February 11, 2024 • 22 mins
Are you holding your business back by clinging too tightly to the reins? That's the central conundrum we unravel on the True CEO podcast, with LaKeysha Cobbs-Hayes & Sonya Songer, where we dissect the 'control freak' mindset and its complex relationship with business growth. As an experienced CEO strategist, LaKeysha lends her expertise to this rich discussion, helping us uncover how the urge to control can be both a fortress and a cage for company leaders. We venture into the psychological roots of control, debating the implications of fear and identity entanglement in one's business. Plus, we don't shy away from the contentious debate over HR's tight grip on sensitive matters versus the liberation necessary for scaling operations. If you're ready to equip your team for success without stifling creativity, join us for a transformative conversation on empowering leadership.
This episode is not just a deep investigation into the balance of control—it's a roadmap to fostering an environment where predictability and stability meet focus and consistency. You'll discover the detrimental effects of micromanagement on company culture and the underestimated power of clear communication and Standard Operating Procedures (SOPs). Together with LaKeysha & Sonya, we explore the evolutionary journey from prioritizing loyalty to valuing adaptability and share our own experiences of making this critical shift. Whether you're a budding entrepreneur or a seasoned leader looking to refine your approach, this episode promises actionable insights to guide your company towards becoming a thriving empire. Tune in, equip yourself with strategic wisdom, and set your business on the path of exponential growth.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:26):
Hello, welcome to an episode ofthe True CEO podcast where we
delve into the intricate worldof business dynamics.
I'm Sonya Songer, your host andHR strategist, and today's
discussion is a profoundexploration into the delicate
balance between control andgrowth.
Get ready for athought-provoking session as we
(00:49):
unravel the impact of controltendencies on your business's
journey to success.
As always, we have with usLaKeysha Cobbs- Hayes, who is
our all-around CEO strategistand expert, and she's going to
get us started out on this topicby helping us understand the
control freak mentality.
Oh man.
LaKeysha Cobbs-Hayes (01:11):
You know that's putting a lot of pressure
over here.
Sonya Songer (01:14):
I mean, I said helping us understand.
I didn't say that you weregoing to just throw it all out
there, because of course, that'swhat this podcast is about is
all of us sharing our opinionson these various topics.
LaKeysha Cobbs-Hayes (01:27):
So Well, I mean, if we have to go ahead
and define control freak in abusiness context, it technically
refers to an individual whoexhibits an intense desire to
maintain authority andmicromanage various aspects of
their work environment, which iskind of crazy, because in one
(01:52):
aspect you got your finger up.
Sonya Songer (01:55):
I'm just I'm not even going to lie to you guys,
I'm not even going to do it.
There are absolutely certainaspects of my roles in HR
professional that I cannot helpmyself and I'm absolutely a
control freak about.
LaKeysha Cobbs-Hayes (02:10):
Based on that, based on that description
of what control freak means in abusiness environment, and I
think, in certain aspects, youdo have to be a control freak,
especially when it comes todelicacy situations.
Right, you're dealing withdelicate information, and so
there has to be a protocol,there has to be something where
(02:32):
you have a checklist hey, thisis what's getting done, this is
who this information is beingshared with, this is how this
information is being shared, andso I think, in certain aspects,
yes, there has to be a certainlevel of control.
However, when you are buildingyour business, transitioning
(02:52):
from working into, on yourbusiness, you've discussed this
before also then that's wherewe're really looking at as far
as business is concerned and Ithink that's where a lot of
people get caught up is, if youwant to grow your business, you
have to let go, you have toallow people to come in, you
(03:14):
have to allow for them to makethose mistakes.
You have to.
You know for lack of a betterword is you just have to be
laxed and you have to say OK,I'm not the only person that
knows how to do this job.
Sonya Songer (03:31):
Let go and let God For those that are religious.
If you're not religious, let goand let Sam.
I don't know.
The point is that's, I think, aphrase that I hear quite often
as just a basic descriptor ofwhat you just said you have to
(03:54):
allow individuals to make thosemistakes because you can't take
it all on.
