A Psychospiritual Infection - The Ring of Cognitive Possession - Troubled Minds Radio

Episode Transcript
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Good evening and welcome to Troubled Minds Radio. I'm your host,
Michael Strange. We're streaming on YouTube, rumble x, Twitch and Kick.
We are broadcasting live on the Troubled Minds Radio Network.
That's KUAP Digital Broadcasting and of course eighty eight point
four FM Auckland, New Zealand. Tonight probably heard the news.

(02:52):
It's the rage today, all the rage that of course
sparks all the controversy that you would expect from anything
in twenty twenty. But it is bad news. Unfortunately, a
rock legend has passed away today, as many of you
are aware, Ozzy Osbourne, famous for Black Sabbath and really
the birth of heavy metal, modern heavy metal as we
know it. And it's again, you know, not a It's

(03:18):
definitely a tragic day, okay, And it drives me a
little bit crazy as usual, where all the hot take
people are, you know, kind of taking shots at heavy
metal and you know, calling it the music of the devil,
and it's just like, can we not just appreciate what,
you know, the art that people created for the moment
and you know, give them the family a minute before

(03:39):
we turn everything into a culture war of ridiculousness. But no,
of course not of course, not people with their hot
takes and the nonsense everybody's going to say, and ah,
but it does spark a conversation, okay, And so of
course I don't want to turn this into a ridiculousness
like the rest of the culture war. But I do
think there's an interesting aspect of this that kind of

(04:02):
comes into play here when you consider that if we
talk about brainwashing all the time on the show, we
talk about Burnet's propaganda, we talk about all manner of
these things specifically because it ties into our identity politics
in particular, Red team, blue team, all the things, right,
and if you see yourself as that first, like I said,
like I've always said, then they have a way of

(04:25):
controlling you, okay, And so identity. I was thinking about
this and trying to find, you know, a synchronicity. As usual.
I'm trying to find sinks that kind of come into
my life and sort of the larger zeitgeist and maybe
put them together as I noticed them. And the last
let's say a week or so, I've been watching that
old Rank and Bass hobbit. You guys remember that one
nineteen seventy seven with you know, bless my soul because

(04:48):
as Bilbob always says, which was so good, it's just
so good. It's a it's a shame that we don't
make good stuff like that anymore. Anyway. I mean maybe
I'm old and nostalgic, but anyway, so I digress on
that part, but check it out. So I was thinking
about this, and there's a lot of folks that say,
in particular that you know, heavy metal is the devil's music.

(05:09):
It is, you know, the demonic or whatever, right, And
so my contention tonight. So that's the question, that is
the question as part of the larger culture conversation. As usual,
we can agree and disagree on troubled minds and not
be mad. We don't have to be mad at each
other for agreeing or disagreeing and sort of feeling out
what these ideas mean together because because of course, there's

(05:29):
a lot of people with the gendas out there. There's
a lot of those folks with as I like to
call them, those reality tunnels, the dogma cycles that you know,
James and I were chatting about this a little bit
yesterday or the day before, you know, dogmacycles, and I
say they die hard and then well, actually no, they
they kind of don't ever die at all. They just
kind of end up being recycled. And it's it's, I

(05:51):
don't know, it's one of those things, those human things
that kind of really, as you can tell, grinds my
gears quite a lot when it comes to us not
understanding each other as people because we see the world
in a different way, and should that be our limiting factor?
But anyway, so to this now, I'm calling this a
psycho spiritual infection, the Ring of cognitive possession. Now, where's

(06:12):
the sink, Mike, where's the sink? Well, not only was
I watching the Hobbit okay, and that old Rank and Bass,
which of course is where Bilbo Baggins finds the ring.
They're escaping from the goblins. He tumbles down a cavern
and he ends up with none other than Galam Gallum,
the old Hobbits that has been aged beyond recognition and

(06:34):
now looks like a monster because he's been corrupted by
the One Ring. Now what does that have to do? Well,
as they take this ring and further on and get
into the Lord of the Rings, this ring starts to
become heavier, the burden of the ring psychologically, the burden
of the ring actually physically, as Frodo gets his again,
the nephew, the nephew of Bilbo who found the ring.

(06:57):
Now Frodo's taking this to the thing. But here's your sink.
And it may be tiny, but the lord of the
rings itself and the sore on, the one ring of
sore on, is that corrupting essence. And I was wondering
about this in particular, and I'll read this to you
in a second, because this is the fascinating part that
got me thinking about this and maybe kind of boiling
the sink down into this one space. But the ring
itself with gallam he real quick. Heavy metal, Okay, heavy metal,

(07:22):
there's your sink. Heavy metal. We'll get back to Ozzie
and we'll get back to brainwashing with music here in
a second. But heavy metal, there's your connection. It may
be loose, it may be flimsy, whatever, get over it
and get over it. It's a good conversation anyway. But
listen to this. So the term precious, and this is
why this kind of dawned on me. I was like,
what is the the esoteric mechanism behind the one ring

(07:47):
corrupting people to the point where they name it. They
call it my precious, which was ultimately the clue that
led Gandalf again. And if you guys are familiar with
the story, If not, it's it's irrelevant, but it's the
clue that led Gandalf to finding out this was the
one ring. It has become precious to me. This was
written down by Isilder. Anyway, this term my precious and

(08:10):
precious is something that's been used over and over and
over again to describe this one corrupting artifact. Okay, Now,
I was like, okay, now, esoterically speaking, what spell would
that be? What kind of corruption or haunting would cause
you to name the thing a particular thing? And I'll
read this to you, and I said, because it's very good.

(08:30):
But anyway, the question for tonight is this, in particular
regarding the heavy metal stuff. Is heavy metal the music
of the devil or demons or whatever? And my take,
of course is that you could say that about any art,
about any about any political movement. You could say it
about any corrupting influence. In my opinion, am I wrong?

(08:54):
Probably because I'm wrong about a lot of things all
the time. And this is a great time to drop
all the disclaimers. Yes, indeed, there's no truth to be
found here, just ideas, just conversations, just sort of merging
culture and well the old ways in the new ways
and considering them together. That's it, and we are taking
your calls. If you want to be a part of
the conversation at seven O two nine five seven one

(09:15):
zero three seven you and click the discord link of
Troubled Minds dot Org. We'll put you on the show.
It's super easy as that. But okay, now that's where
this comes in. Now, the corrupting influence of the ring.
What was that mechanism? Now, I'll explain it to you
when we get back, but it's it's an interesting aspect
that kind of comes into this because it's not just
let's say, a haunting like Annabelle, like that doll where
there's some essence in this doll or whatever. Again, conceptually

(09:37):
you don't have to believe that it's cool conceptually speaking here,
all right, it's something greater than that. It's like an
aggregore of sorts that's stuck in this ring that's corrupting,
and it has an identity itself that draws the bearer
of the ring into it. Okay, now we're going to
turn this into again identity per usual. But what is

(10:01):
the mechanism of that? And do you think it is,
let's say, in this case, esoterically limited to something like
the one ring, or do you think this could be
a larger aspect of our own control through something like
heavy metal as people are describing, And I'll pull up
the xposts in a second here that you know, kind
of got me thinking about this and like going, really,
here we go again, you know, like people it's like

(10:22):
the satannic panic three point oh, three point five or
four point seven or whatever the hell it is. Here
we go again?

Speaker 6 (10:27):
Right?

Speaker 2 (10:28):
Anyway, what is your take on that? Love to hear
it as we go. Let me play you this though.
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let us continue, shout you all right. Now here's the thing. Now,
this is this is the interesting part of it. As usual.
I need I needed like a tug for my brain,
like a way to draw me into these conversations or
else I get just incredibly bored. As you guys can tell,
I don't have add per se. But if I'm dis interested,

(12:00):
I'm a disinteresting guy, an uninteresting guy anyway. So the
term precious, Now they call the ring precious. Now check
this out. The mechanism whereby that term comes to bear
of the bearer of the ring. Listen to this, The
term precious, and the lord of the rings is more
than obsession. It's programming. The One Ring doesn't merely seduce
with power or promise. It implants a memetic trigger precious

(12:26):
into the psyche of the wearer. This isn't poetic addiction.
It's an esoteric mechanism of self reinforcing domination, a kind
of linguistic virus embedded by Sore on himself. And well,
don't worry, we will work this back to the heavy
metal as well. The word becomes a mental anchor, and
think of it in terms of heavy metal, by the way,
or any music or political movement, or Brene's propaganda like

(12:48):
we always talk about. Think about the One Ring as
a corrupting influence that could be anything. Okay, all right,
here we go. So the word becomes a mental anchor.
Once spoken, it isn't just descriptive. It rebinds ownership and
identity to the ring itself. Gallum's endless repetition is not
madness in the common sense, but the result of a

(13:08):
long term psycho spiritual infection. And that's where the term
comes from.

Speaker 6 (13:12):
Here.

Speaker 2 (13:14):
Every utterance of precious is a neural glyph, an act
of magical recursion, drawing the subject deeper into identification with
the rings will. In esoteric terms, this aligns with the
principle of naming as binding, and we've talked about that
in the past as well. Or also knowing an entity's
name like Rumpelstiltskin can allow you to break free from it,

(13:37):
or to break its curse, or to cast it off,
or any of these things. Again esoterically speaking, across magical traditions,
to name something is to control it, like I said,
But the ring in this case inverts that idea, which
is strange, which is why I was thinking about that
larger mechanism of what this might mean. So teaching the
bearer to name it in such a way that it
binds them. It's like the reverse right, so like a

(13:59):
reversed true name spell from Marcane Dungeons and Dragon's cosmology.
Because you know me the D and d nerd. It
is not the name of the person that gives power,
but their compelled naming of the odd object that enslaves.
This also evokes the concept of thought forms or egergores
like I was describing, by inducing millions of utterances of
the same word across timelines and hosts. Precious, of course,

(14:21):
the ring sustains its own will as a metaphysical entity.
Each time Precious is whispered, it's a breath of life
into the rings astral intelligence. It is summoning itself into
reality through the minds of others, and the term acts
as the chant in a ritual of self reinforcement. More disturbingly,
the ring's enchantment is not merely linguistic. It operates on

(14:45):
the level of will erosion. I almost named it that
very good. The more it is worn, the more it
teaches its bearer to refer to it in this intimate,
possessive precious. It inserts a possessive word that is also
a claim of value and dependency, my precious. But the
trick is that the possessiveness is illusory. The ring never

(15:07):
truly belongs to the bearer. The bearer belongs to the ring.
Now think about that in terms of art, Think about
that in terms of political movements, populism. Think about that
in terms of propaganda. You ever had a favorite brand,
Coca Cola, for instance, McDonald's, whatever it was. Hopefully those
aren't your favorite brands these days, but you get my point.
Those marketing jingles we've talked about for a very long

(15:29):
time are this corruptive influence. It's the same thing now
regarding that, except in the ring's case, it's a little
bit weird magical inversion, which I like when they have
these ideas that kind of don't fit the mold of
that larger conversation when it comes to magic and D
and D and stuff like that. So the ring in
that capacity, because it's imbued with the essence of soar On,

(15:50):
it's a trickster. It's a trickster spirit like we've talked
about in the past quite a lot. But you get
the idea, right, It's and an interesting part about the
ring as well is that it's never ever truly yours.
You are indoctrinated to call it my precious. However, the
my precious part is just the binding, because it's always
trying to slip you. It's always trying to duck you

(16:12):
and go be found by somebody else, because it's trying
to go back and find its master, soar On. Anyway,
now back to the idea we're talking about, which is
specifically not just the binding of the ring and the
essence of our own identities, but beyond that, is it
possible that as this conversation is happening today with again
the passing of Ozzie Osbourne, which, again this stuff is

(16:33):
so tasteless to me, how everybody has to have a
damn hot take. But hey, the hot takes have been
opened up, so let's talk about it, including of course,
what it means for the satanic panic in twenty twenty five,
and is actual heavy metal something that is demonic music?
Because we're talking about art? Am I right? And can
you actually label a particular art itself if it's not

(16:55):
inherently innately by itself destructive? I don't know. I don't know,
and that becomes a larger question here, which made me go,
I personally don't like I don't think so and again
am I wrong? Maybe? Am I not? Maybe? I don't know.
Like again, I don't count points to when I'm right
and when I'm wrong, because of course it's about ideas,

(17:16):
it's about sort of looking at these things differently. And
let me read this to you. So this is what
I wrote earlier, and tell me if I'm wrong on this.
This is from Let's see. I replied to, uh, this
is Cernovich. You guys know this guy, Mike Cernovich. The
hot take ready for the hot take. Here's the hot take.
He says, my parents didn't let us listen to metal.

Speaker 1 (17:36):
Here you go.

Speaker 2 (17:37):
We'll just drop that on the screen.

Speaker 1 (17:39):
Here you go, Here you go.

Speaker 2 (17:40):
My parents didn't let us listen to metal. Was a
devil worshiping music. Hard to see how they were wrong.
Pantera used pentagrams, even if ironic or art, it's demonic symbolism.
Later in life. I tried, couldn't stomach. It made me
physically ill. It's the sound of demons. H Like I said,

(18:01):
kind of a tasteless hot take in my opinion, but
again based on a particular dogma, based on a particular
as we always talk about these reality tunnels, which is fine. Look,
maybe he's right, maybe I'm wrong, but I answered him
because this type of stuff grinds on me a little bit.

(18:22):
When again, I don't know, I think hot take culture
in general just pisses me off because why has it
got to be like this all the damn time? I
don't know. Well that's another question as part of it.
But anyway, okay, So anyway, as you know me, when
it comes to art and comes to speech, I don't
see things that way. I see them as expressions of
being human, all right, very simple. It's a very simple

(18:43):
thing to me. And so when you want to censor
one because of a superstition you might have, it just
makes you another authoritarian ahole. Am I right? That seems
right to me? So and this is what I posted earlier,
and I think this is probably more in line with
what I think specifically and directly. But again, am I wrong?

(19:03):
Maybe I said this. Calling metal music demonic says more
about the listener's fears than the music itself. It's a
scapegoat for raw emotion, rebellion, and uncomfortable truths. The devil
didn't right the riffs humans did, screaming back at a
world that often pretends everything's fine. And now you see,

(19:26):
sort of in a weird roundabout way where the inspiration
for this show is tonight again, rest in pace, Ozzy Osbourne.
Losing talented people, losing any people is always horrific, But
of course the hot take stuff in twenty twenty five
has to happen because that's what people do. And here

(19:46):
we are having the same discussion again that we had
in the eighties, having the same discussion we had in
the nineties, having the same discussion over and over and
over again because of these dogma cycles, because of these
reality tunnels where we cannot appreciate things we do not understand,
and so that becomes a question is it demonic? And yeah,

(20:08):
so that's my take. That's where we start. Let me,
uh see if I can fix this camera on the fly.
Like I said, it's quite a bit harder to do
than it looks on TV to keep everything working because
things crash and blah blah whatever. Anyway tears my tears,
but yeah, that's that's what reminds that and a lot
of ways to look at it. And like I said,
I don't and don't go after this guy. I mean,
he's got millions of followers or something, so he's like

(20:29):
super famous. It's not like we could, you know, if
every single person ever heard trouble minds like went after
the guy, like we could make a dent or anything.
But I'm just encouraging you not to. We don't have
to start fights on the internet because we disagree with people.
It's okay to just say, well, you know, this is
the way I see it and that's it and kind
of move on. But it is an interesting aspect here
of that psycho spiritual infection, because the way I see it,

(20:49):
when we're talking the idea of Brene's propaganda, when we're
talking about again populism and politics, when we're talking about
either the Blue team or the Red team politically, any
of this crap we're always talking about that really gets
my goat. By the way, as you can tell because
I'm always talking about it as well, is it's a trick.
It's all a trick. And so what does it mean,

(21:11):
look other than I think we should recognize these things
and be very wary of how we sort of employ
them in our lives. Beyond that, I think it's important
to recognize what's happening to us as part of these
conversations as usual. Right, And so this again brings the
satanic panic to bear once again in twenty twenty five,
which I think is like beating a dead horse a

(21:36):
little bit. I don't know. Again, the hot take in
twenty twenty five is the hot take the same hot
take from nineteen eighty three. You see what I mean? Like,
are we heading somewhere here? Guys? I would hope we're
heading somewhere. We're making some progress in some ways and
can understand things a little better that maybe we don't
understand collectively. But yeah, that's so it's on my mind tonight.

(21:57):
Back to the satanic panic once again is heavy metal
demonic And I've got a nice heavy metal song for you,
queed Up, which we'll listen to in a second here.
But that's really it. And of course that larger context
of this, of being manipulated by again ancient things, by
a primordial sense of belonging, by all of this stuff

(22:18):
that we've always talked about as part of this show,
not just necessarily as magic like I always describe it,
but as the magic of manipulation. In twenty twenty five,
it need not be magic at all. It could be
all manner of things, and we've talked about tons of them.
But that becomes a question here when we're talking about
art as speech itself, is it ridiculous to say, well,

(22:42):
that genre of music is of the devil? That's all
simple question, And again we don't have to get religious
on this, Like understand what I'm trying to do here.
I'm trying to break down the idea of human speech
and human ideas that don't directly hurt anybody, and ask
the question, are they actually hurting people because you know me,
I can see it both ways. I can see it

(23:03):
ten ways. And dare I say many of the ways
could indeed be troubling in and of themselves. And as
I say, welcome to troubled minds. That's the whole point
of it. Like I said, we can agree, we can disagree,
we can be friends tomorrow. That's the entire point of this.
And I don't know. And what about that hot take stuff,

(23:23):
like is that necessary for this you know guy with
these millions of followers to pop off about heavy metal.
I mean, and there's people, you know, there's there's people
like you know, the guy, the guy literally freshly passed
away today, and there's people that popping off about how
he's burning in hell and all kinds of stuff. I
thought that was supposed to be above our pay grade,
that sort of eternal judgment. I don't know, right, it's

(23:46):
frustrating to me. It's just like I said, the hot
takes and getting people all riled up, and it doesn't
rile me. It disappoints me. This is what we have
to do for engagement in twenty twenty five, to get attention,
because that's just the way people have become as part
of another psycho spiritual infection of the attention economy and

(24:07):
of clicks and eyeballs. You see what I mean. It's
the same damn thing by the same damn people that
have been doing this for our entire lives. Am I
making any sense? If I'm not, that's cool. I've been
known to make no sense whatsoever. But let me hear
your thoughts on this. The Satanic Panic twenty twenty five.

