August 15, 2025 • 42 mins
Join us on a captivating journey into the world of trees and the profound connection we share with them, as we welcome Marguerite Holloway, author of "Take to the Trees," to our podcast. Marguerite's journey from a tree-climbing novice to a passionate canopy explorer is an inspiring tale of adventure, resilience, and personal transformation. Listen in as we explore her motivations behind writing a book that blends science, memoir, and adventure, offering a vivid portrayal of the beauty and challenges faced by our forests. Her insights, enriched by personal reflections on loss and resilience, provide a compelling narrative on the intricate bond between humans and nature.
This week’s episode was written and recorded in New York on the land of the Lenape tribes.
This episode was written, edited, and produced by Jonathan Zautner.
To learn more about our podcast and episodes, please visit treespeechpodcast.com and consider supporting us through our Patreon - every contribution supports our production, and we’ll be giving gifts of gratitude to patrons of all levels. Please also consider passing the word, and rate and review us on Apple podcasts. Every kind word helps.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:08):
Reaching for one branch at a time, pulling myself higher and
higher, one step then another, as the ground drifts away
beneath my feet. Above, sunlight sifts through a
lattice of green, and every leafseems to whisper its own small
(00:30):
story. When I was much younger, I found
such comfort and accomplishment in the canopies of trees.
Climbing felt adventurous and daring, athletic, artistic and
brave. I'm Jonathan Zoutner, and this
(00:53):
is tree speech. It's been a long time since I
felt the exhilaration of climbing a tree, but in today's
episode, we listen for what the treetops can still teach us
about beauty, urgency, and care with someone who began climbing
trees as an adult and whose lifereminds us of the fearlessness
(01:15):
we all need to grow. Our guest, Marguerite Holloway,
is an author, journalist, and professor whose latest book,
Take to the Trees, a story of hope, science, and self
discovery in America's ImperiledForests, is a vivid blend of
science, memoir, and adventure. She chronicles her
(01:38):
transformation from tree climbing novice to passionate
canopy explorer, guided by twin arborists Bear and Melissa
Livangi. Along the way, she learns not
only the skills and science of climbing, but also urgent truths
about the challenges our forestsface and the quiet understanding
(02:00):
that trees, like people, hold histories, grief and resilience
in their rings. Marguerite Weave's powerful
personal reflections on loss, resilience, and the enduring
bond between people and trees. With lyrical reportage.
That balances alarm with hope. She has written for the New York
(02:23):
Times, The New Yorker, Audubon, Wired, and Scientific American.
Today, she serves as professor and director of science and
environmental Journalism at Columbia University's Graduate
School of Journalism and is alsothe author of The Measure of
Manhattan, The story of John Randall Junior, the surveyor who
(02:43):
laid out New York City's 1811 grid plan, and of the
researchers who use his data today.
Now she brings that same depth and wonder into the branches of
our forests and our lives. In our conversation, we'll
explore the research and writingof Take to the Trees, the
(03:03):
unexpected lessons of climbing high into the canopy, and what
her journey taught her about theresilience of forests and of
herself. So lace up your boots, look up
toward the branches, and join usas we take to the trees with
Marguerite Holloway. Let's listen.
(03:28):
Well, hello Marguerite. It is so wonderful to have you
on the podcast today on this hotJuly day.
But I'm excited to to discuss your book.
So thank you for joining us. Thank you so much for inviting
me, I'm really looking forward to this conversation.
Me too. So I'm going to start with where
(03:48):
I was introduced to you and to your book.
Take to the Trees. And that was at the book launch,
which happened on the Upper WestSide at Book Culture.
And I was intrigued by by the book and by you.
And so I went there to hear you read from the book and to to
learn more about it. And I've been thinking a lot
(04:11):
about tenderness lately and sortof this need for more tenderness
in our world and for each other and patience.
And I was really struck by the amount of tenderness in that
room from you and for the content and for the passion that
you have for this book that was being launched into the world,
(04:32):
but also from the people that were there.
I gathered from all walks of your life, students, colleagues,
family tree scientists, other climbers, tree people.
And I just wanted to hear from you what that felt like to have
all of those people in one placein the room celebrating you and
(04:52):
your work and trees in this way.It, it was incredibly moving and
that I think it might choke me up a little bit, but I was so
nervous about the reading and also in some ways about the
book, because for me, it is sucha departure in terms of the way
(05:12):
I've written in the last couple of decades.
And just every second another person came in just was like, Oh
my God, you, oh, you, you. Like just this incredible joy
about people who had made the effort to be there.
And this incredible sense of what I think connects to
(05:36):
tenderness, but a sense of safety and a sense of connection
and kindness. And I just felt that from
everybody in the room. And it was, it transformed my
nervousness into this kind of euphoric energy that was really
(05:57):
wonderful. And I was very moved by the
questions, some of them from people who had been with me
through this whole process and knew some of the very particular
details and things that I had been thinking about.
And then others that were were broader but just so creative and
(06:18):
engaging and made me also realize that the book, which I
know abstractly, but then any piece of writing, different
people find different things in it and that that is very moving.
Yes, yes. And, and sitting there was a
moving experience in itself. So let's talk about the book and
(06:39):
about your sort of entry point into it.
You've described attending the Women's Tree Climbing Workshop
as a turning point where fear ofheights, grief, and a career
crossroads all converged for you.
What made you say yes to the climb?
And once you were up in the canopy, what shifted for you
(07:02):
internally? I think I may have mentioned
this before, but I had been writing about climate change and
I was working on a story for theNew York Times about climate
change in New England forests. And as part of that, I, I heard
about Baron Melissa actually from someone who works for the
(07:22):
International Society of Arbor Culture in in New England.
And then I met them and I can't imagine saying no to anything
that they. Would propose.
They are just so present, so kind, so aware of the world and
of people and of the natural world that the non human natural
(07:47):
world that when they told me about the workshop and then they
found a space for me, someone had, I think there's often a
very long wait list. And the one I had wanted to take
was filled up and then there wasa cancellation and they let me
know. And I, I think it took me maybe,
you know, 3 or 4 minutes to decide.
(08:09):
Yes. And so I knew that it was going
to be very challenging because of, as you mentioned, I had this
incredible fear of heights. And I'm on the older side, not
I, I'm, I think I'm relatively physically fit, but taking on
something that I knew was going to be very physically
(08:29):
challenging and it was going to really push me, you know, was,
was daunting up in the canopy. As you say, all sorts of things
happened to me. It, they didn't happen
immediately. They happened over time over
going back to the same trees andto the same place several times.
(08:51):
The transformation for me was was slow, but it didn't happen.
Well, and the book is about thatself discovery, but it it also
pertains to your relationship with your late mother and
brother through the lens of yourtime with trees.
(09:12):
Could you tell us a little bit about how the act of climbing,
physically ascending into this canopy?
How did that shape your experience of grief and healing?
