Uncanny Book Club Ep. 14 | X-Men #132 - 134

Join us for another episode of Uncanny Book Club and explore one of the most influential storytelling sagas in comic book history. 

In episode 14 we see the X-Men take a knee at Angel's remote home before charging into the Hellfire Club's birthday bash, the emergence of the Black Queen, a very angry Wolverine, a clash to the death (sorta) in the astral plane, and the reveal of Dark Phoenix!

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Uncanny Book Club is a biweekly read-along through Chris Claremont’s 16-year long X-Men run, which includes some of the most iconic X-Men stories. 

Whether you’re revisiting these stories, are reading it for the first time like us, or just want to ride along for the discussion — we hope you’ll join us every other Wednesday. 

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Episode Transcript

SPEAKER_00 (00:09):
Hello and welcome to Uncanny Butt Club.
I'm my dictators, Bill, andjoining me today is my co-host
Adam Ward.
Yo.
Hello.
Comic books, you know how it is.

SPEAKER_01 (00:23):
I feel like we've been building to these three
issues for a while now.
I mean, not that not even thatthese three issues are like the
culmination of the story.
Like, I feel like we're justkind of using this as a launch
pad into the next big thing.
And the next big thing is avery, very big thing.
It is a very big thing.
Yeah.
A very big thing that's been, Ithink, forced into being in

(00:48):
every X-Men movie and cinemaandor television or anything
related to the X-Men.
Um, and that is Dark Phoenix.

SPEAKER_00 (00:59):
Speaking of which, I watched the newest Dark Phoenix
movie just to be able to speakto it.
Yeah, and how was that?
I have not watched it.
It was a huge mistake.
I was by myself on a Friday.

(01:19):
My family was all gone.
It took me like two or threetries to make my way through it.

SPEAKER_01 (01:27):
Wow, that's not a good sign.

SPEAKER_00 (01:29):
Like, I got like 20 minutes in, I was like, uh, I'm
just not feeling this.
And then had to pick it up againlater.
There were some elements that Iwas like, hey, this is a good
change.
And then there was a lot ofelements where it seemed like
they really wanted to justborrow from X-Men 3, The Last
Stand.

(01:50):
And I felt like maybe weshouldn't or didn't need to do
that.

SPEAKER_01 (01:55):
Yeah, there seems to be a bit of hesitancy in
Hollywood specifically to trynew things with the X-Men.
Like even them talking aboutlike this, you know, forthcoming
reboot that we're gonna get fromDisney, they've really kind of
talked about how they want tobring in a new team that's young
and kind of like retell the samestory that we've already kind of

(02:19):
told repeatedly.
So I I like I think it's justlike I would almost prefer we're
stepping into an establishedteam, you know, kind of like
what we have what we have wherewe are now, right?
Like where Scott has establishedhimself as a leader, we don't
need Xavier anymore, we don'tneed his baggage and drama.
Like we can just we can just dostuff.

(02:40):
I actually really like this teamand would not be opposed to
seeing a version of this onscreen.
Like we've kind of seen theelements, right?
Like we've seen Nightcrawler,we've seen Scott and Gene and
Logan and Storm and like thosepeople have all been used, but I

(03:00):
don't know that we've reallyseen them in this capacity, and
I would love to see it.

SPEAKER_00 (03:05):
That would be interesting.
I am kind of thinking we'regonna see like a mixture of
these people.
Maybe I think they'll bringover, I assume, like Beast from
like the original X-Men, but Idon't really think we need Angel
or Iceman.
Sorry to Angel and Iceman.
And then they'll probably takelike a couple characters from

(03:27):
the like the 90s cartoon andjust mishmash all those teams
together and create like a thiswill be the the intro team that
we start with.

SPEAKER_01 (03:36):
Yeah, maybe.
I think we would very likely seesome, yeah, like some version of
like the X-Men's greatest hitsand less so of these um, you
know, side characters.

SPEAKER_00 (03:49):
What if we just jump straight into the middle of like
a really complicated Summersfamily tree situation with you
know cables in there?
We've got Rachel Summers, who islike their kid, sort of maybe
from like a different timelinekind of something something.
I mean, there's more likedifferent weird Summerses from
all over that they can pull in.

(04:11):
Just make it extra confusing forlike introducing it to new
audiences.

SPEAKER_01 (04:16):
I know there's like a lot of different ways that
they could probably go, evenfrom a story perspective.
I actually think something likethe Hellfire Club could be like
a very cool setup, right?
Like you have this secret cabalthat's kind of operating within
the public and nobody reallyknows about them, and they
somehow know the intricacies andthe weaknesses of the X-Men

(04:38):
without them really having anunderstanding as to how.
However, and I cannot stressthis enough, we cannot do like a
repeat of like let's just godown the well with Gene again.
Like, we need like I wouldn'teven be upset if Gene isn't even
involved, at least in like theinitial film.
Like if they're if they're likejust off and like we have

(05:00):
whatever our core team, blah,blah, blah.
Like, I think it needs to bemore of like a team movie rather
than kind of like what the otherfilms had had become where
they're latched on to Wolverineas like a main character, or
even the very first X-Men moviewas kind of like a it was a s it
was a story of Logan and andRogue, really.
Yeah.
And everybody else was just likean accompanying character with

(05:23):
like Gene Gray kind of thrown inthis love triangle between her
and Scott and Logan, which youknow obviously is an important
story thread that we've seen inthe comics and you know has been
a big part of the comic historyof the X-Men.
But I feel like that's a trapwaiting to happen, and it's
nothing new that we haven'tseen.
So like maybe you go with uhSinister, right?

(05:46):
Like maybe it's a Mr.
Sinister type of situation.

SPEAKER_00 (05:49):
And I hope it's over the top, more modern Sinister,
though, just like the reallygoofy, very evil and stuff
still, but just likeoutrageously himself.

SPEAKER_01 (06:01):
I mean, you could even go, I don't know, like an
ultimate X-Men route and dosomething totally crazy and
different.
That would be interesting.
I I don't I don't know.
We'll see what happens, anyways.

SPEAKER_00 (06:14):
We'll see.
Comics.
Usually we delay if we don'thave good stuff to talk about.
Sometimes we definitely havegood stuff to talk about, so I'm
not really sure why we went onthis tangent, but um, you know,
because of Dark Phoenix.
That's it's all tied together.
It's all connected.
It's it's all Fox's second DarkPhoenix movie's fault.

(06:38):
I will venture to watch it.
Um I wouldn't.

SPEAKER_01 (06:42):
Well, I mean, I just want now I need to know.

SPEAKER_00 (06:45):
Now I need to see it.
It's a bummer.
The thing about it that I likethe most is that it involved
going to space, and that's wherelike the Phoenix, you know, went
into Gene or whatever.
So like that part I appreciatedthat it actually involved space.
I thought that the setup thatthey did for like why they went

(07:05):
made sense to me.
I was like, okay, yeah, like ifyou're not gonna be doing like a
rescue mission, okay, we'rewe're we're getting off the
rails.
Issue 132.
In issue 132, we see the X-Menwisely decide against returning
home, instead seeking refugewith Warren Worthington III, or
Angel.

