34. When Motherhood Feels Like "Hell:" A Christian Perspective on Reclaiming Joy in Homemaking and Motherhood

Episode Transcript
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Sheila Nonato (00:00):
What would you say to your 19 or 20 year old
self, you know, when you were inthe midst of all the busyness
of being a new mom, of all thenewness of having a baby,
running a household, being awife.
What would you say to her whenshe's not feeling the joy of
motherhood, when there's all thechaos or the stress, or just a

(00:24):
lot of work and less sleep,little sleep.
What would you say to her torecover, to reclaim that joy?

Tessa Weenink (00:31):
I would say put one foot in front of the other.
That's all you need to do.
Just take what's right in frontof you.
Sometimes capacity isnon-existent.
You don't have to do it.
You don't have to do it all,just take the next step.
That's all you need to focus onright now.
But at the same time, keeptaking that next step, because
there is so much hope.
There is a way, and I had totell myself this, often through

(00:55):
health issues, throughdepression, through a postpartum
depression, which is adifferent beast altogether than
regular depression, throughmarital struggles, through
business struggles, all of thissort of stuff.

take one more step and hold on to that hope in
your life.
Hello and welcome to the Veiland Armor podcast.
This is your host, SheilaNonato.
I'm a stay-at-home mom and afreelance Catholic journalist,
seeking the guidance of the HolySpirit and the inspiration of
Our Lady, I strive to tellstories that inspire, illuminate
and enrich the lives ofCatholic women to help them in

(01:34):
living out our vocation ofraising the next generation of
leaders and saints.

Co-Host (01:39):
Please join us every week on the Veil and Armour
podcast, where stories comealive through a journalist's
lens and mother's heart.

Hello, Sisters in Christ, welcome to this week's
episode of Hot Topics, and we'relooking at motherhood.
Is it Heaven or hell?
American singer Chappell Roansaid parenthood is "hell.
All of my friends who have kidsare in hell, she said during an
interview.
Quote I don't actually knowanyone who is happy and has

(02:13):
children at this age, anyone whohas light in their eyes, anyone
who has slept.
Rowan said what is hell?
According to the Catechism ofthe Catholic Church, hell means
"to die in mortal sin withoutrepenting and accepting God's
merciful love means remainingseparated from him forever by
our own choice.

(02:34):
This state of definitiveself-exclusion from communion
with God in the blessed iscalled hell.
" It continues Jesus oftenspeaks of Gehenna, of the quote
unquenchable fire reserved forthose who, to the end of their
lives, refuse to believe and beconverted, where both soul and
body can be lost.
Jesus solemnly proclaims thatquote he will send his angels

(02:55):
and they will gather allevildoers and throw them into
the furnace of fire and thatwill pronounce a condemnation
quote to depart from me, youcursed, and into the eternal
fire.
Now I know we can get exhausted.
Parenthood can take a lot outof you.
It can require sacrificesfinancially, emotionally,
physically and all of us, all usmothers who have given birth,

(03:16):
know that sacrifice all too well, but all in the name of love.
And now, is that really hell?
I know there are stages ofparenthood.
There are phases of parenthoodwhere, when the kids are little,
yes, it does take a lot out ofyou, and especially when we
don't have our village to dependon, we don't have our mothers
who live near us or help,babysitting is out of the

(03:40):
question in terms of the budget.
And when the family is young,out of the question in terms of
the budget.
And when the family is young,this is a challenge.
But is that really hell?
Is that what we consider hell?
And the earthly sense thateverything, that it's an all or
nothing, that it's either heavenor hell?
But you know, are our childrenreally bringing us that much

(04:01):
misery?
I would beg to differ and sayyes, there are challenges,
misery.
I would beg to differ and say,yes, there are challenges, but
that doesn't mean we are notenjoying motherhood, we are not
happy in our motherhood.
Perhaps, you know, we need moreresources, perhaps we need more
skills in homemaking in ourmotherhood, more tactics and

(04:21):
tips to help us to get throughsome of the challenges that we
do face, especially if we aredoing motherhood on our own a
lot of times.
And now, what if motherhooddidn't have to be exhausting,
depleting and costing us so much?
What if there was another waythat a happy, healthy and

(04:45):
life-giving vision of motherhoodis possible?
Let's hear from Tessa, fromAimed at the Heart.
Share her experience ofmotherhood as a homeschooling,
mom of five, a dairy farmer inCanada, a new entrepreneur and a
Christian homemaker.
What is the secret to a happy,healthy and holy motherhood?

(05:06):
Tessa, please give us some tipsand thank you for joining us
this week.
God bless.
Sisters in Christ, let's jointogether in prayer.
In the name of the Father andof the Son and of the Holy
Spirit.
Amen, our Father, who art inHeaven, Hallowed be thy name.
Thy kingdom come.

(05:26):
Thy will be done on earth as itis in heaven.
Give us this day our dailybread and forgive us our
trespasses, as we forgive thosewho trespass against us, and
lead us not into temptation, butdeliver us from evil.
Amen, Hail Mary full of grace.
The Lord is with thee.
Blessed art thou amongst women,and blessed is the fruit of thy
womb Jesus.
Holy Mary, mother of God, prayfor us sinners, now and at the

(05:49):
hour of our death.
Amen, in the name of the Fatherand of the Son and of the Holy
Spirit, Amen.
And let's hear Tessa.
Welcome back, Tessa.
In one of our YouTube shorts,actually, of you talking about
how you have been teaching yourkids how to be responsible.

(06:12):
One of them had over 500 views.
I think.
At least three of them werevery popular because people,
moms especially are interestedin knowing how do you have a
less stressed and more blessedmotherhood.
So I'm just going toreintroduce Tessa again.
Tessa is a mom, life coach, ahomeschooling mom, an

(06:33):
entrepreneur and also a dairyfarmer, and I don't know how you
have time for all these things,tessa, but that is amazing.
Welcome back, and can I ask youwhat is your mission statement?

My desire to affect change in the world has
always been to, I'm a firmbeliever that moms are the
foundation of society and thatall of society is built on what
happens within our homes.
So my life goal is to rebuildsociety by rebuilding moms,
helping them increase theircapacity.
That's been a word, that'sreally a phrase, that's been
really big in my life lately.
Increase your capacity so thatyour life, your marriage, your

(07:28):
motherhood is not draining you,so that you do have left like
more to give to your surroundingcommunity, rather than feeling
drained and always coming from aplace of depletion.
So my real life goal thatsounds really ambitious is to
rebuild society by rebuildingmoms rebuild society by

(07:50):
rebuilding moms.

That's, That's a beautiful and a gigantic task,
but we all have to start, youknow, from the foundation.
So can you help us sort ofbuild that foundation?
How do we have a happymotherhood?
Because, you know, in, I guess,tv shows or other media, you
know, we always see like the momis always stressed, she's
always doing so many things.

(08:11):
She's working.
Now she has to come home and dothe, you know, the laundry, the
dishes, everything, prepare thedinner.
She's the super mom.
And then there's sort ofsometimes a sense of maybe
depletion, you know, or maybe alittle unhappiness, or maybe
resentment if she feels likeshe's taking on everything.

(08:31):
So how do we recover, reclaimthis joy of motherhood that is
rooted in our faith in Christ?
How do we?
How do we do that?

