43):
even in the face of all thistechnology having a personal
relationship with a client, andI've seen so many examples of
this where the client justtrusts the travel advisor and
they're not necessarily going touse the online tools that are
available to them, even with AI,because they have a deep
personal relationship with atravel advisor and they actually
just take their recommendation,and that recommendation is they

(27:04):
don't even I've heard exampleswhere they don't even know what
cruise line they were on.
They just know that they bookedwith their travel advisor and
took exactly what they suggested, and so that to me, in many
ways in startup languages, is amoat, because you, you know

(27:27):
no-transcript and that is theadvantage you have is that if
you're going to promote thatcruise line or if you're going
to feature an article I shouldsay about that cruise line, that
travel advisor is going to read, that, they're going to promote
it to their client and they'regoing to book that trip.
And that's sort of, I guess,the positive feedback loop or
the virtuous cycle that occursin our space when you have a

(27:49):
trusted brand like yours, thatthey know that the content
you're going to publish isexactly the information they
need to know.
So let me get the AI questionout of the way, then.
Right now, arnie, when you lookat generative AI and what a
massive impact that's having insociety and specifically on
travel, how are you harnessingany of that at travel weekly?

(28:12):
How are you viewing that?
Especially when it comes towriting articles, do you have a
policy around?
You know how much of thecontent has to be 100% written
by staff.
How are you seeing those tools?
How are you using them?
And, I guess, what are thethreats that you see to the
trade media by the introductionof generative AI?

Speaker 1 (28:31):
Yeah, it's been very interesting, and so we do not
publish articles that aregenerated by AI.
There are other titles in NorthStar's stable Travel H West,
for instance, will take a pressrelease, have it more or less

(28:52):
rewritten for the audience withvery specific prompts with AI,
but it's always alwaystransparent that this was an AI
written article.
Travel Weekly never.
We look at AI as a tool, muchlike a thesaurus.
There are times, but I can tellyou it is still far from

(29:18):
accurate enough to rely on.
I used it personally and askedabout something and it said well
, because one half cup is largerthan two thirds cup.
You know this is the answer.

(29:40):
I was like well, that seemedini, you know, on Google, so it is
nothing that we would use togather information.
The other really critical thing, and the reason that is
probably less of a threat totravel weekly than most people
might even assume, is becausegenerative AI needs us more than

(30:04):
we need it.
They can't tell anybodyanything until it's somewhere
and we're one of the source.
We are a source for generativeAI, so without it, without us,
it's got nothing, and so Ireassured my staff they're not

(30:25):
going to take your job.
You know.
They need you to do what theydo.
So that's one part of it, youknow, but AI it's.
I'm perhaps more worried in oneregard for travel advisors.
And on the other hand, I thinktravel advisors have some real
advantages.
And, going to what you said youknow, in terms of the

(30:45):
relationships with the clients,that's one half of the
relationship circle.
The other half is withsuppliers.
So if a really good traveladvisor knows the names of the
GM, not just the names of theGMs, they've met the GM, the
general manager of a hotel or aproperty, and so that
relationship saying, hey, I'vegot a really important client

(31:09):
coming your way.
I need you to take really goodcare of her that is really a
huge advantage for the advisors.
There's a wonderful advisornamed Ann Scully, a luxury
advisor, and she was having aclient saying to her what can
you do for me that Expedia can'tdo?

(31:30):
And she replied well, I don'tthink Expedia can tell the
general manager that you're God.
You know and as much as you wantto say to people I'm a VIP, you
know.
If they've never heard of you,good luck.
But if you have a traveladvisor who's been sending
clients to this hotel for years,has a good relationship and

(31:50):
says this client is God, thatclient will be well taken care
of.

Speaker 2 (31:55):
That's a great example.
And just to add to that, we hadEllie Wagner, who runs a
company called Wagner BespokeTravel.
She's based in Santa Monica.
She ended up on our podcast ayear ago at the Forbes Travel
Guy Conference in Las Vegas and,to her credit, she kind of
pushed her way in to say I'dlike to be interviewed on the
podcast, and she was a greatinterview and it actually got a
lot of attention.

(32:15):
I learned quite a bit from herbecause she was a former lawyer,
entertainment lawyer working onlike Jeopardy, and she loved
travel and switched intobecoming a travel advisor and
she literally built her businessby doing exactly what you
described is that she got toknow the hotel GMs, develop
personal relationships with themand then was better positioned
to be able to serve her clientsbecause they gave them that

(32:37):
incredible VIP treatment.
And this is in the age of AIand technology and like.
So here's an individual thatbreaks into our space at a later
stage.
She's like a young mom and Iwas just like it was a
fascinating story to me and toshare her journey.
And obviously there's manyother individuals that have come
into the industry that havestarted to now understand
exactly what you described andare building successful

