CARRIE COON joins me on the TV Topics couch to dig into her THE WHITE LOTUS character, Laurie. We discuss her infamous sprint from danger, the soul crushing moment more people need to be discussing, making dinner, commercials, The Leftovers ending, and plenty of TV Topics.
#TheWhiteLotus #TheLeftovers #CarrieCoon #TheGildedAge #Ghostbusters #MCU #Avengers #TV #FYC #Emmys #Interview #TVTopics
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Episode Transcript
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(00:03):
Hey, where's the remote? It's time for TV Topics, where
those who love television discuss the series and
performances that should be on your radar.
Welcome to TV TOPICS. I'm your host Stephen
Prusakowski. Today's guest is an actress who
left a lasting impression on me with her outstanding work in the
haunting HBO series The Leftovers.
(00:23):
Since then, if she's in it, I will watch it.
Films like The Nest and his three daughters or in the TV
series The Gilded Age, Fargo andmost recently The White Lotus
where she played Laurie whose girls trip to the flawless
Thailand resort makes her re examine her life.
It was a pleasure to speak with her, to learn about her work and
the TV she enjoys. Of course I'm talking about the
(00:43):
great Carrie Coon. If you follow her on social
media you might expect this, butthe conversation gets a little
bit dark but still a lot of fun.Hi, this is Carrie Kuhn, and
today I'm hanging out with SteveBrusikowski on TV Topics.
Well, let's get things moving. First of all, welcome.
I've been a big fan of yours since The Leftovers, an all time
favorite of mine. An OG fan.
(01:05):
Yes, yes. And I was so excited, not just
TV, but also your film work and and it's been amazing to watch
you. You know, I started there and
then to see you through the years, show up everywhere in.
Slow and steady, man, Slow and steady.
Well, and quality too. So that's, that's what it comes
down to. That's why I stay a fan.
(01:25):
So I was very excited to see youcast in the White Lotus.
Thank you. Mike White puts together a great
ensemble and this year's no exception.
Yeah. Before we get into your work on
the White Lotus, I just have a few TV topics questions to start
with. Remember there's no pressure,
there's no right or wrong answers, it's just all a bit of
fun. OK, so looking back at over the
(01:47):
years, what has your relationship been with TV?
Were you ATV junkie who watches everything?
Were you very selective? Do you have go to shows?
No, I was never ATV junkie. I was very busy, say in high
school, I was an athlete and so I didn't watch friends.
I didn't watch Seinfeld, like I didn't watch 90210 any of the
big shows you can think of from the 80s and from when I was
growing up 80s. I never I didn't watch any of
(02:07):
them. So I feel like a, like I, it's
like I'm an alien and I'm, and missing a bunch of references.
So TV came to me later when I started to have more time and
when I frankly, when I started doing it, I started watching
more because I had friends and Ihad shows that I was interested
in. You know, seeing, seeing what
was happening on TVTV got more interesting for me as a woman.
They were more female charactersI could identify with.
(02:28):
And so I watch more TV now because I'm a voter now.
I really have to watch a lot of TV and there's no way you can
watch all of it. It's impossible.
What sports did you play? I played soccer all through high
school and then I played, I ended up going to University of
Mount Union in Ohio to play soccer, though it's not a it's
Division Three school. So it was an academic
scholarship, but it was a real jock college.
(02:49):
We have one of the most, the winningest football teams in the
history of the sport. So most of the people on the
campus played sports. And then I ran track a little
bit, but I ran track in high school and we lost two meets in
26 years. My coach was really talented, so
I had an amazing track team and ran a little bit in college and
then gave that up to do theater.And then, you know, when I was
in Graduate School in Wisconsin,I still played pickup and stuff.
(03:11):
My my daughters both play, so it's soccer, basketball.
Volleyball, it's the, it's greatfor girls to play sports.
I just especially when you go off to school later in life and
you come in with like a community and it's just great
for your confidence and for timemanagement and leadership
skills. It just teaches you so many
things. So that's great.
(03:32):
You nailed all the big ones. I agree 100%.
It's great. As a late bloomer for TV.
What was your What prime time show was the first one that you
remember really loving? What a good question.
Doesn't matter how good or how bad it is just.
You know what, Northern Exposureactually was one my parents
watched, and so I would come in when I was hanging out with them
(03:54):
and I saw actually quite a lot of Northern Exposure, which is
kind of closer to that time of TV that I've been missing
mostly. I thought that was a really
great and fun show. I remember watching.
My mom was an ER nurse, and so they had ER on a lot as well.
Some were watching a lot of ER when it came out and that was
very impactful. That was kind of one of the
major, first major medical dramas of its kind.
(04:17):
Those are sort of the most I remember from like when I was
younger. Yeah, some good picks.
ER definitely stands out. That's kind of like a set period
of time that you live during theER era.
Yes. I mean, it was such a massive
hit, right? It just really changed TV.
And now Noah's back. Noah's back on TV doing the pit,
yes. Another and he's fantastic.
I just finished last night but. It was great.
(04:38):
I haven't seen all of it yet. Definitely catch up.
I will. What show makes you laugh the
most? One that you put on if you need
to pick me up or just. You know, I don't go.
I don't. I don't tend to use TV in that
way. But I would say that I loved the
absurdity of Atlanta, that that that kind of absurd sensibility
I really respond to. I also laughed out loud at Penn
(05:01):
15. I thought Penn 15 was so
encapsulated what it was like tobe a gross teenage girl.
And you don't see teenagers depicted in that, like, gnarly,
nasty, gross way. Also the best depiction of high
school theater I've ever seen onTV.
So that was really great. Yeah.
Those two probably my favorites I think for that.
Was my guest on on this? Oh, she was.
(05:24):
Great. I finally got to introduce
myself to her at one of those. You know, I think I met her at
the Emmys, but I just think she's great.
I think both of them are fantastic.
Yeah. And then then both very smart
shows, both give unique perspectives that don't always
get put out there for people. And you know, Penn, 15, might be
a little too mature for my daughters, but at one point I
want them to watch it because I think it kind of connects you to
(05:46):
say, oh, wait, that's not just me.
These feelings aren't just me. That's right.
And and we know that that kind of representation is really
important. It's nice to see yourself and
like I say, it took TVA long time before I saw people I could
relate to. Yeah, I mean, I, I think it
keeps I, I, I know I don't relate to embedded people on TV.
My, the characters I watch are not ones that are like me.
(06:07):
They're typically completely unlike me, but.
Then that's the power. But it's more for my, you know,
for my kids and for, you know, people who I know that I I hear
all the time. Oh, yeah.
It wasn't, it wasn't until this series that some a character
connected with me in this way. And it's like everyone should
have that. Everyone should have that
ability to say, oh wait, I'm seen.
(06:29):
You know, we have enough space to make the content for
everyone. I think Reservation Dogs is so
my husband's from Oklahoma and he's he's about to make the new
Sterling Harjo show. I mean, we'll just do anything
Sterling Harjo asks of us because it's so it was just so
amazing to see that community depicted on on ATV show and a
comedy. And you know, it was, it was
(06:49):
just very meaningful. So there's some great work
happening. Very much so.
Maybe this connects to that question, but are you a crier?
And if So, what is the last showthat made you cry?
No, my husband would tell you no.
He says. I have ice water in my veins.
It's very hard to make me cry. It's also very hard to make me
laugh out loud. I laughed out loud at Dynamite,
(07:10):
the film Dynamite. But I'm trying to think, when's
the last time I really teared upfor ATV show?
That's really hard to do. I don't tear up very easily.
I'd have to ask Tracy. He really?
My husband cries at everything. My husband cries at the Peanuts
Christmas special. I I I see that I can understand
that what what was the last thing that he.
Cried on an airplane that he cried at.
(07:33):
Oh, he cries at everything. There was a movie we were
watching just the other night and he was crying.
What was that? Some, I think it was some sort
show. Oh, it might have been we were
watching. Oh, I have to look at my
Twitter. I can't remember the titles of
anything. I don't remember any names
either. I'm That's how I work.
Oh my gosh, I'm terrible. Tracy wakes up in the morning
(07:54):
and he's like, what did we watchlast night?
And I'm like, I can't I can't remember, but but that's great.
I'm not cursed with the memory. I really did laugh out loud.
It we watched metropolitan by Whit Stillman, but this is I
know a TVATV podcast. Oh, we watched the killing
fields and definitely by that. I I teared up at the killing
(08:15):
fields. Tracy certainly did.
Like I say, we're in movie season right now.
We're we're, we watch movies when it's not any season well.
I was going to say you have an impeccable taste.
I I would follow you on Twitter and I see you your movie night
postings. Our letterbox.
And yes, and your in your in your commentary.
So on the flip side of that coin, what TV show do you watch
(08:38):
that you think would surprise your fans?
One that's maybe not impeccable taste.
Oh man, that's interesting. I just don't watch that much.
Let's see, what's something I like that they would be
surprised by? Oh my gosh, it might be so
boring that I don't even have like a like a guilty pleasure
(08:59):
show. No, I watch really.
I watch, watch prestige TVI think the revelation is that
it's I'm a total snob. Like, I don't watch Real
Housewives. I don't watch a lot of reality
TVI just don't. I just don't watch TV.
I I like that answer. Actually I can't.
There's certain shows, I won't name them, that I hate when they
(09:20):
come up with it when I ask this.No, because when I'm in a hotel,
I always so so the thing that happened to me in leftovers in
Fargo where technology doesn't work is true in my actual life.
My father was going to sign me up for a scientific study when I
was a child because every time Isat down at the computer or
tried to use the printer, every nothing works.
So when I go to a hotel, like for a job or for press, I can't
(09:41):
ever get the TV to work. And so I just give up and I read
my book. So when I'm not with Tracy, I
don't watch anything. I don't watch movies, I don't
watch TV. And when he's gone, I can't, I
don't know where anything is in our collection because he keeps
changing the system and I don't know how it's alphabetized.
And also I, when I, when I sit down and look at Netflix, for
example, I just get totally overwhelmed and I, and I turn it
(10:02):
off because there's so much content there's.
I don't know how many nights that, you know, like gather with
my family and they like, let's watch something and we sit there
for half an hour and then like, forget it.
There's nothing to watch, yet there's pages and pages and
pages. There's so much to watch, but
like you couldn't possibly agree, which is why my husband
and I have the arrangement wherehe chooses and I don't have to
make. That's one fewer decision I have
(10:23):
to make in in the day, which as a mother of two, I'm just by the
end of the day, I'm just like, please, somebody decide.
The worst question of the day. What's for dinner?
That's the oh. My gosh, it is every day and you
have to do it every day. You have to feed them every day.
No one told me that when I had kids.
No one said, hey, by the way, you're going to be cursed for
the next like 15 to 20 years. Yes, every night.
(10:45):
Every night. It's like that's I'm just,
that's what I'm going to be like.
That's how I'll die. Just like weeping and saying I
don't know. I don't know anymore.
Especially because my kids have hit this picky eating phase.
So one of them's like, I don't eat chicken Nuggets anymore.
The other one's like fish sticks.
And you're like, well, this isn't a restaurant.
And then you proceed to make them whatever they want.
I cook all the time and I say just do one thing, pick
(11:07):
something, agree on something and we're good.
