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August 25, 2025 181 mins
If the brain preserves perfect maps of limbs that no longer exist, what else might be stored in the hidden architecture of consciousness? Could phantom sensations, morphic templates, and holographic body fields point to an unseen design where nothing of the self is ever truly lost? Or are we glimpsing evidence that awareness itself exists beyond the boundaries of matter?

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​https://troubledminds.substack.com/p/the-ghost-body-network-neuroscience

​https://neurosciencenews.com/neuroplasticity-phantom-limb-mapping-29598/

​https://irp.nih.gov/news-and-events/in-the-news/phantom-limb-study-rewires-our-understanding-of-the-brain

​https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/ten-zen-questions/201906/out-body-experiences-the-astral

​https://www.britannica.com/science/phantom-limb-syndrome

​https://abilitykc.org/phantom-limb-syndrome-what-is-it-and-how-can-it-affect-someone-after-amputation/

​https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK571301/

​https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_Egyptian_conception_of_the_soul

​https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2016/02/phantom-limbs-explain-consciousness/459780/

​https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subtle_body

​https://www.historyembalmed.org/egyptian-mummies/egyptian-ka.htm

​https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duma_Key

​https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Claude_Debussy

​https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kirlian_photography

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Transcript

Episode Transcript

Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
But I think you can development of our admitial intelligence.
He end up that you and race.

Speaker 2 (00:10):
It's a fine objective.

Speaker 3 (00:11):
We don't know what it is.

Speaker 2 (00:12):
I would hope somebody has.

Speaker 4 (00:14):
Checking it out.

Speaker 5 (00:15):
I don't know, but whether luck or whatever.

Speaker 1 (00:17):
But I can really be five, you know, Uncle would
do like they would be probably be okay.

Speaker 2 (00:23):
I'm glad the Pentagon is an opposing threat.

Speaker 6 (00:26):
I love them up.

Speaker 1 (00:28):
All the craft generates its own gravitational field and hither
like God, the Internet has to come the command to
send them the criminal centers.

Speaker 3 (00:46):
Let it happen.

Speaker 2 (00:47):
That's that's what we're expected to sell. Rosser Area fifty
one Avian kept deep under the ground in the media,

(01:12):
that's an app.

Speaker 6 (01:13):
Does interested.

Speaker 7 (01:18):
In the.

Speaker 2 (01:21):
Self serving.

Speaker 6 (01:25):
You're here.

Speaker 8 (01:27):
Flows you're listening into Trump of Mines Radio, broadcasting live
from the Sickle Bunker, just off the Extraterrestrial Highway, somewhere

(01:54):
in the desert sands outside of Las Vegas, from some
more in space time loosely labeled Generation X on planning Earth.

Speaker 2 (02:16):
And asking questions of you in earnest into the digital difference.

Speaker 6 (02:28):
Well, good evening, and.

Speaker 2 (02:31):
Welcome to Troubled Minds Radio. Wow, why is that different?
My sound is different. What's happening to folks. My name
is Mike. This is Troubled Minds, and we talk about
wild ideas. It's what we do. It's what we've been
doing for quite a long time now, and the whole
point of these conversations, as usual is so well to
consider possibilities and per usual, as always, there's no answers here.

(02:51):
I'm not here claiming to be some guru that knows
some things you don't know or whatever. I'm just a
guy that likes thinking in non linear terms and wondering
what we've missed about the past, the present, and the future.
It's as simple as that. It doesn't need to be
any more complicated, does it. But of course you get
people with the wrong ideas, so you got to make
sure you lay down the groundwork as we go. This

(03:12):
is a live show, so we are taking your phone calls.
If you want to be part of the conversation tonight.
The way to do that is to dial seven two
nine five seven one zero three seven. You can click
the discord link at Troubledminds dot org. That's the official
website and all the rest of it. Of course, we're
streaming in all the places you would expect. We are
on digital radio. That's KAP Digital Broadcasting, broadcasting out of
Las Vegas, and of course eighty eight point four FM Auckland,

(03:34):
New Zealand. And how's get to it, shall we? Thanks
for bearing with me as I work through the audio here.
It's bizarre. You reset the sound card and everything is different.
It's like, wait, that was loud this time, now this
is quiet this time. Anyway, whatever, I'll bore you with
the details on that and never but here we go.
So we start here. Now this is a weird one because,
of course, as usual, there's a lot of things happening,

(03:56):
not just let's say, in terms of i'd say the
mass media, yeah, okay, and clickbait and all the all
the BS nonsense out there. That's there's a ton of
I mean, let's be real, there's just a ton of it.
It's phony, it's intentionally phony, it's intentionally misleading. But then
there's also some people out there doing some science, and
you know, not science the trademark science trusts, the science
trust the experts, real science, actual science, you know, kind

(04:18):
of the hypothesis and testing and you know, anyway, I
came across this article. This is from neurosciencenews dot com,
and wouldn't you know it, it's talking about the actual
lost limb. Okay, so here's here's the headline. Brain retains
lost limbs control map, define plasticity theories. Ah, what does

(04:39):
that mean? Yeah? Exactly. Okay, let me read a little
bit of this. And there's there's two versions of this paper.
They will be linked in the description and there's a
fantastic image here of them describing what this looks like.

Speaker 3 (04:51):
What do I do?

Speaker 2 (04:51):
How do I do this?

Speaker 7 (04:52):
All?

Speaker 2 (04:52):
Right?

Speaker 6 (04:52):
How I do it? This way?

Speaker 2 (04:53):
I'm going to do the show you the comet assistant
and I'll just read the summary.

Speaker 6 (04:59):
There you go.

Speaker 2 (05:00):
A new study challenges long standing neuroscience theories by showing
that the brain's map of a lost limb remains intact
long after amputation, rather than being overtaken by neighboring areas,
a process called cortical plasticity. Using functional MRI scans of
patients before end up to five years after amputation, researchers

(05:20):
found little to no change in brain activity patterns when
participants attempted to move either their real or phantom fingers,
which again is back to this really cool graphic here
which you can see and it is pretty amazing. So
what they did, it's very simple.

Speaker 9 (05:37):
Here.

Speaker 2 (05:37):
They did these MRI scans before amputation, and the person
would move their lips and they would you know, kind
of track in the brain where that you know, movement
stimulus came from to kind of send the move the
lips right, We're not gonna actually amputate your lips. We're
going to amputate your hand or your arm or something.
So then then they did, okay, so now move your
left arm and they trace these these again, these these

(05:59):
actual scans were picking up where the brain was firing
for these particular things. Now they found out that after
amputation that this wild business of the brain kind of
reforming and that cortical plasticity is it doesn't seem to
be true at all, or you know, we talk about
neuroplasticity in terms of neuroscience, modern neuroscience and being able

(06:21):
to kind of change, you know, not necessarily who you are,
but sort of sort of maybe your old ways and
look to a new horizon in terms of chemistry, in
terms of you know, the actual biology biological aspect aspect
of being a human. But anyway, So the bizarre part
is that they measured this three months, six months, and
a year and a half later, and you can see

(06:42):
from the graphics here that the brain literally didn't stop
actually sending signals to the hand, to the amputated part
of the body again up to a year and a
half and even more later. Now, as usual, this is
one of those things that kind of flies in the
face of science, at least what consensus science, that that
cortical place pasticity would sort of start to cover that

(07:02):
area and realize it's not there anymore, and you know,
sending you know, to pick something up with a hand
that's not there. You can't pick anything up because the
hand actually doesn't pick anything up. However, this seems to
not be the case. This seems to be something that
persists years into the future, as if the body never
really recognizes that the limb is gone, and the brain

(07:23):
sort of never does that cortical plasticity to kind of
cover for it or adapt without it. Which is weird
because this really kind of goes back to some really
really old spaces, some really really old ideas, including of course,
versions of the soul or versions of how would you
call I don't know. The writeups very good. Let me
read this from the rite up, because that's the best
way to do this, straight from the thing, and do

(07:46):
check it out. The write up tonight is very good.
It usually is. And I've been using, like I said,
the Comet browser, which is from Perplexity, and it is magnificent.
And I'll show you here. I'll do a summary of
the write up itself, and anyway I'm going to reach
straight from it. So the Phantom limbs study, conducted by
the National Institutes of Health has revealed something extraordinary. The

(08:06):
challenges are fundamental understanding of consciousness and the brain. When
researchers scanned people before and after arm amputation, they discovered
that the brain's detailed map of the missing limb remained
completely intact for years. Machine learning algorithms could still identify
which phantom finger a person was trying to move with

(08:27):
the same precision as before the surgery. This finding overturns
decades of scientific belief about brain plasticity and cortical remapping.
As we just said there and so what makes us
discovery truly remarkable And this is where we start to
get weird. As you know, me we're going to get weird.
What makes us discovery truly remarkable is how perfectly it
aligns with ancient magical and mystical traditions from around the world.

(08:49):
The ancient Egyptians discover described the Ka ka if you've
ever heard of this, a spiritual double that maintains the
exact form and function of the physical body even after death.
They believe this ethereal duplicate could move, sense, and experience
the world independently of physical matter. The phantom limb research
provides evidence scientific evidence for exactly this phenomenon. People with

(09:13):
amputated limbs report vivid sensations, detailed movements, and complete awareness
of body parts that no longer exist physically. All book
mark that. We'll get back to it momentarily. Now, this
is the weird part. This is where you ask yourself
a couple of questions. Number One, do you believe there
is a human soul where some sort of actual ethereal

(09:33):
substrate or no ethereal lattice that's operating beneath the substrate? Okay,
which could be this mirror, this cau, this whatever, the
human soul? And how does our mind actually account for that?
And is it always in continually accounting for those sorts
of things that we don't even recognize, and of course
beyond that, we'll get more weird as we go, because

(09:54):
that's what we do here. But that's where we start
tonight again. The link is in the discord and the
the write up is in the description. Do check it
out if you're interested in these ideas. They are very good.
I'll drop the study and the chat in just a
second here, But a lot of things in play, and
a lot of things make me wonder what the hell's
going on with this, as if our body doesn't even
recognize that we've lost a limb entirely. I mean, clearly,

(10:15):
if you're walking on one leg, that's going to be
very different. It might change things. But if we're moving
fingers and stuff and you get the arm, which may
or may not be a you know, a dire necessity
every moment, maybe it's not. Maybe these things will change
as the science comes in, but anyway, that's your thought.
That's that's where we begin tonight's and that's what's on
my mind. I hope you guys are doing well, hanging

(10:36):
out to doing the thing. I appreciate you being here
and ready to go when we start, and thanks for
listening to me, ramble on into the night. We're gonna
get a quick word from our sponsor in this case,
that's human inspiration. Don't go anywhere more, trouble mind's coming up.
In exactly one minute, we got James on the line
and your calls as well coming up. What do you
know about this? And of course the question becomes how
weird does it get? Be right back? Don't go anywhere

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Alien Skin by tremble and support Human Inspiration available now
on us iTunes. Welcome back to Troubled Minds on Michael Strange.
Let us continue, shall we? Okay, so now what we're
talking about here is of course, that phantom limb syndrome.
Let me read you just a little bit of this.
We're all on the same page as we go. After
an amputation. It takes some time for your body and

(12:14):
mind to adjust, and this is the old version of
this without the new findings. Many patients report both residual
limb pain and phantom pain in the limb they've lost.
Though we can't explain exactly how phantom limb syndrome works,
it's thought to have involved mixed or interrupted signals between
the brain and the nerves and the affected limb, and
phantom limb syndrome effects sixty to eighty percent of amputees,

(12:37):
often causing severe pain and discomfort. Fortunately, there are some
rebuilditative therapies and treatments that can help improve symptoms while
you heal. This will be in the description. It is
by abilitycc dot org, which seems to be an advocacy
outreach program and of course a knowledgeable knowledge base of
this type of actual rehabilitation, which is super cool. Okay,

(12:59):
but you get the idea we started with. This bizarre
part of the brain really seems to be locked into
this map, this sort of limbs the lost limbs control map,
as if it doesn't want to let it go, or
as if it doesn't really matter if it's there or not.
It's still controlling, you know. Darely suggests the sole version
of your arm or the ethereal version of your arm,
or who knows, Like, what the hell's really going on

(13:20):
with this? And how weird does it get? I got
lots of wild questions to ask you, of course as
we go, and lots of wild theories is part of this.
But what do you know about it? And is there
anything in maybe pop culture that we that were missing
here because I didn't kind of dig into that. I'll
get into some more of this stuff. Actually, let me
read this real quick because this is important as part
of it. So we talked about the Egyptian cop Okay, Well,
there's also a Hindu tradition and called a Sukshma Sharira.

(13:44):
Sorry if I butchered that, I probably did. It's s
uk s h m A s h A R I
R a or known as the translation subtle body, which
preserves the premise sorry precise anatomical structure of a person
regardless of physical changes. The subtle body was said to
maintain all sensory and motor functions as a kind of

(14:04):
energetic template. The stability of brain maps. After amputation validates
this ancient understanding, the cortex shows no reorganization or remapping,
suggesting that consciousness holds a permanent blueprint of the body
that exists independently of physical form, which is the spooky part, right.
And again this persists for years, and as you saw,

(14:26):
there's some actual physical therapy that can kind of help
this sort of thing, and maybe as we learn more
about the science of this, maybe can actually sort of
bridge the gap between that cortical plasticity as we were saying. Anyway,
so culture's worldwide have practiced astral projection. Now listen to
this describing how consciousness can separate from the physical body
while maintaining complete control over limbs and senses. Shamanic traditions,

(14:50):
Tibetan dream yoga, and various mystical schools all report the
ability to experience detailed bodily sensations and movements during out
of body states. The phantom findings to demonstrate that this
is neurologically possible. If the brain can generate complete limb
awareness without any physical limb present, it suggests consciousness operates
through mechanisms that transcend ordinary neural pathways. And believe it there,

(15:14):
that's straight from the rite up. Like I said, it
is very good. Check it out if you're into it,
if you want more information here, But I'd love to
hear your thoughts on this as usual, because that's what
this is all about. What do you know about it?
And uh, how weird is it? And you think this
does have something to do with the soul or something
to do with some ethereal lattice kind of beneath the
or operating with or beneath our, the substrate of our

(15:35):
physical form. Love to hear what you think. Seven oh
two nine seven one zero three seven click the discord
blank at Troubledminds dot org. We'll put you on the
show just like this. Let's go to at James in Michigan,
Salsato Paranormal. How are you sir? Welcome to the joint
and go right ahead.

Speaker 6 (15:49):
I'm okay, can you hear me?

Speaker 2 (15:51):
Yes, sir, coming through ladin clean.

Speaker 6 (15:54):
Good. This is an amazing topic in that there's a
book I mentioned that in the general chat in the
discord earlier, a novel from Stephen King, because those that
know me know I'm a huge Stephen King fan. And
it's about someone who was involved and terribly injured in

(16:17):
an accident on a construction site and lost an arm
to this accident. And now, a key thing about this
in the story is that prior to this event, this
was a you would say, like an ordinary person, had

(16:38):
no connection to anything unexplained, unusual, paranormal, supernatural, none of that.
But after this happened, he started having experiences where he
not only did he feel his arm, there's feel like
he felt his arm. There were a few instances when
he was in an extreme situation, extreme fear, extreme, any

(17:02):
kind of emotions where he would see the missing arm
and even in a couple of cases be able to
manipulate physical objects with it even though it wasn't physically there.
And that's just one part of that story. But I
really thought that was amazing this topic tonight in that

(17:23):
this is a fairly popular book for Stephen King fans.
I think it was turned into a movie or TV series.
I'm not not totally sure that because I don't follow that,
but that's just where that story begins, and he ends
up having these abilities to to draw and paint things

(17:45):
and situations into existence or out of it in the story,
using at times this missing arm and or the energy
where his arm was at, he sort of channel and
to see other things in other places and memories from
other people, even at some point. So this is amazing

(18:10):
to have this topic in a real world sense from
these arts, these scientific papers. But then you also have
this example of this in popular fiction.

Speaker 2 (18:21):
Yeah, that damn that Stephen King, that wily creative guy.
I just wish you stay away from politics. That guy's
just like a train wreck. He's like a binary. Don't
follow him on accent engineered. Do you want to punch
your face out?

Speaker 6 (18:32):
It's terrible.

Speaker 2 (18:33):
It is beyond terrible, beyond terrible anyway, But he's a
good writer, again, well regarded, multiple bestsellers, all the rest
of it. But I think that's incredibly creative. What you're
describing there again written by Stephen King, is that you're
able to sort of manipulate reality with that phantom limb
and that phantom limb, of course, is because it's operating
on a different level of reality itself now as usual.

(18:54):
Now let's think about this in sort of the you know,
quasi troubled minded. Abstract term of that would be the
your your mind is actually sort of operating in that
space with that phantom limb all the time. Anyway, it
just has merged because you have the physical limb and
the phantom limb. And so you can manipulate this reality
by painting something here or you know, by punching the

(19:14):
wall and hurting yourself. Don't do that. I don't recommend that,
or you know, creating something wonderful as we say, with
playing a guitar or painting as I described all manner
of things. However, there's the weirdness to it, where the
other part is you're maybe manipulating a different reality as
part of this. This the weird the weird structure. I
don't know, this is this That's an amazing thought there.

(19:35):
I'd never heard of this book, and I'm glad you
brought it up. What us you got, go ahead?

Speaker 6 (19:40):
Yeah, just it's a great book. He's there's so much
to go into with that book. But he has. He's
able to touch pictures and or photographs and almost like
a form psychometry in a way, that idea of of

(20:00):
being able to touch objects with your your hands and
your fingers and get energy and memories from them. But
he was able to do this with this arm that
wasn't there and get information from I mean, no one
really knows where, even in this fictional story, but so
often you hear about that when people do these things,

(20:21):
they get information from, you know, it's possibly the consciousness
of a person from before or from the bits of
themselves and energy wise, so to speak, their memories that
are embedded in the material. But he's able to do
this with objects, and it sort of is a part

(20:43):
of the book. But but yeah, so and it's it's
a it's quite the story. It starts off with him
because he gets this ability, you know, this is the
other part of this novel. When he gets this ability,
he also draws the attention of you can almost i'll say,
this otherworldly being that tries to use him to to

(21:07):
for various basically negative purposes. And of course that's where
the action or the drama of the story takes place.
But even at the end of that story, He's still
after dealing with everything he goes to he still has
that ability. So it's not just this other being interacting

(21:27):
with him. He has the abilities still. And so yeah,
I just wonder about that. I wonder about the out
of body connection, just because I've had so many experiences
with it with that myself, to where I was able
to still sense and feel things and see things, interestingly

(21:51):
enough in a way, when I have ian We've talked
about this before. When I have out of body experiences
or weird experiences, paranormal with dream experiences, my vision is
always the same there as it is here, which I'm
legally blind. So I wonder, and this is sort of

(22:12):
going kind of connected to this idea, was is that
because I was born legally blind? Is that why that
has happened? Happens that way? Because I've heard people say
that have lost their vision, that when they have these
out of body experiences or dreams or however you want
to call them, they can they do have better vision

(22:35):
in those experiences. So is this whole phantom limb or
phantom any body part? Really is this connected to the
entire body? I guess is the question I.

Speaker 3 (22:46):
Have about this.