(07:26):
Scott discusses their recentattack by the White Queen and
Hellfire Club, and Warrenannounces that he inherited a
membership to the club andpoints Scott in their direction.
Scott and Gene have a romanticrendezvous where Gene removes
his visor and uses her powers tohold back his optic blasts.

(07:46):
We cut to a week later and seethe X-Men enacting a plan to
infiltrate the club during itsbirthday celebration.
Wolverine and Nightcrawler takethe sewers, with everyone else
being allowed to walk throughthe front.
Wolverine does a checkoff's gunby stripping the insulation off
power lines headed to the club,meaning that as the sewer water
rises, they will eventually leadto a surprise blackout.

(08:10):
We get to meet the rest of theHellfire inner circle and see
Donald Pierce, Harry Leland,Sebastian Shaw, and Wingard.
Wingard cuts in while Scott andGene are dancing and eventually
leads her upstairs.
Scott attempts to go after themand recognizes Jason without his
disguise as being Mastermind,the master of illusion.

(08:32):
It's too late though, as GeneGrey, transformed into the Black
Queen, emerges and blasts Scott.
Colossus and Storm hear hisscream and run upstairs, but are
confronted by Shaw, who absorbskinetic energy as his mutant
power and makes short work ofthem.
Wolverine and Nightcrawlerlikewise don't have much luck,

(08:53):
with the Cyborg Pierce capturingKurt, and Leland using his
gravitational powers to increaseWolverine's mass until he breaks
through the floor and is sweptaway by the sewer.
The Hellfire Club celebratetheir victory over the X-Men,
but Shaw grows paranoid aboutWingard supplanting him as the
club's chairman, now that he hasthe power of the Phoenix, and

(09:15):
tries to highlight that it was agroup effort.
We end the issue with a sickpanel of a very angry Wolverine
who did not perish as theHellfire Club thinks,
announcing, okay, suckers,you've taken your best shot.
Now it's my turn.
Our teaser for next issue isWolverine Alone, Nuff said.

(09:36):
I'm really happy actually.

SPEAKER_01 (09:38):
Let's just start with the ending scene because
this image of Logan likecrawling around in the sewer is
awesome.
I was so happy to see it.
And even the, you know, we'llget into this, but the opening
scenes of the following book,uh, the following issue are
probably the highlight of thatentire uh kind of middle issue

(10:01):
that we're going to be talkingabout.

SPEAKER_00 (10:03):
Yeah, I love this last panel.
Like if we were to make acollage of some of the standout
best single panels in this runso far, this would definitely,
you know, be in that top five,top ten sort of area.
It'd be included.

SPEAKER_01 (10:18):
Yeah, John Byrne is uh showing up for that um that
illustration that we see at thevery end.
He's just kind of showing off insome of these.
Yeah, there's actually anotherI'm I'm just gonna mention it
now rather than later, justbecause we're talking about
John.
But I made a note in issue 134,and we can kind of get more into
the nitty-gritty, but there'sanother panel in issue 134 that

(10:41):
is just so awesome.
And John did an incredible, likemasterful job at illustrating
it.

SPEAKER_00 (10:49):
And we we we can talk about it when we get there.
It's been a few days, so off thetop of my head, I don't know
which one you are referencing,and I am very looking forward to
uh seeing which one it is whenwe get to it.
Yeah, a little recap of it,yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (11:02):
So we get we get a bunch of character introductions
here.
Like we've kind of seen Shaw alittle bit.
You kind of went over this inthe intro, but I'm just gonna do
a bit of a like a level set onwho we're meeting and what they
can do.
Perfect.
Sounds great.
We meet Sebastian Shaw, he's youknow, the middleman of the
entire uh Hellfire Club, right?

(11:23):
Like he's the the chairman, ifyou will.
I think actually that is whathis position is, but he has a
very interesting power set thatisn't like really well
explained, at least initially,but his abilities allow him to
absorb kinetic energy in anyform they take.
So we see this confrontationbetween him and Colossus.

(11:45):
And I actually felt like thiswas a really strong showing of
Shaw as being uh a real forceagainst the X-Men.
Unfortunately, again, and I'mbeating a dead horse here.
Once again, Peter is justrelegated to being the butt of
the joke and how they basicallyshow off the strength.

(12:08):
Like we keep I understand thatlike Peter is a big uh
abominable force, right?
Like he's a big guy, his entirerepertoire strength, he's
supposed to be their heavyhitter.
Is he though?
Because like I feel as thoughthe other members of the team
hit even harder than he does.
Well, Storm and Gene bothhistorically, as we've seen,

(12:33):
have been the closers of most ofthe confrontations that they've
had.

SPEAKER_00 (12:37):
Yeah, I mean I would describe them as like the
heavies, and like he's more oflike he's like a heavy header in
terms of like he's their tank, Iguess.
If we're going to incorporatesome video game terms.
Yeah.
It's um The problem is hedoesn't use his head.
I don't think that's theproblem.

(12:57):
I think it's just the writingthat's the problem.
Well, maybe.
I think I I think a lot of itcan sort of be explained by, you
know, he's very much I mean,he's not very much the young one
of the group because they're notthat much older than him, but a
lot of times he's portrayed asbeing the young one.

(13:18):
And I feel like that sometimestranslates into him just going
into a situation withoutthinking and using his head.

SPEAKER_01 (13:27):
I I think what you're trying to hit at is he is
the least experienced comparedto the others.
Like when you kind of look athow they use their powers,
right?
Like we have Gene and Scott,they're original members,
they're very well trained in howto utilize their powers
appropriately.
We have Logan, who is older thanall of them, and is able to

(13:51):
utilize his powers appropriatelyand he knows what he can and
can't do.
We have Storm, who has beentrained long before joining the
X-Men to be a survivor and wasbasically bringing life to
these, you know, the thesedrought-stricken places in
Africa, and has demonstrated herabilities through many

(14:14):
confrontations.
And then you had Sean, who isobviously no longer with the
team, who was also an originalmember and incredibly powerful
and knowledgeable.
When you kind of look at it fromthat perspective, Peter, sorry,
I'm not including Nightcrawler.
Nightcrawler is also very wellexperienced with using his
powers and has gotten better atusing them, as we've seen,

(14:36):
right?
Like he can teleport with otherpeople, he can teleport while
falling appropriately.
Like he's been able to includehis powers, and we've seen that
actually illustrated in part ofhis development.
Whereas with Peter, we justhaven't gotten there.

SPEAKER_00 (14:54):
Those powers are mostly on off switch.
Flesh boy, metal boy, and then Ithink it's you know super
strength and like addedconstitution, but yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (15:04):
Well, I mean, still, as you said, like maybe it's a
development of uh being moretactful with those powers.
Maybe it's determining, youknow, when you're creating your
body to be more dense, likemaybe you're transforming
between his metal form and hisnon-metal form to increase his
speed and velocity, and thentransforming in and hitting

(15:26):
harder.
Like there's a bunch ofdifferent ways that you could
probably approach it.
But we've been promised thiskind of story thread many times
now where Peter is supposed tobe finding his place on the
team.
And so far, it has been prettymuch the same thing where Peter
just kind of gets his asskicked, and it's really to
showcase the power of thevillain or the antagonist or

(15:51):
whatever it might be in themoment.
In this case, it's Shaw, whojust takes Peter's hits like
they're absolutely nothing.
And unfortunately for Peter,like Shaw's powers are absorbing
kinetic energy, so he is reallya terrible matchup there.
But we've seen this with othervillains as well.
So maybe it's just a coincidencethat he is constantly being put

(16:13):
in this confrontation withenemies that are polar opposite
of him and are able to reallycounteract his strengths.
And I'm getting way off trackwith having having a level set
of the powers, but this is arant I needed to get off my
chest because I still feel likePeter hasn't had the moment to
really shine.
Yes, he defeated Proteus, andthat was wonderful to see, but

(16:37):
even then it was just kind oflike thrown in there, it felt
like it didn't really feel likeit was his story, like his his
culmination of finding hisplace.
And end of rant on Peter.
Tell me about this Donald Piercedude.
Yeah, Donald Pierce.

