October 29, 2025 • 43 mins
Join us for another episode of Uncanny Book Club and explore one of the most influential storytelling sagas in comic book history.
Episode 15 is all Dark Phoenix Saga! We see the X-Men confront Jean/Dark Phoenix, some space travel, some space atrocities, Gary Grey, the power of love, and it's all wrapped up in a way that the movies really, really are unable to capture.
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Uncanny Book Club is a biweekly read-along through Chris Claremont’s 16-year long X-Men run, which includes some of the most iconic X-Men stories.
Whether you’re revisiting these stories, are reading it for the first time like us, or just want to ride along for the discussion — we hope you’ll join us every other Wednesday.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_01 (00:09):
Hello and welcome to Uncanny Book Club.
I'm Isaac Vader Trio, andjoining me today is my co-host
Adam Ward.
Hello.
I still have not watched thatX-Men Phoenix, dark Phoenix
movie.
SPEAKER_02 (00:23):
Is that what it was?
SPEAKER_01 (00:24):
I was wondering.
Uh I think so, yeah.
Yeah, I still haven't watchedit.
That's okay.
Maybe you're just saving thatfor when we wrap things up with
the next episode.
Yeah, we'll see.
We'll see.
You probably might have a fewbetter things you could do with
your time.
SPEAKER_02 (00:44):
I mean, now that I've at least read uh a bulk of
the story, I can at least gointo the movie with a proper
critique of how it plays out.
I definitely saw the shades ofX-Men X3, whatever that movie
was.
The third X- Original X-Men.
The last stand.
Last Stand, that was it.
(01:04):
Thank you.
I definitely could see wherethey got the inspiration for
some of the scenes that happenedin that film.
I don't think we actually seeGene like go full Dark Phoenix,
like at all, or even Phoenix.
She was just kind of She's justevil.
I think she was just beingtalking about the movie?
Yeah, yeah.
In the m in the movie, she wasbeing exploited by Magneto,
(01:27):
basically.
SPEAKER_01 (01:28):
Yeah.
I, you know, when I wasreflecting on this and making
notes, I was thinking back and Iwas like, man, I do not remember
what happens in that movie.
Like there's the beginning, shekills Scott.
There's that scene where likeMagneto and Professor X are
there, and then I think Xavierdies for reasons or something.
(01:51):
And then, you know, he likelocked away parts of her brain
and powers and stuff like that.
And then I remember the end whenLogan stabs her with his claws.
Well, you definitely remember alot more of that movie than I
do.
I mean, I I don't remember theentire middle.
Like I remember like the first10 minutes and the last three
(02:13):
minutes.
I didn't even remember that shekilled Scott.
Yeah, he's like missing from theentire movie.
It's it's a weird death, too.
You don't like see it.
It happens semi-off screen, andI think it's just like a big
flash of light, and maybesomebody goes back to where it
is, and all that's left of himis a visor.
(02:33):
I'm not sure.
Imagine making an X-Men storywithout Cyclops.
Feels like a sin.
Imagine making this specificstory without Cyclops.
SPEAKER_02 (02:43):
Yeah, they're definitely, you know, pulling
probably elements from Logan'sand Scott's stories and kind of
just melding them together andthrowing Cyclops to the side.
Like that's essentially kind oflike at least part of what
happens, you know?
Although it doesn't play out thesame way as it as it does in the
movie, as it does in the book.
(03:05):
Which I think is for the better.
I actually really, reallyenjoyed these two issues we're
gonna talk about.
I very good.
I'm a little nervous aboutwhat's gonna come after this,
because I feel like what kind ofhappens in these two issues
together is excellent.
SPEAKER_01 (03:26):
Like I think you could put it up there with
Proteus.
I think that's fair andaccurate.
And I think generally I thinkthat's kind of the the top shelf
stuff.
It's yeah, yeah, it's not a hottake.
SPEAKER_02 (03:39):
It it is the take.
SPEAKER_01 (03:41):
Well, to just to make sure we don't spend too
much time lingering on a coupleof maybe bad movies, should we
uh just get into it then?
SPEAKER_02 (03:51):
Yeah, I think so, because this is a treat that
these this is I didn't know whatI was expecting based off the
terrible experiences from thefilms, given that has kind of
been my true experience with thestory mixed in, I guess.
Like I think it was covered inthe animated show, but I could
not so I think that's actuallyprobably where I saw the
(04:13):
majority of this likepre-reading.
Obviously, being aware of thecharacters and the general
concept, like you know, she goescrazy.
But this was so much morecomplex, it was so much deeper
between the characterinteractions, the you know, some
(04:35):
of the characters who were kindof coming back into this story
to provide like assistance, likewe see Hank, we see Charles come
back, I think in a very moremeaningful way.
In a very Charles Xavier way,based on the version of Charles
that we've seen in these issues.
SPEAKER_01 (04:54):
Yeah, I'm interested in hearing some of your takes
about Charles and issue 136, butwe'll get there.
We'll get there.
SPEAKER_02 (05:01):
Yeah, so why why don't you kind of give us the
scene set here?
Because there's kind of a lot ofuh story for us to go through.
SPEAKER_01 (05:08):
Issue 135, we are greeted with the text Witness
the Birth of a God.
Dark Phoenix immediately beginsfighting the X-Men, who are
outclassed and holding back dueto not wanting to hurt Gene.
We get to meet Senator MarkKelly, a presidential candidate,
who is meeting with his oldfriend Shaw in the aftermath of
(05:32):
the supposed X-Men rampage inhis club.
The police tell Senator Kellythat they aren't equipped to
deal with mutants, and Shawslyly suggests that Sentinels
may be a better long-term play,and one that is under the
control of the federalgovernment.
Meanwhile, the outburst ofPhoenix's power is noticed by
(05:52):
the Fantastic Four, Spider-Man,Doctor Strange, and the Silver
Surfer.
Beast arrives just in time tosee Phoenix leaving Earth, and
we see a Wii chat betweenProfessor X and Moira regarding
Phoenix and the power readingsthat they're getting.
Phoenix does a little bit ofspace travel, opens a Stargate,
(06:14):
and goes to a whole new solarsystem, and in her hunger for
power, decides to consume anentire sun, exterminating 5
billion people on a nearbyplanet.
This act is witnessed by thestrongest ship in the Shiar
fleet, which engages Phoenix inbattle while hailing Lilandra.
(06:35):
Lilandra ends up recognizingboth Jean and Phoenix, and after
the ship is destroyed, she saysto summon her ministers, the
threat must be dealt with onceand for all, no matter the cost.
We then jump back to the X-Menwho are bumming around the
X-Mansion's kitchen, having asoothing kappa besides Logan,
(06:56):
who pops a beer, and they're allkind of contemplating what went
down.
They're worrying about Scott,who is sort of just not talking
or responding to anything andjust sitting there.
But in the final pages, he jerksto his senses and announces that
he can sense Phoenix returningto Earth and that she's hungry.
(07:17):
I think we need to start withthe cover.
Yes, I think that's very fair.
I think looking at and a littlebit of a spoilers for the next
issue, I think it's fair to saythat 135 and 136 are some of, if
not the most iconic, X-Mencovers, and maybe some of the
most iconic in comics just ingeneral.
SPEAKER_02 (07:40):
Yeah, certainly 135, like this whole front page look
that they're giving Gene, youknow, crushing the uh the
X-Men's uh title, that has beenredrawn many, many times over
and over with other charactersin some shape or form.
SPEAKER_01 (08:00):
Overall, awesome, like so awesome.
It's very attention getting.
Like you would notice that onthe uh on the shelf of a comic
store.
SPEAKER_02 (08:09):
Yeah, I uh agree 100%.
You know, they've really done,and I've complimented some of
this in the past, but thecolorist is just nailing the
depth and I think flavor of someof the characters, like looking
at this costume for DarkPhoenix, like just the kind of
like black and red sort ofoutlining that they did, um,
(08:33):
with like the golden Phoenixemblem and the belt swishing in
the air.
It's just an awesome, it justlooks awesome.
SPEAKER_01 (08:42):
And a crazy look on her face.
That is a feature of a lot ofart panels uh throughout these
this story, though.
Yeah.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (08:51):
There was a lot of fun, you know, you could tell uh
fun panels where you could seethat John was having a lot of
fun, probably like depictingthis pretty intense fight
between the X-Men and Gene.
There's like a scene where Ithink it's near the end of the
fight, where Gene's now kind oftaken out all of the X-Men and
(09:14):
kind of incapacitated them, andshe's just like standing there
with like her arms raised to thesky and her hair is like you
know, in the wind.
It looks great.
It's she's uh she's summoningsome lightning.
Yeah, it's uh just awesome, andthen even later on, there's like
the a lot of big Phoenix artthat was you know really
(09:36):
delicate and descriptive.
And then of course we get likethe space scenes that are just
so awesome.
SPEAKER_01 (09:43):
I love it.
They are very good.
And obviously, art is like avery good uh discussion point
for an audio-only podcast, but Imean, we really do have to call
it out because it's justexcellent.
And not even while we're talkingabout like the space stuff, not
you know, it's not even just theart of her, you know, consuming
(10:05):
the star, it exploding,destroying the I I believe we
learned later it's uh calledDabari, the planet.
Like the descriptions that theywrote alongside it is also very
good.