There's just no way thosemistakes are going to happen
probably tenfold if you aretrying to do every single aspect
yourself, absolutely, asopposed to getting other
individuals and not being thatcontrol freak and allowing them
(04:17):
to learn from their mistakes.
So now it's just, you know itgets better and better.
LaKeysha Cobbs-Hayes (04:21):
Well, I think, and there's also a
psychology behind it, right?
So there's reasons why you'renot letting go, and some of them
are you're afraid to fail.
Sonya Songer (04:31):
Right.
LaKeysha Cobbs-Hayes (04:32):
If I give this to you, then I no longer
have control and I no longerhave ownership, and I think
there's a discrepancy betweenwhat you're thinking about.
Ownership, the language ofownership is I'm the owner, I
take ownership of whether thisship you know it sells or it
fails, right.
(04:52):
But on the other hand, is youalso take ownership of the
people that you are in charge of, and that's what makes a huge
difference.
What's happening when you'retaking charge of these people?
The ownership looks different,and I think that's the part.
I think that's the part like Ididn't understand in this whole
thing.
So my ownership is not whetherthe project is successful.
(05:16):
My ownership is whether I madethe people in charge of the
project successful.
And gave them the tools to besuccessful Exactly, and gave
them the tools to be successful,and I think a lot of business
owners don't understand that.
It's like, okay, well, theyfailed, so I failed and in a
certain sense, yes, that's right.
But the other part is divingdeeper and say what did I do to
(05:38):
equip this person to be the mostsuccessful person in this
particular?
Sonya Songer (05:43):
round.
And then I would even gofurther that, from an HR
standpoint, did you allow yourpeople to be able to take
ownership of that task of thatproject.
Because if they are not takingownership, then how can you
expect them to be engaged intheir job?
(06:04):
How can you expect them to takeownership at any other time,
when things go left and you'reasking questions to determine
how to best address a situation,but nobody wants to step
forward and take ownership forwhat went wrong.
(06:25):
People are quick to write uptheir staff and say that you
didn't take ownership.
But were you a control freak inthat situation?
Did you offer them the propertools and did you give them the
leeway to be able to takeownership?
LaKeysha Cobbs-Hayes (06:41):
Absolutely , absolutely, which actually
comes to the next part of this.
I don't even know if you knewthat was coming I didn't but the
desire for predictability andso a need to alleviate all of
the anxieties associated withthe unpredictable nature of
business, which is absolutelyuncontrollable.
(07:06):
You cannot predict everysituation.
You're going to hope and thenalso you're going to lean on
what you know.
But, as a new business owner,you can't lean on what you know
because you don't know, you'renot going to know until you do
it.
A friend of mine, we werehaving this discussion yesterday
and she was saying like, hey, Ilike the aspect of putting all
(07:30):
of the details together.
So she's more on the operationside, she's more of the hey,
come to me, when you are, youjust want the information, and
so, therefore, I'll build outall of your systems.
And I was like, and that'samazing for people within their
first one or two years, not sogreat for people that start to
(07:51):
get into the third and fourthyear, because you need that at
first, because you don't knowwhat you don't know.
You need to get around peoplethat know their profession.
And there's always this thingoh, I don't have enough money,
or I don't trust anyone, orright?
There's so many differentreasons as to why you don't have
those people work with youfirst.
(08:12):
The second part of that is, yes, you need that in the beginning
the systems but you absolutelyshould not be operating and
working in areas that is notyour expertise.
You either need to consultthose out or you need to, you
know, have somebody there.
So it just depends on you knowwhat your financial need is.
(08:33):
But you can always bring in aconsultant for Four to five
hours a month, based on if youhave the system set up.
But what I was telling her isthat's not so great and for
people that's in their third orfourth year, because your first,
your first year, your cultureis based on you.
It's everything that you think,you want, you desire for your
(08:57):
company.
But once you start getting intoyour third and fourth year,
then your company culture startsto change and it starts to
develop, starts to be about thepeople.
So now that your company hasevolved and then now is about
the people, those basictemplates are no longer going to
work for you and you need torevamp them.
