082 - this game will end in 205 clicks., Hell Clock, & Blue Prince (Guest: Kara from Patch Magazine) - Underplayed

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:04):
Thank you for pressing start on episode 82 of Underplayed KZUMS
MD video game podcasts. Today we have two secret games,
a discussion with Kara from Patch magazine, and a review of
our featured game blueprints. Here on Underplayed, we review

(00:29):
indie games of all kinds, the games with small budgets but big
hearts, the lesser known experiences with imaginative
ideas. I'm Bo Po and I'm joined by
another. He got the platinum in going
under. It's one of his numerous claims
to fame. He's the OB to your IB in a
cooperative game. He runs like a pony.
He loves pepperoni. It's the one and only Disco

(00:52):
Cola. What's going on?
You know, I'm full of turnips. I don't love that very much,
honestly. Thank God, because I was getting
so tired trying to find this recording studio.
Did you did you know this building has a dove coat?
Like a just like a room full of doves.
But like anyway, how are you? I'm doing just fine, my sneaky

(01:13):
chauffeur. Those are references to our
featured game blueprints. And yeah, I was also having a
tough time drafting this very room.
It just wouldn't show up for me.Yes, that is our featured game
today, a game that's been talkedabout by many people this year,
in 2025, came out earlier this year and a lot of people were
talking about it all at once, itseems, and we're sort of

(01:36):
hopefully starting the second wave of popularity.
We still hopefully get to celebrate with the party.
Yeah, we're a little late, guys,but we're here talking about
blueprints and it's a special episode because we have a guest
today. It's going to be Kara from Patch
magazine. Kara's a writer.
We're going to be talking to hermomentarily about her work with

(01:56):
Patch Magazine, which is a magazine I've enjoyed the last
few years. We're going to talk to Kara
about her work with Patch Magazine and indie game focused
Zine that comes out every month.We will also review Blueprints
alongside Kara because she picked it from our lists, which
is great. So because we have all of that
going on with Kara, we're going to keep this top of the show

(02:18):
segment pretty short. But before we move on, there are
a few very easy ways to support Underplayed.
They cost nothing. They take almost no time at all.
And we would really appreciate you doing these things for us if
you haven't already. One, give us a follow and a five
star rating on podcast platformslike Spotify and Apple Podcasts.
That makes us appear more consistently for you and for

(02:40):
others. Two, you can follow us across
social media using the links in our show notes.
And three, sharing our podcast by reposting our stuff on social
media and telling your indie game loving friends about us
means the world. And as always, we love you.
Thank you for listening. Let's move on to our secret
games. Secret games.
Secret games. I know you're playing without

(03:03):
me. Secret games.
Well, I'm here to tell you, baby.
Secret games. I've been playing too.
Secret Games Secret Games is oursegment where we each reveal a
game we've been playing recently, and I'm going to learn
what Disco Cola's been playing and what he wants to review.
Today, he's going to do the samefor me, starting with you, Disco

(03:25):
Cola. Let the mystery be no more.
Reveal your secret game for Episode 82 of Underplayed.
My Secret Game This episode comes from the creator of
instars and time developer. Insert disc 5 and the game is
called. This game will end in 205
clicks. Music.

(04:08):
What a name. What a name.
It's quite aptly named. It is.
I kind of see a connection already, the blueprints with a
particular number going on. Cool.
So I'm going to read the steam description because the that'll
come up later. What does a super villain do
when he is forbidden from doing anything evil for the day?

(04:30):
Warning, this is not the type ofgame where you can make
meaningful choices. OK, setting our expectations
accordingly. Yeah.
So yeah, this might be the shortest game ever played for
underplayed. This isn't really a mistake
either, as you might learn a little bit later, a certain game
had me really strapped for time.It wasn't my secret game.

(04:54):
Only one other game we're talking about did it only.
Be one other thing originally I was going to play great God
Grove for the episode yeah yeah yeah.
But then they announced a physical for the Switch, so that
was a very pleasant surprise andI'm I'm happy that I waited on
on getting this game for now. And this game released super
recently as. We sit down, Report.

(05:15):
Yeah, I just happened to see it caught my eye on blue sky, you
know, so it's cool. It was really lucky to not only
see a title that promised 205 clicks, but I really liked the
visual art style as well. So I was like, all right, so
that's the one. Sign me up.
The game opens with the fictional game The Girls Royal

(05:36):
Invite and near the end of the story of the game.
This fictional story includes a I'm going to consider it a
Powerpuff Girls analog simply called The Girls, and it shows
the end of their battle with Royal.
But is it happening or is it a dream or a nightmare?
Even so, Royal wakes up from thestream and after waking up, they

(05:58):
get a message stating that no evil acts may be performed
today. Now, if you're evil, why would
you even listen, right? But we get another message
drilling the point down. But the game does offer you side
quests, which in this case are simply just daily chores.
And after completing a few dailychores, Royal will begin to

(06:20):
deconstruct the relationship between classical hero and
classical villain, and recognizethe meta level of how soon the
game will end. And truly and really, the game
does end in 205 clicks and that is it.
So it seems very meta. It seems like it's potentially
commenting on themes from games we've talked about before, Yeah,

(06:42):
in maybe a a shorter time span. Yeah, it makes a point to point
out freedom of choice, maybe notonly necessarily for super
villains, cuz like, they always lose or they're always like when
they're doing their monologue, that means the episode's almost
over and the girls are about to win.
And he comments as such on that.But also there are some comments

(07:06):
in the game that sort of allude to the censoring of LGBTQ plus
peoples in media. So there's different levels of
commentary going on there. Nice.
That's very impressive given that it is so.
Short. It is quite short, yes, but
yeah, like I said, that's that'sreally it for things I like.

(07:29):
I do love the visual identity ofthis game.
Everything in this game leans into the red, pink, magenta,
purple and black region, and I've just been I've been into
that for a few years. So no surprise that I love how
it looks. I also love that this game
really bucks pretty much all expectations.
Like I was expecting maybe some massive deeper secrets on on on

(07:54):
what I got, but you'll be surprised by what you find
coming coming in with that expectation.
And lastly, I love that a lot ofvery specific and very unseen
people are really resonating with this game.
Like there are a lot of people, especially in the LGBTQ
community that are loving this game and I'm really happy like
that, that that's awesome for me.

(08:16):
This game does have the flip side for things that I'm not
like totally on the same page with.
I don't totally resonate in the same way.
Like, I don't know. The closest I can relate is that
professionally speaking, I'm kind of young enough that people
expect me to fail or be lazy. And I can be helpful at times
for sure. So I'm like bucking expectations

(08:37):
when I perform well. Oh, sure.
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, but otherwise Royal and I
don't really have a lot in common.
Yeah. So you're consuming a piece of
media where you understand, but you don't 1 to 1 relate.
And so it's hard to fully connect.
And we've had this happen. With this has happened.
Before all kinds of stories. Yeah, not just this perspective.
Right. Yeah.

(08:57):
Next, I do find that the music is kind of shrill.
This whole thing is a really quick experience.
And based on that principle, I am surprised at the variation of
sound design. But it I just, I don't really
like how it sounds. And honestly, that's close to
most I could say about it, yeah.Not a lot to comment on, right?

(09:18):
Like 30 minutes, is that, Is that how long you said it was?
No, it's not. Not even it's, well, I probably
did play it for 30 minutes because I was like, oh, surely
there's something more. And so I started it again and I
was like, OK, the ending's goingto be different this time, even
though it told me it wouldn't be.
And so I played it three times and it was the IT was the same

(09:39):
every time. OK, so good to know.
But like, yeah, if you look up on on YouTube, most people are
spending 14 minutes on it, OK. And these are like people that
are reading it word for word aloud.
So it can be very quick. So in the end, I'm glad it was
brief because that is the primary thing I was looking for.
But I think I needed just like alittle bit more depth in

(10:00):
general, not necessarily in story, but in gameplay.
Either way, I'm surprised at thehonesty and discipline in what
the game promises. Like I said, the description
says this isn't a game where youcan make meaningful choices.
But what I didn't expect was to make no choices, even though
that does fit thematically. And the theme of censoring queer

(10:23):
people's existence is done quiteintelligently.
The unfortunate result, in my opinion, is that there is a
pretty extreme lack of actual gameplay.
So as someone that craves at least a little bit that I I just
don't think this game is for people like me.
So I give it, unfortunately a 5.5 out of 10.
Yeah. And again, just stating that a

(10:45):
lot of people are loving it and really resonating with it so.
Yeah, I'm looking at it on Steamand it's, even though it
released less than a week ago, as we sit down again, like this
episode will come out a little later, but it released in early
August 2025. It's already got over 400
reviews. They're very positive.
Most people are, you know, enjoying it.
And sometimes, you know, this isa free game.

(11:07):
Sometimes that bodes well for a game's reputation as well as the
length. If it if you're super digestible
and you have a very low price orit's a free to download game,
that goes a long way and in youresteem for your game.
And so not to say that the positivity for the game isn't
warranted, but there's very little risk in trying this out.

(11:29):
I think I might want to try thisout if it's only 1015 minutes.
Yeah, I'd, I'd do it you. Could do that yeah and all the
all the people that I've talked to that I'm like this is what
I'm playing instead of great God, grow up.
They're like, oh, big bisexual vibes.
And so if you get into big bisexual vibes, this might be
your game. I'm always interested in trying

(11:51):
a game that shows me a perspective I don't see in every
game. So like that is immediately
drawing me and just the themes here.
I would love to give this a shotknowing that it's free and
that's it's overall very positive on Steam.
I do have just one question thatcomes to mind.
You don't have to say the significance like explain it,
but does the number 205 have a significance or is does it feel

(12:15):
arbitrary it? Feels arbitrary to me.
Interesting. It's kind of a kind of a head
Turner, you know? How often do we see that?
Number. Yeah, it is a particular number.
I guess if it would have been like 2O7 that would have been
like even more strange. Two O 5 is like a nice even
round 5. So it's like there could be
significance there. I will stay though.

(12:36):
Something I forgot to mention isthat there is one thing that
makes the clicks part feel even more arbitrary is that sometimes
the game progresses regardless of your input, so it's like this
section of dialogue is over and so it will sometimes
automatically move on to the next thing.

(12:57):
Not always. OK.
So, so it can feel a little bit more passive in those moments,
like you're you're on a ride, you're not participating.
Yeah. And it's as much.
Yeah, I've. I've had a good way to describe
it. I've had games like that too,
where it feels like, oh, do I need to be here?
Like I'm here and I'm sort of, you know, at what point does it
turn from a game into an experimental short film maybe.

(13:20):
Yeah. Yeah, totally get that.
All right. Well, I assume that you can only
play it on PC. This is on Linux, Mac and PC.
OK, so on desktop systems, very cool.
Well, a nice short one. I will probably check it out
soon and we'll move on to my Secret Game.
My Secret Game is one that I've talked about on our show.

(13:42):
But not reviewed. But not reviewed.
I've talked about quite recentlyit too like your secret game and
like our featured game today. Came out this year.
Released this year, in fact quite recently.
My secret game is called Hell Clock.

(14:11):
I. This phone was my fucking hell

(14:37):
clock. I remember you mentioning this.
Is this like the survivors like 1?
It's an action RPG. It's more like a Diablo slash
Path of Exile game. OK, there's a lot more
customization and choice and inputs that you're doing as the
player compared to some other survivors likes, but it's not.

(15:00):
It's foremost like a dungeon crawling action RPG.
Oh. OK, this might have been the one
that I compared to Land of the Dead Gods.
Yeah, yes, it's got a style that's like that.
It released this year again quite recently.
It was developed by Rogue Snail and published by Mad Mushroom
and the game synopsis from the Steam storefront reads quote.

