April 25, 2025 • 34 mins
New Zealand introduces crazy alcohol laws across the Easter Weekend, making it impossible for some businesses to trade. Adam describes the chaos and confusion of not being able to celebrate Easter Weekend the only way an Englishman knows how. Tune in and let us know if you agree!
In the second half, Adam and Alun open up about the difficulties of finding work as a backpacker on a Working Holiday Visa. If you're looking for advice regarding this topic, please get in touch. We'd love to help!
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
The alcohol laws in New Zealand are mental.
Play the theme music. Hello and welcome to this
episode of Tribology. I'm Alan and I'm here with the
(00:23):
ever holy Adam. Mate, I'm holy in a few ways
this week. It's Easter weekend, as we know.
I've been celebrating this weekend, but I've also got a few
new holes in my face. Yeah, holy, with an EHOLEY.
I've noticed you posting on the Instagram as if you're trying to
break some sort of Guinness World Record.
You've got all kinds of piercings up your face.
(00:46):
You want to talk about it? I think so.
There's been a couple of comments on the old gram down in
the DMS. What do we think?
Is it cringe? Am I too old?
Is it a midlife crisis? I am choosing not to comment.
Our Instagram, I see, is a very holy place to talk about travel,
to talk about the adventure intothe beyond.
You've chosen it to be a very holy place where you show
(01:08):
pictures of your face with all sorts of holes in.
Yeah, I mean, a lot of people won't know this.
I mean, even you, because our friendship is only sort of four
years old at this point. But I did have my nose pierced
when I was a lot younger, when Iwas back when I was in my early
20s, got myself a couple of earrings as well, just to go
with it. In for a penny, in for a pound,
as we say in the UK. But I don't know, I think I've
(01:30):
had some good comments. It feels all right.
It feels like the right time. And I guess I, I've been wanting
to do it for such a long time. And now that I'm in that
backpacker mode, I feel like, you know, that I'm not customer
facing. I'm not going to any business
meetings. I think it's all right.
And that that might sound sort of an old fuddy Duddy
traditional thing to say, but I just, you know, I don't
(01:53):
necessarily want to be walking around with a nose ring while
I'm going into corporate environments, is all I'm saying.
Well, here's what I'm saying mate.
If you wanted to do it and you're happy with it, I'm proud
of you for doing it. I think we should all just do
whatever we want. So I think nice, if anything, to
have metal in your face. Yeah, I mean, it might throw a
bit of a spanner in the works, excuse the pun, only because
(02:14):
you're going to be in Asia. We've spoken about that before,
over the next week or two perhaps.
I would love to join you, but the woman who pierced my nose
did say do not submerge your head underwater.
And we all know that the diving in the Philippines is absolutely
fantastic. So tough one.
Yeah. Did she also say don't go
through one of those airport scanners?
(02:38):
I mean, you know, it's fine. It is something to take care of.
It is a bit of a burden, especially if you're sleeping in
dorms and, you know, moving around hostels and that kind of
stuff. It can be quite difficult to
keep clean. But I'm doing my best.
I think. I think it looks all right.
Well, honest opinion, do you hate it?
Well, on my honest opinion, is your camera's not quite high
definition enough for me to see it?
Oh so. Let me get close to see if I can
(03:00):
get the light shining on it. This bloody massive lamp that
I've been lugging around the whole of Auckland for two weeks.
I. Think it's lovely, Adam.
Nice. Like I said, to get metal in
your face. How else has it been going?
Your time in New Zealand is soldiering on.
I'm, I mean, the audience couldn't help but notice that
I'm still here in a house in Scotland.
(03:21):
So, so not yet on the road again, but you've been
gallivanting enough, doing travel for both of us.
I have, I mean, I've not been doing that much outside of
Auckland. Auckland's become a place that's
been incredibly easy to stay. We've mentioned a few times on
the show places like Ponsonby, really nice, Melbourne, really
nice neighborhood. There's, you know, maybe akin to
something you might find in Melbourne or Sydney perhaps.
(03:43):
Just been spending a lot of timein cafes, mate.
Just got a fantastic group of people at the hostel and I
wanted, I told you, I want to take the time to say this on on
air because you would expect, and I know that you've felt this
many times over that living in hostels for such a long time,
you do meet a lot of people thattell you travel stories around
the world and they say, oh, you know, I ended up staying there
(04:05):
for three months because we justhad a really good group of
people at the hostel. It was like a family and we just
all ended up staying there. However, I don't think I've felt
that as many times as you would expect.
But at this hostel in Auckland, I'm having a great time.
I really, really like it. There's a massive group of us
French people and we're all, we're all speaking French and
I'm improving my French and it's, it's just lovely.
(04:26):
It's a really nice atmosphere inthere.
Friends who Pierce together staytogether.
And you and your budding pals inPonsonby.
I like the sound of that mate. Any little activities you've
been getting up to? It's been Easter weekend, that's
exciting. I just spent it sort of waking
up, perhaps eating a small pieceof chocolate in the shape of an
egg, celebrating the resurrection of what can only be
(04:48):
described as Christ. So I think, yeah, I'd like to
hear what you did. Yeah.
I mean, it has been a few weeks since we mentioned religion on
the podcast. And you know, we do like to do
that periodically. I've been feeling itchy.
You're a great person to ask because Easter weekend now we do
celebrate it in the UK typically, as you've said, with
some chocolate. What else goes on for the kids
(05:10):
you do? Like?
An Easter egg hunt perhaps? Yeah, you can hide Easter eggs
all over the garden in my family.
Famously, once my brother pickedup an Easter egg, it had a slug
on it. It sent him into such a terror
that the whole of Easter cascaded into sort of a mollusk
fearing ceremony. What else happens?
I mean, we just celebrate the idea of rebirth, the coming of
(05:32):
spring, the idea of new things sort of emerging all over the
world. OK, so that's what it is.
There's no church going in your house on a Sunday.
There's no mass or sermon or anyother word that you can fit in
that's vaguely religious. I don't really know much about
it. A church, a sermon, a massive
celebration, a kind of event with candlelight and priests.
No, we don't do any of that in my house.
(05:53):
We just sort of maybe vaguely think about the idea of rebirth
over, you know, a morning egg. So in a very English way, I
mean, we celebrated it over Easter weekend with some some
French and some English people. In the only way we know how to
celebrate anything, which is to to drink a lot of alcohol.
Ah, yeah. OK.
(06:14):
Of course. I mean, I mean, it has to be
said during the Last Supper on aGood Friday.
You know, actually I think he did the supper on Thursday, Good
Friday was the day where he actually went up to the hill.
Jesus did partake of wine. So drinking alcohol may not
actually be a terrible way to sort of remember that moment.
I'm not sure you're allowed to say that.
(06:36):
Well, this is where it gets really interesting because I do
want to preface this by saying both you and me, I'm going to
put words in your mouth here that we like to respect the
culture, the location that we'rein.
We completely understand that the location that we're in is
experiencing us. We, we want to minimize our
impact. We want to blend in.
We want to, you know, appreciatewhatever.
However, when it's somewhere like New Zealand, which feels
(06:58):
quite close to home in terms of its culture, but, but hang on.
But there are some rules and regulations surrounding alcohol,
which I think make absolutely nosense.
They're completely unfounded. And it threw a massive curveball
towards me and certainly the other English guys, to the point
where we were parading around the streets just, you know,
(07:19):
scratching our heads thinking, fucking hell, this is absolutely
mental. OK.
Do you want to talk to me about it?
Do you want me to do some Eastertherapy for you?
Yeah, I, I would like to mate. So I'm going to tell you
everything I know about the rules and regulations.
I've done a little bit of reading, but it was after the
fact because this is the sort ofthing that's that made its way
through to us in terms of the information, the flow of
information, way too late. OK, so we knew that.
(07:44):
Obviously we knew that there wasGood Friday coming up and we
knew that there was Easter Sunday and Easter Monday.
