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September 2, 2025 26 mins

Nico Van de Venne joins us to share his insights on leadership and the importance of truly understanding oneself before leading others. With over 25 years of diverse experience, Nico emphasizes that leadership isn't about telling people what to do, but rather about supporting them and helping them flourish. He highlights the common pitfalls of leadership, like micromanagement and the "CEO disease," and insists that effective leaders need to listen and create trust within their teams. We dive into the idea of turning the traditional leadership pyramid upside down, focusing on serving rather than directing. Tune in as we explore how personal reflection and genuine connection can transform not just leaders, but entire teams.

Nico Van de Venne, a seasoned confidant for high achievers, dives deep into the essence of leadership during a riveting conversation with Jaclyn Strominger. With over 25 years of experience in various industries, including nuclear, legal IT, and telecom sales, Nico shares insights that challenge conventional views on leadership. He reflects on the common pitfalls leaders face, such as micromanagement and the struggle to let go, referring to these issues as 'CEO disease' and 'founder syndrome'. Nico emphasizes the importance of understanding oneself before stepping into a leadership role. He believes that true leadership is not about merely climbing the corporate ladder but understanding the needs of the team and fostering an environment conducive to growth and fulfillment. His approach is to listen actively and create a safe space for honest conversations, allowing leaders to identify their strengths and weaknesses through reflection.

Throughout the episode, Nico and Jaclyn explore the necessity of aligning personal values with leadership roles. They discuss how many individuals find themselves in leadership positions not necessarily because they possess the innate qualities of a leader but due to their past performance as individual contributors. Nico warns against the dangers of promoting high achievers without adequately preparing them for the complexities of leadership. Instead, he advocates for a dual path: one for those who thrive in leadership and another for those who excel as individual contributors. This nuanced perspective sheds light on the importance of personal choice in leadership trajectories and the need for organizations to support their employees in finding their true callings.


As the conversation unfolds, Nico draws parallels between effective leadership and conducting an orchestra, where the leader's role is to harmonize the team's efforts rather than dictate their actions. He underscores the significance of trust in leadership, advising listeners to seek out trustworthy confidants to discuss their challenges openly. By sharing personal stories and experiences, Nico illustrates that leadership is a journey filled with learning opportunities, and that embracing failure can lead to personal and professional growth. With a reminder that leadership should ultimately serve the team and not the ego, this episode is a treasure trove of wisdom for anyone looking to enhance their leadership skills and foster a more fulfilling work environment.

Takeaways:

  • Leadership is not just about telling others what to do; it's about understanding and supporting your team.
  • Finding a trustworthy confidant can help leaders process their thoughts and discover solutions.
  • True leadership involves knowing oneself deeply, as your team often reflects your own strengths and weaknesses.
  • It's essential to let go and trust your team to navigate their own challenges and learn from failures.

Links referenced in this episode:

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Transcript

Episode Transcript

Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:41):
Well, hello everybody andwelcome to another amazing episode
of Unstoppable LeadershipSpotlight. I am your host, Jaclyn
Strominger. And today I havethe absolute pleasure of speaking
with Nico Van de Venne. Andyou're going to love hearing from
him. We've just had a greatpre show conversation. He is not
here in the United States.He's actually over across the pond

(01:02):
in Belgium. Yeah, I was like,wait a minute, Belgium in the, in
the country? I was like, waita minute, where are we? We were just
talking about a few differentcountries. Anyway, so let me just
tell you a little bit aboutNico. He is a premium confidant for
high achievers, successfulCEOs and founders and entrepreneurs.
His journey is a master classin professional evolution stretching
over 25 years in diversefields such as nuclear, as a nuclear

(01:27):
industry, legal I T, telecomsales. And extensive experience has
culminated in a deepunderstanding of fulfillment bey
conventional, conventionalsuccess metrics, which obviously
really tends to bring in greatleadership. Because when you have
vast experience, you have, youcan learn so much about leadership.

(01:48):
So, Nico, welcome to the podcast.
Thank you so much for having me.
No, it's my pleasure. So, soI, you know, I, I'm really curious,
you know, you had all thisgreat, you know, experience and across
all these different depths ofprofessions and if you could say,

(02:09):
like, what was the, what wasthe turning point for you in this
that you were like, you knowwhat, now I want to go out and, and,
and help other people.
Well, I think, I think thatpart's been there the whole while.
Why otherwise do you go intoleadership to guide people towards

(02:33):
good, good goals and wonderfuldreams and so on. But if, if I would
go to a point where a decisionwas made to do it as an independent
person, that might be a verybig switch is when I saw a couple
of symptoms in a large companywhich is called Big Blue. But I'm
not going to name the car thecompany in itself. When one of the

