January 7, 2025 • 64 mins
The tragic story of two missing hikers searching for Bigfoot not only captivates with its mysteries but also serves as a cautionary tale about wilderness safety. This episode discusses the recent events, highlighting essential tips for preparation and respect in nature, while also unpacking the cultural significance of the Sasquatch phenomena.
• Exploration of the circumstances surrounding the hikers' disappearance
• Insights from expert Tobe Johnson on Bigfoot research
• Importance of preparedness and safety in wilderness hiking
• Discussion of emotional responses when lost in the woods
• Cultural significance of Sasquatch in various communities
• Emphasis on fostering a supportive outdoor community
• Encouragement to respect the natural environment and its mysteries
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Welcome to US Phenomenon, where possibilities
are endless.
Put down those same oldheadlines.
It's time to expand your mindand question what if?
From paranormal activity toUFOs, bigfoot sightings and
unsolved mysteries, this is USPhenomenon?
Speaker 2 (00:21):
From the Pacific Northwest in the shadow of the
1962 World's Fair, the space youknow.
Good evening, good morning,good afternoon.
Wherever you are on God's greenearth, I'm your host, mario
Magana.
This is US Phenomenon, where weexplore the extraordinary and
the unexplained.
We're discussing the shockingnews about the two hikers that
went missing in search of theelusive Bigfoot Sasquatch.
(00:45):
Our guest, tove Johnson, is awell-known figure in the realm
of Bigfoot research.
With his deep passion forexploring the mysteries of the
natural world, johnson hasdedicated years to meticulously
investigating and documentingthe elusive creature known as
Bigfoot.
His journey began with aprofound fascination for the
(01:07):
unknown and a desire to uncoverthe truth behind these countless
sightings reported globally.
Johnson's approach combinesscientific rigor with
open-minded curiosity, allowinghim to navigate the complexities
of his field with skepticismand wonder.
(01:27):
In addition to his field work,he's also an accomplished author
, with a book called the al moonlab a paranormal experience
receiving widespread acclaim.
Through his research andwritings, tobe johnson continues
to inspire fellow researchersand enthusiasts, inviting us all
to question the unknown andembrace the wonder of the
(01:49):
natural world.
It is my pleasure to welcomeback to us phenomenon tobe
johnson.
Speaker 3 (01:55):
Welcome back to the show man that bio dude is
straight out of ai.
There ain't no way I'm thatcool, no, yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:05):
Hey man, you know when you when you, when you do,
when you produce the show andhave to do produce, host and
everything else.
It's kind of nice to have ahelp out once in a while.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
I like it OK, great, so I'm glad to be here.
Thanks for having me on.
Speaker 2 (02:21):
You know it's interesting to me about these
two hikers that have gonemissing.
I know there's tons to me aboutthese two hikers that have gone
missing.
I know there's tons of reportsout there, uh, what we do know
is that two that these twohikers were um out looking for
bigfoot um, so both of these mentragically passed away in the
gifford uh pincho nationalforest.
Now there are there are so manydifferent records or reports
(02:46):
out here.
One guy was 37.
The other guy was 59.
What do you know so far inregards to what information we
have up to this point?
Speaker 3 (03:00):
I really don't know anything.
That's going to be news to thelistening audience?
I don't think.
But the unfortunate part for melet's just start with a little
bit of griping, then we'll getinto what's going on.
The unfortunate part to me isthis story broke nationally all
(03:23):
over right, like Reuters got it,everyone got it because it had
the word Bigfoot attached to theunfortunate death of two
individuals that you know had anuntimely event happen to them
out in a very interestingsquatchy area, skamania County
Also, where Ted, I almost saidtax and gouge me, but Ted
(03:46):
Kulangoski, the old governor,put down an order.
Basically, you can't kill aBigfoot, kind of as a lark, I
think, for a family member,maybe his daughter, if I
remember correctly.
And so, but it is an actualorder in Skamania County that
you cannot kill a Bigfoot orharass a Bigfoot.
Or harass a bigfoot, I think,um, and I don't know if that is
(04:08):
necessarily the case anywhereelse in the united states.
So here, these guys are freshout of portland, from what I
read, and they were going inthere, I believe, on christmas
eve or around that time, I think, maybe just a day trip and
they're supposed to be back.
They didn't come back and thensearch and rescue got involved,
(04:30):
and the interesting orperplexing part for me is the
fact A that the names have notbeen released.
We were talking a little bitabout that, mario.
Speaker 2 (04:40):
Right.
Speaker 3 (04:40):
That does strike me as something that's ordinary.
That does strike me assomething that's ordinary.
I was talking to a deputyex-deputy sheriff, rich Germeau,
who's also a witness out herein the Olympic Peninsula, used
to work the beat in La Push,washington.
He was saying when they don'trelease the names like that,
(05:03):
that there's something moregoing on to the story.
Speaker 2 (05:04):
So for those who are listening or maybe watching,
we're going to pull up a reallynice map here in just a few
seconds.
But to kind of paint thepicture and kind of for those
that may be driving or listeningto the podcast, the Gifford
Pinchot National Forest islocated in southern Washington,
which covers 1.3 million acres.
(05:26):
That's a lot of forest.
Now this is tucked in from thecolumbia river up through mount
adams and mount rainier nationalvolcano monument.
Now what's interesting to meabout that whole city?
That's dense forest man, hugedense forest.
Right, I mean, you're talking.
Let me pull this map up for ushere.
We're talking about a map andas we look at this, it is
(05:51):
profoundly so dense in this area.
Now, according to the reports,they were down here in Willard
Washington.
Now they were on the OklahomaRoad.
I believe this is the road outhere.
Speaker 3 (06:04):
Yes, right, yes Right .
Speaker 2 (06:06):
Yes, yeah.
But what's interesting to me,that this doesn't even seem like
the information that was givento everyone seems too vague to
me, as you're, as I'm startingto do the research myself to
look at this map which hasBigfoot sightings.
I'm like this to me, tobdoesn't look like there's.
You know, we're just talkingabout a road that hits up.
(06:35):
But if I mean how many miles, Imean this is you know, maybe
you know five, ten miles up theroad.
I mean you got to get in here,did like do some serious hiking.
Now if I pull up the map, if Ipull out from the map here, we
can start to see some of theseBigfoot sightings here on the
map.
But what's interesting to me isthat this area, the topography
(06:56):
is wild.
I mean we got dense forest, youhave elevation, drastic
elevation changing.
But as we continue to pull themap completely out, you start to
see the hot spots here of allthe different sightings of
Bigfoot, even including upthrough the Rainier.
I mean this is hot stuff, man.
It's pretty interesting to mewhen you start to pull all the
(07:19):
way out, when you start to seethe hotbeds and where these guys
are hanging out at.
Speaker 3 (07:25):
Mario, can you go back to Oklahoma Road again?
I'm just seeing something therethat's kind of interesting.
Nothing per se to do, whatwould happen there, but an
anomaly of sorts If you can gonorth even more to where you
were.
Keep going, keep going.
Higher, higher, higher Oklahomathere.
(07:47):
See those go up a littlefarther to see the dice that
rolled there in the forest offto the left.
Yeah, up here.
No, over here, look to the left.
There's no keep going left,more, more left in the forest.
Speaker 2 (08:00):
Oh yeah, see those guys.
Speaker 3 (08:01):
Yeah yeah, oh yeah.
See those dice.
Yeah yeah, that's.
That's interesting to me.
I don't know what that means Ifloggers just do that.
That you know.
(08:22):
Here's the deal is that we couldget really conspiratorial about
what the Forest kind of thingsthat I look for when I'm looking
for hot spots.
Not only you know is this agreat resource?
This may be.
What brought them to this areawas a recent report on a map
like this.
It could have very well beensomething you know that they
heard about.
Maybe a family member had anexperience.
(08:43):
The thing is that we shouldknow and not just in a nosy way.
The police should end any kindof speculation or conspiratorial
stuff by releasing the namesand say you know, unfortunately
these guys got wet and cold,they had hypothermia.
Don't do the same.
This area is very dangerous.
(09:04):
There's obviously some creeksthat we had to cross to get
there right.
Um, and I find that odd toothat they crossed a creek, at
least one.
Um, the search and rescue did.
At least they had a ladder out.
They crossed a creek.
Um, and what were these guysdoing in a snow drift area for a
(09:24):
day?
Hike, crossing creeks, lookingfor Bigfoot?
That's a little bit.
That's strange to me.
I wouldn't do it unless I knewthat there was something on the
other side of that creek that Ihad to get to it's.
It's just too hard to crosscreeks in the wet and cold like
that unless you're wearing likereally big muck boots that are
neoprene.
So that's a little bit odd.
(09:48):
But people do stuff in the woodsthat they shouldn't do and they
think they can get away with it.
I've been lost in the woods.
It's a horrible feeling.
The first thing that happens toyou is you panic and you have
to talk yourself out of notpanicking.
And if you're with anotherperson and they're trusting on
(10:08):
you as being the guy that getsthem in and out, it becomes
really embarrassing.
So now you have the panic andthe shame.
So this like strikes home to me.
The few times I've been lost,both of those emotions came over
me.
And the shame right like themovie with Anthony Hopkins and
(10:28):
Alec Baldwin called the Edge.
There's this scene in therewhere they get lost in the
Alaska wilderness and they havethis bear chasing them.
And you know, anthony Hopkinsturns to the Baldwin character
and says you know, it's not theelements that will kill you,
it's the shame that you've beenoutsmarted by the wilderness,
(10:50):
and that's absolutely true.
And if you don't have your witsabout you, you can get turned
around really quick in the densebrush and we can talk about
ways that I've overcome thosehurdles, so I don't ever get
lost again, if you want to yes,definitely for sure.
Speaker 2 (11:07):
Yeah, what's interesting to me about this
whole situation?
A1, just like you were saying,uh, just a few minutes ago about
why they didn't haven'treleased the names of these two
individuals, um, what's is thisdoes?
Is this more of a crime scenethat we're looking at now?
Was there?
Why didn't they just say thisis where they were at?
It's the same thing as thegentleman that went missing in
(11:28):
2020, sam DeBolle, who was anavid hiker, who went missing in
the Mowich Lake, mother Mountain, over by Mount Rainier.
He was over in this area, in avery dense, uh, very dense area
on the mother mountain trail and, uh, this was during october
(11:50):
and he, uh the.
The last thing they saw of himwas his water bottle and nothing
else was found of the gentleman.
So he's been, he's been, not,he has not been found.
So if he's fallen into acrevasse, um, what's interesting
?
There's nothing to be found.
But they definitely releasedhis name.
But in this case, it doesstrike me that the information
(12:14):
on these two gentlemen has notbeen released.
Speaker 3 (12:18):
And I don't know if families have wishes to not
release the name.
Does that bypass what the stateand the sheriff's office do
with the names?
I don't know how any of thatworks.
Legality, yeah, um, I didn't, Ididn't check into it, but
generally the names, eventuallyum, are released right, like if
(12:39):
you follow Politi's work on 411,missing 411, there's usually
names attached.
Right when he gets on youtubehe brings up very specific
information.
Um, but, yeah, I mean anybodylistening to this right now.
I mean you can get in touchwith mario or myself.
Um, I'd like to hear more.
You can reach out to me on onfacebook under the same name,
(13:01):
tobe johnson, or reach out to meover at olympicstrangedays at
gmailcom.
I'd like to know more aboutwhat the protocol is for state
and local law enforcementregarding releasing the names of
people that are missing orpresumed dead.
Speaker 2 (13:21):
So, tobe, you were talking a few minutes ago about
getting lost in the woods, butwhen you go out to do your
research, in, in, in the wintertime, I'm assuming you do this
all year round.
I'm assuming that maybe maybe.
Speaker 3 (13:34):
Yeah, I've been on the phone all day planning a
trip for tomorrow.
Speaker 2 (13:38):
Yeah, um, yeah, in regards to this, I mean,
obviously, inclement weather.
This is definitely.
I mean, anywhere you go thistime of season, the weather can
switch on a dime on you.
What do you tell most of these?
I don't want enthusiasts,amateur Bigfoot researchers,
(14:02):
someone out there looking forthe elusive creature.
I want them to be prepared.
I know that this is notsomething that typically happens
a lot, but it seems that peopleare still going hiking this
ain't 2020, and everyone's likeokay, I'm going to get a
backpack on and I'm going out inthe woods, but there are a lot
more avid hikers in here in thePacific Northwest.
(14:23):
What are we telling individualsto do and what are you
preparing yourself to do whenyou go out into those and into
these areas?
Speaker 3 (14:33):
well, um, the first thing I would suggest people
doing is research where you'regoing and what the weather is
going to be this time of year,because things change so
drastically and there's washoutsall over out here in the
Olympic Peninsula so you may notget to where you're going, but
what?
What happens if you get to thearea and there's a washout or a
(14:54):
down tree and you can't getyourself out and you're 30 miles
in the backcountry without acell phone signal.
So these are all the thingsthat I think of, because these
have either happened or I'veheard of them happening.
And so this time of year youneed some things with you that
you don't necessarily need inthe summer as a rule, but the
(15:16):
big one is presume you're goingto get wet and cold and always
have a change of gear with youand a tote, and that tote is
going to be like a Costco sizetote for $6.99 and you're going
to stick it in your trunk andyou're going to make it your
priority tote that has all yourgear in it, a change of clothes,
you know, any kind of survivalgear that you need, as far as
(15:39):
like a little Coleman stove, acouple little snacks in there
may not be enough, so I wouldjust go ahead and get the freeze
dried one for $8.99.
