The Palomar Anomalies - When the Stars Shouldn't Vanish - Troubled Minds Radio

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
I didn't demo our advisual.

Speaker 2 (00:02):
Intelligence, which the end of that you don't and Grace, it's.

Speaker 1 (00:07):
A fine objective.

Speaker 3 (00:08):
We don't know what it is.

Speaker 1 (00:09):
I would hope somebody is checking it out.

Speaker 4 (00:12):
I don't know, but whether the luck it or whatever.

Speaker 5 (00:14):
But I can to be five, you know, all go
to do.

Speaker 2 (00:16):
I shall probe.

Speaker 5 (00:18):
Okay, I'm glad the Pentagon Fou is an opposing threat.

Speaker 1 (00:23):
I want them on top of the well.

Speaker 2 (00:26):
The craft generates its own gravitational field. Can to hinder
light to guy. The internet has to come, the the
met send them the criminal senters to let it happen.
You know. That's that's what we're expected to sell.

Speaker 4 (00:47):
Rosser Area fifty one, Aby and Captain deep under the ground.

Speaker 6 (01:07):
The media.

Speaker 1 (01:10):
That does not happen.

Speaker 7 (01:10):
That's interesting, the.

Speaker 3 (01:18):
Self serving.

Speaker 7 (01:22):
You're here.

Speaker 3 (01:24):
Flow reason.

Speaker 1 (01:30):
You're listening into trumble Mines radio broadcasting life from the
sleeper bunker just off the Extraterrestrial Highway somewhere in the

(01:52):
desert sands outside of Las Vegas, from somewhere in space
time loosely labeled Generation X on planet Earth and asking

(02:14):
questions of you in earnest into the digital MS. Well,
good evening and Welcome to Troubled Minds Radio. I'm your host,
Michael Strange. We're streaming on YouTube, rumble x, Twitch and Kick.

(02:35):
We are broadcasting live on the Troubled Minds Radio Network.
That's KUAP Digital Broadcasting in eighty eight point four FM Auckland,
New Zealand. Tonight, we got a doozy for you. We've
been following this one for a few years now, and
there seems to be the plot thickens this whole the
acceleration quickening we always talk about. In this particular case,

(02:58):
things seem to be as if reality is out of alignments.
If you guys remember this old story. There was an
old uh going back a couple of years about the
Palomar anomalies, which was an old observatory where they kind
of did this, uh, these sky surveys and as they
went back and we're kind of looking at these with
new eyes, fresh eyes and new equipment, of course, because

(03:20):
in the fifties we were using you know, less than
less than high tech stuff, of course. And so the
odd part is that these as we went back and
looked at some of these old sky surveys from the Palm,
the Palomar observatories and the sky survey itself that a
lot of these stars that they imaged back then are
now gone. They've literally vanished based on what we can

(03:41):
see with the naked eye and also what we can
see through modern sky surveys, which is an incredible thing
to consider right off the bat, and we've talked about
in the past a few different ways. It fit into
that that what was that show from Netflix, the Three
Body Problem That kind of fit into that a little bit.
If you've remember that spoilers on there, they had the
stars blinking out, and you know, that's just sci fi.

(04:04):
But in this particular case, if you read the write
up tonight, it's very good and it's very detailed, and
it kind of goes into the many different sort of
aspects of this. And I'll get into this in just
a second, but as usual, look, these are just ideas.
This is based on a pre print paper that is
yet to be peer reviewed, and it is done by
an individual and her team by the name of Beatrice

(04:25):
Villa Reale a Villa Roel. Sorry about that, And the
links are going to be in the description down below.
They're already there. If you guys want to read up
on this stuff. And the entire paper is there as well,
which is incredible because it's literally going back over those
old the Palomar Sky Survey and finding where these stars
have literally vanished. And we've talked about this, like I said,

(04:46):
quite a lot in the past, but now suddenly we've
got a you know, actual scientist, a team of scientists
going through with a fine tooth comb and trying to
figure out what the hell happened and why exactly we're
dealing with these these anomalies today. It doesn't make any
damn sense because you would expect if we're dealing with technology,
old technology, that we would see new stars with the

(05:08):
new technology, and not disappearing ones that were very clear,
very obvious back in the nineteen fifties. Now again so
that this is a published on ResearchGate dot nets and
the name of the paper is aligned multiple transient events
in the first Palomar Sky Survey. And that really becomes
the point of this because, like I said, it gets
spooky because as we know it, stars don't just disappear, Okay,

(05:31):
they explode, they go supernova, they collapse into black holes.
There's all manner of things that we know as far
as modern actual cosmology goes that fits into this, but
stars just vanishing entirely is really doesn't fit that mold.
And there there were a couple of articles in the
past that kind of touched on this a little bit.
Here's one of them that goes back a little bit,

(05:52):
back to May of twenty twenty four. Headline is this,
hundreds of huge stars disappear from the sky. We may
finally know why. And one of the things here is
that they're talking about a collapse of a like a
total collapse of the star itself. Okay, but still that
doesn't explain why hundreds of these things have just gone missing,
which again is very weird. And this article is listed

(06:13):
down below, and do check that out. If you're into
the science of this, I do recommend you read the paper.
Like I said that, this is way smarter than met
It actually has some images here, it's got math. If
you guys are into math, I'm not, obviously, or else
I'd be going through this and kind of helping you
understand it a little bit better. But instead we're going

(06:33):
to talk about the possibilities here and what the hell
do you think is going on with these actual missing stars?
Because clearly, like I said, it's the inversion effect here
of new technology should be able to find more stars,
not lose them. And well, here we are in twenty
twenty five, matching these sky surveys with modern equipment and
realizing we're missing dozens or hundreds or more of actual

(06:56):
stars that have been cataloged in the past, which doesn't
make any damn sense. And so yeah, that's where we start.
Now here's the weird part about this. Let me make
sure I go owe my stuff lined up, and there's
so much, so much to this that it's really dense,
and it's good to read the other rite up as well. Actually,
I'm going to just read the right up. That's the
best way to do this, because I went and spent
the time to lay this out properly, so I may

(07:17):
as well read it. So here we go. In the
archives of the Palamore Observatory, among thousands of glass photographic
plates from the nineteen fifties lie images that challenge our
understanding of what should and shouldn't be possible. These photographs,
taken before humanity launched its first satellite, before we cluttered
Earth's orbit with our machines, capture something that that defies
easy explanation. Points of light that appear and vanish within minutes,

(07:41):
sometimes arranged in perfect alignment, like pearls on an invisible string.
Doctor Beatrice Villa Roel and her team didn't set out
to find evidence for height of high strangeness. They were
conducting a systematic survey through the Vasco project, which is
vanishing in appearing sources during a century of observations, which
we've talked about in the past quite a lot, and

(08:02):
they were comparing old astronomical photographs with modern sky surveys.
What they found instead was a pattern of anomalies that
refuses to fit neatly into any category of known phenomena.
This is where things get weird. The numbers tell the
stark story. Out of over one hundred thousand transient events
identified in the first Palamar Sky survey, some show statistical
significance levels that demand attention. One particular alignment of multiple

(08:26):
transients carries a three point nine sigma significance, a level
that in particle physics would herald the possible discovery of
something new. But perhaps more unsettling than the statistics is
the timing. This is where this kind of comes together
in a weird synchronistic space. In this particular event occurred
on July nineteenth, nineteen fifty two, the same night that

(08:48):
radar operators and pilots reported unexplained objects maneuvering over Washington, DC,
and that goes back to this. This is also linked
in the description. It is known as the nineteen fifty
two Washington DCUFO and or the Washington Flap. We've talked
about this in the past quite a lot in different ways.
In this particular case we get into high strangeness, which

(09:08):
this article gets into after that, which we'll catch up
to in a second here, which interestingly enough, high strangeness
was a term coined by none no no than Jay
Allen Heinik, the astronomer and UFO researcher and notable for
Project Bluebook and all the work he did with UFOs
in the scientific realm. Anyway, So as of this, like

(09:29):
I said, we're talking, we're theory crafting tonight. We're looking
at some of the science on this, We're looking at
some of the explanations, some of them maybe space dust.
I mean, there's a ton of things that this could be.
So it doesn't have to be weird plasma orbs in
the sky, but it could be all right. Once again,
things are so strange sometimes that even they defy not
just the obvious explanation, but maybe even defy some of

(09:52):
the more bizarre explanations as well. So remember all of
his claims apply as part of these conversations. We're theory crafting,
we're talking about the ideas. All it should go to
Beatrice and her team links from the description, Please go
follow them in all the appropriate places. Like I said,
if we're not doing science on this stuff and actually
trying to find out what the hell it is, what
are we doing? Okay, I'm not a scientist, so I'm
not going to kind of be the one doing this.

(10:14):
So props to the team for kind of asking some
of these hard questions that we don't really know a
lot about. And that's that all ideas are not truth
tonight or any night. We're just here kicking the cosmic
soccer ball around, as I like to say, and so
we are taking your call. So if you want to
be part of the conversation at seven oh two nine

(10:35):
one zero three seven, you click the discord link at
troubleminds dot org and we'll talk to you guys, tonight
about this, But what are your theories? And remember, no truth,
just possibilities ideas. What do you know about this? Have
you read the paper? Have you heard of this? And
what do you expect the peer review process to bring
as part of this larger conversation? Peer are back more
trouble minds coming up in exactly one minute. Don't go anywhere.

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Welcome back to Troubled Mind. So I'm Michael Strange. Let
us continue, shall we? Okay, So, now there's a lot
of a lot of theories that go along with this,
but I want to point out some of the specific dates.
They are in the paper here, and so this goes
all the way back to the fifties, all right again,

(12:24):
So not just let's say the nineteen fifty two UFO flap,
which is an interesting thing, but this is all pre Sputnik.
And if you guys remember Sputnik, it was the first
satellite that was launched into space, the first human actual
well from what we're told, right, because who knows what
they actually do tell us, and so you take that
wherever you like. But Sputnik in again, it was launched,

(12:47):
it entered a low elliptical Earth orbit on October fourth,
nineteen fifty seven. Okay, So this UFO flap was nineteen
fifty two, and right smack dab in the middle of
this star survey, which is again at the nip the
Palamoor Star survey. So again were like five years away
from the first actual man made satellite launch, and all

(13:09):
of this stuff. Again, when you look at the dates
and some of the coincidences as they line up with
that UFO flap from nineteen fifty two in Washington, DC,
it really kind of arkens at this bizarre space of well,
we barely had jets, we didn't have satellites, and yet
we have all these damn lights in the sky that
are as of now unquantifiable, as if they just vanished entirely.

(13:33):
That's weird, and not just that some of them statistically significant.
It seems like they wouldn't be just some sort of
poorly let's say, some misidentification, okay, and which is always
a possibility as part of this. But as you look
at the paper and go through some of this stuff
and a lot of the things they've been talking about
with this regard on Twitter or x and some other places,

(13:57):
it seems like this is not the case. Because they
of course they they considered that as one of the
first parts of this, and this is why this keeps
gaining traction and oxygen and sort of the larger, you know,
bizarre world spaces of conversation like we do is because
it's not easily categorized and it's not easily written off
by just some misidentification of some spots on the glass, right,

(14:18):
It's not like that at all, and so that becomes
the weird part. So as part of the conversation, of course,
I'd love to hear your thoughts on this. What do
you think this is? What do you know about it?
And what do you expect a peer review process to
bring as part of this and do you think that
as usual reality is far more odd than we ever
give it credit? For love to hear your thoughts. Seven
oh two nine five seven one zero three seven. You

(14:39):
can click the discord link at Troubledminds dot org. We'll
put you on the show. Let's go to James first.
So James first, we got the Robert next, and there
you go. That's the pecking order as we start, because
first in and we'll talk to you first, and then
if you want to put your hand up, get in line.
You're definitely welcome to James in Michigan, Selcia to Paraorma.
What's our brother? You're on Trouble Minds. How are you sir?

Speaker 7 (14:56):
Go right ahead, I'm okay, I'm just hoping that the
technology works for me this time.

Speaker 1 (15:01):
Loud and clear. So far, so good, cross your fingers.

Speaker 7 (15:03):
Okay, yeah, seriously, Yeah, this is a great topic.

Speaker 8 (15:08):
I would like to sit in but and then just
talk when there's time and between calls if possible. But
I do think that's amazing that the study is being done.
If you think about all the weird things that happen
here on this planet that we can't easily explain. To me,
it's always made sense that there's going to be things
out there in space that also we can't easily explain.

(15:30):
So I love that there's this this study being done
on these these images and these glass plates and not
like it's digital, not like you can manipulate it to
find out or figure out trying to figure out what's
going on with these disappearing and appearing and lights or
stars or.

Speaker 7 (15:46):
Whatever they may be.

Speaker 1 (15:48):
Yeah, it is. It is a weird one, and it
is you know, like you know, us on this show,
we like to get super weird with possibilities and ideas
and the rest of that stuff. But as more of
this starts coming out and know kind of cementing this
down as well, this is these are real anomalies. This
is not just some misidentification of as you're saying, technology,
I don't know. I don't know what to think, because again,
space dust really doesn't describe vanishing stars. I mean, and

(16:11):
think about it here. I didn't I didn't land this properly.
But this is the spookiest part about it. Think about
it this way. In the paper, they're actually describing these
as possibly objects that are sort of glinting reflecting light. Okay,
but once again, this is pre human satellite. And so
if that's the case, and these are actually like objects

(16:31):
out there like UFOs or something to that degree, or
you know, dare we murmur the breakaway civilization? Or were
we really in space quite a bit sooner than we
thought we were? Like, there's a lot of this kind
of these larger questions that come into this space and
make you scratch your chin and go, what the hell
is happening? And that's the bizarre part because if you
go back to what Charles Ford said. I know you're

(16:52):
a big fan of Charles Fort, the godfather of the paranormal,
He said something to the effect of that we're a zoo,
We're like creatures in a zoo, and we're being sort
of watched over by these these other entities. And how
else would you do it other than kind of plant
these these I don't know, pre satellite satellites in the sky.

(17:12):
And I mean ancient astronaut theorists say yes, am I right?

Speaker 3 (17:17):
Yeah?

Speaker 7 (17:17):
And I mean I'm not sure if this is something
that they cover in the paper and that.

Speaker 8 (17:21):
But the thing that I always wonder too with this
is not only reflections, but when these lights vanish, is
there some object that is even bigger than the star
going by that is also still dark, that is just
hiding the star for again minutes and then goes away

(17:44):
and then the.

Speaker 3 (17:44):
Light comes back again.

Speaker 8 (17:46):
Or are there objects that are big enough to hide
stars for who knows how long, for days or hour
hours or days or weeks or whatever.

Speaker 7 (17:55):
And then that's that's really amazing to think about that.

Speaker 8 (17:59):
What could be that big, moving that fast in relation
to everything else that is still blocking out a star?

Speaker 2 (18:07):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (18:07):
Exactly. And here's here's her follow up. She so, she
tweeted this on July twenty seven. This is Beatrice villarel
Villa role. Can I say it properly? And so this
is what she tweeted and linked the paper, She said,
this is a preprint of a paper now under review.
We first tried in twenty twenty two, but it was
too early for the journals. Years later, with better methods,
we gave it another go. The key question has been

(18:29):
are the transience real or plate defects as we just
described there, She says, well, there seems to be a
clear deficit of transience in the Earth's shadow, if correct,
That demonstrates their highly reflective objects with flat surfaces, think
mirrors or glass, and transients are sunlight glints, and it
seems there may be a few more of them than

(18:49):
we initially thought. So that's that's where I first saw this,
and she posted this is getting a ton of traction
on X, as it should. And so imagine that actual
glinting years out there that are now no longer there.
I mean, suddenly options become plentiful, Like what the hell's
going on?

Speaker 7 (19:09):
James.

Speaker 8 (19:11):
Yeah, if you think of mirrors, and you think of
something that's almost like class, what also has not only mirrors,
but what also has glass cameras in a lot of cases,
or at least something reflective, something to take in the light.
So again, I mean, how many places are are are
we and the rest of maybe our solar system or whatever?

(19:35):
How how many directions are we being watched from? Or
where we being watched from? And have they moved on
or are they still there?

Speaker 1 (19:41):
Yeah, and so this also brings to mind that idea
of the zoo hypothesis to kind of back in that
sort of Fort Charles fort Vane, that we're being watched
or where zoo animals or something to that effect cosmically,
And so how would they watch us? This would be
a way, right, and maybe they they sort of just
vanished all those out of the sky because I realized, Oh, oops,
they're you know, kind of moving into the space age

(20:01):
are about to launch a satellite. They've got jet technology. Now,
like who knows, Like this is the type of like
human thinking that kind of goes into this into a
cosmic space, but who really knows? And like I said,
it's spooky enough to make you go, okay, so what's
going on? And I think she said to Beatrice said
this again on a Twitter X shout out Joe UFO
Joe also who actually transcribed with chet GBT an article

(20:25):
that she was part of here. But I think she
said something to the effect of that. Once she started
to verify this information that it wasn't just simple misidentifications
and some of these other things that you would expect
it to be. That she was kind of giddy, but
then also kind of sick to her stomach because it
meant like the implications were massive depending on what these
things could actually be.

Speaker 8 (20:47):
Yeah, and even just with the fort analogy, it makes
me think of how there are things he was talking about,
were falls of objects, falls of stones or rocks, or
biological actually parts or entire small animals and stones, and
I'm just thinking far enough back that would be anomalous.

(21:11):
And if you look at stones and meteors and asteroids
and all that. Now we know that things can fall
from the sky, So what if we do know that
all those falls have basically slowed down now since then?

Speaker 7 (21:25):
But what else are they doing now?

Speaker 8 (21:27):
If there's other beings out there, then are they doing
anything else out there? Or have they moved more into
purely an observational phase or not, yeah.

Speaker 1 (21:37):
Or kind of cloak themselves. Maybe maybe they're still there
and we just can't see them with our again digital
technology versus analog technology. As they were kind of putting
these on glass plates at the time. I mean, there's
a lot of information here that kind of is super
mind boggling. And as part of it, do you think
that there's some significance to that UFO flap of nineteen

(21:57):
fifty two, that this was occurring at the same time
they were actually taking this data from the sky. I mean,
it's this seems like a you know, you follow just
wet dream in that regard that damn, I'll look at
all this coming together in this massive synchronicity of not
just kind of verifying that event, but also having it
as as a larger sky survey as part of it.
I don't know what's your take on that, that idea

(22:19):
that it's happening all at the same time.

