September 19, 2023 • 47 mins
Let's encourage our hosts to be even more hospitable. In Ep#50 we're going to analyse why podcast hosting companies shut down, integrating v4v as a business and how you could do it all by yourself (or with some peers).
Huge thanks to The Bearded Tek, Sam Sethi, Chad F, James Cridland & Boobury for supporting the show. Loving the live boosts!
15% of this episode is going to Cameron for providing an important building block and his behind the scenes work.
5% of this is also going to IPFS hosting so if you want some sats, have a think about favouriting this show.
Handy links:
Feed Your Brand: https://podetize.com/why-podcast-hosting-companies-quit-and-what-you-can-do-to-avoid-it/
Podcast Pontifications: https://podcastpontifications.com/episode/hitting-the-limits-of-low-cost-podcast-hosting
IPFS Hosting: https://ipfspodcasting.net/
DeMu Github: https://github.com/de-mu/demu-feed-template
Value 4 Value Support:
Boostagram: https://www.meremortalspodcast.com/support
Paypal: https://www.paypal.com/paypalme/meremortalspodcast
Connect With Kyrin/Mere Mortals:
Website: https://www.meremortalspodcast.com/
Discord: https://discord.gg/jjfq9eGReU
Twitter/X: https://twitter.com/meremortalspods
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/meremortalspodcasts/
TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@meremortalspodcasts
Huge thanks to The Bearded Tek, Sam Sethi, Chad F, James Cridland & Boobury for supporting the show. Loving the live boosts!
15% of this episode is going to Cameron for providing an important building block and his behind the scenes work.
5% of this is also going to IPFS hosting so if you want some sats, have a think about favouriting this show.
Handy links:
Feed Your Brand: https://podetize.com/why-podcast-hosting-companies-quit-and-what-you-can-do-to-avoid-it/
Podcast Pontifications: https://podcastpontifications.com/episode/hitting-the-limits-of-low-cost-podcast-hosting
IPFS Hosting: https://ipfspodcasting.net/
DeMu Github: https://github.com/de-mu/demu-feed-template
Value 4 Value Support:
Boostagram: https://www.meremortalspodcast.com/support
Paypal: https://www.paypal.com/paypalme/meremortalspodcast
Connect With Kyrin/Mere Mortals:
Website: https://www.meremortalspodcast.com/
Discord: https://discord.gg/jjfq9eGReU
Twitter/X: https://twitter.com/meremortalspods
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/meremortalspodcasts/
TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@meremortalspodcasts
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Let'sencourage our hosts to
be even more hospitable.
Welcome, everyone,to another episode
of the Valuefor Value podcast.
My name is Kyrin, hostof the Mere Mortals
& Mere Mortals
book reviews,and also this one,
which is the podcast fordigital content creators
who want to connect deeperwith their audience
(00:23):
to create a community,and also to be able
to kind of
find a way to monetise
in this very crazy,ad driven world
that we usuallyfind ourselves in.
I'm recording here on the20th of September 2023.
I usually do a live show,
so if you ever feellike tuning in yet,
just check outsome of the notes
that I'll say at the endand you can find out
when that is today'stopic.
(00:45):
We're going to be talkingabout
the incentives of hosting.
Everyone needs to win.
So this is definitelygoing
to be a more businessorientated episode.
I don't typically go downthis this rope realm
because I'm more
interestedin the kind of philosophy
and how
the putting itinto the practice
certainlyis an important point,
but it's it'sthe kind of underpinnings
(01:07):
which are what I'mreally fascinated with.
However,this is going to talk
aboutthe hosting companies
because they are reallyan integral part of the
podcasting ecosystem.
I guess
it's possible
to have podcastingwithout them, but
it wouldn't be very big,let's put it that way.
Yet there are a coupleof niggling problems
that we kind of seewith the podcasting hope
(01:29):
podcasting hosts
and how they runtheir businesses
and in particularI mentioned at the start
therethe incentives of hosting.
What are their incentives.
And so I just want to givea quick definition here.
So incentives,
anything that
that persuade a personor a company or entity
to alter their behaviourand then decide manner
is emphasisedthat incentives
(01:50):
matter by the basiclaw of economists
and the laws of behaviourwhich state
that the higher incentives
amount to greaterlevels of effort
and therefore higherlevels of performance.
So we go, okay,
you know,
it's essentially something
that makesyou do something and in
you want it in ain a good way usually,
but you can have badincentives as well.
And this is where you can
have misaligned incentives
(02:11):
and this is wherewe're going to
talk about that today.
But once again,
a misaligned
incentive refersto a situation where the
goals of different partiesinvolved
in a particular situation,such as a firm
or a systemare not aligned
and may even conflictwith each other.
So how can there besome misaligned incentives
in podcasting?
Hope podcasting host carAnd what do you
(02:33):
what are you talkingabout?
So I first want to talkabout why a podcasting
company would shut down
what what would bea reason for that?
Obviously,bad business practices and
all that sort of thing.
But one of the big reasonsis because of the models
that they tryand operate under.
So for example,the sound of FM,
(02:53):
I don't know if manypeople have heard of that.
They weren't
the biggestof the biggest companies,
but I'd certainlyheard of it.
We this is meand myself, me, myself
and one we were looking atmoving our host over
Geez back in 2020and sound was an option.
We tried them out.
We didn't particularlyenjoy it,
so we ended upgoing with them with Bass
(03:15):
Bus Brat instead.
But I actually did havea personal tie with them.
I had a showwhich I was not an active
and active podcastanymore, could present
in Spanglish.
It was basically bookreviews that I did in
Spanish
and I had done a wholebunch of episodes of it.
I don't know
how many 50, 50 to 100,something like that.
(03:37):
And I just wanted to havethis.
They are to
basicallyjust just have a show
just living in existingand sound.
It was great becausethey had free hosting.
So I was like,Oh, okay, awesome.
Now there's a problemwith this because phrases
never really free.
So there was this
really great articlethat I came across
(03:59):
from the feedYour brand is the
is the nameof this podcast,
and it's hosted by Tracyand Tom Hazzard,
and they actually havea podcasting
company called Productizeand Productize
with a t, I z e dot com,
and they actually had thisarticle February
(04:19):
2nd, 2023.Why podcasting happening?
Why podcasthosting companies quit?
Well, it's a tongue tie
and what you can doto avoid it
not really talking abouthey exactly
the situation I hadI had this business
and SpanglishOP, the podcasting,
the podcast host
companyquit went out of business,
(04:40):
changed their businessmodel.
They they still exist,
but they don't hostpodcasts anymore.
And I looked at moving itover and I, you know,
I dilly dallyaround the deadline
and eventuallyit just I'd let it lapse.
And so that podcastis not up anymore,
although I do still have
all the audio filesand things like that.
So it's not too hardto get it back up.
But I just went, you know,
this doesn't matter to methat much.
(05:01):
It's not that important.
However,it would have been nice.
Now the problemthat they had was
they had a freemium modeland so
if you want to go back to
episodefour of this very podcast
where I had
free is never free, well,even in the feed
your brand,they talk about free
isn't always free,
which is was their versionof it.
(05:22):
So essentiallywhat podcasting
companies do, these hosts,they try and
get as many people inwith a kind of free offer.
And then as the podcastwill grow,
as peoplewant to put more episodes
in things like that,
that's when they say,Hey, look, this is
actually costing us moneyto host this.
You need to jump ontoone of these other plans
(05:44):
or we have all of these
otherand you know, add ons
additions,which you can use.
Okay, cool.
Now, the problem with thisis that competition is
reallytight and you'll see a
picture shortly of justhow many podcasting hosts
there are
and there'sa whole bunch of them
and for example, isa whole bunch of podcasts
(06:06):
as well.
And a lot of themare on anchor.
And I guess I want to sayhere, there's like
4 million podcastsroughly and alone.
A lot of them arethese kind of shows
which people just put upand don't
care about,sort of like I had.
And so there's actuallyonly a relatively small
number of active podcastsaround the 400,000 range.
(06:28):
And so all of these
companies are tryingto get these more active
podcasts usually,
although there are others,of course,
which still have valueand people pay for,
but they make them money
mostlyfrom these small shows
because by definitionmost podcasts are small.
So when you've got thiskind of freemium model,
(06:48):
you'rekind of having to go
after these small shows.
And if you justcan't get enough of them,
get off,
go off to the small shows,and then
kind of upsell them onto aonto a new product
because that'show a lot of podcasts so
podcasts start.
That'show the ME and models did.
We just jumped with a freeone and eventually
we realised,Oh, this is really cool.
We want to keep continuingthis.
(07:09):
Okay,we'll stop paying for this
because we want
more abilityto upload episodes.
We want to have greater
functionality,things like this.
And if you just don'tget that momentum,
that's,that's how you, you end up
crashing and burning ornot running out of money.
And this is what happenedto two sound up
for example.
The other problem thatexist is big bandwidth.
(07:31):
You always talk aboutlike, you know,
big pharma, big,big industrial,
big, big militarythings like this
while big bandwidth.
The problem that a lot ofpodcast host have is
they don't want big shows.
They actually don't
want their customersto really be successful.
You go, okay, well, why?
And so there is anothergreat podcast called
(07:52):
Podcast Pontifications,hosted by Eric Volterra,
and he had thisepisode called
Hitting the Limits of LowCost Podcast Hosting.
At some point,if you're lucky
or very strategic,
your podcastmight become too popular
just too popular for youto stay on the same
low price hosting plan.
Remember,unlimited downloads
sounds all fine and gooduntil your popular
(08:13):
show startscosting them real money.
So yes, this is exactlywhat happens.
Essentially, onceyou start hitting 10,000
or more downloads,
the bandwidthcosts just skyrocket and
once again, this is
because podcasting, it'skind of this on demand.
You can get it
whenever you want,
but when you releasean episode,
(08:33):
if you're very popular,everyone's
going to listento that straight away.
Or, you know, 90%,75% of your audience
will hit that episodewithin the first 24 hours.
And so the bandwidthcosts,
maybe if you coulddistribute it over a week,
it'd be all right
if you had a weekly appepisode.
But that's not howthis stuff happens.
If you get absolutely hitand so
(08:56):
this is whereI guess the the
what are thea lot of the hosts
do is they go, okay, well,once you've got someone
adding
this much bandwidth,you need to start
have a chat with them.
And this is what EvaTerra was saying.
You know,
this is whereyou'll get a message
once you startgetting really popular.
It's like, hey,
(09:18):
you know,your show is doing well.
It's actually startingto cost us a lot of money.
We need to cometo a solution
and either this is
we start paying moreas a kind of flat rate
for your host.