I think there's something about feeling that you can't do
something that you just, it is, it is not possible for you to do
(09:33):
something and then within a few seconds or a minute or however
long it takes, you do that thing.
And it made me feel this incredible sense of, of, of
strength and centeredness and a sense that yes, I, I could deal
(09:55):
with things, I could face things, not just physical things
and challenges, but also emotional and psychological
challenges. And they were all bound
together. And I think we are all, we are
all bound together in this way. Like the physical expression of
(10:16):
things is so connected to the way we think and the way we
feel. And I think many of us feel most
alive when there is some kind offusion, when those when those
realms are all sort of operatingtogether, even if we don't
always recognize that they're operating together in that
(10:37):
moment. And overcoming the physical
challenges led me to overcome these blocks, I think in emotion
and being able to face a lot of the loss and grief.
And I had this experience and I write about it in the book.
But being in the canopy, feelingthis incredible joy and then
(10:58):
suddenly feeling these waves of grief and sadness and was all
connected. But I feel as though if I hadn't
pushed myself and realized thesestrengths in myself, I wouldn't
have gotten there in the same way.
Right. And reading about that process
(11:19):
is is quite inspiring and the way that you detail it really
takes us through piece by piece the amount of time, the amount
of patience, and the process that healing undergoes. 1/3
aspect of the book with this personal journey is climate
change. And you've written that climate
(11:42):
change feels like a trauma that keeps gathering power because we
won't look directly at it. How did climbing trees help you
reframe or manage climate anxiety in real time?
Well, I think that in the same way that I couldn't maybe look
so directly at the grief around the loss of my mother and my
(12:06):
brother, I feel it is very similar and I feel as though we
as a society do not want to. Well, that's not true.
That's an over generalization. There are many people, in fact,
I think most people are, are looking as directly as they can
at this, at this huge issue. But I think that's very
(12:31):
different than engaging with it in a very active everyday way.
And the longer we put off looking at it directly and
acting as if it is perhaps the most important thing, the longer
it just snowballs and gathers force.
And I do feel that there is a lot of connection between facing
(12:56):
things as an individual and facing things as a society.
And I think climate change is very much, very much resides in
that, in that realm. And I have to say also, it was
overwhelming doing all this research on what climate change
is doing to trees and then what pests and diseases are doing.
(13:19):
And, and at times it was really very consistently dark and
difficult. And it was in meeting people who
are trying so hard at all these different levels, at the level
of themselves, their family, their community, their forest,
(13:40):
their profession, their research, their policy efforts
like that really began to make me feel in a in a much broader
community of people who are looking very directly at it and
who are who are feeling grief, but who are also feeling agency.
And that is what the book and climbing did for me.
(14:06):
I I understand and the importance of community and
collective care is apparent throughout every.
Page of the book. Let's stay there for a moment.
The book highlights the work of women in what's long been a male
dominated field. What lessons would you say
(14:26):
emerged from your time at Camp High Rock and throughout the
book, and how did those women influence your view of the
broader climate movement? Again, I think it really has to
do with people understanding their own power and and learning
that power and recognizing it ina setting in which they feel
(14:50):
safe and cared for. Because I think in those
settings, we really do our best.We face things, we are more open
to things, we are less defensive.
And the process of being in the workshop and observing so many
other workshops that I wasn't anactive participant in, but was
(15:14):
sort of more reporting on and talking to the, the women and
made me just see. And many good teachers know
this, like if you create a spacein which people feel safe,
they're willing to take all sorts of risks intellectually
and physically that help them grow.
(15:34):
And that's one of the, the big things that I, that I took from
the workshop. I also took this amazing sense
of it doesn't matter where in the country you are, you are, if
you've gone through that workshop, part of this like huge
network of people who are all doing really important things.
(15:55):
Whether it is trying to explain to home owners the importance of
the trees and how they can make better choices in terms of what
they want to take down or what they want to plant.
Or, you know, somebody just supporting someone who's had a
really crappy day on a, on a crew that doesn't appreciate
them or connecting researchers who are coming at the same
(16:20):
problem in very different ways. And that network, I think we
tend to forget because there is so much fragmentation in our
society that we read about constantly, that there's
actually also a lot of cohesion in our society and a lot of
people who are very connected around the same issues and do
(16:41):
express a lot of care. And I think it's just really,
really important to remember that.
Yes, it's powerful. I've heard, I've heard it's
referred to as sort of a mycelial network of climbers
because they're all interconnected and feeding one
another and nourishing each other and the earth.
And it's honestly, I believe through that power, that real
(17:06):
change will happen, the change that is needed for humanity.
I agree and and Baron Melissa explicitly referred to it as the
Mycelial Network of the Women's Tree Climbing Workshop.
I love that imagery. It's it's you feel like you're
part of something. As I said, powerful, but but
creating real change. As a Columbia journalism
(17:28):
professor and longtime reporter,how did blending memoir,
science, and immersive adventureshift your writing process?
Did it uncover insights you wouldn't have found through
traditional reporting? And how was that process to
write in a different way than you had previously done?
(17:49):
It was very, very difficult for me and I have thought about it a
lot because I started my I started, I was a comparative
literature major and I did a lotof fiction writing when I was in
at university. And I really for a long time
thought that that was the way that I would go.
(18:11):
And I ended up focusing on science and public health in
large part, I think, because it needs a lot of translation,
those realms, because people areintimidated by science, although
none of us should be. And there's a lot of opportunity
for using description and imagery and narrative to make
(18:36):
those worlds feel those realms feel much more accessible.
That said, I turned away from fiction writing, and although I
was incorporating those components of writing that I
really love in terms of imagery and translation and description,
I was doing journalism in a verytraditional and very sort of
(18:57):
classical science journalist way, and I have always
discouraged my students from using I.
There has to be a very, very good reason for it.
You really need like it. It has to make a lot of sense.
If you can read the piece without the eye just as easily,
(19:18):
then the eye should probably notbe there.
But here I was now including myself, including my family,
including all of this description of my internal life
and, and, and braiding it with science journalism.
And it was a very, very difficult process.
(19:39):
And it took a lot of encouragement on the part of my
editors in my family and at Norton, my amazing editor at
Norton, Tom Mayer and my husbandTom, and my kids, Auden and
Julian. It was almost like a musical
process where something had goneon too long, maybe a scientific
(20:02):
description, and felt as though.The the braiding with the
personal or with the memoir wasn't happening at the right
rhythm, but the right pacing. So I would have to go back and
all sorts of associations happened in that going back that
I think would have never happened if I was writing in the
(20:23):
way that I have for the last several decades.
Associations would just would just come almost in this.
It was, it was kind of wild whenit happened and I can't really
explain it, but there were connections that I was much more
open to because I was writing about these memories and my
(20:46):
family and my own experience that I just don't think I would
have made otherwise. I don't know quite how to
explain that. I, I was talking with my editor
about it at one point and I mentioned this artist that my
husband and I love. Her name is Isabella Ortiz.