(24:28):
Here we go again. What do you think? Is it
possible that heavy metal is of the devil? Or you
think that many influences could be at the devil? And
therein lies the conversation seven oh two nine seven one
zero three seven click the discord link of Troubleminds dot
or this is Troubled Minds on Michael Strange, don't go anywhere,
be right back. We got Jacob Parsher boy coming up

(24:49):
in your calls as well. See you on the other
side of the break that button right there.

Speaker 8 (25:12):
Two shadows creeping in my mind, the metal whispers, parsing.

Speaker 2 (25:18):
Lights, dips of power, the.

Speaker 9 (25:21):
Inter twice shattering silence, shattering silence.

Speaker 3 (25:30):
You re grow normally reality face still love raging thoughts
that consume my.

Speaker 8 (25:44):
Soul, round and round in the endless night, in every rip,
a fine control, a voice.

Speaker 4 (25:53):
So hearty, a voice.

Speaker 10 (25:55):
So heart.

Speaker 3 (26:00):
You re grow lovely reality face.

Speaker 6 (26:10):
Still lovely, shade of sad.

Speaker 5 (26:20):
Feel the story read.

Speaker 9 (26:26):
Lose yourself in the.

Speaker 7 (26:33):
Oriel Bay, all that drown.

Speaker 6 (26:59):
You. We are.

Speaker 2 (27:25):
Welcome back to Troubled Minds. I'm your host, Michael Strange.
We're streaming on YouTube, rumble x, Twitch and Kick. We
are broadcasting live on the Troubled Minds Radio Network. That's
KUAP Digital Broadcasting and of course eighty eight point four
FM Auckland, New Zealand. Tonight, we're talking to psycho spiritual infection,
the ring of cognitive possession. Now, when Lord of the Rings,

(27:46):
the one ring was exactly that it would dominate your will,
it would change you into something you would never become otherwise.
Now we're told that heavy metal itself is the music
of the devil. Has the hot take again in p
s Ozzy Osborne tonight and look whatether you like the
guy or not? Like I said I said this too
on X, I'm not a I'm just not a metal fan.

(28:07):
I'm typically not. I appreciate the artistry that goes into it.
But it's not. It's just not my jam. It never
has been. But I never ran around saying it is
of the devil either. You see what I'm saying, I
don't know? And again am I wrong? That becomes really
the question here, And don't forget I'm okay being wrong.
That's fine. Let's talk about reality tunnels, Let's talk about dogma,
Let's talk about propaganda. Let's talk about identity and how

(28:29):
it's always changing, and how if we forget and allow
the keys of our identity into somebody else's hands, we
become what they want us to become. That is most
on my mind tonight. Love to hear your thoughts on this.
Seven two nine five seven one zero three seven Click
the discord link at Troubledminds dot org. We'll put you
on the show. It's as easy as that. Let's go
to Jacob in all the discord. I can't remember which

(28:51):
stature and welcome to the joint. How are you doing tonight, sir?
Go right ahead. Lots of ways to take this, take
it wherever you like. Welcome back to the thank thanks
for being flexible with the technology and you sound great.

Speaker 9 (28:58):
Go ahead, sir, you guys have brought up this concept
before that there's like maybe some hitted agenda with like
the culture of music, Like something.

Speaker 3 (29:10):
Could be programming or like you know, like horror movies,
heavy metal. You know, no one knows wherever they came from.

Speaker 9 (29:18):
I mean you could say like Black Sabbath and all
these bands kind of created it. But like, could there
be some other agenda there, like satanic pantic. I don't
think it's anything like.

Speaker 1 (29:33):
That, but.

Speaker 9 (29:35):
It's it's a super interesting concept, Like so what if
that idea was implanted there too for some sort of agenda.
I never even considered this. I've just been such a fan,
you know, I mean and getting into this music. You know,
like in the eighties for me, it was like you

(29:56):
just had the radio and it was just like all
this just music. And I mean I never you know,
even before I understood the themes of religion, you know,
I just like the music was just just spoke to me.

Speaker 6 (30:10):
You know.

Speaker 9 (30:11):
It was just like the same thing with horror movies.
I just something about it. It's just like the charm
of it. I don't know, you know, I never thought
about the maybe consequences or the outcome of like these things,
you know. And another thing, I became a musician somewhere
in the mid nineties, you know, But I mean I
was super influenced by like Black Sabbath and ousy Osmore

(30:36):
and just like, you know, I remember just wanting to
you contribute to something, you know, and at some point,
you know, I had to put in a little bit
of work, and I felt like I became kind of
a vessel, you know. And I don't know how to
feel about that, because at some point it felt like

(30:56):
I had to put in some practice and sacrifice and
then it's some point something connected with me, and you know,
all this, all these musical ideas are artistic ideas just
started coming through me. I've been writing songs for like
twenty twenty five years now. I don't know where that
comes from, you know. And it's but I'm just super

(31:16):
grateful for the music of Black Sabbath, which was also
inspired by the Beatles. So it's just like, how do
you feel about that? You know, it's something from the
Peace and Love era, which was it kind of had
it kind of came from that, but it also Black
Sabbath came from that kind of industrialized darkness of Birmingham.

(31:37):
England and it was like, that's where the product is,
where they were from. So I mean, I'm super.

Speaker 3 (31:45):
Grateful for that, But I could that I've been fun
into some other satanic ma. I don't know.

Speaker 9 (31:53):
I think for people religious fanatics trying to control something
they don't underst sure they'll brand it or something like that.
But could there be some hitting an agenda. I think
that's also a possibility, but I never really considered it. Yeah,
it's interesting.

Speaker 2 (32:08):
Yeah, well, I mean this exact thing. You're right. We've
talked about this quite a lot on this show because
it seems to be that recurring theme. Like I said
to me, politics is equally dangerous, maybe more so, because
nobody really has to deal with music. You could live
without music your entire life. What a sad life it
would be, I think, because music is beautiful and wonderful
and magical and all those things in good ways, not

(32:29):
just bad ways. Of course, there's you know, if you're
listening to talking about you know, red rum in people
often people and stuff, and you know all that, like
all that type of stuff, it is in some degree
it's going to be brainwashing. It's going to be messing,
especially with impressionable youth. Of course, politics is too, and
in the old days, you know, correct me if I'm

(32:50):
wrong here. I was never very political when I was young.
It was just like these jerks that they're just get
out of my way, right, let me listen to the
music or whatever. And so I think as you're describing
it might be possible that it's been weaponized against us,
which becomes that larger conversation. But directly speaking, heavy metal
itself and those genres and subgenres as part of the

(33:12):
musical expression of people, like, is that directly of the devil?
Or do you think I mean, I could hear the
case of popular like actual pop music being of the devil.
You know what I'm saying. I can see it so
many different ways here, because there's again unlimited ways to
manipulate people in general. And so do you think there
is a distinction there, like a darker aspect of it,

(33:34):
or do you think that the case I'm making makes
more sense as sort of a fractal and the idea
of music itself as not just a movement but beyond
politics into sort of the mind's eye of the youth itself.

Speaker 9 (33:46):
Well, I think yeah, I mean the way we are
right now, I think probably easily corruptible.

Speaker 3 (33:56):
How can I, let say, how I can explain this, Like.

Speaker 9 (34:02):
The way I look at it is, I think, yeah,
exactly what I was trying to say, Like, you'll have
these you know, political people trying I mean, they're so fake.

Speaker 3 (34:13):
I don't know, I see right through it. They're just
trying to basically throw.

Speaker 9 (34:15):
A label on something they don't understand, or they're just
trying to convince their followers just to do the same,
like and uh, but I'm just like it seems like
a cop out, Like, I mean, you have so many
good examples of positive stuff happening, so I think it's
I think it's so much more that it's like duality

(34:37):
is a good example. Like there's a lot of really
dark elements you can go into and you can pursue
and whatever your energy is.

Speaker 3 (34:46):
Some people feel that's benefit to them.

Speaker 9 (34:48):
Some people feel that's normal, like the darkest most a
full energy that is out there. Some people feel that's benefit.
I don't necessarily agree with that, but some people just
feel that way to your transcending duality in a way,
some people same thing. Some people will I mean, these
these people that maybe if you harness, if you consider

(35:10):
that maybe.

Speaker 3 (35:13):
Some people are just these you know, politicians, people in
power have just.

Speaker 9 (35:19):
Possibly taken advantage of things and for their own benefit,
you know, and they think that's some sort of benefit thing.
I'm not gonna I'm not saying that's good at all.
I just think there's so much hypocrisy and a lot
of it. But I mean I think there's there's good.
There's it's maybe it's more than black and white. There's
good and bad parts of it.

Speaker 10 (35:39):
You know.

Speaker 9 (35:40):
Some people can take take their own thing from it,
you know, but you should be critical thinking about it.

Speaker 3 (35:47):
So this is a good conversation as well.

Speaker 9 (35:49):
Like you know, for example, like I've been into this
kind of music for thirty plus years, you know, and
I'm considering, oh, maybe there was some other agenda there
at some point which was sholling my influence, you know.
And if you talk about like the things you know,
I was watching or playing video games in the nineties,
this could also influence these things, you know. Uh, and

(36:11):
now I mean our our new generation now, like no,
they would consider these things.

Speaker 1 (36:17):
You know.

Speaker 3 (36:17):
It's just it's.

Speaker 9 (36:20):
It's it's complicated, but it's a good thing to talk
about because these things are coming out that you know,
maybe this is the thing. You know, maybe this is
a possibility. So it's it's definitely interesting to think about.

Speaker 2 (36:36):
Yeah, and again, like I said, I could be wrong
about all of it. That's why I think we need
to get some some ideas on this, people that can
look at the world in a different way and consider
because like I said, I can, and I'm sure you
could too, where we would agree to say, Okay, you
could make the case that pop music could be incredibly
dangerous because it's been manufactured specifically for that sort of

(36:57):
airworm and business like that. Like it's it's literally been
probably worked on more than commercials, more than Burnet's propaganda
pop music itself to weaponize what specifically to make some dollars. Yeah, definitely,
but beyond that, you know, kind of put these ideas
into people's heads. This is something that's been going on
for a very long time. And I do think that,

(37:17):
like I said, boiling it down by genre, I think
it just depends and the level of repetition too. Don't
forget that is that if you're stuck in one thing
all the time, all the time, all the time, all
the time, you become that one thing. So without sort
of a diverse repertoire of ideas and let's say, genres
and interests, then it's easy to kind of get stuck

(37:37):
in that one thing, which can become dangerous no matter
what the thing is, including pop music specifically indirectly, or
including politics. Like you said, you see right through it.
I do too. These people don't believe half the things
they're saying, probably more than that. But that's really the
point tonight, is that when you look at this stuff
and you consider it as an immersion, right, an immersion

(37:57):
of the one ideal, it's never good. Like we have
to actually be able to say, okay, yeah, cool. So
let's look at it this way. In that way. Now,
let's make the case you and I that pop music
is the most dangerous thing on the planet. Can you
see that? Can you see that? In try and make
the case philosophically why that particular genre in general is

(38:19):
more dangerous than metal? Can you see it? I can
see it.

Speaker 3 (38:23):
Oh, I can tell you exactly.

Speaker 9 (38:24):
So I hate to say, I'm not trying to like
throw shade anybody, but the it's a bit or will
you in a way like yeah, it's just so dumb down.
I mean, you have you have very basic structures of
music happening. I mean I hear music these days, which
the drum patterns I could I could come up with

(38:45):
this on my own and garage bound in about I
mean ten to twenty minutes. I could come up with
a lot of the stuff I hear modern music. I
could come up with this and replicate this. You know,
it's just lacking substance the same thing. And I've heard
some things where people like, you know, back in the
nineties or early two thousands, you know, you had kids

(39:05):
in high school forming bands trying to.

Speaker 3 (39:07):
Figure this out.

Speaker 9 (39:08):
They were getting into you know, grunge or metal, becoming
musicians and stuff that's not happening anymore. From from I
don't have sources on this, but it's just not the
same demographic. It's just people are playing video games, you know,
and it's just it's a different culture, you know. So
that's it's almost like becoming extinct in a way. But

(39:29):
I think the pop culture is that there's not there's
not anything that's everything's been done. It's a lot of
the ideas and concepts that have already been I've came
out and been discussed in music, and it's in it's
a way, it's like a dir form, you know, and.

Speaker 3 (39:52):
Pop music is it's it uses a lot of the same.

Speaker 9 (39:56):
Chord progressions, you know, and there's not a whole lot
of new territory being explored. So uh, to me, I
think it's kind of dumbing down society in some ways.
It's like I said, it's kind of ore Willing killing
what what's the uh, what's the thing in nineteen eighty

(40:16):
four you're talking about the erasing of the language, you know,
it's kind of like that in a way. I think
there's parallels there.

Speaker 2 (40:24):
So now speak, yeah, newspaper.

Speaker 3 (40:26):
Yeah, it's happening with music.

Speaker 2 (40:29):
Yeah, and I and exactly. And that's and that's the
point I would make too. Is that so pop music
in and of itself? I mean, fine, right, but it's
it's it's just very very highly mechanical. It's very copied.
They kind of use these templates to try and create
these hooks to just you know, like that that damn
song you can't get out of your head. And that's
that's science for sure. But also it's science where it

(40:51):
meets sort of our cognitive jellyfish. Okay, like the squishy
part of our brain that we don't really control, and
it controls us as part of it. So it it
becomes science meeting consciousness, which again turns into some ritual
magic of old. I mean, this is this is what
they've been doing forever, and so this is this is

(41:11):
why it's important. Like I said, immersion in any one thing,
no matter what it is, and my opinion is going
to be bad.

Speaker 3 (41:18):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (41:19):
But but but but once you sort of sort of
branch out in some other ideas, and that's the healthy stuff.
You can you can enjoy different arts or different different
styles or all the things. Right, read different kinds of books,
do it, Go, get it, learn as much as you
can about all the different things. But in one thing,
if you get stuck in one reality tunnel forever, like

(41:39):
that soulist politician, is what you become. And even though
they don't believe it, like you said, those politicians are dirty,
slimy bastards that are always lying to us. I don't
even think they believe the lies they're telling us anymore
at all. And did they ever? Probably it probably drew
them to that that that space of a fire and
brimstone and smelling like sulfur, as they all probably do.

(42:00):
But you get my meaning here is if they're if
immersion can be good unless you get stuck there. Because
here's another thing to regarding you said video games. To me,
it's tragic that somebody can get on like the guitar
band with that like plastic joystick that's like a guitar
and just shred like you'd never believe. And I'm like,
what a waste of time you could be doing that

(42:22):
on a real guitar. What are you doing? Oh my gosh,
I guess I'm getting old. I don't know what you take.

Speaker 9 (42:30):
You know, it's the guitar is The guitar is like
a it's a weird instrument that I think it still
has room to be figured out. I'll take patterns and
try to write them backwards and stuff like that. It's
just but it's a it's a process.

Speaker 3 (42:51):
Let's see. But yeah, you can do that. I mean,
I think there's some inspiration there.

Speaker 9 (42:55):
I think someone who's playing a video game like that
would probably get bored after some point they maybe would
want to pick up guitar. So there's some elements of
positivity there. But overall, you also have this thing where
just for a cloud or somebody's snapchat page, they're going
to just be like, throw something in in a AI
generator for music, create some music, throw some vocals on it,

(43:18):
and people will just eat this stuff up. People aren't
really questioning things. So I think there's stuff like that
that's that's concerning to me. There's already been you know,
platforms which have had to reject bands for so many
AI music, and it's just the lazy way of things.

(43:39):
I think that's what our society is potentially coming to.
We're just But also it's maybe is that just because
everything's so oversaturated, we're just people are trying to get
some dopamine fixed. It was just like, hey, I can
I can get this all these followers, I can just
you know, put together this music and an AI website
and throw some vocals over it, and then I'll be

(44:00):
the newest, you know, cool kid on the block.

Speaker 1 (44:02):
Man.

Speaker 9 (44:03):
It is, you know, versus the blood and pain and
sacrifices so many people last fifty decades have put through
to do something that's actually genuine.

Speaker 3 (44:16):
It's it's a weird battle of spiritual musical you know, integrity,
so it's something that's very true, very I very much
think that's the case. So in it's crazy to think about.
I think there's something to.

Speaker 2 (44:33):
That, something to it is good. That's why we're here
to kind of sniff out some of the something too.
It's and wonder how we can change these ideas and
how you know, we again talking about it is one way,
certainly because if we don't talk about it and sort
of redredge this stuff into the into the open here,
it doesn't get talked about at all, mostly because it's
political discourses, it's all binary stuff, it's people hating each other,

(44:53):
it's all the stuff, right, and so kind of and
again talking about this like this, this is once again
so Ossie passes away to rest in peace again a
huge influence of yours and not just show as many
other people and it turns into again social media points
like fire and off about this. I'm gonna read it again.
My parents didn't let us listen to metal, was devil

(45:13):
worshiping music. Hard to see how they were wrong. Pantera
used pentagrams, even if ironic or art, it's demonic symbolism.
Later in life, I tried, couldn't stomach it. Made me
physically ill. It's the sound of demons. I mean a
little dramatic. Are we the sound of demons? Oh my goodness, gracious? Yeah. Anyway, anyway,

(45:36):
if you got anything else, that's cool. I don't want
to drag you out here and make you compeat yourself,
but but go ahead, anything good.