(32:58):
businesses in 2025 and beyond.
So I love that because, clearly, you and I attend a number of
these conferences together andare surrounded by those types of
individuals that have thoseinspiring stories.
Expedia can't tell you're God.
I like that line a lot.
But the other thing I wanted toask you too, on this topic,
Arnie, is that when we thinkabout the travel advisors and

(33:22):
you started to allude to thisbut I want to ask you this
direct question because I hadthe opportunity to ask Matthew
Upchurch and I certainly have myviews we did a deep dive into
travel advisors in season fourand really it was about the
renaissance of travel advisors,and I've spoken about this on
the show because, as much asthat industry has been predicted
its demise, the reality is isthat it's had a massive
resurgence post pandemic and ifyou look at some of the trends

(33:44):
where you know people aresearching three times as many
websites now as they did priorto the pandemic.
The complexity has onlyincreased and therefore the
tendency to rely on a traveladvisor that can cut through the
clutter, make personalizedrecommendations, and this is not
just for the 50 or 60 plus.
This is now 20 and30-somethings are also using
travel advisors and there'scompanies like Fora that are

(34:04):
coming along that are givingopportunities for people to
become travel advisors.
So in many ways I see it as anexciting time to be in this
space.
An exciting time to be in thisspace.
So I had the opportunity to askMatthew Upchurch and I did see
him get hit with a real hardballquestion from a journalist at
the virtual conference last yearabout the future of B2B when
everything's going to go B2Cindirect.

(34:26):
I was shocked that someone askedhim such a direct question and
kind of tried to put him on thespot.
Matthew is such an excellentstoryteller and such a pro he
obviously just like he lined itright up.
That was a fastball right downthe middle for Matthew Uptures
to turn around and actually giveall the points as to why trade
has never been more and traveladvisors have never been more
relevant and more important, andtalked about suppliers, savvy

(34:48):
suppliers, and he used Intrepidas the example in his response
as being the ones that actuallyserve both that they do direct
marketing and they do brandmarketing, but they get a ton of
business from trade and that'swhy they're at Virtuoso and they
belong to that network.
So I want to give you theopportunity to answer that same
question was that, as we sithere together in 2025 and we ask
ourselves what does the role oftravel advisors look like and

(35:10):
what the future is for them?
What is your take on that?

Speaker 1 (35:16):
what the future is for them.
What is your take on that?
Yeah, it's interesting.
You mentioned that somebodywent to from being a lawyer to a
travel advisor.
It's about the third one I'veheard of recently.
It used to be that a traveladvisor, you know, thought a
terrific luck to be hired by asupplier.
These days it's the other wayaround.
Suppliers are leaving thesupplier side and becoming

(35:39):
advisors, and it wasn't thatlong ago that the supply side
was really worried that therewasn't a pipeline of new travel
advisors coming in.
And the reason they wereworried and we've done research
that backs this up reason theywere worried and we've done
research that backs this up thatclients of travel advisors take
more trips per year, longertrips per trip and spend more

(36:02):
money per day.
So these are the highest margintravelers, these are the ones
in the front of the plane, theseare the ones staying at the
five-star plus resorts.
So the advisor position isright now very, very good,
almost as good as I've ever seenit.
And the millennials sort ofsaved things in a way, because

(36:25):
they were the original digitalnomads who also found they could
work and travel at the sametime.
They could be travel advisors,not stuck in an office in a
strip mall, but they could be ontravel at the same time.
They could be travel advisors,not stuck in an office in a
strip mall, but they could be ona beach in Bali and provide
good service for the clients.
So young people and I'm sayingyoung people, now millennials

(36:45):
aren't the youngest anymore butthey kind of saved it and one
way that they saw this as anattractive thing this is so
interesting Destination weddings.
So travel advisors are reallygood in the destination wedding
space and so a millennial wouldget married and it was a
fantastic experience at adestination.

(37:09):
They say how did you do this?
They say, well, use the traveladvisor, and that kind of spread
out.
I heard actually you mentionedMatthew Uptridge at Virtuoso
Travel Week.
They had one of the producersof the show, the Bachelor, was
on and he said he was a traveladvisor.
And he said you know, the keywith millennials is millennials'

(37:31):
expertise, is knowing who theexperts are.
And I think that you know thatgeneration really kind of
revived things when things werelooking questionable.
To be honest, you know, and andnow no one's looked back I mean
the travel advisor business isthriving.