(09:17):
So she's in a great businessBecause she'll always be there
to help you revamp it and lookfor different ways on and new
systems.
However, there's other areas inwhich you need to know exactly
what this is Right.
We're going through a changenow where HR it looks different
(09:40):
for us right now.
Things that I was just like, no, go ahead and take care of our
things that I'm going no, Ireally want to see this, but
that's also because I have abetter Knowledge of business.
That's also because I havethings that I'm looking for to
to build the business that maybeHR doesn't necessarily see or
(10:02):
that our operations doesn'tnecessarily see.
I'm the one driving thebusiness, whereas when I first
started, I was the one doing thebusiness.
I was in the back.
There was no way that I candrive business and build it at
the same time.
And there's, there's like thisbig thing with that right now.
It's when you first start right.
Sonya Songer (10:22):
So I Hope that everybody really heard that,
because I think that was a veryimportant thing that you said.
There's no way to drivebusiness when I'm trying to
build business Right, and sothis is a topic that we have
come back to in so many of thedifferent topics that we've
discussed thus far in thispodcast, which is knowing when
(10:43):
to be able to remove yourselfand Work on your business
instead of in your business.
I think that's such animportant and key component to
this whole control freak, youknow scenario that we're posing
to you guys today.
LaKeysha Cobbs-Hayes (10:59):
And then they also the the next one, the
next topic.
They have under, like thepsychology of being a control
freak, especially in businesses,the compulsion that's rooted in
your identity and self-worthright, and it's tied to your
ability to maintain order andefficiency.
Where, what is your identity?
(11:21):
How do you identify?
I mean, I know a lot of firstgeneration business owners such
as me.
I've never seen anotherbusiness owner there's no other
business owners really in myfamily that I can go back and I
can say, oh, I used to work withmy aunt or I used to go here.
There's no one that's there toteach me those things.
(11:44):
And I think that's intricate.
I mean, that's very specificand where you need to go as a
business owner and Identify withthose people that you can get
around to then say, okay, I'mgoing to Model my business after
these people, I'm gonna modelmy business after these people,
(12:04):
but you're not gonna know untilyou actually get into it and
then how to build your identityyour identity when you first
start as as an employee.
So it's just kind of like, okay, well, I have these certain
tasks, I work these certainhours, this is what I do, and so
you kind of stick to that and,like you know For lack of a
better word is just kind of likewhat the hell am I doing, right
(12:27):
?
Oh, you mean, I'm in charge,right.
And then we start getting intoimposter syndrome and just kind
of like what, what, what?
First of all, I never heard ofimposter syndrome until I
actually started in business.
And then the second part isself-worth.
I don't know myself worth andif you're anything like my
(12:47):
business, you went from zero tosix figures and then from six
figures to seven figures, allwithin the span of three years.
I don't necessarily know that Ibelieve that I work, I was
worth, that.
I don't think that I personallydid the work to get to that
next step.
You know, obviously I did thework to get to the next step,
(13:09):
but how do you think you gotthere?
How do I think I mean I gotthere by recruiting people,
literally, I think that'sprobably why.
Sonya Songer (13:19):
So then and then that ties into you had to not be
a control freak yes, in thatscenario.
And then that just kind of loopsus back to this whole thing,
because I think a lot of that,just like you were saying, in
the psychology of it, when youare releasing that to other
(13:40):
people but you have this tied toyour identity, then you feel
like you're allowing otherpeople to be in control of what
your identity is, and that's notnecessarily the case.
If you have that vision and Ithink that's part of like when
we're coaching and consultingwith new business owners and
(14:03):
stressing how important it isfor them to determine what their
vision is for theirorganization, what their mission
is, what are your core valueswhen you stop being a control
freak, if you have that in place, then you can ensure that those
individuals even though if youstill feel like it's tied to
(14:24):
your identity, it's still tiedthere because you have those
things in place and you're stillconveying that to others that
are able to take over thoseother aspects that you are not
necessarily an expert in.
LaKeysha Cobbs-Hayes (14:38):
And what ends up happening is you now
have Stifle creativity, you havestrained relationships, you've
missed out on differentopportunities and you're over
there micro bandaging and tryingto maintain authority.