All this stuff can be bought onAmazon, by the way.
And then the big one is achainsaw.
You can get a little tinybattery operated chainsaw to
keep in your truck.
That chainsaw is not only goingto help you, maybe, get out of
(16:00):
an area, but it can also helpyou create a fire really quickly
if you need to, if you arestuck on the side of the road
and there's a you know that'ssuch a.
We were talking earlier aboutthe shame element.
I want to drive this point homeagain because it's so important
.
If you feel like you're winningthe battle against the cold
with a fire, that's a huge egoboost for you for the night and
(16:24):
chances are you're not going tobe out there more than a night.
Now, if you're away from yourcar and your tote's back in your
vehicle, then you need to havesome of this stuff in your pack,
a way to keep yourself warm andalert and dry.
So you need a day pack to bringwith you out on these, even a
(16:45):
day hike.
You also need protection ofsome kind.
I would prefer something smallthat you can keep in your pocket
and keep things at a distancefrom you, right?
Those are the kind of thingsthat I have in my pocket, as
well as bear spray and otherthings like that.
I've I've had to use theseitems to keep people at bay and
animals at bay, and you, youknow it's something that you
(17:07):
don've had to use these items tokeep people at bay and animals
at bay, and you know it'ssomething that you don't
necessarily ever want to have touse.
Speaker 2 (17:13):
But Lord fear if you need it and you don't have it,
but the big one, go ahead, goahead.
I was going to say you said youhad to use it on animals and
people, so you're saying you'rerunning into other individuals
that may be.
Are we talking these like what?
Are these the feral people outthere in the woods?
Speaker 3 (17:31):
No.
So I do a lot of solo, remotecamping on abandoned roads that
lead into the high country ofthe Olympic Peninsula, right.
So in this incident, around2.30 in the morning, I had some
individuals show up and throwtheir high beams on at me about
you know, 20 to 30 yards away,and they just sat there in their
(17:52):
truck.
And so if you present the factthat you're not just, you know
going to be a bystander waitingto get abused, then people tend
to back up.
And so who knows what thatwould have turned into had I,
you know not had a secondamendment approach to the whole
thing.
It may have been me as a victimthat died of uh or disappeared,
(18:13):
who knows.
Or just you know what I mean.
Like I don't want those kind ofconditions when I'm out to
explore the beauty.
I don't want to deal with that,but there are feral people out
in the woods.
I just took a report up here onthe Elwha River of a guy that
(18:35):
ran into three feral individualsin the high, remote country
that were coming down as thoughthey had lived in the winter up
in this area where it snows, andI said, well, what did they
look like?
And he's just like well, it waskind of like the hills have eyes
and they look like they hadresources.
And I said, well, what do youmean by resources?
Just like they had gear.
But you could tell that they'dbeen out there for months and we
(18:59):
didn't exchange words.
So I'm going to go meet withthis guy next week and get his
story, because it is interestingto me, not only because of the
Bigfoot thing, but the very factthat we do have individuals
that aren't necessarily homelessor in crisis.
They've chosen a different path, kind of like the Alaskan bush
people perhaps, and they liveout in the woods and they
(19:23):
probably are a-okay in somedegrees, but you never know it's
kind of interesting when youtalk about that, because there's
a lot of stuff that doesn't gettalked about.
Speaker 2 (19:34):
Doing my research, continuing to do my
investigation work, stilllooking through the information
freedom act in regards to thepeople that have gone missing in
the national parks and I knowthat there's already someone out
there who does a fantastic jobbut really just to try to find
more information about certainindividuals that have gone
missing locally here in town.
Uh, like the assistantprofessor, every, I mean, I've
(19:56):
done a show about this guy forlike the last couple years.
Every october we talk aboutthis guy that has gone missing,
but there's nothing to be foundof him except for his water
bottle.
I'm like, where did his tent go?
Where did his clothes go?
Where did he go?
Did he?
You know, these are things thatI think about.
Uh, not to get off on a tangent, but like you know how many
(20:20):
feral people are living in thenational park, you know what I
mean.
It's it's not talked about,it's not really talked about and
as, as you know, as people talk, as you you know, are sharing
your experiences out about thesedifferent individuals, people
coming to mess with you, or, youknow, you being able to protect
yourself in in in your, whileyou're doing your research.
It's almost a hazard for you.
(20:41):
Not only is the inclementweather a hazard, but it's also
individuals that could behazardous to you as well.
In this case, with these twohikers that were pronounced
missing and then eventuallypronounced dead.
I mean, we're talking, you knowsome resources that were put in
60 people in search for thesetwo individuals.
(21:02):
You know them crossing a creekwith a ladder.
It seemed like they weredefinitely deep in the woods.
But, man, I can't imagine if Iwas out there doing research
looking for Bigfoot, andeverybody knows well.
I make it known that I'm likeyou're not going to see me out
there researching it.
There are plenty of otherpeople to do it and I'm not that
(21:23):
great of an avid hiker.
I've already been spooked.
I don't.
I don't carry a secondamendment.
I probably should.
Um, I believe in it.
But what's interesting to me is,like the times that I've gone
up, you know, you know back, youknow going off-roading and
things of that nature in thesummer, looking for a sunset
over mount by mount, rainier,the things that I've seen were
(21:44):
plenty enough to make me to getthe hell out.
Now, was it Bigfoot, was it?
You know feral people, I don'tknow.
But to see rocks stacked in acertain way, sticks put on the
national, whatever the ForestService Road, you know where
you're going, through the gatesand whatnot, but I'm like why am
I finding more?
Whatever the forest serviceroad, you know where you're
(22:04):
going through, the gates andwhatnot, but I'm like why am I?
Why am I finding more?
Why am I finding wood sticksbunched up together?
I'm like clearly somebody doesnot want us continuing up the
road.
Um, have you ever encounteredanything like that?
Speaker 3 (22:20):
yeah, there's a really strange case.
I'll'll tell you real quick.
It'll take me a few minuteshere.
But in an area called theFrench Pete Wilderness in Oregon
I used to live in a little townof Springfield, oregon, and
outside of Spring.
First it was a physicsprofessor from the University of
(22:46):
Oregon.
His name was Professor Xing Zhu.
All they found of his in theFrench Pete wilderness was, I
believe, his leather backpack.
About three to four years latera guy by the name of Jake Dutton
, retired Coast Guard, wentmissing in the exact same area.
Lower part of the trail hadfrench peat wilderness.
Nonetheless, jake dutton had abackground, um, I believe he was
(23:10):
a coast guard reservist, so hedefinitely had cold weather
background.
Young guy I think he lived ineugene.
Um, he was planning on justdoing maybe an overnight or two
and was going into the backcountry.
Never found um went missing formaybe two to three years.
The mother drove all the waydown from portland oregon, put a
(23:31):
sign that she made herself onthe trailhead sign and said my
son, um, was killed undermysterious circumstances, I
think.
Uh, and you know, there's nobody that was ever found.
And here the mother came downand wrote that.
So we went up there to look forJake and didn't find him.
(23:51):
But we found out that a friendof ours actually found his skull
on top of a fern.
Now, jake's body was so farback at a hidden area that three
to three years had passed, Ibelieve, since he went missing.
So you have all that snow, youhave all that weather, a lot of
(24:14):
heavy snow, a lot of heavycurrent coming down the creek,
turning it into a river.
Now his skull was placed on topof a fern by the creek.
His shoes were tied and placedby his backpack.
They were unopened and therewas no weathering.
That was really noted.
Uh, from the report from mybuddy that had found this, not
(24:38):
not so much body, but had foundjake's skull, of course he was
interviewed as a possiblesuspect.
He wasn't, uh and um.
So my point about this is isthat they ruled jake stutton
died of exposure and there's noway to know what happened to
(24:58):
jake, because there was nothingleft except the top of his skull
cap and his skull to me seemsas though it was placed there
for someone to find it, becauseyou don't have three winters
rolling by and have a bleachedwhite skull cap set on top of a
fern Sure, um, and the shoeswere sitting next to one another
(25:19):
and tied and there was no,there was no attempt of rescue
on Jake's part to get in hisbackpack, um, so that those are
the kinds of weird things I'vebeen a part of.
Uh, those are, you know,stories near my bigfoot areas
where I've had really strangestuff happen, and so when people
(25:40):
start putting in, I mean I knowlike polities doesn't like to
put the the category of sSasquatch involved with these
things here, but I'll just saythat these are individuals,
these are not fake, they're notphony, these are very real
phenomena.
I've seen one and they come asindividuals do, and I think that
(26:04):
they're capable of greatindividual personalities, and so
I don't bet totally back awayfrom the fact that if someone
goes missing and has ruled out,you know, a death from exposure,
that they actually died ofexposure.
I don't know what happened toJake Duttons.
Maybe a serial killer got him,maybe some crazed, lunatic,
(26:26):
feral person got him.
But that's kind of what bigfootis to me.
I've never had a run in them,run in with them, where I was
scared for my life.
It's always been veryinquisitive.
Uh, it's almost like teenagepranksters, like frat boy
personality stuff, sure, um, andthere seems to be a real
(26:46):
genuine type of like, humanityand kindness to them and so.
But there is these otherqualities.
I don't know what's all out inthe woods it could.
Speaker 2 (26:55):
It's a very strange world and when you talk about
his shoes being there, if he wasstill in his shoes wouldn't,
wouldn't his feet still be?
Speaker 3 (27:08):
the remains of his feet still be in the shoe, you
know predation and weather, uh,are big factors, mario, and that
predation coyotes, sure, rats,beavers, birds, they'll all get
in there and nothing reallylasts that long in the woods.
Now you can watch time lapsevideos of predation happen to
(27:31):
like a roadkill or somethinglike that, right, but then you
know you don't see what theweather is doing and it's not in
the dense, mossy forest of thepacific northwest.
So you have that amplitude ofthings that are starving around
you on top of the weather andlike mega fauna.
You know, depleting thosethings.
So things do go very quicklybut you still find bones, like I
(27:54):
found, yeah, very old bones outin the woods and they're intact
yeah, that was my thing.
Speaker 2 (28:01):
I was like, well, I wonder if there were still bones
, uh, other than the skull cap,that what you know was found.
It just it's, it's, just it's.
And I think the one thing thatI really wanted to bring to the
attention of our listeners whoare out here I don't know so
much.
I know that there are avidhunters out here, there are
people that do enjoy hiking Justa quick reminder that hey, if
(28:22):
you're going to be out here inthe element, make sure you are
protected, wearing yourprotective gear.
We'll have links if you needstuff, but clearly you're not.
You're not getting yourexpertise from me but, um,
because, lord knows, you know Idon't do a lot of.
You know I'm my urban, my urbanhiking is out, you know, trying
(28:42):
to.
You know, fend someone off thirdavenue over there, off of third
and pike oh yeah, wild yeah um,but so you know tobe, when we
talk about these, thesesituations, these two
individuals, let's, let's godown the let's go down the
rabbit hole, uh, if we can.
(29:02):
In regards to what do you thinkif you were to put yourselves
in their shoes, what in the hellwere you thinking about doing
near christmas time?
What you know it would like it?
No one says they were they.
You know family members.
I mean, it is so vague inregards to what, actually, what
their knowledge was to you knowwho?
(29:23):
Were they related to each other?
Were they just two guys outhere trying to do a documentary
and try to submit it to you orsomebody else?
I know that you're not a part ofthis, but there's so many
people trying to make a quickdollar.
Were these guys trying to do abook?
Bigfoot Only Fans I have youknow.
Was it Bigfoot Fetish?
I have no idea in regards towhy, so close to the holidays,
(29:46):
would you think someone would beout here doing this type of
research?
Speaker 3 (29:51):
Well, on Christmas Eve there were five friends of
mine and they all went outbigfooting.
They left their families, itwas raining, they all went up
into the woods overnight and thereason that they went is
because the night before theycaptured language and, um,
(30:12):
that's very difficult to do.
That's kind of the holy grailis like you know, you get
bigfoot tracks, you have a goodsighting, maybe you get on film,
but if you can record anunknown language from these
things, then it gets into adifferent category of what we're
talking about, because asidebar, if they have language,
they have culture and if theyhave culture it's a game changer
(30:32):
.
We're not talking aboutprimates in the typical sense,
like a relic hominid or anythinglike that.
So maybe these guys got a hitlike on the map there.
These are all cluster areasthat we're looking at, um, so if
you go down there, you can seeBigfoot tracks were found.
So there's a Bigfoot print,there's different color-coded
(30:55):
types of encounters Yellow, red,bright red, orange and then
there's auditory things toothere as well.
So they were in a hot zone.
But Scamania, the whole thing,is a hot zone and that's all you
have to do is go to SkamaniaCounty and you walk the streets
(31:19):
and you're going to see Bigfootstuff all over downtown.
You know just by over.
I don't know if you've everbeen to Skamania area, but if
you go on the Columbia RiverGorge, like you're heading
towards Benjen Washington orBeacon Rock, you'll run into
Skamania County and it's knownas a Bigfoot hotspot.
So it could very well be.
(31:41):
These guys hopped in there justto do a day trip and on a lark
they went uplahoma road and theygot into some trouble.
I don't know why they got intosome trouble.
