Ape Canyon What Really Happened with Marc Myrsell ep179

As Luck would have it, just couple of weeks after releasing my dive into Ape Canyon, I get put in contact with the foremost authority on the topic! Tonights guest, Mark Marcel, an expert on the 1924 Ape Canyon incident, where miners claimed they were attacked by Bigfoot-like creatures. Mark shares his extensive research, including original newspaper articles and interviews, and recounts his own unsettling encounter with a bipedal creature during field research. The discussion explores the emotional impact of such experiences, the phenomenon of infrasound, and the importance of thorough documentation. Mark also highlights the significance of collaboration in research and the upcoming Small Town Monsters documentary on the Ape Canyon incident.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:16):
Welcome back to the show, my friends. I am your host,
Eric Solodgi. If you've had an uncomfortable experience and you'd
like to have it shared here on the show, please
get a hold of me at contact dot uncomfortable at
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(00:36):
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(01:00):
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If that's where you like to listen to us, make
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new release comes out. Take a minute and check out

(01:21):
the Uncomfortable link tree, as it's the single best place
that you can find anything and everything uncomfortable, all in
one spot. The link for that is in the show
description in the show notes in the description below. I
got a great show for you tonight. This gentleman that's
going to be our guest tonight was suggested by a

(01:41):
good friend of the show and it kind of goes
in line with a couple of weeks ago. If you
remember my release of my take on the Ape Canyon.
We have the man himself. This guy is supposedly and
I have no outs that he is the foremost authority

(02:03):
on the Ape Canyon event. So if you're ready, let's
get into it. If you would please give a warm

(02:32):
Uncomfortable welcome to mister Mark Murcell. Mark, welcome to Uncomfortable.

Speaker 2 (02:38):
Right on, Eric, Thanks so much for inviting me. Uh yeah,
I checked out your previous podcast two or three weeks ago,
and you'll lead it down pretty well about the whole
the whole bones of the of the Ape Canyon incident
of nineteen twenty four, and really it's one of those
Bigfoot classics, and.

Speaker 1 (02:57):
It really is. It really is.

Speaker 2 (02:59):
Yeah. When we were when we were kids, every and
if you were interested in the unexplained, no matter what
it was, Bigfoot or UFOs or Atlantis, everybody heard about
the Apnion incident, particularly where I am. I'm coming to
you from the Pacific Northwest right now in Olympia, Washington.
Everybody around here in southwest Washington, get that's where. That's

(03:22):
where it all happened, just one hundred miles from me,
up on Mount Olympia. Everybody knew about it. Yeah, So
the it was sort of a midlife crisis, maybe about
fifteen seventeen years ago, and I started re researching it
and as if, as if I had never heard about
it before. I remember hearing about it when I was

(03:43):
about six or seven years old, and about fifteen seventeen
years ago, I got back into it and I just
found this huge dearth of information, newspaper document, evidence that
had really never been brought back to lot brought to
light before, and I just became obsessed with it and
been working on it ever since.

Speaker 1 (04:03):
Fantastic. That's awesome. So I got it right, is what
you're saying.

Speaker 2 (04:07):
I got detail, but we can talk about it.

Speaker 1 (04:13):
Well. I did notice, like as I re read my script,
there was there was there was some cloudiness in in
a couple of the different texts and uh resources that
I was pulling from as far as whether it was
the main character who actually fired the first shot or

(04:33):
if it was somebody who was accompanying him on the
way to the well to get her on the way
to the water source. And and that was that was
the only part that I was like, I'm gonna I'm
gonna leave it in there because I wasn't sure who
who did what.

Speaker 2 (04:51):
So, yeah, you know the way that almost everybody and
probably you uh got a hold of the Ape Canyon story,
it's basically from two sources. My first source, when I
was like six or seven years old, was this great
dramatization that was part of the film by Ronaldlson called

(05:14):
Sasquatch Legend of Bigfoot. I believe it came out seventy
five or seventy six, and that's where I first saw
it on the Late Show, and it up until up
until here in about three weeks, I got to say
it was one of the best storytellings of the Eight
Canyon incident. The other source material that most people first

(05:36):
get a hold of the story is the book I Thought,
the Eight Men of Mount Saint Helens that came out
in sixty seven or sixty eight, written by Fred Beck
and his son Ronald Beck Ronald Ernie Beck. And when
you look at when you read that book, it's basically
divided into two parts. The first part is the basic

(05:58):
retelling of the events. The second part that Fred gets
a lot of bad press on, is that it goes
and the second part it goes on and on and
on about Fred's opinions of how we fit into cosmology,
how Bigfoot fits into cosmology, and it just philosophizes is

(06:20):
the best word for I guess. But when you review
that first part of the book, and then you go
back and look at the document evidence that I have pulled,
what Fred talked about is basically basically true. He gives

(06:41):
some the basic facts. And what I'm talking about is
that directly after the nineteen twenty four attack, word got out,
and actually the first newspaper article was published only two
days after the attack. It was published on July the twelfth,
nineteen twenty four. Had the Associated Press wire at that

(07:02):
point and so it spread on all newspapers all over
the West. I found the story was covered at the
time as far east as Missouri north to b C.
And I think I found a copy down in San Diego.
So the words spread like wildfire, the good.

Speaker 1 (07:21):
Can I can I can? I can? I jump in
here real quick with with as much as the as
you know, and and Beck even Beck even kind of
drew attention to the fact that the story moved really rapidly. Yeah,
So like, were you able to find like copies of

(07:45):
the actual articles? So I guess what I'm I'm really
interested in is how were they written? Were they written
to be sensationalized, you know, were they or were were
they written as you know, Hey, this is what this
guy's saying happened and this is an account or was

(08:05):
there some sensation sensationalism to the way they were written.

Speaker 2 (08:10):
The thing that helps us out the most is that
when word got out there were about five or six
newspaper reporters that some of them actually bothered to go
up a week after the attack and review the site.