OK, so that's really interesting.
I don't know how much I sharedon our previous podcast about my
start into my journey ofmotherhood, but when I was 18, I
was diagnosed with clinicaldepression.
So I started motherhood from aplace of depression and
overwhelm and it took me areally long time to move out of

(09:06):
that, like build myself up with,like give myself enough skills
and mental training, thephysical health stuff I have
struggled with a lot of reallysome completely not related to
me, just really bad luck stuff,but other stuff based on chronic
health issues.
So it took me a really longtime to figure out how to serve

(09:30):
my family and not feel stressedand overwhelmed.
I think sometimes we look atthese moms that are on the other
side of this journey and think,oh, they've always been this
way.
But that's not the reality.
Most of us are startingprobably right where you are,
maybe even further back.
I mean, I look at a lot of mymom friends that I've been in my
life for long periods andthey've had different challenges

(09:52):
, but every single one of us hashad struggles to overcome.
But so, as a Christian, I trulybelieve that the number one
place and the number one placewhen I go through, because
depression is a little bit likea roller coaster you end up on
like easier times and you end upon more difficult times, and
every time that I get to one ofthose really, really difficult
stretches, the first place thatI've always gone is reconnecting

(10:16):
with God and making sure that,if nothing else happens, at
least I am leaning on him andconnecting with him.
And so, for me, when I'm reallyreally rock bottom, the first
thing I do is try to think ofthree things I can be grateful
for.
And it sounds really simple,and truth is that process is

(10:41):
actually really simple.
It takes sometimes five, 10minutes and I physically write
it down.
I'm a pen to paper kind ofperson.
I have all of the digital techand, like you know, I've got the
smartphone, I've got a tabletthat I can like write on, but
when I really need to, what Ineed is just like a journal or
just a sheet of loose leaf, ascrap sheet of paper.
I used to find I had stickynotes that I would write these

(11:03):
things on, but to put pen topaper and just write three
things, lord, and I did thisfirst thing in the morning,
before my day had come, so myday wasn't coloring it, so I
started my day from a place ofgratitude like Lord.
I am so grateful that I have aroof over my head when it's
raining, that I have childrenwho know how to dress themselves

(11:25):
, you know just really seeminglyminor things, but it starts
your day in a good place and itstarts your day connecting with
God.
Because for me, the wholethought of spending massive
amounts of time in deep prayeror reading scripture when I had
my little ones in my lap, in myarms all the time, it was next

(11:45):
to impossible.
But starting just from thatpoint of three things of
gratitude, and then I wouldexpand, once that kind of became
a regular in my life, Iexpanded to three items of
prayer Lord, help me today withthe lack of sleep.
Help me today with thisphysical ailment.
Please help me just get alittle bit of laundry done today

(12:05):
.
And just like really point form, but starting it simple, but
starting with God.
From that point, once you startfilling your spiritual cup and
it's not, you're not fillingyour spiritual cup at that point
you're letting God pour intoyou so that you were starting,
you're finding that center ofpeace within him, regardless of

(12:26):
the storm that is brewingoutside, you know, like in a
hurricane.
I'm not from a hurricane areawhatsoever, I'm from Southern
Alberta.
There are no hurricanes here,but I have read about them and
there's the eye of the storm.
Right, so you can be in the eyeof the storm and things seem
really calm, but there's stillchaos around you and I kind of
feel like a lot of life is spenttrying to stay in that eye of

(12:47):
that storm.
There's always going to bechaos, there's always going to
be challenges and I think, asI'm saying, it sounds a little
pessimistic, but God does notpromise us an easy life, but he
promises to be with us in thelife that we are in and so
helping him be like that anchorin the midst of the storm.
From that point you startfilling the needs of your family

(13:08):
and your children.
But if you are starting it fromlike, oh my goodness, I first
have to get all of my work doneand then I can focus on my kids.
Oh, and once I've got my kidsall settled out, then I'll go
and have a private prayer time,it's not going to work.
You're building from theoutside in and you're going to
run into like pushback everystep of the way, because you
should be working from thecenter out, starting with God,

(13:30):
then moving into families, andonce you have your, your family,
filled, then you can move outinto the greater world, into
things like whether it bevolunteering elsewhere,
contributing to the world inother ways beyond just staying
sane while you're a mom.
Does that make sense?

Yes, it does so, if I'm understanding it
correctly, sort of the buildingblocks, the building foundation.
We start with God and prayer.
Do you have a set time?
You know, once you get up, doyou go somewhere?
Is there a prayer space?
Do you have a routine?
How does it work for you andhow long Some people are like I

(14:10):
don't have an hour.
How do I pray if I don't havean hour?

Yeah.
So I have six kids that wehomeschool and they're always
here.
There is no quiet prayer time,very few seasons.
Right now.
My littlest is going to be twotomorrow.
Actually, as of the recordingof this, so he's two and that's
a very different stage than whenyou have a brand new baby.

(14:34):
When you're in those seasonsgetting an hour away, it just
doesn't happen.
So for me personally, when Ihave little ones, I just go and
I grab my morning coffee and sitin my comfy chair and I have my
newborn or my baby in one arm.
Often another young child willcrawl into my lap and then, as

(14:55):
long as they're not in my lefthand because I'm left-handed,
then I can still write.
If they are, and if my arms arefull and I physically do not
have a hand free to write,because you know children like
to be on mom then I will justeven almost mentally think my
praise and prayer.
I call it my three items ofpraise, three items of prayer.

(15:16):
I think that other people willcall it a daily exam and where
they do five items of praise,five items of prayer, and trying
to think there's another one,five, I can't remember anyways,
but I limit myself to three,because otherwise I can't think
beyond three.
First thing in the morning,before I've had my coffee, at

(15:37):
this point I grab my morningcoffee, which is often made with
a toddler on my hip.
Or my 14 year old now hasdecided he's drinking coffee.
So a lot of mornings I'll comeup and he's gone outside to do
his farm chores.
He comes in and he makes coffee.
So then I could just pour mycoffee.
And I've learned, if I sit atthe kitchen table and tuck my
chair in really close, the kidsphysically can't get into my lap

(15:59):
.
Sometimes that works.
Occasionally my toddler willliterally crawl onto the table,
just sit beside me on the table.
It doesn't have to be perfect tobe productive.
It doesn't have to be perfect.
You don't have to have hoursand hours of alone time.
God will meet you where you are.
And if all you have is 35seconds to shoot off a quick

(16:21):
prayer and say, lord, I am sothankful for these wonderful
people that you have filled myarms with and my lap prayer, and
say, lord, I am so thankful forthese wonderful people that you
have filled my arms with and mylap with and my table with, god
will meet you there.
He will meet you where you are.
It doesn't have to be fancy.
Start where you can, as mytwo-year-old now gets bigger, a
lot of times in the mornings heis toddling off to play with his

(16:42):
siblings, or my kids makethemselves breakfast If they
want to eat in the morning.
I'm not doing it.
I'm not feeding them.
They feed each other.
So then he will go and they allwill get their breakfast stuff
done.
And my time I'm still at thekitchen table.
I'm still interrupted.
No-transcript.

(17:25):
To be perfect, it doesn't haveto be quiet.
It's going to be what you arecapable of doing.
If you're going to wait forperfection, it's never going to
happen.

Yes, so I love this idea.
So when you start the day yousaid you start with gratitude.
You talk to Jesus, you readscripture if I'm listening to it
correctly and then you write itdown and sort of contemplate
amongst the busyness of thestart of your day, but that kind

(17:57):
of, you know, like the coffee,it's your spiritual kind of fuel
, as you were saying, likefilling your cup with God.
And so does that, since you'rea life coach, so does that sort
of orient your mindset for theday that you know start with
gratitude, meaning thank you,and so when things are thrown
your way that you don't expect,you are able to kind of go back

(18:22):
to that gratitude, that thankyou God, even if something
happened that you didn't expect,you're able to bring that
mindset and change that sort ofnegative situation into a
positive.
Is that sort of how you goabout it?

Yeah, yeah, sort of.
As you're speaking, I'mthinking of that, one of the
scripts that I really really hadto drill into my head, that
I've been working on since, Iguess since my daughter was born
and she's five.
So I am quick to recalibrate,because I was not.
I do not do change.
I'm a very linear thinker andreally like to.
Before I had kids, I was aperson that had my schedule

(19:00):
planned down to the minute, myto-do list planned down to the
minute, my to-do list planneddown to the minute very type A
in that sense.
So, letting go of the controlwith kids, you have to to a
point.
I mean you obviously need acertain amount of structure, but
things are going to happen, andhow can you pivot throughout
that?
And a lot of it is, I mean,part of it is just having kind

(19:20):
of pre-made plans for, oh, if achild gets sick, this is how I
can respond, and some of thatcomes with experience or talking
to other more experiencedmothers I had.
My son was sick a couple ofdays ago and the older kids can.
I could go to work and theywill kind of take care of each
other.
But it was the baby, my toddler, who's still, he's still my

(19:42):
baby.
I mean, he's two but he's stillmy baby.
And so that was.
It took a different kind ofrecalibration.
If it was my first, I wouldn'tknow what to do in that
circumstance.
People think six kids is hard,but by the time you get to the
six you've already been throughall of this.
I knew kind of how he was goingto behave.
So when he was clinging to meall day, it wasn't a surprise
and it didn't drain me because Iwas expecting it.

