Police Ego 101: Class Is In Session

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_06 (00:00):
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(00:20):
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(00:48):
All right, welcome back to CopsOne Donut.
I'm your host, Eric Levine.
With me today is Officer GeorgeLopez.
How are you, sir?
I'm doing well.
Thanks.
And with me as always is myco-host, the big red bearded
bastard banning sweatland.
What's up, buddy?
What's up, brother?
Oh, you know, just doing ourthing.
Um, we've been talking aboutthis for a while, trying to get

(01:09):
George lined up, talking aboutego.
So if you are listening to thispodcast at a later time, um just
know that this whole thing isgoing to be about police ego and
how we can recognize it, how wecan change and adapt when it
takes over, um, and hopefullystart doing some preventative

(01:29):
maintenance for officers thatseem to be very susceptible to
their ego and letting emotiontake over when it should be
rational, logical line ofthinking.
Um, but enough about me.
Let's get to our special guesthere.
George, um, as I told you,you're gonna see a lot of chat
going on up and down the thingright there.
So feel free to answer questionsas we go.

(01:52):
I may stop and have people, youknow, just tell you the
question, you answer that.
Um, and for those watching andlistening, we do have like a
PowerPoint that we are using asa guide.
So if you see us looking over,we're we're just making sure we
follow the class all the waythrough.
But I don't want to bore youwith PowerPoint.
And George knows this stuffinside and out.
So he's just gonna, we're justgonna have like a conversation

(02:12):
about the class.
So that's how this will work.
And um, yeah, but before we dothat, George, I just want people
to kind of get to know you.
What got you down this line?

SPEAKER_01 (02:22):
Um, well, I've been an officer for almost 30 years
now combined.
Um 27 here in Fort Worth.
Uh uh more than half of that inin training.
And one of the things that I'veseen is uh some of the gaps in
our training.
And I'm I've always wanted tomake things a little bit better
for the people who come alongbehind me.

(02:45):
And um I've been very fortunatethat the department has been
okay with investing some timeand money into me getting some
good training and sending me tovarious courses and
certifications and whatnot andtrainings so that I can put this
stuff together when I bring itback.
Um as far as what the ego classwas, is I speaking of those
training gaps, um, we talk aboutthings like emotional control,

(03:10):
and you're not allowed to beoffended as a cop.
And you have to have thisprofessional demeanor, and you
can't let things you know hityou personally, but how we don't
we don't train them on how to dothat, we don't test them on
their ability to do that.
And from the outset, um aperson's character is pretty

(03:33):
much set by the time they get tothe police academy.
I mean, 21, 22-year-old um manor woman is who they are by
then.
So as far as training goes,you're you're not gonna change
their character.
At the most, we can model thetype of character that is the
most conducive to lawenforcement and most beneficial

(03:54):
to the community, but we can'twe can't remake someone's
character or um demeanor orthose kind of things.
The best we can do other thanmodeling is things like this
with uh with some education onit.

SPEAKER_06 (04:08):
Training, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (04:09):
Right.

SPEAKER_06 (04:09):
Um you're gonna see this happen quite a bit too,
sir.
Whenever you see these green uhthings pop up here, this is the
people that are giftingmemberships to other people
watching to our YouTube channel.
So Brandar86 uh just giftedfive.

SPEAKER_01 (04:23):
Hello, Mr.
Billfold.

SPEAKER_06 (04:25):
Uh and uh yeah, Mr.
Billfold, he is one of ourregulars.
Um very good dude.
Uh, but thank you very much,Brandar.
Appreciate it.
Um and then uh we've got um andthen also you see this part
right here.

SPEAKER_08 (04:41):
Yes, yeah, just remember that.

SPEAKER_06 (04:43):
So um, but yeah, we are going to um we're gonna jump
into the ego stuff, but for you,sir, there's one thing that you
and uh banning have in commonthat we didn't bring up yet is
that you're a devil dog.

SPEAKER_01 (04:57):
I am.

SPEAKER_06 (04:57):
Yes.

SPEAKER_01 (04:58):
So simplify.

SPEAKER_06 (04:59):
Yep.

SPEAKER_01 (05:00):
If banning simplify, I'm I'm lagging.
I apologize, guys.
Love it.
Um I think I might be a littlebit before his time, though.
89 to 95.
Yeah, nine ninety-seven to ohone.
Okay.

SPEAKER_06 (05:16):
He was in the 80s, bro.
Yes, dang.
What was it like working withPaul Revere?

SPEAKER_01 (05:20):
It wasn't bad.
He, you know, he had some ego.

SPEAKER_06 (05:23):
Yeah, he had some ego, yeah.
Um, we got another CraigHolcomb.
Oh, gifted 20 memberships, sir.
He's trying to outdo Brand R86.
Thank you very much, brother.
We really appreciate that.
Mr.
Bill Fold, Semplify, he's also aMarine, yep.
Um, and then uh and then goingdown the line here.

(05:43):
Behave in the chat, y'all.
You know, there's certain thingswe're not gonna chat about.
We're gonna Marine's blood.
Yep.
Marine's blood is one of ourmods.

SPEAKER_01 (05:51):
Um Lopez is Hollywood.
Yeah, that's okay.
We had drill instructors.
I know you guys had Sand Fleas,right?
Oh fired.
Uh I was Parasylon.

SPEAKER_06 (06:04):
I was flying high.
I was uh you know, San Antonio.
It's pretty pretty rough.
Well, I was Air Force, so don'ttell.

SPEAKER_05 (06:19):
I can't remember.

SPEAKER_06 (06:20):
Something like that.
Jeez O Pete's the membershipskeep flying.
Does somebody else pay or isthat still the 20 going on?

SPEAKER_05 (06:27):
Probably still the 20.

SPEAKER_06 (06:28):
Yeah, it's probably still the 20.
Jesus Pete's it's just flyingthrough there.
You know what?
Marine Blood did not get anaccount, so cheers.
We have a rule.
Every time Marines Blood doesn'tget a membership, we drink.
So he's never gotten one.
Harrison.
Oh, somebody else must have.
Thank you, Craig.

(06:49):
Subs.
Craig Harrison and oh, somebodysee, somebody else did do one.
He said Coase.
Who's Coase?
They all happen so fast.
Oh, there it is.
Yep.
Lofton did it.
There it is.
Thank you, Lofton.
Appreciate it.
How do you think you say thatfirst name there?
Cose?

(07:10):
Kosechia.
I don't know.
That's a hard one.
I never try to pronounce thatname because Lofton's so much
easier.
Brandart, everybody making melook cheap.
Sorry, brother.
All right.
Let's uh let's keep let's keepthis going.
All right.
So um Marine, um, been in lawenforcement almost 30 years.

(07:34):
Um a huge chunk of that has beentraining, which is how you and I
met.
Um basically taught meeverything I know about
instructing people, y'all.

SPEAKER_01 (07:42):
So uh don't blame me for that.

SPEAKER_06 (07:44):
Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_01 (07:46):
That's where I keep screwing up.

SPEAKER_06 (07:47):
But um, no, uh let's get to let's get to this because
I don't know how long this classis gonna take us.
Okay.
Sure.
But uh I want to jump into this.
Uh what was the problem and thegap that you noticed and how did
this come about?

SPEAKER_01 (08:01):
All right.
So the gap that I noticed, um,partly uh a lot of the videos
that you've posted and a lot ofofficers having just emotional
responses to interactions withthe public.
And in in my opinion, those kindof things could influence how

(08:23):
that interaction ends or how itgoes or how it progresses.
So uh everyone is on this bigkick of de-escalation and
everyone wants us to get alongwith everybody, and you know,
and and that's that's absolutelypart of it.
That that has to you have tohave a good character, you have
to be a professional, and all ofthose things.
However, you are still just ahuman being.

(08:45):
And as a human being, you'resusceptible to all the things
that all human beings aresusceptible to.
So human factors across theboard, performance-rise, this is
something performance-wise, thisis something I've I've really
dug deep into as far as responsetimes and the way your eye works
and your brain processing andall that stuff.
But what I've noticed was isthat we don't have a whole lot

(09:07):
of um emotional intelligencetraining.
We mention it and we talk abouthow we need to be in control of
our emotions and we need to notget upset with things, but how
exactly do we do that?

SPEAKER_06 (09:19):
And and I'm gonna cut you off real quick.
When we're talking aboutemotional intelligence, a lot of
people think of that as I canread you emotionally, I can tell
how you feel.
But really, what emotionalintelligence is is reading
yourself.

SPEAKER_01 (09:31):
Right.
There there's four majorcomponents there's
self-awareness, socialawareness, others' awareness,
and internal awareness.
All of those components umfactor into your emotional
intelligence.
So it is a part of being able topick up on other people's
emotions.
Maybe reading a room and or uman interaction.
I can I can if I have goodemotional intelligence, I can

(09:53):
kind of tell from your demeanorwhere my conversation might be
leading you.
Or that I said one thing thatjust kind of just kind of got to
you.
So with those things in mind,um, we don't have a whole lot of
training on that.
So this is really like I showedyou earlier, I showed you a
magic trick and this littlecheesy, sad little sleight of

(10:15):
hand trick.

SPEAKER_06 (10:16):
It was cool, guys.

SPEAKER_01 (10:16):
It was I tried to get him to show it on here, and
he's like, I can't.
It's it's nothing more thansleight of hand, a little bit of
distraction.
But when I showed it to him, hehe was amazed.
He was like, Oh, that's reallycool.
How'd you do that?
But then when I explained it tohim, I gave him a glimpse behind
the curtain.
Uh, I can't won't be able tofool him with that kind of trick
again.
And that's kind of the wholeconcept here is that once you're

(10:37):
aware that you are havingcertain emotions or reactions to
one thing or another, um, youcan be aware of them, you can be
on guard for them.
And the reason I titled thisclass Ego is because a lot of
people um, in layman's terms,believe that if you are
arrogant, if you'reself-centered, if you have
problems communicating withpeople, you get upset easily,

(10:59):
you're easily offended, you havea big ego, and your ego has been
uh damaged or attacked oroffended.
And that's that's kind of amisnomer.
We get into that in the class alittle bit, but the the the
truth of it is is whatever youcall it, it's a human response.
And if officers, young officers,recruits, even senior officers,

(11:22):
um having some recognition ofthat is just gonna be helpful.

SPEAKER_06 (14:22):
Yeah.
Um, sorry, we're having someconnection issues with Banning.
He may have to jump off here andcome back on.
Um, shout out to Jerry.
Uh hooked us up with 20 bucksand said, Welcome, George.
Thank you, sir.
So thank you very much.
Uh I don't uh know who else.
Okay, that's my mom.
She said thank you for that.
Uh trying to get a lot of peopleto comprehend that is nearly

(14:43):
impossible.
Um but yeah, I want to thankJerry very much.
And then uh, okay, so younoticed the gap and you
recognized what needed to be umdone.
So now you've got the challengeof a person that let's face it,
in law enforcement, I have neverheard of a class that discusses
ego, right?

(15:04):
Talks about how what it is, howwe go after it, how we make sure
we avoid it, how to recognizethe signs of it.
So you had the painstaking taskof figuring all that out from
scratch.
Right.
Um so you you go through, youstudy, you pull up a bunch of
scholarly stuff that becausewhen we teach the stuff, it
isn't just some dude saying,hey, this, that, and the other.

(15:26):
You had to back up what you weresaying.

SPEAKER_04 (15:27):
Right.

SPEAKER_06 (15:28):
So when when we train and when we create classes
um through T call regulationsand stuff like that, like that's
one of the things you do is I'mnot just teaching you based on
my experience.
I'm teaching I'm teaching youbased on things that I can back
up through sources.
Right.
So you create this course.
And so from there, let's isthere anything else that you

(15:50):
want to chime into that beforewe uh no, that's that's a good
segue.
Okay.

SPEAKER_01 (15:54):
Um so to start with, we we we talked about ego and
ego being kind of the I don'twant to call it a misnomer
because it does, it does playin.
It's just not um it's not theend-all be-all way to phrase or
to think, even think about this.
So what I do and what I did withmy research is I went straight
to the sources with psychologyand uh personality traits and

(16:17):
whatnot.
The guy there is uh some guynamed Sigmund Freud.
Yeah, yeah.
Some about your, you know, mymom, your mom, whatever,
somebody's mom.
Um and he identifies threecomponents of your personality,
which he says are across theboard, very basic, very
foundational, but that everybodyhas.

(16:37):
And uh, of course, I have youhave pulled up on that
PowerPoint, per those T cole,like you mentioned, they they
have to have lesson objectives.
So the class is is gotta be aslegitimate as possible for um
for it to just even stand alone.
I can't just throw stuff upthere and say, you know, this is
this is what we think.
Right.
And this is this is the kind ofcopy it should be.

(16:57):
I I have to back it.
And you know, on a personalnote, um, I want it to be good.
I don't, if if there's somethinghorrible and something wrong and
it's totally off base, I I needto know about that so I can
correct it because I don't wantto send out bad information.
So anyway, I started with thescientific stuff with the basics
of that psychology theory, um,the characteristics of

(17:19):
self-discipline um per ourgeneral orders and how it
relates to the importance of howyou have to develop that
emotional control.
And then a couple of tools uhthat I I found online um and
through some some more research.
My my big go-to is for science.

unknown (17:38):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (17:38):
If if you've ever done any force science stuff,
man, that's a real look behindthe curtain.

SPEAKER_06 (17:42):
We've had Von Klem on here a few times.

SPEAKER_01 (17:44):
Amazing.
I've been his student severaltimes.
Dude, just I film notebooks justlistening to the guys.
Yeah.
So anyway, uh, a couple ofprinciples in something called
the Johari window.
It sounds exotic, but it'sactually just a combination of
the guys' names.

SPEAKER_10 (17:59):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (18:00):
And um the ruler concept that I recently stumbled
upon that makes a whole lot ofsense that I'm gonna start
incorporating with um on thespot detection of when I can
feel myself going sideways in aninteraction.
And we'll talk about that too.

SPEAKER_06 (18:17):
Okay.
Cool.
Um, looking at some of thecomments, Mr.
Billfold, uh, Sprite as always,he said, There are no classes
because LEO culture would neverstoop solo as to admit flaws
unless they can get qualifiedimmunity.
Uh, which is one of the things Ilike about where we're at.
We have no issues talking aboutour flaws, um, but we're really

(18:37):
good at creating courses and andtrying to rectify the issues
that we find.

SPEAKER_01 (18:43):
Um so just to address that, um, we got to
start somewhere.

SPEAKER_10 (18:47):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (18:48):
I mean, uh it it might not be as timely as
everyone would like it to be,but at least it's being noticed
and those gaps are being filledand people are taking steps.
So watch banging on the table,by the way.

SPEAKER_06 (18:59):
I can hear it through the mic.
Yeah.
You're good.
I know you're you're you'rehanding it animated.
Talk up here.
Yeah.
Trying to take the Italian outof him.
Um, looks like Banning's back.
Let's bring his third time's acharm, hey.

SPEAKER_05 (19:18):
That's right.

SPEAKER_06 (19:19):
Oh, geez, I gotta turn you down.
You're super loud in my ears,brother.
There we go.
Um, all right, going over to thechat here.
USA Transparency said, Hey, Igot a free month membership.
Sweet, thanks.
Appreciate that.
Uh all right, so all right,brother.
So we got the objectives out ofthe way, and uh let's uh let's

(19:42):
jump in.

SPEAKER_01 (19:43):
Okay, so the according to Freud, his
personality theory breaks ourpersonality characteristics, our
basic psychology into three bigcomponents: the id, the ego, and
the superego.
Everyone is born um with thecapacity to develop all three.
Everyone, I would say, um has anid.

(20:06):
And the id is that toddler, thatyour inner child.
I want what I want when I wantit.
And it's the your desires andthey sexual desires, material
desires, desire for respect,desire for acceptance, all of
those come to the id.
Um, if you can think about it,uh in terms of a child, the way

(20:27):
we learn to interact in ourworld is basically through trial
and error from the beginning.
So as an infant, you recognizethat you're wet, you're cold,
you're tired, you're hungry,something hurts.
And the only thing that you cando to communicate that to the
outside world is to cry.
And once that crying isinitiated, you get that

(20:50):
response.
The adult comes to check on you,figure out what's going on.
If what your problem is, is thatyou've got a wet diaper and they
give you a bottle, the cryingcontinues because that need
isn't met.
So it is basically your needs,and and they need to be met.
And they can be rational orirrational.
Um, they're unconscious, um,they demand immediate

(21:12):
gratification.
For example, the infant crying.
And um in that sense, it's notacceptable for us as adults,
especially as law enforcementprofessionals, to operate in our
id.
Okay, I can't I can't look atthe guy and say you're under
arrest, turn around, put yourhands behind your back.
And when he doesn't complyimmediately, it's not
appropriate to just thump him onthe head and get to work and get

(21:34):
him handcuffed.
Okay, that's my id.
I want to end it fast.
I want to do it now.
Or I want to do it in the waythat I believe reflects the
respect I believe I deserve.
And that's another part of itwe'll get into after that.
But that's your id.
Basically, your inner child, youwant your demands, your needs,
all of that stuff.

(21:55):
Your superego is the other endof that spectrum.
So your superego is built on uhthe guidelines that you have,
depending on your culture, yourupbringing, your moral values,
moral compass, your parents, theway you're raised.
It's basically your conscienceand your ego ideal.
It's um what you considerinternally to be right or wrong.

unknown (22:20):
Okay.

SPEAKER_01 (22:21):
That's that would be your super ego.
And your superego is alwayswanting to do what you've been
taught is the ideal to do.
Um rules and behaviors that theego aspires to.
It tries to keep us civilized,it's it tries to suppress the
id's urges in in the sense thatum your id wants to do a, but

(22:43):
your superego recognizes that Bis more appropriate and A is
totally inappropriate.
So there's there's conversationthere between the superego and
the id, if you would.

SPEAKER_06 (22:53):
Yeah.
Uh Mr.
Billfold says they need id andneed us not to know the law any
better than they do, even thougheven though they dang it, it
shifted.

SPEAKER_01 (23:06):
Even though they get that sweet taxpayer money direct
deposit with no clue how to dotheir job.

SPEAKER_08 (23:11):
Yeah.
Id is a hell of a drug, lightcontrol.

SPEAKER_01 (23:14):
Um yeah, you're not wrong.
I mean, id is it absolutely is,but that's not the question, uh,
because your id is is just as uhimportant to you and your needs
and your your desire to havethose needs met as mine is.
The trick is is to recognizewhen my id is getting outside of

(23:36):
reasonableness so that I can getit back under control.
And that's on the next slide,that's where the ego comes in.
Gotcha.
So the ego is like the balancerof the superego and the id.
So when a lot of people say he'sgot a big ego or he's got a
strong ego, or his his ego istoo big for you know his

(23:56):
authority, he's got a bad egoproblem.
Um, what they're really tryingto say is that he's not
emotionally regulated.
He's not keeping a close holdand control over the id using
the super ego's guidance and theego's balance.

SPEAKER_06 (24:11):
You find it a coincidence that the thing that
we crave the most as a cop isID, which is spelt the same way
as id.
Yeah.
Give me your ID.
Give me your id.
Give me your id.
Yeah.
My id needs to be satisfied.
Yeah.
That's what Mr.

SPEAKER_05 (24:25):
Bill Fold's talking about is ID crackable.

SPEAKER_06 (24:27):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Hello.
Okay.
He goes, I meant ID, likedemanding.
Oh, yeah, that's probably whatmade my brain trigger that.
Yeah, that's hilarious.
Uh good job, Mr.
Bill Fold.
You're on top of shit.
Good catch.
I love it.

SPEAKER_01 (24:41):
That's why I love having them on here.
Uh so anyway, back to ego.
So the ego works to keep theid's impulses acceptable and it
operates on what we perceive tobe the reality.
Everything that there's there'sperception, and then there's um
stimulus.
We'll call it stimulus or data.
Okay.
Your eye will pick up data, youreye will see something.

(25:04):
And the only thing that your eyeis really doing is it's
detecting changes in how thatlight is reflecting off of
whatever object in space you areseeing.
It takes time for that data toget to your brain, and it takes
time for your brain to assesswhat that is and assign meaning
to it.
And once that meaning isassigned to it, that's when it

(25:25):
goes through this process ofvalue sorting.
It's either important orunimportant, or it's offensive
or not offensive to my id or mydesires or my superego or my
ego.
So that's how we're constantlyfiltering every interaction with
things.
And um, it takes time.
And part of the part of theexplanation, if if it helps you

(25:48):
to understand, is a greatexample that comes up in the
next couple of slides here.
Um, the ego is often compared tobeing a judge.
So you've got your superego,which is everything moralistic,
perfect, ideal.
You know, dad and mom would beproud of you for behaving this
way, and your id is your innerchild wanting what it wants when

(26:09):
it wants it.
So the ego has to balance thetwo because you can't operate on
superego because your your egoknows that your id will never be
satisfied.
And if it's basically anegotiator to try and buy time
to satisfy the id's desires.
Gotcha.
Okay.
And the only way we caninterrupt that process in the

(26:30):
middle of things is to recognizeit when it's happening and be a
stronger ego negotiator.