So, you know,
for example,I think we pay $24 a month
for the main modelswith with Buzz Sprout.
If that gotreally popular,
(09:38):
that wouldmaybe start saying, hey,
like you need to startpaying hundred,
maybe you need to start
paying 200just to cover our cost.
And then another way wouldbe, okay, well, perhaps
we can do some sortof ad solution where,
you know, you're the waythat you'll make money
from ads.
And so if we can geta percentage of that,
then the better
(09:58):
your show goes,the more ads you pay,
the more ads are gettingplayed.
The more moneyyou're coming from ad
advertisers, You know,we get a cut of that.
Everyone's happyla di da da da.
But there's always,I guess,
you know,
unless you get thesethings
really aligned,this is where you can have
the misaligned
incentives comingwhere the podcast host
(10:20):
actually kind of doesn'twant you to get popular.
They would ratheryour show stay small
and youplay pay that flat rate
or is so small thatit doesn't even matter.
And so they can offer thatfree free service
and it really doesn'thurt them at all.
But you can you just gothink like, man,
(10:40):
there's there's
probably somethinglingering
in the back of the mindwhere it is
this misalignedincentives.
They don't want youto get better.
They don't want youto get more popular.
So they might even startdoing some things
which would make it
so that you'renot as popular or,
you know, they won't
advertise your show,They won't do everything
that they can toto help you out,
(11:01):
which is a really funnysituation.
You'd think like, Damn,okay, what's
what's going on here?
Is there is there a way toperhaps solve this?
It's not super,
super bad,
but it's still obviouslypeople are writing about
these things.
So it stillobviously is a problem.
And this is wherewe're going to come to.
Okay.
What if we can becomemore closely linked?
And so this is actuallysomething
(11:22):
that I have experimentedwith and is happening
on this very showright now as you speak.
So Todd Cochrane,
who is, I thinkone of the co-founders
or thethe founder of Blueberry,
he made a recent post
on the podcastindex Mastodon,
and he was talking abouthow the shows
using the valuetag made 0.4 BTC.
(11:43):
So this is about40 million Satoshis,
which is 10,000 us from
from beinghosted on blueberry
and using the valuetag there,
which is pretty coolbecause man, that tag is,
it's, it's kind of hiddenout of the way.
It's called experimental.
It's not
(12:03):
the easiest thing to useand yet there's still,
you know, a bit of money
flowing through inthis was
and they're ableto tell this
because they geta 3% split of all of that.
So they would get 3%of 10,000 U.S.
which is if my math isokay, you know, 300 bucks,
not it'snot a crazy amount.
And that'ssince the start of 2023.
(12:27):
I wanted to actually get
a little bitmore details on that.
And, you know, how manypodcasts was that from?
Because I bet
it would be less than 100if I had to say.
But yeah,so that's still cool. And
it'lllink up with some the
stats that I talked about
a couple of weeks agoin the second hour.
But you can haveyou can see, okay,
(12:49):
this is an opportunity
where the hosts have
can partake directlyin the success of the show
and of course is wherenegotiations can occur.
So, for example,this very podcast,
if you boost in 3% of it,is going to
go to blubrry.
If this show gets very,very popular,
I'm going to havemore people boosting it.
And that'skind of how the the value
(13:10):
for value model works,you know?
Yeah, obviouslyyou have to do the ask.
You have to createa good show.
You have to
make sure that people knowhow they can do it.
And all of these sortsof things.
But, you know, roughly4% of people will will
contribute to the show.
And once again,check out an episode
in a couple of weeks
where I'll talk
about my ownvarious statistics
(13:31):
and I'll be able to back
this upwith some actual numbers.
But the bigger the showgets,
the more thatthey will earn.
So once again,this is where it's like
incentivesare directly aligned,
much like how they can
have it with the
the advertisingand if they getting
a percentageof the advertising split,
if they get a percentageof the value
(13:51):
split of thatcoming in, okay, awesome.
They can do this.
And then yeah,negotiations can occur.
I can say, oh, you know,3%, that's a that's a lot.
Todd Like, I'm
I'm, I'm not sure I'mhappy with that.
And he's like a carand the cost man
costs of doing this
you get in very popularwe actually need a bump
it up to 5% And I'm like,Oh damn.
And this is wherethe free market comes in.
(14:12):
And if I don't like that,I could go do
another podcast hostor you know, that
that sort of deal,this is beautiful.
This is how it shouldall work.
Why wouldn't they?
Why wouldn't host jump onto this opportunity?
You know, you hear thesearguments elsewhere, a
value for values,not a steady income.
So the host they need,
(14:32):
you know,a steady stream coming in
and it uses bitcoin,which is a scam.
Oh, my God, Can't do that.It's such small numbers.
Only 10,000us over the course of 2023
people won't pay.
You haveto force them to pay.
I think all of these we'vekind of been debunked
over the course of all ofthe value for value show.
(14:54):
They're all fallacies.
You know,people won't pay.
No, they'll pay.
It's it's just
you just have to ask
and you just have tochange your show
so that it's easier for it
so that they havethe incentives, too,
so that they getpart of the feedback loop
so that they know
that they're actuallycontributing directly
and they are havingan impact
on such small numbers.
(15:14):
You know, go back
to two episodes agoto episode 48.
This is where we saw,you know,
a couple of years ago,it was only 60,000.
That's flowing
through the ecosystema day
now it's closer to 1 to 2million.
Where will that bein two years time?
And that could be anotherwhatever percentage X
(15:34):
that is you know, 150X or something like that.
So it's not hard to see.
Okay.
Well,
you know, it's only
maybe 10,000over the course
of nine monthsat this very moment.
What if that was 100,000or a million?
Okay, Well, that's
that's actually goingto stop
making a big differenceto these podcasting hope
(15:55):
companies, if theycan get a split of that.
You know, BTC is a scam.
I don't want to gointo that one.
v4v is not steady income.
Yeah, sure.
That's a that'san argument and some
but once again,if this is a podcasting
hosting company,if they have 5100
300 a thousand shows,
(16:16):
which they'repart of the split off,
you know,
those showsare going to vary
in their amount as well.
But it's kind ofin the variance that
you'll get some stability.
So once again, there's athere's an option now,
another optionthat is possible.
But, you know,you could be saying,
and this is all risky,what if my host fails?
(16:37):
You know,what if what if Bluebird
just goes out of business?
Ye of little faith?
Do you think I'd forgotten
aboutthe first two properties
that I talked aboutin episode 40?
This being
decentralisationand being self-sovereign.
So this is
why we're going to jumpinto IP FS hosting.
And so
(16:58):
first,
I mean, first ofall, if that's the case,
what if my host failsand just move?
It's not too hard.
You know, I've I've
all of my showshave been on
multiple hostsmultiple times.
It's a bit of a painin the ass, but,
you know, it's it'snot, it's not that hard.
But on a recent podcasting2.3 episode,
episode 145,which had Alberto
(17:19):
from Ask.com and Cameron,who is the guy
who's kind of created Ipfspodcasting, hosting,
it's they gointo this concept
of being ableto do it in a direct
in a peer
to peer manner of
distributing, of having,you know, decentralisation
of your hosting.
So it's not just inthis one central location.
(17:41):
That episodeis super complex.
I roughly knewthe general idea
coming in,
but they got into the techside of things
and they were talkingabout gateways
that are talking aboutall this crazy stuff.
So this is is kind of hardto sustain.
So here'sthe basic overview.
Yeah.
Instead of having onecentral point
where you uploadyour audio
(18:02):
and it's
getting absolutelyhammered,
just like we were talking
aboutwith the big bandwidth,
you can have multipleproviders or peers, each
providing a bit.
So if you want to think of
torrentingor the Pirate Bay,
this is how that worked.
You would have a movieor a music on online.
Multiple peoplewould have this online,
and if someone wantedto get the episode, those
(18:26):
or that movie or whateverit is,
instead ofjust absolutely hammering
one of those peoplewho had it,
that person could justprovide part of the file
and then someone else
could providepart of the file.
Think of it like a jigsaw.
Everyone'sgot their little piece,
everyone ownsthe full thing,
they have the full jigsaw,
but they just providea little piece
(18:46):
to someone new who wantsto get that jigsaw puzzle.
And then that waythey're not,
you know,
gettingabsolutely hammered
and having a thousandpeople
showing up their doorall trying to get
their jigsaw puzzleat the same time.
And so this is whereyou can say,
okay, your peers can helphost your files
so that they're notever offline
(19:06):
if your podcasting hostgoes down well, you know,
or if one of the peersgoes down,
that's okaybecause there's, you know,
50 others, 100 otherswhich are also hosting it.
So once again,this is the the kind of
decentralisation,even permissionless,
because you can havejust multiple people
coming on to usand I'll talk to you
(19:26):
about how I'm doing thisfor this episode
very shortly.
And so once again, it'sthis idea
of the tech behindit is very, very complex.
There's all sorts of crazythings
going on with Ipfs,
which stands
for interplanetary filesystem of file storage.
I've had both and this isthat central idea of
(19:47):
of having multiple filesin various locations.
And yet if one of themgoes down, it's okay
because there's otherswhich are backups for it.
Now, this is not going to
completely replace hostingor anything like that.
They still havea central point
which they linkedto which is,
you know, the host,which I have.
(20:08):
But if that host goesdown, this should
theoretically work.
I actually, you know,
I don't think anyone'stried it out
where the main hostingcompany has gone down
and this is all so new.
So this is just
if you're interested inthese sorts of ideas is a
here'sa little taste of for you.
So getting onto the kind
of peer
to peer incentives, well,why would someone else
(20:28):
host my file?
What'swhat's in it for them?
Because you were just
talking about incentivesbefore.
They needto have a reason for it.
Because even though
it might be onlya little bit of bandwidth,
you know,
they're still providingbandwidth
that's still costing themmoney.
Why wouldwhy would they do that?
And so thisis where it's like, okay,
(20:49):
a high value for valueincentives kick in.
And so
if I provide a split,which I've done for this
very episode, 5% ofthis is going to go to
the Ipfshosting solution thing.
That's going on here,
and I might do thisgoing forward.
I'm not sure I want totest out for this episode.
(21:09):
Then whoever helps host
this filewill get some of the sets
as distributed via
the Magic IpfsSystem technology.
So there's a kind of
like technologywhich is saying, Yeah,
you provide this pieceof the jigsaw puzzle,
you providethe end corner,
you provide thislittle bit in the middle,
and that
all comes together
to form a file whichsomeone can download.
(21:32):
What if I contributesome sets 5%?
And so that 5%kind of goes into a pool.
So each person
who is providing
a piece of that puzzle,then they get
part of the sets for it.