And but no one will say, you know, do you want the pasta with
white sauce or with, you know, with the red sauce, red sauce,
white sauce. And like no.
Agreed. You have to agree.
I'm gonna mix it together and make pink sauce.
How old are your kids? 14 and just set turn 17.
OK, so they need to, yeah, they need to get over this and just
(11:28):
eat what you put in front of them.
See minor 7. And just like they have to eat,
you know, or you'll get arrestedanyway.
I tell them all the time, like we grew up and we just had like,
that's right, oiled hot dogs andgo, here you go.
It's on the. And the tomato.
Yes, yeah. And applesauce.
Applesauce was also a vegetable where I'm from.
The applesauce was like the thing that allowed you to pellet
(11:51):
everything else because you're like, at least I can eat this.
Yeah, it's good. Poorly cooked hot dogs and frank
and beans and things like that. My dad.
Did I'm Still here wok, which felt very edgy for rural Ohio in
the 80s. He had like this cool electric
wok and he would make us like, you know, like a fried rice and
vegetables kind of thing. It was so good.
He really was. He made, you know, we had frozen
(12:12):
vegetables, but he would like cream them.
So thanks, Dad. I I hope that one day that at
least my kids will look back andsay, well my dad did cook for
us. You know, if it cures me out for
everything else. Yeah, that's like he did.
Remember that you didn't have boiled hot dogs.
Well, you know, you just don't get any points.
That's not how it works. I don't I'm I'm expecting it.
(12:33):
So all right, well, let's move on.
We'll skip over from TV topics. We'll return to those in a in a
little bit, but let's first talkabout the white Lotus.
So what was your reaction to being cast in the series, and
was Lori always a character thatMike White had in mind for you?
I think they had dummy sides that maybe included bits of all
the women. Maybe they were heavily favored
(12:54):
in one character. So I was definitely given Lori
heavy sides. I know a lot of actresses were
asked to read for a different part after they submitted a
tape, but I think I was just Lori from the jump for any
casting director. I think that's right.
So so I sent my tape in. I got a phone call from casting
and then I said, oh, no, becausehonestly, having I have small
(13:15):
children and the idea of going to Thailand for six months
didn't necessarily feel tenable for us.
And so the question was, can we can we actually make this work
or do I have to turn down this, you know, very coveted job?
So I kind of panicked. I guess my reaction was Oh no
it. Was like yay and then oh crap
the reality of the situation. Yes, the reality.
(13:36):
Very challenging, yeah. And as an actress, when you
start, when do you start to develop the character?
And how did your idea of Laurie change?
As you like, Read through the scripts.
Well, thankfully, if you're lucky enough to work with good
writing like I am, a lot of whatyou need, everything you need is
on the page. That's how I choose to think
about it. I'm sure there are actresses who
(13:57):
have a lot of time to do some journaling.
I, my children are 7 and four, as I mentioned.
So let me just be honest, Steven, I don't have a lot of
time to prepare. I don't have a lot of time to
work on character. My work consists of making sure
I'm thoroughly memorized by the time I hit the scene so that I
can play and I can be present with the other actors.
And you know, Mike gives you enough information.
(14:19):
We talked a little bit about maybe her job, making her job a
little bit more specific. We certainly talked a little bit
about her home life. But but that's all.
That's all I needed. And then of course, you know,
we, we worked with our, our costume designer was given the
directive that the women were the same.
And so we had this, these racks of clothing and then we got to
kind of go in there and craft what we thought our vacation
(14:40):
wardrobe would be. And so that was an interesting
exercise knowing the circumstances Lori's coming
from. So I guess that was kind of a
part of it. But she was very familiar to me
as a type. She was very familiar.
There was some. There's a lot of there.
And then it's all reacting to your your coasters.
Yeah, I mean, I think the best work happens in between people.
(15:01):
It's not happening over here. You know, there's a selfish
version of acting where you're just trying to stand out, I
guess. And I've never been very
interested in that. I'm a theatre actor.
And so it all rides on your scene partners and how present
they are. And of course, I was working
with incredibly successful and professional women who I, who I
admire. And so I knew that piece was in
place and Mike gave us these really interesting dialogue
(15:22):
scenes that were quite long. So many of our scenes were cut
down for time, but we always felt we got to luxuriate a
little bit in the dialogue. And so we always looked forward
to doing those those big scenes with the three of us because
it's fun to, it's fun to get thelanguage.
It's fun to, you know, we, we started off the season just the
three of us shooting for the first, I think 10 or 12 days
before anybody else started shooting.
(15:43):
So it felt like a show about three women.
And then suddenly everybody elsearrived and we were only
working, you know, in the background or every few days.
And so you came to be very hungry to do the scene work
because you were missing it. And of course, I was commuting
to New York when I had free time.
So that was hard. That's a lot from from Thailand
to New York is. Yes, it's the longest flight in
the world, plus a couple of hours.
That was not easy to do. No, I learned a lot.
(16:05):
I learned a lot about, you know,commuting on long flights the
other day they you'd buy the Tokyo for a day and I was like,
how long is it? And they were like 14 hours,
like, Oh yeah, yeah, 14 hours. I can do you know?
It's easy. Yeah.
No problem with your eyes closed.
Don't be. Your character goes through a
lot. And she also had these very
steamy scenes where Lori let's loose.
(16:27):
And at the peak of her kind of sexual freedom with Alexa, it
takes a darker turn. My stomach sank when he begins
to talk about money right there in bed.
And you're like, this woman is kind of, you know, dealing with
maybe a midlife crisis, you'd call it, or there's some
existential crisis going on thatshe's dealing with.
And then this comes to her, like, right after, like the
(16:48):
where you should be getting yourtrophy and like, yes, I'm in a
better place. So how did this a moment affect
Lori and who she was? You know, who was already
struggling with these issues? It's a it's a rock bottom in a
way. It's humiliating.
It's humiliating. And all of her worst fears and
insecurities, which she has voiced earlier when her friends
are trying to encourage her to get together with Valentin, all
(17:11):
of those insecurities feel true,right?
He didn't actually want to sleepwith her.
He wasn't really interested in her.
He just was thought she had money.
That's really humiliating. And so Lori walks away from that
encounter with, I don't know, kind of her worst fears
validated. And so she hits a bottom.
And then there has to be, it's adark night of the soul, right?
(17:33):
Mike White has put Laurie through a dark night of the
soul. There has to be something on the
other side of that. And fortunately for me as the
actor, I got to kind of go through the the beginnings of
that transformation for her, thebeginning of that enlightenment.
How does she you? I think some people, if you're
cynical, you could look at that as just justifying where she's
ended up. And if you're less cynical or
(17:55):
more hopeful person, you may seethat as like a real spiritual
shift in Laurie where she comes to value her friendships in a
new way, where she understands the power of other people
bearing witness to her life. People that will always see her
from see the scope of her whole life.
You know, it's unlike a new friend where you're kind of
reintroducing yourself. And so, I mean, I think for me,
(18:18):
I feel like it's a tiptoe into something, into a transformation
for her, where she's being more honest about her life, where
she's being more honest about how she feels in her life.
And she's more honest about maybe having played the victim a
little bit about acting. She's actually made decisions
that have caused the consequences she's experiencing,
but she has not been thus far willing to take responsibility
(18:39):
for her part. And so I feel like there's a
moment here where Lori gets to start to take responsibility for
her part in those choices, whichis really powerful.
I don't know if she's entirely ready.
Like, I don't know how much these revelations will stick.
I think it will be very easy forthe women to go back to the
States and default to their old patterns because I don't know
how it is in your life. But I know for me, the harder
(19:00):
lessons I've had to learn in my life, I've had to learn them a
few times before they really make it.
It's very rare you have this epiphany and then everything
changes. I mean, God willing, people will
have that experience. But I don't know if Lori's ready
for that level of, of shifting, but but I think the humiliation
serves a function for her. And I think it's important.
(19:21):
I think that, you know, that high bottom, as we call it, if
you're in recovery, it's like she didn't have to kill somebody
with a car. She had a higher bottom.
She gets to maybe make some change without really disastrous
consequences. Yeah, I, I feel that scene gets
most people talk about you jumping out the window, which is
fantastic, but you know, it overshadows, you know what
(19:42):
really, what really happens to Lori there?
And I was really curious and I appreciate your answer and the
insight I. Think it's really powerful,
powerful moment for her to have to go through that.
So you touched upon this a little bit, but, you know, after
witnessing Laurie's secret breakdown early on, she finally
takes down the armor and exposesher vulnerability and her
discontent and her feelings about her friendship.
(20:03):
It's one of the highlights of the series.
Why do you think it resonates sowell with people?
And why is there, why do you feel there's like this conflict
about, you know, is this a good thing or a bad thing?
I think that in this age of social media pressure, everybody
is performing self on a level that we've never experienced.
Young people are crafting selvesthat then follow them home.
(20:25):
Bullying used to happen on the playground and you had to reckon
with the idea of calling someonefat and then watching what
happened to their face when you said it.
And now it's all anonymous and separate from consequences.
And I think we have become a little dull to the impact of our
to our own impact on other people in a way.
And at the same time, in this performance of self, where
(20:47):
everyone is believe somehow wholeheartedly in the in the
vision someone else is putting forward that we are left out,
that we are the ones who aren't succeeding, that we are the ones
who aren't achieving because we see it happening all around us
in these very shiny videos that maybe we're not as good at
making. I know that's my experience, and
it's really crushing and detrimental.
(21:09):
We know it's bad for girls. We know it's worse for girls
than it is. They have studies that bear that
out. And so everybody's suffering and
it's this, it's this thing whereif you're not participating in
the system, then you feel left out, even more left out in some
ways than you would if you were.But I think what we're finding
(21:31):
with these pledges to keep kids from having phones in school or
not use social media to a certain age is that the kids are
relieved. The kids are relieved because
it's all just peer pressure. They don't actually want to do
it. And yet here we are all doing
it. And I think it's just this great
passive fiction machine where it's also keeping us from, from
reckoning with the, the, the actual consequences of our
(21:53):
capitalist, you know, machine asthey're unfolding around us.
I mean, it's, you know, we'll beon our phones as we're, as we're
burning up or getting swept awayby flood because the, you know,
physics doesn't care about our feelings.
And, and I think we're not really, we're not really keyed
into just what a dangerous moment we're in.
(22:14):
And I think these phones and social media really, really, and
I think everybody feels that andthey feel the impotence, they
feel our own. It's like it's so much easier to
participate in this social experiment because otherwise you
just feel like you have no powerover anything.
So it's extreme. It's extreme and it doesn't.
And I think one of the ways we can start to move through this
(22:35):
moment is this radical honesty and radical authenticity.
Now, that doesn't mean that you are honest without consequences
like Lori tries to be, where shecalls out her friends on their
foibles without taking on her own right participation.
But but but like a kind of authenticity that we're not
experiencing community, right? We're lacking community more
than anything. And community is the only way we
(22:57):
will survive the many pronged challenges that are coming our
way, the only way our children will survive what's coming to
them. Fair.
I know that's dark, I think, butI think it is dark.
And I think, you know, the simple thing on this, on this
vacation, right? These privileged women taking
this vacation, if they had walked into the villa and said,
listen, here's what's happening with me.