Now here's one thing I wouldlike to ask the audience is that
I heard that the search andrescue team had their gear
(32:03):
stolen and that they're actuallynow having to crowdfund to
replace the gear.
Now, was that gear stolen onthe site?
Because if they were in thebackcountry and that gear was
stolen, that's a veryinteresting move by somebody.
It wasn't, in my opinion,unless they had Snickers or
(32:23):
something in there, it probablywasn't a bear.
They would see sign that it wasa bear.
But if their gear was takenright, maybe it was taken back
at like the search and rescueshack in portland or the dallas
or wherever they came in from,and that's maybe they just had a
break-in, but I I haven't beenable to loop that together, so
(32:43):
I'd like to know where that gearwas taken.
Speaker 2 (32:47):
That's interesting.
I did not get that report but,as I take a few seconds here to
put my thoughts together, ifthey were out looking and the
gear was stolen during thesearch and rescue, that would
lead me to believe that therewas something else out there
(33:10):
Feral people, maybe a group ofindividuals who have gone off
the grid?
Obviously the same thing, Maybenot as feral as, maybe, people
living off the grid.
Maybe it's a cluster ofSasquatch that may be more
advanced in modern dayday timesand maybe they're like Harry and
(33:32):
the Henderson, and maybe theseBigfoot were like hey, I need a
ladder and we need some tools.
Speaker 3 (33:40):
Let me finish the rest of this story about Jake
Dutton After that event, afterhis body was found.
A friend of mine by the name ofTodd Bailey and Dave S we'll
call him Dave S used to work forthe local McKinsey Fire
Department, and Todd Bailey is abig old redneck and he's never
(34:02):
been outdone by the woods ever.
And so they went out to seewhat happened to Jake Dutton, to
find out if it was somethingnefarious, and they stayed in
the area by themselves.
That night Todd fell asleepunderneath a cedar tree.
Dave hung up his hammock, likehe usually does, and that's kind
(34:23):
of protocol when we all wouldgo camping that next day.
That next morning Todd foundhimself face down, 30 yards away
from where he'd fallen asleepand his face pushed down into a
fern.
And he woke up to find that hisbody had been drenched.
(34:44):
He was wearing one pieceCarhartt uniform, like you see
on the construction crew, sure,and his entire carhartt was
soaked in urine and somethinghad peed all over him not
himself so as he, as he got upto figure out what had happened,
he found that his only backpackhad been moved and unzipped and
(35:08):
something had peed a gallon ofpee inside his backpack and then
zipped it kindly back up.
So now his change of clotheshave also been peed on.
This happened exactly whereJake Dutton, within proximity to
where Jake Dutton's body, wasfound and recovered, and so
people can believe that story ornot.
(35:29):
They can say that Todd had anaccident and then did that.
But this is the kind of highstrangeness that makes you say
things like we're not going toreport this.
It's not associated with whathappened out here to Jake.
It's a very tall tale, soundingkind of crazy story.
(35:52):
But when we get into like gearbeing stolen if it was stolen
out in the woods that becomesway more interesting to me.
If it was stolen out of thecamp shack back in the Dalles or
Trout, wherever it was kept, tr?
Um troutdale then it wasprobably a break-in.
But why not just release thenames, uh, of these people and?
(36:16):
Um the circumstances, so otherpeople don't find themselves in
that trouble?
And I don't know.
You know here this is aclose-knit, close-knit community
.
In portland there's a lot ofBigfooters in Portland.
The NABC Cliff Berkman's Museumis in Boring, oregon, right
across the Columbia River fromSkamania County.
(36:37):
I would imagine that these guysare interested in what happened
to these guys.
It's a very Bigfoot-rich area.
So is it related?
No, but the news kind of madeit related because they push the
story.
It's like sasquatch hikers gomissing and die of exposure.
It's kind of a it's obviously ahorrible thing to do because it
(37:00):
desensitizes you from thetragedy of possibly daughters
and sons and wives and brothersand sisters you know that had a
a horrible Christmas and ahorrible life, maybe.
So what I am here to say isthat there are strange things
that happen in Bigfoot areas andthey can be very creepy being
(37:34):
prepared, um, like you said,having your whereabouts about
where you're at.
Speaker 2 (37:35):
Um, all right, do you carry, like a gps unit, what is
uh, what is uh, um, politelysay to carry?
You know, he was just said thison the axe.
He said he was remindingeveryone, hey, if you're going
to be out here in the woods,make sure you have, you know,
one of those recovery you knowbeacons yeah, so that if you
know, you can put a.
Speaker 3 (37:55):
You can put a geo tracker on you so people can
watch from afar where you are.
Most phones already have thatbuilt into them.
I mean, people can find outwhere you are even if you don't
have a signal.
They can ping and andtriangulate.
You know, I dropped an air tagin the middle of the Umpqua
National Forest and I was ableto track it and that wasn't
(38:17):
around anything.
You know what I mean.
So that's like a $29 littlething that you can put in your
pocket.
That's the first thing I woulddo is go buy an air tag
immediately put it in yourbackpack and forget about it and
give your girlfriend or yourwife or your kids you know a way
to track you right so you cansee where you're going.
(38:39):
The other thing I would do iscarry um a cell phone with a
subscription to onyx, o-n-xx.
Onyx, you can download digitalmaps.
As long as you have a signalwhere Onyx is on your smartphone
or your AirPad or whatever, youcan get yourself out of the
woods.
(38:59):
It'll tell you exactly whereyou left and how to get back out
of there what kind of terrain.
I purposely got myself lost inthe woods in the last two months
since I bought it to see if itwill work and it hasn't failed
me yet tells you where the sideroads are, how to get to the old
logging road, how to get backto your truck.
That's what you want to do, isyou got to get back to your
(39:22):
vehicle and you got to get to amain road, and that that's a way
.
And the other last thing I wouldsay is carry flagging tape.
It's like 299 at home depot.
It's the stuff you see hangingin trees when loggers go there.
It comes in a roll.
You stick that next to onyx.
You're never going to get lost.
You just hang that with aneyesight as you're walking into
(39:45):
a trail and you can't miss it.
You can see it at night.
You can also get littlereflectors that look like
thumbtacks.
You can make them at home.
You can buy reflector tape, putthem on a thumbtack, spend an
hour doing it, or go on Amazonand just look up reflective
thumbtacks and you stick thoseon a tree and so as you're
walking in, they're always onthe same side of the tree or the
(40:07):
branch and as you come out itlooks like a street.
You know heading down throughthe forest with your headlamp,
and the other thing, too, is aheadlamp.
Headlamp and extra batteries.
That'll save the day if you canhave a bright flashlight or
headlamp Preferably a headlamp,so you can use your hands.
Speaker 2 (40:25):
When you go out to do research, you have a favorite
hot spot, do you like?
Is there a place that you enjoygoing the most during the
winter time, the summertime?
What's your all-time favoritelocation to go?
Looking for the illusion?
Speaker 3 (40:40):
I know I want to go looking for the mini hoonie in
hawaii.
That's the ultimate goal thelittle people, the little people
in Hawaii in board shorts.
But if I can't make that happen, my PayPal account is no.
If I can't make that happen, myfavorite place to go as far as
like the productivity of theaction right the big phenomena
(41:05):
is what's featured in ourdocumentary A Flash of Beauty is
this place called the Al MoonLab, which was this enigmatic
spot outside of Cottage Grove,oregon, where, after about 17
years of full-time research, Iended up seeing a Sasquatch for
the first time.
For the first time and havingmy mind blown in multiple ways,
(41:31):
not only through the world ofBigfoot but the
cross-pollination of thephenomena, which is largely
paranormal-based, includingpoltergeist activity, ufo
activity and everything underthe sun attached to this one
little unassuming house nearCottage Grove Lake.
Speaker 2 (41:48):
Under the sun, attached to this one little
unassuming house, um nearcottage grove lake for those who
may think of the elusivebigfoot to be, not to know of it
, to be paranormal, but to thinkof it as an indigenous to the
planet it would.
Would we say that it isindigenous to the planet, or do
(42:11):
we say that it's, uh, notindigenous to the planet?
Okay, or do?
We are there, yeah I would sayso.
Speaker 3 (42:18):
It's a lot like this ufo issue.
Is that it?
Um the?
You know the soft disclosurewith the ufo stuff?
Mario is, mario is the Bigfootdisclosure?
People don't know it yet, but noone's really saying that these
are from outer space anymore.
In fact, lou Elizondo, who'sbroken a lot of this stuff
(42:40):
through ATIP, wrote the bookEminent about disclosure coming,
basically says that these arecoming through other realms,
that they are coming through thepages in between.
So they're not from inner space, outer space, they're from the
pages in between, to quote himspecifically.
And so I think this is what theNative Americans have been
telling us here.
(43:01):
They straight up told me in2004, these things come from
between two worlds and we needto show that phenomena great
respect.
In fact, in our documentary wehave a Native American.
Tj Ravenwolf opens up a Flash ofBeauty Paranormal Bigfoot with
(43:22):
a ceremony and he looks into thefire and says forgive us for
speaking so plainly about you.
And this is the kind ofreverence that still gives me
goosebumps, because what we'retalking about is real and not
everybody who listens to thisknows that yet.
But when the ET stuff hits thefan and there's going to be like
(43:44):
a major sighting that happensover downtown seattle, you know,
maybe during a seahawks game?
Um, right, right.
Speaker 2 (43:52):
I think that's going to open people's mind up in a
way to where they look at thisbigfoot phenomena and don't see
it as a bumper sticker anymoreit was funny when, when, when
you say that you talked aboutyou know the uh a sighting, when
we were kind of skimmingthrough the uh the map there,
the uh the Bigfoot map, uh,through the you know the website
of the uh Bigfoot project here,uh, I mean, there was sightings
(44:17):
in downtown Tacoma, washington,over in the tide flats, which
was kind of quite funny to me.
I was like, oh, look at that,there's a.
I was like there's someone must, if I can get over there
quickly.
It just kind of made me laughfor a second.
I was like, oh, wow, people are, they're looking for, they're
looking, they're seeing Bigfootin these other, you know,
(44:38):
populated areas.
Speaker 3 (44:40):
Yeah Well, we would get sightings quite often right
outside of Tacoma, in KitsapCounty, in the little town of
Alala, which is really, I think,only about a 15 minute, 20
minute drive to like, uh, youknow, the close to the Tacoma
Narrows Bridge in the I-5corridor.
Yes, but there's very.
(45:00):
Look at how dense all thatbrush is like.
If we're going solely with thephysical aspect of Sasquatch
using brush as camouflage, thenbingo, how much of that is green
.
You know what I mean.
So it gets pretty dark out hereat 4 o'clock in the winter.
You walk through that green,through a suburb at 5 or 10
(45:22):
o'clock or 2 in the morning.
Speaker 2 (45:24):
And that area is still very dense, olala, that
Sedgwick Highway heading to 16,that area is very dense still
Still, really, as you said, fullof water.
I mean, look at that, there'sone right there.
Speaker 3 (45:41):
I didn't, even I didn't know that.
Yeah Well, that's what.
That was, my old backyard.
And yeah, there'd be reportsfrom not only our address of
strange things being left infront of, uh the kitchen window,
including handprints, um bricksthat were stuck in people's um
barbed wire fences, as thoughsomething went up and grabbed
(46:03):
like a garden brick.
We would have things disappearfrom the front of yard for
months at a time and then returnin the back of the yard, broken
in half.
We lived on private property onfive acres, so I don't think it
was the UPS guy.
So you know, it gets reallyinteresting really quick, like
(46:24):
if these things are comingaround and they're interested in
property or they're interestedin family groups and messing
with uh stuff around your yard.
Um, that doesn't really.
I mean that points to a type ofcuriosity, but also points to a
type of possible uh gaming.
You know, like it seems like atrick, or.
But this is what the nativeamericans said about them is
(46:46):
that they're tricksters, right,they're in the vein of the
coyote, that they're, they'rereal.
They're in the base of thetotem pole, which is where you
put the most powerful thing onthe totem pole in the pacific
northwest, from my understanding, and that sasquatch goes along
with the other natural thingsthat exist the bear, the salmon,
(47:07):
the orca, the Bigfoot.
Speaker 2 (47:13):
So many people who and I think I saw this recently
as you were doing some researchyou were showing some of these
magnificent artwork of thesetotem poles at a casino.
Was it Seven Cedars?
Is that where you were at?
Speaker 3 (47:32):
Yeah, down the street .
Speaker 2 (47:33):
Yeah, great casino to stop in at.
I'm not plugging them.
They don't pay any of the billshere, but the artwork was so
impressive.
Pay any of the bills here, but,um, the artwork was so
impressive.
And for you to like show theartwork, uh, take a look at
tobe's uh facebook page if youhave a chance to take a look at
that.
(47:54):
It's interesting because I thinka lot of us who look at totem
poles we're like, oh yeah, it'sgreat, and we, we move on with
our day.
We don't take the time toreally go over with complexity
and use our imaginations and tolook at it and examine it and
say what is that?
Why is it that way?
(48:14):
You know, what is the messagehere?
I think a lot of it is theallure of you know, we're going
to the casino, we're going to.
You know, spend money, we'regoing to hit the buffet.
We're going to the casino,we're going to.
You know, spend money, we'regoing to hit the buffet.
But what was so great on that?
Uh, that piece that you showed.