Now, it's
not going to be hugeamounts because
5% of my showand then split that up to
another 100 peopleor something,
their only public to get,
(21:52):
you know,tiny little bits.
But once again,that's compensation
for these tiny little bitsthat they're providing.
So you can see, okay,this is maybe where
the everyone'sgetting a part of the
part of the pie, you know,everyone needs to win.
Is, was the kind ofsubtitle of this episode
and this is whereyou can see,
(22:13):
okay,when incentives work,
when everyone has anincentive to do something
in and
they are alignedand not misaligned,
this is whereyou could go.
All right, sweet.
This is you know, thisthis is making it work
for everyone.
Once again,
there'sall sorts of things
behind this old filesthat are getting
no downloadsin a 48 hour period.
(22:35):
They get removed
unless they're favoritedby someone.
You can just see how
all of thiswould come together.
There's this
things in the backgroundwhich, sure,
it could make itdifficult, but
I'm more see this as the,you know, angel music.
Oh aligned incentivesit's all coming together
(22:55):
as from theThe Emperor's New Groove.
What's his name,Gronk or something?
Oh yeah. It'sall coming together.
So yeah, this is whereit's just a way.
This is wherelike, a kind of like,
littlebusiness episode of saying
the value for valuecan work for businesses.
Once again, this is fordigital products.
It's nota physical products.
(23:17):
I need to see more proofof this working
in the real worldfor a physical product.
I know some examples
and I might do an episodeon that at some point,
but this is definitely onewhere it's like, okay,
this is worthlooking out for.
If I was a hostingcompany,
I would seriously be
looking at doing thisand many of them are.
I know RSS dot com hasthis feature as well.
(23:38):
Blue variables obviously,
and I think all of them
will come aroundat some stage because it's
it isrelatively easy thing to
to just put in thein the actual
what would you call it.
The RSS, the XML file.
It's just the podcastis themselves needing
to learnabout value for value
and why they would want
(24:00):
to ask the listenersto listen on a,
on an app like Fountain
and Stream sitesor to Brustein,
which is hencewhy I have this show here.
All right,beautiful suite.
Let's go onto the Brewster Gremlins
and I'll do some livechats at the same time.
So I have a
a small live chat here,which is just my discord
(24:22):
and I can seewant to be very listening.
So thank youvery much for that.
And so one was asking,is there a predicted path
through where technically
data storage becomescheaper and cheaper
to allow for bandwidthexpansion?
I look, I don't actuallyeven know what that means.
I'm guessingyou're just saying it.
If the bandwidthand data storage
(24:44):
becomes cheaper,which tends to happen
over timewith the internet,
you can see howall of this this happens.
Will willthis kind of make this
be a justan unknown entity,
a non-issue because,you know, audio files
there aren't they aren'tthat big that usually
what in the megabytesrange
(25:05):
you know if unless it'slike a music one which can
need a bit more outthis episode, for example,
it'll probably besomewhere around
40 to 60, I think forabout 45 minutes worth.
So. So this is whereyou could say, Oh, well,
if we just, if,
if everything nextand was the same price,
(25:26):
this would becomea non-issue.
Yeah, potentially.
Typically, though,
what happens is peopleexpand their
that capacity.
So when you get moreenergy
and energy is cheaper,you tend to use more.
So there's you know,
if I could make my audiofiles that much better
by just adding
more megabytes onto them,
even if it was only
(25:47):
a tiny little bit,I'd probably do it.
And so that's one thing.
There was also asking,
could the
podcast businesses, notby default, make podcasts
possibly pay thempercent to as they grew,
as they grow?
Yep, sure they can.
But once again,this is just the
because there'sso many podcast hosts
(26:07):
this is where forcingpeople to do things,
you can lose your customer
pretty easilybecause people would just
go, I'mjust going to go over
to this host here,which doesn't have that.
This I think is
just in relation more likea business thing,
the industry,
because so many peoplewill start a podcast,
(26:27):
not know if they reallywant to do it,
not be serious about it.
And so they don't wantto pay because it's it's,
it's kind of like you needto you need to start
and do it for a whileto realise if you want,
if this is an avenue worthgoing down,
much like we did
one as my co-host
in the miyamoto's,you know,
it was probably onlyinto where we're,
(26:50):
I don't know, 50to 100 episodes in where
we were starting to go.
Like, okay,this is actually something
we really enjoy.
We can keep doing this.
It's probably startworking worthy
of looking at how
we can make this betterfor our audience.
And to do that, thenwe need to start paying.
So I think that's more an
industry thing rather than
the actualbusiness itself.
(27:11):
It if they start trying to
force people to pay, it's
just not going to workas, as great.
And they might, you know,lose those people
who would convert
to becomingpaying customers
if they'd just waiteda little bit longer.
I don't know.
I'm not a podcast host,
so I'm just kind ofguessing there.
But as I mentioned
with those
couple of articles
and there's links
(27:32):
in all the chapter images,
when if you listento this post and
you'll see that peopleare obviously highlighting
these issuesand talking about it.
So there must be issues.
So yeah, there we go.
I'm going to jump ontothe boostagrams here
and thank some people whohave supported the show.
Welcometo the Value for value.
(27:53):
Graham Lounge.
As we were saying,you know, 5% of this
is going to go to Ipfspodcasting, hosting.
So if you are a nodeand you want to help
support this showand you know, get paid
for doing that,
you know, favouritethis episode and,
(28:13):
and you'll get some statscoming in
hopefullyfrom the next week.
You know,
we're goingto have to rely on
very kind
people like the people who
support it in
and I'll say
at the very end
how you cansupport the show
but we've got coming upat the top here
the beard tech.
He says thank youfor the kind words.
This is
the guy who I wastalking about last week
is creating the blogindex.
We're still veryearly days
(28:34):
and anyonewho wants to help dive in
and create something
great with code ideas,funding, etc.,
I'm more thanwelcome to come join in
and help out in matrixor GitHub match.
Seems like a great idea.
The only issueI personally have with
it is all the Trekkies,which is understandable,
but what we aretrying to build
will be 100% self-hosted
not for profit and databroker.
Check a free exclamation
(28:55):
mark 1000 sets sentusing fountain.
Thank you very much,my friend.
Yeah.
Look, honestly,
when it comes to privacythings, I am so oblivious.
I chuck a lot of my stuffout there, so
that's not something I
really care aboutor watch too closely.
So it's good to knowthat other people
are on top of that and,and doing that.
(29:17):
And yeah, once again
when I get some time I,
I'll probably try outmesh someday
but it's it's loweron the priority list.
I see.
Once again Sam Sethi
just absolutely blastingmy channel here with
lots ofit just says received
donation message you know19 sets 19 sets 3958.
So you must have been
playing aroundwith the amounts
(29:37):
because these arestreaming amounts.
But I did see in thishe did send a message
at some points, whereashere we go
POD fans has a statsenabled blog with Zaps
and Bruce love the ideaof also adding splits.
We are creating an RSS2.06 feed and putting it
in podcast indexwith the medium of blog.
Very cool pod fan spin.
(29:58):
What can't you doover there?
What can't youdo? He's coming out with a
the progressiveweb app on mobile in
I think it's like about aweek's time.
So yeah, I'mdefinitely going
help him outwith the testing
and things of all of that.That would be very cool.
But pod vents, it's yeah,it's getting stronger.
It's getting you canlisten live
(30:19):
and I've put up links
and stuff to that as wellso very, very cool.
I see Chad coming in herewith a row of threes.
3333 sent usingCosta matic,
he says playing catch up.
Thank you very much, Chad.
If catch up all you want,
I definitely needto update
all of my episodes again.
I've made it a solid craftpeople.
(30:40):
The first seasonis pretty good.
Apartfrom some of the chapters,
I still need to fix those.
But this first season,all the notes,
all the links,everything works.
I still need to fix up
the boosting amountsfor season two.
So boosting amountsthe splits for season two.
So my to do list
and another one,an exciting one here
from James Cridland,the host of POD News.
(31:03):
Also,
Sam Seth is our partnerin crime over at Pod News
and he saidlike boost 1111
and that'sa row of Richards
sent using fountainanother live on here
from blueberry himself17,776 Baller
using boost cli
This is awesome
we're getting
like basically every
(31:23):
method just need a curecost a boost and that'll
sort it all out, he says.
I inadvertentlyfound myself
in the hosting game,getting a bunch of music
uploaded of over the pastcouple of weeks.
It's been fun.
Snip snip
a reference to the runningwith scissors,
their blueberries,
Bruce Seeleyand his Bruce spot
is actually in my splitsas well.
So all of these boosts,once I finally get
(31:45):
all the live chat andall that stuff working,
that'll
be a veryawesome addition.
And once again,just showcasing
the splits, showcasing
that people are excitedabout all of these things.
The music
obviouslyhas really taken off
and I would encouragepeople to
to just keep an eye outon that because
I'm going to get Adamas well.
(32:05):
I hope to get Adamon the main models
perhaps next month
to talk about that becausehe's been doing it for,
geez, what,close to two months now.
So I think you havesome interesting insights
about the voiceof the music.
But thank you, everyone.Thank you.
Obviously, blueberry.
Thank you for thatBig Bruce man.
Much appreciated.That is going to the ipfs.
So, Chad,if you're also listening,
(32:25):
I know you do some
hosting of nodesand things like that.
If you want a favourite,this one,
that'd be very, very cool.
So that is the Boostagram Lounge.
Once again,
I didn't order it dueto Sam's shenanigans.
Absolute shenanigansgoing on there.
But thank you very mucheveryone, for boosting
in very, very, very cool.
(32:46):
Oh yeah.And then blueberries.
Just gota little thing here
showing that the boost
what actuallyactually works
So awesome legend manyou are incredible.
Keep those scissors.
Just just keep them awayfrom your face.
Your face is beautiful.
Mint And don't
get to too many scars orthings like that in there.
Okay.
Let's get to some tips.
(33:07):
Some tips.
The podcasting host.
I need feedback. People,
if they don'thave a podcast,
they almost certainlyhave a YouTube channel.
So I know Buzz Cast hasa Buzz Brat has podcast.
I know that Blueberryhas the new media show.
I'm pretty sureI've heard that
some of the other
most of the hosting
(33:28):
companies, I believe,have their own podcast.
So this is a perfectopportunity for you
to help support them
and to let them knowwhat you want
because they need to knowabout these things.
If they don't have valuefor value,
if they don'thave a split,
if they don't have live
tag that you want,if they don't have
any of the numerous things
(33:48):
that you want to
to play with,to provide more value
to your audience,they need to know
about these things.
And so
buzz cast, for example,I supported them to Todd
help me get this very livestream set up
when I was with Casta Pod Yassine Handheld me
through all of that.