(08:31):
They went down to the cabin and they reviewed the mine,
and some of them actually took the trouble to interview
the miners. There were five miners at the time on Thursday,
July the tenth, and some were interviewed at length, some
were interviewed just short briefly. But that gave us a
really really good storyline, a really good contemporary storyline of

(08:55):
what had happened the week before. The way that the
articles came out, I got to tell you, for the
most part, it was just the facts, ma'am. It was
just I got to say, sensationalized. No, the only thing
that could have been qualified as sensationalism was that, you know,

(09:15):
you and I think of ourselves in the year twenty
twenty five as being so erudite and so sophisticated, and
we think of our ancestors, the people that came before us,
as you know, Bumpkins, who believed in supertition. Right. But
what was quite amazing is that when these stories came

(09:37):
out in the papers, how quickly they were. They came
up with explained away theories. They were drunk, they were boozing,
and they were seeing things and they were spiritualists. They
were doing luigia board or seances or whatever they put
into it. Yeah, they did. Yeah, And I mean Miles

(10:00):
joke that I tell people is, you know, I like
to drink beer and wine, and I've messed around with
ouija board, But at no point have I ever thought
that my house was being attacked by a band of
seven foot tall monsters. Right right. So each one of
the miners was interviewed and they said, no, we weren't drinking,
and no, we're not spiritualous, and this is what happened.

(10:22):
And there were rumors through my years of working on
this project of a deathbed confession. At some point there
was a miner that said that we hoaxed the whole thing.
And I never found anyone. I've never found any evidence
of that at all. And they all went to their deathbeds,
all went to their graves, never recanting the story. They said,

(10:45):
this is what happened.

Speaker 1 (10:46):
So the one that the one that said we all hoaxed,
that he was one of the original five, or he
was an additional miner.

Speaker 2 (10:53):
Oh no, no, no, no, no, all of them, all
of them said we did not hoax it at all.
Each one at each one of them said no. This
was the most interesting one I found, who was not
interviewed hardly at all, was the youngest of the crew.
It was Leroy Perry Smith. He was the one who
went to the spring and came back to the cabin.

(11:16):
It was only about seventy five feet away. Came back
to the cabin and this big bruis or this big
individual creatures coming out of the brush at him during
the daytime before the big attack. Leroy said in his interview,
he said, I don't know what that was that came
out of the brush, and I fired shots into it,
but I wanted to know. I got to tell you,

(11:37):
I never ever want to have anything to do with
that thing ever again. And it was true. He went
to his grave with hardly ever talking about it again.
I have been able to track down and became friends
and have interviewed his daughter, Betty Mitchell, who is still alive,

(11:58):
and she knew grew up in Kelso Longview where the
miners were lived in the sort of their headquarters, and
she knew about the Eighth Canyon attack, but she didn't
know it was her dad and her uncle and her
grandfather until until I told her her dad. Her dad
never said a single word to her about it at all.

Speaker 1 (12:22):
Interesting.

Speaker 2 (12:23):
Yeah, yeah, something something sure scared them. They had They
had another good maybe four or five months worth of
good weather where they could stay up there and still
work the mine. Allegedly they were getting good assays, they
were getting gold out of the mine. I'm actually trying
to track down the assay record on the mine itself

(12:45):
right now. So they had they had good weather. But
we know from the document record where they had to
file the proof of labor to maintain their claim, and
they filed a proof of labor that year in nineteen
twenty we moved this much or we got so much
gold and all work that in that document that was

(13:07):
filed in nineteen twenty four, all work was completed on
July the tenth, nineteen twenty four. It says that in
the proof of labor July the tenth, nineteen twenty four
was the night of the attack, and they were saying
we're done and we're never going back, and they never.

Speaker 1 (13:24):
Did, did they. Was it true that they relinquished any
rights to the property.

Speaker 2 (13:30):
Yeah, to that claim, they basically did. Now here in
Washington and Oregon at the time it was. The issue
is sort of like a donation land claim, where a
land or with mineral rights you have to lay claim
to it and then you have to work the mine
for a statutory period of time. I believe in nineteen

(13:53):
twenty four it was three years or five years, and
so they had only worked the mine for two years
at that point they started. They laid claim in nineteen
twenty two, and then by that proof of labor stating
that all work was completed. On July the tenth, nineteen
twenty four, they were ad hoc in a way giving

(14:14):
up their claim. And at that point they never worked
the mine again and never filed a proof of labor.
So any mineral rights that they could have had just
all disappeared. They're all gone right now. The property the
property was in a national forest at the time, the
Columbia Columbia National Forest, and now it's in the Mount

(14:38):
Saint Helen's Volcanic Monument. And you can't do anything. You can't.
There are no minerals, no mining know nothing. So the
mine is there, the mine was found last year, but
there it is. There could be gold in it, but
you can't dig it.

Speaker 1 (14:55):
Yeah, without without going into the story of of it.
Because the people listening to this are going to have
already heard it, you know, just a couple of weeks
ago and on top of that, probably the majority of
those people have already heard the story countless times. What

(15:16):
are the one of the more deep seated aspects that
you've you've uncovered over the years that what would impact
impact this story even more.

Speaker 2 (15:32):
My background is I'm a private land surveyor. My dad
was a land surveyor, and I've been surveying all my
life and I'm still doing it. The thing about the Nate,
if I can bore you for a minute, the nature
of land surveying is that Eric, you call me and say,
I need to know where my property corners are. The
first thing that I do is a tremendous amount of

(15:56):
document research because I need to find out what previous
surveyor have done, or at least what they said that
they did, what previous landowners have done. I need to
know what kind of groundwork has been done before. And
then the next one is I have to go out
and collect field evidence out in the field compare that
information with the document evidence. So I'm, you know, coming,

(16:19):
I'm comparing apples and oranges and see coming to some
sort of conclusion. And so with the way that you
and I grew up in the early seventies, I was
always fascinated with the unexplained mysteries of life, Bigfoot and
everything you know, UFOs, and so I found that my

(16:40):
skills is land surveying, believe it or not, directly applied
to my interest in historical stories of high strangeness, particularly
if I thought think that there could be some sort
of physical aspect to these old stories that could still exist.
And so the issue of Bigfoot today is the Bigfoot

(17:05):
phenomenon real? Absolutely, yes, it's real. What it is I
don't know exactly. Yeah, I'm more likely in the camp
of a flesh and blood North American wood ade kind
of thing. But there are other people who have like
issues of like interdimensional beings and you know, portal and

(17:27):
all that kind of jazz, which there's not that much
evidence of that. So I don't I really don't go
down that rabbit hole, you know, you bring that up.

Speaker 1 (17:35):
But what I find really fascinating is in in the
book that Beck wrote, once you get past the the
initial recounting of the story of that day and night,
as you were saying, you know that that book kind

(17:56):
of drolls on, uh philosophically, sure, but there's there's some
significant correlations to what's said in that book that lines
up with the and I hate the term. I wish
they'd come up with something new. But the WU aspects
of Bigfoot, you know, there were some things that were like,

(18:22):
oh shit, he was talking about this back then.

