July 8, 2025 • 60 mins
A foreshadowing of the national impending healthcare collapse as we see the beginnings of it in Rhode Island. As mental health workers face increasing dangers from understaffing, violence, and corporate retaliation against unionization efforts. Matt shares his terrifying classroom experience with possible gunfire, highlighting educators' vulnerability in America's gun violence epidemic, while Erika exposes the expanding network of privatized immigrant detention centers that are akin to the start of concentration camps. Towards the end of the episode we welcome Hannah John Damarjian.
• Rhode Island healthcare system facing multiple facility closures and bankruptcy filings
• Mental health hospital fired all striking nurses who demanded safer staffing ratios
• Multiple cases of healthcare workers murdered or seriously injured by patients discussed
• Matt recounts hearing gunshots outside his classroom with 27 students and no way to lock doors
• Private corporations like CoreCivic and GeoGroup operating immigrant detention centers in flood zones
• Laura Loomer's disturbing comments about "alligator meals" target Latino populations
• Palestinian American guest John discusses running for office as a young candidate
• Average age of Congress (63) disconnected from challenges facing younger generations
• Money in politics corrupts even well-intentioned candidates
• Rhode Island's "Homeless Bill of Rights" criticized as performative rather than substantive
Join us next time when we continue our conversation with John about his experiences as a Palestinian American and his journey into politics.
Laura Loomer’s “65 Million Meals” Comment: What She Actually Said—and Why It’s So Dangerous
https://youtube.com/@johnsharestories
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Artwork and logo design by Misty Rae.
Special thanks to Joanna Roux for editing help.
Special thanks to the listeners and all the wonderful people who helped listen to and provide feedback on the episode's prerelease.
Please feel free to email Matt topics or suggestions, questions or feedback.
Matt@unitedstatesofPTSD.com
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:15):
This podcast is not intended to serve as therapeutic
advice or to replace anyprofessional treatment.
These opinions belong to us anddo not reflect any company or
agency.
Speaker 3 (00:27):
Hi everybody and welcome back to another episode
of the United States of PTSD.
I have the absolutely wonderfuland fabulous Erica with me
again today.
Speaker 1 (00:38):
Hi everyone, I'm happy to be here.
Speaker 3 (00:41):
I love having you here.
Speaker 1 (00:43):
It's very nourishing.
Speaker 3 (00:45):
One of the best things that's come out of
creating this podcast has beenmeeting you, by the way.
I just have to say so it wasseriously, so it's been such a
blessing and privilege.
We originally had a guestspeaker that was going to come
on, but we actually don't knowwhat happened to the speaker.
So Eric and I are going to talkabout some other topics today
that are equally important.
I'm going to cover a couple oflocal events here over on the
(01:09):
East Coast in Rhode Island and,Erica, you're going to talk
about a wonderful and I say thatsarcastically person over there
at your deck of the woods.
Yeah, we'll talk about somethings happening over in the
borderlands.
Oh man, so an update.
I know a couple episodes ago wetalked about why I talked about
(01:32):
how there was a lot of issueswith healthcare in Rhode Island
and, as far as I know, the placethat was closing, anchor, which
is the one of the biggestplaces for primary care doctors,
closed.
But a couple of other things Iwanted to just briefly mention
is that we also had a situationwith a hospital that specializes
in mental health and they hadthe nurses there had gone on
strike because of poor workingconditions.
(01:54):
There's a problem with patientto staff ratio.
As a matter of fact, there wasan incident I think it was a
year ago where a nurse at RhodeIsland Hospital was assaulted by
a patient and almost died, andthey did a nice PR stunt where
it seems like they blamed thenurse for not following protocol
that didn't exist yeah, not theactual staff, like the nurses,
(02:19):
but the higher ups and he almostdied.
It was a pretty horrific thing.
So these nurses went on strikeand the hospital's response was
to just terminate all their jobs, which makes me laugh, because
who is ever going to work forthat company now?
Speaker 1 (02:35):
I mean, that is what you would hope.
Speaker 3 (02:38):
True, yes, yes, I guess that's true.
Speaker 1 (02:41):
Yeah, and you know, I think that, like Matt, if
you're willing to share as aperspective, as a mental health
care worker who, like,understands the importance of
client and patient to personratio under those conditions,
like, could you like walk ourlisteners through, like, some of
(03:01):
the reasons why it's soimportant, even though, like you
have the obvious like, couldyou, could you like walk our
listeners through, like, some ofthe reasons why it's so
important, even though, like youhave the obvious consequence of
, like somebody having theirphysical safety compromised to
the point of almost being killed?
You know, can you just share alittle bit?
Speaker 3 (03:20):
Yeah, actually two things come to mind immediately.
One of them I talked about wayback in season one, before I met
you.
Erica and I had a student thatwas murdered and she worked in a
homeless shelter.
I don't know the staffingsituation, but most again, most
places are understaffed andthere was somebody who came in
(03:42):
that I think was a resident orsomebody that was staying at the
shelter and murdered her withan ax.
And I know that there werestaff members there, but I don't
know how many there were.
But there was another incidentrecently in Connecticut where I
think it was, a visiting nursewas doing a home visit on a, I
guess, a patient she had seenbefore and the patient kidnapped
her, murdered her and she wasin the basement for, I think, a
(04:04):
couple of days before they foundher.
So we and then the incident Ijust talked about about the
nurse being assaulted and if Iremember correctly I might be
off on this, but it was over aphone the nurse was trying to
follow a no phone policy for thepeople coming in and the
patient punched him in the chestand I guess he went to the
bathroom.
He seemed fine and then hepassed out of the bathroom and
(04:25):
had some sort of major cardiacepisode, and so it's really
important, especially whenyou're dealing with people who
are compromised, whether it'sthrough things like strokes or
organic stuff going on thatchanges the way they're thinking
, or if it's a mental healthissue.
Right, there was another casethis is probably decades ago
because it was when I firststarted where there was a social
(04:48):
worker and a nurse doing a homevisit on a client they had been
seeing for a very long time whohad schizophrenia, and the
patient stopped taking themedication.
So when the visiting teamshowed up, the patient was
psychotic and ended up stabbing,I think, the social worker in
the head with a knife and killedthem.
I think that it was one of thetwo was stabbed, I don't
(05:08):
remember which one.
So these are all incidents ofwhy it's so important for us to
have staff that matches thepatient or client caseload,
because you just never know.
You never know what's going tohappen.
I mean, we deal with people whoare incredibly compromised.
Speaker 1 (05:28):
So I think there are some things that I want to bring
up as well in this discussion,because, you know veterinary
medicine we have patients thatcan kill us too, and it's not
(06:00):
like I want to emphasize thefact that it's like not the
fault of a person or an animalin of like that there is a risk
that we are taking, like everyveterinary professional that
goes into a room with a 120pound canine corso that they've
never met before is taking aphysical risk, like a life
physical risk to serve, physicalrisk to serve right.
(06:29):
And so I do want to bring upthat complexity because, like,
while we talk about these thingsthat are about violence being
like, I guess, like withviolence itself, that sometimes
doesn't have a lot of goodexplanations around it or not a
whole lot of reasoning around it, it can be very difficult to
hear about that, and so I dowant to put forward that, you
(06:52):
know, as devastating as thesetypes of risks and losses are,
there are ways to do it safelyright.
We can't be 100% safe all thetime, but, um, both people and
animals, um, and living beingsthat, um, that uh, can be
dangerous to work with at times,are also very deeply deserving
(07:15):
of care and compassion.
Um, so I want to pair that withthat, because sometimes,
sometimes it doesn't.
Speaker 3 (07:23):
Yeah, I thank you for pointing that out.
I've actually heard storiesfrom vets too about dealing with
their patient not the animalpatient, but the human patient.
Oh gosh being threatened, beinglike assaulted, being followed
home, like all of these terriblethings, and that's stuff that I
don't think a lot of people areaware of.
That I mean, I certainly wasnot aware of it until I heard
(07:44):
about it, cause you just don'tthink about that stuff until you
experience it and, honestly, Ithink it's very difficult to
talk about, like, preparingright.
Speaker 1 (07:53):
I think that preparing and understanding
preparing to respond issomething and in veterinary
medicine, one way that we areprepared to respond is we're not
alone.
We don't go into thesesituations alone, because if you
(08:13):
have people who are experiencedand know how to respond with
veter, you know the types oflike.
You know with veterinarymedicine, we have medications
that we use to help a processand I think that it's important
that, like fundamentally that'swhy it's so compromising of
(08:36):
safety to be understaffed whenyou're working with a population
that is at risk for havingincapacitated responses.
Speaker 3 (08:49):
Which that the understaffing issue is going to
lead into the second part of thestory I have to tell.
But I want to go back just tothere's two other things I
wanted to mention that werehappening in Rhode Island.
Another one is our favoriteinsurance company and again I
say that sarcastically united isgetting into some sort of
pissing contest with the biggesthospital network in the state
(09:11):
and now they're deciding atleast my understanding is
they're deciding that they'reconsidering that hospital and
all its partners out of networkand not paying for any of their
services.
So we have, and not paying forany of their services, so we
have.
Oh, and then the other majorplace in Rhode Island who does
primary care work has also filedbankruptcy.
So when you put all of thosethings together and then the
(09:33):
reimbursement rates are garbagein Rhode Island, doctors are
fleeing the state we don't evenhave.
We do not have one dentalclinic in the entire state that
people can go to for emergenciesat all.
Like no hospital in the entirestate that people can go to for
emergencies at all.
Like no hospital in the entirestate will treat dental stuff.
You'll have to get anappointment with a dentist a
couple days later.
I found that out the hard waywhen I had a dental issue.
(09:54):
So the state in general is a isa hellscape when it comes to
health care right now, and it'sgetting worse.
It's a hundred percent you'rebasically you.
Speaker 1 (10:06):
Basically, you and your community are experiencing
what many more parts of thecountry will be experiencing
soon.
Speaker 3 (10:13):
Absolutely, and we've been experiencing this for a
while.
If you look at the surroundingstates Connecticut,
massachusetts the reimbursementrate is so much better that all
of the doctors in Rhode Islandare kind of fleeing.
And personally again, this isjust my opinion I think a lot of
it has to do with mismanagementof money.
I mean, there's so much revenuethat's brought in from the
(10:34):
legalization of marijuana inRhode Island.
I don't know where that money'sgoing, and we have, I think
it's, the second highestcigarette tax in the state.
I'm not sure where that moneyis going either.
So actually I do know where itwent, because one of the one of
the core had done a research onthis before it was going to the
general fund, and where thegeneral fund is actually
utilized I have no idea.
(10:55):
But it makes you think, andwe'll talk about this later on
too.
If we took the money we'respending on creating wars and
committing genocide and took themoney that we're utilizing to
bring in the Gestapo in theUnited States and take out
everybody that they think lookslike a foreign person, well I
don't know, maybe we'd havemoney for housing, health care
and food, but that's a that's awhole other issue.
(11:17):
We'll get to that part in asecond.
Speaker 1 (11:20):
And if unionization action and striking action
wasn't dealt with illegally bycorporations by firing people,
because that is calledretaliation Right, and if we had
an administration thatrespected unions, then you know
we might be in a better position.
Speaker 3 (11:39):
So true, so true.
Speaker 1 (11:41):
So true.
Speaker 3 (11:42):
So I want to go to the crux of what I had to say,
which I'm still processing, eventhough it was a couple of weeks
later.
As you know, I teach and I wasteaching a summer class Last day
of class.
There was a total of 27students that are typically in
this class, but there was acouple of students that were
missing.
That's a larger size class.
(12:03):
Generally we have about 22, 23.
And I don't have a problem withteaching extra students and
this was actually a fantasticclass.
It was a wonderful group ofstudents.
We had three presentations todo that day and this class is
specifically about them doingpolicy work or doing something
around making change.
(12:23):
And ironically, we had onegroup was doing gun safety and
the recent law that went intoeffect in Rhode Island about
assault rifles, banning them.
And here we are, we're about todo the third presentation and
we hear a loud bang that soundslike a gunshot, like right
outside the window.
And I've lived in Providence.
(12:45):
I lived in Providence for 12years and during the summer we
always played the game gunshotor firework, because you never
knew what it was.
