[EP01] "You Got This"

Episode Transcript
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Alfred (00:03):
Hey everyone, and welcome to the Unmodern Podcast,
the podcast where we haveunscripted, unapologetic and
uncomfortable conversations thataffects everyday people.
If you've ever had an outlookthought or an opinion that
modern day society told you tobe silent on, That you would get
in trouble for, or if you'veever heard the words, probably
shouldn't say that, then this isthe podcast for you.

(00:26):
My name is Alfred, a husband,father, and an adventure seeking
kind of guy who over the yearshas learned to have a positive
outlook on life, regardless ofwhat society throws at me.
So if you're ready to listen,let's go.

(01:03):
Hey babe.
Hi.
How are you?
Fabulous.
Amazing.
You excited to do this?
Yeah.
And

Courtney (01:10):
nervous.
Okay, that's fair.
I just don't know what you'regonna ask me.

Alfred (01:13):
That's fair.
It's gonna get a little spicy.
Is what it is.
Yeah.
So welcome to the El Modernpodcast.
Obviously you are the behind thescenes on this podcast, this
studio.
A lot of the stuff I have, evensome of the behind the scenes,
our logo.
That was all you.
So thank you very much, babe.
You are welcome.
So what do you think of the nameUnmodern podcast?

(01:33):
What does that mean to you?

Courtney (01:35):
I think it suits you.
I don't think that you've everbeen a modern kind of person,
especially in today's societyor.
Definitely you follow adifferent curve than everyone
else, which I like and I thinkis refreshing.
I think that if we all went thatmodern approach that we would,
or I think society just wouldn'tbe what it is.

(01:55):
You are a very traditionalperson and Unmodern is

Alfred (02:00):
perfectly suited to you.
Well, thank you.
We've been married for eightyears this past July.
We, yeah.
What's our anniversary?
Shut your mouth.
Yes.
I failed that before ouranniversary.
I'm sorry.
Yeah, so eight years married.
We have a daughter, Sophie,she's six.
And you've been a mom for sixyears.
How does that feel?

(02:20):
How was that experience, by theway?
Was it everything?
It was propped up to be thingsthat you thought it was
Obviously some people that mightnot know the whole story, if you
wanna unpack that,

Courtney (02:29):
Like, what part do you want

Alfred (02:30):
me to go?
Like, what was your vision ofbeing a mom before you became a
mom?
And then obviously after thefact, I'm sure there's some moms
that can relate to that, whereyou have this idea and then you
get thrown in front of a trainthat blows up your reality.

Courtney (02:43):
I think for me it was a little bit different than all
the moms that I hang out with.
I think when you go intomotherhood, you have this
preconceived notion of what yourworld will look like, how, you
know, your daughter will or yourson will grow up, they'll go to
college or sorry, go to highschool, go to college, graduate,
have a boyfriend or girlfriend,and then get married, have kids

(03:05):
of their own.
And I think for us it ended upbeing a little bit different.
And at the beginning it wasreally hard to swallow.
And for the listeners who don'tknow what I'm talking about our
daughter was diagnosed at twoand a half years old with autism
and.
Just recently diagnosed with agenetic condition called

(03:26):
hereditary spastic paraplegia.
So, I mean, a lot different thanwhat any of our friends have had
to go through.
And I think looking back now, Ikind of resent them for it.
I had a really difficult timeeven being in the room with a
friend of mine that had a childthat was quote unquote normal.

(03:47):
Knowing that my daughtercouldn't speak, that my daughter
couldn't developmentally do thesame things that those kids
could, was a hard pill toswallow.
But I have surrounded myselfwith some of the most fantastic
people, and these people reallymake me feel normal.

(04:09):
Make it so that they don't seeSophie's disability.
Instead, they see everythingthat she can do.
And I think that was a huge

Alfred (04:17):
thing for me.
Do you think that's somethingplaguing women today?
Is this race to the top, thiscompetition?
Absolutely absolutely.
I like, I'm a man so I can, I Iobserve it from the outside.
Right.
And I don't see everything thatyou deal with on a regular
basis.
But it does seem like in societythere is this, it's like a rat
race.
The, the only way to get to thetop is to step on somebody
else's back a hundred percent.
And, and I don't understand itbecause we didn't grow up like

(04:39):
that.
That's not what we've seen.
We've seen women buildingcommunities and we've seen men
maintaining communities.
But I think we, we see, we'veseen men being there for the
women, but the women relying oneach other.
Whereas today's society,everything is individualized
where it has to be maintainedwithin the marriage.
It has to.
Your friends have to, like bothspouses, you have to be aligned

(05:00):
on so many things.
And, and I just think thatthat's doing a detriment to both
men and women, but women inparticular because now there's
this massive dichotomy of youeither have these hyper
professional, super successfulwomen that will look down upon a
stay-at-home mom or vice versa,where a stay-at-home mom will
look at a professional and arguethat you're outsourcing

(05:21):
everything about your family toprofessionals.
You're outsourcing the educationof your kids or the care of your
kids.
You're outsourcing thecleanliness of your house.
You're outsourcing, nourishingyour family through ordering
food all the time because moneyhas now become the new standard
of measure.
And I feel like that does a hugedetriment and we do a good job
in our house of balancing that.
But if you just wanna unpackthat a bit of how you think
that's affected your friendshipcircle and the women you

(05:42):
associate with.

Courtney (05:43):
I have made it kind of my mission to not judge other
moms.
I think that we are all goingthrough this crazy thing called
life, and no one is doing itright.
There's not a single person whoyou can te who you can say to me
is a perfect mom.
Do I think that other peoplehave it kind of more together
than others?
Absolutely.
But do I see the whole picture?

(06:05):
Do they put on this fake facadethat only Instagram can see and
then everything else behind thescenes is kind of trash?
I think that we as women oftenplay this ridiculous game of who
does it better?
Or my kid can do this, can yourkid do that?
And I think that that was mybiggest pet peeve and still is

(06:28):
to this day, is when someonecomes to me and says my child
can speak this many words.
How many can your child speak?
And it's like number one, it's,this is not a test.
This is not a, your kid doesn'twin if, if they speak more words
than mine.
And number two, you just put medown so hard because in my head

(06:51):
all that I thought was shit, mykid can't speak.
So like, what does that say tome as a parent?
Am I failing?
And unfortunately, we live in asociety today that that is the
first thing that women thinkabout is, am I failing?
Am I actually doing a good jobas a mom?
'cause my kid can't talk.
And I think when that did happenfor me, when those words were

(07:13):
spoken to me, Sophie was, Ithink around like two years old
and we didn't have a diagnosisyet.
And so in the back of my head itwas what's going on?
I have a background in childhoodeducation with a specialty in
special needs kids.
So I think from an early age, Ikind of seen.
Signs with Sophie, but neverreally thought too much into it.

(07:36):
So yeah, that was, that was ahard one, hard pill to swallow.
But going back to women today, Ithink that everyone has this
unrealistic expectation ofthemselves.
And you can't do it all.
You can't be a supermom whilerunning a job or full-time job

(07:57):
while keeping the housetogether, while making sure that
it's clean while taking yourkids to all of the activities.
It's just, it's not possible.
You're going to run yourselfout.
You're going to be exhausted.
That's just it's reality.
And the people who think thatthey can do it are those modern
day people.
Sorry to whoever is listening.

(08:18):
That is one of those people.
I just, it's not me.
And I'm very thankful and I'mfortunate that I'm in the
position that I'm in that.
I don't necessarily have to workmy husband, which is you.
You know, we make enough to livethe way or to live the lifestyle
that we currently live, and I'mokay with that.

(08:38):
I get to watch my daughter growup.
I get to go to every singleactivity.
I don't have to miss anything.
And it's something that I, whenI first knew that I was a mom,
it was the one thing that Isaid, I don't ever want to miss
something.
I want to be there on her firstday of school.
I want to be there to pick herup every single day when it
comes time to, to pick her up.

(08:59):
I wanna be at every singledancer title at every single
swim meet.
And I'm very lucky that I'm ableto do that.
I think that women today just, Idon't know if they don't care,
but I think that a lot of womenput their job above their family
and.

(09:20):
That's not how I was raised.
I was raised in an environmentwith my grandmothers that they
put us first 100% of the time.
Do I think that that is okay?
Probably not.
But at the same time, they werethe most influential people in
my entire life and I owe who Iam to them.

(09:41):
And if I had to look back in mylife and think of someone who I
aspire to be, it would be them.

Alfred (09:50):
What would you say to the women that feel like they've
been backed into a corner andhave, have to prioritize their
job because of cost ofinflation?
Or, and I'll unpack this alittle bit later, but because of
piece of shit men and men thatare weak, men that don't have
any valuable skills, men that.
Really don't support women.
And I think that's, that goesback to my side of the coin from
the community we grew up in, isthe men allowed the women to

(10:14):
flourish.
I think it was in the 1940swhere there was a magazine that
taught women how to treat theirman at the door and make sure
you're pretty.
That's not what I'm talkingabout.
You know, that's that bullshittoxic masculinity that people
talk about these days.
I'm talking about men that willbreak their back for the
self-sacrifice nature of womendoing what they need to do, not

(10:34):
doing what they want to do.
That's a very, very bigdistinguishment Yes.
Is I'm not gonna work all thisfucking overtime so you can have
a hot girl summer.
That's not what I'm gonnafucking do.
Mm-hmm.
Is you need to put in equalamounts of effort, but in
different areas.
I think

Courtney (10:49):
that today though, that's so farfetched for women.
I feel like, you know, multipletimes I've heard people say,
like your husband, like you feedyour husband as soon as he walks
in.
Absolutely.
He just worked an entire day tomake sure that me and my
daughter have the life that wehave.
The least I could do is makesure that when he comes home
that food is on the table andthat the house is clean.