Speaker 2 (37:48):
Well, I'm sure many of our listeners who are travel
advisors were thrilled to hearthat answer to that question
because, you know, constantlypeople do position them in such
a way that, like, the industryis under siege, and clearly the
ones that have embraced thisspace and are seeing the booking
results they know.
The answer to that is that.
So, despite the perception thathas been around for so long,

(38:10):
it's never been, as you said, amore exciting time to be in that
space, and I'm certainly seeingthat as well.
So I'd like to get into this is.
This is where, for me, as we'vebeen discussing you know, your
background, what you've beenworking on, one of the big
things that I always love todiscuss on the show hence the
name is the big trends that arehappening.
And now I have the opportunityto ask someone that has, you
know, reported on countlessindustry shifts over the years,

(38:33):
so someone that has that wisdomand experience but also is very
contemporary.
And this is where, when I seeyou at everything and the number
of people that gravitatetowards you, arnie and I was
like so it's always a delight tosee you in person, but also
just to know that you are thatperson that people go to to ask
these types of questions, andnow we have this opportunity
together.
So, when you think about thetrends that are shaping travel,

(38:56):
especially here in 2025, I knowwe need one that we definitely
need to address, which is theAmerican market and what's
happening domestically andinternationally.
That's obviously top of mindfor a lot of our listeners, so
we definitely need to dive intothat.
But I'm also keen to get yourtake on the travel trade and
what the next few years looklike.
But maybe let's start with theAmerican market, since that is

(39:18):
obviously something that you areso very close to the American
traveler and the inbound tourismmarket.
But I'm keen to take this inany direction you want to Arnie
in terms of the things thatyou're going to be able to share
with myself and our listeners.
So I guess what are the bigtrends that you're paying
attention to?

Speaker 1 (39:33):
listeners.
So, guess what?
What are the big trends thatyou're paying attention to?
Yeah, so, as I mentioned alittle bit earlier, solo travel,
women travel are really, youknow, there's always been there
and there's always been, youknow, programs especially to
serve that market.
But now I don't know one touroperator that hasn't jumped in

(39:54):
with both feet.
Now I don't know one touroperator that hasn't jumped in
with both feet.
And I know people you know, whoare friends, women, who say
what do you recommend?
I want to go somewhere.
You know I'm not traveling withanybody.
It really seems that there's Iguess it's a baby boomer kind of
age that they're ready to go, ababy boomer kind of age that

(40:17):
they're ready to go, and theyyou know the husband maybe for
years has been saying I don'twant to do it, and they've kind
of gone along with it andthey're like screw it.
I'm, you know, I'm at a pointin my life I want to do what I
want to do, and so that is areally interesting development.
It's interesting to see how themarket has responded with very,

(40:37):
very specific programs.
You know, you're seeing, stilla lot of these trends have been
going on for a while, but theyhave legs, things like doing a
buyout on a hotel.
This is something that you knowit's not going to happen at the
MGM Grand in Las Vegas, butsome very nice five star 60 room

(41:00):
properties will be just takenover by a family or for an
occasion.
That's still really goingstrong.
The multi-gen travel is stillgoing very, very strong and
again the market responds.
You see every cruise line, whatthey would call contemporary
cruise line, which is anotherword for mass market All of them

(41:20):
have really really exceptionalsuites that are even kind of
closed off.
You have to be in those suitesto get into that area.
So the grandkids are downstairs, they're going to the water
slide all the time.
So the grandkids are downstairs, they're, you know, going to
the water slide all the time andthe grandparents are having a
really nice sophisticated timeup in their area.

(41:40):
So these sorts of things youknow trends the market really
does react well to kind ofseeing these patterns and they
have so much data they can sortof see it before most other
people can, before most otherpeople can.
You know, kind of looking ahead, I am very concerned with the

(42:02):
stories that come out aboutpeople getting detained when
they're coming into the USbecause their visa isn't exactly
in order.
You know, in the past they wouldjust be turned around, said no,
you can't come in.
They'd be on the next flight outor turned around at the border
in Canada or Mexico.
Now they're being detained andthe stories coming out are

(42:25):
really disturbing.
You know people being held forthree weeks, 45 days even for
you know the one that really gotto me.
There was a Welsh woman comingfrom Canada into the US and she

(42:45):
had arranged that before sheleft home to go to various
houses and she would help aroundthe house, do some errands in
exchange for her room.
And this has actually alwaysbeen a no-no, that if you wanted
to exchange house sitting tocome into the country, if the

(43:08):
border guard found that out youweren't coming in.
But this woman was held for 19days and not in a pleasant place
, and so I think you know thissounds like it has to be
somewhat intentional that theywant to send a message don't try
to do this.
But the message that's comingthrough is some person who just

(43:29):
wanted to visit the US, who hada proper visa for a tourism visa
, is not only not going to getin, they're going to be made an
example of, and that is going tobe a turnoff.
And this is we're in a statewhere the market share for the

(43:51):
US inbound travel has notrecovered to pre-pandemic levels
.
This year was going to be agood year.
It was predicted to go up 3.9%.
We've got coming up, we've gotOlympics, we've got the World
Cup, we've got all these things,and this is something that, to

(44:11):
me, is very concerning, and it'sconcerning reputationally for
the country and it's concerningfor those people who get caught
in this.