You took the time to show thatand I was like damn, how many
times have I gone to the casinoand not looked at the artwork
(48:34):
and not paid attention to whatis actually being scribed or
been?
What story is being told on thetotem pole?
Speaker 3 (48:42):
yeah, their story pulls.
I mean, I don't know the storyof what I was really showing you
, but that was the supernaturalworld totem pole.
They all had little placards onthe bottom of it and it
appeared to be a primate becauseit had the giant ears on the
side of the head, like you wouldsee with a chimp, and it had
the purse lips, which is thetonic while the whistling,
(49:04):
sasquatch, the whooping sound orthe whistle, and then it had
what appeared to be kind of likea humanoid and it's below it.
So you know, this is we need tolisten to these stories more
from the First Nations people,because they do keep a lot to
themselves, but there's acertain amount of them that are
(49:25):
open books and if you can talkto a first nations person and
they can tell you their storywith great zest and zeal, take
the opportunity to listen.
Um, they, they.
Speaker 2 (49:37):
I think they're more right than they are wrong about
bigfoot and when you, when youshared that piece about um, what
was the word that you used orthat was scribed on the on the
totem pole that it was?
oh, I think the supernaturalworld yeah, that would really go
back to what you wereexplaining and what you know.
You know lua alessandro wasexplaining to us in regards to
(50:01):
what's actually being told outhere and how these worlds are
kind of, as you're saying, goingto be brought forward, but it's
been a part of our naturalexistence.
It's been out there to thepublic for a long time.
It just hasn't been shared tothe white man because of the
First Nations, as you would say,or have kept this story or have
(50:25):
not shared the story other thanin the artwork.
Speaker 3 (50:28):
Uh, that has been you know has been carved well
before, like the industrialrevolution and the atom bomb, we
were a world of science andreligion that merged.
It was only during thecompartmentalization of the
industrial revolution and theatom bomb that we start to
bisect and silo these phenomenais not working together, but we
(50:50):
really come from a world of thesupernatural law.
Right like not the mystery, notthe folklore, like angels and
demons kind of stuff.
Right like this is the talkthroughout all religions, and so
I see that, coming back now, Imean this is what's being talked
about.
This is what Jacques Vallée,you know, talks about regularly
(51:12):
with people when he's having aglass of wine.
All of these researchers intothe hard sciences of UFOs are
all like really invested intothe supernatural consequences of
what we're looking at here, andI think the same will be true
for Bigfoot.
I supernatural consequences ofwhat we're looking at here, and
I think the same will be truefor Bigfoot.
I don't know what we're talkingabout here, but I don't put
them in the demonic category, nomore than I put us.
(51:35):
You know they're capable ofgreat, you know evil, but so are
we.
They have that kind of humanityto them.
So are we.
They have that kind of humanityto them, and I'm only saying
that because I lived with themin this little place in Cottage
Grove for about a year and ahalf.
As crazy as that sounds to havethem as your neighbor, we had
(52:01):
ample evidence that they werethere, not only the sightings
but footprints, hair gosh, thesegiant knee impressions.
We walked away with a lot ofphysical evidence from this
place, including our sightings,and it was never to the point
where we were worried about them.
(52:24):
We were kind of worried aboutthe phenomena that seemed to be
attached to them or that theywould attract, and this would be
the poltergeist activity, orwhat people call the hitchhiker
effect, where the supernaturalstuff follows you home, sure,
and it appears like apoltergeist activity.
So, but the big, the Bigfootstuff in general, you know, when
(52:45):
you're looking into it, whenyou're going into the woods,
when you're, let's just say, youbelieve this is a flesh and
blood issue, I think it willkind of present itself to you.
That way, you kind of get whatyou're looking for to a degree,
but eventually you're going tohave your mind blown with these
doggone lights that appearwithin the proximity of where
(53:05):
you're having Bigfoot action.
And this would be theseplasmoids, these orbs that
appear near them, and I hope I'mnot blowing too many minds away
, but this is the thing, likeyou just got to get used to it.
When you're looking intoBigfoot, you're looking into the
supernatural.
Speaker 2 (53:22):
And I think a lot of the time where we've had
researchers come on, and it'sbeen a while since we've had you
come on.
Um, it's been forever sincewe've had um uh the voice.
Um, he really should be the uhthe voice, the voice of the us
phenomenon, but um, why can't?
Uh, the sierra sounds um ohmorehead yeah ron ron, yeah, um,
(53:43):
it's been forever.
And those stories that you know,that he's shared, you've shared
, um, the native americancomponent, the first nations
component, to to a lot of this,uh, these stories that were
shared from you know thathaven't been told by the Native
Americans, where they werecoalesced, working with
(54:04):
Sasquatch or had some type of.
I've heard this from you, knowfrom others that are out there
you know, sharing theirdifferent versions of these
different stories, and it'sinteresting to me how the
community that is involved or isin search of the elusive
Bigfoot, engulfed, or is insearch of the elusive Bigfoot,
(54:25):
how some can't coalesce or worktogether.
It's like I don't, I don't,like you know what I mean, like
I don't understand, like it'sokay, I guess let me put it to
you this way I know there's DJsout here and you know right.
It's like the same thing, it'slike the same thing.
It's like you're hating on thethe other DJ.
You're like.
Oh man he the way he spun thatsong does suck.
(54:47):
He didn't play it right, so Iguess that I, I can relate to
that piece.
But I always tell everyone I'mlike dude, we're on the same
thing, like who gives a care.
Speaker 3 (55:08):
Yeah, you know, it's just interesting to me.
It's pandering for relevanceand it strikes um easiest to the
male ego, which is generallypretty frag, fragile, right, and
um, you know this phenomena,once you find out it's real,
it's kind of like finding, um,you know sauron's ring and lord
of the rings just like, can youbury the bear?
The weight of what thisphenomenon is, cause it goes to
(55:29):
your ego, it goes to your thenature of how you will handle
these God-like abilities.
Right, like you're witnessingsuperpowers happen before you,
something that shouldn't exist.
Now you know it exists.
It's a type of responsibility.
(55:50):
But then your ego is just like,well, I want to be the one, I
want, I'm the most relevant, I,it's the same with, I'm sure
with the dj.
Just like, oh no, I'm gonnaspin that rick assley in a way
that nobody's heard it before.
Speaker 2 (55:58):
For sure, for sure, we're gonna rickroll you really
well yeah um, before we, beforewe get out of, I want to ask you
a couple things, something thatI've noticed when I've been out
in the woods, eitheroff-roading, looking for a
sunset, for a romantic sunset orwhatever and it's been a while
since I've done that but ifyou're out there and you see
(56:19):
stacks of rocks, what does thatmean to an individual, like
someone who may be out herehiking, who's just a hiker, but
they're starting to see rockformations or sticks that are
like lined up back to back toback?
Um, what are we telling?
What are we?
What should we share with our,our listening audience or
viewing audience?
What?
(56:39):
What are we seeing here?
What are?
What is this?
Speaker 3 (56:42):
well, not everything that looks interesting in the
forest is.
Weather does some crazy stuff.
I've got friends that look forstuff on the forest floor and
they swear that it's some kindof archaic stick, latin, or
glyphs, as they call them.
Those things do exist, but inthe forest they better be pretty
dang impressive.
The one thing I do look for arebig branches that have been
(57:07):
laid up against the tree, thatare in groups, like a bunch of
big branches grouped together,leaning up against a tree and
maybe going in a direction.
To me that's interesting,especially if you can follow up
on it and see that more limbsare added or taken away over a
period of time.
(57:27):
Those are the kind of thingsthat would happen to us at the
Al Moon Lab, and it ended upwith sightings, tracks, multiple
people having experiences, andso I think there's something to
what we would call leaners.
Speaker 2 (57:42):
Because you know, when you're out there and I get
the weather piece, but when youfind, when you're finding rocks
stacked up in it, like in aformation, weather's not doing
that.
You know what I mean.
Speaker 3 (57:53):
It's like well and, but those are karens too,
because hikers leave those asway points and turning points.
I guess you're right.
And so if you get to a summityou'll find what's called a rock
karen and then, and then, ifyou go to the summit, people add
to the cairn kind of deal.
But people also do those fortaking a wrong turn, like people
(58:14):
that are up to no good sometimewill leave these markers that
other people won't notice, likerocks, and that means turn right
to go, drop off your bag ofcontraband or pick up the
satchel of money.
So those are things too thatpeople do.
Speaker 2 (58:28):
So when you're out here, if you're hiking or if
you're looking for a Bigfoot, beprepared, right.
I mean clearly that's numberone.
You've got to be out here inthe element, especially right
now, this time of season.
It's unfortunate.
My thoughts go out to the twofamily members of the two
individuals that have passed Atthe end of the day Tobe be
(58:54):
prepared, man.
I mean carry a gun, you know.
Be, carry your bear spray forme, you know, if I'm out here in
the, in the city, I mean Idon't, don't know, man, it might
be rougher in the city than itis out in the country yeah, I
don't envy that man.
Speaker 3 (59:11):
I'd much rather take my chances in the sticks than in
some places I've been over, youknow in pierce county there is
um.
Speaker 2 (59:20):
There's an app that I used, um, it's called the
citizens app and um.
So I know I'm gettingnotifications of stuff that's
going on when I'm wherever I'mat within my geotag.
So like, let's say, I go tocostco and they're like hey,
there's a guy who just atgunpoint to a mile and a half
(59:42):
down the street, I'm like oh mygosh, because I'm not one who is
packing a gun into costco,right, you know, that's just not
me well, even if you had a gun,that's still scary just to be
involved with it, right?
right, I don't even want to seethat kind of stuff so I was like
, oh, do I need to abandon mycostco shopping cart to head
home, to get out of harm's way?
(01:00:04):
Clearly they caught the guy,they arrested him, blah, blah,
blah.
But take the precautions, likeyou said.
Download Audix, not the band,not the hip-hop artist band.
Do you remember that band Slam?
Speaker (01:00:18):
Da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da , the boys.
Speaker 2 (01:00:20):
Yes, okay, good, I'm glad when you said that, it made
me go to that in my head.
So, um, that's how, that's howyoung we are.
And um, again, as as we wrapthings up here from the pacific
northwest, uh, tobe, uh, what doyou tell these individuals out
here who, uh, want to be avidSasquatch researchers and
(01:00:45):
enthusiasts?
Speaker 3 (01:00:47):
Well, they can show up at a local event that I have
in Port Townsend, washington,every third Wednesday at the
Anchor Saloon at 628 WaterStreet.
We meet there from 7 to close.
It's a 21-over environment.
Once a month, the 15th ofJanuary, we're going to be
(01:01:07):
talking about abductions.
We're going to have a guy onfrom Zoom, from Skinwalker Ranch
, and an actual abductee fromPort Townsend talking about
their case Not Sasquatch, we'retalking of the ET kind, and then
each month it changes fromsubject to subject, so not
always just Bigfoot.
However, I am kind of theBigfoot guy there.
(01:01:28):
There's other Bigfoot peoplethat show up and that would be a
good place to start networkingwith other like minds.
The other thing you can do ifyou're interested in going out
in the woods is, you know, seeif you can go out in the woods
and stand it.
You know, as far as like hearingstrange stuff, you don't
(01:01:50):
necessarily want to be out inthe woods at night hearing
strange stuff right in thebeginning.
Just take it easy, you knowwhat I mean.
Like if you're coming in fromthe city and you want to get out
in the woods and go into, likeI don't know green water or out
to a lull like we're talking,talking about you don't have to
go that far, um, and then gocheck out, uh, some of these um
museums like go to cliff'smuseum and see the evidence for
(01:02:13):
yourself and and judge foryourself.
And see the size of a sasquatch, see if you want to see one,
because generally eight feet islike the average height.
You know, I built a replica outin forks, washington, at
sasquatch the legend museum.
He's called biggie.
He's eight and a half feet talland about three and a half feet
(01:02:33):
wide at the shoulders.
So do you really want to seesomething like that in the
daytime or the night?
Speaker 2 (01:02:39):
right, uh, you also do artwork.
I know that you recently had.
You have some of your artworkthat is for sale, so make sure,
if you have a chance, go totobes facebook page.
Speaker 3 (01:02:49):
You still have that available, right I'm a chainsaw
carver so I do bigfoot heads alot of them yeah, and you were
still.
Speaker 2 (01:02:56):
You did those, already sell the ones that you
had I, yeah, I sell out everytime I create them.
I've made three today andthey're already gone all right,
well, well, never, never mindthen, so don't go to, well you?
Speaker 3 (01:03:08):
can go check out Facebook Wood Watchers Wood
Watchers on Facebook and you canlook at the profile.
Speaker 2 (01:03:16):
Awesome Again, tobe.
It's always fun to have youcome on and talk about this
stuff.
It's unfortunate that it is inregards to two researchers that
were enthusiasts looking for theelusive bigfoot and they lost
their lives to uh, to the, tothe inclement weather yeah
excuse me, excuse me exposureexposure yeah that's what they
(01:03:41):
died of, that's what they saidright of.
So if you're out here and youhave information, feel free to
send me a text 775-990-5151.
We'd love to have you come onand share what information you
might have.
If you don't follow us, pleasedo so.
You can download the podcast ifyou're watching us.
You're watching us throughYouTube, twitch or instagram, uh
(01:04:06):
or facebook, however that playsout for you.
You can go to uh my website todownload the podcast on air
mariocom.
Click on the podcast link tosubscribe to the podcast.