(15:21):
Forge powerful builds with endless loot in this relentless
combination of roguelike and ARPG.
Blast through dungeons and unleash inhuman powers in a dark
fantasy twist on Brazil's War ofCanutos.
End Quote. So this game has a setting
that's very particular. It takes place during a an
alternate version of a conflict that's from real world history.

(15:44):
And I'd like to actually move down the Steam page and quote
another section from that to just describe what's going on,
because I think the Steam page does a great job at this, way
better than I could. So from the Steam page further
down it says quote. In the 19th century, Kanutos
became a refuge for thousands when its people defied the New
Republic. They faced brutal retaliation,

(16:06):
leaving 25,000 dead. Play as Pajeu, a warrior
fighting to rescue the soul of the Counselor, his fallen
mentor. With each descent, time warps
and your power grows as you confront the dark forces that
claimed his head and trapped hissoul.
End Quote. So that kind of gives you the
history and a jumping off point for what's going on.

(16:27):
This is an isometric action RPG dungeon crawler in the same vein
as Diablo. But I would specifically call
out Diablo 3 and 4 because I've played all of those games and
it's faster paced. Like the more modern Diablo
games where you're looting things, you're killing lots of
monsters very quickly, looting gear and just seeing how you can

(16:49):
create a build that just is really good at slaying monsters.
There's also that story going on.
And another game that's like this that's more modern is Path
of Exile and Ath of Exile 2. I've played the first one in
that series, and this game features illustrated cutscenes
of this war and your quest to rescue the soul of your mentor.
Since it takes place during a twisted version of this

(17:11):
conflict, you will hear the story spoken through Brazilian
Portuguese. So if you're an English speaker
like me, you will hear that language in this game, but there
are subtitles, obviously, so youcan still understand what's
going on. So I was doing a lot of that
reading when the story was happening, and there are three
acts in the base game. Each act has 21 layers, and each

(17:33):
layer only takes a moment to go through.
But when you have 21 layers and you're trying to get to the end
of an act that could be a prettysolidly long run, and you're
fighting demonic enemies and bosses that are spread
throughout some of the layers, you really can't go slowly if
you want to make progress because the titular hell clock
is always running out of time. It is a central mechanic to this

(17:55):
game. You get at default 7 minutes to
make your way through all the layers, as many as you can, and
when the clock runs out your runwill die.
You also have health, and you could run out of health and die
prematurely, but those are the two most common ways that a run
ends, other than like beating anaxe and beating the final boss
on layer 21 of an axe. There's no drawing a utility

(18:17):
closet and. Exactly.
Yes, that's one way. This game doesn't have synergy,
but you use so many mechanics tocreate a build.
You have abilities. These are your active slots that
you're using to attack and augment the fights.
I was using this ability called Repeater which allows you to

(18:39):
shoot a handgun really fast, like a machine gun.
You can slow down and lasso enemies.
You can summon spirits the fightalongside you.
You can deal holy plague, lightning, and fire damage.
Plague element, that's a good one for me.
They're never at that. There are lots of elements in
this game. There are tons of stats.

(18:59):
You have movement speed, you have evasion, you have all kinds
of different stats that you can see on a page.
It gets super nerdy and you can really delve into like what your
character needs to to be better,but you also create synergies by
equipping gear that you find that persist between runs.
These are like a gun that you would carry into the fight or

(19:22):
like boots or like rings and an amulets that have passive stats.
You also pick up these relics. You have a inventory for relics
that give you passive abilities,and relics will augment your
abilities. So one relic I had that I
depended on a lot was turning myrepeater ability into a fire

(19:48):
damage dealing skill. And then I would look out for
relics and other items that increased my fire damage because
now instead of physical damage, I'm doing fire damage.
That's just one example, but you're mixing and matching all
your relics. You also start each run as level
0 or level 1 and. As you fight enemies, you have

(20:10):
an experience bar that fills up and when you fill out your
experience bar, you get a blessing.
And this is kind of like Hades. This is where you get a
selection of three, sometimes four different ways to upgrade
the abilities that you've brought into your run.
So like you might choose one that increases your repeater
damage by 40% and you can only choose so many per ability.

(20:33):
Then you also have trinkets. Trinkets are items that will
give you yet more passive stat increases, and trinkets reset
after each run and so do the blessings.
But as you fight, you collect these things called Soul stones,
which give you points for a permanent skill tree that you

(20:56):
examine after each run. So I say all this.
I know it's confusing. There are tons of things that
augment your run, but all of this is combining to create
complexity with creating a character that just does a lot
of damage. Yeah.
So honestly, the the thing that I'm thinking of is very recent
for me. And in Iris and the Giant,

(21:17):
there's a lot of like parallels.It's like, OK, you get this to
upgrade this permanent thing, you get this, but it's only in
the run and you level up during your run, so.
So I know all that was confusingto a new player, but you get a
mixture, a healthy mixture of upgrades that are particular to
each run and then they are wiped.

(21:38):
And then also upgrades that are permanent and you can carry
between your runs, but that alsoare constantly being swapped out
by better things that you find. So I love that balance.
Not to get into my likes too early, but I think that's what
makes this game super interesting.
Later on you unlock a constellation skill tree that

(21:58):
gives you yet more passive upgrades and that's where we get
into end game progression stuff.So you have tons of character
stats that are affected and yourgoal is to fight your way
through the three acts of the game and defeat all the demons
you find and just learn more about this story that's based on
this actual conflict that happened in the late 19th
century. So what I liked about this game

(22:18):
is that I think this is so addictive.
This has the freaking addictive like action RPG sauce that I
chase in games like this. I grew up playing Diablo 2 when
I was in middle school and I hada group of friends that we'd
have sleepovers and just played Diablo 2 all night.
And so this is much faster pace than that.
It's more modern than that and you always feel like you are

(22:42):
getting more powerful. I did play this game for about 6
or 7 hours when it just had a demo.
It had a demo for Steam Necks Fest and that became my demo of
the fest. That's a chunky demo.
It lets you go to like I think layer 14 of act one, which is
really considerate. Like it gives you a good chunk
of the game to play and I would just grind out finding relics

(23:06):
and upgrading my skills in that demo for all those hours and
then they let you carry that progression over into the full
game when it released several weeks later.
Pro Pro Gamer. Move.
Love that. That's actually what made me
energized to want to play the demo so much, so props to them
for allowing for that. I then put in another 11 hours

(23:27):
or so after the full game release.
So I've put in a good 18 hours into this.
I've beaten it, and in most runsyou feel yourself getting
increasingly more powerful through everything you're
finding. You eventually mow down bosses
in seconds that once took you minutes to beat.
The sound design is thick with lots of combat and creature

(23:47):
sounds that I enjoy. And then the music is, you know,
I think it's tempting for a gamelike this to employ like, really
in your face, like heavy metal music, maybe something like
Hades, which we love that soundtrack, but this music feels
very particular to this place. I would.
I would prefer something that's in like, like blasphemous maybe?

(24:07):
Yeah, it's, it's very blasphemous, I would say.
I think it's reminiscent of that.
I also love that the style of this game is evocative of this
particular place, down to the voice erformances, the character
models, what characters are wearing, how they emote.
I've never played a game that evoked this particular sense of
place. It's so specific that it feels

(24:30):
unforgettable to me. And also the third act of this
game is so surprising and ambitious with where it goes.
It's actually the the location that we go to in this game that
I didn't see coming. And my jaw dropped.
And act three of three in this game reinvested me into the
story in a way where I had been occasionally caring about the

(24:53):
story up to that point. And then act three happened and
I was like suddenly really caring about the games
narrative, which is a big thing for such an action focused game
to do for me. Like I was like, hell yeah, I'm
into this. And I was paying extra close
attention to what everybody was saying after that.
That's awesome. Yeah.
So I love that the game did thatin its last third or so.

(25:14):
I do have things that I dislikedabout Hell Clock.
One thing is that later into theActs, as we get to layers like
14 onward, we can get into some grindy progression because the
enemies start to get super beefy, especially the bosses.
And so you can sometimes sit there and just be hitting bosses

(25:34):
and you're seeing their health bar just crawl downward and you
might have enough abilities and skills and passives that keep
you alive really well. It's just you need to stand
there shooting your gun at them for minutes on end sometimes to
to get that bar down. And I get why that's happening.
They have to, they have to make these runs last long enough and

(25:59):
be hard enough that we don't just sail through them.
But it just feels like there's this exponent based stat thing
going on where there's this imbalance of tough enemies that
halt your progression just because they take so much time,
not because they're actually challenging your skill a ton.
Yeah. So it's just the the demons get
beefy. Yeah, I, I felt a little bit of

(26:21):
that Rogue Legacy. Yeah.
Yeah. So I think we see parallels to
that in other rogue lights. Organizing relics that you find
can be a chore. You will.
When you're sailing through an act, you're fighting lots of
mini bosses and bosses, they'll drop relics and those relics you
have to then sort of organize inyour reliquary after the run.

(26:43):
And sometimes you spend a few minutes having to organize
things. You get just inundated
sometimes. And you can salvage them for
soul stones, which help you pay for upgrades, which is cool.
But there is that upkeep step between runs where you do have
to take care of that. You also start to recognize some
of the same patterns to the acts.

(27:06):
I'm thinking mostly about the layout of the maps.
You'll start to see a room and you'll go, oh, I've seen this
room every other time I've been in this act.
So it doesn't feel as randomizedas other rogue lights sometimes
and load times can also be long after runs.
I was noticing that sometimes load times were like 30 seconds
when you finish a run that's bigand that can you know, I did 50

(27:26):
plus runs throughout all the acts.
So that does add up overtime. That's a considerable amount of
time. So overall, I think hell clock
is super addicting. I can play it for hours.
I had so many just one more run sessions with this game.
I I lost sleep to this game. I think it's addicting if you
love action RPGs. It does get grindy and tedious

(27:49):
at points, but it's got a strongpersonality and sense of place.
I'm going to look forward to seeing how the road map for this
thing expands. I'm going to give this an 8.5
out of 10. It's playable on PC.
Yeah, I don't have any questionsreally.
Like I can see just from watching this trailer on loop
that there are a lot of systems.And so like, just because I'm

(28:14):
just at this moment overwhelmed with the amount of different
systems, I can't really like drill down on any details.
It's kind of reminding me of blasphemous where we have our
our rosary beads and our prayersand our whatever other two
things there were. So it's I'd have to touch.

(28:35):
It like or even like Colts of the Lamb.
Like I don't think there are oneto one comparisons in with this
and Colts of the lamb necessarily.
But I remember Colts of the Lambhad so many different aspects of
controlling how you performed inthe village and the dungeon, you
know, and, and sometimes it was confusing knowing what part had

(28:57):
what place. And that can be the case here.
But you slowly get eased into it.
If you play, it's not going to all hit you at once.
I think the game does on board you really smoothly.
Yeah, I mean, I've I've had a lot of trouble, good trouble,
most would say with like the just one more run games
recently. So I mean this for now.

(29:18):
I don't see how this isn't my jealous game for now, but oh
wow, cool, we've still got half a season to go.
So as we see, yeah, I mean, sometime if you come over, you
can, you can try out a run in Hell Clock or yeah, there's,
there's a lot of videos online. This this is a pretty popular
game so far this year and peopleare excited to see more from the
development team. They're expanding it, they're

(29:38):
working on content expansions for it.
So yeah, we'll see what happens with Hell Clock in the future.
So those are our secret games. This game will end in 205 clicks
and Hell Clock. Let's move on to our discussion
with Kara from Patch Magazine, this episode's special guest.

(30:09):
Our guest today is a talented writer with words and topics
that couldn't be tighter, talking about games and
developers and sounds in a handyscene you can carry around of
games they're so fond from across the pond.
We're pleased to correspond withKara from Patch Magazine.
How's it going? That was so magical.
What an intro wow I feel so special.

