February 17, 2025 • 27 mins
Summary
The central theme of this discourse revolves around the dichotomy between a formulaic approach to spirituality and the profound nature of faith. Dr. Ray Mitsch elucidates the pervasive tendency among individuals to reduce their relationship with the divine to a mere series of if-then propositions, thereby undermining the essential trust and vulnerability that underpin authentic faith. Through personal reflections on grief and loss, particularly relating to the sorrow of significant anniversaries, he explores the implications of viewing spirituality through a lens of control rather than openness to the transformative work of the Holy Spirit. This examination reveals that the rigid adherence to formulas often leads to disillusionment when divine responses do not align with human expectations. Ultimately, he invites listeners to reconsider their spiritual journeys: will they continue to cling to the safety of formulas, or will they embrace the risks inherent in a relationship grounded in faith?
Show Notes
The discourse presented by Dr. Ray Mitsch delves into the profound intricacies of human emotion, particularly focusing on the themes of sorrow and grief. He articulates the notion that life is often punctuated by moments of sorrow, which are sometimes inadequately acknowledged in our daily experiences. Drawing from personal experiences of loss, including the recent passing of a long-time friend, Dr. Mitsch emphasizes the importance of recognizing how anniversaries of loss can shape our emotional landscape. He reflects on the concept of grief, asserting that it transcends mere loss due to death and encompasses various forms of emotional upheaval that we encounter throughout our lives. Through this dialogue, he invites listeners to engage with their own feelings of sorrow and to understand the significance of addressing these emotions as part of the human experience.
Furthermore, Dr. Mitsch transitions into a critical examination of the dichotomy between formulas and faith in the context of spirituality. He posits that humans inherently seek to create formulas to navigate their relationships, particularly with the divine. This tendency, he argues, can lead to a superficial understanding of faith that prioritizes rituals over genuine connection. By referencing historical contexts, such as the intricate religious formulas established during Jesus' time, he highlights the dangers of reducing spirituality to a mere checklist of behaviors. Instead, he advocates for a faith that is rooted in trust and vulnerability, urging listeners to consider how their desire for control may inhibit their spiritual growth and relational depth. The discussion culminates in a powerful invitation to cultivate a faith that is open to the movement of the Holy Spirit, contrasting this with the restrictive nature of formulaic approaches to spirituality.
Takeaways:
- In our lives, sorrow often permeates our experiences, yet we frequently fail to acknowledge it.
- The tendency to approach our relationship with God through a formulaic lens can hinder genuine connection.
- Navigating our grief requires understanding that loss is multifaceted and not solely tied to death.
- Faith necessitates a deep trust that cannot coexist with a desire for control over outcomes.
- The act of vulnerability is crucial in establishing authentic relationships and community.
- Living by faith rather than formulas encourages exploration and discovery in our spiritual journeys.
Links referenced in this episode:
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Foreign welcome to a brand new week.
(00:24):
I'm glad to be able to shareit with you and join in.
I am back again behind the micto talk about something that I think
is important.
Before I do that, just tointroduce myself, I'm Dr.
Ray Mitch, your host of Unscripted.
It is the collected wisdom oflife, living and sorrow.
(00:48):
And I think there's probably alot more to it than meets the eye,
partly because of how much ofour lives oftentimes are punctuated
by sorrow.
But we really don't think inthose terms.
And that's what I want toaddress in one fashion or another.
Now the reality is, is thatthere is a certain selfish part of
(01:12):
me that is doing this becauseof the sorrow that I continue to
feel.
I had a good friend of mine of34 years that died a year ago, and
a lot of the anniversaries arestarting to hit because we're past
the midway point of February.
(01:33):
And that was when I started toget updates and people telling me
how he was doing and what wasgoing on there.
And I can just feel in variouspoints in time in my day or otherwise,
where I am thinking about itand it rests on my shoulders in so
(01:58):
many ways, thinking back tothat year.
And that's really a part ofsorrow is this aspect of anniversaries.
And I spent a little time inanother podcast talking about it,
and if you want, you can goback and listen to was one of the
early ones, so probably onethrough five.
One of those was on anniversary.
(02:21):
In a lot of cases weexperience that kind of thing without
really knowing it.
Sometimes we don't evenidentify that that's exactly what
we're feeling and the thoughtsbegin to show up and the things that
we feel show up as well.
So that's what Unscripted isall about.
It's partly that and partlyabout talking through the seasons
(02:44):
of our grief and what they allmean and how we experience them and
the things that are importantto understand about them.
And remember that grief is notjust about loss to death, but it
also is other losses.