(16:58):
Cyborg, not like C3PO, but likepart man, part machine, all
evil.
Yeah, he's a bit of a racist.
He's very anti-mutant.

SPEAKER_00 (17:11):
It's a weird company for him to be keeping.

SPEAKER_01 (17:14):
It really is.
I did a bit of like looking intohis history, and I don't want to
like get too deep into itbecause it might come up again
down the road.
But like, let's just say he is acyborg with the self-professed
strength of the juggernaut ishow he kind of positions himself
and describes his powers even incombat.
And actually, once again, hegets into a fight with Colossus

(17:39):
where now you're getting aheadof yourself.

SPEAKER_00 (17:42):
He kind of wins up him again.
I know.
We'll get to that eventually.
But to be fair, he says power ofa juggernaut, not the
juggernaut.
I don't know if that was clearfor what you said.
I mean, is there any other butthe juggernaut?
I think it's a distinction.
I think it's just like uhlowercase J.
Yeah.
Well, it does look like it well,it's all uppercase letters, but

(18:04):
I think it's lowercasejuggernaut.

SPEAKER_01 (18:08):
The the lowercase juggernaut.
The last member we kind of getintroduced to here is Harry
Leland, and I think he kind hehas one of the more interesting
of the three powers because likeShaw's isn't very visual.
Pierce is a cyborg, not amutant, who cares?

SPEAKER_02 (18:24):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (18:24):
You have Leland, who is this big kind of chonky dude,
like he's very hefty.
He's a unit.
And his powers is to increasethe mass of an object or a
person, making it extremelyheavy.
Which is a little one-sided.
It would it would be more maybea little more interesting if he
could lighten things as well.

(18:46):
Maybe he can, and he's only doneit the one way, or we just
haven't seen it the other way.
Fun seeing him take out Loganthe way he did, and even Logan
seemed a little stressed by thesituation.
I I feel like we've kind of seenthis play out a couple different
times uh over the last number ofissues.

(19:06):
In the first issue, most ofthese, they have some sort of
confrontation with the villain.
The villain gets up gets theupper hand because the X-Men's
unfamiliar with them.
Then we kind of have some stuffthat happens in the middle just
to kind of like keep the ballrolling down until we get to the
third issue where the X-Men havekind of learned from their
mistakes and are able toovercome them in some way,

(19:27):
shape, or form.

SPEAKER_00 (19:28):
I have some notes on that and how we're getting ahead
of ourselves, but I appreciatedhow in 134 they didn't
necessarily have that, and theX-Men easily triumph over
everyone.
There was some McGuffin stuffhappening, though.
I'll I'll I'll save, I'll saveit, I'll save it.

SPEAKER_01 (19:49):
Anywho, that's our power set.
Mysteriously, no white queen, noEmma Frost.

SPEAKER_00 (19:56):
She is presumed dead?
I don't remember which issue inone of these.
Yeah, because she goestoe-to-toe with Gene, right?
Yeah.
And I didn't get this at allfrom the previous issues, but in
one of these it makes mentionthat she preferred like suicide

(20:16):
to capture, and it alluded tolike she killed herself with you
know sending that last ditchpsychic attack, and I didn't get
that at all.
No, neither did I from readingit.
So I think that's sort of justuh they were trying to be like,
oh, she's not coming back, butuh she does.

(20:37):
Trying to make it make sense,sure.
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (20:39):
Well, it was a real shame not seeing her, I will
say, regardless.
I I felt like Sebastian Shaw wasuh was a highlight of this
issue.
Very cool seeing him reallydominate, even like this scene
of him dominating Storm incombat, and we kind of get this
final scene of him just draggingher by the cape after beating

(21:00):
both her and Colossus, and thenjust throws her on the pile of
X-Men.
Yeah.
So, anyways, I felt like thatwas a very strong showing by
Shaw, and I think really kind ofsets him up to be a power player
in the future.
So I was I was happy to seethat.

SPEAKER_00 (21:15):
So, Mastermind, we finally have our identity of uh
Wingard revealed.
My knowledge of him is mostlyjust this story, and then you
know, some spoilery things downthe line.
I know he shows up in Krakoa fora little bit, but I don't really
have a whole lot to say abouthim.
I assume he must have came up atsome point during the previous

(21:39):
run of the comics.
But apart from him, maybe evenin spite of him, the Hellfire
Inner Circle, and you've alreadysort of covered this already.
I think it's a pretty cool powerset for the group of villains.
I like that we get a little bitof variety.
You know, we have the illusiondude, whatever, but then we have
the people that are actuallyparticipating in the fight, I

(22:00):
guess.
You know, Leland, as youmentioned, has a cool power.
Pierce is a robot, Shaw has acool power.
If Emmer were here, she is acool power.
It's uh it's a good cabal ofmutants to and a and a robot for
them to be fighting.
It's a good little an enemygroup that they've assembled.
I'm very happy with it.

SPEAKER_01 (22:20):
Yeah, I think it would have been nice to see, I
don't know, more of a flex fromsome of the other members.
Yeah, they did get the upperhand in this issue, but maybe it
would have been cool to see moreof like Pierce's abilities as a
cyborg.
We don't really get much ofthat.

SPEAKER_00 (22:36):
Um It was mostly just I'm okay with you tearing
off my arm.
Yeah.
It was I imagine that's kind ofhow he sounds.
Kripes, you're a flamin' robot.
Uh Wolverine.

SPEAKER_01 (22:54):
It was it was it was fun also seeing that like this
group is not well tinkered,right?
Like this group has its owninner politics that's kind of
playing out.
We see them having uh a bit of apower struggle between Shaw and

(23:17):
Wingard, where Wingard reallywants to now take over, and Shaw
isn't a fool and sees this.
And that was kind of a coolacknowledgement to kind of see
play out, like even though likewe're it's like we're trying to
advance a story that isn't gonnahappen.

SPEAKER_00 (23:33):
Yeah, I mean, over these few issues, we kind of
have a little bit of a minorpolitical intrigue sort of
storyline going on with them.
It is nice to have a group ofvillains where Shaw is kind of
the leader, but not in the senseof it's one leader bossing
around a bunch of underlings.
It's a group of people who willall probably be willing to

(23:56):
backstab each other to raisetheir raise themselves up in the
group.

