June 19, 2025 • 34 mins
In this episode, we turn the tables on our usual host YS Chi, who becomes our guest for the week. Join us as Márcia Balisciano, RELX Chief Sustainability Officer and Global Head of Corporate Responsibility, poses the questions to reveal fascinating insights from 20 years of curiosity, learning and working with great people at RELX.
YS Chi, RELX Director of Corporate Affairs shares with Márcia what we mean by our Unique Contributions. As he celebrates two decades at RELX, YS reflects on how the company has evolved, what drives the business to focus on corporate responsibility and how we define it. He discusses responsible AI, the future of print, and his vision for the future. Along the way, YS shares advice for the next generation of future leaders and thoughts on who we are as a company.
The video version of this episode is available at https://youtu.be/-i71SXhpBfg
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
YS Chi (00:00):
The Unique Contributions Podcast is brought to you by
RELX. Find out more about us byvisiting relx.com.
We still live in a world in which too many people judge us by what we do and where we are, and I think a better measurement is how well we do what we choose to do.
Márcia Balisciano (00:41):
Welcome to the Unique Contributions
podcast. My name is MárciaBalisciano, and I am head of
corporate responsibility atRELX. I am really delighted to
turn the tables on your usualhost, YS Chi, a distinguished
colleague celebrating 20 yearsat RELX. I wanted to start YS,
(01:06):
with asking the question that weask everyone, which is to
introduce yourself.
YS Chi (01:12):
Hello, everyone. My name is Youngsuk Chi, and I asked to
just call me YS to make iteasier. It's become my
professional name since about 40years ago. I originally come
from Korea, but as a child of acareer diplomat, I only got to
live in Korea for four years ofmy life during my youth. I've
worked and lived in over a dozencountries across all the
(01:34):
continents, and had the fortuneof experiencing the finance
sector, the IT industry, thedistribution industry and now
publishing industry, which thenhas transformed itself into a
content based analytics andtools businesses that leverage
the latest technology, like AI.
(01:57):
So as you so kindly acknowledgein your email to me this
weekend, I'm celebrating my 20thanniversary here at Elsevier and
RELX, this week.
Márcia Balisciano (02:05):
That's wonderful, YS. I wondered, given
that you have had adistinguished career at RELX and
before joining us at otherorganisations, how have you kept
motivated?
YS Chi (02:24):
I would say, what keeps me going and motivated is a
combination of, on one hand, thelove of being around great
people. And second is the habitof asking a lot of questions
because of my curiosity. WhenI'm around great people that are
good at what they do and arecurious like I am, I just seem
(02:46):
to be learning all the time. AndI have to say, even now, I've
learned so much during theswitching of the five industry
sectors, but the pace of thelearning that I do now is
actually accelerating the pastfew years, then it is slowing
down. So I would say, doesn'tneed a lot to be motivated when
(03:06):
I'm around great people, andthat I get to ask questions.
Márcia Balisciano (03:13):
That's quite interesting, that you think it's
speeding up in terms of thelearning. Why is that?
YS Chi (03:19):
I think, on the one hand, over the years, I've
accumulated more kind offoundational knowledge, and I'm
asking more and more questionsthat are relevant to those
foundations. Having come fromfive different sectors, and
being around the 40,000 peopleat RELX and our customers, our
(03:41):
partners, and the technology. Mygoodness. I mean, the pace of
change in technology isenormous, and either we get left
behind or we jump on the trainand make sure we don't fall
behind.
Márcia Balisciano (03:56):
Yeah, I agree with that. So important. If we
just take a step backwardsbecause you decided to name this
podcast Unique Contributions.
And I know those of us at RELX,it's really ingrained what we
mean by that. But could youdefine for our listeners what
constitutes our uniquecontributions?
YS Chi (04:18):
Sure. Let me give it a try. Let's start with the
purpose of the company, RELX. Sowe are obviously a global
provider of data in and contentbased technology, analytics and
decision tools for ourcustomers. So we don't just give
(04:40):
the content, we also give themthe tools on top of it that
makes the content so much richerand a little bit relevant to the
decisions they have to make atthe moment. This is the way to
get our customers to get betterresults, meaning through
productivity, right? So Ibelieve that our purpose is to
benefit our society bydevelopment of these products
(05:03):
and services on top of thecontent. And it's that
combination that makes it quitedifferent from everybody else.
Whether that be researchers inthe scientific field, doctors
and nurses in the medical field,lawyers and judges in the court
of law for the fairness of legalresults. Banks, finance
(05:28):
companies, other businesses andgovernments that have to prevent
so much fraud that's going onright now. Consumers that are
getting defrauded as well. So,it goes on and on about these
people needing to actually makedecisions, and our being able to
uniquely provide both the dataset and the analytic tool around
(05:51):
it, wrapped around it. I thinkthat that is the positive impact
that we're trying to have on thesociety through what we do as
quote, unquote business.
Márcia Balisciano (06:01):
I like that, because it's how we think about
corporate responsibility atRELX, isn't it? It's not a
prescriptive set of activities.
It needs to be owned by allthose people who are colleagues
at RELX and embedded into whatwe do every day. I wonder if
there's some specific examplesthat you could give. I mean, you
(06:25):
highlighted a few, but I wouldbe interested.
YS Chi (06:26):
Sure, to be fair, I'll try to give examples from four
different segments of ourbusinesses, right? So, Risk
business, our largest businessby both revenue and
contribution. They provideprotection to the society by
helping prevent fraud.
(06:46):
ThreatMetrix for example,reduces online fraud with
150,000 websites that apply ourapps to do identification and to
help recognise a trustedtransaction versus a fraud
transaction. Legal &Professional division of
LexisNexis. They support therule of law through their
(07:07):
content, data and analyticsusing things like eyeWitness to
Atrocities app, and that appgives human rights defenders to
be able to use their mobilephone to document and report
human rights abuse in a way thathas been accepted as photos and
(07:29):
videos and audio, as admissibleevidence in the court of law.