Now, the first time I knew something was wrong was when I
turned up to a supermarket on Friday morning to just buy some
fruit and the supermarkets were closed.
Now it's very rare the supermarket shuts, especially on
a public holiday. I don't know if that happens in
(08:05):
the UK, maybe they close early, but I would like to think that
they would do some pretty good business on these holidays.
Where are you heading? You're heading to a countdown,
something like that. OK, Is that the name of a
supermarket in New Zealand? Yeah.
No, no Woolies mate. OK, Yeah, All right.
Woolworths actually, do you knowwhat I think?
I think maybe countdowns Canadian, and it's the Canadian
version of Woolworths. I'm not quite sure.
(08:26):
Woolworths is the big green one,the main one.
In you got it. You got.
It OK, Yeah, gotcha. So then I started asking
questions. And then you go back to the
hostel and of course it makes its way through the Grapevine.
Oh yeah, everything's shut. Oh, oh, by the way, it's not
just everything's shut, it's Good Friday, which means that
none of the bars are going to beopen either because they can't
sell alcohol by law. And you start going.
(08:48):
OK, so. Right.
So I mean, does this extend any further than that?
Oh yeah. So at that point you're
thinking, finally some fucking respect for religious festival.
Yeah, all I wanted to do was just sit there completely sober
and think about what Good Fridaymeans to me.
Now I can have the kind of contemplative Good Friday that
(09:09):
I've been waiting for my whole life.
There's me going now. Hang on, It's a Friday night
though. Have they not?
Have they not taken account for the fact it's a Friday night and
that's when you drink alcohol Good Friday night, yes.
So, so then, you know, we're allscratching our heads thinking,
oh fucking hell, that came around quick.
That's a bit of a surprise. And then we start talking to
(09:31):
people about about the weekend, right.
And the manager of the hostel, he's a lovely guy, he's from
Wales. He said, oh, it gets even more
bizarre than that lads. Friday, Good Friday, nothing's
open. However, at 12 O1, because it's
technically Saturday, all the bars and clubs open and you can
drink alcohol and go and party. I was like, OK, right.
(09:54):
So tonight if we want to go out,it's.
A bit of a loophole. In it yeah, it's a good one.
So yeah. So all right, if we want to go
out and drink, we either buy ouralcohol before, but that time
had already passed unfortunately.
Maybe we'll find someone in the hostel who was smart enough to
buy a couple of bottles of wine that we can get some off and
then we just wait until 12, we go out, we have a good time,
whatever. He said do be careful though,
(10:15):
because on Saturday night everything is open until 12
because 12 O1 is technically Easter Sunday when everything
shuts again. I'm going like, but hang on.
What do you mean? Like, what about all the clubs
and bars open on a Saturday night?
He says, yeah, yeah, they just opened slightly earlier and then
they close at midnight and everyone has to go home.
(10:36):
I'm going because it's Easter Sunday.
OK, that's that's quite crazy. However, again, there were a few
rumours that there's maybe a couple of bars that had an
exemption. There's maybe some areas of
Auckland that that for some reason have got an exemption as
well. There's maybe some places that
you can buy alcohol as long as you're eating food in the
restaurant at the same time. They weren't exempt from the
(10:59):
benefits of Christ literally dying for their sins though,
weren't they? No, they wreaked the benefit of
his sacrifice, but they got exemption from the alcohol sales
law. Very convenient.
It's, it was really, really strange.
It was like so, so backwards andmaybe I don't fully understand.
No, no, I mean, I have to go on air and say it because that's
(11:21):
what we were all saying at the time.
And you know, I'd rather represent myself as I as I was
then. But I was walking around the
streets with these, with this bunch from the hostel, and we're
trying to get into bars and stuff, but the people are piling
out because it's 1155 and I went.
What happens if there's remaining in there after
midnight? They turn into a fucking
pumpkin. I've got no idea, but the
(11:42):
security guard, there's one security guard.
So I'm on Kay Rd. We'll have Kay Rd. in, in
Auckland. There's a bar there that we were
going to go to. Everyone's piling out the bar as
we arrive at 11:50. And I spoke to the security
guard and I said, hey, mate, I look, I, I don't really
understand the rules, but I've heard that they're, you know,
through a bunch of people that maybe we can't find anywhere to
go after 12 or for some reason we can't buy alcohol.
(12:04):
Is that true? And he said, yeah, because we go
to church on a Sunday. I was like, oh God.
OK, don't use God's name in vain, bastard.
Well, listen, what do you say toyour detractors that say, you
know, New Zealand historically is a country that worships
Christianity, that Easter is a special day in Christianity and
(12:25):
perhaps, you know, take a day off the drinking in reverence to
the Lord? Well, I read an article, and
maybe you can correct me if I'm wrong, but I read an article
just this morning actually. There's written by I believe he
was someone involved in the church.
I don't know if he's a reverend or what, but he says nowhere,
absolutely nowhere in the Bible does it say that you are
prohibited from drinking alcoholon religious holidays.
(12:47):
So I'm not too sure where I stand with it.
I mean, it's certainly screwed over my night.
Perhaps in hindsight it was a good thing, but I went to a
little convenience store along KRd. just after that just to see
if I could try and charm some alcohol.
Nothing doing unfortunately, because I think they get they
get a hefty fine if they sell alcohol outside of the hours
they're allowed. And I spoke to a woman there and
(13:09):
I said, yeah, it's just, you know, really strange for me.
It's, you know, maybe a little bit of a culture shock that
we're we're in this time where the the government are like
rationing when we can, you know,or certainly enforcing rules
that stop us from buying alcoholat certain times.
I was, I was thinking, hang on, is this the pandemic?
Are we like back in COVID again?Are we allowed?
I don't know are we allowed out it?
(13:30):
Brings me like a strange sense of joy.
You sort of squirreling around Auckland on East to someday
desperate to find some booze. I think that's a beautiful
image. Like, I know, I know it sounds
bad, but it got to the point where it's more about principle
than whether I wanted a drink ornot.
I mean, it was pretty sober at this point.
And I was just thinking I shouldbe, I'm a fucking adult, I
(13:51):
should be allowed to buy alcohol.
So I spoke to this lovely lady and she said, yeah, I mean,
it's, we have a huge alcohol problem in New Zealand anyway,
and it is to try and curb that. And I said, what's the result
then? Does it help?
And she said, no, everyone just gets pissed much earlier and
everyone buys loads more booze earlier in the day or the OR the
week before. Oh, OK.
So as the adverse effect, it sort of accelerates the problem,
(14:12):
Does it? I mean mate, what do I what do I
know? Well, it's an interesting
concept, isn't it? I seem to remember something
similar to that. I mean, Patrick St.
Paddy's Day is just a few weeks before, isn't it?
And that's a major 1. So I think maybe I just had an
organic week off when it came toEaster Sunday when I was there.
I don't remember being sort of caged in wanting to unleash my
(14:34):
alcoholism out into the world. But I'm sorry you had the
experience mate. No, I mean, it was, it was
somewhat similar and reminiscentof the pandemic because there
were rules that were being enforced that I was looking at
and analysing and trying to do alittle bit of research onto
into, you know, as to why they were being enforced or
implemented in that way. And I just remember thinking,
but these there's no logic behind this.
(14:55):
I just don't make any sense. So.
Did you take the opportunity to ponder the resurrection, ponder
rebirth, ponder the, you know, the whole concept?
Or did you? No, not at all.
No, I spent most of the night just speaking to other
backpackers to see if I we couldscore a beer.
Well, there we go with that. Let's I just want a brief
meditation break. If you love the podcast as much
(15:18):
as we love you, please could youtake the time to rate the show
on your favorite podcasting platform?
Yeah, go and give it. Five stars everyone else has.
We're just waiting on you. Thanks for supporting us, it
means the world to us. Like a beer left on a shelf,
unable to be purchased until 24 hours of holiness of past allow
your conscious mind to return into your brain.
