242. Society of Secret History

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
I'm awake, are you. I wonder how many miles I've fallen.
It seems I'll get to the center of the earth. Curious,
isn't it? And really nothing is quite impossible. Let's go
now to our new episode of The Unfiltered Rise with
me Hei do he Love.

Speaker 2 (00:20):
Hello everyone, and welcome to another episode of The Unfiltered
Rise with me Heidi Love. And today I have another
interesting story for you, guys. I have the armchair philosopher
m Allen, who is going to talk to us about
Project Red. He doesn't really want to be on camera,
and I can't say I blame him. You know, it's
a love it or hate it world, and you get
a lot of hate, So we don't want to throw

(00:42):
that at everybody. He's trying to get his word out there,
and we don't want to be crass, right. We want
to give him some space to speak because he wrote
me a message and I was totally intrigued. Now, you guys,
if you have a message to tell me, and it's
something in depth right with thehilosophy or the things I
speak on, I'm probably gonna want to talk to you.

(01:05):
And that was exactly what mister Allan did so, mister Allen,
how are you doing today?

Speaker 3 (01:11):
Good evening, Heidi. It's nice to finally speak with you.

Speaker 2 (01:14):
I'm excited we've we've been speaking a little bit pre
roll and we're already rolling down the hill on Crawley.
So I'm like, we need to just start this up.
This is getting hot in the presses, so.

Speaker 3 (01:25):
Let's do it.

Speaker 2 (01:25):
Let's do Yeah. Tell me a little bit about your
project and your book and kind of what happened to
bring you to the book level. I know because you
gave me the deats before, but I would love the
audience to know sure absolutely well.

Speaker 3 (01:39):
Like you said, I'm an armchair philosopher. I guess I
have no degrees. I have nothing that really stands out
as far as anything other than what I feel most
people are doing these days, and that's digging a little
deeper into things that they have a passion into. Like
like you said, we talked a little bit. I found
that over time I collected too many Google documents us

(02:04):
as I think a lot of people know, and I
compiled it into something that I just called Project Read.
The title is something I've I've just gone with for
my entire life. I use it on a lot of
different things, but it's never been anything other than a
personal moniker that I used. But it felt, it felt right.

(02:26):
I found a lot of interesting connections between I would
say the the true passion of my of my research,
which was an early life in uithology, taking taking interest
in the nineties X files and all the way back

(02:46):
to you know, TV and movies and media. So it
just it rolled with me. My my parents had this
big bookshelf over our fireplace that had you know, world strangers,
the most amazing dot dot dot and they were they
were always there, and I'd read them. They were fun,

(03:08):
and that was it. But when I got to I
guess some more interested age and some of the details,
I went into just following patterns, following names, connecting people
that on the surface you wouldn't connect. And that basically
led me to this compiled essay of things that I

(03:31):
think shows a well tapestried view of of just blended
things that might give people a new view as to
how we're interacting with intelligences that may not be.

Speaker 2 (03:48):
Physical, and they may not be benevolent, or they may
be right.

Speaker 3 (03:52):
Precisely, I didn't really have a lot of access to
organized religion growing up as far as Christianity or Catholicism
or any real structure, but it was very lucky. It
was very It was very spiritual though. I can remember
as a child my grandmother and my mother both having

(04:15):
a lot of spiritual connections, and they always kind of
referenced the indigenous side of where they thought our bloodline
I guess would have gone, or our heritage, but we
never had any way to check it, right. But they
were very spiritual, and they were very connected with just
doing outside stuff. So I found it was interesting, Like

(04:39):
you just said, Elaheim and all these names that they're
they're in the King James Bible. You can go read them.
I didn't know they were there until I looked into it.

Speaker 2 (04:52):
Right, And then you look at the references, and you're like,
wait a minute, which Lord are we talking about? Which
God are we speaking about? Which la do we mean?
And it gets really in the weeds, and I'm thankful
for me with a Christian like I am a Christian,
so I choose to say, okay, for me, I just
say God right, because but I try to be you know,

(05:14):
kind of specific, because things get crazy, like Lord is
a whole nother rabbit hole, and people don't understand like
they replace that on purpose. Like these people that edit
the Bible know what they're doing. They know well.

Speaker 3 (05:29):
And I you say edit the Bible, and that a
lot of people will push back on that in a
lot of ways. But what I didn't realize until recently,
within the last I'd say five years, is there are
multiple versions of that that go back way older than
most people interested in the topic would venture. And when

(05:51):
you get into the I guess you would say, the
the Book of Enoch, the Book of Jubilees, the Book
of Giants, and these these are texts that we can't
really ignore anymore, I don't think, especially when we're trying,
we're trying as a society to to talk about a

(06:12):
lot of stuff which is spiritual and also it's it's
in that woohoo realm.

Speaker 2 (06:20):
Yes it was, Yes it was. And I'm going to
do this really quick because they'll come for me. I
just want to tell people. The substitution of the divine
name with titles like Lord was a practice that started
in third to second BCE in Second Temple Judaism. This
was done out of reverence, so not to pronounce the

(06:40):
name of the Lord in Vain. And so you guys,
I'm not making it up. You can look it up.
I just better throw that out there because they'll come
for me.

Speaker 3 (06:51):
Yeah. I find that it's you know, the names are
really interesting because as you get into but like you
have John deep book behind you, when you when you
look at his his interactions with I call them non
human intelligence. And I put that under the umbrella category
of anything you want to categorize that's interacting with consciousness.

(07:14):
And I think that's a that's a pretty good term
for me to I guess, I guess move through the
conversation without getting muddied by my own words.

Speaker 2 (07:28):
So the ideas, it gets hard. Yeah, like Steiner calls them, well,
a lot of people call them, you know, anything in
the outer realm, not of this earth, right, And so
that's also elohem just so people know. And again and
then you get pushedback. But but there are look in

(07:48):
every religion clear back to the beginning. They speak of
things whatever you want to say. They are communicating with
human beings that are not psychotic, right, because some are,
but like true actual and you know what, psychotic people
have some wisdom too. I don't throw that out as well,

(08:09):
because they you know, we we don't get to pick
and choose who they come to, right.

Speaker 3 (08:16):
For some for some of us, it's uh, it's it's
beyond words.

Speaker 2 (08:19):
I guess, yes, yeah.

Speaker 3 (08:21):
But and and something that I I really dove into
really hard was I think I just I connected non
human intelligence to consciousness. And there's a really really big
world that exists in the study of where that exists

(08:42):
in the brain. And and I'm not I'm not a
quantum physicist. I'm not a I don't have any of
any of that. But it's so interesting. And I found podcasts,
and I found people who did like long term along
form talks and interviews, and you know, it's fascinating when

(09:02):
you look into the world of near death experience and
out of body experience. And I have to go and
say that I am a rabbit hole diver. I look
at people right now who are talking about the Monroe Institute,
and I don't think they realize how that connects to
something that goes where it flows into your realm, which

(09:23):
is the Mormon Church. And all of this this is connected.

Speaker 2 (09:27):
The Mormons are in everything, and.

Speaker 3 (09:31):
It's not that they could even have a big deal.
It's just it's like there's there's a spider web effect.
It's an octopus, it's a hydra. And when you look
at the forest through the trees, when you peer back
and you gaze at all of this and you say, WHOA,
how can all of this be interconnected? Well, hey, there's ways.

Speaker 2 (09:50):
And it's crazy. When I learned what you're talking about,
I had an existential crisis, Like I was like everything
is everything, and my husband didn't know what I meant,
and I was having a moment and I was just
and you know what took me there was JFK. And
I never cared about that, like not that I didn't
care he died or I was just like, yeah, it's

(10:12):
a setup, like whatever, Yeah, I get it, you know,
but I never cared about the bullet stuff and whatever.
I just cared about like, Okay, this was definitely for
a purpose. This, you know, not one person crap. And
so when I went down that rabbit hole and found
a whole bunch of stuff, Catholics and Mormons and weird

(10:32):
stuff and politicians and religion and it's just weird and
you just step back and go whoa.

Speaker 3 (10:40):
And nazis always yes, oh, those Nazis.

Speaker 2 (10:45):
Those Nazis are pesky, and you know, it's just not
like I just don't think people can comprehend, you know,
And they tell us what do they say in occultism? Right,
like weaving spiders come not here? Like wonder what that means? Right,

(11:05):
It's just like they tell you, they literally do and
we just don't care now.

Speaker 3 (11:11):
And that's that's something very fascinating I find. Because you
said you had a very you know, religious background. I
came from a more spiritual side, but even growing up
a cult, to me through my childhood, it wasn't witchcraft.
It was strictly demons. It was pure demonology. And growing
up through the nineties, I realized that when people would

(11:35):
talk about the occult it was it wasn't because I
knew what witchcraft was. I knew what folk magic was.
My grandparents and my great grandparents talked about it. And
that's what sparked me when I when I found your podcast.
You you said a few names that I said, you
know what, let me let me stop what I'm doing.

(11:56):
I was working on something else, and I said, let
me into my my township, because where I'm located is
in the sixteen hundreds. It's old, and I wanted to
see where some of this origin goes, and it's it's deep.

(12:16):
I don't know how much you know about the Quakers.

Speaker 2 (12:20):
Not enough, not enough?

Speaker 3 (12:22):
Well, I guess, I mean, if you'd like to take
a little bit of time and talk.

Speaker 2 (12:26):
About Oh yeah, yes, definitely. I do know one thing
I know JFK had to do with a Quaker mister
of Pain. But I've always thought that something was up.
You know, they're a little too any of the religions,
let's be honest. I just pick on the Mormons because
I was one, but none of them, none of them escape.

(12:48):
You know, as soon as they get big enough, they
become corrupt. It's just it's just how it works.

Speaker 3 (12:54):
So well, I'm I'm going to try and keep my
location somewhat limited, but we have to talk about where
he's located, and we have to talk about the area
of Penn's Penn's landing. He was a landowner in the

(13:15):
sixteen hundreds, late seventeenth century, and his philosophy over I
would say his philosophy was mainly to try and get
away from what was happening in Europe at the time, and.

Speaker 2 (13:31):
Who was this sorry I missed that. Sorry.

Speaker 3 (13:33):
William Penn, Oh.

Speaker 2 (13:34):
William Penn, Yes, yes, yes.

Speaker 3 (13:35):
Yes, Okay, Now he had I think it was around
five thousand acres that he purchased in southeast Pennsylvania, right
along the Delaware River. And I've been to two museums
at his home and also his I guess it would
you would say his summer landing where he had right
along the William Penn grounds. What I think is interesting

(14:01):
is his interactions with the native indigenous people here. He
did so much to try and keep that land peaceful
while also orchestrating his own religious tolerance of they were.
There were Mennonites, there were Pitis, there were I mean
I have to just pull up one second, one document
because I can't remember all these names.

Speaker 2 (14:22):
But no, now it would be impossible.

Speaker 3 (14:25):
Yeah, there were so many different people that came over
here at the time, and I just thought it was
kind of like you know, in I'll go back to
what I said before the nineties for me was Okay,
there's Salem, Massachusetts. You know, there's some pilgrims, Thanksgiving. That's

(14:46):
about it. Civil you know, we've got some Revolutionary war
stuff and then Civil War. JFK.

Speaker 2 (14:51):
That was history.

Speaker 3 (14:53):
I didn't know it went way further in American history,
but also into European history. And I'll tell you it,
it really flipped my lid on what people were trying
to actually put together at a time when it was
it was scary to talk about gnostic.

Speaker 2 (15:12):
And and get hung. Yeah, yeah, and alchemy you're gonna
get hung.

Speaker 3 (15:20):
What connected me to you was when you told I
believe I don't want to quote podcasts, but I think
you went on Sam Tripoli, right, Yes, it's Tim fool Hat. Yeah,
that's the one I heard you on and you were
talking about how the Mormons got their start up in Massachusetts.

Speaker 2 (15:39):
In yes TOPSI yes, yeah. And they try to hide this.
This is very obfuscated. You know, through the Smith line,
through the paternal side, they were very important. They weren't
dom farmers, these were select men. And even on the
tombstone of the captain they call him captain. He's honorary

(16:02):
Captain Samuel smith S Squire. Does that sound dumb to you?

Speaker 3 (16:06):
Not to me?

Speaker 2 (16:08):
Not to me?

Speaker 3 (16:09):
And I don't have as much access to the names
on his family that I think somebody who in your
position would, But as far as I could trace back,
you know, when they came from Europe, whether it was
in England or in more close to Germany, the same
thing was happening in like sixteen seventy sixteen eighty. With

(16:33):
this guy. You might be familiar with his name, but
his last name was Rosenroth. He was. Let me try
and find his full name, because it's long. It's I'm
sure you know who Paracelsus is, of.

Speaker 2 (16:48):
Course, you know even later, you know in Utah of
all places, you know, because he's kind of a heretic
mister Parasols's. He's making babies and jars. We had a
paris Elsie in society here for a long time. And
why would they settle here? Isn't that weird?

Speaker 3 (17:07):
No, well, and we'll get to why. I thought he
was interesting. But his connection to this is fascinating. This guy,
though his name was Christian nor von Rosenroth. He was
a baron and he was over in Europe at the time,
around sixteen thirty to sixteen ninety, and he was responsible

(17:32):
for converting the I guess you would say it was
the Jewish or Hebrew Kabbala, and he transferred it into
a Christian text. It was called the Schoolsbach Kalaba, Kabala,
Dnu Data.

Speaker 2 (17:52):
That's a name.

Speaker 3 (17:52):
Well, yeah, it's hard. These Latin names are not easy.
Believe me. I'm close to Philadelphia.

Speaker 2 (17:58):
So you're like, oh my gosh, yeah.