Right? That's pretty powerful.
And on this Elsevier side, bothon the research and medical
side, we publish nearly threequarters million of peer
reviewed articles just lastyear. And through programs like
Research4Life, which we helpedstart 23 years ago, we provide
(07:53):
completely or nearly free accessto nearly 100 countries that are
unable to afford our commercialproducts, and they get complete
access to it like anybody else.
And then finally, there's theExhibition business, and they
create communities, right? What?
Nearly 300 events, 25 countries,and 40 vertical industry
(08:18):
sectors. Our events just convenepeople to come together and grow
their business by having face toface interaction all in one
shot. So an example of theircontribution is the energy show.
Their energy show emphasises thelow carbon energy and
sustainability event that looksat all of the innovation power
(08:40):
in both renewable, low carbonand even low carbon heating,
transporting. All these elementsare coming together, and we
congregate them all, and I thinkthat's what we do so uniquely
well.
Márcia Balisciano (08:54):
I agree. And speaking of RX, they are putting
out a first SustainabilityReport before long, so we look
forward to seeing that as partof their commitment to, as
you're saying, net zero carbonevents. Think that's an
important aspect, and it'scertainly been an important
aspect of your career as well,in terms of partnerships, and
(09:19):
making sure that we put ourheads down, do the work within
our company, but also trying tospread good practice. You have
had such an impressive career,you're past president of the
International PublishersAssociation, also past Chair of
the Association of AmericanPublishers. Can you talk a
(09:42):
little bit about why thatmatters? Because certainly
there's enough to do withinRELX, but why should we be
involved more broadly?
YS Chi (09:52):
Yeah, that's a really good question. And I would say
on one hand, we have to walk thetalk, and that's what we do
internally. But as you know, wecan't boil the entire ocean, and
we do our part, but we wantothers to also contribute. In
positions of leadership, in anindustries, we can really make
(10:14):
this an important agenda item,right? Rather than hoping that
everyone will do it at their ownpace. We can try to influence
them to accelerate theirparticipation with their own
contribution. And I think thattaking positions of leadership
in these associations is reallyimportant. And you can see that
in all of our leaders in thefour businesses. They all take
(10:37):
this extra effort, in additionto running their business to
become industry leaders, and Ithink that has been a kind of a
multiplying factor for us. AndIPA, as you pointed out, is
adopting a lot of the bestpractices that we have learned
over the years, and are nowspreading among all the members
(11:01):
to be able to replicate and evenimprove from there. And I think
that we make our industry thatmuch more relevant and
contributory to thesustainability of what we so
enjoy today.
Márcia Balisciano (11:16):
Yeah, I agree with you. It's a kind of rising
tide lifts all boats approach.
And YS coming back to corporateresponsibility. Why do you think
that, we've had this focus? It'ssupported at the top of our
organisation, with our board,our senior leadership, senior
leaders such as yourself and allthrough the organisation. Why is
(11:37):
this? Why does this need to be afocus? What's the business
driver here?
YS Chi (11:45):
Yeah, that's the billion dollar question, isn't it? Yeah.
And we do this because weactually deeply believe that
these unique contributions giveus a identifiable, long term and
sustainable competitiveadvantage. That's why we do it.
The exercise of these principlesand guidance do inspire
(12:07):
confidence in our stakeholders,including our customers. They
provide almost a license tooperate in communities in which
we live and work, with trust inus. We're earning trust because
of how we behave. And pleaseremember that unique
(12:27):
contributions is not a programor prescriptive set of
initiatives, right? It's rathera how we conduct ourselves and
the business on a daily basis.
Whether that had sourced frombottom up by thousands of our
people, you know, wanting to doit that that way, or whether our
(12:49):
leaders helped pull that up. Ireally can't tell you the
history of that, but what I cansay is that it's been an amazing
combination of the two. As younoticed, you just said a few
minutes ago, leaders have reallybeen upfront, emphasising the
importance and thousands andthousands and thousands of our
people did the hard work. Everyday they do the hard work, the
(13:12):
right way. Therefore, you cancall this an ingrained
responsibility of corporateculture. It's a corporate
guidance. And what we, what I'veobserved, especially these last
15 years under the leadership ofErik Engstrom, RELX's CEO, we've
(13:33):
been driving actual performancethrough our culture and
nurturing that talent of peoplewho have that culture. It's the
supporting working environmentand the inspiring people,
they'll do the right thing, andthen eventually that will
contribute to the society. So,in the mindset of making unique
contributions is really resultedin the culture that we represent
(13:56):
in our businesses, constantlyinnovating to differentiate our
contribution. To give you oneexample, some of our businesses
could have remained a publisher.
Why not? That's a great, noblebusiness, and nearly all of our
competitors have remained apublisher. Well, instead, our
business leaders have decided toinvest in digital solutions and
(14:17):
on a continual basis. And thelatest example, that is perhaps
the most visible is thetransformation of our Legal
business at LexisNexis, whichembraced Gen AI instantly. They
launched way ahead of anycompetitors, a thoroughly
advanced AI enabled tools thattoday legal professionals tell
(14:37):
us, save enormous amount of timeand add completeness to their
work. You can see that in thenumber of customers that have
now signed up to go fromLexisNexis advance to LexisNexis
advance +AI. So, I think it'sbeen great combination for us.
On one hand, the talented peoplefrom bottom up and the leaders
(15:01):
from the top down, moving inunison together. Today, I think
unique contribution is just ourculture.
Márcia Balisciano (15:09):
You have alluded to how the company has
changed over time. Certainlyfrom the one that you joined and
you mentioned about AI inparticular. I wonder if you
could talk a little bit aboutthe importance for us of
responsible AI, because this isa kind of adjunct from, you know
(15:33):
what we look at in terms of ourcorporate responsibilities,
making sure that the content isaccurate and factual and is
really driving those performanceimprovements for our customers.
