IS MONEY BLOCKING YOUR DREAM? HERE’S HOW TO BEGIN! WITH DAVEED BENITO

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People often focus on all the reasons why they can’t achieve something—lack of money, equipment, or confidence. But what if we flipped the script? Let’s talk about all the ways you can break through those barriers. 💡

We believe this is the moment for independent creators to rise, break the rules, and maybe even reshape the entertainment industry. Hollywood might just have to step aside. Are you ready to conquer your fear of the camera and start creating? 🎥

In this episode, I’m joined by my friend and business partner, Daveed Benito, who started with nothing—literally having to choose between buying a Home Depot light for photography or eating that week. Through grit and determination, he’s worked his way up to collaborating with some of the biggest bands and brands on the planet, from music videos for The Offspring to major campaigns for Walmart.

I’ll also share some of my own scrappy DIY hacks for filmmaking and discuss how affordable tech is leveling the playing field. We’ll explore the evolution of music videos, the battle between TikTok and YouTube, and how AI is opening up incredible opportunities for creators everywhere.

We want you to leave this episode thinking, That thing I thought I couldn’t start? I’m going to figure out how. This episode is a celebration of underdogs, fearless creativity, and breaking norms. If you’re ready to stop making excuses and start making magic, this is the inspiration you’ve been waiting for. 🚀

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:02):
Hello and welcome to underdogs, bootstrappers and
game changers.
This is for those of you thatare starting with nothing and
using business to change theirstars, motivating people who
disrupted industry standards.
This is the real side ofbusiness.
This isn't Shark Tank.
My aim with this podcast is totake away some of the imaginary

(00:22):
roadblocks that are out there.
I want to help more underdogs,because underdogs are truly who
change the world.
This is part of our Content forGood initiative.
All the proceeds from themonetization of this podcast
will go to charitable causes.
It's for the person that wantsit.
Hello and welcome to anotherepisode of Underdogs,

(00:45):
bootstrappers, game Changers.
And guess what?
I got my great friend Daveedhere today.
Motherfucker, all right, yetanother one of my friends that
does amazing things and is superafraid of the camera.
And we were just talking aboutit right before the episode
started.
Believe it or not, I was themost afraid that you could ever

(01:05):
be of the camera.
I mean, I turned down fourreality shows in our first
business.
They approached us, you know,wanting to do it.
I was like no way, you know, Iwas afraid to even say like if
you talk to me about thebusiness, it's like yeah, I'd
say I work there.

Speaker 2 (01:21):
You know you could probably never.
In the club days I wanted to beon a reality show, I wanted to
do this and that, but I don'tknow what's changed.
But I've always liked being.
You know.
Now it's behind the scenes, butI have footage from those days
like terabytes, because I wouldhave cameras following me
through the clubs.
And I look back and it's goodbecause it's humility and I'm

(01:42):
going.
And I look back and it's goodbecause it's humility and I'm
going, oh no.

Speaker 1 (01:46):
You know part of me.
I was approached really youngto 21 or something like that
with a reality show when I wasdoing the concert stuff and like
I'm kind of glad for not doingthat.

Speaker 2 (01:56):
Right, yeah, well, I mean, I knew people that did it,
yeah, and I still know somethat are, you know, later in
life, yeah, and you know laterin life, yeah, and you know a
couple of them still holding onto that.

Speaker 1 (02:06):
I mean well, and the other thing is like, how many
stupid things did we do when wewere 20?
Oh yeah, and that's now.
That's out there for the world.
The poor kids now growing upwith social media their stuff's
out there anyway.

Speaker 2 (02:15):
It's right in front of you, yeah.
I mean I was being the idiotfilming, you know, having the uh
, you know film crews follow ineverything, but never did
anything stupid on camera.
Yeah, but I can just imaginethat the 20, 20 something year
old oh.

Speaker 1 (02:36):
God.
So David is my business partnerin our uh, bigger production
company, um, and so I invitedhim on today because, like, his
story is an underdog story, um,so kind of like some preface.
Like this year we've doneoffspring music video, so got
really cool shout out to castlesand coasters, by the way.

(02:56):
And yes, yes, uh, like they letus go out there.
It's here in Phoenix, um, andit's an amusement park.
And they let us, like, can Iuse the word, free reign?

Speaker 2 (03:05):
They really like it was free reign.
Yeah, I mean they Gail, she wasthe point of contact, but
trying to get a hold of them.
The initial idea was to film inSanta Monica and that came with
a lot of restrictions andcastles and coasters, came with
a lot of like, less restrictionand a lot of freedom, and they

(03:26):
actually like set the rides forme to say like let's go now,
yeah, you know, in thesummertime, so you know you
don't have anything.

Speaker 1 (03:33):
It was a really cool experience being able to be and
then like we made those poorkids ride the roller coaster.

Speaker 2 (03:38):
The actors, oh they loved it Like 50 times.
Yeah, Shout out to them too.
I mean, they loved it Like 50times.

Speaker 1 (03:41):
Yeah, shout out to them too.

Speaker 2 (03:44):
I mean they, they loved it, they were, they were,
you know, all happy about thosescenes.
I of course made the excuse of,like I got to operate the
camera so I can't get on thatfucking thing.
No way, no.

Speaker 1 (03:57):
I really enjoy when we get to work on those projects
.
Did another one for Walmartthis year.

Speaker 2 (04:02):
Played around with some stuff for Yellowstone's
food product brand got to be thecowboy got a Stetson hat out of
the deal, yeah, and of all thisstuff.
It's been an adventure lastcouple of years and it's been
interesting to see where it'sgoing, compared to what I've
been doing for the last 15, 16years out of the 18, almost 19

(04:25):
years.

Speaker 1 (04:26):
I mean, and folks I want to preface this for you too
.
David is another one of myfriends that won't get in front
of the camera.
I've dragged him in here today.
Um, he like he could have alaundry list of people that he's
worked with that you wouldrecognize, um, when we do shoots
, uh, he will sew the costume or, excuse me, the dress for
somebody.
He will make the jewelry fromscratch.

(04:47):
He will build a robot, ifthat's what it takes to get that
production done.
He turned, uh, one of ourstudio buildings into a
graveyard the other day and shotthis really cool.
Actually, we'll try to postsome pictures in this video so
you can see, like, some of thatstuff and, um, amazing creative
that I work with and I reallyenjoy when we get to work on

(05:07):
really cool projects together.

Speaker 2 (05:09):
I love that stuff.
It's just about you knowdocumenting it.
I have such a hard time withself promotion.
That's why my social media is,you know, it's never consistent.
Yeah, what I built social mediaon was a platform that I was
utilizing for, for monetization,which was publishing, and that
involved a lot of the you know,posters and girls and stuff like

(05:31):
that which I guarantee you'veseen some of his posters out
there and stuff, whether youknow it or not, yeah, they're.
I mean they, they've been putthrough so many stores and so
many places and stolen countlesstimes.
So you know it's not me makingall that money with it.
It's other people, you know,stealing it.
But the thing is that's not whoI am, that's not my persona.

(05:54):
All the girl stuff, the models,you know I love working with
those people.
It's been amazing to do that.
It's just I'm behind a curtain,I don't show my face and I
don't talk about much, and sopeople have an idea about me.

Speaker 1 (06:09):
Well, what's interesting too?
It's like people are going tohave those perceptions too, and
you and I have known each othera long time, and I even had some
of those perceptions about youwhen we first met.
Of course I feel bad about itnow.
No-transcript true at all.

(06:46):
You know, and like it's.
It's so funny about my friendsthat are like these hidden gems,
like David and squally isanother person that's been on
here.
You know it's like you guys aredoing so many amazing things
and the people out there thatare popular for doing these
things aren't even holding acandle to you guys doing these
things, like squally and fitness.

Speaker 2 (07:10):
He builds his own equipment, literally has a whole
welding shop that he builds hisown equipment and invents
workouts, you know, and that'sthat's what I would have loved
starting out with this.
Um, because that's what I hadto do with all of my equipment,
I couldn't afford anything, so Ihad to make my own filming rigs
, and all that too.