(11:11):
That's the least that I can do.
He's allowing me to stay homeand, and I feel really sad for
girls that don't get to do that,that don't have that in their
life.
And again, like is it, like yousaid, is it because of the man
that they have or is it becausethey prioritize something that I
don't?
Or is it because society is justso fucking expensive right now

(11:34):
that you can't do anything?
It's hard enough to go to agrocery store and get one bag of
groceries that's costing you ahundred dollars.
it's insane.
I feel sad.
I'm sad that we have come to theplace in Canada that.
We, we can't do this anymore.
That it's getting harder andharder to be that.
Stay-at-home mom and live thelifestyle that we all are used

(11:55):
to.
But what do I say to women?
I say that it's okay to startover.
It's okay to shift your focusand revamp your life and stop
the lifestyle that you have andembrace something different.
If you want to be there for yourkids, then do it that, but that
means that you can't have alavish car.

(12:15):
You can't go get your nails doneevery week.
You can't have fake eyelashes.
So like, there's, there's justcertain things that you would
have to cut out of your life ifyou want the lifestyle that it,
that is a stay-at-home mom.
That doesn't mean that it's notattainable, that doesn't mean
that you can't do it, but youhave to have a person behind you
that is capable of basicallylike doing what you do.

(12:38):
You know, it's a shift work kindof mentality or an eight hour
day that you're working nonstopor you have a stay-at-home job
that like, like, you know what Imean?
Like it's, it's hard'cause thereare stay-at-home moms or sorry,
there's a, there's single momsout there that don't get that.
And I 100% get it.

(13:00):
I think that it's, that to me isone of the hardest jobs in the
world is to be a single mom andnot have the support that I have
or that any other mom that has aspouse has, I don't know how
they do it and I applaud themfor it and stay-at-home Mom gig
is not easy for them.

(13:20):
But I definitely think that youcan still take traditional roles
or traditional aspects of it andimplement it into your life.

Alfred (13:27):
Yeah, I love a lot of that to unpack a few of those.
To me, the secret for anyindividual or couple's happiness
is contentment, is I think thissociety expectation of keeping
up with the Joneses has been thedownfall for a lot of people,
young teenage boys thinking theyhave to buy a Camaro.
You have, you know, single momsthinking they need to post on
Instagram, scandalous picturesto get attention from, from

(13:48):
guys.
And the, the one thing thatwe're missing is accountability
is when I hear men talk aboutshitty ex-wives, and it's like,
well, where'd you meet them atthe club.
Oh, what?
She had fake tits.
Oh, she know, she, she sleptwith a couple of my friends and
they said how good she was.
Don't anything wrong with it.
No, no, no.
But what I'm saying is thatthey're putting value in the

(14:09):
incorrect place.
Yes.
You know, oh, you know, she, shesleeps with me every single
night and does all this stuffand all that.
It's like, but everything elsein your life that's a reflection
of you is in fucking chaos.
You, you talk to people thattheir houses are ridiculous.
You talk to people that theyhaven't gone to a recital or a
game or anything like that.
And, and it just seems so assbackwards to me.

(14:30):
And I don't know where the ballfell.
I'm trying to look back in mychildhood at who our, who our
idols were.
My parents were not like that.
Your parents were not like thatin terms of keeping up with the
Joneses and all that.
There may be, there may havebeen some negative attitudes and
stuff, and that's different, butI'm trying to see, it seems like
it was within my generation, butit seems like I missed it by
like five, 10 years.

(14:51):
We were both born in 1989 and itseems like kids that were born
like late nineties, midnineties, they're kind of in
that sphere of like right whenthey were coming into their main
development area, that's like Ytwo K and like the, the first
iPhone was released.
Mm-hmm.
And I can't pinpoint exactlywhat it would've been, but I
feel like things like values,things like hard work, things

(15:13):
like difficult conversations,all that shit is gone.
It's fucking gone.
You hear of stories of teachersthat can't give zeros on tests
in case they're gonna fuckingoffend somebody that they didn't
do the test.
Like, what if my kid puts inzero effort?
You give them a zero, you givethem a fucking zero.
And and why is that so hard tosay nowadays?

(15:33):
It doesn't make sense to me.
And, and going,'cause we live

Courtney (15:36):
in a woke society.
That fucking, every single thingthat someone does offends you.

Alfred (15:44):
Everything.
And, and I think we, we've lostour spine.
We've lost our spine as asociety.
Yeah.
I don't understand why that's sohard to talk about.
And, looking back on it, for megrowing up is things that were
important when we grew up.
Was your time.
I, I is that was the ultimatecurrency.
Community service helping aneighbor, putting in hard work.

(16:07):
And I spoke about it yesterday.
Right now it's measured.
If I put in an hour, is it worthit for me to do it or should I
outsource it like that if

Courtney (16:15):
everything is based on money.

Alfred (16:17):
But that's what I'm getting at is, is we are
undervaluing time andovervaluing money a hundred
percent be be because I spokeabout it on, on a different
podcast, but when I'm cooking, Ilove cooking.
I love the kitchen.
I'm in there.
It's my space.
I love when you cook.
Yes.
And people think I, I've heardcomments and be like, well, why

(16:38):
don't you just order out atSubway?
Or you have these new likeHelloFresh boxes and people are
doing a cost benefit analysis,if it's worth maintaining a
skill of cooking food andnourishing your family versus
saving money.
And it's because we look atanything we do with our time, we
look at it as binary.
What am I putting in?
What am I getting out?
Well, let's unpack that a bit.

(16:59):
When I'm in the kitchen, I'mlearning a skill.
I am not on my phone, so I'm notkind of doom scrolling or any
crap like that.
I'm in a meditative state.
I'm in a good state of mind thatthat's very hard to put a
tangible value to.
I'm also connecting.
Sophie helps us cook.
You help me cook.

(17:19):
Also, nothing brings peopletogether like food.
When you have good food and goodmeals, that's why people eat out
all the time.
They something about good foodand the social component of it.
So it's not binary.
It's not, well, yeah, maybe Iwould save a little bit of
money, so maybe I shouldn't dothis.
No, you have to look at thebigger picture.
The way you keep our home andthe way you nourish me when I
get home with, you know,whatever it is, craft dinner one

(17:41):
day and Turkey dinner, another,whatever it is.
That's not just an assessment ofhow you're maintaining your
house.
How you do one thing is how youdo everything.
And it truly is something thatis overlooked today.
Building a podcast studio in myhouse, well, what wouldn't it
have been worth it to rent out astudio for$50 an hour or, you
know, why did you eat up a roomin your house?

(18:02):
There's so many more layers toit, and we've demonized those
layers we're looking at it froman in and out perspective.
We're not looking at the macro,the outlying skills, resources,
tools that we're getting andgoing back to women.
I feel that's unfortunatelywhat's been the downfall.
I'm speaking anecdotally,because I've been blessed to
have a great marriage and we'veobviously been through this

(18:24):
shit, but we've learned this andwe're aligned.
It wasn't.
Five years ago we were evenvoting for different political
parties.
When you go through the shit andyou really test your metal,
that's when you find out whatyour priorities are and you
always revert back to your corevalues and your foundation.
And it's been absolutely fuckingobliterated in today's society.

(18:49):
Nobody has a strong leg to standon because nobody knows what the
fuck they're doing.
Yeah.
Like who do I vote for what'struth, what's not, what's
freedom, what's safe?
It's all a confusing mess.
And the reliance on governmentsocial programs, the news for
our information, people thatdon't even know who their
fucking neighbors are.

(19:10):
So if you were ever in atraumatic experience, let's use
our own example.
When Sophie had her very firstseizure,

Courtney (19:16):
yeah.
If it wouldn't have been for ourneighbor I honestly don't know
what I would've done.
She definitely.
Stepped up.
But like you said, if I didn'tknow her, I would've never went
over there.

Alfred (19:27):
But would you ever allow that to even be a reality where
you wouldn't know who yourneighbor is?
No.
You don't need to align withthem.
You don't need to be bestiebesties.
They don't need to come over toyour house every day.
Mind you, that's how it was, howwe grew up.
So in an ideal world, that's howI envision it, honestly, I

Courtney (19:40):
think, I think again, when you're talking about us and
our experiences versus let's sayour friends' experiences, I
think we all came from adifferent world.
We came from a very small townin Nova Scotia, and they came
from a very big town in SpruceGrover, Stoney Plain, or
Edmonton, or wherever the casemay have been.

(20:02):
But I think it all matters whereyou grew up and what you grew up
around.
I grew up basically in a hamlet.
Population.
When I was there, it was like500 people.
And we all knew everyone.
Everybody helped every singleperson in that community.
And I'm very lucky to say thatand thankful to say that that's

(20:24):
still the case there.
There's definitely a biggerpopulation, but it's still a
community that helps everyoneout.
And I think that that's whatwe're looking for out here is
we're trying to find that sametype of community, but in a
city, and it's hard.
It's really hard.
It's hard to find the peoplethat have traditional values or

(20:45):
that are conservative or thatthey value marriage.
I have friends and I have heardof people, and my friends have
friends that I just, wow, Ican't, I don't even know what to
say.
They just are so often leftfield from anything that I would
consider myself that associatingwith them makes it hard.