SPEAKER_01 (24:02):
Yeah, and I think that really gives it a very
different dynamic than some ofthe other confrontations and
groups that we've seen, right?
Like a lot of the other kind ofvillains we've seen the X-Mant
one doing.
Yeah, they've just they'vereally just kind of had them be
one guy and a bunch ofunderlings who go off and do

(24:23):
their thing.
So it's it's nice to see a bitof internal conflict happening.
And I think if we would haveseen this play out over several
issues, maybe it would have madeit more impactful.
Maybe if we had seen this kindof uh inner monologue from Shaw
take place in like a coupleissues ago, like maybe even

(24:44):
during the Proteus arc or evenduring the last three books, uh,
you know, where we get theconflict between the X-Men and
Emma Frost and them findingKitty and all this other stuff,
who we do not see at all, by theway.

SPEAKER_00 (24:58):
Um, she's at school.
Is she?
The Hellfire the Hell Yes, theHellfire Club is no place for a
teenager.
I wasn't even I wasn't eventhinking that, but like, you
know, we see I mean she's notgoing to Xavier school yet.
She's just like in school.
Well, regardless.

(25:20):
Her family's deciding on whichprivate school to send her to,
the Emma Frost one or the Xavierone.

SPEAKER_01 (25:26):
The dead lady or the not dead dead man, I guess.

SPEAKER_00 (25:31):
Not yet.

SPEAKER_01 (25:32):
Spoilers, holy.
Dies like eight times.
Are they an X-Men?
They've probably died.
RAP.
That's just the truth.
Speaking of Kitty Pride, though,in this kind of opening sequence
we get with um this privateconversation that Scott's trying
to have with Warren, I just wanthad a couple of uh of notes that

(25:55):
I kind of felt were a bitinteresting.
We see Scott again reallyshowing why he's the leader of
the X-Men, right?
Like he's anticipated that theX-Mansion's been compromised in
some way.
They think there might be somesort of mole on the team.
Like he's really trying tofigure out why the Hellfire Club

(26:16):
had this one-up on them and howthey know so much about the
X-Men.
And he really tries to removethem off the board, right?
Like he's taking the X-Men offthe playing field.
We're gonna go someplace wherethey very likely do not have
access to us in some way, andAngel really provided that
opportunity.
So I felt like Scott did afantastic job.

(26:37):
Yet again, Scott, number oneleader, screw Charles Xavier.
Hell yeah.
We also see this interactionwhere Scott is talking about
Kitty and like kind of recantingwhat had happened over the last
couple of issues, right?
Like the Hellfire called got theone up on us while Charles and a

(26:58):
bunch of my X-Men colleagueswere off in, you know, wherever
they were, Philadelphia, right?
Chicago, Chicago.
Chicago.
And he refers this stuck out tome.
He refers to Kitty as aneo-mutant.

SPEAKER_00 (27:12):
They did that in those initial issues with Kitty
and Dazzler, too, I think.

SPEAKER_01 (27:17):
So that got me thinking
difference between a mutant anda neo-mutant?
Do you have any indication?
Do you have an idea?

SPEAKER_00 (27:25):
I thought about looking it up and decided that I
didn't care enough and that Iwas just gonna assume it meant
like a newly emerging power setfor a mutant.
You are on the money, man.

SPEAKER_01 (27:40):
That is exactly what it means.

SPEAKER_00 (27:41):
It it is glad I saved myself 15 seconds.

SPEAKER_01 (27:44):
It is uh it is a reference to a newly emerged
mutant whose powers have onlyrecently manifested.

SPEAKER_00 (27:51):
I'm okay with them dropping that term in the uh
newer runs of X-Men.

SPEAKER_01 (27:57):
And there's a good reason for that, actually,
because Chris uh Claremontactually does a story later on
that happens in the 90s wherethere is like a whole story
involving like a species ofmutants or people or something
called the Neos or somethingalong those lines.

(28:18):
So that the term kind of getspulled into a different
direction to mean somethingelse.

SPEAKER_00 (28:24):
You know, there's even a better reason for why it
gets dropped.
Because it's a bad, bad wordingfor it.
I was gonna say no more mutants,they don't have to worry about
neo-mutants if uh no newmutants.
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (28:37):
Yeah, too true.
I wanted to provide that claritybecause I was curious what it
meant, but clearly I'm justdumb, and you and probably other
people figured this out already.
Context clues.
One thing I did kind of feelirritated by was this Gene
coming up and being like, hey,you guys have been up here for

(28:58):
hours.
You've been up here talking forhours.
And it's like, what?
They just got here.
Someone mentioned my name.
Yeah, it made me feel like, oh,like, did Gene just manifest
this idea that they've beenthere for hours?

SPEAKER_00 (29:12):
Because it like reading the issue did not give
me that sort of uh Well, youknow, they probably talked about
whatever stuff first.
Hey, are you on the page rightnow where they're like, hey,
you've been up here for hours?
I'm not, but I can be.
There's something wrong withAngel's shirt.
Is it the back?
Yeah.
Yeah.

(29:32):
It's very it's an open it's anopen back.
I don't understand how it works.
Did they I don't want to spendtime in this.
Also, speaking of Angel, whatwas the deal with the kiss
between Warren and Gene?
Maybe that's how they kissed inthe eighties with um uh friends.

(29:54):
They're not gonna be like, Well,he's always been like he's been
like uh well, he's rich, so Whenyou're rich, you act European.
Like Emma Frost.
Yeah, you're sophisticated.
Yeah, he's sophisticated, so hekisses on the mouth.
Like uh I thought it was weird.

SPEAKER_01 (30:11):
Didn't they do that on Family Feud back in the 70s
and 80s?
Wasn't that like what the hostdid?
Kiss people on the mouth?
Probably.
It's weird, man.
I don't know.
It's rich people stuff.
Yeah, rich people stuff.
Aside from like the kind of chatthat they have, it felt like
Angel is just interjected herefor no real reason.
Maybe maybe it'll come up againin Dark Phoenix.

(30:32):
Like there's this.

SPEAKER_00 (30:34):
I think it's a nice way to incorporate his character
just as like a little check-in,hang out with him.
Scott needs someone completelyremoved from his current team
that he can bounce these ideasoff of.
Just because, like you said,there could be a mole, so he's
got to discuss it with someoneoutside the situation.

(30:54):
So he comes to someone he grewup with.
With a soft accusation in theregiven uh And with a sick house
in the middle of nowhere wherethe enemies can't track them.

SPEAKER_01 (31:06):
Unless Angel is the enemy within, but he said he's
not, so we'll take that for thetruth that it is.
Although weird, because like Imean, like, yes, the X-Men get
kind of caught.
Like, they are able to seethrough their really terrible
disguises the second they walkin through the door.
But wouldn't Shaw and all theother kind of inner circle

(31:29):
members be aware that Warren isa former X-Men and that he would
have access to the club in somecapacity?
Maybe that's how they knew wherethey were gonna come, but they
seem surprised.

SPEAKER_00 (31:40):
They might not know, because the I feel like the
original X-Men was like a littleless public.
So they probably don'tnecessarily know his secret
identity, possibly.
And he inherited the membership.
He's only gone there once.
Or so he said.
So he says, maybe he's the mole.
He's could be the mole.

(32:01):
I mean, we know it's cerebro,but it could be him.
He could be the molecularWarhawk.