Speaker 2 (44:20):
Yeah, I appreciate you raising that and I'm glad
that you did, because you knowwhen we first started mentioning
the trend, solo travel,multi-generational travel, all
those things are so exciting andthis is where the future for
our industry post-COVID has beenso bright and so exciting.
This is kind of the first timesince the lockdowns that we went
through where, all of a sudden,we're starting to see choppy

(44:41):
waters again and trying tofigure out what does this all
mean?
And so I just wanted toinitially go back to what you
shared about the solo traveler,which is overwhelmingly for sure
, one of the biggest trends thatare happening in travel and
driving group travel, and I'mseeing even the latest figures
from companies like Intrepid andG Adventures and this rise in
solo travel and it was actuallycame up at the Forbes Travel

(45:05):
Guide conference that we were atas well.
I sat in one of the sessions atPwC a couple of consultants
from PwC and they talked abouthow the last five years, solo
travel has more than doubled.
Travel has more than doubled,and the interesting stat they
had shared it was that 47% ofsolo travelers were women that
are either divorced or widowed,and I found that really
fascinating as well, justbecause some people may
associate solo female travelerwith 20 or 30s, where actually

(45:27):
solo female travelers actuallyat least half of that is people
that are in their 40s, 50s and60s, and so that's really
exciting and I'm also encouragedto see some of the latest
results that, despite some ofthe challenges that are
happening in the tourism marketthat we'll come back to right
away that we're still seeingpeople travel.

(45:49):
So that's still at leastoutbound.
So these solo female travelersare still saying, despite
everything that's going on inAmerica at the moment, I want to
go and travel.
If anything, I want to get outof the country and I want to see
some of the world.
And then the other thing youmentioned is the
multi-generational travel, whichagain is one of those things
that the smart, savvy suppliersthat are creating itineraries
where I worked with Uniworld fora number of years, Uniworld was

(46:12):
, you know, they put twoitineraries a year that were
multi-generational.
We took our kids on thesefamily itineraries and the
number of grandparents that havebought the trips for their kids
and their grandkids,recognizing exactly what you
just described, because aninteresting stat that I had just
learned from Michael Clinton,who wrote a book called Roar
about longevity travel, is thatthe 50 plus control 70% of the

(46:32):
wealth and, rightly or wrongly,but it's like that most of the
marketing goes to the youngergenerations, or you're
highlighting there's a missedopportunity.
You're not speaking to thepeople with the money.
Follow the money market, marketto the people that can book a
cruise for everyone.
Um, exactly as you described.
So I just I just wanted to goback to those, because this is
where there is some reallypositive encouraging.
But let's come back to exactlywhat you just shared then, Arnie

(46:55):
, which is this difficultreality we're currently
experiencing.
And, of course, I'm Canadian.
I spent a lot of time travelingto the US.
I love America, I loveAmericans, and I say that
forthrightly because I genuinelydo.
I lived in the US for a numberof years and I struggle with
everything that's going on atthe moment, and I'm hearing it

(47:31):
more and more from industrycolleagues about their concerns
and people like Shannon Stollwho runs the Adventure Travel
and their phone.
Even if it was that they couldbe held and turned away for that
reason, that is a frighteningproposition that we haven't had
to contend with before.
So all of a sudden.
That's certainly sending achill to international travelers
to the US.
And then we have this complexitywhere Americans are also quite

(47:51):
concerned about how they'regoing to be received abroad,
where Americans are also quiteconcerned about how they're
going to be received abroad,which is something obviously
keen for you to speak to as well, being an American in the US,
knowing that this is something Iheard at our conference just
recently.
The number of Americans thatexpressed this concern that how
they're going to be treated andperceived and I think we all
know is that they're going to betreated incredibly well.
Canadians will love seeingAmericans and we want to see

(48:13):
Americans traveling.
So for any Americans listeningto that, the first thing I would
say is don't even let thatenter your mind, Because, if
anything, it's going to be thecomplete opposite of what you
expect, which is, our people aregoing to be delighted to see
you, their arms are going to bewide open and they're going to
be thrilled that you've come tovisit their country.

Speaker 1 (48:29):
So no-transcript been related to this topic.

(49:04):
I called it the travel tariff.
You know that there's all theseheadwinds that are being
created unnecessarily in my view, that I mentioned how it's
going to impact.
I worry how it's going toimpact inbound travel, but
you're absolutely right that andit will be not that there I

(49:26):
hope that there would beexperiences where Americans are
really treated differently andpoorly.
I got my first press releaseyesterday from a Canadian city
saying we want you, please come,because you know that is the
economic impact and we are a B2Bpublication.

(49:47):
This is something we focus onkind of radiates negatively in
all directions, deviatesnegatively in all directions.
So you know the, the hope myhope would be that there is.
You know the, the currentadministration.
What a big criticism often is isthat there's no obvious plan.