Speaker 9 (45:40):
I'm gonna say this because I think it's veryker Sure,
maybe he's not man for everybody, but I'm super grateful
for bands, iron made in Black, Sabbath, maybe some old
Pantera stuff. I'll listen to something and it gives me
chills all you know, the hairs in the back of
my neck are setting up. I don't know how to
explain that. Maybe that's my own religious experience happening, and

(46:02):
I will accept that. But I'm super grateful for that that.
I'm going to take that over some word of a mouth.
People saying that this is satanic, they're just throwing this
narrative out there. They'd be like, hey, you know, this
is sa tantic what people don't even know what to
happen that stuff means. The same people will say you're

(46:23):
a communist, but they don't know what that even means,
you know, and so people just throw these words out there.
If you experience something and it's spiritual to you in
a way, I think that's super important. But like again,
you know, when I first experienced Osiotomor or Black Sabbath
or Iron Maiden or those are good examples, I heard it.
I didn't understand it, but I felt this sensation happening

(46:46):
to me, you know, and to me, I mean, is
that something that could be programmed into me?

Speaker 3 (46:52):
Possibly?

Speaker 9 (46:53):
I think it's a stretch, but I think there's an
experience there to be, to be, you know, to consider that,
and that's something important, you know, and not you don't
have that anymore. There's something that there's a lack of that.
I don't know any modern music that's happening right now
that's connecting with people where I can say I heard

(47:15):
something that's giving me chills and you know, so that's
how it used to be when I grew up in
the in the eighties and nineties, I connected with something
like that. I don't know how to explain it, but
it hit me and I was just like, WHOA this
is for me? I just felt a rush of energy.
Maybe there's some something crazy about I don't know, there's
something to that as well. So maybe some of us

(47:37):
are just tuned differently than others.

Speaker 3 (47:40):
Two and.

Speaker 9 (47:42):
I don't know how to explain that, but that's that's
definitely a different conversation. But I think there's something there.

Speaker 2 (47:47):
Yeah, well said, Well said all that, and I appreciate
you jumping in here. Like I said when I was
putting the show together, I'm like, I wonder if Jacob's
out there. I hope he calls tonight. And my wish
is your command or vice versa. I appreciate you very much, brother,
Thanks for listening, Thanks for popping in here and sharing
your expertise. You know where to find him. Jacob a
good friend for a long time. Harsher Boy is what
he used to be known as. That's his old account
Mefisto on Walls on Discord at Troubleminds dot org Ford

(48:11):
slash friends. Scroll down it says follow Jacob here, please
check out his music. Talented guy and does knows a
lot about this genre and this style and again heavily
influenced by Ozzie. And again sorry for the loss there
of the influence and keep on keeping on. You're the best, brother,
Talk to soon. Appreciate the call and you have a
great night.

Speaker 3 (48:28):
Yes, take it you too.

Speaker 2 (48:29):
There you go, you knowing to love them. And that's
the point. That's why we do this again, so many
people with so many different ideas kind of coming together
to look at this a little differently, you know, like like,
there you go. He spent a bunch of his life
learning how to play heavy metal music and he does
it well. Does that make him a demon? You see
what I'm saying. So suddenly and real quick, I want

(48:50):
to read this to North Dixon. Shout out over there.
On Rumble says this too, and I get the energy
frequency of the vibration part of it. North Fixon says, again,
I used to be a metal head, but the past
five years learned about frequencies and the spiritual warfare and
mainstream music. I have transformed a lot of my brain,
changing my music. And like I said, I agree we
are sort of fertile, fertile ground for influence. But my

(49:13):
point in all of this is that I don't think
a little heavy metal can will hurt you a little
bit of it, you know what I mean? If it's
that all the time, it's like gangster rap, it like
you know, shooting people and dealing drugs. And if that's
all the time, all the time, all the time, it's
probably not the best headspace for you. So, like I said,
maybe I'm wrong, You guys tell me as usual. This

(49:34):
is one of those things that again, this conversation once again,
here's its ugly head. In twenty twenty five with this
couldn't stomach. It made me physically ill. It's the sound
of demons, shout out Mike Cernovich, who doesn't know who
I am. And I could care less. By the way,
I don't like I'm not going to say it. I
don't like political people that are binary. And that's it.

(49:56):
That's it. But you know that's that's the hot take.
And so, like I was saying, the hot take, culture
rears its ugly head again and that's it. And that's
exactly the point. So I love to hear your thoughts
on this. We got Derek the night Stocker coming up.
We got Kelly on the phone line. I hope he
can hear me. Let me know, Kelly, if you can
hear me there on the phone line. I thought, I
hope I fixed everything, but you know me, I can't.

(50:17):
I can't. Actually, you know without testing it with multiple people,
and it's hard to get all that set up with
such a small window and anyway. Anyway, so we'll get
you guys on a second here. I appreciate you being patient,
but yeah, that becomes the point. And I do think immersion,
like I said, immersion in anything really becomes sort of
like that one ring, which is why I'm talking about
this in the way I am that actual idea of

(50:39):
a psycho spiritual infection. Now in the case of the
one ring, remember it's more like an eagregor, it's more
like some entity cooked into this thing that is now
manipulating you. Now in the case of music, is that
the same idea that becomes a question immersion of would
be very similar to that level of actual possession? Dare

(51:01):
we say? Or this psycho spiritual infection and cognitive possession
as I'm calling it, it's weird, I know. And again
the more we learn about this too, with actual consciousness
studies and how malleable our brains really are, and do
we ever really have the thought of our own all
that stuff right, all that stuff really plays. However, it

(51:23):
doesn't mean that, you know, like a van Go is
of the devil or whatever. This is what I mean, Like,
you could probably picky any artist or any genre of
anything and make it legitimate case of it being of
the devil. And that's my point, is that it's human expression.
So as long as people aren't getting directly hurt, is
it of the devil?

Speaker 1 (51:42):
Maybe?

Speaker 2 (51:43):
Look, maybe I'm wrong as usual. Look maybe I'm wrong,
and that's okay. Don't forget it. It's okay to be wrong.
That's how you learn things, right, and having conversations with
brilliant friends like you, guys, is how you learn things.
So what am I missing? Why are we still talking
about this in twenty twenty five? Is heavy metal of
the Devil? I'm a poet and I don't even know.

(52:05):
I'd love to hear your thoughts. Steven Or two nine
one zero three seven click the discord blank at Troubled Minds,
dot Ter, We'll put you on the show. It's as
easy as that. If let's see if we got Dareth
the night Stalker coming up, Kelly and Colorado for sure,
with your hands up. I see you, guys, Thanks for
being patient. Here we go, Trouble Minds on the way
after this quick commercial break here right back don't go anywhere.

(52:45):
Welcome back to Trouble Minds. I'm your host, Michael Strange.
We're streaming on at YouTube, the rumble x, Twitch and Kick.
We are broadcasting live on the Trouble Minds Radio Network.
That's KUAP Digital Broadcasting and of course eighty eight point
four FM Auckland, New Zealand tonight only. This is psycho
spiritual infection, the ring of cognitive possession. We're kind of
combining the one ring from Lord of the Rings and

(53:06):
its overbearing presence of dragging you into an identity that
is not yours.

Speaker 6 (53:11):
Now.

Speaker 2 (53:12):
It mirrors and echoes in a very similar way. This
comment by Mike Cernovich regarding the death of Ozzy Osbourne
dressed in piece Ozzy who Prince of Darkness as he
called himself. Now here's the thing. Cernovich said this, My
parents didn't let us listen to metal was devil worshiping music.
Hard to see how they were wrong. Pantera used pentagrams,

(53:33):
even if ironic or art, it's demonic symbolism. Later in life,
I tried, couldn't stomach it made me physically ill. It's
the sound of demons, the sound of demons, I mean,
that's pretty poignant. That's a nice statement to make. What
does that mean? You see what I'm saying. I think
it's a little extreme. The call music. You don't like

(53:54):
the sound of demons? Very spooky, right? I don't know.
In any case, the Satanic panic is back. It's twenty
twenty five and we're still talking about this. Why seven
oh two nine seven one zero three seven click the
discord blank at Troubleminds dot RG. We'll put you on
the show just like this.

Speaker 3 (54:14):
What's going on?

Speaker 2 (54:15):
Derek in Massachusetts, the night's talker? What's going on? Brother?
How are you? Welcome to the joints? Go right ahead?
What's mind? My man? I'm sure you saw the news.
I'm sure it's been all over your feet and everybody else's.
And uh, I'm not sure if you like a heavy
metal at all or whatever, but it doesn't matter. Welcome
to the joint. What's on your mind?

Speaker 6 (54:32):
My meda?

Speaker 11 (54:33):
Yeah, that's crazy stuff. RP Ozzy first, RP Yoh Huxtable too.
It's kind of getting buried a little bit. He passed
away yesterday to but uh, wild stuff.

Speaker 12 (54:46):
I do.

Speaker 11 (54:47):
Ozzy's probably as heavy as I go, I think, Mike,
my dad grew me up on like my favorite band
all time it is probably Zeppelin, and then obviously on
the radio, I mean not in his car. I was
always think Floyd Sabbath, that one who happening just all
the time. So those are kind of the core of
rock music for me personally, but also in my like

(55:08):
in the Zeitgeist when I was coming up, my first
kind of memory of Ozzie is like him doing like
the talk show circuit to promote his new reality show
and about how how off the wall is, so kind
of have two different pictures in my head, how he's
the rock god, but then my first time seeing him
it's as the old characater Ozzy. So it's weird how

(55:28):
I kind of both those things are one siding at
one time.

Speaker 1 (55:31):
But you want hot takes. I got a crazy hot take.
It's not it's not mine, but it's out there. I
want to deliver.

Speaker 2 (55:37):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, And that's that's my point. Every time
something happens in the Zeitgeist, everybody has to polarize hot take,
and it's like, come on, guys, really, and I see
all the esoteric stuff and their life. Maybe you've got one,
Maybe you've got one. What do you got to go ahead?

Speaker 11 (55:51):
I have I haven't been huh been digging at all today.
I haven't seen anything today or it looks today there's
a problem over the weekend. I saw I saw this
or maybe like a you go, I saw this and
I hate it. I don't like this theory. And when
I prefaces best, I'll tell you why in a minute.
But I don't like this theory, not because I don't
believe it's possible. I like the weird theories in so
in in theory this can be possible. But I'll tell

(56:14):
you why I don't like it in a minute. You
heard of the the new metal singer young Blood, who's
been around like with Ozzy and Osbourne's a lot recently
he performed his last show, and uh it's been it's
like the new He's like the new Ozzie there like
the Osbourne are like periading him around.

Speaker 1 (56:32):
It's kind of the the air apparent to the throne.

Speaker 2 (56:35):
I have not I have no idea who that is.
That shows you how close I are.

Speaker 11 (56:40):
He's like a twenty seven year old sorry, you can
name it, okay, He's like a He's like a twenty
seven year old and he's saying, like changes during that
last concert and stuff, and so the theory is, so
he went, so he's been he's being paraded.

Speaker 1 (56:53):
By the Osbornes around a ton. So I only know
who this person is. I've only heard him sing Ozzie songs.

Speaker 11 (56:58):
I only know him who he is because because the
Osbornes keeps saying, oh, he's so much like him.

Speaker 6 (57:02):
And then.

Speaker 11 (57:05):
The theory is that during that concert on stage, Ozzy
transferred his consciousness into this new kid, young Blood, in
order for him to live on after he dies. That
his body is deteriorating and he's transferring. He's like doing
a soul transfer. That's like the viral terms going around
about it, soul trans So if you search Ozzy soul transfer,
you'll find a bunch of TikTok videos about this from

(57:26):
a week ago.

Speaker 1 (57:26):
And then this happens.

Speaker 11 (57:27):
I don't know what the updated version of it is,
but that he went on stage, he did this weird thing.
He ritually kind of gave young Blood his cross, put
it on his neck, kind of touched heads with them.
And the videos are all like if you know anything
about the pineal gland and the touching of the paneal Gland.
It's a it's a potential consciousness transfer and it's like
the ICEU type of thing, and it's related to Brahmovich

(57:47):
and jay Z and just hitting all the TikTok conspiracy buttons,
you know, and that he's going to live on as
this new kid who apparently has all the same mannerisms
and has the same kind of vibe as Ozzy.

Speaker 1 (58:00):
Have you heard that at all?

Speaker 2 (58:01):
No, But it doesn't surprise me with TikTok. I mean, well,
if you think we're weird, TikTok is completely off the
rails and I don't think they'll ever get back. That's
a So that doesn't surprise me a single bit. And
that again that type of interestingly to me, that type
of sort of soul transference ritual. The ritual itself is
you know, on stages with a lot of people around.

(58:22):
Is it's the ancient way. But we're still talking about
in twenty twenty five, this acceleration that I'm always considering
in technology where they're saying we're going to download our
soul and upload it to R two D two. So
I mean it's the same damn thing. It's just a
sort of a different way of looking at the exact idea.
It's it's weird how it's all coming together again in
the Satanic Panic twenty twenty five.

Speaker 1 (58:43):
Yeah, yeah, that's right. So I so personally I don't
like that theory. So I commented on it.

Speaker 11 (58:48):
I'm like, I hate this theer you because I don't
think it's pusbuble, but because it kind of discounts Audie,
Like are you serious with the guy? And I mean,
you haven't heard his young blood character, but I've only
heard him sing a few Audie songs, and he sounds
like Ozzie's voice is transcendent. There's no other voices that
sound like like Ozzy Osbourne. It's it's almost like he
sounds autotuned. And obviously I think he did adapt a

(59:10):
little bit of auto tuned later on in life, but
his voice has this kind of like ethereal quality to
it that you can kind of really only have with
with auto tune, and nobody can really replicate it. In
the idea that this guy who's just like struggling trying
as hard as he possibly can to even get to
like one tenth of what Ozzie's vibe in essence is,
I think it's an insult to Ozzie and the hyping
up this dork too much, who is just like some

(59:32):
weird goth kid who I don't know, like it probably
Sharon wants to bang him. That's probably that's the vibe
that I'm getting. It's probably if there's anything weird going on,
it's that. But in the comment like as the night Sock,
I'm like, I love conspiracies, I love weird conspiracies.

Speaker 1 (59:46):
In theory, this is possible. I don't hate it because
of this.

Speaker 11 (59:49):
But also we have to remember that the Osbourne's have
been on mainstream TV for thirty years now, so they
are part of the mainstream TV machine.

Speaker 1 (59:57):
She's on the View or.

Speaker 11 (59:58):
Whatever, Sharon or whatever that a few competitors like like
they are, they are part of the mainstream keeping machine.
So and like ritual ritual craft, the craft on stage
is definitely a thing that people. People are all doing rituals,
but also stage craft, just as an entertainer, is also
a thing. And Ozzie probably being the number one person

(01:00:20):
in the world at it, like obviously the connotation of
doing this thing on stage is a passing of the torch,
and they do kind of want you to think this way,
but that's just to manufacture a new star for this corporation,
a new metal star for this corporation on Ozzie's way out,
because he's part of this corporate machine, less so than
he's transferring his essence, who's one in a million. There's

(01:00:42):
no other people like my favorite for my favorite front
man of all time is Robert Plant, but Ozi Osborne's
right up there as far as like, there's no other
voices like this, and to say that his essence has
now been transfer it into some kid with wearing eyeliner
who's just the only goth in a seat of email
people now, Like, it's upsetting to me, and it's just
it's it's it's in theory, it's fun. In practice, I

(01:01:05):
think it's lame, and I want to make that clear
because he just passed away and I don't want to
say that that happened. But yeah, that's far hot takes.
That's the big one that's going around, and then.

Speaker 2 (01:01:15):
It takes real quick on that real quick, just a
real quick recock aside. So so the interesting part to me,
another layer of this is that it may not be literal,
but it's certainly like you said, they're passing the torch
and the brand and trying to get that stuck out
of our head. Right, So the ritual is not necessarily,
you know, a soul transference. It's it's the transference of

(01:01:36):
the brand in our brain. That's that's the real ritual
right there.

Speaker 3 (01:01:41):
You're you're actually right.

Speaker 11 (01:01:42):
But the evidence in like the TikTok videos and everything
is one in one interview that Sharon and Kelly All
was born in doing with this young blood guy.

Speaker 1 (01:01:49):
All the quin questions like, oh, what do you do
for fun, and the guys, oh, well along way, like
I'm strange.

Speaker 11 (01:01:55):
I love to watch wool movies, like wool movies, And
that was one like, oh my god, that's that's just
like my father.

Speaker 1 (01:02:02):
That keeps like staring at each other. That's just just
like Aussie. That's just like Aussie. And they ask him like.

Speaker 11 (01:02:06):
Four different questions and to make the to make it
seem like basically he's a like a reincrenated version of
Ozzie while he's still alive basically. But again, that's that's
part of the part of the thing. But then I
just looked up real quick before the call to see
what is there any connections like what he did after
after he died, and he's like not staring away from it.
So this is young Blood's like Twitter, Instagram eulogy to Ozzy.

(01:02:30):
I didn't think you would leave so soon the last
time we met. You were so full of life and
your laugh field of the room. But as it is
written with legends, they seem to know things.

Speaker 3 (01:02:37):
That we don't.

Speaker 11 (01:02:38):
And I guess Ozzie had some tweet like he tweeted
out like eight hours ago, a poster of like the
final show and kind of like a goodbye type of
message type of thing. But as as written with legends,
they seem to know things that we don't. I will
never forget you. You will be in every single note
I sing with me, every time I walk on stage.
You cross around my neck is the most precious thing

(01:02:58):
I own. You asked me once if I was anything,
if there's anything you can do for me, And as
I said then and I will say now for all
of us, your music wasn't enough. He took us on
an adventure, your adventure that started at all truly heartbreaking.
You're the greatest of all time. And then all right,
PAUSI a legend, but just you will be in every
single note I sing and with me every single.

Speaker 1 (01:03:17):
Time I walk on stage.

Speaker 11 (01:03:18):
If you don't think his team has heard of this
theory that's out there, you're you're kidding itself. They do, so,
I mean, I just think it's weird that he puts
that in there. You know, what do you think before
I move on off of that?

Speaker 2 (01:03:30):
Yeah, No, definitely, it's it's a it's a strange thing
to lean into. But I guess here we are strap in.
Things are about to get more weird than twenty twenty five.

Speaker 3 (01:03:39):
Yeah.