SPEAKER_01 (32:10):
Overall, I thought it was a pretty fun issue.
Definitely.
Seeing this confrontation withHellfire that we've kind of been
building towards, seeing Genekind of become the black queen.
That it was a lot of fun.
I really liked it.
Um it was uh it set things up tokind of fall into place and
takes all the pieces that havekind of been laid out in front

(32:32):
of us over the last couple ofissues and gives us the some
sort of payoff at least, likethis confrontation finally.
We get to see Sebastian Shawlike kick everybody's ass just
being topless and like greentights and a sash belt.
So yeah, the sick bow in hishair.
Yeah, man.
I'm digging Shaw.
What can I say?

(32:52):
Emma's not here anymore.

SPEAKER_00 (32:54):
I gotta support somebody, and I'm standing Shaw.
His powers are kineticabsorption and capitalism.
Just like uh any properaristocrat.
I agree with you.
Great issue.
It's a good teeing us up forwhat's to come.

SPEAKER_01 (33:10):
Yeah, which is starts on a high note.

SPEAKER_00 (33:12):
Which is Wolverine Alone.
That's what it says.
Why don't you hit us with theWolverine Alone synopsis?
Issue 133 starts withWolverine's solo mission to
infiltrate and rescue the otherX-Men.
He defeats a number of Hellfiregoons more brutally than he
probably would have if the otherX-Men were around.

(33:34):
We see the Hellfire inner circlegloating over their victory, and
see what Jean, now the BlackQueen, sees when she looks at
her teammates.
We get a brief flashback to whenJean held back Scott's optic
blasts and learned that the twoestablished a permanent psychic
rapport.
We take a quick break from NewYork to hang with Sean and

(33:56):
Moira.
Sean is enjoying the retiredlife, but Moira is full of worry
over the latest gene scans thatCharles sent her.
She notes to Sean thatsomething, or someone, has
removed nearly all of thepsychic circuit breakers that
Gene's mind established.
Speaking of psychic rapports, wealso learn that Xavier has been

(34:18):
unable to re-establish the onehe previously had with the
X-Men.
Charles also confides in Angelthat he resented seeing Scott
lead the X-Men and recognizesthat he's made some mistakes.
Wolverine makes his way to themain party area, but is soon
surrounded by weirdos andbarrister wigs who beat on him

(34:38):
with clubs.
Scott attempts to reach Genepsychically, but loses a duel in
the astral plane to Mastermind.
The issue ends with Mastermindstabbing Scott seemingly
fatally, as Nightcrawler notesthat Scott isn't moving or
breathing.
Well, in fairness, he he full onsays he's he's dead.

SPEAKER_01 (34:58):
But not dead dead.
I mean, you don't know that.
Okay, well, you do know thatbecause you know what happens in
the next issue, but they didn'tknow that.
Maybe, maybe, maybe, maybe.
Oh my gosh.
I just looked at the panel againof Logan and the sewer.
Man.
Sungry dude.
It really lived up to it.
Like, frankly, I the whole Logansubplot that we kind of get in

(35:21):
this issue is phenomenal.
It it makes it the only truething that I really absolutely
loved.
I could have had an entire bookof Logan just trying to
infiltrate the Hellfire Club,slowly taking enemies out.
But I will take what we gotbecause we get a lot of

(35:43):
brutality from Logan.
We see him take enemies out inways that we know we wouldn't
get if he was surrounded byScott, especially.
But we get an awesome scenewhere he takes out a couple
different goons, and there's oneleft, and he's holding this gun

(36:03):
and he's pointing it at Logan,and Logan is just like smirking
at him, and he's he he he'sholding up his hands and he's
welcoming the goon to take himon, and he says something to the
other one.
I'm gonna get like, hey, I knowwhat you're thinking here.
You know, I'm hurt, he's fivemeters away from me.
I got a full clip of ammo, I cantake him.

(36:25):
And he and the guy just likedrops the gun and then Logan
dashes and takes him out.
But it's it's a such a funnysequence, like this guy just
totally acknowledging that Ican't beat Logan.
I cannot beat this Wolverineguy.

SPEAKER_00 (36:40):
No.
Uh on the subject of that, Ithink this might be the first
usage of the words doing what hedoes best.
We get that in like the secondpage.
Uh Wolverine never stops, neverslows, each move blending into
the next in a frighteningdisplay of destruction.

(37:01):
He's doing what he does best andhaving the time of his life.
He really is having fun.
Yeah, he really is on his face.

SPEAKER_01 (37:11):
Even the end scene with Logan getting like taking
on these how did you describethem?
Goons.
Goons, hellfire.

SPEAKER_00 (37:21):
Oh, the weird barristers and wigs.
Yeah, yeah, with like Billyclubs, or weirdos and barrister
wigs with clubs, yeah.
That was one of the oddestchoices.
It feels on brand, but it'sstill odd.
It I I felt appropriate for theHellfire Club.

SPEAKER_01 (37:38):
They kind of have that motif that we see, like
even the inner circle kind ofaddresses like that, like a
British aristocrat.
And so I I I guess they expectthe staff to embody a similar
18th century sort of 16thcentury appeal.
I don't even know what centurythat would be.

(37:59):
This is all to say.
I really, really love theWolverine stuff.
I thought it was great.
Everything else, eh.
I thought it was okay.
I I wasn't a huge fan of thejumping around that kind of
happens in this issue where weget this like interlude is
almost like how it's like Ithink maybe that is the
interlude that we get.
We get two of them, which I justdon't like because it's we're

(38:21):
like interjecting this into themiddle of a of the story, and
it's like I get that likeCharles is kind of like
reflecting on his failures andacknowledging that like he was
jealous of Scott and that he'sbeen trained.
Which I think we're happy about.

SPEAKER_00 (38:37):
It is nice to see that acknowledged of him being
like, Yeah, I kinda suck, andyeah, that's on me.

SPEAKER_01 (38:46):
Because he does suck.
He should go back to space andwe should just forget about him.
Maybe he will die soon and Iwill have my wish.
R.I.P.
Charles.
R.I.P.
Charles.
I felt like it was fine, like interms of like the scene itself
was like a nice acknowledgement,but it just felt like it was
thrown in.
Yeah.
Um, and similar, like at leastthe Moira situation made a

(39:09):
little bit more sense toinclude.
It's like a foreshadowing.
Yeah, exactly.
And and even like I don't evenknow if it's foreshadowing,
really, because we've knowneverything she has said, right?
Like, yeah.
Maybe it's spelling it out alittle bit more clear, like
Jason is something could be forthe people that just jumped in
this issue.

SPEAKER_00 (39:29):
Very possible.
Didn't didn't read the previousones, or just to like, you know,
kind of look into the camera andwaggle your eyebrows a little
bit.
Like, remember.
Yeah, remember everyone.
Remember what's going on.
You saw it in the last issue.

SPEAKER_01 (39:44):
It was kind of talked about in this one.

SPEAKER_00 (39:47):
It is nice uh just to see Sean enjoying his
retirement, yeah, earned life ofrunning around in a sweatsuit
and scarf and asking Moira ifshe wants to fool around.
He's a bit cheeky with her, uh,which I appreciate because
that's uh good couple goals.

SPEAKER_01 (40:03):
And they are uh in the uh the Europe, so they are
allowed to be cheeky.
What do they say?
It's like 500 meters or 500miles from the Arctic Circle or
something like that.
It's like where they're located.
Man, that would be freezing.
It's a weird way to just sayScotland.