(20:03):
So being quick to recalibrateis partially knowing the options
that are available to you.
But starting the day with Godreally does set the tone for
your day, even if it.
I have a friend who, the minutethat her alarm clock goes off
in the morning, she opens hereyes and then closes them again

(20:24):
and says a really quick prayerlike God, please be with me
through my day and help me tosee the joy.
And it's finding peace, not inthe beauty of life and in the
love of life, although that'sabsolutely there, but finding
beauty and peace in spite of allof the things that are going on

(20:45):
.
And as somebody who's got arather full life, one thing I
want to point out is.
My life did not start this full.
I started with one child, justthe same as everybody else.
That's not true.
Some people start with twins ortriplets, but we start at the
beginning.
I now do have six kids andseveral businesses and all of
this other stuff going on, but Ididn't start here.

(21:06):
I built up those skills overthe last.
I've been a mom almost 17 yearsnow and I built up all those
skills over this time.
So give yourself the grace tosay this is where I'm at right
now.
What can I do right now, inthis moment?
So, when you do have somethingthrown your way, like an
unexpected sick child, or yourvehicle breaks down, okay, you

(21:26):
can still find peace within thatstorm.
And what can I do in thiscircumstance?
Even though you can be stressedand overwhelmed and depleted,
you don't have to do it all.
But what can you do?
Just focus on that one thing.
Focus on that one thing.
You know what.

(21:47):
I can get somebody to cover forme at work.
I'm working outside the home forthe first time in like 16 years
.
I worked a little bit outsidethe home when my eldest was a
baby, but other than that I'veworked within my home and on the
farm I guess, technically inthe barn, is outside the home,
but I could take my kids with me.
Now I work at a children's playplace, an indoor play place in
town that a friend and I justbought a few months ago, and so
I have my shifts that I need todo there, and I thought, OK, my

(22:11):
options are to leave my toddlerat home with his siblings or to
ask my business partner can youfind a way to navigate this?
It turned out she was able tonavigate this but, worst case
scenario, we would have shutdown for a couple of hours.
She ended up finding childcarefor her kids.
You don't know how it's going towork out, but there's always a
way forward.

(22:31):
There's always something, evenif it's something small, that
you can do, and my somethingsmall was I needed to sit and
cuddle and deal with all thelaundry that happens when you
have a sick toddler later.
Don't stress about it, it'sgoing to happen.
Stress doesn't make it.
Don't borrow worries fromtomorrow.
Is that the saying?
Just focus on what you can doright in this moment.

And I love that you're talking about seasons of
motherhood and the buildingblocks building that foundation.
So for those young moms orwomen who you know may want to
become a mother in the future,if they're sort of they're
trying to navigate everything,everything is new.
And for the young mom, let'ssay kids are small and they

(23:20):
don't have.
You know, I think nowadays noteveryone has their parents to
come and help them.
Maybe they're not living nearthem or they don't have a
babysitter.
It's just not in the budget atthe moment.
How can they build thatcapacity within themselves and
also to have that joy inmotherhood that you know?
Let's say, yes, I'm home allday.

(23:42):
Or you know I don't have ababysitter, but how can I manage
everything and still keep mypeace and sanity If I'm home all
day?
Let's say that was my situationa few years ago when the kids
were very little.
And yeah, just, you know, howdo you keep that peace?

First of all know that it's normal, totally
normal, to be the sanity yes,keeping my sanity.
I very much relate to that.
So, so much, and I, most of mymotherhood journey, haven't had
any support.
I have had good friends, butthey all have also had their own

(24:29):
little ones and childcare.
Swapping it just it was neversomething some moms will like
say, oh, I'll take your kids,you take mine.
My kids were always really,really attached to me.
My first four kids were veryattached to mom and still very
introverted homebodies andchildcare regularly for them,

(24:50):
even if I was like in the homewhich, again, I never had this
until I think my fourth was ababy.
When I asked my friend's 14year old daughter to watch the
kids for an hour so that myhusband and I could go for a
drive, that was the first timewe ever didn't have kids with us
.
They were always with me.
So I relate very, very much tonot having that support.

(25:11):
I should say not having thatsupport in that sense and in
that case you kind of have toraise your own village and we
talked about this on the lasttime that I was on your podcast.
Was getting your kids involvedin something as simple as
homemaking, communicating reallyclearly with your spouse, I

(25:31):
feel like.
But at the same time we don'tdo ourselves any favor when we
do not allow our spouse to seethe truth of what's going on in

(25:51):
our heart.
Now this is very different.
You can go to the other sideand go into like nagging and
controlling, or you can go intobeing a doormat.
I mean being really blunt.
There there are, and I thinksometimes within we feel like
scripture is kind of teaching usto be a doormat.
But that's not true.
Part of being in a marriage isI look at iron, sharpens iron it

(26:15):
is our job to edify, uplift andsupport our husbands in their
pursuits and what they feel Godhas called them to, our husbands
in their pursuits and what theyfeel God has called them to.
But at the same time it is notdoing them any favors by not
communicating when we arefeeling that doormat kind of
feel like when he comes homefrom work, for example, and says

(26:36):
oh, I just need two hours in myman cave to decompress from
work, and my husband and I gotmarried young to decompress from
work.
And my husband and I got marriedyoung.
We met at 17.
We're married at 19.
So we had the privilege ofgrowing up together.
We've been married over 20years now, but we were both
really young when we got married.
However, a lot of times when awoman has a baby, she has to

(27:00):
grow up.
She just does because it's yourlittle heart walking around
outside or, you know, sittingbefore they're walking.
You know what I mean.
And our husbands?
Their transition is different.
So when we, in a loving voice,can communicate to them that you
know what I understand, you'redone work at five o'clock and

(27:22):
that you need time to decompressfrom work, can you please do
that on the drive home, so thatwhen you get home from work, I
can take time to decompress too?
Because your work, it's work.
Let's face it.
You are working 24-7 as amother and with a lot of polite

(27:42):
communications.
This is something I do in mylife coaching.
It's not so much something thatI've offered in standalone
courses, but because marriage isa delicate situation.
It's not something I typicallyspeak about, but I do truly
believe we as women do ourselvesa disservice when we don't
communicate these things in akind and loving way to our
husband, not expecting that he'sgoing to understand it right
away.
I think my husband and I weremarried for like 14 or 15 years.

(28:06):
When I had a conversation Ifinally he's got a mechanical
brain and so I finally explainedit to him I can't even remember
the exact wording, but using acar analogy which I'm not a
mechanical brain, so I had toget really creative with this
but he finally understood that,yes, you get home from work,
from this job, but now you're atthis job You're not done work

(28:29):
until the kids are in bed, anymore than I'm done work till the
kids are in bed.
But just his finalunderstanding of that has game
changer.
I don't do bedtimes anymorebecause he actually enjoys it.
He likes doing the baths andthe bedtimes and whereas for me,
by the end of the day I'mstressed, I'm done.
So that's one thingCommunicating really clearly

(28:51):
with your spouse about whereyou're at, not in a whining way,
but just in a hey, these arethe facts.
Can we find a way to navigatethis so that you and I are both
part of this parenting team andthe homemaking team?
Just because he's done work atfive doesn't mean the work is
done.
There's still work to be doneat home.
He lives there too and thenalso teaching your kids from a
really young age, bringing theminto your world.

(29:13):
It starts really with justconnecting with your children.
So my two-year-old does not dolike he's not capable of caring
for the home but at the sametime he loves to help out his
siblings with the dishwasher.
So he will empty the dishwasherand I put all of my dishes on a
lower shelf which, yes, hasresulted in some broken dishes.

(29:33):
But he is able to go, grab aplate from the dishwasher and,
under the supervision of me orhis siblings, contributes, he
puts it on the pile of plates.
That's not hard for atwo-year-old to do and when you
start him, when they're young,it's second nature.
You live in the home, you carefor the home.
One of the scripts that myfamily has is our home is a

(29:55):
blessing from God and we showour gratitude to him by taking
good care of it.
The same thing with siblings,when siblings are fighting,
because as much as my kids doget along really, really well,
we still have squabbles Notnearly to the extent that a lot
of other families do, because Iteach my children to serve each
other.

(30:15):
Your siblings are a blessingfrom God and we show our love
and gratitude to them by playingwith them in their zone rather
than trying to control all theplay or by serving them, say you
know what?
I know that that's not yourtowel on the floor, but please
pick it up anyways.
So my kids do each other'slaundry.
They clean the bathrooms.