Speaker 11 (01:03:41):
So then as far as as far as the psych
the psychic spiritual infection type of thing, I do think
that's interesting and kind of like these weird entry points
for kind of non physical or like different types of consciousness.
There's different types of like like invasive of things to

(01:04:02):
enter our reality. We talk about Cuthulhu entering reality of
craft streams, but I wonder could there be to look
at the whole trajectory kind of the last fifty to
seventy years of human history that maybe they did kind
of enter this way, and like just pre metal rock
music has Bobby Johnson, who's known as the first person

(01:04:24):
to like go to the crossroads to sell their soul,
to be good at music and that kind of stuff.
He's kind of the one of these kind of godfathers
of just like blues and folk and indie rock, like
very early kind of the rock music in itself kind
of has him as a seed. And then all of
a sudden, obviously, we get to metal, which has this
kind of grinding, grinding cacoughiness kind of like like like

(01:04:49):
pank bang pots and pants type of machinery type of
that's where the turn metal comes from, kind of like
it's supposed to be Discordian a little bit.

Speaker 1 (01:04:56):
But just like same way with the satanic panic. If
you look and be like.

Speaker 11 (01:05:01):
WHOA, well, my entire life, I've visualized these satanic panic
people with the goes who are calling for panic, like oh,
rock music is evil as the people who were wrong
or dungeons and dragons and evil.

Speaker 1 (01:05:11):
These people are wrong.

Speaker 11 (01:05:12):
But then if you look at the world right now,
this is exactly pretty much what they were saying is
going to happen at that time. And I don't think
these things are demonic, but just like they weren't wrong
in saying that, like these things were going to happen.
So then if you look at metal, all these like
symbols of satanism, all these symbols of magic and the
occult and everything are used to sell records and stuff.

(01:05:35):
But then fast forward to the current day. That's so
the heavy metal it's this niche brand, something that was
considered to be oh you listen to that, or it's
kind of scary, or oh, what's that's that's weird. When
it was as an inception, obviously becomes ubiquitous, it becomes
the top of its time period. But then also now
pop music, which is just popular music without the metal influence,

(01:05:59):
now has all the same accouterments to it, the same
satanic stuff to it. Like Lady Gaga as uh, she's
doing all kind of weird like rituals and she's just
chock full of weird stuff that she does on stage.
The Weekend has his weird robot rituals and the moon
and giant effigies of robots and he's literally praying to
him and everything. Taylor Swift has her during Willow during

(01:06:21):
her tour, She's has her and all her dancers wearing
robes coming out like holding orbs, these glowing orbs and
doing this weird ritual on stage as the as the
the audience chance summon the demon as part of their
like participation with the audience and everything. And I single
those three out because they're so popular, but also my
sister I've seen them all in concert within the last

(01:06:42):
five years. And she comes and shows me the pictures
and everything. She's a regular high school teacher, not in
conspiracies at all, knows that I like them, but knows
nothing about them. And she's showing these these pictures from
all these shows a different time periods, and I'm like,
that's a ritual.

Speaker 1 (01:06:56):
What are they doing.

Speaker 11 (01:06:57):
They're wearing cloaks and doing all this weird stuff and
saying someone demon like Lady Gagoa with blood all over
and just it's really weird.

Speaker 1 (01:07:04):
And I'm like, my sister is very normal. I'm like,
you like this, Yeah, that sounds weird. But another artist
or whatever, like.

Speaker 11 (01:07:09):
It's a ritual. She's like ritual for what, Like ritual
for what. I don't know anything, it could be anything,
but like look at it. It's like a mass up there.
And so it's just weird that that's now popular music.
And so often I think of like like when Lady
got geta something weird. I get a little bit excited
because like I'm into this stuff and it's content.

Speaker 1 (01:07:28):
Oh wow, that's cool. We can talk about that.

Speaker 11 (01:07:30):
But if you're a Lady Gaga fan, what goes through
your mind when she's like spitting up blood like Geene
Simmons is. If you're a Gene Simmons fan, you get that,
that's what you want, get the people what they want.
But a Lady Gaga fan, there's a kind of disconnect,
maybe like some kind of spiritual infection. You can see
kind of the path of the infection kind of taking
over the body collective a little bit. I'm rambling, what

(01:07:52):
do you think that?

Speaker 2 (01:07:53):
Yeah, well, and almost as if we're prime for it,
Like it's it's like like what we want. It's a
that's the weird part of it. And you know, the
same thing goes with politics and all the stuff I've
been talking about, Like it's that Bernee propaganda that we're
just kind of chilling until there's something that draws us.
And if you don't notice it and kind of karate
chop yourself off of it, then you're just drawn to it.

(01:08:15):
I mean, you know, that's why TV works. That's why
commercials work. That's why all the stuff that we've always
talked about radio, that's why talk radio and the commercials
and the jingles, that's why it all works. Man. It's
it's it is a weird and wild thing. We're a
weird point too. So if you've got more, go ahead.
If not, let's wrap it up.

Speaker 3 (01:08:29):
You tell me, uh and to just I'll try to
be real quick a little bit more. That's cool.

Speaker 2 (01:08:39):
Yeah, we got Kelly on that line, so I just
want to make sure. So, so Kelly, hang tight. We'll
get to you momentarily here. But yeah, go ahead.

Speaker 1 (01:08:46):
Right now.

Speaker 3 (01:08:46):
But uh yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:08:47):
So again, with pop music, it's not just like America,
and it's not just American corporations and Hollywood crupt thing,
and it's it's kind of worldwide. This is like again,
it's popular music.

Speaker 11 (01:08:56):
So and rap music doesn't have the so like a
look of satanic stuff, although they do have this artists
and there was the Little Lazac dancing on Left, dancing
on Satan and everything, but also there's if you're somebody
who's crying out about satanic stuff, then you're crying out
about things that are like corrupting you.

Speaker 1 (01:09:13):
So I love rap music my favorite genre. But if
you have a vibe and the kind of.

Speaker 11 (01:09:21):
Like a way to peacock, how cool you are within
this one brand is too like out drugs and about
selling drugs and womanizing, all these different type of things
that are kind of core with the satanic stuff, then
like if you can make the same argument that's taking
you away from you were corrupting you morally or whatever.
But with pop music Eurovision in Europe it's their American Idol,

(01:09:42):
but it's huge and it's every country competes and it's
like the World Series of Music mixed with American Idol,
and it's something we don't have, so we can't really
understand how big it is, but it's huge. And last
year one of their top people, one of the people
who almost won, was a Bambi thug and if you
look her up, she's a nightmare. She's like Nightmarria. It's
scarier than Marilyn Roe or Rob Zombie or anything that

(01:10:03):
we had like in the nineties. Wait, she's horrifying. And
her brand of music is called Wigi pop Ouigi pop like,
so it's very in this Eurovision, there's one hundreds of
thousands of people cheering for I know, you're like Dran
Duran they had a Uigi board with their last album
come out, had a Wigi board come with it, and
it's like, what's what that's Dran Duran. That's not anything
satanic about them, but it's somehow as an infection the

(01:10:25):
affection that spread to pop music just for a just.

Speaker 1 (01:10:29):
I don't know.

Speaker 11 (01:10:30):
And it's like for the hot take culture, the attention,
the clicks and attention all that kind of stuff.

Speaker 3 (01:10:34):
That that's also with the with the satanic.

Speaker 11 (01:10:37):
With the with the satanic panic in rock music is
that these people in need not like if you watch
any documentary or any like like the Motley Crue movie
on Netflix, Dirt or whatever, like trying to think of
a name. Oh this is cool, Oh this is badass.
Oh this will get them going, and the like, no,
that's not quite right, not quite right, and finally think, oh,
Matley Crue and they come up with a name.

Speaker 1 (01:10:56):
Oh that's pretty cool.

Speaker 11 (01:10:57):
And then they have the scene where they turn the
oh into a pentagram and stuff and oh, yeah that's cool,
and then like let's.

Speaker 1 (01:11:05):
Look at this symbol.

Speaker 11 (01:11:05):
Oh yeah that's metal. Oh that'll get them going that'll
get the people fired up. And they just want girls.
They just want money and stuff. They're they're like metaphorically
selling their soul. They're doing things that in theory are bad.
If you believe these things are real, then their depth
are bad. All for money, all for like physical gratification

(01:11:29):
and stuff. And as a as a spiritual psychic infection,
they're a spreader, you know, so that becomes cool. You
get people all over the world wearing these on their
t shirts thinking it's cool. Then the next generation get
a little bit more scary, a little bit more satanic
than the next generation, even more satanic, whereas like Rob
Zombie is now tame, Marilyn Manson a little bit tame.
Listening to stuff right now, it's really really scary. I mean,

(01:11:51):
like I'm just we're such trajectory. But as a as
a psychic spiritual infection, I think it's an interesting idea.
So again, I don't think these things are in themselves satanic,
like rock is more satanic than pop. But it's just
like these forces some outside new ways to enter them,
to enter our reality, and this was potentially one of.

Speaker 2 (01:12:10):
Them, you know, yeah, and grow it in the fractal
space of twenty twenty five where it used to be
just like an old school radio and an old school
TV and now just like well, anything you do, anything
you turn on the black screen. We've always talked about that,
what is it? The black mirror is in full effect
in twenty twenty five, and it's accelerating because now look,
I'm surrounded by them. There's a screen there, there's a

(01:12:30):
screen there. This guy mean here we go, man, absolutely, I.

Speaker 11 (01:12:33):
Mean like like like Ausie, like what was the name
of the original fan for like like dirt or like
like ground, like something that is completely like generic.

Speaker 1 (01:12:42):
And then they go, what about Black Sabbath? But what
does that? Don't know?

Speaker 11 (01:12:44):
It just sounds cool and then yeah, that'll get them going,
and then they become famous, and then that starts up
punching people who like Black Sabbath throo, like where's the worst?

Speaker 1 (01:12:52):
Pick them? And they I don't know.

Speaker 11 (01:12:53):
Just if you're watching the spread of the second connection,
if there, if this is one, then you can see
how what's spread to where you are today.

Speaker 1 (01:13:00):
And Taylor Swipt is the biggest.

Speaker 11 (01:13:01):
Artist maybe of all time, and she's up there doing
robes and telling the audience to something the demon, so
people passing out on stage and everything, but watch that.

Speaker 3 (01:13:08):
Sorry sorry Kelly, hey best, No.

Speaker 2 (01:13:10):
No, you're the best. Appreciate you very much. Thanks for
Papa in here. You know what me love him. That's
Derek the night Stalker. It is s T O C
K E R. He does call us from work and
he is the best grocer in the known multiverse. Where
you find him Trouble mind star rig for Sie friends
scrolled out, very simple and it's a alphabetical under in
the night Stalker right there. Go give him a follow
on his YouTube channel, leave him a nice comment. I
know many of you have. Thank you for that. Appreciate

(01:13:31):
it very much. Let's go, Let's go to Kelly and
let's see if let's test the phone line and then
you've got as much time as you need after the break.
Thanks for impatient guys. We get herschel coming up as
well after that. And uh, Kelly in Colorado, thanks for
being patier brother. You're on trouble minds. How are you?
And go right ahead?

Speaker 13 (01:13:47):
Anything Michael, can you hear me?

Speaker 2 (01:13:49):
I can hear you? You're coming through? Can you guys
hear him on the discord? Oh I'm worried oh, we
may have to do the discord dance again.

Speaker 13 (01:13:58):
The only thing, Elise, is the only the only issue
that was happened last time was that I couldn't hear
anybody that was on discord. I could hear you, like
you know, and then I can hear you pause for
a while and while phone was talking, and then I
can hear you talk, and I just I just couldn't
hear everybody else when I was like waiting on the phone.

Speaker 2 (01:14:16):
I think that may be happening. So do you hear
us this time on the phone? You heard everybody?

Speaker 13 (01:14:21):
Yeah, I heard everybody.

Speaker 1 (01:14:22):
I heard.

Speaker 13 (01:14:24):
Derek can there and you and everything down?

Speaker 3 (01:14:26):
Good?

Speaker 2 (01:14:27):
Okay, all right, well that's good. Can you guys hear
him on the discord? Can somebody over there tell me
if you can hear Kelly. If not, we'll we'll have
him swap over to the other the other thing here
test test one two. So we're kind of at bottom
of the hour, so there's only like a couple of
three minutes left here, So let's let's get a sound
check and then if not, we'll just bump you to
after because I don't want to I don't want to

(01:14:47):
have you have only half of everybody hear you? Can
anybody there on discord, please chime in and tell me
if you.

Speaker 13 (01:14:53):
Can hear a yeah, anybody hear me the old the.

Speaker 2 (01:14:59):
Old professional on air test while you're on air test test?
Could anybody hear h exactly? Is this thing working? Can
anybody here Kelly over on the discord? Because he's coming
through the stream and so we're we're working. That's fine.
But if you guys can't hear him on the discord,
then we got a problem. You can wear that word,

(01:15:21):
you can, yes, okay, all right, perfect, thank you, thank you.
That's Matthew and color. All right, So timekeeper here, we
got about two and a half minutes, and you've got
time two minutes and then you've got time afterward as well.
So lead us into where we're headed. What do you
think is it?

Speaker 6 (01:15:39):
Is it?

Speaker 2 (01:15:40):
Is it metal music? Satanic? Or is this ridiculous?

Speaker 13 (01:15:44):
Well, let's just like what everybody else is saying. You know,
first off, I'm just gonna say, I mean, he already
said it already. It is a frequency as plain as simple.
Begin to leave it as that, you know what I mean.
And it doesn't matter if it's rock and roll or
if it's country music or if it's rap music, because

(01:16:08):
I've heard trash coming from all three of them, you
know what I mean. And I'm talking like violent like
you were saying, you know, and a lot of us
got to do with you know, before we get two
thousand into it. But to start with it is you
know what people are saying, you know what I mean,
whatever they're saying in their songs is what it's going
to make it more devan, I would have to say,

(01:16:30):
because you know, putting the word out and the spoken
word is a lot of frequency too, because it's whatever
you're putting out in the universes what's going to be
coming back to you. So maybe now maybe that's what
these old rock and rollers or anybody, these old artists
that they're having issues with is you know, whatever they
put out to the universe is now coming back to

(01:16:52):
them tenfold while they're getting older, you know what I mean.
And that's why there's a lot of some of these
guys like you know, they're dying early, or they just
look like their drug do do the do the mud,
you know you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 2 (01:17:06):
Yeah, which is uh that that takes a toll to
that rock and roll lifestyle, that's for sure. And so
it does make sense in that that regard that you know,
you can look at some of these guys and go, yeah,
you know that guy looks like he's been to Helen
back right. I mean that makes some sense, but I
mean the actual devil. I don't know about that. Thanks TI.
Kelly will be right back. We got well with Kelly

(01:17:27):
coming up and we'll talk about it once again. Like
I said, this is why we talk about these things.
What am I missing? What are we missing? Together? Seven
or two ninety seven one zero three seven click the
discord like in Troubleminds Dot Look, we're coming up. We
got Kelly and Colorado more from him. We got herschel
with the hand that thanks for being patient, my man,
and zero calls as well and be her rights back. Okay,

(01:18:04):
welcome back to Trouble Minds. I'm Michael Strange. Let us
continue shower psycho spiritual infection, the Ring of cognitive Possession.
We're talking about Ozzy Osbourne. He just passed away today
and all the hot takes are flying like crazy like
you would expect again hot take culture. Somebody's got to
say something, and I saw this today Mike Cernovich again, like,
I'm not really a fan, to be honest, he doesn't

(01:18:25):
know who I am, and I could care less. Like
I said, he's a very much a political guy. But
he said this. My parents didn't let us listen to metal.
What's devil worshiping music? Hard to see how they were wrong.
Pantera used pentagrams even if ironic or aren't, it's demonic
symbolism later in life, I tried, couldn't stomach. It made
me physically ill. It's wait, kind of where's the thing

(01:18:47):
here we go? Is it's the solid of tins? Yeah,
that's what he says. Okay, so whatever, there you go.
It's just said that's the literal sound of demons, but
he's talking about the sound of demons in a different way.

Speaker 1 (01:18:58):
I don't know.

Speaker 2 (01:18:59):
I can see the sound of demons being prevalent a
great many ways. What do you know about it? Seven
oh two nine one zero three seven click the discord
like at troubleminds dot org. Thanks for reading, patient, Kelly,
you are back. Welcome to the joints. Go right ahead.
Don't make me do the demon voice again?

Speaker 13 (01:19:15):
Yeah, do the demon voice again. That was pretty good.

Speaker 4 (01:19:18):
You know what I mean.

Speaker 2 (01:19:19):
Okay, I'll save it. I'll save it for the end
of the call. Go ahead. What you got so you
were talking about We talked about the frequency and and
you're right. Though you've heard some country stuff, I've heard
it too. There's pop stuff that's just vile and vulgar
and terrible and rap.

Speaker 5 (01:19:33):
All of it.

Speaker 2 (01:19:33):
Right, there's different genres that are all just grotesque. What
about this in this moment? What do you know about Ozzie?
And what are we Why are we still talking about
this in twenty twenty five?

Speaker 13 (01:19:41):
Okay, with Ozzie, I just want to say risks and
may he risk some power?

Speaker 1 (01:19:45):
You know.

Speaker 13 (01:19:46):
I went and seen him a couple of times when
he was torn when I was younger. Last of my
scene was up in Alaska. He came up with Pantera.
No that was two different concerts. But it's pretty good man.
I mean, he throws a pretty good show. You can
tell when he changes, you know, just like anybody he's like,

(01:20:07):
he changes into the Ozzy Osbourne, you know, the singer
on stage when he puts on his black makeup around
his eyes. You know, it's just like a not really mask.
Well it is sometimes stick mask here, but it just
like he gets going and it's just like a dark
circles around his eyes, you know, and you.

Speaker 3 (01:20:27):
Know he just.