(02:56):
things was like Excel sheetmanagement, leadership, micromanagement,
um, you know, paralysis inchange, all those wonderful things.
I've, I've started to namethose things as, as, as a disease.
You know, CEO disease andfounder syndrome are two films in
a way, really. It's like I'venoticed the same things happening
to entrepreneurs who are goodleaders, but sometimes, you know,

(03:20):
letting go and stuff like thatdoes not really work for them because,
you know, first you started onyourself, then you have to go to
the next level by letting go.But to answer your question, um,
honestly, I think about 2020would have been the key year, 2019,
2020 would be the key yearsthat I actually decided to jump into

(03:41):
the pool of. Of reaching outto a more individual IR level story.
Yeah.
So. All right, so a couplethings that you said I just kind
of want to kind of touch on,you know, as you said, you know,
when I was asking thequestion, you know, most people step
into leadership, they have thegoal to help people. But I actually
want to challenge you on thatbecause sometimes I think people

(04:01):
get into leadership notbecause they have that na, you know,
they want to help otherpeople. It's because they've performed
well at a company and somebodyhas helped them rise up into that
spot.
Yeah, I always chuckle when Iget this kind of question because

(04:22):
it's so very prevalent thesedays. I see it happening so many
times. You know, the oneexpert who does a great job, you
know, gets in early, stays inlate, you know, gets all these things
done, becomes the next leaderof a team. Worst mistake that a company
can make, by the way. That'smy opinion, to be completely honest.

(04:43):
You have your exceptions.Indeed. I'm going to actually talk
to myself here and be advocateof the devil because I actually recently
put somebody in that position.But I was able to prepare him for
leadership, which is a bigdifference. And that's a lot. That's
what happens a lot is that youhave a lot of people, you know, they're
expert and they're. They'regreat in what they do. And you have

(05:04):
to make a distinction betweenis somebody a leader or individual
contributor who's an expertand in a company. I also work in
learning and development and Isee these things happen. Look for
true two distincttrajectories. One is getting them
into leadership, and the otherone is giving them the alternative

(05:25):
to become an expert for theirteam. Being, you know, a sidekick
of a leader. Not. Not as inthey need to, you know, manage people
because usually they're a bitawkward in managing people for one.
One part, or they just don'thave the talent for it. And you can
learn leadership up to acertain extent. Funny that I just

(05:47):
flashed through my mind thatmy whole career has become falling
into leadership one time afteranother just by being somewhere,
by acting with people and soon. So some kind of inherent talent
that was within me. But I'veseen other people who just jump into
being the expert the wholetime. You know, they just know things.
They. They find a problem andthey solve it. And nobody ever asked

(06:11):
for it in a certain way. But.Yeah, I. I see what you mean. And
and indeed, it's somethingthat sometimes needs to be avoided
to just push somebody in thatdirection. You're right. You're right.
You know, and, and as we'retalking, you know, one of the things
that I find that's reallyfascinating what you, you know, just
sharing is that, you know, yousaid, like, either giving somebody
that ability to say, as youshared, you know, you. You just help

(06:37):
somebody transition intoleadership. Like, you, you help them
get ready for it. Keeping. Getready for it, right? And, you know,
so you put it. And it's. And,you know, but before you help them
get ready, you gave them achoice. You ask the question, right?

(06:58):
You know, is this some, youknow, do. Is this something that
you want to do? Do you seeyourself as a leader? Is it something
that you want to grow into?Right? And. Or, you know, again,
asking those questions. And Ithink that's actually, you know,
when I think about the. One ofthe quintessential things about leadership

(07:20):
that's. That tends to happenis that the person going into it,
you know, they. It's morelike, oh, I want to go. That's my.
It's part of my trajectory. I.I know I go here and my next step
is to be like the assistant,blah, blah, blah. And then it's to
be the, the director. Andthen, you know, and you have this

(07:42):
ladder. But nowhere reallyalong the way is somebody really
asking and saying, like, orasking the question, what do you
really want to do? We justknow, right? Like, I want to climb
the ladder, but is it reallywhat we want?
Good question. Yeah, it's.It's very, very, very difficult to

(08:08):
answer because you have to behonest. You're gonna be honest not
with the person who asking thequestion. It's gonna be, you know,
getting up in the morning,seeing that mirror, and saying, what
do I really want? Do I want toget on this next step on the ladder,
or do I want to sit where I'msitting right now and just be better
at what I do? And at the pointthat we were discussing his jump,