Speaker 8 (22:22):
Well, especially when you look at okay, in the fact
that there was was the UFO flap going on at
that time? Is there's There's been many over the years,
but not a lot as far as I know. Someone
maybe out there can correct me if I'm wrong. Not
a ton of them have gone over DC have and

(22:43):
they haven't only gone over in Washington, DC all that
much from what I've heard. I think, again, I could
be wrong, but if that was let's say the only one.
Then the timing is amazing, it's it's it seems a
lot more than a coincidence to me anyway.

Speaker 1 (22:57):
Yeah, which again really kind of makes us not just
a sort of a scientific oddity, but also now sort
of a synchronistic event where maybe this stuff is related
in the larger context of the conversation. So I don't know.
As usual, look, you guys know me, I don't have answers.
I'm not the answers guy. I don't show up and
tell you what to think. Or let's just open it

(23:18):
up and consider all the possibilities here, because who knows
what's happening. And as usual, look, think we can run
the entire gamut of these ideas, including you know, some
misidentification stuff, the space dust, you know, maybe these vanishing
stars of collapse stars. I mean, there's some of that
stuff that might be able to explain some of these things.
But again, when they're able to identify more and more

(23:38):
of them and start to really kind of line this
up and go, wait a minute, there was something to
this now and what comes next, I don't know, what
do you guys think regarding this and how weird does
it get? James final thought that we got about thirty
seconds left and then you're welcome to the said of course,
and now we'll get back to you in just a moment.

Speaker 7 (23:54):
Yeah, happiness, And just.

Speaker 8 (23:55):
One of the things we've all talked before about, how
there have been you foes seeing going in and out
of the sun. If that can happen with all the
stars out there, then how do we know that there
aren't stars that are being created and then shut down
somehow destroyed, somehow send somewhere us somehow to close those

(24:16):
portals if they.

Speaker 7 (24:17):
Are some kind of portal in a way.

Speaker 1 (24:20):
Yeah, very well said. Again, opening it up to some
ideas to start here, no idea other than possibilities. What
do you guys think is going on? How weird is this?
And do you think that maybe we're on the cusp
of actually finding out something more bizarre than we ever dreamed?
Seven O two one zero three seven. That's seven two
nine one zero three seven. You can click the discord

(24:42):
link of Trouble Minds Bottle. We'll put you on the show.
It's easy as that you're right back. More from James.
We got the Robert coming up and your calls as well.
What do you know about the curious case of the
Disappearing stars. This is Trouble Minds on Michael Strange, be
all right back.

Speaker 6 (25:00):
M starts to shine down to the cur in the
night we go in and now both such a sight
to dream me.

Speaker 9 (25:21):
Of above the close soul bride bright wave to the
universe feeling just trying to dream me night kill and you.

Speaker 10 (25:35):
May see sad starts at starts worst.

Speaker 11 (25:47):
Galaxies, Gali, person like dream cosmic commonly gay, the change
screens so serene, closer to the edge, flying high high
kiss so serene, field cost night.

Speaker 10 (26:07):
Words real thrill you pacy, sir. It starts with this, starts.

Speaker 1 (26:22):
The words.

Speaker 11 (26:39):
Close your eyes, let the starlight, the going through the
cosmos both villain.

Speaker 6 (26:45):
Andy in the small man must.

Speaker 9 (26:48):
Say nothing compared to lost and magic flowing through the end.

Speaker 12 (26:57):
Paco, Welcome back to Troubled Minds.

Speaker 1 (27:23):
I'm your host, Michael Strange. We're streaming on YouTube, rumble x,
Twitch and Kick. We are broadcasting live on the Troubled
Minds Radio Network. That's KUAP Digital Broadcasting and of course
eighty eight point four FM Auckland, New Zealand. Tonight, we're
taking your calls as we talk about the palomar anomalies
when the stars shouldn't vanish? How about this, what if

(27:43):
mysterious light? Mysterious lights captured on nineteen fifties astronomical photographs
are glitches in realities, code holographic projections from higher dimensions
plasma intelligence responding to nuclear tests. When professional astronomers document
objects that appear vanish in a line patterns before satellites existed,
we must ask are these explanations too wild? Where is

(28:07):
reality wilder than we imagine? And that's what's on my
mind tonight again thanks to the great work of Beatrice
and her team. I do encourage you guys to go
follow read the paper in full if you're in a
kind of of a science mind. If not, anyway, go
check it out for the pictures and stuff and some
of the other things. Like I said, scientific papers are
kind of a dense read if you're not super into
the math and stuff. But but do check it out.

(28:28):
Go give her a follow actually on a Twitter X.
I'm following her right now, And yeah, this is a
this is, like I said, shout out to the team
of scientists that are making let's say, have the audacity
to sort of ask these these level of questions that
seem outside of the normal realm of science. And so
a big, big fan here, because this is this is
what science is. It's we're supposed to ask these these

(28:51):
sort of daring questions and if there's data to back
it up, then let's consider it together. Great stuff. I
appreciate you, James. Anything to add real quick and we'll
go to the Roberts.

Speaker 8 (29:00):
Yeah, I just I think that should be done more,
and we should ask the questions and if there is
nothing then thing move on. But still at least ask
the questions anyway, not just us, but scientists as well.

Speaker 1 (29:12):
Exactly right, exactly right. It is easy for us too,
because you know, I get I get the ridicule anyway.
But beyond that, you know, a scientist kind of sticks
their neck out sometimes to ask some questions if they're
not supposed to ask. Love to hear your thoughts on this.
What do you what do you know about these vanishing stars?
And what about this new uh the new study seven
oh two nine seven one zero three seven Click the
discord link of Troupe of Mines dot Rug the Roberts.

(29:33):
Welcome to the joint How you doing, sir? Go right ahead, nothing.
If you want to a couple things, you could either
restart discord and try again, or if you want to
call back on the phone line, that'll work too.

Speaker 2 (29:44):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (29:44):
Live shows on live shows. Okay, I'm gonna read this
a little bit. If you just just talk, if you
if you cut in, I'll just I'll shut up and
it's all yours. Yeah, okay, So so back to this,
back to the right. No, this is very good. Like
I said, so. High strangeness as we left off, a
term coined by astronomer and UFO researcher Jay Allen Heinek,
describes events that possess such bizarre characteristics they resist conventional
explanation while simultaneously containing multiple layers of absurdity that prevent

(30:08):
easy dismissal as mere misidentification. As we were talking about
the Palomar transits embody this concept perfectly. They are documented
on scientific instruments, analyzed with rigorous methodology, yet they behave
in ways that shouldn't be possible. Consider that what we're
actually seeing star like points of lights captured on photographic
emotion during exposures lasting thirty to fifty minutes that weren't

(30:31):
there before and won't be there after. Natural astronomical objects
obviously don't behave in this way. The stars don't blink
in and out of existence, meteors leave trails, Satellites didn't
exist yet Aircraft would show movement across the long exposure.
Yet here they are frozen in time, defying categorization. Let's
go back to the Roberts. I think maybe we're good.

(30:53):
Not sure what happened if you had a thing and
then a thing and the Roberts and the Robert Pennsylvania.
You're in trouble. Mind how you doing, sir? Go right ahead,
try the phone line if you're you're into it? Sorry
about that? Nothing? Still nothing. We know discord works because
it was working for James, so there's a we can
we can rule that out so far working for games, yes,

(31:14):
they Hey, why are you going to jinx yourself?

Speaker 7 (31:19):
No, that's that's I think myself.

Speaker 1 (31:20):
Oh sorry, I said, now you're good.

Speaker 3 (31:22):
You're good.

Speaker 1 (31:23):
The Roberts. Nothing, I see that. There's like a camera
icon but no, yeah, unmute to okay, just just call
back on the phone line however you want to do that.
But okay, So back to this now, and that becomes
the bizarre part.

Speaker 2 (31:33):
Of this.

Speaker 1 (31:33):
Like I said, so long exposures lasting thirty to fifty
minutes is where they found these initially, And we're put
into these again, what are they? Photographic emulsion? So we're
talking about glass plates, and like I said, could there
be some sort of contamination effect?

Speaker 7 (31:48):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (31:48):
Maybe it could it be all these other things we
talked about, the space dust and some other things which
they took into account. I'm sure they're not just you know,
piping off kind of saying, oh, peer review my thing,
and it's ridiculous. So where does it get? It really
becomes a question the Roberts. The Roberts. Okay, I'd love
to hear you guys thoughts on this. Robert, give us
a call on the phone line and we'll get you

(32:09):
on the show. Sorry about all the issues there. I
don't know what's happening. But what can you do? You can't.
I can't. I can't magically wave the one and fiction
it anyway, So the alignment phenomenon adds another layer of impossibility.
Random cosmic race strikes on photographic plates should scatter randomly.
Thus particles or emulsion effects might create false stars, but
they wouldn't arrange themselves in geometric patterns or the bizarreness

(32:32):
of this. The researchers found multiple cases where transients appeared
in straight lines or narrow bands, a configuration that has
no ready explanation in conventional astronomy. And like I said,
this write up is very good. It kind of goes
through the entirety of what this is. And it's, like
I said, it's mind boggling. It's one of those things
that kind of makes you pause and go, wait, what
do we really know about the nature of reality itself?

(32:54):
We've got a nice framework, okay, the scientific method and
all those things, right, thousands of years of human observation. However, however,
why is this so bizarre in terms of what we're
seeing and what we know? Seems very different, doesn't it?
Seven two one zero three seven you click the discord
link at troubleminds dot org. Thank you for calling back
the Roberts. You're on trouble Minds. How are you, sir?

(33:16):
All years? Go right ahead?

Speaker 13 (33:18):
Oh, I'm fine, How are you?

Speaker 1 (33:21):
Oh? Pretty good? No complaints out of me. I'm just
hanging out and talking about wild ideas with my friends.
What you got, my man?

Speaker 13 (33:27):
Well, I think I might be able to actually add
somewhere albums to it. You know, there are planets for
that suns. And I'm thinking that maybe it's possible that
these sons that disappear, they disappear because some advanced civilization

(33:50):
whose own son is dying last though a son at
the another son and take it back to their solar system.

Speaker 1 (34:00):
Okay, all right, So so planets without suns, I like
it with the I guess how I guess how close
they would have to be would be could be maybe
a million light years or something, or you know what
I mean, something like that. Maybe they're not as close
as we think because it stills as a twinkle in
the night sky.

Speaker 13 (34:16):
Well, look at our own sign. There's no proof of
that that our own sun is native to the to
our solar system.

Speaker 1 (34:24):
Yeah. Maybe maybe maybe the Olds what tattooing something, the
two sons from Star Wars, maybe they had one that
kind of got kicked out a long time ago. I mean,
that's that's very possible, and it's probably happened, not just
possible here, but clearly elsewhere. It's happened for sure.

Speaker 13 (34:39):
Yeah, I'm thinking to myself, Uh, you know, in a
five billion years, when our sun is binding on its
last legs. Maybe our civilization has advanced enough that it could,
uh you know, trans overcome relativity and speed through the universe,
and and and and with some technology, uh, move another

(35:05):
sun into back into the sewer, into the steel system
three places. Then we have.

Speaker 2 (35:12):
Why not?

Speaker 1 (35:13):
All right? I like the wild idea. Uh do you
expect any kind of a scientific validation of this? What
do you think will happen during the peer review process
of this paper.

Speaker 13 (35:24):
I think that, uh, they're gonna, you know, they're going
to really have to reconsider that there was someone that
analomies I don't know how to say that word, that
you know, they might have gotten ah uh dots of

(35:45):
light from other things that were flying around, like airplanes things,
maybe not, and maybe even you know, I think that
the only thing that's that makes sense, like you said,
we have supernovas, we have red dwarfs, these things that

(36:05):
naturally occur to stars, all right, And your only explanation
I can come up with in my own way of thinking,
is that for stars to vanish like that.

Speaker 1 (36:21):
They have to have been moved, yeah, which which seems
the impossible part because we're talking about actual planetary level
or sized objects or greater stars in that regard, that
seems even more ridiculous because think about it, if they
were moving, let's say, firing across some random rogue stars
shooting across the cosmos, which supposedly does happen as part

(36:45):
of that scenario of a binary star system kind of
getting thrown out of whack and then one gets kicked
off into space. These things do happen out there in
the greater cosmos, so you would still see it on
the thirty to fifty minutes actual scan of this. And
that becomes the weird part because they were completely stationary
and then now they're completely gone, so we're dealing.

Speaker 7 (37:05):
With what seems to be magic here.

Speaker 2 (37:07):
Yeah.

Speaker 13 (37:07):
Good, Well, they were stationary in nineteen fifty, all right,
and that's what that's. That's the photographs that they're going by.
We're talking about what fifty fifty more years later, and
they're saying, we're those stars that's in those nineteen fifty

(37:30):
photographs or however they were taken. And the answer is
that they're not there anymore, and the question is what
happened to them. It doesn't rule out that they removed.

Speaker 1 (37:46):
Right, just that we can't see them now, which is
a little more.

Speaker 13 (37:49):
Spookery, right, but you know they may have been moved,
you know, a million light years, you know, beyond that.
We might be seeing with the web telescope. We might
be seeing stars that didn't exist there, and you know,
you know when it took when it didn't exist at

(38:11):
that particular place that removed from another place.

Speaker 1 (38:18):
Okay, I'm following you, which which again stands to reason
for a lot of a lot of different sort of
angles here. But one of them in particular is that
ancient astronaut theorists say, yes, do you think that maybe
the zoo hypothesis comes into this as part of this?
This the idea that these things were out there, maybe
watching us, and now they've cloaked themselves, like like you described,

(38:38):
Maybe they're still there, we just don't see them now
because they don't want to be seen.

Speaker 13 (38:42):
What about that, Well, if you don't want to be seen,
I'm sure you won't be seen. If you make up
your mind you don't want to be seen there, you
aren't see your brands right now?

Speaker 1 (38:54):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (38:55):
True?

Speaker 1 (38:55):
That especially when you talk technology, yeah and right, yeah,
when when you talk to technology in that regard of
advanced technology, clearly they've got to have some kind of
cloaking device again, assuming that that would be what we're
dealing with here. But yeah, that makes a ton of sense.

Speaker 13 (39:09):
Well, that's probably where we've got our stealth technology with
to be the one bomber we you know, we probably
got that off of any uh salvaged UFO craft from
roswell On.

Speaker 6 (39:28):
All right.

Speaker 13 (39:29):
Sure, they've had the ability to the idea of a
civilization that has existed for without any disruption, let's say,
for billions of years, not being advanced enough to be
able to move things that they want to move from

(39:50):
one part of the universe to another. Uh. That sounds
like something that's very real, real to me that they
would have that a bbility.

Speaker 1 (40:02):
Yeah.

Speaker 13 (40:02):
Again, if we had, if we had to, if our
if our sun started to go crazy and started to
die and we're and we managed to survive five more
five billion more years, Uh, if we had the technology,
do you not think that we would grab a sun
from someplace else and bring it here.

Speaker 1 (40:22):
Yeah, Well, if if we could sort of conquer those distances, absolutely,
and maybe that's what's coming. Maybe we're going to start
dragging these things and you know, ten thousand years from
now or something, maybe we'll be able to do that
type of stuff, which makes sense, especially with we talk
about that acceleration of our our own technology and AI
and all that stuff. So so I don't know a
lot of ways to look at it. And maybe I

(40:43):
mean as usual, right made drinking the mayby juice? Here,
what else you got?

Speaker 13 (40:47):
Well, that's it, you know. Also they don't really did
they give an estimated number on the stars that are
missing from nineteen sixty.

Speaker 1 (41:02):
Yes, it's in the right of here one moment, hold on,
hold on, Yes, I'll get you that answer in just
a second. I've got so much material here to go through.
But yeah, there is sort of a rough number. So
here you go the shocking find over one hundred thousand
transient events and that won that three point nine signess significance.
So that's what they and they were originally looking for
the vanishing stars as part of it. So there's a

(41:23):
ton of stuff happening outside of just the vanishing stars,
at least conceptually. And so yeah, here we are.

Speaker 2 (41:31):
So so.

Speaker 13 (41:33):
Either these stars have been moved, are they didn't exist
at all? And somehow there their telescope that you know,
got sold.

Speaker 3 (41:49):
I don't.

Speaker 13 (41:50):
My personal belief is that there's there's definitely civilizations in
the universe that are so far advanced they literally can
do anything, not just moose move planets, but moose suns.
And definitely my best guess is what's going on there

(42:14):
that those one hundred thousand or so stars that are
missing or just transport somewhere else to know, he provide
for another for another planetary system. Yeah, losing the road.

Speaker 1 (42:29):
Yeah, I wonder. I wonder because clearly that would be
an anomalous event to us. And you know, we're looking
at this again seventy five years later, basically kind of
going through that old data. So I mean, who knows.
I imagine we're going to find some other bizarre things,
let's say in another seventy five years, that will probably
spook us again or continually in still so yeah, maybe,

(42:51):
I mean that type of technology might exist in sort
of the larger cosmos that we have not really became
part of yet. Back to that sort of star trek future. Yeah, absolutely,
I love where your heads at and maybe drinking the
mayby juice. Do you remember anything from the spot nak Era.

Speaker 13 (43:11):
I remember people being very scared when when you know
from that little little ball it was under in the
sky back then, and that's what precipitated the space race.
Uh you know under Kennedy, I remember that, But it
really was nothing but a beeping ball of a circle

(43:33):
in the earth. There was nothing, really nothing really all
that spectacular to us today, but to the people from
back then, all right, it was a marvel that kind
of technology, all right. And I would think that we
as living in today's world can can't even imagine what

(43:59):
sensitive civilisations that are billions of years ahead of us
are capable of doing, including moving stars if they're you
know this that when it comes to life, whether it's
human life or it's alien life, all lives want their
their number one trigger is survival. And if they if

(44:22):
they you know, we know an advance that five billion
years from now approximately, our son's going to die. It's
going to flare up and cook the earth, all right,
and then may become a red dwarf. We know that
in advance, and we can and and and we have

(44:43):
five billion years to prepare for it, and the survival,
ands think will kick in always, all right, and probably
maybe a billion years before it happens, all right, We
we uh, tolerate the technology to be able to get
you know, send our Sun into some sort of of

(45:06):
interstellar landfill and bring a new one in.