(30:36):
My older kids based because ofum, because partially of just
the natural way that things inour home go, because I have
physically not been able to andmentally like because of
physical and mental health,there have been many seasons of
my life when I just haven't beenable to do what a normal mom
would, so my children have hadto step up.
But it's also benefited all ofus, I think, in a massive,

(30:58):
massive way, so that I don'tfeel stressed and overwhelmed
when I have extra on my plate.
It's currently tax season, soI'm trying to prepare
information to send to theaccountant for a couple of
different businesses so thatthey can get the taxes done.
That's an extra busy seasonPlus.
We've just did the grandreopening of a business, our

(31:19):
grand opening of a business intown where I'm working out of
the house again three days aweek and choir season started
again and I'm the executivedirector at our local choir, not
conductor.
I direct, like the management,the admin side, but all of these
things are only possiblebecause I built up a village
within my home, because I havecreated I've, yeah, created my

(31:43):
own really with my family and mychildren, by being really clear
and consistent withcommunicating the importance of
supporting each other.

Wow.
So, if I'm understanding thiscorrectly, so in terms of the
building the foundation, youexposed your kids to the
responsibilities at home, evenif you know whatever they could
do based on their ability, andthen you had a conversation with
your husband and, I'm assuming,with your children too, to sort
of explain to them this is howwe will be running this

(32:15):
household.
You're going to have to chip inbecause it's a team.
I think from the last interviewyou were talking about the team
effort that you want all theplayers to feel like they're the
MVP Meaningful contribution isa phrase that I use a lot.

Kids crave meaningful contribution.
They want to be part of theteam.
Absolutely, that's beautiful.
And I will say I got to saymultiple conversations with my
husband.
Okay, it's not just oneconversation, multiple
conversations.
It's been 20 years ofconversations with my husband,
17 years of mothering mychildren.
In this vein, there's a reasonwhy God gives us 18 years with

(32:50):
them under our roof, or more.
It's not an overnight thing,but it is a possible thing.

And so I don't know if this is sort of a
male-female brain situation, butso I have done this, I am
guilty of doing this, but, yes,the lack of communication and
sometimes also maybe frustration.
At the end of the day you'rejust and you don't know how to
communicate, you're justexhausted.
But sometimes, like yeah, Ijust don't straight out tell my

(33:25):
husband, like, can you please dothis for me?
I don't know, take out thegarbage or this, and that, like
I kind of, yeah, it's, it's notgood.
But sometimes I have, you know,sort of hinted at it.
Oh, the garbage is full again,but you know, like not in a nice
way, yeah, so that's thenagging.

Marital communication advice that our
premarital counselor gave us.
Now, keep in mind we were 19 atthis time and he was a little
uncertain because we were soyoung.
And he told me that and myhusband was sitting or my future
husband at the time was sittingright next to me.

(34:07):
He says I just want to tell youa little bit about how men
communicate.
Okay, we do not do subtle Witha man.
You need to state it bluntly.
You have to hit them in theface with a two by four or they
will not get it.
So when you say to your husband, oh man, the garbage is
overflowing, he looks at it ohyeah, it is, and that's that
right, and so it's.
And I tell this joke oftenabout my husband because it's so

(34:29):
true he does not take subtlety.
Well, and our premaritalcounselor said you need to hit
them in the face with a two byfour.
I joke about how I need to hitmy husband in the face with a
two by 10.
So I learned really early onthat if I want something, I need
to be really, really explicit.
So instead of saying, oh, thegarbage is really overflowing

(34:49):
right now and he'll say, oh yeah, it is, and that that's
honestly, a lot of times timeshow far your husband's mind goes
and other times, you know basedon past conversations, at that
moment he's going to be like, oh, here it comes again.
Right, and sometimes rightfullyso, because, yeah, I'm not
always super polite with myhusband.
I speak to him in frustratedway.

(35:11):
But if we can make betterpatterns in communication, say,
oh, you know what, you'reactually headed right out, why
don't I grab this bag of garbage?
I'll tie it.
You're going right out the door.
Can you please just put it inthe dumpster?
Or I don't know, do they havedumpsters in town?
How does that work?
We have a dumpster that's likeby my bar and it's like right
next to where my husband goes.

(35:31):
So that's, and I will literallylike, hand him the bag, oh, can
you please just put this in thedumpster.
And at that point most men arelike, oh yeah, no big deal,
right, they do it withoutthinking this.
This is the same way withtraining children.
You start them really small.
Training children, you'reallowed to say training children
.
You're not allowed to saytraining husbands, but you're uh

(35:53):
, so with kids, I will say and,and husbands are really similar,
although again, that's a reallytricky conversation.
Training our husbands.
I don't want to look at it thatway, but it's maybe more like
learning how to communicate moreeffectively with your husbands,
but with a child, because noteverybody's starting with their
kids when they're two years oldand they just empty the

(36:13):
dishwasher because it's secondnature, because it's something
they've done their whole lives.
No, many people are startingwith five, six, seven,
eight-year-olds teenagers.
It is if you were to tell ateenager who has never lifted a
finger in the home okay, go, doall the laundry.
Their brain is going to justfireworks are going to go off
and you're going to getimmediate resistance because
they don't know how, they don'tknow what, they don't know,
they're instantly stressed andoverwhelmed.

(36:35):
You're going to send them intothat emotional red zone and
cause a ton of stress for them,which is going to cause a ton of
stress for your relationship.
If, however, you were to say oh, you're headed down the hall,
can you please grab this, like,just hand them like the kitchen
towel, please put this in thelaundry basket, they will almost
do it without thinking andthey'll, oh sure, and that is a

(36:56):
a yes response.
So it's small enough that thereis no reason for them to object
.
So you are um oh, there's aword for it creating barriers of
resistance.
You're decreasing the barriersof resistance, the barrier of
entry, like it's like aneconomic term.
Decreasing barriers of entry,yeah.

It works with our kids too.

You are decreasing their need to resist
because it's such a small taskthat they almost don't even
think about resisting.
And then they say yes.
And then you do this a fewtimes and they get in the habit
of just saying yes and grabbinglaundry when they go down the
hall.
Then next time you say oh hey,I see you're going to go down
the hall.
Can you just grab the towelfrom the sink and toss it in the

(37:40):
thing?
Well, now you're one stepfurther, and it's the very same
thing with husbands.
It's almost always that spouses.
It's not that they're notwilling, it's that they don't
know, because we're notcommunicating clearly and, let's
face it, a lot of times they'reexhausted at the end of the day
too, which is when we approachthese kinds of things.
It's very different if they'vebeen able to sleep in on a

(38:01):
Saturday morning and it's 10 or11 o'clock.
Coming up on lunch and saying,hey, can you go get the butter
from the fridge so that I canmake lunch.
That's again creating a reallysmall yes response.
And now, all of a sudden,they're helping you in the
kitchen Right, because you'vebeen clear and you haven't
overwhelmed them.
Does that make sense?

Yeah, yes, absolutely.
And I my husband's going to belistening to this, so I have to
say he does take out the garbage.
So I just gave a bad example,but no, the garbage is an easy
one.

I use that example all the time with my
kids, and yet my kids alwaystake out the garbage.

But, yeah, what I sample all the time with my
kids and yet my kids always takeout the garbage.
But, um, yeah, what I see whatyou're saying is that you know.
So, yeah, I do what you'resaying about being like husbands
coming home being exhausted.
I think that's also part of why, um, I and me, and probably
other women they don't want tosay it out, you know, stay
straight to them that you got todo this, you got to do that
because I'm mindful that he's,yeah, worked a full day and he's

(38:58):
also tired, um, and I don'twant to add another burden.
But then the thing is, when Ikeep it to myself, then it's
like you know, kind of likefestering inside.