And I've been critical about youknow, moments where you know
we're leaning too heavy intoexposition, but yeah, I found it
all just very interesting andjust really it really helps to
(10:30):
paint more of like a personalpicture of what people
experienced on like the planet.
And I I love the kind of detailsthat Chris goes into about like,
you know, here's what happenedon the side of the planet that
was facing the star.
Here's you know, the people onthe other side experienced the
craziest Aurora Borealis, andthen they all died.
SPEAKER_02 (10:52):
Yeah, even the you know, kind of the horror that
you end up seeing too on some ofthe faces as they're kind of
facing Phoenix in this likespace battle is just like very
illustrative of the neededemotion kind of in this
conflict.
It really raised the stakes andmade this more than just an
(11:14):
X-Men story on Earth.
And I like that that's kind ofwhere I'm very curious what's
gonna happen next after thesetwo issues.
Um, because we have this big,you know, uh space element that
really tie kind of ties thesestories that we've had ongoing
now for several issues withLalandra and you know, back home
(11:35):
now, she's the Empress.
Charles has kind of left herside, but like that's kind of
been like this lingering threadthat's out there, and to see
kind of Chris pulling it here tokind of tie this Phoenix story
back to where it all started,you know, when Jean had the
interaction with Lalandra andher brother the first time.
(11:57):
So it's it's kind of a nicepuzzle that's been all put
together, and Chris did a nicejob leaving it all, for sure.
SPEAKER_01 (12:04):
One of the things I was a little surprised to see,
and I think over the pastseveral issues, we've just been
kind of getting a lot of bigcharacters or important
characters thrown into the mix,even if it is just a quick view
of them.
Uh, we got Senator Kelly in thisone.
Big character making his firstappearance.
(12:24):
Yeah, I wasn't sure if this washis first or not.
SPEAKER_02 (12:27):
I had to go actually and look that up because I was
immediately.
I only just assumed.
Uh it was.
Yeah.
No, no, yeah, it is.
Yeah, a huge X-Men antagonist.
And to see the mention of theSentinel program by Shaw is like
a nice thread of probably what'sto come.
Mm-hmm.
I'm assuming.
(12:47):
And I I imagine that's kind ofwhere Kitty's gonna kind of come
back into the fold.
SPEAKER_01 (12:52):
Sure.
I did kind of make a note thatyou know, the Dark Phoenix saga
is such an incredibly pivotalmoment in X-Men history.
And even though it's less of afocus of this specific issue,
Shaw suggesting Sentinels toSenator Kelly story-wise, is
also just crazy impactful aboutyou know the cascading effects
(13:16):
that lead from thatconversation.
SPEAKER_02 (13:19):
I don't know that I ever knew it was Shaw that kind
of laid the breadcrumbs, so tospeak.
But like obviously we know thatthe Sentinels have existed to
this point.
It's not like it's uhnecessarily an original idea by
Shaw, but I don't know that Iever tied him to the origins of
Kelly, nor Kelly's exposure tokind of like being the face of
(13:43):
the Sentinel program.
A fun little note, right?
Like I'm I'm happy that we'rekind of seeing Chris uh push
forward.
It'll be interesting to seewhere things go from here.
I was curious what your thoughtswere about like that first fight
that we kind of see unfoldbetween Gene and the X-Men.
You know, there was a lot ofmoments where there was
(14:05):
hesitation, I think, to likereally take her at face value
and at the power level that shewas kind of presenting herself
at.
Like they were pulling theirpunches, right?
They didn't want to hurt Gene.
Do you think that fight wouldhave gone differently had they
went all in?
SPEAKER_01 (14:21):
No, not really.
Um, I and I think part of thereason is I don't think we can
assume Scott would go all in,even if the others did.
I don't I mean, does he doanything really in this fight?
I don't remember him doing much,if anything.
But I mean, no.
I think it's really just ademonstration of how much power
(14:45):
she's amassed at this point.
And we see just some interestingthings happening too, where
previously a lot of what we'veseen of Gene is like, oh, she's
super powerful, but it seemslike you know, this whole
Phoenix business is really justlike amplifying her existing
power set.
Whereas at the beginning ofhere, we have a wild interaction
(15:08):
where Gene untransforms Colossusand then also turns a tree that
he's carrying into gold.
So we're kind of dipping ourtoes into more of that reality
warping sort of power set.
Yeah.
I think at times maybe it's beenexplained as her TK is so
(15:30):
powerful that she's likereorganizing like the atoms and
molecules, but I I have no idea.
SPEAKER_02 (15:37):
I thought the inclusion of the Fantastic Four
and the Avengers and uh DoctorStrange and Spider-Man, like
really kind of amped up thestakes here.
Like this is getting therecognition of all of the big
players on Earth, but alsoSilver Surfer who is off planet
someplace.
(15:58):
And I'm I'm hoping that we seehim show up.
Like that was kind of theimplication, right?
SPEAKER_01 (16:03):
I I mean a little bit.
He he says, can it be?
I sense a kindred soul.
She is human, flawed, and thatflawed bids fair to destroy her.
I must aid her if I can.
A child of the stars, so likethe Silver Surfer, and yet not
like me at all.
Maybe this is just meant to bean advertisement for Silver
(16:25):
Surfer, like that panel.
It's kind of just like a heyman, remember this uh character
exists?
Maybe buy some comics.
I mean, you could be correct.
SPEAKER_02 (16:35):
We could also conceivably see him, given the
fact that we are heading intowhat I can only assume is a
confrontation in space, or atleast Gene is held accountable
for destroying an entire planet.
I both enjoyed like I bothenjoyed that.
Like, I think it really providedGene with the the gravity needed
(17:01):
to be this massive threat toeverything.
But then to have her kind ofcome back to Earth seemed a
little out of left field.
Like, why go all the way out tothis random planet?
And unless it's just Gene kindof feeling, I guess, like uh
sentimental, or she wanted to goand close the book on seeing her
family, which I have a lot ofopinions about because yeah, I
(17:24):
mean, well, we'll get there.
Well, we'll get there in issueuh 136.
That whole interaction likereally made me not like Gene's
father.
SPEAKER_01 (17:33):
But we'll get there.
We'll get there.
Super fair.
Yeah.
I like that it's just sort ofbrushed off after two.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (17:42):
Maybe that's they're just uh that's just how he is.
Gary.
I think that's his name.
I actually don't know.
Gary Gray?
That sounds like an awful name.
SPEAKER_01 (17:50):
That does sound pretty bad.
Gary Gray.
Gary Gary is used quitefrequently for superheroes, but
Gary Gray just sounds and feelsbad coming out of the mouth.
Uh her father is John Gray,which No, we're gonna we're
(18:11):
gonna call him Gary the rest ofthis episode for sure.
Yeah, Gary Gray.
SPEAKER_02 (18:16):
Anywho, that was it.
Um, I th I felt like there was alot of nice um character
interactions, especially in thatearly fight, you know, really
seeing Storm show uh someleadership and kind of trying to
give the X-Men like a like aminute to catch their breath,
given that, you know, theirplane has exploded and they're
(18:39):
now like falling out of the sky.
SPEAKER_01 (18:41):
I do love that Kurt made a quick thing about that.
Oknine, not another aircraftdestroyed.
I love that it's always him thatmakes these little notes.
He's uh the meta breaker.
He's like Spider-Man.
He's just keeping count of likehow much cash they've wasted.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (19:01):
But yeah, I I felt like the Storm, I think amongst
the characters, like Storm playsa very important role as like
this sister figure with Gene,which we kind of see especially
touched upon in the next issue.
But even her approach and a lotof the approach by the X-Men,
like really came from a place oflove, like really trying to
(19:23):
reason with Phoenix and try to,I guess, like can talk Jean out
of whatever's happening to her,which they obviously don't
really truly understand.
So I I I really liked kind ofthis picture that we're getting
between Gene's chosen family andher legitimate family.
SPEAKER_01 (19:44):
I think that might be most of what I have.
So if you want, we can gothrough the 136 plot and then we
can talk a little bit more abouther legitimate family, Gary
Gray.
SPEAKER_02 (19:56):
Yeah, I think the only other thing that I just
want to mention is again thescene of Gene destroying the sun
and absorbing it and how it islaid out and the descriptions of
how this scene is unfolding.
It was super cinematic.
I really hate that I feel likeif I do watch this movie, not
(20:17):
exist.
I'm assuming it is it thishappens.
Do you want to know?
Yeah, I want to know.
Does that happen in the movie?
No, no, dude.
It is like made for a movie or aTV show or something.
Like it's it's literally shotfor shot cinematic.
SPEAKER_01 (20:32):
It's too much uh budget to to make it make a make
a um play it and explode it.
It's more that this eventoccurs, but it's not Gene that
does it.
It's the Phoenix that does it,and it's before the movie
starts.
And there's a few Dabari peoplewho are the bad guys in the
(20:54):
movie, and they're trying to getGene to give them the Phoenix
power.
Wow, that sounds so it's a weirdrepurposing of what's there.
That is so awful.
What the hell?
They're plant people.
They're plant people?
These, so the Dabari people,this is in my notes for next
(21:15):
issue, but they are, I think, inan official guide or something
like that, or I I tried to dolike a slight amount of research
on it, but the Dabari are calledasparagus people.
That's like their intergalacticslang term that people call
them.