And she describes, and I think many painters do this of sort of
(21:06):
she approaches her canvas or herpaper from one side and she
turns it and she comes in another side and she turns it,
she comes in another side and like there is very non linear.
And that's exactly what my process was like.
Usually it's very linear and it was not at all this time.
I was coming in here, coming in there, turning it like leaving
(21:28):
it and and that all made for something quite different that
I'm very happy with. Yes, that's fascinating.
We talked about the book launch.Did it feel different putting
this into the world as well? Because it.
Contained. More personal information and
parts of you that you were now sharing with the the whole
(21:50):
world. It did feel different, but on
the other it it felt very scary and I think that's part of why I
was so nervous. I mean part of it is just being
in front of a group. A crowd that always is can make
one nervous or make me nervous. But at the same time, it is the
most me thing I've ever written.And I feel so grateful to have
(22:17):
been able to have the freedom toapproach this book in this way.
And so yes, it, it, it did. It scared me a little bit, but I
also just feel this enormous sense of of gratitude and and
and joy about having written something that really feels for
the first time fully in my voice, fully me.
(22:41):
All of the all of the elements of your world sort of came
together to produce this beautiful work as you were
writing then, drawing from all of these different components,
how did you balance urgency withwonder in in your writing,
especially when facing what feels like irreversible
ecological change? And we've heard a lot about how
(23:05):
we present or how climate changeis presented and the importance
of story within that, how how people learn about climate
change and what needs to happen.So I wonder your thoughts on
what responsibility storytellersmay carry in this moment as
we're looking at the work that needs to be done.
(23:27):
I think storytellers have an incredibly important role to
play and not in necessarily in the on the tracks that we
usually think of. I think we need storytellers and
in all, all situations, all sites, anyone who can describe
change and, and communicate it against this backdrop of what is
(23:52):
happening, I think is extremely valuable.
And I, I think sometimes these very landscape or bird's eye
scale understandings, they're, they're critically important,
but it's also, it's also the understanding of what is right
next to you and right around you.
(24:12):
And there are people who who observe closely pretty much I
think everyone observes closely given the opportunity and that
that that be celebrated and thatthat be presented in a way that
feels accessible and allows people in I think is just
absolutely essential. And what you said about urgency
(24:35):
and wonder, I think it's really fascinating because again and
again, you know, scientists and when one of one of the
researchers in the book says this, but it's it's horrifying
what he's seeing happen to, for example, the Beech trees, the
forests are, are looking completely denuded.
(24:55):
And you know, this incredible food source is disappearing.
And yet he is so driven to understand why this is
happening, how this is happening, the the, the
intricate, granular details of these nematodes.
And it it, he has this incredible curiosity and wonder
(25:19):
about understanding these processes at the same time that
he has this incredible sense of urgency and incredible clarity
about what is happening and grief about what is happening to
the forest. So I think that that fusion
makes a lot of sense that you you can have all those things.
And in fact, it's very motivating to have all those
(25:41):
things. Yes, I believe that too.
Sort of. Everything happens.
It can happen all at the same time.
All of these contrasts can be true.
Throughout the book, there's a anarrative thread that involves
you uncovering trees that you learned were important to your
(26:02):
mother, but only had found that they were important to her after
she had died. Could you talk a little bit
about about that? Yes.
So the germ or the seed of the book really began right after my
mother died and I was cleaning out her apartment.
And I thought I had, you know, seen everything that there was
(26:25):
because I had moved her from oneapartment to another.
I'd redone her apartment. I'd taken care of her.
And this tree journal I had not seen.
And it just blows my mind that Ihadn't found that before.
But in the Tree Journal for about 11 years, she chronicles
all these trees that she meets and writes about their Natural
(26:46):
History, and sometimes she drawsthem.
And I knew that she loved trees because she had had my brother
and I spend a lot of time out ofdoors and try to learn, had us
learn the names, tried to teach us the names of all the trees.
So I knew she had a lot of deep knowledge, but I hadn't known
(27:07):
that it was that she had sort ofbrought her artistic and
naturalist sensibility to chronicling that in any way.
So it made me feel it hugely connected to her to start to
see, to observe as closely as she did some of the trees that I
(27:28):
was getting to know. That made me feel like I
understood her, even though I'vealways known she was a
naturalist. It made me understand her more
deeply and, and that I'm, I'm just incredibly happy about that
and feel very lucky to have discovered that journal when I
did actually, you know, because she had dementia.
(27:51):
And if I had discovered it in the thralls of her dementia, I
don't know if we would have beenable to communicate it about it
in some way. Yeah.
Where is the journal now? Do you have it in your
possession or where and who? I think it is right here.
Yes, it is right here. I keep it right near me and I
(28:14):
look at it occasionally and I it's right here.
I think I might still do something with it because there
were many, there are many trees that she wrote about that I
didn't write about in the book. And I didn't share any of her
illustrations or any of these images of the leaves that she
taped in. And I am really curious about
(28:36):
the Natural History description she got.
I found one reference to a library at at the University of
Berkeley, University of California at Berkeley.
And I'm really curious, like what texts she was in reading.
So that is something I might look into going forward because
(28:56):
they're not the standard texts, the field books and field guides
that I've looked at. There's a very different
language. It's amazing.
There might be more to. Do and it feels sort of like she
guided this process. You know, it's really beautiful.
It's when, when she her, her story and the story of the
journal is interwoven with we talked as we talked about
(29:18):
urgency and wonder it, it reallycreates those moments to
breathe, to gain perspective andto feel energized to do the work
that needs to happen to, to makethis world a better place.
You talked about your mother's illustrations, which I would
love to see. So I hope that you do something
(29:38):
with that, with that journal oneday when the timing is right.
But I must also mention the gorgeous and inspiring
illustrations that appear throughout this book.
They are magical. And I wonder if you could tell
us how you hope the illustrations relate to your
writing, and maybe what that relationship or dialogue is.
Oh, that. I mean, Ellen Weiner is just so
(30:02):
brilliant. And I wanted illustrations that
that had a lot of emotion to them and a lot of movement and
power to them because this book is about so many things.
But the trees as characters who are sort of trying to tell a
different story or different facet of climate change, they
(30:26):
come forward and take the stage.And I wanted the the
illustrations to have as much like, to have as much presence
as possible. And Ellen kept saying that she
was not a traditional botanical illustrator and that I didn't
really know what I was doing. And I kept saying, I do know
(30:49):
exactly what I'm doing. Like just see them and they move
and they, they're evocative. They're like poems.
And she has a very, very strong connection to poetry and to
literature. And I'm so thrilled.
I feel like they, they tell the story, they work with the text,
but they're also their own story.
(31:11):
And we very much worked with a, a designer to have them coming
in and the text go around them in places where that felt felt
right. But I I feel like you could get
a sense of light and dark and power and hope and despair by
looking at the illustrations just by themselves.
(31:32):
Yes. Yeah, you definitely do.
It is now that you say that it is visual poetry, and I'm glad
you convinced her to be a part that.