Speaker 1 (45:12):
Yeah, yeah, well said, well said.

Speaker 14 (45:14):
And.

Speaker 13 (45:17):
Or uh, somehow ignite Jupiter, which is nothing but a
son that never you know, it's a son that never
flared up, you know, ignite Jupiter, which is just a
second son that just never flared up into a new son.

(45:38):
But I I personally think that that that that it's
quite possible. It's the only thing for me that makes
sense that sons don't just vanish, all right. They go
through what you what you said earlier, the realistic thing
of of of of course becoming dwarfs, uh not supernovous,

(45:58):
But they don't just vanish all right. And so the
only thing that makes sense to me is somebody moved them.

Speaker 1 (46:07):
Okay, okay, I'm in. I'm in. I love the wild ideas.

Speaker 13 (46:12):
Maybe there's a maybe there's a whole industry out there
interstellar space, all right, you could Yeah, they make they
call up, Hey, look, our son's going bad here. Uh,
we need you to take and bring a new one
in and take the old one out.

Speaker 1 (46:27):
Look door dash for son, door dash for sons.

Speaker 13 (46:31):
Yeah, yeah, I would buy stock in that in that company, Okay.

Speaker 1 (46:40):
As would I. I think that's that's probably a very
nice service for the cosmos at large. And uh yeah,
why not?

Speaker 2 (46:46):
Right?

Speaker 1 (46:46):
Why not? Again, given given a Kardashev three civilization, that
type of stuff does become viable. So yeah, I mean
why not? Absolutely why not? They're just moving around and
we're like, we don't recognize it yet. Imagine when we
do recognize something like that and kind of get to
the bottom of this. Yeah, time to buy stock at it.

Speaker 13 (47:04):
And there's not just and it's not just for the
reason that their own sun is dying.

Speaker 6 (47:08):
Uh.

Speaker 13 (47:09):
We look at our own solar system, uh, you know,
and and they see a possibility there of life and
all it's lacking is the Sun. So they move a
sun in there, Uh in just the right place. The
third planet from the Sun spawns life.

Speaker 1 (47:29):
Uh, the old Pan Spermia directed Pan Spermia. And even
more than that, some uh some actual shenanigans with some
plain billiards with the Sun's shadout on YouTube. Whoever said
that smart comment there that was a desert I believe, Yeah,
I mean, yeah, I'm into it. Maybe that's what's happening here.
And if you find a line on that cosmic company,

(47:50):
let me know because I'm buying stocking that too.

Speaker 13 (47:52):
Yeah, Earth, Earth Sun And in the corner pocket.

Speaker 1 (47:56):
There you got you the best brother. Thanks for jumping
through the hoops and getting back on the phone line.
And thanks for the cole always a pleasure. Appreciate you
very much and we'll talk to you soon now, great.

Speaker 13 (48:05):
Night, Okay, good night.

Speaker 1 (48:08):
Thanks a lot. You know, we love it. That's the
Robert again, a not just a dear friend for a
long time, a mentor of ours, not just mine, but
all the rest of us as well. But check out
his book links. In the description of Trouble Mind's dotter
of Fordsize friends, it's called Stories from a Fracture of Mind,
the Robert Collection. Scroll down. It's going to be under
the Roberts because of course that's his writer's name. Let

(48:28):
me get my big hit out of the way, and
there it is the Robert on the bottom down there,
and please go give him a follow. That's the whole
point of doing this is to meet people, to learn
a new ideas, to kind of consider things that are
off the beaten path. And I've described his book. He
did send me a couple of copies. Again, full disclosure.
He doesn't pay me to say his book is good.

Speaker 2 (48:45):
It just is.

Speaker 1 (48:46):
And it reminds me of Rod Serlane meets little Philip K. Dick,
you know, kind of like that very troubled minds the
type stuff. And there's a little bit of Lovecraft in there.
I mean, there's a something for everybody, that's for sure.
But yeah, fire stuff. Appreciate the call.

Speaker 7 (49:01):
You were the best.

Speaker 1 (49:02):
Thanks for jumping through the hoops and calling back on
the phone line. James, anything on to the rest of that,
I see you on the phone line THEO. I don't
want to short change you. Wait till after the break
and then we'll go to THEO. But that, James, anything
to add there with what the Roberts said or anything
else come to mind?

Speaker 7 (49:15):
Yeah, a quote came to mind. Actually, I put in
the chat.

Speaker 8 (49:19):
Any sufficiently advanced technology would appear there, would appear into
indistinguishable from magic, and I butchered that. But the idea
of that technology could look like magic, and magic is
something that we've heard about from.

Speaker 7 (49:33):
Ancient times and it just makes me think of that.

Speaker 8 (49:37):
I was talking about that with Jem the Arcane Observer
on my show on Saturday, and this whole topic here
tonight just reminds me of that as Robert described, just
on a massive I guess you could say cosmic scale,
and with how how hard it is to find information
or to figure out things out out distant space, far

(50:00):
off space, then it seems like it could be very
easy to keep us.

Speaker 7 (50:05):
Keep things hidden from us as of now.

Speaker 8 (50:08):
So that wouldn't surprise me if things could be moved
around using means that that we we just don't have yet.

Speaker 1 (50:15):
Yeah, the technology space, especially with the acceleration, we're always
talking about that quickening. Yeah, I mean a lot of
maybe's there, but I dig it. And back to the
back to the sort of the mirror is glinting. You
know what also reminds me of I'm sure you've seen
this back in the old days Superman too. They had
that glinting mirror, right, but it was sort of a
a prison for those three fugitives from was it a Krypton? Right,

(50:37):
And so they had imprisoned them in these things and
they were kind of flowing through space and then right
what Superman saved through a rocket into space and it
blew up and like let him out imagine something like
that where they were kind of something just maybe these
portals to some other places in encapsulated in glass, like
a flat pane of glass just chilling and maybe us doing.

(50:59):
And this is one of the theories too as part
of it, some of the WU theories, the starfish prime
and a sort of launching nukes in the sky maybe
started cracking these things open. What do you think about that?

Speaker 2 (51:10):
Oh?

Speaker 8 (51:10):
Yeah, I mean the idea of that's the whole mirror
concept in a way, except for just a huge scale
again where they seem to be at least in paranormal
accounts here there's reports of all kinds of things coming
through and going into mirrors in people's buildings and their homes. Now,
if you make a giant mirror, like let's say a

(51:32):
giant crystal, the giant mass of stone, even stones, do
you have energy, rocks and everything, then yeah, I could
see that completely and even possibly being portals to other versions.

Speaker 7 (51:46):
Of the universe as well.

Speaker 1 (51:49):
Yeah, why not?

Speaker 2 (51:50):
Right?

Speaker 1 (51:50):
Why not? As long as we're considering all the options
and all the wild ideas, let's throw that one into
the buckets. Maybe the Superman panes of glass or we're
cracked open by a starfish prime and some of the
other things they were doing with the nuclear testing. I
don't really know.

Speaker 13 (52:03):
I do know.

Speaker 1 (52:03):
I live in Vegas, and in the fifties and into
the sixties and even into the nineties, they were blowing
up nukes out here in the desert. Yeah, super weird. Fine, Fine,
it's gonna be fine. If I started growing an arm
out of my back, you'll know what happened. If you're
right back, More Trouble Mind's coming up. Love to hear
your thoughts. We got the you and Philly coming up
in your calls as well. What happened to these missing stars?

(52:25):
More Trouble Minds coming up. Be all right back, Welcome

(52:47):
back to Troubled Mind. So I'm your host, Michael Strange.
We're streaming on YouTube, rumble x, Twitch and kick. We
are broadcasting live on the Troubled Minds Radio Network. That's
KUAP Digital Broadcasting and eighty eight point for FM Offland,
New Zealand on the Underground Media Network. Tonight, we're talking
about this bizarre synchronicity and of course this odd scientific

(53:08):
discovery of the curious case of the Missing Stars. We've
talked about this in the past. Now, not only is
a paper being written on this to each multiple transient
events and the first Palomar sky survey back in the
nineteen fifties, but there's this odd synchronicity where this was
going down right around the same time as this nineteen
fifty two Washington DCUFO flap, which is massively famous in ufology.

(53:32):
This is something people talk about all the time because
again this is pre satellite. Remember nineteen fifty seven was
the first Sputnik satellite they went up, and so this
in particular makes you wonder what the hell was actually happening.
And now we're looking at these transient events that might
seem as if they are reflective material of just an

(53:52):
object chilling out there, maybe watching us. But now they're gone.
We go back and look and they have literally, quite
quite literally vanish. So what the hell does that mean?
I don't know. And this is again one of those
modern curiosities of where science meets discovery and mysticism and
all those things. What does it mean? I don't know.

(54:12):
That's that's why we're talking about it anything, James, and
we'll go to THEO and Philly.

Speaker 8 (54:17):
Just I always I'm always trying to squeeze some thoughts
here there at then the segment, But I wanted to say,
great call from Robert as well, And yeah, I've been
thinking about the the idea of of some kind of
a vessel, some kind of a spaceship the whole time
as well. And funny thing with that is fort was
thinking about that kind of possibility before the term UFO
or a spaceship ever was really around.

Speaker 7 (54:39):
So pretty pretty amazing there as well.

Speaker 1 (54:42):
Yeah, exactly, And so what does it mean? How weird
does this get? And is this really when we sort
of run into the idea of disclosure? What if this
is the findings of this these anomalies are so bizarre
that we have to change the way we think about
the world we live in. Right? Maybe also maybe not.
You hear your thoughts at seven O two nine one
zero three seven click the discord link at Troubledminds dot org.

(55:04):
Puts on the show just like this. You went, Philly.
Thanks for being patient, my man, you're on Trouble Minds.
How are you, sir? All right ahead?

Speaker 5 (55:10):
Hello, I'm doing quite well.

Speaker 2 (55:12):
How is my audio a loud and clear?

Speaker 1 (55:15):
You sound fantastic. Welcome to the joint.

Speaker 5 (55:18):
Dude, I love this topic so much. Just star is disappearing.
There's something so vaguely just settling about the fact that
you can look up at the night sky and slowly
watch those little tiny patches of light disappear and kind
of like have no idea why that's happening.

Speaker 1 (55:38):
It's amazing, and we have talked about this a few
times for that exact reason. But now the science is
digging into it and trying to get some answers here,
which I'm super excited about. I hope they give it
a fair shake and peer review. What else you got
theories or anything else on the peer review process or
whatever else. You're right, this is very sort of cuthulhu
esque unsettling in terms of like the greater cause most

(56:00):
for sure.

Speaker 5 (56:02):
Yeah, I mean, like are you excited about that? Like
could there be a good possible reason for the stars
to disappear?

Speaker 2 (56:09):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (56:09):
Yeah, we've We've listed a couple, and I think let's say,
let's let's just say, for instance, throw one out. I
think let's say we're being watched by, you know, the
Galactic Federation, like the actual Galactic Federation. Again, theory craft
in here, like Star Trek because they have what's it
called the the prime directive, right, Well, they're not supposed
to interfere, but they watch so I mean imagine if

(56:32):
that actually exists out there somewhere, and this was part
of their sort of protocol of watching us that from
when we get technologically advanced enough that maybe first contact
does happen. I mean, that could be a very very good.

Speaker 2 (56:43):
Thing, right, No, I mean fair enough.

Speaker 5 (56:46):
I was going to bring up another sci fi series.
Have you ever heard of lex l e x X No,
never heard of it, and it is my favorite Canadian
low budget sci fi series of all time. Everything else
out of the water, dude. I think it was like

(57:07):
on Showtime, but it was like back before Showtime was good,
Like this was in I think like nineteen ninety seven
or nineteen ninety eight, when like three D computer animation
graphics were first coming out. The entire premise of the
show is like it's in space and they are on
like a living starship that is a bug And it's

(57:31):
just really weird and very very kitchy and very low budget,
but like simultaneously like one of the best series I've
ever watched, just because it's everything I need from sci Fi.
But in season two, and I'm going to try to
like not give out spoilers here, one of the main
villains is this hyper genius who has these self replicating drones,

(58:00):
and these low budget self replicating drones. The way the
Canadian television portrays them, they're just like arms that fly
around like literally like disembodied arms, at least that's how
they portrayed them. And they have like nanobots inside. But
one of the main plot points, and I guess I

(58:20):
am going to give out some spoilers, but they can
self replicate, and towards the end of season two they
start like feeding off of suns various stars and self replicating,
so the entire star or in the entire sky just
slowly starts to get dark. And I don't know, it's

(58:43):
just like one of the creepiest, coolest contents I've ever
heard of in my life.

Speaker 1 (58:48):
Yeah, I love it, rasays Lex was awesome talking about
the bug the bugships over this, so you're not alone
in seeing this. And I can remember a time shot.
It was real quick. I can remember a time back
in the early eighties where showtime used to be good too,
So maybe they got they were they were good and
then got bad and they got good again or whatever.
But what I mean is that it used to be
just Karate Kid and lethal Weaponry run. So you know

(59:09):
how much better do well get to that?

Speaker 5 (59:11):
I mean karatedn't lead for Red. They're both great too.
Although fun fact, I'm not sure if it's actually a
fun fact, but the Dutch actor who played the main
villain in Le season two is also the same Dutch
actor that played the main villain villain in the Human
Centipede Theater Laser. He's like a great actor, but it

(59:32):
is really good at playing like preposterously in humane humans.

Speaker 2 (59:38):
R I P.

Speaker 5 (59:38):
Theater Laser.

Speaker 1 (59:39):
But yeah, right, yeah, I'll have to add that to
the list of things that that one day when I retire,
I'll just watch end to end and I will be complete.
But yeah, it's okay, and also quick too. Now you're good,
you're good. As part of that, you're you're you're bringing
up something that I am familiar with. I've seen Stargate
SG one. Shout out if you guys have seen that.
If not, there's something in there called the Replicators. Have

(01:00:02):
you ever seen that? And does it? Does it make
sense as a nice parallel with what you just described.

Speaker 5 (01:00:07):
No, I've actually not seen that. A lot of people
keep on telling me, what are the replicators? And should
I watch that series?

Speaker 1 (01:00:14):
I think you should. It's it's pretty good. It's it's
very troubled minds. And back in, back in it was
early aunts when they when they created it, I didn't
watch it. Then I was like, really mcguiver and like
a space thing, stop it, get out of here. And
so I never watched it. When I finally went back
and watched it, I was like, and then this was
probably like what three years ago. I mean, I kind
of like, we're talking to you guys. As I was

(01:00:35):
watching them, I'd lay down on the couch after after
the show and turn one on and fall asleep or whatever, right,
And so I watched them kind of in fragmented pieces.
But I thought it was very good. It was very
well done, and the acting was great, and the you know,
the characters were compelling, and they had these weird stargates
where they popped around, and you know, it was like
this we lived in this ancient cosmos that humans were

(01:00:55):
just learning about, and there were these these alien you know,
dramas and takeovers and all kinds of stuff that the
humans were always fighting against. I thought it was good.
I never saw the additionals, but Stargate SG one I
do recommend it. And the replicators are basically think of
the Von Newman probes. We've talked about them as these
sort of the small things that are self replicating and

(01:01:18):
they take whatever they can get, whatever raw materials they
can get, replicate themselves and then sort of seed themselves
into the galaxy, right, which is how we would expect
to sort of seed ourselves, at least technologically out into
the cosmos. But in this case, they were like little bugs,
you know, like a figure the size of like a
volleyball or something with legs, and these things would eat anything.

(01:01:41):
So they would eat a spaceship and repurpose the parts
of the spaceship to create more replicators, right, And so
whether it was raw materials, technology, and the better the technology,
the more dangerous the replicators became, because then they were
you know, nanotech and all kinds of wild stuff. But yeah,
that's the short version, and they come in way later,
like in season six or seven or something. So do

(01:02:03):
watch it.

Speaker 2 (01:02:04):
No, I have to watch that.

Speaker 1 (01:02:05):
Okay, but does that sound similar to what you're describing
from Lex there.

Speaker 5 (01:02:09):
Yeah, no, that's exactly like a similar I mean, like
I would say that, you know, the Von Newman probes,
the mantred drones from Lex, the Borg from Star Treks.
You know, they all kind of like have the same
concept where they will absorb and recreate anything given enough
matter to create from. But yeah, like I love that

(01:02:30):
concept so much. It's such a scary dystopian idea. But yeah,
yeahs also like oddly realistic. Like, you know, I think
that if our technology does progress enough to that point,
no matter how kitchy our perception of it is from
nineteen nineties or two thousand sci fi like, I think

(01:02:51):
that's a realistic worry that we should worry about at
some point.

Speaker 1 (01:02:54):
Yeah, I think so too. It's I don't know, it's
a weird thing. This whole thing is incredibly weird because
we're looking at again data, we're looking at science, and
we're looking at something spooky all at the same time,
and that high strangeness comes into this conversation. I don't
know what else you got on it. What would be
your take on this? For maybe the most tame thing

(01:03:16):
here and maybe the most wild thing. I don't know.
There's a ton of ways to look at this.

Speaker 2 (01:03:19):
Of course, I mean, I got nothing else.

Speaker 5 (01:03:23):
There is a good isaac as an old story about
all the star is going out at night, but I
don't want to spoil that because I would butcher it
if I were to attempt to retell it.

Speaker 1 (01:03:33):
I do have a short poem though, Okay, great, love
to hear the short poem.

Speaker 5 (01:03:38):
All right, let's see if I cannot butcher the metre
on this. But all right, here it goes mirrors and
glass and into the light, out of the sky and
into the night. A ferment cracked, a pink Floyd planetarium
left intact, a Neo deGrasse tyson yet to be smacked,

(01:04:01):
a store of bove A universe below, and all my
homies watching on the Troubled Minds show.