Uh, for my entire team.
Uh, mark christopher sophiamagana.
Again, tobe, thank you so muchfor coming to hang out with us.
Speaker 3 (01:04:24):
Yeah, thank you, mario.
Speaker 2 (01:04:26):
As I always say, be sure to look up at the sky,
cause you never know what youmight see.
Good night, he's gone.
Welcome to US Phenomenon, where possibilities
are endless.
Put down those same oldheadlines.
It's time to expand your mindand question what if?
From paranormal activity toUFOs, bigfoot sightings and
unsolved mysteries, this is USPhenomenon?
Speaker 2 (00:21):
From the Pacific Northwest in the shadow of the
1962 World's Fair, the space youknow.
Good evening, good morning,good afternoon.
Wherever you are on God's greenearth, I'm your host, mario
Magana.
This is US Phenomenon, where weexplore the extraordinary and
the unexplained.
We're discussing the shockingnews about the two hikers that
went missing in search of theelusive Bigfoot Sasquatch.
(00:45):
Our guest, tove Johnson, is awell-known figure in the realm
of Bigfoot research.
With his deep passion forexploring the mysteries of the
natural world, johnson hasdedicated years to meticulously
investigating and documentingthe elusive creature known as
Bigfoot.
His journey began with aprofound fascination for the
(01:07):
unknown and a desire to uncoverthe truth behind these countless
sightings reported globally.
Johnson's approach combinesscientific rigor with
open-minded curiosity, allowinghim to navigate the complexities
of his field with skepticismand wonder.
(01:27):
In addition to his field work,he's also an accomplished author
, with a book called the al moonlab a paranormal experience
receiving widespread acclaim.
Through his research andwritings, tobe johnson continues
to inspire fellow researchersand enthusiasts, inviting us all
to question the unknown andembrace the wonder of the
(01:49):
natural world.
It is my pleasure to welcomeback to us phenomenon tobe
johnson.
Speaker 3 (01:55):
Welcome back to the show man that bio dude is
straight out of ai.
There ain't no way I'm thatcool, no, yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:05):
Hey man, you know when you when you, when you do,
when you produce the show andhave to do produce, host and
everything else.
It's kind of nice to have ahelp out once in a while.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
I like it OK, great, so I'm glad to be here.
Thanks for having me on.
Speaker 2 (02:21):
You know it's interesting to me about these
two hikers that have gonemissing.
I know there's tons to me aboutthese two hikers that have gone
missing.
I know there's tons of reportsout there, uh, what we do know
is that two that these twohikers were um out looking for
bigfoot um, so both of these mentragically passed away in the
gifford uh pincho nationalforest.
Now there are there are so manydifferent records or reports
(02:46):
out here.
One guy was 37.
The other guy was 59.
What do you know so far inregards to what information we
have up to this point?
Speaker 3 (03:00):
I really don't know anything.
That's going to be news to thelistening audience?
I don't think.
But the unfortunate part for melet's just start with a little
bit of griping, then we'll getinto what's going on.
The unfortunate part to me isthis story broke nationally all
(03:23):
over right, like Reuters got it,everyone got it because it had
the word Bigfoot attached to theunfortunate death of two
individuals that you know had anuntimely event happen to them
out in a very interestingsquatchy area, skamania County
Also, where Ted, I almost saidtax and gouge me, but Ted
(03:46):
Kulangoski, the old governor,put down an order.
Basically, you can't kill aBigfoot, kind of as a lark, I
think, for a family member,maybe his daughter, if I
remember correctly.
And so, but it is an actualorder in Skamania County that
you cannot kill a Bigfoot orharass a Bigfoot.
Or harass a bigfoot, I think,um, and I don't know if that is
(04:08):
necessarily the case anywhereelse in the united states.
So here, these guys are freshout of portland, from what I
read, and they were going inthere, I believe, on christmas
eve or around that time, I think, maybe just a day trip and
they're supposed to be back.
They didn't come back and thensearch and rescue got involved,
(04:30):
and the interesting orperplexing part for me is the
fact A that the names have notbeen released.
We were talking a little bitabout that, mario.
Speaker 2 (04:40):
Right.
Speaker 3 (04:40):
That does strike me as something that's ordinary.
That does strike me assomething that's ordinary.
I was talking to a deputyex-deputy sheriff, rich Germeau,
who's also a witness out herein the Olympic Peninsula, used
to work the beat in La Push,washington.
He was saying when they don'trelease the names like that,
(05:03):
that there's something moregoing on to the story.
Speaker 2 (05:04):
So for those who are listening or maybe watching,
we're going to pull up a reallynice map here in just a few
seconds.
But to kind of paint thepicture and kind of for those
that may be driving or listeningto the podcast, the Gifford
Pinchot National Forest islocated in southern Washington,
which covers 1.3 million acres.
(05:26):
That's a lot of forest.
Now this is tucked in from thecolumbia river up through mount
adams and mount rainier nationalvolcano monument.
Now what's interesting to meabout that whole city?
That's dense forest man, hugedense forest.
Right, I mean, you're talking.
Let me pull this map up for ushere.
We're talking about a map andas we look at this, it is
(05:51):
profoundly so dense in this area.
Now, according to the reports,they were down here in Willard
Washington.
Now they were on the OklahomaRoad.
I believe this is the road outhere.
Speaker 3 (06:04):
Yes, right, yes Right .
Speaker 2 (06:06):
Yes, yeah.
But what's interesting to me,that this doesn't even seem like
the information that was givento everyone seems too vague to
me, as you're, as I'm startingto do the research myself to
look at this map which hasBigfoot sightings.
I'm like this to me, tobdoesn't look like there's.
You know, we're just talkingabout a road that hits up.
(06:35):
But if I mean how many miles, Imean this is you know, maybe
you know five, ten miles up theroad.
I mean you got to get in here,did like do some serious hiking.
Now if I pull up the map, if Ipull out from the map here, we
can start to see some of theseBigfoot sightings here on the
map.
But what's interesting to me isthat this area, the topography
(06:56):
is wild.
I mean we got dense forest, youhave elevation, drastic
elevation changing.
But as we continue to pull themap completely out, you start to
see the hot spots here of allthe different sightings of
Bigfoot, even including upthrough the Rainier.
I mean this is hot stuff, man.
It's pretty interesting to mewhen you start to pull all the
(07:19):
way out, when you start to seethe hotbeds and where these guys
are hanging out at.
Speaker 3 (07:25):
Mario, can you go back to Oklahoma Road again?
I'm just seeing something therethat's kind of interesting.
Nothing per se to do, whatwould happen there, but an
anomaly of sorts If you can gonorth even more to where you
were.
Keep going, keep going.
Higher, higher, higher Oklahomathere.
(07:47):
See those go up a littlefarther to see the dice that
rolled there in the forest offto the left.
Yeah, up here.
No, over here, look to the left.
There's no keep going left,more, more left in the forest.
Speaker 2 (08:00):
Oh yeah, see those guys.
Speaker 3 (08:01):
Yeah yeah, oh yeah.
See those dice.
Yeah yeah, that's.
That's interesting to me.
I don't know what that means Ifloggers just do that.
That you know.
(08:22):
Here's the deal is that we couldget really conspiratorial about
what the Forest kind of thingsthat I look for when I'm looking
for hot spots.
Not only you know is this agreat resource?
This may be.
What brought them to this areawas a recent report on a map
like this.
It could have very well beensomething you know that they
heard about.
Maybe a family member had anexperience.
(08:43):
The thing is that we shouldknow and not just in a nosy way.
The police should end any kindof speculation or conspiratorial
stuff by releasing the namesand say you know, unfortunately
these guys got wet and cold,they had hypothermia.
Don't do the same.
This area is very dangerous.
(09:04):
There's obviously some creeksthat we had to cross to get
there right.
Um, and I find that odd toothat they crossed a creek, at
least one.
Um, the search and rescue did.
At least they had a ladder out.
They crossed a creek.
Um, and what were these guysdoing in a snow drift area for a
(09:24):
day?
Hike, crossing creeks, lookingfor Bigfoot?
That's a little bit.
That's strange to me.
I wouldn't do it unless I knewthat there was something on the
other side of that creek that Ihad to get to it's.
It's just too hard to crosscreeks in the wet and cold like
that unless you're wearing likereally big muck boots that are
neoprene.
So that's a little bit odd.
(09:48):
But people do stuff in the woodsthat they shouldn't do and they
think they can get away with it.
I've been lost in the woods.
It's a horrible feeling.
The first thing that happens toyou is you panic and you have
to talk yourself out of notpanicking.
And if you're with anotherperson and they're trusting on
(10:08):
you as being the guy that getsthem in and out, it becomes
really embarrassing.
So now you have the panic andthe shame.
So this like strikes home to me.
The few times I've been lost,both of those emotions came over
me.
And the shame right like themovie with Anthony Hopkins and
(10:28):
Alec Baldwin called the Edge.
There's this scene in therewhere they get lost in the
Alaska wilderness and they havethis bear chasing them.
And you know, anthony Hopkinsturns to the Baldwin character
and says you know, it's not theelements that will kill you,
it's the shame that you've beenoutsmarted by the wilderness,
(10:50):
and that's absolutely true.
And if you don't have your witsabout you, you can get turned
around really quick in the densebrush and we can talk about
ways that I've overcome thosehurdles, so I don't ever get
lost again, if you want to yes,definitely for sure.
Speaker 2 (11:07):
Yeah, what's interesting to me about this
whole situation?
A1, just like you were saying,uh, just a few minutes ago about
why they didn't haven'treleased the names of these two
individuals, um, what's is thisdoes?
Is this more of a crime scenethat we're looking at now?
Was there?
Why didn't they just say thisis where they were at?
It's the same thing as thegentleman that went missing in
(11:28):
2020, sam DeBolle, who was anavid hiker, who went missing in
the Mowich Lake, mother Mountain, over by Mount Rainier.
He was over in this area, in avery dense, uh, very dense area
on the mother mountain trail and, uh, this was during october
(11:50):
and he, uh the.
The last thing they saw of himwas his water bottle and nothing
else was found of the gentleman.
So he's been, he's been, not,he has not been found.
So if he's fallen into acrevasse, um, what's interesting
?
There's nothing to be found.
But they definitely releasedhis name.
But in this case, it doesstrike me that the information
(12:14):
on these two gentlemen has notbeen released.
Speaker 3 (12:18):
And I don't know if families have wishes to not
release the name.
Does that bypass what the stateand the sheriff's office do
with the names?
I don't know how any of thatworks.
Legality, yeah, um, I didn't, Ididn't check into it, but
generally the names, eventuallyum, are released right, like if
(12:39):
you follow Politi's work on 411,missing 411, there's usually
names attached.
Right when he gets on youtubehe brings up very specific
information.
Um, but, yeah, I mean anybodylistening to this right now.
I mean you can get in touchwith mario or myself.
Um, I'd like to hear more.
You can reach out to me on onfacebook under the same name,
(13:01):
tobe johnson, or reach out to meover at olympicstrangedays at
gmailcom.
I'd like to know more aboutwhat the protocol is for state
and local law enforcementregarding releasing the names of
people that are missing orpresumed dead.
Speaker 2 (13:21):
So, tobe, you were talking a few minutes ago about
getting lost in the woods, butwhen you go out to do your
research, in, in, in the wintertime, I'm assuming you do this
all year round.
I'm assuming that maybe maybe.
Speaker 3 (13:34):
Yeah, I've been on the phone all day planning a
trip for tomorrow.
Speaker 2 (13:38):
Yeah, um, yeah, in regards to this, I mean,
obviously, inclement weather.
This is definitely.
I mean, anywhere you go thistime of season, the weather can
switch on a dime on you.
What do you tell most of these?
I don't want enthusiasts,amateur Bigfoot researchers,
(14:02):
someone out there looking forthe elusive creature.
I want them to be prepared.
I know that this is notsomething that typically happens
a lot, but it seems that peopleare still going hiking this
ain't 2020, and everyone's likeokay, I'm going to get a
backpack on and I'm going out inthe woods, but there are a lot
more avid hikers in here in thePacific Northwest.
(14:23):
What are we telling individualsto do and what are you
preparing yourself to do whenyou go out into those and into
these areas?
Speaker 3 (14:33):
well, um, the first thing I would suggest people
doing is research where you'regoing and what the weather is
going to be this time of year,because things change so
drastically and there's washoutsall over out here in the
Olympic Peninsula so you may notget to where you're going, but
what?
What happens if you get to thearea and there's a washout or a
(14:54):
down tree and you can't getyourself out and you're 30 miles
in the backcountry without acell phone signal.
So these are all the thingsthat I think of, because these
have either happened or I'veheard of them happening.
And so this time of year youneed some things with you that
you don't necessarily need inthe summer as a rule, but the
(15:16):
big one is presume you're goingto get wet and cold and always
have a change of gear with youand a tote, and that tote is
going to be like a Costco sizetote for $6.99 and you're going
to stick it in your trunk andyou're going to make it your
priority tote that has all yourgear in it, a change of clothes,
you know, any kind of survivalgear that you need, as far as
(15:39):
like a little Coleman stove, acouple little snacks in there
may not be enough, so I wouldjust go ahead and get the freeze
dried one for $8.99.
All this stuff can be bought onAmazon, by the way.
And then the big one is achainsaw.
You can get a little tinybattery operated chainsaw to
keep in your truck.
