June 9, 2025 • 47 mins
While the Tramp is away, Elle will play! Buckle in for an all girls episode.
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Episode Transcript
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Elle (00:05):
Welcome back to Unapologetic Swingers.
I'm Al, and today we have a veryspecial episode.
While Tramp is away, L willplay.
Tramp is off having his own sexyadventures in Mexico.
And I snag the equipment and I'mgoing rogue.
And actually the funny story is,we already recorded this, but we
didn't hit the record button, sowe're gonna do it again.
(00:27):
Welcome to episode 21.
The All Girls Show.
I have brought together two ofmy favorite women, and we have a
list of questions to discuss toget the female opinion about the
lifestyle.
What I have noticed over theyears is that there's no cookie
cutter way to explore thelifestyle.
Everyone's story is differentand everyone's story is just
right for them.
(00:47):
We can have open conversationslike we can't have with most of
our vanilla friends, and we cantalk about the sexy stuff, the
deep stuff, and ask questions ofeach other to help with our
journeys, and that's what we aredoing here today.
So with no further ado, I wouldlike to introduce Nikki and
Polly and can you please take amoment to introduce yourself and
give a short description of howyou got into the lifestyle and
(01:09):
what you're looking for.
Nikki (01:11):
Hi everyone.
I'm Nikki and I have been in thelifestyle probably about two
years now with my currentpartner.
I was in the lifestyle with myex.
And it was more of a trying tosave the marriage equation of
trying to get into thelifestyle, trying to spice a
marriage up that was basicallynot repairable anymore.
(01:35):
And so it's been a journeybecause like I said at the
beginning, I was with my ex, hewas very, scholarly about it.
I would say it was a lot ofreading books a lot of podcasts
or, other, information likegoing to a club or trying to
absorb it all.
And I'm more of a.
(01:56):
Does it feel right?
Is this fun?
Which way are we gonna go?
I just wanna mm-hmm.
Let me just experiment.
Let me see where, I don't wannawhere it goes.
Don't go to school.
No, exactly.
And it, it all has to be fun,but I guess everybody has their
own way of, how do you feelcomfortable?
How do you get started?
For me, it was we were thenjointly on an app called Field.
Mm-hmm.
And, I then started playing morealone as a unicorn, and it was
(02:21):
really trying to figure out whatare my likes and dislikes and do
I like a threesome?
Do I like a one-on-one?
Is it, other items that youlike, kink or whatever?
And then when that stopped, andI met my current partner, we
were talking about thelifestyle, and he was in it with
his ex, but he was in it as afull swinger.
(02:44):
So really only couples andpretty much, foursome.
And that was about it.
So then when we got together andwe ventured into it together it
was kind of an interesting startbecause like I said, I was
always used to, it's my owndecision.
Right.
I'm the only one who goesforward with something and now
you are a team and also you'retrying to get a foursome going,
(03:05):
which is by itself, as we allknow, super hard.
Elle (03:08):
Yeah.
A challenge.
Nikki (03:09):
So that is one thing also that I guess, you really learn
how to do as a team and you haveto talk about and what do you
like, what don't you like?
So I would say that is sort ofthe way how I got into the
lifestyle.
Okay.
Polly (03:24):
Hi, I'm Polly.
My swinging lifestyle storystarted a long time ago.
I was in my early twenties withmy first husband and he tried to
get us into the lifestylebecause he wanted to watch other
guys fuck me.
I was young and doe-eyed andmadly in love with him and
(03:45):
didn't understand what he wastrying to achieve, so it did not
work out.
The marriage did not work outeither.
Funny yeah, sometimes thathappens.
Flash forward, 30 somethingyears, and my current husband
and I were actually on vacationin Mexico and he had taken a nap
and came down to the pool andfound me in the hot tub with two
lesbians.
And he is like, what the hell'sgoing on?
Elle (04:06):
Oh,
Polly (04:06):
and it started being a joke where I think you're a
little bit bi when you drink.
And
Elle (04:14):
maybe not just when you drink, but Okay.
Polly (04:16):
Sat on that for a couple of years and once all the kids
left, I finally said to him,well, I think I might be a
little bit bi when I don'tdrink.
And he said, okay, well what doyou wanna do about that?
And I was like, well, I'm a 50something year old woman living
in the suburbs.
I'm not sure what to do aboutthat.
So I got online, started doingsome research, found a couple of
websites.
(04:36):
Some were way out there andstumbled upon Scarlet Ranch and
said, let's go check it out.
And we walked in on kink night.
It was our very first time wewalked in.
Oh yeah.
Walked in to see a woman ChAARIhanging from a, a hook in the
ceiling.
And we looked at each other,we're like, what did we just do?
Mm-hmm.
(04:57):
But we took it slow.
We kept going.
We went our first Sunday fun dayand I was like, I can lay out in
the sun naked.
And I looked at him and I'mlike, I found my happy place.
These are my people.
And that was the beginning ofthat story.
Elle (05:13):
Nice, nice.
So what are your play styles?
I mean, I know you guys haveevolved in, in.
Where you're at.
But is it full swap side byside?
Is it just women?
What is it that you like to do?
Yes.
(05:34):
Good answer.
Polly (05:36):
We got into it because I'm
Elle (05:38):
interested in women.
Polly (05:38):
Yes.
So that's how it started for us,was for me to be able to explore
that side of me.
And from there, as most peoplein the lifestyle know there
aren't a whole lot of unicornsout there.
And so we became friends withseveral couples and it started
off, our first experience was aside by side.
Mm-hmm.
And then we moved into more of asoft swap and then we moved into
(06:02):
a full swap in the same room.
And then we decided to try afull swap in separate rooms.
And it's just kind of all been amixture since then.
A little bit of this, a littlebit of that.
Nikki (06:16):
Interesting.
So we, from the start, were fullswap.
Mm-hmm.
And it was more, I think both ofus are very sexual people.
So we never really had anyqualms about you can't do this,
or you have to start slow.
I would say it depends more onthe other couple.
Right.
The, the people you meet, do yougel with them?
And then it's kinda like, whatdo you normally do?
(06:38):
So we've had wonderfulexperiences with parallel play.
We've beautiful experiences withSoft Swap, and then also on the
other side with full swaps andems and just women or, other
things.
So I would say we don't havelike a.
A slow agenda that we, went fromone point and, and just slowly
(06:59):
went down the road.
It was really more situational.
How does the other, partner orcouple react to us and how does
that happen organically as we'rethere either at an event or at a
club
Polly (07:12):
I love a mor,
Nikki (07:14):
I love a mor too.
It's, it's actually are
Polly (07:16):
fun.
Nikki (07:16):
So for me, I've only done two.
Okay.
So far, one was not that muchfun because we were with three
couples and the one couple had ababysitter and they had to go
home at one point.
So it was really like, okay, yougot 20 minutes.
You got 20 minutes, and now wego here.
You have 20 minutes, and oh myGod, we gotta go home.
Elle (07:38):
That's a little too structured.
It was.
It was very structured.
Wors are not structured.
That's the whole beauty of them.
Exactly.
Nikki (07:46):
And so then more recently we did have a very unstructured
one and that was really nice.
And then one a couples had a bigduffle bag of.
Toys.
Mm-hmm.
Like spread our bars and otherthings and explore.
It was, it was really kindalike, yay, we signed up for the
right morum.
Elle (08:05):
I think my favorite part about the Morum is really just
the, everybody interacting andyou don't know who's doing.
Mm-hmm.
What, but it just is there'ssuch a connection with the other
people in the room.
And I really do like that.
I like the, kind of just beingin another world and not really
(08:25):
focused on what one person isdoing to you.
But
Nikki (08:27):
when you are talking about a mor, is it like you
start out with a finite group ofpeople, or is it like you are
somewhere and anybody can joinin and how does that work?
I guess because the only onesI've done is it's like a fixed
group, right?
That's what I've done, andthere's no peripheral people
that all of a sudden are thereand, oh, look, then Joey is now
(08:48):
jumping in.
Right?
So
Elle (08:50):
We've done.
They're very structured.
But we also have early on wewent to some house parties.
There was a couple that threwhouse parties.
It was called the Ravens Nest,and it was pretty monthly
mm-hmm.
That they were putting'em on.
And we would go to'em and reallya nice setup upstairs.
Food and drink, you know, youpay an$80 donation mm-hmm.
Or whatever to get in for acouple and there might be 50, 60
(09:13):
people there.
I mean, it was pretty big.
And then downstairs is all theplay area.
So, you still have that elementof, I need to be okay with who
it is.
Mm-hmm.
You need to ask, can I join you?
That kind of a thing.
And we didn't have any issueswith that at all.
Okay.
No, I take that back.
Jay and I were playing togetheron one of the beds, just the two
of us, and a guy that we weretalking to, him and his wife,
(09:36):
and we had met them a couple oftimes, came up and started
fondling my breasts withoutsaying anything.
And I was just like, well, thatwas not okay.
And later we saw him, he's like,I am so sorry.
'cause I think his wife saw himdo that.
And she's like, what are youdoing?
Like, you didn't even ask, just'cause you know somebody doesn't
mean you just mm-hmm.
(09:57):
Go join their tits.
Yeah.
You know?
And so it was like, okay, thatwas good.
And so it wasn't bad.
It was nice, you know,'causepeople are moving in different
rooms and they had a little BDSroom, B-D-B-D-S-M room with a
cross, and then they had a Sianin there and some other things.
And then, bigger playrooms whereeverybody was there.
(10:18):
But but I do like mm-hmm thesmaller groups where, you know,
the people, everybody'sattracted to each other off the
bat, you don't have to worryabout that.
Oh great.
I want him and him to touch meand her, and her and her, but
not him.
You know, that's a little moreawkward.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Polly (10:34):
Yeah.
The two times that we've hadthat experience, it was with a
set group of people, and it waspeople that we knew.
Mm-hmm.
Some of whom we had played withbefore, some of whom we had
flirted and kissed and made outwith before.
There was one couple that we hadnever met before, but we really
hit it off very quickly withthem.
And so it was just a, it was avery fun experience.
Elle (10:54):
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Okay.
Men versus women
Nikki (11:02):
interest.
Maybe elaborate a little bit onthat.
Elle (11:05):
How do you like to play with men and with, with women?
Nikki (11:12):
I guess it's with women it's way more sensual, I would
say.
It's much more kissing andstroking and holding and,
enjoying the voluptuous natureof mm-hmm.
Two female bodies together.
And the beauty of it.
Elle (11:27):
Yeah, the softness.
The softness, the soft lips.
Yes.
The tongue.
Yeah.
Nikki (11:31):
And I think just in general, women with each other,
it's much more soft.
Elle (11:36):
Mm-hmm.
Nikki (11:36):
Right.
Maybe one person might be alittle bit more dominant, but in
general it's much softer than ifyou have sex with a man.
Right.
But that said, I am into reallyrough sex.
Elle (11:49):
Well, I'm, I'm good.
If you talk, if you wanna tossme around, I'm good with that.
I don't wanna think, don't,don't need to ask me what I
want.
Just move me, you know?
Right.
But
Nikki (11:58):
like I said, so it's, it's funny.
So we're into choking andslapping and this and that,
which you'll probably never havewith women, I would presume.
At least I've never experiencedit.
I'm gonna Yeah.
I've never experienced it.
Yeah.
Yeah.
May maybe a playful slap, butthat's about as far as it goes.
Mm-hmm.
And the other funny thing is,what I have noticed for myself,
I am submissive to men, butdominant to women.
Elle (12:20):
Hmm.
Nikki (12:21):
So when I play with a woman, I'm the one, the
aggressor.
Assertive, well, assertive.
Also, I'm taller normally.
So it's just kind of that,natural, yeah.
Dominant part.
And then with men, it's exactlythe other way around, and I love
it.
I love both.
I mm-hmm.
My partner always says, well,yeah, you love women, but you
can't do it without a dick.