And I've been really honest, they would have had a very
(23:19):
different vacation. But for some reason, they're
afraid. They're afraid to be exposed.
They're afraid to be vulnerable to each other.
And I don't know exactly what's happened to make us feel that
way in our friendships, but it has to do with not feeling like
it would be accepted, you know? So sad.
You know, with the social media aspect of it, it ties into we're
always being judged. You cannot do anything without
(23:42):
saying, wait, I need to make sure everything you see you post
is not just just to like, hey, look at the family album like it
used to be, or let's sit down and talk about what I did.
It's I'm going to put this out in the public and then be rated.
Do I get enough likes? Do people criticize me?
You know, and, and you know, with, with a show like the white
Lotus where afterwards you see these hyper critical fans and
(24:03):
like, and like, can we just be positive?
Can we stop trying to tear people down and just build
people up or just be quiet once in a while?
No, and that's, and that's the genius of setting the season in
a Buddhist country, because one of the tenants of Buddhism,
right, is to examine your comparing mind.
Now we are biologically wired tohave comparing minds.
That's how we stay alive. That's how we compare, you know,
predators to prey. Our brains actually function
(24:26):
that way. And when we have all this
leisure time now because we're not surviving, though probably
soon we'll be doing that again, it goes into hyperdrive.
So we're always, we are actuallylike wired to compare ourselves.
But what Buddhism says is that, you know, whether you're putting
yourself above someone or below them, there is suffering.
You will be inflicting sufferingout of the people, You will feel
suffering yourself. And so you have to uproot your
(24:48):
comparing mind. You know, that's one of those, I
don't know, fundamental questions about Buddhism.
So I don't know. It's, it's just really smart
that he sets it there. There was something else too,
but now I can't remember what it.
Was, I mean, there's so much youcan break, break down, you know,
not just with the series. But the tearing down of women in
particular, I mean, some of the,we knew we would be compared,
but it's pretty, I mean, I knew what I knew what I was in for.
(25:11):
It's pretty shocking to read some of the stuff about our
physical appearance. And you know, I, people always
talk about my age when they see me on TV.
I'm aging in HD and you know, I've chosen not to have any like
cosmetic procedures, just a choice I'm making for myself.
And boy are people mean about it.
People are really nasty about it.
And it's it's just really stark to see the people, what they're
(25:33):
willing to just kind of toss outthere casually about the way
somebody looks. Now, this is a choice I've made.
This is the job I have. I like my job.
I'm I'm happy to be an artist. I'm proud to be an artist.
So I'm going to keep doing it and then I can let you know,
trolling stop me. But it's pretty it's pretty
startling to read. Well, not that you need me to
say it, but I, I applaud that. I think we have we're, we're,
(25:55):
we're distancing ourselves from humanity.
You think if if you were in a time machine and went from the
50s to now and saw the people, you would think you were in the
the damn twilight zone. I know thinking about like I
think about when you see photos of these young men who fought in
World War One, like my grandfather survived the Battle
of the Bulge. The way a 12 year old looked in
like 1930, it was just like theyjust had so much more
(26:16):
responsibility than our children.
They just look like totally different human beings.
Anyway, it's fascinating to see what what time has wrought.
But yeah, you know, taking a stand for what women actually
look like. This kind of ties in as well,
and I don't know if I wanted to tap into this and we can ignore
it if you don't want to, but Kate Leslie Bibb's character
reveals that she is a Trumper. Seeing how these last few months
(26:39):
have played out, do you think that scene would play out the
same if it was shot today? I think it, I mean, there was
more to that scene, which I've talked about a little bit.
There was a little, that scene was a little bit longer.
And I think Mike actively chose to not have the politics over
shadow the show just as a storytelling to not a political
(27:00):
choice, not out of political pressure.
Yeah. I mean, sadly, the reality is
that that half, almost half of our country outwardly rejects
Trump and almost half of our country kind of enthusiastically
supports him to a cult like degree.
And when you have an informationsystem, you know, one of the
ways authoritarian regimes come to power is that they become the
(27:21):
only source of information. And so you've seen that that
takeover of of Donald Trump taking over the information
system so that it becomes a closed system.
So there's no way to penetrate that system with facts or
information or science. It's just all self reinforcing.
And that's just kind of one of the hallmarks of authoritarian
takeover. So it's kind of the same, you
(27:42):
know, it's, it's, it's just kindof become more cult like as it's
unfolded. And now you see there, you know,
the Republicans going so far as to our, our system of checks and
balances has completely broken down because they are unwilling
to challenge him because a, theywill be primaried by the richest
man in the world and they will actually be threatened.
So I guess they have good reasonto do it, but it's at the
(28:02):
consequence of our democracy. So that's too.
Bad and so much more. Yeah, and so much human lives.
I taught both my daughters, I remember studying it with both
of them checks and balances and trying to convey how important
it is. And then a few years later to
just watch it breakdown and say that's that's the core of what
(28:23):
really what makes America great.It's not, you know, all these
other things are add-ons, but without that it's lost and.
Having a dictator. Yeah, we're losing our identity.
We really are. It's a shame.
Or this may be who we always were, but only time will tell.
But we won't be around to sell it.
Really fun at parties. Really fun at parties.
(28:45):
Yeah, I know, I know. I don't trust me.
I I don't sleep at night. I really, I really don't.
So especially if you're paying, if you have children, you're
paying attention to what's happening with again, the
climate. And my castmates got so tired of
me being sad in Thailand becauseof the the warming of the ocean,
the plastic washing up the coralreef die off.
The mass coral reef die off started happening while we were
(29:06):
there. And it's devastating.
And the fact that we couldn't, Imean, I couldn't go outside
between 9:00 and and 5:00 because of the UV index and the
heat. So, and that was like the most
extreme those temperatures have been and they are now more
extreme this year. And this will be the coolest
summer for the rest of our lives.
So the fact that people can justoutright pretend that's not
happening, it's really, I'll just never understand it.
(29:28):
I'll never understand how how wehow we get there.
But but yeah, it's tough. Luckily we have some
entertainment to escape every now and then for an ass.
Yes, thank God, you know, and itactually does work.
It's it's rare that I can, I canpull myself away and actually
stop thinking about it. And the White Lotus did that for
me this season. Which?
(29:49):
And part of it was you jumping out windows, running away from
water guns, and you're Sprint away from gunfire.
Very American. Sad to say, but yeah.
I didn't catch it the first time, but when I watched it the
second time, I was like, man, I love that.
I'm so glad that people did catch it and pointed out and
make memes of it because it's it's hilarious and it's really
fitting. You know, when I first, when I,
(30:09):
I was standing by the monitor when they were shooting some of
the background stuff, like people just running through the
spa. And I remember seeing some very
polite Thai background actors kind of just, you know, trudging
through the background with a little.
And I was like, no, no, you needsome.
You need some. Just like white people running
so fast, you know, these like privileged Americans on vacation
sprinting through the resort because, you know, we're all
(30:30):
primed for a mass shooting. So depressing.
This is the most depressing TV topics of all.
Time, you know, really. I'm really.
That's what I'm bringing to the table these days.
I I get it. So would you do another season
of The White Lotus? Oh, I mean, gosh, if I was so
lucky as to be asked, I would love to work with Mike again
(30:51):
because he's a really, he's a marvelous director and he's such
a compassionate leader on set. And he just knows all the
characters better than anyone because he wrote them.
So yes, I would love to say yes to that.
It would be entirely contingent on where it was and the
circumstances of my family. It's just hard, it's hard to
make those decisions. My, my husband's careers also,
(31:12):
you know, we have two, two careers happening here and we
have to find balance. So like he's working right now
because I worked straight through from July until mid
January. Champagne problems.
I know in a time when the industry has really been
contracting. So we recognize how lucky we
are. We're very grateful, but it's
hard to find that that work lifebalance, which is basically a
myth anyway. Yeah, well the the quality work
(31:32):
is why you are so busy. Thank you.
I mean, I'm, I'm grateful. I, I love my IMDb page.
I'm really proud of the things I've gotten to say yes to.
And I stand by it. And I, I'm also, I have the
great privilege of being able tobe patient and sort of wait to
see what's worth doing. So you know I get to say no now
instead of saying yes to everything.
And to dig a little deeper into that last question, if Lori were
(31:55):
to appear on a future season, how would her life has changed,
which you kind of touched upon, and who would she arrive with,
if anyone? That's a good question.
I'd like to believe that she hadmoved herself along the
continuum a little more, you know, maybe like new partner,
new problems, but I don't know. Or maybe she's with her kid.
Maybe they've maybe they've grown into some, some form of
(32:17):
repair. I don't know what Mike would
come up with, come up with something, something more
creative than I. That's why he's the writer, and
I'm just the, you know, the actor.
And last, the white lips question.
What do you think would Laurie'sfavorite TV show be?
Oh, I bet she's zones. I bet she just zones out.
(32:38):
I bet she just watches like naked and afraid or something.
Is that what it's called? Yes.
Or like, you know, the Great British Bake Off.
You know, she's just like, mindlessly consuming something
that's far from her. I think her job is really
stressful. I'll take that.
So let's close out with a few more TV topics questions and and
get you on your way. So you grab a remote control.
(33:00):
A genie pops out and offers you this TV based wish.
What TV show do you want one more season of now?
It could be a prequel season. It could be an extra season
somewhere, put in the middle of it, or one tag down at the end
of its run and the same cast andcrew, it says, if time never
passed. Oh wow, do you know what show I
loved that. I think more people should have
watched Halt and Catch Fire. Oh yes.
(33:23):
By the end of that, they were all firing on all cylinders and
it was a fascinating quite conversation.
And the way the women overtook this, the show as sort of this,
the heart of it and the center of it and sort of the the
leaders of it technologically aswell was really fascinating.
But like Lee and Scoot and Mackenzie and Carrie, they were
(33:43):
so magnificent in that show. And I would watch anything.
The rest they're in now for the rest of their careers because I
thought they were just killing it.
And I thought that show was really under just, again, it was
one of those things like The Leftovers where the critics were
watching it, but but people didn't watch it when it was on.
And it was so, so good. It's funny I I always recommend
shows to people and I love that series and I thought the the
(34:06):
final season was insanely good but I always forget to recommend
it. I I have to put that down on my
list? Though kind of disappear.
So good. It's such a good show.
And do you have a favorite themesong that you cannot skip?
You know what? My husband and I watch Mary
(34:27):
Hartman, Mary Hartman, which is a show from the 70s.
We have the DVDs. So we for a while, when our kids
were going to bed, maybe a little earlier, we had more
time. We would watch a Mary Hartman
before our movie because it's sogreat.
It's such a wild, absurd show, you know, from the 70s, Louise
Lasser playing a housewife in Ohio.
It's just such a fascinating juxtaposition.
(34:47):
She's excellent. And it's so, so weird.
It's when TV used to be really weird.
Like, like network TV used to beweird.
I mean, we have weird shows now.But like, you know, Maude had an
abortion in the in the 80s on, you know, had contemplated an
abortion at 50. Like we just don't have that
conversation on network TV anymore.