And by being moreconnected with them,
you do get benefitsfor yourself.
(34:09):
So not only because, look,you're going to say,
Hey, I want this,
I want that,and they're going to go,
Yeah, that's going to takea bit of time.
So buzz cast, for example,a bus.
Brad They haven'tgot the live talk.
I would 100% be using thatbecause I use that
for the modelsand the book reviews.
I will be using that asof a week or two's time.
(34:30):
They haven'tupdated it yet.
They haven't got that
all that functionalitybecause they
they're very much focussedon the consumer on the
what is it, the UI,the UX of making things
run really smoothly,
whereas I'm morein the experimental phase
and I just want to stuff.
I don't care
if it's hotand in care for breaks,
(34:50):
I just want todo these things.
So yeah,this is where it's,
it's like it's worthy ofjust letting them know
that'sand you get benefits.
So open three and pod row,
those are the two thingsthat time
I got added to the modelsand you know,
people were talking aboutthat.
I had James Cridlandto boost it in just before
he mentioned thaton Pod news,
(35:10):
that kind of just, youknow, extra visibility,
extra little functions,extra extra features.
If you go on to POD fans,you'll see that pod
roll is still workingfor my show,
which highlightsother shows
I think are worthyof of you checking out
kind of like a
recommendation listwithin within the
the actual podcastapp itself.
(35:31):
All of these things help.
And so that's just my tipfor today.
You know, ultimatelyBlueberry got my business
because they had thesefeatures like the value,
like being ableto go live.
The live one was a bigone for me.
I really wanted to do thatfor this show.
I was, you know,I was looking at moving it
onto bus sprout,but they didn't have that.
(35:53):
And so once again,the pod,
the podcast hosts, I'm
going to goand spend my money.
And I spent a I can'tremember how much it was.
It was probably about 200and something
Australian dollars
hosting this for a yearon on blueberry.
And, you know,
not only that,but he's also receiving
3% of everythingthat's coming in
so that while he blueberryis receiving that.
(36:17):
So very, very cool.
And that'sjust my tip for today.
Reach out to your host.
Tell them what they
what you want,what you need,
and you know,
be willing toto share some of your your
your profits,
your your value with thembecause
when they get better,you get better.
And it's it's when those
incentives are alignedthat it
(36:38):
it really really takes it
to a to a whole new level.
So and I've just gotblueberry in the chat here
saying live is littaking your show
live takes the productionto a whole new level.
Ten out of tenwould do it again.
I can definitely say forthis show it makes me prep
and actuallyfor the models as well.
I think it makes us prepbetter by doing it live.
(36:59):
So there's there'svariations to this.
I want to talkat some point about
the kind of optimal show
for value, for value,
how you have to actually
change your showa little bit.
But that's definitelyfor a
for another episode
of my app and servicehighlight,
this is a worthy reminderthat you actually
don't need
a podcast hosting companybehind the schemes.
(37:20):
I don't thinkthey used one.
This is very, very show.
I know.
So Spencer, for example,he has a dimly a dim view
feed templatewith comments and notes
to help a musicianwho wants to sell fast.
So he's got this thingwhere it's basically,
you know,there's wavelike out
and there's the music sideprojects.
(37:41):
And once again,these are kind of like
varying ordersof being able to
to host it yourself.
And he's like, Look,this is how you can do it.
Here's somenotes. Anyone can do this.
And this is where I
somewhat agreeand somewhat disagree.
I use cost upload,
which was a self hostingsolution.
It's doableeven for the tech
strugglerslike myself. Okay.
(38:03):
They use a podcastingcompany called Pod Serve,
but I'm pretty sure healters his own RSS feed.
So once again, it's it'skind of like a half
half thingthat he's doing.
And that's somethingthat I want to look at
in the future as well.
But this is whereit's like, okay,
you can, you can do ityourself.
Costa Pod is a selfhosting solution.
(38:24):
I had Digital Oceanas my servers.
I installed their package.
I was to basicallyget all my stuff
uploadedwithout using what
you would call a typicalpodcasting company.
CostaPod actually has added
that service as a thing,
but you can also do it
(38:44):
the open source routeif you want,
and the Self-Sovereignroute.
This is beingable to host it yourself.
Just rememberthere are trade-offs
and time and pain pointsfor all of this.
So for example,
I very humorously
locked myselfout of my very own feed.
So this was for the valuefor value show.
And basicallyI put the locked tag in.
(39:05):
I lost my log in details.
I couldn't log into my ownadministration dashboard
and with the log tagthe companies, basically
the point of that is tosay, I'm not going to
ingest this RSS feedand be able to switch host
because they put the locktag on it,
which really fucked meover,
(39:26):
especially becauseI had one episode left.
It was hilarious.
I had one episodeleft of season
two and I did that,so I basically
had to recreatethe whole thing again
just to be able topublish that last episode.
A good learning pointfor me, and also
good learning pointfor you guys at home.
If you want to do selfhosting, just be prepared.
You got to runningwith scissors, you got to
(39:48):
you've got take some time.
Some things are goingto be harder.
And just like Burberry'ssaying, yeah,
they have a handpacked feed
that they submitto the index.
You know, when things gowrong, that's on him now.
It's not on the podcastinghost.
So the it's good to havethese aligned incentives.
A host can do thingsthat I certainly can't.
(40:08):
I'm not greatwith data management.
I'm not great with,
you know, the realfinicky side of technology
and things like this.
It's awesometo have a host for that
and but it does trade offs
of like I don't have
all the featuresthat I would like,
you know, that's okay.
And you just have to keepthat in mind as a
and yeah,
if you want to knowmore about
how to do self hosting.
(40:29):
So Spencer'sa great resource for that.
So if you go on to the
podcast index Mastodon,you can find him there.
Finally, value for value.
Who is 15% of this showgoing to go to?
So obviously I've gotthe 5% go into the Ipfs
podcasting hosting,
but I want to give 15%to Cameron as well.
(40:50):
This is a dudewho's living by a forest
or a woods. If youlisten to that podcast,
podcasting,2.0 episode, you'll
you'll hearthat was a bit of debate
about whetherit was a forest or woods.
And he was like, he's
just some rendered outin the woods
who has created thisawesome system
(41:11):
that's going to be so muchbackend work.
There'sgoing to be so much time
spent optimisingcertain niche things,
learninghow to use ipfs like that,
that placesthat thing is difficult to
to understand,let alone build on top of.
You know, he's
just another unsung herowho does great work
that could really changean industry
(41:33):
and reminds meof this picture
that was posted on the
podcast index Mastodon
shout out to ChristopherEzine,
which is showshow RSS is holding up
the whole podcastingecosystem.
It's this,
it's this blockwhich is on the very edge
wood kind of like a Jengatower,
you know, it's the blockright at the bottom.
If you pulled that out,
(41:53):
everything comescrashing down
and so this is whereit's like, you know,
I want to getI want to shout out people
who help create thingslike this where
they're doing something
that could thatis another building block
and that could become anintegral building block of
of, you know, hostingin the future, of making
it more reliant,more distributed
(42:14):
of creating incentivesthat work for everyone.
And so, yeah, bigshout out to Cameron
Massive, massive,
massivework that he's doing.
And I'm going toleave it there for today
and just give yousome recommendations
of the value for value
system.
(42:34):
Sorry, there's a couple
before I get into thatas couple
of last frontier, JamesCridland was mentioning
captivate chargesper download,
which some podcasts
which some podcastssee as a bad thing,
but it means they reallywant to help you grow.
And he was an advisor
for them once,
so he knows deeplyabout that as well.
One also sent me a commentas well
(42:55):
to do this was relatedto the memorial,
so that's all good.
So yeah, very, very cool
to have all of thesethings available.
Value for value.
This is a value for valueshow,
obviously it is the valuefor value show.
And there'sa couple of ways
that you can helpsupport the show time,
you know, sharing the showwith someone who
(43:17):
is maybe looking at
wonderingabout podcasting, hosting,
about wondering
aboutgetting a popular podcast,
why are they charging memore,
Why is thishappening to me?
How can I becomemore distributed
so that my followersdon't go offline
and I'm a tech personor they're a tech person?
They love to knowabout all these things.
Pleaseshare the show with them.
(43:37):
I would really love to
start reaching outto a bit of a greater
audience to really.
This is definitelythe show where I'm trying
to I'm trying to helppeople understand
value for value
and the various parts
that gointo all of these things.
Not only the philosophy,but yes, in practice
and the businessside of things as well.
You could also come
join for the live as Jamesas one as Burberry
(43:59):
have done.This is very exciting.
I love gettingthese little interactions
talent.So next week topic, for
example,is on open source.
Now I got a recommendation
of for doing this from Sir
Alex Gates months ago and.
This topicas well as others
were suggested by people.
And if there's a topic
that you would like
to know about of the valuefor value, please
(44:21):
reach out to me.Let me know.
Hey, I really want to knowhow value
for value workswith physical products.
Okay, well,
I'll spend more timeresearching,
much like I have done
today, to seewhere does this work.
I already know,
for example, that churchesand music, you know,
church music, people willsometimes have CDs
and it's likeyou just take a CD.
Anyone can get it.
(44:42):
Just givewhat you think is worth
or what youwhat you can contribute.
And this is very muchon an ethos of V for V,
and Iknow there's a guy at
my local Bitcoin made up.
He does it with honeyand who also does it with
with meatand things like this.
So it is possible,but if you've got a topic,
please please reach outand let me know.
(45:03):
And or just resources.
Things that you think
would be interesting toto hear about.
And then finally,the treasure,
the three options
available for youat this very moment.
You can geta new podcasting app.
I mentioned a whole bunchof them
in the boostagramsjust then,
so people boosted inby a castamatic via pod
fans, by a by a fountainby the Bruce CLI
(45:24):
and other great ones
are things like podcastguru of things like
podverse obviously pod
verse
is a massive one and curiocaster
and I thinkthere's even more
and I'm just forgetting
them at the momentbut you know,
those are a great wholebunch of options.
You're helping supportthe show, you're
helping support Cameron,you're helping support
(45:46):
Burberrywith as Bruce Bartlett,
you're helping support
the Ipfs hosting.
All of this
is getting distributedto various people
and to me, of course,which is
very much appreciated.
I told you how much
my hosting costfor this year,
so I'd really loveto recoup that.
At the very least,that would be awesome.
So you can do itvia there.
You can do itdirectly to me at KYRIN at
(46:08):
get Alby dot com
a slightly riskier routeif you want to do it
that way.
Because I don't checkthese as I do
check in regularly.
But it's harder to seebecause the ALBY extension
with the incoming,it doesn't show me
a full weeks worth.