That chainsaw is not only goingto help you, maybe, get out of
(16:00):
an area, but it can also helpyou create a fire really quickly
if you need to, if you arestuck on the side of the road
and there's a you know that'ssuch a.
We were talking earlier aboutthe shame element.
I want to drive this point homeagain because it's so important
.
If you feel like you're winningthe battle against the cold
with a fire, that's a huge egoboost for you for the night and
(16:24):
chances are you're not going tobe out there more than a night.
Now, if you're away from yourcar and your tote's back in your
vehicle, then you need to havesome of this stuff in your pack,
a way to keep yourself warm andalert and dry.
So you need a day pack to bringwith you out on these, even a
(16:45):
day hike.
You also need protection ofsome kind.
I would prefer something smallthat you can keep in your pocket
and keep things at a distancefrom you, right?
Those are the kind of thingsthat I have in my pocket, as
well as bear spray and otherthings like that.
I've I've had to use theseitems to keep people at bay and
animals at bay, and you, youknow it's something that you
(17:07):
don've had to use these items tokeep people at bay and animals
at bay, and you know it'ssomething that you don't
necessarily ever want to have touse.
Speaker 2 (17:13):
But Lord fear if you need it and you don't have it,
but the big one, go ahead, goahead.
I was going to say you said youhad to use it on animals and
people, so you're saying you'rerunning into other individuals
that may be.
Are we talking these like what?
Are these the feral people outthere in the woods?
Speaker 3 (17:31):
No.
So I do a lot of solo, remotecamping on abandoned roads that
lead into the high country ofthe Olympic Peninsula, right.
So in this incident, around2.30 in the morning, I had some
individuals show up and throwtheir high beams on at me about
you know, 20 to 30 yards away,and they just sat there in their
(17:52):
truck.
And so if you present the factthat you're not just, you know
going to be a bystander waitingto get abused, then people tend
to back up.
And so who knows what thatwould have turned into had I,
you know not had a secondamendment approach to the whole
thing.
It may have been me as a victimthat died of uh or disappeared,
(18:13):
who knows.
Or just you know what I mean.
Like I don't want those kind ofconditions when I'm out to
explore the beauty.
I don't want to deal with that,but there are feral people out
in the woods.
I just took a report up here onthe Elwha River of a guy that
(18:35):
ran into three feral individualsin the high, remote country
that were coming down as thoughthey had lived in the winter up
in this area where it snows, andI said, well, what did they
look like?
And he's just like well, it waskind of like the hills have eyes
and they look like they hadresources.
And I said, well, what do youmean by resources?
Just like they had gear.
But you could tell that they'dbeen out there for months and we
(18:59):
didn't exchange words.
So I'm going to go meet withthis guy next week and get his
story, because it is interestingto me, not only because of the
Bigfoot thing, but the very factthat we do have individuals
that aren't necessarily homelessor in crisis.
They've chosen a different path, kind of like the Alaskan bush
people perhaps, and they liveout in the woods and they
(19:23):
probably are a-okay in somedegrees, but you never know it's
kind of interesting when youtalk about that, because there's
a lot of stuff that doesn't gettalked about.
Speaker 2 (19:34):
Doing my research, continuing to do my
investigation work, stilllooking through the information
freedom act in regards to thepeople that have gone missing in
the national parks and I knowthat there's already someone out
there who does a fantastic jobbut really just to try to find
more information about certainindividuals that have gone
missing locally here in town.
Uh, like the assistantprofessor, every, I mean, I've
(19:56):
done a show about this guy forlike the last couple years.
Every october we talk aboutthis guy that has gone missing,
but there's nothing to be foundof him except for his water
bottle.
I'm like, where did his tent go?
Where did his clothes go?
Where did he go?
Did he?
You know, these are things thatI think about.
Uh, not to get off on a tangent, but like you know how many
(20:20):
feral people are living in thenational park, you know what I
mean.
It's it's not talked about,it's not really talked about and
as, as you know, as people talk, as you you know, are sharing
your experiences out about thesedifferent individuals, people
coming to mess with you, or, youknow, you being able to protect
yourself in in in your, whileyou're doing your research.
It's almost a hazard for you.
(20:41):
Not only is the inclementweather a hazard, but it's also
individuals that could behazardous to you as well.
In this case, with these twohikers that were pronounced
missing and then eventuallypronounced dead.
I mean, we're talking, you knowsome resources that were put in
60 people in search for thesetwo individuals.
(21:02):
You know them crossing a creekwith a ladder.
It seemed like they weredefinitely deep in the woods.
But, man, I can't imagine if Iwas out there doing research
looking for Bigfoot, andeverybody knows well.
I make it known that I'm likeyou're not going to see me out
there researching it.
There are plenty of otherpeople to do it and I'm not that
(21:23):
great of an avid hiker.
I've already been spooked.
I don't.
I don't carry a secondamendment.
I probably should.
Um, I believe in it.
But what's interesting to me is,like the times that I've gone
up, you know, you know back, youknow going off-roading and
things of that nature in thesummer, looking for a sunset
over mount by mount, rainier,the things that I've seen were
(21:44):
plenty enough to make me to getthe hell out.
Now, was it Bigfoot, was it?
You know feral people, I don'tknow.
But to see rocks stacked in acertain way, sticks put on the
national, whatever the ForestService Road, you know where
you're going, through the gatesand whatnot, but I'm like why am
I finding more?
Whatever the forest serviceroad, you know where you're
(22:04):
going through, the gates andwhatnot, but I'm like why am I?
Why am I finding more?
Why am I finding wood sticksbunched up together?
I'm like clearly somebody doesnot want us continuing up the
road.
Um, have you ever encounteredanything like that?
Speaker 3 (22:20):
yeah, there's a really strange case.
I'll'll tell you real quick.
It'll take me a few minuteshere.
But in an area called theFrench Pete Wilderness in Oregon
I used to live in a little townof Springfield, oregon, and
outside of Spring.
First it was a physicsprofessor from the University of
(22:46):
Oregon.
His name was Professor Xing Zhu.
All they found of his in theFrench Pete wilderness was, I
believe, his leather backpack.
About three to four years latera guy by the name of Jake Dutton
, retired Coast Guard, wentmissing in the exact same area.
Lower part of the trail hadfrench peat wilderness.
Nonetheless, jake dutton had abackground, um, I believe he was
(23:10):
a coast guard reservist, so hedefinitely had cold weather
background.
Young guy I think he lived ineugene.
Um, he was planning on justdoing maybe an overnight or two
and was going into the backcountry.
Never found um went missing formaybe two to three years.
The mother drove all the waydown from portland oregon, put a
(23:31):
sign that she made herself onthe trailhead sign and said my
son, um, was killed undermysterious circumstances, I
think.
Uh, and you know, there's nobody that was ever found.
And here the mother came downand wrote that.
So we went up there to look forJake and didn't find him.
(23:51):
But we found out that a friendof ours actually found his skull
on top of a fern.
Now, jake's body was so farback at a hidden area that three
to three years had passed, Ibelieve, since he went missing.
So you have all that snow, youhave all that weather, a lot of
(24:14):
heavy snow, a lot of heavycurrent coming down the creek,
turning it into a river.
Now his skull was placed on topof a fern by the creek.
His shoes were tied and placedby his backpack.
They were unopened and therewas no weathering.
That was really noted.
Uh, from the report from mybuddy that had found this, not
(24:38):
not so much body, but had foundjake's skull, of course he was
interviewed as a possiblesuspect.
He wasn't, uh and um.
So my point about this is isthat they ruled jake stutton
died of exposure and there's noway to know what happened to
(24:58):
jake, because there was nothingleft except the top of his skull
cap and his skull to me seemsas though it was placed there
for someone to find it, becauseyou don't have three winters
rolling by and have a bleachedwhite skull cap set on top of a
fern Sure, um, and the shoeswere sitting next to one another
(25:19):
and tied and there was no,there was no attempt of rescue
on Jake's part to get in hisbackpack, um, so that those are
the kinds of weird things I'vebeen a part of.
Uh, those are, you know,stories near my bigfoot areas
where I've had really strangestuff happen, and so when people
(25:40):
start putting in, I mean I knowlike polities doesn't like to
put the the category of sSasquatch involved with these
things here, but I'll just saythat these are individuals,
these are not fake, they're notphony, these are very real
phenomena.
I've seen one and they come asindividuals do, and I think that
(26:04):
they're capable of greatindividual personalities, and so
I don't bet totally back awayfrom the fact that if someone
goes missing and has ruled out,you know, a death from exposure,
that they actually died ofexposure.
I don't know what happened toJake Duttons.
Maybe a serial killer got him,maybe some crazed, lunatic,
(26:26):
feral person got him.
But that's kind of what bigfootis to me.
I've never had a run in them,run in with them, where I was
scared for my life.
It's always been veryinquisitive.
Uh, it's almost like teenagepranksters, like frat boy
personality stuff, sure, um, andthere seems to be a real
(26:46):
genuine type of like, humanityand kindness to them and so.
But there is these otherqualities.
I don't know what's all out inthe woods it could.
Speaker 2 (26:55):
It's a very strange world and when you talk about
his shoes being there, if he wasstill in his shoes wouldn't,
wouldn't his feet still be?
Speaker 3 (27:08):
the remains of his feet still be in the shoe, you
know predation and weather, uh,are big factors, mario, and that
predation coyotes, sure, rats,beavers, birds, they'll all get
in there and nothing reallylasts that long in the woods.
Now you can watch time lapsevideos of predation happen to
(27:31):
like a roadkill or somethinglike that, right, but then you
know you don't see what theweather is doing and it's not in
the dense, mossy forest of thepacific northwest.
So you have that amplitude ofthings that are starving around
you on top of the weather andlike mega fauna.
You know, depleting thosethings.
So things do go very quicklybut you still find bones, like I
(27:54):
found, yeah, very old bones outin the woods and they're intact
yeah, that was my thing.
Speaker 2 (28:01):
I was like, well, I wonder if there were still bones
, uh, other than the skull cap,that what you know was found.
It just it's, it's, just it's.
And I think the one thing thatI really wanted to bring to the
attention of our listeners whoare out here I don't know so
much.
I know that there are avidhunters out here, there are
people that do enjoy hiking Justa quick reminder that hey, if
(28:22):
you're going to be out here inthe element, make sure you are
protected, wearing yourprotective gear.
We'll have links if you needstuff, but clearly you're not.
You're not getting yourexpertise from me but, um,
because, lord knows, you know Idon't do a lot of.
You know I'm my urban, my urbanhiking is out, you know, trying
(28:42):
to.
You know, fend someone off thirdavenue over there, off of third
and pike oh yeah, wild yeah um,but so you know tobe, when we
talk about these, thesesituations, these two
individuals, let's, let's godown the let's go down the
rabbit hole, uh, if we can.
(29:02):
In regards to what do you thinkif you were to put yourselves
in their shoes, what in the hellwere you thinking about doing
near christmas time?
What you know it would like it?
No one says they were they.
You know family members.
I mean, it is so vague inregards to what, actually, what
their knowledge was to you knowwho?
(29:23):
Were they related to each other?
Were they just two guys outhere trying to do a documentary
and try to submit it to you orsomebody else?
I know that you're not a part ofthis, but there's so many
people trying to make a quickdollar.
Were these guys trying to do abook?
Bigfoot Only Fans I have youknow.
Was it Bigfoot Fetish?
I have no idea in regards towhy, so close to the holidays,
(29:46):
would you think someone would beout here doing this type of
research?
Speaker 3 (29:51):
Well, on Christmas Eve there were five friends of
mine and they all went outbigfooting.
They left their families, itwas raining, they all went up
into the woods overnight and thereason that they went is
because the night before theycaptured language and, um,
(30:12):
that's very difficult to do.
That's kind of the holy grailis like you know, you get
bigfoot tracks, you have a goodsighting, maybe you get on film,
but if you can record anunknown language from these
things, then it gets into adifferent category of what we're
talking about, because asidebar, if they have language,
they have culture and if theyhave culture it's a game changer
(30:32):
.
We're not talking aboutprimates in the typical sense,
like a relic hominid or anythinglike that.
So maybe these guys got a hitlike on the map there.
These are all cluster areasthat we're looking at, um, so if
you go down there, you can seeBigfoot tracks were found.
So there's a Bigfoot print,there's different color-coded
(30:55):
types of encounters Yellow, red,bright red, orange and then
there's auditory things toothere as well.
So they were in a hot zone.
But Scamania, the whole thing,is a hot zone and that's all you
have to do is go to SkamaniaCounty and you walk the streets
(31:19):
and you're going to see Bigfootstuff all over downtown.
You know just by over.
I don't know if you've everbeen to Skamania area, but if
you go on the Columbia RiverGorge, like you're heading
towards Benjen Washington orBeacon Rock, you'll run into
Skamania County and it's knownas a Bigfoot hotspot.
So it could very well be.
(31:41):
These guys hopped in there justto do a day trip and on a lark
they went uplahoma road and theygot into some trouble.
I don't know why they got intosome trouble.
Now here's one thing I wouldlike to ask the audience is that
I heard that the search andrescue team had their gear
(32:03):
stolen and that they're actuallynow having to crowdfund to
replace the gear.
Now, was that gear stolen onthe site?
Because if they were in thebackcountry and that gear was
stolen, that's a veryinteresting move by somebody.
It wasn't, in my opinion,unless they had Snickers or
(32:23):
something in there, it probablywasn't a bear.