But maybe just a top line on howyou see responsible AI?
YS Chi (15:52):
Sure. Almost immediately after I joined Elsevier, I had
an opportunity to attend animportant forum in Kyoto called
STS, Science and Technology inSociety. At the first meeting, I
learned the expression about thelight and the shadow of
(16:14):
advancement, or light and shadowof scientific discovery. That
everything we do to discover, toenhance our humanity can be
abused and misused to be thedark side. It's the
responsibility of us to ensurethat we steer the use of such
(16:36):
advancement in light manner, notthe dark manner. I think that
our responsible code for AI, theuse of AI responsibly, is that
light for RELX. We have to usesuch discovery and such
(16:56):
advancement in the way in whichit actually brings light to our
humanity, rather than making it,hoard it into the few, who can
then misuse that power toactually bring unfairness to
everybody else. I think thatthat is one of the things that I
(17:19):
think, you and your team andthroughout the four businesses
have done extraordinarily welland in advance. Well ahead of
people, by putting thoseresponsible codes in place
before even things like OpenAIbecame a fad. Well well before
that, right? And this is whatmakes me so proud, that RELX's
(17:42):
unique contribution concept isnot a program. That it is
embedded DNA.
Márcia Balisciano (17:49):
Agreed. YS, when you joined the business, we
had over 50 percent of ourrevenue from print. And as
someone with a strong backgroundin printed material. In 2024
print only accounted in terms ofour formats, about 4 percent.
(18:12):
I'm curious to know what youthink is the future of print. Is
there still a place for it?
YS Chi (18:19):
Yeah, I'm not sure that print should disappear
completely, because it does haveits unique contribution to the
society, right? There'sgenerational stuff, which is
that many of us grew up inpaper, and some of the habits of
paper will not disappear. But asthat diminishes, there are also
(18:42):
additional factors, such aspaper being a better medium than
any other medium for certainpurposes. I think that we should
not be dismissive of the paperas a problem, but as a unique
player within the spectrum ofmedium. Most of which is
(19:05):
becoming digital, and most ofwhich is becoming small enough
to fit in one device like this.
But just like we are debatingbetween this device and a pad
device versus a laptop deviceversus a large screen like the
one I'm looking at right now. Weshould have multiple options.
(19:26):
But do I see a day in whichpaper will actually overtake
digital again? Not in mylifetime, unless we lose all
electricity, we lose allmemories. And that would have
far bigger consequence thanpaper versus digital.
Márcia Balisciano (19:41):
Given the fact that RELX has been on the
forefront of the evolution ofour sector. When you look ahead
into the future, what do you seein terms of what comes next, in
terms of how we will continue todrive the business forward as it
(20:01):
relates to technology?
YS Chi (20:02):
Well, I think that these are probably much better
answered by our tech colleagueswho are much closer to the
matters and are more experts.
But from the position that I'msitting in as a user of
technology, I would say thatthis journey of AI will continue
on for a quite a long time. Now,AI is just a nomination, right?
(20:29):
It's just a label. I mean, weused to call AI, what data
analytics. That's all it is. Bigdata, data analytics. And now
the fancier word is AI. But whatit means is that there is a need
for enormous amount of trustableand sizable data sets that have
to inform those data analytictools, which is, guess what?
(20:55):
What we do. We produce thoseconstant data sets, we gather
them, we massage them to makesure they're consistently
structured and organised andaccessible. We create enormous
amount of new knowledge throughLexis, through Elsevier, and we
create enormous behavioralpattern, even in things like
exhibition. Where people, weknow what kind of transaction
(21:17):
happens under what circumstanceswithin our exhibitions. So, I
think that the journey ahead isvery exciting, and it's going to
be a while. Is it generative AI?
Is it, another form of AI?
(21:38):
People say spatial AI,predictive AI. I mean, we can
label them, whatever we want to,but it will be the analytic
capability of large, large,large and ever growing size of
data sets to inform ourdecisions, to make sure that we
get the most out of what we can.
And every step of the way,Márcia, I think that we need to
(22:01):
remember the responsible use ofit, so that not the very few
will misuse it in the darkness.
Márcia Balisciano (22:10):
YS, I wanted to come back, a bit more
personally to your experience atRELX and previous. In the time
that you worked for thebusiness, what made you stay?
Surely, you would have had lotsof opportunities to do other
things. Why did you? What was itabout being here that made you
(22:34):
stay the course?
YS Chi (22:35):
Yes, you are absolutely right. I could have dropped my
handicap probably 10 strokes ifI had walked away sooner from
working. But no, seriously. Ithink there's only one thing
that really kept me here, andthat's people. I tell people who
(22:56):
do not know what I do.... Imean, who do not know what I do.
And they ask me, you know, whatis so exciting about where you
are? I say, I'm really excitedevery day to be working with my
colleagues. I'm excited to workwith my customers because they
are smart people that are reallytrying to make a difference. I
(23:17):
even like my competitors in ourindustries, because they're
decent people. They areinnovative people themselves,
and we learned throughcompetition. So it's just one
thing, Marcia, it's the people.
I cannot imagine going toanother company where I could
wake up every morning and knowthat I'm going to encounter
really, really great people.
(23:41):
They're going to teach mesomething valuable every day.
And so long as I feel that way,I think I'll be around.
Márcia Balisciano (23:49):
That rather trite expression of being a
glass half empty or half fullkind of person. You're
definitely, YS a glass halffull. Are there ever times when
you're feeling less optimistic?
You know what keeps you up atnight?