Which is totally, absolutelytrue.
(12:42):
Completely.
Polly (12:44):
Absolutely.
I'm never given that up 100.
Exactly.
So,
Nikki (12:47):
but like I said, it's just very interesting how
different for me the experienceis, and I love both.
Mm-hmm.
Polly (12:54):
I would agree.
I think that with a woman, it'sa much more.
Sensual, tender, gentle, soft,slow stroking, slow touching.
Mm-hmm.
Experience.
And with a man, I do like to bemanhandled.
Mm-hmm.
A little bit.
Right.
I'm a very, in my normal life,I'm a pretty type, a aggressive
(13:15):
go-getter, control freak, planeverything out in my life.
And when I'm in bed, I don'twanna do that.
Mm-hmm.
I don't wanna think about it.
Right.
And so that's one of the thingsthat I like about being with.
Bigger men mm-hmm.
In particular is because I feellike they can just pick me up
and they can just throw mearound and they can do what
they, and I'm just like, bringit, you're a tiny
Elle (13:34):
little spinner anyway.
I mean, I could pick you up andthrow you around.
Oh, I need to see that.
But I get what you mean.
Us being taller.
I'm like in between the two ofyou.
Mm-hmm.
I like somebody who's.
Taller than me.
Who's bigger.
Bigger.
Yeah.
I don't wanna feel like I'mbigger than the guy Absolutely
ever.
And I love that, strong arming,move me around, flip me around.
(13:58):
Mm-hmm.
Do this, do that.
You know, now I'll tell you thismuch.
Don't tell me what to do.
Don't order me to do something.
Is we have also found that.
I am a horrible slave.
So we, we were playing withanother couple and a single guy
and we're kind of done.
And when I'm done, I'm tappedout and I just like, I'll sit
(14:20):
and watch and I'm perfectlyhappy.
And the single guy's sittingthere and he goes, L, suck my
dick.
And I looked at him, I went.
No.
And he looks at me and he says,worst slave ever.
And I'm like, yeah, it soundsabout right.
Polly (14:37):
Yes.
I don't like to be told what todo, but I have to tell you that
there have been a few times whenI've been bed with my husband
and he's like, get on yourfucking knee.
So I'm like, yes, sir.
Right away.
Right away.
Jay
Elle (14:49):
has figured out if he says, you know, I'd really like
it if you'd go over and givePauly a kiss, you know?
I'm more apt to saying, oh,okay, I'll go do that for you.
Mm-hmm.
Whereas go kiss Polly.
Yeah, fuck you.
Polly (15:05):
You know?
Well, you can come kiss Pollyanytime you want.
Elle (15:07):
Oh, good to know.
Okay, so one of the otherquestions I had too was
formatted.
Sexual play or organic, likehaving dates and going out to
dinner and, going through awhole process or just meeting
someone in, in an organic way.
(15:28):
What do you prefer?
Nikki (15:29):
I think we were talking about it before.
It depends where you are,
Elle (15:32):
right?
Nikki (15:33):
If you are around town in your own city or whatever, we
normally like to have drinks ordinner or.
And have more of a structuredapproach, see if it fits, see if
it's a foursome or not.
So we normally don't play on thefirst date.
Mm-hmm.
Always exceptions of course.
I mean, let's be honest.
Yeah.
But I don't wanna wait.
(15:55):
But, normally that's theapproach, right?
We, we'll set a day for drinksand blah, blah, and then have a
follow-up date.
But while we're outta town or onvacation at a resort on a
cruise.
Vacation mode comes on.
And I think it's also becauseyou have so much more time to
connect with people.
'cause you're mm-hmm.
At the gym together, you seepeople at breakfast, you are at
(16:15):
the pool.
You're talking to people in thehot tub and you just have so
many more opportunities toconnect that it almost negates
the fact of that you need tostructure it.
Elle (16:23):
Yeah.
Yeah.
I agree.
Well, and, and like when you'reon vacation, you're not thinking
about, oh, I gotta get you up inthe morning and go to work, or
oh, I have all this laundry todo, or, oh, I gotta take the
kids somewhere.
I mean, that's not us anymore,but, there's a lot of people
where that's a big thing where Ihave to get home for babysitter,
so that's a time constraint welove vacation LI don't.
(16:47):
Overthink things.
I don't put too much head on it.
Well, okay, well hopefully I'll,if you ask nicely.
But it's, I don't get in my headas much and I'm able to just
relax and let it be.
Nikki (17:03):
I also feel it's, it is a formula of will you see these
people again?
Or not exactly, like if it's inyour own backyard.
I wanna be a little bit moreSure, sure.
Because you will see'em again ifyou have a club nearby or house
parties or wherever you play.
And honestly, if you are at aresort or somewhere else, I
mean, you might see him again.
Mm-hmm.
But, but then again, you alsomight never see him again at
(17:26):
all.
Also it has a different playstyle.
Mm-hmm.
Or brings with it a differentplay style.
Polly (17:29):
We generally are a little bit more like at home, like you
are mm-hmm.
Where we wanna meet people, wewanna get to know them.
We have a couple that we hookedup with on the first date and we
see them.
It, it was not a goodexperience.
Okay.
For, I don't think any of us andwe see them regularly.
At the club, and it has beenvery, very awkward since then.
(17:51):
Like the husband can't even makeeye contact
Nikki (17:54):
with you.
Oh, you're kidding.
Oh, no.
So
Polly (17:55):
I, I finally, and it is funny because this experience
has helped to establish our twobiggest ground rules, which is
we don't play on the first dateand we don't play with You're
drunk.
Because, oh yes.
They were so drunk that, I mean,it was just, it was a horrible
experience all the way around.
And so I finally, after likefour or five months after this
guy not being able to make eyecontact with me, the club, I
(18:16):
walked up to him, I'm like,dude, it was awkward.
It wasn't good for any of us.
You don't have to make it weird.
Elle (18:23):
Nice.
Good for you.
Come on.
Polly (18:26):
We're
Elle (18:26):
all adults here.
Yes, we're still gonna exist inthe same room.
Exactly.
But you bring up a really goodpoint and we talk about it a
lot.
Alcohol mm-hmm.
Is a huge turnoff for us.
I mean, I don't, you know, havea drink or two or whatever, but
when people get to the pointwhere they're sloppy drunk for
us, that is questionableconsent.
That is, yes.
(18:47):
Questionable consent.
That is, are they really eventhere?
Are they gonna second guess it?
Are they gonna come back thenext morning and go, I really
didn't wanna do that, and thenit's our fault?
And we're like, no, no, wedon't.
We don't even wanna play that.
But also they're just sloppy.
They were very sloppy and that'snot fun or sexy.
Yeah.
Nikki (19:03):
So we had an experience one, and it was really early on.
It might have been the thirdcouple we played with.
We met'em for drinks.
Mm-hmm.
And two bottles of wine withinlike an hour.
Oh.
And it was really like, at thattime, my partner and I, we were
also kind of green, so you'rekinda like, well, this is going
well, you know?
Mm-hmm.
(19:24):
And, and we didn't drink thatmuch.
But they did.
Mm-hmm.
And then we invited them back toour, and this was like the third
date I think that we went onwith them.
So we, we had seen'em severaltimes.
Right.
And then that date, I guess theywere nervous'cause they also
could feel it was finally gonnahappen.
And then they drank so much.
Yeah.
They came to the house probablytwo weeks later we saw'em again.
(19:45):
They couldn't remember.
Oh, they could not remember howthey drove home.
And we were just like, wow.
So.
I don't know if they rememberedthe experience.
It was a hazard on the road.
Yeah.
I mean, we felt terrible becausew what do you do as a host?
Yeah.
Right?
So that there was all thesethings that came up and then
(20:06):
another experience was the samething.
The woman was really drunk.
Yeah.
The guy was fine and she waslike beyond repair.
Elle (20:15):
Yeah.
Nikki (20:16):
And then it's also kinda like, what do you do?
Right.
Yeah.
Like, do you proceed or not?
Like you were saying, politelyconsent or let's try this
another
Elle (20:23):
night's.
Nikki (20:24):
It's a very difficult situation.
Yeah.
And, I think in general, in thelifestyle though, a lot of
people, it's a party atmosphere.
So you do have a glass of wine.
Mm-hmm.
You do,.
Indulge in, in, in, Hey,Saturday night, let's have fun.
But there is that line of like,yeah, this is really uncool.
Elle (20:40):
Right.
And I think, it's hard forpeople who are new and at the
club for the first time or thefirst couple of times and
they're nervous.
Mm-hmm.
So you drinking and then youdrink more and you drink more.
And I take issue with thehusbands or the wife is.
Obviously impaired here, honey,here's another glass of wine.
Like, what are you doing?
You know, and it's just not agood situation for her.
(21:03):
It's not for him, for us.
And here's my cautionary tale isjust dial it back little bit
less than what you, yourself,what you think you want.
Nothing's gonna happen that youdon't want to happen, but make
sure that you're there makingthat choice and that it's not
something that you're gonnaregret.
So.
Drink enough to get those,little bit of the nerves gone,
(21:24):
but don't overdo it.
Mm-hmm.
There's always water.
There are always glasses ofwater every lined up on the
counter and on both of the bars,you can go grab it.
Or if there isn't any, they'remore than happy to give some to
you and just pace yourself.
Polly (21:38):
Yeah.
I had to learn that when I firststarted going because I was
nervous.
Yeah.
Right.
And I drank way too much, waytoo many times.
And.
My poor husband had to deal withyou dragging my drunk ass home.
Oh shit.
You know, this is fun.
It would inevitably end up in anargument.
Mm-hmm.
And then it kind of put a, acloud over the entire evening.
'cause he is like, you got drunkand I felt like I had to babysit
(21:59):
you and then I couldn't have anyfun.
And so I have intentionally madethe choice not to drink.
At as much.
I mean, I still have like one ortwo glasses of wine or a
cocktail or two.
Right.
But just really, really dialedit back a lot since then.
Yeah.
Because I want it to be a goodexperience for both of us.
I don't wanna be so drunk that Ican't say yes and I don't wanna
(22:20):
be so drunk that I don'tremember.
Mm-hmm.
The next day.
Because, I mean, we're doingthis because.
It's exciting and it's sexy andit's fun and it's pleasurable,
and I wanna be able to rememberthe pleasure later on and have
that fun next morningconversation with my husband.
Hey, how did you like that?
Did you enjoy that?
Was it fun watching me?
And you know, and he'll be like,and you know, I don't wanna be
(22:41):
looking at him going, I have noidea what you're talking about.
What do you mean I did that?
Elle (22:44):
I did what?
I did?
What, what?
What I did?
What?
No, I think, I think you'reright.
You know, one to two drinks.
Mm-hmm.
I mean, you're there for four orfive hours, then you can also
drive home nicely or hopefullyyou've Ubered.
But we've seen people, going andgetting in their car and it's
like, you just, you gotta justbe smart.
(23:05):
We're adults here.
At what point did we stop beingadults at that moment?
You know,
Polly (23:10):
we had to do the drive of shame one morning when we took a
couple home'cause they were sodrunk they couldn't drive to our
house Uhhuh.
And the next morning we had todrive them back.
To the club to get their car,their car, talk about an awkward
silent drive because he couldn'tperform because he was so drunk.
And it was just such a horrible,all the way around experience
(23:31):
that we're just like, we'renever gonna do that again.
Elle (23:34):
Right.
Again, all the things we learnedthe hard way.
Mm, for sure.
Okay, so on that, give me yourbest fun story of an experience
in the lifestyle.
Nikki (23:48):
Shall I go first?
Elle (23:50):
Yes.
Need a moment, Polly?
I need a moment.
Nikki (23:52):
Polly
Polly (23:53):
needs
Nikki (23:53):
a cracker.
No.
Elle (23:56):
I gave her a Moses.
Yeah, I know.
That should be helping.
Right?