(46:28):
It only shows me upto a certain point.
So I can't see
every single onethat's coming in.
But yeah, that's
very much appreciated that
you can do itby there as well.
Another optionis going directly
to the podcastingindex site and boosting in
with Alby.
From there,
which will honourall of the splits,
(46:50):
which is very, very cool.
And then finally,if you go to me
Immortals podcast dotcom such support
this one likely won't getread out the PayPal.
I don't check thatfor these shows,
but there is a PayPaloption there
and you can boost and buy
there as well directlyto the memorial.
So lots of differentfor you available
(47:10):
if you're in Brisbane.
You could also I don'tknow, reach out to me and
Henry some cash in personif you want.
Buy me a drink.That'd be awesome.
I'd be really fun.
I'm going to leave itthere for today.
Thank you very muchfor everyone to join live.
Thank you very much foreveryone who contributed.
Thank you very much.
For everyone
who's listening nowlater as well, it's it's
(47:32):
awesometo see all of this.
And I'm really lovingthe the interactions. It's
very heartfelt.
I'm gladto know the effort
I'm putting in is
having some sort of effectand helping out people.
So we'll leave it there.
As I mentioned,next week's
episode is going to be allabout open source
and yet until then,chao for now, Kyrin out.
Let'sencourage our hosts to
be even more hospitable.
Welcome, everyone,to another episode
of the Valuefor Value podcast.
My name is Kyrin, hostof the Mere Mortals
& Mere Mortals
book reviews,and also this one,
which is the podcast fordigital content creators
who want to connect deeperwith their audience
(00:23):
to create a community,and also to be able
to kind of
find a way to monetise
in this very crazy,ad driven world
that we usuallyfind ourselves in.
I'm recording here on the20th of September 2023.
I usually do a live show,
so if you ever feellike tuning in yet,
just check outsome of the notes
that I'll say at the endand you can find out
when that is today'stopic.
(00:45):
We're going to be talkingabout
the incentives of hosting.
Everyone needs to win.
So this is definitelygoing
to be a more businessorientated episode.
I don't typically go downthis this rope realm
because I'm more
interestedin the kind of philosophy
and how
the putting itinto the practice
certainlyis an important point,
but it's it'sthe kind of underpinnings
(01:07):
which are what I'mreally fascinated with.
However,this is going to talk
aboutthe hosting companies
because they are reallyan integral part of the
podcasting ecosystem.
I guess
it's possible
to have podcastingwithout them, but
it wouldn't be very big,let's put it that way.
Yet there are a coupleof niggling problems
that we kind of seewith the podcasting hope
(01:29):
podcasting hosts
and how they runtheir businesses
and in particularI mentioned at the start
therethe incentives of hosting.
What are their incentives.
And so I just want to givea quick definition here.
So incentives,
anything that
that persuade a personor a company or entity
to alter their behaviourand then decide manner
is emphasisedthat incentives
(01:50):
matter by the basiclaw of economists
and the laws of behaviourwhich state
that the higher incentives
amount to greaterlevels of effort
and therefore higherlevels of performance.
So we go, okay,
you know,
it's essentially something
that makesyou do something and in
you want it in ain a good way usually,
but you can have badincentives as well.
And this is where you can
have misaligned incentives
(02:11):
and this is wherewe're going to
talk about that today.
But once again,
a misaligned
incentive refersto a situation where the
goals of different partiesinvolved
in a particular situation,such as a firm
or a systemare not aligned
and may even conflictwith each other.
So how can there besome misaligned incentives
in podcasting?
Hope podcasting host carAnd what do you
(02:33):
what are you talkingabout?
So I first want to talkabout why a podcasting
company would shut down
what what would bea reason for that?
Obviously,bad business practices and
all that sort of thing.
But one of the big reasonsis because of the models
that they tryand operate under.
So for example,the sound of FM,
(02:53):
I don't know if manypeople have heard of that.
They weren't
the biggestof the biggest companies,
but I'd certainlyheard of it.
We this is meand myself, me, myself
and one we were looking atmoving our host over
Geez back in 2020and sound was an option.
We tried them out.
We didn't particularlyenjoy it,
so we ended upgoing with them with Bass
(03:15):
Bus Brat instead.
But I actually did havea personal tie with them.
I had a showwhich I was not an active
and active podcastanymore, could present
in Spanglish.
It was basically bookreviews that I did in
Spanish
and I had done a wholebunch of episodes of it.
I don't know
how many 50, 50 to 100,something like that.
(03:37):
And I just wanted to havethis.
They are to
basicallyjust just have a show
just living in existingand sound.
It was great becausethey had free hosting.
So I was like,Oh, okay, awesome.
Now there's a problemwith this because phrases
never really free.
So there was this
really great articlethat I came across
(03:59):
from the feedYour brand is the
is the nameof this podcast,
and it's hosted by Tracyand Tom Hazzard,
and they actually havea podcasting
company called Productizeand Productize
with a t, I z e dot com,
and they actually had thisarticle February
(04:19):
2nd, 2023.Why podcasting happening?
Why podcasthosting companies quit?
Well, it's a tongue tie
and what you can doto avoid it
not really talking abouthey exactly
the situation I hadI had this business
and SpanglishOP, the podcasting,
the podcast host
companyquit went out of business,
(04:40):
changed their businessmodel.
They they still exist,
but they don't hostpodcasts anymore.
And I looked at moving itover and I, you know,
I dilly dallyaround the deadline
and eventuallyit just I'd let it lapse.
And so that podcastis not up anymore,
although I do still have
all the audio filesand things like that.
So it's not too hardto get it back up.
But I just went, you know,
this doesn't matter to methat much.
(05:01):
It's not that important.
However,it would have been nice.
Now the problemthat they had was
they had a freemium modeland so
if you want to go back to
episodefour of this very podcast
where I had
free is never free, well,even in the feed
your brand,they talk about free
isn't always free,
which is was their versionof it.
(05:22):
So essentiallywhat podcasting
companies do, these hosts,they try and
get as many people inwith a kind of free offer.
And then as the podcastwill grow,
as peoplewant to put more episodes
in things like that,
that's when they say,Hey, look, this is
actually costing us moneyto host this.
You need to jump ontoone of these other plans
(05:44):
or we have all of these
otherand you know, add ons
additions,which you can use.
Okay, cool.
Now, the problem with thisis that competition is
reallytight and you'll see a
picture shortly of justhow many podcasting hosts
there are
and there'sa whole bunch of them
and for example, isa whole bunch of podcasts
(06:06):
as well.
And a lot of themare on anchor.
And I guess I want to sayhere, there's like
4 million podcastsroughly and alone.
A lot of them arethese kind of shows
which people just put upand don't
care about,sort of like I had.
And so there's actuallyonly a relatively small
number of active podcastsaround the 400,000 range.
(06:28):
And so all of these
companies are tryingto get these more active
podcasts usually,
although there are others,of course,
which still have valueand people pay for,
but they make them money
mostlyfrom these small shows
because by definitionmost podcasts are small.
So when you've got thiskind of freemium model,
(06:48):
you'rekind of having to go
after these small shows.
And if you justcan't get enough of them,
get off,
go off to the small shows,and then
kind of upsell them onto aonto a new product
because that'show a lot of podcasts so
podcasts start.
That'show the ME and models did.
We just jumped with a freeone and eventually
we realised,Oh, this is really cool.
We want to keep continuingthis.
(07:09):
Okay,we'll stop paying for this
because we want
more abilityto upload episodes.
We want to have greater
functionality,things like this.
And if you just don'tget that momentum,
that's,that's how you, you end up
crashing and burning ornot running out of money.
And this is what happenedto two sound up
for example.
The other problem thatexist is big bandwidth.
(07:31):
You always talk aboutlike, you know,
big pharma, big,big industrial,
big, big militarythings like this
while big bandwidth.
The problem that a lot ofpodcast host have is
they don't want big shows.
They actually don't
want their customersto really be successful.
You go, okay, well, why?
And so there is anothergreat podcast called
(07:52):
Podcast Pontifications,hosted by Eric Volterra,
and he had thisepisode called
Hitting the Limits of LowCost Podcast Hosting.
At some point,if you're lucky
or very strategic,
your podcastmight become too popular
just too popular for youto stay on the same
low price hosting plan.
Remember,unlimited downloads
sounds all fine and gooduntil your popular
(08:13):
show startscosting them real money.
So yes, this is exactlywhat happens.
Essentially, onceyou start hitting 10,000
or more downloads,
the bandwidthcosts just skyrocket and
once again, this is
because podcasting, it'skind of this on demand.
You can get it
whenever you want,
but when you releasean episode,
(08:33):
if you're very popular,everyone's
going to listento that straight away.
Or, you know, 90%,75% of your audience
will hit that episodewithin the first 24 hours.
And so the bandwidthcosts,
maybe if you coulddistribute it over a week,
it'd be all right
if you had a weekly appepisode.
But that's not howthis stuff happens.
If you get absolutely hitand so
(08:56):
this is whereI guess the the
what are thea lot of the hosts
do is they go, okay, well,once you've got someone
adding
this much bandwidth,you need to start
have a chat with them.
And this is what EvaTerra was saying.
You know,
this is whereyou'll get a message
once you startgetting really popular.
It's like, hey,
(09:18):
you know,your show is doing well.
It's actually startingto cost us a lot of money.
We need to cometo a solution
and either this is
we start paying moreas a kind of flat rate
for your host.
So, you know,
for example,I think we pay $24 a month
for the main modelswith with Buzz Sprout.
If that gotreally popular,
(09:38):
that wouldmaybe start saying, hey,
like you need to startpaying hundred,
maybe you need to start
paying 200just to cover our cost.
And then another way wouldbe, okay, well, perhaps
we can do some sortof ad solution where,
you know, you're the waythat you'll make money
from ads.
And so if we can geta percentage of that,
then the better
(09:58):
your show goes,the more ads you pay,
the more ads are gettingplayed.
The more moneyyou're coming from ad
advertisers, You know,we get a cut of that.
Everyone's happyla di da da da.
But there's always,I guess,
you know,
unless you get thesethings
really aligned,this is where you can have
the misaligned
incentives comingwhere the podcast host
(10:20):
actually kind of doesn'twant you to get popular.
They would ratheryour show stay small
and youplay pay that flat rate
or is so small thatit doesn't even matter.
And so they can offer thatfree free service
and it really doesn'thurt them at all.
But you can you just gothink like, man,
(10:40):
there's there's
probably somethinglingering
in the back of the mindwhere it is
this misalignedincentives.
They don't want youto get better.
They don't want youto get more popular.