(08:31):
it was only like six or sevenmonths ago, and he had the opportunity
to really go into a verytechnical oriented direction or into
this. And I had discussionwith him and I asked him that question,
and he was really kind ofbaffled looking at me. He's like,
yeah, but it's the logicalnext step. I'm like, no, no, no,
no. There's no logic here.This is about feeling and knowing

(08:53):
and understanding who you areas a person. Because as leader, you
need to know a heck of a lotabout yourself before you start leading
people. If you don't, there'sa lot of stuff that you're going
to meet along the way that youdon't want to meet, because all your
people are reflections of youand they're going to just rub it
into your face when you'redoing something wrong. And you're

(09:15):
going to have to tackle that.And it's better to tackle beforehand
instead of really in your role.
Right. And it's so important.Like, yeah, you do, as a leader,
you really do need to know whoyou are. You need to know your values
and what you stand for. And,you know, and something that you
said, again, I'm just goingback to this is. Is. Is. Is helping.

(09:35):
You know, as you said, youknow, it's about helping people.
And I don't. And I think thisis the key thing about leadership
is that I think people forsometimes forget that part. Like
the word lead is not tell.Right, Right. And so if we think

(10:01):
about what leadership reallymeans, it is, you know, and, and
I'll go down to like, youknow, we were talking before about
being like on a farm. Right.You know, you have the. The person
who's leading a flock. You'rebringing people to a point, you're
moving people. And so I thinkwe forget that. And so I want to

(10:25):
ask you, as you're workingwith people, how do you help your
clients and how do you helppeople kind of take that step back
and say, how do you lead?
Well, first of all, I'd liketo make a comparison as well. What

(10:45):
I see what leadership is,there's this old image of you have
a horse and carriage, and the,the comparisons is the horses are
your team and the carriage isthe. The product or service or whatever.
You're, you know, moving intothe world of arts or outside of the
world. Now you have differentkind of leaders. There's the manager

(11:09):
sitting on top of thecarriage, telling people where they
need to go. Then you have theleader that is in front of all the
horses, showing them how toneed to do it and expecting all of
them to do the same. And thenyou have this one person that somewhere
there in between that youdon't see, he's running around between
the horses and listening toall the horses and trying to understand

(11:31):
why that one horse wants to goleft and the other one goes right.
And you try to compare themand ask them, you know, why are you
doing this? And bringing themback together in that same direction,
you know, putting the noses inthe right direction. To me, leadership
in my core is that guy who isinvisible, but who is there to only
support their environmentinstead of directing them, micromanaging

(11:54):
and all that stuff. So how Ihelp my clients in that story is
by purely listening first towhat's going on with them. There's
a lot of leaders out there whoare in very specific positions, and
I would say executives or Clevels or founders or entrepreneurs

(12:15):
who are managing a flock thatis so diverse that they meet a lot
of different stories and theyneed to be able to tell somebody
those stories, but they're notgoing to be able to do that to their
employees or to their teammembers. I'm the one who is listening
to their story in fullconfidence, and I will not spread
it. That's the first thingcreating the trust environment of,

(12:40):
you can tell me your story andit will not leave the room. That
is, apparently, that's thefeedback I get is that it's very
exceptional. Even thoughpeople go to therapists and coaches
and so on, their story isbeing recycled and reused for other,
Other means. They might putanother name on it and this and that,
but in some point, they'rereusing it. And it's not okay to

(13:02):
do that. Basically. No, youknow, if somebody tells you something
in confidence, right? Yeah,Yeah. I don't have any, for instance,
I don't have any specificwitnesses or anything like that that
will tell you about myservices. I do not want that. I don't
care about it. It is. I dowhat I do, and people come to me

(13:24):
for that reason. So that's whyI have the possibility to tell them
a little bit more and a littlebit deeper on who they are, because
they're telling me theirstories, their deepest threats, their
deepest fears, their deepestconcerns. I can tackle those deepest
fears and concerns and threatsmore deeply kind of thing. A lot

(13:47):
of deep here. But yeah, it'sreally what's happening. And the
thing is, they come out ofthis as a totally different person
because it's what I saidearlier. You meet your reflection
in your team, you meet yourown pains in your team. If somebody's
not performing it, it isreally a reflection of you. You're

(14:08):
not performing in a certainpart of what you're doing. And they
will show you as long asnecessary that you yourself see what's,
What's. What's going on. Whatare you doing wrong. I've had this
experience in this. In the, inthe past myself. I was. I've never
been a writer. You know,procedures and all those documents.
It's not my thing. I. I loveAI for it these days. It helps me.