Nikki (24:00):
So our favorite experience on a cruise,, I think
the last day of the cruise.
So we had already played with, adear couple that we know very
well and and a new threesome.
And the threesome we had waswith another woman.
Okay?
So my partner and two women.
And so then it was kinda like,well, it'd be so cool to turn it
(24:22):
around two guys and me.
Yeah, it would be cool.
And so then, sorry, the wholecruise we had sort of, connected
with this other couple and itwasn't connecting all the way.
And then I came up with the ideabecause they have these
workshops, a hall pass.
Mm-hmm.
So it's a meet and greet hallpass.
So we went to the hall pass andthe couple that we had been kind
(24:42):
of gelling with almost.
But not quite.
Was there and the husband hadthe hall pass.
And so it was the funniestthing.
He beelined over to the guy andthey were all like, blah, blah,
blah.
And I was completely outta theconversation, but I mean, it was
exactly what I wanted.
Right.
But he was just making it happenfor me.
So that was really sexy.
Yeah.
And then it was interesting'cause then the other guy came
(25:04):
back and he's like, well.
I've never done this, so I'llhave to go ask my wife,
Elle (25:09):
which you know, absolutely perfect.
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
As you should.
As you
Nikki (25:12):
should.
And there's a hall pass andthere's, you know, you still got
a check.
This was really great.
So then he came back and he'slike, she's okay as long as she
can watch.
So we were like, oh, okay.
So we marched off to the cabinand we had the most awesome
threesome with the two guys andI, while she watched, and then.
(25:35):
Guys were done.
They're like hanging on thebalcony and she was dominant by,
and I didn't know that.
Oh.
And so she had a whole bag oftoys and then her and I went to
town.
Oh my God, that's so awesome.
So that was by far one of thebest experiences ever.
And it was just unexpected.
You think you're gonna go oneway and then in the end you
(25:57):
morphed to this beautifulconstellation that we never
dreamed up of.
Elle (26:01):
We had, we had an instant the first time we went to Desire
that reminded me and met thisreally lovely couple, we'd been
on the Telegram group togetherand had talked and everything,
and then we're there at theresort and we're flirting and
talking and they're like, well,she doesn't play.
It's just him now.
She'll watch, but you know, sooften you'll have the guys will
(26:21):
not play the do the hot wipingthing.
Mm-hmm.
This was a hot husband kind of athing, and I think she had some
physical things going on withher and so it's just not
comfortable for her.
And so it took us like aboutfour days into the trip and he's
came over and he sat down.
I was on one of the cabanas andhe's like, okay, this is what we
wanna do and we'd like to do itnow.
(26:43):
And I'm like, well, we gotta gocheck with Jay and gimme half an
hour.
I want to go shower and, andwell, let's do this.
So she came and she watched andthen.
Jay would, talk with her whilehe and I were playing and, he'd
rub her back and she felt socomfortable that by the time we
were done with it, she was kindof in there and she was,
(27:03):
stroking me and stroking himand, you know, part of it.
And then her husband fucked her.
And, it felt so special that,this is not what they normally
do, but she felt good enough inthat scenario and safe enough
that she could play a littlebit.
Mm-hmm.
So it was really interesting.
So thank you for sharing thatone.
Yeah.
Polly.
Polly (27:25):
I'm trying to think.
Okay.
Well, just because, we've takenit so slow that we haven't done
a, we haven't had multiple.
Elle (27:35):
Well
Polly (27:35):
occurrences,
Elle (27:36):
like we discussed in our pre-recording recording, you had
said you, you've been doing thisfor two years.
Yes.
But you've really only playedwith, I
Polly (27:43):
think we've only played with three, or the drunk people.
Just reminded me.
I think that's four.
Okay.
But I don't count them.
Nope.
It was bad.
Didn't happen.
Elle (27:50):
For everybody.
I
Polly (27:50):
mean, I have to say that probably the, the mor some was
probably the most fun because itwas something that neither of us
had ever done.
I mean.
It's definitely not my husband'sjam.
I mean, he had never eventhought about that, I think in
his whole entire life.
I'm trying to
Elle (28:07):
picture.
Polly (28:09):
But it was just one of those things where, we were all
away for the weekend and it wasjust a, a quiet, kind of
romantic, fun, intimate settingwith, it was five couples and
we'd had a really great timeduring the day, had great dinner
and wine and.
My one girlfriend who's alwaysthe instigator, of course she
started that was a fire
Elle (28:30):
starter.
Polly (28:31):
He is a fire starter and next thing I know, I look over
and she's all my husband.
And then game one,
Elle (28:38):
you gotta work with the lowest common denominator.
Exactly.
But if that lowest commondenominator is in, you're all
in.
In.
Polly (28:45):
Exactly.
And so it was just really funbecause, it was dark, but there
was like moonlight on the snowoutside coming through the
windows.
And so it was just very visuallybeautiful.
And it was sensual, but it wasdirty and it was, you know,
everybody kind of took turnsplaying with everybody.
(29:05):
And so you weren't quite surewho was with who and who was
doing what where.
And it was just a really eroticexperience.
And then, one of the, thegentleman wasn't able to finish.
Mm-hmm.
Which is very common, whichhappens very, very, very common.
No,
Elle (29:20):
we, we, we've stopped expecting that either one of us
will Yeah.
Just, and just enjoy the moment.
Takes all the pressure off.
Polly (29:27):
What was really amazing is that I went over and I hopped
on him, Uhhuh, and I helped himwith that little problem.
Oh, you're such a giver.
I'm a giver.
And the cool part was that myhusband was watching Oh.
And it really turned him on.
Like he, he.
He doesn't like, he doesn't likesame room play'cause he doesn't
like watching me with anotherman.
(29:47):
Mm-hmm.
So for him to watch that andenjoy it was super sexy for me.
Wow.
So then we went upstairs to ourroom afterwards and I made sure
to take care of my husband.
Reconnecting.
Yeah.
And we connected and it wasjust, it was a very, it was a
really cool moment.
Elle (30:03):
That is an awesome story.
Mm-hmm.
Thank you.
So all three of us are bisexualwomen.
Mm-hmm.
Correct.
We enjoy women.
Okay.
Tell me about your first femalekiss.
Polly (30:17):
I honestly think my first female kiss when I was about
nine years old.
Okay.
My neighbor girl, we were, itwas so funny.
She was not just a latchkey kid,she like lived with her
grandparents.
And I remember we were playingone day and we went into her
bedroom and she took my shirtdown and she started playing
with my boobs and she kissed oneof'em and she said, this one's
chocolate milk.
And this one's vanilla milk andthen we kissed each other.
Elle (30:41):
I'm not sure that's what I was looking for, but I got it.
Polly (30:47):
No, I had my first adult kiss with a woman.
It was just soft and she wasbeautiful.
I actually met her, it was atthe club, and she just was
gorgeous and she and I looked ateach other and we were just
like.
Instantly connected, like Yes.
Yes.
And she came over and we kissedyou and it was just.
(31:09):
It was hot.
Oh, that's lovely.
It was hot.
What about you, Nikki?
Nikki (31:12):
For me, it was in my twenties.
Okay.
I think it was a little laterduring my studies.
And you weren't
Polly (31:17):
nine?
Nikki (31:18):
No, no, I wasn't.
Well, I know,
Elle (31:21):
but
Nikki (31:21):
I,
Elle (31:22):
I just conversation.
Took a weird turn.
We're gonna roll with you saidthe first.
I know.
I know.
I did.
That was me.
That's all on me.
Nikki (31:32):
But this was definitely college time.
A little bit more experimentingfeeling a little freer away from
home.
I guess it's the classicalstory, right?
Mm-hmm.
You have your first bisexualexperience in college.
And then I got married andabsolute put a lid on it.
My ex-partner or my ex-husbandjust, it, it just wasn't a
(31:52):
thing.
I didn't tell him.
I, he never knew.
Okay.
Until we then were trying thelifestyle and then we were at a
club and we're at like a massageroom, and then I started kissing
whoever was next to me.
And then it restarted that wholething again of like, wow.
I, I've suppressed this for solong and I really enjoy it, and
(32:12):
why am I suppressing it evenfurther?
And then my new partner, he'swildly attracted by seeing me
with another woman.
Polly (32:22):
Mm-hmm.
Oh yeah.
Yes.
And he's very
Nikki (32:23):
supportive.
He loves it.
Absolutely.
He's always saying that.
And he, he, before we met, healways told his friends like his
favorite thing would be to havea bisexual girlfriend.
And boom, there I was manifest,manifested itself.
And then now it's a super fun,still almost new thing because
like I said, I suppress it forso long and you do have, I find
(32:47):
a lot of instances where you godancing maybe at a vanilla club
and there's always a drunk bygirl mm-hmm.
Who will only kiss women whenshe's had X amount of drinks.
And they love it.
Like a couple weeks ago, I'm onthe dance floor somewhere and
this girl just comes up and westart kissing and it was great.
But you do see all the star ofeverybody around you and you're
(33:08):
like,
Elle (33:09):
oh, oh, I'm not at the club.
Yeah,
Nikki (33:11):
exactly.
What I really enjoy is when youare in a swinging.
Situation and you are with afoursome that you have that
mutual connection between thetwo women.
Elle (33:23):
Yes.
Yeah.
Right.
Nikki (33:24):
You might.
Play, you know, the couples areput the penises.
Yeah.
You have the penis part.
And then the aftermath ofdancing and holding and
caressing and playing some moreand making each other come.
And, and it's just that reallysoft aftermath of a foursome.
Mm-hmm.
Which I really, truly enjoy.
Elle (33:47):
My first girl kiss was, my first experience in the
lifestyle and Jay had somefriends come over and he had
told me previously she is anattention whore.
She likes the more BDSM becausethe attention's on her.
She's a wonderful person.
Like I love this woman insideand out.
(34:08):
And but he told me,'cause shegoes, she's.
Like the worst kisser.
Oh no.
And so here I am in my firstfoursome situation, and God, I
hope she's not listening tothis.
I'm horrible, but I do again, Ilove you.
But, and we're playing.
(34:30):
And so he stands up and I suckhis cock, and then she's sitting
on the sofa just laying there,just looking sexy.
I'm like, okay, well here I go.
I'm gonna dive in.
And I went to kiss her and itwas like kissing a toddler.
Like there was no movement, itwas just sort of lips pursed and
(34:51):
out.
And I sort of pulled back and Ilooked back at Jay and he just
looked at me like, mm-hmm.
I'm like, told so.
And then told our friends thesic swingers about that, and
they're devastated.
Devastated that, that was myfirst female again.
Oh.
Like, I'm so sorry I've made upfor it.
(35:12):
Said, yeah.
No, no, no.
I feel good.
But it was so, it was mememorable, let's put it that
way.
Okay.
Yeah.
What about the first time youwent down on a woman?
Polly (35:21):
I did that be not before ninth grade, a 9-year-old?
No.
Stop, Polly.
Elle (35:28):
No, I was 12
Polly (35:30):
in my adult.
No, I, I was, I was in myforties when I did that, and so
I hadn't kissed a woman yet, butI'd had an experience with a
very close friend of mine andanother man and she's the first
person that I went down on.
Okay.
Yeah.
And it was, awkward.
Sure.
Because she was my best friendand we were all drunk and it was
(35:52):
just a really weird experience.
Huh.
And it just wasn't great.
And I think it's just because Ididn't get the reaction that I
was expecting mm-hmm.
To get from it.
I don't know, I'm not sure Ieven went into it thinking about
a specific reaction, but it justwasn't what I thought it was
going to be.
So it just wasn't great.
(36:13):
I made up for it though.
Nikki (36:14):
Okay.
Elle (36:14):
Alright.
To take your word for it.
Yeah.
Nikki (36:17):
For me it was in college.
Mm-hmm.
So, like I said, you, you'reaway from home.