Speaker 1 (07:21):
That's where I want to go today and that's where you
know I always have a hiddenagenda, you know.
Yes.
I want to help my friend face,fear, um and uh and get him out
there in the world.
But uh, hidden agenda for youfolks today.
Um, the message is everybodysays I need this to start, I
need that to start.
I was working with somebodyyesterday and she's like I need
this and I need that and likethousands of dollars worth of

(07:42):
stuff.
I'm like no, you don't, youdon't need that stuff.
And so let's backtrack for asecond.
Like you, first start gettinginto photography right With
generally is really expensive.
Like I have a couple thousanddollar camera that I shoot
photos with.

Speaker 2 (07:55):
Oh, and it's nothing in comparison to what it was
back in 2006.
Talk about it when I started in2006, I had the most base model
of a Canon, yeah, and that wasstill about $1,000, and it was a
kit lens just crap.
But for me, I didn't look atthis as learning photography.
I even went to college and tooksome classes of photography and

(08:16):
dropped them quick, mainlybecause they wanted me to get
into film, and I realized I'mbroke, yeah, and I started this.
I'm telling you so broke.
It was a decision of $50 toeither eat food or purchase dome
lights from Home Depot, and Iliterally can show a picture of
these things.
I had no idea about color,temperature, lighting, anything

(08:41):
technical.
To this day, I really don'trely on anything technical, and
when people, I mean, just as youknow, we work for a magazine.
One of the many fights that Igot into with people was the
editor, and it was about how IPhotoshop something and he had a
whole way of complaining aboutit.
We got into a fight and he saidI went through and just did it

(09:03):
30 minutes, sent it to him and Isaid I get to the same result.
Yeah, this is what it lookslike.
It's better than what you weredoing.

Speaker 1 (09:09):
You know not to brag, but that's how uh it's a good
point because you know, like weteach certain somebody a certain
way and say it has to be donethis way.

Speaker 2 (09:18):
Well, curriculum, yeah you look at, uh, everything
from how we were taught math tohow it's taught now.
Sure, when I look atphotography and I look at, you
know, people, like even somebodywho may have worked with
recently they're technical, yeah, but it kind of loses the magic
.
They're holding onto somethingand romanticizing of the way it
should be.
Yeah, and we live in such a,you know God, creatively diverse

(09:41):
environment in this world thatwhy does it have to be in these
constraints?
When I started this, I didn'twant to follow the uh, the rules
, and part of it was, yeah, Iwanted shortcuts.
You know, there was a sense oftwo things survival for me, and
that's one of the, the, thethings, that's instinctual
fucking survival, um, which I'vereally have been shedding over

(10:05):
the past few years and being alittle more comfortable, but in
the beginning it wasn't about.
You know, I need to technicallydo this, I need to frame this
like this, I need to use thistype of lens.
I was just gathering all thecrap that I needed to to create
what I wanted.
The first photographs I evertook were in my backyard of

(10:25):
firecrackers in a bottle,because I just wanted to capture
the motion of it.
I didn't know what I was doingfor the next five years.
I still didn't know what I wasdoing, but it you know the
fucking first business card,it's still on my refrigerator
because it's, you know, I liketo bring myself back down to
earth.
Yeah, I have a business cardwhere I made what was called a

(10:48):
multiple.
Yeah, and I've done a handful ofthese throughout the years
where, like Sean Marion from theSuns was in one, carey Hart,
the motocross guy, yep, and thefirst one I did, I had an idea.
I was like I can put myself inone photo, but like five of me,
and I have like five differentcharacters in this photo and one
of me is without a shirt on.
Uh, now I put this on my veryfirst fucking business card and

(11:12):
under it says I do weddings.
So I found this not that longago, showed my wife and of
course she's like like really,I'm like okay, I didn't know any
better, you know, but that'show I started.
You know it was.
It was a concept.
How do I utilize these tools toget to that concept?
And, not having money, you haveto really navigate resourceful.

(11:33):
You have to navigate through umwhat you don't have and it's.
I can tell you so many timesabout wanting to give up because
I see these other people thatwere, you know, nepo babies in
LA having everything gifted tothem.
Their parents were in theindustry.
For the 18 years I've beendoing this, I'm still an
outsider.
You know I'm not respectedthrough some of those channels.

(11:56):
I don't do things the way I'msupposed to Most people.
You know bullshit rules.

Speaker 1 (12:03):
You know, I want to bolster that too.
It's like there's a gooddocumentary on Netflix, uh and
uh, it's like the 30 for 30, butthis one's about the yacht
racing in um uh, I guess theAmericans, for they're so
heavily funded there's a yachtrace that they just destroy
everybody on and these kinds ofscrappy Australians came out of
nowhere and they actually hiredan engineer that was like out of

(12:24):
a different industry and theboat had always been built the
same way, and then he actuallyuh, took a shot at it and he
built the rudder systemcompletely different and when
they first came out, like theAustralians, this is, this is
like a bigger upset than likeany in like sports history
really, and they're just killingthem and they're like
disguising the rudder, basically.

(12:44):
But the point was it's like thisguy came out of a different
industry and said why don't wedo this rudder thing a different
way?
And that boat now is the waythey build boats still, and it's
like that's what I see aboutyour style too.
It's like you didn't lock intolike somebody else's style.
You found your own, and I thinkthat's what gives it so much
beauty.

Speaker 2 (13:02):
I found my own.
It was adopted, though I mean,when I started it was looking at
other people's work, you know,in earlier in the industry, you
know having relationships, youknow, with someone that was
model, getting to go to photoshoots and see other people that
I thought were way better, andthen also being told, like you
can't be here because I don'twant you to see my secrets.

(13:23):
Yeah, and after being told thatso many times and trying to
contact people through MySpace,you know, people were assholes
to me.
I didn't understand thesimplest concept of how that
flash worked or why it worked.
Yeah, and it was like mindblowing to me when a guy that I
knew, yzie Doug Yazzie he wasanother photographer really

(13:46):
loved his work.
Yeah, I had gotten a studio.
I acquired the studio.
It was just a bare warehousewith swamp, cooler and Tempe,
okay, on university, and thisplace was, you know, rundown.
Yeah, and a couple of peoplehad a print shop.
Friends, I used the back ofthis place.
Uh, friend, you know, madefriends with this.

(14:07):
This guy, yazi, um, he hadlights which were, you know,
like holy shit, these werethousands of dollars.
Yeah, strobe lights still noconcept how they worked.
He came by one time, uh,brought some friend
photographers I have a backalley and there's these big bay
doors and they had a modelstanding there and it's all

(14:29):
shadowed and it's all in thebackground, sunny.
They snap a photo, it goesright to the laptop.
She is lit up beautifully and Ijust go what the fuck was that
how?
And he helped me learn that andso we made a deal.
You can use the studio wheneveryou want, keep the lights here.
I could use lights.
Yeah, so that was my first youknow real um introduction to

(14:51):
that.
Yeah, he was, you know he was.

Speaker 1 (14:53):
He was very helpful and instrumental in in showing
me the concept of lighting andstrobe lighting when you um,
let's talk about like, like, Iknow one of the things that you
did when you first started.
You were using those like $2flashlights at home Depot.

Speaker 2 (15:08):
Well, uh, the flashlights.
The flashlights actually camelater on.
I was using dome.
You know these, those domelights, little silver things
from home Depot.
Yeah, the flashlights camelater on and I think it was more
of um, a reflection of where Istarted.
Okay, and when I first startedthat I I thought, well, why
couldn't I just utilizesomething from, you know, the

(15:29):
broke photographer who's gettinginto this?
Cameras are getting cheaper.
You can get one of my oldcameras, you know used one, for
a few hundred dollars.
Yeah, why couldn't I use, youknow, flashlights to light a
scene and create somethingcinematic?
Um, and I think the first one Idid was with my wife.
We were in Marina Del Rey place.

(15:51):
We used to rent out theirlittle apartment and, and I put
this scene together.
We can cut to that too to showit.
But I mean, she sat for twohours while I tried to light
this scene and I was able to doit.
But when I had proof of concept,I thought this is great, this
is amazing, I can do something,but I can show people.