(14:31):
I call her Luna.
Oh, I love. I love AI for. So,yes. Anyway, yeah, helps.
Helps a lot. But somebody inmy team as well was always complaining
about the fact that she didn'tknow what she needed to do. And of
course, if you don't have anystandard operating procedures within
your department, you know,you're. You're effed, you know, forget
my French. But I startedunderstanding like, whoa, hold on,

(14:54):
there's a big hole there.What's the hole? And eventually I
had a mentor within thecompany who really rubbed it into
my face. And he said, so howdo you know every day what you need
to do? I'm like, well,actually I open up my email and that's
what he said. Oh, yeah, yeah,yeah, yeah, yeah. You're turning
out fires. You're not solvingproblems, you're turning out fires.
Where are your SOPs? Where areyour standard operating procedures?

(15:15):
What are you doing? Oh, okay.So, yeah. And I started realizing
these things and it solved.The person who had the issue suddenly
knew exactly what she neededto do and her day was much better,
her life was much better, andso on. And then you come to the layer
where you become thefoundation of your team, where you
are at service. And that'swhere I want to reply to the question

(15:40):
you have about helping as aleader. You are not there to be what
a lot of people think as beingthe boss. Always makes me think about
the 80s episodes, series ofwho's the Boss? Where you never know
who's the boss, basically. Butindeed you're there to service them.

(16:00):
And a couple of months ago, Iwent to a company and I saw a perfect
example of how aninfrastructure structure, organizational
structure looks like. What itlooks like when you're, when you're
helping the right people. Andthey had it upside down, basically.
If you know, you're a classic,classic structure in organizations
is pyramid. They turned thepyramid upside down and they said,

(16:22):
you know, everybody executiveis supporting all the rest of the
teams. They are supporting thesales guys and so on. They're there
to provide you with thenecessary funds to do that event,
to do the customer attractionsolution and so on. And they're not
there to tell you what to do.They're the expert. And I love saying
this to my team. When I comeinto a meeting, I'm like, listen,

(16:45):
guys, I'm the dumbest personin the room right now. You're going
to tell me what you need me todo to get your stuff moved forward.
And that's what they love. Youknow, keep. Keep them in the place
where they are the best.That's their expertise. So that's
how I see leadership andhelping and so on. I hope it gives
you an answer to the question.
And actually it's so. It is,it's, you know, so listeners, I really

(17:09):
want you to like, think aboutthis too. Like, this is a real, you
know, we're, we always aretalking about, you know, key insights.
And I really think this issomething that, you know, you may
have heard it before, but, youknow, is turning the. That pyramid
upside down. And we are hereto serve people. The people that
are. That they're. They're inyour. They're on your team. And you

(17:33):
are, you're not telling peoplewhat to do. You know, if you can
think a bit about it in thesense of like the conductor, right?
The conductor is helpingpeople. You know, is like helping
people figure out what notesto be playing so that the other people
who are playing other notescan come together in a beautiful
melody so that they can worktogether. He's not dictating, you

(17:56):
know, who's doing what. He's.He's conducting. Right? And so as
a leader, we are doing that.Like, that's, you know, you're not
dictating to your team. You'rethere to help the team thrive and
just. And but the other parttoo is also really getting to know
your team, right? So that, youknow, that. Oh, I know Nico, Nico

(18:20):
wants to go here. Like, hisvision is for him to do, blah, blah,
blah, like five years fromnow, what do I need to do as the,
as the leader to help raiseNico up to that, whatever that is,

(18:41):
you know, and, and what yousaid in the beginning was it's like,
do people like. You know, Ithink some. That's why I think sometimes
people fall into leadershipand they forget. Like, at the end
of the day, it's, it's. We'releading people. So get to know your
team and their values as youwere sharing them.

(19:04):
Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's, It's.It's easy to see where you're going
if you, if you're not beingmindful of the effects of where you're
going. You know, the next stepis logical step. It's not the neck.
No, it's. It's. There's nologic in, in humanity. Humanity does
not have logic. Life does nothave logic. It's. It's so funny that

(19:27):
also, you know, my kids,they're turning 15 and 13 this year.
And it must be horrible tohave me as a dad because I can be
so very, you know, right onthe dot and like, oh, dad, you know
these things and why are youtelling us? And I prepare them for
a lot of things. And I said,you know, pain is something that's
part of life. Don't run awayfrom it. It's something that's part

(19:50):
of life and you're going tohave pain in life, but it's a good
thing. Pain gives you, teachesyou, and it brings you to a point
where you find your limits andyour boundaries and you go from there
and you find those and thenyou break through them and in comfort
and so on. And that'ssomething where a leader as well
needs to understand the painof their team. And it's bit what