(50:10):
You know tariffs around,tariffs are off.
This is happening.
That is happening, that theattention that goes, that turns
into pressure.
One hopes can modify or evenreverse this.
In other words, you knowthere's a lot of airlines who
have a big lobbying force, hotelcompanies, advisory boards to

(50:35):
the government that if there issome pressure and I can be
public in my pressure I canwrite this and try and get
things going.
What is interesting is howquiet other large travel
entities are because they don'twant to get blowback or or,

(50:56):
worse yet, be seen as criticsthat could be disregarded.
But there's a lot that can goon quietly and I understand it,
you know.
I mean the US TravelAssociation, I think, does a
tremendous work.
They're kind of quiet on allthis so far and I think the
reason is if they, you know,start complaining about it, they

(51:18):
will be seen as people thatdon't have to be listened to.
But if they do it quietly,through a lobbying effort, I'm
hopeful that some of thesepositions can get reversed,
because you know, if they dig inand this is how they're going
to treat everybody and this, bythe way, comes out of an
executive order on day one thatsaid there would be what.

(51:43):
The word wasn't extreme, but itwas like extra.
So the vetting will be done.
That the maximum, that was theword.
The maximum vetting will occurfrom people coming into the
country.
So maximum vetting, if thatmeans we're going to put you in
a detention center, who's goingto want to take a chance on that

(52:05):
?
So, and yes, the idea oflooking through people's social
media accounts, I mean, it'sjust you don't want.
This reminds me of when Ivisited Romania in 1988, when it
was under this horribledictatorship, and they at that
time pre-phones, they took allmy journals, they took them away
, they read through them all.

(52:25):
They, you know, took my film.
I was afraid they were going tofog it.
They didn't end up doing that.
But you know, this sort ofthing feels very, very intrusive
and unnecessary.
So we'll see where this goes.
I'm hoping it tones down.

Speaker 2 (52:39):
Yeah well, your articles on this have been
fantastic.
I actually just read TourismTariff comes into focus, and you
talked about the number ofpeople that you've met
internationally that have had USeducations and their sentiment
traveling to the US now, andeven you also highlighted in the
article, too, about some of theuniversity organizations that
are advising their students, whoeven have green cards, not to

(53:02):
travel internationally, andwe're seeing some of those
headlines as well.
So I think you reporting onthis and making sure that we
continue to advocate, hopefullymore and more people will listen
to it, more people will speakup, and because obviously both
of us love this industry, wethink there's so much to be
gained from tourism and commerceand opportunity, and so, yes,

(53:24):
for sure, I'm going to keepreading, I want to make sure our
listeners do too, and obviouslyI want you to continue to lead
the charge on this, because wecertainly need more and more
people to make everyone awarethat these are exceptional times
and certain things like thisare just not normal, and and,
wherever possible, to be able toreassure people, because also
sometimes, as you know, one ofthose incidents occur, and this

(53:47):
is the reality for travel.
There was an interestingsession I attended recently
about the perceptions ofdestinations is these can have
lasting negative consequences.
So, even if it does getremedied in short order, the
damage that continues to getrecently about the perceptions
of destinations is these canhave lasting negative
consequences.
So, even if it does getremedied in short order, the
damage that continues to getdone by these stories of
headlines of a French scientistgetting turned away for after
their phone gets shared.
Or there was a Canadian exactlywhat you just described with a

(54:09):
visa entering through Mexico washeld for two weeks and pretty
horrible conditions, and so forsure, that's going to continue
to be a big concern.
So let's move on topics, becauseobviously there's other things
we want to discuss.
In 2025 will quickly become2030, as we both know in our
careers and our lives.
Let's look forward and talkabout where you're seeing some

(54:31):
of the exciting developments inthe travel industry, whether it
be in cruise or adventure travel, or some of the destinations
that are opening up.
What are some of the thingsthat stand out to you as we look
forward, putting the currentrealities aside just for a
moment, as to where the industryis headed and should?

Speaker 1 (54:49):
be headed.
Yeah, and I think one of thethings that and this is a little
related to what we were justtalking about is that when it
comes to destinations, thechoice is so broad right now
that you know if you're worriedabout coming to the US, well,
there's, you know, 22 are somedestinations I think are really
exciting, that are, at thispoint, you know, over.
Tourism is a serious and realproblem and I've written about

(55:22):
it extensively, I've writtenabout it in books.
But the the other thing that isabsolutely true is that there
are lots of places that you willnot experience it.
That are wonderful experiences,and the problem with
overtourism is it's no fun foranyone, it's not fun for the
residents, not fun for thevisitor.
But there are lots of differentways you can do it.

(55:46):
You can if you look at it bothacross the map and across the
calendar.
So in February I was in Venice.
It was the week before Carnival, so nobody was there.
The residents outnumberedvisitors significantly and it
was still Venice.
You know you could still gointo St Mark's and no line.

(56:09):
I think traveling off-season issomething that I would imagine
is going to not even justshoulder season, off season, if
there's some real advantages toit and I think that this will be
picked up, especially as thebaby boomers retire and they've
got more time and more choicethey can do.