So I think the Mary Hartman theme just gives me like Mormon
(35:09):
perceived feelings. I know that's a weird one, but
you know. Do you sing along or dance to
it? That's extra.
Points I can't it's been too long since you watched it, but
they every season, the only thing that changes is the mom
character. Who was this magnificent?
What was her name? She's a magnificent like musical
theater actress who was probablylike 10 years older than Louise
(35:31):
Lasser when she was playing her mom.
But every season the only thing that changes is the way she
yells Mary Hartman. Mary Hartman at the end.
And so my husband always does itanyway.
Dumb. I've got to hunt that down.
Do you prefer binge watching or weekly watching?
I I think it's good to exercise some patience.
I don't mind weekly watching andwe don't have time to binge.
We're falling asleep every night.
(35:53):
My husband's struggling to keep me awake to finish the movie, so
I just would literally fall asleep.
There's no way I could binge watch anything.
Now when I'm on location, I'll, I'll do a little bit more.
Oh, I tend a little bit more toward a binge because I don't
have kids there. Yeah, it used to be, if you
actually watch the TV show live,because they didn't even have
whole seasons on DVD, it was watch it live or wait till some
(36:14):
kind of random repeat showed up.You used to have to wait not
only for the next episode, but for the between commercials and
then between seasons. It was like everything was a
waiting game. It's true.
And I, I, I, I'm, I'm like primed to watch things right
when they happen. But also I've also come to hate
commercials. So I like I or like if we watch
even like the award shows, I prefer just to record it so we
(36:36):
can Fast forward through most ofthe most of the commercial
stuff. I just really have come to load
them. Completely understandable.
And is there ATV death that you would stop if you could?
Oh, oh gosh, let me think about that.
Trying to think of the shows that have really devastated me.
Oh no, I was not prepared to have we or.
(36:58):
Someone done. You can hold off and but in the
background and see if it something pops up.
Yeah, let me let that rattle. It is a big question.
It's. Really big and like who was I
really in love with? Who passes on?
Oh, you know, I when Calamity Jane dies in Deadwood, that came
(37:19):
comes to mind. She's so, she's so marvelous in
that part and she's such a, she's such a like soulful part
of that show that that was really sad.
I remember that being sad. That's old.
That's kind of digging deep, though.
Sure, there's something more contemporary.
Yeah, no, that's fine. I I actually like to, to dig a
little deeper because there are some that like that you still
(37:41):
remember going back years and years, like even.
So indelible in that part. I remember thinking that she was
such a great actress. And she is.
So how about 1 show that you used to watch that has not aged
well for any reason and can't believe you used to like?
Oh, oh, that's interesting. I mean, probably most of them I,
(38:07):
you know, it's Barney Miller's kind of a relic of another time.
And so you see some really what we would consider to be like
inappropriate themes or casting on that show.
But it's still a good show. Like it still holds up as one of
the most interesting depictions of what it's like to be a
policeman, which is basically, you know, doing paperwork in an
office. And then there's a, there's a
(38:29):
moment where he there's a shooting where the, where the
where, where starts with AW, where the Polish cop shoots
someone. And it's a whole episode, like
really processing the actual impact of that.
You know, we've gotten so inuredthis turned into a question
about something that actually aged well.
I'm sorry, I I totally turned iton.
(38:50):
You see violence on TV without consequence, and we've gotten so
accustomed to seeing like reallyextreme violence where everyone
just kind of moves through it without any, without blinking.
And that was I remember watchingthat Wojo Wojo shoots.
Yes. Yes, he shoots somebody and he
and there's a whole episode of him at home really mentally
(39:12):
struggling with that load. And I just thought, you know,
for all of the like, politicallyincorrect things that show does
with all those marvelous theatreactors that just come back and
play like a, you know, like a rotating theatre troupe,
basically, they just keep comingback.
You know, whatever mental illness or the depiction of gay
characters, whatever it is that is problematic or domestic
(39:32):
violence or whatever, at least it was talking about things.
And that depiction, like the consequences of violence, I
thought was really it was startling to see that on TVI
realized how few moments I'd seen of that kind of
contemplation on television. All right, just a couple more
questions and we'll get you on your way.
So the, the end of the Leftovershappened about 8 years ago.
(39:52):
Now I know you don't want to define what the ending means to
for people, but have your feelings or the way you
interpret it changed it all overthose you know over the years?
They haven't. They haven't changed and I'll
never say all. Right, cut that one, no.
(40:15):
But it's always interesting to hear what other people have to
say about it. You know, everybody has their
and it's really split. Where, what's, where do you
fall? I'm not going to say I think,
OK. It's a simple but like George or
Fargo, right? Like whether you think good or
evil wins out in Fargo or in Lake George, if you think she's
she's still there or not, which people haven't seen it, go go
(40:36):
watch it. It's a good movie.
It's a fun movie. I like those endings.
So do I, actually. It's great to have something
that you keep thinking about long after the credits have
rolled. But for The Leftovers, I'd have
to revisit to, to watch it and, and, and see because it has been
a while. I don't think I've watched it
since I had in my DVR since I recorded it.
(40:56):
And then they made me turn in myDVR.
I said one day I'm going to rewatch this.
Yeah, I don't if you're not going to give me more anything,
my assessment. Really interesting what an an
ambiguous ending reveals about the person who's watching it.
And to me that's so much more interesting than a piece of art
where you just and you finish itand you say, all right, well,
you know what? What's my snack going to be
(41:18):
before bed? That it's actually forcing a
little bit of contemplation. I love that kind of art.
I've I've become the queen of ambiguous endings, but I like
them. I appreciate them and I and
that's what art does it. You say what you think.
I try not to tell people what tothink and I also hate spoilers
so even discussing it right now if someone hasn't getting into
(41:38):
it too much. If you have not watched it,
anyone who hasn't go watch it. It is one of the greatest series
of all time. The first season will test your
patience the whole the. Whole smoking thing.
It's a humorless season. Which Tom Perrotta's books are
not humorless. They're quite satirical.
And so if you're a fan of Tom Perrotta's books, you'll say,
where'd the sense of humor go? But it comes back.
Just hang in there. Yeah, once you get to Season 2,
(41:58):
it, it starts to click and then you can't watch the rest without
Season 1. So it's, and also Season 1, the
opening moments with you and your family are some of the most
heartbreaking. I was, it was eight years ago,
so I was, I'd been a father for a little while, but it it's
crushing. Yeah, it's really I I going back
(42:19):
would be even harder, I think now that I because I didn't have
kids then and now I do so. There might be a reason I didn't
go back to it because of I also don't watch re watch a lot of TV
but it's not an easy. There's not enough time.
Who are these people that are reading all these shows?
I mean I know people are like, oh I've seen the Office like 3
times. I'm like who?
Who are you that you have this time in your life 'cause just
(42:39):
carry. I don't have time.
I finish one and I'm like here'swhat's next on my list.
Time to time to move on. Yeah.
I, I get 30 seconds to digest itand to go, oh, that was good.
And then once it's done onward. Exactly.
So I like these conversations I get to, I do get to actually
venture back in and get different get insights onto the
(43:01):
the work that I wouldn't have seen and directly from people
who who brought it to life. Very dry, good service
especially it does since there'sso much content now, it's very
hard to you. You'll miss things, you know,
unless you're paying attention to critical voices like yours,
letting us know what we're missing.
Well, I appreciate that. All right, let me close with
this one. If you had a magic door, one
(43:22):
that allowed you access to live in one TV show, popping in and
out whenever you want. So you open the door, you go in
your real life pauses. Which show would it be and could
be for any reason. Wow that's such a good question,
I never thought about it. The the first thing that popped
into my mind, if I'm honest, is there was an old British
adaptation of the Chronicles of Narnia.
And because I would grew up during Goonies and Narnia, I was
(43:45):
obsessively looking for secret passageways everywhere I went.
I grew up on an old farm, so we had like all these weird
outbuildings, like, you know, smokehouse and a milkhouse and a
barn. We were always trying to lift,
you know, find a way in to some secret room.
And so I, I feel so compelled bythe idea that there's like a
whole other world happening beyond the walls of or beyond a
wardrobe. And I just remember images from
(44:06):
that show really standing out tome and, and it's kind of the
world is sort of different everywhere you go.
So I think maybe that like old adaptation of Chronicles of
Narnia isn't. That weird.
I believe I've seen it, but it'sprobably 20 years ago.
Oh yeah, it's so oh. I wonder if it holds up.
I'd like to see it again. I'm sure my kids will watch it.
Trying to think if there's something else like I've been
(44:27):
watching or I'm eager to show them where I would want to live
in it. T VS pretty it.
Doesn't have to be a good world either, it could be something.
It could be a nasty world, right?
Where have to survive? Yeah, I mean, I don't know some
so. Just go explore or to watch.
Is so dark, like like most of the worlds I I like popping into
(44:47):
them would be deadly. It would be really tough.
That's a good question, though. I mean, oh, it's such a good
question. I haven't really thought about
it. I don't watch enough TV to know.
Maybe, you know, something like a world like the Nick would be
(45:12):
fun or like Deadwood, you know, a Wild West kind of Deadwood
where you got to pop in and out.That would be fun.
Take your guns a. Complete disconnect from this
world where it's complete, you know, where we're on our phones
and. Everything kind of Westworld was
sort of offering that wasn't like popping into Deadwood.
But yeah, some like, some like that kind of environment,
especially because I don't get to like, do Westerns, you know,
that might be fun. That might be ride horses, you
(45:34):
know. Is that do you think that's on
the horizon for you westerns? Gosh, I mean, I hope so.
Anything action oriented I'm very interested in.
I'm interested in action and I'minterested in comedy.
I, I always do, I, I do dramaticthings all the time, but I have
to tell you, my family does not think of me that way.
And most of the people that workwith me are expecting a very
(45:55):
serious person. And I, that's not how I conduct
myself on any set. I just I really try to have fun
and and bring some energy to theroom just so because we got long
days ahead of us, you know, so Idon't I I don't feel a heavy
like a heavy presence. I think I'm quite light hearted.
But so I don't know, action, comedy, something like that.
Well, I hope to one day hear about your comedic cowgirl.
(46:18):
Thank you. Tiptoeing a little bit, but
White Load is great up comedy sowe'll see.
I'll keep trying. Thank you so much for your time
for being a guest on TV Topics. I look forward to seeing what
you do next. If it's a western or not, I'll
be watching and and feel free tocome back.
I will next time I do, I will domy like preparation and remember
the TV shows that. I, yeah, I've, I've always
(46:38):
struggled. Do I share any of the questions?
Right, right. That's what I'll do.
I'll share a few of them ahead of time.
Maybe like round two I'll be better.
But yeah, that's good. I should also know I'm talking
about TVI could have you know, Icould have sussed that out
myself. No worries, I I loved your
answer so thank you so much. Really appreciate you having you
(46:59):
on there. Have a great day, it was my
pleasure. Thanks.
Thank you. Bye.
Thank you to the incredible Carrie Kuhn for being such a
great guest on TV Topics. Be sure to watch Carrie's work
on The White Lotus and The Leftovers, an all timer of a
show. Keep tuning into TV Topics and
be sure to subscribe on Spotify or Apple Podcast or wherever you
find your podcast. And if you really enjoy the
(47:20):
show, please give it a five starrating.