SPEAKER_00 (40:21):
Yeah, yeah.
I I mean it's on a remoteisland, so it's not on the
mainland.
All of 500 miles below theArctic Circle.
I think they just want to letAmericans know that it's brisk.
It be cold.
That's why he has the scarf.

SPEAKER_01 (40:36):
Was there anything else that you really liked about
this issue?
Uh I I guess like the Scott andGene stuff, this like psychic
rapport and kind of seeingconfine in one another.

SPEAKER_00 (40:48):
Yeah, but like it made more sense than like the
other two.
I liked them going back to thewhole like, you know, getting,
you know, it it kind of feelsweird after the fact, but it
felt like a good detail to moveto this issue versus the last
one, which already had a lotgoing on.
And it didn't necessarily feellike a, oh, this is how we'll

(41:12):
like you, we wrote ourselvesinto a corner.
It felt a more planned.
I like the plan.
I didn't really dig the wholeastral plane fight necessarily.
And I think the word that youused either earlier before we
started to record or in like atext was that the second issue

(41:34):
kind of meanders.
Yeah.
Overall it was sort of fine, butI mean, I don't have like a ton
of notes.
It kind of it really like, likeyou said, does jump around quite
a bit to just like everythingeverywhere.
Not a whole lot happens, itdoesn't move things forward that
much.

SPEAKER_01 (41:54):
No, it kind of keeps us like in the same gear a
little bit.
Like we have the Hellfire Clubkind of rejoicing in their
splendors, and then kind of likejust, hey everybody, remember
this?

SPEAKER_00 (42:06):
R it might be the same goblet of wine that Shaw
has now from the first issue.
It's impossible to say.

SPEAKER_01 (42:14):
I did like the detail of them putting like this
quartz mask on Scott.
Well, they know all theirpowers, they know what to do.
And I've I've I've thought ofthis in the past.
I don't know that we've reallydiscussed it, but like sometimes
I just feel like Scott and someof the other X-Men, like the

(42:36):
villains, and maybe it is justlike, oh well, they just don't
know.
But we've seen like a coupleinstances where, especially
earlier on, where Scott uses hisoptic beams because it's just
like not something they accountfor, even like them.
Them taking Storm's like lockpicks away in this issue, and

(42:56):
that kind of became a plotpoint.
It was really fun seeing thisentire this entire quartz helmet
on top of Scott.

SPEAKER_00 (43:05):
I think the smartest thing about it is that it stops
him from being able to talkwithout.
Because then he can't he can'tgive direction to any of the
other team, he can't try tocommunicate with Gene that way.
He's sort of just locked away,you know.
They know he's the tactical mindbehind everything, just keep him

(43:25):
isolated, and yet not isolatedenough, right?

SPEAKER_01 (43:29):
Imagine if they just removed him from the room
entirely, right?
Like they Or cut his head off.
Well, well, they make a pointthat they don't want to kill
them, right?
They wanna do some sinisterlevel stuff of like eugenics of
making Mr.

SPEAKER_00 (43:47):
Sinister eugenics?
Genetics?
Essex-Men.
In issue 134.
We quickly see that Scott didnot, in fact, die in the
previous issue.
Wolverine has somehow managed toescape the dog pile of clubs and
breaks through the door to wherethe X-Men and Hellfire inner
circle are.

(44:08):
Mastermind commands Gene to takecare of Wolverine, but we also
see her unlock Scott'seye-blocking helmet while
everyone is looking atWolverine.
It turns out that seeing Scottalmost die in the astral plane
is what was able to break herfree from Mastermind's control.
Scott is free, blasts Pierce,frees the remaining X-Men, and

(44:29):
blasts Leland over a balconyinto the party below.
Scott knows that he can't blastShaw, so he destroys the floor
beneath him instead.
Cyclops directs Peter to take onPierce and Storm and
Nightcrawler to go after Shaw,with him going after Mastermind.
We see Wolverine diving downtoward Leland, who makes the
mistake of using his power ofmass instinctively, and then we

(44:54):
see an even heavier Wolverinecrash on top of Leland and they
crash through the floor.
Beast is hanging out at theAvengers mansion when he sees an
alert that the X-Men are on arampage.
He decides not to alert theAvengers and proceeds alone.
Pierce is able to escapeColossus and meets up with Shaw,

(45:14):
who likewise was able to escapehis fight.
Mastermind causes a panicupstairs with his powers, but we
then see Wolverine's checkoff'sgunfire and the power goes out.
Wolverine then shows up byScott, who asks what happened to
Leland.
Wolverine only replies, Don'task.
Gene confronts Mastermind, andwe learn he was only able to go

(45:39):
beyond his illusions intopsychic manipulation due to a
device that Emma had built forhim.
In a rage, Gene expands his mindso that it touches the entire
universe.
His brain breaks, and Gene saysthat he won't be coming back
from his trip.
She keeps her dirty doings fromScott's mind, and the team flees

(46:00):
the club.
It seems the X-Men have escapedscot-free when they hear a
threat from Gene and turndramatically to see her
declaring, No longer am I thewoman you knew.
I am fire and life incarnate.
Now and forever, I am Phoenix.
The issue ends with the teaserof next, Dark Phoenix.

(46:23):
Bump bump.
Um not the movie to be clear.

SPEAKER_01 (46:37):
Like we end the last issue, right?
Scott's on the floor.
We have Nightcrawler exclaimingthat Cyclops is dead, and then
immediately resolve this on thefirst page.
That's just like comics in thisera, though.
It's just like, could youimagine like I would have loved,
okay?
I would have loved for this.

(46:58):
They they could have kept thisin, like, they could have ha
made it happen, but imagine theimpact that this would have had
on the team.
Imagine the emotional impacteven more on Gene that would
have unlocked this like psychic,you know, uh hold that Wingard
has on her.
It it would have just had somuch more heart and and value to

(47:21):
readers to see Scott like isstill alive.
It's maybe they move his bodyout of the room, maybe he just
comes too later on, whatever itis.

SPEAKER_00 (47:31):
And I'm um so you're suggesting that a team of people
embarrassed or wigs should havepicked him up and like escorted
him out of the room wheneveryone thought he was dead.
Sure.
Like whatever it might be.
At first, I thought you werearguing that Scott should have
died here.

SPEAKER_01 (47:47):
No, no, no, no, no.
Like, I think it's fine that hedidn't.
That's a bold call.
No, no, no, no, no.
I think it just would have beenmore impactful if they didn't
reveal that he was alive on thefirst page.

SPEAKER_00 (47:58):
Yeah.
I think that's just like uh aclassic pitfall of a lot of
comics of this era of like he'sdead, and then you start with
like, or is he JK.

SPEAKER_01 (48:09):
I, you know, the way we're reading this, right?
And we've talked about this abit before, right?
We're consuming this in a waythat it wasn't originally meant
to be consumed, which is all atonce.
But when you think about aniPad, when you think about this
being released a month afterseeing that final scene of Scott
being dead or proclaimed to bedead, and then you pick up this

(48:31):
book being like, Oh my god, Ineed to find out what happened.
And like you open the first pageand he's like, Oh, he's fine.