(21:07):
And it makes it really hard inthis day and age to to have
friends because of it.
And I think it's a touchysubject too, when you when you
have friends that.
And I'm gonna use the liberalversus conservative way of about
this because that's all that Ican think of right now.
But when you have friends thatare more liberal than are

(21:29):
conservative, and you make aremark about something and they
come back to you and it's like,shit, what did I just do?
You have to silence yourself.
And it sucks in this day and agebecause unfortunately, I'm the
one that's in the wrong whenreally I'm not.
But I'm made to feel that way.
I can't have that opinion,

Alfred (21:50):
What do you think the best resource out there is for
somebody who has your opinions,beliefs, shares your values, but
are in a big city and are in amore modern culture?
What is something that they canleverage or a tactic or a
mindset?
What is kind of the.
Maybe you've discovered or wouldlike to discover or get better
at what can be done to not besilent so much, to have a voice

(22:14):
or to be able to speak yourpiece and align with people of
similar values what do you thinkis the best resource?
I think

Courtney (22:21):
that it's hard to, to talk about it and not be made to
feel less than.

Alfred (22:28):
That's why this podcast exists.
But speak.
Your peace, speaker peace.
But

Courtney (22:32):
To be honest, church, faith, it's, while I don't go to
church every week, I havesurrounded myself with
faith-based people.
And they have been the biggestinfluence in my entire life.
I look back and I am shockedbecause that's what I grew up
in.
That was my grandmother's, bothof them, my grandfather's.

(22:55):
It was my entire family.
We were all very faith,faith-based.
I don't think that I align withthe faith that I grew up on,
that doesn't mean that it's notstill within me.
So I think that if this issomething that you truly want
for yourself and you don't wantto be silenced or you want to
have people around you that feelthe same way or are aligned with

(23:18):
you more than I think lookinginto something that is
faith-based.
I when it was time to put ourdaughter into school, I had a
really hard time choosing aschool.
And I mean, we live in an, inwhere we live, we have districts
and you have to put your childin the district that you live
in.

(23:38):
I was limited on the optionsthat I had in front of me, but
We definitely made the rightdecision in the decision that we
did make.
Sophie, which is our daughter,she is super happy where she is
and she's not in a publicschool, and I don't think that I
would ever have a child that isin a public school.

Alfred (23:59):
Do you think it is about people of faith or people of
God?
What is it about them?
What characteristics do theyhave?
What qualities do they possess?
What is something that you canstick out?
You don't need to name names,but a few people in your mind
that we do align with, that weassociate with closely.
What is it about them?
Like, like can you kind ofpinpoint that?

Courtney (24:16):
They hold themselves to a higher power.
It's not just society as awhole, they look to someone who
is much bigger than you and I oranyone else.
They also have this loving,nurturing amazingness about them
that just can't be brought downbecause anytime that something

(24:37):
bad goes on in their life, it'snot, oh, wo was me.
It's, he has a plan for me andit's going to be okay.
We have this saying, you and I,and ever since our daughter was
little, it's the three wordsthat kind of got us through the
thick of it and made us, Ithink, who we are today.

(24:57):
We got this.
Was, was huge to us and it, butit came from faith.
It came from me having faith andknowing that we were gonna be
okay because he he's here and heloves me and he has a plan for
me.
I didn't get there by myself.
There was a lot of peopleinvolved in that that helped me.

(25:20):
Our wonderful neighbors who welove very much me, their
daughter, took me to theirchurch, and it was eyeopening.
It was different.
I grew up in Catholic religionand we went to a Christian
Church and it was not the sameas my Catholic.
Upbringing at all.
It was a lot of music, a lot ofmovement, a lot of just so

(25:44):
different.
I'm very used to staringstraight, repeating after me,
sign of the cross kneel.
That's it.
So this is much different, muchmore eye-opening and

Alfred (25:56):
just better.
Absolutely is, is that peopledon't, the these amazing humans,
they don't look at things as,what am I gonna get?
As a result?
They look at it as, because oftheir faith, I'm going to put
out effort and God will rewardme in however he sees fit.
You do things for other peoplewithout the requirement of

(26:17):
acknowledgement, without therequirement of equal return.
Because perhaps you're helpingsomebody in a worse situation
than you, and they don't havethe ability or the means to, to
return the favor.
One for one.

Courtney (26:28):
And it's funny because what I think is hilarious about
this entire thing is youwould've asked me a year ago
where my husband's head would'vebeen, this is not what I
would've said.
You were basically to put itbluntly, an atheist.
I don't believe in anythingthere is.
No, God, I believe in somethingbigger, but it's not that.

(26:51):
And having these people in ourlives that we look up to now,
it's very different and it'skind of made you open your eyes
to new and different things foryourself.
So

Alfred (27:02):
that's pretty cool.
I mean, I try to stay away fromit, but the pandemic it,
polarized people and it dividedpeople.
It did.
And when you're put at thebottom, it divided us.
It did.
It did.
We had a lot of problems in thishouse.
Yep.
And it was an eye-opening momentwhen I realized that the only
people that were there forothers were the people that were

(27:24):
rooted in faith.
'cause everybody else was on a,an, an individual war.
You were either fighting thegovernment or you were fighting
the pandemic.
You were either getting thevaccine or you weren't getting
the vaccine.
You were either votingconservative or you were voting
liberal.
You're either for Trump oryou're for Biden.
It was the most ridiculous time.
I think when history writesitself in the, in human history,
I, I, I truly, truly believethat.

(27:45):
And I think what was allowed tohappen during that time is a
fucking embarrassment.
Not from the government.
I'm talking people calling thepeace officers on their
neighbors.
'cause there was too many carsparked in the driveway at
Christmas.
Yes.
That did happen in a, in, in ourcommunity.
Are you fucking kidding me?
Like you need to be absolutelyembarrassed at that action

(28:05):
because that is insane.
People in hospital waiting roomsyelling at other people because
you took your mask off to take adrink of water

Courtney (28:12):
but the thing was, and I think why we were so divided
is I was that person.
I was terrified at the beginningand you didn't give a fuck put
it bluntly.
And I think that that was a hugeproblem in our life and in our
marriage is we were just sopolar opposites.
And then time went on and I veryquickly realized this is never

(28:36):
going away.
Then my grandmothers both gotsick.
The vaccine mandate came out andI was not able to fly to Nova
Scotia

Alfred (28:45):
to pay the ultimate respect.
Yeah.

Courtney (28:48):
to tell you that I would've done anything that I
could have is putting itlightly.
I would have swam the fuckingocean to be beside them.
It was a no brainer for me.
Unfortunately, what came withthat was that I did have to get
the vaccine, it is a decisionthat I regret since I got it.

Alfred (29:09):
And not, not only that, these women that were pillars in
both our lives.
Yeah.
Obviously yours more than mine,both of them having gone in such
a short period of time, it meantthat you had to go through that.
Traumatic worst case life lossexperience alone.
Exactly.
And I still apologize to you tothis day that you had to go
through that.
And I know that you understandmy reasoning and I know I
understand your frustration.
But that's what, but I think

Courtney (29:30):
that's where, that's where it all kind of broke for
me is, and, and made mefrustrated with you, is that
he's making this unbelievablyselfish decision for himself.
And I have to do this alone.
I have to take my daughter threetimes back and forth to Nova
Scotia by myself with my serviceanimal.

(29:52):
It was a nightmare, an absolutenightmare.
And I did it three times and notonce, three times

Alfred (29:59):
within like a three month span.
Two month.
Yeah.
It was August, September,October.
Exactly.

Courtney (30:04):
They, I went, I had went home for two weeks.
To kind of see them and to makesure that Sophie had some time
with them and pictures,memories, pictures, memories.
And it was a fabulous trip.
And then I think it was twoweeks later, I got the phone
call that I first grandmotherpassed away and then two weeks

(30:25):
after that was my secondgrandmother.
And so it's a lot to handle, alot to, a huge pill to swallow,
but then to not only have allthat happen, but to not have
your husband there to comfortyou to be with you.
It's horrible.
I would wish to my worst enemy.
they didn't die of Covid.
Just so everyone is aware,although their charts probably

(30:49):
say that they

Alfred (30:49):
did, but yeah, I wanted to highlight that because I
wanna, I wanna highlight thefact that our, our house has,
hasn't always been aligned.
No, that there, we've had a lotof disagreements with raising
our daughter political parties.
We vote for approach to thepandemic.
And just to, and just to beclear, when the pandemic was
announced, we were supposed tohave our five-year wedding
anniversary in we had everythingbooked, everything was good.

(31:11):
And then two weeks before theworld shut down, me and my
nephew went to the last N h lhockey game before the season
was canceled for the rest of theyear.
And we bought in both of usbecause vaccines weren't,
weren't even discussed big time.
We, literally locked down forthe month of April.
We had, we never,

Courtney (31:28):
I don't even think we left our

Alfred (31:29):
house.
We didn't, we had groceriesdelivered to the door.
Yeah.
We,

Courtney (31:32):
I, I was terrified of everything.
I wouldn't, for me, I Lysol mygroceries when they got dropped
off on my doorstep.
For

Alfred (31:39):
me, it wasn't fear, it was compliance is, I said, you
know what, for

Courtney (31:45):
you, it wasn't fear, it was compliance for me, it was

Alfred (31:47):
genuine fear, but where my head was at.
Is the messaging at the time wasfour weeks to flatten the curve
to just get this, no, it was twoweeks or whatever, two weeks to
flatten the curve, whatever thenumber.
And I said, you know what, it'sa shoulder month.
the end of winter, but notreally summer.
We don't have many plans.
It's not going to affect me.
So in a selfish way, that was mymental approach.