Huh.
Are you trying to look at whatthey look like?
(21:35):
I mean, I am trying to find it,yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (21:38):
Okay, okay, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Um, I don't know that Inecessarily got that from the
art in the book at least.
SPEAKER_01 (21:44):
It must be the official like tie-in book that
really explains it when theycall them asparagus people.
SPEAKER_02 (21:51):
Well, I mean, looking at the panel as it's
drawn, like, I don't see plantpeople.
Like, they just kind of looklike they have fluffy hair.
Aliens.
Yeah.
My I mean, literally, my note inthe next issue is goddamn, do
they make some ugly aliens inthe in these books?
SPEAKER_01 (22:09):
They're just absolutely terrible to look at.
Between the Dabari and the andthe Shiar, it's it's rough out
there.
SPEAKER_02 (22:16):
Well, the Shiar and all of the even the council
species that are included justare so hideous.
SPEAKER_01 (22:26):
Issue 136 starts us off with a menacing reimagining
of the Phoenix destroying thestar, and we see Lalandra
briefing her ministers.
We also see the presidentcalling the Avengers mansion.
I rate that there isn't anAvenger on standby to answer.
Poor Jarvis worries about whathappened to Beast.
(22:48):
Speaking of Beast, he's buildinga cool contraption to try and
lock down the Phoenix's powerwhile Peter, Logan, and Kurt
train in the danger room.
Phoenix returns home to Earth inthe middle of the night, and
then home home to her parents'house, and we see her experience
a lot of inner turmoil.
(23:08):
It seems Jean Grey is still inthere after all.
Her parents and sister all comedown to talk to her.
They're worried.
Dark Phoenix comes out a bit andchanges a plant into crystals,
and her dad exclaims, Who areyou?
What are you?
In heaven's name, what do youwant from us?
You're not mine, not any part ofme.
(23:29):
I deny you, I cast you out.
It's very dramatic.
Phoenix notices it's getting alittle misty outside and heads
out to confront Storm, but issurprised by Kurt teleporting
Beast's device onto her head.
The X-Men begin fighting her.
Unfortunately, her powers aren'tcompletely locked down, but they
(23:49):
are reduced.
Wolverine notices that everyoneis still holding back, and he
jumps in to do what needs to bedone.
But right before he strikes,Jean comes back to herself and
begs him to finish her.
He hesitates just for a moment,and Phoenix removes the
scrambler.
This is when Scott appears.
(24:10):
Phoenix is eager to fight him,but Scott says that she can
essentially kill him if shewants to.
He's not gonna fight back oranything like that.
Instead, he points out howPhoenix could have killed all of
them at any time and hasn't yet.
Why?
He points out that Gene Grey'slove for the X-Men led her to
sacrificing herself.
Love for him led to herresurrection, and love for the
(24:33):
whole universe almost caused herdeath a second time, when she
saved all of reality.
He says, quote, your existence,your very creation springs from
love, from the noblest emotionsa human can obtain.
And now you want to deny that?
To deny yourself?
It seems like he's reallygetting through to her.
When from out of nowhere, arogue Professor X slides in and
(24:55):
mind blasts her.
The two engage in a mentalbattle, but Professor X is able
to install more permanentpsionic circuit breakers.
He thanks Gene as he notes thathe would have lost the fight if
not for her helping internally.
Uh, I think we essentially haveto read a little bit word for
word here too, but Scott scoopsher up saying, Gene, she's so
(25:18):
still, I'm not even sure she'salive.
I want her to live, but what ifshe hasn't changed?
What if she's still DarkPhoenix?
I'll love her just the same.
For better, worse, richer,poorer, sickness, health, till
death do us part.
Gene awakens and says it soundslike Scott has just proposed.
(25:39):
He asks what she says to that,and Gene says yes, with the two
embracing, officially fiancés, Iguess.
It's looking like a happy endingwith the X-Men and her family,
when suddenly the X-Men all glowand are spirited away to parts
unknown, probably space.
But we'll have to wait for thenext issue, the fate of the
(26:02):
Phoenix.
Yeah, what's Gary Jean think?
Gary Gray.
Gary Gray.
Not Gary Jean.
SPEAKER_02 (26:12):
Yeah, Gary Gray.
Standing there aloof.
I don't know.
The X-Men seemed as surprised aswe were.
Dude, I do not like do not likeGary Gray.
It's the the whole interactionbetween him and Gene.
I actually felt how thisstarted, the interaction was
(26:32):
actually, I think, what youwould expect in a situation like
that, right?
Like it's understandable thather parents, while trying to
show their love and concern forGene, still felt afraid of her.
I think that's a very naturalway of dealing with that
situation to see somebody youlove appear uh in the middle of
(26:54):
the night at your house, dressedstrange.
Seemingly without a reason.
Seemingly without a reason, witha crazy look in your eyes.
Yeah, you know, like they'reconcerned and they love you, and
they're, you know, hoping thatyou don't do something crazy.
That you're not on meth.
But then, you know, thingsobviously escalate as you know,
(27:15):
the Phoenix is really kind ofpreying on Jean's uh
vulnerabilities and faults andprobing deeper, and I think
trying to make a mountain out ofa molehill of how her parents
are reacting.
And then we kind of see theentire situation just go off the
rails as she starts kind of likeacting out and trying to
(27:36):
demonstrate her power.
We see her like create like thiscrystal, you know, with the with
just the thought of her hands.
And honestly, like the whole waythat the father was just
suddenly like, you know what?
Yeah, who are you?
And it goes berserk.
SPEAKER_01 (27:52):
What are you in heaven's name?
Yeah.
I deny the it's a little much.
You are not mine.
SPEAKER_02 (28:00):
And and even seeing Gene having like the thought
bubble, like her initial thoughtbubble was dad, no, please.
SPEAKER_01 (28:09):
And then what she says is, watch your tone with
me, old man.
You dance with death, and worsethan eh?
That fog?
Where did it come from?
She's easily distracted by fog.
SPEAKER_02 (28:22):
Yeah.
Well, I mean, she probablyknows.
And I I imagine for somebody whocan sense your deepest, darkest,
even unconscious thoughts, notdetecting that suddenly would
probably be incredibly alarming.
Especially when you know theonly person capable of doing
what's happening is Storm.
And well, I mean, as we've seen,Storm is by far one of the
(28:44):
strongest members, I think,still at this point.
But I think I mentioned earlier,we kind of see this contrast
through this entire two issuesof the X-Men still trying to
approach Gene from a place oflove.
Like they're still, despitebeing defeated once, despite
knowing that she's incrediblystrong, they still, still are
(29:08):
trying to save her.
And when you compare that to herfamily, who disowned her when
things got hard, it kind ofreally shows the love that
having people like Scott and uhLogan and all of the other X-Men
around her really brings and howmeaningful that connection is.
(29:29):
And even obviously seeing theproposal that happens at the end
with Scott, I think, really kindof completing this hero's
journey of love that he's beenon to indirectly and then
directly propose Gene and have areally lovely moment.
I thought their whole story herewas beautiful, the way Scott
diffused the situation and wasclearly getting through to Gene
(29:52):
and you know, really trying toplead to the good that still
remained in Phoenix.
You could probably argue thatScott.
Kind of making the approach hedid really probably allowed the
situation that followed withCharles to play out the way it
did and really kind of give Genethe room she needed to start
mentally fighting back.
However, Charles, however,Charles just mucks it all up
(30:18):
again, man.
SPEAKER_01 (30:19):
Just mucks it all up.
You know, I thought you wouldpoint this out.
And the first time that I readthrough this, I was like, God,
this is so typical, Charles.
You know, when I've looked at itlike a second or like a third
(30:39):
time, it seems less egregiousand ultimately is probably the
right call.
It doesn't feel as bad.
SPEAKER_02 (30:48):
I'm assuming you're saying it was probably the
correct call because of how itturned out.
Um like, is that pretty muchyour reasoning?
I could be devil's advocate andsay if Charles didn't do that,
given that Scott was gettingthrough to Gene, they could have
diffused the situation and had aconsenting conversation between
(31:11):
Gene and Charles to then do thething that Charles did.
SPEAKER_01 (31:15):
Yeah.
That is a good take on things.
I don't have anything for that.
I I mean, I think ultimatelyit's something that needs to
occur.
I don't think this is asituation where they just talk
her down and then she's goodforever.
Like, even when she's prettymuch fully herself, I would say,
(31:36):
she's like, I hunger, Scott, fora joy, a rapture beyond all
comprehension.
That need is a part of me too.
It consumes me.
And that's like right beforeshe's blasted.
She has the you know, the urgeof like consuming power or I
mean energy vampire is not atall what the situation is, but
(31:58):
you know, she's just got like anuncontrollable hunger.
Yeah, she's got uh galactussyndrome.
You know, my brain was thinkingthe exact same thing as soon as
he started talking.
I was like, he's gonna saygalactus syndrome.
SPEAKER_02 (32:15):
Yeah, I mean, I will slightly give you the nod on
that it was probably the rightchoice.
As it turned out well.
SPEAKER_00 (32:24):
Mm-hmm.
SPEAKER_01 (32:25):
There's a really I the he also has a really sick
line when they're starting theirpsychic battle.
So I'm gonna I'll read this oneout.