SPEAKER_06 (26:36):
Yeah.
Um, Brandar86 said the I picksup information.
The problem with information, itcan mean nothing or everything.
And bias creates aninterpretation one way or
another, can cause problems.
100%.

SPEAKER_01 (26:49):
Yep.
That's that's not wrong.
And a bias can can there's anegative connotation to it, but
it can also be a positive bias.
It could be uh the kind of biasthat leads you to do something
positive instead of doingsomething in the negative.
So it everyone has those.
And um, like I said, assigningmeaning to it is is the trick.

SPEAKER_06 (27:12):
Yeah.
Yeah, absolutely.
All right.
So we're on to uh do we need toreally read?

SPEAKER_01 (27:20):
Um no, no, we don't need the geo.
Yeah, I was gonna say generalorder just explains it.
It's we we are bound to at leastmake this attempt to be
emotionally regulated in dealingwith the comp with the
community.

SPEAKER_06 (27:32):
Gotcha.
Um, we just got another 10memberships gifted by Lofton
again.
Dang, appreciate it.
Just looking through who gotsome memberships.
I'm not seeing any names.
Uh Wichita Audits got one.
Uh, in Bing Bong, 25987 got one.
Good for you, buddy.
Um Marine Bloods.
Eric, is there slides?

(27:53):
It sounded like George mentionedyou.
Yes, we're we're reading theslides.
We have them on the screen uphere, but we don't want to bore
you guys with looking at theslides.
Um, PowerPoint's a killer of it.

SPEAKER_01 (28:07):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 (28:07):
Stay on track.
I was gonna say, because he'staught it so many times.
We can have a conversationversus reading from the slides.
So we are actually having aconversation about what the
slides entail.
So um Freeman Key, 75memberships, Marine Blood, and I
get none.
Oh, damn.
Sorry, brother.
Uh Brandard drink.

(28:28):
Yeah, cheers.
Yep.
Okay.
So now we will, I think we're onto our first video.

SPEAKER_01 (28:35):
So this uh we got oh so the example.
So the the the example that uhwe use, you can go to the next
one with the horses.

SPEAKER_08 (28:43):
Okay.

SPEAKER_01 (28:43):
So if you think of um id, ego and superego and how
they operate in your mind, um, avery basic way to understand
that the concept of how theyoperate with each other is to
imagine the metaphor of a horseand rider.
So the horse would be thepowerful urges of the id.
The id is going to get what itwants.
Okay, the horse uh weighs what,1200, 1300 pounds.

SPEAKER_06 (29:06):
About as much as banning.

SPEAKER_01 (29:07):
Yeah.
So and the man on top weighsmuch, much less.
However, if the man on top is anexperienced rider who can use
the reins properly, he cancontrol that horse and he can
get that horse to go where itwants it to go and keep that
horse going in a direction.
Horses can be a valuable toolfor work.
But you have to satisfy theirid.

(29:28):
But you have to be able tonegotiate that id with that
horse.
So the metaphor is the horse isyour id, the rider is your ego,
and the reins are your superego.

SPEAKER_08 (29:37):
Ah, that makes sense.

SPEAKER_01 (29:38):
So when you pull one way or the other with the
superego, if you get too stronga response on to the right on a
horse, and that id does not wantto go to the right, you're gonna
have conflict with that id, andthat id will rebel.
So you can see how it's abalancing act for the ego to be
a good rider.

SPEAKER_09 (29:55):
Ah, gotcha.

SPEAKER_05 (29:56):
It's almost like balancing out TRT, too, if you
do it wrong.

unknown (30:00):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 (30:02):
You just rage out.
Yeah.
Uh that's funny.
Um Mr.
Billfold said, I fail to see anysense of that obligation to
control emotions by Elios.
I guess most cops missed out onthe obligation part while
getting fitted for their gunbelt.
I I guess it just depends on thesituation, sir.

(30:23):
Um, I'm not gonna just put ablanket statement on everybody
like that.
So um, all right.
Let's go on to the next, whichis a video.
So we will share that screen.
Let me, I think we're on theright one.
Going in with the horse talk.
That's the right video, correct?
Yeah.
Okay, so we'll share thisscreen.

SPEAKER_01 (30:45):
We will So can we talk while we're over this and
kind of explain what's going on?
Um, do I need to do I need toplay sound with it?
No, you don't have to.
It's pretty clear what'shappening.

SPEAKER_06 (30:57):
Okay, I'll mute it and then you can talk over it.

SPEAKER_01 (31:00):
Okay, so you've got the id.
Id wants to do its thing, andthe rider is trying to control
it.
So with that super ego, he'strying to over-control it with
that whip.
Or uh I I don't know what theycall it.
A whip.
It's a horse whip, yeah.
Yeah.
So in competition here, thesehorses are very highly trained
and they're very, very good atwhat they do.
It's just that for whateverreason, today, that horse didn't

(31:22):
want to do that thing that therider needed it to do.
So the rider, the ego withemotional deregulation, didn't
handle that well.
So what he did was he he triedto forcibly delay the horse's
gratification.
And then at the end, if you seeit, the horse does what it wants
anyway and just runs rightthrough the barricade.

SPEAKER_10 (31:42):
Right.

SPEAKER_01 (31:43):
So when you try to overcorrect with that super ego
moralistic, idealistic, perfectmoral compass response, and the
ego isn't there to balance itwell, it can be detrimental.

SPEAKER_08 (31:55):
Gotcha.
Okay.
And I I don't know.

SPEAKER_05 (31:58):
Just to add to that, on a canine front, I ran a
canine for many years.
And you know, they they taughtus from day one when we were
training our dogs, and and someof this came from uh the area
that you work at from one of thetrainers, you know, you have to
and this is just theterminology, but urinate,
hydrate, and defecate.
If you're not doing thatconsistently, it's an animal,

(32:20):
it's a breathing heartbeat.
If you're not doing that, andthat's on the top of their
brain, if you're giving theminstruction and you haven't done
the urinate hydrate anddefecate, it's gonna be a major
issue.
So I mean it's it'sencapsulating that as well.
I mean, if you're not if you'renot taking care of them checking
all of that stuff uh before youdeploy, you you may have an
issue for sure.

SPEAKER_07 (32:41):
Yeah.
Um all right.
Let's go to this video.

SPEAKER_01 (32:46):
So this quick one, you see, um, this is a horse
training video, and the guy istalking about this horse that's
got some damage, somepsychological damage.
It was abused and it wastreated.
Poorly, and he's trying to getit to trust him and whatnot.
Um as it relates to the id, theego, and the superego, this
horse.
Um when you see here at the end,it's a little bit longer.

(33:08):
Maybe you could move it a littlebit forward to where the horse
is laying down.
Um there we go, right there.
So this horse is docile, itdoesn't want any trouble.
But his id lashes out here, andyou'll see in a second.
For no reason.

(33:28):
No reason other than what'sknown to the horse.
And I don't, you know, presumeto know what a horse might be
thinking.
I don't have that muchexperience with him.
Yeah.
But what the trainer is doingthere is doing something that in
the past aggravated the horse.
Yeah.
And now if you watch the horse'sreaction, right after he bites,
he lets him go and he moves andhe goes right back to looking at
his trainer like I recognizethat I did something wrong.

(33:49):
I I I don't know why I did that.
And that happens to us as well.

SPEAKER_08 (33:52):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (33:52):
Uh lots of times, I don't know.
I can speak for myself when Isay I have been in my life so
angry in a situation or aninteraction or whatever, that I
do or say something that Inumber one immediately regret,
and then two, afterwards can'texplain why.

SPEAKER_10 (34:09):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (34:09):
And that and that's a human thing.
That's not a just cops thing.

SPEAKER_10 (34:15):
Right.

SPEAKER_01 (34:15):
All humans do that.
I mean, if if you if you take alook at how we interact with
people that are not in lawenforcement, look at all the
videos of people losing itbecause their McDonald's order
was wrong.

SPEAKER_10 (34:25):
Right.

SPEAKER_01 (34:26):
And hopping over the counter and doing something.
That's the id that got tickedoff, and the ego is not managing
the superego.
The superego clearly should besaying something like, hey, it's
not reasonable for you to loseit like this.
But they'd lose it anyway.
And then afterwards, it becomeskind of hard to explain.
So that that's kind of a humanthing across the board.

SPEAKER_06 (34:43):
And it goes back to your magic trick analogy that
it's happening to these adultsthat are in their 30s because
nobody's shown them the magictrick and how it works yet.
Right.

SPEAKER_01 (34:54):
Right.
And a lot of emotionalregulation is well, it'll we'll
get it at the end when we talkabout self-discipline.

SPEAKER_09 (35:01):
Okay.

SPEAKER_01 (35:03):
So a strong ego isn't a bad thing.
When someone says they have astrong ego, strong ego is a
disciplined rider.
Okay.
A strong ego manages the moralideals of the superego with the
impulsive, instinctive nature ofthe id.
So if we can get that ego torecognize when there's problems,
then we're better off.

(35:23):
And the metaphor I use for thatis going back to the horse.
So that horse is your id, andyou're the rider, and you've got
your reins for the super ego,and you're riding along this
trail, and everything is great.
The horse loves it.
You're having fun, it's out innature, no problems.
Okay.
And you're in charge.
That horse recognizes the ridersin charge.
He's following the leads on thereins.
Everything is great.
But then all of a sudden, thehorse sees a snake on the trail.

(35:48):
Who now is in charge of thathorse?
Right.
That horse is in charge of thathorse.
Yeah.
So the trick is for us to seethe signs that there are snakes
on the trail so that we canguide either off the trail or
keep the horse controlled orrein the horse back and keep
them away from the snakecompletely.

SPEAKER_06 (36:05):
Altogether.
Yeah.
That makes sense.
Like it.
Marine blood, Tim, get in here.
Rub your ears and say, woo-sah.

SPEAKER_01 (36:15):
All right.
So next up is emotion.
Emotion.
Okay, so emotion is the bigthing.
Everyone and every in everysituation is going to have an
emotional component to everyhuman interaction.
Just about everything that we dois flavored or filtered through
our emotions.
Think something as simple asloading the dishwasher.

unknown (36:39):
Okay.

SPEAKER_01 (36:39):
You are loading the dishwasher.
Dinner was awesome.
It was great.
Candlelight dinner, anniversary.
Everything's beautiful.
Your wife, lovely bride,everything is perfect.
And you go to load thedishwasher and you put a cup on
the bottom rack.
And you look over and your wifeand she goes, that cup goes on
the top rack.

(37:00):
Yeah.
In an instant, everything thatbuilt up to that moment
emotionally gets sidetracked andbypassed and hijacked by the
emotion of here I am trying todo something nice after dinner.
And this is the respect I get.
This is I get criticized.

SPEAKER_06 (37:19):
So for a cop, that's you know, I I came out here to
help to try to do something goodfor the community, and you're
giving me shit, Mr.
Billfold.

SPEAKER_01 (37:28):
It could be anything as it could be as simple as, hey
man, how are you doing tonight?
Man, screw you, cop.
Okay, cool.
I mean, you've you've been a copalmost 30 years, you're like,
okay, all right, I'll see youlater.
Hope your day gets better.
But if you're a young officerwho, you know, doesn't have that
level of maturity yet, or you'venever been taught that something

(37:49):
like that might happen as a lawenforcement officer, you'll
react emotionally.
And that's that's pretty muchacross the board human.
Okay, because for as many umvideos as you we have of cops
behaving badly, there's just asmany of civilians behaving
badly.

unknown (38:05):
Right.

SPEAKER_01 (38:05):
Black Friday is a great example.

unknown (38:07):
Okay.

SPEAKER_01 (38:08):
Tickle me Elmo, that's all I remember.
Yeah.
So I'm and that's not it's notrestricted to law enforcement.
It's not a law enforcementpsychology.
I wouldn't even call it a lawenforcement culture.
It's a human performance factorthat we have to we have to
negotiate our emotions.

SPEAKER_06 (38:27):
Yeah.
I like that.
So it's not it's not that justonly us would benefit from
learning this stuff.
It's society in a whole.
Sure.

SPEAKER_01 (38:36):
Yeah, if if everybody was better at
emotional regulation, it wouldbe a better place.
Right.

unknown (38:40):
Okay.

SPEAKER_01 (38:41):
So we talk about emotions and how strong those
emotions can be.
And I talk with a little bit, wedon't go too much into it, but
we we address it.
Um, the strongest emotions, anda lot of people say the
strongest emotion is going to beanger, the strongest emotion is
going to be fear.
And for the most part, they'revery close to being right, in my

(39:02):
opinion.
Um my opinion being just basedon what I have personally
experienced and what I canattribute in my life as a law
enforcement officer and just ashusband, father, all of those
things and interacting withpeople.
Um anger is very, very fast.

(39:22):
We feel anger very, very quicklywhen we don't have a met
expectation.
Um, we go we can go very quicklyinto a blind rage.
It's it's it's crazy fast howquickly we get angry.
Um, it's very dangerous for copsto have to negotiate with anger.
Um fear is another.
It's it's a very primitiveemotion.

(39:43):
Uh big scary thing wants to eatme, run away, fight, set it on
fire, something.
Right.
So I don't know what to do, andI'm scared.
I might even just freeze.
And I'm gonna do what makes themost sense in that little
second, um, which could be justabout anything in in in the
throes of that emotion becauseit's very powerful.

(40:05):
It's unavoidable in lawenforcement because our job is
scary stuff.

SPEAKER_06 (40:11):
Yeah, he says Sebulous Max was saying George
is talking about my wife withthe quick anger.

SPEAKER_01 (40:17):
That's a great example of dishwasher.
Yeah, you load it wrong, you'rein trouble.
But fear is one of those thingsthat we have to learn how to
negotiate.
And uh, I think it was JohnWayne that said, you know,
courage isn't not being afraid,it's it's mounting up even when
you are afraid.
You know, we have that's the jobwe swore to do.
Yeah, and that goes back tobeing a character-driven

(40:39):
culture.
We should be hiring people ofgreat high moral character that
have that deep internal need orid to serve their fellow man.
Yeah, okay.
Otherwise, um fear is gonnadominate, anger is gonna creep
in very easily.

SPEAKER_06 (40:55):
How do you how do you equate for that though in
the hiring process?
Um I don't think we currently wewe really don't.

SPEAKER_01 (41:04):
That's a whole separate thing.

SPEAKER_06 (41:05):
Yeah, I know, but that's what I'm saying.

SPEAKER_01 (41:06):
We don't really have a good way to get that.
We have psyche valves, we haveinterviews, and what we lose in
the process, I think, is thepeople that are conducting the
interviews and the people thatare meeting these people have an
internal, uh, hopefullyemotional awareness, emotional
intelligence of their own, yeah,and can get a good read on that

(41:28):
person.
Like you and I know fromexperience that the the CTPT
instructors know those recruits.
I mean, we're with them everyday for the seven months that
they're turning into cops.

SPEAKER_06 (41:39):
And I would say, and you tell me, because you've done
it a lot longer than me, but Icould tell you just from my own
experience, within the firstday, I have what I consider a
good read on the ones that havea high likelihood of passing and
the high likelihood of failingout or getting fired.

SPEAKER_01 (41:55):
Right.
Or you can at least detectsomething that is outstandingly
different about that onecompared to the baseline of the
rest of them.

SPEAKER_07 (42:05):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (42:05):
And and it's not so much that you can see precisely
into their personality, but youcan see that something is either
higher or lower than thebaseline.
So the strongest emotion, myopinion, um, is love.
And I I come to that conclusionbecause love is a complex
emotion that is hard to naildown.

(42:25):
You can't really explain what itis.
But there have been times that Ihave been so angry, but love has
won through.
And love has been able to tampdown that that anger.
And there have been times thatI've been so afraid, but love
pushes me forward into doingwhat I what what I'm deathly
afraid of.
Um, if you think about it, thatwould be the ideal emotion for

(42:47):
cops to experience.
And I don't mean, you know, Isay that, you know, almost
30-year cop, CTPT, you know,George Lopez.
I'm human punching bag here,right?
Yeah.
And everybody thinks, oh, Georgethinks love is the most
important emotion.
It's not the touchy-feely loveI'm talking about.
It's not romantic love.
What I'm talking about is is thelove that um an officer has to

(43:10):
stand in front of a completestranger when shots are ringing
out during the middle of aprotest and telling that person
to get down, get behind cover,dragging someone out of a
burning building, all kinds ofthings.
And love will make you do somecrazy stuff that you can never
explain later, just like angerand fear can.

SPEAKER_06 (43:26):
Yeah.
Um going over to the comments,um Mr.
Bill Fold said the worst partfor me are the veterans who join
the force and forget what theConstitution their brothers and
sisters died defending is allabout.
Um Perry Lemmley said, those ofus who are willing to run into
the fire, these are who we needin law enforcement.
Um Chris Garrett said qualityversus quantity.

(43:49):
The Angry Vet, he's been a newerone that's been joining us.
I love everything he's usuallygot to say on there.
Um he said evals and interviewsmean nothing when the target.
Where'd it go?
When the target IQ is subpar.
Now, I will address that alittle bit, Angry Vet.
That did happen at um uh adepartment that was a very
famous uh issue with that onedepartment.

(44:11):
But I can promise you, in myexperience for the hiring, they
want if they if they're gonnapick you if you got a degree
over somebody that doesn't havea degree.
If you've got um time in themilitary versus somebody that
doesn't have time in themilitary, they're looking for
that sort of thing, not IQ.
We didn't even take an IQ test.
Nope.

SPEAKER_01 (44:30):
I don't remember one.
No, I didn't take an IT.

SPEAKER_06 (44:33):
Yeah.
So um are there some departmentsI think that did do that?
I know there's, like I said,there was one department, I
think up in Massachusetts orConnecticut or something like
that, uh, that did havesomething to do with trying to
find high IQ.
No, they had somebody that theysaid scored too high of an IQ.
It was really strange.
That's um yeah.

(44:54):
Uh and I do know what he'stalking about, but for the most
part, no.
Oh, we got Jerry Worms in thehouse.
Do you know who Jerry Worms is?
He was the first cop everfeatured on cops.
Oh, wow.
Yeah, yeah.
And uh carried nunchucks.
He called them foldable batons.
So Jerry said uh during theinterview process by a
psychologist, some of the way arecruit reacts to a situation

(45:17):
cannot be duplicated only duringa real incident.

SPEAKER_01 (45:20):
100%.
That is true.
You're you're right on the mark.
And that's why just to kind ofnot chase the rabbit too much,
but just get into why as atraining institution we've moved
a lot towards scenario training.
Scenario training has been shownto develop um schemas in the
brain and what I call files thata recruit or a young officer can

(45:43):
refer back to.
So the more exposure we can getthem to various files, the
better their experience is gonnabe.
Uh, and then we have to do thestress inoculation thing because
you know, we we we really can'tpredict what's gonna happen in
real-world environments.
So you're exactly right.

SPEAKER_06 (46:01):
Okay.
Banning, I just want to makesure you I feel like you're
you're just along for the show,baby.

SPEAKER_05 (46:07):
I've taken this all in, experienced a lot of it, and
uh new and young people alike.
So I love that we're talkingabout it.

SPEAKER_06 (46:14):
Fair.
Okay.
Um, so lead us into this nextone here.
I will uh Okay.

SPEAKER_01 (46:21):
Here's a quick little video of an officer who
um I don't know all the detailsof the purpose for the stop.
So any any probable cause,reasonable suspicion questions,
I'm not really a hundred percentsure.
Um, but the the problem is isthat he clearly goes from trying
to act as a professional tohaving a clear emotional
response.

SPEAKER_09 (46:41):
Okay.

SPEAKER_01 (46:41):
So it's basically to the person he's talking to
knowing his rights and andstanding up for his rights.

SPEAKER_06 (46:47):
Um yeah, I I think we've actually covered this
video on here before, but uh Mr.
Billfold, yeah, this video is anoldie but a goodie.
Yeah, so if you haven't seenthis one, you're in for a treat.
Uh all right.

SPEAKER_13 (47:01):
Hi, what's going on?

SPEAKER_12 (47:05):
We didn't call you.

unknown (47:06):
I don't answer questions.

SPEAKER_12 (47:08):
He did.
Okay, we'll go talk to him.

unknown (47:10):
Oh, I'm gonna be talking.

SPEAKER_12 (47:11):
No, you're not gonna talk to me.

unknown (47:12):
Yeah, you ain't gonna talk.

SPEAKER_01 (47:14):
So right there, his id is taking over.
So you're gonna talk to me.
I'm the guy in charge here.
Uh I I am the police officer.
I have the badge, I have thistraining, I have this authority.
You will respect me at such andsuch level, or uh we're gonna
have conflict.
So if that that id need isn'tmet, that emotional response

(47:39):
just starts to grow.

SPEAKER_09 (47:40):
Okay.

SPEAKER_01 (47:41):
Keep going.