Speaker 3 (18:02):
I mean, I'm I'm in here with I'll quote some
of these guys in the Red on the Wissa Hicken here.
You know, I've got the southeast Pennsylvania. So but yeah,
this this guy, he was he was really big into this,
converting this into a way that Christians could start to
absorb this type of gnostic faith and the Quakers. The

(18:25):
Quakers kind of come in later because he was teaching
a lot of this stuff. From what I've read now,
finding sources on this is hard. I'm limited to maybe
like six books that I've been able to find. But
what they talk about is that at the time in Sulzbach,

(18:46):
don't really know the exact location.

Speaker 2 (18:49):
That's okay, it's sixteen Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 3 (18:55):
A lot of these people were intermingling, and one of
them was a guy named Johann Jacob Zimmerman. He was
a Lutheran minister and he had a couple connections that
during the time, he was an astronomer and astrologer, and
he had this big event in sixteen eighty called the
It was a comet that shot over Rotterdam in Europe,

(19:19):
and he prophesied that the millennium was coming sixteen ninety four,
sixteen ninety five. That they started to say, we have
to get out of Europe. And that's how they got
tied in with I mean, I'm ad living right here
and really throwing this together quickly. But he he and
another guy named hold On, it'll come to me a

(19:41):
lot of names.

Speaker 2 (19:42):
That happens to me too.

Speaker 3 (19:45):
Yeah, it was a Heinrich Bernard cost and this Johann Zimmerman.
They got together forty families now numerology right right number there.
They waited for these families to come together. These people
came to them basically, and they acquired this. Now this

(20:10):
is where the rumors and the speculation pop in. But
supposedly Zimmerman dies the night before they're supposed to leave
on penship. Some people say it was the day of,
some people say it was the day after. But it
kind of threw it off for a loop. And this guy,
his last name was Kelpius, takes up the mantle and
all of Zimmerman's things. He brings all these people over

(20:33):
to Pennsylvania and they settle in what's called Germantown. Right now,
this is this is right off the Wissahickon Creek. It's
there today, all of his his cavern that he had,
the tabernacle, everything you can. You can go there and
visit it. And what's fascinating is when you stand there, Heidi,

(20:54):
there is a pillar with a stone from the Rosicrucians.

Speaker 2 (21:00):
Oh juicy there and that.

Speaker 3 (21:06):
It was not a red flag for me, but it
was one of those tethers where I went, Okay, why
why is this here right right? And the more I
dug as I got beyond the dates, I found that
in the eighteen hundreds of people who were writing about this.
The author his name is Julius Sachs, and he wrote

(21:28):
a lot about these the Quakers and the pitus of
the Mennonites, and a lot of the German religious and
spiritual movements. But he didn't have access to this stone.
He died in like sixteen nineteen, sixteen ten.

Speaker 2 (21:46):
And this stone was always about a stone.

Speaker 3 (21:49):
Yeah, I mean it's a good eight foot stone too.

Speaker 2 (21:52):
It's always it's always rocks. Yeah, like whether they're big
or small. Look, they show up in every single one.

Speaker 3 (22:00):
So where where he missed all this, I think his
history stopped is like he didn't have any way to
confirm that he writes about that there were Rosicrucian influences
through Agrippa, Paracelsus, Francis Bacon especially one.

Speaker 2 (22:18):
But don't worry. Agrippa said nothing he wrote was true
and he was just kidding yep.

Speaker 3 (22:24):
And he doesn't believe in any of that.

Speaker 2 (22:25):
Magic isn't real, right, Oh, he just didn't want to
get hung. Let's be realm hmm.

Speaker 3 (22:32):
I don't believe in magic, that's right.

Speaker 2 (22:35):
Yeah, it's all silly nonsense. This is how you do it, though,
don't forget well.

Speaker 3 (22:39):
And that's as I dug deeper, I started to realize
that I think there could be a reason why these
individuals chose to align themselves with the Quakers at the time,
because they were very much in the same wheelhouse with
their religious and their their spiritual beliefs, and that allowed
them to kind of make their way into North America.

(23:03):
And when the Rosa Crucian stone showed up for me,
and it wasn't in the book, but Sax was writing
about how they were influenced by the Early Order. I
went to their their official information, and I.

Speaker 2 (23:17):
Like, what Order?

Speaker 3 (23:18):
Is this a right? I'd never heard of it. So
when their own names started popping up and they started
showing up in my books that I was reading, I
got to the end of Sax's ability to tell me
what happened with this. They were called they were called
the Society of the Women of the Wilderness or from

(23:43):
Revelation twelve fourteen, I believe, and no, yeah, I think
it is twelve fourteen. I'll get the exact you know proverb.

Speaker 2 (23:54):
I'm shocked at you've already got me for a loop,
because I thought for sure this would be mail. This
is interesting.

Speaker 3 (24:00):
Well, they they were primarily a group of mystics and
hermits that were abstinent. Kelpius himself was you know, they abstained?

Speaker 2 (24:08):
Were they abstinate or were they hermetically abstinate?

Speaker 3 (24:13):
I can't find any you know what I'm talking.

Speaker 2 (24:16):
Do you know what I'm talking about? Though?

Speaker 3 (24:18):
H yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (24:20):
A lot of times they're like and the Templars were abstinate.
I'm like, well, no, they they were practicing white contras.
So let's see realistic. I don't. I don't know all things,
but I know enough to know what was up there.

Speaker 3 (24:37):
So yeah, what I learned just through reading the books
that I was able to get my hands on a
lot of them that came over here in sixteen ninety four.
When the comment didn't I mean this happens Calus times,
prophecies don't happen, people leave, a lot of these families
were like, Okay, well, I don't want to do this anymore.

(25:00):
Some of them started. There's there's a group of Quakers
called the Kethians or the Keithians. They branch off and
they move into different orders, and they bicker and they
quarrel and they at the time I found one really
incredible printing, uh and it's it's just a pamphlet, and
it's basically the Quakers bashing these four guys that are

(25:22):
like breaking away from their order. And they're like, you know,
they don't do this anymore, they don't do that, and
they're just you know, dirty laundry.

Speaker 2 (25:29):
They did that. And you know what, back in the day,
the newspapers were funny. They would be like, and you
suck and you suck back, and it's crazy to me
but it really did happen.

Speaker 3 (25:41):
It did, and and I always looked for those smoking
guns or those threads. And the guy on that pamphlet
his name was Henry Bernard Coster, and I'm like, okay,
well I know that name. I go back to my books,
and his name from from Rotterdam and Germany and Sulzbach
was Heinrich iron Hard Closter with an land the double

(26:04):
thoughts over the Oh, well, there's about nine families in
this book that go from being a German name to
an English name, and they all appear in different Rosicrucian texts,
in different in different forms of gnostic text And I'll
tell you what this is the one that I had

(26:26):
to sit down for was Francis Bacon. I don't know
anything about this guy. I don't think I ever heard
about him in school.

Speaker 2 (26:36):
Very briefly. For me, it was Shakespeare, right, It was
the Shakespeare stuff, that was it. Yep.

Speaker 3 (26:43):
Yeah, So sure he has a writing called The New Atlantis.
I don't know if you're familiar with it.

Speaker 2 (26:52):
I have it. Oh this is a different one, okay,
a man? So yeah, so do.

Speaker 3 (26:59):
You have you? Have you read any of it? I
tried to it's hard.

Speaker 2 (27:03):
It's hard. I haven't read the Atlantis one, Okay.

Speaker 3 (27:07):
I skimmed through it. And I do this thing I
have a fun time of. You know. It's the control
left on the keyboard, and then you search for keywords.
You search for keywords, you search for hot names, sentences.
Something that popped up to me, which is a name
that he refers to is Ben Salam or Ben Salem.

(27:30):
Now it was funny because if you look that name up,
it only shows up in one spot that I found,
and that's a township right in the wist of hicken
right in southeast Pennsylvania where the Rose Crucians and the
Quakers and these mystics all kind of landed. And the

(27:54):
guy who gamed it that was kind of part of
that is is his lineage goes back to these same people.

Speaker 2 (28:01):
And I just but they probably say he wasn't related
like doctor Nathan Smith.

Speaker 3 (28:07):
And that's what I said, and I just I hold
on to the fact that, like I said, a lot
of these German Europeans changed their names to an English version.
Richter writer Heinrich, Henry Coaster Coster, and this Growden or
Grodin that eventually founded Ben Salem, Pennsylvania, right outside of

(28:30):
this area. I mean, how do you pick that name?
Come on, it's sixteen seventy. You haven't read Francis Bacon
and you just choose Ben salam.

Speaker 2 (28:38):
As the city he didn't read it.

Speaker 3 (28:41):
It's the only one. It's the only one in the
entire world I've found.

Speaker 2 (28:46):
Was he a dumb farm boy too?

Speaker 3 (28:49):
He has some roots?

Speaker 2 (28:50):
Oh my gosh. It's so funny to me that they're like, no,
these people never read anything.

Speaker 3 (28:56):
No, Well wrong, how about.

Speaker 2 (29:00):
That?

Speaker 3 (29:00):
In that New Atlantis? I can't really say I know
a lot about it. I tried to read it. Like
I said, it's it's dense, but I know they're talking
about like some of the original like children of Abraham,
the tribes of Israel that ventured. I think, I mean,
at least that's what I got from it.

Speaker 2 (29:15):
And when are they talking about Seth? By chance?

Speaker 3 (29:20):
I think he comes up and I don't know why,
but they they interact. I think this fictional story. I
mean it's fictional because they have to say it.

Speaker 2 (29:30):
I think, what are you gonna do?

Speaker 3 (29:33):
Right? I saw I saw you know a UFO. Well,
did you really see it?

Speaker 2 (29:37):
Well?

Speaker 3 (29:37):
I think I saw it I'll write a book about it,
or I'll do this about just kidding, right, I don't know.
I feel like Bacon was trying to say something because
he was talking about how these indigenous people in this
land of Ben Salem were a tribe of Israel. Well,
lo and behold when you find out what Kelpius was doing.

(29:58):
He was trying to ent review the local Sioux tribe,
Indian tribe, the local indigenous tribes. He was trying to
figure out who their gods were. He was trying to
figure out what days they prayed on, which day was
the Sabbath. He wanted to mingle, and he found out
that a lot of their ancestry was dating back to

(30:19):
the Hebrew text that they were learning through Rosenroth and
the Kabbala and Sachs. This Julius Sachs. He was a
member of the American Philosophical Society. He was really into
trying to bring these connected sources together, I think, and
that just it threw me for a loop. I'm like, Wow,

(30:41):
Kelpius was doing the same thing Bacon was talking about
in a land that's kind of prophesied to be where
he kind of wanted to be. Could they have an
ulterior motive. Could they have a reason.

Speaker 2 (30:54):
To be always always? Well, a lot of these people
that left, you know, came over here with this whole
freedom of religion thing. It was very you know, it
was all about everyone. They had to bring everyone, but
it wasn't all about God, like the witches came here

(31:15):
in the Freemasons, and the this and the that, like
all of them came. And of course they had to
say some other people had to come too, because then
it looks sketchy, you know. But every early president we
have is a member of the Society of the Cincinnati.
All these important people are linked, if not by blood
then by secret societies. There's tons of them, Like I

(31:39):
can't even name them all back then, let alone now,
you know. I mean, people like will pick out little
ones and they're like, this is the important one. I'm like,
you have no idea. There's so many, you know.

Speaker 3 (31:54):
I agree. And the only thing I try and do
in my line of research is I try and put
my own eyes and my own hands on things that
I can physically see in touch. And I'm in the
process of trying to do that with one thing, but
getting to Germany's heart.

Speaker 2 (32:12):
Yeah, Germany's a nightmare. But don't worry. The Mormons have
their records.

Speaker 3 (32:16):
You mentioned the Masons, and one thing that I can
definitively tell you is factual that these people existed. They
were connected to the Masons, and they were connected to
the Rosicrucians of the seventeenth century. Is the last living
member of the Society of the Women of the Wilderness,
these mystic Hermits, was a doctor Christopher Witt. He died.

(32:39):
I think I can tell you if I just look
him up on my little pamphlet here he Let's see
when did he die. I want to say he died
around the late seventeen fifties, because the last thing he
did was he took the remaining books and the remaining

(33:01):
items they had in the possession of Kelpius, and he
gave them to his good buddy at the APS, the
American Philosophical Society. And his good buddy was doctor Benjamin Franklin.
Now I'm sure everybody knows who Benny Benny is. He's
a good old, good old American founding father. But little

(33:22):
do people know that he spent most of his life
in Europe. Go to the Rosicrucian website right now, am
orc whatever he's on there, he was a member.

Speaker 2 (33:35):
He was there for people that are listening to you.
If this guy died in seventeen fifty, Scottish Rite Freemasonry
wasn't organized and formed until May thirty first, eighteen oh one.
So therefore we have to look at the old rights
of masonry. And when I talk about this, it's like
the Egyptian rights a lot of the times, like the

(33:55):
miserym right. It can be York as well. It could
be you know, York, right, But if they're magical at all,
it's not because some people play with it, some people don't.

Speaker 3 (34:06):
So yeah, and everybody kind of looks at the founding
of the Independence, the seventeen seventy six you know founding fathers.
They say, you know, there was an order there. There
was a group that were, you know, acting together. Were
they Masons, I don't know. Some speculate, but we know
Franklin had his hands in the European version of the APS.

(34:30):
He was the founding I think he was the chairman
at the time. But when Wit donated this, it was
an item that these mystics used called the dial of ahez,
and it was a brass sun dial. Now, people who
don't research occultism or look into magic, a sun dial

(34:54):
can be two things. I found. If it's a concave
or bowl shape, you can put stuff in that. And
if you see these pictures of this dial, it was
made in the fifteen hundreds, it's got astrological signs, it's
got different zodiac signs, it's got different written Latin. And

(35:20):
what's really fascinating is when you put water in it,
apparently and gaze up at the stars, which they had
an observatory at this tabernacle. What would you see in
sixteen ninety what would you look at right? Right? And
what these guys were they have the actual prophecy still.
I think there's three that exist from like the sixteen

(35:43):
late sixteen hundreds into the seventeen hundreds that are just
kept and they're just basically these guys looking at the
stars and saying, well, I think this is going to happen,
or I think this is going to happen. But what
I found fascinating is that when when I read that
Benjamin Franklin took it, it's put away? Is it still there?