You can experiment all you wantand you have, freedom and
Elle (36:23):
well you grew up in Europe, right?
Yes.
Yeah.
Nikki (36:25):
Yes.
Elle (36:26):
So it's a little more, more free than Absolutely.
I would say in the US anyway.
Nikki (36:32):
Well, I, I guess, I don't know because I didn't go to
college here.
That's true.
So, but
Polly (36:36):
we're pretty damn oppressed here.
Yeah.
A little bit.
Nikki (36:39):
Yeah.
A little bit.
So in that sense, but for me,like I said, it was sort of a
start and go.
Mm-hmm.
Right.
It started and then here in theUS and then it was on hold for
quite a long time.
And then I did have anexperience with friends not
necessarily best friend, but youknow, it's kind of like the, the
people that you meet that youare hanging out with and then
(36:59):
it's like, oh, there's a sparkor there's not.
And I would say, really that.
It, it got going.
It was more in the lifestyle.
Elle (37:06):
Mm-hmm.
Nikki (37:07):
Right.
Because it, it might be during aswap or foursome or, if you have
threesome, whatever.
But the other thing, what Iwould like to say is that on
these dating apps for thelifestyle, everybody says I'm by
comfortable.
Mm-hmm.
I'm, I'm straight.
Well, exactly.
I'll touch
Elle (37:23):
boobs.
You can touch my boobs.
Maybe you can go down on me.
I'm not going down.
Nikki (37:27):
So, but, but that's why it's so funny because some
couples have I'm straight.
And then you have a Velociraptorin the room, and then the other
way around, somebody's backcomfortable and they won't even
kiss you.
Right.
So it it, it's such a wild arrayof what people like, or what
they're into
Elle (37:44):
or what they feel comfortable stating out there.
Yeah.
For the world to see.
Nikki (37:48):
But what we have noticed though, is that a lot of
couples.
The women aren't really that bi,even though they say they are.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
And, it's all good, I mean, thatdoesn't matter.
And so, for instance, I wouldsay I go down more on women than
they go down on me becausethey're kinda like, he,
Elle (38:05):
well, and I think, especially that first couple of
times, you're not confident inwhat you're doing.
You know, what you, what feelsgood to you, but I'm still not
confident
Polly (38:13):
in what I doing.
Oh,
Elle (38:13):
right.
And, and, and to go.
Down on a woman and, oh, I mean,the, the, the first time I came,
actually came, had a woman thatdidn't, you couldn't find her
clit.
I'm like, I couldn't find it.
And he's like, now, you knowwhat I feel like, but, you know
just, just getting that feel forhow they're reacting and what
seems to be working and, I thinkI've gotten better at it.
(38:35):
Me, but those first couple oftimes it was,
Nikki (38:37):
I feel it's the other way around because I'm kind of like.
Well, I know what it feels like,so I'll just do what I like.
Right.
And they seem to react to it'swhat And there you go.
Right.
It's, and I think that we're all
Polly (38:46):
different.
Like, we all like differentthings.
Yeah.
And so I know that I've hadinstances where I'm like, I'm
going to do to her what like, Ilike my husband to do.
Right.
It's a good start.
And I like it a little harder.
A little faster.
Right.
And this last woman that I waswith, she's like, slow down.
Elle (39:05):
Mm-hmm.
Polly (39:05):
And so I have to remember like it's.
It's what the other personlikes.
It's what they want.
It's not necessarily the waythat I like it,
Elle (39:14):
but they also have to be using their words.
They have to communicate.
They have to communicate.
So if they're not, and they'rejust tensing up.
Yeah.
You might mistake that for anorgasm, but it's not, and I
think that's it.
Like I don't want someone tobite my clip, my.
Clit is huge, and it's there andit probably looks pretty
biteable.
I don't want that.
I want, slow fat licks or, putthat finger inside me and
(39:36):
mm-hmm.
Come hither.
Mm-hmm.
You know, but not everybody doesthat or knows what to do, so
it's kind of up to me to letsomebody know, yeah, this is
what I want.
Yeah.
Nikki (39:47):
How about repeat play?
Like, Hmm.
Same night or no?
Well, same couple of courseanother time.
No, no, no.
I want more.
I guess I have to be morespecific.
Our ideal is you have, or youknow, 10 couples.
And you a rotation, youintermittently play with them.
(40:10):
Depending.
Yeah.
You know, so merry around.
It's like, yeah, this
Elle (40:13):
works.
We're good.
We have this rhythm.
And then the more you play withanother couple, we have a couple
like that.
We, the more we know each otherand we, the better we get.
Exactly.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Nikki (40:22):
And so that is one of those things.
How do you feel about that?
Is it like,'cause I'm also surethat some people are like one
and done Well also because it's,it, it keeps the emotions at
bay.
Yeah.
Right.
For sure.
Sure.
It, takes, that whole part of itcould get weird.
Out of the way.
Mm-hmm.
But for me, it's also kinda likethe first time when you play
with anybody, it's new, it'sdifferent.
You don't know.
(40:42):
It might be great, might bemedium, might be, and then the
second time it's absolutelyfabulous because, oh, I know
that if I do this, you're gonnago.
Yeah, exactly.
So, mm-hmm.
What, what are your thoughts onthat?
Elle (40:56):
Yeah.
No, I, I, 100%.
I think that when you find thosepeople that you connect with
mm-hmm.
Whether it's a single male or asingle female or a couple, and,
you do have to keep that levelof, the emotional mm-hmm.
Attachment off from it.
But, it's nice to have when youknow what you're gonna get,
there's so many times we'vegotten together with a couple
(41:17):
and I'm like, well, that wasmeh.
You know, for whatever reason,doesn't mean want anything
negative about them.
It just could be off night.
I could have been the math and Ijust didn't know.
But to have those people thatyou know, what you're getting
when you come back to it isreally nice.
Yeah, I do like having a few ofthose around.
Mm-hmm.
Polly (41:38):
Yeah, I would agree with you.
I mean, we only have one couplethat we've had repeat play with
and I love it because.
He's a ton of fun.
My husband and she really enjoyeach other.
To the point where the last timethat we played together, I
finally looked at him.
I'm like, could you please closethe door?
'cause all I can hear is hermaking noise, right?
Because I'm like, I know myhusband's doing his job and I
(41:59):
don't need to hear it.
So proud.
So proud.
You go, baby, I don't need tohear it.
There is definitely something,sexy and exciting and
exhilarating about that firsttime.
Oh yeah.
But I do know what you meanabout like knowing what you're
going to get and knowing, and Ithink.
I think that's part of thereason, like why my husband
might have such great sex is'cause I know what I'm gonna
(42:20):
get.
Yeah.
He knows what to do to turn meon.
And so the more you're withsomebody, the more they get to
understand you and your body.
Mm-hmm.
And how you move and how youreact.
And it definitely, I think,heightens the entire experience.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Good
Elle (42:34):
question though.
What about fears and anxietiesthat you have had or have
overcome or still have?
Polly (42:43):
Being found out?
Yeah.
Is probably the number one.
Yeah, that's a good one.
'cause nobody in our regularlife except one person knows
about that we're in thelifestyle.
So that's a really big fear.
And there's always gonna be someinsecurities and.
You worry like, is he gonna likeher better?
(43:03):
Like, is she gonna pleasure himbetter than I do?
He's always worried that, I'mgonna like, another guy's dick
more than his.
And I think that those thingsare part of, would've brought us
closer together knowing thatwhen we're together, there's
nothing like that sex.
Elle (43:21):
Yeah.
And
Polly (43:22):
there never will be.
Like, it's just makes youstronger.
Hands down, the best sex I'veever had in my life.
And, and it's because we havethat emotional bond and we can
talk to each other.
Mm-hmm.
And we can be vulnerable witheach other.
Mm-hmm.
And nobody else is gonna put upwith him.
So I don't think he's gonnaleave me.
Elle (43:37):
I'm thinking he feels the same, right?
I think so too.
What about you, Nikki?
Nikki (43:43):
Fear.
I don't know if I really haveany fears.
It's more, I think.
Some, some experiences are justbetter than others, but you kind
of forget the most obvious onein the room about being found
out or being judged for that.
Sure.
I don't know if it's necessarilythe being found out because if,
if they're cool with it, itdoesn't matter.
Right.
It's more the judgey, oh my God,I can't believe that.
(44:06):
Yeah.
Yeah.
But fears.
My, well, actually, one of myfears, and I don't fear, I don't
know fear is the right word, butit's what are we going to do 10
years from now?
Elle (44:18):
Oh, we talk about that.
You know, it's, it's like weonly have a few years in this
and, but, but it's kinda likewe're gonna be the 70 year olds
on the naked beaches.
Right.
And, but, but it talk about allthese things.
Nikki (44:27):
It's a thing of like.
Elle (44:29):
Oh
Nikki (44:29):
yeah.
As we get older.
As you get older, is there stilla couple that's interested in
us?
Yeah.
Are we interested in them?
Are we able to just are runaround the beach and fuck around
and whatever.
So it's not a fear, but it'smore one of those things like is
there a hard stop to thislifestyle?
Is it gonna just meander offinto the sunset until we decide
(44:51):
it's no longer fun?
Elle (44:53):
Yeah.
Nikki (44:53):
But there is that sense of like, well, I know it's
finite.
It's finite.
And also it's as you age, yourbody changes.
Mm-hmm.
Right.
Do you still wanna do it?
Elle (45:04):
Right?
I hope so too.
Well, yeah.
But you do, but you're, but you,like I said, I don't know if,
Nikki (45:07):
what if I'm 80?
I always use 80.
Right?
Like, does somebody want B whenI'm 80?
Mm-hmm.
I don't know.
So that definitely is part of mythought process.
Like also better have fun nowbecause it might be finite.
Polly (45:24):
I have to say that I have, one of the big surprises
to me since getting into thelifestyle is I don't feel like
there is a ton of ageism when itcomes to couple play, when it
comes to just women.
I definitely feel that.
So when we're at the club and,on all the online sites, there's
tons of people in their sixtiesinto their seventies Oh yeah.
(45:45):
On there.
Like, and they seem very activeand they're very happy and
they're doing it.
On the flip side of it, I'm partof a, a group for women only,
and I feel very, very old inthat group.
Nikki (45:55):
Interesting.
Polly (45:56):
And you know, I'm in my mid fifties.
I don't look it No, you don't.
I don't act it.
Nikki (46:00):
No.
Polly (46:00):
But I am.
And so I find it challenging tomake a connection with other.
Five women because we don't havea lot in common.
'cause most of the time there'sa 20 year age gap between me and
the rest of these women.
So in that instance, thatdefinitely plays into it.
Mm-hmm.
Like, when I go to one of theseevents with women, is anybody
(46:21):
gonna like me?
Is anybody gonna find meattractive?
Is anybody gonna wanna play withme?
Yeah.
Elle (46:26):
Mm-hmm.
Well, so we've been going forabout 50 minutes here this
second time around.
So I'm thinking that maybe weshould stop this and pick up, I
think there's a few more topicsthat we still could talk about
and get another one in so we canmake a, mm-hmm.
Part two are here.
So I do feel like today was justone giant ask me anything.
(46:50):
And I do wanna thank both of youfor joining me today and coming
along and, and bearing yoursouls for sure.
And I wanna take a moment andjust.
Reach out and thank everybodywho listens.
It's so cool to look at thestats after an episode and see
all the far reaching countries.
And please reach out to us atunapologetic swingers@gmail.com
(47:12):
and let us know how you foundus, what you like, and if
there's any topics you'd like usto cover.
We hope to have more sexyadventures to talk about in the
future and maybe even get somedetails about all of our
travels.
And by all means, leave us areview on whatever format you
listen to.
Tramp will be back on.
Well, maybe not the next episodesince we're gonna do a second
one here.
(47:32):
But in the following episodeafter he recovers from his
wonderful vacation.
Until next time, I'm al.