YS Chi (24:09):
Yeah, I think I've been asked that question more often
these days than before. I thinkwhat keeps me up at night these
days is that more people seem tobe not listening to each other,
but too busy talking at oneanother. Our listening,
analysing and absorbing power isnot being harvested as well as
(24:32):
we should. I wish we could getto a point where we respect
listening to each other more andtalking less.
Márcia Balisciano (24:41):
But I wonder if you think that being that
positive, optimistic leader thatyou are, do you have to be born
that way? Or is that a skillthat can be learned?
YS Chi (24:55):
Of course, I believe that it is learned and not born.
If you know my story, whichactually you do, but you know
our audience doesn't? I alwayssay that I'm the luckiest person
you'll ever meet in your life.
When you have a life like that,then of course, I believe it's
learned. I learned to thinkpositively, because my glass may
(25:20):
be half full, but I have theoptimism that I can fill it up.
I've had people along my lifethat have helped me fill up my
cup. They're great mentors, theywere great colleagues, they're
great friends. I think thathaving been exposed to and live
with these people, these 40 someyears that I've been in
(25:43):
workforce, it's really made metrust that others do want me to
be better. That it is not a zerosum game, that we can all rise
together. And so yes, I am a PMAperson, positive mental attitude
will always guide me, and that Ido believe it is learned.
Márcia Balisciano (26:04):
That's good.
There's hope for the rest of us.
YS, what advice would you havefor young people who are
interested in our sector? You doso much work, as it relates to
academia, both for us as abusiness, but then personally,
(26:26):
as a mentor for so many and asponsor for many. What is your
advice for the next, generationof future leaders?
YS Chi (26:39):
I want to just repeat what I said earlier, that it's
not about what, where, evenwhen. But it's about who. It has
to be who in all the decisionsthat we make. Who we surround
with is what's going to shapeus. Whether they are parents or
(27:00):
friends or colleagues. Rememberall the teachers we had, all the
teachers we do have today aroundus. I think it's really about
who. Once we make a gooddecision about who the next,
most important thing, in myview, is how well one does. We
(27:24):
still live in a world in whichtoo many people judge us by what
we do and where we are, and Ithink that the better
measurement is how well we dowhat we choose to do. I grew up
in a society where it was allabout what school you attended,
what rank you achieved, andthose were good prepositions for
(27:47):
judging someone in the old days.
But in today's world, that's notwhat really matters. What
matters is, no matter what youchoose to do, how well one does.
I think that we are increasinglygoing toward the world in which
we are less judgmental about thepast and more appreciative of
what we deliver day to day, forthe benefit of you and those
(28:11):
around you. I think that wouldbe the two pieces of advice that
I would share with them. First,who, and number two, how well.
Márcia Balisciano (28:23):
In terms of attracting talent, because we do
have competitors, and it is arace to get the best people to
come and work for RELX. There'sa few things that you've said,
which would make a lot of sensefor why someone who's looking to
(28:44):
develop a career in our sector,come to work for us. You talked
about the people, the excellenceof our products and services,
the potential for the future.
What else? Can you think ofanything else that, why should
they come to us as opposed togoing elsewhere?
YS Chi (29:07):
The more they know about the culture of this place, the
harder it is for them to notjoin us. I think that we have to
do a good job, really, duringthe process of interacting with
the candidates to impart notjust what we do, but how we do
(29:28):
things. And that way, once we'regood in lucky enough to have
them join us, that they will notleave. They will stay and thrive
through their own contributionto the innovation, and that then
reinforces the culture, right?
(29:52):
So, I would hope that we do agood job imparting to people
outside whether they'recustomers or potential future
member of our team. It's theculture that matters. But we all
know, right Marcia, that noteverybody thinks that's the
factor that is most important tothem. And for those people, we
wish them well wherever theyare, but they probably don't fit
(30:19):
us very neatly.
Márcia Balisciano (30:20):
Stakeholders matter. Obviously, we're talking
about employees, current, futureemployees. How is the
perception? What is theperception by other stakeholders
do you think, for government,investors, non-governmental
(30:40):
organisations when they whenthey look at us in terms of our
unique contributions? How do yousee that play out?
YS Chi (30:50):
I would say that we are, in general, as a company, quite
modest about telling the worldwhat we do, how well we do what
we do, and how we do them. Andas such, those who know us on
the surface may not be able todistinguish us from the rest,
other than the more standardmeasurement, like revenue or
(31:14):
earnings growth orprofitability. But it's those
who actually go layer belowthat, that come to appreciate
what we're made up of. And forthose, whether they're investors
or government partners or nonprofit, I mean, non-governmental
organisation. When they dig eventhird level below, they really
(31:36):
become our deep partners, andthey don't want to leave us as
our partners and vice versa, ofcourse. It's a question of
whether someone looks at us fromlayer one, layer two, layer
three, and so on and so forth.
The more we can welcome them toknow us in a deeper layer, the
more respect we earn. The moretrust we have earned. I think
(31:58):
that will continue to be thecase, but we are not going to do
a lot of self promotion. That'sjust not us either.
Márcia Balisciano (32:08):
So, YS, I know your drive and energy, that
there's a lot more you wouldlike to do within RELX. Can you
highlight what's on your ownlist for the future?
YS Chi (32:24):
Oh, that's a really tough question Márcia. If I said
more of the same, I would soundvery boring, but I think that's
really what it is. I think whenwe look at what we have been
able to collectively achieveover the past 15, 20 years. I
think it should be more of thesame. More innovation, more
(32:46):
respect for each other, morefair implementation of our
products and services, moreglobal reach, right? I think
it's more and more and more ofthis earning of the trust
through both innovative use ofour content and technology, but
(33:08):
also the kind of people we wantto bring into our organisation.
The attitude with which we treatothers around us. Man, I think
that if it's been working. Hey,I'm optimistic that it's going
to work even better.
Márcia Balisciano (33:21):
Thank you for that. And YS, thank you for
allowing me to be on the side ofthe microphone where I get to
interview you, but I am going tosay thank you so much for
sharing your insights with us.