(56:29):
They can go whenever they wantto go, and that's something that
I think you'll be seeing.
And then the other thing I'mgoing to just talk about some of
my favorite destinations that Ithink are completely
undervisited thankfully, it'sone of the benefits of them,
actually, but which I love.

(56:49):
Start with Ethiopia.
It's my favorite country in theworld as a tourist.
It's the only country in Africathat was never colonized, so
the culture and the tradition ishundreds of years old.
They have a fair amount ofdiversity in terms of religion.
They have incredible diversitygeographically.

(57:11):
They have deserts, they havejungle, they have mountains.
I mean it's really an amazingplace.
The food is great, the havedeserts, they have jungle, they
have mountains.
I mean it's really an amazingplace.
The food is great, the peopleare great, the thing that they
have that is I would thinkanyone with a sense of adventure
might want to look into thisthey have ruins in a town called

(57:32):
Lollibella.
It's in the middle of nowhere.
It is not easy to get to you.
Most people fly, if they go atall.
But this was where a probablycrazy emperor once lived who had
a dream that God told him tobuild the New Jerusalem, kind of
in this wasteland New Jerusalemkind of in this wasteland.

(58:00):
And so what he did was he had13 churches carved out of the
bedrock.
I believe six of them or sevenof them are down.
He built a trench, leaving abig monolithic rock, and then
carved a church out of it, andthen he did the other ones into
a mountainside.
These are incredible, these areunbelievable, and they're still
actually used.
So if you go during the day,you don't see anybody and it's

(58:20):
very much a tourist experience.
But if you happen to go thereon a Sunday, you see services
like you've never seen before.
It's really an incredibleexperience.
I really really like Oman.
It's a really interestingdestination.
Saudi Arabia is developing.

(58:41):
I think some of the areas arestill a little early.
You've heard of the NEOMproject, but in the Riyadh area
and Alula there's a lot of stuffgoing on there, that is.
You know, there's one of thethings I like getting to a place

(59:03):
before when it's in its earlystages, and so that does.
Saudi Arabia is still there.
They're beginning to pick upsome steam, but if you want to
see a country before everybodygets there, you can still do
that.
And yeah, and it's afascinating, big, wonderful,

(59:24):
wild, wide world that has somany opportunities still.

Speaker 2 (59:29):
That's fantastic.
I'm glad that certainly shiftedthings on a very happy and
positive note.
I have not been to Ethiopia orOman.
I've had great interest totravel to Ethiopia for some time
.
Actually, just to highlight, wetraveled to Kenya and Tanzania
and we flew through Addis Ababaand we were flying on Ethiopian
Airlines and they have a wholenew fleet of jets and they were

(59:53):
absolutely gorgeous and my sonwants to be a pilot and he was
just and this is where, likeperception, I would never have
thought Ethiopia Airlines wouldhave some of the newest, most
sophisticated fleet of jets inthe world and so and it gives
you a completely differentperspective of that destination
and how important it's going tobe for future travel They've
invested in that for the veryreason that countries like Dubai
have as well, because they wantto become more of a hub and

(01:00:14):
they want to offer.
So I'm glad you mentioned those, because that's a nice happy,
positive shift.
The other thing I wanted to Igot a couple more things I
definitely want to ask you, arne, while we're chatting today.
The other one I wanted to getinto is just the innovations
that you think are going to comethrough in travel.
You started to talk about thiswhen you mentioned about the
bright outlook for traveladvisors, and one of the

(01:00:37):
developments I read recently wasin a Focusrite report your
example about the research theydo.
They had published a.
They track the investment instartups, and one of the things
they had called out in a reportearly 2025 is that actually the
majority of investment in travelstartups went to B2B travel
startups in Q4 2024.
That's the very first time thatmore money has been invested in

(01:00:58):
B2B than B2C and it actuallyoverwhelmingly went to European
startups.
And this is where I say it'svery reassuring for travel
advisors, because the technologyis now being built for them to
be able to use to run their backoffice, to be able to
streamline, make them moreefficient so they can spend more
time working with customers andproviding that human touch.

(01:01:20):
And so I was just keen to knowwhat other innovations you're
paying attention to in the tradespace that you're excited about
, or just kind of monitoring tosee what's coming, because,
again, you're just someone thathas a good read on things.
So I was keen to ask you whatelse are you paying attention to
when it comes to interestingdevelopments and innovations in

(01:01:42):
the trade business?

Speaker 1 (01:01:43):
Yeah, you know it's interesting.
You know the B2C.
There's one company that Ithink has done a really
interesting job overlapping B2Band B2C is TripAdvisor.
So TripAdvisor recently cameout and said look, we're going
to put a whole lot of emphasison experiences.
They own a company calledViator.

(01:02:05):
Viator is really where youwould go for a day trip.
If you're on TripAdvisor andyou say, what can I do today,
you look, what is there to do?
You're going to find a wholelot of links to things you can
do that are guided, a guidedexperience.
Viator also serves hundreds ofthousands of travel advisors.