Be sexy,
Nikki (47:41):
be confident.
Polly (47:42):
Be unapologetic.
Welcome back to Unapologetic Swingers.
I'm Al, and today we have a veryspecial episode.
While Tramp is away, L willplay.
Tramp is off having his own sexyadventures in Mexico.
And I snag the equipment and I'mgoing rogue.
And actually the funny story is,we already recorded this, but we
didn't hit the record button, sowe're gonna do it again.
(00:27):
Welcome to episode 21.
The All Girls Show.
I have brought together two ofmy favorite women, and we have a
list of questions to discuss toget the female opinion about the
lifestyle.
What I have noticed over theyears is that there's no cookie
cutter way to explore thelifestyle.
Everyone's story is differentand everyone's story is just
right for them.
(00:47):
We can have open conversationslike we can't have with most of
our vanilla friends, and we cantalk about the sexy stuff, the
deep stuff, and ask questions ofeach other to help with our
journeys, and that's what we aredoing here today.
So with no further ado, I wouldlike to introduce Nikki and
Polly and can you please take amoment to introduce yourself and
give a short description of howyou got into the lifestyle and
(01:09):
what you're looking for.
Nikki (01:11):
Hi everyone.
I'm Nikki and I have been in thelifestyle probably about two
years now with my currentpartner.
I was in the lifestyle with myex.
And it was more of a trying tosave the marriage equation of
trying to get into thelifestyle, trying to spice a
marriage up that was basicallynot repairable anymore.
(01:35):
And so it's been a journeybecause like I said at the
beginning, I was with my ex, hewas very, scholarly about it.
I would say it was a lot ofreading books a lot of podcasts
or, other, information likegoing to a club or trying to
absorb it all.
And I'm more of a.
(01:56):
Does it feel right?
Is this fun?
Which way are we gonna go?
I just wanna mm-hmm.
Let me just experiment.
Let me see where, I don't wannawhere it goes.
Don't go to school.
No, exactly.
And it, it all has to be fun,but I guess everybody has their
own way of, how do you feelcomfortable?
How do you get started?
For me, it was we were thenjointly on an app called Field.
Mm-hmm.
And, I then started playing morealone as a unicorn, and it was
(02:21):
really trying to figure out whatare my likes and dislikes and do
I like a threesome?
Do I like a one-on-one?
Is it, other items that youlike, kink or whatever?
And then when that stopped, andI met my current partner, we
were talking about thelifestyle, and he was in it with
his ex, but he was in it as afull swinger.
(02:44):
So really only couples andpretty much, foursome.
And that was about it.
So then when we got together andwe ventured into it together it
was kind of an interesting startbecause like I said, I was
always used to, it's my owndecision.
Right.
I'm the only one who goesforward with something and now
you are a team and also you'retrying to get a foursome going,
(03:05):
which is by itself, as we allknow, super hard.
Elle (03:08):
Yeah.
A challenge.
Nikki (03:09):
So that is one thing also that I guess, you really learn
how to do as a team and you haveto talk about and what do you
like, what don't you like?
So I would say that is sort ofthe way how I got into the
lifestyle.
Okay.
Polly (03:24):
Hi, I'm Polly.
My swinging lifestyle storystarted a long time ago.
I was in my early twenties withmy first husband and he tried to
get us into the lifestylebecause he wanted to watch other
guys fuck me.
I was young and doe-eyed andmadly in love with him and
(03:45):
didn't understand what he wastrying to achieve, so it did not
work out.
The marriage did not work outeither.
Funny yeah, sometimes thathappens.
Flash forward, 30 somethingyears, and my current husband
and I were actually on vacationin Mexico and he had taken a nap
and came down to the pool andfound me in the hot tub with two
lesbians.
And he is like, what the hell'sgoing on?
Elle (04:06):
Oh,
Polly (04:06):
and it started being a joke where I think you're a
little bit bi when you drink.
And
Elle (04:14):
maybe not just when you drink, but Okay.
Polly (04:16):
Sat on that for a couple of years and once all the kids
left, I finally said to him,well, I think I might be a
little bit bi when I don'tdrink.
And he said, okay, well what doyou wanna do about that?
And I was like, well, I'm a 50something year old woman living
in the suburbs.
I'm not sure what to do aboutthat.
So I got online, started doingsome research, found a couple of
websites.
(04:36):
Some were way out there andstumbled upon Scarlet Ranch and
said, let's go check it out.
And we walked in on kink night.
It was our very first time wewalked in.
Oh yeah.
Walked in to see a woman ChAARIhanging from a, a hook in the
ceiling.
And we looked at each other,we're like, what did we just do?
Mm-hmm.
(04:57):
But we took it slow.
We kept going.
We went our first Sunday fun dayand I was like, I can lay out in
the sun naked.
And I looked at him and I'mlike, I found my happy place.
These are my people.
And that was the beginning ofthat story.
Elle (05:13):
Nice, nice.
So what are your play styles?
I mean, I know you guys haveevolved in, in.
Where you're at.
But is it full swap side byside?
Is it just women?
What is it that you like to do?
Yes.
(05:34):
Good answer.
Polly (05:36):
We got into it because I'm
Elle (05:38):
interested in women.
Polly (05:38):
Yes.
So that's how it started for us,was for me to be able to explore
that side of me.
And from there, as most peoplein the lifestyle know there
aren't a whole lot of unicornsout there.
And so we became friends withseveral couples and it started
off, our first experience was aside by side.
Mm-hmm.
And then we moved into more of asoft swap and then we moved into
(06:02):
a full swap in the same room.
And then we decided to try afull swap in separate rooms.
And it's just kind of all been amixture since then.
A little bit of this, a littlebit of that.
Nikki (06:16):
Interesting.
So we, from the start, were fullswap.
Mm-hmm.
And it was more, I think both ofus are very sexual people.
So we never really had anyqualms about you can't do this,
or you have to start slow.
I would say it depends more onthe other couple.
Right.
The, the people you meet, do yougel with them?
And then it's kinda like, whatdo you normally do?
(06:38):
So we've had wonderfulexperiences with parallel play.
We've beautiful experiences withSoft Swap, and then also on the
other side with full swaps andems and just women or, other
things.
So I would say we don't havelike a.
A slow agenda that we, went fromone point and, and just slowly
(06:59):
went down the road.
It was really more situational.
How does the other, partner orcouple react to us and how does
that happen organically as we'rethere either at an event or at a
club
Polly (07:12):
I love a mor,
Nikki (07:14):
I love a mor too.
It's, it's actually are
Polly (07:16):
fun.
Nikki (07:16):
So for me, I've only done two.
Okay.
So far, one was not that muchfun because we were with three
couples and the one couple had ababysitter and they had to go
home at one point.
So it was really like, okay, yougot 20 minutes.
You got 20 minutes, and now wego here.
You have 20 minutes, and oh myGod, we gotta go home.
Elle (07:38):
That's a little too structured.
It was.
It was very structured.
Wors are not structured.
That's the whole beauty of them.
Exactly.
Nikki (07:46):
And so then more recently we did have a very unstructured
one and that was really nice.
And then one a couples had a bigduffle bag of.
Toys.
Mm-hmm.
Like spread our bars and otherthings and explore.
It was, it was really kindalike, yay, we signed up for the
right morum.
Elle (08:05):
I think my favorite part about the Morum is really just
the, everybody interacting andyou don't know who's doing.
Mm-hmm.
What, but it just is there'ssuch a connection with the other
people in the room.
And I really do like that.
I like the, kind of just beingin another world and not really
(08:25):
focused on what one person isdoing to you.
But
Nikki (08:27):
when you are talking about a mor, is it like you
start out with a finite group ofpeople, or is it like you are
somewhere and anybody can joinin and how does that work?
I guess because the only onesI've done is it's like a fixed
group, right?
That's what I've done, andthere's no peripheral people
that all of a sudden are thereand, oh, look, then Joey is now
(08:48):
jumping in.
Right?
So
Elle (08:50):
We've done.
They're very structured.
But we also have early on wewent to some house parties.
There was a couple that threwhouse parties.
It was called the Ravens Nest,and it was pretty monthly
mm-hmm.
That they were putting'em on.
And we would go to'em and reallya nice setup upstairs.
Food and drink, you know, youpay an$80 donation mm-hmm.
Or whatever to get in for acouple and there might be 50, 60
(09:13):
people there.
I mean, it was pretty big.
And then downstairs is all theplay area.
So, you still have that elementof, I need to be okay with who
it is.
Mm-hmm.
You need to ask, can I join you?
That kind of a thing.
And we didn't have any issueswith that at all.
Okay.
No, I take that back.
Jay and I were playing togetheron one of the beds, just the two
of us, and a guy that we weretalking to, him and his wife,
(09:36):
and we had met them a couple oftimes, came up and started
fondling my breasts withoutsaying anything.
And I was just like, well, thatwas not okay.
And later we saw him, he's like,I am so sorry.
'cause I think his wife saw himdo that.
And she's like, what are youdoing?
Like, you didn't even ask, just'cause you know somebody doesn't
mean you just mm-hmm.
(09:57):
Go join their tits.
Yeah.
You know?
And so it was like, okay, thatwas good.
And so it wasn't bad.
It was nice, you know,'causepeople are moving in different
rooms and they had a little BDSroom, B-D-B-D-S-M room with a
cross, and then they had a Sianin there and some other things.
And then, bigger playrooms whereeverybody was there.
(10:18):
But but I do like mm-hmm thesmaller groups where, you know,
the people, everybody'sattracted to each other off the
bat, you don't have to worryabout that.
Oh great.
I want him and him to touch meand her, and her and her, but
not him.
You know, that's a little moreawkward.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Polly (10:34):
Yeah.
The two times that we've hadthat experience, it was with a
set group of people, and it waspeople that we knew.
Mm-hmm.
Some of whom we had played withbefore, some of whom we had
flirted and kissed and made outwith before.
There was one couple that we hadnever met before, but we really
hit it off very quickly withthem.
And so it was just a, it was avery fun experience.
Elle (10:54):
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Okay.
Men versus women
Nikki (11:02):
interest.
Maybe elaborate a little bit onthat.
Elle (11:05):
How do you like to play with men and with, with women?
Nikki (11:12):
I guess it's with women it's way more sensual, I would
say.
It's much more kissing andstroking and holding and,
enjoying the voluptuous natureof mm-hmm.
Two female bodies together.
And the beauty of it.
Elle (11:27):
Yeah, the softness.
The softness, the soft lips.
Yes.
The tongue.
Yeah.
Nikki (11:31):
And I think just in general, women with each other,
it's much more soft.
Elle (11:36):
Mm-hmm.
Nikki (11:36):
Right.
Maybe one person might be alittle bit more dominant, but in
general it's much softer than ifyou have sex with a man.
Right.
But that said, I am into reallyrough sex.
Elle (11:49):
Well, I'm, I'm good.
If you talk, if you wanna tossme around, I'm good with that.
I don't wanna think, don't,don't need to ask me what I
want.
Just move me, you know?
Right.
But
Nikki (11:58):
like I said, so it's, it's funny.
So we're into choking andslapping and this and that,
which you'll probably never havewith women, I would presume.
At least I've never experiencedit.
I'm gonna Yeah.
I've never experienced it.
Yeah.
Yeah.
May maybe a playful slap, butthat's about as far as it goes.
Mm-hmm.
And the other funny thing is,what I have noticed for myself,
I am submissive to men, butdominant to women.
Elle (12:20):
Hmm.
Nikki (12:21):
So when I play with a woman, I'm the one, the
aggressor.
Assertive, well, assertive.
Also, I'm taller normally.
So it's just kind of that,natural, yeah.
Dominant part.
And then with men, it's exactlythe other way around, and I love
it.
I love both.
I mm-hmm.
My partner always says, well,yeah, you love women, but you
can't do it without a dick.
Which is totally, absolutelytrue.
(12:42):
Completely.