Speaker 2 (22:47):
Yeah, within how the brain reacts to it. And I
think that's the wild part of this is because there's
so much in play here that you know, this this
fits in sort of the morphic resonance field of Rupert
Sheldrake and some other really old wild zoteric ideas like
we said, the co and some other ones that make
a ton of sense in terms of just the human
soul itself. Again, and if you don't believe in the soul,

(23:07):
that's okay. Like I said, a lot of this is semantics.
If you do, cool, we can talk about it in
that framework. If not, we can talk about it in
terms of sort of a human energy or you know,
something like that and doesn't persist after we pass on,
you know. And so there's there's a lot in play,
like I said, And it always bothered me as part
of these conversations that people could kind of untangle those
things and say, Okay, look, you know, we're talking about

(23:28):
the same thing. You know, doesn't matter what we really
call it, and should we argue about what it is called?
I mean, anyway, just a little Michael Strange commentary about
lots of things happening with the human body that is
as yet discovered and you would expect that with all
the science that has been done on humans forever, basically
as long as science has been around. It's one of

(23:49):
the first things we experimented on, at least in the
modern biological sense, of course. But they're still mysteries, mysteries
of the human body that we cannot explain in twenty
twenty five, and some of them are downright spooky as hell.
Which this is another one, that phantom limb hypothesis or
I'm sorry it's called phantom limb what's it called phantom

(24:10):
limb syndrome. Yeah, not hypothesis. My bad on that. Yeah,
sorry about that. I get a little weird with my
hypotheses anyway. So that's where we're at tonight. I appreciate you. James.
You're welcome to sit if you have you're feeling tonight,
you're feeling good, good enough to uh what's going on?

Speaker 6 (24:25):
Yeah, happy to sit in because I think this does
touch on a lot of things that I have read
into before.

Speaker 2 (24:30):
Yeah, okay, perfect, We'll be right back more with James
Selsey too, of course, the paranormal expert of Troubled Minds
and your calls as well. We got Joe and Florida
coming up. We got Darryl in New York and the
Robert in Pennsylvania and your calls as well. What do
you know about it? There's a lot in play here
and it goes back to one simple question. Do you
believe in the human soul? Seven oh two nine one

(24:51):
zero three seven. This is Troubled Minds. I'm Michael Strange
be right back. More on the way.

Speaker 10 (25:14):
In the mind's expanse, maps of us unfold, a lot
of graphic dance.

Speaker 2 (25:25):
Stories, yet untold.

Speaker 10 (25:44):
Conscious MANESSI golos those prints of our souls, So consciousness

(26:47):
it flows, prints of of souls. Consciousness it Boss.

Speaker 2 (27:08):
New Crimsons. Welcome back to Troubled Minds. I'm your host,

(27:33):
Michael Strange Worth streaming on YouTube, rumble x, Twitch and kick.
We are broadcasting live on the Troubled Minds Radio Network.
That's KUAP Digital Broadcasting and of course eighty eight point
four FM Auckland, New Zealand on the Underground Media Network. Tonight.
We're taking your calls as we discuss this. If the
brain preserves perfect maps of limbs that no longer exist,

(27:54):
what else might be stored in the hidden architecture of consciousness,
good phantom sensations, more templates and holographic body fields point
to an unseen design where nothing of the self is
ever truly lost. Or are we glimpsying evidence that awareness
itself exists beyond the boundaries of matter And that's very
troubled mind ye, And of course welcome to troubled minds.

(28:16):
Lots of things in play here as usual. Like I said,
if you're interested in the rite up, I do recommend
you check it out. It talks about all kinds of
this stuff, the ancient Egyptian conception of the soul, the
ca all this stuff that really kind of plays into
these ideas, including of course the modern version of very
simply the human soul. It's complicated and wide and varied,
and all the things that go with it that go

(28:37):
all the way back thousands of years to all different
traditions all over the world. What do you know about it?
And what about this bizarre study talking about actually the
brain sort of retaining the lost limbs control map years
after the limb is gone again, flies in the face
of modern neuroscience consensus of that cortical plasticity. I believe

(28:58):
it's called love to hear what you think seven two
nine one zero three seven click the discord like a
Troubleminds dot org. I'm going to go to the phone line.
Joe in Florida. I know you've had some issues with
the phone line, so I may have to route this
real quick. So on the discord. Please let me know
if you can hear him, and if not, I'll fix
it real quick. But here we go, Joe in Florida.
Thanks for being patient, my man, you're on Trouble Minds.
How are you?

Speaker 7 (29:16):
Sir?

Speaker 2 (29:17):
All yours go right ahead.

Speaker 6 (29:19):
I'm okay. Can you hear me?

Speaker 2 (29:20):
Okay, I hear you loud and clear. You're going out
to the stream perfectly. And well, let me fix the
discord if they say they can hear it not. But anyway,
you're good. I'll worry about that. You worry about you.
Go ahead, sir.

Speaker 9 (29:32):
What even I got to test up the microphone? I
mean since again, because I reset everything to you and
it seemed to be working. But I don't want a
lot of tested Well you know, well you got to show.
But when you mentioned the CA and all that, I
remember things like that when I was a kid. I
don't remember pile whatever. What popped in my head immediately

(29:54):
I put it in the chat is cloth. The entanglement
in some kind of way describe that is, we don't
know where our consciousness is stored, and first of all
different perspective, but as you know, different perspectives. And I
don't look at this, but wander would be if we
don't know where the conscious is stored and where there's

(30:16):
walking meat puppets, and wherever our conscious lies, whether there's
a ghost body, spirit or a program or whatever it
is that's still setting up a signal, and it's still
mapp like that in her brain and we just don't

(30:36):
have a joint order wins to function. So you can
look at it that way. Then part of me starts
to wonder if we've all heard of this organ donation.
I have a friend of mine work with organ donation.
But anyway works. But it's been said that certain people

(31:00):
who are the recipients of prank plants start to maybe
the cravings for certain foods or maybe certain habits that
the parting door that's passed away used to have. So
there's like these shadow cravings. So that makes you think
about gene genetic memory, which we've talked about on the show, right,

(31:26):
if it's down to the genetic memory, or if the
genetic memory is part of the feedback group that goes
to our conscience that's sitting somewhere in the clothing state,
you can look at it that way. Also, look at
a robot. If a robot lost it's wind, the actuators,

(31:46):
the stepper motors, all the gear up to the point
of the lost wind, it would still function if you're
giving the commands, the gears would spin, everything would still spid.
It's just that it would stop and that way would
be missing. However, with the robot, if it's programmed to

(32:07):
have a feedback loop, maybe it would shut that system
down to conserve power, Which gets me into another idea
of if we're born with all of these things. Somebody
said that it's just wired in. We're born with everything
wired in, and that could be totally true. But let's
just look at other animals that have very very long

(32:29):
life spans and maybe are able to regenerate whims. Maybe
when you look at the Bible, they used to say
that some people can live. I don't know who that
goes in the Bible, whatever, no or whatever. Five hundred
years a thousand years. Supposedly in these stories, the humans
matter humans, whatever you want to call them, they were

(32:51):
able to live beyond the normal life span never used to.

Speaker 8 (32:55):
Now.

Speaker 9 (32:56):
Now, I don't think in the book it mentioned anybody
losing whims or anything, but let's just say that was
part of it. Let's just say in general, there's a
gene that we haven't just let us regenerate. Not whether
that regenerates just ourselves and our let's think, what can
call it the players on our cells that shrink will

(33:17):
get longer. We've talked about that before. Let's just say
there's an overall button or a gene that.

Speaker 4 (33:25):
Slows down the.

Speaker 9 (33:26):
Agent process, or may doesn't slow it down, but just
regenerates us. And I'm more constant, right, And part of
that gene is also regenerating any major loss of the wind.
And we've seen this in the animal worlds, wizards and
things like that.

Speaker 2 (33:44):
Let's just say that.

Speaker 9 (33:47):
Our genetic manipulators, or if it just genetically happened in evolution,
whatever you want to believe, but let's just say that
was turned off for one reason or another. Because God knows,
if we live two hundred years or three hundred years,
would humanity still be here because we probably would have

(34:09):
put a drain on the resources a long time ago.
It's that makes sense.

Speaker 2 (34:15):
It makes sense. I wonder too, let's say that we
could live thousands of years, and let's say there was
a way to sort of make that happen through gene
expression as you're describing. I do wonder if you know,
sort of in the past when things are just so violent,
I mean, you know, you can you can make the
argument now that when you watch social media there's violence everywhere, Mike,
But then also go walk out your front door and

(34:35):
then report back to me, and we'll talk about violence
on your front door. That's probably not there, just as
an example. But I do wonder if even if we could,
it would have been sort of largely moot because of
that that age old sort of might makes right versions
of ourselves. And so maybe you know, the r versus
case selection theory of you know, maybe live shorter, reproduce faster,

(34:57):
and maybe it's it is part of that gene expression
of what the modern human is, but not necessarily the
end all of what we could become. That makes that
makes some sense to me as well as what you
just described there.

Speaker 9 (35:09):
Yeah, yeah. I mean that's you know, we're constantly trying,
you know, we're cant. We try to be immortal, and
you know, somebody put in there the dust and the
electrostatic fields, and I just kind of started thinking about
five you know, not that I subscribe to five G,

(35:30):
but that five G conspiracy however, you know, not extreme. However,
you know, the body carries a currence and we know
that you could say some people, they could say just
being in the cell phone like I am, But what's
of ethnetic fields do affect us?

Speaker 4 (35:49):
You know, there's even.

Speaker 9 (35:52):
Rumors and I've got an EV. I haven't experienced it yet,
but I've seen people say that if they sitting there, ev,
if they sit in an eed too, all that whatever
field is there like.

Speaker 7 (36:04):
That.

Speaker 9 (36:05):
You know, I haven't dove into that rabbit hole, you know,
because I think it it was totally true, you'd see
more warnings about that. But I had seen that come
out here, you know, But that's all. I mean, there's
other people on the line. I just kind of wrote
some notes real quick. I mean, you know who I

(36:25):
think we could ask, and probably a lot of people
in this crowd are too young young to remember, but
do you remember worrying above it and what she did
to her husband John.

Speaker 2 (36:36):
Unfortunately I do it still gives me nightmares, can just
give you nightmares.

Speaker 9 (36:41):
But I wonder if he had phantom lem I wonder
if he did. Got leave you with that one.

Speaker 2 (36:46):
Of course, of course you wouldn't. Joe, you have the best.
Appreciate the call. Thanks, thanks for statably with us. Have
a great name.

Speaker 9 (36:52):
I'm gonna take a cold shower right now.

Speaker 2 (36:54):
Yeah, yeah, there you go, there you go, take out
Joe and Florida good friend for a long time. And
if you remember the Lorraine Bobbit's story, she yes, she
cut off the nether region singular of her male counterpart.
So yeah, if anything, I'll give you nightmares as a
dude that will in any case. Funny thing there, Phantom

(37:16):
Limb was the joke, and I wonder, I wonder phantom
pain probably anyway, So we're talking the ghost body networks
to that. I'm calling it neuroscience meets ancient knowledge, and
we started with this fantastic study again, Phantom Limb study
rewires our understanding of the brain because we're supposed to
have what's called this cortical elasticity, which means that once

(37:38):
when our amputation, let's say we lose a limb or whatever,
our brain will sort of adapt to that and no
longer fire off commands to move the limb. Well, the
new study suggests that's not true at all, and it
kind of is looking at the different ways we consider
what this cortical elasticity actually even means anymore. Because again,
they did this study and they found that three months,

(38:00):
six months, and even up to one point five and
more years afterward, the brain was still firing thoughts to
move this limb that had been gone for years plus
at this point. So what does that mean? And is
there sort of that Egyptian version of this. I'm gonna
point this out real quick too. I misspoke. So there's
an ancient Egyptian conception of the soul, and there's a
bunch of this.

Speaker 9 (38:19):
Right.

Speaker 2 (38:20):
The ket is the physical body, the saw is the
spiritual body. Ren is name or identity, that's name magic.
We've talked about that in the past. Ba is the personality.
Ku is what we're talking about tonight is the double
or vital essence. Now, think of an amputation and think
of that phantom limb actual situation where you get pain

(38:40):
or you feel like it's still there. Okay, Well, in
that particular case, that double or that vital essence seems
as if there's a mirror effect of where that limb
would be or could be anyway. So, like I said,
squinch your eyes and think of it in sort of
the thousands of years perspective here, and it feels as
if they knew something about this long before we did,
and even had a name for it. So what does

(39:02):
it mean? And a lot of things in play here,
a lot of ideas in my mind, but what do
you think? That's what I want to know, just to
finish this out. So the ib the eb or ib
was the heart, the shoe yet was the shadow, and
the sec m was the power or form. And this
is a different actual ancient Egyptian conceptions of the soul,

(39:22):
different different breakdowns of what it is. But the call
is the double or the vital essence, which really makes
some sense here in terms of the amputations. James, anything
on that and we'll go to Darryl and then the
Robert after that. Thanks for being patient, friends.

Speaker 6 (39:38):
No problem, great call from Joe. He just reminded me
two of more comic book stuff. I put in the
chat there there's this character in Marvel that his name
was doctor Kurt Connors, and he had an injury. I
don't know exactly how it happened, but he had his
arm was amputated, and he started working on to grow

(40:00):
it back, and of course in science fiction, what happens
is he figures it out, but he ends up turning
into a giant lizard like creature, and and he gets
the arm back, but he loses his personality when he's
in that form. And so just more references here to
similar things here. But but yeah, and I find that

(40:22):
amazing all the different aspects of the person from Egyptian
thoughts and ideas and everything in their beliefs. That's amazing
that there's so many parts. It's not just like one
consciousness is not just one thing. So I find that
fascinating as well.

Speaker 2 (40:40):
Yeah, well said all that, it's God, this is as usual,
look as complicated. And I think the most basic way
to look at it is that lattice of a sort
of the spiritual energy or the actual regular energy, I
mean more sort of uh what goll ems with, you know,
the energetic uh just energy sort of moving our limbs
and our brains and everything else together, So I don't know,

(41:03):
it's a weird one to me. But also as this
science develops, I wonder if you can, maybe, as Joe suggested,
switch these gene expressions on and off and maybe maybe
regrow limbs as you're describing as well. And that's the
type of thing that kind of makes you go, well,
I wonder, I wonder. Right, we're seeing that the lizards
grow back their tails, right as part of that evolutionary adaptation,

(41:24):
and we used to have a tail. This digital tale
we're told, I'm not sure if you believe that or not,
and I'm not expecting you to believe it or disbelieve it.
I'm saying it's something that has been said in the past.
But yeah, wild stuff, James, and on fire as usual.
And I didn't realize too, by the way, there's a
lot of so many, you know, comic references and fiction
references as part of this, where I would have pinged

(41:45):
a perplexity to kind of spin out some of that
stuff too. But glad we have James here on point
and knowing the things that the rest of us do
not to know. You're the best, James Hank tyg. We'll
get back to you momentarily, and you know where to
find him, of course, Celsito paranormal, that's where you find himself.
You know, paranormal dot com, the paranormal expert of Troubled
Minds and go give him a following all the places.
Check out his books, check out his podcast, check out

(42:06):
his website, check out his discord all the things, and
come say hi. He's a great dude, as you know.
Let's go to seven O two nine seven one zero
three seven click the discord like a Trouble Minds dot Org.
Let's go to Daryl in New York. Thanks for being patient,
my friend. How are you tonight? Welcome to Troubled Minds
and it is all yours. Welcome to the thing.

Speaker 11 (42:22):
I'm Michael. I was thinking, it's so funny. I was
singing the same thing that so from Florida was singing
of the reign of volvitsa husband, and I wound up
looking up some information. You're not going to believe this.
I have to tell you what happened at what like,
what happened to him after him after he had his

(42:44):
penis cut off? You know, he wound up had a
short career in the porn industry, and he was a
recurring guest on the Howard Stern show.

Speaker 2 (42:56):
Stop It No? Is that for real? Or is that
that seems that's for real? That's for real?

Speaker 12 (43:02):
No, true, I'm not kidding.

Speaker 11 (43:04):
Then he he revealed he was diagnosed with toxic peripheral polyneuropathy,
a condition linked to his time at Camp La June
that was in North Carolina where the water was very contaminated.

Speaker 12 (43:18):
You know about Camp La June, right, both, you're not.

Speaker 11 (43:23):
Gonna leave with He a both nerve damage and osteomyelitis,
a bone infection that leads to alcos and requires skin grafts.
In twenty twenty three, he had his remaining toes amputated,
which he said left him unable to work.

Speaker 12 (43:38):
Can you believe that.

Speaker 1 (43:41):
Guy?

Speaker 11 (43:42):
He should be on the show. You know, I wonder
if he fills his toes. I wonder what happened? You know,
did he feel his you know, missing Penis that that's crazy?

Speaker 12 (43:52):
Yes?

Speaker 2 (43:52):
Yes, like I said, nightmare fuel right there. I just
didn't want to say the word, but you said it, so.

Speaker 12 (44:01):
Said something else.

Speaker 11 (44:02):
But yeah, I was wondering, you know, but we've like
I wonder, like we've had, like I've had missing teeth,
you know, and I felt pain in the missing teeth.
Those are like amputations when you get your teeth pulled.
You know, I didn't feel anything when you know, I didn't.
I don't miss my tonsils. They weren't amputated, and I wonder,

(44:25):
you know, sometimes a bad haircut could really you know,
ruin your your.

Speaker 12 (44:31):
Your months.

Speaker 2 (44:31):
You know, easy, easy, you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 1 (44:35):
You know.

Speaker 12 (44:38):
What I'm just saying.

Speaker 11 (44:38):
You know, you know, we get I want your nails,
your hair, your you know, we have some some amputations
that you do miss. You do miss your hair. I'm
sure you know if you have long hair and you
cut it. But I've heard, you know that people that
have missing limbs, I feel pain in their missing limb

(45:01):
that's not there, you know.

Speaker 2 (45:05):
Yeah, that's a that's that phantom limb syndrome. Yeah, yeah, exactly,
and yeah, it's it's it's incredibly weird. And so now
we're seeing sort of the correlation between the brain doesn't
ever really kind of miss it. It just it keeps
firing the commands that come from the brain and doesn't
do that the cortical elasticity as we're describing or plasticity.
I mean, because maybe there is sort of that underlying

(45:26):
aspect of the energy body still there, you know, the
cause we're describing from the Egyptian space. I mean, why not?

Speaker 8 (45:32):
Right?

Speaker 9 (45:33):
Right?

Speaker 1 (45:34):
You know?

Speaker 11 (45:34):
I read something in your substack that was very disturbing.
I mentioned some some culture, I think it was in
India that they dismember their bodies so that they could
be re you know, re reunited in their afterlife or
in their next life.

Speaker 4 (45:55):
Did you write that?

Speaker 2 (45:56):
Yes, yes, hold on, let me find it. Let me
find scar.

Speaker 11 (45:59):
Like all who gets dismembered, I hope it's after they're dead,
you know, yeah, I would assume, of course. But why
what kind of what kind of cultural you know, ritual?
Is that a dismemberment of the dead? Where did I
put yourself back?

Speaker 2 (46:17):
I'm trying to find it. I got you, I got you.
I'll find it.

Speaker 11 (46:19):
Yeah, I found it very disturbing. That's that's really disturbing.
And what I don't know, maybe they do it for
easier burial, I don't know, you know, if they they
don't need a large sarcophagus.

Speaker 2 (46:39):
Or what they Yeah, well that's that's been a thing too.
Historically that where they kind of trim them up and
put them in a small, small burial chambers, which is
not the best. But I mean, yeah, I'm trying to
find this. I'm trying to find this. There's so many
things in here, all very gruesome.