Yeah, I think you are adding burden in that
because, yeah, it's the samething as as kids.
We don't do them any favors bynot teaching them the skills
that they need to survive in thereal world.
We do not do our husbands anyfavors by not teaching them how
to run the household when we'renot available, whether it be you
go to a retreat for a weekendand he doesn't know how to do

(39:30):
things.
That's not fair to him.
Why would you put him in thatsituation?
Uh, there I.
I gave an example of a littlebit different example, but I
think it goes in this veinrecently to a friend who we
talked about how I like to planthings.
I am a list maker, I am aplanner.
I do not do spontaneousactivities.
My husband is the fun one wherehe will have these ideas and

(39:56):
they're spontaneous.
He comes to me on a Fridaymorning and we had gotten a
camper, never used it, and saysto me and we had four little
kids at this time four, maybe itwas five, four or five kids
anyways.
He says to me we should gocamping this weekend and my
instant response was panic.
But because I knew that that isjust my brain, panicking at the

(40:22):
thought of we need to likeclean the camper.
We need to fill the camper, Ineed to pack all the kids stuff.
I don't know how to do any ofthis.
This was in.
Camping is a new skill to myfamily.
At that point and I took a stepback, took some deep breaths.
I had been working really,really hard with a life coach at
this time and she was teachingme to kind of overcome that
panic, anxiety response and Isaid, okay, let me think on this

(40:44):
.
So what I did?
He went back to work.
He literally came in the housebut because the barn is right
across the yard from my house,he came in the house, said to me
, hey, we should go camping.
And then left back to the bar,like, okay, just pause, we're
going to pause this, we're notgoing to talk about it for a
while, you're going to let mybrain process this.
I made my lists and instead ofsaying an instant no which would

(41:07):
have been my response probablysix months before that date,
just because I didn't have thecapacity to do that At this
point, I just said, okay, we'regoing to pause this conversation
.
I made my list and I figuredout okay, I actually can
navigate this.
So it looked like I was beingspontaneous for him.
But really it was me planning,making the plan to fulfill his

(41:32):
spontaneity.
And where was I going with this?
Oh, somebody said to me when Iwas explaining this, this
difference in how our brainswork.
She's like oh and yeah, youhave to pack for the kids and
you have to pack for yourhusband.
And I said no, why would I packfor my husband?
He's a grown man, he knows whathe needs for a weekend.
Oh well, what if he forgets hisswimming trunks or his
underwear or something?
I'm like I don't know, that'son him, right, I right, I'm not

(41:58):
gonna baby my husband.
I will pack for thetwo-year-old.
I'm not gonna pack for my10-year-old.
He knows how to read.
I gave him a list.
He knows what to pack.
And we have had times when we'vegone camping and one of my kids
has like forgotten all of hissocks, for example.
I'm like, well, I guess you'redoing bare feet, not a big deal,
right?
Or one of them forgot a coatand it was kind of like a windy,
rainy trip and he layered onsweat.
I'm sorry, but you're oldenough to read a list, you're

(42:20):
old enough to pack your ownclothes.
And so I don't even make a listfor my husband and they were
shocked that I didn't have tomake a list for my husband.
And I was shocked that, likeyour husband's a grown man and
he doesn't know how to pack fora weekend away and I remember it
was a retired couple and shewas visiting a friend and the
husband didn't know how to makehimself a sandwich, so he went

(42:45):
without lunch because he didn'tknow how to feed himself.
Like, is that fair to ourhusbands to think that they are
as incapable as small childrenwhen it comes to this stuff?
That's not fair to them.
But when you think of a lot ofthe sitcoms sorry, sitcoms that
I don't know I think you and Iare about the same age that we
had growing up.
I don't know if they're thesame anymore, I don't watch a
lot of tv, but it was basicallythe dad is a great big oaf who

(43:07):
needs everything done for him inthe house.
Well, that's not fair.
He's a grown man who'sperfectly capable of acting like
a grown-up, just like you arecapable of acting like a
grown-up.
So it's not fair to ourhusbands if we treat them like
children yes, absolutely, andit's.

It's great that you you know in the beginning
you were talking about theconversation, the communication,
how important that is tocommunicate what you're going to
be doing as a family, as youwere saying, like we, you need
to let your kids in on.
I guess it's almost like asecret, you know, like the
homemaking secret when doeseverything go?
How does everything go?
And also, to have your husbandon board, your partners, right?

(43:48):
Your equal partners.
And yeah, exactly, and your kidstoo.
You're also building themcapacity so that when they grow
up, when they have their ownfamilies, they can do the same
thing and they're going to havemore joy.
Right, because I find so.
I started reading the Bibleagain, started from the
beginning.
So what I've been learning islike how God is a God of order

(44:11):
and he has rules.
You know the Ten Commandments,leviticus, I'm now in Numbers,
but what is the but all these?
What is the point of all theserules?
What's the point of order IsGod is giving us, you know,
capacity.
We're not just infantilechildren.
He wants us to grow up in ourfaith and in a relationship with
Him, but all these rules arealso to make us, to help us in

(44:33):
becoming happy, you know, tolasting happiness.

To decrease that stress and overwhelm.
How many of us came intomarriage and motherhood without
these skills?
Why would we put our childrenthrough the same struggle?

Absolutely.
I feel like there's a revivalof this sort of homemaking
domesticity.
Revival of this sort ofhomemaking domesticity you know,
Beg and Markle just had a newshow about, you know, cooking
and entertaining and stuff likethat.
So I feel like we're kind ofreturning to the basics, things
that we kind of forgot or wethought wasn't that important.

Yeah, I think we thought it wasn't important and
we were told get out of thehouse, use your degree, use your
skills, because why would youuse your skills for motherhood?
And anybody who knowsmotherhood and homemaking knows
that that is a whole differentset of skills it takes to run a
smooth, efficient household thatruns to the point that you are

(45:32):
not so stressed and overwhelmedthat you actually have more to
give to the community and inother capacities, like in other
facets of your life.
That's huge, and it's somethingthat we've minimalized for so
long, and not even justminimalized from the point of
like, oh, go out, go to school,get a good job, like get good

(45:54):
grades, get a great job.
And then go out, go to school,get a good job, like get good
grades, get a great job, andthen, oh, you're just a mom like
that.
That's one side of it, but Ithink the other thing is we
almost want to ignore it.
We want to do all the otherstuff while our house is falling
apart.
And now I'm trying to think isit in Timothy where he talks

(46:15):
about elders of the church?
Make sure that their house isin order before you ask them to
serve in the church?
And part of that is because youwant them to be the husband of
but one woman and all that sortof stuff.
But I think that we could alsolook at it as God is saying if
an elder in the you know allthat sort of stuff.

(46:35):
But I think that we could alsolook at it as God is saying if
an elder in the church does nothave their home life in order,
that is where their focus shouldbe.
And we as women are the samething.
If our home is not in order,that is where our focus should
be.
And sometimes that can be areally hard truth.
That doesn't necessarily mean Iunderstand that there are

(46:58):
families that have mortgagesthat need to be paid by two jobs
.
That isn't necessarily.
Focus is not the same as time.
So you can give your leftoversto your work I mean within a
certain capacity and then giveyour primary to your family.
That is where your initialfocus should be, because if you

(47:20):
can get your family and yourhome life, god is a God of order
for a reason because itbenefits us.
And whether that be homemakingroutines, whether that be
getting your kids' attitudes inthe right place, that's your
primary.
I mean, again, starting withGod at the center.
But your second, your vocation,if you have kids, it's your

(47:42):
family.
If you have a marriage, it'syour marriage.
The people that are closest toyou should be getting the best
of you and then the leftoverswhich hopefully you have a lot
left over by that point can goto your work.
If you are burnt out at home butnot at work, that's telling you

(48:04):
something.
That's telling you that youneed to work on your skills
within the home, just like a lotof people have taken, you know,
four to seven years training toget to the place where they are
in their careers.
Four to seven years training toget to the place where they are
in their careers.
Why would you neglect yourtraining as a mom and as a wife

(48:25):
and as a homemaker?
I think all three of those aredifferent things.
A lot of the skills overlap,but to be a wife, that's
uplifting and helping sharpenyour husband into the man that
God created him to be.
That's a skill set learning howto communicate in a way that
makes sense to him.
For my husband, the mechanicalterms work well.
For an accountant husband, youmight need to go to like a
spreadsheet and talk about timeprojections and energy

(48:47):
percentages or something.
Meet your husband where he's at.
That is one side of our lifethat should be getting proper
attention and we should beworking on the skills to be able
to do that.
Then honoring the children thatGod has given to you and raising
them in.
There's a passage train up achild in the way he should go,

(49:08):
and when he's old he will notdepart from it.
I don't think that means youknow, push them into a certain
career path.
I think that means, as God madethis child, and it's your job
as a mom to get them to knowthem on such a deep basis that
you can help them develop intothe person that God designed
them to be, so that they canpursue the things that God has
in store for them.
All kids are different.