SPEAKER_00 (48:37):
I think most people probably assumed he would be
fine.
I'm a little surprised it'simmediately he's just on his
knee.
He's like, It's all right, team,I'm back in the game.
Versus maybe he gets stuck inthe astro plane and they need
to, you know, Gene breaks freeand has to save him, or
Professor X feels his fake deathand knows he's stuck and has to

(49:03):
intervene and save him, and thenhe's able to re-establish his
rapport that he's been missing,blah, blah, blah.
They felt like other routes wecould have went with it versus
just I'm good.

SPEAKER_01 (49:13):
And that's really all I'm alluding to here.
It just felt like it could havebeen more meaningful.
Like you you could have kept thebait and switch, right?
Like that, that's fine.
I don't think Scott should havedied here.
But to just give it more meaningwhen we throw that around, I

(49:34):
think would be better.
Especially at this point,because it's not like you know,
a lot of characters are dying.
It like the you know, the ruleof resurrection is hasn't really
been a thing yet.
It's been years since theykilled Thunderbird at this
point.
Exactly, right?
And we saw that impact thatplayed out over several issues.

(49:54):
And I and I think like thereason that we have this
developed Scott that we havetoday is largely because he lost
Thunderbird in that fight.
So there you go.
There's my two cents.
I I feel like it just could havebeen better.
Like, you know.

SPEAKER_00 (50:09):
On the opposite side of that coin, this guy kind of
kicks ass once he's freed, huh?
He really uh just takes controlof that situation really fast.
Yeah, he really does.

SPEAKER_01 (50:21):
He is able, and I mean, like, it speaks to how
serious of a threat the HellfireClip took it.
The only reason that their plansfell apart was because, you
know, Wingard lost control ofGene and Gene was able to dude
had one job to undo the tinylock that they put on his
helmet.

SPEAKER_00 (50:40):
It's so cute.
It's like the kind of lock thatyou find on uh on a children's
diary.
Yeah, it is, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (50:48):
Like the kind of thing you could just like smash
open with a hammer.
Yeah.
I'm trying to find the page, uh,and this isn't necessarily for
inclusion, but I must havemissed it.
Like, do you know where in hereit is explained that it's Gene,
like this, like seeing Scott diein the astral plane?

SPEAKER_00 (51:07):
I think it's when she's creepily confronting him.
Confronting a wing guard?
Yeah.
Uh yeah, so it's you made amistake, Jason.
You slew the man I loved beforemy eyes.
Instead of severing my lastconnection with the X-Men, that
acted like a bucket of ice waterin my face.

(51:27):
Okay, yeah.
These are some crazy are thesethe panels that you're alluding
to from earlier?
Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (51:35):
The panel that I want to bring to your attention.
It's not it, it's a couple pagesafter where Gene like I do love
the illustration of likeWolverine in the dark with Scott
and Gene monot like menacinglyapproaching Jason.
The menacing is really good.
It's and the dark one is goodtoo.

(51:55):
Like it's it's all very cool.
Even this like little scene atthe bottom where she is, you
know, telling him like insteadof enslaving me forever, you
shocked me awake and you set mefree, and your power is nothing.
Like, that is a really coolscene, but that is not the one I
want to draw to your attention.
We see I think I figured it outnow.
We see Gene unleash, like trulyunleash her powers.

(52:19):
Like, this is probably themoment where Gene stops being
Gene and becomes Dark Phoenix,right?
We've never truly seen Gene useher powers this way.
Like, even this like zoom in onJason's eye to illustrate this
fear that he's experiencing.
And then on the next page, wehave this awesome John Byrne

(52:42):
special of like his his astralbody kind of being illustrated
with these whites as like thegalaxy is kind of like
positioned behind the silhouetteof Jason as he is like having a
manic episode and like galaxiesare exploding or stars are

(53:03):
exploding.
It's awesome.
I love it.

SPEAKER_00 (53:05):
It's a crazy panel.
That's some crazy trippy art.
That must have taken forever.
It really must have takenforever.

SPEAKER_01 (53:13):
And good on the color is too for filling that
in, because that must have beena real pain in the ass.
Yeah.
And speaking of cool art, uh, Ialso just want to quickly
mention the cover of this issueis also awesome.
We get this image of the twodifferent sides, right?

(53:34):
The Hellfire on one side, we getthe X-Men on the other.
In the middle, we see Gene andthis big phoenix in the
backdrop, which I have many,many times and will always
continue to stand this.
But anytime you want to give methat phoenix in the backdrop,
I'll I love it.
I eat it up, man.

SPEAKER_00 (53:54):
It's so good.
We've seen this cover before.
Like the one that I think of iswhen they're on the spaceship
fighting the Sentinels that arefake X-Men.
And it's like X-Men versusX-Men, new team versus old team,
blah, blah, blah.
This one is a way better versionof that.
The blacks and the reds and thePhoenix backdrop, like you said,

(54:15):
it's a very cool cover.
It's easy for Wolverine to get alittle lost though, because he's
so small.

SPEAKER_01 (54:22):
I I'll I'll even say too, I I don't know that I see
the Hellfire Club on the right.

SPEAKER_00 (54:28):
Like um, I can see how that's Shaw.
Um apart from that.
Really?
I don't see how that's Shaw.
But I mean, he kind of lookslike Shaw mixed with Mo from The
Simpsons, but oh, and I guesslike the smallest one or the one

(54:49):
in the way back is Jason, Isuppose.
Yeah, I think that's Jason, andthen it's uh I was my mind was
trying to see Pierce there, andit was like, that's not
happening.
No, Lee Leland's in the middle.
He's got that big beard.

SPEAKER_01 (55:01):
A great big bushy beard.
Yeah, you're right though.
That Logan does kind of blend inwith uh between Scott and
Colossus there, but regardless,it's an awesome cover, and
you're right.
We have seen this kind of many,many times over at this point of
uh, you know, whatever, duelingsides clashing.
Very cool though.

(55:21):
I I really, really love thiscover.

SPEAKER_00 (55:23):
Super awesome.
One of my favorite parts of thisbook, and I don't know if this
is a normal thing or if youdon't think it were if you
really liked this part.
I love the whole Wolverine andLeland situation.
I think it's a really fun way toresolve their fight versus just
like, oh, you know, one of themtriumphed over the other.

(55:44):
It's more, you know, this guy'snot experienced in combat,
probably.
He's a fancy aristocrat.
You know, other people do hisfighting for him.
So he acts instinctively, hemakes Wolverine very heavy,
Wolverine falls down on him, andthen the whole like Scott
saying, What happened to Leland?
And Wolverine's just don't ask.

(56:07):
I feel like there's a lot leftup for interpretation there.
Did Wolverine kill him?
Did he get so heavy that hesquashed him like a bug and it
was really gross?
There's a lot of, you know, whatexactly happened here?
And I think it's really fun toread that don't ask in different

(56:28):
ways and interpret it indifferent ways, and kind of
headcanon my way into likecontinuing that that side story.

SPEAKER_01 (56:37):
I mean, it would have been a really cool scene to
maybe play, but yeah, I agree.
I think the leaving it up toyour imagination probably does
it better than having it laidout, right?
Like sometimes less is more, andthis is a good example of that.

SPEAKER_00 (56:53):
Earlier we had talked about, you know, whether
or not this was that instanceof, you know, X-Men fall to the
enemy, they learn their lessons,they triumph over the enemy.
And I had made the argument thatthat didn't necessarily happen
here.
And I'm sticking to it becauseShaw does escape Kurt and Storm.