Power without restraint,knowledge without wisdom, age
without maturity, passionwithout love.
I must fight you, Gene.
I think it just paints such agood picture.
(32:45):
Like that whole, like, you know,you have incredible power,
there's no restraint.
And by you, we're talking DarkPhoenix.
Gene loves.
Dark Phoenix is no love, allpassion.
SPEAKER_02 (32:56):
Even the way that this is illustrated in color
too, like the entire sequence,all of these panels of this
giant pink Phoenix in behindGene representing her incredible
power.
You know, you have Charlescrawling on his hands, and you
(33:18):
know, is is prone crying becausehe knows what has to happen.
It's it's very emotional andvery well done.
And you're probably right thatI'm being overly critical of the
Chuck situation, but he reallydoes just come in and muck it
all up, though, doesn't he?
He definitely comes and mucks itall up.
I think it would be different ifthat was like the plan, you
(33:39):
know, like Scott kind of yeah,maybe not doesn't directly mean
to like cause this situation tounfold the way it does, like
with the proposal and oh sorry,the proposal happens after.
But the way like his his pleawas kind of unfolding.
SPEAKER_01 (33:54):
Um, but like that could have been the play, you
know.
Yeah.
I mean, one thing that we'llgive to old old man Chuck,
everybody else had a problemwith holding back, you know, was
the issue.
They couldn't really make anyheadway.
Not not him.
Yeah, yeah.
I I think that's part of, youknow, he's got the age and the
(34:15):
wisdom.
So he knows, you know, thissucks.
I hate this.
This does need to happen.
SPEAKER_02 (34:23):
It's uh very similar to Logan's sort of interaction
here, where we see him admitthat what needs to happen is
something that no other X-Mencould do.
And then he can't do it.
Yeah, he can't do it.
He has just that moment of pausewhen he sees Gene, D Gene,
(34:46):
pleading for him to kill her,and then he can't.
SPEAKER_01 (34:50):
And that's where we connect to X-Men 3, the last
stand.
Yeah, that's lift that's lifted,except things go way different
in that movie.
Yeah, way different.
Yeah.
They may have fumbled themessage of unconditional love a
little bit.
SPEAKER_02 (35:09):
Going back to what you said at the beginning, the
fact that they did that storyand Cyclops wasn't involved is
crazy.
SPEAKER_01 (35:15):
It's well, I mean, I you know, I I you won me over a
little bit by saying like Logantakes his place.
Yeah, yeah.
But like, because, you know,they just gave up on Scott.
But yeah, that's a weird.
And you know what?
Scott is part of the newer DarkPhoenix movie.
(35:36):
However, I do think he's alsojust super like he's sort of
just there.
And maybe it's because he's alsoboring in that movie, and man,
they just don't know how theyjust don't know how to do
Cyclops real good for like themovies.
They'll probably nail it on thenext one, but I mean he's just
sort of second fiddle to Xavier,Meg's, Phoenix, Beast.
(36:01):
So, you know.
SPEAKER_02 (36:03):
I think mostly because he wasn't really there
from the start.
Like, I think if he was thereand Gene was there in the same
capacity that Hank was, and andlike they've now been in a few
movies at this point.
Yeah.
Whereas I think they like startrecruiting them in an
apocalypse, right?
Yeah, that's what we saw.
SPEAKER_01 (36:25):
Yeah, that was terrible.
It's really bad.
I think I fell asleep duringthat one, actually.
But that's another weird onewhere like Apocalypse and Gene
are having like they're blastingeach other, and then suddenly
it's like the there's like aPhoenix tease, and it's like, oh
god, I guess we're going herenext.
They're really bad at buildingto it.
SPEAKER_02 (36:47):
I th honestly, I feel like to do it right, it
would need to be built out overa series of films.
Because when you look at likethree or four movies, yeah, it
either needs to be over likethree or four films, or it has
to be like a TV series, whereyou know, you you have more
(37:08):
wiggle room to you know providethe breadcrumbs and I think
build the relationship.
Like that's the big part.
This story works because of Geneand Scott's relationship, the
relationship that Gene has withall the S-mens, the relationship
she has with Logan, therelationship she has with Chuck.
(37:28):
Like it's all a very emotionalplace.
And you could honestly probablytake everything from the
introduction of this team tonow, take some of the filler
out, and you would probably havelike a decent series to like
start off with the team kind oflike fresh face, recruiting
them, you get everybody going,you bring Gene and you know,
(37:51):
back in the fold, you know, shecomes back to the team, blah,
blah, blah.
You literally could do it shotfor shot, and I think it would
be like good.
And then like the climax of allthis is like what we're seeing
here.
SPEAKER_01 (38:04):
Yeah, I mean, the issue is they start the movie
with what happens in issue 100and then jump to issue 135.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It's like there's been a lotthat's gone on in between there.
SPEAKER_02 (38:17):
100%.
And I think that's why like youwould really need to build a
relationship because this storythat we read is just the
culmination of everythinginvolving Phoenix since Phoenix
has been introduced to thestory, and all of the
developments and friendships,believe death of the characters
(38:39):
and how they each individuallycoped.
And, you know, this really isthe culmination of that story
with Phoenix and you know,having this proposal at the very
end, and then presumably spacecourt or whatever the hell's
about to happen.
SPEAKER_01 (38:53):
I think the only other thing that I wanted to
mention, and we sort of dancedon this a little bit with the
reaction of her family andthinking, like, hey, where's
things going next?
I think it's such a good turnright at the end.
Just enough happens in the bookthat you sort of forget about
the Shiara a bit.
Yeah.
(39:13):
And it's like they've really wonthe day.
This is gonna be a happy endingissue.
And then it's like, ah, beans,things gonna get bad again when
they all disappear.
SPEAKER_02 (39:24):
Yeah.
I really like these two issues.
If they left it at that, then Iwould have probably been
satisfied.
I hope that it's as good asthis.
That's it.
That's all I have.
Like, I hope then I hope thenext one, I'm assuming, is where
this kind of gets wrapped upbecause it's a special
double-size issue.
A double boy.
(39:45):
This Marvel comic could be worth$2,500 to you.
I tried looking for the detailsinside, they weren't there.
So what's uh what do you whatare you giving this?
SPEAKER_01 (39:55):
What's the rating?
Nine?
Like a nine, a solid nine?
That is very good.
Maybe slightly too heavy onexposition over the two issues,
but I mean no overall not toobad.
And a lot of the exposition thatthey did have was also very
good.
So kind of hard, but they youknow it it finds a a a pretty
(40:16):
good balance.
Um I think it's a good exampleof the power of love saves the
day, similar to Thunderbolts outnow on Disney Plus.
I just watched that actually.
Me too.
They should give us money forthe mention just throwing it out
there.
Yeah, Disney, give us somemoney.
I liked I liked Thunderboltspretty good.
(40:38):
Bummed about Taskmaster.
I'm not uh but yeah.
It wasn't Taskmaster, you saidfor Yelena, you know?
It was it it's that it wasn'tthe right one.
You said for character.
Yeah, I like Yell Yelena,Yelena.
SPEAKER_02 (40:54):
Yelena.
Solid, solid nine.
Yeah, solid nine.
Uh same with me.
I really enjoyed it.
I kind of left not really havinganything massively negative to
say about it.
I enjoyed it pretty much startto finish.
Uh, I really loved the characterdevelopment that we saw, and you
know, I've been talking on andon and on about relationships
(41:16):
and how great they are when theywork and how terrible they are
when they don't.
We kind of see that play outhere.
So this is all to say.
Nine for me.
I will be very curious to seehow this all fits together,
because you know, I am expectingspace court.
Uh, they're gonna want to putGene to death or imprisonment or
(41:38):
something to that effect, or youknow, they'll be like, well, we
don't want to kill Gene, but wewant to kill the Phoenix, and
you the Phoenix is in you, sosucks to suck.
They'll get She-Hulk as alawyer.
Yeah, maybe Matt Murdoch willcome too.
It'll be uh, you know, they'llhave to go to some sort of
reality space courtroom and uhsettle it, probably run by mojo.
SPEAKER_01 (41:59):
Yeah, and then then you uh broadcast it around the
the galaxy probably be a bighit.
God, have they ever done a likemojo as a reality court judge?
It feels so right.
And I'm not a big like I'm notreal big into when we like
comics on little mojo arcs, butit feels very right.
(42:22):
Make it happen, Marvel.
That's a freebie.
Run with it.
Just but yeah, I do feel badabout splitting us up into 135,
136, and then 137, 138 separate,just because I feel like
discussing them as a whole wouldbe great.
But also, with 137 being adouble issue, it sounds like a
(42:44):
bit of a logistical nightmarefrom our end.
SPEAKER_02 (42:48):
Oh, it's totally fine for me.
I felt like we had a lot to say,and it's I'd rather it all be
good content than us having tolike shred it down just to talk
about Gary Gray?
Yeah, Gary Gray would never seethe light of day.
SPEAKER_01 (43:02):
I would have had to cut it for time.
So sad.
Gary Gray lives.
Alrighty.
Well, that does it for thisepisode of Uncanny Book Club.
Thanks for listening, and wehope to see you next episode
where we'll discuss issues 137and 138.
Thanks for tuning in to thisepisode of Uncanny Book Club.
(43:24):
If you enjoyed this podcast,don't forget to subscribe, leave
a review, or share with afriend.