Really. Complete.
I am so lucky. That's gorgeous.
We touched on this a little bit,but how has your perspective on
nature, storytelling and humanity's place?
(31:53):
This is a big question in the World evolved since finishing
the book. And what are your next questions
for yourself, for science or forthe forests?
I feel as though the book helpedme sort of align the personal
and the societal. It made me feel like it's OK to
(32:16):
be explicit about all these realms being connected.
At least for me, that felt very right.
My next steps, I don't know, I, I'm really curious to go back to
a bunch of the incredible researchers who I spoke with
during the course of the book and sort of find out how they're
doing right now. Because the Forest Service has
(32:39):
been so hard hit, the Park Service has been so hard hit
science research generally has been so hard hit the EPA, like
everything that supports an understanding of climate Noah
and the research that really canhelp us find our way in the
future is, is really under threat.
(33:02):
And so, but I don't know the specifics.
And that is something I'm hopingto return to and to write about
maybe more as articles or as essays for the next step.
And I also really want to keep working with people like Ellen,
anybody who wants to, with colleagues at Columbia, like at
(33:27):
other universities, other artists, to find ways to tell
the stories as you were talking about earlier, that connect
people to the changes that are happening and and make it really
clear how dire they are, but howmuch action and engagement can
make a difference. So.
(33:48):
Right, it's the most important at this point, which leads me to
ask you, what advice do you havefor listeners who want to
cultivate a deeper relationship with trees, especially those who
don't live near big forests or aren't ready to do a tree
climbing workshop? Are there accessible ways to
(34:09):
take to the trees wherever a person may?
Be. And I think there are, and I
think also the woman's tree climbing workshop is, is very
aware that some people don't need a whole weekend like to do
this training. They might want to just spend
the day in the canopy and and sort of have not have to learn
(34:31):
all the knots and the equipment,but just get up there and to be
there. So I think that there are gonna
be opportunities to do that through them as well.
And so those might be an easier on ramp than committing to
learning how to climb, although I would strongly encourage that
too. I live in New York City.
(34:51):
I don't live in a forest. I spend as much time in forests
as I can. But you can start just closely
observing a tree outside your house or your apartment building
or on the street or in a park. You can engage with community
groups who are really working ongreening suburban and urban
(35:13):
spaces. So I don't think you have to be
in the forest to take to the trees.
You just need to slow down a little bit and look carefully
and observe what's happening andthink about maybe who is the
caretaker for that tree? Could you become the caretaker
for that tree? Can you engage other people on
(35:33):
your block to be caretakers for the trees?
I've, I've mentioned this in some of the interviews I've
done, but I attended a course called Citizen Pruners that is
run by the trees New York and, and I took that class, which was
amazing. And I have still yet to take my
exam to become actually a citizen pruner, even though I
(35:56):
talk about this group all the time and what I learned in it.
You've. Been busy?
I hope I actually do this soon. But that's one example.
That's a New York City group that has thousands of members
and people who are looking at the trees, who have learned how
to prune them in a Safeway, who can look at the soil, who can
(36:19):
look at the tree pits and who can really start to think about
caretaking. And I think that, you know, you
can do it anywhere. It doesn't have to be in a
forest or at the scale of a whole woodland.
Right, it's starting wherever you are with whatever you have.
So of course we suggest that everyone go out and and purchase
(36:42):
your book at their nearest bookstore or get it at the
library. But if people want to know more,
where where can they find you, especially to know about your
upcoming tour for the next few months?
I have a a new website that one of my friends former student
designed Janelle Redka. It's absolutely beautiful and
(37:06):
it's Marguerite holloway.com andI'm putting all of the book
tours on there. I also put it on LinkedIn
yesterday, the whole list of them.
But the links to the actual bookstores are up and I will
keep updating that and adding podcasts and interviews and
things when they appear. I also just really like talking
(37:29):
to people, so I'm very open to people reaching out.
I had the most beautiful letter from from a gentleman, I think
in Fairbanks who works with wood.
He told me the stories of all ofthe trees around his house and
then in his home and all the things that he had built with
these different trees and sent me pictures.
(37:52):
It was one of the most beautiful, beautiful notes.
Anyway, I love hearing from people so they can do that
through the website or through my Columbia.
I have a Columbia faculty website too.
Wonderful and, and I'm not surprised that you have received
mail like that because your work, including this book take
to the Trees is very inspiring, as is this conversation.
(38:17):
So thank you so much for being with us today.
Marguerite. I know you talk about sort of
the care and safety that people need to feel in order to go out
and make a difference. And honestly, your work really
lends itself to to feeling health, to feeling safe, and to
feeling empowered to go out and make a difference.
(38:38):
So thank you for your words and your inspiration.
We'll be looking out for for your book and for your tour and
for all of the work to come. Thank you again.
Thank you so much. This was a really, really lovely
and wonderful conversation and Ireally appreciate it.
Thank you it. Was all our pleasure.
(39:00):
Marguerite's journey leaves us with a quiet truth.
When we feel safe, truly safe, we can open.
We can stretch higher, root deeper, and see the world more
clearly. Tenderness is not only an
emotion, it's a space we create for one another, a shelter where
(39:21):
growth becomes possible. Here on the ground, the trees
still stand tall above us, theirbranches reaching out, their
roots holding steady, reminding us that safety and care for
ourselves, for each other, for the wild places we love are not
just the soil beneath our feet, but the very roots that lift us
(39:44):
toward the sky. Marguerite carries with her a
powerful reminder from her mother, a tree journal, a legacy
of care and witness that lives on through her.
In the same way, the care we offer now, through our stories,
our actions, and our love for the natural world becomes the
(40:05):
legacy we leave behind, a gift for generations yet to come.
And it is through story, the stories we tell and the
relationships we nurture with trees and the earth, that we
find the spark to act, to protect, to restore, and to
build a healthier climate and ecosystem for all who share the
(40:27):
earth. Because to take to the trees is
to step forward with courage, tobecome part of a legacy that
nurtures life and lifts us all towards something better.
Thank you to Marguerite for showing us one way to make this
possible, for reminding us of what we once knew when we could
(40:49):
so easily climb a tree without acare, and of the great
responsibility we now carry for them.
Until next time, be gentle with yourself and keep listening.
For in the rustle of leaves and the stretch of branches, the
trees are still speaking. And if we're quiet enough, we
(41:10):
might just hear the future calling.
This week's episode was written and recorded in New York City on
the native lands of the Lenape tribes.
This episode was produced, written and edited by Jonathan
Zoutner with Dory Robinson. To learn more about our podcasts
(41:33):
and episodes, please visit treespeechpodcast.com and
consider supporting us through our Patreon.
Every contribution supports our production and we.
Offer gifts of gratitude to. Patrons at every level.
If you liked this episode. Please rate and review us on
Apple Podcasts or share it with a friend.
Every kind word helps this forest grow.
(41:56):
And thank you for listening to Tree Speech today.
