Episode 95: The Royal Botanical Gardens - Where Science Meets Conservation

Strange wildlife encounters close to home can remind us of our complex relationship with the natural world. Jerry Ouellette opens this episode with a startling story about a raccoon that boldly entered his house by following his dog through the back door, leading to concerns about potential disease transmission and a late-night veterinary visit.

This unexpected encounter perfectly sets up our fascinating conversation with Dr. David Galbraith, Director of Science at the Royal Botanical Gardens (RBG) in Hamilton, Ontario. Dr. Galbraith brings decades of expertise in wildlife biology to his role, having spent years researching turtle populations in Algonquin Park before joining RBG over 30 years ago. His insights on turtle longevity reveal the remarkable fact that some snapping turtles could easily be a century old—creatures that might have "said hi to Champlain as he paddled by."

The Royal Botanical Gardens itself emerges as a remarkable conservation success story spanning nearly a century. Founded through the vision of Thomas Baker McQuiston in the 1920s and granted royal designation by King George V in 1930, RBG now encompasses over 2,100 acres of diverse habitats. Dr. Galbraith details their innovative approaches to managing invasive species like carp and phragmites, including a pioneering "fish filter" system and creative use of old Christmas trees to create wetland berms. Their prairie restoration efforts, complete with controlled burns, demonstrate how careful management can bring back lost habitats and endangered species.

Beyond its scientific importance, RBG offers visitors a remarkable range of experiences throughout the seasons—from lilac gardens and woodland trails to winter exhibits and natural skating on Coots Paradise Marsh. At just an hour's drive from Toronto, this natural treasure provides both recreational opportunities and vital ecosystem services to the densely populated Golden Horseshoe region.

Ready to explore this natural wonder yourself? Visit rbg.ca to learn about upcoming events, seasonal blooms, and conservation projects that you can witness firsthand. Whether you're a passionate naturalist, a casual garden enthusiast, or simply seeking a peaceful retreat from urban life, the Royal Botanical Gardens offers a perfect blend of beauty, science, and natural inspiration.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:01):
Hi everybody.
I'm Angelo Viola and I'm PeteBowman.
Now you might know us as thehosts of Canada's Favorite
Fishing Show, but now we'rehosting a podcast.
That's right.
Every Thursday, Ang and I willbe right here in your ears
bringing you a brand new episodeof Outdoor Journal Radio.
Now, what are we going to talkabout for two hours every week?
Well, you know there's going tobe a lot of fishing.

Speaker 4 (00:22):
I knew exactly where those fish were going to be and
how to catch them, and they wereeasy to catch.

Speaker 1 (00:32):
Yeah, but it's not just a fishing show.
We're going to be talking topeople from all facets of the
outdoors From athletes.

Speaker 3 (00:35):
All the other guys would go golfing.

Speaker 5 (00:36):
Me and Garth and Turk and all the Russians would go
fishing To scientists.
But now that we're reforestingand laying things free.

Speaker 4 (00:44):
It's the perfect transmission environment for
life.

Speaker 2 (00:47):
To chefs If any game isn't cooked properly, marinated
, you will taste it.

Speaker 1 (00:53):
And whoever else will pick up the phone Wherever you
are.
Outdoor Journal Radio seeks toanswer the questions and tell
the stories of all those whoenjoy being outside.
Find us on Spotify, applePodcasts or wherever you get
your podcasts.

Speaker 6 (01:15):
As the world gets louder and louder, the lessons
of our natural world becomeharder and harder to hear, but
they are still available tothose who know where to listen.
I'm Jerry Ouellette and I washonoured to serve as Ontario's
Minister of Natural Resources.
However, my journey into thewoods didn't come from politics.

(01:36):
Rather, it came from my time inthe bush and a mushroom.
In 2015, I was introduced tothe birch-hungry fungus known as
chaga, a tree conch withcenturies of medicinal
applications used by Indigenouspeoples all over the globe.
After nearly a decade ofharvest use, testimonials and

(01:59):
research, my skepticism hasfaded to obsession and I now
spend my life dedicated toimproving the lives of others
through natural means.
But that's not what the show isabout.
My pursuit of the strangemushroom and my passion for the
outdoors has brought me to theplaces and around the people
that are shaped by our naturalworld.

(02:20):
On Outdoor Journal Radio'sUnder the Canopy podcast, I'm
going to take you along with meto see the places, meet the
people that will help you findyour outdoor passion and help
you live a life close to natureand under the canopy.
So join me today for anothergreat episode, and hopefully we

(02:40):
can inspire a few more people tolive their lives under the
canopy Well.
First of all, as always, wethank our listeners throughout
Canada, the States, switzerland,trinidad, tobago, ghana, all
around the world.
We really appreciate yoursupport and, as normal, any

(03:02):
questions or any suggestions forshows, we'd be more than happy
to take them.
Just email us when it comes upand we'll see what we can do.
Sometimes it takes a bit oftime to get it on, but because
we try to find the right personor the right information for
what people are looking for, butwe do what we can.
Now I gotta tell you last nightwas interesting.

(03:22):
So I get home, I get in thehouse and, as normal, the
temperature is nice outside.
So we got the back door open,the sliding door, and I got a
screen door there that once upona time the dog took full run
from the living room rightthrough and went right through
the screen door.
So the screen door it's kind oflike the screen part is kind of

(03:46):
hanging there Anyway.
So I get in and Gunnar, mychocolate lab, he does as usual
he runs over, he grabs his Kong,which is a rubber thing, that
we put dog treats in.
We did a show with Lawrence andtalked about making dog treats.
Some of Lawrence's dog treatsand then a little bit of peanut

(04:09):
butter.
So he has to eat through it andI give it to him and he goes
over to his corner spot wherenobody can bug him.
Didn't want to bug him whenhe's at the Kong.
Anyways, all of a suddensomething's going on.
He's like terror right outsidethe back door, right through the
screen, and I go, what is goingon?
I look and a raccoon has comeright up to the door and kind of
face to face with him and it'slike what's going on here?

(04:32):
So I call him off.
He's very obedient, welltrained, and I tell him to come
back in.
Guess who comes in the housebehind the dog?
The raccoon.
So now I got a raccoon in thehouse trying to deal with that
and I'm chasing the raccoon outof the house and it's kind of
like kind of hissing at me andit's just like this was the
strangest thing.
So then I tried to get it tomove on and it kept coming to me

(04:54):
as if it was a.
I don't know if it wassomebody's pet that they let out
, because it was like if I felt,if I had food in my hand and
went to feed it, it would takeit out of my hand and consume it
right away and it would notleave.
So I've got there and I'mtrying to chase it away and get
it out of the yard and it's kindof walking around, you know,

(05:15):
with a hunchback and that sortof thing and just like, pretty
much ignores me, just goes onits business.
So, anyway, so I call animalcontrol.
Well, you know, we don't doanything like that, we don't
deal with any of those kinds ofthings.
And has there been cases ofrabies in the area or anything
like that that I need to worryabout?
No, no, no, we don't have anyraccoon rabies in the area.
Nothing reported there.
And I said well, has there beenincidents of distemper that

(05:36):
you're aware of?
Well, raccoons get a lot ofdistemper.
So it could be, but no, they'renot usually aggressive, they
very shy away and that's not thecharacter of something with
distemper.
Well, I can put you through toanimal control.
So go to animal control.
Of course they close at 4.30,so this is after 4.30, and
nobody there to talk to.