(32:10):
We've set up our house.
We always have to be a place ofsolitude that we don't need to
leave.
We have enough stuff to engage.
Our daughter, we have enoughstuff to engage us.
We have a nice little movietheater area.
We can stay here for a bit andnot feel like we're in a dungeon
per se.
And then at the end of that,when me and you were done, we
were just like, I need oxygennot recycled by my furnace.

(32:32):
Mm-hmm.
The messaging changed and theykept continuing to move the
narrative.
And I was very skeptical.
I will also say I was veryblessed to not have a employment
impact.
I know people were forced to getthe vaccine to keep employment.
Yeah.
That's sad.
And we had the discussion thatwhen it was being discussed, I
said very clearly, if this comesdown the pipe, I'm unemployed.

(32:54):
Mm-hmm.
Because I refuse.
Because at that, which again is

Courtney (32:57):
another huge hard strain that kind of hit us as
well as I was like, wow, you aregonna be so selfish that you're
going to be unemployed, so ourfamily can't have income to
survive because you won't get avaccine.
Wow.
So to me it was bullshit.
To be honest,

Alfred (33:14):
we had this discussion many times.
Yeah.
It, it, it was, it was a bone ofcontention in the house for
sure.

Courtney (33:18):
Yeah.
But I look back at it and theonly reason that I did it was
for my grandmothers, and

Alfred (33:23):
which

Courtney (33:24):
you don't regret.
I don't regret that for a singlesecond.
But I think that, how awful isit that I.
The government put something inplace that I didn't want to have
in my body, but I had to have itjust to go home and see my
grandmothers before they died.
Like, that's disgusting.
How are they able to mandatewhat I put in my body?
And if you don't do it, here'sthe consequences to your

(33:45):
actions.
Fuck you.
Why do you get to decide what Ido with my life with my bo?
Like it's just, it, none of itmakes sense to me.
None of it.
Yeah.

Alfred (33:55):
Aside from the family issues we were dealing with at
the time, there was noconsequence that came out to me
that persuaded me and there wasno reward that they dangled in
front of me.
That was enough to persuade

Courtney (34:04):
me.
I'm not gonna lie, I truly likedbeing able to travel.
Yeah.
Even though you couldn't.
Sorry.
Okay.

Alfred (34:11):
It's all good.
And, and that's just mypersonality, right?
Is, is do I like to travel?
Of course I love to travel.
I think it's fantastic, but I.
What the sticking point for mewhen it really became
solidified, and I think it wasfor you too, I think,'cause this
was after, you know, thegrandmothers and all that stuff
is when they started offeringmoney Yeah.

(34:33):
To people.
The Alberta government was like,get a jab and will give you
dollars.
Okay.
That's a little fucking weirdbecause they truly, they truly
set the message out that thiswas for health and Okay.
If that was the case, ratherthan give money, why wouldn't
you pay for people's gymmemberships?
Why?
Rather than incentive?

(34:55):
Because you couldn't go to thegym, but No, no, no.
But what or, or why don't youpay for people to get discounts
on, on organic food?
Why don't you, wasn't
there

Courtney (35:04):
a time where you had to get a test just to go

Alfred (35:08):
do something?
I had to test every three daysfor,

Courtney (35:10):
but that was for work.
Correct.
But wasn't there a time where,I'm almost positive we had to go
to the drugstore.
So you could go to, to eat at arestaurant.

Alfred (35:20):
Oh yeah.
You had to show proof of

Courtney (35:22):
negative, you had to show proof of a negative mm-hmm.
Covid test.
Mm-hmm.
If you weren't vaccinated.
Yes.

Alfred (35:26):
How ridiculous is it?
Like it's crazy.
In in what world?
It's crazy.
It's great.
Looking back now, it's, it's,

Courtney (35:32):
it's insane.
Looking back at everything thatwe had to do, I just shake my
head and I'm like, what?
And now they're coming out withlike, apparently if you've
haven't read the fucking news,they're coming out with another
one.
Of course they're, and it's,well, you better mask up, or you
gotta do this, or you gotta do

Alfred (35:47):
that.
And it's like, I I, I had anappointment this morning and
there was somebody wearing amask in the

Courtney (35:51):
office.
Oh, that's, that's everywhere.
But what's insane to me, is howpeople are still buying into it.
How people are like, Nope, thiswill 100% keep me safe.
I know someone who has had fivevaccine five.
That's scary.
Five vaccines.
Why in in three years?

(36:12):
Are they?
No, actually in less than that.
It's been like, what, a year anda half, two years now?
Something like that.
No, no.
Don't care.
But like so you've had morecovid vaccines than you've had
flu shots in that amount oftime.
Like can you not wrap your headlike, I can't wrap my head
around that.
Like if Covid is like a flushot, then why wouldn't you just

(36:34):
lump it in with a flu shot?
And if you have to get it onceor, anyway, I can't talk about
this'cause I'll go on a freakingrant all day long.

Alfred (36:41):
Oh, no worries.
What, what, where I was goingwith all this and I love that we
unpacked that a little bit.
'cause I think it's on mostpeople's minds and people want
to say these things.
People want to put down amandated vaccine that didn't
make sense and didn't align withthem, but they may have been
persuaded.
I know, I know people in ourlives that got the vaccine just
because they wanted to traveland that was their logic and
that's totally fine and that'scompletely however, Now we're

(37:02):
running into this situation of aweak society that people don't
take responsibility.
Was it hard for me to not getthe vaccine?
Of course.
That wasn't an easy decision.
You almost cracked.
I almost cracked.
I told you I was about sixmonths away.
Yeah.
And, and the sticking point wasyour second grandmother is you
came back and you weredistraught and I was not able to
be there.
And that broke me.

(37:24):
And I was like, you know what?
Maybe it is time for me toswallow my pride and then more
and more comes out and I'm, andI'm happy.
What?
But was it easy for me?
No.
Yeah.
But when you have people makingthe decision to get the vaccine,
because,

Courtney (37:36):
and, and also, and, and let me clarify, it wasn't
easy for me either, of course,because I had course, of course,
I had so many people in my lifesaying, well, why isn't he
getting it?
That's super selfish of him.
He's, he's gonna hurt yourfamily.
What I have to say to them isthis, if I have covid as a
vaccinated person and give it tomy husband, who is unvaccinated.

(37:59):
He gives it to my daughter whois, by the way, also
unvaccinated, and then they giveit to someone else who's
vaccinated.
It's not, it doesn't matter.
You're gonna get it.
You're gonna get it.
No.
Whether you're vaccinated oryou're not vaccinated.

Alfred (38:09):
I don't under, I don't understand that if, think of
theological approach to this,you are vaccinated and I'm not.
We both have the ability to getcovid yet I'm the problem.
I'm actually the one puttingmyself at risk.
100%.
And then, and then they're gonnasit

Courtney (38:22):
there and tell us, so how is it that a vaccinated
person is the

Alfred (38:24):
problem?
No, but they're also gonna sitthere and tell us, oh, it's a
hospital bed issue.
Oh, so it's an infrastructureproblem, not a pandemic.
Yeah.
Okay.
That, that fucking makes sense.
So I'm gonna di I'm gonnadigress from this topic a little
bit here.
Yeah.
But where I was going with this,with the pandemic is us having
not a solidified house in termsof opinion approaches.
All that stuff is, I'm thankfuland grateful because it made us

(38:49):
stronger a hundred percent.
And what that took.
It took me seeing how selflessyou are that you would, I don't
wanna say compromise yourself,but you would swallow your
pride, take a vaccine that youwere told was safe, so you're
gonna believe it at face value,which is fine for the people you
love the most.
Then on the flip, now you'regonna have a firm stance because

(39:11):
I stood my ground and you'reappreciative of that.
I think to this day, that'swhere we compliment each other.
The problem that we're havingnow is you have people that got
the vaccine for superficialreasons, and then they won't
take responsibility.
They'll blame the government.
They'll blame Pfizer.
They'll blame Moderna.
They'll blame society.
They'll blame unvaccinated.

(39:31):
You decided to get this.
You made the decision.
That's right.
Regardless of your reasonings,you decided to get it.
Not getting it was that hard.
Of course, it was not easy.
We lost friends.
We were judged.
We deleted people off Facebookbecause of arguments.
It was not easy.
Was it easy for me to be toldthat I can't go to the Atlantic

(39:54):
bubble and see my grandmotherwho was passing away?
Of course.

Courtney (39:57):
Yeah, of course.
Yeah.
That's

Alfred (39:58):
another thing is your grandmother also.
That's right.
That's right.
That's not easy.
Yeah.
We lost three grandmothers thatkinda mm-hmm.
Not because of Covid, just sowe're all fucking clear.
Yeah.
But where I'm going with this isyou're gonna have people that
will not take responsibility,and I think that's a reflection,
going back to even the title ofthis podcast on Modern is today
in Modern Society, people willmake decisions because the

(40:21):
alternative was hard, thealternative was difficult, and
then when it doesn't work out orit goes awry, or they don't get
the desired result, They willturn around and deflect.
Mm-hmm.
Because people are soft.
They will blame other moms.
They will blame their work.
They will blame interest rates,they will blame.