Speaker 12 (46:56):
Where did I put it? I think I found it.

Speaker 2 (47:00):
I'll find it anyways, you gotta ahead. But yeah, another
thing too is part of this is that, like like
Joe is describing there that not just not just the
pain that kind of comes with it, but the fact
that the limb still exists kind of in your mind,
and some of the people that even describe it, which
is in the substeck as well, describe it. You know,
if they lose a limb when they're young, it still
seems to grow proportionally with sort of their adult body,

(47:22):
even though let's say they lost an arm at like
five tragically obviously, but as they grow, that proportion still
stays as if that sort of light body grows with you,
which is incredible to think because your or maybe your
brain has anticipated the growth of it. I don't know
a lot of ways to look at that. I'm still
looking for the thing you described that, But.

Speaker 12 (47:42):
Wait a second, and maybe indigenous traditions. Way is that it? Now?
What did I hear about the three legged dog?

Speaker 3 (48:00):
Oh?

Speaker 11 (48:01):
He had a prosthesis and aget what happened? He lost
his prosthesis? I guess they called it a faux a
faux pours.

Speaker 2 (48:12):
There's a Daryl joke. There we go. Now we're cooking
with gas. I had no idea that Larino Bobbitt joke
was not a joke.

Speaker 12 (48:20):
That's that's horrifying, terrible, But do you believe it? He
had his toes also amputated? This poor guy? What a
lifetime of really like you know, serious uh, missing missing things?

Speaker 7 (48:36):
You know.

Speaker 6 (48:37):
I don't know.

Speaker 12 (48:38):
But maybe he's used to it by now.

Speaker 6 (48:39):
I don't know.

Speaker 12 (48:40):
No, I don't think.

Speaker 2 (48:42):
Let's hope you'd never get used to something like that.

Speaker 11 (48:44):
Absolutely, it could have been worse, right, it could have
been worse of juris doctors said, But where did the
article go?

Speaker 2 (48:51):
I'll find it. I'll find it and bring it up. Yeah,
it's this is a deep boil, and I did. I
did so much. I have like sixty links on this,
so I'm trying to trying to find exactly where that
came from. But when when I find it, I'll dig
it out and we'll talk about or if you find it,
let me know and I'll yeah, yeah.

Speaker 12 (49:06):
That that's really garish, you know. But I had two
more things to mention.

Speaker 6 (49:11):
H oh. Yeah.

Speaker 11 (49:13):
I was arguing with one of these flat earthers that
was also an amputee. You know, you'd ever talked to
a flat earther. Well, he didn't have a leg to
stand on, you know anyway, terrible, terrible.

Speaker 2 (49:28):
Terrible, terrible, but he actually he was an arm amputee.

Speaker 11 (49:32):
So I don't know that's why they don't rob banks.
Let's see, you can't really they have a good sense
of humor. Their issues. You know, this is rib and
terrible taste. So that's right, that's right. Some people do
have I know this for sure. They have a fetish about,

(49:56):
you know, things that amputations. They like to to see,
you know, women like you know without you know, get
their hair cut or stuff like that, or amputees.

Speaker 12 (50:07):
And you could find them on this app. It's called
stub hub. Can you believe that.

Speaker 2 (50:15):
Talking about bad in poor taste needs to be a
t shirt? Troubled minds?

Speaker 12 (50:23):
So I figured in a flatter there could be a
make a little fun of.

Speaker 2 (50:27):
Them take the shot. Hey, people make fun of us too,
so it's all fun. It's all it's all square, it's
all good, it's all good. You were the best. Appreciate
the call unless you have anything else.

Speaker 12 (50:37):
No, no, I'm looking forward to hearing the rest of
the show.

Speaker 2 (50:41):
Fires always you were the best. Thank you so much.
That's Daryl, New York. You know you love he been
a good friend for a long time. And of course, uh,
the the the what, the cosmic comic of Troubled Minds,
the official cosmic comic for obvious reasons, but also talented
young lady. You can find her singing karaoke on a
Troubled on the discord. If you haven't done that yet,

(51:02):
do check out her YouTube channel. You can find that
very easily at Troubledminds dot org or its last friends.
Just scroll down. It's alphabetical, as I always say, and
just click on Daryl. Right there. I'll take you right
to her YouTube channel. There's some stuff on margallon, some
paranormal stuff, and of course lots of footage and great
stuff of her singing in both English and French. Very
talented young lady, as I said, And yeah, come I

(51:22):
join the discord. Meet Daryl. She's every bit and more
as amazing as she seems, like I said, And all
the people that are the contribute to the show are
by the way, like I said, the bad part is
I cut them off and I you know, radio say,
you know, ask kind of don radio questions a lot
of time and whatever, right, but you know, for the
sake of the show style conversation. But these people, I'm
telling you, these people are incredible. Please come meet them.

(51:43):
Darryl chief among them, because of course he's been a
good friend for a long time. And if you like karaoke,
come sing karaoke with her. She shares those links and
is of course, yeah, please do that. Go go hang
out and listen to the karaoke and if you like
to sing, you're welcome to just listen or of course
sing along and kind of do the rotation stuff that
they do with the karaoke, which is incredible. I've done

(52:05):
it and it is very cool, and there's a lot
of really talented people that are doing that as well.
So yeah, go check that out. And sorry, trying to
fix the camera. I'll fix that during the break. But yeah,
so that's what's on my mind. Tonight, all this stuff
great jokes by Darryl as usual, and we're talking to
the ghost. I'm calling this a ghost body network. Now
we'll get to what that means, because it is really
part of this larger context of the soul, right, or

(52:26):
the soul or the ca the Egyptian double, which is
a mirror image of ourselves, of our physical body, but
instead it's some sort of energetic aspect. And it does
it answer not just a question of this phantom limb syndrome,
but this other bizarre study that just came out talking
about how our brain does not rewire with that cortical plasticity.

(52:51):
I keep trying to get the terms right of exactly
what this means, and so I don't know. As usual. Look,
no answers for me, just more questions as part of it.
But I'd love to hear your thoughts if you want
to be a part of the conversation tonight. Seven O
two nine five seven one zero three seven. That's seven
oh two nine one zero three seven. This is troubled mind.
Si'm Michael Strange. More with James coming up. We got

(53:12):
the Roberts in Pennsylvania and your calls as well. Don't
go anywhere, be right back. Welcome back to Troubled mind S.

(53:44):
I'm your host, Michael Strange. We're streaming on YouTube, a,
rumble x, Twitch and Kick. We're broadcasting live on the
Troubled Minds Radio Network. That's KUAP Digital Broadcasting and of
course eighty eight point four FM Auckland, New Zealand. Tonight
we're talking about this new study, the Phantom Limbs study
that rewires our understanding of the brain. This is from
August twenty first, so this is brand spank and new,

(54:06):
and it's going out to peer review and all the
rest of that stuff, of course, but it really begs
the question of not just let's say the energetic output
of humans and maybe the mirroring of the caa or
the double version of the Egyptian soul. Well, maybe there's
something more to this, and maybe that I don't know,
maybe gene expressions, we can maybe grow regrow some of

(54:28):
these limbs with who knows all kinds of stuff. But
I want to make sure I get this right. So,
like I said, the caw in the Egyptian ancient Egyptian
conception of the soul, and this is from Wikipedia, so
bear with me on that it is the double or
the vital essence. Meaning again, so if you lose your
physical arm, it still should exist in the sense of
the kaw in that arm space. Okay. And so that's

(54:50):
what we're talking about tonight in terms of this weird
study that just came out where the brain retains lost limbs,
control map define plasticity theories, which and I know you
you've heard this, you've seen heard recently in the last
five to ten years at all the rage in neuroscience
is plasticity. Ye had neuroplasticity, right, It's what Blossom from

(55:10):
what's her face? From what's her name? I can't bile
like whatever her name is anyway, from Blossom, she's now
a neuroscientist, and she's alway she's doing commercials about this
stuff and talking about it all the time. But I
do wonder, I do wonder what the hell this looks
like and if there is some sort of underlying lattice
of our substructure that does persist beyond the physical, which,

(55:32):
of course just is a fancy way saying is there
a human soul? Seven two nine seven one zero three
seven click to discord like a troubled mind styt rug
before we go to the Robert James, anything to add
to that, and then we'll go to our friend of
the Robert.

Speaker 6 (55:45):
Yeah, just great cause from Darrow and Joe. I also, now,
I don't know if anyone else has heard of this before.
I've heard of accounts are people seeing apparitions of just
hands or feet in places, sometimes moving, sometimes not just
staying still. I wonder, so, if we do have this

(56:09):
other energetic form, can it also be broken or can
it not? And if it can't, then what are these
other things that people see occasionally where it's the cases
of parts of bodies. And I'm not talking anything you know,
gory or graphic. I'm just saying literally almost like it

(56:30):
like the rest of my body is invisible. But is
it or is it is that? Are those just just
the energetic remains in a way of people that have
maybe moved on?

Speaker 2 (56:42):
Yeah, which is very down your lane of these ideas
that paranormal stuff. It's like, okay, so how much of
that energy after somebody passes remains and how much of
that becomes a residual human energy as I like to
describe it in terms of hauntings or spirits, lingering or
sort of even maybe merges with sort of the the
uh what the uh what's it called? The guy a hypothesis,

(57:04):
these primordial nature spirits, maybe they are sort of our
ancestral spirits just kind of hanging out. Maybe that some
of that energy remains as in some capacity, and maybe
it's what we're dealing with with all the stuff we
can't explain. I don't know. It's complicated as usual, at
least at least Idea wise. Of course, the materialists would
say this is nonsense, there's no such thing as a
human soul. But the fundamentalist might say religious fundamentalists might say, well, yeah,

(57:26):
clearly there's there's obviously a human soul, and there's something
to do with what we're talking about tonight. And so
that becomes a question, and as usual, you guys decide.
I'm not the arbiter of that truth. As I always say,
this is the stuff is way above my pay grade,
and that's a fact. But what do you know about it?
And I think that ad there, James, and will go
to Robert.

Speaker 13 (57:43):
Yeah.

Speaker 6 (57:44):
I think going back to at least in earlier too,
about words and the labels we put on things. I
think we have to focus on describing things and maybe
see how that goes and what connections we can make
to things. And because if we just try to name
things by one word or two words, I think that

(58:06):
can easily be confusing. But also it's hard to not
use just single words or two words to describe things.
So it's a double edged sword as well.

Speaker 2 (58:15):
Yeah, we need to be succinct, but also things are complicated,
as I always say, which is why this is a
long form talk show and we don't do a thirty
second TikTok. I mean you want to see me TikTok
and shake. Okay, whatever, go go check out the TikTok
anyway seven O, two, nine, one or three seven. Click
the discord link at Troubleminds dot org will put you
on the show. Thanks for being patient, friends. Let's go
to the Roberts in Pennsylvania. What's my man? You're on

(58:37):
Trouble Minds.

Speaker 9 (58:38):
How are you?

Speaker 6 (58:38):
Sir?

Speaker 2 (58:38):
All yours go right ahead?

Speaker 3 (58:41):
Can you hear me?

Speaker 2 (58:42):
Yes, sir, you sound great, loud and clear.

Speaker 13 (58:45):
Oh so biggybacking off at Darryl reminds me when I've
an old when us kid playing baseball and stuff, we
had a writing joke on my set, on my team. Uh,
little little David goes to the to Missus Ramsey's house
and knocks on the door, and Missus Ramsey opens the door,

(59:08):
and and and and David says, can Johnny, Missus Ramsey,
can Johnny come out and play baseball with us? And
she says, well, you know, Donnie hat doesn't have any
arms and legs. Oh that's okay, Missus Ramsey. We just
want to use them for second base.

Speaker 2 (59:28):
Damn it, Roberts, can we stop picking on the Hampu tees?
Come on, manious, you.

Speaker 3 (59:34):
Know that's that's a horrible joke. But we were kids
when we Okay.

Speaker 2 (59:38):
All right, all right, okay, you're you're forgiving this one time,
but don't don't get out of hand.

Speaker 3 (59:42):
Here, okay.

Speaker 13 (59:46):
Also, and what Dara was saying about Bobby Fella uh
and and she's correct, he did go go into pornography.

Speaker 3 (59:55):
Of the few pornography films.

Speaker 13 (59:58):
And an interview one of his female co stars just
ask about, uh, you know, his member and she called
it Frank and Weenie.

Speaker 2 (01:00:10):
Another one, why that's trae she did.

Speaker 3 (01:00:14):
She she called it, she said it was Frank and Weenie.

Speaker 2 (01:00:18):
Okay, all right, I'd never never heard that, nor do
I want to hear it again.

Speaker 13 (01:00:24):
All Right, I followed, you know, being a married man,
I followed that story intensely when that was breaking. You
never know, you never know, you never know, you never know. Yeah,
they go off the off the rocker, and next thing
you know, you're frank and weeding number two.

Speaker 2 (01:00:45):
Let's hope not. Let's definitely hope not. What do you
got regarding this other stuff? Stop stop picking on the
poor amputees. My man, you're killing me.

Speaker 3 (01:00:52):
Okay, I was thinking about another thing.

Speaker 9 (01:00:56):
Uh.

Speaker 13 (01:00:57):
I think it was Joe, or maybe it was Darryl
and Daryl's talking about how several animals possess the ability
to regent regenerate their limbs.

Speaker 3 (01:01:08):
They can we grow lost body parts.

Speaker 6 (01:01:11):
Uh.

Speaker 13 (01:01:11):
Some examples of that are like starfish, salamanders, some lizards,
and there's even certain flatworms that can regenerate their entire
bodies from fragments.

Speaker 2 (01:01:26):
Yeah, like you cut them into pieces and they just
grow into like five, right, five different ones or whatever.

Speaker 13 (01:01:33):
Yeah, And I'm thinking to myself, you know, let's say
take the salamander, right, Let's say he loses a leg,
you know, and that leg's gonna come back, it's gonna regenerate.
But the difference between a salamander and a human being
is that the salamander doesn't have a surgeon. He's going
to pack that uh, you know, wound and throw it off,

(01:02:00):
all right, so you know, so it can't grow. And
I'm thinking when you're on the subject that you've bought
here about the brain still recognizing that there's a limb
there and sending signals to that missing limb that had
if the surgeons wouldn't uh clorize the wound and then

(01:02:24):
stitch it all up, uh maybe and just left it alone.
Just over time, the brain signaling to that arm that
that's not just signaling that stems to still see the arm,
it's sending sigalings there to regenerate that arm.

Speaker 2 (01:02:45):
Yeah, which is uh, I'm pretty sure looka that this is.
This is you know, this goes back to the primordial
space of the salamander and the tail. But I do
wonder if that gene expression would be able to do
that for us. And eventually we're going to be able
to do this, I believe so, But what's it going
to take. I think in terms of the medical profession,
and you know, is it ethically viable to do these

(01:03:07):
types of things. I mean, I don't know. I mean,
clearly it would be a miracle, But where we're heading,
I don't even know if they want to pursue this,
because you know, what's quite a bit easier is to
just whip you up a robotic leg or whatever, right,
and then the transhumanist future here we come.

Speaker 13 (01:03:24):
Yeah, but yeah, robotic leg is not the same as
as a flesh and blood, you know arm. And I'm
trying to make myself clear here what I'm thinking, you know,
because I think I might have had a little bit
too much maybe geez, But I'm thinking that.

Speaker 3 (01:03:43):
Maybe we do it all wrong.

Speaker 13 (01:03:47):
Maybe the surgeon should take precautions to make sure there's
no infection that sort of stuff. But leave the dog
gone thing alone that the brain is setting is. And
once they have it all showed up, you know, I'll
calterized and all showed up. There's no way, no breakers
and all those things that want to it's not going

(01:04:08):
to regenerate. But if they leave it alone, maybe that's
what the brain's trying to do.

Speaker 2 (01:04:15):
Yeah. Maybe maybe as usual like that, the brain is
one of those things it's a great mystery, even in
twenty twenty five. And like, like I've said in the
past two you know me, I kind of lean that
UFOs and we've said this before, shout out b out
there on Twitter exit you know, to me, UFOs are
probably more Carl Young than Carl Sagan and so again

(01:04:37):
to find that however you like. But I think we're
still dealing with this, this the depth of the human
mind that seems to be endless at least in terms
of things and ideas and psychoses and just trauma. And
there's just so much with it that I don't know
if we'll ever really be able to sort of unravel
it scientifically to the end of itself.

Speaker 13 (01:04:56):
You know what I'm saying, Yeah, and mine is for
for for as long as I can remember, is something
I read somewhere years of years ago where the brand
where the mind goes, the body must follow, right, And
if the mind is signaling a missing arm, signaling that,

(01:05:18):
you know, phantom arm, you know, the.

Speaker 3 (01:05:23):
Body must go with it. The body must regenerate.

Speaker 2 (01:05:28):
Let's hope. So I mean, yeah, we got we got
a long ways to go between here and there, but
definitely absolutely let's hope.

Speaker 13 (01:05:34):
So what they should do is experiment. They should do
an experiment on somebody. Uh, not close off the wound
to make it impossible, but leave it open, uh and
see if over time it's you know, it starts to regenerate.

Speaker 3 (01:05:53):
I don't think they've ever tried that before.

Speaker 2 (01:05:55):
You. I would think that that that was sort of
the space before they learned how to caunterize a wound
and my tourniquets and the whole bit. I would think
that was the initial state. So if that was beneficial,
I would guess we'd still be doing it. So, so
I wouldn't say it was a scientific endeavor. I say
it's probably like ancient wisdom here in this capacity anyway.

Speaker 13 (01:06:15):
Just let's say it's medieval times and it's in a
night there they're there, you know, the Faxons, and they
was saying that there's a war going on between Great
Britain and Norway or whatever, and one of the and
a soldier, uh, you know, has this arm sliced off?

Speaker 3 (01:06:36):
What did they do with that back then? Did they did?

Speaker 13 (01:06:40):
They did the same type procedure as modern day surgency
today as far as closing off the wound, And I kind.

Speaker 2 (01:06:47):
Of doubt that. It depends on the time and the
space in the world, but I kind of doubt this.

Speaker 13 (01:06:52):
There's plenty of there's plenty of one armed, one legged
u X knights back in those days. Somehow they did
him get infected.

Speaker 2 (01:07:06):
Yeah, honey and cauterization as you're describing, I think, I
think there's there's some ancient ways to kind of handle
that for sure, if they go back even to the
Egyptians so and beyond, And honey was definitely one of
those natural sort of anti antiseptics that will keep you
from getting infected. So I mean there were some ways.
So I'm with you. I understand what you're saying, but
I'm also saying there's there's some other ways that what

(01:07:26):
that probably would have happened sort of in the natural space,
you know, somebody barely surviving or whatever, you.

Speaker 3 (01:07:32):
Know, would they have sewn the wound up back in those.

Speaker 2 (01:07:39):
Days, depends on what, Like I said, those days, would they.

Speaker 13 (01:07:43):
Put put SPT claw filer or something, And I just
wonder how that I will have to look and find
out how they did that. But it just seems to
me that there's good, there's no Everything has a reason
to it if the brain is and the idea that
the brain doesn't recognize that the limb is gone, that's
hard for me to really believe, right, because the brain

(01:08:08):
is a console center of the whole body. And the
other thing that makes sense to me is if it's
signaling a phantom arm, it's because it's trying to regenerate
that arm.