It really helps. You can also follow TV topics on
Instagram at TV under score Topics.
Thanks for listening and stay tuned for more TV topics.
TV Topics is produced by StephenBrzekowski.
ZAP.
Hey, where's the remote? It's time for TV Topics, where
those who love television discuss the series and
performances that should be on your radar.
Welcome to TV TOPICS. I'm your host Stephen
Prusakowski. Today's guest is an actress who
left a lasting impression on me with her outstanding work in the
haunting HBO series The Leftovers.
(00:23):
Since then, if she's in it, I will watch it.
Films like The Nest and his three daughters or in the TV
series The Gilded Age, Fargo andmost recently The White Lotus
where she played Laurie whose girls trip to the flawless
Thailand resort makes her re examine her life.
It was a pleasure to speak with her, to learn about her work and
the TV she enjoys. Of course I'm talking about the
(00:43):
great Carrie Coon. If you follow her on social
media you might expect this, butthe conversation gets a little
bit dark but still a lot of fun.Hi, this is Carrie Kuhn, and
today I'm hanging out with SteveBrusikowski on TV Topics.
Well, let's get things moving. First of all, welcome.
I've been a big fan of yours since The Leftovers, an all time
favorite of mine. An OG fan.
(01:05):
Yes, yes. And I was so excited, not just
TV, but also your film work and and it's been amazing to watch
you. You know, I started there and
then to see you through the years, show up everywhere in.
Slow and steady, man, Slow and steady.
Well, and quality too. So that's, that's what it comes
down to. That's why I stay a fan.
(01:25):
So I was very excited to see youcast in the White Lotus.
Thank you. Mike White puts together a great
ensemble and this year's no exception.
Yeah. Before we get into your work on
the White Lotus, I just have a few TV topics questions to start
with. Remember there's no pressure,
there's no right or wrong answers, it's just all a bit of
fun. OK, so looking back at over the
(01:47):
years, what has your relationship been with TV?
Were you ATV junkie who watches everything?
Were you very selective? Do you have go to shows?
No, I was never ATV junkie. I was very busy, say in high
school, I was an athlete and so I didn't watch friends.
I didn't watch Seinfeld, like I didn't watch 90210 any of the
big shows you can think of from the 80s and from when I was
growing up 80s. I never I didn't watch any of
(02:07):
them. So I feel like a, like I, it's
like I'm an alien and I'm, and missing a bunch of references.
So TV came to me later when I started to have more time and
when I frankly, when I started doing it, I started watching
more because I had friends and Ihad shows that I was interested
in. You know, seeing, seeing what
was happening on TVTV got more interesting for me as a woman.
They were more female charactersI could identify with.
(02:28):
And so I watch more TV now because I'm a voter now.
I really have to watch a lot of TV and there's no way you can
watch all of it. It's impossible.
What sports did you play? I played soccer all through high
school and then I played, I ended up going to University of
Mount Union in Ohio to play soccer, though it's not a it's
Division Three school. So it was an academic
scholarship, but it was a real jock college.
(02:49):
We have one of the most, the winningest football teams in the
history of the sport. So most of the people on the
campus played sports. And then I ran track a little
bit, but I ran track in high school and we lost two meets in
26 years. My coach was really talented, so
I had an amazing track team and ran a little bit in college and
then gave that up to do theater.And then, you know, when I was
in Graduate School in Wisconsin,I still played pickup and stuff.
(03:11):
My my daughters both play, so it's soccer, basketball.
Volleyball, it's the, it's greatfor girls to play sports.
I just especially when you go off to school later in life and
you come in with like a community and it's just great
for your confidence and for timemanagement and leadership
skills. It just teaches you so many
things. So that's great.
(03:32):
You nailed all the big ones. I agree 100%.
It's great. As a late bloomer for TV.
What was your What prime time show was the first one that you
remember really loving? What a good question.
Doesn't matter how good or how bad it is just.
You know what, Northern Exposureactually was one my parents
watched, and so I would come in when I was hanging out with them
(03:54):
and I saw actually quite a lot of Northern Exposure, which is
kind of closer to that time of TV that I've been missing
mostly. I thought that was a really
great and fun show. I remember watching.
My mom was an ER nurse, and so they had ER on a lot as well.
Some were watching a lot of ER when it came out and that was
very impactful. That was kind of one of the
major, first major medical dramas of its kind.
(04:17):
Those are sort of the most I remember from like when I was
younger. Yeah, some good picks.
ER definitely stands out. That's kind of like a set period
of time that you live during theER era.
Yes. I mean, it was such a massive
hit, right? It just really changed TV.
And now Noah's back. Noah's back on TV doing the pit,
yes. Another and he's fantastic.
I just finished last night but. It was great.
(04:38):
I haven't seen all of it yet. Definitely catch up.
I will. What show makes you laugh the
most? One that you put on if you need
to pick me up or just. You know, I don't go.
I don't. I don't tend to use TV in that
way. But I would say that I loved the
absurdity of Atlanta, that that that kind of absurd sensibility
I really respond to. I also laughed out loud at Penn
(05:01):
15. I thought Penn 15 was so
encapsulated what it was like tobe a gross teenage girl.
And you don't see teenagers depicted in that, like, gnarly,
nasty, gross way. Also the best depiction of high
school theater I've ever seen onTV.
So that was really great. Yeah.
Those two probably my favorites I think for that.
Was my guest on on this? Oh, she was.
(05:24):
Great. I finally got to introduce
myself to her at one of those. You know, I think I met her at
the Emmys, but I just think she's great.
I think both of them are fantastic.
Yeah. And then then both very smart
shows, both give unique perspectives that don't always
get put out there for people. And you know, Penn, 15, might be
a little too mature for my daughters, but at one point I
want them to watch it because I think it kind of connects you to
(05:46):
say, oh, wait, that's not just me.
These feelings aren't just me. That's right.
And and we know that that kind of representation is really
important. It's nice to see yourself and
like I say, it took TVA long time before I saw people I could
relate to. Yeah, I mean, I, I think it
keeps I, I, I know I don't relate to embedded people on TV.
My, the characters I watch are not ones that are like me.
(06:07):
They're typically completely unlike me, but.
Then that's the power. But it's more for my, you know,
for my kids and for, you know, people who I know that I I hear
all the time. Oh, yeah.
It wasn't, it wasn't until this series that some a character
connected with me in this way. And it's like everyone should
have that. Everyone should have that
ability to say, oh wait, I'm seen.
(06:29):
You know, we have enough space to make the content for
everyone. I think Reservation Dogs is so
my husband's from Oklahoma and he's he's about to make the new
Sterling Harjo show. I mean, we'll just do anything
Sterling Harjo asks of us because it's so it was just so
amazing to see that community depicted on on ATV show and a
comedy. And you know, it was, it was
(06:49):
just very meaningful. So there's some great work
happening. Very much so.
Maybe this connects to that question, but are you a crier?
And if So, what is the last showthat made you cry?
No, my husband would tell you no.
He says. I have ice water in my veins.
It's very hard to make me cry. It's also very hard to make me
laugh out loud. I laughed out loud at Dynamite,
(07:10):
the film Dynamite. But I'm trying to think, when's
the last time I really teared upfor ATV show?
That's really hard to do. I don't tear up very easily.
I'd have to ask Tracy. He really?
My husband cries at everything. My husband cries at the Peanuts
Christmas special. I I I see that I can understand
that what what was the last thing that he.
Cried on an airplane that he cried at.
(07:33):
Oh, he cries at everything. There was a movie we were
watching just the other night and he was crying.
What was that? Some, I think it was some sort
show. Oh, it might have been we were
watching. Oh, I have to look at my
Twitter. I can't remember the titles of
anything. I don't remember any names
either. I'm That's how I work.
Oh my gosh, I'm terrible. Tracy wakes up in the morning
(07:54):
and he's like, what did we watchlast night?
And I'm like, I can't I can't remember, but but that's great.
I'm not cursed with the memory. I really did laugh out loud.
It we watched metropolitan by Whit Stillman, but this is I
know a TVATV podcast. Oh, we watched the killing
fields and definitely by that. I I teared up at the killing
(08:15):
fields. Tracy certainly did.
Like I say, we're in movie season right now.
We're we're, we watch movies when it's not any season well.
I was going to say you have an impeccable taste.
I I would follow you on Twitter and I see you your movie night
postings. Our letterbox.
And yes, and your in your in your commentary.
So on the flip side of that coin, what TV show do you watch
(08:38):
that you think would surprise your fans?
One that's maybe not impeccable taste.
Oh man, that's interesting. I just don't watch that much.
Let's see, what's something I like that they would be
surprised by? Oh my gosh, it might be so
boring that I don't even have like a like a guilty pleasure
(08:59):
show. No, I watch really.
I watch, watch prestige TVI think the revelation is that
it's I'm a total snob. Like, I don't watch Real
Housewives. I don't watch a lot of reality
TVI just don't. I just don't watch TV.
I I like that answer. Actually I can't.
There's certain shows, I won't name them, that I hate when they
(09:20):
come up with it when I ask this.No, because when I'm in a hotel,
I always so so the thing that happened to me in leftovers in
Fargo where technology doesn't work is true in my actual life.
My father was going to sign me up for a scientific study when I
was a child because every time Isat down at the computer or
tried to use the printer, every nothing works.
So when I go to a hotel, like for a job or for press, I can't
(09:41):
ever get the TV to work. And so I just give up and I read
my book. So when I'm not with Tracy, I
don't watch anything. I don't watch movies, I don't
watch TV. And when he's gone, I can't, I
don't know where anything is in our collection because he keeps
changing the system and I don't know how it's alphabetized.
And also I, when I, when I sit down and look at Netflix, for
example, I just get totally overwhelmed and I, and I turn it
(10:02):
off because there's so much content there's.
I don't know how many nights that, you know, like gather with
my family and they like, let's watch something and we sit there
for half an hour and then like, forget it.
There's nothing to watch, yet there's pages and pages and
pages. There's so much to watch, but
like you couldn't possibly agree, which is why my husband
and I have the arrangement wherehe chooses and I don't have to
make. That's one fewer decision I have
(10:23):
to make in in the day, which as a mother of two, I'm just by the
end of the day, I'm just like, please, somebody decide.
The worst question of the day. What's for dinner?
That's the oh. My gosh, it is every day and you
have to do it every day. You have to feed them every day.
No one told me that when I had kids.
No one said, hey, by the way, you're going to be cursed for
the next like 15 to 20 years. Yes, every night.
(10:45):
Every night. It's like that's I'm just,
that's what I'm going to be like.
That's how I'll die. Just like weeping and saying I
don't know. I don't know anymore.
Especially because my kids have hit this picky eating phase.
So one of them's like, I don't eat chicken Nuggets anymore.
The other one's like fish sticks.
And you're like, well, this isn't a restaurant.
And then you proceed to make them whatever they want.
I cook all the time and I say just do one thing, pick
(11:07):
something, agree on something and we're good.
And but no one will say, you know, do you want the pasta with
white sauce or with, you know, with the red sauce, red sauce,
white sauce. And like no.
Agreed. You have to agree.
I'm gonna mix it together and make pink sauce.