(14:58):
And nobody likes you andeverybody's putting Probably
high turnover too.
Sonya Songer (15:01):
yes, so it's not to say probably high turnover
too, because if you're Stiflingcreativity, I mean you can pick
any and every survey aboutemployee engagement these days
and a lot of them will sayyou're talking about a new
generation of people that valuethe ability to have flexibility
and creativity in their job andfreedom right in their job.
(15:26):
And that doesn't necessarilyjust pertain to wanting to work
remotely right.
That pertains to having thatflexibility and freedom in their
actual job and being able tomake certain decisions and take
that ownership that we werespeaking to earlier in their
role, so that they can be moreengaged Right.
LaKeysha Cobbs-Hayes (15:47):
And what I'm saying too, also just in
this new age, I think.
When we first started workingit was just kind of like oh well
, here's your job description.
It might have said five or sixthings and we were just like, oh
okay.
And then they had that littlecaveat at the end that says and
other duties, as a sign andpeople hate the end as other
(16:10):
duties as a sign and HR peoplesuch as me love it.
Right.
So what I'm finding is you haveto over communicate and as a
new business owner, as someonewithin the first five years of
your business, you don't knowhow to over communicate, you
don't know what overcommunicating means.
(16:30):
And then also, you may beoverwhelming people by trying to
over communicate, and that'snot what they're asking for.
They're asking for a clear,concise way of doing things.
Where you don't even have aclear and concise way of doing
things, hits while you'reoverwhelming people because
(16:53):
you're not clear on what youneed to do, because then you
need to so you're just throwingin everything under the kitchen
sink, yeah, and you're trying tocontinue to control, because
you have not figured out asystem for yourself, right?
So if I tell you what I'm doingand it's wrong, then guess what?
I don't look like the fuck up.
Sonya Songer (17:12):
Indeed Right.
LaKeysha Cobbs-Hayes (17:15):
So I don't want to do that, so then I may
not even tell you.
So now you can't do your job.
Sonya Songer (17:21):
Right, or you tell me too many things that are all
over the place, that some haveto do with their job and some of
them don't, and some of themare kind of closely related, and
then again you're moving intothat control freak kind of
mentality.
LaKeysha Cobbs-Hayes (17:41):
So what are some things that you can do?
You can, what are some things Iknow?
Right, what are some things?
That is a very good question.
Some things you can do is youcan have your SOPs together.
You can consult with someonethat's going to fulfill those
(18:03):
areas that you're not an expertin.
You can make sure that you'remaking time for yourself to
really work on your business andand really drive your business
and this may be you know whereyou're working 20% of your day
is I'm going to focus onbuilding my business.
(18:24):
I'm going to focus on thosedrivers.
I'm going to look for keypeople that are going to help me
sustain my business.
Some of those people I know.
One of the things I talkedabout really early on and I know
is and I told my team is likein the beginning I needed
loyalty and today I don't needloyalty.
(18:46):
Loyalty is not a staple Right,I needed people to be there and
to be loyal because I neededsecurity.
Today, I don't necessarily needloyalty.
I need stability, I need focus,I need consistency, I need
somebody that can come in andthey can do their job, and so,
(19:07):
once you switch over from theloyalty part into the
consistency part and qualitythen it's going to now change
how you look at your businessand then also what you are not
trying to control.
Sonya Songer (19:22):
Right.
So, oh, very good points.
So thank you for joining us onthis enlightening episode of
True CEO Podcast.
Your time and attention arevalued and we hope this episode
has sparked contemplation aboutthe intricate interplay of
(19:42):
control and growth.
If you enjoyed this episode,don't hesitate to subscribe,
leave your reviews I think it'sbelow and share with your peers.
Until the next exploration intothe world of business
intricacies, stay tuned to thewisdom that shapes enterprises
into empires.
And so, with that again, SonyaSonger, I'm the HR strategist
(20:06):
here.
With True CEO, I also have myown HR consulting business,
BossyHR.