Speaker 2 (18:26):
Sure that that part of the book I find incredibly fascinating,
and I feel like Fred beck In, I'm going to explain.
I'm going to explain what I'm trying to say. Fred
beck In writing that really got a bad rap where
he was he was philosophizing about it, and then people

(18:47):
are taking that as WU. I agree with you. I
don't like that term either. But what they were doing
is is because of what Fred wrote in the second part,
they were throwing the baby out with the bathwater. If
they don't they don't like that aspect, you know, they're
throwing everything away, right. The fascinating thing about Fred at

(19:09):
one point in the interviews in nineteen twenty four, he
and his father in law Marian Smith, who is really
the patriarch of the Holy Canyon Project, they were asked,
you know, are you guys spiritualists? Were you doing seances
up there? And they're like, no, we're not spiritualists. You know,
it was the time in nineteen twenties where there people
were doing seances much more commonplace than perhaps today.

Speaker 1 (19:33):
That was a big that was a big thing back then.

Speaker 2 (19:35):
But the fascinating thing is that later on in life,
as an older man on his property, on his house
off of Allen Street in Kelso, he did become a spiritualist.
He did become a faith healer where he was conducting
seances in his house and doing Betty again Lero. LeRoy's

(19:56):
daughter attended one and witnessed herd ad being healed by
Fred Beck, and Fred claimed that he was, you know,
having levitations of chairs and ectoplasm and all the kind
of classic seance kind of thing. The other thing is
that Fred was just a logger, mill worker, hard working guy,

(20:19):
union man all of his life. He may have been Lutheran,
but he was just like a regular hard working guy.
But I found it fascinating that he pursued that advocation
later in life of spiritual healing and doing seances and stuff.
At the time, in the early nineteen sixties, right even

(20:40):
before the late sixties, even before that kind of became
in vogue.

Speaker 1 (20:45):
You know, the hippie movement and all that.

Speaker 2 (20:48):
Sure, so I find I find that part really fascinating. Ronald,
his son was Now I try to track down Ronald,
his son and who co authored the book with him.
I missed Ronald by literally three or four weeks after
Ronald had died. But fortunately my friend John Pickering is

(21:11):
a great Bigfoot researcher. He had interviewed Ronald Beck in
the Rest Home, and Ronald felt that his dad was
sort of like an Edgar Casey kind of character, somewhat
of a clairvoyant. That Fred had the ability to see
things that the rest of us don't have a greater

(21:32):
understanding of, if you will, the cosmos and how truly
existence really works. And so when you read that book
and you take a look at the very few audio
and video recordings of Fred Beck regarding Ape Canyon, and
comparing the writing in the book and comparing the interviews

(21:55):
that Fred did, you can tell that that second part
of the book was more Ronald's voice. I believe it
was his son who was promulgating a lot of this,
even though Fred was definitely on board with it. But
it was more Ronald, his son, who was explain explaining,

(22:15):
explaining what his dad did and what his dad new
and explaining his dad's abilities. Yeah, but yeah, he definitely
was a forerunner where I have I have great friends
in the Bigfoot research community, yes, who are definitely in
the camp of interdimensional beings and portals and and and

(22:36):
and being able to communicate either with mind speak or
leaving glyphs out in the woods with sticks and leaves
and stuff in different arrangements and then getting some sort
of response back from from these individuals, these big hair
covered creatures on in the woods. And so again, I
don't like the word WU and I may not agree

(22:58):
with everything that they that they under that they believe,
you know, witnesses or researchers, but I can't discount what
they have to say because I believe ninety nine percent
of the time when someone says that they saw something
in the woods, they saw something in the woods. Right.
What it is, I don't know, But if they well,

(23:20):
I just whatever they believe I have to take. I
have to take that into account.

Speaker 1 (23:24):
Yeah, I just I just had some several great conversations
with researcher Todd Nie Sure, who was from out in
Oregon recently moved to Arkansas.

Speaker 2 (23:41):
To Arkansas. Yeah, Tod and I are good friends. He
was one of the earliest supporters when nobody knew me,
and he invited me to his conference out of beach,
but that was my first conference.

Speaker 1 (23:53):
Yeah, he actually extended me a invitation to that this year,
which I was like, I was pretty floored because that's
limited to one hundred people and by invitation only. So
I was honored by that.

Speaker 2 (24:09):
But you know, are you going.

Speaker 1 (24:12):
I don't know that I can.

Speaker 2 (24:14):
I don't know if I can either. It's on the
fourth of July, I would say, why do you have
on the fourth of July?

Speaker 1 (24:20):
My girlfriend? My girlfriend's birthday is the fourth of July,
and you know, she supports me in what I do here,
but I'm not sure that I want to take her
her birthday and turn it into a big Foot weekend.
And uh, it would be a hell of a hell

(24:44):
of a long drive. And I'll be damned if I'm
getting on a fucking plane anytime soon with the way
things have been going.

Speaker 2 (24:53):
Tell me about it. I have a very similar relationship
with my wife and my family, and she supports me
greatly and she I love I well, of course I
love her. She's the best person in the world. But
she is also somewhat of a skeptic as well, which
is good because she really questions my stuff, as she should,
you know. But yeah, I can't push it too hard,

(25:14):
so I understand.

Speaker 1 (25:15):
You know, it's interesting because you know, mine knows. My
girlfriend knows of this stuff, you know, she but she's
not like dove into all of it, you know. I mean,
most of most of what she's heard has been from

(25:37):
going and listening to my shows.

Speaker 2 (25:39):
Okay, right, so you.

Speaker 1 (25:41):
Know whether I'm whether I'm right or wrong, that's where
she's getting her information. But you know, it was it
was a grand gesture on his part, and I would
love to be able to say yes, But I just
don't know that. I don't know that it's in the cards.
H But I guess I guess what I was before

(26:03):
we got sidetracked on that. What I was gonna say is,
you know, like people when they have these experiences, you know,
According to Todd in his in his account, he he
estimates that he witnessed these three beings for a period
of maybe twenty to twenty five seconds, right, and that

(26:26):
changed the course of his life. Yeah, not immediately, but
ultimately within a couple of years. He had he had
transitioned into that being I gotta, I gotta figure this out.
I gotta, I gotta find out what it was. I
need to talk to people who've seen the same thing,

(26:49):
you know, and in forty years that that's that's an
impactful thing when you see something for you know, and
and his was a prolonged experience. Most reports are much
more fleeting than that about but nonetheless uh no, less

(27:12):
uh impactful. I mean it changes the history of of
how those people view things and and their interests and
and I hate to say that you use the word obsessed,
but you know, some people become drawn to to research
and uh if nothing else, becoming you know, enthusiasts about

(27:33):
the topic.