Speaker 2 (01:08:24):
Yeah, I wonder exactly that, And that's the hell of
the point. And I think that may be maybe the
missing link here. As part of our gene expression. Let's
say you're able to do that and flip a gene
and it does sort of just start regrowing the arm
or whatever. Maybe the brain is sort of holding that
the placeholder space of the limb itself, so it knows
exactly where to regrow. I love that one. And by

(01:08:46):
the way, the.

Speaker 13 (01:08:47):
Keys and the key to the key to helping the
brain is not to let yourself forget arm, right, you know,
after like you said earlier, after a year or so,
you know, you don't feel that sensation anymore because it
becomes a custom. But you help the brain by keeping

(01:09:09):
the memory of the arm alive.

Speaker 2 (01:09:12):
That makes sense. And I'm running through perplexity by the
way that exact question you asked about, sort of a
lost limbs. So I can read a little blurb here
for you if you like. But what else you got?

Speaker 3 (01:09:20):
Go ahead, that's all I had.

Speaker 2 (01:09:24):
You're the best. Let me read a little bit of
this before you take off. Here. So the prehistoric in
early evidence, the oldest known surgical amputation occurred approximately thirty
one thousand years ago in Borneo, where researchers discovered skeleton
remains showing a precisely healed foot amputation. This prehistoric individual
survived for years after the procedure, indicating sophisticated wound care

(01:09:44):
involving regular cleaning, dressing, and disinfection using medicinal plants. So
it goes back a very long time. I guess i'll
drop that in the chat. If you guys want to
check it out, well I would check it out. Okay,
I'll drop it.

Speaker 9 (01:09:59):
In the that for you.

Speaker 2 (01:10:00):
And uh, there's a there's a ton more there because
it cranked out a bunch of stuff. And this is
the beauty of again. Again, I'm not not glorifying AI
everybody relaxed, but being able to literally draw on like
fifty or seventy five sources in an instant and then
bring you sort of a quick detail is super super
powerful for learning and for of course conversations and all
the rest of it. But yeah, it seems like.

Speaker 3 (01:10:21):
You must speak.

Speaker 13 (01:10:22):
You must be very careful what they eat with that AI,
because the bubbles about to burst on that. That's what
I keep on making money. I'm making money off it. Yeah,
they're just losing money and it's got too many problems.
When you know the enormous amount of electricity work is
a bubble is gonna burst, and it's gonna burst before
this year's out.

Speaker 2 (01:10:43):
Okay, So I'm looking forward to its good.

Speaker 13 (01:10:46):
And it's gonna it's gonna make two thousand that crash,
that Internet crash in two thousand, it's going to make
that look like walking the park perfect.

Speaker 2 (01:11:00):
I'm looking forward to it. I'm here and I'm ready
for whatever comes next. You know me, you're the best.
Appreciate the call. Okay, there you go, cash in the bitcoin.
You never know what's going to happen next. This is
not financial advice. Have a great one. You're the best.
Good Night, Roberts. You know you love him. That's the
Roberts again, a mentor of mine and us all, go

(01:11:20):
check out his book, Go give him a follow, and
let's inspire him to continue writing. You know where to
find it. As you find all of our friends, not
all of them, most of them. I'm still adding some
people and having some problems with migration from the old computer.
So don't you mind me with all my tech issues.
I'll bore you with those details later. But Trouble Mind's
not ordered forward size friends, it is still live on
the interwebs. Just scroll down a little bit, actually a lot,

(01:11:42):
because he is under the Robert the Robert his writing name,
and get my big head out of the way, and
go check out his book. Like I said, full disclosure.
He's sent me a couple of copies. I read it.
He doesn't pay me to say it's good. It just
is good. He's a great writer and a lot of
great great idea is coming out of that. And it's
very Troubled Mind style stuff against stories from a fracture mind.
The Robert collection. Do check that out, and yeah, I

(01:12:04):
appreciate you. I appreciate the call. Anything on that, James.
A lot of a lot of sideways humor tonight, what
do you what's wrong with you? People? And I'm just kidding, James,
if you got anything.

Speaker 6 (01:12:13):
Else, Yeah, I great call from Robert. Just that aspect
of the mind wanting to regenerate things. I think it
is fascinating. I do wonder about that. I don't know.
I wonder if if that can even how that would work,

(01:12:35):
because could that work for I understand skin and bone
and all that thing, all those things, but the nerves
themselves growing again, I'm curious if that could even be possible.
I'm not and I'm not everyone knows. I'm not really
arguing with Robert or what he's saying. I'm just curious
if that can even really happen, because if it could,

(01:13:01):
then it's something I think that needs to be discovered
or looked into because of all the people out there
who have problems with because of nerve damage, whether they
were born with it or it happened later through injury.
There's a lot out there, a lot of pain caused
out there, or discomfort or just problems caused by underdeveloped

(01:13:26):
or damaged nerves. Funny enough, and then what reason I'm
thinking about this is because my own little vision is
caused by an underdeveloped and or damage No one really knows.
Optic nerve bundle that did not It was just not right,

(01:13:46):
it was not normal, and that's what started. That's how
that's how I was born leally blind, which is from
what I understand, it's it's a little more rare than
a lot of other conditions with eyes. So yeah, I
don't know. I just wonder about the the details of
that in a way, not just the skin, because I

(01:14:08):
do think obviously skin can regenerate and things like that,
but how would that work with the nerves is why
I'm just kind of focusing now.

Speaker 2 (01:14:16):
Yeah, obviously I have no idea. I mean, we're all
we're all kind of punching out there into the darkness
and in terms of you know, above our pay grade
type stuff, because this is as yet discovered you know,
uh technology, And so yeah, I don't know. I don't
have the answer to that, And you're right, there's a
I think there's a lot in play here. And that's
why we should look at these things from a bunch

(01:14:37):
of different perspectives, as we always do, and as I
call them reality tunnels, and recognize that so much truth
comes out of these conversations when you defer truth anyway,
there's so much that's like, Yep, that's probably definitely true.
That's probably definitely true. From all the different voices that
kind of come through here, all the amazing folks and
the information we kind of flow through. It's a it's

(01:14:57):
a beautiful thing as we come to it. If you've
got more ahead. If not that, I want to read
a little bit more from this archaeological evidence that goes
back to the Egyptians and stuff regarding amputations. It was
a great question by Robert, and I'm glad he asked it.

Speaker 6 (01:15:09):
Yeah, not much right now. I do wonder and maybe
we'll get meth to this this time later. The idea
of when you're having an out of body experience still
being able to feel and sense things the same way.
It makes me wonder about that whole concept of alien
abductions or abductions of any kind of other world, the

(01:15:31):
abductions where the person's body does not leave where they're at,
but it's like somehow there their etheric form, their their energy,
their subtle body is taken away for a time and
then brought back, but they still have they so report

(01:15:53):
feeling things when they're in that form. So I'm really
curious about that, and it makes me wonder again. I
like it to be all about me, but it makes
you wonder about my own possible abduction experience and if
that's what happened with it, and I can get in
that more late there, if there's time.

Speaker 2 (01:16:08):
Yeah, and there's an astral effect as part of it too,
as part of the discussion. Yeah, wild stuff. Okay, So
to this we will. We'll make some time for that, James.
If you stay at play with us, you know I'll
make some time. So here's the thing, right, So, this
is what I pulled up from the Robert. I just asked,
you know, how was a lost lim handled in ancient medicine?
Very simply? And it spent two minutes cranking the thing
out with forty two sources. But here you go. So

(01:16:31):
I read the borneo one and there's the actual imaging
of you, of what you see, and it says skeleton
remains showing a prehistoric leg amputation thirty one thousand years ago.
But here we go. The ancient Egyptians. Now this one's
wild so engine Egyptians pioneered early prosthetic surgery or technology,
creating some of the world's oldest artificial limbs. The Cairo
to a wooden and leather prosthetic dating between twenty seven

(01:16:52):
hundred and three thousand years old, represents the earliest known
practical artificial limb. This device showed remarkable sophistication, featuring flexibility
and evidence of multiple refittings for the wearer. And there
you go. There's the example and the picture of it. So, however,
Egyptian surgical practices regarding amputation remained limited. Their general level

(01:17:13):
of Egyptian surgery suggests that therapeutic amputations of major limbs
were unlikely to have been performed routinely. Egyptian medical papyride
describe only simple surgical procedures, and no surgical incisens have
been found in tens of thousands of investigated mummies from
the Pharaonic period. Well, they certainly treated fractures with fairy
and success. Therapeutic amputations remained extraordinary procedures, which doesn't mean

(01:17:37):
they didn't try it, just means they probably failed quite
a bit. And yes, indeed, anyway, that was a great
question from Robert. I'm glad asked it because it clearly
I didn't know the answer to it. I did my best,
but thirty one thousand years ago was a long time,
and even if it's an extraordinary undertaking, there's something to
this that we've been dealing with for a very long time.
So what does it mean? And recognizing that sort of

(01:18:00):
the caw or the soul or that mirror of ourselves
in the sense of an actual uh, what would you
call it? Like a like like a soul double of
our physical self persists even in our mind in twenty
twenty five. That seems dare I suggest compelling. I'd love

(01:18:21):
to hear your thoughts on this. More from James coming up.
We got Derek the knight Stalker and Joe calls as well.
Seven oh two nine one zero three seven Click the
discord link of Troubleminds dot Org. More on the way,
don't go anywhere, Okay, Welcome back to Trouble Minds. I'm

(01:19:01):
your host, Michael Strange. All the things, all the places, YadA, YadA,
blah blah blah. Eighty eight point four fm Aukland, New
Zealand KUAP Digital Broadcasting out of Las Vegas. Tonight we're
talking this. I'm calling it the ghost body network. Neuroscience
meets ancient knowledge. Now, if the brain preserves perfect maps
of limbs, that no longer exist. What else might be

(01:19:22):
stored in the hidden architecture of consciousness. Could phantom sensations,
morphic templates, and holographic body fields point to an unseen
design where nothing of the self is ever truly lost?
Or are we glimpsing evidence that awareness itself exists beyond
the boundaries of matter, which is really the core question.

(01:19:43):
I mean, it doesn't get any more simple than the
human soul, than the energy aspect of what people are. Then,
the original question of troubled minds is that do we
stop evolving the moment we're born? I don't think so. Again,
above my pay grade, all that stuff, but I think
the easy, the easy way to describe that is that
we're not the same person. We're always evolving as a person, period,

(01:20:06):
no matter what. And you could say biological evolution stops.
But I think from the time we were born to
the time we expire, there's a whole lot in between
that is relevant. And I don't like to make the
irrelevancy of human evolution in a lifespan well, I don't

(01:20:27):
like to sideline it. I think it's a I think
it's something that's incredibly important to well guess what people
that are still alive anyway, I love to hear your
thoughts on this. Lots of things in play here, and
the study starts with this weird phantom limb stuff where
we expect the brain to adapt, but it doesn't. It
just keeps firing signals out to these missing limbs of
amputees years later, as if it's never going to adjust

(01:20:50):
or it's going to take years and years and years
this for the brain to finally recognize, oh, that limb
is no longer there now, why that becomes a question? Jamie,
anything the ad real quick on? Go to Derek the
knight stock or thanks for being patient my man.

Speaker 6 (01:21:04):
Yeah. I think there's an important thing to consider here,
which is that we don't know and I mean this
is may seem obvious, but I think it's important to
point out again maybe that we don't know how the
brain works, and we don't know where consciousness comes from.
So just because the brain is trying to do something
that may have done before, I mean, it's amazing to

(01:21:27):
think that it could be doing this to heal the body.
But also I wonder if it's also just firing things off,
because that's all it knows how to do, and it
has nothing to do directly with the consciousness that's in
the body or the brain at the time.

Speaker 2 (01:21:44):
Yeah, maybe the old shout out to our good friend
mighty Roehan rest in peace. They always said, fire and forget.
Maybe the brain just keeps firing and forgetting whether whether
the hand moves or not. It kind of cares less
because it's just doing its function. Maybe you're right, Maybe
you're absolutely right. Fires James, you were the best. Let's
go to Uh Derek in Massachusetts, Welcome to the joint.

(01:22:08):
How you doing tonight? Thanks for saying to play with us,
and thanks for calling in. What's on your mind? My man?

Speaker 1 (01:22:13):
Go right ahead, great show, great calls everybody.

Speaker 14 (01:22:17):
My boss was off and I goord handed, so I
didn't get a chance to popping the chat and everything,
and my thoughts might not be as organized I would
like to be.

Speaker 1 (01:22:23):
But I got a couple of ideas here.

Speaker 14 (01:22:27):
First, Like with the phantom limb thing, there's this I
wonder how much that extends to cause that extended like
a phantom twin in the womb?

Speaker 1 (01:22:36):
Who like dies in the womb? Is that kind of
what you can be missing?

Speaker 5 (01:22:39):
Uh?

Speaker 14 (01:22:40):
Your your twin later on in life, and Elvis Presley
famously had a brother died in the womb, and he
talks about how his brother he's kind of with the
entire life and kind of talks about him like he's
a ghost. There is another presence that he's always communicating
with throughout the course of his life, and I'm not
sure if I'm kind of mixing there's that. There was
an episode where the uh PC's Legs Tomorrow where they

(01:23:01):
kind of fictionalize the two. So I'm not sure how
much I'm excited between that and the and the real
version of it. But he is a very mystical guy
into mystical stuff. I'm not sure how many like ideas
or definitely in the episode they credit his musical ability
to his brother a lot. So I wonder if it
is a kind of like phantom twin, like like a
ghost or like kind of where inspiration comes from, or

(01:23:24):
like something that we can not just miss, an appended
miss uh like a ghost twin brother that absorbed in
the room or something you know, just pupped my head.

Speaker 1 (01:23:34):
As far as ghosts is concerned with that, Yeah, I
wonder that's right.

Speaker 2 (01:23:37):
Well, that's an interesting one. Of course, because they say
that twins have that that connection, right, like that that bizarre,
eerie connection throughout their life. It seems supernatural. It seems
it seems as if that resonance of being connected at
one point and then being disconnected stays again across time
and distance, and it really begs the question of that entanglement,

(01:23:58):
right the entanglement effect of or you were the same
cells at some point at least in the same pool
of cells, and then suddenly you broke off, and then
maybe maybe that is the definition of that entanglement. And
I wonder as one passes on, that entanglement in the
in the sense of the soul may persist. And I
didn't know that about Elvis Presley. And that's an incredible
aspect here that uh, I'm going to look into right now.

(01:24:19):
Matter of fact, Yeah, I mean it's it's it's interesting.

Speaker 1 (01:24:23):
And then you have a good ciguree here right now.
Well with the with the human connection aspect, they I'll
be thinking.

Speaker 14 (01:24:29):
About, like the kind of the soul neates could be
one thing, so missing missing, a missing a loved one,
could I could kind of feel like that you miss
if you're if you're like had the same spouse for
decades and dicades and decades, and then you lose that
loved one and like a lot of times a person
might path away sooner afterwards you're kind of like in

(01:24:50):
always a kind of reaching to the other side of
the bed thinking that it's gonna be somebody there, or
or looking up at dinner thinking that the person can
be set across from you, or or getting the drink
for the person that they got every day at five A. Well,
that type of thing, like you did a phantom limited
it's a phantom partner type of thing. But I wonder,
especially like sorry Ham, sorry, so especially uh, if time

(01:25:14):
doesn't exist, could there be kind of a remnant of
like the hive mind that we had? So if if
like if there we see the evolutionary process of something
moving linear from like point A to point B and
we're somewhere in the middle of that or whatever, But
what if kind of it all is happening at once.
I mean it kind of more touches in my later

(01:25:34):
on my notes, but just like, what if there's a
hive mind and we're missing a remnant of Wednesay before
the fall, people talk about we were like five D
or something like that, and then we had a fall
where we could became this more material like meet like
like we had to build things with our hands and stuff.
Whereas we were five D we were all telepathic and
telekinetic and like didn't even need to speak. And then

(01:25:56):
we would build their pyramids and five D and then
just popped up there and then we fell down and
trying to get back up whatever. So like what if
kind of a remnant soulmates or quin flames or the
reason why like people look for best friends or solitary
confinement is such a painful punishment for people is because
we have a phantom limb. We are like the missing

(01:26:17):
leg or like we're the missing legs searching for the
body for the missing leg that misses its friend the
hand when it was all tied into the same body.
That are the human hunger for connection is a phantom
limb syndrome from when we were all unified in this
like ancient Atlantean five D telekinetic ive mind type of thing.

Speaker 2 (01:26:37):
I think with that, I think it's fantastic. By the way,
that's that is the ghost body network and you just
seguin perfectly into that. Let me read this to you. So,
so the quick blurb from the rite ap is this,
It's so, the ghost body network is the persistence of
phantom limb that maps. Sorry, so phantom limb maps suggests
a brain may be preserving far more than anatomy. These

(01:26:59):
intact neural tear territories could represent dormant systems holding the
blueprints of ancient sensory abilities humanity once possessed, as you
just described, such as maybe, for instance, electromagnetic perception or
ultrasonic awareness, waiting for conditions to reactivate them. It doesn't
touch on the twin part of the flint, the twin
flames or any of that. But that's exactly what you're

(01:27:20):
describing in the sense of that that ancient ability that
is maybe waiting to wake up for a lot of
reasons and just waiting for the right stimuli. And maybe
well maybe we're there or maybe we're not.

Speaker 14 (01:27:32):
Yeah, I mean maybe that could be like what what
technology is doing too. Sorry, I'm visiting. I gotta coup again.

Speaker 2 (01:27:38):
Sorry, that's right, you're allowed.

Speaker 1 (01:27:40):
Im sorry, running all over the place. I'm smoking in
the car.

Speaker 14 (01:27:45):
But yeah, but there's like the episode of Star Trek
where uh of a TG where they kept to remember
the boorg and he like they kind of try to
like tell him that he's a person and be like,
we've taken you from this as in, now what's your name?
You can be a person. Now you can be like
what's your desires and goals and stuff? And but he

(01:28:06):
was just he was a limb that was missing the
body collected.

Speaker 3 (01:28:09):
Like he was part of that.

Speaker 1 (01:28:10):
He was missing the hive.

Speaker 14 (01:28:11):
Mind Like if a if a bee is removed from
the hive, does the hive have a phantom like syndrome
for that bee and then vice versa, does the be
missed the like we don't consider is the leg and
missing the body because we don't consider.

Speaker 1 (01:28:23):
The like to be sentient like that. But what if
we are all part of a hive, a great or hive, and.

Speaker 14 (01:28:27):
Like, I mean, humans seem to need connection, you know,
humans seem to need to be around each other.

Speaker 1 (01:28:34):
They need to feel each other's or or something like that.

Speaker 14 (01:28:37):
It's like it can't only be like the human touch
stuff obviously and everything, but we seemed to we seem
to need it. And like a marting Manhunter in DC comics,
he's like the last surviving Martian and uh, like peace
telepathic and on Mars, they were a hive mind and
it was like.

Speaker 1 (01:28:54):
You were telepathically bonded with everybody.

Speaker 14 (01:28:56):
So he's missing He's like so so Superman is the
last of Krypton Marsha Mantunter is the last nun of Mars,
but Clark doesn't. Superman doesn't miss Crypton because he didn't
experience it. Marshal Manhunter it was destoried when he was
like a thirty, so he misses it, but then he
also misses the connection. He can never experience it, like
with the Justice League, he's does friends with them or

(01:29:17):
whatever he can, like, he can never find the connection
that he had when they were all unified as one
giant mind, as like one brain, and he's missing brain
cell like he's like a he's a his whole.