Speaker 1 (01:04:10):
Oh yeah, hell yeah, that's the O, the official poet
of Troubled Minds. Thanks for bringing the rhymes tonight. Fantastic
is always. Can we share your substack yet.

Speaker 3 (01:04:18):
I have it?

Speaker 14 (01:04:19):
I know it.

Speaker 3 (01:04:20):
Oh no, no, no no, don't don't.

Speaker 5 (01:04:22):
Count to that. It's it's not good. But thank you
for offering. HID always appreciate that.

Speaker 1 (01:04:26):
Okay, let me know when you're ready, we will share
your substack. Thanks for the call, thanks for listening, thanks
for being you always a pleasure, my men, cool, great night.

Speaker 2 (01:04:34):
You don't know it?

Speaker 1 (01:04:35):
And Philly the official poet of troubled minds? And again,
how do you become the official anything of troubled minds?
Like I've always said, you just call when you do
a thing and then it just becomes a thing. And
James is the paranormal expert of trouble minds. We got
Derek the official syncrol mystic of troubled minds. We got
THEO and Philly the official poet of troubled minds.

Speaker 2 (01:04:53):
What are you?

Speaker 1 (01:04:54):
Where do you fit in here?

Speaker 2 (01:04:55):
You're your?

Speaker 1 (01:04:56):
You got it? You got a unique take somehow someway.
That's why we get together and talk about these ideas.
Give you a call, let's do it and we'll talk
about all manner of wild things. Anything on that, James,
We've got herschel eure up next because Derek's bottom of
the hour, so we'll go to a herschel next. Just
a heads up so I don't sneak up on you, James.
Anything on what what THEO said? And then we'll go
to Herschel.

Speaker 7 (01:05:16):
Yeah, it's amazing, great call from THEO. It's amazing how.

Speaker 8 (01:05:20):
Sci fi just keeps on being relevant and predicting things
even when it's just supposed to be that's just a story,
just fiction. And yeah, I love the again, the whole
mirror and lights and reflection aspect of all this. It's
just I never thought about that on a sort of
a cosmic scale until tonight.

Speaker 7 (01:05:42):
So that's really amazing.

Speaker 1 (01:05:43):
Yeah, tons of stuff here and uh that again something
watching us has always really kind of been on my
mind as part of these these conversations when it comes
to you know, aliens or the zoo hypothesis or this
type of stuff. I mean, I don't think it's let's say,
it would be trivial for an advance civilization to hide
themselves from us. And that's why I when I you know,
when people say I saw a UFO or you know,

(01:06:06):
I got evidence, I got a video or this type
of stuff, I got to wonder if they're messing with us,
because you could, I mean, we're probably at the point
where we can move into other you know, let's say,
foreign airspace and not be detected, be completely quiet, be
completely stealth. So if we're doing that and sort of
in the infancy of that technology, then obviously the aliens

(01:06:30):
would be like, no, we can move around with impunity,
not be seen, not be detected, because of course if
we were, then we'd have problems. And you know, don't
Los Angelinos. Don't shoot at the UFOs. You'll spark an
interstellar war. Yeah, don't do that. But that becomes the
larger question here. I don't know.

Speaker 2 (01:06:48):
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (01:06:49):
What do you guys think we're talking about the Palmar
anomalies tonight when the stars shouldn't vanish and yet they are.
It's seventy five years on, nineteen fifty ish. And what
about the synchronicity of this bizarre thing in the nineteen
fifty two UFO flap in Washington, DC that seems to
coincide pretty well with the Palomar Sky survey. So something here.

(01:07:12):
We're now seven oh two nine five seven one zero
three seven. Click the discord link at Troubledminds dot org.
Will put you on the show. Herschel in Arizona, Commershall, Herschel.
What's a brother? You're on Troubled Minds? How are you?
You're good at so many things? You're the official Herschel
of Trouble Minds. I guess what's our brother? Welcome to
the joint.

Speaker 3 (01:07:31):
On whatever whatever are you? However you wanted to find me,
it's your show.

Speaker 1 (01:07:36):
Herschel is the man of Troubled Minds, the man. All right,
tell all your brother, Well, what's on your mind tonight?

Speaker 7 (01:07:42):
Fuck ah.

Speaker 3 (01:07:45):
I we've talked about these types of things before, and
we've come across this topic of like the different the
frequencies that we are only sometimes able to perceive and
other times we're not. And I've written and I've read

(01:08:07):
stories like the people looking at the swimming pool at
a different angle and stuff like that, you know, and
there I've got several stories like that go in that
like direction in mine and I have this essay that
I'm going to read and if you don't mind, and like,
this is one of the things where I started it

(01:08:28):
out as a rambling recording, you know, just talking into
my recorder, and then I transcribed it with a soft
you know, I put in a transcription software, and then
I started refining it. So it went from like four

(01:08:48):
thousand words and it's down to like twenty six hundred
words now. So it's it's a refinement of things that
we ideas that you and I have discussed on your
show before, and also some new ideas.

Speaker 1 (01:09:08):
Perfect love to hear let's go and it has.

Speaker 3 (01:09:11):
And the thing that made me want to read it
was I read your entire write up and I'm like, okay,
like you're talking about things appearing and disappearing and maybe
being there and maybe not being there and blah blah blah.
So everything that that, Yeah, everything that THEO said, what
the Roberts said, Like, it's this goes and it's in

(01:09:31):
line with it. So it's about aliens, but we can
think about it as the palam our situation or the
plasma balls or whatever, you know, Like it's so many things.
So it's alien avoid it's on our coinciding plane. That
is the title of the essay. Do beings from other
frequencies coexist with us? The visible light spectrum and beyond

(01:09:53):
the visible light spectrum, as defined by Thought co is
the segment of electromagnetic spectrum humans can ranging from approximately
four hundred to seven hundred nanometers, encompassing the colors of
the rainbow, red, orange, yellow, green, blue, indigo, and violet.
This spectrum also known as the optical spectrum of white light,
is just a small fraction of the full electromagnetic spectrum.

(01:10:17):
The University of Tennessee explains that shorter wavelengths and higher
frequencies include ultraviolet light, X rays, and gamma rays, while
longer wavelengths and lower frequencies encompass infrared light, microwaves, and
radio waves. The edges of the visible spectrum blend into
ultraviolet and infrared radiation, revealing a broader reality beyond human perception.

(01:10:41):
As scientists develop tools to peer into these other spectrum,
they uncover phenomena invisible to the naked eye, beings in
unseen frequencies. Some entities we label as aliens may not
be extraterrestrial, but rather coexist on Earth in frequencies beyond
our visible spectrum. These beings could be composed of light

(01:11:04):
or energy that we cannot naturally perceive, much like how
we radiate energy invisible to ourselves. Calling them aliens may
be a misnomer. If they originate from this plane of existence,
their presence might go unnoticed because their frequency differs from ours,
yet they share our same physical space. Materialism and monism

(01:11:26):
a philosophical framework. Materialism A monistic philosophy posits that all things, frequencies, light, space,
and time are matter. Monism views reality as stemming from
a singular essence, unlike dualism, which sees a division between
consciousness and matter. Picture the Yin yang symbol. A dualist

(01:11:49):
focuses on the yin and the yang, while a monist
sees the encompassing circle. Monism allows for duality the emergence
of multiple forms from the singular form, but rejects dualism's separation.
You've heard of the Internet of Things. Well, we live

(01:12:09):
in the consciousness of things already, we were first. The
Internet of things is a copy. In this view, unseen light,
like the five G signals connecting devices, is matter, as
are the beings that we might call aliens. Their existence
as matter in a different frequency explains why we don't

(01:12:29):
perceive them consistently. They may seem to appear and disappear,
but it's not clear that they do that. Emotional sensitivity
and interaction, these beings may possess heightened emotional sensitivity, feeling
human emotions like fear or tension with a far greater intensity.

(01:12:51):
Imagine walking into a room and sensing eyes on you
multiply that sensation by thousands. Humans react with fear upon
encountering these beings. The intensity could be overwhelming for them,
akin to a form of pain. The sensitivity might explain
their avoidance of interaction, like a skinless body exposing bones

(01:13:13):
and organs. What we perceive of these beings is not
their outer form, but in internal essence, visible only because
their true frequency illses us. Attempting to touch them would
be like reaching into their core or touching their inner organs,
further discouraging their desire to be in contact with us.
The observer effect and coexistence. The observer effect, where observation

(01:13:37):
alters the behavior of particles, suggests that these beings are
highly sensitive to being watched. When we spot a craft
in low earth orbit strinking across the sky, they may
sense our gage, just as we feel theirs. This mutual
awareness mirrors how wildlife like raccoons or deer, avoids humans

(01:13:59):
due to persue feeding us as predators. Different types of
consciousness human, animal, or these beings coexist on Earth, but
operate in distinct worlds. Just as we don't live among wildlife,
these beings have little reason to integrate with us. Existing
in a frequency we can't access, or at least we
can't fully access, the conclusion redefining aliens rather than alien visitors.

(01:14:25):
These beings may be or may have been, native to Earth,
existing infrequencies beyond our perception. Their avoidance could stem from
their sensitivity to our emotions and the incompatibility of our
respective existences. As humans don't live among wildlife or other species,
these beings have no need to integrate with us. Their

(01:14:46):
presence in an unseen spectrum doesn't make them alien success
it suggests a richer, more complex plane of existence we're
only beginning to understand, and good for them. Further expert
exploration consider our delayings, the politics of experience, or discussions

(01:15:08):
on AI and consciousness which touch on related themes of
perception and reality.

Speaker 1 (01:15:15):
And Finn Yeah, Okay, there's a ton there, and I
think you're right. As part of the core aspect of that,
in my opinion, is that we're always doing this too,
as part of our conversations. Like you said, you and
I have talked about this in the past, and we'll
continue to talk about this is reframing what alien means.
James says it all the time too, not just because

(01:15:36):
it just means different, and so suddenly when you start
to look at this in a different light, I think
reframing aliens entirely for the human space, for all of
planet Earth really becomes the next frontier, and I think
we should consider it quite a bit more fire stuff.
I love that what us do.

Speaker 3 (01:15:54):
Well. I think that this relates to the discussion of
the pole phenomenon, because I mean, I don't know, I remember,
I mean, I remember one time I was looking at
the Big Dipper and I can't remember the name of
the Starbards, the bottom right hand star of the Big Dipper,
and it was throbbing, and I'd never seen a star

(01:16:17):
that I've looked at a million times throb I mean,
it was like pulsing, you know, and and it has
never done it since. I've only seen that happen once.
So these anomalous things where these stars disappeared, like what
we might what might have been there might still be there.

(01:16:40):
What might have been there might have been a reflection
like was suggested, or it might they may have been
super novas that just are done now, like we just don't,
like there's no you know, there's obviously no way to know.

Speaker 2 (01:16:54):
But I think that.

Speaker 3 (01:16:57):
We know that light bends. We know that we can
that theoretically, and it is being experimented with the concept
of bending space. There could have been another anomaly in
another place that kind of bent space. Atlanta put the
for those those kind of the image of those stars

(01:17:20):
in that spot for a while, and then that space
bent out, you know, and then they went back to
where they belonged to. There's so many I've got the
music I'm going to take off. Thanks for having my call.

Speaker 1 (01:17:32):
You're the best. Appreciate the call. Thanks for reading that essay.
Fire As always, that's Herschel, the official man of Troubled Minds.
I'll tell you all about it when we get back
Trouble Minds do of course that friends, if you're back,
more Trouble Minds coming up. We get more from James.
We get there at the night stock or in her
calls as well. Don't go anywhere. Welcome back to Troubled Minds.

(01:18:06):
I'm your host, Michael Strange. We're streaming on YouTube, a
rumble x, a Twitch and Kick. We are broadcasting live
on the Troubled Minds Radio Network. That's ku AP Digital
Broadcasting and of course eighty eight point four FM. Auckland,
New Zealand. Tonight we're talking the Palomar anomalies when the
stars shouldn't vanish. And again this has brought This is
a scientific paper brought to you by Beatrice villa Rol

(01:18:30):
of Stockholm University and friends. She's got some all fifteen
authors of this links from the description go give her
a follow on Twitter x. It's at doctor b E
A v I L L O R R O E L.
Links are in the description. Please do that. Well, look,
basically this they were the Palomar sky surveys were in

(01:18:50):
the fifties and they found all these amazing things. And
now we're going back seventy five years later and double
checking and there's missing stars, which which has been covered,
you know a little bit here and there in the
mainstream stuff in the mainstream space over the last couple
of years. But now she's finding that there's these anomalies,
transient anomalyes she's calling them, that are actually possibly she's

(01:19:14):
seeing think mirrors or glass like reflective things just chilling
out there that we detected as stars initially and now
looking back on them, they might be I don't know
what would that be. As we were saying sort of
that's the idea of the prime directive maybe coming into
play as we start to get into the space age
of humans, human space age, that maybe they kind of

(01:19:37):
cloaked those things watching us. I don't know, what do
you think? How deep does that get? How weird? Is
it a lot of ways to look at this? And
that's exactly the point. Anything on that, James, and we'll
go to Derek the n ice talker.

Speaker 8 (01:19:47):
Yeah, great controversial. I just want I was just thinking
too about how you have you have lens caps for cameras.
What if those are just giant cameras and the caps
were put on In other words, some giant opaque object
just was just slid over these things and that's why

(01:20:08):
they're gone. And just regarding the prime directive thing there
is you know, that's a good idea and a good possibility.
But also then if you would put in all the
the manufacturing, all the UFOs and everything seen around the planet,
all the experiences people have been having for who knows
how long, that it makes you wonder is it really

(01:20:28):
a prime directive? But also the prime directive they would watch,
but they would also usually try to get close to
the civilization to see how far along they were, and
that didn't always go well in the in the in
the Star Trek series, there were mistakes made more than
a few times. And but it's just making me think

(01:20:48):
now there, you know, is it that mistakes are being
made or is it that they just don't care? And
it's sort of the opposite of the prime directive. They
can do whatever they want and it doesn't matter if
we see them because obviously, as a civilization, we have
not decided that aliens aliens exist.

Speaker 1 (01:21:07):
Indeed, and the debate rages rageous heavily well said all
that seven oh two nine seven one zero three seven
click to discord link of Troubleminds dot org. Will pat
you on the show just like this. Derek in Massachusetts,
I'm stucker. What's going on?

Speaker 7 (01:21:23):
My man?

Speaker 1 (01:21:23):
How you doing tonight? Thanks for popping in here. I
know you said you're busy work. I appreciate that very much.

Speaker 7 (01:21:28):
What do you got?

Speaker 1 (01:21:29):
This is again We've talked about this a number of times,
but now suddenly we're we have legitimate scientists kind of
backing us up our wild ideas at least and looking
into this a little deeper. What's your take? The official
synchro mystic of troubled minds to speaking of official folks minds.

Speaker 14 (01:21:47):
Yeah, yeah, well we're very shorting in this night. I
got my work cut off for me once I hang
up this phone call, so I apologize in advanced per time.
So we scrambled, And this is probably not my best
idea going in, but the main reason why I wanted
to call was going to into the yeos. But it's
like it's out there for sure, so a little more
down to earth first, Like my initial idea when the
show first started, when I think kind of what we

(01:22:08):
talked about a little bit on the first time we're
kind of a few years ago when we kind of
talked about the missing starts a little bit was some
kind of like communication, some kind of message, And that's
the kind of the three body problem thing, some kind
of like talk to the system or shocked to the
nature of reality.

Speaker 2 (01:22:25):
Some kind of like whoa like communication to us, you know,
and potentially like it is.

Speaker 14 (01:22:30):
A message, maybe we'll have AI figured out at some point,
like if there is some kind of like you mentioned,
and again I'm like really busy work, but you mentioned
in like some lines or geometric patterns or shapes or
whatever that might be not discernible to us, but maybe
eventually we get some good mathematicians on it, like a
three body problem, or the AI can crush the numbers
four or this is just the initial piece of the

(01:22:53):
data and when we stuck, when we do it another
type of survey in a few years, we'll notice more
different patterns. And then if we've enough different survey then
will notice like foaming in alphabet, or we'll notice a
message where right now we kind of just have the
NFL letters.

Speaker 2 (01:23:05):
It is not really a message yet or whatever, but
just like it could be right now, we don't.

Speaker 14 (01:23:10):
We have kind of our skywatching them by some amateur skywalkers,
by NASA, by the powers that be, to a certain extent,
but for pretty much the entire course of humanity, the elites,
the priests classes at the time, the most kind of
important people were just like a priesthood that was watching
the sky, priestthood that was skywatching and just mapping it
out and just chronicling it all for generations and generations, generations,

(01:23:32):
and you form astrology, you form the crazy wild things
that you need have generations in thousands of years of
data in order to form, but maybe the origin of that.
Obviously this has above so below. If you know the sky,
you know the ground, you know, like the internal processes
and stuff. But also what if there was like somebody
was told somewhere, whether in as a psychedelic state or by.

Speaker 2 (01:23:56):
Actual ancient aliens or whatever.

Speaker 14 (01:23:58):
Hey, like we're taking off now, or we're not there yet,
or we're on our way like through body problem style
or whatever. We'll be there in a few thousand years,
but like, keep an eye on the sky for the
next message. Like maybe they got a first message of
Wild's kind of visioned in the sky a thousands of
years ago, and then like, hey, by the way, part
two of the message is going to be happening in
the sky, so we're like written in the stars, so

(01:24:20):
keep an eye out for it. And the generation generations
they did that come up with all these patterns. Right now,
we're kind of in a low point at that or
at least like we've kind of put that into the
hands of others. Is not really as begging the culture anymore,
so we don't really remember remember that the importance of.

Speaker 2 (01:24:36):
It, But that's the message that we were working for.

Speaker 1 (01:24:38):
What do you think, Yeah, I dig that, and especially
since again we're we're kind of stumbling on this again
and at seventy five years removed from when when they
actually did the initial survey, and so who knows what
kind of stuff is continually and constantly changing. And with
that regard, and our technology is always changing as well,
we're doing you know, we're doing infrared scans of the
sky and you know, the James Webb telescope and the

(01:25:00):
satellites we got out there now kind of looking at
different areas of the cosmos and the different part parts
of the Solar system, the Parker Solo probe. I mean,
there's so much we got going on that I do
wonder if that type of thing would actually become Uh
maybe maybe this is exactly the way it's always worked,
and as you're describing that, we just need to pay

(01:25:22):
attention to how these things are moving or changing. Maybe
maybe the patterns are as easily as just tracking the
stars in the sky, and it would make a ton
of sense to why the ancients watched so closely and
made you know, star maps written in stone.