And Providence, I could tellyou right now, downplays the
amount of gunfire that goes onin that city.
I remember there was a vacationI had taken where there were 22
gunshots fired on my street.
That's actually one of thereasons why I ended up moving
(13:05):
out.
And there was a meeting we hadwith the police chief and the
local councilwoman and Iremember them basically saying
that if the bullet doesn'tconnect with anything or if they
don't find the bullet, theydon't consider it a shooting.
Therefore, you can play withthe numbers and make it sound
like gun violence is going downif you don't look for the
bullets and you don't look forwhere they land.
It can sound like gun violenceis going down if you don't look
(13:27):
for the bullets and you don'tlook for where they land.
But anyway it didn't.
Having heard fireworks, I shouldalso say it was during the day,
so fireworks generally don't gooff during the day, at least
normally, and everybody justkind of stopped.
The classroom is also allwindows and I thought what the
heck?
And then all of a sudden wehear three more and they were
(13:49):
very loud.
They could have been fireworks.
Nobody in the class thoughtthey were fireworks.
And I should also add we havesome gun owners that were
students and they actually hadsaid that's gunfire.
So there wasn't one personthere that actually believed it
was fireworks and I thought tomyself what the hell do I do
right now?
Right, so I don't.
I don't have keys to thebuilding, I can't lock the door.
(14:10):
Most college campuses, all thebuildings, are open.
This isn't just particular toour college campus.
I mean, most of them areaccessible all the time.
And I thought what the hell doI do right now?
How do I control this manypeople in a setting that we
don't really have any trainingfor?
And I thought, okay, we have a.
You know, we have this room inthe basement that is more of an
(14:31):
auditorium room and it's it's,it's.
There's two doors and they'reheavier, so they're they're
easier to, I think, barricade.
So I just said everybody getdownstairs, go into the
auditorium.
So they all went down there andwe called campus security,
which led to another problem,because apparently campus
security doesn't carry guns,because they're not allowed to,
which then effectively makesthem useless, because what are
(14:54):
they going to do if there's anactive shooter?
Absolutely nothing.
Now, in the meantime, wecontinue to hear these noises,
but they were getting furtheraway, which also makes me think
they were gunfire, because if itwas fireworks, they would all
be the same distance, youwouldn't be hearing them kind of
go away and you talk about.
I've never thought about thatas a college educator, it's
(15:16):
never crossed my mind.
That, seriously, I think, andrealizing the vulnerability,
realizing that I am nowresponsible for all of these
people and how much better itwould be if there was another
person that could have helped medo that, I mean, I think, or
even if there was training,because we're not trained on
that stuff.
And it was incrediblyterrifying.
(15:39):
And one of one of the studentshad pointed out that the, the
younger students, actually didbetter because they're used to
it.
They're used to it and theolder students did not.
Right, nor did I.
Like I was fine in the moment,like I think, in the moment I
just thought, okay, protect them, get this done, kind of stay
focused, do what you need to do.
And then I was driving home andI was it kind of all hit me
(16:02):
when I was driving home like, ohmy god, like any one of us
could have died if that, if thatwas a like a school shooter, I
think.
In my uh, amateur assessment ofwhat happened, I think it was
probably somebody driving byclose to the campus because
there's a lot of gang activityin providence, so it could have
been somebody firing at a car orwhatever.
(16:24):
I don't think it was actuallysomething that happened on
campus.
I just think it was reallyclose by, you know, and the
Providence police did come outand they were actually really
helpful, they were reallyfriendly and they were.
I think they were great in theway that they handled it.
But no educator, no student, nofaculty member, nobody should
have to deal with that, nobody.
(16:46):
And I don't know that havingmore staff would, would you know
, fix that if they were real.
But you know, with the summerclasses, nobody on campus.
So it's, it's even, it's evenworse.
And that was just it was.
It was terrifying, it wasabsolutely terrifying.
I really felt for my studentsand I, I, we.
In that moment I was reallylike holy shit, I could die
right now.
Speaker 1 (17:06):
You know, yeah, I mean, I think that there are
things that the things that Ithink are really important when
you're when navigating an acutetrauma that is involving
violence, and also like thethreat of public violence.
(17:28):
I think it's important to behaving conversations both before
right which are things thatyou're saying that at your
particular campus, like thatdidn't feel like that that had
happened.
And and after Right and thataftercare.
And I think that that's goingto be even more essential
(17:49):
because right now, like, as aswe know, like public violence is
a new norm of our, of our, ofour world here, and, you know,
we've been able to avoid it to acertain circumstance in a lot
of ways, but now, like it'shappening all over the country
(18:13):
as far as state public violence.
So I think that what I'd liketo check in with you about is
about your students.
As far as the conversations youwere able to have after, do you
feel like there was somecollective processing that you
all were able to do, or was itkind of like I know it was like
(18:35):
was it like the last day ofclass?
Speaker 3 (18:38):
Yeah, it was the last , literally the last day of
class.
Like the last day of class,yeah, it was the last, literally
the last day of class.
And after, after they cleared,the police cleared the building
and cleared the area, there wasone group who still had to do a
presentation and they didn'tfeel safe being in the building
and I certainly was not going tomake anybody stay in the
building.
Under those circumstances I waslike, absolutely, I totally get
it, you know, but then you havethe problem of grades being due
(18:59):
and like all this stuff.
So I made arrangements withthem to just do it online
afterwards, because I never.
I mean, there are people that goto that, that teach, just to
get a paycheck.
We know that.
Right, that is not me.
I go to class, I care about mystudents.
I'm very invested in mystudents.
So that night consisted of mesending out an email to the
(19:21):
whole class and then getting youknow, responding to students
individually, calling them onthe phone, checking with them
the next day, and then I wasable to get them connected with
the counseling center at schoolto do like a group processing
thing.
My supervisor was great intelling me, really validating
what I did, and saying likehere's, you know, let's get them
(19:42):
connected and that's what wedid.
So you know?
Again, it's just like nobodyshould have to go through that
right, like nobody.
And school should be a placethat people go to learn, not
worry about getting shot ordeported or kidnapped or like
sex trafficked or bombed or likeit's.
I don't know what happened.
Like I really don't know how wegot here.
(20:04):
I mean, I know how we'reprogressing, I just don't know,
like where it was.
Speaker 1 (20:07):
That, like that, that pivotal moment was, you know
yeah, I think that when we'retrying to process, uh, the loss
of collective safety, you know,I, I, I think at at times, you
do the best you can with whatyou have and you circle back and
(20:28):
you make sure that everyone ischecked in with.
And this is so.
You know, matt and I are goingto be having conversations with
people about organizing andcommunity organizing, and I
think that this is the why,right.
The why is because humans getthrough trauma better together
(20:53):
than in isolation.
Speaker 3 (20:55):
So true, I actually, by the way, I meant to plug this
book.
I haven't finished reading ityet, but I'll show you.
It's called Genocide Bad.
Have you seen this?
No, actually, you would reallylike it, because the author's
name is Sim Kern and myunderstanding is that they are a
trans Jewish person who istalking about how bad what's
happening in Palestine is rightnow, and there was something in
(21:19):
their book that I thought wasreally awesome, where they and I
don't know what the laws are onreading from the book.
I'll just summarize it and thisis in.
Again, it's by Sim Kern andit's called Genocide Bad and
they basically talk about theillusion of the DNC and how the
DNC kind of always runs on this.
This fear of everything isgoing to fall apart and they
(21:43):
need to kind of save the world,but at the same time, behind the
scenes, they're also pursuingpolicies about mass deportation,
mass incarceration, like allthe same stuff.
They're all owned by AIPAC.
Like there's literally nodifference between the two sides
.
One just looks prettier.
Speaker 1 (21:56):
I so did.
We want to shift to theborderlands.
Speaker 3 (21:59):
We can totally shift to that.
Speaker 1 (22:02):
Absolutely, because that's what this feels like.
Speaker 3 (22:04):
Yes, I thought it was a nice transition.
Speaker 1 (22:07):
So I live in Arizona.
I have a friend who lives inFlorence, arizona.
Florence Arizona is a site oftwo of the detention centers and
also where they are wanting tobuild more.
Now let me make this very, very, very clear for any audience
(22:31):
member who this space is newthese detention centers are run
by private companies.
Centers are run by privatecompanies.
The two largest one isCoreCivic and GeoGroup are the
two largest ones, so this islike private.
What is being built is aprivate detention system or
(22:56):
privately owned prison systemfor immigrants, regardless of
status.
Speaker 3 (23:04):
And I wish this is obviously the verbiage that
they're using, not that you'reusing the whole detention center
like.
Let's call it what it is.
It's kidnapping.
It's a concentration camp.
It's a kidnapping concentrationcamp.
Let's just call it that.
It's like.
I get so angry, even with like,even with people who claim to
be pro-Palestinian when theykeep talking about the war
(23:25):
between Israel and Gaza.
It is not a war, it is agenocide, and I correct this
over and, over and over again.
Speaker 1 (23:33):
Yeah, yeah.
These prisons, theseconcentration camps, the most
(24:05):
recent of which in the news, youknow, is in Florida where, as
built appropriately, so alreadyflooding day one in the path of
hurricanes that they say it canwithstand up to a category two
hurricane that region has had.
all of the most recent ones havebeen above that and you know
there's commentary um from thethe right, like uh, laura loomer
(24:27):
, who has has a greatwhack-a-doodle influence on our
current president, as was seenwhen a conversation with her
resulted in some staff membersgetting fired or removed from
their positions and she, and shesaid you're gonna say what she
(24:47):
said how about you say it Idon't, I don't know I don't know
what really she said somethingabout oh god, now we're gonna
look it up okay, well, you lookit up while I, while I I fill in
the space.
Speaker 3 (25:00):
She cause?
Is she referring it to the factthat you know our, our dear
leader?
Speaker 1 (25:25):
wanted to open up alcatraz itself.
And then you know, insteadwe're going to put millions.
Well, that was, you know, not,not economically feasible, right
?
Speaker 3 (25:37):
so this is where I found it and I'll reference this
.
Actually, let me cut it outright now, because this is
coming from a place calledProximity Portal, substack, and
she said alligator lives matter.
The good news is, alligatorsare guaranteed at least 65
million meals if we get startednow.
(25:59):
And the reason why that's soconcerning well, I'm sure most
people can figure out that'sconcerning is because there's
approximately 65 million Latino,hispanic people in the United
States, according to the CensusBureau.
Now, obviously, there are not65 million undocumented people
living here, right?
So this is referencing theentire latino population in the
(26:21):
country by saying uh, let'sthrow them all on alligator,
alligator, alcatraz.
The fact that she can say thatis and and it's okay for people
to hear that is so disturbing isso disturbing.
(26:43):
We've seen this happen inhistory many, many, many times.
Where people are denyingthere's a genocide happening,
where people are denying thatpeople are being targeted and we
know exactly where this ends up.
I had a client who said to memonths and months and months ago
he said the way of Gaza isgoing to become the way of the
United States.
And I thought I was like no,that can't be right.
But he's right, he's 100% right, that is going to happen here.
Speaker 1 (27:07):
So I mean, this is, this is our intention, dear
listeners.
It's not to be alarmist, it isto be real, right, because these
are also, in addition to that,it is, the conditions in which
our mental health is existing.
So this is a collectivelytraumatizing event around this
(27:45):
country.
Everywhere are going to witnessan increasingly militarized
state police force that is isbeing in, in, that is employing
a certain cohort of people right, that have a certain belief
system people who are just doingtheir job right Like that is
not going to fly.
People who agree with 65 billionpeople being ethnically
(28:11):
cleansed, right?
So there are important thingsto know about and these are
talking points that you canutilize and you can continue to
train yourself to the advocatesin this work and to stay active
in this work, because takingaction can make people feel more
grounded during this process.
(28:34):
So we know that a lot of thesefacilities, some of these
companies, have had previoushuman rights violations.
During the previous round of,like this progressive
dehumanization andde-rightsification, shall we say
(28:55):
, of immigrant populations, likethis has been the failing of
the democratic party, in whichthey just kind of pushed things
along, they pushed the Overtonwindow around around immigration
.