Speaker 2 (36:00):
So? Where is it?

Speaker 3 (36:02):
Right?

Speaker 2 (36:02):
Where is it? Yeah? Where to go and to your point,
you may want to someday look up something called or
you can now the Leahonah the Leahonah, and that may
be an exact replica of what you're talking about that
the Book of Mormon uses for direction.

Speaker 3 (36:19):
Does it have does it almost look like a like
a scale?

Speaker 2 (36:23):
It looks like a ball, Like I said, it looks
like a brass ball thing. And they talk about this
in the Book of Mormon back that this is how
they used, you know, to find their way.

Speaker 3 (36:34):
Yeah. Yeah, And I decided I wanted to see if
it was still there, because the APS is still in Philadelphia.
So I called them up and I decided to talk
to him and they pulled the catalog and they're like, answer,
you can come, you come take a look at it.

Speaker 2 (36:47):
You're on the list now. Uh oh yeah.

Speaker 3 (36:51):
So I'm arranging to go look at it and view it.
But I just, you know, those are the things that
to me when you can when you can say that
somebody says, yeah, this is here, like that has history
that you don't really understand anymore. Right, it's real, it's real, yeah,
and whatever ties to it, I think what limited sources

(37:12):
we have, like this book from this author Sacks. He
was doing his best in eighteen you know, eighteen forty,
eighteen fifty to just try and keep this information together.
But what really really fascinates me is just how there's
so much connection to like the mystic arts. And you
mentioned how the Mormons kind of they pull into that

(37:36):
like magic mysticism.

Speaker 2 (37:39):
Without without Let's see, they did Joseph Smith one hundred percent,
and then when Brigham Young took over, I think they do,
but I think he hit it. It's for the elect
and select.

Speaker 3 (37:52):
Now, well, you know who was the founder of the uh,
I'm gonna get it wrong. I think it's the oto
of the the group that Crowley tried to take over.
One of the names that popped up to me because
I did a lot of research with occults, the occult stuff,
and the theosophy and theology, and just I tried to

(38:13):
look at everything from Lavotsky to Steiner, what were they
interacting with, what were they talking to? And the part
of Rosenroth's Kabbala that gravitated into modern dayccultism was when
Mathers took that exact Christian converted script that was the

(38:37):
one that all of these pitists and mystics were reading
back in the sixteen hundreds. He took it in the
eighteen and he just rewrote it into his own version
and it carried over. So what else carried over? Where
else did these people flock to? And I think a
lot of it. Probably if you look up some of
the founders of the Mormon Church, I would guess that

(38:59):
they had.

Speaker 2 (39:01):
So I just got this from a listener, and I
did verify its origin and I'm going to do a
deep dive on it, and thank you to you who
sent me this. But they sent me a genealogy thing
and it was really weird because they it's old, okay,
and it says this at the top. It says one

(39:21):
the royal line pedigree, and it's it's all this like
back to Adam okay. And this is created by Archibald Bennett,
which I'm sure people have heard me speak about the Bennetts,
and he is the one that they base all of

(39:42):
their genealogy. This, this is what he created, is what
they go off of to say you're related to so
and so by so and so by in their whole
like diagram for their website. Okay, and on this really
old handwritten pedigree the royal line, right, it's called one
Royal line. On there is Joseph Smith and he's always

(40:05):
claimed that as well. But in the middle of it
there's a star of David or Rampam and it says,
and God saw these souls that they were good, and
he said these I will make my rulers. Yeah, and
that's a scripture. But I'm just saying it gets anytime
we start saying that this person is more special than

(40:29):
this person, this race is more special than that. Ray
Steiner does it. All these people do it that you're
talking about, you know, the Great White Brotherhood. This stuff,
it gets super dangerous. Like people say, oh, no, it's
just philosophy, you know, or whatever. I'm like, yeah, but
but it leads somewhere weird, we know, because somebody gets,
you know, something in their pants and wants to, you know,

(40:49):
get rid of everybody else or make the supreme Uber mentioned,
you know, but they're not even supposed to. You want
to know why, because they're not even suppose to spill
their cups. So I don't know what's happening there. But
there is some pieces to the puzzle with the templars too,
because you know, they later they said, and you said,

(41:13):
you go to this country, and you go to this country,
and you go to that country, and you all make
a baby, right like all of you. And or maybe
this was the Rosicrucians. I can't remember, but they're spreading
this royal seed.

Speaker 3 (41:25):
Basically very well could have bled over between the two
from what I'm looking into, the rose Crucians and the
Royal I mean, the Rosy Cross, the Golden Cross. I
jumped into this whole avenue. I was working on something
that it just so happened synchronicity strikes. I heard you

(41:47):
talking about the Templars on your podcast while I was
editing something about Columbus, and how again, we've been kind
of educated to think that in fourteen ninety two Curtis
for Columbus saled the Ocean Blue. That's what I grew
up on. But we've got vikings landing there, We've got
up in Nova Scotia, we've got the templars, We've got

(42:09):
all of this information with physical evidence, building sites, tools, arrowheads,
interactions with the natives that were living there. I didn't
know that.

Speaker 2 (42:22):
I didn't know that, yep, and let alone the vikings
raping and pillaging their way through everything and spreading babies.

Speaker 3 (42:30):
Yeah, you get into the ideas of some of the
indigenous cultures of that area talk about red giants and
large red headed giants moving around. I mean, I think
it was Eric the Red or Leaf the Red, one
of them. I can't remember all the vikings, but one
of them landed up there. So who really understands exactly
what's there? And when you look at the templars then,

(42:51):
I mean, look at Oak Island. You had that discussion
a while back. There's a lot of connections to like
tenth century eleventh century Jerusalem. The dial that I spoke of,
it's a recreation made by this brass architect or handler artist.

(43:12):
His name was Christopher or Schissler or Schistler, and he
built this dial as a replication of the herolygum Aquez.
It was just I think it dates back to like
eleventh century Jerusalem era, but it.

Speaker 2 (43:31):
Was and the Abrahamic priests had this stuff too. Yeah,
I think if I remember right, the Leahnat though though
that's a Mormon term, I think it comes up in
the Bible as well.

Speaker 3 (43:45):
I would be interesting to see how much because you've
talked on your podcast about how the Mormons have a
connection to Yale and the Skull and Bones. Yes, yeah,
and if that's true in the sense that even one
percent of one percent of it's true, that would tie
them to a lot of information that goes to what

(44:07):
the in the sixteenth century, the Invisible College, or the Illuminati,
the Freemasonry, Rosicrucians, these orders of men and high society
people were passing information back and forth. If even something
from the Mormon churches in that vault that could coincide
with anything else, who knows.

Speaker 2 (44:29):
Yep, Well, it's interesting. Yeah, it's interesting because we look
at it and every single time these people are like, okay, Mohammed, Joseph,
all these people that get this revelation, Okay, they immediately
start wanting them to sleep with other women. They wanted
John de two, they wanted Joseph Smith to take other brides.

(44:50):
They wanted other people, and it's spreading their seed far
and wide. Like Brigham Young had fifty five wives, Like
he was bad at his job because he only had
like fifty seven kids. But quite yeah, it's not even
one a piece. I mean, let's get real, he wasn't
doing a good job. But they want them to make

(45:12):
these babies, you know. And there's a quote and I
can't find the actual source, so I only give it
once in a great while that Hitler supposedly said, and
this came up in a Mormon forum that he said,
you know, the Mormons are the ultimate uber midge because
they don't they don't race mix, and they didn't until
nineteen seventy eight. It was if you had one drop

(45:34):
of blood, like you were done. That was why they
helped the Nazis, which people don't like to talk about,
but they did. And this is how they got the
records because they said, look, you give us the records
clear back, like charlottne all of it. This is why
the Mormon Church had them is because he said, if
you give them to me, we'll organize them and help
you be able to trace the lineage back three so

(45:56):
that you can make sure you're not marrying and I
quote but jew. So they had to put these up
if you had a daughter of dating age or a
son of dating age and put it on your wall
to prove your heritage before you could be married. So well,
that's a real.

Speaker 3 (46:13):
Rabbit hole of the Nazi and Hitler regime. Of the
you know, the World War two era. I always say
it's kind of cliche, but you know, a conspiracy is
about ten months from being true. So a conspiracy theorist,
like myself, if you want to say I'm a conspiracy theorist,

(46:35):
it's going to it's not gonna take long before the
Internet or somebody finds some piece of documentation that's going
to shed light on something. And I think, as we've
learned through Foyer requests and more people digging into Internet
sources and documentation and putting things together that, let's face it,
at a time period in the forties, fifties, and sixties,
these guys were coming fresh out of nineteen thirty World

(46:58):
War One. It was it was. They weren't prophesizing into
twenty twenty five and going, there's going to be some
kid that's nineteen looking at my documents unt the computer.

Speaker 2 (47:09):
Right, although Steiner knew Steiner, but he.

Speaker 3 (47:12):
Was kind of ahead of his curve. Yeah. But the
Nazi thing, we again, here we go into the education system.
I was taught the Nazis were bad. They were the
bad guys of World War two. That was it and destroyed.
The good guys won. But when you research what they
were doing with the Thule Society, the whole rill thing,

(47:33):
and that they're accult sides, they were really interested in
some weird stuff.

Speaker 2 (47:41):
And real goes immediately into the white tntra right again.

Speaker 3 (47:45):
You know, right, And I have so many names in
my head that I can't remember them all, but the
guys who were running the Thule Society that were visiting
Tibet and in you know, in India, and like like
you said, I'm sure they had somebody with the Mormons.
And that's a good way to say, hey, we got
a lot of stuff we got to get out of Germany.

(48:05):
We'll go hide it over here.

Speaker 2 (48:07):
Well, and we have proof that this really really happened
with these genealogical records because it had to be released
from the CIA. And there's a CIA declassified doc that says, yeah,
all of the punch cards for the you know, mass
destruction of a certain people, they ended up with the CIA,

(48:27):
and the CIA gave them to the Mormons. And it's proven.
And guess how that was, you know, functioned. It was
all put through somebody on the board for IBM. She
wasn't if you put in was she employed by IBM?
It was that, you silly goose. No, but she was
on the board. And it's Bill Gates mother. And who's

(48:48):
the number one stockholding for their portfolio, Bill Gates. So
you know they're all in it together.

Speaker 3 (48:54):
And there's a lot of farmland out there.

Speaker 2 (48:56):
Too, a lot of farm Bill Gates has number one
and Marmon Church has number two of farmland. People always go,
they're not the biggest land. I know that for farmland
for a farm. Yes.

Speaker 3 (49:07):
Well, that's that's why Shell corporations and other names and
things that you don't tie things together until you dig.

Speaker 2 (49:13):
And then it gets uncomfortable, right.

Speaker 3 (49:16):
Right, And and that's what I mean, like when you
when you connect the dots and you just try and
it's not even conspiracy when you say I'm comparing apples
to apples, I'm not looking at two different things. I'm saying, Okay,
if if I have proof that this person Rosenroth rewrote
the Kabbalah into Christianity and it's made its way to

(49:37):
Mathers and all these guys in the occult and it's
somehow gotten into let's take it all the way up
to Crowley who Crowley went into Parsons and Hubbard, you're
looking at intelligence. You're not looking at you know, religion
per se anymore. You're looking at a conglomeration, almost an

(49:58):
amalgamation of so much many different things that are orchestrating
the same exact mentality, which is somewhere in these scriptures,
in these writings, people are interacting with things. They could
be angels, they could be demons, they could be both
at the same time.

Speaker 2 (50:15):
It's a mile the time the.

Speaker 3 (50:18):
Trickster incarnate. They are both. I mean, who said that?
Wasn't it a Schrodinger's cat. They are Schrodinger's non physical intelligence.
They're both at the same time.

Speaker 2 (50:30):
And these said they lied, and and even the most
evil cruelly said they lied. That's why as never comes
up and Lamb comes up, because he said, if I
could go back, I would not write that book of
the Law because he lied to me about what I
do not know.

Speaker 3 (50:48):
Yeah, well, it tricked them real good up in you know,
up in the King's chamber a couple of times. Wasn't
that I just I don't know what what I see
as I continued through my my path of like it's
like a skipping stone across these connections. Is even into
modern day right now. How we're we're on the cusp

(51:12):
of what I think is is a very large data
dump of things that I don't think a lot of
people give a lot a great deal of time too.
You know, you've got your your Sunday church goers, you've
got your people who are religious, and you've got every
sort of walk of life. If you hear a bird,
I have a dove, So you hear him in the background.

Speaker 2 (51:35):
I do hear him. But that's cute.

Speaker 3 (51:37):
If it's distracting, I can shut the door. But no,
I mean, uh, what I what I see is that
you know, you've got all of this this happening, and
and at the forefront right now, Like I don't mean
to sway the conversation one way or the other place.
When you look at what's happening in Congress right now

(51:57):
with with the so called so called disclosure, and you've
got X which is flooded with you, Hey, come to
my space and come here and talk about this. And
we've got these scientists who are going to do here,
and we've got a hearing coming all right. Do you
know who these people are? Well, okay, let's take one.

(52:17):
I don't want to name names. But the most popular
I would say that's been getting around is we think
about how put off Have you ever heard of him?
Most people have, But he has a connection from what
I've read. I could be wrong. If he wants to
come on a podcast and dispute it, he can, but
I've found multiple sources that say he was involved with

(52:38):
the Church of el Ron Hubbard. Can we say the
name of it? I don't care, I will.