So they might even startdoing some things
which would make it
so that you'renot as popular or,
you know, they won't
advertise your show,They won't do everything
that they can toto help you out,
(11:01):
which is a really funnysituation.
You'd think like, Damn,okay, what's
what's going on here?
Is there is there a way toperhaps solve this?
It's not super,
super bad,
but it's still obviouslypeople are writing about
these things.
So it stillobviously is a problem.
And this is wherewe're going to come to.
Okay.
What if we can becomemore closely linked?
And so this is actuallysomething
(11:22):
that I have experimentedwith and is happening
on this very showright now as you speak.
So Todd Cochrane,
who is, I thinkone of the co-founders
or thethe founder of Blueberry,
he made a recent post
on the podcastindex Mastodon,
and he was talking abouthow the shows
using the valuetag made 0.4 BTC.
(11:43):
So this is about40 million Satoshis,
which is 10,000 us from
from beinghosted on blueberry
and using the valuetag there,
which is pretty coolbecause man, that tag is,
it's, it's kind of hiddenout of the way.
It's called experimental.
It's not
(12:03):
the easiest thing to useand yet there's still,
you know, a bit of money
flowing through inthis was
and they're ableto tell this
because they geta 3% split of all of that.
So they would get 3%of 10,000 U.S.
which is if my math isokay, you know, 300 bucks,
not it'snot a crazy amount.
And that'ssince the start of 2023.
(12:27):
I wanted to actually get
a little bitmore details on that.
And, you know, how manypodcasts was that from?
Because I bet
it would be less than 100if I had to say.
But yeah,so that's still cool. And
it'lllink up with some the
stats that I talked about
a couple of weeks agoin the second hour.
But you can haveyou can see, okay,
(12:49):
this is an opportunity
where the hosts have
can partake directlyin the success of the show
and of course is wherenegotiations can occur.
So, for example,this very podcast,
if you boost in 3% of it,is going to
go to blubrry.
If this show gets very,very popular,
I'm going to havemore people boosting it.
And that'skind of how the the value
(13:10):
for value model works,you know?
Yeah, obviouslyyou have to do the ask.
You have to createa good show.
You have to
make sure that people knowhow they can do it.
And all of these sortsof things.
But, you know, roughly4% of people will will
contribute to the show.
And once again,check out an episode
in a couple of weeks
where I'll talk
about my ownvarious statistics
(13:31):
and I'll be able to back
this upwith some actual numbers.
But the bigger the showgets,
the more thatthey will earn.
So once again,this is where it's like
incentivesare directly aligned,
much like how they can
have it with the
the advertisingand if they getting
a percentageof the advertising split,
if they get a percentageof the value
(13:51):
split of thatcoming in, okay, awesome.
They can do this.
And then yeah,negotiations can occur.
I can say, oh, you know,3%, that's a that's a lot.
Todd Like, I'm
I'm, I'm not sure I'mhappy with that.
And he's like a carand the cost man
costs of doing this
you get in very popularwe actually need a bump
it up to 5% And I'm like,Oh damn.
And this is wherethe free market comes in.
(14:12):
And if I don't like that,I could go do
another podcast hostor you know, that
that sort of deal,this is beautiful.
This is how it shouldall work.
Why wouldn't they?
Why wouldn't host jump onto this opportunity?
You know, you hear thesearguments elsewhere, a
value for values,not a steady income.
So the host they need,
(14:32):
you know,a steady stream coming in
and it uses bitcoin,which is a scam.
Oh, my God, Can't do that.It's such small numbers.
Only 10,000us over the course of 2023
people won't pay.
You haveto force them to pay.
I think all of these we'vekind of been debunked
over the course of all ofthe value for value show.
(14:54):
They're all fallacies.
You know,people won't pay.
No, they'll pay.
It's it's just
you just have to ask
and you just have tochange your show
so that it's easier for it
so that they havethe incentives, too,
so that they getpart of the feedback loop
so that they know
that they're actuallycontributing directly
and they are havingan impact
on such small numbers.
(15:14):
You know, go back
to two episodes agoto episode 48.
This is where we saw,you know,
a couple of years ago,it was only 60,000.
That's flowing
through the ecosystema day
now it's closer to 1 to 2million.
Where will that bein two years time?
And that could be anotherwhatever percentage X
(15:34):
that is you know, 150X or something like that.
So it's not hard to see.
Okay.
Well,
you know, it's only
maybe 10,000over the course
of nine monthsat this very moment.
What if that was 100,000or a million?
Okay, Well, that's
that's actually goingto stop
making a big differenceto these podcasting hope
(15:55):
companies, if theycan get a split of that.
You know, BTC is a scam.
I don't want to gointo that one.
v4v is not steady income.
Yeah, sure.
That's a that'san argument and some
but once again,if this is a podcasting
hosting company,if they have 5100
300 a thousand shows,
(16:16):
which they'repart of the split off,
you know,
those showsare going to vary
in their amount as well.
But it's kind ofin the variance that
you'll get some stability.
So once again, there's athere's an option now,
another optionthat is possible.
But, you know,you could be saying,
and this is all risky,what if my host fails?
(16:37):
You know,what if what if Bluebird
just goes out of business?
Ye of little faith?
Do you think I'd forgotten
aboutthe first two properties
that I talked aboutin episode 40?
This being
decentralisationand being self-sovereign.
So this is
why we're going to jumpinto IP FS hosting.
And so
(16:58):
first,
I mean, first ofall, if that's the case,
what if my host failsand just move?
It's not too hard.
You know, I've I've
all of my showshave been on
multiple hostsmultiple times.
It's a bit of a painin the ass, but,
you know, it's it'snot, it's not that hard.
But on a recent podcasting2.3 episode,
episode 145,which had Alberto
(17:19):
from Ask.com and Cameron,who is the guy
who's kind of created Ipfspodcasting, hosting,
it's they gointo this concept
of being ableto do it in a direct
in a peer
to peer manner of
distributing, of having,you know, decentralisation
of your hosting.
So it's not just inthis one central location.
(17:41):
That episodeis super complex.
I roughly knewthe general idea
coming in,
but they got into the techside of things
and they were talkingabout gateways
that are talking aboutall this crazy stuff.
So this is is kind of hardto sustain.
So here'sthe basic overview.
Yeah.
Instead of having onecentral point
where you uploadyour audio
(18:02):
and it's
getting absolutelyhammered,
just like we were talking
aboutwith the big bandwidth,
you can have multipleproviders or peers, each
providing a bit.
So if you want to think of
torrentingor the Pirate Bay,
this is how that worked.
You would have a movieor a music on online.
Multiple peoplewould have this online,
and if someone wantedto get the episode, those
(18:26):
or that movie or whateverit is,
instead ofjust absolutely hammering
one of those peoplewho had it,
that person could justprovide part of the file
and then someone else
could providepart of the file.
Think of it like a jigsaw.
Everyone'sgot their little piece,
everyone ownsthe full thing,
they have the full jigsaw,
but they just providea little piece
(18:46):
to someone new who wantsto get that jigsaw puzzle.
And then that waythey're not,
you know,
gettingabsolutely hammered
and having a thousandpeople
showing up their doorall trying to get
their jigsaw puzzleat the same time.
And so this is whereyou can say,
okay, your peers can helphost your files
so that they're notever offline
(19:06):
if your podcasting hostgoes down well, you know,
or if one of the peersgoes down,
that's okaybecause there's, you know,
50 others, 100 otherswhich are also hosting it.
So once again,this is the the kind of
decentralisation,even permissionless,
because you can havejust multiple people
coming on to usand I'll talk to you
(19:26):
about how I'm doing thisfor this episode
very shortly.
And so once again, it'sthis idea
of the tech behindit is very, very complex.
There's all sorts of crazythings
going on with Ipfs,
which stands
for interplanetary filesystem of file storage.
I've had both and this isthat central idea of
(19:47):
of having multiple filesin various locations.
And yet if one of themgoes down, it's okay
because there's otherswhich are backups for it.
Now, this is not going to
completely replace hostingor anything like that.
They still havea central point
which they linkedto which is,
you know, the host,which I have.
(20:08):
But if that host goesdown, this should
theoretically work.
I actually, you know,
I don't think anyone'stried it out
where the main hostingcompany has gone down
and this is all so new.
So this is just
if you're interested inthese sorts of ideas is a
here'sa little taste of for you.
So getting onto the kind
of peer
to peer incentives, well,why would someone else
(20:28):
host my file?
What'swhat's in it for them?
Because you were just
talking about incentivesbefore.
They needto have a reason for it.
Because even though
it might be onlya little bit of bandwidth,
you know,
they're still providingbandwidth
that's still costing themmoney.
Why wouldwhy would they do that?
And so thisis where it's like, okay,
(20:49):
a high value for valueincentives kick in.
And so
if I provide a split,which I've done for this
very episode, 5% ofthis is going to go to
the Ipfshosting solution thing.
That's going on here,
and I might do thisgoing forward.
I'm not sure I want totest out for this episode.
(21:09):
Then whoever helps host
this filewill get some of the sets
as distributed via
the Magic IpfsSystem technology.
So there's a kind of
like technologywhich is saying, Yeah,
you provide this pieceof the jigsaw puzzle,
you providethe end corner,
you provide thislittle bit in the middle,
and that
all comes together
to form a file whichsomeone can download.
(21:32):
What if I contributesome sets 5%?
And so that 5%kind of goes into a pool.
So each person
who is providing
a piece of that puzzle,then they get
part of the sets for it.
Now, it's
not going to be hugeamounts because
5% of my showand then split that up to
another 100 peopleor something,
their only public to get,
(21:52):
you know,tiny little bits.
But once again,that's compensation
for these tiny little bitsthat they're providing.
So you can see, okay,this is maybe where
the everyone'sgetting a part of the
part of the pie, you know,everyone needs to win.
Is, was the kind ofsubtitle of this episode
and this is whereyou can see,
(22:13):
okay,when incentives work,
when everyone has anincentive to do something
in and
they are alignedand not misaligned,
this is whereyou could go.
All right, sweet.
This is you know, thisthis is making it work
for everyone.
Once again,
there'sall sorts of things
behind this old filesthat are getting
no downloadsin a 48 hour period.
(22:35):
They get removed
unless they're favoritedby someone.
You can just see how
all of thiswould come together.
There's this
things in the backgroundwhich, sure,
it could make itdifficult, but
I'm more see this as the,you know, angel music.
Oh aligned incentivesit's all coming together
(22:55):
as from theThe Emperor's New Groove.
What's his name,Gronk or something?
Oh yeah. It'sall coming together.
So yeah, this is whereit's just a way.
This is wherelike, a kind of like,
littlebusiness episode of saying
the value for valuecan work for businesses.
Once again, this is fordigital products.