(16:12):
Hey, you don't need to have ahuge budget.
Yeah, because that was theproblem I had is where I started
was the pie in the sky.
Yeah, I really looked at likethe big production is where I
want to be.
Sure, I want the most expensivelights.
Never could afford that.
Um, so I had to force myselfand be resourceful to get to you
know where I at least felt likeI wanted to be, or you?

Speaker 1 (16:35):
know I, I want to, like, I want to and I hope I
don't preface this questionwrong but it's like so we have
right right now.
It's like you can go out thereand buy a ten thousand dollar
camera to shoot photos withright and then like you have
some like in the quality of thephotographer.
It's like, weigh in for me, aamazing photographer with a

(16:57):
cheap camera versus a crappyphotographer with the best
camera on the planet.
What's the better photo?

Speaker 2 (17:05):
I mean that's, that's subjective.
Um, some people fall into it.
I have fallen into photo shootswhere I go, holy shit, I didn't
know I was going to create that.
I have a plan, but there hasbeen times throughout my career
where I put something together.
It's not necessarily thisgenuine plan.
To the client I'll bullshit itLike that's what I meant to do,

(17:27):
but I also.
That was a learning moment forme too.
But going back to your question,you can have and I've seen it,
I've seen photographers thatthey shoot all natural light.
Yeah, and we'll get into thistoo, because where I started, I
started half you know assbackwards.
Yeah, from from how lightingworks.
But I've seen photographersthat do this beautiful natural

(17:50):
light stuff and it was stuff Icould never do.
But they couldn't get into astudio.
They couldn't do anything withstrobe lights, they couldn't
manipulate light.
A studio, they couldn't doanything with strobe lights.
They couldn't manipulate light.
Yeah, they knew a reflector.
The problem I had was I startedcompletely backwards.
Okay, I started with strobelights in a studio because we
were still in that era of likefashion.

(18:11):
Yeah, and I was nowhere nearfashion.
But David LaChapelle was aphotographer that I like.
I really just, um, I looked athis work and I was just so
impressed, enamored with it.
Yeah, um, his stuff was socolorful, he had set design, he
had budgets.
Yeah, uh, I, he was someonethat I wanted to kind of start

(18:34):
modeling my work with.
There was another guy out of, Idon't even know if I'll mention
his name, but he would do theselive photo shoot things, but
everything was based in strobelighting.
So when I learned, I learnedthe more expensive route, I
learned the non-technical stuffand I learned how to manipulate
my lighting, versus starting outwith the basics, which is, just

(18:58):
how do you light with a window?
Yeah, you know how do youcreate soft shadows.
And so it took until my wife,you know I, when I had met her,
we had gotten married and shewas doing some modeling and she
was doing it for fun.
You know, she's verycompetitive person.
She did it for fun, but Iwanted her to work with some
other people, cause I, I wantedher to see how my industry was.

(19:19):
And she got to work with somesome good photographers and I
loved some of the photos, causeI was like, oh my God, I see her
in a different light, butnatural light with some of them
I was like, okay, I needed tolearn this.
It took that that long, um, youknow, for me to start learning
natural light, and when Istarted I was still struggling

(19:39):
and cheating it because I had myold ways.
Yeah, and this is what we do.
When we don't know, we revertto default yeah, that's what I
call it Um, to where you, youscare yourself and you don't
push yourself to the nextchallenge, and that's fine
sometimes, but if you're notlearning to move forward, so
learning the natural light itwas, uh, you know, falling on my

(20:00):
face.
So then I started rentingstudios that had natural light
and then I started understandingI could take video lighting and
I can create and manipulatelight and make it look like
natural light, and so that wasallowing me to take some of my
skills from strobe lighting,studio stuff to, um, you know,
making soft shadows with videolighting and less expensive

(20:20):
stuff.
Yeah, but all of that kind ofled into the flashlight
photography, okay, you knowwhere, where it was like, oh, an
idea of the broke photographeragain.

Speaker 1 (20:29):
And that's what I want people to really understand
.
It's like you know, you don'thave to have every fancy item on
the planet to start this stuff.
Actually, there's another storyI'll drop here which I actually
think has been on this podcastbefore, but it's one of my
favorites.
It's this guy that wanted toget into the belt business and
he'll remember here some of thedetails, but it's like it wants
to get in the belt businessMachine costs a hundred thousand

(20:50):
dollars, Doesn't have a hundredthousand dollars, right?
He could just say I don't havea hundred thousand dollars, I
have to fundraise, I have to dowhatever I got to do to get to
the a hundred thousand dollars.
Instead, he thought about whatdo I, what do I have, Right?
And he had $10,000.
So he went out there to homeDepot or something, got a bunch
of parts and he built a machinefor $10,000.
And that machine was actuallybetter than the a hundred
thousand dollar machine andrecreated the whole industry.

Speaker 2 (21:12):
Yeah, well, and it's sometimes you have to fall, you,
you have to work in reverse.
Um, it's funny, because nowyou're you're telling me about,
you're talking about the qualityof like equipment.

Speaker 1 (21:22):
Yeah, uh god, how long ago was this?
Well, I have like some nicecameras and stuff.
It's like I'm never gonna outshoot you.
You could have the, you couldhave the world's crappiest
camera and you're still gonnaout shoot me, even with the
better camera and I think.

Speaker 2 (21:37):
Think that's it's spatial awareness lighting.
I mean, there's a lot offactors with it, but I have the
reason I say this reminded me ofsomething I always would dream
too big.
To this day.
I still do.
Yeah, I think nothing wrongwith that.
It is when you don't have thebudget for it.
But I have this change jar andI still have it Cause I just
remembered I still have thisthing that I keep, like keys and

(21:59):
stuff, and it's hidden, but Iforgot what I wrapped around it
and it's an ad from BH photo andthis is probably, you know, 13,
14 years ago, Okay, Maybelonger, but it was an ad.
And back then, if you want to,you know, compete, compete, If
you want to compete with the bigguys Annie Leibovitz, Dave
LaChapelle they were using Maya.

(22:20):
They were using I think it'sMaya I'm probably saying that
wrong but the cameras andHasselblad.
Hasselblad was the brand.
Okay, Hasselblad was the brand.
Sounds like David Hasselhoff tome, hasselblad was like that's
the, you know, and this camera,beautiful, these things.
And then the lenses, of course,starting at like $8,000.
But this body I cut this outfrom the magazine and it was

(22:44):
$30,000 without the lens andthat was going to be my goal.
I was like I want that.
And as technology has changed,this really shows how this
industry has evolved andtechnology moving fast.
Now I can take the cameras thatI'm, you know, using now, the,

(23:05):
the sonys, yeah, um, and I'msitting there looking oh, I can
do what that camera used to beable to do.
Of course, there's, there's alot more to it.
Technically, I'm not atechnical guy, but I looked, uh,
actually, just probably lastyear, I was like where's that
camera now?
Yeah, it still exists, sure,and it's more, I think the
enthusiast, the, the collector,it's like 1500 bucks.

(23:26):
No, it's still up there.
How much is it?
It's still probably 30, youknow, 30 grand.
Uh, it's not that, though.
Yeah, hasselblad, the brand,was known for making these what
called, uh, medium frame.
You know, cameras, yeah, andit's just the size of a sensor.
Basically, they don't.
They don't make these camerasanymore.
Now they're doing the samething that sony's doing and

(23:48):
canon's doing.

Speaker 1 (23:49):
Yeah, it's all digital there's no shutter, and
that's the thing too.
It's like there's that movie,the creator, that just came out
not too long ago.
But this guy, like he went outof his way to like show, like
the people out there you know,kind of like what we're talking
about today, it's like not togive up on starting.
So he went out there with an FXthree.
It's the same one we use toshoot our docu series all over

(24:10):
the world and you know it's notcheap, cheap, but we're talking
like five grand with a lens.
It's a fraction, it's afraction, but but he went out,
he, he filmed that whole moviewhich is incredible, with a
$7,000 camera to show you like,hey, it's not $400,000
constraint from making a movieanymore, you know seeing.

Speaker 2 (24:29):
That's the kind of constructive, uh stubborn, that
I like, because he's going outof his way to be like fuck you.
Yeah, I don't need that.
You know, I can make this withthis type of camera Now.