Speaker 1 (01:29:28):
Like longing is almost like phantom syndrome or whatever. It's
just interesting to.

Speaker 14 (01:29:33):
Me, and that like part of that, like if we
if this did a ball and we were telepathic, we
were part of a high mind, or we would have
like other powerful abilities or like the year you want
to go we want to go to is our desire
to create technology like a remnant. So if you zoom
way out of time. Is that a remnant of that?
Is that kind of like trying to trying to like

(01:29:57):
like we generate basically, I mean, like like the way
kind of a reptile we're generate as tail or whatever
are we as our body collective? We zoom way way
way way out of time rather than like lifespans if
just the entire totality of humanity as one life span
or whatever. Like who's to say we we aren't telepathic

(01:30:20):
for most of the time in the last like five
to ten thousand years. It's kind of an anomaly out
of the part where we are missing a leg and
then we have to like get an implant or whatever.

Speaker 1 (01:30:30):
We have to get a prosthetic.

Speaker 14 (01:30:31):
And the prosthetic could be in the form of technology,
so elon like patent and like pelekinesis and coupathist terms
and stuff and the neuralink and everything.

Speaker 1 (01:30:40):
Is our desire to build.

Speaker 14 (01:30:41):
Things a natural kind of phantom limb thing juveniate like
trying to like regrow a missing limb or that ghost
body term used that I'm forgetting right now with that.

Speaker 2 (01:30:56):
No, yeah, it's a it does bring back that like
I brought up earlier that's little body, Like I've clicked
it up on this crito. Yeah, yeah, where it is.
I'm gonna read a little bit from this. So this
is just from Wikipedia. So again forgive me on that
a subtle body is a quasi material aspect of the
human body, being neither solely physical nor solely spiritual according
to various esoterical and mystic teachings, and of course contracts

(01:31:17):
with the contrasts with the mind body dualism that has
dominated Western thought. But you know me, like, I'm looking
at this and you know, trying to look at it
in several different ways six seven, eight, ten different ways,
And this certainly seems to play as part of it
because if we're missing again, as you're described, you're describing
entanglement in some cases right with people and that human connection.

(01:31:38):
And I do wonder too if you would remove somebody
from I don't know, like like some people like isolation
is the best, right, Like what do they say, Like
the the introvert is like I'm happy alone, right, Like
I don't need that most of the time. I just
don't need that. But there's some people that have to
have it. They thrive on interaction with others and sort

(01:31:58):
of this energetic change constantly and continually. And it's weird though,
because like how do we define that within ourselves? And
then also how do we look at it in terms
of these antium traditions, because they certainly recognized it and
there were some people that could deal with it outside
of that space, but I don't know. And again, as
you're describing to it brings about the twin flames, and
of course that twin stuff, and the twin stuff is

(01:32:20):
spooky af like if you've ever looked into that, it
is do we have any twins out there? Anybody who
actually has a twin sibling that might be able to
speak to this, because I mean, this is the type
of stuff When you read accounts of this, it creeps out.
It's almost as if they are sort of quantum entangled anyway,
period forever. That's the weird part of this to me.
I don't know, it's a but the subtle body is

(01:32:42):
the one and links will be in the description. I
didn't have time to drop them all, but there's like
like fifteen links that are very very good. And the
subtle body, in this particular aspect, the quasi material of
the human body itself is fascinating, and I think it
fits very well with this conversation.

Speaker 14 (01:32:57):
Yeah, exactly, like the quasi body or the suttle material body,
or like the morphic field as a body like shape
like a body in the kind of.

Speaker 1 (01:33:07):
I'm visualizing it. What does that look like?

Speaker 14 (01:33:09):
Is that an upright human that we are right now
the version of the of us that we are right
now we have been for the last like a couple
thousands or a bunch of thousands of years of suff
or is it the entire is it reflective of the
entire course of human evolution? In which case, how long
do we have other abilities? If those ideas are correct,
and if we are some kind of in this low

(01:33:30):
stage like this bottom of the of the design wave
type of type of thing, we is our technology trying
to like we juvenile like make material again something that
already exists in the subtle like are we tell like
let's just for for for instance, like if we have
some kind of like if our subtle body has three

(01:33:51):
metal has like three arms, and right now we have
two arms, or we know a million years ago we
had three arms. It was way way more convenient. We'd
als kind of kind of crazy stuff, like they were
able to build the Peermans because were they were way
faster the joke, but they're way fast they the regards,
they were hammering and nailing like crazy these It was nuts.
And then in the future we'll be able to like
implant the dirt mechanical dirt m and have arrolink to

(01:34:14):
us or whatever, and that, Like right now we're kind
of in this phantom loom stage where we're missing that,
we're longing for that, and the connection thing, the solitary
confinement is really painful type thing. We're in this time
period where we have kind of this ast over that
phantom or like that procleem lane where we're we have
kind of a pseudo prosthetic over that misconnection and the

(01:34:37):
form of the Internet in the form of technology and
stuff that we can almost feel overwhelmed with how many
people and interactions we have to deal with online and
the stresses online and getting in fights.

Speaker 1 (01:34:46):
To people online or like like falling in love online
and all.

Speaker 14 (01:34:49):
Kinds of stuff and never see somebody out in the
way the waking world, never actually touch onto the human
being and that type of stuff. So and it's all
kind of like inceelt stuff and other kind of problems
with that creating obviously and different delusions and whatever. But
like it's something that didn't happen if you were like
when in made a cabin in the woods in the

(01:35:09):
fifties or whatever.

Speaker 1 (01:35:10):
Now you can have a cabin in.

Speaker 14 (01:35:11):
The woods with the Internet and feel overcrowded, you know,
even though you haven't see somebody shut it down, stop it.

Speaker 2 (01:35:18):
So leave me alone, and you're think you're out there
by yourself anyway.

Speaker 14 (01:35:22):
Yeah, So are all these things and why why do
humans seemingly always building them? Like why we all like
why is all the remnants of humanity a piece of
technology and stuff? It's because we're like, for all we
can see is the rejuvenation process. We've been trying to
constantly trying to regrow that limbit, regrow that tail and stuff.

Speaker 1 (01:35:43):
And that's that one more big idea. What do you
think that?

Speaker 2 (01:35:46):
Yeah, So, okay, so I want to go back to
what you said earlier, we're missing the third Army. I
don't think we're missing I don't And again I know
that was as a metaphorical it was not direct a
third arm So just just yeah, yeah, exactly, but I
think it's not if we're missed see limbs at all.
I think it's tentacles, is I think is what we're
actually because because look like like I said, as we

(01:36:08):
we race into the future here and then we start,
we're going to build humanoid robots, but eventually they're going
to be you know, two human, they're going to be replicant,
they're going to be uh uh, what's what's that movie
Blade Runner? Right, and it's it's not going to be
cool because we're not going to be able to tell
the difference. However, when you have like these tank tread
robots with fourteen tentacles, you're going to be able to
tell the difference. So maybe this is where evolution has

(01:36:30):
led us all along. I didn't know that was in
your notes, But that's hilarious.

Speaker 14 (01:36:35):
No, I mean exactly exactly. And it's like it's like
it's perfectly because that like, what does our subtle body
look like? If I think, what does all the time
with the Ciccadian rhythms and stuff, that if if humanity
is a species that's destined to go off planet and
we spend if we fatality of humanity lasts one hundred
billion years, like and only one hundred million of them

(01:36:58):
were on the Earth. You look at that timeline, are
like having a circadian rhythm that matches of the Earth.
We a blip on that rate would almost be nothing.
It'd be like coming out of the primorial loose or
something like that. So we had and again I don't
know if we had Tellesis back in the day.

Speaker 1 (01:37:15):
These are all just like theories on.

Speaker 14 (01:37:17):
Deers and theories, but just just for the idea of
the views, these cycles up and down and a we're
in a down thing? Could it be kind and especially
like a time doesn't exist and for our subtle body
wouldn't really be evolving like that. There would just be
a subtle body and we're kind of just navigating different
slices of it. We're just in this time slice of

(01:37:37):
the subtle body and we're experiencing in one way or whatever.
And it that's kind of what Grant Morrison describes five
D beings look like like the metallic blob liquid iridescent
liquid blobs, which are us. It's like anybody also describes
it as like it's like if every moment of your
life was a time slice. These are all of your
moments of your life connected and tied together and pushed

(01:37:58):
together into just like one shape. You know what would
that look like? Outside of time? There would be no
time slices or whatever. So I'm rambling, but just like
I know, so I have a future phantom limb syndrome.
If time doesn't exist, are we missing limbs that we
have for if humanity lasts for one hundred billion years?
Right now we haven't. We haven't had doctor Doc doc

(01:38:20):
awk tentacle robot arms yet. But what if we end
up having that for like eighty billion years of human
history we have tentacle arms, and right now we're long
and like time doesn't exist. So just our phantom body
has our our subtle body has tentacle robot arms or whatever.
We're missing that we're longing for, that we're searching for that.
The example I have is like flight human the Superman

(01:38:41):
is the man of tomorrow, insinuating that in the future
we'll all be Superman.

Speaker 1 (01:38:44):
We'll all be able to fly and Krypton they can
fly with technology.

Speaker 14 (01:38:47):
And stuff that, like I feel it, and sometimes I
feel like I just look up and I'm like, damn,
I feel like we can fly in the future. If
we can fly is that feeling I'm having phantom LNG
syndrome for flight or whatever.

Speaker 1 (01:38:58):
We're just technology in general.

Speaker 14 (01:39:00):
Like I always think these genius coders like Zuckerberg or
Bill Gates or whatever, if they were born one hundred
years earlier, what would their life be like? Were they
really struggle like or somebody who's awesome at cars? If
they were born like to just have a natural intuitive
ability to fix a car, they were born when we
only rode horses, what would their life be like? Could
they go super successful mechanic it's genius mechanic or genius coder,

(01:39:23):
a super billionaire who lived up this technology of his.

Speaker 1 (01:39:26):
Time, who was born in any other time, what would
what would he be like?

Speaker 14 (01:39:30):
It's almost we have like phantom limbs for like like
like a future technology whatever, and these longs, these like
adjectives people have that they don't know where it comes
from or whatever.

Speaker 1 (01:39:39):
Are they missing? Are they are they like, I don't
missing something that we're going to have in the.

Speaker 14 (01:39:43):
Future, or like kids with iPad babies you can just
hand them and hand a like me a piece of technology,
I'm okay at it whatever, like hand a person a
few generations older than me, they're probably a little roper
hand the little kid in an iPad.

Speaker 1 (01:39:58):
They know how to do everything in one minute. It's
an intuitive ability or whatever?

Speaker 14 (01:40:02):
Are we going to Are we going to have some
kind of external technology with us for most of human history?
So does our subtle body like also, I mean, as
are are all these things kind of just like us
trying to up and say for missing things we had
in the past or build things that we will have

(01:40:23):
in the future, and our desire to make them is
a symptom of this like future phantom limb syndrome.

Speaker 1 (01:40:29):
That' make any sense? I'm really no.

Speaker 2 (01:40:30):
Yeah, or the past actually that came up, Yeah, part
of my part of my my brainstorming. I didn't add
it to the right it, but that was part of it.
I was like, this temporal Taco Tuesday. Does it fit here?
I don't know. I don't know, but the way you
described it, I think it does because I think we're
all we're all yearning for the place we fit, and
the place we fit may not be twenty twenty five.
No offense to that. I'm just saying that that, you know,

(01:40:52):
some people feel out of joint, some people feel out
of out of town, yeah, yeah, whatever that looks like
you know they did. They're like, you know what, I
just belong on the floor and that's what kind of
causes that luddite aspect of this stuff. And you know,
rejecting technology. Now, look, I totally get it too. Like
I said, I've got this, and I'm not kidding you.
I've got this overwhelming desire just take everything I own,
cash it in, sell everything, and then just go build

(01:41:14):
something in the desert and never come back. Like it
is in me. I feel this, But also there's this
draw of technology as well, and so it's like, so
which is it? And how do we deal with this?
But I do wonder if sort of us in that
space the longing for the place we belong, and it
might be maybe you were like a blacksmith and belonging
in fifteen hundreds. Like I always make the joke of,

(01:41:35):
you know, how horrific would have been if you were
in the fifteen hundreds that got put to the sword
for you know, was something somebody said, some rumor or
something or whatever, and the Lord was like, yep, he
did it, kill him and you're done. But what if
that was your jam? Not killing people? But you know,
making horseshoes, and you made the best horseshoes the world
had ever seen. Maybe that was your jam. That's so

(01:41:56):
to the past to add the pass to what you're
talking about with the future there, Yeah, yeah, absolutely, I mean, and.

Speaker 14 (01:42:00):
That could be with the neural thing is too like
so the connectivity along with the human connection could be
when we were a high of mind in the past
or what will be a hive mind in the future,
like I'm becoming a Borgan we do we long for
connection the monoculture.

Speaker 1 (01:42:14):
I was talking about listening to the radio because.

Speaker 14 (01:42:16):
It's the same song somebody else will listening to just
to have the connection or whatever, because we were that
in the past, or because eventually we are going to
have some kind of mind that's just the course of
consciousness or whatever. Potentially, maybe that lasts for much much, much,
much longer than the state we're in right now. Is
that future syndrome or just like somebody who was born
immediately before the drum John Bonham Soul was born pre drums.

(01:42:40):
Is he a crazy person banging on rocks or whatever.
But if he was born at the perfect time when
when metal was about to rule the world, he becomes
a rock god or something like I don't want to
be controversial, but something like autism or aspergers, like people
born with that in the eighties had a really tough
life or and it was picked on or called the
nerd or whatever.

Speaker 1 (01:42:58):
People born with that a little bit later or maybe
a little bit later into.

Speaker 14 (01:43:02):
Becoming Zuckerberg or Elon Musk maybe like and like people
with natural coding abilities when they had nothing to code
might just seem like an outlier. But like, is there
a future technology like that we're long is there something
that we're longing for that we don't even know what?

Speaker 1 (01:43:17):
Who exists? You know? The way that people long to
go out in the woods? Do we long for? And
like a doesn't exist?

Speaker 14 (01:43:27):
Yeah exactly, yeah, yeah, Like so if time doesn't exist,
does a subtle body already look like this? And then
just like if time does exist, if you zoom out
in the timeline, we could we could have had a
long history of this or a long future of this,
just like our cicccadian rhythm. If we if we are
off world, have our off le future, then that the

(01:43:49):
time where we have to navigate our sleep schedule based
on the horizon all of the sun it's a blip
in the radar, Like I mean, so maybe we have
some kind of like future circadian rhythm. We can adjust
it some future lamb, some future subtle body thing that
exists now because time doesn't exist, or because it occupies
most of our history. And that I'm saying this handing
over and over again. But we're we're built where we

(01:44:11):
make friends to because we long for a hive mind
we once had it we will have. We're building technology
because we technically we long for abilities we once had.

Speaker 1 (01:44:20):
Or will have. That's basically it would you like, Yeah,
I don't know, fantom limb, future randol limb.

Speaker 6 (01:44:25):
I love it. I love it.

Speaker 2 (01:44:27):
And it was, like I said, part of the rite
up and I didn't. It didn't make it in. But
I'm glad you brought it up because it definitely FETs
you're the best. Brotherly appreciate your fire is always. That's
Derek the ny Stocker. Go give him a follow Trouble
Minds dot word Forward Size Friends. Scroll down just a
little bit and you'll find nice stocker under hand of course,
and go follow his YouTube channel. Go leave you a
nice comment about you heard him on Troubled Minds make

(01:44:49):
more contents. We love you, Derek, appreciate the call. We're
trouble Whine's coming up. More from James and your calls
as well. Don't go anywhere, be right back. Hi, Welcome

(01:45:22):
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Click that and you'll get an MP three stream and
you'll hear us live. You don't have to pay anything anywhere.
It's completely free and there's twenty four hours of programming,

(01:45:45):
amazing stuff. James is on the network, so many other folks, Ricky,
who else is in here that's on the network that
I can shout out?

Speaker 13 (01:45:51):
Jen?

Speaker 2 (01:45:52):
Just want to end up Jen as well? What's up
robing fund As I see you guys, Yeah, go check
it out. Also, we're on eighty eight point four FM Auckland,
New Zealand, and we're talking about the the phantom limb syndrome. Okay,
where clearly this is this is a one that goes
back quite a ways, and it's a conundrum and I
wanted to bring up to as part of the conversation
that have you guys seen that experiment that they do

(01:46:13):
where sort of our brain can fool itself where they
have a person sitting there and they have their arm
on the other side of like a piece of cardboard,
and then they cover it entirely and so you can't
see they're actually let's call it their left arm, for instance.
But then they put in the place on the on
the front side of the cardboard that they can see,
like this rubber arm that looks as if it's coming

(01:46:34):
out of you know, close to where their arms should be.
And so they sit there with like a fake arm.
I mean, the real alarm is still there. They don't
amputate it at all, but then they sort of replace
it visually with this rubber arm. And then their other
hand and they take a hammer and they they smash
the the actual rubber hand rubber arm. They hit it,
and there should be zero pain because there's no connection whatsoever.

(01:46:59):
But they jump, they freak out, They feel actual pain
as part of it, and it's not just sort of
the shock of it because they know what's coming. They
their mind knows exactly what's happening before it happens. But
then they when they hit it with the hammer, they
jump like like they've been hit with a hammer, and
obviously clearly they haven't. It's I don't know. The brain's
a weird thing when we talk about this against subtle

(01:47:21):
body as we're talking about or sort of the the
sort of substrate of like I said, the energy body
of the human soul itself. I don't know what does
it look like as usual. Look, I don't have those
answers above my pay grade, but those types of experiments
make me go wt F anything on that. James. We
got Jen on the line, as you know, and we
think we've got plenty of time tonight to work in

(01:47:42):
all the stuff. So you tell me, you decide how
you want to do this. Welcome back to the joint.
How you feeling my man in go right ahead?

Speaker 3 (01:47:49):
Yeah?

Speaker 6 (01:47:49):
I doing okay. My americrophone got jost li a bit,
so hopefully I still sound okay, yep, you're good. But okay,
good positioning is difficult when you can't see the position.
I'll just say that, but yeah, just and that that
studied that the experiment that you just described. That makes
me think that there's no to me, there's no other

(01:48:12):
other explanation except that part of that person's energy somehow,
that subtle body, their consciousness, who knows, I don't even
know what, but something of them connected to that that
inanimate object that was designed to look like an arm,

(01:48:33):
And that, to me is the only explanation for other
than psychological. But even psychological, that's still the mind. That's
still the brain. And so I've heard that the brain
causes pain or something about pain being partly in the mind,
and I don't think that's all together the way it is,

(01:48:54):
but I think it's part of it. So I'm really
I mean, it's terrifying in a way to think about
the experiment, but also fascinating as well.

Speaker 2 (01:49:02):
Yeah, it's a that whole thing is weird too. Like
I said, I'll see if I can dig that up.
It's on X and many of you have probably seen that.
But it's a strange thing because your mind knows rationally
that you're not under any danger at all. I mean,
you know, we're not smacking people with hammers for science,
but in this case, it's a rubber arm that looks
like you're on because they've made sort of an optical illusion.