It's nota physical products.
(23:17):
I need to see more proofof this working
in the real worldfor a physical product.
I know some examples
and I might do an episodeon that at some point,
but this is definitely onewhere it's like, okay,
this is worthlooking out for.
If I was a hostingcompany,
I would seriously be
looking at doing thisand many of them are.
I know RSS dot com hasthis feature as well.
(23:38):
Blue variables obviously,
and I think all of them
will come aroundat some stage because it's
it isrelatively easy thing to
to just put in thein the actual
what would you call it.
The RSS, the XML file.
It's just the podcastis themselves needing
to learnabout value for value
and why they would want
(24:00):
to ask the listenersto listen on a,
on an app like Fountain
and Stream sitesor to Brustein,
which is hencewhy I have this show here.
All right,beautiful suite.
Let's go onto the Brewster Gremlins
and I'll do some livechats at the same time.
So I have a
a small live chat here,which is just my discord
(24:22):
and I can seewant to be very listening.
So thank youvery much for that.
And so one was asking,is there a predicted path
through where technically
data storage becomescheaper and cheaper
to allow for bandwidthexpansion?
I look, I don't actuallyeven know what that means.
I'm guessingyou're just saying it.
If the bandwidthand data storage
(24:44):
becomes cheaper,which tends to happen
over timewith the internet,
you can see howall of this this happens.
Will willthis kind of make this
be a justan unknown entity,
a non-issue because,you know, audio files
there aren't they aren'tthat big that usually
what in the megabytesrange
(25:05):
you know if unless it'slike a music one which can
need a bit more outthis episode, for example,
it'll probably besomewhere around
40 to 60, I think forabout 45 minutes worth.
So. So this is whereyou could say, Oh, well,
if we just, if,
if everything nextand was the same price,
(25:26):
this would becomea non-issue.
Yeah, potentially.
Typically, though,
what happens is peopleexpand their
that capacity.
So when you get moreenergy
and energy is cheaper,you tend to use more.
So there's you know,
if I could make my audiofiles that much better
by just adding
more megabytes onto them,
even if it was only
(25:47):
a tiny little bit,I'd probably do it.
And so that's one thing.
There was also asking,
could the
podcast businesses, notby default, make podcasts
possibly pay thempercent to as they grew,
as they grow?
Yep, sure they can.
But once again,this is just the
because there'sso many podcast hosts
(26:07):
this is where forcingpeople to do things,
you can lose your customer
pretty easilybecause people would just
go, I'mjust going to go over
to this host here,which doesn't have that.
This I think is
just in relation more likea business thing,
the industry,
because so many peoplewill start a podcast,
(26:27):
not know if they reallywant to do it,
not be serious about it.
And so they don't wantto pay because it's it's,
it's kind of like you needto you need to start
and do it for a whileto realise if you want,
if this is an avenue worthgoing down,
much like we did
one as my co-host
in the miyamoto's,you know,
it was probably onlyinto where we're,
(26:50):
I don't know, 50to 100 episodes in where
we were starting to go.
Like, okay,this is actually something
we really enjoy.
We can keep doing this.
It's probably startworking worthy
of looking at how
we can make this betterfor our audience.
And to do that, thenwe need to start paying.
So I think that's more an
industry thing rather than
the actualbusiness itself.
(27:11):
It if they start trying to
force people to pay, it's
just not going to workas, as great.
And they might, you know,lose those people
who would convert
to becomingpaying customers
if they'd just waiteda little bit longer.
I don't know.
I'm not a podcast host,
so I'm just kind ofguessing there.
But as I mentioned
with those
couple of articles
and there's links
(27:32):
in all the chapter images,
when if you listento this post and
you'll see that peopleare obviously highlighting
these issuesand talking about it.
So there must be issues.
So yeah, there we go.
I'm going to jump ontothe boostagrams here
and thank some people whohave supported the show.
Welcometo the Value for value.
(27:53):
Graham Lounge.
As we were saying,you know, 5% of this
is going to go to Ipfspodcasting, hosting.
So if you are a nodeand you want to help
support this showand you know, get paid
for doing that,
you know, favouritethis episode and,
(28:13):
and you'll get some statscoming in
hopefullyfrom the next week.
You know,
we're goingto have to rely on
very kind
people like the people who
support it in
and I'll say
at the very end
how you cansupport the show
but we've got coming upat the top here
the beard tech.
He says thank youfor the kind words.
This is
the guy who I wastalking about last week
is creating the blogindex.
We're still veryearly days
(28:34):
and anyonewho wants to help dive in
and create something
great with code ideas,funding, etc.,
I'm more thanwelcome to come join in
and help out in matrixor GitHub match.
Seems like a great idea.
The only issueI personally have with
it is all the Trekkies,which is understandable,
but what we aretrying to build
will be 100% self-hosted
not for profit and databroker.
Check a free exclamation
(28:55):
mark 1000 sets sentusing fountain.
Thank you very much,my friend.
Yeah.
Look, honestly,
when it comes to privacythings, I am so oblivious.
I chuck a lot of my stuffout there, so
that's not something I
really care aboutor watch too closely.
So it's good to knowthat other people
are on top of that and,and doing that.
(29:17):
And yeah, once again
when I get some time I,
I'll probably try outmesh someday
but it's it's loweron the priority list.
I see.
Once again Sam Sethi
just absolutely blastingmy channel here with
lots ofit just says received
donation message you know19 sets 19 sets 3958.
So you must have been
playing aroundwith the amounts
(29:37):
because these arestreaming amounts.
But I did see in thishe did send a message
at some points, whereashere we go
POD fans has a statsenabled blog with Zaps
and Bruce love the ideaof also adding splits.
We are creating an RSS2.06 feed and putting it
in podcast indexwith the medium of blog.
Very cool pod fan spin.
(29:58):
What can't you doover there?
What can't youdo? He's coming out with a
the progressiveweb app on mobile in
I think it's like about aweek's time.
So yeah, I'mdefinitely going
help him outwith the testing
and things of all of that.That would be very cool.
But pod vents, it's yeah,it's getting stronger.
It's getting you canlisten live
(30:19):
and I've put up links
and stuff to that as wellso very, very cool.
I see Chad coming in herewith a row of threes.
3333 sent usingCosta matic,
he says playing catch up.
Thank you very much, Chad.
If catch up all you want,
I definitely needto update
all of my episodes again.
I've made it a solid craftpeople.
(30:40):
The first seasonis pretty good.
Apartfrom some of the chapters,
I still need to fix those.
But this first season,all the notes,
all the links,everything works.
I still need to fix up
the boosting amountsfor season two.
So boosting amountsthe splits for season two.
So my to do list
and another one,an exciting one here
from James Cridland,the host of POD News.
(31:03):
Also,
Sam Seth is our partnerin crime over at Pod News
and he saidlike boost 1111
and that'sa row of Richards
sent using fountainanother live on here
from blueberry himself17,776 Baller
using boost cli
This is awesome
we're getting
like basically every
(31:23):
method just need a curecost a boost and that'll
sort it all out, he says.
I inadvertentlyfound myself
in the hosting game,getting a bunch of music
uploaded of over the pastcouple of weeks.
It's been fun.
Snip snip
a reference to the runningwith scissors,
their blueberries,
Bruce Seeleyand his Bruce spot
is actually in my splitsas well.
So all of these boosts,once I finally get
(31:45):
all the live chat andall that stuff working,
that'll
be a veryawesome addition.
And once again,just showcasing
the splits, showcasing
that people are excitedabout all of these things.
The music
obviouslyhas really taken off
and I would encouragepeople to
to just keep an eye outon that because
I'm going to get Adamas well.
(32:05):
I hope to get Adamon the main models
perhaps next month
to talk about that becausehe's been doing it for,
geez, what,close to two months now.
So I think you havesome interesting insights
about the voiceof the music.
But thank you, everyone.Thank you.
Obviously, blueberry.
Thank you for thatBig Bruce man.
Much appreciated.That is going to the ipfs.
So, Chad,if you're also listening,
(32:25):
I know you do some
hosting of nodesand things like that.
If you want a favourite,this one,
that'd be very, very cool.
So that is the Boostagram Lounge.
Once again,
I didn't order it dueto Sam's shenanigans.
Absolute shenanigansgoing on there.
But thank you very mucheveryone, for boosting
in very, very, very cool.
(32:46):
Oh yeah.And then blueberries.
Just gota little thing here
showing that the boost
what actuallyactually works
So awesome legend manyou are incredible.
Keep those scissors.
Just just keep them awayfrom your face.
Your face is beautiful.
Mint And don't
get to too many scars orthings like that in there.
Okay.
Let's get to some tips.
(33:07):
Some tips.
The podcasting host.
I need feedback. People,
if they don'thave a podcast,
they almost certainlyhave a YouTube channel.
So I know Buzz Cast hasa Buzz Brat has podcast.
I know that Blueberryhas the new media show.
I'm pretty sureI've heard that
some of the other
most of the hosting
(33:28):
companies, I believe,have their own podcast.
So this is a perfectopportunity for you
to help support them
and to let them knowwhat you want
because they need to knowabout these things.
If they don't have valuefor value,
if they don'thave a split,
if they don't have live
tag that you want,if they don't have
any of the numerous things
(33:48):
that you want to
to play with,to provide more value
to your audience,they need to know
about these things.
And so
buzz cast, for example,I supported them to Todd
help me get this very livestream set up
when I was with Casta Pod Yassine Handheld me
through all of that.
And by being moreconnected with them,
you do get benefitsfor yourself.
(34:09):
So not only because, look,you're going to say,
Hey, I want this,
I want that,and they're going to go,
Yeah, that's going to takea bit of time.
So buzz cast, for example,a bus.
Brad They haven'tgot the live talk.
I would 100% be using thatbecause I use that
for the modelsand the book reviews.
I will be using that asof a week or two's time.
(34:30):
They haven'tupdated it yet.
They haven't got that
all that functionalitybecause they
they're very much focussedon the consumer on the
what is it, the UI,the UX of making things
run really smoothly,
whereas I'm morein the experimental phase
and I just want to stuff.
I don't care
if it's hotand in care for breaks,
(34:50):
I just want todo these things.
So yeah,this is where it's,
it's like it's worthy ofjust letting them know
that'sand you get benefits.
So open three and pod row,
those are the two thingsthat time
I got added to the modelsand you know,
people were talking aboutthat.
I had James Cridlandto boost it in just before
he mentioned thaton Pod news,
(35:10):
that kind of just, youknow, extra visibility,
extra little functions,extra extra features.
If you go on to POD fans,you'll see that pod
roll is still workingfor my show,
which highlightsother shows
I think are worthyof of you checking out
kind of like a
recommendation listwithin within the
the actual podcastapp itself.