SPEAKER_12 (47:42):
So go talk to the guy that called you.
Isn't that in that procedure?
When a complaint party calls,you go talk to the complaining
party.
No, you don't get sure it is.
Sure it is.
Sure it is.
Go talk to him, he'll tell youwhat's going on, and then you
can be like, oh, nothing illegalis going on.
I can go back to doing my realjob.

(48:03):
Don't touch our vehicle.
You are you are our vehicle.
Don't touch our vehicle.
You didn't pull us over.
Yes, I did not.

SPEAKER_11 (48:11):
Say what's up to Utica Police Sergeant Greg
Morabito.

SPEAKER_12 (48:14):
We were parked here.

SPEAKER_11 (48:15):
Okay.
You didn't pull it up.

SPEAKER_01 (48:17):
So so if you've seen this video before and you've
you've broken down before, it'sreally no point in going through
it again.
Okay, cool.
The the the teaching point herethat I use for the recruits and
for officers is that the thisofficer has clearly overstepped
and is now trying to force it.

SPEAKER_06 (48:33):
What we call doubling down.

SPEAKER_01 (48:34):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Instead of admitting saying, youknow what, you're right.
Let me go talk to that guyfirst.
I'll be right back.
Thank you.
I mean, but and that that takessome emotional control, some
emotional regulation becauseyou've got to rein in that id
because the id wants the respectthat it believes it deserves.

SPEAKER_09 (48:49):
Right.
Okay.

SPEAKER_01 (48:51):
So this next slide, there's just a quick little
diagram just to explain it toyou.
Um it's a diagram of the brainand how emotions are controlled
by the limbic system.
Limbic system being theprimitive part of the brain, the
first part of the brain thatdevelops.
It uh deals with um all of yourunconscious, unregulated stuff.

SPEAKER_08 (49:09):
Gotcha.
I'll actually show this one onthe screen.

unknown (49:12):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (49:13):
So your emotions, your behaviors, motivations,
memories, autonomic nervoussystem, breathing, you know,
pooping, puking when you needto, all that stuff.
Um and then that amygdala there,that is basically the gatekeeper
of conflict or no conflict,threat or no threat, um, harmful

(49:33):
or not harmful.
So that amygdala is veryimportant to cops because if we
don't learn to regulate that,everything can become a threat.
And uh you and I know fromtraining that we'll have
recruits going through ascenario with a primary purpose
of the scenario, and then othermembers or other role players

(49:54):
just being loud and distracting,and they almost always focus on
the loud and distracting.

SPEAKER_07 (49:59):
Right.

SPEAKER_01 (49:59):
Because they can't circumvent that amygdala telling
them that the bigger crowd isthe bigger threat.
When in reality, what they havein front of them is what they
should be focusing on.
So that's the limbic system,it's part of the brain.
The uh next slide.
Okay.
Is that uh prefrontal cortex?

(50:20):
That's where all of your highreasoning comes from.
Okay, math, right here, science.
Yes, yes.
And there's studies now thatshow that it does not develop in
adult humans in males untilaround the age of 25.
I think females are around 22.
They're a little bit quickerthan us, but I think it's
because from the outset, girlsculturally, whatever you want to

(50:45):
call it, they're they're alittle bit better equipped with
dealing with their emotionsverbally than we are.

SPEAKER_07 (50:52):
Okay.

SPEAKER_01 (50:53):
They can say that hurts my feelings.
Whereas we don't run aroundsaying, hey, you really hurt my
feelings the other day, Eric.

SPEAKER_06 (50:59):
Yeah.
Well, banning does, but youknow, yeah.
Banning's not he's not, he's nottoo.
Um the angry vet said, Well, Ijust stopped by to kick kick the
algorithm.
Much love, guys.
If anyone can convince me thatthere are good cops out there,
it will be y'all, I'm sure.
Tough road, though.
Thanks, man.
Appreciate it.
We're trying, brother.
One step at a time.
Yeah.

(51:19):
At least we're doing something.
Yeah.
So we're trying to do something.
Um the Lofton said, the angryvet, we cops will learn to be
better from Eric and Banning.
Oh, I appreciate that.
And now George.
Hey, thanks.
Um, Mr.
Billfold said, Angry vet.
Angry, they are good guys, butgood cops is still a hard idea
to wrap my head around.

(51:40):
It's 2025 and shit has notimproved.
We're trying, brother.
We're trying.
I promise we are trying.
Um, at least you have cops thatare publicly trying to
acknowledge the fault and fixthings.
Yep.
We may not get it right, butdamn it, it's better than doing
nothing and sitting by quiet.
So, um, but yeah, prefrontalcortex, let's move on to the
next here.

(52:01):
So I use this.
Oh shit.

SPEAKER_01 (52:03):
It's just a quick little slide and it it's it's
pretty metaphorical, but I sayto them when you are emotionally
unregulated or you are having anemotional response, you are
literally not in your rightmind.
Simply because, you know, whenyou tell someone you're out of
your mind, um it's it'simpactful.
You're not thinking straight.
There's something wrong with howyou're processing information

(52:25):
right now.
But if you're emotional andyou're not regulating that
emotional, that emotion well,you're literally in that limbic
system and not in yourprefrontal cortex.
And as a law enforcementofficer, you've you've got to
strive to stay in thatprefrontal cortex because the
decisions you make in hundredthsof a second can determine an
outcome.

SPEAKER_06 (52:44):
Right.
Um I correct me if I'm wrong,prefrontal cortex doesn't make
decisions nearly as quick.
I'm sorry, I didn't catch, I washalf reading.
Oh, yeah.
Um the the prefrontal cortex uhis not nearly as quick at
distinguishing and in in makingdecisions quickly.
Right.
Um, so that's why it's it's abalancing act in the police

(53:06):
world because we may have toswitch over to that lizard brain
really fucking quick.

SPEAKER_01 (53:10):
Right.
You'll feel faster than you'llthink.
You'll it'll always be that way.
Right.
And at best, you can think in away that gets you close enough
to appropriate, which is whyreasonableness is so important.

SPEAKER_07 (53:23):
Right.

SPEAKER_06 (53:24):
Sorry, I am refilling my drink here.

SPEAKER_08 (53:26):
Let me hook me up if you can.

SPEAKER_06 (53:29):
Grab yourself an ice cube out of here.
I didn't want to.
I know you're marine and youdon't give a shit.
Um shit.
I'll let you uh finish off thisguy.

SPEAKER_05 (53:42):
He doesn't care if your skinners has been all over
it, man.

SPEAKER_06 (53:45):
I'll let you finish that part of the bottle.
I will go over here to somesmoke wagon.
Which one?
It's gone.
I I put the rest in there.
Yeah, you get the rest.
Thank you.
Put a little smoke wagon in thebottle.
There we go.
Okay.
Now that we're properly uhrefueled.

SPEAKER_01 (54:02):
Um there's a comment on there, Michelle Ferlisi.
29 years, plain clothes,undercover.
I was trained and taught byolder guys who fought in
Vietnam.
Uh, and they taught me how tofocus on that one person or task
and to just tune everythingaround you out.
That's um that's not bad forsome situations.
Yeah.

(54:22):
That's not bad for a gunfight.
That's not bad for, I would evensay, a fist fight to get someone
under control.
However, uh, there's thisconcept that we have of
multitasking, and the way thebrain works is we we simply
can't multitask.
Well, we can't watch severaldifferent things at the same
time.
What we can get pretty good atis changing focus very, very
quickly.

(54:43):
So I can go from you to him tohim to you to this to that, the
crowd, everything else.
But I I still do have to have aprimary focus.
So it is critical to be able todo that.
But um, if it's just that and wefocus on that, we lose context.
Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 (54:58):
One of the things that I learned through grappling
is and I never really had areason to make this conversation
until you just brought that up.
But one of the things that I'velearned through grappling is I
can literally think in twodifferent brains when I'm when
I'm holding on to somebody onthe ground, like in the areas
that you and I used to work, um,I would be in a fight.

(55:22):
Now, to me, I'm not fightingbecause they have no idea what
they're doing on the ground.
Um, so I'm controlling them, butI'm looking at everything around
me because I don't need to focuson him.
That muscle memory, I'm not,like I said, I'm not thinking my
body's just reacting to whateverthey're physically making me
respond to, but I am thinkingabout everybody else that's
around me.
Because as you know, like whenyou've grappled for so long, you

(55:44):
can do it blindfolded.
You you you physically don'tneed to see what's going on.
Yeah.
Um, and and that's why I push itso much.
Um, and and George will get onme.
So it's not just BJJ, it's uhGreco-Roman wrestling, uh catch
wrestling, judo, uh what else?
Muay Thai.
Muay Thai.
Western boxing.
Yeah, all of those things.
I'm I'm a big fan of all ofthose, but in grappling alone

(56:05):
with the you know, judo stufflike that, you you get a sense
of when you're in contact withthe person, I don't have to
think as much.
Right.
I can focus on everything else.

SPEAKER_01 (56:15):
And that and that's experience.
Yes.
So how do we get that to ourbrand new officers?

SPEAKER_09 (56:19):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (56:20):
Uh outside of exposure.
And even more critically, how dowe get them to think that way
before the event?

SPEAKER_06 (56:28):
I I again I kind of feeling yeah.
I I get more into a hiringpractice.
I I am uh now of the opinionthat in policing, and you tell
me what you think because yougot more experience than me, but
we we make a doctor doschooling.
They're prepping for the jobbefore they ever become a
doctor, right?
Right?
Got to get good grades in highschool, they got to get good
grades in college, they got togo through their prereqs, then

(56:49):
they got to go through clinicalsand all these things.
A lawyer, what do they got todo?
They gotta do good in school,they gotta focus on writing.
They got they're like thesethings they know they're gonna
have to do to get to that goal.
If you're gonna become a cop,I'm of the opinion that we
shouldn't be hiring people thatjust decide they want to be a
cop.
You have to have prepped to getinto this career field.
So if you want to prep to get inthis career field, one of the

(57:12):
things that you need to havedone is a form of martial arts
grappling.
Now, I get very picky on what Ithink that should be boxing,
judo, like things that areproven.
Right.
Things that are proven.
And I there's got to be a testfor that.
You can't just tell me you didit.
We gotta you gotta prove it.
Yeah.
And we'll be able to see thatvery quickly from anybody that's

(57:32):
experienced.
That is one prerequisite that Ithink if they had that coming
in, we fixed a lot of theissues.

SPEAKER_01 (57:38):
Sure.
And that that goes to a point,um, education is not training.
Right.
So I can I could sit here andtell you, you know, how to do X,
Y, and Z, but can you put X, Y,and Z in front of me on the
table and can I put it backtogether and take it apart and
show you all the parts, how theywork, and then put it back
together and make it work again?
That's that's training.

(57:58):
So for us, um, where that wherethat kind of interjects or or
layers into is um this thismight go over, it might not.
The capacity for physical forceis a prerequisite for this job.

(58:20):
Not because we want to, butbecause there is an element that
will resist, right?
And it will always be that.
And so you have to be capable,yes, have to be capable, but the
intangible of it is you have tobe not just competent, but
internally confident.
You you can't come in needing toget your validation on your

(58:45):
competence from others.
You have to have your internalvalidation from yourself.
So it's kind of the phenomenon.
Some of the most dangerousfighters on the planet are the
are the kindest, gentlest, mosthumble person you'll ever meet.

SPEAKER_06 (58:58):
I I would say that is 99% of all USU fighters.

SPEAKER_01 (59:02):
Why is that?
Look at these tactical operatorswho are legit, legit, dangerous
dudes.
Yeah.
Nice guys, all of them, easygoing, won't have conflict in
the line at Albertson's becausesomebody cut in front of them.
Why is that?
It's that internal confidence,confident competence.

SPEAKER_06 (59:19):
Agreed.
Agreed.
100%.
Um, going back to the chat,guys.
We're gonna keep bouncing backto the chat.
If we get wrapped up in theclass, it's just because the
class is so good.
Um, so I apologize if we missedanybody.
We definitely didn't want tomiss Anthony White.
He said, Lopez, one of the mostwell-respected and knowledgeable
officers I know.
Thank you so much, sir.
Um love that.
Prefrontal cortex.
This is from somebody onLinkedIn said the prefrontal

(59:41):
cortex is the primary brainregion of making quick
decisions, but it works withother areas of the habitual
choices.
Um and the anterior.
Singulate, thank you, sir.
Cortex uh to sort throughoptions.

SPEAKER_01 (59:54):
And now you're getting into all kinds of things
that require even more time.
Yeah.
The more options you have, themore time it takes to sort
through which one is best.

SPEAKER_05 (01:00:01):
Yeah, that's that's from that question, was from
David Cardoso off my LinkedIn.

SPEAKER_06 (01:00:05):
Oh, okay, good.
Um, yeah, for some reason it'snot showing on here, so I
apologize, uh, David.
Um Brandar said, stop resistinghas the same effect as I smell
something.
That's awesome.
Well played, sir.
Well played.
Um no, I like that.
But um yes, I I think that I'msorry, I'm not talking on the

(01:00:29):
mic.
I think that with the idea ofbeing able to process and and
going through experience, sothis is why this class
specifically is so important tothe rookie officer versus the
more experienced officer.
Because it's not that a morebecause we've watched videos on

(01:00:51):
here of more experiencedofficers falling flat and doing
stupid shit.

SPEAKER_01 (01:00:55):
Yep.

SPEAKER_06 (01:00:55):
They're just less likely because they've learned
through the experience.
Yeah, they may not be able toexplain it, and I still think
the class could help everybody.
But the important part is rightnow is understanding why we're
talking about what we're talkingabout.
Um Wade Lucero said, let's fixthe officer safety issue.
That's my pet peeve.
Hey, brother, we got a lot ofthings we're gonna be working on

(01:01:17):
today specifically.
We just want to recognize thegap in ego, understanding what
ego is, uh, when to see ittaking over and you're not
thinking clearly.

unknown (01:01:28):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 (01:01:28):
Um, because if we can start getting that problem
handled, maybe we can starthandling a lot of other issues.
Yeah, for sure.
Yeah.
Um, but all right, we're gonnakeep moving.
Um we already hit this, right?
Yeah.
Okay.
So we got another video comingup.
Let's see what the next one is.
Is this the is this the one thatyou wanted to just talk through
the sentence, the cartoon one?

SPEAKER_01 (01:01:48):
Oh, yeah.
It it explains a little bitabout how the limbic system
works and what it's in charge ofand how you're literally your
emotions can rede re entirelyderail your thought process.
Okay.
I mean, you can you can be 100%perfectly trained and know the
exact right answer, and youthrow an emotional aspect into

(01:02:09):
it and it goes out the window.

SPEAKER_06 (01:02:10):
Yeah, and we see that the moment somebody goes,
I'll go and you know, I'll findout who your wife is and fuck
your wife.

SPEAKER_01 (01:02:16):
And you see they weren't ready for that.
Yeah, and all they justtriggered.
Yeah.
And if you go take it one stepback, why is that guy saying
that to that officer?

SPEAKER_10 (01:02:27):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (01:02:27):
Because he's angry, right?
Because he's wanting to inducethat.
He's he's he's trying his id.
Yeah, his id is not getting met.
So they feed on each other.

SPEAKER_09 (01:02:37):
I gotcha.
Okay.
This guy's so smart.

SPEAKER_01 (01:02:40):
Uh so the goal is to to keep us thinking in that
prefrontal cortex and notfeeling in that limbic system.
The the problem is that as humanbeings, we feel much faster than
we think.

SPEAKER_10 (01:02:54):
Yes.

SPEAKER_01 (01:02:55):
And unless we're exposed to those feelings and
then expected to think, thefeeling will circumvent the
thought because it's so muchstronger and so much deeper in
that internal instinctive partof our brains.

SPEAKER_07 (01:03:07):
Unmet expectations.

SPEAKER_01 (01:03:09):
That's the biggest part of anger and frustration,
really.

SPEAKER_06 (01:03:12):
Um let me share this photo so people can get an idea
what we're talking about here.
Because this man is awesome.

SPEAKER_01 (01:03:21):
That's Tig, right?

SPEAKER_06 (01:03:24):
Love it.
Let me see.
Nope, that's not what we want.
We want to share the window tothe wall.
There we go.
Check this out.
All right.
So we've got a 97-year-olddeputy with 74 years on the job,
is the oldest working officer inhistory.
Look at the hash marks.

SPEAKER_01 (01:03:44):
Three quarters of a century on there.
Jesus.
He's running out of sleeve.
Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 (01:03:48):
Yeah.
He probably had to have thosehash marks like made
specifically smaller just to fiton there.
Oh Lord.

SPEAKER_01 (01:03:57):
So that's the that's the question.
How do the old guys manage to beable to negotiate all of these
things and they let people saythings?
And I don't know.
I've I've worked part-time jobswhere everybody around me is
intoxicated.
Not the fellow officers, but allof the everyone, everyone at the
bar.

(01:04:19):
And um everyone, once they'reintoxicated, they're operating
almost entirely emotionally.
Their prefrontal cortex istaking a nap.
And that's that's why thealcohol is considered
depressant, because that'sthat's the effect it's having on
your brain.
You're not processinginformation the same way.

(01:04:39):
It depresses the information.

SPEAKER_06 (01:04:40):
You're not depressing me right now.
Okay, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (01:04:42):
So but my point is is how do the old guys manage to
negotiate with that rowdy drunkwho's been asked to leave and
now he wants to challengeeverybody and bows up his chest
and everything?
So how is it the old guys can doit?
But the young guys are like,okay, cool, let's go.
Right.
I'll throw down.
I'm happy to throw down.
Yeah.
So that's the question.
How do the old guys do it?

SPEAKER_06 (01:05:02):
Gotcha.
Um, Brand R86 dropped five bucksand said, uh, or the guy said it
because he was swatted while ina Call of Duty lobby.
Yeah.
Holy shit.
So just a short little siderabbit hole.
Um, you know, got to play.
I'm a gamer.

(01:05:23):
I I I've always been a gamer,but it's always been on
computers.
So I don't know the the wholeXbox lobby stuff.
I didn't, I didn't, it wasn't mything.
I didn't I didn't jump on those.
I I would play, and when I play,I play with Discord, and
Discord's always with people Iknow.
So I'm not really listening toanybody else, but I got in an
Xbox lobby with some friendswhen oh my god, the the amount

(01:05:46):
of hate and racial shit in its12-year-olds just get shit on
like oh my god.
Oh so well, it's thatundeveloped prefrontal.
Oh, it is, and let me tell you,like if you are any somewhat at
all PC, if you're like, youknow, like stuff that we used to
say in the 80s and 90s, youknow, that you can't really say

(01:06:06):
today, and you're just like, youtook it away from us.
Uh Xbox Lobby thinks it's the 19fucking 40s and they don't give
a shit.
So anyway, um supposedly it'sgetting better.
But I'm going over to the uhgoing over to the comments.
I want to read what everybody'sgot to say.
Um if I had my choice, copswould learn the law properly,

(01:06:27):
then take ego training.
Most ego-driven mistakes happenwhen they when people know the
law better than the badge, whoshows up and corrects them.
So sure.

SPEAKER_01 (01:06:37):
But if that officer was emotionally regulated well
enough to say, you know what,I'm not 100% on that.
And I think I'm gonna take yourword for it on this one because
I'm I'm not 100% and I I'm notconfident with writing you the
ticket or taking you intocustody or continuing this
interaction without being moreknowledgeable myself.

SPEAKER_06 (01:06:54):
And that is the point we're trying to make, Mr.
Buffold.
It's not mutually exclusive.
They complement each other.
Knowing the law is great, butwhen your ego's in check and you
you don't know, because how manyfucking laws are there?
A ton.

SPEAKER_01 (01:07:08):
How often do they change?

SPEAKER_06 (01:07:09):
Yeah, there's no way to keep up with them all.
Lawyers, judges don't know allthe laws.
So even for us, I would say ifyou've got a good ego in check,
then even on the times whenyou're not sure, you're able to
acknowledge that, you know what?
I I need more guidance on what Igot, versus you're gonna fucking
listen to me because you justgot challenged, and we went from

(01:07:31):
our prefrontal cortex into thelimbic limbic system.
Limbic system.
See, look at me learning.
Um Eye of the Night.
I want to hear Izzo's take onthat one.
Have you listened to any of theDominic Izzo stuff?
You know who I'm talking aboutat all?
Yes.
And I've I've had him on a fewtimes.
He is very um shock jock style,yeah, but his heart is

(01:07:54):
definitely in the right place.
I love Izzo.
I have a lot of conversations onthe side um with him, and and
sometimes things that I cannotsay or do online, but he has the
freedom to, I'll just pass it onto him and he'll talk about the
topic for me.
So um great dude.
Great dude.
Definitely back him up.
Make sure you like follow,subscribe to Izzo Cop Talk Live.
Great stuff.

(01:08:15):
Um But let me see here.
Uh go to Mr.
Billfold again.
He said it's simple.
No amount of ego will make youthink that the sidewalks are
private property.
Ego doesn't make you unaware ofthe Fourth Amendment.

SPEAKER_01 (01:08:27):
You're right, but your emotion will make you
forget it.
Oh gets deep.

SPEAKER_06 (01:08:32):
What do you mean by that?