Speaker 14 (01:25:35):
I mean, I wonder, right, yeah, exactly, it did really trippy,
like the big kind of I really want to spoil it.
It was kind of spoiled when we had that guest
on to talk about three body problem because I think
he read the books or watch the like the the
like the original version from from China, which goes further
than us. But like so I don't want to give

(01:25:55):
this away, but what we're presented in the story of
like a alien ships that are arriving is not what's coming.
And it's more so we're talking about with like Carl
Sagan's flat Landers and everything, that we're dealing with a
c Thulu like entity or some kind of thing like
a fifth dimensional entity or something that's outside of our
realm of existence and needs to clue us in to

(01:26:18):
the fact that they even exist in order for us
to like do what we what they want us what
to do. Basically, like if if they're trapped in a
jail cell or whatever, if they're trapped outside the house
and there's like a dog inside the house, like Comparates
of the Caribbean, when Jack Sparrow is trying to get
the dog given the keys so we can get out
of the jail, Like the dog's not going to understand
that whole process.

Speaker 2 (01:26:36):
Hey, get open the door.

Speaker 14 (01:26:37):
For me, like like learn how to stand up and
open the door, and all the kind of stuff you
have to like over a long period of time, get
to get the dog's attention. You got to get the
dog to move over, You got to get the dog
to do this and do this, and maybe that's like
what kind of all like these cosmic waves were getting
sent down like unmal cosmic waves. So they build this invention,
and then once they build that invention, they'll learn about this.

(01:26:59):
And once they learn about this, they'll figure this out
and stuff. And there's just one of those things. Now
we have like the technology to.

Speaker 2 (01:27:07):
Notice it.

Speaker 14 (01:27:08):
I don't know, but uh, for the more more wild thing,
the more to touch on with you was talking about,
like what if we're in the middle of some kind
of like cosmic war between advanced entities and this is
kind of just the only like thing that we kind
of really notice, like like the ants notice when humans
are in World War three or World word warl War two,

(01:27:29):
unless like Darrian Hill gets blown up, Like if just
soldiers are marching to war to the ants underneath the ground,
I have any kind of understanding of that, and it
really only crosses their path when they directly get stepped
on by these things. So our son wasn't like flipped
out of existence if that's what's happening. But what if
there is kind of a cosmic war that's happening, and

(01:27:52):
the first thing we notice is that the stars that
are plane being blinked out. And then kind of like
what if this dc LAP is because someone is trying
to get our attention like this, like to look up.
That's kind of the point of it, like to see
if we're capable if we noticed this thing, if we
have the technology to notice, maybe we can be recruited
from kind of interesteller into cello war or whatever. And

(01:28:14):
there was there's this YouTube channel all the Quinn's Ideas
shoutou Quins ideas. We just kind of like give summaries
of like I think high uh fi fi, the heart
flat fi stuff, and I got into them, like all
the Dune books, like he dives into all the Dune books.
So we posted one video a couple of months ago
called the le the z Leaf Sequence x E E

(01:28:35):
L E E sequence, and I didn't really know what
it was. I was listening to his Dune stuff, so
I kind of just I was supposed to take a nap,
and I thought it was just going to be like
one of the one of the Brian Herbert Dune books
that are just like way off the track. So I
put it on and stuff's mentioned an alien. So I'm
like this, this doesn't seem like it's it's done. Theren's
really no aliens here. But it was ended up being
really cool and it's kind of production into this. Any

(01:28:58):
thoughts on that, well, I get a drink, but yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:29:00):
Yeah, real quick too, there's this bizarre synchronicity of that
the Washington Flat and I think I love where your
heads out with this because looking up at the sky
and again this is this is pre or you know,
kind of in the infancy of jets, there's no satellite yet,
and this became a national thing, like actual national media attention.
They caught worldwide attention at the time, and so so

(01:29:22):
I do wonder. I mean, that's if you're trying to
communicate with us, flying over the White House is one
way that you would expect people to be like, Okay,
now let's start looking up, and instead, you know, we
just start looking down. And the other thing. Real quick,
I want to I want to mention on the ants. Interestingly,
the ants themselves, let's say, in terms of a world
war or something like, they know when their ant hill

(01:29:44):
gets blown up, and that's the catastrophe, right, and then
they put the pieces back together whatever, or move or
die or whatever they do. But in the same instance,
a war or construction to them is the same thing,
because their ant hill's going to get blown up either way,
and one's destroying things and one's see creating things, but
it still messes up the antle. So you know, in

(01:30:04):
that regard to with ourselves as part of it, how
would you recognize what that even look like in an
innerstellar sense? You know what I mean?

Speaker 14 (01:30:12):
Like I said, love your heads that prett usual, Yeah,
no exactly, I mean like they unless like it was
kind of like if the if the soldiers were marching
down the street and kind of there's like.

Speaker 2 (01:30:22):
A dozen anhels they could possibly step on.

Speaker 14 (01:30:24):
It's up on a few in the middle kind of
one in the outskirts is going to feel the rumble.
But unless it's unless their an hills actually collapse and
they're not going to necessarily know what's going on, or
these things step up right over them, or they see
these things, they feel a vibration, Like do they understand
the concept of earthquakes? Maybe the thing it's an earthquake,
but they're just like effects that are happening. They're experiencing
that's happening on a plane of existence that they have

(01:30:46):
no from of reference for Kinder, So what if that's
what's happening and involved with like the feeling of suns
or the extinguishing of stars to.

Speaker 2 (01:30:55):
Touching with theo's talking about.

Speaker 14 (01:30:57):
This book is called The Zaiy Sequence, and I just
c Ai just to give me some some like summaries
on these exact points that I want to mention just
to save me time because I was really Russian network.

Speaker 2 (01:31:07):
I don't mean to redo rose reading.

Speaker 14 (01:31:09):
But The Daily Sequence is a series of hard science
fiction and science fiction novels and stories and this stuff
like I haven't I haven't touched on in a few months,
but it really blew my mind when I was listening
to it, and it's like I can kind of forgetting
them now.

Speaker 2 (01:31:20):
But there's some cool but what I'm going to talk
about is not the cool stuff.

Speaker 14 (01:31:23):
But there was really cool things, and what I'm going
to talk about is.

Speaker 2 (01:31:25):
Kind of found fantastical.

Speaker 14 (01:31:27):
But the book is seemingly so hard sci fi that
at the other rand, it almost it gets so hard
that it almost becomes fantasy. That like the like it's
so it's just like such a heady idea that it
almost becomes fantastical. But the daily sequence of the series
of hard sci fi novels and stories. But even back
to the floor community's future in the universe, and it's
a vast cosmic conflict between a supremely advanced A Z

(01:31:48):
e Lee and the dark matter entities known as the
Polkino birds.

Speaker 2 (01:31:53):
So basically human like humans are starting to call aize space.

Speaker 14 (01:31:56):
And this book takes place over like millions and hundreds
of millions and basically the time course of humanity and
then the universe as a whole, and like humanity's expansion
throughout the universe, so we start to like create dice
ins fears, or start to colonize the galaxy.

Speaker 2 (01:32:09):
You start to colonize or the Solar system and the galaxy.

Speaker 14 (01:32:12):
And yet it like he's expanding out until we and
we've come up with like other cultures, like we have
cosmic wars, but with other cultures and stuff. But then
and eventually it gets so advanced that they realize that
there is like a supreme intelligence, something on another plane
of existence, something that's like not not doesn't have soldiers
to battle.

Speaker 2 (01:32:30):
They're they're like a five D type of society so to.

Speaker 14 (01:32:34):
Speak, not technical that, but just like unbelievably advanced that
we don't notice them unless we get like like somewhere
near their level of advancement, that we're not even close
to being able to see them. So a review of
the LE are supremely advanced ancient species and the z
LE sequenced by a few backs. They possess technology that

(01:32:55):
allows manipulation of space, time, construction and megastructures, and travel
through universes. Atino birds are entities made of dark matter
associated with hypothetical oatino particles. They inhabit gravity wells of
stars and seek to cool the stars by inhabiting or
inhibiting nuclear fusion. Humanity discovers a LE through their own
expansion in the galaxy and encounters with the Artiffact through

(01:33:16):
remnants of ze Lee activity.

Speaker 2 (01:33:18):
Basically like like they.

Speaker 14 (01:33:21):
Notice like a solar system and is kind of a
line in a weird way that shouldn't be natural. Something
that that we're talking about advanced culture that can blink
out the stars, potentially to give a message like something
so advanced like that. The details of this discovery are
part of the broader narrative exploring humanities place in the
cosmos amidst greater conflicts. The dynamics of the war the

(01:33:41):
Z Fatina War Fatino War. The z are fighting to
maintain their control and projects involving superlight, massive black holes,
and cosmic structures against the Fotino Birds influence. They sink
to count of the Patino birds Alteration of stellar evolution.
Fatino Birds goals aim to alter the evolution of stars
across the universe, causing them to cease fusion and become

(01:34:02):
cold dark remnants. This would shape the universe's future in
a way favorable to their existence in dark matic gravity walls.
The conflx is on cosmological scale, with both sides and
pointing advanced universe spanning strategies to ze Lee use the
technology to manipulate space time count to Platino bomb birds actions,
Tina birds work to influence cellar revolution. It's basically it's

(01:34:22):
this cosmic war between these two sides. One of them
are like super advanced things that kind of live within
our realm, and the other is kind of the its equivalent,
but within the dark matter of space, and for the
dark matter ones to kind of rive, their goal is
to like have a dark universe, and that that happens
and then all life kind of gets blunked out of
the universe. So essentially, I'm like like long story short

(01:34:45):
kind of attracts. It's like a super advanced AI that
ends up in this kind of kind of end up
watching kind of the stars all blink out around them
over the course of millions and millions years until it's
kind of alone in the dead universe because these Fotino
birds killed it that they can survive in this dark
meta universe instead, you know, And just how would we
even like comprehend that we wouldn't notice that at all,

(01:35:06):
Like if our stars were one of the ones that
go blinked out, then we realize it, and now we're
just seeing some stars get blink outa up from the distance.

Speaker 2 (01:35:14):
Oh, that's kind of weird. I wonder what that is,
like a spudge in the glass, like you know.

Speaker 1 (01:35:18):
What exactly kind of kind of reminds me of the
war thing you were talking about earlier to the ants
in the war as well. That the war analog. Let's
say they were they were drawing, you know, the power
of suns as sort of a reload, as ammunition or something,
and so the fight's going on who knows where, maybe
even in a like dimensional space or something. But the
way they do it is by drawing the energy from

(01:35:39):
these stars and blinking them out in a short period
of time. And so they don't go supernova, they don't
go black hole. They are just literally drawn into a
power source of a cloak technology that we would never
be able to see anyway. And I mean, surely you
could create something like that as a you know, maybe
a hey, we're here type of thing, like like you
were describing earlier, sort of like a cropscle in the

(01:36:00):
sky sort of situation. So I don't know, like what
the hell is actually happening with it, And there's a
ton of ideas flowing through this that I'm digging. I
think you're on the game here. And what is that?
That the name of that again? That the series you're
talking about?

Speaker 2 (01:36:11):
Yeah, the z Lea sequence. Sequence. I'm not sure if
it's one book or a series of books, but.

Speaker 5 (01:36:16):
I'm sure what the a I didn't give me the
date of it x.

Speaker 14 (01:36:19):
E e l e e z lea sequence, And yeah,
I mean it's it's in this case of battle is
literally about the sounds. So it's not like it's like
using the fuel or whatever. It's that just like the
peak of advancement in like the realm of light, basically
in the observable universe, but like not really observable to us,
just because they're unbelievably advanced. So basically like, uh, we

(01:36:41):
talked about what the galactic octopus at the center of
the galaxy that would use pants fermia to propably, like
I mentioned an entire civilization of that or more advanced whatever,
and we don't even notice them until we get like
the Dune level of advancement and like unbelievably advanced, and
then we start to notice, oh wow, there's that actually
something that's above us, like some type of like AI

(01:37:03):
god entity species or whatever. And then they're rivals I
guess basically, or they're like another presence is the darkn
these dark matter like energy bird thing. They call them
Bilkino birds, which sounds kind of like fantasy whatever, But
it's just these entities that are like these I don't
know how you even describe, just like as a thought

(01:37:24):
kind of made out of like made out of the
dark matter that don't like can't exist if there's a
star there. So they're like basically battling over the stars,
trying to blink out all the stars. So if you
see a star being blinked out from our perspective, and
if you know about the.

Speaker 2 (01:37:40):
War, it's like, oh, the ze Lee just off the
battle or whatever, and.

Speaker 14 (01:37:43):
I'm spend like a few months, but I'm kind of forgetting.
But I think basically there were such an advancement that
they eventually they realized that a lot of civilizations were
just being grown in order to be drafted into this
war eventually. So for all we know, the dc APP
in the fifties is just kind of the recruitment offers
and being like, hey, check check on that Patrick Farmalley

(01:38:05):
and called Earth and see if they're see if those
that those beings have flowered into a usable fighting force
that we can conscript into the battle here you know.

Speaker 1 (01:38:15):
Yeah, I'm reading this, so I'll drop this ze Lee
sync with sequence the Wikipedia in the in the descriptions,
you guys can check it ouf you're into it. This
is wild, just real fast. So it's a glintar intergalactic
war with an enigmatic and supremely powerful Kardashev type five
alien civilization. And it describes them You're gonna love this

(01:38:35):
as Eldrich symbiotes, composed of the space time defects, Bose, Einstein,
condessse and buryonic matter fine, seems fine. And the zi
Lee's own cosmos spanning world with dark matter entities called
the Fotino Birds. I love this.

Speaker 14 (01:38:51):
And and they're literally only they're literally fighting over the stars.
So in this, in this, in this, the story, like
the humanity is at a point where they can't notice it.
But this is like I'm pretty sure the books kind
of starts in the modern day and then ends up
like at the end of the universe. So this once
they realize that the z Le even exist, to realize
that there's a war in the first place, it's like

(01:39:12):
millions and millions of years in our future. So what
if how would we experience this war if we weren't
at that like right now, if we weren't an advenced civilization,
all we would potentially notice is just whoa some stars
blinking out you know, and then maybe we'll get a
more of a glimmer if the AI can figure out
a pattern or some kind of like I don't know,
like a message would be the best case scenario. If

(01:39:33):
it's some kind of war like I don't know, like
we're lucky, then our story hasn't been bloked out already,
you know.

Speaker 2 (01:39:38):
And it's like, what if like.

Speaker 14 (01:39:41):
A fantastic fours in datas now, which I haven't seen whatever,
it would just we talk about Galactus and stuff when
it comes to like Cuthulu or these kind of eldrish
cosmic entities that are coming to have kind of no
so beyond our scope that they are the humans to
the Anhill and that they're not even.

Speaker 2 (01:39:54):
Thinking about us.

Speaker 14 (01:39:55):
But what if Galactus is like one soldier in a
whole civilization of Glacus. Is it's more advanced than Galactus
and stuff. And it's just like I don't know, Bugles
of mind specifically, it's about stars, so all we the
only something we wouceived from that is stars plucking out?

Speaker 2 (01:40:10):
So is that app thing right now?

Speaker 14 (01:40:12):
Of the Foltino birds battling the zi leive?

Speaker 1 (01:40:15):
I dig that no, no fire stuff has always Thanks
for peeling out time for us. I know you're busy
at work and all the rest of it. Always a pleasure.
You were the best. I'm gonna look into the z
le sequence and will be linked to the description. And
you were the man.

Speaker 2 (01:40:28):
Thank you.

Speaker 1 (01:40:29):
That's you know what, Derek the knight Stalker again it
is st O c k e R. And go give
him a follow. And uh, I owe Herschel when I
didn't tell you about Herschel. So while you're down there
following the n ice Stocker trouble mindsttr of course my
friends also hollow follow Herschel again. Look, there's a lot
of people here on this list. And if you belong
on this list, yes you do. It's an in list.

(01:40:51):
It's not an outlist. Okay, we're not. We're not trying
to divide people or make make people feel left out
or anything. Okay, you belong on this list. All you
gotta do is help one iota and we'll put you
on this list. I mean an email, will hit me
up on Discord or x whatever. But scroll down to
troubleminds dot org forts last Friends or from trouble Mind's
click the friends link, scroll down a little bit and

(01:41:11):
you'll find, of course Herschel there there you go, bingo
his sexy link tree as there you go. Sorry about that, Herschel,
I didn't tell everybody about you when we got back,
but I did now. But also the Nightstalker it is
under and of course alphabetically, it's all alphabetical. Go check
out his YouTube channel. Go check out all the stuff
that Herschel's doing again commercial Herschel, the substack, the easy

(01:41:31):
Toping is the podcast, all the things he's writing, he's
doing the flash fiction, he's doing it a couple times
a year now, where every single day he wakes up
and writes stories first thing before he does anything else.
I mean, it's just an incredible process and an incredible
creative outlet to bring to us. And as you can tell,
a brilliant people and brilliant friends we have. And thank
you for that. Thanks thanks for upinning Herschel's link tree

(01:41:53):
over there on Rumble as well, James, anything on any
of that. We got time when we get back if
you want, you want to add anything else. But there's
a ton there. That Zeelee sequence and a cardishi of
five civilizations got my head spinning.

Speaker 8 (01:42:05):
Yeah, it really is an amazing, great call from Derek
as always, and uh, I will get into it more
when we.

Speaker 7 (01:42:10):
Get back, if when there's if there's time. But it's
really wild because.

Speaker 8 (01:42:16):
Spoilers and I'm not going into a ton of detail,
but for the Star Trek universe, they later on in
the in the series, like in well in the series,
in the series of all the shows, they get to
a point, the Federation gets to a point where they
have such major enemies that they do start looking to
every other world they can find that they haven't added

(01:42:38):
to the Federation yet to recruit them to help fight
those enemies.