How old are your kids? 14 and just set turn 17.
OK, so they need to, yeah, they need to get over this and just
(11:28):
eat what you put in front of them.
See minor 7. And just like they have to eat,
you know, or you'll get arrestedanyway.
I tell them all the time, like we grew up and we just had like,
that's right, oiled hot dogs andgo, here you go.
It's on the. And the tomato.
Yes, yeah. And applesauce.
Applesauce was also a vegetable where I'm from.
The applesauce was like the thing that allowed you to pellet
(11:51):
everything else because you're like, at least I can eat this.
Yeah, it's good. Poorly cooked hot dogs and frank
and beans and things like that. My dad.
Did I'm Still here wok, which felt very edgy for rural Ohio in
the 80s. He had like this cool electric
wok and he would make us like, you know, like a fried rice and
vegetables kind of thing. It was so good.
He really was. He made, you know, we had frozen
(12:12):
vegetables, but he would like cream them.
So thanks, Dad. I I hope that one day that at
least my kids will look back andsay, well my dad did cook for
us. You know, if it cures me out for
everything else. Yeah, that's like he did.
Remember that you didn't have boiled hot dogs.
Well, you know, you just don't get any points.
That's not how it works. I don't I'm I'm expecting it.
(12:33):
So all right, well, let's move on.
We'll skip over from TV topics. We'll return to those in a in a
little bit, but let's first talkabout the white Lotus.
So what was your reaction to being cast in the series, and
was Lori always a character thatMike White had in mind for you?
I think they had dummy sides that maybe included bits of all
the women. Maybe they were heavily favored
(12:54):
in one character. So I was definitely given Lori
heavy sides. I know a lot of actresses were
asked to read for a different part after they submitted a
tape, but I think I was just Lori from the jump for any
casting director. I think that's right.
So so I sent my tape in. I got a phone call from casting
and then I said, oh, no, becausehonestly, having I have small
(13:15):
children and the idea of going to Thailand for six months
didn't necessarily feel tenable for us.
And so the question was, can we can we actually make this work
or do I have to turn down this, you know, very coveted job?
So I kind of panicked. I guess my reaction was Oh no
it. Was like yay and then oh crap
the reality of the situation. Yes, the reality.
(13:36):
Very challenging, yeah. And as an actress, when you
start, when do you start to develop the character?
And how did your idea of Laurie change?
As you like, Read through the scripts.
Well, thankfully, if you're lucky enough to work with good
writing like I am, a lot of whatyou need, everything you need is
on the page. That's how I choose to think
about it. I'm sure there are actresses who
(13:57):
have a lot of time to do some journaling.
I, my children are 7 and four, as I mentioned.
So let me just be honest, Steven, I don't have a lot of
time to prepare. I don't have a lot of time to
work on character. My work consists of making sure
I'm thoroughly memorized by the time I hit the scene so that I
can play and I can be present with the other actors.
And you know, Mike gives you enough information.
(14:19):
We talked a little bit about maybe her job, making her job a
little bit more specific. We certainly talked a little bit
about her home life. But but that's all.
That's all I needed. And then of course, you know,
we, we worked with our, our costume designer was given the
directive that the women were the same.
And so we had this, these racks of clothing and then we got to
kind of go in there and craft what we thought our vacation
(14:40):
wardrobe would be. And so that was an interesting
exercise knowing the circumstances Lori's coming
from. So I guess that was kind of a
part of it. But she was very familiar to me
as a type. She was very familiar.
There was some. There's a lot of there.
And then it's all reacting to your your coasters.
Yeah, I mean, I think the best work happens in between people.
(15:01):
It's not happening over here. You know, there's a selfish
version of acting where you're just trying to stand out, I
guess. And I've never been very
interested in that. I'm a theatre actor.
And so it all rides on your scene partners and how present
they are. And of course, I was working
with incredibly successful and professional women who I, who I
admire. And so I knew that piece was in
place and Mike gave us these really interesting dialogue
(15:22):
scenes that were quite long. So many of our scenes were cut
down for time, but we always felt we got to luxuriate a
little bit in the dialogue. And so we always looked forward
to doing those those big scenes with the three of us because
it's fun to, it's fun to get thelanguage.
It's fun to, you know, we, we started off the season just the
three of us shooting for the first, I think 10 or 12 days
before anybody else started shooting.
(15:43):
So it felt like a show about three women.
And then suddenly everybody elsearrived and we were only
working, you know, in the background or every few days.
And so you came to be very hungry to do the scene work
because you were missing it. And of course, I was commuting
to New York when I had free time.
So that was hard. That's a lot from from Thailand
to New York is. Yes, it's the longest flight in
the world, plus a couple of hours.
That was not easy to do. No, I learned a lot.
(16:05):
I learned a lot about, you know,commuting on long flights the
other day they you'd buy the Tokyo for a day and I was like,
how long is it? And they were like 14 hours,
like, Oh yeah, yeah, 14 hours. I can do you know?
It's easy. Yeah.
No problem with your eyes closed.
Don't be. Your character goes through a
lot. And she also had these very
steamy scenes where Lori let's loose.
(16:27):
And at the peak of her kind of sexual freedom with Alexa, it
takes a darker turn. My stomach sank when he begins
to talk about money right there in bed.
And you're like, this woman is kind of, you know, dealing with
maybe a midlife crisis, you'd call it, or there's some
existential crisis going on thatshe's dealing with.
And then this comes to her, like, right after, like the
(16:48):
where you should be getting yourtrophy and like, yes, I'm in a
better place. So how did this a moment affect
Lori and who she was? You know, who was already
struggling with these issues? It's a it's a rock bottom in a
way. It's humiliating.
It's humiliating. And all of her worst fears and
insecurities, which she has voiced earlier when her friends
are trying to encourage her to get together with Valentin, all
(17:11):
of those insecurities feel true,right?
He didn't actually want to sleepwith her.
He wasn't really interested in her.
He just was thought she had money.
That's really humiliating. And so Lori walks away from that
encounter with, I don't know, kind of her worst fears
validated. And so she hits a bottom.
And then there has to be, it's adark night of the soul, right?
(17:33):
Mike White has put Laurie through a dark night of the
soul. There has to be something on the
other side of that. And fortunately for me as the
actor, I got to kind of go through the the beginnings of
that transformation for her, thebeginning of that enlightenment.
How does she you? I think some people, if you're
cynical, you could look at that as just justifying where she's
ended up. And if you're less cynical or
(17:55):
more hopeful person, you may seethat as like a real spiritual
shift in Laurie where she comes to value her friendships in a
new way, where she understands the power of other people
bearing witness to her life. People that will always see her
from see the scope of her whole life.
You know, it's unlike a new friend where you're kind of
reintroducing yourself. And so, I mean, I think for me,
(18:18):
I feel like it's a tiptoe into something, into a transformation
for her, where she's being more honest about her life, where
she's being more honest about how she feels in her life.
And she's more honest about maybe having played the victim a
little bit about acting. She's actually made decisions
that have caused the consequences she's experiencing,
but she has not been thus far willing to take responsibility
(18:39):
for her part. And so I feel like there's a
moment here where Lori gets to start to take responsibility for
her part in those choices, whichis really powerful.
I don't know if she's entirely ready.
Like, I don't know how much these revelations will stick.
I think it will be very easy forthe women to go back to the
States and default to their old patterns because I don't know
how it is in your life. But I know for me, the harder
(19:00):
lessons I've had to learn in my life, I've had to learn them a
few times before they really make it.
It's very rare you have this epiphany and then everything
changes. I mean, God willing, people will
have that experience. But I don't know if Lori's ready
for that level of, of shifting, but but I think the humiliation
serves a function for her. And I think it's important.
(19:21):
I think that, you know, that high bottom, as we call it, if
you're in recovery, it's like she didn't have to kill somebody
with a car. She had a higher bottom.
She gets to maybe make some change without really disastrous
consequences. Yeah, I, I feel that scene gets
most people talk about you jumping out the window, which is
fantastic, but you know, it overshadows, you know what
(19:42):
really, what really happens to Lori there?
And I was really curious and I appreciate your answer and the
insight I. Think it's really powerful,
powerful moment for her to have to go through that.
So you touched upon this a little bit, but, you know, after
witnessing Laurie's secret breakdown early on, she finally
takes down the armor and exposesher vulnerability and her
discontent and her feelings about her friendship.
(20:03):
It's one of the highlights of the series.
Why do you think it resonates sowell with people?
And why is there, why do you feel there's like this conflict
about, you know, is this a good thing or a bad thing?
I think that in this age of social media pressure, everybody
is performing self on a level that we've never experienced.
Young people are crafting selvesthat then follow them home.
(20:25):
Bullying used to happen on the playground and you had to reckon
with the idea of calling someonefat and then watching what
happened to their face when you said it.
And now it's all anonymous and separate from consequences.
And I think we have become a little dull to the impact of our
to our own impact on other people in a way.
And at the same time, in this performance of self, where
(20:47):
everyone is believe somehow wholeheartedly in the in the
vision someone else is putting forward that we are left out,
that we are the ones who aren't succeeding, that we are the ones
who aren't achieving because we see it happening all around us
in these very shiny videos that maybe we're not as good at
making. I know that's my experience, and
it's really crushing and detrimental.
(21:09):
We know it's bad for girls. We know it's worse for girls
than it is. They have studies that bear that
out. And so everybody's suffering and
it's this, it's this thing whereif you're not participating in
the system, then you feel left out, even more left out in some
ways than you would if you were.But I think what we're finding
(21:31):
with these pledges to keep kids from having phones in school or
not use social media to a certain age is that the kids are
relieved. The kids are relieved because
it's all just peer pressure. They don't actually want to do
it. And yet here we are all doing
it. And I think it's just this great
passive fiction machine where it's also keeping us from, from
reckoning with the, the, the actual consequences of our
(21:53):
capitalist, you know, machine asthey're unfolding around us.
I mean, it's, you know, we'll beon our phones as we're, as we're
burning up or getting swept awayby flood because the, you know,
physics doesn't care about our feelings.
And, and I think we're not really, we're not really keyed
into just what a dangerous moment we're in.
(22:14):
And I think these phones and social media really, really, and
I think everybody feels that andthey feel the impotence, they
feel our own. It's like it's so much easier to
participate in this social experiment because otherwise you
just feel like you have no powerover anything.
So it's extreme. It's extreme and it doesn't.
And I think one of the ways we can start to move through this
(22:35):
moment is this radical honesty and radical authenticity.
Now, that doesn't mean that you are honest without consequences
like Lori tries to be, where shecalls out her friends on their
foibles without taking on her own right participation.
But but but like a kind of authenticity that we're not
experiencing community, right? We're lacking community more
than anything. And community is the only way we
(22:57):
will survive the many pronged challenges that are coming our
way, the only way our children will survive what's coming to
them. Fair.
I know that's dark, I think, butI think it is dark.
And I think, you know, the simple thing on this, on this
vacation, right? These privileged women taking
this vacation, if they had walked into the villa and said,
listen, here's what's happening with me.
And I've been really honest, they would have had a very
(23:19):
different vacation. But for some reason, they're
afraid. They're afraid to be exposed.
They're afraid to be vulnerable to each other.