You can find me on all socialmedia platforms, BossyHR, with
the exception of Instagram,where I am Onlyb ossyHR.
Keysha, where can they find you?
LaKeysha Cobbs-Hayes (20:22):
You can find me at Strategic underscore
Behavior.
You can find us atstrategicbehaviorconsultantscom,
where you'll be able to seewhat we're doing in our
consulting business and True CEOand if you just happen to want
to see me, and then you can golook me up at LaKeysha Cobbs-
(20:42):
Hayes.
Sonya Songer (20:43):
And then, of course, we have all of our
consulting services, as in ourbusiness venture of combined
consulting services that areinclusive of overall CEO
information, human resources,marketing and accounting.
If you go to TrueCEOlife.
com, thanks guys.
Hello, welcome to an episode ofthe True CEO podcast where we
delve into the intricate worldof business dynamics.
I'm Sonya Songer, your host andHR strategist, and today's
discussion is a profoundexploration into the delicate
balance between control andgrowth.
Get ready for athought-provoking session as we
(00:49):
unravel the impact of controltendencies on your business's
journey to success.
As always, we have with usLaKeysha Cobbs- Hayes, who is
our all-around CEO strategistand expert, and she's going to
get us started out on this topicby helping us understand the
control freak mentality.
Oh man.
LaKeysha Cobbs-Hayes (01:11):
You know that's putting a lot of pressure
over here.
Sonya Songer (01:14):
I mean, I said helping us understand.
I didn't say that you weregoing to just throw it all out
there, because of course, that'swhat this podcast is about is
all of us sharing our opinionson these various topics.
LaKeysha Cobbs-Hayes (01:27):
So Well, I mean, if we have to go ahead
and define control freak in abusiness context, it technically
refers to an individual whoexhibits an intense desire to
maintain authority andmicromanage various aspects of
their work environment, which iskind of crazy, because in one
(01:52):
aspect you got your finger up.
Sonya Songer (01:55):
I'm just I'm not even going to lie to you guys,
I'm not even going to do it.
There are absolutely certainaspects of my roles in HR
professional that I cannot helpmyself and I'm absolutely a
control freak about.
LaKeysha Cobbs-Hayes (02:10):
Based on that, based on that description
of what control freak means in abusiness environment, and I
think, in certain aspects, youdo have to be a control freak,
especially when it comes todelicacy situations.
Right, you're dealing withdelicate information, and so
there has to be a protocol,there has to be something where
(02:32):
you have a checklist hey, thisis what's getting done, this is
who this information is beingshared with, this is how this
information is being shared, andso I think, in certain aspects,
yes, there has to be a certainlevel of control.
However, when you are buildingyour business, transitioning
(02:52):
from working into, on yourbusiness, you've discussed this
before also then that's wherewe're really looking at as far
as business is concerned and Ithink that's where a lot of
people get caught up is, if youwant to grow your business, you
have to let go, you have toallow people to come in, you
(03:14):
have to allow for them to makethose mistakes.
You have to.
You know for lack of a betterword is you just have to be
laxed and you have to say OK,I'm not the only person that
knows how to do this job.
Sonya Songer (03:31):
Let go and let God For those that are religious.
If you're not religious, let goand let Sam.
I don't know.
The point is that's, I think, aphrase that I hear quite often
as just a basic descriptor ofwhat you just said you have to
(03:54):
allow individuals to make thosemistakes because you can't take
it all on.
There's just no way thosemistakes are going to happen
probably tenfold if you aretrying to do every single aspect
yourself, absolutely, asopposed to getting other
individuals and not being thatcontrol freak and allowing them
(04:17):
to learn from their mistakes.
So now it's just, you know itgets better and better.
LaKeysha Cobbs-Hayes (04:21):
Well, I think, and there's also a
psychology behind it, right?
So there's reasons why you'renot letting go, and some of them
are you're afraid to fail.
Sonya Songer (04:31):
Right.
LaKeysha Cobbs-Hayes (04:32):
If I give this to you, then I no longer
have control and I no longerhave ownership, and I think
there's a discrepancy betweenwhat you're thinking about.