Speaker 13 (01:20:29):
And you see I mean, I mean, we're not going
to pretend here, you know what I mean, Just like
Derek was kind of brought up, was like all the
black magic that's going on with it, you know what
I mean, a lot of these you know, when he's
when he's art his first start, or when they go
out you know, they sometimes they just perform and they
don't know what's going on with you know, with the
stage they say they don't, right, but sometimes like they

(01:20:53):
you know, sometimes like with the award shows, they really can.
You know, they don't control that. They just go out
there perform. But what's happening in the background, you know,
it's something that's you know, that's that's just magic, you know,
that's and it's and it's dark magic obviously, because I
mean there's nothing there's nothing light about it, you know
what I mean. And it's been happening gradually through music,

(01:21:16):
you know, in different genres through throughout you know, history,
because history, you know through music. When you first think
about music, you know what I mean, you just think
about actual music, you know what I mean, like by
you know, they had symphonies. You know, people wrote symphonies
in uh, you know Mozart, you know, Beethoven, stuff like that.

(01:21:39):
You know, people would go to these places and you
know they would listen to the music, you know, and
now they're financial There was a thing I posted to
I've seen I've seen it on different platforms. But they
were talking about there was a or they some some
scientists did some tests down in De Genniro, uh in Brazil,
and they're I mean that Beethoe fifth, you know, they

(01:22:02):
would they had different music, different genres of music. They
played it all for different people.

Speaker 1 (01:22:07):
You know.

Speaker 13 (01:22:08):
But they were saying after like it was a couple
of weeks of people, you know, constant listening to certain genres.
They found in the fifth Beethoven fifth Symphony and C
minor was you know, starting to effect cancer cells. And
just like you know all the ancients. We've talked about
this and other shows too, with like frequencies you know,

(01:22:29):
like on different like on the Island of Crete, right,
they had those the hyper gm right, they have that
where it's all frequency. You know, you start putting a
sound or a frequency even maybe even some kind of
a singing, right, and it's going to start affecting your body.
Of course, because we are what seventy percent water, right,

(01:22:50):
and we're it's all we're all frequency anyway, We're all
on our own frequency. So but if you get something
like that, you know what I mean, I mean, just
look at the music I was going on. I'm not
going to try to smash on you know, different type genres,
but if you look at the type of frequencies that's
going on, like, for instance, I'm one of the ones
that they're using a lot now. Is the eight oh

(01:23:12):
eight bass drum?

Speaker 6 (01:23:13):
Right?

Speaker 13 (01:23:13):
For example, I talked about this where the eight to
eight bass drum is. You know, it's an exciting uh
frequency for humans, right, It's more it's like a it's
a sexually arousal right that when it vibrates through the
body with that hard the hard bass, right, that's why
you hear like a lot of rap songs now they're

(01:23:35):
using a lot of at O eight right, and especially nowadays,
Like I don't, I don't get it, you know. I
mean I've been to a couple growing up, you know,
I've been to a couple of raves and stuff. But
like you know, going to like concerts, and there's thousands
of people that go to these, you know, just a DJ.
It not even it's not even musicians anymore, right, it's
just a DJ up there throwing out eight to eight

(01:23:56):
bass and you can tell how everybody he's reacting just
the way they're you know, and then hype it up
on drugs, you know, some kind of mind altering drugs
out there. You know that's you know, just vibrating, making
their body vibrate even even off or even more, you
know what I mean, And you're you know, and then

(01:24:17):
you're just having tons of people on the same frequency
like that, you know what I mean. So of course
all that frequency like that is going to be is affecting,
you know, it loves a lot of people, you know,
but is it really even right, you know what I'm saying,
is it? What's the purpose behind all this? Just like
when they change you know, like anything that's coming over

(01:24:39):
the airwaves from four point thirty two to four forty four, right,
so again changing frequencies, you know, and it's it's that
type of stuff is disrupting the human body, right, and
that's why they're talking about like five G. Anything electrical,
like that free wave going through the atmosphere is going
to affect our body somehow. It just is you know,

(01:25:01):
that's science, you know what I'm saying. So that's that's
not any kind of you know, conspiracy theory that's already
been talked about through you know, forever now, you know
what I mean, it's just now they're finding more. You know,
I can give you books that you can read for
like what five G's doing to a lot of people. Right,
there's a few scientists in this one. I mean, the

(01:25:24):
book's gonna it's gonna it's a little spendy, right, but
it's kind of the used for like universities and stuff.
But yeah, man, I won't say so, I wouldn't say
it's certain music. But like you know, and some of
these artists, right for example, like some of these artists,
that's just what they were going through. They want to
change up the gendre and you know, like heavy metal,

(01:25:46):
Like most of my stuff was metallic to some of
the old stuff. Right when I was working at this place,
we made roller coaster rides. So you know, you're trying
to stay busy, like you know, just moving along and
that type of music just helps you. It does and
you know kind of like get you motivated into a
certain way, like if you put your mind frame into
like your work, you know what I mean, whatever you're doing.

(01:26:08):
You know, it could be anything actually, but music does
and it will affect you in some kind of way. Right,
So that nowadays my someone was talking, Now, you know,
you look at frequencies and you'll understand if you're you know,
if you dive down that rabbit hole. But nowadays for me,
it's just more back to you know, I wouldn't say

(01:26:28):
like classical music, but it's music without a lot of singing,
you know what I mean. It's bringing it back down tour,
you know. And I like to listen to it to
like four point thirty two too as well, so you
know what I mean. And again, just like with Derek
and other people that talk about you know, you add
that with you know, like with the magic that's going

(01:26:50):
on in the background. Yeah, these people are they know
what they're doing. They've been doing it for a while.
So it's got to be pick your I guess, take
your poison or picture and whatever, but just kind of
be conmnent about it, you know what I mean, you know,
I know again, you know, lifestyles and everybody have lifestyle
changes throughout your life, you know, and some songs that

(01:27:12):
do effect you know, like all this and songs and
like the nostalgia or something takes you right back to
that moment, right, that's the whole point of it.

Speaker 2 (01:27:21):
Yeah, I saw something recently they were talking about like
we do have a particular style, like there's you know,
a key or a genre or both or something where
it really actually sort of increases our mood or like
our respiration, like all the stuff that you would expect
of that energy, frequency, vibration type of conversation. I'll see
if I can find the article. This is from a

(01:27:42):
couple of weeks ago. But that you know, when you're
like that's my genre, that's my jam. When you say
that those words, it really is scientifically your jam. So
I mean it makes a ton of sense that this
type of stuff, you know, that there would be a
not your jam, you know, like whatever that looks like,
whatever that feels like, and maybe that's metal.

Speaker 6 (01:28:01):
You know.

Speaker 2 (01:28:01):
For me, I can listen to metal. I enjoy it.
It's just not like one of the things where I'm like, oh,
I got to put that on and listen to it,
and I think, and my whole point it's not even
having this conversation again at twenty twenty five, we're talking
about the same satanic panic stuff. Just because it's metal
doesn't mean it's demonic. There could be other demonic music.
Let's say per Se that's manipulative in many ways, that's

(01:28:21):
not metal at all. And that was my point, is
that just because you don't like it it's sort of
your anti vibe, doesn't mean it's demonic. That doesn't make
any sense to me. But again, am I wrong? Maybe
I'm wrong.

Speaker 5 (01:28:32):
I don't know.

Speaker 13 (01:28:32):
You know, I watched this program one time and they
were talking about like it was a deep dive into
like what we're talking about now with frequencies and like
you know what I mean, just like you know, they
were they even took it to like the AshEL right
or tell you they talk about like this as it
both sold below and they were talking about actually one
of the best bands that I like, which is you know,

(01:28:53):
it's kind of irritating to hear, but it's also interesting
to hear. At the same time was when they were
talking about when you play records backwards, right, and they
when you play it backwards almost at the same speed
they play it forward, the words come out different and
you can literally hear these what they're they're singing, you know,
I mean, sometimes it look sounds like it's just jumbles,

(01:29:16):
but sometimes that comes up and and it's weird too.
So you but you look at the so I was like,
now there's you know, so I played it, you know,
that same part of the song. I played it forward again, right.
But and then you listen to it and sometimes some
Zeppelin songs, some of their lyrics don't even really make sense.

Speaker 1 (01:29:36):
You know what I mean.

Speaker 13 (01:29:36):
It's just like they it just throw't in there because
they're kind of rhymed with the word before, you know
what I mean. It's like and there are some songs
like that, right, like you what were they talking about?
Like what are they you know, what are they you know,
trying to come across in this part of the song,
And it doesn't really you know what I mean, it
doesn't seem to go with the song, right, it's just

(01:29:58):
out there, right, And then you play that record backwards
on that one part when they were doing it, and
that's where the forward speaking, you know, that you can
understand what it was saying. And also it was a trip.
It was like I don't know, man, So, like are
they forced to put these certain lyrics in these certain songs,

(01:30:20):
you know, because they're always talk about selling theirselves to
the devil? I mean all even like artists like whatever
you want to call it, you know, actors and actresses
and stuff like that. But it's mostly in like with music, right, yeah,
I mean there's all kinds of ancient songs right that

(01:30:40):
talk about how like the devil that like, you know,
they talk about like that, you know, they sold their
soul or the devil one down to Georgia. And I
love that song too, right, that's that's a damned song.
But you you know it's it's true, you know. And
then you have like you go so like you go
to a concert, like some of these people have like

(01:31:02):
stadium concerts, you know, you know they say that like, yeah,
I don't say it, but there's people out there that saying,
like Taylor Swift is a witch, right and she even
says that she's got a covenant and all that stuff.
They maybe there's all these crazy videos about like but
if you look at a lot of their like I said,
their stage presidents, you know what I mean, they're like

(01:31:23):
telling a story too. So what's really you know, what's
really going on? You know behind stage? Are they really
selling their something to something else? You know what I mean?
Like because we don't really know what's behind all that,
you know, behind all the stage, we don't know exactly
what they're really seeing or what's really going on, you

(01:31:45):
know what I mean. But what we do know is
that they've changed the music, especially changing the music going
on the add on the waves right from fourt thirty
two to four forty four for a reason, right, and
they got even more music like you know, these type
of genres, and again the artists could be going in
whatever they're going through at the time, and some of
a lot of those songs like that. That's why the

(01:32:06):
one the wre people can you know, they you know,
they identify with you know what I mean a lot
of like.

Speaker 6 (01:32:14):
What's your name?

Speaker 13 (01:32:15):
She's a good singer too, and she was at the
group the wife Like sure a lot. I can't remember
her name right now, I'm bad.

Speaker 2 (01:32:22):
With that's okay, But when you when you get it,
just dropping the discord if you if you feel like
it's I appreciate what's that we got. We got Herssel's
been waiting a long time. Your final thought here, wrap
it up? Satanic or no? I guess.

Speaker 6 (01:32:35):
Now.

Speaker 13 (01:32:35):
I mean again, like I said, it's going to be,
I wouldn't say it is the music. I mean again,
it's whatever vibration to put it out, whatever they put
it on the airwaves, so like, and lyrics as well too.
So I mean it doesn't have to be. It doesn't
have to be just rock and roll, you know. I mean,
look at that rap nowadays, something the mumble raped, or
they're just all high on all the drugs that are

(01:32:57):
out there, and it's just you know, I'm and they're
just like all these kids there the brains their mush
out listen to thinking that it is. I don't know, man,
are they being hypnotized with some of this stuff or nine?
You know, I mean, because they're playing in some of
the stuff I don't even listen to anymore. But I
mean again, I would say I would lean more to it. Yes,

(01:33:17):
but it's not just rock and roll.

Speaker 6 (01:33:19):
It's all music, fair enough, and I and.

Speaker 2 (01:33:22):
I agree with you. And that was my point in
bringing this up, is it's a little unfair to me
to pick on heavy metal as we have been. You're
the best, Kelly. Thanks for being patient and accepting of
the technology and all the things, and just the thanks
for being you. Always a pleasure. Brother. Tell Michelle we said, hi,
you have you have a fantastic and I appreciate the call.

Speaker 13 (01:33:39):
Really you too, man and everyone they have a good one.

Speaker 2 (01:33:41):
Thank you later, excellent, thank you. You know, we love
them again. The first guy that called and then called back,
that's Kelly in Colorado seven oh two nine five seven
and one zero three seven Click to discording like a
trouble Minds dot Org. We're talking the Satanic panic again
in twenty twenty five. Why Herschel and Arizona. Thanks for
being patient, my man, your own trouble minds go right ahead.

Speaker 6 (01:34:00):
Ozzie for real. When I was in high school and
he did his first solo record, like the songs, there
was a couple of songs on that record, and then
one that came out later too, but one of them
was called I don't know when the other one was
crazy Train. Something about Crazy Train just made me stop

(01:34:21):
taking things seriously so much and relax and don't it
really it really saved my butt? Did Ozzie saved me
in high school? Like that helped me a lot. The
energy of it just helped me of just the whole
idea of like the world is not there's nothing you

(01:34:44):
can do about it. You're not gonna there's no point
in taking it so seriously that you ruin your day
over it, you know, So like that was that really
helped me out, Like it really helped me out. And
I fel of like Ozzie was a net game, I mean,
you know, and as far as the whether a heavy

(01:35:06):
metal a satanic or not, like some of them are,
you know, But people read things in like as a
writer and as a guy who played music when I
was a kid, and I will not tell you about
the really uncomfortable, awkward experiences of being in a group
that opened for Striper that was so embarrassing and awful,

(01:35:29):
and I will not get into the details of it.
But like people read things into lyrics, like I've read
written lyrics just because it was like some dream I had,
or just a walk I took in the woods, or
a hike I took, or a hike I took at
night under the stars, and you're just looking for words

(01:35:52):
that rhyme that fit in the meter of the song,
and it's not some big, deep meaning and people read
all kinds of crazy stuff into it, and they're revealing
stuff that's going on inside their heads when they you
know what I mean. Like some people just have to
have a controversy. They have to have drama, and even

(01:36:14):
if there isn't any, they're going to create it because
that's their dopamine hit. So as far as the lyrics go,
like from what I hear, I'm not I don't get
all into like every into any single genre like crazy,
I don't. I like all of I like aspects of
all of it, and I appreciate the musicianship of all

(01:36:34):
of it, but I don't get into anything. My two
favorite bands are The Replacements and the Talking Heads. I
mean that's like, those are the two bands that I
always go to when I'm when I want to pick
myself up, like I'm having a bad day or something,
you know. But like but like lyrics, like like the
metal it's like sometimes they probably are satanic, you know,

(01:36:58):
but you know, And as far as The Black Sabbath goes,
Geezer Butler wrote all the songs that every the Sabbath
songs that are the classic Sabbath songs, like the Cornerstone
Sabbath songs, were all written by Geezer Butler, not Ozzie.
He wrote some of them, but Geezer wrote the really

(01:37:19):
well known Sabbath song and then Ozzi wrote his songs
when he did his solo stuff. You know, so that's
just something that we didn't write all this stuff he
sang with Sabbath.

Speaker 2 (01:37:31):
But Quick Well Ahead, Crazy Train was so good. It
still so good.

Speaker 6 (01:37:36):
It's crazy, Flying High again, Flying High again too. That song.
Anytime any Sabbath song, or I'm a radio guy in
the car, I don't do the bluetooth. I just I
just like scan the radio anytime on a Sabbath song
or an Azzie song comes on, I blow my speakers up.
I just frank it up. It's just good. And that

(01:37:59):
show that they did, those guys were playing. Those guys
could have played those songs in their sleep. They sounded
so good. The only time you could understand Ozzie is
when he's singing, which which is weird. His muscle memory
is so acute that it's the only time he's you
know that he's coherent, like it's weird, it's funny. But

(01:38:22):
as far as like the satan anything goes like like
if somebody really feels like they have to or they
have like tied the millstone around their neck and cast
themselves into the sea and they've reached the point in
overturn and they just have to be like God's enemy
or something like that, Satanism and that kind of stuff
is really initiate stuff. It's like very it's like kindergarten

(01:38:48):
the serious. If you were as serious about being God's enemy,
what you would do is start a Christian church so
you can raise your own sheep. And that's the deep stuff.
And that's real. So as far as trying to that's real,
Like that sounds heavier, maybe that's the first time some
people had heard that, but that's real. And that's where

(01:39:09):
you get into the higher degrees of that world of
wanting to be against God or something like. That's where
that is. And I can tell you with one hundred
percent certainty that there's a range of behavior across all
these different genres. There's ranges of thought. From one of

(01:39:31):
my experience with metal is people it's just asking questions
and not being afraid to be ambiguous and not being
afraid to be daring in the way that you ask questions.
It's like you're kind of like questioning authority, you know,
and all of that and the really really dark stuff

(01:39:53):
that people do. And it's real that some of the
stuff that you hear about that is really like really
discuss and anti human behavior. That stuff's real. It happens,
but it doesn't it's not relegated to any one culture,
like the stuff with these pop musicians on these stages.
I mean, some of this stuff is like it's like

(01:40:15):
what Derek was saying about ritual and stuff, but it's
so rudimentary and puerile and childish, you know what I mean.
It's like it's like just you know, it's just they're
probably doing something, they're probably conjuring something, but when you
watch it you can just tell it. It's just like
so it's so it's so the word I think of

(01:40:38):
his is puerile, you know.

Speaker 3 (01:40:41):
So, I mean.

Speaker 6 (01:40:43):
Some of the and there's a range of different music too,
like some of I remember some of the Christian rock
bands from the eighties, they were terrible some of them,
and some of them were really good musician, you know,
and that's still true now. Like some of them are
really good, like, you know, their music is good, you
can't deny it. Some of it's just garbage, like they're

(01:41:06):
just trying to copy like other people and trying to
like whatever, like build an audience so they can make
an income or something. You know, it's just really contrived,
you know. But some of it's very genuine and genuinely
good music with interesting lyrics, you know. I mean, you
can't deny that, you know. But some of it's not
Like I said I opened for Striper like that was

(01:41:29):
just absolutely not.

Speaker 2 (01:41:32):
It's just you know, remind me the story to tell
you a story about Sister Christian when we get back.
Somebody reminded me regarding lyrics. I didn't know them or
play with them or anything. But yeah, I mean, it's
the whole thing is wild. That again, you can ask,
you know, take an Aussy song and ask like ten people,
you know, what are the lyrics, and ten different people

(01:41:54):
will tell you ten different things.