(01:02:25):
So they have got sort of thatoverlap.
It can be booked by a traveladvisor, it could be booked by a
consumer, and I think you'regoing to see a lot more of that
sort of thing happening, where acompany may have been thinking
of itself as B2C and then all ofa sudden they're realizing why

(01:02:46):
would I ignore a channel thatprovides, again, the highest
margins, the best sort ofcustomers?
So you're seeing these things.
One big story, sort of techstory in 2024, was the rollout

(01:03:06):
of what they call the newdistribution capability of the
airlines NDC for short and thiswas seen as a huge threat
initially and I'll name namesAmerican Airlines did a terrible
job rolling it out.
They tried to cut the trade out.
It cost them a billion and ahalf dollars in trying to market

(01:03:31):
around the trade.
The people who were thearchitects were fired.
They're trying to repair thoserelationships as best they can.
But the heart of what this newdistribution capability is
really interesting to me,because they have so much data
and they automate an offer.

(01:03:54):
So they will say, for instance,this passenger always wants the
exit row window seat, theyalways buy a meal.
Why don't we package somethingthat has all those things we
know they like and offer it tothem on an email offer or
notification something?
And this was the.

(01:04:16):
A lot of travel advisors sawthis as a huge threat.
The reality is, the traveladvisor is in a much better
position to make an offer.
They know the people, not justthrough their data.
They know them, they know theirclientele.
They can put together that samesort of package that's much
more personal and much moretargeted, even than someone who

(01:04:37):
has reams and reams of big data.
So there's that aspect.
So there's that aspect, and oneis a really, I think, brilliant
travel advisor named Jack Eason, and he had a conference and he
would put a advisor and one ofhis preferred suppliers together

(01:05:01):
at a table and they'd call aclient and they'd say, you know?
The advisor would say, you know, I've got this supplier name
sitting right here and theywould target the client.
They would know that thisadvisor and this client were a
perfect match and they would say, hey, this, he's been telling

(01:05:21):
me about what they've got goingand I put him on the phone right
now.
So I mean that sort ofrelationship it's just whatever
automated things might comealong, it just can't compare and
that is not going to go away.
In fact, if anything, I thinkthe more people feel isolated by
technology, the more they'regoing to value that human

(01:05:44):
connection.

Speaker 2 (01:05:46):
Yeah, that's very well said, Arnie, and given your
background experience in theindustry, I'm sure so many
people are keen for you toanswer the question that I'm
always very keen to ask a guest,especially like yourself, that
has such a distinguished careerbut is very much as relevant and
has as much energy and interestin this industry as ever.

(01:06:08):
So, I mean, you are you are, uhan important voice in this
industry, and will be for manyyears to come.
I think one of the things thatI wanted to um make sure that I
asked you, though, is that, ifyou think about those people
that are coming up in theindustry, the advice you would
like to share with them and thisis where, for me I think many
of our listeners know when Istarted the podcast, it was one

(01:06:28):
of the things that I alwayswanted to be mindful of.
Is you know myself 20 years ago, I mean, if I think about it
even now in this conversation islike it was such a privilege to
be able to go to my very firstFocusrite conference.
It was amazing to have that oneopportunity to be able to speak
on a stage at a Focusriteconference, because for me, it
was very much like the AcademyAwards.
It was, like you know, gettingand to be able to go to the
conferences I've had a number ofyears and then see you and be

(01:06:50):
able to be able to shake yourhand, say hello, it's like.
So I can still consider that tobe such a privilege, and
certainly it has been, havinghad this time now to have this
conversation with you.
So what I want to ask for myyounger self and for all those
people in the room that aresaying if you had the chance to
interview Arnie, what would youask him?
What advice would you have forthose young people out there

(01:07:10):
looking to make their way inthis industry?

Speaker 1 (01:07:12):
Well, dan, you're very kind.
I mean, believe me, whateverwisdom I might possess is built
on mistakes.
But I would say that if therewere one word that is just the
advice I would give to anybodyreally almost starting out in
anything is how are you going todifferentiate yourself?
What is it that you're going todo that is not being done right

(01:07:34):
now, that nobody is doing andthat is really needed, and the
bar gets very low.
This is kind of the trouble withtrends is, by the time you hear
about the trend depending whenyou hear about it, it might be a
little late to get in there,and then you become one of many

(01:07:58):
people who are hopping onto thetrend.
So it's not always easy, butit's worth the thought about how
am I going to do something alittle bit different?
How am I going to do it in away that is going to get some
attention?
And you know you've got to havethe basics underlying this.
You can't just have a gimmick,but if you have a way to to

(01:08:20):
approach a problem that isreally going to make you stand
out.
Whether you're a journalist, Imean you know, whether you're a
writer, whether you're a traveladvisor, whether you're creating
a travel product.
What are you doing?
That's going to separate youfrom the path and that's that, I
think, will never go out offashion.