(01:49:24):
And then and I mess it up a little bit
because they take the hammer first and they kind of
tap it on the knuckles very lightly, and on the
wrist and on the hand and up the arm and
kind of make your brain start to feel like it
feels that by seeing the visual aspect of it. And
then they go whacker of jumps. It's it's the craziest
thing ever. But our brain controls all of those things,

(01:49:46):
and how does that work? And again, so that's a
phony representation of this, this actual subtle body, and yet
we still respond to it. And in the in the inverse,
this ghost body network, as I'm describing, an amputee still
feels and the still feels pain and sensation in an

(01:50:06):
actual amputated limb years later, and the brain is still
firing information to this phantom limb, which again it seems
incredible and it probably explains in a you know, dare
we suggest a pseudoscientific way, as yet undiscovered, why why
we still feel that pain in an amputation when we shouldn't,

(01:50:26):
Like that's long gone, that's a that's old trauma. Anyway,
what do you guys know about this? It gets weird
when we talk about the subtle body and of course
the ancient Egyptian cause as I've been describing, What do
you know about it? Seven oh two nine one zero
three seven. Click the discord link at Troubledminds dot org
will put you on the show. It's as easy as that.
Let's go to Jenny Missouri, the Arcane Observer. Thanks for
being patient, my friend. You're on Troubled Minds. Go right ahead.

Speaker 4 (01:50:50):
I've thought about this for a long time.

Speaker 6 (01:50:53):
Can you hear me?

Speaker 2 (01:50:54):
Okay, yep, coming through loud and clear. Thank you.

Speaker 7 (01:50:58):
Well, you know the way that dreams work and what
they tell us about reality. It turns it turns out
there's a wild connection between phantom lens syndrome, and it
shows just how much our brains make up what we
think is real. When you dream, your dreams basically running
a simulation during rim sleep, your visual areas and your

(01:51:23):
emotional centers are firing like crazy while the nervous I
think it's the tendrils and everything that we're thinking about
have to do with the nervous system. The feelers are
our nervous system and the cause for the phantom limb
syndrome is that's an extension of it's an undying effort

(01:51:46):
from the way that the brain is interacting with the
nervous system. If you take the skin and the bone
and the muscle off of a human body and you
just leave it with the nervous system of the spine
and all of the tendrils coming off of that, which
is what we actually are made of. I mean, this

(01:52:07):
is actually why we are. What we are is this
sort of worm, this sort of horrific thing. Actually visually
to imagine, it's as if the body created the muscle
and the that came after, like the root of what
humans look like like on a table in a medical

(01:52:31):
field for example. You know, you have the entire nervous
system and it's so sensitive it has to be protected
and every other way with the flesh and the bone
and the muscle, but the nervous system itself connected all
with the brain and everything else. It looks like a

(01:52:54):
squid or like a worm or something of the kind.
It looks entirely different than what what we look at
when we look at each other. You know, it's dramatically different,
but it is the actual thing that is responding and
experiencing and reacting to reality. So that is where the

(01:53:15):
influence of existence is actually occurring, is within this worm
of what the body actually is, and everything else outside
of that, the skeletal system, the muscle system, the skin.
It's all to protect that, almost like the way that
a hermit crab goes and gets a home inside of

(01:53:36):
a shell.

Speaker 4 (01:53:38):
It is to protect that.

Speaker 7 (01:53:39):
And the way that it's it's expressed is really interesting too,
because I mean the way that you know, the nervous
system creates the environment around itself, or how it protects,
you know, how it does protect itself. But the nervous
system itself and the phantom limb syndrome is directly linked,

(01:54:00):
pardon me, to the to the dreamscape.

Speaker 4 (01:54:05):
If you.

Speaker 7 (01:54:07):
When you were dreaming in the ram's sleep, it's accessing
parts of the brain that deal with memory and emotion.
Those all become activated and those are all, you know,
directly linked into the nervous system. So the idea of that,

(01:54:27):
if you were to lose a limb, the nervous system
would still recall at limb being there because it's connected
to a part of the brain that is so intrigally
united both vision and imagination and dreamscape of memory, of

(01:54:47):
having had that and remaining such a part of itself
that you know, that is the extension of it. So
I don't think necessarily that's spiritual. I think it is
the nervous and it's the firing of the neurons and
the way the power of the mind. They found these
studies recently that the human brain blows. It blows in

(01:55:14):
the dark, so which is really interesting. Basically, just so
there's a light coming, there is a light coming from
within and it's coming from the brain. It's illuminating in
a way. I think this was on like a you know,
like Life Science.

Speaker 1 (01:55:30):
Or some like.

Speaker 7 (01:55:30):
That's some article I saw, but that the brain actually
is illuminating and it is glowing type of light.

Speaker 4 (01:55:38):
There's another There was something I shared with James.

Speaker 7 (01:55:41):
Actually it was children that were blindfolded and they were
told to imagine a light coming from inside of behind
their eyes, and through that imagination mechanism, they were able
to see what their eyes come letely blindfold and not

(01:56:01):
all I'll find the study that was done, but it
was repeated over and over again.

Speaker 4 (01:56:05):
It was able to be replicated. And it's interesting because
in old cases of like you know, like studying for
this sort of spiritual.

Speaker 7 (01:56:19):
I guess, you know, aggressive trying to become spiritual shaman
or something like that, that there was a progress. There
was a sort of a situation where they would do
that as a sort of exercise by covering the eyes
and making the individual try to see, and they would
always try to sense their environments. They would never actually

(01:56:40):
see their environments. It was like there's this idea that
they should try to sense that there's a tree there
or something of the kind.

Speaker 4 (01:56:49):
But there there's a lot to that.

Speaker 7 (01:56:52):
I would say that people should look into that about
like just if they're interested in why it could occur,
how it could occur. But I think that the phantom
limb syndrome that comes from because it's connected with the
part of the brain that's connected with dreaming and with memory,
retention and emotion, and that those are linked together. But
I think it's the nervous system that's doing it. And

(01:57:13):
as far as it being what's the spiritual aspect or
is there something spiritual to it? It's the root of
your existence. You're if any part of that that connects
to the brain is disconnected from it, or discontinued. You discontinue.

(01:57:34):
I mean, it's not quite like the musk. It's not
like the muscular system. It's not like the skeletal system.
Is unique in that way that the root of our
existence is rooted in the nervous system and how that
reacts to every thing, as far as how does things
like a yoga or tai chiet. Because it's reacting on
the nervous system, it's keeping it healthy. It's it's treating

(01:57:58):
the nervous system the same as things like a relaxation
or visual meditation or whatever. That is why that ties
into that because sexually not treating just the sore muscles
or the pysical activity. It's working at a root level,
the root of what a person is and what I like.
I say, I won't repeat it again. It is terrifying

(01:58:18):
looking to look at the human nervous system just sort
of pulled away from its shell and we can and
to imagine that we all look like that and that
we are just what's what you're seeing on the side
is a sort of a progression, is an extension, it's

(01:58:39):
a projection of what is needed for survival or like
how that nervous system is interpreting reality and genes and
all of that. But it's just really fascinating. But I
think at a spiritual level that the nervous system is
this all that firing of all of the power of
the glowing brain as I subscribed sort of earlier. And

(01:59:04):
then there's the heart, the heart being described as a
sort of miniature star or sun. The continuance of the beating,
the power behind that life force is it's almost cosmic.
The strength of it and why it continues on as
it does, what sets it off and why it continues

(01:59:27):
isn't a mystery. I mean, they have kind of broken
it down into that it's just this this dynamic force
that's very similar though to what we see in our
environment around us as far as like cosmically speaking. But
then that is firing all the power into the nervous system.
And then the nervous system is reacting continuously and sensing everything,

(01:59:51):
you know, through its five senses or someone say twelve senses,
and on and on about how everything is being perceived
and responded to through that.

Speaker 2 (02:00:00):
Yeah, I'm real quick, I'm trying. I'm trying to find
that image of the nervous system you're talking about because
I've seen it and it does like terrifying, it incredibly alien,
and all I find they are all these sort of.

Speaker 7 (02:00:09):
Grat tasted it one time a long time ago, and
it's literally like the brain and the eyes and the
extended tendrils of the nervous system when it's pulled away
in the sort of you know, a medical view, and
it looks just like a an octopus or a squid

(02:00:30):
or something.

Speaker 2 (02:00:32):
Planet totally, totally, totally.

Speaker 4 (02:00:35):
Does look alien.

Speaker 7 (02:00:36):
And just to imagine, if you, you know, people are
used to seeing the skeletal system and they're like, oh,
that's neat, you know, and that's.

Speaker 4 (02:00:44):
That's what we are.

Speaker 7 (02:00:45):
No, like when you look at the actual nervous system,
that is actually what we are. And the rest of
it is almost like a shell, but it looks yes,
like that.

Speaker 2 (02:00:56):
It's sounded.

Speaker 7 (02:00:57):
It's just like that is well yep, and that is
extending out and it's protected by the flesh and the
bone and the muscle. So that because if you were
exposed to all of it, it'd be like torture, just
the exposure, because you're desired.

Speaker 4 (02:01:13):
Apparently this is not.

Speaker 7 (02:01:17):
I think that the saline water of the ocean and
things like that, like all life forms come from. Is
more akin to what that came from or something similar,
And that's just my own speculation, but it does seem
to resonate more like that that eventually, when it was
exposed to the air and the elements, that had to

(02:01:38):
have protection because the nerves are so sensitive. The whole
nervous system is so delicate that it was protected by
the bone and the flesh and the skin, and it
was more like a shield against but also able to
proceed and beyond that distance, you know, like they have dogs,
you know, like send to animals that are able to

(02:02:00):
smell at a great distance. And I think that, pardon me, goodness,
but our nervous system is able to sense at a
great distance, but it's limited if there are things in
the way, the flesh and the bone and so and
so forth. But I think that that system you're looking
at right there is the way that and it's possibly

(02:02:22):
what we ignore because we've begun to believe that we've
forgotten what we actually are.

Speaker 4 (02:02:30):
We've become convinced by the illusion.

Speaker 2 (02:02:33):
Yeah, as I like to call it the meat suit
experience because it is complicated and as usual, I think
you may be right here as this larger conversation is
that you know, you talk about biophotonics as you were
describing the brain glowing in other parts, like recently they
discovered that we're glowing from our eyes as well, and
even from every cell in our body, like this type

(02:02:55):
of stuff, which is incredible. But then also as part
of this and the actual nervous system itself off and
you know, all of that resonant energy from our heart
and our brain, that's that's actually measurable outside of our body.
I do think what you're describing here is in play
massively because it doesn't have to be a spiritual space
as usual, because we're talking about the human energy factor

(02:03:17):
and and coming from our nervous system at large, which
is the core of who we are, of what we
are as horrific an alien as it looks like I said,
if you, if you could, you could script an alien
movie with this thing as the main antagonist, and it
would it would play. It would totally play. But by
the way, oh yeah that's you and that's me, so
you know, welcome.

Speaker 4 (02:03:37):
To it nice all of us.

Speaker 7 (02:03:39):
Yeah, it's wild, and it's like, yeah, it's like we
put on a suit so we could walk around on
the surface like.

Speaker 4 (02:03:50):
Experience it because we have a suit on.

Speaker 7 (02:03:52):
But I think too, I mean just the power of
the source of the life itself inside that nervous system,
and that it's using this delicate source to feel its
environment to such an extent and is creating.

Speaker 4 (02:04:10):
The mental imagery in the mind.

Speaker 7 (02:04:13):
That and the impossible things that are accomplished, and the
studies we've heard about with remote viewing and lucid dreaming
that accomplished in the same part of the mind. All
of that, it's the nervous system. Like I say, with
an RIM sleep, it's the part of the brain the
migdala for emotion and then hypocampus for memory.

Speaker 4 (02:04:35):
I think is what it was.

Speaker 7 (02:04:38):
Those centers of the brain are active in RM sleep,
and I think that you know the fact that it's
all linked together. It's very likely that the brain just
remembers that you had a limb there. It's still firing
from the nervous system the same patterns of energy of power.
I don't know if they call it power or what

(02:04:58):
you would call it, but the energy is still electricity
or something of the kind is still being fired into
that direction, and the memory recall is still feeling out
that area because it had it for some period of time.
I think it'd be different if you didn't start out
having it. I think that it's kind of locked in
in a way, so do I just think that there's

(02:05:18):
something like that going on, and it's the nervous system
and the endocrine system that have everything to do with that,
the phantom limb syndrome. I think that people are experiencing
and beyond that too, we are experiencing our world from
that alien image you see there. That's what's experiencing it,

(02:05:39):
and the rest of it is all a sort of
survival mechanism, you know, because and it's really interesting that
that's how the way that everybody's expressed.

Speaker 4 (02:05:50):
But at the very root of it, that's the root
of us, all right there?

Speaker 2 (02:05:55):
Yeah, well said a biophotonics and a nervous system, and
consider rope shell Drake as well. Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 4 (02:06:02):
Good night.

Speaker 2 (02:06:03):
She's the best. Appreciate Call jenn in Missouri the Arcane Observer.
Go give her a follow on all the places you know.
We're to do that Troubledminds dot org forward slash Friends.
It says follow Jennifer here and of course follow stuff
Cedo Paranormal. She's a co host over there on the
weekends as well with James, and uh yeah, help our friends,
help our friends grow, and these amazing ideas flow through.
Look at like I've always said, this is not just me.

(02:06:23):
This is a wall of people that have made this
incredible and I will. I know, we got some people
pen need to get on this list. I'm notoriously slow
about doing extra stuff. And we got some mods to
make over there on Rumble too. I'm sorry about that.
We need a male mod on Rumble. There's been a
request that there's too many female mods on Rumble. I
mean that is it a thing? Anyway? We need we

(02:06:44):
need some male mods on Rumble. I think Real JB
was one, and I think shout Out the Mighty Rowhan
and we Missing risk in Peace Brother was also one.
But anyway, James, anything to add there to what Jen said,
lots of stuff she brought up in that that nervous
system thing is creepy as hell. It's something that's been
on my mind for a long time because once you
see that, you can't unsee it. But that's you, James,
and that's me.

Speaker 6 (02:07:06):
Yeah, that is wild. I did look at it. Great
call from Jen as always, and I'm always happy to
have her as a co host on my show. And yeah,
this has been making me think too. It all since
Derek's call and then Jen's call, and based on the image,
you know, then Derek might remember this, others may as well.

(02:07:27):
For anyone that has seen any of the Justice League
animated series and or the DC Comics animated series from
the nineties and two thousands, at one point they had
the Superman villain plenty that Superman comes back into this
brainiac which is the sentient machine being, and he can

(02:07:50):
have a body, a full human shape body, but also
he can just exist as as a head the tentacles
coming out of it. And in that series, in one
of those one or two of those series, he had
a ship that flew around, you know, wherever you need
to go, and the ship was literally I think it
may even even be part of a giant robo at

(02:08:11):
one point, but either way, at some point he was
just flying around in this giant version of his own
head with all these tentacles sticking out of it and
coming down and hanging in the sky and so and
that also reminds me that image of apparitions people have

(02:08:32):
seen of similar things of either stick figures or just
masses of light or energy that seemed to have tentacles
or at least extensions of all kinds sticking out of them.
I really find that fascinating. I wonder what that if
there's a connection there as well. So and I'll get
into the most of there's time and in the last

(02:08:53):
segment here.

Speaker 2 (02:08:53):
Yeah, the actually you bring that up, as you said,
I immediately thought of that Ghost Hunter show was Zach Bagan, right,
And they have like they they're they're scanning, you know,
energy or whatever they're doing, like I don't know, you
believe it or don't believe it as usual. Look I'm not.
I'm not here as the arbiter of truth or whatever.
But it is interesting that of all the things they
could do, as you know, a if they were trying

(02:09:15):
to fool people, like a visual representation that they can
have like you know, like the disembodied apparition like in
Ghostbusters in the library at the beginning, right, Like they
could have like that, like a very obvious silhouette, but
instead they have like this weird stick figure thing that
looks kind of like in this sense kind of like
a nervous system. You're right, Oh geez again, I'm not

(02:09:39):
I'm not saying it's real. I'm not saying it's fake.
I'm saying make up your own mind, because wow. Yeah, okay,
So sometimes there are connections and sometimes there are connections.
So what do you know about it? MoMA James coming
up and your calls as well. Nobody on the line.
If you guys want to jump in here. Seven oh
two nine five seven one zero three seven. This is
Troubled Minds. I'm Michael Strange. Yeah, more on the way,

(02:10:01):
don't go anywhere, be right back. Welcome back to Troubled Minds.

(02:10:28):
I'm your host, Michael Strange. We're streaming on YouTube, the
Rumble x, Twitch and Kick. We are broadcasting live on
the Trouble Minds Radio Network. That's KUAP Digital Broadcasting and
of course eighty eight point four FM, Auckland, New Zealand.
Shout out to our friends down in Auckland. Tonight we're
talking the Ghost Body Network. Neuroscience meets ancient knowledge, and
we started with this fantastic article talking about how the

(02:10:49):
brain retains lost limbs, control map, define plasticity theories. Now
what is it. Cortical plasticity is what they describe as.
And I know many of you've heard this in terms
of neuroscience. As I described earlier, the idea of cortical
plasticity is that our brain adapts, it will change, it

(02:11:09):
will for our nervous systems, specifically as Jim was talking about,
and also neuroplastic plasticity in terms of new neuroscience. Right
like this, it's all the rage, It's all the rage,
but I'm not so sure it's as usual. I may
what would you call me? A not a dissenter. I'm
something that's like, oh, well, that's a really cool scientific

(02:11:32):
thing that we discovered, but what does it mean about
the future? And what does it mean about the things
we missed? Like that's how I see the world and
look to my detriment, I know, but also to my superpower,
because I can look at things slightly differently and talk
about them and wonder about what we are missing As
part of it. Is it a spiritual thing as I've
been describing, part of that Egyptian call from when we began,

(02:11:54):
the Egyptian conception of the soul that has what eight
different sections to it, But also maybe as Gen was describing,
maybe it's not spiritual at all, and that bio photonic
or the energy resonant human energy as I'm always talking
about as well, is part of what's happening here. And
we're you know, our nervous system there or not is
still trying to receive things. Look, I don't know. I

(02:12:18):
don't really know the answers to these questions, but I
do know that there's amazing science happening every day. And
don't be fooled, right, don't be fooled by like you
know such and such is an amazing breakthrough because they
did it in mice. Okay, remember every every damn scientific
breakthrough you see. For example, remember they told us like

(02:12:38):
twenty years ago, all we got the breakthrough, we can
grow new teeth, so Dennis are going to be obsolete
in like ten years. And here we are twenty years later,
and then they're still saying this. It's like, wait, so
which was it? Did you figure that out or did
you not? And you know the asterisk is we figured
it out in mice, and people are I know this

(02:13:00):
is controversial, but people are not mice. I mean, what, James,
don't make me get rowdy I know it's a controversial
thing to say, and I know many of you will disagree,
but people are not mice and look mammals, mammals to mammals,
dust to dust as they say, or whatever, as I
just made up. But you get my point. There's some

(02:13:21):
things here that are kind of all over the place,
and it's important to keep an open mind and a
skeptical mind at the same time and wonder what they're
trying to tell us and why some of these things,
some of these breakthroughs that were twenty years ago, have
not culminated into a commercial space as yet. And let
me suggest not because Dennis will be out of business.

(02:13:43):
Let me suggest because people are not mice. James, what
you got on that.

Speaker 6 (02:13:49):
Not too much, But yeah, I know I do agree.
I was just making a joke, but yeah, it's and
what's funny about that is you were just talking about
the it's good to be skeptical, and now here I
am about to talk about my possible alien abduction experience.
So we can cover all the bases here in these

(02:14:11):
kinds of shows, which is good, all.