Reaching for one branch at a time, pulling myself higher and
higher, one step then another, as the ground drifts away
beneath my feet. Above, sunlight sifts through a
lattice of green, and every leafseems to whisper its own small
(00:30):
story. When I was much younger, I found
such comfort and accomplishment in the canopies of trees.
Climbing felt adventurous and daring, athletic, artistic and
brave. I'm Jonathan Zoutner, and this
(00:53):
is tree speech. It's been a long time since I
felt the exhilaration of climbing a tree, but in today's
episode, we listen for what the treetops can still teach us
about beauty, urgency, and care with someone who began climbing
trees as an adult and whose lifereminds us of the fearlessness
(01:15):
we all need to grow. Our guest, Marguerite Holloway,
is an author, journalist, and professor whose latest book,
Take to the Trees, a story of hope, science, and self
discovery in America's ImperiledForests, is a vivid blend of
science, memoir, and adventure. She chronicles her
(01:38):
transformation from tree climbing novice to passionate
canopy explorer, guided by twin arborists Bear and Melissa
Livangi. Along the way, she learns not
only the skills and science of climbing, but also urgent truths
about the challenges our forestsface and the quiet understanding
(02:00):
that trees, like people, hold histories, grief and resilience
in their rings. Marguerite Weave's powerful
personal reflections on loss, resilience, and the enduring
bond between people and trees. With lyrical reportage.
That balances alarm with hope. She has written for the New York
(02:23):
Times, The New Yorker, Audubon, Wired, and Scientific American.
Today, she serves as professor and director of science and
environmental Journalism at Columbia University's Graduate
School of Journalism and is alsothe author of The Measure of
Manhattan, The story of John Randall Junior, the surveyor who
(02:43):
laid out New York City's 1811 grid plan, and of the
researchers who use his data today.
Now she brings that same depth and wonder into the branches of
our forests and our lives. In our conversation, we'll
explore the research and writingof Take to the Trees, the
(03:03):
unexpected lessons of climbing high into the canopy, and what
her journey taught her about theresilience of forests and of
herself. So lace up your boots, look up
toward the branches, and join usas we take to the trees with
Marguerite Holloway. Let's listen.
(03:28):
Well, hello Marguerite. It is so wonderful to have you
on the podcast today on this hotJuly day.
But I'm excited to to discuss your book.
So thank you for joining us. Thank you so much for inviting
me, I'm really looking forward to this conversation.
Me too. So I'm going to start with where
(03:48):
I was introduced to you and to your book.
Take to the Trees. And that was at the book launch,
which happened on the Upper WestSide at Book Culture.
And I was intrigued by by the book and by you.
And so I went there to hear you read from the book and to to
learn more about it. And I've been thinking a lot
(04:11):
about tenderness lately and sortof this need for more tenderness
in our world and for each other and patience.
And I was really struck by the amount of tenderness in that
room from you and for the content and for the passion that
you have for this book that was being launched into the world,
(04:32):
but also from the people that were there.
I gathered from all walks of your life, students, colleagues,
family tree scientists, other climbers, tree people.
And I just wanted to hear from you what that felt like to have
all of those people in one placein the room celebrating you and
(04:52):
your work and trees in this way.It, it was incredibly moving and
that I think it might choke me up a little bit, but I was so
nervous about the reading and also in some ways about the
book, because for me, it is sucha departure in terms of the way
(05:12):
I've written in the last couple of decades.
And just every second another person came in just was like, Oh
my God, you, oh, you, you. Like just this incredible joy
about people who had made the effort to be there.
And this incredible sense of what I think connects to
(05:36):
tenderness, but a sense of safety and a sense of connection
and kindness. And I just felt that from
everybody in the room. And it was, it transformed my
nervousness into this kind of euphoric energy that was really
(05:57):
wonderful. And I was very moved by the
questions, some of them from people who had been with me
through this whole process and knew some of the very particular
details and things that I had been thinking about.
And then others that were were broader but just so creative and
(06:18):
engaging and made me also realize that the book, which I
know abstractly, but then any piece of writing, different
people find different things in it and that that is very moving.
Yes, yes. And, and sitting there was a
moving experience in itself. So let's talk about the book and
(06:39):
about your sort of entry point into it.
You've described attending the Women's Tree Climbing Workshop
as a turning point where fear ofheights, grief, and a career
crossroads all converged for you.
What made you say yes to the climb?
And once you were up in the canopy, what shifted for you
(07:02):
internally? I think I may have mentioned
this before, but I had been writing about climate change and
I was working on a story for theNew York Times about climate
change in New England forests. And as part of that, I, I heard
about Baron Melissa actually from someone who works for the
(07:22):
International Society of Arbor Culture in in New England.
And then I met them and I can't imagine saying no to anything
that they. Would propose.
They are just so present, so kind, so aware of the world and
of people and of the natural world that the non human natural
(07:47):
world that when they told me about the workshop and then they
found a space for me, someone had, I think there's often a
very long wait list. And the one I had wanted to take
was filled up and then there wasa cancellation and they let me
know. And I, I think it took me maybe,
you know, 3 or 4 minutes to decide.
(08:09):
Yes. And so I knew that it was going
to be very challenging because of, as you mentioned, I had this
incredible fear of heights. And I'm on the older side, not
I, I'm, I think I'm relatively physically fit, but taking on
something that I knew was going to be very physically
(08:29):
challenging and it was going to really push me, you know, was,
was daunting up in the canopy. As you say, all sorts of things
happened to me. It, they didn't happen
immediately. They happened over time over
going back to the same trees andto the same place several times.
(08:51):
The transformation for me was was slow, but it didn't happen.
Well, and the book is about thatself discovery, but it it also
pertains to your relationship with your late mother and
brother through the lens of yourtime with trees.
(09:12):
Could you tell us a little bit about how the act of climbing,
physically ascending into this canopy?
How did that shape your experience of grief and healing?
I think there's something about feeling that you can't do
something that you just, it is, it is not possible for you to do
(09:33):
something and then within a few seconds or a minute or however
long it takes, you do that thing.
And it made me feel this incredible sense of, of, of
strength and centeredness and a sense that yes, I, I could deal
(09:55):
with things, I could face things, not just physical things
and challenges, but also emotional and psychological
challenges. And they were all bound
together. And I think we are all, we are
all bound together in this way. Like the physical expression of
(10:16):
things is so connected to the way we think and the way we
feel. And I think many of us feel most
alive when there is some kind offusion, when those when those
realms are all sort of operatingtogether, even if we don't
always recognize that they're operating together in that
(10:37):
moment. And overcoming the physical
challenges led me to overcome these blocks, I think in emotion
and being able to face a lot of the loss and grief.
And I had this experience and I write about it in the book.
But being in the canopy, feelingthis incredible joy and then
(10:58):
suddenly feeling these waves of grief and sadness and was all
connected. But I feel as though if I hadn't
pushed myself and realized thesestrengths in myself, I wouldn't
have gotten there in the same way.