Speaker 1 (24:40):
The barrier and entry just went.
Yeah On filming.

Speaker 2 (24:43):
But here's the thing.
Yeah, he made a point.
Yeah, but there's, there ismore to it.
There's the entire rig.
This thing is on.

Speaker 1 (24:51):
Yeah, is.

Speaker 2 (25:01):
Well, I see that.
I think it's more of like.
I appreciate the stubbornness.
Yeah, of course he needed moreto add to that thing.
Yeah, but at the base of it,the foundation was that camera.
Oh yeah, and it, you know whatis $3,000 camera, $4,000 camera.

Speaker 1 (25:11):
Yeah, I mean it's, it's changed, like there's a
couple of, there's a lot ofthings in film changing and you
and I are keeping a big eye onit, obviously, with the work
that we're doing.
But it's like that camerabringing down the barrier to
entry so we don't have to rentthe RED and those other cameras
anymore to make good production.
I mean, the other thing that'shappening right now is this

(25:32):
happens with the video gameindustry too, and I was watching
an interview with Matt Damonand Matt Damon's like, basically
, like you can't make a goodwillhunting anymore.
Or, you know, like these reallylike interesting scripts,
because if you make an X-Men,for instance, or a Marvel, you
know you're going to put, let'ssay, a million dollars into it.
You're going to get, you know,like sorry, it'd be more like 50

(25:54):
million.
You're going to get like 300out of it, right, that's safe,
you know.
But if you put 30 million intoa goodwill hunting, you may or
may not win, right.
And so like that's where Ireally think creatives, you know
, are going to come out becausethey're not afraid to make those
film anymore and now thecamera's achievable.

Speaker 2 (26:12):
Well, and it's.
It's um evolutionary stupidityon people.
The viewer Show me colors andsplashes.
Let's lose storyline.
You're never going to see aShawshank Redemption again.
Yeah, that's sad, but you can.
But what it turns into ispeople not being so fucking
greedy.

Speaker 1 (26:29):
That, and I think it's going to take independence,
and I think that's where it'sgoing to take the bootstrappers.

Speaker 2 (26:34):
It's going to take the person that has the money.
So, not to get into a differentsubject, but when you're
looking at someone who's abillionaire these days, versus
how it was, you know, 50 yearsago, 60 years ago, 70 years ago,
the Vanderbilts, they werecreating places, libraries, they
were creating public spaces.
Yeah, there is no philanthropyanymore.
Yeah, so these people, it'snothing but fucking greed on

(27:03):
that end, but it takes someonethat has that money, that's why
I want to win the lottery?

Speaker 1 (27:05):
Yeah, cause I'm having fun.
Some fun shit I don't care.
Well, I you know that's.
I think the world is reallyopening up to the scrappy
bootstrappers I really do, youknow like, especially in film,
because you can go out thereright now and you can create a
script.
That's amazing.
I mean, that's how Matt Damonand uh uh, ben Affleck got
started.
From what I know, it's likethey wrote um goodwill hunting,
I think it was, and that blastedthem into stardom.

(27:25):
And somebody out there rightnow has written a script.
They can get with some buddiesby a $5,000 FX three and you can
make a production now.
You know it's like and there'sa shot.
You put that thing on YouTube.
It even gives you a platform,you know it's like, and if you
do it clever and creative enough, you can blast off.
I totally believe this.

Speaker 2 (27:43):
Well, and I think there's such a gradient to the
level of scripting andproduction that exists right now
, yeah, and I can see thatthere's a lot of criticism from
the old school heads that lookat this and they go this is how
a film should be.
That look at this and they gothis is how a film should be,
this is how it should alwaysshould be done this way, yeah,
and that's that's kind ofbullshit.
Honestly, it's definitelybullshit, and I found myself
handing that criticism at times,and now I I have opened my mind

(28:05):
to it and thought no, I'vewatched a hundred different
shorts on YouTube, yeah, andI've also watched other, you
know, little skits from theselittle production houses.
They're a couple of guys, yeah,okay, so some of them are
flashes.
They're lost in the wind, yeah,but Vine was a part of that,
yeah, and I remember when Vinewas super popular, you had these

(28:27):
short-ass clips and peoplestill reminisce on some of that.
They're not the feature films.
As much as I kind of want toshit on that and be like, oh,
it's not the stuff that's goingto be in history.
Yeah, it is, it just is.

Speaker 1 (28:40):
You never, you never know.
Like there's a good storyaround home alone.
I don't know if you've heardthis story before, but home
alone was really under budget.
They almost didn't make it, youknow.
And then, like they had to hire, like the B team, you Master's
dad could have just paid for itwith that fucking house.
Yeah, have you seen those thingson where they analyze the house
and what he has to be making?
But it's like so they hiredthis B team because that's all

(29:02):
they could afford and theirdirector of photography was,
like usually, an assistant andso he's so afraid to screw up
right that he actually used whathe called the chicken cam,
which was a smaller cam, to likeback record everything in case
he messed it up.
And that chicken cam ended upbeing a cam they used in so many
different ways.
You know the scene where he'sdropping the iron through and it

(29:23):
hits him in the face.
It's like that ended up beingsome of the genius parts of the
film and it was all from a fearand a guy that was thinking
about it differently and that'swhat kind of made the movie.
That stuff's incredible.

Speaker 2 (30:02):
No-transcript, you have to and we all have, you
know, the fear of failure.
Sure, and the thing is, ifyou're not failing enough,
you're not learning.
And you're not learning.
Yeah, you're not pushing it,you're really not.
And you know I still strugglewith that to this day.
You know it's nothing I'm evergoing to really shed, but no it.
It really takes a lot forsomeone to go through and fail

(30:26):
but also step back and examinewhat went wrong and what.
What are you learning from this?

Speaker 1 (30:32):
How good did the winds feel?
Yeah, you know, it's like he.
The last offspring video wasn'tthe like.
Not this one, but the one twotimes ago.
Didn't you spend like 10 daysin the pool underwater?

Speaker 2 (30:44):
Yeah, no, we did.
I think we did just a couple, acouple of days there, or I
don't remember.
I think it was one or two days.
Well, and then you had tofigure out cause they're
underwater.

Speaker 1 (30:52):
Camera equipment is expensive.
Well, there's a right way to doit Well a supposed right way to
do it.

Speaker 2 (30:57):
Well, and that's the thing is, I had a smaller budget
and I didn't know what I wasreally getting into.
And that's kind of the thingthat I do with some projects I
don't know what I'm getting into, so I overwhelm myself.
But the fear of change is whatI look forward to.

Speaker 1 (31:11):
But you always figure out a way to do it.
You know it's like instead oflike.
I don't know how they usuallydo it.
I would assume it's usuallylike a $100,000 system or
something like that.

Speaker 2 (31:20):
Yeah, and there's various ways and things that you
can buy for it.

Speaker 1 (31:31):
But it's the.
Where was I getting at?
I mean, you're one of thosepeople that epitomizes.
You don't figure out all theways you can't do it, you figure
out a way you can.
I've seen it over and overagain.

Speaker 2 (31:41):
Yeah, and the thing is I don't look at it that way.
I hate to say this, but there'salways that that cloud that I
kind of carry.
It's my own burden.
Um, I don't feel the winds asmuch as I should and it's mainly
because I don't feel like Igive myself the credit that
others do.
Yeah, you know you talk me up.

Speaker 1 (32:00):
I hate, I don't talk you up at all.
I just tell people what is you,you know, and like, if it
sounds like a talk you up, it'sbecause that's because you've
done some cool stuff.

Speaker 2 (32:10):
And it's hard for me to in my own personal being.
I can accept that.
I can sit there and I thinkabout and reflect about my
career.
I think about what I'm done.
I'm proud of what I've done andI'm proud of the things I've
created.
It's just hard for me to gloaton that publicly.
Yeah, it really is.

Speaker 1 (32:26):
Like that's why you can't speak your own praises.
So I sure as heck will, youknow, and so and like, like the
stuff I see you pull off isincredible.
You know it's like I'm not theartistic person here.
You know David is.
You know it's like and I canalways count on he's going to
figure it out.
I can like.
It doesn't matter what we haveto build or do, it's like he
figures out a way to do that.
You know it's like every singletime.