And while we may not gothrough the full range of emotions
and anniversaries andeverything else, oftentimes there's
(03:08):
a lot in there that is very similar.
And to some degree it is a.
I was going to say a warm up.
I wouldn't call it a warm up,but it is a playing through of things
that we will experience again.
And that is the inevitabilityof life.
(03:28):
And life is continuous withdeath, not death discontinuous with
life because death, ultimatelythe end of our lives, actually gives
meaning to the lives we chooseto live.
So what I want to talk abouttonight is I've got it entitled From
(03:48):
Formula to Faith.
And it's not a topic weusually talk about or even really
want to talk about.
And part of the reason forthat is that we really honestly don't
even think about it.
Quite honestly, I don't thinkwhen I point it out, people don't
notice it really.
(04:10):
And we as humans, we tend tosee almost any situation in terms
of if then, if I do this, thenthis will occur, or this person will
say this, or they will thinkthis or whatever.
There's always a if then in there.
(04:32):
And that's something I call a formula.
And our tendency is to takeour relationship with God that same
way.
It becomes a formula approach.
Now, there was an entire groupof people during Jesus Day that had
put together an extensivelibrary of formula about how to worship
(04:59):
God, about ritual cleansingand cleaning, about all sorts of
things.
Some very minute, really whenit comes right down to it.
And for us it seems a littleodd and maybe even ridiculous if
you want to really stick ournecks out a little ways.
(05:19):
But the reality is that whenwe're confronted with a novel situation,
we want to make sense of it.
And that really is a God givenperspective or a God given quality
that is designed into us, thatwe have curiosity.
The problem is, is once weland on a formula, the curiosity
(05:42):
stops.
And so when we watch otherpeople navigate their sorrow, they
navigate situations, theynavigate relationships.
We think and we watch very closely.
And what we tend to think isbecause it worked for that person,
(06:04):
how did it work?
What did they do, what didthey say?
The problem is for most of usis that we don't know what they think.
And we're probably not goingto interview them about what were
you thinking when you did?
Whatever.
Okay?
But when we see somethingwork, for example, let me give you
(06:27):
an example.
In the Christian life, when wesee somebody who we think is the
model of a quote unquote goodChristian, I can't tell you how many
times I've heard that word,that phrase.
And it really sets my teeth onedge because we don't define, excuse
me, we don't define what good is.
(06:50):
And usually it's not goodChristian, it's ideal Christian.
And we're living up to astandard that we can't possibly keep,
we can't possibly live into.
And so when we watch somebodylike that and it works well for them,
they have a Vibrant prayer life.
Or they seem to be able topray in public really well.
(07:12):
Or their worship is aparticular way, maybe very exuberant
or maybe very contemplative.
Either way, and we look atthat and say, I wonder how did they
do that?
And maybe I should emulate them.
Maybe I should do that.
The problem, of course, withemulation is that if I simply emulate
(07:35):
the behavior, then sooner orlater, excuse me, sooner or later
that will break down.
Because I don't have themotivation figured out.
I don't have the why figured out.
And so our tendency is tocreate a formula for how our spiritual
(07:58):
life is supposed to look.
For example, particularly howour relationship with God is supposed
to look.
As a matter of fact, it goeseven farther than that.
And it becomes.
We write a contract that Goddoesn't sign.
But if I do this, if I praythis much, if I have a quiet time,
(08:18):
this many times, I've got atickle in my throat, my apologies.
If I do all those things, thenGod will be close to me and my relationship
with him will be intimate.
And the biggest problem withthat is, is that the minute we begin
to create a formula around arelationship, we destroy the relationship.
(08:44):
And that's what often happens.
So people end up wandering inthe wilderness in their spiritual
lives thinking that they weredoing it all, quote, unquote, right?
And they.
That didn't seem to producewhat they thought it would produce.
And then they're stuck.
(09:05):
It's like, where do I go from here?
Or how do I make this any better?
And so when something happens,we think, because it worked for the
other person, it should workfor me.
And then additionally, we addin, what are the steps to doing it?
And our questions tend to giveaway what our agendas are.
(09:32):
And sometimes it's not questions.
We just listen for certainthings, like how much time do they
spend doing a quiet time,whatever that is.
I mean, don't get me startedon that one.
Because ultimately, ultimatelywe end up systematizing a relationship
(10:00):
and creating a bunch of rulesas to how it should go, abiding by
and following those rules.
And then when we get to theend, we wonder why God isn't waiting
for us.
Because it was a relationshipwith rules.
It wasn't a relationship withGod himself.
So what are the steps that Ican do to do it like them?