And I don't know exactly what's happened to make us feel that
way in our friendships, but it has to do with not feeling like
it would be accepted, you know? So sad.
You know, with the social media aspect of it, it ties into we're
always being judged. You cannot do anything without
(23:42):
saying, wait, I need to make sure everything you see you post
is not just just to like, hey, look at the family album like it
used to be, or let's sit down and talk about what I did.
It's I'm going to put this out in the public and then be rated.
Do I get enough likes? Do people criticize me?
You know, and, and you know, with, with a show like the white
Lotus where afterwards you see these hyper critical fans and
(24:03):
like, and like, can we just be positive?
Can we stop trying to tear people down and just build
people up or just be quiet once in a while?
No, and that's, and that's the genius of setting the season in
a Buddhist country, because one of the tenants of Buddhism,
right, is to examine your comparing mind.
Now we are biologically wired tohave comparing minds.
That's how we stay alive. That's how we compare, you know,
predators to prey. Our brains actually function
(24:26):
that way. And when we have all this
leisure time now because we're not surviving, though probably
soon we'll be doing that again, it goes into hyperdrive.
So we're always, we are actuallylike wired to compare ourselves.
But what Buddhism says is that, you know, whether you're putting
yourself above someone or below them, there is suffering.
You will be inflicting sufferingout of the people, You will feel
suffering yourself. And so you have to uproot your
(24:48):
comparing mind. You know, that's one of those, I
don't know, fundamental questions about Buddhism.
So I don't know. It's, it's just really smart
that he sets it there. There was something else too,
but now I can't remember what it.
Was, I mean, there's so much youcan break, break down, you know,
not just with the series. But the tearing down of women in
particular, I mean, some of the,we knew we would be compared,
but it's pretty, I mean, I knew what I knew what I was in for.
(25:11):
It's pretty shocking to read some of the stuff about our
physical appearance. And you know, I, people always
talk about my age when they see me on TV.
I'm aging in HD and you know, I've chosen not to have any like
cosmetic procedures, just a choice I'm making for myself.
And boy are people mean about it.
People are really nasty about it.
And it's it's just really stark to see the people, what they're
(25:33):
willing to just kind of toss outthere casually about the way
somebody looks. Now, this is a choice I've made.
This is the job I have. I like my job.
I'm I'm happy to be an artist. I'm proud to be an artist.
So I'm going to keep doing it and then I can let you know,
trolling stop me. But it's pretty it's pretty
startling to read. Well, not that you need me to
say it, but I, I applaud that. I think we have we're, we're,
(25:55):
we're distancing ourselves from humanity.
You think if if you were in a time machine and went from the
50s to now and saw the people, you would think you were in the
the damn twilight zone. I know thinking about like I
think about when you see photos of these young men who fought in
World War One, like my grandfather survived the Battle
of the Bulge. The way a 12 year old looked in
like 1930, it was just like theyjust had so much more
(26:16):
responsibility than our children.
They just look like totally different human beings.
Anyway, it's fascinating to see what what time has wrought.
But yeah, you know, taking a stand for what women actually
look like. This kind of ties in as well,
and I don't know if I wanted to tap into this and we can ignore
it if you don't want to, but Kate Leslie Bibb's character
reveals that she is a Trumper. Seeing how these last few months
(26:39):
have played out, do you think that scene would play out the
same if it was shot today? I think it, I mean, there was
more to that scene, which I've talked about a little bit.
There was a little, that scene was a little bit longer.
And I think Mike actively chose to not have the politics over
shadow the show just as a storytelling to not a political
(27:00):
choice, not out of political pressure.
Yeah. I mean, sadly, the reality is
that that half, almost half of our country outwardly rejects
Trump and almost half of our country kind of enthusiastically
supports him to a cult like degree.
And when you have an informationsystem, you know, one of the
ways authoritarian regimes come to power is that they become the
(27:21):
only source of information. And so you've seen that that
takeover of of Donald Trump taking over the information
system so that it becomes a closed system.
So there's no way to penetrate that system with facts or
information or science. It's just all self reinforcing.
And that's just kind of one of the hallmarks of authoritarian
takeover. So it's kind of the same, you
(27:42):
know, it's, it's, it's just kindof become more cult like as it's
unfolded. And now you see there, you know,
the Republicans going so far as to our, our system of checks and
balances has completely broken down because they are unwilling
to challenge him because a, theywill be primaried by the richest
man in the world and they will actually be threatened.
So I guess they have good reasonto do it, but it's at the
(28:02):
consequence of our democracy. So that's too.
Bad and so much more. Yeah, and so much human lives.
I taught both my daughters, I remember studying it with both
of them checks and balances and trying to convey how important
it is. And then a few years later to
just watch it breakdown and say that's that's the core of what
(28:23):
really what makes America great.It's not, you know, all these
other things are add-ons, but without that it's lost and.
Having a dictator. Yeah, we're losing our identity.
We really are. It's a shame.
Or this may be who we always were, but only time will tell.
But we won't be around to sell it.
Really fun at parties. Really fun at parties.
(28:45):
Yeah, I know, I know. I don't trust me.
I I don't sleep at night. I really, I really don't.
So especially if you're paying, if you have children, you're
paying attention to what's happening with again, the
climate. And my castmates got so tired of
me being sad in Thailand becauseof the the warming of the ocean,
the plastic washing up the coralreef die off.
The mass coral reef die off started happening while we were
(29:06):
there. And it's devastating.
And the fact that we couldn't, Imean, I couldn't go outside
between 9:00 and and 5:00 because of the UV index and the
heat. So, and that was like the most
extreme those temperatures have been and they are now more
extreme this year. And this will be the coolest
summer for the rest of our lives.
So the fact that people can justoutright pretend that's not
happening, it's really, I'll just never understand it.
(29:28):
I'll never understand how how wehow we get there.
But but yeah, it's tough. Luckily we have some
entertainment to escape every now and then for an ass.
Yes, thank God, you know, and itactually does work.
It's it's rare that I can, I canpull myself away and actually
stop thinking about it. And the White Lotus did that for
me this season. Which?
(29:49):
And part of it was you jumping out windows, running away from
water guns, and you're Sprint away from gunfire.
Very American. Sad to say, but yeah.
I didn't catch it the first time, but when I watched it the
second time, I was like, man, I love that.
I'm so glad that people did catch it and pointed out and
make memes of it because it's it's hilarious and it's really
fitting. You know, when I first, when I,
(30:09):
I was standing by the monitor when they were shooting some of
the background stuff, like people just running through the
spa. And I remember seeing some very
polite Thai background actors kind of just, you know, trudging
through the background with a little.
And I was like, no, no, you needsome.
You need some. Just like white people running
so fast, you know, these like privileged Americans on vacation
sprinting through the resort because, you know, we're all
(30:30):
primed for a mass shooting. So depressing.
This is the most depressing TV topics of all.
Time, you know, really. I'm really.
That's what I'm bringing to the table these days.
I I get it. So would you do another season
of The White Lotus? Oh, I mean, gosh, if I was so
lucky as to be asked, I would love to work with Mike again
(30:51):
because he's a really, he's a marvelous director and he's such
a compassionate leader on set. And he just knows all the
characters better than anyone because he wrote them.
So yes, I would love to say yes to that.
It would be entirely contingent on where it was and the
circumstances of my family. It's just hard, it's hard to
make those decisions. My, my husband's careers also,
(31:12):
you know, we have two, two careers happening here and we
have to find balance. So like he's working right now
because I worked straight through from July until mid
January. Champagne problems.
I know in a time when the industry has really been
contracting. So we recognize how lucky we
are. We're very grateful, but it's
hard to find that that work lifebalance, which is basically a
myth anyway. Yeah, well the the quality work
(31:32):
is why you are so busy. Thank you.
I mean, I'm, I'm grateful. I, I love my IMDb page.
I'm really proud of the things I've gotten to say yes to.
And I stand by it. And I, I'm also, I have the
great privilege of being able tobe patient and sort of wait to
see what's worth doing. So you know I get to say no now
instead of saying yes to everything.
And to dig a little deeper into that last question, if Lori were
(31:55):
to appear on a future season, how would her life has changed,
which you kind of touched upon, and who would she arrive with,
if anyone? That's a good question.
I'd like to believe that she hadmoved herself along the
continuum a little more, you know, maybe like new partner,
new problems, but I don't know. Or maybe she's with her kid.
Maybe they've maybe they've grown into some, some form of
(32:17):
repair. I don't know what Mike would
come up with, come up with something, something more
creative than I. That's why he's the writer, and
I'm just the, you know, the actor.
And last, the white lips question.
What do you think would Laurie'sfavorite TV show be?
Oh, I bet she's zones. I bet she just zones out.
(32:38):
I bet she just watches like naked and afraid or something.
Is that what it's called? Yes.
Or like, you know, the Great British Bake Off.
You know, she's just like, mindlessly consuming something
that's far from her. I think her job is really
stressful. I'll take that.
So let's close out with a few more TV topics questions and and
get you on your way. So you grab a remote control.
(33:00):
A genie pops out and offers you this TV based wish.
What TV show do you want one more season of now?
It could be a prequel season. It could be an extra season
somewhere, put in the middle of it, or one tag down at the end
of its run and the same cast andcrew, it says, if time never
passed. Oh wow, do you know what show I
loved that. I think more people should have
watched Halt and Catch Fire. Oh yes.
(33:23):
By the end of that, they were all firing on all cylinders and
it was a fascinating quite conversation.
And the way the women overtook this, the show as sort of this,
the heart of it and the center of it and sort of the the
leaders of it technologically aswell was really fascinating.
But like Lee and Scoot and Mackenzie and Carrie, they were
(33:43):
so magnificent in that show. And I would watch anything.
The rest they're in now for the rest of their careers because I
thought they were just killing it.
And I thought that show was really under just, again, it was
one of those things like The Leftovers where the critics were
watching it, but but people didn't watch it when it was on.
And it was so, so good. It's funny I I always recommend
shows to people and I love that series and I thought the the
(34:06):
final season was insanely good but I always forget to recommend
it. I I have to put that down on my
list? Though kind of disappear.
So good. It's such a good show.
And do you have a favorite themesong that you cannot skip?
You know what? My husband and I watch Mary
(34:27):
Hartman, Mary Hartman, which is a show from the 70s.
We have the DVDs. So we for a while, when our kids
were going to bed, maybe a little earlier, we had more
time. We would watch a Mary Hartman
before our movie because it's sogreat.
It's such a wild, absurd show, you know, from the 70s, Louise
Lasser playing a housewife in Ohio.
It's just such a fascinating juxtaposition.
(34:47):
She's excellent. And it's so, so weird.
It's when TV used to be really weird.
Like, like network TV used to beweird.
I mean, we have weird shows now.But like, you know, Maude had an
abortion in the in the 80s on, you know, had contemplated an
abortion at 50. Like we just don't have that
conversation on network TV anymore.
So I think the Mary Hartman theme just gives me like Mormon
(35:09):
perceived feelings. I know that's a weird one, but
you know. Do you sing along or dance to
it? That's extra.
Points I can't it's been too long since you watched it, but
they every season, the only thing that changes is the mom
character. Who was this magnificent?