Speaker 2 (27:35):
You know. H my friend Shane Courson and he's with
the Olympic Project up here.

Speaker 1 (27:45):
He's got an interview with him next week.

Speaker 2 (27:47):
With Shane O. Great. Well, yeah, okay, that's good because Shane,
Shane is one of the best people in the world.
And actually he is an eighth Kenyon veteran. He's been
up with there with me twice. Uh. Great, great guy.
Shane taught me the term confirmation experience and with Bigfoot,
probably with any other other subject, but a confirmation there's

(28:09):
experienced is where you see that right in front of
you and you may not have a word for it,
and you may not understand what you're seeing, but there's
no denying what you saw, right. And so up until
about two years ago getting involved with a research community

(28:29):
and talking to people about bigfoot and talking to people
about it, Kenyon, people would come to me, especially at
conferences or whatever, and they would want to share their story,
you know, a story that could have happened twenty five
years ago when they were fourteen years old or whatever.
But one fellow told me he was just looking for
a safe space and a safe, friendly ear to hear

(28:52):
his story, right. And so I up up until a
couple of years ago, listen to all their stories and
ask questions when I felt it was, you know, warranted
to ask a question. But I kind of got the
impression hearing these stories. And I'm not trying to discredit

(29:13):
the term I'm about to use, but it almost seems
to be a PTSD kind of phenomenon where these witnesses
encounter something that is so it really twigs your brain.
It's something that you have never ever seen before. And
after that, it's like PTSD. It's like looping in your

(29:35):
head over and over and over again, and you have
to you have to do something about it, you know,
pursue research, go to therapy or something, because it's there.
On another project, another historic monster attack project down in
southwest Oregon of a series of attacks and different stuff

(29:57):
that happened over the period of actually thirty years. I
was down there again like Eighth Canyon, looking for physical
evidence of gold mining activity and a cabin that was
attacked twice in one week. And driving out way out
in the national forest, out in the middle of nowhere,

(30:18):
I had the weirdest five or six seconds of my
life where at two hundred feet in front of me,
crossing the road were two individuals that just bolted. And
it was about five or six seconds of my life.
I was driving and when I first saw the first
individual enter the road, I was about two hundred feet

(30:38):
away or so slowed the car type upon him. By
the time the second individual bolted up the hill into
the woods, I was nearly right on top of them.
And all I can say is I know what I saw.
And my bigfoot research friends say, you don't think you
saw sasquatch and plain to them what I saw, and

(31:01):
they're like, you saw too, sasquatch individuals. And I'm like,
I don't know, because frankly, I'm not even sure what
sasquatch is, but I know what I saw. And again,
dealing with other family members who may not have delved
into the subject as much as we have. My sweetheart,
my wife says, well, the only other explanation besides sasquatch

(31:25):
is that someone is raising and releasing orangutans into the
National Forest down in Southwest story.

Speaker 1 (31:36):
But interesting, So now that you're now, you've brought it up,
so I got to ask, I gotta do what I do?
What did you see?

Speaker 2 (31:46):
Oh? So here, I'm going to give you one historical
aspect about the Thompson Flat Monster. My my, my term
for the for the project is a Thompson Flat Monster,
and it happened at Thompson Flat down down in Curry County, Oregon,
about twenty miles from the ocean, about sixty miles north
of the California border. Historically, starting around eighteen seventy three

(32:08):
and going into the teens of the early twentieth century,
there were a whole series of encounters up there, a
lot of them not that friendly. It was not just
a road crossing. These were aggressive individuals, tall, bipedal, covered

(32:29):
with hair, no hair on their face or their hands,
and camps were being torn apart. Dogs were being killed
taking shots into it, just like eight canyons, seemingly to
no effect. At one point, over the period of about
eighteen months, four miners were found dead individually with their
bodies beaten to a pulp or their heads bashed in

(32:52):
completely unexplained deaths. Oddly enough, those miners are buried up
there in the National forest, and we were able to
track down burial plots up there and their cabins and
their gold mining activity and everything. The interesting thing about
this is that very very consistently, the individual creatures were

(33:14):
described as maybe six to seven feet tall, covered entirely
with hair, and the characteristic was there was a dirty blonde,
yellowish hair each to each and all of these historical reports,
and again there were newspaper articles written and people interviewed
at the time of these individual encounters. So it was

(33:37):
about five thirty It was within November, so it's about
five or five thirty in the afternoon, and this is
a lot of these area's old growth forest because the
terrain is just simply was simply too steep for it
to be logged. So down going down this forest service
road that is pretty dinky. It's good enough for maybe

(33:58):
a vehicle and a half going through the tall trees.
And again, this is very steep terrain where you have
a steep bank coming up from the river, a road cut,
and then it keeps on going up, very very steeply.
I'm rounding around the curve and I have my head
lights on and I drive. I've always driven like an

(34:21):
old lady, you know, twenty five saves lives. I drive
really slow anyway, and so I have my lights on.
I may have had my brights on on the car
round around the curve. Yeah. Yeah. It's fall in November,
so it's dark and coming up from the river through

(34:45):
the brush onto the road, I startled it. I spooked it.
I don't think it saw or heard me coming, but
about two hundred feet in front of me there was
an individual in the middle of the road and I
could see it moving, but as soon as my lights
hit it, it dead stopped and it faced me about
two hundred feet away, and my first thought was, who

(35:08):
the hell is playing? In the middle of the National
forest at night. And why are they wearing a fireman's outfit?
Because it was big bulky arms. It looked like a
firefighter's outfit, you know, big bulky arms legs. Sorry, light
tan and color too, yeah, And that was it, like

(35:31):
a fireman's outfit. It was dark beige, dirty yellow, right,
and as if the fireman had a big, huge collar,
there was no neck or anything. And I immediately took
my foot off the accelerator a little bit, but continued
on maybe fifteen twenty miles an hour, and it started

(35:53):
to cross the road. But just before it keeps on
crossing the road, it turns and looks where it had
come from. And then a second individual comes from a
crouching position, standing up on the standing up of the road,
and the two of them just start cooking it across
the road. And what was one of the most disturbing

(36:16):
things is that it was something that I had never
seen before. And then secondly it was their movement. The
paradigm that you and I live with is what does
sasquatch look like? How does sasquatch move? We have in
our brains Roger Patterson and Bob Gimlin's film of the

(36:37):
PG film and Sasquatch walks in these long, loping, nice
easy strides and swinging arms and that kind of thing. No,
these guys were in a runner's fashion with their arms
bent like they were jogging, but their movements were lightning
quick and shirky. And the best way I can describe