It's been really fascinating totalk to you, and you'll be back
(33:44):
at the microphone before longwith our next interesting guest.
YS Chi (33:48):
Well, no, thank you so much for taking the time. As I
said earlier, in the beginning,I was a bit nervous as to
whether I would be able toanswer as well as I can ask, but
this has been fun. Thank youvery much for taking the time.
The Unique Contributions Podcast is brought to you by
RELX. Find out more about us byvisiting relx.com.
We still live in a world in which too many people judge us by what we do and where we are, and I think a better measurement is how well we do what we choose to do.
Márcia Balisciano (00:41):
Welcome to the Unique Contributions
podcast. My name is MárciaBalisciano, and I am head of
corporate responsibility atRELX. I am really delighted to
turn the tables on your usualhost, YS Chi, a distinguished
colleague celebrating 20 yearsat RELX. I wanted to start YS,
(01:06):
with asking the question that weask everyone, which is to
introduce yourself.
YS Chi (01:12):
Hello, everyone. My name is Youngsuk Chi, and I asked to
just call me YS to make iteasier. It's become my
professional name since about 40years ago. I originally come
from Korea, but as a child of acareer diplomat, I only got to
live in Korea for four years ofmy life during my youth. I've
worked and lived in over a dozencountries across all the
(01:34):
continents, and had the fortuneof experiencing the finance
sector, the IT industry, thedistribution industry and now
publishing industry, which thenhas transformed itself into a
content based analytics andtools businesses that leverage
the latest technology, like AI.
(01:57):
So as you so kindly acknowledgein your email to me this
weekend, I'm celebrating my 20thanniversary here at Elsevier and
RELX, this week.
Márcia Balisciano (02:05):
That's wonderful, YS. I wondered, given
that you have had adistinguished career at RELX and
before joining us at otherorganisations, how have you kept
motivated?
YS Chi (02:24):
I would say, what keeps me going and motivated is a
combination of, on one hand, thelove of being around great
people. And second is the habitof asking a lot of questions
because of my curiosity. WhenI'm around great people that are
good at what they do and arecurious like I am, I just seem
(02:46):
to be learning all the time. AndI have to say, even now, I've
learned so much during theswitching of the five industry
sectors, but the pace of thelearning that I do now is
actually accelerating the pastfew years, then it is slowing
down. So I would say, doesn'tneed a lot to be motivated when
(03:06):
I'm around great people, andthat I get to ask questions.
Márcia Balisciano (03:13):
That's quite interesting, that you think it's
speeding up in terms of thelearning. Why is that?
YS Chi (03:19):
I think, on the one hand, over the years, I've
accumulated more kind offoundational knowledge, and I'm
asking more and more questionsthat are relevant to those
foundations. Having come fromfive different sectors, and
being around the 40,000 peopleat RELX and our customers, our
(03:41):
partners, and the technology. Mygoodness. I mean, the pace of
change in technology isenormous, and either we get left
behind or we jump on the trainand make sure we don't fall
behind.
Márcia Balisciano (03:56):
Yeah, I agree with that. So important. If we
just take a step backwardsbecause you decided to name this
podcast Unique Contributions.
And I know those of us at RELX,it's really ingrained what we
mean by that. But could youdefine for our listeners what
constitutes our uniquecontributions?
YS Chi (04:18):
Sure. Let me give it a try. Let's start with the
purpose of the company, RELX. Sowe are obviously a global
provider of data in and contentbased technology, analytics and
decision tools for ourcustomers. So we don't just give
(04:40):
the content, we also give themthe tools on top of it that
makes the content so much richerand a little bit relevant to the
decisions they have to make atthe moment. This is the way to
get our customers to get betterresults, meaning through
productivity, right? So Ibelieve that our purpose is to
benefit our society bydevelopment of these products
(05:03):
and services on top of thecontent. And it's that
combination that makes it quitedifferent from everybody else.
Whether that be researchers inthe scientific field, doctors
and nurses in the medical field,lawyers and judges in the court
of law for the fairness of legalresults. Banks, finance
(05:28):
companies, other businesses andgovernments that have to prevent
so much fraud that's going onright now. Consumers that are
getting defrauded as well. So,it goes on and on about these
people needing to actually makedecisions, and our being able to
uniquely provide both the dataset and the analytic tool around
(05:51):
it, wrapped around it. I thinkthat that is the positive impact
that we're trying to have on thesociety through what we do as
quote, unquote business.
Márcia Balisciano (06:01):
I like that, because it's how we think about
corporate responsibility atRELX, isn't it? It's not a
prescriptive set of activities.
It needs to be owned by allthose people who are colleagues
at RELX and embedded into whatwe do every day. I wonder if
there's some specific examplesthat you could give. I mean, you
(06:25):
highlighted a few, but I wouldbe interested.
YS Chi (06:26):
Sure, to be fair, I'll try to give examples from four
different segments of ourbusinesses, right? So, Risk
business, our largest businessby both revenue and
contribution. They provideprotection to the society by
helping prevent fraud.
(06:46):
ThreatMetrix for example,reduces online fraud with
150,000 websites that apply ourapps to do identification and to
help recognise a trustedtransaction versus a fraud
transaction. Legal &Professional division of
LexisNexis. They support therule of law through their
(07:07):
content, data and analyticsusing things like eyeWitness to
Atrocities app, and that appgives human rights defenders to
be able to use their mobilephone to document and report
human rights abuse in a way thathas been accepted as photos and
(07:29):
videos and audio, as admissibleevidence in the court of law.
Right? That's pretty powerful.
And on this Elsevier side, bothon the research and medical
side, we publish nearly threequarters million of peer
reviewed articles just lastyear. And through programs like
Research4Life, which we helpedstart 23 years ago, we provide
(07:53):
completely or nearly free accessto nearly 100 countries that are
unable to afford our commercialproducts, and they get complete
access to it like anybody else.