Speaker 7 (01:42:43):
Not even joking. That's in the TV movie series.

Speaker 1 (01:42:46):
There we go, strap it you guys, You guys ready
to encounter the intergalactic war. Just a look to the
stars and the the pattern is there so wild. I
love it. Thank you. James are the best. Follow James,
why are down there? Troubleminds dot org forts my friends.
Follow James the again not just a dear friend, the

(01:43:06):
glue of the show, but the paranormal export of Trouble
Minds as well, all the places, all the things. And
thanks for being part of this, James. We'll talk to
you when we get back. There's a lot here, there's
a lot in play, and we started with the idea
of these stars vanishing. Now when you go back and
look at this the sky survey, now there seems to
be this synchronicity event in nineteen fifty two with the
UFO flap in Washington, DC. What the hell does that mean?

(01:43:29):
And how come not just stars vanishing leads to this
weird synchronicity with nineteen fifty two in DC, but also
these transient events which seem to be anomalous objects reflecting
light as if they're alien craft. What do you know
about it? Seven oh two nine one zero three seven.

(01:43:49):
This is Troubled Minds. I'm Michael Strange. Be right back
more after the break. Nobody on the line. If you
guys want to jump in here, don't go anywhere. Welcome

(01:44:15):
back to Troubled mind So. I'm your host, Michael Strange.
We're streaming on YouTube, rumble x, Twitch, and Kick. We
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(01:44:38):
matter what page you're on, right there, and so you
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It's free right there.

Speaker 7 (01:44:47):
Click it.

Speaker 1 (01:44:48):
It's an MP three stream, and come listen, come hang out,
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Apoc h Apac is Apoc on there. Maybe eventually Jen

(01:45:09):
is on there. The arcan observer that so many people
that have been part of this are also on that
radio network. So check it out. Support the support the fam,
and go listen to the stream and come hang out.
Just be part of this, because like I said, this
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trust me on that, James confirm lucrative. I wanted you

(01:45:30):
talk about Mike all, no, no, please support the fam
in all the ways, and that's one of the ways
to do it. Go listen to that radio station. I'm
trying to work on some things to get us in
a larger audience space. Okay, it's just picking out the
right audience space because I've had I've had chances and
you guys, let me know how you feel about this.

(01:45:50):
Never mind, never mind, this is a derail we don't
need right now. I'll talk about this on sort of
a non topic show. We'll discuss these ideas. But basically,
I don't want to put us in a space like
a weird political space, you know what I mean, where
it's like either super lefties or super righty's or because
those are the types of spaces that they are, you know,
kind of generating content and needing additional information in people

(01:46:12):
and things, and I'm just like, I kind of don't
like either of those things anyway. James, back to you
on this and the shout out sweets real quick, I
got you. We'll figure this out, okay, the sweet span,
the restream bot James, Okay, so yeah, yeah, we'll figure
out how to fix that.

Speaker 8 (01:46:29):
Yeah, yeah, everyone bans the wrong person at least once.
If you're a moderator, I think it just happens once.

Speaker 1 (01:46:36):
Yeah, I think did I ban myself once? Maybe we'll
work on that. But okay, So, so Derek had a
ton of stuff that he brought to the thing here,
including of course that Kardship five civilization and the idea
of the ze Lee sequence. Take that anywhere you like,
love to hear your thoughts. You had some additional stuff
you want, dad, all yours may go right ahead.

Speaker 7 (01:46:56):
Well, it's just amazing because in the Star Trek universe
there really are The big thing was for a long time, and.

Speaker 8 (01:47:03):
The TV series and the movies was just the idea
of exploration, which is good in a way but also
bad in other ways. And part of that is they
encountered other I guess you'd call them civilizations. They encountered
the Borg, they encountered another another alien group of different

(01:47:25):
multiple alien species called the Dominion. And these are huge
empires pretty much that were moving outward, moving forward, trying
to take over. And so what was amazing to me
is with everything Derek was talking about the Federation, even
though it didn't start out.

Speaker 7 (01:47:45):
As the idea of.

Speaker 8 (01:47:48):
Taking in more more planets, more civilizations to get more powerful.
It ended up being that way because they were fighting
really war on two fronts that different points in time,
and they were barely holding together, and so they were
literally trying to They're reaching out to all these other

(01:48:08):
planets they could find out there wherever they could to
see if they'd be willing to join them.

Speaker 7 (01:48:14):
And so it's just it's funny how that happens in fiction.
And I could see that happening.

Speaker 8 (01:48:19):
If there's technology that's so far advanced out there that
we again, like Derek was talking about and THEO we
barely noticed it. It just appears as a light or
as darkness to us changing from one to the other.
Then there could be that going on, you know, the
analogy of the antil and all that. Just think about
that locally, I mean, you know, it's you can take

(01:48:43):
that Teddy scull you want from the anhel to you know,
one part of the world to the other part of
the world to do the cosmos. So it really is
an amazing great call from Derek as well.

Speaker 1 (01:48:55):
Yeah, and again, so remember that a Kardashiv five civilization
is literally godlike levels of power, and so if you're
talking about a cosmic war that's so far beyond anything
we could conceive of in terms of that level of
energy output, input and output. Clearly it's going to be
some level of I mean, I say clearly, conceptually, clearly,

(01:49:20):
in an abstract sense.

Speaker 2 (01:49:21):
There we go.

Speaker 1 (01:49:21):
Let's make that make a little more sense, because nobody
really knows what that looks like. But I mean, wouldn't
that be like a war between Heaven and Hell? You
know what I mean? It would be something kind of
like that, And that's probably the best way to put
it in terms of human ways of looking at that.
But it's an unbelievably immense amount of power that's being
generated as part of that. And again I'm not saying

(01:49:42):
it's that We're not saying it's that these are possibilities,
But you get what I mean is that in that
space of something we can't even conceive of God, what
do gods look like when they fight each other? We
don't know. We don't know. I mean, we can have
some ideas and some metaph fourcle guesses and some you know,
so that type of stuff, but you get what I mean,

(01:50:04):
Like when you pull a Kardaschev five card, I mean,
that's that's what they able to generate or derive the
entire power of the universe itself, I believe as a
Kardaschev five. I'll have to look that up, but it
is a massive amount of energy. And so who knows,
Like this is the type of stuff that we would

(01:50:24):
never really recognize as part of an actual interstellar war,
because as I said, they'd be able to cloak themselves
from us. They not like they would care, by the way,
like that level of power, like they give a crap
what the ants think. And we're the ants in this scenario. Yes,
we are the ants in this scenario, and so they
couldn't they could give a crap again conceptually, but maybe
there is something, as we were talking about previously, that

(01:50:46):
there is a you know that star trek what's it
called the prime directive? And as James pointed out, by
the way, hilariously you said in the chat earlier that
the prime directive the captains violate all the damn time. Anyway,
I mean, maybe it's one of those oops is yeah,
And so hold on real quick on, I'm going to
read this from Herschel's it's perfect and fits into this.
He says they were beating tom our windows and when

(01:51:09):
we noticed them, they skid daddled, and maybe that's it.
Maybe they're like, oh oops, we kind of exposed ourselves
and then tighten up that and you know, quadrant X
to not freak these these guys out or whatever, I mean,
that type of thing. But I mean, wouldn't that be
something like Jean Luke did or Kirk or I mean,
how many other captains?

Speaker 7 (01:51:27):
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (01:51:28):
Those are the two captains I know, and I'm not
going any deeper than that because I just get weird
after that. But anyway, what do you got on that?
Because I think that's the hilarious part of this.

Speaker 8 (01:51:37):
Yeah, those are probably the two most well known and yeah,
there's just so many examples of them doing that. And
they didn't always get in trouble right away because they
were who knows how far out in space away from
their center of government or of organization. But then a
lot of times they would there will be people from
the government that would hear about this days, weeks, months

(01:51:58):
later and then come after them and be like, hey,
you did this thing and you were not supposed to
do that, and even just launch entire investigations into these things,
and you know, of course, because it's a TV series,
somehow these you know, Kirk and Picard and everybody else,
they would they would somehow find a way out of it,
or of course something else would happen that would require

(01:52:21):
them to uh get be busy again and and and
the trouble will go away because the Federation was busy.

Speaker 7 (01:52:27):
Dealing with one threat or another.

Speaker 8 (01:52:28):
So yeah, it really is wild how that that has
happened so many times in those shows. Just I don't
even need to go into an individual examples because there's
probably too many to be honest.

Speaker 1 (01:52:41):
Yeah, which again, me and me is a star trek.
The next generation is my jam. I watched the old
ones too. Captain Kirk was amazing, but beyond that, I
haven't seen all the all the rest of the stuff,
including the new Pitcard, which I'm told was really bad
and then really good and then finished good. I don't know,
like whatever one day and watch all the things. But

(01:53:01):
when I do that, there will be no troubled minds
because there will be no time. So you guys decide
whyt me to go watch all the things, otherwise you'll
have to be okay with me remaining ignorant to that space,
mostly regarding I don't know, I'm not sure what you've
covered or not covered in because my mind's in ten
places right now. But I don't know anything else you
want to add to this, because I've got tons of stuff,

(01:53:23):
including like that living plasma. I wonder if something like
that could exist out there in the cosmic space, sort
of the intermediary space, maybe watching us in that regard,
sort of back to the watchers as an aspect or
there's tons of stuff I can get to you, But
anything else you want to add as part of anything
anybody else said, or your own ideas or whatever, blah blah,
all yours or I'm I'm gonna riff.

Speaker 7 (01:53:44):
Well, a couple of things. I mean, if we think
of the things that we talked about earlier with.

Speaker 8 (01:53:48):
Suns being moved, there is also the whole idea of
the planets and the stars being sent came where if
they move themselves from place to place.

Speaker 7 (01:54:00):
That's just something that just came to mind to where
they were there.

Speaker 8 (01:54:04):
But then they they for whatever reason they decided to move,
and so that's why they weren't there anymore.

Speaker 7 (01:54:12):
And so yeah, that just makes me think of that.

Speaker 8 (01:54:15):
It also makes me think of again, if if a
ship is big enough, if a spaceship is big enough,
think about let's say, like mixing your sci fi here
the death Star. Now enlarge that to planet size or bigger.
Then that would make the planet a planet the size
of an ant hill. Literally, if you could do that,

(01:54:39):
especially with the size of a planet simulation to suns,
I know, it's quite a bit bit different.

Speaker 7 (01:54:45):
So if you can make something the size of a
sun that can move around and then it's gone.

Speaker 8 (01:54:51):
So all these things, I mean, it's it's sci fi,
but look at how often sci fi is just it
becomes reality at some point. And is that I guess
the question there maybe this is a topic for all
the show. Will all sci fi eventually be reality?

Speaker 7 (01:55:09):
Or is there some things that will never happen?

Speaker 1 (01:55:12):
It's a singularity, James strap In, it's apparently it's next
Tuesday or something like that. Dates are so reliable, exactly,
don't worry about that. We got Claude Opus four point one. Today,
we got actual chat EPT released open weights, so you
could actually and and oh three equivalent I believe, And

(01:55:35):
so you could install the thing on your computer and
run it entirely offline, like we got we got three
massive things today in terms of you know, it's only Tuesday.
So that's why I make the joke next Tuesday, James whatever.
And again, like I said, if you don't know what
I'm talking about, and that seems that sounds like Greek
to you, don't worry. Trust me. The acceleration is in
full play. And I know, I know some of you

(01:55:57):
get triggered when I talk about AI all the time
because I'm deep in that space and I'm watching how
fast it's accelerating. And that's exactly the point is that
if we're not watching that space, pretty soon, it's gonna
seem like an alien planet. And we're the natives here,
so you get what I mean. We got to pay attention.
So back to this. This is the Palomer anomalies. When

(01:56:18):
this when the stars shouldn't banish him calling this read
the rite up. It's very good, it's up. So I
went heavy on details from the scientific paper this time,
and I used by the way for this write up.
I used the new the new shiny thing. I used
Claude Opus four point one. It just was released either
today or yesterday, and it's very good. It's very good

(01:56:38):
on the details and the statistics and all the things.
I'm gonna read straight from that because this is important.
We're talking about again this paper from Beatriz. Can I
say her name properly? Probably not, but I'm gonna try anyway.

Speaker 3 (01:56:49):
Again.

Speaker 1 (01:56:50):
I give her follow Beatriz Villo row O V I
N L A R R O E L and the
preprint of the paper. It's under peer review current and
it is about these vanishing stars and these transient objects.
And this is what she said. This is a quick
post on X from her. Check this out and this

(01:57:11):
is where she linked it. This is where I saw it.
This is from July twenty seventh. This is a pre
print of a paper now under review. We first tried
in twenty twenty two, but it was too early for
the journals. Years later, with better methods, we gave it
another go. The key question has been are the transience
real or plate defects? Well, there seems to be a
clear deficit of transience and the Earth's shadow if correct,

(01:57:35):
that demonstrates there are highly reflective objects with flat surfaces
think mirrors, glass, et cetera. And transients are sunlight glints.
And it seems there may be a few more of
them we initially thought. Now that's the paper. All this
stuff is linked in the description. If you're into these ideas,
I encourage you to read this stuff in full, or
at least go check out the full Trouble Mind's newsletter

(01:57:58):
version of this because it is mostly kind of locked
into fact until it gets to like the last third
or so, then it starts to get weird. But anyway
back to this. So, what makes these findings that we're
describing right now particularly compelling is their historical context, which
is where we kind of started with the where all
this weirdness kind of comes together. The nineteen fifties represents

(01:58:21):
a unique window in human history, advanced enough to have
sophisticated photographic sky surveys, yet primitive enough that our own
technology couldn't be responsible for anomalous aerial phenomenon. We had
not yet begun to fill the sky with our satellites
against Spotnick, launched in nineteen fifty seven. This sky survey
was fifty fifty one fifty two somewhere in that space,

(01:58:43):
and our space debris, our radio signals broadcasting, our presence
to the Cosmos was still in this particular sense virgin
territory of space. Okay, July nineteen fifty two was a
month of high strangeness over America, which is where this
actual synchronicity comes in as part of this bizarre aspect. Here,
while astronomers at Palomar were conducting their routine sky survey

(01:59:05):
capturing the heavens on glass plates, something unprecedented was unfolding
over the nation's capital here in the United States of America,
God bless America. Radar operators at Washington National Airport were
tracking objects that shouldn't exist, Lights that moved in ways
that aircraft couldn't achieve, phenomena that would trigger one of
the most significant UFO flaps in American history. And let

(01:59:28):
me bookmark that and get to this. So from July.
This is from the Wikipedia. From July twelfth to the
twenty ninth, nineteen fifty two, again another summer of saucers,
maybe the original summer of saucers. A series of unidentified
flying objects sidings were reported in Washington, d C. If
you're not familiar with this, it later become became known
as the Washington Flap, the Washington National Airport sidings, or

(01:59:49):
the invasion of Washington. That's a harbinger, maybe the most.
You're right, James, you're thinking you're un croaked, You're thing croaked.
You're spitting out tapped into the matrix again. Just just
start Discord, restart. They'll get frustrated, we'll get this fixed.
We'll figure out exactly what that hardware aspect is. We

(02:00:11):
think it's his headset. So yeah, yeah, so I'm gonna
drop you out in Just please please come back, Just
reach restart Discord and then we'll see you back in
a second. We'll try again a second here. I know
it's frustrating and technology and the rest, but I think
we've narrowed it down to his headset. We thought we
had it fixed. Thank you, James, Sorry about that.

Speaker 3 (02:00:30):
Okay.

Speaker 1 (02:00:30):
So the most pubblicized sightings took place on consecutive weekends
July nineteenth and twentieth and July twenty sixth and twenty seventh.
UFO historian Curtis Peebles called the incident the climax of
the nineteen fifty two UFO flap end quote, never before
or after did Project Blue Book and the Air Force
undergo such a tidal wave of UFO reports. This went
on to become one of the most known UFO sightings ever.

(02:00:52):
And so it's interesting to me that we have this
the synchronicity space of the timing, and not just because
of all the nuclear testing. All of this again that
inflection point of history that I like to call I
like to point out in some of these unprecedented spaces
we're in one now with this acceleration to that singularity,

(02:01:14):
but back then it was the nuclear acceleration to that
level of technology. And so you know that the bombs
had been dropped, and like I've been reading things recently
saying there's people saying the bombs never were dropped and
all kinds of stuff, and I'm like, I don't know,
like like like literally just as showing all of known history,
I don't know. Like that type of stuff to me

(02:01:35):
is maybe maybe go there and see it or something
instead of like reading stuff on the internet before you
make those type of claims. Anyway, I'm saying I'm not
not ready to go there yet. I'll bet you there's
some horrific things if you go on the ground. Anyway,
So back then, so Bob Abob, the nineteen fifty two
UFO flap, Okay, so in April third, the Associated Press

(02:01:56):
reports an upcoming story in the Life magazine that would
reveal the Force was taking a serious interest in flying saucers.
And this is we've covered this extensively, all of this again,
the Kenneth Arnold, the nineteen forty seven, the naming of
the UFO. They weren't discs, remember, they were actually what
were they? Boomerangs? I believe initially, I mean, there's a

(02:02:17):
whole bunch of stuff that kind of fits into this
larger synchronistic aspect. But again, now when you're looking at
this through the lens of history and recognizing that during
the same time we had these transiing events happening that
were possibly I mean, dare we suggest alien craft. I
don't think you could say that enough of them were
out there to be like, you know, asteroids covered an

(02:02:43):
ice or so, you know what I mean, something like that.
I mean, I don't think so. But again I don't.
I'm not the arbiter of the truth of the cosmos, obviously,
because if I was, why would I be doing this
and talking about these things. I just tell you, I
just right raised the heavens or whatever, like part the
sea or whatever. But I'm not okay. And so this

(02:03:04):
as this comes together, it makes me wonder, as Derek
was saying, too, are we supposed to be watching this stuff?
And if we're not smart enough to recognize as something
like this is happening, it's something that's so ridiculous in
terms of known physics, in terms of known cosmology, in
terms of known anything, that maybe it's sort of the

(02:03:25):
collective human IQ test of Earth, Like they're not even
smart enough to recognize, you know, like two hundred stars
dipped right, and we even gave them the hint of
buzzing over you know, Washington, d C. With some some
lights in the sky, you know what I mean. So
that type of thing I could see from an advanced

(02:03:47):
civilization in the aspect of you know, back to the
star trek, that the whole idea. But I don't know,
Like what is your guys feeling on this? Like I said,
there's a lot here scientifically, and there's a lot that's
again being peer reviewed, and a lot of things happening
in the space. And like I said, I say this
a lot too regarding UFOs and the stuff that people
say about them. Look, I'm not sold. I'm not sold.