(36:59):
it is like watching a dragonfly or an insect take off,
or very very young people in a game of chase
in the playground. It was fast, quick, quick, quick, and
their heads were down looking down at the ground at
their feet. They didn't want to look at me, and
bam they and they got to this, to the other

(37:20):
side of the road and just flew up the side
of this cliff, side of a hillside. Well. By the
time the second individual exited the road, I was within
about fifty feet or so, and I almost kept going.
I was very wigged out. My heart was racing, and

(37:42):
I almost kept going, but I slammed on the brakes
put it in part stood up, and I looked to
where these two individuals had left the road. And the
thing that got me the worst is that all I
heard was the south ork of the Sixth River running
below me two or three hundred feet away. I didn't

(38:05):
hear any brush breaking, I didn't hear any crutching, and
I assumed by the rate of speed that they were
maybe seventy five feet one hundred feet up the hill
from me. I didn't hear anything. And what got me
in my fight or flight brain was that whatever I
saw crossing the road was now up there, standing there,

(38:28):
watching me, watching you. And then suddenly all this heat
started coming up the back of my neck and the
hair started, you know, going up high on me, and
it was it was freaky I had been up there.

Speaker 1 (38:41):
Do you think do you think that feeling that you
had was just the realization of, holy shit, I just
saw something that shouldn't be or do you think that
that was Do you think that it's possible that that
could have been kind of a side effect to what
so many people referred to as being zapped or you know,

(39:04):
being having their being influenced by being around these creatures.

Speaker 2 (39:12):
One of the most common things I'm going to just
do a sidebar here for a second, one of the
most common things that people talk about, which mainstream science
is mainstream mainstream science, and there are a lot of
problems with mainstream mainstream science and how research is funded

(39:33):
and conducted. And I'm going to talk briefly about infrasound.
Infrasound is uh. There are some people in the mainstream
research community, science community, it's like that's nonsense and it's
never been proven. I completely disagree. Infrasound is is a
known phenomenon.

Speaker 1 (39:53):
Elephants, animals in our natural uh, in our natural world
that exhibit the and use that to to stop their
prey's just done.

Speaker 2 (40:07):
Yeah exactly, Yeah, exactly. So it's a real phenomenon. And
of course the idea is that infra sound is not
audible to our everyday years. So whether it was that
phenomenon with me and other people, because that was my
only I've heard some very strange things in the woods

(40:27):
that I can't explain. I've seen tracks, fortunately one that
we were able to cast up on the mountain, but I
never had that confirmation experience. So I need for me
personally about what happened to me. Again, I don't know
by my twentieth encounter, by the time I'm dead, maybe
I'll be able to have more comparative, you know, compare

(40:48):
the experiences. But that was my only one. Number one.
It was something that I had never seen before. And
also the movements, the movements were like nothing I saw before.
They were upright bipedal, walking like a person, running like
a person, but they weren't shaped like a person. And
the way that they moved certainly was not like any

(41:11):
person I've ever seen move on video or live. It
was just plain disturbing. It was plain disturbing. It was
disturbing to the point where I got back to the
reception area where my phone would work, and I am
like six or seven, six or seven hours drive from

(41:33):
my family. We're going to stay in a hotel room
because we have some more research to do, document research
to do. And I got to the hotel room and
the first thing that everybody should do is I got
my notebook and a pencil, and I started sketching out
what I had just seen. Three or four hours previously.

(41:53):
I called into my family and I was on speakerphone
with my wife and one of my sons, and I
couldn't I couldn't tell them. I just couldn't tell them.
But two or three or four days later, I got
back home and I was like, honey, I saw something
in the woods, something happened in the woods. I saw

(42:15):
something and told her about it. And Thanksgiving was about
a week later, so friends and I called Shane, talked
to other people in the Bigfoot research community. And the
oddest phenomenon for me the first dozen times telling people
this story is I couldn't get through the story without

(42:38):
tears coming down my face. And I don't know why.
I didn't feel in danger, I didn't feel unsafe. I
really didn't feel threatened, but in talking about what happened,
it was just that disturbing where even right now, Eric,
I choke up a little bit because I don't want

(43:00):
to say flashbacks. I'm not a I'm not a combat veteran,
and I don't know, but it almost is like a
PTSD where those images keep coming back and you never
shake it, you never forget every single detail.

Speaker 1 (43:15):
There's nothing to reconcile it with.

Speaker 2 (43:17):
Right exactly, Yeah, because you don't have you don't have
that apple to compare it to with the orange that
you just saw. You know, you don't you don't have that.
You have a you have a round peg and you
just have a bunch of square holes, you know. So
where where what do I do with this? What or
where do I put it?

Speaker 1 (43:33):
You know, let me take you back to something you said.
You said they were bipedal. They were upright, they were
running like people, but they didn't look like people, right.
Is that? Is that a commentary on just the fact
that they were hair covered, or was that a commentary
on build the way they were shaped?

Speaker 2 (43:54):
It? I mean, setting aside people who work out and
use too many bodybuilding muscle building, setting that aside. There, Yeah,
it's the bulk. And okay here I got to tell

(44:14):
you one thing. I was up there with a couple
of other researchers and we went into town, but we
went back the next morning. We went up the slope
to look for tracks and and we found a few impressions,
nothing castable. But one thing that we did is that
one person stood I knew, I knew exactly where they

(44:35):
crossed the road. So we had one person stand up
there and the other my other friend went with me
in the car and we recreated my driving route to
be able to tell how big these things were. And
the best that we can tell is that the first
individual was about six and a half feet tall. The
second was a little bit shorter, maybe six feet tall,

(44:56):
but it was there. There definitely was the bulk there.
It was massive, massive legs and massive, massive shoulders and arms.
That was one. The other thing is that I got
a better look at the second individual because I was
a lot closer, and it was it was and I

(45:20):
don't know, fifty feet away, and it was looking down
where I was able to clearly see the side of
its face, and it was the best way I could
tell is that it was not like a black Newfoundland
dog in hair length. It was more like a I
don't know, a greyhound if you will, it was. It

(45:41):
was short, nappy hair.

Speaker 1 (45:43):
Really it was.