Polly (12:44):
Absolutely.
I'm never given that up 100.
Exactly.
So,
Nikki (12:47):
but like I said, it's just very interesting how
different for me the experienceis, and I love both.
Mm-hmm.
Polly (12:54):
I would agree.
I think that with a woman, it'sa much more.
Sensual, tender, gentle, soft,slow stroking, slow touching.
Mm-hmm.
Experience.
And with a man, I do like to bemanhandled.
Mm-hmm.
A little bit.
Right.
I'm a very, in my normal life,I'm a pretty type, a aggressive
(13:15):
go-getter, control freak, planeverything out in my life.
And when I'm in bed, I don'twanna do that.
Mm-hmm.
I don't wanna think about it.
Right.
And so that's one of the thingsthat I like about being with.
Bigger men mm-hmm.
In particular is because I feellike they can just pick me up
and they can just throw mearound and they can do what
they, and I'm just like, bringit, you're a tiny
Elle (13:34):
little spinner anyway.
I mean, I could pick you up andthrow you around.
Oh, I need to see that.
But I get what you mean.
Us being taller.
I'm like in between the two ofyou.
Mm-hmm.
I like somebody who's.
Taller than me.
Who's bigger.
Bigger.
Yeah.
I don't wanna feel like I'mbigger than the guy Absolutely
ever.
And I love that, strong arming,move me around, flip me around.
(13:58):
Mm-hmm.
Do this, do that.
You know, now I'll tell you thismuch.
Don't tell me what to do.
Don't order me to do something.
Is we have also found that.
I am a horrible slave.
So we, we were playing withanother couple and a single guy
and we're kind of done.
And when I'm done, I'm tappedout and I just like, I'll sit
(14:20):
and watch and I'm perfectlyhappy.
And the single guy's sittingthere and he goes, L, suck my
dick.
And I looked at him, I went.
No.
And he looks at me and he says,worst slave ever.
And I'm like, yeah, it soundsabout right.
Polly (14:37):
Yes.
I don't like to be told what todo, but I have to tell you that
there have been a few times whenI've been bed with my husband
and he's like, get on yourfucking knee.
So I'm like, yes, sir.
Right away.
Right away.
Jay
Elle (14:49):
has figured out if he says, you know, I'd really like
it if you'd go over and givePauly a kiss, you know?
I'm more apt to saying, oh,okay, I'll go do that for you.
Mm-hmm.
Whereas go kiss Polly.
Yeah, fuck you.
Polly (15:05):
You know?
Well, you can come kiss Pollyanytime you want.
Elle (15:07):
Oh, good to know.
Okay, so one of the otherquestions I had too was
formatted.
Sexual play or organic, likehaving dates and going out to
dinner and, going through awhole process or just meeting
someone in, in an organic way.
(15:28):
What do you prefer?
Nikki (15:29):
I think we were talking about it before.
It depends where you are,
Elle (15:32):
right?
Nikki (15:33):
If you are around town in your own city or whatever, we
normally like to have drinks ordinner or.
And have more of a structuredapproach, see if it fits, see if
it's a foursome or not.
So we normally don't play on thefirst date.
Mm-hmm.
Always exceptions of course.
I mean, let's be honest.
Yeah.
But I don't wanna wait.
(15:55):
But, normally that's theapproach, right?
We, we'll set a day for drinksand blah, blah, and then have a
follow-up date.
But while we're outta town or onvacation at a resort on a
cruise.
Vacation mode comes on.
And I think it's also becauseyou have so much more time to
connect with people.
'cause you're mm-hmm.
At the gym together, you seepeople at breakfast, you are at
(16:15):
the pool.
You're talking to people in thehot tub and you just have so
many more opportunities toconnect that it almost negates
the fact of that you need tostructure it.
Elle (16:23):
Yeah.
Yeah.
I agree.
Well, and, and like when you'reon vacation, you're not thinking
about, oh, I gotta get you up inthe morning and go to work, or
oh, I have all this laundry todo, or, oh, I gotta take the
kids somewhere.
I mean, that's not us anymore,but, there's a lot of people
where that's a big thing where Ihave to get home for babysitter,
so that's a time constraint welove vacation LI don't.
(16:47):
Overthink things.
I don't put too much head on it.
Well, okay, well hopefully I'll,if you ask nicely.
But it's, I don't get in my headas much and I'm able to just
relax and let it be.
Nikki (17:03):
I also feel it's, it is a formula of will you see these
people again?
Or not exactly, like if it's inyour own backyard.
I wanna be a little bit moreSure, sure.
Because you will see'em again ifyou have a club nearby or house
parties or wherever you play.
And honestly, if you are at aresort or somewhere else, I
mean, you might see him again.
Mm-hmm.
But, but then again, you alsomight never see him again at
(17:26):
all.
Also it has a different playstyle.
Mm-hmm.
Or brings with it a differentplay style.
Polly (17:29):
We generally are a little bit more like at home, like you
are mm-hmm.
Where we wanna meet people, wewanna get to know them.
We have a couple that we hookedup with on the first date and we
see them.
It, it was not a goodexperience.
Okay.
For, I don't think any of us andwe see them regularly.
At the club, and it has beenvery, very awkward since then.
(17:51):
Like the husband can't even makeeye contact
Nikki (17:54):
with you.
Oh, you're kidding.
Oh, no.
So
Polly (17:55):
I, I finally, and it is funny because this experience
has helped to establish our twobiggest ground rules, which is
we don't play on the first dateand we don't play with You're
drunk.
Because, oh yes.
They were so drunk that, I mean,it was just, it was a horrible
experience all the way around.
And so I finally, after likefour or five months after this
guy not being able to make eyecontact with me, the club, I
(18:16):
walked up to him, I'm like,dude, it was awkward.
It wasn't good for any of us.
You don't have to make it weird.
Elle (18:23):
Nice.
Good for you.
Come on.
Polly (18:26):
We're
Elle (18:26):
all adults here.
Yes, we're still gonna exist inthe same room.
Exactly.
But you bring up a really goodpoint and we talk about it a
lot.
Alcohol mm-hmm.
Is a huge turnoff for us.
I mean, I don't, you know, havea drink or two or whatever, but
when people get to the pointwhere they're sloppy drunk for
us, that is questionableconsent.
That is, yes.
(18:47):
Questionable consent.
That is, are they really eventhere?
Are they gonna second guess it?
Are they gonna come back thenext morning and go, I really
didn't wanna do that, and thenit's our fault?
And we're like, no, no, wedon't.
We don't even wanna play that.
But also they're just sloppy.
They were very sloppy and that'snot fun or sexy.
Yeah.
Nikki (19:03):
So we had an experience one, and it was really early on.
It might have been the thirdcouple we played with.
We met'em for drinks.
Mm-hmm.
And two bottles of wine withinlike an hour.
Oh.
And it was really like, at thattime, my partner and I, we were
also kind of green, so you'rekinda like, well, this is going
well, you know?
Mm-hmm.
(19:24):
And, and we didn't drink thatmuch.
But they did.
Mm-hmm.
And then we invited them back toour, and this was like the third
date I think that we went onwith them.
So we, we had seen'em severaltimes.
Right.
And then that date, I guess theywere nervous'cause they also
could feel it was finally gonnahappen.
And then they drank so much.
Yeah.
They came to the house probablytwo weeks later we saw'em again.
(19:45):
They couldn't remember.
Oh, they could not remember howthey drove home.
And we were just like, wow.
So.
I don't know if they rememberedthe experience.
It was a hazard on the road.
Yeah.
I mean, we felt terrible becausew what do you do as a host?
Yeah.
Right?
So that there was all thesethings that came up and then
(20:06):
another experience was the samething.
The woman was really drunk.
Yeah.
The guy was fine and she waslike beyond repair.
Elle (20:15):
Yeah.
Nikki (20:16):
And then it's also kinda like, what do you do?
Right.
Yeah.
Like, do you proceed or not?
Like you were saying, politelyconsent or let's try this
another
Elle (20:23):
night's.
Nikki (20:24):
It's a very difficult situation.
Yeah.
And, I think in general, in thelifestyle though, a lot of
people, it's a party atmosphere.
So you do have a glass of wine.
Mm-hmm.
You do,.
Indulge in, in, in, Hey,Saturday night, let's have fun.
But there is that line of like,yeah, this is really uncool.
Elle (20:40):
Right.
And I think, it's hard forpeople who are new and at the
club for the first time or thefirst couple of times and
they're nervous.
Mm-hmm.
So you drinking and then youdrink more and you drink more.
And I take issue with thehusbands or the wife is.
Obviously impaired here, honey,here's another glass of wine.
Like, what are you doing?
You know, and it's just not agood situation for her.
(21:03):
It's not for him, for us.
And here's my cautionary tale isjust dial it back little bit
less than what you, yourself,what you think you want.
Nothing's gonna happen that youdon't want to happen, but make
sure that you're there makingthat choice and that it's not
something that you're gonnaregret.
So.
Drink enough to get those,little bit of the nerves gone,
(21:24):
but don't overdo it.
Mm-hmm.
There's always water.
There are always glasses ofwater every lined up on the
counter and on both of the bars,you can go grab it.
Or if there isn't any, they'remore than happy to give some to
you and just pace yourself.
Polly (21:38):
Yeah.
I had to learn that when I firststarted going because I was
nervous.
Yeah.
Right.
And I drank way too much, waytoo many times.
And.
My poor husband had to deal withyou dragging my drunk ass home.
Oh shit.
You know, this is fun.
It would inevitably end up in anargument.
Mm-hmm.
And then it kind of put a, acloud over the entire evening.
'cause he is like, you got drunkand I felt like I had to babysit
(21:59):
you and then I couldn't have anyfun.
And so I have intentionally madethe choice not to drink.
At as much.
I mean, I still have like one ortwo glasses of wine or a
cocktail or two.
Right.
But just really, really dialedit back a lot since then.
Yeah.
Because I want it to be a goodexperience for both of us.
I don't wanna be so drunk that Ican't say yes and I don't wanna
(22:20):
be so drunk that I don'tremember.
Mm-hmm.
The next day.
Because, I mean, we're doingthis because.
It's exciting and it's sexy andit's fun and it's pleasurable,
and I wanna be able to rememberthe pleasure later on and have
that fun next morningconversation with my husband.
Hey, how did you like that?
Did you enjoy that?
Was it fun watching me?
And you know, and he'll be like,and you know, I don't wanna be
(22:41):
looking at him going, I have noidea what you're talking about.
What do you mean I did that?
Elle (22:44):
I did what?
I did?
What, what?
What I did?
What?
No, I think, I think you'reright.
You know, one to two drinks.
Mm-hmm.
I mean, you're there for four orfive hours, then you can also
drive home nicely or hopefullyyou've Ubered.
But we've seen people, going andgetting in their car and it's
like, you just, you gotta justbe smart.
(23:05):
We're adults here.
At what point did we stop beingadults at that moment?
You know,
Polly (23:10):
we had to do the drive of shame one morning when we took a
couple home'cause they were sodrunk they couldn't drive to our
house Uhhuh.
And the next morning we had todrive them back.
To the club to get their car,their car, talk about an awkward
silent drive because he couldn'tperform because he was so drunk.
And it was just such a horrible,all the way around experience
(23:31):
that we're just like, we'renever gonna do that again.
Elle (23:34):
Right.
Again, all the things we learnedthe hard way.
Mm, for sure.
Okay, so on that, give me yourbest fun story of an experience
in the lifestyle.
Nikki (23:48):
Shall I go first?
Elle (23:50):
Yes.
Need a moment, Polly?
I need a moment.
Nikki (23:52):
Polly
Polly (23:53):
needs
Nikki (23:53):
a cracker.
No.
Elle (23:56):
I gave her a Moses.
Yeah, I know.
That should be helping.
Right?
Nikki (24:00):
So our favorite experience on a cruise,, I think
the last day of the cruise.