You know, to the right, thereare things that could have been
done to make it possible forpeople who were married to
(29:15):
United States citizens getcitizenship.
Speaker 3 (29:20):
Erica, I have to jump in because the guy just showed
up in the lobby.
Should I let him in?
Speaker 1 (29:29):
Sure, why not?
Let's go ahead and do this.
Speaker 3 (29:35):
Oh gosh, it's hysterical.
This is going to be.
Speaker 1 (29:38):
this is going to be a very amazing it really is.
Speaker 3 (29:43):
Hello, hello how are?
Speaker 2 (29:45):
you hi, I am so sorry .
I just want to apologize to youboth.
I just I I misread the time andI was looking through my past
messages.
I am so sorry that's right.
Speaker 1 (29:57):
So we're actually actively recording.
Speaker 3 (29:59):
We are we're recording right now.
We're actually activelyrecording.
Speaker 1 (30:01):
We are recording right now.
Speaker 3 (30:04):
This episode is hysterical because we're like
all over the place.
Speaker 1 (30:07):
Yeah, we're covering a lot of different topics, so
just to orient you as far aswhere we have our audiences
currently, the journey that ouraudience has been taking, we've
been talking about closure ofhealth care systems in Rhode
(30:29):
Island, a anti-union response ofa health care system to nurses
striking due to poor conditions,and then we shifted also a
little bit over to Matt.
Speaker 3 (30:43):
I don't want to like.
You want to continue the nextone?
Yeah, there was a.
I teach part time and there wasan incident recently where it
sounded like there was activegunfire while I was teaching a
class and I had to deal withthat on a on and it was very
unnerving.
So we talked about that andthen we had shifted into talking
about the detention center, akaconcentration camps, going on
right now, and we were right onthat topic when you popped in.
Speaker 1 (31:10):
So I'm going to give you an opportunity to say like,
if you want to say that, or veryrapid bouncing around of
different topics, is thereanything about those kinds of
things that you would like tosay anything about?
Speaker 3 (31:25):
And actually wait.
Hang on.
Is it John or Hannah?
Speaker 2 (31:28):
Because oh, so I guess let me just say a short
introduction.
So, hi everybody, my name isHannah and it translates to John
.
You guys can just call me Johnhere on this, on this podcast,
but I just wanted to justclarify that, and I just want to
again first like apologize toyou both.
(31:50):
That was incredibly rude of meand I acknowledge that I misread
the time.
So it happens.
Yeah, I just want to apologizeto you both time.
So it happens.
Yeah, I just want to apologizeto you both and in terms of any
other comments that I have, Imean, in a summary, I've just
been trying to stay active withwhat's going on across the world
(32:13):
.
There's a few political analystsand journalists that I've been
reading about, but, yeah, I meanthe recent big, big, beautiful
bill that was passed and theoutcome, or the long-term
outcomes as of now are, are atforms, the girl task and, um, in
my opinion, uh, I I just reallythink that we are at a very low
(32:35):
point, but I do.
I do see that it's going to getbetter, though, just because I
think that this was bound tohappen when we would hit this
very bottom pit.
So I guess that's a summary ofhow I'm feeling.
I know I don't have as muchknowledge in the healthcare area
, but I know that with cuts toMedicaid for millions of
(32:59):
Americans, it's disgusting.
So all I can do is just try toempathize.
All I can do is try to be ableto listen and ask questions to
people and keep learning andcontribute to people that are in
need.
So that's my personal sentimentand I'm still learning, so I'm
(33:19):
sure I can learn more from youguys on this topic.
Speaker 3 (33:22):
And the one question I have is because I want to call
you what you prefer to becalled.
Do you prefer to be calledHannah or do you prefer to be
called John?
Speaker 2 (33:31):
You guys can call me John.
Speaker 3 (33:32):
Okay, all right, I just wanted to check with you
because that's important,obviously.
So originally I was going tohave you come on the show
because you are PalestinianAmerican and I wanted you to
talk about your coming outprocess because you, at least
from what I can see, if you werea TikTok, you identify as gay
and the only problem is I have ahard stop at 1210.
(33:53):
So I don't know if we shouldhave you back on to talk about
that later, because I don't wantyou to be rushed.
We should have you back on totalk about that later because I
don't want you to be rushed.
So we can just pick up withwhat we were talking about now.
If you want to talk more aboutbecause you also have long-term
plans to run for office, correct?
Yes, so I don't know if youwant to talk about that a little
(34:14):
bit and then we'll have youback on the show later on.
Speaker 2 (34:16):
Um sure, yeah, I can share a little bit more about
that.
So I actually this was likepretty recent in terms of like
what inspired me to run longterm, and in my mind I so a
little background.
I have been doing a lot of selfwork in and out of therapy for
(34:38):
several years and I would saythat one thing that I have
personally learned that, in myopinion, is common with a lot of
people in America and evenaround the world, is, I think we
have a very fearful-mindedheadspace.
Instead of having a healthyrange of our emotions that help
us be able to make decisions, welet fear overtake a lot of our
(35:01):
decision-making process and ourthoughts, and I used to be like
that, and I think that a lot, ofa lot of people have that sort
of headspace.
They're feeling desensitized,they're feeling very anxious as
anxiety and depression rates areskyrocketing, especially with
younger generations.
Speaker 3 (35:19):
And which, John, if I can add that in my opinion that
is by design.
That's actually why I startedthis podcast, is because we are
conditioned to live that way.
Speaker 2 (35:31):
Yeah, and I personally think that it is
atrocious that this is how we'reteaching future generations to
live is instead, actually,instead of live, you're just,
they're just trying to survive.
You know it's all about ifyou're lucky enough to get a job
, if you're lucky enough to havea good form of healthcare, if
(35:54):
you're lucky enough to get yourtuition wavered, or if you're
lucky enough, even despiteworking really hard, you're
going to get scholarshipsthrough collegesed, or if you're
lucky enough, even despiteworking really hard, you're
going to get scholarshipsthrough colleges, etc.
So I don't think that's fair atall to have the younger
generations live a life thatprior generations especially
during the 50s, 60s, 70s withthe boomers and Gen X are have
been able to live.
(36:15):
But like, where I'm trying togo back with this idea of a
fearful foundation is fear hadheld me back a lot in my life
and I can share that in a futurepodcast with you guys, with my
coming out experience, and thatwas probably the start for me of
retraining my mind or my brain,to not have to make decisions
in a very anxiety inducingheadspace, anxiety-inducing
(36:44):
headspace, and I tell peopleanxiety is an effect or a result
of fear.
That is not actually, that maynot be realistic In terms of why
I want to go into office andhow I've been bouncing around
between prior topics.
I'm now at a headspace whereI'm continuing to learn on how
to regulate my emotions andfeelings in and out of therapy.
The one thing I've been learningis with coming out, with being
(37:06):
an atheist or non-religious andgrowing up in a very religious
household, with, you know, goingto college and becoming a
better critical thinker throughlike what I majored in and how I
apply that in my personal life,with self-learning and doing
other things, and then watchingthe political landscape, like
Zoran Mamdani winning thedemocratic primary race, and
(37:32):
even just being able to justconsider what exactly I'm doing
in my personal life, likedonating to those in Gaza and
actively talking to people allacross the world, like those in
Ukraine, those in Sudan.
So it made me realize that thesequalities of empathy, curiosity
(37:52):
, compassion, altruism itsignaled to me.
Okay, I feel this desire in methat I want to help out the
American people and recognizingagain that we're at the bottom
point right now in terms ofwhere our country is at.
You know, we're under adictatorship, in my mind, or an
authoritarian government.
Who has who?
(38:13):
Our president has hit the 14points of fascism, to my
understanding.
So you know it made me realizeif I am possessing these
qualities and I want to myunderstanding.
So you know it made me realizeif I am possessing these
qualities and I want to help outmore people, especially in this
country, then I think having ayounger face that actually wants
to help people out can makepeople feel less desensitized
(38:35):
and have more optimism, and Iwant to share my optimism with
them and have more optimism, andI want to share my optimism
with them.
Speaker 3 (38:42):
I love everything you said and, as both as an
educator and a therapist, I II'm very happy that you do both
therapy and we're talking aboutcollege.
I think that's fantastic, andyou brought up so many great
points.
One of your tick tocks, becauseI watched, obviously, a lot of
your tech talks.
That's how I found you.
Um, you had talked aboutgetting all getting people out
of office, who were alsoproblematic too, because,
although I can't stand Trump andI, he is.
(39:03):
He is a symptom of the of abigger problem, right, we have
so much corruption and Eric andI were just.
I was quoting this book.
I don't know if you've read itGenocide, bad.
Speaker 2 (39:12):
I've heard of it, but I'm not.
Speaker 3 (39:14):
It's.
I just started reading it.
I would highly recommend it.
But the author talks about thekind of illusion of the two
party system.
Reading it, I would highlyrecommend it.
But the author talks about thekind of illusion of the two
party system.
And they are.
They're just all corrupt, right, like, I think, anybody who's
taking money from a foreigncountry and has a foreign
country's interest before theUnited States should be, I don't
know, imprisoned.
That's my opinion, but it's,it's never going to happen
(39:35):
because at least not right now,because it's so embedded and
even in in my neck of the woods,our, our senators, our
congressmen they've been inoffice for decades can't and
nobody can get them out yeah, Ia few comments to that.
Speaker 2 (39:50):
I believe, at this moment, the median age of our
congress.
Do you guys want to take aguess what it is?
The median age 65.
My close, how about yourself,erica?
Speaker 1 (40:03):
I'm going to go ahead and say 68.
Speaker 2 (40:08):
It's actually 63.
Wow, but yeah, very yeah, thatthe median age of our Congress
(40:29):
is 63.
And the American dream, or thisideological view of you you get
a job, or you go to high school, you get your diploma, you get
a.
You go to college, you graduate, you get a job, you eventually
own a home, and back, I think,in the 70s and 80s you could
correct me if I'm wrong, matthewand Erica you would have an
income that was, I believe, athird of the house that you
(40:55):
would eventually pay and buy offas your own asset.
But these were parts of whatcomprised of the American dream
and, in my opinion, if we'rehaving people run this country
that are very close toretirement age which is, in
essence, a huge like endpointfor the American dream is you
would eventually retire, likewhat?
60, 65 years old, and they'restill leaving this country then
in my mind, they're pretty muchgoing against what the whole
(41:17):
essence or the whole idea iswith the end goal of the
American dream, like why do youwant to continue to be in this
position of power, why do youwant to continue to lead this
country?
And I think a big factor withthese generations that are still
in power is they are.
They're not really empathetic.
They don't really understand,like, what goes on in the
(41:37):
headspace of, let's say, say, asingle mom who was working as a
bank teller and has to pay offher.
Let's say she can't afford ahome, like her monthly rent or
child care or uh, what she hasto do to just pay for even the
basic necessities, like uh forfood and uh for health care
insurance and it.
Perhaps she has a car, like shehas car insurance or a car
(42:00):
mortgage.
I think katie porter did afantastic job at being able to
call jamie diamond out on his bsand in a court case and he was
just completely aesthetic.
He just kept on responding to avery similar situation like
this.
He said I don't know, I have tothink about that I might be
wrong of this, but wasn't katieporter also?
Speaker 3 (42:17):
because I remember following her on tick tock and
really liked her.
But then wasn't she also kindof a little shady too?
Wasn't she talking about nottaking any money from any sort
of institutions?
And she was also taking a lotof money too.
Speaker 2 (42:31):
I'm not entirely sure about that, but perhaps that's
another question for me to thinkabout is you know what sort of
donations has she taken?
And I know the FederalElections Commission's website,
or the FECP, I believe,showcases and publicizes
donations that individuals thatare running for Senate or for
(42:53):
the House of Representativeswould be taking, and it's in a
tabular data, tabular structurelike.
The data is shown like onerecord and every record
represents a certain amount ofmoney that that candidate
running for like in this case,legislative branch, would be
taking from each of the um, fromeach of like, let's say, the
(43:15):
political action committees orso, um.
So yeah, I would.
I actually am interested in howto look into the fbc uh website
and just be like, what sort ofcommittees or packs perhaps that
katie porter is takingdonations from?