Speaker 2 (02:14:13):
The bases And yeah, okay, so we got Enoch on
the line. So if you want to if you want
to peel it off. You tell me if you want
to take him first, or do you want to tell
the thing. He just put his hand there just a
couple of minutes ago, so he hasn't waited a ton,
So you tell me, you decide on how this goes,
and we'll do.

Speaker 6 (02:14:26):
It that way. Let's let him go in, because I
don't think it usually takes very long to tell the story.
So we'll let you not go and then go from there.

Speaker 2 (02:14:35):
Okay, and we will you have the time. We're going
to hear this one way or the other, as long
as you stay a play with us. We're talking the
Ghost Body Network tonight here with James selcied To, of
course of Selseedo Paranormal, not just a dear friend of
the show, but also the paranormal expert of the show.
And what do you know about this whole business of
the ca or neuroscience and this this weirdness of the

(02:14:58):
phantom limb syndrome. And yeah, it's complicated, but also it's developing,
and I think it's incredible to think about in a
lot of different ways. One more time seven oh two
nine five seven one zero three seven click the discord
link at Troubledminds dot RG will put you on the show.
Let's go to uh Austin, Austin in Michigan. What's the
brother you're own Trouble Minds? How are you sure? Right?

Speaker 3 (02:15:18):
Head?

Speaker 15 (02:15:18):
I'm doing I'm doing well? How are you pretty good?

Speaker 2 (02:15:23):
I have no complaints other than speak up just a
little bit and welcome to the thing. All yours? What's
on your mind?

Speaker 15 (02:15:32):
How do I sound?

Speaker 7 (02:15:32):
Now?

Speaker 2 (02:15:33):
Got better? ASMR? Whatever you're grinding on on the back,
stop grinding on that, but keep talking.

Speaker 15 (02:15:40):
That was just me adjusting my microphone, right.

Speaker 2 (02:15:45):
I was just making a joke. Everybody, relaxs, go heads her.
I'll just make it a joke, go hits her.

Speaker 9 (02:15:52):
Yes.

Speaker 15 (02:15:53):
I just heard about this phantom lend thing a week ago.

Speaker 16 (02:15:58):
I visited a cousin of mine that she makes prosthetic
limbs for people that have lost their limbs, and she
was telling me about that last week where people can
have pain of something that isn't there anymore because the

(02:16:20):
coating in the brain still registers is.

Speaker 12 (02:16:25):
There.

Speaker 16 (02:16:25):
And I just was reading about this earlier today about
why yoga and stuff like tai chi or cheekong so
important is because if you have any traumas or pains
from previous traumas or injuries, and you don't work on
your cardiovascular system and the nervous system together with these

(02:16:51):
breathing techniques which focuses on controlling your heart flow, that
your blood of your cardiovascular system with your breath and
realizing through meditation that your mind can directly affect your
blood flow. Most of us will think too much and

(02:17:16):
cause depression and all kinds of things to disrupt blood flow.
And when we have previous traumas injuries and we don't
re low those areas because when they get hit with
stuff and stuff gets trapped, energy gets built up, and
then like the it's like dams get formed, and your

(02:17:38):
own bloods and your own body's rivers, and then the
dams get overwhelmed and then eventually they burst and you
get things like It's been attributed to things like cancer
and all kinds of diseases that are not coming up

(02:18:00):
with large or any sort of evidence on what the
causes or solutions could be. A lot of the mysterious
diseases and illments and cancers have been attributed to things
of this nature, where and balances in the nervous system
and the cardiovascular system through these traumas or injuries or

(02:18:25):
like phantom. The phantom thing's extremely interesting because I have
someone that lives very close to me that I think
about almost every day. I'm not going to get in particular,
but he lost his leg in a motorcycle accident, and
it makes me wonder because I've been kind of like
helping him out and telling him about my chigong and

(02:18:47):
tai chie kind of stuff. I hope he's I hope
I can talk to him again to see if maybe
that can help him, because I'm really interested and if
doing these exercises can do that, because I don't really
know anyone that has lost the limb and turned off
the phantom limb thing by just doing certain exercises. But

(02:19:10):
if there is someone, I could teach them ways on
test and test that for myself because I've been practicing
for over five years and I have certain things that
were like a total roadblock in my life that I
feel like I removed and it has put my ego
in shock, and I've had to let go of my
old identities over and over again, and the old identity

(02:19:32):
keeps coming back, like, oh my brightious come back and
you just got to whack it in the head again
with a shovel or whatever.

Speaker 15 (02:19:41):
Leave go back to life.

Speaker 16 (02:19:42):
That's trying to pull you back under your to your
death because ego will do that. Like you identify with
one of your vices in life. We all have different vices,
but when you choose to identify with that vice, that's
when it ultimately leads to to your demise and everyone
around you sees that, and it becomes that thing you

(02:20:03):
don't want to face that everyone can see but you,
and it's like, if you don't wake up, you're going
to scare everyone you love and you're going to be
taken under by your own ego.

Speaker 2 (02:20:14):
Yeah, by the way, troubled minds is my vice. It's
taken me under. I'm just kidding. So okay, So regarding
that thing that you said about your acquaintance or friend
there with the missing limb and the motorcycle accident, sucks.
Sorry to hear that.

Speaker 9 (02:20:29):
I was.

Speaker 2 (02:20:30):
Let's see, I'll pull this article up. But so one
of the ways, by the way that they get rid
of this eventually is through physical therapy. So it is
a link going to be in the description down below.
And there are people that are working on this, but
maybe maybe you've got a better way to do this,
And so if you're going to do this, I would
ask you pretty please just for posterity to kind of

(02:20:51):
take notes on the process, because maybe just maybe your
techniques are better than this, and you never know until
you document the thing, and then maybe you can put
some thing out that'll help somebody else somewhere else, or
maybe even help a second or a third person and
do better than modern medicine right with sort of these
these older ideas. So I'm looking forward to that if
you feel up to it, and if you again that

(02:21:11):
the friend has got to feel up to it and
all the rest of it. But that would be amazing
if some of this Qui gong and some of the
things you've been into are able to actually, you know,
quote cue or that phantom limb syndrome, because why not, right,
I'd love to hear that if it works.

Speaker 16 (02:21:28):
I really think it's very possible. Some of the most
amazing injuries and diseases I've ever seen were cured from
videos that I've watched of like these Shalllin monks doing
very like minimalistic type of practice on their patients and

(02:21:48):
the people in the documentary saying that a lot of
people are like completely caught off guard by how they
practice medicine. It's just always inspired me, and uh, I
think nutrition is going to be very important when it
comes to rebuilding things in your body. And I just
pulled up in shall in course the four quadrant of health.

(02:22:13):
Movement is one and nutrition is another, and then sleep
and recovery is its own thing as well, and then
stress management. So this is like the foundation of all health.
There are those four things movement, nutrition, sleep and recovery,
stress management. So I just think having that alone as
a blueprint with what you gave me would be enough

(02:22:34):
for me to formulate what I need. And I've been
taking notes every day since I seen a yellow feather
in my backyard a few weeks ago. I got this
meditations book like Marcus Aurelius and Not Your Journal from
the Mulligan Brothers, and I've been daily writing my life
now finally, So I guess that's part of what is

(02:22:59):
kind of making smile a little bit now, because I
feel like I'm a lot more squared away than I
would have been if I didn't start practicing this amen.

Speaker 2 (02:23:07):
And by the way, Austin is very young. In case
you didn't know that, he sounds very wise and very aged,
but he's not. I met him when he was a
whipper snapper of like twenty two or twenty three, and
he was the wisest twenty two or twenty three year
old I've ever met. And he continues sort of on
that process and just kind of looking into these spaces
that are less regard less well regarded in the modern space.

(02:23:30):
And it's good. It's good to learn these things because look,
if they're changing your life for the better, certainly they
can change other people's lives for the better. And that's
why we need to talk about this. What else you
got regarding this, I'm calling it the ghost body network
and sort of this phantom limbs space. Do you think
there is more like a spiritual aspect to it, like
we were talking about the subtle body, like a I'll
rage of the quick definition on this. So it is

(02:23:52):
a quasi material the subtle body. It's an aspect of
the human body being neither solely physical nor solely spiritual,
acording to various esoterica, cult and mystical teachings or Jen
actually brought up a fantastic point that it's more to
do with the nervous system and sort of that biophotonics
that we're sort of radiating out into the ether around us,

(02:24:12):
that maybe it's more physical than we think it is.
What's your take, and you don't have to take one
or the other, but what is your idea on why
this sort of thing persists and how maybe physical therapy
or what you're doing might be able to cure it
or change it, let's say, curing. It's a bad word
in this space.

Speaker 15 (02:24:30):
Yeah, not FDA compliant.

Speaker 16 (02:24:34):
That word is right, exactly right, the cardiovascular symbol. As
I pulled out of one of these books of wisdom
that I found through someone close to me.

Speaker 15 (02:24:48):
This guy's name is Joseph.

Speaker 6 (02:24:52):
What is it?

Speaker 15 (02:24:53):
Says it right here Harry B. Joseph.

Speaker 16 (02:24:55):
So it's kind of a controversial book, but I'm just
saying it in respect because I don't I want to
try to be the arbiter of everything that I collect.
I like to just be like, Okay, this guy is
where I got it from, because I believe in that
type of honor.

Speaker 15 (02:25:09):
So the Tree of life and the Tree of.

Speaker 16 (02:25:14):
Knowledge, the Tree of knowledge is through his first book
and maybe even even a second which he references it
out of the Biblence and uses stuff out of the Bible,
pointing to the Tree life being the cardiovascular system and
the Tree of Knowledge being the nervous system. So looking

(02:25:36):
at those things through those lenses, I can see the
importance of this breath work. The first week of joining
the Shaolin Self Mastery course, that is what they taught me.
And the first day, the first week, the first thing
that they teach you is the right way to breathe,

(02:25:59):
and they teach you different methods, and it's all about
improving your cardiovascular system through your breathing.

Speaker 15 (02:26:06):
That's the number one thing.

Speaker 16 (02:26:08):
And after about six months of long walks over three
miles and breath work at the beginning of an end
of every day, I was finally able to get to
a point to where I wasn't thinking about anything, which
is like one of the biggest vices because we're always like, oh,

(02:26:28):
I don't have time to practice breath work, and then
you're thinking about things all the time when you do that.
So you got to be able to let go and
go into the unknown of just feeling yourself. It's very
much about developing the feeling, and that's the heart. The
heart is the center of all feeling. The lower feelings
would be like your desires for things like food and drug, stimulants, pleasures,

(02:26:54):
and then the higher things would be like the knowledge, intuition, wisdom,
and love is the base of those things. So keeping
us higher dimensional by focusing and developing us higher dimensionally
and staying away from the lower dimensional things. So that's
very much you're going to lose friends practicing this if

(02:27:16):
you just heard of it, If you just heard of it,
you're very much going to probably lose a couple of
friends because they're.

Speaker 15 (02:27:22):
Going to be like, you mean, you're not going to
do this anymore. You just want to learn and grow.

Speaker 2 (02:27:26):
I see you're not going to come play pool with
us and smoke cigars and drink beer. And that's you're like, no,
that's not the best for me. Yeah, that makes sense.

Speaker 15 (02:27:33):
I want to go barefoot in the sand and practice
breathing or whatever.

Speaker 2 (02:27:38):
That makes sense. That makes sense. But here's the thing though,
regarding that, it's interesting that you know when you're young,
and I'm not maligning you for being young, God bless
you get it, earn it, do the things have a
great life. I'm saying that when you're young, you think
that that's everything right, like for the most part, like, oh,
my friends, And then as you get older, I'm an

(02:27:58):
old guy, look at all the gray hair, You're like, well,
that kind of seemed o rated a little bit like
who cares what Jimmy from the block thought like? And
and why did I want to do that crap with
Jimmy anyway? He was a jerk. It just becomes, you know,
sort of sort of a a clarity space, I guess.
But but look as part of it. So the reason
I brought it up is not to crap on our
old friends or who used to be friends, is to say,

(02:28:20):
look at all the friends we've made along the way
as part of this. You and I would have never
met if you weren't doing the thing and I wasn't
doing the thing right. And so there's a yeah, there's
always a light silver lining. I guess.

Speaker 16 (02:28:34):
Yeah, I really wanted to keep forgetting to bring this up.
The whole purpose of why I brought up the breathing
was because I wanted to share what I really felt
like I got out of it. Was I got to
the point where I could go over thirty seconds filling
up the belly, and I noticed, after failing over and
over again filling up the belly the right way, I

(02:28:57):
was like raising my belly before I was breathe into it.
I wasn't just letting the airflow into there. I still
do that, and it's always just let go, let it
fill in slowly. If you think about like anything besides that,
just linking your mind to a feeling, that's the best

(02:29:20):
way to explain it. Oh, where that air is in
your belly filling up, And once that happens, you're going
to get over thirty seconds of air going in there,
and it's going to be extremely relaxed. And then when
you get good at that, you can fill up the chest,
but only after the belly is full. And if you

(02:29:42):
skip that, you will not get the one minute. You
will not get past one minute, because you still can
put like thirty seconds another thirty seconds into the top
parts of your chest. And that's you got to practice
them individually. You're going to fail over and over again.
And if you can't accept that and be grateful for

(02:30:04):
failing over and over again and not let the mind
worm come up of Oh, I don't have time. If
you can manage your time enough to make a spot
in your schedule to do this, you should not be
thinking I don't have enough time, because you already manage
that time, you already put down in your schedule that
this is what I'm going to do. I made time

(02:30:25):
for it. And it's other things that come up in life.
And this is always the test of the discipline when
we have to like make new time for things when
other things take away time. But it's so worth it,
because I got my heart beat down to the point
to where I could hear it getting slower and slower

(02:30:47):
and slower, and it was like the best feeling I've
ever felt in my entire life. I really have a
completely different perception on air just from practicing that. I
never think of it the same whenever I'm at home
and I'm not outside very much, I know, I feel

(02:31:09):
so guilty, I feel so terrible. I'm like, because I
know the outside air, with all the senses and everything
it has in itself, develops your nervous system, by developing
your cardiovascular system. By improving your cardiovascular system, with just
training your breath, you improve everything else. It's the tree

(02:31:31):
of life. It literally brings more life to yourselves. So
you could have other things going on. You could be
eating really bad things or whatever. And that's why I
said the four quadrants of health, the stress management, movement
or movement, nutrition, sleep and recovery, and stress management are

(02:31:52):
the foundations of how you plan to improve your cardiovascular health.
Besides learning the right way to breathe, which is belly first,
chest top of the chest. You see them doing the
thing with the hands and yoga or chiegong or tai chie.
It's part your hands or you do when you're talking.
You move your hands. It's like controlling focus. So when

(02:32:14):
you use your tentacles your ten fingers and you put
them over areas and you just link your mind to
the breath. I don't want to say think about breathing
because then you're thinking too much already. You literally have
to practice and train to link your brain to your breath.

Speaker 1 (02:32:31):
You can do that.

Speaker 16 (02:32:32):
It just takes a lot of being okay with messing
up over twenty times. You're like, okay, I'll do ten
at the beginning and ten at the end of the
every do you start counting and then you count wrong,
and then you're like oh, I'm going to give up.

Speaker 15 (02:32:45):
Just don't give up.

Speaker 16 (02:32:46):
That's only two mistakes, masteries not getting started and not
going all the way. And I recommend this to anyone
that is going through any kind of stress especially It's
the best thing you could do is learn how to
breathe is an ultimate stress manager. I think for the
foundation of your health. I'm sleep and recovery stress management.

Speaker 2 (02:33:10):
I've been sleeping more, I've been resting more. And I'm
with you. And as as you said, and I've said
this previously to you, like I wear a one of
those heart rate monitor wristwatches now and because if you
haven't done it, find one, borrow one, whatever, and check
it out. And as you breathe properly, it's wild to

(02:33:31):
just watch your heart rate just go down, just go
down and down and down. Breathing properly. It's wild. And
we're not in the modern space. We're like running around,
we're like short breasts. It's like staccato breathing, like right,
like a panting like a dog. And we're not supposed
to breathe that way. Like our literal body is waiting
for us to breathe properly or not, and it can

(02:33:53):
contributes to the stress factor and all the rest of
this stuff. Yeah, absolutely, one hundred percent. It sounds like
you're selling something. Are you selling something?

Speaker 6 (02:33:59):
Are you?

Speaker 2 (02:34:00):
Or what are air?

Speaker 6 (02:34:03):
Air?

Speaker 16 (02:34:04):
So it's this air that is outside of our homes
with all the cleaning chemicals and deteriorating building supplies that
you're breathing in. Oh, also a warning. This should be
on every fricking car windows sticker, but it's not. And
it irritates me because I got to remind my mother
about this every time I see her, especially now because
I just had clawed. AI expand on how car companies

(02:34:28):
don't tell you anything about the chemicals that leak off
of your car's interiors when the sun's cooking your car.
You got the windows open, you go in there, you
close the door, you start it up. All that air
goes right through your lungs before it goes anywhere else.
And oh, that's like for mel to hide. And oh
my gosh, people.

Speaker 15 (02:34:48):
Are are gonna there.

Speaker 16 (02:34:50):
There's no doubt there has to be some kind of
respiratory pandemic coming soon because there's just too much lack
of accountability with all the stuff that's affect your respiratory system,
including the lack of movement and no accountability on what
they put inside of these cars interiors. And you start
it up, have all the windows up, and no one's

(02:35:11):
going to get in trouble when your lungs are totally
shot from breathing that in every single day. So give
your lungs the break, crack the door or something, let
it air out cold or whatever, just trying to get
the air out a little bit really hot, especially, that's
the worst when it's super hot and you can't. All
the air is trapped in there. You close the door

(02:35:32):
and you're like, oh, I'll be the cabin's air filter today.
I'll just breathe in all the plastic that's been lingering
in the air from the sun for however many hours
you've been at work.

Speaker 2 (02:35:42):
Yeah, I live in Vegas, so that's especially pertinent. When
you get in the car, you're like, wow, that smells
like Chinese plastic. And this car's fourteen years old. Oh yeah, yep, exactly.

Speaker 15 (02:35:52):
It gets worse as they age, too.

Speaker 16 (02:35:54):
Even when they're brand new, they still oh man, you
get a tasty out of different chemicals. At the beginning,
it's like a never ending the new class of different
chemicals exactly throughout the years. I mean at thirty years
most your plastic is going to be cracking. Wires are
gonna that's the half life for most plastic. I've done

(02:36:16):
research on that looking at new cars for years old
you old used cars too, because I like the classics.
That's one thing you want to keep in mind is
if it's over thirty years old, you're gonna be considering replacing,
like almost all the wires. So with all the new
cars and gadgets and stuff, the cars that are thirty
years old aren't going to be that common anymore because

(02:36:38):
it's just too too much money to fix.

Speaker 1 (02:36:41):
All that.

Speaker 2 (02:36:43):
Well said, all that fire stuff, brother, we got we
got calls to get to. We got more from James,
and we got Erica behind you.

Speaker 3 (02:36:49):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (02:36:50):
Look, this is this is important. Learn to breathe properly.
I promise you you will not regret it. Austin's working
on it. I'm working on it. Watch your hard re
when you do this, and your body will be happier
for it. And yes, yes, you caught us. You caught
Austin selling free air. If you're the best.