(05:56):
So called my vet and talked toDr Matt and couldn't get a real
answer what to do.
Everything else, you know, justmake sure his vaccinations are
up to date.
And it could be this, could bethat, can't tell you know and on
and on.
So anyway.
So last night I called anotherone.
We had a podcast on withsomebody, and nine o'clock last

(06:19):
night, guess who's going to getmy dog vaccinated, an hour drive
away.
So I'm up getting themvaccinated and didn't get home
till about 1130, but all looksgood and doesn't appear to be
problems at all.
But I don't know what thegestation period of things like
dust temper is.
But we're watching to make sureeverything's okay.
And of course I'm boostingGunnar's immune system with
chaga.

(06:39):
So he's been getting a dose ofchaga to help out there and
we'll see how it goes.
But strangest thing to havethis raccoon come follow him
right into the house as if hewanted to play or something.
And yeah, it was, it was.
It was interesting, to say theleast, anyways.
So today we have a special guest, dr David Galbraith.

(07:01):
Did I say it right, david?
David, oh, that's fine, jerry.
Okay, just checking to makesure.
And David is with the RoyalBotanical Gardens.
Welcome to the program, david.
Thank you so much, great to behere.
Well, we appreciate you takingthe time.
I know you're busy and it's avery interesting location that
I'm looking forward to talkingabout.
But tell us a bit aboutyourself Where'd you go to
school and where's yourbackground, and things like that

(07:22):
.

Speaker 7 (07:22):
Oh right, well, I grew up in Kitchener-Waterloo
and had always been interestedin biology and various things
and I went to University ofGuelph for my bachelor's degree
and my master's A lot ofdifferent kinds of biology and
then for my master's degree itwas wildlife biology

(07:43):
specifically.
Oh really, yeah, I had amazingexperiences with a professor who
just passed away a couple ofyears back named Ron Brooks.
He took me up to the wildliferesearch station in Algonquin
Park the summer I graduated andhad me working as a technician

(08:03):
on his long-term study of thebiology of snapping turtles.
And once you get sort of upclose and personal and getting
into the scientific questionsaround these animals, they're
just fascinating.
So I did my master's degreetrying to work out some
information, some informationabout their populations, like

(08:26):
how, how, how old, how old dothey get, how long do they live
and and how the populationsfunction mathematically Right,
which was pretty, prettyexciting.

Speaker 6 (08:37):
Well, I this is going to lead to some questions,
david.
Yeah, and the reason is isbecause last week we recorded
with the Ontario TurtleConservation Centre Excellent
and we had the vet.
She's a vet veterinarian thatworks full time there and that
was some of the questions Iasked about how long do turtles
live, and it wasn't really adefined answer and maybe you've

(09:01):
got some.
Your research was was that whatyour thesis was on for your
master's, my master's?

Speaker 7 (09:05):
Well, um, it's absolutely difficult to know
because they're not like we areas mammals that kind of have a
life expectancy.
Um, if they're, if they're notinjured or get a disease or or
something like that, um, mostturtles will keep going.
So for the snapping turtles wewere looking at in Algonquin

(09:28):
Park, some of the biggerindividuals we thought could be
easily a century old.
We sometimes joke about themsaying hi to Champlain as he
paddled by.
But it's just impossible totell, unless you actually have
an individual that you know whenhe hatched out or she hatched

(09:49):
out.
Everything's an estimate.
Hmm, one of the mainstays in thelab was a biologist who went on
to work with the Ministry ofNatural Resources for many years
as a lead bear biologist, drMartin Obard.

(10:12):
Right, but Marty was working onthe same group of turtles and
trying to really understand how,at the population level,
reproduction works.
So there are some basicpatterns in wildlife biology
that we see, with some animalshaving very few expensive babies

(10:33):
, other animals having a lot ofcheap babies, and turtles kind
of have their own trajectory inthere.
They don't put a lot of energyinto reproduction every year,
but they do it for decades.
They don't put a lot of energyinto reproduction every year,
but they do it for decades,right.
So it was fascinating stuff.
And then I came back to thesame population for my PhD, but

(10:55):
from Queen's University, oh yeah, and trying to come up again
some interesting questions froma different direction,
particularly trying to work outwhich male turtles were
fathering babies in thepopulation, and again it gets
into some esoteric biology as towhy that's interesting.
But so I spent a lot of timewith those turtles in Algonquin

(11:19):
Park, that's for sure.

Speaker 6 (11:20):
Oh, yeah, well, Dr Sue Carstairs, she's the vet
that works with the ontarioturtle conservation center.
Um, it was fascinating andbasically it was kind of just
like you said, it's difficult todetermine the age of a lot of
the turtles.
And he also mentioned anotherindividual, dr marty obart, who
I worked with extensively whenhe did the polar bear research
in ontario.
Yes, yeah, and he was a leadingpolar bear researcher that I've

(11:44):
been trying to track down but Ican't seem to locate him to
talk polar bears because I wasup and actually when I was
minister of natural resources, Ivirtually I don't know may have
close to doubled his funding by.
Actually, what happened was wemade the ability for people to
participate by going up andseeing and helping it, and they

(12:09):
sold off those seats atfundraising dinners with Safari
Club International, right, and Iknow in Ontario the seats were
made available and they gotabout $15,000 just for the seat
from the Ontario one to go.
And then they took it to SafariClub International in, I think,
their big convention I'm notsure where it is, in Vegas or in

(12:29):
the States somewhere and theygot a huge amount of funds there
and part of the benefit to itwas I found a way to make it tax
deductible, so they paid$15,000 in the one case and it
was was funneled actually Ibelieve it was through Trent
University and then the fund wastransferred over and they got a

(12:50):
tax receipt for it, which was ahuge incentive to increase the
funds.
And anyways, the end result wasa substantial amount of funds
to help out with the polar bearresearch in Ontario, because
most people don't know that wehave polar bears and quite a
substantial large population.

Speaker 7 (13:04):
Oh, that's fantastic.
Fantastic to learn about, Jerry.
Thank you.

Speaker 6 (13:07):
Yeah, sorry about that.
It's just that you know thesekind of topics lead into
different areas.
So it was interesting that youmentioned Marty and the turtles,
and last week, here we are, drSue Carstairs, the Ontario
Turtle Conservation Center.
Okay, so now we're about.
So you were born and raised inwhich area?
Again, kitchener-waterloo.

(13:27):
Yeah, okay.
And so tell us about the RoyalBotanical Gardens and where it's
located and some of the historyof it and how it all comes to
be.

Speaker 7 (13:38):
Yeah, well, my place here is a little bit interesting
too.
I've been here over 30 yearsnow and my current title is
Director of Science, and whatI've been working on here is a
wide variety of things, and somaybe some of it will come up a
little later.
But RBG itself is an amazingplace.