Speaker 3 (43:29):
but I, I do that website track a pack, so I'm
gonna I'm gonna have to look itup because I remember liking her
and then I remember this was awhile ago thinking she was a
hypocrite because it was likethat other.
There was another guy, I can'tremember his name.
He was on TikTok.
He was using the platform tolike run, get a lot of support
and he was talking about howmuch he was reaching out to
(43:51):
people on TikTok, but then hewas in support of the TikTok ban
.
Do you know what I'm talkingabout?
Speaker 2 (43:56):
I can't remember his name.
I'm not entirely sure um I Ihonestly had started using
TikTok more frequently in thepast couple of several months.
Speaker 1 (44:11):
But yeah, I'm not too sure about that.
What is starting to happen asfar as people who are starting
to move towards running foroffice that are like young?
Right, absolutely, as youcommented, it's so important
because we need to be planningfor the future and it seems like
(44:34):
there is this very, very, verystrong pattern of the older
generation who has been stuck inleadership how should I say or
clung to leadership, as far astheir disconnection from these
issues that are top of mind.
For people who are like I'mplanning on being on the planet
(44:57):
for another you know 50, 60years, not like I'm only going
to be on this planet for another, you know 10 to 30 years it's
definitely, as Matt was saying,it's very encouraging as far as
for us, like for our roles, Ifind it the most powerful thing
and the most encouraging thingfor my existence to continue to
(45:18):
support youth in their steppinginto leadership.
So how does that feel for youat this point in time?
As far as like where becausethere's politics is a whole
different situation, right?
Political actors, politicaloperatives that play roles in
(45:40):
shaping public opinion, shapingmass communications I know that
for me, learning about thosekinds of things are a little bit
intimidating and I'm justcurious how are you managing or
how are you feeling about, youknow, how should I say like
coming across this differentworld or parallel world that
exists, that has so much of animpact on day-to-day people?
Speaker 2 (46:03):
So just to understand your question, dr Erica, I
believe you're asking how do Iand other, perhaps younger
individuals take in so much ofwhat is going on across the
world, especially with thepolitical landscape?
Is that what you're asking?
Speaker 1 (46:24):
Yeah, and like the mechanisms of politics, right,
because as the, as a powerstructure, as a, as a process
structure, it's like verydifferent from the rest of life.
Speaker 2 (46:38):
Yeah, I think that I think again that's the first
word that comes to my mind ispessimistic for a lot of younger
people and in terms of mypersonal thoughts, the reason
why I could feel pessimistic alot about the how, the
mechanisms of the politicallandscape, and then also the the
(47:00):
reality of how.
It is so different from how alot of younger people feel in
their day-to-day life is moneyLike.
That's the biggest factor forme when it comes to being able
to try to better understand thepolitical landscape.
Many people just associatebeing in Congress or, you know,
(47:22):
being like president or somebodythat is in our government.
They associate it with not justpower, but people associate
power to money and you know, forexample, if you are, you know,
somebody in your 40s or 50s or60s, then, assuming that you
have been able to accumulatemore money and saved it and
(47:43):
invested in your life, it'sgoing to be much easier for you
to be able to run a campaign sothat way you can promote your
message, and to be able totravel across the country, give
talks like if you're lookinglike, in this case, for somebody
who's running for presidency,but if you're somebody who is
looking to run for, let's sayyour district and you want to
win a seat in the house ofrepresentatives, then it's going
(48:08):
to require a lot of money to beable to promote yourself and
your message besides activelydoing it on social media,
because there's going to be alot of people who aren't as
active politically.
But I think that where a lot ofyounger people maybe are not
understanding of this which Iacknowledge, because a lot of
younger people tend to not getinvolved in politics until maybe
(48:30):
in their mid-20s, I'd say justbecause they don't have a
full-time job, they don'tunderstand how it affects
everyday costs or monthly costslike having a home or paying off
student debt, et cetera.
The most difficult thing isbeing able to like people
locally that don't have enoughmoney, that want to get into
(48:52):
politics, and I think that'sgoing to be a big challenge for
me because you know I don't havemajor connections out there,
like Andrew Cuomo, for example,who can be able to talk to, like
DoorDash and get, like hismajor campaign donation of a
million dollars from them whenhe's running when he was running
for and, I believe, still isrunning for, new York City mayor
(49:14):
.
So for people that are around myage or so or younger people
that are wanting to get intopolitics.
The question is, how can youknow, how can we try to speak up
more or or spread our messageswhen money is a big issue, when
we're when we need to have moneyto promote ourselves and make
(49:35):
ourselves more wellknown,besides the usage of technology?
So you know, I think thatthat's a big like point that
I've been thinking about andthat's something that is
challenging.
But if your message spreadswith a lot of people like Kat
Abugazale, who's right here,locally close by to me, and
(49:58):
she's running for the 9thDistrict, she just exploded
online because she has beenspeaking and preaching out to so
many people that aredesensitized and want a strong
change in the Democraticestablishment.
So she's been getting a lot ofcampaign donations from many
average Americans.
So I think she's doing afantastic job, and that's a
(50:21):
similar campaign that I and withZora Mamdani.
Speaker 3 (50:24):
Those are similar campaigns I hope I can be able
to learn from and do, john, if Icould ask one question, or just
actually to both of you, to getwhat your thoughts on this are,
because I think the otherproblem is and I forgot who said
this absolute power corruptsabsolutely, and I don't
necessarily know if youngerpeople are immune to that either
(50:46):
, because we certainly havequite a few younger people who
are in Congress and the Senatewho are just as corrupt, and
politics in itself is a corruptinstitution.
And when you take a healthyperson and you put them in a
corrupt institution, theinstitution doesn't generally
get healthier.
(51:06):
The healthy person becomescorrupt.
And I'm just how do you, howcan you prepare yourself for
that and how do you prevent thatfrom happening?
Or have you thought about that?
How do you prevent that fromhappening?
Speaker 2 (51:19):
Or have you thought about that?
Actually, I had a conversationwith my mom about this yesterday
and I was telling her that, inmy perspective, I don't think a
lot of politicians are asself-aware.
I think that they are just.
(51:39):
I think that they are just morefocused on what can benefit
them to stay in power and to beable to have more money.
But I also have questions attimes, such as what is going on
behind the scenes.
You know, are there, you know,once they, you know, are there
people who reach out to themlike big political action
(52:01):
committee saying, hey, you know,we want to, we'll sponsor you,
we'll pay you this much, butthen you have to be a talking
mouthpiece and this salespersonor this person that's going to
essentially make us look betterand speak more positively about
us, and then we'll just funnelmore of our, of our campaign
donations into, or our donationsinto, your campaign.
(52:24):
So I think, then, it's also apart of this change or evolution
, right when somebody that maybe, like that's younger or doesn't
have enough money and wants torun for politics.
You know, I think that if theyare not as self-aware or they're
not staying true to their corevalues and that tie into helping
(52:44):
out so many people, then Ithink they're going to start to
lose a part of their identityand then they're going to all of
a sudden focus on changing intoa more like, perhaps a greedy
person, let's say.
You know, like, for example.
I think at the core of why wehave so many like, why we have
such a stark difference inwealth gap, inequality, is
(53:05):
because these people that havebecome incredibly rich, like
Jamie Dimon, for example, cameto America and were poor, I
believe, like I believe hisparents were immigrants and he
came with them here.
But they eventually lose touchwith the struggles of the
average American and whatthey're dealing with.
And I think that as you start tolike in my mind and this is
(53:28):
just theoretical again, it maybe an over-generalization when
people start to realize thatwhen they're in politics, they
start to gradually increase moreof their money through, like
these campaign donations from,like big PACs, it can eventually
just exponentially boom interms of, after some time,
they're just going to get moreand more and more money that
(53:49):
they'll reinvest or that theywill, that they'll keep for
themselves, and then I thinkthey start to live a much more
fearful minded headspace of Idon't want to lose my money I
don't want to lose my investmentand then they start to lose
touch with many otherindividuals that they could have
(54:10):
easily connected with prior togetting to that position or
prior to even getting thesedonations.
So I think, still, like, as muchas we want to promote positive
change, I think this is agradual or a pretty like
exponential negative change forsome people that get into office
, even if they're younger,because I think they're not as
self-aware to recognize that, oh, these were my core values
(54:33):
before of like kindness andrepresenting people, and you
know, I came from like a poordistrict or I came from a poor
family or I came from a terribleenvironment.
And then, once they start toget so much money through
campaign not campaign throughdonations for their campaign
that you know being funneledinto their pockets, all of a
(54:53):
sudden now their priorities aregoing to change if they're not
as self-aware, and then they'regoing to focus on those people
instead, and that can lead themto becoming more greedy,
apathetic and not compassionateenough to understand the
struggles of many people.
So I think self-awareness is abig quality that can lead to the
fate of where these people are.
Speaker 3 (55:14):
John, there's so much to say, we don't have enough
time Because there is.
You said a lot of stuff and oneof the things if you look at
corporations like ceos, theyparticularly look for people who
have personality disorder, liketraits, because they will have
no problem going in on christmaseve and laying off half the
(55:37):
staff.
Right, because that's kind ofwhat they do.
And I wonder how much ofpolitics ends up being the same
thing, right, where you'relooking for people who have
these traits.
That may not be so good,because I think the focus is
always re -election, not helpingthe people.
(55:57):
The focus is always keeping themoney, not making change.
And we have a great example ofthis in Rhode Island, where we,
I think, are the first state inthe country who did the Homeless
Bill of Rights, which gives allof these rights to people who
are homeless.
And one of the things I reallylove and I'm being sarcastic is
(56:18):
the performative stuff we do.
Right, so we change the name ofthe homeless people to the
unhoused, because somehow thatmakes it sound better.
But I would imagine if you askany person who doesn't have a
house, would you rather becalled unhoused or would you
rather have housing, they wouldsay please give me housing right
.
So, like we do this stuff Nowat the same time, we have this
Bill of Rights, have we havecities in the state of rhode
(56:39):
island that are criminalizinghomelessness and like taking
down you know tents, but thensaying like, oh well, we're
going to pass a law that givesyou the right to then sue and
then get yeah, okay, becausethey're going to run out and get
a lawyer.
I mean it.
The whole thing is like superperformative, to make it sound
like we're actually doingsomething.
Why, at the same time, we havea 37% rise in homelessness in
(56:59):
one year and we have a 60% risein people living in their cars,
but we're going to continue topretend we're addressing it by
do you know what I mean?
It's like so performative.
Speaker 1 (57:13):
Yeah, and I think that younger generations have
been expressing their awarenessof that um, so I am really
looking forward to our furtherof both this conversation.
Yes, you and I, we have someimmigrant activists that we're
(57:34):
gonna have here.
So, uh, dear listeners, thankyou so much for this lovely
journey that we've been ontogether.
It's a little bit bit humor, sowe're good.
We had a um, this, this episode, is the overview episode of
something, yes, coming in in thepipes for us to be talking
about a little bit morethoroughly um, john, uh, I am
(57:55):
very much looking forward tohaving additional time and we'll
get that on the schedule and um, talking about, um, this like
commitment and persistence thatboth exists in your experience
outside of politics, the worldof politics that you are going
to be taking into the world ofpolitics, as well as the other
(58:15):
things that you are, um, thatyou know are focusing on, and we
so appreciate your time and weso appreciate your arrival and I
agree.
Speaker 3 (58:28):
To echo everything Erica said.
I look forward to having moreconversations with you, John, so
I'll I'll send you a messageand we can.
We can come up with anothertime, but it was really nice
meeting you and I'm glad thatyou're here and anything we can
do to help promote that.
When you decide to run, let meknow.
And if there's anything youwant me to add on the show notes
, like if you want me to putyour TikTok stuff in, I can put
(58:49):
a link to that and I'll send youa copy of the episode before we
release it.
Speaker 2 (58:55):
Of course, yeah, and I know you said you needed to
leave at 1210 Easter StandardTime.
Pomp to Tomat.
I just want to say one more timeI profusely apologize again
because I'm just trying to putmyself in your shoes and I
recognize that I came in laterthan the scheduled time and that
(59:15):
was a misread on my end.
But I just want to say Iappreciate you both just letting
me you know, still be able tocome on and talk, and I'd love
to be able to connect with youguys further and again I wish
you guys the best.