(15:40):
Adam, I can't help but paint an image of you roaming the Kiwi
streets desperate for booze on areligious holiday and I you know
that. Basically, that progression of
thoughts leads me to wonder, have you tried to get a fucking
job yet? Oh, yeah, because it sounds like
a little bit like a, you know, an alcoholic, something, you
(16:00):
know, alcoholic would do. I'm just concerned, you know,
there's a lot of tasks that needdoing for the for the podcast.
They haven't been done. You're messaging me going, I
love you, man, on Easter holidays.
And I'm just worried that perhaps you are feeling a little
bit unemployed. Yeah, you know, it's stark at
the moment because usually I frame my alcoholism by getting a
job in the wine industry, so it goes some somewhat undercover.
(16:25):
Yeah, you've got piercings in your face.
It's all basically I'm wonderingis everything OK?
Usually the size of the fucking tattoo on my back.
It's a picture of a beer bottle.Yeah, though, so, yeah, just to
answer your question, I mean, it's a bit of a sore subject for
me at the moment, mate. Trying to find a job in New
Zealand, as you well know, and so will the listener that I'm on
(16:46):
a working holiday visa. Thank goodness they increased
the age limit to 35, which meantthat I was included.
It turned my head and then I knew I was going to come here to
work in a country that I've always wanted to work in.
And the wine industry here is, it's pretty special.
I mean, obviously some world renowned wineries, some
fantastic, some of the world's best wine and I was really
looking forward to coming here and seeing what it was all
(17:07):
about. Now I have, I'm going to be very
honest about this. I've applied for two jobs and
this be quite a good thing for us to chat about, make quite a
good conversation because hopefully it resonates with a
lot of backpackers out there. A lot of people that have lived
in other countries with, you know, great experience, great
qualifications, highly educated.And we're in a position where
(17:27):
we're almost sort of vulnerable because the businesses that
we're applying to work at, they know that they have their pick
really of all the people that are here.
And I don't know whether it's certainly not the same as it
used to be, You know, certainly in Australia when you're doing
farm work and stuff. I mean, people were getting
exploited, wouldn't you agree? Yeah, it was definitely a
problem that people, you know, were basic, basically working
(17:49):
for free in exchange for the extension of their visa.
Yeah, doing absolutely horrendous jobs in awful
conditions. So, you know, I, I do feel
somewhat a bit sensitive about this because I've applied for
two jobs, which I was absolutelycertain I'll get interviews for
and was quietly, quietly confident I would be considered
(18:11):
for the role. And unfortunately, in both of
these situations, I've, I've been successful in getting an
interview. I've had a great time with the
companies themselves, either in an interview capacity or even a
trial shift in a wine bar, but I'm not going to mention the
name, obviously. However, I, I've received the
responses and they've been negative, they've been
(18:33):
unsuccessful and, and it's quitea strange moment in my life
actually, if I can be so, so serious as to say that because
it's a bit of a wake up call, mate, it really is.
You know, you think I'm thinkingabout the last 10 years of my
life and all the things I've achieved in the wine industry,
the wealth of knowledge that I have, the qualifications that
(18:53):
I've done, the amazing opportunities that I've been
very lucky to work and the incredible people that I've
worked with as well and learnt alot from.
But at the end of the day, I mean, it comes down to someone's
decision in a new business. And you've got like a finite
amount of time not just to get that job in particular, but
you're looking at your bank balance, especially in a country
in New Zealand. It's just going down and down
and down and down. And you go in there with good
(19:14):
intentions. You think, God, I'm so perfect
for this job. The job description is almost as
if they've written a descriptionof me.
And then the answer comes back and it's like, yeah, thanks, but
no thanks. We're we're going to move in
another direction. And, you know, good luck to you.
And you think, oh shit, back to square 1.
Yeah. OK.
So how has that made you? You said that it was making you
feel a bit reflective. In what way do you think?
(19:37):
I, I just think that I've, I wasso sure of myself and so
confident and, you know, I wouldhave loved to have thought that,
that I would have been considered for those roles very
seriously. And, and maybe I was, but it's
just, it's not as easy as as I thought it would be.
(19:57):
And I guess maybe it's what is it delusions of grandeur to a
certain extent to just say something like, you know, pretty
honest. I, we've, we've got it quite
good, haven't we? We've got it quite good when it
comes to trying to find jobs in English speaking countries.
We've already got the upper hand.
I mean, you're incredibly talented when it comes to your
diverse range of skills, your technical ability, the fact
(20:17):
you're a musician, obviously you're incredibly smart, You've
got qualifications. And, and all that sort of stuff.
So you would have hoped you'd bewhen you're going for a bar job.
I mean, fucking hell, give us a break.
Yeah, it was something a lot of backpackers worry about, mate.
It was like they, you know, their CV essentially becomes 1
great big gap, so many gaps. They all merge together like a
(20:38):
huge chasm. And we wonder are we, you know,
still as employable as we once were, all that sort of stuff.
So it's worth us talking about. You've come to me.
You've said, Alan, I'm feeling abit professional.
I'm struggling to get work. You won't let me tell you a
little story about when I first arrived in New Zealand because
when I when I first arrived in Auckland I was in a horror show
(20:58):
of situation. I've just been mugged in
Johannesburg. I had about £250 left to my
name. It's not fun.
Yeah, I was, I was in a terriblestate, and luckily a friend let
me sleep on their sofa. I was applying for all kinds of
jobs. I applied for cafes, for bars.
(21:19):
I went. I tried to apply for this place
selling hot tubs, OK. And I thought, yeah, you know,
there's this thing that happens when you're applying for jobs
and you're desperate for work. And my account was dwindling to
the only asset I had was that myfriend was letting me sleep on
her sofa. There's a thing that happens
when you're that desperate whereyou start questioning yourself
so much. I was like, yeah, maybe I am a
(21:41):
hot tub salesman. Maybe that is what I do.
Maybe that is what I'm best at. Yeah, I remember, I remember
calling my family and being like, yeah, I'm going to sell
hot tubs. And my mum was like, what?
Sorry. I was like, what do you mean?
What is that what I am? So things weird things happen.
(22:04):
And and it got to the stage where my friend said, Hey, my
housemates have been talking andyou know, we really would like
this living room space back now.And oh God, you know, you've
been here for a few weeks. So next week you're going to
have to move out. Oh yeah, Well, and I.
Was in a you know, now I was eating into an overdraft.
I'd been I tried to do everything man and I moved into
(22:26):
a new place, used the last of mymoney as a security deposit and
then rent was coming up due in like 4 weeks time.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, and.
It basically got to a point where I walked into a music shop
and I said, just can I speak to the owner of the company and got
(22:46):
a meeting with the owner of thiscompany and I essentially said
to him, I, I'm at last chance saloon and I really need this
job. If you give me a shot, I will be
a great asset to you. I will do whatever it takes to
be the best salesman you have. Like please just give me this
shot. I desperately, desperately need
(23:08):
to start yesterday. Yeah, well, amazing.
And he said, OK, I'll think about it.
And I was like, oh man. And I left the shop and he left
the shop and he went to his car and I was walking the other way
and I was thinking, God, what the fuck am I going to do?
I have no money. And he called me when Alan and I
(23:30):
turned around and it was like a movie.
I was like, yes, I turned aroundand he said, would you like a
Red Bull from my car? And I went, no, no I wouldn't.
I would like a job please. Like you know.
(23:51):
Long story short, he called me that evening.
I started the next day. Beautiful.
Got paid just in time to pay rent.
I paid my first rent one day late and then, you know, I went
on to be promoted within that company, Move stars, move stores
become one of their their best sellers.
And like that guy who offered methe Red Bull became like a
(24:13):
surrogate, like pop to me. And that in New Zealand, he like
really looked after me and, and it was a great job.
So I mean, what's the moral of that story?
I keep trying, I guess. Man, I was in a really, really
bad spot. And eventually, just with sheer
tenacity and a little bit of humility, I ended up getting
there, getting it done. Totally.
(24:33):
I'm in desperate times call for desperate measures and we're not
necessarily in in that situationat the moment.