SPEAKER_01 (01:08:34):
Well, I mean you can know something and be so
hot-headed or so emotional aboutit that you forget the logic of
it.
So, personal story, like I'vetold you, I've I've been so
angry that I've done somethingtotally outside of my nature and
immediately regretted it andthen had to pay the consequence
for it.
Okay.
Having an argument with thewife.

(01:08:54):
I get so pissed off, I punch ahole in the drywall.
The second my hand fits thatdrywall, I have that negative
reinforcement because it hurts.
Yeah.
Okay.
And then I have the, oh shit.
Now she's gonna be scared of me.
Now this is really erupting.
Now I'm losing control here.
And then afterwards, I'm the guywho has to fix the drywall.
But in that moment, all of thosethings that I knew that it was

(01:09:18):
gonna hurt, that I was gonnahave to repair it later, that I
was gonna be scaring my wife,they didn't matter because I was
mad.
That's what I mean when I sayyour emotion will hijack that
prefrontal cortex.

SPEAKER_08 (01:09:28):
Because you know better.

SPEAKER_01 (01:09:29):
Because you know better.
You know the Fourth Amendment.
But he pissed you off, so you'regonna try and get around it.
And that horse is gonna leavethe trail and it's gonna go.

SPEAKER_06 (01:09:39):
Yeah, that makes sense.
Uh, Brandon R86.
Brandar, spoiling us tonight.
I don't know what he did, what Idid to make him happy, but he's
he's loving on us.
I like it.
Uh he did a five-dollar superchat that said um policing is
allowed to make mistakes andthen go back, review the
incident, and then apply newlaws that they didn't know about
at the time of the arrest.

(01:10:01):
Um I'm trying to process that.
Policing is allowed to makemistakes and then go back,
review the incident, and thenapply new laws they didn't know
about at the time of the arrest.
Can you, Brandar, can you kindof give me an example of what
you mean there?

SPEAKER_01 (01:10:19):
That's there's there's one there.
Uh Mr.
Bill Fold again.
If you're emotional, I'mthinking that's what you mean.
Yeah.
If your emotion makes you forgetit, then you do not need to be a
cop.
Um I'm gonna halfway agree withthat.
I'm not I'm gonna add the caveatof if you cannot learn to
emotionally regulate yourself,you don't need to be a cop.

SPEAKER_06 (01:10:41):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (01:10:41):
Because every human being has emotion.

SPEAKER_06 (01:10:44):
Yes.

SPEAKER_01 (01:10:44):
Every human being does.

SPEAKER_06 (01:10:45):
Yeah.
And you don't want cops withoutemotion, too.
Right.
That's because then you have arobot.
Then you got robots.
Yeah, it's a fucking fine line.
It really is.
Um first by first first best,Gigi said, uh, Izzo's channel is
where I found your channel.
Oh, very cool.
Thank you very much, uh, Gigi.
Um Eye of the Night said, Iwould also say before cops says,

(01:11:06):
for example, I would also saybefore a cop says, for example,
you were jaywalking, but thencome to find out the place
doesn't have jaywalking laws orthe lawful requirements for
jaywalking, not at a crosswalk.
Correct.
Um Joffreon citing vagrancy lawsthat don't exist.
Yeah, that was a big one.
Did you see that video?

(01:11:27):
Uh-huh.
This moron gets um, it's like adeposition, it's not like an
official criminal like thing.
It's like him being sued orsomething, and he's just kept
doing, I don't remember.
I don't remember.
Like you could tell he wasclearly like you could tell he's
lying.
Yeah.
I mean, am I speculatingtechnically?
Yes.
But we're human bullshitdetectives.

(01:11:48):
You can tell.
He'd been coached and he wasgoing through the motions, just
piece of shit.
Piece of shit.
And um, but yeah, he startedreciting laws that didn't
fucking exist.
Um again, um, poor trainingcan't control his ego.
Um, but uh all right, let's umoh, Brandar clarified here.
He said police can apply thewrong law in an arrest, then

(01:12:11):
review the totality of theincident and apply a different
law violation later.
I I yeah, that's true.
That's true.
I've explained this before onhere where I know somebody broke
a law.
I'm not 100% sure which specificlaw it is.
Like we'll go with um the one Ilike to use is you know, I found

(01:12:34):
two different credit cards umthat didn't belong to a person
on them.
It's a felony, it's an assumedfelony because you got two
credit cards that don't belongto you.
Um now through theinvestigation, you can later
find out that they wereborrowing them or whatever.
But until then, you were gettingcharged with that, you know,
basically theft or identitytheft or whatever it is.
But you don't know that law offthe top of your head unless you

(01:12:56):
specialize in property crimes.
Um so you'll put cuffs onsomebody and you don't even know
what law that they've officiallybroke yet.
But you're you're beingdetained, you're putting being
put in cuffs.
Any reasonable person probablywould believe they're under
arrest already because they'rebeing cuffed, put in the back of
a car while we're looking at thelaw that you fucking broke.
We knew you broke one, we justgot to figure it out.

SPEAKER_01 (01:13:18):
Or you didn't break it according to the law, and we
need to get that cleared up.

SPEAKER_08 (01:13:22):
Yeah, or let you go.

SPEAKER_01 (01:13:23):
Yeah, because if you don't meet the elements of the
offense, you don't meet theelements of the offense.

unknown (01:13:27):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (01:13:28):
Like the difference between robbery and theft.
You don't know until you talk tothe person that was actually
harmed in the robbery.

SPEAKER_06 (01:13:34):
Right.
Um, and you'll hear that quite abit.
You'd be like, oh, I got robbed,and then you talk to somebody
like, well, what happened?
He took my purse out of my carwhen I was inside.
Yeah.
That's not robbery, it'sburglary.
Yeah.
So um, yeah, for sure.
Yeah, Mr.
Bilville, he's talking aboutthat Joffrey.
And I don't recall.
I don't recall.
That's what that dude said.
Um, Wade Lucero said, just learnto control your ego, or I can do

(01:13:56):
it for you.
Careful, careful.
Make sure you're right.
Like I said, and this goes withmaturity, y'all.
You can be right and fucking behurt for it, or you can be right
and just take the ride.
Figure it out later.
There's there's a time and aplace.
Only you will know.
And I tell that to everybody.

(01:14:18):
I put a video out recently of umcop sticking his foot in the
door.

SPEAKER_09 (01:14:21):
Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_06 (01:14:22):
Um, clearly in the wrong.
He had uh he had an arrestwarrant for somebody he thought
may be at the place, but didn'thave the articulation to say for
sure that per person was inthere.
And uh I did some follow-up onit, and the guy got hammered for
a fourth amendment violation forsure.
And uh, but the point being isthat guy stepping over that line

(01:14:45):
and not stepping back and takingthe time to think about what he
was doing, and all the people inthe comments were just all over
this dude.
I lost my train of thought.
I was gonna go somewhere elsewith that.
Um, the I don't recall.
Just learn to control your ego.
Oh, but it became the ego.
That's what I was gonna get toabout him putting his foot in

(01:15:05):
the door.
Yeah, it became about the ego.

SPEAKER_10 (01:15:08):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 (01:15:08):
Um, because he wanted to know, he wanted to ask
more questions.
This guy wasn't having it.
He's like, No, I'm gonna shut mydoor.
And then the guy stuck his footin the door.
Yeah, it's too late, man.
Um, and and you since you'rehere, you can actually back me
up because uh the thing that Isaid in that video was that is a
scenario we specifically trainin the academy.
Is uh we usually guide it as aloud music party.

(01:15:30):
Yep.
And it's uh I am talking like 15to 20 cops.
They're they're off duty,they're they're volunteering
their time.

SPEAKER_01 (01:15:39):
Several civilians, too.
Yeah, lots of code blue people.
Yeah.
So it's a good mix.
Yeah.
It's not just because when whencops are the role players, you
can tell that's a cop.
Right.
Because they talk to you likethey've been talked to in the
past.

SPEAKER_06 (01:15:50):
Yes.
But they know how to get underyour skin.

SPEAKER_01 (01:15:52):
That's that's exactly what I mean.
Is it when put them in there sothat so that they can get under
that skin?
That's part of the stressinoculation.

SPEAKER_06 (01:15:59):
And so we we just put them through the most
craziest of loud partyscenarios, but the idea is to
get them to open that, hold thatdoor open or put their foot in
the doorway, and then we loseour ever fucking mind on them.
And it is it is literally likeyou know, uh a kid touching the
hot pan after you told themdon't touch it, don't touch it,
and then they touch it and theyimmediately regret.

SPEAKER_01 (01:16:22):
Yep.
And then when you ask them aboutit, they know they shouldn't
have.
And they yes, they'llarticulate.
I knew I shouldn't have done it,but I was mad.
The lady with the bubble gunkept getting in my face.
Yeah, Jenny with the bubbles.
She just irritates them.
And I've had uh recruits say,Well, I'm gonna arrest you for
assault because that soap andthat bubble is come on, you're
really gonna be that guy.

(01:16:42):
Yeah, yeah, you're gonna getyou're gonna be officer bubbles.
Right, exactly.

SPEAKER_06 (01:16:47):
All right, let's uh we're never gonna get through
all this going.
No worries.

SPEAKER_01 (01:16:51):
So knowing yourself, just being honest with yourself,
and that that's part of it.
A lot of people, their ego iswrapped up in their identity or
their job.
Okay, I I am this, and this isexpected of me, so I've got to
be this guy.
Yeah, I've got the the peopleare watching.
And I've even in my trainingback in the day, before the turn
of the century, when I was ayoung recruit out there on
Eastide, I'd have officers say,If if you let that guy talk to

(01:17:13):
you like that, the rest of thecrowd is gonna talk to you like
that.
I was like, I don't care.
They're just talking.
Right.
What do I care if they'retalking?
Let them say what they're gonnasay as long as they're doing
what I need them to do.

SPEAKER_06 (01:17:22):
Yeah.
Um, while we're on that subject,real quick, I actually got into
it with some um officers inPhiladelphia where I'm I watched
this video, and they're they aguy's jawing at them, and the
officers go into a roastsection, roast session with
them.
Funny, yes.

(01:17:43):
Completely unprofessional.
Yeah.
And you could tell that theofficer was feeling some sort of
way, was getting he was gettinghe was mad, so he jawed back,
but he did it funny.
I'm not listening it's funny.
I'm not saying it's not funny,but I was like, it's
unprofessional.
I was like, if I was yoursupervisor, that'd be your ass.
Like, we have no, you have noright to do that.

(01:18:05):
You do I understand it, yes, butnot in the uniform.
I hold you to a higher standardwhen you're wearing that
uniform.
And they say, That's Philly.
This is how you would neversurvive over here in Philly.
And I'm like, I you're lettingwhat he said get to you.
Okay, I could give a shit less.

SPEAKER_01 (01:18:23):
So are are you asking me to back you up on your
opinion or are you asking me myopinion?

SPEAKER_06 (01:18:27):
No, I I'm saying this is kind of to your point.
This is what I'm getting into.
Is like, now, am I the guy thathas lipped off and gone back at
them because I'm not gonna letthem walk on me?
Yeah, I've done it.

SPEAKER_01 (01:18:38):
Some of that is culture too, though.
True.
I mean, look at we just we saidon here that uh Marines.
Right Marines are all gonna beberating each other.
They're always gonna beHollywood Marine or San Diego or
Sand Fleece, whatever.
But inside that culture, it'sacceptable.
Right.
So you as a supervisor, you'rein the unique position of having
to protect and defend the honor,we'll call it, of the agency

(01:19:05):
itself and bring those youngofficers up to a standard that
you believe to be correct.
But the interaction betweenthose those officers and that
civilian, that could have beenthe one thing that makes that
civilian go, that officer'sactually pretty cool.

SPEAKER_06 (01:19:21):
He got agreed.
I agree.
That wasn't this situation.
Okay, that's not what this wasabout.
I I understand what you mean onthat.
Yes.
Okay, a hundred percent.
This wasn't that.
This was he was trying to hurthim emotionally.
Okay.
It wasn't a it was one of those.
Yeah.
And I'm like, no, you can't godown.

SPEAKER_01 (01:19:41):
That's a little that's a little more.
You know playful banter back andforth.
That's probably harmless,depending on culturally where
you're at, and you know what itis you're saying, of course.

SPEAKER_06 (01:19:51):
Yeah.
I I looked at it as punchingdown.
It's kind of how I saw thesituation.
I'm like, you're punching down,dude.
Like, why?

SPEAKER_01 (01:19:57):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 (01:19:57):
Like this guy's going to jail.
Yeah.
He's already got it bad enough.

SPEAKER_01 (01:20:01):
Yeah.

unknown (01:20:01):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 (01:20:02):
And now you're it was just where you're coming
from.
I didn't like it.
Um, anyway, uh Brandar droppedanother.
Brandar, save your money, dude.
Like, I appreciate you, but letsome other people share the
wealth, man.
I believe Brandar is military.
So I know he he just needs tosave his money as it is.

(01:20:22):
Um, he said, if an officer hasan ego-driven adverse adverse
encounter, the officer's EMIshould be an eight-hour shift in
a COD lobby learning toemotional control.

SPEAKER_01 (01:20:34):
That might be a little too much inoculation.

SPEAKER_07 (01:20:36):
Bro, that's just mean.

SPEAKER_01 (01:20:38):
That might be like the old psychology of shock
treatment.
Yeah, yeah.
You know, you're it's just alittle too much.
That's mean.
So the the this next slide thatwe have pulled up, um, how we
can do these things.
It's an it's an honest no BSself-assessment,
self-assessment.
I tell people that in the in therecruit classes.
Um, I tell officers that.
I tell officers that want to becontrol tactics instructors that

(01:21:01):
um there are things that youcannot change about our agency,
about the law, about thecommunity you serve.
There are things that you canchange, and if they're
changeable by you and you shouldchange them, go for it.
Okay.
And learning that humility isgreater than your cred, okay.
If if you think about it, if youreally break it down in that
prefrontal cortex and usinglogical thought, the person that

(01:21:25):
you are interacting with thathas just insulted you or just
called you the worst name in thebook, or said something about
your wife, or whatever, whateverit was that sparked that
emotional response.
What are literally themathematical odds of that person
being able to complete that?
If if they're there, then takethat appropriate step,
terroristic threat, whatever.

(01:21:45):
Okay.
Right.
Re-retaliation, whatever it,whatever it comes up.
But if it's not, what does ithurt?

SPEAKER_06 (01:21:51):
Let it go.

SPEAKER_01 (01:21:51):
Okay.
And and that's one of the thingsthat I use a lot working these
off-duties is for example, um,security is ask the guy to
leave.
I don't ask anybody to leave.
That's their job.
I back them up if it starts tobreach the peace.

SPEAKER_10 (01:22:04):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (01:22:05):
So they're walking them out, they want to argue,
they want to sp say their piece.
Their id is they want to explainwhy, why I did this, why, why,
you know, they they need allthis, why.
So one of the things I'll say isI can't hear you in here.
Let's go outside and we can talkas long as you need to talk to
understand what's going on.

SPEAKER_06 (01:22:22):
Yeah, and you're not exactly lying.

SPEAKER_01 (01:22:24):
Fucking loud in those bars.
Yeah, yeah.
But then once we're outside, didI just complete what we need
done?

SPEAKER_06 (01:22:30):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (01:22:31):
Yeah, the guy needed to leave.
So we got him out, okay, withwith no force needed.

SPEAKER_06 (01:22:34):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (01:22:35):
And then it's on me to just be okay with listening
to him and having to do it.

SPEAKER_06 (01:22:39):
And you weren't lying.
You actually go, and that'sanother thing.
So officers out there listening.
Don't lie.
Like, if you say you're gonna goout there to listen to them,
unless you plan on arrestingthem and you're just trying to
keep it like, you know, so youknow other people don't get
hurt, because cops can lie.
Uh, I do think there is a timeand a place, like, especially if
you try not to get anybody elsehurt, you don't want to escalate

(01:23:02):
the situation.
Um, there are times for it.
So I get that.
But if you aren't planning toarrest and you say, Yeah,
legitimately, I want it, justtell me your side.
If that will keep them calm forthe remainder, yeah, go outside
and listen to them.

SPEAKER_01 (01:23:15):
And 90% of the time I've I've found that that's all
they wanted.

SPEAKER_06 (01:23:18):
Yeah, they want to be heard.
Yeah, they just want to saytheir peace.
I'm with you.

SPEAKER_01 (01:23:22):
You have to be humble enough to listen.
You can't you can't be the guywho says, No, I already told you
you're leaving, it's time to go.

SPEAKER_06 (01:23:27):
Right.

SPEAKER_01 (01:23:27):
You set your heels, they're gonna set their heels.

SPEAKER_06 (01:23:29):
Because you get emotionally wrapped up into the
you're I'm the authority in yourperceived disrespect or your
need for respect.

SPEAKER_01 (01:23:40):
Yes.
That's id driven.

SPEAKER_06 (01:23:42):
Yes.
So I'm with you.
Um, Mr.
Bill Fold said, Um, this is whyI like these guys.
They are fighting a losingbattle, a losing fight, and that
is my whole life story.
Cops will never change.
Too many jurisdictions to policethemselves for any change to
happen.
Hope springs eternal.
Hope springs eternal.

(01:24:03):
I like that.
And and Mr.
Billfold, if there's one thingyou've learned about me, is that
I surround myself withlike-minded people as far as my
drive goes.
George is one of those.
Banning is one of those.
Um, so it yes, I'm going toannoy you with my optimism and
my positivity and my hope.
Sorry, brother.

(01:24:24):
Uh, it is what it is.
It what it isn't.

SPEAKER_01 (01:24:27):
Um, because anything other than that is just
surrender.

SPEAKER_06 (01:24:30):
Yeah.
And Marines don't surrender.
That's right.
Ooh, I got you, Mr.
Billfold.
Now you're in a conundrum.
Uh, let's go to this next video.
Let me uh share the screen here.
And guys, these videos areactually a part of the class.
So these aren't videos we justpulled up for y'all.

(01:24:53):
This is the right video,correct?

SPEAKER_07 (01:24:55):
Yes.

SPEAKER_06 (01:24:55):
Okay.
So we will play.

SPEAKER_13 (01:25:03):
You understand that?
I'm not speaking.
I got a I got a fucking dash camwith my GPS on it, buddy.
That's not illegal, buddy.

SPEAKER_11 (01:25:14):
This is correct.
It is not illegal to flip off acop.
However, this is what the copdoes now.

SPEAKER_13 (01:25:20):
It's not illegal.
You just committed a crime.
No, I do not get license toregistration.
I haven't committed no crime.
What's what's my crime?

SPEAKER_03 (01:25:28):
What's my crime, buddy?
What's my crime?

SPEAKER_13 (01:25:32):
Paste me, paste me, buddy.
Let me see your thing.
Let me see your guard.
Let me see your gun, buddy.
You paste me.
Get out of here.
Let me see your radar gun.
I'm not giving you registration.
You pulled me over unlawfully,sir.
Santos, number 620.
No, I'm not giving you advicefor registration.
Pull me over unlawfully, buddy.
Unlawful pullover.

SPEAKER_01 (01:25:53):
So uh I'm sure you guys have picked something
either this video or somethingvery similar in the past.
Okay, you've picked it apart,you've gone through it.
Clearly, both people in thisinteraction are emotional.

SPEAKER_09 (01:26:06):
Yes.

SPEAKER_01 (01:26:07):
So the officer has been fronted.
You pulled me over for noreason.
And the driver is clearlyemotional as well.
So going back to can we all usea little emotional regulation?
100%.
Okay, because could this beavoided by that driver having
some emotional regulation andsaying, you know what, officer,
if that's what you say, cool.
Here we go.
Here's this, here's this, here'sthis.

(01:26:28):
I'll see you in court.
Thank you very much.
Problem solved, right?
Or the officer says, you knowwhat?
You're you're right.
Um, I'm just gonna let you gowith a warning.
Or uh I would appreciate it ifyou didn't flip me off.
That was kind of disrespectful,or whatever.

SPEAKER_04 (01:26:42):
Right.

SPEAKER_01 (01:26:42):
But more open, better communication to solve
that on from both sides.
So the reason I I include thisvideo is because what it ends up
being is that this officer setshis heels on it being the way
it's going to be, and the driveris doing the same thing.
And the driver in this instanceis in the right.

(01:27:03):
You you it's not probable causeto pull someone over for
flipping them off.
Yeah, we've got that's a FirstAmendment protection.

SPEAKER_06 (01:27:08):
Yeah, there's actually a court case on that.
Um, I've pulled it up before,but I that's there's a Supreme
Court ruling that, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (01:27:17):
Specifically in traffic, yeah.
Yeah.
Side note to that,training-wise, I use that little
tactic in the recruit classes.

SPEAKER_10 (01:27:24):
Oh, you flip them off.