Speaker 2 (52:44):
I can believe right right, it just gets you know, but.

Speaker 3 (52:48):
They how can you look at it from the narrow
lens of this is just a guy who worked at
SRI with that was a parapsychologist, that wasn't involved with
the same things that these Rosicrucians, these Masons and all
these secret orders. It stems back to the same source.
It's just branching out and infecting everything.

Speaker 2 (53:10):
Who was working with Parsons, who used to work for
Howard Hughes, who worked with the Mormons.

Speaker 3 (53:15):
I had a really interesting exactly, I had a really
interesting conversation. I can't confirm or deny that it was him,
but I tried to reach out to If you've ever
heard of his name, his name was Uri Geller.

Speaker 2 (53:28):
The uh oh, of course, uh huh.

Speaker 3 (53:30):
I tried to reach out to him and just confirm
a couple things, and I didn't get an answer back
except for an email that was just if you'd like
to speak. I think it was on WhatsApp or whatever
we can, but it was a thumbs up from the
quote from Basically he was talking about his time at SRI,
where a few generals had come to see what he
could do put off in targ we're testing him, and

(53:54):
the quote was somewhere I'm ad living, but I don't
care what this guy can do about undes and X,
Y and Z. Can he turn on the nukes or not?
And when these guys realized that he could read through
a room that was sealed through, you know, several floors,
and also in a vessel and he could read the
documents in there, that's what kind of sparked them. And

(54:16):
the thumbs up to me was kind of just like
a all right, I guess he's right, or it might
not even be him, It may just be a guy
pulled on my chain who knows right, right, what are
we talking about here? If if the government invests trillions
of dollars into this, if we've got I talk about

(54:36):
it in my book, and I'm not going to say
that because I don't want to be that cliche guy.
Don't read my book. I'm not going to give you answers.
I'm going to give you too much information and I'm
going to hurt your brain. Talk. I talk about the
the fact that there's compartmentalization, there's ways that at the
time when after World War Two the government went, hey,

(54:58):
we can't talk about this. We've got a private We've
got to put it places where we can't have people going, hey,
I got a foyer request. I want to see the receipts.
That's why you've got Lockheed Martin north of Grummitt. You've
got all of these government contractors that interact with these
people that are tied to science, religion, theology, even occultism,

(55:23):
and they intermingle and they talk about everything, and they
all I think it was on Joe Rogan. He had
put off on and they were talking about the I
guess it was the project of how forty six or
fifty different categories of what this would do to society,
you know, and how it would change religion, economy, finance,

(55:46):
and everybody in the room was unanimous that we can't
talk about the spiritual Wolu crap and we can't do
this now. But he did. I mean he was there
doing it. And who else was in that room? You
know who other?

Speaker 2 (56:00):
Who else is involved?

Speaker 3 (56:01):
And I think that the basic just easy way to
explain it is, you know, Nazis bad, World War two
over Cia, JFK dead. Oh look, modern day like keep
move along, move along, move along. Magnifying glasses are hard
to come by these days. But the fun when you
get your hands on.

Speaker 2 (56:19):
Them, and well, it's they don't want you to look
at it because then we will find out that the
Nazis didn't lose shit. They just came over here. And
that's what I told my husband. I said, if what
I'm looking at is real, as I when I had
this crisis, I said it, then they weren't helping the Nazis,

(56:42):
they are Nazis. And he's like, that's a big statement,
and I was like, I.

Speaker 3 (56:48):
Know, well, how many came over in Project paper clip exactly?

Speaker 2 (56:52):
Well, one for sure, and he was super important and
that was Werner von Braun, and then the next and
his good buddy that up doing what with Ruth Paine
and you know, her son works for him, and and
you know the whole nine do you know about that
whole thing?

Speaker 3 (57:10):
Like are you are you jumping into Andrea Puchark I'm
talking about this?

Speaker 2 (57:15):
Is? Yes, yes, that nine. I've done a bunch of
shows on Andrea pooh Hark and then nine and then.

Speaker 3 (57:22):
Round Table right, the round Table Foundation.

Speaker 2 (57:25):
Absolutely, And so what's his name? Why can't I think
of it? The other Nazi that came with von Braun
and he ends up over at Bell Helicopter with Ruth
Payne Young. She's you know, not Ruth Payne JFK because
they both married a Ruth like and it gets really dumb.

(57:46):
And then yeah, and then you know, Arthur makes the
Bell helicopter bounces out and starts doing woo woo to
woo woo after this whole stance of the nine.

Speaker 3 (57:57):
Ruth Young was she Brigham Young? Is that the same?

Speaker 2 (58:00):
I haven't looked into that yet, but you know, Ruth
Payne Young is you know, Mike, Michael's wife and then
the mother to or not Michael, Arthur's wife, the inventor
of Bell Helicopter. She has a son, Michael, and he
ends up working there with this Nazi. I can't remember

(58:22):
his name. I'm gonna find it anyway. It's a whole thing,
and he should have been Actually they were going to
kill him because he's super Nazi like he wasn't reformable.
They literally said he wasn't reformable and so and then
you know, it gets weird because it all ties into JFK,
which was the whole reason how I got involved with
the whole thing, and I was like, this is crazy,

(58:45):
Like how like how you know?

Speaker 3 (58:48):
Well? I think I did listen to a few of
your podcasts on the Roundtable in the nine, and I
had never heard about them until I started looking into
like the parapsychology realm of interacting with not seances but
just intelligences. And what sparked me off was have you

(59:10):
ever heard of something.

Speaker 2 (59:10):
Called door and Berger? It's Walter doren Berger. That was
his boss, and he should have been killed and he
isn't killed and he ends up just you know, running
bell helicopter and shit, like what what You're just going
to give this guy all this crazy knowledge and put
him in charge? How come?

Speaker 3 (59:32):
Yeah, a lot of those people got really important jobs,
like NASA and the CIA and the Department of Energy
and a few of these that don't really make much
sense as to why they're even involved, but you know, or.

Speaker 2 (59:47):
Why they let them come if they're un reformable right.

Speaker 3 (59:51):
And achieve these great statuses of you responsibility the whole
the roundtable though, did you how how?

Speaker 2 (01:00:03):
I mean? I got pretty deep on Pooharrik with the
kids and the Faraday cages and Yurie and running around
the desert.

Speaker 3 (01:00:13):
How about did you did you happen to get anywhere
on when he was interacting with I think his name
was V. G. Vinod or one of the doctor Ye
did you find anything with that?

Speaker 2 (01:00:27):
So they go back and forth whether he's even real
or not, whether.

Speaker 3 (01:00:32):
I contacted the school. I found the school that he was,
you know, accredited to, and I reached out to them
and I never got a response. But that's as far
as my lead got. And what what set me off
with the roundtable was have you ever heard of the
Phillip Ailsford experiment? M h, I think that's what it is.
I could be wrong, but I think that's right. I'll

(01:00:54):
double check it was. It was a Canadian experiment I
think in the nineteen sixties or where they create there's
a couple podcasts that talk about it. But they created
this fictional being, this fictional man, They created this whole backstory,
this whole entire persona. He had a love affair, his
wife dies, He was this aristocratic noble and they performed

(01:01:17):
seances at a table and they televise it. I mean,
you can YouTube the some of their documents, the documentary
sciences that they tried to interact with this through a
spirit board, and they ended up contacting something that was
creating its own fictional story, that was feeding off of

(01:01:37):
what they gave it, and they couldn't quite figure out
how it was pulling this information because it was basically
it was trying to lie to them and make them
believe that it really was him, but it was so
believable that it was creating its own I guess, Aggregor,
it was becoming. In my opinion, what I read is

(01:01:58):
it was basically trying to trick them into believing it
was real, even though they made it, and they were
trying to trick it, and it's and it's that trickster
element of we know you're trying to get us because
we built this thing, so who are you? You're not
Philip because we know all about him, we made him.
So who are you? Who are you talking to us?

(01:02:18):
As you say you're family, but who are you?

Speaker 2 (01:02:21):
Uh?

Speaker 3 (01:02:21):
And then I got into Fuharak and the people who
were tied to him, like I mean, for one, the
Star Trek.

Speaker 2 (01:02:31):
Guy rotten Berry, ye, yep.

Speaker 3 (01:02:35):
And you look at some of his stories throughout the
the seventies and the eighties, and I'm I'm gonna, I
don't know, I can't say that I'm a fan of his.
But Jeremy Corbel, the the ex you know UFO guy,
he talks about how he's you know, been in connection
with Geene Roddenberry, him and George and I put names

(01:02:59):
and connections together. And if this guy was write in
fiction and he loves aliens and UFOs and all this
Wulu stuff. He also is really into Andrea fou Hark
in the roundtable, so wow.

Speaker 2 (01:03:12):
And the people that were there, No, the people that
were there were like the top families, I mean the
top yeah that his.

Speaker 3 (01:03:22):
Yeah, you know, I think I had like nine families
that were were pretty wealthy, pretty wealthy that were donating
to him regularly to try and you got way deeper
than I did. I didn't get into the whole you know.
I went more along the psychedelic realm of like the
mushrooms and what he was doing in Mexico and the

(01:03:43):
whole side phenomenon. But he had his hands and a
lot of stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:03:48):
Oh yeah, And and he was known to be, you know,
working with the government CEI exactly.

Speaker 3 (01:03:54):
He was Army intelligence, yes, and started there.

Speaker 2 (01:03:58):
The people that were there, I'll find it. It was
like the Astors and the DuPonts and you know, all
these very very important people. And then the ast was
you know, John Jacob Astor's daughter and she dies of
she's like twenty nine or third, I don't know. She
was super damn young and she just died of a

(01:04:19):
stroke after they started all hanging out. Okay, cool, Sorry,
it's really isn't it funny?

Speaker 3 (01:04:26):
How when DNA evidence kind of shows up on the
public record, like a lot of these people just stop
dying of really dumb can I swear?

Speaker 2 (01:04:35):
I don't know if I could say, oh yes, yeah,
of course.

Speaker 3 (01:04:37):
A lot of dumb shit just stops happening because all
of a sudden they realize, oh, we're gonna.

Speaker 2 (01:04:41):
Get caught, like right, and they're never related. By the way,
even if they're right by each other and seventy five
miles apart and their families inner marry other people right
next door, they're not related.

Speaker 3 (01:04:52):
I forget. I forget who it was. But there was
one UFO story I read where the guy who was
talking about something. I'm gonna have to look it up,
but supposedly he died and on the same day, three
guys with the same name all died. Oh so it's like,
you know, I think it was on the Y Files
if you've ever heard of the y Files on YouTube.

(01:05:13):
He does really good work on deep dives and debunks.
But like, that's one of those facts where you kind
of look at it and.

Speaker 2 (01:05:19):
You go, huh, sure, yeah where.

Speaker 3 (01:05:22):
And another one is in the realm of remote viewing
Pat Price. I don't know if you've heard the name
Pat Price, but he was a former He was a
former officer, police officer that he just thought he got
stuff right. He just he really he was good at
his job, and he ended up being one of the

(01:05:43):
founding assets with Ingo Swan that started the remote viewing programs.
And he died supposedly, speculatively he died in I think Nevada.
He felt something jab his leg. He was in a
public place. He felt something in her. He goes up
to his room.

Speaker 2 (01:06:01):
He starts getting sounds very JFK.

Speaker 3 (01:06:03):
Yeah, is it true. I don't know, but he died mysteriously.
He was thirty something years old.

Speaker 2 (01:06:09):
Those ice guns, you know, yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:06:12):
And a lot of these the CIA guys that after
they were done with them, they just we don't need
you anymore. We got what we needed.

Speaker 2 (01:06:18):
You're a liability at this point. Look at all the
people that were in you know, the the hearings that
were in that secret church you know, uh that wasn't
a real church, and all this weird stuff, and all
of them started dropping dead immediately immediately, and I'm like,
this is weird. Leavenda goes into a pretty deep in
one of his books, and he also goes into the
Nine Sinister Forces is that book? And it's so it

(01:06:42):
was so eye opening to me because I'm like, wait,
why are all these fancy rich people that are like
the core. It's not just that they're rich, these are
the core families of America that were here, that were
like the Krem de La Crem, the DuPonts, and the
Astors and that this and then that. Well, these were
also people that had a big part in either being

(01:07:03):
four or against what money money being you know, transitioned,
transitioned into you know, not backing our money with gold
and being part of the Federal Reserve. Astor was against it,
and he you know, met his fate accordingly, so.

Speaker 3 (01:07:22):
You know, and they monopolized a lot of it through education.
I mean, we we have a lot of I can't say.
People will dispute it, and you know, left and right,
but that influenced the education system in the early you
know days of the fifties, sixties, and I think that
that's okay, we could speculate, but when I compare it

(01:07:44):
to something that's factual, I look at these interactions with
the the uf faux world, the Condon Report, the Robertson Panel.
These things happened in our history that children of the
eighties and the nineties, the Generation x's and the millennials,
we didn't know about unless we went to school for

(01:08:07):
or we watched the documentary. But these things happened. The
Condon Report happened, the Robinson Report happened. The United States
government actively worked and orchestrated with Disney with major corporations
to publicly fund and put people in the mindset of
this isn't real, it's none of it's real, while systematically

(01:08:28):
they funded it a tone of billions and compartmentalized it
in all these different societies and organizations and just funded
and funded and funded, and it's been secret. And I think,
like I said, I think we've we've come to the
edge where independent research is now combating against academia. It's

(01:08:49):
combating against a lot of these these sources that.

Speaker 2 (01:08:54):
Are the lies. It's the lies, it's it's the complete
obfuscation of the true, where it's not just an accidental lie.
This is like a changing of history.