It's not panic stations by any means, but I, I guess a lot of
backpackers will go through thiskind of psychological.
Yeah, if I can call it, if I cancall it that.
It's like an emotional thing. And it's very specific to moving
countries, being on working holiday visas and trying to get
(24:55):
work in other countries maybe where you don't necessarily know
the market. And of course, we're subject to
things like visa restrictions. I mean, maybe, I don't know, but
maybe the person who got the jobahead of me is a Kiwi.
And so they don't have to worry about, you know, them leaving in
a year or two or whatever it might be, but.
The bird, not the nationality. But yeah, I think in these in
(25:17):
these times, you've got to thinkabout the bigger picture, think
about the reason you're here andget out your own way a little
bit. Because I think I was quite
guilty of walking in there thinking, well, hang on, I'm
like, I've got to be the perfectguy for the job, haven't I?
And things seemingly went well and I got on with everyone that
I met. And, you know, a couple of days
later when the when the e-mail comes through and says, I'm
(25:37):
really sorry, but you weren't successful.
Thanks ever so much for your time.
You think? I mean, how could it have been
any better? But well.
Would it be of help to you? You know, you are my best
friend. I love you to bits.
I, I believe you're one of the most employable people ever.
Would you like to do a role playinterview to practice your
skills? Because I've got experience
(25:58):
getting work in New Zealand. Perhaps, you know, we could talk
it. Through yeah, I, I mean, this is
going to be a great learning experience for me in particular
and hopefully the listener will learn something about how to do
an interview completely UN fucking scripted, Ellen.
OK, Adam, you know, you've come here to me in New Zealand.
Why do you want the job mate? I just really want to get stuck
(26:20):
into something that I really believe in, something that
aligns with my values. I'm very passionate about your
business. I've done a bit of research on
the company. I know that you have been in
business for at least a week nowand I I really like the look of
what you guys are doing. I can't help but notice that
you've done absolutely fucking nothing but travel for the last
10 years. As an employer, I'd be confident
(26:43):
that you're going to stick around for more than a couple of
weeks. Well, it's been a really long
time now and as you've seen fromthe date of birth, it isn't on
my CV for obvious reasons. I am now 35.
I'm starting to slow down a little bit.
I'd like some. You don't like it?
I'd like some, I'd like some predictability and and a
(27:03):
routine. I just want to, like I said, I
really would like to apply myself and your company just
seems like a fantastic opportunity for for me to do
something that I truly believe in.
We've had a quick Google of you,now we can't help but be
concerned by the fact it seems like you have a full time job as
a podcaster already is. Are you going to have enough
time for this business? I I will have enough time, I
(27:25):
absolutely will. And that's because you have my
words that I will not sleep a wink ever.
Until I have improved your social media following.
I will use all of my skills, my knowledge and my expertise
surrounding social media to makesure that you have at least
three stories a week, perhaps some Instagram reels and.
(27:46):
I can't see a problem, Adam. I think you'd be hired by me.
So I think maybe just clip that,send that to an employer via
e-mail and say don't. I've done all the work for you
regarding the interview process as well.
Do do you know right? I don't know if I've told you
this, but we did have a chat actually a few months back and
(28:06):
we were talking about me workingin New Zealand and you know, how
I would approach these interviews and stuff and live in
the interview in real time. I, I put on my CV something
about, you know, having a knowledge of social media and
what have you, because that was your recommendation.
You were a fantastic friend in doing so.
And they picked up on that and they said, Oh, yeah, what have
you done before then? And I, you know, puffed my chest
(28:28):
out. And I thought, oh, you know,
I've got a travel show and, you know, run it with my best friend
and we release an episode every week and all this kind of stuff.
And they immediately jumped intothe exact sort of question that
you. Oh, that sounds like a lot of
work. I mean, it's fantastic that
you've done that. But I'm not sure that you'll be
able to commit the sort of time that we may need for the role.
How do you feel about that? And you know, I mean, Tripology
(28:51):
is always going to come up Trump's right if anything gets
in. In that, yeah.
Best not to say that it needs tobe, though.
Just start singing the theme tune loudly and backing out of
the room. If you need me to do any
announcements, I mean, I can definitely take care of those.
I've got a pretty good microphone.
My friends describe me as whollyinformative, energetic,
(29:13):
articular, just listing the adjective.
For the first interview anyway. I haven't even had my nose
pierced at this this point, so it wasn't that.
That's why you didn't get it mate.
Well, you think I should have gone in in there with a nose
piercing. But yeah, I want to say this
mate, I really just want to say that I feel it's difficult for
backpackers. It's difficult for people that
travel on working holiday visas especially.
(29:35):
You know, let's take a moment toappreciate the the non-native
English speakers that come here,whether they're from, you know,
any country in Europe or even further afield where they've
bothered to learn English to an incredibly high level, to the
level that that allows them to then work in other jobs.
And we're incredibly lucky as two people who come from the UK
with qualifications that are recognized around the world.
But when you've got people that are so highly qualified far more
(29:59):
than than I am, definitely. And then they just, they take it
as an opportunity maybe to take their foot off the gas and do
something pretty casual that they enjoy.
Or they just take it on the chinand swallow the fact that in
order to live in New Zealand, they have to take a bar job.
And, and I think that is, you know, on the one hand, it's
quite humbling, but on the otherhand, I think hats off to you.
(30:19):
What an amazing decision to try.And, you know, in order to
obtain this experience, you needto get out your own way and
just, you know, make a make a couple of sacrifices.
Yeah, I mean, it's a discrepancy, isn't it, between a
way that the working holiday visa scheme is perceived and the
way that the government that enforces it perceives it.
You know, no spoilers because you know, I'll talk about it on
(30:41):
subsequent episodes, but I've recently been applying for a
working holiday visa visa and the onus very much is that
you're supposed to be going on aholiday and working a little
bit. The the way that the governments
want you to do the working holiday is to travel around the
country and do a a few odd jobs and earn cash so that you can
(31:03):
travel more whilst you do that. You're not supposed to be
bunkering down, earning serious cash and then leaving after a
year so completely. So it's a difficult little
alteration in perception. Whereas my argument as a
traveller is always do things that progress you
professionally. So find a job.
Like for me it was in the music industry in a small way.
(31:25):
I learned to repair guitars whenI was in Auckland.
That came in very useful later on for you.
You want to work in a field thatyou have experienced in that can
progress your CV. So it's a difficult balancing
act, isn't it? No, it's, it's very difficult.
And I do think that there are a number of jobs or industries
that have become sort of backpacker specific or specific
to backpackers. And maybe that's, I don't know,
(31:48):
perpetuated by the fact that locals in whichever country
we're, you know, talking about in that context that you just
don't get the local people of that country doing those jobs.
And maybe they're the low level entry level admin jobs in an
office setting, or maybe they'rebar jobs or certainly in
Australia or for Australians, they're quite famous for working
lots of ski jobs, whether that'sover in Japan or, or Canada or
(32:10):
even, or even in Europe, right? They do all the bar jobs and all
the ski hill jobs. So yeah, I, I would just on the
one hand, I understand, I mean, it makes complete sense that
that's the way things work. But on the other hand, I would
love people that do want to travel and live in other
countries to hopefully aim theirsights a little higher and then
(32:30):
achieve those things as well. Yeah, it's an interesting
dialogue to have me and you are both experts on working holiday
because at this point we've bothdone multiple ones.
So if anyone has any questions or anyone struggling to get work
whilst travelling, go to tripologypodcast.com.
There's a form on there. You can send us a message, we'll
reply, we'll have a dialogue about it and we're interested in
(32:50):
following your adventures through New Zealand as you
continue to try and get that job.
So we'll hear about that on on future weeks.
We certainly will, mate. There's also some cool stuff
going up on Instagram all the time at Tropology Podcast.
And now, if you don't mind, we'll go over to the Lost and
Found section where I'm going totell Alan another story about me
not being able to purchase alcohol again.