Ownership, the language ofownership is I'm the owner, I
take ownership of whether thisship you know it sells or it
fails, right.
(04:52):
But on the other hand, is youalso take ownership of the
people that you are in charge of, and that's what makes a huge
difference.
What's happening when you'retaking charge of these people?
The ownership looks different,and I think that's the part.
I think that's the part like Ididn't understand in this whole
thing.
So my ownership is not whetherthe project is successful.
(05:16):
My ownership is whether I madethe people in charge of the
project successful.
And gave them the tools to besuccessful Exactly, and gave
them the tools to be successful,and I think a lot of business
owners don't understand that.
It's like, okay, well, theyfailed, so I failed and in a
certain sense, yes, that's right.
But the other part is divingdeeper and say what did I do to
(05:38):
equip this person to be the mostsuccessful person in this
particular?
Sonya Songer (05:43):
round.
And then I would even gofurther that, from an HR
standpoint, did you allow yourpeople to be able to take
ownership of that task of thatproject.
Because if they are not takingownership, then how can you
expect them to be engaged intheir job?
(06:04):
How can you expect them to takeownership at any other time,
when things go left and you'reasking questions to determine
how to best address a situation,but nobody wants to step
forward and take ownership forwhat went wrong.
(06:25):
People are quick to write uptheir staff and say that you
didn't take ownership.
But were you a control freak inthat situation?
Did you offer them the propertools and did you give them the
leeway to be able to takeownership?
LaKeysha Cobbs-Hayes (06:41):
Absolutely , absolutely, which actually
comes to the next part of this.
I don't even know if you knewthat was coming I didn't but the
desire for predictability andso a need to alleviate all of
the anxieties associated withthe unpredictable nature of
business, which is absolutelyuncontrollable.
(07:06):
You cannot predict everysituation.
You're going to hope and thenalso you're going to lean on
what you know.
But, as a new business owner,you can't lean on what you know
because you don't know, you'renot going to know until you do
it.
A friend of mine, we werehaving this discussion yesterday
and she was saying like, hey, Ilike the aspect of putting all
(07:30):
of the details together.
So she's more on the operationside, she's more of the hey,
come to me, when you are, youjust want the information, and
so, therefore, I'll build outall of your systems.
And I was like, and that'samazing for people within their
first one or two years, not sogreat for people that start to
(07:51):
get into the third and fourthyear, because you need that at
first, because you don't knowwhat you don't know.
You need to get around peoplethat know their profession.
And there's always this thingoh, I don't have enough money,
or I don't trust anyone, orright?
There's so many differentreasons as to why you don't have
those people work with youfirst.
(08:12):
The second part of that is, yes, you need that in the beginning
the systems but you absolutelyshould not be operating and
working in areas that is notyour expertise.
You either need to consultthose out or you need to, you
know, have somebody there.
So it just depends on you knowwhat your financial need is.
(08:33):
But you can always bring in aconsultant for Four to five
hours a month, based on if youhave the system set up.
But what I was telling her isthat's not so great and for
people that's in their third orfourth year, because your first,
your first year, your cultureis based on you.
It's everything that you think,you want, you desire for your
(08:57):
company.
But once you start getting intoyour third and fourth year,
then your company culture startsto change and it starts to
develop, starts to be about thepeople.
So now that your company hasevolved and then now is about
the people, those basictemplates are no longer going to
work for you and you need torevamp them.
(09:17):
So she's in a great businessBecause she'll always be there
to help you revamp it and lookfor different ways on and new
systems.
However, there's other areas inwhich you need to know exactly
what this is Right.
We're going through a changenow where HR it looks different
(09:40):
for us right now.
Things that I was just like, no, go ahead and take care of our
things that I'm going no, Ireally want to see this, but
that's also because I have abetter Knowledge of business.
That's also because I havethings that I'm looking for to
to build the business that maybeHR doesn't necessarily see or
(10:02):
that our operations doesn'tnecessarily see.
I'm the one driving thebusiness, whereas when I first
started, I was the one doing thebusiness.
I was in the back.
There was no way that I candrive business and build it at
the same time.