(30:34):
Well, we feel so special having you join us.
Thank you so much for being here.
I forget every time. Thank you so much for having me.
I forget every time that he doesthat.
It's incredible. Wow.
Nothing can prepare you for that.
You hear it on the recordings from other episodes, but when
you actually hear it, that is wow, I've got such whimsy now
in. My step, we want to get you

(30:54):
started on the right foot. So yeah, thank you so much for
joining. We're going to talk to you about
Patch Magazine today, your work with Patch, some of your gaming
tastes, and then we'll get into our discussion on Blueprints as
well, which is the game that youchose from our list, and we're
so excited to talk to you. So Kara, for anyone who doesn't
know about Patch, can you tell us what Patch is?

(31:17):
Of course. So Patch Magazine is a monthly
gaming magazine specializing in all things indie games.
So inside you'll find everythingfrom reviews to interviews with
developers. You'll even find recipes taken
from games that we've desperately tried to create in
real life, and crafts to do withall your favorite game
characters. And it all comes neatly packaged

(31:39):
in the post or via e-mail if youget a digital subscription for
all things. Yeah, your slice of indie
gaming. Beautiful.
Every time we have a guest here on Underplayed, we want to talk
a little bit about your background.
So tell us about your backgroundin games writing and your role
at Patch. Yeah, so my role at Patch, I'm a

(32:01):
copy editor alongside a writer. I've been working in games
journalism for four years now. I've spent a lot of that time
freelance writing for a number of different publications,
covering software and hardware and all sorts of things like
reviews, news, features, basically anything I can
possibly get my hands on. In that time I've tried to and

(32:23):
luckily I've been housed sort ofpermanently at Patch.
Lovely. And yeah, you work on a tons of
different projects, tons of different pieces for the Zine.
And along with that you have various roles that you're
working with on the Patch team. You have the other writers, you
also have the people who put thedesign of the magazine together.

(32:43):
So can you talk a little bit more about your work with the
various other roles and how you work with all the team members?
Yeah, so we are quite a small team, especially for a print
publication, so we do work very tightly together.
As a copy editor, a lot of my time is spent working alongside

(33:04):
the writers. I go through everyone's
deadlines and articles every month, just get them up to
scratch, make sure that they match our style guide for the
magazine. I also work alongside our editor
in chief, Jemima, to make sure that all of the issue themes and
everything are unified, very ready to go for the next couple

(33:25):
of months. And then the social media team
as well, just making sure that all of the content that's going
out accurately represents the upcoming issue or if we want to
get everyone excited for a certain event.
It's a very like unified effort.Everyone is working together, so
there's not like one specific team that works solo.

(33:47):
Like everyone is involved with every part of the planning
process up until publication, and by that point we're already
working on the next magazine. So it's a constant flurry of
just making sure that everythingis good to go.
And I play like one part in that.
Yeah, I imagine like One Piece will affect another piece.

(34:07):
Like how long copy is might affect how design ends up
looking for a two page piece or maybe a three page piece.
And so that constant communication is important,
isn't it? Yeah, absolutely.
Yeah. And a lot of the editorial that
people are writing and a lot of the ways the articles go, you
don't know until you're writing them.
And then that can massively impact the style of the spread

(34:31):
and the illustrations that the design team work on.
Like it all can change in such an instant, But I personally
think that that's one of the most exciting parts of working
for Patch 'cause it's also you never really know.
Like you have such a vague outline and then anything can
happen. That's awesome.
Do you do you find that most of the patch team, are they like

(34:52):
writers by trade and are, you know, just happen to be game
fans? Are they game fans that are
using maybe a natural skill withwriting to just like become a
part of the game ecosphere? Like what?
What do you find is is the usualstory there?
I think a lot of the time, not necessarily for everyone, but a

(35:14):
lot of the time it is a game fan1st.
And I think one thing with having spent so many years in
games journalism, one of the things that is so hard about the
industry is getting into it. And without the opportunity to
get into it, you can't get very far.
Like, unless you have some sort of evidence of work that you've

(35:36):
produced, you can't then progress from that.
And I think what's so special about Patch is it is a place
where people can start as well as sort of flourish.
So it's the place that you can find that voice as a games
journalist without having the background of a writer.
And that's one of the things that I love most about it.

(35:58):
And I've loved that since I started working there.
But it is that hub of I really want to do this thing, but I
don't know how to start doing it.
And having that close team of people working on this is
essentially a passion project every month for us, which other
people enjoy, which is great forus.
But yeah, having that like central hub of come here, see

(36:21):
how it feels and then go from there.
And whether you like stick around then that's up to you
guys. I think that sounds very
relatable to the very organization we're we're working
with right here. So I I know exactly what you're
talking about there. OK, So you talked about keeping
people in touch. Walk us through the rest of the
process of getting a new issue published every single month.

(36:46):
So our issue planning always starts with deciding on a theme.
So every issue of Patch Magazinefollows a theme, be it like
pixel art games or a newest issue coming in September for
example. It's all themed around forest
floor. We've had things like nostalgia
and self-care in the past, so once that theme is decided,

(37:06):
whether that's from a game that we really want to talk about or
whether that's from an idea thatsomeone's thrown in our planning
chat and we've wanted to run with that, that's essentially
the first seed that is planted. And then each month we have a
brainstorm meeting, which is where all of the writers and
some of the designers come together and we sit and we let

(37:27):
people pitch their article ideasor talk about any games that
they've really wanted to play that upcoming or games that have
already come out, whether it's acouple of years ago or not.
And then we just go through the motions of like this would make
a really good think piece, for example.
Or do you think you can make a guide from this game that's just

(37:47):
come out? And these meetings go on for
about an hour and a half to two hours until we've got
essentially the skeleton and theplan of an issue.
And then we'll have two sets of deadlines where everyone can
submit their articles. Then they'll go through the
editing process and the design team will take all of the
illustration briefs that they'vebeen given.

(38:08):
And then it all, like over the course of a month, sort of comes
together until suddenly there's a magazine in my hands and I
think, oh cool, we've done it. And then we do it all again.
Do it all again, do it 11 more times for the next year.
Yeah, Yeah. So that's fascinating that you
start with a seed like you said,you have the the the theme of
the issue and then everything grows from there.

(38:30):
I have to imagine with anyone having the ability to pitch an
idea for a theme and throw it inthat chat, in that planning
group, Do you have a long backlog of theme ideas at Patch?
Like, is it? Is it just like dozens of ideas
that are? Maybe someday we could do
something like this. Absolutely.
We've got this big document thatI think our design lead,

(38:53):
Natasha, she put together and it's just the second anyone puts
into this server like, oh, we could do this.
It just is thrown into this document.
And then we get together every couple of months to talk about
upcoming issue themes. And it's just like, oh, I forgot
about that. I did like we've got one sort of
penciled in that's all about dinosaurs.

(39:14):
And I've loved dinosaurs since Iwas a kid.
And so if I get a chance to talkabout dinosaur games, I'm the
frame one. Like ready to go.
Oh my goodness, you have so manyoptions of pieces to do for
that. Yeah.
And it they just keep coming out.
And so sometimes all it takes is1 game to come out or be
announced. And then it's like we have that

(39:34):
theme idea that we've penciled in months ago that we can now
bring forward to coincide with that release.
And it's, yeah, it's kind of chaotic, but it works.
No, I think the best ideas come out of that kind of chaos.
That's brilliant. And some really popular indie
games release and it's like theysort of enter the zeitgeist.

(39:56):
Like the game we're going to feature today, Blueprints, that
is a game that everybody suddenly started talking about.
That's a huge game from this year.
And so everybody started talkingabout first person puzzle games.
You know, in my circles I heard lots of people talking about
Blueprints, but also games that inspired it, like The Witness
and other things. And so that that is really
powerful. People see that theme of an

(40:17):
issue and they've already been thinking about it in a way.
They've already been preparing themselves to read this issue
from Patch, which is really cool.
And everyone gets sort of all ofthe writers get almost warned in
advance, like this theme is coming up.
And it would just be a flurry ofmessages, like, I really want to
talk about this game. This one is like in my backlog.
I need an excuse to play it. It can go into this theme.

(40:40):
And so it's like people will be planning articles that they want
to write like 6 months in advance for certain themes.
And. It's constant.
It's constant. That's so exciting.
That's a chat group that I wouldlove to just be a family on the
wall for and to just be able to see.
Now, we've read multiple articles from you regarding

(41:01):
sound in games. This is something that we just
see has sort of cropped up over time.
Is that one of your specialties and do you and the other Patch
staff members have this interestin sound in common?
So interestingly, sound isn't actually I've got nothing to do
with audio design. I've never had anything to do
with audio design or producing music for games.

(41:26):
It's just so important to me forany sort of experience for the
game, and it creates such an atmosphere across so many genres
that it's almost like the one thing that I look for as soon as
I play a game. It's like if the soundtrack is
good, there is like a 90% chanceI will enjoy the game more

(41:49):
because if it's something that Igo off and I listen to straight
away afterwards, it's like that game has stuck with me, which I
think comes across in a lot of my writing.
I always am like, oh, this soundtrack is really good.
And you'll always see my like Spotify listening history as
like game soundtrack, after gamesoundtrack.
And I think the patch team are also aware of like the

(42:11):
importance of sound design. And so it does come up in
conversation a lot, but I don't know if that's because people
know that I always talk about soundtracks.
That could be the the thing thatkeeps them talking to me about
it. But I've always, I've always
loved music in every possible way.
I used to play a couple instruments and I think that

(42:34):
that's just carried across into adulthood and my writing.
Do you notice that other team members have specialties maybe
or like things that it's like ifthis comes up in a game, like
let's say if it is about pixel art, just to pull an example, if
there's a game about pixel art, is there, are you like thinking

(42:56):
like, oh, Fred's the guy that's going to write this.
He's he's the one that we talkedto about this.
Absolutely. There are games that get thrown
into our Brainstorm document andI feel like every month I'm
like, oh, that's definitely a Ben game.
That's definitely a pumpkin game.
That's like, Emily would love that.
Whether or not they're in the meeting, it's just like that

(43:17):
default. They have shown an interest in
this genre in the past, or they've voiced their love for
this sort of style. And it is that, like, we don't
have a sheet to explain everyone's favorite genres or
styles or anything like that. It's solely A vibe.
Vibe. Yeah.
And that definitely happens. That's a special form of love, I

(43:38):
think when you look at a piece of art and it just reminds you
of a person because of how they've expressed what they love
to you and the rest of the team.We do that here.
Like I'll see a game and I'll belike, oh, that's a me game.
Or I'll think that's a disco cola game.
Absolutely. We've just done this enough that
you kind of know. Yeah.

(43:58):
So let's say research and Deadlight Times aren't an
interest, what would you most like to write about for Patch?
Or or who might you want to interview?
This is a really good question. I feel like the obvious answers
and ones that absolutely apply to me would be concerned Ape

(44:19):
because like, obviously Stagy Valley is such a pioneer for its
genre and has set such a foundation for so many cozy
indie games. And with Haunted Chocolatier
being such an anticipated game release, I would love to get
into his mind and see what he's thinking.
And then I feel like Team Cherryis sort of in the same vein

(44:43):
there. But personally, I would really
love to interview Toby Fox if I could because Undertale was such
a significant game for me to play when I was younger.
I just want to pick people's brains about it and know every
single thing that went into creating something like that.

(45:04):
And then As for the things I'd like to write, I guess it kind
of, it does all depend on the issue theme.
So it's it's hard to to plan in advance.
Yeah, that makes sense. Hey everybody, this is Bopo
coming in here with an edit. While I'm putting the episode
together, just wanted to let youknow that there is an outdated

(45:26):
little discussion coming your way about Hollow Night Silk
Song, where we talk about whether it's coming out in 2025.
And lo and behold, days after werecorded this episode, the
release date for Hollow Night Silk Song was announced by Team
Cherry, set for September 4th. We could just delete this next
section of the discussion, but we thought that it was still a

(45:48):
charming and fun little moment, so we will keep it in.
Just keep that in mind that we didn't know this at the time and
this is the nature of doing podcasts sometimes.
I will send you back now. Speaking of Team Cherry, do you
think Silk songs come in this year?
It's kind of like AI. Do you do?