Hello and welcome to Uncanny Book Club.
I'm Isaac Vader Trio, andjoining me today is my co-host
Adam Ward.
Hello.
I still have not watched thatX-Men Phoenix, dark Phoenix
movie.
SPEAKER_02 (00:23):
Is that what it was?
SPEAKER_01 (00:24):
I was wondering.
Uh I think so, yeah.
Yeah, I still haven't watchedit.
That's okay.
Maybe you're just saving thatfor when we wrap things up with
the next episode.
Yeah, we'll see.
We'll see.
You probably might have a fewbetter things you could do with
your time.
SPEAKER_02 (00:44):
I mean, now that I've at least read uh a bulk of
the story, I can at least gointo the movie with a proper
critique of how it plays out.
I definitely saw the shades ofX-Men X3, whatever that movie
was.
The third X- Original X-Men.
The last stand.
Last Stand, that was it.
(01:04):
Thank you.
I definitely could see wherethey got the inspiration for
some of the scenes that happenedin that film.
I don't think we actually seeGene like go full Dark Phoenix,
like at all, or even Phoenix.
She was just kind of She's justevil.
I think she was just beingtalking about the movie?
Yeah, yeah.
In the m in the movie, she wasbeing exploited by Magneto,
(01:27):
basically.
SPEAKER_01 (01:28):
Yeah.
I, you know, when I wasreflecting on this and making
notes, I was thinking back and Iwas like, man, I do not remember
what happens in that movie.
Like there's the beginning, shekills Scott.
There's that scene where likeMagneto and Professor X are
there, and then I think Xavierdies for reasons or something.
(01:51):
And then, you know, he likelocked away parts of her brain
and powers and stuff like that.
And then I remember the end whenLogan stabs her with his claws.
Well, you definitely remember alot more of that movie than I
do.
I mean, I I don't remember theentire middle.
Like I remember like the first10 minutes and the last three
(02:13):
minutes.
I didn't even remember that shekilled Scott.
Yeah, he's like missing from theentire movie.
It's it's a weird death, too.
You don't like see it.
It happens semi-off screen, andI think it's just like a big
flash of light, and maybesomebody goes back to where it
is, and all that's left of himis a visor.
(02:33):
I'm not sure.
Imagine making an X-Men storywithout Cyclops.
Feels like a sin.
Imagine making this specificstory without Cyclops.
SPEAKER_02 (02:43):
Yeah, they're definitely, you know, pulling
probably elements from Logan'sand Scott's stories and kind of
just melding them together andthrowing Cyclops to the side.
Like that's essentially kind oflike at least part of what
happens, you know?
Although it doesn't play out thesame way as it as it does in the
movie, as it does in the book.
(03:05):
Which I think is for the better.
I actually really, reallyenjoyed these two issues we're
gonna talk about.
I very good.
I'm a little nervous aboutwhat's gonna come after this,
because I feel like what kind ofhappens in these two issues
together is excellent.
SPEAKER_01 (03:26):
Like I think you could put it up there with
Proteus.
I think that's fair andaccurate.
And I think generally I thinkthat's kind of the the top shelf
stuff.
It's yeah, yeah, it's not a hottake.
SPEAKER_02 (03:39):
It it is the take.
SPEAKER_01 (03:41):
Well, to just to make sure we don't spend too
much time lingering on a coupleof maybe bad movies, should we
uh just get into it then?
SPEAKER_02 (03:51):
Yeah, I think so, because this is a treat that
these this is I didn't know whatI was expecting based off the
terrible experiences from thefilms, given that has kind of
been my true experience with thestory mixed in, I guess.
Like I think it was covered inthe animated show, but I could
not so I think that's actuallyprobably where I saw the
(04:13):
majority of this likepre-reading.
Obviously, being aware of thecharacters and the general
concept, like you know, she goescrazy.
But this was so much morecomplex, it was so much deeper
between the characterinteractions, the you know, some
(04:35):
of the characters who were kindof coming back into this story
to provide like assistance, likewe see Hank, we see Charles come
back, I think in a very moremeaningful way.
In a very Charles Xavier way,based on the version of Charles
that we've seen in these issues.
SPEAKER_01 (04:54):
Yeah, I'm interested in hearing some of your takes
about Charles and issue 136, butwe'll get there.
We'll get there.
SPEAKER_02 (05:01):
Yeah, so why why don't you kind of give us the
scene set here?
Because there's kind of a lot ofuh story for us to go through.
SPEAKER_01 (05:08):
Issue 135, we are greeted with the text Witness
the Birth of a God.
Dark Phoenix immediately beginsfighting the X-Men, who are
outclassed and holding back dueto not wanting to hurt Gene.
We get to meet Senator MarkKelly, a presidential candidate,
who is meeting with his oldfriend Shaw in the aftermath of
(05:32):
the supposed X-Men rampage inhis club.
The police tell Senator Kellythat they aren't equipped to
deal with mutants, and Shawslyly suggests that Sentinels
may be a better long-term play,and one that is under the
control of the federalgovernment.
Meanwhile, the outburst ofPhoenix's power is noticed by
(05:52):
the Fantastic Four, Spider-Man,Doctor Strange, and the Silver
Surfer.
Beast arrives just in time tosee Phoenix leaving Earth, and
we see a Wii chat betweenProfessor X and Moira regarding
Phoenix and the power readingsthat they're getting.
Phoenix does a little bit ofspace travel, opens a Stargate,
(06:14):
and goes to a whole new solarsystem, and in her hunger for
power, decides to consume anentire sun, exterminating 5
billion people on a nearbyplanet.
This act is witnessed by thestrongest ship in the Shiar
fleet, which engages Phoenix inbattle while hailing Lilandra.
(06:35):
Lilandra ends up recognizingboth Jean and Phoenix, and after
the ship is destroyed, she saysto summon her ministers, the
threat must be dealt with onceand for all, no matter the cost.
We then jump back to the X-Menwho are bumming around the
X-Mansion's kitchen, having asoothing kappa besides Logan,
(06:56):
who pops a beer, and they're allkind of contemplating what went
down.
They're worrying about Scott,who is sort of just not talking
or responding to anything andjust sitting there.
But in the final pages, he jerksto his senses and announces that
he can sense Phoenix returningto Earth and that she's hungry.
(07:17):
I think we need to start withthe cover.
Yes, I think that's very fair.
I think looking at and a littlebit of a spoilers for the next
issue, I think it's fair to saythat 135 and 136 are some of, if
not the most iconic, X-Mencovers, and maybe some of the
most iconic in comics just ingeneral.
SPEAKER_02 (07:40):
Yeah, certainly 135, like this whole front page look
that they're giving Gene, youknow, crushing the uh the
X-Men's uh title, that has beenredrawn many, many times over
and over with other charactersin some shape or form.
SPEAKER_01 (08:00):
Overall, awesome, like so awesome.
It's very attention getting.
Like you would notice that onthe uh on the shelf of a comic
store.
SPEAKER_02 (08:09):
Yeah, I uh agree 100%.
You know, they've really done,and I've complimented some of
this in the past, but thecolorist is just nailing the
depth and I think flavor of someof the characters, like looking
at this costume for DarkPhoenix, like just the kind of
like black and red sort ofoutlining that they did, um,
(08:33):
with like the golden Phoenixemblem and the belt swishing in
the air.
It's just an awesome, it justlooks awesome.
SPEAKER_01 (08:42):
And a crazy look on her face.
That is a feature of a lot ofart panels uh throughout these
this story, though.
Yeah.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (08:51):
There was a lot of fun, you know, you could tell uh
fun panels where you could seethat John was having a lot of
fun, probably like depictingthis pretty intense fight
between the X-Men and Gene.
There's like a scene where Ithink it's near the end of the
fight, where Gene's now kind oftaken out all of the X-Men and
(09:14):
kind of incapacitated them, andshe's just like standing there
with like her arms raised to thesky and her hair is like you
know, in the wind.
It looks great.
It's she's uh she's summoningsome lightning.
Yeah, it's uh just awesome, andthen even later on, there's like
the a lot of big Phoenix artthat was you know really
(09:36):
delicate and descriptive.
And then of course we get likethe space scenes that are just
so awesome.
SPEAKER_01 (09:43):
I love it.
They are very good.
And obviously, art is like avery good uh discussion point
for an audio-only podcast, but Imean, we really do have to call
it out because it's justexcellent.
And not even while we're talkingabout like the space stuff, not
you know, it's not even just theart of her, you know, consuming
(10:05):
the star, it exploding,destroying the I I believe we
learned later it's uh calledDabari, the planet.
Like the descriptions that theywrote alongside it is also very
good.
And I've been critical about youknow, moments where you know
we're leaning too heavy intoexposition, but yeah, I found it
all just very interesting andjust really it really helps to
(10:30):
paint more of like a personalpicture of what people
experienced on like the planet.
And I I love the kind of detailsthat Chris goes into about like,
you know, here's what happenedon the side of the planet that
was facing the star.
Here's you know, the people onthe other side experienced the
craziest Aurora Borealis, andthen they all died.
SPEAKER_02 (10:52):
Yeah, even the you know, kind of the horror that
you end up seeing too on some ofthe faces as they're kind of
facing Phoenix in this likespace battle is just like very
illustrative of the neededemotion kind of in this
conflict.