Speaker 15 (02:37:08):
Brother, Oh yeah, yeah, the checks in the mail for sure.

Speaker 2 (02:37:11):
Exactly exactly. Let me know.

Speaker 9 (02:37:13):
Thank you.

Speaker 2 (02:37:13):
I'll let you know when I catch it. You're the
best brother. Appreciate the call. That's a that's Austin and Michigan.
Good friend for a long time. And yeah, he's uh,
he's he's on the game. He's on the game. This
type of stuff, the subtle body stuff, is very important
and what do you know about it? And that's why
we talk about these ideas together because there's a ton
of stuff happening that we miss in the modern society. James, James,

(02:37:35):
all yours. We got to we'll stay up late. U
two things on staying up late on tonight. I get
to go in late tomorrow. So if yeah, so I'm
a no massive hurry here, but James, tell us your
thing and then uh no hurry, Eric's stay up play
with us as well. We'll go to Eric and then
we'll wrap this up. And if you got to think
to add, of course you get the final word.

Speaker 6 (02:37:56):
Yeah, great cost from everyone. So this does come up.
And it's funny because I never thought of this this
way before until the show tonight. So I'm going to
tell the experience and then I'll come on Tina after
real quick several years ago, about thirteen fourteen, something like that.
Years ago. Now I'm terrible of time remembering dates and

(02:38:18):
all that. But I fell asleep here in my living room.
At the time. I was sleeping on a very comfortable couch,
so I didn't mind. And it was it was late
it was either late night or early morning because it
was dark, and I fell asleep there and I started
to wake up. I felt like I woke up, and

(02:38:42):
I realized I was not on the couch anymore. I
was on this like a table bed kind of thing,
but it was all one solid, flat surface, which I
was not on that kind of the couch I had
was not solid and flat, and so I noticed that

(02:39:02):
right away and out in my eyes, and I could
see I was in the room with blue walls and
these white cabinets built into the walls with some kind
of electronics or computers in them, built into the walls,
and there were these three gray blurs human size, just

(02:39:22):
moving around me and this table. But that's all I
could see of them was blurs. But I realized I
could not move except for my eyes, and so at
first I was thinking, well, this is weird. I'm hoping
that this is just a dream, because it's really weird.

(02:39:44):
But I just could not move, and I could not
wake up or anything. And I tried to move and
I couldn't, and I heard my parents off to one
side saying that everything was going to be fine, but
they're their voices had no emotion in them. And I

(02:40:05):
was able to look over and I saw two more
of these gray blurs, so I got confirmation basically that
it was not my parents. And above me, all I
could see was light. I'm not sure if it was
one solid light for the ceiling or if it was
just so much light that that's all I was seeing.
But as I was seeing all this and trying to move,

(02:40:29):
there was something coming down from the ceiling and it
was like a robotic extension kind of arm, not a
human shaped arm, just to I guess you could almost
call it like a like a skeleton, like a skeleton
armor arm frame of arm. And it was coming down
toward me, and so I kept them trying to move,
and eventually and these gray blurs were moving around me.

(02:40:54):
I never sorry I felt them do anything around me.
They were just moving, and eventually this thing came down
and I saw there was a needle attached to the
end of this arm, and of course I started to
freak out a bit, because what is that for? And
it moved toward my head and eventually it came down

(02:41:18):
toward my left eye. Now I'm already legally blind, I
was born that way, so I was freaking out and
it touched my eye. It actually touched my left eye,
and I freaked out and everything went black, and I
came to back here at home on my couch, and

(02:41:42):
I don't know what that was. But after that is
when I started to have to notice that my eyes
were not the same as they were before that. And
I didn't put to connect these two things together myself.
Actually was friends of the show that I told him
about this year ago, and they asked about that, about

(02:42:03):
when I had this experience and when my eyes started
to change. But after that experience, I started getting eyes
strained and light sensitivity, which I never had before. And
ever since then, these things have been slowly increasing, and
then there are times where they flare up and I'm

(02:42:24):
just basically immobilized for a day or so. But the
odd thing about that experience and this topic tonight is
what I mentioned earlier where people have described abductions from
what appeared to be aliens, where they these people felt

(02:42:44):
like they were taken out of their body, but they
also still had physical sensations in a way of a
sort where they could they there was pain at times
and just different things they could feel their surroundings. And
I never thought about that until tonight because I my

(02:43:05):
mind just went to somehow I was physically transported to
this other place. But now I'm thinking about it, and
maybe I wasn't. Maybe it was some kind of outer
body experience, abduction crossover kind of thing there. So that's
why I wanted to mention that tonight.

Speaker 2 (02:43:21):
Yeah, it's a It's one of those ones that kind
of sticks for a lot of reasons, and not just
because some people a say, no, what's up? Why why
says suckubus encounter possibly, and certainly it fits into that
mold of that. You know, scientifically they would describe it
as sleep paralysis, right, sort of that aspect, and you
bring it back with you. But I don't, like I said,

(02:43:42):
you know me like I'm I'm willing to hear experience
or accounts and then think about them in the long
term and this isn't the first one. Like again, you know,
it's this is modern times. You're here with us talking
about it, and you've seen it, and so these are
the types of things where it's like, okay, so if
this is possible, we know James, who's who's gone through

(02:44:05):
something like this, very similar to like that fire in
the sky aspect of it. Not identical, of course, but similar.
And then it traces back in modern times to a
lot of different accounts I don't know. And that becomes
the thing is that you know you, as always, you guys,
believe what you want on how this fits. But I
believe James because I know James and he's an honest man,
and that's it. And to me, as usual, there are

(02:44:31):
well it's complicated. And I say that not because I
say that for brevity. I don't say that to ob
this gate. I say that for brevity because there's a
lot of things to talk about. But yeah, yeah, I
appreciate you sharing that, and it's it's horrible that you
went through that, and again sort of the pain in
your eyes and that happened as a part of it,
the needle and all this stuff, and then your vision

(02:44:51):
actually sort of taken a downturn after the fact. It's
like it's almost as if almost as if there's there
we suggest something to play here that we never ever considered,
and that's the point. That's the point. So yeah, thank
you for sharing that great stuff. Anything to ad. We're
going to go to Eric and then we'll wrap this up.

Speaker 6 (02:45:11):
Just that I don't really know what it was. You
know that will experience and I describe it as well,
and I always say this too with a lot of
my experiences, is that they seemed like an alien abduction.
It seemed like the stereotypical description of a ghost. And
I say that because again, I don't know what any

(02:45:32):
of this is. So I think it's important to point
out what it felt like and what it seemed like,
but also be aware that I could be wrong and
or it could be something completely different from what I
think it was. So yeah, looking forward to Eric's call.

Speaker 2 (02:45:47):
Yeah, as usual, And that's the thing. And don't forget
the another another among many other admirable things about James
is that he's willing to say, you know what, this
is what it felt like, this is what was my experience,
but I don't know. I don't know, So let's hear more,
let's get more data, let's suggest this or that, or
you know, maybe find some people who had similar experiences,

(02:46:08):
and then that's the whole point of this. And that's
where I'm at too with my mind, because I don't
really know, but per usual, right, we live in that
post truth world where everybody knows everything, and it's like
this is really that? I mean, is it really like that? Anyway?
I'd love to hear your thoughts as we continue trucking on.
Let's go to Eric Eric in Ohio. What's up my

(02:46:30):
manure on trouble minds? How are you? And go right ahead?
What's going on?

Speaker 9 (02:46:34):
Well?

Speaker 15 (02:46:35):
How is everyone there?

Speaker 2 (02:46:36):
No complaints out of me? Just doing that trouble mind stuff?

Speaker 3 (02:46:41):
Excellent?

Speaker 5 (02:46:42):
I was thinking that branch at the turn of the century,
the last century, not this last turn of the century,
but you know, going into the nineteen hundreds was a
pretty cool and hit place to be, a lot of
Renaissance things going on, people drinking a lot of absent,
which is pretty cool.

Speaker 6 (02:47:02):
And of course in.

Speaker 5 (02:47:05):
Eighteen ninety four, Debussy had wrote Raylude to an Afternoon
of a Vawn, which was brilliant based on a poem
as friend wrote and is actually the ancient DNA of
all cinematic music today, with the possible exception of John Williams.
And there was another French experimenter there, and he had

(02:47:29):
a pretty weird name, basically Hippolyte Barduke, and he was
the first person to take electrographs of hands and leaves,
which later in the mid fifties accumulated in the work

(02:47:50):
of what's the dude's name, Simeon Krillion, and in the
seventies became widely known as Krillion photography. And one of
the things about Krillian photography that was published like pretty
early on was that you could take a leaf and

(02:48:12):
cut it and then take a photograph a Karelian photograph
of the leaf, and the outline of the leaf and
all of its vessels that Harry's nutrients from the leaf
down into the plant were all still visible with the
Korellian photography even though they had been physically cut off.

(02:48:35):
So it just struck me as bearing on the question
about you know, having limbs severed.

Speaker 2 (02:48:43):
And still be able to.

Speaker 3 (02:48:50):
Them, and you do when you do this, Okay, you're.

Speaker 2 (02:48:58):
Going to robody, You're going roby for hang tight, just
a minute. Let's let let the internet choppy waves do
its thing. And yeah, I've seen that. So if you
you trim out part of the leaf and then still
to do this photography, it still is projecting the part
that's removed from it, right, and so in that capacity
once again, so we're talking about nervous systems. We're talking

(02:49:18):
about sort of a metaphysical aspect to this, this ghost
botty network as I'm describing, well, this happening with leaves
that have fallen off of trees that are no longer
you know, quote alive or attached to their living systems.
I guess it depends on definitions. Try it and see
if you're less choppy. If you can hear me, yeah
it can. It's doing any better, way better, way better.

(02:49:39):
You just chopped out for a second. We got some
internet chops, but you're good to go. Welcome back to
the thing now.

Speaker 5 (02:49:45):
I was just saying, you know, it's just reminist having
limbs so that you still have the harder there in
your brain to run the lit We just don't have it.
But with robotic prosthetic that you still have that hardware
and your brain is fortunate because you can run those
pretty easily and quickly because it hasn't developed a way,

(02:50:07):
you know, much like memory. It like chemicals will eventually
create the physical hardware the synapses in your brain, and
they're they're going to be there for a while. But yeah, yeah,
like you were saying, with the leaf and other plants
and other people, all of these things still held energy

(02:50:29):
traces as if the you know, as if there was
a component an energy component to life. That form mattered
in terms of that energy or life, just like form
matters in terms of you put together the variaules of
the elements, how you put them together, mix the difference cases.

(02:50:53):
And it also harkens back to the ancients, the idea
that you were assole going to have a physical body
like another Christianity there, Christian Protestant truth is that say
you're going to have the body, and you're gonna be lost.

Speaker 2 (02:51:13):
A back, and I'll have a back or whatever, and
it be you know that.

Speaker 5 (02:51:21):
The fact that there's always the body carry with you,
the medical body, physical body runs down to the temper
were near and earlier you were talking about the Egyptians
and how that in terms of levels you're talking about Okay, hang.

Speaker 2 (02:51:43):
Tight once again, once again, we got some some chop
chop chop. You've been a rowbody and choppy. I'm not
sure if you can strike a pose or do a
dancer that prey to the internet gods or something, but yeah,
it's it's bad. Well I can hear you. We can,
we can follow the things you're saying that you sound
like a like like a deep throat in a robot
right now, it's not I'm sorry. Wait, way better, way better.

(02:52:03):
I don't know what you just did, but that is
way freaking better. Go ahead, sir, you know, just the ah.

Speaker 5 (02:52:11):
The most ancient word for magic is hikahika hka, and
it's an Egyptian word and it uses the cause basically,
when you use the force inside your body to affect
material things in the outside material world. And if you
do that, you're practicing hika. And that was the Egyptians

(02:52:32):
first and early word for magic. And they even had
a god called Hka that was represented in a statu
statue form anthropomorphic form with hands and arms coming out
of her head. And she was also a goddess of
medicine and a lot of the magic was you know,

(02:52:53):
poultice is and that sort of thing. Herbs and holistic
in that time, so she was a magical god of medicine.
But yet that's where the first magic term was coined,
was from the Egyptians using the car outside to affect things.

Speaker 6 (02:53:12):
I love it.

Speaker 2 (02:53:13):
I love that you're an academic, a reformed academic that
has become a full troubled mind. Lots of ways to
look at the world outside of the academic space. But
as always, wisdom is knowledge, and so it doesn't matter.
As I've always said, it doesn't matter where you get it.
Learn some things, do some things, and don't count anything
out because some of the sources you deem most likely

(02:53:36):
personally may be the most fulfilling. And so who really knows?
A fire stuff? Brother, appreciate the call.

Speaker 5 (02:53:41):
What else I got, Well, then that's all good. I
just wanted to bring up those points. I'll drop a
link on Curlyan photography in the A or in the
show chat.

Speaker 2 (02:53:54):
Thank you for that, appreciate it very much. Thanks for
staying and play with us, Thanks for considering these wild ideas,
and thanks for being you. Always a pleasure my man.
Thanks sure have a great eight You know what me
love him. That's Eric in Ohio. Go check out his
music again Hammersmith Music. You can find that of course
at troubledminds dot org for inside Friends, where you can
find most of our friends. Shout out to dragon Rose.

(02:54:16):
Congratulations on the latch today. I'm sorry about that. I
still haven't got the stuff up. I'm having problems with
my old hard drives because I don't have enclosures to
put him in. I don't have like a anyway, I'm
not gonna board you with the details, but I have
to order some stuff to get all the stuff. But anyway,
I'll get you up on the thing because I can't
get back into my website because I'm a moron. But anyway,
shout out dragon Rose, which will be on the list here,

(02:54:36):
and also follow Eric. Thanks for the great call and
as always, and you know what to do. Troubleminds dot
org fortside Friends go to right there. I'm gonna click it,
it's gonna highlight it. It's alphabetical follow Eric Hammersmith Music
and you can find not just the work he's doing there,
but he's got a link tree and as he adds
additional projects. I hope he continues working on some stuff

(02:54:57):
because he's a very smart guy. As you can tell,
and very again sort of academic, but he's always been
a troubled mind. He didn't turn troubled minds. But I
think there's a lot of information that plays into these
spaces that are relevant. And looking forward to whatever Eric
comes up with next, and of course Dragon Ros and
all the rest of you guys. You guys are the best.

(02:55:17):
Thanks for being part of this, Thanks for caring about
the conversations. Thanks for putting in with my garbage, because
I'm you know, I wouldn't call myself garbage in particular,
but I would say sometimes I'm a sloppy mess. James,
anything to add, Let's get out here, and don't you
dare insult me.

Speaker 6 (02:55:32):
No, you're not garbage, You're something.

Speaker 2 (02:55:34):
But all right, thanks, that's nice, that's nice.

Speaker 6 (02:55:38):
See how I did that there? I didn't insult you.
I just you know, I'll take I'll take great calls
from everyone Eric and Austin and everyone tonight. That the
idea of the leaf is fascinating, That the aspect of it,
the image of it appearing almost a whole even though
it had been broken. It makes me wonder, and you

(02:55:59):
know what, this maybe something to leave off with too,
I wonder if in those cases where let's say, the
unfortunate happens and someone does lose a limb, I'm really
curious if you were to get all kinds of energy
detection devices and put them near the space where that

(02:56:22):
limb would be, would they pick up anything. I'm honestly,
actually really curious about that, if they would find anything
or not.

Speaker 2 (02:56:33):
I wonder. I wonder That's, like I said, it's a
good place to kind of pick up and think about
these things as we continue down the road of wondering
why sometimes it's easy, but why sometimes it's not so easy,
Because personally, I think there's a lot of a lot
of things out there in the world that are not
as easily quantified and categorizable as you might expect. And

(02:56:58):
fire stuff. James, appreciate you for staying up late and
being patient and the glue of the show and all
the things. You know him. You love him. James Salcito,
the paranormal expert of Trouble Minds. Please go give him
a follow in all the places. Salcito paranormal dot com
is the best way to do it.

Speaker 9 (02:57:11):
S A L.

Speaker 2 (02:57:12):
S I d O paranormal dot com. It's a fantastic website,
super sexy. I go check out all his books and
his podcast and is a discord and all the things.
James are the best. Appreciate you, stay up Layton to
be just being you. I appreciate you so much you
can't put into words, but I'm trying to do my best.
Go follow James pretty please.

Speaker 6 (02:57:32):
No, just always glad to be here and talk about
whatever I can or whatever I I feel like I
might have to leaves hand to it. So thank you again,
and thanks everyone for listening.

Speaker 2 (02:57:42):
In ay Man, brother, you are the best. You know
what to do if you want to help us, help
our friends. There's a big list of friends. Like I said,
if you should be on that list, you should be.
This is an en list, not an outlist. And if
I dawdle on it and don't add you quickly, I'm
sorry about that. Like I said, there are some tech
issues sometimes, and like Rumble, I'm not kidding you. I've

(02:58:03):
tried to add Hiker and Sweets to the rumble Bob
list for a few times now, and for some reason
it's not working. So the process has changed and I
can't figure it out, or it's errors or something happening.
But anyway, actually wait, I thought just came to mind. Anyway.

Speaker 1 (02:58:22):
The point is.

Speaker 2 (02:58:24):
Everything's not as as it seems sometimes, so I don't
take everything personally, by the way, But if you want
to help trouble Minds, help our friends, Troubleminds dot forward
sized friends. If you feel like you want to help us,
and you've got a few minutes this week, scroll down
that list and go make some accounts in some places
you don't have them, and follow these people. Go check
out their music, Go check out the books they've written,

(02:58:44):
Go check out the all of the things they're working on.
Because let me tell you what, Like I said, this
is not about me. This is about us. And that's
the thing that that's what makes us magical. By the way,
is there's like you want me to ego play and
you want me to you know, kind of stomp faces
and climb to the top and reach out to all
the topist influencers. I could do that. I could do that,

(02:59:08):
But why, like I came here to do this, because
this is not what anybody else does, right, Why are
you here? Not a judgment, just a question, And so
that's it. If you want to help us, help our
friends trouble mindstart up for such friends. If you want
to help us in the greater context of the conversation,

(02:59:31):
spread the word. Let people know what conversation is happening.
But we're not going to tell you to vote for
We're not going to use their narratives. We're not going
to talk about lefty righty politics. We're not going to
talk about any of this nonsense because let me tell
you what, so much of that is nonsense. I don't
see it, I don't get it. I think it's all
been manufactured to make us hate each other. And I

(02:59:55):
hate that notion. So let's do something else there. We
are dulations to Gordo if he's still there, our new
mod over there on Rumble what I get it figured out?
Because of course they said we need a male mod
over here to tamp down some of the estrogen. Okay,
all right, as you wish, as you wish, if you

(03:00:19):
want to help us directly. And again, like I said,
there are costs of the show, all the AI stuff
I use you name it, paying for the website, all
the things Troubledfans dot com. You can find not Michael
Strange at hot tub. You can find the hottest troubled minds.
Merch around and yeah, buy some stuff over there. Go
go buy a hat, Go buy a shirt. There's a

(03:00:41):
really sweet shirt with like a it's called Dimensional Influencer.
It's my favorite. Go check that out. Some hats and
some stuff and anyway, that's how you help us, or
of course a tip or a sub up on Rumble.
Appreciate you guys very much. As we finish, it goes
exactly like this. Be sure, be strong, be true. Thank

(03:01:06):
you for listening from our troubled minds to yours. Have
a great night.
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