SPEAKER_01 (01:27:25):
So our recruits are they're they're dictated to
greet every person that they seein the hallways.
Good morning, sir, good morning,sir, good morning, ma'am, good
morning, ma'am.
And when they say that to me, Iflip them off.
And they laugh and they giggle,Officer Lopez, that's so funny.
Uh they one day we'll get youback.
But there's a subcontext tothat.
I'm doing that so that the nexttime they're out on some road

(01:27:47):
and some sketchy area and theydrive past some guy and he flips
them off, instead of them beingoffended, and they laugh.
They go, Oh, just like Lopezused to flip me off in the
academy.
And you know, if I can do thosesubtle little things, it it's a
little bit helpful.
At least that's that's mythinking.

SPEAKER_06 (01:28:02):
Uh Mr.
Bill Fold said, I never saidsurrender, I said we are
fighting a losing fight.
By all means, keep fighting, butdo not fool yourselves in things
and things will change.
Sorry, sir.
I disagree.
I think if I fix, or I say fix,that's a terrible way to say it.
If I have one officer that takessomething that we teach and they

(01:28:22):
take it out to the field and itmakes a difference to the people
they interact with, did I notmake a change?

SPEAKER_01 (01:28:30):
So, Mr.
Billfold, Billfold, both areemotional.
The driver has a right to be,the cop does not.
Okay.
It has nothing to do with theright to be emotional.
You are a human being, you'regoing to be emotional.
And that's that's the wholepoint of this.
It's it's not that I have aright to be emotional because I
have the authority.
I'm emotional because I'm ahuman being.
It's not that you have the rightto be emotional because you're

(01:28:51):
just happily driving on your wayand you're pulled over and
inconvenienced and taken awayfrom your primary task and
having to deal with an officerwho doesn't know what he's
talking about.
All of those inconveniences thatthat disrupt your day, that it
doesn't give you a right to beemotional.
You're going to be emotional.
The key is to learn how tonavigate that emotion before it
becomes a problem.

SPEAKER_07 (01:29:12):
Yeah.
Um, let me get to the nextvideo.
It goes video to video, back toback, right?
Yeah.

SPEAKER_10 (01:29:23):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 (01:29:23):
Okay, so let me stop sharing.

SPEAKER_06 (01:29:29):
This is the problem with not having an Alan in the
background.
There we go.
We got nobody in the backgroundtoday, guys.
It's just me.
Bannings bannings over therelooking disheveled.

unknown (01:29:41):
All right.

SPEAKER_01 (01:29:42):
I'm pretty sure this is a pretty popular video, too.
The guy pulled over themotorcycle riders.

SPEAKER_09 (01:29:47):
Okay.

SPEAKER_03 (01:29:48):
Well, there's always a reason, but I'm not going to
share it.
Okay.
Yeah.
I'm going to be on my way.
Have a good day.
You're going to stay here for asecond.
Are you detaining me?

SPEAKER_02 (01:29:55):
Yes.
In Hibbing, Minnesota, then ispolice sergeant Black Everett.
The sergeant has stopped RyanSwanson, who runs the YouTube
site, Good Citizen of the North.
Moments earlier, Swanson wasfilming government buildings on
public property.
You may have a very legitimatereason.

SPEAKER_03 (01:30:10):
Can you explain that to me?
Or you don't care to explain it.
Can I see your identification?
Have I broken a law?
I don't know, but people takethings very seriously when it
comes to uh public safety andmilitary safety.
And if you've been walkingaround the property
photographing things, I don'tthink it's unreasonable for me

(01:30:30):
to ask.

SPEAKER_02 (01:30:31):
It's not unreasonable for a police
officer to ask for an ID, but itis against the Constitution and
settled case law to demand an IDwithout reasonable articulable
suspicion of a crime.

SPEAKER_03 (01:30:42):
Now you asked me a few questions from my computer
and my name and batch number, Iwas more than willing to provide
that with you.
Which I believe you're requiredto do.
Yep.
I'm not.

SPEAKER_02 (01:30:52):
Well, if uh we have a reason to believe you may be
involved in criminal activity,you need a reasonable,
articulable suspicion that Ihave M or I'm about to commit a
crime to be able to detain you.

SPEAKER_03 (01:31:03):
What are you?
So what am I being detained for?
Identification purposes.

SPEAKER_06 (01:31:07):
In order to ID Which we already know with a lot of
the stuff that we've put out,that that is not a reason to ID.

SPEAKER_01 (01:31:15):
Yeah.
So the the reason I includevideos like this is that at the
recruit level, from what they'rehearing, they're just hearing
some, they're just hearing coptalk.
But what we're seeing is thatthis cop doesn't know what he's
talking about and he's trying tomake it fit.

SPEAKER_07 (01:31:31):
Right.

unknown (01:31:32):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (01:31:32):
Trying to double down, like you said.
Gotcha.
So when we talk about humility,and we talk about humility a
lot, we're talking about thequality of being free from pride
or arrogance.
Okay.
Humble doesn't mean you thinkless of yourself.
It's just that you think ofyourself less.
Um in the realm of publicservice, there is what we call

(01:31:53):
the priority of life, right?
In in exigent circumstances,critical incidents, all of those
things.
You've got hostages, innocentbystanders, first responders,
and then suspect subjects on thepriority of life that we are
tasked with defending as best wecan to keep safe, right?
So if you notice on thatpriority of life, we're number

(01:32:14):
three hostages and bystanders,then the public, then the first
responders.

SPEAKER_09 (01:32:19):
Right.

SPEAKER_01 (01:32:19):
So we have to have, I can't even call it a mindset.
I would call it, and this isjust you know, George being
George, call it a heart set.
Um I have to be okay with beingthe less important person in
that interaction because that'sthe only way I'm going to be
able to communicate to you whileyou're emotional, while you're

(01:32:41):
emotional, um, what needs to bedone in this interaction.
Is to and you like I saidbefore, you're never going to
completely um remove emotionsfrom human beings.
And someone said it's time forRobocops.
No emotions, no warnings, noexceptions, no discretion,
pre-programmed responses.
Um self-checkout.

(01:33:05):
Yeah.
Automated anything.
Yeah.
That's that's what you'll havewith police work.
And police work, um the humanelement, it's gonna you're gonna
lose something there.
Yeah.
Plus, how is a robot going totestify to reasonableness or
probable?

SPEAKER_10 (01:33:21):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (01:33:22):
It either is or it isn't.
And that that that might beproblematic.
It's a nice idea.

SPEAKER_07 (01:33:28):
Can you read that?

SPEAKER_01 (01:33:30):
Let's see.
Thoughts on humility?
Uh yeah.
Not inflating or reducing yourplace in the world, but fitting
into your place correctly.
Understanding that as the cop,you are the public servant.
The servant.
I am here to help you.
It could be that the reason I'mhere interacting with you is
because you've broken the lawand I am serving the public by
taking you out of that situationbriefly until a judge can

(01:33:54):
determine whether or not you areguilty or innocent.
I have no I have no say in yourguilt or innocence.
What I have is probable cause tobelieve that this has happened,
and it's time for me to make aseizure under Fourth Amendment
for it to be decided by a judge.

SPEAKER_07 (01:34:08):
Right.

SPEAKER_06 (01:34:09):
Mr.
Billfold said uh you guys havenever been wrongfully arrested
or beaten by cops, so you willnever understand why we are
tired of the untrained tyrantswith guns who ride rough shod
overshod.
Oh roughshod over our lives.
Yeah, you you're right.
It's a good horse term.
Yeah, roughshod.
You are going to have anexperience that we cannot relate

(01:34:30):
to.

SPEAKER_01 (01:34:31):
I can relate to being beat up by cops, though.

SPEAKER_07 (01:34:33):
So can you?
Oh shit.
Okinawa.
You got beat up by MPs?
Oh shit.

unknown (01:34:40):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (01:34:41):
Actually, it was the JPs.
We got past the MPs.
They were they were shortpatrol.

SPEAKER_06 (01:34:47):
Short patrol?
Sure.
Sure.
Oh, sure.
Yeah.
I would say, well, they'reprobably short too.

SPEAKER_01 (01:34:51):
Uh but as as far as wrongfully arrested, um, I I can
I can see where you're comingfrom with that.
There's there's there's plentyof examples.
Examples.
Yeah, there's plenty ofexamples.
I can't argue that point.

SPEAKER_06 (01:35:02):
Yeah, and and to sit back and and again, I would
never minimize your experience,Mr.
Billfold.
Um it's just we're we're we'retrying, brother.
We are trying.
Umle, Texas said, George isexactly right.
Um, Nat is actually our Facebookmod.
Oh, okay.

(01:35:23):
She's been kicking ass, takingnames.
So um very thankful for havingher a part of what we do.
We're trying to get her intowhat we're doing.
So I'll let you get into yourokay.

SPEAKER_01 (01:35:32):
So this is a new um acronym that I've I've
discovered.
There is a psychiatrist, Dr.
Mark Barrett, um, one R2Ts.
And he is part of Talent SmartEQ training.
So basically, he's put togetherthis quick little um acronym
that can be helpful inidentifying our ego problems or

(01:35:57):
our emotional responses.
And it's basically a ruler.
You want to be the ruler, if youcan think of it, be the ruler of
your emotions.
And what's critical to that isto recognize that you're having
an emotional response.
First and foremost, you have torecognize that what you are
talking, dealing with, um,articulating, explaining, you
are no longer in the realm oflogic and reason.

(01:36:19):
You are now feeling and tryingto explain your feelings, but
you're not doing it well enough.
You're trying to set your terms,you're trying to double down,
like you said.
So you've got to recognize whenthat's happening.
And then you need to understandwhat it is that you're feeling.
I'm angry, I'm upset.
And there's there's such aspectrum of feelings that we
could get into, but we we won'tfor the sake of brevity here.
But anger is not just across theboard always anger.

(01:36:41):
Would you say there's adifference between wrath and
frustration?

SPEAKER_10 (01:36:45):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (01:36:46):
Absolutely.
So there's a spectrum of anger,there's a spectrum of sadness,
there's a spectrum of love andjoy and all of those feelings
and emotions that are powerful.
So you need to be able tounderstand specifically what is
happening in your brain at thattime.
And then you can label it.
If you can put a word on it, youare now adding prefrontal cortex

(01:37:09):
reasoning to an emotion.
Okay.
So if you am I screaming, no, itwas me.

SPEAKER_06 (01:37:17):
I I typed out ruler to them so they knew what it
meant.
And I did an all caps thing.

SPEAKER_01 (01:37:21):
Okay.
Like you're yelling.
Yeah.
So when you if you can name it,you can tame it.
Do you know this person?
Elena?
That's my daughter, yeah.
Thank you so much, Knucklebutt.
Oh, that's Knucklebutt?
That's my knucklebutt.
I remember that.

SPEAKER_06 (01:37:34):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (01:37:35):
That's awesome.
So labeling the emotion helps usgo from feeling the emotion to
starting to think about theemotion.

SPEAKER_04 (01:37:41):
Okay.

SPEAKER_01 (01:37:42):
I can see your frustration.
We use this in de-escalation allthe time.
If I'm trying to de-escalateyou, I'm getting you to talk
about what you're feeling, andthen I'm giving it back to you.
I'm paraphrasing, I'm doing allthose active listening skills.
But we can do that withourselves, and we should do it
with them with ourselves.
I'm I'm really upset right now.
Why am I so pissed off?
Well, really, it's because of II think I think I messed up, and

(01:38:04):
now I'm scared because I'm gonnaget in trouble because this guy
knows the law better than I do.
So what do I do?
I have to start figuring outways to emotionally rein myself
in so that I can get it back.

SPEAKER_08 (01:38:15):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (01:38:15):
Okay.
And then expressing, not so muchfor us to as law enforcement to
be able to express our feelingsfor whatever situation we're in.
I I don't have to, I don't seeany great, great need or great
value in telling someone thatI'm interacting with, you know
what, the thing that you justtold me really hurts my
feelings.
Yeah.
That really makes me sad.

(01:38:36):
I don't I don't see any realvalue in that.
However, if I can acknowledgethat that's what I'm feeling,
that can help me process and getback to the thinking about it.
And then regulating the emotion.
Okay, we have uh there's apsychological therapy theory
called cognitive behaviortherapy.
And in there is this concept ofcognitive distortions.

(01:39:00):
So a cognitive distortion isliterally a wrong thought.
You you have said something andI have processed that
information incorrectly, and ithas induced an emotional
response on my part.

SPEAKER_10 (01:39:12):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (01:39:13):
So I have to be able to regulate what that cognitive
distortion is.
And that can either be throughmore communication with you,
right, by saying, Hey, clarifywhat you mean by that.

SPEAKER_06 (01:39:23):
Yeah, like if you were to say, like, I remember my
first time teaching shufflestep.
Right.
And I would be like, What thefuck do you mean by that?

SPEAKER_01 (01:39:29):
Right.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So you acknowledging that andyou having that response right
there shows me that you canregulate that emotion because at
the time you were probablyfeeling very embarrassed.

SPEAKER_06 (01:39:40):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (01:39:41):
You were probably like, crap, I'm stuck.
I don't know what to do.

SPEAKER_06 (01:39:44):
We should, we should probably tell that story.
Um, so I'm a new instructor.
Um, and I am I'm the new controltactics guy.
Um, and and George is my mybackup and uh my my
co-instructor.
And I have my first class thatis my class.
They don't just throw a class atyou.
You got to go through and belike an assistant for other

(01:40:06):
classes, and then you get yourown class.
And I step out onto the mats,and I am teaching the very first
move that we teach these guys ina fight, and it's just called
shuffle step.
And it's literally what itsounds like.
You just shuffle forward, youshuffle backwards, and uh I get
out to the mats, and I all thestuff I know, and I know what I

(01:40:27):
want to say, and I just brainfart and freeze up.
And I'm like, all right, guys,so today we're gonna go over
shuffle step.
And uh the thing about shufflestep, and I feel it coming over
me, and I'm like, ah fuck, Idon't know what I'm gonna say.
Um, so George is gonna come outhere and demonstrate shuffle
step for us.
And uh George, without missing abeat, jumps out there, okay,

(01:40:47):
guys.
Shuffle step.
We're gonna fight.
This is what we do, this is howit looks, da da da da.
And he he takes over like themastery is.
Now, we have such a good system,as long as it's being followed,
set up, um, that you are alwaysready to step in as the more
senior instructor, or um, evenyou don't even necessarily have
to be the more senior, justready just in case something
like that happens, because ithappens.

(01:41:08):
You don't want to losecredibility in front of
students.
They gotta trust that you knowwhat you're talking about, and
that when you don't, that you'reable to handle it in a way that
instills confidence.
I did not know how to teach thetechnique at the time.
I did know how to teach it.
I just I brain farted, I had abad move.

(01:41:29):
And so I asked George to stepin.
He steps in, he teaches it, andit became a joke.
What it was that was in 2016,2017, it's still a joke today.

SPEAKER_01 (01:41:39):
Yeah, well, no, it became a great teaching point
too for future instructors.
It did.
So it's it's not so much howit's not so how much you know,
it's how much can you transferto the student.
Yes.
So um let me go to the commentshere, real quick.
Okay.
Uh Twitchy skitch said Halt canhelp you identify your emotions,
hungry, angry, lonely, tired, orsad.
Identify it, and then you candeal with it.
That's great.

(01:41:59):
Yeah, it's a that's a greattool.
Hungry is usually and if you ifyou were taught that, if you
were taught that early on inyour career, you are you are
very blessed because a lot ofofficers don't get that kind of
insight.

SPEAKER_10 (01:42:11):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (01:42:12):
And uh Mr.
Billfold, uh bouncer and doormanat the worst dive strip club
outside Camp Lejeune, never letit get to you, wasn't paid
enough to react emotionally toassholes.
Uh that's a good hiring set.

SPEAKER_06 (01:42:25):
Yeah, I know we are hiring.
I wish I dude, bro, I it'd be sofun if he came out.
Um I I don't know his lifesituation per se.
Yeah.
Um, but yeah, guys like him, Iwould love to come out.

SPEAKER_01 (01:42:38):
Yeah, that's a character thing that you can't
teach, man.

SPEAKER_06 (01:42:40):
Yep, absolutely.
Um yeah, Twitchy Sketch saidHalt is a tool that can also
help uh stop depressing emotionsby identifying them so they can
be dealt with head on.
Yep.
Agreed.
Um, okay, let's go to our nextuh so yeah, when you guys hear
his joke about shuffle step, ifyou hear me and George joke
about that's that's where thatcame from.

(01:43:01):
Um, because I I was a snot-nosedinstructor, came out uh probably
uh I don't know if I was cocky,but I was excited to do it.
And uh you weren't cocky, and itjust kept George on his toes
every day, that's for sure.

SPEAKER_01 (01:43:16):
Uh okay, so so emotional intelligence, emotions
are a part of every everybody'slife experience.
Everyone is is experiencingemotions, they're processing
emotions, they're they're tryingto get their prefrontal cortex
to line up with emotions.
Everybody is going through it,okay.
Learning how to effectivelyregulate it and not suppress or

(01:43:36):
deny or ignore because that'sthat's a whole different set of
problems.
Um you're a Seinfeld guy.
Yes.
Serenity now.
Serenity now.
Insanity later.
Yeah, and that and that's allthat is, and that's a very
common theme in cop psychology.

SPEAKER_10 (01:43:51):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (01:43:52):
If you look at lots of cops, they are depressed,
they are um, they have addictionproblems, they have all the
problems across the spectrumthat every that every human
being goes through.
Okay, but you expect more fromcops, and that's part of it as
well, because we can't or we'renot supposed to.
And then when we do, we end upgetting in trouble for our

(01:44:14):
emotional outbursts and whatnot.

SPEAKER_10 (01:44:16):
Right.

SPEAKER_01 (01:44:16):
So that's that's part of it.
And you can't turn off emotion.
You you can't just not be angry.
I mean, really, the the bestproof anyone should need of this
is going back to the dishwasherscenario.
You've loaded the dishwasherwrong, and your wife gives you
this look, and you can tellshe's upset because she's told
you a hundred times that cups goin the top rack, not on the

(01:44:37):
bottom.
And you did it anyway, and youfeel disrespected.
So now you're feeling this flashof anger, and she's feeling this
flash of irritation becauseyou're doing it wrong again.
If you want her to turn off heremotion, just say the words calm
down.
Yeah, that works every time.
You can't turn off emotion.
Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 (01:44:56):
Okay.
Um, okay, let's go to the next.

unknown (01:45:05):
No?

SPEAKER_01 (01:45:05):
Oh, yeah.
Um, I'm sorry, I was reading uhMr.
Billfoot again.
Great, great interaction therewith that, and I appreciate
that.
Um going hands-on as a lastresort, you're absolutely right.
Uh, it should be that way.
And if more cops had actualhands-on experience before they
got a batch, yeah, I agree.
And that's not that's not atraining problem, that's a

(01:45:27):
hiring problem.

SPEAKER_06 (01:45:28):
A hiring, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (01:45:29):
What what where are we pooling our people from?
Yep.
Where are we recruiting from?

SPEAKER_06 (01:45:35):
And then you got to start looking at political
pressures on if if if you havepoor politics in your city,
recruitment's gonna be way down.
When recruitment goes way down,now you got a manpower issue and
recruitment standards go down.

SPEAKER_01 (01:45:48):
Yeah.
Because they got to fill in thefill in the bricks.
So what we have as as streetcops or even trainers, or
recruits, or citizens who havehad interactions with the cops
is a street level view or afloor-level view.
What people in the hiring arenaor the recruiting arena or the
management administration, theyhave a 35,000 foot view.

SPEAKER_10 (01:46:11):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (01:46:12):
So they see things in our department, in our
agency, and in the in the in theprofession that we simply don't.
And we see things that theysimply don't.
So trying to bridge the gap,this this is what this is about,
is trying to get that that kindof information out there.

SPEAKER_09 (01:46:27):
Gotcha.

SPEAKER_01 (01:46:28):
So we talk a little bit about self-discipline and
self-control and what thosethings mean.
Um, self-discipline is theability to suppress um instinct.
Uh, I want it and I'm strongenough to take it, so I'm gonna
take it.
So, but if you haveself-discipline, you can reason
with it's not right for me totake it just because I'm bigger
and stronger and I can take itfrom them.

(01:46:48):
Okay, that's that's an example.
Um it requires conscious effort.
You have to be able to stay inthat reasoning mind so that your
it doesn't take over.
Um, self-control is effortfulregulation of the self by the
self.
It's internal.
You you are the person incontrol of yourself.
And that's kind of a stoicmindset.
Um, some people think stoicsmeans stoicism means you you

(01:47:12):
just don't care about it.
It's it's more that you don'tinvest emotion into something
that you cannot change.

SPEAKER_07 (01:47:19):
Right.

SPEAKER_01 (01:47:19):
It's more of a uh you you you have no effect on
the environment, you can onlyaffect how you react to that
environment.

SPEAKER_06 (01:47:26):
And I it's something I actually raised my kids with
that I got from my Englishteacher in high school, um, Mr.
McBride, uh R.I.P.
Uh he taught us very early,concentrate on what you can
control.

SPEAKER_01 (01:47:39):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 (01:47:40):
And I was like, you know, at the time you you kind
of got it, but you didn't getit.
But as you aged and matured, Iunderstand what he meant.
Yeah.
And I think that goes into whatwe're talking about here.