(40:42):
You have the ability to takecontrol of your life in every
way, shape and form.
If you don't like the schoolsystem, homeschool can't afford
it.
Sell the house and, anddowngrade can't afford that.
Rent a one bedroom and put bunkbeds in it.
People are

Courtney (40:55):
still afraid though, of going

Alfred (40:56):
backwards.
Right.
And, and that's my problem.
And that, that's where I'm goingwith this is, is we, we demonize
it.
We look at, like, even us, doyou remember, I think it was
2017, we were realigning ourfinances.
We sold our rv, we sold ourtruck for a car.
So like our, our social imageonline looked like everything
was kind of being fire sold.
And you heard through friends ofa friend that people were

(41:17):
saying, I hear Courtney andAlbert aren't doing very well.
What's going on?
And we were just like, what?
No, we're doing fine.
We're we just don't need allthis shit.
We're actually doing betterbecause we don't have as many
payments and, and we're actuallylike, you know, we kind of just
realized it.
And, and that's what I, that'swhat I mean is, is when you were
saying, when you talk aboutpeople having to have exp
expense or pay for expenses andhaving to compromise the

(41:38):
structure of their home and theymake that choice, that's fine,
but then you can't turn aroundand blame interest rates when
you can't afford things,especially if you've made
decisions in your life to makemore money.
Yeah.
So that's, that's what, whereI'm going with all of this is
contentment the power of notcaring what other people think

(42:00):
is having conversations likethis with your partner.
Raising your kids in a mannerthat aligns with that.
And I'm not saying people haveto have the same opinions and
views as us.
That's not what I'm getting at.
No.
But I think we can agree thatall of society can use a little
bit more self-responsibility andunderstand that everything is
within your control andeverything that goes wrong in
your life.

(42:21):
The majority of it, not all ofit, but the majority of it, you
have control and that's it.
The one thing you don't havecontrol of is other people.
And that's something that in thelast calendar year has helped me
immensely.
Yeah.
Is giving up control.
I cannot control other people'sopinions.
I cannot control other people'sactions.

(42:43):
I control my own.
That's it.
Whether I choose to align withyou or not, that's my decision.
Whether I choose to go to thefire with other men or not,
that's my decision.
If I choose to align with theseother social justice movements
that are going on or not, that'smy decision.
The problem.
Is we've allowed to happen as asociety is we've allowed people

(43:07):
that align with these smallmovements, L G B T, black Lives
Matter, all these reallyradical, hard agenda groups.
We've allowed them to have a lotof power.
We've allowed them to say, how Ifeel is reality.
We've allowed them to say thathow people that I have no way,
shape, or form experience withthat they, that what they said

(43:30):
or did I align with, thereforeit's law, therefore it's reality
and it's not the case.
And, and I feel like

Courtney (43:37):
they always, they like groups like that.
They have this, this stance onlife and it's like, this is my
reality.
I am a trans woman.
Actually don't even know whatthat means.
I'm a trans woman.
Does that mean you're a prettysure that's girl?
Pretty sure

Alfred (43:56):
that's a dude.
A dude.

Courtney (43:58):
Okay, so I was a guy and now I'm a girl and you have
to be okay with it.
Nope, sure.
Don't.
Cool for you.
Great, awesome.
Live your life, bud.
Do it.
But don't you dare push thatshit down my throat.
If there's something in theworld that I cannot stand is
when someone tells me I have toagree with you.
I have to have this take onthis.

(44:18):
I have to go with society.
No, I don't.
I don't.
And if I don't agree with it andI don't like it, that's okay.
we can all have different viewsand different opinions.
It doesn't mean that I thinkless of you as a person.
I love you as a person.
I think you're a fabulousperson, but your views do not
align with my views.
And that is okay.

Alfred (44:36):
That's where faith comes in, right?
Because a hundred percent Ivalue your value as a human.
A hundred percent.
I'm not aligning or I'm notassociating your value with your
opinions and beliefs.
Yeah.
The fact that you're living andbreathing means that you have
innate value.
And that's where the differencealigns with people with
abortion, people with L G B T,people with radical political
ideals.

(44:57):
I love you as a personregardless of any sort of
difference.
You have skin color, beliefs,religion doesn't matter.
But in terms of just valuingyour opinion and, and your
presence around me, that'sinnate.
That, just happens by virtue.

Courtney (45:12):
There's this social media guy, his name is and I say
Guy, but really, I don't know.
Jeffrey Starr.
Fabulous podcast.
Or not podcast, I think he's a,he's on Instagram and TikTok.
That's all I know.
Anyway, he was being interviewedby this guy and he had said
something that stuck with me.

(45:36):
He is transgender or, or she istransgender.
And if I'm mislabeling supersorry.
he had said that all the otherbullshit, the they in them, the,
he's like, there's two genders.
There's male and there's female,there's guys and there's women.
And he said, it's the they inthem in the middle that has gone

(45:56):
crazy.
And then he said, but I can saythat'cause I identify as that
you can't because that'll makeyou transphobic.
How ass fucking backwards isthat I'm not allowed to have
that opinion because I don'tidentify as that.

Alfred (46:13):
I think that's completely ridiculous.
And that goes to almostanything.
My opinion and position is notdiscounted because of my lack of
experience.
Is it more valuable because theyhave experience?
Sure.
But that's to say that oh, mendon't have any reproductive say
when a woman is pregnant.
Okay, well that's prettyridiculous because it takes up a
man to get a woman pregnant.
Yeah.
You didn't just come up withthat on your, just so the fact
that they're not involved inthat conversation strictly

(46:35):
because they cannot getpregnant, which is also a
fucking hilarious hypocrisy inthe sense of the same people
that will tell you that men andwomen are the same, will also be
the ones that tell you that youdon't have an opinion on
abortion.
But that's another topic.
And then it's the same thingthat anything in life, you don't
have an opinion on how to raisekids.
'cause you're working all day.
Well, I'm pretty sure it's mychild too.
And I'm pretty sure, and I'mpretty sure there's a dichotomy
in marriage and in and in lifeon how to raise children, how to

(47:00):
have a functioning society.
Yeah.
And I, and

Courtney (47:02):
I think that where we are in life and, and kind of
where society places everybodyis, women can do all of the jobs
that men can do.
Sorry.
They can't.
And guess what?
Men can't do all the jobs thatwomen can do.
And people will hate me for whatI just said.
And that's okay.
You hate me.
You hate me.
I don't really give a shit, Ipersonally think that there are

(47:27):
men are, men are stronger thanwomen.
That's it.
Women are better at certainthings than men.
And that's it.
That's okay.
When did it become this horriblestigma that everything that I
can do, you can do everythingthat you can do, I can do, I

(47:49):
can't stand that.
You can't.
'cause then it goes right backto everything that we just
talked about.
It's,

Alfred (47:56):
it's modern.
Russell Brand has a really greatway of putting this.
He was on the diary of a c e Opodcast.
Love that podcast by the way.
He's got some really greatguests on there.
And he, I mean, Russell Brand'sa character as it is.
And he said that he has toconstantly practice anarchist
calisthenics.
And he ex what is that?
And he explained it in a waythat in the last, I don't know,

(48:19):
I, I don't remember how manyyears he quoted.
He basically said the lying andthe bullshit that has come from
people who call themselvesleaders, people who call
themselves, you know, highpowered individuals and all this
stuff has been so ridiculousthat he actually now has to
practice.
Not doing the exact opposite ofwhat anybody says.

(48:39):
And, and I truly believe that ifsomebody tells me to get
vaccinated, get fucked.
If someone tells me to put yourkid in this school, I'm likely
going somewhere else.
Anybody in a position ofauthority that tries to come at
me and invalidate my opinionjust by proxy, I immediately
have this urge and desire to gothe opposite direction.
Yep.
Anybody who puts it down mythroat and tells me that I need

(49:02):
to get rid of my criticalthinking skills, get rid of my
research, which, I mean, whatthe fuck is research nowadays?
You can't even, you can't.
It's all fake news.
It, it's it.
That's all it is.
And I truly have to practicethat.
I is, I actually have to fightthe urge.
And, and Russell brand talksabout it from positions of
authority.
I almost think about it.
Anybody that comes at me with ahigher tone of voice or a

(49:25):
position of empowerment, even ifthey're on the same level as me,
even if they're a friend, my, myimmediate knee jerk reaction now
is to go the other direction.
And this comes from years ofbeing told what to do, how to do
it, when to do it, why to do it,or even worse what you can't do.

Courtney (49:42):
And that's my biggest thing.
And that is don't tell me that Ican't do something.

Alfred (49:45):
Exactly.
And, and, and that's where thefreedom is infringed upon.
Listen, I like in Canada, youcannot deny the Holocaust.
It is against the law.
I think that's brilliant.
I think that is amazing.
And I think Holocaust deniersare ridiculous.
And the fact that that's lawpays respects to the people that
suffered through that.
It recognizes the atrocities andit burns it into history that we

(50:07):
can learn from the past.
But what's happening now is,It's a bigger issue with what's
happened throughout historywhere people have always fought
against structures.
You've always had rebellionagainst kings.
You've always had strongercountries trying to conquer
weaker countries.
Sometimes they weren't, weren'tsuccessful.

(50:28):
You look at the Vietnam War, bigpowerhouse US tries to invade
Vietnam.
I'm paying respect to militaryservice men and women that lost
their lives.
What I'm, where this is going isin 2023 and likely beyond, there
is a war against the structureof truth is people are rewriting
vocabulary because they'reconsidering it a win.
People are wanting to alter youropinion and position by law and

(50:53):
force because they don't likeyour reality.
They don't have to go thedifficult road.
All they have to do is scream.
Call the helpline and you loseyour job or you lose your kids,
or you lose your socialreputation or you get canceled,
which is a fun word these dayswithout putting in effort.