(10:26):
And is there a key here to howthey did it that I can replicate?
Now, remember, all of thefocus entirely is on the outward
appearances of it, not themotivations of the heart part of
it and so, by thinking inthese terms, our tendency is to apply
(10:50):
it to pretty much everythingin our lives.
And the problem that comes outof it is it doesn't account for the
impact of the Holy Spirit in it.
See, as long as things adhereto our ideas, our of how it should
go, what the steps are, Irepeat them and life goes pretty
(11:15):
well.
And if I do those things, thenI will feel closer to God.
Now I may for a period oftime, but like I said, the motivations
leak and before too longthey're pretty well gone.
So when it doesn't work, itreally doesn't work.
(11:35):
And then we're really caughtbetween a rock and a hard place because
we end up getting angrybecause I did it the way I thought
I was supposed to do it, andthen it didn't work that way.
And so what gives God?
I did it the way youy told meto, or the way that yout showed me,
or whatever other thing we cancome up with.
(11:57):
And so unfortunately, we seemprone to not learn from what doesn't
work, and we stay with what is comfortable.
And that is the formula andrepeating it over and over again.
Unfortunately, if you add.
There are certain formulas,even in chemistry, I think that if
you add too much of something,you have an explosion and if you
(12:23):
had too little of it, youdon't hit the mark and it's not what
you hoped it would be.
And so the problem in ourspiritual lives is that God doesn't
comply with our formulasbecause there are unwritten contracts
on how he should behave inaccordance with our behaviors.
(12:46):
And when that doesn't happen,then we're usually really caught.
And so our formulas, even ourcontracts, are built on how do I
control my world, control howpeople think, control what I do in
order to.
There's the then in order toaccomplish certain things, God being
(13:11):
closer to me, me feelingsettled in what my direction is or
what my decision might be.
And it just further confirmsthat we live in an if then universe
rather than one that isactually open to the movement of
the Holy Spirit in our livesand, and even those around us.
(13:34):
Because if we dispense withthe formulas, then we have really
a wide open world that is aworld to discover rather than one
to control.
And the bottom line is ourformulas, our formulas, it doesn't
(13:58):
really require any trust ofGod's heart for us.
There's no requirement on that.
As long as I do the formularight, and God does what he's supposed
to do, then everything's good, right?
And so that's why I entitledthis whole thing formula or faith?
Because faith is built onrelationships and trust.
(14:20):
And there's one thing I sayover and over and over again, and
that is trust and controlcannot coexist.
But ultimately, when we're allabout if then statements or formulas,
we only trust our ability tofigure things out and make them happen.
We do not trust what God will do.
And in a lot of cases, whenyou press real hard, most people
(14:43):
think God will force us to dosomething we don't want to do, which
is antithetical to his nature.
I mean, it truly is, if youunderstand God's character.
It's not about forcing peopleto do something they don't want to
do, but it is about invitingpeople to do something that they're
(15:05):
not sure about or they don'tknow about, anything like that.
And I think in a lot of wayswe have to have that be reflected
in our relationships too, isthat we invite people into the kind
of relationship with us,whatever that might be.
And I think pretty muchanybody that might be listening all
(15:27):
dozen of you hate being pigeonholed.
We really hate being our voicetaken away from us by the voice in
somebody else's head.
The problem is that we'redoing it with other people as well
(15:47):
as they are doing it with us.
So what exactly are werelating to or relating, period?
Because the reality is thatwhere we relate is in our heads,
not in the space between us.
Because the space between usis the most dangerous place to be.
(16:11):
Because it requiresvulnerability and it requires coming
out from behind our stainedglass to be seen as we are.
And we don't trust people toaccept us as we are because we don't
accept us as we are.
And that's ultimately kind ofa minor detail, but it is part of
(16:32):
it.
And so formulas or trust orformulas or faith are a big part
of our journey, I think, eveninto the land of sorrow, which is
what I connect up with, withthis particular podcast.
And I'm probably moresensitive to it than most people,
(16:56):
you know, because I've writtena book about grief, and actually
I've written two books aboutgrief, but I'm sensitive to it in
our lives and how much depthit brings to our lives by allowing
sorrow to exist.
It is no accident that a lotof the, probably a third of the psalms,
(17:25):
I may have that a little too elevated.
But even still, many of thepsalms are psalms of lament.
As a matter of fact, Jesusdying words on the cross were from
one of those.
My God, my God, why have youforsaken me.
And that's lament.
(17:47):
And so if we're going to befrightened away from going into that
place, we are then frightenedaway from living life in trust and
vulnerability.
And we don't like vulnerability.