Right. And reading about that process
(11:19):
is is quite inspiring and the way that you detail it really
takes us through piece by piece the amount of time, the amount
of patience, and the process that healing undergoes. 1/3
aspect of the book with this personal journey is climate
change. And you've written that climate
(11:42):
change feels like a trauma that keeps gathering power because we
won't look directly at it. How did climbing trees help you
reframe or manage climate anxiety in real time?
Well, I think that in the same way that I couldn't maybe look
so directly at the grief around the loss of my mother and my
(12:06):
brother, I feel it is very similar and I feel as though we
as a society do not want to. Well, that's not true.
That's an over generalization. There are many people, in fact,
I think most people are, are looking as directly as they can
at this, at this huge issue. But I think that's very
(12:31):
different than engaging with it in a very active everyday way.
And the longer we put off looking at it directly and
acting as if it is perhaps the most important thing, the longer
it just snowballs and gathers force.
And I do feel that there is a lot of connection between facing
(12:56):
things as an individual and facing things as a society.
And I think climate change is very much, very much resides in
that, in that realm. And I have to say also, it was
overwhelming doing all this research on what climate change
is doing to trees and then what pests and diseases are doing.
(13:19):
And, and at times it was really very consistently dark and
difficult. And it was in meeting people who
are trying so hard at all these different levels, at the level
of themselves, their family, their community, their forest,
(13:40):
their profession, their research, their policy efforts
like that really began to make me feel in a in a much broader
community of people who are looking very directly at it and
who are who are feeling grief, but who are also feeling agency.
And that is what the book and climbing did for me.
(14:06):
I I understand and the importance of community and
collective care is apparent throughout every.
Page of the book. Let's stay there for a moment.
The book highlights the work of women in what's long been a male
dominated field. What lessons would you say
(14:26):
emerged from your time at Camp High Rock and throughout the
book, and how did those women influence your view of the
broader climate movement? Again, I think it really has to
do with people understanding their own power and and learning
that power and recognizing it ina setting in which they feel
(14:50):
safe and cared for. Because I think in those
settings, we really do our best.We face things, we are more open
to things, we are less defensive.
And the process of being in the workshop and observing so many
other workshops that I wasn't anactive participant in, but was
(15:14):
sort of more reporting on and talking to the, the women and
made me just see. And many good teachers know
this, like if you create a spacein which people feel safe,
they're willing to take all sorts of risks intellectually
and physically that help them grow.
(15:34):
And that's one of the, the big things that I, that I took from
the workshop. I also took this amazing sense
of it doesn't matter where in the country you are, you are, if
you've gone through that workshop, part of this like huge
network of people who are all doing really important things.
(15:55):
Whether it is trying to explain to home owners the importance of
the trees and how they can make better choices in terms of what
they want to take down or what they want to plant.
Or, you know, somebody just supporting someone who's had a
really crappy day on a, on a crew that doesn't appreciate
them or connecting researchers who are coming at the same
(16:20):
problem in very different ways. And that network, I think we
tend to forget because there is so much fragmentation in our
society that we read about constantly, that there's
actually also a lot of cohesion in our society and a lot of
people who are very connected around the same issues and do
(16:41):
express a lot of care. And I think it's just really,
really important to remember that.
Yes, it's powerful. I've heard, I've heard it's
referred to as sort of a mycelial network of climbers
because they're all interconnected and feeding one
another and nourishing each other and the earth.
And it's honestly, I believe through that power, that real
(17:06):
change will happen, the change that is needed for humanity.
I agree and and Baron Melissa explicitly referred to it as the
Mycelial Network of the Women's Tree Climbing Workshop.
I love that imagery. It's it's you feel like you're
part of something. As I said, powerful, but but
creating real change. As a Columbia journalism
(17:28):
professor and longtime reporter,how did blending memoir,
science, and immersive adventureshift your writing process?
Did it uncover insights you wouldn't have found through
traditional reporting? And how was that process to
write in a different way than you had previously done?
(17:49):
It was very, very difficult for me and I have thought about it a
lot because I started my I started, I was a comparative
literature major and I did a lotof fiction writing when I was in
at university. And I really for a long time
thought that that was the way that I would go.
(18:11):
And I ended up focusing on science and public health in
large part, I think, because it needs a lot of translation,
those realms, because people areintimidated by science, although
none of us should be. And there's a lot of opportunity
for using description and imagery and narrative to make
(18:36):
those worlds feel those realms feel much more accessible.
That said, I turned away from fiction writing, and although I
was incorporating those components of writing that I
really love in terms of imagery and translation and description,
I was doing journalism in a verytraditional and very sort of
(18:57):
classical science journalist way, and I have always
discouraged my students from using I.
There has to be a very, very good reason for it.
You really need like it. It has to make a lot of sense.
If you can read the piece without the eye just as easily,
(19:18):
then the eye should probably notbe there.
But here I was now including myself, including my family,
including all of this description of my internal life
and, and, and braiding it with science journalism.
And it was a very, very difficult process.
(19:39):
And it took a lot of encouragement on the part of my
editors in my family and at Norton, my amazing editor at
Norton, Tom Mayer and my husbandTom, and my kids, Auden and
Julian. It was almost like a musical
process where something had goneon too long, maybe a scientific
(20:02):
description, and felt as though.The the braiding with the
personal or with the memoir wasn't happening at the right
rhythm, but the right pacing. So I would have to go back and
all sorts of associations happened in that going back that
I think would have never happened if I was writing in the
(20:23):
way that I have for the last several decades.
Associations would just would just come almost in this.
It was, it was kind of wild whenit happened and I can't really
explain it, but there were connections that I was much more
open to because I was writing about these memories and my
(20:46):
family and my own experience that I just don't think I would
have made otherwise. I don't know quite how to
explain that. I, I was talking with my editor
about it at one point and I mentioned this artist that my
husband and I love. Her name is Isabella Ortiz.
And she describes, and I think many painters do this of sort of
(21:06):
she approaches her canvas or herpaper from one side and she
turns it and she comes in another side and she turns it,
she comes in another side and like there is very non linear.
And that's exactly what my process was like.
Usually it's very linear and it was not at all this time.
I was coming in here, coming in there, turning it like leaving
(21:28):
it and and that all made for something quite different that
I'm very happy with. Yes, that's fascinating.
We talked about the book launch.Did it feel different putting
this into the world as well? Because it.
Contained. More personal information and
parts of you that you were now sharing with the the whole
(21:50):
world. It did feel different, but on
the other it it felt very scary and I think that's part of why I
was so nervous. I mean part of it is just being
in front of a group. A crowd that always is can make
one nervous or make me nervous. But at the same time, it is the
most me thing I've ever written.And I feel so grateful to have
(22:17):
been able to have the freedom toapproach this book in this way.
And so yes, it, it, it did. It scared me a little bit, but I
also just feel this enormous sense of of gratitude and and
and joy about having written something that really feels for
the first time fully in my voice, fully me.