(46:08):
I think it is. I'm skeptical.
They sort of dropped it into that Xbox game showcase with
that handheld. They were like, it's going to
come out and Silksong was already on it.
I feel like they're just going to drop it.
It's going to be a Hades to Early Access 2.0.
They're literally just going to be like, there it is.
Here it is. I I think when it does come that

(46:30):
it's going to, you know, just belike, here it is, but I'm
skeptical it's coming this year.I I share your optimism, Kara,
and I I believe that this is theyear I've talked to other people
other than Disco Cola and they're like, do you think Silk
Song is coming this year? And I'm like, yeah, I actually
do. And they don't believe me.
So it's. You've got to stay optimistic,
otherwise it simply won't release.

(46:51):
Yeah, and I do think Team Cherryis one of those developers that
could just shadow drop it and they do just fine.
You know they they can get away with.
That I think the pessimism makesthe shadow drop even better,
personally. But oh.
Sure, yeah. This is me.
Less joy now, more joy later. Intense joy later.
Yeah, and. It's very like nonchalant.
If it drops and you were like itmight come out, you can be like

(47:14):
it's out. Whereas I feel like the people
that are like it's coming, I'm counting down from the days
like. Yeah, yeah.
I can't, I can't imagine the pressure just being on that
small team and, and you know. I know, yeah.
The whole world is waiting and watching.
Every single showcase is every silk song.
When Silk. Song I I have to close the like
YouTube live chat 'cause I'm just like I'm sick of it's it's

(47:37):
all silk song. Yeah, Haunted Chocolatier,
though, that's another one that people are just really looking
forward to, and it's been in development for a while.
But then we have had plenty of updates that have been like it's
not coming for a while. Yeah.
So our expectations are set. We're not making any bets about
2025 for that one. Now, when you look at what Patch

(47:58):
does, how do you see Patch approaching games journalism
differently from some of the more large legacy journalists
entities? I think one of the things that
separates Patch from a lot of these larger scale publications
is the fact that we make the magazine on the basis that we

(48:19):
want it to sound like a conversation that you're having
with a friend. It doesn't need to be this hard
hitting reporting on news and the state of the industry and
all of this stuff. It is almost as if you've walked
into a cafe or a bar and your friend is gone.
Hey, have you played this game? Oh, I played this last week.
Like you would really like it. And here's why we sort of pride

(48:42):
ourselves, I guess, on that feeling of it being such a close
comfort. And I think as well, at a time
where games media in particular is so intense and everyone is
reporting on all of these like mass layoffs and all of this
stuff, it's almost that breath of remembering that the hobby is

(49:07):
meant to be enjoyed. It's not meant to be such a
constant competition with one another to see who can play the
most games this year or who's created the longest JRPG and all
of this stuff. It's just, it's designed to be
just a chill approach to games media.
It definitely comes across. I've been a reader for a little

(49:28):
over a year and when I started subscribing, I actually went to
your website and I ordered all of the backlog issues that were
still in stock and I actually started back in, you know those
early issues. I couldn't get all of the early
ones. I guess I could get them
digitally always, but I got all the physical ones that I could
and started making my way. I've I've read pretty much all

(49:50):
of 2023. I'm now have made my way into
2024, but then as I get new issues in the mail, I also read
ones from this year too. So I kind of jump back and forth
and it's just been a pleasure. And I also shared some issues
with Disco, especially issues that had pieces by you in them
so that he could kind of catch up as well.
Speaking of that conversation, how how do you see Patch fans

(50:12):
interacting with your team and and how does the community shape
the the magazine? So we have a community Discord
server which obviously anyone can join whether they subscribe
or not. It's just a place where people
can come and talk about games, which so many people do.
I feel like I've got more game recommendations from that server
than I have just looking at a showcase or like the Steam

(50:35):
homepage, which is great becauseI love getting recommendations
from people and hearing their opinions on it rather than
trusting my instincts. So there's always a constant
conversation of people talking about the magazine or a lot of
the time we take a lot of inspiration from the
conversations that people are having about a certain game.

(50:57):
It can encourage us to talk about that in the future.
And people in particular love toshare what they would like to
see in the magazine, which obviously impacts the planning
process because it gives us so many ideas of things that we can
include that people do want to read.
And it also makes them feel slightly more connected to us

(51:21):
because obviously we're all people at the end of the day.
And we want you to feel like we're people.
And so having that connection oflike, oh, we used your idea for
this issue, that really helps usfeel connected to the community
and also them feeling like they have an impact on the magazine,
which they do. Yeah, it's the coffee shop

(51:42):
feeling of like walking in and getting those recommendations
both shared to you and shared tothe people you're talking to.
That's so cool. And then I also, I've noticed at
the end of the issues there willbe basically reposts of people
posting about the magazine on social media.
So posts lifted from places likeInstagram, pictures of them

(52:04):
reading the the scene right there in the back of the scene,
just as a tribute to those people who are keeping up with
the current issues too. Yeah, And it's lovely because
people get so creative with those photos, and even without
knowing necessarily that they could end up in the magazine,
they're always so excited to share these photos that they've
taken. And one example in particular

(52:25):
that was shared in our Discord server recently is someone
matched their issues that they had, their physical issues, They
paired them with their cosplay wigs and took these incredibly
aesthetically pleasing photos. And I was just, I was amazed
because I was like, I would never think of doing something
like that. Wow.

(52:46):
That's a. That's a it was incredible,
unexpected creative inspiration there.
Yeah, that's so cool. It was really cool.
Carrie, let's talk about upcoming games.
We know you mentioned Haunted Chocolatier and we talked about
Silk Song for a second, but whenyou look at the calendar, maybe
over the next year, what games are you really looking forward

(53:06):
to covering or maybe just playing casually?
One of the biggest ones for me is going to be Little Nightmares
Three. I love that series.
I'm so excited for this game andto see how it's executed in
comparison to the last two. Yeah, talk about, yeah, talk
about a series that is like, I wish we could cover more because

(53:27):
it's not indie, but it's like, so indie, like it has that
atmosphere. It's it's it's such a shame, but
also I'm. I'm so glad that like, more
mainstream entities are like, you know what, let's just have a
couple of these games with this vibe.
Yeah, definitely. I think, yeah, one of the things
that I'll always, even though it's not indie anymore, knowing

(53:48):
that it's still got its roots inTazi's studios is like all I
need for an excuse to play it. Similarly, I don't know when
it's scheduled to release, but RE Animal, which is from some of
the guys that made the original Little Nightmares game, also
looks terrifying. But I'm excited to play that.

(54:09):
And then things like baby steps.And big.
Walk, which are two like walkingsimulator games I'm really
excited for. As if I can't just go outside
and do that in real life. And then there's one called
Danchi Days, which was shared atthe Wholesome Direct.
But it's about like summer in Japan, which is totally my vibe.

(54:30):
And you have a little Kappa companion.
And so it's already a win in my books.
Yeah, we're seeing really cool second projects or third
projects from teams that made really interesting games before
these. Like Big Walk is the follow up
game from House House, who made Untitled Goose Game, which we
got to talk about last season onour podcast.

(54:50):
And yeah, it's just really cool to see these teams do these
things. Baby steps coming from the team
that gave us Ape Out too. Like I never would have expected
something like this. And it's super ambitious.
Beyond games, what are you looking forward to doing next?
Professionally, Personally, Tonight for dinner, if you

(55:12):
haven't already eaten. I have already eaten so I have
no exciting dinner plans, but ohgosh, I don't know.
I, I feel like because everything's so quick,
especially with work at the moment, everything's so
fast-paced. I'm just trying to take things
one day at a time. And so yeah, tomorrow I'll
probably get up and do it all again.

(55:35):
I'll take my dog for a walk. Perhaps that would.
Be good, start the next process for the next month.
Of yeah, we've just actually finished, We just finished the
deadlines for our September issue.
So I think tomorrow's going to be some some proofing and making
sure that everything's going through with that.
Awesome. Good luck with finishing that

(55:56):
issue up. And you know, let's end this
interview section by having you tell listeners where they can
find PATCH and your work. Yeah, so you can visit the Patch
Magazine website if you fancy getting yourself a subscription
of our monthly magazine or by following our social media.
We are at the Patch Mag on X andInstagram and just Patch

(56:20):
Magazine on Blue Sky and TikTok.Wonderful.
Well, Kara, thank you so much for telling us about Patch and
your work and your interest in games.
It's an honor. We're not done with you yet.
We're going to move on to our next segment with you, which is
talking about Blueprints, this episode's featured game.
To The Architect, an empty blueprint represents a world of

(56:46):
possibilities. I give and bequeath to my
grandnephew all of my right, title and interest in the house
and land which. I own.
Near Mount Holly. A world of dreams and doorways.

(57:19):
The above. Provision is contingent.
On discovering location of the 46th room of my 45.
Room State. So Blueprints is a 2025 rogue
light puzzle narrative adventuregame.
There are a lot of genres you could use to describe it, I

(57:40):
think. It's developed by Doggy Bomb and
published by Raw Fury. The game synopsis from the Steam
storefront reads quotes. Welcome to Mount Holly, where
every dawn unveils a new mystery.
Navigate through shifting corridors and ever changing
chambers in this genre defying strategy puzzle adventure.
But will your unpredictable pathlead you to the rumored Room 46?

(58:04):
So Blueprints is a first person puzzle game.
You play as 14 year old Simon Jones, who inherits a large
estate in the mountains from hisgreat uncle Herbert S Sinclair,
the former Baron of the estates.And Herbert's will states that
to fulfill his right to the inheritance, Simon has to locate

(58:24):
the 46th room in the 45 room estates.
This estate has magical properties.
Each day the floor plan and the layout of the estate is wiped
clean and the rooms are built one at a time, starting from the
entrance hall. And you work your way sort of
north. And this is a game of many

(58:45):
secrets with dozens of rooms youcan build.
And along the way, you're learning about the background
and legacy of your family, the people who knew them, and what
goes into making this place work.
It's a lot of intrigue going on.And the question is, can you
find the 46th room, Which I think is really enticing when
you hear that this place only has 45 rooms.

(59:07):
So that's what I would say to somebody to set up the story and
setting, But the layers go deeper and deeper and deeper the
more you play. I know people who have played
this game for over 100 hours. I know people who have 100 plus
days in the game. But Disco Cola, when we look at
gameplay, how would you describewhat's going on interactive

(59:30):
wise? Yeah, in Blueprints, you're sort
of in this first person 3D space.
You have access to a very slightjog.
Otherwise, most of what you can do is pick up a currency style
items like coins or gems or keysor dice.
You can also move up to doors toopen the door to the next room.

(59:52):
And when you do, you'll be givena selection of three rooms to
choose from. And whatever room you choose, if
you can afford it, will be the room that gets built.
You also have what is essentially A stamina meter, so
each time you enter a new room, you lose one step or you know in
this case, stamina for the for the simile here.

(01:00:16):
And if you run out of steps on any given day, you will become
quote exhausted and you will have to call it a day and move
on to the next day regardless ofwhat you've built next.
There are several items in the game.
If you think of them in the Rogue Light experience, they
would be considered passive upgrades for the run.

(01:00:36):
My favorite examples are the shovel, which will allow you to
dig up noticeable dirt spots in order to obtain items, or in
some cases nothing. You may also get a sledgehammer
that allows you to break the locks on chests without spending
keys on them. And there are a few others that
give you other different passiveupgrades.