I don't know anybody who does.
At the same time, it isabsolutely necessary for our growth,
(18:12):
for our connection, for oursense of belonging.
And if we are revolting at theidea that there is actually this
thing called vulnerability,I'm not talking about vulnerability
from things that have already happened.
That's not vulnerability.
It is, particularly if I'msharing something that somebody else
(18:32):
may not know.
But vulnerability, the true character.
Vulnerability is what is goingon right now, not what has been going
on or has happened, and we'vehad some resolution to it.
That's a story to tell, butthat's not vulnerability to share.
(18:54):
And that's a big part, Ithink, of what we're talking about
here is that faith requires trust.
And the reality is, as humansare a very, very, very unreliable
bunch who our trust can onlybe conditional at best.
But even so, with those peoplethat have demonstrated to us that
(19:18):
they're safe enough for ourvulnerability, it enhances in remarkable
ways our connection to them.
And so one of the things Ihave so many stories from doing groups
with students that are part ofmy grief and loss class, and this
(19:42):
semester is no different,because once one person walks out
on that limb of vulnerability,there are probably a couple other
people that before too longjoined them out there on that limb,
not to just make sure thatthey don't feel alone, but more because
they are saying with a loudchorus, me too.
(20:09):
And that's a big part, Ithink, ultimately of building and
making community, whichultimately was the vision of sgi,
was how can we move frombehind our stained glass to be seen
and known as we are and inviteother people to do the same, not
create conditions or notcreate bargains that if I come out,
(20:34):
you'll come out, but go out,because I need it.
I need to be seen.
I need to own myself enough tosay what's going on in there.
And in a lot of cases, if Idon't say it out loud, I won't own
it, and it remains hidden andI remain invulnerable.
(20:55):
And CS Lewis goes so far as tosay we become unbreakable.
And so it is a big part ofwhat we say.
If we believe community is anessential part of our relationality
in God and with each other,then what are we going to do with
vulnerability?
(21:18):
Because in a lot of Cases wetalk a good game, myself included.
I'm not throwing any stones at anybody.
But we talk a good game, butwe don't act on it because we're
afraid.
The bottom line is we're justafraid, not so much of the other
people.
(21:38):
There's a fair amount of fearabout what other people might think,
but a lot of times the fearisn't of them, it's of us.
We're afraid that if Iactually say it out loud, then we
will have this huge wet, damp.
That's kind of redundant.
But anyway, wet, heavy blanketof shame that gets thrown all over
(22:02):
us.
And it's not gets thrown allover us.
We take it on because we'resure that we're worthy of being condemned
rather than connected to.
And so when those momentsoccur and we find the courage to
be able to share fully fromour hearts which is what courage
really means or is one of thedefinitions of it.
(22:26):
What we find is people morethan willing to move into that place
with us and offer us the gracethat we find a really hard time.
We find ourselves having areally hard time sharing with ourselves.
And so that's true for sorrow.
It's funny how sorrow and oursense of grief tends to sidestep
(22:49):
all of our defenses and wecan't seem to avoid it.
And it just really does livethere and it sometimes even hijacks
us.
And that's not all bad.
I mean, a lot of times theonly way that it comes out is by
being hijacked because we havegot things so well buttoned up that
(23:11):
that's just the way it's goingto be.
And so is it faith or formula?
Formulas are safe.
Formulas are about my controlover the world around me and other
people and what they think,which I say I don't believe I have.
And.
Or faith.
And that's not just faith in humans.
(23:33):
Like I said, they are terribly unreliable.
But faith in God himself.
That if I live my life thisway and live my life trusting the
vulnerability with safepeople, not just anybody.
That's not what I'm saying.
But trust my life with safe people.
I'll find connection and Iwill find belonging.
(23:56):
And I might actually learn howto redefine what grace really looks
like.
Because right now we've got aincredibly distorted level of understanding
about grace in spite of itbeing central to our faith.
So I think that's it for tonight.
(24:16):
I can't really think ofanything else to add.
The question to you is, is itgoing to be faith or formula?
Tomorrow morning, as yourelate to people or even as you relate
to God, more importantly.
And that's what this really isall about.
So sgi-net.org that's home for us.
(24:37):
Please join us.
Join the community.
Find out more of the resourcesthat are there.
We can be found on threedifferent social media outlets.
Instagram, GIInternational, onFacebook, @ Stained Glass International,
and Same goes for LinkedIn.
So you can listen to thispodcast on whatever platform you
(24:59):
listen to.
And if you're interested inpartnering with us to continue to
develop the ministry of sgi,all of your gifts are tax deductible
and they will help us tocontinue to develop our retreats
and our resources.