(13:58):
We're a not-for-profitorganization.
We were actually formed up as aproject of the city of Hamilton
in the 1920s and 30s, right, uh, really, one person kind of ran
with the idea, uh, that wasThomas Baker McQuiston, who was
a provincial, or he was startedout being a lawyer in Hamilton,

(14:19):
and he was behind, uh, with somecolleagues, a huge number of
park building exercises orprojects in the Hamilton area.
They were really trying totransform Hamilton and make sure
there were a lot of parks here,and they got the idea of having
a big public garden, a bigbotanical garden here, and so

(14:42):
we're located at the verywestern tip of lake ontario, um,
part of it's in city ofhamilton, part of it's in city
of burlington.
Today, because of of changes andboundaries and such and uh, the
city of hamilton worked on theidea for many years, assembled
land and started to build somegardens, and and uh forward the

(15:05):
idea.
Uh, and then finally, in 1941,rbg was created as a
not-for-profit organization bythe province through a private
members bill, okay, and the landwas transferred in ownership
from the city of Hamilton andwe've had that kind of status

(15:26):
ever since.
The property has grown we'renow above 2,100 acres oh, that's
good size 90% of which isnature sanctuary.
So RBG owns large wetlands, thebiggest being Coots Paradise
Marsh in Hamilton.
We own sections of Niagara,escarpment, forested areas,

(15:49):
prairie habitat, so it's a mixedlandscape.
And then, of course, there'sseveral very important large
focal gardens as well.
Oh, yeah, and from the name andfrom a lot of the things we do
to have experiences here for thepublic, of course, the gardens
are extremely important, right.

Speaker 6 (16:10):
So about roughly how far are you from Toronto, just
so internationalists can kind ofget a sense of the distance
from Toronto.

Speaker 7 (16:17):
Yeah, we're about an hour's drive, as long as traffic
is smooth on the QEW and the403.
We're about an hour's drivewest of Toronto and also about
an hour's drive west of Buffalo,new York as well.

Speaker 6 (16:31):
Okay, that gives a good sense for people listening.
So you mentioned that RBG,royal Botanical Gardens, has
wetlands in there.
Yep, do you do any partnershipswith the wetlands?
And the reason I'm asking thisis I'm going to be leading a
little bit, because whathappened was I happened to find
I was at an event when I waselected I wasn't the minister at

(16:52):
the time, this was prior tothat and I was leaving the event
and I said is anybody headingback to Queen's Park?
So one person said actually theminister of the environment at
that time said no, I'm not, butmy driver is, and give you a
ride, anyways.
So I asked him.
And this person was also incharge of a fund that was

(17:14):
established by the Ministry ofthe Environment for
rehabilitation of wetland areasor areas, aocs, areas of concern
.
And I said, oh yeah, I said,but I said, since the minister
has changed positions, the staffinside have not been willing to
work with us, so I have allthese funds there and nothing to

(17:37):
do.
I said, oh really, I might knowan organization that might be
interested in partnering withyou.
If you're interested, tell memore.
So I said well, look, ducks,unlimited.
Canada has the matching fundswhere they bring funds up for
the states for redevelopment ofareas of concern or wetlands and
things like that, and the endresult was they had I think it

(18:00):
was $5 million that DucksUnlimited brought in $5 million
from the states and paired it,matched it and they used that
fund to develop lots of wetlandsin the area.
So hence the question are youpairing with anybody and have
you looked at otherorganizations potentially to do
some work with?

Speaker 7 (18:20):
Well, all the time and it's a great question we
have a couple of very importantrestoration projects underway
all the time here.
Right, some of the biggestchallenges on these wetlands are
various invasive species.
Oh, probably the focal one.
For so many years here havebeen common carp.

(18:42):
Oh, yes, these were introducedinto Lake Ontario in the 19th
century as a fish for food.
Mm-hmm.
In the 19th century as a fishfor food because we had a native
subspecies of Atlantic salmonin Lake Ontario and
unfortunately by the end of the19th century it was gone and

(19:03):
people were always interested inthe fishery and providing food.
So someone thought, oh, let'sput carp in the lake and they
thrived.
But unfortunately they likecoming up into shallow waters
when they're spawning and stirup the sediments with their
tails, yep, and that chokes outthe vegetation.
So for over 50 years here therehave been various attempts to

(19:30):
get the carp under control and Iknow again, I don't have all of
the history of all this at myfingertips, but I know that we
had a partnership with DucksUnlimited in the early 1990s.
One of the so Coots, paradiseMarsh, is a very shallow wetland
.
It's a couple of hundred acresin extent but it's only about a

(19:51):
meter deep in a lot of places,and one of the things you can do
in a big shallow wetland is cutoff areas like little bays so
that the invasive carp don't getin there and you let the
vegetation regenerate in theselocal areas.
And at the time, ducksUnlimited was very interested in

(20:16):
that approach and we workedwith them to create these areas
that were protected from carpand vegetation was allowed to
recover.
And the way they did that wasessentially by an enormous
rubber tube called an aquadam.
Okay, so imagine a gigantic oldcar inner tube full of water.

(20:36):
You can set it up anywhere, youpump it full of water and now
you've got a berm, you've got aseparation in the wetland that
protects the inner area from thecarp.
We tried that and this was justending when I joined staff but

(20:58):
unfortunately we ran intotrouble with using that approach
.
We found a lot of people likedcoming up to these big things
and punching holes in them, soit didn't prove a practical
approach.
But what has happenedsubsequently?
In RBG, along with a lot ofpartners in the federal and the
provincial government and thelocal cities, created an

(21:21):
interesting system that keepscarp out of the wetland most of
the year.
It's kind of like a giant fishfilter Right.
The wetland only has oneattachment point to Lake Ontario
through Hamilton Harbor, andit's narrow enough that we can
put a.
There's a permanent structureacross it with what are

(21:42):
essentially filters with a gapof about five centimeters.
So anything smaller than thatcan move in and out of the
wetland, yep, and anythinglarger than that gets captured
and our staff are able to sort.
Native fish are allowed to goin whichever direction they were
trying to go, and the invasivecarp and goldfish are sent back

(22:05):
to Hamilton Harbor when theycome in.
And that's been in operationnow since 1997 and has been
pretty effective.

Speaker 6 (22:15):
I know Second Marsh in Oshawa had difficulty with
carp in the Second Marsh as well, and they tried something and I
don't know how successful itwas and I'm not sure if you've
heard of it or not but what theyessentially did was they took
old Christmas trees and made aberm in the same sense that you
have a small section whereaccess is controlled from Lake
Ontario and did the same thing,utilizing Christmas trees to try

(22:38):
and stop the carp from goingthrough.
And to be honest, I've neverhad any discussions nor found if
it was very successful or not,but I know it was something new
that they were trying to doexactly what you're doing.
Not sure if you've heard ofthat or not.