Speaker 6 (01:41:55):
It's incredible, that's for sure, you know. And the dark
stuff does happen, I mean, it's real. Like I mean,
I did drop a link in the in the show
chat about a conversation that happened on Oprah, like back
in the eighties or something, and you know that stuff

(01:42:15):
is real, But that's not any specific genre of music
or any specific race of people, or any specific culture
or subculture or anything. That's just a weird, terrible thing
that happens. And they those people are out there, they
exist in the world, and you can't just like you

(01:42:37):
can't just paint a brush on a whole genre of
music and say that's what that is, because it's obviously
not like someone some some some it's like what what
you know, what Kelly was saying and what I had
said earlier, Like some lyrics, they're just there to rhyme.
You know, it's not it's it's not so serious. Everything's

(01:43:00):
not a big drama like drug show, like crazy. Just
people insert their crazy imaginations into your writing. If you're
a writer all the time, I get the wildest interpretation
and I'm like, dude, I don't want to know what's
going inside that.

Speaker 3 (01:43:20):
It's like sick to.

Speaker 2 (01:43:21):
You exactly, just about out of time. If you need
more time, you're welcome to say you tell me.

Speaker 6 (01:43:28):
No. Well, if I feel like I need more, I'll
call later. But thanks man. Thanks everybody, have a good night.

Speaker 2 (01:43:33):
You're the best. Appreciate you. Herschel and Arizona the Easytopian
podcast commercial. Herschel is a substack go could given the
follow up Troubleminds dot Org for sized friends alphabetically Herschel
help our friends out. This is about You're at back.
More trouble Minds coming up. We got the Stargate ritual,
and then we got Matthew and Colorado. We got Michael
w and your calls coming up, the Satanic Panic in

(01:43:55):
twenty twenty five. Here we go, strap in, You're at back.
More trouble Minds all the way. Welcome back to Troubled Minds.

(01:44:17):
I'm your host, Michael Strange. We're streaming on YouTube, rumble x, Twitch,
d Live, not d Live, and Kick. We're broadcasting live
on the Troubled Minds Radio Network. That's KUAP Digital Broadcasting,
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So if you have the problems, by the way, hearing

(01:44:39):
us and these weird streaming platforms. You've got to pay
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or whatever. Right there is absolutely free on the very
top click it listen live KUAP Digital Broadcasting Las Vegas.
By the way, actually an official thing. It's not just

(01:45:02):
making stuff up. It's actually an official thing anyway. And
of course we're on eighty eight point four FM Auckland,
New Zealand. Love to hear your thoughts on this tonight.
We're talking Ozzy, Yeah, rest in peace, Ozzy Osbourne and
of course not just let's say the piece that he
deserves after a long, hard fought life with a lot
of maladies, a lot of addictions, a lot of the again,

(01:45:22):
the hero's journey. What do you think, because of course
we're talking about Cernovich earlier posted this. You got to
have the hot take culture In twenty twenty five, my
parents didn't let us listen to metal. Was devil worshiping music.
Hard to see how they were wrong. Pantera used pentagrams,
even if ironic or art, it's demonic symbolism. Later in life,
I tried, couldn't stomach it made me physically ill. Let's

(01:45:44):
do it again. It's the sound of fifteen minutes. Yeah,
he says, it's the sound of demons. No, that was
the sound of demons. I don't know if metal was
a sound of demons. Seven two nine, seven one three
seven That one was for Kelly clicked the link at
Troubleminds dot Org. Matthew and Colorado. Thanks for being patient,
my man. You're on trouble minds. How are you, sir?
All yours gored ahead? Cotton balls in your mouth? You're

(01:46:07):
on trouble minds. Go ahead, do you hear me?

Speaker 5 (01:46:10):
Now?

Speaker 2 (01:46:11):
Better? Better talk a little bit please?

Speaker 5 (01:46:14):
All right here? I am so yeah, great calls tonight.
Oh my goodness. Everybody's lighting in the fire right as always.

Speaker 2 (01:46:23):
Yeah. We, like I said, we're blessed to have smart
friends and you among them. And I can hear you better.
Thank you for fixing whatever you did, pulling the cotton
balls out of your mouth. That's always helpful when you're
trying to speak. And you know, I'm just messing with you.
Go right ahead. What's your thought on this? There's a
lot of ways to take it, all yours well, you know.

Speaker 5 (01:46:39):
I'm gon Kelly and Colorado left my I'm not call
it a hot take, but you know, you just kind
of go back to Nikola Tesla right with energy frequency
and vibration. And I had taken a note for that, Michael,

(01:47:01):
and then like three minutes later you said it. And
so the vibrational frequency, and he was talking about, you know,
the difference between you know, the four thirty two Hurts
tuning frequency, which was what musical instruments were tuned to
for hundreds years and then they switched it to four forty.

(01:47:23):
And that's a long detailed story, but it kind of
messed uff up. And and I know, I know you're quick,
but you can pull up a thing where it'll show
the difference between four thirty two frequency and a four
forty played under like a table that's got stand on top,

(01:47:45):
and when it's four thirty two, it'll make this beautiful
geometric pattern, right, And when it's four forty, it's kind
of jacked up and it's blurry and it's not the
right geometry. And so the red isn't that frequency of
the tuning of the instruments and the music and how

(01:48:07):
it affects our body, how it affects our emotions is different.
And so that's you know, that's what Kelly was saying,
and we still got to do lunch Saturday. We almost
had lunch last year. But the energy frequency of the music, Okay,

(01:48:32):
I think has of course uh an effect on your body.
And you know we've talked about before where I had
binarial beat light sound machine and they also have uh
the one that's the pulsing the uh it's by the

(01:48:56):
pulse rate and binarial beats. It's doing offset frequency between
the two ears, and that has a lot to do
with how it affects your mind and your brain. Okay,
So how's this tie into the show topic? Obviously, well,
the particular genre of music, the type of music what

(01:49:18):
is being played at Yes, this is going to have
an effect on you, either for a beneficial healing effect,
whether it's just somebody doing a Tibetan chant right okay,
or or you can have the two that resonate with me,

(01:49:39):
like really well Johann Sebastian Bach okay, and Handle like
Handle's Messiah if you've never heard heard that. Those are
just like this sort of divinely inspired music that resonates
your heart and resonates your body and resonates your soul

(01:50:03):
and is like therapeutic. Now is there really heavy metal music.
That's the opposite of that, the antithesis of that that
it's at four hundred and forty hertz and it's a
different frequency that doesn't resonate you know, your your heart
and your mind and your and your body and soul

(01:50:26):
in a in a resonant way. I think so, I
think so, and and for me personally, and you know,
everybody's got their own genres and styles and stuff they
like to but I know I never really got into
the having metal. It just didn't never resonate with me. Now,
hard rock, you know, give me some Aerosmith, right, you

(01:50:49):
know what I'm saying.

Speaker 2 (01:50:51):
Yeah, I follow you. And here's the thing too, with
regarding musicians. I'm a guitar player as many if you know,
I'm not very good, but you know, I've been playing
for a long time, life goals, play for a long time,
play for play for a long time and not be
very good. But even even the most basic guitar player
recognizes you can strum an a chord and you know,
on an acoustic guitar or even without distortion, and it's

(01:51:14):
it's gonna sound, you know, lovely and beautiful, kind of
like a harp. Okay, but then you stomp on the
distortion panel, it's the same note. But then you know,
you get some squeals and you get some chunk chunk chunk,
and then you know what I mean. So suddenly it
depends on how you play palm muting and stuff. But
then but then we're talking about the same note, and
so it's the attack, it's sort of the the resonant,
the tempo, it's it's all these other things that really

(01:51:37):
kind of cook into what that is. So it's not
necessarily That's why when I see something like like like
what this guy said Cernovich, I roll my eyes. I'm like,
oh yeah, okay, santanic panic, and we go all over again.
It's a it is what that is? It there? It is, No,
I can't get it. I was gonna do the sound
of the demon's voice again, but it's it's the sound
of demons. Yeah, go ahead, good yeah yeah yeah.

Speaker 6 (01:51:59):
No.

Speaker 5 (01:52:00):
So it's about and it's an interesting thing. Actually, I
don't know if you know this, but the musical notes
there there there may actually be other ones, or they
may be I want to say a little bit a
little bit arbitrary. That's probably not the best word for it.
But what they are is things we discovered that have

(01:52:25):
a residence sound pleasing, you know, to the ear. And
so there's like I said, and you know, with a
lot of the Middle Eastern music and stuff, they have
a seventeen note scale, right instead of a twelve note scale,

(01:52:46):
so that there's other musical notes. There's it's it's a
matter of what's pleasing, what people like. It's you know,
kind of weird that way. But but what I'm thinking
is uh, and and Derek was just on fire tonight,
but and everybody was it just so what I'm thinking

(01:53:12):
is there can be you know. And so in terms
of Ozzy, I never listened to much Black Sabath and
and Ozzy because it just wasn't my genre of music.
So I'm not a good you know, commentator about that.
And uh, but r I p And definitely made major

(01:53:37):
influence and and I'm sure you know, help people's lives
and uh and I'm sure some killer concerts that probably
if I was there, I would have loved it. Right.

Speaker 6 (01:53:49):
So, but.

Speaker 5 (01:53:53):
You know, I think that the thing is there's harmonious
resonant frequencies, and there's discordance, and there's discord caught the

(01:54:15):
joke right there, Okay, discord. So and when you have
discordance and you have resonance, and yeah, I'm not going
to go all the way and be like, oh, that's evil,
that's the devil's music, And no, I think that's kind
of you know, retarded.

Speaker 2 (01:54:33):
Yeah to me, like I said, to me, it kind
of sounds like somebody who doesn't know anything about music whatsoever.
And that's fine. Look, that's fine. Or like I said,
the most stomach turning style of music to you, doesn't
necessarily describe it as demonic, is really my point. And
you guys have said it way better than I have tonight,
which is again why we're so blessed to have so
many smart friends as part of these conversations, because it's

(01:54:53):
some of the stuff, to me is obvious. However, that's
why I want to sound any morted off you guys
and be like am I am I losing the plot guy,
because it's entirely possible. We got to Michael w behind you.
He's been waiting a very long time. So you're you're
welcome to stay if you if you got more, if
you want to stay plate with us. But if you
can't wrap it up. Make it quick, and then we'll
go to Michael w. And we'll go back to you
if you have more. You tell me, you know, I

(01:55:14):
can put up.

Speaker 5 (01:55:15):
It up right now and I'll probably hang you out
and uh, bring your mind man.

Speaker 2 (01:55:20):
Everybody all right, I tell you were the best. You know,
we love him. That's Matthew and Colorado, good friend from
all the time. Welcome back, Glad to have you back.
Everything moving.

Speaker 5 (01:55:30):
I got to give a shout out to Apok and
the Trouble Mind's family. I missed you guys.

Speaker 2 (01:55:34):
Okay, glad to have you back. You're the best. You're
all the best. As you know, my mom taught me
that trick. She used to tell we have three of us,
three siblings, and she would always say, Mike, you're the best.
And then she would tell my brother redacted name, you're
the best. You're all the best, We're all the best,
we could all be the best. Seven oh two nine,
five seven ones or a three seven Click the discord
link at Troubleminds dot org and yeah right, the diplomatic

(01:55:57):
way of saying we're all the best. But also, by
the way, have you recognized we're also all the best.
Speaking of the best, Michael W what's up brother? Thanks
for being patient. You're on trouble minds. How are you, sir?
Go Redhead.

Speaker 3 (01:56:09):
Hey, what a beautiful compliment. I would love to be
the best.

Speaker 8 (01:56:13):
I'd hate to let you down, but I want to
tie together some of the satanic panic concepts and the
paradox therein of some of the lyrics of Crazy Train
and kind of what Herschel was saying about what you
would really be doing if you wanted to do the

(01:56:34):
devil's work. Dang this this episode so far has blown
my mind wide open. But I was raised, as I've
said before, in a very hyper Christian like Assemblies of
God household, where I was not allowed to listen to
secular music, let alone have you metal, and I was

(01:56:56):
taught that it was satanic. Literally, they would call it satanic,
and all that I knew about it was how they
would say he bit off a bat's head, and they
used pentagrams, and the people saying this didn't even know
what pentagrams really mean, or what they're really from or

(01:57:16):
anything like that. They were just regurgitating what their parents
taught them and things like that. And there was so
much pearl clutching and just desperate attempts to, I don't know,
to preserve some kind of authority in that world.

Speaker 1 (01:57:38):
But I grew up.

Speaker 8 (01:57:39):
Eventually, you know, And I was always enamored with music.
And it started in the church because there was beautiful
music in the church. It was so beautiful, just like
it is outside of the church. And when I decided
I was not a Christian and I started exploring being

(01:58:01):
a pagan and exploring other music, it changed my life.
And I remember when I heard I discovered the song
crazy Train before I know, before I knew who Ozzy
Osbourne was, God Rest his soul, and I remember hearing

(01:58:21):
the melody and being kind of turned on by it
and then listening to the lyrics and.

Speaker 6 (01:58:27):
It's so simple.

Speaker 8 (01:58:29):
I mean, they're very simple lyrics crazy but that's how
it goes millions of people living as foes.

Speaker 5 (01:58:39):
And I was like, oh, yeah, I can kind of
agree with that.

Speaker 6 (01:58:42):
Maybe it's not too.

Speaker 5 (01:58:44):
Late love and forget how to hate. And I was
blown away.

Speaker 8 (01:58:52):
It brought me to tears when I heard that, and
I thought, this is the devil worshiper singing this. This
doesn't make sense, This doesn't make sense.

Speaker 3 (01:59:02):
At all? How can this be true.

Speaker 2 (01:59:06):
Exactly?

Speaker 5 (01:59:06):
And you know what I mean?

Speaker 8 (01:59:09):
And and the gist the and he in the bridge
of the song, he says, I know that things are
going wrong for me. And he's telling the world, Hey,
I don't fit in here. But this stuff doesn't make
sense and this is a crazy train and I'm going
off the rails. And I remember discovering that song and

(01:59:33):
how it melted my heart and then I discovered that
I was I had the same vocal range as Ozzie Osbourne,
and it just it was a wonderful thing when that
happened in my life. But I listening to what Herschel
said earlier about what you would really do if you

(01:59:53):
wanted to do the devil's work in this world, what
would you really do. You would infiltrate Jesus' church, right,
that's what you would really do. You wouldn't masquerade around
as as a goat with horns and pentagrams all over
the place. You would subvert things from within. And that's

(02:00:16):
in my opinion, like what I've discovered in the world
what's really happening is that what we think is really
going on is not what's really going on. Things are backwards.
It's it's been reversed on us for probably thousands of years,
maybe a couple thousand years, and uh and and it's

(02:00:40):
and it's insane. It's a crazy train. Sorry, I kind
of want to you're grand page there, but you're good.

Speaker 2 (02:00:48):
By the way, your crazy training was fantastic. By the way,
I couldn't touch that with a ten foot poll. That
was very good. And you're right, it's it almost as
if it is sort of a theme song to what
we talk about. You know, it is the recognition of
the nutter butters upside down world we live in, of
life being unfair, but then also the rules stacked on
top of that that are also unfair. And again, once again,

(02:01:11):
you know, to invoke George Carlin. Nobody seems to notice,
nobody seems to care well enter troubled minds and these ideas.
And that's the whole point of this, is like, hey, look,
this stuff is going on and it's not fair, and
let's talk about it and why. But we don't have
to get into that. It's late in the night for that.
Back to the music, what do you know about it?
Regarding and I love the reform satanic panic kind of

(02:01:31):
in your mind doing the devil's work. Do you think
there is that level of actual satanic music out there
and can it be classified by genre? I guess.

Speaker 3 (02:01:44):
No, I don't believe it is.

Speaker 8 (02:01:46):
I believe that there is that level of Satanic Like
I don't believe in Satan, I don't, but but I
do believe in evil forces, and there is that level
of sinister behavior out there, and it's organized and it
is based within what we think of as the modern
Christian Church. I probably shouldn't say this stuff out loud,

(02:02:09):
it's a little bit blasphemous, but I fully believe that
that's how evil works, is it finds a way to
creep in from the bottom, from from the lowest levels,
from the level of a servant. A servant goes into

(02:02:31):
its master's house and says, I will serve you however
I can, and dedicate its life to that master and
teaches its children. This is what we're doing. We're dedicating
our lives to making this master believe that we love it.
And I think that's been going on from hundreds and hundreds,

(02:02:52):
if not thousands of years. I don't think it's music. No,
Like Herschel was saying, the quality of music in Christian
gospel rock and roll music is laughable. It's like there
are a very few small gems in there. There are
people in that are Christian musicians that make very good music,

(02:03:13):
but they are so few and far between, and the
vast majority of of that industry is just designed to
suck up money and to present a facade of a religion.
And I don't think that the the if we think

(02:03:34):
of something as a Satanic force in the world, and
and I mean, like Derek was saying, there is something
weird going on in actual uh secular pop music with
all of the symbolism like the like like he was
talking about the Weekend. The weekend freaks me out, dude,
that guy that that guy, his music, the symbolism and

(02:03:56):
everything in his concerts creeps me out and it and
I think it's possible stuff like that may be connected
in some way to dark forces. I don't God, I
wish I could find better terms to describe this stuff,
because I don't want to talk in religious terms like
I was brought up in. I want to talk in
real and not real, and black and white and good

(02:04:17):
and bad.

Speaker 1 (02:04:18):
You know.

Speaker 8 (02:04:19):
But there is that stuff in pop music what I
was taught to call secular music as a child. But
what we all think of as just pop popular culture,
that it is weird, and I think half of it
is just making fun of it. And while they're doing that, though,

(02:04:43):
they are sort of lending themselves to whatever it is
that is very close to the darkest, horrible evil things
in our culture. And when I say that, I'm talking
about I'm talking about violence, talking about hate hurting other people.
Why would you hurt somebody else? You know, there's no

(02:05:05):
good reason to do it other than to defend yourself.
You know, That's what I'm talking about. When I talk
about satanic I'm talking about just hurting somebody for no reason.
I'm talking about war for war's sake. I'm talking about
war for making money. I'm talking about boundless hate. That

(02:05:27):
these are the destructive forces and what I think of
as our human existence. And I guess that's what I
equate to what people would call satanic.