(49:30):
Figure out what makes yoursexceptional and then mother in
that vein.
Again, that's a huge skill setto learn who they are, to be
able to adapt your approach tothem.
What works with a very socialkid is going to work with an
analytical introvert.
Get to know your kids so thatyou can meet them where they're

(49:50):
at.
And then homemaking is a wholeother different skill set
Learning and I'm not saying ittakes skills to wash a dish.
My five-year-old can wash adish, usually without dropping
it and breaking it at this pointright, the actual skill of
washing a dish is not hard.
The actual skill of folding atowel is not hard.

(50:12):
But to create the system sothat that happens consistently
to the point that you are livingin again not Pinterest perfect
or Instagram worthy home, but ina home that runs smoothly,
that's where the skill set comesin.
So why do we put all of theseskills into everything that
happens outside the home and wearen't willing to put the time

(50:32):
and energy into learning theskills to give our best to our
spouse and our children and ourhome like our primary launching
pad?
Why wouldn't we set that up?
We're going to launch a lotfurther if we have a solid
launching pad underneath us.

Yes, absolutely A solid foundation.
And I think I had made thiscomment to my husband a few
times before, because I wassaying, oh, I feel bad, I don't
contribute, I don't earnanything.
And he said you earn half ofwhat I earn.
And he said you actually havethe most important mothers, have
the most important vocationbecause of the children.

(51:12):
The investment it's.
It's not monetary, you know youdon't, you know they don't earn
money or anything, but it's aspiritual investment and it's
actually also an investment forthe community that you're going
to raise the next generation ofleaders and you want them to be
leaders who have capacity, whohave empathy, who have love of

(51:33):
neighbor right, but they alsoneed to be able to know how to
cook and clean, right it's.
You can't always hire whatevertask rabbit or maid service.

Most of us can't right, most of us can't.
We need to do it, figure outhow to do it.
And even if you can, even ifyou were to have like a
full-time chef, for example, whocooked all your meals and did
all of the kitchen stuff example, who cooked all your meals and
did all of the kitchen stuffthat's still a skill you need to
learn, because who wants to bestarving if the chef calls in
sick?
So I'm trying to think if itwas Albert Einstein I think it

(52:04):
was CS Lewis that said somethingalong the lines of it's not a
direct book, but something alongthe lines of every other job in
the world is there to make surethat the mother can do hers.
And that's why I believe we arethe.
We are, like the pivotal pointof society.
And if we want a strong society, if we want strong country, a
strong world, we as mothers needto create that strong

(52:27):
foundation with our home.
And that's what I mean byrebuilding society, one mom at a
time.
It's on us.
We have we have the weight ofthe world in that sense is that
we have the, the opportunity tochange the world with that next
generation.
I love that your husband seesthat.

Yes, I have a lot to learn from my husband, but
I'm a little bit stubborn andyou know, a prophet is never, I
guess, without honor in hishometown yeah, in his hometown.
So he does try to give me tipsand I do have to have that
humility because he put me incharge.
I'm the CEO of this householdand when things are kind of not

(53:09):
working well, I feel embarrassedto tell him this is not working
well.
So when I I don't know if otherwomen have this when he says
something I know he doesn't sayit out of you know, malice or
anything like he's trying tohelp, but then because of my
pride or maybe lack of humility,then I'm like cause he said I
have a system, do you want toteach it?
Want me to teach you how to dothe dish?

(53:31):
You know the dishwashing moreefficiently, so we don't waste
so much water.
But I think when I was a newwife I was so annoyed, like
every time he would try to teachme things.
But then I'm thinking back andI'm thinking no one taught me
this, so I should have been morehumble and say, yes, can you
teach me how to do this?
He's in the army, so he's beentaught certain habits,

(53:52):
organization systems, certainhabits, organization systems,
but I guess also that sort ofthat humble sort of spirit of
you know, realizing that wedon't know everything and and,
yeah, my husband, yeah, doesalways affirm me to be honest in
my motherhood and and I'mtrying to, you know, from, I

(54:16):
guess, past wounds or whatever,I'm trying to accept, you know,
maybe some women do have thiskind of issue that they're
trying to be more confident.
You know, because Instagram,all that, you know, social media
, to be honest, I deletedInstagram from my phone.
To be honest, I deletedInstagram from my phone.

(54:51):
But, you know, trying tocompare, like right, comparison,
is the thief of joy.
Trying to compare oh, my housedoesn't look like that.
Oh, I don't even look like that, like how confident in their
motherhood when they reallyshould, they should be, they
should own, own that.
Right.

So I've got a couple of things to say.
The first one is I sound reallyput together right now.
I haven't showered in like fivedays, so you can't really tell,
because I pulled my hair back.
Showered in like five days soyou can't really tell, because I
pulled my hair back, but myshirt is all wrinkly because it
sat in the washer for two or inthe dryer for too long before it
got folded.
So those people that look puttogether on the outside still

(55:24):
have their things.
We had to get dinner out likethree nights a week last week
because I wasn't able to be homeand cook for my family and I
forgot to delegate it to one ofmy kids.
So we all have those things thatnobody's perfect and if they
look perfect, honestly, thereare some really, really amazing

(55:46):
people out there who havenatural skills in some of these
areas or have just learned themquicker than some of us do.
It took me a really long time.
I've been married for 20 years.
If you've been married for fiveand you're looking at my wife
thinking I can't do that, I willremind you that I've been
working really, really hard forthe last 20 years to get to the
point where I can sit here todayand say I am at peace in spite

(56:07):
of everything that's on myschedule and even all the
overdue tasks.
But that's part of it.
The other thing is we canchoose to learn from people or
we can choose to be hurt bypeople who aren't actually
hurting us.
You get to decide how yourespond.

(56:28):
So the comparison one is reallytough.
Tough Because we tend to like,like you were saying, there's
that well, you're talking aboutyour husband.
Well, I can do this.
I'm the housewife, I shouldknow how to do this.
Dr John Gottman calls itaccepting influence from your,
your spouse, which is wonderful,and it should go both ways.

(56:49):
You should be able to chime inand say oh, you know, you're
having this issue with yourcoworker.
What if you were to saysomething like this with that
work instead?
So going back and forth likethat and having respectful adult
conversations For some reasonwe're told we're adults at 18 or
in some states I think, it's 21.
The reality is, it takes us areally long time to be adults.

(57:09):
So that's one thing isaccepting influence from your
spouse, but also acceptinginfluence from people who have
skills that you don't have.
You have skills they don't have.
They have skills that you don'thave, and we can look at this
as an attack on us and allow itto hurt us and bring us down.
And deleting Instagram,deleting Pinterest?

(57:31):
I totally am.
I really don't like socialmedia, so I hear you on that one
.
Find people in your real lifewho can inspire you.
That is.
The alternative is that you canfeel the all the negative stuff
when you're comparing or youcould say you know what that
there came a point actually Iwas scrolling Pinterest several

(57:52):
years ago, and probably 10 yearsago at this point, and
scrolling all these wonderfulchore charts and all this sort
of stuff, and I thought my firstthought went to oh my goodness,
and I'm struggling just to getmy kids fed every day, and
they're not even clothed mostdays.
The beauties of homeschooling.
I didn't have to clothe them,they could go play, and we live
in the country, so they'd goplay out in their underwear or
something.

(58:12):
They weren't dressed every day,they were barely fed and I
would scroll through thesethings and one day it occurred
to me hmm, I wonder what I canlearn from them.
And so then, going from a pointof being inspired by people who
have skills that you don't have,rather than becoming

(58:33):
self-deprecating about thedifferences and then also
knowing and this is like a hardone, I think, sometimes to
remember, especially when we'rehaving struggles with our
children, for example, or withour spouse God puts you in this

(58:55):
place for a reason not becausehe knows you're going to be
perfect at it, but because heknows that you are capable
Somewhere within you.
Whether you know it yet or not,whether you have the skills yet
or not, he knows you can dothis with his support, with him
filling you.
But if there's a will, like ifyou allow him to fill you with
the will, then you will find theway.
So when you are looking at yourkids and thinking I don't know

(59:18):
why God put me here, I'm aterrible mother and you say wait
a second.
God literally geneticallydesigned these little people to
be in my home and in my care, heknows more than I do.
So if I move from doubting thefact that I'm supposed to be
their mother or whether I'm agood mother or not, is whether
you count yourself as a goodmother or not is kind of

(59:40):
irrelevant, because at the endof the day, the thing that you
should be focusing for is howcan I love and honor these
little people that God has putinto my life?
Well, that includes creatingorder, that includes things like
discipline, but we all know weneed to potty train our children
.
At some point they got to beout of diapers.
Even if they object, even ifit's a struggle, we know that

(01:00:02):
this will happen at some point.
Why would we doubt that?
Any of all of this other stuffis also supposed to happen,
which means there must be a way.
If he puts you in thatsituation, he has also provided
a way through it and thereforeit sounds really flippant to say
but comparison is only good ifit's for your own benefit.