They would see sign that it wasa bear.
But if their gear was takenright, maybe it was taken back
at like the search and rescueshack in portland or the dallas
or wherever they came in from,and that's maybe they just had a
break-in, but I I haven't beenable to loop that together, so
(32:43):
I'd like to know where that gearwas taken.
Speaker 2 (32:47):
That's interesting.
I did not get that report but,as I take a few seconds here to
put my thoughts together, ifthey were out looking and the
gear was stolen during thesearch and rescue, that would
lead me to believe that therewas something else out there
(33:10):
Feral people, maybe a group ofindividuals who have gone off
the grid?
Obviously the same thing, Maybenot as feral as, maybe, people
living off the grid.
Maybe it's a cluster ofSasquatch that may be more
advanced in modern dayday timesand maybe they're like Harry and
(33:32):
the Henderson, and maybe theseBigfoot were like hey, I need a
ladder and we need some tools.
Speaker 3 (33:40):
Let me finish the rest of this story about Jake
Dutton After that event, afterhis body was found.
A friend of mine by the name ofTodd Bailey and Dave S we'll
call him Dave S used to work forthe local McKinsey Fire
Department, and Todd Bailey is abig old redneck and he's never
(34:02):
been outdone by the woods ever.
And so they went out to seewhat happened to Jake Dutton, to
find out if it was somethingnefarious, and they stayed in
the area by themselves.
That night Todd fell asleepunderneath a cedar tree.
Dave hung up his hammock, likehe usually does, and that's kind
(34:23):
of protocol when we all wouldgo camping that next day.
That next morning Todd foundhimself face down, 30 yards away
from where he'd fallen asleepand his face pushed down into a
fern.
And he woke up to find that hisbody had been drenched.
(34:44):
He was wearing one pieceCarhartt uniform, like you see
on the construction crew, sure,and his entire carhartt was
soaked in urine and somethinghad peed all over him not
himself so as he, as he got upto figure out what had happened,
he found that his only backpackhad been moved and unzipped and
(35:08):
something had peed a gallon ofpee inside his backpack and then
zipped it kindly back up.
So now his change of clotheshave also been peed on.
This happened exactly whereJake Dutton, within proximity to
where Jake Dutton's body, wasfound and recovered, and so
people can believe that story ornot.
(35:29):
They can say that Todd had anaccident and then did that.
But this is the kind of highstrangeness that makes you say
things like we're not going toreport this.
It's not associated with whathappened out here to Jake.
It's a very tall tale, soundingkind of crazy story.
(35:52):
But when we get into like gearbeing stolen if it was stolen
out in the woods that becomesway more interesting to me.
If it was stolen out of thecamp shack back in the Dalles or
Trout, wherever it was kept, tr?
Um troutdale then it wasprobably a break-in.
But why not just release thenames, uh, of these people and?
(36:16):
Um the circumstances, so otherpeople don't find themselves in
that trouble?
And I don't know.
You know here this is aclose-knit, close-knit community
.
In portland there's a lot ofBigfooters in Portland.
The NABC Cliff Berkman's Museumis in Boring, oregon, right
across the Columbia River fromSkamania County.
(36:37):
I would imagine that these guysare interested in what happened
to these guys.
It's a very Bigfoot-rich area.
So is it related?
No, but the news kind of madeit related because they push the
story.
It's like sasquatch hikers gomissing and die of exposure.
It's kind of a it's obviously ahorrible thing to do because it
(37:00):
desensitizes you from thetragedy of possibly daughters
and sons and wives and brothersand sisters you know that had a
a horrible Christmas and ahorrible life, maybe.
So what I am here to say isthat there are strange things
that happen in Bigfoot areas andthey can be very creepy being
(37:34):
prepared, um, like you said,having your whereabouts about
where you're at.
Speaker 2 (37:35):
Um, all right, do you carry, like a gps unit, what is
uh, what is uh, um, politelysay to carry?
You know, he was just said thison the axe.
He said he was remindingeveryone, hey, if you're going
to be out here in the woods,make sure you have, you know,
one of those recovery you knowbeacons yeah, so that if you
know, you can put a.
Speaker 3 (37:55):
You can put a geo tracker on you so people can
watch from afar where you are.
Most phones already have thatbuilt into them.
I mean, people can find outwhere you are even if you don't
have a signal.
They can ping and andtriangulate.
You know, I dropped an air tagin the middle of the Umpqua
National Forest and I was ableto track it and that wasn't
(38:17):
around anything.
You know what I mean.
So that's like a $29 littlething that you can put in your
pocket.
That's the first thing I woulddo is go buy an air tag
immediately put it in yourbackpack and forget about it and
give your girlfriend or yourwife or your kids you know a way
to track you right so you cansee where you're going.
(38:39):
The other thing I would do iscarry um a cell phone with a
subscription to onyx, o-n-xx.
Onyx, you can download digitalmaps.
As long as you have a signalwhere Onyx is on your smartphone
or your AirPad or whatever, youcan get yourself out of the
woods.
(38:59):
It'll tell you exactly whereyou left and how to get back out
of there what kind of terrain.
I purposely got myself lost inthe woods in the last two months
since I bought it to see if itwill work and it hasn't failed
me yet tells you where the sideroads are, how to get to the old
logging road, how to get backto your truck.
That's what you want to do, isyou got to get back to your
(39:22):
vehicle and you got to get to amain road, and that that's a way
.
And the other last thing I wouldsay is carry flagging tape.
It's like 299 at home depot.
It's the stuff you see hangingin trees when loggers go there.
It comes in a roll.
You stick that next to onyx.
You're never going to get lost.
You just hang that with aneyesight as you're walking into
(39:45):
a trail and you can't miss it.
You can see it at night.
You can also get littlereflectors that look like
thumbtacks.
You can make them at home.
You can buy reflector tape, putthem on a thumbtack, spend an
hour doing it, or go on Amazonand just look up reflective
thumbtacks and you stick thoseon a tree and so as you're
walking in, they're always onthe same side of the tree or the
(40:07):
branch and as you come out itlooks like a street.
You know heading down throughthe forest with your headlamp,
and the other thing, too, is aheadlamp.
Headlamp and extra batteries.
That'll save the day if you canhave a bright flashlight or
headlamp Preferably a headlamp,so you can use your hands.
Speaker 2 (40:25):
When you go out to do research, you have a favorite
hot spot, do you like?
Is there a place that you enjoygoing the most during the
winter time, the summertime?
What's your all-time favoritelocation to go?
Looking for the illusion?
Speaker 3 (40:40):
I know I want to go looking for the mini hoonie in
hawaii.
That's the ultimate goal thelittle people, the little people
in Hawaii in board shorts.
But if I can't make that happen, my PayPal account is no.
If I can't make that happen, myfavorite place to go as far as
like the productivity of theaction right the big phenomena
(41:05):
is what's featured in ourdocumentary A Flash of Beauty is
this place called the Al MoonLab, which was this enigmatic
spot outside of Cottage Grove,oregon, where, after about 17
years of full-time research, Iended up seeing a Sasquatch for
the first time.
For the first time and havingmy mind blown in multiple ways,
(41:31):
not only through the world ofBigfoot but the
cross-pollination of thephenomena, which is largely
paranormal-based, includingpoltergeist activity, ufo
activity and everything underthe sun attached to this one
little unassuming house nearCottage Grove Lake.
Speaker 2 (41:48):
Under the sun, attached to this one little
unassuming house, um nearcottage grove lake for those who
may think of the elusivebigfoot to be, not to know of it
, to be paranormal, but to thinkof it as an indigenous to the
planet it would.
Would we say that it isindigenous to the planet, or do
(42:11):
we say that it's, uh, notindigenous to the planet?
Okay, or do?
We are there, yeah I would sayso.
Speaker 3 (42:18):
It's a lot like this ufo issue.
Is that it?
Um the?
You know the soft disclosurewith the ufo stuff?
Mario is, mario is the Bigfootdisclosure?
People don't know it yet, but noone's really saying that these
are from outer space anymore.
In fact, lou Elizondo, who'sbroken a lot of this stuff
(42:40):
through ATIP, wrote the bookEminent about disclosure coming,
basically says that these arecoming through other realms,
that they are coming through thepages in between.
So they're not from inner space, outer space, they're from the
pages in between, to quote himspecifically.
And so I think this is what theNative Americans have been
telling us here.
(43:01):
They straight up told me in2004, these things come from
between two worlds and we needto show that phenomena great
respect.
In fact, in our documentary wehave a Native American.
Tj Ravenwolf opens up a Flash ofBeauty Paranormal Bigfoot with
(43:22):
a ceremony and he looks into thefire and says forgive us for
speaking so plainly about you.
And this is the kind ofreverence that still gives me
goosebumps, because what we'retalking about is real and not
everybody who listens to thisknows that yet.
But when the ET stuff hits thefan and there's going to be like
(43:44):
a major sighting that happensover downtown seattle, you know,
maybe during a seahawks game?
Um, right, right.
Speaker 2 (43:52):
I think that's going to open people's mind up in a
way to where they look at thisbigfoot phenomena and don't see
it as a bumper sticker anymoreit was funny when, when, when
you say that you talked aboutyou know the uh a sighting, when
we were kind of skimmingthrough the uh the map there,
the uh the Bigfoot map, uh,through the you know the website
of the uh Bigfoot project here,uh, I mean, there was sightings
(44:17):
in downtown Tacoma, washington,over in the tide flats, which
was kind of quite funny to me.
I was like, oh, look at that,there's a.
I was like there's someone must, if I can get over there
quickly.
It just kind of made me laughfor a second.
I was like, oh, wow, people are, they're looking for, they're
looking, they're seeing Bigfootin these other, you know,
(44:38):
populated areas.
Speaker 3 (44:40):
Yeah Well, we would get sightings quite often right
outside of Tacoma, in KitsapCounty, in the little town of
Alala, which is really, I think,only about a 15 minute, 20
minute drive to like, uh, youknow, the close to the Tacoma
Narrows Bridge in the I-5corridor.
Yes, but there's very.
(45:00):
Look at how dense all thatbrush is like.
If we're going solely with thephysical aspect of Sasquatch
using brush as camouflage, thenbingo, how much of that is green
.
You know what I mean.
So it gets pretty dark out hereat 4 o'clock in the winter.
You walk through that green,through a suburb at 5 or 10
(45:22):
o'clock or 2 in the morning.
Speaker 2 (45:24):
And that area is still very dense, olala, that
Sedgwick Highway heading to 16,that area is very dense still
Still, really, as you said, fullof water.
I mean, look at that, there'sone right there.
Speaker 3 (45:41):
I didn't, even I didn't know that.
Yeah Well, that's what.
That was, my old backyard.
And yeah, there'd be reportsfrom not only our address of
strange things being left infront of, uh the kitchen window,
including handprints, um bricksthat were stuck in people's um
barbed wire fences, as thoughsomething went up and grabbed
(46:03):
like a garden brick.
We would have things disappearfrom the front of yard for
months at a time and then returnin the back of the yard, broken
in half.
We lived on private property onfive acres, so I don't think it
was the UPS guy.
So you know, it gets reallyinteresting really quick, like
(46:24):
if these things are comingaround and they're interested in
property or they're interestedin family groups and messing
with uh stuff around your yard.
Um, that doesn't really.
I mean that points to a type ofcuriosity, but also points to a
type of possible uh gaming.
You know, like it seems like atrick, or.
But this is what the nativeamericans said about them is
(46:46):
that they're tricksters, right,they're in the vein of the
coyote, that they're, they'rereal.
They're in the base of thetotem pole, which is where you
put the most powerful thing onthe totem pole in the pacific
northwest, from my understanding, and that sasquatch goes along
with the other natural thingsthat exist the bear, the salmon,
(47:07):
the orca, the Bigfoot.
Speaker 2 (47:13):
So many people who and I think I saw this recently
as you were doing some researchyou were showing some of these
magnificent artwork of thesetotem poles at a casino.
Was it Seven Cedars?
Is that where you were at?
Speaker 3 (47:32):
Yeah, down the street .
Speaker 2 (47:33):
Yeah, great casino to stop in at.
I'm not plugging them.
They don't pay any of the billshere, but the artwork was so
impressive.
Pay any of the bills here, but,um, the artwork was so
impressive.
And for you to like show theartwork, uh, take a look at
tobe's uh facebook page if youhave a chance to take a look at
that.
(47:54):
It's interesting because I thinka lot of us who look at totem
poles we're like, oh yeah, it'sgreat, and we, we move on with
our day.
We don't take the time toreally go over with complexity
and use our imaginations and tolook at it and examine it and
say what is that?
Why is it that way?
(48:14):
You know, what is the messagehere?
I think a lot of it is theallure of you know, we're going
to the casino, we're going to.
You know, spend money, we'regoing to hit the buffet.
We're going to the casino,we're going to.
You know, spend money, we'regoing to hit the buffet.
But what was so great on that?
Uh, that piece that you showed.
You took the time to show thatand I was like damn, how many
times have I gone to the casinoand not looked at the artwork
(48:34):
and not paid attention to whatis actually being scribed or
been?
What story is being told on thetotem pole?
Speaker 3 (48:42):
yeah, their story pulls.
I mean, I don't know the storyof what I was really showing you
, but that was the supernaturalworld totem pole.