Speaker 1 (02:05:39):
Entities.

Speaker 8 (02:05:41):
And I hear the music coming on.

Speaker 2 (02:05:44):
Yeah, you're welcome to stay. If you got more, No,
I think.

Speaker 10 (02:05:50):
I'll let it go.

Speaker 3 (02:05:51):
I think I'll let it go. Yeah, that I think
I said most of what I have to say.

Speaker 2 (02:05:58):
I love you guys, hoops me to myself, appreciate the call,
fire stuff, have a fantastic night and we talked to soon.
Michael W on the discord. Thank you very much. Please
join the discord. If you have not come meet these
amazing people. I promise you they're way more interesting and
amazing when I don't cut them off and stuff. More
trouble Minds coming up. Don't go anywhere, nobody on the line.

(02:06:19):
If you want to be part of it, be all
right back. Welcome back to Troubled Minds. YadA YadA, blah

(02:06:44):
blah blah, all the things, all the places. Go to
troubleminds dot org. That's where you'll find all this stuff.
And while you're there, follow our friends troubleminds dot org,
forward slash friends, or just click on friends while you're
there and go help our friends. There's a lot of people,
smart creative people doing smart creative things. Please help them.

(02:07:04):
Look at look at that wall of people. Look at
all those people, Look at all those people. If you
should be on that list, all you got to do
is help us. One iota. Want to share something, contact me,
send me an email, hit me up on discord. We'll
put you on the list. It's it's very simple. It's
a it's an in list, it's not an outlist. I
just want to make sure we're clear on that. I
have to say time it again because people misunderstand me. Yes,

(02:07:26):
if you should be on that list, then yes, you
should be on that list. Again. Like I said, we're
blessed to have such smart friends, and that's why we
do this to meet people to talk about ideas together
that typically aren't water cooler conversations, water coolest conversations. Shout
out Derek in Massachusetts, that I stalker. That's his term.
He made that up. Matthew in Colorado, you're up, be quick,

(02:07:47):
pretty please do ministry turns. And then we'll go to
Jen and go to Joe and Florida and then we'll
wrap this up. Welcome back to the joint. How are
you men? Go right ahead? Hey Jen, first, okay, stay
right there. We're going to go to Jena, Missouri. Seven
oh two nine to five seven on'ser your three seven
clicked the discord link at Troubledminds dot Org, et cetera.
So on all the things, all the places you know
what to do, come talk us the Satanic Panic twenty

(02:08:08):
twenty five with us, what do you know about it?
I think it's complicated, and that's why I think these
discussions need to go as deep as they do and
as long as they do. Remember, our TikTok attention span
is not TikTok. JENNI MISERI what's going on? You're on
troubled minds?

Speaker 3 (02:08:23):
How are you go?

Speaker 14 (02:08:24):
Read it?

Speaker 3 (02:08:26):
Hey? Are you doing?

Speaker 5 (02:08:27):
There?

Speaker 6 (02:08:28):
You go?

Speaker 2 (02:08:28):
I'm I am will? How are you welcome to trouble minds?

Speaker 5 (02:08:30):
I'm good? I'm good?

Speaker 1 (02:08:31):
Now.

Speaker 10 (02:08:32):
I think that you know humanity itself, we're walking a
fine line at all times. The best of people can
do evil things, you know, Like you can listen to
country music with the best intentions. You can sit around
listening to whatever you want. You can live a life
that should be full of morale or appear to be.

(02:08:54):
You can live a life down in like the dungeons
of the dark of the world, you know, like say,
like in a prison or something like that, where you're
surrounded by evil all the time, or supposed evil, or
however it be interpreted by you know, like humanity. So,
I mean, we are constantly on this fine line. No
one is you know, immune to the influences of the

(02:09:19):
emotional realm that we get into and get stuck in.
Depending on how we interact with the people that are
around us. You can have people the biggest harm is
coming from like a you know, I guess the people
that are closest and able to influence, but it's not
always the case.

Speaker 3 (02:09:38):
It's like a.

Speaker 10 (02:09:41):
Whatever evil is, it's something that is natural to humanity,
and the danger is that we are always fighting against that.
There's like this Eastern side scenario and that can be
channeled to be useful against true.

Speaker 12 (02:10:01):
As.

Speaker 10 (02:10:01):
But whatever interprets that that is. There have been cultures
that have sacrificed, you know, sacrificed you innocent people. There
are people there are innocent people who die every day.
There's been there have been cultures who have you know,
intentionally just snuffed out children, not as an individual doing that,

(02:10:24):
but entire cultures doing that. And so you have like
and there's justification for why they did it, and so
there's different scenarios at work. I mean, every evil being
defined is very difficult. But whether or not music has
something to do with it, everybody wants an excuse whenever

(02:10:44):
it comes down to why did you do something or
why would you do such a thing? And music and
different cultures and things like that are very easy. Even
though we know the government has well I'm not talking
about the governesssarily being evil, but there have been influences
that the music has been used as a tool. So

(02:11:07):
like when you have things that have been used as
a tool against society, it's very easy to misconstruct and
say that it has something to do with pure evil
or something of the kind, because it is a part
of the problem, even though there have been benefits that
people have gained from it, like they've enjoyed the music
or it spoke to them in some way, and that's
why it would work as a tool. It's very effective

(02:11:29):
at getting into the psyche and things like that.

Speaker 3 (02:11:31):
So I think that.

Speaker 10 (02:11:33):
You know, there were little jingles they used to play
in the preschools that were on records, and there was
like a I can't remember the record company, but it
was to happen. It was during the during the war,
where basically the music itself that was played in like
for preschool children had a certain type of tempo and
there was all this type of work that went into

(02:11:54):
how you would make the music to maybe agitate the mind,
or that it might be used as a tool to
how could you construct.

Speaker 12 (02:12:01):
The mind of the youth certain way?

Speaker 10 (02:12:05):
And you have that with like the churches being built
in a certain way, that they would music of the
choirs and everything would carry.

Speaker 12 (02:12:13):
They would literally.

Speaker 10 (02:12:14):
Castrate young boys so that they could sing at a
certain type of you know, an octave that was desirable.
That was very strongly in practice. I think they were
called the I can't remember that there was actually an
exact word for it, and it's not coming to me
right now on the spot, but a yeah, I'm not

(02:12:35):
going to try to find the word, but it was.

Speaker 2 (02:12:37):
I want to right was that what it was? Castro?
I don't know, I'll look it up all the what
you're talking about. And by the way you're talking about
the just real quick regarding that, would that not be evil?
We're mutilating children to keep their voices pure, like what.

Speaker 12 (02:12:59):
Yes, spend the time. It's really unusual that they.

Speaker 10 (02:13:03):
They would They defended that and practice and they practiced
it fluently, and they protected that art in their mindset.
And then if you think about like in other cultures
now would that considered an art and no that's completely
evil to do.

Speaker 12 (02:13:20):
But I'm saying that they were. Gosh, the word is
like literally right on.

Speaker 1 (02:13:27):
The point.

Speaker 10 (02:13:27):
I can't remember what it was, but that is constant.
You have a you know, the society basically getting down
to like what is what does music? Can it push
somebody over the edge?

Speaker 12 (02:13:41):
Somebody?

Speaker 10 (02:13:41):
They're going to go over the edge anyway? For example,
like the laws that we have, and I have been
someone who's like you've said this several times. When laws
are in place, you know, they're not for people who
are not going to violate those laws. For example, if
you say, like, well you you shall not steal, well
a person who that's it's just so you can make

(02:14:04):
it official. Just because it's a law, Does it mean
people are going to suddenly stop stealing, Like, oh, I
won't steal because it's a law, I won't do it?
Or how shall not kill? You know, Well, now that
they've said that, I guess I won't do that. You know,
I mean you either would do it or you wouldn't
in certain circumstances. Define that so that they can be

(02:14:25):
prosecuted if necessary, because we have to define how we
will handle you know, what do we define ourselves as
a society. So the law has been used for that
for a great deal, and it's the basis of what
we define what human.

Speaker 12 (02:14:41):
Society defines as being level of evil.

Speaker 10 (02:14:44):
We've tried to really masterpiece it down to what level
and what level of punishment and so on and so forth.
But the United States is the highest, you know, incarceration
rate in the world, you know, but we are also
the most liberal, but we also have leniencies. The whole
prison system was created by the Shakers. I mean, it's

(02:15:04):
really interesting, a religious sector, you know, created the prison systems.
The idea of isolation as we have it, that the
person could somehow come out of it or something so
that when people talk about that, it's really interesting. But
there's just I think that music doesn't make somebody evil,
but it can be the tipping point. You're either you're

(02:15:26):
you're leaning. People will lean towards music that they can
resonate with find by their life that they have experienced
or experienced, you know, the experiences that they have had
if the music speaks to that. In heavy metal, music
does speak to a sort of a rebellion sometimes a frustration,

(02:15:49):
a chaos, you know, in a controlled way and It's
not like a lot of music can say that same
message in different way. Metal music is more active. It's
designed to be used as like a tool for release.
I would say, it's not something you sit back and contemplate,

(02:16:11):
you know, your rage. You don't lay back and just
kind of listen to it as you contemplate your rage
against the world. It's a participatory experience, and so depending
upon how the person takes it, I think is what
defines sort of personally motivated to do it. I mentioned
in chat that the Colorado shooter at the theater for

(02:16:34):
the Batman film, he would listen to techno music. And
there's a lot of talk that he was in that
he may have been influenced through DARPA that he was
involved in. Well, he was working for DARPA, and there
was a lot of a lot of conspiracy around all
of that, but that it was like he was in
a video game sort of process is what people were
thinking about with his mindset. He was also on a

(02:16:56):
lot of medications, so there's a lot to concer about
what goes into the whole thing about like why are
people motivated to produce the evil that they do music.
I mean, it's just very interesting because you can think
about the sixties and you know, like even the Manson

(02:17:18):
family and things like that, the music industry. As I
was coming to fruition with that whole era, that it
was designed to have an influence in society, that even
the movement was almost like a syop. The hippie free
love movement was almost like a syop. Is it all
part of a big idea to create a hive mind? Eventually?

Speaker 12 (02:17:40):
It could be.

Speaker 10 (02:17:42):
I mean it does look like that, but I mean
I think that it is all part of a bigger scheme.
But music has always been a societal thing. Music that
would be produced by individuals in a private atmosphere. It's
impossible to imagine because we are so influenced by We
are mimic creatures. We learn from seeing things, we imitate

(02:18:06):
the world around us. And so a simple mind could
be influenced by music to produce and do evil things
just because the music told them to. And there have
been many people who have said that. But I think
it wouldn't be as simple as it sounds. I think
they would also have to be conditioned through other things,
or already have a tipping point that was ready to

(02:18:26):
kind of go off, and if the music was what
pushed them over that edge, there were other factors at
play that that was singing out to. So it's almost
like a release. It's a toxic release of it. But
you know, the thing of it is too is that
people have limits. The animal has limits, you know. So

(02:18:50):
it's really strange, and it's generational. I mean a lot
of the generational evil that I've you know, tried to
just like, you know, research into that. But you know,
some why do some children, if they're raised to a
certain circumstance where they are surrounded by pain and suffering,
they go out and they they try to Eventually when

(02:19:13):
they get older, they re enact that onto others, whereas
others see the pain and suffering they experienced from it,
and they won't do that. They go the other direction.
So there's a very interesting mechanism about what's going on
in the psyche, about why people react that way. And
then if you're going to include into that some kind
of paranormal aspect, that is there some unseen realm that

(02:19:36):
is influencing humanity of course, because I mean most of
the ideas we have are coming from the unseen realm,
and the influences that make people do the things that
they do.

Speaker 12 (02:19:46):
They start in the mind.

Speaker 10 (02:19:47):
So there must be something going on in that unseen realm,
and could it be some type of art like true evil?
Absolutely that is, you know, it's the animal side, the
beast steals side of humanity, but with the intelligence of
the mindset like that humans are gifted with that makes

(02:20:07):
them so incrediblely dangerous. And then the interpretation of it
by the other creatures, the other humans around them, that
are like, how could you do something like this? And
we can't, you know, it's very hard. We try to
find excuses for why there is no excuse, and music
is not an excuse to do anything evil, and it

(02:20:28):
therefore cannot be the product of what created the evil
to begin with, but it could be inspired by the
pain and suffering of evil that happened. It's like a
sort of cyclical thing. So I think that there's something
that the music tempo itself is. It's chaos, is what
metal music, I think is trying to encompass, and people

(02:20:49):
feel that it's a human range of emotion and they
were able to put that, you know, into the same
thing with jazz and rock is like people are like, oh,
it's evil. It's like it's the you know, it's it's
sometimes it's sexy, sometimes it's soothing. But speaking to something
like the people were going crazy over the young ladies

(02:21:12):
were going completely crazy over the Beatles and all this
so unbelievable something that kind of it's weird that you
don't see that kind of reaction not quite the same.
It's it's like different people are fainting and things same
as when they watched The Exorcist.

Speaker 12 (02:21:29):
Really incredible.

Speaker 2 (02:21:30):
I think it happens in like the far East, like
in the South Korea and stuff. It's it's weird, how
like they're like fifty years behind, so I think that
stuff with the cafe off is still happening. But yeah,
you're right, almost like we built sort of this sort
of a psychic commune system to mass ysteria, which is
what that Yeah, yeah, exactly.

Speaker 10 (02:21:49):
Yeah, well like when the Extorcists came out, you know,
everybody's heard about this that people were fainting vomiting from
watching it, and I mean, I don't know. You have
a very repressed society that has produced a lot of issues.
Humanity has been it's a free creature that's been, you know,

(02:22:13):
kind of captured and dociled, and we're trying to find
a way to have them all live in a civil
way with their intelligence and everything intact ideally, but we
may have governments and we may have bodies that work,
but that does not beneficial to them, That is not
beneficial to the big idea of you know, like what

(02:22:36):
would be best for the world when you want to
talk about you one world monetary system, one world belief systems,
Let's all come together as one so that many, like
a few, can be of gods essentially, but they tell
everybody that they can individually be gods. That's very appealing
and that comes through in the music, and so they

(02:22:56):
begin to follow it, like the Pied Piper sort of scenario,
and you know, they believe that if they've listened to it,
they can be themselves. And they don't even know what
they are because they've been raised in this type of
captivity that makes it almost impossible for them to ever
find out what that even would look like. They can
only imitate what they're seeing around them, so they control

(02:23:17):
everything you see, everything you hear. And that's the idea
of like why they would have influenced the Cia into
their music, you know, during the war when they were
convincing everybody that millions of people should go and die
for an effort that they don't even understand the point
of you know, nobody. You know, that's you're taking small
tribal group belief systems and you're trying to apply it

(02:23:39):
to masses of people. So it takes a lot of
and that's why they probably have done much of the
research that they have done into this, you know, the
psychic mind and all of the control studies, and how
do you get to the certain brain mind the wavelength
and the brain and like where how do you find that?

(02:23:59):
And even deeper than that, you know, like what is
the motivation we could get to? So it's all it's
definitely all being controlled that way because we live in
a society. So the music is not harmless, but it
is also not necessarily I mean, not everybody who listens
to it's going to go out and do some horrific thing.
Not everybody who has gone through this or done that

(02:24:21):
or whatever. And there are people who have done had
no trauma whatsoever, and they go out and do horrific
things on accident, on purpose. It's the chaos of our
world and there's no way to really define how we
can prevent it, and we just can't accept it.

Speaker 2 (02:24:39):
Yeah, agreed, Agreed. It's a it is a complicated space.
And that's what you're singing to the appreaching of the
choir here and singing the same tune. It's true to
the degree of this. And I said this earlier, is
that to boil down satanic music to a particular genre
as ridiculou to be like, absolutely ridiculous, because all of

(02:25:03):
these things can affect us in so many different ways,
and as you're describing how we are influenced by them,
as we are grown, as we change, as we develop,
all those things it's all in play. And that's why
it's important once again for us to recognize this and
talk with each other about it, because if you miss it,
you could become you know, the walking dead or whatever.
You're the best. We got calls. We gotta get to it.

(02:25:24):
It's about time anything. Good night, Thank you appreciate the call.
You were the best. Thanks for popping in here at Uniti.

Speaker 6 (02:25:30):
Lover.

Speaker 2 (02:25:30):
That's gen the Urricane Observer in Jenna, Missouri.

Speaker 3 (02:25:33):
You know what to do.

Speaker 2 (02:25:34):
Troubleminds dot org Ford sized friends. Scroll down just a
little bit. It's alphabetical and it's right there. Follow Jen.
Click that and you will find Jen there, Jenna, says Jennifer.
And also, by the way, she does co hosting with
James of Celsido Paranormal on the weekends on Saturday too,
so follow James while you're there as well. And yeah,
fire stuff. A fantastic call. And this is once again

(02:25:55):
why we need to talk to each other about these ideas,
because there's so many different ways to look at them,
and what do you know about it? That becomes really
the question, and well maybe the answer, is there an answer.
I'm not so sure there's an answer. I think there
are fractal answers, and that's why we need to hear
many of them in these conversations. Join Florida, eure up, buddy,
how you're doing? Go right ahead, you're on Trouble Minds.

(02:26:18):
Test to one too, Joe and Florida soundcheck? Soundcheck? Are
you there? Matthew and Colorado? Till Joe gets it figured out?

Speaker 5 (02:26:30):
Yeah you don't. God, what a great show tonight. You
are just so blessed with your callers. You know Herschel
was on the money and Jen just and I just,
I have to think it is profound that what Jen

(02:26:54):
I heard her saying basically, I mean she says somebody
wonderful things, but basically that music is just one of
the ways that they influence people's minds.

Speaker 1 (02:27:07):
You know.

Speaker 5 (02:27:08):
It might be uh, television, it might be religious upbringing,
it might be this thought or the other. But and
this is is generally speaking, what's called cultural programming, and
certainly music is a part of that. And of course
they're gonna put that in every genre of music. You know,

(02:27:32):
she made a great point. It could be frenchrie Western
or this or that or the other. And the other
thing is that I was trying to think back to
a point that Herschel made that the but I lost it.