Um, I'll send you my tiktok andyoutube channel, which my
youtube channel shares a lot ofstories about my dates and other
(59:36):
experiences, and I also sharesome other things related to my
journey doing OnlyFans as well,which I think can be a topic to
discuss down the road, becauseyou know there's a stigma of
course of, like you know,onlyfans and doing professional
work and things like that youknow, and so I'll share that
information with you.
Matt and Dr Eric, I'd love tofollow you on TikTok and keep in
(59:58):
touch with you as well.
Again, thank you to you both,just still to have me on and
love to talk with you guys again.
Speaker 3 (01:00:05):
Thank you everybody, and thank you again for
listening.
This is just a reminder that nopart of this podcast can be
(01:00:36):
duplicated or copied withoutwritten consent from either
myself or Wendy.
Speaker 1 (01:00:38):
Thank, you again.
This podcast is not intended to serve as therapeutic
advice or to replace anyprofessional treatment.
These opinions belong to us anddo not reflect any company or
agency.
Speaker 3 (00:27):
Hi everybody and welcome back to another episode
of the United States of PTSD.
I have the absolutely wonderfuland fabulous Erica with me
again today.
Speaker 1 (00:38):
Hi everyone, I'm happy to be here.
Speaker 3 (00:41):
I love having you here.
Speaker 1 (00:43):
It's very nourishing.
Speaker 3 (00:45):
One of the best things that's come out of
creating this podcast has beenmeeting you, by the way.
I just have to say so it wasseriously, so it's been such a
blessing and privilege.
We originally had a guestspeaker that was going to come
on, but we actually don't knowwhat happened to the speaker.
So Eric and I are going to talkabout some other topics today
that are equally important.
I'm going to cover a couple oflocal events here over on the
(01:09):
East Coast in Rhode Island and,Erica, you're going to talk
about a wonderful and I say thatsarcastically person over there
at your deck of the woods.
Yeah, we'll talk about somethings happening over in the
borderlands.
Oh man, so an update.
I know a couple episodes ago wetalked about why I talked about
(01:32):
how there was a lot of issueswith healthcare in Rhode Island
and, as far as I know, the placethat was closing, anchor, which
is the one of the biggestplaces for primary care doctors,
closed.
But a couple of other things Iwanted to just briefly mention
is that we also had a situationwith a hospital that specializes
in mental health and they hadthe nurses there had gone on
strike because of poor workingconditions.
(01:54):
There's a problem with patientto staff ratio.
As a matter of fact, there wasan incident I think it was a
year ago where a nurse at RhodeIsland Hospital was assaulted by
a patient and almost died, andthey did a nice PR stunt where
it seems like they blamed thenurse for not following protocol
that didn't exist yeah, not theactual staff, like the nurses,
(02:19):
but the higher ups and he almostdied.
It was a pretty horrific thing.
So these nurses went on strikeand the hospital's response was
to just terminate all their jobs, which makes me laugh, because
who is ever going to work forthat company now?
Speaker 1 (02:35):
I mean, that is what you would hope.
Speaker 3 (02:38):
True, yes, yes, I guess that's true.
Speaker 1 (02:41):
Yeah, and you know, I think that, like Matt, if
you're willing to share as aperspective, as a mental health
care worker who, like,understands the importance of
client and patient to personratio under those conditions,
like, could you like walk ourlisteners through, like, some of
(03:01):
the reasons why it's soimportant, even though, like you
have the obvious like, couldyou, could you like walk our
listeners through, like, some ofthe reasons why it's so
important, even though, like youhave the obvious consequence of
, like somebody having theirphysical safety compromised to
the point of almost being killed?
You know, can you just share alittle bit?
Speaker 3 (03:20):
Yeah, actually two things come to mind immediately.
One of them I talked about wayback in season one, before I met
you.
Erica and I had a student thatwas murdered and she worked in a
homeless shelter.
I don't know the staffingsituation, but most again, most
places are understaffed andthere was somebody who came in
(03:42):
that I think was a resident orsomebody that was staying at the
shelter and murdered her withan ax.
And I know that there werestaff members there, but I don't
know how many there were.
But there was another incidentrecently in Connecticut where I
think it was, a visiting nursewas doing a home visit on a, I
guess, a patient she had seenbefore and the patient kidnapped
her, murdered her and she wasin the basement for, I think, a
(04:04):
couple of days before they foundher.
So we and then the incident Ijust talked about about the
nurse being assaulted and if Iremember correctly I might be
off on this, but it was over aphone the nurse was trying to
follow a no phone policy for thepeople coming in and the
patient punched him in the chestand I guess he went to the
bathroom.
He seemed fine and then hepassed out of the bathroom and
(04:25):
had some sort of major cardiacepisode, and so it's really
important, especially whenyou're dealing with people who
are compromised, whether it'sthrough things like strokes or
organic stuff going on thatchanges the way they're thinking
, or if it's a mental healthissue.
Right, there was another casethis is probably decades ago
because it was when I firststarted where there was a social
(04:48):
worker and a nurse doing a homevisit on a client they had been
seeing for a very long time whohad schizophrenia, and the
patient stopped taking themedication.
So when the visiting teamshowed up, the patient was
psychotic and ended up stabbing,I think, the social worker in
the head with a knife and killedthem.
I think that it was one of thetwo was stabbed, I don't
(05:08):
remember which one.
So these are all incidents ofwhy it's so important for us to
have staff that matches thepatient or client caseload,
because you just never know.
You never know what's going tohappen.
I mean, we deal with people whoare incredibly compromised.
Speaker 1 (05:28):
So I think there are some things that I want to bring
up as well in this discussion,because, you know veterinary
medicine we have patients thatcan kill us too, and it's not
(06:00):
like I want to emphasize thefact that it's like not the
fault of a person or an animalin of like that there is a risk
that we are taking, like everyveterinary professional that
goes into a room with a 120pound canine corso that they've
never met before is taking aphysical risk, like a life
physical risk to serve, physicalrisk to serve right.
(06:29):
And so I do want to bring upthat complexity because, like,
while we talk about these thingsthat are about violence being
like, I guess, like withviolence itself, that sometimes
doesn't have a lot of goodexplanations around it or not a
whole lot of reasoning around it, it can be very difficult to
hear about that, and so I dowant to put forward that, you
(06:52):
know, as devastating as thesetypes of risks and losses are,
there are ways to do it safelyright.
We can't be 100% safe all thetime, but, um, both people and
animals, um, and living beingsthat, um, that uh, can be
dangerous to work with at times,are also very deeply deserving
(07:15):
of care and compassion.
Um, so I want to pair that withthat, because sometimes,
sometimes it doesn't.
Speaker 3 (07:23):
Yeah, I thank you for pointing that out.
I've actually heard storiesfrom vets too about dealing with
their patient not the animalpatient, but the human patient.
Oh gosh being threatened, beinglike assaulted, being followed
home, like all of these terriblethings, and that's stuff that I
don't think a lot of people areaware of.
That I mean, I certainly wasnot aware of it until I heard
(07:44):
about it, cause you just don'tthink about that stuff until you
experience it and, honestly, Ithink it's very difficult to
talk about, like, preparingright.
Speaker 1 (07:53):
I think that preparing and understanding
preparing to respond issomething and in veterinary
medicine, one way that we areprepared to respond is we're not
alone.
We don't go into thesesituations alone, because if you
(08:13):
have people who are experiencedand know how to respond with
veter, you know the types oflike.
You know with veterinarymedicine, we have medications
that we use to help a processand I think that it's important
that, like fundamentally that'swhy it's so compromising of
(08:36):
safety to be understaffed whenyou're working with a population
that is at risk for havingincapacitated responses.
Speaker 3 (08:49):
Which that the understaffing issue is going to
lead into the second part of thestory I have to tell.
But I want to go back just tothere's two other things I
wanted to mention that werehappening in Rhode Island.
Another one is our favoriteinsurance company and again I
say that sarcastically united isgetting into some sort of
pissing contest with the biggesthospital network in the state
(09:11):
and now they're deciding atleast my understanding is
they're deciding that they'reconsidering that hospital and
all its partners out of networkand not paying for any of their
services.
So we have, and not paying forany of their services, so we
have.
Oh, and then the other majorplace in Rhode Island who does
primary care work has also filedbankruptcy.
So when you put all of thosethings together and then the
(09:33):
reimbursement rates are garbagein Rhode Island, doctors are
fleeing the state we don't evenhave.
We do not have one dentalclinic in the entire state that
people can go to for emergenciesat all.
Like no hospital in the entirestate that people can go to for
emergencies at all.
Like no hospital in the entirestate will treat dental stuff.
You'll have to get anappointment with a dentist a
couple days later.
I found that out the hard waywhen I had a dental issue.
(09:54):
So the state in general is a isa hellscape when it comes to
health care right now, and it'sgetting worse.
It's a hundred percent you'rebasically you.
Speaker 1 (10:06):
Basically, you and your community are experiencing
what many more parts of thecountry will be experiencing
soon.
Speaker 3 (10:13):
Absolutely, and we've been experiencing this for a
while.
If you look at the surroundingstates Connecticut,
massachusetts the reimbursementrate is so much better that all
of the doctors in Rhode Islandare kind of fleeing.
And personally again, this isjust my opinion I think a lot of
it has to do with mismanagementof money.
I mean, there's so much revenuethat's brought in from the
(10:34):
legalization of marijuana inRhode Island.
I don't know where that money'sgoing, and we have, I think
it's, the second highestcigarette tax in the state.
I'm not sure where that moneyis going either.
So actually I do know where itwent, because one of the one of
the core had done a research onthis before it was going to the
general fund, and where thegeneral fund is actually
utilized I have no idea.
(10:55):
But it makes you think, andwe'll talk about this later on
too.
If we took the money we'respending on creating wars and
committing genocide and took themoney that we're utilizing to
bring in the Gestapo in theUnited States and take out
everybody that they think lookslike a foreign person, well I
don't know, maybe we'd havemoney for housing, health care
and food, but that's a that's awhole other issue.
(11:17):
We'll get to that part in asecond.
Speaker 1 (11:20):
And if unionization action and striking action
wasn't dealt with illegally bycorporations by firing people,
because that is calledretaliation Right, and if we had
an administration thatrespected unions, then you know
we might be in a better position.
Speaker 3 (11:39):
So true, so true.
Speaker 1 (11:41):
So true.
Speaker 3 (11:42):
So I want to go to the crux of what I had to say,
which I'm still processing, eventhough it was a couple of weeks
later.
As you know, I teach and I wasteaching a summer class Last day
of class.
There was a total of 27students that are typically in
this class, but there was acouple of students that were
missing.
That's a larger size class.
(12:03):
Generally we have about 22, 23.
And I don't have a problem withteaching extra students and
this was actually a fantasticclass.
It was a wonderful group ofstudents.
We had three presentations todo that day and this class is
specifically about them doingpolicy work or doing something
around making change.
(12:23):
And ironically, we had onegroup was doing gun safety and
the recent law that went intoeffect in Rhode Island about
assault rifles, banning them.
And here we are, we're about todo the third presentation and
we hear a loud bang that soundslike a gunshot, like right
outside the window.
And I've lived in Providence.
(12:45):
I lived in Providence for 12years and during the summer we
always played the game gunshotor firework, because you never
knew what it was.
And Providence, I could tellyou right now, downplays the
amount of gunfire that goes onin that city.
I remember there was a vacationI had taken where there were 22
gunshots fired on my street.
That's actually one of thereasons why I ended up moving
(13:05):
out.
And there was a meeting we hadwith the police chief and the
local councilwoman and Iremember them basically saying
that if the bullet doesn'tconnect with anything or if they
don't find the bullet, theydon't consider it a shooting.
Therefore, you can play withthe numbers and make it sound
like gun violence is going downif you don't look for the
bullets and you don't look forwhere they land.
It can sound like gun violenceis going down if you don't look
(13:27):
for the bullets and you don'tlook for where they land.
But anyway it didn't.
Having heard fireworks, I shouldalso say it was during the day,
so fireworks generally don't gooff during the day, at least
normally, and everybody justkind of stopped.
The classroom is also allwindows and I thought what the
heck?