(51:13):
That's the problem.
We're rewarding delinquency.
We're rewarding lack of effort.
We're rewarding people thatdon't want to do work.
And I'm not talking about work,work.
I'm talking about anything thatis a net positive to themselves
or society.
You know, a great example I'lluse, I've seen this on a
podcast, and this goes back towomen, I've seen, a podcast

(51:35):
called the whatever podcast.
It's about dating.
They have some very interestingpeople on that podcast.
It's a really fun one.
the host asked all the girls onthere, rate yourself one through
10.
Oh, I remember this.
Yes.
And all the girls said 10.
First of all, you can't know thevalue of a woman strictly by
looks.
No.
You can't know the value of aman strictly by looks.

(51:56):
But there was one girl on therewho called Lizzo a 10.
for anybody who's know Lizzo is,she's a very famous hip hop
artist, whatever you wanna callher.
About halfway through the show,the host complimented her by
saying, I love what you'rewearing today.
You remind me of Lizzo.
And she took it as an offense.
that goes, but yet she calledLizzo a 10.
And that, and that goes back tothis underlying lie to conform,

(52:19):
that we tell people, this bodypositivity, this fallacy where
people are taking reality andthey're lying, and then they're
telling you, you either believemy lie you face consequences.
And that's on both sides.
I don't want to pick on one sidebecause I align with one more
than the other, but that's onboth sides.
Don't force me to have to dothat.

(52:41):
that's where I absolutely lovewhere we're at is we've gone
through the shit over the lastfew years.
We've reinforced ourselves,we've reduced our circle, but
we've reinforced our circle ofinfluence around us.
And I think that is the codethat is the secret to happiness.
That is the secret to feelingand living more fulfilled.

(53:05):
And I feel so sorry for peopleout there that are going in the
opposite direction because I dothink it's a direction that
leads off the end of a cliff.
I truly do.
That's why suicides are up.
That's why depression is up.
That's why all these, thesemodern day problems, That's why
they're all increasing is peoplehave a lost connection with
themselves and with the peoplearound them.

(53:26):
Yeah, One more topic I'd love todiscuss on here today, and this
was kind of one that was broughtup in my mind this morning a
little bit, is I wanted to getyour thoughts on men is I wanna,
I want you to kind of, I knowyou're married, happily married.
We're doing great.
Am I though?
I mean, you're asking the wrongguy.
I mean, my goodness.

(53:46):
I definitely would not ratemyself through one through 10.
That's just terrible.
But this is an interestingconversation'cause I feel like
women don't have thisconversation anymore.
I feel like the only, so do youthink we

Courtney (53:56):
don't have it with each other or do you think that
we don't have it, period?
I

Alfred (54:00):
don't think you have it, honestly, with each other.
Correct.
And what do you wanna know?
I want to know in your mind,what have you heard as a woman?
Mm-hmm.
Because as much as we talkedabout women on here, and as much
as we talked about people takingaccountability, that's for both
sides of the fence.

Courtney (54:16):
I'm still not understanding what you're

Alfred (54:17):
asking me.
So, so what I'm asking you iswhen you talk to the girls that
you hang out with, not all ofthem are married.
Not all of them have kids.
Some of them are divorced, someof'em never been married.
Mm-hmm.
What do you hear when it comesto, what are men's shortfalls?
What do you hear that womenthink is missing from society?

(54:38):
That any single divorced menlistening to this, what can they
do to position themselves ifthey want to?
If they don't want to, that'sfine, but position themselves to
find a partner.
Quality, not some hot summerchick that was a good fling for
one night and then it ends indivorce six months later.
I'm talking about somebody ofvalue and substance.

(54:58):
So I think that first

Courtney (54:59):
of all, you need to like, what do you want in a
relationship?
Do you want someone who is gonnatravel the world with you so
that you can fuck on the dailyand then that's it.
Or do you want someone that'sgoing to help you raise a
family?
Because those are two verydifferent people.
Will I absolutely travel theworld with you?
Absolutely.
But you ain't gonna get thesecond one from me.
I can guarantee you that.

Alfred (55:20):
Not with that attitude,

Courtney (55:22):
but I, it's, it's that I think fine line of what do you
want and what do you need in arelationship or in, or in a
woman.

Alfred (55:33):
So what are some commonalities you're seeing from
women, whether they're marriedor not?
Because we know some marriagesthat are hanging on by a thread
and we know some divorces thathappened that honestly shouldn't
have happened.
What do you think is a shortfallthat

Courtney (55:44):
when I look back at the divorces that I feel like
shouldn't have happened?
A lot of it was time you weren'tthere.
And but I also look at it on theflip side is did you communicate
with them that that was thecase?
So I come from a very, I think,different perspective than what

(56:06):
most women will, whereas I valuemen, I hold them or, or I put
them on this pedestal, whereas alot of women

Alfred (56:13):
don't.
What kind of men do you put on apedestal?
'cause not all men get put onpedestals.
So what are some things that youvalue in a man?

Courtney (56:21):
Hard work.
I think that all men need tohave a work ethic.
I can't stand when I hear thatsome guy has sat on a video.
Game for eight hours a day.
For myself he needs to behardworking.
He needs to want to spend timewith us.
He has to have a good homework-life balance.

(56:45):
I think that's the biggest one.
'cause I can guarantee you onething, if something happens to
you, your job is not going to bethe person that calls you to see
if you're okay.
It's gonna be your family, notyour job.
So prioritize your family overyour work.
Hundred percent of the time.
I think we've seen thatrecently, is that your job is

(57:07):
not there for you.
They're not the ones that matterthe most in life.
Yeah.
It's how you make your income,but your family will always be
there for you.
So that's, I think the biggestone for me is making sure that
that man has that work-lifebalance.
Leave work at the door, don'ttake it home with you.
That's another one.

(57:28):
A healthy sexual appetite,that's also another one.
And wanting to explore beingthat guy that wants to go
places, that wants to see newthings, that wants to travel.
I am not.
I am not the type of person, andagain, I'm, I'm talking about
this as if it was for me.
I'm not the person who likes tosit still, never have been,

(57:49):
never will be.
I left my house when I was 17years old and never looked back.
I want to see the world and Ithink that that's a very for
myself, high priority

Alfred (57:59):
for me.
So I think what you'redescribing is a pretty low
percentage of men right now,which I think is where men's
shortfall shortcomings comefrom.
I truly do.
Yeah.
So I, I'm gonna push back onthat a little bit.
I think part of that is theissue is I think we're, that I
hold, we're telling women thatyou need to have a high income
earner who's not obese, loves totravel, can fuck real good, but

(58:21):
I never said anything.
Ha ha has strong.
No, but you paraphrase a littlebit there.
You said you wanted to go seethe world.
Yep.
Needs to, so you're atraditional woman, so you love
the man to work and make theincome, but he also needs to
balance work and home.
Yeah, the, the, that's inconfliction a little bit.
'cause where do you find thehappy medium?
Where it's not because you

Courtney (58:38):
do it, but, so here's, but here's the thing, but I
haven't always done it.
And, but here's my thing.
Yeah.
Listen, here's my thing.
Mm-hmm.
Is it's different.
So, and, and again, I'm lookingat it from my life, not from
anybody else's'cause this is allI know.
Mm-hmm.
But you're a shift worker.
The five days that you'reworking or the five days that
you're working, when you comeoff on those five days, my

(58:59):
expectation is that you at somepoint will be with your family.
That you'll prioritize us oversomething else that you want to
do.
Does that mean that you can't dosomething for yourself?
No.
But that means that the priorityis that you have a family.
That's it.
I never said that every singlewaking day you needed to be with
your family.

(59:20):
I said that you prioritize yourfamily.

Alfred (59:22):
Continue.
Just give an example.
Like, I just came off of a fiveshift.
Yes.
So, so like we live in Alberta.
This is a very shift work kindof cultured workspace, the oil
and gas industry, thetransportation industry, the
aviation industry.
It's very shift work base.
We know friends that theirhusbands are gone 24 days of the
month.
Yep.
You know, is, you know, that's ahard pill to swallow.

(59:44):
Mm-hmm.
And it's very hard to have aquality sexual life.
So here's the question on it's,hang on.
So hold on, hang on, hang on.
It's very hard to have thatbalance and you, but it's not,
but, but hang on.
You have men that go work for60, 70% of the month away from
their home.
Mm-hmm.
Whether it's 500 miles away or5,000 miles away, whatever it's
Yep.

(01:00:04):
Then when they come home, theexpectation is prioritize family
when they have yet to haveindividual time at home.
And we know people thatliterally when the man walks in
the door, they're handed a babyand the mom just takes a couple
days off.
Do they deserve that day off?
A hundred percent.
A hundred percent, but the manjust came.
Where I'm getting at with thisis I want to get a female
perspective using other peoplethat might be in a more

(01:00:27):
difficult situation like we'vetalked about.
An example I'll say is you said,if I was to ever have to go back
and do commuting work, you wouldnever allow it.
You would move to that city.
Absolutely.
You would leave your friends ahundred percent and you would
make the hard decisions.

Courtney (01:00:41):
Absolutely.
That's, but that's the problemthat most women nowadays
wouldn't, they wouldn't do that.
They don't want to do that.
They wanna live in theircomfortable life.
They wanna live in theircomfortable home with older,
comfortable things.
And that's fine for them, butthat's not me.
I prioritize my family.
I want my family to be togetherall the time.
That means that if my husbandhas a job in Fort McMurray, my

(01:01:04):
husband has a job inYellowknife, my husband has a
job in none of it, I don't carewhere it is.
I am not going to sit here andfor 20 days out of a month.
Wait for my husband to comeback.
And that's my opinion.
That's my choice as a person, asa wife.