It really raised the stakes andmade this more than just an
(11:14):
X-Men story on Earth.
And I like that that's kind ofwhere I'm very curious what's
gonna happen next after thesetwo issues.
Um, because we have this big,you know, uh space element that
really tie kind of ties thesestories that we've had ongoing
now for several issues withLalandra and you know, back home
(11:35):
now, she's the Empress.
Charles has kind of left herside, but like that's kind of
been like this lingering threadthat's out there, and to see
kind of Chris pulling it here tokind of tie this Phoenix story
back to where it all started,you know, when Jean had the
interaction with Lalandra andher brother the first time.
(11:57):
So it's it's kind of a nicepuzzle that's been all put
together, and Chris did a nicejob leaving it all, for sure.
SPEAKER_01 (12:04):
One of the things I was a little surprised to see,
and I think over the pastseveral issues, we've just been
kind of getting a lot of bigcharacters or important
characters thrown into the mix,even if it is just a quick view
of them.
Uh, we got Senator Kelly in thisone.
Big character making his firstappearance.
(12:24):
Yeah, I wasn't sure if this washis first or not.
SPEAKER_02 (12:27):
I had to go actually and look that up because I was
immediately.
I only just assumed.
Uh it was.
Yeah.
No, no, yeah, it is.
Yeah, a huge X-Men antagonist.
And to see the mention of theSentinel program by Shaw is like
a nice thread of probably what'sto come.
Mm-hmm.
I'm assuming.
(12:47):
And I I imagine that's kind ofwhere Kitty's gonna kind of come
back into the fold.
SPEAKER_01 (12:52):
Sure.
I did kind of make a note thatyou know, the Dark Phoenix saga
is such an incredibly pivotalmoment in X-Men history.
And even though it's less of afocus of this specific issue,
Shaw suggesting Sentinels toSenator Kelly story-wise, is
also just crazy impactful aboutyou know the cascading effects
(13:16):
that lead from thatconversation.
SPEAKER_02 (13:19):
I don't know that I ever knew it was Shaw that kind
of laid the breadcrumbs, so tospeak.
But like obviously we know thatthe Sentinels have existed to
this point.
It's not like it's uhnecessarily an original idea by
Shaw, but I don't know that Iever tied him to the origins of
Kelly, nor Kelly's exposure tokind of like being the face of
(13:43):
the Sentinel program.
A fun little note, right?
Like I'm I'm happy that we'rekind of seeing Chris uh push
forward.
It'll be interesting to seewhere things go from here.
I was curious what your thoughtswere about like that first fight
that we kind of see unfoldbetween Gene and the X-Men.
You know, there was a lot ofmoments where there was
(14:05):
hesitation, I think, to likereally take her at face value
and at the power level that shewas kind of presenting herself
at.
Like they were pulling theirpunches, right?
They didn't want to hurt Gene.
Do you think that fight wouldhave gone differently had they
went all in?
SPEAKER_01 (14:21):
No, not really.
Um, I and I think part of thereason is I don't think we can
assume Scott would go all in,even if the others did.
I don't I mean, does he doanything really in this fight?
I don't remember him doing much,if anything.
But I mean, no.
I think it's really just ademonstration of how much power
(14:45):
she's amassed at this point.
And we see just some interestingthings happening too, where
previously a lot of what we'veseen of Gene is like, oh, she's
super powerful, but it seemslike you know, this whole
Phoenix business is really justlike amplifying her existing
power set.
Whereas at the beginning ofhere, we have a wild interaction
(15:08):
where Gene untransforms Colossusand then also turns a tree that
he's carrying into gold.
So we're kind of dipping ourtoes into more of that reality
warping sort of power set.
Yeah.
I think at times maybe it's beenexplained as her TK is so
(15:30):
powerful that she's likereorganizing like the atoms and
molecules, but I I have no idea.
SPEAKER_02 (15:37):
I thought the inclusion of the Fantastic Four
and the Avengers and uh DoctorStrange and Spider-Man, like
really kind of amped up thestakes here.
Like this is getting therecognition of all of the big
players on Earth, but alsoSilver Surfer who is off planet
someplace.
(15:58):
And I'm I'm hoping that we seehim show up.
Like that was kind of theimplication, right?
SPEAKER_01 (16:03):
I I mean a little bit.
He he says, can it be?
I sense a kindred soul.
She is human, flawed, and thatflawed bids fair to destroy her.
I must aid her if I can.
A child of the stars, so likethe Silver Surfer, and yet not
like me at all.
Maybe this is just meant to bean advertisement for Silver
(16:25):
Surfer, like that panel.
It's kind of just like a heyman, remember this uh character
exists?
Maybe buy some comics.
I mean, you could be correct.
SPEAKER_02 (16:35):
We could also conceivably see him, given the
fact that we are heading intowhat I can only assume is a
confrontation in space, or atleast Gene is held accountable
for destroying an entire planet.
I both enjoyed like I bothenjoyed that.
Like, I think it really providedGene with the the gravity needed
(17:01):
to be this massive threat toeverything.
But then to have her kind ofcome back to Earth seemed a
little out of left field.
Like, why go all the way out tothis random planet?
And unless it's just Gene kindof feeling, I guess, like uh
sentimental, or she wanted to goand close the book on seeing her
family, which I have a lot ofopinions about because yeah, I
(17:24):
mean, well, we'll get there.
Well, we'll get there in issueuh 136.
That whole interaction likereally made me not like Gene's
father.
SPEAKER_01 (17:33):
But we'll get there.
We'll get there.
Super fair.
Yeah.
I like that it's just sort ofbrushed off after two.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (17:42):
Maybe that's they're just uh that's just how he is.
Gary.
I think that's his name.
I actually don't know.
Gary Gray?
That sounds like an awful name.
SPEAKER_01 (17:50):
That does sound pretty bad.
Gary Gray.
Gary Gary is used quitefrequently for superheroes, but
Gary Gray just sounds and feelsbad coming out of the mouth.
Uh her father is John Gray,which No, we're gonna we're
(18:11):
gonna call him Gary the rest ofthis episode for sure.
Yeah, Gary Gray.
SPEAKER_02 (18:16):
Anywho, that was it.
Um, I th I felt like there was alot of nice um character
interactions, especially in thatearly fight, you know, really
seeing Storm show uh someleadership and kind of trying to
give the X-Men like a like aminute to catch their breath,
given that, you know, theirplane has exploded and they're
(18:39):
now like falling out of the sky.
SPEAKER_01 (18:41):
I do love that Kurt made a quick thing about that.
Oknine, not another aircraftdestroyed.
I love that it's always him thatmakes these little notes.
He's uh the meta breaker.
He's like Spider-Man.
He's just keeping count of likehow much cash they've wasted.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (19:01):
But yeah, I I felt like the Storm, I think amongst
the characters, like Storm playsa very important role as like
this sister figure with Gene,which we kind of see especially
touched upon in the next issue.
But even her approach and a lotof the approach by the X-Men,
like really came from a place oflove, like really trying to
(19:23):
reason with Phoenix and try to,I guess, like can talk Jean out
of whatever's happening to her,which they obviously don't
really truly understand.
So I I I really liked kind ofthis picture that we're getting
between Gene's chosen family andher legitimate family.
SPEAKER_01 (19:44):
I think that might be most of what I have.
So if you want, we can gothrough the 136 plot and then we
can talk a little bit more abouther legitimate family, Gary
Gray.
SPEAKER_02 (19:56):
Yeah, I think the only other thing that I just
want to mention is again thescene of Gene destroying the sun
and absorbing it and how it islaid out and the descriptions of
how this scene is unfolding.
It was super cinematic.
I really hate that I feel likeif I do watch this movie, not
(20:17):
exist.
I'm assuming it is it thishappens.
Do you want to know?
Yeah, I want to know.
Does that happen in the movie?
No, no, dude.
It is like made for a movie or aTV show or something.
Like it's it's literally shotfor shot cinematic.
SPEAKER_01 (20:32):
It's too much uh budget to to make it make a make
a um play it and explode it.
It's more that this eventoccurs, but it's not Gene that
does it.
It's the Phoenix that does it,and it's before the movie
starts.
And there's a few Dabari peoplewho are the bad guys in the
(20:54):
movie, and they're trying to getGene to give them the Phoenix
power.
Wow, that sounds so it's a weirdrepurposing of what's there.
That is so awful.
What the hell?
They're plant people.
They're plant people?
These, so the Dabari people,this is in my notes for next
(21:15):
issue, but they are, I think, inan official guide or something
like that, or I I tried to dolike a slight amount of research
on it, but the Dabari are calledasparagus people.
That's like their intergalacticslang term that people call
them.
Huh.
Are you trying to look at whatthey look like?
(21:35):
I mean, I am trying to find it,yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (21:38):
Okay, okay, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Um, I don't know that Inecessarily got that from the
art in the book at least.
SPEAKER_01 (21:44):
It must be the official like tie-in book that
really explains it when theycall them asparagus people.
SPEAKER_02 (21:51):
Well, I mean, looking at the panel as it's
drawn, like, I don't see plantpeople.
Like, they just kind of looklike they have fluffy hair.
Aliens.
Yeah.
My I mean, literally, my note inthe next issue is goddamn, do
they make some ugly aliens inthe in these books?