And then finally, there's theExhibition business, and they
create communities, right? What?
Nearly 300 events, 25 countries,and 40 vertical industry
(08:18):
sectors. Our events just convenepeople to come together and grow
their business by having face toface interaction all in one
shot. So an example of theircontribution is the energy show.
Their energy show emphasises thelow carbon energy and
sustainability event that looksat all of the innovation power
(08:40):
in both renewable, low carbonand even low carbon heating,
transporting. All these elementsare coming together, and we
congregate them all, and I thinkthat's what we do so uniquely
well.
Márcia Balisciano (08:54):
I agree. And speaking of RX, they are putting
out a first SustainabilityReport before long, so we look
forward to seeing that as partof their commitment to, as
you're saying, net zero carbonevents. Think that's an
important aspect, and it'scertainly been an important
aspect of your career as well,in terms of partnerships, and
(09:19):
making sure that we put ourheads down, do the work within
our company, but also trying tospread good practice. You have
had such an impressive career,you're past president of the
International PublishersAssociation, also past Chair of
the Association of AmericanPublishers. Can you talk a
(09:42):
little bit about why thatmatters? Because certainly
there's enough to do withinRELX, but why should we be
involved more broadly?
YS Chi (09:52):
Yeah, that's a really good question. And I would say
on one hand, we have to walk thetalk, and that's what we do
internally. But as you know, wecan't boil the entire ocean, and
we do our part, but we wantothers to also contribute. In
positions of leadership, in anindustries, we can really make
(10:14):
this an important agenda item,right? Rather than hoping that
everyone will do it at their ownpace. We can try to influence
them to accelerate theirparticipation with their own
contribution. And I think thattaking positions of leadership
in these associations is reallyimportant. And you can see that
in all of our leaders in thefour businesses. They all take
(10:37):
this extra effort, in additionto running their business to
become industry leaders, and Ithink that has been a kind of a
multiplying factor for us. AndIPA, as you pointed out, is
adopting a lot of the bestpractices that we have learned
over the years, and are nowspreading among all the members
(11:01):
to be able to replicate and evenimprove from there. And I think
that we make our industry thatmuch more relevant and
contributory to thesustainability of what we so
enjoy today.
Márcia Balisciano (11:16):
Yeah, I agree with you. It's a kind of rising
tide lifts all boats approach.
And YS coming back to corporateresponsibility. Why do you think
that, we've had this focus? It'ssupported at the top of our
organisation, with our board,our senior leadership, senior
leaders such as yourself and allthrough the organisation. Why is
(11:37):
this? Why does this need to be afocus? What's the business
driver here?
YS Chi (11:45):
Yeah, that's the billion dollar question, isn't it? Yeah.
And we do this because weactually deeply believe that
these unique contributions giveus a identifiable, long term and
sustainable competitiveadvantage. That's why we do it.
The exercise of these principlesand guidance do inspire
(12:07):
confidence in our stakeholders,including our customers. They
provide almost a license tooperate in communities in which
we live and work, with trust inus. We're earning trust because
of how we behave. And pleaseremember that unique
(12:27):
contributions is not a programor prescriptive set of
initiatives, right? It's rathera how we conduct ourselves and
the business on a daily basis.
Whether that had sourced frombottom up by thousands of our
people, you know, wanting to doit that that way, or whether our
(12:49):
leaders helped pull that up. Ireally can't tell you the
history of that, but what I cansay is that it's been an amazing
combination of the two. As younoticed, you just said a few
minutes ago, leaders have reallybeen upfront, emphasising the
importance and thousands andthousands and thousands of our
people did the hard work. Everyday they do the hard work, the
(13:12):
right way. Therefore, you cancall this an ingrained
responsibility of corporateculture. It's a corporate
guidance. And what we, what I'veobserved, especially these last
15 years under the leadership ofErik Engstrom, RELX's CEO, we've
(13:33):
been driving actual performancethrough our culture and
nurturing that talent of peoplewho have that culture. It's the
supporting working environmentand the inspiring people,
they'll do the right thing, andthen eventually that will
contribute to the society. So,in the mindset of making unique
contributions is really resultedin the culture that we represent
(13:56):
in our businesses, constantlyinnovating to differentiate our
contribution. To give you oneexample, some of our businesses
could have remained a publisher.
Why not? That's a great, noblebusiness, and nearly all of our
competitors have remained apublisher. Well, instead, our
business leaders have decided toinvest in digital solutions and
(14:17):
on a continual basis. And thelatest example, that is perhaps
the most visible is thetransformation of our Legal
business at LexisNexis, whichembraced Gen AI instantly. They
launched way ahead of anycompetitors, a thoroughly
advanced AI enabled tools thattoday legal professionals tell
(14:37):
us, save enormous amount of timeand add completeness to their
work. You can see that in thenumber of customers that have
now signed up to go fromLexisNexis advance to LexisNexis
advance +AI. So, I think it'sbeen great combination for us.
On one hand, the talented peoplefrom bottom up and the leaders
(15:01):
from the top down, moving inunison together. Today, I think
unique contribution is just ourculture.
Márcia Balisciano (15:09):
You have alluded to how the company has
changed over time. Certainlyfrom the one that you joined and
you mentioned about AI inparticular. I wonder if you
could talk a little bit aboutthe importance for us of
responsible AI, because this isa kind of adjunct from, you know
(15:33):
what we look at in terms of ourcorporate responsibilities,
making sure that the content isaccurate and factual and is
really driving those performanceimprovements for our customers.
But maybe just a top line on howyou see responsible AI?