(32:48):
It's like you jump over to homeDepot and you grab a couple of
things and that helps, somehowbecomes the missing link to what
we were trying to do.

Speaker 2 (32:53):
It it also can be a problem with collecting, you
know, bullshit and stuff that Idon't need.
In my house we literally purgedbecause, you know, we just two
of us in a house decent size waytoo much shit.
Yeah, and I have my garage.
It is packed, can't park a carin it because I have equipment,
and then I have shelving whichis shit in it.

(33:14):
A bunch of shit, and I lovedoing that.
And as much as I want to gobuild, I have custom art frames
that I've built that are justsitting in rooms because I have
nowhere to put them.
I don't want them really up inmy house.
But I used to have the GoddardGallery in Las Vegas.
I took over almost 50% of oneof their galleries with canvases

(33:36):
and I would put custom stuff inthere and of course, they would
take 50%, you know, of theprofit.
But hey, it was getting soldand seen.
Yeah, now I have this stuff.
So the limitation what kind ofsucks for me is, I want to be
more creative, I want to buildmore stuff, but I also have to
be practical, especially as Igot older.

(33:56):
What am I going to do with this, this?
Where is this going to goafterwards?
I mean I I think, if we could,we'd be daily working on
projects just that were fun forus, yeah I mean, when I look at
the space as a studio, I think,oh, this would be great.
I can build and store a bunchof shit.
Yeah, you know that we may ormay not use.
Yeah, but it's the constant,you know building.
Now I've ordered 20,000 gelcapsules.

(34:21):
They were used in the OpioidDiaries music video.
There's a colorful scene with agirl's face coming out of pills.
I remember that I had like5,000 pills I used for that.
But I came up with this ideathat I want to kind of of
emphasize the you know, thedisparaging how would you say it
?
I want to emphasize the unevenkeel in society about, like, the

(34:45):
drug industry, just drugsthemselves.
Yeah, um, the series is goingto be called, uh, designer drug.
And I want to have, you know, adress that I'm making.
I have, I think it's, 300syringes that I filled and
sealed with red liquid in themand I'm, I'm making a dress out
of this.
I like, I'm making an actualdress out of all these.

(35:06):
I don't know how yet, but I'm,I'm, you know, making it, trying
to laying in this sea of pills,and you know, I want it to be,
you know, the, the, the, the.
I don't know how to put thisright.
But the typical blonde, yeah,to be there and she's got a
tiara of needles, yeah, and it'sit's what people have gotten

(35:27):
away with in society versus whatpoor people have not.
Yeah, for, you know, having ajoint will go to jail for 20
years.
Yeah, and that could be basedon, uh, you know, color of skin,
demographic, where you're,where you're, uh, you know where
you are in class.

Speaker 1 (35:43):
There's some really interesting documentaries.
It's like why do you go to jailmore for crack than cocaine?
And we know that?

Speaker 2 (35:48):
there's a lot of public figures that are very
wealthy that do a lot of drugs.
Sure, did he.
Yeah, I didn't even know therewas pink cocaine, but yeah, I I,
that was an idea that I had, soI have to figure out.
How am I building around this?

Speaker 1 (36:03):
Yeah, it's safe to say like I see your photos and
like they're really, they'realmost telling a huge story in
himself.
You know, are you always likethinking of that big story
that's actually behind the photo?

Speaker 2 (36:15):
Sometimes, but sometimes I'm afraid to tell it.
Yeah, that's actually behindthe photo Sometimes, but
sometimes I'm afraid to tell it.
To tell the story because I'velearned to be very quiet when it
comes to some of my opinions,and not that it's controversial,
it's just in the climate thatwe're in.
It's one of those things.
I'd rather retire and have myactivism for my privacy versus

(36:39):
being overly public Because I'vespent too much time broke.
I don't even know if I wantthis part out, but having my
opinions and the things that Ibelieve in being a good person.
I can't stand bigotry, racism.
I really look at that and Iwill in person stand up for
somebody.

(36:59):
Publicly I don't really saymuch because I would like to be
comfortable in life, financiallyand I remember too much what
it's like to be broke and havingopinions sometimes, you know,
gets you canceled.

Speaker 1 (37:12):
You know that's what I think where we align.
We align in a lot of ways, butI think both of us are about
expressing to the world loveright, and then through our work
together, you know it's like wetry to work on things that do
have a good impact.
You know it's like the 5013C.
You know content for good thatliterally uses the camera to

(37:32):
tell good stories and in thatwe're not directly saying don't
be hateful, we're showing theworld that what love is and
kindness is you know, because weneed it more than anything.

Speaker 2 (37:43):
I mean, I agree, hate will always win, hey, we'll,
hey, we'll always win.
But that's why, you know,fighting for compassion and love
, it's so difficult, but I willalways, you know, be a proponent
of that.

Speaker 1 (37:57):
It's so tough.
It's like I'm thinking aboutthis video that I saw that's
like just screwing me up lately,and it's it's this video clip
series of like people caught oncamera dropping off like their
household dog and leaving them,and the dog always is like

(38:17):
thinks it's a game or you know.
It's like I just can't imaginethinking like that.
It's like here's this and kidstoo, you know things a lot
around.
It's like I can't imaginewhat's going through somebody's
head when they can just abandonsomething, leave something, hurt
something.
You know someone, you know it'slike.
That's why I think there needsto be more love direction in the
world, because we're gettingtoo desensitized to um, um awful

(38:41):
things.

Speaker 2 (38:42):
Oh, we absolutely are , and I mean everything's cause
and effect in this world.

Speaker 1 (38:46):
I mean, that's the power of this thing here.
You know it's like a big reasonwhy I've like faced so many
fears around it, because thishas been a big fear for me.
I know being in front of it's abig fear for you, you know it's
like, but it has to finallycome down to.
It's like we need more goodpeople with good messaging.
And what I find over and overagain and that's why I have I go
several of you to getting onhere is the good people are.

(39:08):
I'm not saying that everybodygood is afraid of this thing.
I'm not saying that at all, buta lot of really good people are
afraid of this thing and that'swhy we need more good people
getting in front of it, cause Isay this all the time evil has
no problem using this right.

Speaker 2 (39:22):
Zero, right, I mean, that's that's the whole.
You know, uh, hate bait.
Yeah, you know it's the easiestway to make money and I can
tell you right now there'sseveral times in my career, um,
that I've made decisions thathave, you know, been financially
not great, because I couldn'tgo down that path, I couldn't
hurt that person, I couldn'tsteal from that person.

Speaker 1 (39:43):
Yeah, there's businesses I've worked with
where I could have screwedpeople over bad You'll you'll
never like get me to sell myintegrity ever.
You know it's like it's notworth it to me, you know.

Speaker 2 (39:53):
I mean, you know, trying to get people to be
involved with those kinds ofdeals.
I'm like, how desensitized areyou?
You're going to hurt thisperson, their livelihood, yeah,
but I've seen others do it.
I've seen others gain.
I've seen people that have madeI mean stupid amounts of money.
But they can turn it off.

Speaker 1 (40:11):
They can just turn off emotion Sometimes you know,
I see it all day long and that'swhat actually kind of probably
there's a bunch of things thatfinally made me turn a corner.
But it's like know a ton aboutbusiness, you know, know a ton
about fitness, know a ton abouta couple of different subjects,
and I see it all day long andwhat I see on social media is
hurtful.
It can make you bankrupt, itcan harm your body.

(40:31):
You know, it's like I got tiredof it.
You know they're all trying tosell you this thing for $99.
That actually will derail youfor years.
You know, it's like that's sofrustrating to me because the
the audience too, is not therich kid.
The audience is people like you, you and I, unsuspecting people
that don't know any better,otherwise they have the rich dad

(40:51):
.
They can go ask hey dad, what doyou think of this thing that I
just learned online and he'llsay that's BS.
Poor kids like you.
And I will go hey, look at that.
You know, it's like we're thataudience, the sucker audience.

Speaker 2 (41:03):
Well, you and I didn't come from generational
wealth, but now I finallyunderstand what it is and I
understand the difference ofwhere I grew up, and you know I
mean a whole nother class.