So we had already played with, adear couple that we know very
well and and a new threesome.
And the threesome we had waswith another woman.
Okay?
So my partner and two women.
And so then it was kinda like,well, it'd be so cool to turn it
(24:22):
around two guys and me.
Yeah, it would be cool.
And so then, sorry, the wholecruise we had sort of, connected
with this other couple and itwasn't connecting all the way.
And then I came up with the ideabecause they have these
workshops, a hall pass.
Mm-hmm.
So it's a meet and greet hallpass.
So we went to the hall pass andthe couple that we had been kind
(24:42):
of gelling with almost.
But not quite.
Was there and the husband hadthe hall pass.
And so it was the funniestthing.
He beelined over to the guy andthey were all like, blah, blah,
blah.
And I was completely outta theconversation, but I mean, it was
exactly what I wanted.
Right.
But he was just making it happenfor me.
So that was really sexy.
Yeah.
And then it was interesting'cause then the other guy came
(25:04):
back and he's like, well.
I've never done this, so I'llhave to go ask my wife,
Elle (25:09):
which you know, absolutely perfect.
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
As you should.
As you
Nikki (25:12):
should.
And there's a hall pass andthere's, you know, you still got
a check.
This was really great.
So then he came back and he'slike, she's okay as long as she
can watch.
So we were like, oh, okay.
So we marched off to the cabinand we had the most awesome
threesome with the two guys andI, while she watched, and then.
(25:35):
Guys were done.
They're like hanging on thebalcony and she was dominant by,
and I didn't know that.
Oh.
And so she had a whole bag oftoys and then her and I went to
town.
Oh my God, that's so awesome.
So that was by far one of thebest experiences ever.
And it was just unexpected.
You think you're gonna go oneway and then in the end you
(25:57):
morphed to this beautifulconstellation that we never
dreamed up of.
Elle (26:01):
We had, we had an instant the first time we went to Desire
that reminded me and met thisreally lovely couple, we'd been
on the Telegram group togetherand had talked and everything,
and then we're there at theresort and we're flirting and
talking and they're like, well,she doesn't play.
It's just him now.
She'll watch, but you know, sooften you'll have the guys will
(26:21):
not play the do the hot wipingthing.
Mm-hmm.
This was a hot husband kind of athing, and I think she had some
physical things going on withher and so it's just not
comfortable for her.
And so it took us like aboutfour days into the trip and he's
came over and he sat down.
I was on one of the cabanas andhe's like, okay, this is what we
wanna do and we'd like to do itnow.
(26:43):
And I'm like, well, we gotta gocheck with Jay and gimme half an
hour.
I want to go shower and, andwell, let's do this.
So she came and she watched andthen.
Jay would, talk with her whilehe and I were playing and, he'd
rub her back and she felt socomfortable that by the time we
were done with it, she was kindof in there and she was,
(27:03):
stroking me and stroking himand, you know, part of it.
And then her husband fucked her.
And, it felt so special that,this is not what they normally
do, but she felt good enough inthat scenario and safe enough
that she could play a littlebit.
Mm-hmm.
So it was really interesting.
So thank you for sharing thatone.
Yeah.
Polly.
Polly (27:25):
I'm trying to think.
Okay.
Well, just because, we've takenit so slow that we haven't done
a, we haven't had multiple.
Elle (27:35):
Well
Polly (27:35):
occurrences,
Elle (27:36):
like we discussed in our pre-recording recording, you had
said you, you've been doing thisfor two years.
Yes.
But you've really only playedwith, I
Polly (27:43):
think we've only played with three, or the drunk people.
Just reminded me.
I think that's four.
Okay.
But I don't count them.
Nope.
It was bad.
Didn't happen.
Elle (27:50):
For everybody.
I
Polly (27:50):
mean, I have to say that probably the, the mor some was
probably the most fun because itwas something that neither of us
had ever done.
I mean.
It's definitely not my husband'sjam.
I mean, he had never eventhought about that, I think in
his whole entire life.
I'm trying to
Elle (28:07):
picture.
Polly (28:09):
But it was just one of those things where, we were all
away for the weekend and it wasjust a, a quiet, kind of
romantic, fun, intimate settingwith, it was five couples and
we'd had a really great timeduring the day, had great dinner
and wine and.
My one girlfriend who's alwaysthe instigator, of course she
started that was a fire
Elle (28:30):
starter.
Polly (28:31):
He is a fire starter and next thing I know, I look over
and she's all my husband.
And then game one,
Elle (28:38):
you gotta work with the lowest common denominator.
Exactly.
But if that lowest commondenominator is in, you're all
in.
In.
Polly (28:45):
Exactly.
And so it was just really funbecause, it was dark, but there
was like moonlight on the snowoutside coming through the
windows.
And so it was just very visuallybeautiful.
And it was sensual, but it wasdirty and it was, you know,
everybody kind of took turnsplaying with everybody.
(29:05):
And so you weren't quite surewho was with who and who was
doing what where.
And it was just a really eroticexperience.
And then, one of the, thegentleman wasn't able to finish.
Mm-hmm.
Which is very common, whichhappens very, very, very common.
No,
Elle (29:20):
we, we, we've stopped expecting that either one of us
will Yeah.
Just, and just enjoy the moment.
Takes all the pressure off.
Polly (29:27):
What was really amazing is that I went over and I hopped
on him, Uhhuh, and I helped himwith that little problem.
Oh, you're such a giver.
I'm a giver.
And the cool part was that myhusband was watching Oh.
And it really turned him on.
Like he, he.
He doesn't like, he doesn't likesame room play'cause he doesn't
like watching me with anotherman.
(29:47):
Mm-hmm.
So for him to watch that andenjoy it was super sexy for me.
Wow.
So then we went upstairs to ourroom afterwards and I made sure
to take care of my husband.
Reconnecting.
Yeah.
And we connected and it wasjust, it was a very, it was a
really cool moment.
Elle (30:03):
That is an awesome story.
Mm-hmm.
Thank you.
So all three of us are bisexualwomen.
Mm-hmm.
Correct.
We enjoy women.
Okay.
Tell me about your first femalekiss.
Polly (30:17):
I honestly think my first female kiss when I was about
nine years old.
Okay.
My neighbor girl, we were, itwas so funny.
She was not just a latchkey kid,she like lived with her
grandparents.
And I remember we were playingone day and we went into her
bedroom and she took my shirtdown and she started playing
with my boobs and she kissed oneof'em and she said, this one's
chocolate milk.
And this one's vanilla milk andthen we kissed each other.
Elle (30:41):
I'm not sure that's what I was looking for, but I got it.
Polly (30:47):
No, I had my first adult kiss with a woman.
It was just soft and she wasbeautiful.
I actually met her, it was atthe club, and she just was
gorgeous and she and I looked ateach other and we were just
like.
Instantly connected, like Yes.
Yes.
And she came over and we kissedyou and it was just.
(31:09):
It was hot.
Oh, that's lovely.
It was hot.
What about you, Nikki?
Nikki (31:12):
For me, it was in my twenties.
Okay.
I think it was a little laterduring my studies.
And you weren't
Polly (31:17):
nine?
Nikki (31:18):
No, no, I wasn't.
Well, I know,
Elle (31:21):
but
Nikki (31:21):
I,
Elle (31:22):
I just conversation.
Took a weird turn.
We're gonna roll with you saidthe first.
I know.
I know.
I did.
That was me.
That's all on me.
Nikki (31:32):
But this was definitely college time.
A little bit more experimentingfeeling a little freer away from
home.
I guess it's the classicalstory, right?
Mm-hmm.
You have your first bisexualexperience in college.
And then I got married andabsolute put a lid on it.
My ex-partner or my ex-husbandjust, it, it just wasn't a
(31:52):
thing.
I didn't tell him.
I, he never knew.
Okay.
Until we then were trying thelifestyle and then we were at a
club and we're at like a massageroom, and then I started kissing
whoever was next to me.
And then it restarted that wholething again of like, wow.
I, I've suppressed this for solong and I really enjoy it, and
(32:12):
why am I suppressing it evenfurther?
And then my new partner, he'swildly attracted by seeing me
with another woman.
Polly (32:22):
Mm-hmm.
Oh yeah.
Yes.
And he's very
Nikki (32:23):
supportive.
He loves it.
Absolutely.
He's always saying that.
And he, he, before we met, healways told his friends like his
favorite thing would be to havea bisexual girlfriend.
And boom, there I was manifest,manifested itself.
And then now it's a super fun,still almost new thing because
like I said, I suppress it forso long and you do have, I find
(32:47):
a lot of instances where you godancing maybe at a vanilla club
and there's always a drunk bygirl mm-hmm.
Who will only kiss women whenshe's had X amount of drinks.
And they love it.
Like a couple weeks ago, I'm onthe dance floor somewhere and
this girl just comes up and westart kissing and it was great.
But you do see all the star ofeverybody around you and you're
(33:08):
like,
Elle (33:09):
oh, oh, I'm not at the club.
Yeah,
Nikki (33:11):
exactly.
What I really enjoy is when youare in a swinging.
Situation and you are with afoursome that you have that
mutual connection between thetwo women.
Elle (33:23):
Yes.
Yeah.
Right.
Nikki (33:24):
You might.
Play, you know, the couples areput the penises.
Yeah.
You have the penis part.
And then the aftermath ofdancing and holding and
caressing and playing some moreand making each other come.
And, and it's just that reallysoft aftermath of a foursome.
Mm-hmm.
Which I really, truly enjoy.
Elle (33:47):
My first girl kiss was, my first experience in the
lifestyle and Jay had somefriends come over and he had
told me previously she is anattention whore.
She likes the more BDSM becausethe attention's on her.
She's a wonderful person.
Like I love this woman insideand out.
(34:08):
And but he told me,'cause shegoes, she's.
Like the worst kisser.
Oh no.
And so here I am in my firstfoursome situation, and God, I
hope she's not listening tothis.
I'm horrible, but I do again, Ilove you.
But, and we're playing.
(34:30):
And so he stands up and I suckhis cock, and then she's sitting
on the sofa just laying there,just looking sexy.
I'm like, okay, well here I go.
I'm gonna dive in.
And I went to kiss her and itwas like kissing a toddler.
Like there was no movement, itwas just sort of lips pursed and
(34:51):
out.
And I sort of pulled back and Ilooked back at Jay and he just
looked at me like, mm-hmm.
I'm like, told so.
And then told our friends thesic swingers about that, and
they're devastated.
Devastated that, that was myfirst female again.
Oh.
Like, I'm so sorry I've made upfor it.
(35:12):
Said, yeah.
No, no, no.
I feel good.
But it was so, it was mememorable, let's put it that
way.
Okay.
Yeah.
What about the first time youwent down on a woman?
Polly (35:21):
I did that be not before ninth grade, a 9-year-old?
No.
Stop, Polly.
Elle (35:28):
No, I was 12
Polly (35:30):
in my adult.
No, I, I was, I was in myforties when I did that, and so
I hadn't kissed a woman yet, butI'd had an experience with a
very close friend of mine andanother man and she's the first
person that I went down on.
Okay.
Yeah.
And it was, awkward.
Sure.
Because she was my best friendand we were all drunk and it was
(35:52):
just a really weird experience.
Huh.
And it just wasn't great.
And I think it's just because Ididn't get the reaction that I
was expecting mm-hmm.
To get from it.
I don't know, I'm not sure Ieven went into it thinking about
a specific reaction, but it justwasn't what I thought it was
going to be.
So it just wasn't great.
(36:13):
I made up for it though.
Nikki (36:14):
Okay.
Elle (36:14):
Alright.
To take your word for it.
Yeah.
Nikki (36:17):
For me it was in college.
Mm-hmm.
So, like I said, you, you'reaway from home.
You can experiment all you wantand you have, freedom and
Elle (36:23):
well you grew up in Europe, right?
Yes.