Speaker 7 (22:51):
Well, we pioneered it here.
Oh, did you?
We started working with bermsmade of old Christmas trees
around 1999.
Yep, and we actually won anaward in 2001 from the Ontario
Solid Waste ManagementAssociation for the most
innovative use of old Christmastrees.
Oh, very good.
So the idea is that the publiccan donate their Christmas trees

(23:15):
in December after they've gotthe tinsel and the electrics off
.
Yep, and our staff will hogtiethe trees between pilings and
that makes another kind offilter.
Water is able to move through.
Animals like turtles can crawlup over the top and keep going,

(23:36):
but large fish are preventedfrom moving through the system
during the spawning season.
Right, and we can control that.
We can open it up, veryinteresting.
So we've been doing that everyyear, rebuilding these berms in
shallow areas that are too widefor the approach of this filter,
the fishway.
We've also found that theseberms are highly effective in

(23:58):
changing the course of the flowof water in the wetland.
So we've been using in the pastfew years we've actually
created a couple of these bermsin Coots, paradise Marsh and in
another wetland, the estuary ofthe Grindstone Creek, to help us
direct water flow where we'dlike it to go away, necessarily

(24:18):
from more sensitive areas andout towards, for example,
hamilton Harbor.
Right, we get a lot of heavysurface flow during storm events
and things like that, and we'drather that water which picks up
sediment and other things goout into the middle of the marsh
and perhaps get out intoHamilton Harbor rather than
going into the sensitive areas,and the Christmas trees seem to

(24:41):
be perfect for this.
Very good.

Speaker 6 (24:44):
Well, and did you ever imagine that we'd be
talking about Christmas trees atyour marshland, at the Royal
Botanical Gardens?

Speaker 7 (24:51):
Well, I certainly would.
I mean, one of my roles here isscience communication, and
we're really hoping more folkswill become aware of the amazing
work that this place has beendoing over the years, and so I'm
so grateful for the opportunityto chat on your podcast.

Speaker 6 (25:06):
Oh, we appreciate you coming Now.
Are you familiar?
Because when I was minister,one of the things that I did in
your area was I was the ministerresponsible for protecting the
Hermosa karst.
Yes, and are you familiar withit?
Have you done much work thereat all?

Speaker 7 (25:21):
I haven't done work there.
My efforts are all about RBG'slands, right, but any of these
karst habitats are very rare inthe province.
Any of these karst habitats arevery rare in the province and
the Aramosa, which is up on thesouth side of Hamilton, is a
wonderful sensitive habitat andit's great that it's there.

Speaker 6 (25:41):
Yeah, so, david, now one thing that I'm finding and a
lot of people haven't and I'mlooking at probably bringing
Invasive Species Ontario on totalk about is are you familiar
with what's happening withPhragmites?
And I'm looking at probablybringing Invasive Species
Ontario on to talk about is areyou familiar with what's
happening with Phragmites andthe impact that it's having
throughout the province?
Are you having problems with itthere at the botanical gardens?

Speaker 7 (26:02):
Yes, phragmites australis, or the common reed,
is a plant that's been used bypeople for various landscaping
purposes and it spreads veryrapidly through a lot of tiny
seed and it likes wetland areas,it likes getting into marshy
areas and it sets up big standsof plants where there's nothing

(26:27):
else except phragmites.

Speaker 6 (26:29):
Yeah.

Speaker 7 (26:30):
And so we've been concerned about it on the RBG
lands for a long time.
We do have good ties into otherorganizations trying to deal
with the same kind of problems.
We're not trying to do thingsalone here, so we've been
learning from other agenciesinvasive species councils and

(26:51):
things like that and in a fewplaces here we've been
successful at removing patchesof Phragmites.
But it's the kind of thing thatyou have to do all the time to
keep an eye on them.

Speaker 6 (27:04):
Yeah, well, maybe you can just so the listeners
understand what we're talkingabout kind of describe it like
the height of it.
About kind of describe it likethe height of it.
It's kind of like a.
It's an ornamental one where alot of people will paint it or
dye it and use it in winterbouquets or outside and those
sort of things.
But go ahead and kind of giveus a breakdown of what it looks
like.

Speaker 7 (27:24):
Yeah, well, it's a grass and it grows very tall, as
you're suggesting.
I think it's probably sort ofin the 8, 9, 10-foot range and
on the top of it there's oftenthe flowers and seed head will
look like a fluffy feathersticking up off of the top.
So if you're driving along aroadside and you see this

(27:47):
enormous bank of tall grass withfluffy stuff on it on the top
of it, that's probablyPhragmites.
Yep, Yep, yeah.

Speaker 6 (27:58):
Yeah, I'm seeing it more and more and since I spoke
with actually it was Tom Warden,who used to be the past
president, well, as thepresident for Ducks Unlimited
Canada and he was telling methey had some major problems but
they worked with the NatureConservancy of Canada to
eliminate quite a bit ofPhragmites in some of the
properties that they wereworking with, and very
successfully, according to Tom,which is good to hear.

(28:20):
But yeah, the more I found outas soon as I found out about it.
I see it everywhere now andit's hugely take, like you
mentioned, takes over and movesin very effectively.
But how does it affect?
Are you familiar with how itaffects the ecosystems or not?
Or is it taking away from thecattails, bulrushes and that
sort of things?

Speaker 7 (28:38):
Yeah, it has a.
I think it has a kind of aparticular kind of zone.
It likes where the water is acertain depth.
I'm not an expert so I'm onlyreflecting on what I picked up
from those that are here.
Yeah, but um, it likesspreading, um, I think it's.
It's.
It's at seeds, so the seedsspread.

(28:59):
But it also spreads under thesediments with roots or rhizomes
, so it spreads out and formsvery dense clusters once.
Once there's a big cluster ofthese plants in a wetland.
There's nothing else in thecluster except Phragmites.
Yeah, so some birds might beable to use it, but you know,

(29:20):
wetland animals would have avery hard time moving through it
.
It's so dense and all the otherplants are crowded out, right.

Speaker 6 (29:27):
Right, yeah, and I'm not familiar what may feed on
them, like you mentioned somebirds, but other than that, I
don't know of much else thatwould feed on them.
I know that you know, forexample, wild rice.
I've seen where moose and deerhave gone in and consumed a lot
of the wild rice in areas, butnot so much with Phragmites,
which I'm the more I see it'smore like.

(29:48):
Yeah, this appears to be aproblem.

Speaker 7 (29:53):
Well, this is a challenge, and this is why
plants like phragmites areinvasive.
Um, there's nobody here thateats them, right?
It's a.
It's a new arrival in theecosystem, and until uh,
herbivores, uh, insects or birdsor mammals or anybody else have
figured out how to make use ofall this biomass that these
plants are accumulating, it'llaccumulate, right.

(30:15):
So, whether it's a tree or aninvasive plant of some kind or
anything else, biologists callthis being released from
ecological control.
So in the ecosystem normally,there's all kinds of things that
will eat plants and be part ofthat food chain.

(30:36):
But many of the plants that webring over for ornamental
purposes or landscaping purposesor other kinds of reasons too I
don't want to single anybodyout and many things that are
invasive have come inaccidentally.
The challenge is that there'snothing that's used to eating
them, so they're released fromthe control that they would have

(30:58):
in their natural habitat, andthat's certainly still the case
with Phragmites, I think.