Speaker 1 (41:15):
It's not just generational money either.
It's generational knowledge,right?
Yeah, Our parents aren'tteaching us these things, you
know?
So?

Speaker 2 (41:23):
you know, it's no fault to my, my parents.
They didn't know any better.

Speaker 1 (41:26):
No, that's exactly my point.

Speaker 2 (41:27):
You know, that's what's.
What's difficult is I finallynow in my forties, I'm going,
holy shit, this is where Iinvest, this is where I put
money.
Yeah, you know it's it actually.

Speaker 1 (41:37):
It's rather simplistic.
That's what this show is abouttoo.
This is a charity show.
You know it's like any moneythat's made on this show
actually goes to fund smallbusinesses.
You know it's like, but like,more importantly than that, in
my opinion, is like trying togive that knowledge.
You know that, likegenerational knowledge that's
being skipped.

(41:57):
It's like now.
I had to learn it over yearsand years of heartache.
You know it's like, and that'swhy I bring people on like you.
You know, then you can talkabout these same things because
knowledge, the right knowledgeon a show you can trust.
And, by the way, I want to makea point on the show today I will
never, ever have somebody onthis show that I don't think is
valid for you.
You know like I get people thatapply to this show all the time

(42:18):
, that have big names and bigfollowings and all that stuff.
Could that help me promote thepodcast more?
Yes, but not.
I'm too protective of you guys.
I will have somebody like youon because you are good for
these guys.
I will never have somebody onthat's trying to sell their
bullshit course.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (42:32):
And there's, there's so much of it.
And this is a sad thing aboutyou know, something like Tik TOK
?
Yeah, I, I was against Tik TOKlike two years ago.
It was like, oh it's stupid.
My mom loved it and I was likeI ain't doing it, it's a stupid
site.
I got on it and realized, holyshit, there is so many people on
here that are you know, somepeople will push shit, but then

(42:53):
there's 10 other people thatwill shit on them and say, no,
that's bullshit.
Yeah, there's financial adviceYep.
There's fitness advice, yep.
And then there's the peoplethat course correct and say, no,
we can show you why that'swrong.
Yeah, so you're getting thisamazing source of information
and then you can go and look foryourself and go.
Okay, cool.

Speaker 1 (43:15):
A lot of them are using data points and they're
like pulling up the articlesonline and like there's some
extremely clever creators onTikTok.

Speaker 2 (43:18):
Oh, absolutely, and I've you know, I've like just
been blown away by it, but thetranslation for you yourself are
heavily invested with, likeYouTube, yeah, you, you think
that's going to be the futureand I think you've convinced me
that too.
So I was a little close mindedof that about you know, a year
and a half ago and I thought, no, you know, this TikTok is only

(43:39):
where it's at, yeah, then Irealized some of these people
that are doing the small skitsor whatever it is, they had big
followings on YouTube also.
Oh, yeah.
They're utilizing severalplatforms.

Speaker 1 (43:49):
It's usually like the marketing driver to the YouTube
channel, right?
Or like, why wouldn't you doboth?
And then another point I justwant to make really quickly is
don't be holding to any platform.
They don't love you.
You know how many businessesI've seen that are like I
actually have like quite a fewpeople that I'm connected to
right now that make an immenseliving from TikTok and they're
fearing it right now because andI've told them this for years

(44:12):
you need to use all of them,right, because you don't want to
be beholden to Facebook.
I've seen even the shitty metastuff.

Speaker 2 (44:18):
Yeah, you don't want to be beholden, these guys or
Airbnb or Amazon.

Speaker 1 (44:22):
It's like you make your whole business on one of
these platforms.
They can take it away.

Speaker 2 (44:26):
You're putting too much risk on one thing, and I'm
glad you said that, because whenI started this, my space was
this you know, it was just beingushered in and it was growing
and I learned how to reallyutilize that system.
You know how to post onsomebody's wall a GIF or some of
you idiots call it a GIF.
I don't know what it's called.

(44:47):
Whatever it is, I could be theidiot but you know a GIF
flashing all of my images.
I'm creating something exciting.
Then we get the clicks.
The people will come over.
I learned this, but I wasrealizing I cannot rely on this,
because when this goes awaybecause they typically do, they
do then my business is fallingflat.

Speaker 1 (45:06):
I mean, there's a guy that built his own whole
business on Facebook and there'stons.
I can tell stories like thisfor hours, but they built their
whole business on Facebook $350million a year, company,
something like that.
And Facebook changed one thingin this algorithm zero overnight
.
You know it's like don't bebeholden to these one platforms
you use them.
You know it's like don't bebeholden to these one platforms
you use them right.

Speaker 2 (45:27):
You use them like they use you, and you know you
have to.
You have to really understandthe algorithm, something with
the way Facebook and Instagramare.
They're a mess.
They're an absolute fuckingmess, but you can still utilize
it.
Yeah, you just have to becautious with it.
Totally.
Something like TikTok was oneof the I mean, to me it was one
of the greatest algorithms thatthere were, because it allowed
people with smaller voices thatwere never heard to be seen.

Speaker 1 (45:49):
That's what people didn't realize in this whole
meta TikTok war and that's whatactually is going on right now
with that People.
It's not really about TikTok.
It's about meta having atremendous amount of power and
they're lobbying against TikTokto get it taken down because
there's their competition right.

(46:10):
There wasn't that long ago thatorganic reach through Instagram
and Facebook was really toughto do, you know, and then TikTok
came along and they werehanding them their lunch quickly
because they allowed organicreach.
Folks, it wasn't short formvideo that helped, it was
organic reach right, I had.

Speaker 2 (46:22):
You know, I started my Instagram and I started to
grow it and now it's.
You know it's a complete messbecause I don't stay in the
consistency of what people in myaudience want.

Speaker 1 (46:31):
Um, but you say one wrong thing.
It's like we, we haven't likeluckily I have this platform
that goes to multiple places,you know but it's like we have
that uh foundation for thefoster kids and I happen to put
out there in the world somestats.
I heard from Lisa and like 90%of the 80% of the people on
death row in California are fromthe foster care system, 60% of

(46:52):
trafficking victims foster caresystem.
I made a video about that onInstagram and I've been blocked
ever since.

Speaker 2 (47:00):
Yeah, uh, there's strict guidelines that are in
there, that, um anything aboutit.
It's interesting.
But if you read into the, intothe uh, strict guidelines that
are in there, that anythingabout.

Speaker 1 (47:12):
It's interesting, but if you read into the guidelines
, they're they're strict in away.
That's ridiculous stuff, youknow.
And then, like he, a couple ofthings went on, you know that
where, like he now, is likebeing diminished as well.
And you know I was telling himI'm like, why are you just on
one flat platform, use them all?
You know it takes an extracouple seconds to put on like

(47:35):
Tik TOK.
You know Instagram, uh Facebook, youtube shorts.

Speaker 2 (47:39):
You know like, uh Pinterest even Pinterest is the
third biggest search engine inthe world.
See and this is this is what Ithink the audience should know
is you know what you're saying?
Utilizing several platforms mebeing older, now I started with
my space.
I'm so grateful to it.

Speaker 1 (47:55):
There's by the way, david and I want to bring Tom
back.
Tom, reach out to us, please.

Speaker 2 (48:00):
Yeah, I know you're doing your photography and
killing it.
Yeah, Come back and startanother platform.
But even you know here's thething I don't think that even if
there was a MySpace, you know,brought back, it would have the
same effect.
It was in its moment it was inits time it worked for then.
We evolved so fast withtechnology and social media that
you have to go with the times.

(48:20):
And my point is, as someonewho's now older than when I
started stubbornness, becauseyou start to close off, you
start to shorten your circle,cautious about who you're around
, what you're doing.
And my point is you can't beafraid to go with the change.

(48:41):
You have to embrace things thatare changing.
If you hate them.
To go with the change.
You have to embrace things thatare changing If you hate them.
Every generation shat on theprior generation.
You know Gen Z.
Whatever they're shitting onGen Z they're shitting on, they
shit on us millennials.
It has been over and over.
You could literally go throughand read every generation has
said the same quote they justdon't want to work anymore.

(49:02):
And it goes all the way back toearly print.