SPEAKER_01 (22:09):
They're just absolutely terrible to look at.
Between the Dabari and the andthe Shiar, it's it's rough out
there.
SPEAKER_02 (22:16):
Well, the Shiar and all of the even the council
species that are included justare so hideous.
SPEAKER_01 (22:26):
Issue 136 starts us off with a menacing reimagining
of the Phoenix destroying thestar, and we see Lalandra
briefing her ministers.
We also see the presidentcalling the Avengers mansion.
I rate that there isn't anAvenger on standby to answer.
Poor Jarvis worries about whathappened to Beast.
(22:48):
Speaking of Beast, he's buildinga cool contraption to try and
lock down the Phoenix's powerwhile Peter, Logan, and Kurt
train in the danger room.
Phoenix returns home to Earth inthe middle of the night, and
then home home to her parents'house, and we see her experience
a lot of inner turmoil.
(23:08):
It seems Jean Grey is still inthere after all.
Her parents and sister all comedown to talk to her.
They're worried.
Dark Phoenix comes out a bit andchanges a plant into crystals,
and her dad exclaims, Who areyou?
What are you?
In heaven's name, what do youwant from us?
You're not mine, not any part ofme.
(23:29):
I deny you, I cast you out.
It's very dramatic.
Phoenix notices it's getting alittle misty outside and heads
out to confront Storm, but issurprised by Kurt teleporting
Beast's device onto her head.
The X-Men begin fighting her.
Unfortunately, her powers aren'tcompletely locked down, but they
(23:49):
are reduced.
Wolverine notices that everyoneis still holding back, and he
jumps in to do what needs to bedone.
But right before he strikes,Jean comes back to herself and
begs him to finish her.
He hesitates just for a moment,and Phoenix removes the
scrambler.
This is when Scott appears.
(24:10):
Phoenix is eager to fight him,but Scott says that she can
essentially kill him if shewants to.
He's not gonna fight back oranything like that.
Instead, he points out howPhoenix could have killed all of
them at any time and hasn't yet.
Why?
He points out that Gene Grey'slove for the X-Men led her to
sacrificing herself.
Love for him led to herresurrection, and love for the
(24:33):
whole universe almost caused herdeath a second time, when she
saved all of reality.
He says, quote, your existence,your very creation springs from
love, from the noblest emotionsa human can obtain.
And now you want to deny that?
To deny yourself?
It seems like he's reallygetting through to her.
When from out of nowhere, arogue Professor X slides in and
(24:55):
mind blasts her.
The two engage in a mentalbattle, but Professor X is able
to install more permanentpsionic circuit breakers.
He thanks Gene as he notes thathe would have lost the fight if
not for her helping internally.
Uh, I think we essentially haveto read a little bit word for
word here too, but Scott scoopsher up saying, Gene, she's so
(25:18):
still, I'm not even sure she'salive.
I want her to live, but what ifshe hasn't changed?
What if she's still DarkPhoenix?
I'll love her just the same.
For better, worse, richer,poorer, sickness, health, till
death do us part.
Gene awakens and says it soundslike Scott has just proposed.
(25:39):
He asks what she says to that,and Gene says yes, with the two
embracing, officially fiancés, Iguess.
It's looking like a happy endingwith the X-Men and her family,
when suddenly the X-Men all glowand are spirited away to parts
unknown, probably space.
But we'll have to wait for thenext issue, the fate of the
(26:02):
Phoenix.
Yeah, what's Gary Jean think?
Gary Gray.
Gary Gray.
Not Gary Jean.
SPEAKER_02 (26:12):
Yeah, Gary Gray.
Standing there aloof.
I don't know.
The X-Men seemed as surprised aswe were.
Dude, I do not like do not likeGary Gray.
It's the the whole interactionbetween him and Gene.
I actually felt how thisstarted, the interaction was
(26:32):
actually, I think, what youwould expect in a situation like
that, right?
Like it's understandable thather parents, while trying to
show their love and concern forGene, still felt afraid of her.
I think that's a very naturalway of dealing with that
situation to see somebody youlove appear uh in the middle of
(26:54):
the night at your house, dressedstrange.
Seemingly without a reason.
Seemingly without a reason, witha crazy look in your eyes.
Yeah, you know, like they'reconcerned and they love you, and
they're, you know, hoping thatyou don't do something crazy.
That you're not on meth.
But then, you know, thingsobviously escalate as you know,
(27:15):
the Phoenix is really kind ofpreying on Jean's uh
vulnerabilities and faults andprobing deeper, and I think
trying to make a mountain out ofa molehill of how her parents
are reacting.
And then we kind of see theentire situation just go off the
rails as she starts kind of likeacting out and trying to
(27:36):
demonstrate her power.
We see her like create like thiscrystal, you know, with the with
just the thought of her hands.
And honestly, like the whole waythat the father was just
suddenly like, you know what?
Yeah, who are you?
And it goes berserk.
SPEAKER_01 (27:52):
What are you in heaven's name?
Yeah.
I deny the it's a little much.
You are not mine.
SPEAKER_02 (28:00):
And and even seeing Gene having like the thought
bubble, like her initial thoughtbubble was dad, no, please.
SPEAKER_01 (28:09):
And then what she says is, watch your tone with
me, old man.
You dance with death, and worsethan eh?
That fog?
Where did it come from?
She's easily distracted by fog.
SPEAKER_02 (28:22):
Yeah.
Well, I mean, she probablyknows.
And I I imagine for somebody whocan sense your deepest, darkest,
even unconscious thoughts, notdetecting that suddenly would
probably be incredibly alarming.
Especially when you know theonly person capable of doing
what's happening is Storm.
And well, I mean, as we've seen,Storm is by far one of the
(28:44):
strongest members, I think,still at this point.
But I think I mentioned earlier,we kind of see this contrast
through this entire two issuesof the X-Men still trying to
approach Gene from a place oflove.
Like they're still, despitebeing defeated once, despite
knowing that she's incrediblystrong, they still, still are
(29:08):
trying to save her.
And when you compare that to herfamily, who disowned her when
things got hard, it kind ofreally shows the love that
having people like Scott and uhLogan and all of the other X-Men
around her really brings and howmeaningful that connection is.
(29:29):
And even obviously seeing theproposal that happens at the end
with Scott, I think, really kindof completing this hero's
journey of love that he's beenon to indirectly and then
directly propose Gene and have areally lovely moment.
I thought their whole story herewas beautiful, the way Scott
diffused the situation and wasclearly getting through to Gene
(29:52):
and you know, really trying toplead to the good that still
remained in Phoenix.
You could probably argue thatScott.
Kind of making the approach hedid really probably allowed the
situation that followed withCharles to play out the way it
did and really kind of give Genethe room she needed to start
mentally fighting back.
However, Charles, however,Charles just mucks it all up
(30:18):
again, man.
SPEAKER_01 (30:19):
Just mucks it all up.
You know, I thought you wouldpoint this out.
And the first time that I readthrough this, I was like, God,
this is so typical, Charles.
You know, when I've looked at itlike a second or like a third
(30:39):
time, it seems less egregiousand ultimately is probably the
right call.
It doesn't feel as bad.
SPEAKER_02 (30:48):
I'm assuming you're saying it was probably the
correct call because of how itturned out.
Um like, is that pretty muchyour reasoning?
I could be devil's advocate andsay if Charles didn't do that,
given that Scott was gettingthrough to Gene, they could have
diffused the situation and had aconsenting conversation between
(31:11):
Gene and Charles to then do thething that Charles did.
SPEAKER_01 (31:15):
Yeah.
That is a good take on things.
I don't have anything for that.
I I mean, I think ultimatelyit's something that needs to
occur.
I don't think this is asituation where they just talk
her down and then she's goodforever.
Like, even when she's prettymuch fully herself, I would say,
(31:36):
she's like, I hunger, Scott, fora joy, a rapture beyond all
comprehension.
That need is a part of me too.
It consumes me.
And that's like right beforeshe's blasted.
She has the you know, the urgeof like consuming power or I
mean energy vampire is not atall what the situation is, but
(31:58):
you know, she's just got like anuncontrollable hunger.
Yeah, she's got uh galactussyndrome.
You know, my brain was thinkingthe exact same thing as soon as
he started talking.
I was like, he's gonna saygalactus syndrome.
SPEAKER_02 (32:15):
Yeah, I mean, I will slightly give you the nod on
that it was probably the rightchoice.
As it turned out well.
SPEAKER_00 (32:24):
Mm-hmm.
SPEAKER_01 (32:25):
There's a really I the he also has a really sick
line when they're starting theirpsychic battle.
So I'm gonna I'll read this oneout.
Power without restraint,knowledge without wisdom, age
without maturity, passionwithout love.
I must fight you, Gene.
I think it just paints such agood picture.
(32:45):
Like that whole, like, you know,you have incredible power,
there's no restraint.
And by you, we're talking DarkPhoenix.
Gene loves.
Dark Phoenix is no love, allpassion.
SPEAKER_02 (32:56):
Even the way that this is illustrated in color
too, like the entire sequence,all of these panels of this
giant pink Phoenix in behindGene representing her incredible
power.
You know, you have Charlescrawling on his hands, and you
(33:18):
know, is is prone crying becausehe knows what has to happen.
It's it's very emotional andvery well done.