(22:41):
All of the all of the elements of your world sort of came
together to produce this beautiful work as you were
writing then, drawing from all of these different components,
how did you balance urgency withwonder in in your writing,
especially when facing what feels like irreversible
ecological change? And we've heard a lot about how
(23:05):
we present or how climate changeis presented and the importance
of story within that, how how people learn about climate
change and what needs to happen.So I wonder your thoughts on
what responsibility storytellersmay carry in this moment as
we're looking at the work that needs to be done.
(23:27):
I think storytellers have an incredibly important role to
play and not in necessarily in the on the tracks that we
usually think of. I think we need storytellers and
in all, all situations, all sites, anyone who can describe
change and, and communicate it against this backdrop of what is
(23:52):
happening, I think is extremely valuable.
And I, I think sometimes these very landscape or bird's eye
scale understandings, they're, they're critically important,
but it's also, it's also the understanding of what is right
next to you and right around you.
(24:12):
And there are people who who observe closely pretty much I
think everyone observes closely given the opportunity and that
that that be celebrated and thatthat be presented in a way that
feels accessible and allows people in I think is just
absolutely essential. And what you said about urgency
(24:35):
and wonder, I think it's really fascinating because again and
again, you know, scientists and when one of one of the
researchers in the book says this, but it's it's horrifying
what he's seeing happen to, for example, the Beech trees, the
forests are, are looking completely denuded.
(24:55):
And you know, this incredible food source is disappearing.
And yet he is so driven to understand why this is
happening, how this is happening, the the, the
intricate, granular details of these nematodes.
And it it, he has this incredible curiosity and wonder
(25:19):
about understanding these processes at the same time that
he has this incredible sense of urgency and incredible clarity
about what is happening and grief about what is happening to
the forest. So I think that that fusion
makes a lot of sense that you you can have all those things.
And in fact, it's very motivating to have all those
(25:41):
things. Yes, I believe that too.
Sort of. Everything happens.
It can happen all at the same time.
All of these contrasts can be true.
Throughout the book, there's a anarrative thread that involves
you uncovering trees that you learned were important to your
(26:02):
mother, but only had found that they were important to her after
she had died. Could you talk a little bit
about about that? Yes.
So the germ or the seed of the book really began right after my
mother died and I was cleaning out her apartment.
And I thought I had, you know, seen everything that there was
(26:25):
because I had moved her from oneapartment to another.
I'd redone her apartment. I'd taken care of her.
And this tree journal I had not seen.
And it just blows my mind that Ihadn't found that before.
But in the Tree Journal for about 11 years, she chronicles
all these trees that she meets and writes about their Natural
(26:46):
History, and sometimes she drawsthem.
And I knew that she loved trees because she had had my brother
and I spend a lot of time out ofdoors and try to learn, had us
learn the names, tried to teach us the names of all the trees.
So I knew she had a lot of deep knowledge, but I hadn't known
(27:07):
that it was that she had sort ofbrought her artistic and
naturalist sensibility to chronicling that in any way.
So it made me feel it hugely connected to her to start to
see, to observe as closely as she did some of the trees that I
(27:28):
was getting to know. That made me feel like I
understood her, even though I'vealways known she was a
naturalist. It made me understand her more
deeply and, and that I'm, I'm just incredibly happy about that
and feel very lucky to have discovered that journal when I
did actually, you know, because she had dementia.
(27:51):
And if I had discovered it in the thralls of her dementia, I
don't know if we would have beenable to communicate it about it
in some way. Yeah.
Where is the journal now? Do you have it in your
possession or where and who? I think it is right here.
Yes, it is right here. I keep it right near me and I
(28:14):
look at it occasionally and I it's right here.
I think I might still do something with it because there
were many, there are many trees that she wrote about that I
didn't write about in the book. And I didn't share any of her
illustrations or any of these images of the leaves that she
taped in. And I am really curious about
(28:36):
the Natural History description she got.
I found one reference to a library at at the University of
Berkeley, University of California at Berkeley.
And I'm really curious, like what texts she was in reading.
So that is something I might look into going forward because
(28:56):
they're not the standard texts, the field books and field guides
that I've looked at. There's a very different
language. It's amazing.
There might be more to. Do and it feels sort of like she
guided this process. You know, it's really beautiful.
It's when, when she her, her story and the story of the
journal is interwoven with we talked as we talked about
(29:18):
urgency and wonder it, it reallycreates those moments to
breathe, to gain perspective andto feel energized to do the work
that needs to happen to, to makethis world a better place.
You talked about your mother's illustrations, which I would
love to see. So I hope that you do something
(29:38):
with that, with that journal oneday when the timing is right.
But I must also mention the gorgeous and inspiring
illustrations that appear throughout this book.
They are magical. And I wonder if you could tell
us how you hope the illustrations relate to your
writing, and maybe what that relationship or dialogue is.
Oh, that. I mean, Ellen Weiner is just so
(30:02):
brilliant. And I wanted illustrations that
that had a lot of emotion to them and a lot of movement and
power to them because this book is about so many things.
But the trees as characters who are sort of trying to tell a
different story or different facet of climate change, they
(30:26):
come forward and take the stage.And I wanted the the
illustrations to have as much like, to have as much presence
as possible. And Ellen kept saying that she
was not a traditional botanical illustrator and that I didn't
really know what I was doing. And I kept saying, I do know
(30:49):
exactly what I'm doing. Like just see them and they move
and they, they're evocative. They're like poems.
And she has a very, very strong connection to poetry and to
literature. And I'm so thrilled.
I feel like they, they tell the story, they work with the text,
but they're also their own story.
(31:11):
And we very much worked with a, a designer to have them coming
in and the text go around them in places where that felt felt
right. But I I feel like you could get
a sense of light and dark and power and hope and despair by
looking at the illustrations just by themselves.
(31:32):
Yes. Yeah, you definitely do.
It is now that you say that it is visual poetry, and I'm glad
you convinced her to be a part that.
Really. Complete.
I am so lucky. That's gorgeous.
We touched on this a little bit,but how has your perspective on
nature, storytelling and humanity's place?
(31:53):
This is a big question in the World evolved since finishing
the book. And what are your next questions
for yourself, for science or forthe forests?
I feel as though the book helpedme sort of align the personal
and the societal. It made me feel like it's OK to
(32:16):
be explicit about all these realms being connected.
At least for me, that felt very right.
My next steps, I don't know, I, I'm really curious to go back to
a bunch of the incredible researchers who I spoke with
during the course of the book and sort of find out how they're
doing right now. Because the Forest Service has
(32:39):
been so hard hit, the Park Service has been so hard hit
science research generally has been so hard hit the EPA, like
everything that supports an understanding of climate Noah
and the research that really canhelp us find our way in the
future is, is really under threat.
(33:02):
And so, but I don't know the specifics.
And that is something I'm hopingto return to and to write about
maybe more as articles or as essays for the next step.