(02:04:09):
On the official narratives. I'm sure that shocks you. And
it hasn't endeared me to the you know, quote UFO
crowd either, because there's all these official narratives that are
just running up and down, and I'm like, wait a minute, now,
didn't we hear that the exact opposite of the thing
was true? You know, six months ago? Now on that
now this thing is now instead. I mean, we've got
disclosure upon us. You know, a UFO as big as

(02:04:31):
the size of a football stadium, and we know the
location of except nobody will tell us where this is.
You see what I mean. It's like everybody has the
tantalizing clues and the smoking gun, but nobody's willing to say, well,
here's your smoking gun. So am I wrong in suggesting
that my tinfoil had tingles? When this type of stuff

(02:04:52):
comes to a screeching halt after all the wild claims
have been made, Look fine, look fine, Like I said,
I promise you over seven years, I've said something that
pissed you off. Maybe that was the thing I just
said that pissed you off. Fine, whatever, Look, I'm not
in this to lobby for some to kiss some dude's
ass because he's notable in the field or something like,

(02:05:13):
I don't care in case you in case you recognized.
But if there are plot holes around, we're tripping in
them and we're not talking about them. We're doing ourselves
a disservice in this space. James, welcome back. Test one two.
It's pray it works, no, sir, broken James. Oh James,

(02:05:38):
is it tapped into the matrix again?

Speaker 6 (02:05:40):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (02:05:41):
Sorry about that? Okay, So let's try it. Let's as
a if you're up to it. I know that you
may not be because this pisses you off, and it
pissed me off too. If you feel up to it,
reboot the system entirely, and then try again. If you
don't feel up to that, I understand. But I think
if this is the case and it does fix it,
I think I know what's up. I think I know
what's up. So it's a it's a more of a

(02:06:02):
troubleshooting step if you're done with this, I understand, because yeah,
tech tech issues pissed me off to anyway, So you
get what I mean. Like, I'm not here to endear
myself to lobbies, to endear myself to whatever i'man whatever
like I said, I'm not telling you to step off

(02:06:23):
and get lost. I'm saying that there are questions that
need to be asked, and there are things that need
to be said, and I'm very diplomatic, like I try
very hard to not step on people, very hard over
the years, and many of you that have been here
forever can can testify that that's the truth. But still
I pissed people off because I'm like, well, what about that?

(02:06:44):
What about the other thing? How come all these guys
say they got all the goods and never bring the goods?
You get it? And I'm a bad guy anyway. Nineteen
fifty two, Washington, DC, the UFO flap. Remember we barely
had jetanes. Remember there were no satellites in the sky.
Remember none of that stuff was legit yet and yet,

(02:07:06):
and yet it was also a thing highly publicized. Clearly,
I wasn't there. I'm not that old though I look
at sometimes bags under the eyes at all. But you
get what I mean here, there's a problem. There's a
problem with some of this information. And if there's a correlation,
I get it, causation, correlation, you know, wild ideas, et cetera.

(02:07:27):
But if this timing of this particular thing, the palamar
anomalies as we're calling them, actually happened during this most
famous every UFO flap. I do wonder if there is
some sort of coincidence. I don't know, I don't, I don't,

(02:07:47):
but I do wonder. And that's it. James is having
an out of body experience. I feel bad for James,
He's a It is highly frustrating, and especially when you
think you got it all fixed and it was fixed,
and then suddenly now it's not fixed at all. So
if this does it, though, we've narrowed it down to
his audio driver on his probably his headset. So again,

(02:08:09):
the you know, fixing these things kind of on the
fly or troubleshooting them is part of the game. I've
been doing this for years. I at least, you know,
know enough to know what we've kind of considered as
not the problem anymore. And anyway, what do you guys
think about this? Like I said, there's a lot happening
in this space. We're talking about peer reviewed science happening

(02:08:30):
right now of one of the most unbelievable, mind boggling
ideas that's ever happened, not just vanishing stars, but also
possibly these transient objects reflecting lights in the shadow of
the earth. They're stationary, think mirrors or panes of glass.

(02:08:51):
What the hell is that? If that doesn't sound like
a spacecraft? What does be? Right back more Trouble Minds
on the way seven oh two nine one zero three
seven me back, Welcome back to Troubled Minds. I'm your host,

(02:09:22):
Michael Strange. You know where to find us all the
things Troubleminds dot org, click all the stuff. Eighty eight
point Forward FM, Mocoa, New Zealand KUAP Digital Broadcasting. Tonight,
we're talking again the Palomar anomalies when the stars shouldn't vanish.
And like I said, this is one of those things
that look, maybe they find some data problem and you know,

(02:09:44):
they're like, oh sorry, my bad. Maybe as part of
the peer review process that happens. That's fine, That's exactly
the way science is supposed to work. Okay, if you
can do something amazing or sort of catalog something inexplicable,
the whole point of that is to say, okay, please
double check me and make sure I'm I'm not tripping here.
And that's where that period review process comes in.

Speaker 7 (02:10:04):
I get it.

Speaker 1 (02:10:04):
Also, there's a scientific cabal. And maybe you don't get
me started on that, but clearly if you look, if
you if you can do something amazing and somebody else
can't replicate it, then there is a problem. And this
is where this type of thing happens. And why again
we're early on this, because we're early on everything as

(02:10:25):
part of the troubled Mind's aspect. But then beyond that,
if something comes of this that I don't know as usual,
if if something amazing kind of peels out of this
and we're talking Kardashiv five civilizations or something like, those
type of ideas start getting kicked around like they are
sometimes by the way, look at Gary Nolan and some
of these guys are talking about, you know, these entities

(02:10:45):
that are you know, the big pie phenomenon itself, And
so what does that mean? That would be like a
Kardashev three, four or five type of civilization. We would
not be able to define it in human terms. It
would sort of be phenomenal us trickster esque. It would
be indifferent. Maybe it wouldn't give a damn about us.
I mean, there's so many ways to look at that,

(02:11:06):
and that kind of taps into that cosmic horror that
we're always talking about that love crafty and Cuthulhu stuff
that at the deepest, darkest level of the cosmos, there's
an indifference. There's an indifference to the light of consciousness
here on Earth, or maybe there isn't. I don't know,
as usual, right, like, how much do we want to
kind of put ourselves in the middle of that cosmic narrative?

(02:11:27):
But you get what I mean. It's complicated as hell. Look,
and it might be frivolous nonsense or nothing. But also
there's a lot of people that experience a lot of
really bizarre things. So what does it mean? I got
some more to get to Welcome back, James, if you're there.
Test one two, My goodness, cross your fingers. Let's pray
this works. Can you hear me, James? Test one two.

(02:11:49):
I'm laughing, but it's not funny. I'm laughing with you, James,
if you're there. Okay, Oh my goodness, no, okay, So broken, broken, broken, broken,
all right? So so a full reboot didn't fix it.
The hardware seems to not be the problem because you
do your shows. Okay, we got we got some issues here.

(02:12:10):
I have no idea. What's going on with that, So
do me a favorite, James, all being after all being,
after all being after and get some additional information because
I figured it was going to be the audio driver.
But now if you completely reset everything and it's still
the same, then it's not. Okay. Yeah, yeah, that sucks.

(02:12:31):
That sucks. Sorry to hear that, James, appreciate you trying.
Like I said, I know it's frustrating when this type
of stuff happens and there's there's no way for us
to fix it on the fly. Okay, So back to
this now. Now, the whole point, the whole point of
this tonight is not just to kind of point out
great scientists kind of sticking their neck out to do
great work and ask these questions that need to be asked, okay,

(02:12:51):
but also to wonder what possibilities might arise as part
of it, and do you think that there would be
a cover up of such Imagine if this was a
sort of lead into a space that was big p phenomenon,
there was something that was like, Okay, look we figured
out sort of the breadcrumbs of the actual high strangeness

(02:13:12):
space that Jay Allen Heinek himself talked about as part
of that project blue Book aspect and the rest. And
if it's the bread crumbs that leads us in, then maybe,
just maybe this is the beginning of that disclosure, that
disclosure process we're always talking about anyway, So back to this. So,
the correlation between the Palamar transience and the Washington incidents

(02:13:33):
might be coincidental, as I said, but science demands we
consider this possibility first. But it also demands we acknowledge
when coincidences pile up beyond comfortable explanation. Another significant transient
event falls within a day of the peak of the
nineteen fifty four UFO wave, another well documented period of
an almost aerial phenomenon that swept across multiple countries. And

(02:13:54):
this is Clawed four point one extrapolating from the paper,
and it's again very good. I'm very imp These temporal
correlations hint at something deeper than a random chance. They
suggest a possibility that whatever mechanism produces transient astronomical phenomena
might be related to whatever mechanism produces observations of anomalous

(02:14:14):
aerial phenomena itself, which we see as UFOs obviously, but
this doesn't necessarily mean extraterrestrials Okay, as usual, there's the
binary aspect of all of these ideas come together because
you know, people like ancient astronaut Theoris say yes, and
if you believe that, that's cool. If you don't, that's
also cool. However, you recognize there's a space between there,

(02:14:39):
or even outside of those bookends, that is possible in
terms of right kind of stacking possibilities. But anyway, so
it doesn't necessarily mean it's extraterrestrial visitors, but it might
point to natural phenomena we don't yet understand, perhaps involving
plasma physics, atmospheric optics, or electromagnetic effects that can manifest

(02:14:59):
both at ground level and in near Earth space. Now,
what does that look like? What does that mean to me?
You know, one of my favorite theories, if you've been
listening to me for any amount of time, primordial nature
spirits some level of consciousness that was here long before
any level of actual sentience, and maybe even bringing that

(02:15:21):
sentience to us. Maybe that you know, we talk about
it as that sort of cosmic field of you know,
maybe consciousness came first and maybe those entities are what
carried it to us or you know, sort of breathed
the life of consciousness into us and maybe it's still here.
And we talk about the guy A hypothesis as part
of this like right, that that goes back deep and
far billions of years. So that becomes the question. So

(02:15:44):
in this case, so the researchers noted another curious correlation,
a statistical relationship between the transient events and nuclear weapons
testing back to Starfish Prime. Right during the period covered
by the Palomar survey, the United States and Soviet Union
were conducting above ground nuclear test that released an enormous
amounts of energy and radiation into the atmosphere. Could these
tests have triggered some kind of atmospheric or magnetospheric response

(02:16:08):
that manifested as optical phenomena or does this correlation point
to something else entirely, perhaps an external observation of humanity's
nuclear activities. And that's another again, you know UFO trope,
ufo idea that seems to resurface constantly and continually that
the UFOs or the anomalous entities that we're dealing with

(02:16:29):
are very interested in our nuclear capacity. Okay, so what
does it mean? Look, I don't know. And some people
even even go so far as to suggest this that
they're looking after us and they want to make sure
that we don't blow each other up, and some suggest
the opposite. No, they want to sort of escalate that
and help us exterminate ourselves. Look, like I said, in

(02:16:53):
the marketplace of ideas, this is what we're dealing with.
And can I vouch for any of it, of course not.
But these are ideas that are being bandied about as
part of this larger conversation. And don't forget there is
science that goes back that's being peer reviewed that might
stoke the weirdness of the high strange that we're always considering.
Love to hear your thoughts. Seven oh two nine five

(02:17:14):
seven one zero three seven. Thanks for putting your hands up, folks.
I appreciate the help very much. And sorry to James
Io you one. We'll figure that out and get that
worked out. DJ and Kansas, what's going on? You're on
trouble blinds. How are you just pop on in here
on mute and it's all yours? What do you know
about this? How does it make you feel? And what
are we dealing with? Welcome to the thing.

Speaker 2 (02:17:33):
Hello, how's it going pretty good?

Speaker 1 (02:17:35):
Pretty good? No complaints out of me just talking about
wild things with my friends. What's on your mind?

Speaker 15 (02:17:40):
So first off, if there can be a cover up,
but there will be a cover up, and then probably
already is a cover up, And that's just across like
my tenfoil hats radiating with this conversation, because of course
they're going to cover.

Speaker 2 (02:17:52):
Anything up that they can.

Speaker 15 (02:17:55):
Bike, So even the twinkling of a star, so it'sated
that it's not really twinkling, it's just an illusion caused
by the Earth's atmosphere. But like with that electric universe theory,
if you believe that ninety nine point nine nine percent
of the observable universus a plasma, then that kind of
changes things because then it would be like a little

(02:18:17):
ray of electricity instead, you know what I mean?

Speaker 1 (02:18:21):
Yeah, definitely, definitely, And back to that sort of the
plasma entity is part of it. I'm not sure if
you read the right yet, but there's a chunk in
there discussing exactly that and that sort of holographic theory
of the universe, and so yeah, I mean, so many
ways to look at it, and that particular thing makes
me go tenfoil tangling.

Speaker 15 (02:18:41):
I just said, it makes you sip the maybe juice,
that's for sure.

Speaker 1 (02:18:46):
Indeed.

Speaker 15 (02:18:46):
Indeed, well then all those ancient civilizations, like we will
never know what the sky used to look like, So
like what did they see like when there was like
no light pollution or was there? We wouldn't know because
we weren't there. But there were like petroglyphs of a
stick man, and they speculate that they were drawing these

(02:19:08):
pet It wasn't art, they were trying to relate what
they were actually seeing in the sky. And it's on
every continent but Antarctica that we know of that like
this little stick man has occurred and it just kind
of makes you wonder, like what kind of events were
they watching in the sky, Like were they seeing nebulas
and like plasmic waves? What did it look like before

(02:19:30):
we fucked up our ozone?

Speaker 1 (02:19:31):
Yeah, well not only that's my language. Sorry, Okay, I
appreciate that look. And the wild part is we're talking
about seventy five years and now we're like, okay, so
all this stuff disappeared. It was also anomalous in the
same space and could have been all kinds of stuff. So,
like you're describing, I think one of the most important
aspects here that I haven't brought up, and I thank
you for doing it, is that what did our ancestors

(02:19:53):
see if in seventy five years we're literally missing hundreds
of stars and then kind of looking back at it
and going, wait a minute, now, because we kept meticulous
records and actually took a sky survey is the only
reason this conversation is happening. And so what did they see?
I don't know? Like this this turns this whole thing
on its head, because what the hell does it mean?

(02:20:13):
And what have we missed for a thousand years that
has never really been cataloged?

Speaker 15 (02:20:18):
Well, and I think that it has been cataloged, but
it's been lost to time. So like ancient Sumerians recorded
stars and planetary movements, and so did the Babylonians, and
it just happened to be on clay tablets that have
been lost to time. So then it makes you then
wonder like how much knowledge have we lost?

Speaker 2 (02:20:40):
And also what they did with that too?

Speaker 15 (02:20:42):
Like I think stars are interesting because they mean different
things to different people, but I find like the trend
is that they're always linked to ancestors, deities, or souls,
which is kind of interesting to think about from like
the ancient culture perspective, especially.

Speaker 1 (02:20:59):
In the trans transient space, of these things vanishing and
just being lost to history, Like what does that mean?
And I'm formulating in a show there's an idea here
that's a larger contextual space in that looking at these
stars as maybe lost ancestors or lost ancestral histories that
were there and for some reason have now faded away.

(02:21:22):
And the movie Coco comes to mind. I don't know
if you've seen that, but definitely yes, right, something like that.

Speaker 15 (02:21:29):
Anyway, Yeah, it's just weird too because the star alignments.
Like so, first off, a shout out to all the
Leos out there because it's Leo season, but astrology, Like,
we wouldn't have astrology if our ancestors weren't looking out
at the stars. And also, fun fact for all you
star nuts is that Leo was one of the first

(02:21:50):
constellations that man looked at and decided to name Leo.
It was basically named after Ishtar with the ancient Sumerians.

Speaker 2 (02:22:00):
Just pretty cool or Babylonians. I might be wrong, but.

Speaker 15 (02:22:05):
It's just like, what what do we do with this
concept of the stars being in the sky and being
so mysterious because they're so far away.

Speaker 2 (02:22:12):
Like we have the Sun.

Speaker 15 (02:22:13):
We can look at the sun every day. Yeah, the
Sun's a star, but what does that actually mean for us? Like, yes,
it provides life, but what about all those stars millions
and millions of light years away?

Speaker 1 (02:22:24):
Yeah, and what do they say, obviously Biles.

Speaker 15 (02:22:27):
Yeah, like we have go Blecky Teplate, Go Bucky Tepe,
We got Stone Hinge, we got the Pyramids aligned with Orion.
I don't know. I feel like we're having an issue
with society now where we're vastly under utilizing the stars.

Speaker 2 (02:22:42):
But what that means I don't.

Speaker 1 (02:22:43):
Really know, nor do I. And that's why sort of again,
the wide open space of the conversation, I think might
jog something in somebody that means something somewhere that's poignant,
that changes their life. And that's okay. That's why these
ideas are outside of the political space because look what
they've done to us when we when we talk about possibilities,
were fringe idiots. I mean, yeah, it's not fair. And

(02:23:06):
so bearing the torch there in the torch, what else
you got? That's all I got? You're the best. I
appreciate you. Thanks for popping in here. I has a pleasure,
have a great night. That's at DJ in Kansas, to
get a good friend for a long time on the
YouTube and now on the discord. And yeah, that's what
this is all about, making making friends and again challenging
our own concepts of ideas, of structural reality of what

(02:23:31):
that means. As again, just think of it this way
in terms of a Kardashev to civilization. Let's say a
thousand years from now, for instance, just for throwing possibilities
out there, do you really think that our human dogma
cycles and experiences in science we'll have any bearing on

(02:23:54):
that a thousand years or ten thousand years from now
or whatever whenever that comes like that is going to
be magic, legit magic. And so we're still stone age
when it comes to quantum stuff. Imagine what the quantum
pham brings. Imagine what the idea of something like the
acotic record brings, or information theory as part of a

(02:24:16):
cosmic space. And I'm telling you, when I say these things,
it seems ridiculous to sort of the layman or the specialist,
but the generalist dreamer can go, yeah, maybe maybe maybe
this is where we're headed but also don't forget with
maybe comes maybe not. That's it seven two n's or

(02:24:38):
three seven. Thanks for the call, DJ, always a pleasure.
You guys are the best, as you know. Let's go
to Eric in not Iowa, but Ohio. What's our brother?