And then all of a sudden wehear three more and they were
(13:49):
very loud.
They could have been fireworks.
Nobody in the class thoughtthey were fireworks.
And I should also add we havesome gun owners that were
students and they actually hadsaid that's gunfire.
So there wasn't one personthere that actually believed it
was fireworks and I thought tomyself what the hell do I do
right now?
Right, so I don't.
I don't have keys to thebuilding, I can't lock the door.
(14:10):
Most college campuses, all thebuildings, are open.
This isn't just particular toour college campus.
I mean, most of them areaccessible all the time.
And I thought what the hell doI do right now?
How do I control this manypeople in a setting that we
don't really have any trainingfor?
And I thought, okay, we have a.
You know, we have this room inthe basement that is more of an
(14:31):
auditorium room and it's it's,it's.
There's two doors and they'reheavier, so they're they're
easier to, I think, barricade.
So I just said everybody getdownstairs, go into the
auditorium.
So they all went down there andwe called campus security,
which led to another problem,because apparently campus
security doesn't carry guns,because they're not allowed to,
which then effectively makesthem useless, because what are
(14:54):
they going to do if there's anactive shooter?
Absolutely nothing.
Now, in the meantime, wecontinue to hear these noises,
but they were getting furtheraway, which also makes me think
they were gunfire, because if itwas fireworks, they would all
be the same distance, youwouldn't be hearing them kind of
go away and you talk about.
I've never thought about thatas a college educator, it's
(15:16):
never crossed my mind.
That, seriously, I think, andrealizing the vulnerability,
realizing that I am nowresponsible for all of these
people and how much better itwould be if there was another
person that could have helped medo that, I mean, I think, or
even if there was training,because we're not trained on
that stuff.
And it was incrediblyterrifying.
(15:39):
And one of one of the studentshad pointed out that the, the
younger students, actually didbetter because they're used to
it.
They're used to it and theolder students did not.
Right, nor did I.
Like I was fine in the moment,like I think, in the moment I
just thought, okay, protect them, get this done, kind of stay
focused, do what you need to do.
And then I was driving home andI was it kind of all hit me
(16:02):
when I was driving home like, ohmy god, like any one of us
could have died if that, if thatwas a like a school shooter, I
think.
In my uh, amateur assessment ofwhat happened, I think it was
probably somebody driving byclose to the campus because
there's a lot of gang activityin providence, so it could have
been somebody firing at a car orwhatever.
(16:24):
I don't think it was actuallysomething that happened on
campus.
I just think it was reallyclose by, you know, and the
Providence police did come outand they were actually really
helpful, they were reallyfriendly and they were.
I think they were great in theway that they handled it.
But no educator, no student, nofaculty member, nobody should
have to deal with that, nobody.
(16:46):
And I don't know that havingmore staff would, would you know
, fix that if they were real.
But you know, with the summerclasses, nobody on campus.
So it's, it's even, it's evenworse.
And that was just it was.
It was terrifying, it wasabsolutely terrifying.
I really felt for my studentsand I, I, we.
In that moment I was reallylike holy shit, I could die
right now.
Speaker 1 (17:06):
You know, yeah, I mean, I think that there are
things that the things that Ithink are really important when
you're when navigating an acutetrauma that is involving
violence, and also like thethreat of public violence.
(17:28):
I think it's important to behaving conversations both before
right which are things thatyou're saying that at your
particular campus, like thatdidn't feel like that that had
happened.
And and after Right and thataftercare.
And I think that that's goingto be even more essential
(17:49):
because right now, like, as aswe know, like public violence is
a new norm of our, of our, ofour world here, and, you know,
we've been able to avoid it to acertain circumstance in a lot
of ways, but now, like it'shappening all over the country
(18:13):
as far as state public violence.
So I think that what I'd liketo check in with you about is
about your students.
As far as the conversations youwere able to have after, do you
feel like there was somecollective processing that you
all were able to do, or was itkind of like I know it was like
(18:35):
was it like the last day ofclass?
Speaker 3 (18:38):
Yeah, it was the last , literally the last day of
class.
Like the last day of class,yeah, it was the last, literally
the last day of class.
And after, after they cleared,the police cleared the building
and cleared the area, there wasone group who still had to do a
presentation and they didn'tfeel safe being in the building
and I certainly was not going tomake anybody stay in the
building.
Under those circumstances I waslike, absolutely, I totally get
it, you know, but then you havethe problem of grades being due
(18:59):
and like all this stuff.
So I made arrangements withthem to just do it online
afterwards, because I never.
I mean, there are people that goto that, that teach, just to
get a paycheck.
We know that.
Right, that is not me.
I go to class, I care about mystudents.
I'm very invested in mystudents.
So that night consisted of mesending out an email to the
(19:21):
whole class and then getting youknow, responding to students
individually, calling them onthe phone, checking with them
the next day, and then I wasable to get them connected with
the counseling center at schoolto do like a group processing
thing.
My supervisor was great intelling me, really validating
what I did, and saying likehere's, you know, let's get them
(19:42):
connected and that's what wedid.
So you know?
Again, it's just like nobodyshould have to go through that
right, like nobody.
And school should be a placethat people go to learn, not
worry about getting shot ordeported or kidnapped or like
sex trafficked or bombed or likeit's.
I don't know what happened.
Like I really don't know how wegot here.
(20:04):
I mean, I know how we'reprogressing, I just don't know,
like where it was.
Speaker 1 (20:07):
That, like that, that pivotal moment was, you know
yeah, I think that when we'retrying to process, uh, the loss
of collective safety, you know,I, I, I think at at times, you
do the best you can with whatyou have and you circle back and
(20:28):
you make sure that everyone ischecked in with.
And this is so.
You know, matt and I are goingto be having conversations with
people about organizing andcommunity organizing, and I
think that this is the why,right.
The why is because humans getthrough trauma better together
(20:53):
than in isolation.
Speaker 3 (20:55):
So true, I actually, by the way, I meant to plug this
book.
I haven't finished reading ityet, but I'll show you.
It's called Genocide Bad.
Have you seen this?
No, actually, you would reallylike it, because the author's
name is Sim Kern and myunderstanding is that they are a
trans Jewish person who istalking about how bad what's
happening in Palestine is rightnow, and there was something in
(21:19):
their book that I thought wasreally awesome, where they and I
don't know what the laws are onreading from the book.
I'll just summarize it and thisis in.
Again, it's by Sim Kern andit's called Genocide Bad and
they basically talk about theillusion of the DNC and how the
DNC kind of always runs on this.
This fear of everything isgoing to fall apart and they
(21:43):
need to kind of save the world,but at the same time, behind the
scenes, they're also pursuingpolicies about mass deportation,
mass incarceration, like allthe same stuff.
They're all owned by AIPAC.
Like there's literally nodifference between the two sides
.
One just looks prettier.
Speaker 1 (21:56):
I so did.
We want to shift to theborderlands.
Speaker 3 (21:59):
We can totally shift to that.
Speaker 1 (22:02):
Absolutely, because that's what this feels like.
Speaker 3 (22:04):
Yes, I thought it was a nice transition.
Speaker 1 (22:07):
So I live in Arizona.
I have a friend who lives inFlorence, arizona.
Florence Arizona is a site oftwo of the detention centers and
also where they are wanting tobuild more.
Now let me make this very, very, very clear for any audience
(22:31):
member who this space is newthese detention centers are run
by private companies.
Centers are run by privatecompanies.
The two largest one isCoreCivic and GeoGroup are the
two largest ones, so this islike private.
What is being built is aprivate detention system or
(22:56):
privately owned prison systemfor immigrants, regardless of
status.
Speaker 3 (23:04):
And I wish this is obviously the verbiage that
they're using, not that you'reusing the whole detention center
like.
Let's call it what it is.
It's kidnapping.
It's a concentration camp.
It's a kidnapping concentrationcamp.
Let's just call it that.
It's like.
I get so angry, even with like,even with people who claim to
be pro-Palestinian when theykeep talking about the war
(23:25):
between Israel and Gaza.
It is not a war, it is agenocide, and I correct this
over and, over and over again.
Speaker 1 (23:33):
Yeah, yeah.
These prisons, theseconcentration camps, the most
(24:05):
recent of which in the news, youknow, is in Florida where, as
built appropriately, so alreadyflooding day one in the path of
hurricanes that they say it canwithstand up to a category two
hurricane that region has had.
all of the most recent ones havebeen above that and you know
there's commentary um from thethe right, like uh, laura loomer
(24:27):
, who has has a greatwhack-a-doodle influence on our
current president, as was seenwhen a conversation with her
resulted in some staff membersgetting fired or removed from
their positions and she, and shesaid you're gonna say what she
(24:47):
said how about you say it Idon't, I don't know I don't know
what really she said somethingabout oh god, now we're gonna
look it up okay, well, you lookit up while I, while I I fill in
the space.
Speaker 3 (25:00):
She cause?
Is she referring it to the factthat you know our, our dear
leader?
Speaker 1 (25:25):
wanted to open up alcatraz itself.
And then you know, insteadwe're going to put millions.
Well, that was, you know, not,not economically feasible, right
?
Speaker 3 (25:37):
so this is where I found it and I'll reference this
.
Actually, let me cut it outright now, because this is
coming from a place calledProximity Portal, substack, and
she said alligator lives matter.
The good news is, alligatorsare guaranteed at least 65
million meals if we get startednow.
(25:59):
And the reason why that's soconcerning well, I'm sure most
people can figure out that'sconcerning is because there's
approximately 65 million Latino,hispanic people in the United
States, according to the CensusBureau.
Now, obviously, there are not65 million undocumented people
living here, right?
So this is referencing theentire latino population in the
(26:21):
country by saying uh, let'sthrow them all on alligator,
alligator, alcatraz.
The fact that she can say thatis and and it's okay for people
to hear that is so disturbing isso disturbing.
(26:43):
We've seen this happen inhistory many, many, many times.
Where people are denyingthere's a genocide happening,
where people are denying thatpeople are being targeted and we
know exactly where this ends up.
I had a client who said to memonths and months and months ago
he said the way of Gaza isgoing to become the way of the
United States.
And I thought I was like no,that can't be right.
But he's right, he's 100% right, that is going to happen here.
Speaker 1 (27:07):
So I mean, this is, this is our intention, dear
listeners.
It's not to be alarmist, it isto be real, right, because these
are also, in addition to that,it is, the conditions in which
our mental health is existing.
So this is a collectivelytraumatizing event around this
(27:45):
country.
Everywhere are going to witnessan increasingly militarized
state police force that is isbeing in, in, that is employing
a certain cohort of people right, that have a certain belief
system people who are just doingtheir job right Like that is
not going to fly.
People who agree with 65 billionpeople being ethnically
(28:11):
cleansed, right?
So there are important thingsto know about and these are
talking points that you canutilize and you can continue to
train yourself to the advocatesin this work and to stay active
in this work, because takingaction can make people feel more
grounded during this process.
(28:34):
So we know that a lot of thesefacilities, some of these
companies, have had previoushuman rights violations.
During the previous round of,like this progressive
dehumanization andde-rightsification, shall we say
(28:55):
, of immigrant populations, likethis has been the failing of
the democratic party, in whichthey just kind of pushed things
along, they pushed the Overtonwindow around around immigration
.
You know, to the right, thereare things that could have been
done to make it possible forpeople who were married to
(29:15):
United States citizens getcitizenship.
Speaker 3 (29:20):
Erica, I have to jump in because the guy just showed
up in the lobby.
Should I let him in?
Speaker 1 (29:29):
Sure, why not?
Let's go ahead and do this.
Speaker 3 (29:35):
Oh gosh, it's hysterical.
This is going to be.
Speaker 1 (29:38):
this is going to be a very amazing it really is.
Speaker 3 (29:43):
Hello, hello how are?
Speaker 2 (29:45):
you hi, I am so sorry .
I just want to apologize to youboth.
I just I I misread the time andI was looking through my past
messages.
I am so sorry that's right.
Speaker 1 (29:57):
So we're actually actively recording.
Speaker 3 (29:59):
We are we're recording right now.
We're actually activelyrecording.
Speaker 1 (30:01):
We are recording right now.