Speaker 6 (31:05):
Well, I know I did introduce a private member's
bill that got the shippingindustry extremely concerned and
what it was was that anycorporation that was found and
to be responsible forintroducing invasive species
into Ontario was responsible forthe cleanup and the cost for

(31:28):
those cleanups and things likezebra mussels I think it was
ontario hydro.
Their intakes and their, theirouttakes for their nuclear pants
was something like 50 60million dollars was the cost.
And not only that, but I thinkit was one ship that came from
scandinavia that was responsiblefor bringing in uh, it may have

(31:49):
been the, the round goby, butI'm not sure which one and it
could be identified to one shipbecause that was the only ship
and it was the only place.
And all of a sudden now they'reeverywhere in Ontario.
So the shipping industry, theydid not like this any way, shape
or form.
But I had a lot of buy-in.
Actually I was asked to presentbefore a US Senate committee on
it in Michigan because theywere very, very thought it was a

(32:13):
great idea, although I wasn'tso sure if it was more political
grandstanding than actuallytrying to take care of a problem
as I was trying to do.
But they found it veryinteresting.
But we get all these invasivespecies by design or intent
coming in, sometimes, as youmentioned, for ornamental bases,
such as purple loosestrife.
That now is having huge impactsand we're now looking how do we

(32:36):
manage it.
Now it's here because it isbecoming a global community and
we're getting a lot of thesethings here, such as phragmites,
that are taking over now yeah,yeah, well, I mean, it's a
challenge and and uh, the purpleloosestrife example is an
interesting one.

Speaker 7 (32:51):
It started out as an ornamental plant, yep, and there
was a federal research centerin Manitoba that thought they
had a sterile hybrid plant so itcould be used in ornamental
horticulture and wouldn't setseed.
And unfortunately it did setseed.
I did not know that.

(33:11):
So when you start looking atsome of these cases again, some
of them are a complete accidentin terms of something getting
loose.
Some of them were brought overintentionally, but nobody ever
intended that they becomeinvasive, right, and when you're
dealing with these species,often there is a big economic

(33:31):
aspect to their presence,whether that's the cost of
cleaning up when they're looseor the damage they might do to
industry or the landscape.
Some of the famous ones arethings like the emerald ash
borer, the insect which has justreally wiped out ash trees in

(33:55):
Ontario.
Yeah, again, no one intendedfor these things to get loose,
but the consequences are severe.

Speaker 6 (34:01):
Well, I was minister when it and was the first one to
report on it when it firstarrived.
Well, it probably arrived justbefore I became minister, but I
was the one that ended updealing with it, because it
landed in the Windsor area.
Oh, yes, and it came inuncontaminated skids from Asia,
yeah, and that's where the eggscame in, and then they spread.
So now all skids have to bedecontaminated before they can

(34:24):
be shipped and those sorts ofthings, or non-wood skids, in
order to make sure things likethat don't happen.
But we're getting all kind ofinvasive species from yeah,
there's been quite a few thatare attacking a lot of the trees
now.

Speaker 7 (34:38):
Yeah, and again, we have to understand that what we
do as people has consequences,and we're a very important part
of every ecosystem on the planet.
We have an enormous capacityfor good and change, and
sometimes these things happentoo, and we have to figure out

(34:58):
how to deal with them.

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Speaker 6 (36:19):
And now it's time for another testimonial for Chaga
Health and Wellness.
Okay, we're here in Lindsay,ontario, with Rusty, who's up
from California and visits usevery year, and Rusty has been a
faithful Chaga user for a longtime.
Rusty, maybe you can just tellus about your experience with
Chaga.

Speaker 3 (36:35):
Well, I feel that it's had a significant impact on
my health and well-being.
I believe in what I'm doing.
I think that Jerry is veryknowledgeable on it.
If he says something, I takethat very seriously.
He has spent most of his life inthe health care field and

(36:56):
certainly knows what he'stalking about, and I like to be
around people like that becausethat's what keeps me healthy.
And I'm 80 now and I'm going totry to enjoy what I've created
with the motorcycle and onething or another, which will
require that I live for at leastanother 10 years to get back

(37:18):
what I've invested in my healthand wellness.

Speaker 6 (37:23):
So you're seeing a big benefit from it an overall
healthy environment and when yougo back to California next
month, you actually take quite abit with you back to California
, don't you?

Speaker 3 (37:34):
Oh yes, we're going to be there for eight months and
we don't want to run out, so wetake it back and we take it
every day and you know, like Isay, it's not a problem for me.

Speaker 6 (37:49):
Right, so how do you take it, rusty?

Speaker 3 (37:52):
I put a tablespoon or a teaspoon rather in my coffee
each morning.
Okay, when I brew the coffee,yeah, and I put it in as the
coffee's brewing.
I put that in with it.

Speaker 6 (38:03):
Oh, very good.

Speaker 3 (38:04):
And I put a little bit of cinnamon in with it too,
right.
And then I sweeten my coffeebecause, take the bitterness, a
little bit of bitterness.
I use a chaga and maple mixthat you make up for those that
want to be well and stay well.

(38:25):
Okay.

Speaker 6 (38:27):
Well, thanks very much.
We appreciate you taking thetime and sharing your chaga
experience with you, and we'llmake sure you have a safe trip
back to California.

Speaker 3 (38:34):
Sure enough, all right, okay, thank you, jerry.
Yeah, thanks, rusty.
Thanks, sir, my pleasure.

Speaker 6 (38:47):
We interrupt this program to bring you a special
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If you've listened this far andyou're still wondering about
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(39:11):
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(39:34):
around five or six cups of tea.
Hey, thanks for listening Backto the episode.
So, david, I have aninteresting question.
At least I think it'sinteresting.
How did the Royal BotanicalGardens get the royal
designation?

Speaker 7 (39:50):
Wow, that's a great one and it is interesting.
Gardens get the royaldesignation wow, that's a great
one and it is interesting.
Um, it, it comes, it comes outof a lot of um.
I have to divert from talkingabout biology to talking about
history for a minute.
Yep, uh, rbg apparently was anidea of one guy, initially
thomas baker mcqueston, and um,initially Thomas Baker McQuiston

(40:12):
, and he was part of this parkplanning board, or the park
board in the city of Hamilton inthe 1920s and he went over to
the UK for a few weeks onesummer 1924, with some family
members as a tour and he wasalready responsible for the

(40:34):
creation of several big parks inthe area, like Gage Park in
Hamilton was one of his projectsin the early 20s, and he went
to Royal Botanic Gardens Kew,which is outside of London, and
Royal Botanic Garden Edinburghup in Scotland.
And just the timing is suchthat everyone who's looked at
his story believes that it musthave happened then.