And.
And there is a big eventcoming up here.
(25:22):
Before too long, we're gettingreally close and I'll tell you more
about it when it happens.
But at this point in time, allI can do is tease it.
On the website you'll find acouple books that I wrote.
One grieving the loss ofsomeone you love.
It's been around for 30 years,which is absolutely stunning to me.
And then the other one, thenewest one, which came out last January,
(25:45):
is called the Seasons of our Grief.
So subscribe to our onlinecommunity, become a part.
We're not going to send you spam.
You can use it to be a part ofthe community and get the newsletter
that comes out periodically orhear more about what's going on in
the community itself.
(26:05):
You can also send us a checkif you want to do that as well.
Just send it to SGI and that's P.O.
box 322, Eastlake, Colorado 80614.
And that is it for tonight.
I pray that you have awonderful week ahead, or if you're
listening to this, halfwaythrough the week, the rest of your
(26:26):
week, whatever that might be.
And consider.
Consider how often you spendtime creating formulas to live life
by rather than figuring outthat maybe it's a life of faith that
I'm searching for and whatkind of risks do I need to take in
trusting the people that Ihave that I know are safe?
(26:46):
They made the deposits into meto demonstrate that and begin to
test out living vulnerablywith vulnerability in the things
that are going on right now,not the things that were.
So that's it for tonight.
Thanks for joining me.
Love you later.
Bye.
Foreign welcome to a brand new week.
(00:24):
I'm glad to be able to shareit with you and join in.
I am back again behind the micto talk about something that I think
is important.
Before I do that, just tointroduce myself, I'm Dr.
Ray Mitch, your host of Unscripted.
It is the collected wisdom oflife, living and sorrow.
(00:48):
And I think there's probably alot more to it than meets the eye,
partly because of how much ofour lives oftentimes are punctuated
by sorrow.
But we really don't think inthose terms.
And that's what I want toaddress in one fashion or another.
Now the reality is, is thatthere is a certain selfish part of
(01:12):
me that is doing this becauseof the sorrow that I continue to
feel.
I had a good friend of mine of34 years that died a year ago, and
a lot of the anniversaries arestarting to hit because we're past
the midway point of February.
(01:33):
And that was when I started toget updates and people telling me
how he was doing and what wasgoing on there.
And I can just feel in variouspoints in time in my day or otherwise,
where I am thinking about itand it rests on my shoulders in so
(01:58):
many ways, thinking back tothat year.
And that's really a part ofsorrow is this aspect of anniversaries.
And I spent a little time inanother podcast talking about it,
and if you want, you can goback and listen to was one of the
early ones, so probably onethrough five.
One of those was on anniversary.
(02:21):
In a lot of cases weexperience that kind of thing without
really knowing it.
Sometimes we don't evenidentify that that's exactly what
we're feeling and the thoughtsbegin to show up and the things that
we feel show up as well.
So that's what Unscripted isall about.
It's partly that and partlyabout talking through the seasons
(02:44):
of our grief and what they allmean and how we experience them and
the things that are importantto understand about them.
And remember that grief is notjust about loss to death, but it
also is other losses.
And while we may not gothrough the full range of emotions
and anniversaries andeverything else, oftentimes there's
(03:08):
a lot in there that is very similar.
And to some degree it is a.
I was going to say a warm up.
I wouldn't call it a warm up,but it is a playing through of things
that we will experience again.
And that is the inevitabilityof life.
(03:28):
And life is continuous withdeath, not death discontinuous with
life because death, ultimatelythe end of our lives, actually gives
meaning to the lives we chooseto live.
So what I want to talk abouttonight is I've got it entitled From
(03:48):
Formula to Faith.
And it's not a topic weusually talk about or even really
want to talk about.
And part of the reason forthat is that we really honestly don't
even think about it.
Quite honestly, I don't thinkwhen I point it out, people don't
notice it really.
(04:10):
And we as humans, we tend tosee almost any situation in terms
of if then, if I do this, thenthis will occur, or this person will
say this, or they will thinkthis or whatever.
There's always a if then in there.
(04:32):
And that's something I call a formula.
And our tendency is to takeour relationship with God that same
way.
It becomes a formula approach.
Now, there was an entire groupof people during Jesus Day that had
put together an extensivelibrary of formula about how to worship
(04:59):
God, about ritual cleansingand cleaning, about all sorts of
things.
Some very minute, really whenit comes right down to it.
And for us it seems a littleodd and maybe even ridiculous if
you want to really stick ournecks out a little ways.