(33:12):
The Lost and Found section. It's available on
patreon.com/tropology Podcast comes out 24 hours early.
For as little as a dollar, you can hear it.
OK, baby, let's go off on an adventure.
We'll see you all next week. See you there.
Bye.
The alcohol laws in New Zealand are mental.
Play the theme music. Hello and welcome to this
episode of Tribology. I'm Alan and I'm here with the
(00:23):
ever holy Adam. Mate, I'm holy in a few ways
this week. It's Easter weekend, as we know.
I've been celebrating this weekend, but I've also got a few
new holes in my face. Yeah, holy, with an EHOLEY.
I've noticed you posting on the Instagram as if you're trying to
break some sort of Guinness World Record.
You've got all kinds of piercings up your face.
(00:46):
You want to talk about it? I think so.
There's been a couple of comments on the old gram down in
the DMS. What do we think?
Is it cringe? Am I too old?
Is it a midlife crisis? I am choosing not to comment.
Our Instagram, I see, is a very holy place to talk about travel,
to talk about the adventure intothe beyond.
You've chosen it to be a very holy place where you show
(01:08):
pictures of your face with all sorts of holes in.
Yeah, I mean, a lot of people won't know this.
I mean, even you, because our friendship is only sort of four
years old at this point. But I did have my nose pierced
when I was a lot younger, when Iwas back when I was in my early
20s, got myself a couple of earrings as well, just to go
with it. In for a penny, in for a pound,
as we say in the UK. But I don't know, I think I've
(01:30):
had some good comments. It feels all right.
It feels like the right time. And I guess I, I've been wanting
to do it for such a long time. And now that I'm in that
backpacker mode, I feel like, you know, that I'm not customer
facing. I'm not going to any business
meetings. I think it's all right.
And that that might sound sort of an old fuddy Duddy
traditional thing to say, but I just, you know, I don't
(01:53):
necessarily want to be walking around with a nose ring while
I'm going into corporate environments, is all I'm saying.
Well, here's what I'm saying mate.
If you wanted to do it and you're happy with it, I'm proud
of you for doing it. I think we should all just do
whatever we want. So I think nice, if anything, to
have metal in your face. Yeah, I mean, it might throw a
bit of a spanner in the works, excuse the pun, only because
(02:14):
you're going to be in Asia. We've spoken about that before,
over the next week or two perhaps.
I would love to join you, but the woman who pierced my nose
did say do not submerge your head underwater.
And we all know that the diving in the Philippines is absolutely
fantastic. So tough one.
Yeah. Did she also say don't go
through one of those airport scanners?
(02:38):
I mean, you know, it's fine. It is something to take care of.
It is a bit of a burden, especially if you're sleeping in
dorms and, you know, moving around hostels and that kind of
stuff. It can be quite difficult to
keep clean. But I'm doing my best.
I think. I think it looks all right.
Well, honest opinion, do you hate it?
Well, on my honest opinion, is your camera's not quite high
definition enough for me to see it?
Oh so. Let me get close to see if I can
(03:00):
get the light shining on it. This bloody massive lamp that
I've been lugging around the whole of Auckland for two weeks.
I. Think it's lovely, Adam.
Nice. Like I said, to get metal in
your face. How else has it been going?
Your time in New Zealand is soldiering on.
I'm, I mean, the audience couldn't help but notice that
I'm still here in a house in Scotland.
(03:21):
So, so not yet on the road again, but you've been
gallivanting enough, doing travel for both of us.
I have, I mean, I've not been doing that much outside of
Auckland. Auckland's become a place that's
been incredibly easy to stay. We've mentioned a few times on
the show places like Ponsonby, really nice, Melbourne, really
nice neighborhood. There's, you know, maybe akin to
something you might find in Melbourne or Sydney perhaps.
(03:43):
Just been spending a lot of timein cafes, mate.
Just got a fantastic group of people at the hostel and I
wanted, I told you, I want to take the time to say this on on
air because you would expect, and I know that you've felt this
many times over that living in hostels for such a long time,
you do meet a lot of people thattell you travel stories around
the world and they say, oh, you know, I ended up staying there
(04:05):
for three months because we justhad a really good group of
people at the hostel. It was like a family and we just
all ended up staying there. However, I don't think I've felt
that as many times as you would expect.
But at this hostel in Auckland, I'm having a great time.
I really, really like it. There's a massive group of us
French people and we're all, we're all speaking French and
I'm improving my French and it's, it's just lovely.
(04:26):
It's a really nice atmosphere inthere.
Friends who Pierce together staytogether.
And you and your budding pals inPonsonby.
I like the sound of that mate. Any little activities you've
been getting up to? It's been Easter weekend, that's
exciting. I just spent it sort of waking
up, perhaps eating a small pieceof chocolate in the shape of an
egg, celebrating the resurrection of what can only be
(04:48):
described as Christ. So I think, yeah, I'd like to
hear what you did. Yeah.
I mean, it has been a few weeks since we mentioned religion on
the podcast. And you know, we do like to do
that periodically. I've been feeling itchy.
You're a great person to ask because Easter weekend now we do
celebrate it in the UK typically, as you've said, with
some chocolate. What else goes on for the kids
(05:10):
you do? Like?
An Easter egg hunt perhaps? Yeah, you can hide Easter eggs
all over the garden in my family.
Famously, once my brother pickedup an Easter egg, it had a slug
on it. It sent him into such a terror
that the whole of Easter cascaded into sort of a mollusk
fearing ceremony. What else happens?
I mean, we just celebrate the idea of rebirth, the coming of
(05:32):
spring, the idea of new things sort of emerging all over the
world. OK, so that's what it is.
There's no church going in your house on a Sunday.
There's no mass or sermon or anyother word that you can fit in
that's vaguely religious. I don't really know much about
it. A church, a sermon, a massive
celebration, a kind of event with candlelight and priests.
No, we don't do any of that in my house.
(05:53):
We just sort of maybe vaguely think about the idea of rebirth
over, you know, a morning egg. So in a very English way, I
mean, we celebrated it over Easter weekend with some some
French and some English people. In the only way we know how to
celebrate anything, which is to to drink a lot of alcohol.
Ah, yeah. OK.
(06:14):
Of course. I mean, I mean, it has to be
said during the Last Supper on aGood Friday.
You know, actually I think he did the supper on Thursday, Good
Friday was the day where he actually went up to the hill.
Jesus did partake of wine. So drinking alcohol may not
actually be a terrible way to sort of remember that moment.
I'm not sure you're allowed to say that.
(06:36):
Well, this is where it gets really interesting because I do
want to preface this by saying both you and me, I'm going to
put words in your mouth here that we like to respect the
culture, the location that we'rein.
We completely understand that the location that we're in is
experiencing us. We, we want to minimize our
impact. We want to blend in.
We want to, you know, appreciatewhatever.
However, when it's somewhere like New Zealand, which feels
(06:58):
quite close to home in terms of its culture, but, but hang on.
But there are some rules and regulations surrounding alcohol,
which I think make absolutely nosense.
They're completely unfounded. And it threw a massive curveball
towards me and certainly the other English guys, to the point
where we were parading around the streets just, you know,
(07:19):
scratching our heads thinking, fucking hell, this is absolutely
mental. OK.
Do you want to talk to me about it?
Do you want me to do some Eastertherapy for you?
Yeah, I, I would like to mate. So I'm going to tell you
everything I know about the rules and regulations.
I've done a little bit of reading, but it was after the
fact because this is the sort ofthing that's that made its way
through to us in terms of the information, the flow of
information, way too late. OK, so we knew that.
(07:44):
Obviously we knew that there wasGood Friday coming up and we
knew that there was Easter Sunday and Easter Monday.
Now, the first time I knew something was wrong was when I
turned up to a supermarket on Friday morning to just buy some
fruit and the supermarkets were closed.
Now it's very rare the supermarket shuts, especially on
a public holiday. I don't know if that happens in
(08:05):
the UK, maybe they close early, but I would like to think that
they would do some pretty good business on these holidays.