And I also really want to keep working with people like Ellen,
anybody who wants to, with colleagues at Columbia, like at
(33:27):
other universities, other artists, to find ways to tell
the stories as you were talking about earlier, that connect
people to the changes that are happening and and make it really
clear how dire they are, but howmuch action and engagement can
make a difference. So.
(33:48):
Right, it's the most important at this point, which leads me to
ask you, what advice do you havefor listeners who want to
cultivate a deeper relationship with trees, especially those who
don't live near big forests or aren't ready to do a tree
climbing workshop? Are there accessible ways to
(34:09):
take to the trees wherever a person may?
Be. And I think there are, and I
think also the woman's tree climbing workshop is, is very
aware that some people don't need a whole weekend like to do
this training. They might want to just spend
the day in the canopy and and sort of have not have to learn
(34:31):
all the knots and the equipment,but just get up there and to be
there. So I think that there are gonna
be opportunities to do that through them as well.
And so those might be an easier on ramp than committing to
learning how to climb, although I would strongly encourage that
too. I live in New York City.
(34:51):
I don't live in a forest. I spend as much time in forests
as I can. But you can start just closely
observing a tree outside your house or your apartment building
or on the street or in a park. You can engage with community
groups who are really working ongreening suburban and urban
(35:13):
spaces. So I don't think you have to be
in the forest to take to the trees.
You just need to slow down a little bit and look carefully
and observe what's happening andthink about maybe who is the
caretaker for that tree? Could you become the caretaker
for that tree? Can you engage other people on
(35:33):
your block to be caretakers for the trees?
I've, I've mentioned this in some of the interviews I've
done, but I attended a course called Citizen Pruners that is
run by the trees New York and, and I took that class, which was
amazing. And I have still yet to take my
exam to become actually a citizen pruner, even though I
(35:56):
talk about this group all the time and what I learned in it.
You've. Been busy?
I hope I actually do this soon. But that's one example.
That's a New York City group that has thousands of members
and people who are looking at the trees, who have learned how
to prune them in a Safeway, who can look at the soil, who can
(36:19):
look at the tree pits and who can really start to think about
caretaking. And I think that, you know, you
can do it anywhere. It doesn't have to be in a
forest or at the scale of a whole woodland.
Right, it's starting wherever you are with whatever you have.
So of course we suggest that everyone go out and and purchase
(36:42):
your book at their nearest bookstore or get it at the
library. But if people want to know more,
where where can they find you, especially to know about your
upcoming tour for the next few months?
I have a a new website that one of my friends former student
designed Janelle Redka. It's absolutely beautiful and
(37:06):
it's Marguerite holloway.com andI'm putting all of the book
tours on there. I also put it on LinkedIn
yesterday, the whole list of them.
But the links to the actual bookstores are up and I will
keep updating that and adding podcasts and interviews and
things when they appear. I also just really like talking
(37:29):
to people, so I'm very open to people reaching out.
I had the most beautiful letter from from a gentleman, I think
in Fairbanks who works with wood.
He told me the stories of all ofthe trees around his house and
then in his home and all the things that he had built with
these different trees and sent me pictures.
(37:52):
It was one of the most beautiful, beautiful notes.
Anyway, I love hearing from people so they can do that
through the website or through my Columbia.
I have a Columbia faculty website too.
Wonderful and, and I'm not surprised that you have received
mail like that because your work, including this book take
to the Trees is very inspiring, as is this conversation.
(38:17):
So thank you so much for being with us today.
Marguerite. I know you talk about sort of
the care and safety that people need to feel in order to go out
and make a difference. And honestly, your work really
lends itself to to feeling health, to feeling safe, and to
feeling empowered to go out and make a difference.
(38:38):
So thank you for your words and your inspiration.
We'll be looking out for for your book and for your tour and
for all of the work to come. Thank you again.
Thank you so much. This was a really, really lovely
and wonderful conversation and Ireally appreciate it.
Thank you it. Was all our pleasure.
(39:00):
Marguerite's journey leaves us with a quiet truth.
When we feel safe, truly safe, we can open.
We can stretch higher, root deeper, and see the world more
clearly. Tenderness is not only an
emotion, it's a space we create for one another, a shelter where
(39:21):
growth becomes possible. Here on the ground, the trees
still stand tall above us, theirbranches reaching out, their
roots holding steady, reminding us that safety and care for
ourselves, for each other, for the wild places we love are not
just the soil beneath our feet, but the very roots that lift us
(39:44):
toward the sky. Marguerite carries with her a
powerful reminder from her mother, a tree journal, a legacy
of care and witness that lives on through her.
In the same way, the care we offer now, through our stories,
our actions, and our love for the natural world becomes the
(40:05):
legacy we leave behind, a gift for generations yet to come.
And it is through story, the stories we tell and the
relationships we nurture with trees and the earth, that we
find the spark to act, to protect, to restore, and to
build a healthier climate and ecosystem for all who share the
(40:27):
earth. Because to take to the trees is
to step forward with courage, tobecome part of a legacy that
nurtures life and lifts us all towards something better.
Thank you to Marguerite for showing us one way to make this
possible, for reminding us of what we once knew when we could
(40:49):
so easily climb a tree without acare, and of the great
responsibility we now carry for them.
Until next time, be gentle with yourself and keep listening.
For in the rustle of leaves and the stretch of branches, the
trees are still speaking. And if we're quiet enough, we
(41:10):
might just hear the future calling.
This week's episode was written and recorded in New York City on
the native lands of the Lenape tribes.
This episode was produced, written and edited by Jonathan
Zoutner with Dory Robinson. To learn more about our podcasts
(41:33):
and episodes, please visit treespeechpodcast.com and
consider supporting us through our Patreon.
Every contribution supports our production and we.
Offer gifts of gratitude to. Patrons at every level.
If you liked this episode. Please rate and review us on
Apple Podcasts or share it with a friend.
Every kind word helps this forest grow.
(41:56):
And thank you for listening to Tree Speech today.
Popular Podcasts
My Favorite Murder with Karen Kilgariff and Georgia Hardstark
My Favorite Murder is a true crime comedy podcast hosted by Karen Kilgariff and Georgia Hardstark. Each week, Karen and Georgia share compelling true crimes and hometown stories from friends and listeners. Since MFM launched in January of 2016, Karen and Georgia have shared their lifelong interest in true crime and have covered stories of infamous serial killers like the Night Stalker, mysterious cold cases, captivating cults, incredible survivor stories and important events from history like the Tulsa race massacre of 1921. My Favorite Murder is part of the Exactly Right podcast network that provides a platform for bold, creative voices to bring to life provocative, entertaining and relatable stories for audiences everywhere. The Exactly Right roster of podcasts covers a variety of topics including historic true crime, comedic interviews and news, science, pop culture and more. Podcasts on the network include Buried Bones with Kate Winkler Dawson and Paul Holes, That's Messed Up: An SVU Podcast, This Podcast Will Kill You, Bananas and more.
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com