They all had little placards onthe bottom of it and it
appeared to be a primate becauseit had the giant ears on the
side of the head, like you wouldsee with a chimp, and it had
the purse lips, which is thetonic while the whistling,
(49:04):
sasquatch, the whooping sound orthe whistle, and then it had
what appeared to be kind of likea humanoid and it's below it.
So you know, this is we need tolisten to these stories more
from the First Nations people,because they do keep a lot to
themselves, but there's acertain amount of them that are
(49:25):
open books and if you can talkto a first nations person and
they can tell you their storywith great zest and zeal, take
the opportunity to listen.
Um, they, they.
Speaker 2 (49:37):
I think they're more right than they are wrong about
bigfoot and when you, when youshared that piece about um, what
was the word that you used orthat was scribed on the on the
totem pole that it was?
oh, I think the supernaturalworld yeah, that would really go
back to what you wereexplaining and what you know.
You know lua alessandro wasexplaining to us in regards to
(50:01):
what's actually being told outhere and how these worlds are
kind of, as you're saying, goingto be brought forward, but it's
been a part of our naturalexistence.
It's been out there to thepublic for a long time.
It just hasn't been shared tothe white man because of the
First Nations, as you would say,or have kept this story or have
(50:25):
not shared the story other thanin the artwork.
Speaker 3 (50:28):
Uh, that has been you know has been carved well
before, like the industrialrevolution and the atom bomb, we
were a world of science andreligion that merged.
It was only during thecompartmentalization of the
industrial revolution and theatom bomb that we start to
bisect and silo these phenomenais not working together, but we
(50:50):
really come from a world of thesupernatural law.
Right like not the mystery, notthe folklore, like angels and
demons kind of stuff.
Right like this is the talkthroughout all religions, and so
I see that, coming back now, Imean this is what's being talked
about.
This is what Jacques Vallée,you know, talks about regularly
(51:12):
with people when he's having aglass of wine.
All of these researchers intothe hard sciences of UFOs are
all like really invested intothe supernatural consequences of
what we're looking at here, andI think the same will be true
for Bigfoot.
I supernatural consequences ofwhat we're looking at here, and
I think the same will be truefor Bigfoot.
I don't know what we're talkingabout here, but I don't put
them in the demonic category, nomore than I put us.
(51:35):
You know they're capable ofgreat, you know evil, but so are
we.
They have that kind of humanityto them.
So are we.
They have that kind of humanityto them, and I'm only saying
that because I lived with themin this little place in Cottage
Grove for about a year and ahalf.
As crazy as that sounds to havethem as your neighbor, we had
(52:01):
ample evidence that they werethere, not only the sightings
but footprints, hair gosh, thesegiant knee impressions.
We walked away with a lot ofphysical evidence from this
place, including our sightings,and it was never to the point
where we were worried about them.
(52:24):
We were kind of worried aboutthe phenomena that seemed to be
attached to them or that theywould attract, and this would be
the poltergeist activity, orwhat people call the hitchhiker
effect, where the supernaturalstuff follows you home, sure,
and it appears like apoltergeist activity.
So, but the big, the Bigfootstuff in general, you know, when
(52:45):
you're looking into it, whenyou're going into the woods,
when you're, let's just say, youbelieve this is a flesh and
blood issue, I think it willkind of present itself to you.
That way, you kind of get whatyou're looking for to a degree,
but eventually you're going tohave your mind blown with these
doggone lights that appearwithin the proximity of where
(53:05):
you're having Bigfoot action.
And this would be theseplasmoids, these orbs that
appear near them, and I hope I'mnot blowing too many minds away
, but this is the thing, likeyou just got to get used to it.
When you're looking intoBigfoot, you're looking into the
supernatural.
Speaker 2 (53:22):
And I think a lot of the time where we've had
researchers come on, and it'sbeen a while since we've had you
come on.
Um, it's been forever sincewe've had um uh the voice.
Um, he really should be the uhthe voice, the voice of the us
phenomenon, but um, why can't?
Uh, the sierra sounds um ohmorehead yeah ron ron, yeah, um,
(53:43):
it's been forever.
And those stories that you know,that he's shared, you've shared
, um, the native americancomponent, the first nations
component, to to a lot of this,uh, these stories that were
shared from you know thathaven't been told by the Native
Americans, where they werecoalesced, working with
(54:04):
Sasquatch or had some type of.
I've heard this from you, knowfrom others that are out there
you know, sharing theirdifferent versions of these
different stories, and it'sinteresting to me how the
community that is involved or isin search of the elusive
Bigfoot, engulfed, or is insearch of the elusive Bigfoot,
(54:25):
how some can't coalesce or worktogether.
It's like I don't, I don't,like you know what I mean, like
I don't understand, like it'sokay, I guess let me put it to
you this way I know there's DJsout here and you know right.
It's like the same thing, it'slike the same thing.
It's like you're hating on thethe other DJ.
You're like.
Oh man he the way he spun thatsong does suck.
(54:47):
He didn't play it right, so Iguess that I, I can relate to
that piece.
But I always tell everyone I'mlike dude, we're on the same
thing, like who gives a care.
Speaker 3 (55:08):
Yeah, you know, it's just interesting to me.
It's pandering for relevanceand it strikes um easiest to the
male ego, which is generallypretty frag, fragile, right, and
um, you know this phenomena,once you find out it's real,
it's kind of like finding, um,you know sauron's ring and lord
of the rings just like, can youbury the bear?
The weight of what thisphenomenon is, cause it goes to
(55:29):
your ego, it goes to your thenature of how you will handle
these God-like abilities.
Right, like you're witnessingsuperpowers happen before you,
something that shouldn't exist.
Now you know it exists.
It's a type of responsibility.
(55:50):
But then your ego is just like,well, I want to be the one, I
want, I'm the most relevant, I,it's the same with, I'm sure
with the dj.
Just like, oh no, I'm gonnaspin that rick assley in a way
that nobody's heard it before.
Speaker 2 (55:58):
For sure, for sure, we're gonna rickroll you really
well yeah um, before we, beforewe get out of, I want to ask you
a couple things, something thatI've noticed when I've been out
in the woods, eitheroff-roading, looking for a
sunset, for a romantic sunset orwhatever and it's been a while
since I've done that but ifyou're out there and you see
(56:19):
stacks of rocks, what does thatmean to an individual, like
someone who may be out herehiking, who's just a hiker, but
they're starting to see rockformations or sticks that are
like lined up back to back toback?
Um, what are we telling?
What are we?
What should we share with our,our listening audience or
viewing audience?
What?
(56:39):
What are we seeing here?
What are?
What is this?
Speaker 3 (56:42):
well, not everything that looks interesting in the
forest is.
Weather does some crazy stuff.
I've got friends that look forstuff on the forest floor and
they swear that it's some kindof archaic stick, latin, or
glyphs, as they call them.
Those things do exist, but inthe forest they better be pretty
dang impressive.
The one thing I do look for arebig branches that have been
(57:07):
laid up against the tree, thatare in groups, like a bunch of
big branches grouped together,leaning up against a tree and
maybe going in a direction.
To me that's interesting,especially if you can follow up
on it and see that more limbsare added or taken away over a
period of time.
(57:27):
Those are the kind of thingsthat would happen to us at the
Al Moon Lab, and it ended upwith sightings, tracks, multiple
people having experiences, andso I think there's something to
what we would call leaners.
Speaker 2 (57:42):
Because you know, when you're out there and I get
the weather piece, but when youfind, when you're finding rocks
stacked up in it, like in aformation, weather's not doing
that.
You know what I mean.
Speaker 3 (57:53):
It's like well and, but those are karens too,
because hikers leave those asway points and turning points.
I guess you're right.
And so if you get to a summityou'll find what's called a rock
karen and then, and then, ifyou go to the summit, people add
to the cairn kind of deal.
But people also do those fortaking a wrong turn, like people
(58:14):
that are up to no good sometimewill leave these markers that
other people won't notice, likerocks, and that means turn right
to go, drop off your bag ofcontraband or pick up the
satchel of money.
So those are things too thatpeople do.
Speaker 2 (58:28):
So when you're out here, if you're hiking or if
you're looking for a Bigfoot, beprepared, right.
I mean clearly that's numberone.
You've got to be out here inthe element, especially right
now, this time of season.
It's unfortunate.
My thoughts go out to the twofamily members of the two
individuals that have passed Atthe end of the day Tobe be
(58:54):
prepared, man.
I mean carry a gun, you know.
Be, carry your bear spray forme, you know, if I'm out here in
the, in the city, I mean Idon't, don't know, man, it might
be rougher in the city than itis out in the country yeah, I
don't envy that man.
Speaker 3 (59:11):
I'd much rather take my chances in the sticks than in
some places I've been over, youknow in pierce county there is
um.
Speaker 2 (59:20):
There's an app that I used, um, it's called the
citizens app and um.
So I know I'm gettingnotifications of stuff that's
going on when I'm wherever I'mat within my geotag.
So like, let's say, I go tocostco and they're like hey,
there's a guy who just atgunpoint to a mile and a half
(59:42):
down the street, I'm like oh mygosh, because I'm not one who is
packing a gun into costco,right, you know, that's just not
me well, even if you had a gun,that's still scary just to be
involved with it, right?
right, I don't even want to seethat kind of stuff so I was like
, oh, do I need to abandon mycostco shopping cart to head
home, to get out of harm's way?
(01:00:04):
Clearly they caught the guy,they arrested him, blah, blah,
blah.
But take the precautions, likeyou said.
Download Audix, not the band,not the hip-hop artist band.
Do you remember that band Slam?
Speaker (01:00:18):
Da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da , the boys.
Speaker 2 (01:00:20):
Yes, okay, good, I'm glad when you said that, it made
me go to that in my head.
So, um, that's how, that's howyoung we are.
And um, again, as as we wrapthings up here from the pacific
northwest, uh, tobe, uh, what doyou tell these individuals out
here who, uh, want to be avidSasquatch researchers and
(01:00:45):
enthusiasts?
Speaker 3 (01:00:47):
Well, they can show up at a local event that I have
in Port Townsend, washington,every third Wednesday at the
Anchor Saloon at 628 WaterStreet.
We meet there from 7 to close.
It's a 21-over environment.
Once a month, the 15th ofJanuary, we're going to be
(01:01:07):
talking about abductions.
We're going to have a guy onfrom Zoom, from Skinwalker Ranch
, and an actual abductee fromPort Townsend talking about
their case Not Sasquatch, we'retalking of the ET kind, and then
each month it changes fromsubject to subject, so not
always just Bigfoot.
However, I am kind of theBigfoot guy there.
(01:01:28):
There's other Bigfoot peoplethat show up and that would be a
good place to start networkingwith other like minds.
The other thing you can do ifyou're interested in going out
in the woods is, you know, seeif you can go out in the woods
and stand it.
You know, as far as like hearingstrange stuff, you don't
(01:01:50):
necessarily want to be out inthe woods at night hearing
strange stuff right in thebeginning.
Just take it easy, you knowwhat I mean.
Like if you're coming in fromthe city and you want to get out
in the woods and go into, likeI don't know green water or out
to a lull like we're talking,talking about you don't have to
go that far, um, and then gocheck out, uh, some of these um
museums like go to cliff'smuseum and see the evidence for
(01:02:13):
yourself and and judge foryourself.
And see the size of a sasquatch, see if you want to see one,
because generally eight feet islike the average height.
You know, I built a replica outin forks, washington, at
sasquatch the legend museum.
He's called biggie.
He's eight and a half feet talland about three and a half feet
(01:02:33):
wide at the shoulders.
So do you really want to seesomething like that in the
daytime or the night?
Speaker 2 (01:02:39):
right, uh, you also do artwork.
I know that you recently had.
You have some of your artworkthat is for sale, so make sure,
if you have a chance, go totobes facebook page.
Speaker 3 (01:02:49):
You still have that available, right I'm a chainsaw
carver so I do bigfoot heads alot of them yeah, and you were
still.
Speaker 2 (01:02:56):
You did those, already sell the ones that you
had I, yeah, I sell out everytime I create them.
I've made three today andthey're already gone all right,
well, well, never, never mindthen, so don't go to, well you?
Speaker 3 (01:03:08):
can go check out Facebook Wood Watchers Wood
Watchers on Facebook and you canlook at the profile.
Speaker 2 (01:03:16):
Awesome Again, tobe.
It's always fun to have youcome on and talk about this
stuff.
It's unfortunate that it is inregards to two researchers that
were enthusiasts looking for theelusive bigfoot and they lost
their lives to uh, to the, tothe inclement weather yeah
excuse me, excuse me exposureexposure yeah that's what they
(01:03:41):
died of, that's what they saidright of.
So if you're out here and youhave information, feel free to
send me a text 775-990-5151.
We'd love to have you come onand share what information you
might have.
If you don't follow us, pleasedo so.
You can download the podcast ifyou're watching us.
You're watching us throughYouTube, twitch or instagram, uh
(01:04:06):
or facebook, however that playsout for you.
You can go to uh my website todownload the podcast on air
mariocom.
Click on the podcast link tosubscribe to the podcast.
Uh, for my entire team.
Uh, mark christopher sophiamagana.
Again, tobe, thank you so muchfor coming to hang out with us.
Speaker 3 (01:04:24):
Yeah, thank you, mario.
Speaker 2 (01:04:26):
As I always say, be sure to look up at the sky,
cause you never know what youmight see.
Good night, he's gone.
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