(01:00:23):
It's like, hey, she's gotsomething.
I had a friend early in mymotherhood and she had her third
at the same time that I had myfirst and I looked at her and I
thought she has something withher children that I want.
She doesn't fight with her kidsall day long.
That means it's possible,because people will say, oh,
just wait till you get.
Teenagers are going to befighting all the time, and and I

(01:00:44):
had actually a couple offriends in my in my early
motherhood that had, like, oneof them had her third, and so I
would look at her and she had anamazing relationship with her
kids.
I had another friend who hereighth child is the same age as
my first.
So she was like in teenage andadult daughter territory and it
wasn't perfect.
Her kids weren't perfect, butshe had this amazing

(01:01:06):
relationship with them, in spiteof the fact that they were all
teens and hormonal and all ofthe things.
And I thought, well, if they cando it, it must be possible.
And as soon as your brain canstart understanding, you kind of
open up that door topossibility.
What if it could be easier?
There are people who are doingthis, so there must be a way.
And that's why I say use thecomparison to benefit you and to

(01:01:28):
learn from it and to show youthe possibilities.
And keep in mind that socialmedia, you have to look for
people in your real life,because social media, we only
look for people in your reallife, because social media, we
only show you our best, mostpeople, or they will show you
their worst, which isn'tbeneficial either, because who
wants to see the mom that's like, oh, I fight with my kids all
day long and complaining like,well, that that's kind of going

(01:01:51):
the other way.
Yes, we want to be real, butthe reality is there's hope,
there is possibility becauseBecause, seriously, if I can do
it, you can do it.
And that's really what it comesdown to.
If you see somebody who'sliving that life, who has, like,
a great relationship with herkids, who has a well-run home,
well I wonder how I can bringthat into my home.

(01:02:11):
It's possible.
Open the door to thepossibility that there is a
better way, because we should beable to enjoy our kids.
God didn't give our kids to usto stress us out all the time,
even though that sometimeshappens.
He gave us these amazing littlepeople that we have the
privilege of watching grow upand guiding their journeys and
being a part of this adventure.
This is a blessing.

(01:02:32):
Children are a blessing.
We will say it.
But how often do we look at ourkids in those tough moments and
say they are still a blessing,even if it's hard?
Motherhood shouldn't be hardall the time.
Yes, it's hard sometimes, butit shouldn't be hard all the
time.
And if it is hard all the timefor you, what if it doesn't have
to be?
What if you could learn theskills to increase your capacity

(01:02:53):
to give more and find morepeace and order in your life.
What if?

Sheila Nonato (01:03:03):
That's beautiful.
Yes, what if?
And so how can you help us?
You have a program.
Is it still called from stressto blessed?

Tessa Weenink (01:03:11):
yes, I do.
I have a course I have sinceour last um podcast, I think I
changed platforms from build acountry home to if you go to
aimtotheheartcom, you will findmy blog with a lot of this stuff
, and I have a a course calledStress to Bless Master the Art
of Christian Homemaking, where Iwalk you through how to design
a home management routine thatworks for your family.

(01:03:32):
For some moms or homeschoolmoms, you're going to need
something different than a momwho works outside the home.
You're going to need somethingdifferent if you have your kids
in lots of activities, if youhave a few kids, if you have a
lot of kids.
That is one of the big reasonswhy all of these checklists we
find online don't work.
I mean, there's checklists outthere that talk about changing
the cat litter.
Well, I don't have a cat, so Idon't need to spend all

(01:03:54):
Wednesday doing cat care.
I mean, we have cats, they'reoutside in the barn, I don't
need to change their litter.
So I walk you through not onlyhow to figure out exactly what
needs to be done in your house,how often it needs to be done,
and then how to teach it to yourchildren, how to communicate
these things with your spouse,open those conversations with

(01:04:15):
your spouse how to literallyteach your kids, based on
different personalities anddifferent stages and ages, and
so it takes you through.
That is my signature courseStress to Bless Master the Art
of Christian Homemaking I alsodo.
In spite of the fact that I amnow also working outside the
home in town, I do still haveopenings for private coaching
and there are the options to.
I can walk you through thecourse material if that's, if

(01:04:37):
you're, if homemaking is whereyour struggle is, or basically
anything mom and life related.
I am trained.
I'm a certified wholenessstrategist with the Wholeness
Coaching School, and so I amtrained to speak with women and
to guide them through all stagesof their life, whether it be
I've had clients that are singleand looking to become a person

(01:04:58):
that is comfortable being singleand looking for a spouse, all
the way to retirees who aretrying to figure out how to
relate to their adult childrenor, let's be honest, not all
retirees know how to run theirhome and it gets harder when you
get older and your energy isdifferent.
So kind of the whole gamut oflife coaching for women.
Those are two different waysthat you can work with me, or

(01:05:21):
you can just go read some of myblog posts.

Yes, amazing.
And you were saying you gotmarried at 19.
Is that correct?
Yeah, so looking back at allthat you have learned over the
years, what would you say toyour 19 or 20 year old self, you
know, when you were in themidst of all the busyness of
being a new mom, of all thenewness of having a baby,

(01:05:49):
running a household, being awife, what would you say to her
when she's not feeling the joyof motherhood, when there's all
the chaos or the stress, or justa lot of work and less sleep,
little sleep, what would you sayto her to recover, to reclaim

(01:06:10):
that joy?

I would say put one foot in front of the other.
That's all you need to do.
Just take what's right in frontof you.
Sometimes capacity isnon-existent.
You don't have to do it.
You don't have to do it all,just take the next step.
That's all you need to focus onright now.
But at the same time, keeptaking that next step because
there is so much hope.
There is a way and I had totell myself this often through

(01:06:37):
health issues, throughdepression, through a postpartum
depression, which is adifferent beast altogether than
regular depression, throughmarital struggles, through
business struggles, all of thissort of stuff.
Take one more step and hold onto that hope in your life.
I have a blog post about stayingfocused on the light at the end

(01:07:02):
of the tunnel.
Sometimes you can't see thelight, sometimes it's around the
corner.
You just take one more step andeventually that light will come
back into view.
And it took me a really longtime to get to the point where I
can finally feel like I ammostly out of that tunnel of
struggle and darkness and thestress and the overwhelm.
But the light is always there.

(01:07:24):
He is always there.
You just need to take one morestep.
So always maintain that hope.

Well, that's uh.
I mean, I'm so grateful thatyou shared your story, Um it.
It is an inspiration.
I you know I guess what youwere saying about sort of
turning the script or turningthe mindset about oh, I, you
know, this person has everything.
I'm so jealous.
Tessa has, you know, her houserunning so well and she's able

(01:07:51):
to do all these businesses.
Now I feel so small but, as youwere saying, transform that Like
, why do you?
Why, I guess, as women wesometimes have, maybe we always
have this sort of mirror thatyou know we have to, we have to
be the same.
But why, why should we comparein a negative way when we can
just say you know what, I'mhappy for her, I'm happy that

(01:08:14):
you are doing so well, that youhave an inspirational story that
I can learn from, as you weresaying, that we can learn from
others.
And, yeah, I love that flippingof the switch in terms of that
mindset that we, instead offeeling inadequate, we are
seeing how we can build capacitythrough the story of somebody

(01:08:35):
else who has gone through a lot,as you have, and you've been
able to find that hope and thatlight even in the midst of your
struggles, and I'm so inspiredby you and I thank you for
coming back.
Was there anything else youwanted to add?