And you're probably right thatI'm being overly critical of the
Chuck situation, but he reallydoes just come in and muck it
all up, though, doesn't he?
He definitely comes and mucks itall up.
I think it would be different ifthat was like the plan, you
(33:39):
know, like Scott kind of yeah,maybe not doesn't directly mean
to like cause this situation tounfold the way it does, like
with the proposal and oh sorry,the proposal happens after.
But the way like his his pleawas kind of unfolding.
SPEAKER_01 (33:54):
Um, but like that could have been the play, you
know.
Yeah.
I mean, one thing that we'llgive to old old man Chuck,
everybody else had a problemwith holding back, you know, was
the issue.
They couldn't really make anyheadway.
Not not him.
Yeah, yeah.
I I think that's part of, youknow, he's got the age and the
(34:15):
wisdom.
So he knows, you know, thissucks.
I hate this.
This does need to happen.
SPEAKER_02 (34:23):
It's uh very similar to Logan's sort of interaction
here, where we see him admitthat what needs to happen is
something that no other X-Mencould do.
And then he can't do it.
Yeah, he can't do it.
He has just that moment of pausewhen he sees Gene, D Gene,
(34:46):
pleading for him to kill her,and then he can't.
SPEAKER_01 (34:50):
And that's where we connect to X-Men 3, the last
stand.
Yeah, that's lift that's lifted,except things go way different
in that movie.
Yeah, way different.
Yeah.
They may have fumbled themessage of unconditional love a
little bit.
SPEAKER_02 (35:09):
Going back to what you said at the beginning, the
fact that they did that storyand Cyclops wasn't involved is
crazy.
SPEAKER_01 (35:15):
It's well, I mean, I you know, I I you won me over a
little bit by saying like Logantakes his place.
Yeah, yeah.
But like, because, you know,they just gave up on Scott.
But yeah, that's a weird.
And you know what?
Scott is part of the newer DarkPhoenix movie.
(35:36):
However, I do think he's alsojust super like he's sort of
just there.
And maybe it's because he's alsoboring in that movie, and man,
they just don't know how theyjust don't know how to do
Cyclops real good for like themovies.
They'll probably nail it on thenext one, but I mean he's just
sort of second fiddle to Xavier,Meg's, Phoenix, Beast.
(36:01):
So, you know.
SPEAKER_02 (36:03):
I think mostly because he wasn't really there
from the start.
Like, I think if he was thereand Gene was there in the same
capacity that Hank was, and andlike they've now been in a few
movies at this point.
Yeah.
Whereas I think they like startrecruiting them in an
apocalypse, right?
Yeah, that's what we saw.
SPEAKER_01 (36:25):
Yeah, that was terrible.
It's really bad.
I think I fell asleep duringthat one, actually.
But that's another weird onewhere like Apocalypse and Gene
are having like they're blastingeach other, and then suddenly
it's like the there's like aPhoenix tease, and it's like, oh
god, I guess we're going herenext.
They're really bad at buildingto it.
SPEAKER_02 (36:47):
I th honestly, I feel like to do it right, it
would need to be built out overa series of films.
Because when you look at likethree or four movies, yeah, it
either needs to be over likethree or four films, or it has
to be like a TV series, whereyou know, you you have more
(37:08):
wiggle room to you know providethe breadcrumbs and I think
build the relationship.
Like that's the big part.
This story works because of Geneand Scott's relationship, the
relationship that Gene has withall the S-mens, the relationship
she has with Logan, therelationship she has with Chuck.
(37:28):
Like it's all a very emotionalplace.
And you could honestly probablytake everything from the
introduction of this team tonow, take some of the filler
out, and you would probably havelike a decent series to like
start off with the team kind oflike fresh face, recruiting
them, you get everybody going,you bring Gene and you know,
(37:51):
back in the fold, you know, shecomes back to the team, blah,
blah, blah.
You literally could do it shotfor shot, and I think it would
be like good.
And then like the climax of allthis is like what we're seeing
here.
SPEAKER_01 (38:04):
Yeah, I mean, the issue is they start the movie
with what happens in issue 100and then jump to issue 135.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It's like there's been a lotthat's gone on in between there.
SPEAKER_02 (38:17):
100%.
And I think that's why like youwould really need to build a
relationship because this storythat we read is just the
culmination of everythinginvolving Phoenix since Phoenix
has been introduced to thestory, and all of the
developments and friendships,believe death of the characters
(38:39):
and how they each individuallycoped.
And, you know, this really isthe culmination of that story
with Phoenix and you know,having this proposal at the very
end, and then presumably spacecourt or whatever the hell's
about to happen.
SPEAKER_01 (38:53):
I think the only other thing that I wanted to
mention, and we sort of dancedon this a little bit with the
reaction of her family andthinking, like, hey, where's
things going next?
I think it's such a good turnright at the end.
Just enough happens in the bookthat you sort of forget about
the Shiara a bit.
Yeah.
(39:13):
And it's like they've really wonthe day.
This is gonna be a happy endingissue.
And then it's like, ah, beans,things gonna get bad again when
they all disappear.
SPEAKER_02 (39:24):
Yeah.
I really like these two issues.
If they left it at that, then Iwould have probably been
satisfied.
I hope that it's as good asthis.
That's it.
That's all I have.
Like, I hope then I hope thenext one, I'm assuming, is where
this kind of gets wrapped upbecause it's a special
double-size issue.
A double boy.
(39:45):
This Marvel comic could be worth$2,500 to you.
I tried looking for the detailsinside, they weren't there.
So what's uh what do you whatare you giving this?
SPEAKER_01 (39:55):
What's the rating?
Nine?
Like a nine, a solid nine?
That is very good.
Maybe slightly too heavy onexposition over the two issues,
but I mean no overall not toobad.
And a lot of the exposition thatthey did have was also very
good.
So kind of hard, but they youknow it it finds a a a pretty
(40:16):
good balance.
Um I think it's a good exampleof the power of love saves the
day, similar to Thunderbolts outnow on Disney Plus.
I just watched that actually.
Me too.
They should give us money forthe mention just throwing it out
there.
Yeah, Disney, give us somemoney.
I liked I liked Thunderboltspretty good.
(40:38):
Bummed about Taskmaster.
I'm not uh but yeah.
It wasn't Taskmaster, you saidfor Yelena, you know?
It was it it's that it wasn'tthe right one.
You said for character.
Yeah, I like Yell Yelena,Yelena.
SPEAKER_02 (40:54):
Yelena.
Solid, solid nine.
Yeah, solid nine.
Uh same with me.
I really enjoyed it.
I kind of left not really havinganything massively negative to
say about it.
I enjoyed it pretty much startto finish.
Uh, I really loved the characterdevelopment that we saw, and you
know, I've been talking on andon and on about relationships
(41:16):
and how great they are when theywork and how terrible they are
when they don't.
We kind of see that play outhere.
So this is all to say.
Nine for me.
I will be very curious to seehow this all fits together,
because you know, I am expectingspace court.
Uh, they're gonna want to putGene to death or imprisonment or
(41:38):
something to that effect, or youknow, they'll be like, well, we
don't want to kill Gene, but wewant to kill the Phoenix, and
you the Phoenix is in you, sosucks to suck.
They'll get She-Hulk as alawyer.
Yeah, maybe Matt Murdoch willcome too.
It'll be uh, you know, they'llhave to go to some sort of
reality space courtroom and uhsettle it, probably run by mojo.
SPEAKER_01 (41:59):
Yeah, and then then you uh broadcast it around the
the galaxy probably be a bighit.
God, have they ever done a likemojo as a reality court judge?
It feels so right.
And I'm not a big like I'm notreal big into when we like
comics on little mojo arcs, butit feels very right.
(42:22):
Make it happen, Marvel.
That's a freebie.
Run with it.
Just but yeah, I do feel badabout splitting us up into 135,
136, and then 137, 138 separate,just because I feel like
discussing them as a whole wouldbe great.
But also, with 137 being adouble issue, it sounds like a
(42:44):
bit of a logistical nightmarefrom our end.
SPEAKER_02 (42:48):
Oh, it's totally fine for me.
I felt like we had a lot to say,and it's I'd rather it all be
good content than us having tolike shred it down just to talk
about Gary Gray?
Yeah, Gary Gray would never seethe light of day.
SPEAKER_01 (43:02):
I would have had to cut it for time.
So sad.
Gary Gray lives.
Alrighty.
Well, that does it for thisepisode of Uncanny Book Club.
Thanks for listening, and wehope to see you next episode
where we'll discuss issues 137and 138.
Thanks for tuning in to thisepisode of Uncanny Book Club.
(43:24):
If you enjoyed this podcast,don't forget to subscribe, leave
a review, or share with afriend.
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The Brothers Ortiz
The Brothers Ortiz is the story of two brothers–both successful, but in very different ways. Gabe Ortiz becomes a third-highest ranking officer in all of Texas while his younger brother Larry climbs the ranks in Puro Tango Blast, a notorious Texas Prison gang. Gabe doesn’t know all the details of his brother’s nefarious dealings, and he’s made a point not to ask, to protect their relationship. But when Larry is murdered during a home invasion in a rented beach house, Gabe has no choice but to look into what happened that night. To solve Larry’s murder, Gabe, and the whole Ortiz family, must ask each other tough questions.