(01:00:57):
And the goal of the game is to select all the right rooms in
the right circumstances to ultimately lead you north and
reach the fabled room 46. This is a game made by a small
team, which we're seeing more and more of in the indie space.
This game is the brainchild of game director Tonda Ross, who
worked on the game for quite a few years, and it was inspired

(01:01:17):
by all kinds of puzzle formats. Games like Gone Home and The
Witness, but also things like picture books that you might
flip through to solve a puzzle. All kinds of formats went into
the inspiration for this. Now, Kara, when you looked at
our giant lists of featured gameideas, this is one of the ones
that stuck out to you. You put it in your short list,

(01:01:40):
and then we decided to pick thatone because it's a big game this
year. But when you first looked at the
list, what stuck out about Blueprints and why did you pick
it? Interestingly, it's really not a
genre that I would usually go for, mostly because as soon as
anything requires any sort of strategy, my brain can't handle
it. And I knew that this would
really challenge me. But because of how many people I

(01:02:03):
heard talking about it as you sent the list to me, it felt
like an appropriate enough challenge to sort of share with
other people. Because I know that it's going
to cause a lot of discussion as well, because the way that it's
structured is everyone has a different experience.
And I find that so fascinating because I immediately want to

(01:02:24):
know why you approached it that way or what made you go for that
room over this room and like whywe did things so differently.
And I just feel like it's rare that you have a game that can
cause such a discussion. And so it just, I was
immediately like, I have to playthis and see what all the fuss
is about. You know, Bopo told me, or I

(01:02:47):
heard secondhand. How many in game days it took
him to reach room 46? And I was just like, excuse me,
what? And so it's it's a very
different experience from what Ihad.
So yeah, that's I wholeheartedlyagree with that sentiment.
I love games that allow each of us to have a different
experience too. That's always something I look
for in indie games. And I would say like beyond your

(01:03:09):
classic genre classifications like adventure, RPG, simulation,
etcetera, I look for games that give us a particular experience
to the person playing. And I actually brought my notes
today that I, I found a notebookthat I could dedicate to
blueprints. And so I might flip through this

(01:03:30):
here and there. This will be a good.
At least five full pages I'm seeing from here.
This this will be some good. ASMR.
ASMR soundscape layers going on here.
But as I look through this, it'snot only my road map for getting
through the game, but it also tells my story of what I learned

(01:03:51):
and what was important to me. And so, like, I could look at
your notes, Kara. I could look at discos notes and
kind of understand a little bit about how your mind thinks and
also about the luck that you gotor didn't get.
Yeah. So I think that's super
interesting. And then if you don't mind going
into more general thoughts on the game after playing it.

(01:04:15):
Yeah, I just feel like it is such a genius way to do it
because in a way it's so linear,but also it's so overwhelmingly
open. And you really have to like
expect the unexpected because you can go in and one day be
like, this is it, I'm going straight to the the antechamber.
Like I've got the route down. And then one single dead end can

(01:04:39):
just throw off your whole your whole track and you just don't
know where that's going to come in.
You don't know what you're goingto end up with.
It's a perfect example of being so frustrated at a game, but you
just have to keep playing it. And I don't love that feeling,
but there is something about blueprints which makes you have
to love that feeling. Yeah, you have to become

(01:05:02):
comfortable with one of the bestfriends of your life suddenly
ending in a few selections of rooms.
And I was actually watching a friend play it on Twitch today
and they were having one of the best runs.
And then they got dead ends and they couldn't get to where they
wanted to go. They were, they were super
disappointed. But then they realized I learned

(01:05:25):
a lot today and they listed all the things they learned.
And so that's how I tried to seethe failure too.
Is like, what can I salvage fromthis failure?
I, I think that's kind of a mindset thing that this game
teaches you or reminds you of. And it's something that I didn't
pick up immediately, but over time that ended up shaping my
journey. Yeah, absolutely.

(01:05:48):
The only dislike I had is I feltlike it was a personal attack
every time I was getting close to the end and there was a dead
end room. And one of the things that I
love so much about it but I alsoabsolutely despise is the fact
you can't back out of a decision.
As soon as you've interacted with the door you are locked in.
You can't be like, actually, I'mgoing to see if I walk away and

(01:06:08):
go to a different place, if I can get different rooms because
you just have to pick. And it's it's always in those
instances that you are given theworst set of blueprints to pick
from. Yeah, that's so relatable.
I had so many times where I justhad to make a decision.
And when you get a bad selection, you kind of already
foresee your your doom a little bit.

(01:06:30):
It's like I, I know that this isthis spells the end for me.
It's OK. I'll just, you know, I got to
pick. Something I have AI have a very
specific example, try to remind me to share it later because I
don't think it's in my notes butit's for sure I quit after that
one. So, any more overall thoughts or
Are you ready to assign a score to the game out of 10?

(01:06:50):
I think there's there's so much that I want to say, but also it
is one of those games where you have to play it to understand
because no matter what you hear other people say and talk about
their success or their failures in their runs, you don't fully
appreciate what is going on until you play it for yourself.
Yeah. I would agree with that.

(01:07:12):
What would you score blueprints out of 10?
I would give it an 8 straight off the bat.
I don't think it deserves any higher just because it took me
so long to figure out things that should have taken a lot
less time. Yeah, and we will talk about our
journeys and our discoveries, maybe tips for new players if

(01:07:33):
you have those in a little bit. But first I want to hear from
Disco Cola on what he thought ofblueprints.
Yeah, I share a lot of cares sentiments there, particularly
in the frustration realm. But I'll, I'll, I'll start off
with things that I did like, andI didn't originally write this
down, but just talking about thesetup today, I really appreciate

(01:07:53):
that this game sets almost a literal North Star for us in the
Anta Chamber. It puts it right on the map and
you know, OK, the ultimate goal is to get here.
I have a lot of room to explore along the way, but I definitely
need to get to the Anta Chamber and that's the North Star 4 room

(01:08:14):
46. How do I get to room 46?
Well, I'll find out when I get to the antechamber, but that's
that's the North star and it's always there on the map.
And then you get a little bit more of that when you find the
foundation finally as well. And so that that's a a semi
north star as well. So I appreciate that visually.

(01:08:35):
I like the thick, bold painters lines in the setting of the
game. It makes everything really
attractive and it's an art styleI've seen before, but usually in
more, not necessarily 2D games. But I haven't seen it in the
first person experience. And so I really appreciate the
art style in the sense and it, it really uses colors, but

(01:08:59):
they're not bold, they feel matte sort of, if that makes
sense. And so it's it's just really
attractive. I like when the music changes.
It makes me feel like I'm on to something.
Usually I'm not, maybe I am and I don't know it, but it's still
a nice feeling when that that music changes in a dramatic way.

(01:09:21):
I love all the little synergies that rooms have.
I love getting loads of green rooms and just and just digging
it. And I love going to the
Observatory. One time I went in there with
like the handheld telescope and I earned double buffs when I had
like 46 stars unlocked. There's a handheld telescope.
There's a handheld telescope youcan find in this game.
You can make it. I didn't make it, but I found

(01:09:43):
it, yeah. Right there, that highlights how
your experience just in that onemoment.
It's so different than mine. I mean, if I have the an
experience that was as long as mine, I'm bound to run into
maybe a lot more stuff than you might have.
But I when I did that, I had like any apple granting me 8
extra steps and that's huge. And then if I find The Secret

(01:10:05):
Garden, that's like spreading even more apples around.
So there are a lot of cool synergies in this game and I
love when the luck has those working together.
This is similar to other games I've played in the very like
very broad strokes, but I've never played a game quite like
this. I've never like built a house as

(01:10:26):
I'm exploring it while also having to manage all of these
resources and also stamina. I think this game is just very
creative and it's surprising that no one has really come up
with something like this yet, asfar as I know.
You know, you've talked about some inspirations, but.
Yeah, inspirations, definitely. But I mean, this game was worked
on for the better part of a decade.

(01:10:47):
I mean, I think for something this ambitious and this grand
and scale and ideas and lore andlayers, I think it would take
humans a long time to come up with this, you know, even if
it's a small team. So there's that too.
I mean, this is just a few people making this game, so
that's understandable, I think. And it would take so long.

(01:11:07):
I mean, think about animal well and Billy Basso, that was like
7-8 years as well, yeah. Yeah, I mentioned it, but I love
digging. I love cracking chests.
I think finding items is really fun and just general.
Most of the time it is overall, it's just super fun to play.
It has that one more try thing. There were several nights where

(01:11:28):
I was like up until almost 4 because I was just like, no,
just one more, I can do it. This time.
If I can just find the green room, I know I can do it.
But so it has that one more one more try thing.
As far as things I don't like, there's a massive reliance on

(01:11:48):
randomness. You can get screwed really
quickly. Sometimes you can get screwed
right at the finish line. I had one run where I had the a
room called the ballroom. So when you walk into the
ballroom it will automatically set your gems to two, which is a
a nerf if you have a ton of gems, but it's a buff if you

(01:12:11):
have no gems. And I was right next to the
antechamber. I was picking a room that would
go up and to the right and into the door that I already
unlocked. The only option that got me
there was a room that costed gems.
And so back to Kara's point, when you get to that door, you
can't back out. Be like, oh just let me go to

(01:12:31):
the ballroom real quick so I canget the gems I need.
Now that I know what I need, I can now use my knowledge of the
rest of the house to go find thething.
But you but you don't get that chance.
And I it was like 3:30 in the morning and I was so mad and I
took my sleeping pill and I wentto bed 'cause I was just so
pissed off. There is meta progression in

(01:12:53):
this game, but I find it to be really slow coming.
It took me forever to find access to the Westgate or
whatever. The finding allowances can be
strange. You can drain the well, but
like, you know, how soon are yougoing to get to the room that

(01:13:15):
drains the well? And so there's a lot going on
that meta progression wise that is nice once you find it, but
it's it's slow coming. It's again relying on that
randomness. So you don't really know what's
going to happen. There are several puzzles that I
find extremely obtuse and I don't even begin to know where

(01:13:35):
to find the clues for that. Other things that I think are
clues to things are just decoration and I'm just like,
I'm looking too deeply at some things but not looking deeply
enough in other areas. And I, I just, I don't know,
like what the pattern is for things that are important, if
that makes sense. It's hard to know that sometimes

(01:13:56):
things are pretty straightforward.
Other times things there are secrets hiding right in
Plainview and you, you walk by them 100 times and you don't
realize it exactly. Other times you have a suspicion
and maybe that doesn't lead anywhere.
It's just the visual style. Right, and I know that this is
probably A+ on Bopo's list, but for me, I know that there's like

(01:14:19):
this massive lore and story, especially with like lineage and
this I don't royalty. I guess I don't really care to
learn it. I got what I needed from the
coin operated fortune teller guy.
That's all I care to learn as far as that's concerned.

(01:14:41):
And you know, I'll, I'll mentionthis right now.
The game ended up taking me like33 hours just to reach room 46.
And so my last complaint is thatthis game did eventually.
Even though it was fun, it did eventually overstay its welcome
for me and I spent way too long on this.
But Blueprints is most certainlya pioneer in what I'm sure will

(01:15:06):
be the next hot roguelite subgenre.
It has the potential to have a balatro effect and giving us a
bunch of different games just like it's.
I think it's very creative and while I am playing it, I do get
sucked in. However, many of the puzzles
rely on information from other areas.

(01:15:27):
Things that seem like clues might be clues, and others are
just mundane objects. So in a game that has that great
amount of randomness and dead ends, I find that puzzle
philosophy kind of frustrating. Blueprints overstate its
welcome. Nevertheless, it's quite
enjoyable and I get that one more try thing because of that
and that goes a long way. I give this a 7.5 out of 10.