Speaker 3 (01:09:06):
It is, and I think the people are that are
pushing back have moved outside of the realm of saying
I'm afraid to be wrong or changed. They're not changing history,
you're changing their identity because they have their accredited careers
on this, they have their books, they have everything that
they've put their lives towards saying this is the thing
that we've written down. We can't change that when you

(01:09:29):
look at history, like I was saying something very specific
about these these resicrutions, I call them early roscructions. And
I'm going to stand by that. I'm writing this out
as a book long form, and I think I have
enough evidence evidence to suggest that there was influence there.
But oh, the fact is people know about this is

(01:09:50):
common knowledge. I just think I'm visiting for the first time. Maybe,
but I see connections here. And the one thing that
I did say is I have someone in Germany I'm
trying to deal. You know, some pictures are maybe just
like a zoom call, so I can physically see the
object in their hands. There's a man who was back

(01:10:12):
a long time ago. His name was Augustus Frank and
he started an orphanage over in Germany. Well it exists today,
and I'm trying to figure out. In the book that
I'm reading, the author says, in eighteen thirty eighteen forty,
he goes and visits this place looking for something called

(01:10:34):
the golden tincture or the elixir dulsis. This is alchemy.
They were distilling gold and they were openly distributing it
throughout the Whista Hicken Valley in Pennsylvania. I have documents
and handwritten descriptions, inscriptions of these mystics were offering this

(01:10:56):
to people like, we've distilled it, we have it. It's
to treat all this to diferent stuff and the.

Speaker 2 (01:11:02):
God atomic the monoatomic gold.

Speaker 3 (01:11:05):
Yeah, and the people who were in control of it
their last name. I look at the guy who created
this back in the fifteenth century, and it's the same
last name. And I go, there's no way that this
German family, which there's three I counted, all with the

(01:11:25):
same all working at this hot orphanage under alchemy. They
all happened to have influences from Agrippa, Paracelsus, the Rosicrucians,
the Hidden societies, and they all come over into southeastern Pennsylvania.
And the people who were selling it through this order
have the.

Speaker 2 (01:11:43):
Same last name, right, but they're not related, don't worry.

Speaker 3 (01:11:46):
Yeah, So here we have modern day alchemy in the
founding of America, and that information was passed directly to
Benjamin Franklin. If what I've read in this book suggests
there were library he's worth of documents that came from Germany, Rottenham,
you know, Sulzbach that was just donated because they trusted

(01:12:09):
these people to put this stuff away. And I think
they were kind of wishing, like, hey, you know when
I'm when I'm dead in one hundred years, you are
going to bring this back out, right? Yeah? Sure, yeah,
we got you like all day long, okay, dangling the
dollar on the fishing line like, oh you almost got it. Yeah.
It just is to me that was That's another one.

(01:12:30):
Like the families are there, the names are there, the
item exists, and it's documented in a book that the
author had his he went to Germany, and he touched it,
he held it. I've seen pictures of the vile of
it empty. And this is just me speaking. I know
I'm babbling, but I can't know. I can no longer
argue that history has so much more to tell us

(01:12:52):
that if we just accept it and say this is fascinating,
it's gonna be cool.

Speaker 2 (01:12:57):
Right, right? Do they have to why do they have
to hide every single thing? And I get like they're
always saying, well, this is for the initiated and the uninitiated,
and it's it's the same way with the Catholics. I
mean that's basically you know why they put a stop
to the templars is. I don't think it had to

(01:13:18):
do with money. I think it had to do with
their practices. Getting out right like this is this is
something that you don't do for the outside people, and
so just wipe it out, like you said, they were
done with them, they were done.

Speaker 3 (01:13:33):
Now you've spoken to a lot more people who have
researched the templars, way more than I have. Do you
feel that after I guess talking with those people were
learning more about them. Do you think they were able
to actually move anything from like the Jerusalem City state,

(01:13:54):
like that tenth century nincent the Holy Wars? Were they
able to move the grail where they able to move
certain things?

Speaker 2 (01:14:01):
Say they say, but they also say the grail isn't
always a physical object, it's a it was you know,
they believe the rex daeis you know, it was Mary
and she had Jesus's baby and the womb is her
grail and and that's like they're talking about the chalice
of Jesus Christ. And so you know that idea makes

(01:14:25):
it here to America. And one of those people that
talk about this is Joseph Smith. He says, I am
the bloodline of Mary Magdalene and Jesus Christ and I
and he's on that that right to rule, you know parchment,
And he said, you know that he was the perfect

(01:14:45):
combination of both, because he's this tribe which is he from,
and this tribe you know, which is Judah, which is
the Manassa in Mormonism, this is what they are, and
that he's the perfect combination of both, therefore making him
like better than other people. You know.

Speaker 3 (01:15:03):
And what I'd like to add to what you just
said there is there were multiple tribes. There were the
tribes of how many different you know, Abrahamic tribes. What
caught my eye is when Bacon talks about the indigenous
in North America being of ben Salam, I think of
Benjamin and these names that change over time. But then

(01:15:24):
you look at the Smithsonian Institute, the the Grand Canyon,
with these hieroglyphs, and these.

Speaker 2 (01:15:31):
Egyptian Temple of Isis.

Speaker 3 (01:15:33):
Yeah, I think I've even read somewhere where there's Hebrew
written in some spots on walls.

Speaker 2 (01:15:39):
Well, in Canada, you know, my Mormon family was there
and married into the mcmac, you know, natives, which was
why I had that conversation with the Canadian guy that
came on and we talked about, you know, all of
these people knew the Bible, which they shouldn't have known. Okay,

(01:16:00):
they said that they were taught it and that these
people came over and they absorbed it so much, but
also were in fear like they had to baptize over
that all of their children were named Mary and Joseph
for for decades and decades, not just one or two,
all of them.

Speaker 3 (01:16:18):
Right, Yeah, And what I think I said that earlier
that even later after, you know, we get into like
the sixteen seventeen hundreds. Kelpius, this Johannes Kelpius, he was
talking with the natives of southeastern Pennsylvania and they were
referring back to him things like, oh, yeah, our Lord

(01:16:40):
does this, our God does this. Our days are this,
this is our creation myth And he's going, wait a minute,
how is this so closely aligned to what they believe?
And what I started to venture into as I went
on my own reli religious path was the Gnostic texts.
And you know, the piece is so and these these

(01:17:02):
ideas of the divine feminine, they're new to me, but
they're even more I guess I would say groundbreaking to
people who have no touch with with religion.

Speaker 2 (01:17:16):
Or well especially even freemasonry minus the free free you know,
with religion. The Freemasonry carries it on as well, like
they don't say they do. It looks extremely patriarchal, right,
but at the at the very tippy top, what are
we talking about? Right? And it I mean many say
that it's you know, a female deity. What what do

(01:17:38):
the Mormons say about, you know, Mother in Heaven that
she's too sacred to speak about, she doesn't have a name. Well,
that sounds interesting, you know, And I don't think that's
for the uninitiated, right. They don't give a crap about
all these porch Mormons, porch Masons that make them look
like a normal society. They're not going to give you

(01:18:01):
the keys. You're not going to know this stuff. You're
not gonna go to the temple and learn exactly what
they do. It just gives them the cover of night
because then okay, look all these people do it, so look, yeah,
we're going to do it too, right, We're gonna go
You're not they're not doing the same thing. They cut
it to pieces to where they only go for an
hour and you don't have to memorize anything anymore, and

(01:18:22):
you don't have to learn anything. They don't really care
and they'll hold up a flash card for you. So
is that g nosis? Like, oh no.

Speaker 3 (01:18:31):
You can see a very close uh like synonymous blend
of action. When you compare what the Mormons did with
their information and how this this you know, compartmentalization of
information in the government world and the secret CIA conspiracy world.

(01:18:51):
They do a very good job of having the surface level.
You've got your like you said, the porch Mormons, you've
got what everybody says as everybody, yeah, the billboard. This
is what you this is what you get. But you
have to have that in order to actively work what
you need to work down below, which is at the
core it seems to be in my opinion, and what
other people who are working in way different areas, the

(01:19:13):
Templars and the Rosicrucians. Okay, I could get that, But
why am I finding information that makes me want to
go talk with your friend up in Canada and the
Micmac tribe. I'm talking about Quakers down here. Why are
we seeing the same thing. It's because it's all the name.

Speaker 2 (01:19:30):
I looked it up really quick while you were chatting
the Brethren of Angels. Whoa Like that's a good one,
you know, Yeah, Like that's what he called it right,
this guy, Yeah, I mean this Quaker guy is talking
about that's what he called this society, the Brethren of Angels.

(01:19:51):
That's bananas.

Speaker 3 (01:19:53):
And there's there's even like like I talked, I talked
a little bit about Francis Bacon. I found a few
books with him that are you know, combined in with
Oddly enough, there are volumes from Harvard Harvard Classics edited
by you know, these eighteenth century Harvard accredited people. You know,

(01:20:15):
they put what they want in there. But anyway, you've
got Francis Bacon, You've got John Milton, and you've got
Sir Thomas Brown, and each one of these guys is
talking about something that is so esoteric that at the time,
in the fifteenth, sixteenth, seventeen hundreds, this is some wild stuff.
And why these guys put this all in one little book.

(01:20:38):
It's wild and I'm trying to make sense of it all.
But to me, it really does it Like a Brotherhood
of Angels is another way of just saying, we have
no clue what these whatever we're interacting with. Kelpias himself.
He talks and I didn't think I would see it.
I did the hot key. Let's find a word. I

(01:20:59):
looked up Sophia just to see what I would find,
and in his own gospel, like his own writings, he
talks about the divine feminine and the divine Sophia wisdom.
And I'm like, Okay, these guys are Germans over, you know,
coming to America. This is his belief and the natives
are reflecting that and saying, yeah, we have the same thing.
We have the Earth Mother, we have the spirit of

(01:21:21):
the divine, this feminine deity. It really does make you
question how much more fascinating information is just right there
at the surface. If you just dig a little, you
just want more, and you want more, and you want
to keep digging until you get everything. And I think
that's why I wrote the book I wrote. I feel
like I had to brain dump. I put everything I

(01:21:43):
could together. If it doesn't make sense to me, it does,
and it shows a pattern of exactly what I see
in religious and theosophical movements now and why I'm doing
what I'm doing, and why I've reached out to you,
because I feel like there's so much that the Mormons
have that I would guess is like the Vatican, you know,

(01:22:05):
like the Secret Archives, which I talked about, Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:22:08):
They have their own. Yeah, they have their own they
admit that they have faults.

Speaker 3 (01:22:15):
Yeah. I mean a lot of people will say, oh,
the Vatican, who cares about that? Well, how about the
Library of Nilanda, how about the Books of Tibet, the
Tibetan Book of the Dead. You've got Diana Walsh Pasalka
who got access to the Vatican secret libraries, and talk
about fifty miles or five hundred miles, whatever it is.
That's a lot of texts. That's a lot of stuff

(01:22:35):
that we don't see.

Speaker 2 (01:22:36):
Well, and they admit to you know, I just a
a solo episode and in it, this lady I can't
remember her name, it's in the episode, but she was
an author in the seventies, and they admitted to her
that they were hiding gnostic texts, specifically about this deity
because they didn't want and I quote a heretical uprising. Yeah,

(01:22:57):
and I admit it. Yeah, I don't care.

Speaker 3 (01:22:59):
I was working really hard. I just I have a
second project that I'm working on. That's why it's called
the project book series that I'm doing. And I was
in the middle of trying to go as far as
I could with that, like, I wanted to see how
far I could trace it. And when I got to
some things with Mormonism, I was I was right at

(01:23:21):
that time. I heard your podcast and it it flipped
the switch and I'm like, I have to start digging
into my own stuff. And the more I looked into
southeastern Pennsylvania, this this William Penn's they called it the
Brotherhood of Friends that the Quaker you know this area.
I think a lot of people use that as a

(01:23:43):
as a modern day or a current day for them,
a mask to say, hey, look, we're all, we're all Quakers,
We're all and when we're all the good guys. Yeah,
And I really I'm not at the eighteenth century yet,
but I really would say that by the time I
get there, I would have a name list of probably
five or six deep that I could send to you

(01:24:05):
and say, do any of these show up in Mormonism?
Because thank you? That's just weird.

Speaker 2 (01:24:09):
Well, and the fact that it's weird that you know
Ruth Payne part you know her her husband is the
child of one of the nine, okay, and then she
happens to be the one that's that where you know
Oswald's wife is living with and then she's a Quaker.
And then if you look into it all the declassified dumps,

(01:24:33):
you know, her dad is confirmed CIA, her sister's confirmed CIA.
I mean, come on, you know, And like you said,
it's it's a cover. It's a cover because there is
friendly it is.

Speaker 3 (01:24:45):
And it's an easy it's an easy way to discredit
and just say, oh, well, you know what, who cares? What?
What difference does it make? This and that? But in
the sixties and the seventies, the best thing we had
was I mean, I wasn't alive. I was, I was
born in the eighties. But paper and pen was a
really good way to write stuff down. You know. Computers

(01:25:06):
and general computers and home computers were coming in typewriters,
but everything had a paper trail. Yeah, and a lot
of and a lot of it was only for internal
use only. And we're seeing more and more. I like
I said, I was digging through a chain of custody
to try and see if I could somehow get to
the Vatican. And I went through about seven libraries across

(01:25:27):
the west to east, the north, the south of where
information could have went. When Alexandria burned, supposedly they even subject.
Whether or not that happened, I can't. I don't know,
but supposedly it did multiple times, and the last time
you can see a chain of custody of where those
documents would have gone to India, to Ethiopia, up to

(01:25:50):
into Ireland, into the Middle East Ireland. Yeah. Yeah, And
when we look at it from the modern day, how
how do we trace that? How do you how do
you do that? Well, you have to get your hands dirty,
and you have to try and put what little information
we have left together, or you have to be an
accredited scholar, I think, and wow.