Alfred (01:01:19):
So is that something that you would tell maybe a
woman absolute might bestruggling?
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
That that is told, and I don'tne, I don't think we would e
necessarily need to if I wasliving in the yellow knife or
something, or if I was workingup north and say the diamond
mines in alt or wherever it isup there.
I don't think we need to move upthere.

What I'm saying is if you're gone for 20 days out of a
month, I'm moving there becauseI know that I can't do it by
myself.

Alfred (01:01:46):
But do you think there's conversations that should be had
that aren't had where therecould be a year or two of
self-sacrifice, so long as a manis doing what he can to become
local, do you think that therecould be that conversation where
somebody looks at this not as a30 year career?
Having to commute and never seetheir kids.
And never see their wives.
So here's a question

to you then.
Are you okay missing two yearsof your kids' life?

Alfred (01:02:09):
Depends on where I'm at in my life.
If you ask 25 year old me 100%,it's not even a question.
But if you ask 34 year old, youno.
See, that's the thing.
But that's what I'm getting atis if there's people listening
that are in that situation andwe know people we're not gonna
name names, that their partneris gone 80% of the month and men

(01:02:29):
get comfortable, men getattracted to the money when that
we've already discussed on thispodcast is not what's important,
but it takes a woman to realignand be contempt with less.
Y yes.
However, so if you had to tradein your nice brand new fancy van

(01:02:52):
Oh my, for a shit box, but itmeant that I stopped commuting.
I, I would do that.
I believe you would do that.
Absolutely.
Is that a secret code that maybewomen haven't considered and or
men sit there and say, I'm gonnatake correspondence while I'm up
there.
I'm gonna finish my degree thatI dropped out of in my third
year to get local or i'll, orI'll pick a full but actually

(01:03:14):
doing that, or, but that's whatI'm getting at, is I wouldn't
think of that unless my womanincentivized me to do it.
Yeah.
So,

cause if a woman, what I would say, what I would say to
those women is, are you happy?
Is this what you want?
Because there was actuallysomething that I read on online
and I actually need to find itbecause it was, it suited this
conversation.
Like you

Alfred (01:03:39):
wouldn't believe.
Where, where I'm going with thisis I think people self-sabotage
all the time.
I think of course, I, I, I thinkpeople will get into that type
of position and, and that's apretty big example.
I'm, I'm obviously, you know,that applies to other small
things in life.
Like if there's no sex life, ifthere's no time with family, if
there's too many video games, ifthere's not enough or if a
person has gained a hundredpounds in a marriage.
'cause once they get married,they're like, well, I'm

(01:04:00):
uncomfortable.
She has to love me regardless,or vice versa.
Self-work never ends.
That goes till the day you die.
Yeah.
And unfortunately that'sdemonized.
That's called toxic masculinity.
That's called, oh, bodypositivity or body shaming or
whatever other fucking modernday buzz phrase you want to use.
That's the issue is I don'tthink people can have these
conversations anymore.
And I think that's the secret.
So, getting your perspective onus using, you know, friends or

(01:04:24):
ex-friend or distanceacquaintances, examples.
Where maybe they haven't hadthese discussions before, but we
have, we're not even in thesefucking situations.
And we've actually had thesediscussions.
We've talked about what ifscenarios, all the fucking time,
all the time we talk about.
But I think that that's

healthy because there could come a day where that is
the case for us.
And what would I do?
Well, I'd pack up and fuck off'cause I don't belong here.

Alfred (01:04:46):
Like I think you've thought about what you would
have to sacrifice a hundredpercent to, to, to meet your
higher priority.
Absolutely.
What you value.
So there's this, sorry.
Yeah, I wanna hear this.

So it says it was a friend of mine actually from
down home that her fiance isworking in Fort McMurray.
So from a down home, so NovaScotia for McMurray.
And I mean, that's how we met.
I was Nova Scotia, you were inAlberta.
A lot of my family friends haveall done the same thing.

(01:05:16):
But it says, so you want thatjob away from home life.
The big trucks, the toys, themoney.
It comes with a price.
Try packing all your things infront of your wives or
girlfriends knowing that they'rehurting to see you.
Leave.
Try starting the clock, hopingthat, hoping that last day home
goes slower than usual.
Try getting in your vehicle withyour kids and partners, staring

(01:05:36):
out the windows and doors.
Try driving down the road withtears in your eyes.
Try hoping you forgot somethingso you can turn around for one
more hug.
One more kiss, or one more.
I love you to think you haven'teven made it to work for your
first day.
there's always at least 20 daysat a time.
Depending on your schedule, ifnot more, your head and heart
will be heavy.
It will never get easier.

(01:05:57):
Think about the next time youthink it will be nice.
It's hard, and you'll sacrificefar more than you think, and
most of the time it's like this.
Be safe.
When I think of that, There'snot an ounce of me that would
ever go through that.
And it hurts my heart that thereare women out there that do have
to go through it.
Friends of ours have to gothrough it, and I question it on

(01:06:19):
the Daily about why, and I thinkfor them is they just don't
wanna leave their reality here.
And that's fine for them ifthat's what they want.
But I think that you need to askyourself wholeheartedly, are you
happy?
Are you okay watching him leaveevery single time that he
leaves?
Are you okay that he missesmonths with your kids, he

(01:06:41):
doesn't get to watch them growup?
Or if he does that, it's overFaceTime.
And if that's okay for you, thenthat's okay for you.
That's your life.
You live it.
But that's not okay for me, andI would never be able to do it.
I'd leave.
My life here, my friends here,my family here in a heartbeat.
If it meant that every night myhusband could

Alfred (01:07:00):
come home to us, it's so interesting because from a man's
perspective, and I can speak toexperience on this, is if you
told me that, or if my daughterever came out to me and said,
daddy, I really want this, or,or you were driving a ship box
car for 10 years and you'relike, I'd really like to not
have to fucking worry about thisthing breaking down.
Or if you were tired of livingin a rental and wanted to buy a
house.

(01:07:21):
If you asked me and you said,there's this job, or if I looked
and I said, there's a jobopportunity up north, I'm, I'm
gonna take it.
And it's a do doubles my salary,I will tell you there's not a
single second in my mind thatwould hesitate to make that
sacrifice.
And I think that's what we'remissing is I think there's a lot
and we, and it goes back to thatoriginal statement that I said
is people look at energy in andenergy out is I.

(01:07:45):
Is this worth it for me?
When it only affects somebodyelse?
What do I get out of this?
And the one thing we'veidentified is people of faith
that love God and that love ahigher entity.
Good people, do things for otherpeople.
Yeah.
Period.
Friends, family, spouses, evenchildren.
Mm-hmm.

(01:08:05):
And where I wanted to go withthis, and we kind of touched on
it a little bit, but basicallyto summarize is I think people
need to be a bit more selflessand a bit more considerate.
Is your feelings while valued?
I don't need to align with, Idon't.
And that's okay.
Mm-hmm.
There's nothing wrong with that.

(01:08:27):
Absolutely.
And then on the flip, I think ifpeople are self-sabotaging,
meaning you don't have somethingin, in control spending sex,
work, travel, friends, alcohol,whatever you wanna call it, if
you don't have it under control,the only answer is it's gonna be
hard.
Mm-hmm.
It's gonna suck.

(01:08:47):
It's

gonna take sacrifice.
I mean, I look at, I look at ourlife in the last few years.
You have, and I say in the lastfew years, but you've had many
business things at two.
Okay.
You've had two.
When we first, how long ago wasthat first one?

Alfred (01:09:08):
Oh my gosh.
2014.
Nine years ago.
Nine years.
Jesus.
There's no way.
2014, it was December, 2013 thatwe did that show at the West
Mont Mall water pool or wavepool.
Oh my gosh.
That'ss, right with Steve

Aoki.

Alfred (01:09:24):
No.
Isn't that No, it was EricPritz.

Ah, that's it.
Anyway you started a businessway back then and that business
flopped.
Sorry, I wouldn't say flopped.
It was great.
It was an expensive education.
It was an expensive, yeah.
That's better.
It's the ultimate reframe.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Okay.
That's good.
It was an expensive educationand then, and it, but it took up

(01:09:46):
a lot of our time.
I remember you would go to work,work a night shift, come home,
stay up.
I.
Go out to the lake to open upthe business, wait for someone
else to get there, go home,sleep for four hours, and then
go back to work that night.
You're exhausted.
It was

Alfred (01:10:04):
ridiculous.
Greatest times of my life.

Can you, but can you imagine doing that with a kid?
Not even close?
what I mean.
You do those things, you makethose decisions when you're
young, when you don't have thekids involved.
But I feel like once you havekids involved, something has to
change.
You can't live that fast paced,go-getter life with kids, I
think, and if you do, but holdon a minute.

(01:10:27):
But if you do, then you and yourpartners need to be okay that
you're sacrificing family time.
And I think it's just, there'sonly so many years we get with
them.

Alfred (01:10:38):
Goes back to that ringing phrase we said when she
was young, where the days arelong and the years are short.
Yes.
Yeah.
Like I just, I I think, I thinkwith kids, your priorities
change, right?
Absolutely.
You now have to keep a humanalive because the return policy
sucks on children.
They

sure do.
Yeah.
It's return policies also suckon husbands.
Yeah, well, no, no.
I've asked and she said no.