Yeah.
Nikki (36:25):
Yes.
Elle (36:26):
So it's a little more, more free than Absolutely.
I would say in the US anyway.
Nikki (36:32):
Well, I, I guess, I don't know because I didn't go to
college here.
That's true.
So, but
Polly (36:36):
we're pretty damn oppressed here.
Yeah.
A little bit.
Nikki (36:39):
Yeah.
A little bit.
So in that sense, but for me,like I said, it was sort of a
start and go.
Mm-hmm.
Right.
It started and then here in theUS and then it was on hold for
quite a long time.
And then I did have anexperience with friends not
necessarily best friend, but youknow, it's kind of like the, the
people that you meet that youare hanging out with and then
(36:59):
it's like, oh, there's a sparkor there's not.
And I would say, really that.
It, it got going.
It was more in the lifestyle.
Elle (37:06):
Mm-hmm.
Nikki (37:07):
Right.
Because it, it might be during aswap or foursome or, if you have
threesome, whatever.
But the other thing, what Iwould like to say is that on
these dating apps for thelifestyle, everybody says I'm by
comfortable.
Mm-hmm.
I'm, I'm straight.
Well, exactly.
I'll touch
Elle (37:23):
boobs.
You can touch my boobs.
Maybe you can go down on me.
I'm not going down.
Nikki (37:27):
So, but, but that's why it's so funny because some
couples have I'm straight.
And then you have a Velociraptorin the room, and then the other
way around, somebody's backcomfortable and they won't even
kiss you.
Right.
So it it, it's such a wild arrayof what people like, or what
they're into
Elle (37:44):
or what they feel comfortable stating out there.
Yeah.
For the world to see.
Nikki (37:48):
But what we have noticed though, is that a lot of
couples.
The women aren't really that bi,even though they say they are.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
And, it's all good, I mean, thatdoesn't matter.
And so, for instance, I wouldsay I go down more on women than
they go down on me becausethey're kinda like, he,
Elle (38:05):
well, and I think, especially that first couple of
times, you're not confident inwhat you're doing.
You know, what you, what feelsgood to you, but I'm still not
confident
Polly (38:13):
in what I doing.
Oh,
Elle (38:13):
right.
And, and, and to go.
Down on a woman and, oh, I mean,the, the, the first time I came,
actually came, had a woman thatdidn't, you couldn't find her
clit.
I'm like, I couldn't find it.
And he's like, now, you knowwhat I feel like, but, you know
just, just getting that feel forhow they're reacting and what
seems to be working and, I thinkI've gotten better at it.
(38:35):
Me, but those first couple oftimes it was,
Nikki (38:37):
I feel it's the other way around because I'm kind of like.
Well, I know what it feels like,so I'll just do what I like.
Right.
And they seem to react to it'swhat And there you go.
Right.
It's, and I think that we're all
Polly (38:46):
different.
Like, we all like differentthings.
Yeah.
And so I know that I've hadinstances where I'm like, I'm
going to do to her what like, Ilike my husband to do.
Right.
It's a good start.
And I like it a little harder.
A little faster.
Right.
And this last woman that I waswith, she's like, slow down.
Elle (39:05):
Mm-hmm.
Polly (39:05):
And so I have to remember like it's.
It's what the other personlikes.
It's what they want.
It's not necessarily the waythat I like it,
Elle (39:14):
but they also have to be using their words.
They have to communicate.
They have to communicate.
So if they're not, and they'rejust tensing up.
Yeah.
You might mistake that for anorgasm, but it's not, and I
think that's it.
Like I don't want someone tobite my clip, my.
Clit is huge, and it's there andit probably looks pretty
biteable.
I don't want that.
I want, slow fat licks or, putthat finger inside me and
(39:36):
mm-hmm.
Come hither.
Mm-hmm.
You know, but not everybody doesthat or knows what to do, so
it's kind of up to me to letsomebody know, yeah, this is
what I want.
Yeah.
Nikki (39:47):
How about repeat play?
Like, Hmm.
Same night or no?
Well, same couple of courseanother time.
No, no, no.
I want more.
I guess I have to be morespecific.
Our ideal is you have, or youknow, 10 couples.
And you a rotation, youintermittently play with them.
(40:10):
Depending.
Yeah.
You know, so merry around.
It's like, yeah, this
Elle (40:13):
works.
We're good.
We have this rhythm.
And then the more you play withanother couple, we have a couple
like that.
We, the more we know each otherand we, the better we get.
Exactly.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Nikki (40:22):
And so that is one of those things.
How do you feel about that?
Is it like,'cause I'm also surethat some people are like one
and done Well also because it's,it, it keeps the emotions at
bay.
Yeah.
Right.
For sure.
Sure.
It, takes, that whole part of itcould get weird.
Out of the way.
Mm-hmm.
But for me, it's also kinda likethe first time when you play
with anybody, it's new, it'sdifferent.
You don't know.
(40:42):
It might be great, might bemedium, might be, and then the
second time it's absolutelyfabulous because, oh, I know
that if I do this, you're gonnago.
Yeah, exactly.
So, mm-hmm.
What, what are your thoughts onthat?
Elle (40:56):
Yeah.
No, I, I, 100%.
I think that when you find thosepeople that you connect with
mm-hmm.
Whether it's a single male or asingle female or a couple, and,
you do have to keep that levelof, the emotional mm-hmm.
Attachment off from it.
But, it's nice to have when youknow what you're gonna get,
there's so many times we'vegotten together with a couple
(41:17):
and I'm like, well, that wasmeh.
You know, for whatever reason,doesn't mean want anything
negative about them.
It just could be off night.
I could have been the math and Ijust didn't know.
But to have those people thatyou know, what you're getting
when you come back to it isreally nice.
Yeah, I do like having a few ofthose around.
Mm-hmm.
Polly (41:38):
Yeah, I would agree with you.
I mean, we only have one couplethat we've had repeat play with
and I love it because.
He's a ton of fun.
My husband and she really enjoyeach other.
To the point where the last timethat we played together, I
finally looked at him.
I'm like, could you please closethe door?
'cause all I can hear is hermaking noise, right?
Because I'm like, I know myhusband's doing his job and I
(41:59):
don't need to hear it.
So proud.
So proud.
You go, baby, I don't need tohear it.
There is definitely something,sexy and exciting and
exhilarating about that firsttime.
Oh yeah.
But I do know what you meanabout like knowing what you're
going to get and knowing, and Ithink.
I think that's part of thereason, like why my husband
might have such great sex is'cause I know what I'm gonna
(42:20):
get.
Yeah.
He knows what to do to turn meon.
And so the more you're withsomebody, the more they get to
understand you and your body.
Mm-hmm.
And how you move and how youreact.
And it definitely, I think,heightens the entire experience.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Good
Elle (42:34):
question though.
What about fears and anxietiesthat you have had or have
overcome or still have?
Polly (42:43):
Being found out?
Yeah.
Is probably the number one.
Yeah, that's a good one.
'cause nobody in our regularlife except one person knows
about that we're in thelifestyle.
So that's a really big fear.
And there's always gonna be someinsecurities and.
You worry like, is he gonna likeher better?
(43:03):
Like, is she gonna pleasure himbetter than I do?
He's always worried that, I'mgonna like, another guy's dick
more than his.
And I think that those thingsare part of, would've brought us
closer together knowing thatwhen we're together, there's
nothing like that sex.
Elle (43:21):
Yeah.
And
Polly (43:22):
there never will be.
Like, it's just makes youstronger.
Hands down, the best sex I'veever had in my life.
And, and it's because we havethat emotional bond and we can
talk to each other.
Mm-hmm.
And we can be vulnerable witheach other.
Mm-hmm.
And nobody else is gonna put upwith him.
So I don't think he's gonnaleave me.
Elle (43:37):
I'm thinking he feels the same, right?
I think so too.
What about you, Nikki?
Nikki (43:43):
Fear.
I don't know if I really haveany fears.
It's more, I think.
Some, some experiences are justbetter than others, but you kind
of forget the most obvious onein the room about being found
out or being judged for that.
Sure.
I don't know if it's necessarilythe being found out because if,
if they're cool with it, itdoesn't matter.
Right.
It's more the judgey, oh my God,I can't believe that.
(44:06):
Yeah.
Yeah.
But fears.
My, well, actually, one of myfears, and I don't fear, I don't
know fear is the right word, butit's what are we going to do 10
years from now?
Elle (44:18):
Oh, we talk about that.
You know, it's, it's like weonly have a few years in this
and, but, but it's kinda likewe're gonna be the 70 year olds
on the naked beaches.
Right.
And, but, but it talk about allthese things.
Nikki (44:27):
It's a thing of like.
Elle (44:29):
Oh
Nikki (44:29):
yeah.
As we get older.
As you get older, is there stilla couple that's interested in
us?
Yeah.
Are we interested in them?
Are we able to just are runaround the beach and fuck around
and whatever.
So it's not a fear, but it'smore one of those things like is
there a hard stop to thislifestyle?
Is it gonna just meander offinto the sunset until we decide
(44:51):
it's no longer fun?
Elle (44:53):
Yeah.
Nikki (44:53):
But there is that sense of like, well, I know it's
finite.
It's finite.
And also it's as you age, yourbody changes.
Mm-hmm.
Right.
Do you still wanna do it?
Elle (45:04):
Right?
I hope so too.
Well, yeah.
But you do, but you're, but you,like I said, I don't know if,
Nikki (45:07):
what if I'm 80?
I always use 80.
Right?
Like, does somebody want B whenI'm 80?
Mm-hmm.
I don't know.
So that definitely is part of mythought process.
Like also better have fun nowbecause it might be finite.
Polly (45:24):
I have to say that I have, one of the big surprises
to me since getting into thelifestyle is I don't feel like
there is a ton of ageism when itcomes to couple play, when it
comes to just women.
I definitely feel that.
So when we're at the club and,on all the online sites, there's
tons of people in their sixtiesinto their seventies Oh yeah.
(45:45):
On there.
Like, and they seem very activeand they're very happy and
they're doing it.
On the flip side of it, I'm partof a, a group for women only,
and I feel very, very old inthat group.
Nikki (45:55):
Interesting.
Polly (45:56):
And you know, I'm in my mid fifties.
I don't look it No, you don't.
I don't act it.
Nikki (46:00):
No.
Polly (46:00):
But I am.
And so I find it challenging tomake a connection with other.
Five women because we don't havea lot in common.
'cause most of the time there'sa 20 year age gap between me and
the rest of these women.
So in that instance, thatdefinitely plays into it.
Mm-hmm.
Like, when I go to one of theseevents with women, is anybody
(46:21):
gonna like me?
Is anybody gonna find meattractive?
Is anybody gonna wanna play withme?
Yeah.
Elle (46:26):
Mm-hmm.
Well, so we've been going forabout 50 minutes here this
second time around.
So I'm thinking that maybe weshould stop this and pick up, I
think there's a few more topicsthat we still could talk about
and get another one in so we canmake a, mm-hmm.
Part two are here.
So I do feel like today was justone giant ask me anything.
(46:50):
And I do wanna thank both of youfor joining me today and coming
along and, and bearing yoursouls for sure.
And I wanna take a moment andjust.
Reach out and thank everybodywho listens.
It's so cool to look at thestats after an episode and see
all the far reaching countries.
And please reach out to us atunapologetic swingers@gmail.com
(47:12):
and let us know how you foundus, what you like, and if
there's any topics you'd like usto cover.
We hope to have more sexyadventures to talk about in the
future and maybe even get somedetails about all of our
travels.
And by all means, leave us areview on whatever format you
listen to.
Tramp will be back on.
Well, maybe not the next episodesince we're gonna do a second
one here.
(47:32):
But in the following episodeafter he recovers from his
wonderful vacation.
Until next time, I'm al.
Be sexy,
Nikki (47:41):
be confident.
Polly (47:42):
Be unapologetic.
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