(01:15:50):
OK, nice. So kind of in the same
neighborhood as Cara as far as score.
And also like as I hear the complaints about the
randomization and just not getting the luck or maybe having
good luck and then it's all ended in an instance, I think
that's something you 2 have in common, right?
Definitely, yeah. So I'll go into my brief
thoughts. This game continues to fill my

(01:16:12):
every waking thoughts since I finished it.
I love this a lot more than I thought I would.
As some background, I first played the demo for this during
Esteem Next Fest, I think last year, I want to say it was in
2024. And I remember not really
getting it. Like I understood the concept.
I understood that you're building this estate room by

(01:16:32):
room and that you have a certainnumber of steps and that you
find gems and keys and coins andthings like that.
But in a demo situation, I just didn't understand the appeal.
And I was like, I'm not sure if this will hit for people.
And then it really hit for people.
People popped off for blueprints.
So I was like, interesting, Maybe I just didn't get it.

(01:16:53):
Maybe I will never get it. And I am actually really
surprised to share that I super dig this game.
I think this is a game where almost anything feels possible,
from the story and the lore to what you can discover, to what
you feel like you may never discover.
And my lists for that latter part there, it's very long for
things I know I'll never discover.

(01:17:14):
Like I have a laundry list of things that I have an inkling
about, but I don't know how to explore them without outside
help. And that will kind of turn into
one of my complaints for sure. But I think this has a very
alluring mixture of things I love in games.
Intrigue, puzzle solving, strategy, emotional depth.

(01:17:36):
I especially love the atmosphere, which I think
carries a lot of that emotional depth.
I think this is creepy, but not scary.
That's a feeling that I love seeing in games.
I think it's got this mature, slow moving, gloomy feeling,
which can be a heavy feeling to be absorbed into, but that's a

(01:17:59):
really particular mood that I love chasing.
I love the soundtrack in this game.
It's full of emotional moments that will coincide with these
goosebump inducing discoveries. There's something with the
garage that leads you to a placeand the music that hits there,
for instance, is one of my favorite moments from this game.

(01:18:20):
And the song that plays will play every time you take that
route. And sometimes I'll go out of my
way just to open the garage to be able to hear the music.
So I've listened to the soundtrack a bunch on my phone.
I, I love the music in this game.
I run into some dislikes as well.
A few runs died so suddenly due to bad luck.

(01:18:42):
That's something that gets easier with experience because
you find permanent upgrades, youcan upgrade rooms to give you
more things. You can sort of learn what the
best strategy is for tackling the house, but you have to
struggle to get there. And the struggle can be
frustrating when those runs and prematurely.
I had plenty of those. Some things feel impossibly out

(01:19:05):
of reach without looking things up, which isn't my favorites.
And the deeper layers that Discoreferred to do seem really
inaccessible. And I do think that's kind of
frustrating. But when I read up about the
game since finishing it, I thinkthe lore and stuff, the story is
super ambitious. I just don't know how to learn
all of it myself. But I appreciate it more than I

(01:19:28):
enjoy actively seeking it out, if that makes sense.
So I think it's a stunning achievement this game, it's one
of the most ambitious pieces of media I've interacted with.
I am going to give it a 9.5. Yes, I did.
I did not expect to love it thismuch.

(01:19:48):
And I kind of want to go back toit if I have time this season.
We have other games to play, butI want to get in there and I I
just want to do the next layer of discovery, the next set of
steps to get me something new and see where that takes me.
You know, I'm still with you. Like, like I said, it has that
one more try. I still want to keep playing
like Rogue Legacy, and I still want to complete the card

(01:20:09):
collection, Iris and the Giant. But, you know, so I'm with you.
Like, I want to finish getting all the red envelopes.
Like that's my next thing. I think if I did that, I would
feel full. Yeah, because I've only got a
couple more to get. I just don't have no clue No
clue where they are. So for Kara, I'm curious what

(01:20:29):
impact, if any, has blueprints had on the rest of the patch
team members? I know you said that this is a
game where you can interact withpeople, ask about people's
experiences, compare them to your own.
Have you had that experience with your team members?
Interestingly, it took a little while for it to hit with Patch.
And I don't know if that's because obviously we had so much

(01:20:53):
else going on when it launched or if people were just slowly
making their own way through it.But it did spur a lot of
conversations where I think two members of our team, Vijay and
Ben, it really like hit with them and they were just chatting

(01:21:13):
about it for I couldn't even tell you how long.
It was just like message after message of them sort of
discussing their own like approach and what they thought,
what they thought of this take on sort of a strategy based
puzzle game. Because it is it is unlike a lot

(01:21:34):
of things I've played in that same vein.
And I know that they felt that and I didn't engage with a lot
of it because it took me a whileto get a lot of the core things
that I should have got. And I also didn't want to spoil
it for anyone else that wanted to play it.
But I saw the same sort of conversation in the community

(01:21:55):
discord that I spoke to you guysabout earlier.
All these people were like, I'm playing blueprints.
And then you wouldn't hear from them for a bit.
And then they'd message and be like, I finished blueprints.
And then it would be like other people saying, oh, what did you
think? Did you, you know, go into this
room, How did you solve this puzzle and stuff like that?
And I think that impact of people basically go into

(01:22:18):
hibernation when they first playit because it's proper, like
curtains closed, like mind map notation of how do I solve this?
And then as soon as people are out of it, I've seen them be
like, Oh yeah, I did this and then I did this, which is really
sweet. So it has had that, like, I need

(01:22:39):
to play something else. That feels like this impact for
a few members of the core Patch team, but I think it has also
had that wider impact on the community of readers for us who
have been openly discussing it with other people.
It's a difficult game to describe and to to discuss with
people because like you said, everybody has a different

(01:23:02):
journey of discovery. And I didn't play for like 33
hours like disco, but I played for a good at least 20, you
know, 20 to 30 or something do. You want to tell the people what
day you got to room 46? I think it was day 2121.
It took me like upwards of 50 I swear.

(01:23:22):
I was at 64. But I've talked to someone who
did it on day like 120 and otherpeople have did it on day 80 and
90. That makes.
Me feel a bit better. You're, I think, I think if you
weren't getting to the antechamber and then room 46,
you were learning a lot and you were finding items that I still
haven't seen, you know, so I still haven't found the

(01:23:45):
telescope. I haven't been to The Secret
Garden. I I don't know how to get in
there. Isn't that crazy?
I mean, because you've probably been there a few times.
Been there a few times, yeah. I have no idea.
Like I have the key but I don't know where to use it.
I don't know if it's a room thathas a door.
I don't know if I'm supposed to use it in a certain like part of
the house. I don't, I just.
Don't tell you after the recording.
Well, I guess I could keep trying things, but it might be

(01:24:07):
better to just learn from you. But yeah, it is one of those
games where you want to go into hiding, you want to go off the
grid a little bit. That was my experience as well.
I started streaming it, and thenI realized if I keep streaming
this just with the added time that comes along with streaming
a game on Twitch, you're readingchat, you're taking breaks, you
generally play the game slower. I know I have to play this off

(01:24:30):
stream, but I still want to finish the game on stream.
And so I played it on stream andthen I played it off stream is
like my homework. And that's where I learned 80%
of what I know about this game. And then I came back the next
stream and it was like I was a different person.
I was like, you know, it's it's like I I went on vacation and

(01:24:53):
not my vacation was blueprints. I finished the game or I got
credits if you will in that nextone.
So there's a lot of rooms, at least 64 of them.
What? Kara, we'll start with you.
What's your favorite and least favorite room?
So my least favorite straight off the bat is the billiard room

(01:25:14):
because it's got the dartboard puzzle in.
And this is so embarrassing to admit, but I am terrible with
numbers. I mean, I am a writer.
So that's my first mistake is trying to do anything math and
space. But this puzzle had me
perplexed. I must have been sat in front of

(01:25:35):
it for an hour. Just like how do these colours
correspond to these numbers? What?
How is this making any sense to anyone trying to solve this
right now? And I was like just clicking.
I was just like if I just click it will solve itself.
Yeah, that's why I did the firstone.
I. Did that?
I think all three of us did that.
Yeah. It doesn't work.

(01:25:56):
You don't know the rules. Doesn't work.
There are ways to learn the rules, but you likely have not
encountered that that place because it's rarer, at least the
place I know. And yeah, you just have to do
trial and error to figure it out.
I am curious as a follow up question, similar room is the
parlor room where you have the word puzzle.

(01:26:17):
You have the three boxes with the gems inside.
Did you identify with that kind of puzzle more because you're.
Loved that, loved that. I think that was actually the
first room I ever unlocked. And I walked in and I looked at
this puzzle and I was just like,Oh, well, it's obviously that
box. And so every time it came up as
one of my drafts, I was like, we've won.

(01:26:39):
This is a huge win for me. And it was, it could be anywhere
on the grid. And I would just feel like, oh,
we've done it, guys. We've done it.
We've beaten blueprints. Amazing.
Nowhere near close to the end. But it was just that
satisfaction of I know what I'm doing here.
I just walk in, solve this Riddle and I'm done.

(01:27:00):
I'm out. That was my get a.
Little treat for it. That was my first room as well
and I, you know, passed it the first couple times, but there
were several times where I just was like not clicking with it.
Yeah, it gets harder the more you draft it, I found out.
I think I thought it was like harder the further north you
are. I thought that at first too, but
it actually gets harder every time you solve it or every time

(01:27:23):
you draft it. Interesting.
But I was able to upgrade the parlor.
There's a way to upgrade rooms, and I chose the upgrade where
you get 2 winding keys instead of 1.
So now I've got a better chance.I've got a two out of three
chance of even if I just blindlytry to open these boxes, I have
a two out of three chance of getting those.

(01:27:44):
So yeah, that that did come in handy one time because I
misunderstood the Riddle. OK, Yeah.
Least favorite Kara or sorry, you said that was your least
What is your favorite? I think this is such an obvious
choice, but the hallway is just so like versatile.

(01:28:05):
And I know that sometimes you walk in and it's like the room
that you actually need is lockedand you can't get through it.
But most of the time it just sends you in the direction that
you need to go. And it just feels like such an
obvious choice. And so I just love it by
default, but I also really like,I can't remember the name of it,
but the the dark room where it'sthe one where you develop

(01:28:28):
photos. That's what the dark room?
Yeah, that's what it's called, yeah.
Whoa, big brain. I'm so clever.
That room for some reason, even though it's like not
particularly helpful because youwalk in and the lights go off.
But I just loved it. Every time I could pull it up,
I'd be like excellent. So it was like barely useful.

(01:28:52):
I couldn't see where I was goingand I just had to like close my
eyes and try and unlock every door.
But I just absolutely loved it. It felt so like like being in a
horror movie and all of the lights in the house get turned
off and you have to just find your way out.
Oh, it's it is scary that first time you don't expect those
lights to go off. And that's the only room to my

(01:29:12):
knowledge, where that happens. And it's just going to show how
each room has its own like special identity and the quirks
that make each room special. I would say some of my favorite
rooms are the garage leading outto the path, mostly because of
that, that music transition. And just I remember that being

(01:29:35):
the first moment in my experience where I realized, oh,
this is this expands a little bit more outside of the confines
that I originally understood. And so that's where my
understanding started to grow about what was going on.
So it was important to me for a couple reasons.
One, just the artistic beauty ofgoing to that place and hearing

(01:29:56):
that music, but then also gaining that deeper
understanding of of the boundaries.
And then also I really like the shelter because the shelter, if
you draft that outside the house, that allows you to draft
some red rooms without the negative effects of those red
rooms. And I, we like avoiding red

(01:30:16):
rooms, at least in my house, because they can really put a
damper on your run. And so I can draft then a Chapel
without worrying about losing money, and I can draft and
archives without losing some of my floor plan options when I
expand from there. But jumping off of what you

(01:30:39):
said, Kara, I also love a hallway.
In fact, almost any orange room.When I'm going into a secret
closet and I get to choose what kind of room I draft from that
secret closet, I'm pretty much always choosing an orange.
Interesting. Yeah, I love hallways.
I'm always choosing green unlessI really need to buy some food.