(01:08:42):
You know, which is toessentially?
I suppose you could sayinnovate, but innovation often
is so tied in with technology.
But you can innovate in almostanything you do.

Speaker 2 (01:08:57):
Yeah, very well said.
I couldn't agree with you more.
But that differentiator whetherit's your own personal brand or
in the business that you'rerunning that really what's going
to set you apart, I thinkthat's I've certainly seen that
as a key to success for manybrands that I've have the um the
opportunity to work with.
So I think that you, you, younailed it with that point.
I think that's one thing thatpeople take away.
Um.

(01:09:17):
But, arnie, obviously I enjoyreading your publications.
I read, you know I um I thinkmany more people will.
As a result of this, hopefullyit reads about a much larger
audience.
I think we've got listeners nowin like 125 countries, so
hopefully we expand the reachwith this conversation.
I'm sure anyone listening tothis is now going to not only
check out travelweeklycom butalso um tell their uh, their

(01:09:38):
friends and colleagues as well.
So I want to make sure thatpeople know every way they can
connect with you or some of theinitiatives that you have on.
That we should be alertingeveryone to so that they can
follow along, pay attention andand, like me, learn from you.

Speaker 1 (01:09:53):
Well, I would say, if you aren't already, if you're
interested in any of the thingswe've been talking about and
you're not already getting theTravel Weekly Daily Bulletin, go
on travelweeklycom and sign upfor it.
So every morning, you will get10, 12 news stories, podcasts,
things that are very, very fresh, and we also have some

(01:10:16):
individual e-newsletters,depending on your area of Europe
, for instance, riverboats,luxury.
If there's a subspecialty intravel that you're interested,
there's a good chance we have anewsletter that's focused just
on that.
I invite you all to follow meon LinkedIn.

(01:10:37):
That's my primary social mediaoutlet.
I guarantee you I'll acceptyour request, so feel free to
connect with me.
I'd be happy, more than happyto hear from you, and it's Arnie
Weissman two S's, two N's onLinkedIn.

Speaker 2 (01:10:58):
Well, and I can vouch for him because he did accept
mine, and so we are connected.
You can see that we are, butyeah, I'm sure you will for sure
, arnie, from this conversation,not only because you are such
an important industry figure,but because you're so generous
with your knowledge and advice,and I think that certainly came
across to me Well, it comesacross to me whenever I see you,
but I think I'm sure it cameacross to many of our listeners

(01:11:18):
as well.
So, make sure that youdefinitely connected with Arnie
on LinkedIn and definitelysubscribe to the Daily Bulletin.
It is an incredibly valuablesource of information and for
global travelers too.
So I would just want tohighlight that is that you want
to understand the US market.
It's something that a lot ofclients come to me to understand
, and reality is a lot of thatis what's happening in the trade

(01:11:38):
media and getting that news andpublication.
So, arnie, I can't thank youenough for making the time for
this.
I'm certainly looking forwardto seeing you again in person
over the course of the year.
I know we'll see each other atFocusrite in San Diego later
this year, if not before.
But yeah, thank you again formaking the time for Travel
Trends.
I wish you and the team everysuccess and I look forward to
staying in touch.

Speaker 1 (01:11:58):
Well, thank you, Dan, I really enjoyed this and best
of luck to you as well.

Speaker 2 (01:12:05):
Look forward to seeing you again.
Thanks so much for joining uson this latest episode of Travel
Trends.
I hope you enjoyed thisspotlight episode featuring
Arnie Weissman, theeditor-in-chief of Travel Weekly
.
I so thoroughly enjoyed ourconversation.
I hope you did as well, and Ijust want to say thank you again
to Arnie for joining us.
I certainly look forward toseeing you at some of the
conferences later this year andfor those of you who now have

(01:12:29):
discovered Arnie Weissman, Idefinitely encourage you to
connect with him on LinkedIn andalso check out travelweeklycom
and be sure to look at hisregular opinion pieces every
week, because he certainlycovers all the geopolitics and
shares his opinion and views,and I always appreciate that.
So thank you, arnie, and forthose of you who've been really
enjoying these spotlightepisodes, I definitely encourage
you to check outTravelTrendsPodcastcom slash

(01:12:51):
spotlights as we continue toroll out a number of episodes
over the course of this month aswe prepare to launch season six
of Travel Trends our Captain ofIndustry series on September
3rd, and we have some amazingguests lined up for that.
Starting off with Chris Hemeterfrom Thayer Ventures, we have
Tao Tao from Get your Guide.
It's going to be an amazingseason with five different

(01:13:12):
themes, and then we also haveour AI Summit happening at the
end of October, the 28th or 29th, so you can find out more
details, to sign up for ourevent and learn about Season 6
of Travel Trends atTravelTrendsPodcastcom.
Until next time, safe travels.