(40:56):
But we think he had this lightbulb over the head moment.
I need one of these in Hamilton.
Oh yeah, he was.
He and his colleagues were verymuch around the creation of
amenities in Hamilton andthroughout Ontario.
In 1934, he was elected to theprovincial legislature and

(41:17):
became a minister and they wereall about what we would now call
perhaps as town planning orcivic development.
But they thought that theycould see that Hamilton was
developing strongly with bigindustry as an important
industrial center.
But they also felt that thepeople living in the city needed

(41:40):
access to green space.
They needed parks to improvetheir lives and make livable in
the city make it livable.
And so he came back and by 1928, this board of park management
was talking about RoyalBotanical Gardens in Hamilton as
a thing.
Right.
They were looking around forland that was available and in

(42:03):
1927, they were able to secure afairly large patch of land on
the south side of CootesParadise Marsh for two projects.
Most of it became the firstthing that was called Royal
Botanical Gardens, but the otherwas 50 acres was set aside for
the Hamilton campus of McMasterUniversity.

(42:23):
Mcmaster had been founded inToronto in the 1880s and they
were really keen on movingbecause they were finding it
hard to kind of compete with Uof T and they'd been courting
Hamilton.
And so the same deal that gavethe first bit of land for RBG

(42:44):
also gave rise to the firstHamilton campus for McMaster.
So around 1929, this board ofpark management.
They were preparing proposalsand ideas and looking into what
their idea could evolve into.
And in the early 20th century ifyou wanted to call something

(43:05):
royal in Ontario, certainly youhad to be serious about it.
You had to be serious about it.
The expectation was that itwould be with the approval of
the if not the king, thensomebody pretty high up in
England around it.
Right, many organizations thathave a royal name have a charter

(43:25):
or some other kind of formalrelationship.
I know some of them, forexample, have to regularly
reapply for the status of usingthe royal term.
And in our case it's a littlebit different.
We went through the channels,or the city of Hamilton went
through the channels.
They asked the federalgovernment of Canada for

(43:46):
permission to use the name RoyalBotanical Gardens for these
gardens they were planning onbuilding in Hamilton, because it
was all still.
It was all still proposal.

Speaker 6 (43:55):
Right.

Speaker 7 (43:56):
And in the spring of 1930, the Board of Park
Management received word fromthe Secretary of State for
External Affairs in Ottawa thatthe name was approved.
Oh, so it's nothing morecomplicated really than an
approval by King George V to goahead and use the name was
approved, so it's nothing morecomplicated really than an
approval by King George V to goahead and use the name.

(44:19):
We don't have any other strongassociation with the British
royal family or anything elselike that.
We're functionally anot-for-profit corporation that
was created by an act of theprovince of Ontario following
all this work by the city ofHamilton.
So we use it, of course, as ourname and I think we try to

(44:43):
present a really excellentexperience for folks who come
and visit.
But we don't have any otherkind of designation per se
except the use of the name.

Speaker 6 (44:53):
Interesting so David, any other kind of designation
per se except the use of thename Interesting so David.
What other sort of thingshappens at RBG?
Is there research projects?
Is there like, is there tours,people come in and see the
facility, or is it just a kindof a walk around or it kind of
gives us a lightness on whatkind of happens there.

Speaker 7 (45:12):
Well, all kinds of things do happen.
We really have sort of twofaces to what we do.
Two areas of our business.
Really important and criticalis people coming to have
wonderful experiences in thegardens and in the nature
sanctuaries themselves.
We have five major garden areashere and we are always working

(45:35):
very hard to put on events thatwould be interesting culinary
events, cultural events so it'smuch more than simply coming to
see a garden.
We feel that people valueexperiences and so we focus on
that and we're having somefantastic results with that.

(45:58):
Even in the wintertime, when thegardens are, they're often open
but not as much to see.
For example, we put on aninternal or an inside exhibit in
the winter months.
This past year was wonderful.
We dressed up our main visitorcenter with all kinds of plants
and displays related to Alice inWonderland, called Alice in

(46:20):
Bloomland, and the response fromthe public was marvelous.
We had a very large number ofpeople come out to experience
the setup out to experience thesetup.
So the gardens are both in thecity of Burlington, adjacent to
our main building on Plains RoadWest in Burlington, and also in

(46:41):
Hamilton.
Our arboretum is in Hamilton, abig open space, and also the
historic rock garden which isthe oldest part of RBG that's
operational as a garden it wasfinished around 1932 and quite a
spectacular space.
So there's always something tosee in the gardens and in many

(47:03):
cases there's programming orevents to participate in.

Speaker 6 (47:08):
Interesting.
So the Alice in Wonderlandevent did, did you have?
Uh, do you know what Fly, asScary is?

Speaker 7 (47:15):
I'm sorry, I don't know the name off the top.

Speaker 6 (47:17):
Um, it's a uh, uh, it's the magic mushroom.
Oh, I see.

Speaker 7 (47:25):
I don't expect so.

Speaker 6 (47:26):
Uh, no, I would not, but um.

Speaker 7 (47:28):
I do a lot of family friendly here.

Speaker 6 (47:30):
The, the.
I do a lot of, uh, mushroomshows.
Uh, we do a lot of mushroomshows.
We have a lot of mycologists onand we talk about a lot of
those different aspects ofwhat's out there and things like
that.
So I know Alice in Wonderlandconsumed one of the ones that
was to make her larger, make hersmall sort of things.

Speaker 7 (47:50):
But interesting To make her large or make her small
sort of things.
But interesting, Well, we didhave.
I mean, there certainly weremodels of mushrooms as part of
the landscaping interiors thatwere done here.
It was certainly there, but weweren't drawing attention to
mushrooms.

Speaker 6 (48:02):
David, do you know the?
What's that video game, DonkeyKong?

Speaker 7 (48:07):
Oh, I'm aware of it, jared, I'm not really onto it.

Speaker 6 (48:10):
Okay, no, when it first came out out, that's the
mushroom that uh donkey kongconsumes as well.
It's very, very uh, widelyrecognized.
It's kind of a red mushroomwith white dots on the cap.
Yes, anyways, but that'sanother story.
So this is how you gain fundinguh, to, to fund everything that
takes place there is is havingevents like this and people and

(48:30):
alice in wonderland and stuffwell, it's Well, it's one of the
routes.

Speaker 7 (48:34):
I mean we're supported very strongly by the
province of Ontario.
We have a wonderful operatinggrant and support that helps us
present all of this for thepeople of Ontario.
We have municipal grants fromthe city of Hamilton and Halton
region.
We have municipal grants fromthe city of Hamilton and Halton
region and together thegovernment grants are about a

(48:54):
third of our budget Right, andall the rest of it is
self-generated revenue.
So we have about 16,000households who are members and
their support is critical for us.
We welcome about 400,000 peoplea year through the gardens and
if they're not members they'repaying for admission Right.
But we have corporate grants,donations, earned revenue

(49:18):
through things like renting ourspaces out for conferences or
other events.
We do everything we can to earnand grow our revenue and that
supports the good work that wedo.

Speaker 6 (49:30):
Right.
So which ministry, David, isthat funds basically receive
your funding from?

Speaker 7 (49:36):
I believe it's again.
I'm sorry if I haven't got thename in front of me.
That's okay, but it's tourismand culture.

Speaker 6 (49:44):
Oh, okay, and the only reason I ask that is
because we've got a recordingwith the Ministry of the
Environment coming up next week,so I thought I'd do a plug for
you if it was environment but atourism, yeah.