(05:19):
But the reality is that whenwe're confronted with a novel situation,
we want to make sense of it.
And that really is a God givenperspective or a God given quality
that is designed into us, thatwe have curiosity.
The problem is, is once weland on a formula, the curiosity
(05:42):
stops.
And so when we watch otherpeople navigate their sorrow, they
navigate situations, theynavigate relationships.
We think and we watch very closely.
And what we tend to think isbecause it worked for that person,
(06:04):
how did it work?
What did they do, what didthey say?
The problem is for most of usis that we don't know what they think.
And we're probably not goingto interview them about what were
you thinking when you did?
Whatever.
Okay?
But when we see somethingwork, for example, let me give you
(06:27):
an example.
In the Christian life, when wesee somebody who we think is the
model of a quote unquote goodChristian, I can't tell you how many
times I've heard that word,that phrase.
And it really sets my teeth onedge because we don't define, excuse
me, we don't define what good is.
(06:50):
And usually it's not goodChristian, it's ideal Christian.
And we're living up to astandard that we can't possibly keep,
we can't possibly live into.
And so when we watch somebodylike that and it works well for them,
they have a Vibrant prayer life.
Or they seem to be able topray in public really well.
(07:12):
Or their worship is aparticular way, maybe very exuberant
or maybe very contemplative.
Either way, and we look atthat and say, I wonder how did they
do that?
And maybe I should emulate them.
Maybe I should do that.
The problem, of course, withemulation is that if I simply emulate
(07:35):
the behavior, then sooner orlater, excuse me, sooner or later
that will break down.
Because I don't have themotivation figured out.
I don't have the why figured out.
And so our tendency is tocreate a formula for how our spiritual
(07:58):
life is supposed to look.
For example, particularly howour relationship with God is supposed
to look.
As a matter of fact, it goeseven farther than that.
And it becomes.
We write a contract that Goddoesn't sign.
But if I do this, if I praythis much, if I have a quiet time,
(08:18):
this many times, I've got atickle in my throat, my apologies.
If I do all those things, thenGod will be close to me and my relationship
with him will be intimate.
And the biggest problem withthat is, is that the minute we begin
to create a formula around arelationship, we destroy the relationship.
(08:44):
And that's what often happens.
So people end up wandering inthe wilderness in their spiritual
lives thinking that they weredoing it all, quote, unquote, right?
And they.
That didn't seem to producewhat they thought it would produce.
And then they're stuck.
(09:05):
It's like, where do I go from here?
Or how do I make this any better?
And so when something happens,we think, because it worked for the
other person, it should workfor me.
And then additionally, we addin, what are the steps to doing it?
And our questions tend to giveaway what our agendas are.
(09:32):
And sometimes it's not questions.
We just listen for certainthings, like how much time do they
spend doing a quiet time,whatever that is.
I mean, don't get me startedon that one.
Because ultimately, ultimatelywe end up systematizing a relationship
(10:00):
and creating a bunch of rulesas to how it should go, abiding by
and following those rules.
And then when we get to theend, we wonder why God isn't waiting
for us.
Because it was a relationshipwith rules.
It wasn't a relationship withGod himself.
So what are the steps that Ican do to do it like them?
(10:26):
And is there a key here to howthey did it that I can replicate?
Now, remember, all of thefocus entirely is on the outward
appearances of it, not themotivations of the heart part of
it and so, by thinking inthese terms, our tendency is to apply
(10:50):
it to pretty much everythingin our lives.
And the problem that comes outof it is it doesn't account for the
impact of the Holy Spirit in it.
See, as long as things adhereto our ideas, our of how it should
go, what the steps are, Irepeat them and life goes pretty
(11:15):
well.
And if I do those things, thenI will feel closer to God.
Now I may for a period oftime, but like I said, the motivations
leak and before too longthey're pretty well gone.
So when it doesn't work, itreally doesn't work.
(11:35):
And then we're really caughtbetween a rock and a hard place because
we end up getting angrybecause I did it the way I thought
I was supposed to do it, andthen it didn't work that way.
And so what gives God?
I did it the way youy told meto, or the way that yout showed me,
or whatever other thing we cancome up with.
(11:57):
And so unfortunately, we seemprone to not learn from what doesn't
work, and we stay with what is comfortable.
And that is the formula andrepeating it over and over again.
Unfortunately, if you add.
There are certain formulas,even in chemistry, I think that if
you add too much of something,you have an explosion and if you
(12:23):
had too little of it, youdon't hit the mark and it's not what
you hoped it would be.
And so the problem in ourspiritual lives is that God doesn't
comply with our formulasbecause there are unwritten contracts
on how he should behave inaccordance with our behaviors.