Where are you heading? You're heading to a countdown,
something like that. OK, Is that the name of a
supermarket in New Zealand? Yeah.
No, no Woolies mate. OK, Yeah, All right.
Woolworths actually, do you knowwhat I think?
I think maybe countdowns Canadian, and it's the Canadian
version of Woolworths. I'm not quite sure.
(08:26):
Woolworths is the big green one,the main one.
In you got it. You got.
It OK, Yeah, gotcha. So then I started asking
questions. And then you go back to the
hostel and of course it makes its way through the Grapevine.
Oh yeah, everything's shut. Oh, oh, by the way, it's not
just everything's shut, it's Good Friday, which means that
none of the bars are going to beopen either because they can't
sell alcohol by law. And you start going.
(08:48):
OK, so. Right.
So I mean, does this extend any further than that?
Oh yeah. So at that point you're
thinking, finally some fucking respect for religious festival.
Yeah, all I wanted to do was just sit there completely sober
and think about what Good Fridaymeans to me.
Now I can have the kind of contemplative Good Friday that
(09:09):
I've been waiting for my whole life.
There's me going now. Hang on, It's a Friday night
though. Have they not?
Have they not taken account for the fact it's a Friday night and
that's when you drink alcohol Good Friday night, yes.
So, so then, you know, we're allscratching our heads thinking,
oh fucking hell, that came around quick.
That's a bit of a surprise. And then we start talking to
(09:31):
people about about the weekend, right.
And the manager of the hostel, he's a lovely guy, he's from
Wales. He said, oh, it gets even more
bizarre than that lads. Friday, Good Friday, nothing's
open. However, at 12 O1, because it's
technically Saturday, all the bars and clubs open and you can
drink alcohol and go and party. I was like, OK, right.
(09:54):
So tonight if we want to go out,it's.
A bit of a loophole. In it yeah, it's a good one.
So yeah. So all right, if we want to go
out and drink, we either buy ouralcohol before, but that time
had already passed unfortunately.
Maybe we'll find someone in the hostel who was smart enough to
buy a couple of bottles of wine that we can get some off and
then we just wait until 12, we go out, we have a good time,
whatever. He said do be careful though,
(10:15):
because on Saturday night everything is open until 12
because 12 O1 is technically Easter Sunday when everything
shuts again. I'm going like, but hang on.
What do you mean? Like, what about all the clubs
and bars open on a Saturday night?
He says, yeah, yeah, they just opened slightly earlier and then
they close at midnight and everyone has to go home.
(10:36):
I'm going because it's Easter Sunday.
OK, that's that's quite crazy. However, again, there were a few
rumours that there's maybe a couple of bars that had an
exemption. There's maybe some areas of
Auckland that that for some reason have got an exemption as
well. There's maybe some places that
you can buy alcohol as long as you're eating food in the
restaurant at the same time. They weren't exempt from the
(10:59):
benefits of Christ literally dying for their sins though,
weren't they? No, they wreaked the benefit of
his sacrifice, but they got exemption from the alcohol sales
law. Very convenient.
It's, it was really, really strange.
It was like so, so backwards andmaybe I don't fully understand.
No, no, I mean, I have to go on air and say it because that's
(11:21):
what we were all saying at the time.
And you know, I'd rather represent myself as I as I was
then. But I was walking around the
streets with these, with this bunch from the hostel, and we're
trying to get into bars and stuff, but the people are piling
out because it's 1155 and I went.
What happens if there's remaining in there after
midnight? They turn into a fucking
pumpkin. I've got no idea, but the
(11:42):
security guard, there's one security guard.
So I'm on Kay Rd. We'll have Kay Rd. in, in
Auckland. There's a bar there that we were
going to go to. Everyone's piling out the bar as
we arrive at 11:50. And I spoke to the security
guard and I said, hey, mate, I look, I, I don't really
understand the rules, but I've heard that they're, you know,
through a bunch of people that maybe we can't find anywhere to
go after 12 or for some reason we can't buy alcohol.
(12:04):
Is that true? And he said, yeah, because we go
to church on a Sunday. I was like, oh God.
OK, don't use God's name in vain, bastard.
Well, listen, what do you say toyour detractors that say, you
know, New Zealand historically is a country that worships
Christianity, that Easter is a special day in Christianity and
(12:25):
perhaps, you know, take a day off the drinking in reverence to
the Lord? Well, I read an article, and
maybe you can correct me if I'm wrong, but I read an article
just this morning actually. There's written by I believe he
was someone involved in the church.
I don't know if he's a reverend or what, but he says nowhere,
absolutely nowhere in the Bible does it say that you are
prohibited from drinking alcoholon religious holidays.
(12:47):
So I'm not too sure where I stand with it.
I mean, it's certainly screwed over my night.
Perhaps in hindsight it was a good thing, but I went to a
little convenience store along KRd. just after that just to see
if I could try and charm some alcohol.
Nothing doing unfortunately, because I think they get they
get a hefty fine if they sell alcohol outside of the hours
they're allowed. And I spoke to a woman there and
(13:09):
I said, yeah, it's just, you know, really strange for me.
It's, you know, maybe a little bit of a culture shock that
we're we're in this time where the the government are like
rationing when we can, you know,or certainly enforcing rules
that stop us from buying alcoholat certain times.
I was, I was thinking, hang on, is this the pandemic?
Are we like back in COVID again?Are we allowed?
I don't know are we allowed out it?
(13:30):
Brings me like a strange sense of joy.
You sort of squirreling around Auckland on East to someday
desperate to find some booze. I think that's a beautiful
image. Like, I know, I know it sounds
bad, but it got to the point where it's more about principle
than whether I wanted a drink ornot.
I mean, it was pretty sober at this point.
And I was just thinking I shouldbe, I'm a fucking adult, I
(13:51):
should be allowed to buy alcohol.
So I spoke to this lovely lady and she said, yeah, I mean,
it's, we have a huge alcohol problem in New Zealand anyway,
and it is to try and curb that. And I said, what's the result
then? Does it help?
And she said, no, everyone just gets pissed much earlier and
everyone buys loads more booze earlier in the day or the OR the
week before. Oh, OK.
So as the adverse effect, it sort of accelerates the problem,
(14:12):
Does it? I mean mate, what do I what do I
know? Well, it's an interesting
concept, isn't it? I seem to remember something
similar to that. I mean, Patrick St.
Paddy's Day is just a few weeks before, isn't it?
And that's a major 1. So I think maybe I just had an
organic week off when it came toEaster Sunday when I was there.
I don't remember being sort of caged in wanting to unleash my
(14:34):
alcoholism out into the world. But I'm sorry you had the
experience mate. No, I mean, it was, it was
somewhat similar and reminiscentof the pandemic because there
were rules that were being enforced that I was looking at
and analysing and trying to do alittle bit of research onto
into, you know, as to why they were being enforced or
implemented in that way. And I just remember thinking,
but these there's no logic behind this.
(14:55):
I just don't make any sense. So.
Did you take the opportunity to ponder the resurrection, ponder
rebirth, ponder the, you know, the whole concept?
Or did you? No, not at all.
No, I spent most of the night just speaking to other
backpackers to see if I we couldscore a beer.
Well, there we go with that. Let's I just want a brief
meditation break. If you love the podcast as much
(15:18):
as we love you, please could youtake the time to rate the show
on your favorite podcasting platform?
Yeah, go and give it. Five stars everyone else has.
We're just waiting on you. Thanks for supporting us, it
means the world to us. Like a beer left on a shelf,
unable to be purchased until 24 hours of holiness of past allow
your conscious mind to return into your brain.
(15:40):
Adam, I can't help but paint an image of you roaming the Kiwi
streets desperate for booze on areligious holiday and I you know
that. Basically, that progression of
thoughts leads me to wonder, have you tried to get a fucking
job yet? Oh, yeah, because it sounds like
a little bit like a, you know, an alcoholic, something, you
(16:00):
know, alcoholic would do. I'm just concerned, you know,
there's a lot of tasks that needdoing for the for the podcast.