Speaker 1 (49:07):
You know like actually one thing I want you to
weigh in on.
I know you're using AI a lotthese days.
Like weigh in on that Causethat.
I know that's been scary for alot of people in this industry.
It's like AI is going to takemy job.
You know it's like what are youdoing to embrace AI?

Speaker 2 (49:22):
I mean, I was about two years ago.
I was very resistant because Isaw the capabilities and I
thought, oh, this is going toreplace, you know, my job.
This is going to replace otherpeople's job.
You couldn't create models nowto put clothing on.
I think it's a bubble.
I don't think it knows whatit's going to be.
It is the internet at its earlyphases.

(49:43):
We don't know what it's goingto be and it's scary, yeah,
because where it's going, Idon't know.
Will it end jobs?
Absolutely?
Yeah, I know it's going to.
Yeah, but you have to.
This is what I say aboutevolving you have to be ready
and try and get ahead of thecurve and learn.
Getting older it's becauseyou're stuck in ways.
The world does not work thatway anymore.
But for me, when I got toreally look at AI and what it

(50:08):
was for now, I thought about itas it's here use it as a tool.
One of the first things I usedit for was an ad that I was
putting together for a company,a drink company, and I needed to
know a sheet for them and Ineeded fresh fruit.
Now, this was the summer deadsummer in phoenix, yeah, and I

(50:31):
needed exotic fruit, yeah.
So I was either gonna have tospend two thousand dollars to
import stuff from who knowswhere hawaii but then make sure
that it looked, you know,photographic, like it could be
photographed.
Yeah, and I'm stressed aboutthis because I'm like there's no
budget for that what am I goingto do with all this?
Quickly was oh shit, I couldmake these and they looked

(50:53):
picture perfect.
I didn't know that ad it looksfantastic, yeah, and the thing
is I'm outing myself with thatbecause I know some people will
say like, well, that's cheating.
At the end of the day, I wasn'tmaking artwork.
I wasn't in the 16 fuckingchapel.
Yeah, I was making an ad for aclient.
Yeah, um, was it going to takeme much longer and much more of

(51:13):
a budget to go through and getfresh fruit and do all that?
Yeah, but I put this togetherand not all the elements of it.
There's a whole design.
Uh, you know the wholecomposite is me designing it.
Yeah, I just added some fuckingAI fruit, yeah, and I was like
wow, it's vibrant, it looksgreat.

Speaker 1 (51:30):
Yeah, I mean, that's the thing too.
It's like the, at the end ofthe day, the clients.
You're going to say, hey, doyou want me to spend $2,000 to
ship in fruit, or do you want meto use AI?
They're going to tell you useAI all day long.

Speaker 2 (51:40):
And don't quote me on $2,000, but I know it's not
going to be cheap.
Oh, I actually think.

Speaker 1 (51:44):
Well, and then, well, this is the way business works.
It's like you'd spend X numberof dollars to ship it in and
then some of it would be bruised.
Then you'd be spending X numberof dollars to find another one.

Speaker 2 (51:54):
There's so much risk in that.
So when I see AI, I'm like yeah, there's bit of it is ai.

(52:16):
You know I've used things whereI've done, where you know 99 of
it is ai.
But it's not just one image,that's just like hey, I prompted
there it is it is.
But it's not just one image,that's just like hey, I prompted
there it is.
It is deconstructed throughoutto make sure that it is mine.
It's not just some prompt.

Speaker 1 (52:32):
I've seen you do amazing work and I'm with you.
I have other friends that arephotographers and stuff and it's
upheavaled their business.
One of them's clip art for petsand she makes a tremendous
living because everybody buys.
It's pretty much.
You can't look on a packagewithout seeing her her
photography for pets, you know.
But she's embracing AI now too.
You know it's like you have toor you get killed, you know.

Speaker 2 (52:54):
I mean it's, it's the world, it's moving fast, yeah,
and the people that are going tostay stubborn and say, well,
this is how it should be, you'regoing to get left behind.

Speaker 1 (53:01):
You have to absolutely embrace the
technology and see what it'll do, and then at least be immersed
into it to know what the pivotsare within it.

Speaker 2 (53:08):
And even going back to production in the movie
industry, for example, the greatdirectors that have been around
, that have had the formula offilmmaking.
There will be a finite amountof them left and even if any
because they won't be able to befunded we'll lose some of that
creativity.
But it doesn't mean that theyshould stop.

(53:28):
Yeah, the Quentin Tarantino'sSure, you still will have some
of those people.
They just won't make the noisethat those guys have.
It's a different time and it'sI.
That's where I say it's sad.

Speaker 1 (53:46):
Yeah, I, that's where I say it's sad.
Yeah, I think we're going toopen it up for more people to
get a shot, you know to, becauseand then AI is going to allow
some of those like impossiblethings to be done, like on a
smaller budget, you know, on asmaller budget, right, and I
think that opens it up for thecreatives of the world that
probably weren't even heard ofto have a shot at it, like I
think your, your best time inlife, especially in this
industry, to have a shot is now.

Speaker 2 (54:05):
Yeah.
Well, and here's the thing Isee with AI is it runs its
course fast, yeah, meaning whenit first came out, you had mid
journey or something that wascoming together and everyone was
like this is the future rightnow.
And then it turned into likeyou know, people posting this
like fake profiles and all that,and that rose quick like stuck,
yeah.
And then it's just starting tocrash back down because people

(54:26):
are tired of it.
Yeah, it gets old quick.
So it's going to do this.
We're going to see spikes withsome of this shit.
We're going to see chat GPT ohno, it's going to take my job
for this, yeah.
And then it's going to get old,because then we're going to
figure it out.
We're going to go okay, we seethrough it.

Speaker 1 (54:39):
Now you know I use Chet GPT quite often and mostly
it's like I use my mind againstit and like it gives me ideas
and stuff.
But I had it build anamortization table the other day
and it was wrong.
Had I not known what it wassupposed to look like, I would
have been screwed Because Iwould have used it right and I
had to even ask it.
I'm like, are you sure aboutthat?

(55:00):
And then it's like and I toldit how it was wrong and it's
like okay, you're right, youknow.
It's like and so more humilitythan more humans these days it
does you know, and it's like andI actually joked around with it
I'm like this is the first timeyou've been, I've been smarter
than you, and it's like, yeah,good, call on that one, or
something like that Probablylaughed.

Speaker 2 (55:17):
later on I got them.

Speaker 1 (55:19):
Yeah, so there's a couple of things I want to get
out of the way.
What do you think is going tohappen with, especially like
music videos and stuff Like?
What are you seeing that'sgoing to change within that?
Oh, it's already changed.

Speaker 2 (55:33):
Back when I started, you know, music videos had
50,000, 100,000.
There was guys I knew that didlike a quarter million for Tommy
Boy.
Yeah, funk junkies, they did amusic video and apparently it
was like a quarter milliondollar.
You know a budget?
Yeah, that doesn't happenanymore.
Yeah, big music videos are$20,000.
Yeah, maybe 30,000.

Speaker 1 (55:54):
It's.
Do you think that's takingsomething away, the budget being
smaller, do you think we're notmaking as good a music?

Speaker 2 (55:59):
video.
I think we're being a littlemore resourceful, but we're
utilizing digital, the digitaltools now.
So more VFX.
That's just the way it is.
I don't really like it, but Ican't fight against something
that's happening when you don'thave the budget there and, in
all honesty, it has gottencheaper, so we don't need all

(56:26):
the stuff that was needed backin the early 2000s or the 90s
yep, so you don't need all thatbig equipment.
There's a lot you can do nowwith smaller equipment.
So, understandably, the budgetshave changed.
The problem, I see, is theplatforming.
Um.
Mtv was a central source.
Yeah, to get on, that was a bigdeal, yep.
Um, now anyone can makeanything and put it out there.

Speaker 1 (56:45):
That's what I think is amazing.

Speaker 2 (56:46):
Well, I think it is amazing.
What dictates popularitysometimes is stupidity.