(12:46):
And when that doesn't happen,then we're usually really caught.
And so our formulas, even ourcontracts, are built on how do I
control my world, control howpeople think, control what I do in
order to.
There's the then in order toaccomplish certain things, God being
(13:11):
closer to me, me feelingsettled in what my direction is or
what my decision might be.
And it just further confirmsthat we live in an if then universe
rather than one that isactually open to the movement of
the Holy Spirit in our livesand, and even those around us.
(13:34):
Because if we dispense withthe formulas, then we have really
a wide open world that is aworld to discover rather than one
to control.
And the bottom line is ourformulas, our formulas, it doesn't
(13:58):
really require any trust ofGod's heart for us.
There's no requirement on that.
As long as I do the formularight, and God does what he's supposed
to do, then everything's good, right?
And so that's why I entitledthis whole thing formula or faith?
Because faith is built onrelationships and trust.
(14:20):
And there's one thing I sayover and over and over again, and
that is trust and controlcannot coexist.
But ultimately, when we're allabout if then statements or formulas,
we only trust our ability tofigure things out and make them happen.
We do not trust what God will do.
And in a lot of cases, whenyou press real hard, most people
(14:43):
think God will force us to dosomething we don't want to do, which
is antithetical to his nature.
I mean, it truly is, if youunderstand God's character.
It's not about forcing peopleto do something they don't want to
do, but it is about invitingpeople to do something that they're
(15:05):
not sure about or they don'tknow about, anything like that.
And I think in a lot of wayswe have to have that be reflected
in our relationships too, isthat we invite people into the kind
of relationship with us,whatever that might be.
And I think pretty muchanybody that might be listening all
(15:27):
dozen of you hate being pigeonholed.
We really hate being our voicetaken away from us by the voice in
somebody else's head.
The problem is that we'redoing it with other people as well
(15:47):
as they are doing it with us.
So what exactly are werelating to or relating, period?
Because the reality is thatwhere we relate is in our heads,
not in the space between us.
Because the space between usis the most dangerous place to be.
(16:11):
Because it requiresvulnerability and it requires coming
out from behind our stainedglass to be seen as we are.
And we don't trust people toaccept us as we are because we don't
accept us as we are.
And that's ultimately kind ofa minor detail, but it is part of
(16:32):
it.
And so formulas or trust orformulas or faith are a big part
of our journey, I think, eveninto the land of sorrow, which is
what I connect up with, withthis particular podcast.
And I'm probably moresensitive to it than most people,
(16:56):
you know, because I've writtena book about grief, and actually
I've written two books aboutgrief, but I'm sensitive to it in
our lives and how much depthit brings to our lives by allowing
sorrow to exist.
It is no accident that a lotof the, probably a third of the psalms,
(17:25):
I may have that a little too elevated.
But even still, many of thepsalms are psalms of lament.
As a matter of fact, Jesusdying words on the cross were from
one of those.
My God, my God, why have youforsaken me.
And that's lament.
(17:47):
And so if we're going to befrightened away from going into that
place, we are then frightenedaway from living life in trust and
vulnerability.
And we don't like vulnerability.
I don't know anybody who does.
At the same time, it isabsolutely necessary for our growth,
(18:12):
for our connection, for oursense of belonging.
And if we are revolting at theidea that there is actually this
thing called vulnerability,I'm not talking about vulnerability
from things that have already happened.
That's not vulnerability.
It is, particularly if I'msharing something that somebody else
(18:32):
may not know.
But vulnerability, the true character.
Vulnerability is what is goingon right now, not what has been going
on or has happened, and we'vehad some resolution to it.
That's a story to tell, butthat's not vulnerability to share.
(18:54):
And that's a big part, Ithink, of what we're talking about
here is that faith requires trust.
And the reality is, as humansare a very, very, very unreliable
bunch who our trust can onlybe conditional at best.
But even so, with those peoplethat have demonstrated to us that
(19:18):
they're safe enough for ourvulnerability, it enhances in remarkable
ways our connection to them.
And so one of the things Ihave so many stories from doing groups
with students that are part ofmy grief and loss class, and this
(19:42):
semester is no different,because once one person walks out
on that limb of vulnerability,there are probably a couple other
people that before too longjoined them out there on that limb,
not to just make sure thatthey don't feel alone, but more because
they are saying with a loudchorus, me too.
(20:09):
And that's a big part, Ithink, ultimately of building and
making community, whichultimately was the vision of sgi,
was how can we move frombehind our stained glass to be seen
and known as we are and inviteother people to do the same, not
create conditions or notcreate bargains that if I come out,
(20:34):
you'll come out, but go out,because I need it.