And there's, there's like thisbig thing with that right now.
It's when you first start right.
Sonya Songer (10:22):
So I Hope that everybody really heard that,
because I think that was a veryimportant thing that you said.
There's no way to drivebusiness when I'm trying to
build business Right, and sothis is a topic that we have
come back to in so many of thedifferent topics that we've
discussed thus far in thispodcast, which is knowing when
(10:43):
to be able to remove yourselfand Work on your business
instead of in your business.
I think that's such animportant and key component to
this whole control freak, youknow scenario that we're posing
to you guys today.
LaKeysha Cobbs-Hayes (10:59):
And then they also the the next one, the
next topic.
They have under, like thepsychology of being a control
freak, especially in businesses,the compulsion that's rooted in
your identity and self-worthright, and it's tied to your
ability to maintain order andefficiency.
Where, what is your identity?
(11:21):
How do you identify?
I mean, I know a lot of firstgeneration business owners such
as me.
I've never seen anotherbusiness owner there's no other
business owners really in myfamily that I can go back and I
can say, oh, I used to work withmy aunt or I used to go here.
There's no one that's there toteach me those things.
(11:44):
And I think that's intricate.
I mean, that's very specificand where you need to go as a
business owner and Identify withthose people that you can get
around to then say, okay, I'mgoing to Model my business after
these people, I'm gonna modelmy business after these people,
(12:04):
but you're not gonna know untilyou actually get into it and
then how to build your identityyour identity when you first
start as as an employee.
So it's just kind of like, okay, well, I have these certain
tasks, I work these certainhours, this is what I do, and so
you kind of stick to that and,like you know For lack of a
better word is just kind of likewhat the hell am I doing, right
(12:27):
?
Oh, you mean, I'm in charge,right.
And then we start getting intoimposter syndrome and just kind
of like what, what, what?
First of all, I never heard ofimposter syndrome until I
actually started in business.
And then the second part isself-worth.
I don't know myself worth andif you're anything like my
(12:47):
business, you went from zero tosix figures and then from six
figures to seven figures, allwithin the span of three years.
I don't necessarily know that Ibelieve that I work, I was
worth, that.
I don't think that I personallydid the work to get to that
next step.
You know, obviously I did thework to get to the next step,
(13:09):
but how do you think you gotthere?
How do I think I mean I gotthere by recruiting people,
literally, I think that'sprobably why.
Sonya Songer (13:19):
So then and then that ties into you had to not be
a control freak yes, in thatscenario.
And then that just kind of loopsus back to this whole thing,
because I think a lot of that,just like you were saying, in
the psychology of it, when youare releasing that to other
(13:40):
people but you have this tied toyour identity, then you feel
like you're allowing otherpeople to be in control of what
your identity is, and that's notnecessarily the case.
If you have that vision and Ithink that's part of like when
we're coaching and consultingwith new business owners and
(14:03):
stressing how important it isfor them to determine what their
vision is for theirorganization, what their mission
is, what are your core valueswhen you stop being a control
freak, if you have that in place, then you can ensure that those
individuals even though if youstill feel like it's tied to
(14:24):
your identity, it's still tiedthere because you have those
things in place and you're stillconveying that to others that
are able to take over thoseother aspects that you are not
necessarily an expert in.
LaKeysha Cobbs-Hayes (14:38):
And what ends up happening is you now
have Stifle creativity, you havestrained relationships, you've
missed out on differentopportunities and you're over
there micro bandaging and tryingto maintain authority.
(14:58):
And nobody likes you andeverybody's putting Probably
high turnover too.
Sonya Songer (15:01):
yes, so it's not to say probably high turnover
too, because if you're Stiflingcreativity, I mean you can pick
any and every survey aboutemployee engagement these days
and a lot of them will sayyou're talking about a new
generation of people that valuethe ability to have flexibility
and creativity in their job andfreedom right in their job.
(15:26):
And that doesn't necessarilyjust pertain to wanting to work
remotely right.
That pertains to having thatflexibility and freedom in their
actual job and being able tomake certain decisions and take
that ownership that we werespeaking to earlier in their
role, so that they can be moreengaged Right.