Speaker 7 (49:54):
We're more aligned to the cultural agencies and we're
akin but not exactly the samestatus as the other agencies
like the Royal Ontario Museumand Science North.

Speaker 6 (50:04):
Right.

Speaker 7 (50:05):
So we're kind of a relative.

Speaker 6 (50:07):
Okay, so and it seems I'm getting notice already I
need to correct myself it wasn'tDonkey Kong, it was Super Mario
, where the mushroom was in.
I'm already getting notice.
Oh, you got the wrong one,wrong mushroom.
Oh, no, wrong game, wrong videogame where it was in.

Speaker 7 (50:22):
Yeah, Well, again, we do a lot.
The people are also.
We also get about 400,000visitors a year on our nature
trails Very good, and there getabout 400 000 visitors a year on
our nature trails very good,and uh, there's about 20 to 25
kilometers of trails hererunning through these nature
sanctuaries.
Uh and uh, our.
Again, the primary thing for meis how, how well we're

(50:44):
connecting the, the public andour audience with the kinds of
things that we see here that areso exciting and engaging.
For you know, kind of abiological nerd like myself, not
everybody gets that or wants tosee that kind of thing.
So there's also lots ofofferings culinary, artistic,
cultural and it's alwaysexciting to see these things

(51:06):
happening.

Speaker 6 (51:07):
So, david, where do you draw your?
Where do the people that attend?
So, david, where do you drawyour?
Where do the people that attend?
And I got to tell you onTuesday last, two days ago, I
was in Halliburton, ontario kindof like for the international
listeners, about two hours kindof north north, pretty much
north of Toronto, and there weresome visitors from England and

(51:29):
they were asking around.
They said, look, before we goback, the one thing we want to
do we want to see a bear, and Ican't believe the number of
tourists.
I was in Bob Cajun and there'sa place there that advertises in
Germany and all these Germanpeople were there and they said
the exact same thing when can wego to see bears?

Speaker 7 (51:52):
Well, that's a sore point for me, jerry, because I
spent nine years doing fieldwork in Algonquin Park and I
never saw a bear.
See, there you go.
And then my friend Marty, whowas a pathfinder doing this work
on turtles in the samelaboratory.
Just before I was done he wentoff and became the bear

(52:13):
biologist in the MNR.
Yeah, yeah, so I hope theyeventually saw their bears Down
here.
We're not known for our bears.

Speaker 6 (52:24):
No.
So where are your visitorscoming from?
Do you kind of track that sortof thing?

Speaker 7 (52:27):
Yeah, well, we certainly do.
It's really important tounderstand for an agency like
this who's coming to visit, whatthey're expecting to see and
how to cultivate that market,how to keep people interested.
Absolutely, I don't have thenumbers in front of me, that's
okay.
We have, I think, a dropprimarily about an hour's drive

(52:49):
in any direction from RBG itself, an hour's drive in any
direction from RBG itself.
So that's the GHTA, the GoldenHorseshoe, toronto, mississauga,
out to St Catharines andNiagara Falls and out to the
west to Guelph andKitchener-Waterloo.
I think, if I remember thenumbers, roughly about an hour's
drive from RBG, there's aboutsix and a half or seven million

(53:11):
people.

Speaker 6 (53:12):
Oh, okay, so that's a good draw, there's a good draw.

Speaker 7 (53:14):
We certainly do get visitors from farther afield,
sometimes in organized tours,right, and every bit of
visitation is a wonderful thing.
We welcome everyone.

Speaker 6 (53:25):
So if somebody were to attend, how much time would
they be able to expect to beable to get a fulfilling
experience at the RoyalBotanical Gardens?
Like, how much time are welooking for somebody to go in?

Speaker 7 (53:35):
It really depends on what specific things they're
looking to do.
We know that in visiting alarge public garden, people are,
I think, looking for anexperience of about two to three
hours.
Right, and that's certainlypossible here at RBG Center,
where we have an indoorconservatory that is lovely

(53:57):
year-round, but especially nicewhen it's wet and cold outside.
And then across the street isour large garden area called the
Gardens in Hendry Park, andthis is about 15 acres of
gardens that you can easilyspend a couple of hours taking
it all in.
Oh yeah, and that's just onearea.
Then there's additional gardensthe laking garden, the rock

(54:20):
garden and the arboretum.
If you're willing to move fromsite to site, because it does
require transport, some of ourgardens are three or four
kilometers apart, just becauseof the scale of the whole
landscape.
Right, you can easily spend aday here.
Oh, very good.

Speaker 6 (54:39):
And I hope some people do Very good.
So you work on other thingslike prairie habitat and maybe
you can just enlighten us onsome of the things, and I've
seen quite a bit of prairie workin some parts of the province,
but you do quite a bit of workwith prairie grasslands and
things like that.
Well, we do a bit.

Speaker 7 (54:59):
Prairie grasslands are really interesting.
The province used to haveseveral hundred square miles of
prairie and it's not the kind ofthing you think of.
Ontario right away oh yeah, allthe prairie in Ontario.
You'd think about out west.
Ontario right away oh yeah, allthe prairie in Ontario, you'd
think about out west.
But over time most of thatprairie landscape was converted

(55:23):
into farmland and today there'sonly a tiny remnant of it.
But prairie is particularly richin biodiversity.
There are some bird species,for example, that just love it,
and so we decided some years agowe started doing this.
Actually in 1997, was the firstact of a prairie restoration
burn.
We decided to bring prairieback to our landscape, and so

(55:43):
there's a couple of areas on thenorth and the south shore of
Cootes Paradise Marsh wherewe've been actively converting
old farmland that we own intomore natural prairie.
Oh yeah, and this is along-term project that involves
things like seeding plants thatare natural to a prairie

(56:07):
Probably the most prominent inour area are things like Canada
goldenrod and then taking stepsto remove the other plants that
have accumulated over time, someof them invasive, some of them
things like Kentucky bluegrassthat were used previously when
it was parkland and one of themain ways we do that is, every

(56:27):
couple of years in these spaces,we undertake a controlled burn.
Okay, so we will have somespecialists come in and set a
very quick, low-burning fireRight.
That helps us manage theprairie.
Mm-hmm, mm.

Speaker 6 (56:43):
Interesting.
Yeah, now with the prairie, doyou get species like are you
familiar with the loggerheadshrike, mm-hmm, things like that
that'll come along, so birderswould see these sorts of things
there, or that sort of thing.

Speaker 7 (56:55):
Or yeah, uh, loggerhead shrike has been seen,
I think, um, one of the realprominent ones, on one of our
habitats that's come back.
Uh, is the bobbling okay, uh,which is also an endangered
species, and uh, these habitatsis kind of a, if you build it,
they will come situation.
Uh, we're not trying to to toplant those animals there or or,

(57:16):
but, but if you have thehabitat they'll, they'll show up
yeah, I used to say bobolinksall over the time, 40 years, all
over the place, but all thetime.

Speaker 6 (57:24):
but I hardly see them at all anymore, like I used to,
and I think part of the reasonthat is is the way the farming
practices have taken place nowbecause, uh, from if I remember
correctly, they are groundnesters, if I believe, and just
the way they harvest hay andthings like that makes it
difficult for them to findsecure areas.
But I'm far from an expert as abirder.