I need to be seen.
I need to own myself enough tosay what's going on in there.
And in a lot of cases, if Idon't say it out loud, I won't own
it, and it remains hidden andI remain invulnerable.
(20:55):
And CS Lewis goes so far as tosay we become unbreakable.
And so it is a big part ofwhat we say.
If we believe community is anessential part of our relationality
in God and with each other,then what are we going to do with
vulnerability?
(21:18):
Because in a lot of Cases wetalk a good game, myself included.
I'm not throwing any stones at anybody.
But we talk a good game, butwe don't act on it because we're
afraid.
The bottom line is we're justafraid, not so much of the other
people.
(21:38):
There's a fair amount of fearabout what other people might think,
but a lot of times the fearisn't of them, it's of us.
We're afraid that if Iactually say it out loud, then we
will have this huge wet, damp.
That's kind of redundant.
But anyway, wet, heavy blanketof shame that gets thrown all over
(22:02):
us.
And it's not gets thrown allover us.
We take it on because we'resure that we're worthy of being condemned
rather than connected to.
And so when those momentsoccur and we find the courage to
be able to share fully fromour hearts which is what courage
really means or is one of thedefinitions of it.
(22:26):
What we find is people morethan willing to move into that place
with us and offer us the gracethat we find a really hard time.
We find ourselves having areally hard time sharing with ourselves.
And so that's true for sorrow.
It's funny how sorrow and oursense of grief tends to sidestep
(22:49):
all of our defenses and wecan't seem to avoid it.
And it just really does livethere and it sometimes even hijacks
us.
And that's not all bad.
I mean, a lot of times theonly way that it comes out is by
being hijacked because we havegot things so well buttoned up that
(23:11):
that's just the way it's goingto be.
And so is it faith or formula?
Formulas are safe.
Formulas are about my controlover the world around me and other
people and what they think,which I say I don't believe I have.
And.
Or faith.
And that's not just faith in humans.
(23:33):
Like I said, they are terribly unreliable.
But faith in God himself.
That if I live my life thisway and live my life trusting the
vulnerability with safepeople, not just anybody.
That's not what I'm saying.
But trust my life with safe people.
I'll find connection and Iwill find belonging.
(23:56):
And I might actually learn howto redefine what grace really looks
like.
Because right now we've got aincredibly distorted level of understanding
about grace in spite of itbeing central to our faith.
So I think that's it for tonight.
(24:16):
I can't really think ofanything else to add.
The question to you is, is itgoing to be faith or formula?
Tomorrow morning, as yourelate to people or even as you relate
to God, more importantly.
And that's what this really isall about.
So sgi-net.org that's home for us.
(24:37):
Please join us.
Join the community.
Find out more of the resourcesthat are there.
We can be found on threedifferent social media outlets.
Instagram, GIInternational, onFacebook, @ Stained Glass International,
and Same goes for LinkedIn.
So you can listen to thispodcast on whatever platform you
(24:59):
listen to.
And if you're interested inpartnering with us to continue to
develop the ministry of sgi,all of your gifts are tax deductible
and they will help us tocontinue to develop our retreats
and our resources.
And.
And there is a big eventcoming up here.
(25:22):
Before too long, we're gettingreally close and I'll tell you more
about it when it happens.
But at this point in time, allI can do is tease it.
On the website you'll find acouple books that I wrote.
One grieving the loss ofsomeone you love.
It's been around for 30 years,which is absolutely stunning to me.
And then the other one, thenewest one, which came out last January,
(25:45):
is called the Seasons of our Grief.
So subscribe to our onlinecommunity, become a part.
We're not going to send you spam.
You can use it to be a part ofthe community and get the newsletter
that comes out periodically orhear more about what's going on in
the community itself.
(26:05):
You can also send us a checkif you want to do that as well.
Just send it to SGI and that's P.O.
box 322, Eastlake, Colorado 80614.
And that is it for tonight.
I pray that you have awonderful week ahead, or if you're
listening to this, halfwaythrough the week, the rest of your
(26:26):
week, whatever that might be.
And consider.
Consider how often you spendtime creating formulas to live life
by rather than figuring outthat maybe it's a life of faith that
I'm searching for and whatkind of risks do I need to take in
trusting the people that Ihave that I know are safe?
(26:46):
They made the deposits into meto demonstrate that and begin to
test out living vulnerablywith vulnerability in the things
that are going on right now,not the things that were.
So that's it for tonight.
Thanks for joining me.
Love you later.
Bye.
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