YS Chi (15:52):
Sure. Almost immediately after I joined Elsevier, I had
an opportunity to attend animportant forum in Kyoto called
STS, Science and Technology inSociety. At the first meeting, I
learned the expression about thelight and the shadow of
(16:14):
advancement, or light and shadowof scientific discovery. That
everything we do to discover, toenhance our humanity can be
abused and misused to be thedark side. It's the
responsibility of us to ensurethat we steer the use of such
(16:36):
advancement in light manner, notthe dark manner. I think that
our responsible code for AI, theuse of AI responsibly, is that
light for RELX. We have to usesuch discovery and such
(16:56):
advancement in the way in whichit actually brings light to our
humanity, rather than making it,hoard it into the few, who can
then misuse that power toactually bring unfairness to
everybody else. I think thatthat is one of the things that I
(17:19):
think, you and your team andthroughout the four businesses
have done extraordinarily welland in advance. Well ahead of
people, by putting thoseresponsible codes in place
before even things like OpenAIbecame a fad. Well well before
that, right? And this is whatmakes me so proud, that RELX's
(17:42):
unique contribution concept isnot a program. That it is
embedded DNA.
Márcia Balisciano (17:49):
Agreed. YS, when you joined the business, we
had over 50 percent of ourrevenue from print. And as
someone with a strong backgroundin printed material. In 2024
print only accounted in terms ofour formats, about 4 percent.
(18:12):
I'm curious to know what youthink is the future of print. Is
there still a place for it?
YS Chi (18:19):
Yeah, I'm not sure that print should disappear
completely, because it does haveits unique contribution to the
society, right? There'sgenerational stuff, which is
that many of us grew up inpaper, and some of the habits of
paper will not disappear. But asthat diminishes, there are also
(18:42):
additional factors, such aspaper being a better medium than
any other medium for certainpurposes. I think that we should
not be dismissive of the paperas a problem, but as a unique
player within the spectrum ofmedium. Most of which is
(19:05):
becoming digital, and most ofwhich is becoming small enough
to fit in one device like this.
But just like we are debatingbetween this device and a pad
device versus a laptop deviceversus a large screen like the
one I'm looking at right now. Weshould have multiple options.
(19:26):
But do I see a day in whichpaper will actually overtake
digital again? Not in mylifetime, unless we lose all
electricity, we lose allmemories. And that would have
far bigger consequence thanpaper versus digital.
Márcia Balisciano (19:41):
Given the fact that RELX has been on the
forefront of the evolution ofour sector. When you look ahead
into the future, what do you seein terms of what comes next, in
terms of how we will continue todrive the business forward as it
(20:01):
relates to technology?
YS Chi (20:02):
Well, I think that these are probably much better
answered by our tech colleagueswho are much closer to the
matters and are more experts.
But from the position that I'msitting in as a user of
technology, I would say thatthis journey of AI will continue
on for a quite a long time. Now,AI is just a nomination, right?
(20:29):
It's just a label. I mean, weused to call AI, what data
analytics. That's all it is. Bigdata, data analytics. And now
the fancier word is AI. But whatit means is that there is a need
for enormous amount of trustableand sizable data sets that have
to inform those data analytictools, which is, guess what?
(20:55):
What we do. We produce thoseconstant data sets, we gather
them, we massage them to makesure they're consistently
structured and organised andaccessible. We create enormous
amount of new knowledge throughLexis, through Elsevier, and we
create enormous behavioralpattern, even in things like
exhibition. Where people, weknow what kind of transaction
(21:17):
happens under what circumstanceswithin our exhibitions. So, I
think that the journey ahead isvery exciting, and it's going to
be a while. Is it generative AI?
Is it, another form of AI?
(21:38):
People say spatial AI,predictive AI. I mean, we can
label them, whatever we want to,but it will be the analytic
capability of large, large,large and ever growing size of
data sets to inform ourdecisions, to make sure that we
get the most out of what we can.
And every step of the way,Márcia, I think that we need to
(22:01):
remember the responsible use ofit, so that not the very few
will misuse it in the darkness.
Márcia Balisciano (22:10):
YS, I wanted to come back, a bit more
personally to your experience atRELX and previous. In the time
that you worked for thebusiness, what made you stay?
Surely, you would have had lotsof opportunities to do other
things. Why did you? What was itabout being here that made you
(22:34):
stay the course?
YS Chi (22:35):
Yes, you are absolutely right. I could have dropped my
handicap probably 10 strokes ifI had walked away sooner from
working. But no, seriously. Ithink there's only one thing
that really kept me here, andthat's people. I tell people who
(22:56):
do not know what I do.... Imean, who do not know what I do.
And they ask me, you know, whatis so exciting about where you
are? I say, I'm really excitedevery day to be working with my
colleagues. I'm excited to workwith my customers because they
are smart people that are reallytrying to make a difference. I
(23:17):
even like my competitors in ourindustries, because they're
decent people. They areinnovative people themselves,
and we learned throughcompetition. So it's just one
thing, Marcia, it's the people.
I cannot imagine going toanother company where I could
wake up every morning and knowthat I'm going to encounter
really, really great people.
(23:41):
They're going to teach mesomething valuable every day.
And so long as I feel that way,I think I'll be around.
Márcia Balisciano (23:49):
That rather trite expression of being a
glass half empty or half fullkind of person. You're
definitely, YS a glass halffull. Are there ever times when
you're feeling less optimistic?
You know what keeps you up atnight?
YS Chi (24:09):
Yeah, I think I've been asked that question more often
these days than before. I thinkwhat keeps me up at night these
days is that more people seem tobe not listening to each other,
but too busy talking at oneanother. Our listening,
analysing and absorbing power isnot being harvested as well as
(24:32):
we should. I wish we could getto a point where we respect
listening to each other more andtalking less.
Márcia Balisciano (24:41):
But I wonder if you think that being that
positive, optimistic leader thatyou are, do you have to be born
that way? Or is that a skillthat can be learned?
YS Chi (24:55):
Of course, I believe that it is learned and not born.