Speaker 7 (02:24:46):
Welcome to Trump?

Speaker 1 (02:24:48):
Exactly? No, Cornfield's out here? What's our brother? Pretty good?
Pretty good? This this is a wild one. Like I
could talk about this all damn night all by myself,
but I'd rather hear your guys take because look, there's
just so much here, and I got like a like
twenty five percent of the way through the right up
and the right up is very good. Guys. If you
haven't checked out the trouble Mind's newsletter, please check it

(02:25:11):
out troubleminds dot org, scroll up to the top, click it,
follow it on substack. But this one is it's so massive.
This could probably probably be three shows, but you know,
I kind of don't want to do three shows on
it because it's a lot of work, So I'll go
with whatever the shiny object is next time. But welcome
to the joint. What do you know about transient stars
and these vanishing aspects of uh well, the human experience.

Speaker 4 (02:25:34):
Well, I guess I got two takes on it, and
one I like and one I don't like, So I'm
gonna start with the one I like.

Speaker 1 (02:25:44):
Okay, okay, there.

Speaker 4 (02:25:47):
So imagine a long time ago there was the Old
Universe sort of to pick that, like you have discussed
in the Stargate, you know, where there's like people who
represent the culture and race, but they're starfaring people because
they're an ancient people, right, And so there's this old

(02:26:07):
universe like full of technology that is bordering on magic.
But a while ago, two trillion times the mass of
our Sun fell into a super massive black hole. Going
through that whole process described in the black Hole Wars
by Kip Thorn and Leonard suskay And and Stephen Hawking,

(02:26:30):
where the event horizon of the black hole acts as
a sort of temporal stopping point where things get encoded
in two dimensional space, but all the information is there
passing through that barrier adds to the circumference of the
event horizon of the singularity. But being on the inside

(02:26:52):
of that and having that two trillion times the mass
of our Sun inside of there, perhaps that is what
established what we call our local group, which is comprised
largely of the and drama of the galaxy M thirty one,
our own bar galaxy, the Milky Way. I love that
it's a bar galaxy, and the struggle on the end

(02:27:15):
galaxy which is M thirty three, and a whole bunch
of swarm of dwarf galaxies and stuff. Right, this is
our local group that we're kind of hanging out in.
And it's been proposed recently that this whole local group
is within the confines of a singularity where from the inside,

(02:27:36):
instead of the outside, where you're looking at the event
horizon as a place that stops time and encodes information,
you're seeing as the hubble field, that point beyond which
you couldn't perceive anything because if light was coming from
that point, it wouldn't have had time to get to you.
So you're effectively cut off in that sense, and you

(02:27:56):
would see that expanding away from you, that hubble you
as the universe or as the black hole would get larger,
as if it fed on anything. And that these lights
that can be seen sometimes are the old Universe from
the outside of the event horizon being perceived on the

(02:28:19):
inside where we are at through the filter of the
observer effect, so that you're seeing potential patterns that align
with an underlying substrate of information that AI arises from,
you know, because of the observer effect and the fact

(02:28:39):
that you're contained within a larger universe that you can't perceive,
but which may not have forgotten about you, but you
may have forgotten about it. That'd be my first take.

Speaker 1 (02:28:51):
I like that one too. I like that one too.
And again, I think if I recall properly, because ten
thousand ideas flow through as these shows come together, I
think that inside the black Hole business is in the
right up. If it's not, I tweeted about it recently.
I don't know, it's in my head. It's definitely been
in my head as part of this idea. So so
real quick on that would that be hawking radiation? You

(02:29:16):
know what I mean? So if we're if we're inside, Yeah,
would those be the UFOs? Will those be the UFOs
that we sort of see as they're maybe kind of
exiting our reality or I don't know if you're gonna
take on that. If not, that's okay, just kind of
came in mind.

Speaker 4 (02:29:31):
Yeah, I mean, possibly because hawking radiation bleeds off of
the poles of the event horizon as the whole thing spins, right,
and so it's like really scrambled information but could also
be organized in patterns.

Speaker 1 (02:29:47):
Okay, I'll take that as a good solid maybe and
no problem not to twister on from that.

Speaker 4 (02:29:52):
Serious about that, and you know you've heard of time dilation, right, absolutely, yep, Okay,
So you know, like that's the thing. And one of
the things that that implies is there is no now
that what's the past for you might be my present,
and what my future is might be your past or
some combination of those things. So the fact that we're

(02:30:15):
perceiving time in different ways kind of says that there
is no absolute, universal now moment. We all perceive the
now moment in our own way, which gives rise to
block universe theory, which is this theory that the four
dimensions of the universe, where time is the fourth dimension,
is a matter of navigating through the block universe, so

(02:30:38):
that in certain ways that you move faster or slower
changes how time is perceived by you, and then your
consciousness can only perceive a slice of it at a time,
like watching a movie go by, you know, at thirty
two frames per second, you only really see one present
moment in the film, but the whole thing is written

(02:30:59):
before and after. So it's this idea that the past
and the future are already written to some extent, and
within the block universe, it's just a matter of how
you navigate it, which fits in really well with the
idea that if you're stuck inside of a singularity, that
there is still a connection because of the way block
universe would work.

Speaker 1 (02:31:22):
Enough enough, that's a it's a lot for a troubled mind.
Late but yes, yes, but which is the point of possibilities?
And again, as usual, right, this is very highly theoretical
conceptual stuff. So everybody relaxed. If you're like, no, everybody chill.
Everybody relaxed. So let's get to the idea you don't like?

(02:31:46):
What's that one?

Speaker 2 (02:31:48):
The idea I don't like?

Speaker 4 (02:31:49):
And I guess I should practice this with the you know,
everybody can find their own truth. Even people that's looking
to avoid truths can find that. But in twenty twenty five,
there was a peer reviewed paper by Hambley and Blair
that noted that in the mid twentieth century, ob observatories

(02:32:11):
distributed glass copies of plates of surveys and the high
intensity copywriting and development process is the likeliest thing that
would have created these bright spots, which were micro dots
and static discharge marks that would appear in the transit
like points.

Speaker 2 (02:32:29):
So, in short, basically, this paper, this pure reviewed paper.

Speaker 4 (02:32:35):
Argued that no extraordinary explanation was needed that the aligned
vanishing stars could simply be the copy induced.

Speaker 3 (02:32:43):
Defects of those plates.

Speaker 4 (02:32:45):
So and it would also explain, I guess in this paper,
like it explains that that's why they seem to appear
and disappear is because they the lights only appeared in
the plates that were photocopied plates.

Speaker 1 (02:33:00):
Okay, I see, so this is even more weird than
I could dream. I'm a strange guy.

Speaker 2 (02:33:08):
So I posted that in the chat too, I posted
where that paper is.

Speaker 1 (02:33:15):
Okay, thank you for that, and I will follow up
on that. And I love these new ideas that I
haven't heard, that I haven't considered. And so what does
that mean about us in that let's say, in that
contextual space of what that scales to? What are we?

Speaker 3 (02:33:28):
Or are we?

Speaker 1 (02:33:29):
What are we? I guess as the general question there, well.

Speaker 4 (02:33:34):
I mean, peerod review doesn't equate into absolute factor proof.
It just means that the people in this whole you
know what I mean, It's like people agree, Yeah, that's
a reasonable explanation. Very likely aucomes razor kind of a thing.
That's the way I look at it, is like some
people are looking for the most mundane possibility, and sometimes

(02:33:58):
they prop gate that possibility up as much as somebody
looking for an extraordinary possibility. So on either side of
that fence, I worry about believing. You know, it's like, okay,
so maybe maybe that's the case.

Speaker 2 (02:34:14):
I don't really know.

Speaker 4 (02:34:14):
I didn't go and examine the plates myself. And of
course I'm not saying there's a conspiracy or nothing. I'm
just saying I don't really know myself, right, I just
found this paper where these people, these two people are like, yeah, man,
it's this you know, well, you.

Speaker 3 (02:34:27):
Know I have a whole idea too, man.

Speaker 1 (02:34:30):
Yeah, and me too. And we can write papers too
because of course in the uh what is that the
democratization of information and ideas. Everybody's an academic. You just
what I mean? And what I mean is, you know,
if we well have our chat GPTs and whatnot. But
but uh, I got your paper up. Thank you for that.
But what I mean is is, of course that opinions

(02:34:53):
and a holes. Have you ever heard this one? Everybody's
got one.

Speaker 3 (02:34:56):
Everybody has one.

Speaker 4 (02:34:57):
Some people get paid to put there's in print and
publish it, and some people will get thirst published. And
I'm getting a paper published here in October, nice through
Kinser in Company.

Speaker 2 (02:35:10):
It's a historical paper, but nice.

Speaker 1 (02:35:13):
And then then you will have become a true human
being in the true human sense. And of course you
since my sarcasm, that's that's the thing that makes its
true human man exactly exactly. I'm going to read this too.
I've been searching for this, this, this comment for the
entire time you've been talking because it was so funny.
I didn't read it. When when when Mattso posted this,

(02:35:36):
he said, we can't even get to level one, talked
about Kardashiev civilizations. We are still fighting over parking spaces.

Speaker 2 (02:35:44):
Right point three right now?

Speaker 1 (02:35:46):
Yeah exactly, exactly zero point three for the parking spaces,
yeah exactly. Uh So this paper that you shared, I
will link will be in the description below. So again,
thank thank you for sharing these ideas and all of this.
Like I said, I'm with you, you know, I don't know,
and I think it's important to stretch and kind of
consider what reality is. And when you see something so

(02:36:08):
jarring like this, when we're like, okay, bro, seventy five
years ago, there were hundreds of stars that we have
a record of that are now no longer there. And
not only that, the people looking at this think it's
not stars. The prevailing theory, at least as I understand it,
is there are some level of flat plate like glass

(02:36:34):
or something that's reflecting sunlight that we're catching as part
of our star surveys.

Speaker 2 (02:36:42):
Like that is.

Speaker 1 (02:36:45):
Various zoo hypothesis. I mean, all the wild things you
can think of kind of come to mind when you
consider that. And also if that's the case that there's
some level of conceptually, some level of entians to those things,
clearly they would cloak at some point, or you know,
maybe just be like oops, they saw us, and then

(02:37:08):
just turn it off and maybe they're still there, right,
I don't know.

Speaker 4 (02:37:12):
Apparently there was a lot of these that they actually
narrowed down to like three hundred and ninety nine. Apparently
they started off with a way higher number, and two
hundred and ninety KA had matches in infrared catalog, one
hundred and eighty nine were asteroids, thirty five or variable stars,

(02:37:32):
one hundred and eighty were high proper motion stars missed
by Gaya, and three thousand, five hundred and ninety two
were artifacts from plate visualization. After all of those things,
they still had five thousand, three hundred and ninety nine
that these guys started looking into or she wrote that paper.

(02:37:54):
So apparently there was like a huge amount of this
happening anyway, and they had to narrow all the possibilities down.
And yeah, like what they said was just what you said.
What was left over seemed to be like low Earth
orbiting objects that were really shiny like mirrors or really

(02:38:14):
uh always be this umbra and so and of course
it was like you had pointed.

Speaker 1 (02:38:21):
Out, you're cutting out, you're cutting out and so. So, Yeah,
which is exactly the point of this. I'm not sure
if you can hear me or not. That's a that's OK,
cut in and out. We'll give him a second to
maybe get his INTERNC connection back. But yeah, that's the
point is that if that's the case, like I said,
this gets very Superman. You know, the three bad guys
put in the magic mirror and floated out into the

(02:38:45):
galaxy or whatever. It's like the the eternal punishment or
not right, you get what I mean? Like, what does
that mean? And what does it mean when you look
at the the the actual reflection of these things. And
and also by the way, too, in terms of correlation
and kind of freethink, don't forget that. Remember of Mua Moa.

(02:39:06):
We talked about this ad nauseum. I feel like I
know more about this than nearly anybody on the planet
other than a belbe. We wrote the paper and was
doing this. But regarding a muamua, the first you know,
interstellar object that came through, they determined that it was
possible the mass of this thing was tumbling, and they
described it as even you know, as at its you know,

(02:39:30):
big d thickest you see what I did there, disclosure
I mean, but that it was sort of sausage shaped.
But then they even determined that the mass level of
this thing could have been flat, like a solar sale,
which brought that level of discourse to it. And so
here we are again looking at these things and saying

(02:39:51):
they might be flat, they might be glass like panels,
they might be reflecting sunlight, back to us. Yes, I
don't know, man, I don't know. This gets it gets weird.
I'm not sure if you're still there, Eric, you're internet
warbled out. If I'm talking over you, I'm sorry about that.
You're still there. Test one two, I'm not sure if

(02:40:14):
you bounced. I don't have the screen up. Nope, nothing nothing, Eric,
Test one two, last call, last round, last round. But okay,
I appreciate the call, Thank you for that. Sorry for
the again the tech issues, and again a special shout
out for James. I'm sorry about that. Like I said,
I know how frustrating that stuff can be, especially when
you're interested in the topic and got some things to say.

(02:40:36):
But thank you again for being part of this and
caring about the ideas. And again, go back and look
at that omumu a thing. I'm not kidding you. Some
of the estimates, the mathematical estimates of what that thing
was is that it was a very thin strip like
we're describing right now, except it was tumbling, which on
three axes. By the way, like I said, I know

(02:40:56):
so much about this because I was. I was following
this so closely. We talked about this ad nausea when
it was out, and now there's been a second and
a third interstellar object. And the third interstellar object is
buzzing through right now, and they're talking about sort of
redirecting one of our satellites to go check it out.
So I don't know, there's no like you know, tumbling
axes in this case as far as I'm aware, But

(02:41:17):
who knows. Who knows what this looks like? But you
see what I mean, there's a causation correlation some of
these things. You know, kind of squint and wonder what
this stuff looks like. And I don't know, but these
are questions that should be asked, and you know, be
careful of falling into the trap of what some guy said. Look,
I know I'm I'm some guy saying something, okay, But

(02:41:38):
what I'm saying is I don't know. But here are
the thoughts that come to my mind and the questions
we should be asking as far as I'm concerned. Of course,
you're different. You're going to think about different questions and
different ideas, and that's the point reality tunnels at all.
You guys are the best. Thanks again, sorry to Eric
for kicking you out there. I don't know what happened
to your internet. Sometimes these things happen, and that's the

(02:42:00):
way we roll as part of these conversations. Don't forget
to give James a follow. Troubleminds dot org Forward sized
Friends scroll down. It says follow James here. It's all alphabetical.
If you guys are interested in another version of this,
maybe down the road, or I don't, I feel like
I did too much talking on this Thursday or whatever.
Let me know, bring me or whatever, send me an

(02:42:22):
email or whatever. And yeah, troubleminds dot org Forward sized Friends,
scroll down. James the glue of the show. Thank you
for putting up with the tech problems. I know it's
a pain in the ass. And thanks for troubleshooting with us.
So we got more information on what's happening with you,
but I don't know exactly what that is. So I'm
gonna have to go deep in the tank and ask
Claude four point one, what the hell what's going on?

(02:42:45):
Because there's always an answer. There's gonna be some firmware
update that will fix all the things. While you're down there.
Get James a follow again. Trouble minds dot org forward
side Friends follow James. Also follow Eric again Hammersmith music.
Talented guy in a lot of ways that you can tell,
very science minded, very troubled minds the all the things,
and a talented musician. Please go check that out Troubleminds

(02:43:07):
dot org board side friends. Click on Eric right there
and it'll take you straight to his link tree, which
has his music and the things he's working on as
he adds them and continues them. I appreciate it very much.
Like I said, thanks for bearing with me, and right,
let's take one for the human team. I think there
are questions that need to be asked. There are narratives

(02:43:30):
that stink, and just because some notable person says them
doesn't mean we should buy them hook line and sinker. Look,
if that makes me the enemy of this disclosure movements trademark,
then fine, do I look like I care.

Speaker 3 (02:43:49):
What else?

Speaker 1 (02:43:50):
Look? I'm not in this for, like I said, kissing
somebody's ass. I'm in this for recognizing that the world
we live in is not as it seems to be.
That's it. That's the way I see this. Once I
learn all the things, we all will be the first
to know. You all will be the best. I'm not
from Texas. If you want to help Trouble Minds, help

(02:44:11):
our friends Troubleminds dot or force my friends. Shout out
to the Robert again for the generous donation over there
on Rumble. I appreciate it very much. If you want
to help Troubled Minds, you can sub up on Rumble.
It's just five bucks a month. And by the way,
I learned that it just drops it right into my PayPal.
So if you want to tip us over there, thank
you for that. The Robert did that tonight, and he
also subbed up over there and shout out Magavelli apparently

(02:44:35):
the official graphic designer of Trouble Minds. That guy also
also over there. He had tipping us a lot on
the deal. Rumble appreciate it very much because of course
we've been demonetized on YouTube. But don't forget the most
important point of all this is, look, I'm not simping
for money. I'm here considering ideas and wondering what all

(02:44:57):
this means. Am I wrong? You bet your ass. However,
the ideas that flow through here are unparalleled because of
our smart friends and our ability to detach from the
dogmas they've given us. As we finish it, goes exactly
like this. Be sure, be strong, be true. Thank you

(02:45:23):
for listening from our troubled minds to yours. Have a
great night. We'll see you on Thursday night. God willing,
don't forget the stoke mindset. Tomorrow is not yours until
it is, so, do your best and consider everything you
have in the moment.

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The Palomar Anomalies - When the Stars Shouldn't Vanish

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}The Palomar Anomalies - When the Stars Shouldn't Vanish