SPEAKER_01 (01:47:50):
So we talk about the characteristics of
self-discipline, being able tostop an impulsive response, uh,
delaying gratification.
That's a big one.
Okay.
And that that leads us intoproblems as human beings, not
just in the use of force arenaor in law enforcement.
That that's a that's a bigproblem with um nationwide debt.

(01:48:11):
The average American family istens of thousands of dollars in
debt.
And it's because we've beenconditioned to not delay our
gratification.
Yeah, you saw my house.
Yeah, I'm in debt.
So you've got you've got you canhave it now.
60 months, 0% interest.
You can't afford that.
Seven-year loan, you'll be fine.
You can't afford that car.

(01:48:32):
Yeah.
You can't afford that car.
Yeah.
And you have to have the abilityto say, I can't afford that car.
I'm gonna live with the car thatI can't afford.
Yeah, and that's self-limiting.
And it doesn't, our id doesn'tlike that.

SPEAKER_10 (01:48:44):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 (01:48:45):
I I do think the truck loan that I have, I do
think it was like a six-yearloan.
I really do.
Uh don't get me wrong, we wepaid more on it than, but just
to get it, we were like, oh, wegotta.
So all right, I think we'regoing to uh video.
Yeah, sure.
I got the right one.

SPEAKER_08 (01:49:05):
Share.

SPEAKER_06 (01:49:06):
Is that the right one?
Yes.
So glad we came in early and putthese things in order.
We really put this together wellfor being the first time we've
ever done it.
It's going smooth.
So um I will rewind here and Mr.
Billfold.
I do remember line training.

SPEAKER_00 (01:49:29):
She's in cuffs?

SPEAKER_07 (01:49:31):
She is in cuffs.
She is.

SPEAKER_06 (01:49:48):
I don't speak Spanish, but I'm pretty sure she
just said, Did you get that oncamera?

SPEAKER_01 (01:49:52):
Right.
Yeah, he's and he's saying, uhI'm recording it, I'm recording
it.
So the the the the teachingpoint for the recruits on this
is that that officer has a veryquick emotional response.
There are three officers on thatarrested person.

SPEAKER_06 (01:50:04):
And she's incuffs.
And she's in handcuffs.
She's already cuffed.

SPEAKER_01 (01:50:07):
So and seated.
Yeah.
So what's the fucking rush?

SPEAKER_05 (01:50:10):
So that's a do not friggin' strike all day long.

SPEAKER_01 (01:50:15):
All day long.
Right.
So but what happens is is youcan you can really you have to
zoom in to see it, and it'sreally, it's really not that
important to the point, but shedoes try to kick him.
And I I I don't know where itlanded or if it hurt or
anything, but the fact that thathappened took him out of that
prefrontal cortex and straightinto that emotional response of

(01:50:35):
who do you think you are hittingme?
Right.
I'm the person in charge here,and I know I can strike in an
intermediate force response tosomeone who's striking me, and
the emotion takes over thereason.
Right.

SPEAKER_06 (01:50:47):
Instead of looking at that bigger picture.
Right.
Did it do any damage?
Is it something that I can getout of the way of?
Right.
Did I put myself in a bad spot?
Like what's more important?
Make her pay for hitting me ordon't get hit again.
Right.
Don't get hit again.
All right, put myself in a badspot.
Yeah.
You know, and and if you want todo a chintzy charge on something

(01:51:08):
that's on that's on you.
Uh it's not my style.
Right.
Um, because like I said at theend of the day, bad guys are
gonna do bad guy stuff, goodguys are gonna do good guy
stuff.
I I signed up for that.
I'm not going to to give you acharge on something that is just
a part of the business.
Right.
I I look at that as being a partof the business.

SPEAKER_01 (01:51:26):
But if we take it a step back, her kicking him is an
emotional response as well.
Absolutely.

SPEAKER_06 (01:51:32):
I don't I don't think that's in her behavior.

SPEAKER_01 (01:51:34):
So normally.
Normally she wouldn't.
Yeah.
Yep, exactly.

SPEAKER_05 (01:51:38):
Let me ask a question to both y'all.
Yes, sir.
Just in reference to thisemotional response.
And and and I think the three ofus combined and the amount of
people that we have trained inour prospective fields, uh and
I'm going into FTO training hereon this question.
When I started FTO training, Ialways wanted to know as soon as
possible what is going to be myemotional response from the from

(01:52:02):
the male or female young youngofficer that I have riding with
me.
And and where I got a lot ofthe, and I I could be wrong on
this, but this is where Banninggot a lot of answers, especially
out here working in the middleof friggin' nowhere.
Um, we would get dispatched to acall, and I want you to keep in
mind 80% of our roads out herethat in the middle of nowhere in

(01:52:22):
Jack County are are 70 to 75miles an hour.
And if you have somebody fallasleep or somebody's intoxicated
and they drift across and theycollide with oncoming traffic,
it's a very, very bad scene,just like it would be on any
highway.
But out here there's no nothingto protect you going across in
these country roads.

(01:52:43):
The emotional response ofsomebody that just came out of
the civilian world, went throughthe police academy, they may or
may not have had militarytraining.
And I would literally pauseeverything, make sure
everybody's safe on scene who'swho's still alive.
But look at the emotionalresponse of your recruit when
they look into a back seat andsee a child that's lifeless or

(01:53:05):
somebody that's been ejected.
Are you taking that in as an FTOto where you can use this as a
training scenario once the callis over with?
But what is their emotionalresponse during that?
I mean, that that's gonna takethem from zero to a hundred
pretty fast if they've got abeating heart in their chest.
And I used to use that to helpwith my training throughout

(01:53:28):
their phases, being the FTOcoordinator of watching where
they're going.
Because I don't know if y'allgot that when you when you went
to accidents with these youngmale and female recruits or
young officer cadets, whateveryou want to call them.
Um, but that was a hugeindicator to me on how they're
gonna swing on other calls.
Granted, it that's gonna makeanybody that's got a beaten

(01:53:49):
heart in their chest just goballistic inside.
But what is their external doingduring that investigation while
we're assisting what we'redoing?
I mean, what do you what areyour thoughts on that, George?

SPEAKER_01 (01:54:00):
Um, well, that's that's that's one of those
things that you just can'ttrain.
How do you how do you replicatethat in a scenario for someone
to experience in a safe sterileenvironment?
And and and it it's it'simpossible because there's
number one, that's that's that'shuman life, and you can't, we we
don't toy with that.
The the principal factor in anyof our training is always gonna

(01:54:22):
be uh safety of the recruit andthe trainee and the student and
the instructor and everyonearound.
So there's there's parametersthat you just can't violate to
get that realistic of ascenario.
So and that that plays in welluh with the the next slide here.
It's called a Jihari window, andit's a it's another tool for
self-assessment, really.
I'm gonna pull it up here.

(01:54:43):
So you have these four boxeshere.
It's gonna pull it up.
Let me share the window.
You have basically things thatyou know that other people know
about you, and you also havethings that um you know about
yourself that you don't letother people know.
That's your hidden area, youknow.
Um Eric likes anime.

(01:55:06):
I do.
So drag fuzzy, but not everybodyknows that.
So that's part of his hiddenarea.
And then there's things that youdon't know about yourself, but
that other people know aboutyou.
Okay.
Um think seventh grade, it'stime to start using deodorant.
Nobody nobody has a problem withrecognizing that you need
deodorant, but you probablydon't notice it.

(01:55:26):
So there's things about yourselfthat you don't know and things
that other people know.
Okay.
My wife says I snore, but Idon't know.
I've never woken myself up withsnoring.
And then there's that bigunknown spot, which is what
you're referring to, is um wedon't know something about
ourselves and other people don'tknow it about ourselves.
And that's frequently what comesup under high stress critical

(01:55:47):
incidents.
That's why we have training likeuh close quarter survival
training.
Because if you've neverexperienced being punched in the
face by a superior opponent inwhen you're in a fatigued
condition, you don't know howyou're gonna react.
You might run, you might fight,you might just curl up and give
up.
We need to, we need to be ableto know that.
So the I guess um what you'reasking me is my thoughts on that

(01:56:10):
is that it's you're you'reabsolutely right.
It is a factor, and we do needto see those things, but we
really don't have an opportunityto see them until it's a real
world experience with real worldconsequence.
And at that point, it becomes uhthe task of the FTO to
articulate whether or not thatperson is compatible with law
enforcement or not.
Gotcha.

(01:56:31):
Because you you can't replicatethose in training, and you can't
you can't um you can't go backand retrain that either.
I can't run them through a s uhsimulator scenario on something
like that and replicate theemotional content of it.

SPEAKER_08 (01:56:44):
Gotcha.
Did you cover this part here?
I did.
Okay.
Yeah.
Just trying to go through.
Oh, yeah, you went through allof these.
Yeah.
Look at you knowing your stuff.

SPEAKER_01 (01:56:53):
All right.
So a couple principles that youcan apply to this jihari window,
once you recognize things aboutyourself that others have
brought to your attention or umthat you are giving yourself a
self-assessment on, is beingopen and communicative.
You can you can increase thesize of the open area.
You can tell people aboutthings.
You can be it's it's okay totell people, you know what, I'm

(01:57:14):
not really that good in jujitsu.
And I don't like jujitsu thatmuch.
I like judo.
I like Sambo.
Something about the tactical manhugs?
Something about the intimacy ofjujitsu.
A little too much.

SPEAKER_06 (01:57:26):
Well, I may have uh created George's fear.
You ruined it for me.
Yeah, whispering in his earwhile I got him wrapped up like
taste the rainbow.

SPEAKER_01 (01:57:34):
And he doesn't like it.
But that that kind of opennessis always going to be good for
our communication in anyrelationship, not just police
interaction.

SPEAKER_06 (01:57:44):
Um so we got some we got some comments going on here.
Let me uh Mr.
Billfold said, I am too old tobe a cop, Eric.
I would come out there and workwith your folks.
At least y'all have standards.
A B uh A1B2C386 said OfficerLopez is easily one of the most
badass officers on thedepartment.

(01:58:04):
I like it.
Appreciate it.
I agree.
There's George is one of myfavorite cops.
Out of my top, he's in my topten cops ever.
Um, so out of a department often.
Uh yeah.
Uh and then Brand R86 said, Doespolice training have a form of
the Kobayashi Maru?
I love that he went with a StarTrek reference.

SPEAKER_01 (01:58:24):
You know what?
I don't know the details of theKobayashi Maru, but I know that
it's an supposed to be anunwinnable situation to
determine your character.

SPEAKER_06 (01:58:31):
Yes.
Uh to face fear or to toacknowledge the fear and still
push through.
Um if I remember what uh JamesT.
Kirk's father did.

SPEAKER_01 (01:58:41):
Well, he he cheated to win.
And no, you're not supposed tobe able to win.
Correct.
I like it.
It's it's supposed to gauge yourreaction to something being
unwinnable.

SPEAKER_06 (01:58:50):
Right.
Brandar, that is a I actuallyreally like that question.
I think that's a very fun and umdifferent question than I've
ever heard.
Could you kind of give more tothat?
Because I would love to hashthat out a little bit more.
I think that's a very that's aninteresting thing.
I wonder what I want, I want toknow what your thoughts are on
that.
I want to go deeper into thatquestion, sir.

(01:59:10):
Um, but let's go into theprinciples here.

SPEAKER_01 (01:59:12):
So the second principle is to seek out and
incorporate correction.
Okay, I do this as aninstructor.
Uh, I've not just been teachingcontrol tactics and physical
training, but just uh all of thespectrum.
I mean, legislative updates, uhinteracting with uh hard of
hearing, ego stuff, knife stuff,uh all kinds of stuff.
And the the thing that we haveum as part of our training is an

(01:59:37):
evaluation at the end of theclass.
And evals.
Yeah, and those can very easilybecome check the box.
You know, hey, I need an evalfrom you guys so that you can
get credit for the class andcheck, check, check, check, and
a NA NA, whatever.
So I make it very specificallyclear and I I I pretty much beg
for input from especially therecruits, because the recruits

(01:59:59):
are in a in a they're in a asegue.
We're taking someone from beinga civilian and rewiring their
initial instinctive response toleave conflict and go towards
conflict.
And that's a hard thing torewire.
Um, so their their perspectiveon how I'm presenting material
to help them make that leap isvery important to how I present

(02:00:22):
it and to how I train.
So seeking out and and takingcorrection is a big thing, and
that's a humility thing.
Yes.
You have to be okay withsomebody saying, you know what,
that class sucks.
Yep.
That class was boring.
I way too many videos.
Yep, you got too scientific,whatever.
But that class is gonna be lessmessed up as the next one

(02:00:45):
because I'm gonna take what youjust told me and I'm gonna make
the next class better.

SPEAKER_06 (02:00:48):
Right.
But that takes you as being theperson that doesn't get
emotionally invested into aproduct that you put a lot of
time and effort in.
Right.
That's hard to do.
Um, I'll give you, and this isjust me um laying laying my
business out there.
Um, I'm a I'm still what I wouldconsider a baby sergeant in the
grand scheme of of where we'reat at our police department.

(02:01:10):
And I'm now on a specializedunit and I'm surrounded by
champs, you know, Camacho, uh,Watkins, uh Joe Ship.
Um, you know, my Joe Ship's outof my class.
And and one of my um mylieutenant just retired or is
about to retire.
He's done.
He just got to turn his stuffin.
But Ward, you know, been aroundforever.
Um Alan East is now mylieutenant.

(02:01:32):
So I am surrounded by justwell-seasoned, conditioned,
specialized unit pros.
I'm not there.
And I am, you know, I get tothis unit.
I am so used to thriving.
Get to control tactics, I knowhow to do control tactics.
Uh get to teaching.
I have no problem teaching.
I love to teach.
I'm I got an educational, youknow, mindset.

(02:01:54):
I get to a specialized unit.
You know, I was I did patrol.
You saw me out in patrol.
I was out on foot every day.
I loved what I did.
I was thriving, teaching youngminds, you know, young rookie
officers.
Loved it.
I get to a specialized unit andI am a moron.
I'm an idiot.
There's so many things I don'tknow, and I'm frustrating my

(02:02:15):
co-sargents because I'm I'mcausing them more work and to
the point where they had to pullme in the office.
Yeah.
Imagine that.

unknown (02:02:25):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 (02:02:26):
And I ate it like a champ, dude.
And I try to tell people, I'mlike, and I I saw the look in
their eyes, they felt so awfulthat they had to have this
conversation, but they knew itwas necessary to help me grow.

SPEAKER_04 (02:02:38):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 (02:02:38):
And I looked at all of them and I probably used a
little emotional intelligence.
I said, guys, don't feel bad.
I was like, I love this.
I love that you care enoughabout me to help me mold and
become a better sergeant.
I am going to take what give mea chance to prove I'm going to
take what you're saying to.
And I'm gonna fix it.
Right.
Um, but don't feel bad about it.

SPEAKER_01 (02:02:59):
It's great.
That's that's some that's somehigh level emotional
intelligence you got goingthere.

SPEAKER_06 (02:03:03):
Right.
And so and I I I I want peopleto realize that even at uh
there's no point that that ends.
It's you're gonna have tocontinue to do this.
Yeah.
Even at the sergeant level, evenat the lieutenant level.
Like there's no you never get tothe point where you're like, I
got it solved, I got it alldown.

SPEAKER_01 (02:03:17):
And it's a good place to be because you're
you're you're always learning.
Yes.
And you're you're keeping yourmind sharp.
For me, that that's that's partof it.

SPEAKER_06 (02:03:24):
I I even called uh because um Marine, uh not
Marine, but um Mr.
Billfold is uh I've had him onthe show a couple of times.
He started out as like um kindof against the grain, didn't
really care for what we weredoing.
Um we started to kind of win himover to the point where I got
him on the show.
He actually debated Von Kleem.
Wow.
Yeah, yeah, live on the air.

(02:03:44):
Like it's crazy.
So, but I've called him up andbeen like, I told him about this
exact situation where I'm like,I'm just fucking up at work,
dude.
I'm just having a rough go.
Like it, it it wasn't so muchthat I was upset with them.
I wasn't upset with them at all.
I was upset with myself.
I'm like, God, like I'm not usedto sucking.

SPEAKER_01 (02:04:03):
Yeah, so there's there's there's a verse,
scriptural verse, it says ironsharpens iron.
Iron sharpens iron.
So that and that's a greatmetaphor, but you've again
prefrontal cortexes.
When iron is sharpening iron,it's it's a violent process.
It's an aggressive,uncomfortable process.
One of the irons, one of the oneof the surfaces is stronger and

(02:04:24):
more refined than the other.
So what it's doing when itstrikes the other iron is it's
taking away the weak spots.
Yeah, it's it's it's shaving offthe parts that are not efficient
for that iron.

SPEAKER_10 (02:04:36):
Yep.

SPEAKER_01 (02:04:36):
And they're both affected.

SPEAKER_10 (02:04:38):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (02:04:39):
So iron sharpening iron is not it's not supposed to
be comfortable.

SPEAKER_10 (02:04:43):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (02:04:44):
Correction is correction is not criticism.
Correction is correction.

SPEAKER_10 (02:04:48):
Right.

SPEAKER_01 (02:04:48):
And that's and that's a big that's a big thing
that helps me with humility.
If somebody's correcting me,that's one thing.
If they're just criticizing,hey, I just take it and I move
along.
So there was a great comment onhere about autism.

SPEAKER_06 (02:04:59):
Um uh George, are you teaching on how to deal with
autism spectrum?

SPEAKER_01 (02:05:04):
Not specifically, but um, I'm trying to get myself
very well educated.
I have a family member who isautistic.
Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 (02:05:11):
My oldest daughter.

SPEAKER_01 (02:05:12):
And is very um, we we're running across that and
interacting with autisticpeople, yeah, adults as well, in
in law enforcement, and it's awhole different ballgame.

SPEAKER_06 (02:05:21):
It is I I showed a really good video.
Um, they're in like a Starbucksor something, and right away,
signs were there.
Yeah, and the cops sits down andthey end up manhandling him and
taking him out.

SPEAKER_01 (02:05:33):
I'm just like, come on, guys.
Yeah, like that's that's thosesigns.
There's a snake on the trailsign.
Don't don't emotionally investin this kid not understanding
what you're trying to get themto do.

SPEAKER_06 (02:05:44):
And to him, the kid, he just kept seeing stuck on
repeat.
He's like, I didn't do anythingwrong.
I didn't do anything wrong.
He didn't, they just wanted himgone.
Right.
It was a it was a big issue.
So um Brand R86 said, Umtraining seems to provide a pure
form of officer control to anyscenario.
This leads me to believe thatthey may not be taught that they
may be in a no-win scenariobecause their ego is in control.

(02:06:09):
I'm processing that.
Give me a second.
Okay.

SPEAKER_01 (02:06:14):
So Okay, he I think he follows it up.
Oh, I'm sorry.
If officers are taught theycould be in a no-win scenario,
it may help check their ego insituations.

SPEAKER_06 (02:06:22):
Or help us screen them.
That's actually a good fuckingidea.

SPEAKER_01 (02:06:24):
I don't, I don't, I don't disagree with that at all.

SPEAKER_06 (02:06:27):
I like that.

SPEAKER_01 (02:06:27):
The Kobayashi Maru test for hiring.
For hiring.
Yeah.
Instead of civil service.

SPEAKER_06 (02:06:33):
That's fucking brilliant.
I really like that, George.
You may be in a you're the onlyone in the position for ours.
Uh maybe you need to figuresomething out.
If we put him, okay, so let'slet's kind of brainstorm that
real quick.
If you put them in a situation,and banning, chime in too.
Um put them in a no-winsituation.
Or a perceived a perceivedno-win situation, um, where

(02:06:56):
really the probably the properanswer is just walk away.

unknown (02:06:59):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 (02:06:59):
Oh, this is a non-law enforcement issue.
And and you've got a upsetcomplainant that knows this is
wrong, this is morally illegal,and you've got a suspect that
knows their rights.

SPEAKER_01 (02:07:13):
Yeah.
Now they get those scenarios inscenario training patrol
procedures.
And and there are several thatthey have to come to the
conclusion of this is a civilmatter, and I have no authority
to do anything here.
True.
So they they learn theconsequences of making a bad
arrest.
Ah, gotcha.
But as far as sorting, charactersorting.

unknown (02:07:32):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 (02:07:32):
Um, and then he said, like some civilians may
know the law better than theofficer at the time during the
encounters.
I I won't lie.
I have had times where somebodyspouted off a law to me,
especially sovereign citizens,and they got me second guessed.
I'm like, what?
I haven't heard of that.
And then I'll be like, you knowwhat?
I'm gonna go check.
Let me check.
Again, that goes into experienceand stuff like that.

(02:07:55):
But I have found more oftentimesthan not dealing with the
sovereign citizens, like I gocheck out their stuff, and I'm
like, oh, this is not even athing.
Yeah, you're just making up someweird ass law.

SPEAKER_01 (02:08:06):
They're they're throwing it at them while the
season sticks.