Speaker 2 (45:44):
It was very very short, but it was definitely hair
covered except in the face. And in the face it
was heavy brow. The hair came down to just above
its brow. It was a heavy, heavy brow and a
very very short, flattened nose and a little bit more
of a muzzle than say humans have a little bit

(46:05):
more of a protrusion around for bits of mouth area,
you know, heavy lips. I remember heavy, heavy, heavy lips.
And in the running I remember that it was hair
covered down along the arm down to maybe the top
of the hand, but the fingers were a little bit
more fleshy and it was say, say, sort of a

(46:26):
beigeish kind of skin.

Speaker 1 (46:28):
Color, skin tone. The face was the same.

Speaker 2 (46:31):
Yeah, the face was the same. Yeah, Yeah, A little interesting.

Speaker 1 (46:34):
It's it's it's interesting that you say the full lips
because in so many in so many encounters, when people
recount it, you hear oftentimes you hear people talk about
just how thin their lips were. Sure, the mouths are
are very wide, but very thin lipped.

Speaker 2 (46:53):
Yeah, it was. I would I would agree with that.
And and from this side you, yeah, you could see
more of the side of the mouth along headed towards back,
the back of the head. It was more than just
a regular human and the lips were thin. It was
just that they were protruding more.

Speaker 1 (47:14):
You know, I got you, I got you. They they
extended out past the the face.

Speaker 2 (47:20):
The front of the face or the front of that
short little muzzle. And we're not talking like a muzzle
like a horse or anything like that. It was just
a little bit more than what we have. And the
issue with the lips is interesting because in observing ape
and particularly ape sometimes monkey and also other reports of

(47:45):
sasquatch encounters, there are so many reports where you and
I our main tools are our hands and our fingers
and our feet to a degree. But there are so
many reports them Bigfoot and the apes that we do
know of the lips being a tool too, where they're

(48:07):
able to use the lips better than we use our
limbs for saying.

Speaker 1 (48:12):
Yeah, they're they're able to manipulate it to pull the
leaves off of limbs and stuff like that. Yeah, it's
I know exactly what you're getting at.

Speaker 2 (48:20):
Sure, there was a great report and I didn't take
the report it, so it's a well known report where uh,
a fasquatch like creature was seen taking evergreen I think
it was Douglas for limbs off a tree and it
was in springtime, mid springtime, and it was using its

(48:40):
lips to take the nice fresh green growth off of
it and pluck it and eat it that way.

Speaker 1 (48:46):
Interesting.

Speaker 2 (48:47):
It wasn't chewing, it was using its lips.

Speaker 1 (48:49):
To Yeah, you know, it's funny because excuse me, uh,
just not too long ago. And I guess we'll give
Mall Town monsters a plug here, because you've got something
coming up very quickly, uh, in the near future with them.
I was watching one of their older documentaries and they

(49:13):
were with people from the Olympic Project, and they were
in the area where the nests were were found and
eventually deconstructed, and they were talking about I believe they
were the huckleberry leaves that were that were and they said,
plucked from the from the branches, and there were piles

(49:36):
of them around. Uh, kind of creating a clear line
of sight from the larger nests to the smaller nests,
which they assumed, you know, we're probably for for juveniles.
But that that point that you bring up about the
the the articulation or the ability to manipulate with their leaves,

(49:56):
I almost wonder if more than it plucking them on
off with their hand, if they're actually grabbing hold of
the branch and plucking them off with their lips.

Speaker 2 (50:05):
Well, I will talk about small town monsters in a second.
But since you have our great pal Shane Corson, who
is one of the core group of the Olympic Project
and one of the core group of the nest site,
Shane can describe it better than I can. But they

(50:27):
definitely were able to track down At first there was
a timber cruiser that brought this information to Shane and
Derek Randalls at the Olympic project. You know, I found
this thing. You guys got to check it out. And
that's where kind of like the first discovery of a
nest site was as far as the research community goes.
So they kept on finding other nest sites around. But

(50:49):
Shane was explaining to me where they were able to
find nearby huckleberry bushes where they could see that break.
They could see that break. That was a definitive break
of that thing taken and then taken over here a
few feet to build to build that nest. One of
the fascinating things about the nests that I've discussed with

(51:13):
op nest site. Friend. I'm a member of the Olympic Project,
so I kind of know everybody.

Speaker 1 (51:17):
There, you know. Ah, you know Amy boo.

Speaker 2 (51:22):
Oh, well yeah, oh Amy and I are good friends.

Speaker 1 (51:24):
Yeah, what a lovely soul. She's wonderful.

Speaker 2 (51:28):
Amy's wonderful. Actually, David ellis the sound analysis guy at
the LP. He invited me and Amy to the Olympic
Project on the same week and so I called Amy.
I was like, are you going to do it? And
She's like, are you going to do it? So that's
how But we were sort of just chatting, you know,

(51:49):
late night, getting together, and I think it's with Chris
Spencer and maybe Todd Haile. But one of the fascinating
things is that huckleberry in our area and traditionally with humans,
is that huckleberry is associated with.

Speaker 1 (52:06):
Medicinally, right, Yeah, disinally for labor pains, Isn't it exactly?

Speaker 2 (52:11):
That's what I was about to bring up. It is
a part.

Speaker 1 (52:13):
I don't mean to jump in, but when when I
know something, I'm like, I know what this is.

Speaker 2 (52:20):
Derek, No, it is, Yeah, it is, it is. It's
it's it's part. It's part of the birth process. It's
part of labor, and it is you use medicinally. So
you have a nest. Why do you build a nest? Well,
I need a nest in order to make babies and
so and so. You know there were other things found
as well, of course, things that were local.

Speaker 1 (52:41):
So do you think that the do you think that
the big nest was actually like the the love shack.

Speaker 2 (52:49):
I'm going to give you ask that question of saying
what's been What's what we've talked about. It is fascinating
where there are nests in an area and they seem
to be arranged because I got I got on their

(53:09):
butt really really hard. Where I was like, you guys
have to map this. You have to survey it, even
with the compass and tape or something, you have to
map it out. Fortunately they did, but they found this
sort of area where there could be a line of
sight in this one area, but where they have found
other nests. I mean, it is deep and remote and

(53:30):
it is so dang hard to get to, almost as
if some of these nests were set up almost as lookouts,
as sort of guards before any other individual creature, person,
intruder could actually get down into the gorge, down into
the draw where.

Speaker 1 (53:50):
They were kind of defensive posture.

Speaker 2 (53:53):
Right exactly, Yeah, sure, exactly. So that's what little I
know about the nest sites. Haven't been there yet, but
I was up there. I was up there the Olympic
Project cabin site when Small Town Monsters came through and
I did a brief interview with them at the time,
and Seth Braidlove, who is in charge of Small Town Monsters.