I think really just keep stepping forward and
know that there's hope, like atthe end of it.
Yeah, life can be hard, it canthrow you all sorts of BS to
deal with, but but God at theend of the day, but God is
always there and he holds us ifwe allow him, and he can help us

(01:09:17):
take that next step forward.
Keep going.
Just take another step forward.
That's all you need to do Inthe midst of the hard.
Just take one more step, that'sit.
Step forward, that's all youneed to do.

In the midst of the hard.
Just take one more step, that'sit, Amen.
And please remind us where canwe find you online, your courses
and your blog again?

So you can find my blog and my courses are all
at aimedattheheartcom, or myspecific courses are at
productsaimedattheheartcom, butthere's links back and forth.
I am I hate social media andyou will notice that I'm not on
it a lot, but I do have anInstagram account at Aimed at
the Heart that I need to dostuff at some point, but I do

(01:09:56):
still check my DMs there becauseI use social media for my other
business.
So those are really the twolocations and pop onto my email
list.
I actually have a free emailchallenge called Hot mess, to
fully blessed five days tomaking over your home and your
heart, transforming your home inyour heart.
So check that out andeventually I will begin.

(01:10:16):
I haven't been in my office alot.
One of my life hurdles was thatI broke both of my feet at the
same time and was an incredibleamounts of pain for several
months, so I'm now starting toget things up.
So get on my email list.
You will start hearing from mesoon.

I forgot to ask you about that.
I don't know, if you have time,like a couple of minutes, what
happened?

If you can share with us.
So I have really bad luckwalking and on multiple
occasions have either sprainedboth ankles, yes at the same
time, or broke one foot andsprained the other, or just
broke a foot.
The last beginning of October,I guess, of 2024, I fell.
I stepped off a curb and thecurb was totally fine.

(01:11:00):
It was not the curb's fault.
The step that I took forwardafter that I twisted one foot
and fell straight down because Ididn't want to knock over my
children like bowling pins, somy foot broke.
And then I landed on my otherfoot and my big toe broke, and
the location of the break on thefoot it's called a Jones
fracture.
I don't know if you're anymedical people following.

(01:11:22):
It's not a fun one and it'sincredibly painful.
And so I was off both feet.
They were so swollen and soreand I would.
My feet were elevated.
I couldn't walk.
It was a uh non-weight bearingon my one foot for eight weeks.
So my kids had to step up andrun the household again and they
, they.
I would nurse the toddler andthen say, oh, he needs a clean

(01:11:44):
diaper and pass him to one of mysons, because I literally
couldn't walk.
And I would nurse the toddlerand then say, oh, he needs a
clean diaper and pass him to oneof my sons because I literally
couldn't walk, and I would.
My mother thankfully had thislittle like rolling walker where
I could oh, and I also put outa couple of ribs in in the
process.
So yeah it was.
I was a hurting unit for a goodcouple of months and everything
stopped.
I couldn't even get into theoffice because anytime I put my
feet down they would start likethrobbing and immense pain.

(01:12:07):
So I had to sit with my feetelevated for a really long time
as the swelling slowly went down.
But because of the fact that mykids had the skills this is not
, unfortunately, the first timethat I've been off my feet they
had to step up and the wholetime through it.
And now this is, I think, atestament to some deep thought
work that I have done and my ownlife and business coach that I

(01:12:30):
have worked with for a number ofyears.
This whole time I thought it'sjust a broken foot or broken
feet.
It could be way worse, becauseI could have spiraled into a
really, really bad depressionand historically that would have
been the case, that I wouldhave gone and I would have still
been like waiting through themuck of that depression, but I
was able to, oddly enough, likelaugh it off a lot of times.

(01:12:53):
I think part of it was I didn'trealize how much pain I was in
until the pain subsided, but itwas just broken feet At the end
of the day.
It could have been much worse.
I ended up having a CT scan andfor making sure everything was
working properly, that I didn'thave blood clots and stuff, and
I thought, wow, like this couldhave been life threatening, but

(01:13:14):
it wasn't.
And even if it was, god wasstill holding my family together
in ways that I could not evenhave imagined.
So sometimes thought work islife changing, life coaching can
be life changing.
I had tried medications and allthe other things, but that was
what got it for me, so that inthese moments, not only did my

(01:13:37):
family have the skills to runthe household, but I had the
fortitude, in spite of the painand the frustration.
I'm not going to lie, that wasa really frustrating period
because I had businesses to run,I had children to raise, I had
laundry to do, but to be able tojust sit and say you know what?

(01:13:57):
This is where God put me rightnow and so I'm just going to sit
my butt here in this chairevery single day and wait until
his next step for me, physically, literally the next step for me
when I was able to startwalking again yeah, it was.
It was ridiculous.
I haven't like, I don't haveany air balance issues.
I don't have bone densityissues.

(01:14:18):
My doctors said you just havereally bad luck walking.

So yeah, and you were protecting your children,
so you were a mother.
You're being a mother,

yeah every single time that I have like injured
myself, it is because I don'twant to drop the baby or fall on
one of my children, so I'lljust blame my kids.

Well, your, your life experiences are a testimony
to the program you created.
So I hope, listeners, if you'reneeding to find some
inspiration, some tips, somedirection, you'll reach out to
Tessa.
And thank you again, tessa.
I really appreciate your timeand your expertise and it's

(01:14:59):
always fun to talk to youbecause I'm always learning,
because I'm always learning andI still have to implement all
the things that you taught fromthe last podcast, because I need
time to let go of my prideabout how I need to run my
household, but I do.
Yes, that's why I startedreading the Bible, because I
need to go back to God.

(01:15:20):
Go back to God and prayer.
And yeah, as you were saying, Istarted praying in the morning,
even though I don't have anhour or anything, tried to get
up earlier, or because myhusband and my one of my kids
goes to school far away so theyhave to leave by six.
So when they leave, that's whenI try to pray and my kids my

(01:15:42):
other kids are still sleeping.
But my husband has actuallytold me that he's noticed a
difference when I started, whenI started praying in the morning
, like starting the day off,like that, that he's noticed
that I was happier and I thought, wow, I never.

I never noticed, but I guess he noticed and so,
yeah, I feel like this is great,or a manicure or something to
fill your cup.
But no, you really don't.
I've never.
I was gonna say I need to get ahaircut or a manicure or
something to fill your cup.
But no, you really don't, I'venever.
I was going to say I've neverhad a haircut.
I, my husband cuts my hair, andI've never had a manicure and
I'm still filled.
You don't need to go out, havea girl's night.

You don't need to do all the fancy things to get
filled, you just need to meetGod and allow him tessa, and
hopefully you're back again andI hope you don't.
You don't have any falls.
Actually I fell this weekend.
I had, yeah, I had.
I was thinking about you andI'm like how am I gonna cook?
Because I haven't really taughtmy kids the ins and outs of
cooking, although they actuallythey learned themselves.
It was one time I was sick and,yeah, my kid just started
making mac and cheese and I wasworried she was gonna burn

(01:16:49):
herself because I didn't teachher, but but she did it like.
I'm reminded of the story ofyour.
Is it your three-year-old whocame downstairs to make?
oatmeal

Yes, yeah, so I'm sitting on the counter beside
the stove making oatmeal on thestove crazy, amazing, amazing.

They are so much more capable than you think.

I'm sorry about your hand, that sucks.

Yeah, no, it's okay, it was a reminder of
humility.
And also, yeah, you know, jesussuffered.
It's Lent and Jesus sufferedfor us.
This is just a very tiny sliverof the pain he felt, so it made
me remind me of the cross andyou know, have courage and get
up.
Well, that was the lessonreally is.
I fell and you have to get up,right, yeah, yeah.

Find a way to get up, and that's what you do,
even if, yeah, you, you do, youjust do right, you get up.

Take that other step and that's what you've done
.
With all the life's challengesand the falls the literal falls
that you've had.
You have gotten up and you hadhelp because you trained them to
help you so yeah, that'samazing.
So anyway, I'm looking forwardto the next conversation with

(01:17:59):
you.
So have a great day, have ablessed day and thank your kids
for allowing this time with you.
So take care Bye.
Have a blessed day and thankyour kids for allowing this time
with you.
So take care, bye, bye, thankyou.
Thank you for listening to theVeil and Armour podcast.

Co-Host (01:18:28):
I invite you to share this with another Catholic mom
today.
Please subscribe to our podcastand YouTube channel and please
spread the word.
Let's Be Brave, let's Be Boldand Be Blessed together.

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