(35:31):
All of these things help.
And so that's just my tipfor today.
You know, ultimatelyBlueberry got my business
because they had thesefeatures like the value,
like being ableto go live.
The live one was a bigone for me.
I really wanted to do thatfor this show.
I was, you know,I was looking at moving it
onto bus sprout,but they didn't have that.
(35:53):
And so once again,the pod,
the podcast hosts, I'm
going to goand spend my money.
And I spent a I can'tremember how much it was.
It was probably about 200and something
Australian dollars
hosting this for a yearon on blueberry.
And, you know,
not only that,but he's also receiving
3% of everythingthat's coming in
so that while he blueberryis receiving that.
(36:17):
So very, very cool.
And that'sjust my tip for today.
Reach out to your host.
Tell them what they
what you want,what you need,
and you know,
be willing toto share some of your your
your profits,
your your value with thembecause
when they get better,you get better.
And it's it's when those
incentives are alignedthat it
(36:38):
it really really takes it
to a to a whole new level.
So and I've just gotblueberry in the chat here
saying live is littaking your show
live takes the productionto a whole new level.
Ten out of tenwould do it again.
I can definitely say forthis show it makes me prep
and actuallyfor the models as well.
I think it makes us prepbetter by doing it live.
(36:59):
So there's there'svariations to this.
I want to talkat some point about
the kind of optimal show
for value, for value,
how you have to actually
change your showa little bit.
But that's definitelyfor a
for another episode
of my app and servicehighlight,
this is a worthy reminderthat you actually
don't need
a podcast hosting companybehind the schemes.
(37:20):
I don't thinkthey used one.
This is very, very show.
I know.
So Spencer, for example,he has a dimly a dim view
feed templatewith comments and notes
to help a musicianwho wants to sell fast.
So he's got this thingwhere it's basically,
you know,there's wavelike out
and there's the music sideprojects.
(37:41):
And once again,these are kind of like
varying ordersof being able to
to host it yourself.
And he's like, Look,this is how you can do it.
Here's somenotes. Anyone can do this.
And this is where I
somewhat agreeand somewhat disagree.
I use cost upload,
which was a self hostingsolution.
It's doableeven for the tech
strugglerslike myself. Okay.
(38:03):
They use a podcastingcompany called Pod Serve,
but I'm pretty sure healters his own RSS feed.
So once again, it's it'skind of like a half
half thingthat he's doing.
And that's somethingthat I want to look at
in the future as well.
But this is whereit's like, okay,
you can, you can do ityourself.
Costa Pod is a selfhosting solution.
(38:24):
I had Digital Oceanas my servers.
I installed their package.
I was to basicallyget all my stuff
uploadedwithout using what
you would call a typicalpodcasting company.
CostaPod actually has added
that service as a thing,
but you can also do it
(38:44):
the open source routeif you want,
and the Self-Sovereignroute.
This is beingable to host it yourself.
Just rememberthere are trade-offs
and time and pain pointsfor all of this.
So for example,
I very humorously
locked myselfout of my very own feed.
So this was for the valuefor value show.
And basicallyI put the locked tag in.
(39:05):
I lost my log in details.
I couldn't log into my ownadministration dashboard
and with the log tagthe companies, basically
the point of that is tosay, I'm not going to
ingest this RSS feedand be able to switch host
because they put the locktag on it,
which really fucked meover,
(39:26):
especially becauseI had one episode left.
It was hilarious.
I had one episodeleft of season
two and I did that,so I basically
had to recreatethe whole thing again
just to be able topublish that last episode.
A good learning pointfor me, and also
good learning pointfor you guys at home.
If you want to do selfhosting, just be prepared.
You got to runningwith scissors, you got to
(39:48):
you've got take some time.
Some things are goingto be harder.
And just like Burberry'ssaying, yeah,
they have a handpacked feed
that they submitto the index.
You know, when things gowrong, that's on him now.
It's not on the podcastinghost.
So the it's good to havethese aligned incentives.
A host can do thingsthat I certainly can't.
(40:08):
I'm not greatwith data management.
I'm not great with,
you know, the realfinicky side of technology
and things like this.
It's awesometo have a host for that
and but it does trade offs
of like I don't have
all the featuresthat I would like,
you know, that's okay.
And you just have to keepthat in mind as a
and yeah,
if you want to knowmore about
how to do self hosting.
(40:29):
So Spencer'sa great resource for that.
So if you go on to the
podcast index Mastodon,you can find him there.
Finally, value for value.
Who is 15% of this showgoing to go to?
So obviously I've gotthe 5% go into the Ipfs
podcasting hosting,
but I want to give 15%to Cameron as well.
(40:50):
This is a dudewho's living by a forest
or a woods. If youlisten to that podcast,
podcasting,2.0 episode, you'll
you'll hearthat was a bit of debate
about whetherit was a forest or woods.
And he was like, he's
just some rendered outin the woods
who has created thisawesome system
(41:11):
that's going to be so muchbackend work.
There'sgoing to be so much time
spent optimisingcertain niche things,
learninghow to use ipfs like that,
that placesthat thing is difficult to
to understand,let alone build on top of.
You know, he's
just another unsung herowho does great work
that could really changean industry
(41:33):
and reminds meof this picture
that was posted on the
podcast index Mastodon
shout out to ChristopherEzine,
which is showshow RSS is holding up
the whole podcastingecosystem.
It's this,
it's this blockwhich is on the very edge
wood kind of like a Jengatower,
you know, it's the blockright at the bottom.
If you pulled that out,
(41:53):
everything comescrashing down
and so this is whereit's like, you know,
I want to getI want to shout out people
who help create thingslike this where
they're doing something
that could thatis another building block
and that could become anintegral building block of
of, you know, hostingin the future, of making
it more reliant,more distributed
(42:14):
of creating incentivesthat work for everyone.
And so, yeah, bigshout out to Cameron
Massive, massive,
massivework that he's doing.
And I'm going toleave it there for today
and just give yousome recommendations
of the value for value
system.
(42:34):
Sorry, there's a couple
before I get into thatas couple
of last frontier, JamesCridland was mentioning
captivate chargesper download,
which some podcasts
which some podcastssee as a bad thing,
but it means they reallywant to help you grow.
And he was an advisor
for them once,
so he knows deeplyabout that as well.
One also sent me a commentas well
(42:55):
to do this was relatedto the memorial,
so that's all good.
So yeah, very, very cool
to have all of thesethings available.
Value for value.
This is a value for valueshow,
obviously it is the valuefor value show.
And there'sa couple of ways
that you can helpsupport the show time,
you know, sharing the showwith someone who
(43:17):
is maybe looking at
wonderingabout podcasting, hosting,
about wondering
aboutgetting a popular podcast,
why are they charging memore,
Why is thishappening to me?
How can I becomemore distributed
so that my followersdon't go offline
and I'm a tech personor they're a tech person?
They love to knowabout all these things.
Pleaseshare the show with them.
(43:37):
I would really love to
start reaching outto a bit of a greater
audience to really.
This is definitelythe show where I'm trying
to I'm trying to helppeople understand
value for value
and the various parts
that gointo all of these things.
Not only the philosophy,but yes, in practice
and the businessside of things as well.
You could also come
join for the live as Jamesas one as Burberry
(43:59):
have done.This is very exciting.
I love gettingthese little interactions
talent.So next week topic, for
example,is on open source.
Now I got a recommendation
of for doing this from Sir
Alex Gates months ago and.
This topicas well as others
were suggested by people.
And if there's a topic
that you would like
to know about of the valuefor value, please
(44:21):
reach out to me.Let me know.
Hey, I really want to knowhow value
for value workswith physical products.
Okay, well,
I'll spend more timeresearching,
much like I have done
today, to seewhere does this work.
I already know,
for example, that churchesand music, you know,
church music, people willsometimes have CDs
and it's likeyou just take a CD.
Anyone can get it.
(44:42):
Just givewhat you think is worth
or what youwhat you can contribute.
And this is very muchon an ethos of V for V,
and Iknow there's a guy at
my local Bitcoin made up.
He does it with honeyand who also does it with
with meatand things like this.
So it is possible,but if you've got a topic,
please please reach outand let me know.
(45:03):
And or just resources.
Things that you think
would be interesting toto hear about.
And then finally,the treasure,
the three options
available for youat this very moment.
You can geta new podcasting app.
I mentioned a whole bunchof them
in the boostagramsjust then,
so people boosted inby a castamatic via pod
fans, by a by a fountainby the Bruce CLI
(45:24):
and other great ones
are things like podcastguru of things like
podverse obviously pod
verse
is a massive one and curiocaster
and I thinkthere's even more
and I'm just forgetting
them at the momentbut you know,
those are a great wholebunch of options.
You're helping supportthe show, you're
helping support Cameron,you're helping support
(45:46):
Burberrywith as Bruce Bartlett,
you're helping support
the Ipfs hosting.
All of this
is getting distributedto various people
and to me, of course,which is
very much appreciated.
I told you how much
my hosting costfor this year,
so I'd really loveto recoup that.
At the very least,that would be awesome.
So you can do itvia there.
You can do itdirectly to me at KYRIN at
(46:08):
get Alby dot com
a slightly riskier routeif you want to do it
that way.
Because I don't checkthese as I do
check in regularly.
But it's harder to seebecause the ALBY extension
with the incoming,it doesn't show me
a full weeks worth.
(46:28):
It only shows me upto a certain point.
So I can't see
every single onethat's coming in.
But yeah, that's
very much appreciated that
you can do itby there as well.
Another optionis going directly
to the podcastingindex site and boosting in
with Alby.
From there,
which will honourall of the splits,
(46:50):
which is very, very cool.
And then finally,if you go to me
Immortals podcast dotcom such support
this one likely won't getread out the PayPal.
I don't check thatfor these shows,
but there is a PayPaloption there
and you can boost and buy
there as well directlyto the memorial.
So lots of differentfor you available
(47:10):
if you're in Brisbane.
You could also I don'tknow, reach out to me and
Henry some cash in personif you want.
Buy me a drink.That'd be awesome.
I'd be really fun.
I'm going to leave itthere for today.
Thank you very muchfor everyone to join live.
Thank you very much foreveryone who contributed.
Thank you very much.
For everyone
who's listening nowlater as well, it's it's
(47:32):
awesometo see all of this.
And I'm really lovingthe the interactions. It's
very heartfelt.
I'm gladto know the effort
I'm putting in is
having some sort of effectand helping out people.
So we'll leave it there.
As I mentioned,next week's
episode is going to be allabout open source
and yet until then,chao for now, Kyrin out.
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