Speaker 1 (56:50):
It it's, it's true, you know.
It's unfortunately true, youknow, let me.
Let me ask you this too it'slike if you're given the pie in
the sky project right now, let'scall it a music video project,
just for fun.
Who's the group?
What are you doing?
Let's call it a music videoproject, just for fun.
Who's the group?
What?

Speaker 2 (57:05):
are you doing, god?
You know, I haven't even putthought into that.
I'm kind of doing it.
I'm working with you.
Know the?

Speaker 1 (57:15):
offspring.
I mean, we were both like thatwas the band when I was a kid.
Yeah, you know it was like, andI remember driving down the
road, you know like listening tothat stuff on road trips and
things like that.
It's been a dream for me towork with you on that stuff.

Speaker 2 (57:26):
It's.
It's been amazing, um, I mean,that's been something that that,
um, that coming together, um,the other thing was the timing
for me when I started workingwith them, like four years ago
now.
Um, it was during COVID.
Yeah, they were actually goingto release an album.
Covid hit and all of a suddenthey delayed it.

(57:49):
Yeah, and then what happenedfrom there is, they had one of
my canvases in their studio andI get a contact from an art
director and it basically waslike hey, there's a band they
want to see about you doingtheir album cover.
And I was like, hey, there's aband they want to see about you
doing their album cover.
And I was like, okay, cool,whatever, I don't know, sure,
let's talk about it.
Yeah, a few calls later, namecomes out, the offspring.

(58:12):
I'm going oh, you're full ofshit.
I didn't believe him and Ithought this is cruel because my
business was hurting, becauseno one's buying posters or
anything.
Yeah, any merch during apandemic.
Yeah, no photo shoots,nothing's going on, sure, so
you're just hemorrhaging.
Yeah, that started.
And then it was what it was.

(58:34):
I did the album cover and thenit turned into let's do all this
artwork on the inside, and thenI happened to drop it to the
management that I was like youknow, I'm a photographer first.
The management that I was likeyou know I'm a photographer
first, and they were like well,let's give it a try, come out
for two days and do a two dayshoot.
Yeah, and now it's been almostfour years of being the
photographer for they're,they're great guys to really

(58:55):
good guys, absolutely.
You know it's, it's been, it'sbeen a nice.
You know it's been nice kind ofbeing a part of that.
That.
That family too, yeah, veryembracing just down to earth.
But if you know, if there wassomeone else I would like to
work with, I was going to makeyou do it.
Yeah, you have to.
Yeah, I mean it'd be.
There's so many I could say.

(59:16):
I mean everything from newmusic that I've discovered, from
like ice nine kills, I'm like,ah, fucking love that band.
Um to you know metallica, yeah,you know there's there's so
many that on the top of my headI couldn't tell you.
But any opportunity with anyonethat I've loved in music, you
know, if I could bring somebodyback, I'd love to work with
freddie mercury.

(59:36):
I'd love to work a queen.
Yeah, yeah, um, but funny story, I I didn't really get to work
with him, but he was kind of.
Brian may was a little bit apart of a little project, this
recent album with the Offspring.
There's interior artwork that'sin the album that I did and it

(59:57):
was based on some artwork thatDexter liked this book and he
sends me this book and one ofthe authors is Brian May and I'm
like, no, it couldn't be.
No, it's that Brian May.
So I have this book still and,you know, it was kind of the
inspiration for some of theartwork in the interior of this,
this medieval kind of Frenchartwork, a blues, french Cool

(01:00:19):
and not nothing but a few.
You know, a couple of monthslater, I see their you know know
instagram post and they'rejamming out with brian may.
Wow, and I was like, oh, that'sfucking awesome.
Um, but yeah, there's a lot ofpeople that I would love to work
with, um, discovering whatevernew music.
Yeah, and to me, it's not justabout working with somebody

(01:00:39):
that's that's got the fame.
Yeah, I, I want to work withgood people.
I don't care if you're famous,you know, if you have the budget
, of course, yeah, no, I thinkboth of us really like to do
cool stuff.

Speaker 1 (01:00:49):
Yeah, but it also takes money to do cool stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:00:52):
It does, you know, and it's not that I need a big
payday, it's not that I reallywant.
I mean, I did the music videothat was a lyric video for their
last album and I put so muchinto it.
And the reason why is becauseit was a learning experience for
me to really push myself.
Yeah, I went through and didVFX.

(01:01:13):
Yeah, you know, we went tocastles and coasters and filmed.
You went to Vegas, california,you know, day in Vegas, um,
california, for the big set, yep, um.
But for me it wasn't about youknow what can I put in my pocket
.
Yeah, I was looking at thebudget and going you know what?
How can I, you know, reallypush this and, you know, take

(01:01:36):
care of the people that areinvolved.
And I had so much fun with it.

Speaker 1 (01:01:39):
It, it was, it was great.
I look forward to having manymore of those projects with you,
you know, and so um it's it'sjust the.

Speaker 2 (01:01:47):
The stress level out of time is like you know, that
is so important when we'veworked with good groups of
people.

Speaker 1 (01:02:08):
You know, on the set of uh, the offspring music video
, great actors, um you know,like to to deal with um, the
makeup artists, the feel free tohelp me drop names because I'm
spacing them right now.

Speaker 2 (01:02:21):
Yeah, you get elias and uh, shayana.
Yeah, um, I mean there's,there's, so there's, um, I mean
there's, there's, so there's toomany people to really mention.
There's a lot that has to gointo it.

Speaker 1 (01:02:29):
And like when you're working with a good team, it
means it makes the rest all somuch fun.
Yeah Right, it's like it couldbe a crappy project anyway.
Which way you could say it?
Not with this stuff, but ingeneral, it's like it could be a
horrible project.
I used to do horrible projectswith my employees.
All the time We'd go empty aback lot or something you know
together.
But if the right team and theright people around, it could be

(01:02:52):
fun.

Speaker 2 (01:02:52):
Oh, absolutely, and it's hard to find the team in a
place like Phoenix because thereis not that community.
Yeah, but you know we have afriend, IROC, who's starting to
put that community together andwe're trying to build that more
and more.

Speaker 1 (01:03:05):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:03:05):
So he, I, I, I think what he's doing is right, but my
, my final thought is it's notnecessarily that the music
videos I want to do music videosare fun.
Yeah, um, I would really liketo do a short.
I'd like to, I like to tell astory.

Speaker 1 (01:03:17):
Yeah, and I I want to continue like and I'll use the
end of this uh episode to saythat we are in Phoenix, we're
based out of here, we doproduction.
Daveed's my partner when we doheavy production work in that
company and we also have a 5013Cwhere we're going to be
bringing out this year the firstepisode of our docu-series,

(01:03:40):
which I'm really excited about.
I'll probably drop some more inthis episode.
We're also working on getting acommunity together that wants
to do charity around film Um, sowe can help foster foundations
within the Phoenix area.
So there's a lot of ways thatwe're working on developing a
community for to bring thecamera about, and we're always
looking to connect to goodpeople in the film industry.
So please get in touch with us.

(01:04:01):
You got any final thoughts fortoday?

Speaker 2 (01:04:05):
Let's get fucking creative, let's do it 2025.

Speaker 1 (01:04:13):
Daveed, you would definitely be one of my top
friends on MySpace, so whetheryou folks know that used to be
the thing.
I think you got 12 of them youcould put up there and then you
would move people up and downdepending on how their friend's
status, however, they pissed youoff.
Yeah, you would be in my group,my friend and I always enjoy
also working with you.
Um and uh folks, I hope you gota little bit out of this episode
today.
Um, what I really want you toget, um, the message home is

(01:04:37):
like don't be afraid to start.
Start with what you can.
You never know when you'rereinventing it, like David's
done over and over again withthe flashlight thing, or just
making things work from homeDepot.
He, if he would have said fromthe beginning, I need the fancy
camera just to start, you stillwouldn't have started.
Right, it's like, and now it's.
It's.
It's made your life, you know,like fulfilling for you, because

(01:04:57):
this is what you enjoy.
The home alone example, theyacht example I've given you so
many examples today.
Don't sit at home and not startbecause you don't have the
fancy camera or the big truckfor your landscaping company.
Figure out the way you canstart.
If I can help you with it,leave a message in the comments.
See you next time.

(01:05:20):
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(01:05:40):
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