(01:30:59):
Interesting. So are the green rooms some of
your favorite? So generally, yes, just because
I get to dig and I'm pretty muchall of them if I have the
shovel, so. You love the shovel.
You love digging? I love the shovel.
It's like random chance but alsoyou know the green rooms all
support each other. Like 1 green room will spread

(01:31:20):
gems to all the other green rooms.
Great. Synergy.
Green rooms are great so I wouldsay those tend to be some of my
favorites. I'm trying to think if I have a
very specific favorite. I mean the the rumpus room is a

(01:31:40):
nice like resting spot and usually gives you quite a lot of
gold. And that's where you talk to the
great Alzara, which again, another cinematic moment.
Every time you get to do that, the music just arrests me.
I love anytime we get to go in there.
I only got to go in there twice.Yeah, I went in there.
I saw all all Zara scenes, so I've been in there a few times.

(01:32:04):
I don't know if I would call that my favorite.
I do want to point out that hallway was one of the rooms I
got to upgrade and it upgraded to the point where anytime I
drafted it, it would then be in my pool for tomorrow.
So like pretty much every run I'm drafting at least 4 hallways
at some point. That was a that was a great

(01:32:27):
upgrade for sure. And that was like my first one
and my best one throughout the whole thing.
I think the shelter's nice. I don't know if I would call it
a favorite. There is one that you can draft
outside that adds more dig spots.
I don't always pick it because it's like I don't even know if
I'm going to get the shovel thistime, But any time I do pick it

(01:32:50):
and I do get the shovel, I'm I'mon top of the world baby rooms.
I hate mostly red rooms, specifically the what is it the
weight room, the one that causesyou to lose like half of your
steps. So if you don't have the shelter
and you draft that, that's just like, well, what do I do now?

(01:33:10):
I guess I'll just look for a couple of secrets and hope for
the best. Oh, I know.
The dining room is a favorite. I love the dining room.
I love the dining room. That's good.
Where you get the meal. Yeah, that saves me many a
times. Yeah.
But yeah, at least favorites theweight room and I I kind of hate

(01:33:30):
the breaker box cuz it's like it's very specific.
It is helpful in like it's only good use is to help with two
other rooms that maybe you won'teven draft.
So I kind of hate getting the breaker because it's a dead end
and it's just like, well, maybe I'll get these other rooms
later. Yeah, the so the breaker box

(01:33:52):
room I didn't understand at first, but that was actually a
key to unlocking something I think you haven't seen yet,
maybe for me. But then there's also something
with it that I don't understand yet, so that's exciting.
Like, I know that I'm not done with that room yet, so I don't
know what's going on there. I wish I was done with that
room. Yeah, you're never done with the
breaker box room. I didn't share my least

(01:34:14):
favorites, but I I point to somered rooms as well.
I point to the furnace specifically.
That makes red rooms more commonand that was my downfall.
A few times drafting that I I remember drafting the furnace
and then I had one crucial point, my only point in my floor
plan where I could expand and itgave me 3 red.

(01:34:36):
So I'm like I'm picking something terrible no matter
what. And then also the archives.
I just don't like losing out on one of my options and not being
able to see it. I have to blindly pick and
that's not fun. And that's that ended my run
once or twice. Along these lines, what were
some puzzles that perplexed us? Kara, I know you talked about

(01:34:57):
the billiard room. Are there any larger mysteries
that you still have questions about?
Or maybe you figured something out, but it was a little bit
challenging to get there. I had an It's not necessarily a
puzzle, it's just a massive stroke of luck.
But in one of my rooms I drafted, I think it might.

(01:35:18):
I might call it the wrong name, but it was something like the
Grand Hallway or like the Great Hall.
I don't. Know.
Yeah, I drafted that and it's, Ibelieve it's 6 doors and they're
all locked and I drafted it whenI was like, where have I ended
up? This is the back rooms like.

(01:35:38):
How do I know which one? I need to go and I just like
swung up to this one door and just unlocked it.
As I unlocked it, it opened and there was a lever in there.
And I thought for some reason, because it was the first time
I'd encountered it, I was just like, oh, every room must have
one. And then that I didn't.
That wasn't how I like ended my experience at the game.

(01:36:02):
That was just one run. That wasn't like my grand finish
because I had no concept of whatthis room was.
I was just like, oh, cool, pulled the lever and then ran
out of steps. And then I was chatting to
someone about it and I was like,oh, that room with all the six
doors. What what did the lever that you
pulled unlock? And they were like, what lever?

(01:36:25):
Oh, I was literally like, what do you mean?
What do you mean? What lever?
What door did you unlock? And they said whichever one,
obviously it's different every run.
But I said, oh, I just walked inand unlocked this door and it
had a lever in. And they were like, you're
kidding. Like that's literally how you
can do one of these doors. And I was just like.
That's amazing. And I I didn't find the Great

(01:36:48):
Hall for a while. I went all the way up north a
couple times. I was like how do I open these
doors? And then the first time I found
the Great Hall, I had the metal detector and I was like, well, I
don't know which of these doors to unlock.
I only have like 2 keys. But the doors on the sides were
interesting to me and the metal detector was beeping next to

(01:37:10):
some doors and not beeping next to others.
So I was like, interesting. So if I go next to a door and my
metal detector is beeping, there's at least something back
there. It could be coins, it could be a
key or something. So I went to one of the corners
where it was beeping and I opened that door and that had
the lever in it. And when I saw the lever, by

(01:37:33):
that point I knew that I needed to find levers.
I just didn't know where they were.
So that was a magical moment forme.
So 2 magical moments about the same place but slightly
different depending on the context of what you've found or
just the luck that you had in that moment of which one to
open. That is so cool.
I love that. Yeah, that was a another magical
moment that I think back to disco.

(01:37:55):
Do you have any puzzles that? So I have one very specific one
that caused a lot of frustrationand it's in the shelter.
There is a time lock safe and what the solution ultimately
comes down to setting a date andtime.
And I did it. And from everything I read, I

(01:38:17):
was doing it correctly and I just kept waiting and waiting.
And every day I drew the shelter, I would try again.
Sometimes I would set this thingand it wouldn't work the way I
was promised online. And I would turn off my
PlayStation, turn it back on andstart the day over and get the
shelter again and try it again. And I just, I kept going after

(01:38:42):
it because at this point, I don't understand the step that
we have to take before getting to room 46.
Like I don't understand what ultimately gets us to room 46.
So what I'm trying to do is collect all the red envelopes
because I think that's going to lead me to an answer.
And so I'm just like stuck on this stupid time lock safe.

(01:39:04):
And then while I'm running to the Discord to just like, anger,
ask my question, smashing my keyboard, someone's telling me
like, no, you're doing it right.And then I'm just standing there
waiting for responses to come inand it just opens while I'm
sitting there. So I'm like.
Just needed to wait a little bitmore.
But it was like, oh, it didn't. It didn't activate the way.

(01:39:28):
It still didn't activate the wayI was prom.
Like it's the time is not accurate in a way that I think
it should be, I guess. But I did ultimately get in
there, yeah. There's something with in game
time in this, in blueprints that's you definitely know, like
what time it is. You can narrow down, you can

(01:39:48):
deduce what date it is, but whenit comes to actually putting in
that time and then waiting, it'skind of mysterious because you
don't, you lose track of the time.
Well, and I haven't done it yet even like choosing the date is
like the part that trips most people up because like if I say
it, it spoils the puzzle. But.
And then like anytime there is alocked safe, like if I enter the

(01:40:11):
room maybe for the 4th or 5th time and I still haven't figured
out how to find the combination,I just look it up online 'cause
I'm just like I have no idea where to look.
Yeah, I think you've given ampleeffort at that point.
I would say what perplexed me was the puzzle with the pictures
on the walls, because I figured out what was going on with it,

(01:40:36):
but I was attributing the pictures to the rooms.
And I just thought these two pictures will always be in the
hallway and they'll always be inthe pantry this way.
But then the next run, I'd draftthose same rooms and it was
different pictures. So I was like, wait, so then
what does that mean? And I won't spoil this, but

(01:40:58):
there's information that we get from those pictures and it
applies the same way to everybody's laythrough.
I just was attributing that information to the locations
that I found them in, not another way that's kind of
similar. And those I'm.
Dancing around what it is. Those pictures are like those
pictures and the like sketchingsthat will be like on a bulletin

(01:41:22):
board. That's a whole different
language to me that I don't evenknow how to translate.
Yeah, so there's that's something I wrote about in my
notebook. And yeah, I guess if we go into
our habits on approaching the game and how they evolved over
time, I definitely just started by writing down a list of all
the rooms and then just information that I learned.

(01:41:43):
I noticed commonalities, like some had chess pieces.
I might notice that there are certain number of candlesticks.
I would just write that down because I what if it's useful at
some point? So is that kind of what you did,
what you both did? Did you write notes and then
found that you were changing your style of note taking as you
went? I was a total brute when I

(01:42:05):
started playing. I was just like, I'm just going
to go and just aim in the general direction I need to go
and hope for the best. And it took me a while to be
like, I should be writing something down.
Like it warns you you should probably write something down.
And I was just, I'm not going todo that.
I'm not going to do that becausewhy would I need to?

(01:42:26):
Yeah, you're a writer though, I know.
It's literally my trade. And I just thought, no, I can do
this. And then all of a sudden I was
questioning everything. I was like, the way that that
door is on its hinges, like thathas to be the answer to some
puzzle. Like every room I went in, I was

(01:42:47):
questioning like, this has to link to something.
And it ended up just being this frantic scribbling of notes that
make no sense if you read them back now.
But it was like, this painting is at this angle in this room,
and the table has this on duringmy like, fifth day or like
something like that. And the something that

(01:43:11):
Blueprints does so well is it really makes you think every
single thing is a piece of the puzzle.
And what's so good about it is it's not.
Sometimes it is. And then sometimes you'll be
staring out of this window or like into a mirror and be like
something's going to change any second now and it won't.
And you'll look like a fool and you'll feel like a clown for the

(01:43:32):
rest of the time he's been playing here.
And so I learnt very quickly after I'd started taking notes,
like I should have been doing this from the beginning.
The game does condition you to look for clues even when there
aren't clues. And so it always feels to me
like a worthwhile thing to take those notes.

(01:43:52):
But you also learn over time that you're going to waste time
taking notes at a certain point because, yeah, it's the game
invites you to learn about the mysteries, but also I think to
just appreciate the details and to appreciate the the texture of
the world. A texture's not always going to
give you the answers, unfortunately.
But that's another reason I likeit.

(01:44:14):
Oddly, it sounds like a complaint, but for me, it's, I
think it's just a really thoughtful game.
I think the game knows the ways that it's mysterious and the
ways that it sort of leads you astray.
I think it's very self aware too.
Like I can kind of tell that they know.
But yeah, I, I was noting the quantities of things in rooms.

(01:44:36):
I was listing learnings about the people.
So we find notes about a driver,like a a chaperone, A chauffeur,
if you will. We find out about the different
people who lived in that in the Manor.
So I thought that that stuff wasreally important, and I think it

(01:44:57):
is. But to finish the game, I don't
know that you need to have a deep understanding of the family
tree. I sure don't.
Yeah, but that's another layer that I want to learn more about.
But did your learning change over time?
So for pretty much the whole game, I was taking a whole bunch
of screenshots on PlayStation. So which is not a good way to

(01:45:19):
approach that because my thinking was I will capture all
of the details, and even if there's details in this picture
that I don't think are important, I can go back to the
picture and see that. However, to access your
screenshots on PlayStation, you except for like your 15 most
recent ones, you have to like close down the game.