Speaker 2 (02:27:53):
That's okay, that's a good hangtied. Joe called in on
the phone line. So just a reminder of so mute up,
we'll get back to your get that thought, and we'll
return to you as we finish up. Just a reminder
if you're going to be on the discord and call in,
like you can listen and it's fine, but if you're
going to call in, you've got to make sure you
update the discord before you do. Just a reminder, because,
like I said, it literally screwed with me for two

(02:28:14):
years before I figured out that's what was happening. Because
Discord updates, not kidding you, three to five times a week,
sometimes more. And so if I have the new estate
and you have yesterday's version, this is the type of
errors and bugs we get. Just a reminder. Just again, PSA,
nobody's in trouble, nobody's mad. Just if you, if you,
if you're going to make sure that you dip out,

(02:28:34):
update it and then come back in and put your
hand up and I'll save your place online. Seven out
two nine one zero three seven click the Discord link
of trouble minds dot rug join Florida. What's up, brother,
Thanks for popping over to the other thing. Welcome to
the joint. How are you go? Ahead?

Speaker 14 (02:28:46):
Kid? You're finally okay, lad and clear. Well, it's a
couple of times in last week a big guy, a
warning came up on Discord, like what speakers do you
want to use it? I'll finally quick yes, and it's
screwed idea. So I still don't have the microphone set
up right, I can hear your then text just can't
talk to the microphone. And I apologize that probably this

(02:29:07):
most of the show. But no cognitive possession, you know,
cognitive possession hearing about Jen and music, and that's just
one demu of programming is the music. You know, we
have media, we're constantly but what are they blasting in
our faces right now? I mean it's people wearing masks.

(02:29:31):
Everybody's wearing a mask. And we've been in front of
people years ago wearing asks for viruns. Now we have
people that represent and every represent and they're wearing masks,
and that seems to be at some point is where
it is it's going to push somebody over the line.
The caller before Jen kind of lung out to me

(02:29:55):
when it comes to people maybe being stuck in some
kind of possession or a belief or.

Speaker 4 (02:30:00):
In a sound chamber.

Speaker 14 (02:30:03):
But you know, I could be off on this, but
I read a book called The Eating Conspiracy, and in
the book, this guy's trying to make an argument with
the Bible and aliens and all of this. I did
not notice. They still have to look at it in
the Bible, right he was putting a sign. Is Jesus
speaking about the Old Testament, and he's basically saying that.

(02:30:27):
In I guess In Johnny, Jesus addresses a crowd of
diehard Yahwehists people but believe in Yahweh or the Old Testament.
He tells them this, you are of the father of
the devil, and is your father's desire you wished to follow.
He was a murderer and a liar from the beginning
and never represented the truth because there is no truth
in him. But he speaks a lie. He is speaking

(02:30:49):
his mother tongue because he is a liar and the
father of lies.

Speaker 4 (02:30:53):
But because I speak the truth, you do not believe.

Speaker 14 (02:30:56):
That's Jesus telling Old Testament people, the old Israelites about
pretty much going against what the Old Testament said. And
then I look at like today, I'm reading this and
I haven't got done with the book because it kind
of bored me. It's kind of funny. You have a
show and a call before jay I was talking about Origion.

(02:31:16):
We seem to be doing stuff, whatever excuse it is
to give it to do it something else, I think, Uh,
what's his name, Derek M.

Speaker 4 (02:31:29):
Stocking? Call it the lush, something feeds off of theish
or whatever it.

Speaker 14 (02:31:33):
Is, and we just keep completing the cycle that being
possessed by this, you know, cognitively or cognitive dissonance, that
we deny it. We read it, yet we deny it,
and it just seems to be something of the genetics.

Speaker 4 (02:31:50):
I just don't doubt.

Speaker 14 (02:31:51):
I don't know what the answer is, but.

Speaker 4 (02:31:53):
Why do we keep doing these things that we do?

Speaker 14 (02:31:57):
It's a cycle. I mean, we could blame the music.
It's funny that she mentioned Colorado because here's a really
I was. I was literally DJing uh always. It was
a Sunday night and the manager of the castle.

Speaker 4 (02:32:09):
Which is where I spin once in a Blue.

Speaker 14 (02:32:11):
Moone in Ybore City. You can look it up, but
they were The manager of the castle was going to
Colorado and she got off the plane in the Batman
movie was starting and he had a choice. There were
two theaters, and he went to the one theater. Had
he gone to the other theater, he would have been
of the shooting. It's kind of funny that Jock Jen
brought that up because I was like, holy shit, you know.

(02:32:33):
And I was actually out seeing a friend of mine
today that the main DJ there that we're in friends
of We were talking about the manager. It's nothing that
I come on tonight, you've got the show on. I
read this in the book in a book today that
I was really your work and had John mentions, you know,
the shooting in Colorado, which the news is all like synchronicities.

Speaker 4 (02:32:51):
That's why we're all here on the TV. So I'm
ready to show every night.

Speaker 14 (02:32:55):
But but yeah, that's all I mean, We're all part
of an e co jam R. I think you know
some of the worst of others. I think the worst
are the religious ones us. We could debate that back
and forth.

Speaker 4 (02:33:07):
But I will never back down on the argument because we.

Speaker 14 (02:33:10):
Have plenty of evidence of what religion has caused as.

Speaker 4 (02:33:13):
Well the dark what plenty of eut its tonight.

Speaker 14 (02:33:17):
Okay, before we could argue, we could argue music, we.

Speaker 2 (02:33:20):
Could before you go, Yeah, before you go, here's a
philosophical query for you to think about. So regarding UH
religion itself, we know it's done a fair amount of good,
it's done a fair amount of bad. Okay, not trying
to spoil the stew here, But what has atheism given
to us in terms of honesty and why exactly specifically

(02:33:46):
does an atheist need to be honest, think about that,
not for tonight. Just kind of put that in your
in your in your crown, smoke it and we'll get
back to that. It's a Steph Mallin who's been talking
about that on Twitter acts and I've been listening to it,
and it's an interesting concept because there's a lot of
reasons why he's bringing it up, and he's kind of
pointing out that it's not as direct as you're making it.

(02:34:08):
So I'm not refuting you. I'm saying, just put that
in your pipe and smoke it will reconvene it. Talk
about that.

Speaker 14 (02:34:15):
We can that. I kind of have an answer, sure,
because I just went through something. I just went I
mentioned it a couple of years ago.

Speaker 4 (02:34:21):
I did something very bad and.

Speaker 14 (02:34:24):
It's a great question and I'll touch on it. Okay,
I did something very bad something that I did it
I knew I had to tell the person it was
most important to me, and I had to keep it
quiet for a while and then I had to complete
And it was for no other reason but my conscious,
but very my conscious comes from who was that put

(02:34:44):
up for the Catholic upbringing? Because I was brought up
a Catholic guilt and maybe I'm a little more agnostic
or a little more for a covering Catholic. I don't
have an answer, okay, because I have to think that
even atheists believe.

Speaker 4 (02:35:01):
In something.

Speaker 14 (02:35:03):
But also I haven't known an atheists, and we haven't
had a leader.

Speaker 4 (02:35:09):
That was an atheist.

Speaker 2 (02:35:11):
That we know of.

Speaker 14 (02:35:13):
It was absolutely evil or without a good intention. All
of our politicians and leaders see the hide behind religion
and that's currently going on now and the supposed faith
and religion I don't know's. I don't look at Twitter,
religious at Facebook, I don't really look at.

Speaker 5 (02:35:31):
Any of that.

Speaker 14 (02:35:32):
But I've had the atheism question in you know, in
Saint Leo.

Speaker 4 (02:35:36):
At my call at the college.

Speaker 2 (02:35:37):
I went to, Yeah, it's okay, so.

Speaker 14 (02:35:42):
It's an excellent question. But even an atheist, we don't
know how. I couldn't put myself in the atheensues because
I don't know how their upbruning is. We're all influenced
by something, whether it's TV, religion or anything. So but
if you don't have believe that they're true atheist, I
guess it doesn't believe in anything. You got to believe

(02:36:04):
in hope. What is hope?

Speaker 4 (02:36:05):
You've got to believe in tomorrow.

Speaker 2 (02:36:07):
You don't though, because because this is your you don't.
This is your only shot at it within that paradigm,
and lying in particular is a very low resource mechanism
that you can gain a ton out of. So there's
there's nothing to stop you if you don't think there's
any celestial reward involved. So it's just an interesting conversation.
We don't have to go. I can talk about this

(02:36:28):
for ten hours, and I don't think.

Speaker 14 (02:36:31):
There's a writing a long answer because for me, I
think I think people are born at different times and
in different mindset, so I could be an atheist. I
just need to be a good person, and we know
what that is because we see sant as a pre right.
What do they believe in things or not? So yeah,
I just to buy people off. I think there's low
residence and there's my residence. And whatever you gain from

(02:36:52):
that new game from that, So however you live your life,
you'll live your life from that. I guess if I
have to give a quick answer, for I know I
have to forgive what soulful that I.

Speaker 4 (02:37:00):
Did, and I needed other people's for giveness.

Speaker 14 (02:37:04):
And I don't know that religion wouldn't or would not
have had anything to do with it because I didn't
see God for this.

Speaker 4 (02:37:12):
I just knew I did wrong.

Speaker 14 (02:37:13):
Now, if I backed up to begad I was born
and not.

Speaker 4 (02:37:16):
Have religion and just wouldn't been an atheist, would I
still be the same person.

Speaker 14 (02:37:19):
I think that's who we're getting after the core for
the core got question is how are we born?

Speaker 4 (02:37:25):
Yeah, so that's it.

Speaker 14 (02:37:28):
I mean, we could see that there's plenty of religious
people that have been bad, and there's probably plenty of atheists,
and there's probably plenty of religous people would have been good.
So I don't think that there is any right or
wrong answer. We just don't know. And maybe we're cursed
with the data haded we're given.

Speaker 1 (02:37:45):
You know.

Speaker 14 (02:37:45):
And if we are created after our own, if we
are made in the image of barn creates forwards, and
we are as fallible and as sinful, as bad as
they are. And times change, people stay the same. I've
had a hopefully it has a good week. I will.

Speaker 2 (02:38:07):
I bid you add you thank you for the call.
You're the best. Appreciate you very much. God bless you
and the family. We'll talk to you soon. Ever, great night.
Thank you.

Speaker 6 (02:38:14):
You know what?

Speaker 2 (02:38:14):
We love him.

Speaker 3 (02:38:15):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (02:38:15):
Look, tonight, we had our two oldest friends, and I'm
just tracing back the troubled mind's timeline here both Kelly,
the first guy that called and then called back, and Joe,
the second guy that called and then called back. Seven
plus years later, we're still having good conversations with longtime friends,
whether we agree or disagree, And that is the lesson

(02:38:37):
here tonight as usual. What do I really believe to
be honest, I don't know. It's always changing as I
learn more, as I grow more, as I consider possibilities
and ideas and fractals and all the things I don't know.
And I think one of the most important parts of
this is it's okay to not know. Matthew and Colorado,

(02:38:57):
welcome back to the joint. Got anything for us to
wrap it up?

Speaker 3 (02:39:01):
Well?

Speaker 5 (02:39:02):
You know what you were just saying? Uh, what's our
old dead Greek guy say? Uh something about knowing? Okay?

Speaker 2 (02:39:15):
The only thing I know is I know nothing, is
what he said. Yeah, I know nothing.

Speaker 5 (02:39:23):
It's like Schultz on Hogan's heies, I know nothing, but man,
just a fantastic show. Really, So what what's it all boiled?
Down to we're talking about music, we're talking about potentially
mind control, We're talking about potentially frequency and vibration, and

(02:39:49):
does it affect us? How does it affect us the
positive the negative? Is it good or evil or whatever
those words mean? And are there influences like Jen was
saying that, of course there's influences, And do they influence

(02:40:14):
their music? Well, of course, do they influence the media?
Of course?

Speaker 14 (02:40:20):
Uh.

Speaker 5 (02:40:21):
And I really liked the idea. I remembered what I
was thinking about. I think it was Herschel brought up
that if you were if you were you know, Satan
or the bad guy or whatever, you're evil and you
want to mess with people, what would you do? You
take over the church? Of course you would. You know

(02:40:44):
that's that's because you want to get to you know,
God's chosen people, believers of good people and manipulate them, right,
you know, you don't have to go after the people
that are already on your side, right, that's true.

Speaker 2 (02:41:04):
Well, well, I think that depends on how you see
the you know, the the establishment. I'll just leave it
at that, but yeah, I mean yeah, I mean absolutely,
if you've corrupted the establishment, then surely half the after
battle is done, and so I'm not making a point
here directly, I'm making an indirect point of Yeah, I
mean that would be the first place you would certainly attack.

Speaker 5 (02:41:26):
Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 6 (02:41:28):
Yeah.

Speaker 5 (02:41:29):
So it's it's like the art of war, right and
and and so so so of course you you that's
and I'm not gonna name any particular churches. And I
don't like to, you know, go after religion, and I
know you don't either, because there's obviously I got a

(02:41:49):
lot of good things in religion. You have the Ten Commandments.
That's where we get our laws from. That's that's you know,
don't kill, you know, don't steal, all right, you know
those are good.

Speaker 2 (02:42:04):
We like those ones. Yeah, I mean that's exactly the point.
The Code of ham Rabbi like this goes all the
way back, which is which is incredibly important to consider
and think about. As Yeah, as we wrap final thought,
my man, let's get that out here. I got to
go cook some dinner and edit this podcast and do
all the things.

Speaker 5 (02:42:20):
Yeah well yeah, yeah, I uh, religion, great code of conduct,
and m'd have gotten a little out of hand a
couple of times throughout history as well.

Speaker 2 (02:42:35):
People tend to do. You're the best, appreciate the call,
always a pleasure. Thanks for staying up late with us
and being flexible, and you have a great night. Glad
to have you back my man YouTube me sir, Thank you,
Matthew and color again. Good friends for long times. And
that's the whole point of this, right. Let's talk to
each other. Let's consider ideas and wonder about why things

(02:42:56):
are different, why things seem complicated, and yet everybody wants
to boil them down to very very easy answers and
very very easy equations in human terms, it's complicated. I
don't think we probably most of us here would accept

(02:43:16):
that premise. And yet many of the ideas that are
fed to us are binary and again mostly nonsense. Just
because it's binary doesn't mean it's entirely nonsense. But you
get my point. There's it's a very straw manny. It's
very if you're not with us, you're against us. And

(02:43:39):
if you can't recognize that level of propaganda, I think
we need to talk to each other. We need to
recognize where this type of stuff comes in, because we
all have biases and we all are being manipulated by them.
So let's recognize it. Let's do it together. And instead
of this couldn't stomach it made me physically ill, so

(02:44:00):
a twenty minutes. How about how about it's the sound
of people crying out for something a little bit more
fair and just and actually equitable, not the nonsense they
tell us it is. Anyway, you guys are incredible. Thanks

(02:44:22):
again for being part of this. Shout out Joey in
the chat. I saw your hand up, man, keep your
hand up. Next time. We'll make some time for you. Look,
the whole point of all of this stuff is to
think about the world just a little bit differently. And
welcome to my wild and crazy trained brain. Rest in peace, Aussie.

(02:44:46):
If you can't see the world in different ways, what
are we doing? That's the whole point of this. That's
the entire point. And look, I don't I don't buy
binary stuff. I just don't do it. I you know,
make the case, let's hear it, let's talk about it.
But my intuition tells me that in the long run,
here the binary space is the biggest sigh off of

(02:45:09):
all time. And we're supposed to talk about fractals, and
we're supposed to talk about possibilities we're supposed to consider
potentialities in a quantum realm, and now we're like vote
red or vote blue. You're whether us or you're against us.
Stop you anyway, you know the drill. We're out of here.

(02:45:29):
If you want to be part of the conversation, you
know what to do. Give us a call on Thursday night.
We'll see you then as part of this. God willing,
and thanks for being part of this and staying up
late and doing all the things. If you want to
help us directly, you know what to do. Troubleminds dot org.
There's the website. You can see you right there on
the stream. If you're watching the stream, click on the
friends or troubleminds dot org for a side friends, you

(02:45:50):
can go straight there. Please help our friends. If you
should be on that list, you're correct. All you have
to do is help the show one iota. That's it,
and you're on this list. There's a lot of great
people over the years, years and years and years of
friends here, and I'm sure we have more people that
deserve to be on here. So just let me know.
Send me an email Troubled Minds Radio at gmail for

(02:46:12):
of course hitting up on discord Troubledminds dot org. Click
the discord linkets to the blue button right up there
on top.

Speaker 14 (02:46:18):
That's it.

Speaker 2 (02:46:19):
That's it, right, that's it. Like all you got to
do to build an amazing community is grind your bippy
off for years and years and years and collect amazing
people like Pokemons one at a time. And this is
what you get is there's there, you go, there you go,
this is what you get. Thanks for being part of this,

(02:46:39):
Thanks for Carrie. If you want to help us correctly,
spread the word, let people know what conversation is happening, well,
we're not going to tell you here to vote for.
This is not about politics. This is not about binary
conversations where we follow what they want us to follow.
We think about these ideas and our terms in our
way and discuss them together and we agree and we

(02:47:01):
disagree and we're still friends tomorrow. Hey, that shouldn't be
novel in twenty twenty five. But you bet your asset
is it pisses me off and is what brings me
back every night.

Speaker 6 (02:47:13):
That's it.

Speaker 2 (02:47:14):
If you want to help us directly, buy some hats
troubledfans dot com, buy some shirts, it's all there. The music.
There's a link down below. If you like the AI music,
there's a you can buy the CD. There's a there's
a digital download version, or if you're in a lower
forty eight states you can buy the CD too. That's it.
It's as simple as that. Thank you for being part
of it. Thanks for staying up late, thanks for caring

(02:47:34):
about the ideas, and thanks for putting up with my bs.
I know I bring a ton of it. As we finish,
it goes exactly like this. Be sure, be strong, be true.
Thank you for listening. Bar troubled minds to yours. Have
a great night.

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A Psychospiritual Infection - The Ring of Cognitive Possession

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}A Psychospiritual Infection - The Ring of Cognitive Possession