Speaker 2 (01:26:11):
I don't think an accredited scholar would ever do it right.

Speaker 3 (01:26:15):
And that goes back to what a lot of people
talk about. I think it's less about changing the mindset
and more about losing your identity. When you are someone
who has spent forty years on the Pyramids and suddenly
we've got scans that are showing things beneath it, are
they real? I'd like to know, I really would. I

(01:26:37):
think we're at an age where the technology you can
do us.

Speaker 2 (01:26:40):
Yeah, who knows what they're gonna They never tell us.

Speaker 3 (01:26:43):
No, And if you change that then it's you know,
those people are going to really have a hard time saying, Okay,
I guess my entire life's work is over, you know,
I have to And what generation is that from the forties,
the fifties, the sixties. It's the same people, well that
we're covering it.

Speaker 2 (01:27:01):
Up in this in this book. Is it mostly circled
around this brethren, you know, the Brethren of Angels And yeah, Bhod,
my friends.

Speaker 3 (01:27:10):
I sincerely start this off with basically, just if anybody
does pick up my first one, I try to keep
I and me out of it as much as possible.
I don't use I statements, I don't use opinion. I
try and just use as much fact as I can.
Same with my second working one that I'm doing this one.

(01:27:31):
I'm taking a stance because I can physically visit these places, right,
you know, and I want to see and allow even
people that are in my family, like when I'm gone,
they can look back and go, hey, this is what
he wrote in twenty twenty five. I'm looking at it
now in twenty seventy five. Wow, things sure have changed
since you know sixteen ninety four.

Speaker 2 (01:27:53):
Well, and it's still history, you know, it's still history. Yeah,
And so the first one is called Project Red, Project
Red yep.

Speaker 3 (01:27:59):
The second and one doesn't have a title. It's still
in the works. But this one it'll keep that theme.
They're all going to be projects something probably a color. Yeah,
I don't know. But this is this is basically just
my take on you know, the hidden the hidden current
of information between you know, Kabbalah, you know, and these

(01:28:19):
mystics and this ancient order of I think the Rosicrucians,
uh and and I really feel like there's there's a
story to be told here, even if it's been told
multiple times in you know, ancient history, or in not
ancient history but our recent history. Yeah, it should be money.

Speaker 2 (01:28:40):
We still need to put it out there because you know,
somebody said to me the other day, a dear friend
of mine, He said, how many times do we have
to repeat the same conspiracies? And I said, well, it's
always new for the next people, though, you know exactly.
And and the problem is is they want you to forget,
you know, but we are already a nation of amnesia here.

(01:29:03):
I mean, you.

Speaker 3 (01:29:03):
Couldn't have said that any better. I said it the
same thing, and it's exactly what Graham Hancock says. We
are a species of living through amnesia. We don't remember
our own history. We don't remember our past and where
I know it sounds woo woo, but I think we
are being led to purposely do that because it makes

(01:29:27):
it easier to keep that narrative going of. This is
what we've been taught. Just keep it the way it is,
don't change, don't rock the boat. That's what my dad
always said, you know, don't rock the boat.

Speaker 2 (01:29:38):
Yeah, but then that net never fixes anything, right, right,
people are constantly telling me just shut up, like you
left the church to leave it alone. Okay, I have
a question. Then would you leave all these people in
a burning building if you really were, you know, led
to help people? I wouldn't. And so now you're not
going to leave it alone because it has to do
with more than religion, or I wouldn't be still going

(01:29:59):
on on and on. It's it's hidden history, it's hidden
a cult. It's it's not hidden that is occultism like
and and it doesn't always mean sacred weirdo rights, but
it usually does, right and and we know that we
know this always almost always goes back to sex. Let's
be real, and why why does it go back to sex.

(01:30:21):
It's not just about being perverted. That's not it.

Speaker 3 (01:30:23):
It doesn't have creation, it's energy. It's it's very very
uh hermetic. It's when when I started to look into
you know, magic, and I have. I've I've read as
much as I can that I can get my hands
on one magic and especially we've talked about them just here, Agrippa.

(01:30:45):
You know it's hard to read that material.

Speaker 2 (01:30:47):
I don't read it so hard, so hard, I don't
read it.

Speaker 3 (01:30:51):
But I can summarize it. I can dump it into
you know, chat, GPT, I can put it in Google
in a translator. I can try my best to get
and and view people who are on sources like YouTube
that are giving you a first hand experience. But you
know what, what's really interesting in that sense is that
it's it's it's all available too, like yeah, we can,

(01:31:13):
we can go look at it.

Speaker 2 (01:31:15):
Yep, it's right there. Well, it's that, you know, it's
it's the circuses, right, the Romans did it best? Are
you not entertained? Like we're busy watching reality TV? Yeah,
And here's that's how they want it.

Speaker 3 (01:31:31):
Talking about magic. That that right there. We're all interested
in the main the main hubs. You know, you've got
your sports entertainment, you've got your your theatrical entertainment. It's
all in orchestrated production to keep your energy and your focus. Well,
guess what these mages and wizards and mystics. Magic is
not sparkly Harry Potter. It is literally, if you talk

(01:31:53):
about what magic is, it is influencing reality one little
bit enough, even if it's enough to just nudge, influencing
reality into your favor. That's when you're pushing towards. And
when you've got fifty thousand people in a sporting arena chanting,
go this team, Go this team, and all of a sudden,

(01:32:15):
the ball arcs to the left when there's no wind,
and we just call it a miracle, or we say, oh,
I can't believe it did that. How can we discredit
the fact that maybe the energy is moving there. It's
woo woo, it's weird. But these occultists and these mystics
and these theosophists were talking about this and doing it.
John d was doing this, you know they and they do.

Speaker 2 (01:32:38):
His own peril too if you think he was lying.
People like this is what always bring up most of
these people like that were brave enough to do this.
Joseph Smith, John Dee. I will give a Joseph Smith
that he was brave. Okay, they did this at their
own cost of their lives. Like John d wasn't immediately,

(01:32:58):
but like he he really suffered after that whole thing,
and he had a raised freakin' Edward Kelly's kid, like.

Speaker 3 (01:33:04):
Yikes, didn't Yeah, I mean I've read somewhere didn't Joseph
Smith's father after after he went for the plates and
he got smacked by the toad and all that wonderful.
I love the stories and I love reading it because
it's to me, it is not It's not a bunch
of malarkey. You're born. Yes, you're interacting with a non
physical intelligence that is telling him to do things that

(01:33:28):
his father. Didn't they go dig up the brother, didn't
they go dig up?

Speaker 2 (01:33:31):
Oh they did that, they did that before. Yeah, And
I find it interesting that, look, this family's involved in magic.
The mother's Irish, he's you know, half Irish, half English,
and the dad's very involved in things. He's the one
that's you know, from Massachusetts. His great grandpa was involved
in the Inquisition and had Mary Easte hung and all

(01:33:55):
this weird stuff. And we know that the people that
were the accusers back then were often the ones doing
the thing. Yeah, and so I find it strange that
all of a sudden, you know, this thing comes, but
not just appears. He asked it to come. He was

(01:34:16):
doing rituals for it to come every year on the
fall equinox, exactly when Martinists will, you know, channel beings
on the fall and spring equinox. This is this is
one hundred percent. So it explains a lot, you know,
for me, because I truly believe he was involved in
either that order or some Egyptian right order. Okay, And

(01:34:38):
so he's channeling this thing and it comes and it says,
bring your brother, and then the brother dies. Well we
know this, it's the oldest brother. It he dies, and
then his wife goes in the brothers stead, but they
did dig him up before he goes back. And so
people always joke that, you know, his oldest brother probably

(01:34:59):
had a hand in Mormonism, because you know, ha ha,
we know that that happened. And in a Faustian bargain,
what is the biggest price, it's not money. What is
the most expensive thing you can pay it's it's your children,
and a girl is not as expensive as a boy,
and you know your firstborn is the most expensive, which

(01:35:22):
hence sleeping beauty, hence all these dumb fairy tales we read.
They're not just you know they're not. And so he pays,
the father does, and then the wife gets pregnant shortly
after all this with the angel dressed in black at
like in the middle of the night, with a black
horse and everything super not Christian sounding whatever, And her

(01:35:47):
first baby is born and it was severely deformed, only
lived a few moments, and they name it the dead
brother's name.

Speaker 3 (01:35:55):
Yeah, that's a little, that's a little. The names are important,
even in my they'll tell you that. Look at the
solemnonic magic, names are important.

Speaker 2 (01:36:03):
He was practicing that and no folk magic.

Speaker 3 (01:36:07):
Yeah exactly. And when you talk about conviction to what
you're doing, I I can't escape that. Like I said,
magic is influencing reality. You have to believe in and
convict yourself to that mentality for you to go dig
up your brother. That that's really like, Okay, this thing
told me I have to use him. He already corrected

(01:36:27):
me a couple times. I don't want to make a
mad again. I better go.

Speaker 2 (01:36:30):
And they ran it in the paper. They've ran it
in the newspaper three times. They were sleeping by his
dead grave for six weeks. You know, I mean, come on,
you know.

Speaker 3 (01:36:41):
It's surface level. You don't you don't get into that
unless you really dig. And when you compare that and
I in my in my book, I call it the
quote unquote, and I feel like there should be a
fan fair behind it. It's like the lens of possibility
when you look at Joseph Smith from the idea of
this guy was talking to something, whatever it was, you

(01:37:03):
can't give it a human definition.

Speaker 2 (01:37:06):
Well, and here's something fun for you to put in
your research. The templars built a temple and would put
the Golden Goddess up in the courtyard and so they
could go be out there in midday and be, you know,

(01:37:28):
around this thing and it's it's like a statue and
what is what is Maroni? It's a golden statue on
top of the Danetown temples, right smack in the middle
of all of them, on a steeple. Like I'm sorry,
but people, every time I go down that road, that
particular road, like this is templar stuff and they're like, no,
it isn't, and I'm like, yes it is.

Speaker 3 (01:37:52):
They definitely had their what we classify as magic now
I think was more or less a form of communication
with something that I try my best. This is this
is some ineffable stuff. And I say that, I say
this is ineffable shit. When you talk about something that
has the ability to not only manipulate perception of your

(01:38:14):
consciousness not purposely, it's it's like almost like a what's
the best analogy? You could say something that that does
something without knowing it's doing it, but it affects you
in a way that you don't like it. You can't
say that you if it's manipulating my perception just because
it exists, it may not know it's doing it. These
things that love to communicate with prophets and people, and

(01:38:39):
even I will say and go as far as to
suggest that this Golden Goddess. You know, we've got people
right now right now named Chris Bledsoe who interacts with
a golden goddess. They talk about her being known as
hathor these these are real things that have gone through history,
Like are they are these things that interacting with people

(01:39:03):
because they can sense that their perception can be.

Speaker 2 (01:39:07):
Or are they bringing them here? Are they bringing exactly here?
And that to me is so And here's the thing too,
about me popping on the scene, because this is going
into I'm like two and a half years in. It
took me a really long time to get on some
of the bigger podcasts, and I think that it's because

(01:39:28):
I have no sponsor, I have no agenda. I just
was like, this is what I got to do because
I'm praying about this a lot and I believe in God,
and this is what's up, and you know, I need
to expose this why I got picked. I have no clue,
Like honestly, I'm not all that great, Like it doesn't
make any sense. But and I even didn't want to,

(01:39:49):
Like I was like, this is stupid, Like this is
I'm not a podcast. I'm a mom and I'm a nurse,
you know.

Speaker 3 (01:39:57):
Exactly a job go to.

Speaker 2 (01:40:00):
I thought it was weird. I was like, this is
so weird, and I knew I was going to get
a lot of shit for it, and I did, you know,
and still do. But then, like my husband said the
other day, what I was telling you, like if you're
truly doing this for God to help people out of
the burning building. Then what about the people, like, even
if it's one in a hundred, the comment you helped me,

(01:40:22):
I see this now blah blah blah, and they're coming
out or not going in or whatever's happening there. And
so I'm like, yeah, that's the whole point, you know,
for me. And I think, yeah, I think that's hard
for people to understand because there are a lot of
people are in this for money, a lot of people
are in this for fame. A lot of people just

(01:40:43):
want to you know, make themselves into something like some
amazing thing. And if that happens for me, great, But
if I just save people, that's better for me.

Speaker 3 (01:40:54):
Yeah. And then I really do admire the fact that
the information you are putting out there, it's helping to
organize thoughts and data streams that otherwise just become loose ends.
And it's hard today with the culture we live in

(01:41:15):
that is a it's a to now culture, not today,
not tomorrow. I want it to now and I want
it immediately. Information is no different. And when you sit
down and spend a good four hours researching something as
a podcast or as an author or as any type
of creative you almost feel like it's not enough because

(01:41:36):
there's so much information you're trying to go through and
you just no one person can do it.

Speaker 2 (01:41:41):
No. And when you get a tie like you sending
in to me, I'm like, oh, okay, this makes sense,
you know, like this has to correlate. I'm sure it will,
you know somehow. Like you said, you know, these are
all magical orders that broke off into their own thing.
I am convinced of that, you know.

Speaker 3 (01:42:01):
Yeah, And I really I feel like that the more
people that know our history isn't And I say this
with with very a very great deal of respect. I
did not like history in school. I didn't like social studies,
and I didn't like learning about it. When you actually
look at what's there beneath the surface, it really starts

(01:42:23):
to open up this world of immense possibility that even
the people who are pseudoscientists or speculative, you know, armchair
philosophers like myself, I feel like there's enough enough information
that you can honestly say, if it's real, then let's
let's let's amend some things.

Speaker 2 (01:42:45):
And that's when you're going to get pushed back, because
the thing is, these orders didn't die, you know.