Alfred (01:11:00):
You asked a woman what the

return policy was.
I asked your mom what yourreturn policy was and she said,
fuck, he's

Alfred (01:11:05):
your problem.
You trade me for my mom any day.
Your mom loves me.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It's true.
I'm her favorite, but I wannachallenge that narrative a
little bit and this'll be whatwe'll close on here is doing
things while you're young Ithink that's a massive issue
today is I think men and men andwomen, when they're 18, 19, Are

(01:11:26):
told to get an education, andthat's a whole other topic.
And they either do so for two tofour years or they don't, and
they travel.
But there's this falseexpectation that you have to be
so experienced in life beforeyou have children, or before you
expand your family or before youset down roots, that it misses

(01:11:46):
people.
PE-people drive by or they driveon the highway of life and they
miss the turnoff.
And before they know it, they'reat the age where they can't have
kids or they're stuck in a jobnow that they feel like they're
committed to'cause they're 15years into a pension and they
overvalue a pension is, I thinkthere's something to be said
about meeting somebody young.
And again, we were blessed'causethat is our reality.

(01:12:09):
But I think there's something tobe said about not wanting to be
experienced in life, travel,sex, and wanting to do all of
your firsts with your kids.
There.
And, and we experience that nowbecause we, we come from a very
poor background.
We didn't come from, means, wedidn't come from, you know, I
think the first time I

left Canada I was 21.
You took me to Disney World.
My dream for

Alfred (01:12:34):
your birthday.
For my birthday.
But what I'm getting at is Idon't want to be, I don't want
people to think that you have todo these things.
'cause we have friends that hadkids at very young ages.
Yep.
And we actually talked about itthis morning where Yeah.
You know, they're only fouryears older than me, yet their
kid is graduating high school.
Mm-hmm.
And it's like they're not even15 or they're what, 15 years

(01:12:54):
from retirement and the kids aregone.
Yeah.
They're gonna live their bestlives while also maintaining
their legacy and havingchildren.
Yeah.
'cause I can promise you if youasked me what were some of the
best experiences in my life, isthere one or two that stand out
before Sophie?
Certainly.
No doubt.
In my mind it's a highlight.
It's an area that I didn't thinkI would, I would reach, or it's,

(01:13:15):
it was a goal that was years inthe making.
But I can assure you my mostfulfilling moments was with
Sophie.
Yep.
No doubt in my mind.
And one of those that I cancertainly tell you is I'm so
happy with what I've built is Itake, like, I, I hang my hat on

(01:13:37):
that of what I was able to workhard for, where you might look
at it as, that was a roughmonth.
You, we only seen you a littlebit'cause you worked a ton
overtime, made all the money or,or you know, you were just
bagged hired doing that and thebusiness, or whatever you wanna
call it, that is something forme that that's a reward for the
work.
And there's that fine balancewhere when you said you need a

(01:13:59):
man, That prioritizes familybecause I can promise any, any
man of quality I know certainlydoes that, even if they work 24
days outta the month in in.
But again,

I think, I think the biggest thing for me is
understanding that I come, or Isay that with, I think just
respect for you because I knowthat that's what you bring to
the table.
I know that that's how you are,I know that that's how I'm
wired.
Exactly.
Like, and that's, but that'swhat I look for, you know?

(01:14:29):
So going back, go blow down thestreet, maybe doesn't look

Alfred (01:14:32):
for that.
Yeah.
So going back and that's okay.
So going back to it, when I hearof couples getting divorced and
then I hear of the guy lookingfor another woman that, okay,
well you met your ex at thisplace and now you're looking for
your future girlfriend in thesame place.
Do you think that that's arecipe for disaster?
You know, like or the first onedidn't work out.
That could be.
Or, when women dress up, wearshort skirts and go to and go to

(01:14:54):
Cook County, they're like, oh, Imet this guy Brad.
He's got a six pack and drives aHummer.
Oh my God, I can't wait.
Like, what the fuck are youtalking about?

But here's the thing.
Here's the thing.
Some of those relationships

Alfred (01:15:04):
work out.
Name one, I can't thank you.
But other than on H G T orfucking T L C or whatever the
fuck the channel is, what I'mgetting at is if you meet a
person that exudes personalitytraits that don't align with
your core values, not, you're

probably not meeting them at a Cook

Alfred (01:15:20):
County ranch house or fucking brew house or whatever,
ranch is no

longer.
That makes me so sad.
That was like the best bar.
I think I

Alfred (01:15:27):
was in there once to ride the

bull.
No, maybe.
Yeah,

Alfred (01:15:31):
I was in there multiple times.
Sorry, I'm a boring ass, boringass dude.
Sorry.
You're not boring.
Yeah.
But yeah, that, that's where I'mgoing at is I think men need to
sit there and stop.
Looking at Instagram type womenwith filters and fake shit and,
you know, all the, you know,these, these bikini photos
because then guys will get madthat they get snaked by a girl

(01:15:53):
that they end up having a kidwith, get divorced six months
later, get taken to childsupport court, and they're, and
they're fucked for their life.
And they do it multiple times.
And then women, same thing.
You'll meet a dude that getsdrunk all the time, plays video
games.
You'll have a kid, or you'll getinto a serious relationship or
common law or you'll, you'lleventually get to a point where
you have something to lose andyou'll lose it.

(01:16:13):
And then you'll question why ithappens.
Mm-hmm.
And that makes no sense.
And, and it's because weprioritize these things.
It's cool if you go to the barand shoot a shoot tequila, it's
cool if you're on Instagram andhave 25,000 followers because
you show all your fuckingcleavage and your, and your ass
on online.
It's cool if a Duke goes onthere and has the lifted truck
and the, the big granitewaterfall island in his house

(01:16:35):
that he can't afford.
And the only way he affords it.
Is by working 24 days a month upnorth and isn't spending time
with his wife and kids.
So there's this weird where it'smutually, you're mutually
responsible for your success,and women like to blame men and
men like to blame women, or youblame society or the government.
And nobody ever takesaccountability.
Nobody ever, it's never your ownfault, but it always is your

(01:16:57):
own.
Oh, absolutely.
You, you have control.
But I'll tell you, I would nothave the same mindset I'd have
if you weren't around and viceversa.
I don't, I like, I value the,the woman that you are and the
woman you exude because itallows me to be the most
successful because we arealigned.

And the same thing goes for you too.
Mm-hmm.
I wouldn't be where I am withoutall of the opportunities that
you've given me.
I run a very successfulphotography business and that
wouldn't have been possiblewithout all of the things that
you've done, the time thatyou've given me.
If something that.
I look at and I'm in awe of allthe

Alfred (01:17:35):
time.
I just look at everybody thatwe, that we associate with that
we would consider having asuccessful life or a quality
life or fulfilling life.
They don't have time for bss.
They don't have time.
Yeah.
For things that don't yield anet positive for themselves or
the people around them.
Yeah.
They don't have time to bitchand mo about politics online.
So yeah.
I love it and I think we'realigned.

(01:17:56):
I'm super appreciative of thisdiscussion.
Yeah, I think, I think this isjust an official version of
conversations we have all thetime and yeah.
I hope people

get, I thought it was gonna go way worse than this.
I'm not gonna lie.
I thought we

Alfred (01:18:07):
were gonna fight.
Oh, I don't think we're gonnafight.
Oh, well,

you know.
Okay.
There's always time.
There's always time.
Yeah.
Say maybe on the next podcastthat I come on, then we can
really break it out, you know?
Sure.

Alfred (01:18:21):
I like that.
Okay.
But is there anything you wannaend on?
No, I think that's it.
Thanks for supporting andhelping me create this space.
You're welcome.
I really appreciate it.
It's a way for me to speak mypeace in a very authentic way.

I think everyone in the world who knows you,

Alfred (01:18:39):
which is not many people,'cause I'm kind of an
introvert,

knows that.
So all of our friends and all ofour family knows that you are
very opinionated and I thinkthis is the best way to get your
opinions out there and geteverything off your chest.
I think this is kind of a

Alfred (01:18:55):
perfect route for you.
This is my vocal journaling.
I like it.
It it truly, I like that.
Yes.
It truly feels like that.
This is, oh, I like that.
This is like my podcast diaryand, and I don't care who's
sitting in that chair.
I wanna talk to anybody andeverybody about this stuff.
I love it.
I don't just wanna talk topeople I align with.
I want to talk to other people.
I like it.
I want to see where people'shead's at because I think that

(01:19:17):
this sort of.
Type of conversation is missing.
It truly is.
'cause I can't have this in theworkplace.
Certainly truly

wonder.
And I feel like your viewers,like, I feel like we should take
a poll.
So once you put this out, I feellike a poll should happen of
what, you're married, do youhave these conversations?
Is this something that you talkabout with your spouse or do you
leave it hush hush.
I'd love to know

Alfred (01:19:39):
coming soon.
Dun dun dun.
Okay, well I'm gonna end it onthat.
Thank you so much, babe.
No problem.
I love this.
And hopefully everyone wholistened got some value outta
this.
I look forward to any comments,any feedback that people might
have, good or bad.
I love all of it.
And where can people find you ifthey wanna know more about
Courtney?
The mom, the photographer, thewife?

(01:20:02):
I.

I have a Instagram and Facebook.
You can look me up at OhanaPhotography, and if you want to
book a session with me, you cango to ohana

Alfred (01:20:14):
photography.ca.
amazing website, by the way.
Okay, well, thanks so much andwe will catch you guys in the
next one.
Well, that's it for thisepisode.
Thank you so much for listeningto the Unmodern Podcast.
If you like what you heard andwant to hear more, don't forget
to hit that subscribe button.
Also, like and follow me onInstagram and Facebook at

(01:20:34):
unmodern podcast.
If you have suggestions forfuture guests or if you are
interested in being a guestyourself, please visit unmodern
podcast.com.
Thank you again, and we'll seeyou in the next episode.

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