They haven't been done. You're messaging me going, I
love you, man, on Easter holidays.
And I'm just worried that perhaps you are feeling a little
bit unemployed. Yeah, you know, it's stark at
the moment because usually I frame my alcoholism by getting a
job in the wine industry, so it goes some somewhat undercover.
(16:25):
Yeah, you've got piercings in your face.
It's all basically I'm wonderingis everything OK?
Usually the size of the fucking tattoo on my back.
It's a picture of a beer bottle.Yeah, though, so, yeah, just to
answer your question, I mean, it's a bit of a sore subject for
me at the moment, mate. Trying to find a job in New
Zealand, as you well know, and so will the listener that I'm on
(16:46):
a working holiday visa. Thank goodness they increased
the age limit to 35, which meantthat I was included.
It turned my head and then I knew I was going to come here to
work in a country that I've always wanted to work in.
And the wine industry here is, it's pretty special.
I mean, obviously some world renowned wineries, some
fantastic, some of the world's best wine and I was really
looking forward to coming here and seeing what it was all
(17:07):
about. Now I have, I'm going to be very
honest about this. I've applied for two jobs and
this be quite a good thing for us to chat about, make quite a
good conversation because hopefully it resonates with a
lot of backpackers out there. A lot of people that have lived
in other countries with, you know, great experience, great
qualifications, highly educated.And we're in a position where
(17:27):
we're almost sort of vulnerable because the businesses that
we're applying to work at, they know that they have their pick
really of all the people that are here.
And I don't know whether it's certainly not the same as it
used to be, You know, certainly in Australia when you're doing
farm work and stuff. I mean, people were getting
exploited, wouldn't you agree? Yeah, it was definitely a
problem that people, you know, were basic, basically working
(17:49):
for free in exchange for the extension of their visa.
Yeah, doing absolutely horrendous jobs in awful
conditions. So, you know, I, I do feel
somewhat a bit sensitive about this because I've applied for
two jobs, which I was absolutelycertain I'll get interviews for
and was quietly, quietly confident I would be considered
(18:11):
for the role. And unfortunately, in both of
these situations, I've, I've been successful in getting an
interview. I've had a great time with the
companies themselves, either in an interview capacity or even a
trial shift in a wine bar, but I'm not going to mention the
name, obviously. However, I, I've received the
responses and they've been negative, they've been
(18:33):
unsuccessful and, and it's quitea strange moment in my life
actually, if I can be so, so serious as to say that because
it's a bit of a wake up call, mate, it really is.
You know, you think I'm thinkingabout the last 10 years of my
life and all the things I've achieved in the wine industry,
the wealth of knowledge that I have, the qualifications that
(18:53):
I've done, the amazing opportunities that I've been
very lucky to work and the incredible people that I've
worked with as well and learnt alot from.
But at the end of the day, I mean, it comes down to someone's
decision in a new business. And you've got like a finite
amount of time not just to get that job in particular, but
you're looking at your bank balance, especially in a country
in New Zealand. It's just going down and down
and down and down. And you go in there with good
(19:14):
intentions. You think, God, I'm so perfect
for this job. The job description is almost as
if they've written a descriptionof me.
And then the answer comes back and it's like, yeah, thanks, but
no thanks. We're we're going to move in
another direction. And, you know, good luck to you.
And you think, oh shit, back to square 1.
Yeah. OK.
So how has that made you? You said that it was making you
feel a bit reflective. In what way do you think?
(19:37):
I, I just think that I've, I wasso sure of myself and so
confident and, you know, I wouldhave loved to have thought that,
that I would have been considered for those roles very
seriously. And, and maybe I was, but it's
just, it's not as easy as as I thought it would be.
(19:57):
And I guess maybe it's what is it delusions of grandeur to a
certain extent to just say something like, you know, pretty
honest. I, we've, we've got it quite
good, haven't we? We've got it quite good when it
comes to trying to find jobs in English speaking countries.
We've already got the upper hand.
I mean, you're incredibly talented when it comes to your
diverse range of skills, your technical ability, the fact
(20:17):
you're a musician, obviously you're incredibly smart, You've
got qualifications. And, and all that sort of stuff.
So you would have hoped you'd bewhen you're going for a bar job.
I mean, fucking hell, give us a break.
Yeah, it was something a lot of backpackers worry about, mate.
It was like they, you know, their CV essentially becomes 1
great big gap, so many gaps. They all merge together like a
(20:38):
huge chasm. And we wonder are we, you know,
still as employable as we once were, all that sort of stuff.
So it's worth us talking about. You've come to me.
You've said, Alan, I'm feeling abit professional.
I'm struggling to get work. You won't let me tell you a
little story about when I first arrived in New Zealand because
when I when I first arrived in Auckland I was in a horror show
(20:58):
of situation. I've just been mugged in
Johannesburg. I had about £250 left to my
name. It's not fun.
Yeah, I was, I was in a terriblestate, and luckily a friend let
me sleep on their sofa. I was applying for all kinds of
jobs. I applied for cafes, for bars.
(21:19):
I went. I tried to apply for this place
selling hot tubs, OK. And I thought, yeah, you know,
there's this thing that happens when you're applying for jobs
and you're desperate for work. And my account was dwindling to
the only asset I had was that myfriend was letting me sleep on
her sofa. There's a thing that happens
when you're that desperate whereyou start questioning yourself
so much. I was like, yeah, maybe I am a
(21:41):
hot tub salesman. Maybe that is what I do.
Maybe that is what I'm best at. Yeah, I remember, I remember
calling my family and being like, yeah, I'm going to sell
hot tubs. And my mum was like, what?
Sorry. I was like, what do you mean?
What is that what I am? So things weird things happen.
(22:04):
And and it got to the stage where my friend said, Hey, my
housemates have been talking andyou know, we really would like
this living room space back now.And oh God, you know, you've
been here for a few weeks. So next week you're going to
have to move out. Oh yeah, Well, and I.
Was in a you know, now I was eating into an overdraft.
I'd been I tried to do everything man and I moved into
(22:26):
a new place, used the last of mymoney as a security deposit and
then rent was coming up due in like 4 weeks time.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, and.
It basically got to a point where I walked into a music shop
and I said, just can I speak to the owner of the company and got
(22:46):
a meeting with the owner of thiscompany and I essentially said
to him, I, I'm at last chance saloon and I really need this
job. If you give me a shot, I will be
a great asset to you. I will do whatever it takes to
be the best salesman you have. Like please just give me this
shot. I desperately, desperately need
(23:08):
to start yesterday. Yeah, well, amazing.
And he said, OK, I'll think about it.
And I was like, oh man. And I left the shop and he left
the shop and he went to his car and I was walking the other way
and I was thinking, God, what the fuck am I going to do?
I have no money. And he called me when Alan and I
(23:30):
turned around and it was like a movie.
I was like, yes, I turned aroundand he said, would you like a
Red Bull from my car? And I went, no, no I wouldn't.
I would like a job please. Like you know.
(23:51):
Long story short, he called me that evening.
I started the next day. Beautiful.
Got paid just in time to pay rent.
I paid my first rent one day late and then, you know, I went
on to be promoted within that company, Move stars, move stores
become one of their their best sellers.
And like that guy who offered methe Red Bull became like a
(24:13):
surrogate, like pop to me. And that in New Zealand, he like
really looked after me and, and it was a great job.
So I mean, what's the moral of that story?
I keep trying, I guess. Man, I was in a really, really
bad spot. And eventually, just with sheer
tenacity and a little bit of humility, I ended up getting
there, getting it done. Totally.
(24:33):
I'm in desperate times call for desperate measures and we're not
necessarily in in that situationat the moment.
It's not panic stations by any means, but I, I guess a lot of
backpackers will go through thiskind of psychological.
Yeah, if I can call it, if I cancall it that.