SPEAKER_06 (02:08:09):
Um eye of the night, iron sharpening, iron takes down
those points to that standproud.
Stick up, whether flatteningdown or shaving off, much like
life, you either bring back intothe acceptable range or you
remove them.

SPEAKER_01 (02:08:23):
Absolutely.
I like that.
Pride's a problem.
Yep.

SPEAKER_06 (02:08:25):
Wade Lucero said, Mr.
B's in the zone.

SPEAKER_05 (02:08:29):
Throw up Mr.
Billfold's.

SPEAKER_06 (02:08:30):
Uh yeah, he said, I will fight with Eric and Banning
enough, though.
I see the ship as sinking.
I do not need the possibility ofa win to chew the same dirt and
fight next to the men I see asbrothers.
I like that.
God, he's such a good dude.

SPEAKER_01 (02:08:44):
Yeah, I like that.
Yeah.
I also like the expressionsomeone came up with says you
don't have to like somebody tolove them.

SPEAKER_06 (02:08:50):
Right.
Yeah, there's a uh um it's anold play um that they would show
in Flint quite a bit, butthere's this there's this
particular scene that I'veactually seen, like Denzel
Washington.
I've seen um James Earl Jonesplay this role where they're the
dad and uh they're talking totheir son, and the son's very
upset because it seems like thedad doesn't like them.

(02:09:12):
He's like, Oh, gotta like you.
He's like, food, clothing, aroof over your head.
He's like, he's like, if thatdoesn't show you that I love
you, you know, like that that'sthe point of the conversation.
Um great, great stuff.

SPEAKER_01 (02:09:27):
Okay, so let's uh so some more tools, uh, being
deliberate with yourself-awareness, being okay with
telling yourself I was emotionalabout that, um, doing a tactical
debrief by yourself, yeah, playit back.
You know, oh how to handle thatcall.
Yeah, when he said that to me,that's what that's when I
turned.
That's when I got pissed.

SPEAKER_06 (02:09:43):
Yeah.
Officers need to do.
I I recommend most calls, themajority of calls, you're never
gonna handle alone.
You shouldn't handle aloneunless you're a deputy out on
sticks, like banning was.
But either way, you can do it byyourself or you can do it with
the person you handle the callwith.
Go, all right, how'd that go?
Bro, you you got a littlewrapped up.

(02:10:04):
Yeah, like when they said this,I saw it trigger you.
Like, yeah, that's why I steppedin.

SPEAKER_01 (02:10:08):
Yep.

SPEAKER_06 (02:10:08):
Um, and that's something that we need to do
more often as cops.
Um, banning, how often, and thisis a an issue that I see quite
often, is you'll get a younger,much younger officer that's on a
call with a more senior guy, andyou'll see the more senior guy
maybe get a little wrapped up insomething, and the younger
officer won't say shit.

SPEAKER_05 (02:10:27):
And that's that's that's a huge problem across the
country.
I mean, we can we can pull thosevideos all day long.
However, I'm starting to see aswitch.
I started to see a switch when Iwas in.
I remember the first time Ipulled a sergeant out of a
doorway uh working in a largeragency down in the Metroplex of
what was going to happen to me.
But I knew that there was a linebeing crossed.

(02:10:47):
And I knew that I took an oath,and it's not to the sergeant
standing in the door thatfreaking signs off of my
timesheet, it's to the peoplethat were serving in that living
room that he was becomingunglued on.
And once I realized probablecause did not exist and we were
done, I had to suck that up,grab the back of that dude's
duty belt with the three stripeson, and pull him down and take

(02:11:11):
the consequences as they came.
Did not do anything in front ofthe public with him.
I'm like, sir, got it from here,meet you in your car in five.
And I just gave him a look thatI that I give people that they
understand that I'm serious.
And uh I finished thatconversation and we let them go.
They got his goat.
I've been a supervisor and I'vealmost had my goat hat, and I've

(02:11:33):
trained guys underneath me thatwere able to see that and call
me out on it.
You've got to be a man enough ifsomebody's got your goat, if
you've got a good good personthere and they let you know it
doesn't matter what the hell'son their sleeve or on their
collar.
Yep.
They're looking out for theinterest of the people that we
took an oath to, and that'swhere you need to check
yourself.

(02:11:54):
Yep.

SPEAKER_06 (02:11:54):
Period.

SPEAKER_05 (02:11:55):
But it's not happening too much.

SPEAKER_06 (02:11:57):
Got a good question by Gigi.
She said, um, is there anaddiction to being right in
policing today?
Uh yeah.
I and I don't even necessarilythink it's um to being right.
Uh something that George and Ican definitely talk about in
policing is that there's aculture of having you control
your scene.

(02:12:17):
Yeah.
That is something that we pushon them that I don't know that
we do a good enough job tounderstand between controlling
your scene and then oversteppinginto that emotional side of
being right.
And I think we're fine-tuningthat today.
We're trying to.

SPEAKER_01 (02:12:35):
Yeah.
And I think part of it is alsounderstanding that it's an
illusion of control.
Right.
And uh this chasing the rabbit,um, telling the recruits to
monitor the potential threatsand deal with the actual in
patrol procedures.
Uh, the example being you have auh a suspect that needs to be
arrested who could potentiallybe armed, but you have a loud

(02:12:56):
crowd in the background.
A lot of the recruits will focustheir attempts on controlling
the crowd.

SPEAKER_10 (02:13:01):
The crowd, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (02:13:02):
And what I'll tell them is that unless you bring in
horses, riot gear, outsideagencies, you're not gonna
control that crowd.

SPEAKER_06 (02:13:10):
You're outnumbered, you're outgunned, so to speak.

SPEAKER_01 (02:13:13):
So what you can do is monitor that potential as you
deal with the actual, becauseyou're you're not gonna have
control un unless there's forceinvolved.
And the goal is to I don't wantto use the word manipulate, but
um convince the the personyou're having the interaction

(02:13:35):
with that the logicalprogression of your interaction
should be this.

SPEAKER_10 (02:13:39):
Yep.

SPEAKER_01 (02:13:40):
And if you can if you can maintain your emotional
regulation and they can maintaintheir emotional regulation, you
can get there.

SPEAKER_06 (02:13:48):
Yeah, yep.
Um, agreed.
Let's uh we are we are prettyclose to getting through all
these, so I want to make sure weget through the rest.

SPEAKER_01 (02:13:56):
The the rest is just some tips, you know, things that
we all know.
Exercising, uh it teaches youdiscipline.
You're learning uh disciplinethrough consistency, practicing
when then visualization.
I used to be real big on if thishappens, then I'll do that.
But I don't want it to be if Iwant it to be when this happens
because it it's it's far moreprobable that the crazy thing

(02:14:17):
that you can imagine willactually help happen in your
career at some point.

SPEAKER_08 (02:14:21):
Yep.

SPEAKER_07 (02:14:26):
Anything on that?

SPEAKER_01 (02:14:29):
Um let's see, active listening.
That that yeah, we can chasethat later.

SPEAKER_09 (02:14:38):
Okay.

SPEAKER_01 (02:14:39):
In the thick of it, all right, breathing.
Um breathing is always going tohelp you think.
Yeah, okay.
A lot of what we do um in thetactical arena involves
regulating our breathing becauseit it puts us back into that
prefrontal cortex, tacticalbreathing, there's all kinds of
little tips and tricks, youknow, research them on your own.
Um, ensuring your personalsafety is a big one because

(02:15:00):
going back to that amygdala, ifyou can go back one screen.

SPEAKER_07 (02:15:03):
Oh, I'm sorry.

SPEAKER_01 (02:15:04):
So if you feel unsafe or there's something in
the back of your mind tellingyou you're not going to operate
rationally, your amygdala istaking over because it it's
picking up something that you'rerefusing to acknowledge.
So I came up with this littleformula distance plus cover
equals time.
So if you have distance andcover, you have time to think

(02:15:26):
about what you need to say,active listen, de-escalate, find
a better position, call inresources, all of those things.
And then the greater the timeyou have, the greater the
survivability of that event.
And the metaphor I use iscrossing the street.
If you go to cross the streetand you look and there is a car
15 feet away and you decide tomake that crossing, you do not

(02:15:47):
have enough distance to survivethat encounter.
But if you recognize the car ahundred feet away, now you've
just increased yoursurvivability.
So those little tips I I if youcan recognize the emotion before
it starts to take over, that'syour distance and time or
distance and cover.

SPEAKER_06 (02:16:03):
Yeah, the moment they make that mama joke, you're
like Right.
Okay, this is something thatgets me going.

SPEAKER_01 (02:16:08):
Yeah.
And then that old thing from uhthat old 80s movie um about the
bartender.
Roadhouse?
Roadhouse.
Uh when you say, what if he sayssomething about my mama?
What if he says my mama's ahorse?
Is she?
We know it.
Yeah.
So these these next internaldialogues, it's not personal.

(02:16:29):
Say that to yourself.
Yeah, that dude doesn't evenknow me.
It's all business.
He doesn't even know me.
And he's pissed off because I'mwalking him out of the bar.
Yep.
Don't, don't, they don't meanthat.
Don't take the bait.
And if you really get to whereyou're recognizing you're
starting to get hot, sayingthings to yourself like, is this
worth my career?

SPEAKER_10 (02:16:45):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (02:16:46):
Is it do I really care about this?

SPEAKER_10 (02:16:48):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (02:16:49):
And um one of the things that you can you can
start putting into your dailylife is just making that
internal dialogue inside yourown mind.
You're you're in line atAlbertson's and someone cuts in
front of you, or someone's rudeto someone, or someone starts,
you know, some kind of conflictwith someone else, and it's
verbal.
Okay, what does law enforcementwant to do?
We've got to step in.
That's a breach of the peace.

(02:17:09):
I've got authority here.
I'm gonna start, I'm gonna startcontrolling the situation.
Is it worth it?
Is the juice worth thesqueezing?
Is it juice worth the squeezing?
Is it worth me physically,potentially physically hurting
this person because they cut inline?
Right.
Yeah, and that's your picture.
And that's in that's in here.
That's a that's a heart set,mindset.

SPEAKER_06 (02:17:28):
Yep.
Um Wade Lucera said, you can'tchange cops stuck in a mode,
learn how to control them.
I will never be controlledagain.
Um it's not that I want tochange cops that are stuck, it's
that I want to help mold copsthat are learning and
emotionally open to learn.

(02:17:49):
So um, what do I wonder when areyou reading?
Uh something that rhymes withscreaming eagle shit.
Yes.
That's what he's saying.
Yeah, that's what you'rereading.
So I guys, you don't know this,but one of uh the terms that are
coined by the George Lopez isknock the screaming eagle shit
out of it.
Like that is his uh his motto.

SPEAKER_01 (02:18:10):
Yeah, I I brought that question up to the great
Eric Daigle at the Daigle LawSummit.
And I said specifically, I usethis phrasing, and my intent
behind it is to demonstrate theneed for um intent.
So if you think about it, uh thethe question was when you hit
somebody, if I'm gonna use aclose fist strike on someone to

(02:18:32):
distract their focus fromreaching for my gun or reaching
back into the car, whathappened?
Does it do me any good from alaw enforcement perspective to
attain my goal if that punchdoes nothing to change their
focus?
Right.
It's no good.
I hit him for nothing.
I didn't get anything.
There was no juice to thatsqueeze.
So I'm gonna squeeze.

(02:18:52):
Why would I squeeze an orangesoftly to try to get as much
juice out of it as I could?
I gotta squeeze that juice, thatorange hard to get the juice
out, right?
So to express that to recruitswho don't have any kind of
grounding on it, I say if you'regonna hit somebody, hit them
hard.

SPEAKER_07 (02:19:07):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (02:19:08):
I mean, you you you're going to go through the
exact same administrativeadministrative administrative
process for having hit themsoft.

SPEAKER_06 (02:19:16):
It's a use of force no matter what.

SPEAKER_01 (02:19:17):
It's a use of force no matter what the law, yeah.
So get what you need out of thethe purpose of that strike.
So I use the expressionscreaming eagle shit.
And when I brought that up toEric Daigle, uh, those of you
who know who Eric Daigle is, youknow who you, you know who he
is.
If you know, you know.
Um and he said the problem withthat is that you can't build
context in court.
They're gonna take what you sayas what you say.

(02:19:38):
So I have stopped saying that.
Uh don't say it that way.
What I do say now is if I'mgoing to strike someone with
whether it's the taser, baton,pepper spray, or a close fist
strike, I need to make it apurposeful, intentional um
strike that's effective to getwhat I need out of that

(02:20:01):
situation.
Yeah.
Somebody just brought up Mocostoo.

SPEAKER_06 (02:20:03):
I don't know what Mocos is.

SPEAKER_01 (02:20:05):
Mocos is boogers.
Ew.
You hit them so hard the boogerscome out.
Ew.
That's a boxing thing.

unknown (02:20:11):
Okay.

SPEAKER_01 (02:20:12):
All right.
All right.
Let's go.
Okay.
Um so the the rest of it is justa little more idealistic stuff.
Which cop do you want to be?
The the good examples of copsthat are listening and being
helpful and being kind andcompassionate.
Or the cop that's you know inyour face and and I'm right,
you're wrong, and that's the wayit's gonna be.
And me personally, I want to Iwant to be the cop that people

(02:20:33):
walk away from and say, it's acool cop.
Yeah, and and I've had thathappen.
I mean, I've had uses of forcewhen I was out in patrol, and on
the way to jail, that thatarrested person is saying, you
know what, I I appreciate thatit went the way that it did
because I was in the wrong.

SPEAKER_10 (02:20:48):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (02:20:48):
And I said, Those are always and they're
eye-opening, they're eye-openingbecause I'm still rattled.
I'm still like, I had to useforce, my adrenal is still up,
my emotions are still high.
But here, this dude is a littlemore emotionally intelligent
than me, and that that's helpingme.
Yeah, and that's a good thing,that's a good interaction,
right?
Yep.
Um, not using force doesn't makeyou weak.

(02:21:10):
You're not a chump for being agood talker.
It's not a bad thing to to havea silver tongue.

SPEAKER_10 (02:21:16):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (02:21:16):
Okay, it's always better to talk someone into the
handcuffs than to force them.
Um, and using force doesn't makeyou look tough.
There are cops out there whowant other cops to think that
they're badasses.
So they will they will useforce.
Yeah.
Okay.
And you have nothing to prove.
Okay.
You have nothing to prove toanybody.

SPEAKER_06 (02:21:34):
One of the one of the funniest things that my guys
told me when I worked over inour area, um, you know, here I
am this big jujitsu background,you know, uh had a rep for
screwing recruits up and in intraining and all that stuff.
And I go work in one of the mosthands-on uh controlling

(02:21:55):
environments that are out there.
It's an entertainment district,and that's where George works,
his bar stuff.
And um I kept getting from my myofficers, I thought I thought
you knew something, Sarge.
I thought you knew something.
And I'm never having to use itbecause I'm talking to people.
I'm I'm working it out so Idon't have to.

SPEAKER_04 (02:22:14):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 (02:22:15):
And it's the thing that I try to show them.
I'm like, I know how to use itso well that I know when I need
to use it.
Yep.
And if I'm not using it, I don'tneed to.
You will never see me use itbecause I don't mean to.
I'm not trying to force to showyou what I know.

SPEAKER_01 (02:22:31):
I don't need to show you.
Yeah, and and if anyone is thatinvested on whether or not I'm
capable or not, we can hit themats.
Yes.
If you really need to know, wecan do that.
Yeah.
But you know, don't don't ask meto show you how badass I am on
this guy who's just having a badday.
Yes.
After being walked out of thebar.
That doesn't prove anything.

SPEAKER_06 (02:22:48):
No.
And I tell them, I'm like, ifyou go in having the mindset
that I've got front row ticketsto the greatest show on earth,
and all of this is just personalentertainment, that is how I
like to do policing.
That and that's why I was alwayson foot.
I'm having conversations withpeople.
I'm laughing and watching.
People like, don't you getannoyed with drunks?
Not at all.
Don't bother me at all.
They're fun to watch.
Yeah.

(02:23:08):
Because it's entertaining.
Because I look at everything aspersonal entertainment.
And when I do that, I have agood mindset into any situation.
If it could be life or death tothem, to me, I'm jovial about
it.
I'm having fun.

SPEAKER_01 (02:23:23):
Well, the way I look at it, especially out in that
entertainment district, is thatperson who's being a jackass
right now, who's calling meevery name in the book, is doing
all he came out thinking he wasjust gonna have a good time and
have a couple drinks.
Yep.
And and watch the game.
Or hang out with his friends.
He did not want to be out hereto do this.
Yep.
And if I can keep that inperspective, it helps me, it
helps me keep him human in mymind, which helps me stay human

(02:23:45):
in mind.
Yes.
In mind.
I agree.
So there's a question on here.
Um AB2C386.

SPEAKER_07 (02:23:52):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (02:23:52):
How do I turn off the cop mentality when I'm home?
I'm trying to be intentional athome, but I feel like I eat,
breathe, and sleep cop life.
Okay.
I'm gonna teach you something,or I'm gonna explain something
to you that is um it's a it'shard fought wisdom.
Sean said, find a hobby.
Yeah, 100%.
Yeah, it's not wrong.

(02:24:14):
I'm gonna tell you the the theno BS zone.
We have entered Officer Lopez noBS zone.
Okay.
This job will forget about youthe day you retire.
Tomorrow.
Yeah, the day you retire.
You are gone.
Okay.
And you will carry this job toyour to your dying day.
So you have to be the one todecide.

(02:24:35):
You have to you have tointernally decide.
I am not just a cop.
Yeah a cop is what I do.

SPEAKER_07 (02:24:42):
It's not who I am.

SPEAKER_01 (02:24:43):
I'm I'm a husband, I'm a father, I'm I'm a dad, a
friend, uh a mentor, whatever.
Anything.
Find hobbies, exercise, all ofthose things.
But you've you've got tounderstand that this is just the
job, and it will it will eat youup.
It will if you if you stay inthat cop mentality.
So um my only advice in apractical sense, it find some

(02:25:05):
friends that are not cops.
Hang out with people that haveno concept of being a cop and
are okay with talking aboutsomething other than what was
the craziest thing you've seenas a cop.
Yes.
Because that's just gonna hookyou right in.
Triggered.
Okay.

SPEAKER_10 (02:25:18):
Yep.

SPEAKER_01 (02:25:19):
Um, and you know, church, hobbies, exercise,
martial arts, all those things,any kind of hobby.

SPEAKER_06 (02:25:26):
Yeah.
I one of the things that Irecommend to people is find if
you were to lose your jobtomorrow, what interests you?
If you were to lose your jobtomorrow, figure out what
interests you.
Um, I had no idea that what I'mdoing now interested me.
I I just wanted to know that Icould still continue to help

(02:25:46):
people if I were to lose thisjob.
And that's how I developed whatI'm doing now.
Yes, it is related to the job,but it's a different way to
help.
Um, so that's that's kind of howI look at that.
Um, looking in the in the chats,I just want to point out uh San
Joaquin Valley Transparencies inthe house.
He said, Hey guys.

(02:26:07):
Um, so if you guys didn't checkout that last uh live stream
that we had, we had him on here.
He's uh one of the OG FirstAmendment auditors.
Okay, um, it was a greatepisode.
Um a lot of a lot of cool peoplethere.
Bearded Tim finally joining inhere.
Um, very cool.
But um guys, I want we're notdone yet, but I do want to make

(02:26:28):
it a point.
The class is over.
We went through the wholecourse.
Please, please, I know for afact I'm not here to change the
civilian mindset about policing.
That's not that wasn't ourpoint.
My point being, I want to showyou that cops are out here
trying to fix issues we see.
George created this class.

(02:26:48):
He saw an issue.
One of the ways he saw the issueis through our show.
So in doing that, what we aredoing is working in a way.
I I look, it may not be thescale that you were hoping for,
but it's working to the pointwhere he changed it, created a
class, and now it is uh for oneof the 12 largest departments in

(02:27:09):
the nation, and it is pushingout to recruits every time they
go through.
And I'm hoping that you guys,anytime you see what you may
consider an ego issue at adepartment, just send them to
this episode because it's goingto be on our YouTube channel now
forever.
And they just got the same exactclass, minus showing all the

(02:27:29):
slides.
Right.
I feel like you got a moreinteractive, yeah, friendly
conversation that I think peoplewill be more accepted or
susceptible to indoctrinating inwhat they do.
So I'm hoping that that thatworks out for you guys.
Um A1Bs2 said, uh, thank youguys.
One of the best podcasts outthere.
Oh I appreciate that.

(02:27:50):
Um Sebulus Maximus, uh, which isone of the funnest names ever.
He said, Welcome back.
He said, I'm back.

SPEAKER_01 (02:27:57):
Um it needs to be sent to departments everywhere.

SPEAKER_06 (02:28:00):
Yep.
Freedom Keys.
Uh free's another one that's uhfair regular on here.
Um, but uh thank you, Sean.
I'll hit up my local BJJ Gym.
Hell yeah.
Uh love my tactical ground hugs.

SPEAKER_01 (02:28:13):
Boxing.
Boxing.

SPEAKER_06 (02:28:15):
Boxing.