Speaker 3 (01:42:51):
Exactly, They just doesn't. They just changed.

Speaker 2 (01:42:53):
These orders are absolutely running podcasting, they're running the news,
they're running your church. And I know what I sound like, like,
I know that sounds crazy, but I'm telling you it's true.

Speaker 3 (01:43:11):
Yeah, like you just said earlier, that the reason why
you do this and the reason you know, we come from.
If I have to, I will say I'm the folk
magic guy. I am. I'm I'm a wild man from
the woods of the Wissa Hict. Yes, i am. I
live up here. It's you know, and my grandparents, they know,
they talked about that stuff. You have the spiritual side.

(01:43:32):
But you know what's funny is they change over time.
Have you ever heard of the Puritans? Of course, okay, okay,
Now have you heard of something called Unitarianism?

Speaker 2 (01:43:45):
Universalism that was this great grandpa was a Universalist.

Speaker 3 (01:43:50):
So they actually get their roots back to the Puritans.
And I did not realize that. And the more I'm
looking at the h the American Church of Universalists and
the versions that are in Europe and over in the
Western world, they're all dating back. That's another one of these.

(01:44:12):
The Quakers, the Pitists, the Amish, the Mennonites, they just
they change and they're still here. They are still here.

Speaker 2 (01:44:23):
Absolutely, they didn't go anywhere. And people will just say
to me, well, don't you think, Heidi, that it's easier
to explain all this stuff that Joseph Smith was just
high on mushrooms. And I'm like, maybe he was, but
I don't think that's why this happened, right, Like that
is part of a sacrament that you probably don't understand.
But sure, go read Andrea Pouhari's Mushroom book and come

(01:44:46):
back and we'll have a talk about it.

Speaker 3 (01:44:48):
You know, I was very interested in mushrooms as he was.

Speaker 2 (01:44:52):
He really was.

Speaker 3 (01:44:53):
He had a lot of connections down in Mexico that
he was connected with that were trying to get him
the different forms of psychedelics that he could use in
his research with people up in the round.

Speaker 2 (01:45:05):
Table and who went to Chihuahua, Mexico and settled it Mormons.
The Romney's.

Speaker 3 (01:45:13):
Now is that the same Romney that? Yes, sir, oh,
oh boy, you know who was the Universalist? You said
that was?

Speaker 2 (01:45:22):
Oh yeah, that was his I'll double check on the name.
It was his grandpa. I believe it was wow.

Speaker 3 (01:45:29):
See, and that's something I found. I found through uh
just just I'm looking at things that go away, and
they don't go away, they just disappear, but they grow
into something bigger, or they they shift some things around.
And then, as I love to say, through that lens
of possibility, you compare it to what the government does

(01:45:51):
with disclosure and what they fund. They shuffle things around
every couple of years and make sure that you don't
dig up to it get real close. But the stuff
that you don't need to see, we'll make sure that
that's in enough pieces that you won't figure it out.

Speaker 2 (01:46:07):
Yeah. It's just silly to me that you know, all
this stuff is buried, and I just think that when
we're looking at all of it, why do the same
players always come up like this? This absolutely Mormonism follows
very closely Jehovah's Witnesses, which follows very closely with other things.

(01:46:29):
And no wonder right like what was the uncle's name
at Dartmouth professor Johnny Smith? It was not an uncle.
It was a cousin through his grandparents, and it is documented.
People say, no, no, no, he was into Armenian studies. Wow,
he was a professor of languages, and he was really

(01:46:51):
into all this weird stuff and he was the rare bookstealer.
But no, they'll say, that's not the same one. Yes,
it is through both sides of the family as a
distant cousin. So I don't care how distant it was,
you know. Then Hiram Smith goes to that college where
he is teaching at the Church of Christ, the very

(01:47:13):
first one out there was ran by Professor Johnny Smith,
and he's got all this really crazy doctrine which people
can read online. And then you go, yeah, okay, you know.
And then they're like, well, then Joseph Smith copied it
from that. No, he taught them the key to do
these things themselves. Even even that story with they try

(01:47:38):
to debunk it all the time. Oh my gosh, I
can't remember the name of it right now. Samuel something.
They always say he stole it from him. No, he
went to the same college. They were required to go
to this church thing three times a day. I mean,
they were studying to be pastors basically to the Native Americans.
So and they're like, well, it's not the same thing

(01:47:58):
as Dartmouth. It's called wheel lock, weel lock is.

Speaker 3 (01:48:01):
When you need to Sam Alkham, Okay, yeah, I got
off writing everything down.

Speaker 2 (01:48:06):
Yeah, wheel Locke is a big one for you. And
so why did he even start that school? And why
is there a Native American that helped him do it?
Aukham Samuel Lockham, and why does he why does he
retire to Oneida? What you know, like, come on, get
out of here with all that, Like that's crazy, that's crazy.

Speaker 3 (01:48:27):
And you're in the same exact wheelhouse I am when
you look at what was happening at the time and
who was interacting with with whom I said it just
a couple of days ago to one of my friends,
I said, you know, in sixteen ninety, I wasn't there.
I can't test for any of this, but I do
know that what I've been taught is that there was

(01:48:48):
pretty much Massachusetts, Boston and the New England side, and
then there was Philadelphia, like that was going to be
the capital of the country. They pretty pretty much all agreed,
like let's make Philadelphia Washington, DC. So travel kind of
went to and from the East coast along that line
from Philadelphia to Boston. All those people intermingled, and those thinkers.

(01:49:14):
It wasn't as quiet as we think today, like, oh,
you all had to ride a horse talk to somebody,
and no, I think they had a lot better communication
than we think. And when I realized that the Mormons
were up there doing witchcraft and in Salem area, and like,
you know, how far does it go? And I have
to say this is one hundred percent speculation. I'm also

(01:49:36):
a cryptid guy, like I like Bigfoot, I like all that.
Have you ever heard of the story of the Jersey Devil? Yeah?

Speaker 2 (01:49:44):
I don't think so.

Speaker 3 (01:49:45):
Okay, Well, in New Jersey there's the Pine Barrens. Long
story short, there's mother Leads. She has her thirteenth child,
it's deformed, it's cursed, and she gives birth to this
being the Jersey Devil. I'm butchering this. It's haunted the
Pine Barrens of New Jersey ever since. Okay, great Leads.
That's a very interesting name. I mean, it's just I

(01:50:08):
don't I don't want to say it's popular, but it's
it's a name. And I couldn't help but notice that
in the book I'm reading, it says yeah, and I'm
gonna quote it because it was funny when it stood
out to me. I'm like, holy shit, I'm like, is
this the Jersey Devil? Okay, So it says right here,
this is a footnote that Sachs puts. He goes Daniel
Leeds was a resident of New Jersey as early as

(01:50:30):
sixteen seventy six. He lived in Burlington in sixteen eighty
and he was married at the Friends Meeting Place in
sixteen eighty one. Now it goes on to say a
whole bunch of other crap about it. But I'm I'm like,
is that the Leeds family of Jersey? I can't confirm
or deny because I can't find a genealogy tree. I

(01:50:51):
can't trace it unless you're gonna unless you're gonna put
your credit card in and you're gonna sign up for
a whole bunch of stuff. That pretty much where does
all that DNA research go? I think I think our
good buddy, uh Bill Gates has a couple of investments
in a few DNA researches. You know.

Speaker 2 (01:51:08):
Oh yeah, it gets concerning, It gets very concerning.

Speaker 3 (01:51:12):
But that that I laughed at that. I'm like, could
this be one of those like those names where you're like,
how common was it? And in the area? Geez, that's
that stands out.

Speaker 2 (01:51:23):
It made me laugh well and and oh I did
find that piece that you wanted. It was his his
grandfather Oziel and Mary Dudy Smith were Universalists before the
organization of the church.

Speaker 3 (01:51:36):
And what a name tool that's not anything.

Speaker 2 (01:51:42):
Yeah, And you know the thing about it is is
when we go down these branches of families, like most
of the people coming over here were related in some
form or fashion. If they had the same last name,
they the same thing with this whole school and bones
and they that helps farm it is something taft blah blah.

(01:52:03):
And then we have Ezra Taft Benson and they're like,
but they weren't related though, don't worry about it. And
I'm like, yes, they were, like it, but we can't
prove it. And just like these Quaker roots, like I'm
sure this is going to go into now you know,
does this go back into the like nowadays? Like does

(01:52:23):
this go into you know, I.

Speaker 3 (01:52:25):
Write family, I can walk over there right now. I'm
a stone's throw away from the actual like houses. He
walked through the libraries that have books from there, and
it's it's exactly how you would think these Quakers lived,
like it is very quaint, it's quiet, it's old. It's
all stone masonry again, all hand done brick and mortar,

(01:52:49):
all the gravestones, the fences, everything's all brick and mortar.
The Quaker meeting house for friends like, it's very much
as it would have been. And like I said, I
think that original group, I think they're still intact. I
really do. I think that mentality of what they sought
was there. But like anything else, I think they were,

(01:53:09):
for lack of a better word, I think they were
impregnated with a bunch of different organizations and people that
use them as a cover story to get here and
to set roots and then kind of branch off because
I even I write about that that the Kethians broke
away from the Quakers after that meteor didn't happen, after
they realized, like, this is a bunch of bullshit. The
millennium is just going to be seventeen hundred. That's it.

(01:53:30):
Let's go do our own thing.

Speaker 2 (01:53:32):
I think that's kind of And I swear one of
the main I can't remember, and I always forget one
of the main people that helped the founding of the church.
And I want to say it's Sydney rigged in. I
think one of them were involved in one of these
Puritan movements. I can't remember which one. I'll have to look.

Speaker 3 (01:53:51):
But there are so many too. There were so many.

Speaker 2 (01:53:55):
Bringing but bringing that connection where even if on this
surface level they don't look connected, look back then, these
interpersonal connections were everything. Everything was on a handshake, everything
was on who you were, who you knew, or what
you did. Like this was all serious. It wasn't just

(01:54:17):
like now where we don't even talk to our neighbors,
you know.

Speaker 3 (01:54:20):
And you couldn't have put it any more beautifully, because
I can't articulate that any better, but to say that
in my own research, we have documents from these people
trying to dig through these records and saying like, at
the time of William Penn, there's no land records. He
just gave these guys one hundred and fifty acres out

(01:54:40):
in the Fairmount Park area. He's like, yeah, you just
go ahead, and that was their agreement. We agree that
your mentality in mind is the same. We're being persecuted
over here, we're being burned at the steak. People are dying.
I've got land. He gave it to them and then
when all of these brothers died off, there's no there's
a land grab. There's people that tried to rush in

(01:55:01):
and preserve it, and there's people who to this day
the foundations and stuff are there, and it's a park
that you can go and walk through. But I just
it's so fascinating that that they all connect. Yeah, and
you can go look at it still and people just
drive by it day by day by day and no

(01:55:23):
connection to how deep it really goes. And it's it's
our history. It really is.

Speaker 2 (01:55:28):
It's a history.

Speaker 3 (01:55:28):
That blended with I think on more than enough levels.
It was. It was really the whole spiritual, gnostic mystical
movement that in the nineteenth century kind of everyone gravitated towards.

Speaker 2 (01:55:44):
That's for sure. Yeah, the Fox Sisters and the Pooh
Harrics and all this weird stuff that was happening like it. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:55:53):
Yeah, I will say you said one thing on your
last podcast about Crowley that I wanted to mention. I
don't know if you follow Twitter. I don't. I stay
off of Twitter x whatever you call it something, how
much I stay on it is, I still call it Twitter.
But there was an ex post by uh A whistleblower,
and he started throwing out, uh magic stuff. Now, I

(01:56:16):
don't know if you've read into it, but do you
know about the Book of Abermelon Uh huh, yeah, the
Abermelon ritual that probably had done.

Speaker 2 (01:56:26):
I think Joseph Smith did as well.

Speaker 3 (01:56:28):
Okay, well that to me. I'll end on this because
I know we've I don't want to keep drawing ont tangents.
But he posted all this stuff about this Abermelon ritual
and he's a former government supposed whistleblower. And there's also
a person.

Speaker 2 (01:56:46):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (01:56:47):
I don't want to give drop names unless you want
me to. I can quote who they.

Speaker 2 (01:56:50):
Are, but yeah, yeah, I love to follow.

Speaker 3 (01:56:52):
Yeah, he's I'm sorry. He's got a YouTube channel lighting
the lamp, I think, okay, and he's come out and
talked about how he's the inspiration of this guy talking
about all this occultic magic. And he speaks heavily on
John D. Nunki in magic, but to the point where
he's like, guys, this is I'm showing you in real

(01:57:15):
time how I'm doing this. And he documents his interactions
with these angelic beings. It's it's wild stuff, but you've
got a whistleblower now that's talking about this in government. Wow.

Speaker 2 (01:57:30):
Well, and they've all had these psychics constantly, like Reagan did,
and uh, what's his name did, the one that got
thrown out and then peached Nix, Nixon did, And they've
all bought these, you know, psychic people, so they obviously care.

Speaker 3 (01:57:53):
I mean, you know, any other way of saying it
fits it best, I think it would be look at
the right hand while you don't watch what the left
hand is doing. They are secretly telling you to not
pay attention to all of this very important stuff while
systematically funding it to the tune of whatever they feel

(01:58:14):
like it's a blank check. Yeah, and it's and it's everywhere,
it really is. And I think I think that's what
I mean by people are really starting to take notice
because I think the fascination of going, I want more
of this, this is this is more important to me
than football. This is more important to me than you know,
what I'm doing this weekend at you know the beach. Right,

(01:58:35):
people are finding their passions like they did back in
the early Renaissance in fifteen to sixteenth centuries.