Speaker 3 (30:04):
This episode is hysterical because we're like
all over the place.
Speaker 1 (30:07):
Yeah, we're covering a lot of different topics, so
just to orient you as far aswhere we have our audiences
currently, the journey that ouraudience has been taking, we've
been talking about closure ofhealth care systems in Rhode
(30:29):
Island, a anti-union response ofa health care system to nurses
striking due to poor conditions,and then we shifted also a
little bit over to Matt.
Speaker 3 (30:43):
I don't want to like.
You want to continue the nextone?
Yeah, there was a.
I teach part time and there wasan incident recently where it
sounded like there was activegunfire while I was teaching a
class and I had to deal withthat on a on and it was very
unnerving.
So we talked about that andthen we had shifted into talking
about the detention center, akaconcentration camps, going on
right now, and we were right onthat topic when you popped in.
Speaker 1 (31:10):
So I'm going to give you an opportunity to say like,
if you want to say that, or veryrapid bouncing around of
different topics, is thereanything about those kinds of
things that you would like tosay anything about?
Speaker 3 (31:25):
And actually wait.
Hang on.
Is it John or Hannah?
Speaker 2 (31:28):
Because oh, so I guess let me just say a short
introduction.
So, hi everybody, my name isHannah and it translates to John
.
You guys can just call me Johnhere on this, on this podcast,
but I just wanted to justclarify that, and I just want to
again first like apologize toyou both.
(31:50):
That was incredibly rude of meand I acknowledge that I misread
the time.
So it happens.
Yeah, I just want to apologizeto you both time.
So it happens.
Yeah, I just want to apologizeto you both and in terms of any
other comments that I have, Imean, in a summary, I've just
been trying to stay active withwhat's going on across the world
(32:13):
.
There's a few political analystsand journalists that I've been
reading about, but, yeah, I meanthe recent big, big, beautiful
bill that was passed and theoutcome, or the long-term
outcomes as of now are, are atforms, the girl task and, um, in
my opinion, uh, I I just reallythink that we are at a very low
(32:35):
point, but I do.
I do see that it's going to getbetter, though, just because I
think that this was bound tohappen when we would hit this
very bottom pit.
So I guess that's a summary ofhow I'm feeling.
I know I don't have as muchknowledge in the healthcare area
, but I know that with cuts toMedicaid for millions of
(32:59):
Americans, it's disgusting.
So all I can do is just try toempathize.
All I can do is try to be ableto listen and ask questions to
people and keep learning andcontribute to people that are in
need.
So that's my personal sentimentand I'm still learning, so I'm
(33:19):
sure I can learn more from youguys on this topic.
Speaker 3 (33:22):
And the one question I have is because I want to call
you what you prefer to becalled.
Do you prefer to be calledHannah or do you prefer to be
called John?
Speaker 2 (33:31):
You guys can call me John.
Speaker 3 (33:32):
Okay, all right, I just wanted to check with you
because that's important,obviously.
So originally I was going tohave you come on the show
because you are PalestinianAmerican and I wanted you to
talk about your coming outprocess because you, at least
from what I can see, if you werea TikTok, you identify as gay
and the only problem is I have ahard stop at 1210.
(33:53):
So I don't know if we shouldhave you back on to talk about
that later, because I don't wantyou to be rushed.
We should have you back on totalk about that later because I
don't want you to be rushed.
So we can just pick up withwhat we were talking about now.
If you want to talk more aboutbecause you also have long-term
plans to run for office, correct?
Yes, so I don't know if youwant to talk about that a little
(34:14):
bit and then we'll have youback on the show later on.
Speaker 2 (34:16):
Um sure, yeah, I can share a little bit more about
that.
So I actually this was likepretty recent in terms of like
what inspired me to run longterm, and in my mind I so a
little background.
I have been doing a lot of selfwork in and out of therapy for
(34:38):
several years and I would saythat one thing that I have
personally learned that, in myopinion, is common with a lot of
people in America and evenaround the world, is, I think we
have a very fearful-mindedheadspace.
Instead of having a healthyrange of our emotions that help
us be able to make decisions, welet fear overtake a lot of our
(35:01):
decision-making process and ourthoughts, and I used to be like
that, and I think that a lot, ofa lot of people have that sort
of headspace.
They're feeling desensitized,they're feeling very anxious as
anxiety and depression rates areskyrocketing, especially with
younger generations.
Speaker 3 (35:19):
And which, John, if I can add that in my opinion that
is by design.
That's actually why I startedthis podcast, is because we are
conditioned to live that way.
Speaker 2 (35:31):
Yeah, and I personally think that it is
atrocious that this is how we'reteaching future generations to
live is instead, actually,instead of live, you're just,
they're just trying to survive.
You know it's all about ifyou're lucky enough to get a job
, if you're lucky enough to havea good form of healthcare, if
(35:54):
you're lucky enough to get yourtuition wavered, or if you're
lucky enough, even despiteworking really hard, you're
going to get scholarshipsthrough collegesed, or if you're
lucky enough, even despiteworking really hard, you're
going to get scholarshipsthrough colleges, etc.
So I don't think that's fair atall to have the younger
generations live a life thatprior generations especially
during the 50s, 60s, 70s withthe boomers and Gen X are have
been able to live.
(36:15):
But like, where I'm trying togo back with this idea of a
fearful foundation is fear hadheld me back a lot in my life
and I can share that in a futurepodcast with you guys, with my
coming out experience, and thatwas probably the start for me of
retraining my mind or my brain,to not have to make decisions
in a very anxiety inducingheadspace, anxiety-inducing
(36:44):
headspace, and I tell peopleanxiety is an effect or a result
of fear.
That is not actually, that maynot be realistic In terms of why
I want to go into office andhow I've been bouncing around
between prior topics.
I'm now at a headspace whereI'm continuing to learn on how
to regulate my emotions andfeelings in and out of therapy.
The one thing I've been learningis with coming out, with being
(37:06):
an atheist or non-religious andgrowing up in a very religious
household, with, you know, goingto college and becoming a
better critical thinker throughlike what I majored in and how I
apply that in my personal life,with self-learning and doing
other things, and then watchingthe political landscape, like
Zoran Mamdani winning thedemocratic primary race, and
(37:32):
even just being able to justconsider what exactly I'm doing
in my personal life, likedonating to those in Gaza and
actively talking to people allacross the world, like those in
Ukraine, those in Sudan.
So it made me realize that thesequalities of empathy, curiosity
(37:52):
, compassion, altruism itsignaled to me.
Okay, I feel this desire in methat I want to help out the
American people and recognizingagain that we're at the bottom
point right now in terms ofwhere our country is at.
You know, we're under adictatorship, in my mind, or an
authoritarian government.
Who has who?
(38:13):
Our president has hit the 14points of fascism, to my
understanding.
So you know it made me realizeif I am possessing these
qualities and I want to myunderstanding.
So you know it made me realizeif I am possessing these
qualities and I want to help outmore people, especially in this
country, then I think having ayounger face that actually wants
to help people out can makepeople feel less desensitized
(38:35):
and have more optimism, and Iwant to share my optimism with
them and have more optimism, andI want to share my optimism
with them.
Speaker 3 (38:42):
I love everything you said and, as both as an
educator and a therapist, I II'm very happy that you do both
therapy and we're talking aboutcollege.
I think that's fantastic, andyou brought up so many great
points.
One of your tick tocks, becauseI watched, obviously, a lot of
your tech talks.
That's how I found you.
Um, you had talked aboutgetting all getting people out
of office, who were alsoproblematic too, because,
although I can't stand Trump andI, he is.
(39:03):
He is a symptom of the of abigger problem, right, we have
so much corruption and Eric andI were just.
I was quoting this book.
I don't know if you've read itGenocide, bad.
Speaker 2 (39:12):
I've heard of it, but I'm not.
Speaker 3 (39:14):
It's.
I just started reading it.
I would highly recommend it.
But the author talks about thekind of illusion of the two
party system.
Reading it, I would highlyrecommend it.
But the author talks about thekind of illusion of the two
party system.
And they are.
They're just all corrupt, right, like, I think, anybody who's
taking money from a foreigncountry and has a foreign
country's interest before theUnited States should be, I don't
know, imprisoned.
That's my opinion, but it's,it's never going to happen
(39:35):
because at least not right now,because it's so embedded and
even in in my neck of the woods,our, our senators, our
congressmen they've been inoffice for decades can't and
nobody can get them out yeah, Ia few comments to that.
Speaker 2 (39:50):
I believe, at this moment, the median age of our
congress.
Do you guys want to take aguess what it is?
The median age 65.
My close, how about yourself,erica?
Speaker 1 (40:03):
I'm going to go ahead and say 68.
Speaker 2 (40:08):
It's actually 63.
Wow, but yeah, very yeah, thatthe median age of our Congress
(40:29):
is 63.
And the American dream, or thisideological view of you you get
a job, or you go to high school, you get your diploma, you get
a.
You go to college, you graduate, you get a job, you eventually
own a home, and back, I think,in the 70s and 80s you could
correct me if I'm wrong, matthewand Erica you would have an
income that was, I believe, athird of the house that you
(40:55):
would eventually pay and buy offas your own asset.
But these were parts of whatcomprised of the American dream
and, in my opinion, if we'rehaving people run this country
that are very close toretirement age which is, in
essence, a huge like endpointfor the American dream is you
would eventually retire, likewhat?
60, 65 years old, and they'restill leaving this country then
in my mind, they're pretty muchgoing against what the whole
(41:17):
essence or the whole idea iswith the end goal of the
American dream, like why do youwant to continue to be in this
position of power, why do youwant to continue to lead this
country?
And I think a big factor withthese generations that are still
in power is they are.
They're not really empathetic.
They don't really understand,like, what goes on in the
(41:37):
headspace of, let's say, say, asingle mom who was working as a
bank teller and has to pay offher.
Let's say she can't afford ahome, like her monthly rent or
child care or uh, what she hasto do to just pay for even the
basic necessities, like uh forfood and uh for health care
insurance and it.
Perhaps she has a car, like shehas car insurance or a car
(42:00):
mortgage.
I think katie porter did afantastic job at being able to
call jamie diamond out on his bsand in a court case and he was
just completely aesthetic.
He just kept on responding to avery similar situation like
this.
He said I don't know, I have tothink about that I might be
wrong of this, but wasn't katieporter also?
Speaker 3 (42:17):
because I remember following her on tick tock and
really liked her.
But then wasn't she also kindof a little shady too?
Wasn't she talking about nottaking any money from any sort
of institutions?
And she was also taking a lotof money too.
Speaker 2 (42:31):
I'm not entirely sure about that, but perhaps that's
another question for me to thinkabout is you know what sort of
donations has she taken?
And I know the FederalElections Commission's website,
or the FECP, I believe,showcases and publicizes
donations that individuals thatare running for Senate or for
(42:53):
the House of Representativeswould be taking, and it's in a
tabular data, tabular structurelike.
The data is shown like onerecord and every record
represents a certain amount ofmoney that that candidate
running for like in this case,legislative branch, would be
taking from each of the um, fromeach of like, let's say, the
(43:15):
political action committees orso, um.
So yeah, I would.
I actually am interested in howto look into the fbc uh website
and just be like, what sort ofcommittees or packs perhaps that
katie porter is takingdonations from?
Speaker 3 (43:29):
but I, I do that website track a pack, so I'm
gonna I'm gonna have to look itup because I remember liking her
and then I remember this was awhile ago thinking she was a
hypocrite because it was likethat other.
There was another guy, I can'tremember his name.
He was on TikTok.
He was using the platform tolike run, get a lot of support
and he was talking about howmuch he was reaching out to
(43:51):
people on TikTok, but then hewas in support of the TikTok ban
.
Do you know what I'm talkingabout?
Speaker 2 (43:56):
I can't remember his name.
I'm not entirely sure um I Ihonestly had started using
TikTok more frequently in thepast couple of several months.
Speaker 1 (44:11):
But yeah, I'm not too sure about that.
What is starting to happen asfar as people who are starting
to move towards running foroffice that are like young?
Right, absolutely, as youcommented, it's so important
because we need to be planningfor the future and it seems like
(44:34):
there is this very, very, verystrong pattern of the older
generation who has been stuck inleadership how should I say or
clung to leadership, as far astheir disconnection from these
issues that are top of mind.