(01:45:40):
So it's not not a useful way to approach the game.
So when that failed, I was also at the point where I understood
the importance of the leavers. I'll just say.
And I was like, OK, I know whereall of the leavers are and I
know what rooms I need to get and I, you know, know how to do

(01:46:02):
the best that I can do with the luck that I'm given.
And at that point, I wasn't taking any notes anymore because
it was just about getting to theend.
I was like, I noticed the chess pieces and I was just like,
that's a different puzzle for a different day.
It doesn't get me to where I need to go, so I don't care.
But what I did change that I found most important was how I

(01:46:24):
approached drafting rooms because what I was doing from
the start was kind of like sneaking my way as I got to a
new rank, going left and right as far as I can and trying to
get as many rooms as possible. And eventually what I did was
start exploring paths N pretty much as far as I can take them

(01:46:45):
unless I think I need to be ableto go back S for resources.
And so if I get to a point whereI'm like maybe going too far
north to where where I might runout of resources and I have
access to maybe more resources down South.
So that's sort of the biggest change that I had in in

(01:47:06):
approaching the game that's. Very interesting.
I actually had a an opposite approach.
I would try to just beeline it north as much as I could and you
know, jumping off to the sides here and there as I needed to.
But the more I played the game, the more I realized, oh, if you
stay in the lower ranks, you're going to have less locked doors,
and those are just going to be more opportunities to farm for

(01:47:28):
coins and gems and keys. So I would spend the first like
one or two or three ranks just building to the sides and just
getting as many rooms as I could.
And then I would narrow down my approach up north overtime.
Yeah, I would. I would do that with like ranks
one and two at the end, but likeI would start exploring N pretty

(01:47:49):
much as far as I could go until I was like, I bet I'm going to
start getting to lock doors. Maybe I'll go back to rank 2 and
and spread. Out, yeah.
Now along that, what advice would you give to new and
curious Blueprints players? Again, without spoiling things,
but what would you tell someone to sort of get them into the

(01:48:11):
mindset to play this game? Aside from make sure you have a
notebook and a pen. Don't make the mistake I did of
thinking that you can just do it, because trust me, you can't.
Yeah, and that is a hard fact toaccept.
We we messed up so you don't have to.
Yeah. Yeah, exactly.
And then if you get the chance to draft a code check room,

(01:48:36):
whether you have an item that you want to stash or not, if you
have one, there's a chance that you will need it because it's
that's the room that you need ifyou want to keep an item for
your next run. And it's that can come in clutch
as soon as you once you have, once it's clicked and the penny

(01:48:56):
has dropped of how you can do this.
Knowing that you have a fail Safeway to do that is so
valuable. And that is something that I did
not learn until quite late on. Yeah, and you can code check
quite literally anything you pick up, I think.
Well, I don't think you can check code.
Check the like currencies. Yeah, you can't do the

(01:49:17):
currencies, but the items that appear in your inventory, yeah.
Yeah, I I spent the last 10 daysof my gameplay with something in
the code check, and I would either get the code check but
not the room that that item interacted with, or I would
spend every exit I could just like please, please.

(01:49:40):
I have the green room. Where's the coat check?
Give me the coat check and I would never get it.
Yeah, coat check can be kind of rare.
I I crafted an item using the workshop that allowed me to open
some shortcuts. And I also happened to craft the
coat check that run. And I didn't want to lose this

(01:50:00):
thing because it took three ingredients to craft this thing.
I was like, I don't know if I can ever find the luck to find
these three things to craft thisthing, I also would have to find
the workshop and I would have tohave a reason to build it.
So maybe I should just code check this and now that thing,
that tool that I have that I find to be very rare to and

(01:50:24):
difficult to assemble, it's justpermanently living in my coat
check. If I retrieve it from the coat
check because I feel like I can use it somewhere.
I always have to remember I got to take this back to the coat.
Check. So you're keeping an eye on your
steps. If you're like OK, I'm getting
low, I need to get back to the coat check.
Like that becomes my number one priority is don't try to learn
any information, don't try to find any new rooms or paths, get

(01:50:45):
this tool back to the coat checkso that I never have to craft it
again. And that's just going to be the
way it is. For me I I got some advice from
a YouTube video I think probablyin the same breath that I was
rage posting on discord about the time lock save.
The piece of advice that I got was always have at least two

(01:51:11):
gems. You want to always be capable of
drafting any room that you approach.
Some rooms will cost more than two gems.
Those are really rare, but always have at least two gems on
you if possible. Yeah, gems become, I think, more
important than definitely more important than coins in a lot of

(01:51:32):
runs, more important than keys in a lot of runs.
And in some cases, like you are going to need keys pretty much
no matter what, there's one thing that you can interact with
that will like basically decrease the number of locked
doors. But yeah, definitely definitely
need some keys. But gems are the because you
could draft something and you'd only be able to access one of

(01:51:55):
the rooms and it's a dead end ifyou don't have any gems.
Yeah, you start to use all of your learnings to streamline the
process and to just make your future runs more informed.
And for advice I would give it'sstuff I've mentioned already or
that we've mentioned. Taking notes is important.
You don't need to take them perfectly, just start taking
them and then you'll probably change how you take notes once

(01:52:17):
you learn more. But just start jotting things
down. It's OK if it's messy, it's
actually probably better if it'smessy.
It's beautiful if it's messy. I would focus less on your bad
luck and more on what you learned.
Like try to see the positive side of things and then build up
those lower ranks a lot to farm those keys and coins and gems
and dice. We haven't mentioned dice a ton,

(01:52:39):
but dice allow you to re roll your options and the that you
can find that pretty easily in closets.
And things. So what questions do you still
have or what do you still want to do in the game, if anything?
There's so much that I feel likeI still need to do.
Like when I discovered the the way that I basically progressed

(01:53:00):
to room 46, I was like, OK, I can take a breather and not go
back to it. But there are so many ways to
approach it that I haven't yet experienced.
And I feel like it's another canof worms.
And then still, so like you, youguys said earlier that you
haven't filled out your emporiumof all these rooms.

(01:53:22):
And I want to know what what they do.
And I know that I could just look it up and read a guide on
it. But it's it's different when you
get to experience that for yourself and you finally pull
that draft up of the room that you've been looking for.
And there's just so much like that and just finding new ways

(01:53:43):
to solve the puzzles that initially I was so confused by.
And there's also, there's just so many questions that I left
with like, oh, what does that post it note?
Like what significance does thatpost it note hold?
What significance does that one sort of part in that room have?

(01:54:04):
There's just so much of that that you really don't get
answers to until you solve it for yourself.
Yeah, you find multiple ways to approach certain rooms.
You think there's maybe only oneway to do a task and then maybe
you find that maybe there aren'ttwo ways, but there's an easier
way to that first way that you found like you can adjust

(01:54:27):
things. Trying to be very vague about
how I describe it, but for me, I'll just say very vaguely
again, I want to figure more outabout the boiler room and
connecting it to other rooms. I've only drafted that a few
times, but I've done the uzzle in there, but now I need to
connect it to some other rooms and I just haven't had the luck.

(01:54:48):
There's something with the workshop that I noticed that
works similarly to the pairs of pictures, but the workshop is so
rare that I can't figure this thing out easily.
It would take so many days, and so I've started to draw a
diagram in my notes and it's mostly empty right now, but it

(01:55:09):
has to do with the workshop only, so I have no idea what
that is. And then I want to open more of
those safes. So we know that there are a few
safes in the game and I've opened a couple, but I would
like to keep opening those. I feel like that's the next
layer that makes sense for me because I've gotten credits and
that's about it. I kind of want to work together

(01:55:30):
with you on that workshop thing because I had an item at one
point that allowed me to change the rarity of certain rooms
permanently, and one of them is the workshop, so I get the
workshop all the time. OK, you would probably, but I
solve this a lot faster. Well, but I have no idea what
you're talking about with what'sgoing on.
I'll. Show this to you after

(01:55:50):
reporting. We'll figure it out.
We'll work together. Play it after dark going on.
I mentioned it, but I want to get the rest of the red
envelopes. I want to, I'm not really like
enthralled by what's in them, but I have four of them, so I
may as well get all of them. And then I want to at some point

(01:56:15):
there is like a, a, a shop that it's like the high end shop
where everything in it is like 20 coins, 40 coins, 90 coins.
And I want to, they're all like not all, but some of them are
like pieces to another puzzle that you might find in another
room. So I want to be able to buy at

(01:56:36):
least a couple of those and thentake them to where their resting
place, their final destination is like that.
That seems like a tough but reasonable task, especially as
my like start of day allowances going up and up and up that that
seems like a a task that I wouldlike to obtain if I had more

(01:56:59):
time. Yeah, I don't know if I've even
been in that shop. I've been in there one time but
I have like 12 coins which is still not nothing in blueprints,
but everything else is more expensive than that.
I guess like Cara, like you said, they're they're just more
rooms you can always find. You can always just find a room
you haven't seen before and that's often like the best way

(01:57:19):
to learn and to move forward. I looked up the base like 45
rooms in the game and I think I'm still, I think 8 of them are
still undiscovered to me. So like there's a lot that I
don't know, there's a lot that each of us doesn't know and I
think it's just beautiful that we each have a different
experience in a different journey.

(01:57:41):
I wanted to open it up here justin case either of you had
anything else to share about Blueprints before we end.
I just feel like you've both talked about so much that I
instantly need to go back and change my game plan because I
feel like I've been playing it wrong.
But I guess that's just everyonehas their own experience.

(01:58:05):
Yes, that's so true. I mean, we all reached the end.
We all did the thing. We all did the.
Thing so yeah, we all got there somehow and other people I've
talked to reached the end a certain way and they talk to me
and they go man, it's crazy how we had to draft this and this
and do this to get there right and I'm like that's not what I

(01:58:26):
did I didn't do that. It's a remote idea what you're
talking about. They're like what?
So it's kind of unbelievable when you start seeing another
person playing or you hear aboutanother person's experience.
But Kara, it's been an absolute pleasure having you on to talk
about blueprints with and to have you share about patch with

(01:58:47):
us. Can you give listeners another
pitch about where to find your content and Patch magazine?
Of course, thank you so much forhaving me.
It's been great talking to you guys.
If you want to learn more about Patch, then you can visit our
website directly. If you just Google Patch
magazine, we'll pop up or you can follow our social media.
We are at the Patch mag on X andInstagram and just Patch

(01:59:09):
Magazine on Blue Sky and TikTok.Carrie, again, it's been a
wonderful pleasure. We wish you all the best with
everything, with the magazine, with personal things, and again,
thank you very, very much. Thank you so much.
Well, that's our review of Blueprints.
You can play it on PCPS 5 and Xbox Series.

(01:59:31):
Kara rated it an 8. Disco Cola rated it a 7.5.
I rated it a 9.5. That's the end of this episode
of Underplayed. You can find more of our
episodes at kzum.org/underplayedand on common podcast platforms
like Spotify or Apple Podcast. Our music was composed by Jack
Rodenberg. Our art comes from Oni Mochi.

(01:59:52):
Check out our show notes where you can find and follow us
across social media. Under Plate is on Blue Sky,
Instagram and Threads. You can also find my links down
below, and I stream a variety ofindie games on Twitch.
And I am at Disco Cola in many places, including Backlogged,
where I put this game in my Top 100 indie games and underplayed

(02:00:13):
is on YouTube. We don't talk about it a lot,
but we're going to talk about itmore often.
Check it out there if that's where you like to get your
podcasts. And we'll try to someday, if we
ever have time, put more contenton there.
Next time we'll have two more secret games to review, and our
featured game will be Moonlighter and Action RPG
developed by Digital Sun. Until then, everyone keep on

(02:00:35):
playing.

All Episodes

082 - this game will end in 205 clicks., Hell Clock, & Blue Prince (Guest: Kara from Patch Magazine)

Episode Transcript

Popular Podcasts

Stuff You Should Know

Dateline NBC

The Breakfast Club

.css-15opob5{left:0;position:absolute;top:0.8rem;} All Episodes

.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}082 - this game will end in 205 clicks., Hell Clock, & Blue Prince (Guest: Kara from Patch Magazine)