(20:12):
you're saying of somebody'sevolution, you know, that they're
in pain because they want toget somewhere else. So how can you
solve their pain? It's bylistening and going through the pain
either with them or for themor just understanding how you can
move away the wall that theyalso tend to walk into. But one of

(20:33):
the biggest things there, andit's so prevalent with children,
with your team, with whateveryou do, it's letting go. It's really
letting them do it and trustin their ability to, to get through
that pain and that wall and,and they will, they will achieve,
but just be there to, youknow, pick up the pieces if they

(20:56):
don't. That's. That's onething as well that I've learned.
I've seen people jump into arole that they thought they were
ready for and they were not,and they had to come back. And, you
know, embarrassment was, wasvery prevalent. You know, they crawled
into a shell and I was thereto break through that shell again
and say, you know, there'snothing's changed in your expertise.

(21:19):
You are still good at what youdo. You just tried something and
you failed, which is amazingto do. You know, fail forward is
one of the best things I everlearned. And pain is part of that.
And you have to understand allthose things. And yeah, it's so much
fun being a leader.
Right, right, right. And I,and listeners, this is a really big,

(21:40):
this is a key thing is, is.And I think something that you just
said, I think it's, it's, it'sbeautiful to be able to say to somebody,
it's okay, you, you, you tooka step, maybe didn't. It didn't come
out the way you wanted it to,but that's okay, you're learning
from it. And you could. The,the next time you step, you can step

(22:04):
bigger because you can, youcan know it. But as long as you,
the leader, can help thatperson grow as opposed to, you know,
there's two different ways.You could. It could happen, right?
You could shun the person andmake them feel like, you know, whatever.
Right.
And not make them feel goodand they. And they don't. Or you

(22:24):
could help them thrive. Andso, you know, you have to decide
what kind of person do youwant to be?
Well, the quick question is,do you want to keep them or not?
Because that's, that's, that'swhat happens. Make those choices.
That's clearly what happens.One goes, the other doesn't. It's
as simple as that.
Yeah, you know, it's. Youknow, I, and I talk to people about

(22:45):
this a lot of times too. Isthat people, you know, and, and not.
And I'm sure people have heardit a thousand times, but it's a key
thing to remember. Nobody everleaves a company because of money.
They may say it's money, butthey, they really leave a company
because they don't feel thatthey are appreciated. They don't
feel that they have been. Thatthey're, that they, they don't feel
worthy or that the, theleadership doesn't make them feel

(23:08):
good about themselves. And ifyou can help people feel good about
themselves when they walk intothat room, God, that's just like,
beautiful, right? You want.
It's like a drug. It's like.
Right? It is. It is so like adrug. So, Nico, I could talk to you
for hours, but, so tell me,like, what is, like, the one thing?

(23:28):
If you could give people,like, you know, one thing to walk
away with, what do you wantthem to know?
There's so many. Shrink itdown to pure leadership. If there's
one message that I would bringout there is find someone. And it

(23:50):
doesn't have to be aprofessional, but find someone who
is 100% trustworthy. And Idon't take that word lightly. 100%
is something that I really,really emphasize. Someone who's 100%
worth of your confidence andyour trust, and speak to them openly
on what is going on withinyour leadership role. And ask them

(24:15):
before you even start, do notgive me any solutions. Do not ask
me any questions. I just wantyou to listen. Because listening
to your own voice is sometimesthe key to finding a solution to
all your problems. It's thesame thing as writing down a problem,
is solving it halfway. BecauseEvery solution that you're looking

(24:37):
for for a problem is withinwriting down and within the problem.
So that's one thing that Iwould. Yeah. Send out there.
Oh, I love that. That is soimportant and so true. So how can
our listeners connect with youand learn more about you and.
Well, the quickest way isLinkedIn. I'm always active on LinkedIn,
so I publicize a weeklypodcast as well, the Everlasting

(24:59):
Fulfillment Podcast, where Idiscuss CEO disease and founder syndrome
very, very explicitly withthe. With executives and C levels.
And on. On the other side, I,you know, do the LND and the confidant
story. That's. That's theother thing. But LinkedIn. Find me
on LinkedIn or just type in myname, put a.com right behind there,
and you'll swim overseas underthe ground to a wonderful country

(25:22):
called Belgium. And that'swhere you'll find my website.
Absolutely. Fantastic. Well,Nico, I so appreciate you being a
guest on our podcast. This isthe Unstoppable Leadership Spotlight
Podcast. And again, I'm yourhost. And Nico, thank you so much
for being an amazing guest.And please, listeners, reach out
to Nico and connect with him.Great, amazing wisdom and insight.

(25:42):
So thank you so much.
Thank you.
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