For people who are like I'mplanning on being on the planet
(44:57):
for another you know 50, 60years, not like I'm only going
to be on this planet for another, you know 10 to 30 years it's
definitely, as Matt was saying,it's very encouraging as far as
for us, like for our roles, Ifind it the most powerful thing
and the most encouraging thingfor my existence to continue to
(45:18):
support youth in their steppinginto leadership.
So how does that feel for youat this point in time?
As far as like where becausethere's politics is a whole
different situation, right?
Political actors, politicaloperatives that play roles in
(45:40):
shaping public opinion, shapingmass communications I know that
for me, learning about thosekinds of things are a little bit
intimidating and I'm justcurious how are you managing or
how are you feeling about, youknow, how should I say like
coming across this differentworld or parallel world that
exists, that has so much of animpact on day-to-day people?
Speaker 2 (46:03):
So just to understand your question, dr Erica, I
believe you're asking how do Iand other, perhaps younger
individuals take in so much ofwhat is going on across the
world, especially with thepolitical landscape?
Is that what you're asking?
Speaker 1 (46:24):
Yeah, and like the mechanisms of politics, right,
because as the, as a powerstructure, as a, as a process
structure, it's like verydifferent from the rest of life.
Speaker 2 (46:38):
Yeah, I think that I think again that's the first
word that comes to my mind ispessimistic for a lot of younger
people and in terms of mypersonal thoughts, the reason
why I could feel pessimistic alot about the how, the
mechanisms of the politicallandscape, and then also the the
(47:00):
reality of how.
It is so different from how alot of younger people feel in
their day-to-day life is moneyLike.
That's the biggest factor forme when it comes to being able
to try to better understand thepolitical landscape.
Many people just associatebeing in Congress or, you know,
(47:22):
being like president or somebodythat is in our government.
They associate it with not justpower, but people associate
power to money and you know, forexample, if you are, you know,
somebody in your 40s or 50s or60s, then, assuming that you
have been able to accumulatemore money and saved it and
(47:43):
invested in your life, it'sgoing to be much easier for you
to be able to run a campaign sothat way you can promote your
message, and to be able totravel across the country, give
talks like if you're lookinglike, in this case, for somebody
who's running for presidency,but if you're somebody who is
looking to run for, let's sayyour district and you want to
win a seat in the house ofrepresentatives, then it's going
(48:08):
to require a lot of money to beable to promote yourself and
your message besides activelydoing it on social media,
because there's going to be alot of people who aren't as
active politically.
But I think that where a lot ofyounger people maybe are not
understanding of this which Iacknowledge, because a lot of
younger people tend to not getinvolved in politics until maybe
(48:30):
in their mid-20s, I'd say justbecause they don't have a
full-time job, they don'tunderstand how it affects
everyday costs or monthly costslike having a home or paying off
student debt, et cetera.
The most difficult thing isbeing able to like people
locally that don't have enoughmoney, that want to get into
(48:52):
politics, and I think that'sgoing to be a big challenge for
me because you know I don't havemajor connections out there,
like Andrew Cuomo, for example,who can be able to talk to, like
DoorDash and get, like hismajor campaign donation of a
million dollars from them whenhe's running when he was running
for and, I believe, still isrunning for, new York City mayor
(49:14):
.
So for people that are around myage or so or younger people
that are wanting to get intopolitics.
The question is, how can youknow, how can we try to speak up
more or or spread our messageswhen money is a big issue, when
we're when we need to have moneyto promote ourselves and make
(49:35):
ourselves more wellknown,besides the usage of technology?
So you know, I think thatthat's a big like point that
I've been thinking about andthat's something that is
challenging.
But if your message spreadswith a lot of people like Kat
Abugazale, who's right here,locally close by to me, and
(49:58):
she's running for the 9thDistrict, she just exploded
online because she has beenspeaking and preaching out to so
many people that aredesensitized and want a strong
change in the Democraticestablishment.
So she's been getting a lot ofcampaign donations from many
average Americans.
So I think she's doing afantastic job, and that's a
(50:21):
similar campaign that I and withZora Mamdani.
Speaker 3 (50:24):
Those are similar campaigns I hope I can be able
to learn from and do, john, if Icould ask one question, or just
actually to both of you, to getwhat your thoughts on this are,
because I think the otherproblem is and I forgot who said
this absolute power corruptsabsolutely, and I don't
necessarily know if youngerpeople are immune to that either
(50:46):
, because we certainly havequite a few younger people who
are in Congress and the Senatewho are just as corrupt, and
politics in itself is a corruptinstitution.
And when you take a healthyperson and you put them in a
corrupt institution, theinstitution doesn't generally
get healthier.
(51:06):
The healthy person becomescorrupt.
And I'm just how do you, howcan you prepare yourself for
that and how do you prevent thatfrom happening?
Or have you thought about that?
How do you prevent that fromhappening?
Speaker 2 (51:19):
Or have you thought about that?
Actually, I had a conversationwith my mom about this yesterday
and I was telling her that, inmy perspective, I don't think a
lot of politicians are asself-aware.
I think that they are just.
(51:39):
I think that they are just morefocused on what can benefit
them to stay in power and to beable to have more money.
But I also have questions attimes, such as what is going on
behind the scenes.
You know, are there, you know,once they, you know, are there
people who reach out to themlike big political action
(52:01):
committee saying, hey, you know,we want to, we'll sponsor you,
we'll pay you this much, butthen you have to be a talking
mouthpiece and this salespersonor this person that's going to
essentially make us look betterand speak more positively about
us, and then we'll just funnelmore of our, of our campaign
donations into, or our donationsinto, your campaign.
(52:24):
So I think, then, it's also apart of this change or evolution
, right when somebody that maybe, like that's younger or doesn't
have enough money and wants torun for politics.
You know, I think that if theyare not as self-aware or they're
not staying true to their corevalues and that tie into helping
(52:44):
out so many people, then Ithink they're going to start to
lose a part of their identityand then they're going to all of
a sudden focus on changing intoa more like, perhaps a greedy
person, let's say.
You know, like, for example.
I think at the core of why wehave so many like, why we have
such a stark difference inwealth gap, inequality, is
(53:05):
because these people that havebecome incredibly rich, like
Jamie Dimon, for example, cameto America and were poor, I
believe, like I believe hisparents were immigrants and he
came with them here.
But they eventually lose touchwith the struggles of the
average American and whatthey're dealing with.
And I think that as you start tolike in my mind and this is
(53:28):
just theoretical again, it maybe an over-generalization when
people start to realize thatwhen they're in politics, they
start to gradually increase moreof their money through, like
these campaign donations from,like big PACs, it can eventually
just exponentially boom interms of, after some time,
they're just going to get moreand more and more money that
(53:49):
they'll reinvest or that theywill, that they'll keep for
themselves, and then I thinkthey start to live a much more
fearful minded headspace of Idon't want to lose my money I
don't want to lose my investmentand then they start to lose
touch with many otherindividuals that they could have
(54:10):
easily connected with prior togetting to that position or
prior to even getting thesedonations.
So I think, still, like, as muchas we want to promote positive
change, I think this is agradual or a pretty like
exponential negative change forsome people that get into office
, even if they're younger,because I think they're not as
self-aware to recognize that, oh, these were my core values
(54:33):
before of like kindness andrepresenting people, and you
know, I came from like a poordistrict or I came from a poor
family or I came from a terribleenvironment.
And then, once they start toget so much money through
campaign not campaign throughdonations for their campaign
that you know being funneledinto their pockets, all of a
(54:53):
sudden now their priorities aregoing to change if they're not
as self-aware, and then they'regoing to focus on those people
instead, and that can lead themto becoming more greedy,
apathetic and not compassionateenough to understand the
struggles of many people.
So I think self-awareness is abig quality that can lead to the
fate of where these people are.
Speaker 3 (55:14):
John, there's so much to say, we don't have enough
time Because there is.
You said a lot of stuff and oneof the things if you look at
corporations like ceos, theyparticularly look for people who
have personality disorder, liketraits, because they will have
no problem going in on christmaseve and laying off half the
(55:37):
staff.
Right, because that's kind ofwhat they do.
And I wonder how much ofpolitics ends up being the same
thing, right, where you'relooking for people who have
these traits.
That may not be so good,because I think the focus is
always re -election, not helpingthe people.
(55:57):
The focus is always keeping themoney, not making change.
And we have a great example ofthis in Rhode Island, where we,
I think, are the first state inthe country who did the Homeless
Bill of Rights, which gives allof these rights to people who
are homeless.
And one of the things I reallylove and I'm being sarcastic is
(56:18):
the performative stuff we do.
Right, so we change the name ofthe homeless people to the
unhoused, because somehow thatmakes it sound better.
But I would imagine if you askany person who doesn't have a
house, would you rather becalled unhoused or would you
rather have housing, they wouldsay please give me housing right
.
So, like we do this stuff Nowat the same time, we have this
Bill of Rights, have we havecities in the state of rhode
(56:39):
island that are criminalizinghomelessness and like taking
down you know tents, but thensaying like, oh well, we're
going to pass a law that givesyou the right to then sue and
then get yeah, okay, becausethey're going to run out and get
a lawyer.
I mean it.
The whole thing is like superperformative, to make it sound
like we're actually doingsomething.
Why, at the same time, we havea 37% rise in homelessness in
(56:59):
one year and we have a 60% risein people living in their cars,
but we're going to continue topretend we're addressing it by
do you know what I mean?
It's like so performative.
Speaker 1 (57:13):
Yeah, and I think that younger generations have
been expressing their awarenessof that um, so I am really
looking forward to our furtherof both this conversation.
Yes, you and I, we have someimmigrant activists that we're
(57:34):
gonna have here.
So, uh, dear listeners, thankyou so much for this lovely
journey that we've been ontogether.
It's a little bit bit humor, sowe're good.
We had a um, this, this episode, is the overview episode of
something, yes, coming in in thepipes for us to be talking
about a little bit morethoroughly um, john, uh, I am
(57:55):
very much looking forward tohaving additional time and we'll
get that on the schedule and um, talking about, um, this like
commitment and persistence thatboth exists in your experience
outside of politics, the worldof politics that you are going
to be taking into the world ofpolitics, as well as the other
(58:15):
things that you are, um, thatyou know are focusing on, and we
so appreciate your time and weso appreciate your arrival and I
agree.
Speaker 3 (58:28):
To echo everything Erica said.
I look forward to having moreconversations with you, John, so
I'll I'll send you a messageand we can.
We can come up with anothertime, but it was really nice
meeting you and I'm glad thatyou're here and anything we can
do to help promote that.
When you decide to run, let meknow.
And if there's anything youwant me to add on the show notes
, like if you want me to putyour TikTok stuff in, I can put
(58:49):
a link to that and I'll send youa copy of the episode before we
release it.
Speaker 2 (58:55):
Of course, yeah, and I know you said you needed to
leave at 1210 Easter StandardTime.
Pomp to Tomat.
I just want to say one more timeI profusely apologize again
because I'm just trying to putmyself in your shoes and I
recognize that I came in laterthan the scheduled time and that
(59:15):
was a misread on my end.
But I just want to say Iappreciate you both just letting
me you know, still be able tocome on and talk, and I'd love
to be able to connect with youguys further and again I wish
you guys the best.
Um, I'll send you my tiktok andyoutube channel, which my
youtube channel shares a lot ofstories about my dates and other
(59:36):
experiences, and I also sharesome other things related to my
journey doing OnlyFans as well,which I think can be a topic to
discuss down the road, becauseyou know there's a stigma of
course of, like you know,onlyfans and doing professional
work and things like that youknow, and so I'll share that
information with you.
Matt and Dr Eric, I'd love tofollow you on TikTok and keep in
(59:58):
touch with you as well.
Again, thank you to you both,just still to have me on and
love to talk with you guys again.
Speaker 3 (01:00:05):
Thank you everybody, and thank you again for
listening.
This is just a reminder that nopart of this podcast can be
(01:00:36):
duplicated or copied withoutwritten consent from either
myself or Wendy.
Speaker 1 (01:00:38):
Thank, you again.
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