What was her name? She's a magnificent like musical
theater actress who was probablylike 10 years older than Louise
(35:31):
Lasser when she was playing her mom.
But every season the only thing that changes is the way she
yells Mary Hartman. Mary Hartman at the end.
And so my husband always does itanyway.
Dumb. I've got to hunt that down.
Do you prefer binge watching or weekly watching?
I I think it's good to exercise some patience.
I don't mind weekly watching andwe don't have time to binge.
We're falling asleep every night.
(35:53):
My husband's struggling to keep me awake to finish the movie, so
I just would literally fall asleep.
There's no way I could binge watch anything.
Now when I'm on location, I'll, I'll do a little bit more.
Oh, I tend a little bit more toward a binge because I don't
have kids there. Yeah, it used to be, if you
actually watch the TV show live,because they didn't even have
whole seasons on DVD, it was watch it live or wait till some
(36:14):
kind of random repeat showed up.You used to have to wait not
only for the next episode, but for the between commercials and
then between seasons. It was like everything was a
waiting game. It's true.
And I, I, I, I'm, I'm like primed to watch things right
when they happen. But also I've also come to hate
commercials. So I like I or like if we watch
even like the award shows, I prefer just to record it so we
(36:36):
can Fast forward through most ofthe most of the commercial
stuff. I just really have come to load
them. Completely understandable.
And is there ATV death that you would stop if you could?
Oh, oh gosh, let me think about that.
Trying to think of the shows that have really devastated me.
Oh no, I was not prepared to have we or.
(36:58):
Someone done. You can hold off and but in the
background and see if it something pops up.
Yeah, let me let that rattle. It is a big question.
It's. Really big and like who was I
really in love with? Who passes on?
Oh, you know, I when Calamity Jane dies in Deadwood, that came
(37:19):
comes to mind. She's so, she's so marvelous in
that part and she's such a, she's such a like soulful part
of that show that that was really sad.
I remember that being sad. That's old.
That's kind of digging deep, though.
Sure, there's something more contemporary.
Yeah, no, that's fine. I I actually like to, to dig a
little deeper because there are some that like that you still
(37:41):
remember going back years and years, like even.
So indelible in that part. I remember thinking that she was
such a great actress. And she is.
So how about 1 show that you used to watch that has not aged
well for any reason and can't believe you used to like?
Oh, oh, that's interesting. I mean, probably most of them I,
(38:07):
you know, it's Barney Miller's kind of a relic of another time.
And so you see some really what we would consider to be like
inappropriate themes or casting on that show.
But it's still a good show. Like it still holds up as one of
the most interesting depictions of what it's like to be a
policeman, which is basically, you know, doing paperwork in an
office. And then there's a, there's a
(38:29):
moment where he there's a shooting where the, where the
where, where starts with AW, where the Polish cop shoots
someone. And it's a whole episode, like
really processing the actual impact of that.
You know, we've gotten so inuredthis turned into a question
about something that actually aged well.
I'm sorry, I I totally turned iton.
(38:50):
You see violence on TV without consequence, and we've gotten so
accustomed to seeing like reallyextreme violence where everyone
just kind of moves through it without any, without blinking.
And that was I remember watchingthat Wojo Wojo shoots.
Yes. Yes, he shoots somebody and he
and there's a whole episode of him at home really mentally
(39:12):
struggling with that load. And I just thought, you know,
for all of the like, politicallyincorrect things that show does
with all those marvelous theatreactors that just come back and
play like a, you know, like a rotating theatre troupe,
basically, they just keep comingback.
You know, whatever mental illness or the depiction of gay
characters, whatever it is that is problematic or domestic
(39:32):
violence or whatever, at least it was talking about things.
And that depiction, like the consequences of violence, I
thought was really it was startling to see that on TVI
realized how few moments I'd seen of that kind of
contemplation on television. All right, just a couple more
questions and we'll get you on your way.
So the, the end of the Leftovershappened about 8 years ago.
(39:52):
Now I know you don't want to define what the ending means to
for people, but have your feelings or the way you
interpret it changed it all overthose you know over the years?
They haven't. They haven't changed and I'll
never say all. Right, cut that one, no.
(40:15):
But it's always interesting to hear what other people have to
say about it. You know, everybody has their
and it's really split. Where, what's, where do you
fall? I'm not going to say I think,
OK. It's a simple but like George or
Fargo, right? Like whether you think good or
evil wins out in Fargo or in Lake George, if you think she's
she's still there or not, which people haven't seen it, go go
(40:36):
watch it. It's a good movie.
It's a fun movie. I like those endings.
So do I, actually. It's great to have something
that you keep thinking about long after the credits have
rolled. But for The Leftovers, I'd have
to revisit to, to watch it and, and, and see because it has been
a while. I don't think I've watched it
since I had in my DVR since I recorded it.
(40:56):
And then they made me turn in myDVR.
I said one day I'm going to rewatch this.
Yeah, I don't if you're not going to give me more anything,
my assessment. Really interesting what an an
ambiguous ending reveals about the person who's watching it.
And to me that's so much more interesting than a piece of art
where you just and you finish itand you say, all right, well,
you know what? What's my snack going to be
(41:18):
before bed? That it's actually forcing a
little bit of contemplation. I love that kind of art.
I've I've become the queen of ambiguous endings, but I like
them. I appreciate them and I and
that's what art does it. You say what you think.
I try not to tell people what tothink and I also hate spoilers
so even discussing it right now if someone hasn't getting into
(41:38):
it too much. If you have not watched it,
anyone who hasn't go watch it. It is one of the greatest series
of all time. The first season will test your
patience the whole the. Whole smoking thing.
It's a humorless season. Which Tom Perrotta's books are
not humorless. They're quite satirical.
And so if you're a fan of Tom Perrotta's books, you'll say,
where'd the sense of humor go? But it comes back.
Just hang in there. Yeah, once you get to Season 2,
(41:58):
it, it starts to click and then you can't watch the rest without
Season 1. So it's, and also Season 1, the
opening moments with you and your family are some of the most
heartbreaking. I was, it was eight years ago,
so I was, I'd been a father for a little while, but it it's
crushing. Yeah, it's really I I going back
(42:19):
would be even harder, I think now that I because I didn't have
kids then and now I do so. There might be a reason I didn't
go back to it because of I also don't watch re watch a lot of TV
but it's not an easy. There's not enough time.
Who are these people that are reading all these shows?
I mean I know people are like, oh I've seen the Office like 3
times. I'm like who?
Who are you that you have this time in your life 'cause just
(42:39):
carry. I don't have time.
I finish one and I'm like here'swhat's next on my list.
Time to time to move on. Yeah.
I, I get 30 seconds to digest itand to go, oh, that was good.
And then once it's done onward. Exactly.
So I like these conversations I get to, I do get to actually
venture back in and get different get insights onto the
(43:01):
the work that I wouldn't have seen and directly from people
who who brought it to life. Very dry, good service
especially it does since there'sso much content now, it's very
hard to you. You'll miss things, you know,
unless you're paying attention to critical voices like yours,
letting us know what we're missing.
Well, I appreciate that. All right, let me close with
this one. If you had a magic door, one
(43:22):
that allowed you access to live in one TV show, popping in and
out whenever you want. So you open the door, you go in
your real life pauses. Which show would it be and could
be for any reason. Wow that's such a good question,
I never thought about it. The the first thing that popped
into my mind, if I'm honest, is there was an old British
adaptation of the Chronicles of Narnia.
And because I would grew up during Goonies and Narnia, I was
(43:45):
obsessively looking for secret passageways everywhere I went.
I grew up on an old farm, so we had like all these weird
outbuildings, like, you know, smokehouse and a milkhouse and a
barn. We were always trying to lift,
you know, find a way in to some secret room.
And so I, I feel so compelled bythe idea that there's like a
whole other world happening beyond the walls of or beyond a
wardrobe. And I just remember images from
(44:06):
that show really standing out tome and, and it's kind of the
world is sort of different everywhere you go.
So I think maybe that like old adaptation of Chronicles of
Narnia isn't. That weird.
I believe I've seen it, but it'sprobably 20 years ago.
Oh yeah, it's so oh. I wonder if it holds up.
I'd like to see it again. I'm sure my kids will watch it.
Trying to think if there's something else like I've been
(44:27):
watching or I'm eager to show them where I would want to live
in it. T VS pretty it.
Doesn't have to be a good world either, it could be something.
It could be a nasty world, right?
Where have to survive? Yeah, I mean, I don't know some
so. Just go explore or to watch.
Is so dark, like like most of the worlds I I like popping into
(44:47):
them would be deadly. It would be really tough.
That's a good question, though. I mean, oh, it's such a good
question. I haven't really thought about
it. I don't watch enough TV to know.
Maybe, you know, something like a world like the Nick would be
(45:12):
fun or like Deadwood, you know, a Wild West kind of Deadwood
where you got to pop in and out.That would be fun.
Take your guns a. Complete disconnect from this
world where it's complete, you know, where we're on our phones
and. Everything kind of Westworld was
sort of offering that wasn't like popping into Deadwood.
But yeah, some like, some like that kind of environment,
especially because I don't get to like, do Westerns, you know,
that might be fun. That might be ride horses, you
(45:34):
know. Is that do you think that's on
the horizon for you westerns? Gosh, I mean, I hope so.
Anything action oriented I'm very interested in.
I'm interested in action and I'minterested in comedy.
I, I always do, I, I do dramaticthings all the time, but I have
to tell you, my family does not think of me that way.
And most of the people that workwith me are expecting a very
(45:55):
serious person. And I, that's not how I conduct
myself on any set. I just I really try to have fun
and and bring some energy to theroom just so because we got long
days ahead of us, you know, so Idon't I I don't feel a heavy
like a heavy presence. I think I'm quite light hearted.
But so I don't know, action, comedy, something like that.
Well, I hope to one day hear about your comedic cowgirl.
(46:18):
Thank you. Tiptoeing a little bit, but
White Load is great up comedy sowe'll see.
I'll keep trying. Thank you so much for your time
for being a guest on TV Topics. I look forward to seeing what
you do next. If it's a western or not, I'll
be watching and and feel free tocome back.
I will next time I do, I will domy like preparation and remember
the TV shows that. I, yeah, I've, I've always
(46:38):
struggled. Do I share any of the questions?
Right, right. That's what I'll do.
I'll share a few of them ahead of time.
Maybe like round two I'll be better.
But yeah, that's good. I should also know I'm talking
about TVI could have you know, Icould have sussed that out
myself. No worries, I I loved your
answer so thank you so much. Really appreciate you having you
(46:59):
on there. Have a great day, it was my
pleasure. Thanks.
Thank you. Bye.
Thank you to the incredible Carrie Kuhn for being such a
great guest on TV Topics. Be sure to watch Carrie's work
on The White Lotus and The Leftovers, an all timer of a
show. Keep tuning into TV Topics and
be sure to subscribe on Spotify or Apple Podcast or wherever you
find your podcast. And if you really enjoy the
(47:20):
show, please give it a five starrating.
It really helps. You can also follow TV topics on
Instagram at TV under score Topics.
Thanks for listening and stay tuned for more TV topics.
TV Topics is produced by StephenBrzekowski.
ZAP.
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