(54:14):
He and I have known each other for about five
or six years. And the weekend that we met, Seth
and I were like, you know, we should really sit
down and talk about eight Kenyon. So people have contacted
me through the years and we need to do a
documentary about eighth Kenyon. We need to do a documentary,
and some have panned out. I did help out a show,

(54:39):
a Discovery show once, and well, I'm going to say
it's names, it's Expedition X. I haven't seen the show,
and I don't plan to see the show because it
was one of those things where I learned. The biggest
thing I learned about helping them out was I need
to be more choosy about who I work with about
about a and so I got a call from a

(55:02):
friend who was involved in the Seattle film and TV
industry and we should do a documentary about eight Kenyon.
I'm like, wait, okay, wait. So I called Seth and
I was like, you know, it's kind of now or never.
At the time, we were coming up on the one
hundredth anniversary of the attack, and Seth was like, let's go,

(55:23):
let's do it. So he pulled the trigger and so
he he put my good friend Eli Watson in charge
of production and direction, and we have been filming off
and on in about four or five different trips. We
were up there on on the exact minute of the
hundredth anniversary were up. We did a lot of great

(55:46):
filming up there on the site. We have collected a
trum I should say, ELI has collected a tremendous collection
of interviews with family members who are still alive, other
people involve in the research in research community, and Eli
has sent me some rushes and right now, just the

(56:07):
story cut, even without all the recreation and all the
other cool pictures and stuff, it's just shy of two
hours right now. So it's like every I mean, it
is really I'm sorry, Eric. I have helicopters going up
with me right now?

Speaker 1 (56:21):
Are they black?

Speaker 2 (56:25):
I can't quite see him, but from what I've seen,
I am thrilled. That's why I wanted to do it,
was Seth because small town monsters dot such quality work.
And Seth is the kind of guy I've filmed with
him before, and they're the kind of people who they

(56:47):
don't tell you what to say the last questions. They
don't have you okay, no, no, take two, take five,
let's redo that. They turn on the camera and let
you do whatever you want to do.

Speaker 1 (56:58):
Right.

Speaker 2 (56:58):
And so from what I seen that it's being called
the Siege of Ape Canyon and it's going to be
released in about three or four weeks, and you can
find out when by checking out Small Town Monsters. But
from what I've seen, it's the Ape Canyon story that
should be told. It is, it's so much good information.
I'm Mark Marcel and I approved this message kind of saying, well, it's.

Speaker 1 (57:23):
Running for governor of Oregon. No, I agree they are.
You know, I think some people kind of accuse them
of of being a a sasquatch mill because they do

(57:44):
put out a lot of content, but by and large,
most of it, let me say this, all of it
is well done. Yeah, all of it is visually appealing.
It's it's it's a even if their episode or their

(58:05):
they're what am I trying to say, even if one
of their documentaries doesn't have any kind of mind boggling,
mind blowing proof or uh, you know, it is still
a very comfortable thing to watch because the the production
and the cinematography is really well done and it's a

(58:26):
very very relaxing, enjoyable to the eyes.

Speaker 2 (58:33):
I I think that that is actually a very good
sign because, as a friend said, Bigfoot research is like
watching paint dry or watching grass grow.

Speaker 1 (58:46):
It can be that's a good point.

Speaker 2 (58:47):
Incredibly boring. It can be incredibly boring. So if some
of the small Town Monsters episodes productions seem rather dull,
I think that that is a very good signe Seth
has a background, if I'm right, if I remember right,
he has a background in journalism, I believe radio and TV.

(59:08):
And I've always had fantasies about being an investigative journalist.
But I realize, I'm I. I lack one skill, and
that is getting the story and getting it out. Get
the story and get it out. And that's one thing
that Seth it's very good about. It's amazing on very
little money, what great quality has and how he's able

(59:30):
to get the story and bam, get it out and
he's really good at it.

Speaker 1 (59:35):
Yeah, it's it's I don't I don't shy away from
any of their any of their releases. When I see
something news coming out, I'm like, all right, all right,
I'm saving this for the weekend, saving this for the weekend,
because you know, it's something you can you can put
on and you know, unless they're in in the midst

(59:55):
of a compelling interview or something, it's something that you
can have on almost like a almost like a podcast,
because you know, the the visual part of it is stunning.
If you're if you if you want to sit there
and watch it, but you can also just pretty much
get everything you need to just just out of listening
to it, you know. And I'm sure I'll turn them
on in the afternoon and I'll do housework or whatever

(01:00:17):
I'm doing, and you know, I have it on going
on the so the same time, and you know, inevitably
I always wind up getting a comfy spot on the
seat and on the couch and then watching.

Speaker 2 (01:00:29):
But it it, it, it is, It's true. There there's
lots of great information. Visually, it's very it's very stunning.
And I believe it was on It was on the trail,
on the trail to Bigfoot, and I think it was
the legend one of the first ones. And I did it.
It was a good one I did. I didn't interview

(01:00:49):
with Seth and we went up on the mountain and
talked about it and he set it hired his graphics
artist where it was sort of it wasn't animated, but
it was sort of fun animation in a way, and
it was like a retelling of the Apion story. And
it was really impactful. And I remember watching it once

(01:01:10):
with my mom because my mom had never seen it,
and we watched, we watched it was like a fifteen
minute segment or so on SETH movie. And I remember
after watching it, I was like, I'm not going up there.
There's monsters up there and my own project. You know,
I've been there a cajulial times. But the telling of

(01:01:34):
it was so good and he really it was the facts,
but it was also visually stunning as well. They do
great work.

Speaker 1 (01:01:43):
They really do, they really do. I Uh, I was
hoping it wasn't this past year, but the year before
I was. I was trying too late unfortunately to have
a better spot there at their at their conference, I
do know in in Ohio. But a lot of good

(01:02:05):
content there, a lot of good content.

Speaker 2 (01:02:07):
Yeah, I'm I'm afraid, I I I don't want to.
I don't want to spill the beans. But I understand
that you missed out because that was going to be
the last monster Fest there. I don't there they don't
have another monster festing planned out.

Speaker 1 (01:02:22):
But yeah, I noticed that I had not seen anything
uh being advertised for it. But oh well, you'll win
semulose some I had other stuff going on that was
equally important. So maybe they'll do it again, I hope.
So yeah, any anything that is anything that needs to

(01:02:46):
be covered about the the Ape Canyon event that we
we may have bypassed in our in our rabbit holes.

Speaker 2 (01:02:55):
One one thing about Well, here's one thing that Ape
Canyon taught me. And it's true of certainly any bigfoot
research project, any historical research project. Honestly, any research project,
no good research project worth its salt, is ever ever done.