If you know my story, whichactually you do, but you know
our audience doesn't? I alwayssay that I'm the luckiest person
you'll ever meet in your life.
When you have a life like that,then of course, I believe it's
learned. I learned to thinkpositively, because my glass may
(25:20):
be half full, but I have theoptimism that I can fill it up.
I've had people along my lifethat have helped me fill up my
cup. They're great mentors, theywere great colleagues, they're
great friends. I think thathaving been exposed to and live
with these people, these 40 someyears that I've been in
(25:43):
workforce, it's really made metrust that others do want me to
be better. That it is not a zerosum game, that we can all rise
together. And so yes, I am a PMAperson, positive mental attitude
will always guide me, and that Ido believe it is learned.
Márcia Balisciano (26:04):
That's good.
There's hope for the rest of us.
YS, what advice would you havefor young people who are
interested in our sector? You doso much work, as it relates to
academia, both for us as abusiness, but then personally,
(26:26):
as a mentor for so many and asponsor for many. What is your
advice for the next, generationof future leaders?
YS Chi (26:39):
I want to just repeat what I said earlier, that it's
not about what, where, evenwhen. But it's about who. It has
to be who in all the decisionsthat we make. Who we surround
with is what's going to shapeus. Whether they are parents or
(27:00):
friends or colleagues. Rememberall the teachers we had, all the
teachers we do have today aroundus. I think it's really about
who. Once we make a gooddecision about who the next,
most important thing, in myview, is how well one does. We
(27:24):
still live in a world in whichtoo many people judge us by what
we do and where we are, and Ithink that the better
measurement is how well we dowhat we choose to do. I grew up
in a society where it was allabout what school you attended,
what rank you achieved, andthose were good prepositions for
(27:47):
judging someone in the old days.
But in today's world, that's notwhat really matters. What
matters is, no matter what youchoose to do, how well one does.
I think that we are increasinglygoing toward the world in which
we are less judgmental about thepast and more appreciative of
what we deliver day to day, forthe benefit of you and those
(28:11):
around you. I think that wouldbe the two pieces of advice that
I would share with them. First,who, and number two, how well.
Márcia Balisciano (28:23):
In terms of attracting talent, because we do
have competitors, and it is arace to get the best people to
come and work for RELX. There'sa few things that you've said,
which would make a lot of sensefor why someone who's looking to
(28:44):
develop a career in our sector,come to work for us. You talked
about the people, the excellenceof our products and services,
the potential for the future.
What else? Can you think ofanything else that, why should
they come to us as opposed togoing elsewhere?
YS Chi (29:07):
The more they know about the culture of this place, the
harder it is for them to notjoin us. I think that we have to
do a good job, really, duringthe process of interacting with
the candidates to impart notjust what we do, but how we do
(29:28):
things. And that way, once we'regood in lucky enough to have
them join us, that they will notleave. They will stay and thrive
through their own contributionto the innovation, and that then
reinforces the culture, right?
(29:52):
So, I would hope that we do agood job imparting to people
outside whether they'recustomers or potential future
member of our team. It's theculture that matters. But we all
know, right Marcia, that noteverybody thinks that's the
factor that is most important tothem. And for those people, we
wish them well wherever theyare, but they probably don't fit
(30:19):
us very neatly.
Márcia Balisciano (30:20):
Stakeholders matter. Obviously, we're talking
about employees, current, futureemployees. How is the
perception? What is theperception by other stakeholders
do you think, for government,investors, non-governmental
(30:40):
organisations when they whenthey look at us in terms of our
unique contributions? How do yousee that play out?
YS Chi (30:50):
I would say that we are, in general, as a company, quite
modest about telling the worldwhat we do, how well we do what
we do, and how we do them. Andas such, those who know us on
the surface may not be able todistinguish us from the rest,
other than the more standardmeasurement, like revenue or
(31:14):
earnings growth orprofitability. But it's those
who actually go layer belowthat, that come to appreciate
what we're made up of. And forthose, whether they're investors
or government partners or nonprofit, I mean, non-governmental
organisation. When they dig eventhird level below, they really
(31:36):
become our deep partners, andthey don't want to leave us as
our partners and vice versa, ofcourse. It's a question of
whether someone looks at us fromlayer one, layer two, layer
three, and so on and so forth.
The more we can welcome them toknow us in a deeper layer, the
more respect we earn. The moretrust we have earned. I think
(31:58):
that will continue to be thecase, but we are not going to do
a lot of self promotion. That'sjust not us either.
Márcia Balisciano (32:08):
So, YS, I know your drive and energy, that
there's a lot more you wouldlike to do within RELX. Can you
highlight what's on your ownlist for the future?
YS Chi (32:24):
Oh, that's a really tough question Márcia. If I said
more of the same, I would soundvery boring, but I think that's
really what it is. I think whenwe look at what we have been
able to collectively achieveover the past 15, 20 years. I
think it should be more of thesame. More innovation, more
(32:46):
respect for each other, morefair implementation of our
products and services, moreglobal reach, right? I think
it's more and more and more ofthis earning of the trust
through both innovative use ofour content and technology, but
(33:08):
also the kind of people we wantto bring into our organisation.
The attitude with which we treatothers around us. Man, I think
that if it's been working. Hey,I'm optimistic that it's going
to work even better.
Márcia Balisciano (33:21):
Thank you for that. And YS, thank you for
allowing me to be on the side ofthe microphone where I get to
interview you, but I am going tosay thank you so much for
sharing your insights with us.
It's been really fascinating totalk to you, and you'll be back
(33:44):
at the microphone before longwith our next interesting guest.
YS Chi (33:48):
Well, no, thank you so much for taking the time. As I
said earlier, in the beginning,I was a bit nervous as to
whether I would be able toanswer as well as I can ask, but
this has been fun. Thank youvery much for taking the time.
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