(57:14):
I think at a certain point itkind of seems like he I think he
could have triumphed.
Like he could have won thisfight, but is more like, ah, I'm
I gotta run away.
I don't want to deal with, youknow, whatever, or you know, who
knows, the Phoenix comes downthere.
But I mean, I think he stillkind of, you know, he escapes
them.

(57:34):
Uh Colossus kind of has anotherreally low moment, I suppose.
Like yeah, getting shocked inthe face.
Yeah, he just gets electrocutedin the eyes and blinded for like
a second, and then Pierce isgone.

SPEAKER_01 (57:48):
I think to your point, like Shaw does make
actually uh mention to that,right?
Like he escapes and runs intoPierce, and Pierce almost seems
a little taken aback by how calmhe is.
And he's just like, Yeah, thisisn't my first time facing
failure.
Like, we'll regroup and we'llcome back and learn from our

(58:11):
mistakes.
Like it's a very tactful retreatrather than, you know, I'll get
you next time.
Which is kind of more uh likeMeg Meter motif, I think.
You know, like that's more ofthe role that he plays.
Like, I'll get you next time,X-Men.
You'll see.
I'm up here on my asteroid.

SPEAKER_00 (58:32):
There's different degrees to how villains react to
losing to the X-Men.
There's, you know, Shaw's, eh,we'll get them next time.
We're gonna learn from this.
There's Magneto's mustachetwirling, I'm gonna get you next
time, I'll murder you.
And then there's Arcade who'slike, eh, and just launches
everybody away in like a ball.

(58:53):
He's like, I stopped caringabout this.

SPEAKER_01 (58:56):
This is stupid.
I'm gonna go make another murderamusement park somewhere else
with other heroes and blackjackand hookers.
You'll see.
I felt overall the three booksfor me.
I originally wrote an eight outof ten, but honestly, discussing
them with you, I'm gonna lowerthat score.
I I would give this like a sevenout of ten.

(59:17):
The middle book and some of themeandering that happens
throughout all three takes meout a little bit at times.
And there's a lot I liked.
The Logan stuff I liked, theintroduction of the Hellfire
Club I liked, um, the setup forDark Phoenix that we get at the
end, I like.
So I'll be very good setup.

(59:38):
I'll be kind of curious like howI feel after we read the Dark
Phoenix books, because I thinkthat would provide a little bit
of context as to like where arewe going?
What is about to happen?
Like, how is what we've justread playing into the bigger
story?
So, not that I'm ever gonna goback and revise this, but.

(01:00:00):
I think for me, I'll give itlike a seven out of ten.
It was like pretty solid.
There's a lot I liked.
I liked a lot of the art that wesaw.
Mm-hmm.
Like it was a solid story, butyeah, seven out of ten for me.

SPEAKER_00 (01:00:13):
Yeah.
I mean, numbers-wise, I'mprobably more in that like seven
and a half to eight area.
You know, I think we we do seethat very kind of typical start
great, dips down, gets betterpattern that we've seen a lot
with certain arcs.
But I mean, like, I feel like,you know, sometimes the

(01:00:34):
conversation just naturallyveers into like a nitpiggy sort
of area.
Yeah, that's fair.
And comparing like these threeto like spending a couple of
issues with arcade.
I think we're just getting kindof spoiled at this point of like
they've been the last severalissues have just been like all
hits, basically.

(01:00:54):
Even the even like the lowpoints are still like a step up
of like where we were like acouple years ago or something
like that, in my opinion.

SPEAKER_01 (01:01:04):
That's actually a very good point.
And I think consideringconsidering I'm changing my
score again of going back to aneight.
And the reason we're justgetting spoiled.
We are getting spoiled.
And when you you're right, whenyou look at the bigger picture,
these issues all stand out asbeing fantastic.
I think where our nitpickingcomes in is it's a lot of the

(01:01:26):
same issues that we just kind ofsee rolled over, rolled over,
rolled over, rolled over.
And that kind of makes thosesmall problems seem so much
bigger.
The meandering that we've talkeda lot about is a very good
example of that.
And I think at this point, whenwe see it taking place because
of how we're consuming this, itfeels way worse.

(01:01:48):
It just feels like a consistentproblem that stands out to us
because we're reading these atyou know, three to four issues
at a time.

SPEAKER_00 (01:01:56):
And so And to be fair, like the entire Proteus
arc was so like well constructedand tight, like there was no
meandering.
Yeah.
And not everything can just bethat like it just felt extremely
well planned and outlined andexecuted.

SPEAKER_01 (01:02:15):
You're 100% correct.
And I'm not even trying tocompare these to Proteus, you
know, I don't know that that's avery fair comparison.
Um, or at least like I, youknow, for me, as I stated
before, that was like a 10 outof 10 or 9 out of 10 or whatever
is like practically perfect.
It's you're right.
I in in like your assessmentthat I do think we tend to

(01:02:36):
nitpick, but I I think that'slike by nature of being, you
know, kind of reviewing thesebooks through a critical lens,
but we also highlight a lot ofthe things that we're gonna do.
That's what you do withsomething you like.

SPEAKER_00 (01:02:46):
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah.
Um, and I'm gonna kind of Ithink that's part of our
personalities to, you know, ifwe enjoy something, part of us
does want to pick at it a littlebit.
And I think that's you know,part of our just how we've done
things over the years, uh likereviewed video games and things

(01:03:07):
like that.
Yeah, you gotta dig in and justpick at it.

SPEAKER_01 (01:03:11):
I mean, yeah, you gotta pick at it, but like I I
think it's fair to be critical,especially when it's the same
things we're being criticalabout, right?
Like we're not like we're we'repointing out the same mistake,
and it's a mistake to us,obviously it's subjective, but
we wanna see things move alongand see improvements in the

(01:03:32):
spaces where we're seeing itfalter, and it's just hasn't
happened yet.
Like it, you know, like andyou're right, when we look at
the big picture, right?
Like from where we started tonow, it's it's like we're
reading an entirely differentbook by an entirely different
creative team, and the storyoverall is very enjoyable.
So there you go.

(01:03:52):
Eight out of ten, revised,revised, revised final scene.

SPEAKER_00 (01:03:57):
Didn't you say like a few minutes ago that you
weren't gonna go back andrevise?

SPEAKER_01 (01:04:02):
I did.
I was I was referring to goingback after we finished Dark
Phoenix and revising my scorebecause I was I was determined
to stick with a seven out often.
But given our conversation onthe critical, I am going, I'm
gonna go back to an eight out often because that's what I wrote
down before.

SPEAKER_00 (01:04:21):
And as we've already discussed, it's my words against
me.

SPEAKER_01 (01:04:25):
As we've already discussed, sometimes you just
have to pick C because that'sthe number or the letter that
you want to go with.

SPEAKER_00 (01:04:31):
Always pick C.
That does it for this episode ofUncanny Book Club.
Thanks for listening, and wehope to see you next episode
where we'll discuss issues 135and 136.
Go watch the Dark Phoenix moviebecause I will.
Don't do it.
Okay.
Bye everyone.
Thanks for tuning in to thisepisode of Uncanny Book Club.

(01:04:52):
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