It's like an emotional thing. And it's very specific to moving
countries, being on working holiday visas and trying to get
(24:55):
work in other countries maybe where you don't necessarily know
the market. And of course, we're subject to
things like visa restrictions. I mean, maybe, I don't know, but
maybe the person who got the jobahead of me is a Kiwi.
And so they don't have to worry about, you know, them leaving in
a year or two or whatever it might be, but.
The bird, not the nationality. But yeah, I think in these in
(25:17):
these times, you've got to thinkabout the bigger picture, think
about the reason you're here andget out your own way a little
bit. Because I think I was quite
guilty of walking in there thinking, well, hang on, I'm
like, I've got to be the perfectguy for the job, haven't I?
And things seemingly went well and I got on with everyone that
I met. And, you know, a couple of days
later when the when the e-mail comes through and says, I'm
(25:37):
really sorry, but you weren't successful.
Thanks ever so much for your time.
You think? I mean, how could it have been
any better? But well.
Would it be of help to you? You know, you are my best
friend. I love you to bits.
I, I believe you're one of the most employable people ever.
Would you like to do a role playinterview to practice your
skills? Because I've got experience
(25:58):
getting work in New Zealand. Perhaps, you know, we could talk
it. Through yeah, I, I mean, this is
going to be a great learning experience for me in particular
and hopefully the listener will learn something about how to do
an interview completely UN fucking scripted, Ellen.
OK, Adam, you know, you've come here to me in New Zealand.
Why do you want the job mate? I just really want to get stuck
(26:20):
into something that I really believe in, something that
aligns with my values. I'm very passionate about your
business. I've done a bit of research on
the company. I know that you have been in
business for at least a week nowand I I really like the look of
what you guys are doing. I can't help but notice that
you've done absolutely fucking nothing but travel for the last
10 years. As an employer, I'd be confident
(26:43):
that you're going to stick around for more than a couple of
weeks. Well, it's been a really long
time now and as you've seen fromthe date of birth, it isn't on
my CV for obvious reasons. I am now 35.
I'm starting to slow down a little bit.
I'd like some. You don't like it?
I'd like some, I'd like some predictability and and a
(27:03):
routine. I just want to, like I said, I
really would like to apply myself and your company just
seems like a fantastic opportunity for for me to do
something that I truly believe in.
We've had a quick Google of you,now we can't help but be
concerned by the fact it seems like you have a full time job as
a podcaster already is. Are you going to have enough
time for this business? I I will have enough time, I
(27:25):
absolutely will. And that's because you have my
words that I will not sleep a wink ever.
Until I have improved your social media following.
I will use all of my skills, my knowledge and my expertise
surrounding social media to makesure that you have at least
three stories a week, perhaps some Instagram reels and.
(27:46):
I can't see a problem, Adam. I think you'd be hired by me.
So I think maybe just clip that,send that to an employer via
e-mail and say don't. I've done all the work for you
regarding the interview process as well.
Do do you know right? I don't know if I've told you
this, but we did have a chat actually a few months back and
(28:06):
we were talking about me workingin New Zealand and you know, how
I would approach these interviews and stuff and live in
the interview in real time. I, I put on my CV something
about, you know, having a knowledge of social media and
what have you, because that was your recommendation.
You were a fantastic friend in doing so.
And they picked up on that and they said, Oh, yeah, what have
you done before then? And I, you know, puffed my chest
(28:28):
out. And I thought, oh, you know,
I've got a travel show and, you know, run it with my best friend
and we release an episode every week and all this kind of stuff.
And they immediately jumped intothe exact sort of question that
you. Oh, that sounds like a lot of
work. I mean, it's fantastic that
you've done that. But I'm not sure that you'll be
able to commit the sort of time that we may need for the role.
How do you feel about that? And you know, I mean, Tripology
(28:51):
is always going to come up Trump's right if anything gets
in. In that, yeah.
Best not to say that it needs tobe, though.
Just start singing the theme tune loudly and backing out of
the room. If you need me to do any
announcements, I mean, I can definitely take care of those.
I've got a pretty good microphone.
My friends describe me as whollyinformative, energetic,
(29:13):
articular, just listing the adjective.
For the first interview anyway. I haven't even had my nose
pierced at this this point, so it wasn't that.
That's why you didn't get it mate.
Well, you think I should have gone in in there with a nose
piercing. But yeah, I want to say this
mate, I really just want to say that I feel it's difficult for
backpackers. It's difficult for people that
travel on working holiday visas especially.
(29:35):
You know, let's take a moment toappreciate the the non-native
English speakers that come here,whether they're from, you know,
any country in Europe or even further afield where they've
bothered to learn English to an incredibly high level, to the
level that that allows them to then work in other jobs.
And we're incredibly lucky as two people who come from the UK
with qualifications that are recognized around the world.
But when you've got people that are so highly qualified far more
(29:59):
than than I am, definitely. And then they just, they take it
as an opportunity maybe to take their foot off the gas and do
something pretty casual that they enjoy.
Or they just take it on the chinand swallow the fact that in
order to live in New Zealand, they have to take a bar job.
And, and I think that is, you know, on the one hand, it's
quite humbling, but on the otherhand, I think hats off to you.
(30:19):
What an amazing decision to try.And, you know, in order to
obtain this experience, you needto get out your own way and
just, you know, make a make a couple of sacrifices.
Yeah, I mean, it's a discrepancy, isn't it, between a
way that the working holiday visa scheme is perceived and the
way that the government that enforces it perceives it.
You know, no spoilers because you know, I'll talk about it on
(30:41):
subsequent episodes, but I've recently been applying for a
working holiday visa visa and the onus very much is that
you're supposed to be going on aholiday and working a little
bit. The the way that the governments
want you to do the working holiday is to travel around the
country and do a a few odd jobs and earn cash so that you can
(31:03):
travel more whilst you do that. You're not supposed to be
bunkering down, earning serious cash and then leaving after a
year so completely. So it's a difficult little
alteration in perception. Whereas my argument as a
traveller is always do things that progress you
professionally. So find a job.
Like for me it was in the music industry in a small way.
(31:25):
I learned to repair guitars whenI was in Auckland.
That came in very useful later on for you.
You want to work in a field thatyou have experienced in that can
progress your CV. So it's a difficult balancing
act, isn't it? No, it's, it's very difficult.
And I do think that there are a number of jobs or industries
that have become sort of backpacker specific or specific
to backpackers. And maybe that's, I don't know,
(31:48):
perpetuated by the fact that locals in whichever country
we're, you know, talking about in that context that you just
don't get the local people of that country doing those jobs.
And maybe they're the low level entry level admin jobs in an
office setting, or maybe they'rebar jobs or certainly in
Australia or for Australians, they're quite famous for working
lots of ski jobs, whether that'sover in Japan or, or Canada or
(32:10):
even, or even in Europe, right? They do all the bar jobs and all
the ski hill jobs. So yeah, I, I would just on the
one hand, I understand, I mean, it makes complete sense that
that's the way things work. But on the other hand, I would
love people that do want to travel and live in other
countries to hopefully aim theirsights a little higher and then
(32:30):
achieve those things as well. Yeah, it's an interesting
dialogue to have me and you are both experts on working holiday
because at this point we've bothdone multiple ones.
So if anyone has any questions or anyone struggling to get work
whilst travelling, go to tripologypodcast.com.
There's a form on there. You can send us a message, we'll
reply, we'll have a dialogue about it and we're interested in
(32:50):
following your adventures through New Zealand as you
continue to try and get that job.
So we'll hear about that on on future weeks.
We certainly will, mate. There's also some cool stuff
going up on Instagram all the time at Tropology Podcast.
And now, if you don't mind, we'll go over to the Lost and
Found section where I'm going totell Alan another story about me
not being able to purchase alcohol again.
(33:12):
The Lost and Found section. It's available on
patreon.com/tropology Podcast comes out 24 hours early.
For as little as a dollar, you can hear it.
OK, baby, let's go off on an adventure.
We'll see you all next week. See you there.
Bye.
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