LaKeysha Cobbs-Hayes (15:47):
And what I'm saying too, also just in
this new age, I think.
When we first started workingit was just kind of like oh well
, here's your job description.
It might have said five or sixthings and we were just like, oh
okay.
And then they had that littlecaveat at the end that says and
other duties, as a sign andpeople hate the end as other
(16:10):
duties as a sign and HR peoplesuch as me love it.
Right.
So what I'm finding is you haveto over communicate and as a
new business owner, as someonewithin the first five years of
your business, you don't knowhow to over communicate, you
don't know what overcommunicating means.
(16:30):
And then also, you may beoverwhelming people by trying to
over communicate, and that'snot what they're asking for.
They're asking for a clear,concise way of doing things.
Where you don't even have aclear and concise way of doing
things, hits while you'reoverwhelming people because
(16:53):
you're not clear on what youneed to do, because then you
need to so you're just throwingin everything under the kitchen
sink, yeah, and you're trying tocontinue to control, because
you have not figured out asystem for yourself, right?
So if I tell you what I'm doingand it's wrong, then guess what?
I don't look like the fuck up.
Sonya Songer (17:12):
Indeed Right.
LaKeysha Cobbs-Hayes (17:15):
So I don't want to do that, so then I may
not even tell you.
So now you can't do your job.
Sonya Songer (17:21):
Right, or you tell me too many things that are all
over the place, that some haveto do with their job and some of
them don't, and some of themare kind of closely related, and
then again you're moving intothat control freak kind of
mentality.
LaKeysha Cobbs-Hayes (17:41):
So what are some things that you can do?
You can, what are some things Iknow?
Right, what are some things?
That is a very good question.
Some things you can do is youcan have your SOPs together.
You can consult with someonethat's going to fulfill those
(18:03):
areas that you're not an expertin.
You can make sure that you'remaking time for yourself to
really work on your business andand really drive your business
and this may be you know whereyou're working 20% of your day
is I'm going to focus onbuilding my business.
(18:24):
I'm going to focus on thosedrivers.
I'm going to look for keypeople that are going to help me
sustain my business.
Some of those people I know.
One of the things I talkedabout really early on and I know
is and I told my team is likein the beginning I needed
loyalty and today I don't needloyalty.
(18:46):
Loyalty is not a staple Right,I needed people to be there and
to be loyal because I neededsecurity.
Today, I don't necessarily needloyalty.
I need stability, I need focus,I need consistency, I need
somebody that can come in andthey can do their job, and so,
(19:07):
once you switch over from theloyalty part into the
consistency part and qualitythen it's going to now change
how you look at your businessand then also what you are not
trying to control.
Sonya Songer (19:22):
Right.
So, oh, very good points.
So thank you for joining us onthis enlightening episode of
True CEO Podcast.
Your time and attention arevalued and we hope this episode
has sparked contemplation aboutthe intricate interplay of
(19:42):
control and growth.
If you enjoyed this episode,don't hesitate to subscribe,
leave your reviews I think it'sbelow and share with your peers.
Until the next exploration intothe world of business
intricacies, stay tuned to thewisdom that shapes enterprises
into empires.
And so, with that again, SonyaSonger, I'm the HR strategist
(20:06):
here.
With True CEO, I also have myown HR consulting business,
BossyHR.
You can find me on all socialmedia platforms, BossyHR, with
the exception of Instagram,where I am Onlyb ossyHR.
Keysha, where can they find you?
LaKeysha Cobbs-Hayes (20:22):
You can find me at Strategic underscore
Behavior.
You can find us atstrategicbehaviorconsultantscom,
where you'll be able to seewhat we're doing in our
consulting business and True CEOand if you just happen to want
to see me, and then you can golook me up at LaKeysha Cobbs-
(20:42):
Hayes.
Sonya Songer (20:43):
And then, of course, we have all of our
consulting services, as in ourbusiness venture of combined
consulting services that areinclusive of overall CEO
information, human resources,marketing and accounting.
If you go to TrueCEOlife.
com, thanks guys.
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