(01:03:18):
It's never ever done. Like I was explaining about how
I conduct boundary surveys and people pay me to draw conclusions,
and I do, but in in my in my other
professional life of Bigfoot, I don't necessarily draw conclusions. I
just grab the facts and I lay them down. And

(01:03:39):
the fascinating thing about it is that sometimes in this
project I've gotten to a point where it's like, you know,
I have tracked down every dang, little tiny lead I
can think of, and then suddenly, out of the blue,
something new crops up. UH old person shows up and

(01:04:01):
she says, you know, my grandfather knew Fred Beck, and
they laid me down. They opened up a whole new
door for me and provided me with great information. Case
in point, which is going to be featured in the
small Town Monster film on screwing around on Facebook, there's
somebody who runs a page of Mount Saint Helens before

(01:04:22):
nineteen eighty eruption. It's old pictures of Mount Saint Helens,
and he had posted this picture of these two Forest
Service rangers building a fire lookout in nineteen twenty four
on Mount Saint Helens. Well, I knew exactly who these
guys were, and there were the two rangers who had

(01:04:42):
talked with the miners, and these rangers had actually gone
up to the cabin site. And I got hold of
his Facebook guy. I was like, who is this that
gave you these photos? And he put me in contact
with an older woman named Sandy who has become a
gem for this project, called Sandy, and she was like,
I know exactly what you're talking about. One of those rangers,

(01:05:05):
a guy named Bill Welch, who had first encountered the
miners when they came off the mountain. It was her
grandfather's brother. And there in the family album that's been
sitting there for one hundred years is Bill Welch's old
photos that he took a week after the attack of
the cabin of the miners, and these photos are so

(01:05:27):
crystal clear. At first, being an older guy, at first
I thought they were AI. But I sent them to
my photographer friends and my AI young junkies and they
were like, no, this is the real deal. And these
are so crystal clear. They're beautiful photos of the cabin
and the whole area, and they're so dang good. On

(01:05:49):
this last trip on July up there, we were able
to go and find each and every single vantage point
of these photos one hundred years ago and so that
case and point. And Sandy's been a great supporter of
the this work. She's like, use this photo to tell
the story. And so, like I said, no research project

(01:06:11):
is ever really done. Uh. And don't think that someday
somebody is going to open the door and have nothing
for you. Somebody is going to walk through your door
and say, Eric, you did really good work on this project,
but here's some new evidence that you may not have
found before, and it'll just it'll knock you on your butt.

Speaker 1 (01:06:30):
Is Can we look forward to seeing those photographs in uh,
in the small Town Monster project that's coming up.

Speaker 2 (01:06:37):
Yes, Yes, absolutely, ELI have all. Plus ELI doesn't have
all of my file, but a lot of the most
juicy parts. Uh. So you can see those photos there
to plug somebody else as well. Uh. Some of my
stuff that I have found, uh artifacts from the cabin site.

(01:06:57):
I was able to use them legally throughout each and
education and some of them I found old spoon, bailing wire,
a broken saw from the miners because we were able
to find the foundation of the cabin, found some of
their tools. Some of these are on display at Cliff
Berrickman's North American big Foot Center out in Boring, Oregon.
There's a great eight canyon display there and also along

(01:07:21):
with Sandy's photographs, they can see there as well.

Speaker 1 (01:07:24):
That's awesome. My daughter and her boyfriend, not this past summer,
but the summer half before that, they had they had
a whirlwind trip out to the West Coast and I
told her. She said that they were going to Portland,
and I said, sweetheart, I said, you're going to be
so close. You have to go.

Speaker 2 (01:07:45):
It's twenty minutes away from downtown Portland.

Speaker 1 (01:07:48):
And she went. And my god, man, the number of
pictures and videos that I got from that girl. She said,
this was amazing for the for the low cost to
get in, oh yeah, and the just trove of information
and stuff that was in there. She said, it was
absolutely amazing.

Speaker 2 (01:08:09):
Absolutely the good thing about Cliff running that not only
because he's like, oh, superstar Cliff Berrickman. I mean, Cliff
is one of my best friends in the world, So
that's why I'm talking trash about him, but not only
like a TV star and stuff. He is the real deal.
He is a great, great researcher, and because he has
a public attraction of this museum, he has been able

(01:08:32):
to get his hands on some amazing pieces of documentation,
some amazing artifacts that he wouldn't have been able to
if he hadn't. He's basically starting a library is and
one of the best libraries in the world honestly for
Bigfoot research. So it is well worth going. His staff,
Miko and Tyler and Dave are so well versed and

(01:08:56):
so well educated and into the subject himself. Even if
Cliff's not around, those guys will take care of you,
and I'll be It's a treasure troph of information.

Speaker 1 (01:09:05):
I had the honor of getting to sit down with him,
albeit a very brief interview. I think we got maybe
twenty five maybe thirty minutes at a at a big
Foot conference in Michigan about four maybe four or five
years ago. Really nice guy, a little guarded at first,

(01:09:27):
but when I think once he realized that I was
just there to have a conversation, he loosened up pretty quickly,
and uh, it was. It was a lot of fun
getting to talk to him. I've I've tried reaching out
a couple of times to get him on the show
and do an interview, and he's like, man, I'm just
so busy with doing his own and and running the

(01:09:47):
running the storefront and all that. So maybe someday.

Speaker 2 (01:09:52):
Keep bugging him, keep bugging him, he'll he'll come around.

Speaker 1 (01:09:57):
Well, Mark, it's been absolutely the intriguing talking with you.
It's been an absolute pleasure. I love your I love
your take on this and your your passion for your
investigative meanderings through this through this topic. If we had

(01:10:17):
more time, I would probably first off ask you if
you ever came across any information that was legitimate about
the the Sasquatch sightings and apparent interactions that happened after
the Mount Saint Helen's eruption. So if you give me

(01:10:40):
a nod or a shake of the head. That would
be something I'd be happy to revisit with you at
another time when you had more time.

Speaker 2 (01:10:48):
Heck, yeah, absolutely, let's do this again. You bet we
could talk about that.

Speaker 1 (01:10:53):
Yeah again, sir. Thank you so much for taking the time.
It's been an absolute pleasure, great meeting.

Speaker 2 (01:10:59):
You had a great time with Karon. Thanks so much.
Let's do it again. Yeah, give back, all right, sir,
good night, good night. Thanks man.

Speaker 1 (01:11:11):
H Speak Consumers

Speaker 2 (01:11:19):
A H.