Speaker 7 (57:47):
Oh, and me too.
There are some wonderfulbirders around here, but I'm
well, as you know, a past turtlebiologist.

Speaker 6 (57:56):
Very interesting, David.
So what else sort of things canpeople, Eric, you can tell us
about the Royal BotanicalGardens?

Speaker 7 (58:02):
Yeah, well, it's a fascinating place and it's very
seasonal too.
There's something here that's alittle bit different every
season.
The prairie habitat areas arerelatively small compared to our
big wetlands and woodland areas.
If you want to go for a walk inthe woods, again, we're a
fantastic place for that.
People will go on to thewetland areas with canoes or

(58:26):
kayaks from time to time, andthat's also an activity that's
pretty straightforward to do.
We have a canoe and kayaklaunching site at Princess Point
, for example.
Seasonally, there's color inthe forests In the wintertime,
if it's a cold enough longenough winter.
That big wetland called CootsParadise Marsh is the biggest

(58:49):
natural skating rink in the area.
Oh, interesting, yeah, so again, it's just hard to encompass it
all relatively quickly, but thegarden areas are also a
fantastic place throughout theyear.
Some of the gardens have veryseasonal bloom periods.
Right now we are in the springbloom period and we've got

(59:13):
really big collections of thingslike lilacs and, uh, magnolia
and um, the collections werestarted uh, 50 or 60 years ago,
Right, and now some of theplants that are in these
collections, as far as we cantell, we are the only ones that
are still growing them.
So that's another reallyinteresting aspect of being a

(59:34):
botanical garden is protectingor preserving this endangered
cultivated plant diversity.
We don't necessarily thinkabout plants as though they were
kind of works of art culturally, but of course, for the
horticultural plants someonebred them on purpose as though
they were kind of works of artculturally.
But of course, for thehorticultural plants someone

(59:58):
bred them on purpose and theycome and go in their popularity
in the commercial nursery trade.
But there's lots of them thatwere beautiful plants and may
have had scents and so on, andthey're not interesting to the
nursery trade anymore.
But we still have some of themthat were beautiful plants and
may have had scents and so on,and they're not interesting to
the nursery trade anymore, butwe still have some of them here.
So another really interestingaspect, and our big lilac garden

(01:00:22):
is at its peak right now.

Speaker 6 (01:00:23):
Oh, so, david, can people buy plants at the
Botanical Gardens?

Speaker 7 (01:00:28):
We have a limited I think we have a limited
selection at different times ofthe year.
We have a lovely gift shop hereat the main center, right, but
I'm not certain off the top ofmy head what might be available
at any time.

Speaker 6 (01:00:40):
Yeah, and how about bees?
Do you have hives there to helppollinate?

Speaker 7 (01:00:45):
We have had in the past.
I'm not certain that we havethem today.
We don't do that sort of thingourselves.
We have them today.
We don't do that sort of thingourselves, but we have had
partnerships with privateapiarists who have had hives
near our gardens at varioustimes.
I don't think there's one thisyear.

Speaker 6 (01:01:04):
Right, yeah, because I would think that with your
contacts at Guelph you wouldhave some good contacts.
They've got a good researchcenter there for bees, who we've
had on a podcast in the past,but you know, just inquiring, so
people we're giving them asense of, okay, they show up,
you can potentially buy someplants and things in your shop,

(01:01:26):
that you have goods for salethere and other things.

Speaker 7 (01:01:29):
So, and giving people some ideas which is good and
really the best place to findout what's happening here is our
website, uh it.
It is a way that you can seeall the different garden areas,
the natural areas, um under, uh,under kind of the page on
events.
You can see what's coming upbecause we keep that up to date
all the time.

(01:01:49):
Right, a lot of things are freeto attend.
For example, if you want to seethe conservation work that we
do in the wetland, people arevery welcome to go and actually
see this Coots Paradise Fishwayin operation and the schedule is
posted on the website.
It's just rbgca.
Okay, some of our experiences.

(01:02:10):
You have to purchase ticketsfor Some of our experiences.
You have to purchase ticketsfor Some of our culinary
experiences or dance shows,musical events, but you can do
that online on the website.

Speaker 6 (01:02:21):
Yeah, and you're supporting a good cause, and
that's some of the things.
These things just don't happenout of the goodness of the heart
.
There has to be.
You know, you have to monitor,you have to maintain, you have
to take care of all these things.
You need to generate revenuesto do that.

Speaker 7 (01:02:34):
Yes.

Speaker 6 (01:02:35):
So you mentioned about canoe and kayak launches.
Do they rent them there forpeople to rent a canoe or kayak?

Speaker 7 (01:02:42):
I don't believe we're offering that service at this
time, just wondering, yeah, yeah, it's something I believe we
have done in the past and ourfolks who are responsible for
developing our various businesslines, I think, are looking at
these kinds of things all thetime.
Right?
But again, the best thing to dois to check what's listed on
the website for what's available.

Speaker 6 (01:03:01):
Right, all right, okay, dave.
Well, thank you very much fortaking the time to be on the
program.
We really appreciate it.
I found it very interesting andenlightening and, quite frankly
, I have not been to the RoyalBotanical Gardens, although I
did have someone, mary AlicePeck, that used to work for me,
that left and went to thePremier's office and then she
went over there and spent ashort period of time working

(01:03:21):
with your people and I think itsounds like something that I
very much enjoy.
I know we have memberships atthe zoo, toronto Zoo, and things
like that, because we enjoygetting out for a couple of
hours, and this might besomething that we can add to it,
to our desire to get out andenjoy some of those things.
So, david, how can people getin touch with you to find out
more information or find outmore details about the Royal

(01:03:42):
Botanical Gardens?

Speaker 7 (01:03:44):
Well, thank you First of all.
Thank you, Gerry, and if you'recoming out this way, get to
Hamilton, drop me a line.
That sounds good.
Hamilton, drop me a line thatsounds good.
The best way is the website.
It's just rbgca and that willgive you an enormous amount of
information about what's here,even maps of our trails.
All that kind of stuff isonline.

(01:04:04):
In terms of getting in touch,there is a contact us form on
the website and you can send ina question to our information
desk and they will send thatquestion off to whomever can
help.

Speaker 6 (01:04:16):
Very good.
Well, we appreciate that andit's something that our
international listeners can addto their agenda when they come
to Ontario to visit us and seethings as significant, things
like the Royal Botanical Gardensout Hamilton Way.

Speaker 7 (01:04:29):
We would look forward to it.
Thank you, Gerry.

Speaker 6 (01:04:31):
Thank you, David.
We really appreciate you takingthe time and it's just
something that we're learningsomething new and interesting
about a lot of different aspects, whether it's wetlands or
prairies or all the trails andeverything else you offer at the
Royal Botanical Gardens, andjust some more information for
people to better enjoy out thereand enjoy things that are
happening out there under thecanopy.
Thanks, David.

Speaker 7 (01:04:50):
You're very welcome, Jerry.

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