SPEAKER_01 (02:28:15):
I think I've been nothing humbles you faster than
getting punched in the mouth.

SPEAKER_06 (02:28:19):
That's true.
That is true.

SPEAKER_05 (02:28:21):
Guns and hoses for one year.
Boy, that humbled the shit outof me.

SPEAKER_06 (02:28:24):
So there's there's two things that um George and I
can really speak to when itcomes to recruit training is um
the guys that go, well, once Isee red, like you get a lot of
recruits that just they thinkthat they can they can best
somebody because they're justgonna rage out.
Well, that doesn't work.
Um, and we have plenty of shit.

(02:28:46):
We got one guy that was a MarineCorps boxer, could have been a
pro boxer.
Um, we've got black belt injujitsu, we've got judo
practitioners, all sorts ofthings.
But we make you do athree-minute round on the ground
so you see just how vulnerableyou are on your back um or face
down or what however we want toput you.
Um, and then uh we put you inthe ring for what's the round?

SPEAKER_01 (02:29:10):
It's a it's about a three-minute round.

SPEAKER_06 (02:29:11):
A three-minute round.

SPEAKER_01 (02:29:12):
It really does depend on how much that recruit
gets after it.

SPEAKER_06 (02:29:16):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (02:29:16):
Because if they're just running and ducking, that
it'll be a longer experience.

SPEAKER_06 (02:29:20):
Yeah, it it will be a long day for you if you choose
kind of the uh if you thinkyou're going to get out of it.
It's not that I think they'rebeing cowards, it's not that I
think they I just think theythink they can survive it, and
that's not what we're trying tosee.
We're trying to see thatmentality to push forward in the
face of danger.

SPEAKER_01 (02:29:36):
We're looking at the character, character Kobayashi
Maru.

SPEAKER_06 (02:29:38):
It is the Kobayashi Maru.
Yeah, you're definitely goingthrough that shit.

SPEAKER_01 (02:29:42):
Mr.
Billfold, I appreciate thekickboxing training.
I'm a Muay Thai guy.
Love it.

SPEAKER_06 (02:29:47):
Yeah, Muay Thai is yeah, that's some the shit.
Um actually, George and one ofour other friends, uh his
academy mate, Buck Wheeler,they're the ones that changed my
mind on boxing.
And then I got really intoboxing for quite a while.
And um, I haven't admittedly hitthe bag in a little over a year.
Uh I need to get back to it, butyou know how it is.
You go in stents of things andyeah, but you're you're making

(02:30:10):
that big money now.

SPEAKER_01 (02:30:11):
Yeah.
Sergeant money, yeah.
That's true.
I am sitting sitting back there.
I'm in the drop.
I'm just coasting.

SPEAKER_06 (02:30:19):
True.
That's true.
Yeah, George can be, he canleave anytime he wants, guys.
Um Sean uh said, yeah, heknocked me out standing up in
the academy, the marine boxer.
Yeah, Eric Canales.
I know exactly who he's talkingabout.
Um, he could have been a proboxer, y'all.

SPEAKER_01 (02:30:35):
Easily, easily, easily, and we have a couple of
pro boxers too, and and quite afew pro card holding MMA
fighters.

SPEAKER_06 (02:30:43):
The hardest I ever been hit by anybody in my life
was a little 145-pound uh towns.
And I was in a red man suit,y'all.
He hit me so damn hard.
I had to, I was like, I'm donefor the day.
Like he rung my bell through athick ass padded helmet.
Just fucked me up.

(02:31:04):
Um, 145 pounds.
I was probably 180 at the time.
Um I'm probably 195 right now,but yeah, I was I was not a
small dude.
But um, Mr.
Billfold, what was that, Benny?

SPEAKER_05 (02:31:17):
That's my calf.
But go ahead.

SPEAKER_06 (02:31:19):
Um, Mr.
Billfold said, I'm 6'2 with a72-inch reach.
I was always getting beat downby the tall, long guys, but I
can eat a punch like Pac-Man.

SPEAKER_01 (02:31:30):
Oh shit.
Well, a wise man once said, it'snot how hard you can hit, it's
how hard you can get hit andjust keep moving forward.

SPEAKER_07 (02:31:38):
Yep.

SPEAKER_06 (02:31:39):
Love it.
Um, George, do you got any?
I mean, we still got time.
I don't know how much time yougot, but is there anything you
want to just that last littleline here that I put on the
slide.

SPEAKER_01 (02:31:49):
Humility and self-control are superpowers.
Okay, everyone is wrapped up onI I've got to look tough.
I want to look like the badass.
I want to look like I'm incontrol of the situation.
I want my peers to admire me andto respect me.
But being that calm, cool,still, unrattled a bull guy in

(02:32:10):
the craziest situations, that'sthe that's the guy.

SPEAKER_10 (02:32:13):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (02:32:14):
Look, look for the guy who's being quiet and
assessing and figuring thingsout and doing things in a way
that truly benefit the purposethat you're there.

SPEAKER_10 (02:32:23):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (02:32:24):
Okay.
Whatever whatever the calldetails are, whatever it is.
Am I really working towardssolving that problem and not
investing time, effort, or forceinto satisfying my id.
I like that.

SPEAKER_07 (02:32:39):
Thanks.
I like that.

SPEAKER_06 (02:32:41):
Um somebody said Buck Wheeler knocked the
screaming eagle shit out of me.
Tasted blood all day in class.
Mr.
Billfold said, I like George.
I can sense good energy.
I see why y'all's department isso.
Squared away compared to therest of Texas.

SPEAKER_01 (02:32:57):
That's probably the best compliment I could have
gotten.

SPEAKER_06 (02:33:00):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (02:33:00):
Ever.
Yeah.
I really appreciate that.

SPEAKER_06 (02:33:02):
Yeah.
Brand R86 said famous words.
I didn't know how many it wouldtake to kick my ass, but I knew
how many they were going to use.
Get George on Joe Rogan.
Fuck it.
Hey, fuckers, I want to be onJoe Rogan too.
He's the whole reason I starteda podcast.
No, you're right.

(02:33:23):
Honestly, one of the things thatI would like to do, y'all, is
have George more implementedwhen we start getting some of
these training shows that wewant to do.
Because you guys know it's morethan just the podcast.
We've got other things.
We're doing a tech and ordershow with through the DTV stuff.
We're trying to talk about thelatest and greatest technologies
that are out there.
I want to talk about the latestand greatest training and stuff

(02:33:44):
like that and how to break downtraining.
So a guy like George could lookat a class and be like, all
right, I see some gaps here.
Like we're not addressing this.
Or there's some really goodstuff here.
We could we could, you know,push this part out.

SPEAKER_01 (02:33:58):
Or we're over-addressing this.
Yeah.
I mean, there's also thisconcept of majoring on the
minors.
Yes.
Which is um over specificity.
Yeah.
Getting into it.

SPEAKER_06 (02:34:07):
Too many, getting a big bite of steak rather than
having small sips of soup.
Yeah.
You want to talk about that whenwe're okay.

SPEAKER_01 (02:34:14):
So you you might just as a side note before we
chase any more rabbits, um, weI've kind of restructured a
little bit how we do the CTtraining.

SPEAKER_08 (02:34:23):
Okay.

SPEAKER_01 (02:34:24):
Because they they were taking some time that they
needed to move around for Bpoxstuff and whatnot.
And um, so they've asked us totrim down how we train in CT.
And I had been looking at it foryears on how we train.
We train in a very basic martialarts format.
Drill, drill, drill, drill, youknow, armbar, armbar, arm bar,
whatever.
Yeah.

(02:34:44):
So to me, what I equated that tois okay, today, this week, we're
gonna learn how to ride a bike.
Okay, Monday, I'm gonna teachyou how to pedal.
Tuesday, I'm gonna teach you howto steer.
Wednesday, I'm gonna teach youhow to hit the brakes.
Thursday, I'm gonna let youpractice going downhill as fast
as you can because you've gotall the elements of bike riding,
just put them together.
Right.

(02:35:04):
And that that's not that's notright, yeah.
That's like giving somebody ascattered piece of puzzle pieces
without showing them the pictureat the end that it's supposed to
look like.
That would take forever.
Okay.
So what we're doing now isinstead of replicating an arm
bar takedown or a strike or thisor that, we're we're replicating
arrest events, like a totallycompliant person.

(02:35:27):
How would that look?
Looks like this.
And then you rep out that miniscenario.

SPEAKER_10 (02:35:31):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (02:35:31):
So they're getting basically of red man one, two,
three every day.
Ah and over.

SPEAKER_06 (02:35:38):
Getting more reps with stuff that they're going to
actually apply.

SPEAKER_01 (02:35:41):
With a complete scenario that ends in a
handcuffed position and thatperson articulating everything.
And I've also implemented um,well, I that I put it in there.
I don't know if they do it onthe daily, but something that I
call the four C's to helpofficers.
Four C's is camera, communicate,contact, and control.

(02:36:01):
So first thing I want to do isturn on my camera, just make it
a habit.
Yeah.
I'm recording this interaction,everything is going on, and then
I'm communicating exactly whatneeds to happen.
You are under arrest, or you aredetained, or you are free to
leave at any time if you don'twant to talk to me.
Whatever, whatever my legalauthority is, I'm communicating
that right to the channel.
Educating as we go.

(02:36:22):
Right?
Yeah.
Yeah.
That's really what it is.

SPEAKER_06 (02:36:24):
You break it down, you're educating as you go.
And I think that's the best wayto do policing.

SPEAKER_01 (02:36:27):
And I'm articulating for my witness, this is this is
what's happening.
This person is being detainedfor this, or this person is free
to leave for this, or they'reunder arrest for this, whatever.
And then contact is you how muchforce is necessary force.
And there was a great example, aguy named Lon Bartell, he works
for Virtue now, but he's he'sone of the four science guys.

(02:36:49):
He had this great example aboutthe difference between necessary
force and appropriate force.
Okay, how much force does ittake to lift this can off this
table?
Specifically, you you don't knowuntil you go to lift it because
it could be full, it could beempty.
It could be full, it could beempty, it could be nailed to the
table.
There could be all kinds ofvariables that require more

(02:37:11):
force.
Right.
So you don't know how much forceis necessary until you get there
and understand the level ofresistance you're getting.
So the way Bob Sutherland wouldput it, yeah, he would say,
Sometimes you just got to grabsomebody and see what happens.
Because that person might be alltalk, and you grab a hold of
them and then they're compliant.

SPEAKER_06 (02:37:30):
Completely compliant.

SPEAKER_01 (02:37:31):
And now it's time for your emotional regulation to
step in and say, Okay, this iswhat I've got.

SPEAKER_06 (02:37:35):
I don't care what you say, I care what you're
doing.
That's what I try to tell peopleall the time.
I don't care what you say.

SPEAKER_01 (02:37:40):
So humility and self-control are superpowers for
cops.
I like it.

SPEAKER_06 (02:37:44):
Um, Mr.
Billfold said, here's a bettercompliment, George.
You and Eric actually make mefeel like your area is safe to
live and be free in.
We shall see how your new chiefworks out.
Um Sean said, guys, it wasawesome getting to hang out a
little and receive someknowledge, but it's time to get
some rest.
Stay safe, brothers and sisters.

(02:38:04):
Appreciate it, brother.
Thank you, sir.
You you actually know who thatis.
Sean Slatlik.
We trained him.
We did.
Yep.
Air Force guy.
Yeah.
Um, I'm going back because I sawBrandar said, Um, famous words.
I didn't know how many it wouldtake to kick my oh wait, I
already read that part.

(02:38:25):
He said something else.
Freeman said, George, I reallyappreciate the really appreciate
the work you put into training.
I know it was a lot of work, butjust know we thank you.
Um, Brandar said, I was calledhere for service.
Give me your ID.
I need to know who I'm talkingwith because I don't know you.
And I I promise you, at theacademy where he's teaching, um,

(02:38:48):
we absolutely work over when andwhen you can't ID somebody.
Right.

SPEAKER_01 (02:38:53):
Um, we don't do that ask, tell, make stuff.

SPEAKER_06 (02:38:56):
No, no, it's not, uh, it's a little different.
Brand R86 drop five dollars.
Thank you, sir.
He said, Does the academy teachthe difference between a call
for service versus a violationof law?
Getting the ID for a non-crimeseems to be a standard.

SPEAKER_01 (02:39:11):
So uh we do teach.
And um the baseline for ourteaching on that is it it never
hurts to ask.
The way I say it is you can askanybody anything, but they can
tell you to fuck off.
And if they tell you to fuck offand you don't have authority,
off you must fuck.
Yep.

SPEAKER_06 (02:39:27):
Off you must fuck.
I like that.
Um, and I've told that to them,and a lot of people on here,
they're not a big fan of evenasking.
They they don't like that.

SPEAKER_05 (02:39:37):
Well, this is the problem across the the globe and
what we're seeing.
And ever since I've joined Ericon this podcast, I'm even seeing
it more with the videos that arebeing provided to me.
But dispatch sending yousomewhere does not give you
legal reason.
Right.
Yeah, that is a big one.
We see it all the time.
You you, as the licensed peaceofficer by your state, when you

(02:39:57):
get on scene, you are the onethat determines if I have a
legal reason to be here or not.
And if you don't, vominose.
Get the fuck out of town, man.

SPEAKER_06 (02:40:06):
I think that's one of the big things that we're
missing in training, is and I'mnot saying with us, because I
know we train it, but whenofficers get into the scene,
they want to handle the details.
They don't want to handle theoffense.
Do I have an offense?
That's all I'm thinking of whenI arrive on scene.
If I'm getting a call, we'll usea First Amendment order because

(02:40:26):
it seems to be the most popularone lately.
Is do I have an offense?
Okay.
How do I figure out if I got anoffense?
I can sit back and observe theperson that is alleged to be my
suspect.
All right, I don't see anoffense.
Let me get a hold of mycomplainant.
What did you see?
Well, I saw him out therefilming people at the bank.
Where was he at?
Was he on the sidewalk the wholetime?
Yeah, he was out there on thesidewalk.

(02:40:47):
Did he ever come out of theproperty?
Did he ever go inside?
No, he didn't.
Okay.
I'm working through to see ifthere's a crime here that even
they're not aware of.
Okay.
Well, ma'am, you're not umeverything that you're telling
me, he is legally allowed to do.
Now it's education time.
Um, I know that it seemed likeit's an invasion of privacy.
I can understand why you mayfeel that way.
Nobody wants their personalinformation and stuff like that

(02:41:09):
maybe taken.
I was like, but that's thatsecurity in public is on you.
It's not on that person.
So they are allowed to film,they're allowed to do that
stuff.
I don't ever have to makecontact with them.
I don't have to make contactwith the auditor if I do things
the right way.
Unless they're able toarticulate something that I'm
like, I need to investigate thatpart.
They said that he went insidethat car.

(02:41:30):
Okay, let me go talk to him.
Hey, bro, they said you wentinside that car.
Were you out here filming allyour stuff?
Yeah, I was out filming.
Okay, I I know how the FirstAmendment thing works.
Um, if if you don't mind, youdon't have to show me because I
don't have a legal right to it.
But if you don't mind showing meuh your video, just to she said
you went inside that car.
No, I went outside and I filmedeverything from the outside.
Do you mind showing that to me?
Yeah, cool.
Awesome.

(02:41:50):
All right, that's all I need tosee.
And if he tells me fuck off, I'mlike, all right.
You can't force it.
I can't.
You can't make him.
No.
I was like, all right, well, letme annotate what both sides told
me, and and that's it.

SPEAKER_01 (02:42:01):
Yeah, that's part of the illusion of control.

SPEAKER_06 (02:42:02):
Yeah.
Because I I need to have anoffense.
If I don't have an offense, andmost, I would say 99% of the
time when you go to that personand be like, all right, are you
willing to sign as a swornwitness statement?
You're like, no.
Yeah.
They're like, no, I'm not doingthat.
So um I do want to give a shoutout.
Marine Blood is reminding me.
Uh, hey, are you guys uh a copthat wants to do better?

(02:42:24):
You want to be a betterdetective, you want to do all
that stuff, and you can't affordto have more cops, check out
paragraphine.io.
Uh, I promise you, if you gettheir program, you will improve
your policing.
So uh shout out to them.
Shout out to Ghost PatchCustoms.
Let me show my my flex badge,yeah.
Uh uh Banning's showing his aswell.

(02:42:46):
It looks metal.
I know it looks metal, but it isnot.
It's actually bendable, and uh,you can put it right on your
police vest.
Um, so or or whatever.
You don't have to be a cop toget that stuff, guys.
So ghostpatchcustoms.com.
Um, but yeah, I'm going over touh Brandar said it seems
officers automatically thinkbecause they are there, an
offense has already occurred,get the details.

(02:43:08):
Um yeah, I agree.
I I that in the problem videosthat we see, I agree.
Do I think that that's themajority of police work?
No.
I mean, we uh George can back meup on this.
We see you're only seeing uh afraction of the calls.
There's I mean, just in our cityalone, there's like one or two
million calls a year.

(02:43:29):
Yep.
So if that was the majority, thethe outrage the public would
have would just be so sooutlandish.
I because I I just can't see it.
Um, but is there a problem?
Yeah.
Uh everybody wants you to get inDiscord, but I don't know what
that is.
So Discord is basically like umI had to learn to it.
It's like uh you remember oldAOL when you had chat rooms?

(02:43:53):
Yeah, like it's kind of likethat.
Okay.
A little bit.
Um, we have a sp a spot inthere.
I can actually show it to you.
Is do you want me in there soyou can beat me up?
Or or are there really freecrayons?
Uh so um I'm actually pulling itup right now for him, y'all.
Um wherever it went.

SPEAKER_08 (02:44:16):
Uh verifying Discord.

SPEAKER_06 (02:44:19):
Where the hell is it?

SPEAKER_08 (02:44:21):
There it goes.

SPEAKER_06 (02:44:22):
Checking for updates.
I'm gonna show them the Discord,but basically, George, I have an
ask a cop question or ask a copchannel in there.
Okay.
So they probably would love ifyou could chime in on that
portion.

SPEAKER_01 (02:44:34):
Um is this like an app that I download?

SPEAKER_06 (02:44:38):
Uh yeah, you can it's an app you can have on your
phone.
You can have uh on here.
So here's our channel.
So when I click on the channel,here's all the like sub channels
of it.
Um so here's our general chat,for instance.
So I click on that, that's whatwe're looking at, and this is
all the stuff everybody'stalking about at the time.
Um, you can go over to memes andfun things, and this is what

(02:45:01):
everybody's looking at andputting in there.
Um, but here's like the ask acop question spot.
So this would be a good spot.
You come in, you can chat aboutthat.
We can actually give you yourown link as well, where it's you
know, George Lopez.
And then people canspecifically, so you see over
here you got Eric, Banning, MattThornton, you got all these uh

(02:45:22):
other cops and stuff that arepart of the show.
And you could literally just beyou'd have your own thing and
chime in from time to time.
So um I might do that.
Yeah.
Well, guys, we have been goingfor two minutes, two hours and
45 minutes.
So we are going to end this.
Um, but uh I appreciateeverybody, George.

(02:45:43):
I really appreciate you takingthe time to come on here.
I think this was great.
Um, everybody else, thank youfor supporting the page tonight.
Um, supporting the live stream.
Thank you for the donations.
We appreciate that.
If you couldn't do itmonetarily, we really just want
your likes, follows, andsubscribes because that really
shows us that we're doing theright thing and you like what
we're doing.
Um, and everybody else, uh Mr.

(02:46:03):
Bill Fold said, How did you takethis long to get George on here,
Eric?
We've been we've been talkingabout it for years, have we not?

SPEAKER_01 (02:46:11):
Yeah, since he started it.

SPEAKER_06 (02:46:12):
Yeah, we've been talking.
It's just a matter of gettingGeorge to get comfortable enough
to come on here.

SPEAKER_01 (02:46:16):
Not so much that.
Hey, I'm a busy guy, man.

SPEAKER_06 (02:46:19):
You're not busy.
You're a grandpa.
Grandpa aren't busy.
Uh Wade Lucero said, Discord ismore formal.
You can cuss Eric and keepYouTube clean.
I like it.
But all right, everybody, BannyKeys, you're welcome.
Banning, you got anything uh toend on?

SPEAKER_05 (02:46:37):
I appreciate everybody tuning in tonight.
Thank you, George, very much forblessing us with your presence,
brother.
Absolutely, man.
Really appreciate it.
Since the uh first day I metyou.
I texted Eric.
I'm like, hey, I met this dude,and he had nothing but uh good
things to say, and I can I canecho that 100%.
Thanks.
I appreciate that.

SPEAKER_01 (02:46:53):
All right, brother.
Yeah, any closing thoughts?
Um if you're a cop and you'rewatching this, humility.
Humility.
Check your egos, watch youremotions.
I mean, be safe, but at the sametime, remember you you it's your
job to be a cop.
It's not who you are.
You know, be a human being.

(02:47:14):
I like it.

SPEAKER_06 (02:47:15):
All right, guys.
Everybody, have a good night.

SPEAKER_01 (02:47:17):
Take it easy.

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