Speaker 2 (01:58:40):
And I hope, I hope that's true for most people,
because I mean I see a fifty to fifty split.
I see people that absolutely do not want to know,
do not disrupt my view of reality, you know, because
then it's scary to them, right, Like like that whole
question where people or like don't you think he was

(01:59:01):
just high? Because that's explains everything? And I'm like, why
why did Carl Jung speak about seven Sermons of the Dead?
Like no, he would channel the book from facilities? What
do you mean? Like even the highest of the high
academics are doing this stuff, you know, like what why
were why were they doing that? What's happening there? Yeah?

(01:59:24):
Like what is what is that?

Speaker 3 (01:59:26):
And how did how do you interpret something like those
Pouharic interviews where somebody who is going in there that's
already had I mean, I can't remember all of them,
but I know I think Phylis Schlemmer was one of them. Uh,
there was There were a few psychics that had already
proven their ability was sound, and they were going there

(01:59:47):
to push Pooharic. They wanted to see if he was
doing things. And when they were going into these trances
and speaking in these seances, they were offering information that
they should not have access to They names like like
Adam and Tom, I am Tom, and I am the
nine Divine Principles. And that goes all the way back
to Vedic texts in India with the Maharabata or whatever.

(02:00:10):
There's so much there with the nine Unknown Men, it's crazy.

Speaker 2 (02:00:16):
And so with the Quakers, did they mention any of this,
like or was it just the guy? Like I know
they said brotherhood of Angels, Like was everybody talking to
angels or just them?

Speaker 3 (02:00:27):
I don't think so. I don't think so. I think
it was mainly, like I said, the rosen Roth to
the Zimmermann coster Bridge. That's they met at a college
and then they started this forty family group and when
they got over here, they prophesied that the millennium was
going to change some stuff. And they were out in
the woods doing this. But they were the only ones

(02:00:48):
really communicating with astrology and the heavens and celestial stuff
and referring to you know, from what I've read, the
Divine Wisdom and Sophia.

Speaker 2 (02:01:00):
Yeah, the Quakers stuff, probably it would document that.

Speaker 3 (02:01:06):
But I do know that the cave that still exists
in the park that.

Speaker 2 (02:01:11):
They say funny it was a cave. It was you
got to look up the Sydney Rigged and stuff. He
was a Campbell Lighte. They were doing stuff in caves
too with Joseph Smith.

Speaker 3 (02:01:19):
Just so you know, oh man, how do you spell it?
Do you know? Can't?

Speaker 2 (02:01:24):
Yeah, Campbell Lighte and just like Campbell the last name
and then I and then he Sidney rigged In. That's that.
But Joseph Smith and Sidney rigged In were in caves
doing they don't know.

Speaker 3 (02:01:38):
Well, that's I can't say that they know that the
location of the cave is there. There's also a manner
that sits in the park that's supposed to commemorate something
to do with the revolutionary were because there's an account
from the Hessian soldiers that were here during the revolutionary times,

(02:01:58):
and one of them is quoted as saying that there
is the tabernacle of Kelp and that was his original
name leaving the souls Boch area, he was Johannes Kelp.
So the Hessians who were fighting in the revolutionary were
even acknowledged that that location was where the original Germans
came over here from. So it was kind of like

(02:02:19):
a nod of being like, okay, we're gonna blow stuff up.
Let's let's not blow up some people. You know, let's
not mess with these guys. They're kind of from our town.
But they acknowledged that they were there in those woods
when they marched through, you know, the Philadelphia area, and
they were coming through and.

Speaker 2 (02:02:34):
The woods too with the golden bough and everything like that.

Speaker 3 (02:02:38):
Could you imagine that could grove.

Speaker 2 (02:02:40):
Too, the same you know Joseph and the Sacred Grove
and there.

Speaker 3 (02:02:45):
They have a sacred orchard and that's where he's supposedly buried.

Speaker 2 (02:02:49):
Mm hmm.

Speaker 3 (02:02:50):
Him and his father.

Speaker 2 (02:02:52):
Marmons have a sacred grove with the witness trees.

Speaker 3 (02:02:56):
It's always sacred, isn't it.

Speaker 2 (02:02:58):
Well, that's because they're they're usually irish er some form
of you know, pagan worship is happening there.

Speaker 3 (02:03:07):
I really it's really cool to me, Like I I
look at what is still there, and I wonder if
even as far back as I can, I can trace
the writers that we're talking about it say, we don't
know if these are the original locations for the Cabins.
And I mean there was a spring that fed up
through the colony that they could drink from and people

(02:03:29):
would come from all over just to come get you know, prophecies.
And it was really interesting to know that right where
I've lived my entire life, this was happening and I
had no idea it was under my nose and how
it connected to everything else I work in it just
it really threw me for a loop, and I said,

(02:03:50):
this is worth stopping what I'm doing and digging into
because it's I can go visit these places and be here.
It's great.

Speaker 2 (02:03:57):
And they're all the same caves now and you know
these groves, these certain you know, early works of angel
stuff in all of them. And so I mean, we
have to look at it because I'm sure out of
these movements, I'm assuming with the Quakers, I'm not sure
you know, the influential people came out of this to

(02:04:20):
move it because they still exist, like you said, like
to move it forward. I don't know what happened.

Speaker 3 (02:04:25):
Yeah, I mean there's in this area there's a lot
of like the Lutheran Faith. Uh there there are still
like in it's called Old Folsington, that's the location, but
it still has the original Quaker pens meetinghouse. I remember
they used to have live bands down at the bottom
of the old barnhouse. You could go and they would

(02:04:46):
have kids play local bands there. Uh you know, we
called it Sacred Grounds. It was, it's still it was.
It was a part of our community and the people
that live there. When you when you walk through, it's
like you look at the house is wow, it's all
it's all original.

Speaker 2 (02:05:04):
It's so they do they have sacred rights like titles stuff,
you know, like special stuff.

Speaker 3 (02:05:13):
I've considered going and just maybe doing a Sunday church
and just going in and sitting down and seeing what
it's like, because it really, to me, you can't fully understand. Yeah,
they were talking about unless you see it in action, and.

Speaker 2 (02:05:26):
Well, they're going to hide it because we get back
to that whole uninitiated, initiated elite, which is why you know,
one world religion is going to have to happen. I
mean it already has. It's just they keep a secret,
you know, all of the elect from each section. I

(02:05:48):
mean we see it, you know, but their s handshakes
and whatever sometimes.

Speaker 3 (02:05:53):
And that's what I think right there, you you highlight
that exactly when I saw the connection between for Wit
and Benjamin Franklin and knowing what I know about him
just from school. I mean he he was in Brothels,
he was in France, he was in Germany. Everywhere he
could go. He was intermingling with very important people, and

(02:06:13):
he was a member of every society he could get
his hands on.

Speaker 2 (02:06:17):
He's so funny.

Speaker 3 (02:06:18):
He followed Isaac Newton, and Newton was a.

Speaker 2 (02:06:20):
Rosicrucian, right right, Yeah.

Speaker 3 (02:06:24):
And we know that. We know that because there are
notations of Francis Bacon in Newton's logs. I mean they
intermingled and they wrote together, and they wrote forwards and
things in their books, and they talk to each other.
So how do we process this when we're just saying, uh,

(02:06:45):
you know, the founding fathers just had had they just wanted.

Speaker 2 (02:06:47):
Independence, right oh yeah right?

Speaker 3 (02:06:50):
Or did they have a lot more knowledge that we
just don't know about.

Speaker 2 (02:06:54):
And still do? These are like select families, you.

Speaker 3 (02:06:59):
Know, I call the modern day Vatican Secret Archive. I
call that the Smithsonian Institute. I really do. We've learned
that they have a lot of stuff that you give
them receipts and they say, oh, we've lost that.

Speaker 2 (02:07:16):
Yeah, thanks for the information though.

Speaker 3 (02:07:18):
Yeah. And they're also an entity that can't be altered
or manipulated we can't FOIA request them, we can't see
their archives. They exist kind of as their own little
independent and.

Speaker 2 (02:07:29):
Just like the Vatican.

Speaker 3 (02:07:31):
Yeah, so I'll tell you what, it's fun to play
with this stuff. I like looking at old books. I
like looking at once from like eighteen forty in American
History when you type in the word giants and it's
got thirty to forty references of people out in the
mid Utah area, Arizona, and they're talking about footprints and

(02:07:51):
giants and stuff, and the Smithsonian Institute they send stuff
away in the book and then they just go, we
don't know.

Speaker 2 (02:08:00):
Oh, we don't know.

Speaker 3 (02:08:02):
But you can't go in there because if you go
in the Grand Canyon, you're going to hurt the bat population.
So don't go in the case.

Speaker 2 (02:08:08):
Yeah, yeah, the bats. The bats will be upset about it.
Wild Well, these are definitely connections that I'm excited to
see where the second book goes for sure, so that
we can see like exactly you know where this is
taking us. And it seems like you're on a hot
trail for sure. Seems like it's going to play out.

Speaker 3 (02:08:28):
Yeah, determined. Yeah, Like I said, I'd have to get
this out of my head, so I dump it into
a you know, a format I can collaborate into long form,
which is it's a book. If people want to play
along and ride the ride. I think there's enough enough
reason to speculate that maybe we should just move that
needle a little bit forward towards this isn't conspiracy, but

(02:08:49):
perhaps part of our collective history. And and I really
think we need to look.

Speaker 2 (02:08:54):
At it closer, definitely for those elites. If we ever
want to see what's happening, we kind of have to
know who's leading what.

Speaker 3 (02:09:04):
And so the good man, the ugly, it's all there.

Speaker 2 (02:09:07):
Yep, sounds like it. Well, awesome, This has been fun.
We've definitely gone down the road and tried to pull
this all apart. So I think it'll be interesting when
you when you get through it, to see exactly what
you find. I bet you're going to find a lot
of weird stuff.

Speaker 3 (02:09:23):
I sure, well, I'm going to email you and try
and get a couple names that I can sure Mormons
are in here, because I really feel like they are.

Speaker 2 (02:09:31):
I'm certain they probably are. So with that, let people
know where to find you, where you want to be contacted,
and where that book is all right.

Speaker 3 (02:09:40):
I mean my only handle that I have. I mean
I have one email, and that is the Projectbook series
at gmail dot com. It's just it's a way for
people who right now. This is the first time I've
talked to anybody. If you want to buy it, read it,
talk to me, ask me questions, throw me hate mail.
There's the email. You can do what you want. I

(02:10:02):
chose to come here because something like you said, spiritually
told you to do a podcast to help people. If
the building's on fire, there's people in there. I felt
like the second you pulled me out of my world
of what I was doing, and basically ninety degreed me.
I said, that's where I need to go. And it's

(02:10:24):
led me to so much more. You have helped me
to actually write more than I thought.

Speaker 2 (02:10:28):
But well, thank you. I think it's really important for
the history of America. I really do so.

Speaker 3 (02:10:35):
And other than that, the book as it's self published
on Amazon. You can look it up. It's Project Read
subtitle and infamous Esoteric Reality.

Speaker 2 (02:10:44):
I called it.

Speaker 3 (02:10:46):
It's m Allen you you can get it. I haven't
done an audio because i'm you know, I'm a normal
person too, just like you.

Speaker 2 (02:10:54):
You're a baby.

Speaker 3 (02:10:55):
Yeah's life, work, family, you know, recording audio is hard.

Speaker 2 (02:11:00):
Yeah, it is true, and I mean eventually you probably will,
but especially if you're writing your next book, it's probably
not the first thing, you know.

Speaker 3 (02:11:08):
Yeah, and that's why I just, like I said, I
wasn't trying to put this out anywhere. It's there. It's
been there for over a year, right, you know. I
just now was the time that I felt like it.
It just it connected everything I looked into over the
last couple of years, and this Mormon into Quakerism, into Rosicrucians.
It's like it's all it leads into everything.

Speaker 2 (02:11:32):
Oh yeah, these are the Founding Fathers or nothing. If
they're not esoteric, we'll just say that.

Speaker 3 (02:11:40):
I agree. And I think if you keep an eye
out for your inbox, I'm probably going to send you
tons of stuff and hopefully try And that's good margin
with more.

Speaker 2 (02:11:47):
I like it because it always you know, wherever I
go on my podcast, people say, why did you go
look up that weird thing that you know? If it
strikes my fancy, I just that's what I do. So
I never really have I guess an agenda where I'm
going next. I just go there wherever, and same thing
with guests, same thing with me going on other podcasts,

(02:12:08):
Like it's all led. You know, if you listen, things
will come to you whatever you're supposed to do, just
like it did for you. So absolutely, yeah, I think
this is good and maybe this is the time that
it needs to be. I mean it may have been
out their year, but like I think you're right, people
are waking up more. Obviously my audience is really involved
in stuff like this, so I think they'll like this.

(02:12:29):
I appreciate you.

Speaker 3 (02:12:30):
Thank you. You're very well coming on. Thank you. I
didn't honestly, I didn't know if you were a real
person or not. I just yeah, it was hard to
reach out and when I got the response back, I'm like, no,
this is hey, this is someone who I think I
really will blend with. And it's been a wonderful experience.

Speaker 2 (02:12:50):
Thank you. It was a fun one for me too.
And see we've even gotten into universalism. Now you're going
to go spinning down that road with with the az
l oh no.

Speaker 3 (02:13:00):
Zasil.

Speaker 2 (02:13:03):
I'm just kidding. Well, thanks again for all your time.
You guys, you got to check out his stuff. I'm
sure you're going to see more and who knows, maybe
he'll be running his own stuff podcasting one day. You
just never know. You did great at it so well.

Speaker 3 (02:13:16):
Thank you.

Speaker 2 (02:13:17):
There you go yep, and I will put all your
links in the show notes. Please check out his book,
you guys, and thank you so much for coming on. Bye.

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242. Society of Secret History

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